1 00:00:02,720 --> 00:00:07,200 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, Radio News. 2 00:00:08,400 --> 00:00:11,240 Speaker 2: Katy, you haven't talked about this, but I watched five minutes, 3 00:00:11,440 --> 00:00:14,560 Speaker 2: five randomly selected minutes of the Golden Globes last weekend. 4 00:00:14,640 --> 00:00:17,120 Speaker 2: Oh my god, it happened to be the five minutes 5 00:00:17,320 --> 00:00:20,079 Speaker 2: during which Snoop dogg It gave an award for Best Podcast. 6 00:00:20,520 --> 00:00:25,160 Speaker 2: So and we won something to aspire to. We did. 7 00:00:25,280 --> 00:00:29,120 Speaker 2: We were not even whatever like seven tiers below nominated 8 00:00:29,120 --> 00:00:30,240 Speaker 2: it is. We weren't that either. 9 00:00:30,280 --> 00:00:32,199 Speaker 3: Our faces weren't in a box on the screen. It 10 00:00:32,240 --> 00:00:35,240 Speaker 3: was Amy Poehler was Amy. Yeah, I'm a huge fan. 11 00:00:35,440 --> 00:00:37,599 Speaker 3: I thought you were going to talk about Timothy Shalmey 12 00:00:37,640 --> 00:00:38,720 Speaker 3: and Kylie Jenner, but. 13 00:00:38,880 --> 00:00:41,879 Speaker 2: I was not. I didn't see those five minutes or. 14 00:00:41,960 --> 00:00:44,800 Speaker 1: Their pda IT award shows. I'm into it. 15 00:00:44,960 --> 00:00:50,360 Speaker 2: Okay, okay, Hello, and welcome to The Money Stuff Podcast, 16 00:00:50,640 --> 00:00:53,960 Speaker 2: your weekly podcast where we talked about stuff related to money. 17 00:00:54,800 --> 00:00:56,680 Speaker 2: I'm Matt Levine, and I write the Money Stuff column 18 00:00:56,680 --> 00:00:58,000 Speaker 2: for Bloomberg Opinion. 19 00:00:58,840 --> 00:01:01,400 Speaker 1: And I'm Katie Greifeld, a reporter for Bloomberg News and 20 00:01:01,440 --> 00:01:04,880 Speaker 1: an anchor for Bloomberg Television. We actually have a lot 21 00:01:04,920 --> 00:01:09,559 Speaker 1: to talk about today, some of it all, right, about first, 22 00:01:09,640 --> 00:01:11,880 Speaker 1: do you want to talk about mister Beest. I guess yes. 23 00:01:12,200 --> 00:01:16,720 Speaker 2: This is a cultural phenomenon that I am cleansically familiar with. 24 00:01:23,480 --> 00:01:25,959 Speaker 1: I only read really the headline, and I feel like 25 00:01:28,360 --> 00:01:29,039 Speaker 1: we're doing great. 26 00:01:29,400 --> 00:01:31,160 Speaker 2: We're clearly the best podcast. 27 00:01:31,640 --> 00:01:35,360 Speaker 3: Mister Beast nabs two hundred million dollar investment from Tom 28 00:01:35,480 --> 00:01:38,520 Speaker 3: Lee's Bitmine. Mister Beast, if you don't know, we're talking 29 00:01:38,560 --> 00:01:42,560 Speaker 3: about Jimmy Donaldson, better known as mister Beasts, who is 30 00:01:42,600 --> 00:01:47,240 Speaker 3: a YouTube phenomenon. I've also not watched him, but he's 31 00:01:47,280 --> 00:01:51,240 Speaker 3: a billionaire. Yeah, he's got an empire. Yeah yeah, and 32 00:01:51,280 --> 00:01:53,120 Speaker 3: now he's got two hundred million dollars from. 33 00:01:53,040 --> 00:01:56,000 Speaker 2: Bitmin another content creator who's more successful than were. Yeah, 34 00:01:56,000 --> 00:01:57,760 Speaker 2: you get two und million dollars from bitmine. To me, 35 00:01:57,800 --> 00:01:59,760 Speaker 2: the interesting thing is the bitmind more than the mister 36 00:01:59,760 --> 00:02:02,600 Speaker 2: be But go on, well, I mean, mister Beast is 37 00:02:02,640 --> 00:02:04,320 Speaker 2: a content creation joy you're not. 38 00:02:04,600 --> 00:02:06,400 Speaker 3: Also, I should point out it's for a stake in 39 00:02:06,480 --> 00:02:08,079 Speaker 3: Beast Industries. 40 00:02:08,240 --> 00:02:09,920 Speaker 1: Not the man, not the Beast himself. 41 00:02:10,040 --> 00:02:12,840 Speaker 2: No, no, he's a little phenomenous. I do wonder a 42 00:02:12,880 --> 00:02:16,239 Speaker 2: little right at this moment, I had not thought about 43 00:02:16,240 --> 00:02:18,880 Speaker 2: it variously, but the Beast industry's succession plan looks like 44 00:02:19,000 --> 00:02:21,480 Speaker 2: because like he is, you know that is that is 45 00:02:21,560 --> 00:02:22,480 Speaker 2: largely an investment in. 46 00:02:22,480 --> 00:02:24,680 Speaker 1: The beast himself Ken Risk Key. 47 00:02:24,480 --> 00:02:26,440 Speaker 2: Beast Risk now. But like to me, the interesting thing 48 00:02:26,480 --> 00:02:30,079 Speaker 2: is like bid Mind, which is a fabulous company. Its 49 00:02:30,160 --> 00:02:33,960 Speaker 2: name is Bitmine Immersion. 50 00:02:33,520 --> 00:02:35,120 Speaker 1: Technologies like a nice bath. 51 00:02:35,400 --> 00:02:38,720 Speaker 2: Yes, the reason it was named that is because one 52 00:02:38,800 --> 00:02:42,880 Speaker 2: year ago it had been for several years a bitcoin 53 00:02:43,000 --> 00:02:47,639 Speaker 2: mining operation whose differentiating factor was that it immersed its 54 00:02:47,639 --> 00:02:50,480 Speaker 2: bitcoin mining rigs and a nice bath to keep them cool. 55 00:02:50,600 --> 00:02:51,079 Speaker 1: Amazing. 56 00:02:51,240 --> 00:02:53,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know a lot about the physics of this. 57 00:02:53,720 --> 00:02:56,560 Speaker 2: I assume it's not just it's not just dunking computers 58 00:02:56,560 --> 00:02:59,320 Speaker 2: and water. There's some more complicated thing going on. But 59 00:02:59,400 --> 00:03:02,880 Speaker 2: immersion is in the name because they immersed, they bathed 60 00:03:03,040 --> 00:03:06,160 Speaker 2: their bitcoin matters and cool cool liquid. 61 00:03:06,440 --> 00:03:09,960 Speaker 3: That is a really fascinating backstory because now they're better 62 00:03:10,000 --> 00:03:12,919 Speaker 3: known as being the largest corporate holder of ether. 63 00:03:13,120 --> 00:03:15,480 Speaker 2: Yes, in the last year, they pivoted away from being 64 00:03:15,480 --> 00:03:17,079 Speaker 2: a minor to being a treasury company, and they pit 65 00:03:17,120 --> 00:03:18,919 Speaker 2: it away from bitcoin to being an etherorem company. 66 00:03:18,919 --> 00:03:20,720 Speaker 1: Didn't pivot, the name didn't pivot. 