1 00:00:02,160 --> 00:00:05,040 Speaker 1: Ephemeral is a production of My Heart three D audio 2 00:00:06,760 --> 00:00:15,720 Speaker 1: for fell exposure. Listen What's that phones. On the last 3 00:00:15,720 --> 00:00:19,640 Speaker 1: episode of Ephemeral, we traced the dynamic history of video games, 4 00:00:20,200 --> 00:00:23,200 Speaker 1: starting with arcades. We looked at how games like Pong 5 00:00:23,480 --> 00:00:28,520 Speaker 1: and Donkey Kong changed the entertainment industry forever and eventually 6 00:00:29,000 --> 00:00:31,880 Speaker 1: how those games left the arcades and landed in the 7 00:00:31,920 --> 00:00:36,640 Speaker 1: homes of consumers across the globe. Here, our producer Max 8 00:00:36,680 --> 00:00:41,640 Speaker 1: Williams picks up the story. In the nineteen eighties, home 9 00:00:41,680 --> 00:00:47,360 Speaker 1: consoles like the Supernintendo and the Atari revolutionize the gaming market, 10 00:00:47,880 --> 00:00:50,840 Speaker 1: and in the late eighties and early nineties the competition 11 00:00:50,920 --> 00:00:55,840 Speaker 1: between these companies starting to heat up. In nineteen Sega 12 00:00:55,920 --> 00:01:00,640 Speaker 1: released their mega hit console, the Sega Genesis. The Genesis 13 00:01:00,720 --> 00:01:05,200 Speaker 1: has blast processing. Super Nintendo doesn't. So what's blast processing do? 14 00:01:11,400 --> 00:01:13,480 Speaker 1: And here's where it gets narrowed, because now all of 15 00:01:13,520 --> 00:01:16,679 Speaker 1: a sudden to we have a really competitive console. You 16 00:01:16,760 --> 00:01:19,560 Speaker 1: still had a Tori bumbling along. They had a thing 17 00:01:19,560 --> 00:01:27,319 Speaker 1: called the Jaguar, which they maintained was the first sixty 18 00:01:27,319 --> 00:01:30,120 Speaker 1: four bit system and it never got off the ground. 19 00:01:30,640 --> 00:01:33,720 Speaker 1: And then there was the three D O which was 20 00:01:33,760 --> 00:01:39,440 Speaker 1: too expensive. This is video games writer Steven L. Kent, 21 00:01:39,800 --> 00:01:43,199 Speaker 1: who we talked to in the last episode. Neo Geo 22 00:01:43,360 --> 00:01:50,080 Speaker 1: had a home console that wasn't really competitive. Stephen says 23 00:01:50,080 --> 00:01:53,760 Speaker 1: that Nintendo, the biggest player in the game's market, responded 24 00:01:53,800 --> 00:02:02,720 Speaker 1: to the Second Genesis by releasing the Nintendo sixty. So 25 00:02:02,960 --> 00:02:07,320 Speaker 1: by the time that the n s D four comes out, now, 26 00:02:07,360 --> 00:02:10,400 Speaker 1: all of a sudden, people think it's gonna be Sega 27 00:02:10,720 --> 00:02:15,200 Speaker 1: versus Nintendo, especially because Sega has this arcade game out 28 00:02:15,360 --> 00:02:18,919 Speaker 1: right now called Virtual Fighter, and all of a sudden, 29 00:02:18,919 --> 00:02:21,480 Speaker 1: they're gonna be a lot more competitive in Japan with 30 00:02:21,600 --> 00:02:26,240 Speaker 1: Virtual Fighter than they had been the past. But no 31 00:02:26,240 --> 00:02:29,120 Speaker 1: one predicted that the next giant to enter the arena 32 00:02:29,440 --> 00:02:34,320 Speaker 1: would be Sony and their consul, the Sony PlayStation. And 33 00:02:34,400 --> 00:02:38,360 Speaker 1: I don't think that people realized how serious Sony was. 34 00:02:39,120 --> 00:02:42,800 Speaker 1: Sony had this Midas touch. They ruled the TV market. 35 00:02:43,160 --> 00:02:46,880 Speaker 1: Tony Trinitron has Sony is exclusive one Gun Picture two 36 00:02:47,040 --> 00:02:51,880 Speaker 1: for the ultimate in brightness, sharpness, contrast, and color. He's 37 00:02:51,919 --> 00:02:57,639 Speaker 1: a very red the dazzling array of colors Sony Trinitron 38 00:02:58,440 --> 00:03:01,800 Speaker 1: Picture Perfect. They rule the stereo market. I don't know 39 00:03:01,840 --> 00:03:05,120 Speaker 1: a tweeter from a Wolfer from a Twitter. So I 40 00:03:05,160 --> 00:03:09,200 Speaker 1: bought the Sony Compact Stereo. So on the one hand, 41 00:03:09,480 --> 00:03:13,000 Speaker 1: that makes them formidable. But on the other hand, maybe 42 00:03:13,000 --> 00:03:15,679 Speaker 1: they're not gonna be so committed. If things don't work out, 43 00:03:15,880 --> 00:03:18,399 Speaker 1: they'll just go their merry way and make a new 44 00:03:18,440 --> 00:03:26,280 Speaker 1: Walkman instead. The Sony Walkman is that tiny stereocassette player 45 00:03:26,480 --> 00:03:35,000 Speaker 1: with truly incredible sound. Put on a Walkman and see 46 00:03:35,040 --> 00:03:39,680 Speaker 1: the world in a whole new light, the Walkman from Sony. 47 00:03:39,800 --> 00:03:43,839 Speaker 1: The one and only executives of thing I could see 48 00:03:43,880 --> 00:03:46,320 Speaker 1: that the writing on the wall, they'd seen enough from 49 00:03:46,320 --> 00:03:49,800 Speaker 1: Sony to realize Sony had quite an offering after all. 50 00:03:50,160 --> 00:03:53,800 Speaker 1: So in the United States they compounded the problem by 51 00:03:53,960 --> 00:03:57,040 Speaker 1: rushing to market. It was supposed to come out on 52 00:03:57,200 --> 00:04:02,200 Speaker 1: September two, Sega Saturday and Saturday September two, then instead 53 00:04:02,240 --> 00:04:05,320 Speaker 1: they released it as a surprise and E three in May, 54 00:04:05,520 --> 00:04:09,119 Speaker 1: making every possible mistake you could make. First of all, 55 00:04:09,440 --> 00:04:13,480 Speaker 1: they released it a few selected retailers, which meant that 56 00:04:13,720 --> 00:04:15,600 Speaker 1: if your toys r US you got something to sell. 57 00:04:15,640 --> 00:04:18,200 Speaker 1: But if you're kV Toys, which actually had more stores, 58 00:04:18,600 --> 00:04:22,880 Speaker 1: you didn't get in and you were passed. Some retailers 59 00:04:23,200 --> 00:04:26,880 Speaker 1: responded by throwing Sega out of their stores. The next 60 00:04:26,920 --> 00:04:30,880 Speaker 1: thing is only in five games, but the packings were wonderful. 61 00:04:31,480 --> 00:04:35,360 Speaker 1: Virtual Fighter Too was fabulous when it came out in Japan, 62 00:04:35,400 --> 00:04:40,120 Speaker 1: it was a huge seller. Then Sony came out with PlayStation. 63 00:04:40,680 --> 00:04:42,839 Speaker 1: It did much better than people thought, but didn't so 64 00:04:42,920 --> 00:04:45,800 Speaker 1: as well as the Saturn. But then it came to 65 00:04:45,839 --> 00:04:49,560 Speaker 1: the United States and people were wild about it, and 66 00:04:49,800 --> 00:04:53,120 Speaker 1: sixty four wouldn't come out for another year. And by 67 00:04:53,120 --> 00:04:56,479 Speaker 1: the time end sixty four did, PlayStation was on such 68 00:04:56,480 --> 00:04:59,039 Speaker 1: a trajectory that no one else would kept up to it. 69 00:05:01,200 --> 00:05:06,280 Speaker 1: So what made the Sony PlayStation so special? The first 70 00:05:06,360 --> 00:05:11,200 Speaker 1: PlayStation was brilliantly designed. Sony gave you a hundred thousand 71 00:05:11,320 --> 00:05:16,159 Speaker 1: colleagons per second. Nintendo trying to compete by giving you 72 00:05:16,360 --> 00:05:20,400 Speaker 1: more textures. But if you looked at games on the PlayStation, 73 00:05:20,440 --> 00:05:24,000 Speaker 1: they looked better. Games on and sixty four looked like 74 00:05:24,040 --> 00:05:27,400 Speaker 1: they were inflated toys. They had that rounded, sort of 75 00:05:27,480 --> 00:05:33,200 Speaker 1: puffy look. The PlayStation also made a smart business move 76 00:05:33,520 --> 00:05:36,960 Speaker 1: in terms of its format. It was the first major 77 00:05:37,000 --> 00:05:41,359 Speaker 1: console to use disks rather than cartridges. That was a 78 00:05:41,400 --> 00:05:47,200 Speaker 1: really good thing for the consumer. Because cartridges are very 79 00:05:47,200 --> 00:05:51,239 Speaker 1: expensive to make. You have to actually build wrong memory 80 00:05:51,279 --> 00:05:54,800 Speaker 1: into them. Instead of a disc. You had chips inside 81 00:05:54,839 --> 00:05:59,400 Speaker 1: those cartridges. That's expensive, but it wasn't just a question cheaper. 82 00:06:00,040 --> 00:06:02,919 Speaker 1: You could fit so much on a single CD, and 83 00:06:03,000 --> 00:06:05,640 Speaker 1: if one c D for any reason wasn't big enough, 84 00:06:05,880 --> 00:06:08,200 Speaker 1: you can put a second CD in the package for 85 00:06:08,560 --> 00:06:13,560 Speaker 1: next to nothing. So all of a sudden games are huge. 86 00:06:14,560 --> 00:06:19,279 Speaker 1: You get this huge breakup where Nintendo's constant partner in 87 00:06:19,760 --> 00:06:25,040 Speaker 1: RPG games, Squaresft, looks at what Sony is offering and says, hey, guys, 88 00:06:25,200 --> 00:06:28,040 Speaker 1: it's been nice, but Final Fantasy seven is going to 89 00:06:28,120 --> 00:06:34,480 Speaker 1: come out on the PlayStation. An evil empire is sucking 90 00:06:34,600 --> 00:06:40,279 Speaker 1: the light source from the planet, destroying all that's gettings packed. 91 00:06:41,040 --> 00:06:44,400 Speaker 1: It's the one soul sort of fortune to save the world. 92 00:06:45,080 --> 00:06:51,480 Speaker 1: If he succeeds, you survive. If he fails, you can 93 00:06:51,640 --> 00:07:01,680 Speaker 1: always hit the reset buttons. Final Fantasy seven. So Nintendo 94 00:07:01,760 --> 00:07:05,040 Speaker 1: found themselves in an interesting situation. They had over nine 95 00:07:05,600 --> 00:07:09,440 Speaker 1: of the market with ANYS and then they were down 96 00:07:09,480 --> 00:07:13,320 Speaker 1: to about on the market with this Nest. Then all 97 00:07:13,360 --> 00:07:16,800 Speaker 1: of a sudden, PlayStation comes out and there are thirty 98 00:07:16,840 --> 00:07:22,080 Speaker 1: percent of the market But Sony's path to domination didn't 99 00:07:22,120 --> 00:07:26,480 Speaker 1: stop there. In two thousand, Sony released their follow up console, 100 00:07:26,760 --> 00:07:31,200 Speaker 1: the PlayStation two, which to this day is the top 101 00:07:31,200 --> 00:07:36,480 Speaker 1: selling console of all time. PlayStation two came out, and 102 00:07:36,560 --> 00:07:40,080 Speaker 1: on the one hand, Sony had become very arrogent. The 103 00:07:40,160 --> 00:07:42,440 Speaker 1: line I always get to kick out of was that 104 00:07:42,480 --> 00:07:46,560 Speaker 1: they called the graphics processor the emotion engine on and 105 00:07:46,680 --> 00:07:49,600 Speaker 1: somebody once quipped that the only emotion I ever got 106 00:07:49,640 --> 00:07:53,800 Speaker 1: out of it was despair. It was hard to program. 107 00:07:53,880 --> 00:07:59,840 Speaker 1: But Sony took the entire PlayStation one architecture, transferred it 108 00:08:00,000 --> 00:08:03,480 Speaker 1: to a single chip and threw it into the PlayStation 109 00:08:03,560 --> 00:08:07,480 Speaker 1: two for good measure, and it played DVDs. That one 110 00:08:07,560 --> 00:08:12,200 Speaker 1: little box, That two box was a PlayStation DVD player 111 00:08:12,440 --> 00:08:16,080 Speaker 1: and a PlayStation two all in one. You can argue 112 00:08:16,160 --> 00:08:20,000 Speaker 1: that they were harsh on their development partners, but they 113 00:08:20,040 --> 00:08:26,000 Speaker 1: were generous to the consumer. As it turns out, Sony 114 00:08:26,040 --> 00:08:29,960 Speaker 1: would desperately need the profits from their PlayStation consoles. That's 115 00:08:29,960 --> 00:08:33,880 Speaker 1: because there are other products weren't doing so well. All 116 00:08:33,920 --> 00:08:37,280 Speaker 1: of a sudden, Samsung and LG come out with great 117 00:08:37,280 --> 00:08:40,760 Speaker 1: TVs for half the price of Sony's, and Sony no 118 00:08:40,840 --> 00:08:47,920 Speaker 1: longer owns the TV market, Sony Ericsson telephones disappeared, Nicon 119 00:08:48,120 --> 00:08:52,320 Speaker 1: and Cannon started coming up with cameras, and Sony lost 120 00:08:52,320 --> 00:08:55,960 Speaker 1: the digital camera market, and all of a sudden, PlayStation 121 00:08:56,000 --> 00:08:57,880 Speaker 1: two as a guts and because it's the only thing 122 00:08:57,880 --> 00:09:03,720 Speaker 1: that's keeping Sony alive, PlayStation's iron grip over the video 123 00:09:03,760 --> 00:09:09,640 Speaker 1: games industry changed everything. Many console developers like Sega and Atari, 124 00:09:09,800 --> 00:09:14,280 Speaker 1: face layoffs, reduced output, or quit the console market altogether, 125 00:09:14,679 --> 00:09:19,400 Speaker 1: until eventually Nintendo was Sony's only real competitor. That is, 126 00:09:19,880 --> 00:09:23,120 Speaker 1: until one more tech company decided to try their hand 127 00:09:23,200 --> 00:09:28,400 Speaker 1: at video games. Microsoft. They released their first console, the Xbox, 128 00:09:28,559 --> 00:09:31,280 Speaker 1: