1 00:00:06,600 --> 00:00:10,280 Speaker 1: Welcome to Creature Future production of I Heart Radio. I'm 2 00:00:10,360 --> 00:00:14,160 Speaker 1: your host of Many Parasites, Katie Golden. I studied psychology 3 00:00:14,200 --> 00:00:17,480 Speaker 1: and evolutionary biology, and today on the show, but do 4 00:00:18,280 --> 00:00:23,680 Speaker 1: it's listener questions. I love answering your animal biology questions, 5 00:00:23,720 --> 00:00:27,240 Speaker 1: and you guys are so good at asking them. If 6 00:00:27,360 --> 00:00:30,000 Speaker 1: you have any questions to ask that you'd like to 7 00:00:30,040 --> 00:00:33,280 Speaker 1: hear answered on the podcast, please send them to Creature 8 00:00:33,360 --> 00:00:37,440 Speaker 1: Feature Pod at gmail dot com. Next week we're gonna 9 00:00:37,520 --> 00:00:40,839 Speaker 1: have a regular episode, but for now, enjoyed the soothing, 10 00:00:41,000 --> 00:00:45,120 Speaker 1: relaxing tones of a casual but well researched Q and 11 00:00:45,200 --> 00:00:49,360 Speaker 1: A about animals. So I love this batch of questions 12 00:00:49,479 --> 00:00:51,960 Speaker 1: very much. You guys are just so Yeah. I'm so 13 00:00:52,000 --> 00:00:55,040 Speaker 1: proud of you all. You ask such amazing questions that 14 00:00:55,120 --> 00:00:59,240 Speaker 1: always sends me on a great research tunnel and are 15 00:00:59,360 --> 00:01:02,320 Speaker 1: things that, like I am really excited to address on 16 00:01:02,320 --> 00:01:06,399 Speaker 1: the show. So let us start with this first one, 17 00:01:06,640 --> 00:01:13,080 Speaker 1: which is from Senor Moderna on Twitter, who asks what 18 00:01:13,360 --> 00:01:17,320 Speaker 1: is the weirdest, creepiest science fiction eye story or behavior 19 00:01:17,440 --> 00:01:21,240 Speaker 1: you know about any animal ever? So this is a 20 00:01:21,400 --> 00:01:24,039 Speaker 1: hard one because there are so many it's hard for 21 00:01:24,080 --> 00:01:26,520 Speaker 1: me to pick my favorites, but I'll just go through 22 00:01:26,560 --> 00:01:30,959 Speaker 1: a few that came to mind. I mean, creepiest science 23 00:01:31,000 --> 00:01:34,800 Speaker 1: fiction e ish I think has to go to the parasites. 24 00:01:34,920 --> 00:01:40,040 Speaker 1: Like any number of parasites, they're always so incredible and weird. 25 00:01:40,560 --> 00:01:45,040 Speaker 1: So there are parasites that control their hosts brains, like 26 00:01:45,280 --> 00:01:50,160 Speaker 1: the parasitoid wasp larva that infects or weaver spider brains 27 00:01:50,280 --> 00:01:54,400 Speaker 1: and causes them to become mindless zombies. That's been a 28 00:01:54,480 --> 00:01:58,600 Speaker 1: nice little cocoon for the parasite larva. And then the 29 00:01:58,640 --> 00:02:02,120 Speaker 1: spider dies and the parasites suck all their juices out 30 00:02:02,200 --> 00:02:06,240 Speaker 1: and just chucks their dead descated body out and goes 31 00:02:06,320 --> 00:02:10,160 Speaker 1: to sleep in their little little cocoon that the poor 32 00:02:10,240 --> 00:02:13,200 Speaker 1: zombie spider had to weave for them. So that it's 33 00:02:13,240 --> 00:02:16,279 Speaker 1: just so interesting to me that you have this very 34 00:02:16,320 --> 00:02:20,800 Speaker 1: relatively simple animal like a wasp, and I mean especially 35 00:02:20,800 --> 00:02:24,000 Speaker 1: the larva, and it has some kind of chemicals that 36 00:02:24,120 --> 00:02:28,800 Speaker 1: manages to hijack the orb weaver spider's brain and make 37 00:02:28,840 --> 00:02:32,640 Speaker 1: it we've a little crib for it, and it's just 38 00:02:32,720 --> 00:02:36,240 Speaker 1: it's so insidious. It's so fascinating, very very sci fi 39 00:02:36,360 --> 00:02:40,960 Speaker 1: to me too. Um there's also the head bursting fungus 40 00:02:41,240 --> 00:02:43,080 Speaker 1: court of Steps, and I think we've mentioned this a 41 00:02:43,080 --> 00:02:47,280 Speaker 1: few times on the show. It's really fascinating. It infects 42 00:02:47,320 --> 00:02:51,560 Speaker 1: Aunt's other insects, arthropods. It causes them to wander around 43 00:02:51,560 --> 00:02:55,040 Speaker 1: like zombies before clamping down on a branch with their 44 00:02:55,120 --> 00:02:59,120 Speaker 1: mandibles so the parasitic fungus can grow right out of 45 00:02:59,120 --> 00:03:02,160 Speaker 1: their heads and at least more parasitic spores. So that 46 00:03:02,360 --> 00:03:07,679 Speaker 1: is very to me horror movie, science fiction zombie movie esque. 47 00:03:07,720 --> 00:03:10,040 Speaker 1: In fact, I think um so like in the Last 48 00:03:10,080 --> 00:03:13,400 Speaker 1: of Us that video game, they use Cortoceps as the 49 00:03:13,440 --> 00:03:17,960 Speaker 1: fungus that turns everyone into zombies. I think in I 50 00:03:18,000 --> 00:03:22,360 Speaker 1: think it's called Cargo. It's a zombie movie where I 51 00:03:22,360 --> 00:03:25,840 Speaker 1: think the I think it's a parasitic fungus or something, 52 00:03:25,919 --> 00:03:29,799 Speaker 1: and then it makes people stick their heads under the 53 00:03:29,840 --> 00:03:35,440 Speaker 1: ground as the scores start to develop in like in 54 00:03:35,480 --> 00:03:38,840 Speaker 1: their brains, and which reminds me a lot of the courtoceps, 55 00:03:38,840 --> 00:03:42,400 Speaker 1: because these insects, like their last act is to bite 56 00:03:42,400 --> 00:03:45,240 Speaker 1: down on a branch their mannible so that the fungus 57 00:03:45,240 --> 00:03:48,120 Speaker 1: has a secure place to grow, which is really messed 58 00:03:48,160 --> 00:03:52,680 Speaker 1: up and really interesting. The ocean also has some really 59 00:03:52,720 --> 00:03:57,400 Speaker 1: incredible sci fi type animals. In terms of the creepier ones, 60 00:03:57,640 --> 00:04:03,640 Speaker 1: there is a microscopic parasite called salmoncola that infects It 61 00:04:03,720 --> 00:04:06,880 Speaker 1: sounds like a beverage, doesn't salmonacola sounds like some kind 62 00:04:06,880 --> 00:04:10,360 Speaker 1: of like coca cola, Like like there's cherry coke and 63 00:04:10,400 --> 00:04:14,240 Speaker 1: then there's salmon flavored coke. But no, it is a 64 00:04:14,280 --> 00:04:18,240 Speaker 1: parasite that infects salmon and directly feeds off of their 65 00:04:18,320 --> 00:04:21,880 Speaker 1: A t P. So a TP is the most basic 66 00:04:22,040 --> 00:04:26,600 Speaker 1: unit of energy that living creatures use. It is produced 67 00:04:26,680 --> 00:04:34,040 Speaker 1: from respiration. And so the fact that these Salminicola parasites 68 00:04:34,120 --> 00:04:36,800 Speaker 1: feed directly on the A t P. They actually do 69 00:04:36,880 --> 00:04:40,960 Speaker 1: not have any mitochondria and they don't breathe. So they're 70 00:04:41,000 --> 00:04:45,440 Speaker 1: the only animal known in the world that does not 71 00:04:45,640 --> 00:04:50,000 Speaker 1: breathe and doesn't use some kind of form of respiration. 72 00:04:50,160 --> 00:04:56,600 Speaker 1: So they look like alien sperm to uh be blunt. 