WEBVTT - Bonus Episode - American Outlaws 0:00:00.400 --> 0:00:02.639 My name is Sean McEwan, and I'm the writer, director 0:00:02.720 --> 0:00:05.520 of one of the producers of the feature film American Outlaws, 0:00:05.519 --> 0:00:09.680 which is coming out in select theaters on Friday, September fifteenth. 0:00:09.960 --> 0:00:12.200 You can also see it from the comfort of your own. 0:00:12.039 --> 0:00:17.560 Home on video on demand Apple, iTunes and Amazon, etc. 0:00:18.320 --> 0:00:21.239 The Dockerty Gang is a feature film story based on 0:00:21.280 --> 0:00:24.840 the true life events of three siblings, Ryan Doherty, Dylan Doherty, 0:00:24.840 --> 0:00:27.480 and league raceed Docerty who back in a little over 0:00:27.520 --> 0:00:29.840 a decade ago, they went on a cross country crime 0:00:29.920 --> 0:00:34.239 spree where they were robbing banks, and each one of 0:00:34.280 --> 0:00:37.520 them are currently serving an excessive amount of time thirty 0:00:37.520 --> 0:00:40.720 plus years in three separate federal prisons. The reason I'm 0:00:40.720 --> 0:00:42.440 here today is for a couple of reasons. One is 0:00:42.640 --> 0:00:46.280 we do have a feature film is coming out selects on. 0:00:46.320 --> 0:00:49.040 The fifteenth of September Friday. 0:00:49.760 --> 0:00:52.199 Also, it will be available for home viewing in the 0:00:52.280 --> 0:00:54.880 VOD video on demand space. You can go to Apple, 0:00:55.360 --> 0:00:58.640 Amazon and check out the film. We think it's an 0:00:58.640 --> 0:01:01.160 extraordinary film because it does fit that true crime space. 0:01:01.480 --> 0:01:04.360 Based on a true story, I had the very good opportunity, 0:01:04.440 --> 0:01:07.560 as people might recollect from the podcast of working and 0:01:07.600 --> 0:01:10.400 getting to know directly the actual individuals that were involved 0:01:10.440 --> 0:01:13.400 in the real true events, including Ryan, Lee Grace, and Dylan, 0:01:13.880 --> 0:01:15.760 got very close with each of them, close with some 0:01:15.800 --> 0:01:17.960 of their family members and some of the other. 0:01:17.800 --> 0:01:19.559 Individuals that were involved in the story. 0:01:19.760 --> 0:01:22.920 What's interesting about talking today in particular is the fact 0:01:22.959 --> 0:01:24.840 that there are some updates just to kind of see 0:01:24.840 --> 0:01:27.360 where things have gone from the original events that we 0:01:27.480 --> 0:01:29.720 portrayed in the earlier episodes of the podcast. You know, 0:01:29.800 --> 0:01:31.920 there's a lot of time has passed, a lot of change, 0:01:31.920 --> 0:01:34.319 a lot of growth, which I kind of find interesting 0:01:34.360 --> 0:01:37.720 even from a psychological standpoint, a human interest standpoint. I'll 0:01:37.720 --> 0:01:42.160 start with Lee Grace. Lee Grace has definitely acclimated, I think, 0:01:42.200 --> 0:01:44.920 to the prison life, if you will. Each of the 0:01:44.959 --> 0:01:49.400 siblings are currently still facing various charges, not all the 0:01:49.400 --> 0:01:52.040 same charges, of various charges with some other states. Again, 0:01:52.080 --> 0:01:55.200 even a decade later, this is still ongoing legal problems 0:01:55.200 --> 0:01:58.160 and issues and complications that they did cross state lines 0:01:58.200 --> 0:02:01.480 which created a federal dynamic here that they have to 0:02:01.520 --> 0:02:04.200 deal with, so that still hangs over their head. As 0:02:04.240 --> 0:02:07.080 I mentioned earlier, they're each serving terms that are roughly 0:02:07.120 --> 0:02:09.560 between thirty and thirty five years a piece. So they 0:02:09.600 --> 0:02:11.560 do have the opportunity to eventually pay their debt to 0:02:11.600 --> 0:02:14.680 society and get out of prison. However, they will be 0:02:14.840 --> 0:02:17.480 much more advanced in age obviously at that point. 