WEBVTT - Bloomberg Businessweek Weekend - October 24th, 2025 0:00:00.280 --> 0:00:07.240 Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio News. 0:00:08.640 --> 0:00:13.000 This is Bloomberg Business Week Daily reporting from the magazine 0:00:13.000 --> 0:00:17.599 that helps global leaders stay ahead with insight on the people, companies, 0:00:17.640 --> 0:00:22.520 and trends shaping today's complex economy, plus global business finance 0:00:22.560 --> 0:00:26.280 and tech news as it happens. The Bloomberg Business Weekdaily 0:00:26.400 --> 0:00:31.320 Podcast with Carol Masser and Tim Stenebek on Bloomberg Radio. 0:00:32.000 --> 0:00:35.520 Hi, everyone, welcome to the Bloomberg Business Weekend Podcast. After 0:00:35.560 --> 0:00:38.240 another non stop week full of earnings from the likes 0:00:38.240 --> 0:00:42.680 of Netflix, Tesla, Intel, GM and many many others, we 0:00:42.720 --> 0:00:45.520 also had a twenty billion dollar currency swap deal between 0:00:45.520 --> 0:00:48.519 the United States and Argentina, We had US sanctions on 0:00:48.600 --> 0:00:51.839 Russian oil giants, and then gosh, I forgot this was 0:00:51.880 --> 0:00:54.040 early in the week. A big media company, Warner Brothers 0:00:54.080 --> 0:00:55.800 Discovery in play big time. 0:00:56.040 --> 0:00:59.080 I think it's fair to call this a mega busy week, 0:00:59.360 --> 0:01:00.800 and I don't to get ahead. 0:01:00.560 --> 0:01:03.360 Of ourselves capitals, capital letters on all of. 0:01:03.320 --> 0:01:05.080 It, but we should get used to it because next 0:01:05.080 --> 0:01:08.280 week is going to be really busy too. I know, right, Okay, 0:01:08.880 --> 0:01:09.240 We're going. 0:01:09.240 --> 0:01:09.840 To keep it here. 0:01:09.880 --> 0:01:11.280 We're going to keep it on what happened over the 0:01:11.360 --> 0:01:15.000 past week Our highlights for the weekend, explaining that deal 0:01:15.080 --> 0:01:18.720 between the United States and Argentina, the why, the why now, 0:01:18.800 --> 0:01:20.840 and why that country. We're going to get all of 0:01:20.840 --> 0:01:22.320 that and more in just a moment. 0:01:22.800 --> 0:01:27.200 Also President Trump's move backing off of an isolated United States. 0:01:27.240 --> 0:01:29.160 It does feel like this is kind of going on. 0:01:30.000 --> 0:01:32.840 It's all in a rare Earth's deal with Australia to 0:01:32.920 --> 0:01:35.800 fight China. This was kind of one of the first 0:01:35.800 --> 0:01:38.000 big moves that someone pointed out that maybe the US 0:01:38.040 --> 0:01:39.119 isn't going to go it alone here. 0:01:39.560 --> 0:01:42.560 And speaking of the President, we've got his top antagonist. 0:01:42.680 --> 0:01:44.800 It is the cover story of the latest issue of 0:01:44.840 --> 0:01:46.600 Bloomberg BusinessWeek magazine. 0:01:46.600 --> 0:01:49.840 Plus in our second hour, Amazon Robotics chief technologist on 0:01:49.960 --> 0:01:52.960 robots in the workforce of tomorrow, Cheat Coats on how 0:01:53.000 --> 0:01:56.360 to improve your overall wellness totally into that and Tim Yes, 0:01:56.600 --> 0:01:59.880 we know we're all about generative and agentic AI LM's, 0:02:00.040 --> 0:02:03.320 but a lot is happening when it comes to quantum computing. 0:02:04.000 --> 0:02:05.840 Just asked the mayor of Chattanooga, Tennessee. 0:02:05.880 --> 0:02:06.240 We did. 0:02:06.640 --> 0:02:08.760 That's all happening. In our second hour. 0:02:08.960 --> 0:02:11.520 We begin with an agreement signed this past week by 0:02:11.520 --> 0:02:15.359 the US Treasury with the Central Bank of Argentina. US 0:02:15.440 --> 0:02:19.400 Secretary of the Treasury Scott Bessant characterized the Treasury's twenty 0:02:19.560 --> 0:02:22.560 billion dollar swap line with the crisis pro nation's central 0:02:22.560 --> 0:02:27.079 bank as a quote economic stabilization deal, an agreement that is, 0:02:27.160 --> 0:02:30.240 quote a bridge to a better economic future for Argentina, 0:02:30.800 --> 0:02:34.160 not a bailout. We had so many questions about this, 0:02:34.639 --> 0:02:36.720 and there was really one voice we wanted to turn to. 0:02:37.160 --> 0:02:41.400 Bloomberg New Economy editorial director Eric Shatzker. He's covered numerous 0:02:41.480 --> 0:02:45.680 global financial and market cycles. He's interviewed various Latin American leaders, 0:02:45.720 --> 0:02:51.680 including Venezuelan President Nicholas Maduro and former Argentinian President Mauricio Macri. 0:02:52.320 --> 0:02:54.960 Eric also had the September cover story on Secretary Scott 0:02:55.000 --> 0:02:56.760 Bessant for Bloomberg BusinessWeek. 0:02:56.919 --> 0:02:59.280 I think we can unpack this in three ways. One 0:02:59.360 --> 0:03:02.720 is why is the US doing this? The second is 0:03:02.919 --> 0:03:07.000 what exactly have we got here? And the third would 0:03:07.040 --> 0:03:11.799 be how might it all end? Perhaps in tears. I'll 0:03:11.800 --> 0:03:14.640 take on the why. And this actually goes back to 0:03:14.720 --> 0:03:17.079 that story you mentioned that I did about Scott bessen 0:03:17.160 --> 0:03:21.080 the Treasury Secretary for Bloomberg Business Week in September. I 0:03:21.120 --> 0:03:24.560 spoke to the Treasury Secretary back in late July, and 0:03:24.639 --> 0:03:27.600 at the time he told me that one of his 0:03:27.800 --> 0:03:31.960 overarching goals in office as the Secretary of the Treasury 0:03:32.080 --> 0:03:35.640 was to quote unquote lock in dollar supremacy. And I 0:03:35.720 --> 0:03:39.040 asked him, well, how do you do that? And he said, 0:03:39.120 --> 0:03:42.520 and I didn't appreciate the significance of it at the time, 0:03:43.440 --> 0:03:47.920 was by facilitating swaps through the Treasury Department, as opposed 0:03:48.000 --> 0:03:51.120 to the way that swaps have traditionally been facilitated, which 0:03:51.160 --> 0:03:54.560 is by the FED from central bank to central bank. 0:03:54.560 --> 0:03:57.640 Now there is precedent for this. The Treasury Department did 0:03:57.640 --> 0:04:01.200 that from Mexico back in the mid nineties the Peso crisis, 0:04:01.720 --> 0:04:05.240 and it helped, and maybe it'll help Argentina. But it 0:04:05.320 --> 0:04:11.000 appears that under the Trump administration, the government's focus is 0:04:11.080 --> 0:04:13.480 on again cuts to the why. It's not just about 0:04:13.480 --> 0:04:17.080 locking in dollar supremacy. It's using the dollar as an 0:04:17.120 --> 0:04:21.480 economic tool to support countries with which the United States 0:04:21.480 --> 0:04:24.919 feel it has some kind of ideological kinship or some 0:04:25.120 --> 0:04:28.560 kind of trading relationship. It's not like Argentina has been 0:04:28.560 --> 0:04:30.840 one of America's major trading partners. 0:04:30.880 --> 0:04:31.400 It has not. 0:04:32.560 --> 0:04:34.960 The amount of bilateral trade that goes on between those 0:04:34.960 --> 0:04:37.279 two countries is a fraction of what it is with 0:04:37.320 --> 0:04:40.000 the United States in Mexico, or the United States and Canada, 0:04:40.080 --> 0:04:43.560 or even the United States and Europe. So in that respect, 0:04:43.600 --> 0:04:45.680 it's unusual. I think. If you think about it though, 0:04:45.680 --> 0:04:48.919 in terms of locking in dollar supremacy and using the 0:04:49.000 --> 0:04:55.320 dollar as an economic tool, a tool of geostrategy, if 0:04:55.360 --> 0:04:57.880 you will, it begins to make a little more sense. 0:04:58.680 --> 0:05:01.640 You said that different elements that we could we could 0:05:01.640 --> 0:05:04.560 talk about with this. One is how another one is 0:05:05.200 --> 0:05:06.000 how this could end. 0:05:06.960 --> 0:05:09.320 Well, let's talk about what is it that we're actually 0:05:09.360 --> 0:05:13.400 talking about here. You mentioned that the Treasure Secretary today 0:05:13.560 --> 0:05:16.280 talked about it as a bridge to a better economic 0:05:16.320 --> 0:05:19.800 future and not a bailout, and not a bailout. But 0:05:20.440 --> 0:05:23.400 the operative word there is bridge, because bridge means something 0:05:23.400 --> 0:05:25.560 from here to there. In other words, what's the there? 0:05:26.200 --> 0:05:27.960 This is a bridge until when? 0:05:28.240 --> 0:05:28.480 Right? 0:05:28.800 --> 0:05:31.839 Is it a bridge until after Argentina's Mitrum elections on 0:05:31.880 --> 0:05:35.120 the twenty sixth of this month Sunday? Is it a 0:05:35.279 --> 0:05:37.600 Trump seems to suggest as much the other day when 0:05:37.640 --> 0:05:39.880 he said, well, you know, if Malay doesn't win we'll 0:05:39.920 --> 0:05:43.000 get rid of the swap line, So that's one possibility. 0:05:43.600 --> 0:05:46.680 Is it a bridge until Argentina decides to abandon the 0:05:46.680 --> 0:05:52.640 Peso peg, which starts an acre the Minister for Deregulation 0:05:52.760 --> 0:05:57.440 and State Transformation said was in the cards. Is it 0:05:57.640 --> 0:06:01.159 a Is it a bridge until the twenty billion dollars 0:06:01.240 --> 0:06:05.120 runs out, which might happen because Argentina was burning through 0:06:05.120 --> 0:06:07.279 a billion and a half dollars worth of foreign currency 0:06:07.320 --> 0:06:09.920 reserves a week a billion and a half a week 0:06:09.960 --> 0:06:13.040 before the swap line was put in place. Is it 0:06:13.200 --> 0:06:19.000 until Argentina's economy can eventually support an exchange rate at 0:06:19.040 --> 0:06:22.359 this level It certainly can't right now. Or maybe is 0:06:22.400 --> 0:06:25.640 it a bridge until I don't know, President Trump just 0:06:25.680 --> 0:06:28.600 loses patience or President Malay does something to annoy him. 0:06:28.640 --> 0:06:30.120 It's a lot to be any of those. It's a 0:06:30.120 --> 0:06:32.600 lot of questions. It's a lot of like possible scenarios. 0:06:32.640 --> 0:06:35.800 You know, Bloomberg reporter that Jamie Diamond is visiting Argentina 0:06:36.160 --> 0:06:39.800 kind of an unprecedented show of support for the government. Mean, 0:06:39.960 --> 0:06:41.440 at the same time, we've had I think it's the 0:06:41.440 --> 0:06:44.039 Wall Street Journal reporting that banks are having a hard 0:06:44.040 --> 0:06:47.240 time kind of getting around this without some kind of guarantees. 0:06:47.000 --> 0:06:51.000 Nobody knows. Nobody knows what Argentina is pledging as collateral. 0:06:51.400 --> 0:06:54.440 In fact, nobody has seen the agreement. To our knowledge, 0:06:54.720 --> 0:06:58.640 the banks themselves, which you're playing intermediary roles here, don't 0:06:58.680 --> 0:07:05.240 know what Argentina has agreed to pledge. You know, so 0:07:05.320 --> 0:07:09.120 that the United States isn't just on the unlimited losing 0:07:09.240 --> 0:07:12.440 end of a bad trade. And that is possible here, right. 0:07:12.840 --> 0:07:17.600 The big difference between what's going on here and the 0:07:17.640 --> 0:07:20.240 comparison that everybody wants to make with the trade that 0:07:20.280 --> 0:07:22.760 broke the Bank of England that the Treasury Secretary was 0:07:22.800 --> 0:07:24.840 involved in that he worked for George Soros and Stan 0:07:24.920 --> 0:07:27.440 Druck and Miller back in the early nineteen nineties. The 0:07:27.440 --> 0:07:31.600 big difference here is that then the UK had nobody 0:07:31.640 --> 0:07:35.880 backstopping them. Now Argentina has the United States backstopping it. 0:07:36.560 --> 0:07:39.320 But as I say, nobody knows until when nobody knows 0:07:40.320 --> 0:07:42.560 if there are any mechanisms that have been put in 0:07:42.600 --> 0:07:46.280 place to make the US taxpayer, if you will, hole, 0:07:46.840 --> 0:07:50.560 should the Treasury Department sustain losses on this trade. I've 0:07:50.600 --> 0:07:54.680 heard that Argentina's uranium reserves may be involved that some 0:07:54.800 --> 0:07:58.520 kind of preferential access to Argentine markets might be involved. 0:07:58.840 --> 0:08:02.960 Who knows. It's just it's like it's like a ready 0:08:03.000 --> 0:08:06.640 aim fire, you know, or a fire you know, ready 0:08:06.680 --> 0:08:08.800 aim in the sense that the swap line was put 0:08:08.840 --> 0:08:12.240 in place, and then it appears, since no document has 0:08:12.280 --> 0:08:15.600 surfaced yet, that all of the mechanics behind it are 0:08:15.680 --> 0:08:18.880 being taken care of after the fact. I don't know, 0:08:19.760 --> 0:08:22.560 but my point is that if anybody knows, he or 0:08:22.600 --> 0:08:24.840 she hasn't put in his hand to say, hey, I know. 0:08:25.480 --> 0:08:28.400 The Treasury Secretary, as you mentioned, described this as a 0:08:28.400 --> 0:08:30.680 bridge to a better economic future for Argentina, not a 0:08:30.680 --> 0:08:33.200 bail out. Is the not a bailout part a fair 0:08:33.240 --> 0:08:35.120 way to describe it in your view? Is this not 0:08:35.200 --> 0:08:35.720 a bail out? 0:08:36.000 --> 0:08:37.560 I think a bailout is in the eye of the 0:08:37.600 --> 0:08:44.680 beholder in some respects. It's unquestionably a gift to President 0:08:44.760 --> 0:08:49.280 Milay ahead of these mid term elections. It isn't working 0:08:49.520 --> 0:08:52.960 for the time being right. The PAESO fresh weakened today 0:08:53.120 --> 0:08:56.840 to a fresh low, and Argentine bonds which had gained 0:08:56.920 --> 0:09:00.280 earlier on the formal announcement of the sagree and have 0:09:00.360 --> 0:09:03.840 since given up those gains and I think are posting losses, 0:09:03.880 --> 0:09:05.840 so it would appear to be a gift in the 0:09:05.880 --> 0:09:09.160 sense that the PASO exchange rate or the PEG to 0:09:09.200 --> 0:09:12.920 the dollar is unsustainable. Milay doesn't want to allow the 0:09:12.960 --> 0:09:15.679 PAESO to float freely. He wants to maintain this peg 0:09:15.960 --> 0:09:20.120 so that Argentine inflation is under control. A critical critical 0:09:20.160 --> 0:09:25.120 economic consideration going into the midterms. So even if Argentine, 0:09:25.240 --> 0:09:28.320 I like, there's no question if the PAESO peg were 0:09:28.360 --> 0:09:32.120 to be abandoned today, it's not like inflation would Inflation 0:09:32.280 --> 0:09:35.400 would show up immediately, but it wouldn't show up in 0:09:35.440 --> 0:09:38.920 official statistics. Excuse me for some time to come. But 0:09:39.080 --> 0:09:43.280 Argentines are so conditioned to this, they know what would happen. 