1 00:00:01,920 --> 00:00:06,200 Speaker 1: Live from our nation's capital. This is Bloomberg Sound on. 2 00:00:07,360 --> 00:00:10,360 Speaker 1: This is historic progress coin our economy out of the 3 00:00:10,400 --> 00:00:12,840 Speaker 1: worst crisis in a hundred years. The key of the 4 00:00:12,880 --> 00:00:15,680 Speaker 1: new innovation technology is actually coming from the oil and 5 00:00:15,720 --> 00:00:18,119 Speaker 1: gas industry. How much funny do we need for a 6 00:00:18,239 --> 00:00:21,520 Speaker 1: rural broadman? How much money to redeep the bridges? Floomberg 7 00:00:21,720 --> 00:00:26,000 Speaker 1: Sound On, Politics, Policy, and perspective from DC's top name. 8 00:00:26,360 --> 00:00:30,600 Speaker 1: Waiters will continue rising and fill those supply constrains. Eas 9 00:00:30,640 --> 00:00:33,599 Speaker 1: economic plan that's certainly working. The investments in the American 10 00:00:33,800 --> 00:00:37,800 Speaker 1: recue plan at being impactful. Schloomberg Sound On with Joe 11 00:00:37,840 --> 00:00:43,520 Speaker 1: Matthew on Floomberg Radio Live from Washington. Were senators negotiating 12 00:00:43,560 --> 00:00:47,080 Speaker 1: infrastructure say they are ninety nine percent. They're coming up. 13 00:00:47,080 --> 00:00:50,479 Speaker 1: We'll focus on some critical issues feeding the debate around 14 00:00:50,479 --> 00:00:54,520 Speaker 1: it and the overall economic recovery with Congresswoman Hailey Stephens, 15 00:00:54,600 --> 00:00:58,080 Speaker 1: Democrat from Michigan, whose local auto industry part of her 16 00:00:58,120 --> 00:01:01,320 Speaker 1: district in Detroit is feeling the impact of the chip shortage. 17 00:01:01,480 --> 00:01:05,759 Speaker 1: We need to incentivize the manufacturing of chips in America. 18 00:01:05,920 --> 00:01:09,000 Speaker 1: Commerce Secretary wing In today will talk later as well 19 00:01:09,040 --> 00:01:12,039 Speaker 1: with a former senior policy advisor to Senator Rob Portman 20 00:01:12,080 --> 00:01:14,840 Speaker 1: about what is happening behind the scenes right now on 21 00:01:14,920 --> 00:01:17,679 Speaker 1: Capitol Hill. Thanks for joining us here on Bloomberg Sound 22 00:01:17,720 --> 00:01:21,240 Speaker 1: on as the Intel makes headlines after hours, just hearing 23 00:01:21,280 --> 00:01:24,280 Speaker 1: we've been watching headlines roll across the terminal about the 24 00:01:24,360 --> 00:01:28,760 Speaker 1: chip shortage with GM forced to stop some pick up 25 00:01:28,840 --> 00:01:32,440 Speaker 1: production for a week that will start Monday, and Commerce 26 00:01:32,480 --> 00:01:36,440 Speaker 1: Secretary Gina Romando calling on Congress today to act. I 27 00:01:36,480 --> 00:01:42,200 Speaker 1: am engaging almost daily with industry. We are working as 28 00:01:42,240 --> 00:01:45,679 Speaker 1: hard as we can to get the House to pass 29 00:01:45,800 --> 00:01:49,480 Speaker 1: the Chips Act, or their version of Yuseka that and 30 00:01:49,560 --> 00:01:52,760 Speaker 1: we're putting plants in place right now, already on the 31 00:01:52,800 --> 00:01:56,920 Speaker 1: team to invest the fifty two billion dollars we need 32 00:01:56,960 --> 00:02:02,320 Speaker 1: to incentivize the manufacturing of chips in America. Uh and 33 00:02:02,440 --> 00:02:05,320 Speaker 1: so we are very focused on putting the pieces in 34 00:02:05,320 --> 00:02:07,880 Speaker 1: place so that can happen. Secretary of Romando speaking to 35 00:02:07,920 --> 00:02:11,240 Speaker 1: reporters today as part of the daily White House Briefing, 36 00:02:11,360 --> 00:02:15,160 Speaker 1: having been tapped, of course, by President Biden to lead 37 00:02:15,400 --> 00:02:19,160 Speaker 1: White House efforts on this. To kick things Office Hour 38 00:02:19,240 --> 00:02:21,360 Speaker 1: were bringing a member of Congress with deep ties to 39 00:02:21,480 --> 00:02:26,560 Speaker 1: the auto industry, Congresswoman Hailey Stevens, Democrat from Michigan, who, 40 00:02:26,560 --> 00:02:29,320 Speaker 1: as I mentioned, has part of her district in Detroit. 41 00:02:29,520 --> 00:02:32,320 Speaker 1: Former chief of staff as well to the US Auto 42 00:02:32,400 --> 00:02:36,960 Speaker 1: Rescue task Force set up by former President Barack Obama. 43 00:02:36,960 --> 00:02:42,480 Speaker 1: If you remember the economic downturn and oh seven oh eight, Congresswoman, 44 00:02:42,760 --> 00:02:46,400 Speaker 1: welcome back to Bloomberg Radio. Thank you. I'm thrilled to you. 45 00:02:47,240 --> 00:02:50,000 Speaker 1: We learned today that GM will stop making most of 46 00:02:50,040 --> 00:02:53,680 Speaker 1: its pickup trucks next week because of the chip shortage. 47 00:02:53,720 --> 00:02:57,359 Speaker 1: We've heard similar announcements recently from Ford, from other automakers, 48 00:02:58,200 --> 00:02:59,919 Speaker 1: and of course we all know there's a big push 49 00:03:00,120 --> 00:03:04,040 Speaker 1: evis which need even more chips. You're urging Speaker Felosi 50 00:03:04,160 --> 00:03:06,919 Speaker 1: to pass the Chips Act, Congresswoman, how would that help 51 00:03:06,960 --> 00:03:12,239 Speaker 1: this problem? Now? Well, certainly there's the industry standpoint of 52 00:03:12,440 --> 00:03:17,080 Speaker 1: what is happening to our original equipment manufacturers, the Ford, 53 00:03:17,200 --> 00:03:22,680 Speaker 1: the g M, the statlantist operations. We're steering this across 54 00:03:22,680 --> 00:03:27,440 Speaker 1: our supply chain or projecting a lot of lost profits 55 00:03:27,440 --> 00:03:32,200 Speaker 1: as a result of this. But most possibly where we 56 00:03:32,280 --> 00:03:37,600 Speaker 1: are seeing the impact is with everyday hard working Michigan families. 57 00:03:37,840 --> 00:03:42,280 Speaker 1: UM Very alarmingly, we just saw a pretty incredible uptick 58 00:03:42,640 --> 00:03:48,520 Speaker 1: UH and UM and unemployment findings in the state of Michigan. 59 00:03:48,640 --> 00:03:54,960 Speaker 1: Nearly thirteen thousand were just filed within the last week alone. Uh. 60 00:03:55,040 --> 00:03:58,200 Speaker 1: This is a direct result of our chips shortage. I 61 00:03:58,320 --> 00:04:01,080 Speaker 1: have been hearing from supplys on this. I have been 62 00:04:01,120 --> 00:04:04,120 Speaker 1: working with suppliers on this. I just held a meeting 63 00:04:04,600 --> 00:04:09,480 Speaker 1: to learn more, and the resounding message was the United 64 00:04:09,520 --> 00:04:13,720 Speaker 1: States government should make an investment now so that we 65 00:04:13,800 --> 00:04:19,000 Speaker 1: can prepare and further stop the bleeding and bring some 66 00:04:19,080 --> 00:04:22,160 Speaker 1: of the certain meats. Now, let's be clear, I don't 67 00:04:22,480 --> 00:04:25,919 Speaker 1: expect these to be permanent job bosses, but this is 68 00:04:26,000 --> 00:04:30,560 Speaker 1: absolutely a setback. When you see the large automakers shutting 69 00:04:30,560 --> 00:04:34,480 Speaker 1: down operations and those are specifically auto jobs. You're talking 70 00:04:34,480 --> 00:04:39,760 Speaker 1: about that number, and these are these are mostly automotive jobs. 71 00:04:40,520 --> 00:04:43,640 Speaker 1: Looking at your over year comparisons, this is a very 72 00:04:43,680 --> 00:04:48,240 Speaker 1: abnormal spike. UH. Talk to my contact Glenn Even's not 73 00:04:48,360 --> 00:04:51,279 Speaker 1: related to me, at what's called miss Auto, which is 74 00:04:51,279 --> 00:04:55,400 Speaker 1: a division of our Detroit Regional Chamber. He verified, UM, 75 00:04:55,720 --> 00:04:58,359 Speaker 1: you know, those who are reporting on this are verifying 76 00:04:58,640 --> 00:05:01,640 Speaker 1: that this is a actually my contact from miss Auto 77 00:05:01,960 --> 00:05:05,400 Speaker 1: that this is on. This is this is a result 78 00:05:05,440 --> 00:05:08,760 Speaker 1: of the