1 00:00:02,160 --> 00:00:02,920 Speaker 1: The media. 2 00:00:12,160 --> 00:00:16,000 Speaker 2: The most difficult part of the journey is when you 3 00:00:16,040 --> 00:00:19,520 Speaker 2: are treking and you meet dead bodies on the road. 4 00:00:21,760 --> 00:00:28,560 Speaker 2: It makes you weep, it makes you cry, but there's 5 00:00:28,600 --> 00:00:33,000 Speaker 2: only one focus in the forest ahead. You have to 6 00:00:33,080 --> 00:00:41,080 Speaker 2: keep going. You'll see mother's children. They are crying just 7 00:00:41,120 --> 00:00:49,600 Speaker 2: to have a sip of water. It is not easy. 8 00:00:53,760 --> 00:00:56,200 Speaker 1: A few weeks ago, I found myself sitting beside the 9 00:00:56,200 --> 00:00:59,840 Speaker 1: Tuquesa River on a warm afternoon in late September, making 10 00:01:00,000 --> 00:01:02,120 Speaker 1: bill faces at a two months old baby as we 11 00:01:02,240 --> 00:01:06,720 Speaker 1: both marveled at the cloud yellow butterflies. Anywhere else on earth, 12 00:01:06,800 --> 00:01:09,480 Speaker 1: it could be in a dyllic summer day, But in 13 00:01:09,520 --> 00:01:11,800 Speaker 1: these final steps, as a journey across the daddy and Gap, 14 00:01:12,319 --> 00:01:14,760 Speaker 1: it's hard to open up your mind to experience joy. 15 00:01:16,160 --> 00:01:18,240 Speaker 1: I'd only been in the tiny Emberra village of Baho 16 00:01:18,319 --> 00:01:20,880 Speaker 1: Jigito a couple of days, and I had already seen 17 00:01:20,920 --> 00:01:22,880 Speaker 1: the lifeless body of a little girl, as though the 18 00:01:22,920 --> 00:01:26,440 Speaker 1: migrants carried her into town. The river I was sleeping 19 00:01:26,440 --> 00:01:28,560 Speaker 1: around him, with this group of migrants resting here in 20 00:01:28,560 --> 00:01:31,360 Speaker 1: the shade, had swept sleeping children to their deaths earlier 21 00:01:31,360 --> 00:01:34,120 Speaker 1: this year. An upstream of me, there were at least 22 00:01:34,120 --> 00:01:38,400 Speaker 1: three people's remains here. It was shin deep, but crossing 23 00:01:38,440 --> 00:01:41,040 Speaker 1: upstream where it's above head height and rages down out 24 00:01:41,080 --> 00:01:44,360 Speaker 1: of the mountains in steep ravines. Was the migrants I 25 00:01:44,360 --> 00:01:47,400 Speaker 1: walked back to town with told me the stuff of nightmares. 26 00:01:48,040 --> 00:01:50,240 Speaker 1: The voice you just heard was a migrant from Cameroon 27 00:01:50,240 --> 00:01:53,640 Speaker 1: who called himself James. That's not his real name, and 28 00:01:53,920 --> 00:01:56,520 Speaker 1: astute listeners will have noticed that it is my real name, 29 00:01:57,120 --> 00:01:59,640 Speaker 1: but for the protection of James and his family, it's 30 00:01:59,640 --> 00:02:03,200 Speaker 1: a name be using when I met James. We're in 31 00:02:03,240 --> 00:02:06,280 Speaker 1: a migrant reception center called Las Blancas, to the north 32 00:02:06,320 --> 00:02:09,600 Speaker 1: of the Darien Gap. To get there, one has to 33 00:02:09,600 --> 00:02:12,760 Speaker 1: take a dugout canoe called a piragua from Bajo Jaquito. 34 00:02:13,800 --> 00:02:16,840 Speaker 1: The voyage takes five hours, and for that five hours, 35 00:02:16,880 --> 00:02:19,760 Speaker 1: migrants are packed fifteen to a boat wearing bright orange 36 00:02:19,800 --> 00:02:23,040 Speaker 1: life jackets. They share the boat with nembra piraguero who 37 00:02:23,040 --> 00:02:24,919 Speaker 1: sit at the back driving the boat with a two 38 00:02:24,919 --> 00:02:27,720 Speaker 1: stroke motor, and a guide who sits on the front, 39 00:02:28,040 --> 00:02:30,160 Speaker 1: using a pole when necessary to push the boat through 40 00:02:30,200 --> 00:02:33,560 Speaker 1: shallow sections. The Umbra people are indigenous to the area 41 00:02:33,600 --> 00:02:36,200 Speaker 1: that's commonly known as the Daliang Gap, or at least 42 00:02:36,400 --> 00:02:39,000 Speaker 1: to this part of it and the tiny Embrea village 43 00:02:39,000 --> 00:02:42,120 Speaker 1: of Bajo Jaquito. It's a first settlement migrants encounter is 44 00:02:42,120 --> 00:02:44,359 Speaker 1: they emerge from the perilous crossing of the jungle that 45 00:02:44,440 --> 00:02:48,440 Speaker 1: divides Central America from South America and thousands of people 46 00:02:48,639 --> 00:02:52,200 Speaker 1: from a better future. There's a morale patch that the 47 00:02:52,240 --> 00:02:55,480 Speaker 1: Panamanian Border Patrol and military were on their uniforms There 48 00:02:55,480 --> 00:03:01,680 Speaker 1: reflects a slogan in a government messaging campaign darien asuna Jungla. 49 00:03:01,880 --> 00:03:05,040 Speaker 1: It says. The campaign was launched in August, and it 50 00:03:05,040 --> 00:03:07,880 Speaker 1: translates to the darinessn't a route or maybe a roads 51 00:03:07,880 --> 00:03:13,080 Speaker 1: a better translation, it's a jungle. Obviously it's actually both, 52 00:03:13,919 --> 00:03:15,919 Speaker 1: but this is like no route. Most of us will 53 00:03:15,960 --> 00:03:18,799 Speaker 1: be familiar with. The dark and foreboding jungle I saw 54 00:03:18,840 --> 00:03:21,520 Speaker 1: in Bahajigito is one of the most impenetrable on Earth, 55 00:03:22,400 --> 00:03:24,600 Speaker 1: and the crossing of it is among the most dangerous 56 00:03:24,680 --> 00:03:28,480 Speaker 1: land migration routes. In the nineteen seventies, the British Army 57 00:03:28,520 --> 00:03:30,919 Speaker 1: sent its most experienced explorers to find a way through 58 00:03:30,960 --> 00:03:34,960 Speaker 1: the gap. Their commander called the gap a god forsaken place. 59 00:03:35,520 --> 00:03:39,480 Speaker 1: Today migrants have their own names for it, Dete or 60 00:03:39,520 --> 00:03:44,240 Speaker 1: sometimes the Green Hell. Here's a group from Cameroon explaining 61 00:03:44,240 --> 00:03:46,600 Speaker 1: why they didn't see a future there and they decided 62 00:03:46,640 --> 00:03:48,120 Speaker 1: to take this dangerous route. 63 00:03:48,280 --> 00:03:51,560 Speaker 3: We are coming from Cameroon. I'm my name is Flowers. 64 00:03:52,240 --> 00:03:54,320 Speaker 3: There's a lot of crisis in our country. The civil 65 00:03:54,360 --> 00:03:57,200 Speaker 3: war going on in Cameroon right now because of our president. 66 00:03:57,280 --> 00:04:00,240 Speaker 3: President Pombia has been in part over forty two years. 67 00:04:00,560 --> 00:04:03,840 Speaker 3: So I was the anglophone. We started revolting for him 68 00:04:03,840 --> 00:04:08,520 Speaker 3: to step down because he doesn't develop the Southern American Sorry, 69 00:04:08,080 --> 00:04:13,320 Speaker 3: the English section of Cameroon anglerphone. Yeah, the anglophone sections 70 00:04:13,560 --> 00:04:16,120 Speaker 3: revolt ins that you was selling the military and it's 71 00:04:16,240 --> 00:04:19,760 Speaker 3: killing the citizens of our country. There's a lot of hardship, 72 00:04:19,800 --> 00:04:22,039 Speaker 3: a lot of that. Eye for one, I've lost everybody, 73 00:04:22,440 --> 00:04:24,440 Speaker 3: a lot of my family, my mom, my dad, my 74 00:04:24,520 --> 00:04:27,800 Speaker 3: two brothers, and I'm the only one left so things 75 00:04:27,839 --> 00:04:30,719 Speaker 3: and there is no job. I've completed school, but there's 76 00:04:30,800 --> 00:04:33,120 Speaker 3: nothing for me to do. So that's why it decided to. 77 00:04:33,160 --> 00:04:37,679 Speaker 1: Mygrae to get to Baho Jikito from Columbia. It's James 78 00:04:37,720 --> 00:04:40,160 Speaker 1: and other migrants did. There's no road you can take. 79 00:04:40,920 --> 00:04:43,880 Speaker 1: You can't even take a boat or a train. Instead, 80 00:04:44,120 --> 00:04:46,960 Speaker 1: you have to walk the Darying Gap, an area of 81 00:04:47,080 --> 00:04:50,320 Speaker 1: rainforested mountains, so it's one of the most dangerous migration 82 00:04:50,480 --> 00:04:54,719 Speaker 1: routes in the world. For anywhere between two and fifteen days, 83 00:04:55,279 --> 00:04:58,159 Speaker 1: migrants trek through waste time mud rivers deeper than they 84 00:04:58,200 --> 00:05:02,760 Speaker 1: are at all. They must im giant boulders, cross perilous ravines, 85 00:05:03,160 --> 00:05:07,000 Speaker 1: and traverse sheer cliff faces, all of this with barely 86 00:05:07,080 --> 00:05:10,159 Speaker 1: any water than what they can carry, little to no food, 87 00:05:10,800 --> 00:05:15,599 Speaker 1: inadequate clothing, a terrible footwear, and no medical attention. They 88 00:05:15,680 --> 00:05:18,440 Speaker 1: must walk past dead bodies and past people who might 89 00:05:18,520 --> 00:05:21,680 Speaker 1: soon become dead bodies as they beg for help. They 90 00:05:21,800 --> 00:05:25,640 Speaker 1: carry their children, their dreams, and sometimes each other across 91 00:05:25,720 --> 00:05:29,360 Speaker 1: mountains and rivers, and in bau Jiquito they take what, 92 00:05:29,520 --> 00:05:31,480 Speaker 1: for many of them will be the final steps of 93 00:05:31,560 --> 00:05:35,080 Speaker 1: this part of their journey. It's a journey that few 94 00:05:35,120 --> 00:05:37,400 Speaker 1: of us can imagine, and they were lucky to be 95 00:05:37,440 --> 00:05:40,760 Speaker 1: able to avoid. My own migration to the US sixteen 96 00:05:40,839 --> 00:05:44,600 Speaker 1: years ago was much simpler and safer, But for migrants 97 00:05:44,680 --> 00:05:47,800 Speaker 1: like James, the journey's worth it because what they're leaving 98 00:05:47,839 --> 00:05:51,520 Speaker 1: behind is worse. Here's James describing the situation in the 99 00:05:51,560 --> 00:05:52,360 Speaker 1: state of Cameroon. 