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Speaker 1: Pushkin. This is the second episode of a three part series.

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Speaker 1: You can enjoy it on a standalone basis, but if

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Speaker 1: you've not heard episode one, you might prefer to listen

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Speaker 1: to it first. The tearful young widow in a cheap

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Speaker 1: looking dress was desperate to get in touch with her

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Speaker 1: recently deceased husband. She explained to mister Herman Parker, one

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Speaker 1: of the leading spiritualist mediums in Chicago. Mister Parker could

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Speaker 1: help with that for a fee, of course. He settled down,

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Speaker 1: closed his eyes and went into a trance.

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Speaker 2: I am in touch with a man. Yes, it's your husband.

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Speaker 3: He says.

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Speaker 2: He is happy but misses you. I think he is

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Speaker 2: leaving us now.

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Speaker 1: Parker opened his eyes.

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Speaker 4: He's gone. Oh, but I did so want to ask

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Speaker 4: him what to do with the money?

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Speaker 1: The money, yes, the widow explained the settlement for his

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Speaker 1: death three thousand dollars.

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Speaker 2: Perhaps I can get your husband back.

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Speaker 1: Said mister Parker. He closed his eyes again.

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Speaker 2: I have your husband again. His spirit is standing by

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Speaker 2: your side. He says, to invest the money. He is

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Speaker 2: trying to give me the name of the company he

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Speaker 2: wants you to invest in.

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Speaker 1: Parker screwed up his face in concentration, then reached for

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Speaker 1: a pen and scribbled a name.

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Speaker 2: Though Wilcox's Transportation Company. Your husband says it is a

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Speaker 2: very sound company.

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Speaker 4: I don't know how to thank you.

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Speaker 1: Said The young woman, wiping a tear from her eye,

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Speaker 1: paid mister Parker the fee for his consultation, went back

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Speaker 1: to her hotel and placed a long distance telephone call

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Speaker 1: to her boss, Harry Houdini. For this young woman was

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Speaker 1: no naive Chicago widow with a chunky death settlement to

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Speaker 1: invest She was New York bachelor girl Rose Mackenberg, Houdini's

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Speaker 1: chief investigator of dodgy mediums. Harry Houdini's sellout shows now

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Speaker 1: consisted of three acts, Some Magic, some of the escapes

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Speaker 1: that made his name, and a new final section called

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Speaker 1: Do the Dead Come Back, where Harry would name and

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Speaker 1: shame fraudulent local mediums. On the stage of the Princess

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Speaker 1: Theater in Chicago, Harry invited Rose to continue the story

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Speaker 1: of herman Parker. She looked into the Wilcox Transportation Company.

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Speaker 1: It was, of course, both worthless and run by an

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Speaker 1: associate of mister Parker. But it couldn't just be Rose's

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Speaker 1: word against herman Parker's they needed to gather hard evidence.

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Speaker 1: Rose told the theater, I.

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Speaker 4: Took out my checkbook and I said, I'm afraid I

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Speaker 4: can't write very well. Mister Parker. Could you help me

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Speaker 4: fill out the check The.

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Speaker 1: Audience loved it. Billboard called this section of Houdini's show

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Speaker 1: as laughter provoking as it was educational. Chicago's police also

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Speaker 1: enjoyed this particular story. They took mister Parker and mister

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Speaker 1: Wilcox to court and got them both convicted. But did

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Speaker 1: the laws in America do enough to protect the vulnerable,

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Speaker 1: bereaved clients of his cynical mediums. Harry Houdini was not

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Speaker 1: convinced that they did, and so in early nineteen twenty six,

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Speaker 1: Harry and Rose went to Washington. I'm Tim Harford, and

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Speaker 1: you're listening to cautionary Tales. The committee room in Washington,

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Speaker 1: d C. Was packed. Three hundred people crammed the seats,

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Speaker 1: the aisles, and anywhere else they could find. Some were

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Speaker 1: simply there to enjoy what promised to be an entertaining spectacle.

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Speaker 1: The Great Showman Houdini was going to give evidence in

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Speaker 1: support of the Copeland Bloom Bill. Others there were spiritualists

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Speaker 1: and mediums whose livelihood and liberty were under threat if

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Speaker 1: the bill made it onto the statute books. The Congressman

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Speaker 1: called the session to order. What is your full name?

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Speaker 1: He asked. My name is Harry Houdini, and what is

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Speaker 1: your business?

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Speaker 3: I am an author, I am a psychic investigator for

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Speaker 3: the scientific magazines of the world, and then I am

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Speaker 3: a mysterious entertainer.

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Speaker 1: It's a revealing answer about how Harry Houdini saw himself.

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Speaker 1: In his fifty second year, the famous escape artist put

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Speaker 1: mysterious entertainer only third on his list of occupations. Top

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Speaker 1: of that list was author. Houdini was proud of his book,

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Speaker 1: A Magician among the Spirits, partly a history of the

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Speaker 1: spiritualist movement and partly an account of his own dealings

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Speaker 1: with spiritualists, such as the seance at which Lady Doyle,

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Speaker 1: wife of the author, Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, had written

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Speaker 1: a lengthy letter that purported to come from Harry's mother.

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Speaker 1: Nearly four years had passed since that seance, and Houdini

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Speaker 1: had become more and more strident in his attacks on

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Speaker 1: those who claimed to be able to communicate with the dead.

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Speaker 1: In his experience, He told the assembled congressman.

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Speaker 3: There are only two kinds of mediums, those who are

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Speaker 3: mental degenerates and those who are deliberate cheats and france,

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Speaker 3: I have never seen one genuine medium.