67 00:03:20,760 --> 00:03:22,720 Speaker 2: The name didn't get around to that yet. But so 68 00:03:22,800 --> 00:03:24,919 Speaker 2: now they're like a treasury company with like kind of 69 00:03:24,960 --> 00:03:29,480 Speaker 2: fourteen billion dollars of mostly ethereum, although also some like 70 00:03:29,760 --> 00:03:33,560 Speaker 2: dollar cash and some random stuff. And we've talked a 71 00:03:33,600 --> 00:03:37,480 Speaker 2: lot about crypto treasury companies. Sure it was a great 72 00:03:37,480 --> 00:03:41,000 Speaker 2: trade to do six months ago, nine months ago, which 73 00:03:41,040 --> 00:03:44,120 Speaker 2: is roughly when they did it. You could put fourteen 74 00:03:44,160 --> 00:03:46,000 Speaker 2: billion dollars with theoreum in a pot and trade to 75 00:03:46,040 --> 00:03:48,160 Speaker 2: twenty eight billion dollars and you make this is great. 76 00:03:48,560 --> 00:03:50,480 Speaker 2: Now if you put fourteen billion dollars with Thereum in 77 00:03:50,480 --> 00:03:53,800 Speaker 2: a pot you trade to like thirteen billion dollars, it's 78 00:03:53,840 --> 00:03:56,400 Speaker 2: not as good a trade. And so there are a 79 00:03:56,400 --> 00:03:58,600 Speaker 2: lot of people who run crypto treasury companies who are 80 00:03:58,640 --> 00:04:00,720 Speaker 2: kind of looking around and being like, what are you 81 00:04:00,720 --> 00:04:03,320 Speaker 2: going to do with this? And one answer is your 82 00:04:03,320 --> 00:04:05,920 Speaker 2: fourteen billion dollars you can go make investments. Right, So 83 00:04:06,400 --> 00:04:08,520 Speaker 2: one thing that seems to be happening here is they're like, wow, 84 00:04:08,520 --> 00:04:10,040 Speaker 2: we have a lot of money, and like just putting 85 00:04:10,080 --> 00:04:12,560 Speaker 2: the next incremental dollar into ethereum is not going to 86 00:04:12,640 --> 00:04:14,760 Speaker 2: move the needle for us. But like mister Beast is 87 00:04:14,840 --> 00:04:15,400 Speaker 2: right there. 88 00:04:15,800 --> 00:04:17,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's pretty funny. 89 00:04:17,040 --> 00:04:20,880 Speaker 3: I saw this read Spike alert on my phone, and 90 00:04:20,960 --> 00:04:22,599 Speaker 3: I think I described it to you in an email, 91 00:04:22,680 --> 00:04:25,480 Speaker 3: is like, it's very fun twenty twenty six headline mad libs. 92 00:04:25,560 --> 00:04:28,159 Speaker 1: Yeah, and for a crypto treasury. 93 00:04:27,839 --> 00:04:30,679 Speaker 3: Company, you know, in the opening weeks of twenty twenty six, 94 00:04:31,240 --> 00:04:33,279 Speaker 3: maybe not a bad diversification play. 95 00:04:33,520 --> 00:04:35,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, crypto treasury companies are going to generate a lot 96 00:04:35,800 --> 00:04:38,880 Speaker 2: of twenty twenty six mad lives because like, it's not 97 00:04:39,920 --> 00:04:43,120 Speaker 2: as simple and obvious and good a trade as it was, 98 00:04:43,160 --> 00:04:44,960 Speaker 2: but all these people are raised billions of dollars to 99 00:04:45,000 --> 00:04:47,200 Speaker 2: do it. And now look, now, what right? And the 100 00:04:47,279 --> 00:04:49,640 Speaker 2: answer is mister beast or some other weird answer that 101 00:04:49,680 --> 00:04:51,119 Speaker 2: we're gonna find in the next couple of months. 102 00:04:51,279 --> 00:04:54,240 Speaker 3: I do like like this line from the article, and 103 00:04:54,279 --> 00:04:56,480 Speaker 3: it's written by my very good friend FORLL Donna Hirich, 104 00:04:56,560 --> 00:04:58,320 Speaker 3: so I don't want to dunk on her. But the 105 00:04:58,400 --> 00:05:01,640 Speaker 3: move highlights the growing convert between digital finance and the 106 00:05:01,680 --> 00:05:04,880 Speaker 3: creator economy, as crypto native firms look to align with 107 00:05:04,960 --> 00:05:08,400 Speaker 3: brands that dominate gen Z and jen Alpha attention. I 108 00:05:08,400 --> 00:05:10,760 Speaker 3: didn't know that this convergence was happening. 109 00:05:11,320 --> 00:05:14,000 Speaker 2: So my take on this is that they have a 110 00:05:14,040 --> 00:05:16,400 Speaker 2: pot of money, like the thing they were doing. The 111 00:05:16,400 --> 00:05:18,320 Speaker 2: money doesn't make sense anymore, so they're doing other things 112 00:05:18,360 --> 00:05:20,200 Speaker 2: with them. They're like an investing firm. But you can 113 00:05:20,279 --> 00:05:22,120 Speaker 2: have another view, which is more like wait hold Ona wrote, 114 00:05:22,120 --> 00:05:25,280 Speaker 2: which is that crypto treasury companies would all say, we're 115 00:05:25,320 --> 00:05:27,120 Speaker 2: not just an investment company. We're not just a pot 116 00:05:27,120 --> 00:05:30,640 Speaker 2: of money. We are building a new digital asset infrastructure. 117 00:05:31,040 --> 00:05:32,880 Speaker 2: And like one aspect of that in a lot of 118 00:05:33,120 --> 00:05:36,720 Speaker 2: like the presentations that crypto treasury companies made is investor education. 119 00:05:36,800 --> 00:05:41,239 Speaker 2: We're going to increase adoption of whatever our preferred token is, right, Yeah, 120 00:05:41,279 --> 00:05:43,480 Speaker 2: And so a lot of that was just like Michael Saylor, 121 00:05:43,600 --> 00:05:46,360 Speaker 2: like putting up presentations and like you know, himself being 122 00:05:46,400 --> 00:05:49,880 Speaker 2: an evangelist for bitcoin. But there are other ways to 123 00:05:49,920 --> 00:05:52,320 Speaker 2: do that. In one way is you give mister bast 124 00:05:52,320 --> 00:05:56,200 Speaker 2: two hundred million dollars and maybe in his vast content 125 00:05:56,279 --> 00:05:59,440 Speaker 2: juggernaut he says, hey, guys, buy ethereum, and maybe the 126 00:05:59,440 --> 00:06:02,080 Speaker 2: price of the goes up, and maybe that makes the 127 00:06:02,120 --> 00:06:04,080 Speaker 2: price of your part of the theoreum go up. I 128 00:06:04,080 --> 00:06:04,400 Speaker 2: don't know. 129 00:06:04,920 --> 00:06:09,360 Speaker 1: You forgot Sailor also posting AI generated images of himself 130 00:06:09,400 --> 00:06:11,640 Speaker 1: in various inspiring poses. 