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Speaker 1: Pushkin self taught is not a slight when it comes

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Speaker 1: to Athena Calderone. In fact, it might be the singular

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Speaker 1: quality that makes her so special. She's famously been called

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Speaker 1: the new Martha Stewart by the New York Times, and

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Speaker 1: the Brooklyn Brownstone she designed is the home that launched

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Speaker 1: a million Pinterest boards. But knowing Athena is to know

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Speaker 1: she doesn't really think of herself as an authority or

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Speaker 1: even as an influencer. Growing up in Long Island, she

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Speaker 1: hit the nightlife of New York early, where she met

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Speaker 1: her husband DJ Victor Calderone and they lived a life

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Speaker 1: on tour. But her curiosity was never confined backstage. It's

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Speaker 1: in fact where her aesthetic education began. So from discovering

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Speaker 1: another side of Abitha, being drawn in by Moroccan hospitality,

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Speaker 1: renewing her roots in Rome, and now embracing the evolution

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Speaker 1: of her eye in Vienna. Athena is one of those

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Speaker 1: rare people that, despite her beautiful life life, she still

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Speaker 1: manages to take us all on the road. Here's my

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Speaker 1: conversation with my collaborator and friend, Athena Calderone. Welcome to

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Speaker 1: traveling through This is really a conversation for me about

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Speaker 1: curiosity and curious people and how travelers have shaped their

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Speaker 1: life and their lens. We can start anywhere, but I'd

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Speaker 1: love to think about, like, what is an earlier travel

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Speaker 1: in your life that maybe kicked things off.

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Speaker 2: Earlier travel wasn't really in my orbit at all.

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Speaker 1: I didn't grow up with travel.

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Speaker 2: I think the only places that we traveled to throughout

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Speaker 2: my high school years was Vermont, Like my dad would

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Speaker 2: take me fishing every summer in a freshwater lake called

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Speaker 2: Lake Boma scene in Vermont. We went to Florida once,

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Speaker 2: and we went to Puerto Rico once, And besides that,

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Speaker 2: I'd never really been on a plane.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I didn't travel much when I was growing up.

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Speaker 1: We went on a trip like kind of Grizzwold's National

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Speaker 1: Lampoons European Vacation exactly to Europe one time, which was

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Speaker 1: very lucky and kind of changed my life when I

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Speaker 1: was ten, But we stayed in youth Hosteales. It was

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Speaker 1: not kind of a glamorous thing. And also I think,

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Speaker 1: you know, there's this thing about being Australian where it's

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Speaker 1: just those distances. So we traveled a bit, you know,

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Speaker 1: to like beach towns and things like that. But sure,

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Speaker 1: you know, I have like this theory and I would

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Speaker 1: never change it that if you traveled a lot as

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Speaker 1: a child, sometimes you don't have the appreciation, the appreciation

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Speaker 1: but also this romantic sense of the rest of the

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Speaker 1: world and this kind of inner urgent need to to

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Speaker 1: go and do those things. And I often I think

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Speaker 1: about you as having this inner urgent need around so

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Speaker 1: many things, and I think that's why you're so voracious.

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Speaker 2: I think you're absolutely right. I think we both share that.

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Speaker 2: Certain Also, my lack of formal education as well as

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Speaker 2: my lack of travel and culture as a child, has

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Speaker 2: just made me like ripe for curiosity and like I

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Speaker 2: want to self educate. I want to understand more, I

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Speaker 2: want to see more, I want to learn more.

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Speaker 1: And it's just.

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Speaker 2: Made me like really hungry to see as much as possible.

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Speaker 2: I'm also thinking back, we went camping a lot. Every

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Speaker 2: memory that I have of travel, even though it was

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Speaker 2: close by, was always it holds a lot of emotion

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Speaker 2: for me and an adventure for me.

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Speaker 1: I feel like the same way I was obsessed with

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Speaker 1: rock pools and finding little things in shells and staffish

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Speaker 1: like at the beach town that we we went to,

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Speaker 1: or like exploring up a creek, which is a very

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Speaker 1: Australian kind of background. But I think it's like it

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Speaker 1: doesn't matter that you kind of went to the other

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Speaker 1: side of the planet as a child. It's if you

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Speaker 1: have that innate sense of curiosity, it just sort of grows. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you were telling me a little bit about your Morocco trip,

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Speaker 1: and I'd love to talk to you a little bit

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Speaker 1: more about that. Yeah, for sure.

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Speaker 2: Well, when I had my son, Jivonne Victor, my husband

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Speaker 2: was on the road, so travel coincided with marriage and

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Speaker 2: family life, and we just took Jimon everywhere with us.

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Speaker 1: And I also didn't have career.

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Speaker 2: At the time, so I was just on the road

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Speaker 2: a lot with my husband and we would just begin

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Speaker 2: that's like really when travel began.

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Speaker 1: But Morocco holds.

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Speaker 2: A very mara Cash specifically holds a very special place

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Speaker 2: in my heart because I'd never been to Africa before,

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Speaker 2: and it wasn't even something that I had really researched, Like,

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Speaker 2: I wasn't really at that point of my life where

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Speaker 2: I was like studying and researching before I traveled. I

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Speaker 2: was kind of just like up for seeing where we landed,

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Speaker 2: and you know what presented itself.

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Speaker 1: What year did you go to Morocco?

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Speaker 2: Jeevon was probably around two, so it was two thousand

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Speaker 2: and five. And I'll just never forget, you know, walking

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Speaker 2: through the Medina to get to the Riad and it's

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Speaker 2: just chaos and sense and sounds and you know, just

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Speaker 2: meandering like small little blocks and I was like, where

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Speaker 2: are we going? What did I make the right choice?

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Speaker 2: You know, like it was just crazy for me to

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Speaker 2: think about. Like you opened these like beautiful wooden doors

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Speaker 2: and they're an oasis awaits and I just loved this

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Speaker 2: idea of this like intimate small home where you have

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Speaker 2: these hosts that are legitimately like your hosts, like they

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Speaker 2: are cooking for you, and you know, there's this this

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Speaker 2: nucleus of family, which was really my nucleus at the time,

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Speaker 2: like my family was and still is my everything. But

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Speaker 2: I didn't I don't want to say that it's all

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Speaker 2: that I had, but like I didn't have a creative

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Speaker 2: outlet at the time, and I'm such a creative so

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Speaker 2: I really threw myself into my family. And it was

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Speaker 2: the first time I was exploring, like you know, cooking

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Speaker 2: and hosting and designing just in my home, not professionally,

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Speaker 2: so being in this riad and seeing these people so

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Speaker 2: graciously host and care for every drop of experience that

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Speaker 2: they were offering us. You know, Jivon, they invited Jevon

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Speaker 2: into the who was two years old, but they invited

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Speaker 2: him into the kitchen every night, and he would stand

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Speaker 2: up on a chair.

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Speaker 1: And he would cook with them.

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Speaker 2: And getting emotional because like they were communicating with this

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Speaker 2: two year old and not speaking the same language, and

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Speaker 2: they were offering him this experience that I could never

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Speaker 2: really offer him. Like he was understanding kind of culture

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Speaker 2: and culinary and like and love and care of food

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Speaker 2: and family in a way that I could never have

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Speaker 2: offered him otherwise. And I just remember being just hit

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Speaker 2: with so much emotion as I am right now about

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Speaker 2: how magical this experience is and so far from our

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Speaker 2: life and from our everyday existence.

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Speaker 1: I can feel that from you. The interesting thing about

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Speaker 1: Morocco is it's not a restaurant culture at all, maybe

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Speaker 1: like to the exclusion of almost any other culture, Like

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Speaker 1: you get the best food in those reads or in

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Speaker 1: those homes, Like yeah, I always tell people when they're going,

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Speaker 1: like eat at the read eat, you know, try to

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Speaker 1: get into people's homes because that's where the best recipes

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Speaker 1: are sure, And I take that from Moroccan culture too,

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Speaker 1: that it is that principle of enveloping people. Yes, yes,

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Speaker 1: I will never forget.

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Speaker 2: When we entered the read, it was really late at night,

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Speaker 2: and Jivonne, who was like a very kind of chill

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Speaker 2: traveler and calm kid who still to this day is like,

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Speaker 2: he's not very outward. He doesn't like I'm not gonna

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Speaker 2: say he doesn't emo. As a child, he wasn't super

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Speaker 2: like verbal and like crying and yelling, and I didn't

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Speaker 2: even know what a read was. And then I was

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Speaker 2: there and saw how quiet and small and intimate, and

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Speaker 2: I was just like, I don't want to be that

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Speaker 2: parent that has this kid that's like losing it. And

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Speaker 2: I remember trying to settle him and quiet him, and

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Speaker 2: in that moment, I felt like he was psychic and

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Speaker 2: he was feeling energies in the space, which is so

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Speaker 2: I've never really like talked about this before, but I

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Speaker 2: felt like there was like something that was like triggering

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Speaker 2: him in that space. But then on the polar opposite,

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Speaker 2: like the next day we went out into the Medina,

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Speaker 2: and I remember being so overwhelmed by like everybody coming

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Speaker 2: at you and trying to get you to come into

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Speaker 2: their shop and buy something and negotiate with you. And

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Speaker 2: I remember being like completely overwhelmed, sincerely.

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Speaker 3: And I remember Jeevon just like being there, like looking

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Speaker 3: taking it in calm as a cucumber, and I was

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Speaker 3: just like this kid man like he is meant to travel.

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Speaker 1: I feel like Narkesh has another thing all together now

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Speaker 1: because because you know, it's such a tourist destination and

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Speaker 1: of course it still has its magic, but it's kind

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Speaker 1: of evolved as well. There are a lot of designers

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Speaker 1: based there now that are creating great things that are

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Speaker 1: within that Moroccan design vernacular, like Benny Ruggs, the people

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Speaker 1: that you did a collaboration with, and I think from

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Speaker 1: a design perspective, those tiles, those rugs, like the tuaregmats

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Speaker 1: from Mauritania or the Berber culture that can be translated

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Speaker 1: into homes that I have one in my house in Milan,

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Speaker 1: and I don't know, I think that now Morocco, well,

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Speaker 1: it's a successful example of using the craftsmanship from there

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Speaker 1: and contemporizing it. And that's not the case with a

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Speaker 1: lot of these places where traditional craft sadly becomes kind

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Speaker 1: of a museum piece or a tourist piece.

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Speaker 2: When I wanted to talk with you about my experience

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Speaker 2: in Marrakesh, it was more so initially that I wanted

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Speaker 2: to talk about how it was the first place that

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Speaker 2: really pushed me from a culinary point of view to

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Speaker 2: explore flavors outside of the Italian American vernacular that I

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Speaker 2: grew up with, as well as like my design aesthetic

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Speaker 2: back then for my homes was very like minimal and

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Speaker 2: sleek and like singular, like B and B Italia. And

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Speaker 2: then I went there and I just saw these like

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Speaker 2: sun drenched colors and things that had patina and chips,

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Speaker 2: and you know, I started to suddenly see how I

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Speaker 2: was like appreciating time worn colors and patina and history

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Speaker 2: and craft.

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Speaker 1: I'm just remembering this.

