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Speaker 1: Hmmm, and welcome back to another edition all the smoke Jack.

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Speaker 1: We got a good one today, bro Legendary, got a

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Speaker 1: good one today. Someone I've been harassing trying to tell you,

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Speaker 1: but on his ass two years Tanner, we need you,

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Speaker 1: we need you, and we keep passing each other. But

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Speaker 1: he finally came out here for something. I found out

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Speaker 1: he was coming out here for something, and he blessed

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Speaker 1: us with his time, two time NBA Champ, twelve time

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Speaker 1: All Star, one of the greatest point guard slash players,

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Speaker 1: the original Zeke to ever play this game, the real

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Speaker 1: z Yes, the one and only one. And Isaiah Thomas,

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Speaker 1: thank you for the time man, Thank you for coming

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Speaker 1: through always always. There was a rumor just recently that

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Speaker 1: you were going to sign with the Sons on the

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Speaker 1: management side. It came out and then what's the latest

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Speaker 1: with that situation.

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Speaker 2: So I'm on the board of UWM, which is Matt

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Speaker 2: Ishbee's stodent company. And you know it's crazy. You have

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Speaker 2: the two biggest mortgage companies in the US in Detroit,

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Speaker 2: UWM and Rocket Mortgage. So I'm on the board. He

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Speaker 2: and I have been friends for a long time. Advise

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Speaker 2: him on a couple of things. He advised me on

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Speaker 2: a couple of things business wise, and we have been

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Speaker 2: you know, really looking for a team since twenty twenty one.

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Speaker 2: Matt wanted to get into the business. His brother wants

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Speaker 2: to own a baseball team. Matt wanted to own a

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Speaker 2: basketball team. So you know, when the story came out,

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Speaker 2: it was only natural that they put us together, you know,

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Speaker 2: advising of talk and still consulting. I don't have any

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Speaker 2: plans of being in a front office position ever. Again

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Speaker 2: in terms of running basketball operations. Now, when you talk

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Speaker 2: about advising, consulting, ownership, those type of things, that's probably

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Speaker 2: where I fit in at you know, not necessarily. I

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Speaker 2: got too much going on. I don't see myself sitting

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Speaker 2: in an office day to day running basketball ops again,

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Speaker 2: but from an advising consulting standpoint, that is on the table,

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Speaker 2: and you know, we'll see what happened. Interesting.

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Speaker 1: Obviously, basketball is what you're known for, but now you're

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Speaker 1: known for just your entrepreneurialism is that a word, or

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Speaker 1: entrepreneurial ship. I mean doing very well making mogul, Yeah, cannabis, space,

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Speaker 1: champagne space, real estate, private equity. Business of basketball wasn't

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Speaker 1: very big when you played, because it wasn't very big

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Speaker 1: when we played, you know what I mean. Now it's

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Speaker 1: the norm. But you've been able to really capitalize off

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Speaker 1: the court with investments in the business space. Can you

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Speaker 1: walk us through first and foremost of your champagne because

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Speaker 1: you said, that's what's keeping you youthful.

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Speaker 2: So fortunately enough for me, you know, basketball in sport

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Speaker 2: has given me the opportunity to really, you know, expand globally.

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Speaker 2: And name of my firm is Isaiah International, and we

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Speaker 2: do a lot of business outside of the United States.

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Speaker 2: So when you talk about the champagne space, we got

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Speaker 2: two hundred acres over in the Old Region of Champagne,

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Speaker 2: which is the oldest region of Champagne, with the largest

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Speaker 2: black owned champagne company in the US, largest first press

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Speaker 2: grape of champagne in the US. And there's three presses

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Speaker 2: of the great first press, second press, third press, and

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Speaker 2: as you know, the first press is the best press.

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Speaker 2: We also are known for zero and low sugar champagnes.

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Speaker 2: Why did we want zero and low sugar champagnes? Being

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Speaker 2: former athletes? Right, most people who drink champagne immediately complain

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Speaker 2: of a headache, So you ask the question why, Right,

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Speaker 2: it's the high sugar content in the high soul fights, right.

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Speaker 2: So we wanted to bring something back to the US,

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Speaker 2: not only back to the US, but back to you know,

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Speaker 2: all people who love champagne, drink champagne, promote champagne, but.

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Speaker 3: It's not theirs.

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Speaker 2: Uh So what we wanted to do is bring you

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Speaker 2: the best of the best. And my ECON teacher told

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Speaker 2: me a long time ago that you know, if you

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Speaker 2: if you got the highest quality and you can give

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Speaker 2: it to the customer and the consumer at the lowest price,

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Speaker 2: and then long term you're going to win the game.

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Speaker 2: So it's not the best marketed, it's the you know,

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Speaker 2: the most, it's the best, highest quality. And we're out

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Speaker 2: here now getting ready on board and a couple of

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Speaker 2: the Hyatt hotels. That's why I'm out here. So Sherilon

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Speaker 2: Champagne the number one rated zero low sugar, first press

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Speaker 2: of the great Champagne in the United States, Black owned

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Speaker 2: and also supported by the four hundred and fifty NBA

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Speaker 2: players on the NBPA side. So shout out to the

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Speaker 2: NBPA for you know, you know, helping and sticking with

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Speaker 2: former players and marked everybody else in the market.

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Speaker 1: Now we got some black black owns, so it's good

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Speaker 1: to get that in there.

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Speaker 4: They might have the all time most successful backcourt ever.

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Speaker 5: Michael Wave, super successful, Z and Joe d them three.

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Speaker 4: Like if you wanted to model use up out of

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Speaker 4: some basketball players that took after advantage of their career

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Speaker 4: and after basketball, y'all might have the top basketball, I

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Speaker 4: mean backcourt in history.

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Speaker 5: As far as business wise.

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Speaker 3: Thank you.

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Speaker 4: Now, seriously, if you think about it, ain't lying if

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Speaker 4: you think about it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I hadn't thought about it that way, but that's

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Speaker 2: why we own this show. That's my y'all. That's my y'all.

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Speaker 3: Another you think, well, thank you for that.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, And you know, and you know we if you

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Speaker 2: notice when we was describing all Salves when we were playing,

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Speaker 2: the media always gave us the physically tough label, but

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Speaker 2: we always described ourselves as mentally tough. And that's the

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Speaker 2: most important time. Yeah, it's like, you know, you you

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Speaker 2: win with smart people. You know, you win with people

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Speaker 2: who don't make mistakes. You know who I understand how

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Speaker 2: to you know, operate, work within the system, game plan,

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Speaker 2: you know, make sacrifices, and then you try to go

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Speaker 2: out and win the basketball game with it, and fortunately

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Speaker 2: enough for us, we had a lot of players that

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Speaker 2: wanted to do that and did it at a very

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Speaker 2: high level.

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Speaker 1: Can you talk a little bit about the cannabis space.

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Speaker 1: That's something that Jack and I are both in and

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Speaker 1: and and obviously you know, this push was supposed to

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Speaker 1: be the push for the minority population in that space,

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Speaker 1: and we're still very small percentage of the population that's

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Speaker 1: making that up. But can you talk to us what

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Speaker 1: you guys are doing in the cannabis space.

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Speaker 2: So I'm chairman CEO of a publicly traded company called

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Speaker 2: One World Products where we cultivate and grow in Colombia.

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Speaker 2: Now again, my firm is Isaiah International, and we do

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Speaker 2: a lot of business, most of our businesses outside of

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Speaker 2: the United States because outside of the United States, I

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Speaker 2: classify as an American. Inside the United States, I classify

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Speaker 2: as black, and you get the minority tax. And we

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Speaker 2: got a lot of white folks in here today who travel,

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Speaker 2: you know, and when you travel outside of the United

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Speaker 2: States your passport, you know, you white folks say they

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Speaker 2: they're American. But the only time they say they're white

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Speaker 2: is when they come back into the United States. Only

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Speaker 2: time we say we black is when we come into

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Speaker 2: the United States. Outside of the United States, there are

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Speaker 2: no minority classifications in terms of business.

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Speaker 3: So one world products.

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Speaker 2: Why do we choose to cultivate and grow in Colombia

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Speaker 2: the same reason we France for Champagne, the soil, the

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Speaker 2: sun and also the farmers and the workers that you

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Speaker 2: work with in terms of indigenous farmers and growers Columbia.

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Speaker 2: Right now we've partnered with the Afro Columbia community. There

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Speaker 2: been granted one point two million acres of land to

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Speaker 2: grow industrial hemp. So when industrial hemp space, and we're

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Speaker 2: also in the THCHC in CBD space, there are also

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Speaker 2: when a process, I got a couple of confidentiality agreement signs,

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Speaker 2: so I got to keep my fingers crossed. But when

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Speaker 2: the process of onboarding two of the larger brands here

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Speaker 2: in the in the US who sell CBD and THC products.

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Speaker 2: Now we can't distribute THHC products across the across the

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Speaker 2: border yet, but internationally, as you know, the borders have

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Speaker 2: opened up in other countries, so we can move THHC

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Speaker 2: and CBD products into other countries. The US will open

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Speaker 2: up THC wise, it has opened up CBD wise, so

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Speaker 2: we're able to move product into the into the US

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Speaker 2: on the CBD in the CBD oils standpoint. The industrial

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Speaker 2: hemp side, we work with the automotive industry. Just signed

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Speaker 2: an agreement with Stilantis and Flexingate to produce a part

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Speaker 2: on the jeep Wrangler that they've given us that we

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Speaker 2: in the automobile space they want to reduce their carbon footprint.

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Speaker 2: Hemp is the natural carbon sink, so it takes carbon

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Speaker 2: out of the air. And what we've done in that

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Speaker 2: company one world product is that we position our sales

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Speaker 2: not only to be the largest supplier of industrial hemp uh,

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Speaker 2: but if you think of how can I put it.

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Speaker 2: Most companies are set up to deal with corporations. We

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Speaker 2: set our salves up to deal with industry changes. So

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Speaker 2: as as plastics are moved out of the industry, you're

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Speaker 2: looking for the next raw material that will be infused

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Speaker 2: into the industry, and we see industrial hemp being the

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Speaker 2: replacement for plastics and also reducing the carbon footprint. You

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Speaker 2: both of you know the discovery of the indocannabinoid system

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Speaker 2: that was discovered in the nineties. Had we known about

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Speaker 2: it when we was playing, I'm sure, we would have

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Speaker 2: treated ourselves much differently. You know they when you talk

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Speaker 2: about CBD and THC. The two things that it does

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Speaker 2: for athletes, right reduces inflammation and help you sleep. We

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Speaker 2: need no swelling, no pain, I can go to sleep,

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Speaker 2: you know. So I think, uh, you know, the plant

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Speaker 2: is going to change the way medicine is prescribed. They're

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Speaker 2: now teaching in metal school now about the indocannabinoid system

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Speaker 2: CB one, CB two receptors, and the more we discover

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Speaker 2: the benefits of the plant, the more it will be used.

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Speaker 2: Now you hit an important topic in terms of you know,

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Speaker 2: classified as black in this country getting business opportunities. We

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Speaker 2: didn't get it on the first blush to first go around.

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Speaker 2: Now that federal and state still having come together in

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Speaker 2: terms of their laws. In the dispensary model that's set

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Speaker 2: up here in the States, you can only cultivate and

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Speaker 2: grow from You can only buy from the cultivators within

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Speaker 2: the state, but you can't cross state lines. So it's

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Speaker 2: an antiquated business model that's been set up here. We

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Speaker 2: do believe that it will have to expand and open up.

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Speaker 2: And once it expands, like any product, and it's you

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Speaker 2: can globally bly it, buy it, and supply it. We

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Speaker 2: see ourselves in Colombia being a unique trade partner with

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Speaker 2: the US, probably the biggest trade partner with the US

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Speaker 2: on this side of the equator. Most of your flowers

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Speaker 2: that you get come from Columbia here in the US,

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Speaker 2: your coffee, your bananas, a lot of fruit. So as

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Speaker 2: a trade partner, Colombia is one of your biggest trade partners.

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Speaker 2: Colombia is projected to supply forty four percent of the

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Speaker 2: world's cannabis supply only because of the geography and also

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Speaker 2: because you can turn your land over three times a year.

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Speaker 2: So again that's that's what we do in one world

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Speaker 2: products in terms of So I'm in the champagne space

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Speaker 2: and I'm in the cannabis space, and my kids love it.

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Speaker 2: I know. That's right. Hey, that is the plug. Is puffet,

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Speaker 2: that is the plug.

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Speaker 5: That's dope. Let's go back, man.

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Speaker 4: I'm a West Side of No, you're a west side absolutely.

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Speaker 4: Talk about a young z growing up on the West

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Speaker 4: Side of Chicago.

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Speaker 2: It was it was. It was hard and as a

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Speaker 2: matter of fact, you were you were just there. I

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Speaker 2: think about a year ago he was running around in

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Speaker 2: oh Block. Yeah, I got the calls, right, I was like, nah,

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Speaker 2: I call, I said, I'll let him know that I

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Speaker 2: was out there. No. But growing up on the West

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Speaker 2: side of Chicago, and we we emphasized west side. And

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Speaker 2: here's why because, uh my mom worked for Fred Hampton

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Speaker 2: and I was one of the kids that got the

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Speaker 2: free breakfast, you know, learned martial arts and all that.

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Speaker 2: And and the Black Panther headquarter was right there on

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Speaker 2: Madison in Western. The Chicago Bulls the stadium was two

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Speaker 2: blocks from Madison in Western where we you know you

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Speaker 2: go to United Center now, or what we called the stadium,

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Speaker 2: it was two blocks from there. So as a kid,

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Speaker 2: I was standing outside the stadium big and for shoes,

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Speaker 2: you know. And then they would throw the popcorn out

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Speaker 2: after the game and they would put it in a

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Speaker 2: trash band. So we would always you know, wait and

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Speaker 2: get the popcorn and take it home. But growing up

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Speaker 2: on the West side, right, you had Noble Drew a

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Speaker 2: lead teachings Morsh Americans. And at that time it was

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Speaker 2: about nationality, right, and you and I have had some

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Speaker 2: conversations about you know, nationality and citizenship. That's what we

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Speaker 2: were all about on the West side of Chicago. When

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Speaker 2: Martin Luther King moved into the West Side of Chicago,

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Speaker 2: lived four blocks from my house. There's a street named

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Speaker 2: after my mom in Chicago. My mom was she was

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Speaker 2: a gangster. You know, she's a real deal. Yeah, So

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Speaker 2: homing in Jackson, you'll see Mary Thomas Way, and you know,

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Speaker 2: named after my mom. You know, we marched in all

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Speaker 2: the civil rights movements. You know, when Martin Luther King

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Speaker 2: moved in, you know, we didn't have babysitters. There's nine

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Speaker 2: of us, so she, you know, she would take us

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Speaker 2: and you know, we had to go where her and

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Speaker 2: my pops went, you know. And so that's kind of

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Speaker 2: the neighborhood that that I'm from. You know, the first

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Speaker 2: original gang that started in the United States, the Vice Lords.

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Speaker 2: When you talk about the Vice Lords and and all

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Speaker 2: these gangs that really started, you know, they if they

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Speaker 2: go back and they read their original charters right, the

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Speaker 2: original charters were set up.

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Speaker 3: They was supposed to be community.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and it was protecting the neighborhood, and it was

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Speaker 2: protecting neighborhood from the police, right, because there's a lot

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Speaker 2: of police brutality and we were fighting not to be colorized.

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Speaker 2: We were fighting not to be put in apartheid colorized system.

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Speaker 2: And when you go back and you look and you

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Speaker 2: know those signs that they was running in Memphis said,

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Speaker 2: I am a man. You know, we were fighting not

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Speaker 2: to be dehumanized and taken out of all humanity. Right.

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Speaker 3: We wanted to be and remain human.

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Speaker 2: But now we've accepted and we've adopted this colorized system.

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Speaker 2: Uh But but those were the teachings that were taught

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Speaker 2: on the West Side of Chicago. So that's where I

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Speaker 2: come from, That's what's ingrained in me, that's what I carry,

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Speaker 2: that's what I still fight for today. And you know,

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Speaker 2: there's no there's no pure anything. We're all living on

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Speaker 2: a hyphen right you you you know you Italian American.

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Speaker 2: And I'm gonna say this, right, when we were growing up,

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Speaker 2: we grew up with Italians.

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Speaker 3: We grew up with Greeks, we grew up with Polish,

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Speaker 3: we grew up with.

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Speaker 2: Irish, right, and they were proud to call themselves Greek, Italian, Irish.

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Speaker 2: Right When did everybody become white?

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Speaker 5: Right?

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Speaker 2: Right?

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Speaker 3: You know, I mean they don't say Greek.

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Speaker 2: Anymore, they don't say I'm Italian anymore, they don't say

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Speaker 2: you know Jeworge that everybody see the white, black, green, purple,

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Speaker 2: blue or orange people about that.

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Speaker 1: My mom I used to, you know, what are you?

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Speaker 1: I'm black and white. My Mom's like, no, you're Italian.

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Speaker 1: You're Italian. You're not white, You're Italian, right, right?

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Speaker 2: Yeah? And and and by the way, the Italians, you know,

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Speaker 2: come from the Moors, right, you know, so you know,

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Speaker 2: when you when you, all of us are human beings, right,

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Speaker 2: and and if we can get back to being human

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Speaker 2: beings and get away from this colorized apartheid system that

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Speaker 2: we're operating in, then we got a chance to make it,

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Speaker 2: you know. And that's what the fight has always been

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Speaker 2: about in this country, right, Those who are who have

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Speaker 2: been classified as black have always been trying to get

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Speaker 2: out of black status. So when immigrants come in, they

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Speaker 2: quickly say what's your status, and they tell you what

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Speaker 2: this status is? Right, and you know, so nationality, birthright,

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Speaker 2: citizenship status, those are the things that we need to

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Speaker 2: be talking about. That was the conversation on the West Side,

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Speaker 2: and it's the conversation I still carry today.

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Speaker 4: One quick question, you said, you and your mom used

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Speaker 4: to take you out to the marches and stuff like that.

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Speaker 4: I got a chance to experience that with George Floyd.

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Speaker 4: Did any of that change you experienced that, like, did

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Speaker 4: that have like any type of hold on you to

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Speaker 4: be able to experience that as a youngster, Cause I

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Speaker 4: experienced as a grown man and it definitely changed me.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. And so two things that I noticed dramatically. So

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Speaker 2: when we were marching, you know, in the sixties, my

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Speaker 2: first ten years of life, right, Martin Luther King's assassinated,

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Speaker 2: Fred Hampton's assassinated, the Kennedys are assassinated, and we're talking

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Speaker 2: sixty three sixty five. Then the Cicero Riots, Chicago riots

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Speaker 2: sixty six sixty seven, So this is my first ten

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Speaker 2: years of lights on the West Side. So I like

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Speaker 2: seven riots, you know, all in all community, right, and

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Speaker 2: it was just the community in the city marching. Right.

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Speaker 2: George Floyd gets killed, and I watched all the pain

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Speaker 2: that you was going through, and we all cried for

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Speaker 2: you and felt for you and saw your heart on

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Speaker 2: display for your brother.

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Speaker 5: Right.

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Speaker 3: But the thing that.

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Speaker 2: Was so different about George Floyd and us marching for

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Speaker 2: voting rights, I can't believe I'm saying this. In this country,

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Speaker 2: we still marching and trying to get voting rights. Think

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Speaker 2: about what I'm saying, right, classified as white in this country,

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Speaker 2: they ain't never had to march for votevoting rights right,

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Speaker 2: equal rights. Uh, keyword civil rights. I just need you

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Speaker 2: to be civil to me. So and these are these

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Speaker 2: are these are these are labels right, these are labels

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Speaker 2: civil rights, equal rights, voting rights. Right. So George Floyd gets,

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Speaker 2: you know, gets murdered and watching all the pain that

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Speaker 2: you was going through. But then seeing the whole world.

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Speaker 2: That's different. It's different. Now the whole world stood up

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Speaker 2: and was marching those who were classified as black, white,

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Speaker 2: different countries and and and what they were saying is, hey,

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Speaker 2: United States of America, these people that y'all have classified

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Speaker 2: as black, please stop doing this to them. Change the

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Speaker 2: these laws, let them be human, right, give them their

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Speaker 2: nationality back, let them be a part of the system.

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Speaker 5: Right.

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Speaker 2: And that was different. You know, where the world stood up.

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Speaker 2: And not only did the world stand up, but you

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Speaker 2: had black folk, white folk, green folk.

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Speaker 3: And everybody, I mean everybody.

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Speaker 2: And in the sustained movement of the young folk. The

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Speaker 2: young folk in this country was like, Hey, I don't

347
00:21:36,640 --> 00:21:39,399
Speaker 2: know what y'all talking about, but I like snoop, you

348
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Speaker 2: know what I mean, Like, you know, it's like you

349
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Speaker 2: know this, my brother is and so the young folk,

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Speaker 2: what they've done in this country, and I hope they

351
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Speaker 2: keep it up, is putting the pressure on to to

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Speaker 2: to let us become a part of the United States,

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Speaker 2: American fact brick and and we don't need no.

354
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Speaker 3: No, no.

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Speaker 2: You know we classified as a minority when you look

356
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Speaker 2: these terms up in the dictionary, right, hey, these words

357
00:22:13,880 --> 00:22:18,280
Speaker 2: have meaning, right, So hey, I'm not a minority. I'm

358
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Speaker 2: a grown man, right right, take care of myself, pay

359
00:22:21,400 --> 00:22:25,520
Speaker 2: my own bills. You know, I'm not a handicap individual,

360
00:22:25,760 --> 00:22:29,879
Speaker 2: and don't classify my business as handicap, you know, treat me,

361
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Speaker 2: you know, level the playing field. We come from, sport

362
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Speaker 2: and all we asked for is hey, man, just the

363
00:22:36,200 --> 00:22:49,600
Speaker 2: referees don't cheat like they change for the Lakers. Keep

364
00:22:49,640 --> 00:22:51,800
Speaker 2: it either gives a chance.

365
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Speaker 3: So sorry, I went off on that.

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Speaker 4: Now, that's why I asked. That's why you had me.

367
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Speaker 4: I was about to let them down.

368
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Speaker 2: Yeah, I saw them tears come. But but you're saying, man,

369
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Speaker 2: but that's some deep stuff. Man, y'all did it? I

370
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Speaker 2: mean y'all and y'all doing it, and we need y'all

371
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Speaker 2: to keep doing it, appreciate it.

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Speaker 5: You know.

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Speaker 4: Let's let's stay on the west side. Let's talk about

374
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Speaker 4: Lord Henry. How how big was he in your life?

375
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Speaker 4: And how nice was he?

376
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Speaker 2: Man? So my older brother, Lord Henry, right, and so

377
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Speaker 2: I think he may steal hold of the Catholic school

378
00:23:24,840 --> 00:23:30,000
Speaker 2: scoring record went to Saint Phillip's. And you know when

379
00:23:30,040 --> 00:23:33,399
Speaker 2: we talk about George Gervin, right, I didn't know George

380
00:23:33,440 --> 00:23:35,800
Speaker 2: Gervin back then. And back then the NBA won on

381
00:23:35,880 --> 00:23:38,800
Speaker 2: TV like the NBA's on TV now. So you only

382
00:23:38,840 --> 00:23:42,640
Speaker 2: admired your your the people in your neighborhood or your

383
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Speaker 2: older brothers.

384
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Speaker 3: Yeah, the locals.

385
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Speaker 2: And every now and then you may you may hear

386
00:23:46,680 --> 00:23:50,440
Speaker 2: about doctor J. And then your imagination you this is

387
00:23:50,520 --> 00:23:52,880
Speaker 2: doctor J. Move but you ain't never really seen him, right,

388
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Speaker 2: But my brother Lord Henry was so smooth man. And

389
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Speaker 2: the name alone you had to be called Lord h.

390
00:24:02,720 --> 00:24:05,720
Speaker 2: You know, my mom and my dad they had high

391
00:24:05,720 --> 00:24:10,639
Speaker 2: hopes and of course of the place that we was

392
00:24:10,680 --> 00:24:15,399
Speaker 2: living in. That's that's that's how it was. But but

393
00:24:15,600 --> 00:24:18,679
Speaker 2: now and and and he got turned out though, you know,

394
00:24:19,119 --> 00:24:20,960
Speaker 2: he got turned out on heroin.

395
00:24:22,600 --> 00:24:25,520
Speaker 3: Ended up dying, uh, you know, several years ago.

396
00:24:25,600 --> 00:24:28,639
Speaker 2: But but man, you're talking about a pretty jump shot,

397
00:24:28,960 --> 00:24:32,800
Speaker 2: you know, between the legs, dribbles behind the back, and

398
00:24:32,840 --> 00:24:34,399
Speaker 2: the way I was taught to play the game and

399
00:24:34,440 --> 00:24:36,320
Speaker 2: the way he taught me to play the game.

400
00:24:36,400 --> 00:24:37,879
Speaker 3: It was all spiritual.

401
00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:38,159
Speaker 5: You know.

402
00:24:38,200 --> 00:24:41,640
Speaker 2: It was like and I can't I can't remember him

403
00:24:41,680 --> 00:24:46,479
Speaker 2: and my older my my second oldest brother, third oldest brother, Larry.

404
00:24:46,560 --> 00:24:47,160
Speaker 3: You know, it's like.

405
00:24:47,200 --> 00:24:50,120
Speaker 2: Junior, you know, you you just can't play the game.

406
00:24:50,160 --> 00:24:51,359
Speaker 3: You gotta feel it.

407
00:24:51,800 --> 00:24:55,000
Speaker 2: I mean, you gotta when you shake, you you gotta

408
00:24:55,119 --> 00:24:59,320
Speaker 2: feel it. Man, you just can't you just dribbling. The

409
00:24:59,359 --> 00:25:04,520
Speaker 2: fun is that you just dripping. You gotta feel it, man.

410
00:25:04,200 --> 00:25:07,520
Speaker 2: And so you that's how you know you tried to play.

411
00:25:07,520 --> 00:25:11,440
Speaker 2: You tried to put that spirituality into the game where

412
00:25:11,480 --> 00:25:14,920
Speaker 2: you tried to make that person who's watching.

413
00:25:14,600 --> 00:25:17,120
Speaker 3: You play feel what you feel. Right.

414
00:25:17,760 --> 00:25:22,080
Speaker 2: And so my brother Lord Henry, you know, like I said,

415
00:25:22,080 --> 00:25:22,919
Speaker 2: he died of heroin.

416
00:25:23,000 --> 00:25:25,400
Speaker 3: But the one thing, you know, he kicked right.

417
00:25:25,920 --> 00:25:28,400
Speaker 2: And I remember when he kicked, you know, and he said,

418
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Speaker 2: I'm gonna go back to school, and and while he kicked,

419
00:25:34,320 --> 00:25:38,040
Speaker 2: he was like, damn, you know it was. It was.

420
00:25:38,119 --> 00:25:40,760
Speaker 2: It was easier when I was on drugs, you know,

421
00:25:41,200 --> 00:25:44,240
Speaker 2: because now now you got to get back into the system.

422
00:25:44,640 --> 00:25:46,639
Speaker 2: You've been out of the system for a long time.

423
00:25:47,000 --> 00:25:50,159
Speaker 2: But he went back, graduated from college, and I'll never forget.

424
00:25:51,280 --> 00:25:54,119
Speaker 2: So you've been on the West side, right, we uh

425
00:25:54,359 --> 00:25:59,000
Speaker 2: his The night before graduation, I rented a bus and

426
00:25:59,080 --> 00:26:02,040
Speaker 2: the bus was eating on Fifth Avenue in Jackson, right,

427
00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:08,640
Speaker 2: and and he was graduating from UH school in Detroit,

428
00:26:08,880 --> 00:26:12,879
Speaker 2: UH Universe, Phoenix University, you know that university online?

429
00:26:12,960 --> 00:26:14,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, that online thing.

430
00:26:14,200 --> 00:26:18,120
Speaker 2: So so I rented a bus and I had the bus,

431
00:26:18,280 --> 00:26:21,200
Speaker 2: you know, show up on Fifth Avenue and Jackson at

432
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Speaker 2: four in the morning, Three in the morning. Want everybody

433
00:26:24,480 --> 00:26:26,840
Speaker 2: to be there, three in the morning. Bus gonna leave

434
00:26:26,880 --> 00:26:29,960
Speaker 2: at four, going down to Detroit so we can watch

435
00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:33,760
Speaker 2: Lord Henry graduate at Ford Field. And I never forget

436
00:26:34,200 --> 00:26:38,600
Speaker 2: bus driver calling me up like, hey, man, you you

437
00:26:38,720 --> 00:26:40,679
Speaker 2: sure I got the right address? You shure I'm in

438
00:26:40,720 --> 00:26:43,960
Speaker 2: the right Okay. I'm like, yeah, man, you're in the

439
00:26:44,040 --> 00:26:47,679
Speaker 2: right location. So anyway, all the Lord Henry's friends, you know,

440
00:26:47,800 --> 00:26:53,439
Speaker 2: some are still addicts, then some you know, you know,

441
00:26:53,480 --> 00:26:56,360
Speaker 2: I've kicked and everything. So we load up the bus

442
00:26:57,080 --> 00:27:00,800
Speaker 2: and as the bus gets loaded up, not drive down

443
00:27:01,160 --> 00:27:04,080
Speaker 2: to Detroit. I meet him in Detroit and we had

444
00:27:04,119 --> 00:27:07,119
Speaker 2: his graduation and I never forget.

445
00:27:07,160 --> 00:27:07,720
Speaker 3: Man, like.

446
00:27:12,920 --> 00:27:16,600
Speaker 2: My brother walking across the stage had his captain gown on.

447
00:27:17,080 --> 00:27:20,840
Speaker 2: He didn't know what he was gonna be there, and

448
00:27:20,840 --> 00:27:24,960
Speaker 2: and all his friends started hollering Lord hen right, Lord Henry,

449
00:27:25,080 --> 00:27:28,840
Speaker 2: and man, he broke down on the stage and just

450
00:27:28,880 --> 00:27:31,800
Speaker 2: started crying, like crying like a little baby. Man. That

451
00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:35,159
Speaker 2: was That was one of the most beautiful days that

452
00:27:35,240 --> 00:27:37,200
Speaker 2: I remember. So when you talk about Lord Henry y

453
00:27:37,200 --> 00:27:40,640
Speaker 2: has basketball playing, but the fact that that dude went

454
00:27:40,680 --> 00:27:43,520
Speaker 2: back to school and then he just died a couple

455
00:27:43,520 --> 00:27:47,080
Speaker 2: of years ago, you know, organs just shut down, all

456
00:27:47,119 --> 00:27:50,480
Speaker 2: of the heroin and stuff. It just body just collapsed.

457
00:27:50,520 --> 00:27:55,280
Speaker 2: But rest in man. Yeah, thanks for bringing him up, man,

458
00:27:55,280 --> 00:27:56,760
Speaker 2: thank you, thank you. Man.

459
00:27:57,119 --> 00:27:59,200
Speaker 4: I just lost my little brother. I lost my older

460
00:27:59,200 --> 00:28:01,840
Speaker 4: brother when I was young. So I know the feeling, yeah,

461
00:28:01,880 --> 00:28:15,280
Speaker 4: I know the feeling. Yeah, Chicago Pipeline, all the especially

462
00:28:15,359 --> 00:28:17,640
Speaker 4: now all the young players that's coming out of Chicago.

463
00:28:17,720 --> 00:28:19,800
Speaker 5: Man, what's in the water though?

464
00:28:19,840 --> 00:28:24,040
Speaker 4: You got d Wade, Anthony Davis, Kevin garn There, Derek Rose,

465
00:28:24,160 --> 00:28:30,679
Speaker 4: Tim Hardaway and too Walker yourself will buying them. Patrick Beverley,

466
00:28:30,720 --> 00:28:32,640
Speaker 4: you got so many, so many hoopers come from there.

467
00:28:32,680 --> 00:28:35,720
Speaker 4: All dogs, yeah, all dogs talking about what's in the water.

468
00:28:36,560 --> 00:28:43,000
Speaker 2: Well it's in Detroit water now too, so I claim Chicago.