0:02:17.600 --> 0:02:18.480 So back to Lee. 0:02:18.440 --> 0:02:20.920 Grace in particular, I think she's acclimated quite nicely to 0:02:21.000 --> 0:02:23.880 the prison system. She's made a lot of friends, she 0:02:24.120 --> 0:02:26.760 has some contacts and some penpals, shall we call them, 0:02:26.800 --> 0:02:28.840 on the outside. I think that's kind of her lifeline. 0:02:28.960 --> 0:02:30.520 I think a big part of the story and the 0:02:30.560 --> 0:02:32.840 thing that interested all of us from the beginning is family. 0:02:33.080 --> 0:02:35.800 She still is very connected to her brothers, as in 0:02:35.880 --> 0:02:37.920 contact with them on a fairly regular basis. 0:02:37.960 --> 0:02:39.239 They write letters to each other. 0:02:39.400 --> 0:02:41.600 That's obviously the primary way that they're able to communicate, 0:02:41.760 --> 0:02:44.240 or to communicate through other family and friends and to 0:02:44.320 --> 0:02:46.920 kind of you pass messages on in the word on, 0:02:47.120 --> 0:02:48.720 check in on and those kinds of things. 0:02:49.040 --> 0:02:51.400 But it still is that that mantra family first. 0:02:51.400 --> 0:02:54.080 They all still talk like that and how important family 0:02:54.120 --> 0:02:55.639 is to them and how much they love each other, 0:02:55.800 --> 0:02:57.359 and that's a big part of it. 0:02:57.680 --> 0:02:58.160 I think then. 0:02:58.240 --> 0:03:02.440 For Dylan has one time he was in South Carolina, 0:03:02.480 --> 0:03:04.720 He's moved around a bit. He's currently in a federal 0:03:04.720 --> 0:03:08.160 prison in Wisconsin. That's a little challenging because he's far 0:03:08.200 --> 0:03:10.760 away from his home base where some of his relatives 0:03:10.800 --> 0:03:14.119 are more in the Florida area, including his nephew Eric, 0:03:14.760 --> 0:03:17.240 who's Ryan's son. So I know that's challenging for him. 0:03:17.360 --> 0:03:19.600 If I'm staying this correctly on his behalf, I think 0:03:19.639 --> 0:03:22.400 he's hoping at some point to get everything kind of 0:03:22.520 --> 0:03:24.320 taken care of and then he can hopefully make some 0:03:24.400 --> 0:03:27.000 kind of transfer a little closer to home base and 0:03:27.320 --> 0:03:29.560 again where he has that support system in place. But 0:03:29.639 --> 0:03:32.120 I'd say he's even, dare I say a tough cookie. 0:03:32.160 --> 0:03:34.480 It sounds like an oxymoron of a statement, but he's 0:03:34.560 --> 0:03:36.480 thriving in the position that he's in. 0:03:36.760 --> 0:03:38.680 I find him. This is my personal opinion. 0:03:38.720 --> 0:03:42.240 If I dare say that, he's very conciliatory and repentive 0:03:42.360 --> 0:03:44.760 if you will, about the events that occurred. He's, you know, 0:03:44.880 --> 0:03:47.120 understands he has to pay his debt to society. I 0:03:47.160 --> 0:03:50.000 think all the siblings have a perspective, and I know 0:03:50.080 --> 0:03:52.320 the argument can be made, who wouldn't that I've used 0:03:52.360 --> 0:03:54.280 the word excessive. I don't mean to bleed my own 0:03:54.320 --> 0:03:56.160 opinion to this, but you know, they got a lot 0:03:56.160 --> 0:03:57.960 of time. They deserve to be in prison. I think 0:03:58.000 --> 0:03:59.920 we can all agree on that. But they definitely got 0:03:59.920 --> 0:04:02.280 the book pretty thrown at them, and the argument could 0:04:02.320 --> 0:04:04.520 be made again, I'm not trying to politicize anything that 0:04:04.600 --> 0:04:07.440 people have done a lot worse crimes than gotten less time. 0:04:07.840 --> 0:04:10.360 But that being said, they did some things that were 0:04:10.400 --> 0:04:13.320 not good, that were bad, and people, while they weren't hurt, 0:04:13.400 --> 0:04:16.240 could have gotten very seriously hurt or even killed. And 0:04:16.320 --> 0:04:18.720 they do, you know, again, deserve to be where they are. 0:04:18.880 --> 0:04:21.360 I'm seeing and I've known them now for oh gosh, 0:04:21.400 --> 0:04:25.440 I want to say eight plus years, seeing