WEBVTT - Ep. 474: Civil War - Part 4: What You Were Never Told About The Emancipation Proclamation

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<v Speaker 1>The Emancipation Proclamation only applied to areas that were under

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<v Speaker 1>Confederate control. It really didn't free the slaves anywhere where

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<v Speaker 1>the United States at that point had any jurisdiction to

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<v Speaker 1>free the slaves. So, you know, it is more of

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<v Speaker 1>a diplomatic kind of psychological document. But Lincoln believed that

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<v Speaker 1>if this was issued, as one historian years later commented

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<v Speaker 1>that the slaves weren't going to read the fine print,

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<v Speaker 1>and he believed that there would be massive runaways from

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<v Speaker 1>these plantations in the South, that the word would get

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<v Speaker 1>around in the enslaved communities, and that people would would

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<v Speaker 1>bolt and head for the nearest Union army.

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<v Speaker 2>This is the fourth pail of water that we've dipped

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<v Speaker 2>out of the ocean of the Civil War. Meaning this

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<v Speaker 2>is part four of our series. We've covered some ground

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<v Speaker 2>and I've enjoyed every step, but it's time to learn

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<v Speaker 2>about the Emancipation Proclamation and how it was a huge

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<v Speaker 2>gamble for Lincoln but would be one of the most

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<v Speaker 2>consequential war acts of the American Civil War. But how

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<v Speaker 2>could this seemingly moral proclamation devastate the Confederates. We're about

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<v Speaker 2>to find out together, And hey, guys, as my wife,

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<v Speaker 2>Misty says, it's a Civil War summer on bear Grease,

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<v Speaker 2>Join me as I explore things that I have never known.

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<v Speaker 2>I really doubt that you're gonna want to miss this one.

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<v Speaker 2>My name is Clay Knucom and this is the bear

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<v Speaker 2>Grease podcast, where we'll explore things forgotten but relevant, search

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<v Speaker 2>for insight and unlikely places, and where we'll tell the

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<v Speaker 2>story of Americans who lived their lives close to the land.

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<v Speaker 2>Brought to you by to Covi's Boots. Boy boot Man,

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<v Speaker 2>and I've been wearing to Covis for years. They're the

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<v Speaker 2>most comfortable boot I've ever put on. Good boots for

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<v Speaker 2>good times. Test test test Test Test, Yeah, Rolling, Man Rolling.

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<v Speaker 2>I'm sitting across from one of my favorite historians, a

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<v Speaker 2>brilliant man. He's published over ten books. His name is

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<v Speaker 2>doctor Brooks Blevins. He works at Missouri State University. He's

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<v Speaker 2>wearing T shirt and jeans, lace up leather work boots

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<v Speaker 2>and a red ball cap. He's unpretentious. He told me

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<v Speaker 2>he gets a haircut every six months, and he's come

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<v Speaker 2>and do. But that's kind of beside the point. I

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<v Speaker 2>pull out a giant book to try to impress him,

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<v Speaker 2>and it works. He takes note I.

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<v Speaker 1>Forgot how big that book was. That is a It

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<v Speaker 1>is a biblical size.

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<v Speaker 2>So when I got this book, battlecryt Freedom by James McPherson.

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<v Speaker 2>When you see it on Amazon, you can't see it

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<v Speaker 2>side angle, You just see the cover. And I envisioned

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<v Speaker 2>it being like this little, like three hundred page, you know, book,

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<v Speaker 2>just cuddly and nice. When I got it, it was

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<v Speaker 2>not cuddly at all. Yeah, this is the book that

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<v Speaker 2>you assigned your students back in the nineties.

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<v Speaker 1>I did. I did, And I think that first time

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<v Speaker 1>I taught a Civil War class, I signed that book.

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<v Speaker 1>And then I probably came to the realization these people,

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<v Speaker 1>they're probably not reading a thousand page book for this course. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>but I was fresh out of grad school and gung

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<v Speaker 1>ho and crazy, and.

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<v Speaker 2>The audacity to assign a book to college students this

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<v Speaker 2>big is exactly why Brooks is here. As a matter

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<v Speaker 2>of fact, this book is just one of over sixty

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<v Speaker 2>thousand books written on the American Civil War, and more

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<v Speaker 2>pumped out each year. American interest in this topic seems endless,

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<v Speaker 2>and I want to ask him the question that we

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<v Speaker 2>started out this whole series discussing how do you feel

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<v Speaker 2>like people, your students, but also just the general world.

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<v Speaker 2>What are your comments on how people or why people

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<v Speaker 2>are so interested in the Civil War?

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<v Speaker 1>You know, growing growing up when I did in the South,

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<v Speaker 1>I think it almost came with the territory of being

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<v Speaker 1>a Southern kid. It just seemed like something you just

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<v Speaker 1>kind of grew up interested in. And so I don't

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<v Speaker 1>remember ever not being interested in the Civil War, but

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<v Speaker 1>I think historians probably spent a lot of time trying

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<v Speaker 1>to explain why there's so much interest, especially in the South,

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<v Speaker 1>the losers who had historically been more interested in the

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<v Speaker 1>Civil War than the winners. I guess. You know, my dad,

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<v Speaker 1>who was an old coach, spent most of his career

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<v Speaker 1>as a basketball coach and sometimes baseball coach, would always

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<v Speaker 1>say he he dwelt a lot more on the losses

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<v Speaker 1>than he did on the winds. And maybe maybe there's

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<v Speaker 1>some kind of psychology there where the South just couldn't

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<v Speaker 1>get over it. We just hung up on getting beat

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<v Speaker 1>with all this mythology about being the superior fighters and

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<v Speaker 1>tougher and meaner and you know, better outdoorsmen, better better horsemen,

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<v Speaker 1>and all that kind of stuff. Than the Yankees were

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<v Speaker 1>and then and then they still get beat So maybe

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<v Speaker 1>part of it is just you know, not being able

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<v Speaker 1>to get over it like that. But but I think

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<v Speaker 1>in general, for Americans, it's one of the few gigantic

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<v Speaker 1>historic moments that's it's really our moment. I mean, there's

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<v Speaker 1>there's a little bit of foreign intrigue in this, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>with England and France and trying that the Confederacy trying

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<v Speaker 1>to get allies on their side, but for the most part,

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<v Speaker 1>it's our story. It's not only our story, but it's

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<v Speaker 1>kind of the the folkrum of all of American history.

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<v Speaker 1>If you go to high school or go to college

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<v Speaker 1>today and you take American history classes, it's either up

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<v Speaker 1>through the Civil War or it's after the Civil War.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, that's still the dividing line. It was when

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<v Speaker 1>I was in school a long time ago, and it

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<v Speaker 1>still is.

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<v Speaker 2>I hadn't really thought about it like that part, but

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<v Speaker 2>you're right, that's the way you think about American history

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<v Speaker 2>as like, yeah, that's free Civil War. I mean almost

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<v Speaker 2>like the way we divide time with Christ's birth, which

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<v Speaker 2>is pretty peculiar really when you write it.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, so much of the world doesn't see history

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<v Speaker 1>and time that way, just as you know the rest

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<v Speaker 1>of the world certainly doesn't divide the period you know,

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<v Speaker 1>from the sixteen hundreds to the twenty first century as

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<v Speaker 1>up through eighteen sixty five, and then after eighteen sixty five,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, I mean, that's our So that's our peculiar

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<v Speaker 1>little thing, and that's and I think that's part of

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<v Speaker 1>the reason it still fascinates us. It is really the

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<v Speaker 1>defining moment in American history.

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<v Speaker 2>This is part four of our series. And ashamedly, but

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<v Speaker 2>also excitedly, I'll admit we're probably halfway through the Civil War,

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<v Speaker 2>but it just all seems so consequential, so relevant. But

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<v Speaker 2>in September of eighteen sixty two, something terrible happened, more

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<v Speaker 2>terrible than everything that had happened before. And it all

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<v Speaker 2>starts when Robert E. Lee marches his army into Maryland,

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<v Speaker 2>into Union territory. His hopes are a victory on enemy

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<v Speaker 2>soil would gain international tension and potentially help from Europe.

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<v Speaker 2>If his rebels could win a battle in the north,

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<v Speaker 2>it would indicate strength. And he even thought he might

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<v Speaker 2>take Washington, d c or at least make Lincoln buckle

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<v Speaker 2>and offer peace terms. It was bold. Here is our

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<v Speaker 2>old buddy j D. Hewittt of the History Underground YouTube channel,

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<v Speaker 2>introducing us to the name of this battle that's going

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<v Speaker 2>to get us moving.

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<v Speaker 3>He probably can't talk about the major battles of the

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<v Speaker 3>Civil War without talking about the Battle of Antietam, single

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<v Speaker 3>bloodiest day in American history. Even to this day, it

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<v Speaker 3>is the single bloodiest day September seventeenth, of eighteen sixty two.

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<v Speaker 2>There will be almost twenty three thousand casualties in this

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<v Speaker 2>single day. That includes the dead, wounded, missing. Thirty six

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<v Speaker 2>hundred will actually die. Antietam, beyond its bloodshed, will be

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<v Speaker 2>the catalyst for something historic, But that's coming. So before

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<v Speaker 2>we get into the battle, I've just got a more

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<v Speaker 2>relevant question that's going to help us understand Antietam. And

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<v Speaker 2>it's a question for JD that just demands attention, and

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<v Speaker 2>it's about the style of fighting in the Civil War

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<v Speaker 2>that caused so much death. I think everybody has watched

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<v Speaker 2>a Civil War movie or a scene a Civil War

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<v Speaker 2>painting and we have a sense of the kind of

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<v Speaker 2>fighting that they were doing that was causing this number

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<v Speaker 2>of casualties. Yeah, I mean it was it was like

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<v Speaker 2>an old school style of fighting, typically where they're like

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<v Speaker 2>lining up in formation and just like marching towards each

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<v Speaker 2>other shooting. Is that about right? I mean, I realize

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<v Speaker 2>that's simplistic, yeah, yeah, but essentially yeah.

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<v Speaker 4>And people look at that and they're like, well, that

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<v Speaker 4>doesn't make sense.

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<v Speaker 2>How where I'm going with this? That doesn't make sense.

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<v Speaker 4>Why would they do that? Okay?

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<v Speaker 3>So what they are doing when they are lining up

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<v Speaker 3>in formation, as you were taking all of your men,

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<v Speaker 3>you're firing in unison, and you're sending a wall of

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<v Speaker 3>lead over to the other side. So people say, well,

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<v Speaker 3>why didn't they just kind of separate and fight like

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<v Speaker 3>they would in modern times like in World War two

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<v Speaker 3>in the Civil War with.

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<v Speaker 4>The equipment that they had.

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<v Speaker 3>Well, then what you do is like you have the

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<v Speaker 3>small pocket of guys over here on the left, where

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<v Speaker 3>you're just going to have your entire formation aim there

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<v Speaker 3>and you're going to take them out, okay, and then

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<v Speaker 3>you're going to go take out the smaller one, and

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<v Speaker 3>you know, so on and so on and so forth.