469
00:28:43,640 --> 00:28:47,800
Speaker 2: Yeah yeah. And and but you know, for us, right

470
00:28:48,120 --> 00:28:51,240
Speaker 2: is so we always say the south Side, like them

471
00:28:51,280 --> 00:28:55,040
Speaker 2: south Side guys, you name, they all got haircuts, you know,

472
00:28:55,120 --> 00:28:58,040
Speaker 2: they pretty, you know what I mean? And they and

473
00:28:58,120 --> 00:29:02,440
Speaker 2: they can shoot right west side. We we d ing

474
00:29:02,600 --> 00:29:07,160
Speaker 2: up so we Patrick Beverly, We Tony Allen, you know

475
00:29:07,200 --> 00:29:09,640
Speaker 2: what I mean, like we, I mean we we were

476
00:29:09,640 --> 00:29:12,000
Speaker 2: picking you up ninety four feet, We getting in your face,

477
00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:15,800
Speaker 2: Tim Hardaway, you know them south Side dudes, Dwayne Wade,

478
00:29:15,840 --> 00:29:18,640
Speaker 2: they can score, yeah, I mean they can. They can

479
00:29:18,720 --> 00:29:22,760
Speaker 2: score the basketball. So it's it's like we and then

480
00:29:22,760 --> 00:29:26,880
Speaker 2: they got a lot of food over there too, we

481
00:29:27,560 --> 00:29:30,320
Speaker 2: having food. But but I would say, just what's in

482
00:29:30,360 --> 00:29:35,400
Speaker 2: the water again, it's the spirituality of you know, wanting

483
00:29:35,440 --> 00:29:39,880
Speaker 2: to be the best and wanting to compete. And the

484
00:29:39,960 --> 00:29:42,800
Speaker 2: guy that we the probably the most proud of out

485
00:29:42,800 --> 00:29:47,960
Speaker 2: of Chicago is Derreck Roves. I mean he man, he

486
00:29:47,960 --> 00:29:52,720
Speaker 2: he lived all of all dreams all of all dream right,

487
00:29:54,040 --> 00:29:58,160
Speaker 2: and then he plays for the Chicago Bulls, right, and

488
00:29:58,200 --> 00:30:01,040
Speaker 2: then he becomes the youngest envy here the league at

489
00:30:01,200 --> 00:30:06,520
Speaker 2: twenty Oh man. I mean, I mean, I mean everybody's like,

490
00:30:06,680 --> 00:30:09,360
Speaker 2: you know, when d Rose walk into the room, it's like,

491
00:30:09,800 --> 00:30:15,560
Speaker 2: you know, theme music playing. I mean, so you know again,

492
00:30:15,760 --> 00:30:19,600
Speaker 2: it's just a I think it's competition, right, we want

493
00:30:19,600 --> 00:30:24,360
Speaker 2: to compete. A lot of us really like to fight.

494
00:30:25,240 --> 00:30:28,200
Speaker 2: Don't say we win all off fights, right, nobody does. Yeah,

495
00:30:28,600 --> 00:30:30,640
Speaker 2: Like I grew up fighting. I had to fight like

496
00:30:30,680 --> 00:30:33,640
Speaker 2: twice a week. I didn't win all my fights. But

497
00:30:33,680 --> 00:30:36,280
Speaker 2: then you just start like fighting, right, and you just

498
00:30:36,320 --> 00:30:38,960
Speaker 2: be like, all right, you know part of it, Yeah,

499
00:30:39,760 --> 00:30:42,480
Speaker 2: I think in Chicago that's that's part of like the

500
00:30:42,560 --> 00:30:47,440
Speaker 2: get down now in Detroit. So I you know, when

501
00:30:47,440 --> 00:30:50,080
Speaker 2: you look at what I the way I grew up

502
00:30:50,120 --> 00:30:52,520
Speaker 2: and the way I learned how to play in Chicago,

503
00:30:52,560 --> 00:30:55,560
Speaker 2: what I tried to do is take that to Detroit.

504
00:30:56,000 --> 00:30:57,960
Speaker 2: So when you look at the Chris Webbers, you look

505
00:30:57,960 --> 00:31:00,520
Speaker 2: at the Derrick Coleman's, you look at the Jay and Roads,

506
00:31:00,560 --> 00:31:02,840
Speaker 2: you look at the Steve Smith, you look at you

507
00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:07,680
Speaker 2: know them, we all bring that same like, Okay, we

508
00:31:07,440 --> 00:31:10,080
Speaker 2: were coming with it. And if you don't like it,

509
00:31:10,160 --> 00:31:10,800
Speaker 2: I'm sorry.

510
00:31:11,000 --> 00:31:16,600
Speaker 4: You know Fields, Yeah, Ronnie Fields, that's the name my classmate.

511
00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:19,480
Speaker 5: If he wouldn't have gotten an accident, bro.

512
00:31:19,640 --> 00:31:25,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, people don't remember, like so KG. Right, people talk

513
00:31:25,080 --> 00:31:30,560
Speaker 2: about Kevin Garnett, But in Chicago they said Kevin Garnett

514
00:31:30,560 --> 00:31:33,400
Speaker 2: play with I say that all the time.

515
00:31:34,040 --> 00:31:36,120
Speaker 3: It was like he played with Ronny Fields man.

516
00:31:36,360 --> 00:31:40,600
Speaker 2: And and you're talking about somebody jumping a right. So

517
00:31:40,680 --> 00:31:43,440
Speaker 2: when KG first got to Chicago, right, you know, KG

518
00:31:43,680 --> 00:31:47,080
Speaker 2: liked to talk, and you know he really animated, right,

519
00:31:47,280 --> 00:31:52,040
Speaker 2: and he wanted to play everywhere, like everywhere, and and

520
00:31:52,120 --> 00:31:54,120
Speaker 2: so he going up in the gym and and and

521
00:31:54,160 --> 00:31:56,080
Speaker 2: so everybody like, man, who is this dude? Man?

522
00:31:58,320 --> 00:31:59,440
Speaker 3: He kind of talk a lot.

523
00:31:59,560 --> 00:32:03,640
Speaker 2: You know, it's like nah, man, he good man, he

524
00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:08,440
Speaker 2: good like Liam. And so KG like went all over

525
00:32:08,560 --> 00:32:11,600
Speaker 2: Chicago play. But as you say, he's the guy that

526
00:32:11,640 --> 00:32:16,640
Speaker 2: played with Ronnie Felds. Truth. And it's like Dwayne Wade

527
00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:24,480
Speaker 2: in Chicago, right, Dwayne Wade get mad love, but he

528
00:32:24,560 --> 00:32:29,080
Speaker 2: don't get them the the Ronnie Fields kind of love.

529
00:32:29,720 --> 00:32:34,440
Speaker 2: Because in Chicago, it's what you did in high school. Yeah,

530
00:32:34,600 --> 00:32:36,640
Speaker 2: if you if you was the man in high school,

531
00:32:36,640 --> 00:32:38,160
Speaker 2: you're the man for life in Chicago.

532
00:32:38,440 --> 00:32:38,880
Speaker 3: Chicago.

533
00:32:39,520 --> 00:32:44,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, we don't have a more decorated athlete that come

534
00:32:44,080 --> 00:32:47,480
Speaker 2: out of Chicago than Dwayne Wade. Dwayne Wade is like

535
00:32:47,560 --> 00:32:53,360
Speaker 2: the gold standard, you know, Olympics, gold medal, championships, everything. No,

536
00:32:53,360 --> 00:32:57,640
Speaker 2: no one has got more you know, decorations than Dwayne Wade.

537
00:32:58,480 --> 00:33:00,720
Speaker 3: But in Chicago, oh.

538
00:33:00,640 --> 00:33:07,840
Speaker 2: Man Field man, you know what I mean, That's how

539
00:33:07,880 --> 00:33:10,120
Speaker 2: I go. You know, it's like what you did you

540
00:33:10,160 --> 00:33:13,160
Speaker 2: know in high school is what matters. That's crazy.

541
00:33:13,760 --> 00:33:16,720
Speaker 1: Uh, you end up shooting Indiana for college? Who else

542
00:33:16,760 --> 00:33:17,240
Speaker 1: was on your list?

543
00:33:17,320 --> 00:33:17,400
Speaker 4: Now?

544
00:33:17,400 --> 00:33:21,880
Speaker 2: I didn't choose Indiana, Mom, Indiana, We'll.

545
00:33:21,760 --> 00:33:24,080
Speaker 1: Talk to us about where your who was recruiting you

546
00:33:24,120 --> 00:33:25,239
Speaker 1: and where you wanted to go.

547
00:33:25,520 --> 00:33:28,880
Speaker 2: So of course I wanted to stay at home and

548
00:33:28,920 --> 00:33:33,080
Speaker 2: go to Paul uh And then my second choice was

549
00:33:33,160 --> 00:33:40,240
Speaker 2: Iowa with Loudosen. And you know, so coach Rosboro was

550
00:33:40,240 --> 00:33:44,640
Speaker 2: the assistant coach at at Iowa and he actually coached

551
00:33:44,720 --> 00:33:49,080
Speaker 2: my brother Lord Henry and Gregory at Our Lady of Sorrows.

552
00:33:49,360 --> 00:33:51,080
Speaker 2: So if you go back and you look at Iowa,

553
00:33:51,640 --> 00:33:56,280
Speaker 2: Loudosen always has Chicago guards. You know from Ronnie Lester,

554
00:33:57,880 --> 00:34:01,160
Speaker 2: Kenny Arnold. I mean, so he had that Chicago Go Pipeline,

555
00:34:01,280 --> 00:34:04,560
Speaker 2: Kevin Boyle, Jim Stack, and he was able to get

556
00:34:04,600 --> 00:34:07,280
Speaker 2: all them because he had Rosboro who had coached on

557
00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:12,920
Speaker 2: the West Side. So I wanted to go to DePaul,

558
00:34:13,000 --> 00:34:16,319
Speaker 2: wanted to stay home. And at that time were we

559
00:34:16,320 --> 00:34:20,320
Speaker 2: were poored and poor, you know, no lights, no gas,

560
00:34:20,960 --> 00:34:25,440
Speaker 2: no food, you know, struggling every day. And you know,

561
00:34:25,520 --> 00:34:27,759
Speaker 2: at that time, people was offering you money to come

562
00:34:27,800 --> 00:34:33,400
Speaker 2: to school. And I never forget, you know, had I

563
00:34:33,600 --> 00:34:36,799
Speaker 2: had I stayed home in Chicago, things would have been

564
00:34:36,840 --> 00:34:38,080
Speaker 2: really nice for the family.

565
00:34:39,440 --> 00:34:40,120
Speaker 3: I don't know if I.

566
00:34:40,080 --> 00:34:43,000
Speaker 2: Would be alive to day though, if I would have

567
00:34:43,000 --> 00:34:47,200
Speaker 2: stayed home in Chicago. And and y'all can understand this,

568
00:34:47,320 --> 00:34:51,120
Speaker 2: and I've never really said this, but growing up in

569
00:34:51,120 --> 00:34:53,200
Speaker 2: the neighborhood that I grew up in and growing up

570
00:34:53,200 --> 00:34:56,800
Speaker 2: the way we grew up, my mom made the wise

571
00:34:56,880 --> 00:35:01,759
Speaker 2: decision and said, you know, you're going to go to Indianah.

572
00:35:01,960 --> 00:35:06,000
Speaker 2: Had I stayed in Chicago, I don't know, if you know,

573
00:35:06,160 --> 00:35:08,959
Speaker 2: running and running around doing the things that we were doing.

574
00:35:09,880 --> 00:35:13,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, so, but she chose Indiana for me.

575
00:35:13,560 --> 00:35:13,759
Speaker 2: You know.

576
00:35:14,239 --> 00:35:16,279
Speaker 1: Legend has it that when Bob Knight showed up, the

577
00:35:16,320 --> 00:35:17,480
Speaker 1: whole neighborhood showed up.

578
00:35:17,600 --> 00:35:20,120
Speaker 2: The whole neighborhood showed up, and and then there was

579
00:35:20,160 --> 00:35:24,160
Speaker 2: a fight almost that broke out too. So my so,

580
00:35:24,320 --> 00:35:27,680
Speaker 2: my so, my two older brothers, you know, all my

581
00:35:27,719 --> 00:35:33,680
Speaker 2: brothers were there, and my second oldest brother, Gregory. I'm

582
00:35:33,680 --> 00:35:36,800
Speaker 2: sure you heard about my second oldest brother, Gregory. Uh

583
00:35:36,840 --> 00:35:40,520
Speaker 2: so he so he asked Coach Knight the question. You know,

584
00:35:40,640 --> 00:35:44,319
Speaker 2: it's like, you know, you know, Coach, like, if if

585
00:35:44,400 --> 00:35:47,680
Speaker 2: Junior was to you know, go down to Indiana, you know,

586
00:35:47,840 --> 00:35:51,239
Speaker 2: we we know the klan is is right there, and

587
00:35:52,280 --> 00:35:55,279
Speaker 2: if something was to go down, you know, who's going

588
00:35:55,320 --> 00:35:57,920
Speaker 2: to look out for Junior? And I thought, coach and

589
00:35:57,920 --> 00:36:00,520
Speaker 2: I gave a you know, pretty slick so you know

590
00:36:00,560 --> 00:36:05,000
Speaker 2: what I mean. He's like, you know, well, if if

591
00:36:05,000 --> 00:36:10,800
Speaker 2: we're winning, then they gonna look out. And he said

592
00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:13,600
Speaker 2: if we lose it, you know, and you know, everybody

593
00:36:13,640 --> 00:36:16,600
Speaker 2: kind of laughed off, but my brother he didn't liked it.

594
00:36:16,680 --> 00:36:20,719
Speaker 2: Answer now and so so back up, So Coach Night,

595
00:36:20,760 --> 00:36:23,200
Speaker 2: when he come to visit me, he walk in with

596
00:36:23,280 --> 00:36:29,440
Speaker 2: Wayne Embry and Quinn Buckner. Now, Quinn Buckner, you know undefeated,

597
00:36:29,840 --> 00:36:37,960
Speaker 2: you know at Thornbridge, undefeated at Indiana, and and Wayne

598
00:36:38,000 --> 00:36:41,839
Speaker 2: Embry first black general manager you know in Milwaukee. Now

599
00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:45,040
Speaker 2: he walk in, he flanked with him, right, and he

600
00:36:45,160 --> 00:36:48,520
Speaker 2: coming to recruit me, so big respect walking through the door.

601
00:36:49,120 --> 00:36:52,520
Speaker 2: So my brother didn't like his answer, right, And and

602
00:36:52,560 --> 00:36:54,719
Speaker 2: so my brother, you know, my brother was lit at

603
00:36:54,719 --> 00:36:55,080
Speaker 2: the time.

604
00:36:55,160 --> 00:36:58,600
Speaker 3: I mean he was you know, that's just.

605
00:36:58,560 --> 00:37:02,600
Speaker 2: How they was, right. And so my brother was like, hey, man,

606
00:37:02,719 --> 00:37:06,000
Speaker 2: I you know, I'm like that, you know that, what

607
00:37:06,160 --> 00:37:09,720
Speaker 2: you mean, they gonna take care we take care of junior,

608
00:37:09,800 --> 00:37:14,640
Speaker 2: you know. And and so the conversation quickly got heated,

609
00:37:15,600 --> 00:37:18,080
Speaker 2: and you know, I you know, the voices raised and

610
00:37:18,120 --> 00:37:23,879
Speaker 2: everything else. And so everybody's like, no, no, y'all, calm

611
00:37:23,960 --> 00:37:27,759
Speaker 2: down now. After that, and so coach Knight stood up.

612
00:37:28,000 --> 00:37:30,239
Speaker 2: You know, my brother's like, well, we can take this outside.

613
00:37:30,520 --> 00:37:33,280
Speaker 2: So Coach Knight stood up and took off his jacket

614
00:37:33,719 --> 00:37:36,719
Speaker 2: and started rolling up his sleep like, yeah, we could

615
00:37:36,760 --> 00:37:39,840
Speaker 2: take this outside. And everybody's like no, no, no, no.

616
00:37:40,200 --> 00:37:42,399
Speaker 2: And so I look over there and my mom, right,

617
00:37:42,680 --> 00:37:46,120
Speaker 2: my mom just sitting there real quiet, kind of nodding

618
00:37:46,120 --> 00:37:49,840
Speaker 2: her head, doing like this, and I'm like, oh, she

619
00:37:50,200 --> 00:37:55,120
Speaker 2: liked the dude, she liked it all. She's falling for it. Yeah.

620
00:37:55,160 --> 00:37:59,800
Speaker 3: So anyway, man, I'm glad they didn't go outside.

621
00:38:00,000 --> 00:38:02,520
Speaker 2: He was gonna get jumped. Oh, he wouldn't have made

622
00:38:02,560 --> 00:38:09,440
Speaker 2: it back in. Thought. But what he thought it was

623
00:38:09,480 --> 00:38:11,279
Speaker 2: just gonna be a one on one thing. Now, he

624
00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:13,160
Speaker 2: wouldn't have made it back in as a matter of fact.

625
00:38:13,560 --> 00:38:15,720
Speaker 2: As a matter of fact, he would have got stuck

626
00:38:15,800 --> 00:38:16,239
Speaker 2: up first.

627
00:38:18,680 --> 00:38:20,240
Speaker 3: He stuck on first.

628
00:38:21,239 --> 00:38:23,759
Speaker 2: Yeah, but he wouldn't have made it back in, you know,

629
00:38:24,640 --> 00:38:25,200
Speaker 2: for sure.

630
00:38:25,640 --> 00:38:28,719
Speaker 4: I remember I remember Bobbie Knight called me my senior year.

631
00:38:30,440 --> 00:38:32,640
Speaker 4: He called he called my houseman. Mama aster the phone.

632
00:38:32,680 --> 00:38:33,960
Speaker 4: She was talking to him. She's like, hold, I'm gonna

633
00:38:33,960 --> 00:38:36,920
Speaker 4: put you on speaker, Paul. This was his exact words.

634
00:38:37,280 --> 00:38:38,520
Speaker 4: Do you want to come to Indiana?

635
00:38:38,680 --> 00:38:43,160
Speaker 2: Not? Right? Straight up? Bro, I'm like huh. I'm like, Mama,

636
00:38:43,280 --> 00:38:45,319
Speaker 2: like I don't know what, excuse me?

637
00:38:45,560 --> 00:38:46,799
Speaker 5: Do you want to come to Indiana? Not?

638
00:38:47,160 --> 00:38:48,759
Speaker 4: And she's like, well, we'll have to give you a

639
00:38:48,840 --> 00:38:50,880
Speaker 4: call back. And she wouldn't expecting to be so blunt.

640
00:38:51,320 --> 00:38:52,440
Speaker 4: And that's all he said, Bro.

641
00:38:52,600 --> 00:38:53,879
Speaker 2: Yeah, never heard from again.

642
00:38:54,520 --> 00:38:54,759
Speaker 5: Trip.

643
00:38:55,160 --> 00:38:56,280
Speaker 2: Do you want to come to Indiana?

644
00:38:56,480 --> 00:38:56,520
Speaker 5: Not?

645
00:38:56,719 --> 00:38:58,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's it.

646
00:38:58,400 --> 00:39:00,560
Speaker 3: No, he was straight game with it.

647
00:39:00,760 --> 00:39:03,600
Speaker 2: He walked up in the house and said, look, I'm

648
00:39:03,680 --> 00:39:07,080
Speaker 2: off your son three things, Miss tim Now it's me

649
00:39:07,160 --> 00:39:10,040
Speaker 2: sitting here right, he said, Miss Thomas, I'm asking I'm

650
00:39:10,200 --> 00:39:13,160
Speaker 2: off of your son three things. He's gonna be a gentleman,

651
00:39:14,520 --> 00:39:17,680
Speaker 2: graduate from college, and I'm gonna teach him how everything

652
00:39:17,719 --> 00:39:21,440
Speaker 2: I know about basketball. And I'm like, well that that

653
00:39:21,880 --> 00:39:26,120
Speaker 2: ain't enough where the money at, you know what I mean.

654
00:39:26,200 --> 00:39:30,719
Speaker 2: He's like, and but you know that's how I recruited.

655
00:39:30,920 --> 00:39:37,759
Speaker 2: And the thing that the thing that my mom and

656
00:39:37,800 --> 00:39:41,120
Speaker 2: I would say my sister that they really loved that

657
00:39:41,200 --> 00:39:44,719
Speaker 2: I didn't understand at that time. Well, Coach Knight was

658
00:39:44,760 --> 00:39:52,680
Speaker 2: doing in the seventies and a little bit of the eighties,

659
00:39:55,880 --> 00:40:03,319
Speaker 2: taking young classified as black men, young boys in the

660
00:40:03,440 --> 00:40:08,000
Speaker 2: United States of America, taking them down to Bloomington, Indiana,

661
00:40:09,920 --> 00:40:21,520
Speaker 2: Bookend by the Klan. Right, everybody graduated from college, everybody's

662
00:40:21,560 --> 00:40:25,920
Speaker 2: doing well, everybody won championships.

663
00:40:26,800 --> 00:40:30,279
Speaker 3: And he didn't cheat, and he didn't cheat and he didn't.

664
00:40:30,040 --> 00:40:36,400
Speaker 2: Cheat, and that was unheard of during that period of

665
00:40:36,440 --> 00:40:41,799
Speaker 2: time because going to college, he was going to take

666
00:40:41,880 --> 00:40:45,680
Speaker 2: basket weaving. You know, you one didn't have to go

667
00:40:45,719 --> 00:40:49,919
Speaker 2: to class. Somebody's gonna be doing your homework. Everybody who

668
00:40:49,960 --> 00:40:53,719
Speaker 2: graduated from Indiana, you went to school, you did your homework,

669
00:40:54,440 --> 00:40:59,000
Speaker 2: and you got a real grade. He prepared you. Yeah yeah.

670
00:40:59,120 --> 00:41:00,440
Speaker 2: How long did it take for you to buy in?

671
00:41:00,520 --> 00:41:00,680
Speaker 5: Though?

672
00:41:00,680 --> 00:41:06,759
Speaker 2: I mean he compromised, he I had, you.

673
00:41:06,719 --> 00:41:08,520
Speaker 3: Know, it's like, hey man, this how is gonna be?

674
00:41:08,719 --> 00:41:08,839
Speaker 2: Like?

675
00:41:08,920 --> 00:41:11,279
Speaker 3: You know, one, no place to go?

676
00:41:11,719 --> 00:41:13,839
Speaker 2: You know, I got kicked off the team a couple

677
00:41:13,880 --> 00:41:16,879
Speaker 2: of times, and and I was like, I'm leaving, I'm

678
00:41:16,880 --> 00:41:19,759
Speaker 2: going home. But then I remember one no lights at home,

679
00:41:19,880 --> 00:41:22,080
Speaker 2: were no food at home or no gas at home.

680
00:41:22,920 --> 00:41:26,360
Speaker 2: So and you wasn't getting no sympathy from your mom.

681
00:41:26,680 --> 00:41:28,600
Speaker 2: Your mom was like, you know, you got to stay there.

682
00:41:28,760 --> 00:41:33,400
Speaker 2: So but uh. The thing that I the thing that

683
00:41:33,480 --> 00:41:37,520
Speaker 2: I loved about Coach Night now that I'm older, is

684
00:41:37,560 --> 00:41:41,719
Speaker 2: that he had the courage to coach me. He had

685
00:41:41,719 --> 00:41:45,920
Speaker 2: the courage to have confrontation with me. He had the

686
00:41:46,000 --> 00:41:48,840
Speaker 2: courage to make me do right when I wanted to

687
00:41:48,880 --> 00:41:52,080
Speaker 2: be wrong right. He didn't let me slide, he didn't

688
00:41:52,160 --> 00:41:55,400
Speaker 2: let me get by. And it would have been easier

689
00:41:55,400 --> 00:41:57,040
Speaker 2: for him to do that now that I looking back,

690
00:41:57,040 --> 00:41:59,440
Speaker 2: because I was pretty good at the time, but I

691
00:41:59,440 --> 00:42:01,959
Speaker 2: didn't know how good I was as a player, right,

692
00:42:02,480 --> 00:42:06,480
Speaker 2: so he let me, you know, he he basically was like, no,

693
00:42:06,640 --> 00:42:09,120
Speaker 2: you you you gotta go to class.

694
00:42:09,160 --> 00:42:09,399
Speaker 3: Man.

695
00:42:10,200 --> 00:42:12,520
Speaker 2: If you don't go to class, you can't come to practice.

696
00:42:13,239 --> 00:42:16,000
Speaker 2: You can't lay in your bed all day and think

697
00:42:16,040 --> 00:42:19,120
Speaker 2: you're gonna come to practice and didn't go to class.

698
00:42:19,440 --> 00:42:21,080
Speaker 3: That ain't happening. Now.

699
00:42:21,080 --> 00:42:23,239
Speaker 2: Of course, that's what I wanted to do. That's what

700
00:42:23,280 --> 00:42:27,680
Speaker 2: we all wanted to do. So and then in terms

701
00:42:27,760 --> 00:42:34,920
Speaker 2: of freedom, right, like we had no plays at Indiana,

702
00:42:35,800 --> 00:42:39,479
Speaker 2: We didn't have out of bounds play, we weren't coming

703
00:42:39,520 --> 00:42:43,680
Speaker 2: down calling, played twenty two up, thirty two out. You know,

704
00:42:44,640 --> 00:42:46,520
Speaker 2: it was like now you got to get to know

705
00:42:46,600 --> 00:42:50,160
Speaker 2: your teammate. And once you get to know your teammate,

706
00:42:51,600 --> 00:42:54,440
Speaker 2: then you'll know if he's going left or right. But

707
00:42:54,560 --> 00:42:57,440
Speaker 2: we played this game they call passing game, similar to

708
00:42:57,480 --> 00:43:00,480
Speaker 2: what Golden State does now. Now, Steve Kirk comes from

709
00:43:00,520 --> 00:43:05,719
Speaker 2: the you know, he comes from the the coaching tree, right, Loudosen.

710
00:43:08,000 --> 00:43:10,319
Speaker 2: You know when you look at Loudosen, when you look

711
00:43:10,320 --> 00:43:13,880
Speaker 2: at Pop, you know all of them really have you know,

712
00:43:14,040 --> 00:43:18,879
Speaker 2: similar coaching trees and thinking philosophies very similar to night right,

713
00:43:19,320 --> 00:43:25,040
Speaker 2: So that passing game, that that that that that that

714
00:43:25,200 --> 00:43:29,720
Speaker 2: know your teammate, understand what your teammates gonna do. Uh,

715
00:43:30,160 --> 00:43:32,920
Speaker 2: you know how we're going to attack the opponent, how

716
00:43:32,920 --> 00:43:36,600
Speaker 2: we're going to dissect him. Uh. Some some teams only

717
00:43:36,719 --> 00:43:39,680
Speaker 2: enter the ball on the left side of the court. Well, tonight,

718
00:43:39,719 --> 00:43:41,840
Speaker 2: you're going to end it on the right side.

719
00:43:42,520 --> 00:43:42,759
Speaker 5: You know.

720
00:43:43,760 --> 00:43:47,160
Speaker 3: So that was the way he made you think and play.

721
00:43:47,680 --> 00:43:50,360
Speaker 2: Uh so you think the game. Yeah, And he always

722
00:43:50,360 --> 00:43:53,560
Speaker 2: says a thinking man's game, mental is the physical as

723
00:43:53,560 --> 00:43:57,920
Speaker 2: forced to one. And you know, if you can't think,

724
00:43:58,280 --> 00:44:01,040
Speaker 2: then you you you got no shot. Again, is playing against.

725
00:44:00,719 --> 00:44:03,879
Speaker 4: Me mental is to physical as far as to one.

726
00:44:04,040 --> 00:44:06,279
Speaker 2: Yes, Okay, I just wanted to make sure it's a

727
00:44:06,320 --> 00:44:09,560
Speaker 2: thinking man's game and you you have to think your

728
00:44:09,560 --> 00:44:10,440
Speaker 2: way through the game.

729
00:44:11,040 --> 00:44:13,239
Speaker 1: And you're gonna have him thinking about that analogy the

730
00:44:13,239 --> 00:44:18,520
Speaker 1: whole Yeah, yeah, show yeah. Two year pit Stock, you

731
00:44:18,520 --> 00:44:21,320
Speaker 1: win a champion national championship in eighty one, dropped twenty

732
00:44:21,320 --> 00:44:24,560
Speaker 1: three versus Sam Perkins and James Worthy over North Carolina.

733
00:44:25,320 --> 00:44:28,840
Speaker 1: What was your favorite on the court moments in college?

734
00:44:28,920 --> 00:44:30,400
Speaker 1: Was it that championship?

735
00:44:32,000 --> 00:44:38,480
Speaker 2: Two favorites? The first favorite was February fourteenth, in Iowa,

736
00:44:39,080 --> 00:44:43,440
Speaker 2: Mike Whitson's return because my freshman year he had back surgery.

737
00:44:43,840 --> 00:44:44,919
Speaker 3: We were ranked number one.

738
00:44:45,760 --> 00:44:50,120
Speaker 2: Whitson goes down, Whitman goes down, Boushie goes down, and

739
00:44:50,160 --> 00:44:55,960
Speaker 2: we like, you know, we faltering right. Woodson comes back

740
00:44:56,719 --> 00:44:59,320
Speaker 2: and that's his first game and it's in Iowa City,

741
00:45:00,600 --> 00:45:04,480
Speaker 2: and this my freshman year and my whole my whole

742
00:45:04,920 --> 00:45:08,320
Speaker 2: time now, you know, playing for coach night. I'm waiting

743
00:45:08,320 --> 00:45:11,200
Speaker 2: for this genius moment, right, I'm waiting for him to

744
00:45:11,239 --> 00:45:14,440
Speaker 2: grab the clipboard, you know, and draw up some stuff.

745
00:45:15,040 --> 00:45:19,120
Speaker 2: And but I ain't seen no clipboard and like, you know,

746
00:45:20,719 --> 00:45:23,160
Speaker 2: I ain't seen the clipboard like since I got there. Right,

747
00:45:23,760 --> 00:45:28,080
Speaker 2: So we down, we down one in Iowa. It was

748
00:45:28,120 --> 00:45:32,800
Speaker 2: Whatdy's first game back, and and we called time out

749
00:45:33,040 --> 00:45:35,200
Speaker 2: and now I'm like, okay, this this is the moments

750
00:45:35,239 --> 00:45:37,719
Speaker 2: up gotta I got, I know, we getting ready to

751
00:45:37,760 --> 00:45:44,640
Speaker 2: draw up play now, right, this was the play he said, Whitson,

752
00:45:44,680 --> 00:45:47,920
Speaker 2: can you make a shot? Well, he said, yeah, I

753
00:45:48,000 --> 00:45:50,880
Speaker 2: knock it down. Coach he said. He called me pee Wee.

754
00:45:50,960 --> 00:45:54,120
Speaker 2: He said, okay, pee Wee, I want you to move

755
00:45:54,160 --> 00:45:56,719
Speaker 2: the ball around. October I want you to set a

756
00:45:56,719 --> 00:45:59,080
Speaker 2: screen for Woodson whitson. I want you to get open

757
00:45:59,600 --> 00:46:01,320
Speaker 2: pee wee. When he gets open, I want you to

758
00:46:01,360 --> 00:46:06,600
Speaker 2: hit it. Woody knocked the shot down. I'm like, on

759
00:46:06,680 --> 00:46:12,160
Speaker 2: the left side, the right side, Well, where where's what'son

760
00:46:12,280 --> 00:46:17,480
Speaker 2: gonna be? I'm scared. I'm like scared. I'm like walking

761
00:46:17,520 --> 00:46:20,120
Speaker 2: down on the floor. I'm like, okay, how we gonna

762
00:46:20,120 --> 00:46:22,200
Speaker 2: get the ball there? Right? He wants you to put

763
00:46:22,239 --> 00:46:26,200
Speaker 2: everybody in place. I'm like, hey man, just all I'm doing.

764
00:46:26,560 --> 00:46:28,960
Speaker 2: So I passed it and I run over there and

765
00:46:28,960 --> 00:46:32,280
Speaker 2: get it. And so I'm waiting for Woody to Woody

766
00:46:32,320 --> 00:46:35,399
Speaker 2: come off to over sets a downscreen. Whiston comes off

767
00:46:35,440 --> 00:46:39,400
Speaker 2: on the left side. I hit him boom and he

768
00:46:39,480 --> 00:46:42,080
Speaker 2: banks it right off the glass. And to me, that

769
00:46:42,200 --> 00:46:44,719
Speaker 2: was the most That was one of the most beautiful

770
00:46:44,760 --> 00:46:48,520
Speaker 2: moments I have experienced because what he recruited me. That

771
00:46:48,640 --> 00:46:51,520
Speaker 2: was my senior year. He had back surgery. You know,

772
00:46:51,560 --> 00:46:54,160
Speaker 2: he's coming back, you know, and so I was like, okay.

773
00:46:55,440 --> 00:46:59,120
Speaker 2: Second best moment was, you know, be North Carolina in

774
00:46:59,200 --> 00:47:03,280
Speaker 2: that final game. So two things happened in that game.

775
00:47:04,640 --> 00:47:07,960
Speaker 2: In the first half, North Carolina got out to a

776
00:47:08,000 --> 00:47:10,640
Speaker 2: good start, and I knew we didn't have the talent

777
00:47:11,320 --> 00:47:14,839
Speaker 2: to play with them right talent for talent, they were

778
00:47:14,880 --> 00:47:20,760
Speaker 2: better James Worthy Sam Perkins. I would that's they back line.

779
00:47:21,640 --> 00:47:24,840
Speaker 2: Worthy was a number one pick. I think Perkins was like,

780
00:47:25,200 --> 00:47:27,520
Speaker 2: you know, five or six, and I wild was like

781
00:47:27,680 --> 00:47:34,000
Speaker 2: ten or something. But North Carolina they played that platoon system,

782
00:47:34,480 --> 00:47:38,520
Speaker 2: so I was just they got up and I was like, Okay,

783
00:47:38,560 --> 00:47:41,360
Speaker 2: we just got a hold on fellas, cause five minutes

784
00:47:41,400 --> 00:47:44,960
Speaker 2: they're gonna take Worthy out. They're gonna take Worthy and

785
00:47:45,040 --> 00:47:48,120
Speaker 2: Perkins out. And when they took them out, so that's

786
00:47:48,160 --> 00:47:51,040
Speaker 2: when we was able to come back. But one of

787
00:47:51,080 --> 00:47:56,800
Speaker 2: the biggest plays I thought in that game clocks running down.