change, seeing growth, 0:04:25.480 --> 0:04:28.919 seeing kids turn into adults, and that's been fascinating to 0:04:28.960 --> 0:04:32.240 see that, to see that perspective, that wisdom, that understanding 0:04:32.720 --> 0:04:35.800 has been really interesting to see, but exciting to see too, 0:04:36.040 --> 0:04:39.239 just that growth. I think then specifically, Ryan, who probably 0:04:39.240 --> 0:04:41.840 has the most complicated might recall from the story and 0:04:41.880 --> 0:04:43.839 you'd see this portrayed in the film as well, that 0:04:43.920 --> 0:04:45.840 he had a you know, his girlfriend at the time 0:04:46.160 --> 0:04:49.240 was pregnant with his soon to be born son, Eric, 0:04:49.480 --> 0:04:52.320 and you know Eric is now ten or eleven. 0:04:52.680 --> 0:04:54.760 I know that he is able to do as I. 0:04:54.800 --> 0:04:57.719 Understand it, calls video calls, and that's been very helpful, 0:04:57.920 --> 0:04:59.760 and without saying too much to also protect a little 0:04:59.760 --> 0:05:02.000 bit of the privacy of everybody, is that Ryan is 0:05:02.040 --> 0:05:04.000 currently serving time now. He was in all the way 0:05:04.000 --> 0:05:06.160 in Arizona for quite some time, but he was able 0:05:06.200 --> 0:05:08.640 to get transferred to closer to home and where his 0:05:08.680 --> 0:05:10.520 family is, which is in the state of Florida, So 0:05:10.520 --> 0:05:12.720 that's been a real I think game changer for him. 0:05:12.839 --> 0:05:15.400 He's probably I don't think he'd mind me saying this, 0:05:15.680 --> 0:05:19.040 but struggle the most in the sense that prison life's 0:05:19.040 --> 0:05:21.520 been really hard for him. I think his personality type 0:05:21.640 --> 0:05:24.359 being the younger sibling, not that he isn't tough in 0:05:24.400 --> 0:05:27.279 his own way, but probably was the biggest m path 0:05:27.480 --> 0:05:30.440 of the group. So you can imagine adjusting to, you know, 0:05:30.560 --> 0:05:32.960 basically looking at the rest of your life and incarceration 0:05:33.080 --> 0:05:34.600 has been a really hard one for him. 0:05:34.880 --> 0:05:36.920 Without saying too much about this, but I know they 0:05:36.960 --> 0:05:37.359 mentioned this. 0:05:37.800 --> 0:05:41.320 A couple of the siblings have definitely struggled with drug 0:05:41.400 --> 0:05:44.640 use with how prison life works. But currently I'm happy 0:05:44.680 --> 0:05:47.680 to say that everybody is clean and living a healthy 0:05:47.680 --> 0:05:50.200 lifestyle in that way for now, which is great. I 0:05:50.240 --> 0:05:52.039 know that that makes the rest of the family, you know, 0:05:52.320 --> 0:05:55.000 feel very good too. I've been also in touch in 0:05:55.040 --> 0:05:57.599 somewhat recent history also with their mother. You know, she 0:05:58.040 --> 0:06:00.080 is still very close with all of them, keeps in 0:06:00.160 --> 0:06:03.360 direct contact. I think, without saying too much that you know, 0:06:03.600 --> 0:06:05.840 she also like, look, these are my kids, and it's 0:06:05.880 --> 0:06:09.120 as tragic. She acknowledges and knows they did some bad things, 0:06:09.400 --> 0:06:11.240 but I think she'd love to see them being able 0:06:11.279 --> 0:06:12.840 to make something of their lives and move on with 0:06:12.880 --> 0:06:15.200 their lives and come out of this better or more 0:06:15.240 --> 0:06:18.240 evolved grown up people, hopefully not serving as much time 0:06:18.279 --> 0:06:19.880 as they are. And I think that kind of brings 0:06:19.920 --> 0:06:22.040 us to one of the last points is is there 0:06:22.200 --> 0:06:25.640 a way for them to maybe you know, hyper accelerate 0:06:25.720 --> 0:06:27.360 some of the time that they're serving so that they 0:06:27.400 --> 0:06:29.479 can have paid their debt to society but actually do 0:06:29.560 --> 0:06:32.320 something in their lives and contribute to society. I know 0:06:32.400 --> 0:06:34.839 that's