in two thousand and one, but it didn't go over 129 00:09:31,320 --> 00:09:35,840 Speaker 1: so well in countries outside the US. The original Xbox 130 00:09:36,480 --> 00:09:39,480 Speaker 1: was a dreadful idea for Japan. A lot of people 131 00:09:39,720 --> 00:09:43,480 Speaker 1: attacked Japan and say, well, Xbox never had a chance 132 00:09:43,520 --> 00:09:46,559 Speaker 1: because it was American and Japan would let it catch on. 133 00:09:46,920 --> 00:09:50,120 Speaker 1: There's some reasons to feel that way, but looking at 134 00:09:50,160 --> 00:09:53,800 Speaker 1: everything from the other perspective, it was way too big. 135 00:09:54,240 --> 00:09:59,040 Speaker 1: There were Japanese washer dryer towers where the footprint on 136 00:09:59,080 --> 00:10:01,800 Speaker 1: the ground is about maybe a third bigger, maybe a 137 00:10:01,840 --> 00:10:04,520 Speaker 1: half bigger than that Xbox, but Drink on the ground 138 00:10:05,160 --> 00:10:08,520 Speaker 1: didn't have a lot of Japanese game scored, whereas Sony 139 00:10:08,880 --> 00:10:13,400 Speaker 1: had a huge library of Japanese exclusives, and Nintendo, of 140 00:10:13,440 --> 00:10:16,520 Speaker 1: course was Nintendo. And then there was the name too. 141 00:10:17,400 --> 00:10:19,640 Speaker 1: I never realized. It's been a friend of mine. Ryan 142 00:10:19,679 --> 00:10:22,600 Speaker 1: Payton pointed out to me that here in the United 143 00:10:22,600 --> 00:10:24,880 Speaker 1: States we say X marks the spot, and that's a 144 00:10:24,880 --> 00:10:27,439 Speaker 1: good thing, but in Japan, X is actually kind of 145 00:10:27,480 --> 00:10:32,559 Speaker 1: a negative. So the Xbox was sort of this negative box. 146 00:10:32,920 --> 00:10:36,559 Speaker 1: It's the box not to have. They came nowhere near 147 00:10:36,600 --> 00:10:42,000 Speaker 1: a million units, but Microsoft was self aware about the 148 00:10:42,000 --> 00:10:45,280 Speaker 1: shortcomings of the Xbox, so when they released the Xbox 149 00:10:45,320 --> 00:10:49,320 Speaker 1: three sixty in two thousand and five, they overhauled their 150 00:10:49,400 --> 00:10:53,480 Speaker 1: marketing strategy. The next x Box up would sell over 151 00:10:53,520 --> 00:10:57,160 Speaker 1: a million, which is still paltry compared to the other Xboxes, 152 00:10:57,559 --> 00:11:01,680 Speaker 1: but boy the effort and the elligence of Microsoft put 153 00:11:01,679 --> 00:11:05,959 Speaker 1: into doubling their sales. They went into Japanese homes and 154 00:11:06,040 --> 00:11:12,000 Speaker 1: talk to people. They worked wildly to attract good game designers, 155 00:11:12,320 --> 00:11:17,320 Speaker 1: and they made a big budget in the Japanese market. Meanwhile, 156 00:11:17,679 --> 00:11:20,800 Speaker 1: Nintendo struggled to stay relevant during the early two thousand's. 157 00:11:21,240 --> 00:11:24,160 Speaker 1: They released the Nintendo GameCube in two thousand and one, 158 00:11:24,360 --> 00:11:28,200 Speaker 1: which sold less units in the Xbox. The GameCube never 159 00:11:28,280 --> 00:11:31,960 Speaker 1: grew to account more than of the total games market. 160 00:11:33,200 --> 00:11:35,400 Speaker 1: On the one hand, you look at GameCube and you say, wow, 161 00:11:35,520 --> 00:11:39,200 Speaker 1: you know, so sorry to seem Intend to go away down. 162 00:11:41,280 --> 00:11:42,920 Speaker 1: But then they turned around and come out with the 163 00:11:43,000 --> 00:11:46,679 Speaker 1: Wi Next, which isn't a game system for gamers. It's 164 00:11:46,720 --> 00:11:50,760 Speaker 1: a game system for gamers grandmothers. But I'll be the 165 00:11:50,840 --> 00:11:56,000 Speaker 1: arnest they didn't recapture the market with the Wei. Nintendo 166 00:11:56,080 --> 00:12:00,280 Speaker 1: successfully diversified the world of video gaming. They created an 167 00:12:00,360 --> 00:12:04,040 Speaker 1: interactive experience unlike anything before it, and it was the 168 00:12:04,160 --> 00:12:07,800 Speaker 1: first console to be fully accessible to a wider, more 169 00:12:07,880 --> 00:12:12,440 Speaker 1: family oriented audience, and it was a huge success, selling 170 00:12:12,480 --> 00:12:15,640 Speaker 1: over a hundred million units and putting Nintendo back on 171 00:12:15,679 --> 00:12:19,360 Speaker 1: the map. Stephen says that the game's industry learned a 172 00:12:19,360 --> 00:12:23,360 Speaker 1: lot from Nintendo success. The more accessible games were, the 173 00:12:23,400 --> 00:12:26,640 Speaker 1: more they would sell, and this sparked a new revolution 174 00:12:26,920 --> 00:12:31,120 Speaker 1: the cross gaming. So the accessibility of video games is 175 00:12:31,280 --> 00:12:35,120 Speaker 1: they've become ubiquitous. It used to be that you went 176 00:12:35,200 --> 00:12:39,160 Speaker 1: to the arcades or if you had two hundred dollars 177 00:12:39,200 --> 00:12:42,280 Speaker 1: a time when two hundred dollars was really five hundred dollars. 178 00:12:42,480 --> 00:12:45,080 Speaker 1: You bought an Atari and it wasn't as good, but 179 00:12:45,160 --> 00:12:49,720 Speaker 1: you bought it. Now you can play the best arcade 180 00:12:49,720 --> 00:12:52,320 Speaker 1: games from the eighties on your cell phone. Everyone's dat 181 00:12:52,400 --> 00:12:56,360 Speaker 1: a cellphone because of go pay your coin as philosophy 182 00:12:56,440 --> 00:12:59,880 Speaker 1: of using old technologies. Nintendo keeps the price on their 183 00:13:00,000 --> 00:13:02,959 Speaker 1: console is pretty achieved. But on top of that, if 184 00:13:03,000 --> 00:13:06,800 Speaker 1: you can't afford an Xbox Series X, guess what you 185 00:13:06,800 --> 00:13:11,480 Speaker 1: can probably affordy used three sixty. There was a time 186 00:13:11,840 --> 00:13:14,520 Speaker 1: when the game companies were saying, yeah, you know, we're 187 00:13:14,520 --> 00:13:17,720 Speaker 1: gonna get twenty billion dollars this year in sales, more 188 00:13:17,760 --> 00:13:21,040 Speaker 1: bigger than Hollywood. Now they're getting closer to a hundred 189 00:13:21,080 --> 00:13:25,200 Speaker 1: billion dollars in sales, and they're bigger than Hollywood plus 190 00:13:25,240 --> 00:13:33,120 Speaker 1: professional sports plus the music industry combined. So what's next 191 00:13:33,160 --> 00:13:37,640 Speaker 1: for gaming? One of the big trends right now is 192 00:13:37,880 --> 00:13:41,640 Speaker 1: virtual reality. But I will tell you that virtual reality 193 00:13:41,760 --> 00:13:45,400 Speaker 1: really scares me. I was talking with someone recently who 194 00:13:45,480 --> 00:13:49,760 Speaker 1: was telling me that he used to get so motion 195 00:13:49,840 --> 00:13:53,320 Speaker 1: sick playing virtual reality games, but now he doesn't anymore. 196 00:13:53,520 --> 00:13:56,240 Speaker 1: And he was happy about that until I pointed out 197 00:13:56,280 --> 00:14:00,640 Speaker 1: that your brain physically remaps itself based on the stimulus 198 00:14:00,720 --> 00:14:03,480 Speaker 1: you get it, which meant that his brain had remapped 199 00:14:03,520 --> 00:14:07,640 Speaker 1: itself to accommodate v R. There's been a lot of 200 00:14:07,679 --> 00:14:10,360 Speaker 1: research don on v ART and the effects it has 201 00:14:10,440 --> 00:14:13,760 Speaker 1: on our brains, but not all of it has been released, 202 00:14:14,120 --> 00:14:18,439 Speaker 1: and I wonder about that. I'm nervous about what VR 203 00:14:18,640 --> 00:14:22,680 Speaker 1: will do in the long run. But one of the 204 00:14:22,680 --> 00:14:26,680 Speaker 1: more exciting advancements to think about is how visuals continue 205 00:14:26,720 --> 00:14:29,680 Speaker 1: to improve. As Stephen points out, graphics have come a 206 00:14:29,720 --> 00:14:34,160 Speaker 1: long way from early video games. I remember looking at 207 00:14:34,360 --> 00:14:37,440 Speaker 1: ghosts and goblins on the NYES and training to my 208 00:14:37,520 --> 00:14:40,440 Speaker 1: mom and saying, you know, that's good artwork. My mom 209 00:14:40,520 --> 00:14:44,360 Speaker 1: is looking at and going, really, you think so? Sony 210 00:14:44,920 --> 00:14:52,560 Speaker 1: was so good, uh presentation. Nintendo was so good at presentation. Frankly, 211 00:14:52,600 --> 00:14:57,120 Speaker 1: if you saw the first FIFA soccer on the three 212 00:14:57,160 --> 00:15:02,000 Speaker 1: do that was the game that turned sports games from 213 00:15:02,080 --> 00:15:05,480 Speaker 1: being flat guys on a flat field taking a flat 214 00:15:05,520 --> 00:15:10,360 Speaker 1: ball into having ambiance. The stadiums are there, and the 215 00:15:10,400 --> 00:15:13,120 Speaker 1: stadium is part of the game. One of the things 216 00:15:13,200 --> 00:15:16,560 Speaker 1: I love about video games. I've always loved about video games, 217 00:15:17,000 --> 00:15:18,880 Speaker 1: and I don't think I'm alone in this is that 218 00:15:19,080 --> 00:15:21,720 Speaker 1: video games can take you someplace you wouldn't want to 219 00:15:21,760 --> 00:15:25,800 Speaker 1: be in real life. You can be a guy challenging 220 00:15:25,880 --> 00:15:28,760 Speaker 1: the Greek and now I believe, the Nordica. You can 221 00:15:28,800 --> 00:15:32,640 Speaker 1: be in a haunted house being chased by machine gun 222 00:15:32,720 --> 00:15:35,800 Speaker 1: toning zombies. Whatever you want. They'll take you into these 223 00:15:35,840 --> 00:15:38,840 Speaker 1: places that you wouldn't want to be in in real life, 224 00:15:39,240 --> 00:15:42,200 Speaker 1: or places that you couldn't qualify for for real life. 225 00:15:42,720 --> 00:15:45,520 Speaker 1: You can beat the Williams sisters in tennis. If you're 226 00:15:45,560 --> 00:15:49,560 Speaker 1: good enough on the tennis games, you can fight brock Lester. 227 00:15:50,200 --> 00:15:52,800 Speaker 1: These are things that in real life are not possible, 228 00:15:53,040 --> 00:15:57,440 Speaker 1: and video games have gotten so good at presenting them 229 00:15:57,560 --> 00:15:59,800 Speaker 1: in a way that you look at it and you 230 00:15:59,800 --> 00:16:02,080 Speaker 1: think it's got to be real, or it's almost real. 231 00:16:02,680 --> 00:16:05,840 Speaker 1: But here's the caveat. In literature, there's a term called 232 00:16:05,880 --> 00:16:10,520 Speaker 1: the suspension of disbelief. I would argue that they achieved 233 00:16:10,520 --> 00:16:13,840 Speaker 1: the suspension of disbelief in video games. Even back in 234 00:16:13,880 --> 00:16:17,560 Speaker 1: the eighth bit era, where you were running Mario across 235 00:16:17,720 --> 00:16:22,080 Speaker 1: polka dotted mushrooms, I gotta tell you I got acrophobic 236 00:16:22,120 --> 00:16:25,760 Speaker 1: playing that game when Mario fell off a mushroom or 237 00:16:25,800 --> 00:16:28,760 Speaker 1: a platform, I felt like I was dropping off the 238 00:16:28,760 --> 00:16:34,600 Speaker 1: face of the world. They've been good at gain people 239 00:16:34,640 --> 00:16:38,360 Speaker 1: to suspend their disbelief with lesser graphics. It gets harder 240 00:16:38,400 --> 00:16:42,520 Speaker 1: now because once you're spoiled with what exists today, if 241 00:16:42,600 --> 00:16:46,080 Speaker 1: you've got a PS five or an Xbox Series X, 242 00:16:46,560 --> 00:16:49,280 Speaker 1: it's hard to go back. You can pick up a 243 00:16:49,320 --> 00:16:53,640 Speaker 1: game boy and still get lost in Tetris easily, but 244 00:16:53,760 --> 00:17:02,840 Speaker 1: some of the other things aren't so easy. With the 245 00:17:02,920 --> 00:17:07,040 Speaker 1: latest consoles, the PlayStation five and the Xbox Series X 246 00:17:07,480 --> 00:17:11,280 Speaker 1: games are now closer than ever to looking lifelike. After 247 00:17:11,280 --> 00:17:14,040 Speaker 1: a quick break, we're going to sit down with familiar 248 00:17:14,080 --> 00:17:17,720 Speaker 1: I Heart Podcast voices who also happened to be avid gamers, 249 00:17:18,200 --> 00:17:21,399 Speaker 1: and we'll discuss what we are most excited about for 250 00:17:21,440 --> 00:17:28,840 Speaker 1: the future of gaming. It's no secret that we have 251 00:17:28,920 --> 00:17:31,200 Speaker 1: a big group of gamer nerds on the I Heart 252 00:17:31,240 --> 00:17:34,520 Speaker 1: podcast team. A few weeks ago, we decided to chat 253 00:17:34,560 --> 00:17:38,680 Speaker 1: with a few of them about our best gaming memories. Hi. 254 00:17:38,720 --> 00:17:43,280 Speaker 1: I'm Trevor Young. I am a producer on Ephemeral, and 255 00:17:43,440 --> 00:17:46,720 Speaker 1: I'm very excited to talk about video games. Hi. I'm 256 00:17:46,760 --> 00:17:49,800 Speaker 1: Annie Reese Um. I'm a podcast host for the show's 257 00:17:49,800 --> 00:17:52,800 Speaker 1: stuff I've never told you and savor and I am 258 00:17:52,880 --> 00:17:56,520 Speaker 1: also very very excited to talk about video games. This 259 00:17:56,560 --> 00:18:00,560 Speaker 1: is Matt Frederick. I'm an executive producer on Ephemeral. Officially, 260 00:18:01,080 --> 00:18:03,760 Speaker 1: I'm also a host of stuff they don't want you 261 00:18:03,800 --> 00:18:06,320 Speaker 1: to know. And Hi, I am Max Williams. I am 262 00:18:06,359 --> 00:18:09,399 Speaker 1: a producer here on Ephemeral, And yeah, I love video games. 