WEBVTT - Julian Lage/Don Was 0:00:15.516 --> 0:00:22.836 Pushkin. We occasionally feel the emails and dms from Broken 0:00:22.876 --> 0:00:25.036 Record listeners telling us who they'd like to hear on 0:00:25.076 --> 0:00:28.156 the program. The past handful of years, one name has 0:00:28.196 --> 0:00:31.516 come up more than others, Julian Lage. Now, if you're 0:00:31.516 --> 0:00:33.516 not part of the Converted, not a member of one 0:00:33.516 --> 0:00:35.916 of his devoted legions of fans, that may come as 0:00:35.956 --> 0:00:38.276 a surprise to you. But if you get the chance 0:00:38.276 --> 0:00:40.236 to spend some time with his music after listening to 0:00:40.316 --> 0:00:44.036 this episode, I have just one word for you, welcome. 0:00:44.916 --> 0:00:47.716 Julian's path and music has been as unique as his gifts. 0:00:47.876 --> 0:00:49.596 He picked up the guitar at five years old and 0:00:49.676 --> 0:00:52.796 quickly became obsessed with the instrument. That obsession and what 0:00:52.916 --> 0:00:55.156 must have been some level of innate abilities, led to 0:00:55.196 --> 0:00:57.876 his designation as a child prodigy, and as you'll hear, 0:00:58.316 --> 0:01:01.036 the opportunity to play live on stage with Carlos Santana 0:01:01.036 --> 0:01:04.196 at eight and live on a Grammy telecast at thirteen. 0:01:05.236 --> 0:01:07.316 But it's his development as an artist over the course 0:01:07.356 --> 0:01:09.716 of four albums and four years on Blue Note that's 0:01:09.756 --> 0:01:12.676 most impressive to me. His album Speak to Me came 0:01:12.676 --> 0:01:15.676 out earlier this year and is impressionistic in its beauty 0:01:15.796 --> 0:01:19.916 rather than prodigious, often quiet rather than flashy. For the 0:01:19.956 --> 0:01:22.476 last episode in our series celebrating the creative legacy of 0:01:22.476 --> 0:01:25.076 Blue Note Records over eighty five years, Don Was and 0:01:25.116 --> 0:01:26.996 I spoke with Julian Lage in front of a live 0:01:27.036 --> 0:01:29.836 audience at the Blue Note Club in New York. We 0:01:29.836 --> 0:01:32.636 talked about his upbringing as a prodigy, about writing and 0:01:32.676 --> 0:01:35.316 recording his new album, and about his unique approach to 0:01:35.396 --> 0:01:39.396 learning and playing guitar. Oh and he plays for us too. 0:01:42.196 --> 0:01:45.476 This is Broken Record Liner Notes for the digital Age. 0:01:45.636 --> 0:01:52.676 I'm justin Richman. Here's Don Was and myself in the 0:01:52.716 --> 0:01:55.316 Blue Note in New York with Julian Lage. See the 0:01:55.316 --> 0:01:57.676 full video version of this episode go to YouTube dot 0:01:57.716 --> 0:01:59.676 com slash Broken Record Podcast. 0:02:01.036 --> 0:02:02.396 How are you my friend? 0:02:03.076 --> 0:02:03.356 Good? 0:02:03.956 --> 0:02:05.156 So, thank you for doing this. 0:02:05.276 --> 0:02:07.316 I mam my pleasure. Thanks for having me. 0:02:07.396 --> 0:02:14.036 Oh Man, your new record is gorgeous record for gorgeous. 0:02:14.116 --> 0:02:15.916 Thank you. I appreciate that it really is. 0:02:17.636 --> 0:02:19.436 But I think Donn and I have talked about maybe 0:02:19.476 --> 0:02:20.676 starting a little further back. 0:02:20.916 --> 0:02:23.356 You say wherever you want, I'm all yours. 0:02:23.676 --> 0:02:26.276 I watched a little bit of Jewels at eight Did 0:02:26.316 --> 0:02:29.636 you really yea the whole the whole thing is not. 0:02:30.596 --> 0:02:32.676 No, I don't I don't even know how to find it. 0:02:32.716 --> 0:02:38.356 Their little little excerpts up there. Yeah, and you get 0:02:38.476 --> 0:02:43.316 such a such a unique blend of real sweetness and 0:02:43.676 --> 0:02:47.556 unbelievable talent. I don't know, have you. This is a 0:02:47.596 --> 0:02:49.356 movie that was made when he was. 0:02:49.836 --> 0:02:51.716 Years old old. 0:02:51.796 --> 0:02:53.996 Yeah, someone shot? Who shot? Who made it? 