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Speaker 2: Right now, but I was in the midst of designing

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Speaker 2: are an apartment that we had bought in Dumbo, two

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Speaker 2: apartments that we were combining, and it was the first

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Speaker 2: time that I really used travel as like this catalyst

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Speaker 2: to make sure that I'm pulling pieces from these far

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Speaker 2: flung places in the world. Like every time I travel somewhere,

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Speaker 2: I bring some sort of trinket.

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Speaker 1: Home that really I'm a suitcase traveler. Yeah, you can't

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Speaker 1: help that things, I know for sure. I mean I think, look,

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Speaker 1: there's definitely a reason why so many of those decorators

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Speaker 1: not just go there and collect things. But think about Tangier, right,

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Speaker 1: some of the great decorators on the planet have these

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Speaker 1: houses there and then have exported to wherever they have

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Speaker 1: their kind of businesses, whether it's London or New York.

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Speaker 2: Call. Yeah, it's really at the center of like who

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Speaker 2: I am as a designer right now, and I think

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Speaker 2: that it started there. I didn't even think about the

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Speaker 2: whole Jievon read part of the story because the home

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Speaker 2: is this nucleus of my world still to this day.

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Speaker 2: And whether it inspired the culinary side of my career

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Speaker 2: or the design side of my career or the family

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Speaker 2: at the center of it, I really feel like that

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Speaker 2: reard and that experience is so in alignment.

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Speaker 1: With like who I am today. Yeah, it's such a

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Speaker 1: place and a labyrinth to just I remember going and

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Speaker 1: shooting something for Vogue Living actually when I was kind

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Speaker 1: of quite a naive travel writer actually, which actually is

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Speaker 1: to be honest. The best, Yeah, the best. The best

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Speaker 1: ones are the ones that are excited for the first time,

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Speaker 1: because then if you've got a good editor, you can

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Speaker 1: temper it a little bit. And I had a very

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Speaker 1: good editor, but I went sort of I remember it vividly,

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Speaker 1: and I have this image that we shot and I

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Speaker 1: could not tell you who it was what realited is,

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Speaker 1: but it's this extraordinary image of a kitchen actually with

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Speaker 1: the mosaic tiles on the walls, just a little wood

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Speaker 1: table with kind of ratan back, a little window opening

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Speaker 1: into a courtyard which had like this kind of very

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Speaker 1: straggly jacaranda. When the cooking is happening and the sun

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Speaker 1: goes down, the call to prayer is like coming in

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Speaker 1: through the roof and like it's getting nighttime and the

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Speaker 1: orange bossom is starting, you know, because they often have

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Speaker 1: an orange bossom in there. I know, it's incredibly evocative.

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Speaker 1: I wanted to talk to you. You know. You mentioned Victor,

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Speaker 1: your husband, and why you traveled so often, and he,

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Speaker 1: you know, is one of the great music producers and

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Speaker 1: DJs worked on, from what I understand, one of the

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Speaker 1: best albums of all time, which is right Right of Life.

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Speaker 1: Of course, but yeah, I you know, I think that's

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Speaker 1: kind of why you traveled a lot to Abitha, Is

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Speaker 1: that right? Abiita?

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Speaker 2: We traveled to before we got married. We got married

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Speaker 2: in ninety nine. I feel like the first time we

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Speaker 2: went was maybe ninety eight. And so, yeah, he's a

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Speaker 2: DJ and he plays all around the world, and it

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Speaker 2: took us to you know, Singapore and Australia and Japan

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Speaker 2: and one trip and then you know, Israel and Italy

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Speaker 2: and Ibiza and another. You know, like we were just

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Speaker 2: constantly or he was constantly on the road. And you know,

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Speaker 2: back then there were bigger budgets and you know, they

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Speaker 2: would fly both of us and givonn until he was

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Speaker 2: under two. We didn't have to pay for a flight,

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Speaker 2: so we just we literally really traveled the world together.

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Speaker 2: But backing up to our first time in Abitha, it

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Speaker 2: was like the start of our love courtship. And then

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Speaker 2: did you meet on the dance floor? We met at

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Speaker 2: the Tunnel in New York City. I was a bartender.

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Speaker 2: I just moved to New York. I was nineteen years old.

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Speaker 2: I had a shaved head because I was and a

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Speaker 2: septum ring because I was trying to be like a

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Speaker 2: bad girl because I was such like a Long Island

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Speaker 2: good girl who did like all the right things, you know,

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Speaker 2: like never like drank or like partied or anything. And

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Speaker 2: then I moved to New York City, and I was like,

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Speaker 2: she's gonna become a bad girl.

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Speaker 1: But it was like just like on the you know, well,

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Speaker 1: one of my favorite parts of you actually is that

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Speaker 1: you're still a potty girl in ways. I mean, I

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Speaker 1: do love a dance floor. I love it.

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Speaker 2: I've seen it, so yeah, I mean, I'm glad you

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Speaker 2: brought that up because my roots as somebody, I mean

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Speaker 2: talk about where I saw culture for the first time.

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Speaker 2: It was at the nightclub, like I was seeing fashion

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Speaker 2: and art. I worked at the Palladium and there was

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Speaker 2: a Kenny Sharp room and there was you know, murals

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Speaker 2: by Keith Hering, and I saw drag queens for the

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Speaker 2: first time, and you know, I just had like I

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Speaker 2: was experienced so much newness in my world. And I

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Speaker 2: didn't have to travel very far, thirty minutes from where

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Speaker 2: I grew up, and all of a sudden I found

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Speaker 2: all this like art and culture and fashion.

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Speaker 1: But anyway, Victor and I met at the.

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Speaker 2: Nightclub and then we started. His career kind of took

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Speaker 2: off after we met, and then Ibiza happened. And what

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Speaker 2: I love so much about Ibiza is the very first

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Speaker 2: place that we ever traveled with Jivon as a baby,

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Speaker 2: he was under.

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Speaker 1: One years old, was Ibiza.

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Speaker 2: So I you know, it started with like Victor's career

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Speaker 2: and our courtship, and then it became where like a

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Speaker 2: place where we went as a young family also as

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Speaker 2: he was DJing, and then fast forward now the past,

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Speaker 2: like you know, we've been going for over twenty five years,

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Speaker 2: but more recently we've been spending a lot of time

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Speaker 2: there and it feels like this beautiful full circle moment

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Speaker 2: where you know, Jivon's early years were there and now

294
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Speaker 2: Jievon's a DJ and he's a producer and he's on

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Speaker 2: the dance floor with us in the nightclubs. And last summer,

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Speaker 2: Victor dj' at Circle Loco, which is like one of

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Speaker 2: the biggest parties in a Biza, and it was like

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Speaker 2: me and Jivonne and some of Jevon's friends like all

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Speaker 2: in the DJ booth, like go like going for it,

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Speaker 2: and it just I was just like this, this is

301
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Speaker 2: the talk about the center of my world is my family,

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Speaker 2: but it's also nightlife. And the fact that like now

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Speaker 2: we still do it as a family.

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Speaker 1: It's that's rare. It's really rare.

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Speaker 2: And also you know that Jeevonn is twenty three years

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Speaker 2: old now and like his still wants to be with us,

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Speaker 2: he still wants to travel with us, Like you know,

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Speaker 2: it's it's really sweet. It's just really sweet. And and

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Speaker 2: Abiita is so much more than just nightlife, you know

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Speaker 2: what I mean, because well there is.

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Speaker 1: Like a very literal other side of Abitha, yes, and

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Speaker 1: another side of Abitha, Like how do you understand the

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Speaker 1: other side of it?

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Speaker 2: Like we hike a lot when we go to Abiita,

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Speaker 2: and it's so funny. Sometimes they say a Biza and

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Speaker 2: sometimes they say Abita.

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Speaker 1: But you know, I mean same would. I'm just kind

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Speaker 1: of whatever comes out. Yeah. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: The nature is just like the rugged coastline is so incredible,

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Speaker 2: the exploration, the just like the raw and the wild.

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Speaker 2: The north side of the island is so special, which

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Speaker 2: is where we first started going with.

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Speaker 1: Oh really, yeah, so you're okay, Yeah, we were there.

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Speaker 2: The very first hotel we ever stayed in was all

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Speaker 2: the way north and then yeah, these past few summers,

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Speaker 2: we do these really long sunset hikes and it literally

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Speaker 2: gives me life. Like those hikes, they're so it's so

328
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Speaker 2: beautiful because it pushes me outside of my comfort zone.

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Speaker 1: You have to be so present.

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Speaker 2: It forces me to like jump inside these like you know,

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Speaker 2: underwater caves, and I'm always doing it with my family

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Speaker 2: and with our dog, and it.

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Speaker 1: Just you're so no. It's funny you say that because

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Speaker 1: like I only got to know the Balaric Islands and

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Speaker 1: mostly Majorca in the past few years, obviously because it's

336
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Speaker 1: no secret to Germans or British people, and it is.

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Speaker 1: I mean, there's a certain thing that happens there, but

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Speaker 1: it's had this big kind of renaissance. And part of

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00:18:48,584 --> 00:18:52,424
Speaker 1: the thing that I didn't really realize about those islands

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Speaker 1: is there kind of the hub of European healers. Like

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Speaker 1: I did not realize that there is some energy there

342
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Speaker 1: and those communities. Like I did a watsu massage, which

343
00:19:04,984 --> 00:19:07,464
Speaker 1: is one of those like whirlpooled ones. It's like being

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Speaker 1: in the womb. And it's only because it was the

345
00:19:09,904 --> 00:19:11,464
Speaker 1: only thing that was on the this s bomb and

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Speaker 1: you and my girlfriends were going to something and I'm

347
00:19:14,024 --> 00:19:17,784
Speaker 1: not like the biggest you know, wellness or spa person,

348
00:19:17,864 --> 00:19:20,464
Speaker 1: but yeah, I'm up for everything. Yeah, and it was

349
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Speaker 1: kind of extraordinary. This woman was like it was almost

350
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Speaker 1: like a duela. You know. It was one of the

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Speaker 1: most intense experiences that I've had in that vein, and

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Speaker 1: I just didn't realize there was that energy there.

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Speaker 2: There's a huge community of healers, especially in that north

354
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Speaker 2: side of Abitha, and there's a lot of like agriculture

355
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Speaker 2: and farms, which is why the food is so fantastic.

356
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Speaker 2: Like the north really has this like beautifully like rooted,

357
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Speaker 2: i don't know.

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Speaker 1: Healing energy.

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Speaker 2: But then also Eshedra, which is it's that big formation

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Speaker 2: of rocks on the like more western side of the island.

361
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Speaker 2: But they say it's one of the most like energetic

362
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Speaker 2: and magnetic places.

363
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Speaker 1: Makes sense.

364
00:20:03,264 --> 00:20:06,824
Speaker 2: On Earth, people are like, oh, Ibiza either welcomes you

365
00:20:06,944 --> 00:20:09,184
Speaker 2: or it spits you out. And I'm just like, Okay,

366
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Speaker 2: I don't always like into the whole wu wu thing,

367
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Speaker 2: but there is something beautifully energetic about the island.

