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Speaker 1: Hey, what a welcome in. I'm Doug Gottlie. This is

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Speaker 1: All Ball, man. I hope you've been enjoying some of

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Speaker 1: these that we were able to capture live when we

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Speaker 1: were in Las Vegas at NBA con. Remember to go

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Speaker 1: through your All Ball list and be like, man, I

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Speaker 1: missed this one. I missed that one. There's a really

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Speaker 1: good it's really good stuff. We'll get to this this

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Speaker 1: podcast guest in a moment, but let me start with

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Speaker 1: the Lebron James man. That was weird where he gets

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Speaker 1: an award at the SPIS for the best record breaking performance.

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Speaker 1: I just it just sounds like a fake award and

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Speaker 1: that's not his fault. I mean, that's that's the SPS

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Speaker 1: kind of in a nutshell, right. Then he goes into

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Speaker 1: this kind of soliloquy about how he doesn't want to

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Speaker 1: achieve the game and that's why he's not retiring and

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Speaker 1: I didn't did anybody think he was retiring? And it's

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Speaker 1: just it's an odd thing, and I think one of

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Speaker 1: the things that I try to be cautious of. And

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Speaker 1: I'm not going to sit here and tell you that

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Speaker 1: I've been perfect in my life, but I try to

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Speaker 1: be cautious of, and I think star athletes for the

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Speaker 1: most part try to be cautious of as well, which

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Speaker 1: is like, how can you grow in status and stature

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Speaker 1: and still just be a regular dude? Right, Like that's

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Speaker 1: the best part of Tim Duncan. People make fun of

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Speaker 1: him dressing like a dork, but like he's the same

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Speaker 1: guy before he won championships, after he won championships, Like

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Speaker 1: he's super laid back, Like that's just who he is.

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Speaker 1: And I truly think it's fascinating to watch Lebron or

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Speaker 1: listen to Lebron and he'll say these things about you know,

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Speaker 1: want to be viewed as like a great dad and

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Speaker 1: a great mentor and a great leader. And I think

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Speaker 1: all those things are true. Like I don't think he's

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Speaker 1: a bad person. He's not doing evil things or wrong

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Speaker 1: to anybody else. But the ego to in a room

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Speaker 1: full of the greatest athletes in our country say hey, guys,

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Speaker 1: guess what, Like I'm not retiring and no one thought

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Speaker 1: you were retiring was just such a similar what cry

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Speaker 1: for attention? So what if I like to anybody else,

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Speaker 1: I like that to be so when I listened to it,

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Speaker 1: I just I don't know if I should. I feel

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Speaker 1: kind of just strange with Lebron because when you're saying

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Speaker 1: things that don't fit the normal context of a conversation

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Speaker 1: because you're a SuperStar's he's lost that ability to be

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Speaker 1: a regular human being, Like you had people who gotten

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Speaker 1: went on TV and said negative things about him when

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Speaker 1: he would say taco Tuesday. But that's kind of a

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Speaker 1: dad thing. I kind of think that's a normal thing.

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Speaker 1: I don't see the negative in that that so many

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Speaker 1: others want to see. So when he says taco Tuesday,

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Speaker 1: I'm like, Okay, maybe Lebrun is a normal guy. And

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Speaker 1: in dealing with his kids, especially with watching them, he's

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Speaker 1: great at watching them at high school games. You know,

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Speaker 1: yes he sits up front, and yes he's caused ust

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Speaker 1: he's Lebrons. Like, what do you want him to do?

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Speaker 1: I guess he'd go hide out and stands. Jordan used

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Speaker 1: to hide out kind of the stands. But you're not

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Speaker 1: really hiding, not just because you're Lebron, you're also six

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Speaker 1: foot seven, six foot eight, two hundred and six pounds.

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Speaker 1: So I don't think that he's a bad human being.

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Speaker 1: But when you look back at the timing of the

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Speaker 1: man maybe I should retire, and oh, yeah, it's not.

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Speaker 1: It wasn't really that out of place. People made it

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Speaker 1: out like I can't believe you said it. He did

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Speaker 1: to take away the shine from the Denver Nuggets. I

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Speaker 1: didn't think that's what's about. But I do believe that

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Speaker 1: because the entire NBA world has revolved around Lebron in

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Speaker 1: the media for as long as we can remember, it's

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Speaker 1: not crazy for us to know that Lebron thinks the

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Speaker 1: world still revolves all around Lebron. You wouldn't say these

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Speaker 1: things otherwise, you wouldn't act this way otherwise. So then

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Speaker 1: in front of you know, what was it, three hundred

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Speaker 1: and fifty of the best athletes in the world. And remember,

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Speaker 1: all of these athletes have grown up or been grown

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Speaker 1: ups during Lebron's twenty years of dominance in the NBA.

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Speaker 1: That's what's unique is you take a snapshot of that

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Speaker 1: room and there's not one human being that can't recall

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Speaker 1: a Lebron game moment when loss, whereas if Michael Jordan

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Speaker 1: is on the exact same stage. Let's be honest, there's

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Speaker 1: a good portion of especially the younger athletes, they never

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Speaker 1: saw him play live so everyone already respects Lebron and

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Speaker 1: he was already getting great gratitude and oh yeah, by

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Speaker 1: the way, if you really want to get down to it,

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Speaker 1: I mean, for me, Aaron Judge's accomplishment was greater in

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Speaker 1: a record breaking season than Lebron's accomplishment in a record

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Speaker 1: breaking season. That's just reality because he broke Roger Merris's record.

