1 00:00:03,080 --> 00:00:05,920 Speaker 1: Welcome to stuff to Blow your Mind from house stop 2 00:00:05,920 --> 00:00:15,640 Speaker 1: works dot com. Hey, welcome to stuff to Blow your mind. 3 00:00:15,680 --> 00:00:18,800 Speaker 1: My name is Robert Lamb and I'm Christian Sager. Hey, Robert, 4 00:00:18,800 --> 00:00:22,720 Speaker 1: have you ever had any like extensive dental work done before? Who? 5 00:00:22,800 --> 00:00:25,960 Speaker 1: I mean, any kind of dental work feels extensive? That's true. Yeah, 6 00:00:26,560 --> 00:00:28,080 Speaker 1: you know, a little bit here and there. I guess 7 00:00:28,280 --> 00:00:30,920 Speaker 1: it's um. It's always a weird issue from me because 8 00:00:30,920 --> 00:00:33,919 Speaker 1: my dad was a dentist, and so at least for 9 00:00:33,960 --> 00:00:36,279 Speaker 1: a few years there when I was having my had 10 00:00:36,280 --> 00:00:39,920 Speaker 1: my my wisdom teeth yanked out. Yeah, it was had this. 11 00:00:40,000 --> 00:00:42,320 Speaker 1: It was in a super weird kind of headspace about 12 00:00:42,360 --> 00:00:45,919 Speaker 1: it because for most of my life my dad had 13 00:00:45,960 --> 00:00:48,840 Speaker 1: been my dentist, and so I'm kind of getting these weird, 14 00:00:49,159 --> 00:00:51,640 Speaker 1: like illogical feelings of like, you can't be my dentist, 15 00:00:51,640 --> 00:00:54,040 Speaker 1: you're not my dad, yeah, kind of thing going on. 16 00:00:54,160 --> 00:00:56,760 Speaker 1: And then and then yeah, it sucks to have your 17 00:00:56,880 --> 00:00:59,240 Speaker 1: your teeth worked on. Yeah, And well that's that's a 18 00:00:59,360 --> 00:01:02,080 Speaker 1: perfect sort of allegory actually, because you know what we're 19 00:01:02,120 --> 00:01:04,959 Speaker 1: gonna be talking about today is the cultural ramifications and 20 00:01:05,000 --> 00:01:09,200 Speaker 1: connections to modifying your teeth. Uh. In my case. I 21 00:01:09,680 --> 00:01:11,240 Speaker 1: you know, I haven't had a ton done, but I 22 00:01:11,280 --> 00:01:13,520 Speaker 1: did have my wisdom teeth taking out as well in 23 00:01:13,520 --> 00:01:16,959 Speaker 1: my early twenties, and it was a nightmare. I remember, 24 00:01:17,200 --> 00:01:19,480 Speaker 1: you know, I was a poor college student at the time, 25 00:01:19,560 --> 00:01:21,679 Speaker 1: and I like had the procedure done and I woke 26 00:01:21,800 --> 00:01:25,360 Speaker 1: up and was just like bleeding everywhere, and my girlfriend 27 00:01:25,400 --> 00:01:27,280 Speaker 1: at the time had to take me back to her 28 00:01:27,360 --> 00:01:29,720 Speaker 1: place where I was supposed to like rest up for 29 00:01:29,760 --> 00:01:31,960 Speaker 1: two days, you know. And it's just I wasn't like 30 00:01:32,440 --> 00:01:36,360 Speaker 1: equipped maturity wise to deal with that kind of a procedure. 31 00:01:36,760 --> 00:01:39,600 Speaker 1: And like weeks later, like I forget what they call 32 00:01:39,640 --> 00:01:42,880 Speaker 1: it in dental practice, but like fragments of tooth would 33 00:01:42,880 --> 00:01:44,800 Speaker 1: like work their way up through my gums. It was. 34 00:01:45,240 --> 00:01:48,000 Speaker 1: It was horrifying. Yeah, when I had mine out, my 35 00:01:48,000 --> 00:01:51,760 Speaker 1: my wife picked me up from the procedure and uh 36 00:01:51,880 --> 00:01:56,440 Speaker 1: and almost fainted when I took the bloody gauze out. Yeah. Yeah, 37 00:01:56,480 --> 00:01:59,960 Speaker 1: Oh that's the weirdest, is the bloody gauze. So we're 38 00:02:00,040 --> 00:02:04,360 Speaker 1: gonna be talking about the body modification of teeth in 39 00:02:04,480 --> 00:02:07,560 Speaker 1: various cultures around the world, but I think it's a 40 00:02:07,560 --> 00:02:10,919 Speaker 1: good starting point for us to sort of compare our 41 00:02:10,919 --> 00:02:15,480 Speaker 1: own dental horror stories in Western culture because it's fairly similar, 42 00:02:15,680 --> 00:02:17,240 Speaker 1: you know, Yeah, I mean it scenario where a lot 43 00:02:17,280 --> 00:02:20,560 Speaker 1: of people have a lot of well deserved anxiety, and 44 00:02:20,600 --> 00:02:24,239 Speaker 1: not only because dental surgery kind of sucks and dental 45 00:02:24,240 --> 00:02:27,440 Speaker 1: pain sucks, but also because these are the only teeth 46 00:02:27,480 --> 00:02:29,920 Speaker 1: you have, and when you start having problems with them, 47 00:02:29,960 --> 00:02:33,880 Speaker 1: it's this damning reminder of your mortality. Yeah. I think 48 00:02:33,880 --> 00:02:37,400 Speaker 1: it was Tina Fey and her autobiography. She had this 49 00:02:37,440 --> 00:02:40,120 Speaker 1: great line that I remember above all else in that book. 50 00:02:40,160 --> 00:02:43,360 Speaker 1: She says, the mouth dies first, talking about just as 51 00:02:43,680 --> 00:02:46,480 Speaker 1: older and like not not even necessarily procedures you have 52 00:02:46,520 --> 00:02:48,959 Speaker 1: to have done, but just like like dealing with like 53 00:02:49,320 --> 00:02:51,480 Speaker 1: the breath of an older person. You know, it's like, oh, 54 00:02:51,520 --> 00:02:54,200 Speaker 1: my breath smells so bad in the morning. What's going on? 55 00:02:54,639 --> 00:02:57,399 Speaker 1: And this feeling that that the rest of me still 56 00:02:57,440 --> 00:03:00,280 Speaker 1: feels young, but my my teeth are on this uh, 57 00:03:00,600 --> 00:03:03,840 Speaker 1: this irreversible path to the grave. Well, Tina fe then 58 00:03:03,880 --> 00:03:06,280 Speaker 1: would probably understand some of the cultures we're going to 59 00:03:06,360 --> 00:03:09,400 Speaker 1: talk about today, especially when it comes to tooth extraction 60 00:03:09,560 --> 00:03:12,720 Speaker 1: and which is also referred to as ablation, uh, and 61 00:03:12,919 --> 00:03:15,560 Speaker 1: the idea that you know, by preemptively yanking them out 62 00:03:15,600 --> 00:03:17,720 Speaker 1: of your head, you're sort of cutting off disease at 63 00:03:17,720 --> 00:03:21,079 Speaker 1: the past. Yeah. So we're gonna talk about different cultural 64 00:03:21,320 --> 00:03:26,120 Speaker 1: rituals and practices that involve the the the shaving of teeth, 65 00:03:26,280 --> 00:03:28,800 Speaker 1: the filing of teeth, the sharpening of teeth, the removal 66 00:03:28,880 --> 00:03:31,560 Speaker 1: of teeth. But before we even get into the details 67 00:03:31,600 --> 00:03:33,720 Speaker 1: of any of these practice, I think it's important to 68 00:03:34,000 --> 00:03:39,120 Speaker 1: really connect those practices to our modern dental obsessions. And 69 00:03:39,160 --> 00:03:42,440 Speaker 1: we have a wonderful quote here, um that you're about 70 00:03:42,440 --> 00:03:44,480 Speaker 1: to read, and it's from one of the sources that 71 00:03:44,520 --> 00:03:49,280 Speaker 1: we use on this episode, the Cultural Modification of Teeth 72 00:03:49,520 --> 00:03:52,600 Speaker 1: by Clark Johnson, d D, s pH D. Yeah, he 73 00:03:52,720 --> 00:03:54,680 Speaker 1: really nailed it, and I think that it provided an 74 00:03:55,120 --> 00:03:59,160 Speaker 1: excellent overview that seemed to be mostly for people in 75 00:03:59,240 --> 00:04:02,480 Speaker 1: school for dent a practice, but giving them an idea 76 00:04:02,520 --> 00:04:05,400 Speaker 1: of you know what without there in the larger scale. Okay, 77 00:04:05,400 --> 00:04:08,760 Speaker 1: So he says, an alien visitor to Earth might describe 78 00:04:08,800 --> 00:04:12,840 Speaker 1: a tooth related cult now common in many industrialized societies. 79 00:04:13,240 --> 00:04:16,680 Speaker 1: The people believe in the tooth cult so unquestionable they 80 00:04:16,680 --> 00:04:20,880 Speaker 1: call the Holy Doers doctor. The cult requires an initiation 81 00:04:21,040 --> 00:04:24,640 Speaker 1: wherein the holy material objects are fastened to their teeth. 82 00:04:25,160 --> 00:04:28,039 Speaker 1: Then they go through to two difficult years of trial 83 00:04:28,440 --> 00:04:32,160 Speaker 1: until they emerge purified and the holy material objects are 84 00:04:32,200 --> 00:04:35,240 Speaker 1: taken off in a right of passage. These people live 85 00:04:35,279 --> 00:04:38,600 Speaker 1: in a society that admires what it sees on billboards 86 00:04:38,600 --> 00:04:43,080 Speaker 1: in magazines, in a mystical place they call Hollywood. Both 87 00:04:43,080 --> 00:04:47,400 Speaker 1: believers and priests learn their ideals there. The practitioners of 88 00:04:47,400 --> 00:04:51,599 Speaker 1: the cult have an obsession with lines and angles. I 89 00:04:51,640 --> 00:04:54,200 Speaker 1: really like that that and I think that it's an 90 00:04:54,200 --> 00:04:59,040 Speaker 1: important distinction for us to set up to as Westerners. 91 00:04:59,360 --> 00:05:01,920 Speaker 1: And we may have some listeners out out there who 92 00:05:02,120 --> 00:05:04,240 Speaker 1: are familiar with some of these cultures that we're gonna 93 00:05:04,240 --> 00:05:07,200 Speaker 1: be talking about, but as Westerners, we mess around with 94 00:05:07,240 --> 00:05:09,679 Speaker 1: our teeth just as much as some of this stuff 95 00:05:09,680 --> 00:05:12,120 Speaker 1: that we're about to talk about. That's gonna seem weird 96 00:05:12,160 --> 00:05:14,440 Speaker 1: and sort of cult dish, right, Yeah. I mean it's 97 00:05:14,600 --> 00:05:17,240 Speaker 1: especially when you look at the cult of the Hollywood smile, 98 00:05:17,400 --> 00:05:21,840 Speaker 1: Like how much time and energy goes into the straightening, whitening, 99 00:05:22,200 --> 00:05:24,360 Speaker 1: and not only just the physical manipulation of the teeth, 100 00:05:24,360 --> 00:05:28,159 Speaker 1: but then placing uh, you know, essentially fake teeth over 101 00:05:28,200 --> 00:05:31,640 Speaker 1: those teeth. And sculpting them down and just getting everything 102 00:05:31,920 --> 00:05:35,520 Speaker 1: perfectly lined up for that magazine worthy smile. So before 103 00:05:35,800 --> 00:05:37,839 Speaker 1: we dive into the first chunk here where we're going 104 00:05:37,880 --> 00:05:41,960 Speaker 1: to talk about everything except for the extraction, let's remind 105 00:05:42,240 --> 00:05:45,000 Speaker 1: uh you the listener out there, if you're new to 106 00:05:45,080 --> 00:05:47,160 Speaker 1: the show, there's a bunch of stuff that we do 107 00:05:47,240 --> 00:05:50,520 Speaker 1: other than just podcasting. So Stuff to Blow Your Mind 108 00:05:51,040 --> 00:05:55,599 Speaker 1: is Robert myself and Joe McCormick, and we podcast, but 109 00:05:55,640 --> 00:05:58,640 Speaker 1: we also do videos. We also write articles. We all 110 00:05:58,680 --> 00:06:01,720 Speaker 1: work out of how stuff works, and you can find 111 00:06:01,800 --> 00:06:05,679 Speaker 1: us on Facebook, Twitter, and Tumbler where we're all blow 112 00:06:05,720 --> 00:06:08,840 Speaker 1: the Mind as our handle, and we curate throughout the 113 00:06:08,880 --> 00:06:13,040 Speaker 1: week various weird science, kind of bizarre oddity articles as 114 00:06:13,040 --> 00:06:16,000 Speaker 1: well as our own content and Stuff to Blow your Mind. 115 00:06:16,040 --> 00:06:20,320 Speaker 1: Dot com is the mothership where you can find most 116 00:06:20,360 --> 00:06:22,880 Speaker 1: of that content, right Yeah, So let's get down to it. 117 00:06:22,960 --> 00:06:25,000 Speaker 1: Let's just start with teeth. Well, what are some of 118 00:06:25,200 --> 00:06:28,840 Speaker 1: the main reasons we have teeth to begin with? Yeah, well, 119 00:06:28,880 --> 00:06:31,160 Speaker 1: you know, when we think about it, the essential functions 120 00:06:31,160 --> 00:06:34,640 Speaker 1: for our teeth are mastication, speech, and then there's the 121 00:06:34,680 --> 00:06:38,520 Speaker 1: aesthetic part, right um, And you know here in Western society. 122 00:06:38,560 --> 00:06:41,520 Speaker 1: I know that most of us worry about the whiteness 123 00:06:41,520 --> 00:06:43,440 Speaker 1: of our teeth, or the shape of our teeth, or 124 00:06:43,680 --> 00:06:46,640 Speaker 1: or how they smell, right, all of those kinds of things. 125 00:06:46,680 --> 00:06:50,040 Speaker 1: But there are also anthropological what are referred to as 126 00:06:50,279 --> 00:06:55,120 Speaker 1: para masticatory functions of teeth. And this is where teeth 127 00:06:55,120 --> 00:06:59,919 Speaker 1: are altered by intent or sometimes in what's called like 128 00:07:00,000 --> 00:07:03,640 Speaker 1: an unconscious accident or maybe some kind of behavioral result. 129 00:07:03,760 --> 00:07:07,720 Speaker 1: Right now, okay, you might be reeling from this idea already. 130 00:07:07,760 --> 00:07:10,360 Speaker 1: You might be one of those people who doesn't like 131 00:07:10,440 --> 00:07:12,800 Speaker 1: going to the dentist, and there's that you know, there's 132 00:07:12,840 --> 00:07:18,280 Speaker 1: that special kind of person persons. Now you know what 133 00:07:18,280 --> 00:07:20,960 Speaker 1: I mean. Isn't there like a particular kind of dentist 134 00:07:21,040 --> 00:07:22,520 Speaker 1: you can go to if you have a little bit 135 00:07:22,520 --> 00:07:26,040 Speaker 1: of trauma associated with dental practice that's like quiet and 136 00:07:26,040 --> 00:07:28,880 Speaker 1: they play soft music and they're like very gentle about 137 00:07:28,880 --> 00:07:30,840 Speaker 1: the way they go about things. I forget what there's 138 00:07:30,840 --> 00:07:32,880 Speaker 1: a name for it, but I've I've read about it before. 