368
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Speaker 1: The other thing I was thinking about is, you know,

369
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Speaker 1: I think sometimes for these places that actually we returned

370
00:20:22,784 --> 00:20:27,664
Speaker 1: to because we have memories or an experience that replicates

371
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Speaker 1: year to year. It's kind of that return place. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: and that's kind of special. I thought maybe as your

373
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Speaker 1: life evolved it would be different, but I think that's

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Speaker 1: really interesting.

375
00:20:37,184 --> 00:20:41,824
Speaker 2: I think I stopped like going out and with Victor

376
00:20:41,944 --> 00:20:44,904
Speaker 2: and like being a part of his nightlife world. And

377
00:20:44,944 --> 00:20:46,864
Speaker 2: I think it's also something that's at the core of

378
00:20:46,904 --> 00:20:49,904
Speaker 2: our marriage. Like we've always had really individual lives but

379
00:20:49,984 --> 00:20:54,064
Speaker 2: also like a unit, as you said, But when I

380
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Speaker 2: was trying to figure out career and I was a

381
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Speaker 2: young mom, I kind of stopped going out and it

382
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Speaker 2: more recently nightlife and dancing. You know.

383
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Speaker 1: Now I have this like.

384
00:21:04,864 --> 00:21:06,984
Speaker 2: Big career and I have a lot of pressure, and

385
00:21:07,064 --> 00:21:09,224
Speaker 2: I have like a lot of time that I'm like

386
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Speaker 2: head down in a computer and like that part of me,

387
00:21:13,184 --> 00:21:16,263
Speaker 2: like that real free spirit where I get to like

388
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Speaker 2: quote unquote let my hair down and like just be

389
00:21:19,344 --> 00:21:23,023
Speaker 2: kind of anonymous and be with the people that like

390
00:21:23,104 --> 00:21:26,224
Speaker 2: pulled joy out of me. Like I needed her back

391
00:21:26,304 --> 00:21:28,784
Speaker 2: in my life, and I like made a strategic choice

392
00:21:28,784 --> 00:21:32,704
Speaker 2: to make sure I honored who I was as a

393
00:21:32,784 --> 00:21:35,384
Speaker 2: club goer, you know what I mean. Like it's it's

394
00:21:35,424 --> 00:21:37,464
Speaker 2: part of who I am, and it does bring me

395
00:21:37,504 --> 00:21:40,944
Speaker 2: a lot of joy. But I will say if I can,

396
00:21:41,424 --> 00:21:44,184
Speaker 2: if I let myself just go too far into that

397
00:21:44,304 --> 00:21:47,904
Speaker 2: night life part of Abitha, because you can, that doesn't speak.

398
00:21:47,664 --> 00:21:48,664
Speaker 1: To who I am either.

399
00:21:48,864 --> 00:21:51,344
Speaker 2: So in a way, the island became this like mirror

400
00:21:51,384 --> 00:21:54,464
Speaker 2: for me. Like last year, I like was doing yoga

401
00:21:54,504 --> 00:21:57,263
Speaker 2: three days a week, like in these like up on

402
00:21:57,304 --> 00:21:59,464
Speaker 2: the top of a hill on a platform, like hearing

403
00:21:59,464 --> 00:22:02,184
Speaker 2: the cicadas and these like big pine trees, and like

404
00:22:02,464 --> 00:22:05,744
Speaker 2: I really tap back into that like yogi part of myself.

405
00:22:06,064 --> 00:22:07,744
Speaker 2: I was going to the market a lot, and I was,

406
00:22:08,064 --> 00:22:10,424
Speaker 2: you know, cooking NonStop, like in the house that we

407
00:22:10,424 --> 00:22:13,424
Speaker 2: rented to, like that part of myself that sometimes falls

408
00:22:13,464 --> 00:22:14,424
Speaker 2: to the waist side when I'm.

409
00:22:14,344 --> 00:22:16,064
Speaker 1: Too busy in New York City.

410
00:22:16,264 --> 00:22:19,664
Speaker 2: Like I do feel like it Bizo really allows me

411
00:22:19,904 --> 00:22:23,584
Speaker 2: to focus on, like who the various parts of who

412
00:22:23,584 --> 00:22:26,904
Speaker 2: I am. I don't think design and like culture, like

413
00:22:26,944 --> 00:22:30,224
Speaker 2: it doesn't have like museums or like you know, but

414
00:22:30,304 --> 00:22:30,664
Speaker 2: it does.

415
00:22:30,664 --> 00:22:34,344
Speaker 1: It's like it has it has a culture of its

416
00:22:34,344 --> 00:22:36,664
Speaker 1: own completely. You know. I think that when we're talking

417
00:22:36,664 --> 00:22:40,464
Speaker 1: about the unit and your like great love Victor, that's

418
00:22:40,544 --> 00:22:42,464
Speaker 1: kind of how we met, right I was just thinking

419
00:22:42,504 --> 00:22:45,744
Speaker 1: about it because you were planning your I was planning my.

420
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Speaker 2: Yeah, my twenty five year wedding anniversary coincided with that's

421
00:22:51,384 --> 00:22:55,144
Speaker 2: so interesting. Yeah, yeah, I kind of hadn't realized that

422
00:22:55,304 --> 00:22:58,944
Speaker 2: I got married at twenty five. So then it made

423
00:22:59,024 --> 00:23:03,584
Speaker 2: my fiftieth birthday and my twenty five year wedding anniversary coincide.

424
00:23:03,664 --> 00:23:07,144
Speaker 2: And in that moment, I didn't do a big celebration

425
00:23:07,224 --> 00:23:09,584
Speaker 2: for my fortieth birthday. We actually went to Africa, we

426
00:23:09,624 --> 00:23:12,384
Speaker 2: went on a safari. At that point in my life,

427
00:23:12,584 --> 00:23:15,944
Speaker 2: I didn't feel like celebrating like four to oh, but

428
00:23:16,104 --> 00:23:19,344
Speaker 2: five oh coinciding with twenty five years of love. It

429
00:23:19,384 --> 00:23:21,304
Speaker 2: just felt like a celebration of love and life that

430
00:23:21,424 --> 00:23:22,024
Speaker 2: needed to.

431
00:23:23,104 --> 00:23:25,184
Speaker 1: Be like a big event.

432
00:23:25,904 --> 00:23:28,144
Speaker 2: And I and you were the first person that I

433
00:23:28,144 --> 00:23:30,824
Speaker 2: thought to reach out to to help me navigate that.

434
00:23:31,304 --> 00:23:33,944
Speaker 1: My great love, of course is Italy and one that

435
00:23:33,984 --> 00:23:36,464
Speaker 1: we share and you you share as a background right

436
00:23:36,464 --> 00:23:39,264
Speaker 1: as a heritage, sure, and Victory as well, and Victor two,

437
00:23:39,384 --> 00:23:43,904
Speaker 1: well look Calderon calderone. But that's how we first. I

438
00:23:43,984 --> 00:23:46,384
Speaker 1: think you messaged me and then we had a little

439
00:23:46,864 --> 00:23:49,664
Speaker 1: a little coffee, and we weren't going to work together

440
00:23:49,824 --> 00:23:52,944
Speaker 1: necessarily on the trip, because you know, I have a

441
00:23:53,064 --> 00:23:55,184
Speaker 1: very strong point of view, you have a very strong

442
00:23:55,824 --> 00:23:58,504
Speaker 1: point of view on things. But it's been a really

443
00:23:59,544 --> 00:24:02,783
Speaker 1: fun collaboration. And I guess it started as your vow

444
00:24:02,864 --> 00:24:05,784
Speaker 1: renewal and just some ideas for the fiftieth birthday, but

445
00:24:05,784 --> 00:24:07,263
Speaker 1: I'm going to hand it over to you because it's

446
00:24:07,344 --> 00:24:09,744
Speaker 1: really your story. Oh oh well, thank you.

447
00:24:10,104 --> 00:24:14,024
Speaker 2: I I have a love of Italy as you do,

448
00:24:14,824 --> 00:24:17,184
Speaker 2: and I'd never been to Umbria, and I was trying

449
00:24:17,224 --> 00:24:21,024
Speaker 2: to find the perfect place to do something very intimate

450
00:24:21,144 --> 00:24:24,904
Speaker 2: with just my family, and then also to do something

451
00:24:25,024 --> 00:24:27,184
Speaker 2: a little bit more over the top and ground with

452
00:24:27,344 --> 00:24:31,024
Speaker 2: my friends. And I felt like Umbria offered that like

453
00:24:31,704 --> 00:24:37,664
Speaker 2: quiet countryside, and then Rome offered the grandeur of like

454
00:24:38,784 --> 00:24:42,384
Speaker 2: literally a living museum. But those were two places in

455
00:24:42,464 --> 00:24:44,344
Speaker 2: my mind. I feel like I shared a lot of

456
00:24:44,384 --> 00:24:47,024
Speaker 2: places though, Like I was thinking, we just had sort

457
00:24:47,024 --> 00:24:49,544
Speaker 2: of have this conversation like is it Palermo because that's

458
00:24:49,544 --> 00:24:50,624
Speaker 2: where Victor's family.

459
00:24:50,464 --> 00:24:54,704
Speaker 1: Is from, the Palatina Chinese? Which is this like Shinwazari

460
00:24:55,064 --> 00:24:58,584
Speaker 1: folly on the edge of Palermo to Venice? I think?

461
00:24:58,664 --> 00:24:59,864
Speaker 1: Was we talked about Venice?

462
00:24:59,984 --> 00:25:01,704
Speaker 2: Yes, you know, we went all over the mast and

463
00:25:01,784 --> 00:25:04,024
Speaker 2: that's that really speaks to like the chaos of my

464
00:25:04,184 --> 00:25:08,064
Speaker 2: creative brain a little bit. But it wasn't until you

465
00:25:08,224 --> 00:25:12,384
Speaker 2: helped me find the locations. And first and foremost you

466
00:25:12,504 --> 00:25:16,584
Speaker 2: had just toured Palazzo Talia, Yes, and it wasn't even

467
00:25:16,624 --> 00:25:19,904
Speaker 2: open yet, right. So for me, it's so funny because

468
00:25:19,904 --> 00:25:21,944
Speaker 2: I'm this way about like design and real estate too.

469
00:25:22,064 --> 00:25:24,584
Speaker 2: Like recently people are like, why did you move to Tribecca,

470
00:25:24,664 --> 00:25:26,264
Speaker 2: And I was like, well, it wasn't Tribeca. It was

471
00:25:26,344 --> 00:25:29,384
Speaker 2: just finding the right place. So I until I found

472
00:25:29,384 --> 00:25:31,464
Speaker 2: the right place, I would have gone anywhere in Italy.

473
00:25:31,464 --> 00:25:33,144
Speaker 2: I would have gone outside of Italy. It was just

474
00:25:33,304 --> 00:25:38,344
Speaker 2: finding the place that was intimate enough to host friends

475
00:25:38,464 --> 00:25:41,784
Speaker 2: without being this grand hotel where everyone would get lost.