chip short And by the way, you know, 79 00:05:09,040 --> 00:05:11,680 Speaker 1: as someone who does you know the deep work of 80 00:05:11,920 --> 00:05:16,480 Speaker 1: going UH into the automotive companies. You know the suppliers, 81 00:05:16,520 --> 00:05:20,360 Speaker 1: the small businesses who are also feeling these ramifications. That's 82 00:05:20,400 --> 00:05:24,360 Speaker 1: not just the oh yas, it's also that's your ones 83 00:05:24,400 --> 00:05:28,360 Speaker 1: and Cure two suppliers and on that have told me 84 00:05:28,720 --> 00:05:31,800 Speaker 1: for a while now that they are worried about uh 85 00:05:31,839 --> 00:05:36,080 Speaker 1: potential four terms layoffs and and and and production shortages 86 00:05:36,520 --> 00:05:39,800 Speaker 1: as a result of this chip shortage. And this is 87 00:05:39,839 --> 00:05:41,880 Speaker 1: a huge wake up moment, and it is I want 88 00:05:41,880 --> 00:05:43,880 Speaker 1: to be really careful with how I'm talking about this 89 00:05:44,000 --> 00:05:47,599 Speaker 1: is the listeners here today, because this is not an 90 00:05:47,640 --> 00:05:52,400 Speaker 1: overnight solution. You making investment right like, you make the 91 00:05:52,440 --> 00:05:56,680 Speaker 1: investment now and and and it's got to play out 92 00:05:56,680 --> 00:06:01,120 Speaker 1: over a multitude of quarters and and really years. But 93 00:06:01,200 --> 00:06:03,080 Speaker 1: that's why I ask you about the Chips Act and 94 00:06:03,400 --> 00:06:05,520 Speaker 1: what it can do to help now, because you know 95 00:06:05,600 --> 00:06:08,000 Speaker 1: more than most people how long it takes to order 96 00:06:08,800 --> 00:06:12,080 Speaker 1: and have a chip manufactured, have a chip delivered. We 97 00:06:12,160 --> 00:06:17,200 Speaker 1: could build new foundries, but it'll take potentially less time 98 00:06:17,240 --> 00:06:21,159 Speaker 1: for this shortage to resolve itself. Are you worried that 99 00:06:21,200 --> 00:06:25,520 Speaker 1: this could get worse before it gets better. Look, I 100 00:06:26,000 --> 00:06:28,599 Speaker 1: believe these are disruptions. I want to I want to 101 00:06:28,600 --> 00:06:32,680 Speaker 1: be clear on that front. Um, would we potentially experience 102 00:06:32,920 --> 00:06:37,120 Speaker 1: more pain worse than we are right now? Absolutely? Couldn't 103 00:06:37,160 --> 00:06:40,240 Speaker 1: look a little bit better a month or two from now? Yes? 104 00:06:40,680 --> 00:06:42,920 Speaker 1: And then could we dip again? Yes? And could that 105 00:06:43,040 --> 00:06:46,200 Speaker 1: dip be worse than the dip that we're experiencing right now? Yes. 106 00:06:47,040 --> 00:06:51,159 Speaker 1: Uh So in many respects, what's playing out is turbulent 107 00:06:51,880 --> 00:06:55,440 Speaker 1: uh and and dips and rises, and there's a real 108 00:06:55,480 --> 00:07:00,440 Speaker 1: need for certainty. And there's just most importantly, uh need 109 00:07:00,800 --> 00:07:04,360 Speaker 1: to address this weakness and our supply shade so that 110 00:07:04,400 --> 00:07:07,479 Speaker 1: we can meet the demand and sells and and sell 111 00:07:07,560 --> 00:07:10,880 Speaker 1: these incredible products as we make them in Michigan. Right now, 112 00:07:10,920 --> 00:07:15,320 Speaker 1: we can't even make them right and therein lies the problem. 113 00:07:15,720 --> 00:07:18,640 Speaker 1: Of course, we've been talking jobs and autos here, congresswomen, 114 00:07:18,720 --> 00:07:22,920 Speaker 1: they're both mentioned and in fact incentivized, if I can 115 00:07:23,000 --> 00:07:25,920 Speaker 1: use that word. In the infrastructure framework that we've been 116 00:07:26,520 --> 00:07:29,920 Speaker 1: talking about and that you've been negotiating here in Washington. 117 00:07:30,280 --> 00:07:32,760 Speaker 1: There's a report out today from Ernst and Young that 118 00:07:32,800 --> 00:07:37,200 Speaker 1: finds that electric cars evs will be taking over from 119 00:07:37,200 --> 00:07:42,160 Speaker 1: internal combustion engines sooner than people thought years earlier, potentially, 120 00:07:42,800 --> 00:07:45,480 Speaker 1: And I wonder if you're worried about that demand for 121 00:07:45,600 --> 00:07:50,760 Speaker 1: chips making this problem potentially worse. It's all a part 122 00:07:50,800 --> 00:07:53,360 Speaker 1: of what I have directly told the President when he 123 00:07:53,400 --> 00:07:55,640 Speaker 1: came to Michigan. We need to be focused on, which 124 00:07:55,680 --> 00:07:59,520 Speaker 1: is the supply change for electric cars and the US 125 00:07:59,600 --> 00:08:03,600 Speaker 1: cont piece of this. I've got some seen examples of 126 00:08:03,920 --> 00:08:07,160 Speaker 1: a lesser likes manufacturers that produced the chemicals that go 127 00:08:07,240 --> 00:08:10,560 Speaker 1: into the battery. We've only got one in Michigan and 128 00:08:10,680 --> 00:08:13,880 Speaker 1: two in the United States total. We have got to 129 00:08:13,960 --> 00:08:18,560 Speaker 1: have a consolidated and regional supply chain that is diversified 130 00:08:18,840 --> 00:08:22,480 Speaker 1: and ready to meet the needs of the battery and 131 00:08:22,600 --> 00:08:25,200 Speaker 1: also the electric vehicle. And you are spot on to 132 00:08:25,360 --> 00:08:28,280 Speaker 1: raise this tips component. If we continue to kick the 133 00:08:28,320 --> 00:08:30,720 Speaker 1: can down the road, we're gonna lose out on jobs 134 00:08:30,720 --> 00:08:33,560 Speaker 1: that We're going to lose out on manufacturing capabilities, and 135 00:08:33,600 --> 00:08:35,640 Speaker 1: we are going to continue to pay the price just 136 00:08:35,840 --> 00:08:39,280 Speaker 1: as we are right now. Talk to me more about 137 00:08:39,320 --> 00:08:42,040 Speaker 1: infrastructure before you're gone. Is this thing going to pass 138 00:08:42,040 --> 00:08:45,640 Speaker 1: and in what form? Well? I I consider myself the 139 00:08:45,679 --> 00:08:48,760 Speaker 1: coalition of the willing of this, and and what I 140 00:08:48,800 --> 00:08:52,920 Speaker 1: mean by that is we have we have the trappings 141 00:08:53,360 --> 00:08:56,560 Speaker 1: of a good bill, a starter bill. There's always a 142 00:08:56,559 --> 00:09:00,000 Speaker 1: lot of pressure in these environments of how much are 143 00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:03,480 Speaker 1: we gonna do? And my philosphya is it You're not 144 00:09:03,520 --> 00:09:06,040 Speaker 1: going to solve all the world's problems in one bill, 145 00:09:06,360 --> 00:09:08,720 Speaker 1: but you can certainly solve the whole heck of a 146 00:09:08,760 --> 00:09:12,160 Speaker 1: lot of them if you passed something. And where we 147 00:09:12,240 --> 00:09:16,200 Speaker 1: are is looking at this brillion dollar proposal. This is 148 00:09:16,240 --> 00:09:18,840 Speaker 1: what I'm hearing, you know, from the stakeholders that I 149 00:09:18,880 --> 00:09:21,359 Speaker 1: work with. I've got a lot of great construction companies 150 00:09:21,679 --> 00:09:24,760 Speaker 1: right in my district too. I I lean on for this. 151 00:09:24,920 --> 00:09:28,160 Speaker 1: You know, your endorsement means a lot. Certainly as a 152 00:09:28,200 --> 00:09:32,079 Speaker 1: House member, I am paying really close attention and and 153 00:09:32,080 --> 00:09:36,160 Speaker 1: and giving my senators from Michigan the space to negotiate 154 00:09:36,280 --> 00:09:39,240 Speaker 1: this this deal and putting trust in this and and 155 00:09:39,280 --> 00:09:41,520 Speaker 1: part of it is we've got to sometimes step off 156 00:09:41,559 --> 00:09:45,439 Speaker 1: the political gas and really look at what is going 157 00:09:45,440 --> 00:09:48,880 Speaker 1: to be best and right for the country. And and 158 00:09:48,920 --> 00:09:51,920 Speaker 1: that's not to be cliche, you know, not everything has 159 00:09:52,000 --> 00:09:54,880 Speaker 1: to be about political score points. We should be scoring 160 00:09:54,920 --> 00:09:58,240 Speaker 1: points to the United States of America We've gone way 161 00:09:58,280 --> 00:10:02,560 Speaker 1: too long underfunding basic infrastructure in this country. We're going 162 00:10:02,600 --> 00:10:05,120 Speaker 1: to continue to come back at it. We also know 163 00:10:05,240 --> 00:10:08,960 Speaker 1: that the infrastructure deal is certainly gonna include some climate 164 00:10:09,040 --> 00:10:12,320 Speaker 1: remedies and solutions, because it can't not. You know, we've 165 00:10:12,400 --> 00:10:16,000 Speaker 1: had record level funding in Michigan. Look at my Chrysler, 166 00:10:16,160 --> 00:10:20,160 Speaker 1: you know, deep underwater just at the end of June 167 00:10:20,160 --> 00:10:23,400 Speaker 1: with some extreme flooding. Again, another step pack from our 168 00:10:23,400 --> 00:10:27,640 Speaker 1: manufacturing capabilities and on. That's all going to inherently tying 169 00:10:27,679 --> 00:10:30,040 Speaker 1: into the work that we are going to do in infrastructure. 