1 00:00:01,000 --> 00:00:04,520 Speaker 1: From UFOs two, ghosts and government cover ups, histories where 2 00:00:04,680 --> 00:00:08,319 Speaker 1: would unexplained events. You can turn back now or learn 3 00:00:08,400 --> 00:00:16,120 Speaker 1: the stuff they don't want you to now. Hello, everyone, 4 00:00:16,200 --> 00:00:19,920 Speaker 1: Welcome back to the show, the show that never ends. Uh. 5 00:00:20,160 --> 00:00:23,440 Speaker 1: My name is Matt, my name is bed and uh 6 00:00:23,480 --> 00:00:27,800 Speaker 1: we're back in the room. This uh scary, dank, dark 7 00:00:27,920 --> 00:00:30,400 Speaker 1: cave of a room, and we're here to tell you 8 00:00:30,680 --> 00:00:35,920 Speaker 1: stories because that's why you're here, right, scary, stark, dank stories. Yeah, 9 00:00:36,479 --> 00:00:40,199 Speaker 1: old bedtime stories. Hopefully you're tucked in bed with your 10 00:00:40,680 --> 00:00:43,440 Speaker 1: whatever product you use to listen to this. Maybe you're 11 00:00:43,479 --> 00:00:46,559 Speaker 1: just pretending to listen to this right now, you're not 12 00:00:46,640 --> 00:00:50,680 Speaker 1: actually listening to it. Maybe you're just channeling this. Maybe 13 00:00:50,680 --> 00:00:55,760 Speaker 1: you can hear electromagnetic waves. Maybe you're currently astraally projecting 14 00:00:55,920 --> 00:00:58,480 Speaker 1: in this room right now and we just can't sense you, 15 00:00:59,000 --> 00:01:01,960 Speaker 1: which we had talked about before. And as you know, 16 00:01:02,000 --> 00:01:04,720 Speaker 1: if you're listening to the show, the US government did 17 00:01:04,800 --> 00:01:11,080 Speaker 1: actually spend millions and millions of dollars researching this idea 18 00:01:11,120 --> 00:01:17,160 Speaker 1: of astral projection, and the Soviet Union spent even more. Matt, 19 00:01:17,920 --> 00:01:20,560 Speaker 1: it occurs to me that now, before we jump into this, 20 00:01:21,400 --> 00:01:24,319 Speaker 1: we should tell people that you and I had a 21 00:01:24,360 --> 00:01:28,039 Speaker 1: pretty interesting experience in this room earlier today we did 22 00:01:28,360 --> 00:01:31,920 Speaker 1: we got to be guest hosts on a show called 23 00:01:31,959 --> 00:01:35,319 Speaker 1: Stuff to Blow Your Mind. Because one of those hosts, Julie, 24 00:01:35,680 --> 00:01:38,560 Speaker 1: is currently out of town, and uh, we have the 25 00:01:38,600 --> 00:01:42,280 Speaker 1: privilege of speaking with Mr Robert lamb Or he's also 26 00:01:42,360 --> 00:01:45,520 Speaker 1: known as Dr Anton and Jessup. Well, the there's a 27 00:01:45,680 --> 00:01:48,760 Speaker 1: there's a passing resemblance between those two, but I believe 28 00:01:48,800 --> 00:01:51,240 Speaker 1: he would argue they are very different people. Okay, that's 29 00:01:51,240 --> 00:01:56,400 Speaker 1: probably correct. Dr Jessop certainly would. Uh. The thing that 30 00:01:56,440 --> 00:01:59,720 Speaker 1: we talked about with Robert on that show. You know, 31 00:01:59,760 --> 00:02:01,760 Speaker 1: we'll leave it to you guys to check it out. 32 00:02:01,800 --> 00:02:04,960 Speaker 1: We don't want to spoil it for you. But if 33 00:02:05,000 --> 00:02:07,760 Speaker 1: you are a fan of this show, we believe that 34 00:02:07,800 --> 00:02:10,760 Speaker 1: you will also enjoy Stuff to Blow your Mind. Oh yes, 35 00:02:10,800 --> 00:02:14,000 Speaker 1: if you aren't already a fan, yeah you probably are. 36 00:02:14,639 --> 00:02:17,600 Speaker 1: Let's be honest. They're a lot bigger than us on 37 00:02:17,600 --> 00:02:20,320 Speaker 1: this audio thing. Oh yeah, nothing wrong with that though. 38 00:02:20,880 --> 00:02:26,160 Speaker 1: I believe in cooperation not competition, which brings me into 39 00:02:26,200 --> 00:02:29,320 Speaker 1: a series of questions. By way of segue, here for you, Matt, 40 00:02:29,760 --> 00:02:37,040 Speaker 1: you're ready, alright, let's do you enjoy games. Yes, I 41 00:02:37,200 --> 00:02:41,880 Speaker 1: enjoy all kinds of games. I like vigia games, I 42 00:02:41,960 --> 00:02:46,520 Speaker 1: like tabletop games, I like meta games, even like social games, 43 00:02:46,560 --> 00:02:52,600 Speaker 1: sociological games. That's that's true. We went through a phase. 44 00:02:52,680 --> 00:02:55,480 Speaker 1: There's a little behind the curtain stuff for all our listeners. Uh. 45 00:02:55,600 --> 00:02:59,600 Speaker 1: You and I went through a phase where we pretty 46 00:02:59,680 --> 00:03:06,080 Speaker 1: much studied body language to to the point of um 47 00:03:06,200 --> 00:03:09,080 Speaker 1: to the point of reading people fairly effectively, I would say. 48 00:03:09,120 --> 00:03:12,480 Speaker 1: And I fought it for a long time. Do you Ben, 49 00:03:12,800 --> 00:03:15,680 Speaker 1: this is still behind the curtain, don't don't look too hard. 50 00:03:15,760 --> 00:03:20,240 Speaker 1: But Ben showed me a book. Uh, and I fought 51 00:03:20,240 --> 00:03:21,760 Speaker 1: it really hard. I didn't want to read it. I 52 00:03:21,760 --> 00:03:25,919 Speaker 1: thought it was evil. Oh my gosh, I forgot about it. Yeah, 53 00:03:25,960 --> 00:03:28,800 Speaker 1: but then I ended up looking a little more into it, 54 00:03:28,919 --> 00:03:32,000 Speaker 1: and it's it's pretty terrifying. It's one of those things 55 00:03:32,080 --> 00:03:38,200 Speaker 1: you can't unknown. Yeah, yeah, it's true. But the reason 56 00:03:38,320 --> 00:03:42,600 Speaker 1: that I asked you about games is because, uh, you know, 57 00:03:42,640 --> 00:03:44,440 Speaker 1: I love the fact that you said social games. But 58 00:03:44,480 --> 00:03:47,760 Speaker 1: it leads me to my next question, which is, do 59 00:03:47,920 --> 00:03:56,680 Speaker 1: you think that empires can coexist? Well, oh gosh, I 60 00:03:56,680 --> 00:04:00,200 Speaker 1: guess it depends on how large you want your empire 61 00:04:00,280 --> 00:04:05,960 Speaker 1: to be and if your empire truly is an empire. Um, 62 00:04:06,000 --> 00:04:09,360 Speaker 1: I guess if the continents are far enough away, sure, 63 00:04:09,880 --> 00:04:13,400 Speaker 1: sure they can. If you have like one continent over 64 00:04:13,440 --> 00:04:16,280 Speaker 1: here and there's there's one empire there, one continent way 65 00:04:16,279 --> 00:04:19,560 Speaker 1: over here, separated by lots and lots and lots of seawater. 66 00:04:19,760 --> 00:04:23,400 Speaker 1: Perhaps Okay, so a buffer of some sort, yes, Okay, 67 00:04:23,440 --> 00:04:27,440 Speaker 1: empires can't co exist together. I don't think so. Okay. 68 00:04:27,640 --> 00:04:29,640 Speaker 1: I I see what you're saying. And the reason I 69 00:04:29,720 --> 00:04:34,680 Speaker 1: asked about a game is because today's audio podcast comes 70 00:04:34,720 --> 00:04:39,760 Speaker 1: to us from our earlier series on uh Soviet activity 71 00:04:39,880 --> 00:04:43,080 Speaker 1: right in Central Asia. Yeah, all kinds of Soviet activity 72 00:04:43,120 --> 00:04:48,880 Speaker 1: we've been covering lately. Yeah, everything from psychotronics to attempting 73 00:04:48,920 --> 00:04:53,799 Speaker 1: to discover Shambala. Yeah, true story. That's so weird to me. Still. 