1 00:00:05,200 --> 00:00:07,480 Speaker 1: Hey, this is Sandy and Samantha. Welcome to stuff. ILL 2 00:00:07,480 --> 00:00:19,480 Speaker 1: never told you a protection of iHeartRadio. And today I'm 3 00:00:19,520 --> 00:00:22,639 Speaker 1: gonna apologize in advance Samanta, because we were once again 4 00:00:22,680 --> 00:00:25,640 Speaker 1: tackling an Internet term that has a long history. We're 5 00:00:25,680 --> 00:00:28,960 Speaker 1: going to get into but if I make a fool 6 00:00:29,000 --> 00:00:36,920 Speaker 1: of myself, I'm sorry. So you can see our past 7 00:00:36,960 --> 00:00:40,159 Speaker 1: episode that we did on Daddy, which yes, this is 8 00:00:40,200 --> 00:00:43,080 Speaker 1: kind of funny that this episode is coming out on 9 00:00:43,520 --> 00:00:47,120 Speaker 1: the day after Father's Day because we're talking about mother today. 10 00:00:47,360 --> 00:00:51,239 Speaker 1: A past host have also done an episode on the 11 00:00:51,240 --> 00:00:56,360 Speaker 1: etymology of mother, like outside of the Internet slaying slash 12 00:00:56,440 --> 00:01:00,680 Speaker 1: queer context. It's interesting to me how the this idea 13 00:01:01,640 --> 00:01:06,440 Speaker 1: came about. I have a friend, Katie, friend of the show, 14 00:01:07,520 --> 00:01:13,640 Speaker 1: and she's currently making all of these bracelets for upcoming 15 00:01:13,880 --> 00:01:18,160 Speaker 1: Dragon con big NERD convention in Atlanta to hand out, 16 00:01:19,120 --> 00:01:21,840 Speaker 1: and she was asked. She just randomly asked me one day, 17 00:01:21,920 --> 00:01:25,119 Speaker 1: like I can't use mother, can I because it has 18 00:01:25,160 --> 00:01:31,840 Speaker 1: another context? And I was like, yeah, I'm not sure, 19 00:01:32,800 --> 00:01:36,720 Speaker 1: but yeah, I think that it has another meaning, which 20 00:01:36,760 --> 00:01:38,280 Speaker 1: I knew it I had another meaning, but I was like, 21 00:01:39,040 --> 00:01:41,399 Speaker 1: I'm not I'm not sure. How cool that would be 22 00:01:42,319 --> 00:01:44,959 Speaker 1: to use it. And then later she sent me an 23 00:01:45,040 --> 00:01:47,600 Speaker 1: article that was like, oh, as this whole queer history 24 00:01:48,280 --> 00:01:50,960 Speaker 1: and here we are, So I thought I would just 25 00:01:50,960 --> 00:01:52,160 Speaker 1: break it down really quickly. 26 00:01:52,400 --> 00:01:52,840 Speaker 2: I love it. 27 00:01:53,800 --> 00:01:57,160 Speaker 1: Yeah. So, while the term mother is really trendy on 28 00:01:57,200 --> 00:02:00,320 Speaker 1: the internet right now, it has a long his street 29 00:02:00,400 --> 00:02:04,600 Speaker 1: in the queer community, perhaps centuries long. According to author 30 00:02:04,640 --> 00:02:07,760 Speaker 1: and professor Paul Baker, it's likely that in seventeen twenties, 31 00:02:07,800 --> 00:02:11,080 Speaker 1: London gay men called the cishet woman who ran a 32 00:02:11,120 --> 00:02:13,800 Speaker 1: coffeehouse that acted as a bit of a safe haven 33 00:02:13,840 --> 00:02:17,560 Speaker 1: for them mother mother Clap specifically Clap was her name. 34 00:02:18,240 --> 00:02:21,800 Speaker 1: In one instance, she provided false testimony to get a 35 00:02:21,840 --> 00:02:26,960 Speaker 1: patron off of sodomy charges. She eventually served two years 36 00:02:26,960 --> 00:02:32,760 Speaker 1: in prison for providing this sanctuary. At some points throughout history, 37 00:02:32,919 --> 00:02:35,640 Speaker 1: it was also used to refer to older gay men 38 00:02:35,760 --> 00:02:37,959 Speaker 1: who