1 00:00:00,880 --> 00:00:04,400 Speaker 1: You're listening to The Bloomberg Sound on podcast Catch us 2 00:00:04,400 --> 00:00:07,560 Speaker 1: Live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg dot com, the 3 00:00:07,680 --> 00:00:10,760 Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app and the Bloomberg Business App, or listening on 4 00:00:10,800 --> 00:00:12,800 Speaker 1: demand wherever you get your podcasts. 5 00:00:13,400 --> 00:00:16,800 Speaker 2: The Reality Check we begin with on the terminal, the headline, 6 00:00:16,880 --> 00:00:21,959 Speaker 2: last minute US shutdown deal unlikely as McCarthy lacks leverage. 7 00:00:22,000 --> 00:00:25,040 Speaker 2: And if you've been listening to this program at all lately, 8 00:00:25,720 --> 00:00:28,480 Speaker 2: none of this should come as a surprise. We're going 9 00:00:28,520 --> 00:00:30,720 Speaker 2: to bring you up to date on the most recent 10 00:00:30,880 --> 00:00:35,840 Speaker 2: wrinkles here. But Congressman Matt Gates is still a major 11 00:00:35,880 --> 00:00:39,040 Speaker 2: sticking point. ABC News caught up with him on the 12 00:00:39,080 --> 00:00:42,159 Speaker 2: idea of warming up to a stopgap, a continuing resolution 13 00:00:43,040 --> 00:00:47,440 Speaker 2: that is emerging, at least from the US Senate. They're 14 00:00:47,440 --> 00:00:49,680 Speaker 2: also talking about one in the House. Maybe we'll see 15 00:00:49,680 --> 00:00:53,239 Speaker 2: it today, but the gentleman from Florida is a no 16 00:00:53,360 --> 00:00:54,120 Speaker 2: go right now. 17 00:00:54,160 --> 00:00:56,240 Speaker 3: We're were going to get these individuals single subject spending 18 00:00:56,240 --> 00:00:56,920 Speaker 3: those pass. 19 00:00:56,760 --> 00:00:58,200 Speaker 4: That's my principal goal. 20 00:00:58,600 --> 00:01:00,520 Speaker 5: Are you still you're still firm now on this short 21 00:01:00,600 --> 00:01:01,319 Speaker 5: term spending bill? 22 00:01:01,440 --> 00:01:02,960 Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm not for a continuing resolution. 23 00:01:03,880 --> 00:01:08,200 Speaker 2: Not for a continuing resolution perplexing evermore. Mitch McConnell, of course, 24 00:01:08,240 --> 00:01:11,200 Speaker 2: the Republican leader in the Senate next door, has been 25 00:01:11,240 --> 00:01:14,840 Speaker 2: working on a continuing resolution and brought his case to 26 00:01:14,880 --> 00:01:15,279 Speaker 2: the floor. 27 00:01:15,400 --> 00:01:18,319 Speaker 6: So, mister President, of vote against a standard short term 28 00:01:18,400 --> 00:01:23,680 Speaker 6: funding measure is a vote against paying over a billion 29 00:01:23,760 --> 00:01:29,200 Speaker 6: dollars in salary for border patrol and ice agents working 30 00:01:29,200 --> 00:01:33,760 Speaker 6: to truck down lethal fentinyl and tame are open borders. 31 00:01:35,440 --> 00:01:39,679 Speaker 6: Letting femi's disaster relief on dry up is not a 32 00:01:39,720 --> 00:01:44,399 Speaker 6: productive way to advocate for victims of disasters. Letting small 33 00:01:44,440 --> 00:01:49,280 Speaker 6: businesses loan applications collect dust, it's not a productive way 34 00:01:49,320 --> 00:01:55,360 Speaker 6: to help working Americans contend with Washington Democrats historic inflation. 35 00:01:56,800 --> 00:01:59,640 Speaker 6: Shutting down the government isn't an effective way to make 36 00:01:59,680 --> 00:01:59,960 Speaker 6: a point. 37 00:02:01,400 --> 00:02:03,840 Speaker 2: Not an effective way to make a point. But of 38 00:02:03,880 --> 00:02:07,640 Speaker 2: course a few are making that point, and we get 39 00:02:07,640 --> 00:02:10,080 Speaker 2: to talk about it now with Dusty Johnson, the Congressman 40 00:02:10,200 --> 00:02:14,280 Speaker 2: from South Dakotas at large district, the Republican who is 41 00:02:14,320 --> 00:02:16,280 Speaker 2: in the throes of the debt ceiling debate, is back 42 00:02:16,320 --> 00:02:19,840 Speaker 2: with us now, in the throes of a potential shutdown. Here, Congressman, 43 00:02:20,280 --> 00:02:23,080 Speaker 2: welcome back. I've got some specific questions for you about 44 00:02:23,120 --> 00:02:26,720 Speaker 2: what you're hearing about what mechanism might be worth investing 45 00:02:26,720 --> 00:02:28,520 Speaker 2: in where your head is. But I just wonder if 46 00:02:28,560 --> 00:02:30,440 Speaker 2: you've kind of given up the ghost on this. The 47 00:02:30,480 --> 00:02:32,320 Speaker 2: government going to shut down this weekend. 48 00:02:33,200 --> 00:02:35,560 Speaker 7: Well, the government should not shut down. That would be 49 00:02:35,600 --> 00:02:39,120 Speaker 7: an exceptionally stupid thing for us to do. Listen, things 50 00:02:39,200 --> 00:02:41,360 Speaker 7: look a little bleak. I'm not going to try to 51 00:02:41,400 --> 00:02:45,240 Speaker 7: put to smiley a face on it, but I'm not 52 00:02:45,360 --> 00:02:49,160 Speaker 7: giving up. We still have time. Cooler heads need to prevail. 53 00:02:49,240 --> 00:02:50,160 Speaker 7: Let's get our work done. 54 00:02:51,400 --> 00:02:53,560 Speaker 2: Are we going to see a continuing resolution in the 55 00:02:53,600 --> 00:02:55,720 Speaker 2: House today or when. 56 00:02:56,520 --> 00:02:59,400 Speaker 7: I expect that tomorrow we will vote on a continuing resolution. 57 00:02:59,520 --> 00:03:02,280 Speaker 7: It is something that I authored along with five of 58 00:03:02,320 --> 00:03:07,200 Speaker 7: my colleagues, generally Conservatives, three members of the Freedom Caucus, 59 00:03:07,200 --> 00:03:10,880 Speaker 7: and three members including myself, of the Conservative Main Street Caucus. 60 00:03:11,480 --> 00:03:14,600 Speaker 7: It would be it would be a stop gap funding 61 00:03:14,639 --> 00:03:17,720 Speaker 7: measure for another thirty days. At the same time, though, 62 00:03:17,720 --> 00:03:21,240 Speaker 7: I would secure the border with policies that we know work. 63 00:03:23,120 --> 00:03:26,240 Speaker 2: Your role on the Republican Main Street Caucus as chair 64 00:03:26,360 --> 00:03:28,320 Speaker 2: is vital here. There are a lot of folks waiting 65 00:03:28,320 --> 00:03:31,800 Speaker 2: for the noise to die down. So the Center can 66 00:03:31,800 --> 00:03:36,200 Speaker 2: come to the rescue here. I wonder your view on 67 00:03:36,320 --> 00:03:39,040 Speaker 2: that and what your message is for those members holding 68 00:03:39,080 --> 00:03:41,600 Speaker 2: things up, like Matt Gates that we just heard from. 69 00:03:42,160 --> 00:03:45,480 Speaker 7: I do think Matt's involvement, particularly regarding a stop gap 70 00:03:45,520 --> 00:03:48,600 Speaker 7: funding measure is Listen, it's been really problematic. It's not 71 00:03:48,720 --> 00:03:52,240 Speaker 7: been helpful. No one, including Matt Gates, thinks that we're 72 00:03:52,280 --> 00:03:54,360 Speaker 7: going to get all of our work done in the 73 00:03:54,400 --> 00:03:57,240 Speaker 7: House and in the Senate by the day after tomorrow 74 00:03:57,640 --> 00:04:00,560 Speaker 7: and then magically, under that same timeline to meet with 75 00:04:00,560 --> 00:04:02,840 Speaker 7: the Senate who wants to spend in general, more money 76 00:04:03,120 --> 00:04:05,280 Speaker 7: and a House that, in general, including me, wants to 77 00:04:05,280 --> 00:04:08,200 Speaker 7: spend a lot less money. It's gonna take some time 78 00:04:08,240 --> 00:04:12,080 Speaker 7: to work that out. So the only question is whether 79 00:04:12,240 --> 00:04:15,720 Speaker 7: or not we will do that work while federal employees 80 00:04:15,800 --> 00:04:19,120 Speaker 7: continue to get paid and while federal taxpayers continue to 81 00:04:19,160 --> 00:04:22,360 Speaker 7: be able to access services at the IRS and Indian 82 00:04:22,440 --> 00:04:26,480 Speaker 7: Health and the Farm Service Agency and others, or whether 83 00:04:26,600 --> 00:04:30,600 Speaker 7: or not we will demand that those agencies shut down 84 00:04:30,760 --> 00:04:34,919 Speaker 7: while we continue our work. Listen, I think shutdowns are stupid. 85 00:04:37,200 --> 00:04:39,479 Speaker 2: Once it happens, we could be looking at a weekend, 86 00:04:39,480 --> 00:04:42,200 Speaker 2: a blip on the radar, some including Golden Sacks, are 87 00:04:42,240 --> 00:04:45,400 Speaker 2: saying two to three weeks. Congressman, I'm sure you don't 88 00:04:45,440 --> 00:04:47,000 Speaker 2: want to go there because you're holding out. 89 00:04:46,880 --> 00:04:47,720 Speaker 4: Hope for a solution. 90 00:04:47,839 --> 00:04:51,679 Speaker 2: But what should people be bracing for here? This looks 91 00:04:51,720 --> 00:04:53,960 Speaker 2: like a full shutdown, not a partial one, and it 92 00:04:53,960 --> 00:04:56,360 Speaker 2: could take some time if it actually happens to reopen. 93 00:04:57,000 --> 00:04:59,880 Speaker 7: Well, I'm glad you mentioned the partial versus full shutdown, 94 00:05:00,000 --> 00:05:02,760 Speaker 7: because I do think that really matters. The shutdown during 95 00:05:02,800 --> 00:05:05,920 Speaker 7: twenty eighteen and in twenty nineteen was a partial shutdown. 