WEBVTT - 09: Who Built Amazon’s Empire? 0:00:01.080 --> 0:00:05.640 I want to thank every Amazon employee and every Amazon 0:00:05.760 --> 0:00:10.719 customer because you guys paid progress. You guys paid probles. 0:00:12.640 --> 0:00:16.599 This is Megacorp, an investigative podcast exposing some of the 0:00:16.640 --> 0:00:23.120 world's most unethical corporations. This series is about Amazon. I'm 0:00:23.239 --> 0:00:30.400 Jake Hanrahan, journalists and documentary filmmaker. Megacorp is produced by 0:00:30.680 --> 0:00:40.720 H eleven for Cool Zone Media. So after eight episodes 0:00:40.800 --> 0:00:44.600 now diving into the many scandals at the heart of Amazon, 0:00:45.320 --> 0:00:47.560 I thought it was time to talk about the man 0:00:47.640 --> 0:00:52.320 who built the empire, Jeff Bezos. As we know, Bezos 0:00:52.479 --> 0:00:56.120 is the richest man on Earth. He founded Amazon in 0:00:57.920 --> 0:01:00.320 and now it's one of the biggest company k needs 0:01:00.360 --> 0:01:03.800 on the planet. Is also, as we've discovered, one of 0:01:03.840 --> 0:01:08.399 the most controversial. But how did Bezos get to this point? 0:01:08.800 --> 0:01:12.240 But if there's anyone that knows that, it's journalist Robert Evans. 0:01:12.720 --> 0:01:16.119 He runs the Behind the Bastards podcast, which looks into 0:01:16.120 --> 0:01:19.360 the lives of some of the worst bastards on Earth. 0:01:19.760 --> 0:01:24.880 So I spoke to Robert Evans about Jeff Bezos. Robert 0:01:24.880 --> 0:01:28.520 goes into a lot of detail in this so mostly 0:01:28.920 --> 0:01:33.880 I'm just gonna let the interview run first. Maybe if 0:01:33.920 --> 0:01:37.080 you can just kind of go into the early life 0:01:37.200 --> 0:01:41.280 of Jeff Bezos, because he didn't start out as Jeff Bezos. Yeah, 0:01:41.360 --> 0:01:46.000 he was born Jeffrey Preston Jourgensen um. And one of 0:01:46.000 --> 0:01:48.240 the things that is I think the first and most 0:01:48.280 --> 0:01:51.440 amazing thing about the Jeff Bezos story is that his 0:01:51.440 --> 0:01:54.560 his actual father abandoned the family. And this is not 0:01:55.360 --> 0:01:57.600 this is not like your normal story of a dude 0:01:57.680 --> 0:02:00.520 winding up without a dad, where like it there's there's 0:02:00.560 --> 0:02:04.080 something like really unsettling or or dark here. It's that 0:02:04.280 --> 0:02:08.120 his his actual father is bio dad um. Theodore Jourgensen 0:02:08.760 --> 0:02:12.359 was just like kind of a uh, kind of a 0:02:12.360 --> 0:02:16.520 ship head carney who really really really loved unicycling. He 0:02:16.560 --> 0:02:19.880 was a high wire unicyclist um, and having a kid 0:02:19.960 --> 0:02:22.640 got in the way of his unicycling dreams. Yes, you 0:02:22.680 --> 0:02:26.840 did hear that right, Jeff Bezos. His biological father abandoned 0:02:26.919 --> 0:02:29.720 him when he was young to fulfill a dream of 0:02:29.760 --> 0:02:34.399 his as a high wire unicyclist. Now, it's not funny 0:02:34.440 --> 0:02:38.239 when somebody abandons the family, but what a strange start 0:02:38.320 --> 0:02:41.919 that is. Anyway, Robot explains more, he could not get 0:02:41.960 --> 0:02:45.520 on board with being Jeffrey's father and eventually kind of 0:02:45.720 --> 0:02:48.280 bounced the funk out of his life and in fact 0:02:48.440 --> 0:02:52.480 did not know that his son was Jeff Bezos and 0:02:52.600 --> 0:02:56.280 who Jeff Bezos was really until a journalist tracked him 0:02:56.280 --> 0:02:59.399 down like decades later when Amazon was a huge deal 0:02:59.440 --> 0:03:01.799 and was like, you know, your kids like super rich 0:03:01.880 --> 0:03:04.600 in creating what's turning into this monster company. He was 0:03:04.800 --> 0:03:07.520 very surprised. Um, and I think is still kind of 0:03:07.520 --> 0:03:11.440 a deadbeat unicyclist dude. So Jeff by the time he 0:03:11.560 --> 0:03:15.360 was pretty young, Um, his mom had met a a 0:03:15.520 --> 0:03:22.000 new dude, UM whose name was Miguel Angel Bezos Perez, 0:03:22.200 --> 0:03:25.640 who was