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Speaker 1: The Book of Joe podcast is a production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 1: Hey Thearon, Welcome back to the Book of Joe Podcast

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Speaker 1: with me, Tom Berducci, and of course Joe Madden and Joe.

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Speaker 1: I've been dying to know since we last left you.

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Speaker 1: You talked about the possibility of wearing your raccoon coat

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Speaker 1: to the Lafayette Lehigh game on Saturday. Complete the story.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it wasn't cold enough, so I was hoping for

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Speaker 2: like that, you know, twenty five thirty degree weather.

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Speaker 3: But it's actually perfect.

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Speaker 2: It was like fifty sitting on the fifty yard line

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Speaker 2: with Bergie and his wife Carolyn. Of course Wendy was there.

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Speaker 2: Second half was in the president's suite with Nicole Hurt,

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Speaker 2: who did listen. I've never seen Lafayette look that good.

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Speaker 2: I you know, as when I was there at the

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Speaker 2: school obviously and then where recently it was at the

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Speaker 2: homecoming a couple of years ago. Went to the Lafia

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Speaker 2: a LEI football game after the World Series. It looked spectacular.

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Speaker 2: Place was jammed two undefeated Patriot League teams. Lee High wins.

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Speaker 2: They really played well. We didn't play badly at all,

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Speaker 2: but they were that good. But I was so impressed

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Speaker 2: right down to the presidential brunch where they exchanged barbs

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Speaker 2: nicole and the president of Lehigh was really entertaining very

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Speaker 2: good in the gym where I once saw. How about

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Speaker 2: this Tom Young coaching Rutgers versus doctor Tom Davis at

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Speaker 2: Lafia with Gary Williams at his side.

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Speaker 3: They had called us Copland? Was it fast? Eddie Jordan Sellers?

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Speaker 2: Now all these guys and I'm just standing there looking

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Speaker 2: up at the bleachers. So that's like the mid mid

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Speaker 2: to early seventies, right, they were like one of the

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Speaker 2: top teams in the country at that time. Rutgers was.

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Speaker 2: And that's also the place where at that time freshmen

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Speaker 2: could not play varsity. We're playing a freshman basketball game

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Speaker 2: against Bucknell, and who's sitting up in the stands with

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Speaker 2: Jim Valvano. Even at that time I realized it was

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Speaker 2: going to be there, it.

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Speaker 3: Was all of that.

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Speaker 2: I'm just like another class whatever. I walk up next

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Speaker 2: to Me's sitting up there by himself, and I sat

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Speaker 2: down and I told him, hey, you're really a good coach.

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Speaker 3: I really think you do a great job.

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Speaker 2: All these things different, and then of course the ballpark,

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Speaker 2: the beautiful stadium we have a great stadium. Used to

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Speaker 2: run the steps there all the time in the off

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Speaker 2: season to try to get ready for baseball season. It

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Speaker 2: was just flooded with memories. It was a great day

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Speaker 2: minus the raccoon code.

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Speaker 1: Okay, I mean, listen, we both had great nostalgic weekends.

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Speaker 1: I was in Happy Valley to watch Penn State play

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Speaker 1: probably their best game of the year against Nebraska, and

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Speaker 1: my brother who's on the staff in Nebraska, so I

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Speaker 1: was a little bit conflicted, but same kind of feeling.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you go back to your campus and just

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Speaker 1: those memories come flooding back, and.

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Speaker 4: Things changed and everything.

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Speaker 1: You know, it doesn't stay exactly the same, but sort

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Speaker 1: of the sights, the sounds, even the smells. It's amazing

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Speaker 1: how it transports you back to those years. My quick

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Speaker 1: observation on what's changed is, man, the students are so

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Speaker 1: into groups singing, like the karaoke thing. You know, every

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Speaker 1: time out they're playing these kitschy songs where it's journey

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Speaker 1: or you know, some more present day songs. I don't know,

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Speaker 1: maybe it's the whole TikTok thing is pretty cool. The

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Speaker 1: way they just join in this Ronnie really belting it out.

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Speaker 1: It's like, just imagine like at Fenway Park and it's

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Speaker 1: Neil Diamond there, you know at Fenway when they play

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Speaker 1: that song.

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Speaker 4: Just imagine that happening every time out. It's so cool.

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Speaker 2: Well, even like back in the day we had the bands, right,

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Speaker 2: the bands would in the Lee High band. We were

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Speaker 2: on the lofty side, so the Lee High band was

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Speaker 2: in our face and they're playing this dissonant kind of

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Speaker 2: sound trying to disrupt the team. But you can think

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Speaker 2: of all the fight songs we used to have right

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Speaker 2: or at halftime, the band's marching on the field, which

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Speaker 2: really was cool. It was very cool. It doesn't happen,

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Speaker 2: I don't think often anymore, but the pageantry of I

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Speaker 2: mean your Penn State, obviously, that's the epitome of college football.

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Speaker 2: Lafayette is a rung below that, but it's just so pure.

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Speaker 2: And I'm telling you, our facilities our first class. The

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Speaker 2: place was first class. I could have been more proud

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Speaker 2: to have been there. I met some people had not

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Speaker 2: met before, went down to zeate my fraternity house. Afterwards,

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Speaker 2: met up with some others, talked to the present brothership there.

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Speaker 2: It was just it was just really a wonderful day

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Speaker 2: in a twelve thirty kickoff. Man.

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Speaker 3: That is brilliant, especially at this time of the year.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that is it's Saturday afternoon. Football is awesome. Ye,

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Speaker 1: back to baseball. And while we were watching football, the

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Speaker 1: last opening in Major League Baseball was filled the Colorado

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Speaker 1: Rockies with Paul de Podesta coming back to the game after.

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Speaker 4: A ten year hiatus in the NFL.

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Speaker 1: Is sticking with the guy who was the interim manager

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Speaker 1: last year, Warren Schaeffer, which I find interesting, Joe, because

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Speaker 1: you think, when you know you get a new president

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Speaker 1: of baseball Operations comes in, he wants to install his

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Speaker 1: own person. But in this case, because Paul, I think,

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Speaker 1: has been out for so long, I think it makes

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Speaker 1: a lot of sense to stick with a guy who

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Speaker 1: knows the lay of the land, knows the talent there,

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Speaker 1: and you can decide later on whether he's your guy

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Speaker 1: going forward. But it would be a difficult transition, I

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Speaker 1: would think to bring in somebody new when the guy

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Speaker 1: in the front office chair is new as well. So

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Speaker 1: Warren Schaeffer, And I mean you probably appreciate this, Joe.

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Speaker 1: I mean, he's more than paid his dues. This is

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Speaker 1: a guy he's sort of like the John Schneider of Colorado.

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Speaker 1: In fact, you know he's never been with another organization.

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Speaker 1: Just the same with John Schneider, the way he played

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Speaker 1: in the system in the minor leagues, became a coach

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Speaker 1: and manager in the minor leagues, became a coach in

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Speaker 1: the big leagues and the managing big leagues.

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Speaker 4: Same with Warren Schaffer.

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Speaker 1: Drafted by the Rockies in two thousand and seven, he

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Speaker 1: played through twenty twelve. I started as a manager in

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Speaker 1: a ball in twenty fifteen. He goes to Double A

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Speaker 1: in twenty eighteen, he goes to Triple A in twenty

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Speaker 1: twenty one because of major league coach in twenty three,

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Speaker 1: major league manager in twenty five, replacing Buddy Black. So

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Speaker 1: this is a case, and I know he's still fairly young,

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Speaker 1: but you must say, Joe, this is the guy who's

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Speaker 1: paid his due, is working his way up the ladder.

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Speaker 3: I'm all for that. I think that's wonderful.

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Speaker 2: I have never met him, but I've heard really good things,

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Speaker 2: just like you've described right there, working away up the

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Speaker 2: ladder and having that kind of a footprint within the

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Speaker 2: organization where the new GM coming in a deep adesta

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Speaker 2: not really been. I don't know how strong he's been

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Speaker 2: involved in baseball more recently, but I would almost bet

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Speaker 2: as long as Schaeffer clicks some boxes for him regarding

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Speaker 2: ecquiescence or you know, you know, really being into the

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Speaker 2: analytical game, the fact that he speaks that language, I

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Speaker 2: would even believe that. I don't think that I would

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Speaker 2: think that deep Adesta didn't have a strong feeling or

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Speaker 2: inkling of who he wanted other than somebody that checks

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Speaker 2: some of these boxes. I'm sure as he got closer

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Speaker 2: to the job, he probably started to ask around regarding

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Speaker 2: who would be a good manager. And from everything I'm

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Speaker 2: here and I think all the ras would have pointed

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Speaker 2: back to Shaeffer. So I think it's great. I listen,

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Speaker 2: I was a lifer with the Angels for so many years,

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Speaker 2: so I get it. And when guys like this do

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Speaker 2: work it all the way through, I just think it

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Speaker 2: sends a lot of good messages within the organization. He

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Speaker 2: gives hope to the other guys that are doing trying

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Speaker 2: to do the same thing, working their way through and

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Speaker 2: to be recognized. I've always you know, you're always at

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Speaker 2: the mercy of the people with charge within your organization.

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Speaker 2: To recognize your work. I mean, there's no you know,

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Speaker 2: you can't pound your own drum. You don't have an

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Speaker 2: agent at that point, and it's all word of mouth.

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Speaker 2: So when they when there, when there is recognition within

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Speaker 2: your organization. According to this one guy Shaeffer being hired,

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Speaker 2: I think the rest of the group kind it's a

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Speaker 2: little bit more puffy, and I think you're going to

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Speaker 2: see I'm sure the work's been good, but you can

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Speaker 2: to see even a higher level knowing that if we

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Speaker 2: do this well, we can be rewarded for it.

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Speaker 1: I'm curious, Joe, if you believe there's a way to

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Speaker 1: win in Colorado, because no one has really solved that

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Speaker 1: baseball equivalent of the riddle of the Sphinx.

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Speaker 4: I mean, I really just don't know. Now it's not

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Speaker 4: the same sort of.

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Speaker 1: Hitters ballpark as it was pre humidor don't get me wrong,

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Speaker 1: it's still a hitters' ballpark. It's just not as extreme

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Speaker 1: as it was in the past. The outfield is just

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Speaker 1: way too big. There's too much ground to cover out there,

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Speaker 1: balls juice is falled, Nobody gets thrown out in the

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Speaker 1: bases there because of that, and pitching is really hard

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Speaker 1: because the ball just simply doesn't break as much at

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Speaker 1: altitude as it does in sea level. They had a

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Speaker 1: lot of people come through there, and I know they

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Speaker 1: had that one sort of mini stretch there, the Blake

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Speaker 1: Street Bombers, where they just beat people with offense. But

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Speaker 1: I think it's the most difficult place to win because

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Speaker 1: it's such a different game at altitude.

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Speaker 4: Let's see what Paul deep Podesta does in.

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Speaker 1: Terms of figuring out a way forward in terms of

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Speaker 1: what kind of talent you want to acquire there. But

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Speaker 1: I listen, I know, in a perfect world you say, oh,

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Speaker 1: just load up on sinker ball pitchers, put the ball

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Speaker 1: on the ground, get athletic defenders behind them.

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Speaker 4: It's just not that easy. I mean, just the physical.

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Speaker 1: Challenges of winning in Colorado are really really difficult, and

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Speaker 1: like I said, I think it's the most difficult place

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Speaker 1: to build a winning team.

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Speaker 4: Good luck, Paul Dee Pedesta.

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Speaker 3: I don't disagrebe. I manage in Midland, Texas for two summers.

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Speaker 2: Not at the altitude, but kind of short ballpark, really windy,

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Speaker 2: ball flying out. My description was you're always trying to

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Speaker 2: maneuver your team into position to kick the last field

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Speaker 2: goal because it really always came down to the very end.

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Speaker 2: It was that impacted by the elements with us there,

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Speaker 2: you know defense. This is a minor league, double a team,

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Speaker 2: so you can't really build your team accordingly. But what

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Speaker 2: I found, I mean contact pitching didn't work, you know,

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Speaker 2: guys that and at that time, that was more of

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Speaker 2: the normal component of trying to get somebody to the

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Speaker 2: big leagues. Pitching wise, the guys with making if you're

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Speaker 2: making contact, it's not gonna work. Because even bad contact

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Speaker 2: turned into something good for the offensive team. Yes, ground

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Speaker 2: balls are groovy if you get the ground ball guys, Yes,

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Speaker 2: that does make sense. And then when you do that,

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Speaker 2: you grow the grass, you soften up the dirt in

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Speaker 2: front of the home plate. Now you have to make

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Speaker 2: sure it doesn't impact your team or that it does

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Speaker 2: work in your team's favor offensively.

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Speaker 3: But I mean all these kinds of things. The thing

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Speaker 3: I like.

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Speaker 2: If you can and again it's the you know, the

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Speaker 2: flavor of the day. Anyway, I still like power pitching there.

