Speaker 1: It's I Do Part two and we're Thelma and Louise,
Speaker 1: your favorite bestie's back at it to have a great
Speaker 1: conversation today about love and loss and chapter two. Our
Speaker 1: guest today is someone we all fell in love with
Speaker 1: when she opened herself up to love again on The
Speaker 1: Golden Bachelor and then when she starred in the Golden Bachelorette.
Speaker 1: We can't wait to talk with her today. Please welcome
Speaker 1: Joan Vassos to the podcast. Welcome, Thanks for having me.
Speaker 2: Hi Joan, Hi, how are you guys? Thank you for
Speaker 2: wanting for me to be on your podcast. I appreciate it.
Speaker 1: We're so excited.
Speaker 3: And I have to ask you a question that's totally
Speaker 3: unrelated to anything that we're talking about today, but it's
Speaker 3: always intrigued me.
Speaker 1: The clothes.
Speaker 3: I mean, how did you figure out your wardrobe for
Speaker 3: the Bachelor and Bachelorette because I feel like you're in
Speaker 3: evening gowns practically every night. I mean, did you have
Speaker 3: to hire a stylist? Do you just have a naturally
Speaker 3: good sense of style? How did you approach that? And
Speaker 3: then I'll get into the meat of it, but I
Speaker 3: had to ask.
Speaker 1: You, well, then we need to ask her about her arms,
Speaker 1: because let's be real, her body is ridiculous.
Speaker 2: Oh god, no it's not. But thank you for saying that.
Speaker 2: Good lightning, I think. So for the Golden Bachelor, I
Speaker 2: had to do all my own clothes, and that you
Speaker 2: could see that they weren't anywhere near as Golden Bachelerette
Speaker 2: as good as Golden Bachelorette. So, Golden Bacher, you do
Speaker 2: all your own clothes. You have to bring all your
Speaker 2: own evening gowns and everything you wear every day is yours.
Speaker 2: And then if you get to be the lead in
Speaker 2: the show. So when I was the Golden Bachelorette, you
Speaker 2: have a stylist's name is Carrie Fatman. He's a genius.
Speaker 2: Do you go like three or four days before you
Speaker 2: start filming, or maybe even a week before you start filming,
Speaker 2: and you'd go and he has thirty racks of clothes,
Speaker 2: at least thirty RECs. He has hundreds of dresses and
Speaker 2: hundreds of outfits and they're all gorgeous, and you have
Speaker 2: conversations with them before you arrive, so you know is
Speaker 2: what your style is, like, your colors are and all that,
Speaker 2: and then you just spend three full days like eight
Speaker 2: to ten hour days trying on clothing, and then you
Speaker 2: kind of narrow it down, like you know, he'll say,
Speaker 2: you're going to need ten evening gowns, and so you
Speaker 2: try on all the evening gowns and you narrow it
Speaker 2: down to the ten and then he alters them so
Speaker 2: they are like made for your body. So it is
Speaker 2: like such a treat to have a stylist. Now I
Speaker 2: have to go back and be my own boring, you know,
Speaker 2: dressed like as you can see.
Speaker 1: You get to keep any of the clothes, any of
Speaker 1: your kind of greatest hits.
Speaker 2: So I've heard through the Great Fige that you get
Speaker 2: to pick some of the outfits that you want to keep.
Speaker 2: But so far I don't have any of the clothes,
Speaker 2: and I'd really like to have some of them. Yeah,
Speaker 2: I'm hoping. I'm keeping my fingers press, but maybe I
Speaker 2: get something an outfit or too. I know that a
Speaker 2: lot of the evening gowns came from Randy Rahm, the
Speaker 2: designer in New York I was talking about, and so
Speaker 2: I think they go back to her. So they are
Speaker 2: kind of like borrowed. They're not they don't belong to
Speaker 2: the show. They're really expensive. She does like really big
Speaker 2: like she does Beyonce and you know, really big stars.
Speaker 2: You wore them, well, I got to wear them.
Speaker 1: You made her look good.
Speaker 3: I think everybody wears it as well. Thank you for
Speaker 3: indulging me. It sounds like a total Cinderella moment.
Speaker 2: Oh my god. So it was my favorite part of
Speaker 2: the show other than finding sorry talk.
Speaker 3: Okay, well, so now moving on, Joan, we loved watching
Speaker 3: you in The Golden Bachelor and the Golden Bachelorette. But
Speaker 3: for those listeners who may not be familiar with your story,
Speaker 3: tell us a little bit about your chapter one.
Speaker 2: Okay, chapter one. So when I was married to John.
Speaker 2: So I met John when I was in college. We
Speaker 2: dated on and off kind of throughout like a three
Speaker 2: year period, and then when we both graduated from college,
Speaker 2: we were kind of like in the good place, you know,
Speaker 2: ready be ready to date more seriously, and we did
Speaker 2: and we got engaged. We got married. We did all
Speaker 2: the normal things that you know, married couples do. We
Speaker 2: had jobs, and we built a house and we you know,
Speaker 2: kind of started life together. We had four kidskids with
Speaker 2: four kids in six years, so we you know, we
Speaker 2: were you know, intimately involved in raising our kids and
Speaker 2: doing sports and the community.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and which is when I kind of loved, like
Speaker 2: I really missed those years still, you know again, because
Speaker 2: I loved kind of raising my kids. John and I
Speaker 2: raising our kids with a bunch of other parents that
Speaker 2: were raising their kids, and it was like a big
Speaker 2: community effort and everybody says, Oh, we're going to have
Speaker 2: pizza tonight, or we're going to go to the baseball game.
Speaker 2: You know, our kids are playing and we're going to
Speaker 2: sit on the sidelines. And they were just such great
Speaker 2: bonding moments of raising our kids together. And I missed
Speaker 2: that like community that we had. So then, you know,
Speaker 2: my kids kind of grow up. They all went off
Speaker 2: to college, and then now I've all kind of started
Speaker 2: their own lives. When my youngest child was in college,
Speaker 2: he was a junior in college, John was diagnosed with
Speaker 2: pancreatic cancer. And it was kind of right as we
Speaker 2: were thinking about like our second chapter of our lives,
Speaker 2: like traveling and you know, maybe buying a second home someplace,
Speaker 2: and you know, you kind of finally get to the
Speaker 2: age where you have the time and you have you know,
Speaker 2: kind of maybe a little more extra money and you
Speaker 2: can do fun, you know, more fun things or different things.
Speaker 2: And right when we were getting to that point in
Speaker 2: our lives is when John got really, really sick. So
Speaker 2: he survived the cancer for about two years, but it
Speaker 2: was while he was in treatment. The whole time we
Speaker 2: were traveling back and forth to Empty Anderson trying to
Speaker 2: get him to be part of a trial. None of
Speaker 2: we never found a trial that he was eligible for.
Speaker 2: We never The chemo really didn't work all that well,
Speaker 2: and then he did radiation, and eventually, after almost two years,
Speaker 2: he passed away a pancreatic cancer.
Speaker 1: So sorry, that's so hard. That's that's that's awful, and.
Speaker 2: It's a terrible cancer. So those two years that he
Speaker 2: was alive, most of those years weren't really weren't very good.
Speaker 2: He was in a lot of pain. So it's it
Speaker 2: was a horrible way to die. And and he left,
Speaker 2: you know, kind of right at the part of our
Speaker 2: life where we were going to start really having fun
Speaker 2: and go back to being a couple, not just parents
Speaker 2: that you know, to our four kids. So I felt
Speaker 2: like my life had kind of ended, like my whole
Speaker 2: future that I was planning with John was all of
Speaker 2: a sudden like this black hole. There was no future.
Speaker 2: I didn't have a person to spend it with. I
Speaker 2: didn't really want to, you know, I just was kind
Speaker 2: of in the mode of just staying alive and trying
Speaker 2: to be strong for my kids, to try to like
Speaker 2: support them as well as I could. And you know,
Speaker 2: I would see them and I was the happy person,
Speaker 2: and you know, we got we're getting through this and
Speaker 2: we're a great family. And then I would go up
Speaker 2: to my bedroom and I would cry. And that took
Speaker 2: me about two years to get through kind of that
Speaker 2: phase of life to then look and say, Okay, well
Speaker 2: maybe I can't have a future. I didn't feel like
Speaker 2: I could in the beginning, But then I thought, you know,
Speaker 2: why am I at the age of fifty nine saying
Speaker 2: that I can't have a second chance at love? Because
Speaker 2: you know, I was married to John for thirty two years.