0:09:43.679 --> 0:09:45.120 Again, I want to go back to and I know 0:09:45.200 --> 0:09:47.800 we've got a couple more minutes here, but Eric the 0:09:48.000 --> 0:09:51.040 US involvement, and again it may be a relationship President 0:09:51.040 --> 0:09:54.560 Trump wants to have with the President of Argentina, But 0:09:54.679 --> 0:09:58.440 I mean, Bloomberg editors wrote an opinion piece why isn't 0:09:58.480 --> 0:10:01.360 the IMF coming in here? And the other question we 0:10:01.640 --> 0:10:03.400 as a group have been trying to figure out, is 0:10:03.440 --> 0:10:05.760 it also to kind of keep China at Bay is 0:10:05.800 --> 0:10:07.360 there that aspect as well. 0:10:07.960 --> 0:10:11.480 Argentina also has an existing eighteen billion dollar currency swap 0:10:11.559 --> 0:10:15.199 with China that goes back well before Sturtzenegger was the 0:10:15.200 --> 0:10:16.960 central Bank governor. I think it may go back to 0:10:17.000 --> 0:10:20.000 twenty fifteen, and perhaps even before that. There has been 0:10:20.040 --> 0:10:22.440 some talk that one of the conditions behind, or at 0:10:22.520 --> 0:10:25.000 least one of the underlying conditions to this swap with 0:10:25.080 --> 0:10:29.640 the Treasury would be that Argentina somehow winds up that 0:10:29.760 --> 0:10:33.920 previous swap agreement with the Chinese. Who knows as far 0:10:33.960 --> 0:10:38.440 as why the IMF isn't involved, I think the easy 0:10:38.440 --> 0:10:40.719 answer to that question is how many months would it 0:10:40.760 --> 0:10:42.960 take the IMF to get its act together? This was 0:10:43.000 --> 0:10:46.440 something that this was a perceived need on the part 0:10:46.480 --> 0:10:49.880 of the Argentine government the Malay government heading into these 0:10:50.480 --> 0:10:55.040 critical midterm elections that there's no way, there's no conceivable 0:10:55.080 --> 0:10:58.160 way that the IMF, in my mind, given everything that 0:10:58.200 --> 0:11:01.640 we've observed in our careers and everything we know that 0:11:01.720 --> 0:11:05.319 precedes that there's no way that it could possibly act 0:11:05.320 --> 0:11:06.120 it without much haste. 0:11:06.240 --> 0:11:08.760 So before we let you go, how could this end? 0:11:09.720 --> 0:11:11.160 What could it mean for the US If it's a 0:11:11.160 --> 0:11:12.840 bad trade, well, if. 0:11:12.760 --> 0:11:15.640 It's a bad trade. It could. I find it hard 0:11:15.720 --> 0:11:18.880 to believe that the United States would put itself in 0:11:18.880 --> 0:11:21.880 a position to ultimately lose money, but it may lose 0:11:21.920 --> 0:11:24.920 money on paper and have to recover that money, just 0:11:25.080 --> 0:11:28.160 like somebody who has been left holding the bag on 0:11:28.240 --> 0:11:32.160 a bad debt by liquidating some kind of Argentine assets 0:11:32.320 --> 0:11:37.559 or somehow you know, turning preferential access into Argentine assets 0:11:38.000 --> 0:11:43.400 or Argentine markets into value over time, that wouldn't look good. 0:11:43.800 --> 0:11:47.319 And again it all depends on how long this bridge is. 0:11:48.280 --> 0:11:51.439 We have seen in the credit markets that you can 0:11:51.520 --> 0:11:56.520 paper things over for an awfully long time before either 0:11:57.320 --> 0:12:01.000 things reflate and you're able to shout at par or 0:12:01.040 --> 0:12:03.600 you have to ultimately take some losses. So it's not 0:12:03.679 --> 0:12:05.760 like that's necessarily going to happen next week. It's not 0:12:05.800 --> 0:12:08.640 like it's necessarily going to happen next month, next quarter, 0:12:08.720 --> 0:12:13.719 even next year. But if Malay doesn't succeed, and if 0:12:13.760 --> 0:12:18.040 the Argentine economy doesn't continue to revive and inflation doesn't 0:12:18.080 --> 0:12:21.319 remain under control, it's hard to see how the speculative 0:12:21.360 --> 0:12:25.240 pressure against the peso won't continue, and we may even 0:12:25.760 --> 0:12:28.360 see I don't know We can only speculate here that 0:12:28.559 --> 0:12:30.640 twenty billion dollars may not end up being enough. 0:12:31.160 --> 0:12:33.120 All Right, we just got schooled by Eric Shatsker in 0:12:33.160 --> 0:12:35.640 a good way, in a good way. Thank you so much, Eric, 0:12:35.840 --> 0:12:37.160 so appreciate it. 0:12:37.160 --> 0:12:37.960 It's what we needed to know. 0:12:37.960 --> 0:12:40.720 Bloomberg New Economy Editorial Director Eric Shatsker. 0:12:45.400 --> 0:12:49.400 You're listening to the Bloomberg Business Weekdaily podcast. Catch US 0:12:49.480 --> 0:12:52.920 live weekday afternoons from two to five pm Eastern Listen 0:12:52.960 --> 0:12:56.520 on Apple CarPlay and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business app, 0:12:56.679 --> 0:12:59.240 or watch US Live on YouTube. 0:13:00.000 --> 0:13:02.880 Trump's administration is involved in talks for a US company 0:13:02.880 --> 0:13:06.280 to access one of the world's largest untapped deposits of tungsten. 0:13:06.360 --> 0:13:08.960 This is a metal used by the Pentagon to make ammunition, 0:13:09.120 --> 0:13:10.840 projectiles and other weapon read. 0:13:11.000 --> 0:13:13.440 Yeah, it's really interesting, right. We continue to see that 0:13:13.520 --> 0:13:17.960 Rare Earth's share space move as a result of these 0:13:18.000 --> 0:13:20.880 headlines coming out from the White House. Keep in mind, 0:13:20.920 --> 0:13:24.000 as to mention President Trump signing that landmark pack with 0:13:24.559 --> 0:13:29.000 visiting Australian Prime Minister Anthony Albani's to boost America's access 0:13:29.000 --> 0:13:31.520 to Rare Earth's and other critical minerals. It's an effort 0:13:31.559 --> 0:13:34.439 to counter China's type grip on the supply chains of 0:13:34.520 --> 0:13:37.200 key metals. Now, the two governments will jointly invest in 0:13:37.200 --> 0:13:40.280 a swath of minds and processing projects in Australia to 0:13:40.320 --> 0:13:44.440 boost production of commodities used in advance technologies, everything from 0:13:44.640 --> 0:13:47.559 electric vehicles to setment conductors and fighter plants. It goes 0:13:47.679 --> 0:13:48.959 into a lot of stuff too. 0:13:49.120 --> 0:13:51.520 In a story on the Bloomberg, our next guest says, quote, 0:13:51.520 --> 0:13:55.640 this is the most significant bilateral minerals cooperation we have 0:13:55.720 --> 0:13:59.360 seen between two major Western countries. Here to explain why 0:13:59.440 --> 0:14:02.400 is Graceland Asker, and she's director of the Critical Minerals 0:14:02.600 --> 0:14:05.319 Security Program at the Center for Strategic and International Study. 0:14:05.360 --> 0:14:09.680 She joins us from the Washington, DC bureau of Bloomberg News. Graceland, 0:14:09.679 --> 0:14:12.679 welcome back to Bloomberg Business Weekdaily. It's always great to 0:14:12.720 --> 0:14:14.680 have you on the program. I do want to start 0:14:14.720 --> 0:14:19.640 with the bilateral minerals cooperation that we are seeing between 0:14:19.680 --> 0:14:22.680 the United States and Australia. Why is all of this 0:14:22.800 --> 0:14:23.880 happening right now? 0:14:24.560 --> 0:14:25.560 It's so great to be back. 0:14:25.600 --> 0:14:27.240 You know, this is a really big deal, and it's 0:14:27.280 --> 0:14:30.560 a big deal because this is minerals cooperation that's going 0:14:30.880 --> 0:14:33.480 not just from conversation, and we've been doing years of 0:14:33.520 --> 0:14:36.600 talking about minerals to actually putting the resources in to 0:14:36.680 --> 0:14:40.440 develop really strategic projects. I mean, we've agreed to commit 0:14:40.600 --> 0:14:44.000 one billion dollars each to be deployed within six months 0:14:44.040 --> 0:14:48.560 on strategic projects, and this could be Alcoa's landmark gallium refinery. 0:14:48.840 --> 0:14:51.080 Keep in mind, China has cut us off of gallium, 0:14:51.520 --> 0:14:55.160 really crucial material for semiconductors, and this gallium refinery is 0:14:55.160 --> 0:14:57.960 going to produce one hundred tons a year in Western Australia. 0:14:58.040 --> 0:15:00.040 That may not sound like a lot, but remember the 0:15:00.120 --> 0:15:02.680 US only uses about twenty tons of galli in the year, 0:15:02.960 --> 0:15:07.120 so it's actually really significant to Australia announcing equity in 0:15:07.160 --> 0:15:08.520 a rare earth project there. 0:15:08.720 --> 0:15:09.920 But what we've also. 0:15:09.680 --> 0:15:12.760 Seen is the first time that these countries are making 0:15:12.800 --> 0:15:15.440 a concerted effort to counter China. So you may have 0:15:15.480 --> 0:15:19.480 seen that both countries have committed to preventing Chinese acquisitions 0:15:19.720 --> 0:15:22.600 of new projects, both within their own countries but also 0:15:22.680 --> 0:15:26.240 using diplomatic instruments. In other countries, we've seen a commitment 0:15:26.280 --> 0:15:29.720 to using price price support. So really, when you take 0:15:29.920 --> 0:15:32.200 the summation of all of these different efforts, We're really 0:15:32.240 --> 0:15:34.720 seeing rubber hit the road with a country that has 0:15:35.120 --> 0:15:38.640 enormous geological potential. We're talking about forty minerals that the 0:15:38.720 --> 0:15:42.400 US identified as critical. Incredible financial market gets in deep 0:15:42.480 --> 0:15:43.479 technical expertise. 0:15:43.680 --> 0:15:46.120 Is this all bottom line about putting kind of a 0:15:46.160 --> 0:15:47.200 hold on China? 0:15:49.080 --> 0:15:52.360 This is about countering China from a supply and a 0:15:52.400 --> 0:15:55.440 demand perspective. You know, let's be totally honest. This year 0:15:55.520 --> 0:15:57.880 was a wake up call for the whole world until now. 0:15:58.400 --> 0:16:01.040 A lot of the export restrictions on critical minerals we're 0:16:01.080 --> 0:16:03.840 really targeted at US here in the United States, but 0:16:03.920 --> 0:16:07.640 the multiple rounds of restrictions this year actually hit companies 0:16:07.680 --> 0:16:10.760 around the world, like these recent rare earth export restrictions. 0:16:10.880 --> 0:16:12.520 Australia is still on the other. 0:16:12.440 --> 0:16:12.920 End of them. 0:16:13.120 --> 0:16:15.240 So what we're really doing is we're uniting with our 0:16:15.280 --> 0:16:18.160 allies and again Australia being the one country that has 0:16:18.160 --> 0:16:21.920 fought beside US in every war since nineteen eighteen, right 0:16:22.000 --> 0:16:24.280 to say, okay, if we work together, we can actually 0:16:24.280 --> 0:16:26.080 start to counter China in a meaningful way. 0:16:26.520 --> 0:16:29.400 Very then significant again, because it feels like we have 0:16:29.440 --> 0:16:31.560 gone through a bunch of months where the US is 0:16:31.600 --> 0:16:33.200 like we don't need you. We're going to do it alone. 0:16:33.200 --> 0:16:35.680 We're going to build up stuff supply chain, so and 0:16:35.680 --> 0:16:37.720 so forth. At least this is coming from the administration 0:16:37.840 --> 0:16:40.440 to do stuff here in the United States. This feels 0:16:40.520 --> 0:16:44.120 like it's very significant the US saying wait, we actually 0:16:44.160 --> 0:16:46.280 need to have global partners on this. And this is 0:16:46.400 --> 0:16:48.680 kind of a big message. Again I'm going to point 0:16:48.720 --> 0:16:51.160 out to China and really the world at large. 0:16:51.800 --> 0:16:54.240 And this is a really important message because I want 0:16:54.240 --> 0:16:58.680 you to understand the historical relationship of Australian mining. Historically, 0:16:58.760 --> 0:17:02.600 Australian minerals have flow have gone to China for processing. 0:17:02.800 --> 0:17:06.600 So it's a highly vertically integrated industry between these two countries. 0:17:06.840 --> 0:17:09.119 So this was a pretty big disruption. You know, if 0:17:09.160 --> 0:17:12.280 we roll out restrictions on China, no, and really bat deny, 0:17:12.440 --> 0:17:15.480 but for Australia where those minerals go to China, this 0:17:15.560 --> 0:17:20.000 is a really important realignment with US and breaking from 0:17:20.040 --> 0:17:22.600 what has been their historical trade relationship as it relates 0:17:22.640 --> 0:17:23.640 to the mining industry. 0:17:24.200 --> 0:17:26.840 So I guess the question that we have is about 0:17:26.840 --> 0:17:30.159 the US companies that are a part of this, and 0:17:30.240 --> 0:17:33.359 we've spoken to quite a few of these. We spoke 0:17:33.480 --> 0:17:37.760 to US antimony. Gary Evans over there a critical mineral, not. 0:17:39.240 --> 0:17:41.000 A rare earth per se, but. 0:17:41.400 --> 0:17:43.800 In the same space, and with the idea that you know, 0:17:43.800 --> 0:17:46.679 they're getting a government contract, not investment from the government, 0:17:46.680 --> 0:17:50.000 but a government contract to actually buy antimony for Defense 0:17:50.040 --> 0:17:53.800 Department purposes. But I'm curious about US company's role and 0:17:54.200 --> 0:17:57.760 if there is such an opportunity for many different US 0:17:57.800 --> 0:18:00.360 companies right now to take advantage of this. And look, 0:18:00.359 --> 0:18:02.640 we have an investing audience. They want to know which 0:18:02.640 --> 0:18:05.359 are the companies that are best positioned right now to 0:18:05.440 --> 0:18:07.600 be in a place where they can be the ones 0:18:07.640 --> 0:18:11.840 that benefit from this increased need for critical minerals. 0:18:13.359 --> 0:18:15.720 So one of the big parts of this a new 0:18:15.800 --> 0:18:18.520 Framework agreement is that they will we will strategically together 0:18:18.720 --> 0:18:21.160 identify priority projects in companies. 0:18:21.480 --> 0:18:21.960 One of the. 0:18:21.920 --> 0:18:25.880 Early leaders here is Alcoa. Again, Alcoa is a Philadelphia 0:18:25.880 --> 0:18:29.159 based company who is now building this gallium refinery through 0:18:29.200 --> 0:18:32.480 support from the Department of War, and it was announced 0:18:32.520 --> 0:18:35.600 by the US and Australian governments yesterday. Again, I want 0:18:35.640 --> 0:18:37.679 to take you back to the fact that gallium is 0:18:37.680 --> 0:18:40.040 a no brainer of a priority for both sides because 0:18:40.080 --> 0:18:42.600 it was a commodity that China cut us off from 0:18:42.680 --> 0:18:45.600 earlier this year. So really, when we start to look 0:18:45.640 --> 0:18:47.800 at what are the winners going to be, I mean 0:18:47.920 --> 0:18:51.440 rare earth. Obviously we're going to see linus being really important. 0:18:52.320 --> 0:18:55.440 But broadly speaking, for some of these minor medals, which 0:18:55.440 --> 0:18:58.119 antimony is one of them, we've seen tungsten emerge in 0:18:58.160 --> 0:19:01.040 the news quite recently. These minor metals are going to 0:19:01.119 --> 0:19:03.560 be the ones where we're highly vulnerable and where we 0:19:03.680 --> 0:19:06.640 do not always have the geology to make it work, 0:19:06.680 --> 0:19:08.160 and where Australia often does. 0:19:10.280 --> 0:19:12.920 We both have questions, but Carole, you go first, Well, 0:19:13.040 --> 0:19:13.560 I want. 0:19:13.400 --> 0:19:15.640 To go back forgive me if we're abouts around, because 0:19:15.640 --> 0:19:17.320 it's just sometimes you know, the brain is a little 0:19:17.359 --> 0:19:20.120 slow and things settle in. But Grace, what I want 0:19:20.160 --> 0:19:22.800 to ask you is going back to, as you said, 0:19:22.840 --> 0:19:26.560 a big deal for Australia to do this because they 0:19:26.600 --> 0:19:30.560 have been so intertwined with China when it comes to 0:19:31.200 --> 0:19:36.080 Australia exporting large quantities of raw minerals and then China processing. 0:19:36.160 --> 0:19:39.840 I mean, this has been a very important trading relationship 0:19:40.240 --> 0:19:42.800 and so we know US and China has been antagonistic 0:19:42.840 --> 0:19:46.080 for a while, but to have them do that. That's 0:19:46.200 --> 0:19:47.160 really significant. 