1 00:00:14,036 --> 00:00:23,676 Speaker 1: Pushing. This is sort of random, but I remember after 2 00:00:23,756 --> 00:00:25,916 Speaker 1: college and I lived in Denver for a year and 3 00:00:25,916 --> 00:00:28,316 Speaker 1: a half or something, and you came out to visit, right, 4 00:00:28,476 --> 00:00:33,356 Speaker 1: and we went to a baseball game. We went to 5 00:00:33,556 --> 00:00:36,276 Speaker 1: a Colorado Rockies game. And that was also the first 6 00:00:36,356 --> 00:00:39,916 Speaker 1: weekend I saw hockey ever in my whole life first, 7 00:00:40,036 --> 00:00:44,996 Speaker 1: and like, hockey, what is that? But I remember people 8 00:00:45,036 --> 00:00:48,316 Speaker 1: around us at the baseball game started asking us questions 9 00:00:48,676 --> 00:00:50,156 Speaker 1: like how do you guys know each other? They were 10 00:00:50,156 --> 00:00:52,596 Speaker 1: really excited and interested and like were you in the 11 00:00:52,596 --> 00:00:58,076 Speaker 1: military together, Like they couldn't conceive of a space where 12 00:00:58,156 --> 00:01:00,236 Speaker 1: we would just had this kind of like comfort around 13 00:01:00,236 --> 00:01:03,436 Speaker 1: one another. And it's sort of it's sort of triggered 14 00:01:03,436 --> 00:01:06,916 Speaker 1: their their curiosity of where would that space exist. I 15 00:01:07,516 --> 00:01:09,676 Speaker 1: just would distinctly remember it being kind of like the 16 00:01:09,676 --> 00:01:12,476 Speaker 1: whitest place I'd ever visited in terms of activities too, 17 00:01:12,516 --> 00:01:14,876 Speaker 1: like we went mountain bike ging. Yeah, we've never done 18 00:01:14,876 --> 00:01:18,476 Speaker 1: that before. Yeah, And and having people look at us, 19 00:01:18,516 --> 00:01:23,876 Speaker 1: even your roommate what was his name, Chip or Chad? Okay, Chip, Chad? 20 00:01:24,396 --> 00:01:29,716 Speaker 1: Uh totally different? Um, so you know, really nice guy. 21 00:01:29,756 --> 00:01:31,836 Speaker 1: I mean that I think even Chad was a little 22 00:01:31,956 --> 00:01:35,316 Speaker 1: like Wow, Ben Scott, you know, got this black friend. 23 00:01:42,036 --> 00:01:47,996 Speaker 1: I'm Khalil Jibrawn Muhammed and I'm Ben Austin. I was 24 00:01:48,036 --> 00:01:50,916 Speaker 1: giving you a runaway. Oh yeah, I don't. I give 25 00:01:50,956 --> 00:01:54,396 Speaker 1: myself runaway. You don't give me runaway. I'm Ben Austin 26 00:01:54,756 --> 00:01:58,876 Speaker 1: and I'm Khalil Gibrad Muhammed. We're two best friends, one black, 27 00:01:59,316 --> 00:02:03,236 Speaker 1: one wife. I'm a historian and I'm a journalist. And 28 00:02:03,356 --> 00:02:06,036 Speaker 1: this is some of my best friends are some of 29 00:02:06,156 --> 00:02:09,276 Speaker 1: my best friends are in this show. We wrestle with 30 00:02:09,316 --> 00:02:14,396 Speaker 1: the absurdities and the challenges of a deeply divided and 31 00:02:14,516 --> 00:02:19,596 Speaker 1: unequal country. Yeah. So we're going to talk today about buddies, 32 00:02:20,276 --> 00:02:23,916 Speaker 1: Buddies on the big screen, interracial buddy films. Yep. And 33 00:02:24,036 --> 00:02:27,516 Speaker 1: just a heads up because we're talking about interracial buddy films. 34 00:02:27,876 --> 00:02:30,476 Speaker 1: Some of the clips contain offensive language. Let's do it. 35 00:02:31,116 --> 00:02:36,836 Speaker 1: So we're gonna talk about four to eight hours and 36 00:02:36,836 --> 00:02:40,156 Speaker 1: we're going to talk about other interracial buddy films today. 37 00:02:40,196 --> 00:02:43,076 Speaker 1: No goddamn way to start a partnership. I get this 38 00:02:44,116 --> 00:02:47,236 Speaker 1: partners sween brothers and we've friends. I'm putting you down 39 00:02:47,276 --> 00:02:49,476 Speaker 1: and keeping you down until games is locked up or dead. 40 00:02:49,836 --> 00:02:51,836 Speaker 1: And if Games gets away, you're gonna be sorry you 41 00:02:51,996 --> 00:02:56,756 Speaker 1: ever met me. I'm already sorry. These Buddy films were 42 00:02:56,836 --> 00:03:01,796 Speaker 1: about crossing the color line, creating relationships. So that opening 43 00:03:01,796 --> 00:03:05,316 Speaker 1: scene we just heard, which has, you know, this classic line, 44 00:03:05,836 --> 00:03:08,316 Speaker 1: we ain't buddies, we ain't partners, and we ain't friends, 45 00:03:08,636 --> 00:03:11,156 Speaker 1: which set the moral arc of the story, which is 46 00:03:11,156 --> 00:03:14,156 Speaker 1: that we're gonna be buddies, partners and friends, and we're 47 00:03:14,156 --> 00:03:16,316 Speaker 1: gonna do a sequel, and we're going to launch all 48 00:03:16,396 --> 00:03:19,636 Speaker 1: kinds of sequels. So I think it's an important moment 49 00:03:19,676 --> 00:03:24,596 Speaker 1: to think about the last forty years since the nineteen eighties, 50 00:03:24,876 --> 00:03:26,916 Speaker 1: and how we got to a moment where we're now 51 00:03:26,956 --> 00:03:31,356 Speaker 1: talking about systemic racism because something about the notion of 52 00:03:31,436 --> 00:03:36,156 Speaker 1: just being together didn't get us to the Promised Land. Yeah. Yeah, 53 00:03:36,276 --> 00:03:39,876 Speaker 1: because I think this moment of talking about racism in 54 00:03:39,916 --> 00:03:43,716 Speaker 1: America and systemic racism in particular. This guy asked me 55 00:03:43,756 --> 00:03:45,876 Speaker 1: the other day. He found out I was a historian, 56 00:03:45,956 --> 00:03:49,076 Speaker 1: and he's like, oh, you teach at Harvard, you're an expert. 57 00:03:49,116 --> 00:03:51,196 Speaker 1: I've been dying astis, So what do you think the 58 00:03:51,236 --> 00:03:53,156 Speaker 1: solution is the First thing I say, I was like, dude, 59 00:03:53,196 --> 00:03:55,676 Speaker 1: come on, I studied the past, but that was just 60 00:03:55,716 --> 00:03:58,716 Speaker 1: me trying to demure from the question, and it is 61 00:03:58,796 --> 00:04:01,756 Speaker 1: no seriously, And I said, well, what do you think 62 00:04:01,836 --> 00:04:04,276 Speaker 1: and he said, integration, man, integration. I grew up in 63 00:04:04,356 --> 00:04:06,956 Speaker 1: Jersey City. There's people everywhere from all over the world. 64 00:04:07,676 --> 00:04:10,556 Speaker 1: And he said, we just need to spend more time together. Yeah, 65 00:04:10,596 --> 00:04:12,996 Speaker 1: And that's what these Buddy films were about. We were 66 00:04:12,996 --> 00:04:15,876 Speaker 1: really shown something then that we were we were we 67 00:04:15,876 --> 00:04:20,476 Speaker 1: were thinking about and revisiting a movie like that now, 68 00:04:20,556 --> 00:04:22,716 Speaker 1: you know, to try to try to imagine that moment 69 00:04:22,756 --> 00:04:24,956 Speaker 1: back when we were kids and what we saw. And 70 00:04:24,996 --> 00:04:26,956 Speaker 1: then also this other thing like what do they what 71 00:04:27,036 --> 00:04:29,196 Speaker 1: do they tell us? Now? What are we? What do 72 00:04:29,236 --> 00:04:30,996 Speaker 1: we learn? What do we take away from them? Yeah, 73 00:04:30,996 --> 00:04:34,196 Speaker 1: so they are all these amazing films. There's everything from 74 00:04:34,236 --> 00:04:37,356 Speaker 1: The Defiant Ones in nineteen fifty eight with Sydney Poortier 75 00:04:37,396 --> 00:04:40,716 Speaker 1: and Tony Curtis. Everybody lives by and everybody stuck with 76 00:04:40,756 --> 00:04:45,036 Speaker 1: what is even a swamp? Animals? Even that weasel. You're 77 00:04:45,116 --> 00:04:49,756 Speaker 1: calling me a weasel. No, I'm calling you a white man. 78 00:04:50,756 --> 00:04:52,916 Speaker 1: There's in the Heat of the Night in nineteen sixty 79 00:04:52,916 --> 00:04:57,796 Speaker 1: seven Sydney Potier again, they call me, mister Tibbs. I 80 00:04:57,876 --> 00:05:00,796 Speaker 1: mean he is, like, I don't know, he's the every 81 00:05:00,916 --> 00:05:04,276 Speaker 1: black man in Hollywood at that time, and he's starring 82 00:05:04,276 --> 00:05:08,436 Speaker 1: alongside Rod Steiger. You got Silver Streak with Gene wild 83 00:05:08,476 --> 00:05:11,796 Speaker 1: there and Richard Prior. I can't pass for black. You 84 00:05:11,916 --> 00:05:13,716 Speaker 1: tell him. I didn't say I was gonna make you black. 