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Speaker 2: This is one place where if you could get guys

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Speaker 2: that can miss bats, that would be wonderful because like

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Speaker 2: I said, even the ball and play it's it's gonna be.

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Speaker 2: It's just so much ground to cover there, which then

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Speaker 2: speaks to speed.

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Speaker 3: I don't know.

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Speaker 2: I'm almost thinking like the Whitey Herzog method with the

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Speaker 2: Cardinals in the eighties that was considered a very big

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Speaker 2: ballpark back then. Of course, the ball didn't carry like

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Speaker 2: it does in Colorado, but big, and those gaps and

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Speaker 2: those lines at Colorado are huge. Ball goes up in

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Speaker 2: the air, and these guys have so much ground to cover.

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Speaker 2: So I guess, to be more concise, I do like

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Speaker 2: power pitching there if the guy has an extreme ground ball,

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Speaker 2: and there's nothing wrong with that. I like speed. I

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Speaker 2: think speed is not talked about enough to pressure. Put

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Speaker 2: pressure speed, you know, steal your bases, do all kinds

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Speaker 2: of things to mess up. Of course, you want power,

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Speaker 2: but guys even without extraordinary power, still going to have

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Speaker 2: power there because the ball does carry differently, and anything defense,

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Speaker 2: speed and defense. I think, I don't think that's really

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Speaker 2: been the matra out there. Everybody, like you said, wants

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Speaker 2: to bang it, and but I'm telling you got it.

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Speaker 2: This is a place. I think run prevention. I mean,

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Speaker 2: run scoring should occur, but run prevention to me would

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Speaker 2: be thing that would be high on my list, and

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Speaker 2: I would just go out there and get the fastest

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Speaker 2: dudes they can find they could catch a baseball and

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Speaker 2: really try to create more motion with this whole thing

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Speaker 2: and pressurize the other side. I know that's I don't know.

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Speaker 2: I don't even know if that's been spoken about in

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Speaker 2: the past in that regard, But in Midland, man, the

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Speaker 2: other things, you've got to be patient. You're starting pitching,

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Speaker 2: they're gonna give up some points. You just can't keep

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Speaker 2: going to your bullpen. So sometimes you're gonna have to

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Speaker 2: absorb games where you give up more from your starting pitcher,

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Speaker 2: and even if the game is lost, at least you

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Speaker 2: don't burn out your whole bullpen that day. So there's

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Speaker 2: a there's a patience with your starters there, and also

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Speaker 2: knowing that on your side of things you can also

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Speaker 2: come back. So that was a different part of it,

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Speaker 2: Just the patient approach with starters and as much power

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Speaker 2: as you can get or or pitchers with one. I

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Speaker 2: mean a power pitch. It doesn't have to be fastball,

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Speaker 2: like an extraordinary like say, for instance, split or forkball,

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Speaker 2: just a co ordinary changeup. I would go for guys

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Speaker 2: either with power or power with one extraordinary other pitch.

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Speaker 1: Now, now that we've filled all the managerial openings, if

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Speaker 1: this is really interesting, Joe, to look at where the

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Speaker 1: game is going and where the trends are and what

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Speaker 1: teams are looking for.

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Speaker 4: So we had nine jobs that were open.

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Speaker 1: That's almost the third of the teams in baseball flipped

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Speaker 1: over the manager's role. Of the nine managers that were hired,

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Speaker 1: five of them are on their first time job. The

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Speaker 1: average age of the nine managers hired this offseason is

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Speaker 1: just forty five point one years old. Seven of those

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Speaker 1: nine managers hired are between thirty three and forty seven. Now,

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Speaker 1: if you look at the four managers who actually have

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Speaker 1: managed before, and that's Walt Weiss in Atlanta, Derek Shelton Minnesota,

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Speaker 1: Skips Shoemaker in Texas, and Warren Schaeffer back with the Rockies,

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Speaker 1: their combined winning percentage in the major leagues is four

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Speaker 1: nineteen four, nineteen seven, seventy one and one thoy sixty nine. So,

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Speaker 1: in other words, there is nobody of the nine managers

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Speaker 1: hired who has any kind of a track record of

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Speaker 1: success in the major leagues. I just find that fascinating

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Speaker 1: and I'm not get your take on this, Joe, but

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Speaker 1: my take is we hear so much now about these

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Speaker 1: front office dudes talking about connecting with players, and I

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Speaker 1: think there's a lot of truth to that that the

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Speaker 1: way to run a game now is basically a shared responsibility.

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Speaker 1: There's so much help that the front office gives the

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Speaker 1: manager and everybody's pretty much doing it the same way.

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Speaker 1: That the top priority now is how do you get

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Speaker 1: the players to play for you? Well, if you're younger,

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Speaker 1: you can relate better to the players, speak the same language,

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Speaker 1: and they'll play for you. That's my take on what

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Speaker 1: managers are looking for essentially, And we've talked about this

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Speaker 1: in the past, Joe.

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Speaker 4: They're looking for the next Stephen vote.

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Speaker 1: And when you look at you know, Craig Stamin in

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Speaker 1: San Diego, Lake but Tera Washington, Greg Galman is in Baltimore,

293
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Speaker 1: Tony Vtello with the Giants, and Kurtsuzuki with the Angels,

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Speaker 1: they're all looking for the next Stephen vote.

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Speaker 3: Right, flavor of the day stuff.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, in today's game, the media component of

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Speaker 2: it is way more important than the experience of actually

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Speaker 2: running a baseball game. Whether it's the social media component

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Speaker 2: of whether it's the media media component of at the

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Speaker 2: multiple press conferences you have to run, and also the

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Speaker 2: furthermore the just the interviews you have to do, whether

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Speaker 2: it's radio, TV, zoom, whatever, there's all kinds of commitments

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Speaker 2: on a daily basis when you walk into the building.

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Speaker 2: So I think that again, like you're saying, the way

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Speaker 2: the game is administrator right now, where there is a

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Speaker 2: way more heavy hand coming from top to the to

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Speaker 2: the middle, which is the dugout in the field.

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Speaker 3: They they, like I said, we talked about it.

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Speaker 2: They being the front office, who prefer somebody that could

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Speaker 2: be more influenced than just telling you the truth. They

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Speaker 2: want that that influence from top to middle. And with that,

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Speaker 2: as long as these guys like you said, it's it's

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Speaker 2: just different. I mean even actually you're just bleeding into

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Speaker 2: my thought for the day afterwards already. You know, it's

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Speaker 2: just a matter of this this connection process, the way

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Speaker 2: we connect and the the the shorter attention spans that

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Speaker 2: we're we have developed. I think it's intentionally, but it's

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Speaker 2: been unintentional that my my my attention pen has been

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Speaker 2: shortened a bit, but intentionally done through algorithms et cetera.

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Speaker 2: So it's it's got to be a different tact in

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Speaker 2: a sense. These players don't really they don't connect to

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Speaker 2: the past as much.

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Speaker 3: They don't, you know, the history of the game.

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Speaker 2: I don't think for most of them really is that

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Speaker 2: important their history really pretty much will be talking about

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Speaker 2: what they saw on their phones after the game, whether

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Speaker 2: it's Instagram, whatever, Facebook, I don't care, whatever they're connected with.

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Speaker 2: So there's a different kind of connection involvement here as

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Speaker 2: compared to the past. So I understand it. That's exactly

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Speaker 2: what's going on. And again it's just it's what's in

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Speaker 2: vogue right now. Will it eventually pass? I don't know,

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Speaker 2: you know. And again talking not giving it away, but

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Speaker 2: what I was going to mention afterwards, it's just how

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Speaker 2: we're being trained as a society right now. And whether

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Speaker 2: you're a baseball player or a plumb room my guy

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Speaker 2: Aaron's going to show up in a little bit or whatever,

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Speaker 2: that's just the way the world's working. We were getting

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Speaker 2: these these short sound bites and these short little thoughts,

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Speaker 2: and listening skills are really being becoming evaporated. The ability

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Speaker 2: to focus and concentrate on one thing for a period of

341
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Speaker 2: time has been become lesson than it's been trained to

342
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Speaker 2: be that way. So speaking the same language I think

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Speaker 2: probably is important. Probably it is important, it's just a

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Speaker 2: different method being incorporated. So I think the way these

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Speaker 2: guys are being chosen is the sensibilities that they may

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Speaker 2: have in common with the players, and the fact that

347
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Speaker 2: everybody's doing it. Of course, because it's such an ancestual situation.

348
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Speaker 2: All these GM's presidents talk among one another and they're

349
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Speaker 2: all after the same thing.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, that's a big part of it as well.

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Speaker 1: If you go out and hire someone like, you know,

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Speaker 1: a Blake Butterra thirty three years old, never been in

353
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Speaker 1: a Major league dugout personally, I like the hire.

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Speaker 4: I mean I do.

355
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Speaker 1: I think if you're looking for leadership, and I do

356
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Speaker 1: think that is that's I think that at the top

357
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Speaker 1: of the wish list, you have to be a leader.

358
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Speaker 4: In today's game experience, maybe not so much.

359
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Speaker 1: We talked about that with all the help that these

360
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Speaker 1: managers are getting running a game and choosing a staff

361
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Speaker 1: even but if you're a leader that's a parent at

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Speaker 1: thirty three for the really good ones, now it may

363
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Speaker 1: not work out, But I I don't mind the fact

364
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Speaker 1: that they're taking a flyer, so to speak. But that

365
00:19:08,078 --> 00:19:10,278
Speaker 1: makes it easier for the Padres to hire a guy

366
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Speaker 1: like Craig Stammitt, a former pitcher who's never managed before

367
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Speaker 1: at forty one, to run a team that's expected to

368
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Speaker 1: compete for the National League Pennant and on down the

369
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Speaker 1: line Craig Almernez, Kurtzuzuki, and on and on.

370
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Speaker 4: It goes right, you see other teams do it.

371
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Speaker 1: I'm not against it, Joe, but I do think that

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Speaker 1: communication and again that we're connecting, connecting with the players

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Speaker 1: is really driving these decisions, and that means skewing younger.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and again it's just it is. It's what's happening now.

375
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Speaker 2: It is the church of what's happening now, and it's

376
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Speaker 2: readily accepted. And again we'll we talked. I think we've

377
00:19:51,358 --> 00:19:53,918
Speaker 2: talked about this. But the outside of the box thinking

378
00:19:54,678 --> 00:19:56,798
Speaker 2: of the last twenty years is now in the box.

379
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Speaker 2: These kind of things are becoming so commonplace you can't

380
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Speaker 2: say it's outside of the box anymore. Almost conservativism is

381
00:20:03,438 --> 00:20:06,998
Speaker 2: becoming outside the box, where this more progressive approach to

382
00:20:07,038 --> 00:20:10,238
Speaker 2: doing things is more of being in the box. So yeah,

383
00:20:10,318 --> 00:20:16,318
Speaker 2: that's it's unique time to be proven whether it's right

384
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Speaker 2: or wrong, or it's going to be successful or not,

385
00:20:19,198 --> 00:20:22,278
Speaker 2: like an like anyc change, whatever you always have, it's

386
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Speaker 2: going to take time to find.

387
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Speaker 3: Out the results of all this.

388
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Speaker 2: And it's and again it's like the whoever is in

389
00:20:27,958 --> 00:20:30,118
Speaker 2: charge gets to create the rules. And that's just the

390
00:20:30,118 --> 00:20:32,518
Speaker 2: way it is right now. The way the thing is

391
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Speaker 2: being constructed is based on a set of guidelines that

392
00:20:37,278 --> 00:20:39,638
Speaker 2: you know, probably started with moneyball to a points filtered

393
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Speaker 2: into the rays when we were there, and then eventually

394
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Speaker 2: I still didn't feel a lot of it. I don't

395
00:20:44,878 --> 00:20:48,078
Speaker 2: think twenty fourteen fifteen, I think it really hit the

396
00:20:48,158 --> 00:20:50,798
Speaker 2: ground running post that, like twenty seven eighteen nineteen. I

397
00:20:50,838 --> 00:20:53,878
Speaker 2: think that's when this really became an accelerated method of

398
00:20:53,878 --> 00:20:57,838
Speaker 2: front office to managers becoming middle managers. So it's just

399
00:20:58,118 --> 00:21:00,998
Speaker 2: a gradual transitions that's been occurring. Like most I don't

400
00:21:00,998 --> 00:21:03,038
Speaker 2: think it's something that we've talked about.

401
00:21:03,078 --> 00:21:03,318
Speaker 3: It.

402
00:21:03,318 --> 00:21:05,318
Speaker 2: It's not like ripping the band aid off. It's just

403
00:21:05,718 --> 00:21:08,518
Speaker 2: slowly pulling it off and eventually you expose whatever you

404
00:21:08,558 --> 00:21:10,838
Speaker 2: want to expose. And I think that's what's happening, and

405
00:21:10,838 --> 00:21:13,238
Speaker 2: that's how I see it, and again, I'm not arguing

406
00:21:13,238 --> 00:21:15,878
Speaker 2: whether it's good or bad. I'm just saying from my perspective,

407
00:21:16,518 --> 00:21:18,358
Speaker 2: I wrote something down when you were talking about this

408
00:21:18,398 --> 00:21:20,398
Speaker 2: in the beginning, I never wanted something before it.

