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Speaker 1: Yeah, Welcome to the Bloomberg Surveillance Podcast. I'm m Keene

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Speaker 1: Jay Leye. We bring you insight from the best in economics, finance, investment,

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Speaker 1: and international relations. Find Bloomberg Surveillance on Apple Podcasts, SoundCloud,

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg dot Com, and of course, on the Bloomberg We begin, though,

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Speaker 1: with the quarterly earning season with JP Morgan down in

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Speaker 1: the pre market by about four tenths of one percent.

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Speaker 1: I'm going to whip through some of the headline numbers.

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Speaker 1: JP morgan fourth quarter adjusted revenue came at twenty five

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Speaker 1: point four five billion dollars the estimate five point five one.

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Speaker 1: The fourth quarter adjusted EPs came in at a dollar

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Speaker 1: and seventies six cents fixed income trading revenue, well below

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Speaker 1: analyst estimates. These results, of course, include a two point

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Speaker 1: four billion dollar a charge as a result of a

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Speaker 1: tax bill. And to get some guidance on where JP

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Speaker 1: Morgan sees the effective tax rate for eighteen, they see

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Speaker 1: it around nineteen percent. I'm very pleased to say I

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Speaker 1: can bring in Bloomberg's day in Campbell now to get

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Speaker 1: us up to speed on on what he sees in

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Speaker 1: the numbers. We've been staying for a while day can

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Speaker 1: we're expecting it to be a murky quarterly report from

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Speaker 1: not just JPMorgan but across the street. Yes, that's that's

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Speaker 1: for sure. This is no exception to get us started.

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Speaker 1: One thing that I noticed in the result is expenses

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Speaker 1: are higher than analysts expected. That's never a good sign,

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Speaker 1: especially at this point in the h in the business

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Speaker 1: cycle for these banks. They've been slashing expenses for for

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Speaker 1: years and UH and to be surprising on the up

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Speaker 1: side in a quarter like this, I think maybe one

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Speaker 1: reason why they shares her down. I'm not sure how

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Speaker 1: much guidance we can take from the interday move pre market.

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Speaker 1: Because they had such a monster year last year they

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Speaker 1: can going forward. I'm still sitting here wondering where the

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Speaker 1: revenue comes from. Let's deal with the investment bank. First

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Speaker 1: trading rem new has been rough for a while, Volatility

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Speaker 1: is not in their client activity won't be what it

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Speaker 1: otherwise would be. Are we going to see a change

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Speaker 1: this year? That's the hope, certainly among Wall Street trading desks. UH,

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Speaker 1: there is some reason for optimism. You you've got central

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Speaker 1: banks UH, and monetary policy diverging around the world. There

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Speaker 1: is some thought that that's gonna help bring volatility back

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Speaker 1: into the markets and give some opportunities for both clients

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Speaker 1: and UH and traders. But we've been we've talked about

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Speaker 1: that in twenty seventeen and it didn't really uh come

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Speaker 1: to fruition. So I think that's still a question mark

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Speaker 1: for So we've got JP Morgan and typically a Bloomberg.

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Speaker 1: We talk about the big investment bank, and we don't

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Speaker 1: spend much time talking about Chase Chase of course, a

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Speaker 1: massive retail arm. Can these guys continue to increase the

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Speaker 1: NEN interest margin and continue to maintain such low deposit beta?

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Speaker 1: And what I mean by cutting through the jargon, can

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Speaker 1: they continue to ignore the rate rises that come from

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Speaker 1: the Federal Reserve without passing them on to the deposit base.

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Speaker 1: That is the big question. Uh. You know this is

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Speaker 1: interest rates have never been at zero percent before, and

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Speaker 1: so coming off of a floor like that, a lot

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Speaker 1: of analysts have had a hard time modeling what deposit

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Speaker 1: betas or how much banks will have to pay depositors. Uh.

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Speaker 1: It's not like any other cycle. And so we have

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Speaker 1: started seeing interest rates deposit rates tick tick up, and

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Speaker 1: so there is some indication that maybe that will continue

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Speaker 1: and make it a little bit harder for banks to

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Speaker 1: expand their margin as much as they as they may like.

