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Speaker 1: Live from our nation's capital. This is Bloomberg Sound On.

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Speaker 1: No president should be able to sustain booth on the

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Speaker 1: ground without congressional approval and without a clear explanation of

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Speaker 1: what the mission is and what the endgame is. This

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Speaker 1: isn't really about the economic policy. This is about the coronavirus.

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg Sound On, Politics, Policy and Prospective from DC's top name.

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Speaker 1: We must use every school possible to defeat the decault

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Speaker 1: on women's reproductive rights. This is a steady growth that

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Speaker 1: we're seeing here in our economy, you know, over the

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Speaker 1: last three months. Bloomberg Sound On with Joe Matthew on

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg Radio. The President left the bubble to make the

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Speaker 1: case for his economic agenda. Bringing the road show today

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Speaker 1: to Michigan, and we're about to talk about the president's

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Speaker 1: message with somebody who knows that area and it's people well,

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Speaker 1: Congresswoman Hailey Stevens, Democrat from Michigan. With more on infrastructure,

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Speaker 1: reconciliation and the that ceiling all still in the works. Later,

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Speaker 1: the Facebook whistleblower testifies on Capitol Hill. We'll talk with

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg Tech Policy reporter Ana Edgerton about the accusations and

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Speaker 1: the possible implications in legislation, and we'll dig through it

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Speaker 1: all with the panel Bloomberg Politics contributors Genie Tanzano when

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Speaker 1: Rick Davis are with us for the hour. Welcome to

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Speaker 1: the Tuesday edition of Sound on a day closer to

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Speaker 1: a possible default. So let's start with what we know

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Speaker 1: on the debt ceiling. The standoff between Democrats and Republicans

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Speaker 1: continues as Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer sets up a

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Speaker 1: vote this week on the House bill that would suspend

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Speaker 1: the debt ceiling through December twenty two. It's likely tomorrow

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Speaker 1: and likely to fail. When Republicans filibuster, White House Deputy

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Speaker 1: Press Secretary Karine John Pierre brief reporters today on Air

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Speaker 1: Force one, is the President flew to Michigan. Here she is.

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Speaker 1: When Democrats opted to go at it alone to get

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Speaker 1: it to get this done, McConnell blocked at as well.

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Speaker 1: So as the President made clear very clear yesterday, we're

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Speaker 1: no longer asking Republicans to do the right thing. We're

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Speaker 1: just asking them to get out of the well. The

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Speaker 1: aforementioned Minority Leader, Mitch McConnell again says no to acting

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Speaker 1: on the debt ceiling, and we'll talking about the Biden

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Speaker 1: agenda on the Senate floor. McConnell quotes a Democrat Senator

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Speaker 1: Joe Mansion, when it comes to the spending plan. Here's McConnell.

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Speaker 1: Even some of our colleagues on the Democratic side are

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Speaker 1: calling this creatian. That's what it is. As one of

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Speaker 1: our colleagues that originally we have to quote stabilize what

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Speaker 1: we have before we start going down this expensive road,

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Speaker 1: or else it would be quote fiscal insanity. That Democrat

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Speaker 1: Senator Joe Manson, who himself says he's still negotiating, still

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Speaker 1: not ready to spend trillions on human infrastructure here he

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Speaker 1: is basically, I'm more concerned about our our nation and

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Speaker 1: our country turning into more of an entitlement society versus

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Speaker 1: a rewarding society. So there's a balance to be have here.

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Speaker 1: And that's why President Biden left the Beltway today to

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Speaker 1: talk with regular Americans, in this case members of the

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Speaker 1: International Union of Operating Engineers Local three to four, who

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Speaker 1: have been pushing for the bipart as an infrastructure bill.

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Speaker 1: Here's the President a short time ago. These bills are

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Speaker 1: not about left versus right, are modern versus progressive or

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Speaker 1: anything that pits Americans against one another. These bills are

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Speaker 1: about competitiveness versus complacency. They're about opportunity versus decay. Speaking

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Speaker 1: at a training facility for the local three to four,

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Speaker 1: and we're joined by somebody who knows that area very well,

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Speaker 1: and it's people. Congresswoman Hayley Stevens. Welcome back to Bloomberg Radio.

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Speaker 1: It's great to have you with us. I'd like to

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Speaker 1: ask you about the President's addressed today and then we'll

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Speaker 1: get to some other issues here. But he was talking

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Speaker 1: to this international Union of Operating Engineers that was pushing

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Speaker 1: hard in the last couple of weeks for passage of

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Speaker 1: the bipartisan infrastructure bill. It of course did not happen,

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Speaker 1: and they have suggested that jobs are already at risk

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Speaker 1: because of the delay in making this law. Is that true. Well,

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Speaker 1: it's the classic thing where the American people, American businesses,

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Speaker 1: and most importantly American workers need certainty, and that is

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Speaker 1: what you get when you get the bills signed in

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Speaker 1: the law past. You've got people all peed up around

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Speaker 1: a big infrastructure package. This country has been waiting for

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Speaker 1: this for a long time. Frankly, it's absurd. This hasn't

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Speaker 1: been done, you know, three years ago, four years ago.

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Speaker 1: I don't know why it's taken us so long. We

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Speaker 1: obviously had a Recovery Act under President Obama that started

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Speaker 1: to make a dent on broader infrastructure in the United

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Speaker 1: States of America. But but this is about certainty. And

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Speaker 1: we're really proud of our operating engineers. These are just

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Speaker 1: fantastic men and women who operate this the heavy machinery.

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Speaker 1: They're going to be so tied in to this broader

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Speaker 1: infrastructure agenda. And I'm really proud of our president. Um,

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Speaker 1: it's not an easy time right now. He easily could

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Speaker 1: have stayed in Washington and and Steady said, no, I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna come to Michigan. I'm gonna come to a place,

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Speaker 1: you know, in the you know, Livingston County, flying into

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Speaker 1: the middle of the state and and talks directly to

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Speaker 1: the American people. And that that's what he did today,

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Speaker 1: his fourth trip to your state as president. And as

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Speaker 1: you just heard, he says, these bills are not about

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Speaker 1: left versus right, or moderate versus progressive. But aren't they

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Speaker 1: about moderate versus progressive? Wouldn't we have a law otherwise?

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Speaker 1: Right now? Well, well, look, I think that we are

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Speaker 1: in um part of this deal making process where you know,

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Speaker 1: we're really close to being at the finish line. I

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Speaker 1: I haven't been biting my nails off on this. I

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Speaker 1: want to get it done. I was in Washington last week,

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Speaker 1: was ready to vote. I'm on seventy or two hour

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Speaker 1: notice to do that. And and look, I'm not going

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Speaker 1: to sidestep your question because you did ask, okay, is

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Speaker 1: this intertwined and and part of the deal. You know,

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Speaker 1: all these things get done in the you know, top

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Speaker 1: corners with the you know, Senate House and the White Houses.

