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Speaker 1: There Are No Girls on the Internet, as a production

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Speaker 1: of iHeartRadio and Unbossed Creative. I'm Bridget Todd and this

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Speaker 1: is There Are No Girls on the Internet. Welcome back

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Speaker 1: to There Are No Girls on the Internet, a podcast

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Speaker 1: where we explore the intersect and the technology, social media

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Speaker 1: and identity. And this is another installment of our weekly

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Speaker 1: news roundup where we dig into some of the stories

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Speaker 1: that you might have missed online so you don't have to.

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Speaker 1: I am so pleased to be joined by this week's

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Speaker 1: guest co host, el Joy Williams, President of the New

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Speaker 1: York NAACP and host of the Sunday Civic Show on

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Speaker 1: sirius XM.

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Speaker 2: El Joy.

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Speaker 1: Thank you so much for being here. I know it

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Speaker 1: is a weird, tough time.

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Speaker 3: That is an understatement, bridge, but thank you so much

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Speaker 3: for inviting me, for us to talk trash about what's

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Speaker 3: happening in the world.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean we were talking before we started recording.

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Speaker 1: Just it just feels like a lot like generally when

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Speaker 1: I do these episodes, I'm having a cocktail.

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Speaker 2: It's the end of a long Thursday.

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Speaker 1: I'm sort of looking back on the week, and this

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Speaker 1: I just it doesn't things don't feel good.

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Speaker 2: Things don't feel right, Like I'll give it to y'all straight.

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Speaker 1: It really feels like things have escalated quite quickly in

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Speaker 1: the wake of Charlie Kirk's murder. I will say I

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Speaker 1: have personally, I don't think I've ever seen anything quite

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Speaker 1: like this.

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Speaker 2: What what have you been sensing around this?

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Speaker 3: Well, I would say the same thing while I was

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Speaker 3: prepared for it, like you knew things were coming, and

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Speaker 3: but you don't know how things are going to be executed,

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Speaker 3: how people are going to take advantage of different moments

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Speaker 3: of different things, and really it is opportunistic in a

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Speaker 3: lot of spaces, and so On the one hand, I

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Speaker 3: feel like people are acting as if things are normal,

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Speaker 3: and I just want to go around and shake everyone.

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Speaker 2: I was at a dinner.

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Speaker 3: Where being honored in like the whole room. There's one

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Speaker 3: of those dinners where like nobody pays attention to your phone.

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Speaker 3: Everybody's just talking and networking and dealing, and like they

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Speaker 3: had Cheryl swoops up there getting an award and like

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Speaker 3: nobody was paying attention. I was like, what is happening?

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Speaker 3: When I got up there, I was like, for the

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Speaker 3: four or five people who are listening to me, This

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Speaker 3: is indicative of what's happening out in the world, where

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Speaker 3: there is a set of people who are just like, oh,

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Speaker 3: this is just you know, normal, and I'm going to

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Speaker 3: continue my deals and my networking and things of that nature.

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Speaker 3: And there's only a handful of people paying attention, and

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Speaker 3: you have to capture.

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Speaker 2: Those who those few who are paying attention.

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Speaker 3: We have to get rid of the moniker that we

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Speaker 3: need to get the masses and need to get everybody.

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Speaker 3: It's just like, no, just speak to the people that's

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Speaker 3: paying attention, builds and organize with them, and then eventually

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Speaker 3: that'll get larger and larger. So that's what it feels like.

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Speaker 3: It feels like you're trying to have some sense of normalcy,

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Speaker 3: particularly for me. I have kids and right so I

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Speaker 3: don't I can't walk around a house like the sky's falling,

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Speaker 3: but at the same time being able to clearly see

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Speaker 3: what's happening around you and develop plans to respond accordingly.

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Speaker 1: Spoken like a true organizer. This is why I'm glad

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Speaker 1: I have you on the show this week. I want

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Speaker 1: to ask you something that I hope is not too personal.

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Speaker 1: I don't have kids, my senses people that do have kids.

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Speaker 2: It kind of forces you to.

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Speaker 1: Stay tethered to some sense of hope, to some sense

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Speaker 1: that something better is on the horizon. I feel, you know,

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Speaker 1: not having children myself, but I have a lot of

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Speaker 1: young people in my life and nieces and nephews and

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Speaker 1: people that I young, people that I care about.

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Speaker 2: But there's something.

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Speaker 1: I think, there's something about being a parent in this

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Speaker 1: time where you kind of have to force yourself, no

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Speaker 1: matter how dark things seem, to think there's something better

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Speaker 1: on the horizon for my kid.

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Speaker 2: Do you do you ever get that sense? Absolutely?

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Speaker 3: There are all these obviously memes on TikTok and stuff

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Speaker 3: like that where there's like the mom having the nervous

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Speaker 3: breakdown and the kid comes and like gives them the

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Speaker 3: juice box to open for them, and there's just like, oh,

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Speaker 3: I open the juice box and then continue to slide

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Speaker 3: down the wall. So we experience that on a regular basis, right,

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Speaker 3: whether it's your own I mean, imagine coming home from

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Speaker 3: a hard day or like I said this, you know

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Speaker 3: past week has been you know, slammed me. I have

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Speaker 3: four kids, the youngest one being one years old, and

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Speaker 3: so when I'm laying on the couch and they come home,

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Speaker 3: they're jumping on top of me doing whatever. I can't

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Speaker 3: be like, don't be happy. You see what Trump is doing,

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Speaker 3: so DC like, you don't know what I mean. And

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Speaker 3: so it's how do you have the conversations the older

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Speaker 3: ones who are ten and sixteen, having conversations with them

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Speaker 3: because I don't want them to be completely disconnected from

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Speaker 3: what's happening in the world, and so talking to them

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Speaker 3: about the things that are happening in an appropriate manner

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Speaker 3: so that they're not walking around scared, but that also

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Speaker 3: they're aware. And then for me, as someone who's a

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Speaker 3: civics enthusiast, I always like to whether it's you know,

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Speaker 3: the adults who listen to the show I do Sunday Civics,

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Speaker 3: or even the young people I engage with. I give

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Speaker 3: them the hope that they have the power and the

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Speaker 3: ability to change things that they don't. You know, this

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Speaker 3: is not just stuff that's happening to you, but you

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Speaker 3: have an opportunity, and what tools do you have in

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Speaker 3: your toolbox to respond to what is happening around you.

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Speaker 2: That's so important and I think especially right now when

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Speaker 2: we're having conversations about young people and this feeling of

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Speaker 2: nihilism and feeling you know, which I understand. But I

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Speaker 2: think the anecdote to that is offering what you're offering

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Speaker 2: that you actually do have agency, you can make change. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: being raised by an organizer, I think you're probably raising

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Speaker 2: young folks who feel quite engaged and quite empowered to

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Speaker 2: make change in their communities.

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Speaker 3: Absolutely, And I have a ten year old who quite

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Speaker 3: offen in his organized and something something in a classroom

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Speaker 3: or something. Although she called me old today, so I'm

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Speaker 3: not gonna speak pop. Well, wasn't being born in the

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Speaker 3: early nineteen hundreds.

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Speaker 2: Oh my god?

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Speaker 1: Sometimes I will be so humbled, like kids will humble

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Speaker 1: you so quickly, it's it really is ridiculous. Absolutely, Well,

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Speaker 1: let's talk more about this, because even though I feel

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Speaker 1: like I've done I've done quite a bit of research,

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Speaker 1: and I still don't feel confident saying, you know, in

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Speaker 1: terms of what happened with Charlie Kirk, that we know

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Speaker 1: exactly a.

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Speaker 2: Clear motive, like don't. I don't think we're there yet.

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Speaker 1: But that has not stopped the Trump administration and their

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Speaker 1: allies from really using this to crack down on a

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Speaker 1: lot of free expression and speech. We talked about this

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Speaker 1: in our recent episode that I recorded the day that

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Speaker 1: Charlie Kirk was killed, but we've really seen it ramp

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Speaker 1: up since then. The Washington Post opinion columnist Karenatia was

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Speaker 1: fired for essentiallyvoing Kirk.

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Speaker 2: On social media.

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Speaker 1: Will actually hear from Karen Natia in her own words

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Speaker 1: and an upcoming episode, so stay tuned for that. It

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Speaker 1: does sound to me like they were kind of angling

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Speaker 1: to get her out of the Post ever since Amazon's

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Speaker 1: Jeff Bezos bought the paper and really announced it as

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Speaker 1: a much more kind of conservative, Trump friendly slant. But

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Speaker 1: so it sounds like since that change, they have been

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Speaker 1: sort of angling to get her out of the Post.

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Speaker 1: But since she was fired, there are no black columnists

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Speaker 1: at the Post.

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Speaker 2: She was the last one.

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Speaker 1: In a substack post, she wrote quote, as a columnist,

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Speaker 1: I used my voice to defend freedom and democracy, challenge power,

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Speaker 1: and reflect on culture and politics with honesty and conviction.

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Speaker 1: Now I am the one being silenced for doing my job.

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Speaker 1: On Blue Sky. In the aftermath of the horrific shootings

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Speaker 1: in Utah and Colorado, I condemned America's acceptance of political

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Speaker 1: violence and criticized its ritualized responses, the hollow, cliched calls

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Speaker 1: for thoughts and prayers, and this is not who we

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Speaker 1: are that normalize gun violence and absolve white perpetrators, especially

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Speaker 1: while nothing is done to curb deaths. I expressed sadness

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Speaker 1: and fear for America. My journalistic and moral values for

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Speaker 1: balance compelled me to condemn violence and murder without engaging

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Speaker 1: in an excessive false mourning for a man who routinely

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Speaker 1: attacked black women as a group, put academics in danger

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Speaker 1: by putting them on watch lists, claimed falsely that black

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Speaker 1: people were better off in the era of Jim Crow,

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Speaker 1: and said that the Civil Rights Act was a mistake,

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Speaker 1: and favorably reviewed a book that called liberals unhumans in

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Speaker 1: a sense. Deleted post, a user accused me of supporting

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Speaker 1: violence and fascism. I made clear that not performing over

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Speaker 1: the top grief for white men who espoused violence was

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Speaker 1: not the same as endorsing violence against them. My only

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Speaker 1: direct reference to Kirk was one post his own words

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Speaker 1: on the record, so that first of all her words,

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Speaker 1: I think, I think she's a hell of a writer,

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Speaker 1: but I think that bit is the substance of why

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Speaker 1: the post says that they fired her. So essentially, she

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Speaker 1: posted on Blue Sky a quote that she attributed to Kirk, quote,

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Speaker 1: black women do not have the brain to be taken seriously.

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Speaker 2: You have to go steal a white persons slot.

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Speaker 1: Now there is a small quibble here in that bit

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Speaker 1: when we actually played Kirk's an audio from Kirk's show

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Speaker 1: in our episode about Charlie Kirk. But the quibble is

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Speaker 1: that they're saying, oh, well, he was talking about a

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Speaker 1: handful of specific black women Michelle Obama, Joy Reid, then

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Speaker 1: Congresswoman Sheila Jackson Lee, Supreme Court Justice Katanji Brown Jackson,

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Speaker 1: like he was like naming specific women. So my senses

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Speaker 1: that in order to justify her firing, they're saying, oh, well,

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Speaker 1: she misquoted Kirk because she's making it sound like he

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Speaker 1: was talking about black women writ large. But really he

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Speaker 1: was talking about these specific black women, which, in my opinion,

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Speaker 1: I just don't I.