0:19:48.760 --> 0:19:52.080 It's extremely significant. But you've been seeing that growing tension 0:19:52.280 --> 0:19:55.760 for but probably the last seven years. Remember that Australia 0:19:55.920 --> 0:19:57.920 was the first country to the ban howway back in 0:19:57.960 --> 0:20:02.480 about twenty eighteen. They also legislation to prevent foreign interference 0:20:02.520 --> 0:20:05.679 in their higher education sector. More recently, there was a 0:20:05.720 --> 0:20:09.320 one point twenty five billion dollar Australian loan that was 0:20:09.359 --> 0:20:12.159 given to build the Iluca refinery. 0:20:11.720 --> 0:20:12.399 For rare Earth. 0:20:12.720 --> 0:20:14.639 One of the t's and c's of that was that 0:20:14.760 --> 0:20:18.280 off take had to go to allied countries. But now 0:20:18.320 --> 0:20:21.320 what this really does now I mean, is it starts 0:20:21.320 --> 0:20:25.359 to potentially re architecture supply chains in a meaningful way. Australia, 0:20:25.400 --> 0:20:27.840 for example, is the biggest lithium producer in the world. 0:20:27.880 --> 0:20:30.840 They produce about close to sixty percent over a world's lithium. 0:20:31.000 --> 0:20:34.520 Over ninety percent of that actually goes to China for refining. 0:20:35.000 --> 0:20:38.439 If that didn't happen, China would lose its grip on 0:20:38.560 --> 0:20:42.720 lithium ion batteries. So what this deal really stands to 0:20:42.800 --> 0:20:47.120 do is re architecture supply chains, not just from mind 0:20:47.240 --> 0:20:49.520 but down to the manufactured good. 0:20:49.720 --> 0:20:52.199 So if we think about this in the context of 0:20:52.440 --> 0:20:55.520 the leverage that China could still have even after the 0:20:55.640 --> 0:20:58.040 US makes deals such as this and deals with allies, 0:20:58.320 --> 0:21:00.760 where's that leverage. 0:21:00.920 --> 0:21:02.720 The leverage is still there in the short term with 0:21:02.840 --> 0:21:06.639 rare earths for sure, no doubt. Right although Australian Australia's 0:21:06.680 --> 0:21:09.840 Linus was the first company to separate heavy rare erths 0:21:09.840 --> 0:21:12.639 earlier this year outside of China, but it's going to 0:21:12.720 --> 0:21:15.280 go beyond that. There was a line in this framework 0:21:15.320 --> 0:21:18.520 agreement that actually said that the US and Australia will 0:21:18.560 --> 0:21:22.960 work with other international partners on price support mechanisms. So 0:21:23.080 --> 0:21:26.480 this conversation is likely to extend beyond these two countries 0:21:26.760 --> 0:21:29.600 to the G seven later this year to think about 0:21:29.600 --> 0:21:33.520 how do we scale these partnerships up even more so, really, 0:21:33.520 --> 0:21:35.920 what we're starting to see is an economy of scale 0:21:35.960 --> 0:21:39.680 that we're creating for the minerals and the processing capabilities. 0:21:39.800 --> 0:21:42.720 I mentioned that our COED deal earlier, that our COED 0:21:42.720 --> 0:21:44.480 deal is also getting Japanese financing. 0:21:44.600 --> 0:21:46.159 It's actually a tripartheid effort. 0:21:46.440 --> 0:21:49.639 So an example of how this bilateral is going to 0:21:49.640 --> 0:21:52.119 set the stage for what's probably going to be a 0:21:52.200 --> 0:21:54.400 much bigger play of countries to counter China. 0:21:54.440 --> 0:21:58.080 How do we figure out, you know, especially as we 0:21:58.119 --> 0:22:02.000 see investors, you know, pushing up shares on all of 0:22:02.040 --> 0:22:06.160 these stories about the relationships, the investments by the US 0:22:06.200 --> 0:22:09.919 government and various critical mineral companies, how do we figure 0:22:09.960 --> 0:22:14.320 out which is investor speculation, you know, kind of chasing 0:22:14.320 --> 0:22:16.840 a trade. Do you think it's misplaced or is it 0:22:16.880 --> 0:22:21.840 a bit irrationally exuberant, or you think these investments, these relationships, 0:22:22.480 --> 0:22:25.359 this is the build out. It's happening, and with good reason, 0:22:25.400 --> 0:22:26.760 because the demand's going to be there. 0:22:28.520 --> 0:22:32.000 The broader buildout of the sector, when it comes to mining, 0:22:32.119 --> 0:22:35.159 being much more strategic, is absolutely here to stay. And 0:22:35.200 --> 0:22:37.160 it's here to stay for a couple of reasons. One 0:22:37.200 --> 0:22:40.040 of them is we are diversifying away from China, right, 0:22:40.359 --> 0:22:42.679 But the second thing we have to remember is that 0:22:42.760 --> 0:22:45.520 certain of these commodities, I need a lot more in 0:22:45.600 --> 0:22:49.080 objective terms, I need a lot more copper to electrify, 0:22:49.200 --> 0:22:52.080 to build data centers, to build defense technologies. 0:22:52.200 --> 0:22:53.800 So it's also the growing demand. 0:22:53.840 --> 0:22:57.560 So I'd say the larger macro trend in prioritization is 0:22:57.640 --> 0:23:01.400 here to stay. And again remember that the US Australia relationship, 0:23:01.440 --> 0:23:04.320 it's a continuation. It was being built under the Biden 0:23:04.359 --> 0:23:07.560 administration as well. But what you know, the other thing 0:23:07.600 --> 0:23:09.640 though is you know, there are going to be fads 0:23:09.640 --> 0:23:11.960 that come and go when it come to specific minerals. 0:23:12.000 --> 0:23:14.320 There's no doubt, right some things are going to you know, 0:23:14.520 --> 0:23:17.040 hit media attention. Certain deals are going to hit media 0:23:17.080 --> 0:23:20.199 attention and they're going to fall away. Not everything that 0:23:20.240 --> 0:23:22.960 this government is looking at is going to succeed, but 0:23:23.040 --> 0:23:25.320 what we are hoping is that the right number of 0:23:25.359 --> 0:23:28.480 them succeed to create a more resilient supply chain. But 0:23:28.560 --> 0:23:30.120 there are a lot of coming and goings. 0:23:30.200 --> 0:23:32.920 Yeah, certainly the relationship with Australia is on our radar 0:23:33.080 --> 0:23:36.119 right now, given the visit of the Prime Minister. But 0:23:36.160 --> 0:23:39.640 I'm wondering what other countries the US could ally with 0:23:40.400 --> 0:23:43.520 that would be able to offer some sort of countermeasure 0:23:43.600 --> 0:23:45.160 to China and its capabilities. 0:23:45.880 --> 0:23:48.800 So countries that like I'm looking at with interest Japan 0:23:48.880 --> 0:23:53.760 in South Korea, particularly because of their midstream and downstream capabilities. 0:23:53.880 --> 0:23:56.399 I'm looking at the UK. There have been you know, 0:23:56.440 --> 0:23:59.960 there's been some interesting acquisitions there, at least Come Metal 0:24:00.119 --> 0:24:04.320 by USA, Rare Earth, that's an interesting one. The EU 0:24:04.560 --> 0:24:08.280 again it's an interesting jurisdiction there as some minerals, I 0:24:08.280 --> 0:24:11.399 mean things like Solvey for their permanent magnets in France. 0:24:11.680 --> 0:24:14.439 An interesting one again with some conversations happening with the 0:24:14.560 --> 0:24:18.000 US as well. So there's certain pockets of interesting transactions 0:24:18.040 --> 0:24:21.080 happening from a global north obviously from the global south. 0:24:21.119 --> 0:24:24.280 Brazil is still a very interesting jurisdiction to US because 0:24:24.320 --> 0:24:26.320 they have the heavy, rare earth that can come back 0:24:26.359 --> 0:24:28.359 and be separated here in the United States. 0:24:28.400 --> 0:24:29.280 Everything we need to know. 0:24:29.520 --> 0:24:31.879 Thank you, Thank you, Doctor Graceland Basker and Director of 0:24:31.880 --> 0:24:34.560 the Critical Mineral Security Program at the Center for Strategic 0:24:34.640 --> 0:24:35.880 and International Studies. 0:24:37.480 --> 0:24:41.320 This is the Bloomberg Business Week Daily Podcast. Listen live 0:24:41.400 --> 0:24:44.320 each weekday starting at two pm Eastern on Apple car 0:24:44.400 --> 0:24:47.359 Play and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business App. You 0:24:47.400 --> 0:24:50.600 can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our flagship 0:24:50.640 --> 0:24:54.240 New York station, Just Say Alexa played Bloomberg eleven thirty 0:24:55.320 --> 0:24:55.800 whole show. 0:24:55.920 --> 0:24:59.120 Democrats are more disillusion than they've been in decades, Sped 0:24:59.200 --> 0:25:02.600 up with agings, leaders frustrated by a party adrift and 0:25:02.760 --> 0:25:06.119 unsure who their next standard bearer should be, but yearning 0:25:06.160 --> 0:25:09.120 for someone to take on Trump So right Josh Green 0:25:09.200 --> 0:25:13.520 and elaiju Kemisher for a Bloomberg BusinessWeek California Governor Gavin 0:25:13.560 --> 0:25:17.119 Newsom has leaped into the breach. He's on for the 0:25:17.160 --> 0:25:21.200 podcast a ballot Measure and tweets Governor Newsom is spoiling 0:25:21.280 --> 0:25:23.439 for a fight with the President he is. 0:25:23.480 --> 0:25:25.399 Indeed, It is the cover of the new issue of 0:25:25.400 --> 0:25:27.879 Bloomberg Business Week, out on newsstands, now online, and on 0:25:27.880 --> 0:25:31.600 the Bloomberg terminal. Bloomberg BusinessWeek National correspondent Josh Green is 0:25:31.640 --> 0:25:34.240 the lead author of the Profile of the Governor. Josh 0:25:34.280 --> 0:25:36.680 is also the author of several books, including the number 0:25:36.680 --> 0:25:40.200 one New York Times bestseller Devil's Bargain, Steve Bannon, Donald Trump, 0:25:40.200 --> 0:25:43.080 and The Storming of the Presidency. He joins us Josh 0:25:43.119 --> 0:25:44.359 from Washington, DC. 0:25:44.520 --> 0:25:45.360 Josh, great to have. 0:25:45.359 --> 0:25:48.800 You here with us, I mean, Gavin Newsom. He went 0:25:49.160 --> 0:25:52.000 from one of his lowest political points earlier this year, 0:25:52.440 --> 0:25:55.159 as deadly fires burned in southern California. She's now being 0:25:55.200 --> 0:25:58.840 a potential leader of the Democratic Party. That seems quite 0:25:58.880 --> 0:26:02.080 a turn. How did this happen and how dark was 0:26:02.119 --> 0:26:03.200 it for him? 0:26:03.960 --> 0:26:06.840 Well, yeah, as you guys said in that nice intro. 0:26:07.320 --> 0:26:09.440 He was our cover story, our cover profile this week, 0:26:09.480 --> 0:26:11.439 went out to the Sacramento spent some time with him, 0:26:11.480 --> 0:26:13.760 talk to him. For a lot of people nationally, I 0:26:13.760 --> 0:26:16.280 think outside California. The last time they really keyed in 0:26:16.280 --> 0:26:19.480 and focused on Governor Newsom was back in January, during 0:26:19.480 --> 0:26:20.320 the wildfires. 0:26:20.359 --> 0:26:21.480 Things were out of control. 0:26:22.240 --> 0:26:24.920 Trump was the new president, was sort of insulting him, 0:26:25.800 --> 0:26:28.399 tweeting negative things about him, and so, you know, he 0:26:28.400 --> 0:26:29.919 told us that was really the low point I think 0:26:29.960 --> 0:26:32.680 of his governorship. But what's interesting is that over the 0:26:32.760 --> 0:26:35.960 last couple of months, partly due to some things that 0:26:36.000 --> 0:26:39.400 Trump has done, Newsom has re emerged on the national 0:26:39.440 --> 0:26:43.720 stage as perhaps the most important Democrat right now, because 0:26:43.800 --> 0:26:46.280 he is in the middle of leading a ballot initiative 0:26:46.320 --> 0:26:49.639 that would create as many as five new Democratic House districts. 0:26:50.080 --> 0:26:53.760 And Democrats nationally are pretty much without power. They don't 0:26:53.800 --> 0:26:56.520 control the White House, they don't control either House of Congress, 0:26:57.200 --> 0:26:59.320 but they're very much hoping to win back the House 0:26:59.400 --> 0:27:03.960 next November. And so Newsome, by dint of his ability 0:27:04.080 --> 0:27:06.919 to kind of run the table in California, get this 0:27:07.000 --> 0:27:11.119 initiative on the ballot, has suddenly become important in preserving Democrats' 0:27:11.240 --> 0:27:14.320 chance to win back some shred of power to confront 0:27:14.359 --> 0:27:17.080 Donald Trump with next November, and of course that would 0:27:17.119 --> 0:27:21.760 vault Newsom himself into even more prominent role as Democrats 0:27:21.800 --> 0:27:24.080 look for somebody to lead the party in twenty twenty 0:27:24.119 --> 0:27:26.200 eight and out of the Trump era. 0:27:26.320 --> 0:27:29.320 Does that proposition have widespread support in California right now? 0:27:29.359 --> 0:27:32.360 I mean, former Governor Ronald Schwarzenegger has spoken out recently 0:27:32.560 --> 0:27:34.560 against it. What did you find in your reporting? 0:27:35.240 --> 0:27:36.800 Yeah, it's not clear that it does. 0:27:36.880 --> 0:27:39.320 I mean, what's going on, just to kind of clue 0:27:39.359 --> 0:27:41.560 in viewers, is that Trump and Republicans have been very 0:27:41.640 --> 0:27:46.359 aggressive about deciding to redraw or try and redraw congressional 0:27:46.400 --> 0:27:48.719 districts in red states across the country as a way 0:27:48.760 --> 0:27:50.919 of kind of putting their thumb on the scale in 0:27:51.000 --> 0:27:55.119 midterm elections in a way that would help Republicans withstand 0:27:55.160 --> 0:27:58.639 what I think most people expect to be an electoral backlash. 0:27:58.720 --> 0:28:02.600 So the fear for Democrats is that Republicans essentially rewrite 0:28:02.640 --> 0:28:07.200 the rules and you know, take control or keep control 0:28:07.240 --> 0:28:09.040 of a House of Representatives that they think they ought 0:28:09.040 --> 0:28:11.359 to be able to win, and so new some value 0:28:11.359 --> 0:28:12.919 to the parties that he's been able to kind of 0:28:12.960 --> 0:28:16.760 come in and I think offset this if this ballot 0:28:16.800 --> 0:28:19.400 referendum wins. But it's not clear that it's winning by 0:28:19.400 --> 0:28:22.479 a lot. The latest poll I've seen has it at 0:28:22.520 --> 0:28:26.040 about fifty percent in favor, about thirty five thirty six 0:28:26.080 --> 0:28:28.040 percent of pose and the rest undecided. 0:28:28.600 --> 0:28:30.280 So it really could still swing either way. 0:28:30.280 --> 0:28:32.199 And as you said, there have been prominent Republicans like 0:28:32.240 --> 0:28:35.199 former Governor Arl Schwarzenegger have come out and said, no, 0:28:35.280 --> 0:28:36.639 we don't want to do this, We don't want to 0:28:36.640 --> 0:28:38.520 create these democratic districts. 0:28:39.040 --> 0:28:39.880 And so we'll see. 0:28:39.920 --> 0:28:42.360 But I think the expectation among the experts that I've 0:28:42.480 --> 0:28:46.160 spoken to is that this probably will prevail, and if 0:28:46.160 --> 0:28:49.240 it does, Democrats nationally, I think are going to breathe 0:28:49.280 --> 0:28:50.160 a big sigh of relief. 0:28:50.280 --> 0:28:52.640 Josh. We want to dig more into this profile piece 0:28:52.680 --> 0:28:55.240 of Gavin Newsoen, but I just want to on this referendum, 0:28:55.280 --> 0:28:59.040 this ballot referendum. How important is it to new some specifically, 0:28:59.120 --> 0:29:02.280 how important is it to you really Democrats more broadly, 0:29:02.360 --> 0:29:05.280 as we all are kind of looking at the upcoming 0:29:05.360 --> 0:29:07.960 midterms and what it means and what it says about 0:29:07.960 --> 0:29:09.200 President Trump's administration. 