476
00:25:42,384 --> 00:25:45,784
Speaker 1: And also somewhere where a lot of people have done

477
00:25:46,144 --> 00:25:49,224
Speaker 1: things before, Like you want to show something new and

478
00:25:49,384 --> 00:25:54,504
Speaker 1: bring something like a different thing to your gigantic audience,

479
00:25:55,264 --> 00:25:58,104
Speaker 1: and also do something that spoke to you in a

480
00:25:58,144 --> 00:26:01,024
Speaker 1: special way. I love, you know, part of the reason

481
00:26:01,064 --> 00:26:03,024
Speaker 1: I was like yes, and then we really got into

482
00:26:03,104 --> 00:26:06,824
Speaker 1: the planning and the execution around it. But I love

483
00:26:06,904 --> 00:26:10,744
Speaker 1: working with people who have a romantic sense and an

484
00:26:10,784 --> 00:26:13,224
Speaker 1: I of what they want to do and an idea

485
00:26:13,344 --> 00:26:15,904
Speaker 1: of a place and then like pulling it together with

486
00:26:15,984 --> 00:26:16,504
Speaker 1: the reality.

487
00:26:16,664 --> 00:26:19,984
Speaker 2: Well you did that brilliantly because I wanted well it's true,

488
00:26:20,664 --> 00:26:25,424
Speaker 2: I wanted a grand room to host like forty guests,

489
00:26:25,744 --> 00:26:29,744
Speaker 2: and it needed to have that like palazzo grandeur, but

490
00:26:29,984 --> 00:26:33,504
Speaker 2: also delicious food and in a city that people from

491
00:26:33,544 --> 00:26:36,544
Speaker 2: New York can get to like without having to travel

492
00:26:36,624 --> 00:26:38,664
Speaker 2: Like that was another thing, Like you couldn't get off

493
00:26:38,704 --> 00:26:40,384
Speaker 2: the plane and then had to like travel two to

494
00:26:40,464 --> 00:26:42,704
Speaker 2: three hours if you're only going for a long weekend.

495
00:26:43,344 --> 00:26:46,624
Speaker 2: So I you know, it really speaks to what you

496
00:26:46,784 --> 00:26:48,584
Speaker 2: are so brilliant at, Like.

497
00:26:48,904 --> 00:26:51,904
Speaker 1: Thanks, I mean, I think also it was like just

498
00:26:52,024 --> 00:26:55,424
Speaker 1: on that point of you know, romance and reality. It's

499
00:26:55,464 --> 00:26:58,344
Speaker 1: not like I'm going to take you to the reality

500
00:26:58,424 --> 00:27:00,704
Speaker 1: of how we're going to do this. Actually, what I

501
00:27:00,944 --> 00:27:03,144
Speaker 1: find and the joy of it is when you mix

502
00:27:03,264 --> 00:27:08,384
Speaker 1: those two things, they become something actually more romantic and

503
00:27:08,464 --> 00:27:11,984
Speaker 1: special because you're you find the way to put the

504
00:27:12,024 --> 00:27:14,104
Speaker 1: spotlight on the best of the place, which I think

505
00:27:14,304 --> 00:27:17,504
Speaker 1: was so fun for us to do. We had such

506
00:27:17,544 --> 00:27:19,384
Speaker 1: a like collaboration that was.

507
00:27:19,384 --> 00:27:22,424
Speaker 2: Amazing, and your team is incredible and Capital you know,

508
00:27:22,544 --> 00:27:25,704
Speaker 2: bringing Capital one into the fold was also you know

509
00:27:25,864 --> 00:27:31,344
Speaker 2: incredible because beyond having that exceptional experience for my fiftieth

510
00:27:31,384 --> 00:27:35,144
Speaker 2: birthday at Palazza Talia, we went back to Rome together

511
00:27:35,504 --> 00:27:38,584
Speaker 2: with Capital one a year later and you know, created

512
00:27:38,664 --> 00:27:42,624
Speaker 2: this beautiful experience for cardholders and got to you know,

513
00:27:43,144 --> 00:27:45,584
Speaker 2: replicate going to the that. I mean, can we just

514
00:27:45,664 --> 00:27:48,023
Speaker 2: talk about like everybody says to me, like how did

515
00:27:48,104 --> 00:27:51,543
Speaker 2: you get into the Vatican, like privately, what is your

516
00:27:51,664 --> 00:27:55,184
Speaker 2: secret sauce about like you know, getting access to or

517
00:27:55,224 --> 00:27:58,224
Speaker 2: don't share too much because sauce.

518
00:27:57,704 --> 00:28:01,144
Speaker 1: I mean, you know what people can get you into

519
00:28:02,384 --> 00:28:06,424
Speaker 1: the Vatican right, you can go like early hours and

520
00:28:06,664 --> 00:28:12,664
Speaker 1: you know the Catholic Church is looking to monetize, Yeah,

521
00:28:15,984 --> 00:28:19,184
Speaker 1: monetize no, but look they got a lot of pieces

522
00:28:19,264 --> 00:28:23,784
Speaker 1: that they've got to restore and and keep like gleaming

523
00:28:23,984 --> 00:28:29,224
Speaker 1: like the Vatican Museum does. But you know, my colleague Carlotta,

524
00:28:29,544 --> 00:28:33,704
Speaker 1: who is a very special person who is able to

525
00:28:34,424 --> 00:28:38,544
Speaker 1: you know, she's what they're calling Italy educata, very polite,

526
00:28:39,184 --> 00:28:42,344
Speaker 1: knows how to navigate asking the right question. She has

527
00:28:42,424 --> 00:28:46,784
Speaker 1: like a very calm demeanor. Ninja unbelievable and I think

528
00:28:46,904 --> 00:28:50,304
Speaker 1: this is the case, and I am certain in various

529
00:28:50,304 --> 00:28:55,304
Speaker 1: different like iterations, when you're curious about something and respectful

530
00:28:55,904 --> 00:29:00,584
Speaker 1: to anyone, whether it is you know, the papal rooms

531
00:29:01,264 --> 00:29:06,184
Speaker 1: or the fishermen, wherever that might be, they always open

532
00:29:06,304 --> 00:29:09,664
Speaker 1: up in the right way. Yes, that was threading a

533
00:29:09,744 --> 00:29:12,504
Speaker 1: needle and getting the Swiss Guard to agree, not only

534
00:29:12,984 --> 00:29:17,664
Speaker 1: the after hours, but the real thing. That from our perspective,

535
00:29:17,664 --> 00:29:20,424
Speaker 1: because I know you wanted to take a photo because

536
00:29:20,584 --> 00:29:24,144
Speaker 1: it's a special moment to It was more than just

537
00:29:24,304 --> 00:29:27,504
Speaker 1: visiting it as a tourist or as someone interested in that.

538
00:29:27,704 --> 00:29:30,344
Speaker 1: I know you wanted to keep that memory. I think

539
00:29:30,424 --> 00:29:34,304
Speaker 1: you think like I do in photo moments, not just

540
00:29:34,304 --> 00:29:37,104
Speaker 1: because of your work and not just because of my work,

541
00:29:37,144 --> 00:29:41,344
Speaker 1: but because it it just affirms that that thing that

542
00:29:41,464 --> 00:29:44,184
Speaker 1: you did, it kind of imprints it it into your.

543
00:29:44,184 --> 00:29:47,664
Speaker 2: Story and it triggers the memory for a lifetime and beyond.

544
00:29:48,184 --> 00:29:51,064
Speaker 1: Yeah, so Colorda, I still don't know exactly how she

545
00:29:51,184 --> 00:29:54,504
Speaker 1: got the Swiss Guard to allow them to do that.

546
00:29:54,784 --> 00:29:59,424
Speaker 2: But yeah, we were inside the Vatican, the Sisting chapel.

547
00:29:59,664 --> 00:30:03,224
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, sorry, we were inside the Cistine Chapel. Yeah,

548
00:30:03,264 --> 00:30:06,464
Speaker 2: we were allowed to take photos in the Vatican, but

549
00:30:06,664 --> 00:30:09,504
Speaker 2: the Vatican Museum, but inside the Cistine Chapel. We were

550
00:30:09,584 --> 00:30:12,104
Speaker 2: told you could not take any photos. And then they

551
00:30:12,224 --> 00:30:14,944
Speaker 2: said you're allowed to take a photo. And you know,

552
00:30:15,144 --> 00:30:17,304
Speaker 2: I was up on the altar and I was just like,

553
00:30:17,504 --> 00:30:20,184
Speaker 2: somebody grab a camera. I mean, everybody had their camera,

554
00:30:20,624 --> 00:30:22,864
Speaker 2: but like everyone was told they couldn't. So then it

555
00:30:22,984 --> 00:30:25,984
Speaker 2: was all of a sudden, you know it Actually I

556
00:30:26,024 --> 00:30:30,504
Speaker 2: won't say it distracted me, but I'm so happy. Like then,

557
00:30:30,504 --> 00:30:32,064
Speaker 2: all of a sudden, I was like seeing it through

558
00:30:32,104 --> 00:30:34,104
Speaker 2: the lens instead of seeing it for real. So when

559
00:30:34,144 --> 00:30:36,824
Speaker 2: we went back with Capital one, I didn't take my phone.

560
00:30:36,864 --> 00:30:39,024
Speaker 2: I was like, oh, I've got this already. So the

561
00:30:39,104 --> 00:30:41,384
Speaker 2: second time around, I just like took it in and

562
00:30:41,504 --> 00:30:45,424
Speaker 2: took in the emotion. That was a very special experience.

563
00:30:45,504 --> 00:30:48,424
Speaker 2: And also you know, there was like I didn't know

564
00:30:48,944 --> 00:30:51,144
Speaker 2: it was my first time also ever at the Vatican,

565
00:30:51,224 --> 00:30:53,144
Speaker 2: but there was like also so much.

566
00:30:53,104 --> 00:30:56,864
Speaker 1: Greek history and like learning about like a fina that

567
00:30:57,104 --> 00:31:02,744
Speaker 1: the map hole. I mean that is absolute heaven.

568
00:31:02,864 --> 00:31:06,104
Speaker 2: But talk about how I take inspiration from everything I

569
00:31:06,224 --> 00:31:10,304
Speaker 2: see when I travel. Red Porphyry is one of the

570
00:31:10,464 --> 00:31:14,544
Speaker 2: oldest Roman stones, and there is this like massive like

571
00:31:14,664 --> 00:31:18,064
Speaker 2: sculpture or structure as well as in the mosaic floors

572
00:31:18,104 --> 00:31:21,584
Speaker 2: that is red porphyry. And from there I dove down

573
00:31:21,624 --> 00:31:24,624
Speaker 2: the rabbit hole of discovery. And now in my Tribeca home,

574
00:31:24,784 --> 00:31:27,424
Speaker 2: like there are elements of red porphyry in my home.

575
00:31:27,584 --> 00:31:30,104
Speaker 2: So I feel like, you know, I can walk through

576
00:31:30,184 --> 00:31:33,224
Speaker 2: my home and know, you know, every place that I

577
00:31:33,464 --> 00:31:35,784
Speaker 2: saw and traveled to and it triggers a memory. And

578
00:31:35,864 --> 00:31:41,024
Speaker 2: that's how you create and build in a motive living home,

579
00:31:41,184 --> 00:31:41,384
Speaker 2: you know.