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<v Speaker 3>So the tactics that they are using are the best

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<v Speaker 3>that they have with the technology and with the knowledge

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<v Speaker 3>that they have at the time. There are people who

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<v Speaker 3>are going to one hundred and fifty years from now

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<v Speaker 3>look back on us and say, wow, I cannot believe

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<v Speaker 3>that they fought the way that they did in Iraq

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<v Speaker 3>and Afghanistan.

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<v Speaker 4>That is completely crazy. The tactics will have advanced so far.

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<v Speaker 2>Are if you lined up two hundred yards from a

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<v Speaker 2>thousand soldiers that had one shot muskets, that kind of

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<v Speaker 2>artillery they were using, and you were just like, all right, ready, go,

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, is that not just a suicide mission? I mean,

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<v Speaker 2>are you just not for like, for sure gonna die?

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<v Speaker 2>That's what I just see. And when you hear the

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<v Speaker 2>number of casualties, the number of people that died, it

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<v Speaker 2>just feels like and maybe there was just no other option,

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<v Speaker 2>maybe just war during those times, it's like, well, yeah,

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<v Speaker 2>you're supposed to die.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, yeah, I know what I know. It's how it

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<v Speaker 4>feels like.

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<v Speaker 3>But this, this war is is going to put an

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<v Speaker 3>end to that because because now with these you know,

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<v Speaker 3>we have rifles, you have you know, the mini ball

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<v Speaker 3>and things like that. There are all kinds of advances

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<v Speaker 3>in military technology where you know, in the Revolutionary War,

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<v Speaker 3>you were shooting a round ball and maybe you hit

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<v Speaker 3>your target, and maybe you don't, you know, depending on

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<v Speaker 3>what the range is. So the best way to fight

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<v Speaker 3>is to get your whole regiment or your whole company

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<v Speaker 3>or whatever in a line of battle and then all

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<v Speaker 3>fire in unison.

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<v Speaker 2>But the other guys are doing the same thing.

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<v Speaker 4>They're doing the exact same thing.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I mean, it's just no wonder so many people

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<v Speaker 2>got killed.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, yeah, I.

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<v Speaker 2>Mean human casualty. It just seems like it wasn't. I

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<v Speaker 2>realized human casualty and death at any point in human

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<v Speaker 2>history would have been hard for people to deal with.

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<v Speaker 2>But it's hard not to think that human life during

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<v Speaker 2>those times was just thought about differently. Yeah, I mean,

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<v Speaker 2>what was it. I mean, you just went to war

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<v Speaker 2>to die. It just feels like it's just like, well,

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<v Speaker 2>Jimmy's going war, he will die.

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<v Speaker 3>I don't think anybody goes in expecting to die or

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<v Speaker 3>wanting to die. I think that they have a value.

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<v Speaker 3>It's not like they view human life as as cheap.

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<v Speaker 3>They probably would have been more familiar with death than

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<v Speaker 3>what we are. If you want to know what the

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<v Speaker 3>big killer is in the Civil Wars, disease, that's what's

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<v Speaker 3>killing a bunch of guys.

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<v Speaker 2>This was a deadly transition period in military technology. Both

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<v Speaker 2>sides have been trained in Napoleonic military strategies. Commanders couldn't

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<v Speaker 2>control scattered troops, no radios, cell phones, only human to

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<v Speaker 2>human communication, and formally, firearms didn't have long ranges, so

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<v Speaker 2>armies just stayed together. This was the first war fought

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<v Speaker 2>with rifled muskets, which increased the effective range from basically

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<v Speaker 2>eighty yards to over three hundred yards. As a matter

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<v Speaker 2>of fact, jeff Davis Jefferson Davis, when he was Secretary

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<v Speaker 2>of War for the United States in eighteen fifty five,

0:13:59.240 --> 0:14:02.080
<v Speaker 2>converted the un United States military to the fifty eight

0:14:02.120 --> 0:14:07.080
<v Speaker 2>caliber Springfield rifled musket. By eighteen sixty three, a seven

0:14:07.160 --> 0:14:11.840
<v Speaker 2>shot spencer carbing was used by the Union. New technology

0:14:11.960 --> 0:14:16.520
<v Speaker 2>with old tactics created terrible bloodshed. But this would also

0:14:16.600 --> 0:14:21.000
<v Speaker 2>be the last major war fought on horseback at close range.

0:14:21.000 --> 0:14:22.880
<v Speaker 2>In a bay of that fight, a horse is a

0:14:22.920 --> 0:14:27.000
<v Speaker 2>powerful tool, but it's an easy and big target at

0:14:27.040 --> 0:14:31.080
<v Speaker 2>three hundred yards. The rifle made the horse obsolete in

0:14:31.120 --> 0:14:35.920
<v Speaker 2>the battlefield. But we got to get back to Antietam.

0:14:36.480 --> 0:14:39.960
<v Speaker 2>Lincoln's Union army had been struggling in the East. He

0:14:40.080 --> 0:14:43.000
<v Speaker 2>was continually being let down by his generals, and he

0:14:43.040 --> 0:14:45.840
<v Speaker 2>was waiting on a Union victory, so he could pull

0:14:45.880 --> 0:14:48.920
<v Speaker 2>out something that was burning a hole in his pocket,

0:14:49.320 --> 0:14:53.520
<v Speaker 2>a document waiting to be signed, and proclaimed he had

0:14:53.560 --> 0:14:56.840
<v Speaker 2>actually made a covenant with God. He said, if his

0:14:57.080 --> 0:15:01.760
<v Speaker 2>armies drove the Confederates out of Maryland, he'd release the document,

0:15:02.200 --> 0:15:06.120
<v Speaker 2>which would have more power than a rifled barrel. So

0:15:06.240 --> 0:15:09.000
<v Speaker 2>hold that document in the back of your mind while

0:15:09.120 --> 0:15:13.600
<v Speaker 2>JD and Doctor Blevins describe and teet them.

0:15:14.440 --> 0:15:18.520
<v Speaker 3>In short, the Army of the Potomac under George McClellan,

0:15:19.360 --> 0:15:23.920
<v Speaker 3>who is following Roberty Lee into Maryland. I remember Maryland

0:15:24.120 --> 0:15:26.840
<v Speaker 3>is a slave state that remains loyal to the Union.

0:15:27.440 --> 0:15:31.200
<v Speaker 3>Roberty Lee is taking the fight out of Virginia and

0:15:31.280 --> 0:15:37.400
<v Speaker 3>taking it into the Northern States. So this is this

0:15:37.480 --> 0:15:39.360
<v Speaker 3>is an invasion of the North.

0:15:39.920 --> 0:15:43.480
<v Speaker 1>And so he marches his army up into Maryland. It's

0:15:43.520 --> 0:15:45.520
<v Speaker 1>one of those weird things, kind of a one of

0:15:45.560 --> 0:15:49.760
<v Speaker 1>those Hollywood moments in the Civil War where a Union

0:15:49.840 --> 0:15:54.600
<v Speaker 1>soldier finds a bunch of cigars wrapped in this you know,

0:15:54.640 --> 0:15:58.160
<v Speaker 1>wrapped in these papers, and he gets the looking at

0:15:58.160 --> 0:16:01.640
<v Speaker 1>these papers and he realizes He's basically got Robert E.

0:16:01.800 --> 0:16:06.080
<v Speaker 1>Lee's plans for his expedition. That some you know, some

0:16:06.240 --> 0:16:09.720
<v Speaker 1>officer had wrapped up his cigars in and lost it

0:16:10.120 --> 0:16:12.560
<v Speaker 1>somehow on the trip up up through there.

0:16:12.920 --> 0:16:15.600
<v Speaker 4>And one of the Union guys picks it up.

0:16:16.120 --> 0:16:19.280
<v Speaker 3>It makes its way up to McClellan and and he says,

0:16:19.840 --> 0:16:21.800
<v Speaker 3>with this right here, I will finally have what I

0:16:21.920 --> 0:16:23.360
<v Speaker 3>need to to whip Bobby Lee.

0:16:23.800 --> 0:16:24.000
<v Speaker 2>You know.

0:16:24.040 --> 0:16:28.080
<v Speaker 1>He those make it back to headquarters. George McClellan. General,

0:16:28.080 --> 0:16:31.280
<v Speaker 1>George McClellan is the He's the commander of the army,

0:16:31.280 --> 0:16:34.840
<v Speaker 1>of the Potomauth Union Army. This very stately looking Yeah,

0:16:34.880 --> 0:16:36.840
<v Speaker 1>I mean, you know, if you if you drew up

0:16:37.920 --> 0:16:40.280
<v Speaker 1>what a general should look like, it would look like

0:16:40.320 --> 0:16:44.440
<v Speaker 1>George McClellan. This big, tall, broad shouldered, you know, deep

0:16:44.560 --> 0:16:48.280
<v Speaker 1>chested guy with a stentorian voice and just you know,

0:16:48.400 --> 0:16:52.200
<v Speaker 1>always impeccably dressed and all that stuff. But he gets

0:16:52.240 --> 0:16:55.360
<v Speaker 1>the orders and turns out George McClellan may look the

0:16:55.400 --> 0:16:58.040
<v Speaker 1>part of a great general, but he didn't play the

0:16:58.120 --> 0:17:02.640
<v Speaker 1>part of a great general. And even with Robert E.

0:17:02.720 --> 0:17:08.400
<v Speaker 1>Lee's plans, he still fights. They fight this major battle,

0:17:08.520 --> 0:17:13.840
<v Speaker 1>a one day battle, September seventeenth, and by all rights,

0:17:13.840 --> 0:17:16.199
<v Speaker 1>the Union army should have just wiped up on the

0:17:16.240 --> 0:17:21.160
<v Speaker 1>Confederates and sent them scurrying back to Virginia right away.

0:17:22.119 --> 0:17:24.960
<v Speaker 1>But because of McClellan's hesitance, and he was just kind

0:17:24.960 --> 0:17:29.280
<v Speaker 1>of a naturally slow moving conservative guy, he always thought

0:17:29.280 --> 0:17:32.640
<v Speaker 1>he's outnumbered, even when he had twice as many troops

0:17:32.920 --> 0:17:39.120
<v Speaker 1>as the Confederates. Lincoln is terribly upset and basically gets

0:17:39.200 --> 0:17:42.720
<v Speaker 1>rid of McClellan, you know, after that battle, sends him

0:17:42.720 --> 0:17:45.040
<v Speaker 1>off to do other things, and you know, it gets

0:17:45.080 --> 0:17:48.840
<v Speaker 1>him away from the Army of the Potomac. But Lincoln decides,

0:17:48.960 --> 0:17:50.840
<v Speaker 1>you know, this may be as good as it gets.

0:17:50.880 --> 0:17:53.520
<v Speaker 1>At least at the end of that battle, Robert E.

