1
00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:09,760
Speaker 1: Too Much Information is a production of iHeartRadio. Hello everyone,

2
00:00:09,800 --> 00:00:12,720
Speaker 1: and welcome to another episode of Too Much Information, the

3
00:00:12,760 --> 00:00:15,239
Speaker 1: show that brings you the secret histories and little lone

4
00:00:15,320 --> 00:00:18,520
Speaker 1: facts behind your favorite movies, music, TV shows and more.

5
00:00:19,160 --> 00:00:22,439
Speaker 1: Or your man children of Minutia, your Rebels of really

6
00:00:22,480 --> 00:00:26,640
Speaker 1: granular details, your bicycle Thieves of Banality. Recording live from

7
00:00:26,640 --> 00:00:29,880
Speaker 1: the basement of the Alamo. My name is Jordan roun.

8
00:00:29,840 --> 00:00:32,120
Speaker 2: Tog and I'm Alex Heigel.

9
00:00:32,200 --> 00:00:34,800
Speaker 1: And welcome to the first and our two part tribute

10
00:00:34,800 --> 00:00:38,520
Speaker 1: to the late Paul Rubins, or more appropriately Pee Wee Herman.

11
00:00:39,280 --> 00:00:41,840
Speaker 1: The performer, died on July thirtieth of this year, six

12
00:00:41,960 --> 00:00:45,160
Speaker 1: years after being diagnosed with cancer. In a statement shared

13
00:00:45,200 --> 00:00:47,840
Speaker 1: just after his death, he said, please accept my apology

14
00:00:47,880 --> 00:00:49,960
Speaker 1: for not going public with what I've been facing the

15
00:00:50,000 --> 00:00:52,680
Speaker 1: last six years. I always felt a huge amount of

16
00:00:52,680 --> 00:00:55,880
Speaker 1: love and respect for my friends, fans and supporters. I

17
00:00:55,920 --> 00:00:58,800
Speaker 1: have loved you all so much and enjoyed making art

18
00:00:58,840 --> 00:01:02,160
Speaker 1: for you. And his passing in a strange way, now

19
00:01:02,200 --> 00:01:04,880
Speaker 1: hear me out, because this is going to God. You

20
00:01:05,280 --> 00:01:08,040
Speaker 1: reminded me a bit of the death of David Bowie,

21
00:01:08,080 --> 00:01:11,600
Speaker 1: in the sense that the patron Saint of weird misfits

22
00:01:11,680 --> 00:01:16,040
Speaker 1: had left us in a very sudden, unexpected way. And

23
00:01:16,400 --> 00:01:17,720
Speaker 1: you know, I mean, I have to say I was

24
00:01:17,760 --> 00:01:20,720
Speaker 1: somewhat shocked by the immense outpouring of grief that I

25
00:01:20,760 --> 00:01:23,600
Speaker 1: saw from all corners of the Internet. And you know,

26
00:01:23,640 --> 00:01:25,880
Speaker 1: I'd watched Pee Wee's Playhouse as a kid, and I

27
00:01:25,920 --> 00:01:29,400
Speaker 1: had a passing familiarity with Peee's Big Adventure, but I'd

28
00:01:29,520 --> 00:01:31,920
Speaker 1: sort of filed pee Wee Herman Away in my internal

29
00:01:32,000 --> 00:01:35,840
Speaker 1: rolodex as just another relic from the eighties monoculture. But

30
00:01:36,000 --> 00:01:39,920
Speaker 1: I think that people really responded to the genuine weirdness,

31
00:01:39,959 --> 00:01:43,280
Speaker 1: both of the character and its creator, who marched so

32
00:01:43,440 --> 00:01:46,039
Speaker 1: fiercely to the beat of his own drum. He said

33
00:01:46,080 --> 00:01:49,480
Speaker 1: repeatedly that through the Playhouse he was quote just trying

34
00:01:49,520 --> 00:01:52,000
Speaker 1: to illustrate to kids that it's okay to be different,

35
00:01:52,320 --> 00:01:54,800
Speaker 1: not that it's good, not that it's bad, but that

36
00:01:54,840 --> 00:01:57,840
Speaker 1: it's all right. So in today's episode, we're going to

37
00:01:57,920 --> 00:02:00,520
Speaker 1: examine the creation of the character and his rise the

38
00:02:00,520 --> 00:02:03,600
Speaker 1: global fame in Pee Wee's Big Adventure at the feature film,

39
00:02:03,920 --> 00:02:06,720
Speaker 1: and next week we'll touch on the groundbreaking TV series

40
00:02:06,880 --> 00:02:10,000
Speaker 1: and the behind the music style fall from Grace and

41
00:02:10,080 --> 00:02:15,079
Speaker 1: Redemption arc. You all know what I'm talking about, Heigel,

42
00:02:15,400 --> 00:02:19,320
Speaker 1: Your thoughts on the film or this deeply unsettling character in.

43
00:02:19,280 --> 00:02:23,280
Speaker 2: General, Yeah, I don't know. I never a big guy.

44
00:02:23,360 --> 00:02:28,000
Speaker 2: For me, missed the playhouse stuff. This movie wasn't huge

45
00:02:28,040 --> 00:02:32,280
Speaker 2: for me. There's something there's like an unsettling, royling heart

46
00:02:32,320 --> 00:02:34,640
Speaker 2: of darkness at the heart of this, like in the

47
00:02:34,639 --> 00:02:38,280
Speaker 2: way that there's like it's like it's it's a do

48
00:02:38,320 --> 00:02:41,000
Speaker 2: you ever watch the Judy Garland Christmas Special from the

49
00:02:41,040 --> 00:02:41,800
Speaker 2: mid fifties?

50
00:02:42,800 --> 00:02:46,400
Speaker 1: Shockingly, No, I'm actually not totally show what you're talking about,

51
00:02:46,440 --> 00:02:49,680
Speaker 1: which is really throwing me into a state of you know,

52
00:02:49,720 --> 00:02:51,760
Speaker 1: I thought I knew myself better than this. I know,

53
00:02:51,880 --> 00:02:53,440
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't know what you're talking about.

54
00:02:53,680 --> 00:02:56,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like her and the whole family, all the kids,

55
00:02:56,240 --> 00:02:59,240
Speaker 2: and but there's just it's like her and her like

56
00:02:59,400 --> 00:03:03,680
Speaker 2: clearly it's like pilled out Jinndaut Judy, and there's such

57
00:03:03,720 --> 00:03:08,799
Speaker 2: a like Lovecraftian madness at the edges of it. It's

58
00:03:08,800 --> 00:03:13,520
Speaker 2: like psychically humming with dark thrumbing.

59
00:03:13,680 --> 00:03:15,000
Speaker 1: Yes, yeah, what's that.

60
00:03:14,960 --> 00:03:17,880
Speaker 2: Manic Street Preachers song like the the the Humming of

61
00:03:18,040 --> 00:03:21,400
Speaker 2: Evil or the Low humming of evil or something like.

62
00:03:22,000 --> 00:03:26,640
Speaker 2: I get that same vibe from Pee's Big Adventure because

63
00:03:26,720 --> 00:03:32,080
Speaker 2: it's just like there's something almost Lynchian, oh yes, to

64
00:03:32,639 --> 00:03:37,480
Speaker 2: how mid century kitchy and annoying. It is, like I

65
00:03:37,520 --> 00:03:39,920
Speaker 2: feel like he would not have been out of place

66
00:03:39,960 --> 00:03:43,320
Speaker 2: in Twin Peaks. Yeah, that like this would have been

67
00:03:43,360 --> 00:03:46,600
Speaker 2: like a character that like Lynch would have like popped

68
00:03:46,640 --> 00:03:49,400
Speaker 2: into Twin Peak or probably Mark Frost. But David Lynch

69
00:03:49,400 --> 00:03:51,720
Speaker 2: would have found this funny. I'm sure David Lynch would

70
00:03:51,720 --> 00:03:56,520
Speaker 2: find Pee Wee like hilarious and just be like, ah, gee,

71
00:03:56,720 --> 00:04:01,840
Speaker 2: that's that's a great bit you're doing there, Paul What what? No,

72
00:04:02,000 --> 00:04:09,800
Speaker 2: I don't remember that? Oh okay, yeah, yeah, I find

73
00:04:09,840 --> 00:04:11,320
Speaker 2: him so unsettling.

74
00:04:11,800 --> 00:04:15,360
Speaker 1: Yeah, oh yeah, I mean you're right, he's a human

75
00:04:15,480 --> 00:04:17,480
Speaker 1: ventriloqu was dummy. It's just the.

76
00:04:17,600 --> 00:04:21,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know, yeah I didn't. It's so aggressively kitchy,

77
00:04:21,760 --> 00:04:25,040
Speaker 2: but it has that unpleasantness of like a child throwing

78
00:04:25,160 --> 00:04:28,040
Speaker 2: rocks at like a bird, you know, in that way

79
00:04:28,040 --> 00:04:31,560
Speaker 2: that like little kids can be really really cruel. There's

80
00:04:31,600 --> 00:04:34,480
Speaker 2: like a hint of insanity under it that I'm just

81
00:04:34,520 --> 00:04:37,960
Speaker 2: like I recoil at and so it was not a

82
00:04:38,000 --> 00:04:41,600
Speaker 2: part of my childhood at all, but so many people like, yeah,

83
00:04:41,640 --> 00:04:43,320
Speaker 2: like when he died, so many people came out and

84
00:04:43,360 --> 00:04:45,800
Speaker 2: said he was this huge, like foundational figure. So I

85
00:04:45,880 --> 00:04:47,840
Speaker 2: have no choice but to tip my hat.

86
00:04:48,760 --> 00:04:49,200
Speaker 1: Obviously.

87
00:04:49,200 --> 00:04:51,480
Speaker 2: It's one of the things that God Batman made. And

88
00:04:51,520 --> 00:04:54,480
Speaker 2: then consequently Batman Returns one of my favorite movies of

89
00:04:54,520 --> 00:04:57,560
Speaker 2: all time, so that that's like that has to go

90
00:04:57,640 --> 00:05:00,240
Speaker 2: in there. Side note, we should do Badman Return.

91
00:05:00,440 --> 00:05:02,279
Speaker 1: You know what, We'll do a two part We'll do

92
00:05:02,320 --> 00:05:04,080
Speaker 1: Batman and Batman Returns as a way to make it

93
00:05:04,120 --> 00:05:05,919
Speaker 1: up to you for doing two episodes on Pee Wee.

94
00:05:06,240 --> 00:05:08,359
Speaker 2: I mean, yeah, like while we're doing Tim Burton Month

95
00:05:08,480 --> 00:05:11,560
Speaker 2: or whatever this ends up being. But yeah, I don't know,

96
00:05:11,720 --> 00:05:13,920
Speaker 2: it was just not He was not like a big

97
00:05:13,960 --> 00:05:17,000
Speaker 2: guy for me. I remember him best as actually the

98
00:05:17,160 --> 00:05:20,680
Speaker 2: Stench or the Farder or something in Mystery Mystery Man. Yeah,

99
00:05:20,839 --> 00:05:23,680
Speaker 2: the movie I watched way too much. Well.

100
00:05:23,720 --> 00:05:25,600
Speaker 1: I liked all sorts of weird stuff as a kid,

101
00:05:25,800 --> 00:05:30,080
Speaker 1: so you know, from bowling to old life magazines to

102
00:05:31,240 --> 00:05:34,440
Speaker 1: the little French orphan mad line, so it's always weird.

103
00:05:34,480 --> 00:05:36,479
Speaker 1: Like I never know when something was big for me

104
00:05:36,760 --> 00:05:38,960
Speaker 1: or big for everybody, So I think maybe it just

105
00:05:39,000 --> 00:05:41,080
Speaker 1: caught me off guard that pee Wee was as big

106
00:05:41,120 --> 00:05:42,880
Speaker 1: to everybody else as it was for me as a kid.

107
00:05:43,880 --> 00:05:47,000
Speaker 1: It was definitely unsettling. I knew that as at the time,

108
00:05:47,160 --> 00:05:49,440
Speaker 1: all the way down to his laugh. I mean, it's

109
00:05:50,240 --> 00:05:52,839
Speaker 1: it's very scary, you know what it was. I think

110
00:05:52,880 --> 00:05:55,799
Speaker 1: my parents liked it maybe more than I did, because

111
00:05:55,800 --> 00:05:58,400
Speaker 1: it was more palatable than you know, some of the

112
00:05:58,440 --> 00:06:01,599
Speaker 1: more benign kids shows stuff. So maybe they preferred having

113
00:06:01,680 --> 00:06:04,719
Speaker 1: that on because at least it wasn't completelyle bottomized in

114
00:06:04,760 --> 00:06:07,120
Speaker 1: the way that so much of like you know, children's

115
00:06:07,160 --> 00:06:10,200
Speaker 1: programming it during our childhood was do you think it's

116
00:06:10,200 --> 00:06:13,000
Speaker 1: supposed to be sinister? I'm trying to figure out put

117
00:06:13,000 --> 00:06:16,080
Speaker 1: my finger on what exactly is sinister about it. I mean,

118
00:06:16,160 --> 00:06:17,520
Speaker 1: Letterman had the great quote.

119
00:06:17,600 --> 00:06:20,479
Speaker 2: I was reading about the character and Letterman had this

120
00:06:20,800 --> 00:06:24,960
Speaker 2: amazing quote that I actually think articulates everything that we're

121
00:06:25,000 --> 00:06:29,240
Speaker 2: trying to which is it has the external structure of

122
00:06:29,279 --> 00:06:32,240
Speaker 2: a braddy, little precocious child, but you know it's being

123
00:06:32,320 --> 00:06:37,599
Speaker 2: controlled by the incubus, the manifestation of evil itself. But

124
00:06:37,680 --> 00:06:40,240
Speaker 2: I'm just like, what the where the like That's what's

125
00:06:40,279 --> 00:06:42,560
Speaker 2: so fascinating to me, is like it does seem so

126
00:06:43,279 --> 00:06:48,320
Speaker 2: suee generous to use a very lofty term like without

127
00:06:48,360 --> 00:06:50,600
Speaker 2: Like where did this come from? I mean one of

128
00:06:50,640 --> 00:06:54,000
Speaker 2: the influences that I read about it was TV host

129
00:06:54,040 --> 00:06:57,560
Speaker 2: in the fifties, Pinky Lee. Yeah, but that's not quite it.

130
00:06:58,160 --> 00:07:01,719
Speaker 2: There's like a weird it's like, yeah, it's like that

131
00:07:01,880 --> 00:07:06,599
Speaker 2: and John Waters and you know some kind of I

132
00:07:06,720 --> 00:07:08,760
Speaker 2: just maybe because I am been a East Coaster for

133
00:07:08,839 --> 00:07:10,720
Speaker 2: so much in my life, I've never had a handle

134
00:07:10,720 --> 00:07:14,520
Speaker 2: on the like sun Baked nineteen fifties, like Desert Kitch,

135
00:07:15,800 --> 00:07:19,480
Speaker 2: like Palm Springs, That's what I'm describing. Yes, I've never

136
00:07:19,520 --> 00:07:21,360
Speaker 2: had a handle on that as like an esthetic.

137
00:07:21,760 --> 00:07:24,720
Speaker 1: I don't know. I mean I would argue that nobody does.

138
00:07:24,800 --> 00:07:27,720
Speaker 1: I think it kind of. I don't think you're missing anything.

139
00:07:27,960 --> 00:07:34,400
Speaker 1: I think it is an inherently uncanny valley, perfect store bought, dull,

140
00:07:35,120 --> 00:07:38,960
Speaker 1: pre made, prefab existence. I think I don't think there's

141
00:07:39,000 --> 00:07:40,960
Speaker 1: anything deeper there that you needed to grow up on

142
00:07:41,000 --> 00:07:44,880
Speaker 1: the West Coast to understand, is my guess. At least, well,

143
00:07:44,920 --> 00:07:47,640
Speaker 1: strap in for a truly weird episode. If this intro

144
00:07:47,800 --> 00:07:51,840
Speaker 1: is any indication from Paul Rubin's early brush with children's

145
00:07:51,880 --> 00:07:54,600
Speaker 1: TV greatness, to his friendship and falling out with the

146
00:07:54,680 --> 00:07:58,640
Speaker 1: late great Phil Hartman, the genesis of that truly insane

147
00:07:58,760 --> 00:08:02,480
Speaker 1: voice and ridiculous suit, and the surprising early script of

148
00:08:02,480 --> 00:08:04,600
Speaker 1: the feature film that never saw the lot of day.

149
00:08:04,880 --> 00:08:07,520
Speaker 1: Here's part one in our two part episode about Pee

150
00:08:07,520 --> 00:08:11,400
Speaker 1: Wee Herman exploring everything you didn't know about Pee Wee's

151
00:08:11,480 --> 00:08:19,000
Speaker 1: big adventure. Sorry.

152
00:08:19,120 --> 00:08:20,680
Speaker 2: When you pitch the show, you were like, one day

153
00:08:20,720 --> 00:08:23,040
Speaker 2: we'll be doing a two parter, a two hander.

154
00:08:23,280 --> 00:08:23,840
Speaker 1: I'm pee Wee.

155
00:08:25,040 --> 00:08:26,360
Speaker 2: You're like, I'm not Jordan.

156
00:08:26,440 --> 00:08:28,480
Speaker 1: What's wrong with you? I owe you? I owe you

157
00:08:28,680 --> 00:08:33,320
Speaker 1: a two parter on Batman, which I will happily do. Actually,

158
00:08:33,320 --> 00:08:35,079
Speaker 1: that would be really fun. We should do Batman and

159
00:08:35,080 --> 00:08:37,800
Speaker 1: Batman returns. I don't like the first one as much

160
00:08:37,840 --> 00:08:39,640
Speaker 1: as I like the second one. The second one is

161
00:08:39,679 --> 00:08:42,600
Speaker 1: just so maximalist. I mean, Jack first one is Jack.

162
00:08:42,679 --> 00:08:45,160
Speaker 1: But you know whatever, Sorry, keep going, go ahead, go ahead,

163
00:08:45,160 --> 00:08:48,720
Speaker 1: go ahead. Paul Rubins created a whole labort backstory for

164
00:08:48,760 --> 00:08:51,040
Speaker 1: Pee Wee, which we'll get into it in our next episode.

165
00:08:51,120 --> 00:08:54,320
Speaker 1: But for years, very little was known about the man

166
00:08:54,360 --> 00:08:57,880
Speaker 1: behind the bow tie. He was born Paul Rubenfeld in

167
00:08:57,960 --> 00:09:00,360
Speaker 1: nineteen fifty two in the arts in New York City

168
00:09:00,400 --> 00:09:03,679
Speaker 1: suburb of Peak Skill, where I believe the gentleman who

169
00:09:03,720 --> 00:09:06,760
Speaker 1: wrote and performed the TMI theme currently lives sat as

170
00:09:06,800 --> 00:09:09,240
Speaker 1: Calabaum of Ghostmunk Orchestra. Do I have that right and

171
00:09:09,480 --> 00:09:10,000
Speaker 1: is correct?

172
00:09:10,280 --> 00:09:15,400
Speaker 2: Wonderful shouts to also Bettina and her new thriving DELI.

173
00:09:15,960 --> 00:09:19,280
Speaker 2: Yes that's right, Benny's brown bag, Bennie's bambag.

174
00:09:19,360 --> 00:09:21,760
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, yes, check it out. If check it out,

175
00:09:21,800 --> 00:09:24,480
Speaker 1: if you are in the Peak Skill area, is that

176
00:09:24,600 --> 00:09:27,240
Speaker 1: entitleist the free sandwiches for better a couple of months?