788
00:47:57,120 --> 00:48:00,120
Speaker 2: We got the last shot out of the half and

789
00:48:00,200 --> 00:48:03,520
Speaker 2: Whitman's in the in the in the right corner and

790
00:48:03,640 --> 00:48:06,919
Speaker 2: I'm standing there. We're, you know, I'm dribbling the ball,

791
00:48:07,040 --> 00:48:09,719
Speaker 2: trying to you know, make sure like everybody is set

792
00:48:09,840 --> 00:48:12,400
Speaker 2: doing what they're supposed to do, trying to start time

793
00:48:13,280 --> 00:48:17,279
Speaker 2: and women and I make eye contact, and you know,

794
00:48:17,600 --> 00:48:20,200
Speaker 2: we run the clock down, kick it over the Whitmen.

795
00:48:21,680 --> 00:48:24,399
Speaker 3: He knocks down the shot in the in.

796
00:48:24,320 --> 00:48:27,960
Speaker 2: The first half, they gave us crazy momentum going in

797
00:48:28,040 --> 00:48:30,160
Speaker 2: because I think we either went up one or was

798
00:48:30,200 --> 00:48:33,360
Speaker 2: down one. We come back out the third to start

799
00:48:33,400 --> 00:48:37,040
Speaker 2: the second half, and then I take over. So you

800
00:48:37,080 --> 00:48:39,560
Speaker 2: know that, But I thought that shot was one of

801
00:48:39,600 --> 00:48:41,080
Speaker 2: the biggest moments in the game.

802
00:48:41,200 --> 00:48:45,480
Speaker 4: Yeah, nineteen eighty one draft, you go number two overall

803
00:48:45,560 --> 00:48:48,120
Speaker 4: to the Pistons, probably the worst team in the league

804
00:48:48,120 --> 00:48:48,960
Speaker 4: before you got there.

805
00:48:49,920 --> 00:48:51,520
Speaker 5: Well, you knew what she was walking into though, right,

806
00:48:51,880 --> 00:48:52,480
Speaker 5: No I didn't.

807
00:48:52,520 --> 00:48:58,840
Speaker 1: You didn't, he said, No, I didn't.

808
00:48:59,200 --> 00:49:03,880
Speaker 2: I did. Now, you know, when you hear the worst team,

809
00:49:04,040 --> 00:49:07,520
Speaker 2: you know you.

810
00:49:05,960 --> 00:49:08,319
Speaker 3: You don't you have no idea what the worst team?

811
00:49:08,400 --> 00:49:08,759
Speaker 5: That's like?

812
00:49:08,880 --> 00:49:11,600
Speaker 3: You know what that really mean? Right you?

813
00:49:11,640 --> 00:49:19,319
Speaker 2: So, so there was no culture, there was no Now,

814
00:49:19,360 --> 00:49:23,279
Speaker 2: I come from every place I've been, I've won, right,

815
00:49:23,600 --> 00:49:29,640
Speaker 2: and and so there's rules, there's there's there's discipline, there's

816
00:49:29,640 --> 00:49:31,799
Speaker 2: a way of acting, there's a way of being, there's

817
00:49:31,840 --> 00:49:37,040
Speaker 2: a way of doing things, and and so when I

818
00:49:37,080 --> 00:49:42,279
Speaker 2: get to Detroit, those it was like what are we doing? Like,

819
00:49:42,840 --> 00:49:44,560
Speaker 2: how are we going to win? That's all I'm trying

820
00:49:44,560 --> 00:49:47,080
Speaker 2: to figure out is how are we going to win?

821
00:49:48,520 --> 00:49:52,040
Speaker 2: And so I had to go to school, right, and

822
00:49:52,400 --> 00:49:55,280
Speaker 2: where I went to school, I went to the Lakers school,

823
00:49:56,080 --> 00:49:58,880
Speaker 2: and I went to the Celtics school, so I started

824
00:49:58,880 --> 00:50:03,560
Speaker 2: following them around. Fortunately enough for me, Magic Johnson, who

825
00:50:03,600 --> 00:50:07,960
Speaker 2: had just come off winning the NBA Championship and being

826
00:50:08,000 --> 00:50:14,640
Speaker 2: the MVP of the championship game. Now he like, he's like,

827
00:50:14,680 --> 00:50:16,719
Speaker 2: come on, man, you with me? And I'm like, really,

828
00:50:16,719 --> 00:50:21,400
Speaker 2: I'm with you? Like yeah, So so now I'm watching

829
00:50:21,400 --> 00:50:26,320
Speaker 2: the Lakers. I'm watching him, and I'm watching how they train,

830
00:50:26,480 --> 00:50:30,640
Speaker 2: how they practice, how they come together. Kevin McHale and

831
00:50:30,680 --> 00:50:34,239
Speaker 2: I were friends, you know, since high school, played on

832
00:50:34,280 --> 00:50:37,160
Speaker 2: the PanAm team together. So now I get to you know,

833
00:50:37,320 --> 00:50:40,040
Speaker 2: I watch how Boston do things. mL Car you know,

834
00:50:40,160 --> 00:50:43,200
Speaker 2: still talk with him today, you know Maxwell. I mean,

835
00:50:43,440 --> 00:50:46,239
Speaker 2: so the Celtics and the Lakers really like, let me

836
00:50:46,440 --> 00:50:48,560
Speaker 2: like in the locker room. You look at all they

837
00:50:48,600 --> 00:50:53,120
Speaker 2: championship celebrations in the eighties. You'll see Isaiah Thomas in

838
00:50:53,200 --> 00:50:58,480
Speaker 2: them locker rooms watching them celebrate, right, you know, on

839
00:50:58,520 --> 00:51:02,080
Speaker 2: their exit meetings. I'm with Magic at the exit meetings,

840
00:51:02,440 --> 00:51:05,160
Speaker 2: you know when they lost to Boston in the room

841
00:51:05,160 --> 00:51:10,280
Speaker 2: with in the fucking room, right, I'm missing to pat Riley,

842
00:51:10,440 --> 00:51:12,799
Speaker 2: you know, give this thing. Jerry West, who's stilled my

843
00:51:12,880 --> 00:51:17,920
Speaker 2: man today, right, Jerry West. They let me in to

844
00:51:18,120 --> 00:51:22,440
Speaker 2: the the sanctuary. I was one of them, right, and

845
00:51:22,440 --> 00:51:27,279
Speaker 2: and so I learned and and so and learning. Not

846
00:51:27,400 --> 00:51:30,920
Speaker 2: only did it make me better, but I was able

847
00:51:31,000 --> 00:51:35,080
Speaker 2: to bring some things back to the Pistons in terms of, hey,

848
00:51:35,440 --> 00:51:38,400
Speaker 2: if we want to win in this league, this is

849
00:51:38,440 --> 00:51:41,960
Speaker 2: what it looks say that again, what it looked like, right,

850
00:51:42,760 --> 00:51:44,120
Speaker 2: because we had no idea.

851
00:51:44,280 --> 00:51:47,320
Speaker 3: So so it's like, okay, how.

852
00:51:47,200 --> 00:51:49,560
Speaker 2: Are you going to win in this league? You you

853
00:51:49,640 --> 00:51:52,560
Speaker 2: got to learn, You got to get educated, right, And

854
00:51:52,560 --> 00:51:56,200
Speaker 2: and they let me in. And so so I'm there

855
00:51:56,760 --> 00:52:00,920
Speaker 2: when Magic Johnson dribbled out the shot clock and they

856
00:52:01,000 --> 00:52:07,040
Speaker 2: calling him Tragic Johnson, right, And I'm in his hotel room,

857
00:52:08,080 --> 00:52:14,920
Speaker 2: me Mark and this dude laying on the floor balling,

858
00:52:15,120 --> 00:52:18,920
Speaker 2: I mean just hurt frying, uh you know, just you

859
00:52:18,920 --> 00:52:24,120
Speaker 2: know that kind of crying, right, And and we stayed

860
00:52:24,200 --> 00:52:27,279
Speaker 2: up with him until you know, bus was leaving at

861
00:52:27,280 --> 00:52:30,479
Speaker 2: five five thirty in the morning, and he just laying

862
00:52:30,520 --> 00:52:34,759
Speaker 2: on the floor, just balling. Right, Come down to escalate it,

863
00:52:35,120 --> 00:52:37,640
Speaker 2: get on the bus, go back to La So I

864
00:52:37,680 --> 00:52:40,080
Speaker 2: get a chance to watch all that. I get a

865
00:52:40,160 --> 00:52:43,719
Speaker 2: chance to see James Worthy, right, take the ball out

866
00:52:43,719 --> 00:52:49,120
Speaker 2: on the sideline and bound it. Gerald Henderson steals it, right,

867
00:52:49,239 --> 00:52:52,400
Speaker 2: he goes lazy. So I get to see all their heartbreak,

868
00:52:52,760 --> 00:52:56,279
Speaker 2: but also get to see that bounce back. I get

869
00:52:56,280 --> 00:53:01,480
Speaker 2: to see that bounce back. Right, and so with magic loss.

870
00:53:01,760 --> 00:53:06,080
Speaker 2: Right Now, that summer, we train and we're working out,

871
00:53:06,320 --> 00:53:09,319
Speaker 2: and that dude shot me with so many bulls, right,

872
00:53:09,640 --> 00:53:11,919
Speaker 2: and finally I just had to say, hey, look man,

873
00:53:12,120 --> 00:53:14,719
Speaker 2: I'm not Larry Bird. You gotta cut this shit out. Fuck.

874
00:53:17,239 --> 00:53:21,799
Speaker 2: But I mean he was training so hard and so

875
00:53:21,920 --> 00:53:24,840
Speaker 2: now Mark, and now we're going through all all stuff.

876
00:53:24,920 --> 00:53:31,959
Speaker 2: Right that summer, that dude shot maybe a thousand free

877
00:53:31,960 --> 00:53:36,799
Speaker 2: throws a day, and I'm like, right, are you.

878
00:53:36,760 --> 00:53:38,080
Speaker 3: So so many free throws?

879
00:53:38,120 --> 00:53:41,040
Speaker 2: Like come on, man, you know, work on your jump shot.

880
00:53:41,080 --> 00:53:45,120
Speaker 3: You know, we gotta get your j right now, that dude.

881
00:53:45,040 --> 00:53:50,560
Speaker 2: Went from being an eighty three eighty four percent jumped

882
00:53:50,600 --> 00:53:56,880
Speaker 2: to ninety. Wow, jumped to ninety percent from the fire line,

883
00:53:57,520 --> 00:54:02,680
Speaker 2: then became the MVP of the league.

884
00:54:01,480 --> 00:54:02,120
Speaker 3: You know what I mean.

885
00:54:02,200 --> 00:54:06,600
Speaker 2: So so watching that and learning that. So when you say,

886
00:54:06,800 --> 00:54:10,120
Speaker 2: now the Detroit Pistons, so we didn't have no culture,

887
00:54:10,800 --> 00:54:14,359
Speaker 2: So what did I do? Right, It's like Okay, this

888
00:54:14,400 --> 00:54:18,719
Speaker 2: is who we are. We need an identity. This is

889
00:54:18,760 --> 00:54:21,680
Speaker 2: who we're going to become. This is how we're gonna dress.

890
00:54:22,160 --> 00:54:24,359
Speaker 2: This is how we're gonna talk. This is how we're

891
00:54:24,360 --> 00:54:28,040
Speaker 2: gonna look right, and and then bringing some stuff from

892
00:54:28,080 --> 00:54:33,839
Speaker 2: the neighborhood. Right, you know that that that ten point program, right,

893
00:54:34,640 --> 00:54:37,240
Speaker 2: you know it's it's like we're gonna we're gonna still

894
00:54:37,320 --> 00:54:38,400
Speaker 2: listen to our teams.

895
00:54:38,520 --> 00:54:40,120
Speaker 3: Right, There's gonna be some rules.

896
00:54:40,160 --> 00:54:42,080
Speaker 2: This is how we're gonna follow this, how we're gonna act, This,

897
00:54:42,160 --> 00:54:45,399
Speaker 2: how we're gonna march, is how we're gonna be. This

898
00:54:45,480 --> 00:54:48,560
Speaker 2: is who we are in this NBA league and still today,

899
00:54:49,280 --> 00:54:50,160
Speaker 2: this is who we are.

900
00:54:50,440 --> 00:54:52,680
Speaker 3: This is what we do now.

901
00:54:54,160 --> 00:54:58,680
Speaker 2: If we didn't establish that that culture, that language, that

902
00:54:58,760 --> 00:55:03,719
Speaker 2: belief system, those values, you know, we we didn't have

903
00:55:03,840 --> 00:55:08,600
Speaker 2: the type of talent that La had. We didn't have

904
00:55:08,680 --> 00:55:11,480
Speaker 2: the type of talent that Boston had, but we had

905
00:55:11,520 --> 00:55:15,400
Speaker 2: a belief system that was so strong that this is

906
00:55:15,400 --> 00:55:21,880
Speaker 2: gonna mess you up when I say this. Bill Lambier

907
00:55:22,080 --> 00:55:28,160
Speaker 2: believed that he can compete every single night against Kareem

908
00:55:28,600 --> 00:55:33,080
Speaker 2: obture your boss a strong belief. Come on, work with me,

909
00:55:33,680 --> 00:55:36,359
Speaker 2: work with you think thinks about what I just said. Yeah,

910
00:55:36,560 --> 00:55:39,839
Speaker 2: think about what I just said. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean,

911
00:55:40,040 --> 00:55:47,400
Speaker 2: I mean it's like that that in itself, right, Lambbier

912
00:55:47,680 --> 00:55:51,960
Speaker 2: walking out on the floor with the belief in understanding

913
00:55:52,040 --> 00:55:56,000
Speaker 2: that number thirty three in purple or number thirty three

914
00:55:56,040 --> 00:55:57,560
Speaker 2: in gold.

915
00:55:57,800 --> 00:56:00,359
Speaker 3: If I do what I'm supposed to do, I can

916
00:56:00,400 --> 00:56:00,799
Speaker 3: beat you.

917
00:56:01,480 --> 00:56:01,919
Speaker 2: M hmm.

918
00:56:03,719 --> 00:56:05,400
Speaker 5: Nobody in the world would agree.

919
00:56:05,120 --> 00:56:12,279
Speaker 2: With him, and they didn't. They didn't that way. They

920
00:56:12,320 --> 00:56:14,719
Speaker 2: still don't believe it. I know. I'm just glad the

921
00:56:14,719 --> 00:56:16,439
Speaker 2: film Don't Lie, Film Don't Lie.

922
00:56:17,080 --> 00:56:19,480
Speaker 4: We just had Barkley on and Barkley was talking about

923
00:56:19,480 --> 00:56:22,920
Speaker 4: around the time you come there, how Bird Magic saved

924
00:56:22,920 --> 00:56:23,320
Speaker 4: the league.

925
00:56:23,320 --> 00:56:24,160
Speaker 5: Do you agree with that?

926
00:56:24,680 --> 00:56:26,279
Speaker 3: I think Bird and Magic.

927
00:56:28,200 --> 00:56:30,480
Speaker 2: Saved the league, and I think the league took off

928
00:56:30,520 --> 00:56:34,560
Speaker 2: when the Detroit Pistons showed up on the scene. I

929
00:56:34,600 --> 00:56:39,120
Speaker 2: think Bird and Magic. You know what the NBA was

930
00:56:39,120 --> 00:56:44,600
Speaker 2: coming out of in the seventies, and how the United

931
00:56:44,640 --> 00:56:46,879
Speaker 2: States was, I mean, we have to talk about that now,

932
00:56:47,200 --> 00:56:50,640
Speaker 2: how the United States was for black men in the seventies,

933
00:56:52,360 --> 00:56:56,160
Speaker 2: and then Bird and Magic being on the stage in

934
00:56:56,239 --> 00:57:00,200
Speaker 2: the early eighties coming out of college, and then you know,

935
00:57:00,640 --> 00:57:04,960
Speaker 2: playing that you know that game again, Magic come to

936
00:57:05,120 --> 00:57:09,160
Speaker 2: La Berg, going to Boston. You know, they walked into culture,

937
00:57:09,719 --> 00:57:13,000
Speaker 2: they walked into a foundation, they walked into a way

938
00:57:13,000 --> 00:57:15,799
Speaker 2: of being, they walked into winning. They didn't have to,

939
00:57:16,000 --> 00:57:17,880
Speaker 2: you know, get a piece of paper and go to

940
00:57:17,920 --> 00:57:21,720
Speaker 2: school and get educated. Right, they walked into it. Right now,

941
00:57:23,040 --> 00:57:27,760
Speaker 2: that help. But what the ratings say and what the

942
00:57:27,840 --> 00:57:32,440
Speaker 2: numbers say when the league took off is when the

943
00:57:32,560 --> 00:57:36,520
Speaker 2: bad boys from the Detroit Pistons showed up. Because we

944
00:57:36,560 --> 00:57:39,200
Speaker 2: showed up with a totally different kind of crowd.

945
00:57:40,120 --> 00:57:41,840
Speaker 3: We we had, you.

946
00:57:41,760 --> 00:57:46,040
Speaker 2: Know, people from all different walks of life, and we

947
00:57:46,120 --> 00:57:49,720
Speaker 2: started putting fifty sixty thousand people in the Silver Dome.

948
00:57:50,640 --> 00:57:54,040
Speaker 3: And then we had three rivalries.

949
00:57:54,120 --> 00:57:56,520
Speaker 2: I think we're the only team that only had three rivalries,

950
00:57:57,360 --> 00:58:01,440
Speaker 2: the Lakers, the Celtics, and the Bulls. Right, so every

951
00:58:01,480 --> 00:58:06,200
Speaker 2: time we played, everywhere we moved, right, it was it

952
00:58:06,320 --> 00:58:10,120
Speaker 2: was different. And then we didn't understand, well, we didn't know.

953
00:58:11,760 --> 00:58:13,439
Speaker 2: So we met a gentleman by the name of Mike

954
00:58:13,560 --> 00:58:17,320
Speaker 2: Ornstein with the La Raiders or the Oakland Raiders at

955
00:58:17,320 --> 00:58:23,040
Speaker 2: that time what they call cross marketing today, We didn't

956
00:58:23,040 --> 00:58:25,760
Speaker 2: know there was such a term as cross marketing. But

957
00:58:25,880 --> 00:58:30,600
Speaker 2: all connection with the Oakland Raiders. Then let us start

958
00:58:30,720 --> 00:58:34,120
Speaker 2: changing all colors. So we went from the red, white

959
00:58:34,120 --> 00:58:36,960
Speaker 2: and blue to the silver and black, and then we

960
00:58:37,040 --> 00:58:41,800
Speaker 2: had a second jersey, We had a second uniform, you know,

961
00:58:41,920 --> 00:58:45,840
Speaker 2: and the NBA really didn't own any of that. So

962
00:58:45,920 --> 00:58:48,320
Speaker 2: when we walked off the stage and the Bulls walked

963
00:58:48,320 --> 00:58:51,040
Speaker 2: on the stage, that's when y'all got the shooting jerseys.

964
00:58:51,080 --> 00:58:53,920
Speaker 2: That's when they started changing, you know, the different colored

965
00:58:53,960 --> 00:58:57,240
Speaker 2: uniforms and everything else. But the Pistons started all that.

966
00:58:57,720 --> 00:59:01,600
Speaker 2: So the highest rate of games in the eighties Pistons

967
00:59:01,600 --> 00:59:07,720
Speaker 2: against Celtics, Pistons against Lakers, Pistons against Bulls, and they

968
00:59:07,760 --> 00:59:12,240
Speaker 2: all have one thing in common. That's a Detroit Pistons set,

969
00:59:12,240 --> 00:59:16,160
Speaker 2: attitude and energy. Y'all brough first NBA game thirty one

970
00:59:16,200 --> 00:59:19,840
Speaker 2: and eleven. Who crazy? First game thirty one eleven? Geez,

971
00:59:21,160 --> 00:59:23,080
Speaker 2: you make the All Star Game as your rookie year too,

972
00:59:23,240 --> 00:59:25,520
Speaker 2: clearly the leader of your team. Did that come to

973
00:59:25,520 --> 00:59:27,800
Speaker 2: you naturally or like when you when you showed up

974
00:59:27,800 --> 00:59:28,640
Speaker 2: they knew you was leader?

975
00:59:28,720 --> 00:59:29,800
Speaker 5: Or did you have to fight for that?

976
00:59:30,520 --> 00:59:34,480
Speaker 2: I never thought of myself as the leader. I never

977
00:59:34,520 --> 00:59:42,080
Speaker 2: thought of myself as the captain. It's you know, leadership

978
00:59:42,760 --> 00:59:45,360
Speaker 2: is given. You never walk into a room and be like,

979
00:59:45,400 --> 00:59:46,280
Speaker 2: I'm the leader.

980
00:59:46,440 --> 00:59:46,760
Speaker 3: You know it.

981
00:59:47,360 --> 00:59:49,360
Speaker 2: They vote on it. You know who's going to be

982
00:59:49,400 --> 00:59:53,560
Speaker 2: the captain. Okay, you can be the captain. And I

983
00:59:53,760 --> 00:59:58,520
Speaker 2: was selected the captain and the leader only because they

984
00:59:58,520 --> 01:00:03,680
Speaker 2: trust me, right, and and that type of trust is earned,

985
01:00:03,720 --> 01:00:07,360
Speaker 2: and then you have to honor it too. Like that means, yeah,

986
01:00:07,400 --> 01:00:10,480
Speaker 2: that means you can't go out when everybody else is

987
01:00:10,520 --> 01:00:13,120
Speaker 2: going out there, right, you can't. I mean I don't

988
01:00:13,120 --> 01:00:13,919
Speaker 2: know I meant that much.

989
01:00:14,400 --> 01:00:15,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, you can't.

990
01:00:15,120 --> 01:00:17,200
Speaker 2: You can't do the things everybody else is doing it

991
01:00:17,400 --> 01:00:19,800
Speaker 2: because you know that there's a certain amount of trust

992
01:00:19,840 --> 01:00:24,080
Speaker 2: and respect that goes along with that. So that that

993
01:00:24,240 --> 01:00:28,200
Speaker 2: first game against Milwaukee, I'm playing against you know, not

994
01:00:28,400 --> 01:00:30,640
Speaker 2: Quinn Buckner. I'm playing against him. It's my first time

995
01:00:30,720 --> 01:00:33,240
Speaker 2: playing against him. You know that dude was just in

996
01:00:33,320 --> 01:00:37,320
Speaker 2: my house. He went undefeated. He went undefeated in high

997
01:00:37,360 --> 01:00:41,840
Speaker 2: school and undefeated in college. Still the last undefeated team

998
01:00:42,040 --> 01:00:45,920
Speaker 2: right now. I'm playing against him and he like, hey, junior,

999
01:00:45,960 --> 01:00:48,040
Speaker 2: how you doing. I'm like, oh, this is gonna be

1000
01:00:48,080 --> 01:00:53,080
Speaker 2: a bad night, right, And and so I remember like

1001
01:00:53,160 --> 01:00:57,040
Speaker 2: the first two three plays, I get buy them and

1002
01:00:57,120 --> 01:00:59,000
Speaker 2: I go down the lane. I go down the lane

1003
01:00:59,320 --> 01:01:02,080
Speaker 2: and make a layup, come back down the lane again,

1004
01:01:02,160 --> 01:01:04,480
Speaker 2: and Bob Lanier literally.

1005
01:01:05,760 --> 01:01:06,920
Speaker 3: I'm up in the air like.

1006
01:01:06,880 --> 01:01:11,640
Speaker 2: This, and he goes, caught you in the air, caught

1007
01:01:11,680 --> 01:01:15,720
Speaker 2: me in the air and set me down and said, look,

1008
01:01:16,760 --> 01:01:21,320
Speaker 2: don't come down here no more. I was like, Okay,

1009
01:01:22,120 --> 01:01:28,400
Speaker 2: my jump shot got real good because when he because

1010
01:01:28,400 --> 01:01:30,240
Speaker 2: when he called me, it wasn't you know, when them

1011
01:01:30,280 --> 01:01:33,640
Speaker 2: guys hit you right, It wasn't like a gentle womb,

1012
01:01:33,760 --> 01:01:36,880
Speaker 2: you know. It was like and they put that force

1013
01:01:36,960 --> 01:01:41,840
Speaker 2: behind him, and yeah, you feel that, right, dude? Set

1014
01:01:41,880 --> 01:01:44,720
Speaker 2: me down, man, And you know, but I had a

1015
01:01:44,720 --> 01:01:47,080
Speaker 2: good game that night, but I was looking forward to

1016
01:01:47,200 --> 01:01:49,920
Speaker 2: the next night. See you're talking about that thirty one

1017
01:01:49,960 --> 01:01:53,080
Speaker 2: and eleven the next night. Then we come home to

1018
01:01:53,120 --> 01:01:57,200
Speaker 2: play the Chicago Bulls and I dropped thirty in that game.

1019
01:01:58,000 --> 01:02:00,800
Speaker 3: Now that's the game that I really like, because.

1020
01:02:00,520 --> 01:02:04,120
Speaker 2: Not all my boys, everybody else, I mean everybody there.

1021
01:02:04,200 --> 01:02:05,360
Speaker 3: You know Red Magic.

1022
01:02:06,040 --> 01:02:08,840
Speaker 1: That trip from Chicago to Boston. How long is that trip?

1023
01:02:09,120 --> 01:02:12,600
Speaker 1: Bus her car from Chicago to Detroit. Excuse that.

1024
01:02:14,360 --> 01:02:16,240
Speaker 3: It's four hours and it's three and a half.

1025
01:02:17,800 --> 01:02:22,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, Jack can get there. Three yeah, yeah, so straight

1026
01:02:22,160 --> 01:02:26,040
Speaker 2: down ninety four. So now you know, we go to Chicago,

1027
01:02:26,480 --> 01:02:30,240
Speaker 2: like I say, Red Magic One. All my brothers nim there,

1028
01:02:30,680 --> 01:02:33,080
Speaker 2: you know, all I mean everybody up in the stands.

1029
01:02:33,080 --> 01:02:35,960
Speaker 2: You know, my my mom and my my aunt. Like

1030
01:02:36,000 --> 01:02:39,720
Speaker 2: back then they didn't have them, the metal detectors. So

1031
01:02:39,760 --> 01:02:43,200
Speaker 2: my mom she believed in the second Amendment. Now she.

1032
01:02:47,440 --> 01:02:49,960
Speaker 3: Yeah, and my aunt got a switch blade.

1033
01:02:50,000 --> 01:02:53,600
Speaker 2: She carried a switch blade. And you and and I

1034
01:02:53,640 --> 01:02:56,640
Speaker 2: don't know people remember this, but you know, like she

1035
01:02:56,640 --> 01:02:58,840
Speaker 2: would be sitting there talking, right, and you remember trick.

1036
01:02:58,960 --> 01:03:01,560
Speaker 2: They could do tricks with their switch plade, you know,

1037
01:03:01,760 --> 01:03:03,800
Speaker 2: and she likes, you know, be talking to you and

1038
01:03:03,880 --> 01:03:08,240
Speaker 2: like troiling it all around and nice with it and

1039
01:03:08,280 --> 01:03:09,560
Speaker 2: close it up on you when they finished.

1040
01:03:10,160 --> 01:03:11,800
Speaker 3: And so they would bring food to the game.

1041
01:03:11,920 --> 01:03:14,960
Speaker 2: So they bringing their chicken and everything, and you know,

1042
01:03:15,080 --> 01:03:19,920
Speaker 2: and so and I'll never forget so we Ricky Sobers

1043
01:03:20,120 --> 01:03:24,800
Speaker 2: was the guard then one number fourteen Tcky Sobers play

1044
01:03:24,880 --> 01:03:30,040
Speaker 2: at UNLV right and and so we you know, I'm

1045
01:03:30,080 --> 01:03:32,480
Speaker 2: going through my stuff. I went between my legs and

1046
01:03:32,520 --> 01:03:37,160
Speaker 2: that dude like hit me so hard, damn right, you know,

1047
01:03:37,480 --> 01:03:40,000
Speaker 2: I folded up right because back then, you know, they

1048
01:03:40,000 --> 01:03:41,840
Speaker 2: didn't like when you try to show them off. Like

1049
01:03:41,920 --> 01:03:44,240
Speaker 2: now you can just go through your legs and everything

1050
01:03:44,240 --> 01:03:46,440
Speaker 2: else for a long time. Like then they're standing up

1051
01:03:46,720 --> 01:03:51,360
Speaker 2: and so I say, hey, man, don't hit me like

1052
01:03:51,400 --> 01:03:54,520
Speaker 2: that no more. You know what you're gonna do a

1053
01:03:54,560 --> 01:03:58,120
Speaker 2: little punk? I said, okay, And so you see all

1054
01:03:58,160 --> 01:04:03,240
Speaker 2: them people sitting up there, so you live here, So

1055
01:04:03,400 --> 01:04:05,880
Speaker 2: you hit me like that one more time, you won't

1056
01:04:05,880 --> 01:04:13,720
Speaker 2: live here no more. Straight up. That's simple. And you

1057
01:04:13,760 --> 01:04:20,880
Speaker 2: know we had a good game, you know, whin yeah,

1058
01:04:18,280 --> 01:04:19,040
Speaker 2: I up.

1059
01:04:21,040 --> 01:04:23,120
Speaker 1: The your Jordan INSS League at the time. The East

1060
01:04:23,120 --> 01:04:29,400
Speaker 1: has loaded yourself, m J Bird, Dominique, Moses Malone, Charles Barkley,

1061
01:04:29,480 --> 01:04:33,680
Speaker 1: doctor J. What was the Eastern Conference back in the

1062
01:04:33,720 --> 01:04:35,640
Speaker 1: middle of the eighties, Like every night.

1063
01:04:35,880 --> 01:04:37,840
Speaker 2: You see, I just took a simple war. It's all

1064
01:04:37,880 --> 01:04:41,080
Speaker 2: them names you just named off. I'm like Chevy, I'm

1065
01:04:41,120 --> 01:04:45,439
Speaker 2: sweating now. Like man, Philadelphia was so good back then,

1066
01:04:49,520 --> 01:04:55,080
Speaker 2: Mo Cheeks, Andrew Tony, doctor J, Moses Malone, Bobby Jones.

1067
01:04:55,720 --> 01:04:58,200
Speaker 2: They don't get enough credit for what they was doing

1068
01:04:58,720 --> 01:05:00,760
Speaker 2: in the eighties. Back then. I mean that team was

1069
01:05:00,840 --> 01:05:04,400
Speaker 2: good and then it got Barkley, right, it just unfair, right,

1070
01:05:05,480 --> 01:05:10,800
Speaker 2: Bird McHale Parish, you know, Milwaukee, that Milwaukee team was

1071
01:05:11,120 --> 01:05:14,600
Speaker 2: loaded with Marcus Johnson and all them, so we you know,

1072
01:05:14,680 --> 01:05:17,680
Speaker 2: it was it was hell, you know up in there.

1073
01:05:19,120 --> 01:05:25,000
Speaker 2: But what what we had and what we were developing

1074
01:05:26,240 --> 01:05:30,600
Speaker 2: was different than all the other teams, right, all those

1075
01:05:30,600 --> 01:05:37,520
Speaker 2: teams you just named. What we was developing was identity, culture,

1076
01:05:38,320 --> 01:05:46,160
Speaker 2: belief systems. You know, understand and you know those you know,

1077
01:05:47,040 --> 01:05:49,080
Speaker 2: those things that you carry with you for the rest

1078
01:05:49,080 --> 01:05:52,200
Speaker 2: of your life. Right, that's what we was building as

1079
01:05:52,240 --> 01:05:56,920
Speaker 2: a team. And talent wise, all those people that you

1080
01:05:57,040 --> 01:06:00,200
Speaker 2: just named, we didn't have that kind of talent. But

1081
01:06:00,320 --> 01:06:04,240
Speaker 2: what we could do is we could outscheme you and

1082
01:06:04,840 --> 01:06:08,480
Speaker 2: we can adhere to a game plan and concentrate and

1083
01:06:08,520 --> 01:06:11,400
Speaker 2: do it for two and a half hours. Most teams,

1084
01:06:11,400 --> 01:06:13,840
Speaker 2: most players, they can't. They can't concentrate for two and

1085
01:06:13,840 --> 01:06:18,320
Speaker 2: a half hours. And so when when Jordan came in,

1086
01:06:18,920 --> 01:06:24,280
Speaker 2: you know in eighty four eighty five, right, you know,

1087
01:06:24,400 --> 01:06:29,600
Speaker 2: he was mega talented, and not only was he mega talented,

1088
01:06:29,680 --> 01:06:33,040
Speaker 2: but we we had never seen an athlete like that.