73 00:04:56,720 --> 00:04:59,240 Speaker 1: They are shaped like sperm. And then they have these 74 00:04:59,279 --> 00:05:01,760 Speaker 1: two ice bots that kind of you know, they look 75 00:05:01,839 --> 00:05:04,680 Speaker 1: like the classic like gray alien kind of thing with 76 00:05:04,720 --> 00:05:06,960 Speaker 1: the with the big eyes. You know, you know what 77 00:05:07,000 --> 00:05:10,760 Speaker 1: I'm talking about, Like any kind of alien logo. It 78 00:05:10,800 --> 00:05:13,839 Speaker 1: just looks exactly like that, except attached to a little 79 00:05:13,880 --> 00:05:17,280 Speaker 1: a little sperm tail. And those eye spots are not 80 00:05:17,440 --> 00:05:20,960 Speaker 1: eyes at all. They are actually old stinger cells from 81 00:05:21,000 --> 00:05:25,960 Speaker 1: their ancestors, who were probably a more jellyfish like animal. Uh. 82 00:05:26,000 --> 00:05:31,320 Speaker 1: Salmon Cola shares the same phylum as jellyfish of Nideria, 83 00:05:32,360 --> 00:05:34,760 Speaker 1: so these are probably some kind of thing that like 84 00:05:34,839 --> 00:05:37,920 Speaker 1: started out as a sort of jellyfish like like Nigerian, 85 00:05:38,160 --> 00:05:41,479 Speaker 1: and then just lost a bunch of features so that 86 00:05:41,520 --> 00:05:46,560 Speaker 1: they could become these little microscopic parasites on salmon. They 87 00:05:46,560 --> 00:05:49,800 Speaker 1: now use those stinging cells that look like alien eyes, 88 00:05:50,320 --> 00:05:54,320 Speaker 1: not to sting, but to actually latch onto the salmon tissue. 89 00:05:55,040 --> 00:05:59,360 Speaker 1: And another cool thing is they glow green under fluorescent lights. 90 00:05:59,400 --> 00:06:03,200 Speaker 1: So they are I think the most alien looking and 91 00:06:03,240 --> 00:06:07,320 Speaker 1: most alien acting, creepy little parasitic animal that I know of. 92 00:06:07,720 --> 00:06:11,679 Speaker 1: They look like cartoonish aliens and they don't breathe, which 93 00:06:11,760 --> 00:06:17,960 Speaker 1: is completely bizarre. So we're going to take a quick 94 00:06:18,080 --> 00:06:21,080 Speaker 1: break and I will be right back to answer more 95 00:06:21,080 --> 00:06:30,119 Speaker 1: of your listener questions. All right, and I am back, 96 00:06:30,160 --> 00:06:34,040 Speaker 1: and I'm really excited about this question. This is from 97 00:06:34,200 --> 00:06:40,240 Speaker 1: Jamie wrote Farthing on Twitter, who asks how domesticated. Our cats, 98 00:06:40,760 --> 00:06:45,400 Speaker 1: aren't they technically counted as a domesticated species. All I 99 00:06:45,520 --> 00:06:47,400 Speaker 1: know is that they will cuddle in my lap and 100 00:06:47,400 --> 00:06:51,359 Speaker 1: then bite my face when they're hungry. Oh, cats, the 101 00:06:51,600 --> 00:06:55,359 Speaker 1: cuddly little demons who sometimes allow us to be in 102 00:06:55,400 --> 00:07:00,320 Speaker 1: their presence and feed them. So they are indeed domestic hated. 103 00:07:00,400 --> 00:07:03,760 Speaker 1: They are a separate species of animal from their wild 104 00:07:03,839 --> 00:07:07,719 Speaker 1: counterparts that have been tamed and adapted to live as 105 00:07:07,800 --> 00:07:12,880 Speaker 1: pets to humans. But you are absolutely correct, Jamie, and 106 00:07:13,040 --> 00:07:17,200 Speaker 1: noting that they are still really wild. So unlike dogs, 107 00:07:17,360 --> 00:07:21,760 Speaker 1: cats are not too dissimilar genetically from their wild counterparts. 108 00:07:22,120 --> 00:07:25,800 Speaker 1: It actually turns out that their natural wild behaviors, like 109 00:07:26,080 --> 00:07:30,640 Speaker 1: chasing mice suited humans really well. Like when we started 110 00:07:30,640 --> 00:07:33,680 Speaker 1: to have a grarian societies where we would store grain, 111 00:07:33,720 --> 00:07:36,560 Speaker 1: and we started to get mice and rats all in 112 00:07:36,640 --> 00:07:39,520 Speaker 1: our business eating up our food, and cats came in 113 00:07:39,560 --> 00:07:42,040 Speaker 1: as like, we will take care of these mice and rats, 114 00:07:42,040 --> 00:07:43,640 Speaker 1: and hey, if you could give us a dish of 115 00:07:43,640 --> 00:07:46,000 Speaker 1: milk every so often, we'd be cool with that. And 116 00:07:46,040 --> 00:07:49,320 Speaker 1: so we formed a partnership with cat, cat and human 117 00:07:49,800 --> 00:07:54,000 Speaker 1: joining hand and paw to dominate the world. So they 118 00:07:54,040 --> 00:07:58,400 Speaker 1: did adapt through selective breeding to be less scared and 119 00:07:58,480 --> 00:08:02,040 Speaker 1: more tolerant of human you know, interacting with them, petting 120 00:08:02,080 --> 00:08:05,240 Speaker 1: them without getting our faces scratched off. For the most part, 121 00:08:05,960 --> 00:08:10,280 Speaker 1: dogs meanwhile, have made an incredible transformation from a wolf 122 00:08:10,360 --> 00:08:13,400 Speaker 1: like ancestor who if you met, would definitely try to 123 00:08:13,480 --> 00:08:16,760 Speaker 1: rip your face off into the sweet, lovable goofs that 124 00:08:16,840 --> 00:08:21,480 Speaker 1: we know today. They were far more transformed to fit 125 00:08:21,520 --> 00:08:25,400 Speaker 1: our human society than cats had to go through. Also, 126 00:08:25,920 --> 00:08:29,480 Speaker 1: one thing to note is that cats don't have in 127 00:08:29,560 --> 00:08:32,880 Speaker 1: general the floppy ears like I think. There's the Scottish 128 00:08:32,920 --> 00:08:34,760 Speaker 1: fold is a breed of cat that has the fold 129 00:08:34,800 --> 00:08:39,120 Speaker 1: down ears, but they're quite rare. Most domesticated animals, on 130 00:08:39,160 --> 00:08:42,440 Speaker 1: the other hand, from dogs too, bunnies to pigs, have 131 00:08:42,679 --> 00:08:45,640 Speaker 1: those floppy ears because they've seen a loss of the 132 00:08:45,720 --> 00:08:50,040 Speaker 1: firmness of their ear cartilage through domestication. This is due 133 00:08:50,320 --> 00:08:56,120 Speaker 1: to the way that animals develop as embryos. So neural 134 00:08:56,320 --> 00:08:59,920 Speaker 1: crest cells are a group of cells in early embryonic 135 00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:04,319 Speaker 1: development that go on to differentiate into many different types 136 00:09:04,360 --> 00:09:09,760 Speaker 1: of cells, including cartilage melano sites which control for coloration. 137 00:09:10,240 --> 00:09:14,760 Speaker 1: There's smooth muscle, and also certain types of neurons including 138 00:09:14,800 --> 00:09:19,040 Speaker 1: those that comprise the adrenal medulla. To kind of grossly 139 00:09:19,120 --> 00:09:25,320 Speaker 1: generalize about the adrenal medulla, proportionally, larger adrenal medulla means 140 00:09:25,440 --> 00:09:29,480 Speaker 1: in general, a more aggressive or easily frightened animal, whereas 141 00:09:29,480 --> 00:09:34,000 Speaker 1: a smaller adrenal medulla a more chill animal. That's a 142 00:09:34,120 --> 00:09:36,920 Speaker 1: that's a big generalization, but you know, otherwise I'd have 143 00:09:36,960 --> 00:09:39,840 Speaker 1: to go into a lot more detail about the adrenal medulla, 144 00:09:40,000 --> 00:09:43,959 Speaker 1: and who has time for that. So fewer neural crust 145 00:09:44,080 --> 00:09:49,319 Speaker 1: cells in embryonic development means a less developed adrenal medulla, 146 00:09:49,960 --> 00:09:54,080 Speaker 1: which also just happens to mean also less cartilage, because, 147 00:09:54,679 --> 00:09:58,640 Speaker 1: as I mentioned earlier, those neural crust cells both develop 148 00:09:58,720 --> 00:10:04,160 Speaker 1: into cartilag millenna sites and also these adrenal mendula cells. 