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Speaker 1: They said, hey, we'll do a bipartisan infrastructure bill, and

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Speaker 1: then we're going to do our broader budget bill, and

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Speaker 1: and and we're you know, the way I see it,

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Speaker 1: we're doing the you know, final components of this. You know,

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Speaker 1: there was I think a bigger package. Obviously it was

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Speaker 1: it was too big to get done. But I want

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Speaker 1: to get the daycare piece done. And that's what's in

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Speaker 1: this Build Back Better agenda for for President Biden. And

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Speaker 1: and I'll tell you this, we want to get people

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Speaker 1: back to work. We've got to be paiding the pathway

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Speaker 1: for people to successfully get back to work and daycare

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Speaker 1: is component number one. So when the President says, I'm

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Speaker 1: going to ensure that this child's tax credit is extended

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Speaker 1: and made permanent, that gives families extra money to pay

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Speaker 1: for things like daycare and to pay for things like

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Speaker 1: the food and the diapers and the on. So this

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Speaker 1: is about, you know, success for hard working Americans and

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Speaker 1: the small businesses who I talked to every single day.

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Speaker 1: I do manufacturing Monday. I just had one yesterday, the

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Speaker 1: fantastic battery manufacturing company that folks are hiring, but they

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Speaker 1: can't get people back to work because of these surrounding impediments.

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Speaker 1: And so this is partly what else we have to do,

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Speaker 1: and we're you know, we're there to do it. If

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Speaker 1: the International Union of Operating Engineers, though, says last last

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Speaker 1: week they said, pass the bipartisan infrastructure bill. Don't just

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Speaker 1: extend transportations spending as as we saw a surface spending

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Speaker 1: as we saw at the end of last week, because

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Speaker 1: you're putting jobs at risk. How can you tell them

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Speaker 1: to wait on infrastructure, Uh, when we don't know how

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Speaker 1: long it's gonna take for this massive reconciliation plan. That's true,

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Speaker 1: and and and they're spot on about that we've got

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Speaker 1: to get this done, and I make sure everyone knows

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Speaker 1: I'm ready to do it. You know, I don't think

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Speaker 1: we should be waiting. I I feel very confident that

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Speaker 1: we've gotten this great bill from the Senate. You know,

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Speaker 1: I've got pieces in this bill that I want to

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Speaker 1: see get done at this product that we just can't

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Speaker 1: extend generally. So I told my constituents, I said, I'm

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Speaker 1: on seventy two hours notice to return, So you're ready

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Speaker 1: to roll on this thing. You're ready to roll on

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Speaker 1: the biff right now if it came to a vote,

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Speaker 1: even without being tied together, it sounds like, yeah, that's no,

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Speaker 1: that's right. There's you know, if you're getting into the

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Speaker 1: procedure here, you know the rule has been done and uh,

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Speaker 1: that's you know, it's I can't think of a time

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Speaker 1: recently where we've had that. Um. So we we're very

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Speaker 1: close to being ready to go here. I appreciate your

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Speaker 1: answering that, Congresswoman. And last time we spoke, we we

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Speaker 1: really dug into the chip shortage and the issue of

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Speaker 1: supply chains in your state of Michigan. We're seeing profit forecasts,

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Speaker 1: financial forecast from the big automakers be lowered by analysts

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Speaker 1: because of the lack of access to materials that we

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Speaker 1: need to build all cars, never mind just E V s.

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Speaker 1: If if this infrastructure build passed, would there be a

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Speaker 1: component that helped to free up this chip shortage or

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Speaker 1: is this going to work itself out before we can

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Speaker 1: handle it in by way of Washington. So look, there's

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Speaker 1: legislation with the Chips Act, which um needs to be funded. Uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, a provision in in uh you know our

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Speaker 1: National Defense authorization that has always gone towards chips. But

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Speaker 1: what we need is the funding for public private partnership

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Speaker 1: and too. Again and this is always about certainty for

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Speaker 1: me because a lot of people, you know, they don't

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Speaker 1: need us in their hair. You know, if it's the

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Speaker 1: money's the authorized moneies that helps and the laws that

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Speaker 1: just create a framework for folks. This with tips is

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Speaker 1: both you know, we need a framework the you know,

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Speaker 1: the multi quarter outlook here is that we are going

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Speaker 1: to be in this chips crisis. We're talking you know,

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Speaker 1: you look at the dollars and cents, you know, across

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Speaker 1: a more institude of industries, I've seen some projections get

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Speaker 1: us up to trillions with automotives, which I'm living and

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Speaker 1: breathing here in Michigan. We're we're at billions now. When

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Speaker 1: you start to think, okay, well, who's losing billions? It's

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Speaker 1: my hardworking Michigan families, some who are working directly with

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Speaker 1: an OI, But my goodness, those who are with the suppliers,

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Speaker 1: and they're they're bowled over right now. I mean, it's

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Speaker 1: it's it's an unbelievable time. I've got people turning down work,

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Speaker 1: turning down purchase orders because this chip crisis. So yeah,

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Speaker 1: the demand is there. The demand is there. If that

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Speaker 1: bill passed the in the it's the NDAA, you're talking

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Speaker 1: about a component of that bill that would help to

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Speaker 1: loosen up the chips shortage. You just wonder, though, Congresswoman,

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Speaker 1: we got into this before. It takes so long to

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Speaker 1: build a foundry. It takes so long for for these

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Speaker 1: policies to potentially take effect that you wonder if the

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Speaker 1: market corrects itself before Washington never gets to it. Well,

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Speaker 1: the market is not going to occur itself unless Washington

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Speaker 1: gives it certainty to invest here in the United States.

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Speaker 1: And I've heard directly from some of these KIP manufacturers.

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Speaker 1: You know. Look, I'm up the street Lavonia, Michigan from Infinian. Okay,

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Speaker 1: they have a nice little R and D facility. Literally

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Speaker 1: I can walk there from my office here and again,

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Speaker 1: and and they're telling me and Intel's telling me, hey,

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Speaker 1: we need certainty. We you know, it's a global market here.

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Speaker 1: We've been way too over relied on foreign markets. People

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Speaker 1: want to create these US jobs. By the way, we've

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Speaker 1: got universities with a lot of this intellectual property. Your

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Speaker 1: spot on about the complexity you know an automotive, it's

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Speaker 1: it's a different type of fab theres as well. But

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Speaker 1: I want to get that chips back done. We're going

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Speaker 1: to get it funded. We've got to do it by

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Speaker 1: the end of the year. Well, we'd like to hear

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Speaker 1: more about that when the time comes. Congresswoman Hailey Stevens,

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Speaker 1: Democrat from Michigan, many thanks for being with us and

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Speaker 1: answering our questions here today on Bloomberg Sound On. You

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Speaker 1: don't get that, you know, from everybody you're listening to Bloomberg.