74 00:04:55,000 --> 00:04:59,240 Speaker 1: What we found when we were looking for Shambala, looking 75 00:04:59,240 --> 00:05:03,760 Speaker 1: for Soviet act civity regarding Shambala, is that there were 76 00:05:03,760 --> 00:05:07,280 Speaker 1: two camps of people there. There was one camp of 77 00:05:07,320 --> 00:05:10,320 Speaker 1: what we can call true believers who really believe that 78 00:05:10,360 --> 00:05:15,760 Speaker 1: there was Shambala or Shambala or whatever, uh, somewhere north 79 00:05:15,839 --> 00:05:21,400 Speaker 1: of India, somewhere in the steps and that this land 80 00:05:21,880 --> 00:05:25,480 Speaker 1: could hold keys to some sort of hidden technology. So 81 00:05:25,480 --> 00:05:29,320 Speaker 1: it's kind of like the conspiracy theories regarding Atlantis or 82 00:05:29,400 --> 00:05:35,000 Speaker 1: Lemuria or other fallen Hyperborean type civil civilizations. And then 83 00:05:35,000 --> 00:05:38,719 Speaker 1: you've got people who believe Shambala is more of a 84 00:05:38,720 --> 00:05:41,120 Speaker 1: philosophy or a state of mind, and they want to 85 00:05:41,400 --> 00:05:44,840 Speaker 1: create a place where that state of mind can flourish, 86 00:05:45,120 --> 00:05:48,960 Speaker 1: and additionally use it as a way of building support 87 00:05:49,040 --> 00:05:57,360 Speaker 1: for communism and building support for the Soviet Empire anarchies, right, monarchs, 88 00:05:57,440 --> 00:06:02,000 Speaker 1: at least for at least for enrollment von ran bug Stundberg. However, 89 00:06:02,279 --> 00:06:04,200 Speaker 1: I found out there's more to that name. Yeah, that 90 00:06:04,320 --> 00:06:06,040 Speaker 1: name is longer. I saw it when you made the 91 00:06:06,120 --> 00:06:10,360 Speaker 1: video and put the whole name in there. Uh yeah, 92 00:06:10,360 --> 00:06:12,560 Speaker 1: there's a vill Ham. Oh yeah, that wasn't even the 93 00:06:12,600 --> 00:06:15,000 Speaker 1: whole name. I put as much as I could fill 94 00:06:15,480 --> 00:06:18,600 Speaker 1: the bottom of the screen. Yeah. He was very um, 95 00:06:18,839 --> 00:06:24,680 Speaker 1: very old blood aristocracy. So no wonder people you no 96 00:06:24,720 --> 00:06:27,120 Speaker 1: wonder he wanted to bring monarchies back. He would have 97 00:06:27,160 --> 00:06:29,760 Speaker 1: been related to so many people. Yeah, he would have 98 00:06:29,760 --> 00:06:35,320 Speaker 1: been up there the crime. It wasn't exactly altruism. So 99 00:06:35,320 --> 00:06:38,240 Speaker 1: so what we found when we were looking at this 100 00:06:38,720 --> 00:06:43,920 Speaker 1: is that we found the search for Schambalah. This takes 101 00:06:43,960 --> 00:06:47,760 Speaker 1: place in the twenties and the thirties, nineties, twenties and thirties, 102 00:06:48,760 --> 00:06:53,080 Speaker 1: but we stumbled across something much bigger. When we're looking 103 00:06:53,120 --> 00:06:56,560 Speaker 1: at this part, it turns out that the Soviet search 104 00:06:56,720 --> 00:07:03,920 Speaker 1: for this law civilization or this spiritual haven was just 105 00:07:04,080 --> 00:07:08,920 Speaker 1: one strange chapter in a much longer story about something 106 00:07:09,000 --> 00:07:15,920 Speaker 1: called the Great Game. And of course you're first question 107 00:07:16,080 --> 00:07:20,960 Speaker 1: is you know, oh, they invented Tetris back then, if only, 108 00:07:21,120 --> 00:07:24,920 Speaker 1: if only? Uh, No, this the Great Game is something different. 109 00:07:25,000 --> 00:07:28,880 Speaker 1: It's the term here is often attributed to a guy 110 00:07:29,000 --> 00:07:34,320 Speaker 1: named Arthur Connolly. Arthur worked as an intelligence officer for 111 00:07:34,360 --> 00:07:40,040 Speaker 1: one of history's most ruthless and for time, most successful corporations. 112 00:07:40,080 --> 00:07:43,880 Speaker 1: That would, of course be the British East India Company. Yes, 113 00:07:44,120 --> 00:07:47,360 Speaker 1: a corporate intelligence officer. So he's the one who said, 114 00:07:48,760 --> 00:07:53,600 Speaker 1: so a great game. Yes, and they're this great game 115 00:07:53,680 --> 00:07:58,960 Speaker 1: was played between primarily two uh empires, really two huge 116 00:07:58,960 --> 00:08:02,239 Speaker 1: empires at the time. You're looking at Victorian era England 117 00:08:02,720 --> 00:08:06,680 Speaker 1: and also the Czarist Russia at the time, and they're 118 00:08:06,720 --> 00:08:09,960 Speaker 1: both vying for power across all of Asia. Yeah, and 119 00:08:09,960 --> 00:08:16,640 Speaker 1: They're each is trying to establish hegemony over Tibet, Mongolia, Afghanistan, Pakistan, 120 00:08:16,800 --> 00:08:21,400 Speaker 1: all the stans, all the stands, and we should take 121 00:08:21,400 --> 00:08:27,800 Speaker 1: a second h Hegemony is ultimately the control of a 122 00:08:27,960 --> 00:08:35,760 Speaker 1: region or area that is beyond state level power. So 123 00:08:36,000 --> 00:08:42,679 Speaker 1: the United States currently uh is the hedgemon of North America, 124 00:08:43,840 --> 00:08:46,200 Speaker 1: plays nice with a lot of the other countries, but 125 00:08:46,440 --> 00:08:50,960 Speaker 1: ultimately decides when the buck goes and where the buck 126 00:08:51,040 --> 00:08:55,120 Speaker 1: stops as to fall into a platitude. So at this 127 00:08:55,160 --> 00:09:00,600 Speaker 1: point we have these two huge empires. England, the Brite Empire, 128 00:09:00,800 --> 00:09:04,760 Speaker 1: has expanded all over the world by far. Their favorite 129 00:09:04,840 --> 00:09:08,120 Speaker 1: thing that they have conquered is India. It is the 130 00:09:08,200 --> 00:09:11,160 Speaker 1: crown Jewel, as it was called, of the British Empire, 131 00:09:11,520 --> 00:09:16,480 Speaker 1: and they want to safeguard this crown Jewel because, um, 132 00:09:16,520 --> 00:09:21,240 Speaker 1: you know, England collection of islands, excuse me, the British 133 00:09:21,280 --> 00:09:26,000 Speaker 1: Isles collection of islands. And so this, this smaller nation 134 00:09:26,040 --> 00:09:29,800 Speaker 1: in terms of land mass, had conquered a much larger 135 00:09:29,880 --> 00:09:34,280 Speaker 1: area and had enormous geopolitical influence because of this. So 136 00:09:34,559 --> 00:09:37,800 Speaker 1: they want to keep that piece of the pie. But 137 00:09:38,040 --> 00:09:41,040 Speaker 1: Russia wants something else. Yeah, Russia is just trying to 138 00:09:41,080 --> 00:09:44,600 Speaker 1: expand expanding its borders, is trying to acquire more and 139 00:09:44,640 --> 00:09:48,960 Speaker 1: more resources and established trade routes to send those resources 140 00:09:48,960 --> 00:09:53,280 Speaker 1: through UM basically send them all over Russia. And they 141 00:09:53,320 --> 00:09:56,480 Speaker 1: really just want to maintain their influence over the region 142 00:09:57,240 --> 00:10:00,640 Speaker 1: because you know, India isn't that far from their borders, 143 00:10:01,280 --> 00:10:04,319 Speaker 1: right yea. So we've got yeah, exactly, We've got Russia 144 00:10:04,760 --> 00:10:10,360 Speaker 1: expanding UM, trying to essentially annexed more nations or at 145 00:10:10,440 --> 00:10:16,240 Speaker 1: least in incorporate them, and we have England saying well, 146 00:10:16,320 --> 00:10:19,679 Speaker 1: how fast is Russia and growing here because we already 147 00:10:19,720 --> 00:10:23,320 Speaker 1: called DIBs on India, which I know sounds cavalier, especially 148 00:10:23,320 --> 00:10:26,280 Speaker 1: when we're talking about the deaths of literally millions of people, 149 00:10:26,840 --> 00:10:29,360 Speaker 1: But these were the attitudes at the time. These governments, 150 00:10:29,679 --> 00:10:31,760 Speaker 1: a lot of the people making the decisions, we have 151 00:10:31,800 --> 00:10:38,600 Speaker 1: to remember, were monarchical, so they were removed from you know, 152 00:10:39,360 --> 00:10:42,439 Speaker 1: kind of considering the common people of their own countries 153 00:10:42,600 --> 00:10:45,600 Speaker 1: as people. Well, sure, and we we tend to forget 154 00:10:45,679 --> 00:10:49,559 Speaker 1: sometimes that when you're in a palace or a boardroom, 155 00:10:49,720 --> 00:10:53,840 Speaker 1: or just sitting in an ivory tower and ivory tower 156 00:10:54,000 --> 00:10:57,880 Speaker 1: somewhere looking at all of these ideas, you the best 157 00:10:57,880 --> 00:11:00,240 Speaker 1: way to look at them is when make them very small. 158 00:11:00,280 --> 00:11:05,320 Speaker 1: Make a small Let's say, I don't know, table, wooden table. 