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Speaker 1: And please don't start with me with the Barry Bonds.

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Speaker 1: That's just silly. If you cheated on the SAT, would

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Speaker 1: the SAT score stand when you apply to college? Of

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Speaker 1: course not so why would it stand that you cheated

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Speaker 1: to hit more home runs than any human being to

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Speaker 1: ever play baseball? You wouldn't. So for me, I would

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Speaker 1: personally say that Aaron Judge's accomplishment is greater. But instead

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Speaker 1: of talking about the accomplishment, talking about doing it as

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Speaker 1: a Laker, doing as a Laker with Kareem who was

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Speaker 1: also a Laker standing by, or even hey, you know,

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Speaker 1: the greatest gift I think I ever bring to the

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Speaker 1: NBA is not scoring. It's actually I like to pass

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Speaker 1: and I like to win. When people think of my career,

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Speaker 1: I don't want you to thank me as the all

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Speaker 1: time scoring leader. I want you to think of me

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Speaker 1: as somebody who took great joy in the success of others.

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Speaker 1: All of these things are great things to be said,

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Speaker 1: but instead it was just I love the game. I

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Speaker 1: don't want to cheat the game. So guess what, y'all

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Speaker 1: you get to watch me play more. Let's just it

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Speaker 1: was weird, a little off putting. And remember, like a

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Speaker 1: lot of these guys say things that are a little

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Speaker 1: off putting. If we're being totally fair and candid. You know,

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Speaker 1: Michael Jordan called the guy up who beat him out

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Speaker 1: in ice school at his Hall of Fame induction ceremony,

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Speaker 1: kind of felt like he humiliated him one more time.

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Speaker 1: Why because he's Michael Jordan. That's very much on brand.

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Speaker 1: And in regards to the Lakers, I do find it

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Speaker 1: interesting that you have people who and whether it's like

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Speaker 1: a knee jerk, we want to defend and support Lebron.

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Speaker 1: I think Rob Plinkett did a very good job, but

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Speaker 1: Rob Blinkt can do a very good job. And they're

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Speaker 1: not a championship team, and you sit there and say, well,

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Speaker 1: they got to the Western Conference finals. Okay, Well I

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Speaker 1: could point out that the Grizzlies, you know, didn't have

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Speaker 1: their starting center, or they're small ball five as well. Right,

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Speaker 1: they were a different team and the Lakers beat him

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Speaker 1: up inside? Did they beat him up inside? If they

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Speaker 1: have those two now? Probably not. Does that mean that

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Speaker 1: the Grizzlies win the series? I think it does, but

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Speaker 1: I don't know that for a fact. But you fast

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Speaker 1: forward a year and let's see what happens with jaw

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Speaker 1: and if he can stay out of trouble. But you

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Speaker 1: would think that the Grizzlies will be better next year.

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Speaker 1: You would think that the Pelicans, if Zion's healthy, are

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Speaker 1: better next year. The Clippers were a better basketball team.

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Speaker 1: They always beat the Lakers, they just aren't healthy. In

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Speaker 1: the playoffs, you would think they'd be better. You know,

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Speaker 1: Phoenix lost to Denver, so to the Lakers. Phoenix didn't

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Speaker 1: have Chris Paul. I think they're better. But regardless, what

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Speaker 1: did they add? Well, he had Gabe Vincent, who might

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Speaker 1: be a starter, might not, but he's not a game changer.

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Speaker 1: But the bigger part that we have to remember is

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Speaker 1: Lebron James not getting younger. So the likelihood that he

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Speaker 1: and Anthony Davis are one both healthy, I mean, what's

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Speaker 1: the likely to that not a lot. And two that

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Speaker 1: he's as good or better next year, which you know,

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Speaker 1: he's been able to keep father time at Bay for

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Speaker 1: a long time. Can't he do it for another year.

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Speaker 1: He's been hurt every other year and was hurt this

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Speaker 1: past year with the Lakers. So the idea that he's

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Speaker 1: going to be healthy, they're going to be better despite

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Speaker 1: the fact they're a year older and you brought back

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Speaker 1: D'ansel Russell. They couldn't play Danzel Russell in the way

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Speaker 1: from conference finals. Austin Reeves is the one guy who

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Speaker 1: was kept getting better and better and better. But the

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Speaker 1: idea that Austin Reeves goes from you know, an undrafted

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Speaker 1: bench player, guy who played well when Lebron was out,

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Speaker 1: to what Darvin Ham said he'd be an All Star.

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Speaker 1: I think we may need to take a breath there

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Speaker 1: just a little bit. He's a tremendous, tremendous pickup and

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Speaker 1: they had to resign him, and he's an improving player.