177
00:09:27,240 --> 00:09:31,000
Speaker 1: You know? Also from Peak Skill. In addition to our

178
00:09:31,080 --> 00:09:36,640
Speaker 1: friend Mel Gibson, Rah the fact that Paul Rubens and

179
00:09:36,679 --> 00:09:39,160
Speaker 1: Mel Gibson were born six months apart in the town

180
00:09:39,160 --> 00:09:41,720
Speaker 1: of Peak Skill was always a great source of amusement

181
00:09:41,760 --> 00:09:45,640
Speaker 1: and fascination to Paul. But what fascinates me is the

182
00:09:45,720 --> 00:09:50,880
Speaker 1: ruben Feld family because they are extremely colorful. Paul Rubins father, Milton,

183
00:09:51,240 --> 00:09:54,120
Speaker 1: was something of a military hero. He was a fighter

184
00:09:54,160 --> 00:09:56,679
Speaker 1: pilot who became one of the five founders of the

185
00:09:56,720 --> 00:09:59,839
Speaker 1: Israeli Air Force During the nineteen forty eight Arab is

186
00:10:00,320 --> 00:10:03,760
Speaker 1: war and he is an extensive Wikipedia page, so if

187
00:10:03,800 --> 00:10:06,280
Speaker 1: you're so inclined, to check that out. But the thing

188
00:10:06,320 --> 00:10:09,080
Speaker 1: that really got me was that his photo is basically

189
00:10:09,200 --> 00:10:12,839
Speaker 1: an old timey picture of pee Wee Herman in military dress.

190
00:10:13,000 --> 00:10:15,720
Speaker 1: So that's very funny to me. It looks just like

191
00:10:15,840 --> 00:10:19,560
Speaker 1: pee Wee Herman. And Paul was the eldest of two siblings.

192
00:10:19,760 --> 00:10:23,079
Speaker 1: His sister Abby is or at least was, an attorney

193
00:10:23,160 --> 00:10:25,840
Speaker 1: who at one time served as the legal director of

194
00:10:25,880 --> 00:10:29,160
Speaker 1: the Lambda Legal Defense and Educational Funds, which is a

195
00:10:29,280 --> 00:10:32,760
Speaker 1: national gay and lesbian civil rights organization very active in

196
00:10:32,800 --> 00:10:37,480
Speaker 1: fighting discrimination against AIDS victims. And Paul's brother Luke sort

197
00:10:37,520 --> 00:10:41,840
Speaker 1: of on the other side of the cultural spectrum professional spectrum.

198
00:10:41,840 --> 00:10:46,720
Speaker 1: I'm not sure which civil rights trained Doberman pinchers, preparing

199
00:10:46,800 --> 00:10:50,200
Speaker 1: them for what has been referred to as a black

200
00:10:50,240 --> 00:10:53,600
Speaker 1: belt in Karate for dogs, which I am choosing to

201
00:10:53,679 --> 00:10:58,080
Speaker 1: read as training Doberman for dog fighting. Yeah. I don't

202
00:10:58,120 --> 00:11:00,640
Speaker 1: know what that means. It's gonna be like private curity, right,

203
00:11:01,200 --> 00:11:03,439
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, no, maybe that's true. You're right, you're right.

204
00:11:03,760 --> 00:11:05,920
Speaker 1: None of this is especially relevant when it comes to

205
00:11:05,960 --> 00:11:09,120
Speaker 1: pee Wee. But I just found it all interesting. Now.

206
00:11:09,280 --> 00:11:11,600
Speaker 1: There are a few key boments of Paul Ruben's childhood

207
00:11:11,640 --> 00:11:14,360
Speaker 1: that point the way towards Peewee and all that would follow.

208
00:11:14,960 --> 00:11:17,280
Speaker 1: The first of these occurred when Paul appeared as part

209
00:11:17,320 --> 00:11:21,320
Speaker 1: of the studio audience for Howdy Duty, arguably the most

210
00:11:21,360 --> 00:11:25,120
Speaker 1: famous children's show of the fifties, which traumatized the whole

211
00:11:25,160 --> 00:11:28,679
Speaker 1: generation with its truly horrific titular puppet. Have you seen?

212
00:11:28,760 --> 00:11:29,920
Speaker 1: Are you familiar with Howdy Duty?

213
00:11:30,040 --> 00:11:32,360
Speaker 2: I am, but I was gonna say it is horrifying.

214
00:11:32,920 --> 00:11:34,680
Speaker 2: I was gonna say, do you think the clown that

215
00:11:34,720 --> 00:11:36,960
Speaker 2: he changes his bike to is supposed to be Boso?

216
00:11:37,080 --> 00:11:40,360
Speaker 2: Because that's like the other big fifties I wouldn't be

217
00:11:40,360 --> 00:11:42,680
Speaker 2: surprised to be clown. That's a good that's a good point.

218
00:11:42,800 --> 00:11:44,640
Speaker 2: That's like when people are archetype. I think that's what

219
00:11:44,679 --> 00:11:49,160
Speaker 2: Pennywise is partially based on. Oh really, I believe so

220
00:11:49,160 --> 00:11:52,520
Speaker 2: so is Boso like the original, like creepy clown. I'm

221
00:11:52,559 --> 00:11:55,000
Speaker 2: so glad you asked a lot of the like archetypal,

222
00:11:55,200 --> 00:11:59,559
Speaker 2: like sad clown, like the big like exaggerated bug Lacci. Yeah,

223
00:11:59,640 --> 00:12:01,719
Speaker 2: like some that comes from Comedia del Arte. Some of

224
00:12:01,760 --> 00:12:04,920
Speaker 2: that comes from like vaudeville, like en, like the tramp characters,

225
00:12:04,960 --> 00:12:07,720
Speaker 2: like the beat up, sad looking clowns.

226
00:12:07,880 --> 00:12:10,480
Speaker 1: But yeah, let's call it bozo. Let's say, let's see.

227
00:12:10,480 --> 00:12:12,880
Speaker 1: I will say, how do Duty had Clara Belle the clown?

228
00:12:13,120 --> 00:12:16,559
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah ye until the last episode. Yeah

229
00:12:16,600 --> 00:12:17,079
Speaker 1: yeah yeah.

230
00:12:17,120 --> 00:12:20,520
Speaker 2: I think clowns should be seen and not heard.

231
00:12:23,040 --> 00:12:25,720
Speaker 1: But yes, Young Paul Rubins was selected to be part

232
00:12:25,760 --> 00:12:30,160
Speaker 1: of Howdy Duty's famous Peanut Gallery racist, a group of

233
00:12:30,240 --> 00:12:34,320
Speaker 1: kids the sort of sort of audience of the show. Sadly,

234
00:12:34,360 --> 00:12:37,120
Speaker 1: there are no pictures of young Paul Rubins young pee

235
00:12:37,120 --> 00:12:39,680
Speaker 1: we should I say, shaking hands with Buffalo Bill, the

236
00:12:39,720 --> 00:12:42,000
Speaker 1: host of Howdy Duty, sort of like that photo of

237
00:12:42,000 --> 00:12:44,840
Speaker 1: Bill Clinton meeting JFK as a teen and shaking sake

238
00:12:44,880 --> 00:12:48,760
Speaker 1: in his hand. No photos like that exist. In fact,

239
00:12:48,800 --> 00:12:50,880
Speaker 1: the whole experience of going to the Howdy Duty taping

240
00:12:51,000 --> 00:12:55,760
Speaker 1: left Paul underwhelmed. He said, I remember sitting there thinking, well,

241
00:12:56,320 --> 00:12:58,880
Speaker 1: what the hell's how do you Duty? You couldn't see anything.

242
00:12:59,360 --> 00:13:01,520
Speaker 1: It was all the cameras and lights and junk in

243
00:13:01,559 --> 00:13:04,920
Speaker 1: the way. Nobody looked like they looked on TV. It

244
00:13:05,000 --> 00:13:07,640
Speaker 1: was all really very frightening. So that was kind of

245
00:13:07,640 --> 00:13:11,040
Speaker 1: a bomber, but definitely a formative moment. Another defining incident

246
00:13:11,040 --> 00:13:14,520
Speaker 1: occurred when Paul and his family moved to Sarasota, Florida

247
00:13:14,640 --> 00:13:20,040
Speaker 1: to Check's notes run a lamp Star. Not only was Sarasota,

248
00:13:20,120 --> 00:13:24,680
Speaker 1: which is apparently somewhat of an artsy enclave of Florida

249
00:13:24,720 --> 00:13:26,719
Speaker 1: which I wasn't aware of, it was home to the

250
00:13:26,800 --> 00:13:30,360
Speaker 1: Ringling Brothers circus, but also the Rubenfeld's new neighbors were

251
00:13:30,360 --> 00:13:34,000
Speaker 1: reportedly the Great Woolendas, who were kind of the American

252
00:13:34,080 --> 00:13:38,480
Speaker 1: first family of high wire acts. This was presumably around

253
00:13:38,559 --> 00:13:40,360
Speaker 1: the time that one of the members it was a

254
00:13:40,480 --> 00:13:43,480
Speaker 1: very big family, Yeda, fell to her death during a

255
00:13:43,559 --> 00:13:47,080
Speaker 1: performance in nineteen sixty three. The only reason I know

256
00:13:47,160 --> 00:13:49,080
Speaker 1: this was because they made a reference to it in

257
00:13:49,120 --> 00:13:52,520
Speaker 1: an episode of mad Men when Roger Sterling says during

258
00:13:52,520 --> 00:13:55,800
Speaker 1: a meeting that someone took a Ya Wilenda size misstep

259
00:13:55,880 --> 00:13:58,840
Speaker 1: last week, and then when everyone looks at him blankly,

260
00:13:59,360 --> 00:14:02,199
Speaker 1: he explained is that they got her off the sidewalk

261
00:14:02,200 --> 00:14:06,440
Speaker 1: with a hose last week. Roches Sterling ladies and gentlemen,

262
00:14:06,960 --> 00:14:10,480
Speaker 1: and also the Rubefelds lived near another circus family who

263
00:14:10,520 --> 00:14:13,400
Speaker 1: made a living by getting shot out of cannons. So

264
00:14:13,600 --> 00:14:16,960
Speaker 1: I have to believe that all of this American performance

265
00:14:17,120 --> 00:14:21,240
Speaker 1: kitch in creepy clown stuff must have contributed to the

266
00:14:21,240 --> 00:14:25,160
Speaker 1: wacky inner life that would birth peewe Herman. Paul Rumans

267
00:14:25,160 --> 00:14:27,840
Speaker 1: began his theatrical career in nineteen sixty three when his

268
00:14:27,880 --> 00:14:30,680
Speaker 1: parents showed him a newspaper ad for a local audition,

269
00:14:31,400 --> 00:14:34,560
Speaker 1: and he apparently had express showbize ambitions to the point where,

270
00:14:35,080 --> 00:14:38,200
Speaker 1: at age five, I read, he asked his dad to

271
00:14:38,200 --> 00:14:40,520
Speaker 1: build him a stage at home where he could perform

272
00:14:40,560 --> 00:14:43,000
Speaker 1: with his brother and sister. He was a big I

273
00:14:43,120 --> 00:14:46,360
Speaker 1: Love Lucy fan, which I guess concerned his teachers to

274
00:14:46,440 --> 00:14:49,240
Speaker 1: no end. I guess like being that into Lucy at

275
00:14:49,280 --> 00:14:51,600
Speaker 1: that time was seen as something of a character flaw

276
00:14:51,720 --> 00:14:53,960
Speaker 1: or something that will get you sent to the guns

277
00:14:54,000 --> 00:14:57,800
Speaker 1: counselor So that's weird, I mean, and now arguably more

278
00:14:57,840 --> 00:15:01,160
Speaker 1: so now so I imagine these Lucy's sketches were things that

279
00:15:01,160 --> 00:15:03,960
Speaker 1: were performed on this homemade stage. But his parents were like,

280
00:15:04,000 --> 00:15:06,200
Speaker 1: all right, enough of this, we got to cure him

281
00:15:06,280 --> 00:15:09,400
Speaker 1: of this performance bug. So they hoped that he would

282
00:15:09,440 --> 00:15:14,080
Speaker 1: audition for this show get his dreams crushed and then

283
00:15:14,080 --> 00:15:17,040
Speaker 1: get the theater bug out of his system parenting in

284
00:15:17,080 --> 00:15:21,320
Speaker 1: the early sixties. But then eleven year old Paul got

285
00:15:21,320 --> 00:15:23,880
Speaker 1: the part. It was a play called One Thousand Clowns,

286
00:15:23,880 --> 00:15:27,400
Speaker 1: appropriately enough, and the rest, as Paul himself would say,

287
00:15:27,680 --> 00:15:31,320
Speaker 1: was history. He was named thespian president of his high

288
00:15:31,320 --> 00:15:34,840
Speaker 1: school and accepted into the Northeastern University's summer program for

289
00:15:34,920 --> 00:15:37,320
Speaker 1: gifted students, and spend a lot of his free time

290
00:15:37,360 --> 00:15:41,560
Speaker 1: in Sarasota acting in local plays. And it's important to

291
00:15:41,560 --> 00:15:43,800
Speaker 1: add at this point that this guy was no joke

292
00:15:43,840 --> 00:15:45,960
Speaker 1: when it came to acting. Many who knew him in

293
00:15:46,000 --> 00:15:48,360
Speaker 1: his early days felt sad that he was always shackled

294
00:15:48,360 --> 00:15:50,920
Speaker 1: to this pewee herman role because it eclipsed his talent

295
00:15:51,000 --> 00:15:55,480
Speaker 1: for versatility. And Paul moved to California for college, where

296
00:15:55,520 --> 00:15:58,480
Speaker 1: he supplemented his meager acting work with odd jobs like

297
00:15:58,800 --> 00:16:01,720
Speaker 1: waiting at restaurants working as a door to door fuller

298
00:16:01,760 --> 00:16:07,800
Speaker 1: brush salesman, which apparently was a fairly popular job for

299
00:16:08,000 --> 00:16:10,800
Speaker 1: wanna be showbiz people. We followed on the footsteps of

300
00:16:10,840 --> 00:16:15,840
Speaker 1: luminaries like Dennis Quaid, Dick Clark, the Reverend Billy Graham,

301
00:16:16,480 --> 00:16:19,360
Speaker 1: and Jack Nicholson. They all worked as Fuller Brush salesman,

302
00:16:20,120 --> 00:16:23,200
Speaker 1: and Paul gained his first national exposure in nineteen seventy

303
00:16:23,240 --> 00:16:26,440
Speaker 1: seven with the first of fourteen guest appearances on The

304
00:16:26,480 --> 00:16:29,080
Speaker 1: Gong Show. For those of you not familiar with The

305
00:16:29,080 --> 00:16:32,160
Speaker 1: Gong Show, it's basically America's got talent with somehow even

306
00:16:32,240 --> 00:16:35,880
Speaker 1: less talent, and Paul performed as part of a double

307
00:16:35,920 --> 00:16:40,120
Speaker 1: act called the Hilarious Betty and Eddie. Not do anything

308
00:16:40,120 --> 00:16:45,720
Speaker 1: for you all keep a little less sobes happy. What's

309
00:16:45,720 --> 00:16:48,920
Speaker 1: a fuller brush? I looked it up. I couldn't find

310
00:16:48,920 --> 00:16:50,200
Speaker 1: a picture of it. I think it's just like a

311
00:16:50,240 --> 00:16:51,320
Speaker 1: brand of brushes.

312
00:16:52,040 --> 00:16:54,120
Speaker 2: Did they like go through a lot more brushes back

313
00:16:54,120 --> 00:16:56,960
Speaker 2: then because the housewives were all on DEXI and like

314
00:16:57,280 --> 00:17:00,720
Speaker 2: mansket cleaning before their husband came home already drunk.

315
00:17:00,960 --> 00:17:03,160
Speaker 1: You know, I thought it was a Chimney sweep brush,

316
00:17:03,440 --> 00:17:05,159
Speaker 1: which just goes to show. I was thinking of like

317
00:17:05,200 --> 00:17:07,040
Speaker 1: Dick Van Dyke dancing around our rooftops.

318
00:17:07,280 --> 00:17:11,040
Speaker 2: Oh sure, yeah, yeah, yeah no that tracks stay tuned

319
00:17:11,080 --> 00:17:11,600
Speaker 2: for TMI.

320
00:17:11,800 --> 00:17:13,000
Speaker 1: The Fuller Brush.

321
00:17:13,200 --> 00:17:15,119
Speaker 2: So it was around the time in nineteen seventy seven

322
00:17:15,160 --> 00:17:19,439
Speaker 2: that Rubens first debuted an embryonic version of Pewee Herman,

323
00:17:19,920 --> 00:17:24,840
Speaker 2: a descriptor that truly sends chills down my spine, like

324
00:17:24,920 --> 00:17:27,359
Speaker 2: the alien, like the chess Burster.

325
00:17:27,480 --> 00:17:28,679
Speaker 1: It's covered in Google.

326
00:17:30,760 --> 00:17:32,560
Speaker 2: He was performing as a member of the famous La

327
00:17:32,640 --> 00:17:37,840
Speaker 2: improv troupe known as The Groundlings, basically the two Well,

328
00:17:37,880 --> 00:17:41,000
Speaker 2: I guess there's UCB. Now there's like three famed improv

329
00:17:41,040 --> 00:17:45,000
Speaker 2: groups in the US, right, it's Upright, Citizens Brigade, Second City,

330
00:17:45,400 --> 00:17:48,120
Speaker 2: and the Groundlings. So they're the West Coast based one

331
00:17:48,359 --> 00:17:51,880
Speaker 2: and some of their alumni include Kristin Wig, Lisa Kudro,

332
00:17:52,119 --> 00:17:55,840
Speaker 2: My Rudolph, Kathy Griffin, John lovettz, Lorraine Newman, Cherio, Terry

333
00:17:55,880 --> 00:17:59,919
Speaker 2: will Ferrell, Chris Catan, Chris Parnell, Melissa McCarthy, Julia Sweeney,

334
00:18:00,160 --> 00:18:04,399
Speaker 2: Hines on a gas tire, mindy sterling Pat Oscar winning

335
00:18:05,640 --> 00:18:07,560
Speaker 2: Pat Noriri, he went on Oscar.

336
00:18:07,920 --> 00:18:11,080
Speaker 1: What's that Oscar nomine? Mister Mia, Oh, mister BOCKI wow?

337
00:18:11,119 --> 00:18:14,120
Speaker 1: What he? What was he nominated for an Oscar for? Oh?

338
00:18:14,160 --> 00:18:15,040
Speaker 1: I didn't know that one?

339
00:18:15,119 --> 00:18:20,800
Speaker 2: Pat Nori Yuki Noriyuki, Pat Noriita well yea also honored

340
00:18:20,840 --> 00:18:24,960
Speaker 2: on Happy Days, Yes, and Captain Sam from mash.

341
00:18:24,600 --> 00:18:28,000
Speaker 1: Oh Yeah wow. He really is quite the intersection of

342
00:18:28,480 --> 00:18:31,640
Speaker 1: so many of my interests. UH.

343
00:18:31,720 --> 00:18:35,840
Speaker 2: And Phil Hartman lest we forget? And John Peregon surely

344
00:18:35,960 --> 00:18:37,879
Speaker 2: at the bottom of all those people I named, And

345
00:18:38,040 --> 00:18:39,760
Speaker 2: Jan Hooks, who's John Paragon?

346
00:18:40,000 --> 00:18:43,840
Speaker 1: Jen Hooks is great? John Peregon is Jambie in Oh

347
00:18:43,920 --> 00:18:48,040
Speaker 1: Peewey's Playhouse a hell of a cv uh.

348
00:18:48,280 --> 00:18:51,920
Speaker 2: During his time with The Groundlings, Rubens created a less

349
00:18:51,960 --> 00:18:56,160
Speaker 2: remembered character called Chief Jay Longtow, who's a Native American

350
00:18:56,280 --> 00:19:01,040
Speaker 2: lounge singer who drank and danced in the classic ballet

351
00:19:01,160 --> 00:19:04,920
Speaker 2: on point stance in Big White Sneaker that wouldn't fly

352
00:19:05,040 --> 00:19:10,360
Speaker 2: today uh and didn't back then. I guess he recalled

353
00:19:10,359 --> 00:19:12,680
Speaker 2: that with embarrassment throughout the rest of his life.

354
00:19:13,280 --> 00:19:13,680
Speaker 1: Uh.