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Speaker 1: But again we're coming off a very low base. Banks

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Speaker 1: typically can move the and they position themselves. They can

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Speaker 1: move the rate that they're getting on the loans uh

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Speaker 1: more quickly than they than they typically do on the deposits.

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Speaker 1: So that should allow them to expand that margin. Taking

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Speaker 1: Campbell with us is he's gonna get ready for his

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Speaker 1: reporting on this and to advance the story further. We

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Speaker 1: like to do that with Bradyn's legendary at Sanford Bernstein.

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Speaker 1: His black book was it required historical and present tense

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Speaker 1: read for years by hold selling the banks, and he

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Speaker 1: now has a shingle out at the New York University

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Speaker 1: Stern School of Business where he crushes people with quality

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Speaker 1: ces each and every quarter. Professor, it's wonderful day. Have

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Speaker 1: you with us? I want to wax philosophical. Seeing a

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg headline JP Morgan fixed income training revenue drops percent?

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Speaker 1: Do we have an excess of banking in America? Are

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Speaker 1: What we're really dealing with here is there's too much

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Speaker 1: much iedness in banking. Um, well, that's a you could

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Speaker 1: argue that on the retail side, which is if you

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Speaker 1: if you think of the millennials, the millennials probably don't

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Speaker 1: visit bank branches a lot branches. I think there's absolutely

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Speaker 1: certain you're but the your lead in which is fixed income,

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Speaker 1: fixed income, has already cut back. I mean what you're

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Speaker 1: what you're seeing with fixed income is a recognition on

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Speaker 1: the part of all the banks that there will be

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Speaker 1: a fixed income market. Someone at some point is going

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Speaker 1: to have to pay for liquidity um. At some point

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Speaker 1: the Vulcar rules will will will loosen up a little

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Speaker 1: bit so that you can make money from market making.

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Speaker 1: But you know right now that is that is a hope.

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Speaker 1: That's a hope. I love that. I hope you can

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Speaker 1: say that. In academics they can hope. Professor Hin says

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Speaker 1: that like three times in any given lecture that he

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Speaker 1: just forget about the hope. Jamie Diamond, Brian moynihan, and arrest.

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Speaker 1: They have to deal with this. Have they cut trading

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Speaker 1: to the bone or is there more to come? I

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Speaker 1: think there's a feeling out there that they have cut

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Speaker 1: trading to the bone. Uh. One one thing we we

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Speaker 1: haven't talked about is how you sort of uh, convinced

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Speaker 1: some traders to leave the bank when you don't want

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Speaker 1: to cut them necessarily. How do you do that, Chief

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Speaker 1: financial officer hands Um, that's called a buyout, right something

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Speaker 1: like that? You uh, you you start seeing that they're

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Speaker 1: not invited to the to the best meetings, their clients

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Speaker 1: are taken away from them, and then next thing that

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Speaker 1: sounds like Bloomberg taking taken This is the kickoff to

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Speaker 1: an earning season. Do you do you? Since you know

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Speaker 1: within our team a similarity bank to bank in terms,

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Speaker 1: I mean, John, what's it like in the United Kingdom?

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Speaker 1: Is it trading? Trading that slow there as well? Training slow,

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Speaker 1: training slow across the board. But I think client mix

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Speaker 1: has been really important over the last couple of quarters,

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Speaker 1: depending on the client mix. If you're really exposed the

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Speaker 1: institutional clients the hedge funds, for instance, then the vix

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Speaker 1: tells the story of what the quarta is going to

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Speaker 1: be like. But if you've got a real good corporate

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Speaker 1: client mixed, like say Bank America, fixed income trading holds

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Speaker 1: up because you've been exposed to that big boom in

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Speaker 1: corporate debt issuance that we've had over the last couple

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Speaker 1: of years. Is that going to be important this time around?