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Speaker 1: But Houdini didn't just want to warn people off spending

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Speaker 1: their hard earned money on messages purportedly from the spirit world.

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Speaker 1: Now he thought it should be illegal to sell those

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Speaker 1: messages at all. That's what the Copeland Bloom Bill set

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Speaker 1: out to do. Cities around America had different laws on mediumship.

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Speaker 1: The laws in Washington, d c. Were among the most permissive.

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Speaker 1: They said that mediums, clairvoyants, soothsayers, fortune tellers, or palmists

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Speaker 1: conducting business for profit shall pay a license tax of

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Speaker 1: twenty five dollars per annum, and to get a license,

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Speaker 1: they simply had to apply to the Superintendent of Licenses

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Speaker 1: with letters from ten credible residents that he or she

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Speaker 1: is of good character. Not exactly difficult, as Houdini pointed out,

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Speaker 1: The problem was was that having a license seemed to

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Speaker 1: imply that the government was vouching for your skills. Fortune

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Speaker 1: tellers could proudly display their official certificate in much the

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Speaker 1: same way as properly qualified lawyers or doctors. The Copeland

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Speaker 1: Bloombill would go to the other extreme. It would ban

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Speaker 1: all together pretending to tell fortunes or unite the separated,

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Speaker 1: among other things. Some of the congressional representatives of the

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Speaker 1: hearing shared Houdini's skepticism about clairvoyance, soothsayers and so on.

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Speaker 1: Others were more credulous that palmistry is a science, said

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Speaker 1: one representative. Isn't it, No, it is not. Houdini was appalled.

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Speaker 3: How can you tell anything from the lines of the hand.

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Speaker 3: You can tell whether a man is a bricklayer or

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Speaker 3: a bank clerk.

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Speaker 1: The congressman continued, I understand astrology can bring out facts

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Speaker 1: that have been proven to be true. Houdini tried to

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Speaker 1: explain to him why you should never be too impressed

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Speaker 1: at discovering that an astrologist has predicted something accurately.

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Speaker 3: Where they make so many guesses, sometimes they make a

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Speaker 3: good guess. If you guess often enough, you're bound to

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Speaker 3: guess something right.

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Speaker 1: The congressman moved on to spiritualism. If it really is

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Speaker 1: such an outrageous fake and fraud, why would that not

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Speaker 1: have been discovered by Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, who after all,

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Speaker 1: is an outstanding authority. Houdini snapped back.

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Speaker 3: Conan Doyle is not an outstanding authority.

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Speaker 1: He is accepted as one of the best, the committee

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Speaker 1: member said.

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Speaker 3: No, he is not accepted as one of the best.

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Speaker 3: He is one of the greatest dupes.

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Speaker 1: The year's long friendship between Houdini and Conan Doyle had

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Speaker 1: become increasingly strained since that seance with Doyle's wife. For

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Speaker 1: a while, Houdini still optimistically addressed his letters my dear

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Speaker 1: Sir Arthur, Conan Doyle became more stiff.

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Speaker 2: Our relations are suddenly.

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Speaker 1: Curious, he wrote to Houdini.

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Speaker 2: For so long as you attack what I know from

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Speaker 2: experience to be true, I have no alternative but to

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Speaker 2: attack you in return. How long a private friendship can

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Speaker 2: survive such an ordeal? I do not know.

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Speaker 1: You can see the problem. Doyle's wife is a medium,

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Speaker 1: and there's Houdini breezily telling a congressional committee that every

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Speaker 1: medium he's encountered is either a deliberate fraud or a

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Speaker 1: mental degenerate. But there's another reason why Arthur and Houdini

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Speaker 1: had fallen out, and it's to do with the second occupation.

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Speaker 1: Whodini listed psychic investigator for the scientific magazines of the world.

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Speaker 1: The Scientific American magazine put up a cash prize for

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Speaker 1: anyone who could conclusively demonstrate psychic phenomena to their panel

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Speaker 1: of eminent academic investigators. The panel was on the cusp

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Speaker 1: of awarding the prize to a friend of Conan Doyle,

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Speaker 1: a medium called Marjorie, the wife of a Boston surgeon,

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Speaker 1: at whose seances the spirits rang bells and shook tambourines.

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Speaker 1: The academics were stumped if this was all a trick.

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Speaker 1: They couldn't figure out how Marjorie was doing it, so

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Speaker 1: it must be spirits. But when the magazine sent Houdini,

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Speaker 1: he watched closely and understood it was slight of hand,

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Speaker 1: highly accomplished and hard to detect, but slight of hand.

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Speaker 1: None the less, academics aren't smart enough for this kind

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Speaker 1: of investigation.

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Speaker 3: Houdini explained, it takes a flim flammer to catch a

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Speaker 3: flim flammer.

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Speaker 1: Because of Houdini, Marjorie did not get the cash prize,

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Speaker 1: But for Sir Arthur it wasn't about the money. The

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Speaker 1: approval of Scientific American would have been a major boost

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Speaker 1: for the spiritualist religion. Sir Arthur was furious with Houdini.

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Speaker 1: He was certain that Marjorie had genuine supernatural powers and

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Speaker 1: Houdini's expose a was unfair. For that matter, he was

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Speaker 1: sure Houdini had supernatural powers and was only pretending that

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Speaker 1: he didn't. When journalists asked Houdini about Conan Oyle, he

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Speaker 1: didn't hold back. Conan Doyle is getting a bit senile.

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Speaker 1: He's fifteen years Houdini's senior. The old man is easily bamboozled.

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Speaker 1: It's such a pity, Houdini, says.

