1 00:00:02,279 --> 00:00:04,840 Speaker 1: Give it a chance, Give it a chance, Give it 2 00:00:04,880 --> 00:00:07,040 Speaker 1: a chance. Come morning, give it a chance. Give it 3 00:00:07,080 --> 00:00:10,080 Speaker 1: a chance, give it a chance, Give it a chance. Morning, 4 00:00:10,119 --> 00:00:12,040 Speaker 1: Give it a You want to give it a chance, 5 00:00:12,280 --> 00:00:14,720 Speaker 1: Give it a chance, Give it a chance. Just give 6 00:00:17,200 --> 00:00:19,360 Speaker 1: we're doing it. 7 00:00:19,360 --> 00:00:22,040 Speaker 2: It's I took a chance. You took a chance. Let's 8 00:00:22,040 --> 00:00:24,880 Speaker 2: all collectively take iron a chance. 9 00:00:25,000 --> 00:00:28,440 Speaker 1: Everyone screams it in their cars on the subway, like 10 00:00:28,480 --> 00:00:30,520 Speaker 1: with people around, They're all screaming. 11 00:00:30,600 --> 00:00:33,040 Speaker 2: Oh chance. You never know where this is going to 12 00:00:33,120 --> 00:00:37,559 Speaker 2: end up. We could be huge, dude, we could be 13 00:00:37,600 --> 00:00:41,040 Speaker 2: having that kind of Ferrispueler moment, street moment, street wibes. 14 00:00:42,080 --> 00:00:44,720 Speaker 1: You know. I actually it's interesting because today's eppy. 15 00:00:45,040 --> 00:00:49,760 Speaker 2: Oh Mari, oh god, oh God, always work in this guy. 16 00:00:50,600 --> 00:00:51,920 Speaker 1: It's a cultural moment. 17 00:00:52,640 --> 00:00:57,360 Speaker 2: Uh oh, I'm not throwing away Matt shot. Isn't that No? 18 00:00:57,440 --> 00:01:01,440 Speaker 1: You keep wanting it to be that. Well, I'm you just. 19 00:01:01,440 --> 00:01:04,679 Speaker 2: Gotta be hungry. I'm just like my country. Sorry, keep going. 20 00:01:04,680 --> 00:01:06,440 Speaker 1: I think we'd have to do a different Linn thing 21 00:01:06,520 --> 00:01:09,280 Speaker 1: because print Manuel, because it would because he you know, 22 00:01:09,360 --> 00:01:12,240 Speaker 1: he's got that in the heights. I the guy. The 23 00:01:12,280 --> 00:01:18,560 Speaker 1: guy's always like hamiltone Heights and I'm always like, I 24 00:01:18,560 --> 00:01:19,840 Speaker 1: don't think you say it that way. 25 00:01:20,600 --> 00:01:22,840 Speaker 2: I have so much we can't do this today. I 26 00:01:22,880 --> 00:01:28,360 Speaker 2: have so much lin Manuel stuff, double barrels. It's it's like, yeah, 27 00:01:28,440 --> 00:01:31,399 Speaker 2: it's like now, I mean also, I'm trying to we 28 00:01:31,480 --> 00:01:33,640 Speaker 2: hear this will be for another time. Chances this isn't 29 00:01:33,640 --> 00:01:35,559 Speaker 2: a bait and switch. We're not getting into lin Manuel 30 00:01:35,680 --> 00:01:38,680 Speaker 2: right now. What what is the cultural moment we're getting 31 00:01:38,680 --> 00:01:39,160 Speaker 2: into though? 32 00:01:39,800 --> 00:01:45,400 Speaker 1: Okay, Coldplay the two people I thought you were going 33 00:01:45,440 --> 00:01:47,680 Speaker 1: to guess that. I tell you're a guest that can 34 00:01:47,720 --> 00:01:49,840 Speaker 1: I say one thing about I know we're tangenting it again? 35 00:01:50,120 --> 00:01:51,840 Speaker 2: It doesn't matter at all. People just want to hear 36 00:01:51,920 --> 00:01:52,760 Speaker 2: us rap, dude. 37 00:01:53,200 --> 00:01:55,960 Speaker 1: My favorite thing is that Kanye refers to Chris Martin 38 00:01:56,040 --> 00:01:59,559 Speaker 1: as Coldplay. He's like, he did a song with Chris Martin, 39 00:01:59,600 --> 00:02:01,640 Speaker 1: and He's like, I did a song with Coldplay. Yeah, 40 00:02:01,680 --> 00:02:03,720 Speaker 1: now jay Z is going to do a song with Coldplay. 41 00:02:03,800 --> 00:02:06,720 Speaker 2: I think for the precise thing, if I remember correctly 42 00:02:06,760 --> 00:02:09,240 Speaker 2: from Big Brother, which is the last song on Graduation, 43 00:02:09,919 --> 00:02:13,720 Speaker 2: is when he goes, I said I would do a 44 00:02:13,760 --> 00:02:16,280 Speaker 2: song with cold Play. Next thing, I know, you did 45 00:02:16,320 --> 00:02:18,400 Speaker 2: a song with Coldplay or something like that. And I 46 00:02:18,440 --> 00:02:26,480 Speaker 2: was like, uh, no way, Jose love it. 47 00:02:25,800 --> 00:02:29,840 Speaker 1: All right? Sorry, sorry, sorry, okay, this is a cultural moment. Now. 48 00:02:29,960 --> 00:02:32,360 Speaker 1: You know. The fun thing is that listeners know what 49 00:02:32,400 --> 00:02:35,400 Speaker 1: it is from the from the name of the episode. 50 00:02:36,040 --> 00:02:38,080 Speaker 2: Oh okay, I don't know this yet. 51 00:02:38,440 --> 00:02:41,440 Speaker 1: And this is the first time that we've done an album. 52 00:02:41,560 --> 00:02:43,240 Speaker 1: Not then we're going to listen to the whole album, 53 00:02:43,280 --> 00:02:46,240 Speaker 1: but we're going to talk about this infamous album. 54 00:02:46,400 --> 00:02:50,000 Speaker 2: Oh my god, well scared, what do. 55 00:02:49,960 --> 00:02:55,480 Speaker 1: You think is one of the most god yeah, infamous albums. 56 00:02:55,160 --> 00:02:56,840 Speaker 2: Ever, like of all time? 57 00:02:57,639 --> 00:03:00,600 Speaker 1: Infamy can mean yes, so yeah, I guess like what 58 00:03:00,760 --> 00:03:04,040 Speaker 1: was culturally like like a big cultural eye roll of 59 00:03:04,080 --> 00:03:04,960 Speaker 1: an album, A. 60 00:03:04,919 --> 00:03:09,320 Speaker 2: Bit a good hint culutural eye roll of an album? 61 00:03:09,600 --> 00:03:12,200 Speaker 2: Well in the present moment or is this in the past? 62 00:03:12,720 --> 00:03:13,880 Speaker 1: It's past, all right. 63 00:03:13,919 --> 00:03:17,000 Speaker 2: I was thinking about this whole Will Smith rollout that 64 00:03:17,160 --> 00:03:20,880 Speaker 2: just happened, because I know, I even I know tangentially 65 00:03:20,919 --> 00:03:25,320 Speaker 2: that he has just been torn apart while doing that, 66 00:03:25,480 --> 00:03:28,200 Speaker 2: but I don't really. I only saw one freestyle where 67 00:03:28,280 --> 00:03:30,240 Speaker 2: said something about like I bite off more than I 68 00:03:30,280 --> 00:03:33,160 Speaker 2: could chew and then not chew it or something like that. 69 00:03:33,240 --> 00:03:34,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, I saw that. 70 00:03:35,080 --> 00:03:38,200 Speaker 2: The Katy Perry album that just came out last year. 71 00:03:38,360 --> 00:03:40,520 Speaker 2: People went nuts and a negative about that. Then she 72 00:03:40,560 --> 00:03:41,400 Speaker 2: flew into space. 73 00:03:41,880 --> 00:03:44,040 Speaker 1: Oh no, I knew the flu into space, but I 74 00:03:44,040 --> 00:03:45,680 Speaker 1: didn't hear much about the record. But you know, I'm 75 00:03:45,720 --> 00:03:49,119 Speaker 1: not really in it anymore with the with the Katy 76 00:03:49,200 --> 00:03:51,520 Speaker 1: Perry's I guess so okay. 77 00:03:51,160 --> 00:03:53,120 Speaker 2: So oh for two? So far are we going further 78 00:03:53,240 --> 00:03:56,400 Speaker 2: back into the public consciousness? This is amazing and an 79 00:03:56,440 --> 00:03:59,720 Speaker 2: infant Oh Chinese Democracy by Guns n' Roses. No. 80 00:04:00,040 --> 00:04:01,520 Speaker 1: One day, I do want to do a song off 81 00:04:01,520 --> 00:04:04,240 Speaker 1: that I really do for you because you're such a 82 00:04:04,320 --> 00:04:06,280 Speaker 1: GNR guy, And I was like, I don't think you 83 00:04:06,320 --> 00:04:07,760 Speaker 1: probably know that record at all. 84 00:04:07,920 --> 00:04:10,080 Speaker 2: I have a story about that for that day too. 85 00:04:10,840 --> 00:04:11,240 Speaker 1: We'll do that. 86 00:04:11,280 --> 00:04:13,640 Speaker 2: We'll do that's always got stories about prim Manuel and 87 00:04:13,720 --> 00:04:15,280 Speaker 2: lyn Manuel and Axel Manuel. 88 00:04:15,840 --> 00:04:19,000 Speaker 1: We do. We'll do China. Let's do Chinese democracy next episode. 89 00:04:19,040 --> 00:04:22,520 Speaker 2: All right, fine, let's see okay, So are we? Are 90 00:04:22,520 --> 00:04:25,520 Speaker 2: we between two thousand and six and twenty four? 91 00:04:26,200 --> 00:04:27,040 Speaker 1: Six and twenty four? 92 00:04:27,120 --> 00:04:30,240 Speaker 2: Yes, give me two more, two more chances. Between two 93 00:04:30,240 --> 00:04:34,719 Speaker 2: thousand and six and twenty four A notorious It was. 94 00:04:34,720 --> 00:04:37,880 Speaker 1: A pretty beloved band that sort of like kind of 95 00:04:37,920 --> 00:04:40,400 Speaker 1: like like became a little bit more not in the zone. 96 00:04:40,440 --> 00:04:43,560 Speaker 2: Oh my god, it's the U two album that everybody. 97 00:04:43,160 --> 00:04:45,880 Speaker 1: Put on that funny you got it, baby, you got it. 98 00:04:45,960 --> 00:04:48,080 Speaker 1: That's literally what I want to name the episode. I 99 00:04:48,120 --> 00:04:51,320 Speaker 1: want to name it the U two album that they 100 00:04:51,360 --> 00:04:52,880 Speaker 1: put on everybody's phones. 101 00:04:53,520 --> 00:04:55,440 Speaker 2: Like, that's what I want to so funny. 