0:29:09.760 --> 0:29:11.800 Yeah, it's a great question. The answer is that it's 0:29:11.920 --> 0:29:14.480 really important to both of them. I just explained on 0:29:14.560 --> 0:29:16.920 kind of the national democratic side why it's important. But 0:29:16.960 --> 0:29:20.880 for Newsom himself, I think it's especially important because you know, 0:29:20.920 --> 0:29:23.080 he is somebody who has long been thought to. 0:29:23.040 --> 0:29:24.600 Have presidential ambitions. 0:29:24.920 --> 0:29:27.520 Democrats are obviously looking for a new leader in twenty 0:29:27.560 --> 0:29:30.720 twenty eight, but talking to people around Washington, around the country, 0:29:30.760 --> 0:29:34.080 in Democratic circles, there could be literally dozens of people running. 0:29:34.440 --> 0:29:37.480 And so if this ballot referendum does pass, it will 0:29:37.520 --> 0:29:42.280 be a real validating credential for Newsome. He's one of 0:29:42.320 --> 0:29:45.640 the rare Democrats right now who isn't a position of power. 0:29:45.960 --> 0:29:48.280 And if he's able to lead his party. 0:29:48.000 --> 0:29:52.320 To victory on this ballot initiative and help Democrats win 0:29:52.440 --> 0:29:55.400 back the House for Representatives in twenty twenty six, he 0:29:55.440 --> 0:29:57.080 can go out and say look like, I'm out here, 0:29:57.120 --> 0:30:00.400 I'm fighting Trump, I'm doing things, I'm helping the Democrats party, 0:30:00.440 --> 0:30:02.800 and that's just not something that a lot of other elected. 0:30:02.480 --> 0:30:03.800 Democrats can say right now. 0:30:04.000 --> 0:30:05.320 And I do think it's going to lead to a 0:30:05.360 --> 0:30:07.520 lot of excitement and a lot of national attention and 0:30:07.600 --> 0:30:10.560 Newsome himself, as I mentioned, as we mentioned it some 0:30:10.680 --> 0:30:13.120 like in the profile, has spent a lot of time 0:30:13.160 --> 0:30:16.680 trying to raise his profile online, doing everything from you know, 0:30:16.760 --> 0:30:19.200 YouTube to Twitch to Twitter to x to try and 0:30:19.280 --> 0:30:21.560 raise his visibility. So I think a win on this 0:30:21.600 --> 0:30:23.520 ballot initiative would really help him in that regard. 0:30:23.560 --> 0:30:25.680 I always think about COVID and like how much he 0:30:25.720 --> 0:30:29.000 became so prominent, and we covered certainly everything he did 0:30:29.120 --> 0:30:30.640 during COVID and what was going on in the state, 0:30:30.680 --> 0:30:32.560 but he really became a national figure. 0:30:32.720 --> 0:30:35.160 Especially during that visit to the French laundry. As Josh 0:30:35.160 --> 0:30:38.080 points out in his piece, which what did he call that? 0:30:38.200 --> 0:30:40.520 In his podcast? Josh he quoted in the piece. 0:30:41.080 --> 0:30:43.200 I think he said it was like his most boneheaded 0:30:43.240 --> 0:30:45.240 move he made this governor, and not a lot of 0:30:45.240 --> 0:30:47.360 people would disagree with that. But you know, he is 0:30:47.440 --> 0:30:50.520 prone to the occasional scandal. So that's part of the 0:30:50.560 --> 0:30:53.240 excitement of following Governor Gavin Newsom. So it does a 0:30:53.280 --> 0:30:55.280 lot of exciting things, both for good and for better. 0:30:55.360 --> 0:30:57.320 So let's talk about that a little bit. As a 0:30:57.400 --> 0:31:01.520 California and I followed Gavin Newsom for decades at this point, 0:31:01.880 --> 0:31:05.600 one thing that just always surprises me though, is where 0:31:05.600 --> 0:31:07.880 he was and who he was with early on in 0:31:07.920 --> 0:31:10.320 his political life. I mean, there's the famous photo shoot 0:31:10.360 --> 0:31:13.360 was at any Lebowitz with Kimberly Gilfoyle, his former wife, 0:31:13.600 --> 0:31:16.520 who is now you know, she was linked to one 0:31:16.520 --> 0:31:20.360 of the Trump's sons romantically. She's now the ambassador to Greece. 0:31:22.080 --> 0:31:24.320 What is his political history? You dive in here, there's 0:31:24.360 --> 0:31:27.440 connections to the Getty family. You really go really far 0:31:27.480 --> 0:31:28.440 back generations. 0:31:28.440 --> 0:31:30.080 Actually yeah, I. 0:31:30.040 --> 0:31:32.479 Mean he's had this fascinating life. You know, his his 0:31:32.800 --> 0:31:35.960 father and grandfather were kind of big time political fixers 0:31:36.000 --> 0:31:39.040 in San Francisco, which gave him entree into the kind 0:31:39.040 --> 0:31:42.960 of wealthy world of San Francisco politics and business. While 0:31:42.960 --> 0:31:45.040 at the same time, you know, his mom after his 0:31:45.080 --> 0:31:47.880 parents divorce, was a single mom who worked three jobs, 0:31:48.040 --> 0:31:49.720 so he kind of really grew up with a foot 0:31:49.760 --> 0:31:52.200 in both worlds. I think he's always been drawn to 0:31:52.280 --> 0:31:54.320 the camera as a politician. As he said, there's a 0:31:54.320 --> 0:31:56.600 famous Vanity Fair cover shirt shoot back when he was 0:31:56.600 --> 0:31:59.600 married to Kimberly Guilfoyle. You know, he managed to be 0:31:59.600 --> 0:32:03.360 a very high profile mayor of San Francisco, conducting or 0:32:03.360 --> 0:32:06.160 allowing gay marriages back before the Supreme Court had allowed 0:32:06.200 --> 0:32:08.000 that first got him on the national stage. But he's 0:32:08.000 --> 0:32:11.160 also you know, good looking, telligenic guy who really wants 0:32:11.200 --> 0:32:14.120 to have his profile out there, and you know, has 0:32:14.160 --> 0:32:17.600 a lot of political talent. I think that the challenge 0:32:17.600 --> 0:32:21.040 for Newsome as governor California, and we get into this 0:32:21.080 --> 0:32:22.640 in the piece a little bit, is that there's a 0:32:22.680 --> 0:32:24.880 lot not to like you about California right now at 0:32:24.920 --> 0:32:27.200 a time when you know, Americans are more and more 0:32:27.200 --> 0:32:30.600 concerned with inflation and the high cost of living. California 0:32:30.640 --> 0:32:34.280 has sky high home prices. It sort of struggles with 0:32:34.320 --> 0:32:36.680 a lot of the things that Americans struggle with generally, 0:32:36.680 --> 0:32:40.760 whether it's high gas prices, high unemployment, homelessness. 0:32:40.240 --> 0:32:43.240 So all of these things are. 0:32:42.560 --> 0:32:46.200 Subjects at Newsom and Business Week spoke about, talked about 0:32:46.240 --> 0:32:47.560 and try to kind of war game out of the 0:32:47.600 --> 0:32:50.760 piece whether this is something that he can overcome. And 0:32:51.000 --> 0:32:53.160 as Newsome himself said too, you know, he's got a 0:32:53.160 --> 0:32:55.360 real pitch I think for Democrats nationally, which is that 0:32:55.480 --> 0:32:59.200 California is this engine of dynamism, whether it's tech or 0:32:59.240 --> 0:33:04.200 AI or business, and really conducts itself in a way 0:33:04.280 --> 0:33:07.960 that I think Newsom would describe as the polar opposite 0:33:08.000 --> 0:33:10.760 of the way Donald Trump runs the US economy, with 0:33:10.800 --> 0:33:13.720 a focus on kind of industrial nostalgia and looking back, 0:33:14.320 --> 0:33:16.800 Newsom is very much a California guy, almost seems like 0:33:16.800 --> 0:33:18.880 a venture capitalist at times, kind of. 0:33:18.880 --> 0:33:19.680 Pitching his state. 0:33:20.040 --> 0:33:21.280 And I think it's going to be interesting to see 0:33:21.280 --> 0:33:23.600 whether Democratic voters connect with that and decide this is 0:33:23.600 --> 0:33:25.120 the guy that they want leading them forward. 0:33:25.320 --> 0:33:28.040 Josh, Dude. Democratic voters also connect with the way he's 0:33:28.160 --> 0:33:31.080 begun using social media, kind of playing President Trump at 0:33:31.120 --> 0:33:35.400 his own game with AI generated content and caps and 0:33:35.440 --> 0:33:36.200 so on and so forth. 0:33:36.440 --> 0:33:38.120 You single this out. 0:33:38.080 --> 0:33:40.680 Certainly in the story. Does that resonate? Is that what 0:33:40.880 --> 0:33:41.760 Democrats want? 0:33:42.720 --> 0:33:44.440 I mean to me, this is the most interesting part 0:33:44.480 --> 0:33:46.400 of the profile is, you know, a couple of months ago, 0:33:46.600 --> 0:33:49.160 Newsom turned the governor's Twitter feed into this kind of 0:33:49.240 --> 0:33:51.680 mockery of Donald Trump and the way he comports himself 0:33:51.720 --> 0:33:55.040 on social media with these all caps tweets kind of 0:33:55.120 --> 0:33:59.200 mocking and insulting him, and you know, AI generated images 0:33:59.240 --> 0:34:02.400 of Trump eating MacDonald's Burger's kind of stuffing his face, 0:34:03.160 --> 0:34:05.360 and it was basically kind of meant to get down 0:34:05.360 --> 0:34:08.960 in the mud with Trump, and it's something that's caused 0:34:09.000 --> 0:34:11.120 a ton of attention, a ton of engagement. 0:34:11.640 --> 0:34:12.120 A lot of. 0:34:12.080 --> 0:34:16.000 Democratic voters are seeing this and engaging with this online. 0:34:16.560 --> 0:34:19.040 I know in my own life, people relatives in mine 0:34:19.040 --> 0:34:22.080 are not particularly political, would have no reason to be 0:34:22.120 --> 0:34:24.319 interested in Gavin Newsom were suddenly asking me about him 0:34:24.320 --> 0:34:27.319 because of his wild social media persona. So in an 0:34:27.320 --> 0:34:30.640 intention getting sense, I think it's helped him. Whether or 0:34:30.680 --> 0:34:33.560 not this helps him like win votes in purple swing 0:34:33.600 --> 0:34:36.759 states three years from now, I'm still a little bit 0:34:36.760 --> 0:34:39.959 skeptical about that, but you know, partly the race right now, 0:34:40.160 --> 0:34:42.680 if you're a Democrat is the race for eyeballs and attention, 0:34:43.120 --> 0:34:44.399 and there's no question. 0:34:44.120 --> 0:34:45.919 That Newsome is doing that kind of. 0:34:45.800 --> 0:34:48.520 More aggressively and in a more interesting way than any 0:34:48.560 --> 0:34:50.000 other Democrat on the scene right now. 0:34:50.120 --> 0:34:53.399 Is it a risk politically for the constituents in California? 0:34:53.480 --> 0:34:56.040 Karen Bass, the mayor of Los Angeles, spoke at Bloomberg 0:34:56.120 --> 0:34:58.960 screen time earlier this month, and she talked about collaborating 0:34:59.000 --> 0:35:01.680 with President Trump in the of the disastrous wildfires. If 0:35:01.719 --> 0:35:07.160 there is another big natural disaster in California before Gavin 0:35:07.200 --> 0:35:09.960 Newsom's term is up. Does he have to go begging 0:35:10.000 --> 0:35:12.600 to President Trump? And President Trump says, no, You've made 0:35:12.600 --> 0:35:13.239 a mockery of me. 0:35:14.120 --> 0:35:15.480 Yeah, I mean it's a good question. 0:35:15.520 --> 0:35:17.000 I mean one of the things we talked about with 0:35:17.120 --> 0:35:19.200 Newsom and this piece is that he essentially, you know, 0:35:19.280 --> 0:35:21.480 Trump had kind of written him off back in January, 0:35:21.520 --> 0:35:25.160 before he'd even taken office, had kind of turned on Newsome, 0:35:25.200 --> 0:35:27.040 and Newsom had said, you know, in the past, they'd 0:35:27.080 --> 0:35:29.320 had a good working relationship. Back in the twenty eighteen 0:35:29.960 --> 0:35:33.720 Paradise fires in California, he thought Trump had been pretty helpful, 0:35:34.239 --> 0:35:36.120 but this time around he wasn't, and Newsom had to 0:35:36.160 --> 0:35:38.360 kind of force his way into Trump's sphere and orbit 0:35:38.680 --> 0:35:41.080 in order to get some of the help that California needed. 0:35:41.440 --> 0:35:43.480 I think it does run a risk when you kind 0:35:43.480 --> 0:35:46.960 of intentionally mock and insult someone, especially as a Democratic governor, 0:35:47.200 --> 0:35:48.799 if you need to then turn around and ask that 0:35:48.840 --> 0:35:51.479 president for help, it could be problematic. On the other hand, 0:35:51.560 --> 0:35:55.240 Trump as president has pursued a scorched earth policy against 0:35:55.280 --> 0:35:58.759 just about every Democrat, every blue state, in every blue 0:35:58.840 --> 0:36:01.320 city that I can think of, regardless of whether or 0:36:01.400 --> 0:36:05.120 not the mayors and governors of those States have insulted 0:36:05.160 --> 0:36:08.680 him personally and gratuitously the way Governor Newsom House. I'm 0:36:08.680 --> 0:36:10.280 not sure in the end will make much of a difference, 0:36:10.320 --> 0:36:11.960 but it'll certainly be something to watch if there is 0:36:12.000 --> 0:36:16.200 another big national disaster in California that requires federal help. 0:36:17.160 --> 0:36:19.520 Fascinating staff. I wish we had another fifteen twenty minutes. 0:36:20.000 --> 0:36:20.960 Josh with you. 0:36:21.040 --> 0:36:24.480 That's always the case, Josh Green, National correspondent at Bloomberg 0:36:24.520 --> 0:36:28.440 Business This is the cover story of the issue New 0:36:28.440 --> 0:36:29.560 Issue at Bloomberg Business Week. 0:36:29.600 --> 0:36:30.520 Find it on newsstands. 0:36:30.600 --> 0:36:33.200 It is on the Bloomberg and at Bloomberg dot Com. 0:36:33.480 --> 0:36:35.560 His profile so much detail. 0:36:36.120 --> 0:36:36.560 Love it. 0:36:41.719 --> 0:36:45.719 You're listening to the Bloomberg Business Weekdaily Podcast. Catch us 0:36:45.760 --> 0:36:49.240 live weekday afternoons from two to five pm Eastern. Listen 0:36:49.239 --> 0:36:52.719 on Applecarplay and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business app, 0:36:52.960 --> 0:36:54.760 or watch us live on YouTube. 0:36:55.880 --> 0:36:57.919 Plenty ahead in our second hour of the weekend edition 0:36:57.960 --> 0:37:01.600 of Bloomberg Business Week, including a computing breakthrough from Google 0:37:01.640 --> 0:37:04.719 when it comes to quantum computing, we check in with 0:37:04.800 --> 0:37:07.399 the mayor of Chattanooga, Tennessee, who is looking to make 0:37:07.640 --> 0:37:09.080 his mark in that space. 0:37:09.400 --> 0:37:13.400 Plus Xenax in your ears, an all in one face fixer, 0:37:14.040 --> 0:37:17.400 maybe some ketamine therapy. Those are just some cheat codes 0:37:17.440 --> 0:37:20.399 on maybe how to improve your overall well innes It's 0:37:20.400 --> 0:37:22.279 courtesy of our Bloomberg Pursuits team. 0:37:22.440 --> 0:37:23.960 I'm just going to stick to getting lots of sleep 0:37:23.960 --> 0:37:24.560 in drikutts. 0:37:25.000 --> 0:37:27.840 I think there's okay, just to throw it out there. 0:37:27.880 --> 0:37:30.360 There's also like the walking uphill treadmill one. 0:37:30.520 --> 0:37:33.359 That I love, no but makes sense. Love it, yeah, 0:37:33.600 --> 0:37:35.160 love it exactly. 