WEBVTT - Valerie June 0:00:02.120 --> 0:00:05.080 Hello everyone, and welcome to another episode of Inside the 0:00:05.120 --> 0:00:08.239 Studio on iHeart Radio. My name is Jordan run Tug, 0:00:08.400 --> 0:00:11.760 But enough about me. I first learned about my guest 0:00:11.840 --> 0:00:14.120 today a few years back from a dear friend of mine. 0:00:14.640 --> 0:00:16.760 They told me, you can listen to her music when 0:00:16.760 --> 0:00:21.440 you're at your lowest, and it's like receiving a nourishing hug. Frankly, 0:00:21.480 --> 0:00:23.680 I don't think I can do any better than that introduction. 0:00:24.200 --> 0:00:28.000 Her latest album, The Moon and Stars Prescriptions for Dreamers 0:00:28.400 --> 0:00:31.520 encompasses so much of it's warm and good and music 0:00:32.240 --> 0:00:37.599 earthy roots, the soulful, passionate, and compassionate. The songs are 0:00:37.600 --> 0:00:40.440 steeped in her Memphis upbringing, with a voice honed in 0:00:40.479 --> 0:00:44.240 the church, orchestrations by the great Stacks arranger Leicster Snell, 0:00:44.840 --> 0:00:48.360 at guest spot from legendary soul Queen Carla Thomas, and 0:00:48.479 --> 0:00:52.800 sessions at the world famous SUNS Studios. She's also included 0:00:52.880 --> 0:00:57.080 nature sounds recorded outside her family home in Tennessee, offering 0:00:57.120 --> 0:01:00.400 one of several meditative moments of reflection. We're listenings are 0:01:00.400 --> 0:01:03.280 invited to bring their own thoughts and feelings to the proceedings. 0:01:04.120 --> 0:01:07.800 It's a touching display of intimacy, emited, formidable displays of talent, 0:01:08.400 --> 0:01:10.800 and it also serves as a reminder that music is 0:01:10.800 --> 0:01:15.280 about communication and communication is a two way street. I'm 0:01:15.319 --> 0:01:19.400 so happy to welcome Valerie June. Please basket or positivity 0:01:19.640 --> 0:01:27.000 and enjoy. Oh my goodness, so many things I want 0:01:27.000 --> 0:01:28.240 to talk to you about. But first off, I want 0:01:28.280 --> 0:01:29.960 to talk to about your album In the Moon and 0:01:30.040 --> 0:01:33.560 Stars Prescriptions for Dreamers, which was out in the spring. 0:01:34.040 --> 0:01:36.559 How did it begin for you? It's such an astonishing record. 0:01:36.640 --> 0:01:39.600 Was there a song that that sort of manifested itself 0:01:39.640 --> 0:01:45.360 first that pointed away to the rest of the record? Um? Yeah, 0:01:45.600 --> 0:01:48.600 there was Um, And I don't really think about it 0:01:48.680 --> 0:01:52.320 like that because the record is a collection of songs 0:01:52.360 --> 0:01:55.000 that have come over the course of about fifteen or 0:01:55.040 --> 0:01:58.600 so years. But the song that really was the one 0:01:58.680 --> 0:02:01.240 that was like, oh out, I think I'm ready to 0:02:01.280 --> 0:02:05.080 make a record was um, call me a Foo. Oh 0:02:05.160 --> 0:02:08.800 my goodness, all that you said over the course of 0:02:08.840 --> 0:02:10.960 fifteen years, what is that set? The oldest? Which is 0:02:11.040 --> 0:02:14.200 which is the oldest track on there? They're Falling is 0:02:14.240 --> 0:02:19.000 the oldest? And then colored right after that, Oh wow, 0:02:19.520 --> 0:02:21.600 I'll call me at four I mean, just it's such 0:02:21.680 --> 0:02:24.079 an amazing song. I mean, and of course it's got 0:02:24.120 --> 0:02:26.600 Carla Thomas on. I mean, what was that experience like 0:02:26.680 --> 0:02:30.240 working with her? Oh? My goodness, it was mind blowing 0:02:30.480 --> 0:02:34.280 because she is so bright and so delight and um 0:02:34.440 --> 0:02:39.359 high energy and just so encouraging and positive and everything 0:02:39.400 --> 0:02:41.919 that I dreamed. Sometimes when you meet like people who 0:02:41.919 --> 0:02:45.160 are famous that you really love, it's like you have 0:02:45.280 --> 0:02:48.200 all of these expectations and they can't possibly live up 0:02:48.240 --> 0:02:50.280 