102 00:04:55,800 --> 00:04:57,240 Speaker 1: I don't want to name it. I don't want to 103 00:04:57,320 --> 00:04:59,919 Speaker 1: name it the song, whatever song we choose, because that 104 00:05:00,000 --> 00:05:02,000 Speaker 1: that's where I'm having trouble with and I need your help. 105 00:05:02,240 --> 00:05:04,240 Speaker 2: I don't know that. Isn't there a song called like 106 00:05:04,480 --> 00:05:07,960 Speaker 2: Saint Joey Ramone or something, the Ballad of Joey Ramone? 107 00:05:08,080 --> 00:05:10,240 Speaker 1: So close, and it's so funny because it's so close 108 00:05:10,279 --> 00:05:12,960 Speaker 1: to your original band name, like you're your first, like 109 00:05:13,000 --> 00:05:15,720 Speaker 1: when I you're first, but like your your your band name. 110 00:05:15,960 --> 00:05:17,800 Speaker 1: It's called the Miracle of Joey Ramone. 111 00:05:18,000 --> 00:05:20,640 Speaker 2: We have to do that. I think that's mandatory because 112 00:05:20,680 --> 00:05:22,640 Speaker 2: we have to do that. It's because this is my 113 00:05:22,800 --> 00:05:27,320 Speaker 2: favorite thing about God. You Too is such a rich, 114 00:05:28,880 --> 00:05:33,440 Speaker 2: rangey subject about I have feelings in every direction about 115 00:05:33,440 --> 00:05:36,000 Speaker 2: you two. There's certain moments in You Too that I 116 00:05:36,040 --> 00:05:41,120 Speaker 2: think are like undeniably almost transcendently beautiful. Even though I 117 00:05:41,160 --> 00:05:43,479 Speaker 2: probably never need to hear their music again for the 118 00:05:43,480 --> 00:05:45,360 Speaker 2: rest of my life, I've heard it. It's like there's 119 00:05:45,360 --> 00:05:47,640 Speaker 2: certain bands I'm like, I'm good on YouTube, I've heard 120 00:05:47,760 --> 00:05:50,279 Speaker 2: enough you too, But then if you hit me in 121 00:05:50,279 --> 00:05:54,640 Speaker 2: the right moment, I'm like, one comes on. I'm like, 122 00:05:54,760 --> 00:05:57,880 Speaker 2: this is like a spiritual experience listening to this song. 123 00:05:58,279 --> 00:06:00,320 Speaker 2: And then there's other things where I'm like, this is 124 00:06:00,360 --> 00:06:06,040 Speaker 2: the most hubristic, ridiculous man. He's like flirting with peak 125 00:06:06,880 --> 00:06:11,960 Speaker 2: unacceptable levels of cartoonish rock star indulgence, messianic horseshit. 126 00:06:12,720 --> 00:06:15,960 Speaker 1: So yeah, he's very Kanye. He's very It's very you know, 127 00:06:16,000 --> 00:06:18,200 Speaker 1: because there's stuff that he Kanye did that is like 128 00:06:18,279 --> 00:06:20,359 Speaker 1: so awesome, and then there's like trash and it's like 129 00:06:21,200 --> 00:06:23,920 Speaker 1: it's very it's different. I don't I wouldn't put Bono 130 00:06:24,040 --> 00:06:26,000 Speaker 1: to that, but it's really. 131 00:06:26,000 --> 00:06:29,840 Speaker 2: Well, maybe there's certain mental health induced public breakdown issues 132 00:06:29,880 --> 00:06:32,520 Speaker 2: with Kanye that put him in his own private Idaho 133 00:06:32,680 --> 00:06:36,400 Speaker 2: compared to a lot of other people, but I do 134 00:06:36,520 --> 00:06:40,760 Speaker 2: think the common thread is a person who certainly believes, 135 00:06:41,000 --> 00:06:46,320 Speaker 2: like Bono, thinks he's like the Pope or something or 136 00:06:46,320 --> 00:06:50,080 Speaker 2: that he's like some cross between like Leonard Cohen and 137 00:06:50,240 --> 00:06:54,280 Speaker 2: John F. Kennedy or something like that. Like he's a 138 00:06:54,320 --> 00:06:57,120 Speaker 2: really specific strain of like I fully get it when 139 00:06:57,120 --> 00:06:59,960 Speaker 2: there's people that are just like he's like some people's 140 00:07:00,279 --> 00:07:02,960 Speaker 2: prime offender. When it's like who is the person you 141 00:07:03,080 --> 00:07:05,640 Speaker 2: cannot handle at all? It's like bono, like you there 142 00:07:05,640 --> 00:07:08,120 Speaker 2: are certain people wouldn't even have to And I get it. 143 00:07:08,440 --> 00:07:09,600 Speaker 2: I fully get it. 144 00:07:10,400 --> 00:07:12,720 Speaker 1: And is it because he's like always trying so hard 145 00:07:12,760 --> 00:07:15,800 Speaker 1: to save the world. But it's like from his mansion. 146 00:07:16,240 --> 00:07:18,640 Speaker 2: I think that there's little lifestyles of the rich and 147 00:07:18,680 --> 00:07:21,200 Speaker 2: famous in there for people. I also think there's a 148 00:07:21,360 --> 00:07:25,120 Speaker 2: like like what I definitely I think that's part of it. 149 00:07:25,160 --> 00:07:26,480 Speaker 2: There's a little bit of like who do you think 150 00:07:26,520 --> 00:07:28,600 Speaker 2: you are? I also think there is some of what 151 00:07:28,680 --> 00:07:32,080 Speaker 2: he does. There's like, you know, you take a dash 152 00:07:32,120 --> 00:07:34,680 Speaker 2: of ketus, you take a dash of There's like a 153 00:07:34,720 --> 00:07:37,440 Speaker 2: lot of like stuff going on with him. There's also 154 00:07:37,560 --> 00:07:39,600 Speaker 2: one of the best things. I encourage you all before 155 00:07:39,600 --> 00:07:40,960 Speaker 2: we even listen to the song. I know we got 156 00:07:41,000 --> 00:07:43,920 Speaker 2: to get into the actual song, which I've never heard. 157 00:07:44,080 --> 00:07:47,600 Speaker 2: I encourage you all. There is a video on the 158 00:07:47,680 --> 00:07:50,600 Speaker 2: internet in nineteen eighty six or seven or something where 159 00:07:50,640 --> 00:07:53,480 Speaker 2: you two is playing a street fair in San Francisco 160 00:07:54,720 --> 00:07:58,160 Speaker 2: and someone in San Francisco is wearing an SF San 161 00:07:58,200 --> 00:08:01,920 Speaker 2: Francisco Giants base ball cap and they're a ugtwo fan, 162 00:08:02,000 --> 00:08:03,680 Speaker 2: and they're freaking out in the front row, and he 163 00:08:04,160 --> 00:08:07,440 Speaker 2: stops the music and starts vamping over like a little 164 00:08:07,520 --> 00:08:11,800 Speaker 2: riff that's being played, screaming at the person who he 165 00:08:11,880 --> 00:08:17,360 Speaker 2: thinks is wearing a shin fane or Irish revolutionary and 166 00:08:17,400 --> 00:08:20,800 Speaker 2: he's like, you think that's cool, you think that's right, 167 00:08:21,360 --> 00:08:23,720 Speaker 2: And he's basically like and the person, I just wish 168 00:08:23,800 --> 00:08:27,400 Speaker 2: you could see the person because they're clearly going like, no, no, no, dude, 169 00:08:27,400 --> 00:08:29,400 Speaker 2: I'm a fan of the San Francisco Giants. 170 00:08:29,400 --> 00:08:33,800 Speaker 1: You're in in San Francisco. That's so funny. It is. 171 00:08:34,600 --> 00:08:37,720 Speaker 2: It is really one of my five favorite I'll watch 172 00:08:37,760 --> 00:08:39,760 Speaker 2: that sometimes when I just need a little pick me 173 00:08:39,880 --> 00:08:44,880 Speaker 2: up and the espress he ain't hitting right that morning, but. 174 00:08:44,880 --> 00:08:46,840 Speaker 1: Anyway, you need a little douce chill. 175 00:08:46,880 --> 00:08:51,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, and that's the whole heat. Friend of the show. 176 00:08:51,920 --> 00:08:55,240 Speaker 2: Michael Iaderola, known as Dola, written about in the Modest 177 00:08:55,240 --> 00:09:00,479 Speaker 2: Mouse Book as criticizing modest mouse for on internet chats, 178 00:09:01,040 --> 00:09:04,240 Speaker 2: for doing advertisements. That's real. I encourage you, as Casey jo, 179 00:09:04,280 --> 00:09:06,120 Speaker 2: just to look at that. He's literally in a book 180 00:09:06,160 --> 00:09:10,760 Speaker 2: as quote Dola. But he once coined when we were 181 00:09:10,760 --> 00:09:15,880 Speaker 2: in high school that deep deep douche chill, the deep 182 00:09:15,920 --> 00:09:18,400 Speaker 2: one that like you shudder, it almost like takes hold 183 00:09:18,440 --> 00:09:21,280 Speaker 2: of your spine. He calls it the hohem h o 184 00:09:21,640 --> 00:09:23,480 Speaker 2: h e e m. And that has been in my 185 00:09:23,559 --> 00:09:25,880 Speaker 2: brain for the rest of time. Whenever he said it 186 00:09:25,960 --> 00:09:28,960 Speaker 2: was when Kevin Arnold does something really embarrassing on the 187 00:09:28,960 --> 00:09:32,200 Speaker 2: Wonder Years, usually in front of Winnie Cooper, and you 188 00:09:32,240 --> 00:09:35,680 Speaker 2: are like, can't move. It's the hohem Yeah, and Bono 189 00:09:35,760 --> 00:09:39,880 Speaker 2: is good for the hohim all day anyway. Then he 190 00:09:39,880 --> 00:09:42,360 Speaker 2: also thinks he's like the avatar of punk music, which 191 00:09:42,400 --> 00:09:44,840 Speaker 2: is why he sings things like the Ballad of Joey 192 00:09:44,920 --> 00:09:47,080 Speaker 2: Ramone or whatever. So there's a lot with Bono. 193 00:09:47,559 --> 00:09:50,960 Speaker 1: So yeah, I guess without further ado uno dos trace cotorse, 194 00:09:51,160 --> 00:10:03,840 Speaker 1: let's jump into it. Okay, protest too much? 195 00:10:04,080 --> 00:10:07,920 Speaker 2: Okay, so may I say one thing. I feel like 196 00:10:07,960 --> 00:10:10,200 Speaker 