149 00:10:04,200 --> 00:10:08,480 Speaker 1: So it just so happens that because these cells differentiate 150 00:10:08,559 --> 00:10:11,080 Speaker 1: from the same cluster of cells, when you reduce that 151 00:10:11,440 --> 00:10:16,360 Speaker 1: cluster of original cells, it means both less cartilage and 152 00:10:16,520 --> 00:10:20,160 Speaker 1: smaller adrenal mendula. And it also means that the millenna sites, 153 00:10:20,240 --> 00:10:24,440 Speaker 1: the cells that control for coat coloration, are you know, 154 00:10:24,520 --> 00:10:28,360 Speaker 1: more blotchy and patchy. That's why domesticated dogs have these 155 00:10:28,400 --> 00:10:32,240 Speaker 1: little spots or patches on their fur, whereas wild wolves 156 00:10:32,240 --> 00:10:35,480 Speaker 1: do not. It also means that with less cartilage, the 157 00:10:35,640 --> 00:10:39,000 Speaker 1: ears flop over because there's less strong cartilage. And you 158 00:10:39,000 --> 00:10:42,840 Speaker 1: will notice that with cats, even though their ears aren't floppy, 159 00:10:42,960 --> 00:10:47,280 Speaker 1: their coats tend to be more more modeled and patchy 160 00:10:47,320 --> 00:10:51,200 Speaker 1: compared to their wild counterparts, which either can be they 161 00:10:51,280 --> 00:10:53,600 Speaker 1: can have spots, they can have stripes, but it's usually 162 00:10:53,880 --> 00:10:57,760 Speaker 1: pretty even even coding, whereas like you get calico cats 163 00:10:57,760 --> 00:10:59,920 Speaker 1: and stuff, where you have these like spotches of coloration. 164 00:11:00,000 --> 00:11:03,319 Speaker 1: So that's that's pretty interesting to me. So the reason 165 00:11:03,640 --> 00:11:07,360 Speaker 1: that cats did not go through as great of a 166 00:11:07,480 --> 00:11:11,120 Speaker 1: change from their wild counterparts to domesticated pets is just 167 00:11:11,200 --> 00:11:15,000 Speaker 1: simply that they didn't really need to. Their behaviors didn't 168 00:11:15,040 --> 00:11:18,439 Speaker 1: require such a great change as like wolves did. I mean, 169 00:11:18,760 --> 00:11:23,719 Speaker 1: interacting with a small, wild feral cat is a lot 170 00:11:23,800 --> 00:11:27,840 Speaker 1: less dangerous than interacting with a wild wolf, to kind 171 00:11:27,880 --> 00:11:30,160 Speaker 1: of put it in a simple way. But yeah, so 172 00:11:30,240 --> 00:11:33,520 Speaker 1: cats did not really take that much coaxing to become 173 00:11:33,559 --> 00:11:37,000 Speaker 1: a house cat. They that life for them was pretty good, 174 00:11:37,040 --> 00:11:39,240 Speaker 1: whereas wolves we had to go through a lot of 175 00:11:39,280 --> 00:11:44,360 Speaker 1: iterations to get to Chihuahua's Yeah, really, great question. Another 176 00:11:44,640 --> 00:11:49,320 Speaker 1: question from Twitter user eager Polcastra is to what extent 177 00:11:49,679 --> 00:11:55,040 Speaker 1: are domesticated animals responsible for the decrease of wildlife in 178 00:11:55,200 --> 00:11:59,520 Speaker 1: urban areas? So this is a really good question. Yes, 179 00:11:59,640 --> 00:12:03,160 Speaker 1: the mess ssticated animals can do a lot of harm 180 00:12:03,200 --> 00:12:08,720 Speaker 1: to indigenous species of animals and plants, especially in urban areas. 181 00:12:09,200 --> 00:12:14,160 Speaker 1: So cats are notorious bird killers. They actually kill one 182 00:12:14,240 --> 00:12:19,400 Speaker 1: to four billion birds globally every year. So if you 183 00:12:19,440 --> 00:12:22,120 Speaker 1: can keep your cat an indoor cat, that is going 184 00:12:22,160 --> 00:12:25,040 Speaker 1: to be much better for the environment. And you know, 185 00:12:25,120 --> 00:12:29,520 Speaker 1: definitely spaying newter your cat because they are wow doing 186 00:12:29,559 --> 00:12:33,560 Speaker 1: a doozy on the bird population. In fact, naughty kitties 187 00:12:33,640 --> 00:12:37,680 Speaker 1: have been the cause of thirty three extinctions worldwide, not 188 00:12:37,800 --> 00:12:41,800 Speaker 1: just of birds, but other animals such as rodents. Uh 189 00:12:41,840 --> 00:12:44,880 Speaker 1: like the key Largo wood rat in the Florida Keys. 190 00:12:45,120 --> 00:12:49,559 Speaker 1: So yeah, bad kitty, very bad. The dodo actually may 191 00:12:49,600 --> 00:12:53,080 Speaker 1: have gone extinct due to the cats, dogs, pigs, and 192 00:12:53,240 --> 00:12:58,240 Speaker 1: rats that came to the island Mauritius along with Dutch sailors. 193 00:12:58,280 --> 00:13:02,800 Speaker 1: So rats not exactly the domesticated by humans, but they 194 00:13:02,840 --> 00:13:07,880 Speaker 1: have definitely become adapters to in fact exploiters of human 195 00:13:07,960 --> 00:13:11,360 Speaker 1: society to thrive. But yeah, when those Dutch sailors came over, 196 00:13:11,400 --> 00:13:14,360 Speaker 1: they had ships that had cats and dogs and pigs, 197 00:13:14,880 --> 00:13:19,720 Speaker 1: and those either out competed the dodos or killed their chicks, 198 00:13:20,000 --> 00:13:22,480 Speaker 1: or killed the dodos themselves. I mean the Dutch also 199 00:13:22,559 --> 00:13:24,040 Speaker 1: killed some of the dodos. But yeah, it was a 200 00:13:24,080 --> 00:13:28,240 Speaker 1: combination of hunting the dodo but also these invasive species 201 00:13:28,280 --> 00:13:32,280 Speaker 1: of domesticated animals that really really spelled the end for 202 00:13:32,920 --> 00:13:38,240 Speaker 1: those lovable goofball birds. Livestock can also cause the endangerment 203 00:13:38,360 --> 00:13:44,040 Speaker 1: and possible extinction of species by grazing indigenous plants. And 204 00:13:44,080 --> 00:13:47,520 Speaker 1: if there is overgrazing of indigenous plants, those plants can 205 00:13:47,600 --> 00:13:52,800 Speaker 1: go extinct and endangered the wildlife that rely upon those plants. 206 00:13:52,960 --> 00:13:56,160 Speaker 1: So you know, like I always say, the ecosystem is 207 00:13:56,200 --> 00:13:58,520 Speaker 1: like a Jenga tower, and you just don't know what's 208 00:13:58,520 --> 00:14:00,400 Speaker 1: gonna happen when you take out one of those bricks. 209 00:14:01,080 --> 00:14:04,680 Speaker 1: I'm not good at Jengas, so you know, it's especially 210 00:14:04,679 --> 00:14:07,840 Speaker 1: bad in my case if I go around eating a 211 00:14:07,880 --> 00:14:11,960 Speaker 1: bunch of birds. Does that make sense anyways? Next question, 212 00:14:13,520 --> 00:14:17,480 Speaker 1: another question about pets. Uh. This is from Jess who 213 00:14:17,600 --> 00:14:21,440 Speaker 1: reached out to me at Creature Future Product gmail dot com. 214 00:14:21,520 --> 00:14:24,480 Speaker 1: Uh So, she writes, Hi, Katie, I'm a huge fan 215 00:14:24,560 --> 00:14:27,680 Speaker 1: in coming to you with a hard hitting guinea pig question. 