WEBVTT - Alec Baldwin "Rust" Shooting With Aphrodite Jones: Part I 0:00:08.360 --> 0:00:13.000 Y'all can't help but love an adorer. She's an author, reporter, 0:00:13.440 --> 0:00:17.960 TV producer, true crime legend. She's hosted her own show, 0:00:18.600 --> 0:00:22.840 True Crime with Aphrodite Jones. She has covered trials high 0:00:22.920 --> 0:00:29.120 profile like Scott Peterson, Michael Jackson, BTK, Dennis Raider, and 0:00:29.200 --> 0:00:32.440 Honey when she's not writing movie scripts and doing fabulous 0:00:32.440 --> 0:00:37.640 parties and crime con and different things. Always stunning for Lawless. 0:00:38.120 --> 0:00:42.040 I've never seen her look even half, not completely put together. 0:00:42.479 --> 0:00:46.120 Come on now, Cheryl, not sure the truth? 0:00:47.360 --> 0:00:50.800 That is absolutely the truth. You're one of the main 0:00:50.880 --> 0:00:54.400 reasons this ain't video, it's voice only. I ain't gonna 0:00:54.400 --> 0:00:56.000 be compared to you looking crazy. 0:00:56.200 --> 0:00:57.360 Who love you, Cheryl? 0:00:57.720 --> 0:00:59.560 I love you, and listen, we are not going to 0:00:59.640 --> 0:01:02.760 waste any time because you and I have got to 0:01:02.880 --> 0:01:06.959 talk about a case that when I first heard about it, 0:01:06.959 --> 0:01:10.040 it took me a second because I'm like, how how 0:01:10.040 --> 0:01:13.720 did this even happen? There should be so many layers 0:01:13.760 --> 0:01:18.400 of protection for everybody on a movie set, y'all. Of 0:01:18.400 --> 0:01:22.400 course we're gonna talk about Alec Baldwin and some other folks, 0:01:22.480 --> 0:01:26.640 but that's how everybody knows this case, and you know, Aphrodity, 0:01:27.160 --> 0:01:29.440 here's what I'm gonna do. I'm gonna let you tell 0:01:29.520 --> 0:01:31.800 us where we're gonna start, and I'm gonna follow you. 0:01:31.840 --> 0:01:34.720 I'm gonna let you drive this train. Because there's so 0:01:34.880 --> 0:01:40.560 many lawsuits and people. Everybody's sueing everybody, and some people 0:01:40.600 --> 0:01:43.039 get in charge, some people not getting charge, some people 0:01:43.040 --> 0:01:46.920 making deals. You almost need to flow charte. So you 0:01:47.160 --> 0:01:50.240 just you just take it away, all right. 0:01:50.400 --> 0:01:53.360 So first I want to say that in the history 0:01:53.400 --> 0:01:56.960 of filmmaking, there has never been a live round of 0:01:56.960 --> 0:02:00.600 ammunition on a set. I have talked to everybody on 0:02:00.600 --> 0:02:03.960 my Hollywood people. I've talked to prop masters. I mean, 0:02:04.040 --> 0:02:06.480 I've been around the Rosie here just to see. One 0:02:06.520 --> 0:02:09.960 of my friends, who who has his own studio, talked 0:02:09.960 --> 0:02:12.800 about the fact that he and he had his wife 0:02:12.880 --> 0:02:14.760 was his first wife was murdered. This is a guy 0:02:14.800 --> 0:02:18.720 who carries a gun in general. Okay. He told me 0:02:18.800 --> 0:02:21.840 that the other time there was ever a real live 0:02:21.919 --> 0:02:25.800 AMMA on any set was when he not on set. 0:02:25.800 --> 0:02:29.160 But even within the scope of where krinbya set was 0:02:29.280 --> 0:02:32.040 where he had a separate building, where he had a 0:02:32.080 --> 0:02:35.720 completely separate situation where he kept his own guns. It 0:02:35.840 --> 0:02:37.680 wasn't a part of the set. It wasn't part of 0:02:37.680 --> 0:02:39.880 what the props were going to be with them, So 0:02:40.200 --> 0:02:42.839 that was that's what I've heard around the block. Now 0:02:43.760 --> 0:02:47.840 come to this case and let's talk about how these 0:02:47.919 --> 0:02:51.600 bullets got onto that set. We have never had anybody 0:02:51.680 --> 0:02:54.160 shot on a set before because there's never been live ammo. 0:02:54.520 --> 0:02:59.520 We had two deaths based on Black's being pulled okay, 0:02:59.680 --> 0:03:03.600 which have a violent discharge of their own and can 0:03:03.880 --> 0:03:06.720 cause harm and did in two cases. But I mean, 0:03:06.800 --> 0:03:09.920 what were you thinking as a cop how this happened 0:03:10.000 --> 0:03:10.960 or why this happened? 