0:17:53.600 --> 0:17:56.520
<v Speaker 1>Lee turned around and went back to Virginia. We can

0:17:56.640 --> 0:18:00.920
<v Speaker 1>claim it as kind of a victory. And so five

0:18:01.000 --> 0:18:05.560
<v Speaker 1>days after the Battle of Antietam, Lincoln issues the preliminary

0:18:06.440 --> 0:18:07.880
<v Speaker 1>Emancipation Proclamation.

0:18:08.560 --> 0:18:13.040
<v Speaker 3>So Emancipation Proclamation, of course, this is the proclamation that

0:18:14.040 --> 0:18:18.320
<v Speaker 3>frees all of the slaves in the Confederate States. So

0:18:18.400 --> 0:18:23.080
<v Speaker 3>slavery is still going to exist in Missouri, Kentucky, and

0:18:23.160 --> 0:18:28.199
<v Speaker 3>in Delaware and Maryland. But it's introduced as a war measure.

0:18:28.480 --> 0:18:31.119
<v Speaker 3>Prior to the Battle of Antietam, he had it ready

0:18:31.119 --> 0:18:36.080
<v Speaker 3>to go, had it drafted. But if he just issues it,

0:18:36.080 --> 0:18:38.840
<v Speaker 3>it looks like a move out of desperation. So he's

0:18:38.840 --> 0:18:41.640
<v Speaker 3>waiting for a Union victory in order to issue this,

0:18:42.680 --> 0:18:46.800
<v Speaker 3>and then after he announces that all of the slaves

0:18:46.840 --> 0:18:49.040
<v Speaker 3>in the South are going to be freed, it takes

0:18:49.040 --> 0:18:53.880
<v Speaker 3>effect in January of eighteen sixty three. That's the bloodiest

0:18:53.920 --> 0:18:54.879
<v Speaker 3>day in American history.

0:18:55.119 --> 0:19:00.520
<v Speaker 1>And it's really from that moment that Lincoln and the

0:19:00.560 --> 0:19:03.800
<v Speaker 1>North wins. The diplomatic battle there.

0:19:04.680 --> 0:19:09.280
<v Speaker 2>Antietam was a tactical draw, but functionally a strategic Union

0:19:09.400 --> 0:19:13.199
<v Speaker 2>victory and good enough for the President to finalize his

0:19:13.280 --> 0:19:18.520
<v Speaker 2>deal with God and issue the Emancipation Proclamation, which was

0:19:18.560 --> 0:19:23.479
<v Speaker 2>a written executive order by Abraham Lincoln. When he signed it,

0:19:23.520 --> 0:19:27.119
<v Speaker 2>he said, I never in my life felt more certain

0:19:27.160 --> 0:19:30.200
<v Speaker 2>that I was doing right than I do in signing

0:19:30.240 --> 0:19:33.879
<v Speaker 2>this paper. If my name ever goes into history, it

0:19:33.960 --> 0:19:38.199
<v Speaker 2>will be for this act, and my whole soul is

0:19:38.240 --> 0:19:42.360
<v Speaker 2>in it. I think it's a unique and important document

0:19:42.520 --> 0:19:45.399
<v Speaker 2>worth understanding. As a matter of fact, I'd like to

0:19:45.440 --> 0:19:50.040
<v Speaker 2>read it. This is the transcript of that order that

0:19:50.200 --> 0:19:54.520
<v Speaker 2>held Lincoln's soul on the first day of January, in

0:19:54.560 --> 0:19:57.439
<v Speaker 2>the year of Our Lord one thousand, eight hundred and

0:19:57.440 --> 0:20:02.080
<v Speaker 2>sixty three. All persons held as slaves within any state

0:20:02.560 --> 0:20:06.479
<v Speaker 2>or designated part of a State, the people whereof shall

0:20:06.520 --> 0:20:11.080
<v Speaker 2>then be in rebellion against the United States, shall be then,

0:20:11.640 --> 0:20:16.280
<v Speaker 2>thenceforth and forever free. And the Executive Government of the

0:20:16.400 --> 0:20:21.040
<v Speaker 2>United States, including the military and naval authority thereof, will

0:20:21.080 --> 0:20:24.960
<v Speaker 2>recognize and maintain the freedom of such persons, and will

0:20:24.960 --> 0:20:28.439
<v Speaker 2>do no act or acts to repress such persons or

0:20:28.480 --> 0:20:31.680
<v Speaker 2>any of them, in any efforts they make for their

0:20:31.720 --> 0:20:36.439
<v Speaker 2>actual freedom. So I'm stepping out of the proclamation. And

0:20:36.520 --> 0:20:39.480
<v Speaker 2>there is a section where it talks about where this

0:20:39.640 --> 0:20:43.679
<v Speaker 2>has jurisdiction and a bunch of eighteen hundreds legal jargon.

0:20:43.760 --> 0:20:47.199
<v Speaker 2>I'll spare you, but it's all the rebel seceded states.

0:20:48.160 --> 0:20:51.840
<v Speaker 2>And by virtue of the power and for the purpose aforesaid,

0:20:52.359 --> 0:20:55.680
<v Speaker 2>I do order and declare that all persons held as

0:20:55.720 --> 0:21:01.280
<v Speaker 2>slaves within said designated states in parts of states, are,

0:21:01.640 --> 0:21:05.960
<v Speaker 2>and henceforth shall be free, And that the Executive Government

0:21:06.000 --> 0:21:10.160
<v Speaker 2>of the United States, including the military and naval authorities thereof,

0:21:10.720 --> 0:21:15.000
<v Speaker 2>will recognize and maintain the freedom of said persons. And

0:21:15.080 --> 0:21:18.840
<v Speaker 2>I hereby enjoin upon the people so declared to be free,

0:21:19.359 --> 0:21:23.920
<v Speaker 2>to abstain from all violence, unless in necessary self defense.

0:21:24.480 --> 0:21:28.480
<v Speaker 2>And I recommend to them that, in all cases, when allowed,

0:21:28.920 --> 0:21:34.640
<v Speaker 2>they labor faithfully for reasonable wages. And I further declare

0:21:34.640 --> 0:21:38.240
<v Speaker 2>and make known that such persons of suitable condition will

0:21:38.280 --> 0:21:41.800
<v Speaker 2>be received into the armed Service of the United States,

0:21:42.080 --> 0:21:47.119
<v Speaker 2>to garrison forts, positions, stations, and other places, and to

0:21:47.240 --> 0:21:50.920
<v Speaker 2>man vessels of all sorts and said service. And upon

0:21:51.040 --> 0:21:54.520
<v Speaker 2>this act, sincerely believed to be an act of justice

0:21:54.880 --> 0:21:59.919
<v Speaker 2>warranted by the Constitution, upon military necessity, I invoke the

0:22:00.119 --> 0:22:04.800
<v Speaker 2>considerate judgment of mankind and the gracious favor of Almighty

0:22:04.880 --> 0:22:09.399
<v Speaker 2>God and witness, whereof I have hereunto set my hand,

0:22:09.880 --> 0:22:12.359
<v Speaker 2>and caused the Seal of the United States to be

0:22:12.440 --> 0:22:16.440
<v Speaker 2>affixed done at the City of Washington, the first day

0:22:16.440 --> 0:22:19.480
<v Speaker 2>of January and the year of our Lord one thousand,

0:22:19.600 --> 0:22:23.199
<v Speaker 2>eight hundred and sixty three, and of the Independence of

0:22:23.200 --> 0:22:30.000
<v Speaker 2>the United States of America the eighty seventh, signed Abraham Lincoln,

0:22:31.560 --> 0:22:36.960
<v Speaker 2>end of proclamation. Can you imagine what this meant if

0:22:37.000 --> 0:22:40.240
<v Speaker 2>you were an enslaved person, your family had been in

0:22:40.320 --> 0:22:45.040
<v Speaker 2>bondage for generations so long that you didn't know when

0:22:45.119 --> 0:22:49.080
<v Speaker 2>the last free person in your family was alive, and

0:22:49.200 --> 0:22:53.639
<v Speaker 2>suddenly you're legally free, but the powers over you don't

0:22:53.680 --> 0:22:58.159
<v Speaker 2>recognize that proclamation's authority. I'd like to have been a

0:22:58.200 --> 0:23:01.479
<v Speaker 2>fly on the wall to listen to the conversations that

0:23:01.520 --> 0:23:09.160
<v Speaker 2>these people had together. We've got to learn why this

0:23:09.359 --> 0:23:12.960
<v Speaker 2>was such a slick and powerful move by Abe Lincoln

0:23:13.520 --> 0:23:16.040
<v Speaker 2>when I think about the Civil War, And again, this

0:23:16.119 --> 0:23:18.960
<v Speaker 2>is just my exploration. This whole series is just my

0:23:19.080 --> 0:23:22.680
<v Speaker 2>exploration into questions that I have in places of interest,

0:23:23.119 --> 0:23:26.760
<v Speaker 2>Like if there was a timeline on that timeline would

0:23:26.800 --> 0:23:31.480
<v Speaker 2>be the Emancipation Proclamation, and I would have known that

0:23:31.560 --> 0:23:35.360
<v Speaker 2>proclamation to, you know, declare that all the.

0:23:35.320 --> 0:23:37.679
<v Speaker 5>Slaves were free.

0:23:37.960 --> 0:23:40.240
<v Speaker 2>That's about the extent of what I would have known

0:23:40.280 --> 0:23:43.280
<v Speaker 2>it as, and I would have I would have viewed

0:23:43.280 --> 0:23:48.280
<v Speaker 2>it as this really moral proclamation that just came from

0:23:48.320 --> 0:23:53.080
<v Speaker 2>this position of this is this is an unjust institution

0:23:53.520 --> 0:23:57.919
<v Speaker 2>that's inhumane and shouldn't exist on planet Earth. And you know,

0:23:58.000 --> 0:24:01.000
<v Speaker 2>that's what this whole war is about. This is what

0:24:01.080 --> 0:24:04.600
<v Speaker 2>I would have thought before. The more as I've learned

0:24:04.600 --> 0:24:06.280
<v Speaker 2>about it is way more complex than that.

0:24:06.359 --> 0:24:08.960
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, I would say the first thing is you hit

0:24:09.000 --> 0:24:11.760
<v Speaker 1>the nail on the head. The Emancipation Proclamation is it's

0:24:11.760 --> 0:24:17.600
<v Speaker 1>a complex story. It's a pretty straightforward document, but the

0:24:17.640 --> 0:24:22.239
<v Speaker 1>story behind it is full of nuance, and it is

0:24:22.280 --> 0:24:27.600
<v Speaker 1>certainly not as simple as your armchair history of the

0:24:27.720 --> 0:24:33.119
<v Speaker 1>United States would suggest. We know Lincoln from the time

0:24:33.160 --> 0:24:37.359
<v Speaker 1>he first became president had announced that I have no

0:24:37.520 --> 0:24:42.400
<v Speaker 1>plans to involve the government with slavery where it currently exists.

