WEBVTT - 110423 The Importance of Pronouns with Ted X Speaker Mea Chiasson (Part 1)

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<v Speaker 1>Broadcasting from the Hip Hop Weekly Studios. I'd like to

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<v Speaker 1>welcome you to another episode of Civic Cipher. I am

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<v Speaker 1>your host, Ramsey's job. Big shout out to my man

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<v Speaker 1>q Ward, who is out of town or the moment,

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<v Speaker 1>but he will be back soon. Trust and believe, but

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<v Speaker 1>have no fear of this week have a good friend

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<v Speaker 1>of the show who is stopping by to have a

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<v Speaker 1>very important conversation and a long overdue conversation with us

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<v Speaker 1>today about pronouns now Again, it's a long overdue conversation,

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<v Speaker 1>and we're well aware that pronouns rather have taken center

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<v Speaker 1>stage over the past few years, and we wanted to

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<v Speaker 1>give this topic the right amount of attention, the right

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<v Speaker 1>kind of attention, and have someone who could contribute what

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<v Speaker 1>we would consider like lived experience so that we can

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<v Speaker 1>understand where it comes from and how to be better

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<v Speaker 1>brothers in our case, Q and I, brothers to our

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<v Speaker 1>siblings out there who are trans, and to become more

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<v Speaker 1>aligned with the transcommunity. So stay tuned because we are

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<v Speaker 1>going to be talking with a good friend of the show,

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<v Speaker 1>her name is Maya, about what that means to be

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<v Speaker 1>acknowledged authentically and in the light that you choose for yourself.

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<v Speaker 1>In addition to that, we are going to discuss sort

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<v Speaker 1>of some of the implications of kind of letting some

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<v Speaker 1>of the air out of the ball, letting people live

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<v Speaker 1>their truth, walk the path that they feel is appropriate

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<v Speaker 1>for them, and what it feels like from that perspective

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<v Speaker 1>to be supported by the people around you, the people

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<v Speaker 1>in your community, and so forth. In addition, we're going

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<v Speaker 1>to touch on maybe the opposite end of that, which

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<v Speaker 1>is what it feels like to be attacked for living

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<v Speaker 1>your truth, which is obviously another part of the reality

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<v Speaker 1>of our trans siblings. And so stay tuned for all

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<v Speaker 1>that and more. But first and foremost, let's discuss some

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<v Speaker 1>ebony excellence. So to be fair, this ebony excellence is

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<v Speaker 1>long overdue. This is something that we've had in the coffers,

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<v Speaker 1>I suppose, waiting to shine some light on it. But

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<v Speaker 1>this reading comes from New Central Africa and we're talking

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<v Speaker 1>about the young lady named Faith Autosuni. She's a Nigerian

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<v Speaker 1>student who won a global mac tournament, beating China, United

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<v Speaker 1>Kingdom and the United States and others and cementing her

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<v Speaker 1>place in history. Odasuni or Odoon. See sorry, this is

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<v Speaker 1>what I'm saying is the winner of the Global Open

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<v Speaker 1>Mathematics Competition. She excelled in all stages of the competition

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<v Speaker 1>and didn't expect that she'd be declared the winner until

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<v Speaker 1>the last round when she answered more questions than her competitors.

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<v Speaker 1>And this is important. She attended secondary school at the

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<v Speaker 1>Ambassador School in Ota Ogoon State, Southwest Nigeria, so she

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<v Speaker 1>was a student of the Urian school system. A couple

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<v Speaker 1>of cool things about her. She saw nineteen mathematical questions

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<v Speaker 1>in sixty seconds, becoming the best candidate in the twenty

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<v Speaker 1>twenty one mathematics competition, beating her next competitor who only

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<v Speaker 1>answered him. She took part in the Global Mathematics Tournament,

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<v Speaker 1>which is an international competition with participants from Europe, Africa, America,

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<v Speaker 1>Asia and Australia, where she scored top marks. In twenty eighteen,

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<v Speaker 1>she received a record Holder award with the highest number

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<v Speaker 1>of questions answered on cow bill Pedia Secondary School's Mathematics

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<v Speaker 1>TV Quiz Show, which is a Nigerian national mathematics television

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<v Speaker 1>quiz show, where she answered nineteen questions in sixty seconds,

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<v Speaker 1>and I promised this list goes on. She's a fantastic