263 00:18:10,160 --> 00:18:12,080 Speaker 1: So one of my first questions I had for the 264 00:18:12,080 --> 00:18:13,960 Speaker 1: group to kick it off is a pretty obvious one, 265 00:18:14,040 --> 00:18:16,120 Speaker 1: but it's just kind of what your first video game 266 00:18:16,160 --> 00:18:19,600 Speaker 1: memory was, like, what your first system and game was. 267 00:18:20,040 --> 00:18:23,080 Speaker 1: I'll start by saying, I'm pretty sure mine was getting 268 00:18:23,119 --> 00:18:26,920 Speaker 1: like the bray Chunky game Boy, like the original Game 269 00:18:26,960 --> 00:18:29,199 Speaker 1: Boy was I think the very first video game system 270 00:18:29,200 --> 00:18:32,840 Speaker 1: I played. And I either played Tetris on it for 271 00:18:32,880 --> 00:18:37,600 Speaker 1: the first time, or I played Pokemon like blue or 272 00:18:37,640 --> 00:18:40,480 Speaker 1: Red version, which would have been around like nine. I 273 00:18:40,480 --> 00:18:48,760 Speaker 1: guess wow. Yeah, Indeed, one of my first video game 274 00:18:48,760 --> 00:18:50,639 Speaker 1: memories is I have an older brother and it was 275 00:18:50,680 --> 00:18:52,480 Speaker 1: kind of through him that I got introduced to video 276 00:18:52,480 --> 00:18:54,199 Speaker 1: game So I was probably four years old, and I 277 00:18:54,240 --> 00:18:58,480 Speaker 1: remember him playing. Like, my early memories get all mixed up, 278 00:18:58,520 --> 00:19:02,560 Speaker 1: but I remember pretty clearly Turtles in Time Supernintendo version, 279 00:19:02,880 --> 00:19:04,560 Speaker 1: and then he had like an X Men game that 280 00:19:04,600 --> 00:19:07,040 Speaker 1: I really liked because the animation was storm. I thought 281 00:19:07,040 --> 00:19:09,760 Speaker 1: that was so cool. I think that's also Supernintendo. But 282 00:19:09,760 --> 00:19:12,960 Speaker 1: we did have like a original Nintendo and I remember 283 00:19:13,000 --> 00:19:15,879 Speaker 1: him playing I believe it was a Zelda game and 284 00:19:15,920 --> 00:19:18,360 Speaker 1: also Mario in there. But by like early memories are 285 00:19:18,400 --> 00:19:20,959 Speaker 1: of watching him play it, and it was kind of 286 00:19:21,040 --> 00:19:23,959 Speaker 1: his domain at first, But then I I moved up 287 00:19:23,960 --> 00:19:28,440 Speaker 1: in the world and started to play myself, so I'm 288 00:19:28,480 --> 00:19:32,000 Speaker 1: I'm a little bit older. Uh Now I only know 289 00:19:32,080 --> 00:19:36,200 Speaker 1: this first one because I have video footage of myself 290 00:19:36,240 --> 00:19:40,480 Speaker 1: and my father playing it. But it was a Mattel 291 00:19:40,720 --> 00:19:44,960 Speaker 1: in television and it's had this controller that had a 292 00:19:44,960 --> 00:19:48,920 Speaker 1: little circular metal thing that you used. It was very strange. 293 00:19:49,720 --> 00:19:52,399 Speaker 1: It was a horse racing game where you don't really 294 00:19:53,080 --> 00:19:55,679 Speaker 1: play the game, you just bet on which horse is 295 00:19:55,680 --> 00:19:57,639 Speaker 1: gonna win. Less is a video game more like an 296 00:19:57,680 --> 00:20:02,080 Speaker 1: interactive movie, very similar. Really, my first real memories are 297 00:20:02,240 --> 00:20:06,600 Speaker 1: of an original Nintendo entertainment system playing weird games like 298 00:20:06,680 --> 00:20:10,200 Speaker 1: Kung Fu and Solstice. Yeah. I think my first video 299 00:20:10,200 --> 00:20:14,520 Speaker 1: game memory was actually on the computer. I remember being 300 00:20:14,560 --> 00:20:17,080 Speaker 1: a kid, and my parents were like, you guys can 301 00:20:17,080 --> 00:20:19,520 Speaker 1: play video games, but they have to be educational. So 302 00:20:20,160 --> 00:20:21,720 Speaker 1: it was a lot of like h G Games I 303 00:20:21,760 --> 00:20:23,880 Speaker 1: believe was the company. It was like pot Putt Goes 304 00:20:23,880 --> 00:20:26,720 Speaker 1: to the Moon and stuff. I think my first gaming 305 00:20:26,760 --> 00:20:28,840 Speaker 1: system was similar to yours, Trevor. I remember having like 306 00:20:28,880 --> 00:20:32,159 Speaker 1: the blocky gray game Boy, and Heven. I think I 307 00:20:32,200 --> 00:20:35,320 Speaker 1: had Pokemon Blue and Ox had Pokemon Red because I 308 00:20:35,359 --> 00:20:37,480 Speaker 1: was always like red schooler, I want Red being the 309 00:20:37,480 --> 00:20:40,119 Speaker 1: annoying little brother that I am. Yeah, what Matt was 310 00:20:40,119 --> 00:20:42,480 Speaker 1: saying reminded me that like there was a whole era 311 00:20:42,840 --> 00:20:45,960 Speaker 1: of like at home video game playing that like wasn't 312 00:20:45,960 --> 00:20:49,200 Speaker 1: like proper consoles. It was like these like little boxes 313 00:20:49,200 --> 00:20:51,080 Speaker 1: that would have like one or two random like kind 314 00:20:51,080 --> 00:20:52,639 Speaker 1: of things on them that you could plug into your 315 00:20:52,640 --> 00:20:56,359 Speaker 1: TV and like go. But it was really just like 316 00:20:56,359 --> 00:20:58,560 Speaker 1: one or two things. It wasn't like a proper game console, 317 00:20:58,560 --> 00:21:01,720 Speaker 1: a cartridges or anything like that. Um, it was that 318 00:21:01,800 --> 00:21:04,440 Speaker 1: kind of what that was, Matt uh the in television, 319 00:21:04,480 --> 00:21:09,040 Speaker 1: I believe it had console, It had cartridges, very similar 320 00:21:09,080 --> 00:21:12,120 Speaker 1: to like a cole Eco Vision that was like the 321 00:21:12,160 --> 00:21:14,320 Speaker 1: other one that came out very early that I remember 322 00:21:14,800 --> 00:21:16,400 Speaker 1: I never had an Atari, which was like the first 323 00:21:16,400 --> 00:21:20,200 Speaker 1: system that had the cartridges you're speaking of. But yeah, 324 00:21:20,359 --> 00:21:22,880 Speaker 1: I I don't know, man, there's something so amazing about 325 00:21:22,880 --> 00:21:28,000 Speaker 1: a physical thing that you just plug in, especially with 326 00:21:28,040 --> 00:21:30,239 Speaker 1: the sound of it plugging in. I don't know when 327 00:21:30,280 --> 00:21:33,680 Speaker 1: you're thinking about ephemeral things. You know, we don't even 328 00:21:33,720 --> 00:21:36,560 Speaker 1: have discs anymore. You just download your games. But like 329 00:21:36,800 --> 00:21:40,760 Speaker 1: getting ahold of that sucker uh and just that feeling, 330 00:21:40,880 --> 00:21:45,200 Speaker 1: especially in the old nintendos. Man, Oh, it's great, which 331 00:21:45,240 --> 00:21:47,760 Speaker 1: made the the experience of like a blockbuster or video 332 00:21:47,760 --> 00:21:51,680 Speaker 1: game rental place all that more important and exciting. Yes, 333 00:21:51,720 --> 00:21:54,440 Speaker 1: I mean, on that note, like where where did you 334 00:21:54,480 --> 00:21:57,680 Speaker 1: all like get your games from? Do you remember Christmas? 335 00:21:58,440 --> 00:22:01,480 Speaker 1: If I got a game, it was Christmas. If I 336 00:22:01,560 --> 00:22:05,119 Speaker 1: picked one up, it was a local video game store probably, 337 00:22:05,160 --> 00:22:08,520 Speaker 1: which was probably a blockbuster. Yeah. Um, I, like I 338 00:22:08,520 --> 00:22:10,959 Speaker 1: said about, my brothers were the ones that usually got 339 00:22:11,000 --> 00:22:13,879 Speaker 1: the video games. And it actually caused some tension later 340 00:22:14,040 --> 00:22:17,000 Speaker 1: because I bought like the console, but they had all 341 00:22:17,000 --> 00:22:18,959 Speaker 1: the games. So when we went our separate ways, you 342 00:22:18,960 --> 00:22:23,240 Speaker 1: know who gets what? I claimed the PlayStation two because 343 00:22:23,240 --> 00:22:27,160 Speaker 1: I fixed it with my own my own hands and screwdrivers. 344 00:22:27,160 --> 00:22:29,440 Speaker 1: So that's fine. I still have it. So I don't 345 00:22:29,480 --> 00:22:31,600 Speaker 1: think I started. We did get a lot of games 346 00:22:32,640 --> 00:22:35,440 Speaker 1: um from Blockbuster. We rented a lot, especially for Sega. 347 00:22:36,160 --> 00:22:40,040 Speaker 1: But I started buying once I got older. It's around 348 00:22:40,040 --> 00:22:43,119 Speaker 1: PlayStation two era. I started buying my own games. Uh. 349 00:22:43,280 --> 00:22:44,920 Speaker 1: And I once did a really annoying thing where I 350 00:22:44,920 --> 00:22:47,320 Speaker 1: showed up with like just my allowance money, so it 351 00:22:47,440 --> 00:22:50,359 Speaker 1: was like quarters and stuff paid for this game. The 352 00:22:50,359 --> 00:22:54,920 Speaker 1: guy was so mad at me, but that's how. That's 353 00:22:54,920 --> 00:22:56,560 Speaker 1: how I had my money. I didn't know what to do, 354 00:22:57,160 --> 00:22:58,960 Speaker 1: you know. I was actually just digging through some like 355 00:22:59,000 --> 00:23:01,080 Speaker 1: I have a bunch of video stuff, like old stuff, 356 00:23:01,080 --> 00:23:03,679 Speaker 1: and I found this copy of a paper Mario for 357 00:23:03,760 --> 00:23:06,840 Speaker 1: the N sixty four nice and right here on the 358 00:23:06,840 --> 00:23:10,879 Speaker 1: top it says property a block button. Because it was like, 359 00:23:10,920 --> 00:23:12,639 Speaker 1: you know, you you can rent the games, but you 360 00:23:12,640 --> 00:23:14,000 Speaker 1: can also pay. I don't know, like what was that 361 00:23:14,040 --> 00:23:16,840 Speaker 1: twenty bucks to buy the use game. I feel like 362 00:23:16,840 --> 00:23:18,680 Speaker 1: there had to have been another place, but I don't 363 00:23:18,680 --> 00:23:20,320 Speaker 1: remember going to a game stop or anything like that 364 00:23:20,359 --> 00:23:22,400 Speaker 1: back then, or even if game stop was a thing yet. 365 00:23:22,760 --> 00:23:25,480 Speaker 1: So yeah, I think just like blockbust, starties rented games 366 00:23:25,520 --> 00:23:27,320 Speaker 1: and after a certain amount of times if I rented it, 367 00:23:27,359 --> 00:23:29,679 Speaker 1: my parents were like, Okay, we're just gonna buy this 368 00:23:29,680 --> 00:23:32,000 Speaker 1: because we're still of paying you know, the nine dollars 369 00:23:32,040 --> 00:23:33,520 Speaker 1: or whatever it is to rent it for the weekend. 370 00:23:34,040 --> 00:23:38,560 Speaker 1: So my recollection is going to It was first called 371 00:23:38,600 --> 00:23:41,840 Speaker 1: Electronics Boutique and then it became e B Games, and 372 00:23:41,880 --> 00:23:45,240 Speaker 1: I'm pretty sure that got merged into game Stop. I 373 00:23:45,280 --> 00:23:48,240 Speaker 1: could be wrong about that, but yeah, the first I remember, 374 00:23:48,240 --> 00:23:50,879 Speaker 1: the first game store I went to was like E 375 00:23:51,000 --> 00:23:53,600 Speaker 1: B Games and that's where I would get like my 376 00:23:53,680 --> 00:23:56,720 Speaker 1: N sixty four games and sn E S games and 377 00:23:56,720 --> 00:23:59,199 Speaker 1: stuff like that. Uh. And I'm pretty sure that was 378 00:23:59,240 --> 00:24:02,080 Speaker 1: like before games off existed. But the mall would have them, 379 00:24:02,119 --> 00:24:06,040 Speaker 1: y'all just stores at the mall, just have them, right, Yeah, 380 00:24:06,119 --> 00:24:08,240 Speaker 1: it was the whole thing. There was a I lived 381 00:24:08,240 --> 00:24:10,640 Speaker 1: in a small town and there was a a mall, 382 00:24:10,760 --> 00:24:13,000 Speaker 1: like a thirty minute drive away. It's a big deal. 383 00:24:13,040 --> 00:24:14,760 Speaker 1: You go to E V Games and you're like, ah, 384 00:24:15,080 --> 00:24:18,000 Speaker 1: this is heaven and it was big exciting dude. Well, 385 00:24:18,040 --> 00:24:20,560 Speaker 1: and you had the arcade there too. Generally not at 386 00:24:20,600 --> 00:24:22,840 Speaker 1: all malls, but if it was a good mall, it 387 00:24:22,920 --> 00:24:25,680 Speaker 1: had an arcade and you know, if you're a kid. 388 00:24:26,680 --> 00:24:28,159 Speaker 1: I don't know if you guys had this experience, but 389 00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:30,919 Speaker 1: you get you get some quarters and your family just 390 00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:33,399 Speaker 1: let you go to the arcade for a little while. 