85 00:05:13,716 --> 00:05:15,036 Speaker 1: I said I was gonna get you on the train. 86 00:05:15,236 --> 00:05:17,476 Speaker 1: Now we've got to make them cops. Thank you black. 87 00:05:18,436 --> 00:05:21,676 Speaker 1: And then they get back together and stir crazy. There's 88 00:05:21,676 --> 00:05:25,596 Speaker 1: also Blazing Saddles, which was the first movie that my 89 00:05:25,636 --> 00:05:27,236 Speaker 1: brother and I went to and we looked at one 90 00:05:27,276 --> 00:05:30,356 Speaker 1: another and were like, damn, they make movies for us. 91 00:05:33,156 --> 00:05:35,836 Speaker 1: And then and then we jump into the nineteen eighties. Yeah, 92 00:05:35,836 --> 00:05:41,796 Speaker 1: we got Trading Places, dan Ackroyd, Eddie Murphy again from Cameroon. 93 00:05:42,356 --> 00:05:49,556 Speaker 1: Do you remember me? It's Lionel, Joseph Yep and all 94 00:05:49,556 --> 00:05:52,556 Speaker 1: the Beverly Hills cop movies of course, which which is 95 00:05:52,596 --> 00:05:54,996 Speaker 1: when Eddie Murphy is at the prime of his career, 96 00:05:55,516 --> 00:05:57,596 Speaker 1: disturbing the piece I got thrown out of a window. 97 00:05:57,916 --> 00:05:59,596 Speaker 1: What's the fucking charge? Were getting pushed out of a 98 00:05:59,596 --> 00:06:02,956 Speaker 1: moving far huh? Jay Walking. Then in the early nineties, 99 00:06:02,956 --> 00:06:04,996 Speaker 1: you get White Men Can't Jump, which is in a 100 00:06:05,076 --> 00:06:09,356 Speaker 1: samizingly amazing film with Woody Harrelson and Wesley Snipes. Now 101 00:06:09,396 --> 00:06:11,516 Speaker 1: I'll see you a hustle man. Hey, I never used 102 00:06:11,516 --> 00:06:13,756 Speaker 1: no goofy white motherfucker like fat Hey, who you calling 103 00:06:13,796 --> 00:06:19,716 Speaker 1: coofy white motherfuck you. There's Rush Hour, which extends the 104 00:06:19,756 --> 00:06:23,556 Speaker 1: genre of interracial buddy films to Jackie chan that. There's 105 00:06:23,636 --> 00:06:27,836 Speaker 1: also Training Day with Denzel Washington and Ethan Hawk, a 106 00:06:27,916 --> 00:06:32,996 Speaker 1: kind of another version with that inversion, right exactly. Yeah, yeah, 107 00:06:33,036 --> 00:06:35,196 Speaker 1: so there. So there's a lot of films, right, it's 108 00:06:35,196 --> 00:06:38,076 Speaker 1: been this is a genre that's been going on literally 109 00:06:38,436 --> 00:06:41,276 Speaker 1: for half a century. So we're gonna talk about two 110 00:06:41,316 --> 00:06:44,916 Speaker 1: in particular today, forty eight Hours, the first of Eddie 111 00:06:44,996 --> 00:06:48,196 Speaker 1: Murphy's films, and also Lethal Weapon, which is a kind 112 00:06:48,236 --> 00:06:52,516 Speaker 1: of a genre buster with Danny Glover and Mel Gibson. Yeah, 113 00:06:52,556 --> 00:06:57,916 Speaker 1: these films set in motion, you know, dozens of copycat versions. 114 00:07:11,396 --> 00:07:14,956 Speaker 1: So Khalil, you you were talking about all the ways 115 00:07:14,996 --> 00:07:18,356 Speaker 1: that you, you know, Danny Glover to hide stereotypes. Do 116 00:07:18,396 --> 00:07:20,196 Speaker 1: you remember that at the time at all of seeing 117 00:07:20,236 --> 00:07:23,076 Speaker 1: that and feeling anything, Well, I think, I mean, yeah, 118 00:07:23,196 --> 00:07:29,396 Speaker 1: I was very conscious of portrayals of blackness and black men, 119 00:07:29,596 --> 00:07:33,396 Speaker 1: black people. You know, I remember watching The Cosby Show 120 00:07:33,436 --> 00:07:36,676 Speaker 1: like everybody else, with a great sense of pride at 121 00:07:36,676 --> 00:07:40,276 Speaker 1: this incredible family, the Huxtables, and so any movie that 122 00:07:40,396 --> 00:07:44,956 Speaker 1: featured black people and particularly black men and key characters 123 00:07:45,036 --> 00:07:46,836 Speaker 1: was a big deal. I Mean, I'd come off of 124 00:07:46,876 --> 00:07:51,076 Speaker 1: seeing Richard Pryor, who mostly was doing comedy of one 125 00:07:51,156 --> 00:07:54,396 Speaker 1: kind or another, whether it was in his own films 126 00:07:54,476 --> 00:07:58,156 Speaker 1: or with Gene Wilder, and these films seemed, you know, 127 00:07:58,196 --> 00:08:04,996 Speaker 1: they seemed more mature, more positive, and I remember feeling 128 00:08:05,036 --> 00:08:07,596 Speaker 1: that I was invested in what was happening on the 129 00:08:07,596 --> 00:08:11,916 Speaker 1: big screen. I think this is probably true for forty 130 00:08:11,916 --> 00:08:14,476 Speaker 1: eight Hours too. I Mean, we don't talk about the 131 00:08:14,596 --> 00:08:17,756 Speaker 1: genre of black savior films like we talk about the 132 00:08:17,796 --> 00:08:21,276 Speaker 1: genre of white savior films. But that's that's the other 133 00:08:21,316 --> 00:08:26,036 Speaker 1: thing that I think made these films interesting to black audiences. Well, 134 00:08:26,156 --> 00:08:28,116 Speaker 1: the thing about the white character and all of these 135 00:08:28,156 --> 00:08:32,716 Speaker 1: films is that for them to have the relationship with 136 00:08:32,756 --> 00:08:36,276 Speaker 1: the black character, they need to be outsiders. That's part 137 00:08:36,316 --> 00:08:40,076 Speaker 1: of the trope. You know, you're you're separate, You're a 138 00:08:40,156 --> 00:08:44,276 Speaker 1: crazy person, a vigilante, not a team player, like you're 139 00:08:44,356 --> 00:08:48,636 Speaker 1: outside somehow white society, normal white society, and therefore you 140 00:08:48,676 --> 00:08:51,516 Speaker 1: could be linked up with this black person in some way. 141 00:08:51,756 --> 00:08:54,556 Speaker 1: That's why I'm thinking about these Buddy films as black 142 00:08:54,556 --> 00:08:57,356 Speaker 1: savior films, right because at the end of the day, 143 00:08:57,996 --> 00:09:03,156 Speaker 1: white people don't need saving but four right like, But 144 00:09:03,436 --> 00:09:08,596 Speaker 1: for the characters Riggs who's suicidal, Nick Nolte, who's just 145 00:09:08,756 --> 00:09:12,836 Speaker 1: an asshole cop who's very selfish and himself is quick 146 00:09:12,836 --> 00:09:16,156 Speaker 1: triggered and racist, right like, he needs Eddie Murphy so 147 00:09:16,156 --> 00:09:20,036 Speaker 1: he can stop being a racist cop. So these Buddy 148 00:09:20,036 --> 00:09:24,556 Speaker 1: films are doing something to create space for black people 149 00:09:24,596 --> 00:09:28,516 Speaker 1: in a white society that had only ever imagined them 150 00:09:28,556 --> 00:09:32,796 Speaker 1: as something less than. So Eddie Murphy been. I mean, 151 00:09:32,916 --> 00:09:36,836 Speaker 1: of course he was for our generation what Richard Pryor 152 00:09:36,916 --> 00:09:40,756 Speaker 1: had been to our parents' generation, and what Dave Chappelle 153 00:09:40,836 --> 00:09:43,596 Speaker 1: has been for a whole generation of young people who 154 00:09:43,636 --> 00:09:48,356 Speaker 1: are younger than us, the black comic translator of all 155 00:09:48,436 --> 00:09:52,436 Speaker 1: the racist myths and mythologies and absurdities in America. And 156 00:09:52,476 --> 00:09:54,396 Speaker 1: that's part of the excitement of forty eight Hours. It's 157 00:09:54,436 --> 00:09:57,396 Speaker 1: a breakout role and we know him already, but it 158 00:09:57,436 --> 00:10:00,076 Speaker 1: was just part of my coming of age experience in 159 00:10:00,156 --> 00:10:04,636 Speaker 1: Hyde Park and being at the local theater. And of 160 00:10:04,676 --> 00:10:07,516 Speaker 1: course you and I ended up working literally we met 161 00:10:07,636 --> 00:10:10,316 Speaker 1: the next year after that movie and work next door 162 00:10:10,356 --> 00:10:13,596 Speaker 1: at Hyde Park Computers, the theater and the computer store. 