100 00:05:53,680 --> 00:05:55,479 Speaker 4: The situation in Cameroon is. 101 00:05:57,520 --> 00:06:02,920 Speaker 2: How can I pity, Very very, very very difficult, especially 102 00:06:03,320 --> 00:06:09,520 Speaker 2: in the Anglophone part of the country. Yeah, because for 103 00:06:10,240 --> 00:06:16,640 Speaker 2: about five to six years there's a world ongoing war 104 00:06:16,760 --> 00:06:18,000 Speaker 2: in the anglophone. 105 00:06:17,520 --> 00:06:19,200 Speaker 4: Crisis we are. 106 00:06:19,279 --> 00:06:24,279 Speaker 2: So they have been there has been fighting, has been shooting, killings. 107 00:06:26,680 --> 00:06:33,960 Speaker 2: I myself speaking to you, Yeah, I've been targeted. My 108 00:06:34,640 --> 00:06:42,400 Speaker 2: cousin was shot and with his husband were shot together. 109 00:06:42,960 --> 00:06:43,839 Speaker 4: Both of them. 110 00:06:45,240 --> 00:06:50,000 Speaker 2: Were nursis and they were shot by the army that 111 00:06:50,120 --> 00:06:54,320 Speaker 2: were there to protect the people. So the situation back 112 00:06:54,400 --> 00:07:00,760 Speaker 2: at home, it's very very tense, Yeah, very very tense. 113 00:07:01,880 --> 00:07:06,799 Speaker 2: When you see most of Camaronians traveling taking the Rigspath 114 00:07:06,960 --> 00:07:11,120 Speaker 2: from Columbia Brazy right up to where I am. 115 00:07:12,000 --> 00:07:14,880 Speaker 4: It is not because they like it. It's because of 116 00:07:14,920 --> 00:07:16,240 Speaker 4: the situation back at. 117 00:07:16,160 --> 00:07:18,680 Speaker 2: Home and most of it, and most of the time 118 00:07:19,640 --> 00:07:22,040 Speaker 2: it is the anglophone population that is suffering. 119 00:07:22,560 --> 00:07:25,120 Speaker 4: Most of them. They choose this part because they will 120 00:07:25,200 --> 00:07:27,120 Speaker 4: not have a direct result to America. 121 00:07:27,640 --> 00:07:28,720 Speaker 1: It's very hard to get one way. 122 00:07:28,800 --> 00:07:31,360 Speaker 2: Yes, it's very very difficult. So they have to use 123 00:07:31,440 --> 00:07:33,440 Speaker 2: the hard way, which is the only way. 124 00:07:34,520 --> 00:07:38,360 Speaker 1: The truth is dead bodies, terrible stories, and families celebrating 125 00:07:38,400 --> 00:07:40,920 Speaker 1: the end of their work. It's nothing out of the ordinary. 126 00:07:40,920 --> 00:07:44,240 Speaker 1: And Babu Jikito, the Enbarra town, with the population of 127 00:07:44,320 --> 00:07:46,680 Speaker 1: just five hundred and ninety, it's a place I've been 128 00:07:46,720 --> 00:07:48,600 Speaker 1: trying to come to for almost as long as I've 129 00:07:48,640 --> 00:07:51,720 Speaker 1: been writing about migration. There are a few stories in 130 00:07:51,760 --> 00:07:53,640 Speaker 1: my time as a journalist that I've been pitching for 131 00:07:53,720 --> 00:07:56,800 Speaker 1: close to a decade. Most of the time I give 132 00:07:56,880 --> 00:07:58,640 Speaker 1: up if there are no bites after a few months. 133 00:07:59,280 --> 00:08:01,240 Speaker 1: And that's why you won't see me right about the 134 00:08:01,280 --> 00:08:03,680 Speaker 1: people who tried to hire mercenaries to intimidate voters in 135 00:08:03,720 --> 00:08:06,560 Speaker 1: twenty twenty, or the Burmese rebels who if I did 136 00:08:06,600 --> 00:08:09,360 Speaker 1: their revolution with co op produced tea or a surfing 137 00:08:09,400 --> 00:08:12,320 Speaker 1: team in the Gaza strip, And on reflection, you probably 138 00:08:12,320 --> 00:08:16,080 Speaker 1: won't hear about that last one anywhere. Now. The media 139 00:08:16,120 --> 00:08:19,000 Speaker 1: cycle has a way of coming around to these stories eventually, sure, 140 00:08:19,120 --> 00:08:20,920 Speaker 1: but I not really want to go back to what 141 00:08:21,040 --> 00:08:22,880 Speaker 1: it is who didn't give a shit about people before 142 00:08:22,960 --> 00:08:25,280 Speaker 1: and only care about their stories now because they get 143 00:08:25,320 --> 00:08:28,480 Speaker 1: more traffic. But there's one story I've never given up on. 144 00:08:29,160 --> 00:08:31,440 Speaker 1: That's the story of a daddy en gap and the 145 00:08:31,520 --> 00:08:33,760 Speaker 1: people who risk their lives crossing it for a shot 146 00:08:33,840 --> 00:08:36,800 Speaker 1: at the American dream. And at this point I do 147 00:08:36,880 --> 00:08:38,880 Speaker 1: want to ignolize. I'm incredibly grateful to the people I 148 00:08:39,000 --> 00:08:41,040 Speaker 1: work with for trusting me when I asked them to 149 00:08:41,080 --> 00:08:43,000 Speaker 1: pay for me to disappear in a dugout canoe into 150 00:08:43,040 --> 00:08:45,839 Speaker 1: the jungle and come back two weeks later with a story. 151 00:08:47,240 --> 00:08:49,599 Speaker 1: The daddy and looms in the stories of migrants I 152 00:08:49,640 --> 00:08:51,720 Speaker 1: meet in the US border as a sort of heart 153 00:08:51,760 --> 00:08:55,000 Speaker 1: of darkness on what is a very difficult and dangerous journey. 154 00:08:56,000 --> 00:08:58,480 Speaker 1: It's worse than the freight trains they hop on in Mexico, 155 00:08:59,080 --> 00:09:02,319 Speaker 1: worse in the crowded worse even than the months of 156 00:09:02,440 --> 00:09:06,079 Speaker 1: waiting for an asylum appointment. I firly believe that you 157 00:09:06,200 --> 00:09:10,600 Speaker 1: can't really understand and write about things you haven't seen, smelt, 158 00:09:10,679 --> 00:09:13,559 Speaker 1: and heard. So for years I've been asking theeed it 159 00:09:13,720 --> 00:09:15,200 Speaker 1: is to send me to the tiny and but our 160 00:09:15,240 --> 00:09:18,199 Speaker 1: community on the banks of the river, so that I 161 00:09:18,240 --> 00:09:20,800 Speaker 1: could share the final steps of this horrific journey with 162 00:09:20,920 --> 00:09:22,920 Speaker 1: the people who see little option but to risk their 163 00:09:22,960 --> 00:09:26,640 Speaker 1: lives for a better future for their children. Because the 164 00:09:26,800 --> 00:09:30,679 Speaker 1: US refuses to create more legal pathways, people instead take 165 00:09:30,720 --> 00:09:33,040 Speaker 1: a sudden pathway straight up and down the mountains to 166 00:09:33,080 --> 00:09:36,599 Speaker 1: the Darian rainforest. The journey will take them past the 167 00:09:36,679 --> 00:09:39,920 Speaker 1: corpse into people who never left. The terrain is too 168 00:09:40,040 --> 00:09:42,720 Speaker 1: fierce for anyone to carry their remains out, so they 169 00:09:42,800 --> 00:09:45,079 Speaker 1: must simply rut there as a reminder to migrants, so 170 00:09:45,120 --> 00:09:48,040 Speaker 1: they must keep going. It's a sort of deterrent through 171 00:09:48,120 --> 00:09:50,600 Speaker 1: death that has been the unofficial and official US border 172 00:09:50,640 --> 00:09:54,040 Speaker 1: policy for decades. To turn or not. Once you're in 173 00:09:54,080 --> 00:09:56,559 Speaker 1: the Darien, there's no turning back, and the lack of 174 00:09:56,720 --> 00:10:00,160 Speaker 1: escape routes has made the gap popular among criminals who 175 00:10:00,160 --> 00:10:03,880 Speaker 1: commit untold numbers of sexual assaults, murders, and armed robberies 176 00:10:03,920 --> 00:10:07,600 Speaker 1: every year in the jungle. Despite this, more than half 177 00:10:07,640 --> 00:10:10,439 Speaker 1: a million migrants made the perilous journey last year, and 178 00:10:10,520 --> 00:10:12,400 Speaker 1: it's many, if not more, will do so this year. 179 00:10:13,559 --> 00:10:15,600 Speaker 1: Do you understand the Daddy and you have to first 180 00:10:15,679 --> 00:10:18,800 Speaker 1: understand US immigration policy, which is something I talk about 181 00:10:18,800 --> 00:10:21,480 Speaker 1: a lot on this podcast. I want to include here 182 00:10:21,520 --> 00:10:24,160 Speaker 1: a clip from Amos, a migrant from North Africa who 183 00:10:24,240 --> 00:10:26,120 Speaker 1: met my friends and helped them build shelters in u 184 00:10:26,160 --> 00:10:29,800 Speaker 1: Cumba last year, explaining his journey to the United States. 