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Speaker 1: Hey guys, Saga and Crystal here.

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Speaker 2: Independent media just played a truly massive role in this election,

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Speaker 2: and we are so excited about what that means for

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Speaker 2: the future of this show.

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Speaker 3: This is the only place where you can find honest

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Speaker 3: perspectives from the left and the right that simply does

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Speaker 3: not exist anywhere else.

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Speaker 2: So if that is something that's important to you, please

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Speaker 2: go to Breakingpoints dot com. Become a member today and

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Speaker 2: and all put together for you every morning in your inbox.

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Speaker 3: We need your help to build the future of independent

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Speaker 3: news media and we hope to see you at Breakingpoints

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Speaker 3: dot com. Good morning, everybody, Happy Tuesday. Have an amazing

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Speaker 3: show for everybody today. What do we have, Crystal Deed,

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Speaker 3: We do a.

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Speaker 4: Lot that is interesting. This morning.

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Speaker 2: We had some breaking news overnight, President Trump posting the

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Speaker 2: private text messages that he had with Emanuel Macron and others,

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Speaker 2: as well as he gets set for Davos's Greenland updates there.

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Speaker 4: We've also got Don.

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Speaker 2: Lemon now is threatened with charges by the administration for

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Speaker 2: documenting an anti ice.

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Speaker 4: Protest that disrupted church services.

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Speaker 2: We've got some new crazy censorship crackdowns on Israel that

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Speaker 2: you with regard to Israel commentary that you have to

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Speaker 2: see to believe Josh Shapiro. So the Shapiro in the

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Speaker 2: show bar here is Josh not Ben is mad about

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Speaker 2: the VP vetting process is a pretty interesting one. Sean

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Speaker 2: Ryan is mad about the White House protecting pedophiles. You've

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Speaker 2: got some Epstein updates for you as well. And Matt

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Speaker 2: Damon and Ben Affleck sounding off on a I some

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Speaker 2: pretty interesting comments there from those two guys.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I know.

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Speaker 3: I mean, look, I love Matt love Ben together. They're

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Speaker 3: the perfect dynamic duo. And every like six months they

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Speaker 3: just do. Ben in particular will just drop like immense

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Speaker 3: wisdom in like a six in like a six minute period,

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Speaker 3: particularly on AI, and we're like, man, you know the

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Speaker 3: Goodwill hunting gang.

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Speaker 4: He's had some epic Bill Maher appearance. Oh, he's an athlete,

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Speaker 4: He's the legendary.

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Speaker 1: That's why I just.

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Speaker 3: Don't I don't understand how that person can exist in

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Speaker 3: the same body as the tabloid figure of like involving

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Speaker 3: all of his j LO and all this other stuff.

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Speaker 1: Like what is going on?

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Speaker 4: Some guys love them, crazy bitch.

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Speaker 1: He's just he's the goat. But anyway, we'll talk about it. Oh,

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Speaker 1: I have not watched the rip. I will admit I

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Speaker 1: have not watched it yet. I also good, right, I

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Speaker 1: don't know. I haven't seen any of the reviews.

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Speaker 5: Right.

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Speaker 1: I think I've unfortunately been out of the game.

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Speaker 3: And when it comes to film, thank you to everybody

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Speaker 3: you want to become a premium subscriber. So let's go ahead,

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Speaker 3: Crystal and start with the overnight breaking news. The Mucron text,

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Speaker 3: it's really not the text the most important thing. It's

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Speaker 3: the economic fallout as the Greenland crisis. I guess you

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Speaker 3: could call it continues threatening the strength of the US

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Speaker 3: dollar and potential economic fallout here in the US.

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Speaker 4: Yes, let's go ahead.

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Speaker 2: And we had a big truth social burst overnight that

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Speaker 2: we woke up to and had to incorporate into the

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Speaker 2: show that is already moving market. So let's put this

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Speaker 2: up on the screen. Among other things that he posted

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Speaker 2: was this, which the French have now confirmed is a

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Speaker 2: legitimate private message that was sent to Trump from French

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Speaker 2: President Emmanuel Macron. He says, my friend, we are totally

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Speaker 2: in line on Syria to do my friend Jackson, we

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Speaker 2: can do great things on Iran. I do not understand

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Speaker 2: what you're doing on Greenland. Let us try to build

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Speaker 2: great things. Number One, I can set up a G

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Speaker 2: seven meeting after Davos in Paris on Thursday afternoon. I

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Speaker 2: can invite the Ukrainians, that Danish, the Syrians and the

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Speaker 2: Russians in the margins. Let us have a dinner together

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Speaker 2: in Paris together on Thursday before you go back to

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Speaker 2: the US. So pretty interesting in terms of the tone here.

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Speaker 2: It just shows you behind the scenes how much they

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Speaker 2: all suck up to him. You also had the Secretary

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Speaker 2: General of NATO, Mark Root, Is that how you say

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Speaker 2: his name? In any case, we got even more sort

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Speaker 2: of slavishly fawning text messages from him as well. So

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Speaker 2: this is the tone that is being professed to President

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Speaker 2: Trump from the Europeans behind the scenes. The Mark Root

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Speaker 2: one says, mister President, dear Donald, what you accomplished in

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Speaker 2: serious today is incredible. I will use my media engagements

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Speaker 2: in Davis to highlight your work there, in Gaza.

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Speaker 4: And in Ukraine.

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Speaker 2: I'm committed to finding a way forward on Greenland. Can't

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Speaker 2: wait to see you yours.

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Speaker 4: Mark.

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Speaker 3: Oh my god, these people are so pathetic.

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Speaker 2: I mean, it's embarrassing for everyone involved. Like posting the

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Speaker 2: private text message as you're getting from various world leaders

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Speaker 2: is crazy. B I mean, it's that is psychotic behavior

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Speaker 2: from literally anyone, especially from the President of the United States.

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Speaker 4: But this tone from them, I can understand. I guess

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Speaker 4: I did a little bit more.

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Speaker 2: That's from the Secretary General of NATO, because truly his

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Speaker 2: fate is held in the palm of Trump's hands. But

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Speaker 2: I mean, like Emmanuel Macrome, have some self respect, no

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Speaker 2: of a sovereign nation.

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Speaker 3: Supposedly, So I said this yesterday I cannot stand the

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Speaker 3: hypocrisy of these people. Can we put the text message

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Speaker 3: please black up on the screen because look.

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Speaker 1: And note what they deal with.

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Speaker 3: We can are totally in line in our al Qaeda

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Speaker 3: backed regime in Syria, where by the way, there are

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Speaker 3: currently literally massacres where women are having their throats slit

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Speaker 3: on camera. If anybody's interested, we can do great things

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Speaker 3: on Iran. Oh, so we can do regime change in Iran.

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Speaker 3: But Greenland, oh man, this is why they're all of

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Speaker 3: their worship and all of this is of the UN Charter.

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Speaker 3: They are happy to sponsor these CIA black wars that

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Speaker 3: happened in Syria over the last fourteen years. They had

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Speaker 3: nothing whatsoever. They basically celebrated turning into an is really rumps.

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Speaker 2: Right now, right now, by the way, Ryan and Dropsite

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Speaker 2: have been documenting them.

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Speaker 1: I hate to say, I've watched some of these videos.

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Speaker 3: You know it is it's like worse than Gaza in

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Speaker 3: some respects, like not because it's not bopy, Like we're

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Speaker 3: talking about hand to hand physical combat and actual torture

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Speaker 3: of people that are happening now we have we can

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Speaker 3: do great things on Iran.

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Speaker 1: So we can do regime change.

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Speaker 3: We can violate the UN Charter, international principles, all of that.

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Speaker 3: But again, oh Greenland, Oh well, you can't have that,

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Speaker 3: because that's about European sovereignty. This is where these people

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Speaker 3: are just completely not only spineless, but it demonstrates that

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Speaker 3: they just want carve outs for themselves. They back to

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Speaker 3: the US kidnapping of Maduro. They said that the Venezuelan

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Speaker 3: government was illegitimate, and they just never and that at

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Speaker 3: the very same time, Oh well, it would be a

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Speaker 3: violation of international norms for Russia to invade Ukraine. But oh,

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Speaker 3: if the United States wants to take Venezuela, we want

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Speaker 3: to do regime change on it.

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Speaker 1: We are totally aligned.

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Speaker 4: We want to take take over Gaza, and right.

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Speaker 3: These people are gonna take over Gaza the bord of

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Speaker 3: You know, the only thing they object to on the

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Speaker 3: Board of Peace is that we're not colonizing Gaza the

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Speaker 3: correct way.

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Speaker 1: Right.

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Speaker 3: It's like, it's not that they care whenever it comes

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Speaker 3: to self determination. So they have never understood that if

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Speaker 3: you're going to operate like that, then yes, you will

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Speaker 3: open the door, not just to China, Taiwan or any

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Speaker 3: of the other US average at Russia and Ukraine. Yes,

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Speaker 3: now the United States can come in with the same

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Speaker 3: logic if they under their you know, under the way

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Speaker 3: that they operate and be like, okay, we're gonna take Greenland.

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Speaker 3: And so this is where you cannot have sympathy for

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Speaker 3: these leaders. They have no self respect whatsoever. Like you

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Speaker 3: were saying on NATO and Markra, it just gives the

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Speaker 3: whole game away. NATO is part of the American empire,

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Speaker 3: end of story period, especially whenever it comes to military power.

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Speaker 3: That's why they're freaking out right now because they know

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Speaker 3: that if this quote blows up NATO, which again you know,

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Speaker 3: don't threaten me with a good time, Well, it demonstrates

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Speaker 3: is the farcical nature of like the entire way that

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Speaker 3: they have tried to operate as quasi independent. And if

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Speaker 3: you're a European watching this, you should be furious with

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Speaker 3: your leaders for allowing you to be in this position.

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Speaker 3: This is why the people I respect the most are

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Speaker 3: the friend and the European right, who are like, listen,

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Speaker 3: that we have we have completely mortgaged.

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Speaker 1: Are economic and foreign policy.

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Speaker 3: To these Brussels bureaucrats who work on behalf of a

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Speaker 3: block instead of our own national interests. And I also

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Speaker 3: respect them because they're not sucking up to America.

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Speaker 1: They're like, no, bitch, we're Europeans. That is not true.

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Speaker 4: They are sucking up to America.

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Speaker 3: No, AFE and the French right on the on the

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Speaker 3: Greenland thing are not going along whatsoever.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but I mean the AFC for example. What I

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Speaker 2: mean is the AFC was one hundred percent sucking up

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Speaker 2: to the American right. The one thing they broke on

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Speaker 2: is Greenland, which is actually not that. But that's not

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Speaker 2: that different from what the liberals are doing at this point,

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Speaker 2: because they suck up to Drump on everything too, and

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Speaker 2: are also drawing the line at Greenland. So I didn't

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Speaker 2: see their positions as being all that different.

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Speaker 3: To be honest, the reason I take it differently is

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Speaker 3: because they're like, no, we will never allow another country

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Speaker 3: to come in to dictate, Like what exactly it means

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Speaker 3: for us as Europeans to have our foreign policy? That

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Speaker 3: is the prime Like, that is the prime principle whenever

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Speaker 3: it comes to being nationalists, and so fundamentally, like, what

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Speaker 3: these people have done is put themselves into a corner

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Speaker 3: where they want to endorse Western imperialism and take over

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Speaker 3: of the globe, except whenever it applies to their own territory, right,

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Speaker 3: they have no leg to stand on.

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Speaker 2: I mean zooming out the deal post World War two,

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Speaker 2: as we discussed yesterday with Jeffrey Sachs, and I really

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Speaker 2: encourage you guys to listen to that interview, is effectively, Okay,

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Speaker 2: we're going to take care of like, you don't have

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Speaker 2: to spend that much on your defense. You can rely

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Speaker 2: on us for that. And you know we're going to

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Speaker 2: do NATO. We're going to have our bases, we're going

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Speaker 2: to you can count on our nuclear umbrella, we're gonna

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Speaker 2: have Article.

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Speaker 4: Five whatever, We're going to have all of that. And

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Speaker 4: in return, you are going to accept the dollars the

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Speaker 4: reserve world's reserve currency.

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Speaker 2: And that is an enormous, incalculable benefit to us. So

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Speaker 2: the only really strategic move on the table. There's two possibilities.

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Speaker 2: One is what they're doing, which is basically like has

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Speaker 2: been appeasement, like let's see if we can and they

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Speaker 2: talk to this guy. Also, this is why it's humiliating

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Speaker 2: for Trump too. They talked to him like he's a

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Speaker 2: toddler that you're trying to appease and get to go

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Speaker 2: to bed, or you know, like, oh, if you're a

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Speaker 2: good boy, then we can have a you know, we

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Speaker 2: can have a nice time tomorrow whatever. Like they talk

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Speaker 2: to him like he's a child and clearly see him

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Speaker 2: as a psychopathic like emotionally volatile, insane person. That totally

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Speaker 2: comes through in the way the tenor of the text here.

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Speaker 2: But in any case can do that, which is what

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Speaker 2: they've been doing, Or you can reach out to the

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Speaker 2: rest of the world. I'll oh, what Canada is doing

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Speaker 2: with China, and you can try to Okay, we're not

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Speaker 2: getting that defense part of the deal anymore. Then you're

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Speaker 2: not going to be able to reliably count on us

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Speaker 2: to you know, follow your policy visa VI China, like

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Speaker 2: for example the UK at our request band Huawei technology

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Speaker 2: in the UK. I mean, okay, so those sorts of

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Speaker 2: things are not going to happen anymore.

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Speaker 4: And they also hold.

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Speaker 2: A good bit of our debt, of our treasury debt.

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Speaker 2: Start telling some of that into the market, like if

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Speaker 2: you want. And there's no choice on the board at

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Speaker 2: this point other than to look elsewhere in the world

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Speaker 2: and to try to achieve your own sovereignty at this point,

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Speaker 2: let me put one up on the screen because we

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Speaker 2: also had this which Trump posted as well, which.

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Speaker 4: Is you know, him with this map that has.

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Speaker 2: Canada and Greenland and Venezuela, and you pointed out Cuba.

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Speaker 3: Yes, if you zoom in you can actually see Cuba

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Speaker 3: in Venezuela there. Cuba is very small there as an island,

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Speaker 3: but if you do zoom in you can see it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so all under the American flag. So this is

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Speaker 2: another thing that he posted. And to your point, you know,

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Speaker 2: the markets are reacting to all of this, including the

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Speaker 2: you know, the tariff threats and the ramping up the

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Speaker 2: trade war. Put them too up on the screen. Dollar

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Speaker 2: falls sharply. Wall Street stock set for heavy losses after

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Speaker 2: Greenland crisis. You know, at the time of this writing,

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Speaker 2: you've got let's see, US currency fell point seven percent

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Speaker 2: against the Euro. Futures are tracking the S and P

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Speaker 2: five hundred down one point five percent amid increasing transatlantic tensions.

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Speaker 4: And threats of a trade war.

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Speaker 2: Tech focused Nasdaq futures were down one point nine percent. Also,

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Speaker 2: the you know, US ten year treasury bond yields are up,

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Speaker 2: which is a bad thing. That means our debt is

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Speaker 2: more expensive. So a lot of tumult in the markets

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Speaker 2: this morning because of the you know, the wild actions

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Speaker 2: of the President of the United States and all of

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Speaker 2: the turmoil that that entails. The other thing with these,

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Speaker 2: you know, the trade thing is like the EU and

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Speaker 2: the UK thought they had these trade deals and Keir Starmer,

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Speaker 2: who was pathetic and unpopular. I mean, most of these

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Speaker 2: leaders that we're talking about, like Emmanuel Macron is really

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Speaker 2: unpopular in France, which is another thing just politically, like

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Speaker 2: the leaders who stand up to Trump, obviously their approval

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Speaker 2: ratings skyrocket.

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Speaker 1: Look at Lula, Yeah, look at Lula.

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Speaker 2: Look at I mean, Shine Mom is really popular, Like

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Speaker 2: you know Carney. The whole reason he's Prime Minister is

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Speaker 2: because of Canada's fight with Trump et cetera. But in

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Speaker 2: any case, so politically it doesn't even even make any sense.

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Speaker 2: But you know, this is this is the landscape.

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Speaker 4: Where we are. They thought they had these trade deals

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Speaker 4: in place.

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Speaker 2: Starmar thought that this was some win that he could

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Speaker 2: take and say, look, you know this thing that I negotiated,

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Speaker 2: it's going to beneficial for us, blah blah blah.

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Speaker 4: Now nope, that's all out the window. Like you can't.

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Speaker 2: You can't do a deal with this person because he

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Speaker 2: is so volatile, he is so much like a child

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Speaker 2: and unpredictable, like Toddler, constantly in danger of doing something

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Speaker 2: insane or throwing some sort of tantrum that may be

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Speaker 2: self destructive and self defeating ultimately, and just you know,

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Speaker 2: so you can't. You can't rely on anything that he

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Speaker 2: says or any deal that you strike with All.

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Speaker 3: That can be true, but you can also look at

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Speaker 3: the people who have successfully negotiated with Trump and have

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Speaker 3: come out on the right end. You've got Mexico, You've

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Speaker 3: got China, and you've got Russia where running.

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Speaker 2: Like invade and bomb Mexico. I don't I want to

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Speaker 2: say that that's been like a you.

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Speaker 1: Know, it hasn't happened yet, and they wanted to do it.

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Speaker 4: Don't yet.

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Speaker 3: The Claudia Scheinbaum has not only been able to work

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Speaker 3: with them on fentanyl drug cartels, but has also maintained

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Speaker 3: her popularity and has kept trade flowing.

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Speaker 1: Look at the Chinese.

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Speaker 3: The Chinese immediately whenever we levied tariffs on them, they

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Speaker 3: just doubled it and then doubled it and doubled it again.

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Speaker 4: Well, that's all that they showed strength.

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Speaker 2: Yes, they showed strength, and I don't know why they

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Speaker 2: these people can't get it in their heads. That is

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Speaker 2: the only thing that he respects. It's the only thing

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Speaker 2: he respects. And so if you're not willing and look,

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Speaker 2: everybody knows the lopsided nature of the relationship, but it's

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Speaker 2: not like the Europeans have nothing they can do.

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Speaker 4: And Trump is not really down.

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Speaker 2: For a lot of pain. He's very worried about the

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Speaker 2: stock market. You know, he's going to be looking at

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Speaker 2: these treasury bond yields. That was the thing that pulled

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Speaker 2: him back from the first liberation day, right, So he's

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Speaker 2: going to be looking closely at this. And so if you,

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Speaker 2: you know, start selling some treasuries into the market, not

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Speaker 2: you know, it doesn't have to.

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Speaker 4: Be a whole huge deal.

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Speaker 2: But if you say, well, hey, listen, we've got some

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Speaker 2: things we can do and it's going to cause you

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Speaker 2: some pain. He does not really have that kind of

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Speaker 2: willpower to stay in it. And the only thing that

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Speaker 2: he will ever respect is you standing strong. So these

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Speaker 2: text messages like it's so embarrassing, it's so the wrong

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Speaker 2: way to deal with him.

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Speaker 4: It's humiliating, on the world stage.

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Speaker 2: Like I said, I think it's also humiliating for him

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Speaker 2: because of the way people feel, because revealing these sorts

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Speaker 2: of things is just like inherently disgusting. Everybody's had that

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Speaker 2: situation where their friend or there it's like an abusive relationship,

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Speaker 2: is what you get from these text messages, right right.

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Speaker 3: The point is around this is that they can't get

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Speaker 3: out of it and they have to continue. And also

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Speaker 3: we all know none of their behavior will change. They'll

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Speaker 3: be privately furious, there'll be.