something that they all express wanting to do. I 0:06:34.880 --> 0:06:37.960 think for anybody who gets the opportunity to really to 0:06:38.000 --> 0:06:40.040 have listened to the podcast can kind. 0:06:39.880 --> 0:06:41.400 Of see all shades and hues of it. 0:06:41.440 --> 0:06:43.359 I think that's interested to us in the story and 0:06:43.400 --> 0:06:46.080 myself as a filmmaker also was there was a lot 0:06:46.120 --> 0:06:48.600 of ambiguity in this. It's not the good guys are 0:06:48.640 --> 0:06:50.320 wearing white hats, the bad guys wearing black hats. 0:06:50.320 --> 0:06:51.359 There's a lot of the in between. 0:06:51.600 --> 0:06:53.480 I think seeing one of the big I hate to 0:06:53.560 --> 0:06:56.760 use a word, but messages is that there's a huge 0:06:56.839 --> 0:06:59.560 swath of the population that is very unrealized, that is 0:06:59.680 --> 0:07:04.640 very marginalized. Not listen to not recognize, yes, is maybe 0:07:04.640 --> 0:07:07.160 a listener could tell interested in hearing this. I've gotten 0:07:07.200 --> 0:07:09.240 close with them, so it's challenging for me to separate 0:07:09.279 --> 0:07:10.880 myself at times. But we try to do our best 0:07:10.920 --> 0:07:12.960 with that and try to relay this story and their 0:07:13.120 --> 0:07:16.800 plight and their story also in the film telling as well, 0:07:16.840 --> 0:07:18.480 so that the audience can kind of make up their 0:07:18.480 --> 0:07:22.200 own mind about it. I think the big takeaway is that, yeah, 0:07:22.280 --> 0:07:25.400 please familiarize yourself if you've already listened to the podcast, obviously, 0:07:25.400 --> 0:07:28.320 if also getting a chance to see the film kind 0:07:28.320 --> 0:07:30.360 of see it traumatized and realized. We try to keep 0:07:30.360 --> 0:07:33.080 this close to true events. Obviously, have to trunk certain 0:07:33.120 --> 0:07:34.880 things because we're telling a story in a little less 0:07:34.880 --> 0:07:38.000 than twoever, but you know, hearing it from shall we 0:07:38.000 --> 0:07:40.640 see the horse's mouth of the people that lived the experience, 0:07:40.800 --> 0:07:43.560 is also looking at from even the law enforcement side 0:07:43.560 --> 0:07:46.760 and the challenges they faced, and also kind of fulfilling them, 0:07:46.880 --> 0:07:50.280 portraying them, I hope to see fully complex. So it's 0:07:50.280 --> 0:07:53.160 not just like these federal agents just you know, chasing 0:07:53.360 --> 0:07:55.440 the bad guy and how all that kind of you 0:07:55.480 --> 0:07:58.800 know comes into focused and kind of a lens of 0:07:59.560 --> 0:08:02.240 yeah and discussions. So I think they've had a lot 0:08:02.240 --> 0:08:05.280 of time to think about what they did. Not the excuse, 0:08:05.320 --> 0:08:07.920 but they were quite young when they made the decisions 0:08:07.920 --> 0:08:10.040 that they made. And again I will say in underline 0:08:10.120 --> 0:08:12.400 is that they deserve to pay for those mistakes that 0:08:12.440 --> 0:08:12.960 they made. 0:08:13.080 --> 0:08:14.880 But I think at this point, look. 0:08:14.720 --> 0:08:17.280 I think they've all been learning different vocations while in prison, 0:08:17.400 --> 0:08:20.160 and they all even prior to prison had certain skill 0:08:20.200 --> 0:08:23.640 sets to where they could actually get decent jobs and 0:08:24.080 --> 0:08:27.000 you know still you know, live a solid life in 0:08:27.040 --> 0:08:30.000 that way coming back together as a family, and that 0:08:30.120 --> 0:08:32.480 appreciation for at the end of the day, they're kind 0:08:32.480 --> 0:08:34.880 of all they have and being each other's lives in 0:08:35.280 --> 0:08:39.080 a realistic and tangible sense, not behind bars, not behind 0:08:39.120 --> 0:08:41.720 just letters that can get to each other every now 0:08:41.760 --> 0:08:44.120 and then, and the occasional word from another family member 0:08:44.480 --> 0:08:45.240 is really important. 