0:02:54.516 --> 0:02:56.756 It's a director named Mark Becker, and he was he 0:02:56.796 --> 0:02:59.956 was at Stanford as a film student, and he had this. 0:03:00.636 --> 0:03:03.756 It's kind of interesting because it wasn't it really wasn't 0:03:03.756 --> 0:03:05.876 about me. He just wanted a movie about a young 0:03:05.956 --> 0:03:10.116 musician or talented person who is straddling the worlds of 0:03:10.516 --> 0:03:15.076 childhood and some sort of skill. And so he called 0:03:15.116 --> 0:03:17.956 us to do it, and my parents and I said no, 0:03:18.076 --> 0:03:20.876 absolutely not, you know, because I really keep in mind, 0:03:20.916 --> 0:03:23.036 I'd only been playing guitar for two years. I wasn't 0:03:23.076 --> 0:03:26.276 like an established musician. But he heard of me through some 0:03:26.396 --> 0:03:29.276 channel who knows what, and came. He was very persistent, 0:03:29.316 --> 0:03:32.076 and eventually we said, well, hey, this is clearly more 0:03:32.076 --> 0:03:34.396 about you than about me, and that's kind of good 0:03:34.716 --> 0:03:36.796 in a way. So that's why we proceeded. But yes, 0:03:36.836 --> 0:03:39.436 there was this film made. 0:03:39.396 --> 0:03:44.156 You're clearly a child prodigy, and there must be an 0:03:44.196 --> 0:03:50.996 incredible set of expectations and pressures that go along with that. 0:03:51.556 --> 0:03:53.556 Sure, absolutely, How. 0:03:53.356 --> 0:03:54.356 Did you deal with that? 0:03:54.796 --> 0:03:57.356 Well, it's so cool that you frame it that way, 0:03:57.396 --> 0:04:01.716 because I think so often there's something blinding about really anybody, 0:04:01.796 --> 0:04:06.316 but especially young people when they exhibit any propensity. Is that, yeah, there, 0:04:08.196 --> 0:04:10.596 you get blinded by that. It's dazzling, and you don't 0:04:10.676 --> 0:04:14.756 It's easy to forget that there's emotional infrastructure that needs 0:04:14.756 --> 0:04:18.796 to be built and supported, and just to even understand 0:04:19.196 --> 0:04:21.996 your own progress and understand your worth is not maybe 0:04:22.036 --> 0:04:24.716 tied to your progress. And in some parts of life 0:04:24.756 --> 0:04:26.476 you might be really advanced, other parts of life, you're 0:04:26.516 --> 0:04:29.916 really at the beginning. All these considerations. I think they 0:04:30.076 --> 0:04:32.956 reveal themselves, but it's easier to see that when you 0:04:32.996 --> 0:04:38.036 have a supporting family or teachers or community. Now. At 0:04:38.036 --> 0:04:40.196 the time, I remember getting a lot of attention, but 0:04:41.116 --> 0:04:44.516 I never once felt overwhelmed by it, and I attribute 0:04:44.516 --> 0:04:47.396 that to my parents. They were when my father was 0:04:47.436 --> 0:04:49.116 a young boy, he was a bit of He was 0:04:49.156 --> 0:04:51.796 a child prodigy as a visual artist, and he had 0:04:51.756 --> 0:04:54.636 a one man show in southern California and we used 0:04:54.636 --> 0:04:56.516 to have letters from you know, he'd send a portrait 0:04:56.556 --> 0:04:58.556 to Jacqueline Kennedy and he'd get a letter back saying 0:04:58.636 --> 0:05:01.196 thank you, or Norman Rockwell, and so I think he 0:05:01.436 --> 0:05:04.116 saw and at certain points he got older, he decided 0:05:04.156 --> 0:05:07.116 not to pursue art because I think that part of 0:05:07.116 --> 0:05:10.476 it freaked him out, is what I imagine. So when 0:05:10.476 --> 0:05:12.036 it came to me, I think there was already a 0:05:12.036 --> 0:05:15.196 certain defensive barrier. No one could really get to me. 0:05:15.236 --> 0:05:17.676 As a kid, I practiced a lot. I did my thing. 