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Speaker 1: You sound on with Joe Matthew on Bluebird Radio. So

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Speaker 1: the President traveled to how Michigan to deliver his message

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Speaker 1: today it's on his way back that town, right between

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Speaker 1: Lansing and Detroit, the President making the case to union workers.

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Speaker 1: He visited a training facility as we were just discussing

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Speaker 1: with the congresswoman with workers to tell them that his

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Speaker 1: spending plans are not just good for them, but good

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Speaker 1: for America. I want to talk about what's fundamentally at

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Speaker 1: stake for our country now at this moment. I know

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Speaker 1: it's an overused phrase, but I've been using it a lot.

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Speaker 1: We're at an inflection point. Every anywhere from eight years

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Speaker 1: in America, there's an inflection point. We have to choose

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Speaker 1: what direction we're gonna go. What we're gonna do, not

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Speaker 1: not Democrat Republican, but what are we going to who

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Speaker 1: we're going to be, Which brings me to the headline

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Speaker 1: on the terminal. Biden calls foes of Economic plan complicit

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Speaker 1: in US decline at Justin Sink and Jenny Leonard from

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Speaker 1: our White House team, right, President Biden to cleared politicians

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Speaker 1: who opposes economic agenda are undermining the country itself. Let's

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Speaker 1: see how this plays with the panel here Bloomberg Politics

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Speaker 1: contributors Genie Schanzano and Rick Davis or with us that

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Speaker 1: the right message from our democratic president here, Genie, that

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Speaker 1: that they're complicit in undermining the country or is that

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Speaker 1: a step through four? I do think it is an

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Speaker 1: effective line for him to use. Um. You know, obviously

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Speaker 1: you wouldn't want to say that you are complicit if

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Speaker 1: you are only willing to go to two trillion versus

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Speaker 1: three point five. But I do think that the argument

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Speaker 1: overall is important, and I think he delivered his message

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Speaker 1: well today. Just look at the comparisons he he talked

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Speaker 1: about between spending in things like infrastructure in the United

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Speaker 1: States versus other countries on things like early childhood education.

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Speaker 1: We are in decline when you look at those comparisons,

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Speaker 1: and it's in large part because Washington hasn't got its

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Speaker 1: act together and invested in infrast structure. So I do

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Speaker 1: think that's the message to send. And by the way,

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Speaker 1: it's a message that Republicans and Democrats all support. Donald

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Speaker 1: Trump had a bill for infrastructure, so you know, this

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Speaker 1: is something that can be widely supported, and I think

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Speaker 1: this is what the President needs to be talking about,

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Speaker 1: not the top line spending numbers. So I thought today

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Speaker 1: was a good sort of you know, refocusing of attention

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Speaker 1: on his agenda items versus the overall cost. You make

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Speaker 1: a good point. I do hear references every now and then,

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Speaker 1: but people largely forget the size and scale of former

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Speaker 1: President Trump's proposed UH infrastructure plan. Rick Davis, Our Republicans

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Speaker 1: complicit in the decline of the United States of America.

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Speaker 1: You know, I thought today was like completely blind to

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Speaker 1: what the current political situation is in Washington. Here. He

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Speaker 1: needs to make friends, not lose them. Bind the House

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Speaker 1: United I mean one of this morning, he's talking about

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Speaker 1: uniting the Democratic Caucus and you work really hard all

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Speaker 1: morning to do it. And then he goes out on

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Speaker 1: a road and gives Republicans five more reasons to not

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Speaker 1: want to support any of measures, including um the current

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Speaker 1: debt limit and so like. If he's trying to get

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Speaker 1: Republicans to do business with his administration, this is not

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Speaker 1: the way to do it, to go out and attack

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Speaker 1: him as being complicit in the decline of America. Prior

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Speaker 1: to COVID, the economy was roaring and and and there's

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Speaker 1: no question that he stepped up the COVID response and

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Speaker 1: that that that we're coming back. But unemployment is not

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Speaker 1: caused right now because of a decline in America. It's

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Speaker 1: because we can't. We have a lot of jobs that

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Speaker 1: need to be filled and we can't find people to

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Speaker 1: fill them. Well, so who was the audience. Was he

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Speaker 1: actually trying to shame Republicans into agreeing with him, Rick,

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Speaker 1: or was he talking to to moderate and progressive Democrats

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Speaker 1: that say, see, we don't have them on our side.

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Speaker 1: We need to get together the sea of the country. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: except like the last interview you just did with Congresswoman

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Speaker 1: Haley Stevens, who says, hey, let's vote on this infrastructure package.

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Speaker 1: I got a lot of good stuff in there, and

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Speaker 1: that's a bipartisan package that came out of the Senate

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Speaker 1: with Republican support. I mean, tomorrow he could have that

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Speaker 1: signing ceremony and the decline of America will start to

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Speaker 1: ebb and we can all be happy again and maybe

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Speaker 1: actually solve the debt crisis. So, I mean, you know,

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Speaker 1: I really don't see how this is anything other than

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Speaker 1: sort of a sot to the base. Uh, you know,

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Speaker 1: try and make the progressive feel like he's doing war,

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Speaker 1: but it doesn't pick up a single vote he doesn't

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Speaker 1: already have. And I guess that's my question. How's he

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Speaker 1: going to go do that because he's short on votes

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Speaker 1: to do all of these things that he claims is

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Speaker 1: going to help America grow. That infrastructure bill Jennie that

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Speaker 1: already passed the Senate, my gosh, more weeks than we

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Speaker 1: can count ago. At this point, it's so close you

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Speaker 1: could taste it. Isn't Rick right, there could be a

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Speaker 1: signing ceremony tomorrow. There could, except they can't get it

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Speaker 1: through the House, and so there won't be as signing

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Speaker 1: ceremony until they make progress on reconciliation. And that's obviously

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Speaker 1: what they're focused on. But I think you know, the

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Speaker 1: Republicans have been very clear in Congress when it comes

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Speaker 1: to reconciliation, they're not getting on board at least as

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Speaker 1: far as we know at this moment. When it comes

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Speaker 1: to raising or suspending the debt ceiling, they are not

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Speaker 1: on board. So I don't think the President is trying

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Speaker 1: to reach out and get Republicans on board for either

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Speaker 1: of those things. I think what he is trying to

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Speaker 1: do is send a larger message. It's quite frankly what

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Speaker 1: the same one he's been sending since he ran for office,

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Speaker 1: which is that the nation's infrastructure, whether hard or human,

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Speaker 1: is crumbling, and you compare it to how other nations

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Speaker 1: are investing and moving forward. We are behind, we are

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Speaker 1: in decline. We need to do this, we need to

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Speaker 1: move this forward. So I do think it's an important

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Speaker 1: message to send to the American public because let's not

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Speaker 1: forget you look at the poll numbers on the agenda items,

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Speaker 1: and these things are widely supported across the board. But

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Speaker 1: he's not going to get the support of Mitch McConnell

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Speaker 1: and Republicans in the Senate on either of those things.

