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Speaker 1: It is Wednesday, October eighteen, twenty twenty three. The league

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Speaker 1: Championship Series are fully underway, and yet the Miami Marlins

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Speaker 1: found themselves as the biggest story in baseball on Monday

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Speaker 1: morning when it was announced that Kim Ang will not

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Speaker 1: return as a team's general manager in twenty twenty four.

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Speaker 1: We're gonna dissect it here again on Fish Unfiltered. I'm

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Speaker 1: your host, Isaac Zout. I'm joined by our farm director

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Speaker 1: today Alex Carver, and our founder Eli Sussman. Very special

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Speaker 1: guests that we have today, the man who broke the

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Speaker 1: kim Ang news, actually, mister Craig, Mish Craig. I know

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Speaker 1: you're busy, but thanks for taking the time.

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Speaker 2: Nonetheless, thanks for having me. It has been a wild

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Speaker 2: seventy two hours or so. I feel like I've fielded

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Speaker 2: more call and texts during this then some of the

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Speaker 2: winter stuff still going by the way. Interesting.

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Speaker 1: So just one of the last seventy two hours been like,

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Speaker 1: when did you realize something was not right here?

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Speaker 2: Yeah? I realized something was not right, as you guys

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Speaker 2: should have realized something was not right, because you guys

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Speaker 2: do a good job, but nobody seemed well. I mean,

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Speaker 2: I don't take it back. I don't think nobody seemed

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Speaker 2: but everybody seemed to sort of miss the fact that

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Speaker 2: the Marlins didn't do a year end press conference, Like

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Speaker 2: they just didn't happen. Maybe you guys did say that.

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Speaker 2: I'm sorry if you guys did say that, but if not,

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Speaker 2: shame on you. So as time started going by, I,

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Speaker 2: you know, was sort of like asking some questions like

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Speaker 2: when is this going to happen, and like wasn't really

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Speaker 2: getting a lot of response. And then, you know, as

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Speaker 2: doing this as long as I have on a lot

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Speaker 2: of different levels, late last week, you know, it sort

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Speaker 2: of occurred to me like either Kim is going to

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Speaker 2: have an extension coming here or or or maybe something

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Speaker 2: is not maybe she's not gonna be with the organization.

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Speaker 2: Like I just couldn't figure out what was going on.

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Speaker 2: So uh so that's that's kind of what happened. And

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Speaker 2: then Monday morning, Monday morning, very early, I found out

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Speaker 2: that that she, you know, had basically decided that she

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Speaker 2: was going to leave the organization. So that's that's it was.

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Speaker 2: I midweek last week, it was too weird, you know,

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Speaker 2: that they didn't talk, Like Kim didn't even say anything

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Speaker 2: end of the year. And by the way, it was

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Speaker 2: like Craig Counsel was talking and David st Or I

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Speaker 2: don't know, the Brewers GM was taught like Alexandthopoles the

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Speaker 2: season ends, the next day he's doing it. I'm like, okay,

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Speaker 2: sothing's going on here, you know, And so I was

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Speaker 2: I was right about that. And and you know, apparently

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Speaker 2: during that time there was like negotiation going on essentially,

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Speaker 2: Like that's obviously that's what was happening during that time.

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Speaker 2: So how could Kim possibly do a year end press

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Speaker 2: conference with this going on? It didn't make a lot

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Speaker 2: of sense, right, So that that was the first, my

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Speaker 2: first indication it proved to be correct.

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Speaker 3: Do you know about how long between when they made

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Speaker 3: the apparent offer to extend her and when she decided

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Speaker 3: to leave, Like how long that? How long it took

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Speaker 3: her to decide to leave?

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Speaker 2: Uh? I don't know. I don't know exactly, but I

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Speaker 2: think a few days. I'm not positive. I think it

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Speaker 2: was a few days. I don't I don't think it

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Speaker 2: was like take it or leave it in like a second.

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Speaker 2: I don't know that, but I don't think so though.

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Speaker 2: I think it was a few days.

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Speaker 4: Right, Well, I guess I'll go ahead, eyl Well, Craig,

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Speaker 4: through the reporting we've seen, and I guess through what

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Speaker 4: you've been able to gather yourself, it's kind of been

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Speaker 4: painted as a simple conflict between Kim and Bruce, a

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Speaker 4: disagreement in terms of how they want to move forward.

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Speaker 4: That's what they That's what Kim personally said in her statement.

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Speaker 4: Is it really is it that simple? Or are there

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Speaker 4: are there any other characters involved with this that we

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Speaker 4: should keep in mind? Or was this really just one

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Speaker 4: on one between these two couldn't iron out exactly where

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Speaker 4: they wanted to go forward that could keep them both

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Speaker 4: satisfied with it.

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Speaker 5: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: You know, I've said a few things on sports Grid,

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Speaker 2: and I noticed that you guys X tweeted those out

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Speaker 2: the other day. I've been pretty quiet on the subject.

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Speaker 2: I haven't done a column or anything like that, and

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Speaker 2: I don't plan too. It's a really difficult situation all around, because,

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Speaker 2: unlike the way that this has been reported, I see

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Speaker 2: both sides. I do. I don't see it as as

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Speaker 2: black and white as the way that it's been covered.

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Speaker 2: And I certainly absolutely respect every journalist. I think that

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Speaker 2: you guys and anybody else watching knows. The number one

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Speaker 2: rule that I have in journalism is I never talk

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Speaker 2: poorly about other journalists and I never comment on other

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Speaker 2: people's work. But that being said, I do think that

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Speaker 2: there is another story to tell. I don't think it's

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Speaker 2: as simple as just what transpired or for a few days,

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Speaker 2: And I think that anybody who thinks that that's really

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Speaker 2: the way that this all happened isn't really in touch

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Speaker 2: with the club, and isn't really in touch with everything

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Speaker 2: that's transpired over the last few years. That being said,

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Speaker 2: I certainly have expressed that I totally understand where Kim

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Speaker 2: is coming from. I can totally understand her wish to

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Speaker 2: either be extended or you have full and total control

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Speaker 2: of what happens in the organization. If you ask me

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Speaker 2: specific comments about other reporting, I will answer those here,

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Speaker 2: because clearly I have not reported anything, and I'm happy

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Speaker 2: to answer any questions you guys may have. But what

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Speaker 2: I would say is there were a few things that

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Speaker 2: I read that, regardless of being accurate or not, and

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Speaker 2: I'm not questioning anybody's accuracy, I thought some of it

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Speaker 2: was pretty harsh, and I thought some of it was

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Speaker 2: unfair too. There are still employees working for the Miami

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Speaker 2: Marlins that, regardless of whether Kim had a good or

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Speaker 2: bad relationship of I don't think anybody would ever want

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Speaker 2: to be in the position to have to defend themselves

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Speaker 2: from potentially being fired from an article. I I just

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Speaker 2: you know, it just really, regardless of the scenarios that

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Speaker 2: those that stuff just did not really sit well with me.

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Speaker 2: If I got access to that information, I don't know

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Speaker 2: if I would have published it or not. I'm not

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Speaker 2: blaming any anybody in terms of journalism, because again, that's

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Speaker 2: that's crazy access to inside baseball, inside a club. Maybe

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Speaker 2: I would have done it as well, I don't know,

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Speaker 2: But the whoever gave that information to UH, to the

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Speaker 2: journalists who reported it, I mean, shame on you. Like

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Speaker 2: if if I mean that that is like some some

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Speaker 2: real calling for firing type stuff, I don't know. Ali,

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Speaker 2: that just did not That particular thing just did not

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Speaker 2: it well with me, regardless probably all accurate.

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Speaker 1: Well, let me ask you something, Craig, because it seems

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Speaker 1: to me what was reported on ESPN was that Bruce

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Speaker 1: was interested in hiring a president of baseball ops. That

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Speaker 1: position had been vacant for the past six years. Actually,

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Speaker 1: when Jeter was here, he was a CEO, and that's

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Speaker 1: who can report it to. And I guess it makes

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Speaker 1: sense that he would want to replay or you know,

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Speaker 1: hire another one for that position. Was a transparency and

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Speaker 1: communication there between Bruce and Kim saying, hey, you know,

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Speaker 1: we're eventually going to have to fill that role and

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Speaker 1: it's not going to be by you. Was that, you know,

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Speaker 1: spoken about the last year or two.

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Speaker 2: I don't know that it was spoken about the past

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Speaker 2: year or two, but I think that there are a

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Speaker 2: lot of organizations that operate in that manner. And I

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Speaker 2: suppose you can ask yourself if if you are the

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Speaker 2: owner of the Marlins and this is something that you

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Speaker 2: want to do, but you want to keep your your

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Speaker 2: general manager as well. I'm speaking in hypotheticals, but you

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Speaker 2: want to speak you want to keep your general manager

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Speaker 2: as well. Because there's no question Kim did a good

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Speaker 2: job at general manager. I mean, no one could sit

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Speaker 2: here and even argue that it's it's inarguable that they

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Speaker 2: had a good year. They went to the postseason, and

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Speaker 2: you know, despite some of the signings and stuff like that,

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Speaker 2: it was made up for the trades. I'd love to

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Speaker 2: get into all that too. I think that stuff is inarguable.

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Speaker 2: But if you are the owner of the team, what

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Speaker 2: is the best course of action at that point? I

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Speaker 2: would ask you, Isaac, if you were the owner, if

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Speaker 2: you were Bruce Sherman, what would you do? Would you

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Speaker 2: tell Kim in a in a meeting that we're going

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Speaker 2: to hire a president of baseball operations? Or would you

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Speaker 2: not and just hand Kim the what is it the

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Speaker 2: mutual option? Would you hand Kim just the option, say

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Speaker 2: sign it and then hire a president of baseball operations afterward?

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Speaker 2: So I think the answer is easy on that one, right,

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Speaker 2: like you're going to say, hey, this is what this

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Speaker 2: is what I want to do. But as far as

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Speaker 2: like conversations that had previous to that, I'm not aware

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Speaker 2: of that, you know, you know, certainly, up until the

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Speaker 2: point that Kim resid, I felt I had a good

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Speaker 2: relationship with Kim, so she never expressed that to me previously.

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Speaker 2: But very clearly, I don't think that Bruce Sherman just

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Speaker 2: all of a sudden, out of nowhere, came up one

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Speaker 2: day and said, Kim, come out of see oh you

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Speaker 2: know what I'm thinking, I'm thinking I'm going to hire

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Speaker 2: a president. Obviously, this is something that has been thought

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Speaker 2: about previously. Now how long, I can't say, a week,

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Speaker 2: a month, a year, two years. I have no idea,

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Speaker 2: but I do know that the preference does seem to

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Speaker 2: be in the organization to operate like a lot of

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Speaker 2: other teams in baseball with just to have a president

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Speaker 2: and a general manager. So that's my long winded answer

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Speaker 2: to that one.

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Speaker 1: We've spoken about it Craig in the past that when

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Speaker 1: they first took over, Bruce Sherman and dert Jeater, the

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Speaker 1: ideal thing would have been to keep Michael Hill as

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Speaker 1: President of Base of Operations and have Kim Ng as

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Speaker 1: a GM. So my question is, did Bruce consider simply

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Speaker 1: promoting Kim to the president of base of Operations role

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Speaker 1: and hiring a new general manager.

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Speaker 2: I obviously that was not the case, because then maybe

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Speaker 2: at that point Kim would have accepted. I don't believe

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Speaker 2: that to be the case. I believe what has been

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Speaker 2: reported and what I know, which is that Kim was

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Speaker 2: offered a chance to remain as the general manager of

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Speaker 2: the Marlins in the same position that she was with

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Speaker 2: the contract that she had with an additional gear on it,

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Speaker 2: with full and total autonomy over handling the everyday minutia,

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Speaker 2: forty man, twenty six man, roster, trades, free agencies, and

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Speaker 2: she would handle that, and whoever else came in would

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Speaker 2: handle everything else potentially in the organization. And my also

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Speaker 2: understanding is is that if there was any difference of

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Speaker 2: opinion between whoever would have come in and Kim that

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Speaker 2: on that part of the deal, no one's going to

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Speaker 2: have complete autonomy over that. That would have had to

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Speaker 2: go up to a higher level to make that decision.