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Speaker 3: Think gets over small like small linguage, right, because it's

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Speaker 3: not as if this one individual statement was taken out

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Speaker 3: of context. There is a pattern in practice of this

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Speaker 3: person stating inflammatory things that are gear towards a particular people,

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Speaker 3: ethnic group, organizations, and things of that nature. So it's

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Speaker 3: not as if a journalist is sort of mischaracterizing this person,

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Speaker 3: but that it is part of the pattern and practice

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Speaker 3: of the rhetoric that they were doing on a daily basis.

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Speaker 3: And you know, I think for a large part, as

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Speaker 3: you mentioned, for a lot of things that are happening again,

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Speaker 3: I believe people are just taking the moments and the

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Speaker 3: opportunities right using it as an excuse. The reason why

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Speaker 3: I want to fire Lisa Cook is also because I

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Speaker 3: want control over the Federal Reserve Board. The reason why

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Speaker 3: you know, I want to fire all of these people

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Speaker 3: in particular agencies is because I want to take over

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Speaker 3: the money that is in there, and also your contracts,

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Speaker 3: private contracts to the people that I owe money to

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Speaker 3: for private prisons. So I think for a lot of it,

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Speaker 3: it is taking the opportunity and rolling people up right

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Speaker 3: to again, which we do very well in American history.

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Speaker 3: We do very well, particularly wealthy people. And I'm talking

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Speaker 3: about uber wealthy. I'm not talking about y'all with like

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Speaker 3: a million dollars, right, I'm talking to uber wealthy where

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Speaker 3: they point the finger at other people, right, they say, oh,

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Speaker 3: you can't afford a bread. You know why that is

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Speaker 3: is because of the people coming across the border. Oh

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Speaker 3: you can't get a job. That's because you know, you

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Speaker 3: have all of these people with visus coming over from

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Speaker 3: Sauth Korea. Right, So it continues to point the finger

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Speaker 3: that the issue that you are most pressed about, the

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Speaker 3: pocketbook issues that people keep saying that they point back

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Speaker 3: to the people as opposed to the folks who are

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Speaker 3: in power and making the decisions and continuing to make

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Speaker 3: the money. We've done that time and time again. When

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Speaker 3: blacks and whites after reconstruction are rebuilding cities and towns,

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Speaker 3: and you have poor white folks and poor black folks

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Speaker 3: coming together building in fighting back for workers' rights, voting rights,

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Speaker 3: and things of that nature, there is a split. They're

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Speaker 3: telling the poor white people. Well, we'll give you an

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Speaker 3: extra two dollars, we'll give you an extra five dollars.

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Speaker 3: You'll be in charge. You'll be management over these people. Right.

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Speaker 3: You can't view yourself as the same, you know, as

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Speaker 3: these black people who were formally enslaved goodness.

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Speaker 4: No.

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Speaker 2: Right, Then, fast.

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Speaker 3: Forward when people are organizing in the union movement and

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Speaker 3: there again telling white people who now we consider white,

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Speaker 3: but telling Irish people and Italians and others who were

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Speaker 3: organizing again with black people, with Asian people, with Mexican people,

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Speaker 3: for workers' rights and things of that nature, and saying,

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Speaker 3: you don't want to be like them, you want to

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Speaker 3: be white over here.

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Speaker 1: Right.

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Speaker 3: So we have a pattern in practice in this country

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Speaker 3: when I say we right of coring to the wealthy

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Speaker 3: people and believing their argument on who's responsible for our

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Speaker 3: present condition, and it's a distraction from the peace people

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Speaker 3: who continue to make money.

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Speaker 1: Absolutely fucking correct, and it's so effective. Sometimes I can't

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Speaker 1: believe how effective it is. I can't believe that this

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Speaker 1: that this old. I mean, I guess that's why it's

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Speaker 1: an old, tried and true tactic. I can't believe that

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Speaker 1: here we are in twenty twenty five that same thing

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Speaker 1: that was being used to divide us decades ago is

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Speaker 1: still effective. I cannot believe that it's still something that

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Speaker 1: we have to contend with. But I guess that's why

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Speaker 1: it's an old testnut is because it works, right, It.

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Speaker 3: Is because of an unhealed wound of race and slavery

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Speaker 3: and not really you know, just think about here in

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Speaker 3: the state of New York, where we're dealing with, you know,

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Speaker 3: a mayor's race and a governor in New York State,

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Speaker 3: who seemingly are in the same tent. You'll have to

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Speaker 3: bring me back and have a whole nother you know,

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Speaker 3: listen to my tirade on why there shouldn't be just

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Speaker 3: two parties because there is no possible way that AOC

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Speaker 3: and Hillary Clinton should be in the same political party.

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Speaker 2: But I digress.

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Speaker 3: But having the conversation even in New York about raising

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Speaker 3: taxes on people that are making six hundred seven hundred

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Speaker 3: million dollars right, people are like, no, I can't raise taxes.

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Speaker 3: All the wealthy people will leave. So my first reaction

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Speaker 3: is like, okay, bye, they have the wherewithal the goal

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Speaker 3: wherever they need to go to continue to make money

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Speaker 3: and you know, feed their families and things of that nature.

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Speaker 3: But those of us right who are working class, barely

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Speaker 3: making it, a lot of people didn't leave because they

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Speaker 3: have no resources in things to leave to go to

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Speaker 3: a different to go to a different place. So my

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Speaker 3: first reaction is by the second thing is a lot

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Speaker 3: of them probably already take advantage of shelling their money

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Speaker 3: around and things like that, so they play less taxes

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Speaker 3: to begin with, and so instead of cutting the programs

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Speaker 3: that are going to be much needed, particularly in this

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Speaker 3: time where the federal government is cutting all different departments

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Speaker 3: from healthcare, which is a huge concern for us here

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Speaker 3: in the state of New York, education, even snap benefits

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Speaker 3: and all of those things. Just then say to the

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Speaker 3: people that are hanging on, who need the affordability to

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Speaker 3: begin with, who need the relief to begin with, to say, oh, well,

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Speaker 3: we're getting less money, so you're gonna have to do

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Speaker 3: more with less. Well, ni motherfucker's over here with like

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Speaker 3: millions of dollars and they're just.

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Speaker 2: Like, oh, sorry for you must be hard, be.

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Speaker 3: Hard, right, I'm going to come like it doesn't make

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Speaker 3: any sense. And particularly while it's a small percentage a

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Speaker 3: majority of people that are in because I don't want

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Speaker 3: to castigate all wealthy people like this, because some of

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Speaker 3: there are a lot of people is just like, yeah,

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Speaker 3: I'll pay more so that I can have a functioning

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Speaker 3: infrastructure in this state and in this city to continue

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Speaker 3: to make the money that I need to make, because

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Speaker 3: they have understood that it's not about, you know, putting

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Speaker 3: money in a system that doesn't get back, is putting

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Speaker 3: money in the system so that we can all benefit. Right,

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Speaker 3: I put money and I pay taxes so that I

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Speaker 3: can have the infrastructure of roads. I put money and

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Speaker 3: I put taxes in so that I can have the

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Speaker 3: infrastructure of public schools. I put money in and I

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Speaker 3: pay my taxes so that I can have health care.

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Speaker 3: And then in the instance where okay, I have health

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Speaker 3: care and I can afford it, you can take care

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Speaker 3: of other people who may need it, which benefits us all.

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Speaker 3: And so people thinking that if we do something over

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Speaker 3: here that it literally takes something out of your pocket again,

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Speaker 3: is a story and a narrative that we have been

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Speaker 3: led to believe.

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Speaker 2: And it's a lie. It's absolutely a lie.

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Speaker 1: And what you just described is community is a society.

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Speaker 1: It's how we all live together. But there are people

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Speaker 1: that hear what you just described and think it's awful,

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Speaker 1: and then it's just so funny to me.

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Speaker 2: How I mean, this is such a tangent.

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Speaker 1: But you know, hearing about how the Trump administration is

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Speaker 1: thinking about bailing out farmers.

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Speaker 2: Socialism, Yes, who's the aid?

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Speaker 1: Is socialism and evil and horrible? And whose aid is? Oh, well,

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Speaker 1: that's just American, that's a bailout, right, Like who decides

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Speaker 1: we believe in socialism.

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Speaker 3: We believe in socialism for banks, We believe in socialism

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Speaker 3: for farmers. We believe in socialism for private prisons, right

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Speaker 3: like we believe in socialism when it's making money for

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Speaker 3: other people.

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Speaker 2: You know. The other thing I would say is this.

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Speaker 3: Nature of this question. If you're talking to people who,

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Speaker 3: although you don't see them much anymore, the people that

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Speaker 3: have the don't Tread on Me T shirts.

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Speaker 2: I wonder where they went.

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Speaker 3: I'm so curious, just like did they stop printing them?

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Speaker 3: Is it like rush order tees and custom Inc? Not

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Speaker 3: printing the T shirts anymore? But they often talk about

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Speaker 3: like the federal government being too big. And then this

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Speaker 3: is also where me as a nerd comes in, right

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Speaker 3: because I'm like, compare the size of the federal government

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Speaker 3: and the population with the founding of this country too. Now, yes,

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Speaker 3: the federal government has to be bigger because we got

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Speaker 3: more motherfucking people, Like so there's more people to.

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Speaker 4: Take care of.

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Speaker 2: Like that, Like it's just common sense.

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Speaker 3: We have more people, Oh so we need more money

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Speaker 3: in order to we actually expanded because of the founder

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Speaker 3: of the country. We didn't have as much physical right

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Speaker 3: place that we had in the founder of the country.

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Speaker 3: So going all through the territories and building infrastructure and

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Speaker 3: schools and roads and healthcare infrastructure and all that kind

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Speaker 3: of stuff takes more money because we got more people

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Speaker 3: and we actually have more land to take care of.

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Speaker 1: So it's common sense. Common sense is not so common anymore.

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Speaker 1: That is really how I'm feeling.

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Speaker 4: Let's take a quick break at our back.

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Speaker 1: So we're talking about all of these different crackdowns on

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Speaker 1: free speech in the wake of Charlie Kirk's murder, even

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Speaker 1: though it kind of seems like none of this is

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Speaker 1: actually about Kirk. It's an excuse, right like that, like

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Speaker 1: this is the reason that they're using to do what

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Speaker 1: they've always wanted to do.

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Speaker 3: Unfortunately, I think people take and I think this is

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Speaker 3: the nature of politics in general. People use different moments

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Speaker 3: to as an opportunity. Oh, we have the opportunity to

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Speaker 3: spread this message a little bit wider, to engage, to organize,

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Speaker 3: and it's done to Faressley, and it's done from an

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Speaker 3: organizing perspective as well. Just think about how we as

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Speaker 3: organizers use moments, right. You know, there was during the

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Speaker 3: George Floyd.

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Speaker 2: Eruption.

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Speaker 3: People took the moment to you know, address legislation that

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Speaker 3: have been pending for some time, you know, the movements

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Speaker 3: that you know we're dying. And now you've got new people,

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Speaker 3: you know, who are aware and energized and educated, and

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Speaker 3: so you're going to fill them in on that. And

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Speaker 3: so I think what is difficult, though, what I call

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Speaker 3: the nefarious thing is taken advantage of someone losing their life.

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Speaker 2: Now I don't.

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Speaker 3: Believe like I'm personally, you know, because I know that

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Speaker 3: they're seeking the death penalty for this person or whatever.