185 00:10:30,480 --> 00:10:34,520 Speaker 5: So another route right now, which is a difficult route, 186 00:10:34,600 --> 00:10:38,640 Speaker 5: is through Brazil because Brazil has a I don't know 187 00:10:38,760 --> 00:10:43,000 Speaker 5: if you guys know, and I think they do that 188 00:10:43,080 --> 00:10:47,240 Speaker 5: for Americans too. Yeah, so Brazil has sort of I 189 00:10:47,280 --> 00:10:49,360 Speaker 5: don't know the word, but the equivalent to them is 190 00:10:49,400 --> 00:10:53,360 Speaker 5: if you impose of his own Brazil Brazilians were imposed 191 00:10:53,360 --> 00:10:56,000 Speaker 5: of his own news. They do that to Americans too, So. 192 00:10:58,200 --> 00:10:58,959 Speaker 1: You know where I'm from. 193 00:10:59,040 --> 00:11:02,600 Speaker 5: They don't have a visa to uh as far as 194 00:11:02,960 --> 00:11:05,719 Speaker 5: for Brazilians, so we don't. So a lot of Africans 195 00:11:05,880 --> 00:11:09,280 Speaker 5: can go to Brazil and from Brazil take the the 196 00:11:09,400 --> 00:11:10,640 Speaker 5: route all the way. 197 00:11:11,080 --> 00:11:14,199 Speaker 1: That game was James couldn't fly here directly that he 198 00:11:14,360 --> 00:11:15,719 Speaker 1: was able to get a little bit closer to the 199 00:11:15,840 --> 00:11:18,640 Speaker 1: US by flying to Columbia. I'll let him explain how 200 00:11:18,679 --> 00:11:19,360 Speaker 1: he pulled that off. 201 00:11:20,120 --> 00:11:25,079 Speaker 2: For me to have a pass to Colombia, it was 202 00:11:25,200 --> 00:11:30,599 Speaker 2: not easy, so we had we had to There was 203 00:11:30,679 --> 00:11:34,120 Speaker 2: a female female on that twenty World Cup that was 204 00:11:35,880 --> 00:11:39,480 Speaker 2: that was taking place in Colombia, so we had to 205 00:11:39,600 --> 00:11:43,880 Speaker 2: go to Columbia as football fans. That's why they had 206 00:11:43,960 --> 00:11:47,920 Speaker 2: they had to give us our visa is all right. 207 00:11:47,960 --> 00:11:52,040 Speaker 2: From Colombia, we'll find our way out of the airport to. 208 00:11:54,000 --> 00:11:54,960 Speaker 4: Where we are today. 209 00:11:56,120 --> 00:12:00,319 Speaker 1: Most continental America. We'll have to travel to Brazil, just 210 00:12:00,440 --> 00:12:03,560 Speaker 1: like Amos. Here's one ac Can. I'll let the speakers 211 00:12:03,559 --> 00:12:04,360 Speaker 1: introduce himselves. 212 00:12:05,520 --> 00:12:07,880 Speaker 6: My name is Tom, I m I'm from Idan. 213 00:12:09,600 --> 00:12:11,000 Speaker 1: My name is mohade for. 214 00:12:11,080 --> 00:12:14,079 Speaker 7: Omran, my name is Ali, and I'm from Idan. 215 00:12:14,800 --> 00:12:17,559 Speaker 1: They told me why they left Irun. But I'm sure 216 00:12:17,600 --> 00:12:19,000 Speaker 1: many di could wear that went out of yourself, so 217 00:12:19,040 --> 00:12:21,680 Speaker 1: we weren't included here. How did you come from Iran 218 00:12:21,840 --> 00:12:23,760 Speaker 1: to hear you got for Turkey? 219 00:12:24,600 --> 00:12:31,160 Speaker 7: It was so difficult, and we came from Iran, Tehran 220 00:12:31,559 --> 00:12:36,400 Speaker 7: to Dubai. After that, saub all of Brazil and after 221 00:12:36,480 --> 00:12:42,920 Speaker 7: that Believe Peru, Ejuador, Colombia and Nkokley and Jungle Panama 222 00:12:43,240 --> 00:12:47,480 Speaker 7: Here Panama. And it was so difficult for us because 223 00:12:47,960 --> 00:12:53,320 Speaker 7: we are young. We just leave our family, my sister, 224 00:12:53,640 --> 00:12:57,240 Speaker 7: my mother, father. It was so emotional, Yeah, and it 225 00:12:57,400 --> 00:13:00,000 Speaker 7: was so hard for us. But because of the freedom, 226 00:13:00,240 --> 00:13:03,320 Speaker 7: because we can't speak in our country. You know, if 227 00:13:03,400 --> 00:13:06,679 Speaker 7: you speaking in your in the street, something like it 228 00:13:07,320 --> 00:13:11,719 Speaker 7: they will arrest you. And yeah, Jai, when you are 229 00:13:11,840 --> 00:13:15,920 Speaker 7: not Muslim, when you really like something like a Christian 230 00:13:16,120 --> 00:13:20,839 Speaker 7: or something else, theres Yes, it was. It was so so, 231 00:13:21,360 --> 00:13:25,240 Speaker 7: so so difficult living in Iran, but it's a it's 232 00:13:25,280 --> 00:13:27,840 Speaker 7: a wonderful country, but not government. 233 00:13:28,720 --> 00:13:30,920 Speaker 1: When I talk to migrants, I always want to offer 234 00:13:30,960 --> 00:13:32,959 Speaker 1: them the chance to share their stories in ways that 235 00:13:33,080 --> 00:13:36,360 Speaker 1: they want to share them. And I asked them what 236 00:13:36,480 --> 00:13:38,640 Speaker 1: they would want to say if they could talk directly 237 00:13:38,720 --> 00:13:41,480 Speaker 1: to Americans. It's a question I asked a lot, because 238 00:13:41,520 --> 00:13:43,720 Speaker 1: in all the coverage of migration I've seen in this country, 239 00:13:44,120 --> 00:13:47,959 Speaker 1: I rarely see migrants' voices. I'm very familiar with being 240 00:13:47,960 --> 00:13:49,760 Speaker 1: the only journalist in a place, and I'd be lying 241 00:13:49,760 --> 00:13:51,959 Speaker 1: if I said I didn't prefer it that way. But 242 00:13:52,640 --> 00:13:54,880 Speaker 1: I do always feel obliged to use the platform I 243 00:13:54,960 --> 00:13:57,520 Speaker 1: have here to give people a chance to share their stories, 244 00:13:57,720 --> 00:14:00,840 Speaker 1: their voices, and their struggles. So he's their message. 245 00:14:01,640 --> 00:14:03,400 Speaker 7: We love you, hope too, you love this? 246 00:14:03,760 --> 00:14:05,400 Speaker 6: Yeah, that's hard question. 247 00:14:06,320 --> 00:14:09,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, Yeah, I think that's very good. 248 00:14:10,960 --> 00:14:14,199 Speaker 7: It will be our next home, and we should be 249 00:14:15,120 --> 00:14:17,360 Speaker 7: proud of that. We should be bored for that, we 250 00:14:17,440 --> 00:14:21,800 Speaker 7: should be real, real American for the concert. 251 00:14:22,200 --> 00:14:28,160 Speaker 6: Yeah, they know women are very bad situations, have a 252 00:14:28,320 --> 00:14:29,640 Speaker 6: bad situation in Iran. 253 00:14:29,960 --> 00:14:33,040 Speaker 8: Yeah, for all people, that is. 254 00:14:35,360 --> 00:14:39,600 Speaker 6: Saying, but for women is very, very, very hard. I 255 00:14:39,680 --> 00:14:46,320 Speaker 6: think American people know about masa Amini. Yeah, and they 256 00:14:46,920 --> 00:14:52,640 Speaker 6: really they chill us, really, they chill women for simple things. 257 00:14:54,400 --> 00:14:57,400 Speaker 1: I heard hundreds of stories like this in my time 258 00:14:57,480 --> 00:15:00,360 Speaker 1: about how Jiqito and the last blankat migrant reception center 259 00:15:00,480 --> 00:15:03,160 Speaker 1: that migrants traveled to after they arrive in Bajo Chiquito. 260 00:15:03,760 --> 00:15:07,720 Speaker 1: People left horrific things behind them and saw horrific things 261 00:15:07,800 --> 00:15:10,960 Speaker 1: on their journey, but they all remained hopeful for a 262 00:15:11,000 --> 00:15:21,600 Speaker 1: better future in America. These journeys, in some cases, can 263 00:15:21,680 --> 00:15:24,520 Speaker 1: take a year or more. One napoly man I met 264 00:15:24,560 --> 00:15:27,600 Speaker 1: in Bajajuquito had spent thirty months just to get that far, 265 00:15:28,480 --> 00:15:31,160 Speaker 1: and among his group, his journey had been the fastest. 266 00:15:32,840 --> 00:15:35,760 Speaker 1: As long as these journeys are, that darien often stems 267 00:15:35,760 --> 00:15:39,640 Speaker 1: out as the hardest part to understand. Why I want 268 00:15:39,680 --> 00:15:41,360 Speaker 1: to take you back to that shady spot by the 269 00:15:41,440 --> 00:15:45,080 Speaker 1: river just a few minutes south of Bajo Juquito. So 270 00:15:45,200 --> 00:15:47,480 Speaker 1: what I'm doing right now, as you can hear from 271 00:15:47,520 --> 00:15:49,480 Speaker 1: my footsteps, is I'm doing what it told me not 272 00:15:49,600 --> 00:15:52,680 Speaker 1: to do. I'm walking along the migrant trail. Lots of 273 00:15:52,760 --> 00:15:58,880 Speaker 1: like vines and creepers, and oh fucking hell, that's me 274 00:15:59,000 --> 00:16:03,440 Speaker 1: el eating shit. There's little bits of tape marking a trail. 