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Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind, a production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: Hey you welcome to Weird House Cinema.

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Speaker 3: This is Rob Lamb and this is Joe McCormick. And

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Speaker 3: last week on Weird House Cinema we talked about the

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Speaker 3: nineteen eighty four fantasy short film Quest, directed by Saul

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Speaker 3: and Elaine Bass, and that was a real good time.

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Speaker 3: If you haven't heard that episode yet, I recommend you

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Speaker 3: go back and check that out. But this week I

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Speaker 3: kind of wanted to stick to the theme of short films,

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Speaker 3: especially weird short films. In the thirty minute run time zone,

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Speaker 3: that's about how long Quest was. So today we're going

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Speaker 3: to be talking about a picture that I've had on

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Speaker 3: my list for a while, the surreal genre Defying nineteen

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Speaker 3: seventy two made for TV Spanish short film La Cabina

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Speaker 3: or The Telephone Box, directed by Antonio Mrcero. Now, much

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Speaker 3: like Quest, The telephone Box you can really do in

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Speaker 3: a one sentence plot description. It is very light on

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Speaker 3: plot machinations, not a lot of dialogue, not a lot

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Speaker 3: of information to process except for weird little images and

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Speaker 3: things to kind of wonder how you should read as

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Speaker 3: the situation develops, but instead of a plot per se,

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Speaker 3: this movie really does have more of a situation, and

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Speaker 3: that situation is a man gets stuck inside a telephone

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Speaker 3: booth and he can't get out. And warning, before we

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Speaker 3: say anything else, this movie does have some major twists

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Speaker 3: and surprises, and we're going to be talking about all

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Speaker 3: of that. So if you want to watch it unspoiled,

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Speaker 3: you should pause here and go do that. The film

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Speaker 3: is available to stream for free online, including in what

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Speaker 3: looks to me like an official upload on YouTube by

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Speaker 3: the television station that owns the rights to it, which

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Speaker 3: I think is RTVE out of Spain.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, RTV Archivo. That's how I watched it. And

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Speaker 2: outside of that, I'm not aware of an actual physical

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Speaker 2: release for this film, though of course sometimes short films

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Speaker 2: like these do get included as extras on the release

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Speaker 2: of full features, but this seems to be the best,

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Speaker 2: if not only, way to watch it right now, at

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Speaker 2: least internationally.

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Speaker 3: So again, the situation that takes place in this film

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Speaker 3: is a man gets stuck in a telephone box and

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Speaker 3: he can't get out. Now, what's really interesting about this

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Speaker 3: story is the way the situation develops, both in terms

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Speaker 3: of tone, and I would say, ultimately in terms of genre.

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Speaker 3: I said at the top this was a genre defying film,

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Speaker 3: and I think you could quite reasonably ask how one

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Speaker 3: would classify it if you were going to have to

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Speaker 3: shelve it at the video store. Where does this go?

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Speaker 3: I've seen write ups that do classify it as a

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Speaker 3: comedy and write ups that classify it as horror. I

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Speaker 3: think it's a lot easier to say it is horror

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Speaker 3: if you had to pick one, but a lot of

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Speaker 3: writing about this notes that it is both. And while

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Speaker 3: I think it certainly is both, I think it would

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Speaker 3: be quite misleading to call Lacabina a horror comedy. That

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Speaker 3: would give the wrong impression, because horror comedy is a

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Speaker 3: well established hybrid genre. But in thinking about this question

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Speaker 3: of what to call Lacabina, I realized that almost all

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Speaker 3: so called horror comedy movies are built the same way,

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Speaker 3: and that is, the bones are horror and the flesh

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Speaker 3: is comedy. So in a horror comedy movie, the plot,

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Speaker 3: the setting, the characters, and situations will almost entirely be

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Speaker 3: those of the horror genre. And then what makes it

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Speaker 3: a comedy is that we get ironic reversals on the

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Speaker 3: expected imagery or tone, maybe through dialogue or the behavior

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Speaker 3: of the characters. You will get changes that twist the

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Speaker 3: basic horror situation and make it funny. When I make

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Speaker 3: a mental list of horror comedy movies, I think this

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Speaker 3: basic format applies to all of them, all the ones

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Speaker 3: I can think of Evil Dead, to Grimlins, Grimlins to

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Speaker 3: Sean of the Dead, Cabin in the Woods, etc. It's

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Speaker 3: really hard to think of a movie that people think

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Speaker 3: of as horror comedy that doesn't basically work like that,

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Speaker 3: built like a horror film, but then furnished and decorated

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Speaker 3: with comedy.

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Speaker 2: I think Trimmor's is a great example of this. Tremors

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Speaker 2: is a film that doesn't do anything in its structure

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Speaker 2: and plot that really screams comedy, but the characters are

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Speaker 2: fun and funny yes at times, and therefore you get

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Speaker 2: plenty of chuckles in there, and you can, I think,

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Speaker 2: accurately call it a horror comedy to some degree.

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Speaker 3: I think that's a great example, and I think there's

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Speaker 3: a reason that horror comedies are usually built like this.

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Speaker 3: Comedy by nature works by subverting expectations. So I think

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Speaker 3: the laugh moment in a comedy routine comes from your

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Speaker 3: brain recognizing some kind of incongruity. I think that's not

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Speaker 3: how that works, or that's not what's supposed to happen,

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Speaker 3: or that's not the right way to respond, and so forth.

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Speaker 3: So when you merge comedy with another genre of storytelling,

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Speaker 3: the script to follow is pretty clear. You change or

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Speaker 3: subvert the expectations of that other genre in amusing ways.

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Speaker 3: So maybe you play with the tone like it's a

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Speaker 3: horror situation, but the moment, the moment where things would

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Speaker 3: normally be very serious, something silly happens. Or maybe you

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Speaker 3: satirize the genre itself, like you invert horror tropes in

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Speaker 3: a way that reveals something about the reason that writers

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Speaker 3: invoke them, which undercuts their power. So in you know,

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Speaker 3: this is what you get more of in movies that

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Speaker 3: are satires on horror itself, like Happin in the Woods.

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Speaker 3: So I think that's the way it almost always works.

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Speaker 3: The other element in the genre hybrid, be it horror

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Speaker 3: or fantasy or whatever, is the setup, and then the

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Speaker 3: comedy is by its very nature. The twist on that.

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Speaker 3: The short film we're going to be talking about today

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Speaker 3: is I would argue the extremely rare inverse of this

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Speaker 3: blueprint in lack of beina, the bones are comedy and

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Speaker 3: the flesh is horror.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. I think that is a very valid point. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: because everything about the premise even just screams comedy. You

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Speaker 2: hear it and you're like, all right, I'm ready to

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Speaker 2: hear this joke. You don't know that the joke's punchline

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Speaker 2: is going to be so bleak and horror centric. But

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Speaker 2: it initially seems to have the structure of comedy, the

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Speaker 2: structure of.

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Speaker 3: A joke exactly right. So it's a comedy situation. In fact,

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Speaker 3: we could explore more about this as we go on,

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Speaker 3: but it feels to me like a very old, classic,

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Speaker 3: almost silent film era style of comedy situation. It makes

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Speaker 3: me think of Charlie Chaplin.

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Speaker 2: Oh absolutely, yeah, it's very mind too, of course, like this,

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Speaker 2: the mind act is oh, I'm stuck in a box,

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Speaker 2: and that's the basic plot here. Yeah. In fact, I

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Speaker 2: believe the filmmakers when they were casting it, initially one

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Speaker 2: of them was pushing for them hiring a mind like

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Speaker 2: let's get somebody who can who can do that level

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Speaker 2: of wordless pure body acting.

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Speaker 3: And the main actor that is cast in the film

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Speaker 3: is the guy who gets stuck in the box does

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Speaker 3: have a lot of mimelike skills. So the setup of

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Speaker 3: the plot is an absurd, humiliating physical situation where there's

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Speaker 3: like a mechanical problem to solve. Again, this is like

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Speaker 3: a Charlie Chaplin scene. So you're stuck in a box

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Speaker 3: and we watch various stereotyped characters come along and try

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Speaker 3: and fail to solve the problem in amusing ways. However,

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Speaker 3: if this movie had just been a comedy that delivered

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Speaker 3: on that premise, I don't think it would be all

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Speaker 3: that well remembered. Not like the comedy elements are not good,

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Speaker 3: but it just wouldn't stand out in the way that

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Speaker 3: it actually does. This movie made a big impression on

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Speaker 3: a lot of people. We can talk more about its

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Speaker 3: cultural impact in a bit, but I think it is

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Speaker 3: the horror twist that really makes this movie memorable to

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Speaker 3: people and is what makes it kind of masterful. So

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Speaker 3: as the comedy scenario drags on, there is a very gradual,

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Speaker 3: almost imperceptibly increasing tone of menace and despair, and moment

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Speaker 3: by moment, the situation just becomes less funny and a

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Speaker 3: little weirder. And more ominous, until by the final moments

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Speaker 3: we are in full throttle nightmare territory. And I honestly

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Speaker 3: cannot think of another film that pulls off this kind

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Speaker 3: of revolution in genre and tone across its run time.

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Speaker 3: It's a really interesting project, has a very unique effect

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Speaker 3: on the viewer, and I can't think of anything else

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Speaker 3: quite like it.

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Speaker 2: The only picture that's coming to my mind that does

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Speaker 2: something even kind of like this is Terry Gilliams Brazil

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Speaker 2: with of course it's actual ending, not the fairy tale ending,

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Speaker 2: but the right bleak ending that that we get in

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Speaker 2: that picture, which is one of the things that makes

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Speaker 2: it so memorable. Like there's so much in Brazil that is,

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Speaker 2: you know, stupid and absurd and outright comedic, but we

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Speaker 2: land in a very dark place, in a very contemplative place,

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Speaker 2: and I think it's one of the reasons that Brazil

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Speaker 2: resonates so strongly with everyone.

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Speaker 3: I think that's a really good point of comparison, though

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Speaker 3: I would say it's different because I think the bleak

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Speaker 3: and ominous stuff is there from the beginning in Brazil,

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Speaker 3: but throughout the runtime it's also like earlier on especially,

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Speaker 3: it's a lot funnier, and then it just ends in

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Speaker 3: like its bleakest point, whereas this is a movie that

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Speaker 3: starts it's not scary or bleak at all at the beginning.

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Speaker 3: It starts off completely lighthearted and then ends where it does.

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Speaker 2: Now we've mentioned absurdity a couple of times, and I

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Speaker 2: think absurdity is also key to understanding The Telephone Box.

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Speaker 2: I think it makes wonderful use of absurdity in multiple ways,

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Speaker 2: and I think we are generally primed to in interpret

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Speaker 2: absurdity in terms of comedy, at least at first. Maybe

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Speaker 2: there's some sort of scenario though, where if absurdity, if

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Speaker 2: you're continually bombarded with absurdity, it eventually becomes horror. I'm

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Speaker 2: not sure, but I think one of the film's great

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Speaker 2: merits is that on the whole as even though we

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Speaker 2: have an absurd premise, from the get go, it's pretty

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Speaker 2: much played straight. We have some goofy moments, some physical comedy,

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Speaker 2: but even those goofier moments I think are played with

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Speaker 2: a realistic air and deliberately avoid going full cartoon on anything.

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Speaker 2: And we'll touch on some examples of this when we

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Speaker 2: get into the plot later, and then of course at

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Speaker 2: the center of it all, our unfortunate man, our gray

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Speaker 2: man trapped in the phone booth played by Jose Lewis

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Speaker 2: Lopez Vsquez, who we'll get to here in a minute,

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Speaker 2: is portrayed just very believable, very relatable. It has this

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Speaker 2: quiet dignity and frustration and embarrassment that just steadily gives

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Speaker 2: way to these darker emotional states.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, I think that's right, And I think I'm

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Speaker 3: not the first to point this out. You know, people

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Speaker 3: have written before about the kind of surprising overlap between

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Speaker 3: comedy and horror and the way I think they can

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Speaker 3: both stem from absurd situations that you know, the genres

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Speaker 3: do have a lot in common, Like they both deal

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Speaker 3: with the with the building and then the release of tension.

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Speaker 3: That's the structure of a joke, and that's the structure

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Speaker 3: of a scare in a horror movie. And as you

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Speaker 3: were just pointing out, with like the situational absurdity in

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Speaker 3: the film, a lot of times the difference but like

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Speaker 3: the same events could be shown as comedy or as horror,

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Speaker 3: And really all that it takes to make a difference

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Speaker 3: between the two is your perspective.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, So.

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Speaker 3: Another thing I wanted to bring up about Lacabino or

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Speaker 3: the telephone Box is that this is not an obscurer movie.

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Speaker 3: Actually certainly not obscure within Spain. You know, we on

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Speaker 3: a weird House. We cover stuff most people have never

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Speaker 3: heard of, and we cover stuff that's pretty well known.

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Speaker 3: This is actually sort of both because I think many

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Speaker 3: English speaking listeners will probably never heard of it. But

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Speaker 3: in Spain, I think lots of people saw this on TV,

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Speaker 3: certainly back when it came out. Lots of people who

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Speaker 3: are adults now saw it on TV when they were kids,

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Speaker 3: having no idea what it was, and it left a

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Speaker 3: powerful impression on them. This is one of those movies

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Speaker 3: where there's like a lot of Internet search traffic of

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Speaker 3: people asking what was the horror movie where the guy

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Speaker 3: gets stuck in a phone box? And then they come

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Speaker 3: across this and find these web pages about it. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I think, as we've discussed before, that's one of the

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Speaker 2: brilliant things about broadcast horror television is that so many

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Speaker 2: of us watched something or part of something and it

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Speaker 2: just stuck in our heads and we had no idea

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Speaker 2: what it was. And it's only much later via the

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Speaker 2: Internet that were able to find out. Oh yeah, I was,

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Speaker 2: that's what it was. It was in my case like Nasaka,

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Speaker 2: it was Nasica or various horror movies that I saw

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Speaker 2: parts of.

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Speaker 3: We may have mentioned this on the show before, but

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Speaker 3: I remember having a conversation with my dad about this

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Speaker 3: where he was remember from when he was a kid

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Speaker 3: seeing something on TV that really scared him, and just

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Speaker 3: talking through it, we were able to figure out what

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Speaker 3: it was, and it was an episode of Boris Karloff's

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Speaker 3: thriller that was an adaptation of the story Pigeons from Hell.

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Speaker 3: Oh yes, yes, the short story by Robert E. Howard.

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Speaker 3: But anyway, coming back to the telephone box, something quite

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Speaker 3: interesting about this was that it was something of a

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Speaker 3: cultural sensation. It was kind of the talk of the

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Speaker 3: town in Spain when it first aired in December nineteen

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Speaker 3: seventy two, and I was reading an article about this

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Speaker 3: movie called Lacabina Creating Horror from the Absurd. This was

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Speaker 3: published in an online magazine called The Artifice, written by

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Speaker 3: a contributor just called Amius. I guess that's like a

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Speaker 3: pseudonym or something. But in this article, which is definitely

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Speaker 3: worth a read for a lot of the background on

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Speaker 3: the film. The author talks about how the movie gave

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Speaker 3: rise to so it was not only talked about a lot,

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Speaker 3: it gave rise to a kind of urban legend in Madrid. Basically,

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Speaker 3: I think the idea was that people in Madrid were

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Speaker 3: becoming trapped in phone boxes and later being kidnapped by

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Speaker 3: sort of agents in shadowy uniforms, and nobody knew where

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Speaker 3: they were taken, and so this actually would cause people

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Speaker 3: to be afraid. And maybe whether or not they'd actually

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Speaker 3: seen this short on TV, maybe they just heard about

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Speaker 3: the kind of rumor of this thing happening secondhand, and

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Speaker 3: so they go into a phone box to make a

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Speaker 3: call and leave their legs sticking out to keep the

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Speaker 3: door from shutting.

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Speaker 2: I love that they made phone boxes scary, which we should.

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Speaker 2: This would probably is probably a good point in the

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Speaker 2: podcast to mention for our younger listeners high zoomers. A

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Speaker 2: phone box or a telephone booth is a is a compartment,

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Speaker 2: sometimes open on one or more sides, but sometimes it

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Speaker 2: can be sealed with a door, and there is a

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Speaker 2: pay telephone in there, a telephone that you would put

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Speaker 2: money into in order to place calls and could receive

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Speaker 2: calls if you've watched enough older films, especially like noir films,

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Speaker 2: you know, payphones off and feature into the plot. So

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Speaker 2: I'm half joking and having to remind everyone what it is.

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Speaker 2: But I also found it an interesting experience to watch

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Speaker 2: this film that is so centered around a phone booth

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Speaker 2: and really asking myself, have I ever actually used one

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Speaker 2: in my life? And I'm not sure that I have

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Speaker 2: ever used a fully enclosed phone booth before.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm not sure I've used payphones when I was younger,

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Speaker 3: but I don't know if they were ever the kind

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Speaker 3: that were enclosed in a glass box.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, there is something just unique about the idea that

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Speaker 2: I must seal myself into this space in order to

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Speaker 2: then have this disembodied conversation with another place. There's almost

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Speaker 2: kind of a magic act going on there, which I

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Speaker 2: think they're tapping into a little bit here.

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Speaker 3: Well, you want privacy for your call, but I mean,

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Speaker 3: does it feel private when everybody can see you from

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Speaker 3: all sides?

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Speaker 2: I don't know. I mean I nowadays with everyone. I mean,

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Speaker 2: it seems like this was a national expectation for folks.