139 00:07:33,600 --> 00:07:36,640 Speaker 1: But so if you're that, you know, type of patient 140 00:07:36,760 --> 00:07:39,480 Speaker 1: for dentists, you might be reeling from this idea already 141 00:07:39,520 --> 00:07:43,520 Speaker 1: about body modification culture in general, especially when it comes 142 00:07:43,520 --> 00:07:46,680 Speaker 1: to your mouth. Yeah, Like I know, having read a 143 00:07:46,680 --> 00:07:50,239 Speaker 1: lot of Stephen King, especially in my junior nine teen years, 144 00:07:50,360 --> 00:07:52,120 Speaker 1: I feel like that was something Keen would come back 145 00:07:52,160 --> 00:07:54,080 Speaker 1: to time and time again. It's the image of an 146 00:07:54,080 --> 00:07:57,840 Speaker 1: individual with with sharpened teeth because on one hand, it's 147 00:07:57,920 --> 00:08:00,600 Speaker 1: it's like they've completely given themselves over to some sort 148 00:08:00,600 --> 00:08:04,080 Speaker 1: of animalistic uh quality, and and at the same time 149 00:08:04,120 --> 00:08:07,440 Speaker 1: it's irreversible. Right, you've how could you try teeth? Yeah, 150 00:08:07,560 --> 00:08:12,000 Speaker 1: And you know, there's our fascination with vampires. There's just 151 00:08:12,080 --> 00:08:14,680 Speaker 1: the idea of exactly like kind of what you're mentioning, 152 00:08:14,680 --> 00:08:18,000 Speaker 1: like the the canine teeth of the human being sort 153 00:08:18,000 --> 00:08:21,000 Speaker 1: of a representation of our primal nature, right, Yeah, because 154 00:08:21,040 --> 00:08:23,920 Speaker 1: of course we have teeth for tearing, teeth for crushing, 155 00:08:24,400 --> 00:08:30,080 Speaker 1: all important for our omnivorous diet. But h yeah. And 156 00:08:30,120 --> 00:08:33,520 Speaker 1: then also it's worth noting that you know, historically teeth 157 00:08:33,520 --> 00:08:36,440 Speaker 1: have come in handy for tool use. We don't recommend it, 158 00:08:36,480 --> 00:08:38,400 Speaker 1: but it is they can be used as a tool, 159 00:08:38,400 --> 00:08:40,400 Speaker 1: and that's another way they can be altered for sure, right, 160 00:08:40,400 --> 00:08:42,600 Speaker 1: if you're like chewing on rope or something like. Right, 161 00:08:42,920 --> 00:08:46,880 Speaker 1: But then also you know, self defense, um, situations as 162 00:08:46,960 --> 00:08:51,560 Speaker 1: well as a last ditch scenario, humans can bite. So 163 00:08:51,800 --> 00:08:54,280 Speaker 1: what the important thing to remember here as we're going 164 00:08:54,320 --> 00:08:57,760 Speaker 1: over this is that, you know, teeth are artifacts of 165 00:08:57,840 --> 00:08:59,800 Speaker 1: human behavior, just in the same way as like our 166 00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:03,840 Speaker 1: clothing are, and as such, we modify them in ways 167 00:09:03,880 --> 00:09:09,839 Speaker 1: to communicate with others nonverbally. My experience in in communications 168 00:09:09,880 --> 00:09:12,679 Speaker 1: theory is this is referred to as artifactual communication. Right, 169 00:09:12,720 --> 00:09:16,280 Speaker 1: So whereas like we might brush our teeth or wear 170 00:09:16,280 --> 00:09:19,560 Speaker 1: braces or um white in our teeth or something like that, 171 00:09:19,760 --> 00:09:22,720 Speaker 1: and other societies they're drilling holes into their teeth and 172 00:09:22,800 --> 00:09:26,839 Speaker 1: mounting jewels in them, or they're dyeing them black, right, 173 00:09:27,040 --> 00:09:30,000 Speaker 1: or they're ripping them out of their gums. And that's 174 00:09:30,000 --> 00:09:33,120 Speaker 1: what we're gonna be talking about today. One theory about 175 00:09:33,160 --> 00:09:36,640 Speaker 1: this is that it's a form of costly signaling theory, 176 00:09:37,000 --> 00:09:41,200 Speaker 1: and this theory argues that in certain cultures, individuals employ 177 00:09:41,520 --> 00:09:47,720 Speaker 1: what are usually costly, monetarily wise signals that help one 178 00:09:47,840 --> 00:09:51,559 Speaker 1: receive rewards, and usually that's in the form of a mate. Okay, 179 00:09:51,800 --> 00:09:53,320 Speaker 1: so you this is the kind of thing you would 180 00:09:53,320 --> 00:09:56,360 Speaker 1: see if you went down to the beach and you saw, 181 00:09:56,559 --> 00:09:58,640 Speaker 1: say a dude who has really put in a lot 182 00:09:58,640 --> 00:10:00,920 Speaker 1: of time and money on his zeke, and maybe he's 183 00:10:00,920 --> 00:10:03,800 Speaker 1: covered with a bunch of tattoos to boot exactly. Yeah, 184 00:10:04,200 --> 00:10:07,640 Speaker 1: and even to some Western dentists, these practices that we're 185 00:10:07,679 --> 00:10:10,240 Speaker 1: going to talk about today are going to seem totally 186 00:10:10,280 --> 00:10:13,679 Speaker 1: weird and and maybe unhealthy in some situations too. Right, 187 00:10:14,160 --> 00:10:15,960 Speaker 1: But you know, we have to remember that our own 188 00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:20,040 Speaker 1: traditions are considered absolute in our culture, and our ideas 189 00:10:20,040 --> 00:10:23,000 Speaker 1: about teeth are just as culturally determined as say the 190 00:10:23,040 --> 00:10:27,199 Speaker 1: Balinese or the Acadian French Canadian population we're going to 191 00:10:27,280 --> 00:10:30,440 Speaker 1: talk about today. So okay, let's let's get into it. 192 00:10:30,480 --> 00:10:35,280 Speaker 1: We've got chipping, filing, staining, banding, jewel inlays. Let's start 193 00:10:35,440 --> 00:10:39,000 Speaker 1: with how human beings modify their teeth, right, So what 194 00:10:39,080 --> 00:10:41,360 Speaker 1: is so? What are some of the earliest known examples 195 00:10:41,360 --> 00:10:43,480 Speaker 1: of this when we look back at the at the 196 00:10:43,559 --> 00:10:47,720 Speaker 1: archaeological data. So the oldest known example are the Etruscans, 197 00:10:47,840 --> 00:10:51,440 Speaker 1: and this is in seventh century b C. They took 198 00:10:51,640 --> 00:10:54,880 Speaker 1: flat gold bands and they would hold their real teeth 199 00:10:54,960 --> 00:10:58,080 Speaker 1: or sometimes fake teeth in place with these gold bands 200 00:10:58,080 --> 00:11:01,880 Speaker 1: in their mouths. Now, only women wore these devices, and 201 00:11:01,880 --> 00:11:05,200 Speaker 1: the surviving pieces have been found in dig sites in 202 00:11:05,240 --> 00:11:09,040 Speaker 1: the Italian region of Lazio. Uh. It's thought that these 203 00:11:09,120 --> 00:11:12,200 Speaker 1: generally denoted wealth in some kind of high status, because 204 00:11:12,240 --> 00:11:13,959 Speaker 1: those were the kind of grave sites that they were 205 00:11:13,960 --> 00:11:17,680 Speaker 1: found in. Um. But there's also been examples from ancient 206 00:11:17,679 --> 00:11:20,960 Speaker 1: cultures of covering your teeth in gold everywhere from Rome 207 00:11:21,080 --> 00:11:23,560 Speaker 1: to China. So that's that's a fairly common thing that 208 00:11:23,600 --> 00:11:25,400 Speaker 1: goes back a while. It's not just like a new 209 00:11:25,480 --> 00:11:27,959 Speaker 1: fat and of course, yeah, and to your point, continues 210 00:11:28,000 --> 00:11:31,480 Speaker 1: on to this day. Yeah. So it's just a perfectly 211 00:11:31,559 --> 00:11:35,839 Speaker 1: human obsessions since time out of mind, right, Yeah, I mean, 212 00:11:35,880 --> 00:11:39,280 Speaker 1: like the the the current culture of like caps and 213 00:11:39,360 --> 00:11:43,640 Speaker 1: grills is especially like similar to these kinds of things. 214 00:11:43,679 --> 00:11:46,720 Speaker 1: And here in Atlanta, I mean just downtown Atlanta. There's 215 00:11:46,760 --> 00:11:49,080 Speaker 1: several places I used to work down there when I 216 00:11:49,120 --> 00:11:52,200 Speaker 1: was working at the university. There's all kinds of places 217 00:11:52,240 --> 00:11:53,880 Speaker 1: where you can just walk in and get your grills 218 00:11:53,880 --> 00:11:57,120 Speaker 1: set up. Um. So it is a you know, common 219 00:11:57,160 --> 00:12:00,800 Speaker 1: cultural phenomenon today as well. With the golden lays. Now, 220 00:12:00,840 --> 00:12:04,720 Speaker 1: one of the examples of dental modification that that that 221 00:12:04,800 --> 00:12:07,560 Speaker 1: I've found particularly fascinating and have blogged on in the 222 00:12:07,600 --> 00:12:11,880 Speaker 1: past is a Balinese tooth filing. So this takes place 223 00:12:11,880 --> 00:12:16,000 Speaker 1: in the Indian Indonesian island of Bali. And uh, this 224 00:12:16,080 --> 00:12:19,360 Speaker 1: is in in in this particular society. It's those carnivorous 225 00:12:19,400 --> 00:12:23,719 Speaker 1: teeth that we've we've touched on already, the canines and incisors. 226 00:12:23,760 --> 00:12:26,319 Speaker 1: So these are viewed as sort of you know, be 227 00:12:26,480 --> 00:12:30,959 Speaker 1: steel teeth is representing the b steal nature of humanity. 228 00:12:31,200 --> 00:12:33,800 Speaker 1: And so here we find tooth filing is a rite 229 00:12:33,800 --> 00:12:37,360 Speaker 1: of passage into adulthood and a key indicator of social, 230 00:12:37,600 --> 00:12:41,440 Speaker 1: aesthetic and spiritual well being. Okay, and the key here 231 00:12:41,480 --> 00:12:43,960 Speaker 1: is that they're not filing their teeth into points. They're 232 00:12:43,960 --> 00:12:47,280 Speaker 1: actually filing them down to they're flatter, right right, it's 233 00:12:47,280 --> 00:12:50,080 Speaker 1: almost you know, to create a more um you know, 234 00:12:50,200 --> 00:12:54,719 Speaker 1: vegetarian dental arrangement. Yeah. They smooth away the thing like 235 00:12:54,920 --> 00:12:57,520 Speaker 1: qualities of of the human teeth, and in doing so 236 00:12:57,600 --> 00:13:00,319 Speaker 1: they smooth away that the savage aspects of their soul. 237 00:13:00,440 --> 00:13:04,200 Speaker 1: That's the approach here. Uh. And ideally the ritualized procedure 238 00:13:04,240 --> 00:13:07,600 Speaker 1: is performed by a Brahmin priest, though you can actually 239 00:13:08,400 --> 00:13:11,600 Speaker 1: get your local Balinese dentist to manage it as well, 240 00:13:12,040 --> 00:13:14,560 Speaker 1: and if you can't afford to filing this is this 241 00:13:14,600 --> 00:13:17,400 Speaker 1: is amazing. They are charitable organizations or you may be 242 00:13:17,760 --> 00:13:21,280 Speaker 1: able to get a sponsor, an individual to sponsor you 243 00:13:21,600 --> 00:13:23,640 Speaker 1: so that you can receive the procedure. Like that's the 244 00:13:24,040 --> 00:13:28,400 Speaker 1: cultural way that it is. Yeah, so it's that important society. 245 00:13:28,679 --> 00:13:31,000 Speaker 1: And so from what I was reading, my understanding was 246 00:13:31,040 --> 00:13:34,920 Speaker 1: that this is a practice that has both localized traditional history, 247 00:13:34,960 --> 00:13:39,480 Speaker 1: but then it also has some Hindu uh religious qualities 248 00:13:39,520 --> 00:13:42,040 Speaker 1: that got merged into it when Hinduism became popular in 249 00:13:42,040 --> 00:13:44,559 Speaker 1: the region. Yeah, it's a it's an ancient custom predates 250 00:13:44,720 --> 00:13:49,160 Speaker 1: Hinduism's arrival on the island in the fifth century BC. Uh. 251 00:13:49,320 --> 00:13:51,160 Speaker 1: And as often, you know, as the case, the the 252 00:13:51,160 --> 00:13:54,160 Speaker 1: old ways merged with the new ways and it becomes 253 00:13:54,200 --> 00:13:57,040 Speaker 1: this uh, you know, this hugely important things so important 254 00:13:57,400 --> 00:14:00,840 Speaker 1: that if you if you die with un modified teeth, 255 00:14:01,480 --> 00:14:04,160 Speaker 1: then then the teeth of your corpse can even be 256 00:14:04,240 --> 00:14:07,120 Speaker 1: filed down to ensure your passage into the spirit room. 257 00:14:07,120 --> 00:14:09,160 Speaker 1: And you probably don't need a specialist for that at 258 00:14:09,160 --> 00:14:11,400 Speaker 1: that point. They can just you know, like your brother 259 00:14:11,440 --> 00:14:13,840 Speaker 1: can do it. Yeah, I'm guessing maybe it requires a 260 00:14:13,840 --> 00:14:17,440 Speaker 1: little less care and finesse the symbolic power. This is 261 00:14:17,440 --> 00:14:20,320 Speaker 1: pretty crazy too, because if anyone out there is familiar 262 00:14:20,400 --> 00:14:22,960 Speaker 1: with Balinese art, like then I should be able to 263 00:14:23,000 --> 00:14:25,520 Speaker 1: just say, bolly Balinese art and you should get certain 264 00:14:25,560 --> 00:14:28,960 Speaker 1: pictures of they're they're more common motifs in your mind, 265 00:14:29,360 --> 00:14:32,480 Speaker 1: you know, particularly you see this. There's a character named Boma, 266 00:14:32,600 --> 00:14:34,680 Speaker 1: the Son of the Earth, and he's the awards off 267 00:14:34,720 --> 00:14:38,200 Speaker 1: evil uh spirits and uh and and he looks like 268 00:14:38,760 --> 00:14:41,040 Speaker 1: some sort of a demon to sort of Western eyes, 269 00:14:41,080 --> 00:14:43,560 Speaker 1: and he has these big h you know things and all. 270 00:14:43,920 --> 00:14:48,520 Speaker 1: According to British anthropologist Anthony Forge, that's a great name 271 00:14:48,560 --> 00:14:52,560 Speaker 1: for an anthropologist by the Forge of anthropology. Here he's 272 00:14:52,600 --> 00:14:57,200 Speaker 1: noted that this dental obsession manifests itself in the art. 273 00:14:57,280 --> 00:14:59,720 Speaker 1: And so you see the teeth of supernatural entities such 274 00:14:59,720 --> 00:15:04,080 Speaker 1: as the gods and spirits take on exaggerated, uh be 275 00:15:04,240 --> 00:15:08,960 Speaker 1: stual form, you know, giant canines to symbolize the opposite 276 00:15:08,960 --> 00:15:12,200 Speaker 1: of desired human qualities. Okay, I'm thinking of like some 277 00:15:12,240 --> 00:15:16,120 Speaker 1: of the kind of like um tribal masks that I've 278 00:15:16,160 --> 00:15:19,880 Speaker 1: seen from certain Pacific island cultures. Yeah, exactly, that kind 279 00:15:19,920 --> 00:15:23,280 Speaker 1: of you know, like huge things because it's beautiful stuff. 