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<v Speaker 1>young lady, and she's still going right now. She's attending

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<v Speaker 1>MIT studying computer science and electrical engineering. Again. Be sure

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<v Speaker 1>to check out her story again. Her name is Faith Odomsey,

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<v Speaker 1>and I think that you will see, like we do,

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<v Speaker 1>that she is a shining example of ebony excellence. Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>So I have a dear friend, someone that I love

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<v Speaker 1>with my whole heart, and this individual is a flower

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<v Speaker 1>in bloom. This individual is dynamic. We all are, but

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<v Speaker 1>I've been able to observe some specific changes, adaptations. Whatever

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<v Speaker 1>the language is, I'm about to learn it with you

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<v Speaker 1>in real time on this show. I think it's important.

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<v Speaker 1>I will always say that it's important that we learn

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<v Speaker 1>how to love people and we teach people how to

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<v Speaker 1>love us. And recently, in recent years, I should say,

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<v Speaker 1>in this country, we've been having conversations about how people

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<v Speaker 1>wish to be identified, specifically with respect to their pronouns.

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<v Speaker 1>And I consider myself to be a woke individual, rather

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<v Speaker 1>be woke than asleep, but in the like the true

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<v Speaker 1>meaning of wokeism, very progressive in my thinking, very accommodating

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<v Speaker 1>of my brothers and sisters that I share this planet with,

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<v Speaker 1>trying to live at peace and have the best, most

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<v Speaker 1>fulfilling experience with this life, but also advocate for the

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<v Speaker 1>best experience on this life for people who may not

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<v Speaker 1>have the same access as I do. And it's in

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<v Speaker 1>that spirit that I wanted to have today's conversation. So Maya,

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<v Speaker 1>Welcome to the show. Kah. In brief, I want you

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<v Speaker 1>to know a little bit about the person we're talking about,

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<v Speaker 1>so i'll pay a picture. I met Maya when she

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<v Speaker 1>was seventeen. She came to my house from out of town,

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<v Speaker 1>and I am a grown man and you're older than

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<v Speaker 1>that now, of course, But when I first met you

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<v Speaker 1>came to my house and the idea was to learn

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<v Speaker 1>to DJ. I've shared on the show many times that

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<v Speaker 1>I'm a DJ, but you also told me something that

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<v Speaker 1>was very profound. You said, I'm going to school to

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<v Speaker 1>become a civil rights attorney. And that moved me because

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<v Speaker 1>Maya is white. Maya's mother and father are white. They

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<v Speaker 1>are both doctors. So if you know like I know,

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<v Speaker 1>you know that that means that Maya did not have

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<v Speaker 1>to be a civil rights attorney. Maya could have did

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<v Speaker 1>anything that she wanted to. But that's I think that

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<v Speaker 1>kind of shows her heart. Being born with considerably less

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<v Speaker 1>in the way of obstacles and problems that you would

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<v Speaker 1>anticipate on your path to whatever it is you wanted

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<v Speaker 1>to be. You choose to take the hard route for

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<v Speaker 1>the benefit of someone else, people that don't even look

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<v Speaker 1>like you, some people who might even be angry with

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<v Speaker 1>people who look like you for the position that they're in.

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<v Speaker 1>It's a lot to reconcile if you've done that by

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<v Speaker 1>age seventeen, what I said makes sense. What I said

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<v Speaker 1>was anything you need now and forever you call me,

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<v Speaker 1>I got you. And when Maya announced to me that

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<v Speaker 1>she had changed her pronouns to better reflect so she

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<v Speaker 1>forgive me again, I'm learning right now. When Maya announced

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<v Speaker 1>the changing of pronouns, i A naturally would accommodate anybody

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<v Speaker 1>to the best I can. I make mistakes. There's other

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<v Speaker 1>people I know who identify as they. They've changed the

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<v Speaker 1>pronouns from she to he. You know, these sorts of things,

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<v Speaker 1>And I feel really bad because I want to I

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<v Speaker 1>want to make sure that everyone knows they're it. It's

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<v Speaker 1>a safe space. I got you. I would protect you.

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<v Speaker 1>But it's language, and it's I guess it's wired into

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<v Speaker 1>a different part of your brain.

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<v Speaker 2>So and I still know that even if you get

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<v Speaker 2>the language wrong.