96 00:05:06,240 --> 00:05:10,000 Speaker 7: Sometimes sometimes people will say, as they're beating their chest, 97 00:05:10,080 --> 00:05:13,560 Speaker 7: shut it all down. Government doesn't really do anything anyway, 98 00:05:13,600 --> 00:05:15,839 Speaker 7: shut it all down. And I would just tell you 99 00:05:15,880 --> 00:05:18,520 Speaker 7: that if this thing goes on for two weeks, you're 100 00:05:18,560 --> 00:05:23,680 Speaker 7: going to have soldiers, sailors, airmen, marines who will have 101 00:05:23,839 --> 00:05:27,440 Speaker 7: worked during that time, and then we're going to refuse 102 00:05:27,480 --> 00:05:31,480 Speaker 7: to pay them. We will have TSA agents who will 103 00:05:31,480 --> 00:05:34,159 Speaker 7: be reporting to duty even though they're not getting paid. 104 00:05:34,640 --> 00:05:37,520 Speaker 7: We are going to have these frontline men and women 105 00:05:37,640 --> 00:05:41,080 Speaker 7: keeping us safe who will be absolutely let down by 106 00:05:41,120 --> 00:05:44,880 Speaker 7: their government. And anybody who wants to be cavalier about that, 107 00:05:45,360 --> 00:05:47,480 Speaker 7: anybody want who want to act like act like that 108 00:05:47,560 --> 00:05:51,600 Speaker 7: doesn't matter. The government doesn't add any value in anybody's life. 109 00:05:51,839 --> 00:05:55,680 Speaker 7: They're playing games. I have a constitutional duty to get 110 00:05:55,680 --> 00:05:58,960 Speaker 7: my work done. All of my colleagues do too. I 111 00:05:59,040 --> 00:06:02,000 Speaker 7: wish they took that utional duty as seriously as I 112 00:06:02,040 --> 00:06:02,680 Speaker 7: think they should. 113 00:06:03,839 --> 00:06:06,000 Speaker 2: That said, I'd like to talk to you about some 114 00:06:06,040 --> 00:06:10,000 Speaker 2: of the sticking points here, including funding for Ukraine. Interesting 115 00:06:10,000 --> 00:06:13,400 Speaker 2: to see members vote on an amendment to remove Ukraine 116 00:06:13,520 --> 00:06:18,600 Speaker 2: aid from the Defense spending bill yesterday. Most Republicans supported 117 00:06:18,720 --> 00:06:21,560 Speaker 2: leaving that in, and I wonder your thoughts on this, 118 00:06:21,640 --> 00:06:23,960 Speaker 2: and if the leadership is at odds with the rank 119 00:06:23,960 --> 00:06:27,440 Speaker 2: and file on helping to fund the war effort in Ukraine. 120 00:06:28,279 --> 00:06:30,719 Speaker 7: You're right insofar as a majority of Republicans and a 121 00:06:30,760 --> 00:06:34,479 Speaker 7: majority of Democrats continue to be supportive in both chambers 122 00:06:34,880 --> 00:06:38,920 Speaker 7: of helping Ukraine, making sure that not that American men 123 00:06:38,920 --> 00:06:42,520 Speaker 7: and women die on Ukrainian battlefields, but that the Ukrainians 124 00:06:42,520 --> 00:06:45,880 Speaker 7: have the ammunition and the supplies they need to hold 125 00:06:45,920 --> 00:06:50,000 Speaker 7: the line against this illegal invasion by Vladimir Putin. I 126 00:06:50,120 --> 00:06:51,800 Speaker 7: just to me, it's a little hard to imagine the 127 00:06:51,839 --> 00:06:57,320 Speaker 7: Party of Ronald Reagan no longer interested in pushing back 128 00:06:57,360 --> 00:07:03,760 Speaker 7: against communism and tyranny and dictatorships. Ukraine is trying to 129 00:07:03,760 --> 00:07:05,520 Speaker 7: hold the line. We should continue to help them. Now 130 00:07:05,560 --> 00:07:08,320 Speaker 7: that doesn't mean there should be blank checks. We do 131 00:07:08,400 --> 00:07:11,520 Speaker 7: need additional accountability, but a majority of the House and 132 00:07:11,560 --> 00:07:13,640 Speaker 7: the Senate are supportive of that. But this gets back 133 00:07:13,680 --> 00:07:17,239 Speaker 7: to all these red lines everybody's got. Nobody ever gets 134 00:07:17,280 --> 00:07:20,480 Speaker 7: everything they want in a negotiation. So when you have 135 00:07:20,640 --> 00:07:24,320 Speaker 7: people who say Republicans or Democrats need to hold out 136 00:07:24,360 --> 00:07:28,440 Speaker 7: until they get every single thing they demand, that is 137 00:07:28,480 --> 00:07:32,720 Speaker 7: a profoundly unseerious person. That's a person who has never 138 00:07:32,800 --> 00:07:38,120 Speaker 7: apparently actually had a successful marriage or business or been 139 00:07:38,160 --> 00:07:42,000 Speaker 7: on a nonprofit board. Nobody gets everything they want. Ever, 140 00:07:42,040 --> 00:07:44,960 Speaker 7: there's some give and take, and so maybe the Ukrainian 141 00:07:45,000 --> 00:07:48,520 Speaker 7: package might not look exactly like I would design it. 142 00:07:48,600 --> 00:07:52,080 Speaker 7: Maybe a stopgap funding measure might not look exactly like 143 00:07:52,160 --> 00:07:54,720 Speaker 7: I would design it. But we have got to stop 144 00:07:54,840 --> 00:07:56,720 Speaker 7: letting perfect be the enemy of the good. 145 00:07:58,240 --> 00:08:02,360 Speaker 2: Let's boy, you just set a lot there, Congressman. I 146 00:08:02,400 --> 00:08:05,720 Speaker 2: wonder from your perch at the helm of the Main 147 00:08:05,760 --> 00:08:09,640 Speaker 2: Street Republican Caucus what your thought is as you look 148 00:08:09,680 --> 00:08:14,200 Speaker 2: around and see a lot of people in your conference 149 00:08:14,240 --> 00:08:19,520 Speaker 2: who might be described as not serious. 150 00:08:19,880 --> 00:08:24,360 Speaker 7: I understand where they're coming from. One underreported fact is 151 00:08:24,400 --> 00:08:28,240 Speaker 7: the extent to which the Republican Conference is really and 152 00:08:28,280 --> 00:08:33,360 Speaker 7: truly unified on big picture questions of governance. We're thirty 153 00:08:33,360 --> 00:08:35,760 Speaker 7: three trillion dollars in debt, and we've been talking about 154 00:08:35,840 --> 00:08:38,200 Speaker 7: debt for so long that I think a lot of 155 00:08:38,280 --> 00:08:40,800 Speaker 7: us assume that it's only as bad today as it 156 00:08:40,840 --> 00:08:44,679 Speaker 7: ever was. It's much worse. We're reaching a tipping point. 157 00:08:44,760 --> 00:08:47,920 Speaker 7: That's why Fitch downgraded us. In the next ten years, 158 00:08:48,120 --> 00:08:50,800 Speaker 7: we won't spend three trillion dollars just on interest on 159 00:08:50,840 --> 00:08:53,160 Speaker 7: the debt as we did in the last decade. We'll 160 00:08:53,200 --> 00:08:57,000 Speaker 7: spend ten trillion. That is going to crowd out all 161 00:08:57,120 --> 00:08:59,720 Speaker 7: of the other virtuous spending. Now, the reason I mentioned 162 00:08:59,760 --> 00:09:03,480 Speaker 7: that is I understand why some of my colleagues believe 163 00:09:03,559 --> 00:09:06,400 Speaker 7: that this is a battle we're fighting for. It absolutely 164 00:09:06,480 --> 00:09:10,800 Speaker 7: positively is. We should not agree to appropriations measures that 165 00:09:10,920 --> 00:09:16,240 Speaker 7: continue business as usual. It is totally unacceptable. And yet 166 00:09:17,440 --> 00:09:20,160 Speaker 7: you've got to be able to fight and win with 167 00:09:20,280 --> 00:09:23,679 Speaker 7: smart strategy and with a tactical plan that moves us 168 00:09:23,679 --> 00:09:26,320 Speaker 7: in the right direction. The people who are screaming that 169 00:09:26,320 --> 00:09:29,559 Speaker 7: we should shut the whole thing down. Do not have 170 00:09:29,600 --> 00:09:30,640 Speaker 7: a plan for victory. 171 00:09:33,800 --> 00:09:36,040 Speaker 2: You were one of the folks who helped to craft 172 00:09:36,040 --> 00:09:39,120 Speaker 2: the debt ceiling deal, a deal that was made to 173 00:09:39,240 --> 00:09:42,760 Speaker 2: avoid all of the drama that we're experiencing right now. 174 00:09:43,960 --> 00:09:47,040 Speaker 2: How do you trust Speaker McCarthy to shake hands on 175 00:09:47,120 --> 00:09:51,240 Speaker 2: the next deal as we relitigate the last one. 176 00:09:51,520 --> 00:09:54,000 Speaker 7: I don't think it's a re litigation. The debt ceiling 177 00:09:54,000 --> 00:09:58,120 Speaker 7: deal was really about our country avoiding default and setting 178 00:09:58,160 --> 00:10:01,800 Speaker 7: some top line numbers for spending. It didn't go into specifics. 179 00:10:01,840 --> 00:10:03,640 Speaker 7: It didn't say how much was going to be in 180 00:10:03,679 --> 00:10:07,440 Speaker 7: that appropriation's bill versus this appropriation's bill. It didn't say 181 00:10:07,440 --> 00:10:09,320 Speaker 7: how much money was going to go for order security 182 00:10:09,400 --> 00:10:10,160 Speaker 7: or for Ukraine. 183 00:10:10,400 --> 00:10:12,320 Speaker 2: But even those top line numbers didn't hold. 184 00:10:13,520 --> 00:10:15,680 Speaker 7: No, that's true. The Senate wants to go above the 185 00:10:15,720 --> 00:10:18,640 Speaker 7: top lines, and the House wants to go below. And 186 00:10:19,120 --> 00:10:22,680 Speaker 7: I think I think Kevin McCarthy understands that at some 187 00:10:22,840 --> 00:10:24,920 Speaker 7: point when we get into conference, when the House and 188 00:10:24,920 --> 00:10:28,240 Speaker 7: the Senate come together, we're going to spend, unfortunately more 189 00:10:28,280 --> 00:10:31,000 Speaker 7: money than the House wants, and we will probably spend 190 00:10:31,040 --> 00:10:33,679 Speaker 7: a little less money than the Senate wants. I still 191 00:10:33,720 --> 00:10:36,760 Speaker 7: think that debt ceiling deal was really important though, because 192 00:10:36,760 --> 00:10:39,559 Speaker 7: it gave us those top line numbers that were centering 193 00:10:39,600 --> 00:10:43,560 Speaker 7: around and those top line numbers are a two trillion 194 00:10:43,600 --> 00:10:47,440 Speaker 7: dollar spending cut in the next five years. That is 195 00:10:47,600 --> 00:10:50,440 Speaker 7: a larger victory than Conservatives have ever been able to 196 00:10:50,440 --> 00:10:54,200 Speaker 7: deliver in any other spending package in modern history. And 197 00:10:54,280 --> 00:10:56,560 Speaker 7: I think that's a pretty big win, on top of 198 00:10:56,600 --> 00:11:00,920 Speaker 7: the welfare reform wins and the energy site that we got. 199 00:11:02,240 --> 00:11:05,280 Speaker 2: Well, you helped us avoid a default, Congressman, and that's 200 00:11:05,280 --> 00:11:07,640 Speaker 2: a big deal. I know you're out of time here. 201 00:11:08,880 --> 00:11:12,480 Speaker 2: Will we avoid a downgrade from Moody's after getting that warning? 