had an air of wisdom about them, who had 39 00:02:38,040 --> 00:02:41,800 Speaker 1: quote seen it all and could support younger gay folk. 40 00:02:42,360 --> 00:02:44,919 Speaker 1: It was used this way in a nineteen seventy one 41 00:02:45,000 --> 00:02:48,720 Speaker 1: camp vampire horror movie where the mother like there was 42 00:02:48,760 --> 00:02:52,399 Speaker 1: a mother that was being teased throughout, and the mother 43 00:02:52,480 --> 00:02:55,360 Speaker 1: in question was revealed to be an older camp be 44 00:02:55,480 --> 00:02:59,959 Speaker 1: gay man. The term was especially popular in the baller 45 00:03:00,280 --> 00:03:03,079 Speaker 1: scene in nineteen sixties New York City by Black and 46 00:03:03,160 --> 00:03:07,480 Speaker 1: LATINX queer communities and drag culture. Essentially, in bal culture, 47 00:03:07,480 --> 00:03:09,760 Speaker 1: there was a mother of the house who would take 48 00:03:09,919 --> 00:03:14,880 Speaker 1: younger queer folks in sort of a mentorship mentee role, 49 00:03:14,960 --> 00:03:18,360 Speaker 1: but a little bit more than that. Beyonce referred to 50 00:03:18,400 --> 00:03:24,119 Speaker 1: this in the Queen's remix of Break My Soul from 51 00:03:24,360 --> 00:03:28,120 Speaker 1: the Gay Times quote. Doctor Jack Doyle, a departmental lecturer 52 00:03:28,120 --> 00:03:31,680 Speaker 1: in LGBTQ plus history at the University of Oxford, tells 53 00:03:31,720 --> 00:03:35,320 Speaker 1: Gay Times that quote the term mother is an exclusive 54 00:03:35,360 --> 00:03:38,480 Speaker 1: to Black American ballroom scenes, but the way it's used 55 00:03:38,480 --> 00:03:40,800 Speaker 1: in those spaces says a lot about how queer people 56 00:03:40,840 --> 00:03:44,560 Speaker 1: across cultures and times have built and named chosen families. 57 00:03:45,000 --> 00:03:48,120 Speaker 1: He points out that the drag mother is often not 58 00:03:48,440 --> 00:03:52,280 Speaker 1: just a mentor, but also literally a parent to estranged 59 00:03:52,440 --> 00:03:56,200 Speaker 1: queer kids. She is the nurturing head of a chosen 60 00:03:56,240 --> 00:04:00,880 Speaker 1: family unit who makes her queer children feel less marginalized 61 00:04:00,960 --> 00:04:05,119 Speaker 1: by providing housing, community, healthcare, and safety. So that does 62 00:04:05,160 --> 00:04:09,120 Speaker 1: seem to be the main defining quality of a mother 63 00:04:09,560 --> 00:04:12,640 Speaker 1: and why gender doesn't necessarily matter in its use because 64 00:04:12,680 --> 00:04:15,600 Speaker 1: it's more about like the nurturing nature. Again, you can 65 00:04:15,680 --> 00:04:18,279 Speaker 1: see our Daddy episode where we did talk about some 66 00:04:18,360 --> 00:04:21,600 Speaker 1: of this, but that's one of the differences. It seems. 67 00:04:22,560 --> 00:04:26,200 Speaker 1: The rise and current popular use of Mother is often 68 00:04:26,320 --> 00:04:29,560 Speaker 1: chased back to a Twitter exchange between Lord and Kim 69 00:04:29,640 --> 00:04:33,880 Speaker 1: Kardashian in twenty fourteen. Lord explained quote, I retweeted Kim's 70 00:04:33,880 --> 00:04:37,560 Speaker 1: amazing cover and wrote, mom, which among the youths with 71 00:04:37,640 --> 00:04:42,400 Speaker 1: a Z is a compliment. It basically jokingly means adopt me, 72 00:04:42,720 --> 00:04:44,479 Speaker 1: be my second mom. I think of you as a 73 00:04:44,480 --> 00:04:45,960 Speaker 1: mother figure. You are so epic. 74 00:04:47,240 --> 00:04:49,360 Speaker 2: Yeah, I was really excited to hear you pronounce that. 75 00:04:50,320 --> 00:04:52,400 Speaker 1: Oh no, I'm so embarrassed. 