0:24:43.600 --> 0:24:45.760
<v Speaker 1>He was from that free soil tradition where the big

0:24:45.800 --> 0:24:48.800
<v Speaker 1>thing was we don't want it to expand anymore. We

0:24:48.920 --> 0:24:50.960
<v Speaker 1>just wanted to keep it kind of contained where it is.

0:24:51.000 --> 0:24:55.000
<v Speaker 1>But he announced that. Of course, the reason he's announcing

0:24:55.040 --> 0:24:58.800
<v Speaker 1>that is because by the time he's inaugurated, seven states

0:24:58.840 --> 0:25:02.560
<v Speaker 1>have already seceded and formed the Confederacy, and he's trying

0:25:02.560 --> 0:25:06.159
<v Speaker 1>to keep the other slave states from seceding. So he

0:25:06.560 --> 0:25:09.240
<v Speaker 1>makes that announcement. I think he meant it. In eighteen

0:25:09.320 --> 0:25:13.119
<v Speaker 1>sixty one. Lincoln was a pretty moderate guy. As the

0:25:13.160 --> 0:25:17.440
<v Speaker 1>war went on, I do think he drifted more toward

0:25:17.520 --> 0:25:23.000
<v Speaker 1>the abolitionist side, but he never became a full out abolitionist.

0:25:23.000 --> 0:25:27.960
<v Speaker 1>Certainly not a kind of radical abolitionist. Nobody was exactly

0:25:28.000 --> 0:25:31.160
<v Speaker 1>like John Brown, but I do think he drifted more

0:25:31.240 --> 0:25:34.719
<v Speaker 1>toward a position where he became more and more in

0:25:34.800 --> 0:25:38.800
<v Speaker 1>favor of abolishing slavery as something that should be done

0:25:39.040 --> 0:25:41.840
<v Speaker 1>and should be done right now. But there were other

0:25:41.920 --> 0:25:45.840
<v Speaker 1>reasons for that. There were military reasons for that, there

0:25:45.840 --> 0:25:47.400
<v Speaker 1>were diplomatic reasons for that.

0:25:48.080 --> 0:25:51.560
<v Speaker 2>This proclamation seems like a no brainer, something so clear

0:25:51.600 --> 0:25:53.720
<v Speaker 2>that anyone in power would have done it. But that's

0:25:53.760 --> 0:25:56.919
<v Speaker 2>just not so. It was a huge gamble. The timing

0:25:57.080 --> 0:26:01.080
<v Speaker 2>was critical, and it could have backfired. I'd like to

0:26:01.160 --> 0:26:05.160
<v Speaker 2>crack open this giant book that impressed Brooks and read

0:26:05.240 --> 0:26:10.159
<v Speaker 2>a passage from McPherson. The proclamation would apply only to

0:26:10.280 --> 0:26:14.600
<v Speaker 2>states in rebellion on January first. This produced some confusion,

0:26:14.680 --> 0:26:18.720
<v Speaker 2>because the edict thus appeared to liberate only those slaves

0:26:18.760 --> 0:26:23.160
<v Speaker 2>beyond union authority, while retaining in bondage all those within

0:26:23.200 --> 0:26:28.399
<v Speaker 2>the government's reach. A few disappointed radicals and abolitionists looked

0:26:28.440 --> 0:26:31.560
<v Speaker 2>on it in this way, where he has no power,

0:26:31.760 --> 0:26:35.479
<v Speaker 2>mister Lincoln will set the negroes free. Where he retains power,

0:26:35.840 --> 0:26:38.960
<v Speaker 2>he will consider them as slaves, declared the London Times.

0:26:39.520 --> 0:26:42.200
<v Speaker 2>This is more like a chinaman beating his two swords

0:26:42.200 --> 0:26:45.080
<v Speaker 2>together to frighten his enemy, than like an earnest man

0:26:45.240 --> 0:26:49.520
<v Speaker 2>pressing forward his cause. But such remarks missed the point

0:26:49.560 --> 0:26:54.400
<v Speaker 2>and misunderstood the president's prerogatives under the Constitution. Lincoln acted

0:26:54.480 --> 0:26:58.760
<v Speaker 2>under his war powers to seize enemy resources. He had

0:26:58.800 --> 0:27:02.800
<v Speaker 2>no constitutional power power to act against slavery in areas

0:27:02.880 --> 0:27:06.720
<v Speaker 2>loyal to the United States. The proclamation would turn Union

0:27:06.760 --> 0:27:10.879
<v Speaker 2>forces into armies of liberation on January first, if they

0:27:10.920 --> 0:27:14.040
<v Speaker 2>could win the war, and it also invited the slaves

0:27:14.080 --> 0:27:17.639
<v Speaker 2>to help them win it. Most anti slavery Americans in

0:27:17.640 --> 0:27:21.640
<v Speaker 2>Britain recognized this. We shout for joy that we live

0:27:21.800 --> 0:27:26.639
<v Speaker 2>to record this righteous decree, wrote Frederick Douglass, while William

0:27:26.720 --> 0:27:31.760
<v Speaker 2>Lloyd Garrison considered it an act of immense historic consequence.

0:27:32.440 --> 0:27:37.200
<v Speaker 2>A British abolitionist pronounced September twenty second a memorable day

0:27:37.320 --> 0:27:39.920
<v Speaker 2>in the annals of the great struggle for the freedom

0:27:40.080 --> 0:27:44.400
<v Speaker 2>of an oppressed and despised race. A radical London newspaper

0:27:44.480 --> 0:27:48.480
<v Speaker 2>believed it a gigantic stride in the paths of Christian

0:27:48.640 --> 0:27:53.240
<v Speaker 2>and civilized progress. Lincoln's own off the record analysis showed

0:27:53.280 --> 0:27:56.040
<v Speaker 2>how much his conception of the war had changed since

0:27:56.119 --> 0:28:02.360
<v Speaker 2>ten months earlier, when he had depreciated a remorseless revolutionary struggle.

0:28:03.040 --> 0:28:08.000
<v Speaker 2>After January one, Lincoln told an official of the Interior Department, quote,

0:28:08.160 --> 0:28:11.360
<v Speaker 2>the character of the war will be changed. It will

0:28:11.400 --> 0:28:14.560
<v Speaker 2>be one of subjugation. The old South is to be

0:28:14.640 --> 0:28:22.520
<v Speaker 2>destroyed and replaced by new propositions and ideas. This is

0:28:22.520 --> 0:28:25.840
<v Speaker 2>a powerful statement by Lincoln. He knew it would shift

0:28:25.880 --> 0:28:29.359
<v Speaker 2>the war, knowing that the old South would now have

0:28:29.440 --> 0:28:34.520
<v Speaker 2>to be destroyed and rebuilt, not negotiated with. This changes

0:28:34.640 --> 0:28:38.760
<v Speaker 2>everything and would change everything for the South even to

0:28:38.800 --> 0:28:45.640
<v Speaker 2>this day. McPherson then writes about the Southern response to

0:28:45.720 --> 0:28:51.000
<v Speaker 2>the emancipation quote, the Southern response to the emancipation and

0:28:51.040 --> 0:28:55.480
<v Speaker 2>the enlistment of black troops was ferocious. Upon learning the

0:28:55.520 --> 0:29:01.840
<v Speaker 2>preliminary emancipation proclamation, General Beauregard called for execution of abolition

0:29:02.000 --> 0:29:07.200
<v Speaker 2>prisoners after January first, Jefferson Davis's message to Congress on

0:29:07.280 --> 0:29:12.200
<v Speaker 2>January twelfth, eighteen sixty three, pronounced the emancipation Proclamation the

0:29:12.240 --> 0:29:17.680
<v Speaker 2>most excreeable measure in the history of guilty man. Davis

0:29:17.720 --> 0:29:22.040
<v Speaker 2>promised to turn overcaptured Union officers to state governments for

0:29:22.160 --> 0:29:28.240
<v Speaker 2>punishment as criminals engaged in inciting civil insurrection. The punishment

0:29:28.280 --> 0:29:33.440
<v Speaker 2>for this crime, of course, was death. End of quote.

0:29:33.800 --> 0:29:37.600
<v Speaker 2>The South didn't take to this proclamation very well, but

0:29:37.720 --> 0:29:41.960
<v Speaker 2>we've got to learn now why Lincoln released it at

0:29:41.960 --> 0:29:44.480
<v Speaker 2>this time and what it did. It's got rows of

0:29:44.560 --> 0:29:49.000
<v Speaker 2>teeth like an alligator. And here's doctor Brooks Blevins that's

0:29:49.040 --> 0:29:53.400
<v Speaker 2>going to tell us what this proclamation actually did the Confederacy.

0:29:53.400 --> 0:29:55.240
<v Speaker 1>And it's one of the things about the Civil War

0:29:55.280 --> 0:29:57.640
<v Speaker 1>that we don't talk about all that much, but from

0:29:57.680 --> 0:29:59.880
<v Speaker 1>the beginning of the Civil War, the Confederates had sent

0:30:00.760 --> 0:30:05.320
<v Speaker 1>basically their diplomats to Europe to try to get European

0:30:05.360 --> 0:30:09.320
<v Speaker 1>countries involved on their side as allies. Anybody who grew

0:30:09.400 --> 0:30:11.800
<v Speaker 1>up in the United States at that time, whether it

0:30:11.840 --> 0:30:15.440
<v Speaker 1>was North or South, knew that the American Revolution probably

0:30:15.480 --> 0:30:18.040
<v Speaker 1>would not have ended the way it did, probably would

0:30:18.040 --> 0:30:21.120
<v Speaker 1>not have been successful for the rebels had it not

0:30:21.240 --> 0:30:24.840
<v Speaker 1>been for the intervention of France on the side of

0:30:25.120 --> 0:30:29.800
<v Speaker 1>the United States and helping this infant country overcome their

0:30:30.040 --> 0:30:35.840
<v Speaker 1>traditional enemy England and get their independence. And so the

0:30:35.880 --> 0:30:38.880
<v Speaker 1>Confederates were thinking the same thing, we need, we need

0:30:38.880 --> 0:30:42.680
<v Speaker 1>some kind of ally to help us in our fight

0:30:42.840 --> 0:30:46.840
<v Speaker 1>for independence. And the one thing that the Confederacy had

0:30:47.480 --> 0:30:49.200
<v Speaker 1>sort of the one bargaining chip, and it was a

0:30:49.200 --> 0:30:53.440
<v Speaker 1>big bargaining chip, was cotton. It's what we call King

0:30:53.520 --> 0:30:58.280
<v Speaker 1>Cotton diplomacy. That's what it was, what historians call the

0:30:58.320 --> 0:31:03.400
<v Speaker 1>confederates approach to diplomatic relations with France and England, especially

0:31:03.600 --> 0:31:06.400
<v Speaker 1>King Cotton diplomacy. So they go over there and they're

0:31:06.440 --> 0:31:10.360
<v Speaker 1>trying to convince the British and the French to get

0:31:10.400 --> 0:31:13.600
<v Speaker 1>on our side. You know, we we've got the cotton,

0:31:14.320 --> 0:31:18.600
<v Speaker 1>especially England. The England is the great mill country of

0:31:18.640 --> 0:31:21.960
<v Speaker 1>the world, you know, you know, making cloth and all

0:31:22.040 --> 0:31:24.560
<v Speaker 1>kinds of clothing and all all that kind of stuff.