202 00:11:13,679 --> 00:11:16,559 Speaker 7: Well, of the three Standard and Poors, Moodies and Fitch, 203 00:11:16,600 --> 00:11:19,520 Speaker 7: two of the three have already downgraded us one years ago, 204 00:11:20,120 --> 00:11:25,240 Speaker 7: months ago. And we have got to get our act together. 205 00:11:26,200 --> 00:11:29,400 Speaker 7: We have an opportunity in the next four days to 206 00:11:29,480 --> 00:11:34,120 Speaker 7: show the world that American debt instruments are indeed zero risk. 207 00:11:34,720 --> 00:11:38,040 Speaker 7: That it may be messy, it may be noisy, but 208 00:11:38,120 --> 00:11:41,040 Speaker 7: in the end of the day, America will have its 209 00:11:41,080 --> 00:11:44,880 Speaker 7: financial house and order. We fail to do that, there 210 00:11:44,920 --> 00:11:46,960 Speaker 7: will be negative repercussions. 211 00:11:48,840 --> 00:11:50,960 Speaker 2: I appreciate your coming back to talk to US Congressman. 212 00:11:51,000 --> 00:11:54,720 Speaker 2: I appreciate your candor, Dusty Johnson, Republican from South Dakota, 213 00:11:54,840 --> 00:11:56,719 Speaker 2: chairs the Republican Main Street Caucus. 214 00:11:57,080 --> 00:11:58,480 Speaker 4: Good luck in the fight here. 215 00:11:58,559 --> 00:12:00,200 Speaker 2: We'll be following, of course, all of this as we 216 00:12:00,240 --> 00:12:03,280 Speaker 2: assimilar panel Now for their take. Jeanie Shanzano is with 217 00:12:03,400 --> 00:12:06,199 Speaker 2: this Democratic analyst, of course, a member of the family 218 00:12:06,240 --> 00:12:10,000 Speaker 2: Bloomberg Politics contributor, joined today by Chapin Fay, the Republican strategist, 219 00:12:10,040 --> 00:12:13,199 Speaker 2: is back with his former Press secretary for Governor George Pataki. 220 00:12:13,480 --> 00:12:15,120 Speaker 4: Great to have you both with us here. 221 00:12:15,640 --> 00:12:19,160 Speaker 2: Chapin, what do you think from what we just heard 222 00:12:19,200 --> 00:12:23,160 Speaker 2: from the chair of the Main Street Caucus trying to 223 00:12:23,280 --> 00:12:27,760 Speaker 2: salvage a continuing resolution here at odds with members of 224 00:12:27,800 --> 00:12:31,160 Speaker 2: his own Republican conference girding for a shutdown. Will the 225 00:12:31,240 --> 00:12:34,559 Speaker 2: Dusty Johnson's of the House be the ones to save this? 226 00:12:36,960 --> 00:12:40,240 Speaker 3: You know, he certainly sounded like he had some clear thoughts, 227 00:12:40,280 --> 00:12:42,800 Speaker 3: But I'm not sure we have a clear answer on 228 00:12:42,880 --> 00:12:46,079 Speaker 3: whether the Dusty Johnson's or the others will will will 229 00:12:46,120 --> 00:12:46,880 Speaker 3: loan out here. 230 00:12:47,679 --> 00:12:48,800 Speaker 8: We do have sort of an. 231 00:12:48,760 --> 00:12:52,960 Speaker 3: Unruly Republican caucus these days, but the reason for that, 232 00:12:53,000 --> 00:12:55,880 Speaker 3: and I've said this before. Is a lot of you know, 233 00:12:55,880 --> 00:12:58,000 Speaker 3: his colleagues further to the right of him, feel like 234 00:12:58,040 --> 00:13:00,480 Speaker 3: they were sent to Congress to you know, rain and 235 00:13:00,520 --> 00:13:03,960 Speaker 3: spending and try and control some of the out of 236 00:13:03,960 --> 00:13:08,360 Speaker 3: control Biden administration agencies and actions by you know, through 237 00:13:08,360 --> 00:13:10,480 Speaker 3: the House, which of course their power is the power 238 00:13:10,520 --> 00:13:12,840 Speaker 3: of the purse. So it's going to be very hard 239 00:13:12,880 --> 00:13:15,520 Speaker 3: to placate them when we're talking about you know, billions 240 00:13:15,600 --> 00:13:16,640 Speaker 3: upon billions of dollars. 241 00:13:16,679 --> 00:13:19,120 Speaker 8: You know, I was struck by the way he described. 242 00:13:18,760 --> 00:13:21,800 Speaker 3: Making sure that Ukrainian soldiers had all the resources they 243 00:13:21,840 --> 00:13:25,480 Speaker 3: need to stave off of the invasion. I mean, municipalities 244 00:13:25,480 --> 00:13:27,319 Speaker 3: in the United States don't have the resources they need 245 00:13:27,360 --> 00:13:30,600 Speaker 3: to to stave off you know, the incoming migrants into 246 00:13:30,640 --> 00:13:34,160 Speaker 3: the into their areas. You know, social services under strain, 247 00:13:34,640 --> 00:13:37,600 Speaker 3: you know. So you know, I think the priorities are 248 00:13:37,640 --> 00:13:39,760 Speaker 3: a little out of whack, and I think the the 249 00:13:39,800 --> 00:13:42,240 Speaker 3: more right word leading members of Congress, you know, those 250 00:13:42,240 --> 00:13:43,680 Speaker 3: are the kinds of things they're thinking about. 251 00:13:44,760 --> 00:13:47,280 Speaker 2: Well, we're going to have more time for this, genie. 252 00:13:47,280 --> 00:13:51,000 Speaker 2: We've got less than a minute. Dusty Johnson says shutdowns 253 00:13:51,040 --> 00:13:51,720 Speaker 2: are stupid. 254 00:13:52,080 --> 00:13:52,840 Speaker 4: Are we going to have one? 255 00:13:52,880 --> 00:13:56,440 Speaker 9: Anyway, we are going to have one anyway. He is 256 00:13:56,520 --> 00:13:59,560 Speaker 9: absolutely right. They are stupid, and he is absolutely right 257 00:13:59,600 --> 00:14:02,600 Speaker 9: the announ pologies he gave about marriages and business. You 258 00:14:02,679 --> 00:14:04,800 Speaker 9: don't get everything you want. You won't get it in 259 00:14:04,880 --> 00:14:08,880 Speaker 9: this It's about negotiation and everybody should listen to that. 260 00:14:08,920 --> 00:14:14,040 Speaker 9: And I folk conservative Republicans and the Caucus do. 261 00:14:12,760 --> 00:14:13,440 Speaker 4: Isn't that something? 262 00:14:13,520 --> 00:14:15,559 Speaker 2: Is this why people want their candidates to be married? 263 00:14:15,600 --> 00:14:17,640 Speaker 2: I never thought about it that way before, But there's 264 00:14:17,679 --> 00:14:20,400 Speaker 2: a lesson in there. Genie, Shanzy, no Chape and Fay. 265 00:14:20,480 --> 00:14:22,920 Speaker 2: We've got a lot to cover with our panel on 266 00:14:23,000 --> 00:14:24,480 Speaker 2: the fastest show in politics. 267 00:14:25,120 --> 00:14:26,720 Speaker 4: Much more. Next, this is Bloomberg. 268 00:14:30,720 --> 00:14:34,080 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch the 269 00:14:34,120 --> 00:14:38,000 Speaker 1: program live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg Radio, the 270 00:14:38,040 --> 00:14:41,400 Speaker 1: tune in app, Bloomberg dot Com, and the Bloomberg Business App. 271 00:14:41,520 --> 00:14:44,360 Speaker 1: You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our 272 00:14:44,400 --> 00:14:48,880 Speaker 1: flagship New York station. Just say Alexa play Bloomberg eleven thirty. 273 00:14:50,120 --> 00:14:52,480 Speaker 2: I want to invite you to join us for an 274 00:14:52,480 --> 00:14:55,720 Speaker 2: important conversation a bit later on in the broadcast. A 275 00:14:55,800 --> 00:15:01,200 Speaker 2: global simulcast of our conversation with former Vice President Mike Pence, 276 00:15:01,240 --> 00:15:04,640 Speaker 2: of course, just hours off of the big debate in 277 00:15:04,800 --> 00:15:07,640 Speaker 2: see Me Valley. Pence is going to be here roughly 278 00:15:07,680 --> 00:15:11,000 Speaker 2: an hour from now. Anne Marie Hordurn will join and 279 00:15:11,040 --> 00:15:13,920 Speaker 2: we'll bring that to you live here on Bloomberg. Of course, 280 00:15:13,960 --> 00:15:17,240 Speaker 2: conversations that you won't hear anywhere else, not the way 281 00:15:17,280 --> 00:15:20,600 Speaker 2: we do them. As we reassemble our panel, Genie Schanzy, 282 00:15:20,640 --> 00:15:23,720 Speaker 2: no Bloomberg Politics contributor, Democratic analyst, is here along with 283 00:15:23,800 --> 00:15:28,200 Speaker 2: Chapin Fay, Republican strategist, former press secretary for Governor George Pateke. 284 00:15:28,680 --> 00:15:32,520 Speaker 2: Remembering the night it was, I'm not even sure how 285 00:15:32,560 --> 00:15:37,360 Speaker 2: to describe it. But before we indulge our panel here, 286 00:15:37,800 --> 00:15:39,680 Speaker 2: did you actually watch this thing? I don't know what 287 00:15:39,720 --> 00:15:43,080 Speaker 2: the ratings are going to look like. Course, Donald Trump 288 00:15:43,160 --> 00:15:46,400 Speaker 2: was counterprogramming. It was on Fox Business out at the 289 00:15:46,400 --> 00:15:51,320 Speaker 2: Reagan Library. See Me Valley seven on the stage again 290 00:15:51,440 --> 00:15:55,400 Speaker 2: Donald Trump not one of them. And things went off 291 00:15:55,440 --> 00:15:58,720 Speaker 2: the rails pretty quickly here. I mean, you talk about interrupting, 292 00:15:58,760 --> 00:16:00,800 Speaker 2: I'll just drop a needle on this. 293 00:16:00,960 --> 00:16:03,960 Speaker 4: The fact Ramaswami. 294 00:16:05,200 --> 00:16:12,800 Speaker 2: Talking with Ron DeSantis, Uh, Tim Scott, and it got 295 00:16:12,800 --> 00:16:15,680 Speaker 2: pretty wacky here. Let me just find this for you 296 00:16:15,680 --> 00:16:17,920 Speaker 2: give you a little taste like these are good people 297 00:16:18,400 --> 00:16:20,840 Speaker 2: who are tainted by a broken system, and it's not 298 00:16:20,920 --> 00:16:26,280 Speaker 2: the fault of anybody who's a thank you for speaking. 