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Speaker 1: He has versatility, he can shoot, he's got positional versatility

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Speaker 1: with his size. He's tough, nothing not to like. But

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Speaker 1: I mean he's not Devin Booker, you know, He's just

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Speaker 1: not I mean kind of go through the all stars

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Speaker 1: in the West and Man's that's a tough butt. My

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Speaker 1: point is you can say I like what Blinka did,

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Speaker 1: I like what the roster looks like, solid team and

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Speaker 1: ever since they trade away Russell Westbrook, they look like

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Speaker 1: an organization that was much more put together. And Darvinham

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Speaker 1: did an excellent job coaching them. Played to their tantrums,

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Speaker 1: maybe slightly above it, but a championship team, you're depending

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Speaker 1: upon Lebron to play at his peak level when he's

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Speaker 1: passed his peak. You're depending upon Lebron and Anthony Davis

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Speaker 1: to be healthy, and there just isn't a guy who

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Speaker 1: makes them demonstanly better. Yes, they got to the Western

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Speaker 1: Conference Finals, they also got swept, so you're not that close.

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Speaker 1: You may think you're that close and you sit there

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Speaker 1: and go, yeah, yeah you are. Go and look at

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Speaker 1: other teams that have had kind of a random finals

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Speaker 1: Western Conference Finals appearance. Happened to Portland, happened to Atlanta Hawks,

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Speaker 1: It's happened to other teams. They make a little bit

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Speaker 1: of a run. You kid yourself and think you're really good,

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Speaker 1: when the truth is it's more about an injury along

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Speaker 1: the way. A really good draw or another team that

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Speaker 1: underachieved beginning of Lebron. Joining me in Las Vegas live

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Speaker 1: here on the All Ball Podcast is Israe Gutierres. Whose

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Speaker 1: whether it's written word, which is how he started, the

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Speaker 1: spoken word, which is what he's known for. Israel gutiras well.

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Speaker 1: He's seen it all with the Miami Heat, including the

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Speaker 1: Dwayne Wade Championship before Lebron even got here, back when

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Speaker 1: they had Shaquille O'Neal. He joins me on the All

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Speaker 1: Ball Podcast as we discuss all things NBA, including Lebron.

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Speaker 2: Fox Sports Radio has the best sports talk lineup in

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Speaker 2: the nation. Catch all of our shows at Foxsports Radio

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Speaker 2: dot com and within the iHeartRadio app. Search FSR to

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Speaker 2: listen live. Let's welcome in is He Gutierras.

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Speaker 1: Of course you see here all over ESPN, ESPN personality

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Speaker 1: and a bunch of things. I want to get to

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Speaker 1: with you. You've been in Miami forever and I just

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Speaker 1: I saw a clip I think it was on social

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Speaker 1: media either yesterday the day before, which is the anniversary

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Speaker 1: of lebron announcement, right the decision, and it's I don't know,

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Speaker 1: it's fascinating to me that Look, obviously Shaq went to

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Speaker 1: Miami that kind of started this ball role. But it

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Speaker 1: is interesting on how it's become. It's kind of become

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Speaker 1: a basketball sort of town maybe since Lebron's decision. That

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Speaker 1: is that fair because because when he and I'm sorry

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Speaker 1: to catch out before I even let you answer, but

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Speaker 1: I did, Jim Rome is burning the day of the

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Speaker 1: announcement and the big line that the writers came up

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Speaker 1: with was like Miami's basketball fan very excited. We showed

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Speaker 1: it's like some sports bar and they're like six dudes

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Speaker 1: high fiving, right and we're like, did you go somewhere

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Speaker 1: they don't care? Yeah?

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Speaker 3: Well, I will say, and first of all, I've been

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Speaker 3: in Miami since I was two years old, so a

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Speaker 3: long time, and it wasn't a basketball town. Even when

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Speaker 3: Alonzo and Tim Hardaway were there getting to a conference

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Speaker 3: finals and getting blown out by Michael Jordan. It wasn't

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Speaker 3: really a basketball town. When Dwayne Wade and Shack won

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Speaker 3: a championship like it legitimized it. It's sort of set

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Speaker 3: a foundation. And I would say what Lebron those four

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Speaker 3: years did was really sort of developed the fan base. Okay,

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Speaker 3: Young fans, a little bit of the older fans really

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Speaker 3: just develop it. And the way it was going to

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Speaker 3: become a basketball town was if that somehow.

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Speaker 1: Continued after Lebron.

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Speaker 3: And so now with Jimmy Butler taking this team surprisingly

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Speaker 3: to two finals in whatever that was four years now,

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Speaker 3: it's become that. So now you've got a full generation

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Speaker 3: of fans who maybe at eight, nine, ten years old,

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Speaker 3: wats Lebron.

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Speaker 1: They're graduating high school.

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Speaker 3: Now they're in the prime of their NBA fandom, and

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Speaker 3: Miami is their team, and Miami is relevant at the

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Speaker 3: highest level again, so way more actually than it was then.

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Speaker 3: You got a lot of sophisticated basketball fans in Miami,

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Speaker 3: and I would say it's a basketball town more than

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Speaker 3: a football town now. And that's even with the Dolphins

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Speaker 3: having you know, a lot a little bit of successfully.

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Speaker 1: Well, I think that's that's the one question though, is

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Speaker 1: what happens if the Dolphins get really good? Right, because

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Speaker 1: there's the old if you track like Cleveland sports, all right,

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Speaker 1: Cleveland sports people will tell you that that the Indians

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Speaker 1: drew really well when they didn't have the Browns, and

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Speaker 1: then as long as the Browns are bad, they draw well.

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Speaker 1: The second. The Browns are good like and every town

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Speaker 1: is different, but most cities only have the ability to

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Speaker 1: prioritize like one professional sports team.

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Speaker 3: And then it's going to be king if they're back

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Speaker 3: up top. Right, But the U has been down as well.