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Speaker 2: So Kim essentially has full control as the general manager,

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Speaker 2: just as she did before. That wouldn't change. But what

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Speaker 2: would change is whoever and by the way, there is

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Speaker 2: no person, but whoever this hypothetical person would be, would

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Speaker 2: come in and do all the other things. I guess

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Speaker 2: that the ownership wanted to fix or make better.

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Speaker 1: So technically it would have been a demotion, correct.

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Speaker 2: It would have been a demotion in the sense that

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Speaker 2: somebody else above her would have had a hand in

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Speaker 2: making in helping make decisions on the on some of

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Speaker 2: the roster stuff. But inevitably she still would have had

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Speaker 2: control over the roster. She still would have had that

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Speaker 2: the other So I mean technically, Isaac, I mean, I

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Speaker 2: guess so, because then there's another voice that's above her

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Speaker 2: that's weighing in. But I don't think that that person

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Speaker 2: would have. In fact, I know that person whoever would

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Speaker 2: have come in could not like overrule her on the

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Speaker 2: general manager ship of the models.

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Speaker 3: Do you think just just knowing like the history of

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Speaker 3: Kim's career here, you know, when they first got here,

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Speaker 3: like Isaac just said, You've said this before to all

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Speaker 3: of us, that it wasn't just her making the decisions, right,

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Speaker 3: that it was Greenley, and it was all these other

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Speaker 3: people that were like grouping together, like, you know, to

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Speaker 3: make the decisions that were going to be final, right,

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Speaker 3: you told us that before. So do you think just

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Speaker 3: looking at this and you know, of course after Jeter

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Speaker 3: left that change and Kim was in charge and everything else,

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Speaker 3: do you think that she thought it was like going

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Speaker 3: backwards to have somebody else that's over her to make decisions?

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Speaker 5: Is that maybe? Knowing Kim, do you think that's probably

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Speaker 5: what she thought?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm sure, I'm sure. And look, I don't know

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Speaker 2: to what value Alex and Extension played into this too.

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Speaker 2: I don't know the answer to that. Maybe it also

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Speaker 2: maybe she was expecting an extension. Maybe she was expecting

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Speaker 2: to walk into a meeting and having a paper put

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Speaker 2: in front of her that says three years and X

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Speaker 2: million to be GM. Maybe that's part of it too.

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Speaker 2: And look, nobody wants to feel in life like that

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Speaker 2: somebody's coming in over them when they feel like they've

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Speaker 2: done a good job. I think in life you have

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Speaker 2: to feel like you have self worth and you have

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Speaker 2: to know what your value is. And clearly Kim does

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Speaker 2: and should have a very high value of herself. But

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Speaker 2: you still, at the end of the day, have a boss,

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Speaker 2: not just in baseball or football or basketball. You have

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Speaker 2: one with Fish on First and I have one at

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Speaker 2: Sports Grid, and those people make the decisions based on

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Speaker 2: what they want to do. And in this case, this

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Speaker 2: is the ownership of the Miami Marlins deciding that this

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Speaker 2: is the direction that they wanted to go. Again, I

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Speaker 2: don't blame Kim for doing it and walking away from

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Speaker 2: you know, obviously as a general manager potentially a lot

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Speaker 2: of money as well. Will just have to see for

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Speaker 2: the Marlins and for Kim, by the way, if this

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Speaker 2: was the proper decision in the end, because I would

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Speaker 2: assume that Kim will be a general manager again in

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Speaker 2: Major League Baseball. I'm sure that James Klick, who got

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Speaker 2: fired from the Houston Astros, assumes that he will be

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Speaker 2: a general manager in Major League Baseball again. And it's

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Speaker 2: not in apples and oranges conversation. There's only a certain

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Speaker 2: amount of these jobs. And when you have them and

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Speaker 2: you choose to leave them and you don't have another

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Speaker 2: job waiting for you, that's the risk that you take

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Speaker 2: when you leave. So we will see in the end

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Speaker 2: how the Marlins perform without Kim, and we'll see Kim

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Speaker 2: inevitably at some point become an executive and baseball general manager,

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Speaker 2: I'm sure again. And we'll see her how she does

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Speaker 2: in that new role, whatever that ends up being, because

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Speaker 2: she will, she'll, she will, You'll clearly end up at

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Speaker 2: some point, as I would think, as a general manager again.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, well, I guess the next question would we can

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Speaker 1: touch on possible candidates.

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Speaker 4: To oh, I want to go to something before we

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Speaker 4: get there the search because in the interim assistant GM

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Speaker 4: Brian Chad, and he's now the instaim GM. And if

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Speaker 4: we assume we'll get into the search, and if it's

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Speaker 4: going to be a broad search, then there will be

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Speaker 4: some sort of things on an interim basis that he'll

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Speaker 4: have to make decisions on while the off season gets

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Speaker 4: under way. I don't think people realize, Craig how long

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Speaker 4: Brian Chadden has been in the organization, Like he has

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Speaker 4: endured from the previous ownership, through the Jeter era, through

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Speaker 4: at least for the moment, through this transition as well.

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Speaker 4: And now he's one of three assistant gms. He over

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Speaker 4: Greenley and over OsO Campbell. He's the one that has

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Speaker 4: this interim title. Do into one like how he's survived

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Speaker 4: all this turnover that everybody else has not, and what

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Speaker 4: exactly he brings to the table.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, no, that's a that's a really good question. So

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Speaker 2: you know, Brian is a collaborator, he's a communicator. He's

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Speaker 2: extremely well liked for decades within the organization. He's also

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Speaker 2: very good with the rules of Major League Baseball and

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Speaker 2: the transactions and sort of you know, making sure that

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Speaker 2: everything is operating. So I'm I'm not surprised that this

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Speaker 2: is the direction that the Marlins chose to go. I

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Speaker 2: also do want to be very clear here that while

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Speaker 2: he is the acting general manager. Make no mistake about it,

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Speaker 2: there's going to be somebody that's going to come in

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Speaker 2: and immediately become the President of Baseball Operations to take

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Speaker 2: total control. So that's going to happen. The second thing

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Speaker 2: that I would say is Dan Greenlee is there, Ozo

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Speaker 2: Campo is there. They have a lot of very capable

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Speaker 2: people in the organization that remain, and collaboration may not

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Speaker 2: even be the correct word for it. It's going to

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Speaker 2: be a massive collaboration for all of them to put

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Speaker 2: their heads together to get arbitration figured out, and to

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Speaker 2: get some of the offseason figured out. The opt outs.

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Speaker 2: I'm sure that's going to be a very interesting topic.

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Speaker 2: I don't know if they will have somebody in place

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Speaker 2: for the winter meetings. I certainly would think, but you know,

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Speaker 2: I can't guarantee. I don't you know. Again, this sort

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Speaker 2: of caught me by surprise too. But I think I

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Speaker 2: don't know what a fair timeline is. I know that

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Speaker 2: will be the next question. I don't know. Is it

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Speaker 2: a month, is it two months? It just depends on

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Speaker 2: how the search goes and who they inevitably decide to

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Speaker 2: choose to choose.

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Speaker 1: What does this mean for Skip Schumacher.

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Speaker 2: Well, it it. I mean, look, there's no question that

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Speaker 2: Skip and Kim had a very collaborative relationship, and you know,

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Speaker 2: Skip publicly has said so many times how much he's

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Speaker 2: appreciated Kim and her leadership and just him being able

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Speaker 2: to operate the clubhouse and operate the team and not

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Speaker 2: have a lot of influx, a lot of meddling going on,

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Speaker 2: which sometimes can happen with a general manager and manager. Skip.

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Speaker 2: I think in the end, when the smoke clears, I

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Speaker 2: think everything will move forward. I can imagine naturally, when

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Speaker 2: something like this happens and you lose somebody that's a

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Speaker 2: confidant or somebody that is inevitably your friend, it's going

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Speaker 2: to be a tough transition at the beginning. But you know, Skip,

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Speaker 2: I would I mean, nothing in the ever life is

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Speaker 2: a guarantee, but I would ninety nine point nine nine

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Speaker 2: nine nine percent guarantee that Skip will be the manager

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Speaker 2: next year. I would almost guarantee if he wants to

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Speaker 2: be the manager of the Marlins, that he'll have his

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Speaker 2: chance to be the manager in the future with the

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Speaker 2: Marlins too. But oh, look, naturally, that's not that's not

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Speaker 2: a question for now, it's a question for the future

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Speaker 2: as well. But you know, certainly I feel for Skip.

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Speaker 2: I thought he had a great year managing the club

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Speaker 2: and then all of a sudden there's a shock to

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Speaker 2: the system in the organization. But in the end, guys,

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Speaker 2: we've seen this happen in baseball so many times, and

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Speaker 2: it just ends and then new things happened. And I mean,

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Speaker 2: we spent so little time talking about the departure of

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Speaker 2: Mike Hill, and we were just like, hey, Kimming, you know,

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Speaker 2: like I mean, do we want to go back there

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Speaker 2: and remember that time and everything that happened like right

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Speaker 2: after that too. It was really not pretty. And I

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Speaker 2: feel like that kind of gets lost in this whole

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Speaker 2: conversation how the outrage is like insane right now. Yet

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Speaker 2: the same exact thing happened when Mike Hill made the

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Speaker 2: postseason and it just was like widely accepted that this

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Speaker 2: is okay to do. It's it's perfectly fine to stop

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Speaker 2: the train after the playoffs. Let's bring in a brand

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Speaker 2: new general manager who you know clearly, you know, qualify

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Speaker 2: for the job, and all those really good things and

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Speaker 2: breaking history in terms of being the first woman to

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Speaker 2: ever be a general manager, first Asian American, no question,

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Speaker 2: but also had not been in a front office in

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Speaker 2: ten years. Let's do this, Let's let's just drop her

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Speaker 2: in and let her run and just see what happens.

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Speaker 2: And what was the result of the Marlins the first

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Speaker 2: two years? A lot of crap, it was. It was

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Speaker 2: not pretty for the first couple of years. This is

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Speaker 2: non indictment on Kim I'm just the reality is they

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Speaker 2: lost so many games in twenty twenty one, in twenty

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Speaker 2: twenty two, and it's like, we don't even this discuss

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Speaker 2: that where is that piece? Are we really gonna miss

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Speaker 2: the real story here that everybody is missing. The best

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Speaker 2: story of all is that Kim Eng broke every barrier

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Speaker 2: in the world and this became a national story and

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Speaker 2: it's awesome and it's amazing, and she has paved the

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Speaker 2: way for people all over the world to do things

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Speaker 2: they never could. But nobody talks about the story of

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Speaker 2: her coming in and just being like, holy bleep, what

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Speaker 2: am I gonna do? I'm now the GM of the

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Speaker 2: Marlins and going from that to where she is now

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Speaker 2: being doing such a great job. I mean, nobody even

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Speaker 2: has a clue what went on that first year that

385
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Speaker 2: Kim was the general manager of the Marlins. She whether

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Speaker 2: or not she would admit it, I have no idea.

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Speaker 2: She was not prepared at that moment to be the

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Speaker 2: general manager of the Marlins, to walk in and have

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Speaker 2: Derek Jeter, who had never been a GM in his

390
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Speaker 2: life be her boss, and Gary denbo who she couldn't

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Speaker 2: get along with if he had never been in a

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Speaker 2: position like that before. And yet you go ahead and

393
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Speaker 2: you be the GM, and go ahead and do all

394
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Speaker 2: these things like who could ever be prepared for that?

395
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Speaker 2: So why was it such a shock that the Marlins

396
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Speaker 2: were just brutal for twenty twenty one and twenty twenty two.

397
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Speaker 2: Wasn't broke out of it in twenty three without a

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Speaker 2: doubt thanks in part to Kim, no question. But I

399
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Speaker 2: think the story is how you go from not just

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Speaker 2: as a woman, an Asian American woman, how you go

401
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Speaker 2: from being so in a spot where you are wide eyed,

402
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Speaker 2: haven't been in a front office in ten years? Oh

403
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Speaker 2: my gosh, I'm the GM. Let me just not mess

404
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Speaker 2: anything up that's been happening to now give me total

405
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Speaker 2: control of the organization. I mean that, that to me

406
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Speaker 2: is the baseball story that is the most incredible story

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Speaker 2: of all that is.