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Speaker 1: A lamand report and then cum Davos.

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Speaker 3: They're going to be kissing each other on the cheek

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Speaker 3: and pretending that none of this ever happened.

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Speaker 1: Because they're pathetic, they're weak people.

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Speaker 3: And you know, you look at this situation and I

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Speaker 3: don't know, like for me, yes you can, you know,

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Speaker 3: oh Trump bad, etc. But you have to look at

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Speaker 3: these people who lack self respet and who for twenty

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Speaker 3: five years have been warned that the NATO security umbrella,

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Speaker 3: your lack of investment and the way that you structure

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Speaker 3: your society has turned you into a vassal state, incapable

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Speaker 3: of defending your own sovereignty and acting independently and This

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Speaker 3: is the net and the end result. That's why the

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Speaker 3: people who either decoupled or built up their domestics strong militaries,

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Speaker 3: they always had.

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Speaker 1: Some sort of a plan.

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Speaker 3: B India, China, Russia, some of the South American countries

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Speaker 3: are the ones who stand strong today. Remember our trade

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Speaker 3: crisis with India. Nothing happened, literally nothing to them. But

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Speaker 3: they're doing fine. They're absolutely fine. Yeah down there, I mean.

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Speaker 3: And so you look at these European leaders in this

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Speaker 3: current context, and you're right. You know, the Japanese are

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Speaker 3: the ones who dumped a huge number of US debt

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Speaker 3: after Liberation Day, and that's ultimately what caused us to buckle.

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Speaker 3: Don't forget that they also got a trade deal where

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Speaker 3: all they had to do was like some fake promises

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Speaker 3: about five hundred billion dollars and effectively in place right

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Speaker 3: now with a modest amount of tariffs. Their economy is okay,

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Speaker 3: and their own leader is conservative like quasi nationalists, trying

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Speaker 3: to keep it relations with the US.

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Speaker 1: But they've handled it well, and of course we respect them.

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Speaker 3: We don't respect the French and NATO and all these

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Speaker 3: other people who are going to be flocking at Davos

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Speaker 3: and who are going to be kissing his ass in

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Speaker 3: twenty four hours. This isn't even the first text message,

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Speaker 3: private text message. People forget that Mark Rutt has sent

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Speaker 3: Trump which has been released and he's the same guy. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: you know, because we track this stuff every day.

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Speaker 1: I remember. I also remember when he.

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Speaker 3: Called Trump daddy whenever it comes to Yeah, this thory

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Speaker 3: of that, this, these are the people we're dealing with.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and again I can with Nato, I mean, his

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Speaker 2: whole fate isn't like I feel like I sort of

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Speaker 2: get the embarrassing nature of what they're doing here.

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Speaker 1: It didn't have to be this way, but you made

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Speaker 1: it this one.

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Speaker 2: But the thing, I mean, listen with Macron, I will

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Speaker 2: say he is the one European leader who came out

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Speaker 2: and said they should use you know what they call

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Speaker 2: this like trade bazuka, like we should use the most

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Speaker 2: aggressive measures we have in our toolkit pushback against this.

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Speaker 2: The and he does say in this message, like listen,

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Speaker 2: we got to do something. You're like, oh, I love

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Speaker 2: you on Syrian and I love you on around blah

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Speaker 2: blah blah. Greenland's another matter. But the overall approach of

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Speaker 2: you know, of the Europeans the rest of the world

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Speaker 2: has to get their act together.

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Speaker 4: I mean, that's just the truth of the matter.

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Speaker 2: Like you have to move away from the US, you

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Speaker 2: have to unite, and you have to move away through

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Speaker 2: the US. You have to like, you know, do what

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Speaker 2: Bricks has done. You have to do what Mark Karney

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Speaker 2: is doing and striking these deals with China. And I

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Speaker 2: think you're right that Ukraine is a big part of

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Speaker 2: the reason why the Europeans have not gotten their act

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Speaker 2: together to you know, unite, have some pushback, show a

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Speaker 2: little bit of that is all.

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Speaker 1: Let me just expand on them.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, the main reason that they can't do anything is

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Speaker 3: because they're obsessed with Ukraine. And I've tried to make

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Speaker 3: this point for the Europeans too. If you're French, you

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Speaker 3: should not mortgage your foreign policies to sovereignty and national

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Speaker 3: pride to the Eastern dun Boss region of Ukraine.

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Speaker 1: That's what's currently happening.

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Speaker 3: The European leaders are so panicked that Trump will go

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Speaker 3: and make a side deal with Russia on Ukraine.

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Speaker 1: They have to they have to start.

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Speaker 3: This is like the destabilization of their complete like mortgaging

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Speaker 3: of sovereignty from the European Union to now the expansion

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Speaker 3: of NATO has created this crisis, like you should be

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Speaker 3: I mean, I could you know, go on for a

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Speaker 3: long time, but like just thinking about how vindicated the

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Speaker 3: de Gaal vision was about the United States NATO and

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Speaker 3: how you know, he would drive us crazy at times,

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Speaker 3: but in retrospect he is one of the most vindicated

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Speaker 3: Europeans of all time who saw this very very early on.

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Speaker 3: And they've they moved away from that vision and that's

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Speaker 3: on them. They turned themselves into vassal states. They have

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Speaker 3: no true economies that are capable of producing things at

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Speaker 3: scale which make them truly independent and economically viable. They're

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Speaker 3: totally dependent on us, and they've created a situation where,

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Speaker 3: you know, where they have to act like this in

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Speaker 3: public and their own democracies. You know, look, I'm not Europeano,

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Speaker 3: pretend to be, but like for those people like they

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Speaker 3: have created and put you in a situation where you're

439
00:20:09,800 --> 00:20:13,919
Speaker 3: emasculated on such, you know, to such a historic degree.

440
00:20:14,160 --> 00:20:15,600
Speaker 3: And you know it's funny, you know, I shouldn't be

441
00:20:15,680 --> 00:20:19,360
Speaker 3: cheering for people to unite against America. I like balance.

442
00:20:19,560 --> 00:20:23,040
Speaker 3: I think balance creates stability. This is why I would

443
00:20:23,040 --> 00:20:26,679
Speaker 3: always talk about Israel. If we had a balanced nature

444
00:20:26,920 --> 00:20:28,840
Speaker 3: in the Middle East, none of this would happen.

445
00:20:28,840 --> 00:20:30,320
Speaker 1: There would be nothing with Palestine.

446
00:20:30,480 --> 00:20:32,920
Speaker 3: And they're also you know, Syria would be a relatively

447
00:20:32,960 --> 00:20:36,400
Speaker 3: stable state, and Iran too. Everything would would we would

448
00:20:36,400 --> 00:20:40,080
Speaker 3: be created and have a situation where mutually assured destruction

449
00:20:40,280 --> 00:20:43,080
Speaker 3: or some credible threat would make it so that rogue

450
00:20:43,160 --> 00:20:46,639
Speaker 3: gangsterism is impossible now here. With the US, we have

451
00:20:46,880 --> 00:20:50,600
Speaker 3: a similar situation where look, Trump is an aberration, but

452
00:20:50,680 --> 00:20:52,880
Speaker 3: all he does is dial up everything that we do.

453
00:20:53,119 --> 00:20:55,640
Speaker 3: He takes it from six to eleven. The United States

454
00:20:55,680 --> 00:20:58,000
Speaker 3: has been operating this way for quite some time. It's

455
00:20:58,040 --> 00:21:01,040
Speaker 3: caused great pain to us as citis, and you know,

456
00:21:01,160 --> 00:21:04,440
Speaker 3: the world has accepted it. And so I like balance

457
00:21:04,520 --> 00:21:08,639
Speaker 3: because it creates ultimately stability. And we have lived in

458
00:21:08,680 --> 00:21:11,919
Speaker 3: a totally unbalanced world largely not just because of our

459
00:21:11,960 --> 00:21:15,600
Speaker 3: own actions, because we've mortgaged really, you know, our unipolar moment.

460
00:21:15,880 --> 00:21:17,560
Speaker 1: We also are.

461
00:21:17,440 --> 00:21:20,320
Speaker 3: In this situation because of exactly people like this, and

462
00:21:20,400 --> 00:21:22,920
Speaker 3: so I don't know, I just maybe I'm being too hard.

463
00:21:23,000 --> 00:21:24,400
Speaker 1: I just think they're clearly my.

464
00:21:24,640 --> 00:21:27,840
Speaker 2: I guess perhaps cope on all of this is that

465
00:21:27,920 --> 00:21:31,719
Speaker 2: I'm hoping that Trump's the brazeness and undeniable nature of

466
00:21:31,760 --> 00:21:33,960
Speaker 2: the way that Trump operates in the room will force

467
00:21:34,040 --> 00:21:37,159
Speaker 2: that sort of reckoning because listen old, the old world

468
00:21:37,280 --> 00:21:41,399
Speaker 2: order was already bankrupt, right it was. And these, you know,

469
00:21:41,440 --> 00:21:44,360
Speaker 2: the international institutions, which I would love to I would

470
00:21:44,400 --> 00:21:46,760
Speaker 2: love them to be functioning. I would love for international

471
00:21:46,840 --> 00:21:49,159
Speaker 2: law to actually have some teeth and for there to

472
00:21:49,200 --> 00:21:51,359
Speaker 2: be rules of the road. That's not the world that

473
00:21:51,400 --> 00:21:54,400
Speaker 2: we live in. And Trump has just Trump has made

474
00:21:54,440 --> 00:21:58,200
Speaker 2: that undeniable. And so I am hoping that that forces

475
00:21:58,359 --> 00:22:02,440
Speaker 2: a realignment of the world order that leads to a

476
00:22:02,520 --> 00:22:05,679
Speaker 2: something that is genuinely better, that is genuinely functional, that

477
00:22:05,880 --> 00:22:09,160
Speaker 2: strikes some sort of balance. The danger and the risk

478
00:22:09,680 --> 00:22:12,400
Speaker 2: is that is that we are breaking apart the post

479
00:22:12,480 --> 00:22:16,640
Speaker 2: World War two order, which, for all its flaws, did

480
00:22:16,720 --> 00:22:18,760
Speaker 2: keep US out of World War Three.

481
00:22:19,119 --> 00:22:21,480
Speaker 1: So we do have to give it made.

482
00:22:21,320 --> 00:22:23,240
Speaker 2: This country fantastic. I mean, it was a great deal

483
00:22:23,240 --> 00:22:25,719
Speaker 2: for the US. Like all of the you know, Trump's

484
00:22:25,720 --> 00:22:28,200
Speaker 2: carping ow is not fair, the Europeans taking advantage of

485
00:22:28,200 --> 00:22:31,080
Speaker 2: blah blah blah, Like we set up these institutions, we

486
00:22:31,200 --> 00:22:33,360
Speaker 2: set up this order to benefit us. It has been

487
00:22:33,400 --> 00:22:37,480
Speaker 2: fantastically beneficial to the United States of America by design,

488
00:22:37,520 --> 00:22:40,840
Speaker 2: but putting that aside, you know, my fear is that

489
00:22:40,880 --> 00:22:44,560
Speaker 2: we're breaking apart those institutions without replacing them with a

490
00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:48,720
Speaker 2: more stable order. And we cannot afford to do that

491
00:22:48,800 --> 00:22:52,199
Speaker 2: because now we have a nuclear world, now we have

492
00:22:52,440 --> 00:22:56,520
Speaker 2: AI you know, driven killer robots. It is a different

493
00:22:56,840 --> 00:22:59,639
Speaker 2: it's a different time, and so that's the fear. The

494
00:22:59,680 --> 00:23:02,760
Speaker 2: whole is that this forces some sort of a reckoning

495
00:23:02,800 --> 00:23:05,919
Speaker 2: and a building of a world order that is actually superior.

496
00:23:08,680 --> 00:23:11,119
Speaker 2: Speaking of that sort of like brazenness and reckoning, some

497
00:23:11,200 --> 00:23:14,840
Speaker 2: of that is coming through at Davos, which is in

498
00:23:14,920 --> 00:23:17,639
Speaker 2: a very interesting identity crisis kind of moment. We can

499
00:23:17,680 --> 00:23:19,760
Speaker 2: put a zero up on the screen. Trump is going

500
00:23:19,800 --> 00:23:22,600
Speaker 2: to be speaking there. Tomorrow's the World Economic Forum, you know,

501
00:23:22,640 --> 00:23:27,080
Speaker 2: all of the world like global elites gather here, infamously,

502
00:23:27,640 --> 00:23:31,920
Speaker 2: CEOs from major companies, a ton of world leaders.

503
00:23:31,840 --> 00:23:32,919
Speaker 4: Show up, et cetera.

504
00:23:33,720 --> 00:23:36,640
Speaker 2: And it says, as Davos can means, difference to Trump

505
00:23:36,720 --> 00:23:40,720
Speaker 2: has replaced everything. So previously, the ethos of Davos was

506
00:23:40,760 --> 00:23:46,439
Speaker 2: always stridently neoliberal right, meaning that they you know, they

507
00:23:46,760 --> 00:23:51,240
Speaker 2: they want total market freedom. They want low taxes for themselves.

508
00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:53,720
Speaker 2: They want low regulation, but they also want to go

509
00:23:53,760 --> 00:23:56,439
Speaker 2: to Davos and talk about get pay lip service to

510
00:23:56,760 --> 00:23:58,240
Speaker 2: how they're going to make the world a better place.

511
00:23:58,320 --> 00:24:00,639
Speaker 1: Climate change, Yeah, buy car urban credit.

512
00:24:00,760 --> 00:24:03,479
Speaker 2: They did something it talks about in this article one

513
00:24:03,560 --> 00:24:04,960
Speaker 2: year just to give you a sense of this sort

514
00:24:04,960 --> 00:24:08,159
Speaker 2: of thing they had, like the refugee experience or like

515
00:24:08,200 --> 00:24:10,880
Speaker 2: be blindfolded and hear gunshots or whatever.

516
00:24:10,960 --> 00:24:13,160
Speaker 4: Anyway, that's like you fly in on.

517
00:24:13,119 --> 00:24:16,400
Speaker 2: Your private jet right where after you're you know, you're

518
00:24:16,400 --> 00:24:18,919
Speaker 2: the Exon Mobile CEO or whatever. You fly in on

519
00:24:18,960 --> 00:24:23,199
Speaker 2: your private jet after doing horrific things in the developing world,

520
00:24:23,280 --> 00:24:26,200
Speaker 2: and then you spend a couple of days publicly pretending

521
00:24:26,760 --> 00:24:28,800
Speaker 2: like you care about making the world a better place,

522
00:24:28,880 --> 00:24:32,240
Speaker 2: the world that you are personally defiling, and behind the

523
00:24:32,240 --> 00:24:35,840
Speaker 2: scenes you're doing deals with the other business leaders and

524
00:24:35,880 --> 00:24:39,640
Speaker 2: world leaders there to continue consolidating wealth power and defiling

525
00:24:39,680 --> 00:24:42,200
Speaker 2: said world. So that was the previous Davos ethos.

526
00:24:42,640 --> 00:24:43,160
Speaker 4: Now in the.

527
00:24:43,080 --> 00:24:47,840
Speaker 2: Trump era, they like that sort of patina of we

528
00:24:47,920 --> 00:24:51,439
Speaker 2: need to be responsible citizens, We need to care about

529
00:24:51,560 --> 00:24:55,080
Speaker 2: poverty or world hunger or climate change or refugee crisis

530
00:24:55,160 --> 00:24:57,919
Speaker 2: or whatever. That's all kind of out the window. So

531
00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:01,480
Speaker 2: the theme this year, I don't remember. It's something very generic.

532
00:25:01,560 --> 00:25:05,160
Speaker 2: It's like big ideas, something like that.

533
00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:06,160
Speaker 4: I have to look at the article.

534
00:25:06,200 --> 00:25:08,400
Speaker 2: It was something like that, like the most generic thing

535
00:25:08,800 --> 00:25:11,800
Speaker 2: that you could possibly think of, and you know, a

536
00:25:11,800 --> 00:25:13,000
Speaker 2: lot of a.

537
00:25:12,920 --> 00:25:15,040
Speaker 1: Lot committed to improving the state of the world.

538
00:25:15,160 --> 00:25:17,600
Speaker 2: No, that's not it, that's not even it's oh, you're right.

539
00:25:17,640 --> 00:25:20,280
Speaker 2: The slogan, the slogan of the forum committed to that's

540
00:25:20,320 --> 00:25:23,359
Speaker 2: the overall one. But no, the specific one for this

541
00:25:23,480 --> 00:25:25,360
Speaker 2: year is a spirit of dialogue.

542
00:25:25,680 --> 00:25:27,640
Speaker 4: That's the theme. Spirit of Dialogue.

543
00:25:28,320 --> 00:25:30,399
Speaker 1: A lot of stuff that turns me into like a

544
00:25:30,640 --> 00:25:34,000
Speaker 1: raging like a true radical.

545
00:25:33,800 --> 00:25:36,080
Speaker 4: Like it makes me turns me into a communist.

546
00:25:36,160 --> 00:25:39,680
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm like, I cannot believe we are ruled by

547
00:25:39,960 --> 00:25:43,200
Speaker 3: such incompetent pathetic.

548
00:25:42,640 --> 00:25:45,520
Speaker 2: Well it's and so the the previous thing has all

549
00:25:45,560 --> 00:25:49,720
Speaker 2: been like the hypocrisy, right. The thing now is the brazenness,

550
00:25:50,119 --> 00:25:53,280
Speaker 2: and you know that's that's the shift. And there's going

551
00:25:53,320 --> 00:25:54,960
Speaker 2: to be a lot to talk about AI and crypto

552
00:25:55,040 --> 00:25:57,119
Speaker 2: and all of that, but really they're in sort of

553
00:25:57,160 --> 00:26:00,400
Speaker 2: the previous The guy who's founded World Economic Forum Club,

554
00:26:00,440 --> 00:26:02,680
Speaker 2: he's stepped down. You've now got I think the head

555
00:26:02,680 --> 00:26:05,000
Speaker 2: of like black Rock is running it along with somebody

556
00:26:05,040 --> 00:26:07,800
Speaker 2: else that I remember, and and yeah, so they're in

557
00:26:07,880 --> 00:26:10,359
Speaker 2: kind of like a they're in kind of an identity

558
00:26:10,560 --> 00:26:13,640
Speaker 2: crisis because they don't know how to exactly position themselves.

559
00:26:13,720 --> 00:26:16,199
Speaker 2: Now in the era of Trump, Trump was planning on

560
00:26:16,280 --> 00:26:19,320
Speaker 2: going there and making some sort of a speech. You know,

561
00:26:19,359 --> 00:26:23,760
Speaker 2: it also comes at a time of incredible, like world

562
00:26:23,880 --> 00:26:26,760
Speaker 2: historic levels of income inequality. Put a three up on

563
00:26:26,760 --> 00:26:29,200
Speaker 2: the screen. This is from Gabriel Zeckman, who you know

564
00:26:29,600 --> 00:26:34,000
Speaker 2: is one of the leading foremost trackers of wealth inequality,

565
00:26:34,720 --> 00:26:37,879
Speaker 2: fantastic economist. He says, back in nineteen ten, so like

566
00:26:37,920 --> 00:26:41,720
Speaker 2: at the peak of the Gilded Era, the richest point

567
00:26:41,920 --> 00:26:45,160
Speaker 2: zero zero zero zero one percent households in the US

568
00:26:45,160 --> 00:26:47,879
Speaker 2: owned wealth equivalent to four percent of US national income.

569
00:26:47,920 --> 00:26:50,800
Speaker 2: Today that mount is twelve percent the wealth and power

570
00:26:50,840 --> 00:26:53,920
Speaker 2: the super rich, he says, now far exceeds.