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Speaker 3: Doyle thinks he is a messiah who has come to

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Speaker 3: save mankind. Instead of that, he is misleading the public,

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Speaker 3: and his teachings are a menace to sanity and health.

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Speaker 1: Houdini was on a mission. He now saw exposing frauds

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Speaker 1: like Marjorie as his sacred duty, and he couldn't do

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Speaker 1: it alone. Cautionary tales will be back after the break.

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Speaker 1: Rose Mackenberg was born in Brooklyn to Russian immigrant parents.

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Speaker 1: She started out as a stenographer at a law firm,

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Speaker 1: then became a private detective. She had just turned thirty

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Speaker 1: when she took on a new client who wanted her

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Speaker 1: to investigate a medium. The medium had given him bad

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Speaker 1: investment advice. Rose didn't know much about mediums, but she

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Speaker 1: did know someone who knew Harry Houdini. She asked the

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Speaker 1: mutual friend to set up a meeting so she could

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Speaker 1: ask for Houdini's advice on how to proceed. Coincidentally, Rose

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Speaker 1: had just spent an evening at a seance herself, invited

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Speaker 1: by a friend who said it would be good, clean fun.

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Speaker 1: It was certainly fun. Rose told Houdini the story. The medium,

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Speaker 1: an attractive young woman, was tied to a chair. Her

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Speaker 1: assistant switched out the lights, and in the darkness, she

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Speaker 1: called on the spirits to play various musical instruments, culminate

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Speaker 1: with a big bass drum in the middle of the room.

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Speaker 1: Her assistant turned on the light to reveal that the

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Speaker 1: medium was still tied to the chair and the big

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Speaker 1: bass drum was beating all on its own. Rose was

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Speaker 1: curious about how it was done, she told Houdini, so

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Speaker 1: she went back a few nights later in disguise. When

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Speaker 1: the lights were turned out, she quietly left her seat

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Speaker 1: and crawled towards the drum, stretching out her fingers in

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Speaker 1: the darkness until they encountered a child, whoever it was, froze,

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Speaker 1: so Rose felt them out further. No, not a child,

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Speaker 1: a dwarf, a very small dwarf. Rose crawled back to

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Speaker 1: her seat, her curiosity satisfied. When the lights came on

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Speaker 1: and the drum was sounding. This time she knew what

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Speaker 1: it was, the dwarf beating the drum from inside. Houdini

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Speaker 1: listened to the story, gave Rose the advice she wanted,

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Speaker 1: then offered her a job. Rose was tough, smart, and,

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Speaker 1: crucially for Houdini, open minded. She had no particular views

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Speaker 1: either way on whether it might be possible to make

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Speaker 1: contact with the dead. If she did happen to find

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Speaker 1: a medium who was genuine, sh'd let Houdini know. As

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Speaker 1: Rose later wrote.

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Speaker 4: Harry Houdini, from the bottom of his fine soul, wanted

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Speaker 4: passionately to believe in spiritualism. He would have sacrificed a

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Speaker 4: fortune if he had ever been able to convince himself

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Speaker 4: that there was actually such a thing as communication with

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Speaker 4: the dead. His relentless attempts to unmask for dudulent mediums

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Speaker 4: were devoid of malice, he thought, but one thing truth.

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Speaker 1: Houdini sent Rose around the country trying to find that elusive,

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Speaker 1: genuine medium while gathering material for his shows. When she

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Speaker 1: got to a new city, she had first hang out

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Speaker 1: in department stores to observe the local fashions. She had

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Speaker 1: decide on a persona the rustic school teacher, perhaps the

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Speaker 1: credulous servant girl, or the small town matron, should purchase

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Speaker 1: an appropriate outfit. Back at her hotel, she wrote.

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Speaker 4: I'd remove the powder from my face, plaster my hair

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Speaker 4: down in the most unbecoming fashion, probably put on glasses

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Speaker 4: and sally forth.

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Speaker 1: Sometimes Houdini himself would turn up for the fun of

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Speaker 1: unmasking the fraud. Inland, Ohio, Houdini went to a seance

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Speaker 1: at a famous trumpet medium's house in a blond wig

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Speaker 1: and thick glasses, having given his name as mister f Road.

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Speaker 1: He had with him a photographer, a prosecutor, a flashlight,

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Speaker 1: and lampblack, a pigment used in boot polish. Trumpet mediums

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Speaker 1: claimed that the spirits move the trumpet around in the

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Speaker 1: darkness and whisper their messages through it. When the lights

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Speaker 1: went out, Houdini surreptitiously smeared lamp black on the trumpet.

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Speaker 1: Then mid seance turned on his flashlight. The photographer caught

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Speaker 1: the medium blackhanded. The prosecutor told him, you're obtaining money

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Speaker 1: under false pretenses. The medium was outraged. In forty years,

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Speaker 1: he protested, I have never been exposed. Well, said Houdini,

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Speaker 1: whipping off his blonde wig.

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Speaker 3: Why now?

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Speaker 1: More often Rose would gather evidence herself, sometimes at grave

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Speaker 1: personal risk. She consulted a man about sixty years old

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Speaker 1: who ran his own spiritualist church. She casually mentioned that

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Speaker 1: she was interested in establishing a church herself. Her husband

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Speaker 1: had left her plenty of money. It was a way

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Speaker 1: to prove how easy it could be to set yourself

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Speaker 1: up as an authority in the spiritualist religion. The man

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Speaker 1: leaned back in his chair, closed his eyes, and began

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Speaker 1: to breathe heavily.

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Speaker 5: Your husband is right near you. He loves you. So

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Speaker 5: your husband tells me to tell you. You go into

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Speaker 5: this work.