76 00:04:52,720 --> 00:04:53,880 Speaker 2: I love it. I love it. 77 00:04:56,120 --> 00:05:00,160 Speaker 1: In twenty three the online use of mother and the 78 00:05:00,240 --> 00:05:04,839 Speaker 1: LGBTQ plus community really exploded, most often applied to female 79 00:05:04,880 --> 00:05:08,680 Speaker 1: pop stars, often straight female pop stars, but not always. 80 00:05:09,760 --> 00:05:13,280 Speaker 1: There have been two SNL sketches I saw about that. 81 00:05:13,360 --> 00:05:16,719 Speaker 1: One was the one with Pedro Pascal where he was 82 00:05:16,800 --> 00:05:20,480 Speaker 1: Daddy and then Sarah Paulson was Mommy he is. And 83 00:05:20,520 --> 00:05:26,360 Speaker 1: then another was where Megan the doll from the movie 84 00:05:27,160 --> 00:05:32,920 Speaker 1: was Mother in a Queer club. Here's a quote okay 85 00:05:33,080 --> 00:05:38,000 Speaker 1: from Gay Times on queer Twitter in twenty twenty three. 86 00:05:38,200 --> 00:05:41,159 Speaker 1: Mother is mainly being applied to cishet women with a 87 00:05:41,160 --> 00:05:45,599 Speaker 1: certain pop cultural cachet and demonstrable queer appeal, and is 88 00:05:45,640 --> 00:05:48,040 Speaker 1: now also used as a verb, So mother is mothering 89 00:05:48,520 --> 00:05:52,960 Speaker 1: is frequent frequent way to use it. Quote when Gay 90 00:05:53,040 --> 00:05:56,600 Speaker 1: Times is entertainer editor Sam dam Shanas and I hope 91 00:05:56,600 --> 00:05:59,760 Speaker 1: I didn't meture that. Asked Sarah Michelle Geller about her 92 00:05:59,760 --> 00:06:03,160 Speaker 1: passionate LGBTQ plus fan base at a January launch event 93 00:06:03,200 --> 00:06:06,000 Speaker 1: for her new series, Wolfpack, She paused to ask him, 94 00:06:06,279 --> 00:06:10,039 Speaker 1: can someone please explain mother to me? Geller has since 95 00:06:10,160 --> 00:06:14,560 Speaker 1: fully embraced this term of inqueerment by updating her Instagram 96 00:06:14,640 --> 00:06:20,160 Speaker 1: bio to simply read mother. Later discussing her mother's status 97 00:06:20,200 --> 00:06:23,719 Speaker 1: in a subsequent interview, Geller said, humbly, it's a huge honor. 98 00:06:24,000 --> 00:06:26,360 Speaker 1: This is a community that has supported me and all 99 00:06:26,400 --> 00:06:29,039 Speaker 1: of the jobs I've done, whether they've been successful or not, 100 00:06:29,640 --> 00:06:34,640 Speaker 1: and so I'm incredibly grateful. People studying this topic think 101 00:06:34,760 --> 00:06:38,000 Speaker 1: that the modern use of this term stem from the 102 00:06:38,040 --> 00:06:41,880 Speaker 1: ballroom use, but was further popularized by the growth of 103 00:06:41,920 --> 00:06:46,080 Speaker 1: things like RuPaul's Drag Race. There's a whole song that 104 00:06:46,160 --> 00:06:50,400 Speaker 1: was produced from RuPaul's Drag Race about Mother. Doyle went 105 00:06:50,440 --> 00:06:53,240 Speaker 1: on to say, I think what we're seeing with Mother 106 00:06:53,320 --> 00:06:56,360 Speaker 1: blowing up Twitter is the latest in the age old 107 00:06:56,400 --> 00:07:01,520 Speaker 1: story of white gays borrowing and misusing queer aave African 108 00:07:01,560 --> 00:07:05,760 Speaker 1: American vernacular English, which eventually jumps to straight people. This 109 00:07:05,839 --> 00:07:08,919 Speaker 1: process has changed and accelerated over the past decade, with 110 00:07:09,000 --> 00:07:13,280 Speaker 1: black and LATINX American drag becoming commodified globally via drag race, 111 00:07:13,640 --> 00:07:16,560 Speaker 1: which is how we get say, white sis head English 112 00:07:16,680 --> 00:07:21,080 Speaker 1: women talking casually about serving realness or throwing shade. But 113 00:07:21,200 --> 00:07:24,480 Speaker 1: that is also quote a term of respect for powerful, 114 00:07:24,560 --> 00:07:28,679 Speaker 1: confident femininity, and this respect does sometimes extend to sis 115 00:07:28,680 --> 00:07:34,160 Speaker 1: had women who are also queer icons. Oh, I apologize again. 