571
00:26:53,680 --> 00:26:55,280
Speaker 4: It's Gilded Age peak.

572
00:26:55,680 --> 00:26:58,159
Speaker 2: And you can see the lines on this graph that

573
00:26:58,280 --> 00:27:03,639
Speaker 2: just effectively go completely vertical. And it's set to continue

574
00:27:03,760 --> 00:27:07,679
Speaker 2: even more aggressively in that direction with the advent of AI.

575
00:27:08,080 --> 00:27:10,680
Speaker 2: These giant tech companies, these giant tech. You know, tech

576
00:27:10,720 --> 00:27:13,760
Speaker 2: oligarchs who seek to become and are on track to

577
00:27:13,800 --> 00:27:18,280
Speaker 2: become the world's first trillionaires. Of productivity in this country

578
00:27:18,280 --> 00:27:21,679
Speaker 2: in particular is spiking, but workers are seeing none of

579
00:27:21,720 --> 00:27:24,879
Speaker 2: those gains. They are all flowing to the very I'm

580
00:27:24,920 --> 00:27:27,040
Speaker 2: not even talking about the top one percent. The top,

581
00:27:27,359 --> 00:27:31,280
Speaker 2: as he says, point one percent are the ones who

582
00:27:31,280 --> 00:27:35,480
Speaker 2: are consolidating the vast majority of the wealth and political power,

583
00:27:35,800 --> 00:27:38,080
Speaker 2: and so that is really the backdrop in the context

584
00:27:38,560 --> 00:27:40,120
Speaker 2: of Davos this year as well.

585
00:27:40,440 --> 00:27:43,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, I mean I think that's why. That is why.

586
00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:46,080
Speaker 3: Look, we were originally going to talk about inequality. Not

587
00:27:46,119 --> 00:27:49,119
Speaker 3: only that, but Trump is planning on making an affordability pit.

588
00:27:49,240 --> 00:27:51,320
Speaker 3: I will say, you know, one of the problems here.

589
00:27:51,680 --> 00:27:53,480
Speaker 3: As much as I would love to crap on the

590
00:27:53,520 --> 00:27:56,320
Speaker 3: Europeans and all that, that's a more of a side

591
00:27:56,359 --> 00:28:00,480
Speaker 3: project for me personally. You know, it's just still side

592
00:28:00,560 --> 00:28:03,200
Speaker 3: quests of a long health vendetta have against the continent.

593
00:28:03,840 --> 00:28:06,840
Speaker 3: But you know, the thing that really matters is affordability.

594
00:28:06,880 --> 00:28:09,320
Speaker 3: And actually, you know, out of the inequality graphic, it's

595
00:28:09,359 --> 00:28:11,880
Speaker 3: really the importance of how people are able to make

596
00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:14,199
Speaker 3: it here and to be able to fulfill even like

597
00:28:14,200 --> 00:28:16,119
Speaker 3: a modicam or hope that your children are going to

598
00:28:16,200 --> 00:28:18,520
Speaker 3: have a better life than you currently have, which is

599
00:28:18,560 --> 00:28:21,480
Speaker 3: just currently not the case the entire millennial generation.

600
00:28:21,600 --> 00:28:23,080
Speaker 1: That's the sound like.

601
00:28:23,359 --> 00:28:27,000
Speaker 3: That is why the Greenland thing, even though as you know,

602
00:28:27,040 --> 00:28:29,359
Speaker 3: my feelings are well known, most people are going to

603
00:28:29,400 --> 00:28:31,040
Speaker 3: look at this and be like, I don't care about Greenland.

604
00:28:31,119 --> 00:28:33,120
Speaker 1: This is insane, Like why are you wasting.

605
00:28:33,000 --> 00:28:35,159
Speaker 4: All of this capital in percent support?

606
00:28:35,240 --> 00:28:38,840
Speaker 3: Right because people they're like, I don't ultimately care that

607
00:28:39,000 --> 00:28:41,920
Speaker 3: much about it, Like this is not eighteen fifteen or

608
00:28:41,960 --> 00:28:44,760
Speaker 3: whatever the Louisiana purchase was, where it's like there's this

609
00:28:44,920 --> 00:28:47,520
Speaker 3: vast land where we get to move into and all

610
00:28:47,520 --> 00:28:50,000
Speaker 3: these resources that we're going to get because at this point,

611
00:28:50,040 --> 00:28:52,440
Speaker 3: as you just pointed out, even if we were to

612
00:28:52,480 --> 00:28:54,880
Speaker 3: have this idea of all these minerals and things in

613
00:28:54,920 --> 00:28:57,680
Speaker 3: Greenland which would be able to exploit, nobody is under

614
00:28:57,680 --> 00:28:59,560
Speaker 3: the illusion that we're all going to get rich because

615
00:28:59,560 --> 00:28:59,800
Speaker 3: of that.

616
00:29:00,000 --> 00:29:01,080
Speaker 1: Because of the way.

617
00:29:00,960 --> 00:29:03,760
Speaker 3: That the market's and wealth and all of that is

618
00:29:03,800 --> 00:29:06,880
Speaker 3: distributed broadly, right, Like, yeah, understand that this would be

619
00:29:06,960 --> 00:29:09,840
Speaker 3: a bonanza to a certain select few of companies that

620
00:29:09,880 --> 00:29:12,840
Speaker 3: we personally though would not reap the benefit. That's the

621
00:29:12,880 --> 00:29:16,080
Speaker 3: issue that I think, you know, structurally, they're never going

622
00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:18,560
Speaker 3: to be able to solve. Like from what I've understood

623
00:29:18,920 --> 00:29:21,280
Speaker 3: in my conversations around, I'm like, what is up with

624
00:29:21,320 --> 00:29:23,080
Speaker 3: the Greenland thing, because like, you know, what is it?

625
00:29:23,120 --> 00:29:24,600
Speaker 3: And they're like, well, first of all, and I keep

626
00:29:24,680 --> 00:29:27,560
Speaker 3: using this term, it's a sugar high. They're just literally

627
00:29:27,640 --> 00:29:31,680
Speaker 3: like they're basking in midnight hammer and Venezuela. They're like,

628
00:29:31,760 --> 00:29:35,840
Speaker 3: we can do anything where America bitch is basically the

629
00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:39,280
Speaker 3: Trump doctrine. And in that they're like, well, this is

630
00:29:39,280 --> 00:29:42,800
Speaker 3: something where he could solidify his legacy as expanding the

631
00:29:42,880 --> 00:29:45,400
Speaker 3: territory of the United States more than any you know

632
00:29:45,480 --> 00:29:48,640
Speaker 3: time since eighteen I forget when the Steward purchased of

633
00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:50,560
Speaker 3: Alaska was I think it was like eighteen sixty eight,

634
00:29:50,640 --> 00:29:53,080
Speaker 3: that it would be the biggest expansion of the map,

635
00:29:53,160 --> 00:29:55,800
Speaker 3: and he loves that. But again, this is a central

636
00:29:55,800 --> 00:29:58,120
Speaker 3: problem for Trump. The more that things are about him

637
00:29:58,160 --> 00:30:00,520
Speaker 3: personally and using the US as a plaything and.

638
00:30:00,440 --> 00:30:01,720
Speaker 1: Not about any of us.

639
00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:05,920
Speaker 3: That's the fundamental issue in his general politics. Okay, let's

640
00:30:05,920 --> 00:30:11,160
Speaker 3: get to the church. Turning now to Minneapolis has been

641
00:30:11,200 --> 00:30:14,480
Speaker 3: a very high profile protest I guess if you could

642
00:30:14,480 --> 00:30:17,040
Speaker 3: call it, where a bunch of BLM activists who are

643
00:30:17,040 --> 00:30:20,640
Speaker 3: now part of the anti ICE movement stormed into a

644
00:30:20,800 --> 00:30:25,600
Speaker 3: church in the state of Minnesota. The reasoning behind this

645
00:30:25,920 --> 00:30:30,280
Speaker 3: was that they had found names of ICE officers and

646
00:30:30,400 --> 00:30:34,560
Speaker 3: suspected that one of the pastors at this church was

647
00:30:34,640 --> 00:30:37,400
Speaker 3: the leader of a local ICE field office. It did

648
00:30:37,520 --> 00:30:39,360
Speaker 3: end up, by the way, that the pastor who they

649
00:30:39,400 --> 00:30:42,440
Speaker 3: alleged was an ICE officer was not even present there

650
00:30:42,680 --> 00:30:44,720
Speaker 3: at the time. It set off a high profile incident

651
00:30:44,800 --> 00:30:47,880
Speaker 3: now showdown with the Trump administration. Don Lemon, the current

652
00:30:47,920 --> 00:30:51,960
Speaker 3: YouTube streamer I guess, a disgraced XCNN anchor, was actually

653
00:30:51,960 --> 00:30:54,120
Speaker 3: present at the protest, which has heightened some of the

654
00:30:54,120 --> 00:30:56,240
Speaker 3: discussion around this. So we're going to show you some

655
00:30:56,360 --> 00:30:58,280
Speaker 3: of the clips that has happened. We're going to discuss

656
00:30:58,280 --> 00:31:01,360
Speaker 3: it on the other side. Let's take a listen, so

657
00:31:01,400 --> 00:31:01,760
Speaker 3: you can.

658
00:31:01,680 --> 00:31:06,640
Speaker 6: See the protesters here have gathered over here. They're in the.

659
00:31:06,560 --> 00:31:07,320
Speaker 1: Middle of the church.

660
00:31:07,800 --> 00:31:10,240
Speaker 6: So in the beginning of the church service, the pastor

661
00:31:10,320 --> 00:31:15,200
Speaker 6: was speaking and Nichema stood up and said her piece,

662
00:31:15,880 --> 00:31:17,960
Speaker 6: and then the protesters surrounded her. But this is a

663
00:31:17,960 --> 00:31:21,400
Speaker 6: clandestine mission. I think they found out one of according

664
00:31:21,440 --> 00:31:25,080
Speaker 6: to them, this is according to Operation pull Up, that

665
00:31:25,360 --> 00:31:28,640
Speaker 6: one of the pastors here is a.

666
00:31:28,600 --> 00:31:30,120
Speaker 1: Member of ICE.

667
00:31:30,240 --> 00:31:34,240
Speaker 5: And so there we go, and we were interrupted by

668
00:31:34,280 --> 00:31:35,640
Speaker 5: this group of protesters.

669
00:31:36,240 --> 00:31:41,480
Speaker 1: We asked them to leave, and they obviously have not lived.

670
00:31:41,680 --> 00:31:42,880
Speaker 4: So what do you think of it?

671
00:31:43,520 --> 00:31:45,520
Speaker 1: I mean, this is unacceptable, it's shameful.

672
00:31:45,920 --> 00:31:50,520
Speaker 6: It's shameful to interrupt a public gathering.

673
00:31:50,160 --> 00:31:55,160
Speaker 1: Of Christians in workship. But there were post I have

674
00:31:55,240 --> 00:31:56,480
Speaker 1: to take care of my flow.

675
00:31:56,960 --> 00:31:59,040
Speaker 5: Listen, we live in there's a constitution in the First

676
00:31:59,040 --> 00:32:02,040
Speaker 5: Amendment to freedom of speech and the freedom to assemblant protest.

677
00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:05,440
Speaker 1: We're here to worship. We're here to worship Jesus because

678
00:32:05,480 --> 00:32:07,520
Speaker 1: that's the hope of these cities. That's the hope of

679
00:32:07,520 --> 00:32:09,000
Speaker 1: the world is Jesus Christ.

680
00:32:09,080 --> 00:32:11,040
Speaker 5: Be very respectful, but please don't push me there.

681
00:32:10,760 --> 00:32:11,640
Speaker 4: We're here.

682
00:32:11,800 --> 00:32:14,480
Speaker 1: We're here to worship Jesus. That's why we're here.

683
00:32:14,640 --> 00:32:17,920
Speaker 5: Tell you is that they're bearing arrays of views on

684
00:32:17,960 --> 00:32:21,600
Speaker 5: the political situation here. What do you what do you mean?

685
00:32:21,600 --> 00:32:22,600
Speaker 4: But I'm going to leave it at that.

686
00:32:22,680 --> 00:32:25,920
Speaker 6: But there there's bearing an array of views in this

687
00:32:26,120 --> 00:32:31,640
Speaker 6: church on politics of immigration, right recognize the complexity issue. Yeah,

688
00:32:31,920 --> 00:32:33,560
Speaker 6: some people don't like what's happening.

689
00:32:33,600 --> 00:32:35,400
Speaker 1: Some people like I'm not going to reduce it to that.

690
00:32:35,480 --> 00:32:38,240
Speaker 5: I won't reduce it in that simply but acknowledge the

691
00:32:38,240 --> 00:32:39,440
Speaker 5: complexity of a situation.

692
00:32:40,200 --> 00:32:40,760
Speaker 4: Thank you, sir.

693
00:32:41,040 --> 00:32:43,840
Speaker 5: I appreciate you talking about By the way, just so

694
00:32:43,880 --> 00:32:46,920
Speaker 5: you know, this is what you get with independent journalism

695
00:32:47,080 --> 00:32:49,440
Speaker 5: that you will not get with corporate media. I'm just

696
00:32:49,480 --> 00:32:51,760
Speaker 5: here to tell you. So if you're in the chat,

697
00:32:51,800 --> 00:32:55,440
Speaker 5: if you're with us, support us, support us, support us,

698
00:32:56,440 --> 00:33:00,000
Speaker 5: like and subscribe, becoming member support independent journalists.

699
00:33:00,960 --> 00:33:03,520
Speaker 3: So there's Don in the church asking for people to

700
00:33:03,640 --> 00:33:07,520
Speaker 3: like and subscribe after accompanying these activists where he appeared

701
00:33:07,560 --> 00:33:09,400
Speaker 3: to have had some fore knowledge. This is relevant, by

702
00:33:09,440 --> 00:33:11,680
Speaker 3: the way, whenever we'll get to some of the charges

703
00:33:11,720 --> 00:33:14,480
Speaker 3: that may be levied against him with the Trump administration.

704
00:33:14,560 --> 00:33:18,400
Speaker 3: Of all these protesters who decide because they suspect again

705
00:33:18,440 --> 00:33:18,880
Speaker 3: they did not.

706
00:33:18,880 --> 00:33:20,120
Speaker 1: Even have it confirmed.

707
00:33:20,120 --> 00:33:22,800
Speaker 3: It's been confirmed now later that a pastor who was

708
00:33:22,840 --> 00:33:26,959
Speaker 3: not there is cape was potentially a leader of the

709
00:33:27,000 --> 00:33:29,720
Speaker 3: local ice office that they decide to come in to

710
00:33:29,840 --> 00:33:34,320
Speaker 3: disrupt this service, to harass, intimidate, scream at including by

711
00:33:34,320 --> 00:33:37,440
Speaker 3: the way women and children. And if anybody's wondering it

712
00:33:37,480 --> 00:33:41,120
Speaker 3: was a multiracial congregation, I don't know, Crystel. I mean

713
00:33:41,480 --> 00:33:43,680
Speaker 3: looking at this like I think that the spirit of

714
00:33:43,720 --> 00:33:47,240
Speaker 3: BLM is alive, and well it's very clear specifically because

715
00:33:47,240 --> 00:33:51,680
Speaker 3: it is also a BLM group that was behind this protest.

716
00:33:51,720 --> 00:33:54,640
Speaker 3: And I've actually been frustrated that everybody's talking about Don

717
00:33:54,720 --> 00:33:58,560
Speaker 3: Lemon and not about the actions of these protesters themselves.

718
00:33:59,040 --> 00:34:02,160
Speaker 3: And then the re action from Democratic lawmakers. So you

719
00:34:02,200 --> 00:34:06,080
Speaker 3: had the Minnesota state attorney general defend this protest action

720
00:34:06,160 --> 00:34:09,560
Speaker 3: and he said, oh, well, people will have to feel uncomfortable,

721
00:34:09,600 --> 00:34:12,160
Speaker 3: so he doesn't see anything unlawful here. He actually doesn't

722
00:34:12,160 --> 00:34:13,840
Speaker 3: think it's a violation of the Face Act. You have

723
00:34:13,920 --> 00:34:18,400
Speaker 3: the state governor Walls of Minnesota put out some mealy

724
00:34:18,480 --> 00:34:23,279
Speaker 3: mouthed statement, and it's like this just seems intrinsic to me.

725
00:34:23,440 --> 00:34:25,399
Speaker 3: And I remember in our debate, you know, people got

726
00:34:25,440 --> 00:34:27,719
Speaker 3: mad because I talked about liberal protest norms. This is

727
00:34:27,800 --> 00:34:30,200
Speaker 3: liberal protest, like they seem to believe it is okay.

728
00:34:30,280 --> 00:34:32,759
Speaker 3: And again, this is a violation actually a federal law.

729
00:34:32,920 --> 00:34:35,640
Speaker 3: At least clearcut to me. Whenever you have the face Act,

730
00:34:35,680 --> 00:34:37,719
Speaker 3: which was written in nineteen ninety four, specifically says you

731
00:34:37,760 --> 00:34:39,440
Speaker 3: can't intimidate and go in and.

732
00:34:39,680 --> 00:34:42,120
Speaker 1: Disrupt religious worship services.

733
00:34:42,600 --> 00:34:45,319
Speaker 3: It is unbelievable to me like that there is no

734
00:34:45,960 --> 00:34:48,920
Speaker 3: general consensus and effectively just silence in the same way

735
00:34:48,920 --> 00:34:50,879
Speaker 3: that you seem many right wingers be silent on let's say,

736
00:34:50,880 --> 00:34:53,279
Speaker 3: the excesses of ice to what is something which is

737
00:34:53,360 --> 00:34:57,360
Speaker 3: so egregious in its form of protests and it seems

738
00:34:57,680 --> 00:35:02,600
Speaker 3: completely normalized and permissed, like in the liberal establishment within

739
00:35:02,640 --> 00:35:05,160
Speaker 3: the state of Minnesota, and the fact that the Attorney

740
00:35:05,160 --> 00:35:09,200
Speaker 3: general immediately dismiss it, the local police literally doing nothing

741
00:35:09,480 --> 00:35:13,000
Speaker 3: whenever these people and again let's be clear, screaming, making

742
00:35:13,080 --> 00:35:17,440
Speaker 3: children cry, following them to their cars, intimidation, direct trespass,

743
00:35:17,680 --> 00:35:19,120
Speaker 3: not leaving whenever they want.

744
00:35:19,400 --> 00:35:21,560
Speaker 1: I just I truly do.

745
00:35:21,600 --> 00:35:27,040
Speaker 3: Not understand how can this cannot be like actually condemned,

746
00:35:27,200 --> 00:35:31,600
Speaker 3: especially when this already happened in twenty twenty and there

747
00:35:31,640 --> 00:35:35,280
Speaker 3: was a massive backlash against it. So I really actually

748
00:35:35,320 --> 00:35:39,040
Speaker 3: want like, don't I don't understand, as somebody who swims

749
00:35:39,040 --> 00:35:41,839
Speaker 3: in this world, like what is happening here? Like, how

750
00:35:41,960 --> 00:35:44,560
Speaker 3: is it that this is completely permissive and it's just like, oh,

751
00:35:44,640 --> 00:35:46,680
Speaker 3: our side is good, so they can do whatever they want.