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Speaker 3: That takes a little bit something as well. Right, So

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Speaker 3: U's been down. The Dolphins have been down, although decent recently. Okay,

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Speaker 3: Damian Lillard, is it a done deal? I mean I

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Speaker 3: believe it to be a done deal. I've heard things

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Speaker 3: third hand this weekend that maybe are closing things down

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Speaker 3: on that deal.

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Speaker 1: Not sure yet.

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Speaker 3: This to me is almost the most obvious of these situations, right,

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Speaker 3: I mean we've seen this so many times with the

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Speaker 3: Superstars after seven years, what have you? Hey, I'm either

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Speaker 3: going to go somewhere or you're gonna trade me. And

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Speaker 3: with Anthony Davis, you know, we waited and it happened eventually.

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Speaker 3: This one is Damian Lillard has been more loyal than

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Speaker 3: any of those guys were. You know, he gave them

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Speaker 3: three or four extra years and he has been playing

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Speaker 3: along the entire time. He has been following the script,

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Speaker 3: if you will, to this experience.

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Speaker 1: And even his agent.

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Speaker 3: Coming out and basically apologizing for the Will Smith song

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Speaker 3: on his IG live. Like it's mind blowing to me,

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Speaker 3: Like you shouldn't even have to address that. But they're

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Speaker 3: doing it because they're respecting Portland in this process and

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Speaker 3: they're doing everything the way they're supposed to be doing it,

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Speaker 3: and Portland is kind of stuck in this situation.

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Speaker 1: And I know, like people kind of laugh when.

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Speaker 3: They think, Oh, is Portland really going to pay down

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Speaker 3: the road for not doing right by Damian Lillard.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, they are, there are in different ways.

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Speaker 3: It's not going to be something as obvious and heavy

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Speaker 3: handed like everybody. You know, nobody's ever going to sign

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Speaker 3: there again, but it's going to affect them as a

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Speaker 3: franchise and they're going to be way better off doing

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Speaker 3: this the right way for Dame and just taking in

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Speaker 3: a bunch of young talent and a bunch of draft

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Speaker 3: picks and doing the Oklahoma City thing because they're never

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Speaker 3: going to get the big free agent and they have

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Speaker 3: to draft themselves at homegrown super smill.

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Speaker 1: I don't think that's that. I don't think anyone's arguing that, right.

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Speaker 1: It's the what does Miami actually have to trade?

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Speaker 3: What does anybody else have to trade, Well, who has

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Speaker 3: the better offer? Somebody tell me where the better offer is,

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Speaker 3: because the only thing I've heard was somebody saying, oh,

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Speaker 3: an offer built around Tyrese Maxi, a budding superstar, is

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Speaker 3: better than anything Miami has to offer. Compare those resumes

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Speaker 3: Tyler Hero tyres Maxie pretty dig similar. In fact, Tyler's

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Speaker 3: probably a little bit more accomplished. So everybody knocking Tyler

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Speaker 3: in this is what's creating this as a bad deal.

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Speaker 3: When you look at the draft picks, when you look

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Speaker 3: at the young talent, they don't have to have a

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Speaker 3: perfect mixed doug.

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Speaker 1: They're not trying to win it next year.

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Speaker 3: They're trying to have guys that they can maybe if

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Speaker 3: they are sort of duplicating in talent, trade one of

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Speaker 3: those guys away and get back something really good.

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Speaker 1: They're not trying to be competitors next year.

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Speaker 3: So this idea that they need this whole you know,

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Speaker 3: haul back of star, No, they need a guy that

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Speaker 3: they can justify. Tyler's that guy, and they need draft picks,

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Speaker 3: and they've got draft picks.

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Speaker 1: In this deal. Lebron, It's interesting. I grew up in

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Speaker 1: Los Angeles, I moved away, moved back and so I've

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Speaker 1: been there, I think eight of the last eleven years. Right,

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Speaker 1: he plays for the Lakers. This was the first year

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Speaker 1: that he kind of felt like a Laker. But even then,

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Speaker 1: it's super weird. Yeah, I feel like I feel like

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Speaker 1: he's going to go down not only as you know,

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Speaker 1: obviously an all time great. We can have the the

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Speaker 1: goat debate or whatever, but he's going to go down

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Speaker 1: as a Miami member of the Miami Heat.

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Speaker 3: It feels like that because they want you to another one,

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Speaker 3: you're saying, yeah, they're not one. Okay, So here's the

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Speaker 3: way I see this. You remember how David Stern sort

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Speaker 3: of created this whole idea of hey, let's not push

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Speaker 3: the team, let's promote the individual. Course, right, We've been

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Speaker 3: writing that this entire time. But yet somehow we still

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Speaker 3: think that the individual has to be tied to a

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Speaker 3: singular team.

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Speaker 1: He doesn't. Lebron James will go down.

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Speaker 3: As the whatever you say, top two greatest basketball players

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Speaker 3: of all time. He doesn't have to have a team

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Speaker 3: attached to him. He's Lebron freaking James. Like he did

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Speaker 3: it for Miami, he did for Cleveland, LA. And it's

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Speaker 3: an incredibly unique path let's just took that next.

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Speaker 1: It is weird though. It is weird though that like,

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Speaker 1: like Laker fans, the first time they really embraced him

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Speaker 1: was when Dylan Brooks talked trash out of this year,

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Speaker 1: Like that was the first time they're like, no, Lebron's

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Speaker 1: our guy.