0:37:34.920 --> 0:37:37.080 Just a little just a little preview of what's to come. 0:37:36.960 --> 0:37:39.279 All right, love it, love it all right. First up 0:37:39.320 --> 0:37:41.880 this Hour addressing the future of work and how robots 0:37:41.920 --> 0:37:45.120 play into that. The New York Times reported this past 0:37:45.160 --> 0:37:48.360 week that Amazon executives believe the company is on the 0:37:48.440 --> 0:37:51.520 cusp of its next big workplace shift, and that is 0:37:51.560 --> 0:37:54.760 replacing more than half a million jobs with robots. So 0:37:54.880 --> 0:37:58.080 the question will the future of work include robots or 0:37:58.239 --> 0:38:00.319 is it all hype? I mean it already kind of 0:38:00.320 --> 0:38:01.719 includes robots, right. 0:38:02.200 --> 0:38:04.839 How do you know I'm not one? I don't know. 0:38:05.160 --> 0:38:06.400 I did see you plug yourself. 0:38:06.200 --> 0:38:09.520 In the Sometimes I feel sometimes I feel like it's 0:38:09.560 --> 0:38:11.600 neither here nor there. Well here with more on what 0:38:11.640 --> 0:38:14.400 Amazon is up to is Ty Brady, chief technologist at 0:38:14.440 --> 0:38:18.240 Amazon Robotics. Ty joined us from Amazon's Delivering the Future 0:38:18.360 --> 0:38:20.680 twenty twenty five event out in California. 0:38:21.080 --> 0:38:26.239 We are fourth Delivering the Future event here and there's 0:38:26.280 --> 0:38:28.279 a bunch of press that we have here and we 0:38:28.360 --> 0:38:31.160 made a couple of big announcements in robotics. The first 0:38:31.239 --> 0:38:35.479 is in our manipulation robot that we call blue Jay. 0:38:35.840 --> 0:38:37.480 And what blue Jay the way that you can think 0:38:37.520 --> 0:38:39.640 of that as we can you can take three assembly 0:38:39.680 --> 0:38:41.720 lines and put it in the same footprint of one. 0:38:42.480 --> 0:38:45.080 What it does is help eliminate the menial, the mundane, 0:38:45.120 --> 0:38:47.480 and the repetitive, and it could pick more than seventy 0:38:47.520 --> 0:38:49.680 five percent of the inventory that we actually sell in 0:38:49.719 --> 0:38:52.000 our sortable network, which is a really big deal. I'm 0:38:52.000 --> 0:38:54.239 really proud of that. And I also say there's something 0:38:54.239 --> 0:38:56.520 interesting about blue Jay as well as compared to our 0:38:56.600 --> 0:39:02.719 other bird manipulation systems Sparrow and Robin, it took us 0:39:02.760 --> 0:39:06.160 about three years to kind of design, deploy and get 0:39:06.160 --> 0:39:10.040 out to our frontline employees. We have actually done blue 0:39:10.120 --> 0:39:13.000 Jay with the power of AI and just over a year, 0:39:13.160 --> 0:39:15.240 so it's really the pace of innovation. 0:39:15.760 --> 0:39:17.600 I think one of a lot of people think about Amazon 0:39:17.680 --> 0:39:19.160 and robots. I just want to jump in because we 0:39:19.160 --> 0:39:20.320 don't have a ton of time, but I like that. 0:39:20.400 --> 0:39:21.920 I want to we'll get to some of the other announcements. 0:39:22.080 --> 0:39:25.759 They think about the Kiva Systems robots the big acquisition 0:39:25.880 --> 0:39:27.520 at the time, you know, twenty twelve, that was a 0:39:27.520 --> 0:39:30.960 big acquisition for Amazon, and they've seen pictures of the 0:39:30.960 --> 0:39:34.560 way that those can move large loads of things across warehouses. 0:39:34.560 --> 0:39:36.600 But if you were to go into a state of 0:39:36.600 --> 0:39:39.120 the art Amazon warehouse today, what would you see That's 0:39:39.520 --> 0:39:41.560 in addition to those Kiva robots. 0:39:42.120 --> 0:39:45.640 Yeah, in addition to the world's first goods to person 0:39:45.719 --> 0:39:49.839 fulfillment strategy, which was just a really good idea where 0:39:49.840 --> 0:39:52.160 we have more than a million robots that we manufacture 0:39:52.160 --> 0:39:55.319 action in Massachusetts doing that job every day. You're going 0:39:55.360 --> 0:39:57.640 to see more of the unstructured fields, right, So, you're 0:39:57.680 --> 0:40:00.560 going to see green robot that we call Proteus that 0:40:00.600 --> 0:40:06.279 can move big cargoes of packages to the right dock 0:40:06.600 --> 0:40:09.799 at the right time. You're going to see many more 0:40:09.840 --> 0:40:13.120 manipulation systems that they we have in there, eliminating kind 0:40:13.120 --> 0:40:15.200 of the repetitive motions that they we have no one 0:40:15.239 --> 0:40:17.680 wants to lift a fifty pound box box all day, 0:40:18.000 --> 0:40:21.080 Robin does that, Cardinal does that. Moving into some of 0:40:21.120 --> 0:40:26.960 these proteus bound carts that we have, you're going to 0:40:27.000 --> 0:40:30.839 see much more collaborative robotics, right. So that's where we 0:40:30.880 --> 0:40:34.440 build our robotic systems to enable people to augment what 0:40:34.480 --> 0:40:37.239 people are capable of. And we really believe in the 0:40:37.280 --> 0:40:41.000 philosophy of people and machines working together. How can we 0:40:41.040 --> 0:40:44.439 build a tool set that enables our employees to do 0:40:44.719 --> 0:40:48.040 their job not only more efficiently, but also with better 0:40:48.080 --> 0:40:48.759 safety in mind? 0:40:48.760 --> 0:40:50.799 All right, So there's this robot arm called blue Jay. 0:40:50.840 --> 0:40:52.520 You just talked about it. You know, you guys are 0:40:52.600 --> 0:40:56.840 using this AI agent called Iluna, and then you're also 0:40:57.080 --> 0:40:59.959 working with augmented reality glasses to be worn by dry 0:41:00.440 --> 0:41:03.399 and delivery trucks in the field. There's like so much 0:41:03.440 --> 0:41:06.680 going on. Step back for a moment, because you guys 0:41:06.880 --> 0:41:07.760 have a lot of data. 0:41:07.880 --> 0:41:09.000 You look at what you're doing. 0:41:10.000 --> 0:41:12.719 I'm just curious investors who are thinking about Amazon and 0:41:12.760 --> 0:41:14.360 what you are doing, how do they think about the 0:41:14.400 --> 0:41:17.560 long term, like ROI return on investment when it comes 0:41:17.560 --> 0:41:20.480 to the investments you guys make in robots, is the 0:41:20.520 --> 0:41:24.279 goal about labor efficiency, through put speed or is it 0:41:24.360 --> 0:41:28.640 margin expansion kind of tie across your fulfillment operations? 0:41:28.680 --> 0:41:29.200 What is it? 0:41:30.680 --> 0:41:34.319 Yeah, well, definitely the efficiency. We think about efficiencies and 0:41:34.360 --> 0:41:37.319 how can we gain efficiency through all the chain of 0:41:37.360 --> 0:41:42.279 our fulfillment processes for sure, And you mentioned data and 0:41:42.400 --> 0:41:45.640 data is the fuel for AI systems. Data has allowed 0:41:45.719 --> 0:41:50.160 us to bring think of the body of being our robotics, 0:41:50.160 --> 0:41:52.719 but bring the mind to robotics, allowing it to be 0:41:52.760 --> 0:41:56.000 more adaptable, more fluid. You can almost think of this 0:41:56.040 --> 0:41:59.160 as the ability to pour our robotics systems into any 0:41:59.200 --> 0:42:04.040 size building, scale of building to amplify what our employees 0:42:04.080 --> 0:42:06.320 are already doing. We want to give them an amazing 0:42:06.320 --> 0:42:08.319 tool set and we see that when we do that, 0:42:08.520 --> 0:42:11.160 we're more productive. Right when you do robotics, right when 0:42:11.200 --> 0:42:13.320 you do collabor of robotics where you need both people 0:42:13.320 --> 0:42:15.839 and machines doing what they do best and they do 0:42:16.040 --> 0:42:19.440 different things better, that it allows you to be more productive. 0:42:19.440 --> 0:42:22.000 And when you're more productive, that allows you to invest 0:42:22.120 --> 0:42:25.120 more in people. We've skilled more than seven hundred thousand 0:42:25.120 --> 0:42:28.359 of our employees, which is a great stat and also 0:42:28.400 --> 0:42:31.040 in our robotics we've expanded from the Kiva days. We've 0:42:31.040 --> 0:42:34.400 expanded from just a movement solution to now movement and 0:42:34.480 --> 0:42:39.000 mobility and sortation and storage and perception systems, packing systems 0:42:39.120 --> 0:42:42.520 that have really changed the game for our customers. That's 0:42:42.520 --> 0:42:43.400 a big deal to us. 0:42:43.480 --> 0:42:47.080 What ty you know, well you need less workers, and 0:42:47.120 --> 0:42:49.320 I got to bring it up. You know, The Times 0:42:49.360 --> 0:42:53.600 had a story out They talked about interviews and a 0:42:53.640 --> 0:42:57.319 cash of internal strategy documents that they saw that it 0:42:57.320 --> 0:43:00.799 reveals that your execs think that the companies on the 0:43:00.800 --> 0:43:03.600 cusp of its next big workplace shift. I'm reading from 0:43:03.640 --> 0:43:05.960 the Times and replacing more than half a million jobs 0:43:05.960 --> 0:43:08.960 with robots, so you know, we know things change. I'm 0:43:08.960 --> 0:43:11.200 not in a horse and buggy anymore. I don't make 0:43:11.239 --> 0:43:14.520 things piecemeal. I get it. I don't get tons of 0:43:14.520 --> 0:43:18.200 faxes and I don't get tons of pieces of physical mail. 0:43:18.360 --> 0:43:22.719 Thank god, things change. Having said that, is Amazon, do 0:43:22.800 --> 0:43:24.960 you guys believe that you're on the cusp of a 0:43:25.000 --> 0:43:27.800 workplace shift and that you won't need as many workers 0:43:27.880 --> 0:43:31.680 because the advancements in robotics, Well. 0:43:31.520 --> 0:43:33.839 There's no doubt that things change. I mean, and we're 0:43:33.840 --> 0:43:36.120 actually really proud of that day and Amazon is that 0:43:36.719 --> 0:43:40.800 we avoid stasis at all costs. We change and we adapt, 0:43:41.160 --> 0:43:44.680 and the nature of tasks definitely changed. There's no doubt 0:43:44.719 --> 0:43:48.640 about that. We are laser focused on efficiencies inside of 0:43:48.640 --> 0:43:52.359 our buildings. But when it comes to that article, that 0:43:52.440 --> 0:43:55.200 article was speculating ten years out right, that's a ten 0:43:55.239 --> 0:43:58.840 year speculation, and it's hard to say what's going to 0:43:58.840 --> 0:44:00.680 happen in the next ten years. But I can tell 0:44:00.680 --> 0:44:03.080 you what happened in the last ten years, the last 0:44:03.080 --> 0:44:06.360 ten years, which is when we seriously invested in robotics, 0:44:06.480 --> 0:44:09.279 that we created hundreds of thousands of new jobs and 0:44:09.360 --> 0:44:12.400 new job types. And there's been no employer in the 0:44:12.440 --> 0:44:17.560 United States that has employed more people than Amazon in 0:44:17.680 --> 0:44:20.400 ten years. I mean, that's and that's the power of 0:44:21.440 --> 0:44:25.359 efficiencies and building your robots in way that's applied and 0:44:25.400 --> 0:44:27.960 real that actually augments the human potential. 0:44:28.040 --> 0:44:29.680 All Right, my brother Sam, I like a dog with 0:44:29.680 --> 0:44:32.960 a bone. So does that mean ten years out it 0:44:32.960 --> 0:44:36.120 could be less jobs or we just don't know or 0:44:36.160 --> 0:44:38.520 you don't think that's the case, Well you. 0:44:38.520 --> 0:44:41.560 Have to think about I mean, there's jobs and there's tasks, right, 0:44:41.600 --> 0:44:44.440 so of course we're changing the nature of tasks. Like 0:44:44.480 --> 0:44:48.759 I'm very bullish on eliminating every menial, mundane and repetitive 0:44:48.840 --> 0:44:51.120 job out there. Nobody wants to do that, so we're 0:44:51.160 --> 0:44:54.319 going to change those tasks one hundred percent. But we 0:44:54.400 --> 0:44:57.920 can again, as history has shown, we continue to create 0:44:58.040 --> 0:45:01.160 jobs right with the goal of two things. Can you 0:45:01.200 --> 0:45:03.640 have it all? Can you be more productive which means 0:45:03.640 --> 0:45:06.240 more efficiency, and can you also create a safer environment 0:45:06.280 --> 0:45:09.200 for employees? And we're actually doing both. That's what history 0:45:09.239 --> 0:45:11.640 has shown. In the last ten years. We have created 0:45:11.920 --> 0:45:16.720 better than thirty percent reduction in our overall recordable injury 0:45:16.800 --> 0:45:19.840 rate over the last five years because of our robotics 0:45:20.400 --> 0:45:24.200 and also much more efficient. For example, our latest generation 0:45:25.040 --> 0:45:28.120 filment center in shreport is twenty five percent more efficient. 0:45:28.360 --> 0:45:30.160 You can have it all, but you have to build 0:45:30.200 --> 0:45:32.680 your robotics in the right way that empowers people. 0:45:33.200 --> 0:45:36.680 We're speaking with Ty Brady, chief technologist at Amazon Robotics. 0:45:36.960 --> 0:45:40.040 When we think about hiring for these one off or 0:45:40.120 --> 0:45:44.200 seasonal events like the holiday season, our Amazon Prime Day, 0:45:44.760 --> 0:45:48.120 I'm wondering how you're putting pencil to paper right now 0:45:48.120 --> 0:45:50.880 and thinking about those numbers and to what extent automation 0:45:51.320 --> 0:45:56.480 has reduced Amazon's dependency on seasonal or hourly labor for holidays, 0:45:56.480 --> 0:45:58.319 for prime day. What does that look like or what 0:45:58.360 --> 0:45:59.959 will that look like this year next year. 0:46:00.280 --> 0:46:04.200 Well, it's the same philosophy of empowering employees, whether they're 0:46:04.239 --> 0:46:07.200 temporary or the full time employees with the world's best 0:46:07.200 --> 0:46:09.680 machines that help them do their job. It's the same philosophy. 0:46:09.760 --> 0:46:11.399 I'm really proud of the fact that this year we're 0:46:11.400 --> 0:46:13.800 going to offer more than two hundred and fifty thousand 0:46:14.280 --> 0:46:17.239 temporary jobs for our employees to come in during the 0:46:17.280 --> 0:46:19.960 holiday season. Those are good paying jobs. I'm really happy 0:46:20.000 --> 0:46:22.480 about that, really pleased with that. And I'm really pleased 0:46:22.520 --> 0:46:24.600 with the work that our women and men have done 0:46:24.800 --> 0:46:28.280 in the robotics field, designing the pioneering these new physical 0:46:28.280 --> 0:46:30.800 AI systems that help them do their jobs better. 0:46:31.360 --> 0:46:33.760 I got to say, one thing that I've been thinking 0:46:33.800 --> 0:46:37.520 a lot about is what's going on overseas, whether it's China, 0:46:37.560 --> 0:46:41.000 whether it's Japan. Bloomberg has done some reporting about service 0:46:41.000 --> 0:46:43.839 industries in Japan because they have a labor shortage that 0:46:43.880 --> 0:46:47.520 they are leading increasingly on robotics. Have you been over 0:46:47.520 --> 0:46:49.759 there and looking at what they're doing, And I'm just 0:46:49.880 --> 0:46:54.160 curious if you're seeing some things that are pretty impressive, 0:46:54.200 --> 0:46:58.560 and that the US, as a creator of things or 0:46:58.880 --> 0:47:02.480 its role in the robotics industry, has to keep a watch. 0:47:02.280 --> 0:47:03.680 On what's going on in other countries. 0:47:04.880 --> 0:47:05.080 Yeah. 0:47:05.320 --> 0:47:08.640 I think it's easy, especially in robotis, to get distracted 0:47:08.840 --> 0:47:12.600 about what other people are doing. I think anybody can 0:47:12.600 --> 0:47:14.759 make a YouTube video. I think anybody can kind of 0:47:15.080 --> 0:47:19.399 pop in and overflate something. But if you come into 0:47:19.440 --> 0:47:22.520 our world, our world is all about application. So final 0:47:22.520 --> 0:47:26.160 thoughts is that robotics when done the right way, when 0:47:26.200 --> 0:47:29.600 you reframe your relationship with machines, you can enable more productivity, 0:47:29.840 --> 0:47:33.920 create greater efficiencies, and create a more safer environment for employees. 