Speaker 2: What tells me that I can't have somebody else for
Speaker 2: thirty two years at that age? I possibly could. And
Speaker 2: so I decided that I needed to take action, and
Speaker 2: I did some dating apps, like everybody does, you know,
Speaker 2: that's like the widest net.
Speaker 1: I am so scared of those dating apps and were
Speaker 1: there friends that were pushing you to do it or
Speaker 1: was it something your kids were involved with, saying Mom,
Speaker 1: it's time to do that. Or did you and John
Speaker 1: have those conversations that he wanted you to have another
Speaker 1: kind of chapter two.
Speaker 2: Yeah, kind of all of the book actually.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: So right before he passed away, about three days before
Speaker 2: he passed away, I remember him calling me over to
Speaker 2: this sop and he's like, come sit next to me,
Speaker 2: comes in next to me. He was kind of in
Speaker 2: and out of sleep. He was really sleeping. He was
Speaker 2: pretty well drugged. And he said, we have a great
Speaker 2: life together, and I want you to be happy again.
Speaker 2: And he said I want you to find somebody else.
Speaker 2: And I was in total denial. If it like, it's
Speaker 2: hard to believe, I was, because he went from one
Speaker 2: hundred and twenty one hundre two hundred and twenty pounds
Speaker 2: to like one hundred and ten pounds and I still
Speaker 2: looked at him and thought he was going to live.
Speaker 2: And I said no, I said, I am not having
Speaker 2: this conversation with you. I said, you are not leaving me,
Speaker 2: and he's like, all right, oh, Joe. It was the
Speaker 2: best gift he could have given me, because I would
Speaker 2: have had a really really hard time doing this. If
Speaker 2: I didn't have his blessing, In fact, I probably wouldn't
Speaker 2: be here today because but he did this. You know,
Speaker 2: he gave this to me and I didn't know it
Speaker 2: at the time, and I didn't really even think about
Speaker 2: it for a lot of months, probably well into the
Speaker 2: second year after he had passed away, and it gave
Speaker 2: me this freedom.
Speaker 1: It was almost like permission was a little bit of
Speaker 1: permission almost right.
Speaker 2: Absolutely wise, yeah, absolutely, And like I said, I wouldn't
Speaker 2: have done this if I hadn't gotten that. He was
Speaker 2: also a person that lived really big. He lived life
Speaker 2: to the fullest. Like everything he did was epic. You
Speaker 2: never went on like a normal vacation. You went to
Speaker 2: the best hotel, and you rented like every boat and
Speaker 2: every you know, like water toy you could rent, and
Speaker 2: like everything was big and everything was huge. We go
Speaker 2: to a restaurant, just a normal restaurant, and he orders
Speaker 2: every dessert on the menu just because we wanted to
Speaker 2: try it all.
Speaker 1: What a data VI, what a life spirit. But that's
Speaker 1: so such a fun life, so brave of you. And
Speaker 1: he's probably looking from above and he's happy and all that.
Speaker 1: But it's so brave and it's I'm so happy for
Speaker 1: you that you're you're getting this again. Are your kids
Speaker 1: are they? How were they supportive of you? Do they
Speaker 1: want to see you have another life? I mean, you
Speaker 1: have four kids. I'm sure there was conflicting feelings for
Speaker 1: all of them.
Speaker 2: Kind of so they wanted me happy, absolutely, But I
Speaker 2: think the whole process of like them knowing I was
Speaker 2: dating wasn't really particularly comfortable. But you know, at this
Speaker 2: but they're all adults, so it's not like I have
Speaker 2: kids at home that are worried, you know, that I'm
Speaker 2: going to bring a man home, you know, enter their
Speaker 2: home or something like that. That wasn't a worry and
Speaker 2: they wanted me to be happy. I just don't think
Speaker 2: they really wanted the details of it. They didn't really
Speaker 2: want to know a lot about relationships and stuff like that.
Speaker 2: So when I was doing online dating, that was easy.
Speaker 2: You know, I'd be like I'm going on days night,
Speaker 2: or maybe I wouldn't even tell them whatever, And I
Speaker 2: didn't talk about the men, you know, really very often.
Speaker 2: When I told them that I had filled out the
Speaker 2: application to go on build a.
Speaker 1: Bag, Sorry, was that your idea to go on the
Speaker 1: show or was that a friend so tell us about that.
Speaker 1: That's amazing.
Speaker 2: So I was out to dinner with a friend. We
Speaker 2: were sitting at the bar, and it was right at
Speaker 2: about the two year marks. So John had been gone
Speaker 2: for about two years. The first year, you know, people say, oh,
Speaker 2: after the first year, you start feeling better. Not true.
Speaker 2: I felt like crap. In fact, I felt worse the
Speaker 2: second year. It kind of all hit me like this
Speaker 2: is my life, this like what the you know, like
Speaker 2: what the heck happened? And so that second year was
Speaker 2: really hard. And I was getting to the end of
Speaker 2: that second year and I was starting to feel lonely.
Speaker 2: Before I was just kind of numb, and then I
Speaker 2: started feeling lonely and feeling like I wasn't part of
Speaker 2: a couple, which is really hard in the world of couples.
Speaker 2: And I had gone from being you know this, you know,
Speaker 2: John and I had gone from being a couple that
Speaker 2: we did. We had a lot of couple of friends
Speaker 2: with I had a lot of couple of friends. We
Speaker 2: did a lot with our couple of friends to me
Speaker 2: being a single and then all of a sudden that
Speaker 2: was excluded from all kinds of social things because I
Speaker 2: was a single so I was starting to feel all
Speaker 2: we're familiar with that, you get it right, and it's
Speaker 2: so weird hard, Yeah, it really is. And I was
Speaker 2: like like alone on singles Island and I hated it
Speaker 2: and I wanted I was starting to feel like I
Speaker 2: wanted to be a couple again, mainly because of the
Speaker 2: like I missed doing the things with other couples.
Speaker 3: Question. You mentioned that you met your husband You met
Speaker 3: John in college, So you really I mean you never
Speaker 3: really experienced dating. You fell in love young and kind
Speaker 3: of it sounds like I grew up with John, so
Speaker 3: first time in thirty years. That not only had you
Speaker 3: been through really a tragedy, but you also had to
Speaker 3: figure out like what what that looked to date?
Speaker 2: And so I mean, what were you feeling at.
Speaker 3: The time, and how did you approach that or did
Speaker 3: you have help?
Speaker 2: You know? Yeah, so weird, right. I mean I had
Speaker 2: this idea that I would rather meet somebody like or
Speaker 2: so I had this new thing that I would do.
Speaker 2: I meet friends out for dinner, and I have tons
Speaker 2: of friends, so I would be out a lot and
Speaker 2: you know, they kind of like a lot of them
Speaker 2: kind of made me go out in the beginning, and
Speaker 2: they're like, you can't sit at home. You need to
Speaker 2: get out, You need to get out. And that kind
Speaker 2: of became like my life, me going out with my friends,
Speaker 2: you know, most evenings every week. So and I would
Speaker 2: always go. We used to go sit at a table,
Speaker 2: and I would say, let's sit at the bar now
Speaker 2: because I thought it opened me up to us.
Speaker 1: So we do. We did it yesterday. It's so fun,
Speaker 1: just the two of us though.
Speaker 2: It just and it's fun going out with a girlfriend
Speaker 2: because a lot of times people will engage you with
Speaker 2: talking and sometimes it's just another couple, a guy, a
Speaker 2: man and a woman, like a husband and wife. But
Speaker 2: you know, you never know, like when you're out if
Speaker 2: that husband and wife have a friend or like the
Speaker 2: more that you're out there and the more accessible you are,
Speaker 2: So you need to not go sit at a table
Speaker 2: where no one's going to come up to you. You need
Speaker 2: to sit at the bar.
