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Speaker 2: All right, welcome to hoops tonight. You're at the Volume.

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Speaker 2: Happy Tuesday, everybody. Hope all of you guys are having

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Speaker 2: a great week. We got a very special guest today,

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Speaker 2: senior NBA writer at Sports Illustrated, one of our colleagues

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Speaker 2: here at the Volume as well, Mister Chris Mannix is

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Speaker 2: going to be joining the show to break down the

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Speaker 2: Boston Celtics and then talk a little bit about the

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Speaker 2: league at large in season turn may where he's at

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Speaker 2: with contenders and things along those lines. Chris, I appreciate

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Speaker 2: you making time to hop on the show. This is

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Speaker 2: where I want to start today. So obviously, when it

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Speaker 2: comes to the Celtics, it's so annoying to talk about

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Speaker 2: them because they're so good that, like it's difficult to

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Speaker 2: frame the conversation properly from the standpoint of like they've

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Speaker 2: been the second best team in the league this year

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Speaker 2: by win percentage, and they've played by far the hardest schedule,

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Speaker 2: So like they're clearly awesome, but then there are like

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Speaker 2: these kind of discouraging moments where it's like they go

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Speaker 2: and they fail a big test in Minnesota, or like

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Speaker 2: last week against Indiana where their offense kind of stalls

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Speaker 2: out down the stretch and like Tatum gets Haliburton on

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Speaker 2: a couple of switches and he just waits for the

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Speaker 2: clock to run out and takes a tough contested jumper,

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Speaker 2: or he's isolating Aaron Nee Smith on a cleared side

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Speaker 2: and he can't really quite get a great advantage and

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Speaker 2: their offense kind of stalls out. They had a one

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Speaker 2: twelve point five offensive rating and clutch time versus Indiana

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Speaker 2: couldn't get a stop on the other end and they lost.

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Speaker 2: So at this point, are you worried at all about

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Speaker 2: the Celtics and the same late game offense issues that

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Speaker 2: we've been hearing discussed over the last few years, And

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Speaker 2: was Indiana concern at all within the lockerown?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I wouldn't use the word worried yet about the Celtics.

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Speaker 1: I still think they are as good as it comes,

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Speaker 1: with the top six in the NBA, and there is

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Speaker 1: a lot to like about this team, right Like when

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Speaker 1: they're on they're great offensively, they're great defensively.

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Speaker 3: I think they're one of three teams in.

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Speaker 1: The NBA that are top ten and offensive, defensive, and

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Speaker 1: net rating. So I think there's just too much to

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Speaker 1: like to be concerned. There are some things that absolutely

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Speaker 1: need to be ironed out. You mentioned fourth quarter execution.

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Speaker 3: From my vantage point, I'd like to see.

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Speaker 1: Them run more offense through Jason Tatum in the fourth quarter.

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Speaker 1: They have been kind of spread the wealth in some

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Speaker 1: of those situations, and I think Tatum when it comes

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Speaker 1: playoff time, he's going to be the guy, like you're

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Speaker 1: gonna need him to take over games, and I'd like

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Speaker 1: to see them more in that direction late in games

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Speaker 1: where it's finding, you know, ways for him to isolate

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Speaker 1: mismatches things like that.

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Speaker 3: That's something I'd like to see the.

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Speaker 1: Coaching staff get more creative with. One of the problems

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Speaker 1: though they've had all seeds has been third quarters. Third

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Speaker 1: quarter has been a disaster for Boston. They're one of

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Speaker 1: the worst third quarter teams in the NBA. And Indiana

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Speaker 1: was a great example of that. They had a seven

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Speaker 1: point league going into the locker room at halftime of

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Speaker 1: that game. They were down like eight or nine or

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Speaker 1: whatever it was beginning the fourth quarter.

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Speaker 3: That's not an aberration. That's been a trend.

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Speaker 1: And you know when you see that, you think the

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Speaker 1: energy isn't right coming out of the locker room, which

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Speaker 1: has been a problem for this team in the past.

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Speaker 1: And you think coaching adjustments, because that's when the coaching

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Speaker 1: staff for both teams makes the adjustments that they're going

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Speaker 1: to make, you know, for the second half. So that

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Speaker 1: to me is a bigger area concern right now. The

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Speaker 1: fact that this team has been so bad in third

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Speaker 1: quarters during this season when you get to the playoffs,

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Speaker 1: that's something that you have to be, you know, straight with.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I remember checking at during that third quarter against

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Speaker 2: Indiana and I looked at I ended up looking at

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Speaker 2: the just the third quarter net rating and I think

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Speaker 2: they were like twenty ninth for the MBA or something

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Speaker 2: like that. It was. It was really bad. I think

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Speaker 2: I think the thing for me personally, that's kind of discouraging.

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Speaker 2: And I understand the reason why because I've seen this

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Speaker 2: with basketball teams a lot where like they're almost too

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Speaker 2: good to the point where it makes them sometimes a

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Speaker 2: little lazy on offense. And what I mean by that

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Speaker 2: is like, like these guys work really hard on a

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Speaker 2: lot of really tough shots, and so sometimes they find

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Speaker 2: themselves in a situation where they can make a shot

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Speaker 2: and they'll take it rather than being a little a

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Speaker 2: little bit more deliberate to get a great shot. So

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Speaker 2: to give you an example, like if I if I

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Speaker 2: told you that you had a team that I think

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Speaker 2: we I think you. Let me just ask you this

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Speaker 2: straight up. Do you think the Celtics have the best

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Speaker 2: combination of ball handling, shooting, and passing in the NBA?

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Speaker 2: I mean, like down the roster and just total number

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Speaker 2: of guys that are skilled off.

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Speaker 1: ENSI point yeah, because you at least the top six

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Speaker 1: that they're playing, and we can get into seven to eight,

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Speaker 1: which I think is a point of concern for this team.

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Speaker 3: At least top six.

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Speaker 1: You know, whether it's big or small, they're all good

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Speaker 1: ball handlers, playmakers, three point shooters.

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Speaker 3: So yeah, I would say the answer is yes.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And see that's what's kind of discouraging to me

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Speaker 2: that group should be better than seventh in offensive rating,

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Speaker 2: And there's a couple of specific things that stand out

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Speaker 2: to me. For one, they take a ton of pull

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Speaker 2: up jump shots. They take twenty one of them a game,

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Speaker 2: which is eighth in the NBA, yet they only get

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Speaker 2: zero point nine to three points per shot, which is

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Speaker 2: seventeenth in the NBA for that shot type. Jason Tatum

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Speaker 2: and Jaylen Brown alone take thirteen pull up jump shots

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Speaker 2: a game, and both of them are not nearly as

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Speaker 2: efficient on that shot for what you would like, like

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Speaker 2: this is not a Tyrese Haliburton pull up jump shot

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Speaker 2: or a Steph Curry pull up jump shot where you're

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Speaker 2: getting well over a point per possession. Then deeper down

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Speaker 2: the list of concern for me, that kind of willingness

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Speaker 2: for both of those guys to kind of settle at

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Speaker 2: the start of possessions has led them to be twenty

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Speaker 2: third in assists per one hundred possessions. And so my

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Speaker 2: thing is, like, I think the idealized version of this

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Speaker 2: team is one that is a little bit more predicated

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Speaker 2: on ball movement, rim pressure through slashing and making really

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Speaker 2: good rim decisions for wide open threes and layups at

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Speaker 2: the rims because at this point, Like, I think if

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Speaker 2: this team's gonna win the title, they have to be

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Speaker 2: better offensively than they have been to this point. Would

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Speaker 2: you agree?

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Speaker 3: Yeah?

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Speaker 1: To expand on that, I think at times they get

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Speaker 1: way too bog down in three point shooting. I mean,

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Speaker 1: the pull up jump shots are bad for sure, but

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Speaker 1: they are the definition of live by the three and

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Speaker 1: die by the three.

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Speaker 3: I mean this year they're.

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Speaker 1: Sixteen and one this season when they're shooting forty three

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Speaker 1: and a half percent, are better from three point range

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Speaker 1: on one four when they're shooting anything less than that.

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Speaker 3: So you know, the way that they leaned.

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Speaker 1: In to the three point shooting this year really going

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Speaker 1: full Missoula ball. Like you know, last year, they still

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Speaker 1: had an offense or a team that was built to

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Speaker 1: play a system that em Udoka was comfortable with. This

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Speaker 1: year because of what we saw at the end of

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Speaker 1: last year where Joe Mizula was just encouraging threes at

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Speaker 1: all times of the game, they've leaned all the way

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Speaker 1: into that with porzingis now getting a lot of minutes

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Speaker 1: at that center position. So you know, I think they

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Speaker 1: they do have some concerns about shot selection, whether it

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Speaker 1: is those pull up jump shots, or just their tendency

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Speaker 1: to get you know, way too committed to three point

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Speaker 1: shots to will themselves back into games.

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Speaker 2: And quick threes too, like, like they take a lot

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Speaker 2: of threes that are like good not great threes, if

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Speaker 2: that makes sense, And like, I think that reflects in

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Speaker 2: I think it reflects in their percentage too, because we

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Speaker 2: talked about this earlier and you and I agree, Like

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Speaker 2: I think I think Derek White's an excellent three point shooter,

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Speaker 2: Jason Tatum's an excellent three point shooter, Jalen Brown is

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Speaker 2: an excellent three point shooter. But they kind of ram

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Speaker 2: their own percentages down with that shot selection. As a team,

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Speaker 2: they're eighteenth in percentage, which really shouldn't be the case

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Speaker 2: for the level of talent that they have on that roster.

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Speaker 2: And like specifically at the end of games, and you

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Speaker 2: had mentioned this, and I one hundred percent agree with you,

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Speaker 2: the running the offense more through Tatum because they're thirteenth

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Speaker 2: in clutch offensive rating, And that was another thing that

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Speaker 2: popped up against Indiana, like we mentioned earlier, And one

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Speaker 2: of the things I noticed down the stretch that Indiana

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Speaker 2: game is they kept trying to get switches off to

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Speaker 2: get Tatum off of Nie Smith, but they were using

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Speaker 2: him as the screener, and so one of the things

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Speaker 2: that Nie Smith was able to do is just hug

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Speaker 2: up on Tatum, and they know Derek White's looking to

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Speaker 2: pass because Derek White wants to get the ball back

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Speaker 2: to Tatum, and so then all of a sudden it

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Speaker 2: would just end up with Nie Smith on Tatum again,

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Speaker 2: and then he'd be taking some tough, contested long jump shot.

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Speaker 2: One of the things I'd like to see him do

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Speaker 2: is put Tatum on the ball and have Derek White

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Speaker 2: set the screen, because then in that situation, if they

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Speaker 2: if they don't hedge or show or switch in any way,

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Speaker 2: shape or form, Tatum can get downhill and that's where

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Speaker 2: his passing ability can become an advantage. And then if

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Speaker 2: for whatever reason, they both show on him, now Derek

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Speaker 2: White could be wide open and it's just they're going

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Speaker 2: to overreact to Tatum and both ends of that action,

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Speaker 2: and so it doesn't make sense for him to not

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Speaker 2: have the ball. And then also, and I'm sure you'd

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Speaker 2: agree with this, but I think Porzingis being out there

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Speaker 2: would help a lot, because in those pick and pop situations,

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Speaker 2: they're just going to be in a drop coverage waiting

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Speaker 2: for Tatum at the rim, and Porzingis is going to

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Speaker 2: get wide open catches at the top of the key

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Speaker 2: where he can kind of get the defense into rotation better.