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Speaker 3: You know, my faith doesn't allow me, you know, my

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Speaker 3: faith tells me that we are not embody to take

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Speaker 3: anybody's life, right, and so, you know, there are ways

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Speaker 3: we can't be the most advanced creatures in society and

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Speaker 3: still not figure out a way to punish people for

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Speaker 3: these things, and to take advantage of this moment when

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Speaker 3: someone lost their life, no matter how you know, vile

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Speaker 3: his rhetoric and everything may be. I don't wish people

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Speaker 3: to die, you know what I mean, I don't in

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Speaker 3: particularly not in the manner in which we are. And

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Speaker 3: so instead of taking that moment, instead of taking that

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Speaker 3: moment to address the pervasive violence, and particularly gun violence

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Speaker 3: in our country, right that we use that as an

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Speaker 3: opportunity for government. Because here's what's happening. Government is actually

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Speaker 3: limiting speech, which is the very thing that the Constitution says,

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Speaker 3: me telling you bridget you can't say that, you know,

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Speaker 3: or something like that, Like, that's not what the constitution

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Speaker 3: it says. It's saying the government cannot abridge your free

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Speaker 3: speech right. And so the government, federal agencies, federal staff

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Speaker 3: and appointed you know, agency directors and things of that nature,

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Speaker 3: telling people that you can't say that or things of

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Speaker 3: that nature is the very definition of the federal government

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Speaker 3: limiting the speech. Now we also say what you can

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Speaker 3: say the thing, it doesn't prevent the repercussions you know

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Speaker 3: that you may experience. So sure you can me didn't work,

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Speaker 3: might get pushed.

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Speaker 1: In a face like that's the reconvession you got.

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Speaker 3: Like from that standpoint, you know what I mean. So

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Speaker 3: I think, you know, again, I think the taking of

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Speaker 3: opportunity and not addressing the root cause, right, because again

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Speaker 3: people are taking advantage or taking the opportunity to further

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Speaker 3: their old narratives rather than using the opportunity to address

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Speaker 3: what is really the culprit, which is the pervasive gun

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Speaker 3: violence in our communities.

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Speaker 1: I want to talk about that because when I saw

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Speaker 1: that Karen was getting fired from the post, I was like, oh, well,

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Speaker 1: black women, we are so often the sort of canaries

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Speaker 1: in a coal mine. You know, we've seen black women

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Speaker 1: after a black women being targeted and fired by the

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Speaker 1: Trump administration, black women like Joy Reid and Jameel Hill

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Speaker 1: being fired from media jobs, are pushed out, you know,

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Speaker 1: a black woman is fired or silenced or or centered

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Speaker 1: off the internet, and then it's like crickets and then

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Speaker 1: it's like, Okay, no one's gonna do anything.

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Speaker 3: Oh Jimmy cam was fired and the people got statements

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Speaker 3: in like exactly, So let's talk about that.

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Speaker 1: So I've seen a lot of reporting suggesting that Kimmel

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Speaker 1: was taken off the air because of his comments about Kirk,

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Speaker 1: But to me, that's not even totally correct. I will

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Speaker 1: play you the actual thing that he said about Kirk.

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Speaker 5: We hit some new lows over the weekend with the

438
00:23:21,560 --> 00:23:25,359
Speaker 5: Magga Gang desperately trying to characterize this kid who murdered

439
00:23:25,440 --> 00:23:27,840
Speaker 5: Charlie Kirk as anything other than one of them and

440
00:23:28,160 --> 00:23:31,240
Speaker 5: everything they can to score political points from it.

441
00:23:31,720 --> 00:23:35,400
Speaker 1: So, to me, the way that this has been reported

442
00:23:35,520 --> 00:23:38,560
Speaker 1: is like, oh, he said horrible things about Charlie Kirk.

443
00:23:38,600 --> 00:23:42,000
Speaker 1: He wasn't being respectful. He's actually talking about exactly what

444
00:23:42,080 --> 00:23:44,399
Speaker 1: you were talking about. He's talking about a critique about

445
00:23:44,400 --> 00:23:48,680
Speaker 1: how people are using Charlie Kirk's murder to further their

446
00:23:48,720 --> 00:23:52,120
Speaker 1: own narrative, to push their own agenda, to exploit. Essentially,

447
00:23:52,160 --> 00:23:54,760
Speaker 1: that's what he's talking about. And according to Rolling Stone,

448
00:23:54,880 --> 00:23:58,360
Speaker 1: multiple ABC executives felt that Kimmel had not even actually

449
00:23:58,359 --> 00:24:00,960
Speaker 1: said anything that was over the line, acording to two sources,

450
00:24:01,040 --> 00:24:05,159
Speaker 1: but that the threat of Trump administration retaliation really loomed large,

451
00:24:05,200 --> 00:24:09,159
Speaker 1: and this is like mobster government ship right like the

452
00:24:09,280 --> 00:24:13,160
Speaker 1: FCC share. Brendan Carr suggested that ABC's broadcast license would

453
00:24:13,160 --> 00:24:15,399
Speaker 1: be at risk because of these comments, and just like

454
00:24:15,440 --> 00:24:17,840
Speaker 1: we talked about it in an earlier episode about CBS,

455
00:24:17,920 --> 00:24:21,439
Speaker 1: it really seems like this is more about ABC's upcoming merger,

456
00:24:21,760 --> 00:24:24,399
Speaker 1: which they will need FCC approval to do so. Just

457
00:24:24,440 --> 00:24:28,200
Speaker 1: before ABC's announcement about Jimmy Kimmel, Nextstar Media Group said

458
00:24:28,240 --> 00:24:30,760
Speaker 1: that it's stations affiliated with ABC, We're going to be

459
00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:33,840
Speaker 1: preempting Kimmel's show for the foreseeable future because of his

460
00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:36,040
Speaker 1: statements around Kirk and MAGA.

461
00:24:36,160 --> 00:24:37,760
Speaker 2: So just a little bit of context.

462
00:24:37,920 --> 00:24:41,320
Speaker 1: Nextstar is seeking FCC approval for its planned six point

463
00:24:41,359 --> 00:24:44,480
Speaker 1: two billion dollar merger with Tanga. If you've not heard

464
00:24:44,480 --> 00:24:46,919
Speaker 1: of those companies before, I also had not heard them before.

465
00:24:46,960 --> 00:24:51,600
Speaker 1: But they basically are these hugely influential media companies that

466
00:24:51,720 --> 00:24:55,119
Speaker 1: own hundreds of local TV stations and news outlets across

467
00:24:55,160 --> 00:24:57,679
Speaker 1: the country, and they basically decide what is on television

468
00:24:57,720 --> 00:25:00,960
Speaker 1: for hundreds of millions of Americans, and they're clearly willing

469
00:25:01,000 --> 00:25:04,119
Speaker 1: to make those decisions based on what Trump wants Americans

470
00:25:04,160 --> 00:25:07,840
Speaker 1: to watch. And so Trump signaled that targeting ABC and

471
00:25:07,960 --> 00:25:10,639
Speaker 1: Kimmel is far from the end. Like Trump said that

472
00:25:10,680 --> 00:25:13,520
Speaker 1: he wants the federal government to revoke the licenses of

473
00:25:13,560 --> 00:25:17,480
Speaker 1: any other broadcast television networks that are quote against him.

474
00:25:17,800 --> 00:25:20,520
Speaker 1: And so I think it's exactly what you said that.

475
00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:23,080
Speaker 1: I don't even think this is about Kirk. I think

476
00:25:23,080 --> 00:25:27,439
Speaker 1: this is about mobster tactics. I'm talking mobster tactics in

477
00:25:27,480 --> 00:25:30,560
Speaker 1: the sense that you have FCC Chairman car going on

478
00:25:30,560 --> 00:25:34,360
Speaker 1: a podcast before Kimmel was fired and saying, well, ABC

479
00:25:34,400 --> 00:25:37,080
Speaker 1: can either remove Kimmel the hard way or the easy

480
00:25:37,119 --> 00:25:41,359
Speaker 1: way to exert control and pressure over these companies. And

481
00:25:41,400 --> 00:25:44,000
Speaker 1: these companies are more than happy to roll over and

482
00:25:44,040 --> 00:25:45,840
Speaker 1: bend the knee and kiss the ring to Trump so

483
00:25:45,880 --> 00:25:49,080
Speaker 1: that it does not mess up their you know, plan,

484
00:25:49,280 --> 00:25:52,320
Speaker 1: their their merger plans to to sort of consolidate our

485
00:25:52,400 --> 00:25:53,120
Speaker 1: media system.

486
00:25:53,600 --> 00:25:59,720
Speaker 3: Well, this is also the reason that we UH originally

487
00:26:00,880 --> 00:26:04,040
Speaker 3: push forth the movement. And you just gave me an

488
00:26:04,040 --> 00:26:07,679
Speaker 3: idea to talk about this for a future show on

489
00:26:07,960 --> 00:26:13,879
Speaker 3: anti trust laws. Because if you have these major you know,

490
00:26:13,960 --> 00:26:17,040
Speaker 3: companies that are coming together, they're merging and all that stuff,

491
00:26:17,040 --> 00:26:22,760
Speaker 3: and they control basically the whole industry, there is very

492
00:26:22,800 --> 00:26:28,720
Speaker 3: limited competition, there's limited diversity in voices, and it's bad

493
00:26:28,880 --> 00:26:32,119
Speaker 3: for our economy and for our society.

494
00:26:32,720 --> 00:26:34,560
Speaker 2: And you know, to.

495
00:26:36,119 --> 00:26:40,160
Speaker 3: A lot of these companies, you know, this person, the

496
00:26:40,160 --> 00:26:42,520
Speaker 3: president is not even asking them or telling them do

497
00:26:42,640 --> 00:26:45,040
Speaker 3: stuff for a lot of people. Because we saw this,

498
00:26:45,200 --> 00:26:48,240
Speaker 3: even with the decision that was very narrow on diversity,

499
00:26:48,280 --> 00:26:52,520
Speaker 3: equity and inclusion at colleges, we begin to see colleges

500
00:26:52,560 --> 00:26:54,160
Speaker 3: instead We're like, well, i don't want to be out

501
00:26:54,160 --> 00:26:56,440
Speaker 3: of favor with the current administration, so I'm going to

502
00:26:56,520 --> 00:26:58,680
Speaker 3: do this right. So for a lot of the things

503
00:26:58,680 --> 00:27:01,760
Speaker 3: that are happening. It's not is this somebody is asking

504
00:27:02,240 --> 00:27:03,800
Speaker 3: directly asking them to doing.

505
00:27:04,160 --> 00:27:05,679
Speaker 2: They're willingly doing it.

506
00:27:05,560 --> 00:27:10,560
Speaker 3: To be in favor, right because they see how sort

507
00:27:10,560 --> 00:27:15,199
Speaker 3: of the mob sort of comes together and decide, you know,

508
00:27:15,280 --> 00:27:20,000
Speaker 3: this is the evil entity, this is who is preventing

509
00:27:20,240 --> 00:27:25,480
Speaker 3: America from being great. Meanwhile, your bread is still, the

510
00:27:25,560 --> 00:27:29,119
Speaker 3: fruit is still, the groceries are still you know.

511
00:27:29,960 --> 00:27:34,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean this is my and I as an organizer,

512
00:27:34,320 --> 00:27:37,280
Speaker 1: I'm very curious for your thoughts. So it has not

513
00:27:37,640 --> 00:27:39,679
Speaker 1: stopped with Kimmel. And again I just want to make

514
00:27:39,720 --> 00:27:42,720
Speaker 1: it clear like I am no bit, like I'm Jenny.

