WEBVTT - Getting Things Done (with Leader Hakeem Jeffries) 0:00:00.720 --> 0:00:03.680 You and Me Both is a production of iHeartRadio. 0:00:05.840 --> 0:00:09.240 I'm Hillary Clinton, and this is You and Me Both. 0:00:09.800 --> 0:00:12.240 I am thrilled to be back for a new season 0:00:12.280 --> 0:00:16.120 of the podcast, and especially delighted we are starting off 0:00:16.280 --> 0:00:20.320 with such a special guest. I've been following the steady 0:00:20.440 --> 0:00:25.079 rise of House Democratic Leader Hakeem Jeffries for some time now, 0:00:25.560 --> 0:00:28.440 through his years in the New York State Assembly, then 0:00:28.480 --> 0:00:32.600 in Congress as a House Manager, overseeing the first impeachment 0:00:32.840 --> 0:00:35.960 of the former president, and as the chair of the 0:00:36.000 --> 0:00:40.640 House Democratic Caucus. But one of the most memorable moments 0:00:40.680 --> 0:00:45.280 in his esteemed career came this past January, just after 0:00:45.360 --> 0:00:50.120 those four chaotic days of in fighting before the House 0:00:50.159 --> 0:00:56.800 Republicans finally elected Kevin McCarthy as Speaker. At the same time, 0:00:57.040 --> 0:01:01.720 Hakim was unanimously chosen by his colleagues to be the 0:01:01.760 --> 0:01:06.400 Democratic Leader, and in his first act in that capacity, 0:01:06.840 --> 0:01:10.320 he took to the podium and offered his vision of 0:01:10.360 --> 0:01:13.360 what Democrats in the House stand for. 0:01:14.040 --> 0:01:20.560 House Democrats will always put American values over autocracy. 0:01:20.720 --> 0:01:21.640 And he did this. 0:01:22.000 --> 0:01:26.280 Let me remind you, in alphabetical order. 0:01:26.120 --> 0:01:34.120 Liberty over limitation, maturity over mar a lago, normalcy over negativity, 0:01:34.680 --> 0:01:36.880 opportunity over obstruction. 0:01:37.880 --> 0:01:41.160 I thought it was an amazing speech, and it perfectly 0:01:41.319 --> 0:01:45.720 demonstrated his unique qualities as a leader, drawing on his 0:01:45.920 --> 0:01:50.720 Brooklyn roots, the Baptist Church, hip hop music, the values 0:01:50.760 --> 0:01:55.760 of his civil servant parents, as well as his skills 0:01:55.920 --> 0:01:59.840 as a litigator and orator. I'm so happy to share 0:01:59.840 --> 0:02:03.080 my conversation with Leader Jeffries with you today. 0:02:04.480 --> 0:02:06.800 Amen a second, theary. How are you good? 0:02:06.840 --> 0:02:07.040 Good? 0:02:07.040 --> 0:02:07.560 How you doing? 0:02:08.360 --> 0:02:10.240 I'm doing great well. 0:02:10.320 --> 0:02:15.800 Let me welcome to the podcast, Congressman Hakim Jeffries. I 0:02:15.840 --> 0:02:19.239 am so excited to speak with you today about a 0:02:19.280 --> 0:02:20.280 whole bunch of things. 0:02:20.320 --> 0:02:23.040 I literally could talk to you for hours, Hakim. 0:02:22.720 --> 0:02:26.480 But I guess we'll try to limit it to, oh, 0:02:26.520 --> 0:02:31.560 you know, your personal history, the future of democracy, what's 0:02:31.600 --> 0:02:34.240 happening in the Congress, and maybe I can, you know, 0:02:34.400 --> 0:02:37.320 let you go before dinner. I'm not sure, but it's 0:02:37.480 --> 0:02:40.040 just such a treat to have you. And let's start 0:02:40.120 --> 0:02:43.840 with your parents, because both of your parents were civil 0:02:43.880 --> 0:02:48.320 servants and I'm wondering how that might have influenced you 0:02:48.720 --> 0:02:52.720 to pursue the career that you are now in. Was 0:02:52.760 --> 0:02:58.200 their dinner table conversations about justice and equity and public service. 0:02:58.560 --> 0:03:00.200 How did it all start. 