275 00:16:03,840 --> 00:16:07,720 Speaker 1: I think they just come down the river here. Some 276 00:16:07,840 --> 00:16:10,080 Speaker 1: local guys are pushing out wheelbarrows on the trail to 277 00:16:10,160 --> 00:16:15,160 Speaker 1: dump trash. The's trash everywhere, to fucking mess the little 278 00:16:15,200 --> 00:16:17,760 Speaker 1: wood arrows that they've carved just outside town to direct 279 00:16:17,800 --> 00:16:21,000 Speaker 1: people into town. And if I heard, I can see 280 00:16:21,040 --> 00:16:24,680 Speaker 1: migrants making what's probably hopefully their final crossing of the 281 00:16:24,800 --> 00:16:28,160 Speaker 1: river here. One thing I noticed was that as soon 282 00:16:28,200 --> 00:16:29,680 Speaker 1: as I got out of sight in near shot of 283 00:16:29,720 --> 00:16:33,960 Speaker 1: the town, the jungle seems a lot more intimidating. Somebody 284 00:16:34,040 --> 00:16:35,680 Speaker 1: spends a lot of time in the mountains, and I 285 00:16:35,760 --> 00:16:38,920 Speaker 1: grew up playing in the woods. I'm comfortable outdoors, and 286 00:16:39,000 --> 00:16:41,120 Speaker 1: I frequently camp and hike for days on my own. 287 00:16:41,680 --> 00:16:44,080 Speaker 1: I like it better that way, and I might see 288 00:16:44,120 --> 00:16:46,520 Speaker 1: more comfortable forty feet under the seed free diving, or 289 00:16:46,640 --> 00:16:48,240 Speaker 1: three hours from the nearest road. Then I'm in a 290 00:16:48,280 --> 00:16:51,680 Speaker 1: busy city sometimes, but in the jungle. After all the 291 00:16:51,720 --> 00:16:56,840 Speaker 1: stories I'd heard that week. I was afraid. I get scary. 292 00:16:56,920 --> 00:17:01,000 Speaker 1: I don't know why. I mean, everything's new to me. I'm, 293 00:17:02,000 --> 00:17:07,760 Speaker 1: you know, relatively comfortable in the outdoors. But fucking there's 294 00:17:07,840 --> 00:17:10,480 Speaker 1: new animals, there's new plants. I don't know what's poisonous. 295 00:17:10,840 --> 00:17:12,440 Speaker 1: I don't know what's going to kill me. I don't 296 00:17:12,480 --> 00:17:15,280 Speaker 1: know who's going to try and hurt me. Got another 297 00:17:15,320 --> 00:17:18,679 Speaker 1: fucking RF Jesus wept. I'm jumping out my skin. Everything 298 00:17:18,760 --> 00:17:29,680 Speaker 1: Now it's funny. I'm in a place that's beautiful, you know, 299 00:17:29,840 --> 00:17:34,400 Speaker 1: like these better paradise plants are just just growing here, gorgeousness. 300 00:17:34,680 --> 00:17:39,680 Speaker 1: Horses belong to people of the Mbah community. I suppose 301 00:17:41,359 --> 00:17:46,439 Speaker 1: having snacks, you know, eating jungle horse food. And here 302 00:17:46,480 --> 00:17:49,240 Speaker 1: here I am at the river. It's wide here, it's 303 00:17:49,280 --> 00:17:51,840 Speaker 1: sort of shallow, and it's been dammed up a little 304 00:17:51,840 --> 00:17:53,960 Speaker 1: bit with rubbish, just like flocks and and jets some 305 00:17:54,080 --> 00:17:54,600 Speaker 1: kind of stuff. 306 00:17:55,280 --> 00:17:55,760 Speaker 7: And then. 307 00:17:57,440 --> 00:17:59,199 Speaker 1: This is where people cross because of that little dam. 308 00:17:59,240 --> 00:18:01,560 Speaker 1: But it's still got some to it, like you wouldn't 309 00:18:01,600 --> 00:18:04,399 Speaker 1: want to fall and crack your head or you know, 310 00:18:04,400 --> 00:18:08,040 Speaker 1: a lot of these folks can't swim even without the fear. 311 00:18:08,080 --> 00:18:11,080 Speaker 1: It's hard going. If you've only hiked on trails, you 312 00:18:11,160 --> 00:18:13,359 Speaker 1: probably don't realize how much work goes into making that 313 00:18:13,480 --> 00:18:16,879 Speaker 1: surface possible. There are no trail crews in the Darien, 314 00:18:17,440 --> 00:18:19,720 Speaker 1: and as a result, every step has the potential to 315 00:18:19,760 --> 00:18:22,560 Speaker 1: results in a sprained ankle or another injury, which might 316 00:18:22,680 --> 00:18:25,479 Speaker 1: sound trivial but can be faithal in such a remote 317 00:18:25,520 --> 00:18:30,160 Speaker 1: and challenging place. Trail is all rocks, like maybe rocks 318 00:18:30,200 --> 00:18:33,480 Speaker 1: the size of a fift like that way now, and 319 00:18:33,560 --> 00:18:36,040 Speaker 1: then there are sort of in this area we only 320 00:18:36,080 --> 00:18:38,880 Speaker 1: have the lower canopy, so we have ferns, we have reeds, 321 00:18:40,040 --> 00:18:42,359 Speaker 1: bamboo plants growing really tall and straight, that's what they 322 00:18:42,440 --> 00:18:44,600 Speaker 1: use for the poles that the pit our words, and 323 00:18:44,760 --> 00:18:49,159 Speaker 1: then sort of low grassy kind of plants. And then 324 00:18:49,200 --> 00:18:51,520 Speaker 1: where the migrants walk is just this muddy trail that 325 00:18:51,640 --> 00:18:54,240 Speaker 1: every time it raine just turns into like ankle to 326 00:18:54,359 --> 00:18:57,800 Speaker 1: knee deep mud. And I could see them making pretty 327 00:18:57,840 --> 00:19:01,159 Speaker 1: slow progress along the trail towards me. At the end 328 00:19:01,160 --> 00:19:03,080 Speaker 1: of the day, as I took a pedagua back to 329 00:19:03,160 --> 00:19:06,040 Speaker 1: Madagan Tea, where I would be staying the night, I 330 00:19:06,119 --> 00:19:09,399 Speaker 1: reflected again on this an incredible tenacity it took for 331 00:19:09,480 --> 00:19:12,520 Speaker 1: people with little outdoor experience and terrible equipment to pass 332 00:19:12,560 --> 00:19:15,600 Speaker 1: through the jungle. You know, I'm a fit person. I 333 00:19:15,680 --> 00:19:18,400 Speaker 1: run ultramarathons. It used to be exercised for a living. 334 00:19:18,480 --> 00:19:23,880 Speaker 1: And it's fucking hard. It's wet. Everything's wet all the time. 335 00:19:23,920 --> 00:19:29,159 Speaker 1: If you're wet from the rain, then you're wet. If 336 00:19:29,160 --> 00:19:30,879 Speaker 1: you're wet from the sweat and you're wet. If you 337 00:19:31,000 --> 00:19:33,240 Speaker 1: cross rivers, you get wet. You just can't stay dry. 338 00:19:34,119 --> 00:19:37,360 Speaker 1: And everyone's feet are just fucked when they get into town, 339 00:19:37,440 --> 00:19:41,240 Speaker 1: Like the size of the blisters I've seen, and like 340 00:19:41,400 --> 00:19:44,320 Speaker 1: one lady had a cramp today where like it just 341 00:19:44,440 --> 00:19:46,320 Speaker 1: locked up a whole that she like, I grabbed her. 342 00:19:46,480 --> 00:19:49,280 Speaker 1: She was falling down and I was able to hold 343 00:19:49,320 --> 00:19:53,159 Speaker 1: her up. But people are really pushing themselves physically as 344 00:19:53,240 --> 00:19:58,600 Speaker 1: well as psychologically. That river crossing south of Bachigiso was 345 00:19:58,640 --> 00:20:00,160 Speaker 1: as far south as I was going to be able 346 00:20:00,200 --> 00:20:02,320 Speaker 1: to get without being forced to be adjacted from Panama, 347 00:20:03,000 --> 00:20:05,280 Speaker 1: and my request to take a boat or walk further 348 00:20:05,400 --> 00:20:09,119 Speaker 1: south was denied by the Panamanian Ministry of Security. So 349 00:20:09,280 --> 00:20:11,160 Speaker 1: the only part of the migrants journey I would share 350 00:20:11,200 --> 00:20:13,359 Speaker 1: with them, with the last kilometer or so of their 351 00:20:13,440 --> 00:20:17,440 Speaker 1: walk even then, I wasn't really supposed to be leaving 352 00:20:17,480 --> 00:20:20,240 Speaker 1: town at all, So several times over the days I 353 00:20:20,280 --> 00:20:23,480 Speaker 1: spent in Bajajigito, I would look over my shoulder, hop 354 00:20:23,560 --> 00:20:26,520 Speaker 1: down the river bank, jump across the stream, and likely 355 00:20:26,640 --> 00:20:29,960 Speaker 1: jog out of town. Once on the trail, I'd started 356 00:20:30,000 --> 00:20:33,400 Speaker 1: to walk slowly and try and waive a groups outcoming migrants. 357 00:20:34,080 --> 00:20:36,200 Speaker 1: I didn't want to scare them. I offered to carry 358 00:20:36,200 --> 00:20:39,040 Speaker 1: their bags and let any help I could, supporting them 359 00:20:39,200 --> 00:20:41,680 Speaker 1: as they walked towards their first meal and clean drink 360 00:20:41,720 --> 00:21:03,440 Speaker 1: of water. In up to a week. Just getting to 361 00:21:03,520 --> 00:21:06,280 Speaker 1: barje Gito was a journey in itself for me. I 362 00:21:06,359 --> 00:21:09,840 Speaker 1: took two flights, a five hour drive which was evenally 363 00:21:09,840 --> 00:21:13,240 Speaker 1: split between paved roads, roads that aspired to pavement, and 364 00:21:13,320 --> 00:21:16,080 Speaker 1: dirt roads. At the end of our road journey, the 365 00:21:16,160 --> 00:21:19,879 Speaker 1: Pan American Highway, the links Alaska to Argentina, seems to 366 00:21:19,920 --> 00:21:23,840 Speaker 1: give up on fighting the jungle and Peter's out. Asphalt 367 00:21:24,040 --> 00:21:27,000 Speaker 1: turned to worse asphalt, which turned to dirt, which turned 368 00:21:27,040 --> 00:21:30,879 Speaker 1: to mud, which led us to a river. A driver, however, 369 00:21:31,400 --> 00:21:35,040 Speaker 1: was prepared for this. The drive here was mad, like 370 00:21:35,160 --> 00:21:37,640 Speaker 1: that road was fucked. We're in this tiny old guard. 