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Speaker 2: People are gonna have phone calls out in public. They

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Speaker 2: want privacy, but now we know they don't really want privacy.

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Speaker 2: People have all sorts of hyper sensitive phone calls out

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Speaker 2: in front of tons of people. So it turns out

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Speaker 2: it really didn't matter.

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Speaker 3: Okay, I got another bizarre cultural legacy of this movie.

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Speaker 3: Also mentioned in that same article on the Artifice, in

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Speaker 3: what seems to me like a quite bizarre marketing choice,

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Speaker 3: there's a Spanish telecom company called Telefonica which actually released

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Speaker 3: TV ads after this special that were a parody of it,

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Speaker 3: using the star of the movie in the ads. That

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Speaker 3: will seem even more bizarre to you after we discuss

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Speaker 3: the whole plot.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, as that Artifice article kind of gets into, it's

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Speaker 2: really kind of brilliant. It's like, uh oh, they've made

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Speaker 2: telephone booth scary. What do we do? We embrace it,

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Speaker 2: We turn it into a commercial. Even though from angles

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Speaker 2: that seems a little tone deaf, it actually reminds me

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Speaker 2: of some of the Severance branded ads out there right

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Speaker 2: now for stuff like zip Recruiter, where they're just like, Yep, Severance,

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Speaker 2: that's great, let's attach our brand to that. When Severance

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Speaker 2: is in many ways like a really cutting look at

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Speaker 2: workplace culture and and you know what it does to

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Speaker 2: us and what we do to ourselves there.

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Speaker 3: So I'm a surfboard company. Let's make a Jaws themed commercial.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I don't know, But then again, I guess

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Speaker 2: any publicity is good publicity, so they go for it.

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Speaker 3: Now. Actually, the story of the ad for this telephone

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Speaker 3: company gets even stranger because that article talks about how

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Speaker 3: the movie itself, the short film may have been in

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Speaker 3: part inspired by a telephone company ad that aired in

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Speaker 3: the nineteen sixties and also had the star of this

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Speaker 3: film in it. So, so there was a phone ad,

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Speaker 3: and then the guy from the phone ad was in

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Speaker 3: a movie that turned a telephone box into horror, and

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Speaker 3: then the telephone company made another ad that was a

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Speaker 3: spin off of the horror movie.

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Speaker 2: Right, And I think there's also some possible connection to

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Speaker 2: a nineteen sixty spy movie that had somebody in a

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Speaker 2: phone booth in the phone booth gets put on the

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Speaker 2: back of a truck, that kind of thing. But the

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Speaker 2: ultimate finished product here goes in original and terrifying directions.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Also this in the not obscure category. This movie

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Speaker 3: won awards. It won an International Emmy in nineteen seventy

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Speaker 3: three for Best Fiction. This was apparently the first Emmy

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Speaker 3: ever for a Spanish director.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and as we'll get into, many of the people

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Speaker 2: involved in this picture were top notch professionals who were

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Speaker 2: recognized certainly within Spain but also internationally.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, so major cultural legacy. There's some kind of there was,

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Speaker 3: at least at some point a kind of campaign to

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Speaker 3: get a monument put in place that's like a phone box,

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Speaker 3: you know, in Madrid, to recognize this movie. There's like

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Speaker 3: telephone booth graffiti that people have found for somebody like

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Speaker 3: illustrates the man from the movie being trapped on the

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Speaker 3: inside of a phone booth.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and it's rather telling. The article points out that

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Speaker 2: Charlie Brooker of Black Mirror fame was inspired by this

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Speaker 2: short film, which should tell you everything you need to

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Speaker 2: know about the ultimate trajectory of this piece.

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Speaker 3: This is very nineteen seventy two Black Mirror. Okay. Now,

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Speaker 3: we would normally play some trailer audio here, but I

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Speaker 3: don't think this thing ever had a trailer, at least

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Speaker 3: as far as I can tell.

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Speaker 2: Not that I could tell. So in a lieu of

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Speaker 2: a trailer, go watch it. Just go watch it and

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Speaker 2: come back, or if you know you're not going to

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Speaker 2: watch it, or you don't like to go into films

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Speaker 2: without full spoilers, then carry on and watch it later. Joe,

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Speaker 2: what's your elevator pitch?

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Speaker 3: Here? Well, if the tagline for Jaws was You'll never

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Speaker 3: go in the water again, this is gotta be You'll

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Speaker 3: never go in a phone booth again. Right.

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Speaker 2: I think that works. I think that works.

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Speaker 3: All right? We talk about the connections.

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Speaker 2: Yes, So let's start at the top with the director

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Speaker 2: who also has a writing credit on this. As we

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Speaker 2: mentioned earlier, it is Antonio Marcero or Marciro. I'm not

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Speaker 2: sure which pronunciation is most accurate here, but he lived

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Speaker 2: nineteen thirty six through twenty eighteen Spanish film and TV

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Speaker 2: director whose work was well regarded domestically and internationally. His

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Speaker 2: directorial work spanned from nineteen sixty through two thousand and

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Speaker 2: seven and included such acclaimed films as nineteen eighty eight's

376
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Speaker 2: Wait for Me in Heaven, about a man selected against

377
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Speaker 2: his will to serve as Franco's double, nineteen eighty eight

378
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Speaker 2: It's a Time for Defiance, a romance set during the

379
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Speaker 2: Spanish Civil War, and two thousand and three's The Fourth

380
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Speaker 2: Floor about seriously ill youths at a Spanish cancer ward.

381
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Speaker 2: As for his other genre films, there's nineteen seventy five

382
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Speaker 2: Bloodstains in a New Car, a kind of follow up

383
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Speaker 2: to this film, I think in some ways has the

384
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Speaker 2: same lead actor. Oh and then there is a nineteen

385
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Speaker 2: eighty three kids monster mash film, a monster mash in

386
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Speaker 2: that it has a franking stense monster, has a dracula,

387
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Speaker 2: a were wolf, and so forth. It's titled good Night

388
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Speaker 2: Mister Monster, and I'm glad to report that it does

389
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Speaker 2: feature Paul Nashi as the were wolf. I'm also to

390
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Speaker 2: understand that it is a disco musical with some rocky

391
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Speaker 2: horror aspirations.

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Speaker 3: Oh wow, I gotta see that. Well, I should have

393
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Speaker 3: thought of it when I picked this movie. But there

394
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Speaker 3: have to be multiple Paul Nashi connections, right, We're gonna

395
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Speaker 3: get several, aren't we?

396
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Speaker 2: There are yes? And also that's I mean, for better

397
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Speaker 2: or worse, That's how I end up grounding any Spanish cinema.

398
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Speaker 2: I'm like, okay, how many decrease the separation are we

399
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Speaker 2: from Paul Nashi?

400
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Speaker 3: So I found a quote of Antonio Mercero's where he's

401
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Speaker 3: trying to describe the themes of his own work, and

402
00:21:53,119 --> 00:21:56,320
Speaker 3: he basically says in all of his movies there are

403
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Speaker 3: three elements. He says, in all my works, I have

404
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Speaker 3: used three consps, pain, love and humor. It's a strange cocktail,

405
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Speaker 3: I know, and often I've asked myself how I could

406
00:22:06,920 --> 00:22:10,000
Speaker 3: mix elements potentially so different from one another. But in

407
00:22:10,040 --> 00:22:14,160
Speaker 3: practice they have been landmarks in developing my creations. And

408
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Speaker 3: you know what, yep, that's they're all three are here

409
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Speaker 3: in the Telephone Box less love than anything else, but

410
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Speaker 3: there is a bit of love, and the bit of

411
00:22:22,320 --> 00:22:26,600
Speaker 3: love makes the horror much more painful. And of course

412
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Speaker 3: there's humor too, So check on all three, all right.

413
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Speaker 2: The other writer credited here is jose Lewis Garci born

414
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Speaker 2: nineteen forty four, claimed Spanish writer and director who directed

415
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Speaker 2: four films nominated for Best Foreign Language Film at the Oscars,

416
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Speaker 2: begin The Beginning at nineteen eighty two and that one

417
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Speaker 2: actually won Double Feature in eighty four, Course Completed in

418
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Speaker 2: nineteen eighty seven, and The Grandfather in nineteen ninety eight.

419
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Speaker 2: He's also credited with a handful of horror films from

420
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Speaker 2: the nineteen nineties, but I couldn't find out much about

421
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Speaker 2: these but he he's certainly best known for his dramas,

422
00:23:01,760 --> 00:23:07,399
Speaker 2: his comedies, and his social commentary. Now our star really

423
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Speaker 2: the when I say star in the short thirty minute film,

424
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Speaker 2: he's pretty much like the I mean, he's the focal

425
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Speaker 2: point the whole time. He is our gray man. He

426
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Speaker 2: is the man trapped in the telephone booth. It's his

427
00:23:19,760 --> 00:23:24,240
Speaker 2: performance within the telephone booth that is. And again we

428
00:23:24,280 --> 00:23:27,359
Speaker 2: barely hear from him. He is mostly sealed in there.

429
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Speaker 2: There is no sound. It's just a pure visual, mime

430
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Speaker 2: like performance.

431
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Speaker 3: He has a few lines at the beginning, yeah, but

432
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Speaker 3: almost no dialogue for this protagonist.

433
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Speaker 2: Yeah. This is again Jose Leuis Lopez Vasquez, who with

434
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Speaker 2: nineteen twenty two through two thousand and nine a claim

435
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Speaker 2: Spanish actor who's largely comedic work eventually shifted towards the

436
00:23:48,640 --> 00:23:53,000
Speaker 2: serious during the nineteen seventies. He worked in theater initially

437
00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:56,080
Speaker 2: before working his way into cinema with various odd jobs

438
00:23:56,080 --> 00:23:58,760
Speaker 2: in cinema, and then his career really began to take

439
00:23:58,760 --> 00:24:02,160
Speaker 2: off in the nineteen fifties. So today's film certainly emerges

440
00:24:02,240 --> 00:24:05,600
Speaker 2: during a prominent part of his career when he's switching

441
00:24:05,640 --> 00:24:08,720
Speaker 2: into more for the most part into more serious roles

442
00:24:09,119 --> 00:24:12,440
Speaker 2: and finding a great deal of success there. Some of

443
00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:16,360
Speaker 2: his most critically well received films are from this time period.

444
00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:20,080
Speaker 2: In fact, he won two Chicago International Film Festival Awards

445
00:24:20,119 --> 00:24:24,560
Speaker 2: for his performances in the early seventies, particularly two films

446
00:24:24,560 --> 00:24:27,800
Speaker 2: of note, The First I've Seen It attributed to nineteen

447
00:24:27,840 --> 00:24:31,720
Speaker 2: seventy and other places to nineteen seventy one, a film

448
00:24:31,800 --> 00:24:35,879
Speaker 2: titled The Anchises Would, a well regarded folk horror film

449
00:24:35,960 --> 00:24:42,560
Speaker 2: about historical Spanish serial killer and self professed werewolf Manuel Blanco.

450
00:24:42,680 --> 00:24:48,600
Speaker 2: Roma Santo Vasquez plays a fictional character based on accounts

451
00:24:48,600 --> 00:24:53,280
Speaker 2: of this individual from the novel by Carlos Martinez Barbito.

452
00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:56,880
Speaker 2: It's a serious role and only his I think, second

453
00:24:57,000 --> 00:25:02,000
Speaker 2: big non comedic role, following the Acclaims aological thriller Peppermint Frape.

454
00:25:02,240 --> 00:25:06,520
Speaker 2: In nineteen sixty eight, The Anchises Woods earned him numerous nominations,

455
00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:08,800
Speaker 2: and then in nineteen seventy two he was in a

456
00:25:08,840 --> 00:25:13,200
Speaker 2: film titled My Dearest Senorita. This was a groundbreaking Spanish

457
00:25:13,200 --> 00:25:17,160
Speaker 2: film dealing with sex change and intersexualism, in which Fasquez

458
00:25:17,240 --> 00:25:21,280
Speaker 2: plays Adella, who becomes Juan. I haven't seen this film

459
00:25:21,400 --> 00:25:23,280
Speaker 2: and so I can't speak for how well at Sinsibela

460
00:25:23,400 --> 00:25:26,560
Speaker 2: sensibilities concerning sex and gender matchup with where we are today,

461
00:25:27,000 --> 00:25:30,280
Speaker 2: but it apparently broke new ground at the time, especially

462
00:25:30,320 --> 00:25:34,040
Speaker 2: in Spain, as such subjects had largely been banned under

463
00:25:34,040 --> 00:25:37,840
Speaker 2: the oppressive Franco regime. And during this time there's like

464
00:25:37,880 --> 00:25:41,159
Speaker 2: a sort of and this is also discussed in that

465
00:25:41,280 --> 00:25:43,560
Speaker 2: article we referenced earlier, during this time period, there's kind

466
00:25:43,600 --> 00:25:48,040
Speaker 2: of a breaking down of some of those strict rules

467
00:25:48,080 --> 00:25:52,040
Speaker 2: concerning media as Spain is beginning to sort of reach

468
00:25:52,080 --> 00:25:53,560
Speaker 2: out and try and sort of fit in with the

469
00:25:53,640 --> 00:25:59,439
Speaker 2: larger European world around them. And so, you know, a

470
00:25:59,440 --> 00:26:02,840
Speaker 2: few years earlier, film like this would not have been released,

471
00:26:03,320 --> 00:26:07,080
Speaker 2: but Vesquez's performance here earned widespread acclaim, and the film

472
00:26:07,119 --> 00:26:09,720
Speaker 2: itself was nominated for Best Foreign Language Film at the

473
00:26:09,760 --> 00:26:13,800
Speaker 2: forty fifth Academy Awards. So these two films were instrumental

474
00:26:13,880 --> 00:26:17,000
Speaker 2: in his shift to more dramatic work, including nineteen seventy

475
00:26:17,040 --> 00:26:21,960
Speaker 2: one's The Garden of Delights seventy fives, Zorito Martinez seventy

476
00:26:22,000 --> 00:26:25,560
Speaker 2: Six's Este Signor di Negro. But of course, as far

477
00:26:25,560 --> 00:26:28,000
Speaker 2: as connections go, you might be wondering, Okay, did he

478
00:26:28,080 --> 00:26:30,879
Speaker 2: work with any of the Spanish cinema mainstays from the

479
00:26:30,880 --> 00:26:33,600
Speaker 2: time period that we've discussed on the show before, And

480
00:26:33,680 --> 00:26:37,840
Speaker 2: the answer is yes, So Frank Bronna multiple times, Lewis

481
00:26:37,880 --> 00:26:43,000
Speaker 2: Barbou multiple times, Helga Line, Yes, I think at least

482
00:26:43,040 --> 00:26:46,359
Speaker 2: one or two pictures there. And indeed there is a

483
00:26:46,400 --> 00:26:50,280
Speaker 2: Paul Nashi connection as well. So Nashi I think had

484
00:26:50,280 --> 00:26:53,080
Speaker 2: an uncredited part in the nineteen sixty six film that

485
00:26:53,200 --> 00:26:57,240
Speaker 2: Veasquez also appears in. But Vasquez definitely appears in a

486
00:26:57,240 --> 00:27:00,880
Speaker 2: pair of Nashi written and directed films, though sadly they're

487
00:27:00,880 --> 00:27:04,080
Speaker 2: from Paul Nashi's late period. So there's a family drama

488
00:27:04,680 --> 00:27:08,480
Speaker 2: titled My Friend the Vagabond, and then that's from nineteen

489
00:27:08,520 --> 00:27:11,680
Speaker 2: eighty four, and then there's a nineteen eighty five film

490
00:27:12,200 --> 00:27:15,960
Speaker 2: titled Operation Mantis that is like a slapstick spy movie

491
00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:19,520
Speaker 2: that I think was just negatively received across the board.

492
00:27:20,119 --> 00:27:23,240
Speaker 2: He did all the genres, didn't they Yeah, at one

493
00:27:23,240 --> 00:27:25,720
Speaker 2: point or another. I've got his horror box sets, but

494
00:27:25,760 --> 00:27:28,920
Speaker 2: I don't see his slapstick spy movies. Yeah, I mean

495
00:27:29,040 --> 00:27:31,560
Speaker 2: the horror I think is by most accounts, the best

496
00:27:31,640 --> 00:27:34,560
Speaker 2: I think that's also where Paul Nashy's heart ultimately was,

497
00:27:35,320 --> 00:27:38,040
Speaker 2: And some of these other genres are often things he

498
00:27:38,160 --> 00:27:41,000
Speaker 2: was getting into later in his career when Gothic horror

499
00:27:42,000 --> 00:27:47,440
Speaker 2: had lost its popularity in Spanish cinema. So yeah, these

500
00:27:47,480 --> 00:27:50,199
Speaker 2: are generally not as well received and or are not

501
00:27:50,280 --> 00:27:51,840
Speaker 2: as widely known outside of Spain.

502
00:27:52,440 --> 00:27:54,879
Speaker 3: I think that he's done at least a couple of

503
00:27:54,920 --> 00:27:58,960
Speaker 3: movies about characters who are either actors or filmmakers and

504
00:27:59,080 --> 00:28:01,960
Speaker 3: just want to keep doing universal style monster movies and

505
00:28:02,000 --> 00:28:05,200
Speaker 3: there's pressure for them to do like action and stuff. Yeah.

506
00:28:05,320 --> 00:28:08,639
Speaker 2: Yeah, Now I can't speak for how Vesquez performs in

507
00:28:08,680 --> 00:28:12,200
Speaker 2: those two pictures, but in fact, in any other picture.