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Speaker 3: That's just on Lakers fans really, Like, it's just on

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Speaker 3: you know, they've had a long history. They have, you

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Speaker 3: know a lot of people that they can be fans

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Speaker 3: of that they can call their own, that they can

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Speaker 3: you know, put posters up and if they have you know,

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Speaker 3: levels for that, if they have you know, entry points,

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Speaker 3: so that then that's fine. Lebron maybe just just hit

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Speaker 3: it this year, but that's that's to them. So the

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Speaker 3: rest of the country, he's been a Laker.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Yeah, I think it's hard because it was such

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Speaker 1: a Kobe town and during peak Kobe, post Jack Kobe,

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Speaker 1: he was the best player, and though they never matched

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Speaker 1: up against each other, there's some form of rivalry there,

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Speaker 1: and it feels like cheating on Kobe to cheer for Lebron.

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Speaker 1: It just does. It feels kind of icky. You know.

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Speaker 3: It's like, I mean, look, I even for people in Miami,

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Speaker 3: it was tough for them to cheer for Lebron when

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Speaker 3: he left for Cleveland, because yeah, obviously he did the

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Speaker 3: town a huge favor when a couple of championships made

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Speaker 3: them into a basketball town, but it still felt kind

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Speaker 3: of weird after a few years. After some time, you're

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Speaker 3: just like, all right, why would I not appreciate that?

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Speaker 3: Like why am I so tied to the Miami Heat laundry?

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Speaker 3: If you know Lebron James is doing that, I can

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Speaker 3: appreciate that. And I think if you are a Los

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Speaker 3: Angeles Lakers fan, like what's the alternative just to kind

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Speaker 3: of sit back and not enjoy what you're watching? Just

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Speaker 3: embrace it, just like the guys playing on your team

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Speaker 3: might be the greatest player of all time.

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Speaker 1: Right, And then if you look at you know, in

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Speaker 1: Laker history, you know, Shaq wasn't homegrown, Kareem wasn't homegrown. No,

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Speaker 1: Wilt wasn't homegrown. And so there is in fact a

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Speaker 1: history there of getting somebody else's best player and then

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Speaker 1: winning a title and their putting their number up up

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Speaker 1: into the rafters. Victor Webbin Yama, We've seen him once,

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Speaker 1: We'll see him tonight. This is going to be really

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Speaker 1: interesting because he has gone to the perfect place, right,

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Speaker 1: Like Lebron went to the perfect place because he's from there. Yep,

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Speaker 1: you know, this guy's gone to the perfect place because

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Speaker 1: you have a coach who's coached foreign players to incredible success,

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Speaker 1: a coach who has kind of complete control of the organization. Right,

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Speaker 1: they're not running him off anytime soon. They've always been

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Speaker 1: into whether it's resting players or developing players. There's no expectations.

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Speaker 1: And I mean, like, look, he wasn't particularly good the

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Speaker 1: other night. He'll have plenty of nights like that. But

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Speaker 1: the best place to have that is San Antonio, where

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Speaker 1: we only watch games in the highlights.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and I do think he'll drift into the background

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Speaker 3: a little bit and we'll only show those highlights when

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Speaker 3: he has a huge game. I think it's a good place.

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Speaker 3: But I think regardless, I think we need to just

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Speaker 3: pull back a little bit and recognize that this whole

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Speaker 3: label of being like the greatest prospect of all of sports,

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Speaker 3: it's over the top.

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Speaker 1: It's ridiculously over the time. Okay, so where look, I

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Speaker 1: work there, You work there. Now here's my hypothesis. Okay,

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Speaker 1: here's my hypothesis. I don't blame ESPN, but I do

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Speaker 1: blame ESPN, and I don't blame because there's just no

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Speaker 1: buzz about the draft anymore. Nobody knows who any of

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Speaker 1: these guys are, right, you know, because you have several

398
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Speaker 1: playing G League at night. Nobody watches that. You have

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Speaker 1: guys playing overtime elite nobody, you know, mainstream, they don't

400
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Speaker 1: watch that. You have some foreign players. Nobody watches that.

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Speaker 1: So what used to be a huge buzz and a

402
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Speaker 1: huge night is now eh. And so you're almost hyper

403
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Speaker 1: sensitized to give much more bolder. Hotter takes and he

404
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Speaker 1: is seven three and a half, right, right, But he's like,

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Speaker 1: there's nothing bigger than Lebron.

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Speaker 3: Here's the part that just bothers me about it is

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Speaker 3: it's not just based on what he's done, it's just

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Speaker 3: based on his size and what he can do.

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Speaker 1: Like when Lebron was.

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Speaker 3: This prospect that we had on national TV as a

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Speaker 3: sixteen year old, he was, you know, dominating in high school.

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Speaker 1: And he looked like a guy that you said, okay.

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Speaker 3: You can put him in the NBA with Wembin Yama,

414
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Speaker 3: it still felt like, wow, super potent but needs to

415
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Speaker 3: get way stronger, and we can't make comparisons to Kevin

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Speaker 3: Durant just because he's tall, like he's got to make shots.

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Speaker 1: I'll have him. He's tall, skinny and black, and you're like, okay,

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Speaker 1: well he's Kevin Rant like you.