371 00:21:37,680 --> 00:21:40,120 Speaker 1: The driver took off his shoes and socks to conduct 372 00:21:40,359 --> 00:21:43,520 Speaker 1: the more technical section of the drive, which I thought 373 00:21:43,600 --> 00:21:47,680 Speaker 1: was quite amusing. And yeah, really steep, lots of holes, 374 00:21:47,760 --> 00:21:51,600 Speaker 1: lots of potholes, you know, just really rutted out kind 375 00:21:51,600 --> 00:21:54,959 Speaker 1: of dirt road. And then we got here and thopped 376 00:21:55,040 --> 00:21:58,240 Speaker 1: some guys, negotiated a price and told him where we 377 00:21:58,280 --> 00:22:00,800 Speaker 1: wanted to go, and they said, yeah, sure, buy some water, 378 00:22:01,000 --> 00:22:04,040 Speaker 1: you know, snow water on the way about three hours 379 00:22:04,119 --> 00:22:07,800 Speaker 1: and so we bought some water right there, and yeah, 380 00:22:07,840 --> 00:22:11,879 Speaker 1: here we are on the boat now, as you can hear, 381 00:22:12,119 --> 00:22:14,399 Speaker 1: I recorded this on a piragua. It's a kind of 382 00:22:14,440 --> 00:22:17,040 Speaker 1: dugout canoe with the hole made out of a single 383 00:22:17,119 --> 00:22:19,640 Speaker 1: tree and a tooth stroke motor bolted on the back. 384 00:22:20,560 --> 00:22:22,399 Speaker 1: It's the only way to travel here other than on 385 00:22:22,480 --> 00:22:25,760 Speaker 1: your feet, and it's the only way the Embarra can 386 00:22:25,800 --> 00:22:30,000 Speaker 1: get the produced cigaret to market. The skill of the piragueros, 387 00:22:30,200 --> 00:22:33,600 Speaker 1: the people who drive the piraguas, is incredible. They navigate 388 00:22:33,680 --> 00:22:35,280 Speaker 1: parts of the river so shallow that they have to 389 00:22:35,320 --> 00:22:38,000 Speaker 1: pull up the two stroke motor. And I noticed all 390 00:22:38,000 --> 00:22:40,840 Speaker 1: the motors have propellers that are covered in chips and bashes, 391 00:22:41,119 --> 00:22:43,879 Speaker 1: from smacking into the rocks at the bottom. In the 392 00:22:43,960 --> 00:22:45,879 Speaker 1: bow of the boat, I sat on top of my 393 00:22:45,960 --> 00:22:50,600 Speaker 1: giant rucksack, marveling at the birds, insects, and foliage of 394 00:22:50,680 --> 00:22:54,320 Speaker 1: the jungle, and occasionally I jumped up to make fairly 395 00:22:54,400 --> 00:22:57,520 Speaker 1: useless contributions with the boat's bamboo pole under the close 396 00:22:57,560 --> 00:23:00,639 Speaker 1: supervision of Marcellino, a driver and are soon to be 397 00:23:00,720 --> 00:23:03,120 Speaker 1: host for mostly just laughed at me as I leaned 398 00:23:03,160 --> 00:23:05,600 Speaker 1: my whole way into the pole, which notably slipped, and 399 00:23:05,680 --> 00:23:08,119 Speaker 1: I tried to avoid falling face first into the chocolate 400 00:23:08,160 --> 00:23:12,200 Speaker 1: brown water. On the way to bout Jiquito, we passed 401 00:23:12,240 --> 00:23:15,800 Speaker 1: several small limber our villages. Little children waved at us 402 00:23:15,840 --> 00:23:17,520 Speaker 1: from the banks or from the shallows of the river 403 00:23:17,600 --> 00:23:20,800 Speaker 1: where they washed and played. Adults looked on I doubtless 404 00:23:20,880 --> 00:23:22,840 Speaker 1: why there one nurse's ex vict three white dude was 405 00:23:23,280 --> 00:23:25,200 Speaker 1: going the wrong way on the river for a migrant, 406 00:23:25,800 --> 00:23:29,640 Speaker 1: but they smiled and waved back anyway. After an overnight flight, 407 00:23:30,000 --> 00:23:32,639 Speaker 1: a five hour drive, and three hours in a dugout canoe, 408 00:23:33,520 --> 00:23:36,119 Speaker 1: we rounded a corner in the river. Abou Jiquito came 409 00:23:36,160 --> 00:23:39,800 Speaker 1: into view. Over the last few years, it's three oriented 410 00:23:39,880 --> 00:23:43,199 Speaker 1: itself from a tiny indigenous village to an unofficial reception 411 00:23:43,320 --> 00:23:47,800 Speaker 1: center for migrants. On my hopelessly outdated topo map, the 412 00:23:47,920 --> 00:23:52,000 Speaker 1: area has nothing but contours and green shading, no roads, 413 00:23:52,119 --> 00:23:55,680 Speaker 1: no trails, no markets of human existence at all, and 414 00:23:55,760 --> 00:23:58,879 Speaker 1: perhaps that's how the state sees this place. The Daddy 415 00:23:58,920 --> 00:24:01,720 Speaker 1: Inn is as real to most Panamanians a Sesame street 416 00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:05,040 Speaker 1: or Jurassic Park, But for the Enber this has been 417 00:24:05,080 --> 00:24:08,120 Speaker 1: their home since long before Panama and Columbia and even 418 00:24:08,200 --> 00:24:12,160 Speaker 1: maps existed. A few dozen houses in the village, mostly 419 00:24:12,200 --> 00:24:15,480 Speaker 1: built on stilts to avoid the seasonal floods, now offer 420 00:24:15,600 --> 00:24:18,639 Speaker 1: up their rooms as hostels for the migrants. Some of 421 00:24:18,720 --> 00:24:22,119 Speaker 1: them have enclosed at bottom floor using plywood or cinder blocks. 422 00:24:22,760 --> 00:24:26,240 Speaker 1: Others have strung hammocks from their support posts. For four 423 00:24:26,400 --> 00:24:29,200 Speaker 1: or five bugs, migrants can get their first good night's 424 00:24:29,200 --> 00:24:31,119 Speaker 1: sleep since they left Neck or Clee in Columbia as 425 00:24:31,200 --> 00:24:34,840 Speaker 1: much as a week before. Along the main street, which 426 00:24:34,880 --> 00:24:37,480 Speaker 1: is really just to raise concrete footpath about a meter across, 427 00:24:38,240 --> 00:24:40,359 Speaker 1: you can buy a meal any of half a dozen 428 00:24:40,400 --> 00:24:42,840 Speaker 1: places for five bucks. You can get an hour of 429 00:24:42,880 --> 00:24:44,879 Speaker 1: Wi Fi for a dollar, or charge your phone for 430 00:24:44,880 --> 00:24:47,880 Speaker 1: at the same price. Cold drinks for a dollar as well. 431 00:24:48,080 --> 00:24:49,920 Speaker 1: Are one of the many front rooms that have turned 432 00:24:49,960 --> 00:24:52,840 Speaker 1: into small kiosks. And that's where the migrants I have 433 00:24:52,920 --> 00:24:54,720 Speaker 1: been sitting down with that the river went. When they're 434 00:24:54,760 --> 00:24:57,360 Speaker 1: rived into town, I let them be for a while 435 00:24:57,520 --> 00:25:00,960 Speaker 1: I went off to interview more migrants. About a thousand 436 00:25:01,040 --> 00:25:04,159 Speaker 1: of them arrive in this village every day. Each year 437 00:25:04,240 --> 00:25:07,520 Speaker 1: since a pandemic has seen record numbers arrive, and the 438 00:25:07,560 --> 00:25:09,760 Speaker 1: little village on the side of a hill, surrounded by 439 00:25:09,840 --> 00:25:12,640 Speaker 1: palm trees and full of smiling children in their traditional 440 00:25:12,680 --> 00:25:16,600 Speaker 1: brightly colored paluomers chasing chickens and dogs, has welcomed every 441 00:25:16,640 --> 00:25:19,720 Speaker 1: single one of them. About a thousand of them arrive 442 00:25:19,760 --> 00:25:22,560 Speaker 1: in this town every day. To get here, they also 443 00:25:22,600 --> 00:25:24,920 Speaker 1: take a boat from neck o'clee across the Golf of 444 00:25:24,960 --> 00:25:28,120 Speaker 1: the Dabbienne. They crossed on small motor boats to Kapolgana 445 00:25:28,320 --> 00:25:31,160 Speaker 1: or Candel. Those are both towns on the western side 446 00:25:31,160 --> 00:25:33,880 Speaker 1: of the Gulf of the Darienne. From there they begin 447 00:25:33,960 --> 00:25:36,960 Speaker 1: their walk. Even though they're now north of the gulf, 448 00:25:37,280 --> 00:25:39,960 Speaker 1: they're still in Colombia, and on the Colombian side of 449 00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:42,520 Speaker 1: the border. They're guided by guides to whom they pay 450 00:25:42,600 --> 00:25:45,920 Speaker 1: several hundred dollars and in return receive protection and a 451 00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:50,320 Speaker 1: wristband that ensures they can walk without being robbed. Nobody 452 00:25:50,400 --> 00:25:52,960 Speaker 1: I spoke to had made it this far without paying 453 00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:55,800 Speaker 1: a guide. The area is largely under the control of 454 00:25:55,840 --> 00:25:58,800 Speaker 1: the Golf Cartel, several members of which were sanctioned by 455 00:25:58,840 --> 00:26:01,520 Speaker 1: the USA. While I was in the jungle, the marcos 456 00:26:01,560 --> 00:26:03,000 Speaker 1: I spoke to you didn't really have much bad to 457 00:26:03,040 --> 00:26:06,399 Speaker 1: say about this part of their experience, but universally acknowledged 458 00:26:06,440 --> 00:26:08,679 Speaker 1: that the next part was where they really confronted their 459 00:26:08,760 --> 00:26:12,359 Speaker 1: fears and nightmares about the Daddy. N Here's one Venezuelan 460 00:26:12,480 --> 00:26:14,000 Speaker 1: migrant sharing his experience. 