163 00:10:13,676 --> 00:10:17,196 Speaker 1: We're almost contiguous, and yeah, and seeing movies there was 164 00:10:17,236 --> 00:10:20,716 Speaker 1: a big deal. Yeah. So that movie I think is 165 00:10:20,716 --> 00:10:25,476 Speaker 1: really powerful because it is so steeped in racism, Like 166 00:10:25,556 --> 00:10:28,556 Speaker 1: you're talking about forty eight hours, forty eight hours, I mean, yeah, 167 00:10:28,556 --> 00:10:31,356 Speaker 1: it is. It is in your face. I mean, if 168 00:10:31,676 --> 00:10:35,196 Speaker 1: a weapon verst color blind version of this, right, this 169 00:10:35,276 --> 00:10:37,916 Speaker 1: is just the opposite. Yeah, so this is very much 170 00:10:37,916 --> 00:10:41,676 Speaker 1: a Hollywood film. Joel Silver produces this film, maybe it's 171 00:10:41,676 --> 00:10:44,196 Speaker 1: his first one, and he ends up producing actually Lethal 172 00:10:44,236 --> 00:10:48,476 Speaker 1: Weapon and a million other movies. But there's something that 173 00:10:48,636 --> 00:10:51,996 Speaker 1: still feels really unique about this and different from other films. 174 00:10:52,276 --> 00:10:55,716 Speaker 1: There's all this racism in the film, but it feels 175 00:10:55,796 --> 00:10:59,956 Speaker 1: like it's an analysis of racism and race rather than 176 00:10:59,996 --> 00:11:04,316 Speaker 1: being racist. Oh. Absolutely, From the very first moment, the 177 00:11:04,476 --> 00:11:08,916 Speaker 1: opening scene is you know where one guy breaks in 178 00:11:08,956 --> 00:11:11,556 Speaker 1: the one out of prison, and the whole way he 179 00:11:11,596 --> 00:11:14,036 Speaker 1: does it is by saying racist things against him as 180 00:11:14,036 --> 00:11:16,316 Speaker 1: a as a Native American. Right, it's from the very 181 00:11:16,316 --> 00:11:22,116 Speaker 1: opening lines, you got a big mouth. He's only joking. 182 00:11:24,356 --> 00:11:27,516 Speaker 1: They have the water place, firewater Tonto. Is that what 183 00:11:27,596 --> 00:11:34,996 Speaker 1: you mean? Firewater? Huh? Yeah, there's firewater Tonto. Right. So yeah, 184 00:11:35,116 --> 00:11:38,196 Speaker 1: so Eddie Murphy is joined in this league, this band 185 00:11:38,756 --> 00:11:42,796 Speaker 1: of criminals, um, that includes two white guys, an Indian 186 00:11:42,956 --> 00:11:44,596 Speaker 1: and a black guy. It's kind of like one of 187 00:11:44,596 --> 00:11:47,836 Speaker 1: those jokes, right, like what happens when two white guys 188 00:11:47,836 --> 00:11:49,876 Speaker 1: in Indian and black guy get together and rob a bank? 189 00:11:50,036 --> 00:11:53,356 Speaker 1: And so that's like the conceit of the film out 190 00:11:53,436 --> 00:11:59,036 Speaker 1: the gate and uh, the racism directed towards the character. 191 00:11:59,516 --> 00:12:02,556 Speaker 1: What if was his name? Billy? Yeah, Billy the Native 192 00:12:02,596 --> 00:12:07,156 Speaker 1: American guy? Yeah, Billy yeah, Billy. Um is just it 193 00:12:07,236 --> 00:12:11,396 Speaker 1: means it's it's it's all dropping from the beginning. And 194 00:12:11,436 --> 00:12:15,036 Speaker 1: so partly what I'm thinking about seeing that as kids 195 00:12:16,436 --> 00:12:20,956 Speaker 1: is how commonplace it was to play to this racist 196 00:12:20,996 --> 00:12:24,916 Speaker 1: humor in these stereotypes, right, yes, saying it felt like 197 00:12:24,956 --> 00:12:28,996 Speaker 1: that race is always present and on people's minds, and 198 00:12:29,116 --> 00:12:31,956 Speaker 1: people talk about it, and people worry about it, and 199 00:12:31,996 --> 00:12:35,476 Speaker 1: people joke about it, and it's there at every moment, 200 00:12:35,676 --> 00:12:38,236 Speaker 1: and it doesn't necessarily lead to racism, but you don't 201 00:12:38,356 --> 00:12:40,516 Speaker 1: pass up a moment to mention it, or to joke 202 00:12:40,556 --> 00:12:42,716 Speaker 1: about it, or to nudge something about it. Yeah, I 203 00:12:42,756 --> 00:12:45,556 Speaker 1: mean the humor. The humor is dramatized, so it's not 204 00:12:45,676 --> 00:12:48,716 Speaker 1: meant for laughs. Right, It's like, we all know this 205 00:12:48,756 --> 00:12:50,796 Speaker 1: is how we really think and talk about each other, 206 00:12:51,396 --> 00:12:53,636 Speaker 1: so we're going to lean into that. In fact, Nick 207 00:12:53,716 --> 00:12:56,036 Speaker 1: Nolty's character, I mean, he you know, he opens as 208 00:12:56,076 --> 00:13:00,516 Speaker 1: this kind of you know, working stiff cop who's sleeping 209 00:13:00,516 --> 00:13:04,076 Speaker 1: with this woman. You know, he's noncommittal, it's just about 210 00:13:04,316 --> 00:13:07,636 Speaker 1: the sex, and it's just another day on the job. 211 00:13:08,076 --> 00:13:10,796 Speaker 1: And this day happens to be one where he's going 212 00:13:10,876 --> 00:13:13,036 Speaker 1: to end up getting some black guy out of jail 213 00:13:13,076 --> 00:13:16,676 Speaker 1: to solve a crime. But the first thing you know, 214 00:13:16,996 --> 00:13:20,476 Speaker 1: out of his mouth basically within the conversation when he 215 00:13:20,476 --> 00:13:23,916 Speaker 1: meets Eddie Murphy shortly after, he basically says, I need 216 00:13:23,956 --> 00:13:26,436 Speaker 1: your help, is you know I thought you were a 217 00:13:26,476 --> 00:13:31,036 Speaker 1: smart boy, like I mean, and he says it just 218 00:13:31,196 --> 00:13:34,396 Speaker 1: shy of a Southern twang. Oh man, it it I mean, 219 00:13:34,436 --> 00:13:38,796 Speaker 1: I I it goes from boy jive. He calls him 220 00:13:39,076 --> 00:13:44,716 Speaker 1: a spear chucker. He says, you, um, what was He 221 00:13:44,756 --> 00:13:48,316 Speaker 1: calls him watermelon at one point. Yeah, later on, Yeah, 222 00:13:48,316 --> 00:13:51,956 Speaker 1: he calls him a chocolate colored loser. And then and 223 00:13:51,996 --> 00:13:55,356 Speaker 1: then finally it like builds builds built, and they have 224 00:13:55,436 --> 00:13:56,916 Speaker 1: this scene where they get in the fist fight. He 225 00:13:56,996 --> 00:13:59,236 Speaker 1: uses the N word it like, I mean he goes 226 00:13:59,276 --> 00:14:03,036 Speaker 1: to places you're like watermelon, damn, like spear chucker, like 227 00:14:03,156 --> 00:14:06,756 Speaker 1: and another actor. You know, if you had Mel Gibson 228 00:14:06,796 --> 00:14:09,596 Speaker 1: saying on those lines, it would have come across totally differently. 