752
00:35:46,800 --> 00:35:49,280
Speaker 3: The Minnesota state Attorney general was making a big stink

753
00:35:49,560 --> 00:35:53,799
Speaker 3: about political you know, political persecutor non prosecution or whatever

754
00:35:53,880 --> 00:35:56,560
Speaker 3: in the Renee Good case immediately comes out and says

755
00:35:56,560 --> 00:35:59,480
Speaker 3: that this is totally fine, especially in a state where

756
00:35:59,480 --> 00:36:01,279
Speaker 3: you have to shoot very recently in church, Like, how

757
00:36:01,280 --> 00:36:04,040
Speaker 3: could you possibly try to encourage this type of behavior.

758
00:36:04,080 --> 00:36:04,799
Speaker 1: I just don't get it.

759
00:36:05,120 --> 00:36:06,719
Speaker 4: So let's separate a few things out.

760
00:36:06,840 --> 00:36:08,239
Speaker 1: And that's why don't want to talk about Don Lemon,

761
00:36:08,280 --> 00:36:09,839
Speaker 1: because you know, but.

762
00:36:09,800 --> 00:36:11,920
Speaker 2: We do need to talk about Don Lemon because that's

763
00:36:11,920 --> 00:36:14,640
Speaker 2: what they're focused on. And the administration is threatening to

764
00:36:14,760 --> 00:36:18,799
Speaker 2: charge him specifically with Face Act and also with the

765
00:36:18,880 --> 00:36:21,279
Speaker 2: KKK violation, which is insane.

766
00:36:21,440 --> 00:36:22,880
Speaker 4: So I watched a good bit.

767
00:36:22,920 --> 00:36:24,200
Speaker 2: I didn't watch the whole thing, but I watched a

768
00:36:24,200 --> 00:36:26,839
Speaker 2: good bit of his stream, and to be honest with you,

769
00:36:27,080 --> 00:36:31,560
Speaker 2: it was genuinely good. Like it was like, I mean,

770
00:36:31,560 --> 00:36:34,680
Speaker 2: we played a little bit of it here. He was

771
00:36:34,800 --> 00:36:36,600
Speaker 2: tipped off by the protesters that they were going to

772
00:36:36,680 --> 00:36:40,839
Speaker 2: do this action. Okay, as a journalist, and no doubt

773
00:36:40,880 --> 00:36:43,160
Speaker 2: he has a perspective. That doesn't mean that he isn't

774
00:36:43,200 --> 00:36:47,439
Speaker 2: a journalist, right, So as a journalist, he goes in,

775
00:36:48,120 --> 00:36:51,439
Speaker 2: he documents what they're doing. As you saw, he spoke

776
00:36:51,480 --> 00:36:55,359
Speaker 2: with the pastor, he spoke with parishioners. You know, he

777
00:36:55,480 --> 00:36:58,799
Speaker 2: at times was asking them challenging questions. But he also

778
00:36:58,840 --> 00:37:02,200
Speaker 2: asked a challenging question of the protesters as well. So

779
00:37:02,440 --> 00:37:04,520
Speaker 2: of course you come away with a sense of where

780
00:37:04,600 --> 00:37:07,319
Speaker 2: Don Lemon is on the issue. But I actually it

781
00:37:07,360 --> 00:37:10,520
Speaker 2: was for me it was genuinely valuable to watch his

782
00:37:10,680 --> 00:37:14,839
Speaker 2: stream and to hear from the parishioners themselves, because if

783
00:37:14,880 --> 00:37:17,399
Speaker 2: you do just come at this from either a right

784
00:37:17,600 --> 00:37:20,040
Speaker 2: or a left perspective, then you're going to have a

785
00:37:20,160 --> 00:37:23,640
Speaker 2: very flattened view of the human beings involved. But you know,

786
00:37:23,680 --> 00:37:26,319
Speaker 2: it actually gave me sort of more texture and more

787
00:37:26,320 --> 00:37:29,200
Speaker 2: context to be able to think about the whether this

788
00:37:29,360 --> 00:37:32,080
Speaker 2: was a sound tactical approach. Hearing like that guy that

789
00:37:32,120 --> 00:37:33,759
Speaker 2: we heard there who's like, listen, you know, to be

790
00:37:33,800 --> 00:37:35,640
Speaker 2: honest with you. There's a lot of different political views

791
00:37:35,680 --> 00:37:37,959
Speaker 2: in this church. There were other people there who said,

792
00:37:38,239 --> 00:37:39,920
Speaker 2: you know, to be honest with you, like some of

793
00:37:39,920 --> 00:37:42,360
Speaker 2: what the protesters are saying, like I kind of agree

794
00:37:42,400 --> 00:37:45,920
Speaker 2: with I just this to me is way on a

795
00:37:45,960 --> 00:37:48,560
Speaker 2: line and it's you know, too comfort and I am

796
00:37:48,680 --> 00:37:51,239
Speaker 2: very upset about what they've done here, But to be

797
00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:53,000
Speaker 2: honest with you, some of the things that they're saying

798
00:37:53,200 --> 00:37:56,279
Speaker 2: might be things that I agree with. So you know,

799
00:37:56,480 --> 00:37:59,799
Speaker 2: in terms of as a journalistic endeavor, like I think

800
00:37:59,840 --> 00:38:02,319
Speaker 2: you should like and subscribe. He's on the ground in Minneapolis.

801
00:38:02,400 --> 00:38:05,919
Speaker 2: He is actually tracking what is going on here and

802
00:38:06,000 --> 00:38:09,680
Speaker 2: giving you a window in that is not just caricaturistion. Well,

803
00:38:09,840 --> 00:38:15,160
Speaker 2: so the idea, the idea of charging him is truly insane,

804
00:38:15,200 --> 00:38:18,320
Speaker 2: and we all know the reason why they are focusing

805
00:38:18,360 --> 00:38:20,239
Speaker 2: on him, which I think is also we're saying as well,

806
00:38:20,320 --> 00:38:23,439
Speaker 2: because he's famous, because he's liberal, because he's hated. Yes,

807
00:38:23,480 --> 00:38:25,879
Speaker 2: I think because he's black and gay. All of that

808
00:38:25,920 --> 00:38:26,799
Speaker 2: plays into it.

809
00:38:27,239 --> 00:38:29,560
Speaker 3: But he's the first person to remind you he's black

810
00:38:29,560 --> 00:38:31,239
Speaker 3: and gay. Okay, it has nothing to do.

811
00:38:31,360 --> 00:38:33,320
Speaker 2: There is no doubt that that is part of why

812
00:38:33,360 --> 00:38:35,200
Speaker 2: he is a lightning rod here. I just don't like

813
00:38:35,280 --> 00:38:37,759
Speaker 2: that that is liberal. I think that that is deniable.

814
00:38:37,760 --> 00:38:39,880
Speaker 2: But in any case, that's the reason that they have

815
00:38:39,920 --> 00:38:41,839
Speaker 2: made the face. He wasn't even the only journalist there,

816
00:38:41,840 --> 00:38:44,600
Speaker 2: by the way, so for don lemon for them to

817
00:38:44,640 --> 00:38:47,120
Speaker 2: even float charging him with the face act with this

818
00:38:47,239 --> 00:38:52,720
Speaker 2: KK insane and like on principle as journalists we should

819
00:38:52,760 --> 00:38:56,799
Speaker 2: be vehemently opposed to that because genuinely, you may not

820
00:38:56,880 --> 00:38:58,920
Speaker 2: like I know, you know, you don't like his views, he's.

821
00:38:58,760 --> 00:38:59,799
Speaker 4: A liberal, all of that.

822
00:39:00,000 --> 00:39:03,320
Speaker 1: It's not because, yes, but you don't like it.

823
00:39:03,520 --> 00:39:06,839
Speaker 2: But nobody as a as a you know, as a journalist,

824
00:39:07,160 --> 00:39:09,920
Speaker 2: like the ability to go in to document this protest,

825
00:39:10,040 --> 00:39:12,400
Speaker 2: to be live, to talk to the protesters, to talk

826
00:39:12,440 --> 00:39:14,359
Speaker 2: to the parishioners, to talk to the pastor, to talk

827
00:39:14,400 --> 00:39:15,400
Speaker 2: to everybody.

828
00:39:14,960 --> 00:39:15,480
Speaker 4: On the ground.

829
00:39:16,280 --> 00:39:20,080
Speaker 2: It was genuine, It was actually valuable content and it

830
00:39:20,239 --> 00:39:23,040
Speaker 2: is worthwhile looking at it because you know, I think

831
00:39:23,080 --> 00:39:25,560
Speaker 2: he in some senses did a favor to the to

832
00:39:25,600 --> 00:39:30,759
Speaker 2: the right because you get tactics, Yes, yes, because you

833
00:39:30,800 --> 00:39:33,319
Speaker 2: do get more of a sense of you can't just

834
00:39:33,440 --> 00:39:37,279
Speaker 2: view the church members there in a caricatureish way when

835
00:39:37,320 --> 00:39:39,719
Speaker 2: you actually listen to what they have to say and

836
00:39:39,760 --> 00:39:42,319
Speaker 2: you're there in the room with them and experiencing that. Now,

837
00:39:42,400 --> 00:39:46,120
Speaker 2: for me, in terms of the protest tactics, you know,

838
00:39:46,400 --> 00:39:48,360
Speaker 2: do I have like a moral issue with No, I

839
00:39:48,400 --> 00:39:50,239
Speaker 2: don't have a moral issue I think it's crazy that

840
00:39:50,320 --> 00:39:54,040
Speaker 2: there's an ICE field officer who is in any sort

841
00:39:54,040 --> 00:39:55,360
Speaker 2: of position of moral leadership.

842
00:39:55,880 --> 00:39:58,040
Speaker 4: This is a guy, This is a guy. Well it is.

843
00:39:58,320 --> 00:40:00,360
Speaker 4: It is my business. It is a b business.

844
00:40:00,400 --> 00:40:02,880
Speaker 2: I mean, I'm a taxpayer of this country. I'm paying

845
00:40:02,920 --> 00:40:03,960
Speaker 2: his salary.

846
00:40:04,320 --> 00:40:06,600
Speaker 4: They are, you know, in the local in the local community.

847
00:40:06,719 --> 00:40:08,799
Speaker 2: Just finished for a second. So do I have a

848
00:40:08,840 --> 00:40:10,760
Speaker 2: moral issue with No, I don't have a moral issue

849
00:40:10,760 --> 00:40:12,920
Speaker 2: with it, do I think? And people get very mad

850
00:40:12,960 --> 00:40:14,799
Speaker 2: when you say this. Do I think it was tactically smart?

851
00:40:14,840 --> 00:40:15,400
Speaker 4: No, of course not.

852
00:40:15,800 --> 00:40:19,440
Speaker 2: You've given a major propaganda win to your adversary. You

853
00:40:19,480 --> 00:40:23,000
Speaker 2: protected zero immigrants, right the work you're undermining the good

854
00:40:23,000 --> 00:40:24,759
Speaker 2: work of the will Stancils of the world who are

855
00:40:24,800 --> 00:40:29,160
Speaker 2: out in the streets tracking ICE agents, blowing whistles and recording.

856
00:40:29,239 --> 00:40:29,520
Speaker 4: I mean.

857
00:40:29,760 --> 00:40:33,000
Speaker 2: And Trump posted actually yesterday before he started posting like

858
00:40:33,040 --> 00:40:35,640
Speaker 2: his private text with Emmanuel Macron or whatever, he posted

859
00:40:35,680 --> 00:40:38,040
Speaker 2: that there was too much focus on ice agents and

860
00:40:38,120 --> 00:40:41,319
Speaker 2: not enough on the fraud. Why because he sees that

861
00:40:41,400 --> 00:40:44,320
Speaker 2: these videos that everybody's seeing of, you know, pulling some

862
00:40:44,440 --> 00:40:48,280
Speaker 2: elderly American citizen out in practically his underwear in the snow,

863
00:40:48,960 --> 00:40:52,040
Speaker 2: tear gassing a six month old baby, shooting now a

864
00:40:52,200 --> 00:40:55,399
Speaker 2: Venezuelan national on top of the killing of Renee Good,

865
00:40:55,640 --> 00:40:58,000
Speaker 2: Like he's seeing that this is not going well for

866
00:40:58,080 --> 00:40:59,360
Speaker 2: him in the public opinion.

867
00:40:59,400 --> 00:41:01,240
Speaker 4: Those tactics are working.

868
00:41:01,719 --> 00:41:04,560
Speaker 2: And instead today of being able to talk about those

869
00:41:04,600 --> 00:41:07,000
Speaker 2: things and those abuses, we're having to have a debate

870
00:41:07,080 --> 00:41:10,759
Speaker 2: about interrupting church services in this way that I think

871
00:41:10,800 --> 00:41:13,160
Speaker 2: for a lot of Americans is going to look over

872
00:41:13,200 --> 00:41:14,680
Speaker 2: the top and very uns.

873
00:41:14,440 --> 00:41:16,520
Speaker 3: Because it is over the top and it is ridiculous,

874
00:41:16,520 --> 00:41:19,080
Speaker 3: like the people violate the social contract at the most

875
00:41:19,080 --> 00:41:19,720
Speaker 3: basic level.

876
00:41:20,120 --> 00:41:23,480
Speaker 2: Can I ask you one thing though, because do you

877
00:41:23,600 --> 00:41:25,440
Speaker 2: also I think you use the term egregious?

878
00:41:25,880 --> 00:41:26,319
Speaker 4: Is that fair?

879
00:41:26,440 --> 00:41:26,720
Speaker 1: Yeah?

880
00:41:26,800 --> 00:41:30,400
Speaker 2: Do you also think it's egregious that ICE has interrupted

881
00:41:30,440 --> 00:41:33,879
Speaker 2: church services to arrest make arrests of undocumented in moment?

882
00:41:33,960 --> 00:41:35,400
Speaker 3: But so you know, this is kind of my point

883
00:41:35,440 --> 00:41:37,040
Speaker 3: is that it is a race to the bottom and

884
00:41:37,080 --> 00:41:39,200
Speaker 3: if we want to have some sort of norms whenever

885
00:41:39,239 --> 00:41:42,719
Speaker 3: we're like and by the way, even but do you

886
00:41:42,880 --> 00:41:45,360
Speaker 3: because it is a bit difficult when you have churches

887
00:41:45,400 --> 00:41:49,160
Speaker 3: who basically declare themselves as a place where the law itself,

888
00:41:49,160 --> 00:41:52,080
Speaker 3: immigration law does not be allowed to enforce like that

889
00:41:52,120 --> 00:41:54,200
Speaker 3: would be like saying that you can commit any crime

890
00:41:54,200 --> 00:41:56,120
Speaker 3: inside of a church and as long as you do that,

891
00:41:56,200 --> 00:41:58,920
Speaker 3: you're going to be immune from federal or estate prosecution.

892
00:41:59,239 --> 00:42:01,720
Speaker 3: So you know, I do think it is fundamentally different.

893
00:42:01,840 --> 00:42:02,600
Speaker 3: And then second, you.

894
00:42:02,600 --> 00:42:05,279
Speaker 2: Know, journal in a sense, I mean, I agree with

895
00:42:05,320 --> 00:42:08,760
Speaker 2: you that it's fundamentally different because the harm of coming

896
00:42:08,800 --> 00:42:11,000
Speaker 2: in and like arrest, Like those people that were at

897
00:42:11,000 --> 00:42:12,880
Speaker 2: the church, I think they were upset and they were angry.

898
00:42:13,000 --> 00:42:14,280
Speaker 4: They're fine right.

899
00:42:14,600 --> 00:42:18,759
Speaker 2: To come in and interrupt services, to make arrest in

900
00:42:18,800 --> 00:42:22,160
Speaker 2: front of everybody and with children and families there, like

901
00:42:22,280 --> 00:42:24,000
Speaker 2: that is deeply so you could.

902
00:42:23,800 --> 00:42:25,920
Speaker 3: Just never arrest if a murderer was hiding inside of

903
00:42:25,920 --> 00:42:26,719
Speaker 3: a church, could you go and.

904
00:42:26,640 --> 00:42:28,480
Speaker 2: You could, Cary, we're not talking about them, We're not

905
00:42:28,520 --> 00:42:32,640
Speaker 2: talking about violation. We're talking about what is a civil

906
00:42:32,680 --> 00:42:34,520
Speaker 2: offense in terms of not all.

907
00:42:34,400 --> 00:42:36,960
Speaker 3: The time, we've had multiple illegals who live in churches

908
00:42:37,040 --> 00:42:38,080
Speaker 3: to escape prosecution.

909
00:42:38,560 --> 00:42:42,480
Speaker 2: So then it's clear. Then you find it egregious when

910
00:42:42,520 --> 00:42:44,719
Speaker 2: people protest in a church, but you do not find

911
00:42:44,760 --> 00:42:47,879
Speaker 2: it egregious when Ice reads it's kit it out in.

912
00:42:47,880 --> 00:42:50,080
Speaker 4: All the military year and pulls people out.

913
00:42:50,000 --> 00:42:50,680
Speaker 1: I would not do it.

914
00:42:50,719 --> 00:42:53,080
Speaker 3: I would not do it for some, but personally, I

915
00:42:53,080 --> 00:42:55,240
Speaker 3: can only speak for myself. If it was just purely

916
00:42:55,400 --> 00:42:57,920
Speaker 3: like uh, you know, like women, children, people have committed

917
00:42:57,960 --> 00:42:59,200
Speaker 3: no crime, yeah, I would say don't do it.

918
00:42:59,200 --> 00:43:01,120
Speaker 1: I think that you you should be able to do

919
00:43:01,160 --> 00:43:02,080
Speaker 1: it a different way.

920
00:43:02,200 --> 00:43:04,440
Speaker 3: What I have seen, though, is there have been extremely

921
00:43:04,480 --> 00:43:07,880
Speaker 3: high profile illegal activists who are actually have committed felonies,

922
00:43:07,880 --> 00:43:10,080
Speaker 3: who go and hide in churches at the direction often

923
00:43:10,440 --> 00:43:12,319
Speaker 3: somebody right down there.

924
00:43:13,640 --> 00:43:17,239
Speaker 2: Let's use the specifics of what we've seen unfold. There's

925
00:43:17,239 --> 00:43:21,520
Speaker 2: a lawsuit right now against the federal government alleging violations

926
00:43:21,520 --> 00:43:25,160
Speaker 2: of people's constitutional right to worship and disrupting, you know,

927
00:43:25,239 --> 00:43:28,520
Speaker 2: their religious practices that were brought by a variety of

928
00:43:28,560 --> 00:43:31,239
Speaker 2: religious organizations. I know the Quakers are involved, there's a

929
00:43:31,280 --> 00:43:33,640
Speaker 2: number of other religious groups that are involved as well.

930
00:43:34,080 --> 00:43:36,959
Speaker 2: And what they allege is not only that these rates

931
00:43:37,000 --> 00:43:40,360
Speaker 2: have occurred, you know, during services on church property, et cetera,

932
00:43:40,800 --> 00:43:43,920
Speaker 2: but it creates a climate. We're not only undocumented immigrants,

933
00:43:44,040 --> 00:43:46,680
Speaker 2: but many other church members are fearful of even going

934
00:43:46,719 --> 00:43:49,040
Speaker 2: to church. So you are, you know, so if you're

935
00:43:49,120 --> 00:43:53,120
Speaker 2: upset about this incursion in terms of you know, protest

936
00:43:53,160 --> 00:43:56,399
Speaker 2: activity where I think you're wrong about the Face Act

937
00:43:56,400 --> 00:43:57,879
Speaker 2: being applicable here, but you.

938
00:43:57,800 --> 00:44:00,759
Speaker 3: Know, as you can, but it also or disruptive.

939
00:44:00,960 --> 00:44:02,840
Speaker 2: No, it does not know, it doesn't say disrupt the

940
00:44:02,840 --> 00:44:06,319
Speaker 2: text you can find that it's about threats intimidation, but

941
00:44:06,400 --> 00:44:12,000
Speaker 2: it also specifically says carves out peaceful first dimensions.