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Speaker 3: No, no, and so like you see the clip with

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Speaker 3: him in an empty gym missing those shots, and you're

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Speaker 3: just like, all right, let's let's get let's refine these skills.

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Speaker 3: Let's let him evolve to the player that he's going

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Speaker 3: to be, because he is nowhere near that, right man.

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Speaker 1: Well, I'll also point out that I don't think people understand.

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Speaker 1: I know, Luca didn't go number one overall. Luca was nineteen.

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Speaker 1: He was the best player in Europe. He won a

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Speaker 1: European Championship, and he hit the game winning shot to

428
00:21:35,800 --> 00:21:39,639
Speaker 1: win the European Championship. He was, at least internationally, way

429
00:21:40,040 --> 00:21:43,400
Speaker 1: way more well regarded than Victor webin Yama. Victor webbin

430
00:21:43,440 --> 00:21:46,160
Speaker 1: Yama is the oh my god, he's seven to three

431
00:21:46,160 --> 00:21:48,080
Speaker 1: and a half. He you know, he looks like an

432
00:21:48,240 --> 00:21:51,520
Speaker 1: X man, right, so he's got to be a great

433
00:21:51,840 --> 00:21:54,879
Speaker 1: basketball player. All right, here's here's the last one. You have,

434
00:21:56,000 --> 00:22:03,760
Speaker 1: Like a James Harden, who immensely talented guy, but like, look,

435
00:22:03,800 --> 00:22:06,720
Speaker 1: he has a rep of kind of like an unlikable superstar.

436
00:22:07,160 --> 00:22:09,639
Speaker 1: Not as a person, that's the weird thing, right, No,

437
00:22:10,160 --> 00:22:13,560
Speaker 1: just as a player like h When he was with Houston,

438
00:22:13,600 --> 00:22:15,680
Speaker 1: he was great, But man, I just hate the way

439
00:22:15,680 --> 00:22:21,000
Speaker 1: he plays. What does some of these guys' legacies where

440
00:22:21,040 --> 00:22:23,879
Speaker 1: they're they're made a ton of money, they have a

441
00:22:23,880 --> 00:22:26,879
Speaker 1: ton of respect as players. Kyrie's another guy who people

442
00:22:27,040 --> 00:22:31,240
Speaker 1: just struggle to like personally. What do you think they

443
00:22:31,359 --> 00:22:33,240
Speaker 1: look like five ten years from now?

444
00:22:33,520 --> 00:22:36,200
Speaker 3: It's tough because I already think there's been a drop

445
00:22:36,240 --> 00:22:38,359
Speaker 3: off with James, Like look at the Houston footage and

446
00:22:38,359 --> 00:22:39,960
Speaker 3: look at him in Philly. It's just a little slower

447
00:22:40,119 --> 00:22:43,040
Speaker 3: and just not not as explosive getting to the rim.

448
00:22:43,160 --> 00:22:46,080
Speaker 3: And so I think it becomes a self awareness thing

449
00:22:46,119 --> 00:22:48,360
Speaker 3: at some point, and I think opting into this.

450
00:22:48,359 --> 00:22:50,520
Speaker 1: Deal was maybe a bit of self awareness.

451
00:22:50,080 --> 00:22:51,679
Speaker 3: Because he realized he wasn't going to get more than

452
00:22:51,680 --> 00:22:54,560
Speaker 3: that over long term. And I think he is essentially

453
00:22:54,600 --> 00:22:57,160
Speaker 3: settling in probably now, into.

454
00:22:57,080 --> 00:23:00,159
Speaker 1: What he really has to be going forward, because I.

455
00:23:00,119 --> 00:23:01,920
Speaker 3: Think last year, last Playoffs was kind of an eye

456
00:23:01,920 --> 00:23:03,400
Speaker 3: opener for him, Like, yeah, he can have a forty

457
00:23:03,400 --> 00:23:05,639
Speaker 3: point game in an important round of the playoffs, and

458
00:23:05,680 --> 00:23:08,480
Speaker 3: maybe even two of them, but he can't do that consistently,

459
00:23:08,520 --> 00:23:13,240
Speaker 3: and he can't be what Joelle needs that much that regularly,

460
00:23:13,480 --> 00:23:15,840
Speaker 3: and so I think he's going to probably one more

461
00:23:15,920 --> 00:23:17,760
Speaker 3: year at this big money and then just sort of

462
00:23:17,760 --> 00:23:20,640
Speaker 3: settle into where he can be, you know, let's say

463
00:23:20,640 --> 00:23:22,800
Speaker 3: the third guy, the fourth guy, whatever it takes, whether

464
00:23:22,800 --> 00:23:23,800
Speaker 3: it be next to Kadi.

465
00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:24,639
Speaker 1: And Phoenix or something like that.

466
00:23:24,680 --> 00:23:27,120
Speaker 3: I think he will eventually have that level of self

467
00:23:27,160 --> 00:23:29,280
Speaker 3: awareness and be, you know, just the setup guy who

468
00:23:29,320 --> 00:23:29,880
Speaker 3: doesn't try to.

469
00:23:29,800 --> 00:23:33,000
Speaker 1: Do too much. I think the NBA con is great.