1089
01:06:33,240 --> 01:06:36,280
Speaker 2: You got to remember, like in the NBA at that time,

1090
01:06:37,120 --> 01:06:41,480
Speaker 2: you know, doctor j still was the best athlete. And

1091
01:06:41,520 --> 01:06:45,400
Speaker 2: when Jordan came in younger than doctor J, I was like, Okay,

1092
01:06:45,440 --> 01:06:50,560
Speaker 2: he's the next doctor j And you know why nobody

1093
01:06:50,640 --> 01:06:53,360
Speaker 2: jumping from the fire line and hanging in the air

1094
01:06:53,520 --> 01:06:56,520
Speaker 2: and doing all the stuff around the rim that he

1095
01:06:56,640 --> 01:07:00,920
Speaker 2: was doing. Nobody, you didn't have athletes like that, So

1096
01:07:01,720 --> 01:07:05,360
Speaker 2: he was. He was a fascinating watch. So do Bars

1097
01:07:05,400 --> 01:07:07,720
Speaker 2: and that, right, you know, we were we would be

1098
01:07:07,840 --> 01:07:13,240
Speaker 2: I'll never forget every time Chicago played, you know, Joe

1099
01:07:13,280 --> 01:07:16,080
Speaker 2: and I would be on the phone and and we'd

1100
01:07:16,080 --> 01:07:18,280
Speaker 2: be talking because we gotta we got to play against him, right,

1101
01:07:19,640 --> 01:07:26,120
Speaker 2: And they were playing New Jersey in Chicago, and Joe

1102
01:07:26,120 --> 01:07:30,280
Speaker 2: and I, you know, we were talking and and Jordan

1103
01:07:30,400 --> 01:07:33,040
Speaker 2: came down on the left side, caught on the left wing,

1104
01:07:34,480 --> 01:07:37,760
Speaker 2: went through a couple of dribbles, and then he took

1105
01:07:37,840 --> 01:07:39,440
Speaker 2: off on.

1106
01:07:39,480 --> 01:07:46,040
Speaker 3: The left box. That dude floated all the way to

1107
01:07:46,120 --> 01:07:46,680
Speaker 3: the right.

1108
01:07:46,560 --> 01:07:52,480
Speaker 2: Box and then laid it up on the other side.

1109
01:07:53,480 --> 01:07:55,480
Speaker 2: And that's where to god, Joe and I on the

1110
01:07:55,560 --> 01:07:58,600
Speaker 2: phone and for about five minutes, man, it was just

1111
01:07:58,760 --> 01:08:04,480
Speaker 2: dead silence, silent. Did we just see Yeah? And then

1112
01:08:04,600 --> 01:08:12,360
Speaker 2: all I'm saying it was like practice tomorrow we got

1113
01:08:12,360 --> 01:08:13,280
Speaker 2: to deal with I mean.

1114
01:08:13,200 --> 01:08:15,960
Speaker 3: That dude jumped from the left box.

1115
01:08:17,200 --> 01:08:19,200
Speaker 2: And was up in the air and went all the

1116
01:08:19,240 --> 01:08:22,320
Speaker 2: way over to the right box and laid it up.

1117
01:08:22,880 --> 01:08:23,439
Speaker 2: It was like.

1118
01:08:27,760 --> 01:08:30,320
Speaker 1: We had Magic on the show at the end of

1119
01:08:30,320 --> 01:08:37,479
Speaker 1: December and your name came up, and Magic was talking

1120
01:08:37,479 --> 01:08:40,080
Speaker 1: about what you and him went through and how you

1121
01:08:40,080 --> 01:08:42,599
Speaker 1: guys were able to sit down and patch.

1122
01:08:42,400 --> 01:08:44,640
Speaker 5: It up, which is beautiful, by the way, Thank you.

1123
01:08:45,560 --> 01:08:48,040
Speaker 1: Everyone was big fans of that. But he also said

1124
01:08:48,560 --> 01:08:51,280
Speaker 1: he would like to see you and Mike patch it up.

1125
01:08:51,960 --> 01:08:54,680
Speaker 1: You called me after that and we had a conversation

1126
01:08:54,760 --> 01:08:57,439
Speaker 1: on the phone about what was going to care to

1127
01:08:57,479 --> 01:08:58,320
Speaker 1: share any of that?

1128
01:08:58,960 --> 01:09:01,559
Speaker 3: Man, You know, I just want some people to be honest.

1129
01:09:02,160 --> 01:09:04,640
Speaker 2: I got I got no problem sitting down talking with

1130
01:09:04,720 --> 01:09:09,760
Speaker 2: anybody right. And as you can see, you know I I'm.

1131
01:09:09,600 --> 01:09:10,280
Speaker 5: Your open book.

1132
01:09:11,080 --> 01:09:13,040
Speaker 3: You know I live with love.

1133
01:09:13,400 --> 01:09:18,519
Speaker 2: Peace, truth, you know, honesty, courage, I'm you know, I

1134
01:09:18,560 --> 01:09:19,479
Speaker 2: stand on my square.

1135
01:09:19,520 --> 01:09:20,240
Speaker 3: I'm upright.

1136
01:09:20,439 --> 01:09:23,519
Speaker 2: You know, I'm independent, and I sit in any chair

1137
01:09:23,520 --> 01:09:26,160
Speaker 2: and I talk to anybody right. But some people don't.

1138
01:09:26,320 --> 01:09:34,720
Speaker 2: They ain't been telling the truth right now anywhere, anytime publicly.

1139
01:09:35,560 --> 01:09:39,920
Speaker 2: I don't don't call me behind the scenes, apologizing or

1140
01:09:40,120 --> 01:09:44,160
Speaker 2: asking your friends to apologize. Right, you got on national

1141
01:09:44,160 --> 01:09:48,600
Speaker 2: television and you call me an asshole, and then you

1142
01:09:48,600 --> 01:09:49,599
Speaker 2: said you hated me.

1143
01:09:50,360 --> 01:09:51,960
Speaker 3: You said that on national television.

1144
01:09:53,760 --> 01:09:56,960
Speaker 2: Now if you didn't mean it, get on national television

1145
01:09:57,520 --> 01:10:00,000
Speaker 2: say that and apologize for it. Now if you miss

1146
01:10:01,520 --> 01:10:06,880
Speaker 2: let it ride as it is. But so I called

1147
01:10:06,920 --> 01:10:10,400
Speaker 2: you in that same day. You know who I call.

1148
01:10:11,080 --> 01:10:17,720
Speaker 2: I call Magic Johnson. Magic was on the plane. There

1149
01:10:17,760 --> 01:10:22,160
Speaker 2: was shooting commercial in Atlanta. Him, Sam Jackson, everybody else

1150
01:10:23,040 --> 01:10:26,840
Speaker 2: we were standing in the Four Seasons Hotel. We missed

1151
01:10:26,880 --> 01:10:31,880
Speaker 2: each other, right because he said he had to go,

1152
01:10:31,960 --> 01:10:34,160
Speaker 2: so he on the plane, right. I called him up.

1153
01:10:35,200 --> 01:10:40,120
Speaker 2: Magic didn't mention Michael Jordan. All right, So I'm still waiting.

1154
01:10:40,240 --> 01:10:42,479
Speaker 2: You know, everybody say this stuff publicly, right, Hey, I'm

1155
01:10:42,479 --> 01:10:44,599
Speaker 2: gonna do this. I'm gonna do this some this all right. Well,

1156
01:10:44,720 --> 01:10:48,719
Speaker 2: I'm the type of guy. I sit here, I talked

1157
01:10:48,720 --> 01:10:51,479
Speaker 2: to you, I talk to you. It ain't a person

1158
01:10:51,800 --> 01:10:56,240
Speaker 2: in this United States of America that I'm not willing

1159
01:10:56,280 --> 01:10:58,880
Speaker 2: to sit down and have a conversation with and break

1160
01:10:58,920 --> 01:11:03,920
Speaker 2: bread with. But if you line and throwing stones from

1161
01:11:03,920 --> 01:11:10,080
Speaker 2: behind the scenes, okay, that's you. But if you honest

1162
01:11:10,920 --> 01:11:14,519
Speaker 2: and you upright on your square, I'm willing to deal with. Yeah.

1163
01:11:15,360 --> 01:11:15,880
Speaker 2: You know, so.

1164
01:11:17,880 --> 01:11:23,360
Speaker 3: That's all I know. Now where do we go from here?

1165
01:11:25,160 --> 01:11:26,519
Speaker 1: I mean, you told me something to mean you have

1166
01:11:26,600 --> 01:11:28,320
Speaker 1: family that had stayed with him, and say at one.

1167
01:11:28,160 --> 01:11:32,160
Speaker 2: Point absolutely eight when when Jordan first came to Chicago.

1168
01:11:35,120 --> 01:11:40,439
Speaker 2: First of all, we were fans of his and to

1169
01:11:40,520 --> 01:11:49,879
Speaker 2: some extent still fans of his. My family, his family.

1170
01:11:51,120 --> 01:11:56,880
Speaker 2: Not only did they socialize, hang out, but as I said,

1171
01:11:56,960 --> 01:12:01,479
Speaker 2: you know, I I had a little nephew that lived

1172
01:12:01,479 --> 01:12:07,280
Speaker 2: with him, and and everybody's still cool, right, Ain't no,

1173
01:12:08,080 --> 01:12:12,960
Speaker 2: ain't no hate for Jordan. We just want some realness, right,

1174
01:12:13,479 --> 01:12:15,280
Speaker 2: just you know, like I said, you you got on

1175
01:12:15,360 --> 01:12:20,280
Speaker 2: national television and ain't nobody, ain't nobody nowhere has ever

1176
01:12:20,320 --> 01:12:26,519
Speaker 2: got on national television and called me an asshole and

1177
01:12:26,560 --> 01:12:29,559
Speaker 2: then publicly said you hate me. I ain't heard that

1178
01:12:29,600 --> 01:12:31,679
Speaker 2: from you. I ain't heard that from you. I ain't

1179
01:12:31,720 --> 01:12:37,519
Speaker 2: heard that from no NBA player. And so I'm and

1180
01:12:37,560 --> 01:12:41,360
Speaker 2: by the way, all them years that you supposedly hated me,

1181
01:12:43,080 --> 01:12:45,439
Speaker 2: you voted for me to be the president of your union.

1182
01:12:46,920 --> 01:12:49,680
Speaker 4: Yeah, you know, I've seen a lot of pictures of

1183
01:12:49,840 --> 01:12:51,960
Speaker 4: All Star Games and y'all laughing a joke and it

1184
01:12:51,960 --> 01:12:52,880
Speaker 4: didn't look like, hey.

1185
01:12:52,880 --> 01:12:55,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm just saying like, you know, if that you

1186
01:12:55,360 --> 01:12:59,439
Speaker 2: know now now maybe you felt like that privately and

1187
01:12:59,479 --> 01:13:05,519
Speaker 2: I didn't know, but now that I do know. And

1188
01:13:05,520 --> 01:13:07,400
Speaker 2: by the way, if you didn't mean it that way,

1189
01:13:08,600 --> 01:13:13,400
Speaker 2: then publicly say it. Don't privately say it. You know, magic,

1190
01:13:13,520 --> 01:13:18,400
Speaker 2: we don't need a private conversation. This man did this

1191
01:13:18,439 --> 01:13:21,960
Speaker 2: on national television internationally. I have to answer this question

1192
01:13:22,720 --> 01:13:25,240
Speaker 2: right in every interview that I sit down and do

1193
01:13:25,880 --> 01:13:30,920
Speaker 2: you asking me this question right? So now now I'm

1194
01:13:30,960 --> 01:13:33,479
Speaker 2: the one who's looking like, oh, why are you talking

1195
01:13:33,479 --> 01:13:35,920
Speaker 2: about Jordan? Why are you saying it? When you to

1196
01:13:35,960 --> 01:13:39,479
Speaker 2: put that out there? And now you at home or

1197
01:13:39,520 --> 01:13:42,519
Speaker 2: on your golf course or doing whatever you do, and

1198
01:13:42,560 --> 01:13:45,479
Speaker 2: now I got to answer this BS question. So if

1199
01:13:45,520 --> 01:13:50,599
Speaker 2: you mad enough, and you and you and you, if

1200
01:13:50,680 --> 01:13:54,200
Speaker 2: you meant it, leave it as it is. But if

1201
01:13:54,200 --> 01:13:56,920
Speaker 2: you didn't mean it, then come out and clean it

1202
01:13:57,000 --> 01:13:59,519
Speaker 2: up the same way it came out, same way it

1203
01:13:59,560 --> 01:14:01,600
Speaker 2: came out with the same intensity.

1204
01:14:01,640 --> 01:14:02,760
Speaker 5: You gotta respect that though.

1205
01:14:03,720 --> 01:14:04,640
Speaker 2: That's why I stay that.

1206
01:14:05,720 --> 01:14:07,120
Speaker 4: I mean because if the shoe was on the foot,

1207
01:14:07,120 --> 01:14:09,040
Speaker 4: I know I've been disrespected a lot of if somebody

1208
01:14:09,040 --> 01:14:11,920
Speaker 4: disrespected me on TV during the game, but also at

1209
01:14:11,920 --> 01:14:12,920
Speaker 4: the end of the game, they decided.

1210
01:14:13,120 --> 01:14:14,479
Speaker 5: You know what, I remember, I said that, let me

1211
01:14:14,479 --> 01:14:14,960
Speaker 5: clear this up.

1212
01:14:14,960 --> 01:14:17,040
Speaker 4: If we get off air, I gotta respect that.

1213
01:14:17,200 --> 01:14:17,840
Speaker 5: I can't hold it.

1214
01:14:17,880 --> 01:14:19,240
Speaker 4: I can't be mad at him no more because he

1215
01:14:19,280 --> 01:14:20,080
Speaker 4: corrected himself.

1216
01:14:21,120 --> 01:14:24,200
Speaker 2: Now you you you said, Magic and I sat down

1217
01:14:24,840 --> 01:14:30,280
Speaker 2: and squashed whatever we had publicly publicly. Magic Johnson apologized.

1218
01:14:30,320 --> 01:14:34,479
Speaker 2: He said, I'm sorry if I hurt you. When I

1219
01:14:34,560 --> 01:14:39,920
Speaker 2: hurt you, I didn't mean that. I'm good with that. Yeah,

1220
01:14:40,320 --> 01:14:43,400
Speaker 2: I gotta accept that and we move on. But if

1221
01:14:43,400 --> 01:14:47,440
Speaker 2: you're gonna let this linger out here in this basketball

1222
01:14:47,520 --> 01:14:52,240
Speaker 2: world and you got everybody else talking, but you ain't

1223
01:14:52,240 --> 01:14:56,479
Speaker 2: saying nothing. Now, if you meant it, stand on it,

1224
01:14:56,640 --> 01:14:57,240
Speaker 2: stand on it.

1225
01:14:57,920 --> 01:14:59,840
Speaker 3: But if you didn't mean it, clean it up.

1226
01:15:01,479 --> 01:15:04,760
Speaker 1: You mentioned, Uh, you know, obviously there's no secret that

1227
01:15:04,800 --> 01:15:08,120
Speaker 1: you and Magic were best of friends at one point,

1228
01:15:08,240 --> 01:15:10,320
Speaker 1: And what did it mean to you, to you guys

1229
01:15:10,280 --> 01:15:12,479
Speaker 1: to be able to sit down and clear that air.

1230
01:15:12,520 --> 01:15:15,439
Speaker 2: For you, it meant a lot, not only to me,

1231
01:15:15,600 --> 01:15:18,920
Speaker 2: but we didn't know, and I didn't know how much

1232
01:15:18,920 --> 01:15:21,200
Speaker 2: it would mean to all of us, to the world.

1233
01:15:21,240 --> 01:15:24,439
Speaker 2: I had no idea, you know, because when you when

1234
01:15:24,479 --> 01:15:27,800
Speaker 2: you're going through that, you're just thinking about yourself. You're

1235
01:15:27,840 --> 01:15:31,160
Speaker 2: not thinking about really how it's affecting other people. And

1236
01:15:31,200 --> 01:15:33,439
Speaker 2: I just had the same thing happened with Karl Malone

1237
01:15:33,520 --> 01:15:37,479
Speaker 2: and I. Right, and by way, thank you Ken, you

1238
01:15:38,120 --> 01:15:45,519
Speaker 2: let you sacking off strong, But you don't realize what

1239
01:15:45,680 --> 01:15:51,120
Speaker 2: the other person is carrying. Right, You're feeling, you know,

1240
01:15:51,640 --> 01:15:56,040
Speaker 2: yourself and your grief and you're hurt, right, But the

1241
01:15:56,120 --> 01:16:01,439
Speaker 2: other person who's carrying that guilt, when you have the

1242
01:16:01,560 --> 01:16:07,120
Speaker 2: opportunity and you can relieve them of that, not knowing

1243
01:16:07,160 --> 01:16:09,000
Speaker 2: that that's how much they carrying.

1244
01:16:09,439 --> 01:16:09,639
Speaker 5: Right.

1245
01:16:10,280 --> 01:16:12,960
Speaker 2: That that that was a powerful moment not only for

1246
01:16:13,080 --> 01:16:16,040
Speaker 2: he and I, but it was a powerful moment for

1247
01:16:16,080 --> 01:16:19,240
Speaker 2: the world, which we didn't know. So it's like two

1248
01:16:19,280 --> 01:16:22,240
Speaker 2: moments we've had that we didn't realize what we was

1249
01:16:22,280 --> 01:16:25,200
Speaker 2: really doing. That ended up changing a lot of stuff.

1250
01:16:26,000 --> 01:16:30,200
Speaker 2: Like when he and I like first hugged and kissed, right, ah,

1251
01:16:30,840 --> 01:16:34,760
Speaker 2: oh you know what the they it's like I can't

1252
01:16:34,800 --> 01:16:37,760
Speaker 2: I can't meet my brother and give him a handshake.

1253
01:16:38,280 --> 01:16:41,240
Speaker 2: Whenever I met family, it was always an embrace, right,

1254
01:16:42,320 --> 01:16:47,320
Speaker 2: when we did that in the eighties, two men, right,

1255
01:16:47,600 --> 01:16:51,240
Speaker 2: black masculinity, you know, and being called in a question

1256
01:16:51,320 --> 01:16:53,800
Speaker 2: you're not supposed to you know, you're supposed to have this,

1257
01:16:54,160 --> 01:16:56,360
Speaker 2: you know, this toughness about you and all this stuff.

1258
01:16:57,320 --> 01:16:57,880
Speaker 3: Well, when we.

1259
01:16:57,880 --> 01:17:01,080
Speaker 2: Broke down that barrier, we didn't realize what we had

1260
01:17:01,120 --> 01:17:05,519
Speaker 2: really done. Now when we saw each other today, first

1261
01:17:05,560 --> 01:17:06,640
Speaker 2: thing we did we hug you.

1262
01:17:06,680 --> 01:17:08,240
Speaker 5: I can wait to hug you when I see you.

1263
01:17:08,320 --> 01:17:10,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, let me And and then then then we hugged

1264
01:17:10,880 --> 01:17:13,240
Speaker 2: for a minute because I wanted to feel you, right.

1265
01:17:13,840 --> 01:17:20,559
Speaker 2: And but back then that was so controversial. Right now,

1266
01:17:20,960 --> 01:17:31,080
Speaker 2: us coming together forgiven compassion, love, friendship, right, it's another

1267
01:17:31,120 --> 01:17:35,080
Speaker 2: powerful moment, not knowing that that's what we were doing, right,

1268
01:17:35,360 --> 01:17:38,160
Speaker 2: you know. So, and I'm glad that he and I

1269
01:17:38,200 --> 01:17:38,920
Speaker 2: got to share that.

1270
01:17:39,640 --> 01:17:41,760
Speaker 1: I mean, you mentioned and obviously this is going to

1271
01:17:41,800 --> 01:17:43,200
Speaker 1: come up to You mentioned you got a chance to

1272
01:17:43,200 --> 01:17:43,679
Speaker 1: sit down.

1273
01:17:43,520 --> 01:17:46,320
Speaker 2: With Carl at this last All Star in Utah.

1274
01:17:46,920 --> 01:17:48,320
Speaker 1: What did you know? How did that go?

1275
01:17:48,520 --> 01:17:48,720
Speaker 2: Man?

1276
01:17:48,760 --> 01:17:52,000
Speaker 3: For years, Man, I wanted to do something to Carl Man.

1277
01:17:52,439 --> 01:17:54,200
Speaker 2: You know you mentioned some people might have met.

1278
01:17:54,240 --> 01:17:56,920
Speaker 1: But Kmart told this story about how he was watching

1279
01:17:56,920 --> 01:17:59,040
Speaker 1: that game on TV when he was a youngster and

1280
01:18:00,040 --> 01:18:01,280
Speaker 1: out him back for you.

1281
01:18:01,400 --> 01:18:02,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, and I'm saying thank you.

1282
01:18:02,960 --> 01:18:04,479
Speaker 1: Yeah, what I'm saying, so you said thank you for

1283
01:18:04,520 --> 01:18:05,519
Speaker 1: people might be car.

1284
01:18:05,920 --> 01:18:08,960
Speaker 2: But let me but let me say, let me say

1285
01:18:08,960 --> 01:18:11,439
Speaker 2: why I said thank you, and then let me let

1286
01:18:11,479 --> 01:18:17,679
Speaker 2: me go further with that, because for years, that dude

1287
01:18:17,680 --> 01:18:23,240
Speaker 2: put a mark on me. Man, And and for years

1288
01:18:23,280 --> 01:18:27,400
Speaker 2: I was like, I'm gonna get my mark back. You know,

1289
01:18:27,439 --> 01:18:30,080
Speaker 2: you put a scar on me, and get my scar back,

1290
01:18:30,640 --> 01:18:31,679
Speaker 2: and I get my scar back.

1291
01:18:31,680 --> 01:18:33,519
Speaker 3: We even but you know, my.

1292
01:18:40,640 --> 01:18:51,200
Speaker 2: Back. But and and so fast forward, right, you know,

1293
01:18:51,240 --> 01:18:57,439
Speaker 2: I'm carrying this around for years, for years. Last dance

1294
01:18:57,520 --> 01:19:03,559
Speaker 2: come out and and you know, every you know, the

1295
01:19:03,840 --> 01:19:07,599
Speaker 2: narrative was, you know, everybody hated Isaiah. You know, nobody

1296
01:19:07,640 --> 01:19:09,960
Speaker 2: wanted him around, nobody wanted to be a part of

1297
01:19:10,000 --> 01:19:12,519
Speaker 2: it so far, and so so that was what's being played.

1298
01:19:12,560 --> 01:19:15,560
Speaker 2: So now on the background, I'm getting calls from everybody.

1299
01:19:16,000 --> 01:19:19,799
Speaker 2: I'm getting calls from the Shock Hit, the Chicago Bulls

1300
01:19:19,880 --> 01:19:24,559
Speaker 2: team teammates, people in the Chicago Bulls front office. I'm

1301
01:19:24,600 --> 01:19:27,639
Speaker 2: getting calls from people who was on the Dream Team saying.

1302
01:19:27,439 --> 01:19:29,439
Speaker 3: Hey, man, that ain't me. You know how I feel

1303
01:19:29,439 --> 01:19:29,800
Speaker 3: about you.

1304
01:19:30,560 --> 01:19:38,240
Speaker 2: Okay, cool, they don't get called from Carl. And I'm like,

1305
01:19:40,120 --> 01:19:43,200
Speaker 2: and he say, hey man, I and this was years ago,

1306
01:19:44,000 --> 01:19:45,559
Speaker 2: say hey man, I just want to tell you, like,

1307
01:19:45,680 --> 01:19:49,519
Speaker 2: you know, I hear all this stuff about the Dream Team.

1308
01:19:49,560 --> 01:19:50,360
Speaker 3: You know, I call talk.

1309
01:19:50,400 --> 01:19:53,400
Speaker 2: I'm a man, I'm a real man. I don't you know.

1310
01:19:53,560 --> 01:19:57,280
Speaker 2: I ain't hiding behind nothing. You know, I didn't have

1311
01:19:57,400 --> 01:19:59,920
Speaker 2: nothing to do with that. You're not making the team.

1312
01:20:00,120 --> 01:20:02,919
Speaker 2: As a matter of fact, you know, I'm speaking for Stockton.

1313
01:20:02,960 --> 01:20:06,200
Speaker 2: Then I we And he said this on camera. He said,

1314
01:20:06,240 --> 01:20:09,120
Speaker 2: if there was a secret meeting me and Stockedon, wasn't

1315
01:20:09,160 --> 01:20:11,200
Speaker 2: a part of those secret meeting trying to keep you

1316
01:20:11,240 --> 01:20:14,040
Speaker 2: off the team? That wasn't us. So now you know

1317
01:20:14,120 --> 01:20:17,760
Speaker 2: my next question is, you know, so man, why you

1318
01:20:17,880 --> 01:20:21,360
Speaker 2: hit me like that? And this is what I have

1319
01:20:21,400 --> 01:20:26,240
Speaker 2: to respect. And and Kenyon, I hope you can respect

1320
01:20:26,240 --> 01:20:30,320
Speaker 2: this too, brother, because and and you know, and all

1321
01:20:30,360 --> 01:20:33,280
Speaker 2: my people in Chicago and in Detroit everywhere. I hope

1322
01:20:33,320 --> 01:20:36,600
Speaker 2: y'all can respect this about Karl Malung because what he

1323
01:20:36,680 --> 01:20:42,800
Speaker 2: said was, Hey, look, I I meant to hit you.

1324
01:20:43,960 --> 01:20:47,320
Speaker 2: That's how we played. You come down the lane. You're

1325
01:20:47,320 --> 01:20:49,400
Speaker 2: gonna you're gonna get some physicality. So I meant to

1326
01:20:49,400 --> 01:20:52,559
Speaker 2: do it, he said, But I but I didn't mean

1327
01:20:52,640 --> 01:20:58,679
Speaker 2: to do that. And I apologize because I didn't mean

1328
01:20:58,720 --> 01:21:01,880
Speaker 2: to do that. Hey, I have to accept that, you

1329
01:21:01,920 --> 01:21:06,360
Speaker 2: know what I mean? Because that now, if he would

1330
01:21:06,400 --> 01:21:08,519
Speaker 2: have been like, I'm a tough guy. You know, that's

1331
01:21:08,560 --> 01:21:10,200
Speaker 2: how we play, and yeah, I'm gonna lay you out,

1332
01:21:10,200 --> 01:21:13,920
Speaker 2: blah blah blah. But at the same time, now, now

1333
01:21:13,960 --> 01:21:18,880
Speaker 2: he gets emotional and he started crying. And you know

1334
01:21:18,920 --> 01:21:22,919
Speaker 2: when people start crying, Now you crying, right, Yeah.

1335
01:21:22,720 --> 01:21:24,639
Speaker 5: So you never know what people dealing with, bro.

1336
01:21:24,880 --> 01:21:29,519
Speaker 2: Yeah, And so I was only looking at it from

1337
01:21:29,560 --> 01:21:33,160
Speaker 2: my point of view. I never knew the type of

1338
01:21:33,240 --> 01:21:36,800
Speaker 2: guilt that he was walking around carrying. And so by

1339
01:21:36,840 --> 01:21:41,360
Speaker 2: me saying, hey man, it's okay, I love you brother,

1340
01:21:41,720 --> 01:21:45,479
Speaker 2: were good man, he said, you just took the whole

1341
01:21:45,560 --> 01:21:47,439
Speaker 2: weight off my shoulder. Now, I never knew he was

1342
01:21:47,479 --> 01:21:50,280
Speaker 2: walking around with waight. I just thought he was walking

1343
01:21:50,280 --> 01:21:52,360
Speaker 2: around like, yeah, I'm a tough dude. Look what I

1344
01:21:52,400 --> 01:21:54,560
Speaker 2: did to you and and somebody else I'm gonna do.

1345
01:21:54,800 --> 01:21:57,240
Speaker 2: But that ain't the way he was thinking. And when

1346
01:21:57,280 --> 01:21:59,920
Speaker 2: he said, yeah, I meant to hit you, but I

1347
01:22:00,080 --> 01:22:02,720
Speaker 2: didn't mean to do that. Now, that last part I

1348
01:22:02,720 --> 01:22:06,200
Speaker 2: got to accept, right, And that's you know that that

1349
01:22:06,320 --> 01:22:08,639
Speaker 2: was real. So I respect that.

1350
01:22:11,160 --> 01:22:14,800
Speaker 4: Mid eighties eighties you start winning, start going on the role.

1351
01:22:15,880 --> 01:22:16,519
Speaker 5: What clicked.

1352
01:22:18,479 --> 01:22:24,120
Speaker 2: We became one, everybody on the same page. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

1353
01:22:24,200 --> 01:22:27,479
Speaker 2: And I don't care who you sit in this chair.

1354
01:22:28,439 --> 01:22:32,040
Speaker 2: If he's a piston, he gonna tell the same story.

1355
01:22:32,680 --> 01:22:35,240
Speaker 2: He's gonna act the same way. He's gonna carry himself

1356
01:22:35,280 --> 01:22:38,559
Speaker 2: the same way. We still got a group chat, right.

1357
01:22:38,960 --> 01:22:42,360
Speaker 2: John said that said that no, no, no, this this

1358
01:22:42,560 --> 01:22:45,920
Speaker 2: this is who we are from day one. Right, That's

1359
01:22:45,960 --> 01:22:52,519
Speaker 2: what clicked. It wasn't like we became better basketball players.

1360
01:22:53,680 --> 01:22:57,920
Speaker 2: We became like this as opposed to being five individuals.

1361
01:22:58,360 --> 01:23:03,479
Speaker 2: Right now punches more pop than the slapt all the time.

1362
01:23:03,560 --> 01:23:09,800
Speaker 2: Bruce Lee talked to about and when you when you

1363
01:23:09,840 --> 01:23:12,479
Speaker 2: put some when you put some energy in there behind

1364
01:23:12,479 --> 01:23:15,840
Speaker 2: that thing. And that's what we was walking up in

1365
01:23:15,920 --> 01:23:21,040
Speaker 2: there with, right, all force. Right, teams had no they

1366
01:23:21,040 --> 01:23:27,040
Speaker 2: had no shot, right because all all togetherness, all force,

1367
01:23:27,920 --> 01:23:32,240
Speaker 2: it was intimidating. So when you say what made it

1368
01:23:32,280 --> 01:23:38,280
Speaker 2: come together is those sacrifices, those individual sacrifices that we

1369
01:23:38,400 --> 01:23:43,800
Speaker 2: all was making that community that communication, that crying, that breakdown,

1370
01:23:43,880 --> 01:23:47,400
Speaker 2: those heartaches, you know, all that that that that staying

1371
01:23:47,400 --> 01:23:51,040
Speaker 2: together and then you you become one. And when we

1372
01:23:51,120 --> 01:23:59,600
Speaker 2: became one, we we're probably we're definitely the most misunderstood

1373
01:23:59,640 --> 01:24:04,040
Speaker 2: team that's ever played in the NBA. And we're the

1374
01:24:04,080 --> 01:24:07,120
Speaker 2: most misunderstood team that's ever played in the NBA. And

1375
01:24:07,160 --> 01:24:13,639
Speaker 2: I say team because we were a team. The NBA,

1376
01:24:14,280 --> 01:24:21,080
Speaker 2: you know, wants to promote individuals. You know, my whole team,

1377
01:24:21,240 --> 01:24:23,600
Speaker 2: you know my you know, you know, our team to

1378
01:24:23,680 --> 01:24:28,280
Speaker 2: the ninth tenth maon first and last name. Yes, our team, right,

1379
01:24:28,360 --> 01:24:32,240
Speaker 2: And that's how we promoted ourselves, right, The NBA wanted

1380
01:24:32,280 --> 01:24:35,040
Speaker 2: to give you the individual were like, nah, we coming

1381
01:24:35,080 --> 01:24:37,120
Speaker 2: to the captains mean, we came to the captains meeting

1382
01:24:37,120 --> 01:24:40,360
Speaker 2: one time, and our whole team came to the captain meeting.

1383
01:24:42,520 --> 01:24:47,320
Speaker 2: That's right. And and so that that type of togetherness,

1384
01:24:47,360 --> 01:24:52,720
Speaker 2: that type of chemistry. Now, these are the facts our

1385
01:24:52,800 --> 01:24:58,360
Speaker 2: first championship in eighty nine because they didn't understand us,

1386
01:24:58,760 --> 01:25:02,000
Speaker 2: and we got the best record in the league. But

1387
01:25:02,080 --> 01:25:05,479
Speaker 2: we don't have one all pro on All Team. I

1388
01:25:05,479 --> 01:25:07,880
Speaker 2: didn't make first team, I didn't make second team, I

1389
01:25:07,880 --> 01:25:12,160
Speaker 2: didn't make third team. Joe didn't make first team, second

1390
01:25:12,160 --> 01:25:16,000
Speaker 2: team or thirteen. Robin didn't make first team, second team

1391
01:25:16,080 --> 01:25:18,559
Speaker 2: or third team. Lambiard didn't make first Now we got

1392
01:25:18,560 --> 01:25:21,800
Speaker 2: the best record in the league, and we swept the Lakers, right,

1393
01:25:21,960 --> 01:25:23,920
Speaker 2: And they say the Lakers was hurt, but they don't

1394
01:25:23,960 --> 01:25:27,320
Speaker 2: never say I was hurt when they beat us. Right.

1395
01:25:35,600 --> 01:25:37,840
Speaker 2: And the other point I want to make is the

1396
01:25:37,920 --> 01:25:41,640
Speaker 2: sacrifices in terms of team. Not only did we not

1397
01:25:41,800 --> 01:25:47,240
Speaker 2: have anybody make All Pro, but nobody averaged twenty points

1398
01:25:47,240 --> 01:25:52,599
Speaker 2: a game. I led with nineteen. This one had eighteen.