391 00:24:33,880 --> 00:24:35,960 Speaker 1: I can't remember if my parents would leave me there, 392 00:24:36,240 --> 00:24:39,280 Speaker 1: but I know that once I entered the arcade, nobody 393 00:24:39,359 --> 00:24:44,880 Speaker 1: was there but me and the consoles, and uh, it's 394 00:24:44,920 --> 00:24:47,439 Speaker 1: just amazing. Yeah, let's tuck our kades for a second. 395 00:24:47,720 --> 00:24:50,399 Speaker 1: So two questions, Matt, maybe you can answer. Do you 396 00:24:50,400 --> 00:24:52,760 Speaker 1: remember the name of the arcade you went to and 397 00:24:52,880 --> 00:24:55,320 Speaker 1: you remember what games you played on it? Oh? Man, 398 00:24:56,760 --> 00:24:59,520 Speaker 1: it was in Clearwater, Florida, when I would go visit 399 00:24:59,560 --> 00:25:04,040 Speaker 1: my grand parents. I remember that one, just really specifically 400 00:25:04,040 --> 00:25:05,960 Speaker 1: in my head. It was just a small mall that 401 00:25:06,040 --> 00:25:10,000 Speaker 1: was a short drive from their house, and I remember 402 00:25:10,040 --> 00:25:13,000 Speaker 1: that one. And I remember the arcade at the roller rink, 403 00:25:13,480 --> 00:25:15,760 Speaker 1: which was just a couple of games set up kind 404 00:25:15,760 --> 00:25:21,800 Speaker 1: of on the periphery of the rink. But I remember playing, uh, 405 00:25:22,119 --> 00:25:24,840 Speaker 1: like a couple of ninja based games there for the 406 00:25:24,840 --> 00:25:28,679 Speaker 1: first time ever. Let ninja gating, Like man, I just 407 00:25:28,800 --> 00:25:31,119 Speaker 1: I have very clear memory of it happening, but I 408 00:25:31,119 --> 00:25:34,119 Speaker 1: can't I can't tell you the details I went to 409 00:25:34,320 --> 00:25:36,679 Speaker 1: a time out. It was called time Out and it 410 00:25:36,760 --> 00:25:41,320 Speaker 1: was an arcade in Gainesville, Georgia, which again I grew 411 00:25:41,359 --> 00:25:42,840 Speaker 1: up in a small town that was just like outing. 412 00:25:42,880 --> 00:25:44,960 Speaker 1: If you're gonna go that way, it's a whole day. 413 00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:46,560 Speaker 1: But my parents would drop us off and just leave 414 00:25:46,640 --> 00:25:49,560 Speaker 1: us there. And I loved there's a zombie game. I 415 00:25:49,560 --> 00:25:53,239 Speaker 1: really loved a Star Wars game. I really loved a 416 00:25:53,280 --> 00:25:57,080 Speaker 1: dinosaur one and a Hotted House one. Oh I love 417 00:25:57,160 --> 00:25:58,960 Speaker 1: those are like the kind of point and shoot ones. 418 00:25:59,359 --> 00:26:01,000 Speaker 1: But I was also really good at commachine. I was 419 00:26:01,040 --> 00:26:05,040 Speaker 1: like so good they banned me from like no more 420 00:26:05,119 --> 00:26:08,040 Speaker 1: no where you're cheating. Yeah, I mean I don't really 421 00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:10,840 Speaker 1: have them any like distinct memories of like I guess 422 00:26:10,880 --> 00:26:12,800 Speaker 1: arcades when I was younger. Oddly enough, when I was 423 00:26:13,080 --> 00:26:15,359 Speaker 1: like nineteen, I actually end up working at it like 424 00:26:15,400 --> 00:26:18,360 Speaker 1: an arcade like place for about six months. But there 425 00:26:18,400 --> 00:26:20,360 Speaker 1: was like this one place called like Startime or something 426 00:26:20,359 --> 00:26:22,960 Speaker 1: with that. It's like like the suburbs nor like north 427 00:26:23,000 --> 00:26:26,399 Speaker 1: of Atlanta and Olex and I would go to that 428 00:26:26,440 --> 00:26:27,960 Speaker 1: and we just play House to the Dead like the 429 00:26:28,080 --> 00:26:30,480 Speaker 1: entire day, just like keep hitting, like you know, continue 430 00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:32,480 Speaker 1: putting the more money and stuff, and by that point 431 00:26:32,480 --> 00:26:35,679 Speaker 1: it wasn't like tokens or chips. It was like the card. 432 00:26:36,800 --> 00:26:38,600 Speaker 1: But yeah, I would say most of my memories are 433 00:26:38,640 --> 00:26:41,280 Speaker 1: like when I was like nineteen, I actually worked at 434 00:26:41,320 --> 00:26:43,399 Speaker 1: like it was kind of like a Chucky Cheese, independently 435 00:26:43,400 --> 00:26:47,200 Speaker 1: owned type place, and I was a technician, which meant 436 00:26:47,280 --> 00:26:48,399 Speaker 1: it's like, you know, if a bunch of kids just 437 00:26:48,440 --> 00:26:51,800 Speaker 1: shove coins into the wrong machine, um, I would take 438 00:26:51,800 --> 00:26:54,600 Speaker 1: it offline on jam the coins. But I remember they 439 00:26:54,600 --> 00:26:56,639 Speaker 1: had like a misspac Man there, and they had like 440 00:26:56,680 --> 00:26:59,760 Speaker 1: I think a Space Invaders there, And unfortunately I was 441 00:26:59,760 --> 00:27:02,840 Speaker 1: still like too young to appreciate how awesome it was 442 00:27:02,880 --> 00:27:06,760 Speaker 1: having those like really retro awesome machines. But I don't know, 443 00:27:06,760 --> 00:27:08,440 Speaker 1: I feel like by the time I got really into gaming, 444 00:27:08,440 --> 00:27:13,119 Speaker 1: like arcades were already you know, pretty phased out. Bless 445 00:27:13,160 --> 00:27:16,439 Speaker 1: you for doing that work, sir. Pinball. Does everybody have 446 00:27:16,520 --> 00:27:20,600 Speaker 1: pinball memories? Does anyone have pinball memories? Yeah? Little, I 447 00:27:20,840 --> 00:27:23,080 Speaker 1: feel like pinball was at the arcades I would go to, 448 00:27:24,200 --> 00:27:25,800 Speaker 1: but like that was the only context that I would 449 00:27:25,840 --> 00:27:29,520 Speaker 1: find it. Early was like in arcades, um, there just 450 00:27:29,640 --> 00:27:31,639 Speaker 1: be usually like a corner or a wall of the 451 00:27:31,720 --> 00:27:35,280 Speaker 1: arcade where they were pinballs, and my favorite ones are 452 00:27:35,280 --> 00:27:38,080 Speaker 1: always the ones connected to movies. You know that I knew, 453 00:27:38,119 --> 00:27:40,640 Speaker 1: like the Star Wars one or the Indiana Jones one 454 00:27:41,080 --> 00:27:45,360 Speaker 1: or something like that. Well, just as a personal connection 455 00:27:45,440 --> 00:27:47,920 Speaker 1: for me, and I wonder how this connects with you guys, 456 00:27:48,000 --> 00:27:51,800 Speaker 1: like the experience of playing a video game of any kind, 457 00:27:51,840 --> 00:27:54,120 Speaker 1: including a pinball game, which isn't really a video game, 458 00:27:54,600 --> 00:27:57,240 Speaker 1: you know, it's more integrated with video graphics and stuff 459 00:27:57,320 --> 00:28:00,440 Speaker 1: later on, but it's associated for me with it because 460 00:28:00,440 --> 00:28:02,680 Speaker 1: of the location, as you're saying to over the arcade, 461 00:28:03,160 --> 00:28:06,320 Speaker 1: I have clear memories of my father and I playing 462 00:28:06,720 --> 00:28:08,720 Speaker 1: and the joy that I would get when my dad 463 00:28:08,760 --> 00:28:12,239 Speaker 1: and I would like compete on a pinball machine, and 464 00:28:12,240 --> 00:28:15,360 Speaker 1: then that translated later on to us competing in other 465 00:28:15,600 --> 00:28:18,080 Speaker 1: like console games at the house, which is just this 466 00:28:18,240 --> 00:28:21,399 Speaker 1: clear through line that I've got with my connection to 467 00:28:21,440 --> 00:28:23,440 Speaker 1: my son now with video games. So I'll just I'll 468 00:28:23,440 --> 00:28:26,600 Speaker 1: bring that back up later. No, that's great, Um, that 469 00:28:26,640 --> 00:28:28,439 Speaker 1: reminds me. You know, I think I have a somewhat 470 00:28:28,480 --> 00:28:32,400 Speaker 1: similar story where most of my arcade time was spent 471 00:28:32,440 --> 00:28:35,200 Speaker 1: at a place in Dallas, Texas called Nickel Rama. Because 472 00:28:35,240 --> 00:28:39,560 Speaker 1: everything was in Nickel and Dallas is where my dad 473 00:28:39,600 --> 00:28:41,840 Speaker 1: and step mom lived, and so I would go visit 474 00:28:41,880 --> 00:28:45,120 Speaker 1: them there. I didn't live in Dallas, and my dad 475 00:28:45,160 --> 00:28:47,240 Speaker 1: was always working, so I never really got to hang 476 00:28:47,280 --> 00:28:49,000 Speaker 1: out with him when I visited, weirdly, so I would 477 00:28:49,000 --> 00:28:51,200 Speaker 1: like spend most of that time with my step mom, 478 00:28:51,240 --> 00:28:53,520 Speaker 1: And that was just kind of our thing we did 479 00:28:53,560 --> 00:28:55,479 Speaker 1: when I would visit, like pretty much like every day 480 00:28:55,520 --> 00:28:58,080 Speaker 1: when I would visit, or like whatever weekends I would go, 481 00:28:58,120 --> 00:29:01,760 Speaker 1: we'd go to the Nicole Rama And that's like really 482 00:29:01,760 --> 00:29:03,840 Speaker 1: how my stepmom and I like got to bond and 483 00:29:03,840 --> 00:29:06,120 Speaker 1: know each other growing up when I was a kid. 484 00:29:06,520 --> 00:29:09,200 Speaker 1: So we'd um, you know, go to the like two 485 00:29:09,200 --> 00:29:12,800 Speaker 1: player you know, like fighting games like Moral Kombat or 486 00:29:12,840 --> 00:29:14,680 Speaker 1: whatever it was, or like the Simpsons game where you 487 00:29:14,680 --> 00:29:18,360 Speaker 1: work together and like kind of go across the map 488 00:29:18,680 --> 00:29:22,320 Speaker 1: shooting weird guys popping out of trash cans. Like like 489 00:29:22,400 --> 00:29:23,840 Speaker 1: that was just our thing. Like that was me and 490 00:29:23,840 --> 00:29:27,120 Speaker 1: my stepmom saying so, uh, you know, she's one of 491 00:29:27,160 --> 00:29:29,480 Speaker 1: my favorite people in the world, and I don't think 492 00:29:29,920 --> 00:29:32,880 Speaker 1: we would be as close without that arcade. Without Nicole Rama, 493 00:29:33,400 --> 00:29:36,120 Speaker 1: I had a friend who had a pinball she had 494 00:29:36,480 --> 00:29:39,120 Speaker 1: some pinball machines at her house because her dad really 495 00:29:39,120 --> 00:29:41,800 Speaker 1: loved pinball machines, and it was the coolest. It was 496 00:29:41,920 --> 00:29:45,320 Speaker 1: so cool. I was always very very excited to go 497 00:29:45,360 --> 00:29:47,840 Speaker 1: and visit her. And I think that's another when I 498 00:29:47,840 --> 00:29:49,920 Speaker 1: think of video games, there's that kind of element when 499 00:29:49,960 --> 00:29:52,520 Speaker 1: you're a kid where you get jealous of who has 500 00:29:52,600 --> 00:29:54,760 Speaker 1: what game and what console and you're gonna go. I 501 00:29:54,760 --> 00:29:56,760 Speaker 1: was gonna go to her house and play pinball, you know, 502 00:29:56,880 --> 00:30:00,600 Speaker 1: like having these associations that she also had an Atari 503 00:30:00,640 --> 00:30:02,320 Speaker 1: and I didn't have an Atari. I had a Sega, 504 00:30:02,920 --> 00:30:05,440 Speaker 1: so we got to mix it up. Sometimes. I was 505 00:30:05,480 --> 00:30:07,400 Speaker 1: always really jealous when my friends were like better very 506 00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:09,560 Speaker 1: like certain games than me, you know, like I was 507 00:30:09,560 --> 00:30:11,720 Speaker 1: always really bad at Super Smash on the N sixty 508 00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:14,360 Speaker 1: four growing up, Like I just couldn't figure it out. 509 00:30:14,400 --> 00:30:15,800 Speaker 1: I don't know if it was a controller. I'm much 510 00:30:15,800 --> 00:30:18,280 Speaker 1: better at it now, but yeah, just like drive Me 511 00:30:18,400 --> 00:30:20,320 Speaker 1: drove me nuts that I was like always like last 512 00:30:20,320 --> 00:30:23,200 Speaker 1: place on Smash, and I feel like since then, I've 513 00:30:23,320 --> 00:30:26,040 Speaker 1: devoted my life to like getting better at that game 514 00:30:26,120 --> 00:30:28,080 Speaker 1: so I can like not be in last place on 515 00:30:28,400 --> 00:30:30,480 Speaker 1: Brawl or whatever the newest one is now Brawl was on. 516 00:30:30,680 --> 00:30:33,600 Speaker 1: We the newest one is like Ultimate. I guess that's 517 00:30:33,640 --> 00:30:37,360 Speaker 1: a really interesting, just larger topic to bring up the 518 00:30:37,400 --> 00:30:41,760 Speaker 1: competitiveness angle. You know, video games is really a bonding 519 00:30:41,920 --> 00:30:47,160 Speaker 1: thing for friends in many ways, especially in the console era. 520 00:30:48,240 --> 00:30:49,840 Speaker 1: You know, my my friends and I would always get 521 00:30:49,840 --> 00:30:52,440 Speaker 1: together and play various games like that. For us, it 522 00:30:52,480 --> 00:30:55,920 Speaker 1: was more like Halo on the original Xbox. My friends 523 00:30:55,960 --> 00:30:58,560 Speaker 1: and would get together all the time and just play Halo, 524 00:30:58,960 --> 00:31:01,640 Speaker 1: and that's all we would do all night, and we 525 00:31:01,640 --> 00:31:03,240 Speaker 1: couldn't wait till the next time we got to do 526 00:31:03,240 --> 00:31:08,440 Speaker 1: it again, which translated later to M m O RPGs 527 00:31:08,520 --> 00:31:10,440 Speaker 1: or you know, the online thing where we could be 528 00:31:10,440 --> 00:31:13,280 Speaker 1: in our separate places. Once we went off to college 529 00:31:13,280 --> 00:31:16,080 Speaker 1: and everything, we're still playing together. We were just separated. 