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Speaker 1: Day can as well that Yes, we think so. But

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Speaker 1: JP Morgan is one of those banks that has that

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Speaker 1: flow business, has a lot of corporate clients, and they

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Speaker 1: turned in a disappointing fixed income quarter. So I sort

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Speaker 1: of shudder to think of what people at Goldman are

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Speaker 1: thinking on a daylight today. And we tite one set

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Speaker 1: of earnings and we extrapolate it forward. We think about,

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Speaker 1: what's JP Morgan gonna report now after Bank of America, say,

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Speaker 1: and then next up Goldman Sex as well, what's the

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Speaker 1: read for Bank b of A and Goldman SAX next week? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: the read for b of A and City I would

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Speaker 1: add to the equation which also have big corporate businesses

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Speaker 1: like uh, like JP Morrigan is you know, it could

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Speaker 1: be down thirty percent, maybe a little bit less. All

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Speaker 1: three of them coming into the quarter said, uh, trading

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Speaker 1: overall was going to be down about fifteen percent, So

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Speaker 1: they were all in the in the range. Uh. For

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Speaker 1: the Goldman Sacks and the Morgan Stanleys of the world,

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Speaker 1: which have less of a corporate business, less flow trading,

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Speaker 1: the story maybe even uglier this quarter. I mean, I

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Speaker 1: think that's gonna be the read out of looking at

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Speaker 1: JP Morgan. If they can't turn in a good quarter

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Speaker 1: on fixed income trading, then then then how is Goldman

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Speaker 1: going to do? Bread hands? I just got a first

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Speaker 1: statistic here. The earnings have come out really nuge two

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Speaker 1: day and JP Morgan they used they're best in class

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Speaker 1: in terms of putting out earnings and it's been a

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Speaker 1: struggle to get the data. Bright and seven r o E.

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Speaker 1: I'm sorry. Managers have to stand up and do something right. Yes,

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Speaker 1: um recognize is viewed as good. I mean that's the

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Speaker 1: cost of capital of these banks. So, I mean what

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Speaker 1: has happened is we've become used to the idea of

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Speaker 1: of you know, below cost of capital performance. Jamie's got

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Speaker 1: the best firm. Now this quarter, this quarter is going

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Speaker 1: to be an unusual quarter, right because we've got all

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Speaker 1: these tax rates to be a mess, Professor, isn't it

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Speaker 1: That's an opportunity if you're the CFO, to throw everything

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Speaker 1: you can into it because the analysts are going to

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Speaker 1: are going to look at the quarter and say it's

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Speaker 1: an aberration. I'm not going to worry about it, right,

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Speaker 1: and so you throw X ray expenses, your rite things off,

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Speaker 1: you let people go. This is any time you have

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Speaker 1: an event like this, it's a it's an opertunity to

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Speaker 1: take the wheelbarrel out. And John the Tier one Capital's

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Speaker 1: ubs like, I mean twelve point one twelve point four

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Speaker 1: percent common equity Tier one capital, Dacon, they're on the

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Speaker 1: edge of credit suite and ubs in terms of financial integrity.

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Speaker 1: They're hold They're holding a lot of capital. Yes, they

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Speaker 1: would certainly for all of Jamie talks about his Fortress

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Speaker 1: balance sheet, he would certainly like to hold last capital. Okay,

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Speaker 1: this is making to Dick and Campbell. Get back to

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Speaker 1: work at your real job. And Brad Hans, thank you

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Speaker 1: so much for being with us today. Look for Dacon

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Speaker 1: Campbell's work on Bloomberg News, further depth on JP Morgan

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Speaker 1: and American banking. This is Bloomberg. We are more than

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Speaker 1: close to a two percent two year yield. That means

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Speaker 1: it's a good time to talk to Ellen Zentner Morgan Stanley.

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Speaker 1: She over the year has been wonderful at parsing y

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Speaker 1: equals C plus I plus G plus n X and

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Speaker 1: really had great acclaim eighteen months and two years ago.