a Cuban who kind of his version of 0:03:25.639 --> 0:03:27.760 the story. And I don't know about much about his 0:03:27.960 --> 0:03:31.000 family back in Cuba or kind of like where they 0:03:31.040 --> 0:03:34.520 stood and whatnot. But he was apparently as a teenager 0:03:34.760 --> 0:03:38.000 like painting anti Castro graffiti, which got him in trouble 0:03:38.000 --> 0:03:41.160 and at age sixteen he had to flee the country. Um, 0:03:41.240 --> 0:03:43.640 and so he wound up in the United States. Uh. 0:03:43.680 --> 0:03:46.320 He did his undergrad work at the University of Albuquerque, 0:03:46.360 --> 0:03:49.320 So he wound up in because Bezos comes from the Southwest, right, 0:03:49.360 --> 0:03:51.200 That's where his his family's like a lot in New 0:03:51.240 --> 0:03:54.520 Mexico because his mom's side of the family were really 0:03:54.560 --> 0:03:57.840 heavily involved in um, the US nuclear programs and like 0:03:57.920 --> 0:04:00.640 nuclear missiles and and all that, all that and stuff. 0:04:01.240 --> 0:04:03.560 Um and Miguel wound up in the same region because 0:04:03.600 --> 0:04:07.200 the University of Albuquerque was offering free scholarships to Cuban refugees, 0:04:07.520 --> 0:04:12.080 and so he met Jeffrey's mom, Jacqueline Um, when he 0:04:12.120 --> 0:04:14.240 was working as a clerk at a bank that she 0:04:14.320 --> 0:04:16.440 worked at two and they fell in love and married 0:04:16.480 --> 0:04:19.240 and I think before jeff really, I don't think jeff 0:04:19.240 --> 0:04:21.880 really remembers much time before mcguel, because Miguel's just kind 0:04:21.880 --> 0:04:24.640 of always been his dad, And so his mom changed 0:04:24.760 --> 0:04:27.839 the changed his last name to Bezos and that's how 0:04:27.880 --> 0:04:31.200 he became Jeffrey bezos Is because this this this Cuban 0:04:31.240 --> 0:04:34.960 immigrant dude kind of uh stepped in to his life 0:04:34.960 --> 0:04:37.520 and took over as his dad. So he got pretty 0:04:37.600 --> 0:04:40.440 lucky there. Um, it's a little bit of a winding story. 0:04:40.480 --> 0:04:43.719 I think it's very funny that his dad abandoned him 0:04:43.760 --> 0:04:47.000 to be a unicyclist, but also I don't I think 0:04:47.040 --> 0:04:49.040 it's probably too much to say that had an effect 0:04:49.080 --> 0:04:51.240 on him, because I don't think he really it doesn't 0:04:51.279 --> 0:04:53.360 seem like he had any memory of that, you know, 0:04:53.520 --> 0:04:56.920 so it's unlikely that that like that laid some deep 0:04:56.960 --> 0:05:00.840 seated wound that is responsible for anything that Amazon has done. Right, 0:05:00.880 --> 0:05:03.640 And this this guy, Miguel kind of took him under 0:05:03.640 --> 0:05:06.120 his wing, right, Like, he seems to be quite instrumental 0:05:06.720 --> 0:05:09.680 in you know, the way Bezos jeff Bezos so the 0:05:09.720 --> 0:05:12.840 world growing up. Yeah, And I think that's why Jeffrey 0:05:12.920 --> 0:05:16.280 kind of grows up as a a very very committed 0:05:16.360 --> 0:05:20.240 capitalist um. Obviously, his dad is like an anti castro 0:05:20.520 --> 0:05:23.359 activist as a kid um and then as an you know, 0:05:23.440 --> 0:05:25.920 as an adult once he's graduated and out in the world. 0:05:25.960 --> 0:05:28.599 Miguel works as a petroleum engineer for Exxon, So he 0:05:28.760 --> 0:05:31.680 is like very much into kind of some of the 0:05:31.800 --> 0:05:38.400 morally grayer or morally blacker aspects of of of of capitalism. Um. Like, 0:05:38.520 --> 0:05:42.599 he's very on board with big business, and I think 0:05:43.120 --> 0:05:46.960 his attitudes towards kind of capitalism versus socialism certainly have 0:05:47.080 --> 0:05:50.760 an impact on young Jeffrey as he grows into an adult. 