530 00:31:16,640 --> 00:31:20,200 Speaker 1: That's what I find really funny about my gaming now 531 00:31:20,240 --> 00:31:22,440 Speaker 1: at this point in my life. So, like, you know, 532 00:31:22,440 --> 00:31:24,640 Speaker 1: I had a lot of friends who were really into gaming, 533 00:31:24,760 --> 00:31:26,920 Speaker 1: really competitive. I would play with them. I was usually 534 00:31:26,920 --> 00:31:28,280 Speaker 1: like one of the worst out of them. But I 535 00:31:28,360 --> 00:31:30,680 Speaker 1: say about like nineteen twenty, that's when I realized I 536 00:31:30,720 --> 00:31:33,720 Speaker 1: hate playing videogas to other people. I'm a solo gamer 537 00:31:33,960 --> 00:31:36,720 Speaker 1: and I've embraced it in my like you know now 538 00:31:36,720 --> 00:31:38,880 Speaker 1: going to my thirties. It's like that's why I got 539 00:31:38,920 --> 00:31:42,080 Speaker 1: really into the Assassin's Creed and then Skyram fall Out 540 00:31:42,080 --> 00:31:45,360 Speaker 1: all this stuff. I'm like nothing about just like getting 541 00:31:45,360 --> 00:31:48,800 Speaker 1: online and playing with people, even if I know them, 542 00:31:48,880 --> 00:31:52,600 Speaker 1: like really Like it's kind of like my period of 543 00:31:52,600 --> 00:31:54,440 Speaker 1: rest bit away from I mean a lot of this 544 00:31:54,600 --> 00:31:56,760 Speaker 1: might tie into the fact that I was a bartender 545 00:31:56,760 --> 00:31:59,280 Speaker 1: for many years. I was with people all the time, 546 00:31:59,720 --> 00:32:01,120 Speaker 1: and I'll play with people on a cage, but I 547 00:32:01,200 --> 00:32:04,480 Speaker 1: don't really enjoy it. Yeah, I'd second that in a way. Now, 548 00:32:04,640 --> 00:32:06,680 Speaker 1: I think I'm like kind of in between where there 549 00:32:06,720 --> 00:32:08,280 Speaker 1: was like a time where I got a lot of 550 00:32:08,320 --> 00:32:12,360 Speaker 1: like communal value out of video games, especially like Matt 551 00:32:12,400 --> 00:32:14,760 Speaker 1: was saying in the m m O RPG Hey Day, 552 00:32:15,240 --> 00:32:17,360 Speaker 1: Like when World of Warcraft hit, me and my friends 553 00:32:17,360 --> 00:32:19,520 Speaker 1: were all up on World of Warcraft, like that was 554 00:32:19,560 --> 00:32:21,880 Speaker 1: like our thing. We didn't even like hang out. There 555 00:32:21,920 --> 00:32:23,200 Speaker 1: was like a whole year where we didn't even hang 556 00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:25,280 Speaker 1: out in person because it was so much cooler to 557 00:32:25,360 --> 00:32:28,480 Speaker 1: be like in our like respective homes, on our computers, 558 00:32:28,800 --> 00:32:33,040 Speaker 1: talking on our like horrible little like USB Mike. That 559 00:32:33,120 --> 00:32:34,520 Speaker 1: was like what we wanted to do. That's how we 560 00:32:34,560 --> 00:32:37,520 Speaker 1: wanted to hang out. But at some point over the years, 561 00:32:37,600 --> 00:32:40,000 Speaker 1: like I don't know, like online gaming just started to 562 00:32:40,000 --> 00:32:42,480 Speaker 1: feel more and more like toxic to me. Like I'd 563 00:32:42,480 --> 00:32:45,600 Speaker 1: be on it and people were like really bad. Like 564 00:32:46,000 --> 00:32:48,720 Speaker 1: by bad, I mean like I would say horrible things 565 00:32:48,800 --> 00:32:52,320 Speaker 1: and we're like just like really rude and mean, and um, 566 00:32:52,360 --> 00:32:54,400 Speaker 1: you know, a couple of years ago, I got really 567 00:32:54,400 --> 00:32:57,960 Speaker 1: into Overwatch, and so as playing like Overwatch like online 568 00:32:58,000 --> 00:33:00,920 Speaker 1: a lot, and like man like just like the amount 569 00:33:00,920 --> 00:33:05,560 Speaker 1: of like racism and sexism and all horrible things that 570 00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:08,040 Speaker 1: I just like and just like abuse, you know, like 571 00:33:08,160 --> 00:33:11,240 Speaker 1: people like berating you over like messing up a game 572 00:33:11,360 --> 00:33:14,680 Speaker 1: or something like that. It's just like not not worth 573 00:33:14,720 --> 00:33:18,160 Speaker 1: it anymore, totally here you, Trevor. I tried recently to 574 00:33:18,800 --> 00:33:23,760 Speaker 1: use the Oculus to do some online multiplayer gaming, and 575 00:33:23,800 --> 00:33:26,000 Speaker 1: it was a horrible experience for that reason you just 576 00:33:26,040 --> 00:33:30,080 Speaker 1: pointed out. And this is my opinion, but this is 577 00:33:30,080 --> 00:33:33,840 Speaker 1: what I think. These are probably a lot of younger 578 00:33:33,880 --> 00:33:37,920 Speaker 1: people who are playing these games, including Overwatch, all these 579 00:33:38,040 --> 00:33:42,680 Speaker 1: games they are developing, They are like testing out some 580 00:33:42,840 --> 00:33:45,840 Speaker 1: of these more the things that they're not supposed to 581 00:33:45,880 --> 00:33:48,920 Speaker 1: say the things that the way they interact with others, 582 00:33:49,240 --> 00:33:52,480 Speaker 1: and you know, testing out that mean streak because maybe 583 00:33:52,480 --> 00:33:54,840 Speaker 1: it's been done to them. And I don't that's not 584 00:33:54,920 --> 00:33:57,760 Speaker 1: the case for every kid, but I think you're you're 585 00:33:57,880 --> 00:34:01,040 Speaker 1: encountering that a ton when you go into an online 586 00:34:01,480 --> 00:34:04,920 Speaker 1: space now with video games with younger people. Again, I 587 00:34:04,920 --> 00:34:07,720 Speaker 1: think they're just they're testing in a lot of ways 588 00:34:07,960 --> 00:34:10,239 Speaker 1: because they're not going to get necessarily in trouble for 589 00:34:10,320 --> 00:34:13,600 Speaker 1: saying those things that are kind of naughty and exciting 590 00:34:13,640 --> 00:34:17,080 Speaker 1: for a kid's mind. Um, and they probably don't even 591 00:34:17,120 --> 00:34:21,080 Speaker 1: understand what they're saying or what it really means. Just 592 00:34:21,120 --> 00:34:25,360 Speaker 1: to defend the griefers in the a holes that you'll encounter. Sorry, 593 00:34:25,560 --> 00:34:28,080 Speaker 1: that's not that they need defending. No, I get that. 594 00:34:28,280 --> 00:34:31,920 Speaker 1: I hope it is really that innocent, um, and it 595 00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:35,160 Speaker 1: comes from a place of naivete. But sometimes it feels 596 00:34:35,160 --> 00:34:38,680 Speaker 1: like I'm talking to adults who were those kids and 597 00:34:38,760 --> 00:34:41,600 Speaker 1: just like never really grew up. You know, now they're 598 00:34:41,640 --> 00:34:45,080 Speaker 1: like in their thirties or something and are still like 599 00:34:45,640 --> 00:34:48,399 Speaker 1: saying horrible things. You know, I don't know, I mean 600 00:34:48,440 --> 00:34:50,120 Speaker 1: that would track right, Yeah, I mean, you've got the 601 00:34:50,160 --> 00:34:53,600 Speaker 1: whole game or gate thing. I'm it's like literally a 602 00:34:53,640 --> 00:34:58,680 Speaker 1: woman getting death threats from adult men because she dared 603 00:34:58,719 --> 00:35:02,560 Speaker 1: to critique a game that they liked. So it's definitely, 604 00:35:02,640 --> 00:35:07,080 Speaker 1: it's extremely it can be very very toxic and very dangerous, 605 00:35:07,080 --> 00:35:11,080 Speaker 1: and unfortunately a lot of like, um, it's getting worse, 606 00:35:11,120 --> 00:35:14,239 Speaker 1: Like there's actually been some surveys, some studies recently that 607 00:35:14,440 --> 00:35:17,120 Speaker 1: we're going backwards, like there have been some progress made. 608 00:35:17,640 --> 00:35:21,640 Speaker 1: So I'm very competitive, but I stopped playing online games 609 00:35:21,680 --> 00:35:24,920 Speaker 1: at twelve because I was getting like harassed, and I've 610 00:35:24,960 --> 00:35:27,440 Speaker 1: just never gone back and it didn't feel like a 611 00:35:27,440 --> 00:35:30,360 Speaker 1: a safe space. It is a weird thing for a 612 00:35:30,360 --> 00:35:33,120 Speaker 1: twelve year old to be like, oh god, O can't 613 00:35:33,200 --> 00:35:37,520 Speaker 1: I can't be involved in this anymore. It's interesting because I, 614 00:35:38,520 --> 00:35:40,560 Speaker 1: like I said, I got introduced to video games to 615 00:35:40,640 --> 00:35:42,520 Speaker 1: my brothers, and I was very competitive. However, it was 616 00:35:42,560 --> 00:35:46,520 Speaker 1: always always in my mind viewed as this is a 617 00:35:46,600 --> 00:35:50,080 Speaker 1: more masculine space. So I would play, but only if 618 00:35:50,080 --> 00:35:53,319 Speaker 1: they would let me play. And like I, you all 619 00:35:53,320 --> 00:35:55,880 Speaker 1: probably remember this, but I bet some listeners don't. Games 620 00:35:55,920 --> 00:35:58,480 Speaker 1: used to only have like one safe space or like 621 00:35:58,520 --> 00:36:00,920 Speaker 1: two maybe, and they so they would go through and 622 00:36:00,920 --> 00:36:03,880 Speaker 1: erase all my games, and it was just like a 623 00:36:04,000 --> 00:36:08,080 Speaker 1: huge point of contention. Um so I always felt like 624 00:36:08,680 --> 00:36:12,080 Speaker 1: I wasn't good enough for them, like they were way 625 00:36:12,120 --> 00:36:15,520 Speaker 1: better than I ever could be. But then at the 626 00:36:15,520 --> 00:36:18,440 Speaker 1: same time, like my other friends who were girls who 627 00:36:18,440 --> 00:36:21,000 Speaker 1: didn't really play video games, thought that like I was 628 00:36:21,120 --> 00:36:25,320 Speaker 1: kind of strange because I was a girl playing video games. Uh. 629 00:36:25,600 --> 00:36:31,280 Speaker 1: But I did go on to I Want a Super 630 00:36:31,280 --> 00:36:36,040 Speaker 1: Smash Brothers competition in college. I went to a very 631 00:36:36,040 --> 00:36:40,840 Speaker 1: technical school and it was se men and they all 632 00:36:40,840 --> 00:36:43,520 Speaker 1: accused me of cheating and said there's no way she 633 00:36:43,560 --> 00:36:47,520 Speaker 1: could have won. It's impossible, like we're shouting in my face. 634 00:36:48,040 --> 00:36:52,399 Speaker 1: So I've never competed ever again. But I did win, 635 00:36:52,480 --> 00:36:56,239 Speaker 1: and I want some money. Whoa congratulations first of all, 636 00:36:56,280 --> 00:37:02,839 Speaker 1: But wow, that sucks. Character? What character ours, marr I mean, 637 00:37:03,000 --> 00:37:06,759 Speaker 1: Martha's pretty jacks make. It's wild to me though, you 638 00:37:06,840 --> 00:37:09,040 Speaker 1: have the kind of self awareness as early as twelve 639 00:37:09,120 --> 00:37:11,280 Speaker 1: to be like, you know what this is like toxic? 640 00:37:11,440 --> 00:37:17,120 Speaker 1: I don't need this. Yeah, yeah, and it was really toxic. Also, 641 00:37:17,239 --> 00:37:20,520 Speaker 1: I just I prefer storyline based games. I do, like 642 00:37:20,560 --> 00:37:23,480 Speaker 1: I like party games like Mario cart and all that 643 00:37:23,520 --> 00:37:25,919 Speaker 1: kind of stuff. But like I really love a good storyline, 644 00:37:26,480 --> 00:37:28,600 Speaker 1: and so this was it was common for me growing 645 00:37:28,680 --> 00:37:30,920 Speaker 1: up to like I would watch my brothers play and 646 00:37:30,920 --> 00:37:32,520 Speaker 1: my friends would watch me play like it like it's 647 00:37:32,520 --> 00:37:35,120 Speaker 1: a movie or something, and I feel like that not 648 00:37:35,160 --> 00:37:38,440 Speaker 1: a lot of online games are like that. So it 649 00:37:38,520 --> 00:37:41,680 Speaker 1: was a couple of reasons, but it's definitely like it 650 00:37:41,840 --> 00:37:50,120 Speaker 1: scared me to play online. What you were saying about 651 00:37:50,320 --> 00:37:52,960 Speaker 1: liking games, I have a story anyways, I'm like totally 652 00:37:53,000 --> 00:37:55,440 Speaker 1: the same way. I think my my favorite game series 653 00:37:55,480 --> 00:37:59,439 Speaker 1: are probably like the Final Fantasy series, the Metal Gear 654 00:37:59,480 --> 00:38:03,960 Speaker 1: Solids areas things that I like have really like compelling, 655 00:38:04,160 --> 00:38:08,920 Speaker 1: deep storylines to them. Certain Final Fantasy games. That's um 656 00:38:09,120 --> 00:38:12,040 Speaker 1: for debate, but overall, I think like they're all written 657 00:38:12,080 --> 00:38:16,279 Speaker 1: pretty well. And um yeah, it's it's been hard for 658 00:38:16,280 --> 00:38:18,799 Speaker 1: me to get into games like Fallout or like a 659 00:38:18,840 --> 00:38:21,000 Speaker 1: BioShock or something where you're just kind of like in 660 00:38:21,080 --> 00:38:23,720 Speaker 1: first person the whole time, like kind of exploring these worlds. 