508
00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:15,199
Speaker 2: This is the only thing I've seen Vesquez in, But

509
00:28:15,320 --> 00:28:17,080
Speaker 2: now I want to see more of him because he's

510
00:28:17,080 --> 00:28:20,600
Speaker 2: so good in the telephone Box again, the quiet dignity

511
00:28:21,160 --> 00:28:23,919
Speaker 2: in the face of all this inconvenience and embarrassment, the

512
00:28:23,960 --> 00:28:29,320
Speaker 2: gradual erosion of his resolve as the situation steadily descends

513
00:28:29,359 --> 00:28:32,400
Speaker 2: into panic and terror. You know, it's all They're all

514
00:28:32,440 --> 00:28:37,359
Speaker 2: wordless and soundless within this soundproof sarcophagus, and we know

515
00:28:37,480 --> 00:28:40,400
Speaker 2: next to nothing about his character, and yet we feel

516
00:28:40,440 --> 00:28:42,080
Speaker 2: we know him so well by the end of it,

517
00:28:42,520 --> 00:28:44,720
Speaker 2: you know, just based on the nuances of the performance

518
00:28:44,800 --> 00:28:47,640
Speaker 2: and also some of these nice key supporting details, like

519
00:28:47,960 --> 00:28:50,440
Speaker 2: you know, obviously there's as we'll discuss, like there's this

520
00:28:50,560 --> 00:28:53,760
Speaker 2: love for his son, and there's this photograph of his family.

521
00:28:54,120 --> 00:28:56,680
Speaker 2: But also I like, I really love the detail of

522
00:28:56,760 --> 00:29:00,920
Speaker 2: his colorful tie. Yeah, it really felt like otherwise he's

523
00:29:00,920 --> 00:29:03,040
Speaker 2: wearing this kind of you know, just boring business suit,

524
00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:06,480
Speaker 2: but he has this really nice tie that makes him

525
00:29:06,480 --> 00:29:09,440
Speaker 2: feel like a guy who has found this one small

526
00:29:09,480 --> 00:29:14,960
Speaker 2: way to allow his individualism to burst free and shine,

527
00:29:15,600 --> 00:29:17,840
Speaker 2: you know, and it's very much filtered and held back,

528
00:29:17,880 --> 00:29:20,920
Speaker 2: but you can get a sense of his inner light. Oh.

529
00:29:21,000 --> 00:29:23,560
Speaker 3: I think the tie is a great detail. Not to

530
00:29:23,600 --> 00:29:27,239
Speaker 3: contradict to you, but you described it as colorful. It

531
00:29:27,320 --> 00:29:31,320
Speaker 3: is visually interesting, but it's actually rather earth toned. It's

532
00:29:31,360 --> 00:29:33,200
Speaker 3: basically brown and black.

533
00:29:34,200 --> 00:29:36,200
Speaker 2: I interpreted it as kind of an orange, but.

534
00:29:36,480 --> 00:29:38,320
Speaker 3: Oh well, maybe it is kind of orange. I mean,

535
00:29:38,720 --> 00:29:41,360
Speaker 3: but it's not like you know, rain the whole rainbow.

536
00:29:41,480 --> 00:29:43,920
Speaker 3: It's like a kind of brown or orange and black.

537
00:29:43,960 --> 00:29:47,479
Speaker 3: But it does have these very striking expressive designs on it.

538
00:29:47,480 --> 00:29:51,040
Speaker 3: It's like these kind of watery swirls in a way.

539
00:29:51,600 --> 00:29:53,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, kind of ya waves.

540
00:29:53,360 --> 00:29:56,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, sorry, folks, we just had to scroll down to

541
00:29:56,360 --> 00:29:59,200
Speaker 3: our screenshots to make sure we're describing the tie correct.

542
00:29:59,360 --> 00:30:01,680
Speaker 3: I don't know they could so it is like black,

543
00:30:01,760 --> 00:30:04,000
Speaker 3: but it is the other color, like could be brown

544
00:30:04,200 --> 00:30:06,520
Speaker 3: or maybe orange or maybe gold. It's a little hard

545
00:30:06,520 --> 00:30:09,200
Speaker 3: to tell in the light quality because it's like under

546
00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:12,600
Speaker 3: a really bright sun, which is another thing about this character.

547
00:30:12,640 --> 00:30:15,160
Speaker 3: He's stuck in a glass box in the middle of

548
00:30:15,280 --> 00:30:19,520
Speaker 3: like right under this noonday sun. So he's like baking

549
00:30:19,560 --> 00:30:22,400
Speaker 3: in there, but he's got this tie on and yeah,

550
00:30:22,440 --> 00:30:24,600
Speaker 3: it's I don't know what you call this pattern, but

551
00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:27,880
Speaker 3: it's like these kind of spirals or swirls that look

552
00:30:27,960 --> 00:30:30,840
Speaker 3: kind of like, I don't know, dabs of paint almost

553
00:30:30,920 --> 00:30:32,800
Speaker 3: maybe made with the fingers or something.

554
00:30:33,120 --> 00:30:37,120
Speaker 2: It's interesting, all right, More on the necktie in a bit,

555
00:30:37,600 --> 00:30:40,640
Speaker 2: Okay that there There are other actors in the picture,

556
00:30:40,680 --> 00:30:43,680
Speaker 2: but mostly it's a one man show, though I do

557
00:30:43,800 --> 00:30:49,040
Speaker 2: want to mention the burly man, the sort of like

558
00:30:49,080 --> 00:30:51,720
Speaker 2: heavy set strong man that comes to try and bust

559
00:30:51,800 --> 00:30:54,800
Speaker 2: him out of the phone booth. This character is played

560
00:30:54,840 --> 00:30:57,479
Speaker 2: by Tito Garcia, who lived nineteen thirty one through two

561
00:30:57,520 --> 00:31:00,360
Speaker 2: thousand and three, I wrote ton Spanish character act whose

562
00:31:00,400 --> 00:31:03,800
Speaker 2: credits include various westerns, also the Jess Franco film The

563
00:31:03,840 --> 00:31:07,280
Speaker 2: Awful Doctor Orloff, and a pair of nasty films nineteen

564
00:31:07,320 --> 00:31:11,320
Speaker 2: eighties Human Beasts, Oh, and nineteen eighty one's Night of

565
00:31:11,360 --> 00:31:14,040
Speaker 2: the Werewolf, which we previously covered on Weird House Cinema.

566
00:31:14,080 --> 00:31:18,120
Speaker 2: He's one of the two grave robbers that accidentally reawakens Voldemartininski.

567
00:31:18,360 --> 00:31:20,840
Speaker 3: Okay, I've seen both of those. Night of the Werewolf's

568
00:31:20,840 --> 00:31:24,200
Speaker 3: a lot better. Human Beasts didn't love that one.

569
00:31:24,280 --> 00:31:26,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, kind of a nasty one and also but in

570
00:31:26,920 --> 00:31:31,520
Speaker 2: very action oriented in its early goings. Yeah, but I

571
00:31:31,560 --> 00:31:33,480
Speaker 2: have to say Garcia is good here. This could have

572
00:31:33,520 --> 00:31:36,680
Speaker 2: easily been a real over the top, blueto stole performance,

573
00:31:36,720 --> 00:31:39,760
Speaker 2: and I guess it is. But there are these nuances,

574
00:31:39,800 --> 00:31:42,240
Speaker 2: you know, like this guy's trying to do the right

575
00:31:42,320 --> 00:31:46,240
Speaker 2: thing despite of the onlookers, but also kind of because

576
00:31:46,280 --> 00:31:49,360
Speaker 2: of the onlookers. Yeah, and it all comes off quite

577
00:31:49,360 --> 00:31:51,320
Speaker 2: believable in my estimation.

578
00:31:51,840 --> 00:31:53,600
Speaker 3: I want to talk later on when we get into

579
00:31:53,640 --> 00:31:56,920
Speaker 3: some of the themes about the way the film portrays

580
00:31:56,960 --> 00:32:00,520
Speaker 3: the people who stop to help the guy in the box. Yeah,

581
00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:03,160
Speaker 3: I think there's interesting stuff about the choices there.

582
00:32:03,960 --> 00:32:06,400
Speaker 2: Now getting into the music here. Early on in the picture,

583
00:32:07,080 --> 00:32:11,240
Speaker 2: the subtitles generously refer to the music as jazz, and

584
00:32:12,120 --> 00:32:15,200
Speaker 2: I'm guessing it's probably stock music. But it also kind

585
00:32:15,200 --> 00:32:18,959
Speaker 2: of works perfectly because it feels energetic but lifeless, you know,

586
00:32:19,040 --> 00:32:22,120
Speaker 2: it's this sort of humdrum modernity, like this is what

587
00:32:22,160 --> 00:32:26,000
Speaker 2: we have done to jazz. And later on in the

588
00:32:26,000 --> 00:32:30,200
Speaker 2: picture we have a rather kind of startling shift in tone.

589
00:32:30,320 --> 00:32:31,920
Speaker 2: I mean, we've been building up to it, but there

590
00:32:31,960 --> 00:32:34,520
Speaker 2: is this shift in tone, and we get a shift

591
00:32:34,560 --> 00:32:38,080
Speaker 2: in the music as well, and suddenly we're utilizing the

592
00:32:38,200 --> 00:32:41,840
Speaker 2: music of German composer and educator Carl Orff, who lived

593
00:32:41,840 --> 00:32:45,160
Speaker 2: eighteen ninety five through nineteen eighty two, best known probably

594
00:32:45,160 --> 00:32:48,200
Speaker 2: for Carmina burana, which has been used to great effect

595
00:32:48,240 --> 00:32:51,520
Speaker 2: in many a film, including John Borman's ex Caliber. His

596
00:32:51,640 --> 00:32:53,880
Speaker 2: music has also been used in such pictures as nineteen

597
00:32:53,920 --> 00:32:58,320
Speaker 2: seventy Three's bad Lands by Terrence Malick. This film makes

598
00:32:58,440 --> 00:33:04,800
Speaker 2: use of a cantata from his operetta Trianfo diafrediti.

599
00:33:05,320 --> 00:33:08,240
Speaker 3: Now, initially the use of this composition did lead to

600
00:33:08,520 --> 00:33:12,560
Speaker 3: a legal dispute. Orf tried to sue Marso because he

601
00:33:12,600 --> 00:33:15,800
Speaker 3: said that one of his compositions was used without permission.

602
00:33:16,360 --> 00:33:18,720
Speaker 3: Marcero pleaded that it was an accident. He said he

603
00:33:19,520 --> 00:33:21,520
Speaker 3: used it. He had meant to ask for permission and

604
00:33:21,560 --> 00:33:24,360
Speaker 3: then forgot to, and he settled out of settled out

605
00:33:24,360 --> 00:33:26,880
Speaker 3: of court with Orf. Apparently they met up and they

606
00:33:26,920 --> 00:33:29,120
Speaker 3: watched the film together, and they came to some kind

607
00:33:29,160 --> 00:33:31,680
Speaker 3: of agreement, and then Orf approved the use of his music.

608
00:33:31,720 --> 00:33:34,520
Speaker 3: But initially that was a bit of a sticky point

609
00:33:34,240 --> 00:33:38,440
Speaker 3: about this. Unclear to me if Marcero actually did just

610
00:33:38,520 --> 00:33:41,000
Speaker 3: forget and it was an accident, an honest mistake, or

611
00:33:41,080 --> 00:33:42,600
Speaker 3: if he was trying to get away with something. I

612
00:33:42,600 --> 00:33:43,760
Speaker 3: don't know. Either way.

613
00:33:43,800 --> 00:33:46,880
Speaker 2: I do feel like the orph music is used really

614
00:33:46,880 --> 00:33:49,040
Speaker 2: well here. He kept us the sense of the transcendent,

615
00:33:49,280 --> 00:33:50,920
Speaker 2: the tragic, and much more.

616
00:33:51,200 --> 00:33:54,000
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, unimpeachable choice to use four effect in the film.

617
00:33:54,040 --> 00:33:55,800
Speaker 3: And just wish he had wish he had gone to

618
00:33:55,920 --> 00:33:57,080
Speaker 3: Orf at first.

619
00:33:58,080 --> 00:34:00,280
Speaker 2: All right, Well, let's get right into the plot.

620
00:34:00,280 --> 00:34:02,720
Speaker 3: All right, So you can kind of divide this movie

621
00:34:02,760 --> 00:34:06,360
Speaker 3: into three parts. There's the opening that takes place in

622
00:34:06,400 --> 00:34:10,359
Speaker 3: the phone booth within a plaza in Madrid. And then

623
00:34:10,400 --> 00:34:13,399
Speaker 3: there's the middle part that's sort of a journey, and

624
00:34:13,440 --> 00:34:16,280
Speaker 3: then there is the climax, which is when we descend

625
00:34:16,360 --> 00:34:19,839
Speaker 3: and descend into the underworld. So the first third, as

626
00:34:19,840 --> 00:34:22,279
Speaker 3: I said, takes place in a plaza in Madrid. It's

627
00:34:22,320 --> 00:34:26,040
Speaker 3: a real place apparently called the Plaza del Conde del

628
00:34:26,120 --> 00:34:31,000
Speaker 3: vaer de Sushil, And the credits play in this blood

629
00:34:31,040 --> 00:34:35,320
Speaker 3: red typewriter font all lowercase over views of the city

630
00:34:35,480 --> 00:34:38,359
Speaker 3: framed by tall, blocky apartment towers.

631
00:34:38,840 --> 00:34:41,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, apparently this is a rather nice part of Madrid,

632
00:34:41,600 --> 00:34:46,480
Speaker 2: a traditional district with an aristocratic architectural flare, according to

633
00:34:46,719 --> 00:34:49,839
Speaker 2: Torismo Madrid. So I take the word for it.

634
00:34:51,280 --> 00:34:53,360
Speaker 3: Yeah, it seems like an elegant part of the city.

635
00:34:53,400 --> 00:34:55,440
Speaker 3: So as we first come in, we're looking up at

636
00:34:55,440 --> 00:34:57,600
Speaker 3: the sky at the tops of the buildings, but then

637
00:34:57,640 --> 00:35:01,120
Speaker 3: the camera pans down to the plaza, which is in

638
00:35:01,160 --> 00:35:03,520
Speaker 3: one sense, yes, it is quite pleasant, like it is

639
00:35:03,560 --> 00:35:06,440
Speaker 3: surrounded by trees, as this big yard where kids can

640
00:35:06,480 --> 00:35:09,640
Speaker 3: play soccer. But in another sense, at least in the

641
00:35:09,640 --> 00:35:13,080
Speaker 3: way it is framed, it's kind of claustrophobic because we

642
00:35:13,120 --> 00:35:16,399
Speaker 3: see it boxed in on all sides by these nondescript

643
00:35:16,480 --> 00:35:17,160
Speaker 3: high rises.

644
00:35:18,040 --> 00:35:20,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, I feel like there's a weird sense of balance here,

645
00:35:21,120 --> 00:35:24,240
Speaker 2: an uneasy balance, but balanced nonetheless. So like the apartment

646
00:35:24,280 --> 00:35:30,800
Speaker 2: complexes are modern and nice, thus pacifying. Apparently government pressure

647
00:35:31,280 --> 00:35:34,799
Speaker 2: to include a sense of modern Madrid to showcase to

648
00:35:34,840 --> 00:35:38,520
Speaker 2: the world. Yes, but on the other it's kind of like, well, okay,

649
00:35:38,920 --> 00:35:41,400
Speaker 2: whatever you may have lost to these sort of stacked

650
00:35:41,440 --> 00:35:43,960
Speaker 2: confines of apartment living, at least you have these nice

651
00:35:43,960 --> 00:35:45,320
Speaker 2: green spaces and pluses.

652
00:35:45,880 --> 00:35:47,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, we should have mentioned this earlier. But yeah, as

653
00:35:48,000 --> 00:35:51,960
Speaker 3: you said, showing off the beautiful modernizing Madrid was apparently

654
00:35:52,000 --> 00:35:55,960
Speaker 3: a requirement to satisfy the government sensors, you know, the

655
00:35:56,040 --> 00:35:59,360
Speaker 3: kind of ministry that they didn't know if this script

656
00:35:59,440 --> 00:36:01,200
Speaker 3: was going to get a proove to be made a

657
00:36:01,480 --> 00:36:04,040
Speaker 3: made for TV movie, And it did. But one of

658
00:36:04,120 --> 00:36:06,760
Speaker 3: the conditions was, okay, you got to make Madrid look nice.

659
00:36:06,880 --> 00:36:09,480
Speaker 3: You know, we got good stuff going on here.

660
00:36:09,880 --> 00:36:13,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, as we'll discuss, as is often the case, government

661
00:36:13,760 --> 00:36:19,359
Speaker 2: mandates for the arts can often be twisted around and

662
00:36:19,560 --> 00:36:23,920
Speaker 2: weaponized in very inventive ways. And then that may be

663
00:36:24,040 --> 00:36:24,960
Speaker 2: what's going on here.