280 00:15:23,920 --> 00:15:26,240 Speaker 1: But it's interesting how in looking at the way that 281 00:15:26,320 --> 00:15:29,960 Speaker 1: the teeth of their spirits are represented in their art. Uh, 282 00:15:30,080 --> 00:15:34,520 Speaker 1: Like that reflects too in their their body modification and 283 00:15:34,560 --> 00:15:38,520 Speaker 1: the the alteration of their teeth for for purely aesthetic 284 00:15:39,040 --> 00:15:42,160 Speaker 1: spiritual and you know, in cultural reasons. Yeah, that makes sense. 285 00:15:42,200 --> 00:15:44,600 Speaker 1: And there's a couple of other examples that we're going 286 00:15:44,680 --> 00:15:46,880 Speaker 1: to talk about in the episode today where that that's 287 00:15:46,880 --> 00:15:50,480 Speaker 1: similar and that the deification of the of the teeth 288 00:15:50,680 --> 00:15:55,840 Speaker 1: shows up in visual representations of gods or myths. Yeah, okay, Well, 289 00:15:55,880 --> 00:15:59,920 Speaker 1: another brief look here at some people who file their 290 00:16:00,040 --> 00:16:06,040 Speaker 1: teeth for dental modification is the I've been people of Borneo, uh, 291 00:16:06,080 --> 00:16:09,200 Speaker 1: and they further beautified their teeth by they both blacken 292 00:16:09,280 --> 00:16:10,960 Speaker 1: and file it. But then what they do is they 293 00:16:11,080 --> 00:16:13,840 Speaker 1: drill a hole in the middle of each tooth and 294 00:16:13,840 --> 00:16:17,800 Speaker 1: then place a brass stud in this hole, so every 295 00:16:17,800 --> 00:16:22,080 Speaker 1: tooth has like a tiny little breast stud in its center. Also, 296 00:16:22,160 --> 00:16:25,960 Speaker 1: the May people of Vietnam, they have their incisors chipped 297 00:16:25,960 --> 00:16:29,120 Speaker 1: and ground down to the gum line. Uh. And this 298 00:16:29,200 --> 00:16:32,760 Speaker 1: is something that was deliberately done in in terms of 299 00:16:32,800 --> 00:16:35,520 Speaker 1: like staining back when they were. This is before it 300 00:16:35,560 --> 00:16:38,720 Speaker 1: was Vietnam, when it was referred to as French colonial annam. 301 00:16:38,960 --> 00:16:41,720 Speaker 1: I think I'm saying that right, uh, And every person 302 00:16:41,880 --> 00:16:45,040 Speaker 1: was expected to have their teeth blackened by what was 303 00:16:45,120 --> 00:16:49,520 Speaker 1: quote a very painful process. Um. So for for those 304 00:16:49,520 --> 00:16:51,200 Speaker 1: of us who are afraid of going to the dentist, 305 00:16:51,240 --> 00:16:53,800 Speaker 1: can you imagine just you know, somebody going at you 306 00:16:53,840 --> 00:16:56,080 Speaker 1: with in a lot of cases easier just with like stones. 307 00:16:56,520 --> 00:16:59,080 Speaker 1: That's how they're they're filing their teeth down. And then 308 00:16:59,080 --> 00:17:02,440 Speaker 1: the blackening usually occurs with some some kind of combination 309 00:17:02,480 --> 00:17:05,800 Speaker 1: of like charcoal or plants. Yeah, they're actually one of 310 00:17:05,840 --> 00:17:10,800 Speaker 1: the practices in modern Mayanmar is the the chewing of 311 00:17:10,840 --> 00:17:15,280 Speaker 1: particular um, you know, root substances to to black to 312 00:17:15,320 --> 00:17:17,800 Speaker 1: help black and yeah, well the moy did it as 313 00:17:17,840 --> 00:17:20,639 Speaker 1: like a beautification thing basically, and the idea was that 314 00:17:20,680 --> 00:17:23,119 Speaker 1: if you didn't do it, you weren't an adult and 315 00:17:23,200 --> 00:17:26,480 Speaker 1: you couldn't get married. So nobody again, like it's like 316 00:17:26,760 --> 00:17:29,320 Speaker 1: it's our version of the Hollywood smile, right, Like, like 317 00:17:29,400 --> 00:17:34,159 Speaker 1: they weren't considered on equal level of maturity until they 318 00:17:34,160 --> 00:17:37,200 Speaker 1: had done this, And some tribes even gave their lower 319 00:17:37,280 --> 00:17:41,040 Speaker 1: jaws like a saw shape with the filing combination, so 320 00:17:41,080 --> 00:17:44,960 Speaker 1: that's kind of interesting, and then meso American teeth filing. 321 00:17:45,080 --> 00:17:47,320 Speaker 1: There there was a lot more research on on this 322 00:17:47,400 --> 00:17:49,920 Speaker 1: from what I could find, but basically it's a combination 323 00:17:49,960 --> 00:17:54,200 Speaker 1: of the filing cross hatch designs like carving cross hatches 324 00:17:54,280 --> 00:17:57,320 Speaker 1: into your teeth, and then the jewel inlays as well. 325 00:17:58,560 --> 00:18:02,359 Speaker 1: So this was frequent in young adults in what is 326 00:18:02,640 --> 00:18:06,160 Speaker 1: referred to as late Classic Mayan sights. And I went 327 00:18:06,240 --> 00:18:08,239 Speaker 1: and looked that up to to you know, some kind 328 00:18:08,280 --> 00:18:11,160 Speaker 1: of placement here in history. It's around a D five 329 00:18:11,280 --> 00:18:15,879 Speaker 1: fifty to eight thirty. Okay. Uh. Many investigators believed at 330 00:18:15,880 --> 00:18:20,199 Speaker 1: the time that dental mutilation correlated with high social position, 331 00:18:20,240 --> 00:18:22,280 Speaker 1: So we're seeing a theme here, right. This seems to 332 00:18:22,359 --> 00:18:25,040 Speaker 1: be going along with almost all of these. It's a 333 00:18:25,119 --> 00:18:27,959 Speaker 1: social status. You need to be able to pay a 334 00:18:28,160 --> 00:18:32,840 Speaker 1: doctor slash artisan to transform your teeth into the desired form, 335 00:18:33,040 --> 00:18:36,280 Speaker 1: which is the same thing that we have today. Yeah. Yeah, 336 00:18:36,760 --> 00:18:39,840 Speaker 1: uh So there's a collection actually at the Institute o 337 00:18:40,200 --> 00:18:44,880 Speaker 1: National day Anthropologia a Historia in Mexico City where they 338 00:18:44,880 --> 00:18:47,480 Speaker 1: have a thousand, two hundred and twelve teeth that's a 339 00:18:47,560 --> 00:18:51,840 Speaker 1: very specific ammounity from this period of time. But yeah, 340 00:18:52,000 --> 00:18:55,320 Speaker 1: mainly these were filed down with stones. The cross hatch 341 00:18:55,400 --> 00:18:58,160 Speaker 1: patterns were carved into what's referred to as the labial 342 00:18:58,359 --> 00:19:00,800 Speaker 1: surface of the tooth, and then they would put in 343 00:19:00,920 --> 00:19:07,040 Speaker 1: jewel incrustation or inlays um. They're basically grills that aren't removable. Uh. 344 00:19:07,080 --> 00:19:10,080 Speaker 1: And they would use all kinds of different stones for this. 345 00:19:10,160 --> 00:19:16,440 Speaker 1: They used pyrite, j dite, turquoise, hematite, serpentine, mother of pearl, cinnabar, 346 00:19:16,640 --> 00:19:19,400 Speaker 1: or gold set into the surface of the teeth. The 347 00:19:19,440 --> 00:19:23,359 Speaker 1: most popular and common where the iron pyrite and the jade. Though, 348 00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:26,080 Speaker 1: and the way that they did this, this is the 349 00:19:26,080 --> 00:19:29,439 Speaker 1: part that's crazy to me. Like I normally don't have 350 00:19:29,440 --> 00:19:31,320 Speaker 1: any problems when I go to the dentist. I'm pretty 351 00:19:31,320 --> 00:19:33,640 Speaker 1: cool with them, you know, doing all the stuff in there. 352 00:19:33,640 --> 00:19:36,040 Speaker 1: And they could the little suction host and stare at 353 00:19:36,080 --> 00:19:39,639 Speaker 1: the ceiling. Yeah. The TV, which always bothers me a 354 00:19:39,640 --> 00:19:42,040 Speaker 1: little bit because I don't really want to watch the TV. 355 00:19:42,480 --> 00:19:44,359 Speaker 1: I don't know if I want you watching the TV 356 00:19:45,080 --> 00:19:48,520 Speaker 1: exactly while you're working on my mouth. Yeah, I've had 357 00:19:48,560 --> 00:19:50,960 Speaker 1: people like comment like can you believe that? Like, while 358 00:19:51,000 --> 00:19:53,080 Speaker 1: they're working on my mouth, and I'm like trying not 359 00:19:53,160 --> 00:19:55,760 Speaker 1: to pay attention to the TV. But yeah, uh so 360 00:19:55,960 --> 00:19:59,520 Speaker 1: in Misso America Mayan culture, what they would do is 361 00:19:59,640 --> 00:20:01,280 Speaker 1: they didn't of the TV, but they would take a 362 00:20:01,440 --> 00:20:04,439 Speaker 1: rotating fine tube of quartz or some other kind of 363 00:20:04,480 --> 00:20:08,600 Speaker 1: resistant stone and they would rotate it slowly against the 364 00:20:08,640 --> 00:20:11,960 Speaker 1: surface of the enamel of your teeth. They'd add water 365 00:20:12,320 --> 00:20:15,560 Speaker 1: in an abrasive powder or sand to help drill it out. 366 00:20:15,600 --> 00:20:18,240 Speaker 1: For this inlay, they would possibly use what's called a 367 00:20:18,359 --> 00:20:20,720 Speaker 1: bow drill as well, which I looked this up. It 368 00:20:20,840 --> 00:20:22,760 Speaker 1: basically looks like what you would think. It looks like 369 00:20:22,920 --> 00:20:24,879 Speaker 1: a bow for a bow and arrow, and then in 370 00:20:24,920 --> 00:20:27,399 Speaker 1: the middle, instead of having an arrow, there's there's this 371 00:20:27,600 --> 00:20:31,879 Speaker 1: quartz tube thing that kind of spins apart sometimes that 372 00:20:32,080 --> 00:20:35,520 Speaker 1: used as a fire making up. Yeah, exactly, yep. Uh. 373 00:20:35,560 --> 00:20:38,719 Speaker 1: And so this was probably somewhere around seven hundred nine 374 00:20:39,480 --> 00:20:44,399 Speaker 1: d and one theory is that this filing occurred because okay, 375 00:20:44,440 --> 00:20:46,240 Speaker 1: here we go again with the d D thing. The 376 00:20:46,240 --> 00:20:49,679 Speaker 1: Maso Americans were honoring a particular solar deity who is 377 00:20:49,720 --> 00:20:52,960 Speaker 1: depicted as having filed teeth. So this was a way 378 00:20:53,000 --> 00:20:56,199 Speaker 1: to show their admiration for him. Some of the skeletons 379 00:20:56,200 --> 00:20:59,920 Speaker 1: that are found in the archaeological record there show incomplete 380 00:21:00,280 --> 00:21:02,760 Speaker 1: inlays as well. Uh, and they think that this might 381 00:21:02,760 --> 00:21:05,199 Speaker 1: be because the pain was actually so much that some 382 00:21:05,240 --> 00:21:08,719 Speaker 1: people couldn't go through with it, or that the individual 383 00:21:09,119 --> 00:21:13,159 Speaker 1: died before it was finished. And death was also possible 384 00:21:13,840 --> 00:21:16,439 Speaker 1: fairly soon after because there was a high risk of 385 00:21:16,480 --> 00:21:20,680 Speaker 1: bacterial encephalitis after these procedures. So one of the pieces 386 00:21:20,720 --> 00:21:24,080 Speaker 1: that we read for this is a thesis paper by 387 00:21:24,080 --> 00:21:26,800 Speaker 1: a woman named Daniel Barnes, and we're gonna come back 388 00:21:26,800 --> 00:21:28,800 Speaker 1: and cite this a lot, but I want to insert 389 00:21:28,880 --> 00:21:32,760 Speaker 1: this here because the main argument of her thesis was that, 390 00:21:33,280 --> 00:21:36,160 Speaker 1: and I'm quoting her here, since death is a possible 391 00:21:36,200 --> 00:21:40,040 Speaker 1: outcome of intentional dental modification, it should be considered a 392 00:21:40,119 --> 00:21:43,639 Speaker 1: high risk procedure. So her point with all of this 393 00:21:43,800 --> 00:21:47,240 Speaker 1: was she sort of showcases all of the different anthropological 394 00:21:47,640 --> 00:21:51,480 Speaker 1: modifications of teeth and then says, you know, think about 395 00:21:51,520 --> 00:21:53,960 Speaker 1: this in context of today and how we modify her 396 00:21:54,000 --> 00:21:57,679 Speaker 1: teeth today, and that there's some danger involved there. But 397 00:21:57,800 --> 00:22:00,240 Speaker 1: she does point out that things like add and grows 398 00:22:00,240 --> 00:22:02,919 Speaker 1: and caps or modern dental procedures you know that that 399 00:22:03,040 --> 00:22:05,040 Speaker 1: that's not what she's talking about here. She's talking about 400 00:22:05,600 --> 00:22:08,840 Speaker 1: instances like trying to file your teeth down with stone, 401 00:22:09,119 --> 00:22:11,560 Speaker 1: or as we're going to talk about later, you know, 402 00:22:11,640 --> 00:22:14,119 Speaker 1: the extraction of all of the teeth from your lower 403 00:22:14,200 --> 00:22:16,720 Speaker 1: jaw or something like that, which even today you're going 404 00:22:16,760 --> 00:22:19,960 Speaker 1: and get your wisdom teeth removed. They put you under anesthesia. 