2: I've talked too much. I'm gonna listen to you after this. 197 00:10:10,280 --> 00:10:13,360 Speaker 2: I just want to say one thing. I also I 198 00:10:13,400 --> 00:10:18,960 Speaker 2: want to make sure I have a soft spot for 199 00:10:19,040 --> 00:10:22,640 Speaker 2: you too, because my older brother John, when I was 200 00:10:22,640 --> 00:10:27,400 Speaker 2: a kid, this was like peak prime first wave of 201 00:10:27,440 --> 00:10:31,920 Speaker 2: You two, you know, yeah, and that was like his band, 202 00:10:32,120 --> 00:10:34,280 Speaker 2: and he was one of the people that definitely introduced 203 00:10:34,280 --> 00:10:37,280 Speaker 2: me to like whatever at the time was like a 204 00:10:37,360 --> 00:10:40,200 Speaker 2: strain of modern music, like first person I ever heard 205 00:10:41,160 --> 00:10:43,040 Speaker 2: any like, you know, I don't know so many of 206 00:10:43,080 --> 00:10:46,440 Speaker 2: those eighties bands through, especially kind of like relative peers 207 00:10:46,440 --> 00:10:47,839 Speaker 2: of You Two when they were still thought of it 208 00:10:47,840 --> 00:10:50,280 Speaker 2: as like almost like a new wave band, you know. 209 00:10:51,600 --> 00:10:55,040 Speaker 2: And that's like and I will also just say our 210 00:10:55,080 --> 00:10:57,559 Speaker 2: band had the opportunity a couple summers ago to play 211 00:10:58,040 --> 00:11:00,240 Speaker 2: at Red Rocks in Colorado, which is like a you know, 212 00:11:00,559 --> 00:11:04,520 Speaker 2: historic venue inside a mountain, and we listened on the 213 00:11:04,600 --> 00:11:07,280 Speaker 2: drive there to you Too the first time they played 214 00:11:07,440 --> 00:11:10,679 Speaker 2: at Red Rocks, and it's amazing. It's crazy because it's 215 00:11:10,679 --> 00:11:13,320 Speaker 2: really just like they're a band. It's just four people. 216 00:11:13,400 --> 00:11:16,040 Speaker 2: You can hear when the Edge plays a lead line, 217 00:11:16,160 --> 00:11:19,040 Speaker 2: there's like, oh, it's just a bass in drums under him, 218 00:11:19,080 --> 00:11:24,160 Speaker 2: like they're you know, and they were a real serious, 219 00:11:24,400 --> 00:11:28,600 Speaker 2: great band, and it's really hard to be a really 220 00:11:28,640 --> 00:11:31,200 Speaker 2: I don't know many that have been a real great 221 00:11:31,360 --> 00:11:36,320 Speaker 2: band in the zeitgeist for forty years, forty five years. 222 00:11:36,360 --> 00:11:39,679 Speaker 2: It's probably impossible. So I just want to say, before 223 00:11:39,720 --> 00:11:42,920 Speaker 2: anything else we get into in this episode, please don't 224 00:11:42,960 --> 00:11:45,520 Speaker 2: mistake that I don't see the value. Part of what 225 00:11:45,559 --> 00:11:48,440 Speaker 2: we'll talk about is the value of you two, I imagine. 226 00:11:48,559 --> 00:11:52,400 Speaker 2: But now we're talking about a song that was, you know, 227 00:11:53,840 --> 00:11:59,439 Speaker 2: implanted into our phones uninvitedly. Yeah, ten years ago. 228 00:12:00,120 --> 00:12:04,319 Speaker 1: My background is that my brother definitely had You two albums, 229 00:12:04,360 --> 00:12:08,319 Speaker 1: and so I knew like the hits, but I didn't 230 00:12:08,760 --> 00:12:11,920 Speaker 1: ever have like a personal relationship with these songs. There 231 00:12:11,920 --> 00:12:14,360 Speaker 1: were times like because the first instrument I started on 232 00:12:14,800 --> 00:12:18,480 Speaker 1: was drums, and and there's definitely like a rite of 233 00:12:18,520 --> 00:12:21,360 Speaker 1: passage for like the Sunday Bloody Sunday drums, like they're 234 00:12:21,520 --> 00:12:24,120 Speaker 1: iconic and so like, as a drummer, you find these 235 00:12:24,160 --> 00:12:28,240 Speaker 1: moments that are like, you know, cool, that sounds cool, 236 00:12:28,320 --> 00:12:30,280 Speaker 1: Let me try that, let me learn that. And so 237 00:12:30,440 --> 00:12:32,360 Speaker 1: I think I give them credit for that. There's probably 238 00:12:32,400 --> 00:12:35,200 Speaker 1: they're probably a band that people learn, like, you know, 239 00:12:35,440 --> 00:12:36,360 Speaker 1: beginners learn all. 240 00:12:36,320 --> 00:12:38,960 Speaker 2: The guitar for that song is the same you learn 241 00:12:39,040 --> 00:12:41,840 Speaker 2: that's like that are pegiation. Yeah, that's the that's like 242 00:12:42,080 --> 00:12:45,000 Speaker 2: riffs on riffs on riffs on drums and guitar in 243 00:12:45,040 --> 00:12:45,400 Speaker 2: that song. 244 00:12:45,480 --> 00:12:47,959 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, and and so and so I thought I 245 00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:51,120 Speaker 1: always thought that was cool. Never really got into them, 246 00:12:51,720 --> 00:12:55,600 Speaker 1: but it was funny. I love the I love the Ramones, Like, 247 00:12:56,240 --> 00:12:58,280 Speaker 1: it's so funny that he's like, this is a song 248 00:12:58,440 --> 00:12:59,720 Speaker 1: to attribute to Ramones, and I. 249 00:12:59,840 --> 00:13:02,080 Speaker 2: Way lots to say about that. Yeah, drummer. 250 00:13:02,160 --> 00:13:04,640 Speaker 1: The drummer actually kind of does a Sunday bloody Sunday 251 00:13:04,679 --> 00:13:07,400 Speaker 1: drumming this. He's doing the double high hats. There's a 252 00:13:07,400 --> 00:13:10,960 Speaker 1: part where he's like like, you're like, you're doing your song, 253 00:13:11,840 --> 00:13:12,199 Speaker 1: you do it? 254 00:13:12,280 --> 00:13:17,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, the Mirror, the Miracle, Breath of you two. 255 00:13:32,679 --> 00:13:34,000 Speaker 2: I mean, before I forget it off the top of 256 00:13:34,000 --> 00:13:36,599 Speaker 2: my head, I should just say the following things immediately. 257 00:13:36,600 --> 00:13:39,480 Speaker 2: This song sounds like that drop Kick Murphy song that 258 00:13:39,600 --> 00:13:43,640 Speaker 2: everybody the the no no, no, Like there's this kind 259 00:13:43,640 --> 00:13:43,960 Speaker 2: of like. 260 00:13:44,280 --> 00:13:45,280 Speaker 1: Yes, you're right. 261 00:13:45,600 --> 00:13:47,040 Speaker 2: And then so I know that was the thing, that 262 00:13:48,040 --> 00:13:50,360 Speaker 2: pergy of Yeah, we gotta get the energy of like 263 00:13:50,440 --> 00:13:52,440 Speaker 2: that kind of thing. And we're Irish and you know 264 00:13:52,440 --> 00:13:54,440 Speaker 2: it's Boston, so we got it. We can claim that 265 00:13:54,480 --> 00:13:57,120 Speaker 2: because it's really ours. And then the other thing is 266 00:13:57,400 --> 00:14:00,920 Speaker 2: it really also feels like that the guitar but iron out, 267 00:14:00,960 --> 00:14:04,160 Speaker 2: which I think is supposed to sound like punk if 268 00:14:04,200 --> 00:14:08,360 Speaker 2: I'm being overly thought too, like whatever in my brain 269 00:14:08,400 --> 00:14:11,680 Speaker 2: about it, it sounds like that great first ever distorted 270 00:14:11,720 --> 00:14:13,679 Speaker 2: guitar sound from the Kinks, the barren air and air 271 00:14:13,679 --> 00:14:15,680 Speaker 2: and air and air, which they got from like breaking 272 00:14:15,760 --> 00:14:18,280 Speaker 2: the amp, you know, the speaker and the amp. So 273 00:14:18,320 --> 00:14:20,680 Speaker 2: that's like maybe they're going for like a proto punk 274 00:14:20,760 --> 00:14:23,360 Speaker 2: thing like where you know, we're gonna, we're gonna what's 275 00:14:23,400 --> 00:14:28,000 Speaker 2: the word, pay tribute to or and also mimic this 276 00:14:28,160 --> 00:14:30,920 Speaker 2: sound that's like kind of the sound that started loud 277 00:14:31,000 --> 00:14:33,720 Speaker 2: rock music was this guitar. Maybe that's not what was 278 00:14:33,760 --> 00:14:36,400 Speaker 2: being thought of, that's what it sounds like. It also 279 00:14:36,440 --> 00:14:40,720 Speaker 2: feels like it could be any Black Keys single from 280 00:14:40,720 --> 00:14:43,920 Speaker 2: the twenty tens, which I don't necessarily mean as a 281 00:14:43,960 --> 00:14:49,480 Speaker 2: positive thing. And I also feel like there's moments in 282 00:14:49,520 --> 00:14:51,800 Speaker 2: this where it's funny where you hear We've talked about 283 00:14:51,800 --> 00:14:53,600 Speaker 2: this on the show before and again this might be 284 00:14:53,640 --> 00:14:58,240 Speaker 2: an impossibility when existing at this altitude, but like someone 285 00:14:58,280 --> 00:15:02,560 Speaker 2: like Chris Martin was clearly influenced by Bono and you two. 286 00:15:03,240 --> 00:15:05,800 Speaker 2: Then there's a moment where, in order to try to 287 00:15:05,920 --> 00:15:10,680 Speaker 2: stay in the zeitgeist, the influencer starts to sound like 288 00:15:10,720 --> 00:15:14,400 Speaker 2: the influenced totally and his vocal delivery in this song 289 00:15:14,440 --> 00:15:16,240 Speaker 2: if you told me, the first verse of this song 290 00:15:16,360 --> 00:15:20,000 Speaker 2: was like a present day cold Play song where they 291 00:15:20,040 --> 00:15:22,840 Speaker 