170 00:10:30,559 --> 00:10:34,240 Speaker 1: And again, I am ready as a congresswoman from Michigan 171 00:10:34,280 --> 00:10:36,440 Speaker 1: to cast that vote and get this done not only 172 00:10:36,480 --> 00:10:39,240 Speaker 1: for my constituents, but for the country. We'll find out 173 00:10:39,320 --> 00:10:42,920 Speaker 1: what happens with negotiations in the meantime. Congresswoman Hailey Stephen's, 174 00:10:42,960 --> 00:10:45,600 Speaker 1: Democrat from Michigan, thank you for talking with us today 175 00:10:45,679 --> 00:10:49,680 Speaker 1: on Bloomberg sound On in our regards to Detroit, Hey, 176 00:10:49,679 --> 00:10:53,160 Speaker 1: thank you so much. Great to be with you. Bloomberg's 177 00:10:53,240 --> 00:10:56,280 Speaker 1: Eric Wasson's reporting that Senators are closing in on a 178 00:10:56,320 --> 00:10:58,559 Speaker 1: deal of the latest on the terminal well closing in 179 00:10:58,640 --> 00:11:01,679 Speaker 1: on a deal again after agreeing to pay for it, 180 00:11:01,720 --> 00:11:04,480 Speaker 1: in part by delaying a Trump era Medicare rule that 181 00:11:04,520 --> 00:11:07,960 Speaker 1: eliminates rebates that drug companies give to benefits managers in 182 00:11:08,000 --> 00:11:10,360 Speaker 1: an effort to lower out of pocket costs. So that 183 00:11:10,880 --> 00:11:13,160 Speaker 1: is being seen by most as progress. But we're not 184 00:11:13,240 --> 00:11:18,200 Speaker 1: there yet. Senator Tom Carper, Democrat from Delaware, Delaware Joe 185 00:11:18,200 --> 00:11:21,199 Speaker 1: Biden state now suggesting that he will object if negotiators 186 00:11:21,200 --> 00:11:24,120 Speaker 1: do not include more money for water and sanitation. He's 187 00:11:24,160 --> 00:11:27,400 Speaker 1: not alone. Others are appointing to their own priorities, as 188 00:11:27,520 --> 00:11:31,400 Speaker 1: Eric reports, like high speed rail. This is why talks 189 00:11:31,480 --> 00:11:37,400 Speaker 1: like these can take forever, and why congressional leads are 190 00:11:37,480 --> 00:11:40,240 Speaker 1: continuously being sent out to get take out food and 191 00:11:40,280 --> 00:11:45,400 Speaker 1: wine for these negotiating sessions. You're listening to Bloomberg Sound 192 00:11:45,440 --> 00:11:50,720 Speaker 1: On with Joe Matthew on Bloomberg Radio. So they say 193 00:11:50,760 --> 00:11:53,480 Speaker 1: we could have a deal on infrastructure at any time. Wait, 194 00:11:53,480 --> 00:11:55,719 Speaker 1: I thought we already had a deal. Though most of 195 00:11:55,720 --> 00:11:58,160 Speaker 1: the negotiators seem to think it will take the weekend. 196 00:11:59,080 --> 00:12:02,280 Speaker 1: Some have suggests did they are nine percent there? And 197 00:12:02,800 --> 00:12:05,200 Speaker 1: isn't that always the hard part? President Biden made the 198 00:12:05,200 --> 00:12:08,400 Speaker 1: case last night in a CNN town hall in Cincinnati. 199 00:12:08,600 --> 00:12:12,640 Speaker 1: Ohio and Kentucky combined, there's well over, there's thousands of 200 00:12:12,679 --> 00:12:17,160 Speaker 1: bridges and need repair thousands, thousands of bridges, and we 201 00:12:17,200 --> 00:12:20,920 Speaker 1: should be looking at this way. It increases commerce number one. 202 00:12:21,120 --> 00:12:26,959 Speaker 1: But guess what for good pain? Union jobs? Unions. Union 203 00:12:27,640 --> 00:12:31,160 Speaker 1: Dad liked it, but House Republican leader Kevin McCarthy did not. 204 00:12:32,240 --> 00:12:37,080 Speaker 1: One conservative sounding the alarm on spending and specifically inflation, 205 00:12:37,240 --> 00:12:39,920 Speaker 1: as he discussed today in a briefing, pointing to specific 206 00:12:40,000 --> 00:12:44,760 Speaker 1: examples he's hearing from constituents. Inflation is a tax on 207 00:12:44,920 --> 00:12:50,400 Speaker 1: every single American. You just listen from the first story 208 00:12:51,960 --> 00:12:56,400 Speaker 1: of a retired police officer and National Guard in Arkansas 209 00:12:57,080 --> 00:12:59,360 Speaker 1: that just last year he paid thirty five dollars to 210 00:12:59,360 --> 00:13:03,960 Speaker 1: fill up his tr Today it's two or that mom 211 00:13:04,000 --> 00:13:06,560 Speaker 1: who says they can't eat down anymore. This is the 212 00:13:06,600 --> 00:13:09,240 Speaker 1: effects of their action. And what do they take from 213 00:13:09,280 --> 00:13:12,360 Speaker 1: that to propose to go spend another three point five trillion? 214 00:13:13,880 --> 00:13:18,240 Speaker 1: So who's right? Joe Biden says infrastructure creates jobs. Kevin 215 00:13:18,320 --> 00:13:22,360 Speaker 1: McCarthy says Democrats have already spent too much. We're joined 216 00:13:22,400 --> 00:13:26,240 Speaker 1: by Gordon Gray, director of Fiscal Policy at the American 217 00:13:26,240 --> 00:13:29,720 Speaker 1: Action Forum, former Senior policy advisor to Senator Rob Portman, 218 00:13:29,760 --> 00:13:34,680 Speaker 1: who of course is leading the GOP side of negotiations. Welcome, 219 00:13:34,679 --> 00:13:37,560 Speaker 1: Gordon's great to have you. Thanks so much for having me. 220 00:13:38,200 --> 00:13:40,320 Speaker 1: I think I know who you're going to agree with here. 221 00:13:41,480 --> 00:13:43,880 Speaker 1: But if we have a jobless recovery, we have Mark's 222 00:13:43,920 --> 00:13:46,160 Speaker 1: Andy telling us yesterday that we need to spend this 223 00:13:46,200 --> 00:13:48,800 Speaker 1: money to not only fix Rhodes Bridges, tunnels, etcetera, but 224 00:13:49,160 --> 00:13:53,719 Speaker 1: also the Reconciliation Plan to add to economic growth, suggesting 225 00:13:53,720 --> 00:13:55,720 Speaker 1: that it will start to slow down once we get 226 00:13:55,760 --> 00:14:02,440 Speaker 1: into fall and winter. When are we gonna have a deal? Well, 227 00:14:02,160 --> 00:14:05,520 Speaker 1: you know, I am encouraged at the progress, the good 228 00:14:05,559 --> 00:14:09,560 Speaker 1: faith progress that congressional negotiators are making. And uh, I 229 00:14:09,600 --> 00:14:12,080 Speaker 1: do think it's probably worth pointing out just a little 230 00:14:12,080 --> 00:14:14,320 Speaker 1: bit that there is a little bit of nuance here 231 00:14:14,320 --> 00:14:17,600 Speaker 1: with respect to spending and inflation, because not all spending 232 00:14:17,720 --> 00:14:21,520 Speaker 1: is created equal. You know, solid investment in infrastructure that 233 00:14:21,600 --> 00:14:28,760 Speaker 1: raises productivity can increase economic growth without overeating the economy, 234 00:14:28,960 --> 00:14:32,600 Speaker 1: but just throwing money at the economy that I think 235 00:14:32,640 --> 00:14:34,880 Speaker 1: some of the other policies