116 00:07:35,360 --> 00:07:38,800 Speaker 1: There has been other stuff written that I thought was 117 00:07:38,840 --> 00:07:41,120 Speaker 1: really interesting in terms of how being like using the 118 00:07:41,240 --> 00:07:45,440 Speaker 1: term mom outside of this context of like queer history 119 00:07:45,560 --> 00:07:51,440 Speaker 1: or what have you was bad. Like that was embarrassing. 120 00:07:51,480 --> 00:07:54,520 Speaker 1: You didn't want to be described as a mom or 121 00:07:54,520 --> 00:07:56,920 Speaker 1: as a mother. And they also had kind of a 122 00:07:56,960 --> 00:08:01,840 Speaker 1: whole part where they were describing like Beyonce hugging her 123 00:08:01,960 --> 00:08:05,200 Speaker 1: daughter on stage, and it was like, not only is 124 00:08:05,240 --> 00:08:09,040 Speaker 1: she mother in this context, but now she's mother, she 125 00:08:09,080 --> 00:08:11,800 Speaker 1: has an actual child and that's cool. So that is 126 00:08:11,840 --> 00:08:15,120 Speaker 1: sort of changing too. And when we compare that to 127 00:08:15,200 --> 00:08:19,920 Speaker 1: what we talked about in the Daddy episode where we 128 00:08:19,920 --> 00:08:24,240 Speaker 1: were talking about how you know, dads who seem to 129 00:08:24,280 --> 00:08:27,800 Speaker 1: give any kind of caring aura in public are given 130 00:08:27,800 --> 00:08:30,600 Speaker 1: a lot more of a pass or are scene as 131 00:08:30,680 --> 00:08:33,480 Speaker 1: like much sexier. But mom wasn't always the case because 132 00:08:33,480 --> 00:08:37,280 Speaker 1: that was just expected, But now it seems to be 133 00:08:37,320 --> 00:08:39,520 Speaker 1: shifting a little, at least for celebrities. 134 00:08:51,160 --> 00:08:54,280 Speaker 2: This is from a female gaze. I feel like this 135 00:08:54,400 --> 00:08:58,280 Speaker 2: is not you will not see a heterosexual sis man 136 00:08:58,400 --> 00:09:01,960 Speaker 2: say that's mother. It would be and honestly it would 137 00:09:01,960 --> 00:09:03,920 Speaker 2: be like what what did you just say? Because there's 138 00:09:03,960 --> 00:09:06,440 Speaker 2: that conversation. But yeah, it's also like a bigger conversation 139 00:09:06,520 --> 00:09:10,800 Speaker 2: about how TikTok and social media like that really is 140 00:09:10,880 --> 00:09:15,240 Speaker 2: pushing the appropriation. However, you want to see it of 141 00:09:15,440 --> 00:09:19,520 Speaker 2: aave so quickly too, because you will like it things 142 00:09:19,520 --> 00:09:22,360 Speaker 2: that I have like just heard and then I'm seeing 143 00:09:22,520 --> 00:09:24,560 Speaker 2: straight white women doing it and I'm like, I'm not 144 00:09:24,640 --> 00:09:26,559 Speaker 2: doing that. I'm straight Asian woman over here. And I'm like, 145 00:09:26,600 --> 00:09:28,720 Speaker 2: I would never like I could. That's not a thing 146 00:09:28,760 --> 00:09:30,200 Speaker 2: that comes out of my mouth, and I have to 147 00:09:30,240 --> 00:09:33,120 Speaker 2: really check. I'm like, all right, am I doing this 148 