159 00:11:05,880 --> 00:11:11,720 Speaker 1: That's the size of wester and that's the that's the 160 00:11:11,760 --> 00:11:14,400 Speaker 1: size of the world. And you look at with little pieces. Okay, 161 00:11:14,400 --> 00:11:16,600 Speaker 1: here's where the resources are, Here's where the cities are 162 00:11:16,640 --> 00:11:18,640 Speaker 1: that we want to maintain. This area. You can only 163 00:11:18,679 --> 00:11:21,000 Speaker 1: see it from that high up. If you really want 164 00:11:21,000 --> 00:11:22,560 Speaker 1: to control it, you have to see it from that 165 00:11:22,640 --> 00:11:28,480 Speaker 1: high up. And this is the nature of the Great Game. 166 00:11:29,040 --> 00:11:34,480 Speaker 1: The Great Game became popularized in a book by Ruggyard 167 00:11:34,600 --> 00:11:38,800 Speaker 1: Kipling uh He wrote a book called Kim and Kim 168 00:11:38,880 --> 00:11:46,559 Speaker 1: Is about this British orphan who is orphaned in India 169 00:11:46,800 --> 00:11:51,880 Speaker 1: and he eventually begins to have adventures as a spy 170 00:11:52,080 --> 00:11:58,600 Speaker 1: working for the British Empire in the Great Game. And 171 00:11:58,760 --> 00:12:02,360 Speaker 1: that would be of course, trying to counter expanding Russian 172 00:12:02,440 --> 00:12:07,120 Speaker 1: influence there. The Great Game itself is generally seen as 173 00:12:07,200 --> 00:12:13,640 Speaker 1: starting around eighteen thirteen when Russia and Persia signed something 174 00:12:13,760 --> 00:12:18,880 Speaker 1: called either the Treaty Gullistan or the Russia Russo Persian 175 00:12:18,920 --> 00:12:21,360 Speaker 1: Treaty um and it did a couple of things that 176 00:12:21,400 --> 00:12:25,320 Speaker 1: really set the set the stage of the game, and 177 00:12:25,440 --> 00:12:28,840 Speaker 1: one of those was it gave Russia control of several 178 00:12:28,960 --> 00:12:33,680 Speaker 1: key pieces of real estate, which would be Azerbaijan, Augustan, 179 00:12:34,000 --> 00:12:37,880 Speaker 1: and basically eastern Georgia. Yeah. And that was a pretty 180 00:12:37,960 --> 00:12:41,720 Speaker 1: nasty blow to England at that time because they had 181 00:12:41,800 --> 00:12:44,400 Speaker 1: some heavy influence in Persia. You know, they had advisors 182 00:12:44,400 --> 00:12:49,720 Speaker 1: in the court and stuff. Um. And this expansion, which 183 00:12:49,760 --> 00:12:51,920 Speaker 1: goes back to the original question I have for you 184 00:12:52,559 --> 00:12:56,520 Speaker 1: about whether empires can coexist and if so, how uh 185 00:12:56,640 --> 00:13:03,600 Speaker 1: this question became increasingly comportant, and you can actually measure 186 00:13:04,400 --> 00:13:08,120 Speaker 1: on the ground how much more important this question became. Um. 187 00:13:08,679 --> 00:13:13,760 Speaker 1: And it's roughly three thousand miles. Yeah. At one earlier point, 188 00:13:13,840 --> 00:13:18,280 Speaker 1: the distance between the closest Russian and English empire outpost 189 00:13:18,360 --> 00:13:21,360 Speaker 1: was about four thousand miles. Uh. In a very short 190 00:13:21,400 --> 00:13:23,960 Speaker 1: amount of time, it got to as little as one 191 00:13:24,000 --> 00:13:29,280 Speaker 1: thousand miles. Uh. The thing that happened was a real 192 00:13:29,400 --> 00:13:34,079 Speaker 1: life secret war. Yeah. So the interesting thing about this 193 00:13:34,440 --> 00:13:37,480 Speaker 1: secret war is that it's not you're not dealing with 194 00:13:38,160 --> 00:13:42,679 Speaker 1: massive battles. You're not. You're not dealing with armies that 195 00:13:42,720 --> 00:13:45,000 Speaker 1: are ready to go to war with one another at 196 00:13:45,000 --> 00:13:48,600 Speaker 1: any time. Well you are, but you're not seeing that happen. 197 00:13:48,640 --> 00:13:55,400 Speaker 1: You're dealing with intrigue, you're dealing with literally secrets and espionage. Um, 198 00:13:55,440 --> 00:13:58,520 Speaker 1: basically in the dark. It's a war in the dark. 199 00:13:58,880 --> 00:14:01,719 Speaker 1: I like that phrase. Yeah, we're talking about some of 200 00:14:01,760 --> 00:14:05,400 Speaker 1: the same people that we mentioned in the video series, right, uh, 201 00:14:06,120 --> 00:14:11,960 Speaker 1: Barchenko and ror Rich. Rorrich especially was functioning as a 202 00:14:12,040 --> 00:14:14,960 Speaker 1: spy often. That guy is fascinating. By the way, we 203 00:14:14,960 --> 00:14:18,720 Speaker 1: need to do a whole just on him. Yeah, he 204 00:14:18,760 --> 00:14:21,720 Speaker 1: impersonated the Dalai Lama. If you haven't seen our episode 205 00:14:21,760 --> 00:14:24,320 Speaker 1: on this yet, please check out Soviet Search for sham 206 00:14:24,360 --> 00:14:28,280 Speaker 1: Ba Lah. Okay, So we have got English and Russian agents, 207 00:14:28,320 --> 00:14:31,320 Speaker 1: as you said, Matt, fighting this war in the dark. 208 00:14:31,560 --> 00:14:36,440 Speaker 1: They're traveling in disguises monks and shamans and horse traders, 209 00:14:36,840 --> 00:14:40,160 Speaker 1: and you know, keep in mind this is still kind 210 00:14:40,160 --> 00:14:42,320 Speaker 1: of in the age of what would be known as 211 00:14:42,680 --> 00:14:49,360 Speaker 1: Napoleonic warfare. Napoleonic warfare is when again, a very isolated 212 00:14:49,520 --> 00:14:53,480 Speaker 1: person in power said, I should just line these guys up, 213 00:14:53,760 --> 00:14:57,480 Speaker 1: and you know, get my buddy that I'm probably related 214 00:14:57,520 --> 00:15:00,440 Speaker 1: to the line his guy his guys up and we'll 215 00:15:00,440 --> 00:15:02,960 Speaker 1: sit at the top of our mutual hills and you know, 216 00:15:03,360 --> 00:15:09,680 Speaker 1: see how many of them survive in them And yeah, 217 00:15:09,680 --> 00:15:11,400 Speaker 1: and at this time, of course, if we look at 218 00:15:11,400 --> 00:15:15,480 Speaker 1: a little bit of the military history, you know, the 219 00:15:15,480 --> 00:15:20,520 Speaker 1: the evolution of firearms also taking place, would ultimately mean 220 00:15:20,600 --> 00:15:25,920 Speaker 1: that Napoleonic tactics were suicidal. But no matter what, even 221 00:15:25,960 --> 00:15:29,840 Speaker 1: before then they were. They were very bloody, and people 222 00:15:29,880 --> 00:15:32,800 Speaker 1: were avoiding an out and out war by trying to 223 00:15:33,000 --> 00:15:38,920 Speaker 1: subtly garner influence. So the Russian Empires sent somebody to 224 00:15:39,000 --> 00:15:42,800 Speaker 1: visit the Dalai Lama, and then the British team would 225 00:15:42,800 --> 00:15:46,800 Speaker 1: send somebody to visit the Amir of Afghanistan and war 226 00:15:46,920 --> 00:15:50,560 Speaker 1: lords and Mongolia and other leaders of Stan's you know, 227 00:15:50,640 --> 00:15:56,320 Speaker 1: emerits and stuff, and and yeah, they would maintain contact 228 00:15:56,400 --> 00:16:01,600 Speaker 1: openly with with Moscow and and uh in with London 229 00:16:01,760 --> 00:16:05,080 Speaker 1: as though everything's cool, guys, where everything's fine. They'll have 230 00:16:05,120 --> 00:16:06,960 Speaker 1: a meeting. Yeah, yeah, we're gonna have a meeting. But 231 00:16:07,080 --> 00:16:09,560 Speaker 1: as I'm having this meeting, buddy's over there and he's 232 00:16:09,560 --> 00:16:12,720 Speaker 1: got the year of some warlord who's planning some bad 233 00:16:12,760 --> 00:16:16,200 Speaker 1: things against you. And Russian and England would also when 234 00:16:16,200 --> 00:16:20,240 Speaker 1: it was necessary cooperate to stop mutual threats. So the 235 00:16:20,280 --> 00:16:25,360 Speaker 1: biggest example of this is the cooperation between the British 236 00:16:25,480 --> 00:16:29,400 Speaker 1: and the Russians during World War Two, which is weird 237 00:16:29,440 --> 00:16:32,480 Speaker 1: because it makes you think, doesn't it that this game 238 00:16:32,600 --> 00:16:35,440 Speaker 1: has been playing for quite a long time. I mean, 239 00:16:35,480 --> 00:16:39,240 Speaker 1: I know, chess games can take a while, but Jesus, yeah, 240 00:16:39,280 --> 00:16:43,880 Speaker 1: that's what is God, that's over a hundred years, a 241 00:16:43,960 --> 00:16:47,680 Speaker 1: hundred and thirty years. Yeah, So it's been going on 242 00:16:47,840 --> 00:16:50,640 Speaker 1: for a while. And that led us to think about 243 00:16:50,920 --> 00:16:54,440 Speaker 1: how the Great Game has molded the world in which 244 00:16:54,520 --> 00:16:59,120 Speaker 1: we live today. So the Great Game has had effects 245 00:16:59,160 --> 00:17:03,000 Speaker 1: on Afghanistan in which were I mean they are they 246 00:17:03,000 --> 00:17:07,439 Speaker 1: have been catastrophic. Um, and it's it's severely limited the 247 00:17:07,440 --> 00:17:12,800 Speaker 1: possible development of Afghanistan because of the Separation Act that's occurred, 248 00:17:12,840 --> 00:17:18,119 Speaker 1: the coagulation of of power inside that country. Yeah. Uh, 249 00:17:18,160 --> 00:17:20,560 Speaker 1: and that that country was also used as a buffer 250 00:17:20,640 --> 00:17:25,399 Speaker 1: state to because you know, it's between Russia and India, 251 00:17:25,680 --> 00:17:28,640 Speaker 1: or it was at the time, and battles, if there 252 00:17:28,640 --> 00:17:31,920 Speaker 1: ever was a battle between those two powers, that's where 253 00:17:31,920 --> 00:17:36,080 Speaker 1: it's going to take place. And uh, those effects, of 254 00:17:36,119 --> 00:17:41,800 Speaker 1: course were catastrophic. The other the Stans were also influenced 255 00:17:41,840 --> 00:17:51,200 Speaker 1: Kazakhstankmenistan Tajakhstan, Kyrgyzstan, Uzbekistan as well, UM. Because they ultimately 256 00:17:51,600 --> 00:17:55,920 Speaker 1: were quote unquote one by the Soviet Party about the 257 00:17:55,960 --> 00:17:59,119 Speaker 1: Russian side, so they remained part of the U. S. 258 00:17:59,359 --> 00:18:02,679 Speaker 1: S R. UM. You know, they were main part of 259 00:18:02,720 --> 00:18:09,560 Speaker 1: Russia effectively even after the revolution in nineteen seventeen and 260 00:18:11,280 --> 00:18:14,520 Speaker 1: when they were under this era of Soviet rule, they 261 00:18:14,520 --> 00:18:21,680 Speaker 1: were still really important from a uh geopolitical stance because 262 00:18:22,160 --> 00:18:27,359 Speaker 1: they they had these um massive resources. I think somebody 263 00:18:27,520 --> 00:18:29,200 Speaker 1: checked me if I'm wrong on this. I think it was. 264 00:18:29,240 --> 00:18:34,280 Speaker 1: Bakistan was known as um one of the bread baskets 265 00:18:34,359 --> 00:18:38,280 Speaker 1: of Russia. So they supplied the Soviet Union with with 266 00:18:38,600 --> 00:18:41,360 Speaker 1: a lot of food and unfortunately, because the central planning, 267 00:18:41,760 --> 00:18:45,600 Speaker 1: a lot of people starved while they were exporting food. UM. 268 00:18:45,880 --> 00:18:48,960 Speaker 1: You know, same in it. It turns out that the 269 00:18:49,040 --> 00:18:53,439 Speaker 1: resources that are acquired in these areas, when you're in 270 00:18:53,480 --> 00:18:56,439 Speaker 1: control of those areas, end up having a huge impact 271 00:18:56,480 --> 00:18:59,760 Speaker 1: on what you're able to do that don't necessarily affect 272 00:19:00,280 --> 00:19:03,280 Speaker 1: the bottom line of the empire, right because these are 273 00:19:03,320 --> 00:19:07,560 Speaker 1: it's like having extra resources. So one great example is 274 00:19:07,640 --> 00:19:11,840 Speaker 1: the Eurasian opium fields, and they basically gave England the 275 00:19:11,880 --> 00:19:15,679 Speaker 1: means to pedal drugs to China um in what it 276 00:19:15,760 --> 00:19:18,760 Speaker 1: ultimately became the Opium Wars, but it was basically an 277 00:19:18,760 --> 00:19:23,360 Speaker 1: extra resource for them to get more money, right, Yeah, 278 00:19:23,400 --> 00:19:25,520 Speaker 1: because if you think about it, they're not growing opium 279 00:19:25,520 --> 00:19:29,439 Speaker 1: in the British Isles. They're not. They're not. They be 280 00:19:29,480 --> 00:19:32,920 Speaker 1: completely against it. Yeah, it's not in my backyard. Kind 281 00:19:32,920 --> 00:19:36,199 Speaker 1: of kind of makes you think about current Afghanistan right 282 00:19:36,240 --> 00:19:41,800 Speaker 1: where opium production has skyrocketed. Is that correct? Yeah, some 283 00:19:41,880 --> 00:19:44,160 Speaker 1: of the same opium fields as a matter of fact, 284 00:19:44,600 --> 00:19:48,119 Speaker 1: and that is strange. Uh, the Opium Wars deserve a 285 00:19:48,359 --> 00:19:54,560 Speaker 1: podcast all their own, but for now, this quick recap, 286 00:19:54,640 --> 00:19:57,000 Speaker 1: just a high level look at the nature of what's 287 00:19:57,040 --> 00:20:01,200 Speaker 1: going on, brings us to the big question of the day. 288 00:20:02,920 --> 00:20:06,919 Speaker 1: When when do you think the Great Game stopped? Or 289 00:20:07,000 --> 00:20:11,680 Speaker 1: do you think it stopped? Between those two powers specifically, 290 00:20:13,440 --> 00:20:17,920 Speaker 1: I mean, how how could you ever prove that it stopped? Right? Yeah, 291 00:20:17,920 --> 00:20:20,280 Speaker 1: that's a good question because it's so much of it 292 00:20:20,400 --> 00:20:26,080 Speaker 1: was waged in a clandestine way and depended upon espionage, 293 00:20:26,200 --> 00:20:29,600 Speaker 1: and and you're you're still looking at two massive I mean, 294 00:20:29,600 --> 00:20:32,560 Speaker 1: there's there are there are large powers. I don't know 295 00:20:32,680 --> 00:20:36,560 Speaker 1: if Russia is considered a superpower anymore. I believe they are. 296 00:20:36,600 --> 00:20:39,040 Speaker 1: I've just read was reading an article about is Russia 297 00:20:39,600 --> 00:20:43,040 Speaker 1: will will Russia become a superpower? Yeah, you probably heard 298 00:20:43,080 --> 00:20:47,159 Speaker 1: some varying assessments. Is probably the most fair word to 299 00:20:47,280 --> 00:20:53,760 Speaker 1: use here of Russia's ability. Um. Sometimes people will say 300 00:20:53,800 --> 00:20:57,800 Speaker 1: that the only reason Russia is at the level it 301 00:20:57,920 --> 00:21:00,720 Speaker 1: is in the U n. Security Council is because of 302 00:21:00,800 --> 00:21:03,240 Speaker 1: World War Two, that it's just a legacy from that, 303 00:21:04,000 --> 00:21:07,720 Speaker 1: or that it is a developing nation that's there because 304 00:21:07,880 --> 00:21:12,680 Speaker 1: it has a strangle hold on gas, and often, weirdly enough, 305 00:21:13,119 --> 00:21:19,000 Speaker 1: in the United States, uh, conservative politicians like to say 306 00:21:19,720 --> 00:21:22,439 Speaker 1: that the United States should begin exporting natural gas to 307 00:21:22,520 --> 00:21:29,840 Speaker 1: Europe as a way of curtailing Russia's influence. It is 308 00:21:29,880 --> 00:21:34,600 Speaker 1: also fair to say that at this point, those guys 309 00:21:34,720 --> 00:21:39,000 Speaker 1: are the nicest way you could say it is optimistic. 310 00:21:39,400 --> 00:21:42,480 Speaker 1: Is literally the nicest way. But yes, so, the idea 311 00:21:42,520 --> 00:21:47,480 Speaker 1: of Russia being a superpower is something that is tremendously 312 00:21:47,520 --> 00:21:52,320 Speaker 1: important to Russia's long term strategy right and could be 313 00:21:52,520 --> 00:21:57,080 Speaker 1: threatening to other countries, but not just the United States. 