461 00:26:14,480 --> 00:26:18,920 Speaker 9: Yeah, that's nothing compared to what comes from the border 462 00:26:18,960 --> 00:26:21,399 Speaker 9: to hear. Yes, the road is better, and I say 463 00:26:21,480 --> 00:26:23,879 Speaker 9: that the dangerous less too, and they have everything you 464 00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:27,040 Speaker 9: need there. You come prepared, you have, you come with water, 465 00:26:27,760 --> 00:26:30,959 Speaker 9: and there are also many ravines where you can drink water. Well, 466 00:26:31,000 --> 00:26:33,400 Speaker 9: there are springs that come from the mountain, but from 467 00:26:33,400 --> 00:26:34,960 Speaker 9: the border on it's pretty ugly. 468 00:26:36,760 --> 00:26:40,159 Speaker 1: It's a stretch from the Colombian Panamanian border at a 469 00:26:40,240 --> 00:26:42,840 Speaker 1: place that they call Las Bandavas, which means the flags 470 00:26:43,240 --> 00:26:48,000 Speaker 1: to Bajo Chiquito, where migrants suffer the most. There, they 471 00:26:48,040 --> 00:26:50,800 Speaker 1: can't drink from the river because it's human waste and 472 00:26:50,960 --> 00:26:54,200 Speaker 1: human remains that constantly fill it like the water deadly. 473 00:26:55,280 --> 00:26:58,240 Speaker 1: They must walk on unmaintained trails. It often turns in 474 00:26:58,359 --> 00:27:02,640 Speaker 1: deep mud. They only have the supplies they carry, which 475 00:27:02,720 --> 00:27:05,080 Speaker 1: often run out, or they jettison to stave weight On 476 00:27:05,119 --> 00:27:08,960 Speaker 1: the incredibly steep mountain path. They climb and descend those 477 00:27:09,040 --> 00:27:12,720 Speaker 1: mountains and cross rivers, often without eating or drinking for 478 00:27:12,880 --> 00:27:15,760 Speaker 1: days at a time. On the trail, they passed by 479 00:27:15,800 --> 00:27:18,280 Speaker 1: the bodies of their fellow travelers as a constant reminder 480 00:27:18,320 --> 00:27:21,200 Speaker 1: of the risk they're taking. If you ask people in 481 00:27:21,240 --> 00:27:24,040 Speaker 1: Panama City, they'll tell you the day and is closed now. 482 00:27:24,960 --> 00:27:28,359 Speaker 1: New President hose Raoul Molino was elected on a promise 483 00:27:28,480 --> 00:27:32,320 Speaker 1: to shut down the gap, end the humanitarian crisis, and 484 00:27:32,480 --> 00:27:36,040 Speaker 1: deport more migrants for the US funding, and that funding 485 00:27:36,080 --> 00:27:38,800 Speaker 1: has certainly arrived, with more than six million already spent 486 00:27:38,920 --> 00:27:42,239 Speaker 1: since he took office in July. Since then, Panama has 487 00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:46,520 Speaker 1: deported more than eleven hundred people to Venezuela, Cuba, Colombia, 488 00:27:46,680 --> 00:27:50,840 Speaker 1: and India. Each of these has been funded by US taxpayers. 489 00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:55,120 Speaker 1: Obviously the jungle isn't closed, and it can't really be closed. 490 00:27:55,960 --> 00:27:58,440 Speaker 1: But in an interview before he was elected, Molino said 491 00:27:58,480 --> 00:28:01,240 Speaker 1: that the border of the United States, instead of being 492 00:28:01,280 --> 00:28:05,520 Speaker 1: in Texas, has moved to Panama, and that is something 493 00:28:05,600 --> 00:28:09,119 Speaker 1: he can do with US support. I spoke to us 494 00:28:09,119 --> 00:28:11,280 Speaker 1: in venezuel and ladies help and carry their bags. It's 495 00:28:11,280 --> 00:28:12,879 Speaker 1: a steep hill, and they were saying that no one 496 00:28:12,920 --> 00:28:14,800 Speaker 1: has seen any barriers. I don't know anythink about any 497 00:28:14,800 --> 00:28:16,879 Speaker 1: barriers or any fences in a Darien and that like 498 00:28:17,560 --> 00:28:20,439 Speaker 1: they hadn't heard it was closed. Evidently it's not. I'm 499 00:28:20,480 --> 00:28:22,240 Speaker 1: standing in front of one hundred people who just got 500 00:28:22,280 --> 00:28:28,760 Speaker 1: off a boat from the Darienn Hubris. Aside, the rhetoric 501 00:28:28,840 --> 00:28:31,720 Speaker 1: of closing the Daddi, m signals are turn not just 502 00:28:31,840 --> 00:28:34,879 Speaker 1: in Panamanian politics, but in the way the world sees 503 00:28:34,920 --> 00:28:39,080 Speaker 1: and handles migration. The US has always sought to externalize 504 00:28:39,080 --> 00:28:42,640 Speaker 1: its borders, from US train border patrol officers and Dominican 505 00:28:42,680 --> 00:28:46,360 Speaker 1: Republic along the border is Haiti to DHS agents deploying 506 00:28:46,400 --> 00:28:50,480 Speaker 1: to Iraq and Afghanistan. As migration has become more politicized, 507 00:28:50,960 --> 00:28:53,280 Speaker 1: the US has sought to move its enforcement away from 508 00:28:53,360 --> 00:28:57,200 Speaker 1: prying eyes and from compassion, and instead brought more trauma 509 00:28:57,360 --> 00:29:00,840 Speaker 1: to a place that is already so high. I've spent 510 00:29:01,000 --> 00:29:02,840 Speaker 1: much of the last decade of my life watching the 511 00:29:02,880 --> 00:29:05,080 Speaker 1: state try to bring the mountains and desert close to 512 00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:08,120 Speaker 1: where I live under its control. I've stood with kumia 513 00:29:08,160 --> 00:29:12,000 Speaker 1: I people as the government dynamited their graveyards. I found 514 00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:15,600 Speaker 1: border walk contractors lost deep in the mountains. I've driven 515 00:29:15,640 --> 00:29:18,600 Speaker 1: the impossibly steep concrete roads that they built, worried about 516 00:29:18,600 --> 00:29:21,800 Speaker 1: my truck turning end on end. I've seen billions of 517 00:29:21,880 --> 00:29:24,920 Speaker 1: dollars thrown at these mountains, and I've seen people with 518 00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:28,080 Speaker 1: twenty dollars angle grinders or ladders made of old palettes 519 00:29:28,120 --> 00:29:31,880 Speaker 1: defeat the wall in moments. Trying to close borders doesn't 520 00:29:31,920 --> 00:29:33,920 Speaker 1: work at home, and it won't work in the Daddy 521 00:29:33,960 --> 00:29:36,680 Speaker 1: and Gap either. Just building the roads to get the 522 00:29:36,760 --> 00:29:40,280 Speaker 1: construction equipment into the gap is a gargantuan task, and 523 00:29:40,360 --> 00:29:42,880 Speaker 1: any attempt to create a barrier across the sixty kilometer 524 00:29:43,080 --> 00:29:46,560 Speaker 1: wide wilderness area will simply push migrants onto other more 525 00:29:46,640 --> 00:29:50,720 Speaker 1: dangerous routes, into places where you can't build, and the 526 00:29:50,760 --> 00:29:52,960 Speaker 1: place is where nobody can rescue you. If you fall 527 00:29:53,040 --> 00:29:56,200 Speaker 1: down or break your leg, that doesn't mean there's nothing 528 00:29:56,240 --> 00:29:59,400 Speaker 1: the US can do. I saw first hand the impact 529 00:29:59,440 --> 00:30:02,680 Speaker 1: of Americans spending here as migrants had a reception center 530 00:30:02,720 --> 00:30:06,080 Speaker 1: called Lajas Blancas, had their families torn apart, and men, 531 00:30:06,200 --> 00:30:09,120 Speaker 1: women and children cried as their parents and partners were 532 00:30:09,160 --> 00:30:12,320 Speaker 1: taken away for a flight back to Colombia, Cuba, or 533 00:30:12,400 --> 00:30:16,200 Speaker 1: Venezuela that my taxes helped to pay for. I consider 534 00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:18,880 Speaker 1: that children with toys and stickers and something to eat 535 00:30:18,960 --> 00:30:22,000 Speaker 1: as their dads were loaded into a flatbed truck. A 536 00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:25,480 Speaker 1: government didn't send money to feed these children, but it 537 00:30:25,600 --> 00:30:27,720 Speaker 1: seemed to have the funds to fund their parents' deportation. 538 00:30:29,200 --> 00:30:32,200 Speaker 1: By deporting people from Panama, the US effectively deprives them 539 00:30:32,240 --> 00:30:34,480 Speaker 1: of much of the due process they should, in theory, 540 00:30:34,560 --> 00:30:37,240 Speaker 1: have the right to in the United States, and the 541 00:30:37,360 --> 00:30:39,480 Speaker 1: US can easily deport them back to places like Cuba 542 00:30:39,520 --> 00:30:43,480 Speaker 1: and Venezuela, which it considers to be dictatorial regimes. The 543 00:30:43,600 --> 00:30:47,640 Speaker 1: US does not and cannot stop migration. People have always moved, 544 00:30:48,440 --> 00:30:51,160 Speaker 1: and people will always want a better future for their children. 