1399
01:25:53,680 --> 01:25:57,839
Speaker 2: Two has seventeen, this one half fifteen. It's had their balance.

1400
01:25:57,880 --> 01:26:00,200
Speaker 2: If we were a team who you're going to you're

1401
01:26:00,200 --> 01:26:04,280
Speaker 2: gonna stop one night, I get thirty five right Game

1402
01:26:04,360 --> 01:26:10,599
Speaker 2: five to go to the to the to beat Boston.

1403
01:26:11,320 --> 01:26:14,599
Speaker 2: The year before, I had thrown the ball away come

1404
01:26:14,640 --> 01:26:18,799
Speaker 2: back in eighty eight week back in game five again, Junior,

1405
01:26:18,800 --> 01:26:19,479
Speaker 2: what you're gonna do?

1406
01:26:21,040 --> 01:26:22,559
Speaker 3: I got magic in my mind.

1407
01:26:22,880 --> 01:26:25,080
Speaker 2: I got James Worthy in my mind because I have

1408
01:26:25,160 --> 01:26:28,320
Speaker 2: seen them get up, come back to that Game five,

1409
01:26:28,840 --> 01:26:32,320
Speaker 2: A Game five in Boston, I dropped thirty five, thirty six,

1410
01:26:32,479 --> 01:26:35,200
Speaker 2: had like a great game come back. Game six on

1411
01:26:35,240 --> 01:26:37,080
Speaker 2: the close out game. You know what I mean points

1412
01:26:37,120 --> 01:26:41,320
Speaker 2: I scored in the close our game nine. You know

1413
01:26:41,360 --> 01:26:46,120
Speaker 2: who got hot? Benny the mic away Bennie.

1414
01:26:46,360 --> 01:26:50,960
Speaker 3: Bennie got hot. It was like, all right, go go Now.

1415
01:26:51,000 --> 01:26:55,320
Speaker 2: If we was playing analytics basketball and playing selfish basketball, Hey.

1416
01:26:55,120 --> 01:26:56,439
Speaker 3: Man, I got to get my twenty.

1417
01:26:56,479 --> 01:27:00,280
Speaker 2: I gotta keep my average up right, right, So that

1418
01:27:00,400 --> 01:27:04,240
Speaker 2: balance that you talk about. We can't beat the Lakers

1419
01:27:04,240 --> 01:27:09,200
Speaker 2: in the Celtics individually, but our team can we beat

1420
01:27:09,200 --> 01:27:09,599
Speaker 2: the team?

1421
01:27:10,000 --> 01:27:12,479
Speaker 3: Hell yeah?

1422
01:27:13,040 --> 01:27:15,200
Speaker 4: A lot of people say Boston Celtics, the team you

1423
01:27:15,240 --> 01:27:19,360
Speaker 4: played against, was the probably the most fundamentally sound team

1424
01:27:19,720 --> 01:27:23,800
Speaker 4: ever to play in the NBA. You was able to

1425
01:27:23,840 --> 01:27:26,960
Speaker 4: battle with them. How good were they? They were?

1426
01:27:27,000 --> 01:27:27,080
Speaker 2: That?

1427
01:27:27,360 --> 01:27:27,800
Speaker 3: They were that.

1428
01:27:28,520 --> 01:27:31,919
Speaker 2: Not only were they that, but they were so smart.

1429
01:27:32,720 --> 01:27:39,800
Speaker 2: I mean Walton Bird with Kale Parish, change Dennis Johnson.

1430
01:27:40,200 --> 01:27:43,679
Speaker 2: At one point in time, they had Nate Archibald, Scott Webman.

1431
01:27:43,960 --> 01:27:46,920
Speaker 2: I mean, I mean they were just loaded with talent

1432
01:27:47,680 --> 01:27:51,840
Speaker 2: but extremely smart. In one year, they went forty and

1433
01:27:51,920 --> 01:27:56,479
Speaker 2: one at home. God damn sit how about that? It

1434
01:27:56,560 --> 01:28:02,439
Speaker 2: went forty and one at home. That's how good they were. Now,

1435
01:28:04,160 --> 01:28:12,639
Speaker 2: now this is how good we were. Okay, arguably they say,

1436
01:28:12,680 --> 01:28:15,479
Speaker 2: that's one of the best teams to ever play in

1437
01:28:15,520 --> 01:28:18,880
Speaker 2: the NBA, if not the best one season that was

1438
01:28:19,040 --> 01:28:23,840
Speaker 2: eighty eighty six, eighty seven, Right, and then the Lakers,

1439
01:28:24,120 --> 01:28:27,760
Speaker 2: Right they you know one and two, those are the

1440
01:28:27,800 --> 01:28:29,599
Speaker 2: two best teams they say they ever played.

1441
01:28:31,360 --> 01:28:32,080
Speaker 3: Well, that's who we.

1442
01:28:32,080 --> 01:28:33,400
Speaker 2: Beat, Random both down.

1443
01:28:33,720 --> 01:28:34,719
Speaker 3: That's who we beat.

1444
01:28:36,560 --> 01:28:37,439
Speaker 2: Random both down.

1445
01:28:37,920 --> 01:28:38,920
Speaker 3: That's how good we were.

1446
01:28:39,040 --> 01:28:42,960
Speaker 4: Yeah, well, you know, like like real talk now, like

1447
01:28:43,000 --> 01:28:46,000
Speaker 4: you say, y'all the only ones that beat all three

1448
01:28:46,040 --> 01:28:51,000
Speaker 4: of them, MJ, Magic and Bird.

1449
01:28:51,560 --> 01:28:53,720
Speaker 5: Name somebody else who beat all three y'all all three of.

1450
01:28:53,680 --> 01:28:56,679
Speaker 3: Them, and let me let me put enough something to it. Yeah,

1451
01:28:56,720 --> 01:28:57,640
Speaker 3: let me add some to it.

1452
01:28:59,200 --> 01:29:03,840
Speaker 2: When we beat them, they were all m vps of

1453
01:29:03,960 --> 01:29:09,760
Speaker 2: the league. Magic was MVP of the league. Jordan was

1454
01:29:09,880 --> 01:29:12,719
Speaker 2: MVP of the league. Bird was MVP of the league

1455
01:29:13,200 --> 01:29:15,320
Speaker 2: when we beat him. Hold that.

1456
01:29:19,040 --> 01:29:21,559
Speaker 5: It is right there. Give me give me a little

1457
01:29:21,560 --> 01:29:26,080
Speaker 5: bit more about the l veto Larry bird Man. Give

1458
01:29:26,120 --> 01:29:27,880
Speaker 5: me a story man by lb Man.

1459
01:29:28,200 --> 01:29:32,519
Speaker 2: So I don't know if people, I don't know how

1460
01:29:32,560 --> 01:29:38,280
Speaker 2: this is going to play with America.

1461
01:29:38,760 --> 01:29:40,600
Speaker 3: Let me just tell you what this dude told me

1462
01:29:40,680 --> 01:29:41,719
Speaker 3: one time, right.

1463
01:29:43,760 --> 01:29:48,880
Speaker 2: Now, all back line, at one time, it was Kelly Trapuko,

1464
01:29:50,720 --> 01:29:54,519
Speaker 2: Bill Lambert, Kim Benson, three white.

1465
01:29:54,360 --> 01:29:56,559
Speaker 5: Dudes, two of might have heard of.

1466
01:29:58,160 --> 01:30:04,880
Speaker 2: All right. So we walk out on the court and

1467
01:30:04,920 --> 01:30:11,040
Speaker 2: he said who guarded me? And I said, well, hey,

1468
01:30:11,280 --> 01:30:14,200
Speaker 2: you know we both from Indiana. We talking stuff. Me

1469
01:30:14,240 --> 01:30:17,320
Speaker 2: and his mom had a close relationship in college.

1470
01:30:17,400 --> 01:30:19,040
Speaker 3: His mom would write me like notes.

1471
01:30:19,360 --> 01:30:21,240
Speaker 2: Was even write me notes like when I was in

1472
01:30:21,280 --> 01:30:25,320
Speaker 2: the pros, like you know, good luck everything else. Right,

1473
01:30:25,439 --> 01:30:29,360
Speaker 2: So Larry's always called me cheesy, right, He's like, cheesy

1474
01:30:29,360 --> 01:30:31,559
Speaker 2: who guarded me? And I was like, you know, I

1475
01:30:31,600 --> 01:30:36,000
Speaker 2: got Kelly, got limb I got I got Benson. He's like,

1476
01:30:38,640 --> 01:30:45,280
Speaker 2: you ain't got no brothers like you. He's like, you

1477
01:30:45,360 --> 01:30:47,160
Speaker 2: disrespecting me. That's what he said.

1478
01:30:47,680 --> 01:30:49,080
Speaker 3: That's exactly what he said.

1479
01:30:49,520 --> 01:30:52,240
Speaker 2: He said, hey, man, you keep putting no white dude

1480
01:30:52,240 --> 01:30:57,479
Speaker 2: on me? Better straight disrespect right, he said, don't put

1481
01:30:57,600 --> 01:30:59,760
Speaker 2: no white dude on me. So check this out. So

1482
01:30:59,880 --> 01:31:02,320
Speaker 2: the next year we come back, I said, I got

1483
01:31:02,360 --> 01:31:06,840
Speaker 2: somebody for your ass. Right, who you got?

1484
01:31:07,040 --> 01:31:07,840
Speaker 3: I said, Rob?

1485
01:31:11,800 --> 01:31:15,599
Speaker 2: He's okay, he's a little better, he said, but don't

1486
01:31:15,600 --> 01:31:20,479
Speaker 2: never put no white dude on me because that is disrespectful. Okay,

1487
01:31:20,880 --> 01:31:23,000
Speaker 2: Now I don't know how America gonna feel about that?

1488
01:31:23,240 --> 01:31:23,519
Speaker 2: All right?

1489
01:31:24,600 --> 01:31:26,760
Speaker 3: But I think he said in his Sports Illustrated too.

1490
01:31:27,200 --> 01:31:29,400
Speaker 3: You can go get the quote I've heard.

1491
01:31:29,479 --> 01:31:32,479
Speaker 4: I heard other people talk about lad Bird and I

1492
01:31:32,520 --> 01:31:35,360
Speaker 4: had conversations with people like John Sally and he said

1493
01:31:35,400 --> 01:31:36,000
Speaker 4: the same thing.

1494
01:31:37,080 --> 01:31:39,559
Speaker 2: He was black. Yeah, I was like, man, he walked

1495
01:31:39,600 --> 01:31:41,680
Speaker 2: on the court, he was black straight, Hey man, but

1496
01:31:41,760 --> 01:31:43,920
Speaker 2: that's who we played with you, that's what I heard.

1497
01:31:44,120 --> 01:31:47,920
Speaker 2: He played with the garbage So the garbage truck workers in.

1498
01:31:49,800 --> 01:31:52,519
Speaker 3: The story is in French lick.

1499
01:31:52,720 --> 01:31:54,800
Speaker 2: You know, he he grew up, you know him and

1500
01:31:54,840 --> 01:31:57,840
Speaker 2: Quinn Buckner, right, you know, so he grew up. You know,

1501
01:31:58,479 --> 01:32:01,679
Speaker 2: even though French lick. You know that's that's kind of Larry.

1502
01:32:02,240 --> 01:32:05,680
Speaker 2: You know, he he ain't in all that right, he like.

1503
01:32:05,760 --> 01:32:07,040
Speaker 5: You know, he did his own thing.

1504
01:32:07,200 --> 01:32:12,920
Speaker 2: But you better put somebody on me that sin and yeah,

1505
01:32:13,520 --> 01:32:15,439
Speaker 2: he ain't got no melon. He can't guard me.

1506
01:32:15,520 --> 01:32:18,519
Speaker 3: You can't guard me that you disrespected my game. And

1507
01:32:18,640 --> 01:32:19,559
Speaker 3: even we got some meling.

1508
01:32:19,560 --> 01:32:20,519
Speaker 2: He gonna have a long night.

1509
01:32:21,080 --> 01:32:22,720
Speaker 4: But you know what though, but you know what, though,

1510
01:32:22,840 --> 01:32:24,559
Speaker 4: I know he walked out on the court one time.

1511
01:32:24,640 --> 01:32:26,760
Speaker 4: Somebody said, look at this white boy, and he can't

1512
01:32:26,800 --> 01:32:29,800
Speaker 4: guard me and Larry served him, you know, so I'm

1513
01:32:29,800 --> 01:32:31,080
Speaker 4: pretty sure he heard that before.

1514
01:32:31,080 --> 01:32:36,320
Speaker 3: And they they used to talk so much trash man.

1515
01:32:37,760 --> 01:32:41,200
Speaker 2: So I remember we were playing them in the elimination

1516
01:32:41,320 --> 01:32:48,880
Speaker 2: game in Joe Louis Arena, and you know, end of

1517
01:32:48,920 --> 01:32:52,439
Speaker 2: the game, they up like eight or nine, they don't

1518
01:32:52,479 --> 01:32:54,760
Speaker 2: won the series, and you're gonna try to take that

1519
01:32:54,880 --> 01:33:01,200
Speaker 2: last shot, right and Michael said, I hope you make

1520
01:33:01,280 --> 01:33:04,200
Speaker 2: this last shot because it's your last one.

1521
01:33:04,240 --> 01:33:06,759
Speaker 3: Other season, while I'm in the air.

1522
01:33:09,000 --> 01:33:14,240
Speaker 2: Bit air, damn clang, I missed it, you know. But

1523
01:33:14,320 --> 01:33:17,160
Speaker 2: they used to talk so much trash man. And if

1524
01:33:17,200 --> 01:33:22,400
Speaker 2: you go back and you watch that the Lakers Celtic documentary,

1525
01:33:23,320 --> 01:33:25,760
Speaker 2: you will see how much trash they was talking to.

1526
01:33:26,360 --> 01:33:29,640
Speaker 2: I don't know if it was Worthy or Magic was

1527
01:33:29,680 --> 01:33:33,720
Speaker 2: at the fire line and he missed the free throw

1528
01:33:34,640 --> 01:33:42,680
Speaker 2: and mL car walked across the fire line and man,

1529
01:33:42,360 --> 01:33:46,280
Speaker 2: and I remember, I don't know if it was eighty

1530
01:33:46,280 --> 01:33:47,160
Speaker 2: four eighty five.

1531
01:33:47,360 --> 01:33:49,120
Speaker 3: So I'm following the series back and forth.

1532
01:33:49,720 --> 01:33:54,720
Speaker 2: The Lakers win in Boston, and they just come up

1533
01:33:54,760 --> 01:33:56,800
Speaker 2: in there and they gainst the Boston like, you know,

1534
01:33:56,840 --> 01:33:59,360
Speaker 2: because Boston was supposed to be the physical team. The

1535
01:33:59,439 --> 01:34:02,280
Speaker 2: Lakers was sposed to be showtime, and you know, so

1536
01:34:02,439 --> 01:34:03,360
Speaker 2: Lakers came up in.

1537
01:34:03,320 --> 01:34:05,320
Speaker 3: There and just you know, boom, boom, pound.

1538
01:34:05,400 --> 01:34:09,679
Speaker 2: And then you know, so Larry Bird the next day,

1539
01:34:11,400 --> 01:34:14,320
Speaker 2: you know, he called my team, you know, called him

1540
01:34:14,360 --> 01:34:17,400
Speaker 2: Sissy's and everything else, you know, all the newspaper. Right,

1541
01:34:18,200 --> 01:34:22,240
Speaker 2: so now they come back. I think it was game

1542
01:34:22,720 --> 01:34:28,360
Speaker 2: five here, and I mean it is. I think that's

1543
01:34:28,400 --> 01:34:33,240
Speaker 2: the game that Michael grabbed Rabbits threw him out of there, right.

1544
01:34:33,800 --> 01:34:38,920
Speaker 2: So so now I'm watching all this right and I'm

1545
01:34:38,960 --> 01:34:44,200
Speaker 2: sitting baseline, and they enter it in the Bird on

1546
01:34:44,240 --> 01:34:47,519
Speaker 2: the on the right side of the court, Bird on

1547
01:34:47,600 --> 01:34:51,840
Speaker 2: the baseline, and he dribbling down and Magic come to

1548
01:34:51,920 --> 01:34:56,320
Speaker 2: double team and I'm like, no, no, no, he ain't

1549
01:34:56,320 --> 01:34:58,519
Speaker 2: getting ready to shoot because now I'm studying. I'm like,

1550
01:34:58,920 --> 01:35:00,600
Speaker 2: you know, now i know when we're gonna do a

1551
01:35:00,640 --> 01:35:01,160
Speaker 2: step back.

1552
01:35:01,240 --> 01:35:04,000
Speaker 3: I'm I'm like no, I'm in my mind like, don't

1553
01:35:04,000 --> 01:35:05,280
Speaker 3: come double, don't come double.

1554
01:35:06,560 --> 01:35:08,400
Speaker 2: And he came in double and he kicked it out

1555
01:35:08,439 --> 01:35:11,840
Speaker 2: to Dennis Johnson and Dennis Johnson knocked it down right

1556
01:35:11,880 --> 01:35:12,679
Speaker 2: from the fire line.

1557
01:35:12,800 --> 01:35:14,360
Speaker 3: Boom game.

1558
01:35:15,640 --> 01:35:18,880
Speaker 2: And Boston beat l A here. But those type of

1559
01:35:19,080 --> 01:35:21,880
Speaker 2: you know, rivalries going back and forth. I mean the

1560
01:35:21,880 --> 01:35:22,840
Speaker 2: way they was fighting, and.

1561
01:35:24,439 --> 01:35:26,240
Speaker 3: I I felt so.

1562
01:35:27,920 --> 01:35:31,599
Speaker 2: Sorry and bad for Bird because the way Michael Cooper

1563
01:35:31,720 --> 01:35:36,760
Speaker 2: was guarding him. Man, I mean, dude, you you can

1564
01:35:36,800 --> 01:35:41,840
Speaker 2: see Michael Cooper's fingernails all on Birds, like you know,

1565
01:35:42,160 --> 01:35:44,800
Speaker 2: one time he pulled his his shirt and all you

1566
01:35:44,840 --> 01:35:48,680
Speaker 2: saw was Coop's fingernails, like and but man, they was

1567
01:35:48,720 --> 01:35:53,040
Speaker 2: going at it. And so now they go back to

1568
01:35:53,120 --> 01:35:59,360
Speaker 2: Boston and Bird was real clever. So they have an

1569
01:35:59,360 --> 01:36:05,840
Speaker 2: out of bounds play where balls balls here on the

1570
01:36:05,920 --> 01:36:10,760
Speaker 2: right side and he's coming up to set an upscreen

1571
01:36:11,720 --> 01:36:13,800
Speaker 2: as he comes, you know, instead of it being a

1572
01:36:13,840 --> 01:36:16,000
Speaker 2: pin down. Yeah, he said, no, he comes up to

1573
01:36:16,000 --> 01:36:19,280
Speaker 2: set an upscreen. But when he comes to set an upscreen,

1574
01:36:19,360 --> 01:36:23,320
Speaker 2: now you taking the ball out and that's the corner.

1575
01:36:24,520 --> 01:36:26,760
Speaker 2: And as he sat in the upscreen, the defenders in

1576
01:36:26,800 --> 01:36:30,479
Speaker 2: front of him, and that dude flared to the corner

1577
01:36:32,960 --> 01:36:37,479
Speaker 2: and caught it. And when he let it go, I

1578
01:36:37,520 --> 01:36:39,439
Speaker 2: was like, he ain't missing.

1579
01:36:39,560 --> 01:36:43,800
Speaker 3: It was like hit the back of the rim.

1580
01:36:43,960 --> 01:36:46,200
Speaker 2: But it must it al must have stayed in the

1581
01:36:46,240 --> 01:36:49,840
Speaker 2: air for about five seconds, I mean, just spinning perfectly

1582
01:36:50,760 --> 01:36:55,200
Speaker 2: right boom, hit the back, bounced off, and I was like, hey,

1583
01:36:55,200 --> 01:36:58,280
Speaker 2: God was with y'all to day Lays, because I mean,

1584
01:36:58,360 --> 01:37:01,840
Speaker 2: it was so clever of a play that he was

1585
01:37:01,880 --> 01:37:06,280
Speaker 2: able to up slide ball there. Ball came in and

1586
01:37:06,400 --> 01:37:08,640
Speaker 2: he was able to just right in front of the

1587
01:37:08,680 --> 01:37:11,000
Speaker 2: Laker bench. And if you go back and you look,

1588
01:37:11,040 --> 01:37:15,320
Speaker 2: you'll see pat Riley like hoping it don't go. Everybody

1589
01:37:15,400 --> 01:37:18,200
Speaker 2: was praying, I mean every the whole gym man when

1590
01:37:18,240 --> 01:37:20,439
Speaker 2: he caught the ball, you know when some people catch

1591
01:37:20,479 --> 01:37:25,120
Speaker 2: the ball right the whole gym, And when he missed, it.

1592
01:37:25,000 --> 01:37:28,799
Speaker 5: Was like, yeah, give me something quick on Robin.

1593
01:37:30,080 --> 01:37:33,800
Speaker 2: Best athlete I've ever seen, probably in the NBA, not

1594
01:37:33,880 --> 01:37:37,120
Speaker 2: the highest jumping athlete, but just the best athlete. Like

1595
01:37:37,200 --> 01:37:43,960
Speaker 2: I've never seen anybody who a ran that fast and

1596
01:37:44,520 --> 01:37:48,200
Speaker 2: then quick jump like that. So my first time playing

1597
01:37:48,240 --> 01:37:53,400
Speaker 2: with him, literally he gets to rebound kick it to

1598
01:37:53,439 --> 01:37:57,479
Speaker 2: me on the outlet pass right, and so when I

1599
01:37:57,520 --> 01:37:59,759
Speaker 2: get on the outlet, now I'm dribbling to the middle

1600
01:37:59,760 --> 01:38:03,639
Speaker 2: of the floor to set the brake. As I'm driveling

1601
01:38:03,680 --> 01:38:05,719
Speaker 2: it to the middle of the floor. Now this dude

1602
01:38:05,800 --> 01:38:08,479
Speaker 2: just threw it to me. He down there underneath of

1603
01:38:08,479 --> 01:38:12,000
Speaker 2: the back waving for it and I'm like, the hell

1604
01:38:12,200 --> 01:38:14,920
Speaker 2: get so of course I kick it up. But adjusting

1605
01:38:14,960 --> 01:38:17,840
Speaker 2: to his speed was the first thing I had to do.

1606
01:38:18,560 --> 01:38:23,040
Speaker 2: And then I never saw anybody scientifically break down rebounding

1607
01:38:23,240 --> 01:38:27,960
Speaker 2: the way Dennis Robin did. So all first, you know,

1608
01:38:28,000 --> 01:38:31,920
Speaker 2: our first couple of games, you know, we be in

1609
01:38:31,960 --> 01:38:36,280
Speaker 2: the layup line, and then he stopped and he just

1610
01:38:36,400 --> 01:38:40,840
Speaker 2: you know, stand under the rim, and you know used

1611
01:38:40,840 --> 01:38:42,719
Speaker 2: to be you you lay it up, and then after

1612
01:38:42,760 --> 01:38:45,200
Speaker 2: you do your layups, then you start taking a little

1613
01:38:45,200 --> 01:38:48,479
Speaker 2: short pull up shots, right, and so whenever we start

1614
01:38:48,520 --> 01:38:52,639
Speaker 2: taking short pull up shots, he would stop. And so finally,

1615
01:38:52,680 --> 01:38:57,559
Speaker 2: you know, like, what you're doing, man, get in line,

1616
01:38:57,600 --> 01:39:01,599
Speaker 2: like you know, like that, He's like, no, I'm counting

1617
01:39:04,200 --> 01:39:07,080
Speaker 2: some dinners. Was a little strange anyway. I'm like, I

1618
01:39:07,080 --> 01:39:12,240
Speaker 2: ain't gonna even respond to that. I'm just yeah, like

1619
01:39:12,280 --> 01:39:15,960
Speaker 2: I'm counting, right, and and so my mind everywhere right,

1620
01:39:16,600 --> 01:39:21,400
Speaker 2: and so finally, you know, now we break up and

1621
01:39:21,439 --> 01:39:24,559
Speaker 2: he's still standing in the basket, right, and he's just

1622
01:39:24,600 --> 01:39:28,000
Speaker 2: looking at everybody ball and I'm like, what you counting? Like,

1623
01:39:28,320 --> 01:39:30,240
Speaker 2: didn't I didn't ask what you're counting? I said, what

1624
01:39:30,280 --> 01:39:33,799
Speaker 2: you're doing? He said, I'm counting. I'm counting the spins

1625
01:39:33,880 --> 01:39:36,720
Speaker 2: on the ball. He said, when you shoot your ball,

1626
01:39:36,840 --> 01:39:42,400
Speaker 2: spind like three times. Joe sometimes spent four. This one spent.

1627
01:39:42,840 --> 01:39:48,400
Speaker 2: This dude was counting the rotations on the ball on

1628
01:39:48,640 --> 01:39:52,120
Speaker 2: every player. He knew how long it was going to

1629
01:39:52,160 --> 01:39:55,479
Speaker 2: be in the air, how many times it rotated, where

1630
01:39:55,479 --> 01:39:57,880
Speaker 2: it was gonna hit, where it would bounce. I had

1631
01:39:57,880 --> 01:40:00,519
Speaker 2: never seen nobody break down rebounding like that my life.

1632
01:40:00,560 --> 01:40:01,919
Speaker 2: That was kind of insane.

1633
01:40:02,080 --> 01:40:04,360
Speaker 3: That was that he was. He was a genius man.

1634
01:40:04,479 --> 01:40:07,479
Speaker 2: Dennis Rodman was a flat out genius when it came

1635
01:40:07,520 --> 01:40:08,280
Speaker 2: to basketball.

1636
01:40:09,520 --> 01:40:10,400
Speaker 3: I remember when he went.

1637
01:40:10,320 --> 01:40:12,320
Speaker 2: To Chicago and they said, well, you're gonna have a

1638
01:40:12,320 --> 01:40:13,679
Speaker 2: hard time learning the triangle.

1639
01:40:14,040 --> 01:40:17,719
Speaker 3: He goes, it's a triangle.

1640
01:40:22,479 --> 01:40:25,599
Speaker 5: Game five after the after the inbound turnover.

1641
01:40:25,920 --> 01:40:26,120
Speaker 2: Yep.

1642
01:40:27,600 --> 01:40:30,519
Speaker 4: Talk about this series and losing. You say, Bird wouldn't

1643
01:40:30,560 --> 01:40:33,040
Speaker 4: be all that if he was black, all that little

1644
01:40:33,040 --> 01:40:36,080
Speaker 4: stuff you know that went on. But and after that,

1645
01:40:36,240 --> 01:40:39,840
Speaker 4: y'all went on to win three finals. And I want

1646
01:40:39,840 --> 01:40:43,479
Speaker 4: to talk about that too, because two, I mean, excuse me, two,

1647
01:40:44,880 --> 01:40:45,679
Speaker 4: it should have been three.

1648
01:40:45,760 --> 01:40:47,960
Speaker 5: Should have been three. Yeah, and talk about that too.

1649
01:40:48,080 --> 01:40:50,120
Speaker 4: That'll be the second question about do you believe that

1650
01:40:50,200 --> 01:40:52,080
Speaker 4: the Pistons are dynasty.

1651
01:40:52,960 --> 01:40:59,639
Speaker 2: Well, we're not a dynasty because technically we didn't win three, right,

1652
01:41:00,120 --> 01:41:02,120
Speaker 2: So is that what caught because there's no written rules.

1653
01:41:02,120 --> 01:41:04,120
Speaker 1: So we had a debate with Freddie Gibbs who said,

1654
01:41:04,160 --> 01:41:07,559
Speaker 1: you guys were an about back and forth. Yeah, three,

1655
01:41:07,600 --> 01:41:09,920
Speaker 1: that makes you with a several runs, That makes you well.

1656
01:41:10,360 --> 01:41:16,240
Speaker 2: To me, it's about your your dominance in your banners,

1657
01:41:17,000 --> 01:41:20,680
Speaker 2: right and even and even though you even though you

1658
01:41:21,680 --> 01:41:25,280
Speaker 2: there's reasons why you didn't get that third banner, right,

1659
01:41:25,400 --> 01:41:29,400
Speaker 2: we would have been the first team in all era

1660
01:41:29,880 --> 01:41:33,800
Speaker 2: to win three. Only two teams if they say the

1661
01:41:33,840 --> 01:41:38,519
Speaker 2: eighties is the greatest basketball era, right, only two teams

1662
01:41:38,560 --> 01:41:41,439
Speaker 2: went back to back. It was Pistons in the Lakers

1663
01:41:41,960 --> 01:41:44,240
Speaker 2: as great a team as the Celtics were, they didn't

1664
01:41:44,240 --> 01:41:46,479
Speaker 2: go back to back. Only two teams went back to back.

1665
01:41:47,080 --> 01:41:50,559
Speaker 3: Now our.

1666
01:41:53,760 --> 01:41:57,160
Speaker 2: So are we a dynasty? We didn't get the third

1667
01:41:57,200 --> 01:42:01,320
Speaker 2: in Chicago was the first team to get three after

1668
01:42:01,320 --> 01:42:04,720
Speaker 2: this septh So Chicago, you can say, okay, what they

1669
01:42:04,760 --> 01:42:08,479
Speaker 2: did those three years and then came back and did

1670
01:42:08,680 --> 01:42:13,440
Speaker 2: you know, So that's when dynasty stopped. Dynasty talk starts.

1671
01:42:14,960 --> 01:42:19,200
Speaker 2: Lakers Celtics you have to give them dynasty talk because

1672
01:42:19,240 --> 01:42:23,320
Speaker 2: of their historical relevance. What Magic and Barry walked into,

1673
01:42:23,840 --> 01:42:28,040
Speaker 2: they walked into ready made dynasties. Already they were already dynasties, right,

1674
01:42:28,280 --> 01:42:31,839
Speaker 2: Celtics were already a dynasty, Lakers was already a dynasty.

1675
01:42:33,880 --> 01:42:35,120
Speaker 3: What now?

1676
01:42:37,920 --> 01:42:42,200
Speaker 2: What I would say, who's been the most impactful team

1677
01:42:43,680 --> 01:42:48,920
Speaker 2: on the NBA, It's the Detroit Pistons. When you look

1678
01:42:48,960 --> 01:42:54,360
Speaker 2: at our style of play, pick and roll, basketball, stretch

1679
01:42:54,439 --> 01:42:59,360
Speaker 2: five in lambeer, small guards, you know, shooting from the perimeter.

1680
01:42:59,479 --> 01:43:05,080
Speaker 2: We didn't have post that player. The way we influenced

1681
01:43:05,080 --> 01:43:09,640
Speaker 2: the game. The guys like myself, we weren't supposed to

1682
01:43:09,680 --> 01:43:11,680
Speaker 2: win championships. As a matter of fact, when I came

1683
01:43:11,680 --> 01:43:15,920
Speaker 2: into the league, all the point guards, Magic Johnson, Reggie Thiz,

1684
01:43:16,479 --> 01:43:20,120
Speaker 2: Paul Pressey, you know, everybody was six eight, sixt ' nine.

1685
01:43:20,560 --> 01:43:21,320
Speaker 3: The dudes won.

1686
01:43:21,960 --> 01:43:24,720
Speaker 2: We weren't supposed to win, right And as a matter

1687
01:43:24,720 --> 01:43:29,200
Speaker 2: of fact, I'm still the only one that's won this way.

1688
01:43:29,920 --> 01:43:30,240
Speaker 3: Now.

1689
01:43:31,760 --> 01:43:36,240
Speaker 2: Steph Wright has won in Golden State, established a dynasty.

1690
01:43:36,680 --> 01:43:40,599
Speaker 2: But his playing style is different than mine totally. I

1691
01:43:40,720 --> 01:43:45,840
Speaker 2: scored and assisted. He scores, so two different ways of impacting,

1692
01:43:46,560 --> 01:43:51,439
Speaker 2: but so Golden State what they did Dynasty. But the

1693
01:43:51,479 --> 01:43:56,720
Speaker 2: most impactful and the most influential team that's played is

1694
01:43:56,720 --> 01:44:05,040
Speaker 2: a Detroit Pistons two. I still hold the record on

1695
01:44:05,120 --> 01:44:07,479
Speaker 2: both ends. And when you look at the playoff record

1696
01:44:07,560 --> 01:44:12,519
Speaker 2: in terms of steals, I think one year I had

1697
01:44:12,560 --> 01:44:16,599
Speaker 2: sixty six steals in a playoff run. I'm gonna say

1698
01:44:16,600 --> 01:44:17,879
Speaker 2: that again. It's a fief.

1699
01:44:18,280 --> 01:44:19,400
Speaker 3: Yeah, I was real.

1700
01:44:20,120 --> 01:44:22,760
Speaker 2: That's a lot of defense right there. But you know,

1701
01:44:24,400 --> 01:44:28,519
Speaker 2: I think we've influenced the game the most from an

1702
01:44:28,520 --> 01:44:32,880
Speaker 2: offensive standpoint and also from a defensive standpoint. And then

1703
01:44:32,920 --> 01:44:36,360
Speaker 2: I would also say from a guard playing standpoint, the

1704
01:44:36,360 --> 01:44:41,400
Speaker 2: way guards play now. Every team they don't have a

1705
01:44:41,479 --> 01:44:44,799
Speaker 2: Magic Johnson type guard. They don't have a Michael Jordan

1706
01:44:44,840 --> 01:44:50,160
Speaker 2: type guard. They don't have a Dennis Johnson type guard.