299 00:16:26,320 --> 00:16:33,720 Speaker 2: While I'm interrupting, gentlemen. 300 00:16:33,400 --> 00:16:41,280 Speaker 4: You'll have your turn one. We haven't focused. Everybody knows that. 301 00:16:41,360 --> 00:16:48,040 Speaker 2: If I may address on holding Joe by accountable, Okay, 302 00:16:48,240 --> 00:16:50,080 Speaker 2: I could keep going, but I'd like to hear from 303 00:16:50,160 --> 00:16:56,080 Speaker 2: Genie and chapin, uh, Chape and Fay to what extent 304 00:16:56,280 --> 00:16:59,960 Speaker 2: was this conversation last night, this exercise in the spirit 305 00:17:00,160 --> 00:17:02,360 Speaker 2: of Ronald Reagan. It was at the Reagan Library. His 306 00:17:02,480 --> 00:17:05,280 Speaker 2: name was invoked repeatedly. Was this a good look for 307 00:17:05,320 --> 00:17:06,280 Speaker 2: the Republican Party? 308 00:17:06,320 --> 00:17:07,600 Speaker 4: Never mind who won or lost. 309 00:17:09,200 --> 00:17:11,359 Speaker 8: I don't think so. I think Ronald Reagan's turning over 310 00:17:11,480 --> 00:17:11,879 Speaker 8: his grave. 311 00:17:11,920 --> 00:17:15,760 Speaker 3: We are a long ways away, generations from when Ronald 312 00:17:15,800 --> 00:17:17,320 Speaker 3: Reagan was running. 313 00:17:17,720 --> 00:17:18,880 Speaker 8: And was president. 314 00:17:19,920 --> 00:17:21,639 Speaker 3: You know the clip you played, but some of the 315 00:17:21,640 --> 00:17:24,359 Speaker 3: gloves are off, so to a certain extent, it was 316 00:17:24,400 --> 00:17:28,080 Speaker 3: probably always going to devolve at some point. But you know, 317 00:17:28,200 --> 00:17:31,080 Speaker 3: like you sort of alluded to, you know, the big winner. 318 00:17:30,920 --> 00:17:32,960 Speaker 8: Is always Donald Trump. I mean, you know, you have 319 00:17:33,160 --> 00:17:33,720 Speaker 8: a bunch of. 320 00:17:33,680 --> 00:17:39,760 Speaker 3: People failing to separate themselves from the crowd, and even worse. 321 00:17:39,600 --> 00:17:42,360 Speaker 8: Just all talking at the same time, right, So. 322 00:17:42,600 --> 00:17:44,880 Speaker 3: You know, meanwhile, Donald Trump is laughing all the way 323 00:17:44,920 --> 00:17:47,080 Speaker 3: to you know, having better pull numbers than all of 324 00:17:47,119 --> 00:17:49,880 Speaker 3: them combined. So you know, I don't know if any 325 00:17:49,880 --> 00:17:51,600 Speaker 3: of them moved the needle forward, and I think some 326 00:17:51,640 --> 00:17:53,320 Speaker 3: of them probably moved the needle backwards. 327 00:17:54,040 --> 00:17:57,560 Speaker 2: I'll ask you about Donald Trump's visit to Detroit. In 328 00:17:57,640 --> 00:18:00,000 Speaker 2: a moment, Jeanie, Chris Christy really tried to go out 329 00:18:00,000 --> 00:18:02,240 Speaker 2: after Trump as we all expected, to call him out 330 00:18:02,240 --> 00:18:03,040 Speaker 2: for not being there. 331 00:18:03,520 --> 00:18:04,280 Speaker 4: Here's what he said. 332 00:18:04,400 --> 00:18:07,800 Speaker 5: You're not here tonight because you're afraid of being on 333 00:18:07,840 --> 00:18:11,119 Speaker 5: the stage and defending your record. You're ducking these things. 334 00:18:11,240 --> 00:18:12,840 Speaker 5: And let me tell you what's going to happen you 335 00:18:12,920 --> 00:18:14,879 Speaker 5: keep doing that. No one appears going to call you 336 00:18:14,960 --> 00:18:17,000 Speaker 5: Donald Trump anymore. We're going to call you Donald Duck. 337 00:18:18,080 --> 00:18:18,960 Speaker 2: Donald Duck. 338 00:18:19,480 --> 00:18:22,119 Speaker 4: So we got a nickname, Genie. Is it gonna stick? 339 00:18:24,040 --> 00:18:24,240 Speaker 8: No? 340 00:18:25,160 --> 00:18:28,439 Speaker 9: It was one of the very bad one liners, and 341 00:18:28,480 --> 00:18:31,800 Speaker 9: we heard a few of them last night. From Chris Christy. 342 00:18:32,160 --> 00:18:37,240 Speaker 9: What started out as a potentially strong statement just fell flat. 343 00:18:37,359 --> 00:18:41,640 Speaker 9: Nobody in the audience responded. Mike Pence obviously had a 344 00:18:41,800 --> 00:18:45,080 Speaker 9: very strange comment that you know, Dame, you know you 345 00:18:45,200 --> 00:18:48,399 Speaker 9: heard they sort of tried the moderators to chuckle a 346 00:18:48,400 --> 00:18:50,719 Speaker 9: little bit after that one, but it was so bizarre 347 00:18:50,800 --> 00:18:54,160 Speaker 9: and nobody really responded, and that really epitomized the night 348 00:18:54,240 --> 00:18:58,600 Speaker 9: last night. It was not substantive and it wasn't entertaining. 349 00:18:58,920 --> 00:19:01,399 Speaker 9: I mean, you know, it was like, not only to 350 00:19:01,480 --> 00:19:04,480 Speaker 9: Nicki Haley's point, did you feel dumber, but you just 351 00:19:04,600 --> 00:19:08,560 Speaker 9: wanted to turn off the TV because it wasn't even entertaining. 352 00:19:08,680 --> 00:19:13,480 Speaker 9: So bad, bad night for Republicans. The winners clearly Donald 353 00:19:13,480 --> 00:19:16,960 Speaker 9: Trump and also by extension, Joe Biden, who fear is 354 00:19:17,040 --> 00:19:19,720 Speaker 9: running against anybody but Donald Trump, so God bless the 355 00:19:19,720 --> 00:19:22,080 Speaker 9: two of them. The American public has to be very 356 00:19:22,119 --> 00:19:23,160 Speaker 9: unhappy at this point. 357 00:19:24,240 --> 00:19:27,159 Speaker 2: Well Ginny refers to a moment that Nicki Haley was 358 00:19:27,200 --> 00:19:31,080 Speaker 2: clearly preparing for as she faced off with the aforementioned 359 00:19:31,160 --> 00:19:32,280 Speaker 2: vive Cramaswami. 360 00:19:32,400 --> 00:19:35,399 Speaker 10: This is infuriating because TikTok is one of the most 361 00:19:35,520 --> 00:19:38,840 Speaker 10: dangerous social media acces that we could have, and what 362 00:19:39,040 --> 00:19:41,280 Speaker 10: you've got. Honestly, every time I hear you, I feel 363 00:19:41,320 --> 00:19:42,639 Speaker 10: a little bit dumber for what. 364 00:19:42,520 --> 00:19:46,720 Speaker 2: You say, okay. But you know, then there was the 365 00:19:46,920 --> 00:19:50,639 Speaker 2: approach from the network and the moderator's chapin when we 366 00:19:50,720 --> 00:19:54,320 Speaker 2: got to this point, when Dana Perino decided to turn 367 00:19:54,320 --> 00:19:56,439 Speaker 2: this into a reality TV show. I mean, I don't know, 368 00:19:56,480 --> 00:19:58,960 Speaker 2: maybe everybody deserved that, maybe that's actually what it was, 369 00:19:59,040 --> 00:20:01,760 Speaker 2: but this seemed like, well, just a different level. 370 00:20:01,600 --> 00:20:03,760 Speaker 4: Than you might expect in a presidential debate. 371 00:20:03,760 --> 00:20:06,600 Speaker 11: Here we go, which one of you on stage tonight 372 00:20:07,080 --> 00:20:13,000 Speaker 11: should be voted off the island? Please use your marker 373 00:20:13,080 --> 00:20:14,880 Speaker 11: to write your choice on the no pad in front 374 00:20:14,880 --> 00:20:18,159 Speaker 11: of you fifteen seconds starting out of the people on 375 00:20:18,200 --> 00:20:21,480 Speaker 11: the stage, you should be I'm absolutely serious, all. 376 00:20:21,359 --> 00:20:23,320 Speaker 5: Due respect, I mean we're here like, well, you know, 377 00:20:23,320 --> 00:20:24,160 Speaker 5: we're happy to debate. 378 00:20:24,720 --> 00:20:30,359 Speaker 4: I think that that's disrespectful to my fellow competitive questions. 379 00:20:30,200 --> 00:20:31,760 Speaker 7: It's talk about the future. 380 00:20:31,440 --> 00:20:34,560 Speaker 2: Of the pet Okay, yeah, so kind of like the 381 00:20:34,640 --> 00:20:37,240 Speaker 2: Show of Hands, I guess last time. But I mean, Chapin, 382 00:20:37,280 --> 00:20:37,960 Speaker 2: are you kidding me? 383 00:20:38,000 --> 00:20:38,280 Speaker 4: I don't. 384 00:20:38,320 --> 00:20:42,880 Speaker 2: I don't try to criticize other media organizations, but if 385 00:20:42,880 --> 00:20:45,320 Speaker 2: we've cheapened this to the point of being an episode 386 00:20:45,320 --> 00:20:46,879 Speaker 2: of Survivor, I mean, what's the point. 387 00:20:48,640 --> 00:20:51,679 Speaker 3: Well, to be fair to uh, to data and the 388 00:20:51,720 --> 00:20:54,040 Speaker 3: moderators and the organizers. I mean, I think the people 389 00:20:54,080 --> 00:20:56,639 Speaker 3: on the stage, you know, brought it to that point. 390 00:20:56,720 --> 00:20:58,879 Speaker 3: I mean I wasn't shocked at all to hear her 391 00:20:58,960 --> 00:21:01,840 Speaker 3: say something like that. I mean, they're all out there, 392 00:21:02,240 --> 00:21:05,359 Speaker 3: and they're all out there trying to out Donald Trump. 393 00:21:05,560 --> 00:21:07,720 Speaker 3: And you know, I want to revisit that about the 394 00:21:07,760 --> 00:21:10,400 Speaker 3: Donald Trump comment. I think Genie's is one hundred percent 395 00:21:10,480 --> 00:21:13,040 Speaker 3: right about it being a bad one liner among many 396 00:21:13,040 --> 00:21:15,600 Speaker 3: one liners. But this is what always happens when people 397 00:21:15,680 --> 00:21:17,199 Speaker 3: try and fight Donald Trump. 398 00:21:17,200 --> 00:21:20,280 Speaker 8: They try and be Donald Trump to fight him. It 399 00:21:20,359 --> 00:21:22,560 Speaker 8: has never worked in history. He has an innate. 400 00:21:22,359 --> 00:21:25,399 Speaker 3: Ability to be himself and be successful at you know, 401 00:21:25,480 --> 00:21:28,920 Speaker 3: campaigns and elections and reality TV and everything. 