314 00:21:57,080 --> 00:21:59,000 Speaker 1: Because I think it's obvious, Matt, that you and I 315 00:21:59,119 --> 00:22:02,800 Speaker 1: both believe the great game continues. I think it absolutely does, 316 00:22:02,840 --> 00:22:06,720 Speaker 1: and perhaps just a few more players have joined. Oh yeah, yeah, 317 00:22:06,760 --> 00:22:08,720 Speaker 1: who would you who? Who would you say has joined 318 00:22:08,720 --> 00:22:14,200 Speaker 1: the game? Well, the chessboard, Well, certainly the United States, Um, 319 00:22:14,240 --> 00:22:19,080 Speaker 1: certainly China. Um. Just if you look at some of 320 00:22:19,080 --> 00:22:21,520 Speaker 1: the spying that goes on and now the known spying 321 00:22:21,560 --> 00:22:26,040 Speaker 1: that the US continues has been and continues to write 322 00:22:26,840 --> 00:22:31,760 Speaker 1: implement um. Oh yeah, as we're as we're recording this. 323 00:22:32,640 --> 00:22:35,879 Speaker 1: Angela Merkel, the Prime Minister of Germany right, was in 324 00:22:35,920 --> 00:22:39,200 Speaker 1: the news for being rejected by the n s A 325 00:22:39,320 --> 00:22:41,480 Speaker 1: when she asked, Hey, can you guys give me the 326 00:22:41,520 --> 00:22:43,560 Speaker 1: stuff you stole from my cell phone? Yeah? Can I 327 00:22:43,640 --> 00:22:46,520 Speaker 1: at least see the things that file on me? Yeah? 328 00:22:46,680 --> 00:22:50,879 Speaker 1: I understand why they wouldn't do that, but stuff to 329 00:22:50,920 --> 00:22:56,520 Speaker 1: look classy doing that, going back to going back to this, yeah, 330 00:22:56,520 --> 00:22:59,320 Speaker 1: the to Two of the big new players in the 331 00:22:59,320 --> 00:23:02,919 Speaker 1: game are China and the United States. Now, for a time, 332 00:23:03,320 --> 00:23:08,720 Speaker 1: China was not able to be a peer level regional 333 00:23:08,840 --> 00:23:14,080 Speaker 1: power due to in fighting, due to um the tremendous 334 00:23:14,119 --> 00:23:19,280 Speaker 1: influence of both the British and the Russian empires. Today, 335 00:23:19,359 --> 00:23:23,040 Speaker 1: China is ascendant and one of its big concerns in 336 00:23:23,040 --> 00:23:30,040 Speaker 1: Eurasia is fortifying its security in Western China and making 337 00:23:30,080 --> 00:23:34,320 Speaker 1: sure that it has secure access to energy. So this 338 00:23:34,320 --> 00:23:38,400 Speaker 1: this means petroleum from the Middle East and Central Asia, 339 00:23:38,600 --> 00:23:43,320 Speaker 1: natural gas, any of those products. Interestingly enough, China is 340 00:23:43,359 --> 00:23:49,320 Speaker 1: also the world leader in construction of some alternative energy, 341 00:23:49,359 --> 00:23:54,159 Speaker 1: world leader in building solar. Yeah. Well, and solar is it. 342 00:23:54,280 --> 00:23:56,879 Speaker 1: I mean, there is no question solar will be huge, 343 00:23:57,320 --> 00:23:59,639 Speaker 1: and I don't know how you can ever stop solar 344 00:23:59,680 --> 00:24:03,040 Speaker 1: power from becoming the next thing, just because it's once 345 00:24:03,080 --> 00:24:05,720 Speaker 1: it passes that threshold of being able to make it 346 00:24:05,800 --> 00:24:10,600 Speaker 1: cheaply enough. Yeah, then I mean, well it's over all. 347 00:24:10,600 --> 00:24:13,240 Speaker 1: The other energies can go take a hike, man, because 348 00:24:13,320 --> 00:24:17,680 Speaker 1: the sun is not going out. That's interesting we say 349 00:24:17,680 --> 00:24:21,960 Speaker 1: this now. Um. The big the new Anglo player in 350 00:24:22,040 --> 00:24:24,040 Speaker 1: the Great Game is, of course, as you said, the 351 00:24:24,119 --> 00:24:29,280 Speaker 1: United States. There's some strange similarities here because the United States, 352 00:24:29,359 --> 00:24:32,800 Speaker 1: like the British Empire in the beginning of the Great Game, 353 00:24:34,200 --> 00:24:40,639 Speaker 1: does not actually have sovereign territory. They're they're interested in 354 00:24:40,800 --> 00:24:46,840 Speaker 1: establishing a hedgemonty hegeminy. Many people would argue, uh for 355 00:24:47,320 --> 00:24:51,120 Speaker 1: the purpose of collecting resources and also for the purpose 356 00:24:51,200 --> 00:24:55,560 Speaker 1: of preventing other threats to that rule. Um, you know, 357 00:24:55,600 --> 00:24:58,920 Speaker 1: the biggest one would be a lot of people think 358 00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:01,840 Speaker 1: the biggest one would be either China and Russia. But 359 00:25:02,040 --> 00:25:04,399 Speaker 1: if you look at the way they're playing the game, 360 00:25:05,160 --> 00:25:08,000 Speaker 1: Iran is the one. Is the country in the target 361 00:25:08,520 --> 00:25:12,520 Speaker 1: in in the in the scope sites. Yeah, they've got 362 00:25:12,560 --> 00:25:16,679 Speaker 1: a really big friend in the Middle East that you know, 363 00:25:16,760 --> 00:25:18,520 Speaker 1: we have a really big friend in the Middle East 364 00:25:18,520 --> 00:25:23,280 Speaker 1: that we have to protect. Um is real, Iran is there, 365 00:25:23,480 --> 00:25:26,320 Speaker 1: is certainly there the biggest they feel it. Iran is 366 00:25:26,320 --> 00:25:29,320 Speaker 1: their biggest threat. So we'll not saying that it's making 367 00:25:29,400 --> 00:25:33,879 Speaker 1: the US and necessarily do what it's doing, but it 368 00:25:34,240 --> 00:25:37,359 Speaker 1: certainly helps. Now I think, you know, I think that 369 00:25:38,160 --> 00:25:43,000 Speaker 1: the United States is looking at Iran for a different reason, 370 00:25:43,080 --> 00:25:45,600 Speaker 1: for a much more pragmatic reason. Now, you know, you 371 00:25:45,680 --> 00:25:48,520 Speaker 1: and I had already talked about this in an earlier show, 372 00:25:49,080 --> 00:25:56,119 Speaker 1: and we're both fairly skeptical. I'm even dismissive of people 373 00:25:56,800 --> 00:26:00,800 Speaker 1: or politicians at least, who make arguments for wars based 374 00:26:00,800 --> 00:26:04,520 Speaker 1: on ideology. It just doesn't cut it. I don't I 375 00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:07,040 Speaker 1: don't believe it. I want to see some numbers, and 376 00:26:07,080 --> 00:26:09,679 Speaker 1: I think there is a number play here in preventing 377 00:26:09,760 --> 00:26:14,640 Speaker 1: iron There's also that very interesting um conspiracy theory about 378 00:26:15,000 --> 00:26:19,560 Speaker 1: Petro dollars, right, and and that Petro dollar bring the 379 00:26:19,640 --> 00:26:23,199 Speaker 1: back of the U S. At least that's what I've 380 00:26:23,200 --> 00:26:26,800 Speaker 1: been hearing of a financial hedge on Hedgemonty. I'm saying 381 00:26:26,800 --> 00:26:30,040 Speaker 1: the word too often. Now we know that we know 382 00:26:30,119 --> 00:26:35,320 Speaker 1: that the United States, like China, wants to secure access 383 00:26:35,359 --> 00:26:43,080 Speaker 1: to reliable energy for itself, but also for another player 384 00:26:43,080 --> 00:26:45,800 Speaker 1: in the game that will get to um, one of 385 00:26:45,840 --> 00:26:49,600 Speaker 1: the Let's go to Russia, one of the oldest, longest 386 00:26:49,640 --> 00:26:53,600 Speaker 1: players in the game, Matt. What does Russia want? Well, 387 00:26:54,680 --> 00:26:57,800 Speaker 1: it definitely wants to re establish its influence over the 388 00:26:57,840 --> 00:27:01,120 Speaker 1: rest of the area, UM, not just inside Russia. And 389 00:27:01,160 --> 00:27:04,720 Speaker 1: we can see that happening right now currently. Don't call 390 00:27:04,760 --> 00:27:08,400 Speaker 1: it a come back, yeah, um. So yeah, they're they're 391 00:27:08,440 --> 00:27:13,439 Speaker 1: interested in expanding, um, revitalizing kind of the the old 392 00:27:13,600 --> 00:27:17,080 Speaker 1: Russian Empire, the part I mean, not necessarily the Soviet 393 00:27:17,119 --> 00:27:21,000 Speaker 1: Empire per se, but you know, regaining some of that. 394 00:27:21,119 --> 00:27:25,160 Speaker 1: Give me back my stands, uncle Sam. Right now. It's 395 00:27:25,320 --> 00:27:28,920 Speaker 1: you know, the the US and Russia are at logger 396 00:27:28,960 --> 00:27:33,760 Speaker 1: heads over the presence of US military bases in uh 397 00:27:33,920 --> 00:27:37,520 Speaker 1: in some I think a Pakistan, maybe Kazakhstan as well, 398 00:27:37,600 --> 00:27:40,080 Speaker 1: I can't remember uh And those are being used to 399 00:27:40,320 --> 00:27:48,840 Speaker 1: support US operations in Afghanistan and additionally as building a 400 00:27:48,920 --> 00:27:53,359 Speaker 1: possibility to wage war with Iran, which is unfortunately on 401 00:27:53,400 --> 00:27:57,359 Speaker 1: the horizon the So that makes sense that Russia wants 402 00:27:57,359 --> 00:28:01,639 Speaker 1: to gain back its influence and back control of the 403 00:28:01,720 --> 00:28:04,960 Speaker 1: areas that it lost during the fall of the U S. 404 00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:07,919 Speaker 1: S R. And I would say it has I'm not 405 00:28:08,600 --> 00:28:11,879 Speaker 1: an historian, I'm not sure. I don't study this stuff 406 00:28:11,960 --> 00:28:15,040 Speaker 1: very often. It just would make sense that there are 407 00:28:15,119 --> 00:28:19,800 Speaker 1: still resources, important resources in those areas, um, that they 408 00:28:19,840 --> 00:28:23,479 Speaker 1: want to get back. Oh. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, like 409 00:28:23,560 --> 00:28:26,600 Speaker 1: you said earlier, most of these things are resource based 410 00:28:26,640 --> 00:28:30,560 Speaker 1: in some way. Um, there's a reason you go, you 411 00:28:30,800 --> 00:28:32,960 Speaker 1: send an army into a place where you try and 412 00:28:33,000 --> 00:28:37,560 Speaker 1: take over a land space, and it's not usually because 413 00:28:37,600 --> 00:28:39,880 Speaker 1: of an ideological reason. Yeah, it's not because you like 414 00:28:40,000 --> 00:28:45,080 Speaker 1: folk songs or whatever. I'm pardon me for sounding so dismissive. Uh. 415 00:28:45,120 --> 00:28:51,640 Speaker 1: Speaking of cynicism, there is another very old player in 416 00:28:51,680 --> 00:28:54,560 Speaker 1: this game, and it's a very old player that a 417 00:28:54,600 --> 00:28:57,440 Speaker 1: lot of people forget to their detriment, and I don't 418 00:28:57,440 --> 00:28:59,400 Speaker 1: blame me because it doesn't get reported on the news 419 00:28:59,520 --> 00:29:05,480 Speaker 1: is often as it should. The corporation the the original 420 00:29:05,560 --> 00:29:08,400 Speaker 1: reason that we even kind of learned about this because 421 00:29:08,440 --> 00:29:13,840 Speaker 1: of that intelligence officer who was working for a corporation. Yeah. Absolutely, 422 00:29:14,080 --> 00:29:20,120 Speaker 1: Uh sometimes we might forget that, Uh, energy companies and 423 00:29:20,320 --> 00:29:25,160 Speaker 1: finance companies or those concerning the financial sector can wield 424 00:29:25,480 --> 00:29:30,280 Speaker 1: enormous interest, uh, enormous influence as well, and in some 425 00:29:30,360 --> 00:29:35,680 Speaker 1: cases having some sort of influence is crucial to their survival. 426 00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:40,480 Speaker 1: You know. We we forget often that, Um, the role 427 00:29:40,520 --> 00:29:44,200 Speaker 1: of oil exploration played a big part in some of 428 00:29:44,240 --> 00:29:48,040 Speaker 1: what the British Empire did when it divided different countries 429 00:29:48,160 --> 00:29:51,280 Speaker 1: up you know, in the in the period leading up 430 00:29:51,320 --> 00:29:55,680 Speaker 1: to the modern day. Uh. We forget sometimes how dependent 431 00:29:56,080 --> 00:30:02,400 Speaker 1: other countries can become on loan from you know, private 432 00:30:02,520 --> 00:30:06,600 Speaker 1: and semi public private sources like the I m F 433 00:30:06,680 --> 00:30:10,320 Speaker 1: for the World Bank, and in some cases, uh, these 434 00:30:10,440 --> 00:30:19,520 Speaker 1: organizations can provide tremendously necessary resources, you know, better, roads, school, sanitation, 435 00:30:20,280 --> 00:30:23,280 Speaker 1: all of these things that countries need to order in 436 00:30:23,400 --> 00:30:26,480 Speaker 1: order to get a chance to develop. As long as 437 00:30:26,560 --> 00:30:28,520 Speaker 1: the I m F or whoever gets their peace too 438 00:30:29,360 --> 00:30:32,200 Speaker 1: as Yeah, as long as the whatever agreements they make 439 00:30:32,520 --> 00:30:37,200 Speaker 1: are something that they that they hold up to and 440 00:30:37,240 --> 00:30:40,280 Speaker 1: that they are allowed to hold up to by anything else. 441 00:30:40,320 --> 00:30:44,120 Speaker 1: Because what's interesting when we read about this is that 442 00:30:44,280 --> 00:30:49,920 Speaker 1: many of the people in the situations here, especially historically, 443 00:30:49,960 --> 00:30:54,160 Speaker 1: many of the people who were Eurasian elites you know, 444 00:30:54,440 --> 00:30:58,560 Speaker 1: Lamas or uh and mirrors and stuff like that, these 445 00:30:58,600 --> 00:31:04,040 Speaker 1: people learned a very careful balancing act, you know. So 446 00:31:04,160 --> 00:31:06,360 Speaker 1: you would say one thing to the British to play 447 00:31:06,400 --> 00:31:09,920 Speaker 1: them off the Russians in order to hopefully make your 448 00:31:10,000 --> 00:31:12,520 Speaker 1: area of the world a little bit better or at 449 00:31:12,640 --> 00:31:16,400 Speaker 1: least a little bit less dangerous. It's interesting now the 450 00:31:16,440 --> 00:31:19,640 Speaker 1: world in which we live, where so much is open 451 00:31:20,360 --> 00:31:24,160 Speaker 1: or at least able to be captured. Um As for 452 00:31:24,360 --> 00:31:29,200 Speaker 1: everything from a cable that's sent from one country to another, 453 00:31:29,400 --> 00:31:32,920 Speaker 1: one diplomat to another, I see interception. Yeah, there could 454 00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:35,480 Speaker 1: be an interception and now it's open, just like what 455 00:31:35,560 --> 00:31:38,960 Speaker 1: happened with those diplomatic cables that got leaked. Um it 456 00:31:39,040 --> 00:31:43,840 Speaker 1: shows you exactly what you're talking about. Where we're we're 457 00:31:43,880 --> 00:31:48,680 Speaker 1: playing a game, well, all all countries are playing some 458 00:31:48,840 --> 00:31:52,040 Speaker 1: kind of weird game to make everyone think that now 459 00:31:52,120 --> 00:31:56,120 Speaker 1: it's cool, man, We're good, is it? Is? It sort 460 00:31:56,160 --> 00:31:59,840 Speaker 1: of like that game where, um, I don't know you listen, 461 00:32:00,160 --> 00:32:02,000 Speaker 1: did this when you were a kid? We had this 462 00:32:02,080 --> 00:32:05,280 Speaker 1: game where we would play tag in a library, which 463 00:32:05,320 --> 00:32:10,320 Speaker 1: couldn't run because you were being watched by teachers. So 464 00:32:10,400 --> 00:32:13,680 Speaker 1: there were a lot of people just power walking after 465 00:32:13,680 --> 00:32:16,320 Speaker 1: each other until the eyes of the teachers were off 466 00:32:16,320 --> 00:32:18,880 Speaker 1: them for a moment, at which point they made mad dashes. 467 00:32:19,520 --> 00:32:21,880 Speaker 1: I ever did that. Well, we could try it in 468 00:32:21,920 --> 00:32:25,200 Speaker 1: the office. I don't know who would who would care? Uh? 469 00:32:25,480 --> 00:32:29,440 Speaker 1: But uh, this this is interesting because you know, we 470 00:32:29,480 --> 00:32:32,040 Speaker 1: always like to do a little bit of further reading, 471 00:32:32,280 --> 00:32:36,080 Speaker 1: a little bit of stuff to recommend this whole topic. 