0:03:00.320 --> 0:03:03.959 You know, growing up in a household with my father, who, 0:03:03.960 --> 0:03:06.560 as you mentioned, and my mother, both of whom were 0:03:06.560 --> 0:03:11.200 public employees throughout the entirety of their careers. My father 0:03:11.400 --> 0:03:14.640 was a substance abuse social worker for the State of 0:03:14.680 --> 0:03:18.560 New York during some trying times for the City of 0:03:18.600 --> 0:03:22.519 New York, including during the nineteen seventies the heroin explosion 0:03:23.120 --> 0:03:25.680 and in the nineteen eighties into the early nineties to 0:03:25.720 --> 0:03:30.240 crack cocaine epidemic, and my mother worked for the Human 0:03:30.280 --> 0:03:34.280 Resources Administration as a case worker. So they were very 0:03:34.360 --> 0:03:38.560 much involved in just trying to be there for people 0:03:38.640 --> 0:03:43.760 who were in many circumstances, going through some adversity and 0:03:43.800 --> 0:03:48.200 trying to get to a better place. And while there 0:03:48.200 --> 0:03:51.760 weren't a lot of conversations around the dinner table about 0:03:52.000 --> 0:03:55.600 politics per se, there weren't a lot of conversations just 0:03:55.680 --> 0:04:00.200 about helping people solve problems. And I think as I 0:04:00.240 --> 0:04:04.440 emerged from law school into the practice of law, a 0:04:04.480 --> 0:04:09.480 lot of the influence of my parents that eventually perhaps 0:04:09.600 --> 0:04:13.720 led me to pursue public service was a desire to 0:04:13.800 --> 0:04:17.760 want to be there for the working class neighborhoods that 0:04:17.839 --> 0:04:21.159 I were raised in Central Brooklyn Crown Heights, but of 0:04:21.200 --> 0:04:25.520 course growing up in Cornerstone Baptist Church and Beford Stuyvesant 0:04:25.960 --> 0:04:28.800 certainly had an impact on me going in the direction 0:04:29.200 --> 0:04:31.200 that I chose to pursue. 0:04:31.440 --> 0:04:34.880 You know, you came of age during the beginning and 0:04:34.960 --> 0:04:39.599 the growth of rap, and I somehow think that's significant. 0:04:39.839 --> 0:04:43.640 You've been known to incorporate rap lyrics into speeches, You're 0:04:43.720 --> 0:04:47.320 known to be a big hip hop fan. Did you 0:04:47.360 --> 0:04:50.280 ever think about being a rap artist yourself? Come on, 0:04:50.640 --> 0:04:52.200 I won't tell anybody well. 0:04:52.080 --> 0:04:56.960 Because it's you, Madame Secretary. I certainly did aspire to 0:04:57.000 --> 0:04:59.480 be a hip hop artist. It didn't quite work out 0:04:59.560 --> 0:05:02.800 for me, but when I was coming up as a 0:05:02.839 --> 0:05:04.680 young man, and you know, in the mid to late 0:05:04.720 --> 0:05:08.240 eighties into the early nineties, there was certainly a point 0:05:08.279 --> 0:05:10.560 of time where I thought that perhaps I had the 0:05:10.600 --> 0:05:13.159 skill set to be able to break through into the 0:05:13.240 --> 0:05:17.080 rap industry. Didn't work out, but it's still a very 0:05:17.160 --> 0:05:21.960 important part of sort of who I've become, and I 0:05:21.960 --> 0:05:25.480 think that connects to what the House of Representatives in 0:05:25.520 --> 0:05:29.479 particular is supposed to represent, which is, as you know, 0:05:29.880 --> 0:05:35.320 the institution closest to the American people to reflect the hopes, 0:05:35.360 --> 0:05:38.640 the dreams, the aspirations, the fears, the concerns, the anxieties, 0:05:38.640 --> 0:05:40.960 and the words of the framers the passions of the 0:05:40.960 --> 0:05:44.800 American people. And so the best representatives in the House 0:05:45.000 --> 0:05:49.200 bring the culture, the vibrancy, the heart, the soul of 0:05:49.240 --> 0:05:53.040 the communities that they represent at home to Washington, d C. 0:05:53.960 --> 0:05:56.599 And for me, a large part of that certainly is 0:05:56.640 --> 0:06:00.559 growing up in Central Brooklyn, growing up in the Baptis Church, 0:06:01.040 --> 0:06:03.719 growing up during the Golden Era, and the coming of 0:06:03.760 --> 0:06:07.720 age of hip hop music, and eventually my own professional 0:06:07.760 --> 0:06:08.960 experiences as a lawyer. 0:06:09.880 --> 0:06:13.600 Well, we saw some of your lawyering skills on a 0:06:13.720 --> 0:06:17.560 very high public platform when you were one of the 0:06:17.640 --> 0:06:20.920 impeachment prosecutors during Trump's presidency. 0:06:21.360 --> 0:06:23.360 You know, I was one of those. 0:06:23.160 --> 0:06:27.400 Who followed that closely, and I'm just wondering why was 0:06:27.440 --> 0:06:30.159 it important to you to be part of that trial. 