409
00:21:20,358 --> 00:21:20,918
Speaker 3: Was my time.

410
00:21:20,958 --> 00:21:24,198
Speaker 2: I was so aware of, Oh yeah, I wanted to

411
00:21:24,198 --> 00:21:26,158
Speaker 2: be a manager. But am I ready to be a manager?

412
00:21:26,158 --> 00:21:29,398
Speaker 2: If I am? I a leader? I know leadership qualities.

413
00:21:29,438 --> 00:21:32,438
Speaker 2: I think to me, those are accumulated over time. And

414
00:21:33,478 --> 00:21:35,278
Speaker 2: you know, whether you start as a quarterback in midsured

415
00:21:35,278 --> 00:21:37,438
Speaker 2: football and eventually end up as a major league manager,

416
00:21:37,678 --> 00:21:39,158
Speaker 2: you're calling your own plays on your tin.

417
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Speaker 3: Does that groom lead? What? What does groom leadership? And

418
00:21:42,358 --> 00:21:45,238
Speaker 3: what does that actually mean? So I think.

419
00:21:45,118 --> 00:21:49,158
Speaker 2: Sometimes those terms are thrown out there very casually without

420
00:21:49,198 --> 00:21:52,238
Speaker 2: really understanding. You know what, Okay, when you say the

421
00:21:52,238 --> 00:21:54,718
Speaker 2: guys regular, what does that mean He's a great communicator,

422
00:21:55,158 --> 00:21:58,198
Speaker 2: is a great motivator? Does he have this ability to connect?

423
00:21:58,318 --> 00:22:01,118
Speaker 2: Is he a great listener? What are these qualities that

424
00:22:01,158 --> 00:22:03,118
Speaker 2: you're really digging on them? And then how does react

425
00:22:03,118 --> 00:22:05,798
Speaker 2: in the pressure moment, a moment that he's never really

426
00:22:05,838 --> 00:22:08,478
Speaker 2: been confronted within the past, or has he been that

427
00:22:08,558 --> 00:22:11,838
Speaker 2: You've seen this grace under pressure where where he's really

428
00:22:11,838 --> 00:22:14,918
Speaker 2: developed experience. All these things are this is how I

429
00:22:14,958 --> 00:22:17,278
Speaker 2: evaluate these moves, and as I'm watching them, this is

430
00:22:17,278 --> 00:22:19,278
Speaker 2: what I think, and so I'm curious.

431
00:22:19,318 --> 00:22:21,678
Speaker 3: I listen. I really want them all to do well.

432
00:22:22,118 --> 00:22:22,558
Speaker 3: To shoot.

433
00:22:22,558 --> 00:22:24,678
Speaker 2: I was I was fifty one and I was considered

434
00:22:24,718 --> 00:22:27,318
Speaker 2: young in a sense when I got my managerial job

435
00:22:27,598 --> 00:22:30,838
Speaker 2: in two thousand and six, and think, I thank god

436
00:22:30,838 --> 00:22:31,958
Speaker 2: I didn't get it before them.

437
00:22:32,598 --> 00:22:34,438
Speaker 1: Just think about that, you are fifty one and the

438
00:22:34,518 --> 00:22:37,638
Speaker 1: average age of managers hired nine managers hired.

439
00:22:37,558 --> 00:22:40,838
Speaker 4: Is forty five. It's really changed quickly.

440
00:22:41,878 --> 00:22:45,638
Speaker 1: Hey, there's been a one on one from one old

441
00:22:45,678 --> 00:22:49,158
Speaker 1: fashioned baseball trade. We need to talk about this between

442
00:22:49,198 --> 00:22:51,918
Speaker 1: the Mets and the Rangers. It's a fascinating one. We'll

443
00:22:51,918 --> 00:23:01,158
Speaker 1: do that right after this on the Book of Joe.

444
00:23:07,038 --> 00:23:10,038
Speaker 4: Welcome back to the Book of Joe. Trade season it's

445
00:23:10,078 --> 00:23:12,398
Speaker 4: already been in full swing, I think.

446
00:23:12,518 --> 00:23:15,198
Speaker 1: I mean, we talked about Grayson Rodriguez and the Orioles

447
00:23:15,238 --> 00:23:18,558
Speaker 1: going to the Angels for turned Ward and now this

448
00:23:18,678 --> 00:23:20,598
Speaker 1: was I think as surprise for a lot of people.

449
00:23:20,638 --> 00:23:24,798
Speaker 1: Joe brandon Nimo, lifelong Met gets traded to Texas for

450
00:23:24,998 --> 00:23:27,318
Speaker 1: Marcus Simeon, who's sort of the heart and soul with

451
00:23:27,798 --> 00:23:30,278
Speaker 1: Cory Seger their World Championship team just a couple of

452
00:23:30,318 --> 00:23:33,958
Speaker 1: years ago. This was an interesting one for me, Joe,

453
00:23:33,998 --> 00:23:37,998
Speaker 1: because I think it boils down to this. Both teams

454
00:23:38,678 --> 00:23:43,038
Speaker 1: don't like the players under the contracts they're currently playing for,

455
00:23:43,598 --> 00:23:49,118
Speaker 1: so they're basically choosing the lesser of two evils, and

456
00:23:49,158 --> 00:23:53,518
Speaker 1: it more directly guys that probably more fit the makeup

457
00:23:53,558 --> 00:23:57,438
Speaker 1: of their team. For Texas, with Adulas Garcia getting non tendered,

458
00:23:58,118 --> 00:24:02,078
Speaker 1: the outfielder of Brandon Neimo makes sense, whereas Josh Wilson

459
00:24:02,318 --> 00:24:04,358
Speaker 1: just Smith and go play base.

460
00:24:04,998 --> 00:24:05,078
Speaker 3: Uh.

461
00:24:05,238 --> 00:24:07,398
Speaker 1: And for the Mets, who were a terrible defensive team

462
00:24:07,478 --> 00:24:11,518
Speaker 1: last year, Simeon gives them elite defense at second base.

463
00:24:11,918 --> 00:24:14,598
Speaker 1: So what was your first reaction when you heard about

464
00:24:14,678 --> 00:24:16,118
Speaker 1: Nemo for Simeon.

465
00:24:16,278 --> 00:24:18,398
Speaker 2: One hundred percent? I mean they're both older. I was

466
00:24:18,438 --> 00:24:20,678
Speaker 2: at thirty three and thirty five something like that. Yep,

467
00:24:20,758 --> 00:24:22,798
Speaker 2: I mean I I you know, when you look at that,

468
00:24:23,118 --> 00:24:25,718
Speaker 2: the only guy I could compa that with is when

469
00:24:25,718 --> 00:24:28,318
Speaker 2: we got Zo with the Cubs. But he was not

470
00:24:28,358 --> 00:24:30,478
Speaker 2: I don't think quite thirty five, or maybe he was,

471
00:24:31,838 --> 00:24:34,358
Speaker 2: but I thought it was an exchange of contracts and

472
00:24:34,398 --> 00:24:37,398
Speaker 2: players that you know, almost equal in age and money

473
00:24:37,478 --> 00:24:39,278
Speaker 2: zoed and all that kind of good stuff.

474
00:24:39,878 --> 00:24:40,278
Speaker 3: And so.

475
00:24:42,038 --> 00:24:44,198
Speaker 2: But then it probably fits a need. I mean, the

476
00:24:44,598 --> 00:24:47,278
Speaker 2: Mets wanting to improve their defense.

477
00:24:47,478 --> 00:24:47,998
Speaker 3: I get it.

478
00:24:49,118 --> 00:24:51,118
Speaker 2: Marcus was not as good at the play lash Man

479
00:24:51,158 --> 00:24:54,478
Speaker 2: when this guy was like hot a couple of years ago. Well,

480
00:24:54,678 --> 00:24:57,798
Speaker 2: that was like one of the better offensive players in

481
00:24:57,838 --> 00:24:59,158
Speaker 2: the league. So I didn't watch them last so I

482
00:24:59,198 --> 00:25:02,038
Speaker 2: don't know what the difference is. And on the other side, Nemo,

483
00:25:02,078 --> 00:25:03,398
Speaker 2: I mean, he gets hurt a little bit too, So

484
00:25:03,398 --> 00:25:05,718
Speaker 2: I don't even know how that played into it. And

485
00:25:05,758 --> 00:25:07,998
Speaker 2: maybe they thought, you know, at thirty three, starting to

486
00:25:07,998 --> 00:25:10,518
Speaker 2: lose some of his juice. But I think they also

487
00:25:10,558 --> 00:25:13,518
Speaker 2: have some people in the outfield coming on up that

488
00:25:13,558 --> 00:25:15,478
Speaker 2: they would prefer to get a look at. So I

489
00:25:15,478 --> 00:25:16,598
Speaker 2: just think it was one of those like, you know,

490
00:25:16,638 --> 00:25:20,158
Speaker 2: exchanging salaries and ages and let's give it a different look.

491
00:25:20,158 --> 00:25:23,198
Speaker 2: We need to we'd like to improve our defense. Marcus

492
00:25:23,278 --> 00:25:25,718
Speaker 2: kind of checks that, Nemo. You know, he's kind of

493
00:25:25,758 --> 00:25:27,678
Speaker 2: this this raw rock kind of dude that flies all

494
00:25:27,678 --> 00:25:31,838
Speaker 2: over the place and that's cool, and so there's probably

495
00:25:31,918 --> 00:25:34,798
Speaker 2: some kind of I don't even know, like it's a need,

496
00:25:34,798 --> 00:25:37,558
Speaker 2: but an ancillary need that kind of checked a box,

497
00:25:37,598 --> 00:25:39,998
Speaker 2: but I think the salary and age component of it

498
00:25:41,238 --> 00:25:44,078
Speaker 2: made it more amenable. And then the slight need on

499
00:25:44,238 --> 00:25:47,678
Speaker 2: both sides to improve like thirty five. I mean, that's

500
00:25:48,198 --> 00:25:52,318
Speaker 2: to really believe that he's going to be that guy.

501
00:25:52,358 --> 00:25:54,238
Speaker 2: And actually I read in the paper today where Sterns

502
00:25:54,278 --> 00:25:57,238
Speaker 2: was talking about not necessarily looking for the offense, but

503
00:25:57,278 --> 00:26:00,278
Speaker 2: they believe their defense was so inaddict with that, he's

504
00:26:00,318 --> 00:26:02,678
Speaker 2: going to provide even if he doesn't hit as he

505
00:26:02,758 --> 00:26:04,678
Speaker 2: had a couple of years ago, that he's still going

506
00:26:04,718 --> 00:26:06,678
Speaker 2: to provide what they're looking for through defense. I don't

507
00:26:06,678 --> 00:26:10,158
Speaker 2: know if that was a rationalization or totally believe in it.

508
00:26:11,198 --> 00:26:13,478
Speaker 1: I think he totally believes in it, because if you

509
00:26:13,518 --> 00:26:18,238
Speaker 1: look at the Baseball actuarial charts, you cannot trade for

510
00:26:18,278 --> 00:26:21,638
Speaker 1: a thirty five year old second baseman and think you're

511
00:26:21,678 --> 00:26:23,078
Speaker 1: going to get offense.

512
00:26:23,598 --> 00:26:24,998
Speaker 4: I mean, you mentioned it down here.

513
00:26:25,078 --> 00:26:29,118
Speaker 1: Last year he had a foot fracture, so the injury

514
00:26:29,198 --> 00:26:31,718
Speaker 1: was related to this, but he has been trending down.

515
00:26:32,118 --> 00:26:34,518
Speaker 1: It's amazing to me, Joe and I've seen this happen

516
00:26:34,598 --> 00:26:38,718
Speaker 1: time and time again. Those middle infielders, especially second basemen,

517
00:26:38,758 --> 00:26:42,838
Speaker 1: who play a lot talking about Dustin Pedroia DJ Lemayhew

518
00:26:43,278 --> 00:26:46,798
Speaker 1: with Maryfield, they go quickly. I saw it happen to

519
00:26:46,878 --> 00:26:51,118
Speaker 1: Robbie Alomar, And it's been funny that you mentioned Ben Zobrist.