131 00:06:11,680 --> 00:06:15,080 Speaker 2: He's great, I mean say he does it, he's great 132 00:06:15,120 --> 00:06:17,840 Speaker 2: to say he's either great or he does a lot 133 00:06:17,920 --> 00:06:20,040 Speaker 2: of this sort of thing. But like the people who 134 00:06:20,200 --> 00:06:25,000 Speaker 2: run the other not micro not strategy, crypto treasury companies, 135 00:06:25,120 --> 00:06:27,360 Speaker 2: you know, they maybe need some help from, you know, 136 00:06:27,520 --> 00:06:30,080 Speaker 2: the greatest content creator for his generation. I think they 137 00:06:30,080 --> 00:06:30,559 Speaker 2: call them. 138 00:06:30,680 --> 00:06:31,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's the thing. 139 00:06:31,560 --> 00:06:34,440 Speaker 3: I don't want to be too glib about mister Beast 140 00:06:34,640 --> 00:06:38,839 Speaker 3: because Beast Industries it oversees basically the YouTube business, which 141 00:06:38,880 --> 00:06:41,600 Speaker 3: is YouTube's most watched series. 142 00:06:41,720 --> 00:06:43,760 Speaker 2: Creachy be clear, we can't be glit Like we have 143 00:06:43,920 --> 00:06:46,080 Speaker 2: a podcast and he has a better podcast. 144 00:06:46,200 --> 00:06:49,640 Speaker 1: He certainly does, no Amy Polar but like you know, also. 145 00:06:49,400 --> 00:06:53,239 Speaker 3: In October, Beast Industries filed a trademark application for mister 146 00:06:53,279 --> 00:06:58,400 Speaker 3: beasts Financial, which lists services such as a cryptocurrency exchange 147 00:06:58,520 --> 00:07:03,160 Speaker 3: or a cryptocurrency exchange platform just everywhere. Also consumer lend it. Yeah, 148 00:07:03,200 --> 00:07:06,000 Speaker 3: so I mean, we joke now, but he's going to 149 00:07:06,080 --> 00:07:09,320 Speaker 3: run our lives the Jeff Bezos of his time. 150 00:07:11,840 --> 00:07:13,520 Speaker 2: Would you borrow money from a Beast? 151 00:07:13,760 --> 00:07:17,640 Speaker 3: Someone would? Maybe these Jen Alpha people that we're talking about. 152 00:07:18,560 --> 00:07:23,000 Speaker 2: I've never felt more old. This whole conversation, so much 153 00:07:23,040 --> 00:07:25,720 Speaker 2: younger than I am, you. 154 00:07:25,680 --> 00:07:27,480 Speaker 3: Know, I keep telling myself, I'm going to watch a 155 00:07:27,560 --> 00:07:30,120 Speaker 3: Mister Beast's YouTube video. And I'm always looking for things 156 00:07:30,120 --> 00:07:32,200 Speaker 3: to watch on YouTube. I mostly just watch US and 157 00:07:32,280 --> 00:07:36,559 Speaker 3: L clips, and probably for market research or my job, 158 00:07:36,600 --> 00:07:39,560 Speaker 3: it'd probably at this point be a good idea to 159 00:07:39,640 --> 00:07:40,840 Speaker 3: watch a Mister Beast video. 160 00:07:41,960 --> 00:07:44,280 Speaker 2: Yes, if you come away from thinking, boy, I better 161 00:07:44,320 --> 00:07:46,320 Speaker 2: buy some ether, then. 162 00:07:49,120 --> 00:08:05,840 Speaker 4: I'll text you. 163 00:08:05,840 --> 00:08:09,400 Speaker 2: You know who else is a consumer lender who you 164 00:08:09,440 --> 00:08:10,800 Speaker 2: wouldn't want to borrow money from? 165 00:08:10,840 --> 00:08:15,600 Speaker 1: Tell me every banks. 166 00:08:13,880 --> 00:08:17,480 Speaker 2: Credit every credit card company. I don't know. My impression 167 00:08:17,560 --> 00:08:19,560 Speaker 2: is that the average interest rate on credit. 168 00:08:19,400 --> 00:08:20,600 Speaker 1: Cards is super high. 169 00:08:23,080 --> 00:08:23,400 Speaker 2: Eight tho. 170 00:08:24,400 --> 00:08:27,040 Speaker 1: I know someone I know someone who wants to change that. 171 00:08:28,400 --> 00:08:29,800 Speaker 1: His name is Donald J. Trump. 172 00:08:29,920 --> 00:08:32,800 Speaker 3: He's the President of the United States, and he would 173 00:08:32,840 --> 00:08:35,000 Speaker 3: like to see those rates capped at ten percent. 174 00:08:36,920 --> 00:08:38,920 Speaker 1: Do you have anything to say about I. 175 00:08:38,840 --> 00:08:45,000 Speaker 3: Mean, it's pretty amazing. This isn't a new topic, right, 176 00:08:45,280 --> 00:08:46,760 Speaker 3: and it's not. 177 00:08:46,840 --> 00:08:52,080 Speaker 2: Like a traditional Republican party talking. It's like more of 178 00:08:52,120 --> 00:08:56,360 Speaker 2: a you know, Elizabeth Warren introduced legislation sort of plan, 179 00:08:56,679 --> 00:08:58,280 Speaker 2: like a Bernie Sanders kind of Well. 180 00:08:58,280 --> 00:09:02,520 Speaker 3: It's amazing because Bernie Sanders and AOC I think they 181 00:09:02,559 --> 00:09:05,760 Speaker 3: were advocating for like fifteen percent originally, like back in 182 00:09:05,760 --> 00:09:10,600 Speaker 3: twenty nineteen ten. Yeah, so President Trump undercut them at 183 00:09:10,600 --> 00:09:12,080 Speaker 3: their own game, which is pretty amazing. 184 00:09:12,720 --> 00:09:14,600 Speaker 1: Make at five ye why not? 185 00:09:15,240 --> 00:09:17,760 Speaker 3: The banks, of course are it seems like trying to 186 00:09:17,760 --> 00:09:20,160 Speaker 3: one up each other on like doomsday predictions of what 187 00:09:20,200 --> 00:09:25,199 Speaker 3: this would mean. It seems like the consensus is that 188 00:09:25,280 --> 00:09:27,560 Speaker 3: they would basically offer less credit. 189 00:09:27,559 --> 00:09:30,800 Speaker 2: Right Like I and I think a lot of financial 190 00:09:30,840 --> 00:09:34,000 Speaker 2: columnists have bad intuitions around the credit component of credit 191 00:09:34,000 --> 00:09:37,040 Speaker 2: cards because like I pay my balance every month, I 192 00:09:37,080 --> 00:09:40,720 Speaker 2: get rewards. Credit cards are a way to get points 193 00:09:40,960 --> 00:09:43,920 Speaker 2: and a convenient payment mechanism and not a credit mechanism. 