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Speaker 1: I'm saying this is a Fed that would be forced

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Speaker 1: to wait and wait and wait. Is a two percent

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Speaker 1: yield on the two year a signal that we're going

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Speaker 1: to have a significant set of rate increases this year? Well,

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Speaker 1: I think that, Uh, you know, we expect three rate hikes, right,

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Speaker 1: and if the tenure does not move much, or if

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Speaker 1: it moves lower yields on the tenure, then you're going

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Speaker 1: to have a very flat yield curve. And so the

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Speaker 1: Fed is going to have a very difficult decision at

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Speaker 1: that time, say in the third quarter of this year. Uh,

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Speaker 1: do they push it further because financial conditions may still

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Speaker 1: be easy to tell them they should go further, or

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Speaker 1: do they take a flat yield curve as as as

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Speaker 1: a sign that if you go further, you're gonna risk

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Speaker 1: converting the yield curve. But what's missing is inflation. You're

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Speaker 1: one of the great parsers of inflation. Do you just

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Speaker 1: hope inflations out there? If your chairman, Powell, do you

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Speaker 1: wish for it as across my fingers, hope to die?

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Speaker 1: How do you do all this if there's no inflation? Well, so,

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Speaker 1: hope is a big piece of it. Right. As a forecaster,

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Speaker 1: you do your best forecasting where you think inflation will go,

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Speaker 1: and developments in the economy and the way the data

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Speaker 1: comes in will either give you more confidence about that

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Speaker 1: assumption or less confidence about their assumption. And how confident

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Speaker 1: you are in your inflation forecast that we will get

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Speaker 1: to the two percent goal at some point over the

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Speaker 1: medium term horizon will dictate what they do today. UH.

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Speaker 1: And so basically the mount Hornback, our global head of

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Speaker 1: right Strategy, sees the tenure yield on the tenure moving

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Speaker 1: lower this year UH basically a completely flat yield curve

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Speaker 1: in the third quarter and slightly inverted in the fourth quarter.

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Speaker 1: Part of what's driving that estimate of his is the

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Speaker 1: fact that we have such a tepid forecast for inflation.

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Speaker 1: We're coming in lower than what the Fed expects, than

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Speaker 1: what consensus expects in terms of the path we're looking for.

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Speaker 1: And in his estimation, if the Fed continues to hike

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Speaker 1: rates with inflation not materializing, right, you're going to continue

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Speaker 1: to get a market that bets every hike is a mistake,

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Speaker 1: and that recessions around the corner, and it's just going

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Speaker 1: to be very difficult to see how the yield kurse

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Speaker 1: deepens in that environment and Ellen, I'm going to have

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Speaker 1: the privilege of speaking to Matt Hornback a little bit

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Speaker 1: later on on Blood Black TV, So I'm looking forward

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Speaker 1: to having this conversation with him. Was that a shameless

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Speaker 1: plug before seventh for the company? We both and in

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Speaker 1: my humble opinion, Matt Hornbuck is an excellent guest, so

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Speaker 1: it ought to be a really good conversation. Thank you

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Speaker 1: very much, Tom. Can you just let us have a

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Speaker 1: conversation now? Thank you? Um CPI is going to come

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Speaker 1: in a little bit later. It's not as if we

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Speaker 1: don't have any inflation. It's going to be north at

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Speaker 1: two per year on year you back out food and energy,

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Speaker 1: it's going to be around one seventy there the estimates

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Speaker 1: the previous number quite similar as well. Is it a

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Speaker 1: bit disingenuous to say there is no inflation in the

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Speaker 1: United States of America because we do see some, right,

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Speaker 1: we do see inflation. That's price growth, and prices are growing,

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Speaker 1: but they're just not growing uh quick as quickly as

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Speaker 1: the FED would like them too. And there's not enough evidence,

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Speaker 1: especially when you look at core PC. They're they're the

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Speaker 1: measure they anchor their two percent goal around. There's just

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Speaker 1: not enough evidence to him to them that there is

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Speaker 1: a sustained pick up in inflation. But they believe that

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Speaker 1: the recipe is there. Growth is coming in well above potential,

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Speaker 1: the unemployment rate is low, much lower than where they

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Speaker 1: think full employment is UH, and they're keeping financial conditions

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Speaker 1: very easy to encourage those inflationary pressures to build. And

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Speaker 1: that's why they have confidence that they will get two

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Speaker 1: percent some time over the medium term. Now, notice I

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Speaker 1: keep stressing the medium term for the Fed. They don't

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Speaker 1: need to see two percent now or tomorrow in order

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Speaker 1: to raise rates. They just need to be convinced that

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Speaker 1: the right UH environment is there for it to get