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Speaker 2: You'll be quite successful.

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Speaker 4: Can you ask my husband where I would find someone

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Speaker 4: to assist me.

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Speaker 1: The man began to speak in a changed voice.

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Speaker 6: Ask the medium. The medium is very good. He can

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Speaker 6: give you a charter for your church. He can cure

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Speaker 6: you physically. You have to be purified before you can

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Speaker 6: do this.

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Speaker 5: Work.

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Speaker 1: The man stopped speaking, breathed heavily for a while longer,

266
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Speaker 1: then rubbed his eyes and spoke in his normal voice again.

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Speaker 5: What did I say?

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Speaker 1: Rose repeated the man's words back to him. Yes, he

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Speaker 1: agreed thoughtfully he could do that. He went into another

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Speaker 1: room and returned with a framed charter for a branch

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Speaker 1: of his church, the First Church of the Divine Light.

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Speaker 1: It would cost Rose five dollars to be ordained, but

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Speaker 1: as the spirits rightly said, she would first need to

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Speaker 1: be purified, and yes, he could purify her.

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Speaker 2: Now, have you any corsets on?

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Speaker 5: The steel will interfere in the purification process?

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Speaker 1: Rose did not have any corsets on, She confirmed.

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Speaker 5: I must get close to the body.

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Speaker 1: He knelt in front of Rose's chair, made the sign

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Speaker 1: of the Cross over her face, then began to rub

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Speaker 1: her ankles and her thighs.

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Speaker 5: Lord, please help me to show this new worker the light.

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Speaker 1: He put his hand on her breast.

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Speaker 5: You God, bring this worker closer to me.

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Speaker 1: Rose stood up, the man still on his knees.

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Speaker 4: I feel purified already. Thank you, five dollars, did you say?

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Speaker 1: Rose paid her money and made her escape from the

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Speaker 1: medium's house. Clutching her framed charter. She was now the

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Speaker 1: Reverend Florence B. Rush of the First Church of the

290
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Speaker 1: Divine Light. When Houdini went to Washington to give evidence

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00:23:06,210 --> 00:23:11,130
Speaker 1: for the Copeland Bloom Bill, he sent Rose ahead. As

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Speaker 1: always suitably disguised, she went to visit two of Washington's

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Speaker 1: most prominent mediums. Houdini called Rose Mackenberg to testify in

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Speaker 1: front of the Congressional Committee. What is your full.

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Speaker 4: Name, Reverend Rose Mackenberg?

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00:23:38,210 --> 00:23:42,090
Speaker 1: Rose explained that she's not just any old reverend. Note

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Speaker 1: she's been ordained six times as a spiritualist minister under

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Speaker 1: various silly names. She has full rights to baptize, to marry,

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Speaker 1: and to bury. She explained too, that the previous day

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Speaker 1: she had made appointments to see two of the best

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Speaker 1: known Washington mediums, Madame Marcia and Missus Coates.

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Speaker 3: Why are you dressed differently from what you are today.

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Speaker 4: Whodini asked, entirely different.

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Speaker 1: Madame Marcia and Missus Coates were both in the committee room.

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Speaker 1: They got up and started to shout.

306
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Speaker 7: I'd demand the right to defend myself.

307
00:24:24,850 --> 00:24:30,090
Speaker 1: Rose related the typically vague reetings she received Missus Coates.

308
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Speaker 1: She says told her.

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Speaker 4: The spirits tell me that you are going to take

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Speaker 4: a trip very shortly and going to meet some person

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Speaker 4: and be placed in a different environment.

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Speaker 1: Could she be more specific? No. As for Madame Marcia,

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Speaker 1: she said a spirit was trying to communicate with her

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Speaker 1: by the name of.

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Speaker 3: So or maybe G.

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Speaker 1: Anyway, said Rose. I then engaged them in conversation about

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Speaker 1: these hearings and this bill. The two mediums, both heavily

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Speaker 1: built women, edged menacingly closer to Rose.

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Speaker 3: I insist that missus Colts keep away from the witness.

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Speaker 1: Houdina yelled. He turned back to Rose.

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Speaker 3: What did she tell you, object.

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00:25:26,810 --> 00:25:32,050
Speaker 1: Shouted Missus Coates. The medium said, Rose told me she

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Speaker 1: thinks the bill won't pass because most senators visit mediums.

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Speaker 1: She named four senators who visit her.

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Speaker 4: That's a lie, She named Senator Kaeper, Senator Watson, Senator Dill,

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Speaker 4: and Senator Fletcher. Then she said, I know for a

327
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Speaker 4: fact there have been spiritual seances held at the White

328
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Speaker 4: House with President Coolidge and his family.

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Speaker 1: The chairman vainly tried to restore order. A man barreged

330
00:26:11,850 --> 00:26:15,730
Speaker 1: through the crowd to lunge at Houdini, shouting, I'll break

331
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Speaker 1: your nose, a congressman threw himself in the way. The

332
00:26:20,090 --> 00:26:26,330
Speaker 1: police were called. The newspapers loved it. Today's Session, said

333
00:26:26,330 --> 00:26:29,570
Speaker 1: The New York Times came near winding up in a

334
00:26:29,650 --> 00:26:35,650
Speaker 1: free for all fistfight. The Chicago Daily Tribune reported that

335
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Speaker 1: if luks could kill Missus Coates and Madame Marcia would

336
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Speaker 1: have destroyed the existence of miss Rose Mackenberg. Rose herself

337
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Speaker 1: later recalled.