194 00:09:44,000 --> 00:09:46,480 Speaker 2: The reason they're not a credit mechanism they charge like 195 00:09:46,520 --> 00:09:49,480 Speaker 2: twenty percent interest and if you want credit, there are 196 00:09:49,480 --> 00:09:52,040 Speaker 2: other ways to get credit. For some people, that's less true. 197 00:09:52,200 --> 00:09:55,960 Speaker 2: And it's a standard form of consumer debt. And my 198 00:09:56,040 --> 00:10:00,600 Speaker 2: assumption is that the rates are so high because one 199 00:10:01,200 --> 00:10:02,880 Speaker 2: the default risk is high and two years short of 200 00:10:02,920 --> 00:10:05,000 Speaker 2: getting adversely selected, right because the people who carry a 201 00:10:05,000 --> 00:10:06,319 Speaker 2: balance with the people who are not going to be 202 00:10:06,360 --> 00:10:06,560 Speaker 2: able to. 203 00:10:06,559 --> 00:10:06,959 Speaker 1: Pay at off. 204 00:10:07,480 --> 00:10:10,560 Speaker 2: But there is like research, you know, Brian Sheer at 205 00:10:10,640 --> 00:10:14,120 Speaker 2: Vanderbilt has research on this that is kind of possibly 206 00:10:14,280 --> 00:10:16,600 Speaker 2: underpinning some of these arguments, saying that the credit card 207 00:10:16,640 --> 00:10:19,199 Speaker 2: industry is so profitable that it could rain and interest 208 00:10:19,280 --> 00:10:21,960 Speaker 2: rates save billions for Americans and small businesses and still 209 00:10:21,960 --> 00:10:24,720 Speaker 2: make profits. Right, so there's there's some fat to be cut. 210 00:10:24,720 --> 00:10:28,160 Speaker 2: Here is something that some economists think, although you will 211 00:10:28,160 --> 00:10:29,160 Speaker 2: not hear that from. 212 00:10:28,960 --> 00:10:32,439 Speaker 3: Banks, No, No, What you will hear from banks is 213 00:10:32,520 --> 00:10:35,719 Speaker 3: the CFO of JP Morgan, for example, saying that if 214 00:10:35,720 --> 00:10:38,320 Speaker 3: it were to happen, it would be very bad for consumers, 215 00:10:38,480 --> 00:10:41,920 Speaker 3: very bad for the economy, and basically that their card 216 00:10:41,960 --> 00:10:44,160 Speaker 3: operation would be a business that we would have to 217 00:10:44,240 --> 00:10:47,760 Speaker 3: significantly change. And I've seen, you know, Bloomberg News basically 218 00:10:47,840 --> 00:10:51,280 Speaker 3: describe the card's business is like the crown jewel of banks. 219 00:10:51,679 --> 00:10:54,720 Speaker 2: Well, I mean the crown jewel of banks are used 220 00:10:55,400 --> 00:10:59,000 Speaker 2: against JP market. It's so good, then it could be 221 00:10:59,080 --> 00:11:01,520 Speaker 2: less good and still you know, give credit to people. 222 00:11:01,520 --> 00:11:04,679 Speaker 2: But my intuition is that they are right. And like 223 00:11:05,040 --> 00:11:07,880 Speaker 2: in particular, if banks had to cut my credit card 224 00:11:07,960 --> 00:11:11,080 Speaker 2: interest rate to ten percent, that wouldn't affect anyone because 225 00:11:11,160 --> 00:11:13,240 Speaker 2: I don't pay interest on my credit card. But if 226 00:11:13,240 --> 00:11:16,120 Speaker 2: they had to cut like the lowest credit score bars 227 00:11:16,160 --> 00:11:18,400 Speaker 2: to ten percent, They would probably do a lot less 228 00:11:18,679 --> 00:11:20,959 Speaker 2: credit provision to those bars, right, and there would be 229 00:11:21,600 --> 00:11:24,040 Speaker 2: you know, you'd see just the migration to credit cards 230 00:11:24,080 --> 00:11:27,400 Speaker 2: being a like less available product and for people with 231 00:11:27,480 --> 00:11:28,440 Speaker 2: higher credit scores. 232 00:11:28,600 --> 00:11:32,640 Speaker 3: Yeah, and those people who would be cut out, seems 233 00:11:32,679 --> 00:11:35,000 Speaker 3: like again the consensus would be that they would go 234 00:11:35,040 --> 00:11:39,440 Speaker 3: to like payday lenders more who don't exactly offer better 235 00:11:39,520 --> 00:11:40,439 Speaker 3: rates necessarily. 236 00:11:40,520 --> 00:11:42,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I don't like the consumer credit right 237 00:11:43,000 --> 00:11:45,000 Speaker 2: now is interesting, right because there's been a huge rise 238 00:11:45,080 --> 00:11:48,760 Speaker 2: and buy now pay later, which is often structured as 239 00:11:49,320 --> 00:11:54,960 Speaker 2: zero interest, fairly sure repayment periods, and loosely speaking, they 240 00:11:54,960 --> 00:11:57,120 Speaker 2: make their money on like interchanin on like swipe fees, right, 241 00:11:57,480 --> 00:11:59,480 Speaker 2: and so there would be some of that, right, but 242 00:11:59,520 --> 00:12:02,880 Speaker 2: that would probrobably you probably get less credit provision that way, right, 243 00:12:02,880 --> 00:12:04,840 Speaker 2: Like you probably couldn't run up as much of a 244 00:12:04,880 --> 00:12:06,599 Speaker 2: balance on your Binea appay. 245 00:12:06,400 --> 00:12:07,720 Speaker 1: Later, yeah product. 246 00:12:08,520 --> 00:12:11,000 Speaker 2: The other thing that Trump wants is to he's also 247 00:12:11,160 --> 00:12:15,800 Speaker 2: talked about swipe fees. Yes, you squeeze credit cards from 248 00:12:15,840 --> 00:12:17,600 Speaker 2: both ends, right, And like, if you're a credit card 249 00:12:17,600 --> 00:12:20,440 Speaker 2: company and you can charge a lot of money in 250 00:12:20,520 --> 00:12:23,880 Speaker 2: swipe fees, then like you can make a lower interest 251 00:12:23,920 --> 00:12:27,240 Speaker 2: rate work in some form for some time, But if 252 00:12:27,240 --> 00:12:29,079 Speaker 2: you both have to give up your swipe fees and 253 00:12:29,120 --> 00:12:30,560 Speaker 2: you have to give out your interest, it's like a 254 00:12:30,640 --> 00:12:31,600 Speaker 2: much worse product. 255 00:12:31,840 --> 00:12:32,200 Speaker 1: Yeah. 256 00:12:32,840 --> 00:12:34,800 Speaker 3: I am really interested to see what happens over the 257 00:12:34,880 --> 00:12:37,719 Speaker 3: next couple of days with this, because we're recording this 258 00:12:38,200 --> 00:12:40,440 Speaker 3: on January fifteenth. 259 00:12:40,040 --> 00:12:42,560 Speaker 2: I'll tell it's gonna happen over the next couple of days. Okay, well, no, 260 00:12:42,640 --> 00:12:45,240 Speaker 2: I shouldn't say it. My genuine instinct is nothing, but like, 261 00:12:45,280 --> 00:12:47,360 Speaker 2: the things are crazy now, so maybe. 