2: were like, we're gonna write a loud rock song to 292 00:15:22,960 --> 00:15:24,920 Speaker 2: throw off the scent of everyone who thinks we're like 293 00:15:24,960 --> 00:15:26,920 Speaker 2: a K pop band now or whatever it is. The 294 00:15:26,920 --> 00:15:32,160 Speaker 2: cold plate has become like that to me. He starts 295 00:15:32,200 --> 00:15:34,800 Speaker 2: sound like Bono, like when the chorus comes in, but 296 00:15:34,880 --> 00:15:36,640 Speaker 2: the first verse I was like, Oh, that's like Chris 297 00:15:36,640 --> 00:15:39,160 Speaker 2: Martin Bono doing Chris Martin doing Bono. 298 00:15:39,880 --> 00:15:42,120 Speaker 1: And another moment of like that, like you know that 299 00:15:42,200 --> 00:15:45,840 Speaker 1: Steve BUSHEMI mehm with the skateboard and like is like 300 00:15:46,240 --> 00:15:49,160 Speaker 1: they got danger Mouse to produce the album. That's who 301 00:15:49,200 --> 00:15:52,880 Speaker 1: made this record, So I like in this I could 302 00:15:52,920 --> 00:15:55,360 Speaker 1: be getting this wrong. But so they started working with 303 00:15:55,480 --> 00:15:59,160 Speaker 1: Danger Mouse for like two years on an album called 304 00:15:59,160 --> 00:16:00,520 Speaker 1: like Songs of Something Else. 305 00:16:00,560 --> 00:16:02,680 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yes, yes, yes, I remember that. 306 00:16:02,720 --> 00:16:04,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, And then they worked with another producer but I 307 00:16:04,480 --> 00:16:07,720 Speaker 1: think there's stuff from both sessions that ended up on 308 00:16:08,320 --> 00:16:11,120 Speaker 1: yeah songs, you know, so so I think like that's 309 00:16:11,160 --> 00:16:14,280 Speaker 1: also maybe and then look, there's nothing wrong. I actually 310 00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:17,880 Speaker 1: like when you know, when you get you know, you 311 00:16:17,960 --> 00:16:20,840 Speaker 1: get like Rick Rubin working with Johnny Cash, Like that's 312 00:16:20,920 --> 00:16:24,840 Speaker 1: different and that's so fun totally, you know. So I'm 313 00:16:24,880 --> 00:16:27,680 Speaker 1: not saying that that's you know, like old old old 314 00:16:27,760 --> 00:16:31,360 Speaker 1: dudes can't work with Rick Rubin was even young at 315 00:16:31,360 --> 00:16:33,800 Speaker 1: the time. But you know, you know what true, right, 316 00:16:34,160 --> 00:16:36,160 Speaker 1: But there's a difference. There's a difference like when you 317 00:16:36,160 --> 00:16:40,080 Speaker 1: could smell this sort of teen spirit, this teen spirit 318 00:16:40,160 --> 00:16:41,760 Speaker 1: boom had to do it. 319 00:16:43,640 --> 00:16:51,680 Speaker 2: Sorry, go ahead, but seriously, though about Nirvana. 320 00:16:49,880 --> 00:16:52,440 Speaker 1: You smell like the desperation right, like a little bit. 321 00:16:52,480 --> 00:16:54,640 Speaker 1: And I was also like, so this is ten years ago. 322 00:16:54,760 --> 00:16:57,320 Speaker 1: This is two thousand and fifty crazy by the way, 323 00:16:57,400 --> 00:17:00,360 Speaker 1: I know. And then they forced it on everyone's eye phones, 324 00:17:00,360 --> 00:17:01,600 Speaker 1: which also feels. 325 00:17:01,280 --> 00:17:03,440 Speaker 2: Like we're going to get to that that has to 326 00:17:03,480 --> 00:17:05,879 Speaker 2: be involved in this conversation, right, Yeah, yes. 327 00:17:05,840 --> 00:17:08,280 Speaker 1: But I watched the music video, which you know I do. 328 00:17:08,280 --> 00:17:10,080 Speaker 2: Sometimes I love that that's the casey way. 329 00:17:10,560 --> 00:17:12,440 Speaker 1: It feels like they were trying to do like almost 330 00:17:12,520 --> 00:17:14,720 Speaker 1: like an I like an iPhone commercial or like a 331 00:17:14,800 --> 00:17:17,800 Speaker 1: yeah yeah yeahs music video or like you know, like 332 00:17:17,840 --> 00:17:21,240 Speaker 1: those what was popular, but even popular though in the 333 00:17:21,680 --> 00:17:24,560 Speaker 1: twenty tens, like they're already five years late to the 334 00:17:24,680 --> 00:17:28,040 Speaker 1: style of editing, you know, and it's and you know 335 00:17:28,320 --> 00:17:31,120 Speaker 1: that's the and and you're like the way they look 336 00:17:31,119 --> 00:17:33,200 Speaker 1: in it and stuff. It's like they never you know, 337 00:17:33,600 --> 00:17:35,320 Speaker 1: kind of glad that they look like you two and 338 00:17:35,400 --> 00:17:37,160 Speaker 1: the version of you two that was like the nineties 339 00:17:37,160 --> 00:17:39,520 Speaker 1: you Tube, Like, they don't look like the eighties you two, 340 00:17:39,520 --> 00:17:42,080 Speaker 1: which would be actually fun because that's what they because 341 00:17:42,080 --> 00:17:44,720 Speaker 1: that's a cool look. I like the way totally yeah yeah, 342 00:17:44,760 --> 00:17:48,040 Speaker 1: But they they stuck to this like nineties like you know, 343 00:17:49,040 --> 00:17:51,440 Speaker 1: if you looked up like the definition of like rock 344 00:17:51,480 --> 00:17:54,439 Speaker 1: and roll, they were like, okay, well where that and 345 00:17:54,480 --> 00:17:58,000 Speaker 1: they never changed from that and so that's dated too, 346 00:17:58,320 --> 00:18:00,000 Speaker 1: so but it's also like, well, that's who they are. 347 00:18:00,320 --> 00:18:03,480 Speaker 1: So that's fine. I know, I'm going a lot of anti. 348 00:18:03,600 --> 00:18:06,040 Speaker 2: No you are and you're doing You're doing the Lord's 349 00:18:06,080 --> 00:18:09,080 Speaker 2: work right now. You're What I'm trying to do is 350 00:18:09,080 --> 00:18:11,720 Speaker 2: restrain myself from following you down each one of the 351 00:18:11,800 --> 00:18:14,359 Speaker 2: roads you're leading me too, because I have a like 352 00:18:14,600 --> 00:18:18,560 Speaker 2: encyclopedic voluminous amounts of negativity not just about you too, 353 00:18:18,600 --> 00:18:21,840 Speaker 2: but actually that are industrial in nature and maybe even 354 00:18:21,960 --> 00:18:24,359 Speaker 2: cultural in nature. When you just said the thing about 355 00:18:24,400 --> 00:18:27,760 Speaker 2: like if you looked up the dictionary definition or whatever 356 00:18:27,760 --> 00:18:28,200 Speaker 2: it is of. 357 00:18:28,240 --> 00:18:29,120 Speaker 1: Like what is rock? 358 00:18:29,720 --> 00:18:33,040 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's part of the problem here for me as 359 00:18:33,119 --> 00:18:37,520 Speaker 2: these people age, is like there are very few examples 360 00:18:37,520 --> 00:18:39,280 Speaker 2: of people who've done it gracefully. And part of it 361 00:18:39,320 --> 00:18:42,919 Speaker 2: is because there's a whole infrastructure surrounding them that is 362 00:18:43,000 --> 00:18:48,879 Speaker 2: like chasing some patina of cool that I actually just 363 00:18:48,960 --> 00:18:54,879 Speaker 2: think gets more and more mortifying. Like as you age, 364 00:18:54,920 --> 00:18:57,600 Speaker 2: there's just like a point like I don't really want 365 00:18:57,640 --> 00:19:01,520 Speaker 2: to see somebody who's trying to hold on to a 366 00:19:01,680 --> 00:19:04,720 Speaker 2: kind of like you know what I'm saying, there's a 367 00:19:04,760 --> 00:19:08,280 Speaker 2: particular kind of like cool that I'm like, just let 368 00:19:08,320 --> 00:19:08,600 Speaker 2: it go. 369 00:19:09,240 --> 00:19:12,359 Speaker 1: The strange thing is like the same people doesn't hold 370 00:19:12,400 --> 00:19:16,840 Speaker 1: on to the thing that that that it gives you 371 00:19:16,920 --> 00:19:20,919 Speaker 1: the the voice, right, like there's no trying to be 372 00:19:21,200 --> 00:19:25,920 Speaker 1: original and like authentic to yourself. It's like the it's yeah, 373 00:19:25,960 --> 00:19:28,879 Speaker 1: it's the it's the version. It's like this the prototypical 374 00:19:28,960 --> 00:19:32,240 Speaker 1: version of what it looks like. It's the aesthetic without 375 00:19:32,280 --> 00:19:36,439 Speaker 1: the actual like work. Yeah, and and like you know, 376 00:19:37,200 --> 00:19:39,360 Speaker 1: and that's why people look the way they did when 377 00:19:39,359 --> 00:19:41,400 Speaker 1: it first started, Like that's why punks looked the way 378 00:19:41,400 --> 00:19:43,399 Speaker 1: they did. That's why I like Jimmy Hendrick. It was 379 00:19:43,440 --> 00:19:48,600 Speaker 1: like there was these were really authenticst like authentic people 380 00:19:49,119 --> 00:19:52,240 Speaker 1: that did these things that were about then like you know, 381 00:19:52,480 --> 00:19:55,960 Speaker 1: have been like cosplayed to death totally. But you know, 382 00:19:56,040 --> 00:19:58,760 Speaker 1: it's like go back to the thing that's you know, 383 00:19:58,960 --> 00:20:01,200 Speaker 1: and it's hard. It's hard for like a person that's 384 00:20:01,240 --> 00:20:04,399 Speaker 1: in their sixties to connect with the world. But also 385 00:20:04,440 --> 00:20:05,800 Speaker 1: sometimes it's like, don't. 386 00:20:06,040 --> 