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<v Speaker 1>I appreciate that. But this you've tasked your brother with

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<v Speaker 1>honoring you as you are blossoming and blooming, and so

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<v Speaker 1>that responsibility is still mine. I appreciate the grace, but

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<v Speaker 1>the responsibilities of mine. What I wanted to ask now

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<v Speaker 1>that we've painted this picture is for you to talk

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<v Speaker 1>us through what it means to go from having one

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<v Speaker 1>set of pronouns to another set of pronouns, and how

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<v Speaker 1>does that fulfill you. I figure the benefit would help

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<v Speaker 1>us people who are coming to terms with pronouns and

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<v Speaker 1>adjusting pronouns. It will help us to be better brothers

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<v Speaker 1>and sisters to those of us who are evolving. Okay,

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<v Speaker 1>glory yours. You can edit this right, of course, of course.

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<v Speaker 2>H Okay, Well I've told you this, But to kind

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<v Speaker 2>of recount, I first started shifting my pronouns in February

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<v Speaker 2>of twenty twenty. Okay, so it's been like three and

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<v Speaker 2>a half years now, and I first started using she, they,

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<v Speaker 2>And it started really just as a I had a

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<v Speaker 2>friend who started to use different pronouns, and I kind

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<v Speaker 2>of thought to myself, like, how would I feel about

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<v Speaker 2>they in reference to me. Then I kind of pushed

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<v Speaker 2>the thought aside. And at that point I had already

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<v Speaker 2>identified as queer like for my sexuality, but I had

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<v Speaker 2>not thought about gender. And then the thought came up again.

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<v Speaker 2>Then I had a friend come to visit and I

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<v Speaker 2>was telling her about it, and I hadn't told anyone

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<v Speaker 2>about it at that point, and we were laying on

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<v Speaker 2>my floor and I was sobbing because it was hitting

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<v Speaker 2>something and I didn't understand. I had no idea and

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<v Speaker 2>I hadn't really thought about it. So I started to

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<v Speaker 2>use Sheeta to try it out to see how it felt,

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<v Speaker 2>and it unlocked something that I didn't know needed to

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<v Speaker 2>be unlocked. And when I think back on my relationship

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<v Speaker 2>to gender, I didn't ever feel when I was younger,

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<v Speaker 2>I didn't feel tied to being girl. I always liked

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<v Speaker 2>that I there are a lot of spaces which I

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<v Speaker 2>could just be one of the boys, I could just

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<v Speaker 2>be myself, and that gender wasn't a roadblock in that

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<v Speaker 2>in terms of me having friends, and I didn't feel

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<v Speaker 2>attached to the identity of being a woman, except for

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<v Speaker 2>when it came to my experience of living under patriarchy,

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<v Speaker 2>like I knew what it meant to connect to other

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<v Speaker 2>women about the experience of like a glance on the

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<v Speaker 2>street that is like very sexualizing and feels deeply uncomfortable

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<v Speaker 2>and sometimes violent, like that's an experience, or being discounted

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<v Speaker 2>on being able to do whatever it was like being

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<v Speaker 2>a DJ, for example, wanting to be DJ. I recognized

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<v Speaker 2>that it was like, Okay, I understand that there are

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<v Speaker 2>so few DJs that I see that look like me

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<v Speaker 2>in the sense of the body type that I have

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<v Speaker 2>that I'm assigned female at birth. It was mostly sis

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<v Speaker 2>men that I was seeing djaying, so I felt connected

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<v Speaker 2>in that way, but it was not necessarily I feel

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<v Speaker 2>like a woman, but I didn't think about it that much.

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<v Speaker 2>I started using she, they, and then for a few

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<v Speaker 2>years it became more comfortable and felt more right. I

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<v Speaker 2>realized I only heard my friends using they them for me.

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<v Speaker 2>I don't really hear many people refer to me as she,

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<v Speaker 2>except for my mom, who you know. She's known about

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<v Speaker 2>this since I started using different pronouns, but it has

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<v Speaker 2>taken a long It takes time for the language to adjust.