Speaker 1: Or it doesn't just drop out of the sky, right
Speaker 1: like you have to put it out there.
Speaker 2: Absolutely totally agree with you on that one. So we
Speaker 2: were out. We were sitting at a local restaurant, a bar,
Speaker 2: like actually right across the street from a house where
Speaker 2: I go off, and like, I know the bartender, I
Speaker 2: know other people there, so it's like a really comfortable
Speaker 2: place to meet for me. And I said to my friend,
Speaker 2: you know, I really feel like I'm ready to maybe
Speaker 2: start dating, and kind of in my I thought it
Speaker 2: in my head. My heart didn't really feel that way yet,
Speaker 2: but my head definitely knew that I wasn't getting any younger,
Speaker 2: I wasn't getting prettier, I wasn't getting any more fun,
Speaker 2: and that they were there could be guys out there
Speaker 2: that are feeling the same way, maybe close to my
Speaker 2: age or whatever, and I thought I felt like I
Speaker 2: needed to get out there. So like I was saying
Speaker 2: that into my head, but I said to her, I go, like,
Speaker 2: look around this restaurant. I go, everybody here is a couple,
Speaker 2: and she's like, yeah, they are. I go, how am
Speaker 2: I ever going to meet somebody? I really want to
Speaker 2: meet somebody organically. I don't want to do dating apps.
Speaker 2: I want to like be at a wedding or be
Speaker 2: at a bar like this, or at a restaurant, or
Speaker 2: meet somebody at the grocery store. You both reach for
Speaker 2: the tomato or you know some romantic story like that.
Speaker 2: But I was like, it hasn't happened yet, and I
Speaker 2: don't feel like it's going to happen. She's like, you're
Speaker 2: going to have to do dating apps and I.
Speaker 1: Was like, ugh, do you live in a small Do
Speaker 1: you live in a small community where most people are married?
Speaker 1: Were people thinking to set you up?
Speaker 2: So I kind of put it out there that I
Speaker 2: was ready to be set up, and people were like, Oh,
Speaker 2: you're not gonna like any of the guys I know
Speaker 2: that are single, or look, I don't know anybody single.
Speaker 2: So like people weren't particularly wanting to set me up.
Speaker 2: They didn't think that I would be interested in the
Speaker 2: people that we knew that were single. So, but I
Speaker 2: don't live in a small community. I live right outside
Speaker 2: of Washington, DC. I live actually right in the suburbs
Speaker 2: of a big city. So it's not like there shouldn't
Speaker 2: have been a lot of people out there. But I
Speaker 2: guess my friends just said no once again, couples hang
Speaker 2: out with couples.
Speaker 3: You also probably just wanted the exercise of dating, right,
Speaker 3: I mean, it's not like you were like I need
Speaker 3: to find my mister perfect. It's like, yeah, you probably
Speaker 3: just didn't even know what it was like to date,
Speaker 3: so it was more about like exercising the muscle, right.
Speaker 1: But she's also good at it. She's also great at
Speaker 1: a relationship obviously. So I'm sure that that felt something
Speaker 1: that would be another destination that you would want in
Speaker 1: your life. Potentially.
Speaker 2: Absolutely, Yeah, yeah, yeah. I love, like I said, being
Speaker 2: part of a and I loved the give and take
Speaker 2: and I love the I love going out with somebody.
Speaker 2: I still love sitting at home and watching a Netflix
Speaker 2: like I like having my person. It's just like I
Speaker 2: had it for so many years of my life. I
Speaker 2: didn't really know how to do it without having somebody,
Speaker 2: Like like you said, I was. You know, we married
Speaker 2: kind of young. You know, we started dating when we
Speaker 2: were in college. I dated while I was in college,
Speaker 2: but like it's college dating, that's not like serious dating.
Speaker 2: I started dating seriously right out of college was John.
Speaker 2: So I never really had a long term relationship with
Speaker 2: anybody other than John. So I did need the practice
Speaker 2: a lot. And so I came home from that restaurant
Speaker 2: that night thinking I got to go on a dating
Speaker 2: app and this, and I turned my TV on and
Speaker 2: I'm a bachelor watcher and it was a Bachelor night,
Speaker 2: and I turned my TV on to watch the Bachelor,
Speaker 2: and the first commercial that came up said, we are
Speaker 2: taking casting calls for a new series called the Golden Bachelor.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, that's a message from the universe.
Speaker 2: Directly, that's exactly what I saimilarly, like a speaking to me.
Speaker 2: And so I filled that application out and I did
Speaker 2: a really lousy job because I was on my phone
Speaker 2: and I had had two glasses of wine and I
Speaker 2: can't see or type. When after I got any wine.
Speaker 1: And there was no chat GPT, then yeah, well there
Speaker 1: was and.
Speaker 2: I needed it. No, no, no, So I filled out
Speaker 2: like I don't know. It was a long application, like
Speaker 2: ninety questions. It was really really really long. I filled
Speaker 2: out about half of it. I did the part where
Speaker 2: you need to send you know, like your Instagram and
Speaker 2: your social media stuff, which I don't think I had
Speaker 2: any followers on Instagram. I'm going to be positive I
Speaker 2: had it, but I set whatever I had.
Speaker 1: So you were the first star really of Golden Bachelette.
Speaker 1: Did you honestly think that there was a reality or
Speaker 1: potential that you could find a forever love on the show,
Speaker 1: Like if so, and at what moment did you think yourself,
Speaker 1: Oh my god, this this could really work for.
Speaker 2: Me, This could happen. So it kind of became a
Speaker 2: little bit of a reality when I was on Golden Boucher,
Speaker 2: or not necessarily because of Gary. I mean, he was fine,
Speaker 2: but I didn't think he was a match for me.
Speaker 2: But when I went on my one in one date
Speaker 2: with him, I felt like I could picture it finally,
Speaker 2: like picture actually being with another person. And I hadn't
Speaker 2: up until that point. I was even on the show
Speaker 2: filming and still was thinking, you know, I don't picture
Speaker 2: myself with anybody other than John. And after I went
Speaker 2: on my date with Gary, even though I knew he
Speaker 2: wasn't for me, and I left the next day, So
Speaker 2: that was the day I left to go home to
Speaker 2: my daughter, I all of a sudden, like a switch flipped,
Speaker 2: and I felt like I could picture a life with
Speaker 2: somebody else. And I think part of it was not
Speaker 2: just being with Gary, but being with the other twenty
Speaker 2: one other women and hearing them their stories and seeing
Speaker 2: how much fun they're having dating and you know, their
Speaker 2: stories about finding love again. It made me want it
Speaker 2: more and think it was possible more because I'm like
Speaker 2: these smart women that I really really respect and you know,
Speaker 2: you know, kind of grew to love there. A lot
Speaker 2: of them are my really really good friends. Now we're
Speaker 2: doing it, and it gave me faith that if they
Speaker 2: were doing it, why did I think that it wasn't
Speaker 2: going to work for me. So it kind of like
Speaker 2: the switch kind of clips. So when I went on
Speaker 2: Golden but when I became the Golden Bacherette and I
Speaker 2: started that filming, I actually was feeling pretty positive about it,
Speaker 2: but I was worried because I hadn't met the men yet,
Speaker 2: and I was like, I don't know what they're casting
Speaker 2: for me, even though I know the producers pretty well
Speaker 2: because I've done Golden Bachelor and over like that time
Speaker 2: of them, you know, interviewing me and kind of selecting
Speaker 2: me and going through that whole process to become the
Speaker 2: Golden Bacherette. I really spoke to them a lot, and
Speaker 2: they I felt like they knew me pretty well. But
Speaker 2: I had no idea who was going to apply for this,
Speaker 2: because I didn't know if there were going to be
Speaker 2: a bunch of really outgoing men that you know, wanted
Speaker 2: to be out there and wanted to date on National TV, Like,
Speaker 2: I don't know if there's a big group of those people,
Speaker 2: because most men I know would be like, yeah, no thanks,
Speaker 2: I'm not going to do that on National TV. That's
Speaker 2: like not very dignified. I just felt like they wouldn't
Speaker 2: be open to being open and being vulnerable and talking
Speaker 2: about their feelings, and that certainly is required in this process.