0:05:17.756 --> 0:05:21.356 Every so often, I'd come up for air, but I 0:05:21.436 --> 0:05:25.596 didn't I was unbothered by it. Now, as I became 0:05:25.676 --> 0:05:27.636 more of an adult, I could see it in the 0:05:27.636 --> 0:05:30.676 rear view beer a little differently. And I think what 0:05:30.836 --> 0:05:32.796 helped me was that I didn't make a record under 0:05:32.836 --> 0:05:36.516 my own name until I was about twenty one twenty two. 0:05:37.196 --> 0:05:40.116 So from five until twenty two, I was just a 0:05:40.156 --> 0:05:43.396 guy practicing guitar, playing people's bands, and it was great. 0:05:44.236 --> 0:05:46.476 I think I needed that many years to just kind 0:05:46.476 --> 0:05:48.676 of develop, and then when I hit it, I really 0:05:48.756 --> 0:05:52.116 hit it strong. The last thing I'll say about that, 0:05:52.236 --> 0:05:53.996 I know I've said it before in other forums, but 0:05:55.436 --> 0:05:57.836 I'm of the generation right before the Internet being so 0:05:58.116 --> 0:06:02.076 prevalent in young people's lives. So there was a documentary 0:06:02.116 --> 0:06:04.196 made about me, but there was no YouTube, There was 0:06:04.236 --> 0:06:07.556 no clips of me anywhere, so I was a secret. 0:06:08.236 --> 0:06:10.196 What went out was very even in the documentary, I 0:06:10.196 --> 0:06:13.196 don't actually play guitar in it, which is interesting. I 0:06:13.236 --> 0:06:15.436 don't play. There's a moment where I play a scale, 0:06:16.036 --> 0:06:17.916 but that's kind of wild to think of that that 0:06:18.076 --> 0:06:19.796 I'm not playing, you know, I could that could be, 0:06:19.876 --> 0:06:23.156 it could be all bogus for all anyone knows. But 0:06:23.276 --> 0:06:24.956 thank god I didn't, you know, so I don't even 0:06:24.956 --> 0:06:26.236 know what I sounded like at that age. 0:06:26.276 --> 0:06:29.396 Really, you sounded awesome. You were playing. 0:06:30.916 --> 0:06:34.556 For a second, that's all I knew that that was 0:06:34.636 --> 0:06:35.476 the whole riff. 0:06:35.676 --> 0:06:37.276 Well, I think that's one of one of the things 0:06:37.316 --> 0:06:43.076 about child prodigies is that I've seen a lot of that, 0:06:43.476 --> 0:06:47.076 you know, but very few make the transition into being 0:06:48.556 --> 0:06:52.396 adult artists. Yeah, and I think that, you know, they 0:06:52.516 --> 0:06:57.436 a lot of them can do an eagle soul perfectly, 0:06:57.476 --> 0:06:59.676 you know, and that's amazing to see a young kid 0:06:59.676 --> 0:07:02.796 do that. But I didn't sinse even when I heard 0:07:02.876 --> 0:07:09.036 you whatever you did in the It didn't sound like 0:07:09.196 --> 0:07:12.556 anybody else. You weren't copying Eric Clappin or anything. You had. 0:07:12.756 --> 0:07:15.236 You had a voice, and I think that's you. That's 0:07:15.316 --> 0:07:18.756 the rarest thing is development of your own voice. 0:07:18.836 --> 0:07:22.476 Right well, I do, I do believe that, especially from 0:07:22.476 --> 0:07:24.436 where I sit now. I was talking to my wife 0:07:24.436 --> 0:07:28.276 Margaret about this just was it last night. But my father, 0:07:28.356 --> 0:07:33.716 both my parents possessed this ability to be They're fans 0:07:33.716 --> 0:07:35.996 of art and music and life right this, and so 0:07:36.596 --> 0:07:38.516 they would talk about things I remember as a kid, 0:07:38.596 --> 0:07:42.396 and they would analyze people, Uh not in the way of, Okay, 0:07:42.436 --> 0:07:45.116 this person's great, you should be like them, but they 0:07:45.156 --> 0:07:50.756 would say, this artist must think this way about themselves 0:07:51.316 --> 0:07:54.316 in order to get this result that you're hearing, you 0:07:54.396 --> 0:07:56.716 know what I mean. It's very new. As a kid, 0:07:56.716 --> 0:07:59.076 we would listen to Jim Hall or something just because 0:07:59.076 --> 0:08:01.596 it was in the house that those records. I just 0:08:01.636 --> 0:08:03.956 remember having those conversations with my father saying that, oh, 0:08:03.996 --> 0:08:07.356 he must have a an acceptance of his own sense 0:08:07.356 --> 0:08:09.796 of humor and