520
00:26:52,038 --> 00:26:56,038
Speaker 1: He is the last second baseman at age thirty five

521
00:26:56,358 --> 00:27:00,078
Speaker 1: or older who was even average in terms of adjusted

522
00:27:00,118 --> 00:27:03,158
Speaker 1: OPS playing one hundred games at second base. That was

523
00:27:03,158 --> 00:27:07,158
Speaker 1: in twenty six team. So we've gone eight full seasons

524
00:27:07,318 --> 00:27:11,038
Speaker 1: in which there has been sixty two second basemen who've

525
00:27:11,078 --> 00:27:15,958
Speaker 1: been at least average offensively. None of them were thirty

526
00:27:15,998 --> 00:27:18,878
Speaker 1: five or older. So the idea that you're trading for

527
00:27:18,998 --> 00:27:22,198
Speaker 1: Marcasimion after a down year and you're taking on years

528
00:27:22,238 --> 00:27:25,758
Speaker 1: thirty five, thirty six, and thirty seven to play second

529
00:27:25,758 --> 00:27:28,718
Speaker 1: base and think you're going to get offense from him

530
00:27:29,078 --> 00:27:32,398
Speaker 1: ain't happening. I think David Stearns, he's a smart guy.

531
00:27:32,718 --> 00:27:35,438
Speaker 1: He knows that, but he also knows that this guy

532
00:27:35,438 --> 00:27:38,278
Speaker 1: can still play defense. The Mets defense was bad. It

533
00:27:38,358 --> 00:27:41,278
Speaker 1: was bottom ten last year in the big leagues, and

534
00:27:41,598 --> 00:27:44,878
Speaker 1: Stearns realizes to get more out of his pitching, he

535
00:27:44,958 --> 00:27:47,758
Speaker 1: needs better defense. I mean, look around the Mets field

536
00:27:47,878 --> 00:27:49,638
Speaker 1: and what they put out there last year. They just

537
00:27:49,798 --> 00:27:53,758
Speaker 1: don't have enough rangy athletes to cover ground in the

538
00:27:53,758 --> 00:27:57,398
Speaker 1: outfield and infield behind their pitching. And that included Brandon Neimo,

539
00:27:57,718 --> 00:28:00,638
Speaker 1: who can't throw and to me as a below average defender.

540
00:28:01,398 --> 00:28:04,318
Speaker 1: So David Sterns figures, you know what, we've got to

541
00:28:04,518 --> 00:28:08,398
Speaker 1: improve our run prevention. And that's not just about going

542
00:28:08,438 --> 00:28:10,918
Speaker 1: out there and buying more pitchers on the free agent market.

543
00:28:11,038 --> 00:28:14,918
Speaker 1: It's about improving yourself defensively. Now they've done that, They've

544
00:28:14,918 --> 00:28:18,358
Speaker 1: improved themselves defensively. Listen, this is early in the winter.

545
00:28:18,478 --> 00:28:21,598
Speaker 1: There's more moves to make. But there's no way that

546
00:28:21,678 --> 00:28:24,118
Speaker 1: you can go into twenty twenty six, twenty seven and

547
00:28:24,198 --> 00:28:26,558
Speaker 1: twenty eight and think that Marcus Simeon is going to

548
00:28:26,598 --> 00:28:30,558
Speaker 1: be an above average player. It's not happening. This guy

549
00:28:30,758 --> 00:28:33,078
Speaker 1: rarely misses time. I know, I just spoke about his

550
00:28:33,118 --> 00:28:37,598
Speaker 1: injury last year. That's the anomaly. This dude plays every day.

551
00:28:37,638 --> 00:28:40,118
Speaker 1: I mean he's taking more than six hundred plate appearances

552
00:28:40,238 --> 00:28:43,198
Speaker 1: every year, year after year after year. Now he's a

553
00:28:43,198 --> 00:28:45,758
Speaker 1: great clubhouse guy. I mean that's a part of it too.

554
00:28:45,798 --> 00:28:47,558
Speaker 1: It's not the reason you make a deal because the

555
00:28:47,558 --> 00:28:49,998
Speaker 1: guy's a good clubhouse guy. But that's a nice ancillary

556
00:28:50,038 --> 00:28:53,038
Speaker 1: bonus you're getting with Marcus Simeon. So I get what

557
00:28:53,158 --> 00:28:55,718
Speaker 1: David Sturns is doing here. But folks, I'm telling you

558
00:28:56,038 --> 00:28:59,158
Speaker 1: this guy is a dead pole hitter. He's not going

559
00:28:59,238 --> 00:29:01,878
Speaker 1: to be a three hundred hitter, you know, getting on

560
00:29:01,998 --> 00:29:03,918
Speaker 1: base thirty five percent of the time of the time

561
00:29:03,958 --> 00:29:04,758
Speaker 1: to lineup.

562
00:29:04,998 --> 00:29:06,958
Speaker 4: That ain't happening with Marcus Simeon.

563
00:29:06,878 --> 00:29:10,158
Speaker 2: Starts right there. You just mentioned it. The fact that

564
00:29:10,198 --> 00:29:12,358
Speaker 2: he plays so much and you're seeing a decline. I mean,

565
00:29:13,078 --> 00:29:15,358
Speaker 2: I'm just going to try to means Zoe, see, Zoe,

566
00:29:15,398 --> 00:29:17,078
Speaker 2: you had to give some time off. But I'll tell

567
00:29:17,078 --> 00:29:22,878
Speaker 2: you one thing about Zorrilla. His post game workouts were phenomenal.

568
00:29:23,278 --> 00:29:26,038
Speaker 2: What he did after games after he played, getting ready

569
00:29:26,038 --> 00:29:28,198
Speaker 2: for the next day. If I'd let him know, of course,

570
00:29:28,198 --> 00:29:29,798
Speaker 2: if he's going to play tomorrow or not, if it's

571
00:29:29,838 --> 00:29:30,878
Speaker 2: a day game after night game.

572
00:29:30,998 --> 00:29:31,598
Speaker 3: Tried not to.

573
00:29:32,278 --> 00:29:34,718
Speaker 2: However, there's times, maybe late year, you wanted to make

574
00:29:35,038 --> 00:29:38,038
Speaker 2: sure that he still had him out there. So that

575
00:29:38,238 --> 00:29:41,638
Speaker 2: was a part of it with Zoe. Now Simeon, you

576
00:29:41,758 --> 00:29:43,998
Speaker 2: got to you're going to have to. I would just

577
00:29:44,038 --> 00:29:46,078
Speaker 2: start with that. I would create some kind of a

578
00:29:46,118 --> 00:29:49,638
Speaker 2: plan and have a backup of course at second base,

579
00:29:50,158 --> 00:29:52,718
Speaker 2: probably primarily because if I have a fly ball pitcher

580
00:29:52,718 --> 00:29:55,558
Speaker 2: pitching that day starter, you know, that might be the

581
00:29:55,558 --> 00:29:58,038
Speaker 2: better day to give him off. But I would really

582
00:29:58,558 --> 00:30:00,318
Speaker 2: see if I could get more offense out of him

583
00:30:00,358 --> 00:30:02,518
Speaker 2: by rescuing him a little bit. And then, of course,

584
00:30:02,558 --> 00:30:04,558
Speaker 2: as you get to be thirty five, if you want

585
00:30:04,598 --> 00:30:07,198
Speaker 2: to fulfill this contract in any way, shape or form

586
00:30:07,238 --> 00:30:11,798
Speaker 2: that it at least comes to something where it feels acceptable,

587
00:30:11,838 --> 00:30:14,438
Speaker 2: I would really and I'm sure they've already talked about it,

588
00:30:14,478 --> 00:30:17,158
Speaker 2: you I would really develop a plan for days offer

589
00:30:17,278 --> 00:30:19,718
Speaker 2: him because I'm telling you, when that bat is alive,

590
00:30:19,758 --> 00:30:22,358
Speaker 2: but ball comes off hot. And I didn't realize he

591
00:30:22,398 --> 00:30:25,998
Speaker 2: had played that many games on an annual basis, So

592
00:30:26,878 --> 00:30:29,638
Speaker 2: moving it forward, you know, just I'm sure you know

593
00:30:29,678 --> 00:30:31,558
Speaker 2: he works very hard. Like most of these guys. Do

594
00:30:32,278 --> 00:30:35,598
Speaker 2: Zoe was a postgame freak, which always impressed me. Bob

595
00:30:35,638 --> 00:30:38,478
Speaker 2: Boone was a postgame freak as a as a catcher

596
00:30:38,518 --> 00:30:40,558
Speaker 2: back in the day, and he played until he was

597
00:30:40,558 --> 00:30:42,798
Speaker 2: forty years old. I don't know what this guy does,

598
00:30:42,838 --> 00:30:47,878
Speaker 2: Marcus does, but I would really pay attention to giving

599
00:30:47,918 --> 00:30:51,238
Speaker 2: him his rest and see we get more bat while

600
00:30:51,238 --> 00:30:54,358
Speaker 2: we're still feeling the benefits of his defense.

601
00:30:55,038 --> 00:30:58,158
Speaker 1: On the Texas side, I talked about the fact that

602
00:30:58,358 --> 00:31:02,198
Speaker 1: non tender Adolice Garcia, who's just gone hit basically his

603
00:31:02,198 --> 00:31:04,478
Speaker 1: game has cratered since twenty twenty three. I mean, the

604
00:31:04,478 --> 00:31:07,358
Speaker 1: guy just cannot catch up to velocity at this point.

605
00:31:07,918 --> 00:31:10,318
Speaker 1: Way too many strikeouts in the Texas lineup. They're trying

606
00:31:10,358 --> 00:31:12,518
Speaker 1: to change that. They're trying to get younger, trying to

607
00:31:12,518 --> 00:31:15,678
Speaker 1: get more athletic. Now, it's interesting Nimo actually strikes out

608
00:31:15,678 --> 00:31:19,558
Speaker 1: at a higher rate than Simeon does. I mentioned he's

609
00:31:19,598 --> 00:31:22,798
Speaker 1: not a great defender in the outfield. I imagine they'll

610
00:31:22,798 --> 00:31:25,758
Speaker 1: put him in left field. You know, you've got Carter,

611
00:31:25,918 --> 00:31:29,318
Speaker 1: You've got Wyatt Langford there also in the outfield.

612
00:31:29,758 --> 00:31:30,438
Speaker 4: It's interesting.

613
00:31:30,438 --> 00:31:32,518
Speaker 1: I don't know where Texas is going here, Joe, other

614
00:31:32,598 --> 00:31:34,558
Speaker 1: than trying to put the ball in play a little

615
00:31:34,558 --> 00:31:34,798
Speaker 1: bit more.

616
00:31:34,878 --> 00:31:36,238
Speaker 4: They're trying to get a little bit younger.

617
00:31:36,638 --> 00:31:40,078
Speaker 1: Do they try to now trade Corey Seeger and just

618
00:31:40,638 --> 00:31:43,198
Speaker 1: full on in terms of, you know, moving on from

619
00:31:43,198 --> 00:31:44,358
Speaker 1: the championship team from.

620
00:31:44,238 --> 00:31:45,158
Speaker 4: A couple of years ago.

621
00:31:45,958 --> 00:31:49,238
Speaker 1: They're in a transition period here, you know, like the Mets,

622
00:31:49,318 --> 00:31:51,718
Speaker 1: let's wait and see how the rest of the offseason

623
00:31:51,718 --> 00:31:52,358
Speaker 1: plays out.

624
00:31:53,918 --> 00:31:55,718
Speaker 4: But listen, I believe the Mets are.

625
00:31:55,598 --> 00:31:58,638
Speaker 1: Happy to be out from five years of Brandon Nimo

626
00:31:58,998 --> 00:32:03,158
Speaker 1: watching him age as an outfielder. The Rangers are taking

627
00:32:03,198 --> 00:32:07,998
Speaker 1: on that aging curve of Brandon Demo. It's just a

628
00:32:08,038 --> 00:32:12,518
Speaker 1: fascinating trade. Again, I don't think either one is a

629
00:32:12,638 --> 00:32:16,478
Speaker 1: true impact player that's going to change the fortunes of

630
00:32:16,518 --> 00:32:19,958
Speaker 1: the team. It's sort of shuffling the cards a little

631
00:32:19,998 --> 00:32:23,958
Speaker 1: bit here based on what positions they play. But I

632
00:32:23,958 --> 00:32:26,238
Speaker 1: can tell you both teams seem to be happy to

633
00:32:26,278 --> 00:32:29,238
Speaker 1: be out from under the commitment they had left on

634
00:32:29,278 --> 00:32:30,158
Speaker 1: these contracts.