515
00:27:42,760 --> 00:27:44,760
Speaker 2: Kimmel will be fine. This is not about his show,

516
00:27:44,760 --> 00:27:46,480
Speaker 2: This is not about him. He will be fine.

517
00:27:46,560 --> 00:27:48,840
Speaker 1: But I think that the fact that we've spent so

518
00:27:49,080 --> 00:27:51,879
Speaker 1: much time talking about free speech, free speech, free speech,

519
00:27:52,000 --> 00:27:53,359
Speaker 1: and when we talked about it in the in the

520
00:27:53,359 --> 00:27:56,439
Speaker 1: context of like social media platforms, it's like, well, a

521
00:27:56,440 --> 00:27:59,120
Speaker 1: private social media platform kicking somebody off is.

522
00:27:59,080 --> 00:28:02,120
Speaker 2: Not really a free speech because they're not the government.

523
00:28:02,160 --> 00:28:05,280
Speaker 1: But now we have the government, as you said, not

524
00:28:05,440 --> 00:28:10,280
Speaker 1: really asking or demanding, but making it clear that, oh,

525
00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:14,399
Speaker 1: we would like this to happen, and great television merger

526
00:28:14,480 --> 00:28:15,440
Speaker 1: deal you have here.

527
00:28:15,480 --> 00:28:17,919
Speaker 2: Wouldn't it be a shame if or something were to

528
00:28:18,080 --> 00:28:19,160
Speaker 2: happen to it?

529
00:28:20,040 --> 00:28:22,679
Speaker 1: You know, those are the tactics and it again, I

530
00:28:22,720 --> 00:28:24,840
Speaker 1: don't think it's about Kirk because now they are going

531
00:28:24,880 --> 00:28:28,640
Speaker 1: after shows that have nothing. They had nothing remotely even

532
00:28:28,720 --> 00:28:30,840
Speaker 1: negative to say about Kirk. Not that Kimmel did either,

533
00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:33,280
Speaker 1: but you know what I mean. Seth Myers on his

534
00:28:33,400 --> 00:28:36,359
Speaker 1: show did a whole special segment in the wake of

535
00:28:36,440 --> 00:28:39,440
Speaker 1: Kirk where he talked about how horrible political violence is,

536
00:28:39,520 --> 00:28:43,200
Speaker 1: like exactly the kind of like respectful, you know, tone

537
00:28:43,240 --> 00:28:45,920
Speaker 1: that you would expect, and that didn't keep from from

538
00:28:45,960 --> 00:28:49,200
Speaker 1: today saying, oh, I want Seth Myers and Jimmy Fallon

539
00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:51,320
Speaker 1: take it off the air too, because he does doesn't

540
00:28:51,360 --> 00:28:52,400
Speaker 1: like these people, He just doesn't.

541
00:28:52,440 --> 00:28:54,360
Speaker 2: He doesn't want these shows on the air.

542
00:28:54,400 --> 00:28:57,360
Speaker 1: And so the idea that this is about Kirk is

543
00:28:57,440 --> 00:29:00,160
Speaker 1: just you can see that that's not true. They're talking

544
00:29:00,200 --> 00:29:02,160
Speaker 1: about taking the view off of the air. You know

545
00:29:02,680 --> 00:29:05,120
Speaker 1: a little bit of backstory here in broadcasting, they have

546
00:29:05,200 --> 00:29:08,840
Speaker 1: that rule, the equal opportunity rule, where broadcasters who feature

547
00:29:08,840 --> 00:29:11,400
Speaker 1: a political candidate on their show have to give equal

548
00:29:11,440 --> 00:29:14,560
Speaker 1: time to their rivals upon request, but certain types of

549
00:29:14,560 --> 00:29:19,000
Speaker 1: shows are exempt. Newscasts, interview programs, certain documentaries, things like that,

550
00:29:19,280 --> 00:29:23,160
Speaker 1: and late night talk shows are exempt. So just today,

551
00:29:23,720 --> 00:29:26,800
Speaker 1: FCC Chairman Brendan Carr wan a podcast and said, I'm

552
00:29:26,840 --> 00:29:29,000
Speaker 1: not so sure that the View is a bona fide

553
00:29:29,000 --> 00:29:31,560
Speaker 1: news program, and I think we should investigate and maybe

554
00:29:31,600 --> 00:29:34,760
Speaker 1: shut that show down so one we can see that

555
00:29:34,800 --> 00:29:37,840
Speaker 1: this is not about Charlie Kirk, but exactly what you said,

556
00:29:38,080 --> 00:29:41,880
Speaker 1: I'm I'm I this might sound pollyannish, but I think

557
00:29:41,920 --> 00:29:46,160
Speaker 1: that only this kind of stuff, I think is only

558
00:29:46,240 --> 00:29:50,560
Speaker 1: popular with the like most loyal of the loyal MAGA types.

559
00:29:50,880 --> 00:29:54,240
Speaker 1: We've already seen people like Bari Weiss and Tucker Carlson

560
00:29:54,640 --> 00:29:56,920
Speaker 1: kind of say like, hey, these are attacks on free speech.

561
00:29:57,240 --> 00:29:59,680
Speaker 1: I personally wonder if the Trump administration is sort of

562
00:29:59,680 --> 00:30:03,040
Speaker 1: over playing their hand here, because most people that I

563
00:30:03,120 --> 00:30:06,080
Speaker 1: know are worried about exactly what you said.

564
00:30:06,120 --> 00:30:07,080
Speaker 2: Grocery prices.

565
00:30:07,360 --> 00:30:09,680
Speaker 1: Everything is like people who say, oh, I voted for

566
00:30:09,720 --> 00:30:12,200
Speaker 1: the price of eggs, I voted for the price of groceries. Well,

567
00:30:12,240 --> 00:30:14,080
Speaker 1: your groceries are twice as expensive right now. Are you

568
00:30:14,120 --> 00:30:16,040
Speaker 1: really worried about what they're saying? On the view, Are

569
00:30:16,040 --> 00:30:18,680
Speaker 1: you really worried about what they're saying on what Jimmy

570
00:30:18,760 --> 00:30:22,320
Speaker 1: fucking Fallon has to say, Like I, maybe this is

571
00:30:22,360 --> 00:30:25,320
Speaker 1: being too optimistic. I genuinely think this is going to

572
00:30:25,360 --> 00:30:29,040
Speaker 1: backfire because I don't think that anybody but the most

573
00:30:29,240 --> 00:30:32,600
Speaker 1: loyal magotypes are seeing this and thinking, Oh, this is great,

574
00:30:32,640 --> 00:30:34,200
Speaker 1: this is what I really care about right now.

575
00:30:34,440 --> 00:30:38,920
Speaker 3: Well, I share your optimism that I hope so. But

576
00:30:39,000 --> 00:30:41,800
Speaker 3: here's something that I know I've shared previously. You know,

577
00:30:42,040 --> 00:30:44,280
Speaker 3: you may have heard people talk about this in terms

578
00:30:44,320 --> 00:30:49,200
Speaker 3: of population, in terms of people who believe in democracy,

579
00:30:49,400 --> 00:30:52,440
Speaker 3: believe in a prosperous future. There are more people that

580
00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:56,320
Speaker 3: believe in that than not believe in the retrenchment to

581
00:30:56,400 --> 00:30:59,680
Speaker 3: an America of a bygone era. And if you have

582
00:30:59,840 --> 00:31:04,920
Speaker 3: the diminishing population, there are two things you have to do. One,

583
00:31:05,040 --> 00:31:08,480
Speaker 3: you have to engage with young people in high schools

584
00:31:08,520 --> 00:31:12,200
Speaker 3: and colleges to build another generation or two that will

585
00:31:12,240 --> 00:31:14,720
Speaker 3: come behind the people that are already shrinking.

586
00:31:15,280 --> 00:31:15,640
Speaker 2: I e.

587
00:31:15,920 --> 00:31:19,800
Speaker 3: Something like a talking point to USA. The second thing

588
00:31:20,000 --> 00:31:22,400
Speaker 3: is the base that you do have. You have to

589
00:31:22,480 --> 00:31:25,280
Speaker 3: keep them riled up and engage so that they are

590
00:31:25,360 --> 00:31:30,000
Speaker 3: always doing something engaged, talking turning out voting doing whatever right.

591
00:31:30,360 --> 00:31:35,360
Speaker 3: Meanwhile suppressing in a very deliberate way, making people feel

592
00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:37,880
Speaker 3: as your vote is not going to matter. And even

593
00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:41,240
Speaker 3: if you do vote, I'm going to create barriers like gerrymandering.

594
00:31:41,560 --> 00:31:45,920
Speaker 3: I'm going to change on the state level ID laws

595
00:31:45,960 --> 00:31:49,000
Speaker 3: and who's eligible to vote, making it difficult. So it's

596
00:31:49,000 --> 00:31:53,040
Speaker 3: a very structured piece. And so what I always argue,

597
00:31:53,800 --> 00:31:57,160
Speaker 3: at least for my strategy, I don't spend a lot

598
00:31:57,280 --> 00:32:01,000
Speaker 3: of time, you know, particularly online or in other places,

599
00:32:01,120 --> 00:32:03,880
Speaker 3: trying to convince people who have already made a decision

600
00:32:04,280 --> 00:32:07,360
Speaker 3: and who have already told people to kiss the ass. Right,

601
00:32:07,800 --> 00:32:11,320
Speaker 3: I'm not organizing with you, right, And so even though

602
00:32:11,360 --> 00:32:15,000
Speaker 3: I vote Democrat now and all, you know, every four

603
00:32:15,120 --> 00:32:18,960
Speaker 3: years the larger party wants to, you know, wove back

604
00:32:19,040 --> 00:32:22,880
Speaker 3: a certain voter of a certain persuasion, and I'm like,

605
00:32:22,960 --> 00:32:23,920
Speaker 3: I'm not organizing.

606
00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:24,200
Speaker 2: There.

607
00:32:24,440 --> 00:32:27,840
Speaker 3: There's a limit, there's a ceiling, right Whereas if we

608
00:32:27,920 --> 00:32:31,400
Speaker 3: go to the places that we're not talking to, that

609
00:32:31,480 --> 00:32:35,520
Speaker 3: we're not engaging, that we're not keeping up to date

610
00:32:35,600 --> 00:32:37,800
Speaker 3: and hearing from them and making sure that they are

611
00:32:37,840 --> 00:32:40,920
Speaker 3: involved in what's happening, you know, there is no ceiling

612
00:32:40,920 --> 00:32:43,520
Speaker 3: there because there's a greater population there.

613
00:32:43,880 --> 00:32:45,760
Speaker 2: And so what I always.

614
00:32:45,400 --> 00:32:49,400
Speaker 3: Try to tell organizers is, don't spend so much of

615
00:32:49,440 --> 00:32:53,200
Speaker 3: your time combating what the other side is doing.

616
00:32:53,440 --> 00:32:56,440
Speaker 2: And I don't mean like not litigating, agitating and all

617
00:32:56,480 --> 00:32:56,880
Speaker 2: that stuff.

618
00:32:56,960 --> 00:32:59,680
Speaker 3: I mean you, you know, playing whack a mole on

619
00:32:59,680 --> 00:33:05,200
Speaker 3: social media, when you can be talking and engaging in

620
00:33:05,200 --> 00:33:09,280
Speaker 3: your community, when you can be building generations on college

621
00:33:09,320 --> 00:33:13,560
Speaker 3: campuses and high schools and things of that nature, helps

622
00:33:13,640 --> 00:33:17,040
Speaker 3: build the movement that we need. And right now, I

623
00:33:17,040 --> 00:33:19,680
Speaker 3: feel like a lot of people because we're stuck right.