that are being considered in 236 00:14:34,920 --> 00:14:38,360 Speaker 1: the broader bill do really have some inflation, right, So 237 00:14:38,360 --> 00:14:40,960 Speaker 1: there's a little bit of nuance here. What is your 238 00:14:41,200 --> 00:14:44,200 Speaker 1: old boss, Rob Portman going through right now? I've you 239 00:14:44,280 --> 00:14:46,840 Speaker 1: a sense of what's going on behind the scenes. He 240 00:14:47,000 --> 00:14:50,360 Speaker 1: is obviously trying to to carry the line for Republicans, 241 00:14:50,400 --> 00:14:52,520 Speaker 1: but he's really walking a tightrope here. And a lot 242 00:14:52,520 --> 00:14:55,200 Speaker 1: of people have suggested after that culture vote yesterday that 243 00:14:55,280 --> 00:14:59,800 Speaker 1: this deal may never happen. So I can just just 244 00:15:00,000 --> 00:15:02,800 Speaker 1: aking from my own experience. You know, Rob is one 245 00:15:02,840 --> 00:15:05,200 Speaker 1: of the hardest working members of the Senate. He is 246 00:15:05,280 --> 00:15:09,800 Speaker 1: a sincere legislator. Uh. He you know, looks at problems 247 00:15:09,800 --> 00:15:13,360 Speaker 1: and tries to approach them pragmatically. Uh. And what I 248 00:15:13,760 --> 00:15:15,680 Speaker 1: know is going on right now is that they're just 249 00:15:15,760 --> 00:15:20,120 Speaker 1: working really hard to find ways to pay for uh 250 00:15:20,120 --> 00:15:24,040 Speaker 1: this big new expenditure that they're considering, and that's really hard. 251 00:15:24,160 --> 00:15:26,480 Speaker 1: There's a reason why we uh you know, we have 252 00:15:26,840 --> 00:15:29,000 Speaker 1: baseline deficits that are on the order of a trillion 253 00:15:29,040 --> 00:15:31,600 Speaker 1: dollars or trillion dollars over the next decade is because 254 00:15:31,640 --> 00:15:34,600 Speaker 1: people don't like paying for stuff, and so that's always 255 00:15:34,600 --> 00:15:37,480 Speaker 1: a tall order. Well, we just had four years of 256 00:15:37,720 --> 00:15:40,040 Speaker 1: Republican president who didn't want to pay for a lot 257 00:15:40,080 --> 00:15:41,840 Speaker 1: of stuff and you know, we're talking about the debt 258 00:15:41,880 --> 00:15:45,200 Speaker 1: ceiling now here Gordon. Uh, it is interesting how people 259 00:15:45,240 --> 00:15:48,240 Speaker 1: find religion when the party seems to change when it 260 00:15:48,240 --> 00:15:52,160 Speaker 1: comes to deficits in there. It's a grand tradition here 261 00:15:52,200 --> 00:15:55,680 Speaker 1: in Washington. So where do you go with that? Then? 262 00:15:55,840 --> 00:15:58,240 Speaker 1: I mean, obviously there are pay for us that have 263 00:15:58,280 --> 00:16:00,680 Speaker 1: been outlined. That's a big part of the the argument 264 00:16:00,800 --> 00:16:04,720 Speaker 1: right now. I mentioned this Trump era medicare regulation that 265 00:16:04,840 --> 00:16:07,880 Speaker 1: they have agreed to delay. But all the while, in 266 00:16:07,920 --> 00:16:11,040 Speaker 1: that same negotiating room, you have members who are looking 267 00:16:11,120 --> 00:16:15,080 Speaker 1: to fulfill their own priorities, right, and and so that's 268 00:16:15,120 --> 00:16:18,600 Speaker 1: always always the challenges that when you when you get 269 00:16:18,600 --> 00:16:21,120 Speaker 1: down to making the hard decisions of what you're gonna 270 00:16:21,160 --> 00:16:25,480 Speaker 1: pay for, and how invariably what you're telling people is no, 271 00:16:25,640 --> 00:16:28,200 Speaker 1: you can't have have something. No you don't get to 272 00:16:28,280 --> 00:16:31,440 Speaker 1: benefit uh through this policy, maybe even in a way 273 00:16:31,480 --> 00:16:33,320 Speaker 1: that you used to. You have to tell people, know, 274 00:16:33,840 --> 00:16:37,400 Speaker 1: nobody gets elected or very few people get elected successfully 275 00:16:37,400 --> 00:16:40,240 Speaker 1: by using the word no very often. And so that's 276 00:16:40,320 --> 00:16:43,320 Speaker 1: that's fundamentally the challenge. When we know, when you're looking 277 00:16:43,360 --> 00:16:47,040 Speaker 1: for for a lot of money to finance a big expenditure, 278 00:16:47,480 --> 00:16:49,800 Speaker 1: you know, then you start adding up an awful lot 279 00:16:49,840 --> 00:16:54,120 Speaker 1: of of promises that people have otherwise made, and it 280 00:16:54,200 --> 00:16:56,400 Speaker 1: makes it difficult to get the y s. If it's 281 00:16:56,440 --> 00:17:01,240 Speaker 1: not paid for, well, Republicans vote for it, I don't 282 00:17:01,240 --> 00:17:06,440 Speaker 1: believe so uh and and Frankly, Um, this is a 283 00:17:06,440 --> 00:17:08,919 Speaker 1: as you you mentioned, you know, Rob is walking a 284 00:17:09,000 --> 00:17:13,160 Speaker 1: very tight tight rope here. Um. They have the good 285 00:17:13,200 --> 00:17:15,880 Speaker 1: faith buy in of of a sufficient number of Republicans 286 00:17:15,880 --> 00:17:19,640 Speaker 1: at the momentum, but we haven't seen the final product. 287 00:17:19,840 --> 00:17:22,959 Speaker 1: And you know that's the that will be the acid 288 00:17:23,000 --> 00:17:25,920 Speaker 1: test for this this proposal because as I said, there's 289 00:17:25,960 --> 00:17:30,560 Speaker 1: gonna be some tough decisions in here. Um and uh. 290 00:17:30,600 --> 00:17:32,920 Speaker 1: And one of those tough decisions is Frankly, to pay 291 00:17:33,040 --> 00:17:35,800 Speaker 1: for it. Now, when this thing comes out, if it's 292 00:17:35,800 --> 00:17:38,560 Speaker 1: filled with budget immics, you know, that may introduce some 293 00:17:38,640 --> 00:17:40,520 Speaker 1: other risks too. So we'll just have to see what 294 00:17:40,560 --> 00:17:43,520 Speaker 1: the final product is. But it's it's it's a tricky 295 00:17:43,880 --> 00:17:49,000 Speaker 1: um needle to um the thread here. So um. You know, Well, 296 00:17:49,040 --> 00:17:51,960 Speaker 1: we'll see Gordon Great, director of Fiscal Policy at the 297 00:17:51,960 --> 00:17:54,440 Speaker 1: American Action Forum. Glad you're with us, Thanks for joining 298 00:17:54,520 --> 00:17:57,600 Speaker 1: us today on Bloomberg Sound On. So what happened to 299 00:17:57,640 --> 00:18:00,800 Speaker 1: the jobs last week that Bloomberg can send call for 300 00:18:00,840 --> 00:18:07,120 Speaker 1: three hundred and fifty thousand new unemployment applications. They actually 301 00:18:07,119 --> 00:18:12,159 Speaker 1: went up by over fifty thousand. We're looking for a 302 00:18:12,280 --> 00:18:16,160 Speaker 1: decline and fifty they went up fifty thousand. Not good 303 00:18:16,800 --> 00:18:19,159 Speaker 1: when we keep hearing companies cannot find enough workers to 304 00:18:19,240 --> 00:18:22,919 Speaker 1: fill positions. Something President Biden was asked about by a 305 00:18:22,960 --> 00:18:26,600 Speaker 1: restaurant owner during a CNN town hall last night. How 306 00:18:27,000 --> 00:18:30,840 Speaker 1: do you and the Biden administration planned to incentivize those 307 00:18:30,880 --> 00:18:34,280 Speaker 1: that haven't returned to work yet. Hiring is our top 308 00:18:34,359 --> 00:18:37,760 Speaker 1: priority right now with two things. One, if you notice, 309 00:18:38,000 --> 00:18:41,199 Speaker 1: we kept you open. We spent billions of dollars to 310 00:18:41,240 --> 00:18:45,199 Speaker 1: make sure restaurants could stay open. And UH, and a 311 00:18:45,240 --> 00:18:49,520 Speaker 1: lot of people who now who worked as waiters and 312 00:18:49,680 --> 00:18:53,639 Speaker 1: waitresses UH, decided that they don't want to do that 313 00:18:53,680 --> 00:18:57,400 Speaker 1: anymore because there's other opportunities at higher wages. Because there's 314 00:18:57,440 --> 00:18:59,960 Speaker 1: a lot of openings now in jobs and people are 315 00:19:00,040 --> 00:19:02,879 Speaker 1: beginning to move, beginning