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Speaker 1: there over time. But the market is much too impatient

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Speaker 1: for that, and you'll not convinced that they can get

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Speaker 1: to that. No, we're not. We're not convinced. And I

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Speaker 1: tell you what the We have been doing the traditional

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Speaker 1: way of forecasting inflation for a long time. Inflation expectations

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Speaker 1: lagged values of actual inflation, trade weighted dollar, all of

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Speaker 1: the above. But we had not properly taken into account

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Speaker 1: technological effects on inflation, and when we did, it just

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Speaker 1: brings the path down that much lower. One minute, Morgan

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Speaker 1: Stanley is a claim for parsing this strange thing. Productivity.

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Speaker 1: What are you observing in the next one quarter, two quarters,

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Speaker 1: three quarters? On productivity? What are you looking for? We've

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Speaker 1: got a cyclical rise in in capex that has already

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Speaker 1: led to higher rates of productivity, and so we're looking

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Speaker 1: between one and one and a half percent one to

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Speaker 1: one and a half percent sustained in productivity. And the

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Speaker 1: story there is that you just take that in a vacuum.

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Speaker 1: It looks pretty tepid, right, but compared to about flat

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Speaker 1: for the last five to six years, I think that's

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Speaker 1: as good as it gets. And that's a pretty good story.

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Speaker 1: A cyclical pickup and productivity can stretch the cycle for longer.

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Speaker 1: Ellen Saner, thank you so much. With Morgan Stanley on

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Speaker 1: this important today. Lots of news, loan, some real shifts. Goland, okay,

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Speaker 1: let's get focused. Bank of America two d and ten

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Speaker 1: thousand employees, JP Morgan, Wells Fargo even more two d

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Speaker 1: and sixty eight thousand in City Group. It's a tiny

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Speaker 1: bank two hundred thousand as well. He's out of Kellogg

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Speaker 1: at Northwestern a real NBA program. Neil dar joins us

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Speaker 1: with p WC on financial services. What I love about

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Speaker 1: Northwestern and the legacy of it. The MIC's over there, Neil,

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Speaker 1: You've got to get close to the mic. What what

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Speaker 1: I love about Northwestern is a core curricula. If you

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Speaker 1: were to teach financial services right now within the core

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Speaker 1: curriculate Northwestaurant, what would be your number one message to

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Speaker 1: the best and brightest. There's a lot of change out there.

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Speaker 1: There's a lot of change, and we have to look

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Speaker 1: at things that are impacting the industry broadly. Uh coming

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Speaker 1: at us in a lot of different directions. Technology is

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Speaker 1: front center right. Did a panel of Davos three or

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Speaker 1: four years ago? The Third world was way ahead of

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Speaker 1: us and used to technology. What are the big countries America,

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Speaker 1: United Kingdom, Germany, et cetera. What are they doing in

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Speaker 1: the next twenty four months on technology? Well, technology, if

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Speaker 1: you if you think about it. Over the last several years,

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Speaker 1: there's been a lot of fintech activity where fintech has

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Speaker 1: been doing a number of things that now the bigger

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Speaker 1: companies are absorbing, either through acquisitions or actually just embracing it.

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Speaker 1: Fintech at times can struggle to scale um so every

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Speaker 1: element of a company, at least in financial services. What

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Speaker 1: we see across the banks, the insurers and the asset

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Speaker 1: managers are looking at front office, mid office and back

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Speaker 1: office innervation. How technology can make things um more efficient

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Speaker 1: firstly than secondly changing the customer experience. If I have

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Speaker 1: a million employees at the top five or six banks total,

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Speaker 1: how many of them are not going to be employed

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Speaker 1: at those banks in twenty four months or far more importantly,

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Speaker 1: five years. That's a great question. They've got a right

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Speaker 1: size at some point. Well, it's a great question. I mean,

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Speaker 1: what we're seeing right now is what the real impact

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Speaker 1: of digital labor is going to be. And what I

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Speaker 1: mean by digital labor is things you hear about things

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Speaker 1: like robotic and artificial intelligence, where it's making things more efficient.