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Speaker 1: The other side of it, and I agree. I think

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Speaker 1: the one difference when it was Hill, the one that

410
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Speaker 1: was not brought back, was that it was always expected

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Speaker 1: that he was going to be gone eventually. They were

412
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Speaker 1: just read that contract from the previous regime, but nobody

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Speaker 1: expected anyone from that regime to continue to continue on

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Speaker 1: with Sherman and Jeter. So I guess that's the one

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Speaker 1: difference I could see.

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Speaker 2: But you're a right, that is I don't I don't

417
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Speaker 2: know that I see it that way. Mike Kill had

418
00:22:12,800 --> 00:22:16,080
Speaker 2: been with the organization organization for twenty some odd years

419
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Speaker 2: just because just because Derek Jeter in the moment didn't

420
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Speaker 2: like what Mike Hill had to say, he decided that

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Speaker 2: that that I'm gonna just let him go and I'm

422
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Speaker 2: just gonna bring in somebody else, not interview anybody else

423
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Speaker 2: at all for the job, and just let me just

424
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Speaker 2: you know, call somebody. What do you think, Okay, great,

425
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Speaker 2: this is this is the person. And then you're gonna

426
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Speaker 2: you're gonna you're gonna work for me. I'm gonna be

427
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Speaker 2: the one that's in charge making all the trades to

428
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Speaker 2: do everything else, what's your experience? I got none to

429
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Speaker 2: This is gonna be awesome. I mean, what did people

430
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Speaker 2: what did people think was gonna happen? So we were

431
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Speaker 2: celebrating it at the time for the right reasons, and

432
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Speaker 2: the right reasons were Kim Kimming changed the world. I mean,

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Speaker 2: Kim Ming changed things that nobody else can and Derek

434
00:22:53,080 --> 00:22:56,120
Speaker 2: Jeter is responsible for that, There's no question. But Derek

435
00:22:56,160 --> 00:22:59,159
Speaker 2: Jeter's responsibility to the world was more important than his

436
00:22:59,200 --> 00:23:03,960
Speaker 2: responsibility to the And here we are, and that's that's

437
00:23:03,960 --> 00:23:08,480
Speaker 2: the dynamic that is really the story after all these years.

438
00:23:09,840 --> 00:23:13,199
Speaker 4: Yeah, well as you touch you touched on there that

439
00:23:13,240 --> 00:23:15,640
Speaker 4: I think is going to be critical to this, even

440
00:23:15,640 --> 00:23:18,400
Speaker 4: though I am I'm not satisfied with what the Marlins

441
00:23:18,400 --> 00:23:20,480
Speaker 4: did here and what Bruce did here. Ultimately it's a

442
00:23:20,480 --> 00:23:23,920
Speaker 4: matter of who comes in next. We don't It could

443
00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:26,400
Speaker 4: be could be a wide variety people, could be another woman,

444
00:23:26,440 --> 00:23:28,520
Speaker 4: It could be another person that has even more baseball

445
00:23:28,560 --> 00:23:30,680
Speaker 4: experience than Kim. We just don't know at this stage.

446
00:23:31,000 --> 00:23:33,560
Speaker 4: So I mean, as long as it is an extensive

447
00:23:33,640 --> 00:23:35,919
Speaker 4: search process, as long as they are thorough with it,

448
00:23:36,000 --> 00:23:38,560
Speaker 4: as long as they get cooperation, hopefully from a lot

449
00:23:38,600 --> 00:23:42,000
Speaker 4: of the best candidates out there. That's going to be

450
00:23:42,200 --> 00:23:45,080
Speaker 4: pretty crucial to me. As you said with in Kim's case,

451
00:23:45,480 --> 00:23:48,720
Speaker 4: she was hand picked by Jeter, she was Jeter reached out,

452
00:23:48,800 --> 00:23:52,560
Speaker 4: Jeter brings her in, and even though it was it

453
00:23:52,600 --> 00:23:54,800
Speaker 4: was a really thrilling moment and proved to be a

454
00:23:54,840 --> 00:23:56,760
Speaker 4: big difference, you know, that is that's not the ideal

455
00:23:56,760 --> 00:23:59,080
Speaker 4: way to do things. You want to be as as

456
00:23:59,119 --> 00:24:02,159
Speaker 4: thorough as possible right now, especially if Bruce's position is

457
00:24:02,160 --> 00:24:05,160
Speaker 4: that there were pretty deep issues with what player development

458
00:24:05,200 --> 00:24:08,080
Speaker 4: with amateur drafting, Like, as long as it is a

459
00:24:08,080 --> 00:24:12,200
Speaker 4: thorough process, that's going to be a lot more important

460
00:24:12,240 --> 00:24:13,880
Speaker 4: this summer around in my opinion.

461
00:24:15,080 --> 00:24:17,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean there's no argument. I mean it is.

462
00:24:17,840 --> 00:24:21,120
Speaker 2: It is now all on the ownership to get this right.

463
00:24:21,600 --> 00:24:24,680
Speaker 2: There's no there's no path, you know. Now, it's all

464
00:24:24,760 --> 00:24:27,080
Speaker 2: it's all now new, Like there's no like looking back

465
00:24:27,119 --> 00:24:28,920
Speaker 2: and saying, oh, is this person's falter or is that

466
00:24:29,080 --> 00:24:30,840
Speaker 2: person's falter? I didn't like this. I mean it is

467
00:24:30,840 --> 00:24:33,760
Speaker 2: all now fresh and new. The slate is clean more

468
00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:37,480
Speaker 2: more or less, the slate is clean. So yeah, so

469
00:24:37,920 --> 00:24:41,159
Speaker 2: whoever this new president is is has to come in

470
00:24:41,200 --> 00:24:43,560
Speaker 2: and fit the mold for the way that the ownership

471
00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:45,480
Speaker 2: wants things to be done. So they so you like

472
00:24:45,640 --> 00:24:49,680
Speaker 2: they have they absolutely have to get it right. And

473
00:24:49,680 --> 00:24:51,760
Speaker 2: and yeah, and listen, you know, I saw some of

474
00:24:51,800 --> 00:24:55,760
Speaker 2: your comments. And look, everybody is entitled to their opinion

475
00:24:55,880 --> 00:24:57,720
Speaker 2: as to you know, have this went down. I have

476
00:24:57,760 --> 00:25:01,280
Speaker 2: a more measured approach to it, maybe because I know

477
00:25:01,359 --> 00:25:05,719
Speaker 2: more than most of the whole situation, and I certainly

478
00:25:05,800 --> 00:25:09,600
Speaker 2: understand that everybody should have an opinion. I just think that,

479
00:25:11,240 --> 00:25:13,959
Speaker 2: you know, a lot happens over the course of several years.

480
00:25:14,400 --> 00:25:17,480
Speaker 2: It's not all about just two or three days. It's

481
00:25:17,560 --> 00:25:20,560
Speaker 2: not all about just one season. And I think I've

482
00:25:20,600 --> 00:25:23,200
Speaker 2: made it perfectly clear, and I'll do it again. Kim

483
00:25:23,280 --> 00:25:26,400
Speaker 2: can be the GM of any team in Major League Baseball.

484
00:25:26,480 --> 00:25:29,679
Speaker 2: She's proven it this year. She's proven it. But just

485
00:25:29,720 --> 00:25:34,080
Speaker 2: because that is the case, it enables her to feel

486
00:25:34,080 --> 00:25:36,960
Speaker 2: a certain way about things. But it doesn't guarantee you

487
00:25:37,040 --> 00:25:40,000
Speaker 2: anything in life. You can feel bad, you can feel slighted.

488
00:25:40,240 --> 00:25:43,120
Speaker 2: It's happened to me too. One time. Let me tell

489
00:25:43,119 --> 00:25:45,880
Speaker 2: you a story. One time I was working at Sirius

490
00:25:46,160 --> 00:25:49,720
Speaker 2: XM and I got a call from another company. I

491
00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:51,159
Speaker 2: don't know why. I'm going to leave their name out

492
00:25:51,200 --> 00:25:52,520
Speaker 2: of it. But I'm going to leave their name out

493
00:25:52,520 --> 00:25:54,680
Speaker 2: of it. I got a call from another company. They

494
00:25:54,720 --> 00:25:57,960
Speaker 2: wanted me to come in and they wanted me to

495
00:25:58,640 --> 00:26:02,280
Speaker 2: do their fantasy content for baseball. So we negotiated this

496
00:26:02,320 --> 00:26:04,480
Speaker 2: whole deal. We negotiated contract. I had to go to

497
00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:07,320
Speaker 2: Serious XM. I had to get them to waive my

498
00:26:08,640 --> 00:26:10,920
Speaker 2: non compete. You know, we want you. We want you

499
00:26:10,960 --> 00:26:12,399
Speaker 2: to lead the whole thing or the whole thing, right.

500
00:26:12,440 --> 00:26:14,960
Speaker 2: We want you to do this and you know the

501
00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:17,800
Speaker 2: you know, the assistant to the ball. Here's your contract.

502
00:26:17,920 --> 00:26:21,439
Speaker 2: I got emails. Here's the money. Sounds good. Sent the

503
00:26:21,480 --> 00:26:24,679
Speaker 2: equipment to the place. Here's where I'm gonna do the shows.

504
00:26:25,200 --> 00:26:29,720
Speaker 2: Day before I start. Other boss calls, cannot hire you

505
00:26:30,880 --> 00:26:34,320
Speaker 2: what I've already been hired. You said I was amazing,

506
00:26:34,359 --> 00:26:36,240
Speaker 2: You said I did a great job. What are you

507
00:26:36,280 --> 00:26:39,960
Speaker 2: talking about? Well, somebody else says that you know that

508
00:26:40,080 --> 00:26:42,119
Speaker 2: we can't do it, So I'm sorry, But what do

509
00:26:42,119 --> 00:26:44,159
Speaker 2: you mean? I thought I was and you know we

510
00:26:44,280 --> 00:26:46,280
Speaker 2: I mean guys, we were gonna have a party at

511
00:26:46,320 --> 00:26:48,560
Speaker 2: my house to celebrate this with my family. A KK,

512
00:26:48,720 --> 00:26:52,440
Speaker 2: congratulations on your new job. Whatever. There's no lower feeling

513
00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:56,040
Speaker 2: than being thought in terms of self worth, how great

514
00:26:56,080 --> 00:26:59,399
Speaker 2: you think you are, to have somebody else essentially tell you,

515
00:26:59,440 --> 00:27:01,720
Speaker 2: we do think you are great. We think you're awesome,

516
00:27:02,480 --> 00:27:05,960
Speaker 2: but not as awesome as you think you are. And

517
00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:08,560
Speaker 2: this is what life is about. And so it's just

518
00:27:08,640 --> 00:27:11,200
Speaker 2: how you bounce back from that. In Kim's choice, hey

519
00:27:11,200 --> 00:27:14,439
Speaker 2: I'm gonna walk away from this loot from this job,

520
00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:17,520
Speaker 2: and I'm going to show these people that I am

521
00:27:17,600 --> 00:27:19,240
Speaker 2: worth what I think I am, and I'm gonna go

522
00:27:19,280 --> 00:27:22,200
Speaker 2: do it somewhere else, well within her right, also well

523
00:27:22,200 --> 00:27:25,200
Speaker 2: within the right for the team and the owner who's

524
00:27:25,200 --> 00:27:28,120
Speaker 2: got billions of dollars to say, hey, I own team.

525
00:27:28,320 --> 00:27:30,159
Speaker 2: This is the way that I want to operate. So

526
00:27:30,320 --> 00:27:33,520
Speaker 2: I just don't understand why people don't get that. I mean,

527
00:27:33,520 --> 00:27:36,440
Speaker 2: this is what life is about. Life isn't always fair.

528
00:27:36,800 --> 00:27:41,040
Speaker 2: Life mostly sucks, but you find a way to get

529
00:27:41,119 --> 00:27:44,280
Speaker 2: over the bad parts. You turn a negative into a positive.