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Speaker 2: And it's worth mentioning Porzingis has played in just four

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Speaker 2: hundred and eighty three out of one and eighteen minutes

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Speaker 2: this year, and he's been one of their best on

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Speaker 2: off guys. Like, if you look at the on off numbers,

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Speaker 2: two of the guys that stand out pretty quickly are

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Speaker 2: Derek White and Chris Hoops Porzingis. And it makes sense

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Speaker 2: to me because Porzingis is such a great entry point

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Speaker 2: for them offensively, and then Derek White is like their

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Speaker 2: most gifted like all around offense of guard, you know,

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Speaker 2: with his ability to pass and to shoot the ball.

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Speaker 2: But like, I think you hit the nail on the head,

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Speaker 2: like they absolutely have to revamp some things with their

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Speaker 2: late game offense and lean on Tatum more, if for

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Speaker 2: no other reason than the reps that he needs, yeah

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Speaker 2: to be to be able to handle that down the line. Overall,

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Speaker 2: with Jason Tatum's development, like here, I guess he turns

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Speaker 2: twenty six in March, so we're getting into like I

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Speaker 2: think you could comfortably say he's in his prime, right, So, like,

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Speaker 2: where are you at overall with his development at this time?

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Speaker 1: I think it's been excellent that you know, look, you

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Speaker 1: see strides that Tatum is making every single year. You

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Speaker 1: look at this year, he's shooting something like seventy four

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Speaker 1: percent at shots at the rim. That's a great number

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Speaker 1: for Jason Tatum. His mid range game, I believe is

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Speaker 1: still right around fifty percent. That's a great number for

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Speaker 1: Jason Tatum. He's spokes as above sixty percent on drive

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Speaker 1: to the basket. That was a real point of emphasis

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Speaker 1: for Jason Tatum and the people around him this offseason.

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Speaker 1: He shot I think thirty eight percent on drives during

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Speaker 1: the two than twenty two playoffs or they made that

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Speaker 1: run to the finals. After that, they were locked in

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Speaker 1: on trying to improve that part of his game. The

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Speaker 1: fact he's above sixty percent, which is like Halliburton territory,

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Speaker 1: Lebron James territory, that speaks volumes about Jason Tatum's development

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Speaker 1: as a player. I mean the critique of Tatum that

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Speaker 1: I've seen recently, and you can go back to that

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Speaker 1: Indiana game when he did get the matchups that he wont,

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Speaker 1: specifically on Halliburn, they won. Him defended by Halliburn in

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Speaker 1: the first half, he was taken to the basket.

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Speaker 3: The second half he was pulling up for three.

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Speaker 1: You're doing Tyres Haliburt in a favor if you're taking

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Speaker 1: a half contested three point jumps shot in a situation

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Speaker 1: like that, I want to see him going to the basket,

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Speaker 1: getting to the free throw line, which has done a

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Speaker 1: nice job of at this year. You know that to

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Speaker 1: me is the strength of Jason Tatum's game right now.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, he has improved so much at the rim, it's ridiculous,

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Speaker 2: like it's night and day from where he was a

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Speaker 2: couple of years ago. The post up stuff has been

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Speaker 2: really interesting. There have been eighteen players this year that

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Speaker 2: have run at least seventy five post steps. His one

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Speaker 2: point one points per possession including passes ranks fourth out.

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Speaker 1: That was an Another better factis for him this offseason,

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Speaker 1: like they they saw their weaknesses, you know, him and

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Speaker 1: the guys around him, Drew Handlin, his longtime trainer, they

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Speaker 1: saw these weaknesses and and they were determined to fix them.

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Speaker 1: And the post ops was something that they wanted to

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Speaker 1: get better at and proving the mid range percentage with something.

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Speaker 3: They want to get better that. And you know those

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Speaker 3: drives to the basket.

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Speaker 1: I mean Jason Tatum, you know, the last couple of

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Speaker 1: years has grown into his man strength. They want him

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Speaker 1: using that to get to the rim, get to the

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Speaker 1: free throw line, and to score at a high percentage.

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Speaker 1: And he's doing that this season.

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Speaker 2: Well, it's it's he's gonna need that when they get

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Speaker 2: to the postseason. That that was That's been one of

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Speaker 2: the things specifically, especially as he's gotten so much stronger.

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Speaker 2: It's just gonna be something that's that he can lean

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Speaker 2: on and like like that. That's that's what's crazy. Like

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Speaker 2: when you're looking at those post up guys like it's

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Speaker 2: Jokic number one, Siakam who's been excellent this year in

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Speaker 2: the post, Anthony Davis, and then Tatum, Like it's kind

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Speaker 2: of weird to even see his name in those types

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Speaker 2: of lists. I would say, Oh, one other wild stat

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Speaker 2: about Tatum in the post, when he shoots out of

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Speaker 2: the post, he draws a foul twenty nine percent of

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Speaker 2: the time.

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Speaker 1: That is a look they think that he can uh

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Speaker 1: the one you know, Eventually, they believe that Tatum's ability

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Speaker 1: to be a creator out of that spot is going

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Speaker 1: to be valuable for them because double teams are going

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Speaker 1: to have to come if he's scoring at an.

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Speaker 3: Efficient rate out of that post.

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Speaker 1: And they believe he's got it in him to be

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Speaker 1: a solid playmaker in those types of situations which unlock

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Speaker 1: other things within that offense.

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Speaker 2: And that specifically was what he did at the end

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Speaker 2: of the Mining Heat series that kind of turned things

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Speaker 2: around for them. It was cleared side post ups and

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Speaker 2: ISOs where basically it simplifies his reads and his ability

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Speaker 2: to see the floor and kind of allows him to

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Speaker 2: use his strength and like, honestly the one because you

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Speaker 2: hit the rim finishing. His assists are down a little bit,

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Speaker 2: but I think that more has to do with Drew

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Speaker 2: Holliday come in and just more diversity of shot creation

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Speaker 2: in general with the team. Like he's just not hell

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Speaker 2: Leo centric, so he's not going to put up six

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Speaker 2: seven assist a game. I still think Tatum's a very

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Speaker 2: gifted passer, but like all of this good there, the

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Speaker 2: one thing is again the pull up jump shot, which

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Speaker 2: is crazy because to start the year he was red hot,

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Speaker 2: like he was making everything, but he's cooled way off.

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Speaker 2: He's at forty three percent in effective field goal percentage

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Speaker 2: on pull up jump shots. That's zero point eighty six

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Speaker 2: points per shot. He was forty two percent last year.

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Speaker 2: He's taken seven of them a game. He's in the

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Speaker 2: thirty sixth percentile for his volume around the league. So

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Speaker 2: for me, like again, it's really this simple. Tatum's good

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Speaker 2: is now good enough to do the job and to

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Speaker 2: get this team over the top. It's can he, as

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Speaker 2: a matter of discipline, kind of cut out some of

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Speaker 2: the bad, which is like, will he have the discipline

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Speaker 2: in a game five in Indiana to to has Haliburton

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Speaker 2: on a switch with a cleared side to rip through

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Speaker 2: to the baseline, turn his back and back him down

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Speaker 2: and make a powerful move towards the basket, or draw

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Speaker 2: a double team and make a playout of it, Like

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Speaker 2: will he have that level of discipline? Because we know

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Speaker 2: he can, it's just a question of whether or not

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Speaker 2: he will. But before we move on to the rest

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Speaker 2: to some big picture stuff, I wanted to kind of

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Speaker 2: get your pulse on the Drew and Christop's acquisition so far.

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Speaker 2: Let's start with Drew Holliday. How do you think his

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Speaker 2: fits spend so far with the Celtics through four?

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Speaker 3: Really good? Look.

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Speaker 1: His shooting numbers continue to concern me because it's something

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Speaker 1: of a continuation of a trend. Like his last year

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Speaker 1: in Milwaukee, the numbers were worse than the year before.

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Speaker 2: This year.

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Speaker 1: I don't know exactly what they are right now, but

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Speaker 1: you know, last time I checked, they were trending downward,

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Speaker 1: and that is obviously something you want to watch as

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Speaker 1: the season goes on. But if you're around that team,

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Speaker 1: you know, they just can't stop singing his praises, like

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Speaker 1: just what he brings defensively.

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Speaker 3: His versatility.

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Speaker 1: I mean, he's defending power forwards most nights, Like you

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Speaker 1: can put him. You know, it's kind of a cliche

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Speaker 1: to go you can guard it, you can put a

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Speaker 1: guy on one to five, but that's exactly what they're doing.

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Speaker 1: You're seeing him on you know, seven footers, you're seeing

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Speaker 1: him on point guards. So you know, that kind of

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Speaker 1: versatility defensively has been invaluable.

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Speaker 3: The same thing with Porzingis.

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Speaker 1: Like my concern with Porzingis was not his production, because

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Speaker 1: I did believe the way Boston moved the ball that

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Speaker 1: he would get opportunities. Maybe not the same volume of

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Speaker 1: opportunities he got last year in Washington, but he would

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Speaker 1: get opportunities and clean looks at the basket.

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Speaker 3: My concern has only been staying on the floor.

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Speaker 1: And look, he's got the calf injury that's lingering right now.

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Speaker 3: Hopefully you know, you can put that behind him.

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Speaker 1: But this is a guy it's only played what sixty

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Speaker 1: plus games three times in his NBA career. You know

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Speaker 1: that worries me. Until he proves he can stay out

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Speaker 1: there on the floor, that's going to be a concern

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Speaker 1: for me. So I think Porzingis and and Holiday have

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Speaker 1: been exactly what this team needed. What what they worries

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Speaker 1: me about this team when they get.

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Speaker 3: To the playoffs.

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Speaker 1: And I said this at the start of the season,

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Speaker 1: I feel like the Celtics were only six and a

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Speaker 1: half guys deep, and I use Peyton Pritcher's kind of

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Speaker 1: a half because I didn't know exactly what they were

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Speaker 1: going to be able to get from. I still think

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Speaker 1: that with the Celtics. Ritcherck has been wildly inconsistent. Uh,

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Speaker 1: Sam Houser shooting the lights out of the ball, But

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Speaker 1: you know what, Sam Houser shot the lights out of

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Speaker 1: the ball first half of last season.

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Speaker 2: Two.

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Speaker 1: I need to see it over a full season before

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Speaker 1: I believe he's gonna do it in the playoffs. The

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Speaker 1: rest of those guys, like you know, Joe Missoula, is

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Speaker 1: kind of mixing matches guys that are in that that rotation.

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Speaker 3: Nobody's really stuck as of yet.