661 00:38:24,000 --> 00:38:26,479 Speaker 1: That's just like it's fun, it's cool, but like there's 662 00:38:26,480 --> 00:38:28,560 Speaker 1: no like characters to latch onto as much. There's no 663 00:38:28,680 --> 00:38:31,960 Speaker 1: real like plot development. Fallout four, you're kidding me, Yes, 664 00:38:32,000 --> 00:38:35,200 Speaker 1: there is. Get Out of Town. I'm gonna get canceled 665 00:38:35,239 --> 00:38:41,200 Speaker 1: for this opinion. My favorite game for PlayStation four is 666 00:38:41,320 --> 00:38:43,680 Speaker 1: The Witcher, which is like that you go wherever you want, 667 00:38:43,680 --> 00:38:45,760 Speaker 1: to do whatever you want. But then the overall story 668 00:38:46,560 --> 00:38:50,560 Speaker 1: is in my mind so perfect and developed for a 669 00:38:50,600 --> 00:38:54,080 Speaker 1: more mature audience. It's it's made for a gamer that's 670 00:38:54,120 --> 00:38:57,480 Speaker 1: been playing since you know any Yes, there is that 671 00:38:57,560 --> 00:38:59,520 Speaker 1: you guys are talking about, like you know, there's that spectrum. 672 00:38:59,560 --> 00:39:02,280 Speaker 1: So it's like I'm thinking about like Elder s Girls 673 00:39:02,280 --> 00:39:04,960 Speaker 1: five Skyrim, which is like one of my favorites of 674 00:39:05,000 --> 00:39:09,120 Speaker 1: all time, but there's really isn't another character you'd really 675 00:39:09,239 --> 00:39:12,720 Speaker 1: ever latch onto and like that. That's what I've always 676 00:39:12,719 --> 00:39:15,000 Speaker 1: felt like one of the big improvements and fall At 677 00:39:15,000 --> 00:39:18,520 Speaker 1: four was it's like, Okay, here are these companions, some 678 00:39:18,640 --> 00:39:20,320 Speaker 1: of which when you finished the game, you're gonna have 679 00:39:20,360 --> 00:39:22,680 Speaker 1: to turn on, you're gonna have to kill. It's not perfect, 680 00:39:22,719 --> 00:39:24,520 Speaker 1: but it is a lot better. But I'm really thinking 681 00:39:24,520 --> 00:39:27,520 Speaker 1: about my favorite play through. I'm thinking like Assassin's Creed too, 682 00:39:27,520 --> 00:39:29,680 Speaker 1: and then I'm gonna include Brotherhood because that's that's the 683 00:39:29,719 --> 00:39:34,520 Speaker 1: conclusion to that. And that was you know, you had 684 00:39:34,560 --> 00:39:37,520 Speaker 1: a lot of like you know, on the tertiary stuff 685 00:39:37,560 --> 00:39:40,120 Speaker 1: you could control, but it was a straight line storyline. 686 00:39:40,280 --> 00:39:43,719 Speaker 1: You were going to start the game at seventeen years 687 00:39:43,719 --> 00:39:47,560 Speaker 1: old and at the end you're killing the Pope's son. Spoiler. 688 00:39:47,640 --> 00:39:50,000 Speaker 1: Anyone has played it yet, and I hadn't dead there yet. 689 00:39:51,120 --> 00:39:53,799 Speaker 1: I was waiting for those switch free Masters. Well, we'll 690 00:39:53,840 --> 00:39:56,640 Speaker 1: think about games like the Legend of Zelda Linked to 691 00:39:56,680 --> 00:39:59,960 Speaker 1: the Past. It came out on Supernintendo, and just how 692 00:40:00,080 --> 00:40:02,279 Speaker 1: story forward that game was, even though it was in 693 00:40:02,360 --> 00:40:05,719 Speaker 1: action game that you got to fight through tons of 694 00:40:05,800 --> 00:40:07,799 Speaker 1: enemies and you never stopped to have a battle, You're 695 00:40:07,840 --> 00:40:11,120 Speaker 1: just fighting. I don't know that that kind of game 696 00:40:11,360 --> 00:40:16,600 Speaker 1: really changed the way I thought about video games in general. 697 00:40:16,680 --> 00:40:21,640 Speaker 1: And Super Metroid Oh god, yeah, I guess up to 698 00:40:21,680 --> 00:40:23,680 Speaker 1: that point, like there was nothing really like that, right, 699 00:40:23,719 --> 00:40:27,160 Speaker 1: There was no concept of like a a story or 700 00:40:27,360 --> 00:40:30,560 Speaker 1: a motivation behind a lot of these games. It was 701 00:40:30,600 --> 00:40:33,799 Speaker 1: just like character does thing. It is fun, you will 702 00:40:33,840 --> 00:40:37,319 Speaker 1: have fun. That is the game. Did y'all ever go 703 00:40:37,400 --> 00:40:40,080 Speaker 1: on a plane flight when you were a kid and 704 00:40:40,239 --> 00:40:45,920 Speaker 1: like get a video game magazine? Oh my god? That 705 00:40:46,040 --> 00:40:49,439 Speaker 1: was again. This is me visiting my grandparents in clear 706 00:40:49,480 --> 00:40:52,000 Speaker 1: Water every once in a while, we would fly instead 707 00:40:52,040 --> 00:40:55,399 Speaker 1: of drive, and if we ever did, it was all 708 00:40:55,440 --> 00:40:58,440 Speaker 1: about getting that video game magazine for the plane flight, 709 00:40:58,640 --> 00:41:01,440 Speaker 1: and you just stare at all the amazing things that 710 00:41:01,520 --> 00:41:05,239 Speaker 1: could be in your life one day. I love that. Yeah. 711 00:41:05,280 --> 00:41:07,560 Speaker 1: I think I maybe got like Game Informer at the 712 00:41:07,640 --> 00:41:12,160 Speaker 1: like at the Hudson news stand or whatever, uh, and 713 00:41:12,200 --> 00:41:14,960 Speaker 1: would like sift through that, like being really stoked about 714 00:41:16,000 --> 00:41:18,920 Speaker 1: like the still images for Kingdom Hearts too or something. 715 00:41:19,400 --> 00:41:21,479 Speaker 1: Can we talk for a second about just how hard 716 00:41:21,560 --> 00:41:25,320 Speaker 1: games back then were, like the games on like Second 717 00:41:25,360 --> 00:41:27,960 Speaker 1: Genesis for example, like some of those Sonic games, and 718 00:41:28,040 --> 00:41:30,080 Speaker 1: if you all ever played those, but like it felt 719 00:41:30,080 --> 00:41:33,120 Speaker 1: like certain games were just impossible to be Like, I don't. 720 00:41:33,160 --> 00:41:34,720 Speaker 1: I don't think I ever beat some of those Sonic 721 00:41:34,760 --> 00:41:37,520 Speaker 1: games that were just like ridiculously hard. But I've heard 722 00:41:37,600 --> 00:41:40,480 Speaker 1: like that was the point. I think that the technology 723 00:41:40,520 --> 00:41:43,160 Speaker 1: has just come so far. There are some games I 724 00:41:43,200 --> 00:41:44,719 Speaker 1: was really good at when I was a kid, and 725 00:41:44,719 --> 00:41:48,640 Speaker 1: now I'm convinced like you compensate for like lag or Glitch, 726 00:41:48,960 --> 00:41:50,879 Speaker 1: So now when I try to play them, I'm like trying, 727 00:41:50,920 --> 00:41:53,279 Speaker 1: why isn't it turning? Like I think you get used 728 00:41:53,320 --> 00:41:55,759 Speaker 1: to those things when you're a kid and you kind 729 00:41:55,800 --> 00:41:57,240 Speaker 1: of have it in the back of your mind. Okay, 730 00:41:57,400 --> 00:42:00,360 Speaker 1: I'd start turning two seconds before I actually looks like 731 00:42:00,400 --> 00:42:02,680 Speaker 1: I need to turn. So I'm terrible at a lot 732 00:42:02,680 --> 00:42:04,600 Speaker 1: of games that used to be really really good at, 733 00:42:05,360 --> 00:42:08,520 Speaker 1: and they were. They were very, very hard. I have 734 00:42:08,600 --> 00:42:14,040 Speaker 1: many memories of just even just the physicality that. Like 735 00:42:14,080 --> 00:42:16,600 Speaker 1: there was another game where the buttons you had to 736 00:42:16,600 --> 00:42:21,840 Speaker 1: press to just jump, like double jump impossible, impossible, And 737 00:42:21,880 --> 00:42:23,560 Speaker 1: it's not like it laid it out anywhere, like now 738 00:42:23,600 --> 00:42:26,240 Speaker 1: games are really good at being like to jump, press 739 00:42:26,280 --> 00:42:28,120 Speaker 1: a back then it should just go for it. I 740 00:42:28,160 --> 00:42:32,080 Speaker 1: don't know, you figure it out your own figure. There 741 00:42:32,120 --> 00:42:33,960 Speaker 1: was a game on any S that I've played called 742 00:42:35,320 --> 00:42:40,040 Speaker 1: Iron Sword Wizards and Warriors Too. That's what it was called, 743 00:42:40,440 --> 00:42:44,040 Speaker 1: and it was my favorite game. I loved it. I 744 00:42:44,080 --> 00:42:48,800 Speaker 1: loved being this warrior in uh like a Google remember 745 00:42:48,800 --> 00:42:52,560 Speaker 1: guls and Ghosts, a little iron clad warrior with all 746 00:42:52,640 --> 00:42:55,160 Speaker 1: his armor and his sword. It was like that, but 747 00:42:55,200 --> 00:42:59,360 Speaker 1: it was way more simple and way more difficult, and 748 00:43:00,440 --> 00:43:02,719 Speaker 1: I never beat it. I have no idea how that 749 00:43:02,719 --> 00:43:05,799 Speaker 1: game ends. I still think about that game, but I 750 00:43:05,840 --> 00:43:08,879 Speaker 1: don't know. I just need to watch a walk through 751 00:43:08,880 --> 00:43:12,359 Speaker 1: on YouTube. I guess with somebody who's better than me. Yeah, yeah, 752 00:43:12,520 --> 00:43:14,560 Speaker 1: I've got that with a bunch of Mega Man games 753 00:43:14,560 --> 00:43:17,400 Speaker 1: that I would play on like PlayStation one and a 754 00:43:17,400 --> 00:43:20,600 Speaker 1: couple of other consoles. Does Mega Man games were I 755 00:43:20,600 --> 00:43:23,840 Speaker 1: think probably the hardest games I've ever played. Yeah, except 756 00:43:23,880 --> 00:43:28,839 Speaker 1: for Dark Souls. Christ No, we don't talk about Dark 757 00:43:28,880 --> 00:43:31,120 Speaker 1: Souls in this house. I never played Dark Souls, but 758 00:43:31,160 --> 00:43:32,880 Speaker 1: I live with guys who played Dark Souls, and that 759 00:43:32,960 --> 00:43:35,520 Speaker 1: was painful for me. Yeah, just like f bombs and 760 00:43:35,880 --> 00:43:37,960 Speaker 1: like hearing controllers like Smash against the Law on the 761 00:43:37,960 --> 00:43:40,440 Speaker 1: other room. I went on vacation with my roommates when 762 00:43:40,440 --> 00:43:42,640 Speaker 1: I was twenty three, and one of the dudes brought 763 00:43:42,719 --> 00:43:45,480 Speaker 1: us PS three and Dark Souls and just sat in 764 00:43:45,800 --> 00:43:48,680 Speaker 1: the condo on the beach the entire trip. What a 765 00:43:48,680 --> 00:43:51,480 Speaker 1: horrible vacation playing Dark Souls because he was hooked and 766 00:43:51,480 --> 00:43:54,000 Speaker 1: it was just pain and misery that we all have 767 00:43:54,120 --> 00:43:57,120 Speaker 1: to listen to in this small little condo and Myrtle Beach. 768 00:43:57,640 --> 00:44:00,640 Speaker 1: You guys know Tyler and Chandler, right, Yeah, I know 769 00:44:00,800 --> 00:44:03,680 Speaker 1: of them. These are two other producers who worked with us. 770 00:44:04,000 --> 00:44:06,359 Speaker 1: We used to go in the basement and put on 771 00:44:06,440 --> 00:44:10,719 Speaker 1: Dark Souls on the projector and take turns playing and 772 00:44:10,800 --> 00:44:14,640 Speaker 1: dying horribly and getting so angry and throwing controllers, and 773 00:44:14,760 --> 00:44:24,560 Speaker 1: Chandler would watch and go, you guys are dorks, but 774 00:44:24,680 --> 00:44:27,560 Speaker 1: we couldn't get enough. Do y'all deal with any like 775 00:44:28,040 --> 00:44:30,799 Speaker 1: conservative parents or people who kind of like borrored you 776 00:44:30,840 --> 00:44:33,920 Speaker 1: from playing like emiraated games and stuff like that, Like 777 00:44:34,239 --> 00:44:36,360 Speaker 1: did your parents not let you play Grand Theft Auto 778 00:44:36,440 --> 00:44:40,960 Speaker 1: or whatever? Yep. Yeah. I remember when Alex and I 779 00:44:41,000 --> 00:44:43,200 Speaker 1: got our End sixty four, we were still pretty young. 780 00:44:43,239 --> 00:44:47,800 Speaker 1: There was one rule we couldn't get Zelda because I 781 00:44:47,880 --> 00:44:50,080 Speaker 1: had swords and fighting. We were a lot of play 782 00:44:50,160 --> 00:44:53,160 Speaker 1: super Specs brothers. We weren't a lot of play Zelda. 