216 00:14:28,240 --> 00:14:31,000 Speaker 1: As long as I can remember, they've been a staple 217 00:14:31,040 --> 00:14:34,840 Speaker 1: in elementary school classrooms and pet stores. How and when 218 00:14:34,920 --> 00:14:37,960 Speaker 1: did a rodent from Peru become such a common pet. 219 00:14:38,360 --> 00:14:41,600 Speaker 1: They have no discernible use, though I have attached some 220 00:14:41,760 --> 00:14:46,160 Speaker 1: empirical evidence of their undeniable appeal. Thanks so much. Your 221 00:14:46,200 --> 00:14:49,760 Speaker 1: podcast makes my compute to work so much better, Jess. 222 00:14:49,760 --> 00:14:52,040 Speaker 1: Thank you so much, Jess, and thank you for the 223 00:14:52,160 --> 00:14:55,560 Speaker 1: cute guinea pig pictures. I will always take cute pet 224 00:14:55,600 --> 00:15:02,320 Speaker 1: pictures any day, anytime, send them to me. So, Jess, 225 00:15:02,360 --> 00:15:05,640 Speaker 1: I do have some terrible news for you about your 226 00:15:05,680 --> 00:15:10,800 Speaker 1: guinea pig pals. So, guinea pigs came from the andies 227 00:15:10,840 --> 00:15:15,840 Speaker 1: of South America, and they are the domesticated relatives of 228 00:15:16,080 --> 00:15:21,600 Speaker 1: wild cavvies. So they were domesticated not as pets, but 229 00:15:21,720 --> 00:15:26,720 Speaker 1: as livestock to be eaten. So we mainly associate them 230 00:15:26,760 --> 00:15:30,280 Speaker 1: as pets in the US, but in South America they 231 00:15:30,320 --> 00:15:34,560 Speaker 1: are also food, much like rabbit. So in the city 232 00:15:34,720 --> 00:15:38,360 Speaker 1: of Whuacho, Peru, there is a guinea pig festival where 233 00:15:38,400 --> 00:15:42,360 Speaker 1: guinea pigs are dressed up in cute outfits and many 234 00:15:42,440 --> 00:15:47,480 Speaker 1: dishes featuring guinea pig meat are served. And if you 235 00:15:47,520 --> 00:15:51,600 Speaker 1: find that unsettling, you should check out any state fair 236 00:15:51,680 --> 00:15:54,200 Speaker 1: in the US that will have like a petting zoo 237 00:15:54,560 --> 00:15:57,880 Speaker 1: right next to a barbecue, or a cow and sheep 238 00:15:57,960 --> 00:16:02,600 Speaker 1: costume contest. Uh. It's really all a matter of which 239 00:16:02,640 --> 00:16:05,480 Speaker 1: animals we grew up thinking of as pets and which 240 00:16:05,520 --> 00:16:07,840 Speaker 1: we grew up thinking of as food, which is not 241 00:16:08,040 --> 00:16:13,880 Speaker 1: universal and not really based necessarily on on anything scientific. 242 00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:16,880 Speaker 1: You know, a guinea pig, I would say, is a 243 00:16:16,920 --> 00:16:20,680 Speaker 1: lot less intelligent than a pig, like, you know, a 244 00:16:20,760 --> 00:16:23,760 Speaker 1: hog pig that we eat in in all over the world. 245 00:16:23,760 --> 00:16:26,360 Speaker 1: But you know, people may be more horrified by a 246 00:16:26,400 --> 00:16:29,840 Speaker 1: little guinea pig being eaten than by bacon. It's all. 247 00:16:29,920 --> 00:16:33,040 Speaker 1: It's it's really interesting. It's like all this cultural perspective. 248 00:16:33,120 --> 00:16:37,000 Speaker 1: Although I remember when I went to the fair. It 249 00:16:37,080 --> 00:16:40,480 Speaker 1: was the Delmar Fair in San Diego where I grew up, 250 00:16:40,760 --> 00:16:44,600 Speaker 1: and I loved all the animals, and I found out 251 00:16:44,680 --> 00:16:49,040 Speaker 1: that these animals got sold uh for me, and I 252 00:16:49,080 --> 00:16:52,000 Speaker 1: was horrified. And that was a sad day in my 253 00:16:52,080 --> 00:16:54,200 Speaker 1: life to find that out, because I was like thinking like, oh, 254 00:16:54,240 --> 00:16:56,120 Speaker 1: I want to be in fourage and raise one of 255 00:16:56,200 --> 00:16:57,960 Speaker 1: these sheep, but then you have to give it away 256 00:16:58,200 --> 00:17:00,760 Speaker 1: to get eaten. And it's not like something that I 257 00:17:00,800 --> 00:17:03,240 Speaker 1: think is morally wrong. In fact, I think it's really 258 00:17:03,280 --> 00:17:06,000 Speaker 1: good for people to learn, like, hey, where the meat 259 00:17:06,080 --> 00:17:08,600 Speaker 1: comes from. Like, if you're gonna you're gonna eat meat, 260 00:17:08,760 --> 00:17:11,040 Speaker 1: it's better that you take care of the animal well 261 00:17:11,080 --> 00:17:14,440 Speaker 1: and understand like what goes into raising an animal properly. 262 00:17:14,800 --> 00:17:17,720 Speaker 1: But yeah, it is. It is kind of h It 263 00:17:17,800 --> 00:17:21,240 Speaker 1: was one of those shocking moments of like, oh yeah, okay, 264 00:17:21,320 --> 00:17:24,880 Speaker 1: it is. It is animals, it is sheep's in cute piggies. 265 00:17:25,119 --> 00:17:30,479 Speaker 1: Oh so yeah, very very interesting. Um, we're gonna take 266 00:17:31,200 --> 00:17:35,320 Speaker 1: another quick break and then we will be back with 267 00:17:35,560 --> 00:17:39,760 Speaker 1: just a few more of your listener questions. So hank tight, 268 00:17:41,720 --> 00:17:46,560 Speaker 1: we are back and uh here is a question from 269 00:17:46,760 --> 00:17:51,439 Speaker 1: Floyd Pollard who on Twitter who asks which bear is best? 270 00:17:51,800 --> 00:17:55,640 Speaker 1: So I gotta say sun Bear, no contest, longest tongue, 271 00:17:55,920 --> 00:17:59,439 Speaker 1: best bear tongue is almost a foot long. That bears 272 00:17:59,440 --> 00:18:04,920 Speaker 1: the winner. Next question, John John on Twitter asks why 273 00:18:04,960 --> 00:18:09,600 Speaker 1: are snails so slow. Shouldn't making the ground slippery underneath 274 00:18:09,640 --> 00:18:13,240 Speaker 1: them make them, you know, faster, So this is a 275 00:18:13,320 --> 00:18:18,160 Speaker 1: really interesting question. There's actually a recent snail study at 276 00:18:18,200 --> 00:18:22,920 Speaker 1: Stanford that seems to indicate that the snail slime their mucus. 277 00:18:23,359 --> 00:18:27,359 Speaker 1: It does help with snail locomotion, but it's not essential 278 00:18:27,600 --> 00:18:32,040 Speaker 1: or even the most important part of snail locomotion unless 279 00:18:32,119 --> 00:18:35,320 Speaker 1: the snail is traveling vertically, in which case the sticky 280 00:18:35,359 --> 00:18:38,600 Speaker 1: slime is very important because it allows the snail to 281 00:18:38,760 --> 00:18:43,920 Speaker 1: adhere to the surface. So snails move through a series 282 00:18:44,080 --> 00:18:48,159 Speaker 1: of muscle contractions on their foot, so that's that flat 283 00:18:48,280 --> 00:18:53,320 Speaker 1: base part of the snail. The mucus trail does help 284 00:18:53,400 --> 00:18:56,680 Speaker 1: with their movement because as you put pressure, while it's 285 00:18:56,760 --> 00:18:59,679 Speaker 1: very sticky, it seems like, well, how it's sticky, Like, 286 00:18:59,760 --> 00:19:01,960 Speaker 1: how can they move across it easily? It seems like 287 00:19:01,960 --> 00:19:04,560 Speaker 1: it would just like glue them down. But actually when 288 00:19:04,560 --> 00:19:08,880 Speaker 1: they put pressure on the mucus, it stops being sticky 289 00:19:08,960 --> 00:19:12,680 Speaker 1: and actually goes from being sticky to becoming a slick fluid. 