Speaker 2: So I thought, maybe they're not going to have a
Speaker 2: lot of men. So I was really worth the night
Speaker 2: of the limousines entering. I was like, Okay, this is it.
Speaker 2: I got to see if, like there's anybody good here,
Speaker 2: and I felt pretty soon after the first couple limousines
Speaker 2: came that this could be, this could work out. And
Speaker 2: how did you.
Speaker 3: Obviously you knew you were going on the Golden Bachelorette
Speaker 3: and you'd already done the Golden Bachelor.
Speaker 1: But back to your kids.
Speaker 3: I think I read an article recently that talked about
Speaker 3: how you had four kids and two of them kind
Speaker 3: of have they had different opinions on you dating and
Speaker 3: especially doing it in the limelight in front of the
Speaker 3: you know, national television. So how much did you seek
Speaker 3: input permission from them and really involve them in this process?
Speaker 2: Probably input, not permission, because I'm not sure if they
Speaker 2: would ever not give me permission, because they would never
Speaker 2: be like that selfish, and they knew, you know, I
Speaker 2: really wanted to do it, they would want that for me.
Speaker 2: But I did really want their input because I wanted
Speaker 2: respect their privacy, because like, it was me going on
Speaker 2: this journey, not them, And so I wanted to make
Speaker 2: sure I didn't embarrass them. I didn't you know, reveal
Speaker 2: anything about them that they didn't want revealed, because this
Speaker 2: was my journey, not theirs. So I had conversations. I
Speaker 2: had a lot of conversations with my kids, and I
Speaker 2: had too that thought it was really kind of cool
Speaker 2: and fun, and you know, my thought was and I
Speaker 2: actually had this conversation with a friend of mine. I said, God,
Speaker 2: I don't know if I'm gonna I want to do this.
Speaker 2: I'm afraid that like, in some way, it's not respecting
Speaker 2: John's memory, it's not honoring John by going out and
Speaker 2: doing something this kind of mist salacious, you know, it's
Speaker 2: a little you know, a little sortied maybe or something.
Speaker 2: You know. I didn't feel that way, but I was
Speaker 2: afraid that other people did. And and I kind of
Speaker 2: knew how I was going to do this process and
Speaker 2: that I was going to be dignified. I was going
Speaker 2: to be embarrassing, but I just didn't want, like to
Speaker 2: embarrass my kids.
Speaker 1: One of the things that Thelma and I really took
Speaker 1: away was the way you handled those overnight dates that
Speaker 1: you didn't I mean, it was so elegant and so
Speaker 1: classy and respect I mean it was it was literally
Speaker 1: Probably my biggest takeaway was how you handle that. It
Speaker 1: was amazing.
Speaker 2: Thank you. I put a lot of thought in that
Speaker 2: because I didn't think it was going to be really
Speaker 2: popular with the producers. I mean that's part of the show,
Speaker 2: and or the guys or the guys or the guys
Speaker 2: there's that too, But I felt like I had to
Speaker 2: do what was right for me. And there's no in
Speaker 2: no universe can I ever imagine sleeping with three guys
Speaker 2: in the.
Speaker 1: Same week, so with your kids and your friends and
Speaker 1: your community watching the show.
Speaker 3: Well, I agree with that, and I think and by
Speaker 3: the way, I would have handled it the same way.
Speaker 3: And as as you know, Louise indicated, I thought you
Speaker 3: were a stellar and you were. You handled it head on,
Speaker 3: you were direct, you were vulnerable and you were amazing.
Speaker 1: And so transparent.
Speaker 3: Question for you, was there any concern because obviously you
Speaker 3: had I mean being with the person for thirty one years,
Speaker 3: right and being I mean there's a level of comfort there.
Speaker 3: Were you at all concerned that this was your opportunity
Speaker 3: to you know, be with these men and were you
Speaker 3: concerned at all about intimacy? I don't, you know, was
Speaker 3: that a priority? Obviously not to that level.
Speaker 2: But you know what I'm saying, I absolutely so, Like
Speaker 2: you said, you know, it was going to be very
Speaker 2: weird and you know, kind of out of my comfort
Speaker 2: zone again, like dating was out of my comfort zone.
Speaker 2: I you know, kind of did that. But getting to
Speaker 2: that end, you think, Okay, there's obviously a physical component.
Speaker 2: I mean, and it's certainly a message that I wanted
Speaker 2: out there. Honestly, I didn't want like this was a
Speaker 2: show about people dating in their you know, second half
Speaker 2: of their life, and so like, I think addressing an
Speaker 2: intimacy part of it is important because I don't want
Speaker 2: people to think that that's not an important part of
Speaker 2: my relationship or a relationship at this age, we know
Speaker 2: it is, right, I Mean, it's certainly like it's certainly
Speaker 2: something that I wanted, but I didn't want to do
Speaker 2: it on national TV. And I think there's things that
Speaker 2: you can tell about your attraction to a person that
Speaker 2: doesn't have to take it all the way to the end.
Speaker 2: So I mean kissing is you know, really important, and
Speaker 2: you know, I feel like there's more, there's intimate moments
Speaker 2: that don't require you like having sex with somebody. And
Speaker 2: so I mean, like I knew that I was only
Speaker 2: going to have, you know, a physical relationship with one
Speaker 2: person if I ended up with somebody, and you know,
Speaker 2: I didn't, So I know I was going to end
Speaker 2: up with somebody, but I knew that wasn't going to
Speaker 2: be on the table for until the end, until I
Speaker 2: was either engaged or the show was over, and I
Speaker 2: had just one person left, whether engaged or not. And like,
Speaker 2: I was not going to do it before that. It
Speaker 2: just didn't feel right to me. It's just not my
Speaker 2: it's just not the way ever operated.
Speaker 1: It's interesting because it's it's you get off the show
Speaker 1: and all of a sudden you're engaged. And so in
Speaker 1: addition to the you know, kind of physical step, there's
Speaker 1: so much to learn about somebody and you guys have
Speaker 1: you know, fifty years of life experiences completely separate that
Speaker 1: you really need to see if kind of your Obviously
Speaker 1: you've learned that your core values are aligned, but there
Speaker 1: is such a learning curve to like really to see
Speaker 1: and to almost undo other like kind of behaviors and
Speaker 1: different things that you navigated for so long. With John,
Speaker 1: it's been a big it's a big thing. So it
Speaker 1: was kind of like getting off the show and then
Speaker 1: I would assume you're looking at each other and you're like,
Speaker 1: where do we start?
Speaker 2: Exactly what happened? It's hilarious. So you do you take
Speaker 2: like this leap of faith? You really do? You say? Okay,
Speaker 2: you know, like there's so many really good things. And
Speaker 2: like I said from the very beginning, I don't need
Speaker 2: to be engaged at the end of this process. I
Speaker 2: want to leave this show with a signal I can't
Speaker 2: one person that I wanted to explore how you know,
Speaker 2: our lives would work together, that we would work together.
Speaker 2: But I did feel pretty strongly about Chocolate. I did
Speaker 2: feel like I was in love with him, and you know,
Speaker 2: I thought he might actually propose to me, and he did,
Speaker 2: and I had in my mind that I would say yes.
Speaker 2: That I was going to take this leap of faith.
Speaker 2: I don't have to I don't have to marry him,
Speaker 2: but it would be nice to leave this process with
Speaker 2: the real commitment. And so I said yes, obviously when
Speaker 2: he asked me to marry him. And then we went back.
Speaker 2: We were staying on a ship, and we went back
Speaker 2: to the ship and we went into he was in
Speaker 2: a suite. We were with in sweets. So I went,
Speaker 2: I went down to his suite. I changed my clothes.
Speaker 2: But on the evening, gown went down to his suite
Speaker 2: and had a bottle of wine there and two glasses,
Speaker 2: and he pored him and he goes, so, tell me
Speaker 2: about yourself. Are you nervous?
Speaker 1: I would have been nervous.