to it. But Carla lives up to it and then 0:02:50.360 --> 0:02:55.239 exceeds it. I love hearing you together. I mean, my gosh, 0:02:55.320 --> 0:02:56.920 I've I've loved her. I think the first song I 0:02:56.960 --> 0:03:00.120 heard of hers was Tramped with Otis Redding and some 0:03:00.280 --> 0:03:02.840 do At. I mean, she's just the best. Oh yeah, 0:03:02.880 --> 0:03:06.040 And I love how on Tramp she uses her speaking 0:03:06.120 --> 0:03:09.800 voice as well as her singing voice. And accidentally it 0:03:09.919 --> 0:03:13.600 happened on this record The Moon and Stars, because I 0:03:13.639 --> 0:03:16.560 was listening to her talk and tell amazing stories about 0:03:16.560 --> 0:03:19.880 working with Otis and her father Rufus and all of 0:03:19.880 --> 0:03:23.040 her sister and everything. And as I was listening to 0:03:23.040 --> 0:03:25.440 her talk, I was like, you know, she really shouldn't 0:03:25.520 --> 0:03:30.360 read the African proverb before the song, and so I 0:03:30.400 --> 0:03:32.480 asked her if she would read it, and she did 0:03:32.560 --> 0:03:35.000 and her voice was perfect. She's like the fairy god 0:03:35.120 --> 0:03:39.880 Mother reading this magical quote over this dreamy, dreamy um 0:03:39.920 --> 0:03:43.080 interlude of music. It's so so sweet to have her. 0:03:43.800 --> 0:03:45.600 Oh it's so great, And I wanted to ask you 0:03:45.640 --> 0:03:48.280 about that proverb, but such a I've been thinking about 0:03:48.320 --> 0:03:50.080 it and I keep going back and forth. And I 0:03:50.120 --> 0:03:52.160 do this with a lot of song lyrics. I kind 0:03:52.160 --> 0:03:54.480 of look at them from different angles, only a full 0:03:54.560 --> 0:03:57.480 test the depths of the water with both feet, which 0:03:57.840 --> 0:04:00.960 makes sense, but there's almost a sense so of you know, 0:04:01.440 --> 0:04:03.520 you hear the you have the other expression of diving 0:04:03.560 --> 0:04:05.920 in with both feet, like a look before you leap, 0:04:05.960 --> 0:04:09.160 almost going on faith, which is sort of the opposite 0:04:09.160 --> 0:04:11.320 of that too. It's a funny. I feel like that 0:04:11.520 --> 0:04:14.560 you could play it both ways. Well, it does work 0:04:14.600 --> 0:04:18.200 both ways, and mamm I think that what I was 0:04:18.279 --> 0:04:22.200 trying to do in using it is say that, yeah, 0:04:22.400 --> 0:04:24.960 you need to just jump in that water. You need 0:04:25.040 --> 0:04:28.200 to do that in your life. But also when Carla 0:04:28.320 --> 0:04:31.440 is saying it, she's saying it before the song called 0:04:31.440 --> 0:04:33.159 me a fool, so she's saying it kind of in 0:04:33.200 --> 0:04:35.760 a way of are you sure you want to jump 0:04:35.839 --> 0:04:39.159 in that water? Only a fool would do it, And 0:04:39.640 --> 0:04:42.320 the fact that she does join me and singing on 0:04:42.360 --> 0:04:45.599 the actual song, Once the Dreamer, who I guess I 0:04:45.640 --> 0:04:49.000 am in this whole narrative, Once the Dreamer begins to 0:04:49.120 --> 0:04:52.160 dream and does take the leap, and is the fool 0:04:52.560 --> 0:04:56.760 She joins in at the end, singing that this beautiful 0:04:56.839 --> 0:05:01.360 high soprano because she's glad that you trusted yourself enough 0:05:01.400 --> 0:05:04.000 to dare to dream, to take the leap, knowing that 0:05:04.120 --> 0:05:06.599 you could fall. I mean, this is the whole album 0:05:06.640 --> 0:05:08.680 is so beautiful because, as you say, it is directed 0:05:08.720 --> 0:05:11.839 towards these dreamers out there to give them encouragement and 0:05:11.960 --> 0:05:15.600 nurture their own creative spirit. As a teenage artist and 0:05:15.800 --> 0:05:17.840 a dreamer, did you get that kind of support growing 0:05:17.920 --> 0:05:21.240 up when you were first beginning of your time in music? Hell? No, 0:05:24.040 --> 0:05:28.000 apparently got that support, Like even when I started and 0:05:28.040 --> 0:05:31.120 