0:47:34.160 --> 0:47:36.879 And this collaborative mindset that we've had that we've done 0:47:36.920 --> 0:47:39.879 for the last ten years really does make the day. 0:47:39.960 --> 0:47:42.640 Ty Brady over at Amazon so appreciate it. 0:47:44.600 --> 0:47:48.439 This is the Bloomberg Business Week Daily Podcast. Listen live 0:47:48.560 --> 0:47:51.280 each weekday starting at two pm e sternup on Apple 0:47:51.320 --> 0:47:54.359 car Play and the Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business app. 0:47:54.440 --> 0:47:57.239 You can also listen live on Amazon Alexa from our 0:47:57.239 --> 0:48:01.400 flagship New York station, just Say Alexa Bloomberg eleven thirty. 0:48:02.200 --> 0:48:04.839 Some news this past week in the world of quantum computing. 0:48:05.160 --> 0:48:08.439 Google ran an algorithm on its Willow quantum computing chip 0:48:08.480 --> 0:48:11.560 that can be repeated on similar platforms and now performed 0:48:11.560 --> 0:48:15.480 classical supercomputers. A breakthrough, it said, clears a path for 0:48:15.640 --> 0:48:19.440 useful applications of quantum technology within five years. 0:48:19.800 --> 0:48:22.600 The folks in Chattanooga, Tennessee, have been thinking about quantum 0:48:22.600 --> 0:48:26.239 computing for years. The first commercially available quantum network in 0:48:26.280 --> 0:48:28.440 the US was established there. That was back in twenty 0:48:28.480 --> 0:48:31.880 twenty two. We should also note that last year Bloomberg 0:48:31.920 --> 0:48:35.640 Philanthropy is named Chattanooga one of twenty five cities selected 0:48:35.680 --> 0:48:39.800 for its American Sustainable Cities Program. Bloomberg Philanthropies is founded 0:48:39.840 --> 0:48:42.400 and supported by Michael R. Bloomberg, the founder and majority 0:48:42.440 --> 0:48:43.839 owner of Bloomberg LP. 0:48:44.120 --> 0:48:47.799 Now Chattanooga Sustainable Cities program still ongoing, and so we 0:48:47.840 --> 0:48:51.200 wanted an update on their quantum network. Back with us 0:48:51.400 --> 0:48:55.920 was Tim Kelly, Mayor of Chattanooga, Tennessee. Also Janet Raeberg, 0:48:56.280 --> 0:48:59.960 President and CEO Elective EPB, formerly known as the Electric 0:49:00.120 --> 0:49:03.960 Power Board of Chattanooga. That company it provides energy, internet, 0:49:04.000 --> 0:49:07.920 phone and more in and around Chattanooga. The environment today, 0:49:08.640 --> 0:49:12.719 how is it in terms of running your city, being 0:49:12.719 --> 0:49:15.360 a mayor in a political environment that's a tough one, 0:49:15.680 --> 0:49:17.479 an economic environment that may be tough. 0:49:17.640 --> 0:49:20.640 Yeah, it's tough, but you know, running cities is an 0:49:20.680 --> 0:49:25.160 eminently practical exercise. And I will say, you know, our 0:49:25.239 --> 0:49:29.480 mayor's races are nonpartisan. They always have been, and I stayed. 0:49:29.239 --> 0:49:29.800 In that lane. 0:49:30.120 --> 0:49:33.680 Again, I mean, I'm not here to catalog my political beliefs. 0:49:33.760 --> 0:49:36.279 They're pretty confusing to most people anyway. I'd say, you know, 0:49:36.560 --> 0:49:39.200 Republicans think I'm a Democratic, and Democrats think I'm a Republican. 0:49:39.239 --> 0:49:41.719 I'm probably doing a pretty good job. So you know, 0:49:41.840 --> 0:49:44.600 I look, that has served me well in this environment, 0:49:44.640 --> 0:49:47.920 because again I believe, as does a lot of folks 0:49:47.920 --> 0:49:51.399 of Bloomberg as do rather, but that cities are really 0:49:51.719 --> 0:49:54.719 the foundation of our economy. I swear ninety percent of 0:49:54.719 --> 0:49:57.720 the GDP's generateds we're all innovations generated. So I'm focused 0:49:57.719 --> 0:50:01.120 on whatever is best for Chattanooga. So I can work 0:50:01.160 --> 0:50:03.200 and have managed to work with people on both sides 0:50:03.200 --> 0:50:05.000 of the aisle, and you know, in the best interest 0:50:05.040 --> 0:50:05.600 of my city. 0:50:05.719 --> 0:50:09.400 Do you find yourself getting pulled into the social issues 0:50:09.400 --> 0:50:12.520 that seem to define our era right now? The stuff 0:50:12.520 --> 0:50:15.520 that does dominate cable news, whether you're talking about the 0:50:15.560 --> 0:50:16.200 right or the left. 0:50:16.360 --> 0:50:20.239 Yeah, I mean I find myself, you know, I find 0:50:20.239 --> 0:50:22.120 people attempting to pull me into those but I think 0:50:22.120 --> 0:50:24.920 I've gotten pretty good at wrestling my way out of 0:50:24.960 --> 0:50:28.760 them and trying to just translate back into simple terms. 0:50:28.840 --> 0:50:31.480 You know, is this what's best for the city? You know, 0:50:31.600 --> 0:50:33.600 does it work or does it not work? I mean, 0:50:33.640 --> 0:50:36.920 sometimes you can't avoid those political issues. It's not as though, 0:50:37.719 --> 0:50:40.760 you know, I don't have my own beliefs. But again, 0:50:40.800 --> 0:50:43.080 I think you, just as a mayor, have to take 0:50:43.640 --> 0:50:46.239 a thoroughly practical approach to what's going to work best 0:50:46.280 --> 0:50:46.719 for the city. 0:50:46.800 --> 0:50:48.400 All right, So when you think about what's best for 0:50:48.440 --> 0:50:50.480 the city, let's talk about that, because you are on 0:50:50.520 --> 0:50:52.799 the ground talking to people what they need, what you 0:50:52.840 --> 0:50:55.320 need to make sure you have a good economy, strong economy, 0:50:55.360 --> 0:50:58.480 not just today but in the future. That quantum computing 0:50:58.520 --> 0:51:00.480 that you made it back in twenty twenty to tell 0:51:00.560 --> 0:51:02.640 us about, kind of give us an update for someone 0:51:02.680 --> 0:51:05.520 who didn't hear the conversation when you were last on 0:51:05.560 --> 0:51:07.760 with this kind of where you guys are with us. 0:51:07.680 --> 0:51:10.279 So I'll give you the cliff notes version, which is 0:51:10.320 --> 0:51:14.360 that you know, we took advantage of a large federal 0:51:14.920 --> 0:51:18.239 low interest loan way back when during Clinton and Gore 0:51:19.400 --> 0:51:22.160 to put in a giant municipal fibre network, and that 0:51:22.239 --> 0:51:25.360 gave us the first and fastest municipal fiber network in 0:51:25.360 --> 0:51:27.400 the country. We had a lot of folks move in 0:51:27.480 --> 0:51:29.360 during COVID because you know, you can get one gig 0:51:29.400 --> 0:51:31.959 of symmetrical speed for sixty seven bucks a month. 0:51:32.120 --> 0:51:33.120 Yeah, pretty great. 0:51:33.160 --> 0:51:35.239 You can get twenty five gigs of speed at your 0:51:35.280 --> 0:51:38.440 house in Chattanooga. But it turns out that you can 0:51:38.480 --> 0:51:41.560 also do quantum computing on large loops of dark fiber, 0:51:42.080 --> 0:51:45.719 one particular type that uses photons and trapped ions, which 0:51:45.760 --> 0:51:49.480 is where ion Q began to become interested in Chattanooga. 0:51:49.560 --> 0:51:51.840 So we opened and Janet can talk more about it. 0:51:52.040 --> 0:51:55.360 The first commercially available quantum network, and it is starting 0:51:55.400 --> 0:51:57.040 to attract a lot of investment and attention. 0:51:57.280 --> 0:51:58.880 So Janet, come on in here, because one thing that 0:51:58.920 --> 0:52:01.440 we're trying to understand is what the practical applications of 0:52:01.520 --> 0:52:04.120 quantum technology are. We spoke with Ed Ludlow the coast 0:52:04.120 --> 0:52:07.200 of our Bloomberg Tech program a little earlier and Carol agreed, 0:52:07.239 --> 0:52:09.720 I mean you thought healthcare first, he said healthcare also, 0:52:09.800 --> 0:52:12.319 this is one area of application, but it's still kind 0:52:12.360 --> 0:52:15.120 of the world where we're thinking about what this tech 0:52:15.120 --> 0:52:17.920 can do, not necessarily seeing what it can do. Have 0:52:18.000 --> 0:52:22.320 we seen any material things be developed as a result 0:52:22.400 --> 0:52:24.480 of this technology and what you're doing in Chattanooga. 0:52:24.600 --> 0:52:26.319 Yeah, So ian Q has been working on a lot 0:52:26.360 --> 0:52:29.880 of different type of application with different industry, and so 0:52:29.920 --> 0:52:32.080 we were interested because we're in an electric company and 0:52:32.160 --> 0:52:33.719 so we have all the data for them to help 0:52:33.800 --> 0:52:36.640 us optimize our grid. So we're doing a partnership actually 0:52:36.719 --> 0:52:39.960 with Ionq, Nvidia, and Oakridge National Lab as a full 0:52:39.960 --> 0:52:43.400 way partnership to help do use hybrid computing until quantum 0:52:43.440 --> 0:52:46.120 computing can get to where it needs to be to 0:52:46.160 --> 0:52:48.560 help us with some grid optimization problem that we can't 0:52:48.560 --> 0:52:49.880 solve today in. 0:52:49.960 --> 0:52:52.200 Terms of energy demands. Tell us about that. That is 0:52:52.239 --> 0:52:55.000 like what you are seeing front and center. The AI 0:52:55.120 --> 0:52:58.279 conversation narrative has moved from the spend and chips and 0:52:58.320 --> 0:53:00.600 so on and so forth, like to basically, all right, 0:53:00.600 --> 0:53:02.359 do we have enough power to do all of this? 0:53:02.920 --> 0:53:06.760 And there is certainly a power scramble among the big hyperscalers. 0:53:06.880 --> 0:53:08.120 What are you seeing on that front? 0:53:08.239 --> 0:53:10.760 Yeah, and I think that's a nationwide, you know, issue 0:53:10.760 --> 0:53:13.200 with with the energy problem. And as AI gets better 0:53:13.239 --> 0:53:16.839 as an energy problem, right, Yeah, I mean as AI 0:53:16.880 --> 0:53:18.920 gets better and better the more energy that it's going 0:53:19.000 --> 0:53:21.600 to need. And so that's where quantum comes in. Very 0:53:21.640 --> 0:53:25.120 important to the part of that solution is that quantum computer, 0:53:25.239 --> 0:53:27.400 once it gets to the phase that it needs to be, 0:53:27.880 --> 0:53:30.400 is it can solve things at a much faster rate, 0:53:30.719 --> 0:53:34.200 which uses less energy than a classical computer because it 0:53:34.239 --> 0:53:37.400 can do things in parallel versus sequential as a classical computer. 0:53:37.480 --> 0:53:40.120 Today, Where do you get the energy that you sell 0:53:40.160 --> 0:53:41.600 to people in and around Chattenoga? 0:53:41.680 --> 0:53:44.640 Yeah, so we buy it from TVA Tennessee Valley Authority, 0:53:45.000 --> 0:53:47.080 and so they generate the power and we distribute it 0:53:47.080 --> 0:53:47.720 to our customers. 0:53:47.760 --> 0:53:48.719 How do they generate it? 0:53:48.920 --> 0:53:52.640 They have a diverse mix of portfolio from hydro, different 0:53:52.640 --> 0:53:56.960 types of renewables to natural gas, and so you know 0:53:57.000 --> 0:53:58.840 they're continuing to look at other options. 0:53:58.880 --> 0:54:00.359 Do you see that mixed going now? 0:54:00.400 --> 0:54:02.080 I was just going to say, they're also very much 0:54:02.120 --> 0:54:03.920 on the front foot in terms of advanced. 0:54:03.640 --> 0:54:05.879 Nuclear Do you see that mix? 0:54:06.080 --> 0:54:06.759 This is either of you. 0:54:06.760 --> 0:54:10.240 Do you see that mixed changing and focusing less unrenewables 0:54:10.280 --> 0:54:13.239 more on nuclear as a result of the changes out 0:54:13.280 --> 0:54:13.920 of Washington. 0:54:14.239 --> 0:54:17.160 I think you're going to see that, you know, and again, 0:54:17.640 --> 0:54:19.840 regardless of your political affiliation, if you just kind of 0:54:19.840 --> 0:54:22.479 look at the math, there's no way around nuclear, right. 0:54:22.760 --> 0:54:26.480 I do think they are giving us or EPB more 0:54:26.560 --> 0:54:28.920 latitude to generate some of our own power because of 0:54:28.960 --> 0:54:31.719 the anticipated demands. And I think we still have a 0:54:31.719 --> 0:54:34.160 lot of headway on solar, So I mean, I think 0:54:34.200 --> 0:54:36.480 we'll contin and we've got a lot of things we 0:54:36.480 --> 0:54:38.560 can do with hydro. We're going to actually start using 0:54:38.920 --> 0:54:43.120 biogas at our wastewater treatment plant to generate electricity. So 0:54:43.160 --> 0:54:45.440 we're looking at any in all ways that we can generate. 0:54:45.600 --> 0:54:47.960 Because my understanding when we talk about SMRs, the small 0:54:48.000 --> 0:54:50.719 modular reactors, it's ten fifteen. 0:54:50.840 --> 0:54:53.640 Will remind us, Will Wage reminds us who covers this 0:54:53.719 --> 0:54:55.879 here at Bloomberg News that we're not there right now, 0:54:55.960 --> 0:54:57.960 it's a while we are not, but we have a 0:54:58.000 --> 0:55:02.280 pretty significant nuclear footprint with TVA already in the tendency. 0:55:02.360 --> 0:55:03.960 What would you tell people who are still kind of 0:55:03.960 --> 0:55:07.000 nervous when it comes to the nuclear footprint that you 0:55:07.000 --> 0:55:10.399 guys have. You know what you know, fine, people do it, Okay, 0:55:10.400 --> 0:55:12.200 do it across the country or do it in another country. 0:55:12.239 --> 0:55:13.920 But you know the feeling here in the I mean, I. 0:55:13.840 --> 0:55:16.279 Grew up next to a nuclear power planet. But I'm fine, right, 0:55:16.520 --> 0:55:17.200 I'm a little weird. 0:55:18.800 --> 0:55:20.399 But what would you say about that? 0:55:20.680 --> 0:55:23.640 I mean, the technology has come a long long way. Yeah, 0:55:24.000 --> 0:55:25.560 that's what I would say. Man, I'd say, go do 0:55:25.640 --> 0:55:26.720 your research, do your homework. 0:55:26.719 --> 0:55:27.040 They're not. 0:55:27.200 --> 0:55:29.160 I mean, that's why we have these discussions, That's why we. 0:55:29.160 --> 0:55:29.640 Have the fears. 0:55:29.680 --> 0:55:33.719 But but there's just not absent fusion. I will say 0:55:33.719 --> 0:55:36.520 the state in the University of Tennessee is also working 0:55:36.600 --> 0:55:40.239 very very hard on fusion technology. Absent that breakthrough, there's 0:55:40.280 --> 0:55:40.600 really not. 0:55:40.960 --> 0:55:41.840 That's what I'm waiting for you. 0:55:42.480 --> 0:55:45.560 When we're talking about quantum today and we're talking about Google, 0:55:45.560 --> 0:55:48.600 we're talking about Silicon Valley. How do you get people 0:55:48.640 --> 0:55:53.160 to think about Chattanooga, Tennessee, and not Silicon Valley, not 0:55:53.360 --> 0:55:56.520 New York City, not Austin, Texas when they're thinking about 0:55:56.520 --> 0:55:59.120 where they want to live to have a job in technology. 0:56:00.120 --> 0:56:02.799 Coming on Bloomberg is a great first step. No, I mean, look, 0:56:02.840 --> 0:56:04.600 we talk about this all the time. It's a mid 0:56:04.640 --> 0:56:06.920 side Southern city with kind of a funny name, and 0:56:06.960 --> 0:56:09.719 there's a bit of cognitive dissonance there. So you know, look, 0:56:09.719 --> 0:56:11.480 we are out telling the story. I mean, I was 0:56:11.560 --> 0:56:14.240 just in Detroit last week at a sustainable mobility conference. 