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Speaker 1: Look, I understand you tighten your rotation in the playoffs,

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Speaker 1: but if you really have six guys that you trust,

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Speaker 1: that that's that worries me when you get into a

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Speaker 1: series against the team that's probably gonna be able to

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Speaker 1: play seven or eight.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, the the Houser thing's been interesting because, like I

401
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Speaker 2: actually think he's been pretty solid on defense too.

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Speaker 1: Like see that and I see no man like the

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Speaker 1: team still hunt him like they still every ty game

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Speaker 1: I see still hunted him down.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I get that the metrics say has been a little

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Speaker 1: bit better, But what I see teams like trying to

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Speaker 1: get him on switches all the time and and attacking

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Speaker 1: going through him. It just look, I just everything with

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Speaker 1: the Celtics. You have to view through the lens of

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Speaker 1: a deep playoff run. And can you play Sam Hauser

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Speaker 1: against Milwaukee in a second or third round series. I'm

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Speaker 1: not yet convinced of it. I mean, look, I was

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Speaker 1: on the Sam Hauser train last year. I mean I

415
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Speaker 1: was around this time of year calling Tony Bennett down

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Speaker 1: to Virginia, writing a glossy profile on Sam Hauser.

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Speaker 3: And then he kind of fell off a cliff.

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Speaker 1: The shot stopped falling, the defense wasn't there, and he

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Speaker 1: was unplayable for that team in the postseason.

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Speaker 3: Has that dramatically changed?

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Speaker 1: Is there a significant difference in the Sam Hauser of

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Speaker 1: this year than there was last year? Maybe there is,

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Speaker 1: but you know, after kind of being a little bit

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Speaker 1: burned on it, you know, after the start of last season,

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Speaker 1: I need to see more of it before I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: buy it.

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Speaker 2: I have this issue with Laker fans too, where it's

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Speaker 2: like there's a difference between like an exciting story, like oh,

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Speaker 2: Max Christy is showing some flashes of you know, and

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Speaker 2: it's like, can this dude play two shifts in the

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Speaker 2: Western Conference Finals? So like it's a totally different ballgame

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Speaker 2: when you get to that point. And I would agree

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Speaker 2: with Sam Hauser, like it's an exciting story. He's got

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Speaker 2: like he kind of fits that mold of like the

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Speaker 2: dunkin Robinson Michael Porter Junior, like elite week side shooter

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00:20:04,000 --> 00:20:06,560
Speaker 2: that's got good length that could theoretically help and help

437
00:20:06,600 --> 00:20:09,800
Speaker 2: defense situations and defensive rebounding, but it's like, do you

438
00:20:09,880 --> 00:20:13,120
Speaker 2: trust him in that spot? I don't know. I think

439
00:20:13,320 --> 00:20:17,480
Speaker 2: Drew's been interesting because it's it's kind of classic Drew,

440
00:20:17,560 --> 00:20:19,720
Speaker 2: where like when he sticks to what he's good at,

441
00:20:19,760 --> 00:20:22,439
Speaker 2: he's awesome. Like off ball, he's been excellent. He's been

442
00:20:22,440 --> 00:20:25,520
Speaker 2: converting spot up possessions at an extremely high rate, almost

443
00:20:25,520 --> 00:20:28,200
Speaker 2: one point three points per possession. Obviously you mentioned the

444
00:20:28,240 --> 00:20:30,760
Speaker 2: defensive stuff, not just power forwards but centers as well,

445
00:20:30,760 --> 00:20:33,840
Speaker 2: Like he's doing everything for them defensively. It's his on

446
00:20:34,040 --> 00:20:36,280
Speaker 2: ball stuff where like he can just go a little

447
00:20:36,359 --> 00:20:39,719
Speaker 2: rogue sometimes and he hasn't been super efficient in those situations.

448
00:20:39,800 --> 00:20:42,919
Speaker 2: I think Chrisops Sports thinkas has been like like about

449
00:20:42,920 --> 00:20:46,240
Speaker 2: as perfect a fit as you could possibly imagine. They

450
00:20:46,240 --> 00:20:48,800
Speaker 2: are almost six points better per one hundred possessions with

451
00:20:48,880 --> 00:20:51,200
Speaker 2: him on the floor versus off. He's been one of

452
00:20:51,200 --> 00:20:52,800
Speaker 2: the best role men in the league this year one

453
00:20:52,840 --> 00:20:55,080
Speaker 2: point three to one points per roleman possession. That's fifth

454
00:20:55,080 --> 00:20:57,480
Speaker 2: out of twenty three players to run at least fifty possessions.

455
00:20:57,880 --> 00:21:00,960
Speaker 2: These post up stats are wild one point six y

456
00:21:01,040 --> 00:21:04,919
Speaker 2: four points per post up including passes on pretty decent volume.

457
00:21:04,920 --> 00:21:08,200
Speaker 2: That's ninety eight percentile. And he really hasn't even shot

458
00:21:08,240 --> 00:21:10,320
Speaker 2: the ball that well yet. Last year with the Wizards,

459
00:21:10,640 --> 00:21:13,479
Speaker 2: a Porzingis jump shot was worth one point one points.

460
00:21:13,520 --> 00:21:15,520
Speaker 2: This year it's been worth zero point nine to eight,

461
00:21:15,640 --> 00:21:17,520
Speaker 2: So I think he could even go up a level

462
00:21:17,800 --> 00:21:21,120
Speaker 2: as a shooter. He's actually held up really well defensively,

463
00:21:21,520 --> 00:21:23,600
Speaker 2: not just in his drop coverages, but he's done really

464
00:21:23,640 --> 00:21:27,480
Speaker 2: good on switches. He's been an excellent switch defender this year.

465
00:21:27,680 --> 00:21:29,960
Speaker 2: I think the Kristaps Porzingis thing has been a home run.

466
00:21:30,000 --> 00:21:33,200
Speaker 2: To your point about the debt, like they're in that

467
00:21:33,280 --> 00:21:35,840
Speaker 2: weird spot now where it's like, if you could guarantee

468
00:21:35,880 --> 00:21:38,199
Speaker 2: me all of those top six guys will be like

469
00:21:38,760 --> 00:21:42,160
Speaker 2: ready to go, then I think they're fine, but there's

470
00:21:42,320 --> 00:21:44,560
Speaker 2: very little margin for error there, and I would imagine

471
00:21:44,560 --> 00:21:46,359
Speaker 2: the front office feels that way as well. So this

472
00:21:46,440 --> 00:21:48,800
Speaker 2: is the before we get to the big picture. My

473
00:21:48,880 --> 00:21:50,560
Speaker 2: last question I want to ask you is do you

474
00:21:50,640 --> 00:21:53,320
Speaker 2: think the Celtics will be active around the deadline at all?

475
00:21:53,480 --> 00:21:55,199
Speaker 2: Or do you think this is a buyout team, Like

476
00:21:55,359 --> 00:21:57,120
Speaker 2: what do you look, what do you think in terms

477
00:21:57,160 --> 00:21:59,080
Speaker 2: of in season changes to the roster.

478
00:21:59,200 --> 00:22:00,160
Speaker 3: I think he'll be act.

479
00:22:00,600 --> 00:22:03,600
Speaker 1: I believe they still have that Grant Williams trade exception

480
00:22:04,000 --> 00:22:07,200
Speaker 1: that they can use, some other you know, salary cap

481
00:22:07,400 --> 00:22:09,280
Speaker 1: vehicles that they can use.

482
00:22:09,320 --> 00:22:11,960
Speaker 3: They still have some draft capital that they can deal.

483
00:22:11,960 --> 00:22:14,399
Speaker 1: And one thing we've learned about Brad Stevens over the

484
00:22:14,440 --> 00:22:16,879
Speaker 1: last few years that he is a chips all in

485
00:22:17,720 --> 00:22:19,760
Speaker 1: kind of guy. With some of the moves he's made

486
00:22:19,960 --> 00:22:23,480
Speaker 1: the last two seasons, he has not been shy about

487
00:22:23,560 --> 00:22:25,520
Speaker 1: upgrading the roster, and it does sound you know, my

488
00:22:25,920 --> 00:22:29,400
Speaker 1: sense of what Celtics ownership has said to Brad Stevens

489
00:22:29,400 --> 00:22:32,280
Speaker 1: is that, like, if you can guarantee that the player

490
00:22:32,359 --> 00:22:34,800
Speaker 1: we're acquiring is going to help us win at a

491
00:22:34,880 --> 00:22:37,760
Speaker 1: higher level, we'll pay whatever you need. It's guys that

492
00:22:37,760 --> 00:22:40,840
Speaker 1: they acquire that wind up not turning out that way

493
00:22:41,200 --> 00:22:46,280
Speaker 1: that irritate the ownership in Boston, which is understandable of course.

494
00:22:46,480 --> 00:22:48,240
Speaker 3: So yeah, I think they'll be active.

495
00:22:48,240 --> 00:22:51,880
Speaker 1: You know, the buyout market, it always just the hype

496
00:22:51,920 --> 00:22:54,200
Speaker 1: has never worked matches the substance. Remember last year It's

497
00:22:54,200 --> 00:22:57,159
Speaker 1: like Terrence Ross is going to be this great signing.

498
00:22:57,200 --> 00:22:59,879
Speaker 1: Everybody wants Terrence Ross, Dallas wants, the Phoenix wants them.

499
00:23:00,080 --> 00:23:01,480
Speaker 3: Terrence Ross plays like, you.

500
00:23:01,440 --> 00:23:03,200
Speaker 1: Know, like ten minutes of the postseason, like it did

501
00:23:03,680 --> 00:23:05,800
Speaker 1: you never you never really get it. Plus this year,

502
00:23:05,840 --> 00:23:08,800
Speaker 1: with the buyout market, there's like thirteen teams in the

503
00:23:08,800 --> 00:23:10,200
Speaker 1: West that are going to try to make a play

504
00:23:10,200 --> 00:23:13,000
Speaker 1: and run, you know, probably ten or eleven in the East,

505
00:23:13,320 --> 00:23:17,200
Speaker 1: maybe twelve. You're not going to get a robust buyout

506
00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:19,960
Speaker 1: market when you have that many teams that could be

507
00:23:19,960 --> 00:23:22,520
Speaker 1: competing for a playoff or a play in spot. So

508
00:23:23,200 --> 00:23:25,360
Speaker 1: I think their focus is going to be more on

509
00:23:25,560 --> 00:23:28,160
Speaker 1: the trade market to try to get one more guy

510
00:23:28,560 --> 00:23:31,560
Speaker 1: that is playable in the postseason, not somebody that can

511
00:23:31,600 --> 00:23:33,240
Speaker 1: give them regular season minutes.

512
00:23:33,280 --> 00:23:34,120
Speaker 3: They've got those guys.