got a label. You know, it's like, you know, when 0:05:31.120 --> 0:05:35.560 you are a dreamer, you're constantly like, uh, you're on 0:05:35.760 --> 0:05:40.599 shaky ground. I'll just put it that way, because the 0:05:40.760 --> 0:05:44.440 path isn't clear. It's it's like Joseph Campbell's says that 0:05:44.800 --> 0:05:46.880 you gotta follow your bliss, and if you're on the 0:05:46.960 --> 0:05:49.719 path this like got a whole lot of clarity to it, 0:05:49.760 --> 0:05:54.200 then that's probably not your path, you know. I mean, 0:05:54.200 --> 0:05:56.520 I feel like being a dreamer means to a certain extent, 0:05:57.279 --> 0:05:59.800 remaining childlike in a way. I mean, and you know, 0:05:59.839 --> 0:06:01.880 how do you keep that sense of, you know, the 0:06:01.920 --> 0:06:05.479 inner child alive, not only in one but especially in 0:06:05.520 --> 0:06:08.320 the music industry, which you know, as you mentioned, is 0:06:08.360 --> 0:06:11.920 not exactly famous for, you know, catering to the inner child, 0:06:12.760 --> 0:06:16.599 that's true. I think one way that I like to 0:06:16.640 --> 0:06:19.479 do it is by spending a lot of time in 0:06:19.600 --> 0:06:24.120 nature and seeing how like the old growth trees are 0:06:24.160 --> 0:06:28.160 the protectors of the new growth, and how like all 0:06:28.240 --> 0:06:31.800 of the forest grounds being down there, being at the 0:06:31.839 --> 0:06:34.520 bottom but also soaring to the top, that there's an 0:06:34.520 --> 0:06:38.919 equal balance between the two, you know, and all seeing 0:06:39.040 --> 0:06:42.159 that and staying in that space and working with plants 0:06:42.200 --> 0:06:44.279 and watching how they grow and how they die and 0:06:44.320 --> 0:06:47.560 how they rose, rise and fall. That really helps me 0:06:47.720 --> 0:06:50.440 to mentally handle what I face as a musician in 0:06:50.480 --> 0:06:54.760 the modern music world, because nature is not always kind, 0:06:55.560 --> 0:06:59.320 you know, death exists there diseased exists there, but it 0:06:59.400 --> 0:07:04.440 does always abide and prevail. It always like makes it through. 0:07:04.520 --> 0:07:08.719 And when a flower is seen, it's so glorious because 0:07:09.120 --> 0:07:11.560 you've seen what it took for that to happen. It 0:07:11.600 --> 0:07:14.280 took a whole lot of work for the rain, the sun, 0:07:14.400 --> 0:07:18.840 the soil, everything was working for that flower, and then 0:07:18.880 --> 0:07:22.880 it doesn't last, you know. And so I think when 0:07:22.920 --> 0:07:25.480 I look at nature and I realize how small I 0:07:25.520 --> 0:07:29.000 am in the universe, but large as well, that that 0:07:29.160 --> 0:07:33.400 perspective helps me, because otherwise it is really tough to 0:07:33.480 --> 0:07:37.040 be a dreamer. You know. I read I'm not sure 0:07:37.040 --> 0:07:39.200 if this is true that you had the studio filled 0:07:39.240 --> 0:07:46.000 with with fresh flowers when you were working. Is that true? Yeah? Yeah, 0:07:46.160 --> 0:07:50.040 every time I would go just anywhere to the local 0:07:50.040 --> 0:07:53.480 grocery store and find flowers in the cities where where 0:07:53.560 --> 0:07:57.240 in Miami and lay in different places and just bring 0:07:57.280 --> 0:08:01.040 them because they say that flowers are stars of the earth, 0:08:01.560 --> 0:08:04.800 and I love that. I love the stars being like 0:08:04.920 --> 0:08:08.040 something I can never physically touch. I was like, well, 0:08:08.080 --> 0:08:11.240 I can't such flowers, I can work with them, so 0:08:11.480 --> 0:08:13.640 let me go and give them. And they change the 0:08:13.800 --> 0:08:16.600 energy and the mood of a space for the musicians. 0:08:16.640 --> 0:08:19.520 Even Oh, I bet now I heard that you recorded 0:08:19.520 --> 0:08:24.200 some of us at at Sam Phillips's Sons Studios in Memphis. 0:08:24.240 --> 0:08:27.080 What was that like? I mean being in those hollowed halls. 