229 00:14:09,876 --> 00:14:15,556 Speaker 1: There's something about about about Nick Nolty's racism and like 230 00:14:15,756 --> 00:14:20,076 Speaker 1: also like he's this giant, hulking guy and so shabby 231 00:14:20,156 --> 00:14:23,116 Speaker 1: and worn out, and like his lines are delivered with 232 00:14:23,156 --> 00:14:26,116 Speaker 1: a weariness. You know, it's not like he's not there's 233 00:14:26,156 --> 00:14:28,436 Speaker 1: not like a spit edge to them. He's just like 234 00:14:28,956 --> 00:14:32,636 Speaker 1: he's just fallen apart. Yeah. Well again, I think he's 235 00:14:32,636 --> 00:14:37,196 Speaker 1: also standing in as this Irish cop. Like he he 236 00:14:37,276 --> 00:14:40,236 Speaker 1: has a proverbial Irish cup of coffee. He pulls out 237 00:14:40,276 --> 00:14:43,596 Speaker 1: his flask and drops a little whiskey in it before 238 00:14:43,596 --> 00:14:47,916 Speaker 1: he gets his day started, and his racism is dripping 239 00:14:48,436 --> 00:14:52,116 Speaker 1: from him, which is a way of kind of signifying 240 00:14:52,756 --> 00:14:57,476 Speaker 1: that the moral arc right of his experience is gonna 241 00:14:57,516 --> 00:15:01,516 Speaker 1: be coming to terms with how shitty he is as 242 00:15:01,556 --> 00:15:05,436 Speaker 1: a person to black people and all that's inside of 243 00:15:05,516 --> 00:15:09,796 Speaker 1: him that Eddie Murphy stands in as this canvas for 244 00:15:09,876 --> 00:15:13,316 Speaker 1: him to spew on, including as you pointed out, this 245 00:15:13,356 --> 00:15:17,956 Speaker 1: line over he calls him literally an overdressed, charcoal colored loser. 246 00:15:18,916 --> 00:15:22,636 Speaker 1: But the truth is he is himself a loser his 247 00:15:23,716 --> 00:15:28,716 Speaker 1: well but he but he, but he is right. Nobody 248 00:15:28,796 --> 00:15:31,756 Speaker 1: likes this guy so so that that idea. I mean, 249 00:15:31,996 --> 00:15:33,476 Speaker 1: I hadn't even thought of the film in a way 250 00:15:33,476 --> 00:15:38,076 Speaker 1: as a black savior movie. Um. And there's this, there's 251 00:15:38,116 --> 00:15:40,636 Speaker 1: this is this amazing moment when they're in the black 252 00:15:40,676 --> 00:15:45,276 Speaker 1: bar and Nick Nolty's character essentially apologizes for all the 253 00:15:45,356 --> 00:15:51,636 Speaker 1: racist things. He said, muff, that was just doing much job, 254 00:15:51,796 --> 00:15:58,396 Speaker 1: keeping me down. Yeah, well, doing your job. Don't explain everything, Jack, Yeah, 255 00:15:58,436 --> 00:16:08,556 Speaker 1: you're right, as long as you feeling like Abraham Lincoln, 256 00:16:11,156 --> 00:16:14,076 Speaker 1: which at first I was like, I confused it with 257 00:16:14,076 --> 00:16:16,076 Speaker 1: with George Washington. Was it telling the truth? And I 258 00:16:16,116 --> 00:16:19,276 Speaker 1: was like, oh no, he means freeing the slaves exactly, 259 00:16:19,676 --> 00:16:23,236 Speaker 1: Like yeah, I mean the the idea that you know 260 00:16:23,316 --> 00:16:26,476 Speaker 1: in his raspy, weary voice. He says all the words 261 00:16:26,516 --> 00:16:30,276 Speaker 1: again and apologizes, I was just doing my job holding 262 00:16:30,276 --> 00:16:34,316 Speaker 1: you down. And Eddie Murphy's line is amazing, you know, 263 00:16:35,076 --> 00:16:37,956 Speaker 1: doing your job doesn't explain all of it, right, and 264 00:16:38,036 --> 00:16:42,916 Speaker 1: he says, yeah, yeah, you're right, fuck like like like 265 00:16:43,436 --> 00:16:46,876 Speaker 1: and then it's so like real and crazy that this 266 00:16:46,956 --> 00:16:49,476 Speaker 1: is actually happening in this in this buddy movie that 267 00:16:49,556 --> 00:16:55,196 Speaker 1: Eddie Murphy has to like deflate it with his laugh, right, No, 268 00:16:55,276 --> 00:16:58,996 Speaker 1: it was. I agree, it was incredible, and I mean 269 00:16:59,076 --> 00:17:03,276 Speaker 1: this is this is where I think the film is 270 00:17:04,236 --> 00:17:11,716 Speaker 1: groundbreaking for taking head on how so many Americans are 271 00:17:11,836 --> 00:17:15,356 Speaker 1: thinking about these issues in this moment. Yeah, you're right. 272 00:17:15,516 --> 00:17:18,076 Speaker 1: You know. One of the things that this film does 273 00:17:18,436 --> 00:17:22,156 Speaker 1: powerfully that say lethal weapon doesn't do at all. It 274 00:17:22,276 --> 00:17:26,276 Speaker 1: actually shows them develop a relationship. They actually do connect. 275 00:17:26,636 --> 00:17:28,396 Speaker 1: And then there's a sense too of like the other 276 00:17:28,476 --> 00:17:32,556 Speaker 1: kind of male bonding of doing a job well that 277 00:17:32,636 --> 00:17:35,156 Speaker 1: they both live by a code, you know, that their 278 00:17:35,236 --> 00:17:40,316 Speaker 1: sense of this being you know, your pluck and your ingenuity. 279 00:17:40,436 --> 00:17:43,116 Speaker 1: When Nick Nolty defends him against the chief, he says 280 00:17:43,436 --> 00:17:45,916 Speaker 1: he might be a convict, but he's the smartest partner 281 00:17:45,916 --> 00:17:48,796 Speaker 1: I ever worked with right. That's that's a big part 282 00:17:48,796 --> 00:17:53,396 Speaker 1: of what you're talking about, which is that that their 283 00:17:53,516 --> 00:18:01,196 Speaker 1: authentic relationship has has to rise above the normal rules 284 00:18:01,236 --> 00:18:04,916 Speaker 1: that apply in a society that's broken. They maybe that's 285 00:18:04,956 --> 00:18:07,796 Speaker 1: a good good moment to talk about that. That bar 286 00:18:07,836 --> 00:18:10,716 Speaker 1: scene the probably the famous scene in the movie. Yeah, 287 00:18:10,756 --> 00:18:13,076 Speaker 1: so this scene, you know they're they're going in to 288 00:18:13,116 --> 00:18:15,596 Speaker 1: find out where this guy Billy is, and they know 289 00:18:15,636 --> 00:18:17,956 Speaker 1: that he used to bartend there, and they walk into 290 00:18:17,996 --> 00:18:22,116 Speaker 1: this bar and it is just like some fantasy land 291 00:18:22,276 --> 00:18:25,356 Speaker 1: of if they say redneck bar. Like the first shot, 292 00:18:25,436 --> 00:18:27,916 Speaker 1: you hear these fiddles, it's like the Charlie Daniels band, 293 00:18:28,276 --> 00:18:31,876 Speaker 1: and you see a woman on stage dancing to like fiddles, 294 00:18:31,916 --> 00:18:34,996 Speaker 1: going nuts. Every single person in there is white, and 295 00:18:35,036 --> 00:18:37,796 Speaker 1: he is wearing a cowboy hat, and there are Confederate 296 00:18:37,836 --> 00:18:41,716 Speaker 1: flags everywhere we where, Like it just goes from small 297 00:18:41,796 --> 00:18:47,116 Speaker 1: Confederate flag, bigger, big Confederate flag, bigger Confederate flag. And 298 00:18:47,316 --> 00:18:49,996 Speaker 1: so the first line that Eddie Murphy says, not a 299 00:18:50,116 --> 00:18:53,916 Speaker 1: very popular place for my kind of place, always like 300 00:18:54,116 --> 00:18:57,676 Speaker 1: custry boys. They're sure there. I was gonna like you. 301 00:18:59,676 --> 00:19:02,076 Speaker 1: Eddie Murphy. The work that he does in this scene. 