to move. President Biden went on 316 00:19:02,960 --> 00:19:06,439 Speaker 1: to say that workers are looking to bargain and some 317 00:19:06,560 --> 00:19:10,240 Speaker 1: were unsatisfied with that answer. White House Press Secretary Jensaki 318 00:19:10,320 --> 00:19:12,520 Speaker 1: today was asked to clarify. I think what the President 319 00:19:12,560 --> 00:19:15,400 Speaker 1: was noting is that at this point in time it's 320 00:19:15,440 --> 00:19:20,000 Speaker 1: also a workers market, and uh, in some places it 321 00:19:20,280 --> 00:19:22,760 Speaker 1: may be that you have to pay more wages in 322 00:19:22,840 --> 00:19:26,359 Speaker 1: order to attract workers. So we're in a workers market, 323 00:19:26,440 --> 00:19:29,399 Speaker 1: even with almost seven million jobs that have yet to 324 00:19:29,440 --> 00:19:32,600 Speaker 1: be restored from the pandemic. And we talked about it 325 00:19:32,600 --> 00:19:35,439 Speaker 1: now with Bloomberg Government's Andrew Husby. Welcommander, it's good to 326 00:19:35,440 --> 00:19:38,639 Speaker 1: have you great, thanks for having me on. I know 327 00:19:38,680 --> 00:19:40,679 Speaker 1: these weekly reports can be noisy, and I want to 328 00:19:40,680 --> 00:19:44,360 Speaker 1: be clear if I just stepped on those numbers. The 329 00:19:44,359 --> 00:19:48,800 Speaker 1: the Bloomberg consensus was calling for three hundred fifty thousand 330 00:19:48,920 --> 00:19:52,639 Speaker 1: new applications. We got four hundred and nineteen thousand. Is 331 00:19:52,640 --> 00:19:57,320 Speaker 1: this looking more like a jobless recovery? Well, um, I'd 332 00:19:57,320 --> 00:20:01,640 Speaker 1: say in this case there is some underlying noise here. 333 00:20:01,880 --> 00:20:04,320 Speaker 1: So these numbers, you know, they are a week bottle 334 00:20:04,400 --> 00:20:06,840 Speaker 1: on a weekly basis, And right now we're dealing with 335 00:20:07,000 --> 00:20:12,000 Speaker 1: some quirks around normal um, say, retooling in the auto 336 00:20:12,040 --> 00:20:14,959 Speaker 1: sector that had a different labor this year. UM. So 337 00:20:15,040 --> 00:20:17,919 Speaker 1: that I think was behind some of the volatility on 338 00:20:17,960 --> 00:20:20,080 Speaker 1: a and the rise on a state by state basis, 339 00:20:20,080 --> 00:20:22,640 Speaker 1: so the numbers aren't quite as bad as they look. Um. 340 00:20:22,720 --> 00:20:27,480 Speaker 1: And another element of this report was the continuing claims count, 341 00:20:27,520 --> 00:20:30,159 Speaker 1: and that's sort of the measure of weeks filed for 342 00:20:30,440 --> 00:20:32,920 Speaker 1: ongoing claims, and those did show a bit of a 343 00:20:33,000 --> 00:20:36,520 Speaker 1: drop on a seasonally adjusted basis. So um, it's certainly 344 00:20:36,720 --> 00:20:39,720 Speaker 1: we would expect, you know, more progress at this point, 345 00:20:39,960 --> 00:20:42,119 Speaker 1: given how many openings there are. But there are a 346 00:20:42,200 --> 00:20:45,200 Speaker 1: number of frictions in the labor market right now that 347 00:20:45,200 --> 00:20:50,680 Speaker 1: that are certainly uh withholding or restraining better momentum right now. 348 00:20:51,000 --> 00:20:55,600 Speaker 1: A lot of questions seven asked about why what's keeping 349 00:20:55,640 --> 00:20:58,440 Speaker 1: people on the sidelines as we have six point eight 350 00:20:58,480 --> 00:21:01,959 Speaker 1: I believe million jobs yet to be recovered from the 351 00:21:01,960 --> 00:21:03,840 Speaker 1: beginning of the pandemic. A lot of people say that 352 00:21:03,840 --> 00:21:07,359 Speaker 1: could change, Andrew in September when kids start going back 353 00:21:07,440 --> 00:21:11,760 Speaker 1: to school and when unemployment benefits expire. The combined effect 354 00:21:11,760 --> 00:21:16,600 Speaker 1: there could be powerful, right Our Our team does expect that, 355 00:21:16,880 --> 00:21:20,320 Speaker 1: our Blueberry Economics team does expect those uh sort of 356 00:21:20,320 --> 00:21:23,320 Speaker 1: the removal of those frictions to help. Now, certainly there's 357 00:21:23,320 --> 00:21:27,000 Speaker 1: going to be uh some measure of permanent job loss. 358 00:21:27,080 --> 00:21:29,360 Speaker 1: You see it. In the other the monthly numbers from 359 00:21:29,400 --> 00:21:32,119 Speaker 1: the BLS, you do see um a lot of workers 360 00:21:32,200 --> 00:21:36,800 Speaker 1: characterizing themselves as sort of permanently displaced. So UM, the 361 00:21:36,880 --> 00:21:40,040 Speaker 1: full amount likely doesn't come back immediately, that that will 362 00:21:40,080 --> 00:21:44,399 Speaker 1: take time mid the displacement we're seeing, UM, but we 363 00:21:44,440 --> 00:21:49,159 Speaker 1: do expect the combination of child care even healthcare is 364 00:21:49,240 --> 00:21:52,080 Speaker 1: still lingering um, as well as the expiration of those 365 00:21:52,119 --> 00:21:55,679 Speaker 1: unemployment benefits to uh factor into that. We are some 366 00:21:55,760 --> 00:21:58,040 Speaker 1: of the research we've done as over the new year 367 00:21:58,080 --> 00:22:00,080 Speaker 1: term about a million jobs are sort of prime to 368 00:22:00,119 --> 00:22:05,080 Speaker 1: come back as the those benefits have been removed in 369 00:22:05,080 --> 00:22:06,760 Speaker 1: about half of the U S states right now, and 370 00:22:06,760 --> 00:22:08,879 Speaker 1: you are seeing some of those states you see get 371 00:22:08,960 --> 00:22:13,920 Speaker 1: more of a pickup. So the removal of unemployment benefits, 372 00:22:14,000 --> 00:22:17,120 Speaker 1: or at least the the increased unemployment benefits you say, 373 00:22:17,119 --> 00:22:20,600 Speaker 1: will result in a million jobs on its own being restored. 374 00:22:20,680 --> 00:22:24,919 Speaker 1: Is that right on its own? That's that's really a 375 00:22:25,040 --> 00:22:27,720 Speaker 1: number that we think is relevant over the summer, and 376 00:22:27,800 --> 00:22:30,640 Speaker 1: it's probably a bit more as we head into the fall. 377 00:22:30,800 --> 00:22:33,639 Speaker 1: So it's it's a sizable number, but it's still doesn't 378 00:22:33,760 --> 00:22:36,200 Speaker 1: doesn't recoup the full number of jobs. When you talk 379 00:22:36,240 --> 00:22:39,440 Speaker 1: about displaced workers, Andrew, can you explain that a bit more. 380 00:22:39,480 --> 00:22:41,680 Speaker 1: Is that people who had to physically relocate. Is it 381 00:22:41,760 --> 00:22:44,199 Speaker 1: people who retired, is it people who just gave up 382 00:22:44,240 --> 00:22:48,560 Speaker 1: looking It's it's really a mix of all though. So 383 00:22:48,880 --> 00:22:52,440 Speaker 1: you know, in this case, you have a new new 384 00:22:52,440 --> 00:22:55,080 Speaker 1: business models popping up for for some things. You know, 385 00:22:55,119 --> 00:22:59,119 Speaker 1: your your home deliveries, your your work from home type jobs, 386 00:22:59,240 --> 00:23:02,760 Speaker 1: and there are their jobs. The new businesses pop up, 387 00:23:02,760 --> 00:23:06,040 Speaker 1: those need to be filled um with openings with the 388 00:23:06,080 --> 00:23:09,359 Speaker 1: new workers. But at the same time, maybe the corner 389 00:23:09,400 --> 00:23:12,199 Speaker 1: store or the corner restaurant isn't going to open, so 390 00:23:12,280 --> 00:23:15,760 Speaker 1: those work there who live near there that is no 391 00:23:15,840 --> 00:23:19,119 Speaker 1: longer an open a job that's going to be filled immediately. 