355
00:19:13,840 --> 00:19:16,240
Speaker 2: More fondly remembered is the character he created at the

356
00:19:16,240 --> 00:19:20,000
Speaker 2: Groundlings called pee Wee Herman. According to Rubens, pee Wee

357
00:19:20,280 --> 00:19:23,359
Speaker 2: just quote came about from an extended improv at the Groundlings.

358
00:19:23,560 --> 00:19:25,200
Speaker 2: We were given an assignment to come up with a

359
00:19:25,280 --> 00:19:28,159
Speaker 2: character that one might encounter in a comedy club. He

360
00:19:28,240 --> 00:19:31,639
Speaker 2: was intended to be a really bad comic, someone you

361
00:19:31,640 --> 00:19:34,160
Speaker 2: would look at and go, this guy is never going

362
00:19:34,240 --> 00:19:36,040
Speaker 2: to make it. It was that tweet I saw if

363
00:19:36,119 --> 00:19:37,560
Speaker 2: you like that. I think I brought it up in

364
00:19:37,600 --> 00:19:39,359
Speaker 2: a different episode that was like, you used to be

365
00:19:39,400 --> 00:19:41,679
Speaker 2: able to make an entire movie about the premise, What

366
00:19:41,760 --> 00:19:43,640
Speaker 2: if a guy was annoying to be around?

367
00:19:44,560 --> 00:19:49,200
Speaker 1: Ah, you mean the pre cable guy? What about Bob?

368
00:19:50,040 --> 00:19:52,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's better when they edge on the psychotic I'm

369
00:19:52,840 --> 00:19:55,439
Speaker 2: thinking of like I'm thinking of, yeah, I mean what

370
00:19:55,680 --> 00:19:57,720
Speaker 2: but that this character to me doesn't scan as a

371
00:19:57,760 --> 00:19:59,000
Speaker 2: stand up comic at all.

372
00:19:59,320 --> 00:20:02,200
Speaker 1: No, I mean, yeah, we'll touch on this a little later,

373
00:20:02,240 --> 00:20:05,520
Speaker 1: But there was an early version. I think the first

374
00:20:05,560 --> 00:20:07,560
Speaker 1: movie that Pee Wee Herman was ever and the character

375
00:20:07,680 --> 00:20:10,600
Speaker 1: was in was a Chief and Child movie, and he

376
00:20:10,960 --> 00:20:14,280
Speaker 1: comes on stage and starts trying to do stand up stuff.

377
00:20:14,400 --> 00:20:18,080
Speaker 1: I mean, it's very telling that this comes, I think,

378
00:20:18,119 --> 00:20:23,400
Speaker 1: fairly soon after Andy Kaufman's foreign Man character, who would

379
00:20:23,400 --> 00:20:26,159
Speaker 1: come on stage and try to be a stand up

380
00:20:26,200 --> 00:20:29,280
Speaker 1: comedian who was terrible at it. So in a way,

381
00:20:30,000 --> 00:20:32,800
Speaker 1: it's almost like you can kind of draw a line,

382
00:20:32,840 --> 00:20:34,639
Speaker 1: I think, between the two and they would have been

383
00:20:35,040 --> 00:20:38,800
Speaker 1: in the same circles in Hollywood at the same time anyway, too. Yeah,

384
00:20:38,800 --> 00:20:39,960
Speaker 1: everyone was chasing them.

385
00:20:40,200 --> 00:20:46,240
Speaker 2: Andy Kaufman making it onto taxi arc just by being annoying, right.

386
00:20:47,280 --> 00:20:49,160
Speaker 1: Being annoying and bad at stand up.

387
00:20:50,480 --> 00:20:54,320
Speaker 2: According to Rubens, the character arrived fairly fully formed, nice

388
00:20:54,320 --> 00:20:57,520
Speaker 2: alliteration there, Jordan, he told Vanity Fair in nineteen ninety nine,

389
00:20:57,680 --> 00:20:59,800
Speaker 2: I sort of flipped a switch and the character came

390
00:20:59,800 --> 00:21:02,560
Speaker 2: out than admitting, you'd think in twenty years I'd have

391
00:21:02,600 --> 00:21:07,960
Speaker 2: a better story, which is strange considering how what is

392
00:21:08,000 --> 00:21:11,920
Speaker 2: it who Athena who sprang fully grown from Zeus's head?

393
00:21:13,720 --> 00:21:16,360
Speaker 2: Little Greek Greek legend.

394
00:21:16,840 --> 00:21:19,920
Speaker 1: Drop for you there? Yeah, your knowledge based from from

395
00:21:19,960 --> 00:21:24,760
Speaker 1: the finer points of fifties children's television to Greek mythology.

396
00:21:25,119 --> 00:21:26,680
Speaker 1: I really I do bow you.

397
00:21:27,720 --> 00:21:32,960
Speaker 2: It's hell inside my head. The character's many distinctive traits

398
00:21:33,040 --> 00:21:36,200
Speaker 2: were just a bunch of stuff that Rubens threw together.

399
00:21:36,320 --> 00:21:36,720
Speaker 1: He said.

400
00:21:36,920 --> 00:21:44,119
Speaker 2: He denied that French cartoon characters Tintin and Pinocchio were influences.

401
00:21:44,640 --> 00:21:47,600
Speaker 2: I don't see where Pinocchio comes in to that. He

402
00:21:47,800 --> 00:21:50,399
Speaker 2: I again, he's the shape of his face. It's like

403
00:21:50,440 --> 00:21:52,720
Speaker 2: the way he has, like his high cheek bones.

404
00:21:52,800 --> 00:21:54,520
Speaker 1: But she then rouge just to make them seem even

405
00:21:54,520 --> 00:21:58,600
Speaker 1: more pronounced, and is very like what's the word like aqualine? Nose.

406
00:21:58,760 --> 00:22:02,800
Speaker 2: Oh sure, yeah, yeah yeah. Perhaps the most distinctive element

407
00:22:02,840 --> 00:22:04,439
Speaker 2: of pe Wee Herman is, of course his voice and

408
00:22:04,520 --> 00:22:09,560
Speaker 2: trademark braying two note laugh, Can you do it? No,

409
00:22:09,600 --> 00:22:12,639
Speaker 2: I'm not doing that, because the second I knew we

410
00:22:12,640 --> 00:22:15,080
Speaker 2: were doing this, I immediately flashed back to, like I

411
00:22:15,119 --> 00:22:17,280
Speaker 2: love the eighties where they just did like a quick

412
00:22:17,320 --> 00:22:19,919
Speaker 2: montage of everyone doing the pee wee laugh, and I

413
00:22:19,960 --> 00:22:22,240
Speaker 2: was like, nope, I'm not debasing myself that way.

414
00:22:24,040 --> 00:22:29,840
Speaker 1: Writer T. Girtler, that's it. Wow that guy. Writer T.

415
00:22:30,040 --> 00:22:33,000
Speaker 2: Girtler described the voice in a nineteen eighty seven Rolling

416
00:22:33,000 --> 00:22:36,800
Speaker 2: Stone profile as sounding, quote like a blender with sinus problems,

417
00:22:37,160 --> 00:22:39,359
Speaker 2: whining at high speed through taco dip.

418
00:22:39,560 --> 00:22:41,800
Speaker 1: That's pretty thing. That's pretty good. That's accurate.

419
00:22:42,160 --> 00:22:44,520
Speaker 2: The voice dated back to nineteen seventy, when Rubens was

420
00:22:44,560 --> 00:22:47,320
Speaker 2: performing in a play called Life with Father. Cast as

421
00:22:47,359 --> 00:22:49,960
Speaker 2: the most annoying character in the show, he developed a

422
00:22:50,000 --> 00:22:53,240
Speaker 2: suitably annoying manner of speaking, explaining it to The New Yorker,

423
00:22:53,600 --> 00:22:56,240
Speaker 2: after three months with the show, I had this cartoon voice.

424
00:22:56,600 --> 00:22:59,720
Speaker 2: It was further proof I was a bad actor. He's

425
00:23:01,119 --> 00:23:05,479
Speaker 2: oh yeah, yeah, I never doubted that. I yeah. His

426
00:23:05,760 --> 00:23:09,360
Speaker 2: iconic gray checked suit was a loaner from The Groundlings

427
00:23:09,400 --> 00:23:12,920
Speaker 2: director and co founder Gary Austen, which Paul simply never

428
00:23:13,040 --> 00:23:17,040
Speaker 2: returned to him. And then someone gave him a child's

429
00:23:17,080 --> 00:23:20,760
Speaker 2: black bow tie, which he swapped for a red bow tie,

430
00:23:21,720 --> 00:23:24,320
Speaker 2: and he says, the white shoes were mine. That's just

431
00:23:24,359 --> 00:23:26,080
Speaker 2: sort of what I put on, and I had success

432
00:23:26,080 --> 00:23:27,840
Speaker 2: with it, so I thought, why mess with it if

433
00:23:27,880 --> 00:23:30,200
Speaker 2: it ain't broke. The fact that the suit was several

434
00:23:30,240 --> 00:23:33,960
Speaker 2: sizes too small became part of the look. But Paul's grandmother,

435
00:23:34,040 --> 00:23:36,439
Speaker 2: of all people, was not a fan. First time she

436
00:23:36,480 --> 00:23:38,520
Speaker 2: saw Paul during one of his many appearances on The

437
00:23:38,560 --> 00:23:41,480
Speaker 2: Dave Letterman Show, she called Paul's mom and said, I

438
00:23:41,480 --> 00:23:43,159
Speaker 2: don't care what you say. I'm going to buy that

439
00:23:43,160 --> 00:23:45,080
Speaker 2: boy a suit that fits him. I don't want to

440
00:23:45,080 --> 00:23:46,760
Speaker 2: see him again on I don't want to see him

441
00:23:46,800 --> 00:23:49,560
Speaker 2: on television again in a suit that doesn't fit him.

442
00:23:50,400 --> 00:23:53,399
Speaker 1: It was difficult for him to keep in the suit.

443
00:23:53,520 --> 00:23:56,560
Speaker 2: And I watching the clips of the movie, I think

444
00:23:56,600 --> 00:23:58,719
Speaker 2: it's so funny that he goes to weigh himself and

445
00:23:58,760 --> 00:24:01,480
Speaker 2: he comes in at ninety eight eight, the archetypal ninety

446
00:24:01,520 --> 00:24:02,320
Speaker 2: eight pound weekling.

447
00:24:02,640 --> 00:24:05,840
Speaker 1: Right, Oh my god, I never put that together. That's

448
00:24:05,880 --> 00:24:10,000
Speaker 1: the Charles Atlas like back of the magazine. Yeah yeah, yeah,

449
00:24:10,280 --> 00:24:14,159
Speaker 1: and sand kicked his face absolutely. A number of people

450
00:24:14,320 --> 00:24:16,840
Speaker 1: said that this wasn't difficult for him though, keeping that

451
00:24:16,960 --> 00:24:20,200
Speaker 1: it keeping at weight, and the nineteen eighty seven Rolling

452
00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:23,320
Speaker 1: Stone profile talks about a good number of people who

453
00:24:23,560 --> 00:24:27,520
Speaker 1: mentioned how hot he was out of pee Weee and

454
00:24:27,520 --> 00:24:28,560
Speaker 1: that he had a great body.

455
00:24:29,359 --> 00:24:34,159
Speaker 3: Weird, yeah, especially when like he's yeah, what's everybody's in.

456
00:24:34,520 --> 00:24:37,160
Speaker 3: Let's let's take a question. Let's take an audience participation.

457
00:24:37,600 --> 00:24:39,040
Speaker 3: What age is pee Wee?

458
00:24:39,760 --> 00:24:42,119
Speaker 1: That is okay, we go. We gotta talk about this,

459
00:24:42,200 --> 00:24:45,680
Speaker 1: because he was very vague when asked about this or

460
00:24:45,680 --> 00:24:48,160
Speaker 1: when speaking about this. Rather an ew in two thousand

461
00:24:48,160 --> 00:24:51,640
Speaker 1: and six, he said to me, there's a conceptual aspect

462
00:24:51,640 --> 00:24:54,760
Speaker 1: to pee Wee. If you thought pee Wee was a kid, fine.

463
00:24:55,240 --> 00:24:57,320
Speaker 1: If you thought Peewee was a man who was trying

464
00:24:57,320 --> 00:24:59,840
Speaker 1: to be a kid, great. If you thought pee Wee

465
00:25:00,320 --> 00:25:04,760
Speaker 1: was developmentally challenged, fine, whatever. But he would also add

466
00:25:04,800 --> 00:25:07,000
Speaker 1: in an interview with Rolling Stone, when I look at

467
00:25:07,040 --> 00:25:09,640
Speaker 1: some of what I do, I go boy, a therapist

468
00:25:09,680 --> 00:25:13,280
Speaker 1: would have a field day, and then laughed a lot. Yeah,

469
00:25:13,720 --> 00:25:15,480
Speaker 1: what do you think. I don't know.

470
00:25:15,560 --> 00:25:17,240
Speaker 2: I mean, it does seem to exist in this like

471
00:25:17,280 --> 00:25:22,120
Speaker 2: heightened childhood world, but like everybody's an adult.

472
00:25:22,240 --> 00:25:23,800
Speaker 1: The concept of a job is.

473
00:25:23,680 --> 00:25:27,800
Speaker 2: Not alien to him, but he doesn't have one. The

474
00:25:27,880 --> 00:25:31,000
Speaker 2: rich kid that his nemesis is like a like a

475
00:25:31,119 --> 00:25:35,040
Speaker 2: middle aged fat guy, but sweet sweet dottie, like he

476
00:25:35,119 --> 00:25:41,440
Speaker 2: recognizes what like romantic lust is not like confusing to him? Right,

477
00:25:42,760 --> 00:25:44,280
Speaker 2: what are we to make of this? This is like

478
00:25:44,320 --> 00:25:47,000
Speaker 2: the Orson Wells voice. What do we make of this?

479
00:25:47,240 --> 00:25:53,439
Speaker 2: Pee wee Hermann see a man? Uh?

480
00:25:55,040 --> 00:25:56,040
Speaker 1: But what of the name.

481
00:25:56,720 --> 00:25:59,040
Speaker 2: Rubens told Rolling Stone in twenty sixteen that it was

482
00:25:59,080 --> 00:26:02,199
Speaker 2: born of two childs memories. The name Herman came from

483
00:26:02,240 --> 00:26:04,159
Speaker 2: a kid I knew who was kind of off the wall.

484
00:26:04,400 --> 00:26:06,479
Speaker 2: The name pee Wee came from a little harmonic I

485
00:26:06,520 --> 00:26:08,800
Speaker 2: had that said pee wee on it. I loved the

486
00:26:08,840 --> 00:26:10,800
Speaker 2: idea of a nickname because it sounded so real to me.

487
00:26:11,280 --> 00:26:13,719
Speaker 2: Pe Wee Herman sounds like a name that is so odd.

488
00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:15,680
Speaker 2: How would you make that up? If you were going

489
00:26:15,720 --> 00:26:17,680
Speaker 2: to make up a name, you'd make up a better name.

490
00:26:18,040 --> 00:26:20,600
Speaker 2: It seemed real to me. It was a nickname with

491
00:26:20,640 --> 00:26:22,840
Speaker 2: a last name that's also a first name, and it

492
00:26:22,880 --> 00:26:24,680
Speaker 2: went hand in hand with what I wanted to do,

493
00:26:25,080 --> 00:26:26,639
Speaker 2: which was to make people think that this was a

494
00:26:26,680 --> 00:26:28,119
Speaker 2: real person, not an actor.

495
00:26:28,480 --> 00:26:30,639
Speaker 1: And we'll talk of the next episode about the great

496
00:26:30,720 --> 00:26:33,480
Speaker 1: length that Paul Rubins went to preserve the illusion that

497
00:26:33,520 --> 00:26:36,879
Speaker 1: Pee Wee Herman was a real person, and it got

498
00:26:37,080 --> 00:26:41,760
Speaker 1: pretty obsessive. I mean, it transcended performance art into something

499
00:26:41,800 --> 00:26:44,600
Speaker 1: that almost seems unhealthy in my opinion.

500
00:26:45,800 --> 00:26:50,679
Speaker 2: I mean, you know, this next bit really socks that

501
00:26:50,800 --> 00:26:53,280
Speaker 2: to him, right, like the fact that you could in

502
00:26:53,359 --> 00:26:55,680
Speaker 2: nineteen seventy nine. Well, okay, let me getting ahead of

503
00:26:55,720 --> 00:26:58,679
Speaker 2: himself for all the bar trivia points. The character of

504
00:26:58,760 --> 00:27:02,080
Speaker 2: Pee Wee Herman actually debuted on The Dating Game in

505
00:27:02,200 --> 00:27:07,360
Speaker 2: nineteen seventy nine, the first of his three appearances as

506
00:27:07,480 --> 00:27:11,080
Speaker 2: Pee Wee, not Paul Rubins. He told Interview magazine later

507
00:27:11,200 --> 00:27:13,120
Speaker 2: that was a little test experiment that I was doing

508
00:27:13,160 --> 00:27:15,480
Speaker 2: early on. I went to a cattle call audition for

509
00:27:15,520 --> 00:27:17,600
Speaker 2: The Dating Game, and before I even got home, they

510
00:27:17,640 --> 00:27:20,480
Speaker 2: called me back. And despite going on the show as

511
00:27:20,560 --> 00:27:24,040
Speaker 2: Pee Wee, he won one of the three times, I

512
00:27:24,080 --> 00:27:26,680
Speaker 2: should say one of the three times, not a defending champ.

513
00:27:27,280 --> 00:27:30,120
Speaker 1: Those are the Ken Jennings of the dating game.

514
00:27:30,760 --> 00:27:33,080
Speaker 2: Dating Game was a weirdly easy paycheck for like one

515
00:27:33,119 --> 00:27:35,480
Speaker 2: of the actors. In the sixties and seventies, you could

516
00:27:35,480 --> 00:27:42,440
Speaker 2: see people like Steve Martin, Tom Selleck, John Ritter, Arnold Schwarzenegger,

517
00:27:42,680 --> 00:27:47,560
Speaker 2: Bob Sagett, Michael Richards, Brian Cranston, George Foreman also and

518
00:27:47,560 --> 00:27:50,880
Speaker 2: Andy Kaufman appears. This is all through the sixties and seventies.

519
00:27:51,080 --> 00:27:55,080
Speaker 2: Andy Kaufman also appears in character under the name Baji

520
00:27:55,280 --> 00:27:59,040
Speaker 2: Kimren God. He truly got no shortage of mileage out

521
00:27:59,040 --> 00:28:01,480
Speaker 2: of what if a guy wasn't from the United.

522
00:28:01,119 --> 00:28:02,080
Speaker 1: States, didn't hear?

523
00:28:03,960 --> 00:28:07,159
Speaker 2: Paul phil Harmon was also on there Farah Fawcett and

524
00:28:07,200 --> 00:28:13,720
Speaker 2: Suzanne Summers Wacky time, Wacky wacky time in Hollywood. As

525
00:28:13,760 --> 00:28:16,199
Speaker 2: you meditate on that, We'll be right back with more

526
00:28:16,240 --> 00:28:29,200
Speaker 2: too much information. After these messages, Pee Wee makes the

527
00:28:29,280 --> 00:28:30,840
Speaker 2: jump from the small screen to the big screen in

528
00:28:30,840 --> 00:28:34,560
Speaker 2: the eighties with Cheech and Chong's Next movie, in which

529
00:28:34,600 --> 00:28:37,200
Speaker 2: he plays a rude hotel clerk who swears at the

530
00:28:37,200 --> 00:28:39,680
Speaker 2: police and ends up getting arrested, But in.