1707
01:44:50,800 --> 01:44:54,439
Speaker 2: Every team right now has an Isaiah Thomas, Joe Dumars,

1708
01:44:54,520 --> 01:44:58,200
Speaker 2: Bennie Johnson type guard. You may not like it, you

1709
01:44:58,280 --> 01:45:01,880
Speaker 2: may not want to acknowledge it, it's true, but those

1710
01:45:01,880 --> 01:45:04,840
Speaker 2: are the facts. Right the nineties.

1711
01:45:06,520 --> 01:45:09,040
Speaker 1: Arguably the greatest team ever symbled in nineteen ninety two,

1712
01:45:09,439 --> 01:45:13,000
Speaker 1: your coach is the coach, and even at twelve years old,

1713
01:45:14,040 --> 01:45:17,400
Speaker 1: I knew the world knew you were missing from that team.

1714
01:45:17,600 --> 01:45:20,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, talk to us about that. Well, you know the

1715
01:45:20,439 --> 01:45:22,960
Speaker 2: last dance told you that's somebody who said they didn't

1716
01:45:22,960 --> 01:45:23,719
Speaker 2: want me on the team.

1717
01:45:23,800 --> 01:45:25,360
Speaker 5: Do you really believe it was a secret meeting.

1718
01:45:26,560 --> 01:45:28,640
Speaker 2: Well, a lot of people are saying there was no

1719
01:45:28,720 --> 01:45:35,639
Speaker 2: secret meeting. So it just sounds like it's just one guy.

1720
01:45:36,880 --> 01:45:40,880
Speaker 2: I said, that's the way medium mind, that's the way

1721
01:45:40,920 --> 01:45:43,599
Speaker 2: it's sounding like. You know, And if that's how you felt,

1722
01:45:43,640 --> 01:45:48,800
Speaker 2: own it, right, don't you know own it? That's how

1723
01:45:48,800 --> 01:45:50,759
Speaker 2: you felt, you know, own it. If you didn't feel

1724
01:45:50,760 --> 01:45:54,360
Speaker 2: that way, then clean it up. So I didn't make

1725
01:45:54,400 --> 01:45:56,240
Speaker 2: the team. That was the first time that I didn't

1726
01:45:56,280 --> 01:45:57,679
Speaker 2: make a team in my life.

1727
01:45:57,720 --> 01:46:01,080
Speaker 3: I never felt the sting of get and cut right.

1728
01:46:01,160 --> 01:46:03,840
Speaker 2: So when we all try for a team, you go

1729
01:46:03,960 --> 01:46:06,719
Speaker 2: and they put the they put the names on the wall,

1730
01:46:06,800 --> 01:46:08,960
Speaker 2: and you look and you see if you made it. Well,

1731
01:46:09,000 --> 01:46:10,800
Speaker 2: I was always on the team. This is the first

1732
01:46:10,840 --> 01:46:14,080
Speaker 2: time I didn't make a team and did that sting?

1733
01:46:14,160 --> 01:46:14,760
Speaker 2: Did that hurt?

1734
01:46:15,479 --> 01:46:16,400
Speaker 3: Absolutely? Did?

1735
01:46:16,400 --> 01:46:19,559
Speaker 2: I want to be on the team one hundred percent right?

1736
01:46:20,320 --> 01:46:21,240
Speaker 2: But I didn't make it.

1737
01:46:21,960 --> 01:46:22,280
Speaker 3: Now?

1738
01:46:24,200 --> 01:46:27,840
Speaker 2: Was I mad? Was I upset? Probably went through all

1739
01:46:27,880 --> 01:46:32,759
Speaker 2: of those ranges of emotion. But then you know, again,

1740
01:46:32,960 --> 01:46:37,800
Speaker 2: I'm from the West side of Chicago, so it's like, hey,

1741
01:46:37,800 --> 01:46:38,479
Speaker 2: you didn't make it.

1742
01:46:39,040 --> 01:46:39,760
Speaker 3: What you're going to do?

1743
01:46:39,960 --> 01:46:43,679
Speaker 2: What's next? You can cry about it or you can

1744
01:46:43,760 --> 01:46:46,680
Speaker 2: you know, move on with your life. So I just

1745
01:46:46,880 --> 01:46:50,720
Speaker 2: kept moving on. I watched every game, I rooted for

1746
01:46:50,760 --> 01:46:53,960
Speaker 2: the USA to win. I have won the gold medal

1747
01:46:54,000 --> 01:46:56,800
Speaker 2: in seventy nine. I made the Olympic team in eighty

1748
01:46:56,960 --> 01:47:00,240
Speaker 2: that was boycotted, and was hoping that I would make

1749
01:47:00,280 --> 01:47:03,519
Speaker 2: this one. I didn't make it. I didn't know why

1750
01:47:03,560 --> 01:47:06,960
Speaker 2: I didn't make it, but did I do? I feel

1751
01:47:06,960 --> 01:47:10,200
Speaker 2: like I should have been on it, absolutely, But let

1752
01:47:10,280 --> 01:47:19,320
Speaker 2: me say this, me not making it has has given

1753
01:47:19,360 --> 01:47:24,560
Speaker 2: me more pub than I would have made it, you know,

1754
01:47:25,840 --> 01:47:30,160
Speaker 2: on the good side. So there's always some good and

1755
01:47:30,240 --> 01:47:33,360
Speaker 2: some bad way, you know. So I like the fact

1756
01:47:33,360 --> 01:47:38,280
Speaker 2: that you know the people acknowledge, even though if the

1757
01:47:38,439 --> 01:47:41,880
Speaker 2: institutions didn't acknowledge, we know the people acknowledge that I

1758
01:47:41,880 --> 01:47:44,720
Speaker 2: should have been on the team, and you know, so

1759
01:47:44,800 --> 01:47:45,400
Speaker 2: I'm good with that.

1760
01:47:46,880 --> 01:47:49,880
Speaker 1: Jordan rules, you went two titles. Mike is starting to catch,

1761
01:47:50,160 --> 01:47:52,800
Speaker 1: you know, get some stem with his team. Explain to

1762
01:47:52,840 --> 01:47:58,720
Speaker 1: the Jordan. Explain what the Jordan rules are and where

1763
01:47:58,720 --> 01:48:00,000
Speaker 1: it came from or what that is.

1764
01:48:00,760 --> 01:48:03,400
Speaker 2: John Sally told us his version of yeah, yeah, yeah,

1765
01:48:03,400 --> 01:48:07,000
Speaker 2: and it's pretty simple. Now, we had rules for everybody.

1766
01:48:07,040 --> 01:48:13,800
Speaker 2: We were a disciplined team. We had rules and we

1767
01:48:14,040 --> 01:48:19,000
Speaker 2: followed rules, We followed orders. This is what we had

1768
01:48:19,040 --> 01:48:22,040
Speaker 2: ten point plan. This is what we did. This is

1769
01:48:22,040 --> 01:48:23,559
Speaker 2: how we act, this is how we walked.

1770
01:48:23,560 --> 01:48:24,280
Speaker 3: This is what we do.

1771
01:48:25,080 --> 01:48:27,719
Speaker 2: So we had rules for Magic, we had rules for Kareem,

1772
01:48:27,800 --> 01:48:30,880
Speaker 2: we had rules for Bird. Just like y'all go into

1773
01:48:30,960 --> 01:48:35,000
Speaker 2: a locker room that rules for everybody, right, So Jordan rules.

1774
01:48:35,520 --> 01:48:39,679
Speaker 2: Jordan was a reluctant passer. He didn't like to pass,

1775
01:48:40,000 --> 01:48:45,160
Speaker 2: no question, and he was the first volume shooter, so

1776
01:48:46,439 --> 01:48:49,280
Speaker 2: he wasn't like a like now you see kids that

1777
01:48:49,400 --> 01:48:51,679
Speaker 2: got great handles and all that. He didn't have great handles.

1778
01:48:52,040 --> 01:48:55,439
Speaker 2: Couldn't go left right, and if he went left more

1779
01:48:55,439 --> 01:48:57,160
Speaker 2: than two three times, he had to pick it up.

1780
01:48:57,760 --> 01:49:02,679
Speaker 2: So the rules were very simple. Left side of the floor,

1781
01:49:03,080 --> 01:49:06,479
Speaker 2: sen him left. Right side of the floor, sen him

1782
01:49:06,560 --> 01:49:10,920
Speaker 2: left in the middle, send him left. Now when he's

1783
01:49:10,960 --> 01:49:16,200
Speaker 2: going left, we wanted the trap to be visible right,

1784
01:49:16,800 --> 01:49:21,559
Speaker 2: So I'm going left and the first person that he

1785
01:49:21,760 --> 01:49:26,360
Speaker 2: sees now is running at him, and you, as a defender,

1786
01:49:26,479 --> 01:49:30,880
Speaker 2: your job is to take away his right hand because now,

1787
01:49:31,200 --> 01:49:34,080
Speaker 2: as a passer, we want that ball going in the air.

1788
01:49:34,840 --> 01:49:36,880
Speaker 2: And if that ball goes in the air, we're quick

1789
01:49:36,960 --> 01:49:39,680
Speaker 2: enough to rotate and get back and match up. So

1790
01:49:39,800 --> 01:49:45,200
Speaker 2: as that defender leaves to come trap off the baseline

1791
01:49:45,360 --> 01:49:48,400
Speaker 2: or from the top, second defender, your job is to

1792
01:49:48,479 --> 01:49:51,360
Speaker 2: rotate to cover. Now we want that pass going in

1793
01:49:51,439 --> 01:49:52,479
Speaker 2: the air. Cross court.

1794
01:49:53,600 --> 01:49:55,599
Speaker 3: Jordan didn't want to pass. So what would he do?

1795
01:49:55,800 --> 01:49:59,360
Speaker 2: Turn over? He would shoot, I'll shoot it, yeah.

1796
01:49:58,840 --> 01:50:03,560
Speaker 3: And guess what he would do. He would miss. Okay, now.

1797
01:50:04,960 --> 01:50:08,120
Speaker 2: He would be You know, we didn't mind if he

1798
01:50:08,280 --> 01:50:10,559
Speaker 2: was nine for twenty six.

1799
01:50:11,439 --> 01:50:14,479
Speaker 3: We didn't mind if he was ten for thirty.

1800
01:50:14,800 --> 01:50:17,920
Speaker 2: Now the newspaper were right, he scored twenty seven, but

1801
01:50:18,000 --> 01:50:22,599
Speaker 2: we would say, okay, you know it was ten for thirty. Now,

1802
01:50:22,640 --> 01:50:25,439
Speaker 2: mind you, there were a couple of games he was

1803
01:50:25,479 --> 01:50:30,800
Speaker 2: twenty for twenty five. He wasn't always ten for thirty.

1804
01:50:30,840 --> 01:50:33,559
Speaker 2: But here's what this was the key though, by him

1805
01:50:33,600 --> 01:50:36,360
Speaker 2: being a volume shooter. So this stuff they talk about

1806
01:50:36,360 --> 01:50:39,240
Speaker 2: analytics right now and all this other stuff. Okay, that

1807
01:50:39,360 --> 01:50:44,200
Speaker 2: was the Detroit Pistons. Okay, how many possessions you're gonna

1808
01:50:44,200 --> 01:50:46,960
Speaker 2: have in the game. Okay, is it gonna be ninety five,

1809
01:50:47,040 --> 01:50:49,000
Speaker 2: it's gonna be one hundred, it's gonna be eighty, it's

1810
01:50:49,000 --> 01:50:53,120
Speaker 2: gonna be eighty five. Right, our job was to limit

1811
01:50:53,160 --> 01:50:57,639
Speaker 2: the possessions. And if we can shut down the possessions. Okay,

1812
01:50:58,000 --> 01:51:01,439
Speaker 2: Jordan's said that you're taking thirty shots this game, right,

1813
01:51:01,479 --> 01:51:02,840
Speaker 2: you're only gonna get twenty five.

1814
01:51:03,439 --> 01:51:04,200
Speaker 3: But here's what was the.

1815
01:51:04,160 --> 01:51:10,599
Speaker 2: Key, Scotty who normally gets twelve to thirteen shots because

1816
01:51:10,600 --> 01:51:13,679
Speaker 2: he's a reluctant passer this game, Scotty, you're only gonna

1817
01:51:13,680 --> 01:51:19,280
Speaker 2: get seven shots. And you know this one over here,

1818
01:51:19,360 --> 01:51:23,559
Speaker 2: Harace Grant, you might get three shots. And by the way,

1819
01:51:23,960 --> 01:51:27,160
Speaker 2: those shots that you've taken and that you're getting, they're

1820
01:51:27,160 --> 01:51:29,679
Speaker 2: gonna be at the end of the shot clock. It's

1821
01:51:29,680 --> 01:51:34,280
Speaker 2: gonna be somebody running at you, potato, and now right,

1822
01:51:36,160 --> 01:51:40,679
Speaker 2: your field goal percentage. Right, So this is where we said,

1823
01:51:40,680 --> 01:51:43,400
Speaker 2: we were mentally like, you know, we we take your

1824
01:51:43,439 --> 01:51:46,479
Speaker 2: little brain and just twist it until you fucking fall off, right,

1825
01:51:46,520 --> 01:51:50,960
Speaker 2: that's we. So now when you're looking at that statue

1826
01:51:52,160 --> 01:51:57,559
Speaker 2: and your field goal percentage, it's thirty seven and it

1827
01:51:57,560 --> 01:52:00,640
Speaker 2: ain't forty five, right, you know that mess with you.

1828
01:52:01,400 --> 01:52:03,280
Speaker 2: So now you're looking at your field goal percentage, and

1829
01:52:03,280 --> 01:52:06,040
Speaker 2: your field goal percentage is thirty seven. And now we

1830
01:52:06,280 --> 01:52:09,880
Speaker 2: you know, you play games with people out on the court. Hey,

1831
01:52:10,040 --> 01:52:13,639
Speaker 2: I'm you know, b J. I'm gonna lee you open right.

1832
01:52:14,080 --> 01:52:17,559
Speaker 2: He ain't gonna even throw it to you right right.

1833
01:52:17,960 --> 01:52:20,680
Speaker 2: You go down there and double he shoot right, and

1834
01:52:20,720 --> 01:52:23,760
Speaker 2: then you come back and say, he ain't got to

1835
01:52:23,800 --> 01:52:26,280
Speaker 2: guard you. So those type of mental games you play

1836
01:52:26,360 --> 01:52:31,600
Speaker 2: with the team. And if I can break trust in

1837
01:52:31,720 --> 01:52:35,519
Speaker 2: one person, you got him, Well I don't beat you.

1838
01:52:36,600 --> 01:52:41,160
Speaker 3: So those were the Jordan rules. Now Jordan goes to

1839
01:52:41,200 --> 01:52:41,799
Speaker 3: the basket.

1840
01:52:42,439 --> 01:52:46,200
Speaker 2: Let's say he beats all the double teams right now,

1841
01:52:46,240 --> 01:52:49,519
Speaker 2: he gets to the basket. The NBA at that time

1842
01:52:49,600 --> 01:52:56,000
Speaker 2: wanted to market the dunk, right and understanding their marketing plan,

1843
01:52:57,080 --> 01:53:00,720
Speaker 2: the Lakers, the Celtics, it was birds shooting, it was

1844
01:53:00,800 --> 01:53:04,200
Speaker 2: magic passing, it was Kareem hooking. Now they come with

1845
01:53:04,240 --> 01:53:06,360
Speaker 2: the marketing plan that we want to market the dunk.

1846
01:53:06,680 --> 01:53:07,799
Speaker 3: Everybody got to fly.

1847
01:53:07,720 --> 01:53:09,960
Speaker 2: In the air. Remember when y'all were growing up, how

1848
01:53:10,040 --> 01:53:12,200
Speaker 2: high can you dunk. How do you got a dunk?

1849
01:53:12,200 --> 01:53:14,880
Speaker 2: You got dunk this way right now? They market in

1850
01:53:14,880 --> 01:53:17,160
Speaker 2: a three point shot. Man, you can come down and

1851
01:53:17,200 --> 01:53:20,519
Speaker 2: do a zach lavine dunk between your legs, floating the

1852
01:53:20,520 --> 01:53:23,120
Speaker 2: air and all this other stuff and do that.

1853
01:53:23,120 --> 01:53:25,040
Speaker 3: That's all somebody shoot a three w.

1854
01:53:27,080 --> 01:53:31,519
Speaker 2: Right crazy. So so the marketing right, so understanding the

1855
01:53:31,600 --> 01:53:35,880
Speaker 2: marketing plan, we ain't gonna let you dunk. Guess what

1856
01:53:36,120 --> 01:53:38,280
Speaker 2: when you come to the whole and you've heard this

1857
01:53:38,360 --> 01:53:43,240
Speaker 2: from all your coaches, don't give up the dunk. We

1858
01:53:43,400 --> 01:53:46,439
Speaker 2: gonna file you. That's and put you on the file line.

1859
01:53:47,200 --> 01:53:48,920
Speaker 2: So when we would file him and put him on

1860
01:53:48,920 --> 01:53:52,559
Speaker 2: the fire line, he would cry, real files too, Oh yeah,

1861
01:53:52,720 --> 01:53:55,280
Speaker 2: what I was getting real files too? Yeah, wait a minute,

1862
01:53:55,320 --> 01:53:57,960
Speaker 2: one like one like he was the only one get

1863
01:53:58,640 --> 01:54:02,960
Speaker 2: getting real back then in everybody was getting filed. Michael

1864
01:54:03,040 --> 01:54:05,920
Speaker 2: snatched rambits out of the air. Bird was fine on

1865
01:54:06,040 --> 01:54:09,240
Speaker 2: doctor J. I'm sorry doctor J was flying on Bird.

1866
01:54:09,680 --> 01:54:11,120
Speaker 3: You know, I mean, who was.

1867
01:54:11,120 --> 01:54:13,120
Speaker 4: The big guy that the talk got of elbowed you?

1868
01:54:13,240 --> 01:54:15,320
Speaker 5: Now I call him? It was another all right call.

1869
01:54:15,320 --> 01:54:19,679
Speaker 2: Right car right, yes, sir, all right, you still lit?

1870
01:54:20,880 --> 01:54:27,519
Speaker 2: I got my lip you call He's coming in like

1871
01:54:27,560 --> 01:54:29,640
Speaker 2: I like to fight. So you go back and you

1872
01:54:29,680 --> 01:54:32,240
Speaker 2: slow that down. I you know, my little left hand

1873
01:54:32,280 --> 01:54:34,960
Speaker 2: was up in there, and I went to plant, and

1874
01:54:34,960 --> 01:54:37,680
Speaker 2: I'm glad I slipped because I went to plant. And

1875
01:54:37,720 --> 01:54:42,600
Speaker 2: when I went to plant, he was still rushing. And

1876
01:54:42,640 --> 01:54:46,560
Speaker 2: by him being big and coming in right on that chin, no,

1877
01:54:46,760 --> 01:54:49,120
Speaker 2: I was broke. No, I was gonna drive that nose

1878
01:54:49,160 --> 01:54:53,400
Speaker 2: bone right up to his brain. I was coming, man,

1879
01:54:53,560 --> 01:54:59,160
Speaker 2: and I slipped. And when I slipped right then you

1880
01:54:59,200 --> 01:55:01,800
Speaker 2: will see me just rush up into him, right. So

1881
01:55:01,840 --> 01:55:04,240
Speaker 2: I just run up into his chest. So he came

1882
01:55:04,360 --> 01:55:06,040
Speaker 2: like swinging hit me and then they break it up.

1883
01:55:06,560 --> 01:55:13,000
Speaker 2: But yeah, so so Oakley, right, he gets traded because

1884
01:55:14,600 --> 01:55:17,600
Speaker 2: they say Chicago won't tough enough. So they went and

1885
01:55:17,640 --> 01:55:20,880
Speaker 2: got caught right. So they traded Oakley to New York.

1886
01:55:21,360 --> 01:55:24,960
Speaker 2: Go get caught right. And you know Cort right, he

1887
01:55:25,040 --> 01:55:28,440
Speaker 2: throw some balls. He caught me. I ain't gonna lie. Yeah,

1888
01:55:28,480 --> 01:55:31,040
Speaker 2: So I was getting Horace Grant. Horace Grant was hitting

1889
01:55:31,040 --> 01:55:33,120
Speaker 2: me pretty hard coming down the lane. So they was

1890
01:55:33,200 --> 01:55:37,600
Speaker 2: laying wood, man, I mean they was laying hardwood. But

1891
01:55:37,600 --> 01:55:40,000
Speaker 2: but Jordan was he was the only one still crying today.

1892
01:55:40,040 --> 01:55:44,160
Speaker 3: They hit it if it was dirty. Look look what

1893
01:55:44,200 --> 01:55:44,440
Speaker 3: they did.

1894
01:55:44,520 --> 01:55:46,880
Speaker 2: They show you all the clips, right, They show you

1895
01:55:46,920 --> 01:55:50,160
Speaker 2: a few video clips and tell the world this is

1896
01:55:50,160 --> 01:55:50,839
Speaker 2: how they played.

1897
01:55:51,320 --> 01:55:52,520
Speaker 3: They don't never show you the game.

1898
01:55:53,920 --> 01:55:57,160
Speaker 2: Have you seen the Chicago Bulls Detroit Pistons basketball game.

1899
01:55:58,160 --> 01:56:01,800
Speaker 2: Any of y'all fans will show you the game. They

1900
01:56:01,880 --> 01:56:04,320
Speaker 2: show you the few video clips because they got to

1901
01:56:04,400 --> 01:56:05,240
Speaker 2: keep this thing going.

1902
01:56:06,400 --> 01:56:10,360
Speaker 3: But show how we really played. Everybody got filed.

1903
01:56:10,600 --> 01:56:16,560
Speaker 2: There's a guy during that time got hit harder and

1904
01:56:16,680 --> 01:56:21,040
Speaker 2: more times than Isaiah Thomas driving down the lane. I

1905
01:56:21,080 --> 01:56:23,440
Speaker 2: got the scars for it, but I ain't never cried.

1906
01:56:23,880 --> 01:56:26,480
Speaker 2: I just got up, went to the fire line. But

1907
01:56:26,680 --> 01:56:28,640
Speaker 2: you know he went to the league office. You know

1908
01:56:29,240 --> 01:56:32,120
Speaker 2: they wrote newspaper articles about it. You sitting here talking

1909
01:56:32,120 --> 01:56:34,920
Speaker 2: about the Jordan rules, and man, we had Kareem rules,

1910
01:56:34,960 --> 01:56:36,000
Speaker 2: we had Magic rules.

1911
01:56:36,720 --> 01:56:41,800
Speaker 3: Y'all played. There was Tim Duncan Ruse, Ryan Ruse rules.

1912
01:56:41,840 --> 01:56:43,560
Speaker 3: So don't make it sound.

1913
01:56:43,400 --> 01:56:45,280
Speaker 5: Like AI rule. Don't get crossed.

1914
01:56:45,360 --> 01:56:47,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, don't make it sound like it was.

1915
01:56:47,800 --> 01:56:50,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, it don't make it sound like it was something

1916
01:56:50,760 --> 01:56:55,000
Speaker 2: really special for them that we had a defensive philosophy

1917
01:56:55,160 --> 01:57:00,760
Speaker 2: for everybody. We played again and his was okay, send

1918
01:57:00,800 --> 01:57:03,680
Speaker 2: them to the foul line, they can make free throws.

1919
01:57:04,760 --> 01:57:07,240
Speaker 2: He was eighty five from the line. We had a

1920
01:57:07,240 --> 01:57:09,320
Speaker 2: better chance for him missing the free throw, which he

1921
01:57:09,320 --> 01:57:13,800
Speaker 2: didn't miss that many. But that dunk, that's for sure too. Yeah,

1922
01:57:14,280 --> 01:57:15,720
Speaker 2: so momentum.

1923
01:57:15,720 --> 01:57:19,160
Speaker 3: Again, So you know possessions, you know shot clocks.

1924
01:57:20,000 --> 01:57:22,040
Speaker 4: You keep trying to go up and dunk four quarter?

1925
01:57:22,080 --> 01:57:23,480
Speaker 4: You tied them shots short.

1926
01:57:23,560 --> 01:57:25,600
Speaker 2: Tell me about it. And by the way, guess what

1927
01:57:25,800 --> 01:57:31,000
Speaker 2: we set real screen? Yeah, yeah, we set screens on offense. Yeah,

1928
01:57:31,480 --> 01:57:36,200
Speaker 2: so you know, everybody getting picked, but then there's some

1929
01:57:36,200 --> 01:57:42,280
Speaker 2: people who get picked harder. Right, so if you if

1930
01:57:42,280 --> 01:57:44,600
Speaker 2: your head ain't on a swivel down there, part of

1931
01:57:45,120 --> 01:57:49,240
Speaker 2: that's part of the game now, lockof So that so

1932
01:57:49,360 --> 01:57:52,160
Speaker 2: don't don't again, don't make it like something that it

1933
01:57:52,160 --> 01:57:52,640
Speaker 2: really was.

1934
01:57:52,720 --> 01:57:55,120
Speaker 4: But you know, as basketball players, we understand that because

1935
01:57:55,120 --> 01:57:57,640
Speaker 4: if you've been in the playoffs, you have you you

1936
01:57:57,680 --> 01:57:59,880
Speaker 4: do game planers and different strategies for each team.

1937
01:58:00,160 --> 01:58:01,920
Speaker 5: Each you have rules for star players.

1938
01:58:01,960 --> 01:58:04,040
Speaker 1: So but I also like them being able to explain

1939
01:58:04,080 --> 01:58:05,920
Speaker 1: it because this is the narrative that has been.

1940
01:58:05,840 --> 01:58:08,600
Speaker 2: Out for thirty forty years. You know what I mean?

1941
01:58:08,640 --> 01:58:10,000
Speaker 2: For you to be able to break it down.

1942
01:58:10,160 --> 01:58:12,480
Speaker 1: It wasn't just there was rules for this, this and that,

1943
01:58:12,560 --> 01:58:14,320
Speaker 1: but they just chose to focus.

1944
01:58:13,960 --> 01:58:16,600
Speaker 2: On That's why y'all got the best show of going

1945
01:58:16,680 --> 01:58:19,440
Speaker 2: all that smoke. You got two crew form of players

1946
01:58:20,040 --> 01:58:25,640
Speaker 2: that now I can have in depth real basketball conversations.

1947
01:58:26,040 --> 01:58:28,680
Speaker 2: I ain't talking to two guys that ain't never played

1948
01:58:28,720 --> 01:58:30,400
Speaker 2: in the NBA. I ain't talking two guys that ain't

1949
01:58:30,440 --> 01:58:33,040
Speaker 2: never won championships. They ain't never played. I'm talking to

1950
01:58:33,120 --> 01:58:36,120
Speaker 2: the real guys now, right. There ain't a whole lot

1951
01:58:36,120 --> 01:58:39,920
Speaker 2: of real guys you can have this level of conversation with, right,

1952
01:58:40,320 --> 01:58:42,560
Speaker 2: So it always had to get dumbed down. You know.

1953
01:58:43,360 --> 01:58:45,920
Speaker 2: Then they take a few sentences or whatever, they chop

1954
01:58:45,960 --> 01:58:47,880
Speaker 2: it up and they go to this the Detroit business.

1955
01:58:48,640 --> 01:58:51,800
Speaker 4: But like I said, it's definitely refreshing to hear from

1956
01:58:51,880 --> 01:58:54,440
Speaker 4: your mom because we know that we know it's rules

1957
01:58:54,440 --> 01:58:56,720
Speaker 4: for every different players, especially the star players. And if

1958
01:58:56,760 --> 01:58:58,800
Speaker 4: you don't have no rules, they're gonna get your ass

1959
01:58:58,800 --> 01:59:00,920
Speaker 4: fifty points. Then you gonna look like you don't even

1960
01:59:00,960 --> 01:59:04,120
Speaker 4: belong God there, Thank you, good down, Thank you.

1961
01:59:06,000 --> 01:59:06,879
Speaker 2: Early nineties.

1962
01:59:06,920 --> 01:59:09,800
Speaker 1: You're coming off three straight finals appearance. You tell your

1963
01:59:09,800 --> 01:59:13,120
Speaker 1: achilles an injury back then there was a career ender.

1964
01:59:13,160 --> 01:59:16,959
Speaker 1: Now they're coming back off them thoughts when that happens.

1965
01:59:17,360 --> 01:59:21,400
Speaker 2: So here was the career ending that that I don't

1966
01:59:21,440 --> 01:59:27,040
Speaker 2: talk about and didn't talk about. Right, So your wrists, yeah,

1967
01:59:27,960 --> 01:59:29,800
Speaker 2: see this is as far as I can bet my wrist.

1968
01:59:30,000 --> 01:59:36,000
Speaker 2: That's your shooting hand to my shooting hand. Now, the

1969
01:59:36,040 --> 01:59:39,760
Speaker 2: doctor Kirk Watson, it's called the Kirk Watson Rich surgery.

1970
01:59:40,440 --> 01:59:41,600
Speaker 3: He invented the surgery.

1971
01:59:42,720 --> 01:59:45,480
Speaker 2: And when he did this surgery on my wrist in

1972
01:59:45,800 --> 01:59:48,080
Speaker 2: ninety one, this is the year we lost.

1973
01:59:48,920 --> 01:59:52,480
Speaker 3: I think I missed like fifty some games that year.

1974
01:59:54,120 --> 01:59:59,160
Speaker 2: He said to me, you never play basketball again, and

1975
01:59:59,200 --> 02:00:01,840
Speaker 2: I was like, no, I'm gonna play. Go No, this

1976
02:00:01,880 --> 02:00:07,240
Speaker 2: is this is career ending specifically for a small guard.

1977
02:00:07,480 --> 02:00:10,520
Speaker 2: Now for big men who play around the basket. If

1978
02:00:10,520 --> 02:00:13,839
Speaker 2: you was six seven post up guy, you know it worked.

1979
02:00:14,320 --> 02:00:17,400
Speaker 2: But you being a small guy having to shoot from

1980
02:00:17,440 --> 02:00:20,240
Speaker 2: the perimeter. And you can go back and look after

1981
02:00:20,280 --> 02:00:23,040
Speaker 2: we won in ninety and after this wrisk surgery, right,

1982
02:00:23,840 --> 02:00:25,760
Speaker 2: you can look at my stats from ninety one to

1983
02:00:25,840 --> 02:00:31,960
Speaker 2: ninety four. I won't the same player because I couldn't shoot.

1984
02:00:32,360 --> 02:00:37,520
Speaker 3: Now, why did I have to hang on that contract?

1985
02:00:37,600 --> 02:00:41,720
Speaker 2: Right? You know you you got three more years left

1986
02:00:41,800 --> 02:00:43,840
Speaker 2: on the contract. I ain't gonna get that bad. You

1987
02:00:43,880 --> 02:00:47,480
Speaker 2: gotta get the money now. I can't retire. So you

1988
02:00:47,560 --> 02:00:49,640
Speaker 2: stay and you do the best you can. But you're

1989
02:00:49,680 --> 02:00:52,120
Speaker 2: not the same anymore. When did you realize you want?

1990
02:00:52,640 --> 02:00:54,080
Speaker 2: Like as soon as you came back, you knew. I

1991
02:00:54,120 --> 02:00:56,800
Speaker 2: was like, oh shit, I can't bend my wrist. I couldn't.

1992
02:00:57,680 --> 02:01:03,160
Speaker 2: So nineteen ninety, I think I still hold the three

1993
02:01:03,200 --> 02:01:07,680
Speaker 2: point shooting record in the NBA Finals, the highest percentage.

1994
02:01:07,800 --> 02:01:12,080
Speaker 2: I think I shot sixty two, sixty three from the

1995
02:01:12,080 --> 02:01:15,480
Speaker 2: three point line. You got researcher here right there. You're

1996
02:01:15,480 --> 02:01:17,840
Speaker 2: doing it right now on it come out of telling.

1997
02:01:18,360 --> 02:01:21,440
Speaker 2: Nineteen ninety were playing the Portland Trail Blazers. We beat

1998
02:01:21,480 --> 02:01:27,320
Speaker 2: them for one. What was my three point field goal percentage? Damn? Damn?

1999
02:01:28,320 --> 02:01:28,760
Speaker 5: What you was?

2000
02:01:28,880 --> 02:01:30,919
Speaker 4: What you was shooting in the ocean?

2001
02:01:31,880 --> 02:01:38,360
Speaker 2: Sh I was kind of good understand So that that

2002
02:01:38,520 --> 02:01:42,600
Speaker 2: still is the highest percentage percentage right sixty. So now

2003
02:01:42,640 --> 02:01:47,560
Speaker 2: I come back ninety one and how you hurt your wrist?

2004
02:01:48,120 --> 02:01:51,840
Speaker 2: Shot too much? It was just doctor said, hey, yeah,

2005
02:01:51,880 --> 02:01:53,880
Speaker 2: he said, you on't hear so many bands in the wrist.