0:03:11.480 --> 0:03:17.520 Listen. I was so stunned about it because my idea 0:03:17.560 --> 0:03:22.240 of Hollywood, none of it's real. That's not really. The 0:03:22.240 --> 0:03:26.560 Empire state building, that's not really. A bomb, that's not really. 0:03:27.000 --> 0:03:30.960 Even the love scenes ain't real. So how in the world, 0:03:31.400 --> 0:03:33.720 because you know, you think, okay, you know, the car 0:03:33.840 --> 0:03:39.000 jumping the bridge and explosions and people getting shot, it's 0:03:39.120 --> 0:03:42.800 never real. You know, they've got the blood bags, they've 0:03:42.800 --> 0:03:44.960 got all this stuff to make it look that way. 0:03:45.560 --> 0:03:48.840 And to me, here's one of the first things that 0:03:48.880 --> 0:03:50.800 did cross my mind when I first heard it. I 0:03:50.880 --> 0:03:54.400 was like, how is this possible? There's no way, there's 0:03:54.560 --> 0:04:00.240 no possible way that anybody took a live round to 0:04:00.320 --> 0:04:03.040 a movie set. The next thing I thought about is 0:04:03.080 --> 0:04:05.760 in my job. My police department is right next to 0:04:05.800 --> 0:04:09.560 the airport in Atlanta, as you know, has become like 0:04:09.720 --> 0:04:13.080 Hollywood of the South. They're making movies all over Atlanta. 0:04:13.160 --> 0:04:18.039 Now we have actually had prop people come into my 0:04:18.120 --> 0:04:21.400 police department where they call me as the evidence person 0:04:21.440 --> 0:04:24.520 and the crime scene investigator because they want to self 0:04:24.600 --> 0:04:27.920 confiscate weapons. They want to just give them to us 0:04:27.920 --> 0:04:29.560 because they don't want to get on an airplane with 0:04:29.600 --> 0:04:32.839 them and they don't need them any longer. But even 0:04:32.960 --> 0:04:36.960 that shocked me that these weapons are real. I thought 0:04:37.160 --> 0:04:40.880 everything was like three D or plastic or made to 0:04:41.040 --> 0:04:44.680 look I had no idea. I had no idea for. 0:04:44.600 --> 0:04:47.000 The most part. You know, a lot of that is 0:04:47.080 --> 0:04:49.720 to make it look. But as time has evolved and 0:04:49.760 --> 0:04:53.279 with the HD, and you know that with realism being 0:04:53.320 --> 0:04:57.200 so important to filmmakers on and always has been. In 0:04:57.279 --> 0:04:59.720 terms of prop masters, you know, you see something from 0:04:59.720 --> 0:05:02.360 the City Extige in the seventies. Every single thing is 0:05:02.480 --> 0:05:05.599 in puri you know, down to the chewing gum, down 0:05:05.720 --> 0:05:07.800 to the bowls that they eat out of in a 0:05:07.880 --> 0:05:10.400 seventies set, you know, you get that old pirate stuff 0:05:10.440 --> 0:05:13.880 coming up. They're very, very particular about keeping things as 0:05:13.920 --> 0:05:16.440 real as possible. Now when it comes to weapons, they 0:05:16.480 --> 0:05:19.920 do use real weapons on sets, but they are only 0:05:20.040 --> 0:05:23.760 filled with dummies and occasionally with blanks when they have 0:05:23.880 --> 0:05:27.159 to actually do the scene rather than rehearse it, so 0:05:27.240 --> 0:05:29.120 that there's some smoke that comes out of the gun, 0:05:29.560 --> 0:05:35.280 but in no circumstance ken that kills someone on There 0:05:35.279 --> 0:05:38.080 were two instances I had referred to. One was a 0:05:38.120 --> 0:05:42.920 young man who took the gun to his head in 0:05:42.960 --> 0:05:45.960 a Russian roulette scene and it had a blank in it. 0:05:46.040 --> 0:05:48.360 He didn't know that and it killed him. And the 0:05:48.400 --> 0:05:50.880 other was Bruce Lee's son who also was killed in 0:05:50.880 --> 0:05:54.000 a freakish way by a blank. That's it in the 0:05:54.000 --> 0:05:59.360 whole history of Hollywood filmmaking. So again, not live bullets. Yes, 0:05:59.480 --> 0:06:02.720 real gun, but not live bullets. So how did this 0:06:02.920 --> 0:06:06.279 bullet get there? And I have a story that I 0:06:06.320 --> 0:06:10.520 want to tell about that that I learned in watching 0:06:10.560 --> 0:06:15.000 the Alec Baldwin trial. How familiar are you with Belle Reid. 0:06:15.520 --> 0:06:17.440 I know about him and I know that's how she 0:06:17.520 --> 0:06:20.440 got in the business, but I don't know enough about 0:06:20.480 --> 0:06:22.359 him to you know, tell a story. 