Speaker 2: I was. I'm engaged in this person. I tell liquid courage.
Speaker 2: I did I need liquids, curds. It was like one
Speaker 2: o'clock in the afternoon and I'm we dranking two hobitles
Speaker 2: of wine, I think. And we really just sat there
Speaker 2: and got to know each other. Which you talked about kids,
Speaker 2: We talked about marriages, we talked about things that we
Speaker 2: talked about a little bit on the show. But once again,
Speaker 2: I didn't want to read the deal, things about my
Speaker 2: kids or you know, parts of my life that would
Speaker 2: embarrass my kids or not. You know, I wouldn't went
Speaker 2: on TV. And he was the same way. So it
Speaker 2: was finally our chance to just be free and open
Speaker 2: and talk about whatever we wanted. But we were really
Speaker 2: lucky because Batcher does a really good job of fostering
Speaker 2: your relationship during those months where you're not public yet.
Speaker 2: So you you know, you finish filming and you have
Speaker 2: like three months before the finale and they, you know,
Speaker 2: they get that you need to like you know, date
Speaker 2: kind of you need to be with each other and
Speaker 2: figure out. So we had these they're called happy couple visits,
Speaker 2: and we had five of them, which is more than
Speaker 2: anybody has ever had it.
Speaker 1: Psychondrigal visits in jail.
Speaker 2: It's like go to jail and like, you know, having
Speaker 2: the room, but instead it's in a beautiful home to
Speaker 2: these beautiful airbnbs in la and you have a pool
Speaker 2: and a tennis court and some of them. So it's
Speaker 2: lovely and they give you food you say, we're going
Speaker 2: to cook, and they'll get to do your grocery shopping
Speaker 2: for you, and they just give you time to be
Speaker 2: together and actually and that first meeting was weird also
Speaker 2: because we hadn't been together in like three weeks because
Speaker 2: we'd stop filming. But we you know, there was time.
Speaker 2: There was a chunk of time where we couldn't see
Speaker 2: each other for like three weeks, and then we finally
Speaker 2: went on our first a happy couple you know weekend,
Speaker 2: which is like a four day weekend. And I remember
Speaker 2: I got to the house before talk and I was like,
Speaker 2: this is so awkward, Like he's just going to come
Speaker 2: even seeing him a hurdly little the.
Speaker 1: Guy, Well, you do look good on face time, so
Speaker 1: hopefully you guys FaceTime regularly.
Speaker 2: We did a little bit. We talked a lot. We
Speaker 2: didn't FaceTime quite as much because he would be working,
Speaker 2: I'd be in like in my car or whatever. For
Speaker 2: some reason, we didn't FaceTime all that much. But we
Speaker 2: talked like five times a day. So we certainly were
Speaker 2: getting to know each other really well. But we were
Speaker 2: both super nervous coming into that house. And hey, I
Speaker 2: got there first. He got there about an hour later,
Speaker 2: and he walked in with the suitcase and he comes
Speaker 2: in and he gives me a kiss, and we were
Speaker 2: right back where we were before. So like it was
Speaker 2: just like we didn't skip a beat. We were right
Speaker 2: back kind of to where we were when we left,
Speaker 2: when we were in love and we you know, we're
Speaker 2: you know, figuring each other out. We got to that point.
Speaker 2: So and then every visit after that and I said
Speaker 2: we had five every time it was better and better
Speaker 2: and better. We became more solid. We knew each other better,
Speaker 2: but we still hadn't dated out like in the real world.
Speaker 2: So we we you know, we dated in like a bubble.
Speaker 2: So we finally, you know, after the finale started to
Speaker 2: go you know, got to go out. We went to
Speaker 2: New York City right at the finale and spent a
Speaker 2: week there, and then he came to my home and
Speaker 2: we spent time here, met some of my friends, and
Speaker 2: you know, spent time with my family, and you know,
Speaker 2: now we just kind of we kind of moved back.
Speaker 2: We worked backwards. We got engaged.
Speaker 1: You guys have a rhythm, And do you feel that
Speaker 1: when you have introduced him to your couple's friends or
Speaker 1: the kids, Like are they open and warm? Are they judgmental?
Speaker 1: Do you feel nervous? Do you feel uncomfort Like? How
Speaker 1: does that play out when you bringing him into your world,
Speaker 1: which was obviously a world with John for so long.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was a little in nerve wracking, and you know,
Speaker 2: we happened our finale happened to have happened to occur
Speaker 2: right before Thanksgiving, so it was like the second week
Speaker 2: in November was willing they have had the finale, and
Speaker 2: we made plans for our families to be together for Thanksgiving.
Speaker 2: So that was really nice of him because he usually
Speaker 2: does something else with his family for Thanksgiving. And his
Speaker 2: kids said they would come, you know, to my house,
Speaker 2: which was really nice. So both his kids came to
Speaker 2: my house and they stayed here along with you know,
Speaker 2: Chalk obviously was here, and we kind of merged the
Speaker 2: families in a really kind of busy weekend where there's
Speaker 2: a lot of other family involved, and it wasn't just
Speaker 2: our two families. I have a big extended family, and
Speaker 2: I wanted to respect that. You know. It was actually
Speaker 2: most of the people that we get together with for
Speaker 2: Thanksgiving is John's family, so I didn't want to change
Speaker 2: that for my kids. Or I'm still very very very
Speaker 2: close to my mother in law, my sister, and the
Speaker 2: I mean they were part of my for like almost
Speaker 2: you know, almost my whole life.
Speaker 1: She raised she raised you.
Speaker 2: You were kind of like she was. Yeah, I was
Speaker 2: like twenty when we met.
Speaker 1: So how did that?
Speaker 2: How did that go? I mean, was it challenging?
Speaker 1: Was it?
Speaker 2: What did that look like? It was just chaotic? Honestly,
Speaker 2: My daughter hosted it at her house and so we
Speaker 2: all went there. So we had a couple of days
Speaker 2: here and then Thanksgiving occurs and we all go over
Speaker 2: to her house and there was like forty people and
Speaker 2: it was chaotic and everybody wanted to meet Chalk and
Speaker 2: his kids, and it was exhausting, to be totally honest,
Speaker 2: it was a really really hard way to do it.
Speaker 2: We did it all at once. It's done now now
Speaker 2: everybody's met everybody. But it wasn't fun for me at all.
Speaker 2: I was nervous.
Speaker 1: I would have been nervous on edge too the whole time.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And we started at like three o'clock and by
Speaker 2: eight o'clock I was freaking exhausted. I just I was like,
Speaker 2: we got to go. And they felt the same way.
Speaker 2: I think we were all in bed by nine o'clock
Speaker 2: that night. We were just it was just a long,
Speaker 2: hard day. It's an emotional day also, because everybody it's
Speaker 2: like there's this big pink elephant in the like he's
Speaker 2: not John yeah, and like we all see it, so
Speaker 2: like he's now like stepping, you know, stepping into the
Speaker 2: role of being my person. And it's hard for everybody
Speaker 2: to accept that. It was hard for me to even
Speaker 2: present it. So that was an uncomfortable day. Did you
Speaker 2: debrief with your children? Did you debrief with your children afterwards?
Speaker 2: I think we've kind of had that conversation about that
Speaker 2: being you know, like a little bit of a rider day.
Speaker 2: Our kids happened to get along really well together though,
Speaker 2: so it's kind of fun. So the next day I
Speaker 2: had made plans for us to go to a local brewery,
Speaker 2: which is really fun, and they had these things they
Speaker 2: have these yurts where you can rent so which oh
Speaker 2: my god, they're so fun. And they had big, you know,
Speaker 2: fire pits. And it was in a town that I
Speaker 2: grew up in, so I know everybody there and we
Speaker 2: went there and that day was fun. That day was
Speaker 2: very social. The pressure was almost off.
Speaker 1: It was like beyond do you feel that the fact
Speaker 1: that both you and Chalk have experienced grief and last
Speaker 1: part that that gave you both a deeper understanding and
Speaker 1: a comfort level which was created more of a connection.