664
00:36:25,200 --> 00:36:27,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, there may be a kind of malicious compliance with

665
00:36:27,960 --> 00:36:31,279
Speaker 3: the sensors. So at first when we come in, the

666
00:36:31,640 --> 00:36:35,440
Speaker 3: soundscape here is chirping birds and the grinding of motors

667
00:36:35,480 --> 00:36:39,240
Speaker 3: and machinery. It's early in the morning, and the first

668
00:36:39,239 --> 00:36:41,800
Speaker 3: thing we see in terms of action is a dark

669
00:36:42,000 --> 00:36:46,520
Speaker 3: green flatbed truck rolling into the plaza with a bright

670
00:36:46,680 --> 00:36:50,719
Speaker 3: red new telephone box as its cargo. The truck slows down,

671
00:36:50,960 --> 00:36:53,120
Speaker 3: backs up to the edge of the yard, and then

672
00:36:53,280 --> 00:36:56,480
Speaker 3: four men in telephone company uniforms get out. They unload

673
00:36:56,560 --> 00:36:58,640
Speaker 3: the box, carry it to the middle of the plaza,

674
00:36:59,000 --> 00:37:02,560
Speaker 3: and efficiently install it. And I want to note that

675
00:37:02,840 --> 00:37:06,440
Speaker 3: nothing really feels ominous at this point. There's no indication

676
00:37:06,719 --> 00:37:09,680
Speaker 3: that this is a horror movie. The birds are chirping,

677
00:37:10,080 --> 00:37:13,839
Speaker 3: the music is bright, almost whimsical. It feels much more

678
00:37:13,880 --> 00:37:16,920
Speaker 3: like the opening of a lighthearted family comedy than a

679
00:37:16,920 --> 00:37:17,880
Speaker 3: horror film.

680
00:37:18,200 --> 00:37:21,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, like we said, the sun is bright. You get

681
00:37:21,080 --> 00:37:23,120
Speaker 2: the sense that there's no danger here because everybody's at

682
00:37:23,160 --> 00:37:26,880
Speaker 2: work or at school, like, nobody's creeping about. It's just

683
00:37:26,880 --> 00:37:29,920
Speaker 2: people here on official business. And especially given the nineteen

684
00:37:29,960 --> 00:37:32,319
Speaker 2: seventies feel to everything, I was reminded of a lot

685
00:37:32,320 --> 00:37:35,160
Speaker 2: of live action sesame street shorts. Yeah, I feel like

686
00:37:35,200 --> 00:37:38,120
Speaker 2: I just needed a child's narration about telephones or the

687
00:37:38,200 --> 00:37:38,560
Speaker 2: letter P.

688
00:37:39,040 --> 00:37:40,560
Speaker 3: This is how they make saxophones.

689
00:37:40,880 --> 00:37:42,120
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah.

690
00:37:42,560 --> 00:37:46,160
Speaker 3: The only thing that potentially registers as threatening to me,

691
00:37:46,239 --> 00:37:48,279
Speaker 3: and it didn't when I first watched this was only

692
00:37:48,800 --> 00:37:52,759
Speaker 3: upon rewatching. The only thing that is potentially threatening is

693
00:37:53,040 --> 00:37:56,560
Speaker 3: the camera angle, because instead of watching this scene from

694
00:37:56,560 --> 00:37:59,960
Speaker 3: the ground, we begin with the camera way up above,

695
00:38:00,080 --> 00:38:04,279
Speaker 3: of surveying everything from a distance in the sky, as

696
00:38:04,280 --> 00:38:07,480
Speaker 3: if we were watching like security camera footage or something.

697
00:38:08,120 --> 00:38:11,600
Speaker 3: And this could allow to set in a kind of

698
00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:15,400
Speaker 3: subconscious awareness of the scene in the plaza as being

699
00:38:16,040 --> 00:38:20,480
Speaker 3: monitored by distant and unfeeling observers, which is a powerful

700
00:38:20,560 --> 00:38:24,200
Speaker 3: kind of horror feeling to create within fiction when you

701
00:38:24,239 --> 00:38:28,000
Speaker 3: take like a mundane scene or activity, something that is

702
00:38:28,040 --> 00:38:31,960
Speaker 3: not unsettling by itself, but then suddenly give the impression

703
00:38:32,080 --> 00:38:37,040
Speaker 3: that it is being watched unsympathetically. It reminds me of

704
00:38:37,080 --> 00:38:40,759
Speaker 3: the excellent opening sentence of HG. Well's War of the Worlds,

705
00:38:40,920 --> 00:38:44,000
Speaker 3: where he says, quote, no one would have believed in

706
00:38:44,040 --> 00:38:47,280
Speaker 3: the last years of the nineteenth century that this world

707
00:38:47,400 --> 00:38:51,440
Speaker 3: was being watched keenly and closely by intelligences greater than

708
00:38:51,520 --> 00:38:54,560
Speaker 3: man's and yet as mortal as his own, that as

709
00:38:54,600 --> 00:38:58,600
Speaker 3: men busied themselves about their various concerns, they were scrutinized

710
00:38:58,640 --> 00:39:01,560
Speaker 3: and studied, perhaps most as narrowly as a man with

711
00:39:01,600 --> 00:39:05,920
Speaker 3: a microscope might scrutinize the transient creatures that swarm and

712
00:39:06,000 --> 00:39:07,720
Speaker 3: multiply and a drop of water.

713
00:39:08,320 --> 00:39:13,440
Speaker 2: M Yeah, that's a good point. This may be ultimately

714
00:39:13,480 --> 00:39:15,560
Speaker 2: because I had some sense of where things were going,

715
00:39:15,600 --> 00:39:18,160
Speaker 2: but I also found it a tiny bit foreboding that

716
00:39:18,239 --> 00:39:22,399
Speaker 2: the box is carried around via inserted staves, like it's

717
00:39:22,440 --> 00:39:24,880
Speaker 2: the Arc of the Covenant or something, you know. I

718
00:39:24,880 --> 00:39:27,319
Speaker 2: don't know, I just I don't see workmen carrying things

719
00:39:27,360 --> 00:39:30,839
Speaker 2: around like this. Maybe this is accurate, or maybe it

720
00:39:30,920 --> 00:39:33,680
Speaker 2: is kind of a nod to something strange.

721
00:39:33,719 --> 00:39:36,600
Speaker 3: I'm not sure. Yeah, with the poles inserted, it's like

722
00:39:36,640 --> 00:39:38,720
Speaker 3: the Arc of the Covenant, or like a palan quinin

723
00:39:39,760 --> 00:39:43,760
Speaker 3: which is especially funny slash disturbing when there is actually

724
00:39:43,800 --> 00:39:46,120
Speaker 3: a person inside the box. So they're being carried like

725
00:39:46,200 --> 00:39:50,240
Speaker 3: a king accepted as they're not being treated well.

726
00:39:50,640 --> 00:39:52,839
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, And there are a number of visual comparisons

727
00:39:52,880 --> 00:39:55,759
Speaker 2: that end up being made between the box and other

728
00:39:55,800 --> 00:39:58,600
Speaker 2: things in the world. We'll discuss as we proceed.

729
00:40:00,080 --> 00:40:02,520
Speaker 3: So anyway, the phone company guys install the box. They

730
00:40:02,560 --> 00:40:04,719
Speaker 3: bolt it down to the earth and they get in

731
00:40:04,719 --> 00:40:06,840
Speaker 3: their truck and drive away, and we see the box

732
00:40:06,960 --> 00:40:09,080
Speaker 3: just left in the middle of the square. It is

733
00:40:09,160 --> 00:40:12,000
Speaker 3: the brightest object in the frame. The door is hanging

734
00:40:12,040 --> 00:40:16,400
Speaker 3: open invitingly. It looks absolutely jolly. And after this we

735
00:40:16,480 --> 00:40:18,760
Speaker 3: get a kind of slice of life of the residents

736
00:40:18,760 --> 00:40:20,960
Speaker 3: of the local buildings. In the morning, we see a

737
00:40:21,000 --> 00:40:24,240
Speaker 3: gardener out watering the plants in the plaza with a hose.

738
00:40:24,960 --> 00:40:28,479
Speaker 3: Children running around, playing and chasing after each other before

739
00:40:28,480 --> 00:40:30,480
Speaker 3: they have to go to the school bus. There are

740
00:40:30,480 --> 00:40:33,680
Speaker 3: some nuns out on a walk. We see this cool guy, Rob.

741
00:40:33,719 --> 00:40:35,760
Speaker 3: I've got a screenshop for you to look at. Here's

742
00:40:35,760 --> 00:40:38,360
Speaker 3: a guy with a button up shirt with a big

743
00:40:38,520 --> 00:40:42,800
Speaker 3: seventies collar and big sunglasses. I like his look.

744
00:40:43,560 --> 00:40:45,640
Speaker 2: He's got some books there. It has to return those

745
00:40:45,640 --> 00:40:46,680
Speaker 2: to the library or something.

746
00:40:47,000 --> 00:40:50,239
Speaker 3: Yeah, I bet their books on the occult. They've got

747
00:40:50,239 --> 00:40:56,600
Speaker 3: to be interlibrary loan for the Necronomicon. So eventually we

748
00:40:56,640 --> 00:40:59,959
Speaker 3: meet our protagonist again. He is an unnamed middle aged

749
00:41:00,200 --> 00:41:03,839
Speaker 3: man in a business suit with this seventies tie with

750
00:41:03,880 --> 00:41:06,799
Speaker 3: the cool design on it. He is bald on the

751
00:41:06,840 --> 00:41:09,160
Speaker 3: top of his head, with a horseshoe of dark hair

752
00:41:09,280 --> 00:41:12,239
Speaker 3: and a mustache. And from what I've read, I think

753
00:41:12,280 --> 00:41:15,200
Speaker 3: this guy is supposed to look like a sort of

754
00:41:15,320 --> 00:41:21,320
Speaker 3: stereotyped character, a stereotypical urban businessman in nineteen seventies Spain.

755
00:41:22,320 --> 00:41:24,560
Speaker 3: This is our gray man. And the gray man is

756
00:41:24,560 --> 00:41:27,600
Speaker 3: not alone. He is leaving home in the morning with

757
00:41:27,680 --> 00:41:30,560
Speaker 3: his son, who's a boy of maybe ten or twelve

758
00:41:30,719 --> 00:41:34,680
Speaker 3: or so, and his son is out bouncing a blue

759
00:41:34,719 --> 00:41:37,560
Speaker 3: soccer ball. So the sun is like kicking the soccer

760
00:41:37,560 --> 00:41:39,640
Speaker 3: ball around and at one point he kicks it and

761
00:41:39,680 --> 00:41:43,120
Speaker 3: it flies into the new phone booth because the door

762
00:41:43,160 --> 00:41:46,040
Speaker 3: is just hanging right open, and upon rewatch. I was

763
00:41:46,080 --> 00:41:49,640
Speaker 3: horrified because I forgot about this moment, but I remember

764
00:41:49,680 --> 00:41:52,280
Speaker 3: at this part. The boy he goes into the phone

765
00:41:52,280 --> 00:41:55,000
Speaker 3: booth to retrieve the ball, and he stops for a

766
00:41:55,040 --> 00:41:58,080
Speaker 3: second like he's messing around. I think he's dawdling before school.

767
00:41:58,239 --> 00:42:00,759
Speaker 3: And he goes to pick up the phone receipt and

768
00:42:00,800 --> 00:42:02,919
Speaker 3: his dad comes over is like, come on, no, get

769
00:42:02,960 --> 00:42:04,919
Speaker 3: out of there, and the boy does, and he never

770
00:42:04,960 --> 00:42:08,560
Speaker 3: closes the door again. There is still if you don't

771
00:42:08,600 --> 00:42:11,640
Speaker 3: know what's coming. There's nothing overtly frightening at this point.

772
00:42:11,680 --> 00:42:15,560
Speaker 3: It's only on rewatch that this moment becomes tense. But

773
00:42:15,600 --> 00:42:17,759
Speaker 3: the boy points out that the phone booth is new,

774
00:42:17,880 --> 00:42:20,040
Speaker 3: and the father acts almost as if he would not

775
00:42:20,160 --> 00:42:23,799
Speaker 3: have noticed that fact otherwise. So they walk off to

776
00:42:23,840 --> 00:42:25,799
Speaker 3: catch the school bus. The father gives his son a

777
00:42:25,880 --> 00:42:29,200
Speaker 3: kiss and says goodbye for the day, and then while

778
00:42:29,280 --> 00:42:31,960
Speaker 3: walking back the way he came, the gray man stops

779
00:42:32,080 --> 00:42:34,799
Speaker 3: beside the phone booth and he seems to remember that

780
00:42:34,920 --> 00:42:38,160
Speaker 3: he needs to make a call, so he steps inside.

781
00:42:39,000 --> 00:42:42,440
Speaker 3: And I noticed this also on rewatch. We never learn

782
00:42:42,800 --> 00:42:45,200
Speaker 3: who he was planning to call or what he was

783
00:42:45,239 --> 00:42:47,160
Speaker 3: calling about, never find out.

784
00:42:47,520 --> 00:42:50,080
Speaker 2: I mean, it was probably something mundane and boring, Like

785
00:42:50,120 --> 00:42:52,120
Speaker 2: he's like, ah, I forgot I'm supposed to call about

786
00:42:52,120 --> 00:42:55,040
Speaker 2: those tickets for the weekend, or I forgot to call

787
00:42:55,040 --> 00:42:58,880
Speaker 2: about the laundry. You know, nowadays, we would stop halfway

788
00:42:58,880 --> 00:43:01,399
Speaker 2: between point A and pot B pull out her cell

789
00:43:01,440 --> 00:43:04,600
Speaker 2: phone and send that quick email or text message. And

790
00:43:04,719 --> 00:43:06,359
Speaker 2: I assume that's just what's going on here.

791
00:43:07,440 --> 00:43:10,440
Speaker 3: But when the man lifts the receiver in the phone booth,

792
00:43:10,560 --> 00:43:13,400
Speaker 3: he does not hear a dial tone, so he starts

793
00:43:13,480 --> 00:43:16,880
Speaker 3: fiddling around with the phone, trying to make it work. Meanwhile,

794
00:43:17,200 --> 00:43:21,600
Speaker 3: behind his back, the door to the box quietly folds shut.

795
00:43:21,760 --> 00:43:24,840
Speaker 3: It's just like a venus flytrap closing on its prey.

796
00:43:25,840 --> 00:43:28,040
Speaker 3: And still there is nothing yet to let you know

797
00:43:28,120 --> 00:43:30,279
Speaker 3: this is horror. The man just keeps messing around with

798
00:43:30,320 --> 00:43:32,800
Speaker 3: the phone to try to figure out what's wrong. Eventually

799
00:43:32,880 --> 00:43:35,760
Speaker 3: he gives up and he tries to leave, but now

800
00:43:35,880 --> 00:43:39,239
Speaker 3: the door is closed and it will not open, and

801
00:43:39,280 --> 00:43:43,040
Speaker 3: he pushes and pulls and it is not going anywhere.

802
00:43:43,560 --> 00:43:46,239
Speaker 3: And then he just stands back and folds his arms, like,

803
00:43:46,320 --> 00:43:49,080
Speaker 3: oh brother, this is all I need very much. In

804
00:43:49,160 --> 00:43:51,640
Speaker 3: the mime school of posture.

805
00:43:51,760 --> 00:43:53,719
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, so at this point again, yeah, there's no

806
00:43:53,800 --> 00:43:57,840
Speaker 2: musical sting to drive home what's happening. The ceiling of

807
00:43:57,840 --> 00:44:00,200
Speaker 2: the phone booth is this low key and natural as

808
00:44:00,200 --> 00:44:03,160
Speaker 2: can be. And initially it's just like, oh goodness, yeah,

809
00:44:03,440 --> 00:44:05,160
Speaker 2: I've got one more thing now I have to do

810
00:44:05,280 --> 00:44:07,280
Speaker 2: in my day, and it's get out of this phone booth.

811
00:44:07,719 --> 00:44:09,440
Speaker 2: But you know, it seems like I've just got to

812
00:44:09,480 --> 00:44:10,040
Speaker 2: figure this out.

813
00:44:10,080 --> 00:44:10,239
Speaker 3: Right.

814
00:44:10,280 --> 00:44:13,600
Speaker 2: It's like there's a latch or there's something. This will

815
00:44:13,600 --> 00:44:15,000
Speaker 2: just take a minute.

816
00:44:14,800 --> 00:44:17,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, And so his initial struggles give rise to I

817
00:44:17,600 --> 00:44:20,200
Speaker 3: think some of the most famous images from the movie,

818
00:44:20,239 --> 00:44:23,279
Speaker 3: images you see clipped out around the internet, ones that

819
00:44:23,320 --> 00:44:26,360
Speaker 3: are reproduced, and stills and graffiti and on the poster.

820
00:44:27,360 --> 00:44:30,120
Speaker 3: It's just the man struggling in this situation. He looks

821
00:44:30,120 --> 00:44:32,840
Speaker 3: around the inside of the box. He's probably trying to

822
00:44:32,880 --> 00:44:35,839
Speaker 3: find some kind of release mechanism or something that he's

823
00:44:35,880 --> 00:44:39,480
Speaker 3: pressing on the corners and searching up and down, but nothing.

824
00:44:39,560 --> 00:44:42,000
Speaker 3: The door is locked and there is no apparent way

825
00:44:42,000 --> 00:44:52,560
Speaker 3: to get out. So next a couple of men come along.