0:06:22.520 --> 0:06:25.360 Yeah, so let me. I'm gonna give a little backdrop here. 0:06:25.839 --> 0:06:28.359 So fell Read has been in the business for sixty 0:06:28.440 --> 0:06:33.080 years and he is a legend in that field with 0:06:33.440 --> 0:06:36.920 all with propmaster and then became, you know, an armorer. 0:06:36.920 --> 0:06:39.679 I mean, this man could twirl a gun around sixteen 0:06:39.720 --> 0:06:42.760 ways from Sunday and I knew what he's doing, knows 0:06:42.760 --> 0:06:45.760 what he's doing best of the business. It just so 0:06:45.960 --> 0:06:53.720 happens that bell Read was working with another gentleman who 0:06:53.760 --> 0:06:56.800 I'm just going to call a concerned citizen, and let's say, 0:06:58.279 --> 0:07:01.000 by the name of Troy Teskey. I don't knows you've 0:07:01.040 --> 0:07:05.640 heard that name in the trial, But Troy Tesky and 0:07:06.760 --> 0:07:11.880 Phil Reid were down in Texas working on the set 0:07:12.040 --> 0:07:15.080 of eighteen eighty three. You know what I'm talking about, 0:07:15.080 --> 0:07:19.040 the prequel to Yellow Sculling. Yep, right, So that's a 0:07:19.040 --> 0:07:21.800 big Western it's back in time, it's eighteen eighty three. 0:07:21.840 --> 0:07:25.160 There's lots of guns, lots of action with guns. And 0:07:25.200 --> 0:07:28.360 what they decided to do the filmmakers wanted to get 0:07:28.400 --> 0:07:31.880 certain people of the cast together and have them learn 0:07:31.920 --> 0:07:34.760 about real guns and shoot real guns and shoot real 0:07:34.800 --> 0:07:37.000 bullets and take lessons in it so that they could 0:07:37.560 --> 0:07:39.880 quote bond with each other, but also so that they 0:07:39.920 --> 0:07:42.360 would have know what it's like, so that when they 0:07:42.360 --> 0:07:44.880 go to act the scene they know how to perhaps 0:07:44.960 --> 0:07:47.560 react to the gun or you know, what the violence 0:07:47.600 --> 0:07:53.480 of it is. So that's where the bullets were. The 0:07:53.520 --> 0:07:57.400 bullets were, at least from what I can detern here 0:07:57.520 --> 0:08:03.960 piece together. The man Troit Teskey has said publicly that 0:08:04.720 --> 0:08:06.880 about the fact that they built this, they went to 0:08:06.920 --> 0:08:10.600 a separate area of the of the property and created 0:08:10.600 --> 0:08:14.240 a you know, a shooting race that was entirely safe 0:08:14.280 --> 0:08:16.560 with the with the backstop and everything needed to be. 0:08:16.920 --> 0:08:18.960 And there were a few cast members there and they 0:08:18.960 --> 0:08:24.200 did the practice round shooting real ammunition. They had the lessons, 0:08:24.280 --> 0:08:26.280 they did what they did, and when it was over, 0:08:27.320 --> 0:08:33.440 the Tesky, this man holds film reads ammunition for him 0:08:33.559 --> 0:08:38.480 at his warehouse in Albuquerque. So that's been the way 0:08:38.559 --> 0:08:41.560 they've done things. Like you say, Atlanta is the Hollywood 0:08:41.600 --> 0:08:46.000 of the South, well, Texas in that area, you know, Montana, 0:08:46.840 --> 0:08:52.600 Arizona kind of the the what the Hollywood of the Midwest, Okay, 0:08:53.160 --> 0:08:56.320 And so he's got his ammo there with his buddy 0:08:56.760 --> 0:09:03.080 for many years now that and munition gets driven to Albuquerque, 0:09:03.480 --> 0:09:08.839 and then somehow another the person who goes to get 0:09:08.840 --> 0:09:13.720 the ammunition who has driven it is somebody evolved in 0:09:13.760 --> 0:09:17.320 the set of Rust. Okay, obviously how did he get there? 