530
00:27:44,440 --> 00:27:47,719
Speaker 2: And in both cases, Kim Eng and the Miami Marlins

531
00:27:47,760 --> 00:27:50,040
Speaker 2: are going to go about their separate ways, and one

532
00:27:50,080 --> 00:27:52,240
Speaker 2: side's gonna say I'll show you. The other side is

533
00:27:52,280 --> 00:27:54,200
Speaker 2: gonna say i'll show you. And in a few years,

534
00:27:54,240 --> 00:27:57,360
Speaker 2: we will come back and we'll evaluate how it worked out.

535
00:27:57,840 --> 00:28:00,800
Speaker 1: So what changed in the last two years of Kim

536
00:28:01,080 --> 00:28:03,680
Speaker 1: having full control? And she obviously, you know, the last

537
00:28:03,720 --> 00:28:05,480
Speaker 1: two years were really bad. This year was great. But

538
00:28:05,520 --> 00:28:07,480
Speaker 1: what changed this year that they wanted to get a

539
00:28:07,480 --> 00:28:08,359
Speaker 1: president of basil Ops?

540
00:28:08,480 --> 00:28:08,640
Speaker 4: Now?

541
00:28:08,920 --> 00:28:11,480
Speaker 1: Why not when Jeter left? Obviously? I think he was

542
00:28:11,520 --> 00:28:13,399
Speaker 1: no experience either. I think they should have had once

543
00:28:13,440 --> 00:28:15,280
Speaker 1: with him here, but especially with him gone, there was

544
00:28:15,320 --> 00:28:17,679
Speaker 1: no one for Kim to report to besides Brewce Sherman.

545
00:28:17,960 --> 00:28:20,040
Speaker 1: Why does he want someone now, Isaac?

546
00:28:20,040 --> 00:28:21,840
Speaker 2: How do we know at that very moment that was

547
00:28:21,880 --> 00:28:24,000
Speaker 2: that decision wasn't made right there? We don't know. It

548
00:28:24,000 --> 00:28:25,600
Speaker 2: could have been. It just took this long to get

549
00:28:25,640 --> 00:28:27,520
Speaker 2: to it. It's very possible. I don't know the answer

550
00:28:27,520 --> 00:28:29,080
Speaker 2: to it. It could have happened a year. It could

551
00:28:29,119 --> 00:28:32,159
Speaker 2: have happened six months ago. I don't know the answer

552
00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:32,399
Speaker 2: to that.

553
00:28:32,480 --> 00:28:36,280
Speaker 1: When it after a playoff appearance? What's that taken after

554
00:28:36,320 --> 00:28:38,760
Speaker 1: a playoff appearance? Isn't that strange timing?

555
00:28:39,520 --> 00:28:43,320
Speaker 2: Well, obviously the decision wasn't made two days before they

556
00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:49,400
Speaker 2: Bruce Sherman spoke to Kim clearly right, I mean it doesn't.

557
00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:52,200
Speaker 2: I mean, I mean, Isaac, you're smart. I mean obviously

558
00:28:52,240 --> 00:28:55,560
Speaker 2: not right like I mean, if that's the case, the

559
00:28:55,560 --> 00:28:57,840
Speaker 2: decision was clearly made before then, but I cannot tell

560
00:28:57,880 --> 00:28:59,760
Speaker 2: you when. I don't know was it a week or

561
00:28:59,760 --> 00:29:02,240
Speaker 2: two or a month or a year. I have no idea.

562
00:29:02,320 --> 00:29:06,440
Speaker 2: But the idea clearly was to bring in somebody to

563
00:29:06,600 --> 00:29:10,640
Speaker 2: oversee the parts of the organization that needed to be

564
00:29:10,680 --> 00:29:15,640
Speaker 2: stepped up. And that and and and guys, I mean,

565
00:29:15,680 --> 00:29:20,320
Speaker 2: Barry had it in his column today. Okay, it's very important.

566
00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:24,320
Speaker 2: And I said this on Sportscrid two. I'm sorry to say.

567
00:29:24,320 --> 00:29:26,360
Speaker 2: The Marlins are never gonna have a three hundred million

568
00:29:26,360 --> 00:29:29,280
Speaker 2: dollar payroll. It's never gonna happen. Okay, it is never

569
00:29:29,320 --> 00:29:32,920
Speaker 2: gonna happen. I don't think it ever will happen. There

570
00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:38,320
Speaker 2: must be players from the minor leagues that are drafted,

571
00:29:39,080 --> 00:29:42,480
Speaker 2: and players that they spend some money internationally that play

572
00:29:43,120 --> 00:29:49,360
Speaker 2: for the Marlins. This cannot be every year. You know, hey, guys,

573
00:29:50,240 --> 00:29:53,080
Speaker 2: drop back, throw a pass, well, Johnny Puerto, all right, great,

574
00:29:53,080 --> 00:29:56,800
Speaker 2: ten million. Hey, let's get Jeeves a girl, great, avisel Garcia,

575
00:29:56,880 --> 00:29:59,720
Speaker 2: let's try you fifty million. It cannot be like this

576
00:30:00,400 --> 00:30:04,160
Speaker 2: and they had not one player in this year's Opening

577
00:30:04,240 --> 00:30:09,120
Speaker 2: Days starting lineup that was drafted by them or signed internationally.

578
00:30:09,480 --> 00:30:13,040
Speaker 2: Not one, not a single one. Is there any other

579
00:30:13,040 --> 00:30:15,600
Speaker 2: team in Major League Baseball that operates like this? I

580
00:30:15,640 --> 00:30:18,920
Speaker 2: don't think so. I don't think so. That's not Kim's fault.

581
00:30:19,120 --> 00:30:23,200
Speaker 2: It's just the reality of where they're at that must change.

582
00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:27,760
Speaker 2: They have to get players who are being developed properly

583
00:30:27,840 --> 00:30:29,239
Speaker 2: in the right way. I mean, I don't know what

584
00:30:29,320 --> 00:30:31,160
Speaker 2: is going on with this player development here. You know,

585
00:30:31,200 --> 00:30:33,520
Speaker 2: pitchers have obviously been pretty good, but what have they

586
00:30:33,520 --> 00:30:35,520
Speaker 2: had to do. Let's take Pabo Lopez, Let's trade him.

587
00:30:35,640 --> 00:30:38,000
Speaker 2: Let's take Zach Out Okay, let's trade him. Like who's next,

588
00:30:38,080 --> 00:30:40,200
Speaker 2: Jake Eater? Okay, let's trade him too. I mean, this

589
00:30:40,240 --> 00:30:43,200
Speaker 2: is not a sustainable way to run a business, just

590
00:30:43,240 --> 00:30:45,160
Speaker 2: trading away all the guys that you think that could

591
00:30:45,200 --> 00:30:47,840
Speaker 2: be good in the farm system, Max byre Oh, Brandon

592
00:30:47,880 --> 00:30:50,760
Speaker 2: marsh he looks good, Let's trade him. I mean literally,

593
00:30:50,800 --> 00:30:52,520
Speaker 2: this is what's happening in order for them to field

594
00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:54,840
Speaker 2: the team, get to the deadline. Oh what do we do?

595
00:30:54,920 --> 00:30:58,040
Speaker 2: Let's get Josh Bell. You think that they can pull

596
00:30:58,040 --> 00:31:00,320
Speaker 2: that off again? Next year. Oh, let's just make more trades.

597
00:31:00,360 --> 00:31:02,000
Speaker 2: All this good. Let's let's put Kim in the same

598
00:31:02,000 --> 00:31:04,000
Speaker 2: spot here. Hey, Kim, go ahead and fix all the

599
00:31:04,000 --> 00:31:06,000
Speaker 2: problems again two years in a row. Go trade all

600
00:31:06,000 --> 00:31:08,680
Speaker 2: the prospects that you have that that were drafted, and

601
00:31:08,800 --> 00:31:10,840
Speaker 2: go get us some guys that could get us into

602
00:31:10,840 --> 00:31:13,680
Speaker 2: the postseason. Seems easy to do, right, I don't think so?

603
00:31:13,680 --> 00:31:16,680
Speaker 3: So So how much different? Obviously it's probably gonna be

604
00:31:16,680 --> 00:31:19,480
Speaker 3: different pretty quickly. How much different do you think this

605
00:31:19,560 --> 00:31:21,840
Speaker 3: offseason looks with whoever's going to take this job? How

606
00:31:21,920 --> 00:31:24,600
Speaker 3: much different do you think this offseason looks than next

607
00:31:24,640 --> 00:31:28,320
Speaker 3: offseason or then past offseason? Sorry, And as a follow

608
00:31:28,360 --> 00:31:32,920
Speaker 3: up to that, who in this player development system? You're

609
00:31:32,920 --> 00:31:35,000
Speaker 3: probably gonna say say, like, but who in this player

610
00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:39,480
Speaker 3: development system is also a candidate to be replaced as well?

611
00:31:40,440 --> 00:31:43,479
Speaker 2: Obviously I'm not gonna do that, Alex. I'm not. I'm

612
00:31:43,520 --> 00:31:45,480
Speaker 2: not gonna I'm not gonna do people who are going

613
00:31:45,560 --> 00:31:47,520
Speaker 2: to be fired on this that that that I'm not

614
00:31:47,520 --> 00:31:51,440
Speaker 2: gonna do. But look the the the of the off

615
00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:55,520
Speaker 2: season in terms of free agent signings, I don't I

616
00:31:55,600 --> 00:31:58,000
Speaker 2: don't think that they're going to just stop with the

617
00:31:58,040 --> 00:32:02,960
Speaker 2: progress that they made, but the track record of not

618
00:32:03,040 --> 00:32:07,920
Speaker 2: just Kim, the organization in recent years of signing players

619
00:32:07,920 --> 00:32:11,280
Speaker 2: to multi year contracts has not gone well. I would

620
00:32:11,320 --> 00:32:15,080
Speaker 2: be very surprised if they go down that road again.

621
00:32:15,280 --> 00:32:17,160
Speaker 2: I mean, I could absolutely see somebody getting a two

622
00:32:17,200 --> 00:32:19,160
Speaker 2: year deal like that. I could see. I could see

623
00:32:19,160 --> 00:32:21,480
Speaker 2: them going back to try to get Josh Bell again. Yeah,

624
00:32:21,480 --> 00:32:24,200
Speaker 2: I mean I absolutely could see that stuff. I just

625
00:32:24,280 --> 00:32:29,840
Speaker 2: don't see this offseason somebody coming in and saying, yeah,

626
00:32:29,880 --> 00:32:31,520
Speaker 2: you know, you know what the answer is, let's give

627
00:32:31,560 --> 00:32:34,240
Speaker 2: another avicel Garcia contract out to somebody else four years,

628
00:32:34,280 --> 00:32:37,280
Speaker 2: sixty millions some I personally don't see that happening. I

629
00:32:37,280 --> 00:32:38,720
Speaker 2: don't know what their payroll figure is going to be.

630
00:32:38,760 --> 00:32:41,520
Speaker 2: I have no idea. Probably a story for a later day,

631
00:32:41,560 --> 00:32:45,000
Speaker 2: but very clearly, you know, another element of the organization

632
00:32:45,160 --> 00:32:47,240
Speaker 2: that I mean, it's not a mistake, but you know,

633
00:32:47,240 --> 00:32:48,440
Speaker 2: we got to call it what it is. They got

634
00:32:48,480 --> 00:32:51,080
Speaker 2: way too many arbitration eligible players and that and no

635
00:32:51,120 --> 00:32:52,440
Speaker 2: one's going to look at that and say that the

636
00:32:52,440 --> 00:32:54,719
Speaker 2: Marlins are spending money, but in the reality they are,

637
00:32:54,760 --> 00:32:57,520
Speaker 2: They're gonna be giving out a lot of money in arbitration.

638
00:32:58,120 --> 00:33:01,600
Speaker 2: This offseason. They have, you know, a dead contract in

639
00:33:01,920 --> 00:33:08,160
Speaker 2: Avid Garcia. They have unfortunately a one dead year contract

640
00:33:08,000 --> 00:33:10,959
Speaker 2: in Sandy. I mean, these are all things that they

641
00:33:10,960 --> 00:33:12,760
Speaker 2: are going to be. It has to be factored in

642
00:33:13,240 --> 00:33:14,200
Speaker 2: going into next year.