826
00:44:53,239 --> 00:44:55,480
Speaker 3: There is a guy in a polo shirt and then

827
00:44:55,520 --> 00:44:59,520
Speaker 3: an older man and a jacket, and they come along

828
00:44:59,760 --> 00:45:02,040
Speaker 3: walk past the box, and the man in the box

829
00:45:02,120 --> 00:45:04,960
Speaker 3: pantomimes to them that he needs help getting out, and

830
00:45:05,040 --> 00:45:08,960
Speaker 3: so the two men stop to try. I think it's

831
00:45:09,000 --> 00:45:12,440
Speaker 3: worth noting that in their performance they never seem to

832
00:45:12,840 --> 00:45:16,000
Speaker 3: care all that much. They do not act like they

833
00:45:16,080 --> 00:45:19,920
Speaker 3: are concerned for the man. They do stop to help,

834
00:45:20,040 --> 00:45:22,960
Speaker 3: but for example, the first thing they do is they

835
00:45:22,960 --> 00:45:25,439
Speaker 3: go to the man and they suggest that he try

836
00:45:25,520 --> 00:45:30,279
Speaker 3: pushing on the door. Then when that clearly doesn't work,

837
00:45:30,320 --> 00:45:32,680
Speaker 3: they start trying to pull on the door from the outside,

838
00:45:32,719 --> 00:45:36,080
Speaker 3: but it's not moving, and then they declare, well, we're

839
00:45:36,160 --> 00:45:38,840
Speaker 3: late for work, and they move on, leaving the man behind.

840
00:45:38,920 --> 00:45:41,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, the guys are basically like, look, we've done exactly

841
00:45:41,760 --> 00:45:44,920
Speaker 2: as much as the Social contract Demand's office, and then

842
00:45:44,960 --> 00:45:47,560
Speaker 2: they move on. And this is a vibe that's going

843
00:45:47,600 --> 00:45:50,719
Speaker 2: to continue throughout the film, where different people attempt to help,

844
00:45:51,560 --> 00:45:54,759
Speaker 2: their actions always very much within the neuro confines of

845
00:45:54,800 --> 00:45:57,879
Speaker 2: what society and or their job requires of them.

846
00:45:58,560 --> 00:46:00,399
Speaker 3: And the thing I want to emphasize is it's true

847
00:46:00,400 --> 00:46:03,560
Speaker 3: of them and basically everybody else who comes along. They

848
00:46:03,600 --> 00:46:06,959
Speaker 3: do briefly stop to try to help, but it never

849
00:46:07,040 --> 00:46:10,960
Speaker 3: feels like they see him or like they're concerned for him.

850
00:46:11,000 --> 00:46:14,000
Speaker 3: It's just kind of like, oh, here's a little problem, eh, okay,

851
00:46:14,080 --> 00:46:15,160
Speaker 3: can't fix it, see.

852
00:46:15,040 --> 00:46:18,680
Speaker 2: You, Yeah, And they never seem to appreciate any real danger.

853
00:46:19,520 --> 00:46:21,839
Speaker 2: And of course we don't truly begin and our main

854
00:46:21,920 --> 00:46:24,480
Speaker 2: character doesn't truly begin to understand the danger till later.

855
00:46:25,040 --> 00:46:27,200
Speaker 3: So in the meantime, while these guys are pulling on

856
00:46:27,200 --> 00:46:30,320
Speaker 3: the door, several spectators sort of gather up around the scene.

857
00:46:30,480 --> 00:46:32,760
Speaker 3: There are some adult women coming back from the store,

858
00:46:33,000 --> 00:46:36,239
Speaker 3: they stop to look at him from a distance. There's

859
00:46:36,280 --> 00:46:39,320
Speaker 3: a group of evil children who begin pointing and laughing

860
00:46:39,360 --> 00:46:42,000
Speaker 3: at him, and they gather outside the door to the box.

861
00:46:42,080 --> 00:46:45,600
Speaker 3: They're mocking him. They're saying, like, what's wrong with you? Man?

862
00:46:45,640 --> 00:46:47,839
Speaker 3: And one of them says, should we throw you peanuts?

863
00:46:48,280 --> 00:46:51,080
Speaker 3: And the children run in circles around the box, hooting

864
00:46:51,160 --> 00:46:53,560
Speaker 3: at him, and they're just having the time of their lives.

865
00:46:53,600 --> 00:46:55,279
Speaker 3: This is hilarious. Yeah.

866
00:46:55,320 --> 00:46:57,120
Speaker 2: How many Spanish films have we seen at this point

867
00:46:57,160 --> 00:47:00,600
Speaker 2: where mobs of children mock an adults predicament. I think

868
00:47:00,600 --> 00:47:02,120
Speaker 2: this is at least the third one.

869
00:47:02,160 --> 00:47:05,080
Speaker 3: That's the mainstay of Paul Nashy movies. Also, yeah, it's

870
00:47:05,080 --> 00:47:06,840
Speaker 3: just mobs of evil children.

871
00:47:07,280 --> 00:47:09,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, I believe it also showed up in the Tomb

872
00:47:09,880 --> 00:47:11,960
Speaker 2: of the Blind Dead film that we watch. It's like

873
00:47:12,680 --> 00:47:15,239
Speaker 2: Spanish Spanish children in these movies are just out to

874
00:47:15,280 --> 00:47:16,400
Speaker 2: shame and harass.

875
00:47:16,920 --> 00:47:19,040
Speaker 3: So I think it's kind of interesting to note all

876
00:47:19,080 --> 00:47:21,760
Speaker 3: of the different characters who become part of the crowd

877
00:47:21,880 --> 00:47:24,359
Speaker 3: around the man in the box. So there's a guy

878
00:47:25,000 --> 00:47:28,160
Speaker 3: carrying an ornate cushioned chair on his head. I think

879
00:47:28,160 --> 00:47:31,400
Speaker 3: he might he's supposed to be a mover maybe maybe

880
00:47:31,400 --> 00:47:33,560
Speaker 3: somebody is moving into one of these apartment buildings, and

881
00:47:33,560 --> 00:47:36,240
Speaker 3: he stops and he puts the chair down in the

882
00:47:36,360 --> 00:47:39,640
Speaker 3: in the yard, just to watch the scene. And then

883
00:47:39,680 --> 00:47:42,120
Speaker 3: there's a man who's or it's a young man I guess,

884
00:47:42,200 --> 00:47:45,399
Speaker 3: going around selling pastries from a tray. He gets robbed. Later,

885
00:47:46,840 --> 00:47:50,960
Speaker 3: a couple of movers are unloading a large, polished mirror

886
00:47:51,040 --> 00:47:54,440
Speaker 3: that has like baroque framing on the outside, and they

887
00:47:54,440 --> 00:47:56,800
Speaker 3: stop and they put the mirror down to watch what's happening.

888
00:47:57,880 --> 00:48:01,120
Speaker 3: A few women nearby they sit down on a bench

889
00:48:01,160 --> 00:48:03,919
Speaker 3: and begin knitting and they're knitting. That's when you really

890
00:48:03,920 --> 00:48:07,200
Speaker 3: know you're in trouble. And so next we get to

891
00:48:08,040 --> 00:48:13,040
Speaker 3: the large man, Tito Garcia. Here he's this big guy

892
00:48:13,160 --> 00:48:15,959
Speaker 3: carrying an athletic bag. I think it's a Puma brand bag.

893
00:48:16,040 --> 00:48:18,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like I guess he's going to the gym or

894
00:48:18,640 --> 00:48:19,760
Speaker 2: just came back from the gym.

895
00:48:19,960 --> 00:48:23,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, he's a weightlifter guy. And he comes to the

896
00:48:23,120 --> 00:48:26,040
Speaker 3: rescue and he's like, Okay, everybody, get out of the way.

897
00:48:26,120 --> 00:48:28,719
Speaker 3: I'm the strongest. I'll get this thing open. And he

898
00:48:28,880 --> 00:48:33,000
Speaker 3: tugs and he tugs, and it's played a bit for comedy.

899
00:48:33,160 --> 00:48:35,880
Speaker 3: All he succeeds in is breaking the handle off of

900
00:48:35,920 --> 00:48:40,360
Speaker 3: the door, and then he tries repeatedly ramming the glass

901
00:48:40,400 --> 00:48:42,880
Speaker 3: with his shoulder like he's a charging bull, but to

902
00:48:43,040 --> 00:48:45,800
Speaker 3: no avail. And this is all played for physical comedy.

903
00:48:46,239 --> 00:48:48,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, but you know, you do get the vibe that

904
00:48:49,000 --> 00:48:51,759
Speaker 2: he is trying to do what's right, both in the

905
00:48:51,800 --> 00:48:55,520
Speaker 2: eyes of the gray man inside, but also the crowd

906
00:48:55,560 --> 00:48:58,640
Speaker 2: of onlookers, like there's a performative aspect of what's going on,

907
00:48:59,040 --> 00:49:03,360
Speaker 2: even though as he begins to fail at this task,

908
00:49:03,440 --> 00:49:06,359
Speaker 2: they begin to sort of mock him as well. But

909
00:49:06,440 --> 00:49:08,440
Speaker 2: in the end, once more, there's only so much he

910
00:49:08,480 --> 00:49:12,200
Speaker 2: can do and has to do in everyone's eyes, and

911
00:49:12,239 --> 00:49:14,040
Speaker 2: it's kind of like, well, it is what it is.

912
00:49:14,160 --> 00:49:16,080
Speaker 2: I gave it a good go, but I've got places

913
00:49:16,120 --> 00:49:17,239
Speaker 2: to be buddy. Yeah.

914
00:49:17,280 --> 00:49:20,440
Speaker 3: Once again, I feel like he never seems to really

915
00:49:20,719 --> 00:49:23,879
Speaker 3: see or be concerned about the man inside. He's just like, oh,

916
00:49:23,880 --> 00:49:26,200
Speaker 3: here's a problem. I'm strong, I can get this thing open.

917
00:49:26,280 --> 00:49:28,960
Speaker 3: And he tries and tries, and then he's humiliated and

918
00:49:29,000 --> 00:49:30,920
Speaker 3: then last to leave. Yeah.

919
00:49:31,000 --> 00:49:34,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, but yeah, there's never a sense that he cares

920
00:49:34,040 --> 00:49:39,640
Speaker 2: about the individual in the box. He wants to obey

921
00:49:39,680 --> 00:49:42,440
Speaker 2: the social contract. He wants to sort of appease the

922
00:49:42,480 --> 00:49:46,560
Speaker 2: crowd and perhaps himself in his own ego. But does

923
00:49:46,560 --> 00:49:49,720
Speaker 2: he really see the gray man at all in a sense.

924
00:49:49,800 --> 00:49:49,840
Speaker 1: No.

925
00:49:50,680 --> 00:49:53,319
Speaker 3: Somewhere in here there's an interesting moment where the man

926
00:49:53,400 --> 00:49:57,000
Speaker 3: in the box sees his reflection in the fancy mirror

927
00:49:57,040 --> 00:50:00,359
Speaker 3: that the movers have set down across from him and

928
00:50:00,480 --> 00:50:02,920
Speaker 3: on Rewatch. I thought this was kind of interesting because

929
00:50:03,160 --> 00:50:05,000
Speaker 3: a few things happen here, for one thing, and the

930
00:50:05,040 --> 00:50:09,400
Speaker 3: man sees himself in the mirror. He's clearly embarrassed, and

931
00:50:09,440 --> 00:50:12,080
Speaker 3: he kind of tries to adjust his appearance in a way.

932
00:50:12,640 --> 00:50:15,080
Speaker 3: But this is also the first moment where it felt

933
00:50:15,120 --> 00:50:20,520
Speaker 3: to me like Vasquez's performance, where the man's demeanor shifts

934
00:50:20,560 --> 00:50:24,440
Speaker 3: a little bit from frustration and embarrassment to worry.

935
00:50:25,360 --> 00:50:28,560
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, And of course I love just the idea

936
00:50:28,560 --> 00:50:32,280
Speaker 2: of bringing the mirror into this. It feels very borges esque,

937
00:50:32,280 --> 00:50:36,400
Speaker 2: you know. And also the mirror is of course a

938
00:50:36,440 --> 00:50:40,000
Speaker 2: person in a box sort and so the man in

939
00:50:40,040 --> 00:50:42,840
Speaker 2: the box is now reflected and is another man in

940
00:50:42,880 --> 00:50:47,160
Speaker 2: the box. And I think maybe now he's seeing himself

941
00:50:47,680 --> 00:50:50,120
Speaker 2: from the outside, right, he's seeing what other people are

942
00:50:50,160 --> 00:50:54,440
Speaker 2: seeing that he is this person trapped within and maybe

943
00:50:54,480 --> 00:50:56,360
Speaker 2: less of a person, you know, he is just he

944
00:50:56,440 --> 00:51:00,319
Speaker 2: is within something else. He he's no longer like this

945
00:51:00,440 --> 00:51:01,600
Speaker 2: free part of the world.

946
00:51:02,520 --> 00:51:04,920
Speaker 3: I think that's right. Yeah, But then so we we're

947
00:51:04,920 --> 00:51:07,160
Speaker 3: gonna get another attempt to intervene. So the guy who

948
00:51:07,280 --> 00:51:09,800
Speaker 3: was carrying the mirror next tries to show that he

949
00:51:09,800 --> 00:51:12,440
Speaker 3: he's the one who can get the box open. He's like,

950
00:51:12,480 --> 00:51:15,280
Speaker 3: it takes not strength but skill, and so he pulls

951
00:51:15,280 --> 00:51:17,480
Speaker 3: out his tools. He's got like a screwdriver. He has

952
00:51:17,520 --> 00:51:20,000
Speaker 3: the tools and he has the know how. So we

953
00:51:20,040 --> 00:51:22,319
Speaker 3: see him searching all over the box looking for the

954
00:51:22,360 --> 00:51:25,240
Speaker 3: place where he can unscrew the door and get it open,

955
00:51:25,800 --> 00:51:28,080
Speaker 3: but he finds nothing. It's like it was made not

956
00:51:28,160 --> 00:51:29,120
Speaker 3: to be disassembled.

957
00:51:29,719 --> 00:51:29,919
Speaker 2: Uh.

958
00:51:29,960 --> 00:51:31,960
Speaker 3: And then he tries to pry the door open with

959
00:51:32,000 --> 00:51:34,680
Speaker 3: his tools, but he can't get that done either. And

960
00:51:34,800 --> 00:51:37,920
Speaker 3: then while the screwdriver man is working and the crowd

961
00:51:38,000 --> 00:51:41,640
Speaker 3: is watching, Uh, the man in the telephone box, he

962
00:51:42,320 --> 00:51:46,280
Speaker 3: like witnesses things happening outside. I thought this was so interesting.

963
00:51:46,280 --> 00:51:49,879
Speaker 3: So everybody's watching him, and then he's looking out through

964
00:51:49,920 --> 00:51:53,600
Speaker 3: the windows seeing things happening in the crowd. That other

965
00:51:53,719 --> 00:51:56,200
Speaker 3: people are not seeing. He's like seeing what is not

966
00:51:56,400 --> 00:52:00,839
Speaker 3: otherwise observed. So he like watches a man steal pastries

967
00:52:00,960 --> 00:52:04,000
Speaker 3: from the pastry vendors tray and cram them in his mouth,

968
00:52:05,160 --> 00:52:07,560
Speaker 3: and he walks. He sees a man walk by behind

969
00:52:07,640 --> 00:52:12,080
Speaker 3: the crowd with multicolored balloons. He sees the mover who

970
00:52:12,200 --> 00:52:15,239
Speaker 3: set down the cushioned chair, offering the chair to an

971
00:52:15,280 --> 00:52:18,759
Speaker 3: elderly woman who is also there watching the scene, which

972
00:52:18,800 --> 00:52:21,640
Speaker 3: is funny because it's like it's like a gesture of kindness,

973
00:52:21,760 --> 00:52:24,520
Speaker 3: but not toward the man in the box, only toward

974
00:52:24,600 --> 00:52:29,840
Speaker 3: another member of his unwonted audience. And then finally, uh oh,

975
00:52:29,880 --> 00:52:34,480
Speaker 3: here comes the fuzz. So two uniformed police come marching

976
00:52:34,520 --> 00:52:35,240
Speaker 3: up to the scene.

977
00:52:35,880 --> 00:52:36,000
Speaker 2: Uh.

978
00:52:36,200 --> 00:52:40,320
Speaker 3: And I've read other reviewers mentioning feeling at this moment

979
00:52:40,440 --> 00:52:42,919
Speaker 3: when they watched it, like, oh, okay, the authorities are here,

980
00:52:42,960 --> 00:52:44,799
Speaker 3: the situation is under control now.

981
00:52:44,840 --> 00:52:47,879
Speaker 2: But nope, Well, you know, given the sort of rule

982
00:52:47,920 --> 00:52:50,080
Speaker 2: of three, right, if this were some sort of a parable,

983
00:52:50,640 --> 00:52:52,880
Speaker 2: and it definitely feel it has more of the trappings

984
00:52:52,880 --> 00:52:55,759
Speaker 2: of parable. I think when we tell listeners what's happening here,

985
00:52:55,760 --> 00:52:57,840
Speaker 2: it feels like okay now, And then the third people

986
00:52:57,880 --> 00:53:00,279
Speaker 2: that came and tried to solve the riddle. They were

987
00:53:00,320 --> 00:53:03,480
Speaker 2: able to solve it because they had legal authority to

988
00:53:03,520 --> 00:53:06,200
Speaker 2: do so. But, like you say, this is also not

989
00:53:06,360 --> 00:53:07,439
Speaker 2: going to work, right.

990
00:53:07,520 --> 00:53:09,880
Speaker 3: So the cops here have an awesome way of dealing

991
00:53:09,880 --> 00:53:13,160
Speaker 3: with the situation. They arrive and they tell the man

992
00:53:13,200 --> 00:53:15,480
Speaker 3: with the screwdriver to get away from the box, and

993
00:53:15,520 --> 00:53:17,359
Speaker 3: they tell the man stuck in the box to get

994
00:53:17,400 --> 00:53:20,720
Speaker 3: out immediately, and then when he shows that he can't,

995
00:53:20,880 --> 00:53:23,319
Speaker 3: they start barking threats at him and saying, didn't you

996
00:53:23,320 --> 00:53:27,319
Speaker 3: hear me, I said, get out of there now? Yeah.