580
00:31:41,584 --> 00:31:45,544
Speaker 1: So yeah, it's funny. I just went again, but we

581
00:31:45,744 --> 00:31:49,744
Speaker 1: went with fifteen members of my family from age four

582
00:31:50,104 --> 00:31:52,784
Speaker 1: to eighty five. It's a very different experience when you're

583
00:31:52,824 --> 00:31:56,344
Speaker 1: cycling through with thousands of people, but you know, that's

584
00:31:56,504 --> 00:31:59,464
Speaker 1: that's what we were doing. And this trip actually was

585
00:31:59,544 --> 00:32:02,944
Speaker 1: quite special because it was basically thirty years to the

586
00:32:03,784 --> 00:32:07,624
Speaker 1: day since we went as a family. Oh wow. Yeah,

587
00:32:07,784 --> 00:32:10,624
Speaker 1: and so it was really special. And you know, my

588
00:32:11,144 --> 00:32:14,344
Speaker 1: this brother passed away not long after that, you know,

589
00:32:14,424 --> 00:32:17,304
Speaker 1: he got diagnosed with cancer and and well, and it

590
00:32:17,424 --> 00:32:19,024
Speaker 1: was just interesting. I mean, I don't mean to go

591
00:32:19,264 --> 00:32:22,664
Speaker 1: to to far into it, but one of the eldest

592
00:32:22,744 --> 00:32:26,144
Speaker 1: boys is the same age. It was really meaningful for

593
00:32:26,264 --> 00:32:28,504
Speaker 1: my parents. But this is actually kind of a it's

594
00:32:28,544 --> 00:32:31,104
Speaker 1: a funny story. The littlest one who is you know,

595
00:32:31,224 --> 00:32:33,744
Speaker 1: like the team mascot. Let's say her name is Joey.

596
00:32:34,024 --> 00:32:39,024
Speaker 1: She's just a very chill, you know, little perfect thing

597
00:32:39,264 --> 00:32:41,384
Speaker 1: that you know, you can throw around everywhere. And she

598
00:32:41,584 --> 00:32:44,904
Speaker 1: marched around Rome and wherever we were the entire time.

599
00:32:44,944 --> 00:32:46,664
Speaker 1: But we went to the Vatican Museum and it was

600
00:32:46,824 --> 00:32:48,984
Speaker 1: towards the end of the trip. You know, when you're

601
00:32:49,104 --> 00:32:52,344
Speaker 1: four and this size, you're not seeing things. You're not

602
00:32:52,424 --> 00:32:55,304
Speaker 1: that of course, that interested basically your eye line with

603
00:32:55,464 --> 00:32:59,824
Speaker 1: everyone's asses. You know, yeah, you're just there. And this

604
00:33:00,064 --> 00:33:03,904
Speaker 1: kid never complains about anything. She's kind of extraordinary. And

605
00:33:04,184 --> 00:33:08,184
Speaker 1: as we walked into the Sistine Chapel, this little kid

606
00:33:08,824 --> 00:33:16,264
Speaker 1: went boring, very boring. I was mortified, but I had

607
00:33:16,384 --> 00:33:19,064
Speaker 1: never seen anything like it, and it just killed us.

608
00:33:19,104 --> 00:33:21,384
Speaker 1: It cracked us up. And you know, they haven't traveled

609
00:33:21,464 --> 00:33:23,224
Speaker 1: much at all. It was a very special gift for

610
00:33:23,744 --> 00:33:25,544
Speaker 1: my parents, to the whole family, and.

611
00:33:25,824 --> 00:33:29,904
Speaker 2: That trip to Umbria for my twenty five year wedding anniversary.

612
00:33:30,224 --> 00:33:32,824
Speaker 2: My brother had never left the country and had always

613
00:33:32,864 --> 00:33:36,664
Speaker 2: wanted to go to Italy. So it was just you know, myself,

614
00:33:37,464 --> 00:33:40,064
Speaker 2: Victor and Jivonn and then my mom and.

615
00:33:40,384 --> 00:33:42,064
Speaker 1: My brother and my brother's wife.

616
00:33:42,864 --> 00:33:46,024
Speaker 2: You know, having this like beautiful experience in Umbria and

617
00:33:46,544 --> 00:33:49,504
Speaker 2: giving them that gift of travel was something that it

618
00:33:49,664 --> 00:33:52,704
Speaker 2: was so important to like all be together in this

619
00:33:52,984 --> 00:33:57,024
Speaker 2: like beautifully magical place and honor our marriage.

620
00:33:57,184 --> 00:33:58,624
Speaker 1: I mean this is probably too.

621
00:33:58,584 --> 00:34:02,464
Speaker 2: Intimate, but my brother struggled with addiction and he was

622
00:34:02,584 --> 00:34:06,024
Speaker 2: unable to be at my wedding when I got married

623
00:34:06,104 --> 00:34:09,223
Speaker 2: twenty five years ago. So to have him there for

624
00:34:09,504 --> 00:34:12,904
Speaker 2: the renewal of the valves and he's sober now was

625
00:34:13,544 --> 00:34:15,544
Speaker 2: really really special.

626
00:34:15,784 --> 00:34:19,464
Speaker 1: And we found a house which I don't know and

627
00:34:19,623 --> 00:34:23,384
Speaker 1: you know, it wasn't it wasn't a palazzo, just to

628
00:34:23,504 --> 00:34:27,104
Speaker 1: be clear. It's a little not little big house, but

629
00:34:27,263 --> 00:34:29,143
Speaker 1: not what you're thinking. It's not a castle on a hill.

630
00:34:29,263 --> 00:34:33,104
Speaker 1: It's a house that had a chapel in the house

631
00:34:33,303 --> 00:34:37,424
Speaker 1: from the thirteenth century. Yeah, and in this pale yellow

632
00:34:38,223 --> 00:34:41,183
Speaker 1: and violet and that the photo of you, I have

633
00:34:41,303 --> 00:34:44,104
Speaker 1: to say, is just you take a good photo, e sap.

634
00:34:44,223 --> 00:34:47,064
Speaker 1: But this one is absolutely It was.

635
00:34:47,183 --> 00:34:50,303
Speaker 2: So special and also it was just like you know,

636
00:34:50,424 --> 00:34:53,944
Speaker 2: you think about your wedding. This wasn't my wedding, but

637
00:34:54,143 --> 00:34:56,783
Speaker 2: like it was wedding part too, And you know, it's

638
00:34:56,864 --> 00:34:59,584
Speaker 2: usually like somebody else is doing everything for you, and

639
00:34:59,783 --> 00:35:00,823
Speaker 2: this was just us.

640
00:35:01,223 --> 00:35:02,944
Speaker 1: You know. It was like me and my mom and my.

641
00:35:02,984 --> 00:35:05,743
Speaker 2: Sister in law like running around like lighting candles, like

642
00:35:05,824 --> 00:35:09,784
Speaker 2: it was just like the most like intimate and grand

643
00:35:09,904 --> 00:35:10,823
Speaker 2: thing at the same time.

644
00:35:11,344 --> 00:35:13,823
Speaker 1: Again, it was just it was just perfect. The last

645
00:35:13,824 --> 00:35:16,264
Speaker 1: thing I want to talk about in Rome is palazza

646
00:35:16,344 --> 00:35:21,304
Speaker 1: talia in this salah, this owl alamannia amanya. You created

647
00:35:21,424 --> 00:35:25,464
Speaker 1: this table. I mean you're you know that's a signature.

648
00:35:25,663 --> 00:35:27,624
Speaker 1: But just tell me a little bit about that table,

649
00:35:27,703 --> 00:35:30,384
Speaker 1: because I am still blown away that how you did that.

650
00:35:30,663 --> 00:35:30,984
Speaker 1: Thank you.

651
00:35:31,544 --> 00:35:35,304
Speaker 2: Food and design. Where those two things intersect is around

652
00:35:35,344 --> 00:35:39,223
Speaker 2: the table, and around the table is where I have

653
00:35:39,344 --> 00:35:44,703
Speaker 2: found my passion, my community, just like you found your

654
00:35:44,984 --> 00:35:48,263
Speaker 2: secret sauce and your like special talents, like you know

655
00:35:48,703 --> 00:35:51,623
Speaker 2: you fused together with prior, like your love of travel

656
00:35:51,743 --> 00:35:55,424
Speaker 2: and writing and curation. It really was around the table

657
00:35:55,584 --> 00:36:00,303
Speaker 2: that gave me my love of noticing and realizing the importance.

658
00:35:59,864 --> 00:36:01,904
Speaker 1: Of all of the elements coming together.

659
00:36:02,544 --> 00:36:06,143
Speaker 2: It's not happenstance. It's not by accident. It has to

660
00:36:06,183 --> 00:36:07,984
Speaker 2: be the right lighting, it has to be the right

661
00:36:08,104 --> 00:36:10,504
Speaker 2: tones and the florals, and you have to draw inspiration,

662
00:36:11,223 --> 00:36:13,544
Speaker 2: and the way I do anyway, I have to draw

663
00:36:13,584 --> 00:36:17,263
Speaker 2: inspiration from the culture itself. So it was like being

664
00:36:17,384 --> 00:36:19,743
Speaker 2: and I didn't really exactly know what was going to

665
00:36:19,783 --> 00:36:22,183
Speaker 2: happen on that table until I was in Rome and

666
00:36:22,303 --> 00:36:26,584
Speaker 2: I saw the colors at the Vatican and that porfyrydinkyo,

667
00:36:27,024 --> 00:36:29,263
Speaker 2: I mean, you know, I went to the market and

668
00:36:29,504 --> 00:36:33,143
Speaker 2: saw the ridicicio was kind of bursting, and the artichoke was,

669
00:36:33,263 --> 00:36:35,863
Speaker 2: you know, in season, and the color of the red

670
00:36:35,944 --> 00:36:38,663
Speaker 2: porphyry at the Vatican, and I drew inspiration from all

671
00:36:38,743 --> 00:36:42,064
Speaker 2: the tones and colors and the markets and everything seasonally

672
00:36:42,143 --> 00:36:46,704
Speaker 2: that was happening, and just built this beautifully undulating cornucopia

673
00:36:46,904 --> 00:36:51,343
Speaker 2: of like flower and food and design. And it was

674
00:36:51,504 --> 00:36:54,664
Speaker 2: just the fusion of Rome coming to life on the table.

675
00:36:55,064 --> 00:36:56,984
Speaker 1: One thing I like to do when with Rome, you

676
00:36:57,064 --> 00:37:00,464
Speaker 1: can you can travel through the basilicas the Church is

677
00:37:00,703 --> 00:37:04,064
Speaker 1: the kind of Catholic lens. You can go the art Caravaggio,

678
00:37:04,743 --> 00:37:06,984
Speaker 1: you can do ancient Rome. But I like to think

679
00:37:07,024 --> 00:37:09,064
Speaker 1: as well, and sometimes I say, you can also do gelato,

680
00:37:09,104 --> 00:37:11,984
Speaker 1: by the way, but I'd like to tell people to

681
00:37:12,464 --> 00:37:18,104
Speaker 1: travel through Rome through vegetables, because you get the art chokes,

682
00:37:18,143 --> 00:37:21,544
Speaker 1: you get the Puntarelli, which is kind of a bitter green,

683
00:37:21,743 --> 00:37:24,383
Speaker 1: you know, all those bitter greens, the chicories like, there

684
00:37:24,544 --> 00:37:28,144
Speaker 1: is so much through that kind of Lazio, the region

685
00:37:28,263 --> 00:37:31,824
Speaker 1: of Rome where you can really pull from. This episode

686
00:37:31,864 --> 00:37:34,663
Speaker 1: of traveling through is sponsored by Capital One. Capital one

687
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690
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696
00:38:06,464 --> 00:38:11,464
Speaker 1: We're talking about the eternal city. Let's go to Paris,

697
00:38:11,544 --> 00:38:14,944
Speaker 1: which is, you know, the muse of so many for

698
00:38:15,944 --> 00:38:19,024
Speaker 1: a variety of reasons, but again there's so many doorways

699
00:38:19,104 --> 00:38:21,183
Speaker 1: in I'd love to hear your take on it.