0:08:45.880 --> 0:08:46.480 I do know. 0:08:46.800 --> 0:08:49.839 I don't think I'm giving way too much of personal information, 0:08:50.000 --> 0:08:52.520 But Dylan has talked about an interesting kind of sense 0:08:52.559 --> 0:08:54.880 of humor about like, oh maybe I'm maybe I'll be 0:08:54.920 --> 0:08:56.480 too old to do it, but maybe I could still, like, 0:08:56.559 --> 0:08:59.320 you know, produce a child, an offspring, you know, or something. 0:08:59.400 --> 0:09:01.120 So I think that's something. 0:09:00.800 --> 0:09:02.480 That they would like. But then, you know, I have 0:09:02.559 --> 0:09:03.600 to be honest with you. 0:09:03.600 --> 0:09:06.200 You can sense the tragedy and all because as much 0:09:06.240 --> 0:09:09.120 as there's dreams and if anybody's ever had the chance 0:09:09.160 --> 0:09:11.599 talks on prison, you know, I think there becomes this 0:09:12.200 --> 0:09:15.280 like man, time passes, people move on, lives change, People 0:09:15.480 --> 0:09:17.120 that were in your life aren't in your life anymore, 0:09:17.160 --> 0:09:20.160 can't necessarily and won't necessarily stand by you for that 0:09:20.200 --> 0:09:20.880 long period of time. 0:09:20.960 --> 0:09:25.079 Certain family members unfortunately pass and so things really do change. 0:09:25.160 --> 0:09:29.360 I think for them it's having solid jobs, working, making 0:09:29.480 --> 0:09:33.160 a clean living. And you know, also from a self standpoint, 0:09:33.200 --> 0:09:35.240 if we can talk like that, I think each of 0:09:35.240 --> 0:09:38.400 them the obvious thing just being happy and content, and 0:09:38.440 --> 0:09:40.680 this is the most important thing, I'll say, being free. 0:09:41.160 --> 0:09:43.199 It sounds so contrived to say that, like, of. 0:09:43.120 --> 0:09:44.920 Course in prison, of course they wouldn't be free. 0:09:44.960 --> 0:09:46.680 But you know, that's a big thing that we explore 0:09:46.679 --> 0:09:49.640 in the film, but also we really touched on the podcast, 0:09:49.800 --> 0:09:52.640 was we came to this conclusion through the journey of 0:09:52.960 --> 0:09:55.360 interviewing all the people and interviewing them, that these were 0:09:55.480 --> 0:09:58.480 kids that were looking for freedom. They weren't looking for 0:09:58.520 --> 0:10:00.880 freedom to necessarily let's do what we want anarchy and 0:10:00.880 --> 0:10:04.120 cause have it, to just have a break, to have 0:10:04.480 --> 0:10:08.640 the opportunity to like stretch their wings and live whatever 0:10:08.800 --> 0:10:11.480 their the concept of the American dream might be to 0:10:11.559 --> 0:10:13.480 be able to breathe, to be able to like kind 0:10:13.480 --> 0:10:15.280 of write your own ticket, to be able to work 0:10:15.320 --> 0:10:18.480 a hard day's work but also get remunerated for that 0:10:18.679 --> 0:10:22.600 and not have everything constantly working against them. That and 0:10:22.640 --> 0:10:24.599 I think that's a really important thing for them, and 0:10:24.960 --> 0:10:27.040 I think they still crave that in so many ways. 0:10:27.040 --> 0:10:29.560 And again, the irony is they went on this trip 0:10:29.600 --> 0:10:31.079 to begin with, they called it a trip, almost like 0:10:31.120 --> 0:10:32.840 a family trip, and it turned in and spun out 0:10:32.840 --> 0:10:35.720 it contleasly to this crime spree. They were, you know, 0:10:35.760 --> 0:10:38.240 they were searching for something more, something better, and I 0:10:38.240 --> 0:10:40.559 think it's something that's innately and all of us as 0:10:40.600 --> 0:10:43.680 even Americans, is that go west, young man, young woman, 0:10:43.800 --> 0:10:45.760 finds your way, like make your way in the world 0:10:45.840 --> 0:10:49.080 and do something great and find freedom and breathe the clean. 