2006
02:01:54,360 --> 02:02:00,600
Speaker 2: Crazy and I was, man, I I practice. All I

2007
02:02:00,680 --> 02:02:04,400
Speaker 2: was doing was shooting, and I had got so good

2008
02:02:04,480 --> 02:02:08,120
Speaker 2: from that three point line, and then my penetration game

2009
02:02:08,200 --> 02:02:10,879
Speaker 2: was on. So again, like when you talk about the pistols,

2010
02:02:10,920 --> 02:02:15,440
Speaker 2: we changed the way the game's played in that same series,

2011
02:02:15,480 --> 02:02:17,880
Speaker 2: What did Bill Lambert shoot from the three point line?

2012
02:02:18,200 --> 02:02:25,400
Speaker 2: Thirty seven thirty six right in today's game? In today's game,

2013
02:02:25,520 --> 02:02:30,760
Speaker 2: that's the standard. Right, So you know that was all

2014
02:02:30,800 --> 02:02:34,240
Speaker 2: center and that's how we played, right. Bill Lambier was

2015
02:02:34,280 --> 02:02:38,640
Speaker 2: heavily criticized because he wasn't a post up center and

2016
02:02:38,680 --> 02:02:41,560
Speaker 2: he was standing outside shooting three pointers and we was

2017
02:02:41,560 --> 02:02:44,760
Speaker 2: playing pick and roll. But you know, when did I

2018
02:02:44,800 --> 02:02:49,280
Speaker 2: know it was over? After that surgery? So I had

2019
02:02:49,320 --> 02:02:52,760
Speaker 2: to the first part of the surgery. I had to

2020
02:02:52,760 --> 02:02:58,360
Speaker 2: walk around like this for six weeks and their little

2021
02:02:58,360 --> 02:03:01,240
Speaker 2: sling and they won't no bla love running up in it, right,

2022
02:03:02,280 --> 02:03:06,840
Speaker 2: And then they let me come down like this, right.

2023
02:03:07,680 --> 02:03:10,720
Speaker 2: And then when they took the cast and everything off, Man,

2024
02:03:10,760 --> 02:03:11,520
Speaker 2: my wrist was that.

2025
02:03:11,560 --> 02:03:18,040
Speaker 4: Big, funky the cast was stinking. Oh I remember them days.

2026
02:03:17,880 --> 02:03:18,440
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah.

2027
02:03:19,400 --> 02:03:25,080
Speaker 2: And so now we I'm playing left handed in the

2028
02:03:25,120 --> 02:03:27,560
Speaker 2: playoffs because I can't.

2029
02:03:27,280 --> 02:03:29,440
Speaker 1: Shoot, Is it painful. You just can't bend.

2030
02:03:29,240 --> 02:03:31,600
Speaker 2: It painful, you know, I wouldn't come out of the

2031
02:03:31,600 --> 02:03:36,400
Speaker 2: cast muscles around it. And then they slapping, I mean

2032
02:03:36,440 --> 02:03:40,440
Speaker 2: they hit me. Scottie Pippen hit my arm one time

2033
02:03:40,480 --> 02:03:43,080
Speaker 2: in the Eastern Coverage final. Man, I swear to god,

2034
02:03:43,680 --> 02:03:48,520
Speaker 2: tears came to my just smother. I didn't do all

2035
02:03:48,560 --> 02:03:51,400
Speaker 2: that because you can't let them know, right, man, I

2036
02:03:51,680 --> 02:03:54,640
Speaker 2: swear to god, I started crying. And if I wasn't sweating, right,

2037
02:03:54,840 --> 02:03:57,120
Speaker 2: you would have seen it. People, people would have seen it.

2038
02:03:57,160 --> 02:04:01,440
Speaker 2: I was just playing it off, like man, that dude

2039
02:04:01,520 --> 02:04:03,920
Speaker 2: hit my arm so hard. Man. And speaking of Scotty,

2040
02:04:04,160 --> 02:04:06,000
Speaker 2: I do want to clean some up and gig Scotty

2041
02:04:06,120 --> 02:04:13,080
Speaker 2: is respect because as a defender, right, he don't get

2042
02:04:13,160 --> 02:04:17,840
Speaker 2: enough credit. And when we talk about probably the greatest

2043
02:04:18,160 --> 02:04:21,920
Speaker 2: and the best defender that's ever played in the NBA,

2044
02:04:23,160 --> 02:04:31,160
Speaker 2: Chicago had two Robbing and Scottie Pippen, but Scotty, Scotty

2045
02:04:31,240 --> 02:04:36,160
Speaker 2: was different, you know, as a defender at his best,

2046
02:04:36,440 --> 02:04:39,760
Speaker 2: I may have to say that he and Robin one

2047
02:04:39,800 --> 02:04:43,320
Speaker 2: and two best defenders probably ever to play the game.

2048
02:04:43,880 --> 02:04:47,879
Speaker 2: And so I do want to give him his respect

2049
02:04:48,000 --> 02:04:54,560
Speaker 2: and his props because and then as a facilitator, you know,

2050
02:04:54,920 --> 02:04:57,640
Speaker 2: I mean Scotty Scotty, you know he was, he was

2051
02:04:57,680 --> 02:05:02,280
Speaker 2: the real deal. It was a great Yeah, there's been

2052
02:05:02,400 --> 02:05:05,680
Speaker 2: recent debates about the physicality in today's game.

2053
02:05:06,760 --> 02:05:08,800
Speaker 1: I don't even understand this because it's not physical. This

2054
02:05:08,920 --> 02:05:13,560
Speaker 1: is the internet talk. So there's been some guys that

2055
02:05:13,640 --> 02:05:16,040
Speaker 1: we play with, Yeah, Gilbert Aarenaz, JJ Redick in particularly

2056
02:05:16,080 --> 02:05:18,880
Speaker 1: that says it's tougher to play in today's game than

2057
02:05:18,920 --> 02:05:21,960
Speaker 1: it was to play in the eighties. Thoughts on that,

2058
02:05:22,320 --> 02:05:24,560
Speaker 1: I mean, obviously the physicality. I don't think there's any

2059
02:05:24,560 --> 02:05:28,160
Speaker 1: comparison to the physicality when you played to what today

2060
02:05:28,200 --> 02:05:30,960
Speaker 1: is because you can't be physical. But just thoughts on

2061
02:05:31,160 --> 02:05:34,880
Speaker 1: I guess let me change my questions just the errors

2062
02:05:34,920 --> 02:05:38,520
Speaker 1: of basketball in your mind, being an all time great,

2063
02:05:39,080 --> 02:05:41,440
Speaker 1: is it hard to compare? Can you compare eras or

2064
02:05:41,520 --> 02:05:43,440
Speaker 1: just the game has continued to evolve so much that

2065
02:05:43,480 --> 02:05:44,960
Speaker 1: it's just kind of you leave them in their era.

2066
02:05:47,440 --> 02:05:50,920
Speaker 2: So I do have to answer this question in a

2067
02:05:50,960 --> 02:05:58,640
Speaker 2: lot of ways. Okay, so the errors are different. Some

2068
02:05:58,680 --> 02:06:02,120
Speaker 2: people say the eighties was the best era of basketball. Ever,

2069
02:06:04,080 --> 02:06:11,440
Speaker 2: some people have said the nineties, you know, it's wasn't

2070
02:06:11,680 --> 02:06:19,400
Speaker 2: one of the greatest basketball eras ever them two thousands.

2071
02:06:19,760 --> 02:06:29,800
Speaker 2: You know that as the rules started changing and coaching

2072
02:06:29,920 --> 02:06:35,640
Speaker 2: schemes started changing. When you say the game has evolved,

2073
02:06:37,560 --> 02:06:39,840
Speaker 2: so I'm gonna go back and I'm gonna go there,

2074
02:06:40,840 --> 02:06:42,680
Speaker 2: and then I want you to take me back to

2075
02:06:42,720 --> 02:06:49,160
Speaker 2: this question. So has the game really evolved? And what

2076
02:06:49,240 --> 02:06:54,720
Speaker 2: does that mean when you say it's evolved? Now, I

2077
02:06:54,720 --> 02:06:57,480
Speaker 2: grew up with watching a guy by the name of

2078
02:06:57,520 --> 02:07:02,920
Speaker 2: Billy Harres shoot from half court. He wouldn't take a layup.

2079
02:07:04,240 --> 02:07:08,080
Speaker 2: He come down one on nobody and he stopped and

2080
02:07:08,160 --> 02:07:10,080
Speaker 2: pull up at the top of the key, and everybody

2081
02:07:10,120 --> 02:07:14,160
Speaker 2: would holler, lay up right. He was known for never

2082
02:07:14,160 --> 02:07:17,320
Speaker 2: shooting the layup right. He was known for pulling up

2083
02:07:17,320 --> 02:07:23,120
Speaker 2: at half court knocking it down. When y'all was playing

2084
02:07:24,280 --> 02:07:25,600
Speaker 2: in the real games, it was a guy by the

2085
02:07:25,640 --> 02:07:29,880
Speaker 2: name of Stephan Marberry Straberry who would stop at half court,

2086
02:07:31,080 --> 02:07:38,880
Speaker 2: pull up, boom, knock it down. What has changed? And

2087
02:07:39,880 --> 02:07:43,520
Speaker 2: the guy who doesn't get credit for changing the game

2088
02:07:44,160 --> 02:07:49,280
Speaker 2: in this so called evolution of the game, his name

2089
02:07:49,320 --> 02:07:55,280
Speaker 2: would be coach Mark Jackson. Now let me tell you

2090
02:07:55,400 --> 02:08:00,560
Speaker 2: why Mark Jackson changed the game. Because Mark jacksc so

2091
02:08:00,680 --> 02:08:03,600
Speaker 2: a guy by the name of Steph Curry and a

2092
02:08:03,640 --> 02:08:07,280
Speaker 2: guy by the name of Clay Thompson, and Mark Jackson

2093
02:08:07,320 --> 02:08:12,560
Speaker 2: as a coach, made it acceptable. He made it acceptable

2094
02:08:13,480 --> 02:08:17,120
Speaker 2: for Steph Curry and Clay to shoot.

2095
02:08:16,760 --> 02:08:18,840
Speaker 3: From that range.

2096
02:08:19,160 --> 02:08:23,240
Speaker 2: People always shot from their range, they just didn't do

2097
02:08:23,360 --> 02:08:30,520
Speaker 2: it as part of their offensive schemes. Mark Jackson solely

2098
02:08:32,640 --> 02:08:37,960
Speaker 2: accepted Steph and Clay shooting from that distance, from that

2099
02:08:38,200 --> 02:08:40,920
Speaker 2: range doing crucial parts of the.

2100
02:08:40,920 --> 02:08:43,000
Speaker 1: Game because before that it was lived by the day

2101
02:08:43,080 --> 02:08:45,000
Speaker 1: three dive US three because it hadn't been proven yet

2102
02:08:45,040 --> 02:08:45,920
Speaker 1: that you could win that way.

2103
02:08:46,880 --> 02:08:49,080
Speaker 3: Well, we proved it.

2104
02:08:48,640 --> 02:08:52,200
Speaker 1: Consistently at a I'll take it back because it was

2105
02:08:52,240 --> 02:08:55,280
Speaker 1: inside out. But also you know when you when we

2106
02:08:55,320 --> 02:08:57,560
Speaker 1: talked about your three point percentage were eleven for sixteen

2107
02:08:57,560 --> 02:08:58,160
Speaker 1: in the finals.

2108
02:08:58,160 --> 02:09:00,480
Speaker 2: Like that's one game for guys, now, you know what

2109
02:09:00,520 --> 02:09:03,240
Speaker 2: I mean. So just the volume, the value, that's what

2110
02:09:03,240 --> 02:09:06,440
Speaker 2: I'm doing it so Mark, So the one who has

2111
02:09:06,600 --> 02:09:13,960
Speaker 2: power gives definition too, and the one who has power

2112
02:09:15,040 --> 02:09:20,440
Speaker 2: can also allow things to happen. We came up and

2113
02:09:20,480 --> 02:09:26,280
Speaker 2: when we were playing all coaches that wasn't acceptable to

2114
02:09:26,440 --> 02:09:31,400
Speaker 2: shoot and from that distance or play that way. It

2115
02:09:31,520 --> 02:09:39,960
Speaker 2: just wasn't acceptable. Mark Jackson alone accepted and when he accepted,

2116
02:09:41,120 --> 02:09:46,240
Speaker 2: that changed the game. That changed the game. Steph Curry,

2117
02:09:47,280 --> 02:09:52,520
Speaker 2: Clay Thompson would not be Steph Curry Clay Thompson getting

2118
02:09:52,560 --> 02:09:57,360
Speaker 2: credit for evolutionary if there wasn't a teacher and a

2119
02:09:57,520 --> 02:09:58,680
Speaker 2: masters say.

2120
02:10:00,080 --> 02:10:01,000
Speaker 3: You can do that.

2121
02:10:02,400 --> 02:10:08,560
Speaker 2: And I'll never forget watching Golden State play. Okay see,

2122
02:10:10,400 --> 02:10:15,120
Speaker 2: and Clay Thompson pulled up, dude in the pressure situation,

2123
02:10:15,880 --> 02:10:21,760
Speaker 2: the pressure situation from the hash Mark bam. Now, Mark

2124
02:10:21,840 --> 02:10:28,560
Speaker 2: Jackson wasn't coaching in but the thought the acceptability right

2125
02:10:28,920 --> 02:10:33,680
Speaker 2: that that's were watching Kevin Durant and Cleveland come down

2126
02:10:34,240 --> 02:10:38,320
Speaker 2: and Lebron James waiting for him, and Kevin Durant stopped

2127
02:10:38,640 --> 02:10:43,280
Speaker 2: three feet from behind Booms Sandwiches, and they asked Lebron

2128
02:10:43,360 --> 02:10:45,560
Speaker 2: James what was the difference between last year and this year?

2129
02:10:45,640 --> 02:10:54,040
Speaker 2: He said, kd You know, but Mark Jackson, in my opinion,

2130
02:10:55,480 --> 02:10:57,920
Speaker 2: when you say the evolution of the game and a

2131
02:10:58,000 --> 02:11:04,080
Speaker 2: three point shot, his name should be. Yeah. He's the

2132
02:11:04,120 --> 02:11:08,200
Speaker 2: one who changed the game. He's the one who made

2133
02:11:08,240 --> 02:11:13,000
Speaker 2: it acceptable from a coaching standpoint to not allow you.

2134
02:11:13,000 --> 02:11:13,920
Speaker 3: To shoot them there.

2135
02:11:14,240 --> 02:11:17,400
Speaker 2: Yeah, me, neither at all. But allow you to miss

2136
02:11:18,160 --> 02:11:18,560
Speaker 2: from there.

2137
02:11:18,560 --> 02:11:20,520
Speaker 1: It wasn't shooting like you said, It was the missus.

2138
02:11:20,360 --> 02:11:22,800
Speaker 2: It's the missus. He can't keep missing. That can't keep missing.

2139
02:11:22,960 --> 02:11:25,600
Speaker 2: Now we see, guys. I saw Steph come back his

2140
02:11:25,680 --> 02:11:27,840
Speaker 2: first game after being injured one time, and he went

2141
02:11:27,880 --> 02:11:30,560
Speaker 2: three for sixteen in Portland from the three point line.

2142
02:11:30,800 --> 02:11:35,160
Speaker 2: It's acceptable now, sixteen of them boys, it's acceptable now, right?

2143
02:11:35,320 --> 02:11:37,640
Speaker 3: You know you can. You can go one for.

2144
02:11:37,760 --> 02:11:42,360
Speaker 2: Ten and say I'm gonna get hot Mark, Mark Jackson.

2145
02:11:43,720 --> 02:11:45,640
Speaker 3: Change the game.

2146
02:11:45,680 --> 02:11:48,040
Speaker 1: And that's not even just credit and Clay and stuff's talent.

2147
02:11:48,200 --> 02:11:49,960
Speaker 1: But like you said, to understand what you're saying, it's

2148
02:11:50,000 --> 02:11:52,560
Speaker 1: just someone that will allowing and accept it and understand it.

2149
02:11:53,200 --> 02:11:56,680
Speaker 1: And you're definitely not wrong. I know you were obviously

2150
02:11:56,720 --> 02:12:01,040
Speaker 1: a team guy and and you ran your system and

2151
02:12:01,080 --> 02:12:05,480
Speaker 1: you thought. But with the freedom of today's game, because

2152
02:12:05,480 --> 02:12:08,840
Speaker 1: of Mark, what do you feel like if you were

2153
02:12:08,880 --> 02:12:10,600
Speaker 1: just an individual out there in today's game, what do

2154
02:12:10,600 --> 02:12:12,280
Speaker 1: you feel like you can average with your ability to

2155
02:12:12,320 --> 02:12:14,600
Speaker 1: do people can't stand in front of you can shoot

2156
02:12:14,600 --> 02:12:15,440
Speaker 1: the ball to high clip.

2157
02:12:16,320 --> 02:12:22,040
Speaker 2: If I dominated, then I would dominating. Yeah, I mean

2158
02:12:22,080 --> 02:12:28,160
Speaker 2: I because the rules now favor me. They favor the

2159
02:12:28,280 --> 02:12:31,280
Speaker 2: small guy. They they favor me. Now, freedom of movement,

2160
02:12:31,480 --> 02:12:35,200
Speaker 2: self space, No, ain't nobody in the lane.

2161
02:12:35,720 --> 02:12:36,920
Speaker 5: No hand checking either.

2162
02:12:37,280 --> 02:12:41,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, but you know the hand checking it bothered me some.

2163
02:12:41,480 --> 02:12:44,760
Speaker 2: But I was fast right, so and then I knew

2164
02:12:44,760 --> 02:12:47,400
Speaker 2: a little judo, So you put your hand there. I

2165
02:12:47,440 --> 02:12:49,800
Speaker 2: hit them, you know, I knew how to I knew

2166
02:12:49,800 --> 02:12:54,800
Speaker 2: how to move it and get by. But the nobody

2167
02:12:54,840 --> 02:12:57,880
Speaker 2: in the lane. See, every time I drove down the lane,

2168
02:12:58,360 --> 02:13:01,560
Speaker 2: six people in the lane. You know, there's me and

2169
02:13:01,640 --> 02:13:06,600
Speaker 2: my defender and then there's you know, two big So

2170
02:13:06,680 --> 02:13:09,160
Speaker 2: you you got to be tricky around the basket. Now

2171
02:13:09,160 --> 02:13:13,720
Speaker 2: you're driving down the lane, it's naked. Ain't nobody there,

2172
02:13:13,920 --> 02:13:17,920
Speaker 2: so you you get to stretch out, lay up if

2173
02:13:17,920 --> 02:13:19,800
Speaker 2: you if you saw me coming down, I had to.

2174
02:13:19,880 --> 02:13:22,120
Speaker 2: I had to ball up and then I had to

2175
02:13:22,120 --> 02:13:27,160
Speaker 2: come out, you know. So But like I said that,

2176
02:13:27,400 --> 02:13:31,720
Speaker 2: if if I dominated, then I would dominate now and

2177
02:13:31,720 --> 02:13:34,240
Speaker 2: and make no mistake about it. In the game of basketball.

2178
02:13:34,400 --> 02:13:37,280
Speaker 2: Some people may say you're arrogant. I don't care. I

2179
02:13:37,600 --> 02:13:44,680
Speaker 2: am extremely confident in my skills and my ability. In

2180
02:13:44,760 --> 02:13:46,640
Speaker 2: what I was doing and what I could do. I

2181
02:13:46,640 --> 02:13:50,760
Speaker 2: can't do it now, But you know, I would be

2182
02:13:50,800 --> 02:13:51,320
Speaker 2: all right.

2183
02:13:52,120 --> 02:13:54,880
Speaker 1: I agree to say the least three players you feel

2184
02:13:54,920 --> 02:13:56,880
Speaker 1: like they'll be the face of the NBA in the

2185
02:13:56,880 --> 02:14:00,160
Speaker 1: next ten years.

2186
02:14:00,600 --> 02:14:06,880
Speaker 2: I don't know if they'll be from America. I'm just

2187
02:14:06,960 --> 02:14:08,040
Speaker 2: saying facts.

2188
02:14:08,120 --> 02:14:08,919
Speaker 5: That's crazy.

2189
02:14:09,080 --> 02:14:14,160
Speaker 2: I mean, that's crazy, that that's true though, Jannis Luca,

2190
02:14:16,120 --> 02:14:18,080
Speaker 2: you know, Joker. I mean when you look at the

2191
02:14:18,160 --> 02:14:22,920
Speaker 2: last five, the young boy woman Yama. Yeah, I mean

2192
02:14:22,960 --> 02:14:26,200
Speaker 2: when you look at the last name, the last four

2193
02:14:26,280 --> 02:14:30,720
Speaker 2: five m m vps, they all been international players. Now

2194
02:14:30,800 --> 02:14:34,880
Speaker 2: that's you know, that's the conversation I have.

2195
02:14:35,520 --> 02:14:39,160
Speaker 4: Yeah, winning the MVP and can't get to the finals

2196
02:14:39,240 --> 02:14:41,600
Speaker 4: or at least the conference finals or something. You can't

2197
02:14:41,720 --> 02:14:44,480
Speaker 4: gotta win. Yeah, it gotta be a shut it down after,

2198
02:14:44,600 --> 02:14:46,280
Speaker 4: like you can win it back to back. Okay, cool,

2199
02:14:46,840 --> 02:14:48,840
Speaker 4: I understand that. But one of them back to back years,

2200
02:14:48,880 --> 02:14:51,200
Speaker 4: you got at least get to your conference finals. Bro,

2201
02:14:51,640 --> 02:14:52,880
Speaker 4: you can't get there. You're not MVP.

2202
02:14:53,160 --> 02:14:55,120
Speaker 1: Got it one time? Then they go to the Western finals.

2203
02:14:55,160 --> 02:14:58,960
Speaker 4: Once in the bubble, right now, that bubble ship don't count.

2204
02:14:59,800 --> 02:15:03,720
Speaker 3: But this was the number. This where the analytics don't count.

2205
02:15:04,800 --> 02:15:09,240
Speaker 2: This is where the analytics, like you know, the the

2206
02:15:09,800 --> 02:15:13,840
Speaker 2: those remember I said, those who are in power, they

2207
02:15:13,840 --> 02:15:18,560
Speaker 2: give definition two. So they get to define, and they

2208
02:15:18,560 --> 02:15:21,880
Speaker 2: get to make the rules and they get to say

2209
02:15:22,160 --> 02:15:30,600
Speaker 2: what's acceptable. So now winning is totally discounted. Yes, that

2210
02:15:31,480 --> 02:15:34,000
Speaker 2: you know, it's like anybody can win. And I'm here

2211
02:15:34,000 --> 02:15:36,640
Speaker 2: to say, no, that ain't true. Those of us who

2212
02:15:36,680 --> 02:15:39,520
Speaker 2: have won will let you know like it ain't easy. No,

2213
02:15:39,640 --> 02:15:42,120
Speaker 2: it ain't easy. And that that guy who's the twelfth

2214
02:15:42,120 --> 02:15:43,960
Speaker 2: man that do count? Right?

2215
02:15:44,040 --> 02:15:45,120
Speaker 3: And why does he count?

2216
02:15:45,200 --> 02:15:49,240
Speaker 2: Because there is a such thing called chemistry that makes

2217
02:15:49,240 --> 02:15:52,280
Speaker 2: a whole team work, that makes it all together.

2218
02:15:52,360 --> 02:15:54,800
Speaker 3: And that guy who part of it is a big

2219
02:15:54,840 --> 02:15:55,320
Speaker 3: part of it.

2220
02:15:56,000 --> 02:16:00,440
Speaker 2: His personality, his character, his showing up things that you

2221
02:16:00,600 --> 02:16:05,040
Speaker 2: don't measure right, those things are what we say, those

2222
02:16:05,080 --> 02:16:07,640
Speaker 2: are the things that we value. Remember when we was

2223
02:16:07,680 --> 02:16:11,520
Speaker 2: growing up, it was like, dude, you could have a

2224
02:16:11,640 --> 02:16:17,600
Speaker 2: twenty points and ten rebounds, but if your character is nasty, you.

2225
02:16:17,440 --> 02:16:18,200
Speaker 3: Ain't on a team.

2226
02:16:18,240 --> 02:16:19,880
Speaker 2: Yah, I ain't picking you, You ain't on a teen.

2227
02:16:19,960 --> 02:16:21,880
Speaker 2: You just ain't on a team. Now you can have

2228
02:16:21,960 --> 02:16:24,120
Speaker 2: as twenty and ten have a bad attitude and they'd

2229
02:16:24,160 --> 02:16:26,200
Speaker 2: be like, well, you know, he does get twenty points

2230
02:16:26,480 --> 02:16:29,720
Speaker 2: ten rebounds, but they never speak to your personality, your character,

2231
02:16:29,800 --> 02:16:32,720
Speaker 2: who you are, you're upstanding, none of that, right, So

2232
02:16:33,440 --> 02:16:37,520
Speaker 2: since winning doesn't matter now, we're just talking about numbers.

2233
02:16:38,080 --> 02:16:44,320
Speaker 2: And if we're only talking about numbers, analytics makes you

2234
02:16:44,600 --> 02:16:50,000
Speaker 2: selfish because you are only thinking about your numbers, and

2235
02:16:50,040 --> 02:16:53,840
Speaker 2: you get paid on your numbers. And if I'm getting

2236
02:16:53,840 --> 02:16:56,680
Speaker 2: paid on my numbers, and all I gotta do is

2237
02:16:56,720 --> 02:17:03,039
Speaker 2: get numbers. And because that's all Republic understands. Because we

2238
02:17:03,240 --> 02:17:06,320
Speaker 2: have to we have to present the game in a

2239
02:17:06,360 --> 02:17:09,600
Speaker 2: way that the average fan will understand it so we

2240
02:17:09,600 --> 02:17:12,280
Speaker 2: can get more fans. So if I dumb it down

2241
02:17:12,360 --> 02:17:14,879
Speaker 2: and break it down so it's only about numbers, then

2242
02:17:14,920 --> 02:17:18,959
Speaker 2: it's a game for everybody. It's not an exclusive club anymore.

2243
02:17:19,160 --> 02:17:21,480
Speaker 2: Anybody can do it. You got kids not thinking like

2244
02:17:21,520 --> 02:17:24,400
Speaker 2: they can play like Steph Curry and shoot like Steph

2245
02:17:24,480 --> 02:17:26,960
Speaker 2: Curry because right now, all you got to do is

2246
02:17:27,000 --> 02:17:30,680
Speaker 2: be able to dribble, make a layup, make a free throw,

2247
02:17:30,680 --> 02:17:33,760
Speaker 2: and shoot a jump shot. You don't have to understand

2248
02:17:33,760 --> 02:17:36,680
Speaker 2: no schemes. So when you look at a guy like

2249
02:17:36,879 --> 02:17:40,240
Speaker 2: you know, the joker, no disrespect, you know I like him,

2250
02:17:40,320 --> 02:17:46,800
Speaker 2: But I was I was saying the other year, like

2251
02:17:46,920 --> 02:17:53,640
Speaker 2: Devin Booker. His team at the best record, and he

2252
02:17:53,720 --> 02:17:58,119
Speaker 2: was average twenty six twenty seven points and he ain't

2253
02:17:58,160 --> 02:18:01,440
Speaker 2: the MVP, right right, There used to be a time

2254
02:18:01,520 --> 02:18:05,280
Speaker 2: when winning mass record when it matters. You haveage twenty six,

2255
02:18:05,360 --> 02:18:06,360
Speaker 2: you have age twenty seven.

2256
02:18:07,040 --> 02:18:08,280
Speaker 3: You know, we got to give you that.

2257
02:18:08,560 --> 02:18:11,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, but you can't be the MVP of the league

2258
02:18:12,360 --> 02:18:16,279
Speaker 2: one year and your team is in fifth places.

2259
02:18:16,560 --> 02:18:16,920
Speaker 5: Yeah.

2260
02:18:17,080 --> 02:18:19,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's never worked that way.

2261
02:18:19,720 --> 02:18:20,440
Speaker 5: And you can't be the.

2262
02:18:20,360 --> 02:18:22,000
Speaker 4: Best player in the league for sure when your team

2263
02:18:22,040 --> 02:18:25,680
Speaker 4: not even in the playoffs. Yeah, they won't know a

2264
02:18:25,720 --> 02:18:26,640
Speaker 4: lot of people don't want to hear that.

2265
02:18:27,200 --> 02:18:29,000
Speaker 2: Those are those are the facts. Well that's how that's

2266
02:18:29,000 --> 02:18:31,760
Speaker 2: how we look at it. Yeah, right, it's like now,

2267
02:18:33,400 --> 02:18:35,960
Speaker 2: unfortunately we don't have the loudest voice.

2268
02:18:37,000 --> 02:18:38,760
Speaker 3: You know that we're not the majority.

2269
02:18:39,040 --> 02:18:43,320
Speaker 2: The majority has the loudest voice because there's more of them, Right,

2270
02:18:43,360 --> 02:18:44,760
Speaker 2: But that doesn't mean that they're right.

2271
02:18:44,760 --> 02:18:47,519
Speaker 5: Absolute, No, not at all, not at all, not at all.

2272
02:18:47,560 --> 02:18:50,920
Speaker 1: Mean culture, you haven't mean that came out. I met

2273
02:18:50,959 --> 02:18:53,440
Speaker 1: the criteria to be selected, but I wasn't. Thoughts on

2274
02:18:53,640 --> 02:18:56,520
Speaker 1: just where can you imagine having social media back when

2275
02:18:56,520 --> 02:18:57,959
Speaker 1: you guys played, we would have killed it?

2276
02:18:58,160 --> 02:18:59,000
Speaker 2: He said, we were killed.

2277
02:18:59,320 --> 02:19:00,400
Speaker 4: What's what's mean?

2278
02:19:01,680 --> 02:19:05,560
Speaker 2: You know I met the criteria, but I wasn't selected. Okay, yeah, yeah,

2279
02:19:05,640 --> 02:19:13,640
Speaker 2: yeah yeah, but I kind of like that. Yeah. Now,

2280
02:19:13,840 --> 02:19:16,280
Speaker 2: speaking of that meme, right, you see me dressed in

2281
02:19:16,280 --> 02:19:18,360
Speaker 2: the three piece suit. This the other thing I got

2282
02:19:18,400 --> 02:19:22,280
Speaker 2: to say about Mike Now, his producer and Mike, they

2283
02:19:22,320 --> 02:19:25,720
Speaker 2: called me, hey, we need you in the video. Can't

2284
02:19:25,760 --> 02:19:28,280
Speaker 2: tell my story without you. He's so important. Now I'm thinking,

2285
02:19:28,280 --> 02:19:31,760
Speaker 2: we all cool, can't tell my story without you, you.

2286
02:19:31,720 --> 02:19:33,000
Speaker 3: Know, blah blah blah blah.

2287
02:19:33,040 --> 02:19:35,119
Speaker 2: So I dress up. I'm sitting in a three piece suit.

2288
02:19:36,360 --> 02:19:39,120
Speaker 2: I bring one of my partners, Kevin Cottrell or you know,

2289
02:19:39,240 --> 02:19:41,879
Speaker 2: he was sitting in the interview. We actually did it

2290
02:19:41,920 --> 02:19:47,720
Speaker 2: at NBA TV. I sat there for two hours, said

2291
02:19:47,720 --> 02:19:52,760
Speaker 2: a lot of good stuff. Right, last dance, come out,

2292
02:19:54,080 --> 02:19:58,160
Speaker 2: and that's it. Now I'm dressed to the nine. I

2293
02:19:58,160 --> 02:20:02,359
Speaker 2: didn't come here in the sweatsuit today. I'm giving you respect.

2294
02:20:02,600 --> 02:20:05,400
Speaker 2: I'm gonna show up, you know, the right way, because

2295
02:20:05,440 --> 02:20:08,080
Speaker 2: I got respect for you. I showed up the right

2296
02:20:08,120 --> 02:20:09,600
Speaker 2: way for that dude. And I sat there and I

2297
02:20:09,640 --> 02:20:15,040
Speaker 2: did the interview. And that's what you do to me. Now,

2298
02:20:15,080 --> 02:20:19,720
Speaker 2: I like the mean on the real I like the mean.

2299
02:20:20,320 --> 02:20:22,200
Speaker 2: I ain't gonna front on it, but I like it.

2300
02:20:22,440 --> 02:20:23,920
Speaker 2: I'm just glad I was dressed nice.

2301
02:20:24,879 --> 02:20:26,800
Speaker 5: Tell me if I'm going too far. Did you get

2302
02:20:26,800 --> 02:20:27,160
Speaker 5: a check?

2303
02:20:27,840 --> 02:20:31,160
Speaker 2: Noh? Hell noah no, wait wait a minute, I didn't

2304
02:20:31,200 --> 02:20:31,880
Speaker 2: ask for a check.

2305
02:20:31,920 --> 02:20:33,360
Speaker 4: No, I know you to ask for you know what

2306
02:20:33,400 --> 02:20:35,039
Speaker 4: I'm saying. But like you know, damn.