635
00:32:30,518 --> 00:32:33,078
Speaker 2: Yeah, but they still have a commitment left both sides, right,

636
00:32:33,158 --> 00:32:35,998
Speaker 2: I mean there's still things, There's still numbers and dollars

637
00:32:36,078 --> 00:32:38,838
Speaker 2: left on both sides. So again, you'd have to like

638
00:32:39,238 --> 00:32:41,318
Speaker 2: look under the hood the Rangers hood, look under the

639
00:32:41,358 --> 00:32:45,118
Speaker 2: Mets hood, and really try to understand completely why they

640
00:32:45,158 --> 00:32:48,438
Speaker 2: did this, because again, it looks like a push kind

641
00:32:48,438 --> 00:32:51,558
Speaker 2: of a thing. On the surface. We're getting better defense,

642
00:32:51,638 --> 00:32:55,038
Speaker 2: We're getting this energetic outfielder. How does it fit into

643
00:32:55,078 --> 00:32:57,438
Speaker 2: our plans? I mean, somebody liked them for whatever reason,

644
00:32:57,638 --> 00:32:59,918
Speaker 2: or like I said, it was just I don't know why,

645
00:32:59,958 --> 00:33:04,438
Speaker 2: but this even Steven Exchange, just this mooth guys on

646
00:33:04,478 --> 00:33:07,438
Speaker 2: and see if it has any kind of ceber rattling

647
00:33:07,438 --> 00:33:08,958
Speaker 2: effect and all of a sudden we get somebody get

648
00:33:08,998 --> 00:33:12,038
Speaker 2: something better out of it. Just it's a curiosity thing.

649
00:33:13,278 --> 00:33:15,798
Speaker 2: We'll see what happens. But it is it's kind of

650
00:33:15,838 --> 00:33:17,958
Speaker 2: like was a head scratch when I read it too,

651
00:33:18,118 --> 00:33:20,238
Speaker 2: other than the fact that the age and the salaries

652
00:33:20,598 --> 00:33:21,438
Speaker 2: kind of matched up.

653
00:33:21,678 --> 00:33:24,158
Speaker 1: And meanwhile, hal Steinbrenner made a little bit of a

654
00:33:24,238 --> 00:33:26,358
Speaker 1: news the owner of the New York Yankees, was talking

655
00:33:26,398 --> 00:33:30,798
Speaker 1: about competitive balance in the Yankees payroll, a couple of

656
00:33:30,838 --> 00:33:32,198
Speaker 1: things that I found interesting.

657
00:33:32,238 --> 00:33:34,998
Speaker 4: And listen, anything that he says, it's.

658
00:33:34,638 --> 00:33:37,318
Speaker 1: Going to be parsed by not just Yankee fans, but

659
00:33:37,398 --> 00:33:39,798
Speaker 1: baseball fans because it is the New York Yankees, right.

660
00:33:40,278 --> 00:33:44,438
Speaker 1: He talked about how he would consider a cap as

661
00:33:44,518 --> 00:33:48,478
Speaker 1: long as they had a floor. And listen, there's no

662
00:33:48,598 --> 00:33:51,198
Speaker 1: way if the owners ask for a cap that there

663
00:33:51,238 --> 00:33:53,198
Speaker 1: would not be a floor associated with it.

664
00:33:53,278 --> 00:33:54,238
Speaker 4: So that's a given.

665
00:33:54,438 --> 00:33:58,158
Speaker 1: So he's on record essentially as saying, I'm okay with

666
00:33:58,198 --> 00:34:00,198
Speaker 1: the idea of talking about a cap, and he talked

667
00:34:00,198 --> 00:34:05,078
Speaker 1: about the idea that baseball needs improved a balance, and

668
00:34:05,118 --> 00:34:08,718
Speaker 1: as he said, most of the fans out there would

669
00:34:08,718 --> 00:34:11,558
Speaker 1: think the competitive balance is not good enough. Now you

670
00:34:11,598 --> 00:34:14,638
Speaker 1: can argue that there's been great competitive balance in baseball

671
00:34:14,678 --> 00:34:16,478
Speaker 1: when it comes to who wins the World Series. I

672
00:34:16,598 --> 00:34:19,878
Speaker 1: realized that teams with higher payrolls have much better chance

673
00:34:19,918 --> 00:34:23,118
Speaker 1: of winning. But it was interesting that the New York

674
00:34:23,198 --> 00:34:25,798
Speaker 1: Yankees owner came out and talked about that. He also

675
00:34:25,878 --> 00:34:30,678
Speaker 1: said he he used the word ideal. It's ideal that

676
00:34:30,718 --> 00:34:33,998
Speaker 1: their payroll next season would be less than it was

677
00:34:34,078 --> 00:34:36,358
Speaker 1: this season. I mean, that was a head scratcher of me.

678
00:34:36,398 --> 00:34:38,878
Speaker 1: They were three hundred and nineteen or so million dollars,

679
00:34:39,598 --> 00:34:42,798
Speaker 1: and he wasn't committing to saying we're going under or

680
00:34:42,798 --> 00:34:43,478
Speaker 1: we're going over.

681
00:34:43,558 --> 00:34:46,558
Speaker 4: He just said, in an ideal situation, we would be under.

682
00:34:46,718 --> 00:34:49,358
Speaker 1: He thinks it's enough to spend three hundred million and

683
00:34:49,398 --> 00:34:51,438
Speaker 1: still have a World Series contender, and I think he's

684
00:34:51,478 --> 00:34:53,878
Speaker 1: right about that. But if you're a Yankee fan, it's

685
00:34:53,878 --> 00:34:56,998
Speaker 1: probably nothing you wanted to hear that the ideal situation

686
00:34:57,118 --> 00:34:59,758
Speaker 1: for New York is to have a payroll less in

687
00:34:59,998 --> 00:35:02,078
Speaker 1: twenty twenty six than they had in twenty five.

688
00:35:02,838 --> 00:35:04,758
Speaker 2: You know, I've been involved in that where you you know,

689
00:35:04,798 --> 00:35:07,238
Speaker 2: you leave camp without hope in a sense, I mean

690
00:35:07,278 --> 00:35:09,758
Speaker 2: you're leaving spring training and you know and your fans, no,

691
00:35:09,958 --> 00:35:13,718
Speaker 2: we got no chance, bad bad method. It was my

692
00:35:14,198 --> 00:35:16,838
Speaker 2: primarily my first year with the with the Devil Rays,

693
00:35:17,038 --> 00:35:20,718
Speaker 2: and you're taking over this situation that once I got there,

694
00:35:20,798 --> 00:35:25,078
Speaker 2: realized how kind of dysfunctional it was, and then you know,

695
00:35:25,158 --> 00:35:30,918
Speaker 2: the obviously the transformation, however, it was really that's that's

696
00:35:30,958 --> 00:35:35,038
Speaker 2: where your your acumen really should show up. And at

697
00:35:35,038 --> 00:35:39,038
Speaker 2: that time, people were constantly saying, you know, an added defendant.

698
00:35:39,038 --> 00:35:41,678
Speaker 2: I just gave my take on it. But the Rays

699
00:35:41,718 --> 00:35:42,998
Speaker 2: need to move out of the Devil Rays need to

700
00:35:43,038 --> 00:35:45,358
Speaker 2: move out of the American LEAGUEES. And my my thought was, no,

701
00:35:45,918 --> 00:35:48,438
Speaker 2: this is the best place for us to get better, quicker.

702
00:35:48,798 --> 00:35:52,798
Speaker 2: When you face better competition, you got to raise your level.

703
00:35:53,318 --> 00:35:55,638
Speaker 2: And and again I I'm just saying, like, if you

704
00:35:55,678 --> 00:35:58,358
Speaker 2: try to do everything the Dodgers do or the Yankees do,

705
00:35:58,598 --> 00:36:02,398
Speaker 2: or remember these these these juggernauts do, and to try

706
00:36:02,438 --> 00:36:05,238
Speaker 2: to match them step for step going to happen. That's why,

707
00:36:05,638 --> 00:36:07,918
Speaker 2: That's why I don't understand why more teams don't zag.

708
00:36:08,038 --> 00:36:11,198
Speaker 2: I mean, it's like everybody wants to be the same

709
00:36:11,238 --> 00:36:14,398
Speaker 2: and the same methods and the same construction, and we

710
00:36:14,438 --> 00:36:16,598
Speaker 2: want the same dudes and all this other stuff. And

711
00:36:17,838 --> 00:36:20,478
Speaker 2: if you want to ascend quickly, you have to be

712
00:36:20,518 --> 00:36:24,518
Speaker 2: able to again get out of this box a little bit.

713
00:36:25,038 --> 00:36:27,758
Speaker 2: And so I'm just curious as too why that doesn't

714
00:36:27,758 --> 00:36:32,518
Speaker 2: have I can't even imagine going to camp and not

715
00:36:32,638 --> 00:36:34,078
Speaker 2: be able to stand up in front of the team

716
00:36:34,118 --> 00:36:36,118
Speaker 2: and talk about how we're going to get at least

717
00:36:36,118 --> 00:36:38,638
Speaker 2: get to the playoffs this year, and always the goal

718
00:36:38,678 --> 00:36:40,678
Speaker 2: should be able to play the be in the last

719
00:36:40,678 --> 00:36:42,718
Speaker 2: game of the season and win it. That has to

720
00:36:42,758 --> 00:36:45,278
Speaker 2: be your mindset going into it. I know it may

721
00:36:45,278 --> 00:36:49,438
Speaker 2: be unrealistic sometimes I get that, And with the Devil Rays,

722
00:36:49,518 --> 00:36:51,158
Speaker 2: I was never able to say that when I first

723
00:36:51,198 --> 00:36:53,598
Speaker 2: got there, but I did say it going into season

724
00:36:53,638 --> 00:36:56,398
Speaker 2: two thousand and eight, and now that it's like after

725
00:36:56,438 --> 00:36:59,398
Speaker 2: a seventy or seventy one win season the previous year,

726
00:36:59,838 --> 00:37:02,958
Speaker 2: So you got to get yourself out a little bit more.

727
00:37:02,958 --> 00:37:07,798
Speaker 2: You've got to be willing to take chances, alternative routes, methods,

728
00:37:07,838 --> 00:37:10,398
Speaker 2: the roadless traveled by, and not just get on this

729
00:37:10,478 --> 00:37:13,758
Speaker 2: busy highway that everybody's the same. So that that to

730
00:37:13,838 --> 00:37:16,478
Speaker 2: me is like the guys that really felt they.

731
00:37:16,438 --> 00:37:16,918
Speaker 3: Have no hope.

732
00:37:16,958 --> 00:37:19,038
Speaker 2: To me, that would be the most interesting place for

733
00:37:19,118 --> 00:37:20,838
Speaker 2: me to end up if I ever wanted to come

734
00:37:20,878 --> 00:37:22,798
Speaker 2: back again or got a chance to come back again.

735
00:37:23,118 --> 00:37:25,918
Speaker 2: Would be the group that feels like they have no hope,

736
00:37:26,238 --> 00:37:28,478
Speaker 2: or they can't really win, or they're they're they're they're

737
00:37:28,478 --> 00:37:33,918
Speaker 2: afraid to talk about expectations in the preseason. That's that's

738
00:37:33,958 --> 00:37:37,518
Speaker 2: the most interesting place to be. So I that's that's

739
00:37:37,518 --> 00:37:39,638
Speaker 2: how I look at it, this whole thing like right now,

740
00:37:39,638 --> 00:37:41,078
Speaker 2: to me, you know, it might be the most interesting

741
00:37:41,158 --> 00:37:43,798
Speaker 2: job in the game, is Warren Shaeffer. That might be

742
00:37:43,918 --> 00:37:46,118
Speaker 2: the most interesting job. I know, I know, I know,

743
00:37:46,158 --> 00:37:48,318
Speaker 2: I know. And if pet Peppy was there, Buddy Black

744
00:37:48,358 --> 00:37:49,878
Speaker 2: was there, I know, I know, I know. They have

745
00:37:49,918 --> 00:37:53,118
Speaker 2: a tremendous spring training facility, they got a great ballpark,

746
00:37:53,158 --> 00:37:57,358
Speaker 2: they get a wonderful fan base. The the the atmosphere

747
00:37:57,398 --> 00:38:00,318
Speaker 2: of the altitude does present problems, and that to me

748
00:38:00,398 --> 00:38:04,758
Speaker 2: is why it's so interesting. That's that's the perfect laboratory

749
00:38:04,958 --> 00:38:08,598
Speaker 2: to incubate and try different and new things and go

750
00:38:08,638 --> 00:38:12,518
Speaker 2: out there and play the game even as simply as listen, boys,

751
00:38:12,878 --> 00:38:14,678
Speaker 2: every time you put the ball on the ground, I

752
00:38:14,718 --> 00:38:17,118
Speaker 2: want your best time the first base. I'm not talking

753
00:38:17,158 --> 00:38:19,958
Speaker 2: about getting hurt when you make a turn at first base.

754
00:38:19,998 --> 00:38:23,798
Speaker 2: I want to see the best turn theoretically fundamentally proper baseball.

755
00:38:23,798 --> 00:38:26,238
Speaker 2: And everybody talks about, you know, doing it right, but

756
00:38:26,278 --> 00:38:28,958
Speaker 2: then at some points you give up on and coolness

757
00:38:28,998 --> 00:38:32,358
Speaker 2: takes over. So the best or most interesting job to

758
00:38:32,358 --> 00:38:34,878
Speaker 2: me right now is Schaefer's, and I wish them nothing

759
00:38:34,878 --> 00:38:35,478
Speaker 2: but the best.