0:06:30.920 --> 0:06:33.760 Well, I want to thank Speaker Pelosi, of course, as 0:06:33.800 --> 0:06:38.359 I've done so repeatedly, for her embracing my journey in 0:06:38.360 --> 0:06:41.920 a variety of different ways, including giving me the opportunity 0:06:42.000 --> 0:06:45.479 to serve as an impeachment manager during that first impeachment trial, 0:06:45.760 --> 0:06:48.920 where we were working hard to really begin the process 0:06:49.080 --> 0:06:53.120 of vindicating the principle that in America no one is 0:06:53.120 --> 0:06:57.120 above the law. And in that particular case, you had 0:06:57.160 --> 0:07:00.880 the former president who, in our view, engaged in the 0:07:00.960 --> 0:07:05.039 corrupt abuse of power as part of the beginning of 0:07:05.080 --> 0:07:08.840 his effort to try to manipulate the twenty twenty presidential 0:07:08.920 --> 0:07:15.800 election by encouraging a foreign country, Ukraine, pressuring them to 0:07:15.920 --> 0:07:20.280 target an American citizen, Joe Biden, and doing so in 0:07:21.120 --> 0:07:25.360 one of the most unfortunate ways, which is basically a 0:07:25.520 --> 0:07:31.440 geopolitical shakedown of Ukraine, by withholding hundreds of millions of 0:07:31.520 --> 0:07:36.720 dollars in defense support, with Russia knocking at the door 0:07:36.800 --> 0:07:40.440 wanting to overrun Ukraine as we've now seen they've endeavored 0:07:40.480 --> 0:07:40.760 to do. 0:07:41.440 --> 0:07:45.840 It must have been very challenging in the circumstances in 0:07:45.880 --> 0:07:50.480 which you and the other House impeachment managers found yourselves 0:07:50.800 --> 0:07:55.040 to just see the naked partisanship that the evidence, the law, 0:07:55.480 --> 0:08:00.440 the clear intention of what the former president was doing 0:08:01.400 --> 0:08:05.720 made little to no impact on the Republicans in the Senate. 0:08:06.120 --> 0:08:09.960 Did any of them or any of your Republican colleagues 0:08:10.400 --> 0:08:15.920 in the House ever say to you, Congressman that yeah, look, 0:08:15.960 --> 0:08:18.400 they knew it was a problem, but they just couldn't 0:08:18.480 --> 0:08:22.760 take the kind of radical action that was required to 0:08:22.840 --> 0:08:24.320 hold Trump accountable. 0:08:25.200 --> 0:08:29.440 At the time, there were some Republicans who would express 0:08:29.560 --> 0:08:35.520 concern with what they viewed as inappropriate conduct by Donald Trump, 0:08:35.559 --> 0:08:40.040 but did largely take the position that it didn't rise 0:08:40.160 --> 0:08:42.640 to the level of an impeachable offense. And I think 0:08:42.640 --> 0:08:46.440 they were looking through glasses that were rose colored in 0:08:46.480 --> 0:08:51.240 that regard based on partisanship, So that was quite unfortunate. 0:08:51.320 --> 0:08:54.640 But we understood that there were three things that we 0:08:54.720 --> 0:08:58.440 needed to do in presenting the case. We needed to 0:08:58.480 --> 0:09:02.560 make the case to the Senate sitting as a court 0:09:02.640 --> 0:09:06.080 in judgment of the president. We needed to present the 0:09:06.120 --> 0:09:08.880 case to the American people. But we also needed to 0:09:08.880 --> 0:09:11.280 present the case for the historical record. 0:09:11.760 --> 0:09:15.240 I think that's a very important reminder that what you 0:09:15.320 --> 0:09:18.800 were doing, in my view, was as much for history 0:09:19.200 --> 0:09:23.800 as anything, to demonstrate clearly the very disturbing behavior of 0:09:23.840 --> 0:09:27.800 the former president. And in this fast paced world we 0:09:27.880 --> 0:09:31.160 find ourselves these days, I think it's good to remind 0:09:31.200 --> 0:09:35.800 ourselves that building a case, building a record, making a 0:09:35.840 --> 0:09:39.520 commitment to truth and to getting it out there, even 0:09:39.559 --> 0:09:45.280 if it doesn't have the desired effect immediately, is critically important. 