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Speaker 4: Ordinarily I dislike scenes, but this pandemonium of unleashed hysteria

339
00:26:55,930 --> 00:27:04,810
Speaker 4: was not only volcanically dramatic, but extremely funny.

340
00:27:05,090 --> 00:27:08,650
Speaker 1: Missus Coates finally got her turn on the witness stand.

341
00:27:09,730 --> 00:27:12,650
Speaker 1: She claimed that Rose's account of their meeting was all wrong,

342
00:27:13,250 --> 00:27:17,290
Speaker 1: that actually she hadn't been fooled by Rose's disguise, and

343
00:27:17,650 --> 00:27:20,250
Speaker 1: that the message she had passed on from the spirits

344
00:27:20,570 --> 00:27:23,930
Speaker 1: was this, you were doing work that is killing you.

345
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Speaker 7: If you don't stop it, you will not live eighteen months.

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Speaker 1: Cautionary tales will be back after the break. The congressional

347
00:27:49,450 --> 00:27:53,850
Speaker 1: hearings on the Copeland Bloom Bill were a total waste

348
00:27:53,890 --> 00:27:56,850
Speaker 1: of time. If you were hoping they might shed some

349
00:27:57,010 --> 00:28:00,370
Speaker 1: light on the wisest way to legislate about mediums and

350
00:28:00,490 --> 00:28:04,290
Speaker 1: fortune tellers. But if all you wanted was circus entertainment,

351
00:28:04,370 --> 00:28:10,730
Speaker 1: they were great. Phodini theatrically brandished ten thousand dollars in cash,

352
00:28:11,010 --> 00:28:14,690
Speaker 1: hundreds of thousands in today's money. I'll give that to

353
00:28:14,970 --> 00:28:18,690
Speaker 1: any medium, he says, who can prove they get knowledge

354
00:28:18,730 --> 00:28:23,330
Speaker 1: by supernatural means. Tell me what nickname my father called

355
00:28:23,370 --> 00:28:26,770
Speaker 1: me when I was a boy. Or here he reaches

356
00:28:26,810 --> 00:28:30,610
Speaker 1: in his pocket and brings out a crumpled telegram. Tell

357
00:28:30,610 --> 00:28:35,930
Speaker 1: me what this telegram says? The medium Madame Marcia yells

358
00:28:35,970 --> 00:28:37,170
Speaker 1: from the audience that.

359
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Speaker 7: Money belongs to me.

360
00:28:39,410 --> 00:28:42,050
Speaker 4: I predicted the election of President Harding.

361
00:28:43,210 --> 00:28:45,770
Speaker 1: Wait a minute, as a congressman, I predicted that too.

362
00:28:46,610 --> 00:28:49,810
Speaker 1: I see the matter is in dispute, adds another. Why

363
00:28:49,850 --> 00:28:54,170
Speaker 1: don't I hold the ten thousand until it's settled. Houdini

364
00:28:54,290 --> 00:28:58,090
Speaker 1: performed tricks to show how easily he could replicate the

365
00:28:58,130 --> 00:29:01,690
Speaker 1: ways mediums claimed to be getting messages from the spirits.

366
00:29:02,250 --> 00:29:04,570
Speaker 1: Speaking through a trumpet, for example.

367
00:29:04,650 --> 00:29:08,450
Speaker 3: Now put it to your ear, and you have got

368
00:29:08,530 --> 00:29:09,290
Speaker 3: to have A.

369
00:29:11,010 --> 00:29:13,530
Speaker 1: Congressman puts the trumpet to his ear.

370
00:29:14,330 --> 00:29:17,890
Speaker 3: If you hear a voice, you speak to it, you say,

371
00:29:18,730 --> 00:29:23,050
Speaker 3: thank you, kind spirit. That's the rigamarole. They go through.

372
00:29:26,130 --> 00:29:29,930
Speaker 1: After making the congressman hear a voice, Hoodini shows them

373
00:29:29,930 --> 00:29:33,610
Speaker 1: a trick with writing on slates. He gets the congressman

374
00:29:33,650 --> 00:29:37,250
Speaker 1: to examine two blank slates, then ties them together with

375
00:29:37,290 --> 00:29:41,410
Speaker 1: a handkerchief. He gives another congressman a card and tells

376
00:29:41,450 --> 00:29:44,890
Speaker 1: him to drop it in a dictionary. As Houdini rifles

377
00:29:44,930 --> 00:29:46,210
Speaker 1: through the pages.

378
00:29:47,010 --> 00:29:49,530
Speaker 3: There is no human being living who can tell me

379
00:29:49,610 --> 00:29:52,010
Speaker 3: the number of the page in which that card has

380
00:29:52,050 --> 00:29:56,250
Speaker 3: been trapped. Spirits. I want you to please give me

381
00:29:56,330 --> 00:30:01,370
Speaker 3: the number of the page. Spirits, are you present if

382
00:30:01,410 --> 00:30:03,930
Speaker 3: you are here, pull my ridea.

383
00:30:05,810 --> 00:30:10,090
Speaker 1: Hoodini unwraps the handkerchief from around the slate on which

384
00:30:10,130 --> 00:30:16,170
Speaker 1: are written Two words. Are those the first and last

385
00:30:16,250 --> 00:30:19,530
Speaker 1: words on the dictionary page where the card was dropped.

386
00:30:20,290 --> 00:30:20,930
Speaker 1: They are.

387
00:30:23,210 --> 00:30:24,450
Speaker 3: Ladies and gentlemen.

388
00:30:24,570 --> 00:30:25,770
Speaker 5: This is a trick.