290 00:19:12,760 --> 00:19:18,359 Speaker 1: So that's a really important interesting physical property of the 291 00:19:18,800 --> 00:19:22,560 Speaker 1: snail slime. Like if you've ever um experimented with like 292 00:19:22,600 --> 00:19:25,520 Speaker 1: these sort of different different fluids, Like there's the um 293 00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:28,199 Speaker 1: what's it called, Like you bleck the the when you 294 00:19:28,280 --> 00:19:31,520 Speaker 1: mix corn starch and water, and it's like this um 295 00:19:31,680 --> 00:19:34,840 Speaker 1: non Newtonian fluid. And you can see, like difference in 296 00:19:34,920 --> 00:19:38,520 Speaker 1: pressure actually causes some fluids to change differently. So like 297 00:19:38,560 --> 00:19:41,080 Speaker 1: when you mix when you mix corn starch with water 298 00:19:41,200 --> 00:19:43,080 Speaker 1: and then you like slap it with your hand, like 299 00:19:43,119 --> 00:19:46,880 Speaker 1: you have a high velocity pressure on the fluid, then 300 00:19:47,080 --> 00:19:50,080 Speaker 1: it actually becomes firm more like a solid, whereas like 301 00:19:50,119 --> 00:19:52,760 Speaker 1: if you slowly put your hand in, it behaves like 302 00:19:52,800 --> 00:19:55,760 Speaker 1: a liquid. So I'm not sure that the same like 303 00:19:55,840 --> 00:19:58,000 Speaker 1: it's not going to be the same exact reasons why 304 00:19:58,160 --> 00:20:00,560 Speaker 1: snail slime changes property when you put pressure on it. 305 00:20:00,560 --> 00:20:04,080 Speaker 1: It's just an example of like how a liquid um 306 00:20:04,280 --> 00:20:08,480 Speaker 1: can change its physical property depending on the pressure that 307 00:20:08,520 --> 00:20:10,520 Speaker 1: you put on it. So the snail there's not that 308 00:20:10,600 --> 00:20:12,919 Speaker 1: much pressure on it, it's sticky. It can help the 309 00:20:12,960 --> 00:20:16,000 Speaker 1: snail cling to surfaces or crawl up surfaces. And if 310 00:20:16,040 --> 00:20:18,399 Speaker 1: the snail puts pressure on it, it becomes slick so 311 00:20:18,520 --> 00:20:22,040 Speaker 1: it can slide across it. But yeah, this this Stanford 312 00:20:22,080 --> 00:20:25,080 Speaker 1: study found that even in the absence of mucus, the 313 00:20:25,119 --> 00:20:28,840 Speaker 1: snails can still move, so it really is those muscle 314 00:20:28,880 --> 00:20:32,960 Speaker 1: contractions that is doing the mean force of movement for them, 315 00:20:33,000 --> 00:20:37,120 Speaker 1: although the mucus does help them go along. In terms 316 00:20:37,119 --> 00:20:42,240 Speaker 1: of why they're so slow, basically forming a wave movement 317 00:20:42,359 --> 00:20:46,280 Speaker 1: with this very small squishy muscles along the foot of 318 00:20:46,320 --> 00:20:48,800 Speaker 1: the snail isn't going to get them going very fast, 319 00:20:48,840 --> 00:20:52,760 Speaker 1: no matter how well lubricated they are. So that's the 320 00:20:52,880 --> 00:20:55,560 Speaker 1: mechanics of why they're slow. They just they simply don't 321 00:20:55,600 --> 00:20:59,320 Speaker 1: have like the muscle uh to get them going that fast, 322 00:20:59,359 --> 00:21:01,480 Speaker 1: and they don't have the surface area on their foot 323 00:21:01,520 --> 00:21:04,440 Speaker 1: to get them going that fast. Um. The reason they 324 00:21:04,440 --> 00:21:07,480 Speaker 1: have not evolved to be faster is that they don't 325 00:21:07,600 --> 00:21:11,600 Speaker 1: really need to. Their shells offer them the protection that 326 00:21:11,720 --> 00:21:16,000 Speaker 1: running away otherwise would, so instead of running, they have 327 00:21:16,080 --> 00:21:20,400 Speaker 1: developed the strategy of hiding in their shells and so 328 00:21:20,520 --> 00:21:23,760 Speaker 1: they don't actually have to be fast to escape predators, 329 00:21:23,760 --> 00:21:26,720 Speaker 1: and they also don't have to be fast to eat. 330 00:21:26,760 --> 00:21:30,840 Speaker 1: There they're chosen food, which is vegetation and leaves. But 331 00:21:31,040 --> 00:21:35,439 Speaker 1: there is actually a faster snail. So the fastest land 332 00:21:35,560 --> 00:21:39,800 Speaker 1: crawling snail in the world is the marine plow snail, 333 00:21:40,160 --> 00:21:43,080 Speaker 1: which can crawl at a breakneck speed of two point 334 00:21:43,119 --> 00:21:47,120 Speaker 1: five centimeters a second doesn't sound super impressive, but when 335 00:21:47,160 --> 00:21:49,960 Speaker 1: you look at videos of these snails booking it, it 336 00:21:50,040 --> 00:21:52,320 Speaker 1: is kind of surprising because you are not used to 337 00:21:52,320 --> 00:21:55,600 Speaker 1: snails moving that fast. The reason they can go so 338 00:21:55,680 --> 00:21:59,720 Speaker 1: fast that it has an unusually wide flat foot. So 339 00:22:00,000 --> 00:22:03,200 Speaker 1: and the foot of the snail is just like that flat, 340 00:22:03,520 --> 00:22:05,560 Speaker 1: you know, its main body like where you see that 341 00:22:05,640 --> 00:22:08,240 Speaker 1: that flat thing that is what makes the slime and 342 00:22:08,280 --> 00:22:11,840 Speaker 1: what what moves along um. But for these the plow snail, 343 00:22:11,880 --> 00:22:16,119 Speaker 1: it's really wide. It almost looks like wings, and it 344 00:22:16,560 --> 00:22:20,320 Speaker 1: can use this to like physically push itself and undulate 345 00:22:20,480 --> 00:22:22,879 Speaker 1: kind of like it's doing, you know, the worm dance 346 00:22:22,920 --> 00:22:25,720 Speaker 1: move to get along, and it this will because it 347 00:22:25,760 --> 00:22:28,399 Speaker 1: has this greater surface area where it can use its 348 00:22:28,440 --> 00:22:32,240 Speaker 1: muscles to like basically shove itself and flop along. It 349 00:22:32,280 --> 00:22:36,600 Speaker 1: actually gets to go a lot faster than um are 350 00:22:36,760 --> 00:22:41,760 Speaker 1: sort of common garden snail. So, uh, it needs to 351 00:22:41,840 --> 00:22:45,679 Speaker 1: go faster than a common garden snail because it's preferred 352 00:22:45,720 --> 00:22:50,359 Speaker 1: food is dead fish, jellyfish and other rotting things that 353 00:22:50,400 --> 00:22:55,320 Speaker 1: have washed ashore, and these are very popular things for scavengers. 