700
00:38:21,743 --> 00:38:26,343
Speaker 2: Well. Paris was the first place I ever traveled to

701
00:38:26,544 --> 00:38:30,343
Speaker 2: with my mom. My mom worked at American Airlines growing up,

702
00:38:30,824 --> 00:38:33,143
Speaker 2: so we used to do these like buddy passes where

703
00:38:33,183 --> 00:38:35,584
Speaker 2: we would like travel stand by. And Paris was the

704
00:38:35,623 --> 00:38:37,743
Speaker 2: first place I ever traveled to in Europe with my

705
00:38:37,864 --> 00:38:41,944
Speaker 2: mom at about twenty years old. And the reason we

706
00:38:42,064 --> 00:38:46,303
Speaker 2: went there is because I was trying to model, and

707
00:38:46,864 --> 00:38:49,944
Speaker 2: an agency in Paris like brought me there, and so

708
00:38:50,064 --> 00:38:54,984
Speaker 2: my very first experience was getting off well, I went

709
00:38:55,064 --> 00:38:57,584
Speaker 2: with my mom first and then I went back with

710
00:38:57,984 --> 00:39:02,223
Speaker 2: this modeling experience, and I was so so young and

711
00:39:02,344 --> 00:39:05,303
Speaker 2: so green to travel, and I remember like getting off

712
00:39:05,384 --> 00:39:07,864
Speaker 2: of the plane and like having men go straight to

713
00:39:07,944 --> 00:39:10,383
Speaker 2: this modeling agency and having them send me on all

714
00:39:10,424 --> 00:39:13,944
Speaker 2: these castings, having to figure out the metro system with

715
00:39:14,143 --> 00:39:16,864
Speaker 2: my luggage before I even like found my model apartment,

716
00:39:16,904 --> 00:39:20,344
Speaker 2: which by the way, was like this teeny tiny apartment.

717
00:39:20,064 --> 00:39:22,944
Speaker 1: With a toilet which was a hole in the floor

718
00:39:23,024 --> 00:39:27,663
Speaker 1: in the hallway. I didn't grow up fancy. But not

719
00:39:28,384 --> 00:39:31,104
Speaker 1: the bathroom in the Tribeca apartment on the cover of

720
00:39:31,223 --> 00:39:35,024
Speaker 1: a d currently, No, not at all. Yeah, it was

721
00:39:35,143 --> 00:39:37,344
Speaker 1: just like this hole in the ground.

722
00:39:37,544 --> 00:39:41,143
Speaker 2: But that was my very first experience with Paris, and

723
00:39:41,864 --> 00:39:45,303
Speaker 2: kind of fast forward. We spent our ten year wedding

724
00:39:45,303 --> 00:39:47,663
Speaker 2: anniversary in Paris and it was the first time I

725
00:39:48,024 --> 00:39:50,703
Speaker 2: visited the Road Down Museum and really was kind of

726
00:39:50,864 --> 00:39:56,464
Speaker 2: smitten by culture like Parisian like sculpture and culture and museum.

727
00:39:56,464 --> 00:39:58,663
Speaker 2: It was really the first time when I lived there

728
00:39:58,783 --> 00:40:00,903
Speaker 2: as a model, I didn't really go to a lot

729
00:40:00,984 --> 00:40:03,864
Speaker 2: of the museums. I don't know why I didn't appreciate

730
00:40:03,944 --> 00:40:07,823
Speaker 2: it back then, maybe, but more recently, when I bought

731
00:40:07,864 --> 00:40:11,663
Speaker 2: this apartment in Tribeca and really became so immersed inspired

732
00:40:12,384 --> 00:40:16,783
Speaker 2: by the Art Decca movement, I really spent a lot

733
00:40:16,864 --> 00:40:20,104
Speaker 2: of time in twenty twenty three and twenty twenty four

734
00:40:20,424 --> 00:40:24,384
Speaker 2: just educating myself and visiting not only the museums, but

735
00:40:24,584 --> 00:40:28,024
Speaker 2: also so many beautifully private homes, like we did a

736
00:40:28,104 --> 00:40:33,504
Speaker 2: photoshoot for Benny Ruggs in the Augusta Peret Apartment. It

737
00:40:33,663 --> 00:40:37,584
Speaker 2: was this most beautiful apartment building that he designed the

738
00:40:37,824 --> 00:40:42,064
Speaker 2: entire facade and interiors, but this was his private apartment

739
00:40:42,223 --> 00:40:46,383
Speaker 2: and it had these beautiful wood paneled clad walls which

740
00:40:46,623 --> 00:40:50,104
Speaker 2: is very similar to my apartment had this gorgeous deco

741
00:40:50,544 --> 00:40:54,384
Speaker 2: kind of cove ceiling that was like glimmering and white,

742
00:40:54,864 --> 00:40:58,343
Speaker 2: but also very industrialist in that you know, there were

743
00:40:58,584 --> 00:41:02,223
Speaker 2: these beautiful columns that were poured concrete that were met

744
00:41:02,303 --> 00:41:06,024
Speaker 2: with this gorgeous like metal brass trim. Like there was

745
00:41:06,183 --> 00:41:10,224
Speaker 2: just this like coming together of so many beautiful design

746
00:41:10,344 --> 00:41:14,743
Speaker 2: elements that again, I've drawn so many of the details

747
00:41:14,783 --> 00:41:18,384
Speaker 2: from that experience in that apartment into my apartment, like

748
00:41:18,504 --> 00:41:21,384
Speaker 2: including all of the doorknobs when I walked through the

749
00:41:21,424 --> 00:41:26,424
Speaker 2: apartment building where center doorknobs at like very low center doorknobs,

750
00:41:26,464 --> 00:41:28,024
Speaker 2: and you know, now in my home I have these

751
00:41:28,024 --> 00:41:31,183
Speaker 2: beautiful center doorknobs, and I just think that, you know,

752
00:41:31,464 --> 00:41:34,783
Speaker 2: I have really used Paris and I actually brought an.

753
00:41:34,703 --> 00:41:37,384
Speaker 1: Object today that I've thought about that.

754
00:41:37,743 --> 00:41:41,143
Speaker 2: Yeah, being at the Paris flea Market has been such

755
00:41:41,303 --> 00:41:44,504
Speaker 2: an education for me of you know, doing my own

756
00:41:44,584 --> 00:41:48,944
Speaker 2: research before I've gone to Paris, but then also I

757
00:41:49,064 --> 00:41:52,783
Speaker 2: started to better understand some of the greats in early

758
00:41:52,864 --> 00:41:56,224
Speaker 2: twentieth century, like Paul dupre Lafon, and in a similar

759
00:41:56,223 --> 00:41:59,423
Speaker 2: way that travel wasn't present like that design education wasn't

760
00:41:59,464 --> 00:42:02,584
Speaker 2: really present. So when I dive into a new movement

761
00:42:02,663 --> 00:42:06,423
Speaker 2: in design, I am just like lit up with curiosity

762
00:42:06,584 --> 00:42:09,823
Speaker 2: and excitement and I start to read everything. I start

763
00:42:09,904 --> 00:42:12,424
Speaker 2: to educate my eye and like being there and picking

764
00:42:12,544 --> 00:42:15,783
Speaker 2: up these objects. But Jan de nund Is, he did

765
00:42:16,024 --> 00:42:19,064
Speaker 2: beautiful lacquer work and metal work, and there's no way

766
00:42:19,104 --> 00:42:21,864
Speaker 2: I can ever afford one of his vessels or vases.

767
00:42:21,944 --> 00:42:25,383
Speaker 2: But in the Paris flee I found this vase which

768
00:42:25,663 --> 00:42:27,904
Speaker 2: is kind of it's probably like some sort of replica,

769
00:42:28,344 --> 00:42:32,424
Speaker 2: but it really represents like the Deco movement and craft.

770
00:42:33,183 --> 00:42:36,783
Speaker 1: And this was one of these It's metal, okay, but.

771
00:42:37,104 --> 00:42:39,743
Speaker 2: Yeah, it has this like beautiful patina and if you

772
00:42:39,824 --> 00:42:42,544
Speaker 2: look at it, it has this like gorgeous hammering detail

773
00:42:42,584 --> 00:42:46,183
Speaker 2: and has these geometric forms on it. And this was

774
00:42:46,223 --> 00:42:49,143
Speaker 2: one of the very first objects that I ever bought

775
00:42:49,344 --> 00:42:51,984
Speaker 2: for my apartment. But it just goes back to like

776
00:42:52,183 --> 00:42:55,823
Speaker 2: everywhere I go, I'm finding something that lives on in

777
00:42:55,984 --> 00:42:59,064
Speaker 2: my homes and is triggering memories of where I've been,

778
00:42:59,223 --> 00:43:01,944
Speaker 2: and it speaks to my love of travel and design

779
00:43:02,064 --> 00:43:02,904
Speaker 2: and self education.

780
00:43:03,263 --> 00:43:09,423
Speaker 1: So it's through the kind of idea of travel. It's

781
00:43:09,464 --> 00:43:12,303
Speaker 1: so it's so clear that you take. You know, you

782
00:43:12,504 --> 00:43:16,024
Speaker 1: research or a researcher, like for sure, I know that firsthand,

783
00:43:16,183 --> 00:43:21,703
Speaker 1: but you're also really open to the unexpected. I'm like

784
00:43:21,864 --> 00:43:25,303
Speaker 1: that way too. I've got okay, this is what I'm after. Yeah,

785
00:43:25,344 --> 00:43:29,064
Speaker 1: I'm finding other pieces, but also I'm responding to this

786
00:43:29,183 --> 00:43:30,503
Speaker 1: in a way that I didn't think I would.

787
00:43:30,703 --> 00:43:33,224
Speaker 2: Well, you have to be able to kind of pivot

788
00:43:33,464 --> 00:43:36,904
Speaker 2: as well. We're talking about like that early twentieth century

789
00:43:36,984 --> 00:43:39,823
Speaker 2: design and that Art Deco movement. When I started to

790
00:43:39,904 --> 00:43:43,663
Speaker 2: study that period in design and also bought my apartment,

791
00:43:43,743 --> 00:43:45,064
Speaker 2: I just got flooded with this.

792
00:43:45,944 --> 00:43:48,183
Speaker 1: This apartment reminds me of Vienna. And I was like, huh,

793
00:43:48,384 --> 00:43:48,984
Speaker 1: that's so strange.

794
00:43:49,024 --> 00:43:50,943
Speaker 2: I've never been to Vienna. Why with this apartment remind

795
00:43:51,024 --> 00:43:51,263
Speaker 2: me of it?