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Speaker 1: Can't even get him on the debt ceiling, Rick, Mitch

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Speaker 1: McConnell voted for the bipartisan infrastructure package that got his vote.

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Speaker 1: Times you're gonna have to go back and delay this.

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Speaker 1: The people who are holding up his package are people

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Speaker 1: in his own party, not Republicans. Broadcasting live from our

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Speaker 1: nation's capital, Bloomberg to New York, Bloomberg eleven, Frio to Boston,

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg one oh six one to San Francisco, Bloomberg nine

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Speaker 1: sixty to the Country Serious x M General one nine

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Speaker 1: and around the globe of Bloomberg Business app and Bloomberg

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Speaker 1: Radio dot Com. This is Bloomberg Sound On with Joe

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Speaker 1: Matthew headline on the terminal whistle blower decries Facebook's free

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Speaker 1: pass for bad behavior. You may have seen her on

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Speaker 1: sixty Minutes. Francis Haugen, a former product manager at Facebook,

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Speaker 1: testify today on Capitol Hill. Sat before the Senate Commerce

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Speaker 1: Committee describing internal research she says proves Facebook put profit

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Speaker 1: before safety and hert the mental health of its youngest users.

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Speaker 1: We'll hear from her, and we'll talk about it with

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg Tech policy reporter Anna Edgerton. It's one thing to

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Speaker 1: talk to Scott Kelly sitting down alone in a controlled set,

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Speaker 1: good lighting, makeup. It's another thing to sit before a

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Speaker 1: congressional committee. I'll be it a friendly one, but that

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Speaker 1: was the reality today for Francis Hogan, the Facebook whistleblower.

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Speaker 1: Yesterday we saw Facebook get taken off the Internet. I

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Speaker 1: don't know why I went down, but I know that

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Speaker 1: for more than five hours, Facebook wasn't used to deepen divides,

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Speaker 1: destabilized democracies, and make young girls and women feel bad

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Speaker 1: about their bodies. It's tough. This is the woman who

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Speaker 1: leaked internal documents, she claims showing Facebook knew about the

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Speaker 1: worst of its influences on young people, among many others,

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Speaker 1: and in fact made it worse, she said when Facebook

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Speaker 1: changed its algorithm in the company intentionally hides vital information

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Speaker 1: from the public, from the U. S. Government and from

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Speaker 1: governments around the world. The documents I have provided Congress

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Speaker 1: proved that Facebook has repeatedly misled the public about what

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Speaker 1: its own researcher deals about the safety of children, the

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Speaker 1: efficacy of its artificial intelligence systems, and its role in

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Speaker 1: spreading divisive and extreme messages. There's a lot there in

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Speaker 1: writing about it for US Today and now talking with

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Speaker 1: us on Bloomberg sound on is Bloomberg Tech Policy reporter

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Speaker 1: Anna Edgerton. This is a pretty big moment for Facebook here,

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Speaker 1: and a lot of people, of course, are wondering if

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Speaker 1: it's if it's going to be more than talking, a

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Speaker 1: chance for politicians to go to the stake out and

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Speaker 1: say what they need to say about Facebook, or if

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Speaker 1: this actually results in some new regulations meaningful change. What's

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Speaker 1: your view, Well, that's an excellent question, and I would

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Speaker 1: argue the question today. And there are a few proposals

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Speaker 1: that were already been introduced in Congress, things that would

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Speaker 1: strengthened privacy regulations for Internet companies that would revoke some

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Speaker 1: of the liability protections that online platforms enjoy, or in

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Speaker 1: some cases for some of the antitrust legislation that that

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Speaker 1: would actually break up these big tech companies. Now that

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Speaker 1: legislation hasn't really gone too far right, you know, as

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Speaker 1: we speak now. But I do think that this is

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Speaker 1: a moment that will give to more moments in too

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Speaker 1: those and really kind of bring people together across the aisle.

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Speaker 1: Whether or not those bills can get to floor time

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Speaker 1: and kind of get through the legislative process is another question.

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Speaker 1: I don't want to pull you into the into this

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Speaker 1: actual debate here, and I know you're a journalist, but

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Speaker 1: is is what this woman is saying about Facebook true?

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Speaker 1: Do we have reason to believe those internal documents are

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Speaker 1: in fact real? Yeah? And Facebook hasn't said much about

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Speaker 1: the internal documents, you know, they haven't pushed back to

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Speaker 1: say that they were not true. They just said that

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Speaker 1: they weren't representative of what Facebook knows. Now we do

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Speaker 1: know that she delivered more than a thousand documents, not

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Speaker 1: only to Congress and to the Wall Street Journal who

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Speaker 1: first reported on this, but also to the Securities and

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Speaker 1: Exchange Commission, alleging that Facebook misled not only Congress in

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Speaker 1: the public, but also investors. So this could turn into

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Speaker 1: a much bigger deal for Facebook as a company, not

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Speaker 1: just as a platform for users. So a statement from

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Speaker 1: Facebook following the testimony came from a spokesman named Joe Osborne.

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Speaker 1: He put it on Twitter and says, today a Senate

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Speaker 1: hearing with a former product manager at Facebook who worked

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Speaker 1: for the company for less than two years, and they've

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Speaker 1: been eager to point that out, had no direct reports,

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Speaker 1: never attended a decision point meeting with the sea level executive,

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Speaker 1: testified more than six times to not working on the

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Speaker 1: subject matter in question. I don't even need to finish

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Speaker 1: the statement here, and they're clearly trying to discredit this woman. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I think that's actually not the best strategy for Facebook

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Speaker 1: to push back on these allegations because in some areas

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Speaker 1: she was speaking from her own expertise, especially when she's

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Speaker 1: talking about the civic misinformation team that she worked on.

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Speaker 1: But she also had this troupe of documents that documented

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Speaker 1: Facebook's own internal research on things like the mental health

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Speaker 1: risk for teen girls using their Instagram platform. So she

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Speaker 1: wasn't speaking from her own experience on all of these issues.