0:31:24.560 --> 0:31:28.720
<v Speaker 1>They've got. They've got all these cotton mills everywhere.

0:31:28.320 --> 0:31:30.800
<v Speaker 2>And kind of be like America's relationship to the Middle

0:31:30.840 --> 0:31:32.000
<v Speaker 2>East with oil in a way.

0:31:32.120 --> 0:31:32.360
<v Speaker 1>Yeah.

0:31:32.480 --> 0:31:36.240
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it was a cotton was a commodity that valuable,

0:31:36.480 --> 0:31:37.400
<v Speaker 2>right right.

0:31:37.240 --> 0:31:41.520
<v Speaker 1>And in this story, Great Britain would be US today, yes,

0:31:42.160 --> 0:31:45.280
<v Speaker 1>and and South and the South would be the Middle East,

0:31:45.480 --> 0:31:49.000
<v Speaker 1>you know that because they've got the raw material that

0:31:49.000 --> 0:31:51.560
<v Speaker 1>that we need. And so so that was their that

0:31:51.680 --> 0:31:54.080
<v Speaker 1>was their bargaining chip, and it was a it was

0:31:54.120 --> 0:31:59.200
<v Speaker 1>a pretty solid thing. The British had been developing a

0:31:59.280 --> 0:32:04.040
<v Speaker 1>cotton industry or a cotton growing culture in India by

0:32:04.080 --> 0:32:06.200
<v Speaker 1>this time, and another one of their colonies, and one

0:32:06.240 --> 0:32:09.400
<v Speaker 1>of their Asian colonies, and so that took a little

0:32:09.400 --> 0:32:12.200
<v Speaker 1>bit of the you know, the staying away from King

0:32:12.280 --> 0:32:16.560
<v Speaker 1>Cotton diplomacy and made the British a little more hesitant

0:32:16.560 --> 0:32:19.640
<v Speaker 1>to jump into this. And Great Britain had already outlawed slavery,

0:32:20.360 --> 0:32:24.640
<v Speaker 1>which is again when the when the war starts, Lincoln himself,

0:32:25.200 --> 0:32:28.400
<v Speaker 1>you know, was saying, this is not a war about slavery,

0:32:28.400 --> 0:32:32.240
<v Speaker 1>it's a war about restoring the Union. But as you've

0:32:32.240 --> 0:32:36.800
<v Speaker 1>already talked about in your earlier episodes, slavery was the

0:32:37.600 --> 0:32:40.000
<v Speaker 1>it was at the center of everything in the story.

0:32:40.040 --> 0:32:42.720
<v Speaker 1>It was it was the big it was the big

0:32:42.760 --> 0:32:44.040
<v Speaker 1>thing that that fueled.

0:32:43.680 --> 0:32:44.800
<v Speaker 2>Every win into Europe.

0:32:44.920 --> 0:32:45.920
<v Speaker 5>Outlawed slavery.

0:32:46.200 --> 0:32:48.400
<v Speaker 1>I think it was the early eighteen hundreds.

0:32:48.400 --> 0:32:50.880
<v Speaker 2>Okay, fifties, sixty seventy years before.

0:32:50.960 --> 0:32:53.000
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it was. It had been you know, for a

0:32:53.000 --> 0:32:56.400
<v Speaker 1>couple of generations. It had been outlawed, and I can't

0:32:56.440 --> 0:32:57.520
<v Speaker 1>remember the exact.

0:32:57.280 --> 0:33:01.560
<v Speaker 2>Year slavery was made a legal and Great Britain in

0:33:01.680 --> 0:33:05.720
<v Speaker 2>seventeen seventy two, but it was legal in English colonies

0:33:05.840 --> 0:33:09.800
<v Speaker 2>until eighteen thirty four, when it was entirely abolished in

0:33:09.880 --> 0:33:13.240
<v Speaker 2>all places with English authority. And to go back even

0:33:13.320 --> 0:33:16.640
<v Speaker 2>further to how it all started, the Age of European

0:33:16.720 --> 0:33:19.840
<v Speaker 2>exploration in the fourteen hundreds found some of the first

0:33:19.920 --> 0:33:23.560
<v Speaker 2>Europeans on the coast of West Africa, where they found

0:33:23.600 --> 0:33:26.800
<v Speaker 2>the slave trade had been in full swing for centuries,

0:33:27.120 --> 0:33:32.400
<v Speaker 2>with African kingdoms selling Africans to the Middle East. Europe

0:33:32.680 --> 0:33:36.480
<v Speaker 2>jumped into the market and exported slaves to Europe and

0:33:36.520 --> 0:33:41.480
<v Speaker 2>then later to North America. Let's get back to England's

0:33:41.600 --> 0:33:44.160
<v Speaker 2>involvement with the South and the Civil.

0:33:43.880 --> 0:33:48.040
<v Speaker 1>War, and so you know that's part of this too.

0:33:49.240 --> 0:33:54.960
<v Speaker 1>England actually does clandestinely support the Confederacy a little bit.

0:33:55.200 --> 0:33:58.960
<v Speaker 1>They built some ships over there that the Confederates quote

0:33:59.040 --> 0:34:04.240
<v Speaker 1>unquote steel and then use as their own. And England

0:34:04.280 --> 0:34:09.560
<v Speaker 1>really helped build a Confederate navy in this and they

0:34:09.560 --> 0:34:14.640
<v Speaker 1>did it all off the books, behind the scenes. Napoleon

0:34:14.680 --> 0:34:17.040
<v Speaker 1>the Third, who was the Emperor of France at the time,

0:34:17.840 --> 0:34:21.160
<v Speaker 1>told the Confederate diplomats, if you can get Great Britain

0:34:21.640 --> 0:34:23.799
<v Speaker 1>to sign off on this, and to come in on

0:34:23.840 --> 0:34:26.719
<v Speaker 1>your side. We'll join you too. You know, he kind

0:34:26.719 --> 0:34:29.239
<v Speaker 1>of wanted to jump in on the side of the Confederacy,

0:34:29.320 --> 0:34:32.280
<v Speaker 1>but he didn't want to do it if Great Britain

0:34:32.760 --> 0:34:35.560
<v Speaker 1>wasn't going to do it. So all this is going on,

0:34:36.320 --> 0:34:38.719
<v Speaker 1>still going on in eighteen sixty two, and of course

0:34:38.840 --> 0:34:42.920
<v Speaker 1>Lincoln knows all this. The war in late eighteen sixty

0:34:42.960 --> 0:34:47.560
<v Speaker 1>two is not going well for the Union side. Robert E.

0:34:47.680 --> 0:34:50.799
<v Speaker 1>Lee has just you know, by the late summer of

0:34:50.840 --> 0:34:53.239
<v Speaker 1>eighteen sixty two, Robert E. Lee has now taken over

0:34:53.280 --> 0:34:55.120
<v Speaker 1>the Army of Northern Virginia, the big you know, the

0:34:55.120 --> 0:34:58.440
<v Speaker 1>big main army in the East for the Confederacy, and

0:34:58.480 --> 0:35:01.600
<v Speaker 1>he turns out to be a really good general, better

0:35:01.640 --> 0:35:04.680
<v Speaker 1>than anybody that Lincoln has at that point, running the

0:35:04.760 --> 0:35:07.799
<v Speaker 1>Army of the Potomac, the big Army facing each other,

0:35:08.000 --> 0:35:11.360
<v Speaker 1>you know, like the old Yankees and Dodgers, you know,

0:35:11.440 --> 0:35:14.600
<v Speaker 1>the two superpowers you know, in the war, kind of

0:35:15.080 --> 0:35:18.160
<v Speaker 1>kind of fighting each other day after day. And so

0:35:18.320 --> 0:35:21.080
<v Speaker 1>all of this is going on in the background, and

0:35:21.239 --> 0:35:26.319
<v Speaker 1>during the late summerfall, Lincoln starts drafting this this proclamation,

0:35:27.080 --> 0:35:32.920
<v Speaker 1>and it's it's part diplomatic document. He knows once this

0:35:33.040 --> 0:35:36.399
<v Speaker 1>thing is issued, if it has any force behind it,

0:35:36.560 --> 0:35:38.880
<v Speaker 1>if it doesn't look like it's just too desperate and

0:35:38.920 --> 0:35:42.960
<v Speaker 1>it's a last ditch attempt by the Union to do something,

0:35:43.280 --> 0:35:46.960
<v Speaker 1>then that's going to keep England and France out of

0:35:47.000 --> 0:35:49.759
<v Speaker 1>the war. On the Confederate side, explain that to me.

0:35:49.960 --> 0:35:54.360
<v Speaker 2>Why would the emancipation Proclamation keep those guys out of

0:35:54.400 --> 0:35:54.640
<v Speaker 2>the way.

0:35:54.719 --> 0:35:59.560
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, and that's the other part of this. The emancipation proclamations,

0:35:59.800 --> 0:36:06.759
<v Speaker 1>as Lincoln envisioned, it would make the war about slavery.

0:36:06.800 --> 0:36:10.000
<v Speaker 1>It would make the war a war to end slavery.

0:36:10.080 --> 0:36:13.680
<v Speaker 1>From the Union side, we know the war was primarily

0:36:13.719 --> 0:36:15.279
<v Speaker 1>caused by slavery.

0:36:15.400 --> 0:36:18.440
<v Speaker 2>But he'd been tiptoeing around that, trying not to make

0:36:18.480 --> 0:36:19.120
<v Speaker 2>it about that.

0:36:19.320 --> 0:36:22.800
<v Speaker 1>Right, it was caused by slavery, but not about slavery.

0:36:22.920 --> 0:36:25.840
<v Speaker 2>So if he made it about slavery, these guys that

0:36:25.880 --> 0:36:29.279
<v Speaker 2>had already outlawed it couldn't get behind it.

0:36:29.320 --> 0:36:31.960
<v Speaker 1>They're not gonna get Yeah, France and England, they're not

0:36:32.000 --> 0:36:35.080
<v Speaker 1>going to touch the American Civil War with a pole

0:36:35.680 --> 0:36:39.240
<v Speaker 1>the length of the Atlantic Ocean between North America and Europe.

0:36:39.360 --> 0:36:42.320
<v Speaker 1>If if it's about slavery.

0:36:42.600 --> 0:36:45.520
<v Speaker 2>Why would that be simply moral concern.

0:36:46.360 --> 0:36:48.480
<v Speaker 1>It would be that and and it would be a

0:36:48.920 --> 0:36:53.520
<v Speaker 1>moral concern and just an image thing. I think by

0:36:53.560 --> 0:36:57.000
<v Speaker 1>this time Europeans would have seen themselves as you know,

0:36:57.040 --> 0:36:59.080
<v Speaker 1>we've we've gone beyond.