760
00:38:35,958 --> 00:38:36,878
Speaker 4: I love that idea.

761
00:38:36,998 --> 00:38:40,398
Speaker 1: I mean, essentially, you're talking about taking what are perceived

762
00:38:40,438 --> 00:38:45,518
Speaker 1: to be disadvantages into advantages, right, And in some cases

763
00:38:45,558 --> 00:38:49,758
Speaker 1: I think Milwaukee and Murph do that really well where

764
00:38:49,798 --> 00:38:52,718
Speaker 1: they know the expectations are against them, but they actually

765
00:38:53,158 --> 00:38:56,558
Speaker 1: play that up and become better than a lot of

766
00:38:56,598 --> 00:38:58,958
Speaker 1: people think it's not easy to do. But I like

767
00:38:58,998 --> 00:39:02,038
Speaker 1: that idea in Colorado, that there's an opportunity there to

768
00:39:02,638 --> 00:39:05,478
Speaker 1: zag when everybody else is zigging. And by the way,

769
00:39:05,558 --> 00:39:08,438
Speaker 1: I mean, we're essentially now the clock is only about

770
00:39:08,518 --> 00:39:11,838
Speaker 1: twelve months away from the expiration to the CBA, and

771
00:39:11,878 --> 00:39:14,238
Speaker 1: I know everybody wants to know right now, what's going

772
00:39:14,278 --> 00:39:17,478
Speaker 1: to happen, and will there be a lockout? I can

773
00:39:17,558 --> 00:39:19,918
Speaker 1: tell you I'm not sure the owners know exactly what

774
00:39:19,958 --> 00:39:22,758
Speaker 1: they want to present and whether if they do want

775
00:39:22,798 --> 00:39:26,958
Speaker 1: to significantly change the economic system of baseball and ask

776
00:39:27,038 --> 00:39:29,958
Speaker 1: for a cap, well, yeah, then we're probably going to

777
00:39:29,958 --> 00:39:33,758
Speaker 1: see trauma of some sort. Things like that don't happen

778
00:39:33,798 --> 00:39:37,518
Speaker 1: if they happen at all easily. But baseball's kind of

779
00:39:37,558 --> 00:39:40,998
Speaker 1: in a weird space where we just talked about that, Joe,

780
00:39:40,998 --> 00:39:42,958
Speaker 1: where if you're one of the teams where you go

781
00:39:42,958 --> 00:39:45,278
Speaker 1: to spring training and you don't have hope, man, you're

782
00:39:45,278 --> 00:39:48,278
Speaker 1: hoping that the system changes. But at the same time,

783
00:39:48,878 --> 00:39:52,518
Speaker 1: baseball is on this high right now, and a big

784
00:39:52,598 --> 00:39:55,198
Speaker 1: part of it, let's be honest, is you have the Yankees,

785
00:39:55,238 --> 00:39:57,678
Speaker 1: the Red Sox, the Cubs, the Dodgers, and the Mets,

786
00:39:57,758 --> 00:40:00,038
Speaker 1: these teams in the biggest markets with the biggest payrolls,

787
00:40:00,238 --> 00:40:03,678
Speaker 1: who are really attractive and doing really well. So you're

788
00:40:03,678 --> 00:40:06,278
Speaker 1: going to I have to choose at some point here

789
00:40:06,398 --> 00:40:08,518
Speaker 1: which path you want to go down. And again, that's

790
00:40:08,558 --> 00:40:10,918
Speaker 1: crazy as it sounds. It's only twelve months, but still

791
00:40:10,958 --> 00:40:14,358
Speaker 1: too early to predict how this is going to play out.

792
00:40:14,678 --> 00:40:16,558
Speaker 1: And I don't think it's that cut and dried.

793
00:40:17,158 --> 00:40:20,918
Speaker 2: I would have our girl back in the day. Freedom

794
00:40:21,038 --> 00:40:24,358
Speaker 2: is just another word for nothing left to lose. I

795
00:40:24,358 --> 00:40:27,718
Speaker 2: would have Janis Joplin's I would have That would be

796
00:40:27,758 --> 00:40:31,358
Speaker 2: the walkout music for the whole team, to inspire the group,

797
00:40:32,158 --> 00:40:34,718
Speaker 2: the groups that really feel like there is no hope

798
00:40:34,798 --> 00:40:36,598
Speaker 2: or you know we're going to be out of it

799
00:40:36,638 --> 00:40:38,318
Speaker 2: by Memorial Day.

800
00:40:38,358 --> 00:40:38,638
Speaker 3: Whatever.

801
00:40:38,838 --> 00:40:41,478
Speaker 2: You have to understand there's a certain there's this high

802
00:40:41,598 --> 00:40:45,438
Speaker 2: level of creativity, involvement and ability to just to throw

803
00:40:45,478 --> 00:40:49,158
Speaker 2: it out there when you are perceived to be not

804
00:40:49,238 --> 00:40:51,678
Speaker 2: as good. There is a freedom about it, and to

805
00:40:51,798 --> 00:40:54,198
Speaker 2: not take advantage of that freedom. To me and just

806
00:40:54,238 --> 00:40:56,798
Speaker 2: stay with status quo is absolutely the wrong way to

807
00:40:56,838 --> 00:41:00,038
Speaker 2: go about your business. Create that new path. I listen,

808
00:41:00,238 --> 00:41:02,438
Speaker 2: I'm telling you this. You're getting me jacked up right now.

809
00:41:02,838 --> 00:41:05,678
Speaker 2: I understand you're talking about like some of these coastal

810
00:41:05,718 --> 00:41:08,398
Speaker 2: teams that are very good, But I'm a hinterland kind

811
00:41:08,398 --> 00:41:11,158
Speaker 2: of guy, you know, I want to see this. I

812
00:41:11,198 --> 00:41:14,438
Speaker 2: want I'd love to see the resurgence of that. The

813
00:41:14,478 --> 00:41:16,558
Speaker 2: guys that kick out the big teams in the shins

814
00:41:16,598 --> 00:41:19,758
Speaker 2: constantly or step on their toes and eventually by the

815
00:41:19,838 --> 00:41:22,278
Speaker 2: end of the season, you go in the Fenway Park,

816
00:41:22,718 --> 00:41:24,278
Speaker 2: where you could not win in the beginning, and all

817
00:41:24,278 --> 00:41:25,918
Speaker 2: of a sudden you could. You could beat Boston and

818
00:41:26,038 --> 00:41:28,518
Speaker 2: Fenway where you went into the old Yankee Stadium, and

819
00:41:28,598 --> 00:41:30,598
Speaker 2: my god, you sit there in the top round in

820
00:41:30,678 --> 00:41:32,678
Speaker 2: the dugout is to like to send a top step.

821
00:41:32,678 --> 00:41:34,038
Speaker 2: We played a double hitter, and I don't know if

822
00:41:34,038 --> 00:41:36,638
Speaker 2: the combined scores of both games might have been like

823
00:41:36,718 --> 00:41:39,478
Speaker 2: thirty something to five. And you're standing up there in

824
00:41:39,518 --> 00:41:41,718
Speaker 2: the sun all day, just getting your brains beat out

825
00:41:42,278 --> 00:41:43,638
Speaker 2: all these all these moments.

826
00:41:43,718 --> 00:41:44,798
Speaker 3: So what do I do?

827
00:41:44,798 --> 00:41:47,638
Speaker 2: Do you just continue to try to play Yankee style baseball?

828
00:41:48,358 --> 00:41:50,678
Speaker 2: Or do you go gorilla warfare with these guys? And

829
00:41:50,758 --> 00:41:53,518
Speaker 2: that's that's what I'm saying. You have this opportunity when

830
00:41:53,558 --> 00:41:56,118
Speaker 2: you're not perceived to be that good and you're trying

831
00:41:56,118 --> 00:41:59,678
Speaker 2: to ascend, you have so much freedom to be creative

832
00:41:59,718 --> 00:42:03,398
Speaker 2: and try new things. That to me is really the

833
00:42:03,438 --> 00:42:07,598
Speaker 2: definition into being progressive. The status quo has become staid

834
00:42:07,678 --> 00:42:10,358
Speaker 2: to me right now, I want to see this progressive

835
00:42:10,398 --> 00:42:13,998
Speaker 2: approach from the Rockies or these other teams, even you

836
00:42:14,038 --> 00:42:16,198
Speaker 2: know the Angels. Right now, they were trying last year

837
00:42:16,278 --> 00:42:18,518
Speaker 2: in different ways. You can make the argument right now

838
00:42:18,558 --> 00:42:21,878
Speaker 2: that the Nationals are trying another method right now. This

839
00:42:21,918 --> 00:42:24,878
Speaker 2: is what I like to see from the other guys,

840
00:42:25,758 --> 00:42:27,678
Speaker 2: the group that is there just to support the group

841
00:42:27,718 --> 00:42:29,238
Speaker 2: that's supposed to win at the end of the year.

842
00:42:29,438 --> 00:42:31,558
Speaker 2: So we could play one hundred and sixty two game schedule.

843
00:42:31,998 --> 00:42:34,798
Speaker 2: Don't be afraid to try something new on your own

844
00:42:34,878 --> 00:42:38,158
Speaker 2: circle your wagons. Come out with a different approach that

845
00:42:38,438 --> 00:42:41,518
Speaker 2: really on a nightly basis. By the time you play,

846
00:42:41,598 --> 00:42:43,678
Speaker 2: you're done playing. The big boys. Their shins are black

847
00:42:43,718 --> 00:42:44,278
Speaker 2: and blue.

848
00:42:44,838 --> 00:42:47,518
Speaker 1: By the way, thanks for the Genis Joplin reference. Because

849
00:42:47,518 --> 00:42:49,238
Speaker 1: you're setting me up. I want to talk about one

850
00:42:49,278 --> 00:42:53,198
Speaker 1: of the great all time songwriting lines that was written,

851
00:42:53,518 --> 00:42:54,798
Speaker 1: and of course we will get to.

852
00:42:54,878 --> 00:42:56,158
Speaker 4: Your thought of the day.

853
00:42:56,398 --> 00:43:09,958
Speaker 1: We'll do that right after this on the Book of Joe.

854
00:43:11,198 --> 00:43:12,678
Speaker 4: Welcome back to the Book of Joe.

855
00:43:12,718 --> 00:43:17,318
Speaker 1: Finishing up here great songwriting lines, lyrics, Joe, how about

856
00:43:17,358 --> 00:43:21,518
Speaker 1: this one? I fought the Law and the long One.

857
00:43:22,318 --> 00:43:23,838
Speaker 4: I know you gotta love that one.

858
00:43:23,718 --> 00:43:26,638
Speaker 3: Right absolutely. I mean I've done it my whole life.

859
00:43:29,198 --> 00:43:32,758
Speaker 1: Well it's been the song has been covered by so

860
00:43:32,998 --> 00:43:35,798
Speaker 1: many rock and rollers, but Originally it was written by

861
00:43:35,958 --> 00:43:39,118
Speaker 1: Sonny Curtis. Back in nineteen sixty six, he played with

862
00:43:39,118 --> 00:43:42,918
Speaker 1: Buddy Holly and the Crickets. Had an incredible songwriting career.

863
00:43:43,598 --> 00:43:45,838
Speaker 1: He passed away recently. It's the reason I bring it

864
00:43:45,918 --> 00:43:49,798
Speaker 1: up here. But just imagine writing a line like that

865
00:43:49,798 --> 00:43:54,318
Speaker 1: that basically lives on in perpetuity and it is something

866
00:43:54,318 --> 00:43:57,958
Speaker 1: that other artists want to celebrate and bring their own

867
00:43:57,998 --> 00:43:58,318
Speaker 1: take to.

868
00:43:58,638 --> 00:44:01,638
Speaker 4: I think that's just amazing, the way you can.

869
00:44:01,638 --> 00:44:06,038
Speaker 1: Find the right sequence of words, you know, just tap

870
00:44:06,158 --> 00:44:08,598
Speaker 1: the right vein and it can last forever.

871
00:44:09,598 --> 00:44:10,318
Speaker 4: And he did that.

872
00:44:10,478 --> 00:44:14,758
Speaker 1: Also in nineteen seventy, he was asked to write the

873
00:44:14,998 --> 00:44:19,838
Speaker 1: opening song for a new sitcom that was starting known

874
00:44:19,918 --> 00:44:23,278
Speaker 1: as The Mary Tyler Moore Show. And you got to

875
00:44:23,318 --> 00:44:25,358
Speaker 1: remember that one, Joe, right, that's got to be in

876
00:44:25,398 --> 00:44:26,438
Speaker 1: your playbook.

877
00:44:27,078 --> 00:44:30,718
Speaker 3: Love that show? Are you're kidding? Absolutely? It was wonderful.