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Speaker 1: She delivered Facebook's own documents. So, you know, it's kind

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Speaker 1: of a hard thing to dismiss when you have these

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Speaker 1: very kind of thorough seeming reports that were poured over

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Speaker 1: by the Wall Street Journal and by members of Congress. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's it's pretty remarkable. As we go on to read

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Speaker 1: the rest of this statement here, it's been twenty five

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Speaker 1: years Facebook, right since the rules for the Internet have

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Speaker 1: been updated. They're asking for the creation of standard rules

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Speaker 1: for the Internet. In other words, I presume, why are

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Speaker 1: you just looking at us, Anna, Well, I mean, they

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Speaker 1: have a good point. It is up to Congress to

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Speaker 1: kind of set the rules of the road. But you

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Speaker 1: have to wonder what Facebook's final objective is in that.

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Speaker 1: You know, if regulations are written a certain way, they

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Speaker 1: could end up entrenching some of the already dominant players

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Speaker 1: like Facebook. So I've spoken with a few of the

430
00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:54,000
Speaker 1: senators who said they appreciate Facebook's public campaign in favor

431
00:23:54,040 --> 00:23:58,159
Speaker 1: of stricter Internet regulations. When it comes to actually crafting legislation,

432
00:23:58,480 --> 00:24:01,320
Speaker 1: they haven't gotten much engagement from Facebook in terms of

433
00:24:01,560 --> 00:24:04,359
Speaker 1: really pouring over how this would work. Well. It's interesting

434
00:24:04,400 --> 00:24:08,040
Speaker 1: because you know, we heard from the chair of the committee,

435
00:24:08,200 --> 00:24:12,200
Speaker 1: Senator Blumenthal, and he's saying, you know, we're seeing underneath

436
00:24:12,240 --> 00:24:15,400
Speaker 1: the hood for the first time of Facebook, and really

437
00:24:15,440 --> 00:24:17,239
Speaker 1: we've been we've been trying to get our hands on

438
00:24:17,240 --> 00:24:20,800
Speaker 1: this information. The lawmakers know enough to act on. Is

439
00:24:20,840 --> 00:24:24,800
Speaker 1: there are enough information they understand without Facebook bringing them

440
00:24:24,800 --> 00:24:27,160
Speaker 1: on a tour through you know, their secret files here

441
00:24:27,240 --> 00:24:29,760
Speaker 1: to do something about it. That was one of the

442
00:24:29,800 --> 00:24:33,520
Speaker 1: central points that Francis Hoggan, the whistle blower, tried to

443
00:24:33,600 --> 00:24:37,560
Speaker 1: make was that it's hard for Congress to legislate to

444
00:24:37,680 --> 00:24:40,160
Speaker 1: regulate an industry that they can't see. You know. She

445
00:24:41,200 --> 00:24:44,399
Speaker 1: likened it to regulating the automobile industry if you had

446
00:24:44,440 --> 00:24:46,879
Speaker 1: never seen a car. You know, a lot of times,

447
00:24:46,920 --> 00:24:50,439
Speaker 1: the way that these platforms work is not transparent for

448
00:24:50,520 --> 00:24:55,119
Speaker 1: anyone outside the company, and even outside researchers who understand

449
00:24:55,160 --> 00:24:57,920
Speaker 1: these issues very well don't have access to the same

450
00:24:58,000 --> 00:25:00,920
Speaker 1: level of data that Facebook does. We didn't hear from

451
00:25:00,920 --> 00:25:03,879
Speaker 1: Senator bloom Dall after the hearing where he said that

452
00:25:04,200 --> 00:25:07,240
Speaker 1: there needs to be a lot more information from Facebook

453
00:25:07,240 --> 00:25:09,879
Speaker 1: turns over the Congressional committee. They're willing to use their

454
00:25:09,880 --> 00:25:12,680
Speaker 1: subpoena power to get it. And he also wants Mark

455
00:25:12,760 --> 00:25:17,040
Speaker 1: Zuckerberg to come in and testify before the Stumer Protection Stubcommittee,

456
00:25:17,160 --> 00:25:19,359
Speaker 1: I guess, and he won't wear a hoodie to that one.

457
00:25:19,359 --> 00:25:21,479
Speaker 1: Anna Edgerton, great work. Great to have you with us,

458
00:25:21,480 --> 00:25:25,080
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Tech Policy reporter. This is why you read the terminal.

459
00:25:26,000 --> 00:25:29,800
Speaker 1: You're listening to Bloomberg. You sound on with Joe Matthew

460
00:25:30,160 --> 00:25:36,960
Speaker 1: on Bloomberg Radio. I'm searching Facebook right now. See if

461
00:25:37,040 --> 00:25:40,480
Speaker 1: Rick and Jennie you're on there? All right? Looks like

462
00:25:40,520 --> 00:25:42,880
Speaker 1: a yes for Ginie, not so much for Rick, unless

463
00:25:43,400 --> 00:25:45,600
Speaker 1: well there's a burner account. I guess, although wait, I

464
00:25:45,640 --> 00:25:48,680
Speaker 1: see it. I see one now. I hope this doesn't

465
00:25:48,720 --> 00:25:50,920
Speaker 1: get me in trouble. A page in search of all

466
00:25:50,960 --> 00:25:53,840
Speaker 1: those lucky enough to be dubbed Rick Davis and all

467
00:25:53,840 --> 00:25:58,720
Speaker 1: those admiring are Rick Davis. Ness my way of reassembling

468
00:25:58,760 --> 00:26:02,240
Speaker 1: the panel here, Genie Schanzano and yes, Rick Davis Bloomberg

469
00:26:02,320 --> 00:26:04,880
Speaker 1: Politics contributors, and so I will start with you here. Rick,

470
00:26:06,280 --> 00:26:08,399
Speaker 1: by the way, congratulations, if you've avoided all of this

471
00:26:08,480 --> 00:26:10,400
Speaker 1: for so many years, you've seen a lot of testimony

472
00:26:10,400 --> 00:26:13,399
Speaker 1: on a lot of issues, this one Facebook has actually

473
00:26:13,480 --> 00:26:19,000
Speaker 1: drawn relatively bipartisan support. Is that because Facebook is big tech,

474
00:26:19,320 --> 00:26:22,200
Speaker 1: which is a great target for both sides of the aisle,

475
00:26:22,280 --> 00:26:24,679
Speaker 1: or because we all have kids somewhere who could be

476
00:26:24,720 --> 00:26:26,959
Speaker 1: impacted by this. Oh, I think all of the above.