Speaker 2: Yeah. So I think that when you go through a
Speaker 2: loss like that, that the little things become less important
Speaker 2: and you realize that and maybe, you know, part of
Speaker 2: that is probably maturity also that just naturally that would
Speaker 2: have happened, but you look at like the small crap
Speaker 2: and it just doesn't matter because because you realize how
Speaker 2: how short life is, and you don't realize it until
Speaker 2: you like come face to face with mortality, and that
Speaker 2: doesn't happen until you know a loved one dies. If
Speaker 2: you die or a loved one dies, that's you know,
Speaker 2: that's the only time when you actually face it, like
Speaker 2: with somebody like I fit, you know, I face mortality
Speaker 2: with John and as he died, and Chalk did the
Speaker 2: same thing with Kathy. So you have a different look
Speaker 2: at life, to be honest, it's more fragile and more valuable.
Speaker 1: My best friend died of cancer over the pandemic, and
Speaker 1: he has fallen in love with a widow who lost
Speaker 1: her husband suddenly in an auto accident, and their relationship
Speaker 1: is unbelievable to watch.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, you value life and you value like your
Speaker 2: moments so much more and easily so Joan, though.
Speaker 3: I mean, it's so fun to watch you and Chock
Speaker 3: and you both have that sparkle in your eye and
Speaker 3: it just seems.
Speaker 2: Like you really really click.
Speaker 3: But now that you're you know, there's no more cameras
Speaker 3: rolling all the rest and you're doing this long distance relationship, Like,
Speaker 3: what are the challenges that come with that? And how
Speaker 3: are you navigating kind of the distance and trying to
Speaker 3: figure out do we move forward?
Speaker 1: Well, maybe she's moving to Kansas, are you?
Speaker 3: I thought we were meeting in New York in a
Speaker 3: sexy pad and having fun there.
Speaker 2: That that is true. We are doing that. We're trying
Speaker 2: to find a place, but it's really really hard to
Speaker 2: find something, or to be honest, they just disappear, like
Speaker 2: the minute they come in the market, they're gone. So
Speaker 2: that's been a little bit of a challenge. We're still
Speaker 2: working on that and it's still our plan. But we
Speaker 2: also have the plan of kind of him spending time here,
Speaker 2: me spending time in Kansas. He's been here more times
Speaker 2: than I've been to Kansas, so I owe a Kansas trip,
Speaker 2: which I'm actually making on Thursday, so I'm going there
Speaker 2: again and then we're driving to Oklahoma to visit his father.
Speaker 2: So I'm doing the whole mid Midwest tour next week
Speaker 2: or this coming up week. I don't think that is
Speaker 2: really a challenge, to be honest. Right now, we have
Speaker 2: been fortunate, since you know we're pretty soon off the show,
Speaker 2: you still have kind of opportunities. People still want to
Speaker 2: see you around, and I'm sure all those will fade
Speaker 2: very soon. But like iHeartRadio invited us to go to
Speaker 2: the Jingle Ball, and you know, we've done a couple
Speaker 2: other things. We've been invited by people to be on shows,
Speaker 2: and like we were Drew very Moore at a couple
Speaker 2: of weeks ago, so they invited to New York City
Speaker 2: and we got to see each other there. So we
Speaker 2: get invited to enough things right now that we organically
Speaker 2: see each other once every couple weeks anyway, And then
Speaker 2: we make an effort. Don't if we're not seeing each
Speaker 2: other in every ten to fourteen days, we've planned something.
Speaker 2: So the few times that we haven't had a reason
Speaker 2: to meet, he's come here or we've been in New
Speaker 2: York City, we've planned a trip. And then we just
Speaker 2: got back from Cancun, so we went on a vacation together.
Speaker 2: So we've done a good job of making sure that
Speaker 2: we see each other. In fact, like I think we're
Speaker 2: coming up on maybe the longest time that we haven't
Speaker 2: seen each other, and it's feeling starting to feel kind
Speaker 2: of crappy. But we're both really busy right now, and
Speaker 2: like the absence makes the heart grow funder is kind
Speaker 2: of a thing that I believe in. And when we
Speaker 2: see each other, we're really happy to see each other,
Speaker 2: like we are, We're like newlyweds, you know, We're like,
Speaker 2: we need to be together at that point, and it
Speaker 2: feels so good.
Speaker 1: No, that makes sense. Do you think that people that
Speaker 1: are looking for their chapter two should be more open
Speaker 1: to long distance dating? It opens up more options?
Speaker 2: Absolutely, and I wasn't. So I think I've learned a
Speaker 2: lot from this experience. I have kind of a philosophy
Speaker 2: and I talked about this. Actually before I went on
Speaker 2: the show, CNN asked to interview me, and it was
Speaker 2: right after Gary and Teresa had broken up. It was right,
Speaker 2: it was fresh off the break up, and it was fresh.
Speaker 2: It was actually they interviewed me like right the day
Speaker 2: that I was announced that I was going to be
Speaker 2: the Golden Bachelor of the day after. So it aired
Speaker 2: the day after and they asked, I said, what are
Speaker 2: you going to do? Like obviously this distance thing is
Speaker 2: what caused that marriage to break up. You know, how
Speaker 2: are you going to handle it? And I said, well,
Speaker 2: I just want to put it out there right now
Speaker 2: that I am not moving from Maryland. I have three
Speaker 2: grandkids here, I have four kids that live there. I
Speaker 2: am and I have a ninety two year old mother
Speaker 2: and an eighty six year old mother in law that
Speaker 2: I can't leave. So I am not leaving Maryland. So
Speaker 2: if somebody thinks that they're coming on the show and
Speaker 2: I am going to change that, that is not going
Speaker 2: to happen. But I do realize that then that's a
Speaker 2: whole different conversation. And it's going to take a lot
Speaker 2: of effort to make this relationship work. And it's going
Speaker 2: to be required that you know, you have to make
Speaker 2: sure that your schedules are you know, you're going to
Speaker 2: match your schedules. It's going to require travel, it's going
Speaker 2: to require an effort to see each other, and I
Speaker 2: am so willing to do that. I will bend over
Speaker 2: backwards to make sure that that part we take care of.
Speaker 2: So it's just a kind of a you know, you
Speaker 2: have to look at it in a little bit of
Speaker 2: different way. But I also in my mind thought, this
Speaker 2: is like really a bad thing.
Speaker 1: You sound like Selma, Yeah, is that Yalma loves long distance.
Speaker 3: I love long distance, And I feel like having a
Speaker 3: chapter one that was very traditional and it was wonderful,
Speaker 3: but again, I think there's so many more variables in
Speaker 3: chapter two, with families and kids and lives, lives and jobs,
Speaker 3: and I was just going to say, I mean, are
Speaker 3: you seeking a more non traditional relationship kind of? And
Speaker 3: I don't mean there's not the connection in the bond
Speaker 3: and all of that, but just the day to day
Speaker 3: you know, it doesn't have to be under one roof,
Speaker 3: like are you seeking something different this chapter? So I'm
Speaker 3: not sure.
Speaker 2: If I'm seeking anything yet, but it's playing out in
Speaker 2: the way I kind of expected to because I know
Speaker 2: that Truck still has a business in Kansas, and I
Speaker 2: still have grand kids, and I'm busy too. I feel
Speaker 2: like we couldn't have the best of both the world.
Speaker 2: So if I have something important going on here, he
Speaker 2: has no problem playing here and doing what I need
Speaker 2: to do. Or if I have something like I'm doing
Speaker 2: this wine collaboration in California, so he and I are like,
Speaker 2: we're meeting in California because it's kind of a fun
Speaker 2: thing to do, kind of a.
Speaker 1: Sexy jet setting life.
Speaker 2: And people see this as a negative. I think it's
Speaker 2: actually really fun. I think it's hugely a positive for us.
Speaker 2: Right now we have all these really cool experiences together.
Speaker 2: And maybe i'd see one day, you know, maybe next year,
Speaker 2: maybe they reactor, maybe five years from now. Then I'm
Speaker 2: going to go like, Okay, you know, it'd be nice
Speaker 2: to have you around, like to cook dinner together and
Speaker 2: to like start living a more normal life. But right now,
Speaker 2: this is really fun and I am not looking to
Speaker 2: change it, and.