00:20:08,240 Speaker 2: That's the thing. I think what you just nailed in 387 00:20:08,320 --> 00:20:10,560 Speaker 2: the verry And they're like, that's the thing. It's not. 388 00:20:12,560 --> 00:20:14,560 Speaker 2: You know, we've talked a few times on this podcast 389 00:20:14,600 --> 00:20:16,359 Speaker 2: about and you and I certainly have talked about this 390 00:20:16,480 --> 00:20:19,320 Speaker 2: just in life about because I don't know, we navigate 391 00:20:19,359 --> 00:20:21,960 Speaker 2: the spaces we navigate, and my brain is wired for 392 00:20:22,040 --> 00:20:24,400 Speaker 2: better and so much often for worse. If you ask 393 00:20:24,440 --> 00:20:26,960 Speaker 2: the people who are for whatever reason still decide to 394 00:20:27,000 --> 00:20:29,480 Speaker 2: work with me, there are things that are very like 395 00:20:29,960 --> 00:20:32,840 Speaker 2: unhelpful and maybe even self spiting about the degree to 396 00:20:32,840 --> 00:20:35,040 Speaker 2: which I think about some of what we're talking about, 397 00:20:35,440 --> 00:20:38,040 Speaker 2: And it's because I do think what you just landed 398 00:20:38,040 --> 00:20:43,000 Speaker 2: at was like, well, don't like, not, don't participate, not, 399 00:20:43,200 --> 00:20:47,119 Speaker 2: don't be. I think maybe sometimes the most authentic thing 400 00:20:47,240 --> 00:20:50,720 Speaker 2: someone can do is try is not try to be 401 00:20:50,880 --> 00:20:54,720 Speaker 2: connected to the zeitgeist when the zeitgeist is no longer 402 00:20:54,800 --> 00:20:58,240 Speaker 2: your zeitgeist. That doesn't mean you can't like, admire, and like. 403 00:20:58,280 --> 00:20:59,960 Speaker 2: It doesn't mean you can't be. You could be sick 404 00:21:00,560 --> 00:21:03,080 Speaker 2: and like Olivia Rodrigo, or you could be whatever. But 405 00:21:03,280 --> 00:21:05,080 Speaker 2: I just mean, like, if you start trying to fucking 406 00:21:05,240 --> 00:21:09,840 Speaker 2: act like Olivia Rodrigo, I think that's weird. And I 407 00:21:09,920 --> 00:21:12,479 Speaker 2: recognize part of what makes it challenging for these people. 408 00:21:12,560 --> 00:21:16,800 Speaker 2: I think, as a person who has the most infinitesimal 409 00:21:17,119 --> 00:21:21,800 Speaker 2: fraction of a glimpse into their lived experience is that 410 00:21:21,840 --> 00:21:26,480 Speaker 2: there is a there is an entire industry, infrastructure, and 411 00:21:26,480 --> 00:21:30,680 Speaker 2: industry around you, right that exists to try to convince 412 00:21:30,720 --> 00:21:36,640 Speaker 2: you you're still really fucking cool and so you I 413 00:21:36,680 --> 00:21:39,840 Speaker 2: think it would be really hard to be like like 414 00:21:39,960 --> 00:21:42,159 Speaker 2: I think, I know this is another one that comes up, 415 00:21:42,400 --> 00:21:45,040 Speaker 2: but also actually even going here as a totally count 416 00:21:45,040 --> 00:21:48,679 Speaker 2: becassinever had the experience Bono did either, but someone like 417 00:21:48,800 --> 00:21:52,400 Speaker 2: a Leonard Cohen In that song Tower of Song, I See, 418 00:21:52,520 --> 00:21:56,119 Speaker 2: I know, he says something like I ache in the 419 00:21:56,160 --> 00:21:58,240 Speaker 2: places where I used to play, which is a really 420 00:21:58,280 --> 00:22:01,440 Speaker 2: funny lyric about aging. I think talking about sex probably 421 00:22:01,480 --> 00:22:03,520 Speaker 2: when he says that, because he's often talking about sex 422 00:22:03,560 --> 00:22:07,200 Speaker 2: and sexuality. But like he didn't try to like be 423 00:22:08,400 --> 00:22:13,919 Speaker 2: uh sixty years old, like adopting whatever cool posture a 424 00:22:14,040 --> 00:22:16,639 Speaker 2: twenty five year old would have adopted. He kind of, 425 00:22:16,680 --> 00:22:19,159 Speaker 2: in fact, when in his totally other, random, weird direction, 426 00:22:19,280 --> 00:22:21,679 Speaker 2: it was like, I'll play a cassio that sounds like 427 00:22:21,680 --> 00:22:24,320 Speaker 2: a four year old wrote the guitar graph the piano parts, 428 00:22:24,600 --> 00:22:27,600 Speaker 2: and I'll like dress in like, you know, he kind 429 00:22:27,600 --> 00:22:29,399 Speaker 2: of was like an old man before he was an 430 00:22:29,400 --> 00:22:33,119 Speaker 2: old man in a lot of ways. But I just wouldn't. 431 00:22:33,160 --> 00:22:35,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, I want to go back to the I'm sorry 432 00:22:35,119 --> 00:22:35,760 Speaker 1: if I'm cutting you. O. 433 00:22:35,920 --> 00:22:37,320 Speaker 2: No, no, no, no, that was a cul de sac 434 00:22:37,359 --> 00:22:38,720 Speaker 2: we didn't need to live in any No. No. 435 00:22:38,760 --> 00:22:40,440 Speaker 1: I like that because it reminded me, like I want 436 00:22:40,440 --> 00:22:43,640 Speaker 1: to go back to the Johnny Cash Yes, right, yes, 437 00:22:43,680 --> 00:22:45,960 Speaker 1: because I don't think he ever tried to work hard 438 00:22:46,040 --> 00:22:48,280 Speaker 1: to be relevant. He always did his thing, and in fact, 439 00:22:48,440 --> 00:22:51,040 Speaker 1: like and that's what you're kind of shooting for, right, 440 00:22:51,160 --> 00:22:54,760 Speaker 1: Like he's working, he's working with Rick Rubin and they're 441 00:22:54,760 --> 00:22:57,840 Speaker 1: doing a cover of Hurt, which was not even the 442 00:22:57,880 --> 00:23:00,479 Speaker 1: biggest song, but like it was. It was a from 443 00:23:00,480 --> 00:23:03,480 Speaker 1: the nineties by Nine Inch Nails, which is cool and 444 00:23:03,520 --> 00:23:06,159 Speaker 1: like on paper, that's so funny. He completely made it 445 00:23:06,480 --> 00:23:11,640 Speaker 1: his own's it took new meaning to the song and 446 00:23:12,119 --> 00:23:14,080 Speaker 1: it's it's not like it wasn't like a song that 447 00:23:14,119 --> 00:23:15,879 Speaker 1: was popular at the time that he was covering. It 448 00:23:15,920 --> 00:23:18,000 Speaker 1: was like an older song. He did it and it 449 00:23:18,160 --> 00:23:20,400 Speaker 1: charted and it blew up. 450 00:23:21,200 --> 00:23:21,399 Speaker 2: You know. 451 00:23:22,240 --> 00:23:24,800 Speaker 1: He died soon after, which like add to the whole 452 00:23:24,840 --> 00:23:27,840 Speaker 1: story of it. It felt so relevant out of his 453 00:23:27,960 --> 00:23:32,439 Speaker 1: mouth that as it did when you know, what's his 454 00:23:32,480 --> 00:23:36,200 Speaker 1: name from Nine Inch Nails, Brent resn Yeah, Trent saying 455 00:23:36,280 --> 00:23:38,879 Speaker 1: it like as like a youth, and it's like that's 456 00:23:39,040 --> 00:23:42,240 Speaker 1: such a cool moment and and like, but I used 457 00:23:42,240 --> 00:23:45,480 Speaker 1: to do a joke. We're trying to gash starts covering 458 00:23:45,520 --> 00:23:52,320 Speaker 1: everything and he's like starships were made to fly, hands 459 00:23:52,400 --> 00:23:56,080 Speaker 1: up because we're so high like he just starts doing 460 00:23:56,160 --> 00:23:59,800 Speaker 1: NICKI Minaj. Like that's the difference, right there is like 461 00:23:59,840 --> 00:24:02,680 Speaker 1: that he wouldn't do that, like he wouldn't do well. 462 00:24:02,720 --> 00:24:07,200 Speaker 2: But I'm on the floor. Oh but no, actually he did, 463 00:24:07,240 --> 00:24:09,440 Speaker 2: Actually he did. He did do it, and we're here 464 00:24:09,480 --> 00:24:13,520 Speaker 2: to premiere it for you now, so give this a check. No, 465 00:24:13,600 --> 00:24:17,679 Speaker 2: but in all, Siri, don't open up Siri. Sorry, not 466 00:24:17,800 --> 00:24:22,400 Speaker 2: real Siri, and all. Seriously, what you're saying is actually 467 00:24:23,680 --> 00:24:26,959 Speaker 2: the I think the spinal column in there, that's the 468 00:24:27,000 --> 00:24:32,320 Speaker 2: real thing. When Johnny Cash and Rick Rubin apparently who knows, 469 00:24:32,600 --> 00:24:34,199 Speaker 2: It's always like who knows the degree to which these 470 00:24:34,240 --> 00:24:36,440 Speaker 2: are real stories or their apocryphal but from what I 471 00:24:37,359 --> 00:24:40,359 Speaker 2: have heard and read or whatever. And I have a 472 00:24:40,359 --> 00:24:43,840 Speaker 2: lot of thoughts about Rick Rubin, which is for another conversation. 