472 00:32:36,160 --> 00:32:39,040 Speaker 1: While it might seem a little bit dry and removed 473 00:32:39,200 --> 00:32:43,520 Speaker 1: from the average person's life, especially in the United States 474 00:32:43,640 --> 00:32:47,360 Speaker 1: or in Europe. Um, the point of the matter is 475 00:32:47,880 --> 00:32:52,880 Speaker 1: that people who are in charge of state level decisions, 476 00:32:53,200 --> 00:32:56,160 Speaker 1: you know, those the wise old men and women who 477 00:32:56,280 --> 00:33:00,640 Speaker 1: advise uh, the advertised leader, you know, whether it's a 478 00:33:01,000 --> 00:33:06,600 Speaker 1: I don't know, CEO, prime minister, president or whatever. These Uh. 479 00:33:06,800 --> 00:33:12,200 Speaker 1: The intelligentsia of international affairs very much believes in this 480 00:33:12,280 --> 00:33:16,280 Speaker 1: concept of a grand game and that uh, Eurasia is 481 00:33:16,400 --> 00:33:23,440 Speaker 1: ultimately the big either melting pot, opportunity point or point 482 00:33:23,480 --> 00:33:27,440 Speaker 1: of conflict in in the world going forward. And when 483 00:33:27,440 --> 00:33:31,600 Speaker 1: I say advisors, I don't mean people that were working 484 00:33:31,720 --> 00:33:35,920 Speaker 1: in the nineteen forties. I mean people who were still 485 00:33:35,960 --> 00:33:40,720 Speaker 1: working much more recently, like Zabeg new Brazynski, who wrote 486 00:33:40,760 --> 00:33:43,840 Speaker 1: a book called The Grand Chessboard where he argues the 487 00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:46,640 Speaker 1: same thing, and he basically says nothing has changed. People 488 00:33:46,640 --> 00:33:51,760 Speaker 1: like Henry Kissinger, people like the advisors to putin, uh, 489 00:33:51,800 --> 00:33:55,640 Speaker 1: putin himself. So when you get to that level, you 490 00:33:55,720 --> 00:33:58,680 Speaker 1: have to have an understanding of the history or else 491 00:33:58,800 --> 00:34:01,240 Speaker 1: you can't you you're not allowed. I mean, you can't 492 00:34:01,240 --> 00:34:03,960 Speaker 1: be here if you don't have a vast understanding of 493 00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:06,960 Speaker 1: the history of what you are doing. And sometimes that 494 00:34:07,120 --> 00:34:12,000 Speaker 1: history does get lost in ideology. Very true. Uh, But 495 00:34:13,719 --> 00:34:15,600 Speaker 1: this goes back to our This goes back to our 496 00:34:15,680 --> 00:34:19,120 Speaker 1: question because if you think about it, if you think 497 00:34:19,160 --> 00:34:21,879 Speaker 1: back to the early days of the of the Great Game, 498 00:34:21,960 --> 00:34:25,520 Speaker 1: we had um, we had a corporate power working with 499 00:34:25,920 --> 00:34:30,440 Speaker 1: a state power to achieve the British Empire. And you know, 500 00:34:31,400 --> 00:34:35,800 Speaker 1: if we're being honest, state and corporate powers have always 501 00:34:35,880 --> 00:34:42,080 Speaker 1: historically intermingled you know, um, the separation of Yeah, the 502 00:34:42,160 --> 00:34:46,520 Speaker 1: separation of a corporation from a you know, a family 503 00:34:46,600 --> 00:34:51,360 Speaker 1: or a monarchy as an official state power is a 504 00:34:51,440 --> 00:34:54,319 Speaker 1: little more recent than we would like to believe us. 505 00:34:54,640 --> 00:34:57,520 Speaker 1: For me, it's of the way I visualize it. It's 506 00:34:57,600 --> 00:35:02,600 Speaker 1: the corporate side, is the funding powers, the money powers 507 00:35:03,080 --> 00:35:07,560 Speaker 1: to an extent, and then the army or the warring 508 00:35:07,600 --> 00:35:10,960 Speaker 1: powers with the state, at least the way I'm seeing 509 00:35:10,960 --> 00:35:13,760 Speaker 1: it currently, And they have to because you know, somebody 510 00:35:13,800 --> 00:35:17,000 Speaker 1: has all the money. Sometimes it's the monarch that has 511 00:35:17,120 --> 00:35:21,239 Speaker 1: you know, the treasure trove room, but usually it's the 512 00:35:21,280 --> 00:35:25,440 Speaker 1: wealth of your nation, um, which isn't always, not always 513 00:35:25,480 --> 00:35:29,640 Speaker 1: controlled by the state power. Yeah. No, I know it 514 00:35:29,760 --> 00:35:35,440 Speaker 1: sounds incredibly cynical to talk this way about this, because 515 00:35:35,480 --> 00:35:38,040 Speaker 1: one of the questions that would pop up would be, 516 00:35:38,320 --> 00:35:43,960 Speaker 1: you know, ideally, why can these states not have their independence? 517 00:35:44,040 --> 00:35:48,759 Speaker 1: Why can they not be able to democratically elect their 518 00:35:48,880 --> 00:35:53,320 Speaker 1: leaders in real elections, not some kind of kangaroo court election? 519 00:35:53,800 --> 00:35:56,680 Speaker 1: And why wouldn't they be able to pursue their own 520 00:35:56,719 --> 00:36:02,560 Speaker 1: interests that would benefit them rather than a larger regional power. Um, 521 00:36:02,719 --> 00:36:05,680 Speaker 1: I totally agree. I think they should be able to 522 00:36:05,719 --> 00:36:07,719 Speaker 1: do that. But the point of the matter is that 523 00:36:07,800 --> 00:36:13,120 Speaker 1: often they end up being client states or being proxy 524 00:36:13,160 --> 00:36:16,160 Speaker 1: this scenes of proxy wars. I hope that this doesn't 525 00:36:16,160 --> 00:36:20,480 Speaker 1: happen again. But it leads us to the question, Matt, 526 00:36:22,239 --> 00:36:27,359 Speaker 1: do you think that empires can coexist? I don't know, dude. 527 00:36:28,760 --> 00:36:31,920 Speaker 1: I feel as though one day there will be no 528 00:36:32,080 --> 00:36:35,799 Speaker 1: such thing as and well there maybe there will be 529 00:36:35,800 --> 00:36:38,279 Speaker 1: one empire. Who knows, Maybe it'll be a death star 530 00:36:38,480 --> 00:36:42,279 Speaker 1: like and it's gonna be really intense, cloaked dudes that 531 00:36:42,320 --> 00:36:45,400 Speaker 1: can wield some kind of supernatural power. I would be 532 00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:50,799 Speaker 1: in really your oacrifice democracy for superpower? Are you kidding? Well, 533 00:36:50,840 --> 00:36:53,919 Speaker 1: if it feels like we have to head that way 534 00:36:53,960 --> 00:36:57,880 Speaker 1: as as as much as it pains me to say that, 535 00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:01,840 Speaker 1: it feels like a global power is inevitable or else 536 00:37:02,960 --> 00:37:05,799 Speaker 1: you mean a single global power. Yeah, like a like 537 00:37:05,880 --> 00:37:09,319 Speaker 1: a freaky empire, a freaky one empire thing. See, I 538 00:37:09,360 --> 00:37:12,680 Speaker 1: think that could happen, but it couldn't be permanent. Well, 539 00:37:12,680 --> 00:37:15,799 Speaker 1: I could see a um I could see something like 540 00:37:15,920 --> 00:37:20,080 Speaker 1: nineteen eighty four's political situation existing where there are three 541 00:37:20,719 --> 00:37:24,080 Speaker 1: huge states that have always been at war with each other, 542 00:37:24,080 --> 00:37:28,120 Speaker 1: always been allied with one another. But if you if 543 00:37:28,200 --> 00:37:32,879 Speaker 1: you play the Great Game effectively, you could convince let's 544 00:37:33,000 --> 00:37:39,239 Speaker 1: let's say they're there are three right, Uh, I'm just 545 00:37:39,400 --> 00:37:42,399 Speaker 1: trampolating here, But if you're playing the Great Game effectively enough, 546 00:37:43,080 --> 00:37:46,640 Speaker 1: then you could convince if you're one number one, you 547 00:37:46,640 --> 00:37:50,720 Speaker 1: could convince after defeating two and three kind of below 548 00:37:50,840 --> 00:37:53,200 Speaker 1: board or through espionage or whatever you do it, you 549 00:37:53,200 --> 00:37:55,319 Speaker 1: could convince the people who live in two and three 550 00:37:55,400 --> 00:38:00,080 Speaker 1: that two and three still exist and everything's okay and 551 00:38:00,120 --> 00:38:04,560 Speaker 1: nothing has changed, when really the power is with the 552 00:38:04,880 --> 00:38:08,000 Speaker 1: with only one. So so it's simple just lie to 553 00:38:08,160 --> 00:38:11,279 Speaker 1: billions of people and never get caught. Yeah, well, it 554 00:38:11,320 --> 00:38:15,799 Speaker 1: takes you to Elvis Huxley's world, and when you combine 555 00:38:16,360 --> 00:38:19,560 Speaker 1: in the Brave New World, then you start look getting 556 00:38:19,680 --> 00:38:23,080 Speaker 1: close to what our world looks like. A brave New night. 