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Speaker 1: Republican regulators have begun dismantling Obama era nette neutrality rules,

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Speaker 1: opening the way for fewer restrictions on broadband providers and

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Speaker 1: raising web companies fears they'll face barriers to reaching customers.

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Speaker 1: The net neutrality rules make it illegal for Internet service

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Speaker 1: providers such as A T and T, Comcast, and Verizon

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Speaker 1: to block website, slow connection speeds, or charge extra for

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Speaker 1: faster delivery of certain content. The Federal Communications Commission, in

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Speaker 1: a two to one Republican led vote, gave preliminary approval

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Speaker 1: to Chairman Agit Pye's plan to replace rules passed in

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Speaker 1: twenty fifteen by Democrats. That begins months of public feedback

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Speaker 1: and consideration, leading to a second conclusive vote. Our guests

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Speaker 1: are Jonathan Spalter, president and CEO of US Telecom, a

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Speaker 1: trade group for broadband providers including A, T and T

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Speaker 1: and Verizon, and Daniel Lyons, professor at Boston College Law School. Jonathan,

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Speaker 1: why do broadband providers object to these rules which prevent

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Speaker 1: them from blocking and slowing down websites? Well, first of all,

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Speaker 1: it's great to be here, but I think we all

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Speaker 1: have to begin this discussion, but by taking a deeper

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Speaker 1: act in fact, the broadband industry is four square UH

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Speaker 1: supportive of making sure that our Internet will remain UH open,

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Speaker 1: that we believe in that neutrality. What we want to

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Speaker 1: do is to develop a more modern and enforceable set

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Speaker 1: of rules that will enable not only more innovation in

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Speaker 1: our networks, but also ensure that we can protect consumers

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Speaker 1: we all deeply care about, to ensure that the kind

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Speaker 1: of Internet protections that we've all enjoyed over the past

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Speaker 1: two decades of our experience with the Internet, that has

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Speaker 1: created so much opportunity, so much innovation, can continue to

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Speaker 1: proceed proceeded in the future. There's nobody who agrees with

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Speaker 1: the idea that our consumers shouldn't be protected and we

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Speaker 1: shouldn't preserve an open and free internet. That is the

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Speaker 1: bedrock principle for UH the entire industry. What we're seeking

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Speaker 1: is a more thoughtful and more modern, more flexible approach

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Speaker 1: that will be as equipped to deal with the kind

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Speaker 1: of innovation cycles that week yet to experience without inhibiting

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Speaker 1: and without slowing down investment, without slowing down innovation, but

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Speaker 1: at the same time making sure that we have enforceable

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Speaker 1: approaches to make our open Internet their main that way

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Speaker 1: that a g PIE has put forward for for getting

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Speaker 1: rid of these Obama era rules, and you heard some

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Speaker 1: of it from Jonathan. There has been that they discourage

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Speaker 1: investment and innovation. Is there evidence to to support that assertion? Well,

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Speaker 1: we have done deep is Daniel in the I was

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Speaker 1: asking Daniels He on the line, Oh yeah, I am um.

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Speaker 1: So the evidence, I think it's fair to say, is mixed.

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Speaker 1: There have been a number of studies that have been

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Speaker 1: released that have suggested that, uh, since the two thousand

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Speaker 1: fifteen rules have come into effect, that in fact, broadband

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Speaker 1: investment has gone down by the major providers. There's been

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Speaker 1: some on the other side who have challenged those figures

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Speaker 1: and released studies of their own. I think the broader

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Speaker 1: since here is is uh that Um. The goal of

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Speaker 1: the SEC in this case is to encourage broadband investment.

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Speaker 1: But I think the broader goal is to try to

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Speaker 1: figure out what the right vehicle is by which to

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Speaker 1: regulate the Internet going forward. And Jonathan, our consumers supposed

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Speaker 1: to trust that their broad broadband providers will always put

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Speaker 1: the public interest before their companies or stockholders interests. Well,

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Speaker 1: I think it's past as product and the answers renoundingly

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Speaker 1: that there's really good reason for them to do so.