392 00:23:19,200 --> 00:23:22,320 Speaker 1: So it could be geographic, it could be skills, it's it's, 393 00:23:22,359 --> 00:23:24,320 Speaker 1: in our view, a mix of all of them. And it's, uh, 394 00:23:24,560 --> 00:23:27,320 Speaker 1: it's not something that can be solved over a course 395 00:23:27,320 --> 00:23:29,440 Speaker 1: of weeks or months. It will probably take a year 396 00:23:29,720 --> 00:23:31,760 Speaker 1: or two at least two to get all of those back. 397 00:23:32,520 --> 00:23:35,600 Speaker 1: You mentioned auto jobs at the outset, Andrew, is the 398 00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:38,640 Speaker 1: services sector still the weakest spot. We heard that restaurant 399 00:23:38,640 --> 00:23:41,840 Speaker 1: owner talking with President Biden last night. Fill encounter jobs, 400 00:23:42,920 --> 00:23:46,760 Speaker 1: jobs in the kitchen, restaurants, hospitality is that's still the 401 00:23:46,800 --> 00:23:50,560 Speaker 1: weak point, that is UM and that's also actually where 402 00:23:50,560 --> 00:23:53,359 Speaker 1: you're seeing a lot of openings well above the pre 403 00:23:53,440 --> 00:23:56,639 Speaker 1: pandemic norm. You're seeing far more openings in that that sector. 404 00:23:56,840 --> 00:24:00,600 Speaker 1: And once again this sort of overlaps with that UM 405 00:24:00,880 --> 00:24:05,160 Speaker 1: low wage workers potentially being incentivized to at least hold 406 00:24:05,160 --> 00:24:07,960 Speaker 1: out for for better pay because if you look at 407 00:24:08,280 --> 00:24:12,280 Speaker 1: what those numbers look like, the top up plus regular 408 00:24:12,320 --> 00:24:16,000 Speaker 1: benefits works out to a an hourly wage of somewhere 409 00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:18,640 Speaker 1: in the vicinity of a seventeen to twenty dollars an 410 00:24:18,640 --> 00:24:21,000 Speaker 1: hour UM, and a lot of these jobs we're not 411 00:24:21,080 --> 00:24:23,679 Speaker 1: paying that UM, So in that sense that you can 412 00:24:23,720 --> 00:24:26,640 Speaker 1: kind of understand why why some of these jobs are 413 00:24:26,680 --> 00:24:30,679 Speaker 1: being uh filled less quickly. We're reporting on the terminal today, 414 00:24:30,880 --> 00:24:35,240 Speaker 1: is well Andrew that COVID could inject further volatility in 415 00:24:35,600 --> 00:24:40,120 Speaker 1: these numbers in the coming months. Is that what you expect? Uh, 416 00:24:40,560 --> 00:24:44,040 Speaker 1: certainly volatility. We don't think it changes the trajectory of recovery. 417 00:24:44,280 --> 00:24:46,479 Speaker 1: We think we still see a pretty strong summer and 418 00:24:46,720 --> 00:24:49,879 Speaker 1: still continuing into the fall UM. But there is a 419 00:24:49,960 --> 00:24:53,400 Speaker 1: risk that the delta variant does sort of tamp down 420 00:24:53,440 --> 00:24:57,760 Speaker 1: the degree of economic search this this sum this summer, 421 00:24:58,000 --> 00:25:01,680 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Governments, Andrew Husby, many thanks for the insights today 422 00:25:01,680 --> 00:25:05,960 Speaker 1: helping us understand what's behind these numbers. And you're listening 423 00:25:06,040 --> 00:25:10,359 Speaker 1: to Bloomberg you sound on with Joe Matthew on Bloomberg 424 00:25:10,480 --> 00:25:15,600 Speaker 1: Radio Report today. The White House is in talks with 425 00:25:15,720 --> 00:25:18,520 Speaker 1: the c d C now about whether to update mask 426 00:25:18,640 --> 00:25:21,600 Speaker 1: guidance for all of us in light of the delta 427 00:25:21,720 --> 00:25:25,720 Speaker 1: variants might have increasing cases and hospitalizations in a number 428 00:25:25,760 --> 00:25:29,440 Speaker 1: of states. White House Press Secretary Jensaki, who has asked 429 00:25:29,440 --> 00:25:32,560 Speaker 1: about it today, we are guided by the science, and 430 00:25:32,560 --> 00:25:35,480 Speaker 1: we're guided by our public health experts, and any decision 431 00:25:35,560 --> 00:25:38,960 Speaker 1: would come from the CDC. And what's the c d 432 00:25:39,080 --> 00:25:42,720 Speaker 1: C got to say Director Rachel Wilenski from today's COVID briefing. 433 00:25:43,160 --> 00:25:45,560 Speaker 1: We are always looking at the data as the data 434 00:25:45,640 --> 00:25:49,879 Speaker 1: come in. Our mat our guidance has been clear since 435 00:25:50,040 --> 00:25:53,000 Speaker 1: since we put it out several months ago. And that's 436 00:25:53,040 --> 00:25:55,960 Speaker 1: where we begin with our panel today. Bloomberg Politics contributor 437 00:25:56,040 --> 00:25:59,080 Speaker 1: Jeanie she in Zano is with us, along with Adam Goodman, 438 00:25:59,119 --> 00:26:02,200 Speaker 1: Republican Strategy just In columnist and Edward R. Mourrow, Senior 439 00:26:02,240 --> 00:26:06,080 Speaker 1: Fellow at Toughs University. Welcome to both of you. Genie, 440 00:26:06,160 --> 00:26:08,760 Speaker 1: this is a delicate dance for the White House and 441 00:26:08,840 --> 00:26:11,000 Speaker 1: for federal health officials, for the c d C as 442 00:26:11,040 --> 00:26:13,560 Speaker 1: they've tried to use masks. I think we can agree 443 00:26:14,240 --> 00:26:18,080 Speaker 1: as an incentive to get vaccinated, almost a reward forgetting 444 00:26:18,080 --> 00:26:20,280 Speaker 1: a shot, and an example for people who have not 445 00:26:20,400 --> 00:26:22,840 Speaker 1: see this could be used someday walking around without a mask. 446 00:26:23,720 --> 00:26:25,800 Speaker 1: Do you see them changing Genie this in light of 447 00:26:25,800 --> 00:26:28,720 Speaker 1: the delta variant or would that actually discourage people from 448 00:26:28,760 --> 00:26:32,199 Speaker 1: getting vaccinated. I think it's a very tough decision for 449 00:26:32,240 --> 00:26:34,800 Speaker 1: this White House. Um. I think they will listen to 450 00:26:34,840 --> 00:26:37,320 Speaker 1: what the c d C has to say. But as 451 00:26:37,320 --> 00:26:39,199 Speaker 1: you look at the states, I mean, look at a 452 00:26:39,240 --> 00:26:41,720 Speaker 1: state like Florida. You have the governor to Santis down 453 00:26:41,720 --> 00:26:44,560 Speaker 1: in Florida saying they won't do lockdowns there. You have 454 00:26:44,680 --> 00:26:48,320 Speaker 1: the governor of Texas saying they will not require masks 455 00:26:48,359 --> 00:26:51,760 Speaker 1: in schools. So the White House is in a very 456 00:26:51,840 --> 00:26:54,399 Speaker 1: tough bind here as the President looks to move on 457 00:26:54,480 --> 00:26:57,640 Speaker 1: with the rest of his agenda and these delta numbers sore, 458 00:26:58,160 --> 00:27:00,879 Speaker 1: how do they handle an up an uptick or a 459 00:27:00,920 --> 00:27:03,679 Speaker 1: surge like we're seeing now, Adam Goodman, is it too 460 00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:06,480 Speaker 1: late from a political standpoint as opposed to a health 461 00:27:06,480 --> 00:27:11,240 Speaker 1: standpoint for this mask policy to change. Uh? It is? 462 00:27:11,280 --> 00:27:14,480 Speaker 1: And and I'll tell you if if we do nothing else, 463 00:27:14,920 --> 00:27:18,600 Speaker 1: did you see it is or it isn't it? There's 464 00:27:18,800 --> 00:27:21,840 Speaker 1: there's something we can do, but it can't be done 465 00:27:21,960 --> 00:27:24,280 Speaker 1: just by politicians because they have to be done by 466 00:27:24,280 --> 00:27:27,680 Speaker 1: this by the American people. Joe, if if you did 467 00:27:27,720 --> 00:27:31,440 Speaker 1: nothing else tonight, but take a look at that interview 468 00:27:31,680 --> 00:27:35,639 Speaker 1: from Brittany Kobea who was the internal medicine doctor from Alabama, 469 00:27:36,240 --> 00:27:38,960 Speaker 1: who was talking about how she was holding the hands 470 00:27:39,000 --> 00:27:44,320 Speaker 1: of young people on their deathbed. We're begging for a vaccine. 