473 00:24:44,160 --> 00:24:47,159 Speaker 2: But I also think on some level, it's like, you know, 474 00:24:47,240 --> 00:24:49,640 Speaker 2: the track record is the track record. I think certain 475 00:24:49,680 --> 00:24:51,760 Speaker 2: things I've heard him say philosophically are a little like 476 00:24:51,800 --> 00:24:55,000 Speaker 2: I roll inducing to me. But but but when it 477 00:24:55,040 --> 00:24:57,800 Speaker 2: comes to this specific artist, in that specific relationship, I 478 00:24:57,840 --> 00:25:01,480 Speaker 2: think that they did some really incredible bull like career 479 00:25:01,600 --> 00:25:06,719 Speaker 2: defining shit together that I also think from a quality perspective, 480 00:25:06,760 --> 00:25:09,680 Speaker 2: you can have career defining shit that isn't actually very good, 481 00:25:10,520 --> 00:25:12,560 Speaker 2: and you can have career defining shit that is also like, 482 00:25:12,560 --> 00:25:15,879 Speaker 2: holy shit, that's incredible. He he heard and saw something 483 00:25:15,920 --> 00:25:18,280 Speaker 2: in Johnny Cash that Johnny Cash would almost like let 484 00:25:18,720 --> 00:25:23,239 Speaker 2: lie dormant for a very long time, kind of in 485 00:25:23,320 --> 00:25:26,280 Speaker 2: the service of like making a living. Like when he 486 00:25:26,320 --> 00:25:31,280 Speaker 2: finds Johnny Cash in the early nineties, he's like playing Branson, Missouri, 487 00:25:31,440 --> 00:25:33,879 Speaker 2: the Yakov Smirnoff place, which is kind of where like 488 00:25:33,880 --> 00:25:36,760 Speaker 2: a certain like it's like at the it's like the 489 00:25:37,480 --> 00:25:41,720 Speaker 2: you know, d List Broadway or Atlantic City Entertainment of 490 00:25:41,760 --> 00:25:44,600 Speaker 2: the Midwest. Johnny Cash is doing shows there where he's 491 00:25:44,640 --> 00:25:48,439 Speaker 2: like fucking opening for comics and stuff on Sunday afternoons, 492 00:25:49,040 --> 00:25:52,199 Speaker 2: half full houses. And he finds out he goes to 493 00:25:52,200 --> 00:25:54,480 Speaker 2: see him, and he's like, this shouldn't be what this 494 00:25:54,560 --> 00:25:58,159 Speaker 2: dude is doing. This guy's like an American legend, like iconic, 495 00:25:58,280 --> 00:26:01,040 Speaker 2: you know. And he brings him to La to play 496 00:26:01,080 --> 00:26:03,760 Speaker 2: a showcase somewhere forget where the Roxy or something, and 497 00:26:03,760 --> 00:26:05,680 Speaker 2: then he's like, all I want to do is put 498 00:26:05,720 --> 00:26:08,320 Speaker 2: a microphone in a room and you play some songs. 499 00:26:08,560 --> 00:26:11,080 Speaker 2: And he reconnects him to the spirit in the heart 500 00:26:11,080 --> 00:26:13,960 Speaker 2: of what it is that he does. Now they then 501 00:26:14,040 --> 00:26:17,640 Speaker 2: he curates a bunch of yes like interesting and at 502 00:26:17,640 --> 00:26:21,439 Speaker 2: times zeitgeist flirting covers over the arc of those four 503 00:26:21,560 --> 00:26:24,480 Speaker 2: or five albums for Johnny Cash to do. But what 504 00:26:24,560 --> 00:26:27,480 Speaker 2: they do that is the whole fucking point to me, 505 00:26:28,240 --> 00:26:33,560 Speaker 2: is they bring those covers into Johnny Cash's world. Johnny 506 00:26:33,600 --> 00:26:37,720 Speaker 2: Cash doesn't cover sound Garden by trying to sound like Soundgarden. 507 00:26:37,800 --> 00:26:40,960 Speaker 2: He doesn't cover nine Inch Nos. He doesn't even cover 508 00:26:41,080 --> 00:26:43,880 Speaker 2: like Will Oldham or Nick Cave or Leonard Cohen. When 509 00:26:43,880 --> 00:26:46,119 Speaker 2: he does those songs, which was to connect him to 510 00:26:46,160 --> 00:26:50,919 Speaker 2: a kind of like alternative songwriter world, it's Johnny Cash 511 00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:54,560 Speaker 2: singing those songs. Yeah, I think that you have to 512 00:26:54,600 --> 00:26:56,320 Speaker 2: have a certain gravity to pull that off. But I 513 00:26:56,320 --> 00:26:58,280 Speaker 2: would make the argument that a band like you two 514 00:26:58,320 --> 00:27:01,280 Speaker 2: should have that gravity, and I agree. And this isn't 515 00:27:01,280 --> 00:27:03,480 Speaker 2: a cover, this is a pastiche So we're being maybe 516 00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:06,480 Speaker 2: a little unfair. They're not doing a Ramone song. They're 517 00:27:06,520 --> 00:27:09,080 Speaker 2: doing a song that actually has nothing to do in 518 00:27:09,119 --> 00:27:12,080 Speaker 2: its information with the Ramones, but somehow just throwing his 519 00:27:12,240 --> 00:27:15,880 Speaker 2: name into it for credibility or something but. 520 00:27:16,200 --> 00:27:18,720 Speaker 1: That is a muddy pastiche too, because it's like they're 521 00:27:18,760 --> 00:27:21,800 Speaker 1: referencing like themselves, because they're trying to sound like themselves 522 00:27:21,800 --> 00:27:24,640 Speaker 1: at this point, but they're like, who are we anymore? 523 00:27:24,720 --> 00:27:26,680 Speaker 2: What is that? What does that mean? Yeah? 524 00:27:26,760 --> 00:27:29,040 Speaker 1: Right, and that's hard and that gives me a little 525 00:27:29,040 --> 00:27:30,840 Speaker 1: bit when we've talked about this like some kind of 526 00:27:30,880 --> 00:27:34,239 Speaker 1: monster vibes where they're like Metallica's figuring out like what 527 00:27:34,280 --> 00:27:35,960 Speaker 1: Metallica is and. 528 00:27:35,880 --> 00:27:39,040 Speaker 2: I'm madly in anger with you. That's that's an all 529 00:27:39,119 --> 00:27:41,040 Speaker 2: timer for me. Yeah, it's so good. 530 00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:54,760 Speaker 1: That must be hard, like to be on your third 531 00:27:54,840 --> 00:27:58,280 Speaker 1: or fourth decade of a of a band, specifically, even 532 00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:00,959 Speaker 1: more so than as a songwriter, because songwriter you're always 533 00:28:01,240 --> 00:28:03,679 Speaker 1: it's it's you and you're doing your thing and you know, 534 00:28:03,800 --> 00:28:07,199 Speaker 1: like I'm sure that you hit your little you know 535 00:28:08,119 --> 00:28:10,679 Speaker 1: moments where it's hard to write, like writers block moments, 536 00:28:10,720 --> 00:28:13,399 Speaker 1: and but it's not like what do we sound like? 537 00:28:13,440 --> 00:28:15,840 Speaker 1: What are we trying to put out as this unit? 538 00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:19,919 Speaker 1: And I give them a chance in that this is 539 00:28:19,960 --> 00:28:23,679 Speaker 1: a hard feat and the time is hard too, like 540 00:28:23,800 --> 00:28:28,439 Speaker 1: remember like I remember, I remember Paul McCartney put out 541 00:28:28,440 --> 00:28:30,040 Speaker 1: a record around this time and he's like got a 542 00:28:30,119 --> 00:28:33,159 Speaker 1: ukulele and he's like and it's and it's like it 543 00:28:33,240 --> 00:28:36,480 Speaker 1: sounds exactly like a Paul McCartney song, but it also 544 00:28:36,600 --> 00:28:39,960 Speaker 1: doesn't because it's like him doing an impression of Paul McCartney. 545 00:28:40,000 --> 00:28:42,320 Speaker 1: And it's like, I remember, but I remember a friend 546 00:28:42,360 --> 00:28:45,080 Speaker 1: who is he was like a swim coach when I 547 00:28:45,120 --> 00:28:46,560 Speaker 1: was a kid, and I just you know, you kind 548 00:28:46,560 --> 00:28:48,760 Speaker 1: of grow up and you start to be like close 549 00:28:48,880 --> 00:28:50,800 Speaker 1: enough in age that you know your friends. But he's 550 00:28:50,800 --> 00:28:52,520 Speaker 1: still like twenty five years old. 551 00:28:52,600 --> 00:28:53,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 552 00:28:53,680 --> 00:28:55,840 Speaker 1: He's like, I love this Paul McCartney album, like I 553 00:28:55,880 --> 00:28:58,600 Speaker 1: made you, I burned you a copy of it was 554 00:28:58,640 --> 00:29:00,680 Speaker 1: so sweet, and he was he's a five fighter two 555 00:29:01,120 --> 00:29:04,760 Speaker 1: and he loved it, right yeah yeah, And you're like, okay, 556 00:29:04,960 --> 00:29:10,080 Speaker 1: like so so maybe this YouTube song does have an audience. 557 00:29:11,040 --> 00:29:13,760 Speaker 1: Now we should get to is that audience every single 558 00:29:13,760 --> 00:29:15,080 Speaker 1: person that has an iPhone? 559 00:29:15,480 --> 00:29:18,280 Speaker 2: Well that yeah, And and I mean I also just 560 00:29:18,320 --> 00:29:21,440 Speaker 2: to just to I think this has been such a 561 00:29:21,480 --> 00:29:24,400 Speaker 2: fertile conversation. There's so much in it. I feel like 562 00:29:24,440 --> 00:29:26,360 Speaker 2: we could do like a four hour version of this 563 00:29:26,400 --> 00:29:29,160 Speaker 2: podcast just like kind of just kind of at the 564 00:29:29,280 --> 00:29:32,960 Speaker 2: like macro level, But I feel like yeah, and I 565 00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:37,160 Speaker 2: don't I only a band like you two. It's like, 566 00:29:37,440 --> 00:29:40,160 Speaker 2: how are they supposed to even there is no way 567 00:29:41,040 --> 00:29:45,280 Speaker 2: to have a clear understanding of what you are in 568 00:29:45,320 --> 00:29:47,840 Speaker 2: your fourth or fifth decade, and what you are is 569 00:29:48,200 --> 00:29:51,080 Speaker 2: how do you even know when you are impersonating yourself 570 00:29:51,160 --> 00:29:53,480 Speaker 2: or not at this point because you've become such a 571 00:29:53,520 --> 00:29:57,320 Speaker 2: publicly owned commodity in a way that it's a really 572 00:29:57,320 --> 00:30:00,600 Speaker 2: hard to separate, Like what is my mission statement? Forty 573 00:30:00,680 --> 00:30:03,400 Speaker 2: years into being bono? And what does it mean to 574 00:30:03,400 --> 