389
00:30:26,970 --> 00:30:29,890
Speaker 3: It is performed by mediums as a proof that they

390
00:30:29,970 --> 00:30:35,570
Speaker 3: consult with the dead. It is the easiest thing in

391
00:30:35,610 --> 00:30:40,290
Speaker 3: the world to make someone believe whose heart is yearning

392
00:30:40,890 --> 00:30:41,570
Speaker 3: to believe.

393
00:30:49,370 --> 00:30:53,290
Speaker 1: It's the nineteen twenties, the aftermath of the First World

394
00:30:53,330 --> 00:30:58,210
Speaker 1: War and the Terrible Flu of nineteen eighteen, the world

395
00:30:58,290 --> 00:31:03,690
Speaker 1: had no shortage of bereaved relatives. Whose hearts were yearning

396
00:31:04,130 --> 00:31:09,050
Speaker 1: to believe. Hudini tells the congressman the story of how

397
00:31:09,290 --> 00:31:13,330
Speaker 1: he once performed a slate writing trick for President Roosevelt,

398
00:31:13,690 --> 00:31:17,450
Speaker 1: and Roosevelt had later asked whether it was genuinely a

399
00:31:17,490 --> 00:31:20,610
Speaker 1: message from the spirits.

400
00:31:20,610 --> 00:31:24,890
Speaker 3: When a great mind like Roosevelt asks that there must

401
00:31:25,050 --> 00:31:31,210
Speaker 3: be protection for those who cannot protect themselves.

402
00:31:32,730 --> 00:31:36,890
Speaker 1: But was the Copeland Bloom Bill the right way to

403
00:31:36,970 --> 00:31:41,050
Speaker 1: provide that protection. When the opponents of the bill gave

404
00:31:41,130 --> 00:31:47,050
Speaker 1: their evidence, there were moments of levity. Missus Coates dramatically

405
00:31:47,130 --> 00:31:51,730
Speaker 1: explained that through the power of his own negative thoughts,

406
00:31:52,210 --> 00:31:57,370
Speaker 1: Houdini is destroying himself, then snapped at a journalist who

407
00:31:57,410 --> 00:32:03,290
Speaker 1: burst out laughing. Madame Marcia engaged a congressman in earnest

408
00:32:03,330 --> 00:32:07,250
Speaker 1: discussion about what it means to have saturn in scorpio

409
00:32:07,530 --> 00:32:13,330
Speaker 1: in the ascendancy. But there were more serious points too.

410
00:32:15,810 --> 00:32:21,050
Speaker 7: Prophecy, spiritual guidance and advice are the very foundation of

411
00:32:21,050 --> 00:32:25,610
Speaker 7: our religion, and to deny a spiritual minister the right

412
00:32:25,690 --> 00:32:29,170
Speaker 7: to advise their followers is to curtail their privileges as

413
00:32:29,210 --> 00:32:33,890
Speaker 7: ministers that their religion. It is a very delicate question gentlemen.

414
00:32:36,690 --> 00:32:42,090
Speaker 1: That hit home. As one congressman mused, it is mighty

415
00:32:42,210 --> 00:32:48,650
Speaker 1: difficult to legislate about religion. Then how exactly do you

416
00:32:48,690 --> 00:32:53,930
Speaker 1: define fortune telling? The wording of the bill was hard

417
00:32:53,970 --> 00:32:57,890
Speaker 1: to pause. You could read it as criminalizing a doctor

418
00:32:57,970 --> 00:33:02,170
Speaker 1: giving a prognosis or the United States Weather Bureau providing

419
00:33:02,170 --> 00:33:07,090
Speaker 1: a weather forecast. And what about uniting the separated? What

420
00:33:07,130 --> 00:33:11,130
Speaker 1: does that mean? If a divorce lawyer persuades her clients

421
00:33:11,250 --> 00:33:15,690
Speaker 1: to give their marriage another chance, would she be guilty

422
00:33:15,730 --> 00:33:20,650
Speaker 1: of uniting the separated by a strict construction of this law?

423
00:33:21,090 --> 00:33:26,530
Speaker 1: Perhaps she would after all the fun with trumpets and

424
00:33:26,690 --> 00:33:32,290
Speaker 1: slates and saturn in scorpio. Eventually, an actual lawyer took

425
00:33:32,330 --> 00:33:37,450
Speaker 1: to the stand to give evidence, although one suspicious congressman

426
00:33:37,770 --> 00:33:40,610
Speaker 1: wanted to be sure he knew who they were speaking to.

427
00:33:42,050 --> 00:33:45,730
Speaker 1: Are you a spiritualist, I am not, said the lawyer.

428
00:33:46,250 --> 00:33:50,810
Speaker 1: Are you a palmist? I am not. You're just a lawyer,

429
00:33:51,890 --> 00:33:57,210
Speaker 1: a mere lawyer. The mere lawyer explained that some clauses

430
00:33:57,250 --> 00:34:02,170
Speaker 1: of the bill are hard to understand. Others might criminalize

431
00:34:02,210 --> 00:34:06,890
Speaker 1: things nobody wants to criminalize, and others still were already

432
00:34:06,970 --> 00:34:11,970
Speaker 1: covered by existing legislation on crimes such as fraud or

433
00:34:12,170 --> 00:34:18,450
Speaker 1: obtaining money under false pretenses. The Copeland Bloom bill doesn't

434
00:34:18,490 --> 00:34:24,570
Speaker 1: actually accomplish what it wants to accomplish, she said, but

435
00:34:24,690 --> 00:34:29,850
Speaker 1: perhaps Senator Copeland and Congressman Bloom shouldn't feel too bad

436
00:34:29,890 --> 00:34:36,250
Speaker 1: about that. In the century that's followed, plenty more legislators