00:09:33,320 --> 00:09:37,760 Speaker 2: because it seems easy and fun to say, like, there's 149 00:09:37,800 --> 00:09:40,240 Speaker 2: not a conversation of course for me as well, being 150 00:09:40,280 --> 00:09:43,480 Speaker 2: the older generation as I am, I don't think it's 151 00:09:43,520 --> 00:09:45,680 Speaker 2: appropriate for me to look at someone's ay, that's mother, 152 00:09:45,800 --> 00:09:48,120 Speaker 2: because I'm like, technically if it was said about me, 153 00:09:48,320 --> 00:09:50,880 Speaker 2: it would make more sense, not because I'm great, but 154 00:09:50,960 --> 00:09:54,080 Speaker 2: because of the age range that I see it. So 155 00:09:54,120 --> 00:09:58,000 Speaker 2: that's the whole different level of conversation in itself that 156 00:09:58,120 --> 00:10:01,679 Speaker 2: I see. Julian Anderson is also a big example of 157 00:10:01,800 --> 00:10:05,840 Speaker 2: people saying mother. Part of that is because people really 158 00:10:05,880 --> 00:10:08,439 Speaker 2: think that she opened up so much queerness for a 159 00:10:08,480 --> 00:10:10,720 Speaker 2: lot of young women and being able to be like, oh, 160 00:10:10,880 --> 00:10:14,280 Speaker 2: just because of her her ability to like really show 161 00:10:14,679 --> 00:10:17,920 Speaker 2: both femininity and masculinity and characters and herself in general 162 00:10:18,000 --> 00:10:20,400 Speaker 2: and not being afraid of that, not being offended by 163 00:10:20,400 --> 00:10:24,640 Speaker 2: either of those titles and moving on and embracing her audience. 164 00:10:24,840 --> 00:10:27,240 Speaker 2: So people have also said that about her, So I see, like, 165 00:10:27,640 --> 00:10:30,439 Speaker 2: that's that, Yes, it's that compliment. But again, this kind 166 00:10:30,480 --> 00:10:36,199 Speaker 2: of goes into more of that female gaze level of conversation. 167 00:10:37,600 --> 00:10:40,560 Speaker 2: It does also feed into that conversation of like, yes, 168 00:10:40,600 --> 00:10:45,559 Speaker 2: it came from queer culture. It was made bigger from 169 00:10:45,600 --> 00:10:49,520 Speaker 2: what I could gather from black or marginalize gay culture, 170 00:10:49,640 --> 00:10:53,679 Speaker 2: so from the black brown community in that area specifically 171 00:10:53,880 --> 00:10:57,680 Speaker 2: like queer ballroom culture and again being like appropriated into 172 00:10:57,679 --> 00:10:59,400 Speaker 2: that because it was more of a safety as you 173 00:10:59,440 --> 00:11:02,480 Speaker 2: were talking about, for like that I knew about the 174 00:11:02,520 --> 00:11:06,439 Speaker 2: mother from queer ballroom culture, which is also like that's 175 00:11:06,480 --> 00:11:10,080 Speaker 2: kind of sacred. Yeah, So throwing that around like that 176 00:11:10,120 --> 00:11:14,800 Speaker 2: because it literally was about safety and trust and getting 177 00:11:14,800 --> 00:11:17,440 Speaker 2: that title was an honor from what I gather and 178 00:11:17,480 --> 00:11:19,760 Speaker 2: giving that title and finding someone that you saw like 179 00:11:19,800 --> 00:11:21,600 Speaker 2: that because that was a part of your chosen family. 