0:36:58.760 --> 0:37:02.040
<v Speaker 2>This, elevated beyond right, we're institution of slavery.

0:37:02.160 --> 0:37:07.040
<v Speaker 1>We're not, We're not practicing this barbaric system anymore. We're

0:37:07.120 --> 0:37:09.680
<v Speaker 1>above that, and we don't want to get back down

0:37:09.719 --> 0:37:10.280
<v Speaker 1>in the mud.

0:37:10.440 --> 0:37:13.760
<v Speaker 2>But before, when they knew that it really was about

0:37:13.800 --> 0:37:16.440
<v Speaker 2>slavery and it was about cotton which was being fueled

0:37:16.440 --> 0:37:19.759
<v Speaker 2>by slavery, it was still okay to kind of be like, oh, yeah,

0:37:19.880 --> 0:37:20.640
<v Speaker 2>probably help you.

0:37:22.400 --> 0:37:23.120
<v Speaker 4>Yeah, that's right.

0:37:23.200 --> 0:37:26.000
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, yeah, as long as it's as long as it's

0:37:26.040 --> 0:37:29.880
<v Speaker 1>a war to restore the union and we've got then,

0:37:30.040 --> 0:37:32.080
<v Speaker 1>then that gives us at least a little bit of

0:37:32.080 --> 0:37:35.719
<v Speaker 1>cover to get involved with this, even if it's a

0:37:35.760 --> 0:37:40.919
<v Speaker 1>clandestine type involvement behind the scenes. But once you get

0:37:40.920 --> 0:37:44.399
<v Speaker 1>that document out into the public where it's a war

0:37:44.400 --> 0:37:45.160
<v Speaker 1>about slavery.

0:37:45.200 --> 0:37:48.600
<v Speaker 2>So that's point number one, is Lincoln knew that it

0:37:48.600 --> 0:37:50.319
<v Speaker 2>would keep Europe out of the war.

0:37:50.440 --> 0:37:55.239
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, it's it's very much a diplomatic weapon that was

0:37:55.640 --> 0:37:58.320
<v Speaker 1>that was effective I mean it, it did its job,

0:38:04.520 --> 0:38:07.440
<v Speaker 1>and I think Lincoln saw a couple other uses in that.

0:38:08.080 --> 0:38:12.640
<v Speaker 1>One was that even though as we've already talked about,

0:38:13.160 --> 0:38:17.920
<v Speaker 1>the Emancipation Proclamation only applied to areas that were under

0:38:17.960 --> 0:38:22.000
<v Speaker 1>Confederate control, So it didn't free the border states, the

0:38:22.040 --> 0:38:26.359
<v Speaker 1>slaves in Kentucky and Maryland, in Missouri or anything like that.

0:38:26.440 --> 0:38:29.919
<v Speaker 1>It was just it really didn't free the slaves anywhere

0:38:30.160 --> 0:38:33.360
<v Speaker 1>where the United States at that point had any jurisdiction

0:38:33.440 --> 0:38:36.880
<v Speaker 1>to free the slaves. So you know, it's it is

0:38:37.040 --> 0:38:41.080
<v Speaker 1>more of a of a diplomatic, kind of psychological document.

0:38:41.160 --> 0:38:46.040
<v Speaker 1>But Lincoln believed that if this was issued that as

0:38:46.600 --> 0:38:50.759
<v Speaker 1>one historian years later commented, that the slaves weren't going

0:38:50.800 --> 0:38:54.600
<v Speaker 1>to read the fine print, and he believed that there

0:38:54.640 --> 0:38:59.000
<v Speaker 1>would be massive runaways from these plantations in the South,

0:38:59.080 --> 0:39:01.239
<v Speaker 1>that the war would get around in the in the

0:39:01.440 --> 0:39:05.239
<v Speaker 1>enslaved communities, and that people would would bolt and head

0:39:05.280 --> 0:39:08.200
<v Speaker 1>for the nearest Union army. And a lot of people

0:39:08.320 --> 0:39:10.640
<v Speaker 1>did that. You know, there were a lot of enslaved

0:39:10.640 --> 0:39:13.279
<v Speaker 1>people who who did do that. Of course, a lot

0:39:13.280 --> 0:39:15.680
<v Speaker 1>of them lived so far, so deep in the South,

0:39:15.760 --> 0:39:17.920
<v Speaker 1>so far away from a Union army that that wasn't

0:39:18.200 --> 0:39:20.000
<v Speaker 1>going to happen that, you know, it just wasn't a

0:39:20.000 --> 0:39:22.799
<v Speaker 1>reasonable thing to expect. So so that was part of

0:39:22.840 --> 0:39:27.040
<v Speaker 1>it too. It was this that not only was a

0:39:27.320 --> 0:39:31.760
<v Speaker 1>sort of psychological warfare with the South, but it also

0:39:32.600 --> 0:39:35.200
<v Speaker 1>took away a lot of the South's labor force. If

0:39:35.239 --> 0:39:38.640
<v Speaker 1>you could get enough of these enslaved people to run

0:39:38.719 --> 0:39:41.960
<v Speaker 1>off from their plantations or the mines or the the

0:39:42.000 --> 0:39:44.839
<v Speaker 1>mills where they where they worked, you know, there you go.

0:39:44.920 --> 0:39:48.040
<v Speaker 1>You're you're you're taking a punch at the South by

0:39:48.239 --> 0:39:51.960
<v Speaker 1>by affecting the labor supply behind the scenes. That's helping

0:39:52.000 --> 0:39:55.040
<v Speaker 1>that helping the home front keep churning. And then I

0:39:55.040 --> 0:39:58.360
<v Speaker 1>think the last thing, going back to that morality question,

0:39:58.960 --> 0:40:03.120
<v Speaker 1>Lincoln realized that by this point, by let's say, by September,

0:40:03.360 --> 0:40:08.040
<v Speaker 1>you know, he issues the preliminary Emancipation Proclamation in September

0:40:08.120 --> 0:40:12.080
<v Speaker 1>of sixty two, and by this point the war had

0:40:12.120 --> 0:40:13.960
<v Speaker 1>been going on for almost a year and a half.

0:40:15.040 --> 0:40:17.680
<v Speaker 1>And as you talked about in an earlier episode, when

0:40:17.680 --> 0:40:20.799
<v Speaker 1>this thing starts, they're expecting, you know, a battle or two,

0:40:20.880 --> 0:40:23.120
<v Speaker 1>and then we're going to declare a winter and go

0:40:23.200 --> 0:40:25.960
<v Speaker 1>on about our lives. So you're a year and a

0:40:26.040 --> 0:40:28.600
<v Speaker 1>half into a war that a lot of people in

0:40:28.640 --> 0:40:33.560
<v Speaker 1>the North didn't want to be involved with, and he's

0:40:33.640 --> 0:40:38.080
<v Speaker 1>looking for something to give the North a rallying point,

0:40:38.280 --> 0:40:42.319
<v Speaker 1>and more importantly, to give the North kind of a

0:40:42.400 --> 0:40:45.520
<v Speaker 1>moral point, a moral ground to stand one. To make

0:40:45.520 --> 0:40:49.479
<v Speaker 1>the war about something that is more biblical, it's more

0:40:50.160 --> 0:40:53.000
<v Speaker 1>more meaningful than just you know, we need to get

0:40:53.040 --> 0:40:57.040
<v Speaker 1>these eleven southern states back in the United States, and

0:40:57.280 --> 0:41:00.040
<v Speaker 1>making it a war about slavery is a thing to

0:41:00.080 --> 0:41:05.560
<v Speaker 1>do that. So you've got it's diplomatic, it's psychological, it's economic,

0:41:05.640 --> 0:41:08.040
<v Speaker 1>trying to chip away at the South, so labor force,

0:41:08.040 --> 0:41:11.520
<v Speaker 1>it's all of those things rolled into one document. And

0:41:11.560 --> 0:41:15.280
<v Speaker 1>it's setting there in his desk in September of eighteen

0:41:15.320 --> 0:41:18.120
<v Speaker 1>sixty two, and he's just waiting for the right time

0:41:18.640 --> 0:41:21.759
<v Speaker 1>to issue. It's really what he's waiting on is for

0:41:22.080 --> 0:41:25.680
<v Speaker 1>one of his armies to actually win a battle, which

0:41:25.800 --> 0:41:29.680
<v Speaker 1>was no easy task. I mean, if you read, if

0:41:29.719 --> 0:41:32.200
<v Speaker 1>you read about the Civil War, you watch pretty much

0:41:32.200 --> 0:41:36.000
<v Speaker 1>any Civil War documentary on TV, you know that in

0:41:36.040 --> 0:41:38.560
<v Speaker 1>the early part of the war, almost the first three

0:41:38.600 --> 0:41:41.680
<v Speaker 1>years of the war, Lincoln spent way more of his

0:41:41.760 --> 0:41:43.840
<v Speaker 1>time than he wanted to just trying to find the

0:41:43.920 --> 0:41:47.719
<v Speaker 1>right general who's gonna especially the right general for the

0:41:47.800 --> 0:41:50.560
<v Speaker 1>Army of the Potomac, the big one that's protecting Washington,

0:41:50.640 --> 0:41:53.240
<v Speaker 1>d c. And trying to put down Robert E. Lee's

0:41:53.320 --> 0:41:57.160
<v Speaker 1>Army of Northern Virginia. And so he goes through this

0:41:57.280 --> 0:42:00.480
<v Speaker 1>long string. It's kind of like when I was a

0:42:00.560 --> 0:42:04.840
<v Speaker 1>kid and you had George Steinbrender who owned the Yankees,

0:42:05.120 --> 0:42:08.439
<v Speaker 1>and he's always firing his managers. You know, every year

0:42:08.480 --> 0:42:11.000
<v Speaker 1>he's basically firing a manager, trying to get the guy.

0:42:11.560 --> 0:42:13.680
<v Speaker 1>They win a World Series, than they lose the next year,

0:42:13.719 --> 0:42:15.880
<v Speaker 1>he fires him, and he's always trying to get the

0:42:15.960 --> 0:42:19.600
<v Speaker 1>right guy. Steinbrender never did Lincoln eventually would a guy

0:42:19.680 --> 0:42:21.319
<v Speaker 1>named us Grant.

0:42:21.840 --> 0:42:25.839
<v Speaker 2>A guy named us Grant more to come on him

0:42:26.200 --> 0:42:34.279
<v Speaker 2>a lot more. Actually. So we've established that the Emancipation

0:42:34.400 --> 0:42:38.600
<v Speaker 2>Proclamation by Lincoln at this strategic time kept Europe out

0:42:38.600 --> 0:42:43.000
<v Speaker 2>of the war. But a second point was they needed

0:42:43.360 --> 0:42:47.040
<v Speaker 2>soldiers in the Union army. It seems like it took

0:42:47.080 --> 0:42:50.080
<v Speaker 2>some time and it was kind of politically hazardous the

0:42:50.239 --> 0:42:53.840
<v Speaker 2>idea that blacks would fight for the Union, But ultimately

0:42:53.880 --> 0:42:59.360
<v Speaker 2>that's what would happen is that the Emancipation Proclamation would

0:42:59.520 --> 0:43:02.799
<v Speaker 2>free the slaves that were in the seceded States. And

0:43:03.400 --> 0:43:07.680
<v Speaker 2>I've heard a statistic that like one in four slaves

0:43:07.960 --> 0:43:11.319
<v Speaker 2>would have left an escape to the North, and some

0:43:11.400 --> 0:43:16.120
<v Speaker 2>portion of them joined the Union, And I've heard numbers

0:43:16.120 --> 0:43:18.319
<v Speaker 2>between one hundred and thirty thousand, but also heard as

0:43:18.360 --> 0:43:22.320
<v Speaker 2>many as two hundred thousand. So this was a war.