783 00:44:53,360 --> 00:44:56,560 Speaker 1: We literally had brothers, had link plenty of swords in 784 00:44:56,600 --> 00:44:59,720 Speaker 1: that game. Yeah, and it was all about fighting. Everything 785 00:45:00,000 --> 00:45:03,520 Speaker 1: ange for me when I got a PlayStation and I 786 00:45:03,600 --> 00:45:07,680 Speaker 1: got a game called Resident Evil, and I would play 787 00:45:07,680 --> 00:45:10,719 Speaker 1: it quietly in my room at night, alone in the 788 00:45:10,800 --> 00:45:15,760 Speaker 1: dark and scaring the crap out of myself. I remember 789 00:45:15,760 --> 00:45:17,600 Speaker 1: my friend had to leave one night when he was 790 00:45:17,640 --> 00:45:19,560 Speaker 1: staying over and we were playing Resident Evil and he's like, 791 00:45:19,600 --> 00:45:25,759 Speaker 1: I gotta go home. I can't handle this. It wasn't. 792 00:45:25,800 --> 00:45:28,080 Speaker 1: I was hiding it from my parents necessarily. They just 793 00:45:28,080 --> 00:45:32,160 Speaker 1: didn't understand what the game was or how scary it 794 00:45:32,360 --> 00:45:34,239 Speaker 1: was to play, but they let you play it like 795 00:45:34,280 --> 00:45:37,000 Speaker 1: they didn't sense there it from you. That was when 796 00:45:37,000 --> 00:45:40,239 Speaker 1: I was quite a bit older, you know, old enough 797 00:45:40,280 --> 00:45:44,800 Speaker 1: to play Resident Evil. I guess was I. I don't know, God, 798 00:45:45,400 --> 00:45:49,520 Speaker 1: are we ever old enough to play Resident Even My 799 00:45:49,640 --> 00:45:51,919 Speaker 1: parents were very much kind of what you mentioned earlier, Max, 800 00:45:51,920 --> 00:45:54,680 Speaker 1: where they were like all about the educational. I had 801 00:45:54,680 --> 00:45:57,080 Speaker 1: a lot of like computer games I played that were 802 00:45:57,120 --> 00:45:59,240 Speaker 1: very educational in nature, and I loved them. I actually 803 00:45:59,239 --> 00:46:02,399 Speaker 1: still think about how fun those were. Um, so they 804 00:46:02,480 --> 00:46:06,080 Speaker 1: that was kind of there. I like to like jump 805 00:46:06,120 --> 00:46:11,040 Speaker 1: Start fifth grade. That was so yeah, I think I 806 00:46:11,040 --> 00:46:14,960 Speaker 1: would play that now still. Uh. And they knew, like 807 00:46:15,080 --> 00:46:17,920 Speaker 1: we had the Sega games, so they would see like 808 00:46:17,960 --> 00:46:21,200 Speaker 1: we had a racing game, we had a like dinosaur game. 809 00:46:21,719 --> 00:46:23,600 Speaker 1: But I think, like you said, Man, I think they 810 00:46:23,640 --> 00:46:27,040 Speaker 1: just didn't really under stand that much. So I too 811 00:46:27,040 --> 00:46:28,960 Speaker 1: played Residon Evil and I definitely was too young to 812 00:46:28,960 --> 00:46:31,439 Speaker 1: play it. That's also a game. One of the last 813 00:46:31,480 --> 00:46:33,760 Speaker 1: games that I mentioned that I bought with all my allowance. 814 00:46:33,800 --> 00:46:35,680 Speaker 1: I bought a Resident Evil game, and I was definitely 815 00:46:35,719 --> 00:46:37,600 Speaker 1: too young to buy it, but the guy didn't say anything. 816 00:46:38,160 --> 00:46:41,000 Speaker 1: I think if they had known, I don't know, they 817 00:46:41,080 --> 00:46:43,960 Speaker 1: might have still been like whatever. Because President Evil is 818 00:46:44,000 --> 00:46:46,239 Speaker 1: kind of a strange one because it's zombies. I don't 819 00:46:46,280 --> 00:46:47,920 Speaker 1: know why that makes it different, but I kind of 820 00:46:48,000 --> 00:46:50,359 Speaker 1: feels like it does. Yeah, I guess they just didn't 821 00:46:50,360 --> 00:46:51,879 Speaker 1: really understand. But I had a friend who was super 822 00:46:51,880 --> 00:46:54,880 Speaker 1: conservative and she did not Her parents were super conservative, 823 00:46:54,920 --> 00:46:56,800 Speaker 1: and she did not approve of me playing video games 824 00:46:57,200 --> 00:46:59,640 Speaker 1: and she didn't like she didn't want me to play 825 00:46:59,680 --> 00:47:03,080 Speaker 1: them around her. So I didn't counter that just on 826 00:47:03,120 --> 00:47:07,160 Speaker 1: the educational games tip. I feel like all my parents 827 00:47:07,160 --> 00:47:09,640 Speaker 1: money went into my video game addiction. Now that I've 828 00:47:09,960 --> 00:47:11,520 Speaker 1: made this, I made a list of all the games 829 00:47:11,520 --> 00:47:14,000 Speaker 1: I played, and I'm just thinking about these things. Super 830 00:47:14,080 --> 00:47:18,680 Speaker 1: Nintendo and Nintendo made a piano game. Are you guys 831 00:47:18,680 --> 00:47:21,160 Speaker 1: aware of this? Like an early Guitar Hero type thing. 832 00:47:22,040 --> 00:47:24,439 Speaker 1: It's kind of like Guitar Hero, but it was specifically 833 00:47:24,480 --> 00:47:28,080 Speaker 1: to teach somebody how to play piano, and it was 834 00:47:28,120 --> 00:47:32,160 Speaker 1: called Miracle. I believe because I think we had one. 835 00:47:32,680 --> 00:47:36,480 Speaker 1: It's weird. I remember specifically having a Miracle Keyboard. I 836 00:47:36,480 --> 00:47:38,759 Speaker 1: can't remember if we had the game for it or not, 837 00:47:39,200 --> 00:47:41,560 Speaker 1: but it was a just a cheap little keyboard and 838 00:47:41,600 --> 00:47:44,239 Speaker 1: you could plug your Nintendo or your Supernintendo into it. 839 00:47:44,320 --> 00:47:48,520 Speaker 1: But that's just really cool. Game systems did things like that. Yeah. 840 00:47:48,560 --> 00:47:51,040 Speaker 1: I mean, I know Guitar Hero is not actually teaching 841 00:47:51,040 --> 00:47:54,279 Speaker 1: anybody how to play guitar, but I feel like it 842 00:47:54,400 --> 00:47:57,120 Speaker 1: definitely inspired a lot of people I know to actually 843 00:47:57,120 --> 00:47:58,960 Speaker 1: pick up a guitar and try and figure that out. 844 00:47:59,239 --> 00:48:00,759 Speaker 1: And I think I introduce a lot of people to 845 00:48:00,920 --> 00:48:03,719 Speaker 1: like a lot of music that maybe people wouldn't have 846 00:48:03,760 --> 00:48:06,680 Speaker 1: known about otherwise. Hell yeah, dude, look at that. Matt 847 00:48:06,760 --> 00:48:13,320 Speaker 1: just pulled out a guitar. Guitar. It's my PlayStation two. Nice. 848 00:48:13,440 --> 00:48:15,600 Speaker 1: How out did those buttons work? Are? Are they like 849 00:48:15,680 --> 00:48:19,279 Speaker 1: super sticky and barely work? Both are in perfectly working order. 850 00:48:19,960 --> 00:48:23,919 Speaker 1: I loved d d R. I had the Matt Dance 851 00:48:23,960 --> 00:48:27,920 Speaker 1: Dance Revolution. I still have them, and we, me and 852 00:48:28,000 --> 00:48:30,560 Speaker 1: my little brother would just play after school. We would 853 00:48:30,560 --> 00:48:33,000 Speaker 1: play DDR, and to this day, there are certain songs 854 00:48:33,040 --> 00:48:35,960 Speaker 1: I can't hear without being like step step step jump step, 855 00:48:37,280 --> 00:48:40,719 Speaker 1: and we would just try so hard to like perfect 856 00:48:40,840 --> 00:48:44,000 Speaker 1: all the songs, and we we had to like do 857 00:48:44,120 --> 00:48:47,400 Speaker 1: some surgery on one of the mats because the sensors 858 00:48:47,440 --> 00:48:50,600 Speaker 1: got all messed up. But that was that was fun. 859 00:48:50,960 --> 00:48:52,840 Speaker 1: I had such a good time with D d R. 860 00:48:53,440 --> 00:48:55,600 Speaker 1: This is what I wanted to bring up. Um more 861 00:48:56,120 --> 00:49:02,520 Speaker 1: things that consoles introduced that were perifer periphery peripherals, so 862 00:49:02,560 --> 00:49:08,880 Speaker 1: how you say it's peripherals. Other pieces of hardware that 863 00:49:08,920 --> 00:49:12,280 Speaker 1: you would attach to your game system to play specific games. 864 00:49:13,160 --> 00:49:15,880 Speaker 1: The one I think many of us probably think about 865 00:49:16,560 --> 00:49:20,600 Speaker 1: is the Nintendo Light Gun, the orange one. Did you 866 00:49:20,640 --> 00:49:23,879 Speaker 1: guys play duck Hunt and all those? Yeah? Yeah, yeah, 867 00:49:24,640 --> 00:49:30,920 Speaker 1: Does anybody remember the Super Nintendo light Gun? Was it different? Yes, 868 00:49:32,160 --> 00:49:36,120 Speaker 1: it was a full blown bazooka called the super Scope six, 869 00:49:36,719 --> 00:49:39,520 Speaker 1: and it was a bazooka and you held it and 870 00:49:39,560 --> 00:49:41,839 Speaker 1: you played games the way you would with a light gun. 871 00:49:41,960 --> 00:49:48,160 Speaker 1: But so were you like bzooking like ducks and duck Hunters? Still? No, 872 00:49:49,360 --> 00:49:52,160 Speaker 1: I remember you're shooting like missiles that are flying through 873 00:49:52,160 --> 00:49:54,120 Speaker 1: the air. You've got your buzuka and you're trying to 874 00:49:54,120 --> 00:49:56,560 Speaker 1: shoot them down. Because I'm just imagining you're playing duck 875 00:49:56,640 --> 00:49:57,959 Speaker 1: Hunt and you're trying to hunt them and you should 876 00:49:58,000 --> 00:50:04,160 Speaker 1: have missed, lad and he just blows them. Dog goes 877 00:50:04,200 --> 00:50:10,799 Speaker 1: to sorry dog splash damage. My friend had a she 878 00:50:10,880 --> 00:50:15,840 Speaker 1: had like an early VR system, um like early early days, 879 00:50:16,760 --> 00:50:20,839 Speaker 1: and that God. I hated it because it was like 880 00:50:21,160 --> 00:50:24,360 Speaker 1: the graphics weren't good. It was really disorienting, and it 881 00:50:24,440 --> 00:50:27,160 Speaker 1: just never did what you were doing. It didn't work 882 00:50:27,280 --> 00:50:30,719 Speaker 1: very well. I guess the technology wasn't there. Yeah, I 883 00:50:30,760 --> 00:50:34,759 Speaker 1: don't know. VR never really appealed to me. However, I 884 00:50:34,760 --> 00:50:37,320 Speaker 1: feel like the Wii is probably was like the closest 885 00:50:37,320 --> 00:50:40,880 Speaker 1: thing to uh, making it sort of accessible or a 886 00:50:40,960 --> 00:50:43,799 Speaker 1: version of it accessible, because it's all like very interactive, right, 887 00:50:43,840 --> 00:50:46,239 Speaker 1: Like the whole point of the week console was like 888 00:50:46,960 --> 00:50:50,520 Speaker 1: to sort of simulate VR and or like at least 889 00:50:51,120 --> 00:50:54,719 Speaker 1: have movement correlate to things happening in the game. I 890 00:50:54,800 --> 00:50:58,360 Speaker 1: just really quickly want to talk about the experience of 891 00:50:58,360 --> 00:51:01,799 Speaker 1: playing video games with your child. It's given me a 892 00:51:01,800 --> 00:51:03,920 Speaker 1: ton of perspective just on what it was, what it 893 00:51:03,960 --> 00:51:07,240 Speaker 1: must have been like from my parents to like release 894 00:51:07,320 --> 00:51:11,160 Speaker 1: me into these video game worlds and trust that I would. 895 00:51:12,360 --> 00:51:15,279 Speaker 1: I don't know. It's it's about decision making in a 896 00:51:15,320 --> 00:51:19,600 Speaker 1: lot of cases, especially in newer games. Like what decision 897 00:51:19,600 --> 00:51:23,719 Speaker 1: will my son make when he encounters a bunch of 898 00:51:23,719 --> 00:51:27,240 Speaker 1: farm animals and Minecraft? How will he react when villagers 899 00:51:27,239 --> 00:51:30,919 Speaker 1: are around in Minecraft? And you know, having those conversations 900 00:51:30,960 --> 00:51:34,400 Speaker 1: with him about well, you know, why would we just 901 00:51:34,480 --> 00:51:39,160 Speaker 1: kill all of these guys or what what's the difference 902 00:51:39,200 --> 00:51:41,400 Speaker 1: between if you'd kill the villager or if you trade 903 00:51:41,400 --> 00:51:43,960 Speaker 1: with the villager. I know that's kind of weird thing 904 00:51:44,000 --> 00:51:48,080 Speaker 1: to think about, but I'm just imagining the learning opportunities 905 00:51:48,200 --> 00:51:50,360 Speaker 1: that aren't just sitting down and you know, learning the 906 00:51:50,360 --> 00:51:52,640 Speaker 1: way with the with the educational games that we used 907 00:51:52,680 --> 00:51:57,600 Speaker 1: to play, but learning about interaction with other things in 908 00:51:57,640 --> 00:52:03,240 Speaker 1: an environment. I both leave. There was a big study 909 00:52:03,320 --> 00:52:07,160 Speaker 1: done about that and specifically like actions have consequences and 910 00:52:07,280 --> 00:52:13,520 Speaker 1: learning that through video games and what that can look like. 911 00:52:14,239 --> 00:52:16,040 Speaker 1: And this is sort of outside the scope of what 912 00:52:16,080 --> 00:52:18,640 Speaker 1: we're talking about today, but video games have been used 913 00:52:19,480 --> 00:52:22,880 Speaker 1: to train people to do things, and one thing I 914 00:52:22,920 --> 00:52:27,520 Speaker 1: find really interesting about them is that sort of aspect 915 00:52:27,600 --> 00:52:30,759 Speaker 1: of when you're designing a game, you do have to 916 00:52:30,800 --> 00:52:33,200 Speaker 1: kind of get into like how the human brain works, 917 00:52:33,239 --> 00:52:35,440 Speaker 1: and like are they going to get that they need 918 00:52:35,480 --> 00:52:38,120 Speaker 1: to go over here? All these really interesting design elements, 919 00:52:38,160 --> 00:52:43,880 Speaker 1: but essentially trying to codify humans and what are they 920 00:52:43,880 --> 00:52:47,759 Speaker 1: going to do in the space, which I find like 921 00:52:49,239 --> 00:52:52,879 Speaker 1: really really really fascinating, and and the ways that they 922 00:52:52,880 --> 00:52:56,080 Speaker 1: can they can be used as kind of a teaching 923 00:52:56,080 --> 00:53:02,120 Speaker 1: way but also like a reflection of of yourself. It 924 00:53:02,239 --> 00:53:04,560 Speaker 1: is weird how video games for me, at this point 925 00:53:04,560 --> 00:53:08,040 Speaker 1: in my late thirties are are in a it's an escape. 