878
00:44:31,278 --> 00:44:33,478
Speaker 1: You're going to make it, after all? You know who

879
00:44:33,558 --> 00:44:35,798
Speaker 1: can set the world on with her smile? Right that

880
00:44:35,998 --> 00:44:39,918
Speaker 1: he wrote the words of that song. They actually redid

881
00:44:39,918 --> 00:44:42,678
Speaker 1: it after the first season because it was sort of

882
00:44:43,758 --> 00:44:46,038
Speaker 1: almost like an open ending question, like whether she was

883
00:44:46,078 --> 00:44:47,158
Speaker 1: going to make it or not.

884
00:44:47,878 --> 00:44:49,998
Speaker 4: And once they knew this was a hit show.

885
00:44:50,078 --> 00:44:53,718
Speaker 1: They sort of played up the positivity end of it that, yeah,

886
00:44:53,838 --> 00:44:56,838
Speaker 1: you've made it, Mary Tyler Moore of course throwing the

887
00:44:56,838 --> 00:44:57,758
Speaker 1: hat at the end of it.

888
00:44:57,838 --> 00:44:59,038
Speaker 4: Just an iconic opening.

889
00:45:00,318 --> 00:45:02,398
Speaker 1: I'm just blown away by the fact that someone like

890
00:45:02,398 --> 00:45:06,318
Speaker 1: a Sunny Curtis passed away to eighty eight can leave

891
00:45:06,438 --> 00:45:10,558
Speaker 1: us with these just iconic in this case songs. But

892
00:45:10,678 --> 00:45:13,678
Speaker 1: it's more the words and the way that you know,

893
00:45:13,718 --> 00:45:16,998
Speaker 1: we talked about going to Lafayette or going to Penn State,

894
00:45:17,118 --> 00:45:20,478
Speaker 1: and the nostalgia comes back. Well, you know as well

895
00:45:20,478 --> 00:45:24,118
Speaker 1: as anybody, Joe, that music and songs and words can

896
00:45:24,158 --> 00:45:25,038
Speaker 1: do the same thing.

897
00:45:25,238 --> 00:45:25,838
Speaker 3: No question.

898
00:45:25,918 --> 00:45:28,118
Speaker 2: One man's see, I think, is another man's floor, right,

899
00:45:28,318 --> 00:45:32,398
Speaker 2: I mean that's I've such a sum in a Garfunkle

900
00:45:33,038 --> 00:45:33,638
Speaker 2: fan growing up.

901
00:45:33,678 --> 00:45:34,758
Speaker 3: I still listen to them every morning.

902
00:45:34,758 --> 00:45:38,558
Speaker 2: I put some in a Garfunkel radio on the Pandora

903
00:45:38,598 --> 00:45:42,318
Speaker 2: as I wake up, wake up slowly, sun hasn't there's

904
00:45:42,358 --> 00:45:44,278
Speaker 2: not even don yet, And I love that, and I

905
00:45:44,278 --> 00:45:47,918
Speaker 2: love watching the dawn break and the peaceful nature living

906
00:45:47,918 --> 00:45:50,998
Speaker 2: out here in the country like that. These words stimulate

907
00:45:51,278 --> 00:45:56,078
Speaker 2: and they're absolutely while yes, I can go on and

908
00:45:56,078 --> 00:45:58,038
Speaker 2: on and which I had time to write down all

909
00:45:58,038 --> 00:46:01,158
Speaker 2: my different favorite We all have our favorites, but I

910
00:46:01,198 --> 00:46:05,278
Speaker 2: am a big I've been motivated a lot by music

911
00:46:05,318 --> 00:46:09,118
Speaker 2: we both have and words within music, and when you're

912
00:46:09,118 --> 00:46:10,918
Speaker 2: able to slow them down. Sometimes as a kid it

913
00:46:10,918 --> 00:46:13,078
Speaker 2: was more visceral. You would just like the beat and

914
00:46:13,238 --> 00:46:15,478
Speaker 2: song whatever, you went along with it. Then as you

915
00:46:15,478 --> 00:46:17,198
Speaker 2: get old, you've kind of slowed it down to oof

916
00:46:17,478 --> 00:46:20,118
Speaker 2: and let's start listening to the words and how well

917
00:46:20,198 --> 00:46:23,758
Speaker 2: thought out they were. I recently watched Laurel Canyon a

918
00:46:23,758 --> 00:46:27,158
Speaker 2: little bit and all the different great groups that were

919
00:46:27,198 --> 00:46:31,078
Speaker 2: involved there and talked about their different songwriting. We've talked about.

920
00:46:31,118 --> 00:46:34,878
Speaker 2: I'm huge Linda Ronstein fan. Even though she never actually

921
00:46:34,958 --> 00:46:37,678
Speaker 2: wrote music, she made them all her own. All the

922
00:46:37,798 --> 00:46:40,198
Speaker 2: songs that she sung, she would put her own twits.

923
00:46:40,358 --> 00:46:40,558
Speaker 3: JD.

924
00:46:40,678 --> 00:46:43,278
Speaker 2: Salder and her were like really tight and he would

925
00:46:43,318 --> 00:46:45,118
Speaker 2: write music for her and this lady would make it

926
00:46:45,238 --> 00:46:48,958
Speaker 2: her own, and then the lyrics live on forever a

927
00:46:49,038 --> 00:46:51,638
Speaker 2: long long time. It's still that's probably my favorite song

928
00:46:51,678 --> 00:46:55,638
Speaker 2: by Ron's stats. So yeah, every morning, whatever it is,

929
00:46:55,718 --> 00:46:57,798
Speaker 2: I mean, I don't know, you're probably the same. I

930
00:46:57,798 --> 00:46:59,118
Speaker 2: get in the car, the radio has got to be

931
00:46:59,198 --> 00:47:00,958
Speaker 2: on I wake up in the morning and the radio's

932
00:47:00,958 --> 00:47:02,878
Speaker 2: got to be on the songs that their music has

933
00:47:02,878 --> 00:47:05,038
Speaker 2: got to be on. I don't know, like if there's

934
00:47:05,038 --> 00:47:07,678
Speaker 2: a if there's a down moment during the course of

935
00:47:07,718 --> 00:47:11,398
Speaker 2: my day, or if I'm not even in your golf cart.

936
00:47:11,478 --> 00:47:13,078
Speaker 3: Now we put music on the golf cart, right.

937
00:47:13,598 --> 00:47:16,518
Speaker 2: Music is such a part, the central part of our existence.

938
00:47:17,078 --> 00:47:19,238
Speaker 2: And when you it is the visceral part of it

939
00:47:19,278 --> 00:47:21,558
Speaker 2: to beat the sound whatever, which is really more prominent

940
00:47:21,558 --> 00:47:23,598
Speaker 2: now than ever. But when you're able to slow it

941
00:47:23,638 --> 00:47:26,998
Speaker 2: down and really, these people are such crafts making. My

942
00:47:27,078 --> 00:47:29,238
Speaker 2: man Eddie veter Eddie, when he writes me a text,

943
00:47:29,478 --> 00:47:32,758
Speaker 2: my god, it's like it's like he's a composing it's

944
00:47:32,798 --> 00:47:35,358
Speaker 2: just it's next. He's going to save it for his

945
00:47:35,398 --> 00:47:39,598
Speaker 2: next album whatever. It's just that when you're an artist, man, artists,

946
00:47:40,438 --> 00:47:43,878
Speaker 2: it's a different breed. Their vision is different. They see

947
00:47:44,198 --> 00:47:46,158
Speaker 2: they see these four trees in front of me right now,

948
00:47:46,198 --> 00:47:47,758
Speaker 2: they would be able to describe it in a way

949
00:47:48,318 --> 00:47:50,838
Speaker 2: that makes you want, where are those four trees? I

950
00:47:50,878 --> 00:47:53,958
Speaker 2: got to go see them, whether in Pennsylvania somewhere. It's

951
00:47:54,038 --> 00:47:55,918
Speaker 2: truly astounding. I'm a big fan of that.

952
00:47:56,278 --> 00:47:58,838
Speaker 1: Yeah, it just brought me back to the days buying

953
00:47:58,918 --> 00:48:02,758
Speaker 1: albums and uh, back in the day on the beat

954
00:48:02,798 --> 00:48:05,678
Speaker 1: with the Yankees, you know, going through Milwaukee, we used

955
00:48:05,678 --> 00:48:08,518
Speaker 1: to go to a place called Radio Doctor, Milwaukee, great

956
00:48:08,558 --> 00:48:12,438
Speaker 1: record shop. Used to come home with a stack of LPs,

957
00:48:12,518 --> 00:48:15,558
Speaker 1: and I was always disappointed if when I opened it

958
00:48:15,638 --> 00:48:18,038
Speaker 1: up and I looked at the liner notes, there were

959
00:48:18,038 --> 00:48:18,758
Speaker 1: no lyrics.

960
00:48:19,158 --> 00:48:19,358
Speaker 4: You know.

961
00:48:19,638 --> 00:48:22,878
Speaker 1: Nowadays, of course, and for a long time, you get

962
00:48:22,918 --> 00:48:24,758
Speaker 1: the lyrics, which is great you can get on your

963
00:48:24,798 --> 00:48:26,918
Speaker 1: phone while you're listening to a song. But back in

964
00:48:26,958 --> 00:48:29,318
Speaker 1: the day, you know what this was like, Joe, if

965
00:48:29,318 --> 00:48:31,718
Speaker 1: you got the album.

966
00:48:31,318 --> 00:48:32,158
Speaker 4: I don't know about you.

967
00:48:32,358 --> 00:48:35,798
Speaker 1: I wanted to see the lyrics as well, because listening

968
00:48:35,878 --> 00:48:40,158
Speaker 1: on you know, your your transistor AM FM radio, you

969
00:48:40,198 --> 00:48:43,558
Speaker 1: couldn't always make out the words. And now again, going

970
00:48:43,638 --> 00:48:45,718
Speaker 1: back to my day at Penn State. The other day,

971
00:48:45,758 --> 00:48:47,678
Speaker 1: I was blown away by the fact that all these

972
00:48:47,718 --> 00:48:51,958
Speaker 1: young students are word by word, this turning Beaver Stadium

973
00:48:51,998 --> 00:48:54,998
Speaker 1: into the largest karaoke bar of the country. Every one

974
00:48:54,998 --> 00:48:57,238
Speaker 1: of these songs, they knew every one of the words.

975
00:48:57,838 --> 00:49:00,118
Speaker 1: So I'm a big word guy, and I was always

976
00:49:00,158 --> 00:49:02,878
Speaker 1: disappointed if I bought an album and opened it up,

977
00:49:02,958 --> 00:49:05,198
Speaker 1: and I saw that the ors were not included.

978
00:49:05,358 --> 00:49:06,918
Speaker 4: Just as important as the music.

979
00:49:07,358 --> 00:49:09,518
Speaker 2: We've gone into the wordsmith that you are also. I mean,

980
00:49:09,518 --> 00:49:11,718
Speaker 2: we've been influenced in so many you know, you've probably

981
00:49:11,758 --> 00:49:13,958
Speaker 2: read a thousand books. I did you listen to a

982
00:49:14,038 --> 00:49:17,598
Speaker 2: zillion songs? I did, And even going to church and

983
00:49:17,638 --> 00:49:21,318
Speaker 2: having the priest give a thoughtful and sightful kind of

984
00:49:21,558 --> 00:49:24,158
Speaker 2: a sermon. I will any time I could go somewhere

985
00:49:24,158 --> 00:49:25,958
Speaker 2: and here's somebody talk about I don't care what it

986
00:49:25,998 --> 00:49:28,638
Speaker 2: is anything, and if this person is into.

987
00:49:28,398 --> 00:49:29,238
Speaker 3: It, I am too.

988
00:49:29,798 --> 00:49:32,038
Speaker 2: I think I've developed good listening skills over Tom, and

989
00:49:32,078 --> 00:49:34,998
Speaker 2: I think that's still when you talk about managers, coaches,

990
00:49:35,478 --> 00:49:40,158
Speaker 2: leadership qualities. While I still believe good listening skills where

991
00:49:40,158 --> 00:49:42,518
Speaker 2: you really lock in and it's just you and that

992
00:49:42,558 --> 00:49:45,398
Speaker 2: person and you're not formulating your next thought. You're not

993
00:49:45,798 --> 00:49:47,478
Speaker 2: you know, the person standing next to you wants to

994
00:49:47,518 --> 00:49:51,518
Speaker 2: speak with you also, but you stay here, you stay present, tense, eyeball,

995
00:49:51,558 --> 00:49:55,358
Speaker 2: the eyeball locked in this moment. I know when I

996
00:49:55,518 --> 00:49:59,278
Speaker 2: have a conversation, I'm communicating with somebody and I believe

997
00:49:59,478 --> 00:50:02,078
Speaker 2: I have their full attention. My god, they got every

998
00:50:02,278 --> 00:50:03,078
Speaker 2: every ounce of me.