0:09:17.559 --> 0:09:21.720 So there's another character in this story whose name is 0:09:21.760 --> 0:09:26.880 Seth Kenny, and Seth Kenny is the person who went 0:09:27.000 --> 0:09:30.960 to retrieve the ammunition. He actually had his assistant go 0:09:31.000 --> 0:09:32.600 and get it, and she was on the phone with 0:09:32.640 --> 0:09:35.520 her directing her what to do. And he got that ammunition. 0:09:35.960 --> 0:09:40.400 She brought it to him and his prop warehouse, and 0:09:40.720 --> 0:09:43.960 he never really checked it, and he says he did. 0:09:44.080 --> 0:09:47.520 He testifies that he did, but obviously he did not 0:09:48.240 --> 0:09:50.839 because live bullets wound up on the set of Rust. 0:09:52.280 --> 0:09:55.679 Why am I saying this? Why it's important is that 0:09:55.760 --> 0:09:57.920 first of all, no one could have figured out how 0:09:57.960 --> 0:09:59.880 that happened. And it's only recently that we did tre 0:10:00.200 --> 0:10:02.880 this out when it was Baldwin's trial was on in 0:10:02.920 --> 0:10:07.080 the first few days. This person, Troy Tesky, is the 0:10:07.120 --> 0:10:13.240 one who brought a bag of ammunition to Hanniguichier's Read's trial. 0:10:14.280 --> 0:10:16.880 He believed he was going to be called as a witness. 0:10:17.160 --> 0:10:20.839 He brought a bag of ammunition that matched the bullets 0:10:21.720 --> 0:10:24.200 that were found at the scene and the bullet that 0:10:24.400 --> 0:10:31.160 killed Helena. Hutchins that that bullet the man the bullet 0:10:31.520 --> 0:10:34.600 and other six other bullets al tonal six bullets on 0:10:34.679 --> 0:10:40.880 set matched these bullets precisely. So he was shocked because 0:10:40.880 --> 0:10:44.760 he had come to the prosecutor, the special prosecutor Morrisey, 0:10:44.840 --> 0:10:48.640 and said, look, I have bullets. They match. I'm going 0:10:48.679 --> 0:10:50.320 to bring them in. I want you to test them, 0:10:50.440 --> 0:10:53.480 and she ignored them for a year, didn't want anything 0:10:53.480 --> 0:10:55.760 to do with it. So when he gets to the trial, 0:10:55.840 --> 0:10:57.960 he realizes he's not going to be called as a witnesses, 0:10:57.960 --> 0:10:59.640 that the preliminary is not going to be called. They 0:10:59.640 --> 0:11:02.360 don't hear about him. He now watches the trial. He's 0:11:02.400 --> 0:11:05.080 got the bullets in his storage, in his car or wherever, 0:11:05.400 --> 0:11:09.600 and he walks into the Santa Fe Police department and 0:11:09.760 --> 0:11:12.040 hands over it says, I have evidence I want to 0:11:12.040 --> 0:11:14.280 give to you here. It is just like people here 0:11:14.400 --> 0:11:16.840 you guns. This guy handed over a bag of bullets 0:11:17.280 --> 0:11:19.559 and we heard testimony and this is where the trial went. 0:11:19.679 --> 0:11:25.679 Arrived for Alec Baldwin from the CSI officer who accepted 0:11:25.720 --> 0:11:29.400 those bullets. Yep, I saw that video, okay, And that's 0:11:29.440 --> 0:11:32.680 where this thing fell apart with Alec Baldwin, because now 0:11:33.160 --> 0:11:38.040 you have this woman testifying that, yes, I was handed 0:11:38.160 --> 0:11:41.120 bullets and what did you do with the bullets? Well, 0:11:41.559 --> 0:11:46.440 I filed them. I put a document and I documented there. 0:11:46.520 --> 0:11:48.520 What do you mean documented? And it turns out we 0:11:48.600 --> 0:11:53.760 discover she was told by somebody higher up to document 0:11:53.960 --> 0:11:58.160 this and file it under a separate case, not under 0:11:58.160 --> 0:12:02.120 the rust case. Right. So now come to find out 0:12:02.280 --> 0:12:05.160 when the when the offense attorneys hear this, they realized 0:12:05.360 --> 0:12:09.760 she's hiding others. This is something should have been tested. Certainly, 0:12:09.840 --> 0:12:12.600 the defense needed to test it. This could have explained 0:12:12.600 --> 0:12:15.440 and