302 00:19:02,196 --> 00:19:05,956 Speaker 1: Just it's masterful, right, But it also it's also the 303 00:19:05,996 --> 00:19:11,316 Speaker 1: moment where Eddie Murphy and bo ease the actual power 304 00:19:11,556 --> 00:19:15,356 Speaker 1: of policing. Yes, right, yeah, that's that's a moment where 305 00:19:15,756 --> 00:19:19,516 Speaker 1: Nick Nolte sees a version of himself and realizes how 306 00:19:19,596 --> 00:19:22,556 Speaker 1: much power and privilege he actually has. Yeah, so before 307 00:19:22,556 --> 00:19:25,876 Speaker 1: they go into this Honckey talk bar, Eddie Murphy's character 308 00:19:25,956 --> 00:19:30,516 Speaker 1: Reggie Hammond says to Nick Nolty's character Jack Kates, the 309 00:19:30,556 --> 00:19:33,356 Speaker 1: thing that gives you power is your badge. I could 310 00:19:33,356 --> 00:19:35,916 Speaker 1: get the information if I just had a badge. And 311 00:19:36,076 --> 00:19:38,556 Speaker 1: Nick Nolty he says, no way. You know, I'm a 312 00:19:38,596 --> 00:19:40,956 Speaker 1: great cop. I know what I'm doing. And so they 313 00:19:40,996 --> 00:19:43,036 Speaker 1: make a bet and he says, I'll give you my 314 00:19:43,116 --> 00:19:45,636 Speaker 1: badge and you can you can try to see if 315 00:19:45,676 --> 00:19:47,756 Speaker 1: you can get the same information out of these people. 316 00:19:48,116 --> 00:19:51,116 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, no, it's it's such a powerful moment in 317 00:19:51,156 --> 00:19:55,516 Speaker 1: the film because, to anyone's surprise, no one has seen 318 00:19:55,556 --> 00:19:57,196 Speaker 1: a film a moment like this in a in a 319 00:19:57,276 --> 00:20:01,796 Speaker 1: Hollywood scene. This is probably this is probably top ten 320 00:20:01,916 --> 00:20:07,956 Speaker 1: scene for groundbreaking use of comedy to illustrate some of 321 00:20:07,996 --> 00:20:12,396 Speaker 1: the most powerful social forces in society, including how much 322 00:20:12,436 --> 00:20:16,756 Speaker 1: the intersection of race and policing matter in our system. Yeah, 323 00:20:16,756 --> 00:20:22,836 Speaker 1: like this is orson Wells level right here, like this 324 00:20:22,836 --> 00:20:25,996 Speaker 1: this is up there. Yeah yeah, all right, listen up. 325 00:20:28,036 --> 00:20:32,556 Speaker 1: I don't like white people. I hate rednecks. You people 326 00:20:32,556 --> 00:20:36,836 Speaker 1: are rednecks. It means I'm enjoying this shit. Yeah, so okay, 327 00:20:36,876 --> 00:20:42,476 Speaker 1: So like that is the moment where Eddie Murphy fully 328 00:20:42,516 --> 00:20:50,756 Speaker 1: embodies Nick Noti's power. He literally turns. He basically collides 329 00:20:51,276 --> 00:20:54,236 Speaker 1: the power of policing with the power to be racist 330 00:20:54,796 --> 00:20:58,556 Speaker 1: because he can do anything to these people and they 331 00:20:58,596 --> 00:21:00,636 Speaker 1: can do nothing about it. You know what I am. 332 00:21:00,636 --> 00:21:04,156 Speaker 1: I'm your worst fucking night man, man manigga would have badged. 333 00:21:04,156 --> 00:21:05,956 Speaker 1: I mean, I got permission to kick your fucking ass 334 00:21:05,956 --> 00:21:09,316 Speaker 1: whenever I feel like it. And that that is the 335 00:21:09,316 --> 00:21:12,996 Speaker 1: slavery metaphor playing out in this moment which Nick Nolte. 336 00:21:13,116 --> 00:21:15,436 Speaker 1: And what I love about the scene is it's also 337 00:21:15,556 --> 00:21:20,436 Speaker 1: the moment where Nick Nolte is watching this. The camera 338 00:21:20,476 --> 00:21:22,956 Speaker 1: comes back to Nick Nolty time and time again, so 339 00:21:23,036 --> 00:21:26,316 Speaker 1: that he can see with his own eyes what he 340 00:21:26,396 --> 00:21:30,356 Speaker 1: has been doing to people. Yeah and maybe maybe like 341 00:21:30,436 --> 00:21:34,236 Speaker 1: he sees it, but he doesn't. It doesn't sink in yet, 342 00:21:34,476 --> 00:21:38,836 Speaker 1: but it's part, it's part of the process grow. Yeah. Yeah, 343 00:21:38,876 --> 00:21:41,796 Speaker 1: so I think we should take a look then at 344 00:21:41,836 --> 00:21:45,836 Speaker 1: how this notion of power and privilege moves out of 345 00:21:45,916 --> 00:21:49,756 Speaker 1: Eddie Murphy to another movie that Joel Silver makes five 346 00:21:49,836 --> 00:21:54,916 Speaker 1: years later, another interracial buddy film, another cop action film, 347 00:21:55,356 --> 00:21:58,956 Speaker 1: and this time Danny Glover plays the straight guy, and 348 00:21:59,276 --> 00:22:03,436 Speaker 1: he's the cop in charge. He's Sergeant Murtok, and all 349 00:22:03,476 --> 00:22:07,396 Speaker 1: of a sudden, all these stereotypes are completely inverted. He's 350 00:22:07,436 --> 00:22:11,676 Speaker 1: a family man, he's hashes, he's played by the rules, 351 00:22:11,956 --> 00:22:15,756 Speaker 1: he's fifty years old, thinking about retirement because he's already 352 00:22:15,796 --> 00:22:18,316 Speaker 1: done his twenty year bit. And he gets this crazy 353 00:22:18,396 --> 00:22:22,076 Speaker 1: ass lunatic white guy as a partner who's played by 354 00:22:22,076 --> 00:22:45,476 Speaker 1: Mel Gibbs. Fascinating. So the premise of Lethal Weapon is, 355 00:22:45,876 --> 00:22:50,676 Speaker 1: you know, Danny Glover's character, Murtile is his name, Roger 356 00:22:50,756 --> 00:22:58,596 Speaker 1: Murtile is Murtalk, Murtalk, Murtalk. Yeah, he's a cop. You know, 357 00:22:59,116 --> 00:23:01,876 Speaker 1: he's guess he's near retirement or something like he's just 358 00:23:01,956 --> 00:23:05,716 Speaker 1: turned fifty and then copy years. You know, that's like 359 00:23:05,876 --> 00:23:08,436 Speaker 1: twenty five good years on the force. Yeah, so you're 360 00:23:08,436 --> 00:23:12,796 Speaker 1: at that done they're on the lapd and he gets 361 00:23:12,836 --> 00:23:16,916 Speaker 1: this renegade partner, you know, the outside or not the 362 00:23:16,956 --> 00:23:19,956 Speaker 1: team player, you know, and and somebody who they think 363 00:23:20,036 --> 00:23:23,716 Speaker 1: is suicidal, and it's Mel Gibson, right, and that's a 364 00:23:23,756 --> 00:23:26,156 Speaker 1: real bad I'm a real company's a really fucking gun. 365 00:23:27,316 --> 00:23:29,276 Speaker 1: It turns out to be a little crazy in the end. 366 00:23:29,476 --> 00:23:32,596 Speaker 1: I mean, when we saw it, do you think of 367 00:23:32,636 --> 00:23:36,076 Speaker 1: it as like an important film in any way of 368 00:23:36,116 --> 00:23:41,236 Speaker 1: seeing like interracial you know, males bonding in some way. 369 00:23:41,396 --> 00:23:43,716 Speaker 1: Did you remember it that way? I did. Yeah. The 370 00:23:43,796 --> 00:23:45,436 Speaker 1: thing that struck me on seeing it now because I 371 00:23:45,516 --> 00:23:48,556 Speaker 1: also remember just just the imagery of seeing the movie 372 00:23:48,596 --> 00:23:51,836 Speaker 1: posters and seeing the VHS box all the time, of 373 00:23:51,916 --> 00:23:55,196 Speaker 1: thinking like that it meant something and seeing it now 374 00:23:56,156 --> 00:23:59,516 Speaker 1: is how little it's actually an interracial film. The cast is, 375 00:23:59,596 --> 00:24:02,196 Speaker 1: it's a black man and a white man, but that race. 376 00:24:02,676 --> 00:24:04,156 Speaker 1: You know, it's almost like the idea of I don't 377 00:24:04,156 --> 00:24:06,996 Speaker 1: see color like that's that's the story of the film. 378 00:24:07,356 --> 00:24:11,396 Speaker 1: That there's no actual writing or very little where they're 379 00:24:11,476 --> 00:24:15,876 Speaker 1: interrogating race, where they're thinking about it, where they're asking 380 00:24:15,916 --> 00:24:18,876 Speaker 1: about it. It's not present. They're not actually interested in 381 00:24:18,916 --> 00:24:21,316 Speaker 1: one another there, you know, it's just a sketch of 382 00:24:22,836 --> 00:24:24,916 Speaker 1: the story. Like they don't they don't really bond over 383 00:24:24,956 --> 00:24:27,636 Speaker 1: anything beyond the surface, and they don't exist in terms 384 00:24:27,636 --> 00:24:31,196 Speaker 1: of their racial identities. They just exist in the you know, 385 00:24:31,276 --> 00:24:33,756 Speaker 1: in the present to do action. See see, this is 386 00:24:33,756 --> 00:24:38,996 Speaker 1: where I would disagree. So I think that whether it 387 00:24:39,036 --> 00:24:41,356 Speaker 1: was deliberate in the scriptwriting or whether it was in 388 00:24:41,396 --> 00:24:44,956 Speaker 1: the casting itself, is a commentary on race. If mean, 389 00:24:44,956 --> 00:24:47,156 Speaker 1: first of all, Danny Glover is a socially conscious actor. 