0:05:57.279 --> 0:06:00.040 When did we see these things kind of manifest He 0:06:00.080 --> 0:06:02.760 didn't go straight to Amazon. Right, he built this kind 0:06:02.760 --> 0:06:04.600 of built you know, he built a good life for 0:06:04.680 --> 0:06:07.479 himself already before that. Yeah. Yeah, so he's you know, 0:06:07.600 --> 0:06:10.200 he goes to his family has number one. His his 0:06:10.600 --> 0:06:13.880 maternal family is loaded, right, They've got he He spends 0:06:13.920 --> 0:06:16.240 his summers as a kid on a twenty five thousand 0:06:16.320 --> 0:06:19.120 acre ranch in Texas, which is, you know, land is 0:06:19.200 --> 0:06:21.760 cheaper in Texas, but you're not poor if your family's 0:06:21.760 --> 0:06:26.000 got twenty five thousand, twenty five. There are countries in 0:06:26.040 --> 0:06:31.520 Europe smaller than this far um. But it also means 0:06:31.520 --> 0:06:33.960 that Jeff like spends his childhood with his grandpa doing 0:06:33.960 --> 0:06:36.400 a lot like practical engineering, you know, learning how to 0:06:36.440 --> 0:06:38.839 like not just put up fences, but like build different 0:06:38.839 --> 0:06:41.839 feeding things for livestock, doing a lot of handyman work, 0:06:41.880 --> 0:06:45.039 repairing engines and stuff. So he grows up with this 0:06:45.160 --> 0:06:50.640 like really um, like this really caught like a lot 0:06:50.680 --> 0:06:54.160 of experience making things and and working hard and this 0:06:54.320 --> 0:06:57.400 kind of like he's very molded both by his his 0:06:57.640 --> 0:07:02.160 adopted father's um attitude towards free enterprise and by this 0:07:02.279 --> 0:07:07.440 kind of very idyllic rural American chunk of his upbringing 0:07:07.480 --> 0:07:09.479 where he's you know working on a farm and self 0:07:09.520 --> 0:07:11.760 reliance and all this stuff. And of course it's self 0:07:11.800 --> 0:07:14.680 reliance within the context of it's his grandpa's hobby farm. 0:07:14.800 --> 0:07:16.960 You know, his grandpa does not have to make a 0:07:17.000 --> 0:07:19.679 living with this farm. His grandfather was in the US 0:07:19.800 --> 0:07:23.680 nuclear program for decades UM and then retired, and this 0:07:23.760 --> 0:07:26.040 farm is kind of like his hobby as as a 0:07:26.080 --> 0:07:29.600 retired man. So there's there's you get two sides of 0:07:29.640 --> 0:07:32.320 it both, Like Jeff is kind of convinced, I've grown 0:07:32.400 --> 0:07:36.720 up with this kind of traditional American rural self supporting, 0:07:36.840 --> 0:07:39.680 like you tell take care of yourself, the government doesn't attitude. 0:07:39.680 --> 0:07:43.840 But also the reason why there it's so much more 0:07:43.880 --> 0:07:45.800 pleasant than a lot of people who grow up in 0:07:45.800 --> 0:07:48.520 a rural agricultural setting is that they're rich. You know, 0:07:48.920 --> 0:07:51.600 I grew up in a farming community, and it's it's 0:07:51.600 --> 0:07:54.520 not most people do not have access to the resources 0:07:54.560 --> 0:07:56.320 he had. But I'm not sure he's really aware of that. 0:07:56.400 --> 0:07:59.280 I think he kind of sees himself as having assault 0:07:59.280 --> 0:08:02.280 of the earth up bringing, even though that's really not 0:08:02.360 --> 0:08:05.800 the case. Um. And he he benefits as well because 0:08:05.840 --> 0:08:09.000 he's in he's farming in the summers and then during 0:08:09.040 --> 0:08:11.000 the rest of the year, he's in Houston. Um, that's 0:08:11.000 --> 0:08:13.760 where his family kind of winds up and he goes 0:08:13.840 --> 0:08:17.040 to this very special He's in a public school, but 0:08:17.200 --> 0:08:19.280 his school district has money for something. They call it 0:08:19.280 --> 0:08:22.440 the Vanguard Program, and it's like this basically this super 0:08:22.480 --> 0:08:25.440 special gifted and talented program where they're kind of experimenting 0:08:25.480 --> 0:08:30.680 with with different ways of of taking care of of 0:08:30.680 --> 0:08:33.280 of or or of teaching kids, and of course sort 0:08:33.280 --> 0:08:36.960 of like molding the curriculum of the program to the 0:08:37.000 --> 0:08:38.760 gifts of the children. And it it seems like a 0:08:38.760 --> 0:08:41.720 good idea. It works really well for Jeff. And it's 0:08:42.200 --> 0:08:45.480 it's you hear about stuff like this too with um 