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<v Speaker 2>I know that she loves me. I know that it's

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<v Speaker 2>taking time for her to understand what this means in

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<v Speaker 2>terms of identity change, and also that like it's hard

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<v Speaker 2>for her to she, you know, had spent that point

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<v Speaker 2>twenty one years only using she, and so for her

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<v Speaker 2>to use something else, it's taking time, right. And then

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<v Speaker 2>I came home from a trip where I spent some

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<v Speaker 2>time alone that last summer about a year ago, and

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<v Speaker 2>I heard someone refer to me as she. I guess, okay,

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<v Speaker 2>getting a little off track, but that's okay, I'll come

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<v Speaker 2>back around. I heard someone use. I heard someone say like,

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<v Speaker 2>oh she blah blah blah, and I had a moment

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<v Speaker 2>of being like, what are you talking about? Fancy anyone

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<v Speaker 2>else around, Like, oh, that's me, You're talking about me?

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<v Speaker 2>And it just did not it felt like they were

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<v Speaker 2>talking about someone else. I think that since I've used them,

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<v Speaker 2>since I started using them, and I think this whole

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<v Speaker 2>sort of experience of using different pronouns. I was describing

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<v Speaker 2>it to a friend last night. Actually it felt like

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<v Speaker 2>I was in a room and I saw I was

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<v Speaker 2>in this room. I saw that there was a door

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<v Speaker 2>that said man, right, and I was like, that's not

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<v Speaker 2>the door for me. I don't want to walk through

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<v Speaker 2>that doesn't feel like the right door. And I saw

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<v Speaker 2>a door out of the corner of my eye. It's like, Okay,

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<v Speaker 2>I didn't really think or you know, I just learned

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<v Speaker 2>about the door. Because also I think using they them

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<v Speaker 2>is relatively newer. Right, It's not that non binary people

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<v Speaker 2>are new, but I think this change in like pronouns

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<v Speaker 2>is relatively new within the past like several years and

0:14:20.680 --> 0:14:23.520
<v Speaker 2>becoming more popular and whatnot. It was like I saw

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<v Speaker 2>the door out of the corner of my eye. I

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<v Speaker 2>hadn't really thought like do I want to walk to

0:14:26.920 --> 0:14:29.680
<v Speaker 2>that door? And then I was like, I'm looking at

0:14:29.720 --> 0:14:33.440
<v Speaker 2>the door. Maybe you know, maybe I might peek through it,

0:14:33.480 --> 0:14:34.960
<v Speaker 2>but I'm not sure do I really need to open

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<v Speaker 2>this door? Like I know this room and maybe not

0:14:38.200 --> 0:14:40.040
<v Speaker 2>doesn't feel like the best room, but it's a room

0:14:40.080 --> 0:14:42.920
<v Speaker 2>that I know. And then I opened that door and

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<v Speaker 2>I'm in a new room and I was like, oh

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<v Speaker 2>my gosh, I didn't know. I had no idea what

0:14:47.760 --> 0:14:50.280
<v Speaker 2>could be waiting beside this door. And and then in

0:14:50.320 --> 0:14:54.840
<v Speaker 2>that room in this analogy, that's like she they, I

0:14:54.880 --> 0:14:57.720
<v Speaker 2>see this other door, right, I see they them, and

0:14:57.800 --> 0:15:00.480
<v Speaker 2>I see more doors. Because also now that I'm starting

0:15:00.480 --> 0:15:02.240
<v Speaker 2>to think about gender. I understand that there are different

0:15:02.240 --> 0:15:06.040
<v Speaker 2>combinations of pronouns and that pronouns are also one thing

0:15:06.080 --> 0:15:09.880
<v Speaker 2>around like gender, that doesn't necessarily determine your gender. And

0:15:09.920 --> 0:15:15.480
<v Speaker 2>it also doesn't you know, I could have I see

0:15:15.480 --> 0:15:17.360
<v Speaker 2>hee him there, I see he they. I say that

0:15:17.440 --> 0:15:19.720
<v Speaker 2>I see they she, I see they them. But I

0:15:19.760 --> 0:15:21.320
<v Speaker 2>see all of these doors. But I see the day

0:15:21.360 --> 0:15:23.160
<v Speaker 2>them door like again in the corner of my eye,

0:15:23.200 --> 0:15:25.080
<v Speaker 2>and I was like, okay, I see it. It doesn't

0:15:25.120 --> 0:15:28.280
<v Speaker 2>really feel right. But then like over time, I'm like, okay,