0:09:45.760 --> 0:09:48.240 I think that's exactly right. And the thing that I'd 0:09:48.240 --> 0:09:51.160 point out as well is that I think it was 0:09:51.200 --> 0:09:53.679 doctor King who once said the time is always right 0:09:53.760 --> 0:09:57.200 to do what's right, And the way I interpret that 0:09:57.320 --> 0:10:01.520 is that even if the immediate results that you yield 0:10:01.880 --> 0:10:07.120 aren't what you are aiming to accomplish, eventually you're going 0:10:07.200 --> 0:10:10.080 to get to the right place. But it has to 0:10:10.120 --> 0:10:15.120 start by leaning in and just elevating truth and facts 0:10:15.480 --> 0:10:19.680 and perspective, even if some people throughout the country aren't ready. 0:10:19.440 --> 0:10:22.600 To receive it well, or, as scripture tells us, do 0:10:22.720 --> 0:10:26.840 not grow weary in doing good, because eventually you will 0:10:27.280 --> 0:10:32.720 reap the harvest. But sometimes there are difficult boulders in 0:10:32.760 --> 0:10:36.640 your path, and that's particularly true in your position as 0:10:36.679 --> 0:10:39.960 a leader. You've been both an unofficial and now official 0:10:40.080 --> 0:10:43.440 leader in the party for years, and I'm just wondering, 0:10:43.800 --> 0:10:48.080 you know, what did Speaker Pelosi have to tell you 0:10:48.320 --> 0:10:52.760 or advise you when she passed that leadership baton. I've 0:10:52.800 --> 0:10:56.240 known her, as you well know, for many, many years, 0:10:56.360 --> 0:10:59.840 and there really isn't a shrewder mind and a more 0:11:00.160 --> 0:11:05.160 effective political organizer in the Democratic Party and certainly one 0:11:05.160 --> 0:11:09.080 of the most successful speakers in our country's history. 0:11:09.880 --> 0:11:12.720 But our question, I thinks you will go down as 0:11:12.720 --> 0:11:15.520 certainly the greatest speaker of all time and what she's 0:11:15.559 --> 0:11:19.200 been able to deliver for the American people even with 0:11:19.480 --> 0:11:23.760 narrow majorities in the House. But what I've learned from 0:11:23.840 --> 0:11:27.120 her throughout the years and as we made the transition, 0:11:27.559 --> 0:11:30.160 is that you know, it's important to find the highest 0:11:30.200 --> 0:11:34.920 common denominator now prior to that, it often involves some 0:11:35.160 --> 0:11:39.800 enthusiastic debates. That happening, and we win no stranger to 0:11:39.960 --> 0:11:43.480 enthusiastic debates, particularly in the House of Representatives. That's true, 0:11:43.520 --> 0:11:47.160 and we kind of work through those family dynamics. But 0:11:47.520 --> 0:11:49.960 at the end of the day, what's always been important 0:11:49.960 --> 0:11:52.480 in terms of Speaker Pelosi's leadership, and I've tried to 0:11:52.559 --> 0:11:56.160 follow along in this regard, is there comes a point 0:11:56.160 --> 0:11:58.160 where you have to make a decision to go forward, 0:11:58.800 --> 0:12:00.880 and we make that decision, and to go forward, you 0:12:01.000 --> 0:12:04.400 do that by finding the highest common denominator a months 0:12:04.440 --> 0:12:07.800 a variety of different perspectives, and in my view, you 0:12:08.000 --> 0:12:11.360 then advance the ball make the progress that you can 0:12:11.400 --> 0:12:14.600 make and where you fall short, you live to fight 0:12:14.640 --> 0:12:19.240 another day. As America continues on March, total more perfect Union. 0:12:22.320 --> 0:12:23.560 We're taking a quick break. 0:12:23.720 --> 0:12:34.600 Stay with us, just like you. 0:12:34.840 --> 0:12:39.199 I've been criticized by some that quote I'm not progressive enough. 0:12:39.679 --> 0:12:42.920 In response to that, I said back in the twenty 0:12:43.000 --> 0:12:46.600 sixteen campaign, I'm a progressive who likes to get things done. 0:12:47.360 --> 0:12:51.040 So for my views on your leadership, I think you're 0:12:51.040 --> 0:12:54.200 playing it exactly right. But I think a lot of 0:12:54.240 --> 0:12:59.800 people don't fully appreciate the extraordinary balancing act that you 0:12:59.840 --> 0:13:03.680 and Gauge an every day to keep your caucus together. 