0:08:45.520 --> 0:08:49.160 with with Bill Gates in particular, and I think Steve 0:08:49.240 --> 0:08:51.240 Jobs kind of benefited from something similar when he was 0:08:51.240 --> 0:08:55.480 a kid. Ditto um Wozniak. Where these are at the 0:08:55.600 --> 0:08:59.880 very least upper middle class kids who benefit from a 0:09:00.200 --> 0:09:04.120 specific kind of educational program that is not available to 0:09:04.160 --> 0:09:07.560 most kids. So Jeff has very early access to computers. UM, 0:09:07.600 --> 0:09:10.120 he's able to do what he wants in school rather 0:09:10.160 --> 0:09:12.079 than kind of like do what the school wants him 0:09:12.080 --> 0:09:15.000 to learn. The school is kind of go looking at Okay, 0:09:15.040 --> 0:09:17.320 here's what Jeff's interested and here's the stuff that he's 0:09:17.400 --> 0:09:21.760 he thinks is fascinating. Let's mold his um, his educational 0:09:21.840 --> 0:09:25.000 program to it. UM. And he's a very competitive kid. 0:09:25.080 --> 0:09:28.559 There's a writer who's sort of evaluating the school program 0:09:28.559 --> 0:09:31.480 when he's like twelve or so. UM and you know, 0:09:31.600 --> 0:09:34.480 decades later, she still had her notes on him because 0:09:34.520 --> 0:09:40.559 he really struck her as UM, very intelligent, very competitive. 0:09:41.080 --> 0:09:43.600 He was working on a science project at the time 0:09:43.640 --> 0:09:46.400 called an infinity cube, which was this battery powered thing 0:09:46.440 --> 0:09:49.440 with rotating mirrors that made the optical illusion of an 0:09:49.520 --> 0:09:51.760 endless tunnel. And it was a thing he'd seen in 0:09:51.760 --> 0:09:54.040 a store but was expensive, so he like made a 0:09:54.120 --> 0:09:57.160 version of it for himself for cheaper. UM. He was 0:09:57.400 --> 0:09:59.800 entering a bunch of local science competitions and winning them. 0:09:59.800 --> 0:10:03.120 He's he's a very very like bright kid. Everyone kind 0:10:03.120 --> 0:10:05.640 of pegs this, this kid out as special and they 0:10:05.679 --> 0:10:08.079 just this whole community because again this is a public 0:10:08.080 --> 0:10:11.679 school program. This whole community in Houston pours resources into 0:10:11.760 --> 0:10:15.400 Jeff when he's a little kid. UM and he graduates, Uh, 0:10:15.520 --> 0:10:17.040 he and his you know, I think when he's in 0:10:17.160 --> 0:10:21.320 Florida by the time he graduates. Um, but he uh, 0:10:22.080 --> 0:10:25.040 he starts this kind of like after school program the 0:10:25.080 --> 0:10:27.400 summer after he graduates with another kid where they're like 0:10:27.840 --> 0:10:31.120 teaching younger kids science stuff, doing like star gazing and 0:10:31.120 --> 0:10:34.120 whatnot with them. Um. He has a really early interest 0:10:34.160 --> 0:10:37.439 in space travel. Uh. He's his favorite show is Star Trek. 0:10:37.480 --> 0:10:39.920 As a kid, he's got kind of some of these 0:10:40.000 --> 0:10:42.840 utopian dreams and it's weird because there's this mix of 0:10:42.880 --> 0:10:46.000 like these sort of utopian and Star Trek is coming 0:10:46.000 --> 0:10:49.880 at utopia from a very left wing sort of perspective. Um, 0:10:50.200 --> 0:10:53.440 and he's fascinated by that. But all of his heroes 0:10:53.520 --> 0:10:57.040 are these businessmen Walt Disney and Thomas Edison, these guys 0:10:57.080 --> 0:11:00.440 who are um, real like capitalist he os. And he 0:11:00.480 --> 0:11:04.640 actually he prefers Disney to Edison, um because he thinks 0:11:04.920 --> 0:11:07.600 Disney was better at building a team and working together, 0:11:07.760 --> 0:11:10.199 like making them work together in a concerted direction. And 0:11:10.400 --> 0:11:12.360 it makes sense that Disney is kind of the person 0:11:12.400 --> 0:11:16.200 he idolizes, right, because Amazon is definitely has that sort 0:11:16.240 --> 0:11:19.600 of thing that Disney has where they're pulling everything in 0:11:19.640 --> 0:11:22.080 the world to them and making this kind of capitalist 0:11:22.160 --> 0:11:26.440 katamari that that just owns everything in a space, right, Yeah, yeah, 0:11:26.480 --> 0:11:29.920 so he's come from he comes from a very privileged background. 