390 00:24:47,556 --> 00:24:53,236 Speaker 1: Second of all, he basically inverts every stereotype in his role. Now, 391 00:24:53,356 --> 00:24:54,836 Speaker 1: the truth is, had it been a white guy, we 392 00:24:54,876 --> 00:24:57,116 Speaker 1: wouldn't necessarily be able to make this commentary. But I 393 00:24:57,236 --> 00:24:59,796 Speaker 1: think it matters to the viewer. It matters to the 394 00:24:59,836 --> 00:25:04,116 Speaker 1: audience that the boss of this film is the black guy, 395 00:25:04,756 --> 00:25:07,396 Speaker 1: the guy who's the family guy, is the black guy, 396 00:25:07,836 --> 00:25:12,356 Speaker 1: the guy who is representing black cops at a time 397 00:25:12,436 --> 00:25:15,716 Speaker 1: when black cops are still being killed by fellow officers 398 00:25:15,756 --> 00:25:20,236 Speaker 1: when they're off duty um and are forming organizations to 399 00:25:20,236 --> 00:25:23,636 Speaker 1: try to fight against racism inside of law enforcement. It 400 00:25:23,716 --> 00:25:26,836 Speaker 1: matters that he's the one in that really powerful scene 401 00:25:27,356 --> 00:25:32,116 Speaker 1: when they're investigating the murder of the women who died 402 00:25:32,156 --> 00:25:33,996 Speaker 1: in the opening scene and they go up to that 403 00:25:34,036 --> 00:25:37,036 Speaker 1: group of kids. Come on, man, you can't say that's 404 00:25:37,076 --> 00:25:40,756 Speaker 1: not about race. Is that a real gun? Yeah, yes, 405 00:25:40,996 --> 00:25:44,196 Speaker 1: this is a real gun. Did you kill people? No, 406 00:25:44,316 --> 00:25:47,116 Speaker 1: it's some guys hurting someone. I try to shoot him 407 00:25:47,156 --> 00:25:51,636 Speaker 1: in the lake or something, just to stop them. Mama's police, missie, 408 00:25:51,756 --> 00:25:54,996 Speaker 1: black people. Is it true? Yea? Is it true? Is 409 00:25:55,036 --> 00:26:03,476 Speaker 1: that true? True? Is that true? Maybe? Kids scream? Scream? 410 00:26:03,556 --> 00:26:09,556 Speaker 1: Do you like icecream? Yeah? Yeah? I think that that 411 00:26:09,756 --> 00:26:13,796 Speaker 1: is such a powerful scene in this film because it 412 00:26:13,876 --> 00:26:16,556 Speaker 1: didn't it just didn't have to happen. It did not 413 00:26:16,676 --> 00:26:20,116 Speaker 1: have to happen. Nothing about that brief moment with those 414 00:26:20,196 --> 00:26:24,676 Speaker 1: kids had to go there other than the need to 415 00:26:24,716 --> 00:26:30,036 Speaker 1: acknowledge that there was this larger social reality happening and 416 00:26:30,236 --> 00:26:33,516 Speaker 1: that those kids were bearing witness to it. Um, I 417 00:26:33,516 --> 00:26:35,476 Speaker 1: don't just we were kind of saying the same thing, 418 00:26:35,556 --> 00:26:38,876 Speaker 1: like like there's a there's a symbolism of their presence, 419 00:26:39,116 --> 00:26:41,716 Speaker 1: but it's very rarely written into the script and meaning. 420 00:26:42,036 --> 00:26:45,876 Speaker 1: And so there's a scene later where, um, you know, 421 00:26:45,916 --> 00:26:51,596 Speaker 1: the Special Forces guy shoot Riggs. Mel Gibson and Murtog's 422 00:26:51,676 --> 00:26:54,996 Speaker 1: daughter has been kidnapped and He's running around the streets 423 00:26:54,996 --> 00:26:57,436 Speaker 1: of La holding a gun, his shirt off. He looks 424 00:26:57,436 --> 00:27:00,436 Speaker 1: crazy and police are pulling up and never is there 425 00:27:00,436 --> 00:27:03,316 Speaker 1: a moment like, oh shit, they might shoot him, right 426 00:27:03,356 --> 00:27:05,796 Speaker 1: and and in forty eight hours, it's like every moment 427 00:27:05,836 --> 00:27:07,676 Speaker 1: that you know, cost people up like we're gonna shoot 428 00:27:07,716 --> 00:27:10,916 Speaker 1: this motherfucker, and you always feel that, And so it's 429 00:27:10,956 --> 00:27:14,236 Speaker 1: sort of race blind at different times. And yet there's 430 00:27:14,236 --> 00:27:17,196 Speaker 1: this symbolism. And so the daughter, they're like, they live 431 00:27:17,236 --> 00:27:19,716 Speaker 1: in some neighborhood and you're like, all right, that's interesting, 432 00:27:19,716 --> 00:27:21,996 Speaker 1: but they don't discuss that in terms of what it 433 00:27:22,036 --> 00:27:24,796 Speaker 1: means for them to live in that neighborhood. The daughter 434 00:27:24,916 --> 00:27:26,676 Speaker 1: is going on some date with a white boy. You 435 00:27:26,716 --> 00:27:30,596 Speaker 1: know that. He says, blond hair, that's not an issue. Um, 436 00:27:30,716 --> 00:27:32,316 Speaker 1: they don't don't really talk about it. But then there 437 00:27:32,316 --> 00:27:34,676 Speaker 1: are these two moments when they try to script in 438 00:27:34,716 --> 00:27:37,636 Speaker 1: some race and one is at the dinner table where 439 00:27:37,676 --> 00:27:41,036 Speaker 1: they beat box. And this is like some white Hollywood 440 00:27:41,116 --> 00:27:43,156 Speaker 1: version of like, well, what would a black family do 441 00:27:43,676 --> 00:27:46,116 Speaker 1: if they're you know, at dinner. I think they're gonna 442 00:27:46,156 --> 00:27:53,756 Speaker 1: beat box and then they wrap I'm going to find Roger. 443 00:27:52,436 --> 00:28:00,476 Speaker 1: And the point is that that they actually don't have, like, 444 00:28:00,556 --> 00:28:03,436 Speaker 1: oh my gosh, black people can't all naturally rap. I 445 00:28:03,476 --> 00:28:05,436 Speaker 1: don't know if you notice this, but you can see 446 00:28:05,516 --> 00:28:09,596 Speaker 1: on their fridge like an end apartheide sticker. Oh, I 447 00:28:09,716 --> 00:28:11,756 Speaker 1: totally saw it. This is why you and I are 448 00:28:11,796 --> 00:28:14,516 Speaker 1: not agreeing on this because I think this is the 449 00:28:14,596 --> 00:28:17,876 Speaker 1: Reagan era. This is an era of I mean no, listen, 450 00:28:17,916 --> 00:28:22,516 Speaker 1: Reagan appoints several key black people in cabinet positions, like 451 00:28:22,596 --> 00:28:27,516 Speaker 1: basically building the base of a kind of black conservative 452 00:28:27,596 --> 00:28:32,596 Speaker 1: movement that is very much about color blindness and seeing 453 00:28:32,596 --> 00:28:36,996 Speaker 1: people as individuals. This is the zeitgeist of the Reagan moment, 454 00:28:37,316 --> 00:28:40,836 Speaker 1: that's this feeling. This film is like part of that brainwashed. 