643
00:33:15,840 --> 00:33:18,360
Speaker 1: I guess now we could sort of touch on some candidates.

644
00:33:18,360 --> 00:33:21,400
Speaker 1: Do you think do you see them promoting from within,

645
00:33:21,640 --> 00:33:23,720
Speaker 1: first of all, to either the GM or President of

646
00:33:23,720 --> 00:33:27,000
Speaker 1: Baseball Operations to burn whether it's Oz or Greenley or

647
00:33:27,560 --> 00:33:28,200
Speaker 1: anywhere else.

648
00:33:28,600 --> 00:33:31,040
Speaker 2: My only thing could be I don't know the answer.

649
00:33:31,080 --> 00:33:33,240
Speaker 2: My opinion would be no. My opinion is they go

650
00:33:33,280 --> 00:33:36,080
Speaker 2: outside the organization. That's my opinion only, Okay.

651
00:33:36,200 --> 00:33:38,080
Speaker 1: And then the next thing we want to touch on is,

652
00:33:38,080 --> 00:33:40,400
Speaker 1: you know our good old friend David Samson. Nothing personal

653
00:33:40,400 --> 00:33:43,080
Speaker 1: with David Samson. He mentioned he was he really advocated

654
00:33:43,120 --> 00:33:45,880
Speaker 1: for Michael Hill, who is obviously vice president of on

655
00:33:45,920 --> 00:33:49,280
Speaker 1: field Operations for Major League Baseball. I think that's perfect candidate.

656
00:33:49,280 --> 00:33:52,960
Speaker 1: I've already asked you, is in the realm of possibilities?

657
00:33:54,560 --> 00:33:57,920
Speaker 2: Mike and I have known each other for I don't know,

658
00:33:58,280 --> 00:34:00,520
Speaker 2: I mean, is it thirty year? I think I've known

659
00:34:00,560 --> 00:34:02,480
Speaker 2: Mike thirty years. I don't think Mike's going to be

660
00:34:02,520 --> 00:34:05,840
Speaker 2: the president of the Marlins. But I do. But I

661
00:34:05,840 --> 00:34:08,040
Speaker 2: do love Mike, and I think Mike loves me. But

662
00:34:08,120 --> 00:34:09,759
Speaker 2: I don't think he's gonna end up being president of

663
00:34:09,760 --> 00:34:11,960
Speaker 2: the mark It just just my thought. I don't I

664
00:34:12,000 --> 00:34:16,560
Speaker 2: don't think so. But nothing against Mike. Mike never should

665
00:34:16,560 --> 00:34:20,680
Speaker 2: have been Mike never never ever, ever, ever, ever ever

666
00:34:20,760 --> 00:34:24,160
Speaker 2: ever from the movie Friday, ever ever, ever, ever, ever

667
00:34:24,200 --> 00:34:28,080
Speaker 2: ever should have been fired by Derreck je never should

668
00:34:28,080 --> 00:34:31,320
Speaker 2: have happened this, you know. I mean, listen, if bringing

669
00:34:31,400 --> 00:34:33,240
Speaker 2: Kim was great, maybe they could have brought in Kim,

670
00:34:33,400 --> 00:34:35,799
Speaker 2: you know, to work with Mike, or maybe her being dead,

671
00:34:35,840 --> 00:34:38,240
Speaker 2: I could have worked. He's a president, she's a GM, right,

672
00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:42,000
Speaker 2: and then maybe who knows, story, A story I guess

673
00:34:42,000 --> 00:34:45,560
Speaker 2: for another podcast. But love Mike with all my heart.

674
00:34:45,960 --> 00:34:49,120
Speaker 2: He's the greatest, one of my favorites of all time

675
00:34:49,200 --> 00:34:51,839
Speaker 2: in baseball. I just I don't. I don't think it's

676
00:34:51,840 --> 00:34:52,680
Speaker 2: going to be him this time.

677
00:34:53,640 --> 00:34:55,919
Speaker 4: There's there's only one other team right now that has

678
00:34:56,280 --> 00:34:59,160
Speaker 4: comparable front office openings. The Red Sox also looking for

679
00:34:59,280 --> 00:35:01,759
Speaker 4: president of baseball operations in a GM. They got a

680
00:35:01,840 --> 00:35:04,080
Speaker 4: headstart on their search, and there's reports that that's not

681
00:35:04,080 --> 00:35:06,840
Speaker 4: actually going very well, but regardless, that is an opportunity

682
00:35:06,920 --> 00:35:09,160
Speaker 4: out there with a bigger market team coming off a

683
00:35:09,200 --> 00:35:13,440
Speaker 4: worse season. How do you think the desirability of this

684
00:35:13,520 --> 00:35:16,000
Speaker 4: job compares to that? Is this a better job to

685
00:35:16,040 --> 00:35:20,280
Speaker 4: you than Boston? Like all things considered, because they're very different,

686
00:35:20,360 --> 00:35:22,400
Speaker 4: But right now, that's kind of that's what the Marlins

687
00:35:22,440 --> 00:35:23,560
Speaker 4: have to keep in mind. Like a lot of the

688
00:35:23,560 --> 00:35:25,799
Speaker 4: candidates that interviewed for that or were targeted for that,

689
00:35:25,840 --> 00:35:27,880
Speaker 4: those are probably names that are in Bruce's mind. So

690
00:35:27,920 --> 00:35:30,879
Speaker 4: that context, that comparison is kind of leighing heavy on.

691
00:35:30,800 --> 00:35:34,920
Speaker 2: My mind, right So I would say Eli that and

692
00:35:34,960 --> 00:35:37,760
Speaker 2: I understand for you to say that it doesn't seem

693
00:35:37,840 --> 00:35:41,840
Speaker 2: like it's going well. The difference between now and maybe

694
00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:46,360
Speaker 2: fifteen twenty years ago is every single name gets reported,

695
00:35:46,719 --> 00:35:49,720
Speaker 2: whereas years ago this is just the dynamic of social

696
00:35:49,719 --> 00:35:52,040
Speaker 2: media and this stuff didn't happen. And the more and

697
00:35:52,080 --> 00:35:55,160
Speaker 2: more we get with more newsbreakers on social media and

698
00:35:55,160 --> 00:35:58,120
Speaker 2: people who are reporting, we're finding out about every single

699
00:35:58,200 --> 00:36:01,040
Speaker 2: name who interviews everywhere. So I personally don't think that

700
00:36:01,040 --> 00:36:03,680
Speaker 2: that's a fair assessment with the Red Sox. If they

701
00:36:03,719 --> 00:36:06,920
Speaker 2: interview somebody and they do their search and that person

702
00:36:06,960 --> 00:36:10,279
Speaker 2: doesn't want the job and it ends up being you know,

703
00:36:10,320 --> 00:36:12,280
Speaker 2: not John Daniels, I think was one of the names.

704
00:36:12,600 --> 00:36:15,440
Speaker 2: Not Derek Falvey I think was another one of the names.

705
00:36:15,440 --> 00:36:17,560
Speaker 2: I think that Levine, you guys have to correct me

706
00:36:17,960 --> 00:36:21,080
Speaker 2: if if that was one of the names too. And

707
00:36:21,280 --> 00:36:24,279
Speaker 2: these are you know, high level executives who just have

708
00:36:24,440 --> 00:36:28,959
Speaker 2: chosen to not be there. My understanding is it's very

709
00:36:29,000 --> 00:36:32,680
Speaker 2: hard right now in the market just for presidents and

710
00:36:33,000 --> 00:36:37,080
Speaker 2: general managers. These people have families, they understand what the

711
00:36:37,160 --> 00:36:40,759
Speaker 2: job entails, and it's not just being the GM. It's

712
00:36:40,920 --> 00:36:43,839
Speaker 2: there's especially the president. There's just a lot more encompassing

713
00:36:43,840 --> 00:36:47,000
Speaker 2: of the job and it's not and maybe it's easier

714
00:36:47,000 --> 00:36:49,400
Speaker 2: for a single man or woman to be able to

715
00:36:49,440 --> 00:36:52,600
Speaker 2: do the gig. And I think from the Marlins perspective,

716
00:36:52,719 --> 00:36:55,000
Speaker 2: I don't know this to be true yet, Eli, but

717
00:36:55,120 --> 00:36:58,560
Speaker 2: I you know, certainly could see a scenario where there

718
00:36:58,560 --> 00:37:00,400
Speaker 2: are gonna be people out there that are going to

719
00:37:00,440 --> 00:37:03,640
Speaker 2: be clowning the Marlins because this person interviewed and this

720
00:37:03,680 --> 00:37:06,080
Speaker 2: person didn't get the job. And maybe there's a few

721
00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:07,640
Speaker 2: names that it's going to go in the same way

722
00:37:08,040 --> 00:37:10,520
Speaker 2: as the Marlins too. But I don't necessarily look at

723
00:37:10,520 --> 00:37:13,440
Speaker 2: that as a success or failure. To me, it just

724
00:37:13,440 --> 00:37:16,120
Speaker 2: looks like they're interviewing and doing a search and interviewing

725
00:37:16,160 --> 00:37:17,799
Speaker 2: a lot of people for the job. So I just

726
00:37:17,840 --> 00:37:21,520
Speaker 2: personally don't look at that situation in the same way.

727
00:37:22,160 --> 00:37:25,879
Speaker 2: And again with the Marlins Gig, I absolutely in the end,

728
00:37:25,880 --> 00:37:28,160
Speaker 2: when it's all over, just like I always do, I'll

729
00:37:28,160 --> 00:37:30,400
Speaker 2: do my assessment. I'll speak to the people who were involved,

730
00:37:30,440 --> 00:37:34,040
Speaker 2: just like I did with the manager, and I'll find

731
00:37:34,040 --> 00:37:36,759
Speaker 2: out if if it was not a thorough search, or

732
00:37:36,800 --> 00:37:39,520
Speaker 2: if you know, a lot of people turned down the job,

733
00:37:39,560 --> 00:37:41,560
Speaker 2: or if it was tough. I'd only anticipate that being

734
00:37:41,600 --> 00:37:44,239
Speaker 2: the case. So I don't indict the Red Sox for

735
00:37:44,280 --> 00:37:46,239
Speaker 2: speaking to a million people and a million people thus

736
00:37:46,280 --> 00:37:48,880
Speaker 2: far saying no. There's also a window of time that

737
00:37:48,960 --> 00:37:51,719
Speaker 2: you have to make a decision on a person and

738
00:37:51,880 --> 00:37:53,840
Speaker 2: you have to complete it within that time to speak

739
00:37:53,840 --> 00:37:55,640
Speaker 2: to somebody else too. It's just something else to keep

740
00:37:55,680 --> 00:37:56,560
Speaker 2: in mind.

741
00:37:56,600 --> 00:37:58,680
Speaker 3: Do you as a last for me, it's my last question, Craig,

742
00:37:58,719 --> 00:38:01,439
Speaker 3: thank you for doing this again. But my last question

743
00:38:01,520 --> 00:38:04,480
Speaker 3: for you would be, as the search gets underway, or

744
00:38:04,480 --> 00:38:05,400
Speaker 3: maybe it already.

745
00:38:05,160 --> 00:38:09,200
Speaker 5: Is, if you had to underway.

746
00:38:09,760 --> 00:38:12,319
Speaker 3: If you had to form an opinion on how you

747
00:38:12,360 --> 00:38:14,640
Speaker 3: think or what kind of candidate you think they target

748
00:38:14,640 --> 00:38:16,200
Speaker 3: do they do you think they go with more the younger,

749
00:38:16,280 --> 00:38:19,320
Speaker 3: more analytically driven candidate, or do they go with an older,

750
00:38:19,480 --> 00:38:22,319
Speaker 3: maybe tenured baseball person, Like what what do you?

751
00:38:22,360 --> 00:38:24,279
Speaker 5: What do you how? In which direction do you see

752
00:38:24,280 --> 00:38:24,520
Speaker 5: it going?