405 00:22:20,320 --> 00:22:24,080 Speaker 1: There's always that slim possibility that you won't wake up. Yeah, 406 00:22:24,119 --> 00:22:26,480 Speaker 1: I always have that thing. So I am used to 407 00:22:26,520 --> 00:22:29,159 Speaker 1: be diagnosed with something called a mitro valve pro lapse, 408 00:22:29,200 --> 00:22:31,760 Speaker 1: which is one of the valves in my heart wasn't 409 00:22:31,800 --> 00:22:33,840 Speaker 1: fluttering the right way or something like that. That's why 410 00:22:33,920 --> 00:22:39,280 Speaker 1: you don't love Christmas? Yeah, exactly. So when you have 411 00:22:39,320 --> 00:22:41,439 Speaker 1: a mitro valve prolapse, whenever you go to the dentist. 412 00:22:41,560 --> 00:22:42,840 Speaker 1: You might have heard of this since your dad was 413 00:22:42,880 --> 00:22:45,920 Speaker 1: a dentist. You have to take antibiotics because they're worried 414 00:22:46,000 --> 00:22:48,880 Speaker 1: that the bacteria that they're messing around within your mouth 415 00:22:48,920 --> 00:22:51,120 Speaker 1: is going to go down and somehow infect your your 416 00:22:51,160 --> 00:22:56,639 Speaker 1: heart because the valve apparently makes you more susceptible to infections. 417 00:22:56,640 --> 00:22:59,280 Speaker 1: This is interesting. Uh, we'll put a pin in that 418 00:22:59,520 --> 00:23:03,640 Speaker 1: tidbit will become important later on in the podcast. Oh yeah, yeah, 419 00:23:03,720 --> 00:23:07,399 Speaker 1: of course. So okay, so we're wrapping up on the 420 00:23:07,520 --> 00:23:10,800 Speaker 1: meso American Mayans there, but they've really got this, you know, 421 00:23:10,880 --> 00:23:15,040 Speaker 1: beautiful jewelry embedded in their teeth. Uh. And then there's 422 00:23:15,119 --> 00:23:18,480 Speaker 1: the staining of the teeth that we want to come to. 423 00:23:18,680 --> 00:23:22,520 Speaker 1: So there's enemies staining, right, Yeah, First of all, there's 424 00:23:22,560 --> 00:23:25,320 Speaker 1: the the enemies who have already covered. And then I 425 00:23:25,359 --> 00:23:28,639 Speaker 1: believe we also have Japanese practice as well. Yeah, and 426 00:23:28,720 --> 00:23:32,400 Speaker 1: so Japanese women used to die this is a specific 427 00:23:32,400 --> 00:23:35,600 Speaker 1: culture called Yaba. I believe they used to dye their 428 00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:39,960 Speaker 1: teeth black with tannin powder and a ferris ascetate solution. 429 00:23:40,800 --> 00:23:44,639 Speaker 1: And they considered this again high fashion and uh it 430 00:23:45,000 --> 00:23:48,159 Speaker 1: signified marital status. It was unknown at the time, but 431 00:23:48,240 --> 00:23:52,439 Speaker 1: they also, uh you know, realized this protected their teeth 432 00:23:52,520 --> 00:23:55,800 Speaker 1: from bacterial colonization. So maybe that's what they should have 433 00:23:55,800 --> 00:23:57,879 Speaker 1: done to me at the dentist instead has just given 434 00:23:57,880 --> 00:24:00,520 Speaker 1: me like a solution of tannin powder or and ferres 435 00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:04,000 Speaker 1: acetate rather than you know, make me take antibiotics. This 436 00:24:04,119 --> 00:24:06,840 Speaker 1: was also done this kind of standing practice in places 437 00:24:06,880 --> 00:24:11,080 Speaker 1: like Peru, Ecuador, Vietnam, as we talked about Laos, Thailand, 438 00:24:11,200 --> 00:24:15,280 Speaker 1: the Philippines, and Africa. In Nigeria, some people stain their 439 00:24:15,280 --> 00:24:18,919 Speaker 1: teeth with something called the solen um in cannum flowers, 440 00:24:19,440 --> 00:24:23,040 Speaker 1: and those are apparently a relative of eggplants, or they 441 00:24:23,119 --> 00:24:27,600 Speaker 1: use something called Nicotania tobaccum, which is, as it sounds, 442 00:24:27,640 --> 00:24:30,960 Speaker 1: an herb containing nicotine that sounds like it would actually 443 00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:32,879 Speaker 1: be kind of cool. It's like it's like, what do 444 00:24:32,920 --> 00:24:36,480 Speaker 1: you call it? Um? Yep? Yeah, yeah, which of course 445 00:24:36,600 --> 00:24:39,000 Speaker 1: can also stain your teeth um. You know, we already 446 00:24:39,000 --> 00:24:41,960 Speaker 1: mentioned the enemies a couple of times, but they had 447 00:24:42,520 --> 00:24:45,960 Speaker 1: an interesting saying that goes along with the staining, and 448 00:24:45,960 --> 00:24:48,600 Speaker 1: that is that any dog can have white teeth, which 449 00:24:48,640 --> 00:24:50,600 Speaker 1: is it puts an interesting twist on it, right, It 450 00:24:50,600 --> 00:24:53,480 Speaker 1: goes back to that whole I am human, and in 451 00:24:53,640 --> 00:24:58,000 Speaker 1: being human, how am I different? Founderstand? Yeah, that's interesting. Yeah. 452 00:24:58,440 --> 00:25:00,600 Speaker 1: And as I was thinking about this, because I brushed 453 00:25:00,640 --> 00:25:03,600 Speaker 1: my dog's teeth for and I was thinking about this 454 00:25:03,680 --> 00:25:09,080 Speaker 1: that like his obviously his canine teeth are very pronounced, right, 455 00:25:09,160 --> 00:25:13,920 Speaker 1: So I'm just trying to imagine like an anthropological dog, 456 00:25:14,080 --> 00:25:17,160 Speaker 1: like humanized dog kind of culture where they're filing down 457 00:25:17,200 --> 00:25:20,720 Speaker 1: their cane teeth. It gets back to what we talked 458 00:25:20,720 --> 00:25:24,280 Speaker 1: about on our Christmas episode. Remember in Rudolph the Red 459 00:25:24,320 --> 00:25:27,119 Speaker 1: Nose Reindeer, there's the whole thing with that and just 460 00:25:27,400 --> 00:25:30,960 Speaker 1: Elf and he removes all of the yet e the 461 00:25:31,000 --> 00:25:34,720 Speaker 1: bumbles teeth, the Abominable Snowman, he pulls all of his 462 00:25:34,760 --> 00:25:37,160 Speaker 1: teeth out of his head. So there's some ablation practice 463 00:25:37,200 --> 00:25:41,000 Speaker 1: going on there, oh for sure. So definitely keep Rudolf 464 00:25:41,040 --> 00:25:43,600 Speaker 1: the Red Nose Reindeer in your mind when we come 465 00:25:43,600 --> 00:25:48,879 Speaker 1: back from this break and start discussing dental extraction, mental illness, 466 00:25:49,119 --> 00:26:01,639 Speaker 1: and science. All right, we're back. So yeah, you're probably thinking, Okay, 467 00:26:01,640 --> 00:26:03,399 Speaker 1: so we've talked about the ways to just change the 468 00:26:03,440 --> 00:26:05,919 Speaker 1: way your teeth look. And I feel like, for the 469 00:26:05,960 --> 00:26:07,960 Speaker 1: most part, that's easier for us to get on board 470 00:26:07,960 --> 00:26:10,160 Speaker 1: with because we look, again, we've already touched on how 471 00:26:10,200 --> 00:26:13,160 Speaker 1: we're always altering the way our teeth appear, uh here 472 00:26:13,160 --> 00:26:16,560 Speaker 1: and in our modern Western civilization, and so we can say, 473 00:26:16,560 --> 00:26:19,199 Speaker 1: all right, I would not personally want to file my 474 00:26:19,240 --> 00:26:21,679 Speaker 1: teeth down or make them into little sharpened points, but 475 00:26:21,800 --> 00:26:24,119 Speaker 1: I can see where that lines up with our existing 476 00:26:24,840 --> 00:26:27,640 Speaker 1: view of things. But then how does it make sense? Right, 477 00:26:28,080 --> 00:26:30,679 Speaker 1: how do we get into the place where one just 478 00:26:30,800 --> 00:26:33,919 Speaker 1: removes the tooth or removes a bunch of teeth for 479 00:26:34,400 --> 00:26:40,240 Speaker 1: seemingly purely supernatural, superstitious or cultural reasons. Right, This isn't 480 00:26:40,280 --> 00:26:42,400 Speaker 1: like you have a bad cavity and the only way 481 00:26:42,440 --> 00:26:43,920 Speaker 1: to take care of it is the yank the tooth. 482 00:26:43,960 --> 00:26:47,760 Speaker 1: That right. In particular, there's deciduous teeth removal that's popular 483 00:26:47,800 --> 00:26:51,880 Speaker 1: in certain African tribal cultures. Uh. And it seems like 484 00:26:52,119 --> 00:26:55,639 Speaker 1: they purposely damage what's referred to as the tooth germ. 485 00:26:55,760 --> 00:26:58,600 Speaker 1: This is sort of like the growing tooth underneath your 486 00:26:58,640 --> 00:27:00,639 Speaker 1: baby teeth, I think, And they damn it's that so 487 00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:02,960 Speaker 1: that uh, you know, it just doesn't grow in. You 488 00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:06,679 Speaker 1: don't have a full tooth there. And in general African ablation, 489 00:27:06,880 --> 00:27:09,760 Speaker 1: it seems like it's kind of common with cultures. Uh. 490 00:27:09,800 --> 00:27:11,760 Speaker 1: And I might get some of these names wrong, but 491 00:27:11,840 --> 00:27:18,800 Speaker 1: these are the tribal cultures Amhara, Azande, Massai, new Air Bakiga, 492 00:27:19,040 --> 00:27:24,080 Speaker 1: a Koli, Baitarros, boogisas uh and that's in Uganda, and 493 00:27:24,119 --> 00:27:27,760 Speaker 1: then the Hia of Tanzania. And so this was one 494 00:27:27,800 --> 00:27:29,679 Speaker 1: of the fascinating things that I read about and I 495 00:27:29,680 --> 00:27:31,280 Speaker 1: think that you saw as well. And it was an 496 00:27:31,280 --> 00:27:33,960 Speaker 1: Eon magazine, right, Yeah, there's a wonderful piece in Ian 497 00:27:34,000 --> 00:27:38,359 Speaker 1: magazine by Brendan Borel. Yeah, it explores what's known as 498 00:27:38,520 --> 00:27:43,600 Speaker 1: a beano or false tooth disease in Uganda. So the 499 00:27:44,080 --> 00:27:48,000 Speaker 1: it's also referred to as a tooth word. Yeah, it's 500 00:27:48,280 --> 00:27:50,919 Speaker 1: I guess with a lot of things supernatural and uh 501 00:27:50,920 --> 00:27:53,359 Speaker 1: and fulkloric. It seems like it has a There are 502 00:27:53,359 --> 00:27:55,840 Speaker 1: a lot of different versions of what exactly it is. 503 00:27:55,960 --> 00:27:59,679 Speaker 1: I think, so yeah, it seems like well older versions 504 00:27:59,720 --> 00:28:02,320 Speaker 1: of this. I don't think that this is modern culture. 505 00:28:02,400 --> 00:28:06,000 Speaker 1: For them, they believed that the toothworm was a possible 506 00:28:06,040 --> 00:28:09,879 Speaker 1: demonic presence. That was it emerged when they saw pulp 507 00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:14,720 Speaker 1: coming out of damaged teeth. Um. So the tooth nerves 508 00:28:14,800 --> 00:28:17,960 Speaker 1: the nerves inside our teeth. Hopefully none of us have 509 00:28:18,000 --> 00:28:21,080 Speaker 1: actually seen this. I haven't. When they're exposed, they have 510 00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:24,239 Speaker 1: a kind of worm like appearance to them. Uh. And 511 00:28:24,280 --> 00:28:28,119 Speaker 1: so there's evidence that back in two d and fifty 512 00:28:28,240 --> 00:28:32,760 Speaker 1: b c e. Physicians would smoke tooth worms out of 513 00:28:32,800 --> 00:28:37,040 Speaker 1: the teeth by using nanbane seed that was needed into 514 00:28:37,119 --> 00:28:40,240 Speaker 1: bees wax. That doesn't sound like it would be particularly 515 00:28:40,240 --> 00:28:43,120 Speaker 1: fun either. Uh. And then the idea here is that 516 00:28:43,160 --> 00:28:46,320 Speaker 1: it would just destroy the nerves in your tooth, so 517 00:28:46,360 --> 00:28:49,600 Speaker 1: if you had any pain there that would obviously disappear. 518 00:28:49,840 --> 00:28:52,520 Speaker 1: I don't think you're actually getting at the quote unquote toothworm. 