phrasing, because that that's what I'm getting 0:08:09.796 --> 0:08:11.756 from this. And I took it for granted, but I 0:08:11.796 --> 0:08:15.556 realized it's really rare. Usually we kind of say, well, 0:08:15.956 --> 0:08:19.356 we people become icons, and then it's very it becomes 0:08:19.356 --> 0:08:22.636 almost impossible to develop a voice because you just aren't 0:08:22.636 --> 0:08:25.036 that person. Your body doesn't work that way, your brain 0:08:25.036 --> 0:08:26.676 doesn't work that way, your heart doesn't work that way. 0:08:26.676 --> 0:08:28.996 You didn't have those parents, you know. But I think 0:08:29.036 --> 0:08:32.356 everything was broken down is if you can understand your 0:08:32.356 --> 0:08:35.636 relationship to yourself, you'll be you'll have access to what 0:08:35.676 --> 0:08:39.716 you can offer most genuinely. And for that, I'm so 0:08:39.796 --> 0:08:41.636 grateful and I think that is the root of kind 0:08:41.636 --> 0:08:43.796 of developing a voice on an instrument. Also, I'm a 0:08:43.876 --> 0:08:46.116 terrible mimic. I couldn't sound like anyone if I tried, 0:08:46.276 --> 0:08:49.436 and I tried, I really remember no. I really my 0:08:49.476 --> 0:08:52.196 wife on that. She's a brilliant. She can hear something, 0:08:52.396 --> 0:08:55.556 repeat it, make it her own. I you know, I 0:08:55.596 --> 0:08:58.036 really can't. And it's good. It's a good handicapped. 0:08:59.676 --> 0:09:02.556 That tradition you're talking about though, of like there's icons 0:09:02.636 --> 0:09:04.676 and then that you kind of steep yourself in them 0:09:04.876 --> 0:09:07.076 and so to become like them and then maybe hopefully 0:09:07.156 --> 0:09:11.036 for lucky, find your voice after. That'sicularly strong tradition in guitar. 0:09:11.236 --> 0:09:14.636 Unless sure, young young people learning guitar and playing guitar. 0:09:14.876 --> 0:09:17.356 Oh my god? Yeah, did you have moments early on 0:09:17.396 --> 0:09:19.556 with that? I mean, were you did you have at 0:09:19.596 --> 0:09:24.116 any point, even if it was a traditional, traditional, more 0:09:24.116 --> 0:09:27.996 traditional trajectory of like I'm learning the blues now now transitioning. 0:09:29.116 --> 0:09:31.476 Well, well, I consider myself, it's a great question. I 0:09:31.516 --> 0:09:34.516 consider myself such a history nut, you know, or maybe 0:09:34.516 --> 0:09:37.956 more accurately, I believe I find great support in knowing 0:09:37.996 --> 0:09:42.356 that I'm far from the only person doing this. You know, 0:09:42.636 --> 0:09:44.276 it was here before me. I'll be here when I'm dead, 0:09:44.276 --> 0:09:49.076 So I'm just passing through, you know. So uh, yes, 0:09:49.116 --> 0:09:51.676 I think there were times where I would investigate history, 0:09:51.836 --> 0:09:55.236 you know. Okay, I really want to understand t Bone Walker, 0:09:55.236 --> 0:09:57.636 and I really want to understand Muddy Waters. And I'm 0:09:57.676 --> 0:09:59.316 not going to learn what they do, but I'm just gonna, 0:10:00.276 --> 0:10:03.276 I guess, cultivate a certain reverence through listening, playing along 0:10:03.276 --> 0:10:07.756 with records, same with jazz, same with different musicians. But 0:10:08.556 --> 0:10:10.756 I was always under the belief I remember so vividly 0:10:10.756 --> 0:10:13.596 thinking that here's my dream. I want us to be 0:10:13.876 --> 0:10:15.716 right where I am with you right now. This truly 0:10:15.796 --> 0:10:18.676 is my dream with all of you, and I want 0:10:18.716 --> 0:10:21.876 to be myself, being a part of a creative project. 