926 00:53:08,160 --> 00:53:12,279 Speaker 1: It's an avoidance almost of real responsibility, things that I 927 00:53:12,320 --> 00:53:14,719 Speaker 1: know I need to get done that I just need 928 00:53:14,760 --> 00:53:19,360 Speaker 1: a break after working or after doing something stressful, um, 929 00:53:19,560 --> 00:53:25,200 Speaker 1: go into a different place, disassociate a bit weirdly, um 930 00:53:25,280 --> 00:53:27,799 Speaker 1: m m. And I've been doing that since I was 931 00:53:27,800 --> 00:53:30,120 Speaker 1: a kid. When I was stressed out with school or something, 932 00:53:30,160 --> 00:53:33,120 Speaker 1: I would want to play my video game. Uh. That's 933 00:53:33,120 --> 00:53:36,919 Speaker 1: why Ultimate Online was a real addiction a problem. Yeah, 934 00:53:37,120 --> 00:53:41,120 Speaker 1: I'm with you. It's weird. How to me that like 935 00:53:41,239 --> 00:53:44,360 Speaker 1: feeling of escapism and addiction and all that kind of 936 00:53:44,400 --> 00:53:47,480 Speaker 1: stuff like like carries with you your whole life in 937 00:53:47,520 --> 00:53:52,040 Speaker 1: a weird way, like games provide that I think that'll 938 00:53:52,040 --> 00:53:53,400 Speaker 1: probably carry with us. I don't know what do you 939 00:53:53,400 --> 00:53:56,880 Speaker 1: guys think, Like how do you see gaming, um like 940 00:53:56,960 --> 00:53:58,880 Speaker 1: being a part of your life over the next like 941 00:53:58,920 --> 00:54:01,399 Speaker 1: say ten to twenty year is what do you think 942 00:54:01,400 --> 00:54:05,959 Speaker 1: it will be for you? It's a good question, So yeah, 943 00:54:06,000 --> 00:54:11,040 Speaker 1: currently I use them. They're definitely kind of an escapism 944 00:54:11,040 --> 00:54:14,759 Speaker 1: and kind of like babysit your brain sometimes just when 945 00:54:14,880 --> 00:54:18,719 Speaker 1: do this. I really really enjoy story games, as I said, 946 00:54:18,760 --> 00:54:22,040 Speaker 1: and I think there are some video games that the 947 00:54:22,080 --> 00:54:24,400 Speaker 1: story is so good. I guess what I'm saying is 948 00:54:24,440 --> 00:54:26,520 Speaker 1: to me, I feel like in the future, I'm going 949 00:54:26,600 --> 00:54:28,720 Speaker 1: to still be playing these same games because it's almost 950 00:54:28,800 --> 00:54:31,680 Speaker 1: like an interactive movie, which I do like. I know 951 00:54:31,719 --> 00:54:34,960 Speaker 1: some people don't, but I really like getting caught up 952 00:54:34,960 --> 00:54:37,880 Speaker 1: in the story and getting to control it. And there's 953 00:54:37,960 --> 00:54:40,880 Speaker 1: so many instances in my life where I'll look back 954 00:54:40,920 --> 00:54:43,839 Speaker 1: and I'm a grown woman and I'll stay up all 955 00:54:43,960 --> 00:54:45,600 Speaker 1: night because I want to know how the story ends, 956 00:54:45,640 --> 00:54:47,440 Speaker 1: like I'll be up, I can't stop, I can't stop, 957 00:54:47,480 --> 00:54:50,239 Speaker 1: I kiss out, like I know how it ends. Um. 958 00:54:50,360 --> 00:54:51,920 Speaker 1: So I think that for me it's going to be 959 00:54:53,360 --> 00:54:55,759 Speaker 1: it's gonna be like that. I would be very it 960 00:54:55,800 --> 00:54:58,200 Speaker 1: would be funny to me if I like suddenly love 961 00:54:58,280 --> 00:55:02,439 Speaker 1: something like animal crossing and like switches. But I think 962 00:55:02,440 --> 00:55:04,839 Speaker 1: it's I'm going to stay the course. I'm pretty sure 963 00:55:04,840 --> 00:55:06,880 Speaker 1: I'm going to keep like ten twenty years from now, 964 00:55:06,880 --> 00:55:09,799 Speaker 1: I'm still gonna be playing video games. Yeah, same, And 965 00:55:09,840 --> 00:55:13,080 Speaker 1: I think my answer is probably similar, but I'd add 966 00:55:13,960 --> 00:55:17,920 Speaker 1: that I feel like video games as a storytelling vehicle 967 00:55:18,880 --> 00:55:23,040 Speaker 1: is like improving so vastly with every new generation of games. 968 00:55:23,120 --> 00:55:26,719 Speaker 1: Like God of War, for example, just like blew my 969 00:55:26,760 --> 00:55:29,880 Speaker 1: mind with like, um, like how well it was written, 970 00:55:30,400 --> 00:55:33,000 Speaker 1: like the kind of like emotional density of it, like 971 00:55:33,320 --> 00:55:37,279 Speaker 1: the how real the characters like felt both in their 972 00:55:37,320 --> 00:55:39,319 Speaker 1: like dialogue and the way they look and a moat. 973 00:55:39,880 --> 00:55:42,120 Speaker 1: You know, It's like games are becoming so advanced now 974 00:55:42,200 --> 00:55:44,920 Speaker 1: that like it's it's no longer just like the kind 975 00:55:44,920 --> 00:55:49,880 Speaker 1: of clunky, you know, dialogue box sort of storytelling from 976 00:55:49,960 --> 00:55:51,759 Speaker 1: you know, not even that long ago. I feel like 977 00:55:51,800 --> 00:55:54,640 Speaker 1: even in the early is like go back and listen 978 00:55:54,680 --> 00:55:57,200 Speaker 1: to some of that dialogue on a lot of popular games, 979 00:55:57,200 --> 00:56:00,319 Speaker 1: and it's just like really kind of cringe e and 980 00:56:00,440 --> 00:56:03,000 Speaker 1: like not great, but like, man, they're getting so much 981 00:56:03,000 --> 00:56:05,840 Speaker 1: better at that, Like they're getting real voice actors and 982 00:56:06,360 --> 00:56:09,000 Speaker 1: like them, the c g I is getting to the 983 00:56:09,000 --> 00:56:12,160 Speaker 1: point where like it really looks like they're saying, you know, 984 00:56:12,200 --> 00:56:16,280 Speaker 1: almost like a like high budget, multimillion dollar like animated 985 00:56:16,320 --> 00:56:18,960 Speaker 1: film or something like that. So I'm really excited to 986 00:56:19,000 --> 00:56:22,080 Speaker 1: see like how the storytelling and like both in terms 987 00:56:22,080 --> 00:56:26,279 Speaker 1: of visual effects and in writing like gets better over 988 00:56:26,280 --> 00:56:28,319 Speaker 1: the next ten to twenty years. You know, I feel 989 00:56:28,320 --> 00:56:31,520 Speaker 1: like we're gonna get like a Citizen Kane of video 990 00:56:31,600 --> 00:56:33,840 Speaker 1: gaming here in the next few years. I feel like 991 00:56:33,840 --> 00:56:36,359 Speaker 1: it's inevitable. When I think about gaming in the future, 992 00:56:36,360 --> 00:56:38,640 Speaker 1: I think it's going to probably stay the same. I mean, 993 00:56:39,120 --> 00:56:42,000 Speaker 1: I feel like it's just like part of it's a thread, 994 00:56:42,040 --> 00:56:44,120 Speaker 1: the tapestory of like me as a person. It's like 995 00:56:44,880 --> 00:56:47,800 Speaker 1: it's such an important thing, like working on this. This 996 00:56:47,880 --> 00:56:49,520 Speaker 1: is like, you know, these last few weeks, I'm like, 997 00:56:49,560 --> 00:56:52,480 Speaker 1: oh man, I'm being so nostalgic. I'm thinking about things 998 00:56:53,360 --> 00:56:56,040 Speaker 1: like I'm thinking about how bad my brother always tried 999 00:56:56,040 --> 00:56:58,840 Speaker 1: to cheat every video game and still lost. He was 1000 00:56:58,840 --> 00:57:01,120 Speaker 1: still lose to me, but he would tried really hard 1001 00:57:01,160 --> 00:57:04,000 Speaker 1: to cheat every some time. It's like, I don't know, 1002 00:57:04,080 --> 00:57:07,400 Speaker 1: I like, I don't see myself, you know, being my 1003 00:57:07,480 --> 00:57:10,600 Speaker 1: fifties and not having video games around. I just think 1004 00:57:10,680 --> 00:57:12,480 Speaker 1: it's like, you know, if I do have a family. 1005 00:57:12,480 --> 00:57:14,000 Speaker 1: One day I do have kids, I think I'm gonna 1006 00:57:14,000 --> 00:57:16,280 Speaker 1: be like, hey, here are video games, because they don't 1007 00:57:16,280 --> 00:57:18,040 Speaker 1: give me excuse to play video games with you and 1008 00:57:18,080 --> 00:57:21,240 Speaker 1: stuff like that. I love what you said, Max about 1009 00:57:22,480 --> 00:57:25,200 Speaker 1: video games being a part of the tapestry. That is 1010 00:57:25,240 --> 00:57:27,320 Speaker 1: you like, I'm looking at a list right now. I 1011 00:57:27,560 --> 00:57:29,760 Speaker 1: can just see it. This is my life right here 1012 00:57:29,800 --> 00:57:33,439 Speaker 1: in a list of titles. Um. And at the top 1013 00:57:33,480 --> 00:57:36,800 Speaker 1: of the list is that in television video game system 1014 00:57:36,880 --> 00:57:40,200 Speaker 1: that I had when I was a little kid. I 1015 00:57:40,240 --> 00:57:45,160 Speaker 1: don't have clear memories of it, but I remember um 1016 00:57:45,200 --> 00:57:48,240 Speaker 1: sitting in front of this old CRT television with my dad, 1017 00:57:48,320 --> 00:57:52,040 Speaker 1: specifically my dad, and we were playing, Uh, do you 1018 00:57:52,040 --> 00:57:55,200 Speaker 1: remember the old game Centipede? We were playing Centipede together. 1019 00:57:55,920 --> 00:58:00,200 Speaker 1: Recently took my son to david Busters and there was 1020 00:58:00,240 --> 00:58:03,520 Speaker 1: a Centipede game, like an arcade game with Centipede, and 1021 00:58:03,560 --> 00:58:05,919 Speaker 1: it was cool and new and looked neater and had 1022 00:58:06,040 --> 00:58:08,480 Speaker 1: flashing lights and everything. And he looked at it and 1023 00:58:08,480 --> 00:58:10,840 Speaker 1: he just wanted to play. He said, Dad, play with me. 1024 00:58:11,760 --> 00:58:14,600 Speaker 1: So I sat down with him and we played a 1025 00:58:14,600 --> 00:58:21,280 Speaker 1: bunch of rounds. And I think just using video games 1026 00:58:21,320 --> 00:58:24,320 Speaker 1: in the future for me as an excuse to spend 1027 00:58:24,360 --> 00:58:26,680 Speaker 1: some quiet time with my son where we get to 1028 00:58:28,080 --> 00:58:31,520 Speaker 1: bond and learn about things and have those moral choices 1029 00:58:31,680 --> 00:58:35,160 Speaker 1: that I was talking about, and just, I don't know, 1030 00:58:35,280 --> 00:58:38,120 Speaker 1: using them as a weirdly a tool to kind of 1031 00:58:38,160 --> 00:58:41,360 Speaker 1: shape his outlook on the world and the way he 1032 00:58:41,480 --> 00:58:46,600 Speaker 1: views other people and things within it and himself. As 1033 00:58:46,640 --> 00:58:49,480 Speaker 1: you were speaking to Annie, like through this character, how 1034 00:58:49,520 --> 00:58:56,480 Speaker 1: do I see myself? That's what I'm gonna do. This 1035 00:58:56,520 --> 00:58:59,520 Speaker 1: episode of a Thema was co written by Max Billiams 1036 00:58:59,640 --> 00:59:03,320 Speaker 1: and Every Yung, with production by Max Williams and additional 1037 00:59:03,440 --> 00:59:06,800 Speaker 1: editing from Jesse Fonk. Stephen L. Kent is the author 1038 00:59:06,840 --> 00:59:09,760 Speaker 1: of the Ultimate History of Video Games Volumes one and two. 1039 00:59:10,560 --> 00:59:13,080 Speaker 1: Some of the great music this episode, like the piece 1040 00:59:13,120 --> 00:59:16,400 Speaker 1: you're hearing now comes Curtis to the artist mon plays you. 1041 00:59:17,000 --> 00:59:19,400 Speaker 1: If you've listened to Ephemeral for a while, you've heard 1042 00:59:19,400 --> 00:59:21,720 Speaker 1: a lot of their work, and we're happy to announce 1043 00:59:21,920 --> 00:59:25,320 Speaker 1: we'll have an upcoming episode interviewing the artist for now 1044 00:59:25,680 --> 00:59:29,840 Speaker 1: here more at Loyalty Freak music dot com and big 1045 00:59:29,840 --> 00:59:33,680 Speaker 1: thanks to our return guests Matt Frederick and Annie Reese. 1046 00:59:34,040 --> 00:59:36,640 Speaker 1: We'd love to hear from you about your favorite games, 1047 00:59:37,040 --> 00:59:39,280 Speaker 1: What are your best gaming memories. What do you think 1048 00:59:39,280 --> 00:59:41,960 Speaker 1: the future holds for video games? Let us know on 1049 00:59:42,040 --> 00:59:46,640 Speaker 1: social media. We're at ephemeral show and for more podcasts 1050 00:59:46,640 --> 00:59:50,600 Speaker 1: from iHeart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, 1051 00:59:51,000 --> 00:59:53,080 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.