262 00:12:47,080 --> 00:12:50,199 Speaker 1: Maybe well specifically I'm referring to January twentieth. 263 00:12:50,600 --> 00:12:54,240 Speaker 2: Oh, yes, that's when if you don't stop charging more 264 00:12:54,280 --> 00:12:56,720 Speaker 2: than ten percent interest, you'll be in violation of the law. 265 00:12:56,800 --> 00:12:57,800 Speaker 1: The law, the law? 266 00:12:57,840 --> 00:12:58,280 Speaker 2: What law? 267 00:12:58,600 --> 00:13:00,319 Speaker 1: That's what I would like to know, And that's what 268 00:13:00,360 --> 00:13:00,880 Speaker 1: I was going. 269 00:13:00,720 --> 00:13:02,640 Speaker 2: To ask, secret law and Donald Trump's had. 270 00:13:02,559 --> 00:13:04,800 Speaker 3: Well, apparently a lot of these banks are going to 271 00:13:04,800 --> 00:13:06,120 Speaker 3: be in violation of it. 272 00:13:06,120 --> 00:13:07,200 Speaker 2: It does seem that way. 273 00:13:07,400 --> 00:13:10,040 Speaker 1: You know, who won't built, Built? 274 00:13:10,280 --> 00:13:10,720 Speaker 2: I love it. 275 00:13:10,760 --> 00:13:14,600 Speaker 1: Built is seizing the moment unveiling three new credit cards 276 00:13:14,600 --> 00:13:16,400 Speaker 1: with interest rates capped at ten percent. 277 00:13:17,080 --> 00:13:19,320 Speaker 2: That's not true, right, It's isn't it? A one year 278 00:13:19,440 --> 00:13:23,320 Speaker 2: promotional rate. Yes, because that's really interesting about this, Like 279 00:13:23,360 --> 00:13:25,840 Speaker 2: Trump is not like credit cards can only charge ten 280 00:13:25,840 --> 00:13:28,000 Speaker 2: percent for the rest of time. He's like for the 281 00:13:28,040 --> 00:13:31,640 Speaker 2: next year until the midterm elections, you have to charge 282 00:13:31,679 --> 00:13:34,559 Speaker 2: cha percent or less. And you know credit card companies 283 00:13:34,600 --> 00:13:36,360 Speaker 2: do that all the time all the time. They offer 284 00:13:36,440 --> 00:13:40,920 Speaker 2: like zero percent introductory rates, right, Like you can like 285 00:13:41,520 --> 00:13:44,800 Speaker 2: have some sort of promotional program that charges ten percent 286 00:13:44,920 --> 00:13:47,200 Speaker 2: or less to attract customers, right and then you know 287 00:13:47,240 --> 00:13:50,600 Speaker 2: eventually jacking up to thirty percent. What a great time 288 00:13:50,760 --> 00:13:53,440 Speaker 2: to have a promotional But these promotional preyers, like you 289 00:13:53,480 --> 00:13:56,120 Speaker 2: often see people being like zero percent introductory APR for 290 00:13:56,120 --> 00:13:58,360 Speaker 2: the first six months it built, is like ten percent, 291 00:13:58,640 --> 00:14:01,400 Speaker 2: no problem, ten percent directory right for one year. 292 00:14:01,320 --> 00:14:02,439 Speaker 1: After new purchases. 293 00:14:03,559 --> 00:14:06,880 Speaker 2: It's a great like combination of politics and marketing. 294 00:14:06,960 --> 00:14:09,440 Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm trying to find all the different asterisks here, 295 00:14:09,679 --> 00:14:13,040 Speaker 3: but yeah, it is great promotion. And I mean you 296 00:14:13,040 --> 00:14:15,480 Speaker 3: haven't really seen anyone else, or at least not in 297 00:14:15,559 --> 00:14:18,680 Speaker 3: like a big splashy way like this sort of take 298 00:14:18,720 --> 00:14:21,080 Speaker 3: advantage of this moment. It's mostly been pushed back from 299 00:14:21,120 --> 00:14:21,440 Speaker 3: the bank. 300 00:14:21,560 --> 00:14:23,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, because if you if you were a bank with 301 00:14:23,360 --> 00:14:26,920 Speaker 2: a long standing portfolio like and you're like tenversent the 302 00:14:26,960 --> 00:14:29,040 Speaker 2: directory rate on our new card. Like it's a little 303 00:14:29,040 --> 00:14:32,120 Speaker 2: bit like people notice that you're mostly not charging that right. 304 00:14:32,400 --> 00:14:36,400 Speaker 2: Built I think has some advantages and the like my 305 00:14:36,440 --> 00:14:38,440 Speaker 2: impression is like they have fairly high credit quality and 306 00:14:38,560 --> 00:14:40,640 Speaker 2: like like they're the pay your rent with a credit 307 00:14:40,720 --> 00:14:42,840 Speaker 2: card thing, Like I think they have probably different economics 308 00:14:42,880 --> 00:14:43,680 Speaker 2: from a regular bank. 309 00:14:43,760 --> 00:14:46,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, we were talking about this earlier in person that 310 00:14:47,320 --> 00:14:50,680 Speaker 3: we've talked about Built on this podcast before, and I. 311 00:14:50,240 --> 00:14:53,160 Speaker 2: Believe you and you told me that I forget. 312 00:14:51,600 --> 00:14:55,760 Speaker 3: What the specific We've definitely talked about it on this podcast, 313 00:14:55,880 --> 00:14:58,360 Speaker 3: but yeah, they have a really interesting model. 314 00:14:58,840 --> 00:15:01,240 Speaker 2: But yeah, you how worked and you didn't know. I 315 00:15:01,400 --> 00:15:04,040 Speaker 2: don't frankly know either. But like my impression is that, 316 00:15:04,080 --> 00:15:06,560 Speaker 2: like you can't normally put your rent on your credit 317 00:15:06,600 --> 00:15:10,320 Speaker 2: card because like that'll cost your landlord, you know, three 318 00:15:10,320 --> 00:15:14,040 Speaker 2: percent interchange pee. But Built has negotiated with landlords to 319 00:15:14,040 --> 00:15:16,560 Speaker 2: make them like Built so much that they can charge 320 00:15:16,600 --> 00:15:17,640 Speaker 2: renting their credit card. 321 00:15:18,000 --> 00:15:21,120 Speaker 1: And now mortgages and no mortgages, pay for your mortgage 322 00:15:21,160 --> 00:15:21,840 Speaker 1: with your card. 323 00:15:21,880 --> 00:15:24,160 Speaker 2: They have enough like moving pieces that like, you know, 324 00:15:24,480 --> 00:15:26,680 Speaker 2: the twenty percent interest on balances is not the most 325 00:15:26,680 --> 00:15:28,360 Speaker 2: important part of their business, and they can go around 326 00:15:28,400 --> 00:15:29,200 Speaker 2: mean like ten percent. 