942
00:44:13,640 --> 00:44:14,319
Speaker 1: Following people to the.

943
00:44:16,160 --> 00:44:16,560
Speaker 4: Peaceful.

944
00:44:16,920 --> 00:44:20,399
Speaker 2: But in any case putting that aside, right, I think

945
00:44:20,560 --> 00:44:23,680
Speaker 2: if you are upset about people going into a church

946
00:44:23,840 --> 00:44:28,520
Speaker 2: to protest peacefully during a church service, I would say

947
00:44:28,600 --> 00:44:30,960
Speaker 2: that to be morally consistent, you should be even more

948
00:44:31,040 --> 00:44:35,320
Speaker 2: upset about the violation by federal agents coming in during

949
00:44:35,360 --> 00:44:38,160
Speaker 2: service to arrest people. And so that's why, you know,

950
00:44:38,239 --> 00:44:42,440
Speaker 2: I mean the the rights upset about this. Again, I

951
00:44:42,440 --> 00:44:45,720
Speaker 2: think the tactic was not smart. I think it caused,

952
00:44:45,880 --> 00:44:49,000
Speaker 2: you know, gave the right something that obviously they see

953
00:44:49,040 --> 00:44:51,200
Speaker 2: as a propaganda whin. I don't think it was the

954
00:44:51,280 --> 00:44:53,759
Speaker 2: right way to go about things. But I also can't

955
00:44:53,800 --> 00:44:56,360
Speaker 2: take seriously the rights like oh my God, the sanctity

956
00:44:56,400 --> 00:44:59,080
Speaker 2: of religion, blah blah blah, because these are also in

957
00:44:59,200 --> 00:45:00,400
Speaker 2: some cases the same people.

958
00:45:00,440 --> 00:45:01,200
Speaker 4: I think Tommy.

959
00:45:00,920 --> 00:45:04,279
Speaker 2: Tupperville, like yesterday said that all Muslims are terrible, and

960
00:45:04,320 --> 00:45:06,240
Speaker 2: the enemies within the case like they have no respect

961
00:45:06,719 --> 00:45:10,319
Speaker 2: for any sort of like blanket religious tradition. It's only

962
00:45:10,400 --> 00:45:12,680
Speaker 2: when it comes to, you know, something they don't like

963
00:45:12,719 --> 00:45:14,400
Speaker 2: from the left and specifically with regards.

964
00:45:14,480 --> 00:45:16,400
Speaker 3: Yeah, but okay, you can say the other side is inconsistent,

965
00:45:16,400 --> 00:45:18,080
Speaker 3: but that doesn't mean that you shouldn't condemn it. And

966
00:45:18,120 --> 00:45:20,880
Speaker 3: here we have the law specifically says injure intimidate or

967
00:45:20,920 --> 00:45:23,920
Speaker 3: interfere with religious worship. There's no it's like open and

968
00:45:23,960 --> 00:45:26,319
Speaker 3: shut for every single one of these pro You don't

969
00:45:26,320 --> 00:45:28,920
Speaker 3: think that they injure into interfere.

970
00:45:28,960 --> 00:45:32,080
Speaker 4: They did not intimidate or And again there is I'm sorry.

971
00:45:32,600 --> 00:45:37,760
Speaker 2: Specific car bounce for again peaceful First Amendment protest activity.

972
00:45:37,760 --> 00:45:38,759
Speaker 1: I don't think now do I.

973
00:45:38,719 --> 00:45:42,600
Speaker 2: Think, you know, maybe maybe like a trespassing charge potentially,

974
00:45:42,960 --> 00:45:45,480
Speaker 2: But the person that they focused in on here is

975
00:45:45,560 --> 00:45:48,960
Speaker 2: specifically Don Lemon, and that to me, I think I

976
00:45:49,000 --> 00:45:52,480
Speaker 2: think should be again, as a journalist, I think you

977
00:45:52,480 --> 00:45:54,480
Speaker 2: should find very troubling.

978
00:45:54,640 --> 00:45:56,239
Speaker 1: So here's here's my transgressive take.

979
00:45:56,440 --> 00:45:58,920
Speaker 3: I would agree with you if we had not already

980
00:45:58,920 --> 00:46:01,600
Speaker 3: had multiple journalist who were prosecuted on the day of

981
00:46:01,680 --> 00:46:04,440
Speaker 3: January sixth. You had three, at least three streamers that

982
00:46:04,520 --> 00:46:08,120
Speaker 3: I know of, Isabella de Luca, Baked Alaska, and Owen Schroyer,

983
00:46:08,120 --> 00:46:11,000
Speaker 3: who were all prosecuted by the DOJ and basic some

984
00:46:11,080 --> 00:46:13,680
Speaker 3: of them actually spent time in prison even though they

985
00:46:13,719 --> 00:46:16,640
Speaker 3: were streaming what was going on under the same thing.

986
00:46:16,719 --> 00:46:19,719
Speaker 3: You could make that argument is that they were interviewing people.

987
00:46:20,320 --> 00:46:21,000
Speaker 4: You support that.

988
00:46:21,120 --> 00:46:24,000
Speaker 1: No, I don't. And that's why I'm saying.

989
00:46:24,040 --> 00:46:27,799
Speaker 3: That's my transgressive take is while I despise don Lemon,

990
00:46:28,000 --> 00:46:30,319
Speaker 3: I think we should set a standard. Actually, and this

991
00:46:30,440 --> 00:46:32,640
Speaker 3: is part of my frustration is we're all focusing on

992
00:46:32,719 --> 00:46:36,480
Speaker 3: don No. It's about the story is the protesters and

993
00:46:36,600 --> 00:46:41,040
Speaker 3: Keith Ellison and Governor Walsh and Jacob Fray and the

994
00:46:41,200 --> 00:46:44,640
Speaker 3: entire like live industrial complex, which has zero to say

995
00:46:44,640 --> 00:46:47,480
Speaker 3: about it. Promila and Japaul even did the meme where

996
00:46:47,520 --> 00:46:49,640
Speaker 3: she said it was mostly peaceful whenever she was.

997
00:46:49,640 --> 00:46:52,560
Speaker 4: Pro And that's why I'm like, that's true.

998
00:46:52,640 --> 00:46:54,680
Speaker 1: Look if a if Nike, surely.

999
00:46:54,719 --> 00:46:57,719
Speaker 4: When Governor Wallas's well, Nick Shirley did go and.

1000
00:46:59,200 --> 00:47:04,360
Speaker 3: They care if a Somali fraudster was a leader of

1001
00:47:04,440 --> 00:47:06,880
Speaker 3: a mosque and it was Nick Shirley and people went in.

1002
00:47:06,920 --> 00:47:10,719
Speaker 3: These people would be screaming to high heaven. You think

1003
00:47:10,719 --> 00:47:15,560
Speaker 3: they'd be talking about mostly peaceful not for a second. No,

1004
00:47:15,680 --> 00:47:17,839
Speaker 3: I actually would not be defending him because I think

1005
00:47:17,880 --> 00:47:20,520
Speaker 3: this is crazy behavior. I'm even said that Nick Shirley

1006
00:47:20,719 --> 00:47:23,200
Speaker 3: literally did a piss poor job and is a retard.

1007
00:47:23,239 --> 00:47:25,520
Speaker 3: It doesn't know what the word benevolent means. So I'm

1008
00:47:25,560 --> 00:47:27,879
Speaker 3: not somebody who's sitting here and defending all of these

1009
00:47:27,920 --> 00:47:28,560
Speaker 3: types of tactics.

1010
00:47:28,600 --> 00:47:30,520
Speaker 1: And I defended all the January sixth streamers.

1011
00:47:30,600 --> 00:47:32,440
Speaker 3: I don't think Don Lemon should be charged, which is

1012
00:47:32,480 --> 00:47:36,680
Speaker 3: why I'm so frustrated that Don Lemon somehow, by the way,

1013
00:47:36,680 --> 00:47:38,560
Speaker 3: we can get to his little clip about claiming white

1014
00:47:38,560 --> 00:47:41,840
Speaker 3: supremacy and denigrating people. Again, the enduring image of that

1015
00:47:41,880 --> 00:47:44,480
Speaker 3: protest is an Asian family who are trying to protect

1016
00:47:44,480 --> 00:47:47,080
Speaker 3: their child from these freaks who are screaming.

1017
00:47:46,640 --> 00:47:47,200
Speaker 1: In their face.

1018
00:47:47,480 --> 00:47:50,720
Speaker 3: But this is the issue, is that BLM and people

1019
00:47:50,800 --> 00:47:52,759
Speaker 3: always are like, why does he talk about it so much?

1020
00:47:52,960 --> 00:47:56,480
Speaker 3: This is the beating heart of liberal activism. The right

1021
00:47:56,560 --> 00:48:00,239
Speaker 3: to distrib the right to be anti social protest, Yes

1022
00:48:00,520 --> 00:48:05,680
Speaker 3: that is protest is that they believe gives them the

1023
00:48:05,719 --> 00:48:07,120
Speaker 3: right to destroy.

1024
00:48:07,360 --> 00:48:08,319
Speaker 4: Can you acknowledge those?

1025
00:48:08,760 --> 00:48:11,080
Speaker 2: Can you acknowledge though that it is some crazy business

1026
00:48:11,200 --> 00:48:12,840
Speaker 2: to have a guy who is the.

1027
00:48:12,640 --> 00:48:15,560
Speaker 4: Field officer, like the head of.

1028
00:48:15,560 --> 00:48:19,040
Speaker 2: The agency, the regional agency of ICE, to be in

1029
00:48:19,080 --> 00:48:21,839
Speaker 2: a position of moral authority like that, like that is

1030
00:48:22,080 --> 00:48:22,440
Speaker 2: that is.

1031
00:48:22,480 --> 00:48:24,879
Speaker 3: Why up to me to defend. That's up to the church.

1032
00:48:24,920 --> 00:48:27,719
Speaker 3: And if they're okay with the then fine whatever. There

1033
00:48:27,719 --> 00:48:30,200
Speaker 3: are crazy black pastors around who are literally believing in

1034
00:48:30,200 --> 00:48:33,640
Speaker 3: like straight black national consistent.

1035
00:48:34,880 --> 00:48:38,920
Speaker 2: Lawsuits about all of the aggressive and illegal tactics here.

1036
00:48:38,920 --> 00:48:42,720
Speaker 2: And I think that, and I think the reason why

1037
00:48:43,440 --> 00:48:46,239
Speaker 2: people you know, oftentimes comment on how much you bring

1038
00:48:46,320 --> 00:48:49,319
Speaker 2: up black lives matter, and like the the level of

1039
00:48:49,520 --> 00:48:53,520
Speaker 2: energy that you bring to this, which is some private

1040
00:48:53,600 --> 00:48:56,520
Speaker 2: individuals who did a protest.

1041
00:48:56,480 --> 00:48:57,319
Speaker 4: That you don't like.

1042
00:48:57,960 --> 00:49:01,640
Speaker 2: But then to me, the much more important and consequential

1043
00:49:01,680 --> 00:49:04,640
Speaker 2: part of this story is those are those are like

1044
00:49:04,719 --> 00:49:09,080
Speaker 2: relatively powerless individuals, right who of course it is you're

1045
00:49:09,120 --> 00:49:09,480
Speaker 2: looking at it.

1046
00:49:10,160 --> 00:49:11,799
Speaker 1: Who did a thing you did?

1047
00:49:12,520 --> 00:49:14,840
Speaker 4: Can I finish who did a thing that you don't like? Okay?

1048
00:49:15,440 --> 00:49:18,640
Speaker 2: I think that that is so much less consequential than

1049
00:49:18,680 --> 00:49:22,440
Speaker 2: the fact that you have a the federal government with

1050
00:49:22,560 --> 00:49:29,400
Speaker 2: all of its powers who are aggressively and illegally using

1051
00:49:29,480 --> 00:49:33,480
Speaker 2: tactics in a widespread manner that amounts to a terror

1052
00:49:33,520 --> 00:49:37,880
Speaker 2: campaign in these communities, and with this story specifically, I

1053
00:49:37,920 --> 00:49:40,400
Speaker 2: find the most important and most troubling thing not to

1054
00:49:40,440 --> 00:49:43,279
Speaker 2: be some tactics that I don't think are effective, but

1055
00:49:43,320 --> 00:49:46,600
Speaker 2: to be the fact that you immediately reach for, let

1056
00:49:46,640 --> 00:49:50,560
Speaker 2: me criminalize this journalism. That's the part that is far

1057
00:49:50,719 --> 00:49:54,879
Speaker 2: more has far more far reaching consequences than you know,

1058
00:49:55,040 --> 00:49:59,240
Speaker 2: some protesters did a thing that you found to be distasteful.

1059
00:49:58,840 --> 00:50:00,400
Speaker 3: Well, I would give you the same thing. Is I

1060
00:50:00,480 --> 00:50:02,840
Speaker 3: find many of the tactic to the extent that I

1061
00:50:02,920 --> 00:50:06,080
Speaker 3: have problems with ice. It is violation of US two process,

1062
00:50:06,320 --> 00:50:10,160
Speaker 3: violation of US rights fundamentally built Like you, I support

1063
00:50:10,280 --> 00:50:13,960
Speaker 3: deporting people who are here illegally, so yes, my tactical

1064
00:50:14,200 --> 00:50:16,840
Speaker 3: objection is going to be on that. But fundamentally I

1065
00:50:16,880 --> 00:50:19,000
Speaker 3: think that people who are illegally should lead. You don't

1066
00:50:19,040 --> 00:50:20,920
Speaker 3: agree with that, that's fine, But this gets to my

1067
00:50:20,960 --> 00:50:24,160
Speaker 3: point about the moral equivalents. Is they are so certain

1068
00:50:24,239 --> 00:50:27,000
Speaker 3: in their moral righteousness that they can walk into and

1069
00:50:27,040 --> 00:50:29,560
Speaker 3: disrupt every facet of our lives. They can burn our

1070
00:50:29,560 --> 00:50:32,200
Speaker 3: cities to the ground, They can turn every major blue

1071
00:50:32,200 --> 00:50:34,600
Speaker 3: city into a literal shithole for two to three years,

1072
00:50:34,800 --> 00:50:38,800
Speaker 3: spike the murder, raid, take over federal and educational institutions.

1073
00:50:38,800 --> 00:50:42,960
Speaker 3: That's why you're saying powerless completely not true, elite, No,

1074
00:50:43,000 --> 00:50:45,560
Speaker 3: but it did happen. And that's why that's why people

1075
00:50:45,600 --> 00:50:47,960
Speaker 3: like us bring it up because when they were in power,

1076
00:50:48,120 --> 00:50:51,160
Speaker 3: and then Keith Ellison, who is in power, is defending this.

1077
00:50:51,680 --> 00:50:54,879
Speaker 3: Are we see with our own eyes very clearly? Oh right,

1078
00:50:55,000 --> 00:50:56,960
Speaker 3: So when you people are in power, they're going to

1079
00:50:56,960 --> 00:50:59,600
Speaker 3: allow this. They're going to use the same selective political prosecution.

1080
00:51:00,040 --> 00:51:02,920
Speaker 3: Nobody gave two shits about journalism when all of these two,

1081
00:51:03,200 --> 00:51:04,799
Speaker 3: when these three I think it might have even been

1082
00:51:04,840 --> 00:51:08,080
Speaker 3: five streamers who were all charged under January sixth, they

1083
00:51:08,080 --> 00:51:08,480
Speaker 3: held it up.

1084
00:51:08,520 --> 00:51:10,120
Speaker 1: They said they're not legitimate journalists.

1085
00:51:10,160 --> 00:51:12,120
Speaker 3: Now, when Don Lemon is here because now he apparently

1086
00:51:12,160 --> 00:51:14,440
Speaker 3: because he's black and gay, then all all of a sudden,

1087
00:51:14,440 --> 00:51:16,280
Speaker 3: we've rediscovered the First Amendment.

1088
00:51:16,320 --> 00:51:19,600
Speaker 1: There is zero consistency like there is I.

1089
00:51:19,520 --> 00:51:22,880
Speaker 2: Think there is zero consistency in saying it is fine

1090
00:51:23,080 --> 00:51:25,480
Speaker 2: for ice agents to go in and rate a church.

1091
00:51:25,480 --> 00:51:27,759
Speaker 2: And you haven't said anything about that up until I

1092
00:51:27,840 --> 00:51:31,480
Speaker 2: asked you about it, and to be so incredibly upset

1093
00:51:32,040 --> 00:51:33,040
Speaker 2: about one.

1094
00:51:32,920 --> 00:51:35,359
Speaker 4: Church service getting interrupted by a handful.

1095
00:51:35,080 --> 00:51:37,800
Speaker 3: Of pion because fundamentals, I think that is wildly because

1096
00:51:37,840 --> 00:51:40,680
Speaker 3: what you're trying to defend is the principle that illegals

1097
00:51:40,719 --> 00:51:43,560
Speaker 3: who are tens of millions here present can go and

1098
00:51:43,600 --> 00:51:44,799
Speaker 3: find safe sanctuary.

1099
00:51:45,040 --> 00:51:45,880
Speaker 1: I'm a church in anyone.

1100
00:51:45,960 --> 00:51:46,759
Speaker 4: What I'm trying to do.

1101
00:51:46,920 --> 00:51:49,080
Speaker 1: I don't believe criminals. I believe have the right to

1102
00:51:49,120 --> 00:51:50,280
Speaker 1: sanctuary anyway.

1103
00:51:50,280 --> 00:51:53,800
Speaker 2: ICE agents should not be brought in to American cities

1104
00:51:54,080 --> 00:51:57,640
Speaker 2: by the thousands to terrorize entire communities. Well, which is

1105
00:51:57,680 --> 00:51:59,520
Speaker 2: what has been done here and is not about this

1106
00:51:59,600 --> 00:52:04,440
Speaker 2: is not even about immigration, that is true, true, Then

1107
00:52:04,480 --> 00:52:05,560
Speaker 2: why are they in Minneapolis?

1108
00:52:05,560 --> 00:52:05,840
Speaker 1: Tell me?

1109
00:52:05,880 --> 00:52:07,680
Speaker 4: Because tell me why did they chose many.

1110
00:52:07,800 --> 00:52:09,759
Speaker 3: Agents are in Minneapolis? Because the Nike surely video and

1111
00:52:09,760 --> 00:52:11,520
Speaker 3: because that's how this administration.

1112
00:52:11,040 --> 00:52:13,280
Speaker 4: Operates, which has nothing to do with immigration.

1113
00:52:13,440 --> 00:52:14,080
Speaker 1: Well, there are.

1114
00:52:14,040 --> 00:52:18,240
Speaker 3: Several, like thewhelming.

1115
00:52:17,160 --> 00:52:21,360
Speaker 2: Number of Somali immigrants are in fact American citizens.

1116
00:52:21,480 --> 00:52:22,600
Speaker 4: Yeah, but that's why they're there.

1117
00:52:22,680 --> 00:52:24,560
Speaker 2: I mean, let's just open our eyes to what is

1118
00:52:24,640 --> 00:52:26,759
Speaker 2: really going on here. It has to do with the

1119
00:52:26,800 --> 00:52:29,440
Speaker 2: fact that they hate some They hate anyone who's not

1120
00:52:29,800 --> 00:52:34,239
Speaker 2: white and Christian. They are after anyone who you know

1121
00:52:34,320 --> 00:52:35,520
Speaker 2: has opposed to Trump.

1122
00:52:35,800 --> 00:52:37,040
Speaker 4: They hate walls.

1123
00:52:37,280 --> 00:52:40,480
Speaker 2: They now hate Jacob Fry because he opposed him as well.