0:56:14.880 --> 0:56:17.319 We were at the Quantum World Congress. I mean, at 0:56:17.320 --> 0:56:19.839 some point it's you know, the evidence is mounting. We 0:56:19.880 --> 0:56:22.360 are it's not just smoke. We are doing the work 0:56:22.480 --> 0:56:23.240 and it's working. 0:56:23.400 --> 0:56:23.840 Is it? Is it? 0:56:23.880 --> 0:56:26.480 If you build it, they will come mentality, I think, 0:56:26.520 --> 0:56:27.400 So have they come? 0:56:27.719 --> 0:56:28.560 Yes, they have come. 0:56:28.560 --> 0:56:31.400 I mean again we had you know, we now have 0:56:31.640 --> 0:56:34.319 independent verification that you know, ten twelve thousand people moved 0:56:34.320 --> 0:56:38.600 to Chattanooga during the pandemic very you know, degree talented 0:56:38.600 --> 0:56:42.040 people that could work remotely. And I think again, our job, 0:56:42.120 --> 0:56:44.400 my job as mayor, is to help break that glass 0:56:44.440 --> 0:56:46.960 ceiling so that we have the level of business investment 0:56:47.120 --> 0:56:50.840 and again can build up our academic horsepower to be 0:56:50.880 --> 0:56:52.800 able to sustain those knowledge economy jobs. 0:56:52.880 --> 0:56:55.319 Jenna, you know, when we think about quantum computing, we 0:56:55.360 --> 0:56:57.439 spend so much time to talking about you know, large 0:56:57.480 --> 0:57:00.200 language models and generative AI and kind of where that's 0:57:00.360 --> 0:57:05.400 agentic AI. You just talked about the power aspect or 0:57:05.520 --> 0:57:08.080 the use of less power when it comes to quantum computing. 0:57:08.120 --> 0:57:13.360 But I mean, should our conversation be shifting in terms 0:57:13.440 --> 0:57:16.000 of what we are having for an investing audience when 0:57:16.040 --> 0:57:20.720 we talk just so much about AI generally versus quantum Well, I. 0:57:20.720 --> 0:57:23.160 Think that with quantum computer, when it gets to you know, 0:57:23.160 --> 0:57:24.760 at the level it needs to be, you can team 0:57:24.800 --> 0:57:28.080 it up with AI and get even more powerful algorithm 0:57:28.080 --> 0:57:29.479 that comes out of it to be able to solve 0:57:29.480 --> 0:57:32.040 more complex problems. So I don't think it's one or 0:57:32.120 --> 0:57:34.080 the other. I think it's going to be a combined 0:57:34.360 --> 0:57:36.080 of you know, how do you combine that and use 0:57:36.160 --> 0:57:39.080 less energy and be able to build algorithm more efficiently. 0:57:39.400 --> 0:57:41.200 So help me because when we talk about the data 0:57:41.200 --> 0:57:43.360 center build out, so does that go hand in hand 0:57:43.360 --> 0:57:46.160 with the buildout of quantum computing? Is that part of it? 0:57:46.760 --> 0:57:49.240 So right now, it's you know, the we're building a 0:57:49.280 --> 0:57:51.439 quantum computer to kind of learn more and be able 0:57:51.480 --> 0:57:54.440 to help accelerate and advance that technology with companies like 0:57:54.480 --> 0:57:56.680 ion Q, and I think once it gets to where 0:57:56.720 --> 0:57:58.760 it needs to be, then well we can team it 0:57:58.840 --> 0:57:59.360 up with AI. 0:57:59.680 --> 0:58:02.840 Okay, yeah, yeah, and many of the implications with quantum. 0:58:02.880 --> 0:58:04.760 I'm asking basic questions because I feel like we spend 0:58:04.800 --> 0:58:06.640 so much time talking about the AI, but this is 0:58:06.640 --> 0:58:09.000 something that increasingly is coming into the dialogue. 0:58:09.080 --> 0:58:09.240 Yeah. 0:58:09.240 --> 0:58:10.920 Now, I'm just going to say the logistics is a 0:58:10.960 --> 0:58:12.920 huge vertical in chattre Go as well, and I think 0:58:12.920 --> 0:58:16.600 the implications for quantum for logistics have huge implications for 0:58:16.760 --> 0:58:20.280 lower power demand and a lower carbon footprint, right, because 0:58:20.440 --> 0:58:23.080 you're going to waste a lot less time getting stuff 0:58:23.200 --> 0:58:26.400 from A to B. Right with root optimization we're going. 0:58:26.400 --> 0:58:27.760 To have to do because we talk about like the 0:58:28.080 --> 0:58:32.400 power drag or the power demand and the cost. Mayor Kelly, 0:58:32.400 --> 0:58:34.560 I'd be remiss not to ask you you are trying 0:58:34.560 --> 0:58:37.360 to build a city where everyone has an opportunity to 0:58:37.360 --> 0:58:39.080 thrive and prosper. We talk so much about the case 0:58:39.080 --> 0:58:41.720 shaped economy. There's a lot of people who aren't thriving 0:58:41.760 --> 0:58:46.000 and prospering in this environment. Thirty five seconds, what's a 0:58:46.040 --> 0:58:47.360 message to send to everybody? 0:58:47.760 --> 0:58:50.360 Well, we are working very hard to reform our workforce 0:58:50.400 --> 0:58:53.560 fillment system so that we so we don't leave folks behind. 0:58:53.560 --> 0:58:56.200 And I think we have some significant opportunities to do that, 0:58:57.200 --> 0:58:59.240 and we are in the midst of doing that again. 0:58:59.360 --> 0:59:01.520 It's tough out there, Yeah, and I think it's going 0:59:01.600 --> 0:59:04.640 to fall more to the state government and to philanthropy 0:59:04.680 --> 0:59:06.520 frankly to kind of take up the slack in the meantime. 0:59:06.760 --> 0:59:08.240 But I mean, we have to play the long game, 0:59:08.280 --> 0:59:10.360 and the long game is we need some significant change 0:59:10.360 --> 0:59:13.280 to the way that we do education workforce development in 0:59:13.280 --> 0:59:15.000 this country so that we don't leave people behind. 0:59:15.080 --> 0:59:16.920 Yeah, it does feel like in terms of education, we're 0:59:16.920 --> 0:59:17.840 starting to think about that. 0:59:18.560 --> 0:59:19.200 Come back soon. 0:59:19.400 --> 0:59:22.600 I'd love to kind of continue this conversation if we may. 0:59:23.200 --> 0:59:26.400 Mayor Tim Kelly of Chattanooga, Tennessee, and Janet Rieberg, she's 0:59:26.400 --> 0:59:29.760 the President's CEO elect of EP be joining us right 0:59:29.800 --> 0:59:33.840 here in our Bloomberg Interactive Burger Studio. 0:59:36.280 --> 0:59:40.240 You're listening to the Bloomberg Business Weekdaily Podcast. Catch us 0:59:40.320 --> 0:59:43.800 live weekday afternoons from two to five pm Eastern Listen 0:59:43.800 --> 0:59:47.400 on Applecarplay and Android Auto with the Bloomberg Business app, 0:59:47.520 --> 0:59:50.080 or watch us live on YouTube. 0:59:50.400 --> 0:59:53.400 I felt like being well has turned into another job. 0:59:53.760 --> 0:59:57.000 From health trackers reporting our every step and snore to 0:59:57.240 --> 1:00:01.040 pricey longevity clubs and celebrity endorse up bits. Like I say, Tim, 1:00:01.120 --> 1:00:03.680 sometimes it feels like protecting your overall wellness can be. 1:00:04.720 --> 1:00:07.720 A lot of work and really hard and also a 1:00:07.760 --> 1:00:13.160 little expensive. Yeah, okay, thankfully we can cheat or maybe 1:00:13.200 --> 1:00:16.560 boosting if that makes us feel better. Yeahat the word cheat, 1:00:16.600 --> 1:00:19.480 I don't know. Yeah, it's so hard, I don't know. Okay, 1:00:19.480 --> 1:00:22.040 to cheat their cheat days with us with a list 1:00:22.080 --> 1:00:24.800 of wellness hacks to try, is the Bloomberg Pursuits Editor 1:00:24.800 --> 1:00:27.400 at Large, Chris Rouser. It is The Pursuit's cover story 1:00:27.440 --> 1:00:30.400 of the October issue of a business week magazine. It's 1:00:30.400 --> 1:00:34.360 available now online, on the terminal and on news stands. 1:00:34.360 --> 1:00:36.080 Before we get into some of the individual cheats, I 1:00:36.080 --> 1:00:36.880 already have my favorite. 1:00:36.920 --> 1:00:38.840 Wait, can we just say, first of all, Chris, you 1:00:38.840 --> 1:00:39.600 look marvelous. 1:00:39.680 --> 1:00:40.960 Oh thank oh my gosh, thank you. 1:00:40.960 --> 1:00:42.840 You're very welcome cheating. 1:00:44.000 --> 1:00:45.480 Now, go ahead, what's your favorite? 1:00:45.640 --> 1:00:47.560 I just want to talk about the overall tone of 1:00:47.600 --> 1:00:50.760 this and how it all came together, because I think it. 1:00:50.960 --> 1:00:53.480 Is it because there's a moment happening with wellness? Or 1:00:53.520 --> 1:00:55.120 is it because we're all getting older? 1:00:55.960 --> 1:00:56.160 Oh? 1:00:56.200 --> 1:00:58.800 I think both, Okay, both of those things. The reason 1:00:58.880 --> 1:01:00.760 we uh, the reason I to look at it and 1:01:00.800 --> 1:01:03.240 have us do a package on it was I had 1:01:03.240 --> 1:01:05.400 a couple of injuries earlier this year where I had 1:01:05.440 --> 1:01:07.840 a foot surgery, you guys remember, and I fractured my 1:01:07.840 --> 1:01:10.360 elbow and I couldn't work out. And the three of us, 1:01:10.400 --> 1:01:13.040 I know are fitness people, and when you cannot work out, 1:01:13.080 --> 1:01:14.400 you become mentally unwell. 1:01:15.360 --> 1:01:15.960 Very true. 1:01:16.040 --> 1:01:17.840 And so I just and when I finally was able 1:01:17.880 --> 1:01:19.960 to work out again, you know, I'm in my mid forties, 1:01:20.200 --> 1:01:22.720 it's like hard to get back in shape, put muscle on, 1:01:22.800 --> 1:01:25.080 lose weight, whatever. And I was like, you know what, 1:01:25.200 --> 1:01:28.919 I really wish I had a little cheat something where 1:01:28.960 --> 1:01:32.240 I could like really get back in shape faster. And 1:01:32.440 --> 1:01:35.800 it turns out there is one. There is a stem 1:01:35.920 --> 1:01:38.680 suit called the Catalyst suit, which is basically like one 1:01:38.680 --> 1:01:41.920 of those as seen on TV ab zappers from the nineties, 1:01:42.600 --> 1:01:44.280 where you put it on your whole body and it 1:01:44.440 --> 1:01:47.400 electrocutes you while you're working out and it activates more 1:01:47.440 --> 1:01:48.160 of your muscles. 1:01:48.880 --> 1:01:50.200 Wait, electrocute YOUO? 1:01:50.360 --> 1:01:51.720 Yeah, did it hurt? 1:01:52.680 --> 1:01:52.720 It? 1:01:53.360 --> 1:01:56.240 Hurting is not the right word. It feels. It's like 1:01:56.280 --> 1:01:58.360 a buzz. It's a very intense buzz, and it can 1:01:58.800 --> 1:02:02.720 be quite uncomfortable, not in a painful. 1:02:02.400 --> 1:02:03.960 Way, like I said, but no pay, no gain. 1:02:04.120 --> 1:02:07.120 Yeah, you really gotta get used to it. So there's 1:02:07.120 --> 1:02:10.320 this suit that activates your muscles like supercharge your workouts 1:02:10.320 --> 1:02:13.800 and actually can get you back in shape faster. And 1:02:13.840 --> 1:02:16.240 so once I started doing that, I was like, well, 1:02:16.240 --> 1:02:19.120 what other cheats are there? And I got everyone on 1:02:19.160 --> 1:02:23.520 the team looking for different chets for wellness, fitness, eating, sleeping, 1:02:23.600 --> 1:02:23.920 all that. 1:02:23.960 --> 1:02:24.080 Well. 1:02:24.080 --> 1:02:25.640 I do want to say, if you want to know 1:02:25.640 --> 1:02:28.640 more about the stemsuit, the Catalyst. Catalyst is the company 1:02:28.680 --> 1:02:32.480 that owns it. Brandon Kennedy's the CEO of the company 1:02:32.480 --> 1:02:34.760 that owns the stemsuit that Chris is talking about. We 1:02:34.800 --> 1:02:37.520 had an extending conversation with him and Chris a few 1:02:37.560 --> 1:02:39.560 weeks ago. You can check it out on our podcast 1:02:39.600 --> 1:02:43.360 feed to learn more. Little spoiler, Chris says, it actually works. 1:02:43.960 --> 1:02:44.800 It works. I do. 1:02:45.040 --> 1:02:45.800 Yeah, it's nice. 1:02:45.800 --> 1:02:48.320 Okay, let's talk about some of these other tricks. Some 1:02:48.360 --> 1:02:52.800 of them involved needles, that's true. Some of them involve treadmills. 1:02:52.920 --> 1:02:55.080 I want to start with my favorite. It's old school. 1:02:55.560 --> 1:02:58.680 It's walking up hill. Oh yeah, because you know we 1:02:58.720 --> 1:03:00.720 think about cheats. This one doesn't even seem like a 1:03:00.760 --> 1:03:03.720 cheat to me, because this is like keeps you in shape. 1:03:03.720 --> 1:03:06.400 This is what you do. But apparently you can do 1:03:06.440 --> 1:03:07.680 this three or four days a week and you're not 1:03:07.720 --> 1:03:09.440 going to feel the effects of like having gone on 1:03:09.480 --> 1:03:10.160 a run or something. 1:03:10.440 --> 1:03:13.040 Yeah, so a lot of these cheats are things where 1:03:13.040 --> 1:03:14.880 you still have to put in work. So like with 1:03:14.960 --> 1:03:17.640 a the stemsuit the Catalyst suit, you have to exercise, 1:03:17.760 --> 1:03:20.400 but just to exercise while you're getting electrocuted, so it 1:03:20.440 --> 1:03:23.080 works better. And walking up hill is an old school 1:03:23.120 --> 1:03:26.560 thing that like celebrity trainers tell people to do because 1:03:26.600 --> 1:03:28.880 it burns calories a lot, but it also doesn't wear 1:03:28.920 --> 1:03:30.360 you out. So if you're doing if you need to 1:03:30.400 --> 1:03:32.360 save your energy for big lifts because you're trying to 1:03:32.360 --> 1:03:35.440 become like a Marvel superhero, you don't want to be 1:03:35.520 --> 1:03:38.160 running a lot and that also burns that also like 1:03:38.160 --> 1:03:40.560 gets in the way of building muscle, whereas walking uphill 1:03:40.960 --> 1:03:43.360 is great, it's not too strenuous, but that's like really 1:03:43.360 --> 1:03:44.360 the best way to burn fat. 1:03:44.440 --> 1:03:44.800 I love that. 1:03:44.840 --> 1:03:47.120 I also like the soul renewal. I feel like, you know, 1:03:47.840 --> 1:03:49.440 when I think about massages, I'm like, you're gonna do 1:03:49.480 --> 1:03:53.040 my feet right, So, but this is so easy, Like 1:03:53.720 --> 1:03:55.760 if you do pet they often say, roll your foot 1:03:55.760 --> 1:03:56.160 on a ball. 1:03:56.280 --> 1:03:58.080 Yeah, this is just rolling your foot on a ball. 1:03:58.160 --> 1:03:59.960 Not only does it make your feet feel better, which 1:04:00.000 --> 1:04:02.720 actually makes your whole, your whole walking around feel better, 1:04:02.720 --> 1:04:06.160 but it actually can calm you down. It's actually something 1:04:06.200 --> 1:04:07.720 that can sort of soothe your mind. 1:04:07.880 --> 1:04:09.560 Tim, I think we should get a collection of balls 1:04:09.560 --> 1:04:10.400 for our team. 1:04:10.800 --> 1:04:12.880 Okay, yeah, you think that'll work. 1:04:12.760 --> 1:04:13.760 To com you down? 1:04:13.920 --> 1:04:15.000 You think it'll do anything. 1:04:15.120 --> 1:04:16.760 No, we could just throw them, that's true. 1:04:16.920 --> 1:04:19.880 The idea of this package was there's so much information 1:04:19.960 --> 1:04:21.840 being thrown at us, like you guys said earlier, where 1:04:21.840 --> 1:04:26.240 there's like a million manosphere podcasts talking about sleep, about eating, 1:04:26.240 --> 1:04:28.480 about when you eat, about just every little supplement you 1:04:28.520 --> 1:04:30.320 should take, and there's so many supplements. And you know, 1:04:30.400 --> 1:04:34.120 BusinessWeek has covered Brian Johnson, the never Die guy who 1:04:34.200 --> 1:04:36.720 wants to have the sort of metabolism an eighteen year 1:04:36.760 --> 1:04:40.520 old and has like used his son's platelets injected into him. 1:04:40.520 --> 1:04:43.080 Like it gets really crazy and it gets really expensive, 1:04:43.120 --> 1:04:44.800 and so we were looking for things that are just 1:04:44.920 --> 1:04:47.280 easy that you can do that actually make a difference. 