531
00:28:39,640 --> 00:28:41,520
Speaker 1: The midst of the movie he does a turn in

532
00:28:41,760 --> 00:28:46,400
Speaker 1: character as a failing comedian who is essentially pee Wee Herman. Now,

533
00:28:46,480 --> 00:28:48,880
Speaker 1: I haven't seen this movie, so I'm unclear if it's

534
00:28:48,880 --> 00:28:52,080
Speaker 1: meant to be two different characters, this rude hotel clerk

535
00:28:52,360 --> 00:28:55,000
Speaker 1: and this failing comedian. I don't know. I'm confused. But

536
00:28:55,280 --> 00:28:57,840
Speaker 1: the stand up comes on stage, it introduces himself as

537
00:28:57,880 --> 00:28:58,400
Speaker 1: pee Wee.

538
00:28:58,440 --> 00:29:01,640
Speaker 2: So Rubens made other non pee Wee appearances during this time,

539
00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:04,560
Speaker 2: including a small part as a waiter in The Blues Brothers,

540
00:29:04,880 --> 00:29:08,880
Speaker 2: another bit part in Meatballs Too. An appearances Dickey Nimmits

541
00:29:09,800 --> 00:29:11,920
Speaker 2: in a nineteen eighty one episode of morec and Mindy.

542
00:29:12,480 --> 00:29:14,280
Speaker 1: I just wanted to get you to say Dicky Nimmtz

543
00:29:14,280 --> 00:29:18,080
Speaker 1: and sorry in the Orson Wells voice. Yeah, Dickey, one

544
00:29:18,120 --> 00:29:23,840
Speaker 1: of this Dicky Nimmts. He was also a prolific voice

545
00:29:23,880 --> 00:29:24,680
Speaker 1: actor around this time.

546
00:29:24,720 --> 00:29:28,880
Speaker 2: He did provided the voice of Freaky Frankenstone on the

547
00:29:28,920 --> 00:29:30,640
Speaker 2: Flintstones Comedy Show spinoff.

548
00:29:31,760 --> 00:29:34,080
Speaker 1: He did the voice of a robot called Rex the

549
00:29:34,120 --> 00:29:35,200
Speaker 1: Star Tours.

550
00:29:35,040 --> 00:29:37,520
Speaker 2: Ride and Disney Lamb the voice of the Robotics spaceship

551
00:29:37,520 --> 00:29:39,760
Speaker 2: Commander Max in the nineteen eighty six Disney live action

552
00:29:39,840 --> 00:29:41,520
Speaker 2: movie The Flight of the Navigator.

553
00:29:42,000 --> 00:29:44,440
Speaker 1: Do you remember that movie? I know, but I know,

554
00:29:44,520 --> 00:29:47,120
Speaker 1: it's like a cult hit. It's a good movie. You

555
00:29:47,160 --> 00:29:49,240
Speaker 1: would like like it now. I feel like I.

556
00:29:49,320 --> 00:29:51,680
Speaker 2: Watched All of Ice Pirates at a bar once. That's

557
00:29:51,720 --> 00:29:52,840
Speaker 2: a great movie. You ever see that?

558
00:29:53,480 --> 00:29:57,200
Speaker 1: No? Really weird? Really really weird? Is that a Disney movie?

559
00:29:57,440 --> 00:30:00,680
Speaker 2: No, it was like a Star Wars attempted Star Wars knockoff.

560
00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:05,080
Speaker 2: Cash in Peewee. Herman received a boost following Paul's biggest

561
00:30:05,120 --> 00:30:09,160
Speaker 2: professional failure to date, which is a nice silver lining.

562
00:30:09,520 --> 00:30:12,400
Speaker 2: On nineteen eighty, he had Rubens auditioned for a spot

563
00:30:12,680 --> 00:30:18,040
Speaker 2: on Saturday Night Live, intimidated hilariously from the moment that

564
00:30:18,080 --> 00:30:20,760
Speaker 2: he walked into the room and saw Gilbert Godfried.

565
00:30:22,960 --> 00:30:24,040
Speaker 1: Who among us.

566
00:30:24,400 --> 00:30:26,959
Speaker 2: I'm just you know that bitten walkhard where he's like

567
00:30:27,000 --> 00:30:30,040
Speaker 2: watching the Big Bopper from the Wings and he's like, Hello,

568
00:30:30,880 --> 00:30:33,480
Speaker 2: this is the Big Baba calling and they just cut

569
00:30:33,520 --> 00:30:34,720
Speaker 2: to do caught.

570
00:30:35,080 --> 00:30:36,440
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, how are we gonna follow that?

571
00:30:36,760 --> 00:30:41,320
Speaker 2: Like you imagine walking and Gilbert Godfreed's doing that obnoxious

572
00:30:41,400 --> 00:30:43,520
Speaker 2: voice and you're like, they already got a voice.

573
00:30:43,520 --> 00:30:49,280
Speaker 1: Sky, I'm camp I'm screwed pretty much what he said.

574
00:30:49,760 --> 00:30:51,880
Speaker 2: Yas he later told Hew, I walked in the room,

575
00:30:51,960 --> 00:30:54,120
Speaker 2: saw him and said, it's not going to be. Both

576
00:30:54,160 --> 00:30:57,040
Speaker 2: of us were the same type of performer. I knew

577
00:30:57,080 --> 00:30:59,240
Speaker 2: that I wasn't going to get it, But by his

578
00:30:59,240 --> 00:31:02,480
Speaker 2: own account, the went pretty well. He told Paper Magazine,

579
00:31:02,560 --> 00:31:04,920
Speaker 2: the producers were pulling me aside, going you should get

580
00:31:04,960 --> 00:31:08,280
Speaker 2: an apartment right away. You're definitely in, and I didn't

581
00:31:08,280 --> 00:31:11,000
Speaker 2: get it. I left there so devastated and freaked out

582
00:31:11,040 --> 00:31:12,440
Speaker 2: that I was going to go from an up and

583
00:31:12,480 --> 00:31:15,680
Speaker 2: comer to a never been. He also told the San

584
00:31:15,680 --> 00:31:18,800
Speaker 2: Francisco Chronicle that he believed the quote fix was in

585
00:31:19,240 --> 00:31:22,640
Speaker 2: because Gottfried was friends with one of the producers, but

586
00:31:23,000 --> 00:31:27,080
Speaker 2: in hindsight, Reubins dodged a bullet. Nineteen eighty was the

587
00:31:27,120 --> 00:31:30,600
Speaker 2: year that SNL creator and executive producer Lorne Michaels temporarily

588
00:31:30,680 --> 00:31:33,040
Speaker 2: quit the show, which was then placed in the hands

589
00:31:33,040 --> 00:31:36,880
Speaker 2: of producer Gene Dumanian. She oversaw what is widely agreed

590
00:31:36,920 --> 00:31:39,600
Speaker 2: to be the least funny stretch of the show's history,

591
00:31:40,120 --> 00:31:44,520
Speaker 2: and she was promptly fired mid season. An Isn't supposedly

592
00:31:44,560 --> 00:31:47,440
Speaker 2: spurred on after cast member Charles Rockett dropped an F

593
00:31:47,480 --> 00:31:49,520
Speaker 2: bomb live on the air in a who Shot Jr.

594
00:31:49,560 --> 00:31:49,960
Speaker 1: Parody.

595
00:31:50,880 --> 00:31:52,880
Speaker 2: The network proceeded to use that as an excuse to

596
00:31:52,920 --> 00:31:56,760
Speaker 2: clean house, firing both Domanian and the entire cast save

597
00:31:56,800 --> 00:32:02,280
Speaker 2: for Eddie Murphy and Joe Piscoppo. Ah, Joe Piscopo, Whither

598
00:32:02,520 --> 00:32:07,160
Speaker 2: Joe Piscophoe? So Gilbert's SNL career was over after just

599
00:32:07,360 --> 00:32:10,280
Speaker 2: twelve episodes. Paul Rubins avoided this fate, but he was

600
00:32:10,280 --> 00:32:13,320
Speaker 2: still pretty bummed about getting passed over at SNL.

601
00:32:13,480 --> 00:32:18,120
Speaker 1: So, showing unusual verve and self determination, Paul decided to

602
00:32:18,120 --> 00:32:20,680
Speaker 1: stage his own show to act as a vehicle for

603
00:32:20,720 --> 00:32:24,280
Speaker 1: his Peewee Herman character. He would recall, I remember being

604
00:32:24,280 --> 00:32:27,320
Speaker 1: in a payphone at LAX, calling my parents and saying

605
00:32:27,560 --> 00:32:29,520
Speaker 1: I need to borrow some money. I'm going to produce

606
00:32:29,520 --> 00:32:32,720
Speaker 1: a show. They loaned me three thousand dollars, which turned

607
00:32:32,720 --> 00:32:34,840
Speaker 1: into five thousand dollars, and about a week and a

608
00:32:34,840 --> 00:32:37,600
Speaker 1: half later, I had twenty to thirty people working for

609
00:32:37,680 --> 00:32:41,400
Speaker 1: free and we wrote The Pewee Herman Show. He launched

610
00:32:41,400 --> 00:32:44,520
Speaker 1: the show at the Groundlings Theater on February seventh, nineteen

611
00:32:44,560 --> 00:32:47,560
Speaker 1: eighty one, and premiering at midnight. It became the group's

612
00:32:47,640 --> 00:32:51,880
Speaker 1: first alternative theater piece. The warm reception led to it

613
00:32:51,960 --> 00:32:54,640
Speaker 1: being moved to the bigger and more prestigious ROXY Theater

614
00:32:54,720 --> 00:32:58,240
Speaker 1: on the Sunset Strip, where it ran for five very

615
00:32:58,240 --> 00:33:01,760
Speaker 1: successful months. Now the State Show is a reputation of

616
00:33:01,800 --> 00:33:03,680
Speaker 1: being a little more risque than the Pee Wee we

617
00:33:03,760 --> 00:33:06,400
Speaker 1: know and love, and there are bits like I think

618
00:33:06,400 --> 00:33:09,560
Speaker 1: there's a bit of him fixing mirrors to his wingtip

619
00:33:09,640 --> 00:33:12,560
Speaker 1: shoes to use to look up girls' skirts and things

620
00:33:12,640 --> 00:33:15,959
Speaker 1: like that. But there are also mattinee shows for kids

621
00:33:16,000 --> 00:33:18,200
Speaker 1: in addition to the late night showings for adults, so

622
00:33:18,720 --> 00:33:23,400
Speaker 1: it was not that far off from the playhouse. The

623
00:33:23,400 --> 00:33:26,240
Speaker 1: show gained the attention of executives at a very new

624
00:33:26,320 --> 00:33:29,960
Speaker 1: network called HBO, who filmed one of the Roxy performances

625
00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:33,960
Speaker 1: for an early special, which brought him nationwide exposure, as

626
00:33:34,040 --> 00:33:36,920
Speaker 1: did a number of guest spots on the David Letterman Show.

627
00:33:37,320 --> 00:33:40,320
Speaker 1: Letterman was always a friend who freaks with alter egos

628
00:33:40,720 --> 00:33:43,200
Speaker 1: again see Andy Coffin. That's where he had his famous

629
00:33:43,200 --> 00:33:47,320
Speaker 1: face off with wrestler Jerry Lawler and the character actor

630
00:33:47,800 --> 00:33:51,120
Speaker 1: DeForest Calvert I think his name played the character Bud

631
00:33:51,160 --> 00:33:54,600
Speaker 1: Melman was a very frequent guest on early Letterman shows.

632
00:33:55,000 --> 00:33:58,880
Speaker 1: No Nope, Yeka, Who's the other. Why DeForest took your

633
00:33:58,920 --> 00:34:03,640
Speaker 1: popular name DeForest? Kelly, Yeah, Bones McCoy on Star Trek.

634
00:34:04,440 --> 00:34:08,480
Speaker 2: There's a lot of defensive lineman right now named DeForest.

635
00:34:08,480 --> 00:34:12,640
Speaker 1: Buckner, I got it backwards. It was Calvert DeForest played

636
00:34:12,640 --> 00:34:13,280
Speaker 1: Bud Melman.

637
00:34:13,360 --> 00:34:16,520
Speaker 2: Alright, you just spoiled my whole bit. The four guys

638
00:34:16,600 --> 00:34:20,080
Speaker 2: named DeForest, Hugh.

639
00:34:21,560 --> 00:34:22,239
Speaker 1: A tight five.

640
00:34:22,360 --> 00:34:27,799
Speaker 2: Onest, we've got any DeForests in here? This guy, this

641
00:34:27,840 --> 00:34:31,359
Speaker 2: guy's DeForest. You'll get that one on the way home.

642
00:34:35,360 --> 00:34:37,880
Speaker 1: The Pee Wee Herman Show introduced many of the characters

643
00:34:37,880 --> 00:34:40,840
Speaker 1: who had become familiar to fans of Peewee's Playhouse, including

644
00:34:40,880 --> 00:34:48,879
Speaker 1: Miss Vaughn, Captain Carl, Jambie Terry, and Clokey who could

645
00:34:48,880 --> 00:34:54,280
Speaker 1: forget Clokey, Sweet Sweet Deer Clocky. Most of these characters

646
00:34:54,280 --> 00:34:58,200
Speaker 1: were played by Paul's growdling friends. Miss Yvaughn, famous to

647
00:34:58,440 --> 00:35:01,360
Speaker 1: fers as the most beautiful woman and puppet Land, was

648
00:35:01,400 --> 00:35:04,440
Speaker 1: played by Lynn Maurice Stewart, who based her performance on

649
00:35:04,480 --> 00:35:08,160
Speaker 1: an early love of Sandra Die and Marilyn Monroe, just

650
00:35:08,280 --> 00:35:12,120
Speaker 1: adding the supersized dose of kitsch in this episode, and

651
00:35:12,320 --> 00:35:15,560
Speaker 1: Jambie the Genie was played by John Parragon, who we

652
00:35:15,600 --> 00:35:19,400
Speaker 1: mentioned earlier, whose trademark I can never say this machalka

653
00:35:19,440 --> 00:35:23,880
Speaker 1: high macha chant dates back to his days as a groundling.

654
00:35:24,160 --> 00:35:29,480
Speaker 1: Was that one also racist? Yeah? He said on the

655
00:35:29,520 --> 00:35:32,239
Speaker 1: special features for Pee Wee's Big Adventure, we were doing

656
00:35:32,280 --> 00:35:34,719
Speaker 1: a sketch at the Groundlings and it was customers in

657
00:35:34,719 --> 00:35:37,400
Speaker 1: a Hawaiian restaurant, and I'm wearing a Hawaiian shirt and

658
00:35:37,400 --> 00:35:40,560
Speaker 1: doing Hawaiian gibberish. So that's where that came from. It

659
00:35:40,600 --> 00:35:44,880
Speaker 1: was supposed to be bad Hawaiian And in our second

660
00:35:44,960 --> 00:35:49,200
Speaker 1: Frank Zappa reference in three episodes. John Peregon would later

661
00:35:49,239 --> 00:35:51,600
Speaker 1: say the heiny part of the chant came from listening

662
00:35:51,640 --> 00:35:55,399
Speaker 1: to Frank Zappa records, where it features prominently. It's such

663
00:35:55,440 --> 00:36:00,520
Speaker 1: a funny word, he added, Heigel, your thoughts, all of that,

664
00:36:01,239 --> 00:36:07,799
Speaker 1: everything you just said, made me so mad. The name

665
00:36:07,880 --> 00:36:11,840
Speaker 1: Jambi supposedly came from a favorite sandwich shop on Hollywood Boulevard.

666
00:36:11,880 --> 00:36:18,000
Speaker 1: Do you like Frank's Appa? No? Yeah, no, yeah. I

667
00:36:18,000 --> 00:36:21,400
Speaker 1: I allowed me to quote what you said when your

668
00:36:21,440 --> 00:36:24,759
Speaker 1: reference frank' Zappa on our last episode. There's nothing wrong

669
00:36:24,800 --> 00:36:27,960
Speaker 1: with a little Frank Zappa, but there's a lot wrong

670
00:36:28,040 --> 00:36:29,440
Speaker 1: with a lot of Frank Zappa.

671
00:36:30,360 --> 00:36:33,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, all this scatological stuff just that's completely lost me.

672
00:36:34,040 --> 00:36:37,120
Speaker 2: There's so much like the only the only time I've

673
00:36:37,160 --> 00:36:41,640
Speaker 2: ever found him funny is actually Camerario Brio gee Woo camel.

674
00:36:41,920 --> 00:36:46,799
Speaker 1: Bo uh boom boom boom boom.

675
00:36:46,840 --> 00:36:49,279
Speaker 2: But it's just he has this uh this like his

676
00:36:49,400 --> 00:36:53,040
Speaker 2: spoken word, like h pardon. He's like, say, is that

677
00:36:53,080 --> 00:36:56,040
Speaker 2: a Mexican poncho or is that a Sears poncho?

678
00:36:57,440 --> 00:36:58,720
Speaker 1: Hmm?

679
00:36:58,719 --> 00:37:03,160
Speaker 2: No Foolin', Like that's the funniest you ever did to me,

680
00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:05,719
Speaker 2: all the like Pepe poo pooh stuff. I'm like, what

681
00:37:05,920 --> 00:37:07,120
Speaker 2: the f is wrong with you?

682
00:37:07,160 --> 00:37:07,839
Speaker 1: Like, grow up?

683
00:37:07,880 --> 00:37:11,200
Speaker 2: Man, Come on, you can't be like name dropping edgar

684
00:37:11,280 --> 00:37:15,919
Speaker 2: Veres and like your interviews like making heinously difficult polyrhythmic

685
00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:21,120
Speaker 2: and twelve tone music and then be like aha, just

686
00:37:21,239 --> 00:37:23,560
Speaker 2: I mean you can he did, and what the do

687
00:37:23,760 --> 00:37:27,120
Speaker 2: I know? But I'm just like, ah, like Primus, like Jesus,

688
00:37:27,120 --> 00:37:30,080
Speaker 2: it's not embarrassing enough. You guys play funk rock like

689
00:37:30,120 --> 00:37:32,960
Speaker 2: you have to be into you know, like.

690
00:37:34,719 --> 00:37:46,760
Speaker 1: One Ona's Big Brown Beaver idiots. I hate everything. Well,

691
00:37:46,840 --> 00:37:50,759
Speaker 1: here's another band you probably don't like. Tool. Tool have

692
00:37:50,800 --> 00:37:53,839
Speaker 1: a song named in honor of Jambi the genie, and

693
00:37:53,960 --> 00:37:58,839
Speaker 1: they would just what I'll say to that? Well, as

694
00:37:58,880 --> 00:38:01,239
Speaker 1: a palate cleanser, we have to talk about the true

695
00:38:01,280 --> 00:38:04,960
Speaker 1: MVP of pe Wee Herman's development, my beloved Phil Hartmon.

696
00:38:05,040 --> 00:38:07,440
Speaker 1: I love Phil Harmon. I'm what right thinking person doesn't

697
00:38:07,480 --> 00:38:09,920
Speaker 1: love Phil Hartman. In addition to playing the part of

698
00:38:09,960 --> 00:38:13,440
Speaker 1: the gruff Captain Carl and I believe also Monsieur Lacroc

699
00:38:13,640 --> 00:38:16,680
Speaker 1: in The Pee Herman Show the HBO special, Phil Harmon

700
00:38:16,760 --> 00:38:19,520
Speaker 1: also played a major role in developing the character and

701
00:38:19,560 --> 00:38:22,920
Speaker 1: co writing many of the sketches and ultimately the Peewee's

702
00:38:22,920 --> 00:38:26,280
Speaker 1: Big Adventure movie. Phil Hartman and Paul Rubin's first cross

703
00:38:26,320 --> 00:38:29,800
Speaker 1: paths at the Groundlings Theater, where Phil was the undisputed star.

704
00:38:30,680 --> 00:38:32,520
Speaker 1: I think I mentioned this in it must have been

705
00:38:32,520 --> 00:38:35,160
Speaker 1: the Brave Little Toaster episode. But prior to Phil's career

706
00:38:35,160 --> 00:38:38,600
Speaker 1: in comedy, he worked as a graphic designer, producing album

707
00:38:38,640 --> 00:38:41,759
Speaker 1: covers for seventies sort of Laurel Canyon centric bands like

708
00:38:41,840 --> 00:38:46,120
Speaker 1: America and Poco. They also designed the logo for Crosby,

709
00:38:46,160 --> 00:38:50,920
Speaker 1: Stills and Nash So very talented man Corn an interview

710
00:38:50,960 --> 00:38:53,440
Speaker 1: given years later, Paul said that he and Phil Hartman

711
00:38:53,480 --> 00:38:56,000
Speaker 1: teamed up and were going out to rule the world.