0:10:48.880 --> 0:10:51.640 Air and you know and all that. And I think 0:10:51.640 --> 0:10:53.920 they're still searching for that. Unfortunately, I don't know if 0:10:53.920 --> 0:10:56.080 I can stay I have the laboratually find it. From 0:10:56.200 --> 0:10:58.360 the very first time you contacted them, what kind of 0:10:58.400 --> 0:10:59.960 growth have you seen from them already? 0:11:01.760 --> 0:11:04.480 Well, distinctly what I've seen, what I've had the opportunity 0:11:04.480 --> 0:11:06.520 to see, and even the blessing in some way, if 0:11:06.520 --> 0:11:09.480 you will, to see, which was not expected. I didn't 0:11:09.520 --> 0:11:13.439 know one hundred percent what I was getting into when 0:11:13.440 --> 0:11:16.920 I got into this, to be the objective was, you know, 0:11:16.920 --> 0:11:19.240 at the onset was like, wow, there's an interesting story here. 0:11:19.280 --> 0:11:22.320 We idied, like we should explore this and look at 0:11:22.360 --> 0:11:24.199 developing it and then you never know when you go 0:11:24.280 --> 0:11:26.480 down these rabbit holes where it'll take you. And it's 0:11:26.480 --> 0:11:29.520 definitely I had the interesting and good fortune to see 0:11:29.559 --> 0:11:32.680 was to get to know Ryan, Dylan Grace. But see 0:11:32.679 --> 0:11:34.880 them and that's not to make an excuse about anything, 0:11:34.920 --> 0:11:38.400 but they were young people, you know, Ryan being nineteen, 0:11:38.520 --> 0:11:43.040 I think Dylan being like twenty three ish twenty four, 0:11:43.120 --> 0:11:44.280 and lead Grace. 0:11:44.040 --> 0:11:47.079 Being a year older than that. You know, in any ways. 0:11:46.840 --> 0:11:49.440 Are command You're still just find your way in the world, 0:11:49.600 --> 0:11:52.840 you know, And and they still were kids, you know, 0:11:52.880 --> 0:11:54.440 they still were looking at it through that lens, and 0:11:54.480 --> 0:11:56.120 I think in some way there was an ia there. 0:11:56.320 --> 0:11:58.480 I think they started to, oh, man, we screwed up. 0:11:58.520 --> 0:12:00.920 There's you know, we've got to a lot take care 0:12:00.920 --> 0:12:03.000 of and pay for here. But at the same time, 0:12:03.000 --> 0:12:04.760 I don't think they realize what that would look like 0:12:05.160 --> 0:12:08.719 and just time to think and to have believe it 0:12:08.800 --> 0:12:12.480 or not. Responsibilities in prison I should say this. You 0:12:12.520 --> 0:12:14.880 know they are they each have jobs while in prison, 0:12:15.120 --> 0:12:17.240 and they go to work. They have hours that they 0:12:17.240 --> 0:12:19.480 have to go and schedules that they have to adhere to. 0:12:19.760 --> 0:12:21.480 I think some of that is even for mental health. 0:12:21.520 --> 0:12:23.600 It keeps you kind of again their words, kind. 0:12:23.520 --> 0:12:27.360 Of sane to have that to do, and I think 0:12:27.400 --> 0:12:30.840 that's really taught them a lot, and they become adults 0:12:30.840 --> 0:12:31.920 and I've seen that growth. 0:12:32.240 --> 0:12:34.720 I think those are the major changes. 0:12:34.320 --> 0:12:38.600 Is and really perspective, the opportunity to look back at 0:12:38.600 --> 0:12:41.280 what they did and go man like I and I'm 0:12:41.320 --> 0:12:43.319 speaking as if I'm them. I can see why I 0:12:43.360 --> 0:12:45.520 made the decisions I made. I see where I excuse my. 0:12:45.520 --> 0:12:46.520 Friends where I fucked up. 0:12:47.360 --> 0:12:49.920 But at the same time, how can I learn from that? 0:12:49.960 --> 0:12:52.520 How can I grow from that? And I think there 0:12:52.559 --> 0:12:56.560 are regrets. I think again comes with digestion and addition 0:12:56.720 --> 0:12:59.920 on your life and what you've done. I don't know 0:13:00.080 --> 0:13:01.560 they have made the same decisions. I kind of think 0:13:01.559 --> 0:13:03.760 they wouldn't have. I think the thing that is constant, 0:13:04.120 --> 0:13:06.240 for better or for worse, is to do almost anything 0:13:06.280 --> 0:13:09.439 to protect each other. Who might remember from the podcast, 