513
00:23:34,119 --> 00:23:36,600
Speaker 1: They can play you know, Deli Blanton, they can play

514
00:23:36,960 --> 00:23:39,240
Speaker 1: Oh Shape or Set. You can play Sam House, you

515
00:23:39,280 --> 00:23:41,320
Speaker 1: can play Peyton Pritchell. You can go into your bench

516
00:23:41,720 --> 00:23:44,399
Speaker 1: for Luke Cornette for regular season minutes. Another guy that

517
00:23:44,400 --> 00:23:46,280
Speaker 1: couldn't play in the playoffs last year, you can go

518
00:23:46,320 --> 00:23:48,840
Speaker 1: into your bench for that. But you need a guy

519
00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:52,600
Speaker 1: that you could trust for fifteen ish minutes per game

520
00:23:52,680 --> 00:23:54,920
Speaker 1: in the playoffs that I think is the one piece

521
00:23:54,920 --> 00:23:56,200
Speaker 1: the Celtics are missing right now.

522
00:23:57,840 --> 00:24:00,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, during the regular season. That's one of the huge

523
00:24:00,840 --> 00:24:04,240
Speaker 2: benefits of having those top six guys be so damn good,

524
00:24:04,840 --> 00:24:07,320
Speaker 2: is like you can take any two of them and

525
00:24:07,400 --> 00:24:10,640
Speaker 2: put three league average rotation into the bench guys with them,

526
00:24:10,640 --> 00:24:12,439
Speaker 2: and they're probably going to be a pretty good lineup.

527
00:24:12,440 --> 00:24:14,840
Speaker 2: Because those top two are two of the top fifty

528
00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:17,280
Speaker 2: or sixty players in the NBA. It's a great luxury

529
00:24:17,320 --> 00:24:19,480
Speaker 2: for this team. But to your point, you can't get

530
00:24:19,520 --> 00:24:22,119
Speaker 2: away with that lineup in Game five at the Eastern

531
00:24:22,119 --> 00:24:24,040
Speaker 2: Conference Finals, which is kind of the point that you're

532
00:24:24,040 --> 00:24:25,800
Speaker 2: trying to make. So let me ask you this, then,

533
00:24:25,920 --> 00:24:29,080
Speaker 2: if you had to pick a specific archetype of player

534
00:24:29,119 --> 00:24:30,600
Speaker 2: that they would be targeting, what would it be?

535
00:24:31,240 --> 00:24:36,240
Speaker 1: Oh man, you know I would say that, well, it's twofold, right.

536
00:24:36,400 --> 00:24:42,400
Speaker 1: I would want a scoring guard that can play multiple positions,

537
00:24:42,480 --> 00:24:45,560
Speaker 1: that can give you more than what Peyton Pritchard is

538
00:24:46,000 --> 00:24:48,560
Speaker 1: giving you right now, something like what Malcolm brog did

539
00:24:48,760 --> 00:24:52,480
Speaker 1: was for them last season and before I get injured

540
00:24:52,480 --> 00:24:54,680
Speaker 1: at the very end, Malcolm Brogden had a phenomenal year

541
00:24:55,000 --> 00:24:55,800
Speaker 1: in Boston, so.

542
00:24:56,400 --> 00:24:57,720
Speaker 3: They need something like that.

543
00:24:57,840 --> 00:25:01,840
Speaker 1: I'm also a little concerned learned about that front court depth,

544
00:25:01,920 --> 00:25:05,159
Speaker 1: because to get to the finals, you're probably going to

545
00:25:05,240 --> 00:25:09,399
Speaker 1: have to go through a Milwaukee, Philadelphia, maybe even in

546
00:25:09,400 --> 00:25:12,000
Speaker 1: New York, which has got great size and strength in

547
00:25:12,000 --> 00:25:14,040
Speaker 1: that front court, among some of the other teams that

548
00:25:14,080 --> 00:25:14,680
Speaker 1: are out there.

549
00:25:15,640 --> 00:25:16,440
Speaker 3: Al Horford in.

550
00:25:16,440 --> 00:25:18,359
Speaker 1: June, I think is going to be what thirty eight

551
00:25:18,560 --> 00:25:21,240
Speaker 1: is he like, he's he's getting up there in age

552
00:25:21,280 --> 00:25:24,720
Speaker 1: and porzingis you know, look, he's been excellent, but an

553
00:25:24,800 --> 00:25:26,840
Speaker 1: injury here followed trouble there, and all of a sudden,

554
00:25:26,840 --> 00:25:30,439
Speaker 1: you're dusting off Luke Cornett to play real minutes and and.

555
00:25:29,760 --> 00:25:31,320
Speaker 3: And that's that's a lot to ask.

556
00:25:31,440 --> 00:25:33,800
Speaker 1: To have Luke Cornette matching up with like bam Adebayo

557
00:25:34,160 --> 00:25:37,560
Speaker 1: in real minutes or against any one of the three

558
00:25:37,600 --> 00:25:41,199
Speaker 1: headed big man monster in Milwaukee with Giannis, Bobby Portis

559
00:25:41,200 --> 00:25:45,960
Speaker 1: and Brook Lopez. That to me is something that's concerned. Look,

560
00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:47,560
Speaker 1: the Celtics share that concern. I mean, it was just

561
00:25:47,640 --> 00:25:51,600
Speaker 1: a couple of years ago that the Celtics were, you know,

562
00:25:51,720 --> 00:25:54,080
Speaker 1: all in on Yaka Perle. You know, when Peerle was

563
00:25:54,080 --> 00:25:55,879
Speaker 1: with the Spurs like they were willing to go and

564
00:25:55,920 --> 00:25:58,119
Speaker 1: give up a first round pick when Pearle was in

565
00:25:58,119 --> 00:26:00,840
Speaker 1: the last year of his contract because they knew they

566
00:26:00,880 --> 00:26:03,240
Speaker 1: needed frontcore depth going into the playoffs.

567
00:26:03,240 --> 00:26:04,800
Speaker 3: And that was on a team that.

568
00:26:04,800 --> 00:26:07,600
Speaker 1: Still had Grant Williams and had more depth than younger depth,

569
00:26:07,600 --> 00:26:10,840
Speaker 1: and Rob Williams was still there. So, you know, one

570
00:26:10,880 --> 00:26:12,840
Speaker 1: of those two things I think should be the part.

571
00:26:12,880 --> 00:26:14,320
Speaker 1: They're good on the wing. You know, Tatum and Brown

572
00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:16,080
Speaker 1: gonna play thirty eight minutes a night and they can

573
00:26:16,080 --> 00:26:21,600
Speaker 1: find you can deal with any lack of depth on

574
00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:26,040
Speaker 1: the bench there, but upfront, muscle upfront, a scoring guard

575
00:26:26,040 --> 00:26:26,600
Speaker 1: in the backcourt.

576
00:26:26,680 --> 00:26:27,920
Speaker 3: Those are the two things I'd look at.

577
00:26:29,720 --> 00:26:32,159
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think I agree with you on both counts.

578
00:26:32,160 --> 00:26:34,159
Speaker 2: Like one of the beautiful things about Derek White and

579
00:26:34,240 --> 00:26:37,000
Speaker 2: Drew Holidays they both can functionally operate as wings as

580
00:26:37,040 --> 00:26:39,119
Speaker 2: well because of what they can do in terms of

581
00:26:39,119 --> 00:26:42,320
Speaker 2: their strength for Drew Holliday and length for Derek White.

582
00:26:42,359 --> 00:26:46,200
Speaker 2: I think, yeah, like a reliable version of that Pritchard archetype.

583
00:26:46,560 --> 00:26:48,399
Speaker 2: And then it's so hard to even tell what the

584
00:26:48,440 --> 00:26:51,120
Speaker 2: center market's gonna look like this year at the deadline,

585
00:26:51,160 --> 00:26:53,080
Speaker 2: just because you haven't heard too many names thrown out there,

586
00:26:53,080 --> 00:26:54,680
Speaker 2: a Yakapurnle. It could be one of the guys that's

587
00:26:54,760 --> 00:26:57,720
Speaker 2: available again, and we'll have to see zooming out a

588
00:26:57,760 --> 00:27:02,040
Speaker 2: little bit as we look at the big picture. Where

589
00:27:02,080 --> 00:27:05,120
Speaker 2: do you like? So I have like an inner circle

590
00:27:05,200 --> 00:27:10,720
Speaker 2: group of contenders seven teams for me, which basically Denver, Boston, Lakers, Bucks,

591
00:27:10,920 --> 00:27:14,199
Speaker 2: the Timberwolf Sons, and then I still kind of like

592
00:27:14,720 --> 00:27:17,080
Speaker 2: just dangling on by a thread. I have the Warriors

593
00:27:17,119 --> 00:27:18,880
Speaker 2: just because if they make the right trade you could

594
00:27:18,920 --> 00:27:20,800
Speaker 2: put you know, like if they got Siakam or something

595
00:27:20,800 --> 00:27:23,119
Speaker 2: like that, you'd be like, you have to take them seriously. So,

596
00:27:23,680 --> 00:27:26,679
Speaker 2: where what does your top tier of contenders look like

597
00:27:26,800 --> 00:27:28,080
Speaker 2: right now? And where do you have to sell?

598
00:27:28,080 --> 00:27:30,520
Speaker 1: Oh, they're in that top tier. I mean, if you're

599
00:27:30,560 --> 00:27:34,480
Speaker 1: going to make an elite tier, you'd probably put Denver

600
00:27:34,800 --> 00:27:39,160
Speaker 1: from the West in that group, and then Milwaukee and Boston. Look,

601
00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:42,560
Speaker 1: I'm a huge fan of what Philadelphia is doing, but

602
00:27:42,560 --> 00:27:44,240
Speaker 1: I'm gonna need to see more of that in the playoffs.

603
00:27:44,280 --> 00:27:47,040
Speaker 1: They're right there and like cut below in terms of

604
00:27:47,080 --> 00:27:50,639
Speaker 1: finals teams that i'd trust, But you know those you know,

605
00:27:50,680 --> 00:27:54,119
Speaker 1: Boston's right there, you know in that mix. You know,

606
00:27:54,200 --> 00:27:56,719
Speaker 1: Milwaukee's still very much a work in progress, but that's

607
00:27:56,720 --> 00:27:58,200
Speaker 1: the kind of team I think is going to get better,

608
00:27:58,600 --> 00:28:01,719
Speaker 1: you know, as Chris Middleton gets more time and more reps,

609
00:28:01,880 --> 00:28:05,720
Speaker 1: As you know, Damian Lillard gets more and more comfortable

610
00:28:05,920 --> 00:28:08,520
Speaker 1: in that offense, as he and Giannis get better and

611
00:28:08,640 --> 00:28:10,640
Speaker 1: more proficient on the pick and roll. So I would

612
00:28:10,640 --> 00:28:13,199
Speaker 1: still put Milwaukee in that tier out West. To me,

613
00:28:13,240 --> 00:28:15,639
Speaker 1: it's only Denver right now. I mean the Clippers the

614
00:28:15,680 --> 00:28:17,680
Speaker 1: last twelve games or nine and three, so I'm keeping

615
00:28:17,720 --> 00:28:18,400
Speaker 1: my eye on them.

616
00:28:19,000 --> 00:28:21,400
Speaker 3: You know, how they play. They've been top five in.