624
00:33:19,760 --> 00:33:23,880
Speaker 3: And it's easy because you see all of this incoming

625
00:33:24,440 --> 00:33:29,720
Speaker 3: and you want to defend right. And there is a strategy,

626
00:33:29,720 --> 00:33:33,240
Speaker 3: a defense strategy on the show. Right now, I'm doing

627
00:33:33,280 --> 00:33:36,480
Speaker 3: what I call this porch Light series, And just imagine

628
00:33:36,560 --> 00:33:39,080
Speaker 3: you're leaving the light, the porch light on for democracy

629
00:33:39,120 --> 00:33:42,840
Speaker 3: and imagining what we want the next iteration of democracy

630
00:33:42,920 --> 00:33:45,760
Speaker 3: to be because this is falling right, and so we

631
00:33:45,880 --> 00:33:48,600
Speaker 3: have the power bridget. You have the power to remake

632
00:33:49,080 --> 00:33:52,040
Speaker 3: what our future democracy will look like. And so I

633
00:33:52,160 --> 00:33:56,880
Speaker 3: need you. While yes, we're filing lawsuits on free speech,

634
00:33:56,960 --> 00:33:59,560
Speaker 3: while we're pushing back on Jerrymander, while we're doing all

635
00:33:59,560 --> 00:34:01,920
Speaker 3: of that stuff, I also need you to imagine what

636
00:34:02,040 --> 00:34:04,560
Speaker 3: kind of society we need in the future and then

637
00:34:04,680 --> 00:34:06,360
Speaker 3: be prepared to build towards that.

638
00:34:06,800 --> 00:34:10,320
Speaker 2: And so imagine holding the shield. And when you see

639
00:34:10,480 --> 00:34:11,240
Speaker 2: some of those.

640
00:34:11,040 --> 00:34:15,560
Speaker 3: Old movies about the guard that's sent out in the

641
00:34:15,600 --> 00:34:18,160
Speaker 3: front and they have those big shields that are you know,

642
00:34:18,200 --> 00:34:21,440
Speaker 3: from the ground to the form. They're defending the folks

643
00:34:21,480 --> 00:34:25,239
Speaker 3: behind them, but they're also pushing forward, right, And so

644
00:34:25,320 --> 00:34:28,840
Speaker 3: we need to defend, yes, and particularly defend what's coming

645
00:34:28,880 --> 00:34:32,600
Speaker 3: behind us, so that they have a clear path to

646
00:34:32,680 --> 00:34:35,799
Speaker 3: strike and to you know, rebuild again. But at the

647
00:34:35,800 --> 00:34:39,200
Speaker 3: same time, we need to gain ground because it wasn't

648
00:34:39,360 --> 00:34:42,560
Speaker 3: we weren't satisfied with where we were, you know what

649
00:34:42,600 --> 00:34:45,480
Speaker 3: I mean, So we need to push and gain greater

650
00:34:45,600 --> 00:34:48,359
Speaker 3: ground as we're doing that as well. So I try

651
00:34:48,360 --> 00:34:50,960
Speaker 3: to encourage people in that. And I know it's only

652
00:34:51,000 --> 00:34:53,319
Speaker 3: a few of us, right, because everybody wants to be

653
00:34:53,719 --> 00:34:56,240
Speaker 3: angry and mad and you know, like in this or whatever,

654
00:34:56,280 --> 00:34:59,160
Speaker 3: and you know, calling people names and you know all

655
00:34:59,160 --> 00:35:01,399
Speaker 3: that kind of stuff. There's space for that, right, There

656
00:35:01,640 --> 00:35:04,000
Speaker 3: is space for that. But at the same time, we

657
00:35:04,120 --> 00:35:06,680
Speaker 3: have to be ready to strike when we need to

658
00:35:06,760 --> 00:35:10,480
Speaker 3: rebuild this democracy, and it doesn't start with just one

659
00:35:10,520 --> 00:35:13,520
Speaker 3: election of changing who would be in Congress or who

660
00:35:13,600 --> 00:35:15,840
Speaker 3: will be in the White House next. Is going to

661
00:35:15,880 --> 00:35:18,759
Speaker 3: take a generation or two to rebuild this democracy into

662
00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:20,320
Speaker 3: something that actually works.

663
00:35:20,560 --> 00:35:22,480
Speaker 2: Oof, you really said it.

664
00:35:22,800 --> 00:35:25,040
Speaker 1: I have a This is not even was not even

665
00:35:25,040 --> 00:35:26,760
Speaker 1: on the agenda that I wanted to ask you about,

666
00:35:26,760 --> 00:35:31,160
Speaker 1: But you have such an encouraging worldview. My producer Mike

667
00:35:31,200 --> 00:35:34,560
Speaker 1: and I got into a long, kind of dark discussion

668
00:35:34,600 --> 00:35:36,240
Speaker 1: about this, and I want to see where you stand.

669
00:35:36,719 --> 00:35:40,240
Speaker 1: I completely agree with you. It's not about anyone election.

670
00:35:40,360 --> 00:35:42,359
Speaker 1: It's not about who's in the White House. It's so

671
00:35:42,600 --> 00:35:47,120
Speaker 1: it's a longer game than that. However, I have this deep,

672
00:35:47,440 --> 00:35:52,440
Speaker 1: deep foreboding feeling the way that the administration is moving

673
00:35:52,520 --> 00:35:56,040
Speaker 1: right now. In my opinion, they are not moving like

674
00:35:56,120 --> 00:35:59,719
Speaker 1: people who expect that they will not be in the

675
00:35:59,760 --> 00:36:04,400
Speaker 1: White House come four years from now. So I'm not like, well,

676
00:36:04,440 --> 00:36:06,200
Speaker 1: I feel like when I say that, people are like

677
00:36:06,960 --> 00:36:10,240
Speaker 1: they say it's I understand that sounds paranoid and crazy.

678
00:36:10,239 --> 00:36:12,000
Speaker 1: I guess, I guess that's what I'm saying. I understand,

679
00:36:12,120 --> 00:36:13,680
Speaker 1: But when it comes to like, like, what are you

680
00:36:13,719 --> 00:36:16,120
Speaker 1: thinking for midterms. What do you where do you think

681
00:36:16,160 --> 00:36:16,839
Speaker 1: we will be at?

682
00:36:17,120 --> 00:36:19,160
Speaker 3: Well? The thing is is because I don't think of

683
00:36:19,239 --> 00:36:22,239
Speaker 3: the elections as I know we use the language the

684
00:36:22,280 --> 00:36:25,319
Speaker 3: most important election of our lifetime, but I don't think

685
00:36:25,320 --> 00:36:29,200
Speaker 3: of them as these you know, oh, we have this

686
00:36:29,239 --> 00:36:32,480
Speaker 3: one chance here and then if not, okay, well we

687
00:36:32,480 --> 00:36:33,319
Speaker 3: ain't got No, we.

688
00:36:33,280 --> 00:36:33,919
Speaker 2: Got eighteen months.

689
00:36:33,920 --> 00:36:36,640
Speaker 3: We gotta wait for eighteen months so we can make

690
00:36:36,640 --> 00:36:41,200
Speaker 3: the change again. Right, Those are certainly markers that we

691
00:36:41,360 --> 00:36:44,279
Speaker 3: use along the way. But even in me taking home

692
00:36:44,480 --> 00:36:48,520
Speaker 3: of the NAACP in New York State conference, my plan

693
00:36:48,600 --> 00:36:51,840
Speaker 3: goes through twenty thirty two, the next level of redistricting, right,

694
00:36:51,880 --> 00:36:55,240
Speaker 3: and so you're thinking about, like, how are you trying

695
00:36:55,239 --> 00:36:58,719
Speaker 3: a path forward? So I would not be surprised if

696
00:36:59,680 --> 00:37:03,120
Speaker 3: everything that they're doing getting people comfortable and used to

697
00:37:03,360 --> 00:37:07,839
Speaker 3: having a militarized presence in cities and in places so

698
00:37:07,880 --> 00:37:11,040
Speaker 3: that they're also in place for election time, and so

699
00:37:11,200 --> 00:37:16,359
Speaker 3: that sort of discourages people from turning out or something else.

700
00:37:16,400 --> 00:37:17,160
Speaker 2: The farius happen.

701
00:37:17,239 --> 00:37:21,160
Speaker 3: We've had multiple instances in this country where this has

702
00:37:21,200 --> 00:37:24,080
Speaker 3: happened before. Again, I know people like to seize me

703
00:37:24,120 --> 00:37:26,480
Speaker 3: about being a nerd, but like there's a reason, like

704
00:37:26,520 --> 00:37:29,279
Speaker 3: we just keep repeating the same things over and over again.

705
00:37:29,360 --> 00:37:32,600
Speaker 3: So there's stuff for us to learn from that standpoint.

706
00:37:33,320 --> 00:37:37,760
Speaker 3: But what I think about is, as each new opportunity comes,

707
00:37:38,040 --> 00:37:41,240
Speaker 3: how can I push forward? How do I push democracy forward?

708
00:37:41,600 --> 00:37:46,080
Speaker 3: How do I ensure Because for me, my history tells

709
00:37:46,120 --> 00:37:49,319
Speaker 3: me that every fight, in every organizing piece that we

710
00:37:49,400 --> 00:37:53,120
Speaker 3: have done, has pushed this country to be more of

711
00:37:53,160 --> 00:37:55,719
Speaker 3: the democracy it's said it wants to be. And so

712
00:37:55,800 --> 00:37:58,920
Speaker 3: if you have that legacy as a collective people, as

713
00:37:58,960 --> 00:38:03,360
Speaker 3: collective organized as collective Americans. Right, So what is stopping

714
00:38:03,400 --> 00:38:06,200
Speaker 3: me from saying, all right, so he's in White House now,

715
00:38:06,280 --> 00:38:09,160
Speaker 3: so Congress is now or whatever? All right, gund what

716
00:38:09,239 --> 00:38:11,120
Speaker 3: ground can we gain after the midterms?

717
00:38:11,360 --> 00:38:11,640
Speaker 2: All right?

718
00:38:11,680 --> 00:38:13,840
Speaker 3: What ground are we gaining? You know, when we go

719
00:38:13,880 --> 00:38:17,319
Speaker 3: to milicipal elections again, what ground are we gaining? You know,

720
00:38:17,320 --> 00:38:19,719
Speaker 3: when we go to state elections again? What ground are

721
00:38:19,719 --> 00:38:23,080
Speaker 3: we gaining? You know, when the presidential election process comes

722
00:38:23,160 --> 00:38:26,120
Speaker 3: over again. And so if we think about it that

723
00:38:26,239 --> 00:38:29,279
Speaker 3: way rather than thinking about these elections, that's sort of

724
00:38:29,280 --> 00:38:34,040
Speaker 3: these one off opportunities to steer the car in a

725
00:38:34,040 --> 00:38:39,160
Speaker 3: different direction and think about how can I specifically you know,

726
00:38:39,560 --> 00:38:42,560
Speaker 3: just turn the wheel a little bit, you know, further

727
00:38:42,640 --> 00:38:46,120
Speaker 3: to that direction. Each opportunity we get, we can get

728
00:38:46,120 --> 00:38:46,920
Speaker 3: to the destination.

729
00:38:48,080 --> 00:38:48,919
Speaker 2: I like that a lot.