would explained most likely how the bullets got on set, 0:12:15.480 --> 0:12:18.440 because one of the things that the prosecutor was alleging 0:12:18.520 --> 0:12:21.760 in the in the gutieris Read case was that she 0:12:22.000 --> 0:12:24.720 brought those bullets onto the set. Not just that she 0:12:25.000 --> 0:12:27.719 was negligent in the way that things were handled, but 0:12:27.760 --> 0:12:30.640 that she brought them on the set. Well, it looks 0:12:30.679 --> 0:12:33.280 to me like Seth Kenny is the one who was 0:12:33.480 --> 0:12:36.160 negligent there in terms of those bullets getting to the set. 0:12:36.200 --> 0:12:38.240 And if if you might recall or might've seen in 0:12:38.280 --> 0:12:44.600 commentary Seth Kenny was helping the law enforcement when they 0:12:44.640 --> 0:12:47.400 were looking at things, trying to explain to them what 0:12:47.480 --> 0:12:49.800 prop guns were like, what prop bullets were like, but 0:12:49.880 --> 0:12:53.640 dummies were like. He had so much involvement there which 0:12:53.679 --> 0:12:56.160 he had no business and involvement that it was like 0:12:56.240 --> 0:12:59.960 he protests too much, if you understand I'm saying, I believe, 0:13:00.520 --> 0:13:03.240 truly believed that he was busy trying to point fingers 0:13:03.280 --> 0:13:07.480 at anyone he could, this prop master, Jeff Kenny, in 0:13:07.559 --> 0:13:09.760 order that he wasn't the one who brought the bullets 0:13:09.760 --> 0:13:12.640 there or got the bullets there. I think I think 0:13:12.720 --> 0:13:16.000 it's been proven, at least to my satisfaction, that this 0:13:16.040 --> 0:13:18.720 is how they got there. They got there through sept 0:13:18.840 --> 0:13:23.040 Kenny's negligence and not testing those bullets, by having those 0:13:23.160 --> 0:13:27.000 bullets come from a set from Texas which belonged to 0:13:27.040 --> 0:13:32.120 THELL Reid. It's ironic that those were fell Reads bullets, right, 0:13:32.440 --> 0:13:36.040 because it's his daughter who winds up in prison because 0:13:36.080 --> 0:13:40.559 of those bullets. And I think the reason that Karen 0:13:40.640 --> 0:13:45.280 Lawressey didn't want to analyze or tall or have anything 0:13:45.280 --> 0:13:49.079 to do with the bullets is because She knew that 0:13:49.280 --> 0:13:52.520 Troy Tesky was a friend of thell Read's, so she 0:13:52.679 --> 0:13:55.760 probably thought this could be a setup. Again, this is 0:13:55.840 --> 0:14:00.000 me just you know, coming up with my own theories here. 0:14:00.040 --> 0:14:00.360 I'm not. 0:14:01.800 --> 0:14:04.240 I'm just guessing here. I know that she was aware 0:14:04.679 --> 0:14:08.440 that Phil Reid was friends with the person who handed 0:14:08.480 --> 0:14:13.199 in those bullets, tro Tesky. Bottom line boom. She hid 0:14:13.880 --> 0:14:18.840 the most important evidence, the bullets that could and did 0:14:18.960 --> 0:14:24.520 match actually was discovered, the bullet that killed Helena Hutchins. 0:14:25.160 --> 0:14:28.760 There's no justice here. She's out for blood. She's out 0:14:28.880 --> 0:14:33.160 for making a name for herself as well, I might add, 0:14:33.200 --> 0:14:36.000 I mean, whoever heard of Karrie Morrissey before she was 0:14:36.000 --> 0:14:38.600 appointed as a special prosecutor. Here, she's going to be 0:14:38.960 --> 0:14:42.440 on TV. It's going to be her O. J. Simpson moment, 0:14:42.880 --> 0:14:45.520 you know, I mean, the whole world is watching. This 0:14:45.560 --> 0:14:48.640 has never happened in the universe before. Here's an a 0:14:48.880 --> 0:14:51.880 list actor Alec Bull, who knew mean you say his name, 0:14:51.960 --> 0:14:54.800 there's no question he's in a lister. And he's also 0:14:54.840 --> 0:15:00.280 somebody known for problems with you know, violence, and you know, 0:15:01.280 --> 0:15:04.720 for that crazy voicemail he left for his daughter calling 0:15:04.760 --> 0:15:06.920 her page and all this other stuff. I mean, I'm 0:15:06.920 --> 0:15:08.600 not saying