402 00:21:28,960 --> 00:21:32,120 Speaker 8: When candidates try and mimic him or try and use 403 00:21:32,160 --> 00:21:34,399 Speaker 8: his own tactics against him, it always fails. Just like 404 00:21:34,440 --> 00:21:36,800 Speaker 8: Donald Duck. That true, right, And that's what you're seeing 405 00:21:36,840 --> 00:21:37,960 Speaker 8: on stage. I think. 406 00:21:39,480 --> 00:21:42,520 Speaker 4: Donald Duck. Well, Donald Trump. 407 00:21:42,280 --> 00:21:45,040 Speaker 2: Was in Michigan, of course, this is what he did 408 00:21:45,040 --> 00:21:47,040 Speaker 2: instead of attending the debate, went to Michigan to speak 409 00:21:47,040 --> 00:21:49,159 Speaker 2: to UA Double D members in the throes of an 410 00:21:49,200 --> 00:21:53,639 Speaker 2: historic auto strike at a non union shop and he 411 00:21:53,720 --> 00:21:56,720 Speaker 2: told them. Essentially, he kind of knows more than they 412 00:21:56,720 --> 00:21:57,400 Speaker 2: do about this. 413 00:21:57,840 --> 00:22:03,440 Speaker 12: Massive percentages of your industry went to other countries like Mexico, 414 00:22:03,640 --> 00:22:07,879 Speaker 12: like China, like South Korea, like Japan. In other words, 415 00:22:07,920 --> 00:22:11,200 Speaker 12: your current negotiations don't mean as much as you think. 416 00:22:11,320 --> 00:22:13,160 Speaker 12: I mean, I'll watch you out there with the pickets, 417 00:22:13,160 --> 00:22:16,160 Speaker 12: but I don't think you're picketing for the right thing. 418 00:22:17,840 --> 00:22:20,680 Speaker 2: You're picketing the wrong thing. Your protest isn't worth what 419 00:22:20,840 --> 00:22:22,440 Speaker 2: you think it is, Genie. Is that how you get 420 00:22:22,440 --> 00:22:24,000 Speaker 2: an endorsement from the UAW. 421 00:22:25,480 --> 00:22:29,280 Speaker 9: Yeah, it was another part of the very bizarre night 422 00:22:29,440 --> 00:22:31,880 Speaker 9: which the debate was half of. And then these statements. 423 00:22:31,920 --> 00:22:35,359 Speaker 9: I mean, essentially, what Donald Trump told these at this 424 00:22:35,520 --> 00:22:39,280 Speaker 9: non union shop, as you mentioned these workers, was forget 425 00:22:39,280 --> 00:22:42,199 Speaker 9: the picketing, not worth, the protests, not work the strike. 426 00:22:42,520 --> 00:22:44,560 Speaker 9: All you have to do is vote for me and 427 00:22:44,640 --> 00:22:48,320 Speaker 9: convince your leadership to endorse me, and all will be great. 428 00:22:48,520 --> 00:22:52,040 Speaker 9: You know, that's his argument, and it is head scratching, 429 00:22:52,080 --> 00:22:55,119 Speaker 9: it is mind numbing. I mean, one big question to 430 00:22:55,160 --> 00:22:59,080 Speaker 9: ask Donald Trump, among many, is what about the ed 431 00:22:59,359 --> 00:23:03,120 Speaker 9: plants unionizing? Why is that such a bad idea? 432 00:23:03,280 --> 00:23:03,520 Speaker 8: Right? 433 00:23:03,680 --> 00:23:06,840 Speaker 9: Why do we have to stop producing ed cars. Why 434 00:23:06,880 --> 00:23:09,800 Speaker 9: can't we unionize those plants. I mean, there's so many 435 00:23:09,920 --> 00:23:13,439 Speaker 9: substance questions to be asked. But of course all he 436 00:23:13,480 --> 00:23:16,639 Speaker 9: wanted to do was attack Joe Biden, because for Biden 437 00:23:16,680 --> 00:23:18,919 Speaker 9: and Trump, we are now in a general He was, 438 00:23:19,080 --> 00:23:21,560 Speaker 9: you know, just dismissed the debate as people trying to 439 00:23:21,640 --> 00:23:24,080 Speaker 9: run for secretary. And I can't say he's wrong about that, 440 00:23:24,400 --> 00:23:26,000 Speaker 9: and said, you know, look at vote for me and 441 00:23:26,600 --> 00:23:28,600 Speaker 9: all will be good. Forget this picck a line, go 442 00:23:28,680 --> 00:23:30,600 Speaker 9: home and wait until I'm in the White House, and 443 00:23:30,880 --> 00:23:32,600 Speaker 9: I will restore whatever you need. 444 00:23:32,640 --> 00:23:33,200 Speaker 7: In terms of. 445 00:23:33,160 --> 00:23:37,760 Speaker 2: Money, We're going to talk a lot more about the 446 00:23:37,880 --> 00:23:40,920 Speaker 2: UA double d because we have news. If you haven't 447 00:23:40,920 --> 00:23:44,280 Speaker 2: heard about this, it's important actually, and we have a 448 00:23:44,359 --> 00:23:48,040 Speaker 2: headline on the terminal that the UA doub is targeting 449 00:23:48,240 --> 00:23:53,840 Speaker 2: thirty percent wage increases, a thirty percent pay raise by 450 00:23:53,880 --> 00:23:56,840 Speaker 2: the time this negotiation is done, remembering they came down 451 00:23:56,920 --> 00:24:00,680 Speaker 2: to thirty six percent most recently, and the Big three 452 00:24:00,720 --> 00:24:03,360 Speaker 2: are still bulking. But we're gonna get into this now 453 00:24:03,400 --> 00:24:07,399 Speaker 2: that Donald Trump and Joe Biden have visited UA doubled 454 00:24:07,480 --> 00:24:10,119 Speaker 2: members in two very different events. We'll get into this 455 00:24:10,520 --> 00:24:13,320 Speaker 2: coming up next with our panel, Genie and Chape and Faith. 456 00:24:18,280 --> 00:24:21,760 Speaker 1: You're listening to the Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch us 457 00:24:21,800 --> 00:24:24,960 Speaker 1: live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg dot com, the 458 00:24:25,040 --> 00:24:28,159 Speaker 1: iHeartRadio app, and the Bloomberg Business App, or listen on 459 00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:30,200 Speaker 1: demand wherever you get your podcasts. 460 00:24:30,600 --> 00:24:35,520 Speaker 2: A day after Donald Trump visits Michigan to court unionized 461 00:24:35,560 --> 00:24:39,280 Speaker 2: auto workers at non union shop, and two days after 462 00:24:39,320 --> 00:24:43,720 Speaker 2: President Biden actually joins the picket line megaphone in hand 463 00:24:43,800 --> 00:24:47,440 Speaker 2: making history. All the while, we do have news from 464 00:24:47,440 --> 00:24:50,600 Speaker 2: the uaw This is according to people familiar with the matter. 465 00:24:50,640 --> 00:24:53,399 Speaker 2: This is why, of course you listen to watch and 466 00:24:53,480 --> 00:24:57,080 Speaker 2: read Bloomberg. The UAUW wants to emerge from its strike 467 00:24:57,200 --> 00:25:01,520 Speaker 2: against the Big three with at least a thirty percent 468 00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:03,960 Speaker 2: pay raise. This is what is on the back of 469 00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:09,280 Speaker 2: the napkin in Sean Fain's office here. Of course, you 470 00:25:09,320 --> 00:25:12,360 Speaker 2: know they came in above forty percent, they've come down 471 00:25:12,440 --> 00:25:15,160 Speaker 2: to thirty six. And we're getting maybe a sense here 472 00:25:15,400 --> 00:25:18,520 Speaker 2: of where this negotiation might end, whether the automakers feel 473 00:25:18,960 --> 00:25:21,960 Speaker 2: on this about this the same way stocks in all 474 00:25:22,040 --> 00:25:26,960 Speaker 2: three are rising today. For what it's worth, Let's reassemble 475 00:25:27,000 --> 00:25:29,520 Speaker 2: the panel to get into this for a bit. Jeanie Shanzo, 476 00:25:29,560 --> 00:25:33,320 Speaker 2: Democratic analyst and Bloomberg Politics contributors here with Jape and Fay, 477 00:25:33,680 --> 00:25:37,040 Speaker 2: republican strategist former press secretary to George Pataki. 478 00:25:37,840 --> 00:25:40,040 Speaker 4: What do you think here, Genie. 479 00:25:40,080 --> 00:25:43,040 Speaker 2: I don't know if we're going to formally hear something 480 00:25:43,119 --> 00:25:46,280 Speaker 2: like this from the Union anytime soon, but do we 481 00:25:46,359 --> 00:25:47,840 Speaker 2: see light at the end of the tunnel with a 482 00:25:47,880 --> 00:25:48,560 Speaker 2: headline like this? 483 00:25:49,640 --> 00:25:49,880 Speaker 7: Yeah? 484 00:25:50,200 --> 00:25:52,880 Speaker 9: I think it is good news all around. I mean, 485 00:25:53,320 --> 00:25:57,600 Speaker 9: as your first guest talked about the representative, when you're negotiating, 486 00:25:57,680 --> 00:26:01,400 Speaker 9: you have to be willing to compromise. And if this 487 00:26:01,480 --> 00:26:03,919 Speaker 9: headline holds true and this is what the Union is 488 00:26:03,960 --> 00:26:05,680 Speaker 9: indeed saying, it is a good sign. 489 00:26:05,880 --> 00:26:06,120 Speaker 7: You know. 490 00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:10,679 Speaker 9: I think for many people, myself included, forty percent was 491 00:26:10,880 --> 00:26:14,359 Speaker 9: probably not a realistic number, but a number to start 492 00:26:14,400 --> 00:26:16,400 Speaker 9: off with. To hear that they are down to ten, 493 00:26:16,840 --> 00:26:19,720 Speaker 9: you know, down to thirty rather down ten makes sense 494 00:26:19,760 --> 00:26:21,920 Speaker 9: and they're going to have to find some middle ground. 495 00:26:22,000 --> 00:26:24,000 Speaker 9: So I think it is good news. Although I'm not 496 00:26:24,040 --> 00:26:25,760 Speaker 9: sure we're going to see a light at the end 497 00:26:25,800 --> 00:26:28,760 Speaker 9: of the tunnel very soon, it is the right direction, 498 00:26:28,960 --> 00:26:29,640 Speaker 9: for sure. 499 00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:33,000 Speaker 2: A lot of questions about what this might mean for 500 00:26:33,080 --> 00:26:37,600 Speaker 2: other workers already emboldened by the UPS deal, this would 501 00:26:37,640 --> 00:26:41,280 Speaker 2: be another one chapin. You can weigh in on this 502 00:26:41,640 --> 00:26:44,240 Speaker 2: latest update. But I wonder if you think the visits 503 00:26:44,240 --> 00:26:47,520 Speaker 2: by Donald Trump and Joe Biden actually might help to 504 00:26:47,600 --> 00:26:50,520 Speaker 2: unlock some progress here to lead to a breakthrough. 