796
00:43:51,424 --> 00:43:51,544
Speaker 1: Right?

797
00:43:51,623 --> 00:43:54,464
Speaker 2: Right? You almost like have to listen sometimes, of course.

798
00:43:54,623 --> 00:43:54,783
Speaker 1: Yes.

799
00:43:54,984 --> 00:43:57,504
Speaker 2: And that trip that I went to Paris. Oh, by

800
00:43:57,544 --> 00:43:59,744
Speaker 2: the way, that trip to Paris, I went by myself.

801
00:44:00,104 --> 00:44:02,504
Speaker 2: It wasn't a family trip, it wasn't with a friend.

802
00:44:02,944 --> 00:44:06,663
Speaker 2: It was just me going and giving myself license to

803
00:44:06,824 --> 00:44:09,664
Speaker 2: go explore and self educate. So I went to Paris,

804
00:44:10,064 --> 00:44:12,383
Speaker 2: and then I went to Vienna, and I just went

805
00:44:12,703 --> 00:44:16,943
Speaker 2: to understand the Viennese succession and understand craft. And one

806
00:44:17,024 --> 00:44:19,743
Speaker 2: of the things that I had no idea I was

807
00:44:19,824 --> 00:44:22,503
Speaker 2: going to be smitten by was like falling in love

808
00:44:23,104 --> 00:44:27,104
Speaker 2: with leaded glass, which started in Vienna at the mac

809
00:44:27,223 --> 00:44:31,504
Speaker 2: Museum and walking in and seeing this beautiful grid like

810
00:44:31,623 --> 00:44:36,024
Speaker 2: pattern with this like beautiful craftmanship and metal work and

811
00:44:36,584 --> 00:44:39,823
Speaker 2: hand blown glass, and I just became so smitten with it,

812
00:44:40,303 --> 00:44:43,104
Speaker 2: not really realizing that I had elements of it in

813
00:44:43,223 --> 00:44:46,464
Speaker 2: my apartment and I was planning on demolishing it.

814
00:44:46,544 --> 00:44:47,904
Speaker 1: I didn't appreciate its beauty.

815
00:44:48,104 --> 00:44:50,424
Speaker 2: So, like, I guess what I'm talking of is like

816
00:44:51,223 --> 00:44:54,384
Speaker 2: sometimes there's like these hidden codes and things that you

817
00:44:55,064 --> 00:44:57,983
Speaker 2: see that is triggering something within you, but you don't

818
00:44:58,024 --> 00:45:00,623
Speaker 2: even realize it. And then I didn't know that like

819
00:45:01,263 --> 00:45:05,904
Speaker 2: craft and materiality of the twentieth century is going to

820
00:45:06,143 --> 00:45:08,823
Speaker 2: really be at the cornerstone of my design renovation. But

821
00:45:08,904 --> 00:45:11,623
Speaker 2: it became that from these trips to Paris and Vienna.

822
00:45:11,824 --> 00:45:14,064
Speaker 1: I gave you this book, which I guess is like,

823
00:45:14,384 --> 00:45:18,863
Speaker 1: you know, one of the gospels of that era, findersec

824
00:45:18,984 --> 00:45:20,504
Speaker 1: But do you want me to tell you why? Aside

825
00:45:20,504 --> 00:45:22,104
Speaker 1: from the fact that we share a love of Vienna,

826
00:45:22,544 --> 00:45:25,544
Speaker 1: and this was a little bit in research for the

827
00:45:25,623 --> 00:45:27,984
Speaker 1: Capital One trip that we're doing together, which is like

828
00:45:28,663 --> 00:45:33,703
Speaker 1: chapter two of our travel Friendship collaboration. Yes, but the

829
00:45:33,783 --> 00:45:37,143
Speaker 1: reason I gave it to you without getting too cerebral

830
00:45:37,464 --> 00:45:41,344
Speaker 1: or Viennese intellectual. You know, it's about like an exhaustion

831
00:45:41,824 --> 00:45:45,304
Speaker 1: with the old world and an esthetic and an idea

832
00:45:45,703 --> 00:45:49,703
Speaker 1: in friction with something modern that's coming, and an anxiety

833
00:45:49,904 --> 00:45:53,463
Speaker 1: about being stuck in something else. And I just saw,

834
00:45:53,783 --> 00:45:56,183
Speaker 1: you know, I had you already read it. Yeah, I

835
00:45:56,303 --> 00:45:58,944
Speaker 1: had read it, but years and years ago, when I

836
00:45:59,024 --> 00:46:05,183
Speaker 1: was doing a story for Vogue Living, I skimmed it. Yeah, yeah,

837
00:46:05,384 --> 00:46:09,064
Speaker 1: and then I read Yeah, it's dense, but I kind

838
00:46:09,104 --> 00:46:11,584
Speaker 1: of I did do more on it when we were

839
00:46:11,984 --> 00:46:17,024
Speaker 1: thinking about this particular trip, because everyone says the most

840
00:46:17,064 --> 00:46:21,343
Speaker 1: famous kitchen in America basically from the previous house, you know,

841
00:46:21,424 --> 00:46:23,783
Speaker 1: the or the most pinterest da da da da, And

842
00:46:23,864 --> 00:46:25,424
Speaker 1: I'm I didn't want to talk to you about that

843
00:46:25,504 --> 00:46:28,504
Speaker 1: because it's an evolution. And what I thought about was

844
00:46:28,623 --> 00:46:32,663
Speaker 1: like this idea that there's an exhaustion with the previous

845
00:46:32,824 --> 00:46:36,423
Speaker 1: aesthetic they had, that there's an anxiety about moving into

846
00:46:36,544 --> 00:46:40,464
Speaker 1: the new thing. And I know that this project that

847
00:46:40,623 --> 00:46:44,783
Speaker 1: you've done was like a swing, a challenge, like the

848
00:46:44,864 --> 00:46:48,544
Speaker 1: biggest thing in many ways, and you correct me if

849
00:46:48,544 --> 00:46:51,424
Speaker 1: I'm wrong that you've you've done. You know it was

850
00:46:51,504 --> 00:46:54,584
Speaker 1: a big challenge, and that's the thing of like moving

851
00:46:54,743 --> 00:46:57,783
Speaker 1: to a new aesthetic and evolving. And I that's why

852
00:46:57,904 --> 00:47:00,464
Speaker 1: I wanted to give you that thank you.

853
00:47:00,864 --> 00:47:04,024
Speaker 2: And I really appreciate you kind of seeing that at

854
00:47:04,104 --> 00:47:08,584
Speaker 2: me and honoring or appreciating that, because yeah, I was

855
00:47:09,024 --> 00:47:11,584
Speaker 2: a big divergence, Like most people would have never sold

856
00:47:11,584 --> 00:47:15,024
Speaker 2: to that townhouse, but I needed And it also speaks

857
00:47:15,024 --> 00:47:17,424
Speaker 2: to what we started this conversation about this kind of

858
00:47:18,143 --> 00:47:24,743
Speaker 2: this this drive, this need for newness and you know, evolution.

859
00:47:25,104 --> 00:47:28,343
Speaker 2: And I'm always trying to not reinvent just for the

860
00:47:28,623 --> 00:47:31,703
Speaker 2: sense of reinvention. I'm not doing it to shock other people.

861
00:47:31,743 --> 00:47:32,663
Speaker 1: I'm doing it for me.

862
00:47:32,864 --> 00:47:36,464
Speaker 2: I'm doing it because my curiosity always wants to change

863
00:47:36,504 --> 00:47:40,864
Speaker 2: and evolve. And every time I get to design something,

864
00:47:41,024 --> 00:47:43,463
Speaker 2: if I get to go on this journey of self

865
00:47:43,544 --> 00:47:48,584
Speaker 2: discovery and self education, like I am filled with so much.

866
00:47:49,864 --> 00:47:52,783
Speaker 1: Excitement. And you know that it is the research. I

867
00:47:52,944 --> 00:47:55,224
Speaker 1: love doing the research. And I was not a good student.

868
00:47:55,344 --> 00:47:57,104
Speaker 2: So like the fact that like I get off on

869
00:47:57,424 --> 00:48:02,064
Speaker 2: like diving into and reading and educating and understanding at

870
00:48:02,143 --> 00:48:06,703
Speaker 2: the core what the successionists were, why they were challenging

871
00:48:07,263 --> 00:48:10,024
Speaker 2: the status quo. And you know, I thought it was

872
00:48:10,104 --> 00:48:12,384
Speaker 2: really interesting that you are comparing me to that and

873
00:48:12,504 --> 00:48:14,464
Speaker 2: it felt really special.

874
00:48:14,663 --> 00:48:18,864
Speaker 1: Well I think that, Yeah, I completely believe it. And

875
00:48:18,984 --> 00:48:21,943
Speaker 1: I think with this couple of one project as well,

876
00:48:22,464 --> 00:48:26,823
Speaker 1: you know, it's going to be sharing your our view

877
00:48:27,064 --> 00:48:29,783
Speaker 1: on it. And they're very They're very good to give

878
00:48:29,864 --> 00:48:32,984
Speaker 1: us a big canvas in which to explore that, I

879
00:48:33,064 --> 00:48:37,623
Speaker 1: I should say, and backing in some experiences like doing

880
00:48:37,783 --> 00:48:40,703
Speaker 1: an after hours thing to the mac Museum where you

881
00:48:40,984 --> 00:48:43,024
Speaker 1: I hope I'm going to do a little reading of.

882
00:48:43,584 --> 00:48:46,464
Speaker 2: My next book, yes, which is so it really is

883
00:48:47,104 --> 00:48:51,183
Speaker 2: the unpacking of the creative mind of going on this

884
00:48:51,663 --> 00:48:55,304
Speaker 2: journey of design for this particular apartment, and how travel

885
00:48:55,944 --> 00:49:01,064
Speaker 2: helped inform and made its way through an entirely new lens.

886
00:49:01,663 --> 00:49:03,743
Speaker 2: You know, I'll share so much about how the things

887
00:49:03,824 --> 00:49:06,223
Speaker 2: that I saw in Vienna and the stones I saw

888
00:49:06,344 --> 00:49:09,143
Speaker 2: in Rome and all the places that I've traveled, even

889
00:49:09,303 --> 00:49:11,303
Speaker 2: you know, going last year, I went to Kyota for

890
00:49:11,384 --> 00:49:14,984
Speaker 2: the first time and you know, found this beautiful parchment

891
00:49:15,183 --> 00:49:18,384
Speaker 2: and lacquer work that then informed a furniture collection that

892
00:49:18,464 --> 00:49:23,023
Speaker 2: I'm designing. So it's really just about how both self

893
00:49:23,104 --> 00:49:27,223
Speaker 2: education and this apartment and travel coalice to like push

894
00:49:27,344 --> 00:49:32,464
Speaker 2: me to explore new ideas and new forms and new everything.

895
00:49:32,864 --> 00:49:35,303
Speaker 1: Will you ever think of yourself? I want to as

896
00:49:35,344 --> 00:49:37,944
Speaker 1: a teacher rather than a self educator.