730
00:38:49,000 --> 00:38:53,120
Speaker 1: That that feels that help here, honestly hearing that help.

731
00:38:57,200 --> 00:38:57,359
Speaker 3: More.

732
00:38:57,400 --> 00:39:11,480
Speaker 4: After a quick break, let's get right back into it.

733
00:39:15,000 --> 00:39:18,920
Speaker 1: Well, speaking of militarization, I did want to talk about

734
00:39:18,960 --> 00:39:22,520
Speaker 1: this far right extremism study. So I don't think anybody

735
00:39:22,560 --> 00:39:25,719
Speaker 1: listening will be surprised to learn that white supremacist and

736
00:39:25,760 --> 00:39:28,680
Speaker 1: far right violence is the biggest source of domestic terrorism

737
00:39:28,800 --> 00:39:32,600
Speaker 1: in the US. It's just an empirical fact, and there

738
00:39:32,640 --> 00:39:35,720
Speaker 1: is overwhelming evidence for this fact. There's even a study

739
00:39:35,719 --> 00:39:38,040
Speaker 1: from the Department of Justice that illustrates it in detail

740
00:39:38,360 --> 00:39:40,879
Speaker 1: and states very clearly that white supremacist and far right

741
00:39:40,960 --> 00:39:43,520
Speaker 1: violence is the biggest source of terrorism and domestic violent

742
00:39:43,520 --> 00:39:46,439
Speaker 1: extremism in the US. But this week's Department of Justice

743
00:39:46,520 --> 00:39:49,440
Speaker 1: quietly pulled that study from their website. So this was

744
00:39:49,520 --> 00:39:52,600
Speaker 1: not some like random blog posts. A study came from

745
00:39:52,600 --> 00:39:55,080
Speaker 1: the National Institute of Justice, which is part of the DOJ.

746
00:39:55,680 --> 00:39:59,000
Speaker 1: Its authors are like highly respected academics. Up until at

747
00:39:59,080 --> 00:40:01,080
Speaker 1: least September twelfth, you could find it right on the

748
00:40:01,120 --> 00:40:05,200
Speaker 1: DJ's website and then poof, it was gone. Jason Palladino

749
00:40:05,200 --> 00:40:08,160
Speaker 1: from four four reported the takedown, who picked it up

750
00:40:08,200 --> 00:40:11,440
Speaker 1: after a grad student who researches online extremism spotted a

751
00:40:11,560 --> 00:40:13,719
Speaker 1: missing So now if you go to that page, there's

752
00:40:13,760 --> 00:40:17,000
Speaker 1: a bland little message that says, oh, the DOJ is

753
00:40:17,040 --> 00:40:20,279
Speaker 1: reviewing its websites and materials in accordance with Trump's recent

754
00:40:20,320 --> 00:40:23,319
Speaker 1: executive orders. I'm sure you'll remember that right after Trump

755
00:40:23,360 --> 00:40:26,520
Speaker 1: took office, he signed in that order banning government agencies

756
00:40:26,560 --> 00:40:29,440
Speaker 1: from using words like gender or DEI or diversity. And

757
00:40:29,520 --> 00:40:33,799
Speaker 1: it was this like very big censorship campaign that tied

758
00:40:33,880 --> 00:40:37,920
Speaker 1: up every federal agency, including NASA, in hours of like

759
00:40:38,040 --> 00:40:42,080
Speaker 1: scrubbing perfectly normal language off of their websites. And so,

760
00:40:42,440 --> 00:40:44,120
Speaker 1: guess not shocking to me that a study like this

761
00:40:44,160 --> 00:40:46,960
Speaker 1: would be targeted. One of the studies authors told for

762
00:40:47,200 --> 00:40:49,880
Speaker 1: four that he was not surprised, but he did point

763
00:40:49,920 --> 00:40:51,960
Speaker 1: out that the research is still out there. If you

764
00:40:51,960 --> 00:40:53,920
Speaker 1: want to read it, we will put it on in

765
00:40:53,960 --> 00:40:57,760
Speaker 1: the show notes. But I do think the timing around

766
00:40:57,880 --> 00:41:01,400
Speaker 1: us having this sort of national conversation about political violence.

767
00:41:01,800 --> 00:41:06,080
Speaker 1: I find the timing very curious when Trump is going

768
00:41:06,120 --> 00:41:09,880
Speaker 1: on TV and talking about how so called radical leftist

769
00:41:09,960 --> 00:41:13,000
Speaker 1: rhetoric is responsible for all political violence in this country.

770
00:41:13,200 --> 00:41:15,319
Speaker 1: You know, you know JD Vance saying that he's going

771
00:41:15,360 --> 00:41:18,719
Speaker 1: to use Kirk's death to crack down on LECTUS organizations,

772
00:41:18,760 --> 00:41:21,840
Speaker 1: and you know all of that. You have Elon Musk

773
00:41:21,920 --> 00:41:24,520
Speaker 1: jumping in on X saying that he's going to fix Grock,

774
00:41:24,800 --> 00:41:28,239
Speaker 1: Twitter's AI assistant because it cited research showing that right

775
00:41:28,280 --> 00:41:31,080
Speaker 1: wing violence is more common. You know, it's this this

776
00:41:31,280 --> 00:41:35,480
Speaker 1: real sort of getting in line behind this reality that

777
00:41:35,600 --> 00:41:38,840
Speaker 1: the research could not be clearer is reality.

778
00:41:39,400 --> 00:41:42,800
Speaker 3: And it's also about new because there was previous reports

779
00:41:43,440 --> 00:41:49,239
Speaker 3: about the rise of white supremacy in the military, in

780
00:41:50,360 --> 00:41:53,160
Speaker 3: police departments. I remember this because I remember it came

781
00:41:53,200 --> 00:41:55,000
Speaker 3: out at around the time when we were at a

782
00:41:55,040 --> 00:41:59,640
Speaker 3: net roots conference talking to folks about it, because I

783
00:41:59,640 --> 00:42:02,400
Speaker 3: think it was also around the time when Black Lives

784
00:42:02,440 --> 00:42:05,520
Speaker 3: Matter that was sort of really.

785
00:42:06,920 --> 00:42:08,200
Speaker 2: Hot, and you know.

786
00:42:08,160 --> 00:42:11,560
Speaker 3: People were engaged and no one was paying attention. From

787
00:42:11,560 --> 00:42:14,680
Speaker 3: that standpoint as well, it's never really died down.

788
00:42:15,400 --> 00:42:16,600
Speaker 2: And I think you.

789
00:42:16,560 --> 00:42:18,600
Speaker 3: And I around the same age where you remember when

790
00:42:18,600 --> 00:42:21,600
Speaker 3: there was like you know, the skinheads and the chat

791
00:42:21,680 --> 00:42:24,440
Speaker 3: rooms and stuff like that. I remember in college, you know,

792
00:42:24,520 --> 00:42:27,520
Speaker 3: where people were organized and then under you know, around

793
00:42:27,600 --> 00:42:29,240
Speaker 3: that in the early nineteen hundreds.

794
00:42:29,239 --> 00:42:34,360
Speaker 2: As my daughter was did you know this is a

795
00:42:34,520 --> 00:42:36,200
Speaker 2: side note, did you ever see that tweet?

796
00:42:36,280 --> 00:42:39,919
Speaker 1: It's like, I like, I told somebody I was working

797
00:42:39,960 --> 00:42:41,360
Speaker 1: with a child that I told them I was I

798
00:42:41,440 --> 00:42:42,800
Speaker 1: was born in the nineteen nineties.

799
00:42:42,800 --> 00:42:45,120
Speaker 2: And she said, were you a slave? Yes?

800
00:42:46,480 --> 00:42:49,440
Speaker 3: You know, my daughter does do that to my husband,

801
00:42:49,440 --> 00:42:51,840
Speaker 3: and I like, will tell something about history or whatever.

802
00:42:52,800 --> 00:42:55,960
Speaker 3: Like we were watching a documentary about voting rights and

803
00:42:55,960 --> 00:42:57,640
Speaker 3: stuff and they showed the march on the bridge and

804
00:42:57,680 --> 00:42:58,759
Speaker 3: she was like, Mom, were you there?

805
00:42:59,200 --> 00:43:04,480
Speaker 1: I was like, not the march across the bridge. It's

806
00:43:04,520 --> 00:43:07,080
Speaker 1: like black and white pictures of like Malcolm X.

807
00:43:07,120 --> 00:43:10,040
Speaker 3: And also there's mom who's like marble. She was like,

808
00:43:10,040 --> 00:43:12,799
Speaker 3: when you go to marches, And I'm just like, oh,

809
00:43:13,480 --> 00:43:17,840
Speaker 3: if your own kids. But yeah, so it's never really

810
00:43:18,160 --> 00:43:21,759
Speaker 3: you know, died down and people find and obviously we

811
00:43:21,840 --> 00:43:24,880
Speaker 3: have the proliferation of the Internet, which allows people to

812
00:43:24,920 --> 00:43:29,799
Speaker 3: find each other across the interwebs and sort of continue

813
00:43:29,920 --> 00:43:33,320
Speaker 3: to you know, go further down the rabbit hole and find,

814
00:43:33,840 --> 00:43:37,520
Speaker 3: you know, things that sort of the confirmation bias. I

815
00:43:37,560 --> 00:43:39,360
Speaker 3: think we talk about where it's like I'm going to

816
00:43:39,400 --> 00:43:41,640
Speaker 3: look for the things and I have cousins who do

817
00:43:41,680 --> 00:43:44,120
Speaker 3: the same thing, you know, and they're just only looking

818
00:43:44,239 --> 00:43:48,160
Speaker 3: for the knowledge and information that furthered their point. And

819
00:43:48,200 --> 00:43:51,960
Speaker 3: I'm like, dude, that's not research. You kinda take in

820
00:43:52,040 --> 00:43:54,080
Speaker 3: all of the context and all of the information and

821
00:43:54,160 --> 00:43:58,480
Speaker 3: then form, you know, an argument, and you can't. Obviously

822
00:43:58,520 --> 00:44:00,840
Speaker 3: we suffered from a lack of media a little as well.

823
00:44:01,320 --> 00:44:04,320
Speaker 3: We can't just take at face value. I mean, Bridget,

824
00:44:04,440 --> 00:44:06,120
Speaker 3: you can tell me something. I can listen to your

825
00:44:06,160 --> 00:44:07,279
Speaker 3: podcast more often than not.

826
00:44:07,400 --> 00:44:10,000
Speaker 2: I have my phone. I'm like, she made that up.

827
00:44:10,040 --> 00:44:10,680
Speaker 2: Let me look at it.

828
00:44:12,239 --> 00:44:14,839
Speaker 3: So you talk about the report. I'm like, she need

829
00:44:14,880 --> 00:44:16,279
Speaker 3: to send me this report. Let me see what she

830
00:44:16,360 --> 00:44:16,759
Speaker 3: tells me.

831
00:44:17,120 --> 00:44:19,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, this is why I love podcasts because you can

832
00:44:19,200 --> 00:44:20,839
Speaker 1: always just pause it and like google it.

833
00:44:20,880 --> 00:44:22,520
Speaker 2: I don't know you, and I don't like you. It's

834
00:44:22,600 --> 00:44:25,080
Speaker 2: just like you just be saying randomness. Let me read

835
00:44:25,160 --> 00:44:27,880
Speaker 2: it myself. Why don't you have that curious nature?

836
00:44:28,000 --> 00:44:28,120
Speaker 4: Right?