477
00:26:27,200 --> 00:26:30,159
Speaker 1: And just for the record, I'm not on Facebook. I

478
00:26:30,200 --> 00:26:31,960
Speaker 1: don't know what that was that you were reading, but

479
00:26:32,000 --> 00:26:35,640
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna look it up. The this is this

480
00:26:35,720 --> 00:26:39,200
Speaker 1: is what's amazing about this debate is that you could

481
00:26:39,280 --> 00:26:42,680
Speaker 1: literally write a novel about all the different issues that

482
00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:45,600
Speaker 1: are at stake here, right, And it's kind of like tobacco,

483
00:26:45,800 --> 00:26:48,960
Speaker 1: seatbelts and opioids all in the same company. Could you

484
00:26:49,000 --> 00:26:52,439
Speaker 1: only imagine? Right? I mean the and and it's and

485
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:55,680
Speaker 1: it's by Parson. Because every one of these issues affects,

486
00:26:55,720 --> 00:26:59,600
Speaker 1: as you point out, everybody's family and everybody UH in

487
00:26:59,720 --> 00:27:03,680
Speaker 1: cong verce UH is directly affected on it because they

488
00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:06,439
Speaker 1: do have Facebook accounts and they do wonder, you know,

489
00:27:06,480 --> 00:27:08,919
Speaker 1: what are they being subjected to? And they all have

490
00:27:09,040 --> 00:27:12,320
Speaker 1: been through the ringer in the last few election cycles.

491
00:27:12,760 --> 00:27:16,119
Speaker 1: And it's time to stop the marriga around and I

492
00:27:16,160 --> 00:27:18,919
Speaker 1: think this is what you're seeing you see, uh, you know,

493
00:27:18,960 --> 00:27:22,440
Speaker 1: senators like Ed Markey and Marsha Blackburn, who honestly see

494
00:27:22,760 --> 00:27:26,359
Speaker 1: nothing in the same light, are completely in sync on

495
00:27:26,480 --> 00:27:29,080
Speaker 1: what's going on with big tech and the need for reform.

496
00:27:29,320 --> 00:27:31,840
Speaker 1: Remarkable to watch that, and of course you remember we

497
00:27:31,840 --> 00:27:34,680
Speaker 1: had Marsha Blackburn on last week just a very different

498
00:27:34,720 --> 00:27:38,520
Speaker 1: tone on this issue, Genie. But there's an urgency, it

499
00:27:38,600 --> 00:27:41,560
Speaker 1: seems behind this. I just wonder, for a body that

500
00:27:41,640 --> 00:27:44,119
Speaker 1: can't even get money to fix crumbling bridges, how do

501
00:27:44,200 --> 00:27:47,720
Speaker 1: we deal with Facebook? Oh that's the big question. Um,

502
00:27:47,760 --> 00:27:51,280
Speaker 1: you know. I thought, listening to this testimony today, Um,

503
00:27:51,320 --> 00:27:53,840
Speaker 1: you know, and of course her interviews on sixty minutes,

504
00:27:54,320 --> 00:27:57,680
Speaker 1: it was, you know, a a moment, that real recording

505
00:27:57,800 --> 00:28:01,359
Speaker 1: for Facebook, because of course this is coming from inside.

506
00:28:01,400 --> 00:28:04,000
Speaker 1: This is like one of those horror movies where they

507
00:28:04,000 --> 00:28:06,919
Speaker 1: are coming from inside the house. And that is what

508
00:28:07,200 --> 00:28:11,399
Speaker 1: always always brings these types of you know, reckonings and

509
00:28:11,520 --> 00:28:14,439
Speaker 1: organizations to task. And so I think this was a

510
00:28:14,480 --> 00:28:16,119
Speaker 1: big moment and I think it will continue to be.

511
00:28:16,600 --> 00:28:18,399
Speaker 1: The One thing I would say, though, and this is

512
00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:21,480
Speaker 1: where I'm not confident we're going to see regulation in

513
00:28:21,520 --> 00:28:26,439
Speaker 1: the near term, is that Democrats and Republicans have you know,

514
00:28:26,840 --> 00:28:30,080
Speaker 1: similar views of Facebook for their and social media in

515
00:28:30,080 --> 00:28:33,080
Speaker 1: general for very different reasons, and that's why I think

516
00:28:33,080 --> 00:28:35,719
Speaker 1: they're having difficulty figuring out how to move forward. On

517
00:28:35,800 --> 00:28:38,400
Speaker 1: top of the fact, as we saw with Bluementhal and others,

518
00:28:38,480 --> 00:28:41,120
Speaker 1: they don't quite understand and you were just talking about

519
00:28:41,120 --> 00:28:43,880
Speaker 1: this with Anna, they don't quite understand these platforms, and

520
00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:46,800
Speaker 1: neither do many of us. But you know, Republicans see

521
00:28:46,840 --> 00:28:50,240
Speaker 1: this as you know they've been discriminating against conservatives versus

522
00:28:50,240 --> 00:28:53,040
Speaker 1: Democrats see it in terms of the unhealthy impact on

523
00:28:53,160 --> 00:28:57,000
Speaker 1: individuals and and democracy as a whole. That would require

524
00:28:57,120 --> 00:29:00,040
Speaker 1: very different sort of regulatory platforms and approaches, and I

525
00:29:00,760 --> 00:29:03,880
Speaker 1: have difficulty imagining how they get there this year, or

526
00:29:03,920 --> 00:29:07,400
Speaker 1: if Republicans take over either House or body next year.

527
00:29:07,520 --> 00:29:10,040
Speaker 1: So I am not confident we see regulation in the

528
00:29:10,080 --> 00:29:12,280
Speaker 1: short term. What do you make of that, Rick, and

529
00:29:12,280 --> 00:29:14,800
Speaker 1: and Genie is onto something there. Does it matter if

530
00:29:14,960 --> 00:29:19,040
Speaker 1: the left and right come after Facebook for different reasons,

531
00:29:19,160 --> 00:29:21,000
Speaker 1: or does it just matter that they're both that there's

532
00:29:21,000 --> 00:29:23,880
Speaker 1: a common foe. Well, I think there's something for everybody

533
00:29:23,920 --> 00:29:25,960
Speaker 1: in here. And I think the point that Jennie was making,

534
00:29:25,960 --> 00:29:28,480
Speaker 1: which I think is critically important, is the lack of

535
00:29:28,600 --> 00:29:32,600
Speaker 1: understanding about how these platforms like Facebook operate. But you've

536
00:29:32,600 --> 00:29:36,440
Speaker 1: got a pied piper now. I mean Francis Huggan gave

537
00:29:36,600 --> 00:29:40,920
Speaker 1: the committee probably more information in one day than they've

538
00:29:40,960 --> 00:29:44,240
Speaker 1: received in a decade from Facebook, and she explained it