455 00:28:40,956 --> 00:28:42,956 Speaker 1: I agree with you. It's like, for the most part, 456 00:28:43,276 --> 00:28:45,836 Speaker 1: it's not exploring that idea. It's not you know, it 457 00:28:45,836 --> 00:28:47,916 Speaker 1: doesn't never lends it. Its surfaces at a couple of 458 00:28:47,956 --> 00:28:50,836 Speaker 1: moments like this, but for the most part, you know, 459 00:28:50,876 --> 00:28:53,796 Speaker 1: they're not they're not they're not thinking about their racial identities, 460 00:28:53,836 --> 00:28:56,236 Speaker 1: they're not discussing them. So then I'm going to talk 461 00:28:56,276 --> 00:28:58,836 Speaker 1: about the very end of the film and what you're saying, 462 00:28:59,276 --> 00:29:01,676 Speaker 1: because so you know, I mean, the premise doesn't really 463 00:29:01,676 --> 00:29:03,836 Speaker 1: matter in a way, it's like just a mcguffin, as 464 00:29:03,836 --> 00:29:06,676 Speaker 1: they say, it's set up. You know, there's a murder, 465 00:29:06,756 --> 00:29:09,636 Speaker 1: there's some drugs. They have to stop it, and the 466 00:29:10,356 --> 00:29:13,436 Speaker 1: bad Vietnam Special Forces guys are trying to kill them. 467 00:29:13,836 --> 00:29:17,076 Speaker 1: And so one of these guys played by Gary Busey 468 00:29:17,836 --> 00:29:20,076 Speaker 1: is the other Special Forces and then he and Mel 469 00:29:20,156 --> 00:29:24,156 Speaker 1: Gibson have this fight on Danny Glover's suburban lawn. The 470 00:29:24,276 --> 00:29:26,996 Speaker 1: very ends, yeah, because he's he you know, they need revenge, 471 00:29:27,436 --> 00:29:32,156 Speaker 1: and in some absurd way, they all the police arelike, 472 00:29:32,356 --> 00:29:34,516 Speaker 1: you know, even though he's murdered all these people, let's 473 00:29:34,596 --> 00:29:36,876 Speaker 1: let them fight like fist fight as like, you know, 474 00:29:36,916 --> 00:29:38,796 Speaker 1: to work this out like man to man. And this 475 00:29:38,836 --> 00:29:42,596 Speaker 1: is such a man world. And and so you know, 476 00:29:42,636 --> 00:29:44,996 Speaker 1: in the end, Mel Gibson is getting he's getting beat up. 477 00:29:44,996 --> 00:29:48,276 Speaker 1: He takes his shirt off, you know, purposefully like he's 478 00:29:48,356 --> 00:29:51,156 Speaker 1: he's you know, this is Mel Gibson. It's raining, he's wet. 479 00:29:51,196 --> 00:29:53,436 Speaker 1: He has this mullet, like a long mullet, you know, 480 00:29:53,556 --> 00:29:56,836 Speaker 1: curly mullet, and you know he's getting punched, but he's 481 00:29:56,876 --> 00:29:59,396 Speaker 1: punching back and he he ends up knocking this guy 482 00:29:59,436 --> 00:30:02,396 Speaker 1: out and the police are arresting him, and but then 483 00:30:02,436 --> 00:30:05,556 Speaker 1: Gary Busey you know, does a jiu jitsu moves and 484 00:30:05,676 --> 00:30:08,156 Speaker 1: pulls a gun from one of the officers. And at 485 00:30:08,156 --> 00:30:13,116 Speaker 1: this point mel Gibson is with his shirt off and 486 00:30:13,396 --> 00:30:16,996 Speaker 1: soaking wet and exhausted, and Danny Glover has draped him 487 00:30:16,996 --> 00:30:19,796 Speaker 1: in a blanket and is holding him into his chest. 488 00:30:19,916 --> 00:30:24,196 Speaker 1: The total buddy moment, dude, Like, this is the culmination. 489 00:30:24,316 --> 00:30:27,996 Speaker 1: This is the culmination of a movie that is in 490 00:30:28,116 --> 00:30:33,196 Speaker 1: conversation with other buddy films, which no, man, I gotta, 491 00:30:33,316 --> 00:30:36,676 Speaker 1: I gotta set this up right, because the film starts 492 00:30:36,796 --> 00:30:40,596 Speaker 1: in classic buddy film fashion with them saying we are 493 00:30:40,676 --> 00:30:43,796 Speaker 1: stuck with each other, right, and the culminating scene that 494 00:30:43,836 --> 00:30:47,316 Speaker 1: you're about to describe is the full narrative arc of 495 00:30:47,356 --> 00:31:03,236 Speaker 1: that relationship. I got your partner. Yeah, So culmination is 496 00:31:03,276 --> 00:31:07,316 Speaker 1: the right word because it's totally orgasmic. It's actually the 497 00:31:07,356 --> 00:31:12,676 Speaker 1: two of them coming together, like like, he is naked, 498 00:31:12,956 --> 00:31:17,156 Speaker 1: mel Gibson, exhausted, He's draped in a blanket on Danny 499 00:31:17,196 --> 00:31:20,036 Speaker 1: Glover's chest, holding him and he says, you know, I 500 00:31:20,116 --> 00:31:23,036 Speaker 1: got you, buddy, I got you, buddy, And then Gary 501 00:31:23,116 --> 00:31:25,476 Speaker 1: Busey it turns out that he has a gun on them, 502 00:31:25,556 --> 00:31:29,516 Speaker 1: and they both hold up their guns simultaneously and and 503 00:31:29,636 --> 00:31:32,276 Speaker 1: you know, shoot one after the other. No, I we 504 00:31:32,356 --> 00:31:36,316 Speaker 1: totally agree on that. And that is the story of 505 00:31:36,956 --> 00:31:42,236 Speaker 1: Cold War Reagan America. Right. Our enemies are foreign, not domestic. 506 00:31:42,836 --> 00:31:47,636 Speaker 1: We as individuals can rise and succeed in this nation 507 00:31:47,716 --> 00:31:50,276 Speaker 1: if we are hard working, if we are family people, 508 00:31:50,356 --> 00:31:53,676 Speaker 1: if we love on our kids, if we don't do drugs, 509 00:31:53,956 --> 00:31:57,076 Speaker 1: if we show restraint. That is the moment where how 510 00:31:57,116 --> 00:31:59,876 Speaker 1: does it end? Right? Because the next scene is a 511 00:31:59,916 --> 00:32:04,356 Speaker 1: family scene. The next scene after this as orgasmic embrace 512 00:32:04,556 --> 00:32:07,236 Speaker 1: of this black guy and white guy. And interestingly enough, 513 00:32:07,356 --> 00:32:10,396 Speaker 1: of course, Danny Glover towers over mel Gibson, right, you 514 00:32:10,436 --> 00:32:13,476 Speaker 1: know he is black Mammy Fogure in this moment. Right. 515 00:32:13,876 --> 00:32:18,116 Speaker 1: The next scene is them going back to his house 516 00:32:18,716 --> 00:32:24,956 Speaker 1: and inviting Rigs into the home with his dog Sam 517 00:32:24,956 --> 00:32:28,236 Speaker 1: to join the family in a holiday meal. That is 518 00:32:28,316 --> 00:32:32,676 Speaker 1: the closure of Cold World America. Right. We are cops, 519 00:32:32,836 --> 00:32:35,916 Speaker 1: we kill bad guys. We do this together. We are 520 00:32:35,996 --> 00:32:53,956 Speaker 1: in this together. So what's obvious about these films is 521 00:32:53,996 --> 00:32:57,196 Speaker 1: these are films for white audiences, for white men who 522 00:32:57,196 --> 00:33:01,356 Speaker 1: are making these films and imagining that liberal Hollywood is 523 00:33:01,356 --> 00:33:05,076 Speaker 1: talking to white guys around America who you know who 524 00:33:05,556 --> 00:33:11,236 Speaker 1: who are having very isolated, segregated, all white experiences. And so, 525 00:33:11,276 --> 00:33:14,316 Speaker 1: as a white guy, what do you think these films 526 00:33:15,236 --> 00:33:17,516 Speaker 1: tell us as we look back and thinking about our 527 00:33:17,556 --> 00:33:21,476 Speaker 1: own relationship and coming of age in the the nineteen eighties. Yeah, 528 00:33:21,516 --> 00:33:25,356 Speaker 1: I mean I also tried to watch these movies and 529 00:33:25,396 --> 00:33:28,796 Speaker 1: see whether I saw myself in them, you know, definitely, 530 00:33:29,076 --> 00:33:31,916 Speaker 1: definitely not in mel Gibson, you know, but I do 531 00:33:32,036 --> 00:33:35,876 Speaker 1: think it is that sense of redemption that you talked about. 532 00:33:35,916 --> 00:33:38,796 Speaker 1: There's something comforting in them, right, Like that's how we're 533 00:33:39,516 --> 00:33:44,356 Speaker 1: redemption for white men. That that the sense of you know, 534 00:33:44,396 --> 00:33:47,716 Speaker 1: coming together is also a sense of, you know, the 535 00:33:48,036 --> 00:33:52,676 Speaker 1: country's ideals being realized in a way that also isn't 536 00:33:53,236 --> 00:33:56,236 Speaker 1: you know, it's not like the social order is being transformed. 