837
00:44:28,160 --> 00:44:30,839
Speaker 3: Like why do you listen to someone And it's just like, oh,

838
00:44:30,920 --> 00:44:32,920
Speaker 3: well they said it on the internet, they said it

839
00:44:32,920 --> 00:44:34,439
Speaker 3: on the news, and I'll be like, who is they

840
00:44:34,800 --> 00:44:37,680
Speaker 3: and what evan is a information you don't remember doing

841
00:44:37,680 --> 00:44:40,319
Speaker 3: that as a child, you know, in class where it's

842
00:44:40,320 --> 00:44:42,520
Speaker 3: just like, you know, tell me the facts before you

843
00:44:42,600 --> 00:44:44,960
Speaker 3: tell me the you know your opinion on the thing,

844
00:44:45,160 --> 00:44:48,520
Speaker 3: Tell me what happened first. Are there multiple sources who

845
00:44:48,560 --> 00:44:51,000
Speaker 3: are confirmeding this and you can see that as something

846
00:44:51,080 --> 00:44:55,239
Speaker 3: not only from news and politics and medical and science information.

847
00:44:55,719 --> 00:45:01,239
Speaker 3: Yang Dane Dash on the Breakfast Club talk about.

848
00:44:59,719 --> 00:45:03,080
Speaker 2: Like so ain't nobody did no due diligence. They just

849
00:45:03,200 --> 00:45:05,440
Speaker 2: running headlines that was that.

850
00:45:05,520 --> 00:45:08,839
Speaker 1: I watched that interview that was That's a whole other thing.

851
00:45:08,920 --> 00:45:12,640
Speaker 1: I mean, I have many questions about what's up with him.

852
00:45:12,680 --> 00:45:15,000
Speaker 1: I just was left with many and many questions about

853
00:45:15,000 --> 00:45:17,160
Speaker 1: what is going on with him. But it's indicative of

854
00:45:17,200 --> 00:45:17,719
Speaker 1: where we are.

855
00:45:17,840 --> 00:45:18,000
Speaker 2: Right.

856
00:45:18,000 --> 00:45:20,879
Speaker 3: People will just say something. All of the stuff I say. Now,

857
00:45:20,920 --> 00:45:22,399
Speaker 3: you may clip it and put it on and people

858
00:45:22,400 --> 00:45:23,839
Speaker 3: are gonna be like, yep, that's true, and.

859
00:45:23,800 --> 00:45:26,160
Speaker 2: I'm like, no, go read it and verify it and

860
00:45:26,239 --> 00:45:26,920
Speaker 2: it is wrong.

861
00:45:27,280 --> 00:45:30,640
Speaker 3: Tell me it's wrong so that I can fix it

862
00:45:30,680 --> 00:45:33,239
Speaker 3: and sort of great like provide the greater context and

863
00:45:33,280 --> 00:45:36,400
Speaker 3: information Like that is the type of atmosphere we should

864
00:45:36,400 --> 00:45:39,319
Speaker 3: be able to live in without being like, let me

865
00:45:39,360 --> 00:45:42,040
Speaker 3: tell you the fifty two reasons why el Joy Williams

866
00:45:42,120 --> 00:45:44,560
Speaker 3: was wrong in this video. It's just like, Okay, you're

867
00:45:44,600 --> 00:45:47,000
Speaker 3: making this argument, but you use this fact, you use

868
00:45:47,040 --> 00:45:50,440
Speaker 3: this thing whatever. Actually, you know, go read when I

869
00:45:50,560 --> 00:45:52,960
Speaker 3: just say stuff, don't take my word for granted.

870
00:45:53,360 --> 00:45:56,479
Speaker 2: Look it up. Read. Let's to read a book.

871
00:45:56,760 --> 00:45:57,319
Speaker 4: Fucking read.

872
00:45:58,120 --> 00:46:00,279
Speaker 2: I remember that. Yeah, we are in.

873
00:46:00,360 --> 00:46:01,799
Speaker 1: I mean, I talk about this all the time, but

874
00:46:03,040 --> 00:46:05,120
Speaker 1: it's a real media literacy crisis.

875
00:46:05,120 --> 00:46:07,200
Speaker 2: And I this is gonna sound random, but.

876
00:46:07,160 --> 00:46:11,399
Speaker 1: I genuinely feel you could convince people of anything if

877
00:46:11,440 --> 00:46:11,880
Speaker 1: you put it.

878
00:46:11,960 --> 00:46:13,680
Speaker 2: If you make an image.

879
00:46:13,280 --> 00:46:16,480
Speaker 1: On canva in that bold black and white text, that

880
00:46:16,600 --> 00:46:19,200
Speaker 1: shade room text, you could say anything and people will

881
00:46:19,239 --> 00:46:20,799
Speaker 1: be like, wow, I saw it on an image that

882
00:46:20,880 --> 00:46:23,120
Speaker 1: had bold black and white text on the internet.

883
00:46:23,280 --> 00:46:25,360
Speaker 3: They said it on the internet. My teenagers comes to this.

884
00:46:25,600 --> 00:46:27,880
Speaker 3: She was like, do you know she'll come in the kitchen?

885
00:46:28,200 --> 00:46:30,480
Speaker 3: Do you know that so and so and so? And

886
00:46:30,480 --> 00:46:32,239
Speaker 3: then my husband and I would be like who said it?

887
00:46:32,520 --> 00:46:35,080
Speaker 3: And she was like it was on TikTok and I'm like, okay,

888
00:46:35,120 --> 00:46:38,080
Speaker 3: but who said it? She was like on TikTok, I'm like,

889
00:46:38,120 --> 00:46:41,839
Speaker 3: but who on TikTok said it, what is it like

890
00:46:42,280 --> 00:46:45,240
Speaker 3: trying to get her in the habit of like digging

891
00:46:45,320 --> 00:46:47,560
Speaker 3: and trust in information. Did you look it up? Did

892
00:46:47,560 --> 00:46:50,359
Speaker 3: you verify it? Or is it just TikTok said, you know.

893
00:46:50,880 --> 00:46:54,920
Speaker 1: Right, it is, We're we're in. I mean, it's It's

894
00:46:54,920 --> 00:46:58,520
Speaker 1: something I really do worry about. Like the generation coming,

895
00:46:58,640 --> 00:47:02,560
Speaker 1: the younger generation, are they learning media literacy? Are they

896
00:47:02,600 --> 00:47:05,080
Speaker 1: learning how to be media critical the way that you know,

897
00:47:05,160 --> 00:47:07,439
Speaker 1: I was like a burnout in school and I still

898
00:47:07,480 --> 00:47:08,880
Speaker 1: remember how to do some of this stuff, and I

899
00:47:08,920 --> 00:47:11,040
Speaker 1: worry that that's not being passed down the same way

900
00:47:11,520 --> 00:47:12,160
Speaker 1: they are.

901
00:47:12,120 --> 00:47:16,200
Speaker 3: Learning to be critical. What they're learning is, oh, this

902
00:47:16,320 --> 00:47:18,759
Speaker 3: is a right ring brag, Oh this is a left

903
00:47:18,840 --> 00:47:21,200
Speaker 3: ring read this is you know, so I can't trust

904
00:47:21,239 --> 00:47:24,480
Speaker 3: anything that this says because George Soros pays for it,

905
00:47:24,920 --> 00:47:28,440
Speaker 3: or I can't trust this because you know, ABC is

906
00:47:28,520 --> 00:47:30,520
Speaker 3: part of the sinclear you know what I mean? So

907
00:47:30,640 --> 00:47:35,440
Speaker 3: like it becomes that and that is the extent of

908
00:47:35,520 --> 00:47:38,320
Speaker 3: the general membershit. If Fox News didn't say it, it's

909
00:47:38,400 --> 00:47:41,040
Speaker 3: you know, MSNBC didn't say it. I had to take

910
00:47:41,120 --> 00:47:45,120
Speaker 3: myself off of watching MSNBC on a regular basis. Because

911
00:47:45,160 --> 00:47:48,320
Speaker 3: I'm just like, dang, ain't there some other news besides

912
00:47:48,360 --> 00:47:50,920
Speaker 3: these same eight stories all day?

913
00:47:50,520 --> 00:47:52,800
Speaker 2: But let me pull my self.

914
00:47:52,800 --> 00:47:56,200
Speaker 3: Back, you know, and I went back to reading news.

915
00:47:56,360 --> 00:47:58,319
Speaker 3: So I read news in the morning and they even

916
00:47:58,440 --> 00:48:00,880
Speaker 3: then listening to MPR through you know, at two different

917
00:48:00,880 --> 00:48:03,440
Speaker 3: points of the day, so I, you know, don't miss

918
00:48:03,480 --> 00:48:06,280
Speaker 3: like breaking news something or whatever like that. But going

919
00:48:06,320 --> 00:48:08,640
Speaker 3: back to reading is sort of using a different part

920
00:48:08,640 --> 00:48:10,359
Speaker 3: of my brain. And I do that even as someone

921
00:48:10,400 --> 00:48:15,600
Speaker 3: who consumes books and articles and magazines on a hyper

922
00:48:15,960 --> 00:48:16,799
Speaker 3: active rate.

923
00:48:17,320 --> 00:48:19,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, So I did have a little bit of good

924
00:48:20,000 --> 00:48:22,279
Speaker 1: news that I wanted to share other and what has

925
00:48:22,360 --> 00:48:25,400
Speaker 1: otherwise been sort of a dark stretch, which is centers

926
00:48:25,440 --> 00:48:28,600
Speaker 1: Tammy Baldwin and Les Sammerkowski just came together on a

927
00:48:28,640 --> 00:48:32,239
Speaker 1: bipartisan bill to bring back the suicide prevention services for

928
00:48:32,320 --> 00:48:35,360
Speaker 1: LGBTQ plus youth that the Trump administration had cut earlier

929
00:48:35,400 --> 00:48:35,960
Speaker 1: this summer.

930
00:48:36,080 --> 00:48:37,239
Speaker 2: So a little bit of backstory.

931
00:48:37,880 --> 00:48:40,640
Speaker 1: In July, the administration pulled the plug on the LGBTQ

932
00:48:40,800 --> 00:48:44,160
Speaker 1: plus line with the nine to eight to eight Crisis Hotline.

933
00:48:44,200 --> 00:48:46,479
Speaker 1: So that was part of the hotline that connected queer

934
00:48:46,520 --> 00:48:49,400
Speaker 1: and trans youth in crisis with counselors that were specifically

935
00:48:49,400 --> 00:48:51,879
Speaker 1: trained on how to understand and talk about their experiences.

936
00:48:52,280 --> 00:48:55,240
Speaker 1: That loss was really devastating because we know that those

937
00:48:55,320 --> 00:48:57,680
Speaker 1: youths are already at a much higher rate for things

938
00:48:57,719 --> 00:49:00,400
Speaker 1: like suicide, and groups like the Trevor Project estimate that

939
00:49:00,480 --> 00:49:04,239
Speaker 1: nearly two million young people seriously consider suicide every year.