437
00:34:36,450 --> 00:34:41,610
Speaker 1: have found psychic phenomena a slippery thing to regulate. In

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00:34:41,650 --> 00:34:47,090
Speaker 1: twenty twelve, the International Journal of Law in Context published

439
00:34:47,090 --> 00:34:51,010
Speaker 1: a paper by scholars from the University of Westminster exploring

440
00:34:51,130 --> 00:34:55,970
Speaker 1: why the UK, for example, had tried the Vagrancy Act,

441
00:34:56,290 --> 00:35:00,450
Speaker 1: the Fraud Act, the Theft Act, the Fraudulent Mediums Act,

442
00:35:00,890 --> 00:35:05,650
Speaker 1: the Trade Descriptions Act, and the Unfair Commercial Practice Regulations,

443
00:35:06,170 --> 00:35:12,370
Speaker 1: all of them manifestly in effect. Is paying to consult

444
00:35:12,410 --> 00:35:19,090
Speaker 1: a medium a consumer transaction, an entertainment service, a religious experience.

445
00:35:20,050 --> 00:35:23,250
Speaker 1: If a medium can't prove they're in touch with the dead,

446
00:35:23,890 --> 00:35:28,130
Speaker 1: should the law care if they genuinely believe it. The

447
00:35:28,250 --> 00:35:31,810
Speaker 1: article's authors reach a conclusion much like that of the

448
00:35:31,850 --> 00:35:37,450
Speaker 1: mere lawyer. It seems unlikely that adequate legislation can be

449
00:35:37,530 --> 00:35:43,010
Speaker 1: framed to deal with what is unknown or unprovable. But

450
00:35:43,130 --> 00:35:46,770
Speaker 1: there's a bigger issue at play. Even when things are

451
00:35:46,970 --> 00:35:50,810
Speaker 1: knowable or provable, There's only so much the law can

452
00:35:50,890 --> 00:35:56,450
Speaker 1: do to shield people from their own gullibility. It's not illegal,

453
00:35:56,570 --> 00:36:02,090
Speaker 1: for example, to sell useless alternative health products, although it

454
00:36:02,170 --> 00:36:04,970
Speaker 1: might be illegal to market them with claims you can't

455
00:36:04,970 --> 00:36:10,130
Speaker 1: back up. Many countries make banks refund customers who fall

456
00:36:10,210 --> 00:36:14,650
Speaker 1: for some kinds of scam, but not all scams. The

457
00:36:14,730 --> 00:36:18,730
Speaker 1: impulse behind the Copeland Bloom Bill, using the law to

458
00:36:18,810 --> 00:36:23,690
Speaker 1: protect vulnerable people is a noble one. But there comes

459
00:36:23,730 --> 00:36:27,210
Speaker 1: a point when laws have to let the public make

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00:36:27,410 --> 00:36:31,930
Speaker 1: their own mistakes. Or, as one congressman summed it up

461
00:36:31,930 --> 00:36:36,890
Speaker 1: to Houdini with an air of resignation, I completely agree

462
00:36:36,930 --> 00:36:39,970
Speaker 1: with you about all this, But what's the use in

463
00:36:40,090 --> 00:36:44,890
Speaker 1: us legislating? A fool and his money are soon parted

464
00:36:45,650 --> 00:36:52,970
Speaker 1: and always will be the showman. Houdini takes the stand

465
00:36:53,010 --> 00:36:56,970
Speaker 1: in the committee room one last time to choreograph what

466
00:36:57,250 --> 00:37:01,290
Speaker 1: Rose Mackenberg later describes as one of the most touching

467
00:37:01,410 --> 00:37:04,050
Speaker 1: little domestic interludes I have ever seen.

468
00:37:05,330 --> 00:37:07,410
Speaker 3: My character has been a sale.

469
00:37:07,530 --> 00:37:12,530
Speaker 1: Says Houdini. It's true one witness compared him to Judas

470
00:37:13,410 --> 00:37:17,170
Speaker 1: someone else shouted anti Semitic slurs while trying to punch

471
00:37:17,250 --> 00:37:22,010
Speaker 1: him in the nose. He's been called brutal, vile, and crazy.

472
00:37:22,930 --> 00:37:24,410
Speaker 1: He wants to defend himself.

473
00:37:25,570 --> 00:37:29,450
Speaker 8: There are no medals and ribbons on me, but when

474
00:37:29,450 --> 00:37:32,370
Speaker 8: a girl will stick to a man for thirty two years,

475
00:37:33,370 --> 00:37:37,090
Speaker 8: it is a pretty good recommendation I would like to

476
00:37:37,170 --> 00:37:40,330
Speaker 8: have as a witness here, Missus Houdini.

477
00:37:41,890 --> 00:37:43,970
Speaker 1: Kudini turns to his wife, Bess.

478
00:37:45,290 --> 00:37:49,250
Speaker 3: Have I shown traces of being crazy unless it was

479
00:37:49,290 --> 00:37:49,730
Speaker 3: about you?

480
00:37:51,490 --> 00:37:56,570
Speaker 9: No am I brutal to you or vile? No am

481
00:37:56,650 --> 00:38:03,130
Speaker 9: I a good boy? Yes, thank you, Missus Houdini.