519 00:28:52,560 --> 00:28:54,160 Speaker 1: You're just killing the nerves in your teeth, so you 520 00:28:54,160 --> 00:28:56,240 Speaker 1: can't feel anything, right, and in this you know it can't. 521 00:28:56,440 --> 00:28:59,560 Speaker 1: We're kind of getting to the root, if you will, 522 00:28:59,600 --> 00:29:02,640 Speaker 1: of this um of this scenario, because because we're gonna 523 00:29:02,680 --> 00:29:04,760 Speaker 1: talk about some of the more you know, elaborate and 524 00:29:04,840 --> 00:29:08,480 Speaker 1: to our eyes, you know, nonsensical versions of it. But 525 00:29:08,800 --> 00:29:12,280 Speaker 1: at heart, you're dealing with somebody in an in an 526 00:29:12,280 --> 00:29:17,040 Speaker 1: older time, with limited resources and understanding, trying to address 527 00:29:17,360 --> 00:29:21,880 Speaker 1: physical pain, trying to deal with anomaly, denal anomalies, and 528 00:29:21,880 --> 00:29:26,240 Speaker 1: and and address them surgically. But as Brendan Barrell points out, 529 00:29:26,480 --> 00:29:29,120 Speaker 1: he just put this wonderfully in the article. Uh. He 530 00:29:29,200 --> 00:29:32,480 Speaker 1: refers to a quote sense of impotence in the face 531 00:29:32,600 --> 00:29:35,280 Speaker 1: of bodily mysteries. And I feel like that comes back 532 00:29:35,320 --> 00:29:38,040 Speaker 1: a time time and time again in this extraction section 533 00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:40,560 Speaker 1: of our podcast. Be here, because you have people trying 534 00:29:40,600 --> 00:29:43,320 Speaker 1: to deal with this illness, deal with this pain, deal 535 00:29:43,360 --> 00:29:48,000 Speaker 1: with this situation, and the best of their understanding seems 536 00:29:48,040 --> 00:29:51,560 Speaker 1: to point towards the removal of the problem tooth, or 537 00:29:51,560 --> 00:29:55,360 Speaker 1: the removal of a problem tooth in hopes of addressing it. Man. 538 00:29:55,480 --> 00:29:58,000 Speaker 1: I mean, I go back to that Tina Fake quote 539 00:29:58,000 --> 00:30:00,560 Speaker 1: that game at the beginning, like feel like, you know, 540 00:30:00,600 --> 00:30:03,240 Speaker 1: I'm closing in on forty here, and I feel like 541 00:30:03,280 --> 00:30:05,160 Speaker 1: I'm just starting to get to that point of these 542 00:30:05,200 --> 00:30:08,560 Speaker 1: bodily mysteries, you know, like it's like, wait, when where 543 00:30:08,560 --> 00:30:10,880 Speaker 1: did this like piece of flesh come from? I don't 544 00:30:10,920 --> 00:30:13,440 Speaker 1: remember this? Or why does this hurt when I wake 545 00:30:13,520 --> 00:30:15,880 Speaker 1: up in the morning. Kyle Canane has this bit about 546 00:30:15,880 --> 00:30:17,400 Speaker 1: how when he wakes up in the morning, his whole 547 00:30:17,400 --> 00:30:19,600 Speaker 1: body sounds like a bag of popcorn just out of 548 00:30:19,600 --> 00:30:22,760 Speaker 1: the microwave because it's all popping and everything like that. 549 00:30:22,760 --> 00:30:24,720 Speaker 1: That's and I'm I'm getting to that point too. And 550 00:30:24,760 --> 00:30:27,400 Speaker 1: you know, I'm no doctor. I don't know, so I 551 00:30:27,400 --> 00:30:29,200 Speaker 1: go into my doctor and I go, hey, what's going on. 552 00:30:29,240 --> 00:30:31,800 Speaker 1: In the same way these people probably went to their 553 00:30:31,840 --> 00:30:34,080 Speaker 1: you know, localized version of a doctor and we're like, 554 00:30:34,120 --> 00:30:36,600 Speaker 1: all right, give it to me with the nanbane seed 555 00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:38,560 Speaker 1: in the bees wax, because I don't know what's happening 556 00:30:38,560 --> 00:30:42,959 Speaker 1: in my mouth now, the false tooth disease, the the abino. Uh. 557 00:30:43,000 --> 00:30:45,320 Speaker 1: It also ends up, you know, applying a lot to children. 558 00:30:45,320 --> 00:30:48,040 Speaker 1: So you have you have an infant, sick, infant, infants complaining, 559 00:30:48,360 --> 00:30:51,280 Speaker 1: and so there's the belief that the child might have 560 00:30:51,560 --> 00:30:54,880 Speaker 1: this worm tooth in their head, this cursed tooth that 561 00:30:54,920 --> 00:30:58,160 Speaker 1: could result in the emergence of gum maggots. Uh. And 562 00:30:58,200 --> 00:31:01,160 Speaker 1: then this is going to you know, just roll out 563 00:31:01,160 --> 00:31:04,640 Speaker 1: of control, and that the causes here can range from 564 00:31:04,680 --> 00:31:09,000 Speaker 1: just you know, infected maze to outright bewitchment. In fact, 565 00:31:09,080 --> 00:31:12,880 Speaker 1: in the the magazine article, they referenced one attributed causes 566 00:31:12,960 --> 00:31:15,880 Speaker 1: just passing a false tooth on the road. Huh. So 567 00:31:16,000 --> 00:31:18,400 Speaker 1: there's a lot of superstition that gets rolled up at this, 568 00:31:18,720 --> 00:31:20,360 Speaker 1: and then the only way to deal with it is 569 00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:23,920 Speaker 1: you don't go to the hospital. You go to a 570 00:31:23,960 --> 00:31:26,960 Speaker 1: traditional healer for the tooth removal. Yeah. One of the 571 00:31:27,040 --> 00:31:30,400 Speaker 1: articles that we referenced for this, they referred to traditional 572 00:31:30,400 --> 00:31:34,160 Speaker 1: healers so many times that the author eventually just started 573 00:31:34,200 --> 00:31:37,959 Speaker 1: calling them thch. It took me a little while. What's 574 00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:41,200 Speaker 1: th h oh, traditional healer. Yeah. One of the papers 575 00:31:41,200 --> 00:31:44,560 Speaker 1: we're looking at two thousand eleven paper published in the 576 00:31:44,600 --> 00:31:49,200 Speaker 1: Journal of eth no Biology and ethno Medicine, and they 577 00:31:49,200 --> 00:31:52,320 Speaker 1: put a lot of this and some interesting context. They 578 00:31:52,360 --> 00:31:56,120 Speaker 1: said that in cameraon, for instance, traditional healers actually do 579 00:31:56,160 --> 00:32:00,040 Speaker 1: a pretty decent job at tooth extracting. And most of 580 00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:02,000 Speaker 1: the the examples they looked at, and again this was 581 00:32:02,000 --> 00:32:06,240 Speaker 1: in twenty eleven, you know very much, you know modern times, Uh, 582 00:32:06,320 --> 00:32:09,400 Speaker 1: most of the examples of tooth extraction stemmed from legitimate 583 00:32:09,440 --> 00:32:12,840 Speaker 1: concerns such as tooth pain, looseness of the teeth, or 584 00:32:12,960 --> 00:32:15,760 Speaker 1: or some sort of visible hole in the tooth. And 585 00:32:15,840 --> 00:32:18,560 Speaker 1: so while this paper criticized, of course a lack of 586 00:32:18,720 --> 00:32:23,719 Speaker 1: lack of standard infection control methods and proper dental anatomy 587 00:32:23,800 --> 00:32:27,880 Speaker 1: understanding among the traditional healers, the paper ultimately suggested, like 588 00:32:27,920 --> 00:32:30,400 Speaker 1: the answer here is not to just tell all the 589 00:32:30,440 --> 00:32:33,320 Speaker 1: traditional healers to go away, but try and bridge the 590 00:32:33,360 --> 00:32:37,760 Speaker 1: world between modern dental practices and traditional healers. Yeah, so 591 00:32:37,800 --> 00:32:40,200 Speaker 1: that they're communicating with one another and they've sort of 592 00:32:40,200 --> 00:32:42,160 Speaker 1: got a bit of understanding. I remember from that one 593 00:32:42,200 --> 00:32:44,800 Speaker 1: piece that some of the data was surprising, Like one 594 00:32:44,800 --> 00:32:46,680 Speaker 1: of the things they're looking at was like how often 595 00:32:46,680 --> 00:32:50,480 Speaker 1: they wore gloves when they moved between different patients and 596 00:32:50,480 --> 00:32:53,000 Speaker 1: we're like extracting teeth and then but then there was 597 00:32:53,040 --> 00:32:55,280 Speaker 1: other instances. I think they said something like three quarter 598 00:32:55,480 --> 00:32:58,360 Speaker 1: of the traditional healers if it was like a serious 599 00:32:58,440 --> 00:33:01,240 Speaker 1: dental problem, they would recommend you need to go see 600 00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:04,680 Speaker 1: an actual dentist. Like what I'm doing here isn't isn't 601 00:33:04,720 --> 00:33:08,360 Speaker 1: gonna cure your problem here. Yeah, And indeed, to come 602 00:33:08,360 --> 00:33:11,520 Speaker 1: back to the ugantin situation with the false tooth disease, 603 00:33:11,560 --> 00:33:14,280 Speaker 1: the Ian magazine article points out, there, you know a 604 00:33:14,360 --> 00:33:17,320 Speaker 1: number of contributing factors as to why the individual would 605 00:33:17,360 --> 00:33:22,000 Speaker 1: go to the traditional healer versus the modern hospital and 606 00:33:22,240 --> 00:33:24,720 Speaker 1: with their sick child. I would suspect that money is 607 00:33:24,760 --> 00:33:26,960 Speaker 1: one of them. Oh yeah, it's generally cheaper. We're talking 608 00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:31,240 Speaker 1: about an impoverished region where available Western medicine is still distrusted. 609 00:33:31,280 --> 00:33:35,760 Speaker 1: You have high mortality rates in the modern hospital's corruption, expense, 610 00:33:36,320 --> 00:33:39,520 Speaker 1: facility shortcomings. Uh, and it all results, you know, in 611 00:33:39,520 --> 00:33:42,520 Speaker 1: a modern health system that feels alien and maybe even 612 00:33:42,560 --> 00:33:46,440 Speaker 1: a bit dangerous to someone accustomed to that culturally ingrained 613 00:33:46,440 --> 00:33:49,520 Speaker 1: traditional healer system that is also just gonna it's just 614 00:33:49,520 --> 00:33:51,520 Speaker 1: gonna be so much more comfortable, and you're gonna end 615 00:33:51,600 --> 00:33:55,240 Speaker 1: up having more faith in its ability to cure what 616 00:33:55,320 --> 00:33:57,120 Speaker 1: ails you. And to give you an idea of the 617 00:33:57,240 --> 00:34:00,480 Speaker 1: numbers we're talking about here, So this is and day 618 00:34:00,560 --> 00:34:04,040 Speaker 1: in certain villages in Tanzania, sixty percent of people have 619 00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:09,480 Speaker 1: their teeth intentionally removed, sixteen percent in northern Uganda, in 620 00:34:09,480 --> 00:34:14,200 Speaker 1: the Sudan of Ethiopian Jews, and then seventy percent of 621 00:34:14,320 --> 00:34:17,959 Speaker 1: other Ethiopians do this, and then the real high point 622 00:34:18,040 --> 00:34:21,080 Speaker 1: was eight seven percent of the Messia and Kenya do this. 623 00:34:21,520 --> 00:34:24,279 Speaker 1: The Massai say that there there's a medical reason though 624 00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:28,040 Speaker 1: right there there's no longer this demonic toothworm thing um. 625 00:34:28,080 --> 00:34:34,360 Speaker 1: They're removing mandibular central incisors UH, specifically in some situations 626 00:34:34,360 --> 00:34:36,480 Speaker 1: so that they can help feed a person if they 627 00:34:36,560 --> 00:34:40,080 Speaker 1: end up with tetanus and subsequently get locked jaw from that. 628 00:34:40,440 --> 00:34:42,160 Speaker 1: So they want to make sure that there's a way, 629 00:34:42,200 --> 00:34:45,719 Speaker 1: you know, if their jaw is locked shut. In our societies, 630 00:34:45,719 --> 00:34:47,480 Speaker 1: we view the whole thing of the straws and everything, 631 00:34:47,560 --> 00:34:49,360 Speaker 1: or we have I V s or whatever, but you know, 632 00:34:49,400 --> 00:34:53,040 Speaker 1: in this situation they're thinking ahead. Yeah, and then there 633 00:34:53,120 --> 00:34:55,040 Speaker 1: is another thing. I read This is very brief, so 634 00:34:55,080 --> 00:34:58,120 Speaker 1: I don't know how much, uh, there is to this, 635 00:34:58,160 --> 00:34:59,960 Speaker 1: and I'd love to hear if somebody in our audience 636 00:35:00,000 --> 00:35:02,600 Speaker 1: knows a little more about it. But apparently the Demera 637 00:35:02,760 --> 00:35:06,319 Speaker 1: people in South Africa, they say that the reason they 638 00:35:06,360 --> 00:35:10,120 Speaker 1: remove their maxillary anterior teeth is so that they can 639 00:35:10,200 --> 00:35:13,399 Speaker 1: properly speak their language, which has a lisp to it. 640 00:35:14,680 --> 00:35:18,560 Speaker 1: Huh though. That is interesting as well and certainly something 641 00:35:18,600 --> 00:35:20,759 Speaker 1: that stands out from our other examples the idea of 642 00:35:21,160 --> 00:35:25,200 Speaker 1: augmenting your teeth so as to augment speech, because that's 643 00:35:25,239 --> 00:35:28,319 Speaker 1: something we didn't mention earlier. But having a full set 644 00:35:28,320 --> 00:35:31,040 Speaker 1: of teeth also plays an end your ability to to 645 00:35:31,040 --> 00:35:36,160 Speaker 1: to speak. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Now another example of dental 646 00:35:36,719 --> 00:35:39,759 Speaker 1: augmentation comes to us. This was actually suggested to us 647 00:35:39,880 --> 00:35:43,759 Speaker 1: to us by one of our South African listeners, Sheldon. Uh. 648 00:35:44,120 --> 00:35:46,719 Speaker 1: Maybe Sheldon knows about the Demorrow thing. Yeah, yeah, maybe 649 00:35:46,760 --> 00:35:48,480 Speaker 1: she can throw in on that as well, But in 650 00:35:48,480 --> 00:35:51,319 Speaker 1: this case, she was saying she pointed out what's known 651 00:35:51,360 --> 00:35:54,920 Speaker 1: as the cape flat smile and sometimes kind of erroneously 652 00:35:55,880 --> 00:35:59,120 Speaker 1: referred to as a passion gap. So what we're talking 653 00:35:59,120 --> 00:36:02,640 Speaker 1: about here is the removal of the front teeth, the 654 00:36:02,719 --> 00:36:07,399 Speaker 1: front incisors amongst communities of the Western Cape in South 655 00:36:07,440 --> 00:36:10,799 Speaker 1: Africa specifically, it's something you see among poor male teenagers 656 00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:13,439 Speaker 1: that are wrapped up in gain culture. Uh. And it's 657 00:36:13,520 --> 00:36:15,840 Speaker 1: it's a modern practice. You still see it today, and 658 00:36:15,840 --> 00:36:19,200 Speaker 1: the practice seems to serve it's part of a write 659 00:36:19,200 --> 00:36:23,719 Speaker 1: a passage into adulthood. The passion gap thing. I'm not 660 00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:25,680 Speaker 1: gonna get into the details, but that seems to be 661 00:36:25,760 --> 00:36:30,560 Speaker 1: something where outsiders misconstrue or even decide to sort of 662 00:36:31,280 --> 00:36:33,080 Speaker 1: demonize it by saying that has some sort of a 663 00:36:33,120 --> 00:36:35,880 Speaker 1: sexual connotation. But there it doesn't seem to be anything 664 00:36:35,920 --> 00:36:38,600 Speaker 1: to back it up. Now, it's not the kind of 665 00:36:38,600 --> 00:36:40,800 Speaker 1: thing that you would go to the dentist for, or 666 00:36:40,840 --> 00:36:43,400 Speaker 1: apparently you could, but you might have to find a 667 00:36:43,480 --> 00:36:46,799 Speaker 1: dentist that would who would do this procedure. Imagine it's 668 00:36:46,840 --> 00:36:50,400 Speaker 1: like sort of the difference between getting like your friend 669 00:36:50,520 --> 00:36:52,759 Speaker 1: to give you a tattoo and then like going and 670 00:36:52,840 --> 00:36:55,320 Speaker 1: spending like a lot of money at a fancy tattoo parlor. 671 00:36:55,400 --> 00:36:58,120 Speaker 1: And in this case, you you spend all that money, 672 00:36:58,160 --> 00:36:59,880 Speaker 1: you take as much as you can you can actually 673 00:37:00,080 --> 00:37:03,880 Speaker 1: uh dish out, and you go get a partial dental 674 00:37:03,960 --> 00:37:07,080 Speaker 1: insert to fill that gap. And here you see just 675 00:37:07,360 --> 00:37:10,640 Speaker 1: you know, an explosion of gold and bling and whatever 676 00:37:11,040 --> 00:37:13,520 Speaker 1: whatever you can afford. Um, Like some of the accounts 677 00:37:13,560 --> 00:37:15,879 Speaker 1: say that, like basically, whenever you can upgrade to something 678 00:37:15,920 --> 00:37:19,480 Speaker 1: a little fancier, you do. So. So here we see 679 00:37:19,480 --> 00:37:21,680 Speaker 1: a little bit of the modern sort of bling culture. 680 00:37:21,800 --> 00:37:24,480 Speaker 1: We see some of these ancient practice we've already discussed, uh, 681 00:37:24,520 --> 00:37:26,600 Speaker 1: you know, where you're just taking gold or jewels to 682 00:37:26,960 --> 00:37:29,080 Speaker 1: brighten up the teeth, but in this case, it's about 683 00:37:29,400 --> 00:37:31,360 Speaker 1: let's just go ahead and remove those front four teeth 684 00:37:31,520 --> 00:37:34,600 Speaker 1: and just get something fancy and bright up in there. Yeah. 685 00:37:34,640 --> 00:37:38,480 Speaker 1: I can I mean I'm not familiar with this particular subculture, 686 00:37:38,520 --> 00:37:41,400 Speaker 1: but I can imagine like both how it would denote 687 00:37:41,560 --> 00:37:45,440 Speaker 1: status because you're showing off money in terms of like 688 00:37:45,480 --> 00:37:48,279 Speaker 1: the particular jewel or metal that you're having put in 689 00:37:48,320 --> 00:37:50,799 Speaker 1: your mouth. But then also just like hey, I'm tough 690 00:37:50,920 --> 00:37:54,120 Speaker 1: enough to have somebody just take these teeth out. I 691 00:37:54,120 --> 00:37:56,879 Speaker 1: don't need a gas mask, I don't need laughing gas. Yeah, 692 00:37:57,160 --> 00:37:59,600 Speaker 1: it seems it seems to be a convergence of those 693 00:37:59,640 --> 00:38:01,640 Speaker 1: two to rent forces. And you were just telling me 694 00:38:01,680 --> 00:38:03,680 Speaker 1: before the podcast episode, before we're gonna come in here 695 00:38:03,719 --> 00:38:05,640 Speaker 1: to record it, you've seen some of this in South 696 00:38:05,680 --> 00:38:08,399 Speaker 1: African hip hop, and I feel like, yeah, so, And 697 00:38:08,600 --> 00:38:11,160 Speaker 1: I might be wrong here again, like our listeners in 698 00:38:11,160 --> 00:38:15,200 Speaker 1: South Africa, please correct me. My only familiarity with South 699 00:38:15,239 --> 00:38:18,240 Speaker 1: African hip hop is through Diante Word, which is fairly 700 00:38:18,239 --> 00:38:21,239 Speaker 1: popular internationally. But I really enjoy them. I've seen them 701 00:38:21,239 --> 00:38:25,080 Speaker 1: tour in America and watched a bunch of their videos, 702 00:38:25,080 --> 00:38:28,440 Speaker 1: and I feel like I've seen some of this missing 703 00:38:28,719 --> 00:38:31,600 Speaker 1: front tooth action in those videos, but I don't know 704 00:38:31,640 --> 00:38:34,040 Speaker 1: if that's particular to this subculture. And like with people 705 00:38:34,080 --> 00:38:37,520 Speaker 1: in the background and performers and not the actual members 706 00:38:37,560 --> 00:38:39,360 Speaker 1: of the band, but people who are just performing and 707 00:38:39,440 --> 00:38:41,959 Speaker 1: dancing and stuff in the videos. All Right, we're gonna 708 00:38:41,960 --> 00:38:44,880 Speaker 1: take another quick break, and when we come back, I 709 00:38:44,920 --> 00:38:46,439 Speaker 1: know what a lot of you are thinking. You're thinking, Hey, 710 00:38:46,520 --> 00:38:49,000 Speaker 1: where we've talked about you know all these uh these 711 00:38:49,000 --> 00:38:52,120 Speaker 1: other cultures that have that have used you know, ritual 712 00:38:52,200 --> 00:38:55,720 Speaker 1: or unnecessary tooth extraction. Well hold on to your seats, 713 00:38:55,760 --> 00:38:57,839 Speaker 1: because when we come back from the break, we're gonna 714 00:38:57,840 --> 00:39:09,920 Speaker 1: look at examples from Canada in the good old United States. Alright, 715 00:39:09,920 --> 00:39:12,920 Speaker 1: we're back, so okay, Yeah, we had sort of set 716 00:39:12,920 --> 00:39:16,840 Speaker 1: this up as saying, like, well, there's a Western perception 717 00:39:17,200 --> 00:39:20,800 Speaker 1: of tooth modification that's very different from these other cultures 718 00:39:20,800 --> 00:39:23,800 Speaker 1: that we're talking about, whether it's meso American or African 719 00:39:23,960 --> 00:39:26,880 Speaker 1: or Asian. Right, and even in some cases they are 720 00:39:26,880 --> 00:39:32,600 Speaker 1: Australian tribes where they performed abbelation as well. But we've 721 00:39:32,640 --> 00:39:37,520 Speaker 1: got this going on right in Canada, right north of Maine. Yeah. 722 00:39:37,719 --> 00:39:41,360 Speaker 1: We we ran across this excellent paper, very intriguing paper 723 00:39:41,800 --> 00:39:47,360 Speaker 1: um titled French Canadian prenuptial dental extractions in Acadian women. 724 00:39:47,719 --> 00:39:53,359 Speaker 1: First report of a cultural tradition uh or Quebec practice. Uh. 725 00:39:53,400 --> 00:39:56,759 Speaker 1: This was yeah, this was really interesting. Uh and apparently 726 00:39:57,880 --> 00:40:02,000 Speaker 1: you know, it has has occurred in modern times among Acadians. 727 00:40:02,040 --> 00:40:04,840 Speaker 1: These are a descendants of seventeenth or eighteenth century French 728 00:40:04,920 --> 00:40:08,440 Speaker 1: colonists in regions of the Canadian provinces of New Brunswick, 729 00:40:08,600 --> 00:40:11,760 Speaker 1: Prince Edward Island, and Nova Scotia. And what was interesting 730 00:40:11,800 --> 00:40:15,239 Speaker 1: about this paper was the author's goal was essentially to 731 00:40:15,360 --> 00:40:18,560 Speaker 1: interview dentists in the region to find out if simply 732 00:40:18,560 --> 00:40:21,879 Speaker 1: if they had ever been asked to perform this procedure. Yeah, 733 00:40:21,880 --> 00:40:24,200 Speaker 1: as well as some interviews with with people who knew 734 00:40:24,400 --> 00:40:27,080 Speaker 1: or or have this procedure, just to see, like to 735 00:40:27,120 --> 00:40:29,319 Speaker 1: what extent is this a thing and not just a 736 00:40:29,320 --> 00:40:33,200 Speaker 1: matter of like anan case, there's an urban myth um 737 00:40:33,400 --> 00:40:35,399 Speaker 1: and it's and it's it's not it. It turns out 738 00:40:35,440 --> 00:40:37,440 Speaker 1: like her results were pretty positive. It turns out that 739 00:40:37,480 --> 00:40:39,920 Speaker 1: this is a thing. Yeah. In these cases, the women 740 00:40:40,000 --> 00:40:42,960 Speaker 1: undergo or in some cases they seek to undergo because 741 00:40:42,960 --> 00:40:47,200 Speaker 1: they talked to Dennis too said turned down right, turned down, um, 742 00:40:47,280 --> 00:40:51,520 Speaker 1: But they're seeking the extraction of all upper and or 743 00:40:51,640 --> 00:40:56,160 Speaker 1: lower uh teeth to in order to obtain dentures prior 744 00:40:56,239 --> 00:40:59,799 Speaker 1: to marry. Right. So the dentures are a dowry right 745 00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:02,440 Speaker 1: from one family to another, and so they have to 746 00:41:02,480 --> 00:41:05,839 Speaker 1: have their teeth removed to receive the dowry. Yeah, it's 747 00:41:06,040 --> 00:41:08,040 Speaker 1: uh you know. And again we kind of get back 748 00:41:08,080 --> 00:41:09,880 Speaker 1: to some of these cases we talked about earlier, like 749 00:41:09,960 --> 00:41:12,440 Speaker 1: at what at what point is there like a medical 750 00:41:12,560 --> 00:41:14,680 Speaker 1: concern here, and then at what point does it become 751 00:41:15,160 --> 00:41:19,000 Speaker 1: uh more complicated in terms of cultural uh you know 752 00:41:19,040 --> 00:41:23,120 Speaker 1: aesthetic values and made selection. Uh. There's at least one 753 00:41:23,120 --> 00:41:25,600 Speaker 1: account in the paper, and it's you know, it's a 754 00:41:25,600 --> 00:41:27,920 Speaker 1: little dubious, but I still want to mention it that 755 00:41:28,040 --> 00:41:31,640 Speaker 1: alleges that this was a British practice by which a 756 00:41:31,719 --> 00:41:34,879 Speaker 1: colonists prepared for the wilds of the New World and 757 00:41:35,320 --> 00:41:38,560 Speaker 1: its lack of dental care by simply removing one's teeth 758 00:41:38,560 --> 00:41:41,560 Speaker 1: and replacing them with dentures. That's ironic given how many 759 00:41:41,760 --> 00:41:45,120 Speaker 1: jokes are made about British dental practice and in present 760 00:41:45,200 --> 00:41:48,800 Speaker 1: day society. Although yeah, I don't know how much stock 761 00:41:48,880 --> 00:41:53,400 Speaker 1: I put into that. Yeah, I mean to a certain extent, 762 00:41:53,520 --> 00:41:56,960 Speaker 1: based on what we've been reading about about the the 763 00:41:57,000 --> 00:42:01,399 Speaker 1: acknowledged link between uh any of dental infection and how 764 00:42:01,400 --> 00:42:04,160 Speaker 1: that could know and and and other health problems. I 765 00:42:04,200 --> 00:42:08,000 Speaker 1: could imagine a scenario in which someone might think, or 766 00:42:08,080 --> 00:42:11,160 Speaker 1: might be convinced, Hey, you've got some some tooth teeth 767 00:42:11,160 --> 00:42:13,640 Speaker 1: issues going on already, you don't have the best dental health. 768 00:42:14,080 --> 00:42:17,959 Speaker 1: You're about to go to the wilds of Canada, whether 769 00:42:18,239 --> 00:42:19,880 Speaker 1: you're not gonna have a dentist. Why don't you go 770 00:42:19,880 --> 00:42:21,399 Speaker 1: ahead and get this out of the way. Why don't 771 00:42:21,400 --> 00:42:23,560 Speaker 1: we go ahead and remove the problem teeth. Maybe just 772 00:42:23,600 --> 00:42:26,799 Speaker 1: remove all those teeth, get some sort of dental um, 773 00:42:27,160 --> 00:42:29,160 Speaker 1: you know, insert and they get some get some some 774 00:42:29,160 --> 00:42:32,200 Speaker 1: some dentures in place, and then the only thing you 775 00:42:32,200 --> 00:42:34,080 Speaker 1: have to worry about is cleaning those things in a 776 00:42:34,160 --> 00:42:37,680 Speaker 1: stream somewhere. Yeah. Yeah, that's that's fair. Well. One of 777 00:42:37,760 --> 00:42:39,640 Speaker 1: the things that I thought was really fascinating about this 778 00:42:39,640 --> 00:42:43,000 Speaker 1: particular article was some of the dentists are at least 779 00:42:43,040 --> 00:42:46,600 Speaker 1: one of the dentist she interviewed was a Kadian was 780 00:42:46,800 --> 00:42:50,120 Speaker 1: from this culture and was like, I've never heard of 781 00:42:50,160 --> 00:42:54,080 Speaker 1: this before, and thought that they were joking, and then realized, oh, no, 782 00:42:54,200 --> 00:42:56,839 Speaker 1: this is an actual practice. It's just I'm removed from 783 00:42:56,840 --> 00:43:01,640 Speaker 1: this particular it's like a niche subculture within the Akadian people. Yeah, 784 00:43:01,719 --> 00:43:05,560 Speaker 1: it's a small, rare thing. But but when they poked around, 785 00:43:05,600 --> 00:43:08,279 Speaker 1: they found that, yes, it did occur with enough frequency 786 00:43:08,560 --> 00:43:11,520 Speaker 1: to suggest that it that it was an actual thing. 787 00:43:11,560 --> 00:43:14,279 Speaker 1: It wasn't just you know, a few individuals here and there. 