0:13:03.800 --> 0:13:07.800 And it's been miraculous how united it has been. And 0:13:08.040 --> 0:13:11.240 I give you big, you know, plaudits for that, but 0:13:11.280 --> 0:13:14.320 maybe give us a little inside view of how you 0:13:14.400 --> 0:13:16.920 do that every day, because that's the real key to 0:13:17.240 --> 0:13:22.240 leadership in a big, contentious, pluralistic body like the House 0:13:22.320 --> 0:13:23.559 Democratic Caucus. 0:13:23.960 --> 0:13:26.560 Well, some people may say that the House is, you know, 0:13:26.640 --> 0:13:31.080 by nature, a chaotic institution, and I don't disagree with 0:13:31.120 --> 0:13:35.920 that sentiment. I do think that whoever organizes the dynamic 0:13:36.040 --> 0:13:41.760 chaos the best yields the best results, and from my standpoint, 0:13:42.200 --> 0:13:46.040 the way to try to do that is to authentically 0:13:46.280 --> 0:13:50.880 value the perspectives of every single member of the House 0:13:50.880 --> 0:13:54.520 Democratic Caucus, from the most progressive member on one end 0:13:54.559 --> 0:13:58.400 of the spectrum representative of Ocasio Cortes, to the most 0:13:58.440 --> 0:14:02.160 moderate centrist member like a John Scottheimer, and all points 0:14:02.160 --> 0:14:07.280 in between, and to really listen, to authentically value the 0:14:07.360 --> 0:14:09.959 fact that they each, along with every other member of 0:14:10.000 --> 0:14:12.680 the House Democratic Caucus, was elected to do a job 0:14:13.120 --> 0:14:16.000 on behalf of the communities that their privileged to represent. 0:14:16.720 --> 0:14:21.440 To have those conversations sometimes noisy ones amongst us as 0:14:21.440 --> 0:14:24.960 a group collectively, but to always be guided by that 0:14:25.120 --> 0:14:29.440 north star of finding common ground to advance the ball 0:14:30.000 --> 0:14:33.760 for the American people. And I think as I transitioned 0:14:33.800 --> 0:14:36.480 into this position having served as Chair of the House 0:14:36.520 --> 0:14:39.320 Democratic Caucus for four years, where I did have the 0:14:39.360 --> 0:14:43.720 responsibility to interact with individual members and the different parts 0:14:43.720 --> 0:14:47.359 of the Democratic Caucus. And we've got everything from progressives 0:14:47.400 --> 0:14:50.240 to New Dems, to Blue Dogs to problem solvers, to 0:14:50.280 --> 0:14:53.280 the Congression of Black Caucus, the Congression of the Vanic Caucus, 0:14:53.520 --> 0:14:56.960 the Asian and Pacific Islander Caucus, the Women's Caucus, the 0:14:57.120 --> 0:15:00.920 LGBTQ Caucus. We got it all. And that's the beauty 0:15:01.240 --> 0:15:04.240 of what we are as House Democrats, And it's like, 0:15:04.280 --> 0:15:08.800 how do you bring the orchestra together? You respect everyone's 0:15:09.040 --> 0:15:12.080 craft as individuals, but know that you can make the 0:15:12.120 --> 0:15:15.200 best possible music when at the end of the day 0:15:15.520 --> 0:15:16.920 we're all working together. 0:15:17.680 --> 0:15:20.640 I love that metaphor the orchestra. That's a great way 0:15:20.680 --> 0:15:21.640 of talking about it. 0:15:22.120 --> 0:15:22.320 You know. 0:15:22.400 --> 0:15:24.840 I know one of the key issues you are passionate 0:15:24.840 --> 0:15:28.920 about is criminal justice reform. And you've actually made some 0:15:29.000 --> 0:15:33.440 progress now, and you did so with some Republican bipartisan support. 0:15:34.000 --> 0:15:38.640 So what is next in the reform agenda for helping 0:15:38.680 --> 0:15:43.480 to create a more equitable, just criminal justice system. 0:15:43.920 --> 0:15:45.840 Well, I was delighted to be able to be part 0:15:45.880 --> 0:15:49.320 of the effort a few years ago to work on 0:15:49.520 --> 0:15:53.280 criminal justice reform in a bipartisan way, to try to 0:15:53.600 --> 0:15:56.320 roll back some of the excesses of what I think 0:15:56.560 --> 0:15:59.120 most people would view as the failed War on drugs, 0:15:59.640 --> 0:16:02.080 and to to get us to a better place where 0:16:02.080 --> 0:16:06.040 we both were leaning into public safety, but also helping 0:16:06.080 --> 0:16:12.200 people successfully transition back into society, become productive citizens, save 0:16:12.360 --> 0:16:17.640 taxpayer dollars, and