997
00:53:27,400 --> 00:53:31,319
Speaker 2: So, once more they follow procedure, they enforce their authority,

998
00:53:32,200 --> 00:53:35,280
Speaker 2: but they are unable to help and gladly step aside

999
00:53:35,320 --> 00:53:39,160
Speaker 2: to let some other authorized party jump in. And during

1000
00:53:39,200 --> 00:53:42,439
Speaker 2: this section of the short film here I thought quite

1001
00:53:42,440 --> 00:53:45,319
Speaker 2: a bit about the bystander effect in all of this.

1002
00:53:45,320 --> 00:53:47,920
Speaker 2: This is that psychological theory that I believe we've talked

1003
00:53:47,960 --> 00:53:50,320
Speaker 2: about in the show before. It states that the presence

1004
00:53:50,640 --> 00:53:55,080
Speaker 2: of others tends to discourage an individual from intervening. So

1005
00:53:55,239 --> 00:53:58,560
Speaker 2: in the more people there are, arguably the less likely

1006
00:53:58,880 --> 00:54:02,640
Speaker 2: any individual is to help. And this is not necessarily

1007
00:54:02,680 --> 00:54:05,360
Speaker 2: grounded in any kind of like state of innate cruelty

1008
00:54:05,440 --> 00:54:08,680
Speaker 2: or anything. If there is a conscious energy to it all,

1009
00:54:08,800 --> 00:54:11,000
Speaker 2: it is often something along the lines of, oh, well,

1010
00:54:11,280 --> 00:54:14,840
Speaker 2: someone more qualified, someone more official, or someone more just

1011
00:54:15,080 --> 00:54:18,080
Speaker 2: someone closer to the situation, they're going to jump in

1012
00:54:18,160 --> 00:54:20,920
Speaker 2: and do what needs to be done. I'm not that person.

1013
00:54:21,440 --> 00:54:23,800
Speaker 2: And this is why if you've ever taken any CPR

1014
00:54:23,880 --> 00:54:27,319
Speaker 2: classes before, they always stress that you don't say, hey,

1015
00:54:27,320 --> 00:54:30,000
Speaker 2: someone called nine one one, because there's too much room

1016
00:54:30,000 --> 00:54:32,360
Speaker 2: for people to say, yes, that's a great idea. Someone

1017
00:54:32,400 --> 00:54:36,319
Speaker 2: should do that, maybe someone closer to the situation or

1018
00:54:36,320 --> 00:54:38,279
Speaker 2: someone unless No, what you do is you point at

1019
00:54:38,360 --> 00:54:40,799
Speaker 2: someone and you tell them to call nine to one one.

1020
00:54:41,160 --> 00:54:44,399
Speaker 2: Because if you leave it open, then there's this there's

1021
00:54:44,440 --> 00:54:47,719
Speaker 2: a high likelihood that nothing is going to be done,

1022
00:54:47,840 --> 00:54:50,440
Speaker 2: or it's going to take far longer for some decision

1023
00:54:50,440 --> 00:54:51,000
Speaker 2: to be made.

1024
00:54:51,239 --> 00:54:54,319
Speaker 3: Yeah, everybody assumes somebody else is doing it, or it

1025
00:54:54,360 --> 00:54:57,279
Speaker 3: takes them too long to figure out who's doing it. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1026
00:54:57,320 --> 00:54:59,160
Speaker 2: So when the when the police kind of run out

1027
00:54:59,160 --> 00:55:02,560
Speaker 2: of options, that you know someone else is about to

1028
00:55:02,680 --> 00:55:05,000
Speaker 2: arrive on the scene. It's the fire department and they're like, oh, well,

1029
00:55:05,000 --> 00:55:06,399
Speaker 2: good fire department will take care.

1030
00:55:06,280 --> 00:55:08,920
Speaker 3: Of it, okay, see yah, So the fire department, it

1031
00:55:08,960 --> 00:55:10,759
Speaker 3: really seems like these are the ones who are going

1032
00:55:10,800 --> 00:55:14,040
Speaker 3: to solve the problem, right. So they've they've got ladders

1033
00:55:14,080 --> 00:55:17,040
Speaker 3: and axes and everything they need to get inside this box.

1034
00:55:18,320 --> 00:55:22,279
Speaker 3: So they get like one of the fire firefighters gets

1035
00:55:22,360 --> 00:55:24,400
Speaker 3: up on top of the box and it seems like

1036
00:55:24,440 --> 00:55:26,600
Speaker 3: he is going to smash the glass in.

1037
00:55:27,040 --> 00:55:29,200
Speaker 2: And I was really thinking this was going to do it,

1038
00:55:29,239 --> 00:55:32,480
Speaker 2: surely like they had. Finally someone has the tools. It

1039
00:55:32,640 --> 00:55:35,160
Speaker 2: seems it's a little violent, but it looks like this

1040
00:55:35,200 --> 00:55:35,839
Speaker 2: is going to work.

1041
00:55:36,120 --> 00:55:40,800
Speaker 3: But just then an even higher authority arrives, the phone company.

1042
00:55:42,520 --> 00:55:45,960
Speaker 3: So finally the right people for the job. The phone

1043
00:55:46,000 --> 00:55:49,239
Speaker 3: company truck parks and four men get out, I think

1044
00:55:49,360 --> 00:55:53,399
Speaker 3: the same fore men who installed the box earlier, and

1045
00:55:53,480 --> 00:55:56,759
Speaker 3: they One thing I thought was worth noting, we never

1046
00:55:56,760 --> 00:55:58,720
Speaker 3: get a very close look at any of the phone

1047
00:55:58,719 --> 00:56:02,600
Speaker 3: company workers, whatever they actually are, the people dressed up

1048
00:56:02,640 --> 00:56:05,319
Speaker 3: in the green uniforms who put the box there. But

1049
00:56:05,680 --> 00:56:10,040
Speaker 3: from a distance they all look vaguely like the man

1050
00:56:10,160 --> 00:56:13,479
Speaker 3: stuck inside the box. They're all like middle aged men

1051
00:56:13,560 --> 00:56:16,520
Speaker 3: who are balding on top with a horseshoe of dark hair.

1052
00:56:17,080 --> 00:56:19,640
Speaker 2: That's a good point. Yeah, they're just very much bland,

1053
00:56:19,800 --> 00:56:23,920
Speaker 2: everyday men, they are, and we get far we get

1054
00:56:24,120 --> 00:56:26,320
Speaker 2: far less character from these. We don't get a sense

1055
00:56:26,680 --> 00:56:30,120
Speaker 2: of the same sort of interpersonal connection that we do

1056
00:56:30,200 --> 00:56:33,440
Speaker 2: with these other phases of helpers or would be helpers.

1057
00:56:33,800 --> 00:56:36,160
Speaker 3: That's right. So the four men come and they unbolt

1058
00:56:36,160 --> 00:56:38,480
Speaker 3: the phone booth from the earth, they lift it up,

1059
00:56:39,000 --> 00:56:41,839
Speaker 3: they insert the poles to carry it, and then they

1060
00:56:41,920 --> 00:56:44,759
Speaker 3: carry it back to their flatbed truck, put it on

1061
00:56:44,800 --> 00:56:47,799
Speaker 3: the truck bed and drive away, all with the man

1062
00:56:47,960 --> 00:56:52,480
Speaker 3: still stuck inside, and everybody at the assembled crowd they're

1063
00:56:52,520 --> 00:56:56,000
Speaker 3: all cheering and celebrating, like this is what's supposed to happen.

1064
00:56:56,480 --> 00:57:00,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like somebody who knows what they're doing came something,

1065
00:57:00,719 --> 00:57:01,919
Speaker 2: so things are okay now.

1066
00:57:02,280 --> 00:57:04,320
Speaker 3: But the guy in the box is like, wait, what

1067
00:57:04,320 --> 00:57:08,480
Speaker 3: what's going on? But from everybody outside's perspective, it's like

1068
00:57:08,560 --> 00:57:12,120
Speaker 3: it's absurd. But it almost is plausible that that is

1069
00:57:12,160 --> 00:57:16,040
Speaker 3: how a crowd would react, because it's now like by

1070
00:57:16,360 --> 00:57:19,680
Speaker 3: removing the man in a in a kind of weird

1071
00:57:19,680 --> 00:57:22,160
Speaker 3: psychological way, the people who were standing around can be

1072
00:57:22,200 --> 00:57:24,480
Speaker 3: like the situation has been resolved.

1073
00:57:24,800 --> 00:57:25,120
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1074
00:57:25,240 --> 00:57:36,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, So this gives rise to the middle section of

1075
00:57:36,520 --> 00:57:38,560
Speaker 3: the movie, where the man is still stuck in the

1076
00:57:38,760 --> 00:57:41,320
Speaker 3: booth and now he's riding around on the back of

1077
00:57:41,360 --> 00:57:44,520
Speaker 3: the truck. I did notice this earlier, actually, but I

1078
00:57:44,520 --> 00:57:46,320
Speaker 3: thought we've got to mention at some point, so I

1079
00:57:46,320 --> 00:57:49,480
Speaker 3: do want to mention here how hot it seems like

1080
00:57:49,520 --> 00:57:51,960
Speaker 3: it would be inside that booth. Was just like the

1081
00:57:52,000 --> 00:57:55,720
Speaker 3: sun blasting down through the glass and the doors are stuck.

1082
00:57:56,400 --> 00:57:59,720
Speaker 3: And apparently this was actually an issue during filmmaking that,

1083
00:57:59,800 --> 00:58:02,400
Speaker 3: like the actor in the box, it was quite hot

1084
00:58:02,440 --> 00:58:05,200
Speaker 3: in there, and they at some points had to like

1085
00:58:05,360 --> 00:58:08,080
Speaker 3: angle shots in certain ways so that you couldn't see

1086
00:58:08,160 --> 00:58:10,960
Speaker 3: that pains had to be removed from parts of the

1087
00:58:10,960 --> 00:58:13,360
Speaker 3: box just to allow some air to circulate, or it

1088
00:58:13,360 --> 00:58:16,760
Speaker 3: would get unbearably hot inside. But during this section of

1089
00:58:16,760 --> 00:58:19,680
Speaker 3: the short, the truck is driving around Madrid and the

1090
00:58:19,720 --> 00:58:23,560
Speaker 3: man is becoming increasingly distressed. He tries to get the

1091
00:58:23,600 --> 00:58:26,280
Speaker 3: attention of the workers in the truck, but they won't

1092
00:58:26,320 --> 00:58:29,040
Speaker 3: even look at him like that. It's not like they're menacing.

1093
00:58:29,080 --> 00:58:32,600
Speaker 3: They just eyes forward, driving, no acknowledgment of him at

1094
00:58:32,640 --> 00:58:36,080
Speaker 3: all other people on the road, much like the crowd

1095
00:58:36,200 --> 00:58:40,200
Speaker 3: earlier just do not seem to take him seriously, Like

1096
00:58:40,280 --> 00:58:43,040
Speaker 3: they stare at him, they're kind of amused, or they

1097
00:58:43,240 --> 00:58:46,000
Speaker 3: mock him and laugh at him. We see some young

1098
00:58:46,040 --> 00:58:48,800
Speaker 3: attractive people in a convertible like pull up next to

1099
00:58:48,840 --> 00:58:51,240
Speaker 3: the truck in traffic, and they're all pointing at him,

1100
00:58:51,440 --> 00:58:53,600
Speaker 3: and one of them jokingly, I think, asks if they

1101
00:58:53,600 --> 00:58:54,600
Speaker 3: can make a phone call.

1102
00:58:55,040 --> 00:59:00,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, And this whole time too, we're driving past more

1103
00:59:01,720 --> 00:59:05,400
Speaker 2: high rise apartment buildings in various high rise buildings in Madrid.

1104
00:59:05,680 --> 00:59:09,040
Speaker 2: And this is another I think there's some great visual

1105
00:59:09,080 --> 00:59:12,920
Speaker 2: poetry going on here between the vertical phone booth and

1106
00:59:12,960 --> 00:59:17,520
Speaker 2: the vertical buildings, the idea of these towers of modernity

1107
00:59:17,760 --> 00:59:20,200
Speaker 2: in here, this sort of little tower of modernity in

1108
00:59:20,240 --> 00:59:21,760
Speaker 2: which our main character is trapped.

1109
00:59:22,240 --> 00:59:26,000
Speaker 3: Yeah. And so obviously this section of the movie is

1110
00:59:26,040 --> 00:59:28,720
Speaker 3: where they were fulfilling part of their obligation to the

1111
00:59:29,200 --> 00:59:33,200
Speaker 3: Ministry office that was like show us Madrid modernizing. And

1112
00:59:33,280 --> 00:59:35,280
Speaker 3: so we get some of these views of the city,

1113
00:59:35,680 --> 00:59:37,600
Speaker 3: but I think a lot of them are sort of

1114
00:59:37,640 --> 00:59:40,720
Speaker 3: situated and edited together actually to make us feel some

1115
00:59:41,160 --> 00:59:45,960
Speaker 3: amount of dread. Yeah, yeah, because we see like buildings

1116
00:59:46,040 --> 00:59:49,240
Speaker 3: being constructed and so in a way all like construction,

1117
00:59:49,400 --> 00:59:52,960
Speaker 3: that's growth, that's modernizing this good, but we see kind

1118
00:59:53,000 --> 00:59:55,680
Speaker 3: of the bones of a building in a way that's

1119
00:59:55,760 --> 00:59:58,240
Speaker 3: a little unsettling, especially because we see them back to

1120
00:59:58,320 --> 01:00:01,320
Speaker 3: back with a moment where the truck stops outside of

1121
01:00:01,320 --> 01:00:04,439
Speaker 3: a church where there's a funeral going on and it's

1122
01:00:04,440 --> 01:00:06,480
Speaker 3: a funeral with a glass coffin.

1123
01:00:07,120 --> 01:00:12,360
Speaker 2: Yeah, and yeah, the comparison there is obvious and rather foreboding.

1124
01:00:12,960 --> 01:00:15,800
Speaker 2: But but then also gave what you mentioned about the

1125
01:00:16,080 --> 01:00:20,040
Speaker 2: we see these buildings that are being built, and it

1126
01:00:20,080 --> 01:00:24,080
Speaker 2: is there's this kind of feeling like something modern and

1127
01:00:24,160 --> 01:00:27,640
Speaker 2: out of control is happening, you know, And that's what's

1128
01:00:27,640 --> 01:00:30,440
Speaker 2: happening on the micro level here with the phone booths

1129
01:00:30,440 --> 01:00:32,160
Speaker 2: as well, or at least that's the sense I'm beginning

1130
01:00:32,160 --> 01:00:35,640
Speaker 2: to get, like there's some sort of a process going

1131
01:00:35,680 --> 01:00:38,440
Speaker 2: on here. People you know, delivered one of these things,

1132
01:00:38,440 --> 01:00:41,480
Speaker 2: it trapped somebody, and now they're taking it away, and

1133
01:00:41,520 --> 01:00:44,920
Speaker 2: there's this feeling that nobody is at the wheel, or

1134
01:00:44,960 --> 01:00:47,440
Speaker 2: that's the the overbearing feeling that I got from it,

1135
01:00:47,800 --> 01:00:52,280
Speaker 2: like there are just machinations in process. They are completely unfeeling,

1136
01:00:53,000 --> 01:00:57,560
Speaker 2: nobody approved them, nobody's fighting them. It's just what's happening, uh,

1137
01:00:57,680 --> 01:00:59,600
Speaker 2: and you and you were just in the wrong place

1138
01:00:59,640 --> 01:01:00,360
Speaker 2: of the wrong time.

1139
01:01:00,640 --> 01:01:03,240
Speaker 3: Will it connects to a kind of to a kind

1140
01:01:03,280 --> 01:01:05,240
Speaker 3: of real world horror that I think a lot of

1141
01:01:05,240 --> 01:01:08,280
Speaker 3: people will have some experience with the feeling of like

1142
01:01:09,160 --> 01:01:12,880
Speaker 3: when you are in some way to your detriment being

1143
01:01:12,960 --> 01:01:17,520
Speaker 3: the object of an institutional process something by like a

1144
01:01:17,560 --> 01:01:19,920
Speaker 3: you know, a big corporation or a government or some

1145
01:01:20,040 --> 01:01:24,240
Speaker 3: big institution, and there's no way for you to feel

1146
01:01:24,240 --> 01:01:27,080
Speaker 3: like you are getting a foothold with that organization, like

1147
01:01:27,120 --> 01:01:30,120
Speaker 3: they're paying attention to your needs. And that kind of

1148
01:01:30,160 --> 01:01:32,280
Speaker 3: experience can of course run the whole gamut from just

1149
01:01:32,320 --> 01:01:36,720
Speaker 3: like a very frustrating inconvenience to like severe oppression of

1150
01:01:36,760 --> 01:01:40,080
Speaker 3: a person's rights, and in any sense it feels bad,

1151
01:01:40,120 --> 01:01:43,479
Speaker 3: but it can go from much like this story does,

1152
01:01:43,880 --> 01:01:48,760
Speaker 3: from the inconvenient to the horrifying. Now right around here

1153
01:01:48,760 --> 01:01:51,240
Speaker 3: in the stories, the first moment where I would say

1154
01:01:51,280 --> 01:01:55,360
Speaker 3: the energy really seems to tip over when it crosses

1155
01:01:55,440 --> 01:02:00,200
Speaker 3: the threshold into horror, and that moment is when the

1156
01:02:00,240 --> 01:02:03,920
Speaker 3: truck pulls up next to a playground and there are

1157
01:02:04,040 --> 01:02:07,120
Speaker 3: children singing a kind of song where it's some kind

1158
01:02:07,120 --> 01:02:10,000
Speaker 3: of I don't know, old like nursery rhyme song that

1159
01:02:10,080 --> 01:02:14,080
Speaker 3: talks about like Easter and the Trinity. And the truck

1160
01:02:14,160 --> 01:02:17,400
Speaker 3: stops and it stops next to another phone company truck,

1161
01:02:17,680 --> 01:02:20,680
Speaker 3: on which there is also a red telephone box with

1162
01:02:20,760 --> 01:02:21,840
Speaker 3: a man stuck inside.