327 00:15:29,720 --> 00:15:31,160 Speaker 1: Yeah, there you go, Donald Trump. 328 00:15:31,320 --> 00:15:35,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, the countdown's on. As of right now, we're five 329 00:15:35,640 --> 00:15:37,400 Speaker 3: days away from all those life. 330 00:15:37,400 --> 00:15:41,600 Speaker 2: I still think the answer to happen on there's nothing but. 331 00:15:41,480 --> 00:15:44,400 Speaker 1: What if they're all arrested, arrested. 332 00:15:45,440 --> 00:15:47,360 Speaker 2: Law law, nobody knows. 333 00:15:47,560 --> 00:15:54,160 Speaker 1: We'd have an emergency podcast, emergency podcast hiding. Is there 334 00:15:54,160 --> 00:15:55,960 Speaker 1: anything else to say about this specific topic. 335 00:15:56,000 --> 00:15:57,720 Speaker 2: I'm sure there's a lot of things. My impression is 336 00:15:57,720 --> 00:16:00,440 Speaker 2: that people on financial television and frankly and financial journalism, 337 00:16:00,440 --> 00:16:02,200 Speaker 2: I've been talking about it pretty months, not for a week, 338 00:16:02,320 --> 00:16:03,120 Speaker 2: you know what's amazing. 339 00:16:03,920 --> 00:16:05,800 Speaker 3: I would have been one of those people, but I 340 00:16:05,840 --> 00:16:08,040 Speaker 3: spent the first half of this week at the JP 341 00:16:08,120 --> 00:16:11,480 Speaker 3: Morgan Healthcare conference, so I was watching these headlines fly by, 342 00:16:12,240 --> 00:16:14,960 Speaker 3: and no, not this year. 343 00:16:15,640 --> 00:16:19,200 Speaker 1: At least, that was my understanding. It's too busy dealing 344 00:16:19,240 --> 00:16:21,440 Speaker 1: with Yeah. 345 00:16:21,520 --> 00:16:28,840 Speaker 3: Because sent that truth Social last Friday night. I remember 346 00:16:28,840 --> 00:16:29,400 Speaker 3: it was at night. 347 00:16:29,440 --> 00:16:33,480 Speaker 1: I was on my couch, run your couch, looking at you. No, 348 00:16:33,560 --> 00:16:34,080 Speaker 1: I wasn't. 349 00:16:34,160 --> 00:16:36,200 Speaker 3: I actually I don't have a truth Social account. But 350 00:16:36,240 --> 00:16:39,960 Speaker 3: everything that he posts then reed spikes on the terminal, 351 00:16:40,000 --> 00:16:41,840 Speaker 3: so I get it through my app anyway. So it's 352 00:16:41,920 --> 00:16:44,880 Speaker 3: it's like having a truth social account, I imagine. I 353 00:16:44,880 --> 00:16:46,960 Speaker 3: don't know what the other posters are up to. I 354 00:16:47,000 --> 00:16:50,760 Speaker 3: don't know if it's one man platform or what someone 355 00:16:51,160 --> 00:16:51,600 Speaker 3: let us know. 356 00:16:53,040 --> 00:17:11,600 Speaker 1: Regeneration true beast mode speaking of healthcare, Yeah. 357 00:17:11,480 --> 00:17:15,600 Speaker 2: Go on, I read this speek about this lovely well 358 00:17:15,680 --> 00:17:19,760 Speaker 2: terrible insider trading case. These like three brothers are accused 359 00:17:19,800 --> 00:17:23,679 Speaker 2: of doing all sorts of insider trading. I think they're like, 360 00:17:23,680 --> 00:17:26,119 Speaker 2: they're like healthcare people. Like I think they worked in 361 00:17:26,160 --> 00:17:28,160 Speaker 2: healthcare banking, or at least one of them did, and 362 00:17:28,480 --> 00:17:31,480 Speaker 2: they do a lot of trading in healthcare stocks and 363 00:17:31,680 --> 00:17:35,320 Speaker 2: allegedly insider trading and market manipulation and healthcare stocks, and 364 00:17:35,359 --> 00:17:38,080 Speaker 2: some of the accusations are wild. Like this is the 365 00:17:38,080 --> 00:17:40,159 Speaker 2: most interesting to me, is like, you know, I love. 366 00:17:40,000 --> 00:17:42,199 Speaker 1: Insider trading and like doing it. 367 00:17:42,280 --> 00:17:44,560 Speaker 2: So like the main thing they're accused of doing is 368 00:17:44,600 --> 00:17:45,680 Speaker 2: like just standard stuff. 369 00:17:45,720 --> 00:17:45,840 Speaker 3: Right. 370 00:17:45,840 --> 00:17:48,120 Speaker 2: They had a friend who they like. The one guy 371 00:17:48,119 --> 00:17:51,080 Speaker 2: had worked with him and he was a fairly junior 372 00:17:51,119 --> 00:17:54,399 Speaker 2: banker at Lizard. He's a healthcare banker, and so he 373 00:17:54,560 --> 00:17:59,000 Speaker 2: had some information about Lazard's healthcare deal flow and he 374 00:17:59,000 --> 00:18:03,040 Speaker 2: would just tell his buddy allegedly, hey, you know this 375 00:18:03,080 --> 00:18:05,600 Speaker 2: deal is coming, and the buddy would allegedly trade options 376 00:18:05,600 --> 00:18:08,440 Speaker 2: and made like forty million dollars right like the ring 377 00:18:08,440 --> 00:18:10,679 Speaker 2: of them made forty millions. And in exchange for this, 378 00:18:11,520 --> 00:18:15,840 Speaker 2: the brother gave the banker gifts, including a Rolex watch, 379 00:18:16,000 --> 00:18:20,240 Speaker 2: fine help in drafting slides for a PowerPoint presentation that 380 00:18:20,280 --> 00:18:22,440 Speaker 2: he was preparing as part of his job at Lizard, 381 00:18:22,880 --> 00:18:26,840 Speaker 2: which is like, really, he's facing up to twenty five 382 00:18:26,920 --> 00:18:29,360 Speaker 2: years in prison or whatever. I want a PowerPoint. 383 00:18:29,400 --> 00:18:32,240 Speaker 1: I want to see the power point. It's probably it 384 00:18:32,240 --> 00:18:36,600 Speaker 1: can only be so good. I mean that's what you say. 385 00:18:36,640 --> 00:18:39,520 Speaker 2: Now, No, like, if you're doing your power point, if 386 00:18:39,560 --> 00:18:42,320 Speaker 2: your banking job with Bizard, like the floor is high, 387 00:18:42,359 --> 00:18:44,720 Speaker 2: it has to be good, but the ceiling is low, 388 00:18:45,000 --> 00:18:46,439 Speaker 2: it can't be that good. And I also give him 389 00:18:46,440 --> 00:18:48,680 Speaker 2: advice and assistance in his search for a new investment 390 00:18:48,720 --> 00:18:51,040 Speaker 2: banking position, which did not work out well because it's 391 00:18:51,040 --> 00:18:53,440 Speaker 2: hard to keep the investment banking job once you're charged 392 00:18:53,440 --> 00:18:53,639 Speaker 2: with the. 393 00:18:54,320 --> 00:18:56,720 Speaker 3: Most valuable piece of advice probably would have been to 394 00:18:56,800 --> 00:18:58,040 Speaker 3: stop insider trading. 