180 00:11:22,280 --> 00:11:25,680 Speaker 2: So like it is, it's interesting to see like the 181 00:11:25,800 --> 00:11:29,560 Speaker 2: expansion in this conversation because it can be funny, and 182 00:11:29,600 --> 00:11:32,199 Speaker 2: you know, we have we've definitely seen a lot of 183 00:11:32,240 --> 00:11:38,520 Speaker 2: like skits wear, weirdly sis men pulling a character of 184 00:11:38,559 --> 00:11:43,200 Speaker 2: being homosexual and using terms like that to make it 185 00:11:43,480 --> 00:11:49,199 Speaker 2: a joke. So it's it's an interesting dichotomy words and 186 00:11:49,320 --> 00:11:50,320 Speaker 2: terminology like that. 187 00:11:51,080 --> 00:11:57,079 Speaker 1: Yeah, And I I think that you know, it's good 188 00:11:57,120 --> 00:12:00,240 Speaker 1: to keep that in mind. Like when you when you 189 00:12:00,320 --> 00:12:02,240 Speaker 1: see a term that gets really popular of a sudden, 190 00:12:02,240 --> 00:12:04,720 Speaker 1: you just start using it. Maybe look into it for it, 191 00:12:04,800 --> 00:12:05,520 Speaker 1: just start using. 192 00:12:05,360 --> 00:12:07,800 Speaker 2: It right because it does seem fun. Also, who would 193 00:12:07,840 --> 00:12:12,079 Speaker 2: Katie give this breastless to, like just getting into a 194 00:12:12,160 --> 00:12:14,080 Speaker 2: random person they call mother? 195 00:12:14,280 --> 00:12:18,000 Speaker 1: Be like, what well, because she gives out bracelets that 196 00:12:18,120 --> 00:12:20,000 Speaker 1: this is what happened. She was like, she gives out 197 00:12:20,080 --> 00:12:23,440 Speaker 1: bracelets that say like space Daddy to Darth Vader. And 198 00:12:23,520 --> 00:12:26,080 Speaker 1: she was like, I can't do that with mother And 199 00:12:26,120 --> 00:12:31,280 Speaker 1: I was like not really, no, Yeah, I was like, girl, 200 00:12:32,080 --> 00:12:34,679 Speaker 1: I don't think so. But I didn't know. 201 00:12:34,800 --> 00:12:36,680 Speaker 2: I didn't know, and I don't think people would find 202 00:12:36,679 --> 00:12:39,240 Speaker 2: that offensive. Like if you went and found someone who's 203 00:12:39,280 --> 00:12:41,199 Speaker 2: dressed up like ah Soka and you gave that to her, 204 00:12:41,559 --> 00:12:43,839 Speaker 2: I don't know they would feel like that's offense for 205 00:12:43,960 --> 00:12:46,880 Speaker 2: not pad May the character, like if you, I think 206 00:12:46,960 --> 00:12:49,560 Speaker 2: like a lot of people would agree if there was 207 00:12:49,600 --> 00:12:53,160 Speaker 2: such a thing, pad May would be Mother. Yeah, I mean, 208 00:12:53,240 --> 00:12:55,240 Speaker 2: someone tell me if I'm wrong. And I'm doing this 209 00:12:55,280 --> 00:12:57,920 Speaker 2: as a person who was neither in the credit culture 210 00:12:58,240 --> 00:13:04,800 Speaker 2: nor in the Star Wars luch Con culture. From what 211 00:13:04,920 --> 00:13:07,360 Speaker 2: I gather as an outsider, so I could see how 212 00:13:07,360 --> 00:13:10,280 Speaker 2: that could be like genuinely appreciated. But it does hold 213 00:13:10,320 --> 00:13:14,360 Speaker 2: into context of like the privilege around using that time 214 00:13:14,360 --> 00:13:15,400 Speaker 2: of terminology. 215 00:13:16,320 --> 00:13:19,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, and we had an interesting conversation about it because 216 00:13:19,280 --> 00:13:23,520 Speaker 1: I feel like Daddy, we've talked, we have so many 217 00:13:23,520 --> 00:13:27,280 Speaker 1: episodes about like the connotations of that, but it's less 218 00:13:27,320 --> 00:13:29,760 Speaker 1: like it could have multiple meanings that a lot of 219 00:13:29,760 --> 00:13:34,400 Speaker 1: people would think of, whereas Mother just feels like it 220 00:13:34,480 --> 00:13:37,000 Speaker 1: just feels like as a bigger weight right too. 221 00:13:37,120 --> 00:13:41,640 Speaker 2: Well, like there's just again when we say mother is 222 00:13:41,679 --> 00:13:45,280 Speaker 2: a lot more about safety and feeling you're feeling of safety. 