753
00:38:26,360 --> 00:38:28,879
Speaker 2: Look, I don't know about age, or gender or any

754
00:38:28,880 --> 00:38:32,040
Speaker 2: of that stuff, but I think that the candidate will

755
00:38:32,080 --> 00:38:37,000
Speaker 2: come from a high level position in a front office,

756
00:38:37,680 --> 00:38:42,720
Speaker 2: in in a major league baseball That's that's my guess

757
00:38:42,920 --> 00:38:44,759
Speaker 2: as to potentially the way that that could go. But

758
00:38:44,920 --> 00:38:48,000
Speaker 2: I don't have any insight, you know, certainly to that.

759
00:38:48,840 --> 00:38:51,200
Speaker 2: I know that, Look, we're all going to be talking

760
00:38:51,239 --> 00:38:54,319
Speaker 2: about the same names. I would tell you that, Look,

761
00:38:54,480 --> 00:38:56,319
Speaker 2: this is not a connection to the Marlins at all,

762
00:38:56,400 --> 00:38:58,720
Speaker 2: just to be clear. But the fact that that Levine

763
00:38:58,840 --> 00:39:01,680
Speaker 2: chose to interview with the red Socks, you know, that's

764
00:39:01,719 --> 00:39:04,960
Speaker 2: a really big step in all of the processes. But

765
00:39:05,040 --> 00:39:07,560
Speaker 2: this Dad Levine, who I like very much, he's been

766
00:39:07,600 --> 00:39:10,560
Speaker 2: on my shows before, has turned down a lot of

767
00:39:10,600 --> 00:39:13,239
Speaker 2: requests in the past. So that really like perked my

768
00:39:13,760 --> 00:39:15,480
Speaker 2: eyes up and ears up a little bit. To see

769
00:39:15,480 --> 00:39:17,960
Speaker 2: that he was willing to do that interview with the

770
00:39:18,000 --> 00:39:20,400
Speaker 2: Red Sox if they can secure him. You know, so

771
00:39:20,600 --> 00:39:22,879
Speaker 2: that's a huge get I think for Boston the way

772
00:39:22,920 --> 00:39:25,000
Speaker 2: that they have run the Minnesota Twins, he and Derek

773
00:39:25,040 --> 00:39:30,960
Speaker 2: Falby for all of those years. So we're gonna learn together. Yeah,

774
00:39:31,120 --> 00:39:32,880
Speaker 2: I don't know through this process that I'm going to

775
00:39:32,960 --> 00:39:36,120
Speaker 2: be doing the this guy turned it down, that guy

776
00:39:36,120 --> 00:39:38,360
Speaker 2: turned it down. I just I don't see the benefit

777
00:39:38,440 --> 00:39:40,080
Speaker 2: to it. I understand that they're gonna be people that

778
00:39:40,120 --> 00:39:41,239
Speaker 2: are going to do it, and they're going to be

779
00:39:41,880 --> 00:39:44,640
Speaker 2: reporters out there much better than me who are just

780
00:39:44,680 --> 00:39:47,680
Speaker 2: going to say, excuse me, just going to say, you know,

781
00:39:47,719 --> 00:39:49,839
Speaker 2: this person turned it down, and this person interviewed, they

782
00:39:49,880 --> 00:39:52,239
Speaker 2: thought it sucked, they turned it down. I don't think

783
00:39:52,280 --> 00:39:54,640
Speaker 2: that's going to be me. What I will do is

784
00:39:54,680 --> 00:39:58,680
Speaker 2: hopefully give everyone who the new person is that you know, inevitably,

785
00:39:59,239 --> 00:40:01,720
Speaker 2: I want the actual piece of the news as opposed

786
00:40:01,760 --> 00:40:03,600
Speaker 2: to the things that that didn't matter.

787
00:40:05,719 --> 00:40:08,880
Speaker 1: When you say an executive in a high level position

788
00:40:08,920 --> 00:40:11,440
Speaker 1: major League Baseball, does that sound like James click music

789
00:40:11,640 --> 00:40:12,480
Speaker 1: to you.

790
00:40:14,000 --> 00:40:16,320
Speaker 2: Again? I would be guessing, Isaac, I'm not going to

791
00:40:16,400 --> 00:40:18,840
Speaker 2: go through the names yet, because I don't know who's

792
00:40:18,880 --> 00:40:21,160
Speaker 2: been interviewed. Even if I did, I don't think that

793
00:40:21,200 --> 00:40:23,920
Speaker 2: I would do it, you know, I just I don't see.

794
00:40:24,920 --> 00:40:28,080
Speaker 2: I don't see how it helps me. It's only going

795
00:40:28,160 --> 00:40:30,840
Speaker 2: to hurt me in the industry to be leaking that

796
00:40:30,880 --> 00:40:33,520
Speaker 2: sort of stuff if I do know, And and right

797
00:40:33,560 --> 00:40:35,000
Speaker 2: now I would tell you that I don't know the

798
00:40:35,360 --> 00:40:39,040
Speaker 2: answer to that. I think I think it's I think

799
00:40:39,080 --> 00:40:41,480
Speaker 2: it's fair to say that there's certainly a chance that

800
00:40:41,560 --> 00:40:44,080
Speaker 2: we don't know the person, like we don't know the name.

801
00:40:44,120 --> 00:40:46,840
Speaker 2: Maybe this is somebody new that has never been a

802
00:40:46,960 --> 00:40:49,359
Speaker 2: president before. I think you have to explore that too.

803
00:40:49,600 --> 00:40:53,440
Speaker 2: I think all avenues are are going to be explored

804
00:40:53,480 --> 00:40:56,719
Speaker 2: with this, and I don't know what the outcome is

805
00:40:56,760 --> 00:40:59,240
Speaker 2: going to be, and we're just going to learn together.

806
00:40:59,280 --> 00:41:02,279
Speaker 2: My hope is for the Marlins is that by the

807
00:41:02,280 --> 00:41:04,799
Speaker 2: winter meetings. I think that that's fair. I hope that

808
00:41:04,840 --> 00:41:06,600
Speaker 2: by then, I know it seems like a long time

809
00:41:06,640 --> 00:41:09,200
Speaker 2: from now, but I hope by then that they have

810
00:41:09,320 --> 00:41:13,319
Speaker 2: somebody in place, because that's sort of not just the

811
00:41:13,320 --> 00:41:17,200
Speaker 2: the trading stuff and free agent stuff. That's kind of

812
00:41:17,200 --> 00:41:20,600
Speaker 2: the moment where you're meeting the media and you're you're

813
00:41:20,640 --> 00:41:22,920
Speaker 2: you're doing you know, you're not saying anything, and generally speaking,

814
00:41:22,920 --> 00:41:26,160
Speaker 2: nothing even happens at the winter meetings mostly, but I

815
00:41:26,160 --> 00:41:29,560
Speaker 2: guess last year a little bit happened, but generally speaking,

816
00:41:29,600 --> 00:41:31,839
Speaker 2: that's like the hey, here's who I am and nice

817
00:41:31,840 --> 00:41:34,680
Speaker 2: to meet you kind of stuff. So I'm hopeful. I'm

818
00:41:34,680 --> 00:41:36,640
Speaker 2: hopeful by then that that's the case. You guys may

819
00:41:36,640 --> 00:41:38,440
Speaker 2: think it should happen earlier. I don't know, but I'm

820
00:41:38,440 --> 00:41:39,440
Speaker 2: hopeful for the winter meetings.

821
00:41:39,680 --> 00:41:41,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was my question, because the GM meetings are

822
00:41:41,960 --> 00:41:43,280
Speaker 1: what early November.

823
00:41:42,880 --> 00:41:47,080
Speaker 2: I believe very unrealistic. Maybe maybe it happens, but I mean,

824
00:41:47,239 --> 00:41:48,960
Speaker 2: this is what are we in or this is like

825
00:41:49,600 --> 00:41:51,719
Speaker 2: they have two weeks to do that, then maybe they

826
00:41:51,760 --> 00:41:53,120
Speaker 2: can maybe they pull it off. I don't know.

827
00:41:53,760 --> 00:41:57,520
Speaker 1: And who is helping Bruce. Is it just Bruce Sherman

828
00:41:57,640 --> 00:42:00,520
Speaker 1: conducting these interviews and doing this search or does he

829
00:42:00,600 --> 00:42:03,879
Speaker 1: have anyone to help him out of the way, because yeah,

830
00:42:03,880 --> 00:42:04,600
Speaker 1: I don't know.

831
00:42:04,640 --> 00:42:09,279
Speaker 2: I mean, my my my guess is is that he

832
00:42:09,360 --> 00:42:13,320
Speaker 2: has people that he trusts in the organization and maybe

833
00:42:13,320 --> 00:42:15,319
Speaker 2: outside to do that. I don't have the answer to that.

834
00:42:15,360 --> 00:42:18,400
Speaker 2: I don't know who's involved in involved in I mean,

835
00:42:18,440 --> 00:42:21,400
Speaker 2: Kim did the interviews for the manager, and she and

836
00:42:21,440 --> 00:42:26,240
Speaker 2: she interviewed Skip Schumacher and then and then I believe

837
00:42:27,200 --> 00:42:29,359
Speaker 2: I think I think Bruce Sherman was Yeah, no, Bruce

838
00:42:29,360 --> 00:42:32,520
Speaker 2: Shermer was involved in in hiring Skip Schumacher. Of course

839
00:42:32,520 --> 00:42:34,960
Speaker 2: it was his manager too, so yeah, so so he

840
00:42:35,040 --> 00:42:36,920
Speaker 2: was involved there at the end. My guess is he'll

841
00:42:36,920 --> 00:42:40,279
Speaker 2: be involved in throughout this process, right.

842
00:42:41,239 --> 00:42:43,239
Speaker 1: I guess the last thing from you would just be because

843
00:42:43,200 --> 00:42:46,080
Speaker 1: Bruce just spoke so highly of Kim, you know, the

844
00:42:46,120 --> 00:42:49,239
Speaker 1: whole the clinching night in Pittsburgh and and the I

845
00:42:49,280 --> 00:42:51,240
Speaker 1: guess before the postseason we were speaking on the field

846
00:42:51,280 --> 00:42:54,279
Speaker 1: and during the regular season, nothing but great things for Kim.

847
00:42:54,320 --> 00:42:56,400
Speaker 1: Are you surprised that they just couldn't come up to

848
00:42:56,400 --> 00:42:59,000
Speaker 1: an agreement, whether you know, however you want to slice it.

849
00:42:59,280 --> 00:43:01,080
Speaker 1: Were you just surprised that there's no agreement made.

850
00:43:02,800 --> 00:43:05,520
Speaker 2: Everybody should be surprised that there's no agreement made. Yeah,

851
00:43:05,600 --> 00:43:09,000
Speaker 2: but the bigger but and I'm not surprised that there's

852
00:43:09,040 --> 00:43:12,160
Speaker 2: disappointment around the industry. And I'm not surprised to read

853
00:43:12,800 --> 00:43:15,399
Speaker 2: columns and articles about how the Marlins ft it up

854
00:43:15,440 --> 00:43:18,200
Speaker 2: and they could have worked it. I look, I knew

855
00:43:18,440 --> 00:43:20,359
Speaker 2: all that was going to come. I mean, I knew

856
00:43:20,400 --> 00:43:26,040
Speaker 2: it was. But you know, I guess, I guess in

857
00:43:26,080 --> 00:43:29,680
Speaker 2: the end with the way that I know, I think

858
00:43:29,760 --> 00:43:31,920
Speaker 2: I know that the Marlins sort of want to operate

859
00:43:31,960 --> 00:43:35,000
Speaker 2: in the future where you see kind of where their

860
00:43:35,000 --> 00:43:38,120
Speaker 2: payroll is and you know, maybe a little bit higher,

861
00:43:38,120 --> 00:43:40,240
Speaker 2: maybe a little bit lower. I don't know which direction

862
00:43:40,280 --> 00:43:44,360
Speaker 2: it's going to go. I just know how important the

863
00:43:44,880 --> 00:43:49,200
Speaker 2: homegrown talent has to be for this organization. Guys like it.

864
00:43:50,680 --> 00:43:53,800
Speaker 2: We're gonna What's funny is is I talk to people

865
00:43:54,239 --> 00:43:56,319
Speaker 2: and you guys have probably said this before too, that

866
00:43:56,400 --> 00:43:58,239
Speaker 2: they want to be the raise. The Marlins want to

867
00:43:58,239 --> 00:43:59,520
Speaker 2: be the raise. They just want to be the raise.