617
00:28:21,400 --> 00:28:24,280
Speaker 1: Defensive efficiency during these last twelve games. So while the

618
00:28:24,359 --> 00:28:27,520
Speaker 1: offense in LA is sorting itself out, the Clippers right

619
00:28:27,560 --> 00:28:31,240
Speaker 1: now are playing great defense, especially on the wings. So

620
00:28:31,280 --> 00:28:32,760
Speaker 1: they're a team I'm keep an eye on. But for

621
00:28:32,840 --> 00:28:36,119
Speaker 1: right now, it's kind of Denver and everybody else in

622
00:28:36,160 --> 00:28:37,000
Speaker 1: the Western Conference.

623
00:28:38,640 --> 00:28:43,160
Speaker 2: Let's see men on the Bucks for a second. I

624
00:28:43,280 --> 00:28:46,680
Speaker 2: thought that Pacers game was really concerning just from the

625
00:28:46,720 --> 00:28:51,160
Speaker 2: standpoint of like they didn't even make Caliburton feel uncomfortable.

626
00:28:52,120 --> 00:28:56,080
Speaker 2: And I tend to think that the point of attack

627
00:28:56,160 --> 00:28:58,320
Speaker 2: stuff that we talked about before the season with them,

628
00:28:58,560 --> 00:29:01,959
Speaker 2: we might have underslt that a little bit. And I

629
00:29:01,960 --> 00:29:06,160
Speaker 2: didn't even like particularly the way the Celtics Bucks matchup

630
00:29:06,200 --> 00:29:07,960
Speaker 2: looked like a few What was that about a month

631
00:29:08,000 --> 00:29:11,479
Speaker 2: ago where it just was so obvious that Boston can

632
00:29:11,560 --> 00:29:15,120
Speaker 2: make Dame work so much harder than Damon Maleik could

633
00:29:15,200 --> 00:29:19,160
Speaker 2: make the Boston guards work. And I'm I'm wondering because

634
00:29:19,200 --> 00:29:21,960
Speaker 2: like I've actually so I have I'm with you in

635
00:29:22,000 --> 00:29:24,320
Speaker 2: the sense that I have Denver and Boston in my

636
00:29:24,440 --> 00:29:26,800
Speaker 2: tier of like seven, I have Denver and Boston is

637
00:29:26,840 --> 00:29:29,760
Speaker 2: like the clear top two, and then like a small gap.

638
00:29:30,280 --> 00:29:32,640
Speaker 2: And then I actually after last week put the Lakers

639
00:29:32,640 --> 00:29:36,760
Speaker 2: above the Bucks just because I think that physically the

640
00:29:36,800 --> 00:29:40,480
Speaker 2: Bucks have some major issues on the perimeter that are

641
00:29:40,520 --> 00:29:42,239
Speaker 2: going to be a problem down the line. Are you

642
00:29:42,640 --> 00:29:43,000
Speaker 2: am I.

643
00:29:42,960 --> 00:29:45,640
Speaker 1: Overplaying that a little bit in your opinion, or because

644
00:29:46,080 --> 00:29:49,800
Speaker 1: I mean I like Malik Beasley. I don't know if

645
00:29:49,840 --> 00:29:53,480
Speaker 1: Malik Beasley is a starting two guard on a finals

646
00:29:53,520 --> 00:29:55,800
Speaker 1: team and I worry.

647
00:29:55,520 --> 00:29:56,800
Speaker 3: About how much they're playing him.

648
00:29:56,800 --> 00:29:59,920
Speaker 1: I worry about Middleton holding up, you know, over the

649
00:30:00,080 --> 00:30:02,200
Speaker 1: the course of a season, because he's really struggled with

650
00:30:02,240 --> 00:30:06,200
Speaker 1: that over the last couple of years. That Pacers loss

651
00:30:06,400 --> 00:30:09,080
Speaker 1: was concerning, no question about it, especially when you have

652
00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:11,800
Speaker 1: got you know, a player like Bobby port Is blowing

653
00:30:11,880 --> 00:30:13,440
Speaker 1: up a little bit in the locker room, you know

654
00:30:13,520 --> 00:30:16,880
Speaker 1: afterwards and pointing the finger in part at Adrian Griffin.

655
00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:18,560
Speaker 1: And Adrian Griffin to me is a wild card and

656
00:30:18,600 --> 00:30:21,719
Speaker 1: all this. I mean, we spent all last year talking

657
00:30:21,720 --> 00:30:24,080
Speaker 1: about Joe Miszula. You know, what kind of factor is

658
00:30:24,080 --> 00:30:26,680
Speaker 1: he going to be in the Celtics post's success. Well, well,

659
00:30:26,840 --> 00:30:29,240
Speaker 1: you know, twenty ish games in you have some of

660
00:30:29,280 --> 00:30:32,480
Speaker 1: the same questions about Adrian Griffin. And I love Griff

661
00:30:32,800 --> 00:30:34,520
Speaker 1: as an assistant coach. I love that he got the

662
00:30:34,560 --> 00:30:37,720
Speaker 1: opportunity to be the head coach. But you know how

663
00:30:37,760 --> 00:30:40,600
Speaker 1: the Sea, how the preseason started with Terry Stotts kind

664
00:30:40,600 --> 00:30:42,800
Speaker 1: of getting broomed out of there pretty early. That was

665
00:30:42,800 --> 00:30:44,840
Speaker 1: a concern for me because Terry Stotts was like the

666
00:30:44,880 --> 00:30:48,160
Speaker 1: offensive czar of that team. You've watched this, They've changed

667
00:30:48,200 --> 00:30:50,600
Speaker 1: their defenses up a few times, you know, you know,

668
00:30:50,640 --> 00:30:52,760
Speaker 1: on the fly, they went from you know, doing kind

669
00:30:52,800 --> 00:30:55,440
Speaker 1: of that trapping pressure defense to going back that Budenolzer

670
00:30:55,560 --> 00:30:58,840
Speaker 1: esque dropped coverage. So they're kind of you know, experimenting,

671
00:30:58,880 --> 00:31:00,880
Speaker 1: they're a work in progress right now.

672
00:31:00,920 --> 00:31:01,960
Speaker 3: So, yeah, there are.

673
00:31:01,880 --> 00:31:06,360
Speaker 1: Some some legitimate concerns about Milwaukee. I just maybe it's

674
00:31:06,440 --> 00:31:09,600
Speaker 1: blind faith that I'm putting in like Yiannis to figure

675
00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:12,560
Speaker 1: it out, Dame, who's still electric, to figure it out

676
00:31:12,920 --> 00:31:16,320
Speaker 1: that front court, to be enough of a deterrent at

677
00:31:16,320 --> 00:31:20,880
Speaker 1: the rim offensively to overcome the obvious defensive problems that

678
00:31:20,920 --> 00:31:22,760
Speaker 1: they have on the perimeter. Maybe I'm putting too much

679
00:31:22,760 --> 00:31:25,880
Speaker 1: blind faith in some of the marquee guys on the roster,

680
00:31:25,960 --> 00:31:28,200
Speaker 1: but I just believe when it comes to, you know,

681
00:31:28,240 --> 00:31:30,440
Speaker 1: April and May, this team's gonna be right.

682
00:31:32,560 --> 00:31:36,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's tough because the other thing is Dame's not

683
00:31:36,480 --> 00:31:39,280
Speaker 2: playing as well as he's capable of. He's like he's

684
00:31:39,800 --> 00:31:42,680
Speaker 2: he had another horrible shooting night last night. He's like

685
00:31:42,720 --> 00:31:46,320
Speaker 2: a healthy he's a healthy five percent in effective field

686
00:31:46,320 --> 00:31:48,440
Speaker 2: goal percentage, down from what he was last year. I

687
00:31:48,440 --> 00:31:49,920
Speaker 2: think there you saw a little bit at the end

688
00:31:49,920 --> 00:31:52,760
Speaker 2: of the Pacers game too, like some like who's who

689
00:31:52,840 --> 00:31:54,840
Speaker 2: should run the show here kind of thing going on

690
00:31:54,880 --> 00:31:56,280
Speaker 2: where they're all kind of looking at each other and

691
00:31:56,320 --> 00:31:58,160
Speaker 2: they don't know what to do. So I definitely think

692
00:31:58,200 --> 00:31:59,720
Speaker 2: some of that stuff's gonna get worked out. But I

693
00:31:59,760 --> 00:32:01,600
Speaker 2: feel the same way about the Bucks that I do

694
00:32:01,720 --> 00:32:04,760
Speaker 2: with the Lakers, which is like, like, yeah, Moleik Beasley

695
00:32:04,760 --> 00:32:06,560
Speaker 2: shooting the shit out of the ball this year, Like

696
00:32:06,840 --> 00:32:09,440
Speaker 2: whatever the Laker curse was, forget about that. Like he's

697
00:32:09,440 --> 00:32:11,840
Speaker 2: making shots, all this stuff is great, but it's like,

698
00:32:11,960 --> 00:32:14,960
Speaker 2: can he be the starting to on a championship team?

699
00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:16,800
Speaker 2: Same thing with the Lakers, it's like, oh, Cam Reddish

700
00:32:16,920 --> 00:32:20,240
Speaker 2: like career resuscitation, excellent point of attack defense, But it's

701
00:32:20,280 --> 00:32:22,760
Speaker 2: like like I just think of a Western Conference Finals

702
00:32:22,760 --> 00:32:25,600
Speaker 2: game and I just think of Michael Porter Junior completely

703
00:32:25,640 --> 00:32:28,440
Speaker 2: ignoring Cam Reddish in the corner and basically just wrecking

704
00:32:28,480 --> 00:32:30,520
Speaker 2: havoc as a six to ten athlete around the rim,

705
00:32:30,560 --> 00:32:32,800
Speaker 2: and like that being a problem. And so for both

706
00:32:32,840 --> 00:32:35,240
Speaker 2: of those teams, I view them as like, if they

707
00:32:35,240 --> 00:32:39,200
Speaker 2: make the right deal at the deadline and shore up

708
00:32:39,280 --> 00:32:42,920
Speaker 2: that specific position to a better version of that player,

709
00:32:43,200 --> 00:32:45,520
Speaker 2: I put them on the same tier with Boston and Denver.

710
00:32:45,840 --> 00:32:47,560
Speaker 2: But until that point, it's just too much of a

711
00:32:47,640 --> 00:32:51,440
Speaker 2: question mark, what did you are you? Are you buying

712
00:32:51,480 --> 00:32:53,920
Speaker 2: the Minnesota Timberwolves at all? They're the best team in

713
00:32:53,920 --> 00:32:55,560
Speaker 2: the league to this point, but they're about to play

714
00:32:55,680 --> 00:32:58,479
Speaker 2: just an absolutely brutal month of basketball, So who knows

715
00:32:58,520 --> 00:33:00,840
Speaker 2: what it'll look like when we get into a month

716
00:33:00,840 --> 00:33:04,840
Speaker 2: from now. But like, they've demonstrated a lot of high

717
00:33:04,960 --> 00:33:06,600
Speaker 2: end potential this year. Are you buying them or do

718
00:33:06,640 --> 00:33:07,400
Speaker 2: you think it's feth fools?