1:04:47.320 --> 1:04:50.280 That alone, to me, just men getting so involved. Like 1:04:50.400 --> 1:04:53.640 women we kind of have always been obsessive about this stuff, 1:04:53.840 --> 1:04:55.960 but men really getting into it and thinking about it. 1:04:56.040 --> 1:04:59.760 Yes, because it's very quantified, it's very it becomes a hobby, 1:05:01.120 --> 1:05:05.320 it's competitive. Yeah, it just has really like been attractive 1:05:05.320 --> 1:05:07.080 to men for a while. This for the past few years. 1:05:07.240 --> 1:05:09.000 Got another one that you like, well, I want I 1:05:09.440 --> 1:05:11.840 tease that we were talking a little bit about needles 1:05:11.880 --> 1:05:15.240 and the peptides thing kind of got my attention because 1:05:15.280 --> 1:05:19.240 in endurance athletics, this is getting attention right now too, 1:05:19.800 --> 1:05:23.280 along with like boosting testosterone, stuff that in the past 1:05:23.320 --> 1:05:26.000 has been sort of dubious in terms of like competitive 1:05:26.040 --> 1:05:28.840 rules and what has been allowed in terms of antidoping. 1:05:28.920 --> 1:05:29.960 What's up with peptides? 1:05:30.080 --> 1:05:33.240 So, Peptides are basically long strings of amino acids that 1:05:33.400 --> 1:05:35.520 tell your molecule, tell your cells what to do and 1:05:35.520 --> 1:05:39.120 how to behave and for so for like testosterone, for example, 1:05:39.480 --> 1:05:42.360 you know you used to get testosterone injected just like 1:05:42.400 --> 1:05:45.440 straight up testosterone. Now people are injecting things like cel 1:05:45.520 --> 1:05:48.160 morale and which tells your body to make testosterone, which 1:05:48.200 --> 1:05:51.040 actually is which is better because if you if your 1:05:51.080 --> 1:05:53.840 body gets used to getting testosterone injected, it won't make 1:05:53.880 --> 1:05:56.240 it on its own. So you know, there's there's peptides 1:05:56.280 --> 1:05:58.400 that will do everything for make your skin more tan, 1:05:59.640 --> 1:06:01.600 you know, make you sleep better at all this stuff, 1:06:01.640 --> 1:06:04.400 and then we go v and ozempic. Those are peptides. 1:06:04.640 --> 1:06:05.800 Which I did not know. 1:06:07.120 --> 1:06:08.400 That was kind of eye opening for me. 1:06:08.560 --> 1:06:10.479 So yeah, So there's a lot of kind of off 1:06:10.560 --> 1:06:12.640 label on label things that are going around, and the 1:06:12.640 --> 1:06:16.080 big most popular one is NAD or NAD plus. And 1:06:16.200 --> 1:06:18.880 doctors caution that when you're getting this from like an 1:06:18.920 --> 1:06:22.439 internet company that that you know has doctors, you still 1:06:22.480 --> 1:06:25.040 really don't necessarily know what you're getting if you're ordering 1:06:25.080 --> 1:06:28.600 this stuff online, especially if you're ordering it in a 1:06:28.880 --> 1:06:31.560 more even more sketchyway. So if you want to get 1:06:31.560 --> 1:06:33.280 into this stuff, definitely talk to a doctor who knows 1:06:33.280 --> 1:06:34.040 you and that you work with. 1:06:34.080 --> 1:06:35.720 What does the FDA say about all this? I mean, 1:06:35.720 --> 1:06:38.880 obviously with wegov and those the GLP ones, they're regulated, 1:06:38.920 --> 1:06:39.760 but I'm just curious. 1:06:39.880 --> 1:06:43.880 Yeah, because of changes in rules that happened during during COVID, 1:06:43.920 --> 1:06:46.840 basically where people can deliver this kind of stuff online, 1:06:47.000 --> 1:06:50.280 the regulation is a lot less It's just like a 1:06:50.280 --> 1:06:51.680 lot less tight. 1:06:51.760 --> 1:06:53.520 I was saying, about peptides, and I think because there's 1:06:53.520 --> 1:06:56.720 a lot of cosmetic stuff has peptides, right, yeah, yeah, 1:06:56.760 --> 1:06:58.440 so this is maybe like just injecting what. 1:06:59.400 --> 1:07:04.720 Speaking of, how do we tighten up that face? I 1:07:04.760 --> 1:07:07.440 didn't know you could do these massages or these sculps 1:07:07.480 --> 1:07:09.360 that actually make your face look different. I thought it 1:07:09.440 --> 1:07:11.280 was like, I thought we all had to go the 1:07:11.920 --> 1:07:14.760 what's who's the who's the Kardashian who got the amazing 1:07:15.960 --> 1:07:16.680 plane facial? 1:07:16.840 --> 1:07:19.880 Yeah, that's what Chris Chris Jenner. Okay, that is not 1:07:19.960 --> 1:07:21.480 a big cheat, that's not a little cheap. 1:07:21.520 --> 1:07:22.680 Okay, because that's extensive. 1:07:22.760 --> 1:07:28.080 That's like face off from John Travoltage level. What we're 1:07:28.120 --> 1:07:30.160 talking about is a fashion facial, which is when you 1:07:30.200 --> 1:07:34.040 go in and somebody basically massages the face, your face, 1:07:34.120 --> 1:07:36.960 and the fascia is the is the lining of your muscles, 1:07:37.280 --> 1:07:40.800 and they can kind of rearrange how your face is 1:07:41.280 --> 1:07:43.080 and uh, you know, if you have a big event 1:07:43.280 --> 1:07:44.880 or like your wedding or something, you can go in 1:07:44.920 --> 1:07:46.800 and for a couple of days it'll look snatched. 1:07:47.200 --> 1:07:48.760 Come on, now I'm gonna watch I'm gonna be looking 1:07:48.760 --> 1:07:50.760 over at Tim. He's gonna be like doing these weird things. 1:07:50.680 --> 1:07:53.760 To apparently they also like you can put on gloves 1:07:53.760 --> 1:07:55.440 and massage you're inside your mouth. 1:07:55.680 --> 1:07:58.160 Yeah, that's part of it. Yeah yeah, and that can 1:07:58.200 --> 1:08:00.360 also help with like if you have pain with TMJ 1:08:00.480 --> 1:08:01.080 and stuff like that. 1:08:01.160 --> 1:08:03.600 Okay, all right, well listen, sometimes an old thing is 1:08:03.640 --> 1:08:06.120 actually good. Maybe not, you don't feel that way about 1:08:06.120 --> 1:08:07.800 your body in your face, but when it comes to 1:08:08.800 --> 1:08:11.000 warn barber jackets. 1:08:10.600 --> 1:08:13.560 Oh yeah, so this is it's fall. Fall was late 1:08:13.560 --> 1:08:15.800 to arrive in New York City, but it finally came 1:08:15.840 --> 1:08:18.120 and it's cool, and that means it's barbera coat season, 1:08:18.240 --> 1:08:22.799 which is all the finance bros and gals and and 1:08:23.040 --> 1:08:23.760 my mom. 1:08:25.120 --> 1:08:28.240 Throw on their Chris Guilty at Barbara coats. 1:08:29.000 --> 1:08:32.200 And you know, I always remind my friends every fall 1:08:32.240 --> 1:08:34.200 that you can get your barber coat rewax. So barber 1:08:34.280 --> 1:08:37.360 coat is like a wax cotton mostly waterproof jacket that 1:08:37.400 --> 1:08:39.599 people used to wear for hunting in like the UK, 1:08:39.720 --> 1:08:42.559 Prince Charles is always wearing one, or King Charles rather, 1:08:43.160 --> 1:08:45.920 and uh, so you can get it rewax so that 1:08:46.040 --> 1:08:48.519 it will last longer. And people keep on these coats 1:08:48.600 --> 1:08:51.280 for decades because they you can sort of you can 1:08:51.400 --> 1:08:53.439 keep re upping the waxing and they last, and then 1:08:53.479 --> 1:08:55.479 the longer that you've had it, the better it looks. 1:08:55.479 --> 1:08:58.120 It's like worn in, it's got this great patina. So 1:08:58.160 --> 1:09:00.719 I started looking at other companies that sort of offer 1:09:00.760 --> 1:09:03.760 those services so that your clothes can age and look 1:09:03.800 --> 1:09:04.479 cool and old. 1:09:04.800 --> 1:09:05.000 Yeah. 1:09:05.080 --> 1:09:08.599 Well, speaking of that, you talk about how increasingly gen 1:09:08.720 --> 1:09:12.120 Z is looking for stuff that is aged and well worn, 1:09:12.200 --> 1:09:14.559 this idea that it's been loved in the past, and 1:09:14.760 --> 1:09:18.080 Barber is actually getting in on that by buying back 1:09:18.120 --> 1:09:20.360 old coats and fixing them up and reselling them. 1:09:20.479 --> 1:09:20.679 Yeah. 1:09:20.720 --> 1:09:23.400 So if your coat has gotten too worn and you 1:09:23.400 --> 1:09:26.160 don't want you don't want it anymore, I really want 1:09:26.160 --> 1:09:28.439 to start over. They'll buy it back for you and 1:09:28.439 --> 1:09:31.880 give you a store credit, and they'll deconstruct the coat 1:09:31.920 --> 1:09:34.360 and they'll reuse it for other coats. And so now 1:09:34.400 --> 1:09:36.519 they sell They have a whole reloved program where they'll 1:09:36.560 --> 1:09:38.800 sell coats that are kind of patched up, mixed in 1:09:38.880 --> 1:09:41.640 match coats. Sometimes they have the tartan pattern on the outside. 1:09:41.720 --> 1:09:44.320 They can look really funky, and they sell them at 1:09:44.320 --> 1:09:46.799 a lower price because they're you know, sort of recycled items, 1:09:46.880 --> 1:09:50.240 upcycled items, and gen Z really likes that and they 1:09:50.240 --> 1:09:52.559 find that they get a lot of younger shoppers coming into. 1:09:52.680 --> 1:09:54.559 But I was surprised that you say the prices start 1:09:54.560 --> 1:09:55.880 at like three twenty five, so they're. 1:09:55.760 --> 1:09:56.800 Not like they're not cheap. 1:09:56.800 --> 1:10:01.200 They're not cheap like even the recycled I have to say, but. 1:10:01.160 --> 1:10:03.240 That's like a Patagonia cos I mean, that's what a jagger. 1:10:03.360 --> 1:10:05.759 No exactly exactly, but I see that in a younger generation. 1:10:05.800 --> 1:10:08.040 I see with my daughter, like she likes to go 1:10:08.280 --> 1:10:11.600 whether it's consignment or like stuff that's been already a 1:10:11.600 --> 1:10:13.360 little bit around the block and a little bit of 1:10:13.360 --> 1:10:13.840 weird and tear in. 1:10:13.920 --> 1:10:15.280 Some things are sometimes really nice. 1:10:15.360 --> 1:10:17.680 Well, you think about resale sites, which are huge, and 1:10:17.720 --> 1:10:19.000 for a long time it was like I got to 1:10:19.000 --> 1:10:21.080 find things that are in mint condition on the real reel, 1:10:21.160 --> 1:10:22.880 Like I want this bag that looks like no one 1:10:22.960 --> 1:10:24.800 uses it and it's changing a bit, and now it's 1:10:24.880 --> 1:10:26.280 now it's like, oh, I want to find something that 1:10:26.320 --> 1:10:28.639 looks like it's been loved and it's been worn, because 1:10:28.640 --> 1:10:30.680 we always want, you know, our geans to look kind 1:10:30.680 --> 1:10:33.120 of beat up. But if you get genes from a 1:10:33.160 --> 1:10:35.639 store that are like pre beat up, it looks really fake. 1:10:35.760 --> 1:10:37.800 It looks like a factory someone went and scratched, like 1:10:37.800 --> 1:10:40.640 the lines in the lap. But if you go to Levi's, 1:10:40.840 --> 1:10:43.679 they buy back jeans and then they resell old jeans 1:10:43.720 --> 1:10:46.080 and like, what's better than a beat up pair of Levi's, Like, 1:10:46.320 --> 1:10:48.920 and you know, gen zs and younger people are really 1:10:48.920 --> 1:10:50.800 into that and really good for the environment as well, 1:10:50.880 --> 1:10:52.960 and that's part of it. They're very into sustainability. 1:10:53.920 --> 1:10:56.679 Didn't you just buy a recycled, not recycled, an old 1:10:56.720 --> 1:10:58.360 watch and you actually said? 1:10:58.400 --> 1:11:01.160 Yes, I love this. As we wrap up here, one. 1:11:01.080 --> 1:11:05.320 Of my favorite watches is this old Gerard Parago triple calendar, 1:11:05.920 --> 1:11:07.400 which is a very old fashioned kind of watch, and 1:11:07.760 --> 1:11:10.000 the like the day and the date are so tiny 1:11:10.000 --> 1:11:12.720 it's hard to read, but it looks great and I 1:11:13.040 --> 1:11:14.840 h and I got it fixed up because it was 1:11:15.040 --> 1:11:16.760 parts of it weren't working, and they were like, okay, 1:11:16.840 --> 1:11:18.360 do you want us to polish it and make it, 1:11:18.400 --> 1:11:20.080 you know, make it new and replace the gold here 1:11:20.080 --> 1:11:22.800 and I was like, no, do not polish it. I 1:11:22.840 --> 1:11:24.920 want it exactly as it was. I just want it 1:11:24.960 --> 1:11:27.040 to work. And that's a thing in watches now, people 1:11:27.080 --> 1:11:28.760 want it. They don't want things polished, they don't want 1:11:28.760 --> 1:11:31.240 things updated. They want it to be exactly as it was. 1:11:31.520 --> 1:11:33.600 Let the record show Chris is wearing not one, but 1:11:33.680 --> 1:11:37.679 two watches right now, the the Analog on his left 1:11:37.680 --> 1:11:39.960 wrist and the Apple Watch Digital on his right. 1:11:40.000 --> 1:11:40.200 Risk. 1:11:40.240 --> 1:11:42.000 It just wants to be balanced. That's what it's all about. 1:11:42.760 --> 1:11:44.800 Love these cheets, Love you, Chris, Thank you so much. 1:11:44.840 --> 1:11:48.400 Really appreciate it, really appreciate it. Bloomberg Pursuits Editor at Large, 1:11:48.479 --> 1:11:49.800 Chris Rouser. 1:11:49.720 --> 1:11:52.000 And that wraps up the weekend edition of Bloomberg Business 1:11:52.000 --> 1:11:54.200 Week from Bloomberg Radio. Thanks so much for joining us. 1:11:54.240 --> 1:11:56.360 You showed a tune into Bloomberg Business Week daily Monday 1:11:56.360 --> 1:11:58.280 through Friday, starting it to be on Wall Street Time, 1:11:58.280 --> 1:12:01.479 on Bloomberg TV, Bloomberg Radio, and on Serious Sixtem Channel 1:12:01.479 --> 1:12:03.840 one twenty one. You can listen to us an Apple 1:12:03.880 --> 1:12:06.840 CarPlay and Android Auto. It is free in the Apple 1:12:06.840 --> 1:12:08.479 app Store or on Google Play. 1:12:08.640 --> 1:12:10.960 You can also watch our daily broadcast on YouTube. Just 1:12:11.000 --> 1:12:15.200 search Bloomberg Podcasts and we're simulcast on Bloomberg Originals available 1:12:15.200 --> 1:12:19.320 at Bloomberg dot com, Slash Originals, and streaming platforms like Roku, Amazon, 1:12:19.320 --> 1:12:21.679 fireTV Samsung TV Plus and more. 1:12:21.720 --> 1:12:24.920 Find our Bloomberg Business Weekdaily Podcast at Bloomberg dot com, Apple, 1:12:25.040 --> 1:12:27.640 or wherever you get your podcasts. The latest edition to 1:12:27.720 --> 1:12:30.479 magazine available on newsstands now, at Bloomberg dot com and 1:12:30.680 --> 1:12:33.720 always on the Bloomberg Terminal. I'm Carol Masser and. 1:12:33.680 --> 1:12:36.240 I'm Tim Steneveek. Have a good and safe weekend everyone. 1:12:36.960 --> 1:12:42.320 This is the Bloomberg BusinessWeek Daily Podcast, available on Apple, Spotify, 1:12:42.439 --> 1:12:46.160 and anywhere else you get your podcasts. Listen live weekday 1:12:46.200 --> 1:12:50.120 afternoons from two to five pm Eastern on Bloomberg dot com, 1:12:50.240 --> 1:12:54.160 the iHeartRadio app, tune In, and the Bloomberg Business App. 1:12:54.360 --> 1:12:57.320 You can also watch us live every weekday on YouTube 1:12:57.360 --> 1:12:59.519 and always on the Bloomberg Terminal