897
00:49:38,143 --> 00:49:42,104
Speaker 2: I do love I'm not a gatekeeper. I love sharing,

898
00:49:42,504 --> 00:49:45,104
Speaker 2: I really and I think that it's because it took

899
00:49:45,183 --> 00:49:47,584
Speaker 2: me a really long time to find myself.

900
00:49:47,743 --> 00:49:48,343
Speaker 1: You know, I wasn't.

901
00:49:48,904 --> 00:49:51,024
Speaker 2: It wasn't until my mid thirties that I really found

902
00:49:51,143 --> 00:49:54,864
Speaker 2: career and like any type of success, and the success

903
00:49:54,904 --> 00:49:58,944
Speaker 2: didn't even come until later. So I asked so many questions,

904
00:49:59,064 --> 00:50:03,944
Speaker 2: Like curiosity is the gift that I would wish on

905
00:50:04,183 --> 00:50:08,544
Speaker 2: everybody to just ask questions. If you don't understand something,

906
00:50:08,663 --> 00:50:12,104
Speaker 2: always like probe and ask and go to other people

907
00:50:12,143 --> 00:50:15,024
Speaker 2: who you admire and have them teach you. And I

908
00:50:15,104 --> 00:50:17,743
Speaker 2: think I've learned so much from other people that I

909
00:50:17,904 --> 00:50:20,183
Speaker 2: do have this I always want to learn, but I

910
00:50:20,303 --> 00:50:22,183
Speaker 2: always want to push it back out into the world

911
00:50:22,263 --> 00:50:24,743
Speaker 2: and share, So there is like a teaching thing.

912
00:50:25,464 --> 00:50:29,664
Speaker 1: And I think about curiosity is that it keeps you vital.

913
00:50:30,623 --> 00:50:34,303
Speaker 1: I read something recently that, you know, people say, you've

914
00:50:34,303 --> 00:50:36,543
Speaker 1: got to practice daily gratitude, which of course is great

915
00:50:36,623 --> 00:50:41,064
Speaker 1: or joy is the thing that will give you a

916
00:50:41,143 --> 00:50:44,104
Speaker 1: long life. But actually there's some kind of study and

917
00:50:44,223 --> 00:50:45,783
Speaker 1: I can't you know, I'm not going to reference it

918
00:50:45,864 --> 00:50:49,104
Speaker 1: because I saw it in passing that said or is

919
00:50:49,183 --> 00:50:52,944
Speaker 1: the thing that will keep you awake and alive in

920
00:50:53,064 --> 00:50:56,064
Speaker 1: this world. And I thought, well, all is curiosity. I mean,

921
00:50:56,263 --> 00:50:59,064
Speaker 1: that's it. That's the two things, and that childlike wonder

922
00:50:59,824 --> 00:51:03,223
Speaker 1: or respect for the beauty and difference of the world

923
00:51:03,344 --> 00:51:06,504
Speaker 1: is honestly for me, the thing ay that's interesting in

924
00:51:06,584 --> 00:51:08,623
Speaker 1: my career, but also I think the thing that keeps

925
00:51:08,663 --> 00:51:11,264
Speaker 1: me like alive, feeling everything.

926
00:51:11,424 --> 00:51:15,143
Speaker 2: That's so beautiful and like, you know, I've said so

927
00:51:15,263 --> 00:51:19,024
Speaker 2: many times that like my greatest I've said this, but

928
00:51:19,183 --> 00:51:21,064
Speaker 2: it comes off negatively, and I don't mean for it

929
00:51:21,143 --> 00:51:23,384
Speaker 2: to come off negatively, but I've said so often that

930
00:51:23,544 --> 00:51:27,623
Speaker 2: my greatest wound is my lack of formal education in design.

931
00:51:27,984 --> 00:51:30,623
Speaker 2: But I actually think it's my greatest gift because it

932
00:51:30,743 --> 00:51:33,863
Speaker 2: keeps me hungry, it keeps that awe. You know, if

933
00:51:33,864 --> 00:51:37,784
Speaker 2: I already knew about the successionists in the Art Deco movement,

934
00:51:37,904 --> 00:51:40,384
Speaker 2: like I wouldn't have thrown myself into this discovery with

935
00:51:40,584 --> 00:51:41,623
Speaker 2: such awe you.

936
00:51:41,663 --> 00:51:44,343
Speaker 1: Know, you know, and this sounds I often say as well.

937
00:51:44,424 --> 00:51:47,743
Speaker 1: Alice Water So I used to work for you know,

938
00:51:47,824 --> 00:51:50,863
Speaker 1: it was several months in, let's say, and she had

939
00:51:50,904 --> 00:51:56,544
Speaker 1: the office Storager, and I overheard her say in reference,

940
00:51:56,623 --> 00:52:00,864
Speaker 1: I think to me, you know what, naivety is powerful

941
00:52:01,504 --> 00:52:04,024
Speaker 1: when harnessed in the right way, and that's not a

942
00:52:04,104 --> 00:52:07,383
Speaker 1: negative thing, No, that's a powerful thing. And I also think,

943
00:52:07,504 --> 00:52:09,864
Speaker 1: like astrology one the gifts that you got to overhear that,

944
00:52:10,464 --> 00:52:13,024
Speaker 1: I agree. Actually I took it as a wound at

945
00:52:13,064 --> 00:52:14,984
Speaker 1: that point. I was like, well, I'm not naive if

946
00:52:14,984 --> 00:52:17,584
Speaker 1: I've just lived in Italy and you know, Australia is

947
00:52:17,623 --> 00:52:19,824
Speaker 1: not the end of the world. It's the fourteenth biggest

948
00:52:19,864 --> 00:52:23,864
Speaker 1: economy and you know I partied in Sydney. But actually

949
00:52:24,024 --> 00:52:26,743
Speaker 1: it's not about like your experience. I mean, it is

950
00:52:26,743 --> 00:52:29,263
Speaker 1: about your experiences as well, but it's also about your

951
00:52:29,663 --> 00:52:32,823
Speaker 1: attitude to life because it's also curiosity and if you

952
00:52:32,984 --> 00:52:35,544
Speaker 1: lose that, I think it's losing a powerful gift. So

953
00:52:35,623 --> 00:52:39,463
Speaker 1: I'm aligned with you a little bit because everyone would

954
00:52:39,584 --> 00:52:44,704
Speaker 1: like to know. Of course, a few of Athena's first

955
00:52:44,783 --> 00:52:51,303
Speaker 1: reactions things that she loves, of course, So I wanted

956
00:52:51,303 --> 00:52:53,584
Speaker 1: to ask you, like a little bit, let's say, a

957
00:52:53,703 --> 00:52:57,424
Speaker 1: lightning round, what's the place that you would always return

958
00:52:57,743 --> 00:53:00,143
Speaker 1: I will always return to Italy, any place in Italy,

959
00:53:00,143 --> 00:53:02,544
Speaker 1: I don't care where. Where's the place that you would

960
00:53:02,584 --> 00:53:03,143
Speaker 1: never go back?

961
00:53:03,743 --> 00:53:06,143
Speaker 2: I really didn't understand Rio when I went, but it

962
00:53:06,263 --> 00:53:07,984
Speaker 2: just might have been that I wasn't with the right people.

963
00:53:08,143 --> 00:53:10,544
Speaker 1: Mm hm, Where do you feel most at home in

964
00:53:10,623 --> 00:53:14,304
Speaker 1: the world. I feel most at home in in Bifa.

965
00:53:15,143 --> 00:53:18,463
Speaker 1: Where's a hotel you could live in? Favorite hotel? Oh?

966
00:53:18,783 --> 00:53:26,064
Speaker 2: Goodness, my favorite hotell. I love the soccer hotel in Vienna.

967
00:53:26,623 --> 00:53:30,463
Speaker 2: It's so different than like my life, right, yeah, well,

968
00:53:31,183 --> 00:53:33,904
Speaker 2: I mean it's different from most people's lives. A restaurant

969
00:53:33,984 --> 00:53:37,783
Speaker 2: or taste that you wish you could experience again, I didn't.

970
00:53:37,544 --> 00:53:38,383
Speaker 1: Grow up eating fish.

971
00:53:38,623 --> 00:53:40,223
Speaker 2: Sorry, I know it's supposed to be a lightning round,

972
00:53:40,263 --> 00:53:43,743
Speaker 2: but being in Greece for the first time and having

973
00:53:43,904 --> 00:53:47,343
Speaker 2: like a whole fish just with exceptional olive oil and

974
00:53:47,663 --> 00:53:49,784
Speaker 2: lemon to me like on a Greek island.

975
00:53:50,263 --> 00:53:55,344
Speaker 1: Great museum, the mac museum and shop or market.

976
00:53:55,944 --> 00:54:00,343
Speaker 2: I will go back to the Roman vegetable market anytime day.

977
00:54:03,024 --> 00:54:07,944
Speaker 1: Where would you spend ideally, complete fantasy, drop everything a

978
00:54:07,984 --> 00:54:12,183
Speaker 1: part of the realities of your life, A week, a month,

979
00:54:12,263 --> 00:54:14,864
Speaker 1: a year, a weekend.

980
00:54:15,904 --> 00:54:17,623
Speaker 2: The first thing that came to mind was going back

981
00:54:17,663 --> 00:54:19,943
Speaker 2: to Vermont. Since my dad passed, I haven't been back,

982
00:54:20,183 --> 00:54:22,344
Speaker 2: so I'd love to go to Vermont for the weekend.

983
00:54:22,743 --> 00:54:25,424
Speaker 2: I want to go back to where we used to

984
00:54:25,504 --> 00:54:30,104
Speaker 2: fish week. I have never been to Iceland, and I

985
00:54:30,223 --> 00:54:31,224
Speaker 2: recently found out.

986
00:54:31,104 --> 00:54:34,383
Speaker 1: How close it is, so yes, for sure.

987
00:54:34,584 --> 00:54:38,504
Speaker 2: Month, I want to go alone to India by myself.

988
00:54:38,904 --> 00:54:41,703
Speaker 1: I got you and a year.

989
00:54:42,743 --> 00:54:45,783
Speaker 2: Well, I will go for multiple years living in the

990
00:54:45,944 --> 00:54:48,504
Speaker 2: countryside in Italy. I want to learn how to speak Italian,

991
00:54:48,663 --> 00:54:50,263
Speaker 2: so that's only going to happen if I spend a

992
00:54:50,384 --> 00:54:50,703
Speaker 2: year there.

993
00:54:50,824 --> 00:54:53,424
Speaker 1: Well, come and visit me in the line. Great, what

994
00:54:53,584 --> 00:54:55,024
Speaker 1: are you traveling through right now?

995
00:54:55,703 --> 00:55:02,343
Speaker 2: I am traveling through growth and expansion and figuring out

996
00:55:03,424 --> 00:55:09,224
Speaker 2: what that looks like of retaining my purity and authenticity

997
00:55:09,344 --> 00:55:13,104
Speaker 2: and humility and also want to to grow and scale

998
00:55:13,344 --> 00:55:13,904
Speaker 2: with grace.

999
00:55:14,663 --> 00:55:19,223
Speaker 1: Amazing, Athena, this has been wonderful, such a great conversation.

1000
00:55:19,783 --> 00:55:20,544
Speaker 1: Thank you, friend,