1124
00:52:40,719 --> 00:52:42,560
Speaker 2: But I mean, if you look at what these people

1125
00:52:42,560 --> 00:52:44,920
Speaker 2: are actually doing, it's incredibly weak.

1126
00:52:45,320 --> 00:52:46,360
Speaker 4: Like Fry is out.

1127
00:52:46,160 --> 00:52:48,400
Speaker 2: There basically saying like there's nothing really good we can

1128
00:52:48,480 --> 00:52:52,200
Speaker 2: do about ice agents who are abusing people in the streets,

1129
00:52:52,200 --> 00:52:56,360
Speaker 2: immigrants and Americans alike. Well, I am much more, yes,

1130
00:52:56,440 --> 00:53:00,239
Speaker 2: I am much more upset about that, which has the

1131
00:53:00,280 --> 00:53:06,080
Speaker 2: backing of the largest law enforcement budget in history, and

1132
00:53:06,360 --> 00:53:08,880
Speaker 2: is backed by the entire federal government, and yes, my

1133
00:53:08,960 --> 00:53:12,920
Speaker 2: taxpayer dollars. Then one church protest that I think was

1134
00:53:12,960 --> 00:53:14,120
Speaker 2: probably that's what I'm saying.

1135
00:53:14,120 --> 00:53:16,399
Speaker 3: You're looking at as an ail advised church protest and

1136
00:53:16,440 --> 00:53:21,040
Speaker 3: not a sustained campaign since twenty fourteen, which has normalized

1137
00:53:21,239 --> 00:53:24,960
Speaker 3: this behavior across the nation and which again literally burned

1138
00:53:25,000 --> 00:53:25,840
Speaker 3: almost in America.

1139
00:53:26,000 --> 00:53:28,640
Speaker 4: Tell me about the tactics that are being used right now.

1140
00:53:28,760 --> 00:53:31,160
Speaker 3: Yes, I've criticized all those tactics here consistently.

1141
00:53:31,200 --> 00:53:34,080
Speaker 4: No no protesters, the protests.

1142
00:53:34,760 --> 00:53:37,680
Speaker 2: Tell me about those tactics, because it has been overwhelmingly

1143
00:53:37,760 --> 00:53:40,719
Speaker 2: what people have been doing is documenting what ICE.

1144
00:53:40,600 --> 00:53:42,239
Speaker 3: I mean ICE, Yeah, you use it, you could say,

1145
00:53:42,280 --> 00:53:46,919
Speaker 3: and they have tried well. Documenting is a very very

1146
00:53:47,000 --> 00:53:49,719
Speaker 3: small cry from the vast majority of them actually are

1147
00:53:49,760 --> 00:53:51,680
Speaker 3: trying to disrupt. And you know, that's a whole other

1148
00:53:51,960 --> 00:53:55,239
Speaker 3: type of conversation where again, we've normalized it so that

1149
00:53:55,440 --> 00:53:58,239
Speaker 3: ordinary Americans just think that it's that they're like Martin

1150
00:53:58,320 --> 00:54:02,080
Speaker 3: Luther King Junior reincarnate, going and putting their cars, let's say,

1151
00:54:02,120 --> 00:54:04,840
Speaker 3: often in front of ICE agents whenever they're trying to

1152
00:54:04,840 --> 00:54:05,480
Speaker 3: conduct a raid.

1153
00:54:05,680 --> 00:54:07,480
Speaker 1: I won't even defend some of the tactics of the raid.

1154
00:54:07,520 --> 00:54:10,440
Speaker 3: I think it's chaotic, and again, like you, I tactically

1155
00:54:10,640 --> 00:54:13,319
Speaker 3: think it's a bad idea, but fundamentally, like you do

1156
00:54:13,520 --> 00:54:14,680
Speaker 3: agree with these protesters.

1157
00:54:14,800 --> 00:54:17,040
Speaker 1: I think illegal should be deported. I think they should leave.

1158
00:54:17,280 --> 00:54:19,759
Speaker 1: And you got that's the fundamental Can you.

1159
00:54:19,760 --> 00:54:22,520
Speaker 2: Not see the Can you not see and that's not

1160
00:54:22,560 --> 00:54:24,759
Speaker 2: even true what you just said, But can you not

1161
00:54:25,000 --> 00:54:30,719
Speaker 2: see the vast disparity between interrupting a church service and

1162
00:54:30,960 --> 00:54:34,719
Speaker 2: shooting a woman dead three times in the face and

1163
00:54:34,760 --> 00:54:39,120
Speaker 2: facing zero accountability well, and one being a group of

1164
00:54:39,200 --> 00:54:43,880
Speaker 2: powerless private citizens and the other being the full force

1165
00:54:44,239 --> 00:54:48,319
Speaker 2: of the United States federal government and the largest law

1166
00:54:48,400 --> 00:54:53,000
Speaker 2: enforcement budget in history, larger than all but thirteen countries, militaries,

1167
00:54:53,320 --> 00:54:55,200
Speaker 2: and the Vice President of the United States saying they

1168
00:54:55,200 --> 00:55:00,000
Speaker 2: have quote absolute immunity, like which one is, which one?

1169
00:55:00,000 --> 00:55:02,280
Speaker 2: No one is more of a danger, more of a threat,

1170
00:55:02,640 --> 00:55:04,200
Speaker 2: or arrow.

1171
00:55:04,160 --> 00:55:07,080
Speaker 3: View of it, considering the fact that not that long

1172
00:55:07,120 --> 00:55:09,440
Speaker 3: ago they actually did have the full power of the government,

1173
00:55:09,640 --> 00:55:11,840
Speaker 3: nobody actually sustained they will charges they do.

1174
00:55:12,000 --> 00:55:12,320
Speaker 5: But they do.

1175
00:55:12,560 --> 00:55:15,120
Speaker 3: And that's why they don't now, Yes, because much of

1176
00:55:15,160 --> 00:55:17,120
Speaker 3: the tactics of the way that they're behaving, and I

1177
00:55:17,160 --> 00:55:19,319
Speaker 3: will even freely admit much of the way of the

1178
00:55:19,320 --> 00:55:21,239
Speaker 3: tactics that the Right and Ice and all of them

1179
00:55:21,239 --> 00:55:24,120
Speaker 3: are employing make it so that very likely these.

1180
00:55:23,920 --> 00:55:25,520
Speaker 1: Freaks are all going to be back into power.

1181
00:55:25,680 --> 00:55:27,880
Speaker 3: But you know, if we're trying to talk here about

1182
00:55:27,920 --> 00:55:31,040
Speaker 3: the way that this all arise and the way that

1183
00:55:31,120 --> 00:55:34,360
Speaker 3: liberal protest norms have evolved now to this point, and

1184
00:55:34,400 --> 00:55:38,080
Speaker 3: where the entire democratic liberal industrial complex will defend it

1185
00:55:38,120 --> 00:55:41,320
Speaker 3: and or stay silent or criticize it only as tactical,

1186
00:55:41,520 --> 00:55:44,439
Speaker 3: you can then realize why most people who may find

1187
00:55:44,440 --> 00:55:46,520
Speaker 3: the Ice thing distasteful are going to be like.

1188
00:55:46,560 --> 00:55:48,759
Speaker 1: Yeah, well you know, look at what we've got face

1189
00:55:48,800 --> 00:55:49,160
Speaker 1: in us.

1190
00:55:49,280 --> 00:55:51,359
Speaker 3: Whenever the other side is in power you and that's

1191
00:55:51,400 --> 00:55:53,160
Speaker 3: exactly what happened with Keith Hell's but saga.

1192
00:55:53,239 --> 00:55:56,680
Speaker 2: We can't always like go back to it's it's this person,

1193
00:55:56,760 --> 00:55:59,240
Speaker 2: it's that person's fault, it's this backlash, it's that backlash

1194
00:55:59,280 --> 00:56:03,640
Speaker 2: because you love to start with the liberal the Black

1195
00:56:03,680 --> 00:56:07,319
Speaker 2: Lives Matter liberal protest tactics that, yes, at times, you know,

1196
00:56:07,360 --> 00:56:09,920
Speaker 2: the fringe of that was very violent. It was not

1197
00:56:10,400 --> 00:56:13,759
Speaker 2: anything that should and not anything that should be condoned,

1198
00:56:14,040 --> 00:56:17,360
Speaker 2: and was incredibly counterproductive in terms of the goals of

1199
00:56:17,400 --> 00:56:21,080
Speaker 2: that movement. But you never look to what precipitates that,

1200
00:56:21,440 --> 00:56:25,000
Speaker 2: which is decades I mean of you know, decades of

1201
00:56:25,360 --> 00:56:30,160
Speaker 2: systematic racism, which is police killings of unarmed black men.

1202
00:56:30,560 --> 00:56:33,680
Speaker 2: So how is there no accountability for that that leads.

1203
00:56:33,440 --> 00:56:34,680
Speaker 4: To an extreme reaction.

1204
00:56:34,760 --> 00:56:37,760
Speaker 3: We want to relitigate reaction. It was a completely fake crisis.

1205
00:56:37,840 --> 00:56:39,800
Speaker 3: The number people can go check if they want you

1206
00:56:39,840 --> 00:56:41,160
Speaker 3: the number of unarmed black people were.

1207
00:56:41,480 --> 00:56:43,080
Speaker 1: Proberts in the year two. Doocrity.

1208
00:56:43,520 --> 00:56:46,680
Speaker 2: I know you're not genuinely I know you're not genuinely

1209
00:56:46,760 --> 00:56:50,640
Speaker 2: asserting that there is no racism in this country, and

1210
00:56:50,680 --> 00:56:54,080
Speaker 2: that there hasn't been systematic races not just from Republicans,

1211
00:56:54,120 --> 00:56:58,760
Speaker 2: but from both parties right in power that have criminalized,

1212
00:56:58,800 --> 00:57:00,400
Speaker 2: that have made it so that you have, you know,

1213
00:57:00,520 --> 00:57:04,440
Speaker 2: a mass incarcerated population that has backed redlining.

1214
00:57:04,480 --> 00:57:06,040
Speaker 4: I mean, we can go through the history.

1215
00:57:06,440 --> 00:57:10,719
Speaker 2: So if you so, it's not accurate to say that

1216
00:57:10,719 --> 00:57:13,279
Speaker 2: that protest movement was based on nothing and came out

1217
00:57:13,320 --> 00:57:18,480
Speaker 2: of nowhere because statistics that is just no, that's not

1218
00:57:19,240 --> 00:57:23,640
Speaker 2: there is no ability to create that kind of a

1219
00:57:23,680 --> 00:57:27,520
Speaker 2: mass movement out of nothing, right, you have to acknowledge

1220
00:57:27,640 --> 00:57:31,640
Speaker 2: that there has to have been something. Yes, last note

1221
00:57:32,760 --> 00:57:35,520
Speaker 2: to just start with the things that liberals do that

1222
00:57:35,560 --> 00:57:38,400
Speaker 2: you don't like, and you you act like that and

1223
00:57:38,480 --> 00:57:40,760
Speaker 2: you love to act like that is the biggest problem.

1224
00:57:40,840 --> 00:57:44,959
Speaker 2: So for example, again you have so you're so exercised

1225
00:57:45,360 --> 00:57:48,560
Speaker 2: about this incursion in a church, you have nothing to

1226
00:57:48,640 --> 00:57:53,080
Speaker 2: say about the way that systematically, across the country religious

1227
00:57:53,080 --> 00:57:57,120
Speaker 2: worship spaces have been violated and made unsafe by the

1228
00:57:57,760 --> 00:57:58,920
Speaker 2: attacks from the special.

1229
00:57:58,720 --> 00:58:02,160
Speaker 3: I think like quite clearly that there is a difference.

1230
00:58:02,160 --> 00:58:03,200
Speaker 3: And because you don't.

1231
00:58:02,960 --> 00:58:05,480
Speaker 2: Get the difference is that one way works and it's

1232
00:58:06,360 --> 00:58:06,880
Speaker 2: coming in around.

1233
00:58:06,960 --> 00:58:09,240
Speaker 3: They fundamentally think that illegals just have a right to

1234
00:58:09,280 --> 00:58:10,040
Speaker 3: sanctuary church.

1235
00:58:10,120 --> 00:58:10,479
Speaker 1: I don't.

1236
00:58:10,480 --> 00:58:12,520
Speaker 3: I don't think criminals who are here illegally have a

1237
00:58:12,600 --> 00:58:15,080
Speaker 3: right to sanctuary anywhere. The only sanctuary they have is

1238
00:58:15,080 --> 00:58:16,160
Speaker 3: in the home where.

1239
00:58:15,960 --> 00:58:20,680
Speaker 2: They were past presidents able to deport undocumented immigrants.

1240
00:58:20,840 --> 00:58:22,720
Speaker 1: I'm glad that you talked were they There's this new

1241
00:58:22,840 --> 00:58:24,160
Speaker 1: fake statistic.

1242
00:58:23,720 --> 00:58:26,720
Speaker 3: Going around about how Obama was able to deport three

1243
00:58:26,760 --> 00:58:29,600
Speaker 3: million people. What he did is he reclassified, turning people

1244
00:58:29,640 --> 00:58:32,880
Speaker 3: away at the border. Internal enforcement was an all time low.

1245
00:58:33,040 --> 00:58:35,080
Speaker 3: All they did was recross fight, just like they did

1246
00:58:35,200 --> 00:58:36,560
Speaker 3: with massive were here is the.

1247
00:58:36,560 --> 00:58:41,200
Speaker 2: Big previous Were previous presidents able to deport undocumented immigrants?

1248
00:58:41,240 --> 00:58:41,320
Speaker 5: Oh?

1249
00:58:41,320 --> 00:58:44,439
Speaker 3: Were they able to deport illegals at an extremely low

1250
00:58:44,520 --> 00:58:47,440
Speaker 3: rate and at a net rate in which it resulted

1251
00:58:47,480 --> 00:58:48,000
Speaker 3: in the last.

1252
00:58:49,520 --> 00:58:50,720
Speaker 1: Ten to fifteen million people here?

1253
00:58:51,040 --> 00:58:55,120
Speaker 2: Not violating church services was the key reason.

1254
00:58:55,320 --> 00:58:55,760
Speaker 1: No, don't.

1255
00:58:56,200 --> 00:58:58,439
Speaker 2: Yeah, of course, I mean, because it's ridiculous and they're

1256
00:58:58,440 --> 00:59:02,080
Speaker 2: doing the same things at school. Okay, so this is

1257
00:59:02,120 --> 00:59:05,240
Speaker 2: something that is genuinely different under the Trump administration. They

1258
00:59:05,280 --> 00:59:09,760
Speaker 2: rescinded the guidance that previously said schools and houses of

1259
00:59:09,800 --> 00:59:13,000
Speaker 2: worship are off limits, and that was fine with you.

1260
00:59:13,000 --> 00:59:13,600
Speaker 4: You had nothing to.

1261
00:59:13,520 --> 00:59:14,400
Speaker 1: Say about it. I don't think so.

1262
00:59:14,600 --> 00:59:15,400
Speaker 4: I don't so.

1263
00:59:15,560 --> 00:59:19,800
Speaker 2: I don't take seriously you're now deep concern about the

1264
00:59:19,840 --> 00:59:20,720
Speaker 2: sanctity of.

1265
00:59:20,760 --> 00:59:23,480
Speaker 4: The church services people are so trauma.

1266
00:59:23,600 --> 00:59:24,880
Speaker 1: As people know, I'm an atheist.

1267
00:59:24,880 --> 00:59:27,760
Speaker 3: I don't particularly care that much about sanctity of churches.

1268
00:59:27,800 --> 00:59:30,400
Speaker 3: I care about liberal protest norms because I can see

1269
00:59:30,480 --> 00:59:33,760
Speaker 3: and I lived through literal mass psychosis where people were

1270
00:59:33,800 --> 00:59:39,320
Speaker 3: storming buildings, restaurants, streets everywhere, rioting, looting, destroying property, exploding

1271
00:59:39,360 --> 00:59:42,560
Speaker 3: our murder rate, destroying the city that I literally lived in,

1272
00:59:42,720 --> 00:59:45,360
Speaker 3: to the point where we still have the same problems

1273
00:59:45,440 --> 00:59:48,160
Speaker 3: that from what five six years ago now at that time,

1274
00:59:48,320 --> 00:59:50,760
Speaker 3: Like that's why you're saying like it's an old thing,

1275
00:59:50,840 --> 00:59:53,560
Speaker 3: It's not like we live with the enduring consequences of that.

1276
00:59:53,640 --> 00:59:57,200
Speaker 3: In fact, literally across the nation, multiple cities and places

1277
00:59:57,240 --> 01:00:00,560
Speaker 3: and areas which I love have been ruined completely because

1278
01:00:00,560 --> 01:00:03,280
Speaker 3: of BLM and the so called criminal justice movement that

1279
01:00:03,320 --> 01:00:05,920
Speaker 3: followed and exploded through all of the people who are

1280
01:00:05,960 --> 01:00:08,960
Speaker 3: actually in power, people like Keith Ellison, who have nothing

1281
01:00:09,000 --> 01:00:12,320
Speaker 3: to say whenever a literal church is violated here because

1282
01:00:12,360 --> 01:00:16,320
Speaker 3: to them, that is permissible whereas any any sort of

1283
01:00:16,640 --> 01:00:20,880
Speaker 3: action to arrest people here illegally is what really gets.

1284
01:00:20,640 --> 01:00:22,960
Speaker 1: Them all spun up about. But there have the same

1285
01:00:23,040 --> 01:00:25,840
Speaker 1: selected that way.

1286
01:00:25,520 --> 01:00:31,320
Speaker 2: Not through before this, Before this, you know, multiple thousand

1287
01:00:31,400 --> 01:00:35,120
Speaker 2: federal agents storming the streets of Minneapolis, the whole region,

1288
01:00:35,160 --> 01:00:39,800
Speaker 2: twin cities. Before that, I was doing enforcement, there was

1289
01:00:39,880 --> 01:00:41,720
Speaker 2: immigration enforcement in Minnesota.

1290
01:00:41,800 --> 01:00:44,920
Speaker 1: No, that's not true, because is true. This is this

1291
01:00:44,960 --> 01:00:46,080
Speaker 1: is the problem.

1292
01:00:46,200 --> 01:00:49,120
Speaker 3: Sanctuary cities make it so that the jails do not

1293
01:00:49,240 --> 01:00:50,720
Speaker 3: turn over report.

1294
01:00:50,480 --> 01:00:52,440
Speaker 4: That is that is not true.

1295
01:00:52,480 --> 01:00:54,880
Speaker 1: They do not comes with detention.

1296
01:00:54,960 --> 01:00:58,920
Speaker 2: True when it comes to violent criminals. There has been

1297
01:00:59,000 --> 01:01:04,040
Speaker 2: cooperation between Minneapolis and the state of Minnesota. Have there

1298
01:01:04,080 --> 01:01:07,280
Speaker 2: been ICE enforcement actions in Minneapolis prior to the.

1299
01:01:07,240 --> 01:01:12,000
Speaker 3: Search Yes, previous regime where you only believe that people functions.

1300
01:01:12,680 --> 01:01:18,200
Speaker 2: Under this Trump administration, there have been ongoing ICE actions

1301
01:01:18,440 --> 01:01:19,840
Speaker 2: in and around Minneapolis.

1302
01:01:20,120 --> 01:01:22,960
Speaker 4: Did they stoke this back? No, So what does that

1303
01:01:23,040 --> 01:01:23,720
Speaker 4: tell you.