868
00:43:59,520 --> 00:44:01,400
Speaker 2: They want to get that amount of people, and you know,

869
00:44:01,400 --> 00:44:02,520
Speaker 2: they just want to be the raise. And then you

870
00:44:02,520 --> 00:44:04,360
Speaker 2: hear people say the Marlins cannot be the raise. Let

871
00:44:04,360 --> 00:44:06,440
Speaker 2: me look at that huge front office the Rays have

872
00:44:06,520 --> 00:44:07,799
Speaker 2: and look at the way that they've done it, and

873
00:44:07,840 --> 00:44:10,319
Speaker 2: they you know, Andrew Friedman and He'm Bloom and all

874
00:44:10,320 --> 00:44:12,759
Speaker 2: these people. They look at those executives they have. So

875
00:44:12,920 --> 00:44:14,719
Speaker 2: I don't think it's as like cut and dry as

876
00:44:14,719 --> 00:44:16,520
Speaker 2: they want to be the Raise. But that's like the

877
00:44:16,560 --> 00:44:21,360
Speaker 2: space that the Marlins have to operate on, the Raised space,

878
00:44:21,520 --> 00:44:26,759
Speaker 2: the Cleveland space, the Milwaukee space. So it doesn't really

879
00:44:26,800 --> 00:44:30,759
Speaker 2: answer your question, Isaac, But I don't I'm not I'm

880
00:44:30,760 --> 00:44:35,080
Speaker 2: not surprised in the sense that that is so important

881
00:44:35,520 --> 00:44:39,520
Speaker 2: and and and maybe and maybe Kim could have operated

882
00:44:39,560 --> 00:44:42,279
Speaker 2: in that space as as the president or maybe she

883
00:44:42,320 --> 00:44:44,200
Speaker 2: could have I don't know the answer to that. But

884
00:44:44,239 --> 00:44:46,920
Speaker 2: they made the decision to say, hey, we got to

885
00:44:46,960 --> 00:44:48,960
Speaker 2: do this the way that we're going to do it,

886
00:44:49,000 --> 00:44:51,879
Speaker 2: and we cannot worry about anybody else's feelings, like this

887
00:44:51,920 --> 00:44:56,480
Speaker 2: is this is how it's got to be done. And

888
00:44:56,560 --> 00:44:58,520
Speaker 2: for you know, for the for the trades and and

889
00:44:58,560 --> 00:45:01,920
Speaker 2: all the success that was made aid by Kim two

890
00:45:02,160 --> 00:45:06,840
Speaker 2: the Burger trade, right, the Josh Bell trade whatever with Robertson, Like,

891
00:45:06,880 --> 00:45:09,320
Speaker 2: those are the three trades. I think I'm missing anything.

892
00:45:10,040 --> 00:45:14,440
Speaker 4: Lopez trade, raw whatever, right, Jonathan Davis.

893
00:45:14,480 --> 00:45:16,919
Speaker 2: Those were all solid. But guys like the free but

894
00:45:16,920 --> 00:45:20,680
Speaker 2: but this is money taken from the organization, not a lot,

895
00:45:20,719 --> 00:45:24,720
Speaker 2: some would argue. But the free agents were not good

896
00:45:24,880 --> 00:45:28,839
Speaker 2: at all. And it was very fortunate that that Kim

897
00:45:28,880 --> 00:45:32,360
Speaker 2: went in and fixed all that stuff that she did

898
00:45:32,880 --> 00:45:35,680
Speaker 2: before the season, Like let's not forget that too, like

899
00:45:36,320 --> 00:45:39,520
Speaker 2: she patched that up. It's just Isaac, It's not it's

900
00:45:39,600 --> 00:45:42,719
Speaker 2: it's it's maybe it's a slam dunk for everybody that

901
00:45:42,760 --> 00:45:44,880
Speaker 2: this should have just been done exactly the way that

902
00:45:44,880 --> 00:45:48,400
Speaker 2: everybody wants it. But that's not the way that the

903
00:45:48,440 --> 00:45:52,440
Speaker 2: Marlins wanted it to work. And there's there's there's people

904
00:45:52,480 --> 00:45:55,239
Speaker 2: that that have commented on my my post on sports career.

905
00:45:55,280 --> 00:45:58,080
Speaker 2: They said, okay, and it's very interesting. They said, well,

906
00:45:58,120 --> 00:46:01,759
Speaker 2: what Craig is saying is that they don't want to

907
00:46:01,800 --> 00:46:07,839
Speaker 2: spend money anymore and they want to just draft guys,

908
00:46:07,920 --> 00:46:10,319
Speaker 2: make sure they all go to the big leagues, use

909
00:46:10,360 --> 00:46:12,719
Speaker 2: the international money, and make sure they're all there. That's

910
00:46:12,719 --> 00:46:16,279
Speaker 2: not true. That's not true. Bruce Sherman said that if

911
00:46:16,280 --> 00:46:19,560
Speaker 2: they're in it to spend money, whenever they're in it.

912
00:46:20,320 --> 00:46:22,799
Speaker 2: This year, they were in it. Maybe it wasn't as

913
00:46:22,880 --> 00:46:24,680
Speaker 2: much money as you guys wanted to spend, but they

914
00:46:24,680 --> 00:46:27,080
Speaker 2: were in it. He spent money, got Josh Bell, got

915
00:46:27,160 --> 00:46:31,080
Speaker 2: Dave Robertson, spend some money, right, got rid of Jean Sigura,

916
00:46:31,239 --> 00:46:34,200
Speaker 2: did all those things. So the goal is for the

917
00:46:34,239 --> 00:46:37,440
Speaker 2: Marlins to be in it every year and then if

918
00:46:37,440 --> 00:46:40,080
Speaker 2: they're in it, go get the other pieces to win,

919
00:46:41,920 --> 00:46:45,880
Speaker 2: to win the postseason and win the championship. So look,

920
00:46:46,000 --> 00:46:51,520
Speaker 2: I'm shocked, definitely upset, you know, for the like I

921
00:46:51,600 --> 00:46:54,520
Speaker 2: built a good relationship with Kim guys, you know, like

922
00:46:55,320 --> 00:46:57,840
Speaker 2: you know, like it's I'm gonna have to get to

923
00:46:57,880 --> 00:47:00,560
Speaker 2: know a new executive. This isn't what do you think

924
00:47:00,600 --> 00:47:02,600
Speaker 2: I'm thinking, like, oh, man, like here we go, let

925
00:47:02,640 --> 00:47:06,640
Speaker 2: give but but but in the end, that's that's the

926
00:47:06,719 --> 00:47:09,000
Speaker 2: dynamic of it. I think I made clear by the

927
00:47:09,000 --> 00:47:11,279
Speaker 2: way on my other stuff that I had not heard

928
00:47:11,320 --> 00:47:14,440
Speaker 2: from Kim at all since this has happened. But I

929
00:47:14,520 --> 00:47:19,240
Speaker 2: finally did today. But I finally did today. I finally

930
00:47:19,280 --> 00:47:21,600
Speaker 2: I finally heard back today. So I'm not going to

931
00:47:21,680 --> 00:47:25,279
Speaker 2: obviously share any of that, but uh, you know, so

932
00:47:25,760 --> 00:47:28,280
Speaker 2: at least I thought that maybe like it was like

933
00:47:28,440 --> 00:47:30,880
Speaker 2: we were in bad, bad standing or something like that,

934
00:47:30,920 --> 00:47:32,920
Speaker 2: but I don't think so excellent.

935
00:47:33,160 --> 00:47:35,320
Speaker 3: You have to be able to do both right, spending

936
00:47:35,320 --> 00:47:37,239
Speaker 3: money in building from within, and the Marlins have had

937
00:47:37,719 --> 00:47:39,040
Speaker 3: Craig knows from the Marlins have had.

938
00:47:39,400 --> 00:47:40,480
Speaker 2: We all know the Marlins have.

939
00:47:40,440 --> 00:47:42,239
Speaker 3: Had a lot of trouble building from within, so that's

940
00:47:42,239 --> 00:47:43,640
Speaker 3: what they got to fix, and hopefully this is the

941
00:47:43,719 --> 00:47:44,319
Speaker 3: right way to do it.

942
00:47:45,160 --> 00:47:48,000
Speaker 5: See who comes in next and see how they do.

943
00:47:49,719 --> 00:47:51,800
Speaker 1: And just to be clear, obviously you know Bruce Sherman

944
00:47:51,840 --> 00:47:53,480
Speaker 1: wanted to do it, and that's probably would have been

945
00:47:53,520 --> 00:47:55,600
Speaker 1: a great decision. The more brain power you have in

946
00:47:55,640 --> 00:47:57,400
Speaker 1: that front off is the better, and it would have

947
00:47:57,440 --> 00:47:58,520
Speaker 1: only helped in my opinion.

948
00:47:58,600 --> 00:47:59,200
Speaker 2: So I was.

949
00:47:59,200 --> 00:48:01,560
Speaker 1: Surprised to see Kim not be satisfied with that position.

950
00:48:01,600 --> 00:48:04,640
Speaker 1: But like you said, she's allowed to do whatever she wants,

951
00:48:04,640 --> 00:48:07,479
Speaker 1: and Bruce has allowed to structure his front office however

952
00:48:07,800 --> 00:48:09,759
Speaker 1: he wants. I guess, unless you guys have anything else,

953
00:48:09,920 --> 00:48:11,120
Speaker 1: I think that'll do it for Craig.

954
00:48:11,160 --> 00:48:15,880
Speaker 2: I guess one more, one other thing. It's just this

955
00:48:15,920 --> 00:48:18,680
Speaker 2: doesn't speak necessarily to you know, the owner of the

956
00:48:18,719 --> 00:48:21,480
Speaker 2: Marlins or anything else. It just speaks. I've had this

957
00:48:21,520 --> 00:48:25,720
Speaker 2: conversation now with a lot of people with just life

958
00:48:25,760 --> 00:48:29,640
Speaker 2: and sports and just everything else we go through years

959
00:48:29,719 --> 00:48:32,600
Speaker 2: in all of the sports, the NBA, in Major League Baseball.

960
00:48:33,800 --> 00:48:36,160
Speaker 2: I don't know enough about the NHL to comment, but

961
00:48:36,280 --> 00:48:38,840
Speaker 2: in the NFL as well, where we always are, you know,

962
00:48:38,920 --> 00:48:41,839
Speaker 2: on the owners, they're they're never good, they always suck,

963
00:48:41,920 --> 00:48:45,160
Speaker 2: they're not doing the right thing, and you know, and

964
00:48:45,520 --> 00:48:49,839
Speaker 2: you know, sometimes maybe that's accurate and sometimes maybe that's inaccurate.

965
00:48:50,480 --> 00:48:53,920
Speaker 2: But in the end we can all yell and scream,

966
00:48:54,280 --> 00:48:57,040
Speaker 2: but the bottom line is that the owners in sports

967
00:48:57,239 --> 00:49:00,440
Speaker 2: have gotten there for a reason. They've got Billy and

968
00:49:00,520 --> 00:49:03,680
Speaker 2: billions of dollars and they can do whatever they want

969
00:49:04,040 --> 00:49:07,560
Speaker 2: and that's never going to change in sports has nothing

970
00:49:07,560 --> 00:49:10,040
Speaker 2: to do with the Marlins. Just look in the last

971
00:49:10,160 --> 00:49:12,799
Speaker 2: thirty years of things that we've seen that we just

972
00:49:12,840 --> 00:49:16,799
Speaker 2: didn't like initially. You guys mentioned James Click as one thing.

973
00:49:16,800 --> 00:49:18,640
Speaker 2: I mean, they won the World Series. He's not the

974
00:49:18,680 --> 00:49:21,920
Speaker 2: GM anymore and looked insane. The Astros are back in

975
00:49:21,920 --> 00:49:24,760
Speaker 2: the American League Championship Series. We're not even talking about

976
00:49:24,760 --> 00:49:28,120
Speaker 2: that anymore. In the moment, it sucks, and because we've

977
00:49:28,160 --> 00:49:31,439
Speaker 2: all built relationships with people and we feel like, feel hurt,

978
00:49:31,520 --> 00:49:34,480
Speaker 2: we feel a little betrayed, like what is this guy doing?