471 00:27:44,600 --> 00:27:48,720 Speaker 1: They were begging for help, and it was too late. 472 00:27:48,760 --> 00:27:51,879 Speaker 1: If you listen to that and you internalize that, you 473 00:27:52,000 --> 00:27:54,840 Speaker 1: understand this. We all we should all understand this. That 474 00:27:54,960 --> 00:27:58,719 Speaker 1: the best medical answer today and the best political answer 475 00:27:59,040 --> 00:28:02,919 Speaker 1: is getting informed, get serious, and get vaccinated. Uh. And 476 00:28:02,920 --> 00:28:05,680 Speaker 1: in a country that's still under fifty percent in terms 477 00:28:05,680 --> 00:28:07,920 Speaker 1: of those who have been vaccinated, and with the true 478 00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:11,000 Speaker 1: scare and plority talked about Florida in Florida, Now you 479 00:28:11,000 --> 00:28:14,560 Speaker 1: know it's We're one of the hotbeds of the delta variant. 480 00:28:15,240 --> 00:28:17,840 Speaker 1: Get out, get vaccay, and get it done. It is 481 00:28:18,240 --> 00:28:21,960 Speaker 1: really you almost go back to the JFK to President 482 00:28:22,040 --> 00:28:24,000 Speaker 1: Kenned anyway, said, don't ask what the government can do 483 00:28:24,200 --> 00:28:26,960 Speaker 1: for you, ask what you can do for your country. 484 00:28:27,240 --> 00:28:29,520 Speaker 1: What you can do is get out if you haven't 485 00:28:29,560 --> 00:28:32,280 Speaker 1: been vaccinated. And I think that's the message that not 486 00:28:32,440 --> 00:28:36,400 Speaker 1: just the president must needs to carry. We the American 487 00:28:36,480 --> 00:28:40,200 Speaker 1: people have to start to act on what seems to 488 00:28:40,240 --> 00:28:44,600 Speaker 1: be just very sane medical advice. So if I'm understanding you, Adam, 489 00:28:44,640 --> 00:28:47,040 Speaker 1: then there's no point in talking about masks. We need 490 00:28:47,080 --> 00:28:50,880 Speaker 1: to focus on people getting vaccinated. Is that right? Well, 491 00:28:50,920 --> 00:28:52,920 Speaker 1: I think you should. We should do everything we can. 492 00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:55,960 Speaker 1: I've had family members, I've had people in our community 493 00:28:56,080 --> 00:28:58,320 Speaker 1: who in the last couple of days have come down 494 00:28:58,320 --> 00:29:01,440 Speaker 1: with the delta variant. It is getting home now. This 495 00:29:01,520 --> 00:29:03,440 Speaker 1: is the time, I think, when you have people's attention, 496 00:29:03,480 --> 00:29:05,800 Speaker 1: when you should try to do everything across the board 497 00:29:06,480 --> 00:29:08,920 Speaker 1: that includes match. That's great for the first and most 498 00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:12,160 Speaker 1: vital stat is the vaccination. So do it all. As 499 00:29:12,200 --> 00:29:15,120 Speaker 1: I read on the terminal here, this is a story 500 00:29:15,400 --> 00:29:19,120 Speaker 1: COVID increase in hotspots states forecast to worsen. Listen to 501 00:29:19,120 --> 00:29:22,920 Speaker 1: this nationally, cases are likely to rise to three hundred 502 00:29:23,040 --> 00:29:26,280 Speaker 1: six thousand, nine hundred nine. How about that for being 503 00:29:26,360 --> 00:29:29,360 Speaker 1: specific for the week ending August fourteen, That would be 504 00:29:29,440 --> 00:29:34,760 Speaker 1: up thirty from last week from where we were last 505 00:29:34,760 --> 00:29:38,680 Speaker 1: week according to a compilation of forecasts from the c 506 00:29:38,840 --> 00:29:43,360 Speaker 1: d C Genie. That is a scary number to think about. 507 00:29:43,400 --> 00:29:45,720 Speaker 1: And I know we've talked about this a couple of times, 508 00:29:45,720 --> 00:29:48,760 Speaker 1: but it speaks to the changing language that we've heard 509 00:29:49,320 --> 00:29:53,720 Speaker 1: on the right. It's even coming from Fox News hosts. 510 00:29:53,800 --> 00:29:56,840 Speaker 1: At some point. You heard Marshall Blackburn talk about it 511 00:29:56,880 --> 00:30:00,320 Speaker 1: on this program earlier this week, with Republicans now saying 512 00:30:00,320 --> 00:30:03,080 Speaker 1: Steve Scalise was one of them go talk to your 513 00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:06,360 Speaker 1: doctor and get the shot. That's right, And they are 514 00:30:06,440 --> 00:30:08,760 Speaker 1: right to say that, you know it, maybe a little 515 00:30:08,880 --> 00:30:11,480 Speaker 1: later than some people wanted, but but they are right 516 00:30:11,560 --> 00:30:13,600 Speaker 1: to come out. We heard the head of the c 517 00:30:13,760 --> 00:30:16,200 Speaker 1: d C, as you've been talking about, saying things are 518 00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:19,760 Speaker 1: looking very very dire with this delta variant, and yet 519 00:30:19,920 --> 00:30:22,120 Speaker 1: there are also other things being done. I mean, I 520 00:30:22,160 --> 00:30:25,000 Speaker 1: want to mention that you have the mayor of New 521 00:30:25,080 --> 00:30:27,840 Speaker 1: York City who came out and said, one thing we're 522 00:30:27,880 --> 00:30:30,200 Speaker 1: going to do is require people in the health industry 523 00:30:30,480 --> 00:30:33,520 Speaker 1: to have proof of vaccination to Adam's point, or to 524 00:30:33,560 --> 00:30:36,920 Speaker 1: get negative tested weekly. We're also seeing that in other 525 00:30:37,000 --> 00:30:39,280 Speaker 1: parts of the world, like Italy saying that they're going 526 00:30:39,320 --> 00:30:42,160 Speaker 1: to do something similar now. So there are steps that 527 00:30:42,200 --> 00:30:44,680 Speaker 1: can be taken. But I do think this is a 528 00:30:44,800 --> 00:30:48,600 Speaker 1: very tough moment for the White House because they made 529 00:30:48,600 --> 00:30:51,959 Speaker 1: a promise of seventy that they missed. The delta variant 530 00:30:52,000 --> 00:30:54,600 Speaker 1: has kicked up here to tell people they have a 531 00:30:54,760 --> 00:30:57,480 Speaker 1: mask again in the face of governors who were saying 532 00:30:57,520 --> 00:31:00,240 Speaker 1: they won't require that in their states or their ounds 533 00:31:00,280 --> 00:31:03,400 Speaker 1: and cities and counties. Very tough political maneuver for the 534 00:31:03,400 --> 00:31:05,800 Speaker 1: White House here, Adam. I'm curious to know what was 535 00:31:05,880 --> 00:31:10,280 Speaker 1: behind the change, the overnight almost change in talking points 536 00:31:10,320 --> 00:31:14,320 Speaker 1: in conservative media and among some conservative politicians to say, 537 00:31:14,360 --> 00:31:16,640 Speaker 1: you know what, I got a shot, go talk to 538 00:31:16,680 --> 00:31:20,960 Speaker 1: your doctor and make that personal decision. It's different than saying, hey, everybody, 539 00:31:21,000 --> 00:31:23,240 Speaker 1: go to a federal vax site lineup and you know 540 00:31:23,400 --> 00:31:26,520 Speaker 1: where we were months ago, but now this very specific 541 00:31:26,640 --> 00:31:29,040 Speaker 1: order to go sit down with your doctor and have 542 00:31:29,080 --> 00:31:32,840 Speaker 1: a private conversation is the White House talking to Fox 543 00:31:33,160 --> 00:31:35,920 Speaker 1: and other conservative outlets. How did this all come together 544 00:31:36,400 --> 00:31:40,400 Speaker 1: seemingly in one day. It's a great question, and you 545 00:31:40,440 --> 00:31:43,960 Speaker 1: know what, the simple one word answer is reality. Reality 546 00:31:44,040 --> 00:31:46,240 Speaker 1: is kicked in for everybody. I think a lot of 547 00:31:46,320 --> 00:31:49,160 Speaker 1: us felt, okay, you've gotten over the worst of it. Yeah, 548 00:31:49,200 --> 00:31:52,200 Speaker 1: we heard about the variants that we're somewhere happy world 549 00:31:52,200 --> 00:31:54,480 Speaker 1: away at this point, and more and more people are 550 00:31:54,480 --> 00:31:57,440 Speaker 1: getting vaccinated, and it seemed we could breathe again. People 551 00:31:57,440 --> 00:32:00,640 Speaker 1: are coming outdoors on the mass mandates said we're giving 552 00:32:00,680 --> 00:32:04,360 Speaker 1: way to open mandates to live and be free again. 