that he was beating people up, but he's 0:15:08.600 --> 0:15:13.200 certainly gone after some paparazzi. In essence, though, what I 0:15:13.240 --> 0:15:19.120 want to say is this, she called Alec Baldwin an 0:15:19.280 --> 0:15:24.120 arrogant ahole. Okay, we found that out. We also found 0:15:24.120 --> 0:15:28.560 out she called them other curse words. She hated her, 0:15:29.600 --> 0:15:32.200 and she wanted to get him. And as soon as 0:15:32.280 --> 0:15:35.040 it turned out that the FBI was able to establish 0:15:35.040 --> 0:15:37.440 that the gun that was used on set had to 0:15:37.480 --> 0:15:41.240 have a trigger pulled in order to fire, she went 0:15:41.320 --> 0:15:43.840 back after Alec Baldwin. Now because you know, I had 0:15:43.880 --> 0:15:47.160 been dropped. And then you know, he was cleared or 0:15:47.400 --> 0:15:50.560 so called, and then later on he was indicted again 0:15:50.720 --> 0:15:58.480 by this special prosecutor. So you know, I want to 0:15:58.480 --> 0:16:03.320 ask you something. Did you ever think that Alec Baldwin 0:16:03.400 --> 0:16:04.680 did not pull the trigger? 0:16:05.200 --> 0:16:07.560 I never once thought he didn't pull the trigger. He 0:16:07.640 --> 0:16:08.800 had to have pulled the trigger. 0:16:09.120 --> 0:16:12.000 And that's that's what I think, And every expert I 0:16:12.120 --> 0:16:16.800 have looked to watch searched out says the same thing. 0:16:17.000 --> 0:16:20.440 I can't imagine how you would have the gun cock 0:16:20.640 --> 0:16:24.040 back like that and with your finger on the trigger. 0:16:24.080 --> 0:16:25.880 And there are photographs of him, by the way, with 0:16:26.000 --> 0:16:28.520 his finger is listen on that trigger. 0:16:28.560 --> 0:16:32.280 Here's the deal, the number one rule when you're teaching 0:16:33.080 --> 0:16:36.920 a young person or a rookie or anybody, you never 0:16:37.440 --> 0:16:40.720 point that gun in another person. Ever, you don't do it. 0:16:41.280 --> 0:16:43.680 And again in Hollywood, there's a way that it looks 0:16:43.760 --> 0:16:46.120 like they're maybe standing in front of each other, but 0:16:46.200 --> 0:16:48.520 you can do that camera angle where they're not. Really, 0:16:49.280 --> 0:16:52.160 there's no reason for this to have ever happened. I 0:16:52.200 --> 0:16:55.000 don't care who you are, whether your grandpa taught you 0:16:55.040 --> 0:16:57.760 to shoot, or a drill sergeant in the army, or 0:16:58.480 --> 0:17:02.000 somebody get a police academy. That statement came out of 0:17:02.000 --> 0:17:05.080 their mouth. Don't ever point it at another person. And 0:17:05.160 --> 0:17:07.439 my dad even told us there's no such thing as 0:17:07.480 --> 0:17:10.840 an unloaded gun. You don't ever act like it's unloaded. 0:17:10.880 --> 0:17:14.240 You don't treat it like it's unloaded. It's always loaded. 0:17:14.760 --> 0:17:18.960 So with that said, he should have never pointed that 0:17:19.080 --> 0:17:20.440 weapon at Miss Hutchins. 0:17:20.480 --> 0:17:25.000 Absolutely, But again now here you have the special prosecutor 0:17:25.359 --> 0:17:30.119 who obviously thinks that way, you know, and now we 0:17:30.240 --> 0:17:32.560 find out, oh no, he had to have pulled the trigger. 0:17:32.720 --> 0:17:35.280 So she goes after him. Now under the auspices that 0:17:36.040 --> 0:17:37.879 now it is being tried as only an actor, not 0:17:37.960 --> 0:17:40.120 as an actor or producer. They didn't find that out 0:17:40.200 --> 0:17:42.520 until the judge made that were ruling right before the 0:17:42.520 --> 0:17:45.600 trial started. That was a big hit against the prosecution 0:17:46.600 --> 0:17:50.800 because had Ellen Baldwin been tried as a producer, Tiger 0:17:50.880 --> 0:17:53.199 stam because I know Hollywood Land pretty well. I've had 0:17:53.200 --> 0:17:56.080 three books mating two movies and etc. When the a 0:17:56.280 --> 0:18:00.040 star gets a producer credit on a film then not 0:18:00.119 --> 0:18:03.439 really producing the film. They're just getting extra money and 0:18:03.480 --> 0:18:07.399 having the name on as a producer. They're not literally producing. 