0:08:27.120 --> 0:08:29.040 I mean, where did you stand on the X where 0:08:29.040 --> 0:08:33.839 Elvis saying or well, I loved it. I mean it 0:08:34.000 --> 0:08:36.800 was I first of all the owner. He was there 0:08:36.960 --> 0:08:38.840 and he did take me on a tour. And there 0:08:38.880 --> 0:08:41.760 are parts of Sam Phillips that are so protected that 0:08:41.840 --> 0:08:45.560 they don't even let you go to. He will say, no, no, no, 0:08:45.640 --> 0:08:47.560 we can't let you see that area. But you know 0:08:47.640 --> 0:08:51.040 they still make music there. Um, some of the sound rooms, 0:08:51.480 --> 0:08:54.160 but um, it's just got the same vibe as it 0:08:54.240 --> 0:08:57.280 had during that time period when all the hits were 0:08:57.280 --> 0:09:00.719 coming out, Like upstairs is preserved way it was when 0:09:00.760 --> 0:09:04.840 Elvis was there, And UM, it's just so wonderful to 0:09:04.920 --> 0:09:07.679 be able to say that on every record I've done. 0:09:07.760 --> 0:09:11.920 Pretty much, I've worked in Tennessee, in particularly Memphis, because 0:09:11.960 --> 0:09:15.760 it's one of my birthplaces and I was originally born 0:09:15.760 --> 0:09:18.840 in Jackson, Tennessee, and how Humboldt, Tennessee is home to 0:09:18.920 --> 0:09:23.760 my family, and then Memphis is the home of my music. 0:09:23.880 --> 0:09:26.560 That's where I first got on stage first he has 0:09:26.679 --> 0:09:29.720 chose first started learning how to play the instruments. That 0:09:30.040 --> 0:09:33.040 was in my early twenties. So to be able to 0:09:33.080 --> 0:09:36.880 always continue to go home and nurture what I have 0:09:37.160 --> 0:09:42.240 there in being from Memphis, I think that's super super important, 0:09:42.320 --> 0:09:47.040 especially for um other like young black girls, to see, Hey, 0:09:47.160 --> 0:09:49.360 you know, we can do anything we want to do. 0:09:49.400 --> 0:09:51.839 You know what I mean, We can do anything we 0:09:51.960 --> 0:09:56.720 wanted to do on these Memphis streets. Absolutely, I know 0:09:56.760 --> 0:09:58.480 you got a little bit of of your your home 0:09:58.520 --> 0:10:02.120 in there on some of the the starlight ethereal silence. 0:10:02.160 --> 0:10:04.960 I think those those birds are from your your family home, 0:10:05.080 --> 0:10:08.680 right yeah. And Humboldt, Tennessee. And there's a pond behind 0:10:08.720 --> 0:10:13.240 the house, and we get visits from the great blue harem, 0:10:13.280 --> 0:10:18.920 from snakes, from Salamander's frogs, and and as you see 0:10:18.960 --> 0:10:21.880 the day rising, you can hear the birds begin to 0:10:21.920 --> 0:10:24.640 get louder and louder, and as the day gets hot, 0:10:24.760 --> 0:10:27.680 they start to quiet down. But as it ends, you 0:10:27.800 --> 0:10:31.400 hear the symphony beginning. And it starts always with the birds, 0:10:31.480 --> 0:10:34.120 and they're back and forth with each other, the different types. 0:10:34.240 --> 0:10:36.960 But then the cicadas and then the bullfrogs and it 0:10:37.000 --> 0:10:42.080 goes on all night long. That's a beautiful lullaby. It 0:10:42.320 --> 0:10:44.880 is every day and it's just so great. And the 0:10:44.920 --> 0:10:47.880 sun that sets um. You can sit on the back 0:10:47.920 --> 0:10:50.440 porch and see the sun sitting by over the pond. 0:10:51.000 --> 0:10:52.839 And I used to sit out there with my dad 0:10:53.200 --> 0:10:56.080 and it was never the same. I realized that the 0:10:56.120 --> 0:11:00.400 sunset is literally never the same. When you are busy 0:11:00.400 --> 0:11:02.520 in your life and you don't take the time for it, 0:11:02.600 --> 0:11:05.040 you always think, oh, it's just sunset. But if you 0:11:05.120 --> 0:11:07.400 really watch it, the color is begin to pop and 0:11:07.440 --> 0:11:12.160 it goes crazy in different ways, and it's never the same. Oh, 0:11:12.160 --> 0:11:15.080 it's that's so funny, my my fun I learned everything 0:11:15.080 --> 0:11:17.520 I know about sunsets. I learned from my father. We 0:11:17.520 --> 0:11:20.200 grew up on on a little pond with different coves, 0:11:20.440 --> 0:11:22.520 and he would always call it chasing the sunset. We 0:11:22.600 --> 0:11:24.480 get in the boat, watch it from one part of 0:11:24.520 --> 0:11:26.600 the pond, and when it would dip below the horizon, 0:11:26.679 --> 0:11:28.520 we'd roll out a little further so we could still 0:11:28.559 --> 0:11:30.120 kind of see it above the horiz and watch it 0:11:30.160 --> 0:11:32.280 dip lower, and we keep it going. We'd roll all 0:11:32.320 --> 0:11:35.400 the way across the pond over forty five minutes an hour, 0:11:35.520 --> 0:11:37.480 and we we'd see how many sunsets we could catch. 0:11:37.520 --> 0:11:39.439 And I feel like there's a metaphor in there somewhere. 0:11:39.480 --> 0:11:41.480 I don't really know what it is, but it's just 0:11:41.600 --> 0:11:46.679 the perfect perfect way to spend the evening, I think absolutely. 0:11:58.120 --> 0:12:00.320 I mean, I love how on your wreck could you 0:12:00.360 --> 0:12:03.520 have these still moments I mean, like stay meditation and 0:12:03.559 --> 0:12:07.040 starlight ethereal silence like I mentioned earlier, I mean it 0:12:07.040 --> 0:12:09.400 feels almost like the end of a yoga session or 0:12:09.720 --> 0:12:12.760 a meditation session with the bell ringing or a singing 0:12:12.800 --> 0:12:15.320 bowl or something. What let you to incorporate those moments 0:12:15.360 --> 0:12:18.440 into your album. Well, the one muld stay Meditation was 0:12:18.480 --> 0:12:21.959 the very first one, and that was worked together with 0:12:22.080 --> 0:12:25.400 Um Jack Splash, who's the co producer and he's pretty 0:12:25.480 --> 0:12:28.920 much the producer of every popping track on the record. 0:12:29.160 --> 0:12:32.000 And when I was working with Jack, he does these 0:12:32.040 --> 0:12:35.040 beautiful interludes with the artists that he works with, from 0:12:35.040 --> 0:12:38.600 Tanking the Bengers to Um to St. Paul and the 0:12:38.640 --> 0:12:43.200 Broken Bones. He's done these amazing, sweet little bits, and 0:12:43.320 --> 0:12:46.200 so I was saying to him, you know, I love 0:12:46.240 --> 0:12:48.600 how you do that with your work, and I really 0:12:48.600 --> 0:12:52.360 want to do something like a meditation on this song Stay, 0:12:52.559 --> 0:12:55.960 and I wanted to sound like, you know, chimes, like 0:12:56.000 --> 0:12:58.920 you're sitting alone in a park and you're listening to 0:12:58.960 --> 0:13:02.240 these beautiful child comes in the wind, like the giant ones. 0:13:02.880 --> 0:13:06.480 And so we were able to incorporate that into the 0:13:07.440 --> 0:13:10.400 song Stay. But then as we went on, more and 0:13:10.440 --> 0:13:12.840 more of them came, like, for example, when I was 0:13:12.960 --> 0:13:16.400 trapped in the pandemic like all of us quarantining we 0:13:16.720 --> 0:13:20.240 um we. I started to record that bird song at 0:13:20.280 --> 0:13:23.320 my family home and I sent it over to him 0:13:23.440 --> 0:13:25.600 and he was like, I love it, we have to 0:13:25.720 --> 0:13:28.559 use it. And he sent it and he played piano, 0:13:28.640 --> 0:13:31.679 but he also sent it to a Native American flute 0:13:32.000 --> 0:13:36.200 musician who did these beautiful flute pieces over it. And 0:13:36.240 --> 0:13:40.240 it's just really, how do we incorporate like the natural world, 0:13:40.400 --> 0:13:44.280 the ethereal realm, and the physical world in sound. Create 0:13:44.320 --> 0:13:48.160 that soundscape and that stratospheric sound that we feel every 0:13:48.240 --> 0:13:52.040 day when we wake up and walk out. You know 0:13:52.160 --> 0:13:56.120 it's there. Just bring that music to an extraal hand 0:13:56.400 --> 0:13:59.200 held on a vinyl. How do you do it? So 0:13:59.240 --> 0:14:01.080 that's what we were trying want to do, bringing in 0:14:01.200 --> 0:14:05.360 some of the world's music to um to this the 0:14:06.280 --> 0:14:12.040 you know, orchestrated and arranged tracks. Oh, it's absolutely gorgeous. 