482
00:38:06,130 --> 00:38:09,330
Speaker 1: The Copeland Bloom Bill didn't make it into law, or

483
00:38:09,930 --> 00:38:14,170
Speaker 1: perhaps that didn't matter. Houdini had got a blizzard of

484
00:38:14,250 --> 00:38:17,490
Speaker 1: newspaper coverage out of the hearings. The people who read

485
00:38:17,490 --> 00:38:20,530
Speaker 1: those articles, like the people who came to his shows,

486
00:38:21,250 --> 00:38:25,210
Speaker 1: might thereby be made less foolish, less liable to be

487
00:38:25,330 --> 00:38:32,090
Speaker 1: parted from their money by claims of supernatural abilities. As

488
00:38:32,130 --> 00:38:36,410
Speaker 1: the hearings came to a close and Houdini prepared to leave,

489
00:38:37,330 --> 00:38:39,330
Speaker 1: Madame Marcia came up to him.

490
00:38:40,010 --> 00:38:43,330
Speaker 4: You're a smart man, mister Houdini, but perhaps I can

491
00:38:43,370 --> 00:38:45,250
Speaker 4: tell you something you don't know.

492
00:38:46,850 --> 00:38:51,210
Speaker 3: What's that, Madam Marcia.

493
00:38:49,730 --> 00:38:53,090
Speaker 4: When November comes around, you won't be here.

494
00:38:54,730 --> 00:38:57,010
Speaker 3: How's that you'll be dead?

495
00:38:59,570 --> 00:39:04,250
Speaker 1: Now? Both Houdini and Rose Mackenberg had had their imminent

496
00:39:04,410 --> 00:39:10,730
Speaker 1: demise foretold. Rose's work did not kill her. She went

497
00:39:10,810 --> 00:39:14,610
Speaker 1: on to spend three more decades as an investigator of

498
00:39:14,730 --> 00:39:20,530
Speaker 1: fraudulent mediums. Rose never married, but by the time she retired,

499
00:39:20,890 --> 00:39:24,210
Speaker 1: she reckoned she'd been confidently put in touch with about

500
00:39:24,250 --> 00:39:29,050
Speaker 1: fifteen hundred dead husbands, all of whom assured her that

501
00:39:29,130 --> 00:39:34,370
Speaker 1: they were blissfully happy. On the other side, fifteen hundred

502
00:39:34,570 --> 00:39:37,690
Speaker 1: dead husbands, not a single one of them said he

503
00:39:37,770 --> 00:39:41,650
Speaker 1: was lost without her. As Rose liked to.

504
00:39:41,690 --> 00:39:44,730
Speaker 4: Joke, that's not entirely flattering.

505
00:39:45,930 --> 00:39:51,970
Speaker 1: But Houdini, What was it that? Houdini had told the committee,

506
00:39:52,970 --> 00:39:58,170
Speaker 1: If an astrologer makes enough guesses, sometimes they'll guess something right.

507
00:39:59,170 --> 00:40:04,290
Speaker 1: Hoodini would indeed be dead by November at the age

508
00:40:04,290 --> 00:40:07,730
Speaker 1: of just fifty two, as we'll hear about next time

509
00:40:08,210 --> 00:40:12,010
Speaker 1: in the third final episode of our three part series.

510
00:40:17,850 --> 00:40:21,530
Speaker 1: Newspaper articles written by Rose Mackenberg are collated in a

511
00:40:21,570 --> 00:40:26,210
Speaker 1: book by Tony Wolfe called Houdini's Girl Detective. For a

512
00:40:26,250 --> 00:40:28,850
Speaker 1: full list of our sources, see the show notes at

513
00:40:28,930 --> 00:40:46,090
Speaker 1: Timharford dot com. Cautionary Tales as written by me Tim

514
00:40:46,170 --> 00:40:50,130
Speaker 1: Harford with Andrew Wright, Alice Fines and Ryan Billy. It's

515
00:40:50,210 --> 00:40:54,170
Speaker 1: produced by Georgia Mills and Marilyn Rust. The sound design

516
00:40:54,290 --> 00:40:58,050
Speaker 1: and original music are the work of Pascal Wise. Additional

517
00:40:58,090 --> 00:41:02,010
Speaker 1: sound design is by Carlos san Juan at Brain Audio.

518
00:41:02,330 --> 00:41:06,370
Speaker 1: Ben and Dapfhhaffrey edited the scripts. The show features the

519
00:41:06,450 --> 00:41:11,330
Speaker 1: voice talents of Melanie Guttridge, Stella Half, Oliver Hembrough, Sarah Jupp,

520
00:41:11,650 --> 00:41:16,290
Speaker 1: Massamn Roe, Jamal Westman and Rufus Wright. The show also

521
00:41:16,370 --> 00:41:19,290
Speaker 1: wouldn't have been possible without the work of Jacob Weisberg,

522
00:41:19,410 --> 00:41:24,210
Speaker 1: Greta Cohene, Sarah Nix, Eric Sandler, Carrie Brody, Christina Sullivan,

523
00:41:24,570 --> 00:41:29,130
Speaker 1: Kira Posey, and Owen Miller. Cautionary Tales is a production

524
00:41:29,290 --> 00:41:33,650
Speaker 1: of Pushkin Industries. It's recorded at Wardoor Studios in London

525
00:41:33,970 --> 00:41:37,530
Speaker 1: by Tom Berry. If you like the show, please remember

526
00:41:37,570 --> 00:41:40,410
Speaker 1: to share, rate and review. It really makes a difference

527
00:41:40,410 --> 00:41:41,970
Speaker 1: to us and if you want to hear the show,

528
00:41:42,210 --> 00:41:45,330
Speaker 1: add free sign up to Pushkin Plus on the show

529
00:41:45,370 --> 00:41:49,410
Speaker 1: page on Apple Podcasts or at Pushkin dot fm, slash

530
00:41:49,570 --> 00:41:51,730
Speaker 1: plus