0:18:07.640 --> 0:18:10.800 Producers are in back rooms and you know, in sound 0:18:10.920 --> 0:18:14.800 rooms and rooms with equipment. They're putting stuff together. They're 0:18:14.840 --> 0:18:17.160 putting budgets together and all of that prior to the 0:18:17.640 --> 0:18:20.040 you know, prior to the set rolling and all of that. 0:18:20.119 --> 0:18:23.679 They're not He was not We know in Hollywood that 0:18:23.800 --> 0:18:29.399 you're not actually producing. But he still had the title 0:18:29.440 --> 0:18:33.320 of producer, So technically I don't care if he's notelf producing. 0:18:33.720 --> 0:18:36.560 He is listed as a producer on that on that 0:18:36.680 --> 0:18:40.000 film as well as the Store, and in the role 0:18:40.040 --> 0:18:44.680 of producer very different than an actor handling a gun. 0:18:45.920 --> 0:18:50.439 And I'll tell you why because producers are responsible for 0:18:50.520 --> 0:18:55.680 the budget. And this goes directly to Alec Baldswin, even 0:18:55.720 --> 0:19:00.439 though he's not a producer, so called Alec than was 0:19:00.440 --> 0:19:03.439 making a vanity film. This is all about. He's sixty 0:19:03.480 --> 0:19:05.800 six or sixty four years old and he wants to, 0:19:06.280 --> 0:19:09.119 you know, be the cowboy again. He wants to be 0:19:09.240 --> 0:19:11.080 in the scene. He wants to be the star. And 0:19:11.119 --> 0:19:13.480 this is going to be great. But it's going to 0:19:13.480 --> 0:19:15.399 be a five million dollar film and it's going to 0:19:15.400 --> 0:19:17.359 be done on a shoe string. And he who do 0:19:17.400 --> 0:19:19.080 you think was going to collect the most money out 0:19:19.119 --> 0:19:22.760 of that whole budget? Alec Bawl, He dos that you that? 0:19:23.000 --> 0:19:26.520 Yep, let me ask you this because I'm so grateful 0:19:26.560 --> 0:19:30.160 that you have that you know, insight, you know, because 0:19:30.200 --> 0:19:32.399 of your books being made to movies and working with 0:19:32.480 --> 0:19:36.000 different actors and producers. The one thing that stood out 0:19:36.000 --> 0:19:39.199 to me when when everything was really coming out is 0:19:39.240 --> 0:19:43.000 the first assistant director. Now again I don't know much 0:19:43.040 --> 0:19:47.760 about Hollywood. I know a director says action cut tape, whatever. 0:19:48.480 --> 0:19:51.840 What does the first assistant director do? And the reason 0:19:51.960 --> 0:19:55.639 I'm asking is we were told that David Halls is 0:19:55.720 --> 0:19:59.480 one that handed him the gun and first hollered out 0:19:59.640 --> 0:20:02.480 cold gun, which means no live, Amma. 0:20:03.080 --> 0:20:07.160 It is not unheard of that an assis director will 0:20:07.200 --> 0:20:10.840 hand somebody abrop and even a gun. It's not that 0:20:10.960 --> 0:20:15.800 is not unheard of. However, the protocol is that the 0:20:16.000 --> 0:20:18.520 armorer is supposed to be in the room, that the 0:20:18.680 --> 0:20:21.280 armorer is the one to be handling the gun in 0:20:21.440 --> 0:20:26.000 all circumstances. So this those two again the sloppiness of 0:20:26.040 --> 0:20:27.920 the set, and what I was getting at was that 0:20:28.200 --> 0:20:31.320 the there was a there was a fast, quick and 0:20:31.440 --> 0:20:33.560 dirty sense of this is going to get done in 0:20:33.560 --> 0:20:37.800 this film, and it didn't matter rules, regulations, didn't matter 0:20:37.880 --> 0:20:41.280 about safety. And I say this because there was a 0:20:41.320 --> 0:20:46.600 situation on the set of Rest where the crew was 0:20:46.680 --> 0:20:50.520 being mistreated and they felt that this that that the 0:20:51.040 --> 0:20:54.760 UH set was unsafe, that the safe circumstances was unsafe. 