0:10:22.116 --> 0:10:27.556 That's what I want, and I recognize that in order 0:10:27.636 --> 0:10:29.716 to do that and feel comfortable, I need to deal 0:10:29.756 --> 0:10:31.596 with a lot of things that are really no one 0:10:31.596 --> 0:10:35.356 else's business. And that's that's scales, that's theory, that's the 0:10:35.436 --> 0:10:37.996 understanding the guitar. I need to get this sort and 0:10:38.036 --> 0:10:42.316 so that our time isn't spent kind of being distracted 0:10:42.356 --> 0:10:45.076 by something I'm not I don't have together. That was 0:10:45.116 --> 0:10:47.836 always my view, So I remember practicing and acquiring information 0:10:48.156 --> 0:10:50.676 from that perspective. I got to acquire a lot so 0:10:50.716 --> 0:10:54.956 that I can just be available emotionally, because we all 0:10:54.956 --> 0:10:56.756 know that when you're just inundated with stuff you have 0:10:56.796 --> 0:10:59.876 to learn, and like you're saying these towering icons over us, 0:11:00.276 --> 0:11:03.316 you can't. You're fumbling to just get through. And that's 0:11:03.356 --> 0:11:06.516 that can really plummet your sense of self, you know, 0:11:06.916 --> 0:11:08.516 And I just I just need to nix that in 0:11:08.556 --> 0:11:12.196 the butt. There are things that are knowable on the guitar, 0:11:12.356 --> 0:11:15.516 and there's the good stuff is the unknowable stuff, but 0:11:15.596 --> 0:11:17.636 there are noble things. I know where the notes are, 0:11:17.676 --> 0:11:18.876 and I know how to hold a pick. 0:11:18.716 --> 0:11:22.396 And can you explain what the noble versus unknowable show. 0:11:22.716 --> 0:11:27.476 There's absolutely it's it's a little bit I feel silly 0:11:28.276 --> 0:11:30.556 doing in front of all you guys. But you know, 0:11:30.716 --> 0:11:34.396 even knowing where the pitches are on the instrument, I've 0:11:34.396 --> 0:11:38.316 always felt like that's massively overlooked. Okay, you have, you 0:11:38.356 --> 0:11:42.996 have all these seas there, and unless I change something 0:11:42.996 --> 0:11:44.876 about the tuning or take a string off, those notes 0:11:44.916 --> 0:11:47.316 will be there for me. Now what I've found, and 0:11:47.316 --> 0:11:50.756 that's true of every all twelve pitches. What I've found, though, 0:11:50.836 --> 0:11:52.836 is there are so many hurdles as guitar players we 0:11:52.876 --> 0:11:55.916 get into. I was there for a long time that 0:11:55.956 --> 0:12:00.036 are attributed to knowing thirty percent of the neck fifty. 0:12:00.036 --> 0:12:01.796 But I know where three of the seas are. I don't. 0:12:02.236 --> 0:12:03.596 I really shouldn't go up there, I should go over 0:12:03.596 --> 0:12:07.996 here instead. That's a very simple example of kind of 0:12:07.996 --> 0:12:10.876 doing your homework as far is just map it out, 0:12:11.236 --> 0:12:14.116 not with a system. It takes a week, you know it, 0:12:14.116 --> 0:12:17.276 it really does. Always I felt about it. Another example 0:12:17.316 --> 0:12:26.996 of it, I've had a fastening. You're really interested in this, Yeah, well, 0:12:27.076 --> 0:12:31.876 I I've been fascinated by this, this thing about mastery 0:12:31.916 --> 0:12:33.796 on the guitar, right because we're all interested all of 0:12:33.796 --> 0:12:35.276 the super you know, you see the people go wow, 0:12:35.276 --> 0:12:37.636 they seem really good. They know something I don't. And 0:12:37.676 --> 0:12:40.956 I feel that all the time with my heroes. However, 0:12:40.996 --> 0:12:43.916 there are things. There's when you're good at something, there's 0:12:43.956 --> 0:12:48.236 there's attributes that also kick in. Like if you're you 0:12:48.276 --> 0:12:51.236 can use a fork and have a conversation, that means 0:12:51.276 --> 0:12:52.476 you probably know how to use a fork. There are 0:12:52.516 --> 0:12:54.876 these like okay, there's a bandwidth for other things. So 0:12:54.956 --> 0:12:57.076 I remember, as a young person, younger person, I was 0:12:57.116 --> 0:13:01.276 really thinking about that on the guitar. What despite all 0:13:01.276 --> 0:13:03.156 the things I know, I don't know what's something I 0:13:03.156 --> 0:13:04.836 can do that I just feel I could do in 0:13:04.876 --> 0:13:06.756 my sleep. You can wake me up at three in 0:13:06.796 --> 0:13:08.996 the morning with a fire extinguishure in my face. They do, 0:13:09.156 --> 0:13:10.716 and I'd say, okay, I can do it. And a 0:13:10.716 --> 0:13:14.116 really good example would be probably playing a C major chord. 