940
00:49:04,560 --> 00:49:07,480
Speaker 1: So this new bill would re establish those services and

941
00:49:07,520 --> 00:49:10,160
Speaker 1: then also make sure that they can't just be stripped

942
00:49:10,160 --> 00:49:12,880
Speaker 1: away again. It's being backed by the Trevor Project and

943
00:49:12,920 --> 00:49:15,680
Speaker 1: the American Foundation for Suicide Prevention, and it's moving to

944
00:49:15,719 --> 00:49:19,040
Speaker 1: committee right now, and so I think this is very

945
00:49:19,080 --> 00:49:21,000
Speaker 1: important and I wanted to share it just as like

946
00:49:21,640 --> 00:49:23,600
Speaker 1: a little bit of good news. You know, when Trump

947
00:49:23,640 --> 00:49:26,360
Speaker 1: won the election in twenty twenty four, calls to the

948
00:49:26,360 --> 00:49:30,000
Speaker 1: Trevor Project hotline spiked seven hundred percent, which I think

949
00:49:30,040 --> 00:49:34,200
Speaker 1: really shows how much stress and fear and anxiety youth

950
00:49:34,239 --> 00:49:36,720
Speaker 1: are carrying right now and how much they need support.

951
00:49:36,800 --> 00:49:39,839
Speaker 1: And so it really it may be a small thing

952
00:49:39,920 --> 00:49:41,719
Speaker 1: in the scheme of things, but having going to be

953
00:49:41,760 --> 00:49:44,719
Speaker 1: a bipartisan effort to bring this back, I think is

954
00:49:44,760 --> 00:49:47,520
Speaker 1: at least something right that like we're doing something to

955
00:49:47,560 --> 00:49:49,120
Speaker 1: sort of support these youths.

956
00:49:49,680 --> 00:49:52,799
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I think it was going to take not

957
00:49:52,880 --> 00:49:56,719
Speaker 3: only legislators, you know, whether they be in Congress, on

958
00:49:56,760 --> 00:49:59,920
Speaker 3: the state and local level, trying to make sure that

959
00:50:00,040 --> 00:50:03,279
Speaker 3: that there's infrastructure in place, but also in communities. Right,

960
00:50:03,400 --> 00:50:09,120
Speaker 3: and we have a track record of building the institution's need,

961
00:50:09,160 --> 00:50:14,200
Speaker 3: infrastructure we need during times of crisis, and so again

962
00:50:14,360 --> 00:50:17,520
Speaker 3: I want to empower people, you know, to create the

963
00:50:17,600 --> 00:50:22,000
Speaker 3: spaces that they need and that are needed in our communities.

964
00:50:22,520 --> 00:50:25,760
Speaker 1: Absolutely. Okay, before I let you go, I have one

965
00:50:26,040 --> 00:50:29,080
Speaker 1: weird question for you. Oh have you ever gone to

966
00:50:29,120 --> 00:50:31,680
Speaker 1: your fridge and thought, wouldn't it be great if there

967
00:50:31,719 --> 00:50:32,520
Speaker 1: was an ad.

968
00:50:32,280 --> 00:50:33,000
Speaker 2: Playing right now?

969
00:50:33,040 --> 00:50:34,600
Speaker 1: Wouldn't it be cool if I could see a commercial

970
00:50:34,640 --> 00:50:35,759
Speaker 1: while I'm at my refrigerator.

971
00:50:35,800 --> 00:50:40,800
Speaker 2: Have you ever thought this? No, Well, if you're.

972
00:50:40,640 --> 00:50:43,359
Speaker 1: Listening and you're like that sounds great, I have news

973
00:50:43,440 --> 00:50:46,320
Speaker 1: for you that dream is a reality because Samsung and

974
00:50:46,440 --> 00:50:50,280
Speaker 1: now it is that they are putting advertisements in smart fridges.

975
00:50:50,719 --> 00:50:53,359
Speaker 1: The Verge reports that a software update is rolling out

976
00:50:53,360 --> 00:50:56,799
Speaker 1: to Samsung's Family Help refrigerators in the United States, where

977
00:50:56,800 --> 00:50:59,120
Speaker 1: they're going to be putting ads in fridges for the

978
00:50:59,160 --> 00:51:04,600
Speaker 1: first time. The Promotions and Curative advertisements are coming to Samsung,

979
00:51:04,760 --> 00:51:07,520
Speaker 1: even though back in April, The Verge talked to Samsung

980
00:51:07,520 --> 00:51:09,480
Speaker 1: and they said they had no plans to do so

981
00:51:10,080 --> 00:51:12,840
Speaker 1: right now. It is a pilot program. And this is

982
00:51:12,880 --> 00:51:15,719
Speaker 1: so wild to me. The Verge printed the statement that

983
00:51:15,760 --> 00:51:18,560
Speaker 1: Samsung made about this. They said that these ads are

984
00:51:18,600 --> 00:51:22,480
Speaker 1: meant to quote strengthen the value of owning a Samsung

985
00:51:22,680 --> 00:51:25,480
Speaker 1: smart fridge. Having there be advertisements that play on your

986
00:51:25,480 --> 00:51:29,240
Speaker 1: refrigerator is meant to strengthen the value of owning a fridge.

987
00:51:29,280 --> 00:51:31,080
Speaker 2: Like that wild to me.

988
00:51:31,680 --> 00:51:36,920
Speaker 3: Nah man, And I so as like, I have Samsung

989
00:51:36,960 --> 00:51:39,279
Speaker 3: products in my kitchen right, like, you know, it's a

990
00:51:39,320 --> 00:51:40,960
Speaker 3: brand that you know.

991
00:51:41,000 --> 00:51:42,200
Speaker 2: I'm pretty loyal to.

992
00:51:42,560 --> 00:51:44,520
Speaker 3: And I remember when we bought the house and we're

993
00:51:44,560 --> 00:51:47,360
Speaker 3: getting like our fridge and sort of all that stuff.

994
00:51:47,680 --> 00:51:51,080
Speaker 3: And we looked at the Samsung series with the screen

995
00:51:51,080 --> 00:51:54,560
Speaker 3: and my husband was like, yeah, when you walk by naked,

996
00:51:54,840 --> 00:51:59,040
Speaker 3: like would like they have a camera facing you. You know,

997
00:51:59,160 --> 00:52:02,360
Speaker 3: there's some like geek guy in a data center looking

998
00:52:02,400 --> 00:52:02,680
Speaker 3: at you.

999
00:52:02,719 --> 00:52:06,160
Speaker 2: Love Vibe Maggie with the milk in your hand. And

1000
00:52:06,239 --> 00:52:09,280
Speaker 2: I was like, all right, never mind, yes.

1001
00:52:09,160 --> 00:52:11,400
Speaker 1: Well, this gives me a reason to quote my favorite

1002
00:52:11,440 --> 00:52:14,759
Speaker 1: blue sky post from this week from Kashana. I like

1003
00:52:14,840 --> 00:52:17,920
Speaker 1: my Fridges, dumb, young and full of plumps.

1004
00:52:18,719 --> 00:52:22,440
Speaker 2: I loved love that. Also, you are such a delight.

1005
00:52:22,480 --> 00:52:23,160
Speaker 2: I have to tell you.

1006
00:52:23,480 --> 00:52:27,840
Speaker 1: I started this conversation feeling, as I said, very down

1007
00:52:27,960 --> 00:52:30,040
Speaker 1: and just not feeling good about where we were at.

1008
00:52:30,040 --> 00:52:32,560
Speaker 1: But I'm leaving feeling a lot more agency. I know

1009
00:52:32,640 --> 00:52:36,640
Speaker 1: that you are curating these conversations on Sunday Civics really

1010
00:52:36,680 --> 00:52:39,839
Speaker 1: helping people understand our democracy, our government and maybe making

1011
00:52:39,840 --> 00:52:43,000
Speaker 1: them feel a little more empowered to make change. Where

1012
00:52:43,000 --> 00:52:45,759
Speaker 1: can people follow you tell us about the show, like

1013
00:52:45,840 --> 00:52:48,120
Speaker 1: how can people be involved in what you've got going on?

1014
00:52:48,400 --> 00:52:50,760
Speaker 3: Well, thank you and I'm glad that you do feel

1015
00:52:50,840 --> 00:52:55,640
Speaker 3: some greater agency and hope about what we can build

1016
00:52:55,680 --> 00:52:58,120
Speaker 3: together in the future. So you can always go to

1017
00:52:58,120 --> 00:53:01,640
Speaker 3: Sunday Civics dot org and get the latest episodes. They

1018
00:53:01,680 --> 00:53:05,120
Speaker 3: air Sunday mornings at nine am. So for the faith people,

1019
00:53:05,200 --> 00:53:07,360
Speaker 3: you on your way to church or maybe you on

1020
00:53:07,400 --> 00:53:10,759
Speaker 3: your way back from early service, you can listen and

1021
00:53:11,080 --> 00:53:15,040
Speaker 3: you can also download it on podcasts, Apple, Spotify, all

1022
00:53:15,120 --> 00:53:18,200
Speaker 3: of those. From that standpoint, and as I mentioned right now,

1023
00:53:18,320 --> 00:53:21,640
Speaker 3: I'm in the series between you know, I started the

1024
00:53:21,640 --> 00:53:25,560
Speaker 3: first Sunday in September through to December what I call

1025
00:53:25,600 --> 00:53:27,839
Speaker 3: the Porch Flight series, where we're leaving the lighte on

1026
00:53:27,880 --> 00:53:32,160
Speaker 3: democracy and I'm asking you to imagine what democracy do

1027
00:53:32,280 --> 00:53:35,600
Speaker 3: you want to fight for and that we want in

1028
00:53:35,640 --> 00:53:38,520
Speaker 3: our future and giving you the agency and the tools

1029
00:53:38,560 --> 00:53:42,600
Speaker 3: to believe that we have the possible, we have the

1030
00:53:42,640 --> 00:53:46,840
Speaker 3: power to actually create that. So join us on Sunday

1031
00:53:46,880 --> 00:53:50,680
Speaker 3: mornings in Sunday Civics classroom because right now we're outside

1032
00:53:50,719 --> 00:53:51,240
Speaker 3: on a porch.

1033
00:53:51,719 --> 00:53:54,680
Speaker 2: Oh well, they're going to leave the light on for you, Aljoie.

1034
00:53:54,760 --> 00:53:56,960
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for being here. Thanks to all

1035
00:53:57,040 --> 00:53:59,400
Speaker 1: of you for listening. I will see you on the Internet.

1036
00:54:06,360 --> 00:54:08,400
Speaker 1: Got a story about an interesting thing in tech, or

1037
00:54:08,480 --> 00:54:10,319
Speaker 1: just want to say hi. You can reach us at

1038
00:54:10,320 --> 00:54:13,040
Speaker 1: Hello at tangody dot com. You can also find transcripts

1039
00:54:13,040 --> 00:54:15,520
Speaker 1: for today's episode at tenggody dot com. There Are No

1040
00:54:15,600 --> 00:54:17,640
Speaker 1: Girls on the Internet was created by me Bridget Tod.

1041
00:54:18,040 --> 00:54:21,480
Speaker 1: It's a production of iHeartRadio, an Unbossed creative. Jonathan Strickland

1042
00:54:21,520 --> 00:54:24,200
Speaker 1: is our executive producer. Tari Harrison is our producer and

1043
00:54:24,280 --> 00:54:28,040
Speaker 1: sound engineer. Michael Almado is our contributing producer. I'm your host,

1044
00:54:28,040 --> 00:54:30,839
Speaker 1: Bridget Todd. If you want to help us grow, rate

1045
00:54:30,880 --> 00:54:31,400
Speaker 1: and review.

1046
00:54:31,280 --> 00:54:32,440
Speaker 4: Us on Apple Podcasts.

1047
00:54:33,120 --> 00:54:35,919
Speaker 1: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, check out the iHeartRadio app,

1048
00:54:35,960 --> 00:54:38,000
Speaker 1: Apple podcast or wherever you get your podcasts,