505 00:26:52,600 --> 00:26:55,560 Speaker 8: I don't know if those particular visits will lead to 506 00:26:55,560 --> 00:26:58,080 Speaker 8: a breakthrough. I'm sure where. 507 00:26:57,920 --> 00:27:00,760 Speaker 3: I hope the President's team President Biden's team is you know, 508 00:27:00,880 --> 00:27:05,359 Speaker 3: involved or at least helping the two sides come to 509 00:27:05,440 --> 00:27:08,359 Speaker 3: an agreement. But but I have to say, you know, 510 00:27:08,400 --> 00:27:11,960 Speaker 3: the labor movement, you know, the momentum of the labor 511 00:27:11,960 --> 00:27:14,119 Speaker 3: movement over recent months and years. 512 00:27:13,840 --> 00:27:14,640 Speaker 8: Has been incredible. 513 00:27:14,680 --> 00:27:18,440 Speaker 3: I mean, you know, the Writers Guild out in Hollywood 514 00:27:18,520 --> 00:27:20,720 Speaker 3: just got everything they have for, or at least claim 515 00:27:20,960 --> 00:27:23,280 Speaker 3: claim that they got everything they asked for. It looks 516 00:27:23,359 --> 00:27:26,680 Speaker 3: like the UAW is going to get some pretty significant 517 00:27:27,280 --> 00:27:30,919 Speaker 3: salary increases and other benefits regardless of you know, where. 518 00:27:30,920 --> 00:27:33,960 Speaker 8: Management comes down on. So I do think labor is 519 00:27:34,480 --> 00:27:37,000 Speaker 8: Labor is becoming. It's always been. 520 00:27:36,960 --> 00:27:38,639 Speaker 3: A force to reckon with, but I think it's I 521 00:27:38,680 --> 00:27:41,080 Speaker 3: think it's having its second moment. 522 00:27:40,880 --> 00:27:44,640 Speaker 8: Here over the past couple of decades. With the momentum 523 00:27:44,640 --> 00:27:45,480 Speaker 8: that they're making. 524 00:27:45,200 --> 00:27:49,720 Speaker 2: That they're getting quite a contrast between the two presidential visits, 525 00:27:49,720 --> 00:27:51,439 Speaker 2: if I can call them that. Of course, Donald Trump 526 00:27:52,040 --> 00:27:55,000 Speaker 2: is a former president genie, but we've never seen anything 527 00:27:55,080 --> 00:27:57,679 Speaker 2: quite like this, and the amount of attention that was 528 00:27:57,720 --> 00:27:59,840 Speaker 2: thrown on the uau W here because of those two 529 00:28:00,119 --> 00:28:03,840 Speaker 2: it is noteworthy. Here's what Trump said last night in Michigan. 530 00:28:04,000 --> 00:28:06,800 Speaker 12: I side with the auto workers of American with those 531 00:28:06,880 --> 00:28:10,080 Speaker 12: who want to make America great again, and I always will. 532 00:28:15,160 --> 00:28:16,320 Speaker 4: And I don't get one thing. 533 00:28:16,840 --> 00:28:20,200 Speaker 12: I don't get why Ford and GM, why these car 534 00:28:20,280 --> 00:28:23,679 Speaker 12: makers aren't fighting for to make cars that are going 535 00:28:23,720 --> 00:28:25,440 Speaker 12: to sell, to make cars that are going to be 536 00:28:25,480 --> 00:28:25,920 Speaker 12: able to. 537 00:28:25,840 --> 00:28:28,960 Speaker 8: Go on long distances, they immediately give up. I see 538 00:28:28,960 --> 00:28:30,200 Speaker 8: it with the oil companies too. 539 00:28:30,680 --> 00:28:33,520 Speaker 12: They're promoting windmills, which don't work, by the way, but 540 00:28:33,640 --> 00:28:34,160 Speaker 12: they don't work. 541 00:28:34,200 --> 00:28:35,800 Speaker 8: They want windmills all over the place. 542 00:28:36,920 --> 00:28:38,560 Speaker 2: As much as I'd love to go into the whole 543 00:28:38,560 --> 00:28:42,480 Speaker 2: windmills thing right now, Chapin, it does say something about 544 00:28:42,520 --> 00:28:45,720 Speaker 2: the current state of the Republican Party. When Donald Trump 545 00:28:45,800 --> 00:28:48,720 Speaker 2: stands there and says I side with the auto workers. 546 00:28:48,760 --> 00:28:50,840 Speaker 2: I know he was at a non union shop, but 547 00:28:50,880 --> 00:28:56,720 Speaker 2: he's effectively endorsing a unionized labor action, right, Yeah, I. 548 00:28:56,680 --> 00:28:58,800 Speaker 3: Think, you know, he is the leader of the current 549 00:28:58,840 --> 00:29:01,280 Speaker 3: populist movement. I mean, is sort of you know, I 550 00:29:01,280 --> 00:29:03,800 Speaker 3: wouldn't say it rises the level of a civil war, 551 00:29:03,840 --> 00:29:07,600 Speaker 3: but there's certainly some tension within the Republican Party amongst 552 00:29:07,600 --> 00:29:11,320 Speaker 3: sort of the establishments, the ideological conservatives, and the populace, 553 00:29:11,400 --> 00:29:14,520 Speaker 3: which I think Donald Trump represents here. There are new 554 00:29:15,280 --> 00:29:20,960 Speaker 3: demographics and types of people in America that feel that 555 00:29:21,000 --> 00:29:23,360 Speaker 3: Donald Trump is speaking for them. If you look at 556 00:29:23,400 --> 00:29:26,040 Speaker 3: you know, just a New York City sort of the young, 557 00:29:26,120 --> 00:29:29,760 Speaker 3: up and coming Republican is very populist, right, very populism driven, 558 00:29:30,200 --> 00:29:33,080 Speaker 3: and are supporting things like unions of all things in 559 00:29:33,120 --> 00:29:37,480 Speaker 3: twenty twenty three. So you know, politics is cyclical, of course, 560 00:29:37,520 --> 00:29:41,680 Speaker 3: and I think you're seeing, you know, Donald Trump and Republicans, 561 00:29:41,360 --> 00:29:45,120 Speaker 3: at least his wing of the Republican Party, you know, 562 00:29:45,280 --> 00:29:47,280 Speaker 3: looking out and at least paying lip service to some 563 00:29:47,320 --> 00:29:49,840 Speaker 3: of these people in America who feel like they've been 564 00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:52,680 Speaker 3: left behind. So I do think it's a little stunning, 565 00:29:52,680 --> 00:29:54,320 Speaker 3: but you know, it has been building, and I think 566 00:29:54,360 --> 00:29:56,480 Speaker 3: that's what Donald Trump represents currently. 567 00:29:57,560 --> 00:29:59,440 Speaker 2: I don't know how many eyeballs he got last night. 568 00:29:59,480 --> 00:29:59,720 Speaker 4: Genie. 569 00:29:59,760 --> 00:30:01,840 Speaker 2: We made the point yesterday that this was not a 570 00:30:01,880 --> 00:30:04,880 Speaker 2: Tucker Carlson interview, and it wasn't a novelty act to 571 00:30:04,920 --> 00:30:06,680 Speaker 2: the point that it was the first time, because well 572 00:30:06,720 --> 00:30:09,480 Speaker 2: it's not the first time, even though he plans to 573 00:30:09,520 --> 00:30:12,120 Speaker 2: skip all of these primary debates. And I guess counter 574 00:30:12,160 --> 00:30:16,640 Speaker 2: program to some extent, you said earlier that Joe Biden 575 00:30:17,040 --> 00:30:20,520 Speaker 2: and Donald Trump essentially won the debate last night, those 576 00:30:20,560 --> 00:30:22,720 Speaker 2: two men who were not there, who won the visit 577 00:30:22,800 --> 00:30:23,440 Speaker 2: to Detroit. 578 00:30:25,400 --> 00:30:28,880 Speaker 9: You know, I think it's you know, still probably an 579 00:30:28,920 --> 00:30:32,440 Speaker 9: even draw. I have to say, I think substantively it 580 00:30:32,560 --> 00:30:36,560 Speaker 9: was the president. But we cannot deny that Donald Trump 581 00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:39,480 Speaker 9: has a lot of support among people on the line. 582 00:30:39,920 --> 00:30:43,040 Speaker 9: And while the leadership has tended towards the Democrats, and 583 00:30:43,160 --> 00:30:46,720 Speaker 9: Joe Biden has been a you know, union stallgart, he 584 00:30:46,800 --> 00:30:50,360 Speaker 9: has been the president of Labor, many people on the 585 00:30:50,440 --> 00:30:53,719 Speaker 9: line feel that they have been forgotten by the Democratic Party. 586 00:30:54,600 --> 00:30:56,920 Speaker 9: You know, this has been a long problem, long term 587 00:30:56,960 --> 00:30:59,840 Speaker 9: problem for the Democrats. That's why Michigan is going to 588 00:30:59,880 --> 00:31:03,240 Speaker 9: be so much up for grabs when we get to 589 00:31:03,360 --> 00:31:06,480 Speaker 9: twenty twenty four. But Joe, if you talk to Donald Trump, 590 00:31:06,520 --> 00:31:09,320 Speaker 9: he's going to tell you it was the biggest event 591 00:31:09,440 --> 00:31:13,440 Speaker 9: last night. He got tons of eyeballs. Don't you worry, nothing, nothing. 592 00:31:13,480 --> 00:31:16,440 Speaker 9: This is probably Super Bowl big. So you know the 593 00:31:16,520 --> 00:31:18,440 Speaker 9: number is you can just count on him to say 594 00:31:18,480 --> 00:31:19,320 Speaker 9: they were bigly. 595 00:31:20,840 --> 00:31:22,880 Speaker 2: They were bigly that he said ten thousand people were 596 00:31:22,880 --> 00:31:26,240 Speaker 2: stuck outside chapin. Are we going to really do this 597 00:31:26,320 --> 00:31:28,000 Speaker 2: crowd sized thing again for another year? 598 00:31:29,200 --> 00:31:31,560 Speaker 8: Boy? I hope not. But you know, it's Donald Trump. 599 00:31:31,600 --> 00:31:33,040 Speaker 7: But he's you know, he's a marketer. 