0:14:12.080 --> 0:14:14.960 I mean I speaking of orchestrating and arranging tracks. You 0:14:15.040 --> 0:14:17.920 worked with the great Lester Snell, who's worked with folks 0:14:18.000 --> 0:14:21.440 like Isaac Hays and the Barqueys and the Masqueraders and 0:14:21.480 --> 0:14:24.200 so many incredible people. The arrangements, I mean, they compliment 0:14:24.280 --> 0:14:27.720 your voice and the emotions so well. When you're writing, 0:14:27.760 --> 0:14:30.920 do you hear those production flourishes or is that something 0:14:30.920 --> 0:14:33.800 that takes place in the studio almost by uh, you know, 0:14:34.320 --> 0:14:38.800 trial and error and collaboration. I hear them as voices 0:14:39.280 --> 0:14:42.000 and so one of the things that really worked working 0:14:42.000 --> 0:14:44.160 with Jack d it was that I sang him the 0:14:44.240 --> 0:14:47.720 voices that I heard, and he was able to say, okay, 0:14:47.840 --> 0:14:50.320 you know what, I know. Just the person who's going 0:14:50.360 --> 0:14:53.520 to be able to translate that those voices into the 0:14:53.600 --> 0:14:57.600 string parts, and that was Mr Lester. And he introduced 0:14:57.600 --> 0:14:59.760 me to Leicester, and believe it or not, after a 0:15:00.000 --> 0:15:02.840 decade of living in Memphis, Tennessee, he said, do you 0:15:02.880 --> 0:15:06.120 know Wester Snail? And I was like, no, who's that? 0:15:06.680 --> 0:15:09.320 And he was like, you don't know who wester Is 0:15:09.360 --> 0:15:11.640 and you lived in Memphis And I was like no, 0:15:12.120 --> 0:15:14.960 and he was like, okay, you know it's music then, 0:15:15.200 --> 0:15:17.360 and he went like you did down the list, that's 0:15:17.400 --> 0:15:21.840 a case Um, Margot Price, Um, all of these amazing 0:15:21.920 --> 0:15:26.040 modern musicians but also old school musicians. And he was like, Wow, 0:15:26.680 --> 0:15:29.680 you gotta go to Memphis. You gotta work with wester 0:15:29.840 --> 0:15:32.920 He's gonna be able to achieve this. And he did. 0:15:33.280 --> 0:15:35.880 You know. So Jack was really like the one who 0:15:36.040 --> 0:15:39.680 knew how to take the voices that I hear and 0:15:40.120 --> 0:15:44.080 to make them into an arrangement of music. You know, 0:15:44.120 --> 0:15:46.840 who's gonna be the person to play that fleet part 0:15:46.920 --> 0:15:51.160 on um stay, Who's gonna be the person to bring 0:15:51.280 --> 0:15:54.800 together these horn voices that I hear? And so he 0:15:54.960 --> 0:15:57.160 just was able to do it. And the key person 0:15:57.280 --> 0:16:00.040 I love that he brought was um. This guy a 0:16:00.200 --> 0:16:04.720 Cave who played the bass on um started scattering. We 0:16:04.800 --> 0:16:08.360 were in the studio and I was like bumping around 0:16:08.400 --> 0:16:12.280 like Bunda, I'm pump pump um pump pump, pum pum pump, 0:16:12.400 --> 0:16:15.000 I don't know, singing him and humming them this part. 0:16:15.200 --> 0:16:18.720 And he was just able to go and do it 0:16:18.840 --> 0:16:24.280 all on the base like just like spaghetti fingers, okay, 0:16:25.960 --> 0:16:29.240 And I was like, thank you so much. I mean, 0:16:29.280 --> 0:16:32.120 I had crime moments, I had laugh moments. I was 0:16:32.160 --> 0:16:36.480 on the floor sun sounds balling because the motion of 0:16:36.520 --> 0:16:39.560 the work was so rich and heavy in the studio, 0:16:39.720 --> 0:16:44.520 you know. So yeah, it was an adventure. Oh my goodness, 0:16:44.520 --> 0:16:46.960 I beat. I mean when you I'm always so curious 0:16:47.000 --> 0:16:49.160 to speak too. If you are blessed with the ability 0:16:49.200 --> 0:16:52.600 to write songs, I'm always curious to ask what compels 0:16:52.640 --> 0:16:54.920 you to do it? Is it in your case? Is 0:16:54.960 --> 0:16:57.360 it a case of wanting to communicate