0:13:14.276 --> 0:13:16.396 You know the reason I say that, I probably learned 0:13:16.436 --> 0:13:19.956 it really early on. And when I do it, I 0:13:19.956 --> 0:13:22.476 can talk and do it. I can breathe and do it. 0:13:22.516 --> 0:13:25.476 I can I don't feel I'm not really I feel good. 0:13:25.636 --> 0:13:28.876 I feel good and I can do it. Now to me, 0:13:28.996 --> 0:13:31.396 that's somewhat of a litmus test. That's a metric for 0:13:31.436 --> 0:13:33.756 what it's like to have a mastery over a little 0:13:33.796 --> 0:13:36.916 domain on the instrument. Now, the next thing would be 0:13:36.916 --> 0:13:40.076 to tackle something that I have less of that experience with. 0:13:40.716 --> 0:13:42.636 So if I would do that and then i'd work 0:13:42.676 --> 0:13:45.716 on I don't know what, I'd work on something difficult, 0:13:45.916 --> 0:13:48.996 and immediately I would just say, what has left me? 0:13:49.876 --> 0:13:52.676 I can't really breathe when I'm doing it. I'm really anxious, 0:13:52.876 --> 0:13:56.476 I'm kind of fumbling my tone, okay, dipped, Okay, so 0:13:56.596 --> 0:13:58.756 let me go back to the reset. And I would 0:13:58.756 --> 0:14:00.316 be ridiculous if you saw me, But I would keep 0:14:00.356 --> 0:14:04.836 going back to that kind of touchstone. Wow, And if 0:14:04.836 --> 0:14:07.636 you do it enough, you know how to For me, 0:14:07.676 --> 0:14:09.076 at least, I felt like I was able to get 0:14:09.156 --> 0:14:12.636 those difficult things to feel good in a way that 0:14:12.676 --> 0:14:16.396 I had faith in. It's very hard to have faith 0:14:16.396 --> 0:14:18.196 in that you're good at something if you if you're 0:14:18.236 --> 0:14:19.916 not used to that good feeling. Do you know what 0:14:19.996 --> 0:14:20.316 I mean? 0:14:20.476 --> 0:14:24.516 Yeah, it's kind of interesting. So it's it's you knew 0:14:24.596 --> 0:14:26.956 you had the hard thing when the hard thing kind of. 0:14:26.956 --> 0:14:29.716 Felt felt like the thing that I considered good not 0:14:29.836 --> 0:14:31.756 what someone else considered good feeling. 0:14:31.916 --> 0:14:32.116 Yeah. 0:14:32.276 --> 0:14:33.796 Yeah, And it's funny to say that because I'm not 0:14:33.916 --> 0:14:36.276 terribly stubborn, So it's not like it's not a This 0:14:36.316 --> 0:14:38.556 isn't a protest, you know, I really don't have a 0:14:38.636 --> 0:14:40.436 dog in the race. It just made sense to me, 0:14:40.476 --> 0:14:44.236 and I think that's how my father looked at teaching 0:14:44.276 --> 0:14:47.396 me guitar when I when I started too. It's all 0:14:47.436 --> 0:14:48.236 from him, you know. 0:14:48.396 --> 0:14:51.436 That's an incredible way to That's a really sophisticated way 0:14:51.476 --> 0:14:55.596 of approaching guitar that my parents are deep. 0:14:56.996 --> 0:14:58.796 But it's it's beautiful because I have seen it pop 0:14:58.876 --> 0:15:00.756 up in others. You see this, you see that. It's 0:15:00.796 --> 0:15:02.356 the same with our health. You have to know when 0:15:02.356 --> 0:15:04.036 you felt good, to know when you don't feel good, right, 0:15:04.196 --> 0:15:05.596 you have to kind of you have to. It's a 0:15:05.596 --> 0:15:07.436 play of oppositions. 0:15:07.236 --> 0:15:08.916 With a touchstone champ. I mean, what, for instance, what 0:15:09.196 --> 0:15:09.916 always be the seed? 0:15:10.276 --> 0:15:12.356 It could be anything sometimes, but you have to go 0:15:12.436 --> 0:15:15.916 and go to something that you would It feels too 0:15:15.956 --> 0:15:18.716 simple to be legitimate. This is one of my favorites. 