0:15:28.320 --> 0:15:30.760
<v Speaker 2>this room is feeling better. But then start the room

0:15:30.800 --> 0:15:33.360
<v Speaker 2>starts to feel a little bit too small, and I

0:15:33.400 --> 0:15:36.440
<v Speaker 2>see this door and it's again I think about the

0:15:36.480 --> 0:15:39.800
<v Speaker 2>door because I thought about using them. It's like, do

0:15:39.840 --> 0:15:41.600
<v Speaker 2>I really need to walk through this door? Like I

0:15:41.680 --> 0:15:45.080
<v Speaker 2>don't know, people are still gonna call me she you know,

0:15:45.160 --> 0:15:46.920
<v Speaker 2>what's the But I think about this door and I

0:15:46.960 --> 0:15:48.200
<v Speaker 2>start to move close to the door. I'm like, you

0:15:48.240 --> 0:15:50.320
<v Speaker 2>know what, might as well try opening the door and

0:15:50.400 --> 0:15:54.040
<v Speaker 2>let's see. And it's just like it's like you It's

0:15:54.040 --> 0:15:55.880
<v Speaker 2>like I opened to the door and I'm no longer

0:15:56.000 --> 0:16:00.080
<v Speaker 2>in a building. It's wow, like it it is so

0:16:00.320 --> 0:16:03.840
<v Speaker 2>expansive and I have, and that's how it's felt. I

0:16:03.840 --> 0:16:06.280
<v Speaker 2>think to use these pronouns, I continue to feel like

0:16:06.360 --> 0:16:10.480
<v Speaker 2>there's more and more space for me within it. I

0:16:10.520 --> 0:16:14.400
<v Speaker 2>continue to learn more about myself. It gives me more

0:16:14.440 --> 0:16:19.560
<v Speaker 2>freedom internally. I just can't. It feels free. That's how

0:16:19.600 --> 0:16:20.040
<v Speaker 2>it feels.

0:16:20.080 --> 0:16:23.040
<v Speaker 1>So let me let me ask you this when you

0:16:23.120 --> 0:16:32.000
<v Speaker 1>talk about it feeling free. I guess maybe for a

0:16:32.040 --> 0:16:37.720
<v Speaker 1>lot of us that our pronouns are they're they have

0:16:37.840 --> 0:16:41.480
<v Speaker 1>roots there, They're not changing at all. There's no need

0:16:41.680 --> 0:16:44.680
<v Speaker 1>not the changing in anything is bad, nothing like that.

0:16:44.760 --> 0:16:48.160
<v Speaker 1>But I just kind of know me, you know what

0:16:48.200 --> 0:16:50.800
<v Speaker 1>I mean. I guess that's it. I guess that's it.

0:16:51.520 --> 0:16:54.160
<v Speaker 1>I think I'm answering my own question because I know me.

0:16:55.160 --> 0:17:01.000
<v Speaker 1>I know who I am, I know the sound of

0:17:01.000 --> 0:17:04.360
<v Speaker 1>my voice. I know when it's me talking, and I

0:17:04.440 --> 0:17:09.200
<v Speaker 1>know when someone is talking about me. And maybe if

0:17:09.200 --> 0:17:14.920
<v Speaker 1>I didn't have that security of knowing those things around myself,

0:17:14.960 --> 0:17:19.320
<v Speaker 1>then maybe I might explore the different rooms to borrow

0:17:19.320 --> 0:17:21.880
<v Speaker 1>from your analogy to see if there's something that works

0:17:21.880 --> 0:17:26.280
<v Speaker 1>a little bit better. One of the things that a

0:17:26.280 --> 0:17:32.919
<v Speaker 1>lot of folks push back against is that many of

0:17:32.920 --> 0:17:39.480
<v Speaker 1>the people who are changing their pronouns. They tend to

0:17:39.480 --> 0:17:41.159
<v Speaker 1>be young. You mentioned that you kind of went through

0:17:41.200 --> 0:17:44.800
<v Speaker 1>this when you were about twenty one. But a big

0:17:44.840 --> 0:17:52.280
<v Speaker 1>part of this country is concerned with I don't even

0:17:52.280 --> 0:17:55.480
<v Speaker 1>know if I'm saying this right, but they're unnecessarily concerned

0:17:55.520 --> 0:17:59.040
<v Speaker 1>with what I will describe here, at least as a