0:11:29.960 --> 0:11:33.280 He acts like the way he talks, I agree with you. 0:11:33.320 --> 0:11:35.760 It's as if I don't even think he's kind of 0:11:35.760 --> 0:11:39.480 trying to present a fight narrative. He just thinks because 0:11:39.480 --> 0:11:42.520 he was on a farm that he's from some like, oh, 0:11:42.559 --> 0:11:44.920 I'm the salt of the earth, I'm from the dirt. Like, no, 0:11:45.000 --> 0:11:47.040 you're from the dirt on like a twenty five thousand 0:11:47.120 --> 0:11:49.480 acre farm. That's very different. You know, if he didn't 0:11:49.480 --> 0:11:51.880 want to, if his granddad decided he was sick of 0:11:51.920 --> 0:11:54.559 that farm, it's not like they would have starved, right, Yeah, 0:11:54.600 --> 0:11:56.320 they could have. They could have stopped all of the 0:11:56.360 --> 0:11:58.920 farming and kept living comfortably in the ranch house and 0:11:58.920 --> 0:12:01.360 would have would have been And I think it's easy 0:12:01.480 --> 0:12:02.920 when you're in the kind of position he was as 0:12:02.920 --> 0:12:05.480 a kid to note that, like, well, we worked hard. 0:12:05.559 --> 0:12:07.319 You know, I was up at dawn every day, we 0:12:07.360 --> 0:12:09.280 didn't stop working until night. We did a bunch of 0:12:09.320 --> 0:12:13.320 really physically and mentally difficult tasks. So that means like 0:12:14.000 --> 0:12:18.360 I had kind of this working class experience and upbringing, 0:12:18.400 --> 0:12:21.160 and the reality is that you're not. You don't really 0:12:21.240 --> 0:12:23.680 know any of that, you're not really having the authentic 0:12:23.720 --> 0:12:26.920 experience if there's not the fear of failure. I think 0:12:26.960 --> 0:12:29.960 it's it's easy because he's working hard as a kid 0:12:30.000 --> 0:12:34.600 for him to forget that. He also has a safety 0:12:34.640 --> 0:12:37.600 net that about like half a percent of kids in 0:12:37.640 --> 0:12:40.520 America maybe benefit from, you know. So so he goes 0:12:40.600 --> 0:12:42.680 on then too, he doesn't exactly end up working in 0:12:42.679 --> 0:12:44.760 the farming industry or anything like that, right, he kind 0:12:44.760 --> 0:12:48.560 of follows his dreams of these kind of like capitalist heroes. Yeah, 0:12:48.559 --> 0:12:50.480 he follows his dreams. He does start like a little 0:12:50.559 --> 0:12:53.280 kind of educational business that does seem like a decent 0:12:53.360 --> 0:12:56.400 thing to do. Um, and then he goes off to college. 0:12:56.640 --> 0:12:59.600 He goes to Princeton. He seemed most of the people 0:12:59.640 --> 0:13:01.800 he went to journalists have found other folks who were 0:13:01.840 --> 0:13:04.520 in his class. He made really no impression on on 0:13:04.600 --> 0:13:08.280 most people. He's very much like kind of a forgettable dude. 0:13:08.600 --> 0:13:11.000 And in fact, one of the classmates who like sets 0:13:11.080 --> 0:13:13.200 him up with a job after college, so you would 0:13:13.200 --> 0:13:16.560 think this guy knew him well. Like when the interviewed 0:13:16.640 --> 0:13:18.559 later after Jeff is rich and famous, it's like, yeah, 0:13:18.600 --> 0:13:20.720 I don't remember anything but that he was smart, like 0:13:20.760 --> 0:13:23.520 he does. He doesn't really Um, he doesn't really leave 0:13:23.600 --> 0:13:26.400 much of an impact like bright, but not a dude 0:13:26.400 --> 0:13:29.959 whose personality like you remember. Um and there's some weird 0:13:30.360 --> 0:13:33.920 he doesn't like music. Um and it doesn't appear to 0:13:33.960 --> 0:13:35.320 be a thing where like some people have like an 0:13:35.360 --> 0:13:39.079 auditory processing issue right where it's uncomfortable, like for whatever reason, 0:13:39.200 --> 0:13:42.079 music just like it doesn't feel good in their ears. 0:13:42.120 --> 0:13:44.120 I don't think it's that because they'll play music for 0:13:44.160 --> 0:13:46.480 