0:43:22.160 --> 0:43:26.200
<v Speaker 1>Effort, right, Yeah. Yeah, It's only after the Emancipation Proclamation

0:43:26.800 --> 0:43:31.480
<v Speaker 1>that the Union Army starts to enlist black troops, and.

0:43:31.440 --> 0:43:33.640
<v Speaker 2>There was a lot of opposition to that, even though.

0:43:33.600 --> 0:43:36.560
<v Speaker 1>Yeah nor yeah, yeah, there would have been there, there

0:43:36.560 --> 0:43:40.920
<v Speaker 1>would have. Yeah, you have to remember that even after

0:43:40.960 --> 0:43:43.360
<v Speaker 1>this becomes a war about slavery and not just a

0:43:43.400 --> 0:43:48.440
<v Speaker 1>war caused by slavery, the philosophies and the opinions of

0:43:49.239 --> 0:43:51.959
<v Speaker 1>the vast majority of white people in the North would

0:43:51.960 --> 0:43:54.839
<v Speaker 1>have been what we would today consider racist. I mean,

0:43:55.000 --> 0:43:58.880
<v Speaker 1>it's not like they all all of a sudden believed

0:43:59.000 --> 0:44:02.399
<v Speaker 1>in black equal right. I mean, you could you could

0:44:02.520 --> 0:44:06.760
<v Speaker 1>be against slavery and still not think that that black

0:44:06.800 --> 0:44:08.719
<v Speaker 1>people were your equal right. There were a lot of

0:44:08.719 --> 0:44:11.879
<v Speaker 1>people who believe that, so so there would have there

0:44:11.920 --> 0:44:16.680
<v Speaker 1>would have been a lot of opposition to arming black troops,

0:44:16.719 --> 0:44:20.320
<v Speaker 1>even even in the North. You know, one of the arguments,

0:44:20.360 --> 0:44:22.120
<v Speaker 1>I guess, you know, if you wanted to be crass

0:44:22.160 --> 0:44:24.560
<v Speaker 1>about it, one of the arguments that you could use is, well,

0:44:24.600 --> 0:44:27.960
<v Speaker 1>it's few of your white sons who have to put

0:44:28.000 --> 0:44:31.760
<v Speaker 1>on uniforms, you know, if we if we arm black people,

0:44:32.000 --> 0:44:34.040
<v Speaker 1>and who would have more reason to want to go

0:44:34.360 --> 0:44:39.440
<v Speaker 1>kill Confederates than former enslaved people. But yeah, that that

0:44:39.560 --> 0:44:42.960
<v Speaker 1>becomes a whole new element of the war in eighteen

0:44:43.000 --> 0:44:43.560
<v Speaker 1>sixty three.

0:44:43.640 --> 0:44:46.719
<v Speaker 2>And there's as I read this book, there's quote after

0:44:46.880 --> 0:44:51.920
<v Speaker 2>quote of people in the North that are upset that

0:44:51.960 --> 0:44:52.760
<v Speaker 2>the war has.

0:44:52.680 --> 0:44:54.320
<v Speaker 5>Now become about slavery.

0:44:54.560 --> 0:44:57.920
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Like there's so many quotes of people just saying

0:44:58.040 --> 0:45:01.520
<v Speaker 2>wild things about, you know, we don't want our sons

0:45:01.560 --> 0:45:04.839
<v Speaker 2>to die over the freedom of these people. I mean

0:45:04.960 --> 0:45:08.719
<v Speaker 2>stuff that like from from the armchair of an American,

0:45:09.520 --> 0:45:13.160
<v Speaker 2>the motivation of the North was just purely this moral

0:45:13.280 --> 0:45:16.359
<v Speaker 2>compass that was not had anywhere else, you know, I mean,

0:45:16.400 --> 0:45:18.839
<v Speaker 2>you see that that's not true. And there were lots

0:45:18.880 --> 0:45:21.560
<v Speaker 2>of people that were like, hey, we didn't sign up

0:45:21.800 --> 0:45:25.319
<v Speaker 2>to make, you know, to lose our lives to free

0:45:25.320 --> 0:45:27.880
<v Speaker 2>the slaves, which is so interesting.

0:45:28.320 --> 0:45:31.680
<v Speaker 1>Well, I mean you you know, you discussed that with

0:45:31.680 --> 0:45:34.479
<v Speaker 1>with JD. I think the you know, it's a whole

0:45:34.480 --> 0:45:38.759
<v Speaker 1>different thing. Why why war starts and why young men

0:45:39.600 --> 0:45:42.959
<v Speaker 1>go to fight. I mean, you know, those aren't those

0:45:43.000 --> 0:45:45.360
<v Speaker 1>don't have to be the same thing. Yeah, you know,

0:45:45.440 --> 0:45:49.520
<v Speaker 1>I mean, how many young Americans enlisted in the military

0:45:49.760 --> 0:45:53.480
<v Speaker 1>after nine to eleven going over there thinking we're protecting

0:45:53.560 --> 0:45:55.960
<v Speaker 1>our oil supplies, you know, I mean, that's what That's

0:45:55.960 --> 0:45:58.520
<v Speaker 1>not what they were doing. I mean, that's that's why

0:45:58.520 --> 0:46:00.680
<v Speaker 1>the United States is messing around in Middle East all

0:46:00.719 --> 0:46:03.759
<v Speaker 1>the time. It's about oil, but it's not. It's not

0:46:03.840 --> 0:46:07.840
<v Speaker 1>necessarily why young men and women sign up to the

0:46:07.880 --> 0:46:10.279
<v Speaker 1>Marines and the Navy and the Army and the Air

0:46:10.320 --> 0:46:13.200
<v Speaker 1>Force to go protect the oil. I mean, they're thinking,

0:46:13.560 --> 0:46:18.160
<v Speaker 1>they're patriotic, they're wanting to represent their country in different

0:46:18.200 --> 0:46:20.239
<v Speaker 1>things in the same way in the Civil War, you know,

0:46:20.840 --> 0:46:24.120
<v Speaker 1>I would say a pretty small percentage of the Northern

0:46:24.160 --> 0:46:28.000
<v Speaker 1>troops enlisted in eighteen sixty one and sixty two and

0:46:28.040 --> 0:46:30.879
<v Speaker 1>went off to war thinking they were they were going

0:46:30.920 --> 0:46:34.080
<v Speaker 1>to end slavery. That's you know, that that wasn't there.

0:46:34.360 --> 0:46:39.759
<v Speaker 1>That wasn't their motivation. And after Lincoln issues the Emancipation Proclamation,

0:46:39.880 --> 0:46:43.480
<v Speaker 1>you have a growing body of discontented people in the

0:46:43.560 --> 0:46:48.439
<v Speaker 1>Northern States who are dissatisfied with the route the war

0:46:48.560 --> 0:46:52.839
<v Speaker 1>is taking. The most radical of those, you know, eventually

0:46:52.920 --> 0:46:58.520
<v Speaker 1>they call them copperheads, and the copperheads are sometimes are

0:46:58.640 --> 0:47:02.719
<v Speaker 1>working behind the scenes to kind of undercut union efforts

0:47:02.719 --> 0:47:05.000
<v Speaker 1>and things like that. But there are plenty of other

0:47:05.040 --> 0:47:09.239
<v Speaker 1>people who weren't being that disloyal, who were just unhappy

0:47:09.280 --> 0:47:11.360
<v Speaker 1>about what the war was becoming.

0:47:11.680 --> 0:47:16.040
<v Speaker 2>You know, what I learned is just what a predicament

0:47:16.120 --> 0:47:18.720
<v Speaker 2>Lincoln was in. I mean, it just seems so clear

0:47:18.760 --> 0:47:22.040
<v Speaker 2>cut today. It's like, well, of course the Emancipation Proclamation

0:47:22.200 --> 0:47:25.600
<v Speaker 2>was this like masterful political move and what's moral move

0:47:25.680 --> 0:47:29.160
<v Speaker 2>that was so correct, But oh man, when he when

0:47:29.200 --> 0:47:32.279
<v Speaker 2>he released that, it was a gamble. I think there's

0:47:32.320 --> 0:47:34.960
<v Speaker 2>a quote in the book where it's like he says,

0:47:35.000 --> 0:47:38.319
<v Speaker 2>if there's a place on this earth that's any more

0:47:38.480 --> 0:47:40.839
<v Speaker 2>like Hell than where I'm at, you know, I don't

0:47:40.840 --> 0:47:43.520
<v Speaker 2>know where it is. Like basically, he's just being hammered

0:47:43.560 --> 0:47:47.480
<v Speaker 2>from every side. There's even political factions of Democrats in

0:47:47.520 --> 0:47:51.000
<v Speaker 2>the North that are that are trying to come around.

0:47:51.560 --> 0:47:55.080
<v Speaker 2>He made a statement about how basically the war's being

0:47:55.120 --> 0:47:56.959
<v Speaker 2>fought in front of him, and he thinks the war

0:47:57.040 --> 0:47:59.640
<v Speaker 2>might be one from behind him. Says something like that,

0:47:59.680 --> 0:48:03.200
<v Speaker 2>bas like people in the North building up political clout

0:48:03.480 --> 0:48:07.360
<v Speaker 2>and actually coming and beating him in the election that

0:48:07.480 --> 0:48:10.080
<v Speaker 2>was coming up. I mean, he's got stuff coming at

0:48:10.160 --> 0:48:13.200
<v Speaker 2>him from every side. People up, even in the North,

0:48:13.239 --> 0:48:16.560
<v Speaker 2>are saying Lincoln's not fit to be president, he's crazy.

0:48:16.840 --> 0:48:19.640
<v Speaker 1>Sure, Well, I mean, it's just kind of a given

0:48:19.719 --> 0:48:24.040
<v Speaker 1>that in the first midterm election after a new president's elected,

0:48:24.320 --> 0:48:27.800
<v Speaker 1>you know his party's going to lose seats. And Lincoln

0:48:28.360 --> 0:48:30.520
<v Speaker 1>even in the Civil War, you know, Lincoln did the

0:48:30.560 --> 0:48:32.720
<v Speaker 1>same thing in sixty two. He gets elected in eighteen

0:48:32.760 --> 0:48:37.040
<v Speaker 1>sixty and sixty two, the Democrats gained back seats. And

0:48:37.360 --> 0:48:40.640
<v Speaker 1>it's easy for us to look back because Lincoln is considered,

0:48:40.680 --> 0:48:44.920
<v Speaker 1>if not the best president in US history. Certainly, he's

0:48:45.080 --> 0:48:48.399
<v Speaker 1>literally on the Mount Rushmore of presidents, you know that.