470
00:23:33,440 --> 00:23:35,560
Speaker 1: I like the cup idea. I'm not sure I like

471
00:23:35,600 --> 00:23:38,640
Speaker 1: the timing of it right coinciding with playoff foot playoff

472
00:23:38,680 --> 00:23:42,639
Speaker 1: college football and the late season in the NFL, but

473
00:23:42,880 --> 00:23:45,160
Speaker 1: I like the idea of it. I think the big

474
00:23:45,240 --> 00:23:48,200
Speaker 1: question is, like, I'm mutching Steph play in the playoffs,

475
00:23:48,400 --> 00:23:52,280
Speaker 1: and I look down. He's thirty five. Yeah, lebron all right,

476
00:23:52,359 --> 00:23:55,879
Speaker 1: so we got probably two years, right, gonna play a

477
00:23:55,920 --> 00:23:59,600
Speaker 1: year with Bronni, So that's his deal. So they both

478
00:23:59,640 --> 00:24:03,800
Speaker 1: probably have two or three years left, and people want

479
00:24:03,800 --> 00:24:05,960
Speaker 1: to make the ratings about a lot of things. It's

480
00:24:06,000 --> 00:24:09,520
Speaker 1: not about it's really about Lebron and Steph. One they

481
00:24:09,600 --> 00:24:11,720
Speaker 1: got time zone issues playing in the Pacific time zone,

482
00:24:12,040 --> 00:24:14,680
Speaker 1: and two when they're not playing, there's just a drop off.

483
00:24:14,760 --> 00:24:17,520
Speaker 1: So you have these two factors or three factors going in. One,

484
00:24:17,640 --> 00:24:21,560
Speaker 1: you have aging superstars. You don't have anybody that has

485
00:24:21,720 --> 00:24:26,600
Speaker 1: an American born player that's that level of likability. And

486
00:24:26,640 --> 00:24:29,399
Speaker 1: then the best players in your league, a lot of

487
00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:32,920
Speaker 1: them are foreign born, which it doesn't make you like.

488
00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:35,400
Speaker 3: To say for the intrigue for the for the NBA

489
00:24:35,400 --> 00:24:37,280
Speaker 3: playoff tournament, or just in jet our NBA in game

490
00:24:37,320 --> 00:24:38,680
Speaker 3: turn just the.

491
00:24:38,720 --> 00:24:41,880
Speaker 1: NBA in general. Right, Like, look at the ratings this year.

492
00:24:42,680 --> 00:24:45,000
Speaker 1: Jokich is an incredible player. And granted some of it's

493
00:24:45,040 --> 00:24:47,520
Speaker 1: that he's in Denver and they haven't won anything, but

494
00:24:48,119 --> 00:24:50,840
Speaker 1: Jokich can win three or four titles. I don't necessarily

495
00:24:50,880 --> 00:24:53,000
Speaker 1: know if it's going to move the meter with mainstream America.

496
00:24:53,040 --> 00:24:55,960
Speaker 1: Whereas Steph in it, Lebron in it, it's a whole

497
00:24:55,960 --> 00:24:58,320
Speaker 1: different vibe. And we're like two years away from neither

498
00:24:58,320 --> 00:24:59,720
Speaker 1: of them being in this game. Yeah.

499
00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:02,560
Speaker 3: I do think though that there are the next wave

500
00:25:02,680 --> 00:25:05,119
Speaker 3: and I think people are paying close enough attention, Like

501
00:25:05,160 --> 00:25:08,359
Speaker 3: I think it really it really hurts to have Zion

502
00:25:08,600 --> 00:25:10,400
Speaker 3: not around as often. It really hurts to have John

503
00:25:10,440 --> 00:25:12,840
Speaker 3: Moran in this situation because those two really sort of

504
00:25:12,880 --> 00:25:16,199
Speaker 3: filled a gap, if you will. I personally think that

505
00:25:16,359 --> 00:25:18,640
Speaker 3: this particular draft class because it's not just about Victor.

506
00:25:18,640 --> 00:25:21,200
Speaker 3: I think the Thompsons are spectacular. I think Scoot's gonna

507
00:25:21,200 --> 00:25:22,720
Speaker 3: be really good. I think Brandon Miller is going to

508
00:25:22,760 --> 00:25:24,280
Speaker 3: be solid. I think it's going to be really good

509
00:25:24,320 --> 00:25:28,240
Speaker 3: draft class with probably three or four franchise type players

510
00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:31,320
Speaker 3: coming out of it, and you know, two of them

511
00:25:31,359 --> 00:25:32,840
Speaker 3: the top ten twins being American born.

512
00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:34,400
Speaker 1: I think there's a lot there.

513
00:25:34,440 --> 00:25:36,720
Speaker 3: I think the league still has a lot and I

514
00:25:36,760 --> 00:25:39,040
Speaker 3: think when Lebron, I think all eyes alone Lebron, because

515
00:25:39,040 --> 00:25:40,840
Speaker 3: you're trying to bring in a little bit more of

516
00:25:40,880 --> 00:25:42,480
Speaker 3: the casuals, a little bit more of the you know,

517
00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:45,119
Speaker 3: the non necessarily NBA fans, especially at this point of

518
00:25:45,119 --> 00:25:46,840
Speaker 3: his career with the nostalgia and everything else.

519
00:25:47,080 --> 00:25:48,400
Speaker 1: But I just think there's a lot there.