00:30:06,320 Speaker 2: be Bono or bono in quotes? What does it mean 575 00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:08,440 Speaker 2: to be you two or U two end quotes? Someone 576 00:30:08,480 --> 00:30:11,800 Speaker 2: like Paul McCartney. I actually think it's amazing that he can. 577 00:30:12,200 --> 00:30:14,800 Speaker 2: That speaks to actually kind of like how gifted to 578 00:30:14,800 --> 00:30:17,240 Speaker 2: some degree and maybe the way media has changed so 579 00:30:17,320 --> 00:30:19,680 Speaker 2: many times over the arc of his career in life, 580 00:30:20,080 --> 00:30:24,360 Speaker 2: that guy hasn't been a normal person for sixty five years, 581 00:30:24,480 --> 00:30:27,160 Speaker 2: sixty two years whatever that even means by I'm using 582 00:30:27,160 --> 00:30:29,640 Speaker 2: those words or trust everyone can define them for themselves, 583 00:30:29,640 --> 00:30:33,560 Speaker 2: but like, so, how does Paul McCartney even know? I 584 00:30:33,640 --> 00:30:36,480 Speaker 2: actually think he deserves a lot of credit for making 585 00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:39,880 Speaker 2: a bunch of like weirdo explorations over the course of 586 00:30:39,920 --> 00:30:41,720 Speaker 2: his career into like what is it like if I 587 00:30:41,880 --> 00:30:44,320 Speaker 2: do this even the UKULELEI to be, like, what's it 588 00:30:44,400 --> 00:30:47,000 Speaker 2: like if I make a record where that's the primary instrument? 589 00:30:47,360 --> 00:30:50,000 Speaker 2: Oh that people talk about this radio headband? What would 590 00:30:50,000 --> 00:30:52,520 Speaker 2: it be like if I was produced by that guy? Oh, 591 00:30:52,600 --> 00:30:55,160 Speaker 2: Nirvana had a left handed guitarist that died. What would 592 00:30:55,200 --> 00:30:57,160 Speaker 2: it be like if I played live with the remaining 593 00:30:57,160 --> 00:30:59,640 Speaker 2: members of that band and just made some noise? Like 594 00:30:59,760 --> 00:31:04,000 Speaker 2: he try? Is interesting things anyway. One thing not even 595 00:31:04,040 --> 00:31:08,080 Speaker 2: Sir Paul has tried, as you mentioned, is me. Yeah, yeah, 596 00:31:08,080 --> 00:31:11,080 Speaker 2: it's true, not for a long time. That is great. 597 00:31:11,120 --> 00:31:15,800 Speaker 2: That's the end of the pod is forcing every iPhone. 598 00:31:15,920 --> 00:31:19,800 Speaker 2: I mean that is such. That is such a perfect 599 00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:23,200 Speaker 2: in its way distillation of everything we're talking about, like 600 00:31:23,640 --> 00:31:27,040 Speaker 2: talk about art versus commerce. Like whoever had to talk 601 00:31:27,120 --> 00:31:29,760 Speaker 2: them into that's a cool idea? 602 00:31:29,880 --> 00:31:32,240 Speaker 1: Oh, I feel like it was fully Bono's idea. And 603 00:31:32,280 --> 00:31:35,720 Speaker 1: then like Tim Cook or whoever, was like okay, and 604 00:31:35,760 --> 00:31:38,040 Speaker 1: like felt like he had to because it's like it 605 00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:41,360 Speaker 1: feels like that like that faux charity, right, It's like 606 00:31:41,400 --> 00:31:45,200 Speaker 1: it's like I'm gonna give everyone I'm gonna get I 607 00:31:45,240 --> 00:31:48,560 Speaker 1: think I'm gonna get everyone the album for free. 608 00:31:49,000 --> 00:31:53,000 Speaker 2: I like turning Bono into like a Dickenzie and Street urchin. 609 00:31:53,400 --> 00:31:54,520 Speaker 2: That's really really good. 610 00:31:55,080 --> 00:32:04,080 Speaker 1: Oh Franky Mark gave a Tim for free Sunday vice. 611 00:32:04,400 --> 00:32:05,040 Speaker 1: Su Uh. 612 00:32:05,360 --> 00:32:09,240 Speaker 2: This is really just you know, so Irish, very Irish. 613 00:32:09,280 --> 00:32:16,480 Speaker 2: It's really whiff a way out. Yet I can't I 614 00:32:16,760 --> 00:32:23,560 Speaker 2: mean that's I feel like I can't live can't live out. Yeah, 615 00:32:23,920 --> 00:32:28,600 Speaker 2: I can't live while without which uh it'soy we hood 616 00:32:28,640 --> 00:32:33,840 Speaker 2: lim man as. Anyway, I don't even know what's to 617 00:32:33,840 --> 00:32:36,600 Speaker 2: be said about that. Whoever's idea was what was great. 618 00:32:37,400 --> 00:32:39,640 Speaker 2: There are moments where the culture surprises you. I kind 619 00:32:39,640 --> 00:32:41,760 Speaker 2: of wish sometimes it would surprise us more and about 620 00:32:41,800 --> 00:32:45,240 Speaker 2: more important things. But this was a moment where people 621 00:32:45,400 --> 00:32:48,400 Speaker 2: in almost ubiquity were like, what the fuck is this? 622 00:32:48,680 --> 00:32:51,040 Speaker 2: I don't know. I never met anybody that was like, no, 623 00:32:51,120 --> 00:32:53,160 Speaker 2: you know, it's so sick. When you two did that, 624 00:32:53,880 --> 00:32:56,000 Speaker 2: it was everybody biggest fans in the world. 625 00:32:56,040 --> 00:32:57,840 Speaker 1: It was even that was kind of like wait what 626 00:32:58,560 --> 00:33:00,520 Speaker 1: because it was a weird time, right, because remember like 627 00:33:00,600 --> 00:33:02,640 Speaker 1: Radio had put out their album for free. It was 628 00:33:02,680 --> 00:33:05,760 Speaker 1: in rainbows and that was what you Oh yeah, pay 629 00:33:05,760 --> 00:33:07,680 Speaker 1: what you want. That was the first and that seemed 630 00:33:07,720 --> 00:33:09,920 Speaker 1: like it was like what year was that? That's that 631 00:33:10,040 --> 00:33:12,440 Speaker 1: was two thousand and seven, that was right, So yeah, 632 00:33:12,760 --> 00:33:15,640 Speaker 1: so it was like seven years later they were like, okay, 633 00:33:15,720 --> 00:33:16,600 Speaker 1: we'll do it now too. 634 00:33:17,120 --> 00:33:22,400 Speaker 2: But it's the opposite. It's the polar opposite. That was, hey, 635 00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:26,320 Speaker 2: we're a huge band. We can go on tour whether 636 00:33:26,360 --> 00:33:29,440 Speaker 2: anybody buys this record or not, and gross millions of 637 00:33:29,480 --> 00:33:33,120 Speaker 2: dollars globally. So you know what what we think would 638 00:33:33,120 --> 00:33:36,680 Speaker 2: be cool is make this. It's always elective whether or 639 00:33:36,680 --> 00:33:38,400 Speaker 2: not you want to engage with music or not, but 640 00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:41,000 Speaker 2: now we're going to make it doubly elective. You can 641 00:33:41,040 --> 00:33:43,080 Speaker 2: engage with this, and if you don't want to pay 642 00:33:43,160 --> 00:33:46,800 Speaker 2: for it, you don't have to. This was like, I'm 643 00:33:46,920 --> 00:33:52,920 Speaker 2: sure you two got paid for that millions and million. 644 00:33:53,040 --> 00:33:56,520 Speaker 2: I'm sure it wasn't a fucking gradis thing between Apple 645 00:33:56,680 --> 00:34:00,520 Speaker 2: and you two, or Emi and Apple or there's no 646 00:34:01,200 --> 00:34:04,640 Speaker 2: world in which that was a free And it's like 647 00:34:05,120 --> 00:34:07,520 Speaker 2: like economics at fucking high school. It was like, there 648 00:34:07,560 --> 00:34:09,239 Speaker 2: is no such thing as a free lunch. There's no 649 00:34:09,320 --> 00:34:11,680 Speaker 2: such thing as a free you two record on an iPhone. 650 00:34:11,719 --> 00:34:15,000 Speaker 2: There's just no now when everyone involves fucking you two 651 00:34:15,400 --> 00:34:18,399 Speaker 2: at this point is a multinational corporation, but E AM, 652 00:34:18,440 --> 00:34:21,920 Speaker 2: I and Apple are like the biggest baddies out there, 653 00:34:22,040 --> 00:34:26,560 Speaker 2: you know, two of them, so to be like it was, 654 00:34:26,719 --> 00:34:31,279 Speaker 2: there's no way that that was like totally the opposite 655 00:34:31,360 --> 00:34:34,080 Speaker 2: of whatever. Fucking And that's what makes this thing so funny. 656 00:34:34,080 --> 00:34:36,520 Speaker 2: By the way, as we round out towards the end here, 657 00:34:37,239 --> 00:34:43,239 Speaker 2: there's nothing what is less punk rock mandating everyone with 658 00:34:43,719 --> 00:34:48,080 Speaker 2: this device gets your record on a given day because 659 00:34:48,600 --> 00:34:51,319 Speaker 2: the corporations say so. And then you try to like 660 00:34:51,400 --> 00:34:54,000 Speaker 2: fucking make it look like some magnanimous gesture and you 661 00:34:54,080 --> 00:34:57,680 Speaker 2: reference Joey Ramone in your song. I can't think of 662 00:34:57,719 --> 00:35:02,359 Speaker 2: something more like. There's layers of ludicrous out of touchness 663 00:35:02,800 --> 00:35:03,360 Speaker 2: at the heart of. 664 00:35:03,400 --> 00:35:05,600 Speaker 1: Letters of ludicrous out of touchness. 665 00:35:06,239 --> 00:35:09,000 Speaker 2: That's why I'm a duchess and I'm not throwing away money. 