600 00:31:33,160 --> 00:31:35,800 Speaker 3: I mean, I wouldn't call them lines, but certainly, you 601 00:31:35,880 --> 00:31:40,000 Speaker 3: know New York real estate developer. Embellishments, you know, is 602 00:31:40,040 --> 00:31:43,480 Speaker 3: his style. And I think Genie was right about the 603 00:31:43,520 --> 00:31:46,600 Speaker 3: state of labor. You know, it has long been discussed 604 00:31:47,080 --> 00:31:53,040 Speaker 3: among you know, publican circles that union leadership is democratic solidly, 605 00:31:53,120 --> 00:31:56,240 Speaker 3: but the rank and file is starting to you know, vote. 606 00:31:56,440 --> 00:31:57,479 Speaker 4: Their Poto books. 607 00:31:58,440 --> 00:32:00,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, this is something that we've been watching very closely 608 00:32:00,800 --> 00:32:03,720 Speaker 2: and will continue to. It really plays into this presidential 609 00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:05,720 Speaker 2: election cycle in a unique way. 610 00:32:12,880 --> 00:32:16,280 Speaker 1: You're listening to The Bloomberg Sound on podcast. Catch the 611 00:32:16,280 --> 00:32:20,160 Speaker 1: program live weekdays at one Eastern on Bloomberg Radio, the 612 00:32:20,240 --> 00:32:23,600 Speaker 1: tune in app, Bloomberg dot Com, and the Bloomberg Business App. 613 00:32:23,720 --> 00:32:26,560 Speaker 1: You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our 614 00:32:26,600 --> 00:32:31,840 Speaker 1: flagship New York station, Just say Alexa play Bloomberg eleven thirty. 615 00:32:33,000 --> 00:32:36,600 Speaker 2: I want to welcome everyone our TV and radio audiences 616 00:32:36,640 --> 00:32:40,320 Speaker 2: worldwide for a special conversation with the former Vice president 617 00:32:40,400 --> 00:32:43,840 Speaker 2: Mike Pence. I'm Joe Matthew in Washington here on Bloomberg 618 00:32:43,840 --> 00:32:46,480 Speaker 2: alongside Anne Marie. Hor Dern and Anne Marie were just 619 00:32:46,600 --> 00:32:49,600 Speaker 2: hours off of the Republican debate. As we've been discussing 620 00:32:49,600 --> 00:32:52,400 Speaker 2: in SeeMe Valley last evening. That was a debate that 621 00:32:52,440 --> 00:32:56,080 Speaker 2: could end up being critical for the future of any campaign, 622 00:32:56,360 --> 00:32:57,360 Speaker 2: including Mike Pences. 623 00:32:57,680 --> 00:33:01,640 Speaker 13: Yep, that's absolutely right. Our Vice president was at that 624 00:33:01,760 --> 00:33:06,000 Speaker 13: debate and we'll see what comes next for him. Right, 625 00:33:06,000 --> 00:33:07,800 Speaker 13: there's a few people who are saying, potentially, with his 626 00:33:07,840 --> 00:33:09,120 Speaker 13: poll numbers, he might have to drop out. 627 00:33:09,200 --> 00:33:12,480 Speaker 2: That's right, well, he joins us from California. Now, mister 628 00:33:12,560 --> 00:33:15,040 Speaker 2: Vice President, it's great to have you back on Bloomberg. 629 00:33:15,200 --> 00:33:18,200 Speaker 2: We welcome you, and I wonder your thoughts about that exercise. 630 00:33:18,280 --> 00:33:21,680 Speaker 2: Last night, we were just playing clips of three, four 631 00:33:21,720 --> 00:33:26,240 Speaker 2: people talking over each other for minutes on end, a 632 00:33:26,280 --> 00:33:28,880 Speaker 2: lot of zingers, a lot of one liners. One of 633 00:33:28,920 --> 00:33:31,720 Speaker 2: the moderators even wanted to play a game of Survivor 634 00:33:31,800 --> 00:33:34,480 Speaker 2: with you. I just wonder with to the extent that 635 00:33:34,560 --> 00:33:38,320 Speaker 2: Ronald Reagan's legacy was invoked last evening in Seame Valley, 636 00:33:38,600 --> 00:33:41,600 Speaker 2: did Republicans live up to the standard set by Ronald 637 00:33:41,680 --> 00:33:43,320 Speaker 2: Reagan and that exercise last night? 638 00:33:46,200 --> 00:33:49,320 Speaker 14: Well, I'm standing here at the Reagan Library still, and 639 00:33:50,040 --> 00:33:52,480 Speaker 14: you know, it was very special for me to be 640 00:33:52,520 --> 00:33:54,440 Speaker 14: a part of the debate last night in here, because 641 00:33:55,000 --> 00:33:57,520 Speaker 14: Reagan is the reason I became a Republican, and it 642 00:33:57,680 --> 00:34:03,280 Speaker 14: was his conservative agenda, it was his optimism, and it 643 00:34:03,360 --> 00:34:07,120 Speaker 14: was his civility that really defined the man and defined 644 00:34:07,160 --> 00:34:14,040 Speaker 14: his administration. And last night's debate was at times chaotic, 645 00:34:14,640 --> 00:34:17,480 Speaker 14: but I really welcomed the opportunity to make my case 646 00:34:17,600 --> 00:34:22,319 Speaker 14: that I believe that, while while the former president and 647 00:34:22,360 --> 00:34:25,160 Speaker 14: some others who were on that stage are steering our 648 00:34:25,200 --> 00:34:29,040 Speaker 14: party away from Ronald Reagan's agenda of American leadership in 649 00:34:29,080 --> 00:34:32,719 Speaker 14: the world, fiscal responsibility, even the right to life, that 650 00:34:32,760 --> 00:34:37,040 Speaker 14: I'm the most consistent and tested conservative in this field. 651 00:34:37,360 --> 00:34:39,880 Speaker 14: The opportunity to make that case here at the Reagan 652 00:34:39,960 --> 00:34:42,400 Speaker 14: Library to the American people was a great privilege for me. 653 00:34:44,160 --> 00:34:46,440 Speaker 13: Mister Vice President, you spoke a lot about what you're 654 00:34:46,480 --> 00:34:50,080 Speaker 13: speaking about now, the fact that populism has taken control 655 00:34:50,080 --> 00:34:52,759 Speaker 13: of the Republican Party. But if you look back to 656 00:34:52,800 --> 00:34:55,440 Speaker 13: what Trump was saying in twenty fifteen when he announced 657 00:34:55,440 --> 00:34:58,960 Speaker 13: his campaign to become president, it reeked of populism. He 658 00:34:59,080 --> 00:35:02,480 Speaker 13: was calling polic dumb. In his first speech, he was 659 00:35:02,560 --> 00:35:05,120 Speaker 13: talking about draining this swamp. He was talking about the 660 00:35:05,200 --> 00:35:07,480 Speaker 13: United States not beating anyone ever. He said, when was 661 00:35:07,480 --> 00:35:10,800 Speaker 13: the last time we beat Japan? Do you feel responsible 662 00:35:10,880 --> 00:35:14,480 Speaker 13: for giving credibility to populism in this Republican Party that 663 00:35:14,480 --> 00:35:15,280 Speaker 13: we're seeing today. 664 00:35:18,440 --> 00:35:22,839 Speaker 14: You know, when Donald Trump came down that escalator, he 665 00:35:22,880 --> 00:35:24,800 Speaker 14: told the American people he was going to make America 666 00:35:24,840 --> 00:35:27,560 Speaker 14: great again. The first person to say make America great 667 00:35:27,600 --> 00:35:32,160 Speaker 14: again was Ronald Reagan. And in that campaign, whether it 668 00:35:32,280 --> 00:35:35,280 Speaker 14: was a commitment to conservatives on our courts, a commitment 669 00:35:35,280 --> 00:35:38,920 Speaker 14: to cut taxes, a commitment to rebuild our military, Donald 670 00:35:38,960 --> 00:35:41,520 Speaker 14: Trump promised to govern as a conservative, and I believe 671 00:35:41,520 --> 00:35:43,239 Speaker 14: when he chose me to be his running mate, there 672 00:35:43,280 --> 00:35:46,560 Speaker 14: was evidence of his seriousness about that, and for four 673 00:35:46,640 --> 00:35:50,240 Speaker 14: years we did govern as conservatives. We kept our word 674 00:35:50,480 --> 00:35:53,000 Speaker 14: on the world stage. We stood with our allies, we 675 00:35:53,040 --> 00:35:57,680 Speaker 14: stood up to our enemies, We advanced the largest tax 676 00:35:57,719 --> 00:36:01,200 Speaker 14: cuts in American history, and of course appointed conservatives to 677 00:36:01,280 --> 00:36:03,960 Speaker 14: our courts at every level, including three of the justices 678 00:36:04,000 --> 00:36:06,319 Speaker 14: that gave us a new beginning for life. But what 679 00:36:06,400 --> 00:36:08,839 Speaker 14: I want people to understand is that Donald Trump makes 680 00:36:08,880 --> 00:36:12,520 Speaker 14: no such promise today. Whatever his rhetoric was back in 681 00:36:12,560 --> 00:36:15,480 Speaker 14: the day, and his rhetoric has remained the same. The 682 00:36:15,560 --> 00:36:20,240 Speaker 14: policies that he's advancing now, which included a ten percent 683 00:36:20,719 --> 00:36:23,920 Speaker 14: tax on all imports into the United States that the 684 00:36:23,960 --> 00:36:27,600 Speaker 14: Tax Foundation said would cost five hundred thousand jobs, is 685 00:36:27,640 --> 00:36:31,759 Speaker 14: directly opposite of our administration and the Reagan legacy of 686 00:36:31,800 --> 00:36:34,279 Speaker 14: cutting taxes for individuals and businesses. 687 00:36:34,520 --> 00:36:35,000 Speaker 1: The way the. 688 00:36:34,960 --> 00:36:38,440 Speaker 14: President is joining a chorus in the Party of embracing 689 00:36:38,480 --> 00:36:46,120 Speaker 14: appeasement and isolationism from supporting Ukraine in their battle against 690 00:36:46,719 --> 00:36:51,520 Speaker 14: the unconscionable Russian invasion, that's not consistent with the way 691 00:36:51,560 --> 00:36:54,360 Speaker 14: that we stood strong with our allies, we stood up 692 00:36:54,400 --> 00:36:57,439 Speaker 14: to our enemies, turned our armed forces loose to take 693 00:36:57,480 --> 00:37:01,080 Speaker 14: down isis we actually armed forces. The United States took 694 00:37:01,080 --> 00:37:05,840 Speaker 14: out one hundred Wagner Group Russian military personnel in twenty 695 00:37:05,880 --> 00:37:09,120 Speaker 14: eighteen in Syria. We stood strong in the world stage, 696 00:37:09,480 --> 00:37:12,200 Speaker 14: embraced our role as leader of the free world. Of course, lastly, 697 00:37:12,320 --> 00:37:14,680 Speaker 14: just on the right to life. Just in recent days, 698 00:37:14,719 --> 00:37:19,600 Speaker 14: the American people have heard the President literally criticize states 699 00:37:19,640 --> 00:37:23,040 Speaker 14: that enacted strong pro life protections from the moment that 700 00:37:23,080 --> 00:37:28,000 Speaker 14: an unborn child experiences a heartbeat, and he's made no 701 00:37:28,040 --> 00:37:31,600 Speaker 14: commitment to support protections for the unborn at the national level. 