1304
01:01:23,720 --> 01:01:26,960
Speaker 2: No, people do not object to any undocumented in or

1305
01:01:26,960 --> 01:01:28,640
Speaker 2: there may be some people like that, but by and

1306
01:01:28,720 --> 01:01:32,160
Speaker 2: large to any undocumented immigrants getting deported. No. What they

1307
01:01:32,200 --> 01:01:34,880
Speaker 2: object to is what they're seeing right now in the

1308
01:01:34,880 --> 01:01:36,240
Speaker 2: streets of Minneapolis, and.

1309
01:01:36,200 --> 01:01:39,080
Speaker 4: They should object to that they should be horrified by that.

1310
01:01:39,440 --> 01:01:40,520
Speaker 4: I'm horrified by that.

1311
01:01:40,800 --> 01:01:44,920
Speaker 2: I'm horrified by giving the absolute immunity to a bunch

1312
01:01:44,960 --> 01:01:48,160
Speaker 2: of massed thugs who have said to people now they

1313
01:01:48,160 --> 01:01:50,400
Speaker 2: have threatened them, They've said, didn't you learn the lesson

1314
01:01:50,640 --> 01:01:53,880
Speaker 2: from that lesbian bitch. They are using the murder of

1315
01:01:53,920 --> 01:01:58,880
Speaker 2: Renee Goods as their ability to threaten people with the

1316
01:01:58,920 --> 01:02:03,040
Speaker 2: same type actions we have already seen now multiple shootings.

1317
01:02:03,040 --> 01:02:07,720
Speaker 2: We've seen also immigrants dying routinely now when they're in detention.

1318
01:02:08,120 --> 01:02:10,760
Speaker 2: So yes, I think people are right to be upset

1319
01:02:10,800 --> 01:02:13,400
Speaker 2: about that. That doesn't mean that they object to any

1320
01:02:13,440 --> 01:02:16,960
Speaker 2: immigrant ever being deported. It means they object to what

1321
01:02:17,120 --> 01:02:19,760
Speaker 2: is happening right now, and they should.

1322
01:02:20,160 --> 01:02:21,160
Speaker 4: And so I am.

1323
01:02:21,040 --> 01:02:24,560
Speaker 2: Going like, I think that is a far more consequential

1324
01:02:24,960 --> 01:02:28,040
Speaker 2: thing to happen in this country right now, backed by

1325
01:02:28,040 --> 01:02:32,240
Speaker 2: our tax dollars, with this private army for Trump and

1326
01:02:32,280 --> 01:02:36,680
Speaker 2: for Steven Miller that is completely rogue and completely unaccountable

1327
01:02:36,760 --> 01:02:40,040
Speaker 2: to the law. I think that is a vastly, vastly

1328
01:02:40,080 --> 01:02:43,840
Speaker 2: more important issue than some protesters who you know, I

1329
01:02:43,880 --> 01:02:46,760
Speaker 2: think you could probably listen. I think when you protest,

1330
01:02:46,880 --> 01:02:49,240
Speaker 2: if you violate the law, like there's an expectation that

1331
01:02:49,280 --> 01:02:53,720
Speaker 2: you may risk arrest, like could they get trespassing charges potentially,

1332
01:02:53,920 --> 01:02:55,720
Speaker 2: you know, will the government go after them for the

1333
01:02:55,720 --> 01:02:57,600
Speaker 2: Face Act? That can be litigated in court. I don't

1334
01:02:57,600 --> 01:03:00,320
Speaker 2: think that they'll succeed, but sure they took on that risk.

1335
01:03:00,440 --> 01:03:03,280
Speaker 3: Is vie is usually not is met with a fine.

1336
01:03:03,320 --> 01:03:04,840
Speaker 3: So just to be clear, like, I'm not saying all

1337
01:03:04,880 --> 01:03:07,840
Speaker 3: these people should be thrown in prison for years at all,

1338
01:03:07,880 --> 01:03:10,200
Speaker 3: and that's why again I would ignore it. But you know,

1339
01:03:10,280 --> 01:03:12,280
Speaker 3: to your point there, I do think it is a

1340
01:03:12,320 --> 01:03:14,439
Speaker 3: bit of a canard whenever people are saying they don't

1341
01:03:14,720 --> 01:03:17,480
Speaker 3: like even when you're talking about violent protesters, People like

1342
01:03:17,560 --> 01:03:21,000
Speaker 3: me believe, I mean Joe Biden, the so called moderate

1343
01:03:21,240 --> 01:03:23,440
Speaker 3: believe that people who are here illegally, who are caught

1344
01:03:23,520 --> 01:03:27,800
Speaker 3: drunk driving should not be deported. That is insane, insane.

1345
01:03:27,920 --> 01:03:30,120
Speaker 3: You're putting people at risk and you shouldn't be deported.

1346
01:03:30,320 --> 01:03:33,360
Speaker 3: The liberal line appears now to be that unless you're

1347
01:03:33,360 --> 01:03:36,200
Speaker 3: a violent rapist or murderer, that you get to stay here,

1348
01:03:36,400 --> 01:03:38,919
Speaker 3: even though you cross into our country illegally, and even

1349
01:03:38,920 --> 01:03:41,000
Speaker 3: though you're probably going to be a massive net drain

1350
01:03:41,200 --> 01:03:43,000
Speaker 3: on our social safety net, which just grant you all

1351
01:03:43,040 --> 01:03:46,720
Speaker 3: citizenship like this is what like is. It is genuine

1352
01:03:46,720 --> 01:03:49,920
Speaker 3: slide of hand. There are tens of millions, somewhere between

1353
01:03:49,920 --> 01:03:52,720
Speaker 3: twenty and thirty people thirty million people who are present

1354
01:03:52,720 --> 01:03:54,800
Speaker 3: in this country illegally, and I think people should just

1355
01:03:54,840 --> 01:03:56,880
Speaker 3: be honest liberals and say, yes, we want to vast

1356
01:03:56,960 --> 01:03:59,600
Speaker 3: we want to legalize the absolute, vast majority of them

1357
01:04:00,000 --> 01:04:02,400
Speaker 3: areless of the consequences, and we want people I would

1358
01:04:02,440 --> 01:04:05,120
Speaker 3: like to talk about tax dollars to pay for all

1359
01:04:05,120 --> 01:04:05,680
Speaker 3: of their healthcare.

1360
01:04:06,240 --> 01:04:07,480
Speaker 1: People who don't speak any English.

1361
01:04:07,880 --> 01:04:11,400
Speaker 2: Authority of them are net contributors to This is a

1362
01:04:11,400 --> 01:04:12,280
Speaker 2: complete canard.

1363
01:04:12,320 --> 01:04:14,160
Speaker 1: And even if you had a small percentage, which are

1364
01:04:14,160 --> 01:04:14,600
Speaker 1: going to be.

1365
01:04:15,400 --> 01:04:16,840
Speaker 4: I think people should be saying that.

1366
01:04:16,880 --> 01:04:19,640
Speaker 2: I think people should say that because that is actually

1367
01:04:19,720 --> 01:04:22,080
Speaker 2: the place where the American people are, that is where

1368
01:04:22,120 --> 01:04:27,640
Speaker 2: the majority position is. They be No, even even at

1369
01:04:27,680 --> 01:04:31,320
Speaker 2: the height of the anti immigrant backlash, even at the

1370
01:04:31,320 --> 01:04:33,840
Speaker 2: height of that, you still had much more complex views

1371
01:04:33,880 --> 01:04:37,280
Speaker 2: on immigration than has been portrayed. So yes, the American

1372
01:04:37,320 --> 01:04:40,880
Speaker 2: people do not they the view that you're articulating as

1373
01:04:40,920 --> 01:04:42,640
Speaker 2: being just like some stupid liberal position.

1374
01:04:42,680 --> 01:04:44,360
Speaker 4: That is the position of the American people.

1375
01:04:44,120 --> 01:04:46,400
Speaker 1: That we should legalize everyone and give them all free.

1376
01:04:46,520 --> 01:04:49,600
Speaker 2: But if you that, if you have been here and

1377
01:04:49,640 --> 01:04:52,480
Speaker 2: you've abided by the law and you've paid your taxes,

1378
01:04:52,760 --> 01:04:54,480
Speaker 2: that there should be some path to citizens.

1379
01:04:54,720 --> 01:04:55,520
Speaker 1: And yet they don't.

1380
01:04:55,600 --> 01:04:58,400
Speaker 2: They don't agree with what is going on. They don't

1381
01:04:58,400 --> 01:05:02,760
Speaker 2: agree certainly with the you know, insane tactics of this

1382
01:05:03,000 --> 01:05:07,720
Speaker 2: private these private thugs, which again, I it your immigration

1383
01:05:07,960 --> 01:05:11,640
Speaker 2: is the pretext here, but this really is about a

1384
01:05:11,920 --> 01:05:12,640
Speaker 2: police state.

1385
01:05:12,840 --> 01:05:14,480
Speaker 4: It is about a mass crackdown.

1386
01:05:14,800 --> 01:05:19,440
Speaker 2: It is about threatening retribution against the opposition, making it

1387
01:05:19,480 --> 01:05:22,400
Speaker 2: so that you know, things are you know, basic protest

1388
01:05:22,800 --> 01:05:23,560
Speaker 2: is criminalized.

1389
01:05:23,640 --> 01:05:25,240
Speaker 1: I think the multiple things can be true.

1390
01:05:25,400 --> 01:05:29,160
Speaker 2: The administration believes that if you protest against them, you

1391
01:05:29,200 --> 01:05:31,680
Speaker 2: are a domestic terrorists. That is there, That is their

1392
01:05:31,720 --> 01:05:35,680
Speaker 2: stated definition. And again I think that is like, that's

1393
01:05:35,880 --> 01:05:37,960
Speaker 2: that's the thing that we should really be focused on

1394
01:05:38,080 --> 01:05:39,760
Speaker 2: right now, because these are the people that are in

1395
01:05:39,840 --> 01:05:42,080
Speaker 2: power right now. This is what they're doing right now,

1396
01:05:42,400 --> 01:05:45,640
Speaker 2: and you know, most of America is horrified by it.

1397
01:05:45,720 --> 01:05:47,480
Speaker 1: Frankly, look, I think they should be horrified.

1398
01:05:47,480 --> 01:05:50,920
Speaker 3: I objected immediately to labeling Renee Good a terrorist, but

1399
01:05:51,040 --> 01:05:52,720
Speaker 3: you know, one of these is it's always you know,

1400
01:05:52,920 --> 01:05:54,439
Speaker 3: yesterday I was feeling very left wing.

1401
01:05:54,600 --> 01:05:56,680
Speaker 1: Today I feel very right wing. I'm like, oh, right,

1402
01:05:56,800 --> 01:05:57,640
Speaker 1: I forgot what.

1403
01:05:57,640 --> 01:06:00,000
Speaker 3: Exactly it is like or would be like to live

1404
01:06:00,240 --> 01:06:02,480
Speaker 3: back under the thumb of these people, And like, I

1405
01:06:02,520 --> 01:06:05,360
Speaker 3: don't think that we should really forget what you know,

1406
01:06:05,400 --> 01:06:09,200
Speaker 3: you're talking about normalization. This was normalized over literally a decade.

1407
01:06:09,240 --> 01:06:12,560
Speaker 3: It has been accepted. There is an extreme position in

1408
01:06:12,640 --> 01:06:15,400
Speaker 3: the way that you look at mass deportation, Like I'm sorry,

1409
01:06:15,440 --> 01:06:18,400
Speaker 3: like legalizing people giving them free health care. No, it's

1410
01:06:18,400 --> 01:06:19,800
Speaker 3: not happening if I get.

1411
01:06:19,680 --> 01:06:21,280
Speaker 4: This free healthcare this country.

1412
01:06:22,680 --> 01:06:25,320
Speaker 3: Your position is free health care for everyone, and legalization

1413
01:06:25,600 --> 01:06:30,600
Speaker 3: that is for illegals and for people who are here illegally.

1414
01:06:30,680 --> 01:06:32,840
Speaker 3: That is not something I will ever support. I don't

1415
01:06:32,840 --> 01:06:36,360
Speaker 3: think anybody should support that empirically. And like, this is

1416
01:06:36,400 --> 01:06:39,000
Speaker 3: where I do think it is important to also note

1417
01:06:39,120 --> 01:06:42,560
Speaker 3: that because of the position of the moral righteousness, which

1418
01:06:42,600 --> 01:06:45,960
Speaker 3: is the heart of all liberal activism, where they genuinely

1419
01:06:46,000 --> 01:06:48,680
Speaker 3: cannot see, like, I don't think anybody can see in

1420
01:06:48,720 --> 01:06:51,480
Speaker 3: the way that you're framing it. Your look ice purely

1421
01:06:51,520 --> 01:06:54,200
Speaker 3: as some sort of intimidation factor, and the fact is

1422
01:06:54,560 --> 01:06:57,080
Speaker 3: immigration is a part of that. Now, can it be

1423
01:06:57,240 --> 01:06:59,480
Speaker 3: done without many of the bad things that they've done.

1424
01:06:59,520 --> 01:07:00,320
Speaker 1: And that's what you know.

1425
01:07:00,400 --> 01:07:03,000
Speaker 3: Often the criticism is like, you only object to the tactics.

1426
01:07:03,040 --> 01:07:04,760
Speaker 3: It's like, yeah, because I agree with the idea they

1427
01:07:04,800 --> 01:07:07,200
Speaker 3: should get deported. I think it's basically your view here

1428
01:07:07,240 --> 01:07:10,760
Speaker 3: on the protests. Yes, we can't agree on enforcement. I

1429
01:07:10,960 --> 01:07:13,880
Speaker 3: would be much happier with one hundred percent remittance tax

1430
01:07:14,000 --> 01:07:17,160
Speaker 3: and mandatory verify and taking a bunch of these employers

1431
01:07:17,280 --> 01:07:19,640
Speaker 3: who vastly profit off of all of this and throw

1432
01:07:19,680 --> 01:07:22,480
Speaker 3: them in prison and then basically encourage everybody to go back,

1433
01:07:22,680 --> 01:07:25,320
Speaker 3: more humane way to do it, less headlines. Yeah, but

1434
01:07:25,440 --> 01:07:27,840
Speaker 3: to be honest, and let's let's be clear here. Libs

1435
01:07:27,840 --> 01:07:30,680
Speaker 3: would be screeching and crying about that too. They would

1436
01:07:30,960 --> 01:07:33,840
Speaker 3: like the idea that they only object to ice tactics

1437
01:07:34,160 --> 01:07:34,880
Speaker 3: is bullshit.

1438
01:07:35,440 --> 01:07:38,160
Speaker 4: They want them to stay your legally hypothetical.

1439
01:07:38,200 --> 01:07:42,040
Speaker 3: We have the reality the criticized them and gide in

1440
01:07:42,160 --> 01:07:44,640
Speaker 3: anybody who even remotely sent people back.

1441
01:07:44,760 --> 01:07:45,680
Speaker 1: They were mad about it.

1442
01:07:45,800 --> 01:07:47,640
Speaker 3: They believe that they should stay it and we should

1443
01:07:47,640 --> 01:07:49,120
Speaker 3: do nothing. They don't care about the time.

1444
01:07:49,160 --> 01:07:52,120
Speaker 4: Are allowed to have that view. We're allowed to have

1445
01:07:52,160 --> 01:07:52,520
Speaker 4: that view.

1446
01:07:52,520 --> 01:07:53,960
Speaker 1: You can leave anything.

1447
01:07:54,040 --> 01:07:56,080
Speaker 2: Here's The thing is, you know, you're very upset about

1448
01:07:56,080 --> 01:08:01,560
Speaker 2: their moral righteousness, like they are allowed to have a perspective.

1449
01:08:01,600 --> 01:08:03,960
Speaker 2: And I do think, I do think that their perspective

1450
01:08:04,520 --> 01:08:08,240
Speaker 2: is morally righteous because it is about you know, so

1451
01:08:08,360 --> 01:08:11,280
Speaker 2: I don't quit. I don't think the two things are equivalent,

1452
01:08:11,440 --> 01:08:14,000
Speaker 2: like I don't think that no position of the right

1453
01:08:14,000 --> 01:08:18,439
Speaker 2: eye and the position of the left are more. But

1454
01:08:18,520 --> 01:08:21,559
Speaker 2: I'm saying there is there is right and wrong, Like

1455
01:08:21,640 --> 01:08:26,519
Speaker 2: it is wrong watching that man, elderly man drug out

1456
01:08:26,560 --> 01:08:31,240
Speaker 2: on the street in the cold, humiliated in his shorts only,

1457
01:08:31,880 --> 01:08:34,800
Speaker 2: and you know, turns out he's an American citizen. Hours

1458
01:08:34,840 --> 01:08:37,720
Speaker 2: later they bring him back. Right, Watching that seventeen year

1459
01:08:37,720 --> 01:08:40,800
Speaker 2: old at Target who they beat the shit out of

1460
01:08:40,880 --> 01:08:43,360
Speaker 2: him and then drop him off, you know, miles away,

1461
01:08:43,680 --> 01:08:48,080
Speaker 2: and he's crying and bloodied, watching a six month old

1462
01:08:48,120 --> 01:08:49,479
Speaker 2: baby get tear gassed.

1463
01:08:49,720 --> 01:08:51,599
Speaker 4: And then the way they lie about all of it.

1464
01:08:52,080 --> 01:08:54,520
Speaker 2: This Venezuelan man who got shot on the leg completely

1465
01:08:54,560 --> 01:08:58,040
Speaker 2: lied about all of that, and of course Rene good like, yes,

1466
01:08:58,400 --> 01:08:59,959
Speaker 2: I yes, I feel.

1467
01:08:59,800 --> 01:09:03,000
Speaker 4: Very much that is on the correct, morally right.

1468
01:09:02,880 --> 01:09:04,880
Speaker 2: Tous side to say those things are wrong, and that

1469
01:09:04,960 --> 01:09:09,120
Speaker 2: the people who are protesting those things are genuinely courageous

1470
01:09:09,439 --> 01:09:13,000
Speaker 2: and noble, and that like more people should aspire to

1471
01:09:13,320 --> 01:09:15,400
Speaker 2: hold values and actually fight for them.

1472
01:09:15,640 --> 01:09:17,280
Speaker 4: Which is why, you know, even with.

1473
01:09:17,240 --> 01:09:20,559
Speaker 2: These protesters, the only reason I'll criticize the tactics.

1474
01:09:20,560 --> 01:09:22,559
Speaker 4: I think the tactics were foolish, but I think.

1475
01:09:22,400 --> 01:09:26,080
Speaker 2: It was freakin' ballsy. I admire the fact that they

1476
01:09:26,120 --> 01:09:28,479
Speaker 2: have the balls to do something I'm not doing right

1477
01:09:28,520 --> 01:09:30,599
Speaker 2: now and go out there in the streets and try

1478
01:09:30,640 --> 01:09:32,280
Speaker 2: to make a difference. Do I think that this was

1479
01:09:32,760 --> 01:09:35,240
Speaker 2: the wrong approach in terms of the Yes, I do.

1480
01:09:35,360 --> 01:09:38,360
Speaker 2: I don't think it was beneficial. Admire the hell on

1481
01:09:38,400 --> 01:09:41,360
Speaker 2: and yeah I do, I actually do, because they are

1482
01:09:41,400 --> 01:09:45,000
Speaker 2: putting their actions where their mouth is. They're not just

1483
01:09:45,040 --> 01:09:48,240
Speaker 2: complaining about it on Twitter or posting. They're going out

1484
01:09:48,320 --> 01:09:50,519
Speaker 2: and they are trying to do something about a moral

1485
01:09:50,600 --> 01:09:52,960
Speaker 2: wrong that they see. And I think that is I

1486
01:09:53,000 --> 01:09:56,400
Speaker 2: think it is incredibly noble thing to do to have

1487
01:09:56,439 --> 01:09:58,080
Speaker 2: a value and to be willing to actually go out

1488
01:09:58,080 --> 01:09:58,280
Speaker 2: and fight.