0:13:09.520 --> 0:13:12.520 and we touch on this in the movies that they 0:13:12.559 --> 0:13:15.520 had a heart upbringing exceptionally heard upbringing, and won't get 0:13:15.559 --> 0:13:17.760 you much away about that, the sense of really being 0:13:17.800 --> 0:13:20.160 so tight knit that they were very protective of each other, 0:13:20.559 --> 0:13:22.880 and that still that still remains, that has not wavered 0:13:22.960 --> 0:13:25.400 at all. So I think those are the that's kind 0:13:25.440 --> 0:13:27.400 of the evolution that I've seen is, you know, the 0:13:27.880 --> 0:13:30.840 interesting arc to see that, especially in this context of 0:13:31.600 --> 0:13:34.040 the giting incident, of all them being on the run 0:13:34.040 --> 0:13:36.600 and eventually be captured, but spending this length of. 0:13:36.600 --> 0:13:37.760 Time and incarcerated. 0:13:39.320 --> 0:13:40.800 If I was going to break this down from an 0:13:40.920 --> 0:13:44.480 armchair psychologists standpoint of where things are today, what's news 0:13:44.480 --> 0:13:46.719 since we listened to the whole podcast, and where we 0:13:46.760 --> 0:13:50.200 are today as of right now. What I've observed and 0:13:50.240 --> 0:13:55.080 noticed is that each one of these three siblings, their 0:13:55.600 --> 0:13:59.480 character has not necessarily changed. It's almost magnified over time. 0:13:59.880 --> 0:14:02.959 And in that I find personally a bit of tragedy 0:14:03.000 --> 0:14:05.400 and sadness and seeing some of that. I don't mean 0:14:05.440 --> 0:14:09.199 to leave this on like a downer from my perspective 0:14:09.240 --> 0:14:12.439 of having had the opportunity to know that this period 0:14:12.520 --> 0:14:16.280 of time, my responsibility as a writer is to try 0:14:16.360 --> 0:14:21.760 to deserve the human condition, the human experience and story 0:14:21.880 --> 0:14:25.400 and get to know these characters. I am again not 0:14:25.440 --> 0:14:27.560 purporting myself to be kind of any kind of psychologist 0:14:27.640 --> 0:14:28.080 or an expert. 0:14:28.120 --> 0:14:31.240 I am not, so this is just a layman's perspective. 0:14:30.840 --> 0:14:34.960 But I think just noticing the characters that we portray 0:14:35.000 --> 0:14:37.000 in the film, that we also obviously get to know 0:14:37.080 --> 0:14:40.359 on the podcast, you kind of saw their aids magnified 0:14:40.440 --> 0:14:41.240 where they are today. 0:14:41.280 --> 0:14:44.040 This is what's different today is that. 0:14:44.360 --> 0:14:47.240 It's more there's growth, so they become adults, but you 0:14:47.280 --> 0:14:50.360 still see those same characteristics of the young Dylan Lee 0:14:50.400 --> 0:14:53.840 Grayson Ryan for example, Dylan. Dylan always had all the 0:14:53.880 --> 0:14:56.720 responsibility on his shoulders. He had to be the strong one, 0:14:56.800 --> 0:14:59.080 he had to take care of his younger siblings. So 0:14:59.200 --> 0:15:02.040 when doing so, you still see that now, like he's 0:15:02.080 --> 0:15:06.400 he hasn't let the system of you know, incarceration or 0:15:06.440 --> 0:15:09.440 the prison. He's he's found a way to thrive in there. 0:15:09.480 --> 0:15:12.200 As I was saying earlier, you'll hear him manning up 0:15:12.240 --> 0:15:13.080 and being a man. 0:15:13.760 --> 0:15:17.800 And I mean no disrespect in saying this, striving. 0:15:17.320 --> 0:15:20.000 To be wanted, to be desired, someone who wants to 0:15:20.040 --> 0:15:24.480 fit in, who is a very strong person, but also 0:15:24.640 --> 0:15:26.880 is searching for something. You can feel that as a 0:15:26.920 --> 0:15:29.320 young person. Again, we see this in the movie, we 0:15:29.440 --> 0:15:32.120 heard this in the podcast buts but even today is 0:15:32.120 --> 0:15:35.160 searching for something, searching like searching to be loved. 