0:20:54.840 --> 0:20:56.639 Why do I say this, First of all, somebody who 0:20:56.640 --> 0:20:58.760 wrote a text saying that two guns had gone off 0:20:59.640 --> 0:21:04.200 to the two guns had gone off prop guns at 0:21:04.200 --> 0:21:07.000 some point and they have felt that things were unsafe. 0:21:07.000 --> 0:21:10.040 This is not on set. It's in and around the set, okay, 0:21:10.080 --> 0:21:13.720 behind the scenes. That text is there, that email is there. 0:21:13.760 --> 0:21:17.040 We saw it early on before the trial started. There's 0:21:17.080 --> 0:21:23.320 another issue here. The crew, a Union crew on this 0:21:23.480 --> 0:21:26.760 set were from Albuquerque. Now Santa Fe is about fifty 0:21:26.760 --> 0:21:29.120 miles from Albuquerque, I know it well, well know both 0:21:29.200 --> 0:21:33.919 cities well. They were originally contracted to do twelve to 0:21:34.000 --> 0:21:38.320 thirteen hour days and be housed in a hotel in 0:21:38.480 --> 0:21:43.800 Santa Fe. However, when the films actually started rolling, that 0:21:43.960 --> 0:21:47.000 crew were told, oh no, we're not putting you up 0:21:47.040 --> 0:21:48.520 in a hotel. You got to drive back and forth 0:21:48.560 --> 0:21:51.679 from Albuquerque. And it turned out one crew member was 0:21:51.680 --> 0:21:54.480 sleeping in his car. Because if you work a twelve 0:21:54.480 --> 0:21:55.960 hour day, think of it. You're working from six in 0:21:56.000 --> 0:21:58.720 the morning till six at night, maybe seven. Now you 0:21:58.760 --> 0:22:01.479 go to drive fifty two miles I was home, and 0:22:01.520 --> 0:22:03.560 then turn around at five o'clock in the morning the 0:22:03.560 --> 0:22:07.840 next day and drive fifty two miles back. It's completely 0:22:07.960 --> 0:22:11.280 unsafe if you're doing this for weeks on end. And 0:22:11.480 --> 0:22:17.800 the crew was demanding, not only making complaints about unsafe 0:22:18.000 --> 0:22:20.640 things going on on the set, but also saying, we 0:22:20.680 --> 0:22:23.080 can't do this anymore. This isn't what we've bargained for, 0:22:23.400 --> 0:22:25.919 this isn't right. We're not being treated right. So then 0:22:25.960 --> 0:22:30.920 you walked off to the set Cheryl that morning October 0:22:30.960 --> 0:22:35.919 twenty first, okay, twenty twenty one, then walked off the 0:22:35.960 --> 0:22:39.359 set because of the unsafe practices. 0:22:39.840 --> 0:22:43.440 That's insane. And see, here's the thing that keeps going 0:22:43.480 --> 0:22:48.600 through my mind. In order for mister Holls to have 0:22:48.680 --> 0:22:52.920 a prop there to grab and again, y'all, I don't 0:22:52.960 --> 0:22:55.760 know nothing about movies, but I've heard people say that, 0:22:55.920 --> 0:22:59.240 like when they're working with dogs, there's only certain times 0:22:59.280 --> 0:23:01.480 a day. You've got to make sure they're not in 0:23:01.560 --> 0:23:03.439 the outdoor heat. You got to make sure they have 0:23:03.480 --> 0:23:05.359 food and water. You've got to make sure they've got 0:23:05.640 --> 0:23:08.640 plenty of time to rest, and you know, be walked 0:23:08.680 --> 0:23:11.680 and that sort of thing. The same for children, I've 0:23:11.680 --> 0:23:13.760 heard all this stuff. They've got to still go to school, 0:23:13.760 --> 0:23:15.960 they've got to do these things. You can't overwork them. 0:23:16.320 --> 0:23:19.679 They are allowed to have a parent there whatever. And 0:23:19.720 --> 0:23:22.720 as far as like even a dog handler, I thought 0:23:22.720 --> 0:23:25.360 they had to be right there with the animal, Well 0:23:25.400 --> 0:23:28.480 they do, okay, but there's not somebody there with a 0:23:28.480 --> 0:23:29.200 freaking gun. 0:23:29.640 --> 0:23:34.399 Well that's just it. So there you have it. Okay. 0:23:34.160 --> 0:23:40.320 So now going back to the chronology, here, the crew 0:23:40.359 --> 0:23:43.280 walks off the set and is replaced by a non 0:23:43.400 --> 0:23:47.119 union crew the same day that this shooting happens. So 0:23:47.200 --> 0:23:49.520 you have people that aren't really familiar with anybody that 0:23:49.600 --> 0:23:52.560