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Speaker 1: Up until at the last couple of years of the

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Speaker 1: Abom administration, our Internet had been guided by a regulatory

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Speaker 1: framework that was advanced by President Clinton, supported by a

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Speaker 1: Republican Congress, that allowed for an enormous amount of innovation

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Speaker 1: and openness to become the dominant teams in the evolution

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Speaker 1: of our Internet and consumers experience with it. We have

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Speaker 1: all enjoyed an opening Internet that has given rise to

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Speaker 1: uninavaginable UM developments, incredible companies like Google and Yahoo, enormous

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Speaker 1: amounts of brought down deployment, and you know, close to

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Speaker 1: a trillion dollars actually more than a trillion dollars of

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Speaker 1: investment in UH making sure that our networks can continue

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Speaker 1: to evolve and become faster and more resilient. This is

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Speaker 1: all based on a statutory framework that took a light

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Speaker 1: touch to making sure that our Internet can remain rather

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Speaker 1: than strait Jack didn't in UM the four h idea

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Speaker 1: that our Internet, one of the most innovative inventions in

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Speaker 1: human kind, should be subject to much more onerous um

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Speaker 1: UH strictures as a public utility, as a common carrier Daniel.

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Speaker 1: Let me let me ask Daniel to respond to that,

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Speaker 1: what do you think about the argument that Jonathan's making there?

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Speaker 1: So I actually tend to agree that, Um, regardless of

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Speaker 1: the merits of net neutrality, the movement towards reclassification under

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Speaker 1: Title two was not the vehicle in which to accomplish

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Speaker 1: this goal, right. The Um, the SEC's unfortunately in a

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Speaker 1: position where, uh, they're perpetually having to to try to

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Speaker 1: fit square pigs into round holes. Right. The last time

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Speaker 1: the Communications Act was updated was back in when Uh,

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Speaker 1: those of us who are on the Internet, we're doing

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Speaker 1: so via dial up. Uh, And the word broadband doesn't

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Speaker 1: appear in the Act more than a handful of times.

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Speaker 1: So I think, um, it's exactly right that the those

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Speaker 1: who were making policy vision the light touch over the

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Speaker 1: Internet because they really weren't sure how it was going

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Speaker 1: to evolve. But since then, the decision to simply try

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Speaker 1: to enact Internet regulation by treating broadband providers essentially as

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Speaker 1: phone companies with somewhat misguided. Uh. Ultimately, I think the

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Speaker 1: right answer here is going to be uh, some update

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Speaker 1: to the Communications Act coming out of Congress. Daniel. Consumer

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Speaker 1: advocates argue that these rules take advanced petition, innovation, small businesses,

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Speaker 1: and entrepreneurs, and there's hardly an Internet based company that

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Speaker 1: has come out in favor of changing the rules. So

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Speaker 1: why is there the disconnect between consumer advocates and the

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Speaker 1: broadband providers. I think the primary concern here isn't the

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Speaker 1: creation of net neutrality rules. I think most people agree

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Speaker 1: and not everybody at this point agrees that broadband providers

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Speaker 1: shouldn't be in the business of blocking content or throttling content. Um.

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Speaker 1: The challenge, I think, is the vehicle by which you

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Speaker 1: get there, right. So, by imposing UM title to common

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Speaker 1: carriage onto broadband providers, the FCC created a host of

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Speaker 1: problems that it wasn't anticipating at the time, one of

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Speaker 1: which was the whole that it ripped in data privacy rules.

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Speaker 1: So the Federal Trade Commission regulates data privacy, but it

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Speaker 1: doesn't have jurisdiction over common carriers. So the moment the

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Speaker 1: FCC labeled broadband providers common carriers, suddenly there was no

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Speaker 1: privacy law applying to broadband pro writers. I'm gonna have

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Speaker 1: to stop. I'm going to have to stop you there.

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Speaker 1: We'll continue the discussion another time. Thank you. Daniel Lyons,

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Speaker 1: Professor Boston College Law School, and Jonathan Spultor, President and

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Speaker 1: CEO of US Telecom. That's it for this edition of

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Speaker 1: Bloomberg Law. We'll be back Monday at one pm Wall

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Speaker 1: Street Time. Thanks to our technical director Chris tried Comby

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Speaker 1: and our producer David Suckerman. You've been listening to Bloomberg

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Speaker 1: Law on Bloomberg Radio. This is Bloomberg