553 00:32:04,680 --> 00:32:06,960 Speaker 1: And then suddenly this news hit is like a ton 554 00:32:07,000 --> 00:32:10,160 Speaker 1: of bricks and it is indefensible if you look at 555 00:32:10,160 --> 00:32:12,880 Speaker 1: this new evidence and you understand what we've just gone through, 556 00:32:12,920 --> 00:32:15,120 Speaker 1: for better part of it, for over a year, and 557 00:32:15,160 --> 00:32:19,000 Speaker 1: you're not changing your tune if your tune before was well, 558 00:32:19,080 --> 00:32:21,080 Speaker 1: freedom says you can kind of do what you want. 559 00:32:21,400 --> 00:32:25,640 Speaker 1: I believe that there's a social contract, a social compact 560 00:32:25,680 --> 00:32:28,560 Speaker 1: we've got to recognize once again in this country, and 561 00:32:28,600 --> 00:32:31,480 Speaker 1: it begins with doing what's right, not just for yourself 562 00:32:31,520 --> 00:32:33,800 Speaker 1: and your family, but for others. And I think a 563 00:32:33,920 --> 00:32:37,480 Speaker 1: Republicans and conservatives have come very quickly to the point 564 00:32:37,480 --> 00:32:39,720 Speaker 1: of view with the new evidence that's in play, that 565 00:32:39,760 --> 00:32:41,720 Speaker 1: they're going to have to get on board and help 566 00:32:42,160 --> 00:32:45,280 Speaker 1: lead lead the way as opposed to, you know, kind 567 00:32:45,320 --> 00:32:49,440 Speaker 1: of make excuses for again liberty and freedom being an 568 00:32:49,440 --> 00:32:52,840 Speaker 1: alibi for not doing the responsible thing and spending time 569 00:32:52,880 --> 00:32:56,520 Speaker 1: with Bloomberg Politics contributor Genie she and Zano and Adam Goodman, 570 00:32:56,920 --> 00:33:01,360 Speaker 1: Republican strategists and columnists at Toughs University. I want to 571 00:33:01,400 --> 00:33:03,480 Speaker 1: ask you both about jobs and some of the comments 572 00:33:03,480 --> 00:33:05,560 Speaker 1: that we heard from President Biden last night. We talked 573 00:33:05,560 --> 00:33:09,240 Speaker 1: about some of this earlier, but the sort of idea 574 00:33:09,640 --> 00:33:13,600 Speaker 1: that workers are for the first time, maybe ever, in 575 00:33:13,640 --> 00:33:18,560 Speaker 1: control as opposed to the wealthy dictating what labor will do. 576 00:33:18,720 --> 00:33:21,120 Speaker 1: This was the President last night on CNN. I think 577 00:33:21,160 --> 00:33:27,360 Speaker 1: it really is a matter of people deciding now that 578 00:33:27,440 --> 00:33:30,640 Speaker 1: they have opportunities to do other things and there is 579 00:33:30,680 --> 00:33:34,240 Speaker 1: a shortage of employees, people are looking to make more 580 00:33:34,280 --> 00:33:37,680 Speaker 1: money and to bargain. The President basically said, if you 581 00:33:37,720 --> 00:33:41,800 Speaker 1: want to hire people, spend more, pay them more money. 582 00:33:41,840 --> 00:33:46,600 Speaker 1: Is that the answer? But he was paid more. I 583 00:33:46,640 --> 00:33:48,400 Speaker 1: think that sounded to me a bit like the old 584 00:33:48,520 --> 00:33:51,360 Speaker 1: Joe Biden we used to hear when he gets off script. 585 00:33:51,640 --> 00:33:54,200 Speaker 1: I don't think that's exactly what he meant to say. 586 00:33:54,240 --> 00:33:56,080 Speaker 1: And of course you look at the jobless numbers you 587 00:33:56,120 --> 00:33:59,520 Speaker 1: were just talking about, you know, to say that, you know, 588 00:33:59,600 --> 00:34:03,200 Speaker 1: simply just pay people more in this economy and inflation 589 00:34:03,400 --> 00:34:05,840 Speaker 1: is still an issue, or to say that it's in 590 00:34:05,880 --> 00:34:09,239 Speaker 1: the hands of workers who are out there negotiating. You know, 591 00:34:09,320 --> 00:34:11,359 Speaker 1: we've got almost you know, about twelve and a half 592 00:34:11,440 --> 00:34:14,880 Speaker 1: million people in this country who are still claiming jobless 593 00:34:14,880 --> 00:34:19,480 Speaker 1: benefits four d and twenty thousand people uh new jobless 594 00:34:19,480 --> 00:34:22,960 Speaker 1: claim increases. You know, these are big, big numbers. So 595 00:34:23,080 --> 00:34:25,560 Speaker 1: I'm not quite certain that the answer is simply pay 596 00:34:25,600 --> 00:34:28,359 Speaker 1: them more and they're out there negotiating. And I think 597 00:34:28,440 --> 00:34:30,800 Speaker 1: we heard Jen Psaki try to walk that back a 598 00:34:30,880 --> 00:34:32,759 Speaker 1: little bit, or at least explain it and put it 599 00:34:32,800 --> 00:34:36,239 Speaker 1: in context. Well, although we have Adam heard him say 600 00:34:36,280 --> 00:34:38,440 Speaker 1: something pretty darn close to that in a news conference 601 00:34:38,520 --> 00:34:40,600 Speaker 1: at the White House when you kind of lean into 602 00:34:40,600 --> 00:34:43,560 Speaker 1: the mic you said you want to hire people pay them. Now, 603 00:34:43,600 --> 00:34:48,680 Speaker 1: obviously we've seen wages increase dramatically and and frankly unsustainable 604 00:34:48,760 --> 00:34:51,680 Speaker 1: level in some areas. We were referring recently to this 605 00:34:51,760 --> 00:34:54,400 Speaker 1: thirty increase we saw in one case according to the 606 00:34:54,440 --> 00:34:56,759 Speaker 1: Beige Book in Boston. But how else are you going 607 00:34:56,800 --> 00:34:59,480 Speaker 1: to get people back? Well, well, first of all, I 608 00:34:59,520 --> 00:35:01,920 Speaker 1: was a genie, was right on about you know, the president, 609 00:35:01,960 --> 00:35:04,560 Speaker 1: and I think having to walk it back. Let's let 610 00:35:04,640 --> 00:35:07,799 Speaker 1: me bring this into a larger context after I give 611 00:35:07,840 --> 00:35:11,680 Speaker 1: you one one headline in Florida, in Florida trend, I 612 00:35:11,719 --> 00:35:13,560 Speaker 1: think two weeks ago there was a headline that said 613 00:35:13,920 --> 00:35:18,160 Speaker 1: five hundred thousand Flordians unemployed, five hundred thousand job openings. 614 00:35:18,360 --> 00:35:20,600 Speaker 1: I mean that kind of says, you know, it's not 615 00:35:20,640 --> 00:35:23,880 Speaker 1: about they are not opportunities that people are choosing a 616 00:35:23,880 --> 00:35:26,200 Speaker 1: lot of people have been choosing not to work. But 617 00:35:26,239 --> 00:35:29,040 Speaker 1: the bigger issue here, Joe, the bigger issue. And you 618 00:35:29,080 --> 00:35:31,120 Speaker 1: saw that in the New Harris poll when they did, 619 00:35:31,280 --> 00:35:33,440 Speaker 1: you know, the poll on the infrastructure bill and the 620 00:35:33,920 --> 00:35:37,799 Speaker 1: four the three point five trillion on top of that, um, 621 00:35:37,920 --> 00:35:40,200 Speaker 1: A lot of people support the infrastructure bill, but six 622 00:35:41,000 --> 00:35:45,000 Speaker 1: in that poll uh said that social spending must have 623 00:35:45,040 --> 00:35:49,480 Speaker 1: by Parson support and almost said they are worried about 624 00:35:49,560 --> 00:35:53,080 Speaker 1: runaway taxes and inflation and that's why that number is 625 00:35:53,120 --> 00:35:57,359 Speaker 1: too big for them, and that Adam good. But I'm sorry, 626 00:35:57,400 --> 00:35:59,879 Speaker 1: we're out of time. Republican strategist and columnists, come back 627 00:36:00,120 --> 00:36:02,160 Speaker 1: see us. I know Genie Will, Jennie She and Zeno 628 00:36:02,200 --> 00:36:05,879 Speaker 1: are Bloomberg Politics contributor. I'm Joe Matthew in Washington. Glad 629 00:36:05,920 --> 00:36:07,759 Speaker 1: we can spend some time together here. Will we get 630 00:36:07,760 --> 00:36:10,080 Speaker 1: a deal tomorrow? Let's meet back at this time and 631 00:36:10,120 --> 00:36:13,520 Speaker 1: find out on Bloomberg's sound on. I'm Joe Matthew. This 632 00:36:13,680 --> 00:36:14,320 Speaker 1: is Bloomberg