395 00:18:58,400 --> 00:19:00,800 Speaker 2: Yes, the one piece of advice he could not provide 396 00:19:00,880 --> 00:19:03,359 Speaker 2: in the circumstances. But yes, But so that's most of 397 00:19:03,400 --> 00:19:06,000 Speaker 2: what they did, most of the money that they're used 398 00:19:06,000 --> 00:19:07,600 Speaker 2: of making. But they also did like other wild stuff, 399 00:19:07,600 --> 00:19:12,399 Speaker 2: including insider trading on drug trials, right, so, like you 400 00:19:12,400 --> 00:19:15,119 Speaker 2: have a biotech company, it's like trialing a cancer drug. 401 00:19:15,720 --> 00:19:17,480 Speaker 2: If the results are good, a stock will go up. 402 00:19:17,480 --> 00:19:19,160 Speaker 2: If the results are bad, the stock will go down. 403 00:19:19,560 --> 00:19:23,679 Speaker 2: And so they allegedly set up fake email addresses for 404 00:19:23,760 --> 00:19:27,119 Speaker 2: fake doctors and would email the people doing the trial 405 00:19:27,200 --> 00:19:29,000 Speaker 2: to be like, I have a cancer patient who would 406 00:19:29,000 --> 00:19:30,879 Speaker 2: like to be part of the trial, and they'd be 407 00:19:30,880 --> 00:19:34,120 Speaker 2: like okay, and then they'd be like, can you tell 408 00:19:34,119 --> 00:19:35,879 Speaker 2: me how it's going so that I know whether I 409 00:19:35,880 --> 00:19:37,600 Speaker 2: should put my cancer patient into the trial. 410 00:19:37,600 --> 00:19:39,040 Speaker 1: And they'd allegedly. 411 00:19:38,720 --> 00:19:43,639 Speaker 2: Get information that was useful for a hypothetical doctor, but 412 00:19:43,720 --> 00:19:45,679 Speaker 2: also useful for an investor, right because if it's like 413 00:19:45,720 --> 00:19:48,680 Speaker 2: a trial is going very well, then you can buy 414 00:19:48,720 --> 00:19:51,960 Speaker 2: call options on the stock. And so they allegedly did that. 415 00:19:52,040 --> 00:19:56,080 Speaker 2: They got some information. Apparently it wasn't like market moving enough, 416 00:19:56,600 --> 00:19:59,920 Speaker 2: is my impression, because instead of using that information to reaptions, 417 00:20:00,080 --> 00:20:02,720 Speaker 2: also like made up fake information saying the trial was 418 00:20:02,760 --> 00:20:05,280 Speaker 2: going really well, and then instead of like putting out 419 00:20:05,280 --> 00:20:07,879 Speaker 2: a fake press release or just like talking about it 420 00:20:07,920 --> 00:20:12,919 Speaker 2: on Twitter, they like very subtly created like fake profiles 421 00:20:12,920 --> 00:20:16,679 Speaker 2: on cancer support sites and like leaked it in a 422 00:20:16,680 --> 00:20:18,679 Speaker 2: way that didn't seem like they were hyping a stock, 423 00:20:18,760 --> 00:20:20,720 Speaker 2: but that made it seem like it was like legitimate 424 00:20:20,840 --> 00:20:23,199 Speaker 2: medical information. And then they took that and leaked it 425 00:20:23,240 --> 00:20:25,439 Speaker 2: on Twitter, and like the stock pannel, they didn't make 426 00:20:25,440 --> 00:20:29,320 Speaker 2: a lot of money on this. This is very convoluted. Yes, 427 00:20:29,880 --> 00:20:32,679 Speaker 2: like forty million dollars on just straightforwardly being told about mergers, right, 428 00:20:32,720 --> 00:20:35,240 Speaker 2: so so like that's a better deal. But this was 429 00:20:35,280 --> 00:20:38,199 Speaker 2: the very sophisticated and interesting form of insider trading that 430 00:20:38,480 --> 00:20:40,000 Speaker 2: it didn't work as well as the regular form of 431 00:20:40,040 --> 00:20:40,760 Speaker 2: insider showing. 432 00:20:40,880 --> 00:20:42,639 Speaker 1: It seems more evil. 433 00:20:42,920 --> 00:20:46,240 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, yeah, Kevin, that we're talking about like breast 434 00:20:46,280 --> 00:20:47,199 Speaker 3: cancer drug trials. 435 00:20:47,320 --> 00:20:52,000 Speaker 2: Right, it's gross, but also like you could imagine the 436 00:20:52,080 --> 00:20:57,080 Speaker 2: upshot of this being people who run biotech companies and 437 00:20:57,160 --> 00:21:00,879 Speaker 2: doctors who run drug trials thinking, ohn, know, we have 438 00:21:00,920 --> 00:21:04,480 Speaker 2: to worry about insider trading by the doctors and patients 439 00:21:04,480 --> 00:21:07,199 Speaker 2: in this trial and sort of having more safeguards to 440 00:21:07,240 --> 00:21:10,600 Speaker 2: prevent that in a way that is bad for cancer patients, 441 00:21:10,920 --> 00:21:14,240 Speaker 2: but that like you know, prevents this sort of insider trading. 442 00:21:14,320 --> 00:21:14,560 Speaker 1: Right. 443 00:21:14,640 --> 00:21:16,359 Speaker 2: It's like, if you're a cancer patient and you go 444 00:21:16,400 --> 00:21:18,720 Speaker 2: to a drug trial, like nobody's like, oh, you better 445 00:21:18,760 --> 00:21:20,639 Speaker 2: sign this piece of paper saying that you want insider 446 00:21:20,640 --> 00:21:22,280 Speaker 2: trade on and we're going to monitor your training because 447 00:21:22,280 --> 00:21:23,000 Speaker 2: it's not that important. 448 00:21:23,080 --> 00:21:24,240 Speaker 1: Like that is so far. 449 00:21:24,480 --> 00:21:28,439 Speaker 2: Right, exactly, it's not far from these guys. Yeah ideas, 450 00:21:28,480 --> 00:21:30,080 Speaker 2: and so now it's like you've sort of made the 451 00:21:30,080 --> 00:21:32,040 Speaker 2: whole drug trial process a little bit worse for everyone. 452 00:21:32,240 --> 00:21:34,359 Speaker 3: I was going to say that, Unfortunately, it feels like 453 00:21:35,760 --> 00:21:40,520 Speaker 3: drug trials, especially for small publicly listed biotech stocks, or 454 00:21:40,600 --> 00:21:43,360 Speaker 3: like sort of the perfect place for this sort of thing. 