with other people, 0:16:57.720 --> 0:17:00.280 or is it a desire to just sort of get 0:17:00.320 --> 0:17:02.760 these feelings out of you, almost like an exorcism, or 0:17:02.800 --> 0:17:06.440 is it a little bit of both. Yeah, it's it's 0:17:06.440 --> 0:17:08.960 a little of both. But to me, it's mostly just 0:17:09.080 --> 0:17:12.919 the voices, like because I hear them and they sound 0:17:12.960 --> 0:17:16.160 so pretty to me, and I'm just like beaming with 0:17:16.200 --> 0:17:19.440 these voices that I wanted to like just sing them 0:17:19.440 --> 0:17:22.240 all and share them all. Like that's the thing that 0:17:22.320 --> 0:17:25.040 propels me. I think, when I don't hear it, when 0:17:25.040 --> 0:17:27.639 I don't hear the voices and I don't hear songs, 0:17:27.680 --> 0:17:30.040 and I don't catch them, and they aren't the thing 0:17:30.160 --> 0:17:33.840 that come to me when I'm sleeping. For example, bright Stars, 0:17:34.000 --> 0:17:37.280 it was a dream song. Or when I'm like walking 0:17:37.280 --> 0:17:40.680 down the street, I hear them. And because I hear them, 0:17:41.119 --> 0:17:44.960 that's why I translated, because I know that nobody else 0:17:45.040 --> 0:17:47.080 is gonna hear it the way I heard it, you know. 0:17:47.920 --> 0:17:50.399 But I think if I don't hear them anymore, if 0:17:50.440 --> 0:17:54.520 they stop, then I'll stop. That's that'll be that, you know, 0:17:54.680 --> 0:17:58.679 It'll just I won't hear any more songs. What do 0:17:58.720 --> 0:18:00.600 you do when you get stuck to go for a 0:18:00.600 --> 0:18:02.800 walk or do you just kind of share? Willpower just 0:18:02.880 --> 0:18:07.000 go through until you finish it? I stop? I can stop. 0:18:07.080 --> 0:18:09.840 What I do is I get. I get what I get, 0:18:10.200 --> 0:18:12.960 and that could be a whole song, or it could 0:18:13.000 --> 0:18:14.560 be a piece of a song, or it could just 0:18:14.600 --> 0:18:17.560 be like a hume or a melody. I get it. 0:18:17.640 --> 0:18:20.640 And if I don't hear anymore, then I'll walk away. 0:18:20.760 --> 0:18:24.119 And yeah, I'm hopeful that I'll get some more. But 0:18:24.200 --> 0:18:26.920 if I don't, it can take like years, like it 0:18:26.960 --> 0:18:30.440 could take a decade and I haven't received the second part. 0:18:30.560 --> 0:18:33.880 Or sometimes I will have that first part and I'll 0:18:33.880 --> 0:18:36.400 write with another songwriter, and they'll have the other part. 0:18:36.560 --> 0:18:39.120 But if I don't get anymore, then I don't get 0:18:39.160 --> 0:18:42.679 anymore period, and it just doesn't happen. But sometimes what 0:18:42.800 --> 0:18:46.840 happens is that the voice, the first voice that I hear, 0:18:46.920 --> 0:18:49.600 I hear that voice, and as I hear that voice, 0:18:49.640 --> 0:18:52.560 I'll hear another voice and another voice, and another voice 0:18:52.560 --> 0:18:55.800 and another voice, and they layer and they stack, and 0:18:56.040 --> 0:19:00.800 to me, they're all voices. Usually they're not usually um, 0:19:00.840 --> 0:19:03.879 they're not usually instruments. And that's the beauty of what 0:19:04.119 --> 0:19:07.879 Jack was able to do is say, for that voice, 0:19:08.040 --> 0:19:11.200 that voice is strings. When I hum him the voice, 0:19:11.240 --> 0:19:14.520 he's able to hear it and say, let's let's make 0:19:14.560 --> 0:19:20.199 that strings, because for me, it's just like and I 0:19:20.280 --> 0:19:23.760 hear all of them together, you know, it's just like 0:19:23.920 --> 0:19:27.240 all of them like a chorus, you know. Or acquire 0:19:28.720 --> 0:19:31.040 dude a cappella album some day or something with you 0:19:31.080 --> 0:19:34.359 doing all the parts, like that would be so fun. Yeah, yeah, 0:19:34.600 --> 0:19:38.119 it would be. I read. I'm not sure if this 0:19:38.160 --> 0:19:40.200 is true that when you first started working with Jack, 0:19:40.280 --> 0:19:43.840 you sent um your lyrics to him as as