other people and stuff. So with that in mind, let's 0:13:46.559 --> 0:13:48.959 take a look at a tweet Jeff Bezos put out 0:13:49.120 --> 0:13:53.560 on February three, twenty next to a picture of the 0:13:53.640 --> 0:13:58.280 singer Lizzo, Bezos wrote quote, I just took a DNA tist. 0:13:58.679 --> 0:14:03.959 Turns out I'm one hun present Lizzo's biggest fan. End quote. Now, 0:14:03.960 --> 0:14:07.400 obviously that's very cringe to say. But also this is 0:14:07.440 --> 0:14:11.560 from a guy that apparently doesn't like music. He's either lying, 0:14:11.840 --> 0:14:15.840 disingenuous or he does actually like music. Who knows which 0:14:15.880 --> 0:14:17.560 one it is? Just doesn't get it, you know, he 0:14:17.640 --> 0:14:20.720 just doesn't understand why people like music, which is which 0:14:20.760 --> 0:14:22.880 is interesting that some folks will claim that this is 0:14:22.960 --> 0:14:26.480 why Apple beats Amazon to the digital music game, right, 0:14:26.520 --> 0:14:29.600 and and then Spotify later. Like Amazon is for all 0:14:29.600 --> 0:14:31.680 the things, they're ahead of the curvan, kind of always 0:14:31.720 --> 0:14:35.360 behind on digital music, um, which there's a weird you know, 0:14:35.400 --> 0:14:38.000 the stuff with Joe Rogan and Neil Young and the 0:14:38.040 --> 0:14:41.280 fight over Spotify. There's kind of a weird parallel there 0:14:41.280 --> 0:14:45.560 because Neil Young when he deletes his catalog from Spotify, 0:14:45.680 --> 0:14:47.680 I'm sure he has an issue with Joe Rogan, but 0:14:47.720 --> 0:14:49.480 a big part of what Young is doing is he's 0:14:49.600 --> 0:14:51.880 he's got a deal with Amazon Music, right, and so 0:14:51.920 --> 0:14:56.280 he's plugging Amazon Music too, you know. Convenient. They're all millionaires, right, 0:14:56.400 --> 0:14:58.640 Like you shouldn't expect any of them to be your hero. 0:14:59.160 --> 0:15:01.720 But yeah, so people will say that like that is 0:15:01.760 --> 0:15:05.200 kind of why Amazon is consistently behind the curve when 0:15:05.240 --> 0:15:07.880 it comes to digital music, which is which is noteworthy 0:15:07.960 --> 0:15:10.400 just because there one thing you have to give Amazon 0:15:10.440 --> 0:15:13.000 credit on there, the head of the curve on most things, 0:15:13.080 --> 0:15:16.720 you know, um, but Bezos just doesn't get that, and 0:15:16.760 --> 0:15:21.240 so they're kind of consistently behind. Um And yeah, he uh. 0:15:21.320 --> 0:15:24.800 He eventually winds up working in a company called Fittel, 0:15:24.840 --> 0:15:28.480 which is like a finance a tech finance company. This 0:15:28.560 --> 0:15:30.720 is in the mid eighties. I think eight four eight 0:15:30.920 --> 0:15:34.000 five is when he gets his first big boy job. Um. 0:15:34.080 --> 0:15:37.960 And so that's this period where computers are starting to 0:15:38.120 --> 0:15:41.640 become standard in investment banks and brokerages, but they're still 0:15:41.680 --> 0:15:44.520 not the norm. Right there there that that process begins, 0:15:45.040 --> 0:15:48.440 the more forward thinking investment banks and brokerages are putting 0:15:48.440 --> 0:15:50.760 computers in, right, but a lot of this is still 0:15:50.800 --> 0:15:53.200 done by analog you know, today all trading is kind 0:15:53.240 --> 0:15:55.640 of done by these machines, and there's some human input, 0:15:55.760 --> 0:15:58.160 but like a lot of it is these computers kind 0:15:58.160 --> 0:16:01.520 of gambling with each other. This is the V's He's 0:16:01.560 --> 0:16:03.840 in on the ground floor of that process, and he 0:16:03.960 --> 0:16:07.080 is working with a company that basically gets hired by 0:16:07.160 --> 0:16:10.360 these big banks and brokerages to help them set up 0:16:10.560 --> 0:16:14.120 these networked computer banks that are initially just kind of 0:16:14.160 --> 0:16:17.240 augmenting human decision making, but will eventually take it over 0:16:17.520 --> 0:16:20.000 to a very large extent in finance. You know, that's 0:16:20.000 --> 0:16:23.240 how things work