provide individuals with the skills, the education, 0:16:18.480 --> 0:16:23.040 the mental health intervention to be able to be successful 0:16:23.400 --> 0:16:26.960 as returning citizens, and we were able to find a 0:16:27.000 --> 0:16:30.880 path forward, eventually resulting in the first step back that 0:16:30.960 --> 0:16:34.200 brought together Democrats and Republicans, the left and the right, 0:16:34.600 --> 0:16:37.600 the ACLU and the Koch Brothers, the NAACP and the 0:16:37.640 --> 0:16:42.040 Heritage Foundation, and all points in between. And it was 0:16:42.160 --> 0:16:45.200 part of an approach that while you were in the Senate, 0:16:45.240 --> 0:16:49.680 Manham Secretary, you leaned into this aggressively as well, bringing 0:16:49.840 --> 0:16:53.560 together what I would call a coalition of the unusual suspects. 0:16:54.080 --> 0:16:56.360 And when you can do that, you can really make 0:16:56.440 --> 0:17:01.040 legislative magic and capture the attention and imagination of the 0:17:01.080 --> 0:17:04.560 American people. And one of the reasons why it's possible 0:17:04.560 --> 0:17:06.840 to do that and why I think there are future 0:17:06.880 --> 0:17:11.560 opportunities in the criminal justice reform space is because Democrats 0:17:11.600 --> 0:17:16.080 and Republicans have arrived at the need to deal with 0:17:16.359 --> 0:17:21.000 over criminalization and mass incarceration in America connected to their 0:17:21.040 --> 0:17:25.440 own authentic ideologies, you know, as democrats and progressives. Many 0:17:25.480 --> 0:17:29.240 of us arrive at that place because of views of 0:17:30.000 --> 0:17:34.159 social justice or racial justice or economic justice, and this 0:17:34.320 --> 0:17:37.000 concept of liberty and justice for all in America and 0:17:37.000 --> 0:17:39.280 bringing that to life for the greatest number of people, 0:17:40.119 --> 0:17:43.560 But many of my Republican colleagues have authentically got to 0:17:43.600 --> 0:17:48.040 the same place, perhaps for different reasons, but those reasons 0:17:48.080 --> 0:17:52.359 are authentic to them. Fiscal conservatives concluding that billions of 0:17:52.400 --> 0:17:56.520 dollars in mass incarceration without resulting public safety benefits is 0:17:56.560 --> 0:17:59.880 a failed government program and a waste of taxpayer dollars. 0:18:00.640 --> 0:18:03.480 Many of the religious right and the Christian conservatives who 0:18:03.480 --> 0:18:05.720 have been involved in this effort have come to that 0:18:05.880 --> 0:18:10.560 place that everyone in society deserves a second chance, that 0:18:10.600 --> 0:18:13.359 we all fall short in the eyes of the Lord, 0:18:13.880 --> 0:18:17.520 and the libertarians have concluded individuals like Ram Paul, who 0:18:17.520 --> 0:18:19.520 I may disagree with on a whole host of issues, 0:18:19.520 --> 0:18:24.400 but on criminal justice reform, we're in lockstep because they 0:18:24.520 --> 0:18:28.280 generally don't like what they view as government overreach, and 0:18:28.359 --> 0:18:30.040 all of us have been able to make the case 0:18:30.080 --> 0:18:33.760 that if you don't like government overreach, one of the 0:18:33.800 --> 0:18:36.840 areas where it can be particularly damaging to the American 0:18:36.880 --> 0:18:41.240 people is when the government can, unjustifiably in some instances, 0:18:41.320 --> 0:18:44.800 take away your life or your liberty. And so, because 0:18:45.240 --> 0:18:50.080 we have authentically arrived at the same place, there's certainly 0:18:50.119 --> 0:18:54.440 an opportunity to continue to move forward. I think some 0:18:54.480 --> 0:18:58.359 of the efforts around making sure when someone has paid 0:18:58.359 --> 0:19:01.320 their debt to society, they don't have to wear that 0:19:01.600 --> 0:19:05.600 record around their neck like a scarlet letter is a 0:19:05.640 --> 0:19:08.960 place where many Democrats and Republicans, I think, are trying 0:19:09.000 --> 0:19:11.680 to get to. So this is a space that I'm 0:19:11.800 --> 0:19:16.040 very cautiously optimistic about our ability to continue to find 0:19:16.040 --> 0:19:18.040 common ground and do what's right for the American people 0:19:18.040 --> 0:19:19.120 and American families. 