1163
01:02:22,240 --> 01:02:24,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's where we begin to realize this is

1164
01:02:24,320 --> 01:02:28,920
Speaker 2: not a singular incident, This is not maybe not that

1165
01:02:29,000 --> 01:02:32,560
Speaker 2: much of an anomaly, This is maybe happening all the time.

1166
01:02:32,960 --> 01:02:35,800
Speaker 3: Yeah, And so the men are unable to talk, like

1167
01:02:36,400 --> 01:02:38,480
Speaker 3: because they're both stuck in the boxes, but they look

1168
01:02:38,480 --> 01:02:42,000
Speaker 3: at each other and you see them both like a

1169
01:02:42,120 --> 01:02:44,880
Speaker 3: kind of horror or dawning on them when they see

1170
01:02:44,920 --> 01:02:47,600
Speaker 3: one another. Also because they're kind of dressed the same

1171
01:02:47,680 --> 01:02:51,280
Speaker 3: and look similar, like they just like look like similar guys.

1172
01:02:51,400 --> 01:02:54,440
Speaker 3: And they see each other and they they're aware something

1173
01:02:54,520 --> 01:02:57,680
Speaker 3: frightening is happening, and they're both powerless to do anything

1174
01:02:57,760 --> 01:03:01,600
Speaker 3: about it. So you can see a it's weird almost

1175
01:03:01,640 --> 01:03:04,520
Speaker 3: to kind of like pity for each other but also

1176
01:03:04,560 --> 01:03:07,720
Speaker 3: a kind of resentment for each other in the like

1177
01:03:08,160 --> 01:03:11,720
Speaker 3: seeing what the other one means for them. Yeah. Another

1178
01:03:11,800 --> 01:03:14,320
Speaker 3: interesting moment, I wonder what you made of this was

1179
01:03:14,600 --> 01:03:18,080
Speaker 3: the part where the truck crosses paths on the outskirts

1180
01:03:18,080 --> 01:03:19,960
Speaker 3: of the city, Like there are these ruins a kind

1181
01:03:19,960 --> 01:03:23,840
Speaker 3: of collapsing old wall, and they cross paths with a

1182
01:03:23,840 --> 01:03:27,720
Speaker 3: group of circus performers. There are these guys juggling and

1183
01:03:27,760 --> 01:03:31,640
Speaker 3: in clown makeup sitting on this collapsing wall. One guy's

1184
01:03:31,680 --> 01:03:34,680
Speaker 3: holding a ship in a bottle. Oh, it's it's an

1185
01:03:34,760 --> 01:03:38,919
Speaker 3: unsettling moment. And I would say the men sitting there,

1186
01:03:38,960 --> 01:03:41,120
Speaker 3: like the circus performers do seem to kind of look

1187
01:03:41,160 --> 01:03:45,120
Speaker 3: at the guy in the phone booth with more recognition

1188
01:03:45,360 --> 01:03:48,320
Speaker 3: and pity than most of the other observers in the

1189
01:03:48,360 --> 01:03:51,960
Speaker 3: story do. But I'm not sure what was really meant

1190
01:03:52,000 --> 01:03:52,360
Speaker 3: by this.

1191
01:03:53,160 --> 01:03:56,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think, like everything in the picture, that

1192
01:03:56,440 --> 01:03:59,120
Speaker 2: they keep it vague so that you can have various interpretations.

1193
01:03:59,160 --> 01:04:02,640
Speaker 2: But I guess what I took away from this is maybe,

1194
01:04:02,680 --> 01:04:05,800
Speaker 2: like the circus performers here have a certain amount of freedom,

1195
01:04:05,840 --> 01:04:08,280
Speaker 2: like they live on the outside, and in fact they

1196
01:04:08,280 --> 01:04:10,440
Speaker 2: are situated in this shot on the other side of

1197
01:04:10,480 --> 01:04:14,480
Speaker 2: a wall that separates them from the truck in the

1198
01:04:14,520 --> 01:04:18,480
Speaker 2: phone booth, So you know, in a way they like

1199
01:04:18,520 --> 01:04:23,560
Speaker 2: pity his condition in his circumstance, but they understand it

1200
01:04:23,640 --> 01:04:25,440
Speaker 2: insofar as they have escaped it.

1201
01:04:26,000 --> 01:04:29,440
Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah. And then right after this comes I was

1202
01:04:29,640 --> 01:04:31,920
Speaker 3: maybe the saddest part in the whole thing, which is

1203
01:04:31,960 --> 01:04:34,760
Speaker 3: when the truck crosses paths with a young boy. There's

1204
01:04:34,760 --> 01:04:37,880
Speaker 3: like a young boy out playing with a ball, and

1205
01:04:37,920 --> 01:04:40,480
Speaker 3: the boy waves to the man. This is another point

1206
01:04:40,520 --> 01:04:42,560
Speaker 3: I guess where the man does. It does feel like

1207
01:04:42,600 --> 01:04:46,400
Speaker 3: somebody actually sees the man and kind of like recognizes

1208
01:04:46,440 --> 01:04:50,600
Speaker 3: his humanity and all that. But he when he sees

1209
01:04:50,640 --> 01:04:52,720
Speaker 3: this boy, obviously he thinks about his son, and he

1210
01:04:52,720 --> 01:04:55,320
Speaker 3: thinks about his son earlier, and he remembers the soccer

1211
01:04:55,360 --> 01:04:59,280
Speaker 3: ball bouncing into the phone booth that morning. And I

1212
01:04:59,320 --> 01:05:02,920
Speaker 3: think it's a wrong image because it implies simultaneously a

1213
01:05:03,120 --> 01:05:06,440
Speaker 3: kind of horror. This man's worrying about his own situation

1214
01:05:07,080 --> 01:05:09,320
Speaker 3: and worrying how he's going to get out of this

1215
01:05:09,440 --> 01:05:11,600
Speaker 3: and whether he's going to see his son again. But

1216
01:05:11,720 --> 01:05:14,400
Speaker 3: also there's a kind of relief in the memory, I think,

1217
01:05:14,440 --> 01:05:17,040
Speaker 3: because he realizes that his son could have been the

1218
01:05:17,120 --> 01:05:20,880
Speaker 3: one trapped in the box and he wasn't. Then after

1219
01:05:20,920 --> 01:05:24,840
Speaker 3: this he just keeps getting weirder. Suddenly there's a helicopter

1220
01:05:25,120 --> 01:05:28,760
Speaker 3: following the truck. Why the helicopter. I never knew what

1221
01:05:28,840 --> 01:05:29,440
Speaker 3: to make of that.

1222
01:05:29,960 --> 01:05:32,880
Speaker 2: I think the helicopter just means like someone is watching.

1223
01:05:33,560 --> 01:05:35,800
Speaker 2: It's almost like the eye of God. But then it

1224
01:05:35,840 --> 01:05:41,600
Speaker 2: becomes it offers no comfort because in this situation, God

1225
01:05:41,680 --> 01:05:46,680
Speaker 2: is doing nothing. Whoever is in the helicopter, who's observing

1226
01:05:46,680 --> 01:05:50,440
Speaker 2: from the helicopter, they're not interfering with this, They're just

1227
01:05:50,720 --> 01:05:54,360
Speaker 2: I guess, documenting it. And again there's just this overbearing

1228
01:05:54,400 --> 01:05:55,840
Speaker 2: coldness to the whole scenario.

1229
01:05:56,360 --> 01:06:00,600
Speaker 3: So the truck leads through some strange and amazing locations.

1230
01:06:00,640 --> 01:06:02,959
Speaker 3: At one point it goes down this mountain side road,

1231
01:06:03,200 --> 01:06:06,920
Speaker 3: zigzagging down, down and down into a valley near a

1232
01:06:07,000 --> 01:06:10,800
Speaker 3: huge dam. And then finally at the end of this road,

1233
01:06:11,240 --> 01:06:14,479
Speaker 3: we pass out of the sunlight, which has been beating down.

1234
01:06:14,520 --> 01:06:16,360
Speaker 3: So you might imagine you almost kind of feel a

1235
01:06:16,400 --> 01:06:19,439
Speaker 3: physical relief because this man's been under the glass under

1236
01:06:19,440 --> 01:06:21,520
Speaker 3: the hot sun and it has just been roasting him

1237
01:06:21,520 --> 01:06:24,360
Speaker 3: in there. And they finally pass into darkness. But things

1238
01:06:24,400 --> 01:06:27,800
Speaker 3: are not getting better. So the truck goes into an

1239
01:06:27,880 --> 01:06:32,160
Speaker 3: underground facility and it drives down a long dark road

1240
01:06:32,240 --> 01:06:35,960
Speaker 3: and a tunnel. There are little sort of utility lights

1241
01:06:36,000 --> 01:06:39,960
Speaker 3: all along the walls, and as it goes deeper, it

1242
01:06:40,040 --> 01:06:43,680
Speaker 3: passes more and more unsettling things. The man sees lots

1243
01:06:43,720 --> 01:06:48,120
Speaker 3: of empty red telephone boxes being cleaned and prepared by

1244
01:06:48,160 --> 01:06:50,880
Speaker 3: phone company workers. Again, if that's actually what they are,

1245
01:06:50,880 --> 01:06:54,760
Speaker 3: they're just men in green uniforms. We see trucks leaving

1246
01:06:54,800 --> 01:07:00,160
Speaker 3: the facility loaded with telephone boxes, and the tone markedly shift.

1247
01:07:00,520 --> 01:07:03,560
Speaker 3: There is no longer any ambiguity or any hint of

1248
01:07:03,640 --> 01:07:07,000
Speaker 3: comedy or whimsy. The music lets you know that things

1249
01:07:07,040 --> 01:07:08,240
Speaker 3: have gotten very dark.

1250
01:07:08,880 --> 01:07:12,920
Speaker 2: That's right, Yeah, the carl Orf is in full swing here,

1251
01:07:13,440 --> 01:07:15,640
Speaker 2: and things that are beginning to feel tragic.

1252
01:07:16,320 --> 01:07:19,880
Speaker 3: So the truck parks and uniformed men get out and

1253
01:07:19,960 --> 01:07:22,360
Speaker 3: the man in the box again. He tries to signal

1254
01:07:22,400 --> 01:07:24,240
Speaker 3: them for help, but they don't even look at him.

1255
01:07:24,240 --> 01:07:27,160
Speaker 3: They unhitch the box from the truck and then it

1256
01:07:27,240 --> 01:07:30,680
Speaker 3: is lifted away by a crane and transported to some

1257
01:07:30,880 --> 01:07:34,880
Speaker 3: deeper part of the facility, and the man becomes increasingly

1258
01:07:35,000 --> 01:07:38,400
Speaker 3: terrified and desperate. He's banging on the glass from the inside,

1259
01:07:38,880 --> 01:07:42,680
Speaker 3: but there seems to be no relief, and eventually the

1260
01:07:42,720 --> 01:07:46,160
Speaker 3: box is transported into some kind of dark back room.

1261
01:07:46,240 --> 01:07:50,800
Speaker 3: This big vast warehouse room where he is wheeled past

1262
01:07:51,120 --> 01:07:56,200
Speaker 3: other telephone boxes, and here just the nightmare reaches its apex,

1263
01:07:56,800 --> 01:08:00,800
Speaker 3: where he looks into the other telephone boxes and there

1264
01:08:00,880 --> 01:08:04,000
Speaker 3: are just dead men inside, dead men dressed like him,

1265
01:08:04,080 --> 01:08:07,360
Speaker 3: in various states of decomposition, looking like they've been in

1266
01:08:07,400 --> 01:08:11,720
Speaker 3: there for years or even decades. And finally he is

1267
01:08:11,840 --> 01:08:14,840
Speaker 3: parked next to one where a guy appears to have

1268
01:08:14,920 --> 01:08:18,439
Speaker 3: strangled himself with the cord of his own telephone receiver.

1269
01:08:19,080 --> 01:08:20,800
Speaker 3: The last image we see of the man is of

1270
01:08:20,840 --> 01:08:23,760
Speaker 3: his hand pressed up against the glass. Is he's just

1271
01:08:23,880 --> 01:08:29,599
Speaker 3: I guess, sinking down to the floor in despair? Ending

1272
01:08:29,640 --> 01:08:31,000
Speaker 3: doesn't get much darker than that.

1273
01:08:32,960 --> 01:08:39,679
Speaker 2: Yeah, there is no escape. That is the final statement

1274
01:08:39,760 --> 01:08:41,400
Speaker 2: here that we do get a little bit of a

1275
01:08:41,400 --> 01:08:45,519
Speaker 2: stinger that reminds us don't worry, there's more doom to come.

1276
01:08:45,840 --> 01:08:48,880
Speaker 3: That's right. So we see a clean, tidy, new telephone

1277
01:08:48,920 --> 01:08:53,200
Speaker 3: box being deployed in the plaza, once again, just waiting

1278
01:08:53,200 --> 01:08:57,080
Speaker 3: for the next person to step inside. Wow. So that's

1279
01:08:57,120 --> 01:09:01,240
Speaker 3: the end of Lacabina. But several things I think I

1280
01:09:01,280 --> 01:09:04,480
Speaker 3: want to talk about because it raises all these interesting ideas.

1281
01:09:05,640 --> 01:09:09,639
Speaker 3: One is within the movie, did you ever detect any

1282
01:09:09,720 --> 01:09:13,880
Speaker 3: hint about what the point of the human harvesting operation was, Like,

1283
01:09:14,479 --> 01:09:18,120
Speaker 3: why are people getting trapped in phone booths and stashed underground?

1284
01:09:18,439 --> 01:09:22,599
Speaker 3: I'm almost certain this is intentionally left unanswered by the film.

1285
01:09:22,640 --> 01:09:25,200
Speaker 3: But did you pick up on any clues that I missed?

1286
01:09:25,760 --> 01:09:28,639
Speaker 2: No, I mean, I think it's left ambiguous. I think

1287
01:09:28,760 --> 01:09:30,920
Speaker 2: if I were to supply, I think my own sort

1288
01:09:30,920 --> 01:09:33,400
Speaker 2: of headcannon for what's happening here is that just like

1289
01:09:33,479 --> 01:09:37,600
Speaker 2: some sort of uncorrected accident of design, and the overall

1290
01:09:37,880 --> 01:09:41,839
Speaker 2: view of the corporation and or the government and anyone

1291
01:09:41,920 --> 01:09:46,040
Speaker 2: involved is like, well, these things happen. It's unavoidable. There

1292
01:09:46,080 --> 01:09:50,120
Speaker 2: are tragedies and horrors baked into modern civilization, and I'm sorry,

1293
01:09:50,160 --> 01:09:52,639
Speaker 2: we can't really address these design flaws. It is what

1294
01:09:52,680 --> 01:09:55,320
Speaker 2: it is. I'm sorry it happened to you, or at

1295
01:09:55,400 --> 01:09:59,400
Speaker 2: least I feel obligated to tell you so. And yeah,

1296
01:09:59,479 --> 01:10:02,360
Speaker 2: that's that's what I got from it. I mean, I

1297
01:10:02,360 --> 01:10:04,880
Speaker 2: guess you could lean into the idea that the boxes

1298
01:10:04,920 --> 01:10:07,320
Speaker 2: are being put out there intentionally to catch and kill

1299
01:10:07,360 --> 01:10:11,839
Speaker 2: middle aged men in Madrid, But I like the idea

1300
01:10:11,880 --> 01:10:14,320
Speaker 2: that this is all just an accident of design and

1301
01:10:15,520 --> 01:10:17,880
Speaker 2: it's just not going to be corrected, not out of

1302
01:10:17,960 --> 01:10:21,720
Speaker 2: maliciousness or not individual maliciousness, but just sort of like

1303
01:10:21,840 --> 01:10:23,639
Speaker 2: the uncaring nature of the world.

1304
01:10:24,160 --> 01:10:26,120
Speaker 3: Well, bridging off of that, I guess to go beyond

1305
01:10:26,280 --> 01:10:30,360
Speaker 3: the sort of in universe question of what these people

1306
01:10:30,360 --> 01:10:33,360
Speaker 3: are supposed to be doing in the narrative, there's something

1307
01:10:33,360 --> 01:10:35,320
Speaker 3: a lot of people have asked, which is, like, what

1308
01:10:35,520 --> 01:10:39,160
Speaker 3: is the meaning of the whole story? Is Luckabina supposed

1309
01:10:39,240 --> 01:10:43,640
Speaker 3: to be a metaphor for living under the Francoist dictatorship

1310
01:10:43,640 --> 01:10:48,240
Speaker 3: in Spain? This is something lots of viewers have inferred.