now. And he is he's he's UM. 0:16:23.280 --> 0:16:25.480 I don't think he's necessarily a huge part because he's 0:16:25.520 --> 0:16:28.360 not a visionary part of this, right He's working for 0:16:28.440 --> 0:16:30.400 the visionaries who see where the future is going to 0:16:30.520 --> 0:16:32.720 be here, but he is also as a code or 0:16:32.760 --> 0:16:35.720 helping to build this, so he's definitely like it's a 0:16:35.720 --> 0:16:39.520 good internship for him in terms of he's experiencing work 0:16:39.560 --> 0:16:41.920 with these people who have seen the future and and 0:16:42.000 --> 0:16:44.360 helping to kind of make it with people. And he 0:16:44.360 --> 0:16:47.400 he bounces around a few of these early fintech companies 0:16:47.840 --> 0:16:51.640 until in nineteen eighty nine, Um, he starts having a 0:16:51.680 --> 0:16:55.120 conversation with a colleague about like, Hey, you know, we're 0:16:55.240 --> 0:16:58.320 we're setting up these computer networks, um that are that 0:16:58.360 --> 0:17:01.800 are connecting like brokerage and allowing them to basically gamble 0:17:01.880 --> 0:17:04.600 a lot faster. Uh, what if we were to set 0:17:04.680 --> 0:17:08.639 up like a a networked computer intranet thing that anyone 0:17:08.680 --> 0:17:10.960 could use to like connect to news stories which will 0:17:11.000 --> 0:17:15.800 be curated algorithmically based on a person's interest. Um, and 0:17:15.800 --> 0:17:18.120 they almost get investments in the idea you know you'll 0:17:18.280 --> 0:17:21.639 do this is basically like how Facebook and Twitter work, right, Um, 0:17:21.680 --> 0:17:24.320 it's a version of that. It doesn't quite happen, but 0:17:24.359 --> 0:17:26.680 the fact that Bezos is sort of thinking about this 0:17:27.080 --> 0:17:31.399 in nineteen nine shows that he does have a really 0:17:31.880 --> 0:17:35.679 pretty deep understanding of where networked computing is going to 0:17:35.720 --> 0:17:39.160 go right, Like he's not just following the trend. He's predicted, Oh, 0:17:39.200 --> 0:17:41.000 this is gonna be a big deal. Um, And he's 0:17:41.080 --> 0:17:43.600 very much ahead of the eight ball on that um. 0:17:43.640 --> 0:17:47.199 I think in the late eight like early nineties, he 0:17:47.240 --> 0:17:50.920 gets a job with an investment with an investment firm 0:17:51.000 --> 0:17:54.320 that manages a hedge fund called d E. Shaw Um, 0:17:54.400 --> 0:17:57.560 which is this as firms go, it's one of these 0:17:57.560 --> 0:17:59.480 ones that's really ahead of the curve. They're doing a 0:17:59.480 --> 0:18:01.720 lot of comput uter stuff. The guy who runs it 0:18:01.800 --> 0:18:04.520 is hiring a lot of programmers, and Bezos is a 0:18:04.600 --> 0:18:09.440 fucking superstar there, you know, um, his colleagues and he's 0:18:09.480 --> 0:18:13.280 both a superstar, but he also he's clearly already thinking 0:18:13.320 --> 0:18:15.960 about his legend. Right. People who work with him will 0:18:16.000 --> 0:18:18.199 note that he would like keep a sleeping bag in 0:18:18.280 --> 0:18:21.280 his office so that he could work overnight if he 0:18:21.320 --> 0:18:23.879 needed to. But the main purpose of the sleeping bag 0:18:24.040 --> 0:18:26.200 was not for him to actually sleep at work, because 0:18:26.240 --> 0:18:28.119 he didn't do that often. He just kept it in 0:18:28.240 --> 0:18:32.160 view so his employees would see it and like would think, oh, Jeff, 0:18:32.359 --> 0:18:34.040 you know, we need I need to work like that, 0:18:34.080 --> 0:18:37.440 because Jeff is like crashing at work sometimes he's using 0:18:37.440 --> 0:18:39.199 it as a prop right, just when through it for 0:18:39.200 --> 0:18:41.879 a second. I think this point that Robot is explaining 0:18:42.040 --> 0:18:45.120 is very interesting if you look at how Amazon went 0:18:45.280 --> 0:18:48.720 on after Bezos started it. He's always saying, hope, people 0:18:48.760 --> 0:18:51.320 need to just work harder. But as we see here, 0:18:51.359 --> 0:18:53.919 he allegedly used props to give the impression