0:19:19.359 --> 0:19:23.560 Well, it's so important that you continue this effort. You know, 0:19:23.600 --> 0:19:26.480 a critique we Democrats get all the time is that 0:19:26.600 --> 0:19:30.600 somehow our messaging is just not as clear, as strong, 0:19:30.840 --> 0:19:35.200 as powerful, impactful. You name whatever adjective you want as 0:19:35.240 --> 0:19:38.600 the other side, So, Leader, what is the pitch that 0:19:38.720 --> 0:19:42.080 you're trying to make for the party right now as 0:19:42.119 --> 0:19:46.280 we are getting geared up for the critically important election 0:19:46.400 --> 0:19:47.480 of twenty twenty four. 0:19:48.200 --> 0:19:50.680 Well, we're going to continue to put people over politics 0:19:51.320 --> 0:19:54.240 and to fight for things that are important to the 0:19:54.280 --> 0:19:58.359 American people. Lower costs, better paying jobs, safer communities. Fight 0:19:58.400 --> 0:20:01.159 for reproductive freedom because we believe in a woman's freedom 0:20:01.200 --> 0:20:05.160 to make our own reproductive health care decisions. Defend democracy, 0:20:05.240 --> 0:20:09.399 protect and strengthen social Security and Medicare, and certainly build 0:20:09.400 --> 0:20:12.120 an economy from the middle out and the bottom up 0:20:12.200 --> 0:20:17.040 that works for everyday Americans. You are right, Madame Secretary, 0:20:17.080 --> 0:20:21.840 that we as Democrats, haven't always been as precise and 0:20:21.880 --> 0:20:25.600 surgical in how we communicate with the American people. The 0:20:25.640 --> 0:20:29.840 big challenge often has been from a messaging standpoint that 0:20:30.400 --> 0:20:33.720 Republicans talk in headlines and Democrats talk and fine print. 0:20:34.040 --> 0:20:37.880 And it comes from a good place as Democrats, because 0:20:37.920 --> 0:20:41.399 if you care about governing, then you have to master 0:20:41.880 --> 0:20:46.560 the fine print. And throughout the years we've done a 0:20:46.560 --> 0:20:49.240 pretty good job at that as Democrats, going all the 0:20:49.240 --> 0:20:54.320 way back to FDR's presidency, from Social Security to rural electrification, 0:20:55.000 --> 0:20:59.680 then Medicare and Medicaid and headstart Civil Rights Act, the 0:20:59.760 --> 0:21:03.040 Vote Rights Act, the Fair Housing Act, the Elementary and 0:21:03.080 --> 0:21:06.720 Secondary School Act, the Higher Education Act, the Affordable Care Act, 0:21:07.440 --> 0:21:10.800 the American Rescue Plan, the Infrastructure Investment in Jobs Act, 0:21:10.800 --> 0:21:14.199 the Chips and Science Act, a gun safety legislation, and 0:21:14.240 --> 0:21:16.800 the Safer Communities Act, all the way through to the 0:21:16.800 --> 0:21:20.840 Inflation Reduction Act, all brought to you by your friendly 0:21:21.040 --> 0:21:26.480 neighborhood Democratic Party. That's an incredible track record of success 0:21:26.880 --> 0:21:29.679 and in order to do it, you have to master 0:21:29.920 --> 0:21:33.320 the fine print. But what we've said is, at the 0:21:33.359 --> 0:21:38.480 same time, while you govern and find print, you message, 0:21:38.520 --> 0:21:42.399 you persuade, you communicate in headlines, and we've got to 0:21:42.520 --> 0:21:45.840 draw that distinction between the two. And I think over 0:21:45.840 --> 0:21:48.080 the last few years we've gotten better at doing that, 0:21:48.600 --> 0:21:51.280 and certainly as we approach the twenty twenty four election, 0:21:51.680 --> 0:21:54.399 where we'll be having a real conversation with the American 0:21:54.400 --> 0:21:57.200 people about the differences at this moment between the two parties, 0:21:57.720 --> 0:22:02.480 we've got to lean into those compelling headlines when we 0:22:02.560 --> 0:22:03.480 have that conversation. 0:22:04.000 --> 0:22:07.960 Well, you've convinced me, I don't know that I'm your 0:22:08.000 --> 0:22:08.840 target audience. 