702 00:37:31,640 --> 00:37:33,760 Speaker 14: That coming from the leader of the most pro life 703 00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:36,879 Speaker 14: administration in history. That's what I mean when I talk 704 00:37:36,960 --> 00:37:40,440 Speaker 14: about the President and some of his imitators walking away 705 00:37:40,480 --> 00:37:43,840 Speaker 14: from that timeless conservative agenda. But if I'm president of 706 00:37:43,880 --> 00:37:47,200 Speaker 14: the United States, the American people can be confident I'll 707 00:37:47,280 --> 00:37:51,520 Speaker 14: lead as America on the world stage, being the leader 708 00:37:51,600 --> 00:37:55,080 Speaker 14: through the world, will lead presidents and policies, and will 709 00:37:55,120 --> 00:37:57,560 Speaker 14: balance our budget and stand for life. 710 00:37:58,480 --> 00:38:01,279 Speaker 2: Your former running mate was, of course not there last night, 711 00:38:01,800 --> 00:38:04,360 Speaker 2: and some believe that he will win the Republican nomination 712 00:38:04,480 --> 00:38:06,840 Speaker 2: without answering a single question in a forum like the 713 00:38:06,840 --> 00:38:10,440 Speaker 2: one that you endured last evening. What should Donald Trump 714 00:38:10,560 --> 00:38:13,319 Speaker 2: answer to would it be the trillions in debt that 715 00:38:13,400 --> 00:38:16,000 Speaker 2: he added to the nation and left behind? Would it 716 00:38:16,040 --> 00:38:18,359 Speaker 2: be his legal challenges right now? 717 00:38:18,600 --> 00:38:20,480 Speaker 4: What is it? 718 00:38:22,239 --> 00:38:24,120 Speaker 14: Well, Look, I think he ought to be there. He 719 00:38:24,160 --> 00:38:26,359 Speaker 14: should have been there last night, He should have been 720 00:38:26,400 --> 00:38:29,840 Speaker 14: there at the first debate. Look, no one is entitled 721 00:38:29,840 --> 00:38:33,560 Speaker 14: the nomination of their party. And frankly, Donald Trump continues 722 00:38:33,600 --> 00:38:37,120 Speaker 14: to campaign as though he were the incumbent president. But 723 00:38:37,560 --> 00:38:41,120 Speaker 14: think about this, he's campaigning as an incumbent, but he 724 00:38:41,200 --> 00:38:44,919 Speaker 14: has less than fifty percent support of Republicans. That means 725 00:38:44,960 --> 00:38:48,279 Speaker 14: half of Republicans are looking somewhere else. I think he 726 00:38:48,280 --> 00:38:51,000 Speaker 14: owes it to our party to step forward and answer 727 00:38:51,080 --> 00:38:53,960 Speaker 14: the questions that they can be on those issues. But 728 00:38:54,040 --> 00:38:57,880 Speaker 14: for my part, for my part, I think the president 729 00:38:57,960 --> 00:39:00,920 Speaker 14: ought to explain while having passed that's the largest tax 730 00:39:00,960 --> 00:39:04,200 Speaker 14: cuts and tax reform in history, he now advocates what 731 00:39:04,320 --> 00:39:09,200 Speaker 14: would be the largest proposal of tariffs, a ten percent 732 00:39:09,320 --> 00:39:13,879 Speaker 14: tariff on all imports, literally since the Herbert Hoover administration. 733 00:39:14,840 --> 00:39:18,480 Speaker 14: And why the president, after we rebuild our military stood 734 00:39:18,480 --> 00:39:21,720 Speaker 14: strong on the world stage, is now joining a courus 735 00:39:21,719 --> 00:39:25,160 Speaker 14: of isolationists in the party, saying that support for the 736 00:39:25,239 --> 00:39:29,080 Speaker 14: Ukrainian military is not sustainable and joining others who were 737 00:39:29,080 --> 00:39:31,280 Speaker 14: on that stage last night, who would be fully prepared 738 00:39:31,360 --> 00:39:34,640 Speaker 14: just to let Vladimir Putin overrun Ukraine. And of course, 739 00:39:34,640 --> 00:39:37,920 Speaker 14: as I said last night, I think if Putin grabs Ukraine, 740 00:39:37,960 --> 00:39:41,759 Speaker 14: that just gives a green light to Jijiingping to move 741 00:39:41,800 --> 00:39:45,000 Speaker 14: against Taiwan. So I think we achieve peace through strength. 742 00:39:45,040 --> 00:39:46,759 Speaker 14: And I think the President ought to be willing to 743 00:39:46,760 --> 00:39:50,800 Speaker 14: step up and explain why he's changed his mind about 744 00:39:50,800 --> 00:39:54,239 Speaker 14: America's obligations but leader of the free world, and why 745 00:39:54,280 --> 00:39:57,960 Speaker 14: he's changed his mind on such a fundamental issue as taxation. 746 00:39:59,200 --> 00:40:01,120 Speaker 13: Well, you've talked a lot. What about your commitment to 747 00:40:01,200 --> 00:40:04,200 Speaker 13: strong defense. We had on Senator Tommy Tuberville on this 748 00:40:04,320 --> 00:40:06,719 Speaker 13: week who said this, This was his quote. He said, 749 00:40:06,719 --> 00:40:11,040 Speaker 13: the US military is not an equal opportunity employer. You 750 00:40:11,080 --> 00:40:14,040 Speaker 13: are the father, you are the stepfather of men who 751 00:40:14,040 --> 00:40:17,759 Speaker 13: have given their lives to this country, to our military. 752 00:40:18,239 --> 00:40:20,360 Speaker 13: What do you have to does this have to say 753 00:40:20,440 --> 00:40:22,440 Speaker 13: about the state of the Republican Party. 754 00:40:25,960 --> 00:40:29,200 Speaker 14: Well, I don't know the context of that remark. 755 00:40:28,840 --> 00:40:29,280 Speaker 1: I think. 756 00:40:31,160 --> 00:40:33,920 Speaker 14: The armed forces of the United States, throughout our history, 757 00:40:33,920 --> 00:40:36,799 Speaker 14: from the founding of the country have been an incredible 758 00:40:36,880 --> 00:40:40,080 Speaker 14: meeting ground for people of every race and every background 759 00:40:40,080 --> 00:40:42,280 Speaker 14: who put on the uniform and served. 760 00:40:42,320 --> 00:40:44,080 Speaker 2: Mister Vice President, I feel like we should put a 761 00:40:44,080 --> 00:40:46,319 Speaker 2: finer point on that. We were asking him about his 762 00:40:46,400 --> 00:40:49,720 Speaker 2: decision to vote against C. Q. Brown, the new chairman 763 00:40:49,760 --> 00:40:52,520 Speaker 2: of the Joint Chiefs. He called and woke and said 764 00:40:52,560 --> 00:40:55,839 Speaker 2: he wants to mix race into the military and made 765 00:40:55,880 --> 00:40:59,879 Speaker 2: that comment that Anne Marie just referred to. Is that 766 00:41:00,160 --> 00:41:03,560 Speaker 2: wrong view for this country? 767 00:41:04,520 --> 00:41:08,360 Speaker 14: Well, look, I believe, and look, I have great respect 768 00:41:08,360 --> 00:41:11,040 Speaker 14: for General Brown, but I'm very frustrated when I see 769 00:41:11,040 --> 00:41:14,560 Speaker 14: the political correctness in the woke politics that's taken hold 770 00:41:14,600 --> 00:41:17,200 Speaker 14: of the Pentagon under the Biden administration. But I do 771 00:41:17,280 --> 00:41:19,240 Speaker 14: know how it works. I've worked in a White House. 772 00:41:19,719 --> 00:41:21,080 Speaker 14: I know how Pentagon works. 773 00:41:21,120 --> 00:41:21,560 Speaker 1: I mean that. 774 00:41:23,239 --> 00:41:26,080 Speaker 14: We have civilian control of the military. I'm confident that 775 00:41:27,440 --> 00:41:30,640 Speaker 14: this woke politics is emanating out of the Biden administration. 776 00:41:30,760 --> 00:41:34,520 Speaker 14: But look that Senator Tubberville has every right to vote 777 00:41:34,560 --> 00:41:38,560 Speaker 14: to confirm or not to confirm. But for my part, 778 00:41:38,560 --> 00:41:40,600 Speaker 14: I've made it very clear that if I'm President of 779 00:41:40,600 --> 00:41:43,640 Speaker 14: the United States, We're going to build a military fitted 780 00:41:43,680 --> 00:41:46,359 Speaker 14: to the widening challenges in the twenty first century. We're 781 00:41:46,400 --> 00:41:49,120 Speaker 14: going to get this woke politics out of the Pentagon 782 00:41:49,600 --> 00:41:53,040 Speaker 14: on day one, and that includes we're going to reinstitute 783 00:41:53,080 --> 00:41:57,759 Speaker 14: the ban on transgender personnel in the United States military. 784 00:41:58,200 --> 00:42:00,880 Speaker 14: I truly do believe that that is not in the 785 00:42:00,920 --> 00:42:07,400 Speaker 14: interest of having a military that reflects unit cohesion, preparedness, 786 00:42:07,520 --> 00:42:11,080 Speaker 14: is deployable. We'll put that common sense back into effect. 787 00:42:12,920 --> 00:42:15,160 Speaker 13: Vice President Mike Pence, thank you so much for joining us. 788 00:42:15,200 --> 00:42:16,560 Speaker 13: It's all the time we have today. 789 00:42:16,880 --> 00:42:17,399 Speaker 9: Thank you again. 790 00:42:17,480 --> 00:42:18,399 Speaker 13: We hope you come back soon. 791 00:42:19,239 --> 00:42:21,080 Speaker 4: Thanks for listening to the sound On podcast. 792 00:42:21,200 --> 00:42:24,320 Speaker 2: Make sure to subscribe if you haven't already, at Apple, Spotify, 793 00:42:24,360 --> 00:42:26,799 Speaker 2: and anywhere else you get your podcasts, and you can 794 00:42:26,840 --> 00:42:29,839 Speaker 2: find us live every weekday from Washington, DC at one 795 00:42:29,880 --> 00:42:34,360 Speaker 2: pm Eastern Time at Bloomberg dot com.