354 00:22:55,320 --> 00:22:57,520 Speaker 1: So for it to get a crack at a carcass, 355 00:22:57,760 --> 00:22:59,800 Speaker 1: it's kind of move pretty fast before it gets out 356 00:23:00,000 --> 00:23:05,359 Speaker 1: repeated by other snails or other scavengers. Also fun is 357 00:23:05,400 --> 00:23:09,160 Speaker 1: that they can use this large flat foot to surf 358 00:23:09,280 --> 00:23:11,680 Speaker 1: the waves, so like when they want to come ashore, 359 00:23:12,200 --> 00:23:14,680 Speaker 1: instead of having to swim or crawl all the way there, 360 00:23:14,680 --> 00:23:16,880 Speaker 1: they just fan out their foot and like surf on 361 00:23:17,040 --> 00:23:20,280 Speaker 1: to shore. So that's that's when a snail can really 362 00:23:20,320 --> 00:23:24,080 Speaker 1: get moving, is when they're surfers. So this next question 363 00:23:24,520 --> 00:23:29,680 Speaker 1: is from doc Garby on Twitter who asks tarantulas with frogs, 364 00:23:29,760 --> 00:23:34,040 Speaker 1: owls with snakes, crabs with anemones, captive cheetahs with dogs. 365 00:23:34,600 --> 00:23:37,960 Speaker 1: Is there any evidence of emotional attachment in these mutually 366 00:23:38,080 --> 00:23:41,720 Speaker 1: beneficial pairings or could the respective creatures be swapped out 367 00:23:41,760 --> 00:23:46,360 Speaker 1: for replacements of the same species without notice? So this 368 00:23:46,480 --> 00:23:51,080 Speaker 1: is a very complex question first of all, So what 369 00:23:51,240 --> 00:23:56,680 Speaker 1: doc Garby is talking about is some mutualistic symbiotic relationships here. 370 00:23:57,080 --> 00:24:01,280 Speaker 1: So with tarantula's and frog it is the micro highland 371 00:24:01,400 --> 00:24:05,359 Speaker 1: frogs who team up with tarantulas, and the tarantulas do 372 00:24:05,480 --> 00:24:09,720 Speaker 1: not eat these little tiny frogs, so the frogs benefit 373 00:24:09,800 --> 00:24:12,840 Speaker 1: from the tarantulas because, first of all, they have protection 374 00:24:13,040 --> 00:24:17,119 Speaker 1: with this big tarantula bodyguard, and they also get to 375 00:24:17,320 --> 00:24:22,119 Speaker 1: eat bugs that are attracted to the remains of a 376 00:24:22,320 --> 00:24:27,359 Speaker 1: tarantula's kills. And the tarantula benefits from these little tiny 377 00:24:27,400 --> 00:24:31,080 Speaker 1: frogs because the frogs love to eat ants, and ants 378 00:24:31,160 --> 00:24:35,439 Speaker 1: love to eat tarantula eggs, so the frog protects the 379 00:24:35,560 --> 00:24:39,439 Speaker 1: tarantula eggs from the ants. And ants are harder for 380 00:24:39,560 --> 00:24:42,359 Speaker 1: the tarantulas to eat because they're so small and fast 381 00:24:42,400 --> 00:24:45,200 Speaker 1: and nimble, and it's much easier for the frog who 382 00:24:45,200 --> 00:24:48,600 Speaker 1: has this like really rapid fire tongue and mouth, to 383 00:24:48,720 --> 00:24:51,840 Speaker 1: be able to eat the little ants. So the other 384 00:24:52,600 --> 00:24:57,280 Speaker 1: pairing that Doc Garby mentioned is owls with snakes. So 385 00:24:57,480 --> 00:25:01,560 Speaker 1: Eastern screech owls and Texas blind snakes form a sort 386 00:25:01,560 --> 00:25:04,840 Speaker 1: of partnership. So the Eastern screech owl will pick up 387 00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:07,600 Speaker 1: one of these little Texas blind snakes, and these snakes 388 00:25:07,600 --> 00:25:09,640 Speaker 1: are the little idy beauty things. They kind of look 389 00:25:09,720 --> 00:25:14,359 Speaker 1: like oversized worms, and they plot them in their nest. 390 00:25:14,480 --> 00:25:17,359 Speaker 1: But for the most part, instead of the chicks eating 391 00:25:17,400 --> 00:25:21,399 Speaker 1: the blind snake, they the snakes will burrow down into 392 00:25:21,440 --> 00:25:25,760 Speaker 1: the nest and actually pick off bugs, keeping pests away 393 00:25:25,840 --> 00:25:30,600 Speaker 1: from the owl's nest. And the other pairing that was 394 00:25:30,640 --> 00:25:36,200 Speaker 1: mentioned was crabs with anemonies, which uh so palm palm crabs, 395 00:25:36,240 --> 00:25:39,800 Speaker 1: which are these little tiny crabs very cute, will actually 396 00:25:39,880 --> 00:25:44,600 Speaker 1: place little parts of anemonies on their claws and attach 397 00:25:44,720 --> 00:25:49,640 Speaker 1: them there, and they use these as like uh these 398 00:25:49,840 --> 00:25:54,720 Speaker 1: these venomous boxing gloves that can sting in any predator 399 00:25:54,760 --> 00:25:58,440 Speaker 1: who tries to get too close. So this obviously benefits 400 00:25:58,480 --> 00:26:02,320 Speaker 1: the crabs because it gives them cool boxing gloves, and 401 00:26:02,400 --> 00:26:08,840 Speaker 1: the this actually helps ennimonies reproduce. So by basically splitting 402 00:26:08,960 --> 00:26:13,720 Speaker 1: up these niminy parts and transferring them around two different 403 00:26:13,720 --> 00:26:16,520 Speaker 1: parts of the ocean, that allows them to disperse and 404 00:26:16,600 --> 00:26:20,240 Speaker 1: reproduce by actually like like breaking off from the main 405 00:26:20,359 --> 00:26:23,680 Speaker 1: animity and they can actually uh reproduce that way, which 406 00:26:23,720 --> 00:26:27,400 Speaker 1: is really fascinating. And the captive cheetahs with dogs thing 407 00:26:27,560 --> 00:26:30,600 Speaker 1: is that in zoos where they have a cheetah, they 408 00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:33,400 Speaker 1: will often pair it with a dog and raise them 409 00:26:33,440 --> 00:26:38,000 Speaker 1: together with a puppy because cheetahs get really nervous all 410 00:26:38,080 --> 00:26:41,800 Speaker 1: on their own and a they found that like, uh, 411 00:26:42,040 --> 00:26:44,960 Speaker 1: dogs get along really well with cheetahs and vice versa, 412 00:26:45,119 --> 00:26:48,760 Speaker 1: and it helps a cheetah feel really emotionally secure, and 413 00:26:48,800 --> 00:26:52,040 Speaker 1: they also don't like have conflicts with the dogs as well, 414 00:26:52,119 --> 00:26:55,760 Speaker 1: So it helps cheetahs who would otherwise be really anxious 415 00:26:55,800 --> 00:26:59,480 Speaker 1: in captivity, to be a little a little more relaxed 416 00:26:59,640 --> 00:27:03,919 Speaker 1: and feel protected by their buddy the dog. In terms 417 00:27:04,160 --> 00:27:07,960 Speaker 1: of the meat of the question, which is is there 418 00:27:08,000 --> 00:27:12,239 Speaker 1: evidence of emotional attachment or could you swap out like 419 00:27:12,280 --> 00:27:15,479 Speaker 1: any of these individuals. So I think, first of all, 420 00:27:15,520 --> 00:27:19,440 Speaker 1: it kind of depends on the animal. I think that 421 00:27:19,760 --> 00:27:23,720 Speaker 1: you know with when you have the more simple relationships 422 00:27:23,800 --> 00:27:28,440 Speaker 1: like tranchlas with frogs, ass with snakes, frogs with anemonies, yeah, 423 00:27:28,480 --> 00:27:31,040 Speaker 1: I don't. I don't. I don't think they're particularly attached 424 00:27:31,080 --> 00:27:34,080 Speaker 1: to any individuals, So I think you could swap them out. 425 00:27:34,080 --> 00:27:36,240 Speaker 1: And now I'm not as certain about that answer with 426 00:27:36,280 --> 00:27:38,679 Speaker 1: the tarantulas and frogs that have to look more into it. 427 00:27:38,720 --> 00:27:41,440 Speaker 1: I'm not sure whether there's been research on that, whether 428 00:27:41,480 --> 00:27:45,440 Speaker 1: they prefer any kind of like specific tarantula or any 429 00:27:45,520 --> 00:27:48,720 Speaker 1: The tranchilas stick to one specific frog. I do know 430 00:27:48,920 --> 00:27:53,959 Speaker 1: that they do, uh prefer once they've learned sort of 431 00:27:54,000 --> 00:27:57,240 Speaker 1: like their