1311
01:10:48,280 --> 01:10:51,519
Speaker 3: I mean, I think it's quite reasonable to suspect that

1312
01:10:51,600 --> 01:10:55,479
Speaker 3: about it. According to the director, the meaning was not

1313
01:10:55,680 --> 01:10:59,639
Speaker 3: intended to be limited to that, so it's not any

1314
01:10:59,720 --> 01:11:04,120
Speaker 3: kind of direct allegory, but instead it was generally about

1315
01:11:04,400 --> 01:11:08,000
Speaker 3: a kind of confinement and unfreedom and the desire for

1316
01:11:08,120 --> 01:11:10,840
Speaker 3: freedom of all sorts. However, I think it's very worth

1317
01:11:10,920 --> 01:11:14,000
Speaker 3: noting that at the time of this film's production and release,

1318
01:11:14,520 --> 01:11:18,080
Speaker 3: Marcero may have believed he had to say that that

1319
01:11:18,200 --> 01:11:22,120
Speaker 3: he could not admit, even if it were a veiled

1320
01:11:22,120 --> 01:11:26,519
Speaker 3: critique of Frank Wist Spain, that that's what it was However,

1321
01:11:26,640 --> 01:11:29,800
Speaker 3: I think this issue is a little further illuminated by

1322
01:11:29,840 --> 01:11:33,599
Speaker 3: a couple of quote quotes that Marcero gave that are

1323
01:11:33,760 --> 01:11:36,920
Speaker 3: collected in that article in the Artifice magazine that we've

1324
01:11:36,960 --> 01:11:40,120
Speaker 3: been talking about. So, for one thing, Marcero, speaking after

1325
01:11:40,160 --> 01:11:45,280
Speaker 3: the film's release, said, quote, Jose Luis Garci and I

1326
01:11:45,320 --> 01:11:48,000
Speaker 3: recognize that when we wrote the script, we were closer

1327
01:11:48,000 --> 01:11:50,360
Speaker 3: to the world of science fiction and terror than any

1328
01:11:50,400 --> 01:11:54,600
Speaker 3: political theme. We also realized that our story had many readings,

1329
01:11:54,840 --> 01:11:58,439
Speaker 3: and that that was its richness and complexity. I would

1330
01:11:58,479 --> 01:12:01,240
Speaker 3: say then that Lakabina is this a parable opened all

1331
01:12:01,320 --> 01:12:04,800
Speaker 3: kinds of interpretations, and according to the sensitivity, culture, and

1332
01:12:04,880 --> 01:12:07,760
Speaker 3: formation of each one, it will be interpreted in a

1333
01:12:07,800 --> 01:12:12,160
Speaker 3: different way, and those multiple interpretations will always be valid.

1334
01:12:12,720 --> 01:12:16,720
Speaker 3: And then, apparently, in an interview to Rtve in two

1335
01:12:16,760 --> 01:12:18,800
Speaker 3: thousand and nine, looking back on the film, so this

1336
01:12:18,840 --> 01:12:22,160
Speaker 3: was when he was much older, he said, quote, all

1337
01:12:22,240 --> 01:12:25,000
Speaker 3: human beings have boxes that we have to get rid of.

1338
01:12:25,439 --> 01:12:27,960
Speaker 3: There are boxes of the moral type, there are boxes

1339
01:12:27,960 --> 01:12:31,200
Speaker 3: of the educational type, there are boxes of the mental type,

1340
01:12:31,280 --> 01:12:34,639
Speaker 3: economic boxes that imprison us. And I believe that life

1341
01:12:34,680 --> 01:12:37,280
Speaker 3: is a continuous quest for freedom from each one of

1342
01:12:37,320 --> 01:12:40,960
Speaker 3: these boxes. In order to be free, spontaneous, and happy,

1343
01:12:41,360 --> 01:12:44,160
Speaker 3: each person has to see which box imprisons him and

1344
01:12:44,240 --> 01:12:48,600
Speaker 3: try to free himself. That is our destiny. So, according

1345
01:12:48,640 --> 01:12:52,839
Speaker 3: to Mrcero himself, a political interpretation is not the only

1346
01:12:52,920 --> 01:12:56,559
Speaker 3: intended meaning, and I certainly don't think it's the only

1347
01:12:56,640 --> 01:12:59,840
Speaker 3: valid interpretation of the film. But I also looking at

1348
01:12:59,880 --> 01:13:02,200
Speaker 3: it and knowing a bit about the history, I would

1349
01:13:02,200 --> 01:13:04,880
Speaker 3: have to say it's certainly a reading that makes sense,

1350
01:13:05,320 --> 01:13:09,480
Speaker 3: especially in the way that it locks with other themes

1351
01:13:09,520 --> 01:13:11,479
Speaker 3: that are clearly there in the story. So there's this

1352
01:13:11,560 --> 01:13:15,560
Speaker 3: theme of unfreedom, but it also the theme of unfreedom

1353
01:13:15,640 --> 01:13:19,240
Speaker 3: connects to the theme of dehumanization, which is a core

1354
01:13:19,360 --> 01:13:22,879
Speaker 3: element of first the comedy and then later the horror.

1355
01:13:23,400 --> 01:13:25,439
Speaker 3: This thing we see over and over is that the

1356
01:13:25,479 --> 01:13:28,400
Speaker 3: man stuck in the phone booth is not being treated

1357
01:13:28,439 --> 01:13:31,400
Speaker 3: as a human being by those outside the booth. He

1358
01:13:31,439 --> 01:13:35,360
Speaker 3: gets mocked, he gets gawkeed at like just some amusing object.

1359
01:13:35,800 --> 01:13:40,000
Speaker 3: He gets absurd, nonsensical orders barked at him by the police,

1360
01:13:40,080 --> 01:13:42,639
Speaker 3: like things that would be impossible for him to comply with.

1361
01:13:43,800 --> 01:13:46,760
Speaker 3: People that do try to help him, most of them

1362
01:13:46,840 --> 01:13:49,840
Speaker 3: don't actually seem all that sympathetic to him. They're just

1363
01:13:49,960 --> 01:13:52,879
Speaker 3: like it's like a way to show off their strength

1364
01:13:52,960 --> 01:13:55,840
Speaker 3: or skills to the gathering crowd by getting the door open.

1365
01:13:56,800 --> 01:14:00,000
Speaker 3: And then eventually the man gets shelved inside an underground

1366
01:14:00,120 --> 01:14:04,040
Speaker 3: bunker to apparently die, with no one at any point

1367
01:14:04,280 --> 01:14:06,320
Speaker 3: other than maybe like the kid on the road, and

1368
01:14:06,360 --> 01:14:10,320
Speaker 3: maybe the circus performers seeming too much notice his humanity,

1369
01:14:10,400 --> 01:14:14,360
Speaker 3: like his pain, his dignity, his desire for freedom, his

1370
01:14:14,439 --> 01:14:18,760
Speaker 3: requests for help. It's really like, once he is stuck

1371
01:14:18,840 --> 01:14:22,360
Speaker 3: in the box, he is not a person anymore. And

1372
01:14:22,439 --> 01:14:27,559
Speaker 3: so despite the film's extremely bleak and horrifying ending, I

1373
01:14:27,560 --> 01:14:31,640
Speaker 3: think it actually functions as a rather humane and emotionally

1374
01:14:31,760 --> 01:14:36,400
Speaker 3: powerful warning against participating in that kind of dehumanization, either

1375
01:14:36,439 --> 01:14:40,520
Speaker 3: as a spectator or as a functionary of an institution

1376
01:14:40,760 --> 01:14:45,000
Speaker 3: stacking telephone boxes full of people underground. Like the person

1377
01:14:45,080 --> 01:14:46,960
Speaker 3: stuck on the other side of the glass is a

1378
01:14:47,040 --> 01:14:50,360
Speaker 3: human being, and tomorrow or the next day, maybe it

1379
01:14:50,439 --> 01:14:53,479
Speaker 3: is you according to this story, and so we've got

1380
01:14:53,479 --> 01:14:55,760
Speaker 3: to treat that person as a human being. The fact

1381
01:14:55,800 --> 01:14:58,120
Speaker 3: that they're stuck in the box isn't funny, and it

1382
01:14:58,160 --> 01:14:59,839
Speaker 3: isn't meaningless. It matters.

1383
01:15:00,640 --> 01:15:03,160
Speaker 2: I think it would be easy to watch this film

1384
01:15:03,200 --> 01:15:05,160
Speaker 2: and just be left with a feeling of like, well,

1385
01:15:05,400 --> 01:15:07,599
Speaker 2: people will do what they can and what they have

1386
01:15:07,680 --> 01:15:09,200
Speaker 2: to do in order to help you, but beyond that,

1387
01:15:09,280 --> 01:15:12,559
Speaker 2: they won't. And you know that. It's not to say

1388
01:15:12,560 --> 01:15:15,240
Speaker 2: that the safety net of society and government is a

1389
01:15:15,240 --> 01:15:17,519
Speaker 2: complete illusion, but it will only get you so far.

1390
01:15:19,200 --> 01:15:21,640
Speaker 2: I guess where it challenges us and where you can

1391
01:15:21,680 --> 01:15:24,400
Speaker 2: get into that idea of the film ultimately being about

1392
01:15:24,479 --> 01:15:29,080
Speaker 2: freeing yourself from your boxes and all is by realizing

1393
01:15:29,160 --> 01:15:32,160
Speaker 2: that we don't have to be like the people in

1394
01:15:32,200 --> 01:15:36,120
Speaker 2: this movie, like this is a cautionary tale, Like we

1395
01:15:36,200 --> 01:15:40,080
Speaker 2: don't have to live in a society, in a culture

1396
01:15:40,439 --> 01:15:43,720
Speaker 2: that views the suffering of other in the predicaments of

1397
01:15:43,800 --> 01:15:45,280
Speaker 2: other people like this.

1398
01:15:45,720 --> 01:15:49,400
Speaker 3: That's right. And so I think that that's one reading

1399
01:15:49,479 --> 01:15:54,559
Speaker 3: on which this weird, absurd, little horror short film actually

1400
01:15:54,560 --> 01:15:59,040
Speaker 3: becomes quite powerful. Like it's not just there to kind

1401
01:15:59,040 --> 01:16:02,200
Speaker 3: of chill you an innertain you. It's rather meaningful and

1402
01:16:02,240 --> 01:16:03,920
Speaker 3: it kind of puts a lesson in there that I

1403
01:16:03,920 --> 01:16:06,680
Speaker 3: think it's hard to forget. But I do want to

1404
01:16:06,680 --> 01:16:09,840
Speaker 3: acknowledge also that that again, that's not the only reading

1405
01:16:09,880 --> 01:16:12,599
Speaker 3: of it. People have interpreted this to mean all kinds

1406
01:16:12,640 --> 01:16:15,599
Speaker 3: of things, and so you know, there's what the director

1407
01:16:15,600 --> 01:16:18,000
Speaker 3: said about it himself, is this general like free your

1408
01:16:18,040 --> 01:16:20,679
Speaker 3: mind sort of thing. There are also all these weird

1409
01:16:20,760 --> 01:16:22,919
Speaker 3: other readings that came up in some of the articles

1410
01:16:22,960 --> 01:16:25,080
Speaker 3: we looked at. The one in the Artifice mentioned some

1411
01:16:25,640 --> 01:16:27,800
Speaker 3: people at the time apparently thought it had something to

1412
01:16:27,800 --> 01:16:31,200
Speaker 3: do with alien abductions. I don't get that much at all,

1413
01:16:31,240 --> 01:16:33,679
Speaker 3: but people take it all over the place.

1414
01:16:34,160 --> 01:16:36,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, and they leave it open, and so you know,

1415
01:16:37,360 --> 01:16:40,760
Speaker 2: all interpretations are valid. All right. Well, there you have it.

1416
01:16:40,960 --> 01:16:46,120
Speaker 2: Nineteen seventy two's La Cabina the telephone Box, I say,

1417
01:16:46,960 --> 01:16:50,559
Speaker 2: still more of a downbeat film compared to last week's Quest,

1418
01:16:51,320 --> 01:16:53,559
Speaker 2: but they do have some things in common, Like they

1419
01:16:53,600 --> 01:16:59,519
Speaker 2: are both films, both short films about liberation or the

1420
01:17:00,240 --> 01:17:03,360
Speaker 2: for liberation, the desire for liberation. Whether that liberation is

1421
01:17:03,400 --> 01:17:05,439
Speaker 2: actually achieved within the runtime or not.

1422
01:17:05,800 --> 01:17:07,960
Speaker 3: I guess it is up to us to imagine the

1423
01:17:08,000 --> 01:17:11,439
Speaker 3: sequel to Lacabino where the where the telephone box regime

1424
01:17:11,520 --> 01:17:12,200
Speaker 3: is overthrown.

1425
01:17:12,720 --> 01:17:15,280
Speaker 2: But can you imagine if someone did a feat I

1426
01:17:15,280 --> 01:17:17,040
Speaker 2: think I've seen that kind of thing done before, where

1427
01:17:17,040 --> 01:17:19,800
Speaker 2: there'll be like some sort of a short, like perfect

1428
01:17:19,920 --> 01:17:22,800
Speaker 2: treatment of an idea. But if you expanded out into

1429
01:17:22,800 --> 01:17:24,880
Speaker 2: a feature, you've got to you've got to add all

1430
01:17:24,880 --> 01:17:27,280
Speaker 2: these elements that kind of take away the bite of

1431
01:17:27,280 --> 01:17:31,080
Speaker 2: the original piece. You know, you'd inevitably have to have

1432
01:17:31,160 --> 01:17:35,240
Speaker 2: that escape and perhaps some explanation of what's going on,

1433
01:17:35,520 --> 01:17:37,439
Speaker 2: and I think a lot of that would fall flat.

1434
01:17:37,680 --> 01:17:39,880
Speaker 3: Yeah, best to leave that victory to the imagination.

1435
01:17:40,680 --> 01:17:42,920
Speaker 2: All right, We're gonna go and close up the episode here,

1436
01:17:42,960 --> 01:17:45,160
Speaker 2: but we'd love to hear from everyone out there. Had

1437
01:17:45,160 --> 01:17:48,439
Speaker 2: you seen the telephone Box before, what did you think

1438
01:17:48,439 --> 01:17:49,800
Speaker 2: of it? What kind of an impact did it have

1439
01:17:49,880 --> 01:17:54,559
Speaker 2: over you? Or are you like us new initians into

1440
01:17:54,600 --> 01:17:56,760
Speaker 2: the mysteries of the telephone box? If that is the case,

1441
01:17:57,320 --> 01:17:59,160
Speaker 2: we want to hear about that too. And if you

1442
01:17:59,280 --> 01:18:02,680
Speaker 2: have any reck mandations for other thirty minute films that

1443
01:18:02,720 --> 01:18:05,080
Speaker 2: feel like a perfect fit for Weird House, we would

1444
01:18:05,080 --> 01:18:08,679
Speaker 2: love to entertain those suggestions. Also, I want to note

1445
01:18:08,720 --> 01:18:11,720
Speaker 2: once more that we are really close to hitting our

1446
01:18:12,040 --> 01:18:15,360
Speaker 2: two hundred film selection here on Weird House Cinema. We've

1447
01:18:15,400 --> 01:18:17,720
Speaker 2: been receiving a number of suggestions for what we might

1448
01:18:17,760 --> 01:18:21,000
Speaker 2: cover and we might not listen to any of those suggestions,

1449
01:18:21,000 --> 01:18:24,960
Speaker 2: but we might. I'm very interested to read more of them,

1450
01:18:25,000 --> 01:18:27,639
Speaker 2: so keep them coming. A reminder that Stuff to Blow

1451
01:18:27,680 --> 01:18:30,680
Speaker 2: Your Mind is primarily a science and culture podcast, with

1452
01:18:30,840 --> 01:18:33,519
Speaker 2: core episodes on Tuesdays and Thursdays, short form episodes on

1453
01:18:33,520 --> 01:18:36,639
Speaker 2: Wednesdays and on Fridays. We set aside most serious concerns

1454
01:18:36,680 --> 01:18:38,519
Speaker 2: to just talk about a weird movie here on weird

1455
01:18:38,520 --> 01:18:41,120
Speaker 2: House Cinema, and if you want to follow us on

1456
01:18:41,280 --> 01:18:45,040
Speaker 2: letterbox dot com, our profile name is weird House and

1457
01:18:45,080 --> 01:18:47,080
Speaker 2: there is in fact a list of all the movies

1458
01:18:47,080 --> 01:18:50,080
Speaker 2: we've covered thus far, and sometimes a glimpse ahead at

1459
01:18:50,080 --> 01:18:51,000
Speaker 2: what's coming out next.

1460
01:18:51,520 --> 01:18:55,480
Speaker 3: Huge thanks as always to our excellent audio producer JJ Posway.

1461
01:18:55,840 --> 01:18:57,479
Speaker 3: If you would like to get in touch with us

1462
01:18:57,479 --> 01:18:59,960
Speaker 3: with feedback on this episode or any other, to suggest

1463
01:19:00,080 --> 01:19:02,120
Speaker 3: to topic for the future, or just to say hello,

1464
01:19:02,520 --> 01:19:05,320
Speaker 3: you can email us at contact at stuff to blow

1465
01:19:05,360 --> 01:19:13,120
Speaker 3: your Mind dot com.

1466
01:19:13,240 --> 01:19:16,200
Speaker 1: Stuff to Blow Your Mind is production of iHeartRadio. For

1467
01:19:16,280 --> 01:19:19,080
Speaker 1: more podcasts from My Heart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app,

1468
01:19:19,240 --> 01:19:22,440
Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.