223 00:13:45,280 --> 00:13:48,160 Speaker 2: When we say Daddy is about dominance in power. So 224 00:13:48,240 --> 00:13:50,439 Speaker 2: there's this whole level of like, yeah, who, what do 225 00:13:50,480 --> 00:13:51,240 Speaker 2: these words mean? 226 00:13:51,760 --> 00:13:56,760 Speaker 1: Yeah? Yeah, And I think looking at the differences between 227 00:13:56,800 --> 00:14:01,760 Speaker 1: it because you know, I when she asked me, I mused, 228 00:14:01,760 --> 00:14:04,520 Speaker 1: it was like, oh, I don't know, that's a good question. 229 00:14:04,559 --> 00:14:04,960 Speaker 1: I'm glad. 230 00:14:05,120 --> 00:14:07,240 Speaker 2: I love that she had the forethought of that. And again, 231 00:14:07,440 --> 00:14:09,800 Speaker 2: this is one of those things that you and I 232 00:14:09,840 --> 00:14:13,720 Speaker 2: are not necessarily the authority on. And for those listeners 233 00:14:13,800 --> 00:14:18,840 Speaker 2: who are part of the black, Brown Indigenous community QUICK community, 234 00:14:18,880 --> 00:14:20,360 Speaker 2: and you have a lot of thoughts on this, those 235 00:14:20,360 --> 00:14:23,320 Speaker 2: who are in like ballroom community, because I thought that's 236 00:14:23,320 --> 00:14:25,800 Speaker 2: actially still a thing which is beautiful. So like, if 237 00:14:25,840 --> 00:14:28,320 Speaker 2: y'all have opinions about this, again, this is kind of 238 00:14:28,320 --> 00:14:30,680 Speaker 2: one of those things like better safe than sorry. 239 00:14:30,960 --> 00:14:35,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, yes, and always look into it, do your research, 240 00:14:36,120 --> 00:14:39,680 Speaker 1: and it's okay to question it is. I'm glad. Yeah, 241 00:14:39,720 --> 00:14:43,200 Speaker 1: and I'm glad I looked into it. Yeah, thank you. 242 00:14:43,240 --> 00:14:45,280 Speaker 1: Clearly I'm very shy about using. 243 00:14:46,560 --> 00:14:48,680 Speaker 2: I loved it. Thank you, especially you're reading it out 244 00:14:49,080 --> 00:14:51,040 Speaker 2: and you just fill it out to saying what you're saying. 245 00:14:53,000 --> 00:14:53,680 Speaker 1: Oh dear. 246 00:14:55,920 --> 00:14:57,000 Speaker 2: Ze why it's amazing. 247 00:14:58,320 --> 00:15:00,480 Speaker 1: Well, listeners, please do write in. If you any thoughts 248 00:15:00,560 --> 00:15:03,520 Speaker 1: or information about this, you can contact us at Stephan 249 00:15:03,560 --> 00:15:06,200 Speaker 1: and mom Stuff at iHeartMedia dot com. You can find 250 00:15:06,280 --> 00:15:08,400 Speaker 1: us on Twitter at mom Stuff podcast, or on Instagram 251 00:15:08,440 --> 00:15:10,520 Speaker 1: and TikTok at stuff I've never told you. We have 252 00:15:10,520 --> 00:15:12,960 Speaker 1: a tea public store, We're on YouTube. We have a 253 00:15:13,000 --> 00:15:15,040 Speaker 1: book you can get wherever you get your books. Thanks 254 00:15:15,080 --> 00:15:17,960 Speaker 1: as always too, our super producer Christina, our executive producer 255 00:15:17,960 --> 00:15:20,680 Speaker 1: My and your contributor Joey. Thank you, and thanks to 256 00:15:20,720 --> 00:15:22,840 Speaker 1: you for listening. Steffan Never Told You Us. Direction by 257 00:15:22,840 --> 00:15:24,520 Speaker 1: Heart Radio for more podcasts, or my Heart Radio. You 258 00:15:24,560 --> 00:15:26,520 Speaker 1: can check out the art Radio app, Apple podcast wherever 259 00:15:26,560 --> 00:15:28,000 Speaker 1: you listen to your favorite shows.