719
00:33:07,440 --> 00:33:10,360
Speaker 1: You're right about the schedule, what's it? Fifteen straight games

720
00:33:10,400 --> 00:33:14,400
Speaker 1: now against teams with a five hundred record or better

721
00:33:14,720 --> 00:33:15,720
Speaker 1: coming up on that.

722
00:33:15,680 --> 00:33:17,760
Speaker 2: Schedule, and most of them on the road too.

723
00:33:17,640 --> 00:33:19,640
Speaker 1: So we are going to learn a lot about Minnesota

724
00:33:19,680 --> 00:33:24,200
Speaker 1: over this next month. I want to buy Minnesota, like

725
00:33:24,280 --> 00:33:27,000
Speaker 1: I really do, because, like Mike Conley is one of

726
00:33:27,040 --> 00:33:29,800
Speaker 1: the most likable guys in the NBA, and I love

727
00:33:30,320 --> 00:33:33,240
Speaker 1: the surge he's having this year. Anthony Edwards is one

728
00:33:33,240 --> 00:33:36,200
Speaker 1: of those guys that talks the talk and walks the walk,

729
00:33:36,360 --> 00:33:38,360
Speaker 1: or at least he's doing it in the first half

730
00:33:38,360 --> 00:33:41,400
Speaker 1: of this season. I love their versatility that they have

731
00:33:41,640 --> 00:33:44,840
Speaker 1: defensively with Edwards and Jaden McDaniels and some of those guys.

732
00:33:44,880 --> 00:33:48,680
Speaker 1: And look, I love that Rudy Gobert and Karl Anthony

733
00:33:48,720 --> 00:33:51,760
Speaker 1: Towns have found a way to make it work. They've

734
00:33:51,800 --> 00:33:54,800
Speaker 1: had ten games this season where both of these guys

735
00:33:55,320 --> 00:33:57,840
Speaker 1: have had double doubles. That's more than any duo has

736
00:33:57,840 --> 00:34:01,160
Speaker 1: had in the same game during during this season.

737
00:34:01,200 --> 00:34:03,520
Speaker 3: So there's promising signs.

738
00:34:03,640 --> 00:34:08,480
Speaker 1: But you know, one thing a coach said to me before,

739
00:34:08,760 --> 00:34:10,600
Speaker 1: really right around the time that Gobert got traded, it

740
00:34:10,600 --> 00:34:13,080
Speaker 1: was reiterated to me before the start of this season,

741
00:34:13,120 --> 00:34:16,680
Speaker 1: is that at some point Chris Finch may be faced

742
00:34:16,680 --> 00:34:21,080
Speaker 1: with a decision where his best playoff lineup, his best

743
00:34:21,080 --> 00:34:25,920
Speaker 1: closing playoff lineup will probably be one where either Carl

744
00:34:25,960 --> 00:34:28,799
Speaker 1: Towns or Rudy Gobert is on the floor and not both.

745
00:34:29,200 --> 00:34:32,839
Speaker 1: And does Chris Finch have it in him to sit

746
00:34:33,040 --> 00:34:35,800
Speaker 1: like a thirty plus million dollar player on the bench

747
00:34:36,160 --> 00:34:39,799
Speaker 1: for the final six minutes of that game? And look,

748
00:34:39,840 --> 00:34:42,319
Speaker 1: I think Chris Finch has done an incredible job because

749
00:34:42,320 --> 00:34:44,400
Speaker 1: I was one of the people that were like wondering

750
00:34:44,400 --> 00:34:47,400
Speaker 1: would Tim Conley fire him at the end of last season?

751
00:34:47,520 --> 00:34:49,680
Speaker 1: Comes back this year. It has really been a big

752
00:34:49,719 --> 00:34:52,759
Speaker 1: part of their success. But I still need to see that.

753
00:34:52,840 --> 00:34:55,320
Speaker 1: I still need to see if these two guys Towns

754
00:34:55,360 --> 00:34:59,080
Speaker 1: and Gobert can play together in late game situations not

755
00:34:59,160 --> 00:35:02,560
Speaker 1: be exploited by smart teams that have to only have

756
00:35:02,600 --> 00:35:06,640
Speaker 1: to drill down on them for one series, So it's

757
00:35:06,680 --> 00:35:09,000
Speaker 1: kind of a punt on that question. But like I want,

758
00:35:09,239 --> 00:35:12,960
Speaker 1: I want to believe in Minnesota because I love the story,

759
00:35:13,080 --> 00:35:16,880
Speaker 1: I love the way they've revived, you know, this this

760
00:35:17,000 --> 00:35:20,759
Speaker 1: team and this franchise after just a terrible season last year.

761
00:35:20,800 --> 00:35:24,080
Speaker 1: But I still need to see more from the gobear

762
00:35:24,239 --> 00:35:26,640
Speaker 1: Towns front court before I make any conclusions.

763
00:35:28,160 --> 00:35:31,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's it's matchup specific because like they're to me,

764
00:35:31,160 --> 00:35:33,719
Speaker 2: they're very similar to the Lakers in the sense that,

765
00:35:33,800 --> 00:35:37,760
Speaker 2: like they have this incredible combination of like excellent rimp protector,

766
00:35:38,160 --> 00:35:40,400
Speaker 2: excellent point of attack defenders, which was weird because we

767
00:35:40,400 --> 00:35:42,720
Speaker 2: didn't expect that with the Lakers. This year, just camerd

768
00:35:42,719 --> 00:35:44,640
Speaker 2: has kind of appeared out of nowhere and kind of

769
00:35:44,640 --> 00:35:47,440
Speaker 2: shored up that. And then the lineup configuration piece going

770
00:35:47,480 --> 00:35:49,759
Speaker 2: away from two skill guards to one skill guard helped

771
00:35:49,760 --> 00:35:52,200
Speaker 2: a lot. But like there, it's a similar configuration there.

772
00:35:52,239 --> 00:35:54,279
Speaker 2: The difference is is there will be teams at the

773
00:35:54,280 --> 00:35:57,680
Speaker 2: top of the league that will view Mike Conley and

774
00:35:57,680 --> 00:36:00,560
Speaker 2: Carl Toowns's entry points and start to really find ways

775
00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:03,200
Speaker 2: to exploit that. And so I am curious in the

776
00:36:03,200 --> 00:36:05,160
Speaker 2: big picture, I kind of view them. I know this

777
00:36:05,200 --> 00:36:07,200
Speaker 2: sounds outrageous to say, because they've been a better regular

778
00:36:07,239 --> 00:36:09,040
Speaker 2: season team to this point, but I just view them

779
00:36:09,040 --> 00:36:11,200
Speaker 2: as a lesser version of the Lakers, which is like

780
00:36:11,520 --> 00:36:15,160
Speaker 2: will their half court offense be able to and from

781
00:36:15,200 --> 00:36:17,359
Speaker 2: a lineup construction standpoint, will they be able to put

782
00:36:17,360 --> 00:36:20,080
Speaker 2: together groups of five players that they trust on both

783
00:36:20,200 --> 00:36:22,160
Speaker 2: ends of the floor enough and will they be able

784
00:36:22,200 --> 00:36:24,560
Speaker 2: to execute in the half court? And it's just a

785
00:36:24,560 --> 00:36:26,759
Speaker 2: big question mark for me. I definitely have them in

786
00:36:26,800 --> 00:36:29,120
Speaker 2: my in like my inner circle of contenders. I just

787
00:36:29,120 --> 00:36:31,480
Speaker 2: have them further down there. Fifth twice for me, I

788
00:36:31,520 --> 00:36:33,320
Speaker 2: would say, one, go ahead.

789
00:36:33,040 --> 00:36:35,440
Speaker 1: The team we haven't talked about, and I'm gonna go

790
00:36:35,480 --> 00:36:38,040
Speaker 1: out to see him next week. Like where do we

791
00:36:38,040 --> 00:36:44,280
Speaker 1: slot Oklahoma City right now? Because like what they're just awesome,

792
00:36:44,360 --> 00:36:47,240
Speaker 1: Like they have been awesome for almost the entire season.

793
00:36:47,280 --> 00:36:50,520
Speaker 1: Jay Guilders Alexander is like an automatic thirty every single night.

794
00:36:51,000 --> 00:36:55,439
Speaker 1: Chet Holmgren, they needed him to be a strong number two,

795
00:36:55,680 --> 00:36:57,839
Speaker 1: and that's exactly what he's been. They've got a bunch

796
00:36:57,920 --> 00:37:01,600
Speaker 1: of guys out there that can defend multiple positions. They're

797
00:37:01,840 --> 00:37:03,640
Speaker 1: another one of those teams top ten I think in

798
00:37:03,719 --> 00:37:07,920
Speaker 1: offensive and defense efficiency net rating, Like, you try to

799
00:37:07,960 --> 00:37:11,800
Speaker 1: find flaws with this team and the only one that

800
00:37:12,480 --> 00:37:14,880
Speaker 1: you can come up with really is that they're really

801
00:37:14,920 --> 00:37:18,000
Speaker 1: young and maybe not ready for that type of moment.

802
00:37:18,080 --> 00:37:19,360
Speaker 3: I mean, Cason Wallace comes in.

803
00:37:19,400 --> 00:37:21,879
Speaker 1: Nobody thought Cason Walls could shoot this level he has,

804
00:37:21,920 --> 00:37:22,520
Speaker 1: and he's defending.

805
00:37:22,520 --> 00:37:24,439
Speaker 3: He's another guy that can defend with this group.

806
00:37:24,520 --> 00:37:25,960
Speaker 1: I mean, I don't know way to put them right now,

807
00:37:25,960 --> 00:37:28,320
Speaker 1: because they've got a top five record in the NBA,

808
00:37:28,600 --> 00:37:30,920
Speaker 1: they're playing great basketball. They only seem to lose to

809
00:37:30,960 --> 00:37:35,680
Speaker 1: teams that are like on their level or better. I'm

810
00:37:35,680 --> 00:37:38,040
Speaker 1: starting to wonder when we have to take Ogloma City seriously.

811
00:37:39,800 --> 00:37:42,120
Speaker 2: We do have to take them seriously. I view them

812
00:37:42,160 --> 00:37:46,839
Speaker 2: as like a serious upset threat, specifically for certain types

813
00:37:46,880 --> 00:37:49,160
Speaker 2: of matchups because, like the youth thing that you mentioned

814
00:37:49,200 --> 00:37:51,280
Speaker 2: is important, and that's obviously something you have to factor

815
00:37:51,320 --> 00:37:54,080
Speaker 2: in the postseason. Just everything about NBA history tells us

816
00:37:54,120 --> 00:37:57,040
Speaker 2: young teams don't win. That's just you know, even when

817
00:37:57,040 --> 00:37:59,000
Speaker 2: we look at some of the younger teams that have

818
00:37:59,120 --> 00:38:01,480
Speaker 2: had success, like this Thunder with Kevin Durant, there were

819
00:38:01,560 --> 00:38:04,200
Speaker 2: veterans on that roster, like Hendrick Perkins and Derek Fisher

820
00:38:04,200 --> 00:38:06,400
Speaker 2: as you know. So like it's a little different. This

821
00:38:06,480 --> 00:38:08,600
Speaker 2: is this roster does not have a veteran like they

822
00:38:08,680 --> 00:38:11,520
Speaker 2: literally don't you know, it's all young kids now. From

823
00:38:11,520 --> 00:38:14,640
Speaker 2: a basketball standpoint, the big thing is they're just really

824
00:38:14,640 --> 00:38:16,920
Speaker 2: small on the front line and they can't defensive rebound

825
00:38:17,080 --> 00:38:19,520
Speaker 2: and so to me, to me, it really comes down

826
00:38:19,520 --> 00:38:22,759
Speaker 2: to matchup specifics stuff. So like, for instance, they are

827
00:38:23,120 --> 00:38:25,680
Speaker 2: one of the best perimeter defense teams in the league.