Speaker 3: It's probably been I would think, is it been helpful
Speaker 3: for your children, because I mean life has changed. You
Speaker 3: obviously have a loved one now, but it's probably nice
Speaker 3: that they still have you to themselves occasionally and you
Speaker 3: know the routine of what was pre Chock.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think you're right, Like it hasn't been a
Speaker 2: big up people to their lives. It hasn't changed all
Speaker 2: that much. Like I'll go away for a week at
Speaker 2: a time or ten days at a time and then
Speaker 2: be home for a week or two weeks at a time,
Speaker 2: and so it's a little different, but it's not a
Speaker 2: lot different. But the difference is they really like it
Speaker 2: when Chalk comes here because they really like him. He's
Speaker 2: just a fun, easy person of the round. Yeah. So
Speaker 2: he stays here and you know, we come down for
Speaker 2: you know, like to have coffee in the morning, and
Speaker 2: you know, one of my kids will be here, and
Speaker 2: I feel like they like him maybe more than like me.
Speaker 2: They really have fun.
Speaker 1: So he fits. He really he really fits, and.
Speaker 2: He has a great since humor, is fun to be around.
Speaker 1: He's also has a very calming what I mean. He
Speaker 1: has such a calming energy about him. And when I
Speaker 1: looked at the two of you when we were all
Speaker 1: in Pebble Beach, I saw the excitement and the attraction,
Speaker 1: but I saw peace, like a real kind of peaceful
Speaker 1: connection with the two of you, where you guys just
Speaker 1: felt safe with each other.
Speaker 2: That's like such a great way to put it, because
Speaker 2: that was something that when John passed away, I felt
Speaker 2: like floating, untethered, like I just was like it was
Speaker 2: just me. Even though I have a great family and
Speaker 2: I have so much love in my life. I felt
Speaker 2: very alone and that it was like me against the world,
Speaker 2: and he grounds me. I don't feel that way anymore.
Speaker 2: I feel like I have my person and that he
Speaker 2: makes me feel safe. I felt like he grounded me.
Speaker 3: We interviewed him at Pebble Beach and he was full
Speaker 3: of sage advice and you can tell he's one of
Speaker 3: those guys that it's not that he needs to be
Speaker 3: the center of attention and speak all the time.
Speaker 1: He has a quiet confidence, but.
Speaker 3: When he does speak, it really resonates with you. And
Speaker 3: if anyone hasn't watched that episode, I would encourage them
Speaker 3: to do so because I think it was so interesting
Speaker 3: to talk to all three of the bachelor's when we
Speaker 3: git them and they're different takes on everything.
Speaker 2: It was. It was really it was.
Speaker 3: I think it was really helpful for us as when
Speaker 3: there are different john we talk.
Speaker 1: A lot in our friends group about sharing or recycling men.
Speaker 1: Were there any of the men that were in either
Speaker 1: you know in your season that you would kind of
Speaker 1: pivot to one of your friends or single friends.
Speaker 2: Yeah, kind of. So there was a thought for me
Speaker 2: that and not just I didn't just think about it
Speaker 2: was like a subject, you know, conversation subject with the
Speaker 2: Golden Bachelor women. So the women that came off of
Speaker 2: Gary season, so there were twenty one of us, they
Speaker 2: were all very interested in when I came home from
Speaker 2: Golden Bachelorette, and I really couldn't talk about like who
Speaker 2: had gone and who didn't until on the show you
Speaker 2: could see that they had been eliminated, and then I
Speaker 2: could kind of address relationships for each one of those
Speaker 2: people as they got eliminated. You became a match maker,
Speaker 2: and I became the matchmaker. I did, and I would
Speaker 2: be getting messages the next day, like after the show aired,
Speaker 2: So whoever got let go that night, people would be like,
Speaker 2: what do you think? Do you think that he would
Speaker 2: like me? Would would you think we're being a good match?
Speaker 2: And I definitely had some matches and I actually worked
Speaker 2: on several. Unfortunately none of them really worked out. The
Speaker 2: guys on my season rescued a little younger than the
Speaker 2: women on Gary season because I was younger. Gary was
Speaker 2: seventy and I was sixty interesting and so yeah, so
Speaker 2: the ages didn't match up. I had guys the age
Speaker 2: from fifty seven and the oldest one on my season
Speaker 2: was sixty nine and it was Pascal and he was
Speaker 2: by far the oldest. I think the next one to
Speaker 2: him was maybe closer to like sixty six of it,
Speaker 2: and the most of my guys.
Speaker 1: Are really good for his age though.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, he's very fit. He's a good looking guy.
Speaker 3: So it sounds like you dated a little bit before
Speaker 3: obviously the Golden Bachelorette, and you dated several men on
Speaker 3: the Golden Bachelorettes, so you definitely are are are a
Speaker 3: force and have probably a lot of advice to give
Speaker 3: what red like subtle red flags do you think that
Speaker 3: people ignore when looking at chapter two?
Speaker 1: Dating?
Speaker 2: So, I think people have like a tendency to date
Speaker 2: a certain type. So some people like the bad boys,
Speaker 2: some people you know, you kind of are attracted to something,
Speaker 2: and it's always pretty consistent, like who you're attracted to.
Speaker 2: I think that the smartest thing to do when you're
Speaker 2: dating is to try to get away from those because
Speaker 2: if you've been dating for a long time and it
Speaker 2: hasn't worked out, it's probably because you're not looking for
Speaker 2: the right kind of person.
Speaker 1: You sound like the j Sheetty podcast that was on
Speaker 1: today with Jillian Tareki, which was all about what you're
Speaker 1: basically saying right now, which is date differently than what
Speaker 1: you've done if it hasn't been working.
Speaker 2: I really strongly about that, because I too have a
Speaker 2: tendency to date like a certain kind of guy. I've
Speaker 2: been Actually, Chalk is very much like my late husband John.
Speaker 2: So I actually I think I'm a good picker, but
Speaker 2: I'm not sure. I've seen a lot of people who
Speaker 2: aren't good pickers, who particularly the people that like the
Speaker 2: bad boy and like I feel like, Okay, that's something
Speaker 2: great to do when you're in high school in college,
Speaker 2: but when you're looking for a relationship that's a bad guy,
Speaker 2: that's not the person you want where they like a playboy.
Speaker 2: So you know, past girl is a bit of a playboy.
Speaker 2: You know, I wasn't going to pick him because I
Speaker 2: knew that about him. He self eliminated. That was all good.
Speaker 2: All of that worked out the way it was supposed to.
Speaker 2: I feel like red flags are the way you're dating
Speaker 2: not and the way you pick because you have a
Speaker 2: tendency to pick the same kind of person I certainly do.
Speaker 2: I that both of you do, and that you should
Speaker 2: like widen your your net a little bit. You know,
Speaker 2: I heard a podcast recently about fixing your profile on
Speaker 2: a dating app and that you should widen the people
Speaker 2: that you're accepting messages from, so like make it a
Speaker 2: bigger age gap that that you say are okay, or
Speaker 2: don't specify religion or don't specify a number of miles
Speaker 2: that they need to be within, Like why did all
Speaker 2: of those parameters? So you get introduced to more people
Speaker 2: and you'll have a better likelihood of finding somebody better
Speaker 2: or sending a better match for you.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's insightful because I feel like when you think
Speaker 3: of red flags, you're always thinking about looking at other
Speaker 3: people and their red flags, right, But it's really what
Speaker 3: you're saying is it might be within us.
Speaker 1: You need to listen to that podcast Filma. That's what
Speaker 1: it was today. So, Joan, did you have speaking of
Speaker 1: red flags and me and bad Boys, did you have
Speaker 1: crazy wild butterflies the minute you met Schoks. I know
Speaker 1: a lot of people say that butterflies can be almost
Speaker 1: a warning signal, and I'm so I'm always trying to
Speaker 1: sit with myself on a date and say, you know, butterflies,
Speaker 1: no butterflies, good thing, bad saying what do you think?