0:17:59.119 --> 0:18:06.800
<v Speaker 1>trans and and they've lumped in the changing of pronouns

0:18:07.280 --> 0:18:13.639
<v Speaker 1>by younger people into that narrative. Now, I want to

0:18:13.680 --> 0:18:16.239
<v Speaker 1>say something because I this is I just know this

0:18:16.280 --> 0:18:23.760
<v Speaker 1>part is true. I don't believe that that is a

0:18:23.800 --> 0:18:29.120
<v Speaker 1>real thing. I think that when people learn a very

0:18:29.160 --> 0:18:34.520
<v Speaker 1>small piece about someone's sexuality, they then define them as

0:18:34.720 --> 0:18:40.200
<v Speaker 1>one hundred percent sexual all the time. Right. If if

0:18:40.240 --> 0:18:44.600
<v Speaker 1>I was to say I'm polyamorous, for instance, then people

0:18:44.640 --> 0:18:48.080
<v Speaker 1>would think that I'm just that I'm a full, full,

0:18:48.119 --> 0:18:52.040
<v Speaker 1>whole person. I go on boats, I cross bridges, and

0:18:52.520 --> 0:18:55.080
<v Speaker 1>there's one part of my life that has that, you

0:18:55.119 --> 0:18:57.520
<v Speaker 1>know what I'm saying. So I think when when people

0:18:57.520 --> 0:19:00.360
<v Speaker 1>think about trans people, they think that that's one who

0:19:00.359 --> 0:19:02.360
<v Speaker 1>they are one hundred percent of the time is their

0:19:02.400 --> 0:19:05.719
<v Speaker 1>sexual expression, and they're expressing that sexuality percent time, And

0:19:05.720 --> 0:19:09.840
<v Speaker 1>that's not true. Another thing that I think is worth mentioning,

0:19:09.880 --> 0:19:15.320
<v Speaker 1>and I want to get your thoughts is a lot

0:19:15.359 --> 0:19:20.480
<v Speaker 1>of people come to terms with their sexuality at a

0:19:20.520 --> 0:19:25.919
<v Speaker 1>young age. Granted, sexuality, from what I understand, it's fluid,

0:19:26.040 --> 0:19:28.960
<v Speaker 1>or it can be fluid. It can change different parts

0:19:28.960 --> 0:19:31.199
<v Speaker 1>of your life, you know, to my understanding of the

0:19:31.240 --> 0:19:34.560
<v Speaker 1>science of it. But for the most part, when people

0:19:34.640 --> 0:19:42.119
<v Speaker 1>start awakening to their sexual self, it happens at a

0:19:42.160 --> 0:19:45.919
<v Speaker 1>younger age typically. And I want to get your thoughts

0:19:45.960 --> 0:19:52.040
<v Speaker 1>on I know you're not trans, okay, so then there

0:19:52.040 --> 0:19:55.199
<v Speaker 1>we go. So I learned that too. So what I

0:19:55.200 --> 0:19:57.560
<v Speaker 1>want you to do is give us some insight into

0:20:00.160 --> 0:20:03.760
<v Speaker 1>maybe how it feels to be to bear witness to

0:20:03.800 --> 0:20:08.320
<v Speaker 1>that attempt at chronicling this narrative and kind of some

0:20:08.359 --> 0:20:09.960
<v Speaker 1>of the things that I said about, you know, people

0:20:10.040 --> 0:20:12.040
<v Speaker 1>coming to terms with their sexuality at a young age,

0:20:12.040 --> 0:20:16.000
<v Speaker 1>and maybe there's the agenda being imagined. Just kind of

0:20:16.000 --> 0:20:18.440
<v Speaker 1>give me some feedback on what I think at least.

0:20:18.920 --> 0:20:23.560
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I think, like, well, I think that's something that's

0:20:23.840 --> 0:20:30.040
<v Speaker 2>been interesting to watch in many different ways. Is that

0:20:30.080 --> 0:20:33.399
<v Speaker 2>I think we've come a lot farther in understanding that

0:20:33.680 --> 0:20:36.320
<v Speaker 2>people can understand their sexualities from a young age. Not

0:20:36.400 --> 0:20:39.520
<v Speaker 2>everyone does, and it is fluid, Like I think, things

0:20:39.560 --> 0:20:42.280
<v Speaker 2>can change over time. I didn't start using the language

0:20:42.280 --> 0:20:44.560
<v Speaker 2>of queer until I was nineteen, and it took me

0:20:44.600 --> 0:20:47.000
<v Speaker 2>a long time to realize like, oh, that's what that is.