455 00:21:43,480 --> 00:21:44,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, and there's. 456 00:21:44,040 --> 00:21:47,000 Speaker 2: Tons of insider trading on them or like cases, but 457 00:21:47,040 --> 00:21:51,480 Speaker 2: they're never patients. They're like a consulting doctor is leaking 458 00:21:51,520 --> 00:21:52,280 Speaker 2: to a hedge finanale. 459 00:21:52,359 --> 00:21:52,520 Speaker 4: You know. 460 00:21:52,680 --> 00:21:55,000 Speaker 2: There's a long history of people worrying about insider trading 461 00:21:55,040 --> 00:21:58,480 Speaker 2: and drug trials, but for the patients, that's kind of 462 00:21:58,480 --> 00:21:58,920 Speaker 2: a new though. 463 00:21:59,359 --> 00:22:03,080 Speaker 3: Yeah, the fake patients, fake patients, the patients themselves. 464 00:22:03,600 --> 00:22:05,239 Speaker 2: They wrote about this, and I was like, hypothetically, if 465 00:22:05,240 --> 00:22:06,879 Speaker 2: you were a patient and you took the drug and 466 00:22:06,920 --> 00:22:08,960 Speaker 2: it worked really well in your case, and then you 467 00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:11,080 Speaker 2: bought call options on that. Would that be insider trading? 468 00:22:11,320 --> 00:22:13,480 Speaker 2: And the answer sort of depends on what you've signed. 469 00:22:13,520 --> 00:22:16,399 Speaker 2: I think legal advice, but also like no one's going 470 00:22:16,480 --> 00:22:19,840 Speaker 2: to come after you, like come on, but yeah, these 471 00:22:19,880 --> 00:22:21,679 Speaker 2: guys kind of run it for a well. 472 00:22:21,680 --> 00:22:24,040 Speaker 3: In the setup, you did ask the popular question that 473 00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:26,240 Speaker 3: you know, say you were on a Boeing plane that. 474 00:22:26,280 --> 00:22:30,120 Speaker 1: Was going down and it's like a big Reddit. What 475 00:22:30,200 --> 00:22:30,800 Speaker 1: was the answer? 476 00:22:32,520 --> 00:22:33,800 Speaker 2: Yeah, so this is like a class. This is like 477 00:22:33,840 --> 00:22:36,160 Speaker 2: a Reddit thing that people send me a lot when 478 00:22:36,200 --> 00:22:39,200 Speaker 2: it was first posted and then periodically send me every 479 00:22:39,200 --> 00:22:42,359 Speaker 2: month since. But there was a Boeing plane where like 480 00:22:42,400 --> 00:22:44,879 Speaker 2: the door popped off in midair and it was pretty 481 00:22:44,920 --> 00:22:46,840 Speaker 2: hairing for the people on the plane, and someone posted 482 00:22:46,920 --> 00:22:49,040 Speaker 2: on Reddit if I were on that plane, could I 483 00:22:49,040 --> 00:22:53,320 Speaker 2: have bought put options on Boeing? Would that be insider trading? 484 00:22:53,480 --> 00:22:56,399 Speaker 2: And my answer is not legal advice is no, that's fine, 485 00:22:56,440 --> 00:22:58,480 Speaker 2: Like that's you know, it's like you're using your product right, 486 00:22:58,480 --> 00:23:01,280 Speaker 2: Like it's like if you have an iPhone and like, yeah, 487 00:23:01,320 --> 00:23:02,920 Speaker 2: you don't think it works very well. You can sell 488 00:23:02,920 --> 00:23:04,439 Speaker 2: Apple stock and if you think it works great, you 489 00:23:04,440 --> 00:23:07,040 Speaker 2: can buy Apple stock like this normal people interact with 490 00:23:07,080 --> 00:23:10,159 Speaker 2: the stock market is like you experience the company's products 491 00:23:10,240 --> 00:23:11,600 Speaker 2: or services and then you trade on it. 492 00:23:11,680 --> 00:23:13,520 Speaker 3: I guess if like you're on that plane and you've 493 00:23:13,520 --> 00:23:16,040 Speaker 3: called all your loved ones everyone you would want to 494 00:23:16,040 --> 00:23:18,600 Speaker 3: talk to, and you have some extra time, that it's 495 00:23:18,640 --> 00:23:20,840 Speaker 3: not unreasonable that you would think to buy puts. 496 00:23:21,840 --> 00:23:24,000 Speaker 2: I feel like the framing of the question and Reddit 497 00:23:24,160 --> 00:23:26,400 Speaker 2: suggests that, like you don't have that many loved ones, 498 00:23:26,880 --> 00:23:30,120 Speaker 2: like kind of a DJA. But yeah, sure, sure, sure, sure. 499 00:23:30,040 --> 00:23:34,160 Speaker 3: Yeah, I just I like to make everything personal, right, 500 00:23:34,440 --> 00:23:35,080 Speaker 3: I would. 501 00:23:34,800 --> 00:23:38,440 Speaker 2: Not I think have the presence of mind to buy 502 00:23:38,440 --> 00:23:41,080 Speaker 2: puts on Boeing is the planet is like the plane 503 00:23:41,160 --> 00:23:44,080 Speaker 2: lands maybe, but anyway, plant is I think it's fine. 504 00:23:44,359 --> 00:23:52,119 Speaker 2: I think it's fine, but it's something like this. And 505 00:23:52,200 --> 00:23:53,600 Speaker 2: that was the Money Stuff Podcast. 506 00:23:53,920 --> 00:23:56,040 Speaker 1: I'm Matt Levine and I'm Katie Greifeld. 507 00:23:56,240 --> 00:23:58,400 Speaker 2: You can find my work by subscribing to the Money 508 00:23:58,400 --> 00:23:59,120 Speaker 2: Stuff Letter. 509 00:23:59,280 --> 00:24:02,560 Speaker 3: I'm Bloomberg and you can find me on Bloomberg TV 510 00:24:02,760 --> 00:24:06,200 Speaker 3: every day on the close between three and five pm Eastern. 511 00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:08,919 Speaker 2: We'd love to hear from you. You can send an 512 00:24:08,920 --> 00:24:12,280 Speaker 2: email to Moneypod at Bloomberg dot net. Ask us a 513 00:24:12,359 --> 00:24:14,200 Speaker 2: question and we might answer it on the air. 514 00:24:14,520 --> 00:24:17,119 Speaker 3: You can also subscribe to our show wherever you're listening 515 00:24:17,200 --> 00:24:19,040 Speaker 3: right now and leave us a review. It helps more 516 00:24:19,080 --> 00:24:19,920 Speaker 3: people find the show. 517 00:24:20,320 --> 00:24:24,680 Speaker 2: The Money Stuff Podcast is produced by Anamazarakis, Moses Onam 518 00:24:25,080 --> 00:24:26,679 Speaker 2: and Alexis HoTT Our. 519 00:24:26,760 --> 00:24:28,840 Speaker 1: Theme music was composed by Blake Maples. 520 00:24:29,160 --> 00:24:31,639 Speaker 2: Thanks for listening to the Money Stuff Podcast. We'll be 521 00:24:31,680 --> 00:24:33,360 Speaker 2: back next week with more stuff.