520
00:25:48,400 --> 00:25:49,920
Speaker 3: I think Victor Webb Begnam is going to bring a

521
00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:52,720
Speaker 3: lot of attention, and you know this in season tournament

522
00:25:52,760 --> 00:25:54,920
Speaker 3: where you know, I was critical of the play, and

523
00:25:55,240 --> 00:25:58,000
Speaker 3: then eventually, even though it might not be exactly what

524
00:25:58,320 --> 00:25:59,320
Speaker 3: you know, it might.

525
00:25:59,200 --> 00:26:00,600
Speaker 1: Not solve take looking forever.

526
00:26:00,840 --> 00:26:02,560
Speaker 3: It was just good for business, Like it was set

527
00:26:02,600 --> 00:26:04,600
Speaker 3: up for some few games and play where the.

528
00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:06,679
Speaker 1: End of the regular season is interesting to get in

529
00:26:06,800 --> 00:26:12,000
Speaker 1: or jockey for position. And I think the.

530
00:26:10,960 --> 00:26:13,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, if you you set up you know, a semi

531
00:26:13,520 --> 00:26:16,080
Speaker 3: final in Vegas where you know a guy on a

532
00:26:16,080 --> 00:26:18,480
Speaker 3: minimum might be getting an extra five hundred k like that,

533
00:26:18,480 --> 00:26:20,000
Speaker 3: that brings a little juice to the game. And if

534
00:26:20,040 --> 00:26:21,680
Speaker 3: there's a little juice with the players, you're gonna see

535
00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:22,840
Speaker 3: it on the floor and the fans are going to

536
00:26:22,840 --> 00:26:25,800
Speaker 3: appreciate it. So I think you know timing of it, like, yeah,

537
00:26:25,840 --> 00:26:28,080
Speaker 3: you're competing against everything else, but you were competing against

538
00:26:28,080 --> 00:26:30,080
Speaker 3: that stuff with regular regular season games, So why not

539
00:26:30,119 --> 00:26:30,959
Speaker 3: prop them up a little bit?

540
00:26:31,080 --> 00:26:33,320
Speaker 1: Make that makes it? That makes a whole whole lot

541
00:26:33,359 --> 00:26:38,040
Speaker 1: of sense. Last thing you've gotten to do, Like you

542
00:26:38,040 --> 00:26:41,720
Speaker 1: get to cover this thing forever. Who's the best dude?

543
00:26:42,720 --> 00:26:45,560
Speaker 1: Like just like that's a really good however question, who's

544
00:26:45,600 --> 00:26:46,439
Speaker 1: a really good dude?

545
00:26:48,080 --> 00:26:52,040
Speaker 3: I mean, the most experiences I've had, like Dwayne Wade

546
00:26:52,080 --> 00:26:54,440
Speaker 3: is always going to be my guy, like from day

547
00:26:54,480 --> 00:26:57,560
Speaker 3: one till you know, even after he retired and didn't

548
00:26:57,560 --> 00:27:02,399
Speaker 3: even more impactful things. Uh, he's genuine. He's super nice,

549
00:27:02,520 --> 00:27:05,359
Speaker 3: great guy. Shane Battier is one of the most you know,

550
00:27:05,400 --> 00:27:08,399
Speaker 3: straightforward and nice guys in the league. And I mean

551
00:27:08,480 --> 00:27:10,640
Speaker 3: I've been a Ray Allen fan, as you know when

552
00:27:10,680 --> 00:27:12,159
Speaker 3: we used to have the all Interview teams.

553
00:27:12,320 --> 00:27:13,320
Speaker 1: Anybody else know about the.

554
00:27:13,320 --> 00:27:15,040
Speaker 3: All Interview teams back then, I used to have all

555
00:27:15,080 --> 00:27:17,800
Speaker 3: interview teams and he was always my vote. And so

556
00:27:17,920 --> 00:27:19,920
Speaker 3: I mean he was a MIT Milwaukee. So yeah, I'll

557
00:27:19,960 --> 00:27:21,960
Speaker 3: say those three and yeah, they all play.

558
00:27:21,840 --> 00:27:23,600
Speaker 1: For the heat. How about that? Yeah, they did all

559
00:27:24,080 --> 00:27:25,920
Speaker 1: is he good Tierras? Of course you see him on ESPN. MA,

560
00:27:25,960 --> 00:27:30,840
Speaker 1: you're great man. I appreciate you. I appreciate that. Ami,

561
00:27:30,920 --> 00:27:34,399
Speaker 1: Thanks to Israel good Tierras. That was awesome. He's a great,

562
00:27:34,400 --> 00:27:36,680
Speaker 1: great dude. I've done him for a long time and

563
00:27:36,760 --> 00:27:39,280
Speaker 1: the honesty with which he shares his information and his

564
00:27:40,320 --> 00:27:43,800
Speaker 1: passion for it is unmatched. Loved having Israel good Tierras

565
00:27:43,840 --> 00:27:45,600
Speaker 1: with me. Thanks so much for listening. Remember the Doug

566
00:27:45,600 --> 00:27:48,199
Speaker 1: Gotleib Show is daily three to five Eastern time, and

567
00:27:48,240 --> 00:27:50,280
Speaker 1: of course We have the in the bonus podcast, which

568
00:27:50,320 --> 00:27:52,560
Speaker 1: is the third hour, and that one No Holds Barred.

569
00:27:52,680 --> 00:28:01,679
Speaker 1: I'm Doug Gottlieb. This is all ball, the bomb,