that he 0:18:54.000 --> 0:18:56.480 was the hardest worker buck in the day. Now the 0:18:56.520 --> 0:18:59.600 hardest workers are on the warehouse floor and he's telling 0:18:59.640 --> 0:19:01.879 them I need to work as hard as him. Perhaps 0:19:01.880 --> 0:19:04.800 he's still using props now. He's very much bought into 0:19:04.880 --> 0:19:07.359 the kind of myths we say about like how you 0:19:07.400 --> 0:19:09.240 ought to work and kind of you know, this is 0:19:09.240 --> 0:19:12.199 how you get ahead is by being uh, you know, 0:19:12.240 --> 0:19:15.280 the busiest, and by you know, sleeping at your desk 0:19:15.359 --> 0:19:17.760 and and and basically living at the office. This kind 0:19:17.800 --> 0:19:20.159 of stuff that that is huge in the tech industry, right. 0:19:20.160 --> 0:19:24.000 This is why Google has sleeping rooms and massages on site, 0:19:24.040 --> 0:19:26.320 and like they try to keep people at the office 0:19:26.320 --> 0:19:29.760 as often as possible. Um, you know this is this 0:19:29.840 --> 0:19:33.879 is just kind of uh, he's he wants to I 0:19:34.240 --> 0:19:38.720 think he he understands that mythologizing as an important part 0:19:38.720 --> 0:19:41.040 of being a founder and I think even though he's 0:19:41.080 --> 0:19:43.120 not a founder at this point, he wants to found 0:19:43.440 --> 0:19:46.280 a a big tech company. You know that that is 0:19:46.320 --> 0:19:49.560 beginning to be his ambition. Um, but he's working at 0:19:49.600 --> 0:19:52.560 D E. Shaw, He's doing great. He meets a woman 0:19:52.640 --> 0:19:55.600 named mckenzy Tuttle while working at the Hedge Fund. She 0:19:55.720 --> 0:19:59.280 graduated from Princeton to She actually studied with Tony Morrison 0:19:59.600 --> 0:20:01.639 when she at an English degree, which is a is 0:20:01.680 --> 0:20:04.080 weird that there's a connection between Tony Morrison and Jeff 0:20:04.119 --> 0:20:07.600 Bezos that close, But there you go. Um, she's a 0:20:07.640 --> 0:20:10.040 novelist and she's kind of working as a secretary in 0:20:10.080 --> 0:20:13.480 this tech company and she winds up with a big 0:20:13.480 --> 0:20:15.320 crush on Jeff. And it is one of those things 0:20:15.520 --> 0:20:17.880 like we talked about Bill Gates. Bill Gates has gotten 0:20:17.880 --> 0:20:20.439 in some trouble recently because he had a history of 0:20:20.480 --> 0:20:25.400 creepily hitting on women who were his employees at Microsoft Conn. Yeah, 0:20:25.400 --> 0:20:27.040 and some kind of connections to Epstein. We could go 0:20:27.040 --> 0:20:30.080 out for a while about about that. Um, it does 0:20:30.080 --> 0:20:32.560 not appear to be that kind of case with Bezos. McKenzie, 0:20:32.560 --> 0:20:34.680 even though she's divorced him now, is adamant that like 0:20:34.760 --> 0:20:37.440 she was the one who started hitting on him. Um. 0:20:37.520 --> 0:20:39.760 She was the one who kind of pushed him to 0:20:39.840 --> 0:20:41.719 go out with her and fell in love with him. 0:20:41.720 --> 0:20:44.240 And it does seem they stayed together a long time 0:20:44.320 --> 0:20:46.960 you know. Um, you know they've split up now, but 0:20:46.960 --> 0:20:50.600 they were together like twenty years or so. Um. And 0:20:50.640 --> 0:20:52.640 she was a big part of the creation of Amazon. 0:20:52.800 --> 0:20:56.240 So whatever else, it does seem like, uh, he is 0:20:56.280 --> 0:20:58.920 a human being who was capable of connecting with another person, 0:20:59.000 --> 0:21:03.520 which I guess there you go. Um. Yeah, So they 0:21:04.600 --> 0:21:07.600 she gets together with mckensey while he's working at D. E. 0:21:07.720 --> 0:21:10.840 Shaw and he starts to this is the you know, 0:21:10.880 --> 0:21:13.119 he's making really good money at this he's not like 0:21:13.160 --> 0:21:16.800 a millionaire, but he's extremely comfortable. But he starts to 0:21:16.880 --> 0:21:19.399 kind of chafe. Not because he likes his boss. He 0:21:19.480 --> 0:21:21.919 likes what they're doing, but it's not his business. And 0:21:21.960 --> 0:21:25.320