539
00:29:44,320 --> 00:29:47,600
Speaker 1: in a way that everybody can understand. An algorithm for

540
00:29:47,640 --> 00:29:50,040
Speaker 1: a change. And I think these are the kinds of

541
00:29:50,320 --> 00:29:54,920
Speaker 1: moments that tend to crystallize support for getting something done

542
00:29:54,920 --> 00:29:57,760
Speaker 1: in Congress. And I think that that now you're going

543
00:29:57,800 --> 00:30:02,760
Speaker 1: to see uniting in an effort behind Republicans and Democrats

544
00:30:02,760 --> 00:30:05,960
Speaker 1: alike to start to legislate around this. And it's not

545
00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:08,560
Speaker 1: going to be what Facebook is advertising. You know, they're

546
00:30:08,560 --> 00:30:11,920
Speaker 1: out there saying, oh, gosh, you know we need government regulation. Well, buddy,

547
00:30:12,160 --> 00:30:15,520
Speaker 1: you're gonna get it here. It comes careful what you

548
00:30:15,560 --> 00:30:19,360
Speaker 1: ask for. Take it from Rick Davis as we turn

549
00:30:19,480 --> 00:30:21,600
Speaker 1: from Facebook, and this is a story we're gonna We're

550
00:30:21,600 --> 00:30:24,120
Speaker 1: gonna stay on here because it just impacts so many people,

551
00:30:24,160 --> 00:30:28,000
Speaker 1: so many of our listeners for for different reasons. Investing

552
00:30:28,600 --> 00:30:32,400
Speaker 1: maybe maybe you have a kid, I'm guessing your grandparents,

553
00:30:32,520 --> 00:30:34,400
Speaker 1: or even on this thing, it doesn't really matter how

554
00:30:34,400 --> 00:30:37,000
Speaker 1: old you are, where you're coming from. It's an important

555
00:30:37,000 --> 00:30:39,960
Speaker 1: story that we want to cover for you, just like

556
00:30:40,120 --> 00:30:44,200
Speaker 1: the FED. And this is the ultimate Bloomberg sound On story.

557
00:30:44,240 --> 00:30:49,600
Speaker 1: Here is the Fed meets Capitol Hill. Enter Elizabeth Warren,

558
00:30:49,880 --> 00:30:53,040
Speaker 1: Mr President, I rise today to express concern about a

559
00:30:53,120 --> 00:30:57,400
Speaker 1: culture of corruption among top officials at the Federal Reserve.

560
00:30:58,920 --> 00:31:02,680
Speaker 1: Takes to the floor to pull out that hammer on

561
00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:05,680
Speaker 1: j Powell, And as I read on the terminal, Biden

562
00:31:05,720 --> 00:31:10,520
Speaker 1: says he has confidence in Powell. After Warren broadside, David

563
00:31:10,520 --> 00:31:14,120
Speaker 1: Weston just sat down with Senator Warren. He's doing Balance

564
00:31:14,160 --> 00:31:16,320
Speaker 1: of Power from Washington, d C. This week in a

565
00:31:16,400 --> 00:31:20,920
Speaker 1: great series of broadcast planned, including this interview. Listen to.

566
00:31:21,080 --> 00:31:24,120
Speaker 1: Warren said about this to David Weston today on Bloomberg.

567
00:31:24,600 --> 00:31:26,800
Speaker 1: So what I want to see now is a FED

568
00:31:26,880 --> 00:31:30,960
Speaker 1: share who cares about both parts of the job. Monetary

569
00:31:31,040 --> 00:31:37,240
Speaker 1: policy very important, but willingness to regulate giant financial institutions

570
00:31:37,520 --> 00:31:41,920
Speaker 1: equally important, Warren said in her floor speech this morning.

571
00:31:41,960 --> 00:31:44,920
Speaker 1: Not terribly long ten minutes or something that Powell had

572
00:31:45,040 --> 00:31:47,840
Speaker 1: failed as a leader. Joe Biden was asked about him

573
00:31:47,880 --> 00:31:50,680
Speaker 1: on his visit to Michigan. Asked if he supports POWI

574
00:31:50,760 --> 00:31:54,400
Speaker 1: said first of all, yes, and went on to speak

575
00:31:54,400 --> 00:31:59,000
Speaker 1: to his confidence in the FEDS integrity and in Powell. Genie,

576
00:31:59,040 --> 00:32:01,160
Speaker 1: is this another one of these issues where it's good

577
00:32:01,240 --> 00:32:04,880
Speaker 1: politics for Elizabeth Warren to come out ahead of any

578
00:32:04,920 --> 00:32:08,680
Speaker 1: potential renomination for J. Powell? Or is she really trying

579
00:32:08,720 --> 00:32:12,080
Speaker 1: to change the makeup of this body starting at the top?

580
00:32:12,840 --> 00:32:15,760
Speaker 1: I think she has shown for much of her career

581
00:32:15,800 --> 00:32:20,920
Speaker 1: in Washington and elsewhere before that she is intent on reconfiguring,

582
00:32:21,080 --> 00:32:24,600
Speaker 1: on remaking this body. And I was struck by the

583
00:32:24,640 --> 00:32:27,520
Speaker 1: fact that she has now sort of morphed her criticism

584
00:32:27,640 --> 00:32:32,120
Speaker 1: or it's broadened it from just solely regulation. Now it is,

585
00:32:32,400 --> 00:32:35,920
Speaker 1: you know, focused increasingly on the issue of ethics. And

586
00:32:35,960 --> 00:32:38,920
Speaker 1: I think she it's not just Elizabeth Warren, she is

587
00:32:38,960 --> 00:32:43,040
Speaker 1: reflecting what we're hearing from many progressives. They are concerned

588
00:32:43,080 --> 00:32:47,040
Speaker 1: about several factors regulation, ethics, also the fact that if

589
00:32:47,120 --> 00:32:50,240
Speaker 1: Powell was to stay in place, it could potentially mean

590
00:32:50,280 --> 00:32:53,360
Speaker 1: that four of the seven board members a majority, would

591
00:32:53,360 --> 00:32:58,280
Speaker 1: be Republican appointees, which they see as incredibly dangerous over

592
00:32:58,320 --> 00:33:02,360
Speaker 1: the next several years, partcularly given how Republicans may be

593
00:33:02,520 --> 00:33:05,600
Speaker 1: making inroads in Congress and or the White House who

594
00:33:05,640 --> 00:33:08,800
Speaker 1: knows in four and so they are intent on making

595
00:33:08,840 --> 00:33:11,640
Speaker 1: this change now before we get to that point. This