0:20:48.280 --> 0:20:50.040
<v Speaker 2>And so I think that if we can see that

0:20:50.119 --> 0:20:54.199
<v Speaker 2>with sexuality, then I think that there's it's surprising to

0:20:54.359 --> 0:20:59.000
<v Speaker 2>then see. Also, I also think that can be true gender, right,

0:21:01.480 --> 0:21:03.679
<v Speaker 2>it's just like an understanding of who you are. And

0:21:03.720 --> 0:21:06.720
<v Speaker 2>also these things can change.

0:21:07.040 --> 0:21:07.960
<v Speaker 1>I think.

0:21:09.280 --> 0:21:11.399
<v Speaker 2>When I think about well, there are a couple of

0:21:11.440 --> 0:21:16.639
<v Speaker 2>things that come to mind. There's this non binary writer,

0:21:17.280 --> 0:21:22.480
<v Speaker 2>poet speaker, a look Weidmannan. They are someone who I

0:21:22.480 --> 0:21:25.439
<v Speaker 2>really appreciate their input. They have a beautiful book on

0:21:26.480 --> 0:21:28.320
<v Speaker 2>called Beyond the Gender Binary, which is like a really

0:21:28.359 --> 0:21:33.560
<v Speaker 2>nice little intro into thinking about beyond the gender binary. Anyways,

0:21:33.600 --> 0:21:36.520
<v Speaker 2>one of the things that they say oftentimes is and

0:21:36.560 --> 0:21:41.520
<v Speaker 2>this isn't a direct quote, but is that what folks

0:21:41.560 --> 0:21:44.200
<v Speaker 2>are afraid of? That it's not that people are afraid

0:21:44.240 --> 0:21:48.119
<v Speaker 2>of gender queer people and people who are exploring gender

0:21:48.200 --> 0:21:50.960
<v Speaker 2>or present in different ways, is that they're afraid of

0:21:51.040 --> 0:21:53.760
<v Speaker 2>like what that means forever for all that folks have

0:21:53.760 --> 0:21:58.439
<v Speaker 2>had to suppress themselves. I think that, like, while I

0:21:58.440 --> 0:22:00.879
<v Speaker 2>don't think there's a transagenda, I think that what I

0:22:01.000 --> 0:22:05.520
<v Speaker 2>find in like trans and non binary community is openings.

0:22:05.520 --> 0:22:09.760
<v Speaker 2>It's like, okay, well what if we take away these boxes? Right?

0:22:11.200 --> 0:22:15.240
<v Speaker 2>What opens Like what does it mean to express yourself

0:22:15.400 --> 0:22:19.080
<v Speaker 2>via dress in a way that feels the best for you? Yeah,

0:22:19.280 --> 0:22:22.879
<v Speaker 2>and everyone should have access to color, to texture, to

0:22:23.000 --> 0:22:25.679
<v Speaker 2>different pieces of garments, like it's not and what does

0:22:25.720 --> 0:22:27.560
<v Speaker 2>it mean to be feminine? What does it mean to

0:22:27.600 --> 0:22:31.760
<v Speaker 2>be masculine? I think it's a lot about like opening

0:22:31.840 --> 0:22:33.439
<v Speaker 2>up that there are so many ways to be in

0:22:33.440 --> 0:22:36.800
<v Speaker 2>this world and we don't have to just be what's

0:22:36.800 --> 0:22:40.240
<v Speaker 2>handed to us. And I think that that and you know,

0:22:40.359 --> 0:22:43.000
<v Speaker 2>encourages I think a lot of imagination, a lot of creativity.

0:22:43.080 --> 0:22:44.160
<v Speaker 2>It's like what's possible?

0:22:44.480 --> 0:22:50.640
<v Speaker 1>Sure? Sure, So, so first off, I appreciate that, and

0:22:52.160 --> 0:22:55.080
<v Speaker 1>let's do this. Let's put a pin in this, okay,

0:22:55.400 --> 0:22:59.439
<v Speaker 1>and we'll come right back to it in just a second. Okay,