712
00:38:56,719 --> 00:38:59,040
Speaker 1: They were thickest thieves. They made appearances together in the

713
00:38:59,080 --> 00:39:01,920
Speaker 1: Cheech and Chong movie, and I would have to assume

714
00:39:01,960 --> 00:39:04,920
Speaker 1: that one got the other a gig on the Dating

715
00:39:04,960 --> 00:39:06,879
Speaker 1: Game because they were both on the Dating Game show

716
00:39:06,960 --> 00:39:10,879
Speaker 1: around the same time. When movie offers came their way

717
00:39:10,960 --> 00:39:13,160
Speaker 1: for a pee Wee's Big Adventure. They collaborated on the

718
00:39:13,160 --> 00:39:16,480
Speaker 1: script and Phil took a small cameo as a reporter

719
00:39:16,560 --> 00:39:19,320
Speaker 1: at the end of the movie, But the film drastically

720
00:39:19,360 --> 00:39:22,359
Speaker 1: altered the course of his life. He was thirty six

721
00:39:22,480 --> 00:39:24,960
Speaker 1: years old and considering quitting acting. He just thought it

722
00:39:25,080 --> 00:39:27,040
Speaker 1: was going to happen for him, but the success of

723
00:39:27,080 --> 00:39:30,600
Speaker 1: Pee Wee's Big Adventure changed his mind. And Paul's also

724
00:39:30,640 --> 00:39:33,000
Speaker 1: said that he's the one who introduced Phil to SNL

725
00:39:33,040 --> 00:39:36,799
Speaker 1: producer Lauren Michaels when he as Peewee was hosting the

726
00:39:36,840 --> 00:39:39,880
Speaker 1: show in nineteen eighty five, thus paving the way for

727
00:39:39,880 --> 00:39:43,000
Speaker 1: Phil's lengthy career. The following year in nineteen eighty six,

728
00:39:43,600 --> 00:39:45,560
Speaker 1: and that same year, nineteen eighty six was the first

729
00:39:45,560 --> 00:39:48,360
Speaker 1: season at Pee Wee's Playhouse in which Hartman reprised his

730
00:39:48,480 --> 00:39:51,160
Speaker 1: role as Captain Carl, but he left the show by

731
00:39:51,160 --> 00:39:54,439
Speaker 1: the second season due to rumored bad blood between him

732
00:39:54,480 --> 00:39:58,399
Speaker 1: and Paul. Now the reasons for this are disputed. It's

733
00:39:58,440 --> 00:40:01,960
Speaker 1: been generally described as a creative disagreement, which could mean

734
00:40:02,040 --> 00:40:04,719
Speaker 1: any number of things. Paul made it sound like Phil

735
00:40:04,760 --> 00:40:07,840
Speaker 1: objected to the all consuming nature of pee Wee Herman,

736
00:40:07,960 --> 00:40:09,719
Speaker 1: you know, the whole idea of making him seem like

737
00:40:09,760 --> 00:40:13,440
Speaker 1: a real person. Paul later said, I'd like the idea

738
00:40:13,480 --> 00:40:16,040
Speaker 1: of becoming pee Wee and letting the public think Pee

739
00:40:16,040 --> 00:40:19,560
Speaker 1: Wee was a real person. Phil was very frustrated by that.

740
00:40:19,960 --> 00:40:23,560
Speaker 1: He thought I was dot dot dot uh dot dot

741
00:40:23,640 --> 00:40:27,920
Speaker 1: dot squandering my talent, as him, speaking to the website Westward,

742
00:40:28,920 --> 00:40:30,960
Speaker 1: he always loved pee Wee Herman, but he used to

743
00:40:30,960 --> 00:40:33,439
Speaker 1: give me a hard time originally about focusing on this

744
00:40:33,800 --> 00:40:36,680
Speaker 1: instead of doing all my other characters. Which makes sense.

745
00:40:36,719 --> 00:40:38,279
Speaker 1: You think of Phil Hartman's career, and he was a

746
00:40:38,320 --> 00:40:42,000
Speaker 1: chameleon he had. I could be wrong, but I think

747
00:40:42,000 --> 00:40:43,719
Speaker 1: for a time he might have held the record for

748
00:40:43,760 --> 00:40:46,520
Speaker 1: the most impressions done on snl H. I think that

749
00:40:46,680 --> 00:40:49,480
Speaker 1: Daryl Hammond beat him, but yeah, I mean he was

750
00:40:49,520 --> 00:40:51,680
Speaker 1: their utility guy for so long, so you can see

751
00:40:51,680 --> 00:40:55,640
Speaker 1: how you know Paul getting roped into doing this one

752
00:40:55,760 --> 00:40:59,359
Speaker 1: character was really anathema to him. However, there are also

753
00:40:59,440 --> 00:41:02,160
Speaker 1: some who believe that Paul felt abandoned when Phil Hartman

754
00:41:02,239 --> 00:41:05,799
Speaker 1: joined SNL, the comedy institution that had turned its back

755
00:41:05,840 --> 00:41:08,200
Speaker 1: on him and directly led him to create pee Wee

756
00:41:08,320 --> 00:41:12,360
Speaker 1: as his own starmaking vehicle. Some felt that this resentment

757
00:41:12,440 --> 00:41:15,200
Speaker 1: was the true cause of their creative split. On the

758
00:41:15,280 --> 00:41:16,880
Speaker 1: other hand, there are some who claimed that Phil was

759
00:41:16,920 --> 00:41:19,720
Speaker 1: resentful for his own reasons, like thinking that he should

760
00:41:19,719 --> 00:41:22,640
Speaker 1: have received more credit for the development of Peewee or

761
00:41:22,680 --> 00:41:25,360
Speaker 1: more money for the script writing for Peewee's Big Adventure.

762
00:41:25,920 --> 00:41:28,719
Speaker 1: Whatever the case, the two didn't speak for years after

763
00:41:28,760 --> 00:41:31,719
Speaker 1: he left pee Wee's Playhouse, but reportedly they were on

764
00:41:31,800 --> 00:41:34,359
Speaker 1: decent terms by the time of Phil's murder in May

765
00:41:34,480 --> 00:41:38,560
Speaker 1: nineteen ninety eight. Paul would later say, I think about

766
00:41:38,560 --> 00:41:43,360
Speaker 1: Phil all the time, Saul of this is a huge bummer.

767
00:41:44,400 --> 00:41:48,000
Speaker 1: It leads us to discussing pee Wee Herman's true breakthrough

768
00:41:48,719 --> 00:41:51,600
Speaker 1: Peewee's Big Adventure. Michael take us there.

769
00:41:51,760 --> 00:41:54,759
Speaker 2: Following the success of the Peewee Herman Show on HBO

770
00:41:55,280 --> 00:41:58,080
Speaker 2: and at gigs across the country, including a sold out

771
00:41:58,080 --> 00:42:01,560
Speaker 2: gig at Carnegie Hall in nineteen eighty four, plus a

772
00:42:01,560 --> 00:42:04,120
Speaker 2: bunch of well received appearances on Letterman the hosting spot

773
00:42:04,160 --> 00:42:06,759
Speaker 2: in US and now Warner Brothers approached Rubens with the

774
00:42:06,760 --> 00:42:09,759
Speaker 2: idea of making a Peewee movie didn't seem like a

775
00:42:09,800 --> 00:42:14,040
Speaker 2: good idea to the rest of the industry, As Rubens

776
00:42:14,040 --> 00:42:15,839
Speaker 2: told the av Club in two thousand and six, when

777
00:42:15,880 --> 00:42:18,160
Speaker 2: we announced we were working on Pee Wee's Big Adventure,

778
00:42:18,280 --> 00:42:20,839
Speaker 2: people said, I don't get it. I don't see how

779
00:42:20,880 --> 00:42:23,560
Speaker 2: it's a movie. It seems like a David Letterman sort

780
00:42:23,560 --> 00:42:28,120
Speaker 2: of thing. I can't tell who. That's a diss on. Yeah,

781
00:42:28,239 --> 00:42:33,279
Speaker 2: I mean not wrong. Yeah, that's true. But nevertheless, they persisted.

782
00:42:33,680 --> 00:42:44,160
Speaker 2: Hashtags are resistance, ah, hashtag Ruth Conda Forever and together

783
00:42:44,200 --> 00:42:48,400
Speaker 2: with Phil Hartman and writer Michael Varhol, which sounds like

784
00:42:48,440 --> 00:42:51,440
Speaker 2: how Dracula would pronounce Andy Warhol's name.

785
00:42:54,560 --> 00:42:57,399
Speaker 1: That's a groundliness. That's so much better than the joke

786
00:42:57,440 --> 00:42:58,000
Speaker 1: I was gonna make.

787
00:42:58,160 --> 00:43:07,239
Speaker 2: That's that's a Groundlings bit. Dracula interviewing Andy Warhol at

788
00:43:07,280 --> 00:43:11,879
Speaker 2: Interview magazine at the Factory, interviewing Dracula go.

789
00:43:12,920 --> 00:43:15,239
Speaker 1: And he's gonna do Dracula doing a screen test at

790
00:43:15,280 --> 00:43:16,680
Speaker 1: the studio or at the factory.

791
00:43:16,880 --> 00:43:19,080
Speaker 2: Oh, but he like doesn't show up because vampires can't

792
00:43:19,120 --> 00:43:22,400
Speaker 2: see their reflections and and and he's like, this is great.

793
00:43:22,719 --> 00:43:24,399
Speaker 1: I need more. I need more.

794
00:43:24,480 --> 00:43:29,880
Speaker 2: He's like, mister Vorhol, I do not understand. Wow, we

795
00:43:29,960 --> 00:43:34,280
Speaker 2: are just killing it today. Just Riffin, just just welcome

796
00:43:34,320 --> 00:43:42,880
Speaker 2: to TMI. All riffs, editions. I can't stop thinking about

797
00:43:43,400 --> 00:43:50,120
Speaker 2: Bela Legosi doing a factory screen test like Heroin addicted

798
00:43:50,680 --> 00:43:53,480
Speaker 2: mid fifties Bella Legosi when he's all checked out doing

799
00:43:53,640 --> 00:43:59,160
Speaker 2: Edwood movies. The original idea was for the film to

800
00:43:59,200 --> 00:44:01,280
Speaker 2: be a remake of the night teen sixty Hayley Mills

801
00:44:01,360 --> 00:44:04,480
Speaker 2: movie Pollyanna, which Rubens once claimed was his favorite film.

802
00:44:05,880 --> 00:44:09,000
Speaker 1: From a factory screen test to Pollyanna in one move

803
00:44:09,560 --> 00:44:11,160
Speaker 1: that is the TMI promise.

804
00:44:12,000 --> 00:44:15,719
Speaker 2: Considering that Pollyanna has become a synonym for naive, saccharine

805
00:44:15,760 --> 00:44:19,080
Speaker 2: and annoying, it does seem like the correct vehicle for Peewee.

806
00:44:19,480 --> 00:44:22,120
Speaker 2: But this idea ultimately fell by the wayside midway through

807
00:44:22,160 --> 00:44:24,520
Speaker 2: the writing, when he noticed that everyone on the Warner

808
00:44:24,560 --> 00:44:27,160
Speaker 2: Brothers lot seemed to have a bike with them. According

809
00:44:27,200 --> 00:44:30,520
Speaker 2: to the version that you heard, Paul asked a studio

810
00:44:30,560 --> 00:44:34,200
Speaker 2: exect when he would get his and he this exac

811
00:44:34,480 --> 00:44:38,800
Speaker 2: responded by presenting Peebe with a garish nineteen fortis Shwin

812
00:44:40,040 --> 00:44:42,239
Speaker 2: not unlike the one scene of the movie, and this

813
00:44:42,719 --> 00:44:46,919
Speaker 2: supposedly gave him the idea for the stolen bike road

814
00:44:46,960 --> 00:44:48,040
Speaker 2: trip plot line.

815
00:44:48,320 --> 00:44:52,000
Speaker 1: We should have used this as a proposed movie, a

816
00:44:52,120 --> 00:44:54,520
Speaker 1: road trip movie for Britney Spears to do instead of

817
00:44:54,520 --> 00:44:58,480
Speaker 1: Crossroads and we're going through our you know, trips. Brittany

818
00:44:58,480 --> 00:44:59,200
Speaker 1: could have acted in.

819
00:45:00,000 --> 00:45:02,160
Speaker 2: You know, she's loopy enough now that you could probably

820
00:45:02,200 --> 00:45:04,759
Speaker 2: pitch her doing Paul like Peewee and she would do

821
00:45:04,800 --> 00:45:06,560
Speaker 2: it on her Instagram for free.

822
00:45:06,680 --> 00:45:11,720
Speaker 1: I feel like she's dressed as Peewe before. Really, yeah,

823
00:45:12,120 --> 00:45:16,439
Speaker 1: I swear I remember seeing this, Okay, not coming up.

824
00:45:17,040 --> 00:45:19,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, that feels like a Mantela effect thing for you.

825
00:45:20,040 --> 00:45:24,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, very uniquely me. Yeah, you don't want to get

826
00:45:24,120 --> 00:45:25,000
Speaker 1: in my head.

827
00:45:25,520 --> 00:45:29,600
Speaker 2: So that idea is itself borrowed from classic cinema, although

828
00:45:29,719 --> 00:45:35,040
Speaker 2: considerably more highbrow influence than Pollyanna. It's been loosely described

829
00:45:35,040 --> 00:45:38,280
Speaker 2: as a parody of the nineteen forty eight Italian cinema

830
00:45:38,600 --> 00:45:42,720
Speaker 2: classic The Bicycle Thief, a film thumbnail I have scrolled

831
00:45:42,719 --> 00:45:45,680
Speaker 2: past so many times on my way to watch Blood

832
00:45:45,680 --> 00:45:46,360
Speaker 2: Sport again?

833
00:45:49,280 --> 00:45:51,360
Speaker 1: Is that the movie that Trump would watch on planes

834
00:45:51,400 --> 00:45:54,160
Speaker 1: and then have Eric fast forward? That is correct?

835
00:45:54,400 --> 00:45:59,959
Speaker 2: Yes, Yes, tremendous film, one of the best. Many people

836
00:46:00,080 --> 00:46:02,799
Speaker 2: were saying it more and more often these days.

837
00:46:05,520 --> 00:46:08,759
Speaker 1: But it's okay. You don't need to You don't need

838
00:46:08,800 --> 00:46:11,600
Speaker 1: to use other people as a crunch in your love

839
00:46:11,600 --> 00:46:14,600
Speaker 1: for blood support. You could just you could just recommend

840
00:46:14,640 --> 00:46:18,560
Speaker 1: it Blood Sports. Oh man, Me and Trump love blood Sport,

841
00:46:18,760 --> 00:46:23,080
Speaker 1: we do. That's really the thing that binds us and

842
00:46:23,160 --> 00:46:25,360
Speaker 1: our love of trucks. Does he love trucks?

843
00:46:25,880 --> 00:46:28,719
Speaker 2: Don't you remember when he was in that the pick

844
00:46:28,760 --> 00:46:31,319
Speaker 2: of him in the big truck, and the quote from

845
00:46:31,800 --> 00:46:35,920
Speaker 2: that was an NPR reporter cited was like the closest

846
00:46:35,960 --> 00:46:39,480
Speaker 2: I've ever felt a Trump in my life. A rally

847
00:46:39,520 --> 00:46:43,399
Speaker 2: in Allentown, PA. By the way, nice trucks. You think

848
00:46:43,440 --> 00:46:45,320
Speaker 2: I could hop into one of them and drive it away.

849
00:46:45,600 --> 00:46:47,759
Speaker 2: I'd love to do it. Just drive the hell out

850
00:46:47,800 --> 00:46:50,160
Speaker 2: of here, Just get the hell out of this. I

851
00:46:50,200 --> 00:46:53,520
Speaker 2: had such a good life, My life was great.

852
00:46:57,239 --> 00:47:01,400
Speaker 1: Wow. Oh wow, that touches me.

853
00:47:02,120 --> 00:47:06,080
Speaker 2: I know right, just get the hell out.

854
00:47:06,120 --> 00:47:10,240
Speaker 1: We all go out anyway.

855
00:47:10,920 --> 00:47:14,120
Speaker 2: There isn't onto Alfred Hitchcock's Vertigo, you see where the

856
00:47:14,160 --> 00:47:17,440
Speaker 2: wheels are seen spinning behind pee Wee's head. It is

857
00:47:17,520 --> 00:47:19,920
Speaker 2: possible that Paul Rubins and the co writers watch a

858
00:47:19,920 --> 00:47:22,279
Speaker 2: bunch of these classic movies for inspiration, since they were,

859
00:47:22,280 --> 00:47:26,360
Speaker 2: by their own admission, complete rookies. Rubens would later confess,

860
00:47:26,640 --> 00:47:28,520
Speaker 2: we didn't really know what we were doing at that point.

861
00:47:28,719 --> 00:47:31,400
Speaker 2: We'd both written stuff, but it was mostly just improvising.

862
00:47:31,640 --> 00:47:34,680
Speaker 2: Sitting down and consciously writing something is very different than improvising.

863
00:47:35,239 --> 00:47:39,359
Speaker 2: To help, they purchase the Screenwriting Bible, appropriately titled Screenplay

864
00:47:39,640 --> 00:47:45,400
Speaker 2: The Foundations of Screenwriting by sid screenwriter Field, and worked

865
00:47:45,440 --> 00:47:48,120
Speaker 2: literally by the book. Paul would say, it's a ninety

866
00:47:48,160 --> 00:47:50,160
Speaker 2: minute film. It's a ninety page script.

867
00:47:51,160 --> 00:47:53,000
Speaker 1: Short. By the way, was screenplays that were like what

868
00:47:53,080 --> 00:48:00,040
Speaker 1: it's supposed to be, like a one, twenty one, one, ten, twenty.

869
00:48:00,200 --> 00:48:03,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, on page thirty, I lose my bike. On page sixty,

870
00:48:03,280 --> 00:48:05,680
Speaker 2: I find it. It's literally exactly what they said to

871
00:48:05,719 --> 00:48:07,760
Speaker 2: do in the book. There should be like a mcguffin

872
00:48:07,880 --> 00:48:10,560
Speaker 2: kind of thing, something you're looking for and I was like, okay,

873
00:48:10,760 --> 00:48:11,400
Speaker 2: my bike.

874
00:48:13,000 --> 00:48:13,280
Speaker 1: Fair.

875
00:48:14,320 --> 00:48:18,399
Speaker 2: The bike in question was built by Pedal Pusher Bike

876
00:48:18,480 --> 00:48:22,840
Speaker 2: Shop of Newport Beach, California. They assembled ten of the

877
00:48:22,920 --> 00:48:25,480
Speaker 2: vintage looking bike to the movie, which they apparently did

878
00:48:25,560 --> 00:48:28,520
Speaker 2: not have much faith in the movie, not the bike.

879
00:48:28,800 --> 00:48:31,440
Speaker 2: They were presented with two options for payment, ten grand

880
00:48:31,440 --> 00:48:34,200
Speaker 2: in cash or slightly less cash and a screen credit.

881
00:48:34,800 --> 00:48:39,600
Speaker 2: They opted for the cash and chose poorly. One of

882
00:48:39,600 --> 00:48:42,440
Speaker 2: these original bikes was put up for auction in twenty fourteen.

883
00:48:42,800 --> 00:48:45,400
Speaker 2: It was expected to sell for fifteen grand, but ultimately

884
00:48:45,400 --> 00:48:49,120
Speaker 2: pulled in thirty six thousand dollars. Another was on display

885
00:48:49,160 --> 00:48:51,880
Speaker 2: at the Carnegie Science Center in Pittsburgh for a time.