poetry 0:19:43.920 --> 0:19:47.000 first before playing the songs to him. I wanted to 0:19:47.040 --> 0:19:48.800 ask if that was true first of all, and also 0:19:48.800 --> 0:19:50.200 I wouldn't ask why you did that. I thought that 0:19:50.240 --> 0:19:55.240 was like such a cool approach of putting the emotion first, 0:19:55.280 --> 0:19:59.679 almost before the melody I did. I don't know if 0:19:59.720 --> 0:20:03.280 I sent them separate, but I sent it for sure altogether, 0:20:03.400 --> 0:20:09.199 the lyrics them, the songs, and then words that like 0:20:09.560 --> 0:20:14.879 make the song's feeling. For example, I would send words 0:20:14.920 --> 0:20:25.520 like um, constellations, iridescent, um, radiant, bright, shimmering, glowing, sparkling, stratosphere. 0:20:25.760 --> 0:20:29.159 I send words that we're putting him in the mind 0:20:29.240 --> 0:20:32.919 of where I wanted him to go in the space 0:20:33.000 --> 0:20:36.719 of the song. And then I also sent proverbs and 0:20:36.800 --> 0:20:42.320 poems and quotes from people other people that that are 0:20:43.119 --> 0:20:46.720 thematically fitting with what I feel the song is saying 0:20:46.760 --> 0:20:49.359 to me, so that he would be able to go 0:20:49.400 --> 0:20:52.840 to that space in his mind too. And he was. 0:20:53.320 --> 0:20:56.040 He was able to go. He was pretty much already there. 0:20:56.280 --> 0:20:59.480 He didn't need me to help film me was already there. 0:21:00.080 --> 0:21:03.000 Is when you meet someone like Jack. I knew from 0:21:03.040 --> 0:21:04.639 the moment I met him that he was going to 0:21:04.720 --> 0:21:07.440 be able to get it, because we had a capecit 0:21:07.760 --> 0:21:13.040 the man's art sensibility, his fashion sensibility, his music taste, 0:21:13.200 --> 0:21:15.760 all of that, in being in his studio and sitting 0:21:15.840 --> 0:21:19.479 and sitting in his environment, all of that was pretty 0:21:19.480 --> 0:21:21.160 clear to me that he was going to be able 0:21:21.200 --> 0:21:24.119 to go to the space where I wanted him to 0:21:24.160 --> 0:21:27.000 go for this creation. You know, he was already there. 0:21:29.080 --> 0:21:31.560 It's so funny to me, how I mean hearing you 0:21:31.640 --> 0:21:33.760 say this to me. So many of the words and 0:21:33.800 --> 0:21:37.159 phrases are celestial thinking, you know, moon and stars, and 0:21:37.280 --> 0:21:39.879 it's so funny how those have become so synonymous in 0:21:39.920 --> 0:21:43.120 culture with dreaming. And I guess maybe because we're thinking back, 0:21:43.119 --> 0:21:46.200 that was the furthest off point that we could possibly 0:21:46.240 --> 0:21:48.639 imagine as as human beings, and maybe that was the 0:21:48.640 --> 0:21:51.080 biggest dream of all to sort of get out there. 0:21:51.080 --> 0:21:54.679 But it's interesting to me how dreaming and stars in 0:21:54.720 --> 0:21:57.919 the moon are are linked in a way. It's true. 0:21:58.119 --> 0:22:02.040 And the fact that we still having attained all the 0:22:02.160 --> 0:22:05.119 knowledge of what's happening out there, you know, it feel 0:22:05.240 --> 0:22:09.640 like there's so much more to explore. And and so 0:22:09.680 --> 0:22:12.480 I wanted for people when they listen to it, to 0:22:12.520 --> 0:22:15.000 be able to go to a magical realm in their mind, 0:22:15.600 --> 0:22:19.959 because dreaming is not easy, and it is hard, and 0:22:20.080 --> 0:22:24.800 it is dark sometimes, and when we face so much 0:22:24.880 --> 0:22:27.919 darkness in the world, it's very difficult for us to 0:22:28.720 --> 0:22:32.040 open up our imagination as we get older and continue 0:22:32.080 --> 0:22:35.680 to dream and to continue and continue to hope for 0:22:35.880 --> 0:22:38.840 a new and brighter future. And the only way we 0:22:38.880 --> 0:22:41.480 can do that is if we yeah face what's heavy 0:22:41.520 --> 0:22:46.840 and dark, but also pushed through that to see back 0:22:47.320 --> 0:22:50.600