545 00:30:52,120 --> 00:30:54,200 Speaker 1: What it can do is to make it as painful 546 00:30:54,360 --> 00:30:57,680 Speaker 1: and dangerous as possible. But the rais of word barriers 547 00:30:57,720 --> 00:30:59,800 Speaker 1: in the Daddy and Gap, which I've seen person on 548 00:30:59,800 --> 00:31:03,640 Speaker 1: social media didn't exist for the hundreds of migrants I 549 00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:06,400 Speaker 1: spoke to. No one I asked had even seen them, 550 00:31:07,000 --> 00:31:09,120 Speaker 1: but what they had seen was far worse. 551 00:31:10,720 --> 00:31:13,920 Speaker 10: Aimucholi, there are many rivers that you're forced into all 552 00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:16,880 Speaker 10: the time. You're putting your life and everything else on 553 00:31:16,960 --> 00:31:19,720 Speaker 10: the line there. I was worried that the indigenous people 554 00:31:19,760 --> 00:31:23,000 Speaker 10: would come out and do something to us. In the nights. 555 00:31:23,160 --> 00:31:25,800 Speaker 10: I was worried that any of the children, God forbid, 556 00:31:26,120 --> 00:31:29,320 Speaker 10: would have an accident. The same for me. It's horrible 557 00:31:29,440 --> 00:31:30,040 Speaker 10: to think about it. 558 00:31:30,080 --> 00:31:34,680 Speaker 1: Now, this mother hood cross with a five, six, and 559 00:31:34,800 --> 00:31:38,760 Speaker 1: sixteen year old child, the baby of six months. They'd 560 00:31:38,760 --> 00:31:41,120 Speaker 1: all made it in one piece, but the journey clearly 561 00:31:41,160 --> 00:31:42,440 Speaker 1: had its impact on the children. 562 00:31:44,600 --> 00:31:46,440 Speaker 10: There are many people who are left out there without 563 00:31:46,520 --> 00:31:48,959 Speaker 10: food and do not have anything to give to their children. 564 00:31:49,560 --> 00:31:53,080 Speaker 10: We had food until last night, nothing left now, and 565 00:31:53,200 --> 00:31:56,000 Speaker 10: we had to each one had to just eat a 566 00:31:56,040 --> 00:31:58,440 Speaker 10: little bit because we had nothing else to give them. 567 00:31:59,080 --> 00:32:01,680 Speaker 10: You can't find anything there. It's in the middle of nowhere. 568 00:32:02,120 --> 00:32:05,360 Speaker 10: People died right now, along with those who came with us. Yesterday. 569 00:32:05,680 --> 00:32:06,880 Speaker 10: How many died yesterday? 570 00:32:07,280 --> 00:32:07,480 Speaker 1: Three? 571 00:32:07,800 --> 00:32:11,920 Speaker 10: I think three died yesterday. One drowned in the river. Yeah, 572 00:32:12,360 --> 00:32:17,680 Speaker 10: it's really tough this. No, no, nobody should do this. Nobody. 573 00:32:18,160 --> 00:32:21,000 Speaker 10: We do this out of pure physical necessity to look 574 00:32:21,080 --> 00:32:23,560 Speaker 10: for a better future for our kids. We can't stay 575 00:32:23,600 --> 00:32:26,000 Speaker 10: in our country, We couldn't stay any longer. 576 00:32:26,040 --> 00:32:29,240 Speaker 1: There here are a couple of the kids I spoke to, 577 00:32:29,480 --> 00:32:31,800 Speaker 1: or in some cases, the kids who took my regorda 578 00:32:32,040 --> 00:32:33,600 Speaker 1: and conducted interviews with each other. 579 00:32:34,720 --> 00:32:39,040 Speaker 10: On the mountains. I was so tired and I couldn't 580 00:32:39,040 --> 00:32:41,600 Speaker 10: climb anymore, and when I fell in the river, I 581 00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:42,520 Speaker 10: was really scared. 582 00:32:48,160 --> 00:32:50,640 Speaker 1: Apparently the whole thing was like an adventure she'd seen 583 00:32:50,680 --> 00:32:53,600 Speaker 1: Pepper Pig having, which at once made me giggle and 584 00:32:53,720 --> 00:32:55,680 Speaker 1: also one reflection, It's one of the saddest things I've 585 00:32:55,680 --> 00:32:58,400 Speaker 1: ever had to record. I'm sure her mum told her 586 00:32:58,440 --> 00:33:00,440 Speaker 1: that to make it easier for her to pass through 587 00:33:00,440 --> 00:33:03,200 Speaker 1: a terrible place, But really she ought to be at home, 588 00:33:03,360 --> 00:33:06,480 Speaker 1: washing Peppa Pig and playing with her friends. No walking 589 00:33:06,560 --> 00:33:09,320 Speaker 1: past three dead bodies which are currently decomposing on the trail. 590 00:33:10,000 --> 00:33:13,400 Speaker 1: She seemed remarkably resilient. She said the long bus ride 591 00:33:13,440 --> 00:33:15,640 Speaker 1: she'd taken to get there went boring because she enjoyed 592 00:33:15,640 --> 00:33:18,040 Speaker 1: looking out the window, and the whole journey was well, 593 00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:19,040 Speaker 1: I'll let her say. 594 00:33:18,840 --> 00:33:21,800 Speaker 8: It else, Mohammed, I'm not buying. 595 00:33:23,200 --> 00:33:23,320 Speaker 2: Her. 596 00:33:23,400 --> 00:33:24,760 Speaker 1: Mum gave us a different account. 597 00:33:25,520 --> 00:33:31,000 Speaker 11: Rah, I didn't want to cry because I didn't want 598 00:33:31,040 --> 00:33:34,040 Speaker 11: her to see me crying. But sometimes I would explode 599 00:33:34,120 --> 00:33:37,040 Speaker 11: because it's hard for your child to ask you for water, 600 00:33:37,160 --> 00:33:39,080 Speaker 11: to ask you for food, and you don't have any 601 00:33:39,960 --> 00:33:41,600 Speaker 11: to be in a place where you walk. You walk 602 00:33:41,680 --> 00:33:44,360 Speaker 11: from five in the morning, it's five in the afternoon. 603 00:33:44,680 --> 00:33:47,160 Speaker 11: You're walking. You don't know what to do, going through 604 00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:49,360 Speaker 11: more than one hundred rivers and asking God not to 605 00:33:49,520 --> 00:33:53,120 Speaker 11: rain and not wanting it to get worse. It rained, 606 00:33:53,280 --> 00:33:54,360 Speaker 11: and the girl got a fever. 607 00:33:54,800 --> 00:33:55,600 Speaker 1: She got a fever. 608 00:33:56,400 --> 00:33:59,360 Speaker 11: But well, God is good that we pray a lot. 609 00:34:00,480 --> 00:34:02,120 Speaker 11: I say that we don't know God so much in 610 00:34:02,160 --> 00:34:05,160 Speaker 11: the church from the process and the process that we 611 00:34:05,240 --> 00:34:07,760 Speaker 11: are in, and we don't know we can be so 612 00:34:07,880 --> 00:34:10,439 Speaker 11: strong until we go through that storm and we see 613 00:34:10,480 --> 00:34:12,560 Speaker 11: that He protects us. He knows that He was always 614 00:34:12,560 --> 00:34:15,280 Speaker 11: there watching over us, taking care of us at all times. 615 00:34:17,160 --> 00:34:20,000 Speaker 1: Parents being amazed at their children and drawing shrink from 616 00:34:20,040 --> 00:34:23,040 Speaker 1: them and their faith was a common message I heard 617 00:34:23,080 --> 00:34:26,920 Speaker 1: from migrants. He's a migrant from Zimbabwe telling me how 618 00:34:26,960 --> 00:34:29,239 Speaker 1: her daughter inspired her to keep going when she felt 619 00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:30,480 Speaker 1: like she couldn't walk anymore. 620 00:34:31,160 --> 00:34:34,120 Speaker 8: My daughter she was strong, she was strong, but she 621 00:34:34,680 --> 00:34:37,399 Speaker 8: was crying also, but she had what wound all over 622 00:34:37,480 --> 00:34:40,320 Speaker 8: the body. Even me, I was crying myself. I was like, 623 00:34:40,520 --> 00:34:44,000 Speaker 8: I want to just put myself in the water. Then again, 624 00:34:44,200 --> 00:34:48,000 Speaker 8: just go both. The gain was tough, really really tough. 625 00:34:48,080 --> 00:34:52,680 Speaker 8: The mountain, the stones, the river. It's not easy at all. 626 00:34:52,840 --> 00:34:57,200 Speaker 8: It's not very I don't even recommended someone to say 627 00:34:57,440 --> 00:35:00,400 Speaker 8: you use daddy and give no. And even myself I 628 00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:03,960 Speaker 8: did know about it. Yeah, I was regretting myself. I 629 00:35:04,120 --> 00:35:07,920 Speaker 8: was crying. I was like, God, I don't know my 630 00:35:08,040 --> 00:35:10,359 Speaker 8: family and my family they don't know where I am 631 00:35:10,560 --> 00:35:11,040 Speaker 8: right now. 632 00:35:12,680 --> 00:35:15,600 Speaker 1: But like so many other migrants, when the government of 633 00:35:15,640 --> 00:35:18,240 Speaker 1: the world abandoned her, she found strength in the strangers 634 00:35:18,280 --> 00:35:20,080 Speaker 1: along the road who wouldn't abandon her. 635 00:35:20,520 --> 00:35:23,959 Speaker 8: We didn't even eat anything. We just asked and people, 636 00:35:24,000 --> 00:35:25,600 Speaker 8: can I have a piece of biscuit? 637 00:35:25,680 --> 00:35:26,520 Speaker 7: They just help us. 638 00:35:26,920 --> 00:35:27,479 Speaker 4: That's nice. 639 00:35:27,560 --> 00:35:28,640 Speaker 1: The other migrants helped you. 640 00:35:28,960 --> 00:35:29,840 Speaker 5: Yeah, the others. 