886
00:48:52,200 --> 00:48:55,200
Speaker 1: How on up there, it's a great bike. Yeah. The

887
00:48:55,280 --> 00:48:58,640
Speaker 1: reason I first watched this movie was I was never

888
00:48:58,800 --> 00:49:01,439
Speaker 1: a very strong bike rider as a kid. I grew

889
00:49:01,520 --> 00:49:04,360
Speaker 1: up we had a four hundred foot driveway that sloped

890
00:49:04,400 --> 00:49:06,799
Speaker 1: down at a ninety degree angle or sorry, forty five

891
00:49:06,840 --> 00:49:09,600
Speaker 1: degree angle and ended in a twelve foot sheer cliff

892
00:49:09,600 --> 00:49:12,080
Speaker 1: into a lake. And so I didn't really I couldn't

893
00:49:12,080 --> 00:49:14,719
Speaker 1: really ride bikes yeah around my house. So I didn't

894
00:49:14,719 --> 00:49:17,839
Speaker 1: really have anywhere to go, and so I as I

895
00:49:17,920 --> 00:49:20,480
Speaker 1: was like maybe like ten or eleven. I was kind

896
00:49:20,480 --> 00:49:22,480
Speaker 1: of shaky on a bike and one time I was

897
00:49:22,480 --> 00:49:25,520
Speaker 1: at a friend's house and I slammed on the brakes

898
00:49:25,560 --> 00:49:28,319
Speaker 1: and I flew over the handle bar and flew off

899
00:49:28,400 --> 00:49:30,880
Speaker 1: my bike and hurt my arm. And my friend that

900
00:49:31,000 --> 00:49:33,160
Speaker 1: cheer me up wanted to put on Pee Wee's Big

901
00:49:33,200 --> 00:49:36,080
Speaker 1: Adventure because of the scene when he gets on the

902
00:49:36,080 --> 00:49:40,120
Speaker 1: motorcycle and rides off and then goes right through the billboard,

903
00:49:40,400 --> 00:49:42,759
Speaker 1: and I just thought that that reminded him of He said,

904
00:49:42,800 --> 00:49:44,680
Speaker 1: that's exactly what you look like when you fell off

905
00:49:44,680 --> 00:49:49,279
Speaker 1: your bike. So so that was my first time I

906
00:49:49,280 --> 00:49:54,480
Speaker 1: saw Pee Wee's Big Adventure. Great stuff, good, great, great stuff.

907
00:49:55,160 --> 00:49:56,239
Speaker 1: Thank thanks for being here.

908
00:49:56,280 --> 00:49:59,840
Speaker 2: Did you see that that New York Times Review books

909
00:50:00,040 --> 00:50:02,360
Speaker 2: thing that went viral this week on Twitter for someone

910
00:50:02,400 --> 00:50:04,759
Speaker 2: slamming it because it opened with this guy talking about

911
00:50:04,760 --> 00:50:06,600
Speaker 2: when he was in college, And someone was like, if

912
00:50:06,600 --> 00:50:09,919
Speaker 2: you ever open a piece about reminiscing about the time

913
00:50:09,960 --> 00:50:13,360
Speaker 2: you were in college, you owe If your editor doesn't

914
00:50:13,400 --> 00:50:15,640
Speaker 2: tell you it doesn't rip that to shreds.

915
00:50:15,280 --> 00:50:17,560
Speaker 1: You need a new editor. I didn't see that, but

916
00:50:17,640 --> 00:50:22,719
Speaker 1: that's great advice. Yeah, yeah, yeah, We're gonna take a

917
00:50:22,760 --> 00:50:25,120
Speaker 1: quick break, but we'll be right back with more too

918
00:50:25,239 --> 00:50:26,920
Speaker 1: much information in just a moment.

919
00:50:38,400 --> 00:50:40,959
Speaker 2: Peemy's Big Adventures famously the film that gave a twenty

920
00:50:40,960 --> 00:50:44,000
Speaker 2: six year old Tim Burton his big directorial break. Given

921
00:50:44,000 --> 00:50:46,160
Speaker 2: his age and lack of experience, he was a tough

922
00:50:46,200 --> 00:50:48,800
Speaker 2: sell for Warner Brothers execs, who did not have Burton

923
00:50:48,840 --> 00:50:52,080
Speaker 2: on their list of approved directors for the project. In fact,

924
00:50:52,400 --> 00:50:54,960
Speaker 2: he probably had a bad name around Hollywood, considering he'd

925
00:50:54,960 --> 00:50:58,239
Speaker 2: recently been fired by Disney for making Franken Weeney, a

926
00:50:58,480 --> 00:51:03,520
Speaker 2: spooky short film shot in expressionistic movie black and white,

927
00:51:03,520 --> 00:51:08,120
Speaker 2: which tells the story of a young dog sort of

928
00:51:08,200 --> 00:51:10,400
Speaker 2: The Dog Was Young, which tells the story of a

929
00:51:10,440 --> 00:51:13,400
Speaker 2: young man who tries to revive his dog after it

930
00:51:13,480 --> 00:51:16,560
Speaker 2: was run over by a car. You may remember from

931
00:51:16,600 --> 00:51:20,240
Speaker 2: our Beetlejuice episode that Tim Burton matriculated through the ranks

932
00:51:20,239 --> 00:51:25,799
Speaker 2: at the Disney Animation studio trendously talented artist. Didn't he

933
00:51:25,840 --> 00:51:27,239
Speaker 2: write them a letter? Is that someone else?

934
00:51:27,239 --> 00:51:27,880
Speaker 1: I'm confused?

935
00:51:28,000 --> 00:51:30,239
Speaker 2: Fact check that. I don't think that's right now that

936
00:51:30,280 --> 00:51:33,279
Speaker 2: I said it. But point mans is, Tim Burton was

937
00:51:33,360 --> 00:51:35,680
Speaker 2: like a he was Disney apprentice. He worked on like

938
00:51:35,719 --> 00:51:37,960
Speaker 2: Fox and the Hound and stuff. But then he when

939
00:51:38,000 --> 00:51:40,240
Speaker 2: he finally was given off clout and made this dog

940
00:51:40,280 --> 00:51:45,560
Speaker 2: Frankenstein movie starring your beloved Shelley Duvall. Insert super cut

941
00:51:45,560 --> 00:51:49,600
Speaker 2: of her going Hi, I'm Shelley Duvall. Yes, Hello, I'm

942
00:51:49,640 --> 00:51:55,560
Speaker 2: Shelley Duvall. They were horrified and fired him. Spent company

943
00:51:55,600 --> 00:52:01,000
Speaker 2: resources on Your Dead Dog project, but it had its fans,

944
00:52:01,480 --> 00:52:04,800
Speaker 2: at least in Paul Rubin's social circle of Weirdo La comics.

945
00:52:05,239 --> 00:52:08,040
Speaker 2: One night at a party, presumably bemoaning the list of

946
00:52:08,120 --> 00:52:11,360
Speaker 2: approved directors that the studio had furnished him, several people

947
00:52:11,400 --> 00:52:14,600
Speaker 2: recommended the Rubens check out Tim Burton, as he recalled

948
00:52:14,640 --> 00:52:18,920
Speaker 2: to Ain't it Cool News? Whither ain't it Cool News?

949
00:52:19,600 --> 00:52:22,279
Speaker 2: I screened Frankenweenie, and I spoke to Shelley Duvall, who

950
00:52:22,360 --> 00:52:24,840
Speaker 2: was a friend of mine who was in franken Weenie.

951
00:52:25,000 --> 00:52:28,279
Speaker 2: How the did that happen? Oh to be a fly

952
00:52:28,360 --> 00:52:31,200
Speaker 2: on that wall. I knew Tim was the director for

953
00:52:31,320 --> 00:52:34,160
Speaker 2: my film. About fifteen seconds into Franken WHENIY like the

954
00:52:34,160 --> 00:52:36,279
Speaker 2: second or third shot of it, I was looking at

955
00:52:36,280 --> 00:52:38,720
Speaker 2: the wallpaper in this bedroom and the lighting and just going,

956
00:52:39,080 --> 00:52:41,880
Speaker 2: this is the guy who has style and understands art direction.

957
00:52:42,280 --> 00:52:44,760
Speaker 2: Those were two really important things for me and my baby,

958
00:52:44,840 --> 00:52:47,160
Speaker 2: I guess, and you know, it just happened to luckily.

959
00:52:46,920 --> 00:52:48,120
Speaker 1: All work out.

960
00:52:48,840 --> 00:52:51,680
Speaker 2: Paul reportedly refused to even perceive with the film unless

961
00:52:51,680 --> 00:52:56,440
Speaker 2: the studio brought on Tim Burton. Eventually, the studio relented

962
00:52:56,560 --> 00:53:02,319
Speaker 2: sewing the seeds for this man to sense your editorializing,

963
00:53:02,360 --> 00:53:04,919
Speaker 2: this is what happens when I don't read ahead, Jordan wrote.

964
00:53:04,920 --> 00:53:07,600
Speaker 2: Eventually they relented sowing the seeds for this man to

965
00:53:07,680 --> 00:53:10,759
Speaker 2: ruin countless pieces of our childhood with his quirky remakes.

966
00:53:11,400 --> 00:53:14,239
Speaker 2: I don't disagree, but Paul Rubens didn't see it that way.

967
00:53:14,640 --> 00:53:16,680
Speaker 2: It was the biggest piece of luck early on in

968
00:53:16,719 --> 00:53:17,719
Speaker 2: my career I could have had.

969
00:53:17,800 --> 00:53:18,799
Speaker 1: He later said.

970
00:53:19,239 --> 00:53:21,680
Speaker 2: Burton would thank Rubens by casting him in several of

971
00:53:21,719 --> 00:53:24,680
Speaker 2: his future films, including a bit part in Beetlejuice and

972
00:53:24,840 --> 00:53:29,480
Speaker 2: in his Batman Returns film as the penguin's father, mister Cobblepot.

973
00:53:29,520 --> 00:53:33,440
Speaker 2: Also the woman who plays Simone is the mom. It's

974
00:53:33,480 --> 00:53:37,200
Speaker 2: two Peewe's people. Tim Burton brought his quirky eye to

975
00:53:37,239 --> 00:53:40,399
Speaker 2: an already quirky project. Years earlier, he'd seen one hundred

976
00:53:40,400 --> 00:53:43,480
Speaker 2: and fifty foot dinosaur statues part of a roadside attraction

977
00:53:43,560 --> 00:53:47,320
Speaker 2: in the unincorporated California community of Cabizon, and always dreamed

978
00:53:47,320 --> 00:53:49,600
Speaker 2: of putting them into a film. He would have his

979
00:53:49,719 --> 00:53:53,359
Speaker 2: chance while making Pee Wee's Big Adventure and following Ruben's death,

980
00:53:53,440 --> 00:53:55,840
Speaker 2: the t Rex was painted so that it appeared he

981
00:53:55,880 --> 00:53:59,279
Speaker 2: was wearing Pee Wee's iconic suit. Burton also made a

982
00:53:59,280 --> 00:54:01,560
Speaker 2: cameo in Pee's Big Adventure as the thug who all

983
00:54:01,640 --> 00:54:04,880
Speaker 2: costs Peewee just before he enters the Fortune Teller's studio.

984
00:54:05,840 --> 00:54:09,080
Speaker 1: Well, unfortunately, discussing this film means we have to talk

985
00:54:09,120 --> 00:54:12,360
Speaker 1: about one of the most traumatizing figures in millennial movie history,

986
00:54:13,360 --> 00:54:17,440
Speaker 1: Large March. But don't take my word for it. I

987
00:54:17,560 --> 00:54:21,000
Speaker 1: FC lists Large Marge as number five on their list

988
00:54:21,040 --> 00:54:24,160
Speaker 1: of the twenty five scariest moments in non horror movies.

989
00:54:24,680 --> 00:54:27,279
Speaker 1: It was beat by the nicky Santoro in the cornfield

990
00:54:27,320 --> 00:54:31,200
Speaker 1: scene from Casino, the tunnel boat ride scene from Willi Wonka,

991
00:54:31,200 --> 00:54:33,200
Speaker 1: and the Chocolate Factory. That makes a lot of sense

992
00:54:33,280 --> 00:54:37,919
Speaker 1: that there's no way of knowing that'd insane. Yeah, that's

993
00:54:37,920 --> 00:54:40,880
Speaker 1: a very pee Wee herman esque Wanka and Pee Wee

994
00:54:40,960 --> 00:54:42,680
Speaker 1: are it seemed to be cut from the same cloth.

995
00:54:42,800 --> 00:54:45,400
Speaker 2: It does have a chicken being decapitated, though, which is

996
00:54:45,680 --> 00:54:49,120
Speaker 2: further Yeah, any of this these movies ever went.

997
00:54:49,560 --> 00:54:52,320
Speaker 1: And some kind of worm like walking across the woman's lips.

998
00:54:52,600 --> 00:54:56,680
Speaker 1: Oh god, yeah, I hate that. Also the horrific ending

999
00:54:56,760 --> 00:54:59,839
Speaker 1: montage from Rugley in for a Dream. And I think

1000
00:54:59,840 --> 00:55:02,320
Speaker 1: the umber one was the eye slice from the Brunuel

1001
00:55:02,560 --> 00:55:06,920
Speaker 1: Salvado Dali joint Unshian and Delu classic.

1002
00:55:06,600 --> 00:55:09,480
Speaker 2: Eye slice in movie. As you know the hook of

1003
00:55:09,920 --> 00:55:13,080
Speaker 2: the Pixies debaser, Oh slicing of eyeballs.

1004
00:55:13,120 --> 00:55:14,919
Speaker 1: I want you to know this might be our most

1005
00:55:14,960 --> 00:55:19,359
Speaker 1: like reference rich episode ever. Challenge accepted. Yeah, let's let's

1006
00:55:19,360 --> 00:55:22,520
Speaker 1: go for it. So for those of you who have

1007
00:55:22,560 --> 00:55:25,399
Speaker 1: repressed the memory of Large Marge, allow me to give

1008
00:55:25,400 --> 00:55:28,040
Speaker 1: you a little refresher. The scene depicts a hitchhiking Pee

1009
00:55:28,040 --> 00:55:31,120
Speaker 1: Wee getting picked up by a trucker named Large Marge,

1010
00:55:31,320 --> 00:55:33,880
Speaker 1: whose eyes bulge out of her head as she terrifies

1011
00:55:33,920 --> 00:55:37,840
Speaker 1: Pee Wee while telling a story. This eye bulging effect

1012
00:55:37,880 --> 00:55:41,520
Speaker 1: was achieved by the Chyoto Brothers, who are responsible for

1013
00:55:41,600 --> 00:55:44,880
Speaker 1: working out effects in movies like Elf, Team America, World

1014
00:55:44,880 --> 00:55:48,400
Speaker 1: Police and killer Clowns from outer Space. You rude.

1015
00:55:48,920 --> 00:55:52,560
Speaker 2: First of all, it's Kyoto's or kyoto because they're greed.

1016
00:55:53,280 --> 00:55:56,160
Speaker 2: It's like Italian. It's like the Greek Italian pronunciation key

1017
00:55:56,320 --> 00:56:01,799
Speaker 2: key maki bella. Yeah, very incredible. Also the Critters franchise,

1018
00:56:02,680 --> 00:56:06,560
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I'm surprised they didn't do more for this

1019
00:56:06,600 --> 00:56:10,240
Speaker 2: movie actually because they killer Clowns. Not a good movie,

1020
00:56:10,280 --> 00:56:13,920
Speaker 2: but like some truly incredible clowns in the titular roles.

1021
00:56:14,480 --> 00:56:16,560
Speaker 1: They probably didn't do more because they couldn't afford it.

1022
00:56:16,600 --> 00:56:20,480
Speaker 1: Because apparently Tim Burton very nearly cut this scene and

1023
00:56:20,880 --> 00:56:24,080
Speaker 1: when asked why, he said, well, you know, it's a

1024
00:56:24,080 --> 00:56:26,439
Speaker 1: special effect and those are the first things to go.

1025
00:56:26,600 --> 00:56:28,400
Speaker 1: So they probably didn't have a lot of budget to

1026
00:56:28,400 --> 00:56:32,000
Speaker 1: play around with things like this. Although it terrifies me

1027
00:56:32,040 --> 00:56:34,920
Speaker 1: to this day, the large Marge sequence does have a

1028
00:56:34,960 --> 00:56:37,640
Speaker 1: link to two things that are very near and dear

1029
00:56:37,719 --> 00:56:41,600
Speaker 1: to both of our hearts. First, the scene, or at

1030
00:56:41,719 --> 00:56:44,359
Speaker 1: least what follows it after she drops Peee off at

1031
00:56:44,360 --> 00:56:47,000
Speaker 1: a truck stop, is essentially the plot of the nineteen

1032
00:56:47,080 --> 00:56:51,560
Speaker 1: sixty seven country song Phantom thirty nine by Red Soovene,

1033
00:56:52,160 --> 00:56:55,799
Speaker 1: which was later reworked by your beloved Tom Waits as

1034
00:56:55,880 --> 00:56:58,360
Speaker 1: Big Joe and Phantom three to Zho nine on his

1035
00:56:58,440 --> 00:57:01,160
Speaker 1: nineteen seventy five album night Hawks at the Diner.

1036
00:57:01,480 --> 00:57:05,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's the faux live one booking word. Oh yeah, no,

1037
00:57:05,719 --> 00:57:08,120
Speaker 2: it's it's it's it's it's not. I mean, it's not

1038
00:57:08,200 --> 00:57:10,719
Speaker 2: my it's not one of my favorites. But it does

1039
00:57:10,760 --> 00:57:18,160
Speaker 2: have some great Tom one liners. Mind yes, actually immediately

1040
00:57:18,200 --> 00:57:20,280
Speaker 2: I'm so damn Horne at the crack of Dawn Better

1041
00:57:20,360 --> 00:57:25,400
Speaker 2: watch Itself around Me is a great one. Uh has

1042
00:57:25,520 --> 00:57:28,400
Speaker 2: warm Beer and cold Women, which is just a punchline

1043
00:57:28,400 --> 00:57:34,320
Speaker 2: by itself, but like also a great song. Yeah, great record,

1044
00:57:34,400 --> 00:57:35,200
Speaker 2: Nighthawks the Diner.

1045
00:57:35,280 --> 00:57:36,880
Speaker 1: Check it out. So we go Tom Waits, and we

1046
00:57:36,920 --> 00:57:41,000
Speaker 1: also have my beloved Michael Kine large marg You'll notice

1047
00:57:41,000 --> 00:57:44,640
Speaker 1: as she's telling a story to Pewee never blinks, much

1048
00:57:44,720 --> 00:57:47,560
Speaker 1: like Michael Kine, who doesn't believe in blinking when he's

1049
00:57:47,560 --> 00:57:49,880
Speaker 1: acting because it weakens him. Because it weakens him.

1050
00:57:50,160 --> 00:57:53,040
Speaker 2: I assume that I assume that her hair was a

1051
00:57:53,080 --> 00:57:57,120
Speaker 2: nod to Elsa Lancaster and or Lanchester and Brida Frankenstein.

1052
00:57:57,200 --> 00:58:00,840
Speaker 2: She has at swept Bufont kind of situation.

1053
00:58:01,600 --> 00:58:06,560
Speaker 1: M Paul Rubins went on, I think it was the

1054
00:58:06,680 --> 00:58:11,480
Speaker 1: newly disgraced Jimmy Fallon. I don't know what he was promoting,

1055
00:58:11,880 --> 00:58:14,520
Speaker 1: and he I guess he was being peppered with all

1056
00:58:14,560 --> 00:58:17,000
Speaker 1: these questions about the making of Pee's Big Adventure. For

1057
00:58:17,000 --> 00:58:20,080
Speaker 1: some reason, Paul Rubins was like really being coy and

1058
00:58:20,080 --> 00:58:22,160
Speaker 1: didn't want to talk about any of the background of it.