1489
01:09:58,360 --> 01:10:00,840
Speaker 3: Fine, then you know, every right winger January sixth was

1490
01:10:00,880 --> 01:10:04,000
Speaker 3: courageous and noble under your definition, because only because you agree,

1491
01:10:04,080 --> 01:10:08,800
Speaker 3: you're basically saying no, because because we are actually.

1492
01:10:08,560 --> 01:10:09,799
Speaker 4: Moral there.

1493
01:10:11,600 --> 01:10:15,000
Speaker 2: Is defined, but you don't even agree with the thing

1494
01:10:15,040 --> 01:10:17,599
Speaker 2: they were doing. Like the election was not rigged and stolen.

1495
01:10:18,200 --> 01:10:21,920
Speaker 2: They were like breaking the law and violent, like you know,

1496
01:10:22,040 --> 01:10:25,439
Speaker 2: beating up cops. Yes, and it was vastly more violent

1497
01:10:25,800 --> 01:10:27,240
Speaker 2: than anything that we have seen.

1498
01:10:27,320 --> 01:10:30,439
Speaker 1: I'm not protest. I'm saying that moral equivalence is.

1499
01:10:30,920 --> 01:10:33,800
Speaker 2: It's no, no, no, no, I'm saying there is no moral

1500
01:10:33,840 --> 01:10:36,439
Speaker 2: equivalence between those two things, only for.

1501
01:10:36,439 --> 01:10:38,880
Speaker 1: Many people, the morality of tens of millions of people here.

1502
01:10:38,880 --> 01:10:41,400
Speaker 4: I legally, you're doing like a very relativist thing.

1503
01:10:41,560 --> 01:10:44,719
Speaker 1: Yes, where we live in a country.

1504
01:10:44,840 --> 01:10:48,639
Speaker 2: No, you're doing a moral relativist position where there can

1505
01:10:48,680 --> 01:10:50,479
Speaker 2: be no right or wrong. It's all just in the

1506
01:10:50,560 --> 01:10:52,719
Speaker 2: eye of the beholder, which is actually a very left

1507
01:10:52,720 --> 01:10:55,000
Speaker 2: wing thing to do and which I don't agree with.

1508
01:10:55,320 --> 01:10:57,200
Speaker 2: I think there is right and wrong. I think there

1509
01:10:57,280 --> 01:10:59,400
Speaker 2: is good and bad. I think there is good and evil,

1510
01:10:59,680 --> 01:11:02,680
Speaker 2: and so, yes, what they did on January sixth was

1511
01:11:02,760 --> 01:11:05,240
Speaker 2: stupid and it was for a bad and wrong cause.

1512
01:11:05,439 --> 01:11:06,759
Speaker 4: What these protesters are.

1513
01:11:06,600 --> 01:11:11,080
Speaker 2: Doing in general in Minneapolis is for a righteous cause.

1514
01:11:11,320 --> 01:11:15,400
Speaker 2: And I think that that is no, because there is

1515
01:11:15,439 --> 01:11:16,800
Speaker 2: such a thing as good and bad.

1516
01:11:16,880 --> 01:11:19,280
Speaker 3: Yeah, everybody who marched against civil rights who were in

1517
01:11:19,320 --> 01:11:21,960
Speaker 3: the white crowds. Black people thought that they were in

1518
01:11:22,000 --> 01:11:24,320
Speaker 3: the right and they were uploading and they were wrong.

1519
01:11:24,400 --> 01:11:25,200
Speaker 1: That's my point.

1520
01:11:25,479 --> 01:11:28,040
Speaker 2: That's my point is that the January sixers, but in

1521
01:11:28,080 --> 01:11:31,760
Speaker 2: their mind they were morally righteous, were incorrect. Right, these

1522
01:11:31,800 --> 01:11:33,680
Speaker 2: people are correct, And you agree with me on that,

1523
01:11:34,000 --> 01:11:36,800
Speaker 2: like you also objected these ice tactics, and you also

1524
01:11:36,920 --> 01:11:38,640
Speaker 2: don't think that the election was stolen and that that

1525
01:11:38,720 --> 01:11:39,200
Speaker 2: was stupid.

1526
01:11:39,439 --> 01:11:41,120
Speaker 4: So clearly there is some you know.

1527
01:11:41,120 --> 01:11:44,920
Speaker 2: Ability to see objectively that some things causes are worthy

1528
01:11:44,960 --> 01:11:48,000
Speaker 2: and noble, and some causes are bad and wrong. That's

1529
01:11:48,040 --> 01:11:50,120
Speaker 2: all I'm saying. Okay, fine, because you're doing a home

1530
01:11:50,160 --> 01:11:50,799
Speaker 2: morel relative.

1531
01:11:50,800 --> 01:11:52,880
Speaker 4: Well, in their mind they think, but they're wrong and

1532
01:11:52,960 --> 01:11:53,640
Speaker 4: these people are not.

1533
01:11:53,800 --> 01:11:56,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, but if I went back to the nineteen fifties,

1534
01:11:56,120 --> 01:11:58,080
Speaker 3: a vast portion of the public would have agreed with

1535
01:11:58,160 --> 01:12:00,160
Speaker 3: the people who were storming, and there would have and

1536
01:12:00,400 --> 01:12:02,840
Speaker 3: let's say a debate here on and many people. Okay,

1537
01:12:02,880 --> 01:12:04,720
Speaker 3: we could say that in retrospect. But the point is

1538
01:12:04,720 --> 01:12:07,080
Speaker 3: is what matters actually in the moment, and what matters

1539
01:12:07,080 --> 01:12:09,080
Speaker 3: in the moment, as you just laid out, is while

1540
01:12:09,120 --> 01:12:12,560
Speaker 3: you think it's noble and courageous. I think that anybody

1541
01:12:12,600 --> 01:12:16,200
Speaker 3: who wants to normalize these types of things is despicable.

1542
01:12:15,600 --> 01:12:17,000
Speaker 1: In the same way that we.

1543
01:12:17,280 --> 01:12:18,840
Speaker 3: I mean, I feel like I'm living in crazy land

1544
01:12:18,920 --> 01:12:21,800
Speaker 3: sometimes because it's like we haven't sat here and criticized ice.

1545
01:12:22,000 --> 01:12:24,120
Speaker 3: We haven't sat here, and so that the tactics are

1546
01:12:24,120 --> 01:12:26,000
Speaker 3: bad as if we haven't sat here and said yes,

1547
01:12:26,040 --> 01:12:27,160
Speaker 3: they've often violated.

1548
01:12:27,320 --> 01:12:29,400
Speaker 1: All of that is readily admittable.

1549
01:12:29,600 --> 01:12:33,200
Speaker 3: However, However, again that does not give you license to

1550
01:12:33,280 --> 01:12:37,120
Speaker 3: be rampaging through private institutions and to go and intimidate

1551
01:12:37,160 --> 01:12:40,759
Speaker 3: people who you disagree with, which is the fundamental belief

1552
01:12:41,040 --> 01:12:43,920
Speaker 3: of left wing activism in and of itself. They do

1553
01:12:44,000 --> 01:12:47,360
Speaker 3: not actually believe that my position or the position of

1554
01:12:47,439 --> 01:12:49,840
Speaker 3: millions of people, for many who voted in twenty twenty

1555
01:12:49,840 --> 01:12:52,840
Speaker 3: four that mass deportation and illegal should go back, which

1556
01:12:52,880 --> 01:12:55,760
Speaker 3: again won the popular vote. Let me remind everyone that

1557
01:12:56,000 --> 01:12:58,519
Speaker 3: is not a legitimate position, and that any of those

1558
01:12:58,560 --> 01:13:00,720
Speaker 3: people should be driven from public life and have no

1559
01:13:00,880 --> 01:13:03,680
Speaker 3: right and tower to speak. That is probably the mainstream

1560
01:13:03,800 --> 01:13:06,920
Speaker 3: view of liberal activism. And let's say DSA or any

1561
01:13:06,960 --> 01:13:10,439
Speaker 3: of these types of people, that is objectionable because it

1562
01:13:10,479 --> 01:13:12,880
Speaker 3: is pretty clear to me that those people are not

1563
01:13:12,960 --> 01:13:15,840
Speaker 3: really consistent with any sort of democratic values. And for

1564
01:13:15,880 --> 01:13:18,920
Speaker 3: all the left's talk of nineteen thirties Germany, what they

1565
01:13:18,960 --> 01:13:21,040
Speaker 3: forget is that these were the same tactics used by

1566
01:13:21,040 --> 01:13:24,400
Speaker 3: the communists. This is actually the exact same playbook of

1567
01:13:24,439 --> 01:13:26,680
Speaker 3: street gangs and all of that that was playing out

1568
01:13:26,720 --> 01:13:29,439
Speaker 3: of anarchism at the time didn't work out so well

1569
01:13:29,560 --> 01:13:31,200
Speaker 3: for all of you. Or the Spanish Civil War and

1570
01:13:31,200 --> 01:13:33,120
Speaker 3: the same murder of a lot of people who were

1571
01:13:33,120 --> 01:13:35,880
Speaker 3: in religious institutions, which is eventually what led to the

1572
01:13:35,920 --> 01:13:37,120
Speaker 3: rise of Spanish fascism.

1573
01:13:37,240 --> 01:13:38,880
Speaker 1: Because it's not just about tactics.

1574
01:13:39,040 --> 01:13:42,160
Speaker 3: It is also about the same level of moralism of

1575
01:13:42,280 --> 01:13:46,240
Speaker 3: protest behavior, and I view that fundamentally as a danger.

1576
01:13:46,280 --> 01:13:48,519
Speaker 3: You don't because you think it's courageous. It is a

1577
01:13:48,560 --> 01:13:51,640
Speaker 3: massive danger to living in a heterogeneous society. And the

1578
01:13:51,680 --> 01:13:54,040
Speaker 3: same way that you see illiberalism on the right, I

1579
01:13:54,080 --> 01:13:57,400
Speaker 3: can point to this exactly and the handling and the

1580
01:13:57,400 --> 01:14:01,920
Speaker 3: basically effective endorsement of this by the democratic industrial complex

1581
01:14:01,960 --> 01:14:04,760
Speaker 3: and to say, wow, illiberalism is still alive and well

1582
01:14:04,920 --> 01:14:08,960
Speaker 3: whenever it comes to the institutionalized that we can.

1583
01:14:08,439 --> 01:14:09,479
Speaker 4: We can wrap this up.

1584
01:14:09,520 --> 01:14:14,080
Speaker 2: But I will just say there is really no comparison

1585
01:14:14,400 --> 01:14:18,000
Speaker 2: between the quote unquote illiberalism of the Biden administration, which

1586
01:14:18,080 --> 01:14:20,599
Speaker 2: I you know, yes condemn, you were.

1587
01:14:20,560 --> 01:14:21,679
Speaker 1: One of the few europe that's.

1588
01:14:21,640 --> 01:14:25,639
Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, and the illiberalism of the Trump administration. There

1589
01:14:25,720 --> 01:14:29,479
Speaker 2: is no comparison. There is no comparison. And I mean

1590
01:14:29,520 --> 01:14:31,360
Speaker 2: we're about to cover some of the like rise of

1591
01:14:31,400 --> 01:14:37,840
Speaker 2: censorship and whatever. You have the criminalizing of pro Palestinian descent,

1592
01:14:38,120 --> 01:14:41,479
Speaker 2: you have the labeling of anyone who would protest them

1593
01:14:41,520 --> 01:14:45,360
Speaker 2: as domestic terrorists. You have the absolute immunity granted to

1594
01:14:45,640 --> 01:14:48,439
Speaker 2: ice thugs to rampage in American streets.

1595
01:14:48,560 --> 01:14:50,280
Speaker 1: Can we can we just say just because the Vice

1596
01:14:50,320 --> 01:14:51,639
Speaker 1: president said it doesn't make it true?

1597
01:14:51,680 --> 01:14:56,000
Speaker 2: That is no, but it but not to harp on this,

1598
01:14:56,080 --> 01:14:58,320
Speaker 2: but it does actually make it true because that is

1599
01:14:58,320 --> 01:15:01,240
Speaker 2: the way that they're operating. I mean, is Jonathan Ross

1600
01:15:01,280 --> 01:15:02,200
Speaker 2: being investigated?

1601
01:15:02,680 --> 01:15:04,760
Speaker 1: No, but you absolutely yes.

1602
01:15:04,880 --> 01:15:07,200
Speaker 3: It would be to say that he's forever has immunity,

1603
01:15:07,240 --> 01:15:10,000
Speaker 3: which is like not true. Liberals will eventually come back

1604
01:15:10,000 --> 01:15:12,080
Speaker 3: into power and there's no statute of limitation on murder.

1605
01:15:12,200 --> 01:15:17,360
Speaker 3: I think you would also, Yeah, but it's pretty maybe,

1606
01:15:18,320 --> 01:15:20,439
Speaker 3: I mean, but yet that are even eligible for pardon.

1607
01:15:20,560 --> 01:15:23,040
Speaker 1: Yes, uh, well, yeah, I'm pretty sure.

1608
01:15:23,040 --> 01:15:25,400
Speaker 3: I checked on this and there was some weird case

1609
01:15:25,479 --> 01:15:27,120
Speaker 3: lock something about state charges.

1610
01:15:27,360 --> 01:15:29,840
Speaker 2: I'm not exactly sure, but my understanding is that he

1611
01:15:29,920 --> 01:15:33,400
Speaker 2: could be pardoned the state and federal thing. It's a

1612
01:15:33,439 --> 01:15:35,840
Speaker 2: it's a question mark. But in any case, the view

1613
01:15:35,840 --> 01:15:38,400
Speaker 2: of this administration is that they have absolutely immunity, and

1614
01:15:38,439 --> 01:15:40,719
Speaker 2: that is the way that they have that those agents

1615
01:15:40,720 --> 01:15:42,840
Speaker 2: have clearly internalized based on the way they're acting and

1616
01:15:42,880 --> 01:15:45,639
Speaker 2: also the things that they're saying to protesters on the street.

1617
01:15:46,080 --> 01:15:50,559
Speaker 2: So in any case, that is nowhere like they are

1618
01:15:50,600 --> 01:15:55,240
Speaker 2: not in the same ballpark with the illiberalism that was

1619
01:15:55,320 --> 01:15:59,599
Speaker 2: evidenced in the Biden administration, which was you know, marginal

1620
01:15:59,680 --> 01:16:02,400
Speaker 2: compared to what we are seeing here in terms of

1621
01:16:02,439 --> 01:16:06,479
Speaker 2: the criminalization of dissent and the you know, the crushing

1622
01:16:06,520 --> 01:16:09,400
Speaker 2: of the media, the crushing like even bringing law firms

1623
01:16:09,400 --> 01:16:14,200
Speaker 2: to heal universities, getting professors fired, all of that, and

1624
01:16:14,240 --> 01:16:17,040
Speaker 2: they genuinely, like Trump will say it, he thinks it

1625
01:16:17,080 --> 01:16:20,400
Speaker 2: should be illegal to criticize him. He says that out loud, right,

1626
01:16:20,720 --> 01:16:24,240
Speaker 2: So I don't see the two things as equivalent, and

1627
01:16:24,400 --> 01:16:27,680
Speaker 2: you can rely on me that if you know, democrats

1628
01:16:27,680 --> 01:16:30,960
Speaker 2: are the left gets in power and there is our

1629
01:16:31,320 --> 01:16:35,240
Speaker 2: abuses that are truly illiberal that I will be critical there,

1630
01:16:35,320 --> 01:16:37,599
Speaker 2: but I am not going to do it both sides,

1631
01:16:37,680 --> 01:16:39,760
Speaker 2: because I don't think that the two sides have been

1632
01:16:39,920 --> 01:16:42,040
Speaker 2: remotely equivalent. And by the way, one of them is

1633
01:16:42,080 --> 01:16:43,479
Speaker 2: in power right now and one of them a list.

1634
01:16:43,479 --> 01:16:45,000
Speaker 3: One will soon be in power. And I think that

1635
01:16:45,040 --> 01:16:46,679
Speaker 3: many of the norms that may have kept the Biden

1636
01:16:46,720 --> 01:16:48,880
Speaker 3: administration or any of those people from doing what truly

1637
01:16:48,960 --> 01:16:50,960
Speaker 3: was in those hearts are now shattered. And next thing

1638
01:16:50,960 --> 01:16:52,519
Speaker 3: we know, and you know, I mean, I don't think

1639
01:16:52,520 --> 01:16:55,320
Speaker 3: people should confuse. I am really not arguing with you.

1640
01:16:55,720 --> 01:16:58,320
Speaker 3: I don't think you're the problem. I really don't. Yeah,

1641
01:16:58,360 --> 01:17:01,200
Speaker 3: but I think the democratic industrial complex is the problem.

1642
01:17:01,400 --> 01:17:04,080
Speaker 3: And Keith Ellison and all of the people who are

1643
01:17:04,120 --> 01:17:06,439
Speaker 3: actually going to be in power, I'm like, oh yeah,

1644
01:17:06,640 --> 01:17:09,680
Speaker 3: especially we it's have been normalized now under Trump. I

1645
01:17:10,200 --> 01:17:12,760
Speaker 3: think a lot of people like a lot of the

1646
01:17:12,920 --> 01:17:16,760
Speaker 3: same tactics which were dreams of the BLM movement and

1647
01:17:16,800 --> 01:17:19,920
Speaker 3: all of that and anti racism amendments.

1648
01:17:20,120 --> 01:17:21,080
Speaker 1: After what has now.

1649
01:17:20,920 --> 01:17:23,160
Speaker 3: Happened under the Trump administration, I think it will be

1650
01:17:23,160 --> 01:17:25,559
Speaker 3: a reality, and I don't doubt that you would speak

1651
01:17:25,600 --> 01:17:28,559
Speaker 3: on behalf of civil liberties for right wingers, but I

1652
01:17:28,560 --> 01:17:31,240
Speaker 3: don't think that that's necessarily a consistent view, and much

1653
01:17:31,280 --> 01:17:32,720
Speaker 3: of the right is to blame for it as well,

1654
01:17:32,800 --> 01:17:35,360
Speaker 3: which is why I often call it out, especially on

1655
01:17:35,400 --> 01:17:38,559
Speaker 3: the censorship stuff, because I'm not dumb. The people who

1656
01:17:38,560 --> 01:17:43,839
Speaker 3: are lawyers, professors, and governors are all watching this and saying, Okay,

1657
01:17:43,960 --> 01:17:46,479
Speaker 3: we never did it out of norms. Now the norm

1658
01:17:46,520 --> 01:17:49,519
Speaker 3: is shattered, which means it's going to happen. And I

1659
01:17:49,520 --> 01:17:52,320
Speaker 3: think that America is basically going to go through some

1660
01:17:52,360 --> 01:17:56,400
Speaker 3: sort of like nineteen nineties South Africa truth and reconciliation

1661
01:17:56,520 --> 01:17:59,120
Speaker 3: movement whenever a Democrat comes back into the White House.

1662
01:17:59,320 --> 01:18:01,240
Speaker 1: And yeah, I don't think it's going to go that well,

1663
01:18:01,280 --> 01:18:02,160
Speaker 1: all right, long debate.

1664
01:18:02,200 --> 01:18:04,400
Speaker 3: I apologize to the audience, but I hope it was

1665
01:18:04,600 --> 01:18:06,320
Speaker 3: somewhat elucidating.

1666
01:18:06,439 --> 01:18:08,400
Speaker 1: Is that the right word. Let's get to the next block.