smell and taste I guess of their skin, 432 00:27:57,280 --> 00:28:00,240 Speaker 1: like they do know that that frog is there their 433 00:28:00,280 --> 00:28:04,480 Speaker 1: little buddy. And if you these researchers skinned some of 434 00:28:04,520 --> 00:28:07,720 Speaker 1: these frogs and put there like the okay, so this 435 00:28:07,840 --> 00:28:12,560 Speaker 1: is messed up. But in the these micro highland frogs 436 00:28:13,000 --> 00:28:15,400 Speaker 1: who are friends with tarantulas, there was there a research 437 00:28:15,440 --> 00:28:18,040 Speaker 1: study where researchers would take one of the frogs which 438 00:28:18,040 --> 00:28:21,320 Speaker 1: were the little buddies of the tarantula, and they would 439 00:28:21,320 --> 00:28:24,480 Speaker 1: skin them and put that skin on another frog species 440 00:28:24,520 --> 00:28:27,240 Speaker 1: that was not the buddy of the tarantulas. So the 441 00:28:27,280 --> 00:28:31,760 Speaker 1: tarantula would not eat the frogs that normally they probably 442 00:28:31,800 --> 00:28:34,200 Speaker 1: would eat once they had the skins of these micro 443 00:28:34,280 --> 00:28:37,840 Speaker 1: highland frogs. So the tarantulas definitely have a preference for 444 00:28:37,920 --> 00:28:39,920 Speaker 1: that species. But in terms of whether they have a 445 00:28:39,960 --> 00:28:43,080 Speaker 1: preference for individual frogs, I'm not sure is known. At 446 00:28:43,160 --> 00:28:47,360 Speaker 1: least I don't know it, but I would guess probably not. However, 447 00:28:47,440 --> 00:28:51,200 Speaker 1: when you start to get more complex animals like cheetahs 448 00:28:51,240 --> 00:28:57,040 Speaker 1: and dogs, they definitely have an attachment to individual dogs, 449 00:28:57,080 --> 00:28:59,760 Speaker 1: individual cheetah like that you know, I mean, like if 450 00:28:59,760 --> 00:29:01,880 Speaker 1: you have a dog, you know that that dog may 451 00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:07,280 Speaker 1: form specific attachments with certain people or even certain other animals. 452 00:29:07,880 --> 00:29:12,400 Speaker 1: And this also happens in nature, coyotes and badgers will 453 00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:14,960 Speaker 1: sometimes pair up and hunt together, and it seems like 454 00:29:15,480 --> 00:29:19,640 Speaker 1: it is an individual seeking out a specific individual, like 455 00:29:19,680 --> 00:29:22,800 Speaker 1: a coyote knows that a specific badger is down to 456 00:29:22,880 --> 00:29:25,840 Speaker 1: hunt together, and so they go and team up. Now, 457 00:29:25,880 --> 00:29:29,920 Speaker 1: in terms of whether there's an emotional connection behind this 458 00:29:30,040 --> 00:29:32,880 Speaker 1: preference or whether it's just a practical thing of like, hey, 459 00:29:32,960 --> 00:29:36,800 Speaker 1: I know this individual, we've gone hunting together before. I 460 00:29:36,800 --> 00:29:39,360 Speaker 1: know they're cool. I know that they are not gonna, 461 00:29:39,600 --> 00:29:43,280 Speaker 1: you know, bite me or be unfair. It's hard to 462 00:29:43,360 --> 00:29:48,160 Speaker 1: know like where the practicality starts and where the emotions start, 463 00:29:48,240 --> 00:29:51,080 Speaker 1: and and if anything, I would guess that they'd be 464 00:29:51,160 --> 00:29:54,680 Speaker 1: highly associated. Because for behaviors, you have to get some 465 00:29:54,760 --> 00:29:58,200 Speaker 1: kind of reward or doing a behavior, and that can 466 00:29:58,280 --> 00:30:02,600 Speaker 1: be like a physical reward feeling full, or a mental 467 00:30:02,640 --> 00:30:07,280 Speaker 1: reward of feeling happy, or a positive emotion. So in 468 00:30:07,400 --> 00:30:13,800 Speaker 1: terms of survival, if animals get a positive emotion out 469 00:30:13,840 --> 00:30:17,880 Speaker 1: of a beneficial relationship, that will probably help them continue 470 00:30:17,920 --> 00:30:22,160 Speaker 1: to seek out that relationship. So I would say that 471 00:30:22,280 --> 00:30:27,920 Speaker 1: for more complex animals like coyotes and badgers or cheetahs 472 00:30:27,960 --> 00:30:30,600 Speaker 1: and dogs, that yeah, I would guess they do have 473 00:30:30,880 --> 00:30:35,360 Speaker 1: an emotion behind it, an emotional attachment to the individual 474 00:30:35,480 --> 00:30:38,480 Speaker 1: that they like to hang out with and brings them 475 00:30:38,520 --> 00:30:41,840 Speaker 1: some benefit. Um. But it's like, you know, we have 476 00:30:41,960 --> 00:30:45,800 Speaker 1: emotions all the time that we may not think of 477 00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:48,960 Speaker 1: as being like practical, but really do have a practical purpose, 478 00:30:49,080 --> 00:30:52,640 Speaker 1: Like the reason humans like friends and family like it 479 00:30:52,760 --> 00:30:57,080 Speaker 1: really is very helpful, in fact essential for our survival. 480 00:30:57,200 --> 00:31:03,360 Speaker 1: Humans aren't the most strong, most you know, well adapted 481 00:31:03,400 --> 00:31:06,560 Speaker 1: animals to survive on our own. We really depend on society. 482 00:31:06,560 --> 00:31:10,200 Speaker 1: Our whole human history is being depending on other people 483 00:31:10,640 --> 00:31:13,200 Speaker 1: to help us, and we help them in our emotional 484 00:31:13,280 --> 00:31:16,200 Speaker 1: attachment to other people, I help think really aided in 485 00:31:16,240 --> 00:31:19,920 Speaker 1: our survival. So I think that there is this connection 486 00:31:19,960 --> 00:31:24,360 Speaker 1: there right where evolutionary behaviors are also emotional behaviors, and 487 00:31:24,400 --> 00:31:27,280 Speaker 1: it's kind of hard to separate out the two in 488 00:31:27,400 --> 00:31:32,520 Speaker 1: terms of when, like which animals feel that emotion right 489 00:31:32,600 --> 00:31:35,360 Speaker 1: Like it's actually it seems kind of hard for me 490 00:31:35,560 --> 00:31:37,640 Speaker 1: to be able to point a finger. It's like, all right, 491 00:31:37,680 --> 00:31:41,360 Speaker 1: here's where the animal is complex enough to actually feel 492 00:31:41,400 --> 00:31:45,600 Speaker 1: complex emotions. So, like, do you see enemies form an 493 00:31:45,600 --> 00:31:49,240 Speaker 1: emotional attachment to the crabs who wear them as boxing gloves? Like, no, 494 00:31:49,400 --> 00:31:53,040 Speaker 1: I don't. I don't think so. Other than literally being attached. 