596
00:33:11,720 --> 00:33:14,719
Speaker 1: has to do with these the trading issues, right the

597
00:33:14,800 --> 00:33:17,840
Speaker 1: leaders of the Dallas and Boston fed Banks, Rick Davis,

598
00:33:17,880 --> 00:33:22,320
Speaker 1: they announced their retirements just last week after internal documents

599
00:33:22,320 --> 00:33:25,000
Speaker 1: show they've been trading stocks and and some other investments

600
00:33:25,560 --> 00:33:28,160
Speaker 1: while in the act of setting monetary policy in the

601
00:33:28,200 --> 00:33:30,880
Speaker 1: depths of the pandemic. That is a non starter for

602
00:33:30,920 --> 00:33:34,400
Speaker 1: Elizabeth Warren. Why not just reinforce the trading rules though, Yeah,

603
00:33:34,480 --> 00:33:37,400
Speaker 1: I really think that this is a lot of a

604
00:33:37,440 --> 00:33:39,920
Speaker 1: lot of smoke, but not a lot of fire. I mean,

605
00:33:40,000 --> 00:33:42,960
Speaker 1: if I didn't know that the White House wasn't that organized.

606
00:33:43,000 --> 00:33:45,200
Speaker 1: I think this was a brilliant move on their part

607
00:33:45,280 --> 00:33:48,160
Speaker 1: to stoke up Elizabeth Warren get her to go after

608
00:33:48,200 --> 00:33:51,760
Speaker 1: Pal so that Biden could take this very ethical approach

609
00:33:51,800 --> 00:33:53,959
Speaker 1: to putting Pal back in the job and look like

610
00:33:54,000 --> 00:33:57,040
Speaker 1: he's distancing himself from you know, the progressives on his

611
00:33:57,120 --> 00:34:00,560
Speaker 1: party at a no cost benefit to the UH to

612
00:34:00,680 --> 00:34:03,240
Speaker 1: the White House. I mean, it honestly sets up perfectly

613
00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:05,320
Speaker 1: for Joe Biden. I mean, there's no reason why you

614
00:34:05,360 --> 00:34:09,440
Speaker 1: shouldn't reappoint the chairman and and look like he's actually

615
00:34:09,560 --> 00:34:12,759
Speaker 1: being independent and a little more moderate than Frankly, what

616
00:34:12,840 --> 00:34:14,960
Speaker 1: the what the progressives are trying to drive him too.

617
00:34:15,080 --> 00:34:17,359
Speaker 1: So yes, I think they got to clean up their

618
00:34:17,400 --> 00:34:20,839
Speaker 1: internal act. I think Elizabeth Warren does point out, uh,

619
00:34:20,960 --> 00:34:24,440
Speaker 1: some vulnerabilities that the Fed have. I mean, come on, guys,

620
00:34:24,960 --> 00:34:27,400
Speaker 1: even Congress is starting to stop trading on things they

621
00:34:27,480 --> 00:34:29,799
Speaker 1: vote on. I mean, I know that sounds crazy, but

622
00:34:30,360 --> 00:34:32,759
Speaker 1: I think it's time for for everybody to start thinking

623
00:34:32,760 --> 00:34:35,120
Speaker 1: about these kinds of issues in in the in the

624
00:34:35,200 --> 00:34:37,600
Speaker 1: environment we live in today. So what should the policy be?

625
00:34:37,719 --> 00:34:40,040
Speaker 1: And I'd be curious, Genie to hear you way in

626
00:34:40,120 --> 00:34:43,920
Speaker 1: on that that that that perceived strategy by Biden to

627
00:34:44,080 --> 00:34:47,839
Speaker 1: kind of reinforce his his moderate credentials. But should there

628
00:34:47,880 --> 00:34:51,640
Speaker 1: just be a flat policy you can't own any individual

629
00:34:51,719 --> 00:34:55,920
Speaker 1: securities period. That's not uncommon. By the way, for people

630
00:34:55,920 --> 00:34:58,760
Speaker 1: who cover business for a living, who cover the financial

631
00:34:58,800 --> 00:35:01,120
Speaker 1: markets for a living, that that's kind of par for

632
00:35:01,160 --> 00:35:04,080
Speaker 1: the course. Genie. Yeah, I think many people hearing this

633
00:35:04,120 --> 00:35:07,440
Speaker 1: would probably stunt to imagine, as Rick just said that

634
00:35:07,520 --> 00:35:10,600
Speaker 1: this hasn't happened already. I mean, this is you know,

635
00:35:10,920 --> 00:35:14,919
Speaker 1: cannot own certainly cannot trade when you're in this kind

636
00:35:14,920 --> 00:35:17,480
Speaker 1: of position, making this kind of policy, and you know,

637
00:35:17,520 --> 00:35:19,640
Speaker 1: you talk about, you know, Donald Trump's sold you know,

638
00:35:19,719 --> 00:35:22,320
Speaker 1: drain the swamp kind of thing. This is what lends

639
00:35:22,360 --> 00:35:26,440
Speaker 1: credence to those kinds of ideas. And you know, I would,

640
00:35:26,760 --> 00:35:29,520
Speaker 1: you know, maybe a few months ago, have thought that

641
00:35:29,640 --> 00:35:33,600
Speaker 1: Biden wanted to shore up his moderate credentials. But given

642
00:35:33,800 --> 00:35:36,920
Speaker 1: what he's had to deal with on infrastructure and as

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Speaker 1: I think, you know, move quite clearly in the progressive direction,

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Speaker 1: I'm not so sure he's going to withstand this onslaught

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Speaker 1: by progressives on this. I thought he would, and we

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Speaker 1: still know he says publicly he supports Powell, but I

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Speaker 1: think he's going to feel a lot of pressure on this.

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Speaker 1: And let's not forget they are also talking about the

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Speaker 1: lack of diversity, and that is a real concern and

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Speaker 1: should be a real concern for everybody. We'll tell you what, Rick,

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Speaker 1: we only have a couple of seconds left here. Not

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Speaker 1: that many lawmakers appear to be weighing in or really

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Speaker 1: leaning into this. Is that because they don't want their

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Speaker 1: own freighting policy. Uh yeah, I think that they don't

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Speaker 1: like this story because they've been burned on it before themselves.

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Speaker 1: And yet there are a lot of members of the

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Speaker 1: Republican Party on the Banking Committee who would come out

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Speaker 1: for Pal. So I think there's a balance here, and

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Speaker 1: we're starting to see it, uh, you know, start to occur.

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Speaker 1: Rick Davis, Jennie Chanzano, the best in the business. On

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Speaker 1: the fastest hour in politics, I'm Joe, Matthew Mats. You

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Speaker 1: back here tomorrow. This is Bloomberg