1059
00:58:22,200 --> 00:58:25,440
Speaker 1: But he did admit, or at least said that Large

1060
00:58:25,480 --> 00:58:30,200
Speaker 1: March's towering hair was based on boxing promoter Don King. Oh,

1061
00:58:30,280 --> 00:58:34,080
Speaker 1: I stay corrected, Wow, might, but he might have just

1062
00:58:34,120 --> 00:58:36,680
Speaker 1: been being sarcastic to get Jimmy Fallon to stop asking

1063
00:58:36,760 --> 00:58:41,480
Speaker 1: him questions about peewee. So I'm not your knowledge may vary.

1064
00:58:41,680 --> 00:58:44,920
Speaker 1: I haven't actually watched that clip. Wouldn't surprise me, though.

1065
00:58:44,960 --> 00:58:46,880
Speaker 1: It was just like mid eighties, the height of Don

1066
00:58:46,960 --> 00:58:53,919
Speaker 1: King's ubiquity. He's still alive, great question? Yeah, holy thirty one.

1067
00:58:54,240 --> 00:58:57,240
Speaker 1: That guy was born Good God. I don't think I

1068
00:58:57,280 --> 00:58:59,400
Speaker 1: realized he was that old. There was a picture in

1069
00:58:59,440 --> 00:59:02,920
Speaker 1: his Wikipedia page with a rocket launcher. Yeah. That tracks.

1070
00:59:03,200 --> 00:59:07,160
Speaker 2: He charged with killing two men and incidents thirteen years.

1071
00:59:06,920 --> 00:59:13,600
Speaker 1: Apart justifiable homicide. Nineteen fifty nine. King was shot a

1072
00:59:13,600 --> 00:59:15,880
Speaker 1: man in the back after spotting him trying to rob

1073
00:59:15,960 --> 00:59:19,320
Speaker 1: one of his gambling houses. The incident was ruled the

1074
00:59:19,440 --> 00:59:27,160
Speaker 1: justifiable homicide shooting him in the back. Oh. In nineteen

1075
00:59:27,200 --> 00:59:31,560
Speaker 1: sixty seven, King was convicted of voluntary manslaughter for stopping

1076
00:59:31,600 --> 00:59:34,520
Speaker 1: one of his employees to death. For this, he served

1077
00:59:34,520 --> 00:59:36,400
Speaker 1: three years and eleven months in prison.

1078
00:59:36,560 --> 00:59:41,560
Speaker 2: Three years and eleven months. Good Lord Don King, who

1079
00:59:41,640 --> 00:59:48,800
Speaker 2: knew he was a monster? Probably everyone? Yeah, God, it

1080
00:59:48,840 --> 00:59:51,000
Speaker 2: just gets worse and worse when you go on.

1081
00:59:51,720 --> 00:59:54,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm gonna bookmark that for later. I had no

1082
00:59:54,920 --> 01:00:00,919
Speaker 1: idea a lot of this. Well, Dottie on to Dottie now?

1083
01:00:01,440 --> 01:00:04,960
Speaker 1: Oh sweet Elizabeth Daily, Yes, yes, yes. The character of

1084
01:00:05,000 --> 01:00:10,640
Speaker 1: Dottie Peewee's love interest question Mark Sure, was played by

1085
01:00:10,680 --> 01:00:14,400
Speaker 1: Elizabeth Daily aka E. G. Daily, who is most famous

1086
01:00:14,440 --> 01:00:17,080
Speaker 1: to me is the voice of Tommy Pickles in Rugrats,

1087
01:00:17,440 --> 01:00:19,840
Speaker 1: as well as Babe the Pig and one of the

1088
01:00:19,880 --> 01:00:22,520
Speaker 1: Powerpuff Girls. For the role of Dottie. The producers of

1089
01:00:22,560 --> 01:00:26,240
Speaker 1: the film considered Lord Laughlin aka Aunt Becky from Full House,

1090
01:00:26,560 --> 01:00:30,600
Speaker 1: Laura Dern, Phoebe Kids, Leah Thompson, I could see that,

1091
01:00:30,760 --> 01:00:33,400
Speaker 1: and Jennifer Jason Lee. Those are all fine. Yeah, I'd

1092
01:00:33,400 --> 01:00:36,920
Speaker 1: go with that. Yeah, But the role went to Elizabeth Daily,

1093
01:00:37,200 --> 01:00:39,480
Speaker 1: and she and Paul Rummans didn't meet until the day

1094
01:00:39,560 --> 01:00:42,680
Speaker 1: she arrived on the set to shoot her scene. He's

1095
01:00:42,720 --> 01:00:45,600
Speaker 1: real gentle and sweet, she told the Hollywood Reporter. On

1096
01:00:45,640 --> 01:00:47,760
Speaker 1: the first day, I walked onto the set of Peewee's

1097
01:00:47,800 --> 01:00:50,520
Speaker 1: Kitchen and I was like, this is really cool. She

1098
01:00:50,600 --> 01:00:52,919
Speaker 1: said that Paul quote has a really soft spoken voice

1099
01:00:52,960 --> 01:00:55,360
Speaker 1: when he's not doing his Peewee thing. Yeah, a lot

1100
01:00:55,400 --> 01:00:59,000
Speaker 1: of profiles on Paul Rubban's remark on his like dulcet

1101
01:00:59,040 --> 01:01:02,280
Speaker 1: tones when he's not Peewee, which I guess we'd be

1102
01:01:02,320 --> 01:01:06,360
Speaker 1: on display. Probably best in the movie Blow. I'm gonna

1103
01:01:06,360 --> 01:01:08,440
Speaker 1: have to say, yeah, I have to rewatch that. But

1104
01:01:08,800 --> 01:01:11,160
Speaker 1: that was kind of the other non Peewee thing that

1105
01:01:11,800 --> 01:01:14,400
Speaker 1: was making the rounds after he died was his part

1106
01:01:14,480 --> 01:01:17,360
Speaker 1: in Blow. But Paul and eg Daily remained close until

1107
01:01:17,360 --> 01:01:19,960
Speaker 1: the end of his life. Although there was a tense

1108
01:01:20,040 --> 01:01:23,160
Speaker 1: moment that occurred during the scene where Peewee is wheeled

1109
01:01:23,200 --> 01:01:26,680
Speaker 1: out of a bike shop on a gurney. Elizabeth's face

1110
01:01:26,720 --> 01:01:31,360
Speaker 1: went white and Paul couldn't figure out why. Apparently the

1111
01:01:31,360 --> 01:01:35,160
Speaker 1: scene gave her flashbacks of her boyfriend John Eric Hexham,

1112
01:01:35,680 --> 01:01:38,640
Speaker 1: an actor who accidentally shot and killed himself with a

1113
01:01:38,680 --> 01:01:41,520
Speaker 1: prop gun on the set of the TV show Cover

1114
01:01:41,680 --> 01:01:44,439
Speaker 1: Up in nineteen eighty four, which would be a year

1115
01:01:44,480 --> 01:01:48,479
Speaker 1: before they shot this scene per Wikipedia. During a break

1116
01:01:48,520 --> 01:01:51,680
Speaker 1: between scenes on the set on Friday October twelfth, nineteen

1117
01:01:51,720 --> 01:01:55,760
Speaker 1: eighty four, John Eric Hexham became bored with the filming delays.

1118
01:01:56,120 --> 01:01:58,680
Speaker 1: He began playing Russian Roulette with what he believed was

1119
01:01:58,680 --> 01:02:01,800
Speaker 1: a harmless forty four magne a prop gun, and jokingly

1120
01:02:01,840 --> 01:02:04,360
Speaker 1: placed it to his temple and pulled the trigger. The

1121
01:02:04,400 --> 01:02:07,640
Speaker 1: shot sent the wadding from the blank cartridge into Hexham's skull,

1122
01:02:08,160 --> 01:02:10,640
Speaker 1: driving a bone fragment the size of a quarter into

1123
01:02:10,640 --> 01:02:14,480
Speaker 1: his brain and causing massive hemorrhaging. Hexham was rushed to

1124
01:02:14,520 --> 01:02:16,960
Speaker 1: the hospital where he was declared brain dead nearly a

1125
01:02:17,000 --> 01:02:20,320
Speaker 1: week later. So he didn't bring that one up on

1126
01:02:20,360 --> 01:02:21,560
Speaker 1: the Rugrats episode.

1127
01:02:22,000 --> 01:02:25,400
Speaker 2: I can't imagine why.

1128
01:02:24,760 --> 01:02:27,200
Speaker 1: Well this this has this directly related to Peewee because

1129
01:02:27,200 --> 01:02:28,720
Speaker 1: she was looking at Pee Wee getting wheeled out on

1130
01:02:28,720 --> 01:02:30,560
Speaker 1: a stretcher a year later and it freaked her out.

1131
01:02:30,560 --> 01:02:35,000
Speaker 1: He had the PTSD. It's directly related. So that's our

1132
01:02:35,000 --> 01:02:37,800
Speaker 1: take on value for this episode is please folks, don't

1133
01:02:37,800 --> 01:02:39,400
Speaker 1: screw all the prop guns.

1134
01:02:39,840 --> 01:02:42,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean a big, big year for prop guns man,

1135
01:02:42,720 --> 01:02:45,760
Speaker 2: I mean Alec Baldwin. They just got a Crow remake

1136
01:02:45,960 --> 01:02:50,640
Speaker 2: going landed distributed. It's done. It just landed landed lions Gate. Yeah,

1137
01:02:50,680 --> 01:02:54,480
Speaker 2: Bill will scarsguard stars Scart one of the Swedes, the

1138
01:02:54,520 --> 01:02:56,760
Speaker 2: creepy Swede, not the stupid hot one.

1139
01:02:56,920 --> 01:03:01,160
Speaker 1: Okay. Yeah. Is the Crow the original? Yeah? Good?

1140
01:03:01,840 --> 01:03:06,280
Speaker 2: No, okay, I mean it's iconic, but it's not really good.

1141
01:03:06,840 --> 01:03:09,760
Speaker 2: He's like super hot in it, and it's really gothy,

1142
01:03:10,720 --> 01:03:14,000
Speaker 2: but it's really not a good like action movie or

1143
01:03:14,520 --> 01:03:18,240
Speaker 2: kind of movie period. Well directed, great soundtrack.

1144
01:03:19,000 --> 01:03:21,560
Speaker 1: Yeah. I remember seeing it as like a young teenager

1145
01:03:21,760 --> 01:03:23,880
Speaker 1: and yeah, I mean that's how everyone.

1146
01:03:23,600 --> 01:03:26,120
Speaker 2: Saw you had like you like your goth crush talked

1147
01:03:26,120 --> 01:03:27,880
Speaker 2: about the Crow, so you went and watched the Crow.

1148
01:03:28,000 --> 01:03:30,600
Speaker 2: I literally dated a girl who had happened lines of

1149
01:03:30,600 --> 01:03:35,840
Speaker 2: it like spray painted on her on her walls.

1150
01:03:34,280 --> 01:03:38,920
Speaker 1: Spray painted cool. Yeah, it was, it was pretty metal.

1151
01:03:39,000 --> 01:03:49,720
Speaker 1: He was pretty cool. Wow. Uh nice. Nice. Well, now

1152
01:03:50,320 --> 01:03:53,280
Speaker 1: let us proceed to pee Wee's grab bag pace. We

1153
01:03:53,280 --> 01:03:56,920
Speaker 1: can't really use the word grab in pee Wee. Oh

1154
01:03:57,240 --> 01:04:02,360
Speaker 1: too soon Yeah, here's some odds and ends. My favorite

1155
01:04:02,360 --> 01:04:06,760
Speaker 1: factoids about this movie. The late Jan Hooks brilliant Jan Hooks,

1156
01:04:06,800 --> 01:04:08,720
Speaker 1: one of my favorite SNL veterans, A veteran of the

1157
01:04:08,760 --> 01:04:12,600
Speaker 1: Groundlings also and one hundred episodes of SNL. She appears

1158
01:04:12,640 --> 01:04:14,480
Speaker 1: as the tour guide of the Alamo when Pee re

1159
01:04:14,640 --> 01:04:17,720
Speaker 1: arrives in search of the basement, the non existent basement.

1160
01:04:18,400 --> 01:04:21,640
Speaker 1: She apparently improvised her whole scene entirely on the spot.

1161
01:04:22,440 --> 01:04:25,960
Speaker 1: Love that pro In addition to bit parts by Phil

1162
01:04:25,960 --> 01:04:28,600
Speaker 1: Hartman and Tim Burton which we touched on earlier, Pee

1163
01:04:28,600 --> 01:04:32,680
Speaker 1: Wee's Big Adventure features cameos from James Browin, Morgan Fairchild,

1164
01:04:33,000 --> 01:04:37,640
Speaker 1: d Snyder, and Milton Burrell. The first two, if not

1165
01:04:37,760 --> 01:04:41,040
Speaker 1: all four I forget now appear in the movie within

1166
01:04:41,080 --> 01:04:44,000
Speaker 1: a movie that plays at the drive in, and that

1167
01:04:44,080 --> 01:04:46,680
Speaker 1: drive in, called the Studio drive In and located in

1168
01:04:46,720 --> 01:04:51,760
Speaker 1: California's Culver City, is reported on some sites to be

1169
01:04:51,920 --> 01:04:54,919
Speaker 1: the one that's used in the movie Grease when John

1170
01:04:54,960 --> 01:04:58,320
Speaker 1: Travolta sings Sandy you know stranded the drive in. I've

1171
01:04:58,360 --> 01:05:00,640
Speaker 1: seen other sites claim that this is isn't the case,

1172
01:05:00,720 --> 01:05:03,280
Speaker 1: and the Grease scene was filmed at a spot in

1173
01:05:03,480 --> 01:05:06,880
Speaker 1: Burbank I believe called Pickwick the Pickwick Theater in an

1174
01:05:06,920 --> 01:05:09,280
Speaker 1: event the Pewee drive it in Culver City was torn

1175
01:05:09,280 --> 01:05:11,840
Speaker 1: down in nineteen ninety three and the Grease one was

1176
01:05:12,000 --> 01:05:14,680
Speaker 1: demoed in nineteen eighty nine, so they are both gone,

1177
01:05:15,400 --> 01:05:18,280
Speaker 1: but furthering the Grease pee Wee Herman connection. The nineteen

1178
01:05:18,280 --> 01:05:21,360
Speaker 1: eighty eight Pee Wee sequel, Big Top Peewee, which we

1179
01:05:21,400 --> 01:05:25,600
Speaker 1: will not be discussing because it just seems bad, was

1180
01:05:25,640 --> 01:05:29,960
Speaker 1: directed by Greece director Randall Kleiser. I think a lot

1181
01:05:29,960 --> 01:05:33,440
Speaker 1: of the Big Top Pee Wee movie drew on some

1182
01:05:33,480 --> 01:05:37,280
Speaker 1: of the unused original premise for a Peewe's Big Adventure,

1183
01:05:37,280 --> 01:05:39,560
Speaker 1: where it was going to be a Pollyanna remake. I

1184
01:05:39,600 --> 01:05:42,800
Speaker 1: think I don't remember. I watched it like once, well,

1185
01:05:42,840 --> 01:05:47,720
Speaker 1: it was maybe like eight. The Tequila Dance, yes, you know,

1186
01:05:47,840 --> 01:05:51,560
Speaker 1: the one with the thumbs. I'm about to ruin it

1187
01:05:51,600 --> 01:05:55,680
Speaker 1: for you. It apparently originated from a dirty joke told

1188
01:05:55,720 --> 01:05:59,959
Speaker 1: by Paul's father, Allow me to quote him. The joke

1189
01:06:00,200 --> 01:06:03,200
Speaker 1: was something that you put one thumb in your and

1190
01:06:03,440 --> 01:06:08,000
Speaker 1: he's he's gesticulating to his backside during this interview, and

1191
01:06:08,040 --> 01:06:10,520
Speaker 1: the other thumb in your mouth and then you switch.

1192
01:06:11,200 --> 01:06:13,160
Speaker 1: I don't really want to know what that joke is.

1193
01:06:13,600 --> 01:06:22,080
Speaker 1: I'll probably cut this whole segment. What is the Yeah?

1194
01:06:22,120 --> 01:06:26,680
Speaker 1: Moving on, oh to only slightly more pleasant news Corey Feldman.

1195
01:06:27,720 --> 01:06:35,280
Speaker 2: Buttholes I felt bad after that one.

1196
01:06:36,400 --> 01:06:40,120
Speaker 1: Corey Feldman was reportedly offered the role of France's Buxton

1197
01:06:41,040 --> 01:06:45,360
Speaker 1: the I think he's the bike the act. He's the

1198
01:06:45,760 --> 01:06:49,600
Speaker 1: rich kid next door. He's like Nemesis. Yeah yeah, But

1199
01:06:49,640 --> 01:06:52,560
Speaker 1: he turned down the role, apparently due to scheduling conflicts

1200
01:06:52,560 --> 01:06:56,960
Speaker 1: with the Goonies. Paul Rubins supposedly visited the Goonies set

1201
01:06:57,000 --> 01:06:59,040
Speaker 1: once because both of the films were shooting on the

1202
01:06:59,080 --> 01:07:01,720
Speaker 1: same lot. And this is one of those IMDb trivia

1203
01:07:01,760 --> 01:07:04,120
Speaker 1: things that I can't really run down. But Feldman did

1204
01:07:04,160 --> 01:07:07,440
Speaker 1: say that the Goony set bosa a tremendous number of

1205
01:07:07,520 --> 01:07:10,920
Speaker 1: celebrity guests. He told Empire Pee Wee's big adventure was

1206
01:07:10,920 --> 01:07:13,560
Speaker 1: shooting across the lot, so Tim Burton and Paul Rubens

1207
01:07:13,600 --> 01:07:17,040
Speaker 1: would come over. Dan Ackroyd too, Harrison Ford actually came

1208
01:07:17,080 --> 01:07:19,040
Speaker 1: and climbed around the caves with us at one point.

1209
01:07:19,120 --> 01:07:22,120
Speaker 1: That's awesome. Michael Jackson and his whole family were there

1210
01:07:22,200 --> 01:07:25,600
Speaker 1: quite a lot. It was happening, you know. One downside

1211
01:07:25,640 --> 01:07:29,080
Speaker 1: was I became friends with Michael and was wearing a

1212
01:07:29,120 --> 01:07:32,200
Speaker 1: Prince t shirt every day. It wouldn't be funnier if

1213
01:07:32,200 --> 01:07:38,440
Speaker 1: he just said one downside was I became friends with Michael. Yeah,

1214
01:07:38,680 --> 01:07:41,320
Speaker 1: Prince and Michael, we're big time rivals in the eighties.

1215
01:07:41,520 --> 01:07:47,600
Speaker 1: The story we've told five times. Pee Wee's Big Adventure

1216
01:07:47,640 --> 01:07:51,080
Speaker 1: marks the screen debut of Darla the Dog, who appears

1217
01:07:51,120 --> 01:07:54,120
Speaker 1: in an uncredited role as one of the pets escaping

1218
01:07:54,120 --> 01:07:57,400
Speaker 1: from the pet store fire. She's been featured in numerous films,

1219
01:07:57,400 --> 01:08:00,440
Speaker 1: including her role as Queenie in nineteen eighty eight, The

1220
01:08:00,440 --> 01:08:04,800
Speaker 1: Burbs and Most Germaine to Our Interests as Precious the

1221
01:08:04,920 --> 01:08:07,840
Speaker 1: Dog in Silence of the Lambs. I don't know why

1222
01:08:07,840 --> 01:08:10,800
Speaker 1: I specified the dog, It's not like she's playing Buffalo Bill,

1223
01:08:11,720 --> 01:08:15,520
Speaker 1: Precious the Human for her role as FBI director Jack Crawford,

1224
01:08:18,360 --> 01:08:20,960
Speaker 1: And finally, the last in my pee Wee grab bag,

1225
01:08:21,479 --> 01:08:24,479
Speaker 1: some Batman nods for my dear friend Alex Heigel. Do

1226
01:08:24,520 --> 01:08:26,360
Speaker 1: you want to take this? It's Batman? You gotta do this.