495 00:31:53,480 --> 00:31:56,960 Speaker 1: Anemonies do not have a brain. They have a nervous system, 496 00:31:57,000 --> 00:31:59,360 Speaker 1: but they have no centralized nervous system, so I don't 497 00:31:59,360 --> 00:32:04,760 Speaker 1: think they have of really much capacity for thought at all. Uh, 498 00:32:04,920 --> 00:32:11,360 Speaker 1: just very basic stimulus response stuff. Uh. But then it's like, well, 499 00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:15,240 Speaker 1: so does a cheetah feel something for the dog that 500 00:32:15,280 --> 00:32:17,240 Speaker 1: it was raised with? Yeah? I think so. But then 501 00:32:17,320 --> 00:32:20,600 Speaker 1: where you know, kind of in this spectrum of animal 502 00:32:20,960 --> 00:32:25,560 Speaker 1: brain complexity, do the emotions start to set in? I 503 00:32:25,600 --> 00:32:28,040 Speaker 1: don't know. I mean, it's really it's hard to say. 504 00:32:28,040 --> 00:32:30,520 Speaker 1: I mean, you have like a rat, which I think 505 00:32:30,760 --> 00:32:36,000 Speaker 1: is shows some very complex emotional intelligence. I think rats 506 00:32:36,040 --> 00:32:40,360 Speaker 1: may feel emotional bonds with each other and with humans. Uh, 507 00:32:40,400 --> 00:32:42,480 Speaker 1: like anyone who is a pet owner who has a 508 00:32:42,560 --> 00:32:47,080 Speaker 1: rat may attest to, but a mouse, I don't know, 509 00:32:47,200 --> 00:32:49,080 Speaker 1: Like it's harder to it's kind of harder to see. 510 00:32:49,120 --> 00:32:52,880 Speaker 1: Like mice seemed to have some problem solving ability. They 511 00:32:52,880 --> 00:32:56,800 Speaker 1: seem to have a preference for their siblings. But then 512 00:32:56,800 --> 00:32:59,160 Speaker 1: when it it's like, well, it's their preference for their 513 00:32:59,200 --> 00:33:03,120 Speaker 1: siblings just the evolutionary advantage of sticking with your siblings 514 00:33:03,120 --> 00:33:07,000 Speaker 1: and trying to make sure like your genes pass on 515 00:33:07,080 --> 00:33:09,560 Speaker 1: and maybe their genes pass on, and knowing that they're 516 00:33:09,600 --> 00:33:13,000 Speaker 1: probably not going to attack you. It's I don't know, 517 00:33:13,160 --> 00:33:15,160 Speaker 1: it's really hard. It's hard to say. It's hard to 518 00:33:15,200 --> 00:33:18,719 Speaker 1: tell how much capacity for emotion that might feel. And 519 00:33:19,280 --> 00:33:22,200 Speaker 1: if anything, I think it's probably like a sliding scale 520 00:33:22,560 --> 00:33:25,760 Speaker 1: of emotional awareness, like I would say, like maybe a 521 00:33:25,840 --> 00:33:29,800 Speaker 1: mouse has some limited capacity for emotions. Maybe your rat 522 00:33:29,880 --> 00:33:33,040 Speaker 1: has more capacity for emotions, and you get the more 523 00:33:33,280 --> 00:33:36,520 Speaker 1: more and more complex, more and more social animals, and 524 00:33:36,560 --> 00:33:41,400 Speaker 1: then maybe they get more like deeper emotions like humans 525 00:33:41,440 --> 00:33:46,880 Speaker 1: and apes and and dolphins, cetaceans, elephants. I think I'll 526 00:33:46,880 --> 00:33:51,680 Speaker 1: have great capacity for deep emotions, so that that's as 527 00:33:51,760 --> 00:33:55,560 Speaker 1: close to an answer that I can probably give. So yeah, 528 00:33:55,800 --> 00:33:59,080 Speaker 1: really interesting question. Uh, And I think that'll do it 529 00:33:59,320 --> 00:34:03,480 Speaker 1: for us to a with with your wonderful listener questions. 530 00:34:03,560 --> 00:34:06,040 Speaker 1: Really enjoy all of them. Thank you so much for 531 00:34:06,080 --> 00:34:08,440 Speaker 1: sending them in Again. If you would like to send 532 00:34:08,480 --> 00:34:11,920 Speaker 1: me some of your questions, all you gotta do is 533 00:34:11,960 --> 00:34:16,120 Speaker 1: email me at Creature feature Pod at gmail dot com, 534 00:34:16,280 --> 00:34:20,000 Speaker 1: or you can find me on Twitter Creature feet Pod. 535 00:34:20,480 --> 00:34:23,399 Speaker 1: That's f e A T not f E T. That's 536 00:34:23,400 --> 00:34:27,600 Speaker 1: something very different. And that's that's the Creature Feet Pod 537 00:34:27,880 --> 00:34:31,520 Speaker 1: on Twitter. I'm also Katie Golden on Twitter k A 538 00:34:31,600 --> 00:34:34,839 Speaker 1: T I E G O L D I N. And yeah, 539 00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:37,759 Speaker 1: that's my that's my people account, So I tweet about 540 00:34:37,760 --> 00:34:40,160 Speaker 1: all sorts of things, all my Katie thoughts, not always 541 00:34:40,360 --> 00:34:43,040 Speaker 1: animal related, but yeah, if you if you have animal questions, 542 00:34:43,080 --> 00:34:46,160 Speaker 1: you can send those there as well. And of course 543 00:34:46,239 --> 00:34:50,839 Speaker 1: on Instagram at Creature feature Pod on Instagram. Then those 544 00:34:50,880 --> 00:34:54,359 Speaker 1: in there also. You got you got pet pictures, send 545 00:34:54,400 --> 00:34:57,200 Speaker 1: them to me. I love them. You got crab memes? 546 00:34:57,560 --> 00:34:59,680 Speaker 1: Do it? Send it to me. You found a weird 547 00:34:59,800 --> 00:35:02,480 Speaker 1: thing in your yard, I don't know, send it to me. 548 00:35:02,520 --> 00:35:05,960 Speaker 1: I'll look at it. Will I be able to identify it? Maybe? 549 00:35:06,040 --> 00:35:08,719 Speaker 1: Who knows? But go ahead and send those things, and 550 00:35:08,880 --> 00:35:12,719 Speaker 1: I love reading them, and maybe I will answer some 551 00:35:12,800 --> 00:35:15,839 Speaker 1: more questions on a future Q and A podcast. Yeah, 552 00:35:15,920 --> 00:35:17,719 Speaker 1: let let me know. You know, if you guys like 553 00:35:17,880 --> 00:35:20,480 Speaker 1: these Q and A things, maybe I'll keep doing them. 554 00:35:20,600 --> 00:35:23,200 Speaker 1: If you kind of like maybe like them a little 555 00:35:23,200 --> 00:35:26,080 Speaker 1: bit but want them to be like spread out between 556 00:35:26,120 --> 00:35:29,319 Speaker 1: episodes and like, yeah, just just let me know. Uh, 557 00:35:29,360 --> 00:35:31,959 Speaker 1: And if you're enjoying the show, please leave a rating 558 00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:35,160 Speaker 1: and review. That really not only helps me out with 559 00:35:35,200 --> 00:35:38,480 Speaker 1: the old with the old Apple podcast algorithm, but it 560 00:35:38,520 --> 00:35:41,239 Speaker 1: also really makes me feel good to read. I I 561 00:35:41,280 --> 00:35:44,480 Speaker 1: really enjoy reading all of your feedback and comments. Really 562 00:35:44,920 --> 00:35:49,120 Speaker 1: warms my little little bird heart. Thank you so much 563 00:35:49,160 --> 00:35:52,080 Speaker 1: for listening. I hope you're all having as good of 564 00:35:52,120 --> 00:35:55,879 Speaker 1: a holiday season as is possible. Please stay safe out there. 565 00:35:56,520 --> 00:35:59,520 Speaker 1: I love you all, uh and really care about you all, 566 00:35:59,640 --> 00:36:03,360 Speaker 1: so you know I'm I'm here with you, you know, 567 00:36:03,480 --> 00:36:06,160 Speaker 1: send me send me pictures of of your pets and 568 00:36:06,239 --> 00:36:10,280 Speaker 1: like festive hat if you want, that'd be great. Thanks 569 00:36:10,320 --> 00:36:13,160 Speaker 1: so much to the Space Classics for their super awesome 570 00:36:13,200 --> 00:36:16,359 Speaker 1: song excell Alumina. Creature features a production of I Heart 571 00:36:16,440 --> 00:36:18,959 Speaker 1: Radio for more podcasts like the one you just heard 572 00:36:19,040 --> 00:36:21,359 Speaker 1: was the I Heart Radio app Apple podcast? Or Hey 573 00:36:21,360 --> 00:36:23,440 Speaker 1: guess what? Where have you listen to your favorite shows? 574 00:36:23,840 --> 00:36:27,600 Speaker 1: See you next Wednesday