828
00:38:26,280 --> 00:38:28,840
Speaker 2: So like if they ran into like a Golden State

829
00:38:29,719 --> 00:38:33,279
Speaker 2: or like a Phoenix where they're not going to be

830
00:38:33,400 --> 00:38:36,359
Speaker 2: as bothered on the front line by some of the

831
00:38:36,360 --> 00:38:40,360
Speaker 2: mismatches there, I could see them upsetting a team, but

832
00:38:40,480 --> 00:38:43,200
Speaker 2: I'd give them like almost no chance to beat Minnesota,

833
00:38:43,239 --> 00:38:46,759
Speaker 2: Denver or the Lakers because of just the front you

834
00:38:46,800 --> 00:38:47,279
Speaker 2: know what I mean.

835
00:38:47,320 --> 00:38:49,439
Speaker 3: And do they do something about that this year?

836
00:38:49,480 --> 00:38:52,040
Speaker 1: Like that's the question I'm going to try to drill

837
00:38:52,120 --> 00:38:53,960
Speaker 1: down on in the next couple of Like they've got

838
00:38:54,000 --> 00:38:55,759
Speaker 1: all these assets, they can't use, all these draft picks,

839
00:38:55,760 --> 00:38:57,960
Speaker 1: but they know that they they probably can't pay all

840
00:38:57,960 --> 00:39:01,120
Speaker 1: these guys because you knowually the cost is going to

841
00:39:01,120 --> 00:39:04,120
Speaker 1: become prohibitive, Like yeah, I remember, you know Sam Presti,

842
00:39:04,160 --> 00:39:07,040
Speaker 1: who's you know, preseason press conferences I just record for

843
00:39:07,200 --> 00:39:09,479
Speaker 1: hilarious sake because they're like an hour and a half long,

844
00:39:09,520 --> 00:39:12,080
Speaker 1: and he uses all these metaphors that take, you know,

845
00:39:12,440 --> 00:39:17,319
Speaker 1: a long time to kind of interpret. But it's like

846
00:39:17,400 --> 00:39:18,920
Speaker 1: you've got all these pieces like do you go out

847
00:39:18,960 --> 00:39:19,920
Speaker 1: and get somebody like you?

848
00:39:20,080 --> 00:39:22,080
Speaker 3: Do you again? I don't know who that is at

849
00:39:22,120 --> 00:39:22,439
Speaker 3: this point.

850
00:39:22,480 --> 00:39:23,960
Speaker 1: The guys that are available that we know of right

851
00:39:24,000 --> 00:39:26,640
Speaker 1: now are more like wing defenders and that's not really

852
00:39:26,680 --> 00:39:29,080
Speaker 1: what Oklahoma City needs to your point at the moment.

853
00:39:29,120 --> 00:39:32,160
Speaker 3: But like, is this a team that that makes a

854
00:39:32,200 --> 00:39:32,720
Speaker 3: big play?

855
00:39:32,800 --> 00:39:34,919
Speaker 1: I mean because even though like they're young, as I mentioned,

856
00:39:34,960 --> 00:39:37,880
Speaker 1: you know, bottom four in terms of UH age, but

857
00:39:38,520 --> 00:39:41,879
Speaker 1: Shay's not young, like lou Dort's not young. Like they're young,

858
00:39:42,320 --> 00:39:44,640
Speaker 1: you know chronologically we've been around for a while and

859
00:39:44,680 --> 00:39:47,719
Speaker 1: they look ready to do something there Like I don't know,

860
00:39:47,800 --> 00:39:50,080
Speaker 1: I mean that that's a team that, you know, if

861
00:39:50,080 --> 00:39:52,520
Speaker 1: it wanted to get aggressive, you know, it might get

862
00:39:52,520 --> 00:39:54,879
Speaker 1: to the trade deadline and realize is a good time

863
00:39:54,920 --> 00:39:55,359
Speaker 1: to do that?

864
00:39:57,160 --> 00:40:00,360
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, because Josh Giddy, beyond the scandal, he just

865
00:40:00,400 --> 00:40:04,840
Speaker 2: hasn't been playing very well. Specifically, his on ball stuff

866
00:40:04,880 --> 00:40:07,880
Speaker 2: hasn't been very good, and there's teams are really starting

867
00:40:07,880 --> 00:40:10,120
Speaker 2: to ignore him off the ball as well, given in

868
00:40:10,160 --> 00:40:12,960
Speaker 2: the whole Jared Vanderbilt treatment, you know, And so I think,

869
00:40:13,000 --> 00:40:15,520
Speaker 2: I think, like, when I look at the idealized version

870
00:40:15,560 --> 00:40:19,000
Speaker 2: of the team, it's Dort and Jalen Williams slotted up

871
00:40:19,040 --> 00:40:21,880
Speaker 2: to the two three rather than the three four, And

872
00:40:21,920 --> 00:40:24,040
Speaker 2: so I almost look at it as at it as

873
00:40:24,120 --> 00:40:29,720
Speaker 2: like Shay Dort, Jalen a big forward to be named

874
00:40:29,800 --> 00:40:33,239
Speaker 2: later and then Chet and to me like the team

875
00:40:33,239 --> 00:40:35,399
Speaker 2: that i'd call. And it's gonna be really hard because

876
00:40:35,440 --> 00:40:37,600
Speaker 2: Danny Ainge is gonna be like, I'll take all of

877
00:40:37,640 --> 00:40:40,520
Speaker 2: the picks. But like, but like I'd be going after

878
00:40:40,560 --> 00:40:43,160
Speaker 2: Laurie marking in because if you could get him, if

879
00:40:43,200 --> 00:40:45,719
Speaker 2: you could get him, if you make a godfather offer there,

880
00:40:46,239 --> 00:40:49,000
Speaker 2: and like and you're basically like, I get to put

881
00:40:49,040 --> 00:40:52,960
Speaker 2: Shae with Laurie, with Chet with Jalen Williams and and

882
00:40:53,080 --> 00:40:55,600
Speaker 2: Lou Dort. Now we're talking about a top tier contenderness.

883
00:40:56,880 --> 00:40:57,400
Speaker 2: I'm with you.

884
00:40:57,480 --> 00:41:02,840
Speaker 1: I think, Oh, I kind of I kind of like

885
00:41:03,520 --> 00:41:05,520
Speaker 1: he's experienced.

886
00:41:04,960 --> 00:41:06,640
Speaker 3: At this point than lowery probably is.

887
00:41:08,360 --> 00:41:11,120
Speaker 2: And he yeah, exactly like you could probably get him

888
00:41:11,440 --> 00:41:14,759
Speaker 2: for Wow, that's actually that's I.

889
00:41:14,719 --> 00:41:16,160
Speaker 3: Think he's the guy that I liked that.

890
00:41:16,600 --> 00:41:19,080
Speaker 1: I think he'd be first to go in Utah once

891
00:41:19,120 --> 00:41:20,960
Speaker 1: they start kind of picking this thing apart. I mean,

892
00:41:21,000 --> 00:41:24,160
Speaker 1: there'll be an appetite for him because he's, you know,

893
00:41:24,239 --> 00:41:26,520
Speaker 1: a six ' ten, six eleven forward center that could

894
00:41:26,520 --> 00:41:30,240
Speaker 1: shoot the ball and has that experience. But again, Oklahoma

895
00:41:30,239 --> 00:41:34,520
Speaker 1: City can outbid pretty much everyone for anything. Uh, that

896
00:41:34,520 --> 00:41:35,880
Speaker 1: that'd be a guy keep an eye.

897
00:41:35,680 --> 00:41:40,239
Speaker 2: On, Yeah, and specifically slotting him next to a Rimp

898
00:41:40,280 --> 00:41:43,279
Speaker 2: protector like Walker Kessler, like a Chet Holmgred. I mean,

899
00:41:43,320 --> 00:41:45,400
Speaker 2: that's another guy'd even be looking at for Indy to

900
00:41:45,400 --> 00:41:47,919
Speaker 2: put next to Miles Turner. That's super interesting. I'm gonna

901
00:41:47,960 --> 00:41:50,440
Speaker 2: keep it, Kelly Olinik. That's that's that's interesting. All right.

902
00:41:50,480 --> 00:41:52,120
Speaker 2: Before we get you out of here today really quickly,

903
00:41:52,440 --> 00:41:54,760
Speaker 2: what were your thoughts in major takeaways from n season

904
00:41:54,760 --> 00:41:57,880
Speaker 2: tournament just like the whole the whole like experience, and

905
00:41:57,880 --> 00:42:00,359
Speaker 2: then did you learn anything from the basketball in gen role.

906
00:42:00,640 --> 00:42:01,279
Speaker 3: I loved it.

907
00:42:01,840 --> 00:42:05,680
Speaker 1: If for no other reason, then I cared more about

908
00:42:05,840 --> 00:42:10,200
Speaker 1: specific November December basketball games this year than I did

909
00:42:10,280 --> 00:42:12,480
Speaker 1: last year. Now, I know it's a lot more complicated

910
00:42:12,480 --> 00:42:16,560
Speaker 1: than that. You know, the in season tournament acolytes will say,

911
00:42:16,600 --> 00:42:20,880
Speaker 1: the ratings are up, the attendance is up, everything, every

912
00:42:20,920 --> 00:42:21,800
Speaker 1: metric you could.

913
00:42:21,680 --> 00:42:22,719
Speaker 3: Want is up.

914
00:42:22,760 --> 00:42:24,640
Speaker 1: But I'm kind of I kind of lean towards that

915
00:42:24,840 --> 00:42:28,000
Speaker 1: side of it. All the skeptics will say, yeah, it's up,

916
00:42:28,000 --> 00:42:28,479
Speaker 1: but how much.

917
00:42:28,440 --> 00:42:29,960
Speaker 3: The nb have to pay for it? Right?

918
00:42:30,120 --> 00:42:32,120
Speaker 1: Like, you know, with all that the league put into

919
00:42:32,200 --> 00:42:36,120
Speaker 1: it in terms of actual cash marketing, I mean, Michael

920
00:42:36,120 --> 00:42:37,520
Speaker 1: imperially commercials, like.