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Speaker 1: We're working through right now the life cycle of how

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Speaker 1: that type of technology is going to impact the day

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Speaker 1: to day business, and then that'll get to if I

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Speaker 1: walk home to the man's okay, this is six bedrooms,

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Speaker 1: five fireplaces, three dogs, I go by eighteen banks, they're

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Speaker 1: all empty. Forget about AI, forget about robots. The old

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Speaker 1: model of banking that PwC advises them on every single

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Speaker 1: day is a dinosaur. How many bodies will go out

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Speaker 1: the door. Well, a percentage it is, it is changing dramatically.

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Speaker 1: So your point around walking home and seeing the empty answers,

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Speaker 1: we are seeing that customer experience dramatically change in relation

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Speaker 1: to UH. There was a survey that that we did

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Speaker 1: that shows fifty two percent fifty two percent of folks

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Speaker 1: are actually looking at digital banking in relation to the

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Speaker 1: way they do things on a day in and day

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Speaker 1: out basis, transferring money, um, paying bills UM. So so

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Speaker 1: you're point a spot on in relation of what is

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Speaker 1: that going to mean in relation to them? When do

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Speaker 1: I start seeing press conferences that aren't a lot of

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Speaker 1: happy talk about tax bills and use of cash and

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Speaker 1: are I'm sorry the models over? I mean, I get it,

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Speaker 1: their control management is going to be doing gradually. I

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Speaker 1: get that, But five years from now on a given

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Speaker 1: million employees, it a huge part of American banking. I

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Speaker 1: can't get a real answer on how many bodies on

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Speaker 1: a percentage basis go out the door. Well, look, I

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Speaker 1: think you're gonna have to see these business models evolve,

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Speaker 1: and as these business models evolved, we will see natural

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Speaker 1: knock on in act. So on the people's side of things,

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Speaker 1: what we're seeing at a number of our clients, uh

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Speaker 1: is folks actually embracing digital labor in relation to doing

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Speaker 1: things differently and then using their folks to actually do

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Speaker 1: things differently in relation to and UM analytics and and

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Speaker 1: actually doing a deeper dive into various things. Will that

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Speaker 1: last over time? We'll see what does it mean for mergers?

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Speaker 1: It it it the regional banks. I mean, you know

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Speaker 1: we're talking this morning. JP Morgan could barely move the needle.

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Speaker 1: They're so big. I went over the scope and scale

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Speaker 1: of trillion dollar numbers with JP Morgan. What does regionals

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Speaker 1: do to compete with this new digital labor and new technology. Well,

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Speaker 1: I think the regionals will continue to do consolidation. I

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Speaker 1: think they'll continue to sort of grow in that aspect um.

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Speaker 1: They're doing interesting things because of different size and scale.

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Speaker 1: I think the global banks just have a different footprint

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Speaker 1: and profile, so they'll probably get bigger on on on

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Speaker 1: the global stage in certain extent. Neil Dart with US

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Speaker 1: with p WCS had a financial services as well. Are

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Speaker 1: the global American banks competitive? The global American banks are

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Speaker 1: competitive in RELATIONSHIPAUS That's a message I get in London.

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Speaker 1: They are the US banks are really competitive. They are compared.

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Speaker 1: What is the distinction of a given American banker going

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Speaker 1: into a median in Poland than somebody from the other

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Speaker 1: platforms of France, Switzerland, United Kingdom. Well, it depends on

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Speaker 1: in relation to what part of the bank you're talking about.

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Speaker 1: Um but um but but yes, us banks are getting

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Speaker 1: uh they are strong and they're getting stronger. Um. I

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Speaker 1: think with a bit less regulation you'll see that these

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Speaker 1: banks become even more competitive. Um so so so it's

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Speaker 1: it's it's a good place to be right now. Now.