0:48:48.760 --> 0:48:51.479
<v Speaker 1>So it's it's kind of difficult for us to think

0:48:51.560 --> 0:48:55.480
<v Speaker 1>back to the fact that almost half the people in

0:48:55.560 --> 0:49:01.440
<v Speaker 1>the North disagreed with Lincoln enough to vote the Democratic ticket.

0:49:02.120 --> 0:49:06.520
<v Speaker 2>History has rightfully turned Lincoln into a national icon, a hero.

0:49:07.400 --> 0:49:09.799
<v Speaker 2>But at the time, it could have gone either way,

0:49:10.800 --> 0:49:14.040
<v Speaker 2>and he would die so soon after the Civil War

0:49:14.560 --> 0:49:18.440
<v Speaker 2>that he'd really never know his own impact. We're going

0:49:18.520 --> 0:49:20.960
<v Speaker 2>to pick up with the Union Army at the end

0:49:21.000 --> 0:49:24.919
<v Speaker 2>of eighteen sixty two, less than two years into the war.

0:49:25.920 --> 0:49:29.320
<v Speaker 1>By the end of that year, you know, the story

0:49:29.320 --> 0:49:32.480
<v Speaker 1>for the Union Army just continues to get worse because

0:49:32.920 --> 0:49:38.600
<v Speaker 1>Lincoln replaces McClellan with a new commander, General Ambrose Burnside.

0:49:39.880 --> 0:49:44.000
<v Speaker 1>Burnside is. He's most remembered for his facial.

0:49:43.680 --> 0:49:48.960
<v Speaker 2>Hair with a last name like that, right, that's.

0:49:48.760 --> 0:49:53.600
<v Speaker 1>Where the term sideburns comes from, is Ambrose Burnside. He

0:49:53.719 --> 0:49:55.799
<v Speaker 1>had these If you look at pictures of him, he's

0:49:55.800 --> 0:50:00.000
<v Speaker 1>got these huge just this huge mass of facial hair

0:50:00.239 --> 0:50:03.360
<v Speaker 1>down down the side of his jaw. And I'm not

0:50:03.360 --> 0:50:05.560
<v Speaker 1>sure why they didn't call him burn Sides, but they

0:50:06.200 --> 0:50:11.239
<v Speaker 1>that hairstyle becomes sideburns for men. Yeah, and and but

0:50:11.320 --> 0:50:12.960
<v Speaker 1>it was after Ambrose Bumber.

0:50:12.800 --> 0:50:16.359
<v Speaker 2>Actually thought about how that's a peculiar name for right,

0:50:16.880 --> 0:50:19.080
<v Speaker 2>the facial hair down on the cheat sideburns.

0:50:19.200 --> 0:50:23.239
<v Speaker 1>It's an Ambrose Burnside and Burnside is. He was a

0:50:23.360 --> 0:50:26.600
<v Speaker 1>rare commander in that he was self aware enough and

0:50:26.680 --> 0:50:29.560
<v Speaker 1>humble enough to know that he didn't belong in charge

0:50:29.560 --> 0:50:32.960
<v Speaker 1>of an army, and he didn't. He reluctantly took the

0:50:33.080 --> 0:50:36.319
<v Speaker 1>job as head of Lincoln's Army of the Potomac, and

0:50:37.080 --> 0:50:41.440
<v Speaker 1>straight away took the army into battle. They went down

0:50:41.239 --> 0:50:44.160
<v Speaker 1>and attacked Robert E. Lee's army in the middle of

0:50:44.200 --> 0:50:46.960
<v Speaker 1>December of eighteen sixty two at a time when back

0:50:47.000 --> 0:50:51.560
<v Speaker 1>in those days you'd usually retreated to winter camp, didn't

0:50:51.600 --> 0:50:56.160
<v Speaker 1>you didn't fight much in the wintertime. And he did

0:50:56.200 --> 0:50:58.719
<v Speaker 1>it sort of because he knew Lincoln wanted him to

0:50:58.760 --> 0:51:01.520
<v Speaker 1>go fight. Lincoln was looking for somebody who would fight

0:51:02.160 --> 0:51:05.000
<v Speaker 1>and defeat Robert E. Lee. And it turned into just

0:51:05.080 --> 0:51:08.919
<v Speaker 1>this terrible defeat for the Union army, just a really

0:51:09.160 --> 0:51:13.360
<v Speaker 1>it's called the Battle of Fredericksburg. Even though Lincoln had,

0:51:13.440 --> 0:51:17.080
<v Speaker 1>you know, it, wins the diplomatic battle with the preliminary

0:51:17.120 --> 0:51:20.080
<v Speaker 1>Emancipation Proclamation, they still got a long ways to go

0:51:20.960 --> 0:51:24.480
<v Speaker 1>to win the military battle against the South. And at

0:51:24.520 --> 0:51:28.600
<v Speaker 1>the end of eighteen sixty two and January first, eighteen

0:51:28.640 --> 0:51:32.200
<v Speaker 1>sixty three, when the proclamation takes effect, pretty much everybody's

0:51:32.200 --> 0:51:35.600
<v Speaker 1>at a standoff. There to stand off in the West

0:51:36.440 --> 0:51:38.960
<v Speaker 1>between the Confederacy and the Union. They're to stand off

0:51:39.800 --> 0:51:43.880
<v Speaker 1>in you know, the Washington, d C. Virginia area, and

0:51:43.920 --> 0:51:48.319
<v Speaker 1>there's a lot more war to go, but that proclamation

0:51:48.400 --> 0:51:52.719
<v Speaker 1>has already set at least it's it's established the foundation

0:51:52.960 --> 0:51:55.759
<v Speaker 1>for a way that the that the Union can can

0:51:55.840 --> 0:51:56.560
<v Speaker 1>win this war.

0:51:57.239 --> 0:52:00.719
<v Speaker 2>The war is a standoff, but there is one more

0:52:00.840 --> 0:52:06.360
<v Speaker 2>thing that the Emancipation Proclamation helps usher into this battle,

0:52:07.239 --> 0:52:11.359
<v Speaker 2>and it's of great consequence, partly because of who it

0:52:11.560 --> 0:52:15.680
<v Speaker 2>ushers to the front of Lincoln's line of generals. With

0:52:15.840 --> 0:52:19.480
<v Speaker 2>this proclamation, with this recruitment of black soldiers that are

0:52:19.480 --> 0:52:22.719
<v Speaker 2>coming into the Union. There also seems to be during

0:52:22.760 --> 0:52:28.520
<v Speaker 2>this time a new philosophy of war that comes in

0:52:28.880 --> 0:52:32.640
<v Speaker 2>and it would be described as total war, which before

0:52:33.560 --> 0:52:35.680
<v Speaker 2>was you know, when they first got into this conflict,

0:52:35.719 --> 0:52:37.080
<v Speaker 2>they felt like it was just gonna be a couple

0:52:37.120 --> 0:52:39.560
<v Speaker 2>of battles. We're just gonna kind of do a little

0:52:39.920 --> 0:52:43.080
<v Speaker 2>fistfight and see who comes out on top and probably

0:52:43.120 --> 0:52:47.200
<v Speaker 2>come to an agreement. And then by you know, sixty

0:52:47.239 --> 0:52:50.600
<v Speaker 2>three or so, it's like this is wild, what's happening.

0:52:50.920 --> 0:52:54.200
<v Speaker 2>And there's all these great quotes of the generals and

0:52:54.320 --> 0:52:59.040
<v Speaker 2>Lincoln and them saying, hey, we're not trying to restore

0:52:59.160 --> 0:53:04.800
<v Speaker 2>the Union, We're trying to basically stamp out this Southern

0:53:05.719 --> 0:53:09.440
<v Speaker 2>you know, these states and rebuild the Union from scratch,

0:53:09.520 --> 0:53:12.840
<v Speaker 2>which is a complete new aim of something that nobody

0:53:12.880 --> 0:53:17.440
<v Speaker 2>could have foreseen in that total war. I mean, you

0:53:17.480 --> 0:53:20.000
<v Speaker 2>see it all through the second half of the Civil

0:53:20.000 --> 0:53:27.200
<v Speaker 2>War of just like civilians getting harmed, burning of private property,

0:53:27.320 --> 0:53:30.399
<v Speaker 2>I mean, all this stuff. Can you tell me about that,

0:53:30.600 --> 0:53:32.640
<v Speaker 2>like how the flip happened?

0:53:33.080 --> 0:53:40.280
<v Speaker 1>Right now? I think probably the leader who best exemplified

0:53:40.320 --> 0:53:44.200
<v Speaker 1>that total war concept that starts to take effect in

0:53:44.239 --> 0:53:48.560
<v Speaker 1>the latter half of the Civil War is US Grant.

0:53:48.920 --> 0:53:52.279
<v Speaker 2>By the assessment of many Ulysses s. Grant is the

0:53:52.280 --> 0:53:56.400
<v Speaker 2>most underrated player in the American Civil War. He rose

0:53:56.520 --> 0:53:58.960
<v Speaker 2>from the ashes of the common man to lead the

0:53:59.040 --> 0:54:04.040
<v Speaker 2>US military, leading the way in this ideology of total

0:54:04.120 --> 0:54:16.560
<v Speaker 2>war which wreaked havoc and punished the South. On the

0:54:16.600 --> 0:54:21.200
<v Speaker 2>next episode, I'm planning a deep dive into this warrior's life.

0:54:21.680 --> 0:54:25.600
<v Speaker 2>I'll be headed to the US Grant Library in Mississippi,

0:54:25.640 --> 0:54:28.160
<v Speaker 2>of all places, to talk with the people that know

0:54:28.239 --> 0:54:31.880
<v Speaker 2>him best. It is a bear grease Civil War summer

0:54:32.280 --> 0:54:35.520
<v Speaker 2>and I'm answering the questions I've always had and I

0:54:35.560 --> 0:54:38.520
<v Speaker 2>can't thank you enough for joining me. Please leave us

0:54:38.520 --> 0:54:42.120
<v Speaker 2>a review and share our podcast with your friends and family.

0:54:42.760 --> 0:54:46.680
<v Speaker 2>Brent Lake and I thank you so much for following along.

0:54:46.719 --> 0:54:49.600
<v Speaker 2>Thanks for taking the bear grease survey, which over two

0:54:49.640 --> 0:54:53.680
<v Speaker 2>thousand of you did. It all was great feedback that

0:54:53.680 --> 0:54:57.120
<v Speaker 2>we're gonna use. Thank you so much, And as always,

0:54:58.000 --> 0:55:00.920
<v Speaker 2>he the wild places wild, that's where the bears live.