0:15:18.796 --> 0:15:22.276 You know, once it feels as once something difficult feels 0:15:22.316 --> 0:15:25.356 as comfortable as just strong me a guitar open with nothing. 0:15:25.716 --> 0:15:28.156 That's when we're kind of getting close to a sense 0:15:28.196 --> 0:15:31.556 of feeling masterful. It's it's certainly been working in a 0:15:31.636 --> 0:15:34.116 nice way, and I and maybe it'll change, you know. 0:15:34.916 --> 0:15:38.636 Do you have variations, you know on different days, like 0:15:38.756 --> 0:15:40.076 something seem harder. 0:15:40.276 --> 0:15:42.676 Oh, one hundred, that's such a good point. Yeah, there, 0:15:42.796 --> 0:15:46.996 there's I feel that in the realm of time, feel 0:15:47.516 --> 0:15:50.116 like I noticed it. Depending on the season, you know, 0:15:50.196 --> 0:15:54.036 a daily, weekly, monthly, yearly, some things will just feel 0:15:54.076 --> 0:15:57.756 not accessible. I can't settle into this beat, or I can, 0:15:57.836 --> 0:15:59.196 but it's going to take me an hour and then 0:15:59.196 --> 0:16:02.116 I can feel it. Other days they'll okay, there's I 0:16:02.116 --> 0:16:06.556 can kind of access that physically too. I'm not a 0:16:06.596 --> 0:16:09.356 big believer at this point, least in warming up on 0:16:09.396 --> 0:16:11.556 the instrument, like it was a time where I did. 0:16:12.396 --> 0:16:14.916 Speaking just from my own experience, I think there's kind 0:16:14.956 --> 0:16:19.476 of a I like the way I sound when I'm 0:16:19.516 --> 0:16:22.916 not warmed up. Sometimes yeah, I trip over my hand, 0:16:22.956 --> 0:16:25.516 but I also have to deal with that like a 0:16:25.596 --> 0:16:28.676 human being rather than just oh this feels great, I 0:16:28.716 --> 0:16:32.556 can do anything I want. So I would say it 0:16:32.596 --> 0:16:38.196 does change as far as the physical time feel, I 0:16:38.276 --> 0:16:40.476 like a lot of playing, a lot of improvised music. 0:16:40.516 --> 0:16:43.036 So usually the cures just start playing. You and I 0:16:43.076 --> 0:16:45.076 have talked about this done before, about the kind of 0:16:45.116 --> 0:16:50.516 the just the virtuous world of playing longer. You know, 0:16:50.636 --> 0:16:52.556 if you're looking for I want to sit down, play 0:16:52.596 --> 0:16:55.236 for five minutes and be amazing, that's great. But what 0:16:55.276 --> 0:16:56.796 if you sit down for forty five minutes, an hour, 0:16:56.876 --> 0:16:59.236 two hours, three hours and you don't stop. You will 0:16:59.316 --> 0:17:03.276 hit walls and you also, my experience, resolve them musically 0:17:03.956 --> 0:17:06.556 rather than divorcing them from the act of playing. And 0:17:06.596 --> 0:17:09.476 so usually when something's off, I just play more. 0:17:09.716 --> 0:17:12.156 I've heard that you'll play like ninety minutes sometimes over 0:17:12.236 --> 0:17:13.116 just the same changes. 0:17:13.356 --> 0:17:17.236 Absolutely, Oh you get so it's kind of yeah, sick 0:17:17.276 --> 0:17:19.396 of yourself, and then you get happy, and then you 0:17:19.396 --> 0:17:23.076 get it. It's a journey, you know. But long form 0:17:23.116 --> 0:17:25.556 playing has been become a big that's a big part 0:17:25.596 --> 0:17:27.876 of my life. And if I don't have the time 0:17:27.876 --> 0:17:31.356 for that lately, I'm okay, just not playing. Do something 0:17:31.356 --> 0:17:33.716 else long form, do you know, Just be alive long 0:17:33.756 --> 0:17:36.796 for you know, but just try not to break every 0:17:36.796 --> 0:17:40.556 part of life into these little kind of life hacker moments. 0:17:41.596 --> 0:17:45.716 There's a great line in Jewels that day where your 0:17:46.116 --> 0:17:51.116 dad's talking and he's talking about people saying, well, don't 0:17:51.116 --> 0:17:52.956 make him practice all the time. He said, no, I 0:17:53.596 --> 0:17:54.556 try to make him stop. 0:17:55.756 --> 0:17:58.156 It was true, like you have to really stop. It's 0:17:58.156 --> 0:18:01.596 been eight hours, you know. It's funny like that. 0:18:01.756 --> 0:18:02.036 Though. 