0:15:35.560 --> 0:15:38.160 And she's still doing that. She still is. I'm gonna 0:15:38.160 --> 0:15:39.720 be blunt here, but you know, I. 0:15:39.960 --> 0:15:43.960 Think Lee Grace is still even using you know her 0:15:44.360 --> 0:15:46.160 there's a better, more appropriate way of saying this, but 0:15:46.240 --> 0:15:50.800 feminine ways to you know, attract and connectivity on the 0:15:50.840 --> 0:15:55.280 outside and to communicate with people and have relationships and 0:15:55.280 --> 0:15:56.600 and that's very important to her. 0:15:56.640 --> 0:15:59.520 That probably seems to be one of her driving cores 0:15:59.520 --> 0:16:01.760 and a way, and I bring that up not that 0:16:01.800 --> 0:16:02.240 there's not. 0:16:02.360 --> 0:16:05.360 More to who she is as a person, and you know, 0:16:05.400 --> 0:16:08.240 you still see the repercussions of that, you know, in 0:16:08.320 --> 0:16:11.680 her personality and how she conducts herself with interfacing with 0:16:11.760 --> 0:16:12.240 other people. 0:16:12.520 --> 0:16:15.560 And then with Ryan, look, you know, he was the 0:16:15.600 --> 0:16:18.040 one that was a little more led. He was led 0:16:18.040 --> 0:16:18.840 by the other two. 0:16:19.040 --> 0:16:22.280 He was as the youngest, you know, constantly trying to 0:16:22.320 --> 0:16:25.480 pull himself up by his own breeches or siblings were 0:16:25.480 --> 0:16:27.560 trying to pull him if you can kind of picture 0:16:27.600 --> 0:16:31.000 that figuratively speaking, and trying to keep up. And you 0:16:31.040 --> 0:16:33.960 can still see that. I mean, he is a very 0:16:34.120 --> 0:16:36.600 very smart person. Actually, I would say he has a 0:16:36.680 --> 0:16:40.480 very high IQ, but also is as much as he's 0:16:40.480 --> 0:16:44.920 streets smarts, there's certain categories where he still seems kind 0:16:44.960 --> 0:16:48.360 of kidlike and he's still trying to catch up. And 0:16:48.400 --> 0:16:50.640 I think that has made the prison experience in particular 0:16:50.720 --> 0:16:52.280 extremely difficult on him. 0:16:52.400 --> 0:16:53.960 I think he's had the hardest time. 0:16:54.640 --> 0:16:57.680 So those are the things that I've seen and you 0:16:57.720 --> 0:16:59.240 look at them and I can still see the kids 0:16:59.240 --> 0:17:01.720 in them. I can still see the kids that had 0:17:01.840 --> 0:17:03.520 all the promise in the world. And I mean the 0:17:03.560 --> 0:17:05.120 kids even when they were kids, when we're talking about 0:17:05.160 --> 0:17:07.639 when they were seven, eight, nine, ten, eleven, because we 0:17:07.760 --> 0:17:11.320 touch on all those things and there's still hope and promise. 0:17:11.400 --> 0:17:14.760 But yet there are situation, their familial situation and the 0:17:14.800 --> 0:17:18.840 things that they were dealing with personally and also again 0:17:18.880 --> 0:17:22.880 their station in life, their socioeconomic status. There, you know, 0:17:23.920 --> 0:17:27.119 disintegration of the family nucleus, all those things that contributed to, 0:17:27.960 --> 0:17:30.600 you know, not the best situation for growing up. You 0:17:30.600 --> 0:17:33.359 could still see the remnants of that even as they 0:17:33.400 --> 0:17:36.720 are adults. Would love for you guys to see the 0:17:36.720 --> 0:17:38.560 film because it is based on a true story and 0:17:38.600 --> 0:17:40.760 true events, and you know, it's always what's behind the 0:17:40.800 --> 0:17:43.000 headlines that seems to be the most interesting and the 0:17:43.000 --> 0:17:46.320 most important and most impactful. While it's entertaining and dare 0:17:46.359 --> 0:17:48.640 I say it has all the salacious bells and whistles 0:17:48.680 --> 0:17:51.040 of the sex, drugs and rock and roll of this 0:17:51.240 --> 0:17:54.879 cross country crime spree that was enacted by these three siblings, 0:17:55.000 --> 0:17:57.320 there was much more to the story that impacted real 0:17:57.400 --> 0:18:00.959 lives and continues to impact real lives to this, including 0:18:00.960 --> 0:18:04.439