788 00:43:14,760 --> 00:43:17,399 Speaker 1: So the author's core argument here is that this all 789 00:43:17,480 --> 00:43:20,239 Speaker 1: may come down to just an uncertain grasp of those 790 00:43:20,520 --> 00:43:24,759 Speaker 1: connections between oral health problems, pregnancy, and just overall health 791 00:43:24,760 --> 00:43:28,480 Speaker 1: in general. Because certainly before the advent of antibiotics, various 792 00:43:28,520 --> 00:43:32,440 Speaker 1: medical medical conditions were blamed on chronic tooth infections. So 793 00:43:32,560 --> 00:43:34,240 Speaker 1: if you can't figure out the source of en ailment 794 00:43:34,360 --> 00:43:36,839 Speaker 1: and you know that there's a troublesome tooth, well then 795 00:43:36,880 --> 00:43:39,040 Speaker 1: you just go ahead and yank it to be sure. Right, 796 00:43:39,719 --> 00:43:42,920 Speaker 1: So what might have begun is a half blind attempt 797 00:43:42,960 --> 00:43:46,239 Speaker 1: to ensure mother and child's survival in a harsh environment 798 00:43:46,680 --> 00:43:51,799 Speaker 1: may have become a brutal social norm. Okay. So the 799 00:43:51,840 --> 00:43:54,440 Speaker 1: next example that you have here is actually another thing 800 00:43:54,440 --> 00:43:56,720 Speaker 1: that we ended up talking about during that Christmas Listener 801 00:43:56,760 --> 00:44:01,720 Speaker 1: mail episode, uh, in relation to the the Abominable Snowman 802 00:44:01,800 --> 00:44:03,759 Speaker 1: having his teeth ripped out. Right, Because you're a big 803 00:44:03,760 --> 00:44:06,399 Speaker 1: fan of the TV show The Nick, Yeah, I really 804 00:44:06,440 --> 00:44:10,719 Speaker 1: love The Nick directed by Steven Soderberg. Clive Owens is 805 00:44:10,719 --> 00:44:14,560 Speaker 1: in it. Uh just a great look, fictionalized look at 806 00:44:14,840 --> 00:44:17,799 Speaker 1: cutting edge medicine, like the frontier of medicine and just 807 00:44:17,880 --> 00:44:20,400 Speaker 1: the ins and outs of running a hospital um in 808 00:44:20,600 --> 00:44:23,520 Speaker 1: turn of the century in New York City. And if 809 00:44:23,520 --> 00:44:25,880 Speaker 1: you're a viewer of the show, you might remember that 810 00:44:25,920 --> 00:44:27,719 Speaker 1: there's a character that pops up by the name of 811 00:44:27,800 --> 00:44:32,279 Speaker 1: Dr Henry Cotton, and he's played fabulously by John Hodgman, Like, 812 00:44:33,160 --> 00:44:35,839 Speaker 1: once you see this, you may find John Hodgmen less 813 00:44:35,880 --> 00:44:38,040 Speaker 1: funny in real life like that, And I mean that 814 00:44:38,120 --> 00:44:40,279 Speaker 1: is a compliment that's he does such a fine could 815 00:44:40,280 --> 00:44:42,760 Speaker 1: see Yeah, I could see Hodgemen performing like a particularly 816 00:44:42,840 --> 00:44:47,200 Speaker 1: kind of creepy uh doctor type. Yeah, and he he 817 00:44:47,400 --> 00:44:50,239 Speaker 1: but he manages the creepy in a way where it 818 00:44:50,239 --> 00:44:52,600 Speaker 1: it's the most natural Hodgman performance I've ever seen. Like, 819 00:44:52,680 --> 00:44:54,880 Speaker 1: he just does a great jobs. What's notable in the 820 00:44:54,920 --> 00:44:59,320 Speaker 1: show is that he goes around basically prescribing full dental 821 00:44:59,360 --> 00:45:02,799 Speaker 1: extraction for not only his mental patients, but also for 822 00:45:02,880 --> 00:45:06,520 Speaker 1: his own children. Wow, okay, okay. And this isn't because 823 00:45:06,600 --> 00:45:09,839 Speaker 1: like he's marrying them off and they need dowry dentures 824 00:45:09,960 --> 00:45:13,960 Speaker 1: or because of any particular cultural reason. Now, it seems 825 00:45:14,000 --> 00:45:15,719 Speaker 1: to be a situation where it's like those teeth are 826 00:45:15,719 --> 00:45:18,160 Speaker 1: gonna cause all sorts of horrible infections. They're just gonna 827 00:45:18,200 --> 00:45:20,560 Speaker 1: it's gonna lead to madness. Better to just pull them 828 00:45:20,600 --> 00:45:25,239 Speaker 1: all out now. And while fictionalized this, the writers of 829 00:45:25,239 --> 00:45:28,440 Speaker 1: the nick actually basis character on a real guy, the 830 00:45:28,560 --> 00:45:31,759 Speaker 1: real Dr Henry Cotton, who lived eighteen seventy six through 831 00:45:31,840 --> 00:45:36,000 Speaker 1: nineteen thirty three, was a respected academic psychiatrist, and he 832 00:45:36,080 --> 00:45:40,600 Speaker 1: served as superintendent of New Jersey's Trenton State Hospital. And 833 00:45:40,680 --> 00:45:44,040 Speaker 1: he was a huge proponent of modern medical practices. But 834 00:45:44,080 --> 00:45:48,040 Speaker 1: when he when established methods proved ineffective in the physical 835 00:45:48,080 --> 00:45:53,120 Speaker 1: treatment of mental illness, he turned to the bacteriological theory 836 00:45:53,160 --> 00:45:55,760 Speaker 1: of disease. Okay. And so this was like a general 837 00:45:55,800 --> 00:45:59,840 Speaker 1: idea at the time that was, you know, depression or 838 00:46:00,000 --> 00:46:04,600 Speaker 1: other mental illness stemmed from something going in the on 839 00:46:04,800 --> 00:46:07,680 Speaker 1: in the body, some Oregon problem, right in a lot 840 00:46:07,680 --> 00:46:09,960 Speaker 1: of cases like that I I had read about in 841 00:46:10,000 --> 00:46:13,879 Speaker 1: relation to this, it was the colon was being removed. Yeah, yeah, 842 00:46:13,920 --> 00:46:15,960 Speaker 1: and we'll we'll get to that, but it's yeah, but 843 00:46:16,000 --> 00:46:18,040 Speaker 1: I mean basically, this was a there was a lot 844 00:46:18,040 --> 00:46:20,759 Speaker 1: of big games going on in medicine, and we were 845 00:46:20,960 --> 00:46:23,600 Speaker 1: figuring out what the biological roots of things like cholera 846 00:46:23,840 --> 00:46:26,759 Speaker 1: and malaria were. So it seeing that the sky was 847 00:46:26,800 --> 00:46:29,080 Speaker 1: the limit and that we could just we we barreled down, 848 00:46:29,440 --> 00:46:32,480 Speaker 1: we could find these problems and we could just completely 849 00:46:32,600 --> 00:46:35,239 Speaker 1: take care of it. So yeah, Cotton decides to give 850 00:46:35,239 --> 00:46:37,680 Speaker 1: it a go. Uh, and in his day, there was 851 00:46:37,800 --> 00:46:40,680 Speaker 1: a prominent theory from a fair of British surgeons that 852 00:46:40,800 --> 00:46:44,320 Speaker 1: linked untreated infections in the gums and in the intestines 853 00:46:44,800 --> 00:46:47,120 Speaker 1: to your point, uh and that, and the idea was 854 00:46:47,160 --> 00:46:51,000 Speaker 1: that these untreated infections were toxifying the blood and this 855 00:46:51,040 --> 00:46:55,719 Speaker 1: could result in pathological brain alterations. So Cotton took this 856 00:46:55,760 --> 00:46:58,880 Speaker 1: theory ran with It's in nineteen he extracted the infected 857 00:46:58,960 --> 00:47:01,920 Speaker 1: teeth from fifty mental patients. So these are just the 858 00:47:01,920 --> 00:47:05,040 Speaker 1: infected teeth. Uh. And then he takes a step back, 859 00:47:05,600 --> 00:47:07,279 Speaker 1: but this doesn't seem to be doing any good, so 860 00:47:07,320 --> 00:47:08,879 Speaker 1: then he goes back in and has to just all 861 00:47:08,880 --> 00:47:12,640 Speaker 1: their teeth removed and uh. Then this doesn't work, so 862 00:47:12,680 --> 00:47:16,960 Speaker 1: he continues to chase the decay as I've heard, I've 863 00:47:16,960 --> 00:47:20,719 Speaker 1: heard the term thrown around and among dentists. Um. So 864 00:47:20,760 --> 00:47:24,759 Speaker 1: the patients have clearly swallowed painted saliva stemming from their 865 00:47:24,920 --> 00:47:30,759 Speaker 1: oral infections. So he systematically removes tonsils, spleens, stomachs, colon's, 866 00:47:30,760 --> 00:47:35,400 Speaker 1: the cervix, and amid all this butchery, he's reporting reporting 867 00:47:37,360 --> 00:47:41,280 Speaker 1: curate from mental illness. But have any of his patients 868 00:47:41,400 --> 00:47:45,879 Speaker 1: lived seizures? Jesus, that's the thing. Because at first everybody's like, oh, 869 00:47:46,440 --> 00:47:48,360 Speaker 1: this huge access rate, this guy's doing good work, and 870 00:47:48,440 --> 00:47:52,640 Speaker 1: he's smell pressed. Can you remove my stomach please? Yeah, 871 00:47:52,680 --> 00:47:56,040 Speaker 1: I mean there's obviously I can see the sort of 872 00:47:56,080 --> 00:47:59,239 Speaker 1: correlation there. There's obviously a long history of and we 873 00:47:59,239 --> 00:48:01,319 Speaker 1: talk we think about today with people who talk about 874 00:48:01,320 --> 00:48:03,759 Speaker 1: ib s between you know, the mental connection to the 875 00:48:03,800 --> 00:48:07,319 Speaker 1: digestive system. But I don't know that one necessitates the 876 00:48:07,320 --> 00:48:09,799 Speaker 1: removal of the ride. I mean, the connections are there, 877 00:48:09,880 --> 00:48:12,200 Speaker 1: it's yeah, it's just what do you do about those 878 00:48:12,200 --> 00:48:14,160 Speaker 1: connections and what kind of assumptions do you jump to? 879 00:48:14,680 --> 00:48:17,719 Speaker 1: Because to your point about about you know, how many 880 00:48:17,760 --> 00:48:21,239 Speaker 1: of these individuals are surviving, Uh, the mortality rate was 881 00:48:21,320 --> 00:48:25,560 Speaker 1: thirty and so when that starts to get out, the 882 00:48:25,719 --> 00:48:29,600 Speaker 1: enthusiasm for Cotton's cure here kind of you know, Peter's 883 00:48:29,600 --> 00:48:33,280 Speaker 1: out a little bit and eventually psycho now psychoanalysis gained steam. 884 00:48:34,200 --> 00:48:37,560 Speaker 1: But these procedures, particularly the surgeries and the removal of 885 00:48:37,719 --> 00:48:41,680 Speaker 1: you know, intestinal material. This continues at Trenton Asylum until Cotton. 886 00:48:41,800 --> 00:48:44,600 Speaker 1: Cotton dies of a heart attack in nineteen thirty three. 887 00:48:44,719 --> 00:48:47,040 Speaker 1: This actually reminds me of something that I'd like us 888 00:48:47,080 --> 00:48:50,640 Speaker 1: to do an episode about is coffee animals, because I 889 00:48:50,640 --> 00:48:53,080 Speaker 1: think that there's there's somewhat of a connection there, right that, 890 00:48:53,160 --> 00:48:56,479 Speaker 1: like the fat of coffee animals that you feel better, 891 00:48:56,600 --> 00:48:59,759 Speaker 1: you feel mentally better after you've kind of flushed your 892 00:49:00,040 --> 00:49:04,080 Speaker 1: stem out this way again, the connection between the digestive 893 00:49:04,120 --> 00:49:05,880 Speaker 1: system and the mental process. Oh yeah, I mean you 894 00:49:05,920 --> 00:49:09,320 Speaker 1: can get into the topic of rectal feeding, which Mary 895 00:49:09,440 --> 00:49:13,920 Speaker 1: Roach explores in her book Gulp, which I highly recommend 896 00:49:13,960 --> 00:49:16,000 Speaker 1: if you have your at all, into a bunch of 897 00:49:16,000 --> 00:49:19,560 Speaker 1: weird digestive data about how the body actually works and 898 00:49:19,600 --> 00:49:21,640 Speaker 1: some of the stuff we've done and exploring it. That's 899 00:49:21,640 --> 00:49:23,560 Speaker 1: a great book to Jack and my wife's read it, 900 00:49:23,600 --> 00:49:24,879 Speaker 1: and I know that it's come up on the show 901 00:49:24,920 --> 00:49:26,600 Speaker 1: frequently in the past. I need to get on that. 902 00:49:27,200 --> 00:49:31,480 Speaker 1: So we're winding down here, but it is important to 903 00:49:31,480 --> 00:49:33,839 Speaker 1: to bring things back around and touch on some of 904 00:49:33,840 --> 00:49:36,720 Speaker 1: the the the the actual science, some of what current 905 00:49:36,760 --> 00:49:40,239 Speaker 1: science is saying about the effects of tooth extraction on 906 00:49:40,400 --> 00:49:44,240 Speaker 1: brain functionality. So, according to a two thousand fourteen paper 907 00:49:44,280 --> 00:49:48,320 Speaker 1: from University College London published in Journal of the American 908 00:49:48,360 --> 00:49:52,480 Speaker 1: Geriatric Society, memory and walking speeds of adults who have 909 00:49:52,640 --> 00:49:56,080 Speaker 1: lost all of their teeth decline more rapidly than those 910 00:49:56,120 --> 00:50:00,640 Speaker 1: who still have some of their own teeth. Huh, that's interesting, Yeah, 911 00:50:00,680 --> 00:50:03,200 Speaker 1: it's I mean, if we'll break down here, it's a 912 00:50:03,239 --> 00:50:06,120 Speaker 1: little more problematically. I would imagine that. Yeah, I imagine 913 00:50:06,160 --> 00:50:09,040 Speaker 1: that there's not a direct connection between those things, but 914 00:50:09,160 --> 00:50:13,719 Speaker 1: that there's the aging process in itself is related to 915 00:50:13,800 --> 00:50:16,560 Speaker 1: those Yeah, because you have to ask questions, why why 916 00:50:16,640 --> 00:50:20,080 Speaker 1: did this individual loser teeth? You know, what the socioeconomic 917 00:50:20,360 --> 00:50:22,919 Speaker 1: situations are going on here? What, how's that factoring in? 918 00:50:23,200 --> 00:50:26,920 Speaker 1: How is pre existing mental illness factoring into lack of hygiene? 