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Speaker 1: These banks also are going through their own evolution in

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Speaker 1: relation to sort of doing things more efficiently. Uh so,

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Speaker 1: things around cost, in relationship, constantly making things more better

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Speaker 1: in improving the experience, but also looking at how to

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Speaker 1: do um cost in a more cost effective way. What

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Speaker 1: do the banks do that are so are lost in

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Speaker 1: the cracks. They're either big but they're not too big

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Speaker 1: or there there there may be too big to be

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Speaker 1: a regional they're these I don't want to mention names,

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Speaker 1: but there's given banks worldwide where I can't figure out

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Speaker 1: what the strategic mission is because they don't have scale. Well,

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Speaker 1: certain banks playing in a very regional model UM and UM,

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Speaker 1: they will have to figure out, UM, what is their

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Speaker 1: next pass in relation to will they be able to

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Speaker 1: invest the way the bigger banks will, Will they have

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Speaker 1: the innovative culture? Uh that that a smaller fintech will

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Speaker 1: in relation to disruption? UM. So you hit a good point, Uh,

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Speaker 1: that those banks are constantly gonna have to go through

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Speaker 1: their own self assessment in relation to do we do

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Speaker 1: something dramatic from a strategy. Is that happening in America

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Speaker 1: and midsize and regional banks right now that that naval

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Speaker 1: gazing into the spring of this year. Well, uh, I

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Speaker 1: mean we're talking about banks specific spankes specifically here. I

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Speaker 1: think what we're seeing on the regional side of the

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Speaker 1: banks is um on a smaller scale many of the

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Speaker 1: other things we just talked about on a larger banks.

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Speaker 1: So the impact of digital, the impact of technology, the

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Speaker 1: impact of artificial intelligence. We saw black Rock today with

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Speaker 1: that thought baying up numbers fift dividend increase. Assets under

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Speaker 1: management is obviously the Creek key phrase three years ago,

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Speaker 1: everybody wanted to be an asset management Is that is

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Speaker 1: that over or is that trend just continue? I think

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Speaker 1: asset managers will continue to grow in relation to consolidate

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Speaker 1: like Aberdeen did. I do think you will see consolidation

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Speaker 1: in the industry in relationship, but also there's a lot

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Speaker 1: of new product that's coming out within the asset management world.

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Speaker 1: UM in relation to more and more money is chasing

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Speaker 1: yield um and I think the strong the strong will

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Speaker 1: get stronger. Uh agreed, And I think you'll see that

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Speaker 1: again through consolidation. But you've got to find a Greek

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Speaker 1: letter to have as a vogue thing for two years.

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Speaker 1: I mean, we've done Beta, We've done Alpha. Do we

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Speaker 1: need a new Greek Do they teach Greek letters at Kel?

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Speaker 1: We need a Greek letter to the Gamma fun? Him?

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Speaker 1: Are you can invest in the Gamma Fund? I don't invest,

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Speaker 1: you invest? You need money to invest, Neil. One final

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Speaker 1: question before we get you onto your Bitcoin day and

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Speaker 1: p w C Bitcoin is that the new the new

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Speaker 1: name for the company. Where does bitcoin fit into all

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Speaker 1: of your financial services consulting. There's a lot of talk owination, cryptocrapnity,

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Speaker 1: action or is it just Look, we have a lot

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Speaker 1: of discussions across the industry and rational What does this

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Speaker 1: mean in relation to regulation? What does it mean in

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Speaker 1: relation to cyber what does it mean in relation to uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, the way things are going to be done

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Speaker 1: in the future. So a lot of discussions. We'll see

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Speaker 1: how this plays out over time the answers. Nobody really knows.

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Speaker 1: I think people are figuring it out because I mean,

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Speaker 1: we saw the I P O flutter or E T

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Speaker 1: F flutter I can't remember which it was now this

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Speaker 1: week and I guess SEC came in. Is it yeah?

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Speaker 1: Maybe not well I think again, you'll we'll see regulation

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Speaker 1: around it, and I think it's developing there. Thank you

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Speaker 1: so much. The p WC and Financial Service is good

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Speaker 1: to catch up with him on a day of banking earnings.

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Speaker 1: Really fascinating to see the huge capitalization of the American banks.

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Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to the Bloomberg Surveillance podcast. Subscribe and

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Speaker 1: listen to interviews on Apple Podcasts, SoundCloud, or whichever podcast

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Speaker 1: platform you prefer. I'm on Twitter at Tom Keane before

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Speaker 1: the podcast. You can always catch us worldwide. I'm Bloomberg

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Speaker 1: Radio