1227
01:08:27,040 --> 01:08:29,240
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, we already discussed how Tim Burton cast Paul

1228
01:08:29,280 --> 01:08:32,599
Speaker 2: Rubins in Batman Returns is the penguin's father, but there

1229
01:08:32,600 --> 01:08:36,240
Speaker 2: are several nods to the Caped Crusader. In Pee's Big Adventure,

1230
01:08:36,280 --> 01:08:38,720
Speaker 2: there's the scene where Peee slides down the pole in

1231
01:08:38,760 --> 01:08:42,960
Speaker 2: his house, trans changing instantaneously from pj's to his signature suit,

1232
01:08:43,360 --> 01:08:44,720
Speaker 2: much like Bruce Wayne would do.

1233
01:08:45,920 --> 01:08:47,759
Speaker 1: I think that's from the sixties show.

1234
01:08:48,800 --> 01:08:50,960
Speaker 2: I don't think that's from the comics, but yeah, where

1235
01:08:51,000 --> 01:08:53,040
Speaker 2: they slide down the shoots in Wayne manner and they're

1236
01:08:53,040 --> 01:08:57,000
Speaker 2: instantly transformed in they're putting their Batman suits, And that's

1237
01:08:57,000 --> 01:09:00,200
Speaker 2: of the sixties. Batman is of a piece with uh

1238
01:09:01,000 --> 01:09:03,800
Speaker 2: you know this whole kitchy era deal?

1239
01:09:04,640 --> 01:09:08,360
Speaker 1: Are you into? I can see you as not liking

1240
01:09:08,439 --> 01:09:09,519
Speaker 1: the sixties Batman.

1241
01:09:09,720 --> 01:09:11,240
Speaker 2: I grew up with him. My dad we had a

1242
01:09:11,240 --> 01:09:16,200
Speaker 2: b yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, biff bam pow. Holy shark

1243
01:09:16,240 --> 01:09:19,400
Speaker 2: repellent bat spray Batman. That's the best one. Send me that,

1244
01:09:19,479 --> 01:09:22,760
Speaker 2: give me the shark repellent bat spray. Yeah, it's great.

1245
01:09:23,360 --> 01:09:25,679
Speaker 2: It's just so good. It's so it makes me happy

1246
01:09:25,680 --> 01:09:27,559
Speaker 2: that you like that. I could see you not liking that.

1247
01:09:27,680 --> 01:09:29,439
Speaker 2: And it's funnier too when you know that they were

1248
01:09:29,479 --> 01:09:33,760
Speaker 2: like having crazy orgies together like Adam West and what's

1249
01:09:33,760 --> 01:09:34,599
Speaker 2: his name Burt.

1250
01:09:34,360 --> 01:09:36,800
Speaker 1: Ward Hurt or yeah, go.

1251
01:09:36,920 --> 01:09:41,120
Speaker 2: Into sixties swinger parties together, probably in the costumes.

1252
01:09:42,120 --> 01:09:46,799
Speaker 1: Oh, I mean yeah, that's money on the table. He didn't.

1253
01:09:46,960 --> 01:09:50,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, funnily enough, speaking of that series, James Brolin and

1254
01:09:50,760 --> 01:09:54,120
Speaker 2: Monty Landis, another bit player in the film, were guest

1255
01:09:54,120 --> 01:09:57,479
Speaker 2: stars in the original Batman series, and the Batmobile can

1256
01:09:57,520 --> 01:09:58,120
Speaker 2: be seen.

1257
01:09:57,960 --> 01:09:59,920
Speaker 1: Cruising through the Warner Brothers a lot in the film.

1258
01:10:00,040 --> 01:10:01,880
Speaker 1: I'll do the music too. I know you're no.

1259
01:10:01,960 --> 01:10:04,040
Speaker 2: I hate Danny Elfman so much. In fact, when I

1260
01:10:04,080 --> 01:10:07,320
Speaker 2: was watching clips of this earlier today, I was like, God,

1261
01:10:07,400 --> 01:10:08,799
Speaker 2: I hate this music.

1262
01:10:09,080 --> 01:10:10,400
Speaker 1: Boom boom boom.

1263
01:10:16,680 --> 01:10:19,040
Speaker 2: Boom boom boom boom boom boom boom boom boom boom

1264
01:10:19,040 --> 01:10:23,400
Speaker 2: boom boom boom boom. God, come up with another idea, dude,

1265
01:10:23,600 --> 01:10:29,599
Speaker 2: come on, we're all begging you. Unsurprisingly, at the time,

1266
01:10:29,920 --> 01:10:32,200
Speaker 2: Danny Elfman did not consider himself a composer.

1267
01:10:32,560 --> 01:10:33,160
Speaker 1: Uh.

1268
01:10:33,200 --> 01:10:35,920
Speaker 2: When he was offered the gig, he was coming off

1269
01:10:35,960 --> 01:10:38,400
Speaker 2: of Oingo Boingo.

1270
01:10:38,680 --> 01:10:41,120
Speaker 1: A band that the pod Oo boy band.

1271
01:10:41,200 --> 01:10:46,120
Speaker 2: That people. Man, they're like number three after like fish

1272
01:10:46,479 --> 01:10:49,320
Speaker 2: and like reggae. That whenever I tell people I don't

1273
01:10:49,439 --> 01:10:54,080
Speaker 2: like it. They're like, no, dude, like no oingo boingo, man,

1274
01:10:54,200 --> 01:10:55,320
Speaker 2: like you just have you heard?

1275
01:10:55,720 --> 01:10:57,320
Speaker 1: Like yeah, it sucks.

1276
01:10:57,439 --> 01:11:00,400
Speaker 2: It's nerd rock. It's like they might be giant. It's like,

1277
01:11:01,520 --> 01:11:06,200
Speaker 2: get it away from me, unserious people. Was that a

1278
01:11:06,240 --> 01:11:08,559
Speaker 2: guy from the Atlantic. It just kept using the phrase

1279
01:11:08,640 --> 01:11:11,599
Speaker 2: deeply unseerious when he was talking about people smoking weed

1280
01:11:11,600 --> 01:11:13,960
Speaker 2: in public in New York and he was like, new York,

1281
01:11:13,960 --> 01:11:17,479
Speaker 2: it just feels deeply unseerious to me. That's what Boying

1282
01:11:17,520 --> 01:11:20,720
Speaker 2: goes to be. Some people are like, that's the point.

1283
01:11:21,200 --> 01:11:26,400
Speaker 2: Not me, not Alex, not this guy, not this guy.

1284
01:11:32,520 --> 01:11:34,439
Speaker 2: When I met Tim Burton, it was like, why me,

1285
01:11:34,720 --> 01:11:37,320
Speaker 2: Why would you want me to do a score? That's crazy.

1286
01:11:37,680 --> 01:11:39,439
Speaker 2: Tim was like, I don't know. I've seen your band

1287
01:11:39,439 --> 01:11:41,640
Speaker 2: and I think you could do it. Ah to be

1288
01:11:41,680 --> 01:11:44,280
Speaker 2: a white guy in Hollywood in the eighties, it was

1289
01:11:44,360 --> 01:11:46,400
Speaker 2: kind of that simple. He showed me scenes from the

1290
01:11:46,400 --> 01:11:49,040
Speaker 2: movie and I recorded a piece and sent in a cassette.

1291
01:11:49,200 --> 01:11:51,680
Speaker 2: I never expected to hear from them again. About two

1292
01:11:51,720 --> 01:11:53,960
Speaker 2: weeks later, I got a call saying you got the job.

1293
01:11:54,600 --> 01:11:56,519
Speaker 2: My first reaction to my manager was to call him

1294
01:11:56,560 --> 01:11:58,439
Speaker 2: and tell him I can't do it. He goes, I've

1295
01:11:58,479 --> 01:12:00,400
Speaker 2: been working on this for two weeks. You call and

1296
01:12:00,439 --> 01:12:02,680
Speaker 2: you tell them you can't do it. I slept on

1297
01:12:02,720 --> 01:12:05,280
Speaker 2: it and decided that I decided. The single piece of

1298
01:12:05,280 --> 01:12:08,880
Speaker 2: anything that's guided my entire life was saying fit like,

1299
01:12:09,160 --> 01:12:12,120
Speaker 2: I hope I don't wreck their movie, whatever any of

1300
01:12:12,120 --> 01:12:14,840
Speaker 2: that means. Uh. He'd also done a score for nineteen

1301
01:12:14,840 --> 01:12:18,599
Speaker 2: eighties Forbidden Zone, which, oh, of course, had the benefit

1302
01:12:18,600 --> 01:12:22,920
Speaker 2: of being directed by his brother, But young Danny Elfman

1303
01:12:23,200 --> 01:12:27,240
Speaker 2: changed his position on scoring after he heard his obnoxious

1304
01:12:27,680 --> 01:12:34,080
Speaker 2: carnival PoCA Bulls played by a full orchestra, which set

1305
01:12:34,200 --> 01:12:36,880
Speaker 2: so many of us on a course to teeth gnashing

1306
01:12:37,000 --> 01:12:40,800
Speaker 2: and wailing and pulling at our hair every time we

1307
01:12:40,840 --> 01:12:42,400
Speaker 2: see his name pop up in the credits.

1308
01:12:43,280 --> 01:12:47,520
Speaker 1: No, I jest I I you know he's fine. He's no. Uh.

1309
01:12:48,000 --> 01:12:52,719
Speaker 2: Also, I hate he's no. James Horner, Oh, Jamess Smith's fine.

1310
01:12:53,400 --> 01:12:56,880
Speaker 2: James Horner sucks. You can't say that because he died tragically.

1311
01:12:56,960 --> 01:12:59,840
Speaker 2: But that's the guy who's self plagiarized and the guy

1312
01:12:59,840 --> 01:13:03,559
Speaker 2: who like two ideals actual play darys. And he had

1313
01:13:03,600 --> 01:13:06,240
Speaker 2: two ideas and one of them was Penny whistles like

1314
01:13:06,760 --> 01:13:11,320
Speaker 2: that guy, God Rest his soul. He's worked with Tim

1315
01:13:11,320 --> 01:13:16,160
Speaker 2: Burton on like ninety eight percent of Burton's filmography, the

1316
01:13:16,200 --> 01:13:18,880
Speaker 2: exceptions being ed Wood, which is Tim Burton's best movie,

1317
01:13:19,200 --> 01:13:22,880
Speaker 2: and Sweeney Todd, which there was already music for that

1318
01:13:23,200 --> 01:13:24,600
Speaker 2: by a guy you might have heard of.

1319
01:13:25,640 --> 01:13:27,120
Speaker 1: Uh.

1320
01:13:27,240 --> 01:13:29,040
Speaker 2: He was called in to provide the score for Big

1321
01:13:29,080 --> 01:13:31,599
Speaker 2: Top Peewee, but because it was produced by a different studio,

1322
01:13:31,800 --> 01:13:33,839
Speaker 2: was not allowed to use any cues from the original

1323
01:13:33,840 --> 01:13:36,479
Speaker 2: movie and had to start from scratch. As if anyone

1324
01:13:36,520 --> 01:13:40,479
Speaker 2: could tell, he says, the pee Wee pieces were inspired

1325
01:13:40,479 --> 01:13:44,320
Speaker 2: by Nino Roda, who is probably most famous for the

1326
01:13:44,360 --> 01:13:45,240
Speaker 2: Godfather theme.

1327
01:13:45,800 --> 01:13:49,040
Speaker 1: Oh weird. I don't hear any comparisons.

1328
01:13:49,840 --> 01:13:51,600
Speaker 2: I guess I hear it in like the you know,

1329
01:13:51,680 --> 01:13:56,880
Speaker 2: the Godfather theme is in that sort of spooky quasi

1330
01:13:57,040 --> 01:14:00,720
Speaker 2: Latin and do lucien minor, like the Phrygian that has

1331
01:14:00,760 --> 01:14:05,760
Speaker 2: that like flat nine flat nine minor third tonality to it,

1332
01:14:05,800 --> 01:14:08,120
Speaker 2: And like Elfman's got a lot of that kind of

1333
01:14:09,240 --> 01:14:12,600
Speaker 2: not quite Spanish but very like minory dissonant sort of

1334
01:14:12,600 --> 01:14:14,320
Speaker 2: stuff in there. So I guess I get that, but

1335
01:14:15,080 --> 01:14:19,800
Speaker 2: I don't know. It's all it's like damn poke rhythm.

1336
01:14:20,240 --> 01:14:26,920
Speaker 2: Oh just sense my teethot edge like SKA anything with

1337
01:14:26,960 --> 01:14:30,679
Speaker 2: that like really insistent, like rigid, like upbeat thing. I'm

1338
01:14:30,720 --> 01:14:33,880
Speaker 2: just like, what is musical about this to you? Chink

1339
01:14:34,000 --> 01:14:37,040
Speaker 2: chink chink chink chink chink chink chink chink.

1340
01:14:36,960 --> 01:14:43,080
Speaker 3: Guitar part but yeah what I ah? And to make

1341
01:14:43,120 --> 01:14:45,920
Speaker 3: that like the crux of your artistic identity for like

1342
01:14:45,960 --> 01:14:51,000
Speaker 3: a full like five years, right like until the Batman theme,

1343
01:14:51,240 --> 01:14:52,960
Speaker 3: Like that was it.

1344
01:14:53,040 --> 01:14:54,040
Speaker 1: That was what you got.

1345
01:14:54,080 --> 01:14:58,000
Speaker 2: When you got a Danny Elfman score, you got obnoxious oompush.

1346
01:14:58,280 --> 01:15:01,720
Speaker 2: You should cut a lot of that of me being

1347
01:15:01,800 --> 01:15:02,839
Speaker 2: mean to Danny Elfman.

1348
01:15:04,520 --> 01:15:09,880
Speaker 1: He's you know, he's redheaded. I'll come back in right here.

1349
01:15:14,240 --> 01:15:17,160
Speaker 1: Pee Wee's Big Adventure was released on August ninth, nineteen

1350
01:15:17,240 --> 01:15:21,080
Speaker 1: eighty five, and Paul Rubins in character is Peewee and

1351
01:15:21,120 --> 01:15:24,519
Speaker 1: Claude in a costumed crown for some reason, and Elizabeth

1352
01:15:24,560 --> 01:15:27,879
Speaker 1: Day arrived together in a bike driven chariot to the premiere.

1353
01:15:28,200 --> 01:15:31,479
Speaker 1: Aside from the lavish bike centric party, the studio was

1354
01:15:31,479 --> 01:15:34,400
Speaker 1: a little uncertain about the prospects for this weird little movie.

1355
01:15:35,000 --> 01:15:38,320
Speaker 1: Rather than go for a big, splashy national release, they

1356
01:15:38,479 --> 01:15:42,559
Speaker 1: rolled it out slowly on a regional basis in limited release.

1357
01:15:42,840 --> 01:15:45,920
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, But after it got a warm reception, they

1358
01:15:45,960 --> 01:15:50,080
Speaker 1: went big. Made for just seven million, Peewee's Big Adventure

1359
01:15:50,160 --> 01:15:53,280
Speaker 1: earned forty one million at the box office, and it

1360
01:15:53,320 --> 01:15:56,919
Speaker 1: was also a success with critics. David Anson of Newsweek

1361
01:15:56,920 --> 01:16:01,720
Speaker 1: described the film as quote I love this phrase, Mattel's surrealism,

1362
01:16:01,920 --> 01:16:06,280
Speaker 1: hmm nice, a toy store, fantasia and primary colors in

1363
01:16:06,400 --> 01:16:11,160
Speaker 1: fifties decorps. Whoever proposed teaming up Peewee aka Paul Rubins

1364
01:16:11,400 --> 01:16:13,840
Speaker 1: with twenty six year old director Tim Burton knew what

1365
01:16:13,880 --> 01:16:17,400
Speaker 1: they were doing together. They've conspired to make a true original,

1366
01:16:17,680 --> 01:16:21,200
Speaker 1: a live action cartoon, brash enough to appeal the little kids,

1367
01:16:21,240 --> 01:16:23,880
Speaker 1: and yet so knee deep in irony that its faux

1368
01:16:23,960 --> 01:16:28,360
Speaker 1: naivete looks as chic as the latest retro fashions. That's cool.

1369
01:16:29,280 --> 01:16:32,839
Speaker 1: Variety compared Paul Rubens to Charlie Chaplin and Buster Keaton,

1370
01:16:33,800 --> 01:16:36,599
Speaker 1: and Roger Ebert placed Heewe's Big Adventure on his list

1371
01:16:36,600 --> 01:16:39,559
Speaker 1: of Guilty Pleasures, writing the movie is not just a

1372
01:16:39,600 --> 01:16:43,320
Speaker 1: strange little man acting goofy. Peewee has created a whole

1373
01:16:43,320 --> 01:16:47,880
Speaker 1: fairy tale universe. As consistent and fascinating as Alice's Wonderland

1374
01:16:48,240 --> 01:16:49,880
Speaker 1: or the World of the Hobbits and Lord of the

1375
01:16:49,960 --> 01:16:53,000
Speaker 1: Ringshewe's Big Adventure is one of those movies, like The

1376
01:16:53,000 --> 01:16:55,439
Speaker 1: Wizard of Oz, I think that kids can look at

1377
01:16:55,479 --> 01:16:57,800
Speaker 1: in one state of mind while grown ups enjoy it

1378
01:16:57,880 --> 01:17:02,599
Speaker 1: on a completely different level. And it was reportedly at

1379
01:17:02,600 --> 01:17:04,479
Speaker 1: the premiere for a pee Wee's Big Adventure that a

1380
01:17:04,520 --> 01:17:08,400
Speaker 1: studio executive for CBS approached Rubens about the prospect of

1381
01:17:08,439 --> 01:17:12,320
Speaker 1: doing a Peewee Herman children's show. But that is an

1382
01:17:12,360 --> 01:17:15,600
Speaker 1: adventure for next week's episode. Join us back here for

1383
01:17:15,640 --> 01:17:18,679
Speaker 1: a deep dive in the Peewee's Playhouse, which found Paul

1384
01:17:18,760 --> 01:17:22,120
Speaker 1: Rubins at the peak of his autuist powers before he

1385
01:17:22,200 --> 01:17:25,360
Speaker 1: took an infamous trip into a movie theater and endure

1386
01:17:25,400 --> 01:17:28,800
Speaker 1: the tabloid hell that nearly destroyed his career. In short,

1387
01:17:28,920 --> 01:17:31,920
Speaker 1: join us next time for more porn and less ono bling.

1388
01:17:32,000 --> 01:17:39,640
Speaker 2: Go bu, play us out, Danny, Boom.

1389
01:17:46,360 --> 01:17:47,200
Speaker 1: And fade.

1390
01:17:49,760 --> 01:17:52,760
Speaker 2: You get no sign off from me this week, give

1391
01:17:52,880 --> 01:17:55,120
Speaker 2: mean spirited Danny Elfin in Fresher.

1392
01:17:56,280 --> 01:18:04,639
Speaker 1: And you'll like it too much. Information was a production

1393
01:18:04,720 --> 01:18:08,240
Speaker 1: of iHeartRadio. The show's executive producers are Noel Brown and

1394
01:18:08,320 --> 01:18:12,160
Speaker 1: Jordan Runtog. The show's supervising producer is Michael Alder. June.

1395
01:18:12,400 --> 01:18:15,519
Speaker 2: The show was researched, written, and hosted by Jordan Runtgg

1396
01:18:15,560 --> 01:18:16,640
Speaker 2: and Alex Heigel.

1397
01:18:16,479 --> 01:18:19,719
Speaker 1: With original music by Seth Applebaum and the Ghost Funk Orchestra.

1398
01:18:20,040 --> 01:18:22,080
Speaker 1: If you like what you heard, please subscribe and leave

1399
01:18:22,160 --> 01:18:25,120
Speaker 1: us a review. For more podcasts on iHeartRadio, visit the

1400
01:18:25,120 --> 01:18:28,439
Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your

1401
01:18:28,439 --> 01:18:29,160
Speaker 1: favorite shows