0:18:02.996 --> 0:18:06.596 I feel lucky because I teach a lot, not much lately, 0:18:06.676 --> 0:18:09.756 but I've taught a lot culturally speak. There is so 0:18:09.916 --> 0:18:12.876 much pressure nowadays in the educational system that I remember 0:18:12.876 --> 0:18:16.556 even as a kid, it wasn't the same. And I 0:18:16.596 --> 0:18:19.396 really have looked back on it. Play all day because 0:18:19.396 --> 0:18:22.196 it's fun was kind of okay, but I've noticed that 0:18:22.276 --> 0:18:24.676 rhetoric is not the same. And if you see young, well, 0:18:24.956 --> 0:18:26.636 that's great that you can play, but you can't just play. 0:18:26.676 --> 0:18:28.596 You've got to be working on something and you have 0:18:28.636 --> 0:18:31.036 to that has to be something that you can show 0:18:31.076 --> 0:18:32.436 to other people, so we can tell you if you're 0:18:32.476 --> 0:18:35.396 getting better or not. I somehow avoided all of that. Yeah, 0:18:35.436 --> 0:18:37.636 that's good, So I feel lucky. 0:18:38.036 --> 0:18:39.836 After fare in school, you went to berkeleye age. 0:18:39.916 --> 0:18:42.036 I went to Berkeley College of Music. I loved it. Well, 0:18:42.276 --> 0:18:44.196 at first I didn't, and then I loved it. You know, 0:18:45.116 --> 0:18:48.956 as a teenager, I started playing with Gary Burton and. 0:18:49.196 --> 0:18:51.636 Before you were at before, yeah, before. 0:18:51.396 --> 0:18:54.196 I was there, so I but Gary used to be 0:18:54.236 --> 0:18:55.996 you know, the he ran that school for so many 0:18:56.076 --> 0:18:57.676 years and he's a part of it for fifty years. 0:18:57.676 --> 0:19:01.076 So it wasn't a big leap to say, well, when 0:19:01.116 --> 0:19:02.956 I get old enough, I want to go there. Gary's 0:19:03.036 --> 0:19:07.436 kind of my guy. So I went and I did 0:19:07.596 --> 0:19:09.956 the thing, Okay, go up to the class whatever, and 0:19:10.036 --> 0:19:12.756 I really didn't like it. I was kind of miserable 0:19:12.836 --> 0:19:17.236 for the first semester, and by no one's doing other 0:19:17.276 --> 0:19:20.076 than my own. I realized that I'd gone from being 0:19:20.076 --> 0:19:24.076 in this musical space to music school, which we all 0:19:24.156 --> 0:19:25.956 those who are familiar with any kind of art school, 0:19:26.276 --> 0:19:30.036 they kind of they have to make it such that 0:19:30.116 --> 0:19:33.356 you're that everyone has accessed information. So you go from 0:19:33.356 --> 0:19:36.316 being the special person in your community, you know, to 0:19:36.436 --> 0:19:38.996 being one of thousands. You go from being the person 0:19:38.996 --> 0:19:41.556 your bedroomho's learning songs because you're just fascinated too. I've 0:19:41.556 --> 0:19:43.476 got homework now and I haven't touched the guitar in 0:19:43.516 --> 0:19:46.836 a month. I thought something's off, you know, So I 0:19:46.916 --> 0:19:48.836 called the president of the school, Roger Brown, who I 0:19:48.876 --> 0:19:51.436 really adore, right to the top. I just said, look, 0:19:51.796 --> 0:19:54.196 I don't want always say anyone. Sime. You're so so 0:19:54.276 --> 0:19:55.876 gracious to let me be here, but I'm going to 0:19:55.956 --> 0:19:57.316 tell you this isn't for me, and I'm going to 0:19:57.556 --> 0:20:00.716 move on. And he he I left that at a voicemail. 0:20:02.116 --> 0:20:04.836 I realized now he called me back, a'mbout tim and 0:20:04.916 --> 0:20:06.836 to say he said, Julian Jillie, what is up? But 0:20:06.836 --> 0:20:08.916 I said, well, here's the deal. I know if I 0:20:09.316 --> 0:20:11.796 I can cultivate what I'm doing already, there's jazz guitar 0:20:11.916 --> 0:20:14.596 pass there's all I want to get my butt kicked 0:20:14.756 --> 0:20:16.796