Speaker 2: So I did have butterflies, which is really good. So
Speaker 2: when he stepped down the limbo, I thought, Okay, now
Speaker 2: that's a good looking guy. He's a great dresser. I
Speaker 2: think he's a good dresser too. He's a good dresser.
Speaker 2: He doesn't and he doesn't know. He thinks he's not
Speaker 2: a good dresser, but he is very really good. You
Speaker 2: have to look really good enclosed. He also looks good
Speaker 2: out of close, but he and because he's tall and
Speaker 2: he's pretty thin, so and he's in shape. He has
Speaker 2: really wide shoulders, broad shoulders which just kind of just
Speaker 2: make your body just look good anyway. So I close
Speaker 2: hangs so well like that, yeah, hangs in like it
Speaker 2: just like has a presence kind of about you. Like
Speaker 2: it's like like there's a man, you know. So I
Speaker 2: liked him when I go out of the limbo. When
Speaker 2: I really really liked him is kind of when I
Speaker 2: needed to feel a comfort and was at Disneyland, and
Speaker 2: that was you know, that was a a kind of
Speaker 2: a stressful as a first date. So I was stressed.
Speaker 2: I was, I was, I was really nervous. And I
Speaker 2: came in on this like little train thingy and they
Speaker 2: dropped me off from the plane on the train platform
Speaker 2: and he's standing there and I immediately felt again the
Speaker 2: word safe with him, and I thought he was really sexy.
Speaker 2: And he put his arm around me and he made
Speaker 2: me feel comfortable and I had butterflies, and I was like,
Speaker 2: this is really good. And that date was phenomenal. Probably
Speaker 2: the best date I've ever went.
Speaker 1: On was that before he left? Was that before he
Speaker 1: So were you sad when he left?
Speaker 2: Like?
Speaker 1: Did you think he was going to come back?
Speaker 2: I was devastated when he left, Okay, And.
Speaker 1: That's a sign too that you knew you liked him.
Speaker 2: That was the day I knew that he was the guy.
Speaker 3: Oh my, I was going to ask you that I
Speaker 3: was going to ask you because I feel like it
Speaker 3: was obvious. I mean it was written Oliver's face that
Speaker 3: he was just enamored with you. And I also think
Speaker 3: it was kind of ironic that the most pedestrian of dates,
Speaker 3: no offense to the bachelor, you know what I mean,
Speaker 3: that you had you had like that was the most
Speaker 3: pedestrian of all the dates, and that was your guy,
Speaker 3: you know, I mean, it wasn't like flying off in
Speaker 3: the hell copter or doing anything super sex Well.
Speaker 1: Also Joan had left her show too. You just didn't
Speaker 1: come back, and so that was the whole thing.
Speaker 2: I when I came to the mansion that day was
Speaker 2: literally you know, like you know, very soon after our date,
Speaker 2: and he was standing waiting outside for me, and I
Speaker 2: was like, that's exactly what they had me do when
Speaker 2: I had to tell Gary I was leaving. It was exactly.
Speaker 2: And there was that bench was sitting right there, which
Speaker 2: was the exact same bench I sat on and had
Speaker 2: to say goodbye to Gary. And I was like, oh,
Speaker 2: something is going something is not good here, but this
Speaker 2: is bizarre. I was going to the mansion to go
Speaker 2: on a date with with Jordan. I had a date
Speaker 2: that day. I was arriving at the at the mansion
Speaker 2: to go on a date and there was standing talk
Speaker 2: is standing there at the front door waiting for me,
Speaker 2: and he said, Hey, can I talk to you for
Speaker 2: a minute. I'm like, that's exactly what I said to Gary, Hey,
Speaker 2: I need to talk to you for a minute. And
Speaker 2: we sat down on the bench and he said, I
Speaker 2: had a very importunate thing happened last night. I knew
Speaker 2: his mom was really sick. So my mom passed and
Speaker 2: you know, I need some help figuring out what I
Speaker 2: should do. And I was like, you have to go there.
Speaker 2: And so he had a stepfather elderly, and I said,
Speaker 2: you need to go see your stepfather. And so he
Speaker 2: decided he was going to do that, and that's absolutely
Speaker 2: the right decision. But when he walked away, I remember
Speaker 2: and he said, I will be back. I'm coming back,
Speaker 2: and I thought, yeah, he thinks he's coming back. I
Speaker 2: thought I was coming back, and I know.
Speaker 3: I mean, he couldn't get back there fast enough though.
Speaker 3: I'm sure that he did tend to his family, but
Speaker 3: I felt like he must have taken somebody the concourse
Speaker 3: back like he. I felt like he was like he
Speaker 3: was back, and I was like, he was not.
Speaker 2: Going to let this opportunity go. I thank god because
Speaker 2: he left, and I, you know, I had to function
Speaker 2: that day. I had to go on the date, and
Speaker 2: you know, I didn't want to. I needed to be
Speaker 2: true to that guy, to Jordan. You know, he was
Speaker 2: excited he had a date, and I, you know, I
Speaker 2: did the best I could to have a great time,
Speaker 2: and I think we did a great your heart, but
Speaker 2: I was worried the whole time that I that chalk
Speaker 2: wasn't going to come back. And in my mind, when
Speaker 2: I finally got to like be off a date and
Speaker 2: like have some time to think, I my mind said,
Speaker 2: he doesn't know if he can come back, And how
Speaker 2: in the world I am I going to do this
Speaker 2: whole journey because right now, like he was like number
Speaker 2: one in my mind, I said, I will have this
Speaker 2: unanswered question forever.
Speaker 1: Would have changed the course of the entire show?
Speaker 2: Who would have changed the course of the entire show?
Speaker 2: And I am not positive I would have gotten to
Speaker 2: an ending of picking somebody. I think I might have,
Speaker 2: just he would be too big of a question market
Speaker 2: I had. I don't think I could have gotten all
Speaker 2: the way to the end and found somebody else. He
Speaker 2: was pretty clearly the guy that I like had kind
Speaker 2: of honed in on. But I was also really careful
Speaker 2: as we were filming because I thought that really early on.
Speaker 2: I thought that at the Disneyland date that this was
Speaker 2: pretty a really good date and that he I felt
Speaker 2: really good about him. But I know that people do
Speaker 2: that a lot on Bauchler, and they kind of hone
Speaker 2: in on a person and they get like four weeks
Speaker 2: in and discover that that person is not the person
Speaker 2: they thought that he was or she was, and that
Speaker 2: then they have to pivot and they don't have very
Speaker 2: much time then to establish another good relationship. So I
Speaker 2: was really careful that every person I dated, every every
Speaker 2: date or every interaction, I treated them like they were
Speaker 2: the person. Like I was really you know, making sure
Speaker 2: I got to do them really well and was giving them,
Speaker 2: you know, I gave everybody like an equal chance, even
Speaker 2: though in my mind I did feel like Chalk was
Speaker 2: the person.
Speaker 1: That's really good advice for the for the future bachelor's
Speaker 1: and bachelorettes to give everybody their day in.
Speaker 3: Court, and you did, and I felt like everybody felt
Speaker 3: that and was they They constantly I think told you
Speaker 3: how appreciative they were that they had your full attention.
Speaker 2: I feel like I really got to know some amazing men,
Speaker 2: and like that's part of the journey also, is that
Speaker 2: even though you don't pick everybody, at the end, you
Speaker 2: end up with these really like unique friendships that you've
Speaker 2: gone through this weird journey of dating, and like they
Speaker 2: are your all your old boyfriends, which is just kind
Speaker 2: of a funny thing to say, because we all don't
Speaker 2: really feel that way. I mean, you know, it's a
Speaker 2: it's a quick journey. It's only eight weeks. You never
Speaker 2: get bad and beaded in somebody unless they're like the
Speaker 2: person that you're picking. So everything is like you hold
Speaker 2: back a little bit so you don't dive like totally
Speaker 2: in and they hold back a little bit too.
Speaker 1: You have to.
Speaker 2: You have to protect your heart.
Speaker 3: It's like it was college again. It was like watching
Speaker 3: college again.
Speaker 1: It was fun.
Speaker 3: But it's been so amazing to talk to you.