999
00:50:04,038 --> 00:50:06,838
Speaker 1: So now that we've talked about the importance of words

1000
00:50:07,118 --> 00:50:10,558
Speaker 1: and lyrics, the pressures on you, Joe with our thought

1001
00:50:10,558 --> 00:50:13,478
Speaker 1: of the day, as you always do, to bring us

1002
00:50:13,518 --> 00:50:15,638
Speaker 1: home with some words of wisdom.

1003
00:50:15,838 --> 00:50:17,958
Speaker 2: Yeah, I was reading The Post, of course this morning.

1004
00:50:17,958 --> 00:50:21,718
Speaker 2: It was an article, you know, about information and how

1005
00:50:21,758 --> 00:50:23,478
Speaker 2: it's generated these days.

1006
00:50:23,518 --> 00:50:26,118
Speaker 3: We're talking about the social media component of it.

1007
00:50:26,558 --> 00:50:30,558
Speaker 2: And the rapidity with videos, videos, videos, short burst, shortbor

1008
00:50:30,678 --> 00:50:33,278
Speaker 2: short bursts. And I had this conversation with Scott Harris

1009
00:50:33,398 --> 00:50:35,798
Speaker 2: is now the head dude with the Tiger Scott he

1010
00:50:35,878 --> 00:50:37,398
Speaker 2: was with the Covees at the time.

1011
00:50:37,438 --> 00:50:38,158
Speaker 3: He sit in my office.

1012
00:50:38,198 --> 00:50:40,478
Speaker 2: I remember in Cincinnati, and this when I was really

1013
00:50:40,518 --> 00:50:43,598
Speaker 2: becoming annoyed with myself because I really felt my attention

1014
00:50:43,678 --> 00:50:45,918
Speaker 2: span was diminishing and I didn't I couldn't pick up

1015
00:50:45,918 --> 00:50:47,518
Speaker 2: a book and read it from cover to cover in

1016
00:50:47,558 --> 00:50:49,838
Speaker 2: like a week, and I thinking myself, what's wrong?

1017
00:50:49,958 --> 00:50:50,598
Speaker 3: What's wrong with me?

1018
00:50:50,678 --> 00:50:53,558
Speaker 2: I read all the time, like from the moment I

1019
00:50:53,598 --> 00:50:55,278
Speaker 2: woke up this morning to like this, I've been reading

1020
00:50:55,278 --> 00:50:57,318
Speaker 2: all morning. I read Laura Wong's book a little bit.

1021
00:50:57,918 --> 00:50:59,718
Speaker 2: It was a part of what I thought was outstanding.

1022
00:51:00,118 --> 00:51:02,678
Speaker 2: You already know, and I highlighted, and then I wrote

1023
00:51:02,678 --> 00:51:05,758
Speaker 2: my own little interpret rotation. I've already senator. So I'm

1024
00:51:05,758 --> 00:51:08,638
Speaker 2: always reading. But the ability to pick up a novel

1025
00:51:08,998 --> 00:51:13,118
Speaker 2: and sit down every night normally before I went to bed.

1026
00:51:13,198 --> 00:51:16,478
Speaker 2: It wasn't Netflix, it was a book. Wow, I missed

1027
00:51:16,478 --> 00:51:18,718
Speaker 2: those days. And that was my conversation with Scotty. And

1028
00:51:18,758 --> 00:51:20,838
Speaker 2: this is like, so this is like, I don't know,

1029
00:51:21,078 --> 00:51:23,558
Speaker 2: last ten years, I think it's really been building. So

1030
00:51:23,598 --> 00:51:26,518
Speaker 2: today I got this one article and then I blew

1031
00:51:26,598 --> 00:51:28,438
Speaker 2: up on one part of it because I really thought,

1032
00:51:28,838 --> 00:51:32,118
Speaker 2: this is exactly what I'm talking about. So from today's times,

1033
00:51:32,198 --> 00:51:33,838
Speaker 2: out of this post and I don't remember who the

1034
00:51:34,198 --> 00:51:36,358
Speaker 2: author is. I should have written it down. But repeated

1035
00:51:36,398 --> 00:51:43,118
Speaker 2: exposure to highly stimulating, fast paced content may contribute to habituation,

1036
00:51:43,718 --> 00:51:49,918
Speaker 2: in which users become desensitized to slower, more effortful cognitive tasks,

1037
00:51:49,958 --> 00:51:54,318
Speaker 2: such as reading, problem solving, or deep learning. The researchers

1038
00:51:54,438 --> 00:51:59,358
Speaker 2: hypothesized this process may gradually weaken the brain's ability to

1039
00:51:59,478 --> 00:52:03,198
Speaker 2: sustain attention on a single task. My god, that's like

1040
00:52:03,238 --> 00:52:07,558
Speaker 2: the tremendous explanation of what's going on, and you know,

1041
00:52:08,238 --> 00:52:11,518
Speaker 2: relating to what you were talking about earlier, the method

1042
00:52:11,558 --> 00:52:16,198
Speaker 2: of matching up managers with players today, it's all incorporated

1043
00:52:16,318 --> 00:52:18,918
Speaker 2: in that nobody reads books anywhere, very rarely, that they

1044
00:52:18,958 --> 00:52:21,318
Speaker 2: don't read it from cover to cover. And then when

1045
00:52:21,358 --> 00:52:23,958
Speaker 2: you don't do that problem solving, you don't have to

1046
00:52:24,038 --> 00:52:26,518
Speaker 2: mean right now, we're you know, considering AI to the

1047
00:52:26,558 --> 00:52:28,278
Speaker 2: point where you don't even have to deep think anywhere,

1048
00:52:28,318 --> 00:52:29,918
Speaker 2: you don't have to be creative anymore.

1049
00:52:30,358 --> 00:52:31,878
Speaker 3: All this stuff is going to be done for you.

1050
00:52:31,918 --> 00:52:34,878
Speaker 3: That's to me where the danger lies. So when you're

1051
00:52:35,558 --> 00:52:38,598
Speaker 3: quote unquote seeking leadership, what are you seeking? Are you

1052
00:52:38,638 --> 00:52:43,638
Speaker 3: seeking somebody that's really there to point out life's lessons

1053
00:52:43,678 --> 00:52:49,078
Speaker 3: and give advice based on again experiences the really relaying

1054
00:52:49,078 --> 00:52:49,758
Speaker 3: of intuition.

1055
00:52:50,878 --> 00:52:53,958
Speaker 2: Is that what we're looking for with with leadership like

1056
00:52:54,038 --> 00:52:57,638
Speaker 2: this courageous method of putting yourself out there? Or are

1057
00:52:57,638 --> 00:53:02,238
Speaker 2: we trying to communicate with somebody and understand that listen,

1058
00:53:02,878 --> 00:53:05,358
Speaker 2: they don't listen, and they're gonna they're gonna check out

1059
00:53:05,518 --> 00:53:08,638
Speaker 2: very quickly. And how do I get my point across

1060
00:53:08,678 --> 00:53:11,998
Speaker 2: in short bursts? Where really it should take longer than

1061
00:53:12,038 --> 00:53:14,438
Speaker 2: a short burst. But I don't have that because if

1062
00:53:14,478 --> 00:53:16,758
Speaker 2: I do attempt to do that, my audience is not

1063
00:53:16,798 --> 00:53:19,198
Speaker 2: it's just going to turn me off. And we have

1064
00:53:19,358 --> 00:53:24,478
Speaker 2: created this. This is not something it's something new. It

1065
00:53:24,638 --> 00:53:28,398
Speaker 2: wasn't the process in the past. I much prefer the

1066
00:53:28,798 --> 00:53:32,918
Speaker 2: slower process where my mind still does leap. I brote

1067
00:53:32,958 --> 00:53:37,478
Speaker 2: this really long evaluation to Laura today based on what

1068
00:53:37,558 --> 00:53:40,118
Speaker 2: I read on her book this morning. I still got it,

1069
00:53:40,158 --> 00:53:43,198
Speaker 2: but that was from my years of I mean, man,

1070
00:53:43,238 --> 00:53:44,958
Speaker 2: I don't even know how many novels I've read, and

1071
00:53:44,958 --> 00:53:47,758
Speaker 2: I don't know how many conversations that have had whatever,

1072
00:53:48,318 --> 00:53:50,958
Speaker 2: But that's that's the difference. And I thought this paragraph

1073
00:53:51,558 --> 00:53:55,278
Speaker 2: really puts that in perspective and explains exactly what's going

1074
00:53:55,278 --> 00:53:56,158
Speaker 2: on in today's world.

1075
00:53:57,198 --> 00:53:59,718
Speaker 1: Yeah, and we're probably going to have to save all

1076
00:53:59,798 --> 00:54:02,438
Speaker 1: of this for an entire episode, Joe.

1077
00:54:02,518 --> 00:54:04,558
Speaker 4: The way to talk about this, because.

1078
00:54:04,198 --> 00:54:07,158
Speaker 1: I think I believe the scientific term is brain rot,

1079
00:54:08,278 --> 00:54:11,638
Speaker 1: where people just basically turn off their critical thinking and

1080
00:54:11,758 --> 00:54:15,758
Speaker 1: just scroll, scroll, scroll. You got put down your phone, man,

1081
00:54:15,958 --> 00:54:19,278
Speaker 1: I mean it says it's as scary what's going on

1082
00:54:19,438 --> 00:54:22,358
Speaker 1: we talk about the environment changing, what we're doing to

1083
00:54:22,438 --> 00:54:26,358
Speaker 1: our brains is just about as scary, if not more so.

1084
00:54:26,558 --> 00:54:31,558
Speaker 1: And you're dead on with that evaluation because our brains

1085
00:54:31,878 --> 00:54:37,158
Speaker 1: literally are changing. This is not hypothesis, just that the

1086
00:54:37,198 --> 00:54:40,758
Speaker 1: physical the chemical makeup of our brains are literally being

1087
00:54:40,918 --> 00:54:45,718
Speaker 1: rewired to think less. I mean, we have a society

1088
00:54:45,718 --> 00:54:49,998
Speaker 1: that's built on convenience and unfortunately that is also taking

1089
00:54:50,078 --> 00:54:53,398
Speaker 1: part inside our head. And it's something we need to

1090
00:54:53,438 --> 00:54:56,838
Speaker 1: wake up about. So that's a lot to unpack, Joe.

1091
00:54:56,878 --> 00:54:59,718
Speaker 1: But I'm glad you brought it up because it's it's

1092
00:54:59,798 --> 00:55:03,758
Speaker 1: super important, and you'd like to think that we're going

1093
00:55:03,798 --> 00:55:05,558
Speaker 1: to realize in time that we need to have the

1094
00:55:05,598 --> 00:55:09,478
Speaker 1: penduluin come back the other way and slow things down,

1095
00:55:09,958 --> 00:55:12,638
Speaker 1: especially when it comes to our reading and critical thinking.

1096
00:55:12,918 --> 00:55:14,998
Speaker 4: But we have to hear those alarm bells first.

1097
00:55:15,398 --> 00:55:15,958
Speaker 3: Agreed to me.

1098
00:55:16,198 --> 00:55:18,198
Speaker 2: You don't want to wait for a catastrophic moment to

1099
00:55:18,438 --> 00:55:19,998
Speaker 2: make you do those kind of things. This is one

1100
00:55:20,038 --> 00:55:22,198
Speaker 2: of those things to me that you have to stay

1101
00:55:22,198 --> 00:55:25,718
Speaker 2: ahead of perspective. When I do pray, I pray that

1102
00:55:25,838 --> 00:55:28,358
Speaker 2: I am able to stay ahead of perspective. Meaning you

1103
00:55:28,398 --> 00:55:30,918
Speaker 2: get so carried away with something that something has to

1104
00:55:30,918 --> 00:55:32,598
Speaker 2: come and slap you in the face and say, hey, hey,

1105
00:55:33,238 --> 00:55:36,678
Speaker 2: slow it down. That's incorrect, you're getting off track. Let's

1106
00:55:36,718 --> 00:55:39,118
Speaker 2: get back on the rails right here. Let's do what

1107
00:55:39,158 --> 00:55:40,758
Speaker 2: we know is the right thing to do, is opposed

1108
00:55:40,798 --> 00:55:42,038
Speaker 2: to the expedient thing to do.

1109
00:55:42,558 --> 00:55:44,118
Speaker 3: That's what I pray for.

1110
00:55:44,518 --> 00:55:48,638
Speaker 1: Great words brought us home as you always do, Joe, flawlessly,

1111
00:55:48,798 --> 00:55:50,718
Speaker 1: So thank you for that, and we'll see you next

1112
00:55:50,718 --> 00:55:51,998
Speaker 1: time on the Book of Joe.

1113
00:55:52,118 --> 00:55:54,078
Speaker 3: See your brother, Happy Thanksgiving.

1114
00:55:53,678 --> 00:55:54,518
Speaker 4: Happy Thanksgiving.

1115
00:56:02,038 --> 00:56:05,238
Speaker 1: The Book of Joe podcast is a product of iHeartRadio.

1116
00:56:05,478 --> 00:56:10,358
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1117
00:56:10,558 --> 00:56:12,358
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