557 00:38:24,680 --> 00:38:26,640 Speaker 1: That's kind of cool, man. You go on my mind, 558 00:38:26,840 --> 00:38:30,600 Speaker 1: well what do you think? Then I think, all right, 559 00:38:31,239 --> 00:38:33,640 Speaker 1: this is gonna sound a little bit fringe. I'm sure 560 00:38:33,719 --> 00:38:36,320 Speaker 1: the person much smarter than me has figured out this theory. 561 00:38:36,440 --> 00:38:42,000 Speaker 1: This is just my two cents, entirely speculation. Okay, So 562 00:38:42,080 --> 00:38:45,759 Speaker 1: in the beginning, we had we being humanity, we had 563 00:38:45,800 --> 00:38:49,719 Speaker 1: the tribe, and the tribe was something that happened due 564 00:38:49,800 --> 00:38:55,320 Speaker 1: to survival. We found that it was in the beginning, especially, 565 00:38:55,560 --> 00:38:59,040 Speaker 1: it was necessary to have other people to help you 566 00:38:59,600 --> 00:39:03,759 Speaker 1: to vibe right. So we set this precedent from the 567 00:39:03,800 --> 00:39:09,239 Speaker 1: tribe arrived the religion, and the religion said, there is 568 00:39:09,320 --> 00:39:14,000 Speaker 1: a reason for us existing other than just to survive here, 569 00:39:14,840 --> 00:39:19,640 Speaker 1: and we are different to other people, and we or 570 00:39:19,800 --> 00:39:25,120 Speaker 1: they deserve something good or bad. So the tribe started 571 00:39:25,160 --> 00:39:30,680 Speaker 1: for survival, the religion gave a reason, and the state 572 00:39:31,640 --> 00:39:36,560 Speaker 1: advanced a method. And the method of the state is 573 00:39:37,040 --> 00:39:42,319 Speaker 1: that there are certain explicit rules that are pragmatic. We're 574 00:39:42,320 --> 00:39:47,560 Speaker 1: not telling you necessarily what's going to happen when you die, 575 00:39:47,640 --> 00:39:51,400 Speaker 1: or we're not telling you about the intangible spiritual things, 576 00:39:51,440 --> 00:39:55,120 Speaker 1: but we are telling you that if you steal an elephant, 577 00:39:55,200 --> 00:39:57,799 Speaker 1: you are going to jail, because that is not what 578 00:39:57,960 --> 00:40:02,239 Speaker 1: makes society work. So let let's put in these rules 579 00:40:02,320 --> 00:40:05,600 Speaker 1: that allows something like a supertribe to exist, you know. 580 00:40:06,600 --> 00:40:11,640 Speaker 1: So then we went from the state to the corporation. 581 00:40:12,800 --> 00:40:17,719 Speaker 1: And what the corporation says is uh still kind of 582 00:40:17,840 --> 00:40:21,480 Speaker 1: left open to question. But in my in my opinion, 583 00:40:22,760 --> 00:40:26,920 Speaker 1: what will ultimately become the biggest player in the great 584 00:40:26,960 --> 00:40:30,960 Speaker 1: game will be some sort of British East India things, 585 00:40:31,040 --> 00:40:34,480 Speaker 1: some sort of private corporation. I could easily see in 586 00:40:34,680 --> 00:40:38,359 Speaker 1: our lifetimes. There's the worst part. I could easily see 587 00:40:38,400 --> 00:40:42,880 Speaker 1: in our lifetimes. Some sort of state or area of 588 00:40:42,920 --> 00:40:51,839 Speaker 1: the world that is transparently and obviously controlled by a corporation. 589 00:40:51,960 --> 00:40:57,359 Speaker 1: And I don't mean some sort of sticky corruption charge. Yeah, 590 00:40:57,520 --> 00:41:02,160 Speaker 1: I mean yeah, I mean like, uh, you know, Luxembourg 591 00:41:02,280 --> 00:41:04,960 Speaker 1: presented by Google. I think it's just gonna be a 592 00:41:04,960 --> 00:41:09,960 Speaker 1: Google stand or Google I mean before you and either 593 00:41:10,120 --> 00:41:13,080 Speaker 1: and and here's the thing. Here's the thing. Depending on 594 00:41:13,440 --> 00:41:16,839 Speaker 1: what which corporation is or how it works out, it 595 00:41:16,960 --> 00:41:20,319 Speaker 1: might be better than the alternative. It might actually be 596 00:41:20,320 --> 00:41:24,080 Speaker 1: better to live in a Google stand. As terrible as 597 00:41:24,120 --> 00:41:28,560 Speaker 1: that sounds. Now, we have to remember that the human 598 00:41:28,640 --> 00:41:32,520 Speaker 1: race and and trying to work with itself, is this 599 00:41:32,640 --> 00:41:37,279 Speaker 1: continual evolution. So I think that soon, um. And when 600 00:41:37,320 --> 00:41:40,240 Speaker 1: I say soon, I mean the grand scheme of things. Uh, 601 00:41:40,440 --> 00:41:44,719 Speaker 1: the corporation, which would be the fourth step, will supersede 602 00:41:44,719 --> 00:41:47,839 Speaker 1: the state. Yeah, but what comes after the corporation, Man, 603 00:41:48,040 --> 00:41:50,280 Speaker 1: I don't know. I just want to go to space. 604 00:41:50,400 --> 00:41:52,640 Speaker 1: I'm gonna be asked with you, I just I want 605 00:41:52,640 --> 00:41:55,000 Speaker 1: to go to space. I'm not going to sell my 606 00:41:55,080 --> 00:41:58,719 Speaker 1: soul for ticket, and I don't really believe in too 607 00:41:58,840 --> 00:42:01,040 Speaker 1: much of that anyway, But just in case I'm not 608 00:42:01,040 --> 00:42:03,879 Speaker 1: going to sell it, you can metaphorically sell your soul. 609 00:42:03,960 --> 00:42:07,200 Speaker 1: You've metaphor? Do you remember that Simpsons episode where Bart 610 00:42:07,239 --> 00:42:10,640 Speaker 1: sold his soul and he couldn't fog the glass in 611 00:42:10,719 --> 00:42:14,200 Speaker 1: the automatic door? What open for him? Man? That got 612 00:42:14,200 --> 00:42:17,160 Speaker 1: to me functioned on soul. Isn't that interesting? Yeah? More 613 00:42:17,160 --> 00:42:19,000 Speaker 1: than a sermon? That got to me? I thought those 614 00:42:19,000 --> 00:42:22,640 Speaker 1: doors are convenient? What will I do the Simpson's teaching, 615 00:42:23,200 --> 00:42:25,719 Speaker 1: teaching people like you and I how the world works 616 00:42:25,719 --> 00:42:30,719 Speaker 1: and how morality works. And let's toss it to you listeners. 617 00:42:30,719 --> 00:42:33,520 Speaker 1: We hope that you enjoyed this episode and we want 618 00:42:33,600 --> 00:42:37,600 Speaker 1: to know what you think. Uh? What what do you 619 00:42:37,640 --> 00:42:40,440 Speaker 1: think will happen in these countries that we in the 620 00:42:40,480 --> 00:42:45,160 Speaker 1: West here so little about? Who, if anyone, do you 621 00:42:45,239 --> 00:42:51,759 Speaker 1: think will eventually control Eurasia? Uh? Will somebody win the 622 00:42:51,840 --> 00:42:56,160 Speaker 1: Great Game? Here's a good one. Is it possible to 623 00:42:56,239 --> 00:43:00,640 Speaker 1: win the Great Game? Or does it just continue? And 624 00:43:00,920 --> 00:43:04,920 Speaker 1: be sure to to go on Facebook and give us 625 00:43:05,360 --> 00:43:08,600 Speaker 1: a little message, UM, tell us what you think about 626 00:43:08,600 --> 00:43:10,840 Speaker 1: this stuff. You can find us where conspiracy Stuff. You 627 00:43:10,840 --> 00:43:13,960 Speaker 1: can find us on Twitter. We're at conspiracy stuff. Make 628 00:43:14,000 --> 00:43:17,759 Speaker 1: sure you check out our old episode called The Long Deception, 629 00:43:18,239 --> 00:43:20,560 Speaker 1: which talks about the Soviet Union and whether or not 630 00:43:20,640 --> 00:43:25,000 Speaker 1: it actually collapsed. Really interesting stuff. UM. If you don't 631 00:43:25,000 --> 00:43:26,640 Speaker 1: like social media and you don't want to watch our 632 00:43:26,719 --> 00:43:29,200 Speaker 1: videos and you just want to tell us something, you 633 00:43:29,239 --> 00:43:39,000 Speaker 1: can always email us. We are conspiracy at Discovery dot com. 634 00:43:39,000 --> 00:43:42,839 Speaker 1: From one on this topic another unexplained phenomenon, visit test 635 00:43:42,880 --> 00:43:46,680 Speaker 1: two dot com slash conspiracy stuff. You can also get 636 00:43:46,719 --> 00:43:50,000 Speaker 1: in touch on Twitter at the handle at conspiracy stuff.