979
00:49:35,080 --> 00:49:38,439
Speaker 2: It's crazy articles coming out, this guy's the worst. Wow,

980
00:49:38,520 --> 00:49:41,960
Speaker 2: you know, and then it's like, you know, how did

981
00:49:41,960 --> 00:49:43,879
Speaker 2: that did these people get to this point? They were

982
00:49:43,920 --> 00:49:46,239
Speaker 2: so smart. Were they just I mean, maybe some of

983
00:49:46,239 --> 00:49:48,359
Speaker 2: them got family money and they were handed billions of dollars.

984
00:49:48,400 --> 00:49:50,319
Speaker 2: I guess that's that's probably true too. But in the

985
00:49:50,440 --> 00:49:53,520
Speaker 2: end it sucks to say, but life is just not

986
00:49:53,719 --> 00:49:59,640
Speaker 2: fair and and a lot of times the owners with

987
00:50:00,120 --> 00:50:02,399
Speaker 2: that kind of money can choose to play with their

988
00:50:02,440 --> 00:50:04,560
Speaker 2: toy however they want to play with it.

989
00:50:04,920 --> 00:50:06,480
Speaker 3: I saw one that said it was like a slap

990
00:50:06,520 --> 00:50:08,160
Speaker 3: in the face defans, and come on, this is the

991
00:50:08,160 --> 00:50:10,600
Speaker 3: business of baseball. This stuff happens like it sucks. Yeah,

992
00:50:10,600 --> 00:50:12,840
Speaker 3: but it's not a slap in the face defans. So

993
00:50:12,880 --> 00:50:14,040
Speaker 3: they went into different directions.

994
00:50:15,280 --> 00:50:20,239
Speaker 2: Look, everybody could continue to be outraged totally. Look I

995
00:50:20,280 --> 00:50:22,880
Speaker 2: was very surprised too. Again, I know my in what

996
00:50:22,920 --> 00:50:24,560
Speaker 2: I'm trying to do. If I'm still gonna do, be

997
00:50:24,600 --> 00:50:26,479
Speaker 2: doing this with the Marlins for who knows how long

998
00:50:26,880 --> 00:50:29,200
Speaker 2: It is better for me to have Kim than it

999
00:50:29,280 --> 00:50:31,400
Speaker 2: is to not. There is no question she's helped me

1000
00:50:31,480 --> 00:50:34,200
Speaker 2: quite a bit last year, without a doubt. I mean,

1001
00:50:34,200 --> 00:50:36,759
Speaker 2: come on, I mean, let's guys get real. I think

1002
00:50:36,800 --> 00:50:39,200
Speaker 2: Kim hasn't helped me with any piece of information the

1003
00:50:39,320 --> 00:50:42,120
Speaker 2: last three years. Of course, she's a very helpful. But

1004
00:50:43,239 --> 00:50:45,239
Speaker 2: it's just this is just part of sports, and we're

1005
00:50:45,520 --> 00:50:48,439
Speaker 2: and and people are gonna pile on and they're gonna

1006
00:50:48,440 --> 00:50:50,560
Speaker 2: do what they're gonna do, and and that's fine, and

1007
00:50:51,280 --> 00:50:53,279
Speaker 2: everybody's entitles to their own opinion. You guys can hang

1008
00:50:53,360 --> 00:50:55,640
Speaker 2: up with me and say, oh gosh, Craigs just whatever.

1009
00:50:55,719 --> 00:50:58,080
Speaker 2: And you know, she got a raw deal and it

1010
00:50:58,160 --> 00:51:00,719
Speaker 2: sucks and she should have been the president. Absolutely fair

1011
00:51:00,760 --> 00:51:03,600
Speaker 2: to feel that way I feel from my point of view,

1012
00:51:04,920 --> 00:51:08,200
Speaker 2: as opposed to I feel from a journalistic point of view.

1013
00:51:08,760 --> 00:51:11,480
Speaker 2: I think I know more about what goes on the

1014
00:51:11,480 --> 00:51:14,319
Speaker 2: Marlin with the Marlins over the last maybe who knows

1015
00:51:14,320 --> 00:51:16,360
Speaker 2: how long, but at least the last five ten years

1016
00:51:16,480 --> 00:51:19,600
Speaker 2: than anybody else in the country. And I feel bad

1017
00:51:19,640 --> 00:51:22,200
Speaker 2: for Kim. But am I outraged? Am I yelling and

1018
00:51:22,280 --> 00:51:25,960
Speaker 2: screaming and saying, oh my gosh, She's like, oh no,

1019
00:51:26,280 --> 00:51:30,680
Speaker 2: because it's just it's easy to just just follow the

1020
00:51:30,680 --> 00:51:32,800
Speaker 2: crowd and just pile on and do all these things.

1021
00:51:33,360 --> 00:51:35,960
Speaker 2: And I hope I still have a ton of respect

1022
00:51:36,000 --> 00:51:38,040
Speaker 2: for Kim. And again, I mean, thank goodness, I was

1023
00:51:38,040 --> 00:51:40,080
Speaker 2: getting worried that maybe something happened and she got back

1024
00:51:40,120 --> 00:51:43,399
Speaker 2: to me there, but a couple of years from now,

1025
00:51:44,120 --> 00:51:47,880
Speaker 2: barring some crazy change in life, we're not gonna be

1026
00:51:47,920 --> 00:51:48,600
Speaker 2: talking about this.

1027
00:51:49,239 --> 00:51:52,880
Speaker 1: Of course, sports is the only industry where people are

1028
00:51:52,920 --> 00:51:56,920
Speaker 1: emotionally attached to other business people that don't care about you,

1029
00:51:56,920 --> 00:51:59,120
Speaker 1: you know, so I guess you can blame some of

1030
00:51:59,160 --> 00:52:02,040
Speaker 1: the fans for being quote unquote outraged.

1031
00:52:04,320 --> 00:52:06,680
Speaker 4: The final thing I'll say on this topic, I could

1032
00:52:06,719 --> 00:52:09,480
Speaker 4: care less about the national opinion from people that are

1033
00:52:09,600 --> 00:52:12,680
Speaker 4: just understandably see little bits of information and put two

1034
00:52:12,719 --> 00:52:15,040
Speaker 4: and two together and think it's it's terrible and have

1035
00:52:15,320 --> 00:52:18,200
Speaker 4: I understand, I don't really mind what they are saying,

1036
00:52:18,239 --> 00:52:21,399
Speaker 4: and they can be on their side. But I see

1037
00:52:21,400 --> 00:52:25,800
Speaker 4: it from the Marlins fans perspective that throughout this entire

1038
00:52:25,920 --> 00:52:28,920
Speaker 4: history of the franchise there's just been no continuity and

1039
00:52:29,120 --> 00:52:32,319
Speaker 4: in like any right there and this is now, I mean,

1040
00:52:32,440 --> 00:52:35,920
Speaker 4: just like Michael Hill, but probably even more so. This

1041
00:52:35,960 --> 00:52:39,799
Speaker 4: is another instance where something good happens there, there was

1042
00:52:39,840 --> 00:52:43,200
Speaker 4: something positive to celebrate, and then on the heels immediately

1043
00:52:43,239 --> 00:52:45,839
Speaker 4: of that, there's once again a big change, whether it

1044
00:52:45,920 --> 00:52:48,200
Speaker 4: is whether it proves to be the right thing or not.

1045
00:52:48,360 --> 00:52:51,480
Speaker 4: Like in this moment, it's really painful for these fans

1046
00:52:51,760 --> 00:52:56,080
Speaker 4: that felt like they knew that that continuity is very important.

1047
00:52:56,320 --> 00:52:59,680
Speaker 4: A lot of the best franchises in sports have that continuity,

1048
00:53:00,000 --> 00:53:02,799
Speaker 4: and the Marlins have been really as far on the

1049
00:53:02,840 --> 00:53:05,759
Speaker 4: wrong side of that spectrum as any other franchise. I

1050
00:53:05,760 --> 00:53:08,239
Speaker 4: think it's a big reason why this franchise is, this

1051
00:53:08,320 --> 00:53:10,360
Speaker 4: fan base is so tortured, why this fan base is

1052
00:53:10,360 --> 00:53:13,520
Speaker 4: so small, because some people they there are going to

1053
00:53:13,520 --> 00:53:16,480
Speaker 4: be people that were Marlins fans that are gonna check

1054
00:53:16,520 --> 00:53:19,360
Speaker 4: out for some period of time because of this decision.

1055
00:53:19,840 --> 00:53:23,359
Speaker 2: I disagree with that. I disagree with that completely. That

1056
00:53:23,640 --> 00:53:25,400
Speaker 2: I agreed with everything you said until the end. I

1057
00:53:25,440 --> 00:53:27,600
Speaker 2: don't think. I think we'll be back next year. The

1058
00:53:27,640 --> 00:53:30,880
Speaker 2: weather will be beautiful in February March. Spring training will happen.

1059
00:53:31,239 --> 00:53:33,319
Speaker 2: They'll bring in a couple of free agents, they'll win

1060
00:53:33,360 --> 00:53:36,200
Speaker 2: a few games. You guys will be talking about Nick Ahmed,

1061
00:53:36,600 --> 00:53:38,719
Speaker 2: What the hell? Why is he the shortstop? You know, like,

1062
00:53:38,960 --> 00:53:40,560
Speaker 2: this is the kind of stuff that's going to be happening.

1063
00:53:40,640 --> 00:53:43,440
Speaker 2: People love the game, people love talking about it, and

1064
00:53:43,520 --> 00:53:46,160
Speaker 2: this is going to go away. I'm absolutely positive of

1065
00:53:46,200 --> 00:53:48,000
Speaker 2: that happening. I can't guarantee you there's going to be

1066
00:53:48,040 --> 00:53:50,719
Speaker 2: success Eli. I don't know the answer to that. But

1067
00:53:50,920 --> 00:53:54,799
Speaker 2: all of these big stories they go away. People do

1068
00:53:54,880 --> 00:53:57,680
Speaker 2: not forget. I'm sorry, people do not talk about right

1069
00:53:57,680 --> 00:54:02,120
Speaker 2: now Jerry Rhyinsdorf, the owner of the Chicago White Sox

1070
00:54:02,200 --> 00:54:05,920
Speaker 2: bringing Tony LaRussa out of retirement to manage the Chicago

1071
00:54:05,960 --> 00:54:08,360
Speaker 2: White Sox. Who Tony. I have a ton of respect

1072
00:54:08,360 --> 00:54:11,160
Speaker 2: for Hall of Famer love Tony LaRussa, think he was

1073
00:54:11,200 --> 00:54:13,719
Speaker 2: an amazing manager and is in the Hall of Fame.

1074
00:54:13,920 --> 00:54:17,720
Speaker 2: Ton of respect. It was a horrendous decision and maybe

1075
00:54:17,800 --> 00:54:20,560
Speaker 2: part of that has and then they fired their president,

1076
00:54:20,560 --> 00:54:23,000
Speaker 2: and then they fired their GM and ELI. A couple

1077
00:54:23,000 --> 00:54:24,560
Speaker 2: of years, we ain't gonna be talking about that either,

1078
00:54:24,600 --> 00:54:26,960
Speaker 2: and we're not even talking about Tony Larus anymore. It

1079
00:54:27,120 --> 00:54:30,640
Speaker 2: all goes away, man, it just does it. Just does

1080
00:54:32,120 --> 00:54:34,000
Speaker 2: you know? It's it's gonna be time to move on soon.

1081
00:54:34,680 --> 00:54:36,640
Speaker 1: Well, I really appreciate the time. We know how busy

1082
00:54:36,640 --> 00:54:39,120
Speaker 1: you are, especially this time of years. So but that

1083
00:54:39,280 --> 00:54:41,840
Speaker 1: will end it here for ELI, for myself, for Alex Scarver,

1084
00:54:41,960 --> 00:54:44,120
Speaker 1: and for Craig. Craig, thank you guys so much, and

1085
00:54:44,239 --> 00:54:59,920
Speaker 1: as always, go Fish

1086
00:55:01,200 --> 00:55:02,240
Speaker 5: And the potlat