0:22:15.240 --> 0:22:16.160 We'll be right back. 0:22:25.160 --> 0:22:27.639 Everyone who knows you, who has seen you in action, 0:22:28.480 --> 0:22:33.560 marvels at how you're able to stay so calm under pressure. 0:22:33.760 --> 0:22:36.280 Does that come naturally to you or is it something 0:22:36.320 --> 0:22:38.520 you've had to work on over the years. 0:22:38.840 --> 0:22:41.400 I certainly think that it's important for all of us 0:22:41.960 --> 0:22:44.920 in public office, particularly during a fraught time where we're 0:22:44.920 --> 0:22:49.640 dealing with a lot of extremism and incoming fire and 0:22:49.680 --> 0:22:55.040 people critiquing your every move, as you've experienced throughout your career, 0:22:55.119 --> 0:22:58.080 all of us who are in the arena experience. But 0:22:58.160 --> 0:23:00.560 what I've concluded one is an honor and a privilege 0:23:00.960 --> 0:23:04.160 to be able to be in this position of trying 0:23:04.160 --> 0:23:06.760 to make a difference in the lives of people in 0:23:06.800 --> 0:23:09.879 Brooklyn and New York City and throughout the country and 0:23:09.960 --> 0:23:12.159 communicating with some of my colleagues. And I was just 0:23:12.240 --> 0:23:16.359 having this conversation with a very high ranking democrat the 0:23:16.400 --> 0:23:19.240 other day. I said, you know, when you think about 0:23:19.480 --> 0:23:24.360 the best quarterbacks in the NFL, they don't get jittery 0:23:24.760 --> 0:23:28.040 in the pocket when the pressure comes, even when you 0:23:28.080 --> 0:23:33.040 have three hundred pound defensive alignment and super strong linebackers 0:23:33.119 --> 0:23:36.240 heading in their direction. They stay in that pocket. They're calm, 0:23:36.280 --> 0:23:40.399 cool and collected, and with the greatest degree of precision 0:23:40.600 --> 0:23:44.960 possible try to get that ball to their receivers in 0:23:45.000 --> 0:23:48.080 a way that allows the team to move forward. And 0:23:48.320 --> 0:23:50.440 I think all of us who are in this position 0:23:50.920 --> 0:23:55.320 when the pressure comes, understanding, as Tom Brady and others understood, 0:23:55.359 --> 0:23:56.960 there will be times that you're going to get hit, 0:23:57.040 --> 0:23:59.320 it's going to get a little rough, but you can 0:23:59.359 --> 0:24:02.280 have success as long as when you're in the pocket, 0:24:02.520 --> 0:24:06.320 you stay calm and focused on releasing the ball, getting 0:24:06.320 --> 0:24:08.960 it to a receiver and hopefully getting it into the 0:24:09.000 --> 0:24:11.200 end zone. And we're trying to get it into the 0:24:11.280 --> 0:24:13.200 end zone on behalf of the American people. 0:24:14.840 --> 0:24:18.880 Well, let's use that football analogy because that does connect 0:24:18.880 --> 0:24:21.040 with a lot of people, you know, and boy do 0:24:21.119 --> 0:24:24.159 I relate to it. It is a little challenging in 0:24:24.200 --> 0:24:29.240 these times when people get their kicks off of insults 0:24:29.280 --> 0:24:32.920 and attacks, to stay calm and try to keep delivering. 0:24:33.359 --> 0:24:36.800 So now you are a legislator, you are a leader, 0:24:36.920 --> 0:24:39.480 you are a husband, and you are the father of 0:24:39.520 --> 0:24:43.000 two sons. So how do you balance your work in 0:24:43.080 --> 0:24:45.520 public life with your family life? And you know, I'm 0:24:45.520 --> 0:24:49.240 starting to ask all of my male guests this question 0:24:49.760 --> 0:24:52.800 because ordinarily this is a question you only ask women 0:24:52.880 --> 0:24:56.720 who are doing something in the public arena. 0:24:56.920 --> 0:25:00.000 It's a wonderful question. And you know, when one person 0:25:00.160 --> 0:25:02.800 and serves, the entire family serves. And that's just part 0:25:02.800 --> 0:25:05.560 of the reality of the moment that we're in. But 0:25:05.640 --> 0:25:07.520 I think all of us and I've tried to take 0:25:07.560 --> 0:25:11.000 this approach from the very beginning, try to shield, you know, 0:25:11.040 --> 0:25:13.360 our family from the rough and tumble of it all, 0:25:13.880 --> 0:25:18.359 and try to be there for our families, particularly during 0:25:18.520 --> 0:25:22.520