919 00:50:27,360 --> 00:50:30,040 Speaker 1: That sort of thing. But the study looked at over 920 00:50:30,120 --> 00:50:34,040 Speaker 1: three thousand adults age sixty or over. Uh, And then 921 00:50:34,040 --> 00:50:38,480 Speaker 1: they compared their performance in tests of memory and walking speed, 922 00:50:39,320 --> 00:50:42,200 Speaker 1: and people with none of their own teeth performed approximately 923 00:50:42,200 --> 00:50:45,120 Speaker 1: temperacent worth in both memory and walking speed tests than 924 00:50:45,120 --> 00:50:48,239 Speaker 1: people with their teeth. And they adjusted this for a 925 00:50:48,280 --> 00:50:52,759 Speaker 1: wide variety of factors, you know, socio demographic characteristics, existing 926 00:50:52,800 --> 00:50:56,520 Speaker 1: health problems, physical health health behaviors, did they smoke, did 927 00:50:56,560 --> 00:50:59,320 Speaker 1: they drink, do they have you know, episodes of depression 928 00:50:59,320 --> 00:51:01,760 Speaker 1: in their life? Applied all of this and they still 929 00:51:01,880 --> 00:51:05,680 Speaker 1: found a definite gap. So the theory here is that 930 00:51:05,760 --> 00:51:08,560 Speaker 1: tooth loss could be used as an early marker of 931 00:51:08,640 --> 00:51:12,480 Speaker 1: mental and physical decline in older age. Now, a two 932 00:51:12,480 --> 00:51:16,279 Speaker 1: thousand thirteen study, uh takes things a little, a little further. Uh. 933 00:51:16,360 --> 00:51:19,239 Speaker 1: This was published in the European Journal of Oral Sciences 934 00:51:19,880 --> 00:51:24,720 Speaker 1: and it explores sort of the hypothetical effects of tooth 935 00:51:24,760 --> 00:51:27,200 Speaker 1: loss here. The research was carried out by the by 936 00:51:27,280 --> 00:51:29,799 Speaker 1: universities in Norway and Sweden, and they looked at two 937 00:51:29,840 --> 00:51:33,400 Speaker 1: hundred and seventy three participants with missing teeth aged fifty 938 00:51:33,680 --> 00:51:37,120 Speaker 1: to eighty, and then they gave them memory tests and 939 00:51:37,120 --> 00:51:39,879 Speaker 1: they found that the number of teeth in an individual's 940 00:51:39,920 --> 00:51:45,280 Speaker 1: head quote positively associated with performance on episodic memory recall 941 00:51:45,400 --> 00:51:50,160 Speaker 1: as well as recognition. Okay, okay, well, I'm trying to 942 00:51:51,120 --> 00:51:54,799 Speaker 1: visualize maybe our listeners are doing this too. I'm trying 943 00:51:54,800 --> 00:51:59,000 Speaker 1: to visualize a biological connection between your teeth in the 944 00:51:59,040 --> 00:52:02,200 Speaker 1: memory centers and your brain. And I suppose that's part 945 00:52:02,200 --> 00:52:03,960 Speaker 1: of it. But there's also, you know, sort of the 946 00:52:04,000 --> 00:52:07,560 Speaker 1: external factors of not having your teeth and the acceleration 947 00:52:07,560 --> 00:52:10,640 Speaker 1: of memory loss. Yeah, so a lot of this seems 948 00:52:10,680 --> 00:52:12,760 Speaker 1: to come down a lot of the theory here seems 949 00:52:12,800 --> 00:52:14,480 Speaker 1: to come down to the fact that the movement of 950 00:52:14,480 --> 00:52:18,600 Speaker 1: our jaw and and teeth send sensory input data to 951 00:52:18,640 --> 00:52:20,840 Speaker 1: the hippocampus, the area of the brain that forms and 952 00:52:20,880 --> 00:52:25,319 Speaker 1: retrieves memories. So one hypothesis is that, so we have 953 00:52:25,400 --> 00:52:28,719 Speaker 1: reduced sensory input from those missing teeth that could be 954 00:52:28,800 --> 00:52:32,040 Speaker 1: damaging our memory. Implants could help, but they're never going 955 00:52:32,080 --> 00:52:35,680 Speaker 1: to replace all of those loss sensations. Okay, so this 956 00:52:35,760 --> 00:52:38,040 Speaker 1: is like a mastication type of thing that like as 957 00:52:38,080 --> 00:52:42,319 Speaker 1: you chew, your receivering sensory input. Uh okay, it's kind 958 00:52:42,320 --> 00:52:44,120 Speaker 1: of like you have all these dead phone lines and 959 00:52:44,160 --> 00:52:48,000 Speaker 1: that could be affecting the phone bank in your in 960 00:52:48,040 --> 00:52:51,240 Speaker 1: your head. To put it very simply, Yeah, I wonder well, 961 00:52:51,360 --> 00:52:53,799 Speaker 1: this is maybe unrelated, but I wonder if there's a 962 00:52:53,840 --> 00:52:58,520 Speaker 1: connection between ringing ear and and and memory loss as well, 963 00:52:58,560 --> 00:53:00,879 Speaker 1: because that's sort of a similar fun amenon in which, 964 00:53:00,960 --> 00:53:03,680 Speaker 1: like the dead phone line analogy is a good one 965 00:53:03,719 --> 00:53:06,560 Speaker 1: that your brains not receiving the right signals anyway, what's 966 00:53:06,680 --> 00:53:09,279 Speaker 1: what's the other high second hypothesis is that it could 967 00:53:09,320 --> 00:53:12,320 Speaker 1: come down more to chewing, so it chewing increases blood 968 00:53:12,320 --> 00:53:14,760 Speaker 1: flow flow in the brain, and it has been shown 969 00:53:14,800 --> 00:53:19,120 Speaker 1: to increase activity in numerous brain areas. Even with dentures. 970 00:53:19,880 --> 00:53:22,960 Speaker 1: An individual with lost teeth is going to maybe avoid 971 00:53:23,000 --> 00:53:25,440 Speaker 1: certain foods. They're gonna chew less, so there's gonna be 972 00:53:25,560 --> 00:53:29,239 Speaker 1: less chewing action and uh, and then that's gonna mean 973 00:53:29,520 --> 00:53:32,359 Speaker 1: less blood flow in portions of the brain. Possible. Yeah, 974 00:53:32,400 --> 00:53:35,120 Speaker 1: my grandmother was recently sick in the hospital and they, 975 00:53:35,719 --> 00:53:37,680 Speaker 1: I am assuming this must be like a fairly standard 976 00:53:37,719 --> 00:53:40,520 Speaker 1: practice for hospitals, but they purde everything that she ate, 977 00:53:40,600 --> 00:53:43,120 Speaker 1: so everything that she received was purade so that she 978 00:53:43,160 --> 00:53:45,360 Speaker 1: didn't have to chew as much because she was so 979 00:53:45,440 --> 00:53:48,920 Speaker 1: weak from the illness that she had had, which was pneumonia. Now, finally, 980 00:53:49,000 --> 00:53:52,240 Speaker 1: it's also possible that people lacking teeth uh and denture 981 00:53:52,280 --> 00:53:55,480 Speaker 1: wears that they end up avoiding certain foods, leading to 982 00:53:55,600 --> 00:53:59,400 Speaker 1: lower intakes of key vitamins, proteins, and just calories in general, 983 00:53:59,640 --> 00:54:04,359 Speaker 1: which in turn impacts brain performance. Huh. Well, I'm most 984 00:54:04,440 --> 00:54:07,920 Speaker 1: curious about hypothesis one, and I wonder if there's any connection. 985 00:54:08,440 --> 00:54:10,200 Speaker 1: Maybe this is just like where I'm going. But I 986 00:54:10,200 --> 00:54:14,960 Speaker 1: wrote an episode about ringing your uh for our video 987 00:54:15,040 --> 00:54:17,759 Speaker 1: series brain Stuff one time, and it's very similar kind 988 00:54:17,760 --> 00:54:21,560 Speaker 1: of kind of missing sensory signals there. So yeah, I'm 989 00:54:21,560 --> 00:54:24,279 Speaker 1: curious about that. Now. There have been other studies that 990 00:54:24,280 --> 00:54:27,520 Speaker 1: have explored correlation between dimple hygiene and various health conditions. 991 00:54:27,520 --> 00:54:29,480 Speaker 1: There seems to be a connection between gum health and 992 00:54:29,520 --> 00:54:33,640 Speaker 1: heart health, between gum disease and dementia. Uh, some even 993 00:54:33,680 --> 00:54:37,360 Speaker 1: suggesting that gum disease bacteria might get into the brain, 994 00:54:37,440 --> 00:54:40,440 Speaker 1: causing inflammation and brain damage. Well, that sounds very similar 995 00:54:40,440 --> 00:54:42,160 Speaker 1: to the heart thing I was talking about, earl. Yeah, 996 00:54:42,280 --> 00:54:44,600 Speaker 1: and it all comes back to, uh, you know Brendan 997 00:54:44,640 --> 00:54:47,640 Speaker 1: Burrel's quote about that that sense of impotence in the 998 00:54:47,640 --> 00:54:49,920 Speaker 1: face of bodily mysteries. Like, I feel like we we 999 00:54:50,080 --> 00:54:52,440 Speaker 1: end up coming back in that same place of just 1000 00:54:52,719 --> 00:54:59,319 Speaker 1: being not completely sure how biological factor A influences biological 1001 00:54:59,320 --> 00:55:01,880 Speaker 1: factor B. We're not as far ahead of the curve 1002 00:55:02,239 --> 00:55:04,200 Speaker 1: with our own biology as we like to think that 1003 00:55:04,239 --> 00:55:07,400 Speaker 1: we are. Yeah, yeah, I think that's that's fair to say. 1004 00:55:07,560 --> 00:55:10,200 Speaker 1: But so I guess I guess the question is, like, uh, 1005 00:55:10,800 --> 00:55:13,520 Speaker 1: let's say, like we're in a situation where, you know, 1006 00:55:13,680 --> 00:55:16,560 Speaker 1: civilized society has fallen apart and you've got a toothache. 1007 00:55:16,760 --> 00:55:19,440 Speaker 1: Would you go ahead and just have somebody yank your 1008 00:55:19,440 --> 00:55:21,520 Speaker 1: tooth out and then like use like a hot knife 1009 00:55:21,560 --> 00:55:25,360 Speaker 1: to burn out the any tooth germ that was remaining behind. 1010 00:55:25,560 --> 00:55:28,120 Speaker 1: I mean, the thing about any kind of dental pain 1011 00:55:28,520 --> 00:55:30,840 Speaker 1: is you can you can imagine yourself getting to that 1012 00:55:30,880 --> 00:55:33,200 Speaker 1: point where you say, all right, I'm gonna I'm gonna 1013 00:55:33,239 --> 00:55:34,960 Speaker 1: go to this traditional healer, I'm gonna go to this 1014 00:55:34,960 --> 00:55:37,320 Speaker 1: guy down the street. I'm going to try something myself, 1015 00:55:37,920 --> 00:55:41,960 Speaker 1: because when when stuff starts going awry in there, you're 1016 00:55:42,000 --> 00:55:44,640 Speaker 1: gonna do whatever it takes. You're gonna even further connection 1017 00:55:44,719 --> 00:55:47,200 Speaker 1: between you know, the mouth and the in the brain 1018 00:55:47,280 --> 00:55:49,680 Speaker 1: and the mind and the I I think that there's 1019 00:55:49,719 --> 00:55:52,440 Speaker 1: like a large connection there, because yeah, any kind of 1020 00:55:52,440 --> 00:55:55,120 Speaker 1: tooth pain that I've ever had before, it's just utterly 1021 00:55:55,200 --> 00:55:58,320 Speaker 1: distracting for anything else that's going on. Yeah, and certainly, 1022 00:55:58,640 --> 00:56:00,440 Speaker 1: you know, any kind of dental infect and if it's 1023 00:56:00,480 --> 00:56:02,640 Speaker 1: not treated, if it gets out of control, that can 1024 00:56:02,680 --> 00:56:05,239 Speaker 1: have dire consequences on your overall health. So it's not 1025 00:56:05,320 --> 00:56:08,640 Speaker 1: just as there's not necessarily a layer of mystery between 1026 00:56:08,920 --> 00:56:11,600 Speaker 1: dental health and overall health. Yeah, So there you have it. 1027 00:56:11,800 --> 00:56:16,080 Speaker 1: Dental extraction, dental modification. We've taken you through a number 1028 00:56:16,120 --> 00:56:18,839 Speaker 1: of different cultures. We've taken you across time here and 1029 00:56:19,160 --> 00:56:23,600 Speaker 1: hopefully landed in a place of curiosity, wonder, and maybe 1030 00:56:23,640 --> 00:56:26,880 Speaker 1: a little horror. Yeah, so I'm curious out there. You know, 1031 00:56:27,000 --> 00:56:29,760 Speaker 1: maybe you have spent time amongst some of the cultures 1032 00:56:29,800 --> 00:56:33,279 Speaker 1: we're talking about, whether it's the Acadians in Canada, or 1033 00:56:33,320 --> 00:56:37,440 Speaker 1: you're in Uganda or maybe meso America. You've done some 1034 00:56:37,560 --> 00:56:41,600 Speaker 1: archaeological digs in in Mayan cultures before. What experience do 1035 00:56:41,640 --> 00:56:44,920 Speaker 1: you have with this teeth modification that goes on in 1036 00:56:44,960 --> 00:56:47,440 Speaker 1: other societies, or you know, what kind of experience have 1037 00:56:47,520 --> 00:56:51,040 Speaker 1: you had in our own sort of Western you know, 1038 00:56:51,600 --> 00:56:55,319 Speaker 1: general dentistry. Yeah, and hey, in the meantime, checks out 1039 00:56:55,320 --> 00:56:57,200 Speaker 1: of stuff to blow your mind dot com that's the mothership. 1040 00:56:57,239 --> 00:56:59,760 Speaker 1: That's we'll find all the blog posts, the podcast episodes 1041 00:56:59,760 --> 00:57:02,160 Speaker 1: of the deals links out of those social media accounts 1042 00:57:02,280 --> 00:57:06,000 Speaker 1: we mentioned earlier on Facebook, Twitter, Tumbler, and Hey, if 1043 00:57:06,000 --> 00:57:07,560 Speaker 1: people want to get in touch with us the old 1044 00:57:07,600 --> 00:57:09,520 Speaker 1: fashioned way, how can they do that? Well, they can 1045 00:57:09,560 --> 00:57:12,120 Speaker 1: write us on the email and that is blow the 1046 00:57:12,200 --> 00:57:23,720 Speaker 1: mind at how stuff works dot com for more on 1047 00:57:23,760 --> 00:57:26,520 Speaker 1: this than thousands of other topics. Is it how stuff works? 1048 00:57:26,560 --> 00:57:34,320 Speaker 1: Dot com love,