666 00:35:09,120 --> 00:35:12,080 Speaker 1: Yes, yes, yes, full sirk mabe full sirk. 667 00:35:13,440 --> 00:35:17,760 Speaker 2: Well, what's the verdict case at the end of the day. 668 00:35:17,960 --> 00:35:20,640 Speaker 1: I this was a tough one to give a chance 669 00:35:20,680 --> 00:35:23,359 Speaker 1: because you know, like culturally we all, like you said, 670 00:35:23,600 --> 00:35:27,279 Speaker 1: all hated this. So you know, so it's like it's 671 00:35:27,320 --> 00:35:32,960 Speaker 1: starting on such a wrong foot, but yeah, it's also 672 00:35:33,440 --> 00:35:35,480 Speaker 1: I finished that song and was like, I can't tell 673 00:35:35,520 --> 00:35:38,960 Speaker 1: you many lyrics. I can't tell you many moments that 674 00:35:39,000 --> 00:35:42,040 Speaker 1: impressed me. It just felt so stock. 675 00:35:42,200 --> 00:35:45,799 Speaker 2: Most importantly divorced from everything else we just talked about, 676 00:35:45,840 --> 00:35:48,120 Speaker 2: which I think is all I always don't think that 677 00:35:48,120 --> 00:35:50,640 Speaker 2: that's the most interesting and important conversation to have is 678 00:35:50,680 --> 00:35:53,360 Speaker 2: all of those conversations. But at the heart of it 679 00:35:53,480 --> 00:35:56,200 Speaker 2: is a song, and you're right. The thing that just 680 00:35:56,239 --> 00:35:58,239 Speaker 2: to even bring it back to that, it is a 681 00:35:58,440 --> 00:36:01,640 Speaker 2: five out of ten, and that's the worst place to be. 682 00:36:02,000 --> 00:36:04,759 Speaker 2: It's not a one, it's not a ten. It is 683 00:36:04,960 --> 00:36:08,920 Speaker 2: it sounds like they over That is the definition to 684 00:36:08,920 --> 00:36:12,840 Speaker 2: some degree of like polishing a turd. The production is unassailable. 685 00:36:13,239 --> 00:36:15,759 Speaker 2: They have all the oh, let's put the ooos in 686 00:36:15,880 --> 00:36:19,120 Speaker 2: for a hook, everything sounds great, the choice is made, 687 00:36:19,280 --> 00:36:22,680 Speaker 2: but there is nothing. The chorus comes and goes and 688 00:36:22,680 --> 00:36:25,080 Speaker 2: you're like, that was the chorus. There is nothing to 689 00:36:25,320 --> 00:36:30,239 Speaker 2: that song. It's a very milk toast song, and that 690 00:36:30,360 --> 00:36:33,000 Speaker 2: I certainly do not think is the miracle of Joey Ramone. 691 00:36:33,040 --> 00:36:35,600 Speaker 2: I guess lyrically he's talking about finding punk music and 692 00:36:35,600 --> 00:36:37,320 Speaker 2: it giving him a voice and a kind of spirit 693 00:36:37,360 --> 00:36:39,960 Speaker 2: of liberation, and that's great. But then there's a lot 694 00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:41,799 Speaker 2: of throwing shit in there that feels a little bit 695 00:36:41,840 --> 00:36:45,719 Speaker 2: like he did. It was like his first pass and 696 00:36:45,800 --> 00:36:48,080 Speaker 2: it was like print it anyway. 697 00:36:48,239 --> 00:36:50,080 Speaker 1: You know, it's kind of crazy about this. How much 698 00:36:50,120 --> 00:36:53,480 Speaker 1: time we have we can let's rap with this. So 699 00:36:55,320 --> 00:36:57,719 Speaker 1: oh there was I was thinking about this because it's 700 00:36:58,560 --> 00:37:01,120 Speaker 1: trying to be a very similar thing with those big guitars. 701 00:37:01,600 --> 00:37:04,960 Speaker 1: The other day, I Good Times, Bad Times came on 702 00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:11,520 Speaker 1: by Zeppelin. Yeah, yeah, that's what is it called good Days, 703 00:37:11,560 --> 00:37:13,160 Speaker 1: Bad Times? Good Times? 704 00:37:13,400 --> 00:37:15,680 Speaker 2: That's what this pot is called? Good Days, Bad Times? 705 00:37:17,640 --> 00:37:20,800 Speaker 1: Good Times? Bad Times comes on and I'm like this still, 706 00:37:22,640 --> 00:37:26,000 Speaker 1: Like I feel it, like it. It's it's still impressive. 707 00:37:26,040 --> 00:37:30,479 Speaker 1: Everyone's working, they're they're doing their best, Like everyone's doing 708 00:37:30,520 --> 00:37:34,360 Speaker 1: something so fun and unique. It's heavy, it's it's interesting, 709 00:37:35,040 --> 00:37:38,880 Speaker 1: it's provocative, and it's like from the get go, the 710 00:37:38,960 --> 00:37:42,920 Speaker 1: tones are great, Like the drumming is unbelievable and like 711 00:37:43,040 --> 00:37:45,200 Speaker 1: it holds up. If I heard that on the radio 712 00:37:45,200 --> 00:37:48,200 Speaker 1: for the first time, I'd be like, whoa, what is this? Yeah, 713 00:37:48,280 --> 00:37:52,120 Speaker 1: it just starts like that, and that whole song is 714 00:37:52,160 --> 00:37:55,960 Speaker 1: twists and turns. It's like everyone's playing at ten and 715 00:37:56,080 --> 00:37:57,840 Speaker 1: not like you have to make every song be that 716 00:37:58,000 --> 00:37:59,879 Speaker 1: and every genre should be that. But if you are 717 00:38:00,040 --> 00:38:02,800 Speaker 1: swing for it, you should be like this is still 718 00:38:02,920 --> 00:38:06,520 Speaker 1: something to compare yourself to totally amaze some degree. 719 00:38:06,719 --> 00:38:09,319 Speaker 2: Maybe a fair thing to point out about that is, 720 00:38:09,960 --> 00:38:13,600 Speaker 2: unless I'm wrong, led Zeppelin's entire recorded output spans what 721 00:38:13,719 --> 00:38:17,239 Speaker 2: a decade they live in our consciousness, right, But Good 722 00:38:17,239 --> 00:38:19,600 Speaker 2: Times Bad Times, I still think is like from whatever 723 00:38:19,800 --> 00:38:22,279 Speaker 2: it's it's even if it was the last record, isn't 724 00:38:22,280 --> 00:38:25,080 Speaker 2: that like nineteen eighty or something, nineteen seventy eight? 725 00:38:25,200 --> 00:38:27,600 Speaker 1: Now this, I think Good Times Bad Time is on 726 00:38:27,640 --> 00:38:29,200 Speaker 1: an earlier record, right, That's. 727 00:38:29,040 --> 00:38:32,080 Speaker 2: What I mean. So like, yeah, they I guess you 728 00:38:32,120 --> 00:38:35,160 Speaker 2: could say the same thing about whatever was on you know, 729 00:38:35,840 --> 00:38:40,359 Speaker 2: Boy or War or The Unforgetable Fire, you know what 730 00:38:40,400 --> 00:38:43,560 Speaker 2: I mean? Like I think what I always have to 731 00:38:43,600 --> 00:38:47,840 Speaker 2: remind myself about these bands, even the Beatles, the Beatles, 732 00:38:47,920 --> 00:38:50,319 Speaker 2: led Zeppelin, certainly things like Nirvana where you know he 733 00:38:50,400 --> 00:38:53,160 Speaker 2: was a kid. It's like they didn't have to well, 734 00:38:53,400 --> 00:38:55,880 Speaker 2: the individual members of those bands, with the exception of 735 00:38:55,960 --> 00:39:00,719 Speaker 2: ones who've died do age into potential irrelevance or into 736 00:39:00,760 --> 00:39:04,239 Speaker 2: these embarrassments that are unavoidable. People that die when they're 737 00:39:04,239 --> 00:39:08,040 Speaker 2: twenty five thirty years old, they're ensconced for eternity in 738 00:39:08,080 --> 00:39:11,279 Speaker 2: that peak of cool, you know what I mean. They 739 00:39:11,280 --> 00:39:15,040 Speaker 2: didn't have to like degrade themselves further over forty years. 740 00:39:15,440 --> 00:39:17,479 Speaker 2: But I do think there is something to be said 741 00:39:17,520 --> 00:39:20,120 Speaker 2: for like, yeah, maybe if the spark's not there, like 742 00:39:20,239 --> 00:39:23,360 Speaker 2: take a little time, because even that early two thousands 743 00:39:23,440 --> 00:39:25,560 Speaker 2: U two stuff. Well, maybe I'll shut up after this, 744 00:39:25,719 --> 00:39:28,800 Speaker 2: Like I'm not saying that's my favorite music by them, 745 00:39:29,239 --> 00:39:32,200 Speaker 2: Vertigo and Beautiful Day and Stuck in a Moment, But 746 00:39:32,239 --> 00:39:34,240 Speaker 2: that's there's vitality in that music. 747 00:39:34,280 --> 00:39:34,879 Speaker 1: I think so too. 748 00:39:34,960 --> 00:39:36,960 Speaker 2: There absolutely is. And you could still hear a band 749 00:39:36,960 --> 00:39:39,560 Speaker 2: who's having fun. You could still hear a band who's 750 00:39:39,600 --> 00:39:42,280 Speaker 2: like and maybe that's the last point. Maybe they tried 751 00:39:42,320 --> 00:39:45,080 Speaker 2: their experimental moment in the last part of the nineties 752 00:39:45,080 --> 00:39:47,560 Speaker 2: where he's like making pop, they're making dance music or 753 00:39:47,600 --> 00:39:50,320 Speaker 2: what they think dance music is electronic music. He's dressed 754 00:39:50,320 --> 00:39:52,600 Speaker 2: in a glitter suit with makeup and he's the devil. 755 00:39:53,120 --> 00:39:54,680 Speaker 2: And then it was like people were like, we just 756 00:39:54,719 --> 00:39:56,799 Speaker 2: wanted to sound like you too, So they make that 757 00:39:56,840 --> 00:39:58,680 Speaker 2: record where they sound like you too, and then it 758 00:39:58,680 --> 00:40:00,680 Speaker 2: seems like from that point for wh they've been sort 759 00:40:00,719 --> 00:40:05,200 Speaker 2: of cause playing you two to diminishing returns and that's 760 00:40:05,680 --> 00:40:17,399 Speaker 2: my chance times anti chance, and I'm not throwing my ship. Yeah, 761 00:40:17,400 --> 00:40:18,160 Speaker 2: I see you forever