537 00:33:56,716 --> 00:33:58,796 Speaker 1: It's you know, it's it's ah, you don't have to 538 00:33:58,836 --> 00:34:02,476 Speaker 1: give up very much to see this piece um. In fact, 539 00:34:02,796 --> 00:34:05,756 Speaker 1: you gain a friend, and that's if that's all it 540 00:34:05,836 --> 00:34:10,236 Speaker 1: takes to have a better society. That you have a 541 00:34:10,276 --> 00:34:13,676 Speaker 1: new buddy and that everyone likes you. You know that 542 00:34:13,676 --> 00:34:17,476 Speaker 1: that that the this is a very easy version of 543 00:34:17,596 --> 00:34:21,476 Speaker 1: racial reconciliation. Yeah, yeah, I think that's exactly right. So, 544 00:34:21,556 --> 00:34:24,076 Speaker 1: I mean we are in this present moment of these 545 00:34:24,396 --> 00:34:28,556 Speaker 1: the last several years where people have been called to 546 00:34:28,596 --> 00:34:34,436 Speaker 1: account and and so looking back on these movies from 547 00:34:34,436 --> 00:34:38,476 Speaker 1: our youth and are wrestling with race and racism and 548 00:34:38,556 --> 00:34:41,476 Speaker 1: where white people are looking at themselves and looking at 549 00:34:41,476 --> 00:34:44,676 Speaker 1: the system. And it's a look that often people are 550 00:34:44,716 --> 00:34:49,316 Speaker 1: avoiding because it's uncomfortable. But sometimes you almost all you 551 00:34:49,396 --> 00:34:52,396 Speaker 1: have to do, I guess is is the nod or 552 00:34:52,436 --> 00:34:57,076 Speaker 1: the corporate sponsorship or the like on Twitter. And that 553 00:34:57,116 --> 00:35:00,236 Speaker 1: feels somewhat equivalent to these movies. I don't know that 554 00:35:00,276 --> 00:35:03,156 Speaker 1: we were They weren't revolutionary for sure. No, But I 555 00:35:03,196 --> 00:35:05,276 Speaker 1: mean I mean to you too, not about us. I mean, 556 00:35:05,396 --> 00:35:07,636 Speaker 1: like if we're thinking about what what do we make 557 00:35:07,676 --> 00:35:10,716 Speaker 1: of these films and the world they've played and how 558 00:35:10,836 --> 00:35:13,836 Speaker 1: people were socialized, you know, in the course of our 559 00:35:13,916 --> 00:35:17,916 Speaker 1: coming of age. Right, So we are fifty basically, um, 560 00:35:17,956 --> 00:35:19,436 Speaker 1: I mean I am a little younger than you. Of 561 00:35:19,476 --> 00:35:23,596 Speaker 1: course you're you're fifty m forty nine. But the notion 562 00:35:23,676 --> 00:35:26,956 Speaker 1: that seeing these films, or watching MTV, or playing on 563 00:35:26,956 --> 00:35:30,076 Speaker 1: a sports team with black people, or having one in 564 00:35:30,116 --> 00:35:34,716 Speaker 1: your band was was enough? So yeah, I think that's 565 00:35:36,156 --> 00:35:38,556 Speaker 1: I think that's I think that's what what what I 566 00:35:38,676 --> 00:35:42,236 Speaker 1: learned looking back on these films, Yeah, that it wasn't enough. 567 00:35:42,676 --> 00:35:49,316 Speaker 1: It maybe necessary in a way to create possible relationships 568 00:35:49,396 --> 00:35:53,076 Speaker 1: that would change our politics and rewrite the rules of 569 00:35:53,076 --> 00:35:57,556 Speaker 1: our society, but yeah, not enough. That's one to grow on. Yeah. Man, 570 00:35:58,556 --> 00:36:02,796 Speaker 1: Well I learned a lot about how we were supposed 571 00:36:02,836 --> 00:36:07,236 Speaker 1: to be buddies by watching these films. Again, friends and partners. Friends, Yeah, 572 00:36:07,396 --> 00:36:10,156 Speaker 1: say we were, we were friends partners, but I mean, 573 00:36:10,236 --> 00:36:12,236 Speaker 1: you know, on the tennis court, we were never friends 574 00:36:12,276 --> 00:36:14,956 Speaker 1: of partners basketball. That's the line that that's the line 575 00:36:14,956 --> 00:36:18,476 Speaker 1: that starts their their interaction. We ain't brothers, we ain't partners, 576 00:36:18,476 --> 00:36:22,516 Speaker 1: and we ain't friends. Yea. And then I got that 577 00:36:22,516 --> 00:36:24,796 Speaker 1: that's what I have tattooed on my arm. It's it 578 00:36:24,876 --> 00:36:30,716 Speaker 1: all came together and I loving brotherly embrace. Yeah. Yeah, alright, man, 579 00:36:31,156 --> 00:36:49,276 Speaker 1: case closed, All right, love you love you man? So 580 00:36:50,956 --> 00:37:01,876 Speaker 1: do Some of My Best Friends Are is a production 581 00:37:01,956 --> 00:37:05,516 Speaker 1: of Pushkin Industries. The show is written and hosted by 582 00:37:05,516 --> 00:37:08,756 Speaker 1: me Khalil, Debron Muhammed, and my best friend Ben Austin. 583 00:37:09,596 --> 00:37:13,596 Speaker 1: It's produced by Serf Vincent and edited by Karen Shakerji. 584 00:37:14,116 --> 00:37:19,076 Speaker 1: Our engineer is Martin Gonzalez. Our associate editor is Tischell Williams, 585 00:37:19,396 --> 00:37:23,596 Speaker 1: and our showrunner is Sasha Matthias. Our executive producers are 586 00:37:23,676 --> 00:37:28,516 Speaker 1: Leta Molad and Mia La Belle Special thanks to Eddie Murphy. 587 00:37:29,196 --> 00:37:32,756 Speaker 1: You've been formative to our lives. Thanks to my wife Stephanie, 588 00:37:32,756 --> 00:37:36,036 Speaker 1: who was our sharpest listener on this episode, and macatl 589 00:37:36,196 --> 00:37:38,916 Speaker 1: the biggest movie watcher I know, who help with research 590 00:37:39,596 --> 00:37:43,916 Speaker 1: at Pushkin. Thanks to Heather Faine, Carly Niggliori, John Schnars, 591 00:37:44,076 --> 00:37:48,476 Speaker 1: and Jacob Weisberg. Our theme song, Little Lily, is by 592 00:37:48,516 --> 00:37:52,796 Speaker 1: fellow chicagoan AVERYR. Young from his amazing album Tubman. You 593 00:37:52,836 --> 00:37:54,916 Speaker 1: will definitely want to check out more of his music 594 00:37:54,996 --> 00:37:58,836 Speaker 1: at his website averyar Young dot com. You can find 595 00:37:58,836 --> 00:38:02,356 Speaker 1: Pushkin on all social platforms at Pushkin Pods, and you 596 00:38:02,396 --> 00:38:05,636 Speaker 1: can sign up for our newsletter at Pushkin dot fm. 597 00:38:05,676 --> 00:38:09,676 Speaker 1: To find more Pushkin podcasts, listen on the iHeart Radio app, 598 00:38:09,876 --> 00:38:13,636 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you like to listen. If you 599 00:38:13,716 --> 00:38:17,796 Speaker 1: love this show and others from Pushkin Industries, consider becoming 600 00:38:17,916 --> 00:38:22,916 Speaker 1: a Pushnick. Pushnick is a podcast subscription that offers bonus 601 00:38:22,916 --> 00:38:27,676 Speaker 1: content uninterrupted listening for four dollars and ninety nine cents 602 00:38:27,676 --> 00:38:32,716 Speaker 1: of mine. Look for Pushnick exclusively on Apple Podcasts subscriptions. 603 00:38:35,036 --> 00:38:40,036 Speaker 1: You got a Hot Mike, Hot Mike. I'm ready as 604 00:38:40,076 --> 00:38:42,156 Speaker 1: as as we say on the golf course, as your 605 00:38:42,156 --> 00:38:44,636 Speaker 1: motor running. I don't know what that means. When you're ready, 606 00:38:44,996 --> 00:38:47,276 Speaker 1: that's when you're ready, now whatever, that's when you're ready. 607 00:38:47,356 --> 00:38:49,116 Speaker 1: You grew up. You grew up. You grew up three 608 00:38:49,156 --> 00:38:51,636 Speaker 1: blocks exactly, and we were My father told me, he 609 00:38:51,756 --> 00:38:55,116 Speaker 1: said to me, we are not people who play golf. 610 00:38:55,116 --> 00:38:55,956 Speaker 1: He said that to me