641 00:35:30,280 --> 00:35:33,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, do you think that they treat African people differently? 642 00:35:35,200 --> 00:35:38,759 Speaker 8: Very nice, especially these Spanish people, they are very nice. 643 00:35:38,920 --> 00:35:41,600 Speaker 8: I don't want to like because if you need help, 644 00:35:41,680 --> 00:35:44,040 Speaker 8: you for call them for your look. The other ones 645 00:35:44,160 --> 00:35:47,200 Speaker 8: they might run away, but the other ones they just 646 00:35:47,320 --> 00:35:51,600 Speaker 8: come for health. They even give us tablets on the road, 647 00:35:52,360 --> 00:35:56,320 Speaker 8: give us energy drinks, give my daughter a sweets for energe. 648 00:35:57,200 --> 00:35:59,640 Speaker 8: They push us like, let's go, guys, let's call, let's go. 649 00:35:59,800 --> 00:36:03,279 Speaker 7: You make it, and we really make it. 650 00:36:28,680 --> 00:36:31,399 Speaker 1: The journey over the mountains to Banama has become more 651 00:36:31,400 --> 00:36:34,080 Speaker 1: and more popular in recent years as other routes have 652 00:36:34,160 --> 00:36:37,600 Speaker 1: become more dangerous or closed themselves off to migrants entirely. 653 00:36:38,560 --> 00:36:41,480 Speaker 1: It's a route the Embra tell me that started with 654 00:36:41,640 --> 00:36:45,200 Speaker 1: people leaving India and then Haiti. It grew as conditions 655 00:36:45,239 --> 00:36:48,600 Speaker 1: in Venezuela became more unsustainable and people found themselves too 656 00:36:48,640 --> 00:36:51,279 Speaker 1: poor to stay home and too poor to travel north 657 00:36:51,320 --> 00:36:54,359 Speaker 1: by any other means, and so they chose a deadly 658 00:36:54,480 --> 00:36:56,640 Speaker 1: jungle over a future in a country where their votes 659 00:36:56,640 --> 00:37:00,800 Speaker 1: don't matter. Last year, as many is half a million 660 00:37:00,840 --> 00:37:03,879 Speaker 1: people across the jungle. This year we might see more 661 00:37:04,800 --> 00:37:07,480 Speaker 1: Magaret's arriving about Jigito, spend the day in the village 662 00:37:07,560 --> 00:37:09,880 Speaker 1: before taking off in a piaguoa of their own up 663 00:37:09,960 --> 00:37:12,920 Speaker 1: to Lahas Blancas, the migrant reception center I mentioned earlier. 664 00:37:13,640 --> 00:37:16,760 Speaker 1: They register with Panamanian Board Patrol known by the acronym 665 00:37:16,880 --> 00:37:20,040 Speaker 1: Cena Front, and they call their families to say they survived. 666 00:37:21,040 --> 00:37:23,960 Speaker 1: Then they dry out their blistered feet, enjoy the cooking 667 00:37:24,000 --> 00:37:26,000 Speaker 1: of several of the families who have turned their homes 668 00:37:26,080 --> 00:37:30,000 Speaker 1: into sort of ersad's restaurants. They sleep on the floors 669 00:37:30,040 --> 00:37:33,080 Speaker 1: of the houses or underneath them, bardge their phones for 670 00:37:33,160 --> 00:37:36,439 Speaker 1: a dollar a time. Certainly, migration has changed this town, 671 00:37:37,040 --> 00:37:39,400 Speaker 1: and I want to talk about that more in tomorrow's episode. 672 00:37:40,080 --> 00:37:42,839 Speaker 1: But despite more than a million people passing through this route, 673 00:37:43,440 --> 00:37:48,080 Speaker 1: you don't find antimigrant sentiment here right now, despite the 674 00:37:48,120 --> 00:37:50,839 Speaker 1: gap being a deadly deterrent, numbers are expected to reach 675 00:37:50,880 --> 00:37:55,120 Speaker 1: a requid again this year, maybe seven hundred thousand people 676 00:37:55,160 --> 00:37:58,040 Speaker 1: will walk the gap. But despite these numbers, which may 677 00:37:58,120 --> 00:38:01,200 Speaker 1: seem high for a small country, I didn't really find 678 00:38:01,280 --> 00:38:04,600 Speaker 1: much anti migroan sentiment in Panama as a whole. There's 679 00:38:04,640 --> 00:38:06,759 Speaker 1: plenty of it in the US, though, and as the 680 00:38:06,840 --> 00:38:09,600 Speaker 1: United States winds down its war and terror. It needs 681 00:38:09,640 --> 00:38:12,640 Speaker 1: a new nebulous enemy to justify its military spending and 682 00:38:12,880 --> 00:38:16,040 Speaker 1: to keep the security into veillance companies donating too politicians 683 00:38:16,080 --> 00:38:20,080 Speaker 1: in their millions. In part, it is found that by 684 00:38:20,160 --> 00:38:23,880 Speaker 1: simply opening a floodgate of weapons and funding, they can 685 00:38:23,920 --> 00:38:27,520 Speaker 1: spew forth genocide and death in Palestine and keep some 686 00:38:27,640 --> 00:38:30,719 Speaker 1: of its income streams. But it needs a more long 687 00:38:30,840 --> 00:38:34,120 Speaker 1: term solution. There are only so many Palestinian babies that 688 00:38:34,200 --> 00:38:36,439 Speaker 1: can bomb, and we'll run out of Palestinians long before 689 00:38:36,440 --> 00:38:39,560 Speaker 1: we run out of bombs. The USA is new enemy 690 00:38:40,239 --> 00:38:42,200 Speaker 1: when it must seek out all over the world. It's 691 00:38:42,239 --> 00:38:45,399 Speaker 1: a migrant. It's a woman I met carrying her child 692 00:38:45,440 --> 00:38:49,560 Speaker 1: across the mountains. The little Venezuelan girl throwing bottle caps 693 00:38:49,560 --> 00:38:51,560 Speaker 1: into a cinder block with me to pass the time 694 00:38:51,920 --> 00:38:55,120 Speaker 1: as she asked me questions about America. It's a twenty 695 00:38:55,160 --> 00:38:57,600 Speaker 1: one year old man who's remains my friends found at 696 00:38:57,600 --> 00:39:00,600 Speaker 1: the border on a hot day this September. The US 697 00:39:00,840 --> 00:39:03,320 Speaker 1: will stop at nothing and fining and destroying the migrant, 698 00:39:03,800 --> 00:39:05,439 Speaker 1: and just as it did in the War on Terror, 699 00:39:05,840 --> 00:39:08,600 Speaker 1: it will find fast friends in states desperate to avail 700 00:39:08,640 --> 00:39:11,560 Speaker 1: themselves to the seemingly unlimited flow of resources the US 701 00:39:11,640 --> 00:39:14,880 Speaker 1: dedicates to keeping its conflicts out of the sights and 702 00:39:14,960 --> 00:39:28,400 Speaker 1: the minds of its citizens. The USA's open hostility to 703 00:39:28,440 --> 00:39:31,640 Speaker 1: migrants isn't something that's I'm known here. Everyone I met 704 00:39:31,680 --> 00:39:34,440 Speaker 1: knew about it. Several of them had watched with horror 705 00:39:34,600 --> 00:39:37,319 Speaker 1: as Kamala Harris and Donald Trump argued not about how 706 00:39:37,400 --> 00:39:40,000 Speaker 1: to treat migrants but about who could turn more of 707 00:39:40,080 --> 00:39:43,440 Speaker 1: them away. In a recent presidential debate. Every migrant I 708 00:39:43,560 --> 00:39:47,480 Speaker 1: met had questions about CBP, one, about US asylum policy, 709 00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:50,040 Speaker 1: and about how they could get to the US before 710 00:39:50,080 --> 00:39:54,000 Speaker 1: a second Trump administration. Despite this, they all clung to 711 00:39:54,040 --> 00:39:57,000 Speaker 1: their versions of the American dream. They wanted to work 712 00:39:57,200 --> 00:39:59,480 Speaker 1: and be paid a fair wage, to send their kids 713 00:39:59,520 --> 00:40:02,000 Speaker 1: to school and maybe to college, to feel safe in 714 00:40:02,040 --> 00:40:04,200 Speaker 1: their homes, and to be able to speak a dress 715 00:40:04,200 --> 00:40:08,000 Speaker 1: as they wish without varing consequences. All of those things 716 00:40:08,360 --> 00:40:11,440 Speaker 1: are imperiling this country too, and they know that, but 717 00:40:11,560 --> 00:40:15,280 Speaker 1: they still feel their dreams are worth the journey. For Noemi, 718 00:40:15,680 --> 00:40:18,120 Speaker 1: the little girl who took the daddy and in Astride, 719 00:40:18,680 --> 00:40:21,759 Speaker 1: the American dream was pretty simple. She wanted two things. 720 00:40:22,520 --> 00:40:24,720 Speaker 1: To see Minnie Mouse and to see her aunt. 721 00:40:25,760 --> 00:40:27,160 Speaker 7: Why am I Mini. 722 00:40:28,640 --> 00:40:31,760 Speaker 4: Get dear with a seven or thousand eros? A study air. 723 00:40:33,360 --> 00:40:34,360 Speaker 10: Not yell an. 724 00:40:34,440 --> 00:40:37,560 Speaker 4: Ammia as to Dear Ami Dea. 725 00:40:47,520 --> 00:40:49,959 Speaker 11: It Could Happen Here is a production of cool Zone Media. 726 00:40:50,200 --> 00:40:53,240 Speaker 11: For more podcasts from cool Zone Media, visit our website 727 00:40:53,360 --> 00:40:55,880 Speaker 11: cool Zonemedia dot com, or check us out on the 728 00:40:55,920 --> 00:40:59,800 Speaker 11: iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. 729 00:41:00,320 --> 00:41:02,200 Speaker 11: You can now find sources for it could Happen Here 730 00:41:02,239 --> 00:41:05,200 Speaker 11: listed directly in episode descriptions. Thanks for listening.