921
00:42:37,520 --> 00:42:39,799
Speaker 2: Can you imagine how much those floors were incredible? Those

922
00:42:39,840 --> 00:42:41,440
Speaker 2: floors regeously.

923
00:42:42,640 --> 00:42:44,760
Speaker 3: It's it's a lot, it's a lot of money.

924
00:42:44,960 --> 00:42:48,000
Speaker 1: So the NBA has invested a lot of cash into it,

925
00:42:48,000 --> 00:42:50,040
Speaker 1: and I understand why, like they're going to go to

926
00:42:50,920 --> 00:42:55,160
Speaker 1: someone this offseason and say we're going to sell the

927
00:42:55,200 --> 00:42:58,719
Speaker 1: is t a la carte and you, and it's another

928
00:42:58,760 --> 00:43:02,680
Speaker 1: way to create revenue for But I would say it

929
00:43:02,719 --> 00:43:06,359
Speaker 1: has been a success because, yes, the ratings were up.

930
00:43:06,719 --> 00:43:08,600
Speaker 1: Somebody from the NBA sent me a stat where it's like,

931
00:43:08,719 --> 00:43:13,000
Speaker 1: during in season tournament games, the quote unquote star players

932
00:43:13,040 --> 00:43:15,480
Speaker 1: played in ninety percent of them or something like that,

933
00:43:15,520 --> 00:43:17,759
Speaker 1: So they got got they got what they wanted, They

934
00:43:17,840 --> 00:43:22,520
Speaker 1: got star players playing in what would have otherwise been

935
00:43:22,719 --> 00:43:28,000
Speaker 1: inconsequential NBA regular season game. So I think to that

936
00:43:28,239 --> 00:43:31,279
Speaker 1: end it's a success. You would it be the same

937
00:43:31,360 --> 00:43:34,880
Speaker 1: next year without all the marketing that's behind it, without

938
00:43:34,920 --> 00:43:37,360
Speaker 1: all the promotion that's behind it, without all the commercializing

939
00:43:37,719 --> 00:43:40,240
Speaker 1: that's behind it. I don't know the answer to that question,

940
00:43:40,320 --> 00:43:43,000
Speaker 1: but I don't know how you can sit there and

941
00:43:43,080 --> 00:43:45,919
Speaker 1: say anyone can sit there and say it's been any

942
00:43:46,000 --> 00:43:49,759
Speaker 1: kind of flop or a failure. Maybe it's a bit

943
00:43:49,760 --> 00:43:51,840
Speaker 1: of a lost leader for the NBA because of my

944
00:43:51,960 --> 00:43:54,880
Speaker 1: much of money they had to spend. But overall it

945
00:43:55,400 --> 00:43:59,560
Speaker 1: generated interest in early season regular season games, which when

946
00:43:59,600 --> 00:44:02,600
Speaker 1: I talked to Adam Silver, when I talked to Evan Wash,

947
00:44:02,680 --> 00:44:05,799
Speaker 1: when I talk to people inside the NBA about the

948
00:44:05,880 --> 00:44:09,120
Speaker 1: ultimate goal of the n season tournament that is often

949
00:44:09,600 --> 00:44:11,400
Speaker 1: at the top of the list, off it accomplished that.

950
00:44:12,000 --> 00:44:14,080
Speaker 1: I think it accomplished what it set out to overall.

951
00:44:15,840 --> 00:44:17,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, I saw Ethan Strauss write a piece the other

952
00:44:17,800 --> 00:44:20,160
Speaker 2: day talking about how people don't realize how much too

953
00:44:20,320 --> 00:44:23,600
Speaker 2: flop it was. He's not wrong. The one thing I

954
00:44:23,640 --> 00:44:27,080
Speaker 2: would say, though, is like Rome wasn't built in a day.

955
00:44:27,360 --> 00:44:28,960
Speaker 2: For lack of a better term, like, this is the

956
00:44:29,040 --> 00:44:31,040
Speaker 2: kind of thing that takes some momentum. I'll give you

957
00:44:31,080 --> 00:44:33,640
Speaker 2: an example. There were i want to say, three teams

958
00:44:33,680 --> 00:44:36,040
Speaker 2: that went three to one in pool play games and

959
00:44:36,080 --> 00:44:38,880
Speaker 2: did not get into the to the knockout round. Point

960
00:44:38,920 --> 00:44:40,880
Speaker 2: being like, you know what, I'm kind of excited for

961
00:44:40,960 --> 00:44:44,360
Speaker 2: next year. I think that that was a good indicator

962
00:44:44,400 --> 00:44:46,719
Speaker 2: of the fact that like, even the four pool play

963
00:44:46,760 --> 00:44:50,200
Speaker 2: games are basically single elimination, like they're like, it kind

964
00:44:50,200 --> 00:44:53,640
Speaker 2: of adds these Like so for all these teams, they're

965
00:44:53,840 --> 00:44:58,200
Speaker 2: six to seven single elimination style games in November and December,

966
00:44:58,200 --> 00:45:01,200
Speaker 2: that adds a great deal of interest, and like in general,

967
00:45:01,360 --> 00:45:03,839
Speaker 2: like Lebron winning and wanting to win it as bad

968
00:45:03,840 --> 00:45:05,800
Speaker 2: as he did, I think that helps for the cachet

969
00:45:05,920 --> 00:45:08,120
Speaker 2: of it all. And like, I think there's a version

970
00:45:08,160 --> 00:45:10,480
Speaker 2: of this we're ten years from now. It is a

971
00:45:10,480 --> 00:45:13,799
Speaker 2: type of tournament that is putting up, you know, a

972
00:45:14,000 --> 00:45:16,160
Speaker 2: half of what you would expect from playoff games. I

973
00:45:16,760 --> 00:45:18,879
Speaker 2: think it's like one of those things where it's way

974
00:45:18,920 --> 00:45:21,520
Speaker 2: too soon to look at it as a success or

975
00:45:21,560 --> 00:45:23,960
Speaker 2: failure in the big picture. But I'll tell you as

976
00:45:23,960 --> 00:45:26,040
Speaker 2: a basketball fan, I loved it. I thought it was fun.

977
00:45:26,360 --> 00:45:29,880
Speaker 1: They're obviously going to be changes, like this was always

978
00:45:30,200 --> 00:45:33,760
Speaker 1: an organic thing that was going to grow and evolve.

979
00:45:33,840 --> 00:45:36,320
Speaker 1: I can tell you that as we sit here recording

980
00:45:36,360 --> 00:45:39,160
Speaker 1: this on Tuesday, there are meetings happening in the league.

981
00:45:38,920 --> 00:45:41,759
Speaker 3: Office about how to evolve it.

982
00:45:41,840 --> 00:45:45,759
Speaker 1: Autopsy is being done. Post mortem's being done about the

983
00:45:45,840 --> 00:45:48,000
Speaker 1: n season tournament. Like one suggestion I would make right

984
00:45:48,080 --> 00:45:50,959
Speaker 1: up the bat. Don't hold the semifinals at two pm

985
00:45:51,040 --> 00:45:52,680
Speaker 1: Local on a Thursday.

986
00:45:52,520 --> 00:45:55,400
Speaker 3: Like that, Like I remember texting League of Fish. I

987
00:45:55,480 --> 00:45:56,719
Speaker 3: understand why the league did it.

988
00:45:56,640 --> 00:45:59,080
Speaker 1: Because they want to do it on one day and

989
00:45:59,360 --> 00:46:02,640
Speaker 1: you could do it or like, but holding it at

990
00:46:02,680 --> 00:46:06,600
Speaker 1: two pm on Thursday in an arena that was didn't

991
00:46:06,640 --> 00:46:08,479
Speaker 1: seem full to me, Like I wasn't there but didn't

992
00:46:08,520 --> 00:46:10,640
Speaker 1: There was no energy in that building at all for

993
00:46:10,719 --> 00:46:13,960
Speaker 1: Pacers against Bucks. That's something needs to be correct corrected.

994
00:46:14,040 --> 00:46:19,040
Speaker 1: Maybe you want to consider other options other than score differential,

995
00:46:19,360 --> 00:46:22,160
Speaker 1: uh for you know, for the next iteration of it,

996
00:46:22,360 --> 00:46:24,520
Speaker 1: for no other reason than to stop getting like Billy

997
00:46:24,600 --> 00:46:27,520
Speaker 1: Donovan pissed off about teams doing things for the Bulls.

998
00:46:27,600 --> 00:46:29,080
Speaker 3: Over the course of the last month.

999
00:46:29,200 --> 00:46:31,880
Speaker 1: So like, there are certainly tweaks that are going to

1000
00:46:31,920 --> 00:46:35,239
Speaker 1: be made, you know, to this format, but overall it

1001
00:46:35,440 --> 00:46:38,840
Speaker 1: generated interest. I mean the Ethan Straus story, like I read.

1002
00:46:38,640 --> 00:46:40,840
Speaker 3: It, it was good. He called it a flop. It's not

1003
00:46:40,880 --> 00:46:41,360
Speaker 3: a flop.

1004
00:46:41,480 --> 00:46:44,200
Speaker 1: Like it's just like it might not be as successful

1005
00:46:44,280 --> 00:46:47,279
Speaker 1: as some people out there are trumpeting it to be,

1006
00:46:48,000 --> 00:46:51,320
Speaker 1: but it absolutely is not a flop. It is absolutely

1007
00:46:51,440 --> 00:46:54,480
Speaker 1: something that the NBA can build on. And you know

1008
00:46:55,000 --> 00:46:57,080
Speaker 1: that just like the play in tournament, it is here

1009
00:46:57,120 --> 00:46:57,560
Speaker 1: to stay.

1010
00:46:59,120 --> 00:47:01,120
Speaker 2: It's here to stay. That's exactly what I was going

1011
00:47:01,200 --> 00:47:03,920
Speaker 2: to say, Like it's very clearly like, oh, the NBA

1012
00:47:04,040 --> 00:47:07,520
Speaker 2: is better with this, so let's keep tweaking it and

1013
00:47:07,560 --> 00:47:09,520
Speaker 2: making it work at that point, all right, Chris, I

1014
00:47:09,560 --> 00:47:11,600
Speaker 2: sincerely appreciate you giving us so much of your time.

1015
00:47:11,640 --> 00:47:13,120
Speaker 2: Did you have anything you wanted to plug before?

1016
00:47:13,320 --> 00:47:15,400
Speaker 1: But if you're listening to this, make sure you subscribe

1017
00:47:15,440 --> 00:47:18,160
Speaker 1: to Boxing with Chris Mannix as well, which is all

1018
00:47:18,280 --> 00:47:20,280
Speaker 1: part of the Old Volume Sports family.

1019
00:47:22,400 --> 00:47:24,759
Speaker 2: All right, thanks, buddy, I appreciate it. Thank you all

1020
00:47:24,800 --> 00:47:27,719
Speaker 2: for listening and for supporting the show as always. Will

1021
00:47:27,760 --> 00:47:30,440
Speaker 2: be back tonight to break down another jam packed Tuesday

1022
00:47:30,480 --> 00:48:00,400
Speaker 2: night Slate, I'll see you guys. Then the Volume Z