2307
02:20:35,320 --> 02:20:37,840
Speaker 2: But but the way I was brought up right again,

2308
02:20:37,920 --> 02:20:40,560
Speaker 2: we talk about that West side of Chicago that you

2309
02:20:40,600 --> 02:20:46,199
Speaker 2: know we I came up in the era where where

2310
02:20:47,000 --> 02:20:50,480
Speaker 2: we give each other knowledge. You know, the game game

2311
02:20:50,680 --> 02:20:54,360
Speaker 2: is meant to be told, and I sold right. This

2312
02:20:54,400 --> 02:20:56,880
Speaker 2: is a generation that has sipped flipped it all around.

2313
02:20:57,120 --> 02:20:59,200
Speaker 2: So we don't work with each other, We don't share

2314
02:20:59,240 --> 02:21:02,200
Speaker 2: with each other, don't pass on knowledge. We don't we

2315
02:21:02,280 --> 02:21:06,160
Speaker 2: don't uplift each other, you know. And so I went

2316
02:21:06,200 --> 02:21:09,920
Speaker 2: there to uplift love. Yeah. Absolutely, I didn't go there

2317
02:21:09,959 --> 02:21:14,160
Speaker 2: to tear down. So do I feel blindsided? Like I said,

2318
02:21:14,160 --> 02:21:17,080
Speaker 2: I got to sit here and answer these questions. Now. Now,

2319
02:21:17,080 --> 02:21:20,160
Speaker 2: if he real he should come on your show, he

2320
02:21:20,200 --> 02:21:23,800
Speaker 2: should sit in this seat, and and he should talk

2321
02:21:23,800 --> 02:21:26,520
Speaker 2: to y'all as brothers. He should talk to y'all as former.

2322
02:21:26,840 --> 02:21:33,920
Speaker 2: You know, I agree, I did this clip straight. No, no,

2323
02:21:34,160 --> 02:21:37,200
Speaker 2: I mean, I mean I hear y'all praise him rightfully.

2324
02:21:37,240 --> 02:21:40,280
Speaker 2: So and he should be, you know, because his shoe

2325
02:21:40,320 --> 02:21:42,560
Speaker 2: game is tight, what he's done in the shoe industry

2326
02:21:43,680 --> 02:21:48,440
Speaker 2: and and and we're happy for that, right, But there's

2327
02:21:48,440 --> 02:21:51,320
Speaker 2: some other stuff, you know, hey, come on, man, like

2328
02:21:51,440 --> 02:21:52,720
Speaker 2: you know, be real.

2329
02:21:54,000 --> 02:21:57,560
Speaker 1: Talk about all times. Two thousand elected to the Hall

2330
02:21:57,600 --> 02:22:00,480
Speaker 1: of Fame. When you think about your body of work,

2331
02:22:00,920 --> 02:22:06,440
Speaker 1: starting in high school, through college, through the league, what

2332
02:22:06,879 --> 02:22:08,240
Speaker 1: rinse what stands out to you the most?

2333
02:22:08,959 --> 02:22:10,160
Speaker 5: Just a winner, proven winner.

2334
02:22:10,200 --> 02:22:12,000
Speaker 4: Everybody can't say they won on every level.

2335
02:22:12,040 --> 02:22:15,880
Speaker 2: They played on and started an NBA franchise in the

2336
02:22:16,600 --> 02:22:20,120
Speaker 2: foreign country, the Toronto Raptors. So when I look at

2337
02:22:20,120 --> 02:22:25,560
Speaker 2: the Raptors and what I did there has stood at

2338
02:22:25,560 --> 02:22:30,560
Speaker 2: the test of time. And you know that two thousand

2339
02:22:30,680 --> 02:22:33,840
Speaker 2: going into the Hall of Fame. So I retired in

2340
02:22:33,920 --> 02:22:39,080
Speaker 2: ninety four in April. In May, I was part owner

2341
02:22:41,280 --> 02:22:44,160
Speaker 2: president of the basketball operation. I was the first player

2342
02:22:44,160 --> 02:22:46,800
Speaker 2: to ever walk off the floor go straight into it

2343
02:22:46,959 --> 02:22:52,280
Speaker 2: and go straight into ownership and run basketball operations. And

2344
02:22:52,320 --> 02:22:55,320
Speaker 2: by the way, all we had was a blank sheet

2345
02:22:55,360 --> 02:22:58,520
Speaker 2: of paper. There was no uniform. So there you go again.

2346
02:22:58,760 --> 02:23:00,800
Speaker 2: You did that before, though you did in Detroit. You

2347
02:23:00,840 --> 02:23:02,920
Speaker 2: built it up so the same thing. So when you

2348
02:23:03,000 --> 02:23:05,480
Speaker 2: see when you see the raptor run out there with

2349
02:23:05,640 --> 02:23:10,040
Speaker 2: that flag and he planted his flag and he waved

2350
02:23:10,120 --> 02:23:12,560
Speaker 2: his flag, you can go back and you will see

2351
02:23:12,600 --> 02:23:17,840
Speaker 2: the bad boys run out what they flag wave it.

2352
02:23:17,959 --> 02:23:22,840
Speaker 2: We plant all flag right and all colors. What we

2353
02:23:22,920 --> 02:23:28,400
Speaker 2: stood for right is all around there. You know that

2354
02:23:28,520 --> 02:23:32,440
Speaker 2: dance pack, that dance team started all of that, right.

2355
02:23:32,959 --> 02:23:36,200
Speaker 2: So standing up there in the Hall of Fame. In

2356
02:23:36,280 --> 02:23:42,240
Speaker 2: two thousand, I owned a league called the CBA and

2357
02:23:43,520 --> 02:23:49,640
Speaker 2: the first man to ever own a league, and turned

2358
02:23:49,640 --> 02:23:54,600
Speaker 2: it into a single entity which the NBA. Then started

2359
02:23:54,640 --> 02:23:58,040
Speaker 2: the w NBA and copied a lot of all formulas

2360
02:23:58,640 --> 02:24:03,200
Speaker 2: what we were doing. CBA had got to a point

2361
02:24:03,240 --> 02:24:06,920
Speaker 2: where it was so good. David Stern said, I like that.

2362
02:24:08,600 --> 02:24:09,280
Speaker 2: I want that.

2363
02:24:10,879 --> 02:24:14,640
Speaker 3: So they started the G League and now everything that.

2364
02:24:14,560 --> 02:24:17,119
Speaker 5: The g you have something to do with the CBA.

2365
02:24:17,760 --> 02:24:19,879
Speaker 3: I owned it. I owned the whole league.

2366
02:24:19,959 --> 02:24:21,920
Speaker 4: I didn't know that. I played that ship for about

2367
02:24:21,920 --> 02:24:26,000
Speaker 4: two weeks. Yeah no, no, the cross Bobcat, Yeah, the

2368
02:24:26,040 --> 02:24:27,160
Speaker 4: worst place on earth.

2369
02:24:27,280 --> 02:24:28,320
Speaker 3: I owned the whole league.

2370
02:24:28,360 --> 02:24:32,840
Speaker 2: About every team, say word about about every team. And

2371
02:24:32,879 --> 02:24:36,240
Speaker 2: I was I was the first individual. It's the first

2372
02:24:36,240 --> 02:24:39,880
Speaker 2: individual to ever own an entire league. Not the way

2373
02:24:39,879 --> 02:24:44,760
Speaker 2: they the way it's been written. Oh you you bankrupted

2374
02:24:44,760 --> 02:24:49,960
Speaker 2: the cb A time out the NBA. David Stern and

2375
02:24:50,000 --> 02:24:55,400
Speaker 2: those owners bankrupted the CBA and started the g leag

2376
02:24:55,520 --> 02:24:59,320
Speaker 2: on purpose. Well, it was competition, you know, And and

2377
02:24:59,400 --> 02:25:02,640
Speaker 2: I get it, that's business, you know. They were they

2378
02:25:02,680 --> 02:25:06,840
Speaker 2: had more money, and I didn't have the money to

2379
02:25:06,879 --> 02:25:08,640
Speaker 2: compete with what they were getting ready to do. I

2380
02:25:08,760 --> 02:25:13,080
Speaker 2: thought wrongfully, So I thought that being a former player,

2381
02:25:14,240 --> 02:25:18,280
Speaker 2: that they would say, support you, let's uplift you.

2382
02:25:18,440 --> 02:25:18,800
Speaker 5: Same thing.

2383
02:25:18,920 --> 02:25:19,440
Speaker 2: You thought.

2384
02:25:20,440 --> 02:25:21,120
Speaker 3: It's business.

2385
02:25:21,600 --> 02:25:23,920
Speaker 2: They looking at his business like no, no, no, no,

2386
02:25:23,920 --> 02:25:27,160
Speaker 2: no no, it's good enough you competition, we want that

2387
02:25:27,480 --> 02:25:31,680
Speaker 2: or either get out now the other thing that you know,

2388
02:25:33,520 --> 02:25:35,720
Speaker 2: let's those are lessons learned. Those are those are hard

2389
02:25:35,760 --> 02:25:39,880
Speaker 2: business lessons. So when you talk about the first game

2390
02:25:40,120 --> 02:25:45,360
Speaker 2: that was ever broadcast live over the internet that came

2391
02:25:45,400 --> 02:25:50,039
Speaker 2: out of the CBA, Isaiah Thomas did that CBA Hoops,

2392
02:25:50,480 --> 02:25:56,720
Speaker 2: there was a CBA Hoops before NBA dot Com. Okay,

2393
02:25:57,320 --> 02:26:02,000
Speaker 2: so that let's just real talk, and that those now

2394
02:26:02,680 --> 02:26:07,720
Speaker 2: were they better at business and did they have more money? Absolutely,

2395
02:26:08,240 --> 02:26:12,959
Speaker 2: when you look at the G League, you know a

2396
02:26:13,000 --> 02:26:15,600
Speaker 2: good portion of that is my business plan. Just the blueprint,

2397
02:26:16,440 --> 02:26:18,760
Speaker 2: the blueprint for sure, that's the blueprint. Mm.

2398
02:26:18,879 --> 02:26:20,640
Speaker 5: Same thing, yep, just with more money.

2399
02:26:20,800 --> 02:26:22,760
Speaker 2: Now. The other thing that you can go back and

2400
02:26:22,800 --> 02:26:27,520
Speaker 2: look into history when you talk about the CBA, they

2401
02:26:27,520 --> 02:26:32,200
Speaker 2: said I couldn't own the league and coach in the

2402
02:26:32,360 --> 02:26:35,800
Speaker 2: NBA at the same time, so they said it was

2403
02:26:35,800 --> 02:26:37,279
Speaker 2: a conflict of interests.

2404
02:26:38,160 --> 02:26:40,480
Speaker 3: The only time that there was a special.

2405
02:26:40,120 --> 02:26:44,720
Speaker 2: Vote in the NBA by the owners that rule that

2406
02:26:44,840 --> 02:26:50,560
Speaker 2: Isaiah Thomas could not own the league or a team

2407
02:26:51,160 --> 02:26:55,720
Speaker 2: because it was a conflict of interests. The owners voted,

2408
02:26:56,120 --> 02:26:58,520
Speaker 2: so I had to sell or give up the CBA

2409
02:26:59,360 --> 02:27:04,560
Speaker 2: to coach the Indiana Pacers. M hmm. Interesting.

2410
02:27:04,600 --> 02:27:06,680
Speaker 4: So did you have a hand in putting the team

2411
02:27:06,680 --> 02:27:13,480
Speaker 4: in Lacrosse, Wisconsin, because I've still traumatized from that city.

2412
02:27:14,120 --> 02:27:16,840
Speaker 4: My first day I go to practice or go unpacked

2413
02:27:16,879 --> 02:27:20,120
Speaker 4: and the team decides to go bowling. As soon as

2414
02:27:20,160 --> 02:27:22,120
Speaker 4: I get rid of the road, mis strike. Two dudes

2415
02:27:22,120 --> 02:27:23,640
Speaker 4: coming in and lay the whole place.

2416
02:27:23,480 --> 02:27:24,720
Speaker 5: Down to rob everybody.

2417
02:27:25,720 --> 02:27:27,760
Speaker 4: I'm like, I want to make play basketball, but I

2418
02:27:27,800 --> 02:27:29,480
Speaker 4: don't know if the risk is worth the reward.

2419
02:27:31,120 --> 02:27:35,520
Speaker 2: So Stid, my brother and I had family in Racine,

2420
02:27:35,560 --> 02:27:38,760
Speaker 2: Westconsin and I had a lot of bad a lot

2421
02:27:38,760 --> 02:27:39,800
Speaker 2: of people from Chicago.

2422
02:27:40,520 --> 02:27:41,320
Speaker 3: A lot of people from.

2423
02:27:41,280 --> 02:27:44,200
Speaker 2: Chicago from Racine, yeah, exactly.

2424
02:27:44,360 --> 02:27:46,879
Speaker 5: A lot of Racine was ontouchables, yeah street.

2425
02:27:47,200 --> 02:27:52,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, a lot of people from Chicago left and had

2426
02:27:52,640 --> 02:27:57,439
Speaker 2: to go to Wisconsin. They went to two places, Wisconsin, Minnesota, Wisconsin, Minnesota.

2427
02:27:57,920 --> 02:28:01,760
Speaker 2: And so actually the owners and Lacrosse, they were good people.

2428
02:28:02,320 --> 02:28:07,560
Speaker 2: So the CBA owners when I bought the CBA from them,

2429
02:28:08,000 --> 02:28:09,440
Speaker 2: all of them were good people.

2430
02:28:09,520 --> 02:28:10,640
Speaker 3: They were good operators.

2431
02:28:11,240 --> 02:28:16,360
Speaker 2: I left them all in the business and the NBA became.

2432
02:28:16,560 --> 02:28:20,400
Speaker 2: You know, they wanted a league for themselves.

2433
02:28:23,640 --> 02:28:25,560
Speaker 1: Is this urban legend? Is there any truth to this

2434
02:28:25,680 --> 02:28:33,480
Speaker 1: that you wanted to draft Kevin Garnett in Toronto, put

2435
02:28:33,520 --> 02:28:36,680
Speaker 1: him in the middle and put four guards around him.

2436
02:28:36,720 --> 02:28:39,600
Speaker 2: Absolutely, So let me let me tell you break that down.

2437
02:28:39,720 --> 02:28:42,000
Speaker 2: Let me tell you what ended up happened, and then

2438
02:28:42,000 --> 02:28:44,959
Speaker 2: I'll break it down. So I'm gonna remind you of

2439
02:28:44,959 --> 02:28:46,760
Speaker 2: a guy by the name of Marcus Camby that I

2440
02:28:46,840 --> 02:28:50,280
Speaker 2: had a brother that you loved by the name of

2441
02:28:50,280 --> 02:28:53,879
Speaker 2: Doug Christy one that I drafted by the name of

2442
02:28:53,920 --> 02:28:57,040
Speaker 2: Tracy McGrady. I love point guard that was Rookie of

2443
02:28:57,080 --> 02:29:00,760
Speaker 2: the Year by name of Dane Stottlemyre. And then number

2444
02:29:00,800 --> 02:29:10,160
Speaker 2: fifteen Vince Carter. That's me them was the guys. Okay, Now,

2445
02:29:10,560 --> 02:29:13,560
Speaker 2: the idea that I had in Jim Kelly right now,

2446
02:29:13,600 --> 02:29:22,120
Speaker 2: who's with the Dallas Mavericks and Bob Zepphaloto, whose son

2447
02:29:22,200 --> 02:29:26,080
Speaker 2: Scott Zephalado runs the Hall of Fame. I brought those

2448
02:29:26,080 --> 02:29:29,760
Speaker 2: two gentlemen in and what I want to do in Toronto.

2449
02:29:29,879 --> 02:29:33,039
Speaker 2: We called it the Raptor two. And what was the

2450
02:29:33,120 --> 02:29:40,760
Speaker 2: Raptor too? The Raptor two was going to be a

2451
02:29:41,000 --> 02:29:47,360
Speaker 2: six seven to six ' nine power forward who had

2452
02:29:47,760 --> 02:29:53,080
Speaker 2: guard skills because if you remember offense back then, the

2453
02:29:53,160 --> 02:29:56,119
Speaker 2: four always pinned down on the two. So we wanted

2454
02:29:56,160 --> 02:29:57,720
Speaker 2: to be able to switch to four in the two,

2455
02:29:58,440 --> 02:30:02,680
Speaker 2: but we wanted on the offensive then that guard that four,

2456
02:30:03,400 --> 02:30:06,560
Speaker 2: who would have been McGrady or Carter or whatever, they

2457
02:30:06,560 --> 02:30:10,600
Speaker 2: would have guard skills down and now they can break

2458
02:30:10,640 --> 02:30:12,200
Speaker 2: it down. They can shoot the three, they can get

2459
02:30:12,200 --> 02:30:15,440
Speaker 2: to the basket. Guys like Oakley couldn't guard them on

2460
02:30:15,560 --> 02:30:19,240
Speaker 2: the perimeter. Had Damon Stottamayo, who could play high screen

2461
02:30:19,280 --> 02:30:22,879
Speaker 2: and roll with Marcus Camby, who could you know pass

2462
02:30:22,920 --> 02:30:28,920
Speaker 2: shoot to the now. When I saw Kevin Garnett, first

2463
02:30:28,959 --> 02:30:31,200
Speaker 2: time I saw him was in South Carolina, had a playground.

2464
02:30:31,240 --> 02:30:34,240
Speaker 2: He didn't even know I was there. He was playing

2465
02:30:34,240 --> 02:30:39,400
Speaker 2: outside and they had this little playground tournament. So I

2466
02:30:39,480 --> 02:30:48,039
Speaker 2: snuck down there and I'm watching this dude, Yeah, between

2467
02:30:48,080 --> 02:30:52,400
Speaker 2: the legs, behind the back, pulling up, shooting, you know,

2468
02:30:52,920 --> 02:30:58,880
Speaker 2: passing diamond, and I'm like, that's my raptor too. That

2469
02:30:58,879 --> 02:31:07,400
Speaker 2: that's who. I won't that's who. So Kevin Garnett, don't.

2470
02:31:08,000 --> 02:31:12,560
Speaker 2: I'm gonna say this. Kevin Garnett also somehow ends up

2471
02:31:12,600 --> 02:31:17,520
Speaker 2: in Chicago and his coaches got my name is Anthony

2472
02:31:17,560 --> 02:31:24,959
Speaker 2: long Street, who I played with Inside Job. I can

2473
02:31:25,080 --> 02:31:27,400
Speaker 2: hear it. I can hear the Inside Job.

2474
02:31:28,440 --> 02:31:30,880
Speaker 3: And he ends up at Farragut on the West Side.

2475
02:31:31,000 --> 02:31:34,359
Speaker 1: And you know, aren't you from the West Side.

2476
02:31:36,200 --> 02:31:39,200
Speaker 3: You know his mom and everybody they they end up you.

2477
02:31:39,160 --> 02:31:43,240
Speaker 1: Know, in Chicago, someone had to roll their red carpetile

2478
02:31:43,240 --> 02:31:43,560
Speaker 1: for him.

2479
02:31:43,720 --> 02:31:50,160
Speaker 2: And so now you know, we're watching Garnett do his thing,

2480
02:31:50,240 --> 02:31:53,680
Speaker 2: and by that time, you know they you can draft

2481
02:31:53,760 --> 02:31:57,440
Speaker 2: high school players. The rules had changed, so I'm trying

2482
02:31:57,440 --> 02:32:04,120
Speaker 2: to figure out how can I get the players? So

2483
02:32:04,920 --> 02:32:07,000
Speaker 2: I had a meeting with the guys that I when

2484
02:32:07,000 --> 02:32:11,279
Speaker 2: I got the job. I had meeting with text Ram Elgin, Braidler,

2485
02:32:12,800 --> 02:32:21,760
Speaker 2: Jerry West, and Buddy Ryan the football coach. Football coaches.

2486
02:32:23,240 --> 02:32:24,800
Speaker 2: Why did I go to football?

2487
02:32:24,879 --> 02:32:25,080
Speaker 5: Right?

2488
02:32:26,240 --> 02:32:34,680
Speaker 2: Because football drafts six rounds and Dallas was known for

2489
02:32:35,240 --> 02:32:38,600
Speaker 2: thinking outside the box. You may not remember a guy

2490
02:32:38,600 --> 02:32:42,160
Speaker 2: by the name of Bob Hayes, but Bob Hayes ran

2491
02:32:42,280 --> 02:32:44,199
Speaker 2: tracks a long time ago. Y'all. We wasn't even born,

2492
02:32:44,600 --> 02:32:47,400
Speaker 2: but they was known for, you know, drafting, you know,

2493
02:32:47,720 --> 02:32:51,640
Speaker 2: guys outside of their sport. So I wanted to know

2494
02:32:51,680 --> 02:32:56,040
Speaker 2: how and why they thought that. Way had to talk

2495
02:32:56,080 --> 02:32:58,720
Speaker 2: with him. Then I studied what the forty nine ers

2496
02:32:58,720 --> 02:33:06,440
Speaker 2: were doing, because what football does that basketball? Don't them?

2497
02:33:06,480 --> 02:33:11,640
Speaker 2: Guys in football? The amount of information that they're able

2498
02:33:11,720 --> 02:33:18,200
Speaker 2: to consume on a weekly basis is mind blowing. I

2499
02:33:18,240 --> 02:33:20,400
Speaker 2: mean when you look at the information that they're able

2500
02:33:20,480 --> 02:33:25,520
Speaker 2: to absorb and then come out, I mean they get

2501
02:33:25,720 --> 02:33:30,000
Speaker 2: volumes and volumes of books that they have to know tendencies,

2502
02:33:30,080 --> 02:33:33,840
Speaker 2: break down everything else. So when I looked at the

2503
02:33:33,840 --> 02:33:37,200
Speaker 2: coaching staffs. Right at that time, there was no such

2504
02:33:37,240 --> 02:33:40,440
Speaker 2: thing as an offensive coordinator defensive coordinator. We brought that

2505
02:33:40,480 --> 02:33:46,600
Speaker 2: in in Toronto, copy different football. And why did we

2506
02:33:46,640 --> 02:33:53,640
Speaker 2: do that because again, football went to specialization long before

2507
02:33:54,160 --> 02:33:59,080
Speaker 2: the NBA went to specialization, special teams, special teams. And

2508
02:33:59,120 --> 02:34:04,160
Speaker 2: then they have you know, quarterback coach, they have alignements coach,

2509
02:34:04,400 --> 02:34:07,320
Speaker 2: they have a running back coach. I mean their specialization,

2510
02:34:07,440 --> 02:34:11,520
Speaker 2: their breakdown and their information, their their quality control and

2511
02:34:11,560 --> 02:34:14,160
Speaker 2: all that. So I put all that together and now

2512
02:34:14,240 --> 02:34:18,240
Speaker 2: bring that to Toronto, and I see Kevin Garnett and

2513
02:34:18,280 --> 02:34:22,160
Speaker 2: I'm like, he the one. He got it all he got,

2514
02:34:22,200 --> 02:34:26,600
Speaker 2: he got the understanding, he's smart, you know, he's got

2515
02:34:26,600 --> 02:34:30,520
Speaker 2: the personality, he's got the motor, he's got the engine.

2516
02:34:30,600 --> 02:34:33,200
Speaker 2: He's got he's got everything that you're looking for. So

2517
02:34:33,280 --> 02:34:37,000
Speaker 2: I have this terminology I call ICE. It's hasham here.

2518
02:34:38,000 --> 02:34:47,840
Speaker 2: What's ice? Intensity concentration and energy. That's that's what we

2519
02:34:48,040 --> 02:34:51,000
Speaker 2: and that's what you look for. That's what separates the

2520
02:34:51,040 --> 02:34:54,440
Speaker 2: great player from the good player. You can high skill

2521
02:34:54,560 --> 02:34:57,879
Speaker 2: and all that, but can you put intensity, concentration and

2522
02:34:58,040 --> 02:35:00,120
Speaker 2: energy on top of that skill? And if you you

2523
02:35:00,120 --> 02:35:04,360
Speaker 2: can do that cool got something that was Kevin Garnett.

2524
02:35:05,200 --> 02:35:09,000
Speaker 2: And so now we're going through the draft. And you know,

2525
02:35:09,000 --> 02:35:10,720
Speaker 2: a while back, I told you Kevin Mchal and I

2526
02:35:10,760 --> 02:35:13,959
Speaker 2: are really good friends. So if you remember, you know,

2527
02:35:14,360 --> 02:35:18,160
Speaker 2: around Garnet's draft, there's a lot of bad talk around him.

2528
02:35:18,360 --> 02:35:22,480
Speaker 2: He's not this, he's dad. You know, he's he's a

2529
02:35:22,480 --> 02:35:24,720
Speaker 2: great player, but can you really trust him?

2530
02:35:25,000 --> 02:35:25,720
Speaker 3: You know character?

2531
02:35:25,959 --> 02:35:28,560
Speaker 4: You know all those Chicago So you didn't you weren't

2532
02:35:28,560 --> 02:35:29,320
Speaker 4: worried about none of that.

2533
02:35:29,600 --> 02:35:34,400
Speaker 2: Well, you know, I was kind of helping that because

2534
02:35:34,400 --> 02:35:36,120
Speaker 2: I wanted to follow us. Right.

2535
02:35:36,800 --> 02:35:39,800
Speaker 1: So so I get a.

2536
02:35:39,720 --> 02:35:45,720
Speaker 2: Call from Micheale. Right, he goes, I, I need you

2537
02:35:45,800 --> 02:35:51,280
Speaker 2: to be honest with me. He goes, tell me about

2538
02:35:51,280 --> 02:35:54,360
Speaker 2: this kid, Garnett. I can't get a read on him.

2539
02:35:54,800 --> 02:35:57,080
Speaker 2: I said, Kevin, I'm not gonna lie to you. I said,

2540
02:35:57,080 --> 02:35:59,879
Speaker 2: if you don't draft him, I'm going to draft him. Right.

2541
02:36:00,520 --> 02:36:02,600
Speaker 2: He goes, you really would take him? I say absolutely?

2542
02:36:02,800 --> 02:36:06,240
Speaker 2: And I say he would be great with you. I said,

2543
02:36:06,240 --> 02:36:09,840
Speaker 2: but you know, if you don't take him, I'm definitely

2544
02:36:09,840 --> 02:36:12,840
Speaker 2: taking them. Everything else you're hearing around him is just

2545
02:36:12,840 --> 02:36:17,040
Speaker 2: just straight noise. He goes, all right, So he ends

2546
02:36:17,120 --> 02:36:23,160
Speaker 2: up taking Kevin. Now, why did I draft Damon Stottamayer?

2547
02:36:25,080 --> 02:36:29,680
Speaker 2: Who did Damon Stodamayer play for? Who was his head?

2548
02:36:30,600 --> 02:36:33,240
Speaker 2: That's what That's what I was supposed to go to Arizona.

2549
02:36:33,959 --> 02:36:35,200
Speaker 3: Did Rosberry will recruit you?

2550
02:36:35,680 --> 02:36:36,560
Speaker 2: Jesse Evans?

2551
02:36:36,640 --> 02:36:37,320
Speaker 3: Jesse Evans?

2552
02:36:37,360 --> 02:36:45,000
Speaker 2: Oh okay, okay, so yeah, so so so I called

2553
02:36:45,080 --> 02:36:49,680
Speaker 2: Rosboro up. I'm like, tell me about Damon, right, I

2554
02:36:49,840 --> 02:36:53,840
Speaker 2: can't miss. Damon becomes a Rookie of the Year. So

2555
02:36:54,840 --> 02:36:58,840
Speaker 2: that's how, that's how Garnett, you know, got started interesting

2556
02:37:00,480 --> 02:37:02,120
Speaker 2: quick hitters. First thing to come to mind.

2557
02:37:02,200 --> 02:37:05,039
Speaker 1: Let us know what you think top five point guards

2558
02:37:05,080 --> 02:37:05,879
Speaker 1: of all time?

2559
02:37:06,040 --> 02:37:09,920
Speaker 2: This is gonna be a good one. Well, I gotta

2560
02:37:09,959 --> 02:37:13,440
Speaker 2: go size in terms of category, because when you look

2561
02:37:13,520 --> 02:37:17,960
Speaker 2: at you know, Magic and Oscar Robertson right there, that's

2562
02:37:18,000 --> 02:37:22,240
Speaker 2: a different there. There was Oscar six six five, he

2563
02:37:22,360 --> 02:37:27,160
Speaker 2: was six five, but dude, like I mean strong, you know,

2564
02:37:27,840 --> 02:37:32,920
Speaker 2: have a triple double all of that, and so you know,

2565
02:37:33,120 --> 02:37:38,320
Speaker 2: I put them in a different category. So we're gonna

2566
02:37:38,320 --> 02:37:41,199
Speaker 2: say they're the best. And why are they the best?

2567
02:37:41,480 --> 02:37:45,600
Speaker 2: Because their size and their weight gives them an advantage

2568
02:37:46,200 --> 02:37:47,920
Speaker 2: over all of us six one dudes.

2569
02:37:48,120 --> 02:37:52,640
Speaker 3: Right now, when you get to small people my size.

2570
02:37:53,280 --> 02:38:02,240
Speaker 2: I'm one, two, three four infant that just you know,

2571
02:38:02,320 --> 02:38:07,039
Speaker 2: it's like, and why do I say that? Name me

2572
02:38:07,080 --> 02:38:11,520
Speaker 2: one guy my size who's done what I've done? Mm hmm,

2573
02:38:13,640 --> 02:38:18,560
Speaker 2: step boy, you got anything for me?

2574
02:38:18,640 --> 02:38:19,560
Speaker 5: I can't see nobody.

2575
02:38:19,600 --> 02:38:22,680
Speaker 4: And the reason why I separate you from a lot

2576
02:38:22,720 --> 02:38:24,800
Speaker 4: of point guards the same reason I separate Kobe from

2577
02:38:24,800 --> 02:38:27,480
Speaker 4: a lot of people, just that toughness, just being relenting,

2578
02:38:27,560 --> 02:38:32,040
Speaker 4: that being a winner. I I look at winning different.

2579
02:38:32,240 --> 02:38:34,520
Speaker 4: You know what I'm saying. I appreciate winning more than anything.

2580
02:38:34,680 --> 02:38:36,920
Speaker 4: You know what I'm saying. So I respect that. So

2581
02:38:36,959 --> 02:38:39,040
Speaker 4: that's why I separate you, because you have the toughness

2582
02:38:39,040 --> 02:38:40,400
Speaker 4: and to win. Everybody don't have that.

2583
02:38:40,440 --> 02:38:43,160
Speaker 1: Can you humor us real quick and give us you

2584
02:38:43,400 --> 02:38:46,160
Speaker 1: plus four more? Just kind of see what you're thinking.

2585
02:38:46,000 --> 02:38:49,160
Speaker 2: Is on the real right. So so I'm gonna go.

2586
02:38:50,040 --> 02:38:53,240
Speaker 2: If you listen, Steph Curry as a point guard, Yeah

2587
02:38:53,240 --> 02:38:56,640
Speaker 2: we are, we are okay, then Steph? We are right

2588
02:38:57,280 --> 02:39:01,800
Speaker 2: then Steph, because no one's done. He's done right from

2589
02:39:01,840 --> 02:39:03,840
Speaker 2: a championship winning standpoint.

2590
02:39:04,400 --> 02:39:06,000
Speaker 3: Now we've done it differently.

2591
02:39:06,800 --> 02:39:12,160
Speaker 2: But people all size right, you know, it's it's one

2592
02:39:12,200 --> 02:39:17,120
Speaker 2: and two right, and and if I was picking right,

2593
02:39:18,480 --> 02:39:23,480
Speaker 2: depending on what day, he may be one, because you

2594
02:39:23,520 --> 02:39:25,920
Speaker 2: know that, and man, it's intimidating when the guy stepp

2595
02:39:25,920 --> 02:39:27,680
Speaker 2: across half court and he can just let it go

2596
02:39:27,840 --> 02:39:30,560
Speaker 2: you and you're standing down in the layup line doing

2597
02:39:30,600 --> 02:39:34,640
Speaker 2: your layups, shooting mask court. That's intimidating. So it's a

2598
02:39:34,680 --> 02:39:36,039
Speaker 2: psychological effect that.

2599
02:39:36,040 --> 02:39:36,960
Speaker 3: He brings to the game.

2600
02:39:37,640 --> 02:39:40,920
Speaker 2: And then he's got he's got the intellect, he's got

2601
02:39:40,920 --> 02:39:43,400
Speaker 2: the he's got the smartness, he's got the toughness, he's

2602
02:39:43,440 --> 02:39:46,120
Speaker 2: got the he's got the character, he's got the pedigree,

2603
02:39:46,120 --> 02:39:48,720
Speaker 2: he's got the leadership. Agree he's got he's got all

2604
02:39:48,760 --> 02:39:52,680
Speaker 2: of that. Right, there's there there there's no flaws there.

2605
02:39:53,040 --> 02:39:56,200
Speaker 2: So you know what what I what I banked on

2606
02:39:56,560 --> 02:40:00,640
Speaker 2: right is again, I'm gonna out think you. I'm gonna

2607
02:40:00,800 --> 02:40:04,480
Speaker 2: concentrate you. I'm gonna you're going to make a mistake

2608
02:40:04,840 --> 02:40:07,680
Speaker 2: against me that allows me to beat you. Right. So

2609
02:40:08,480 --> 02:40:11,000
Speaker 2: Steph and I very similar in that way. We do

2610
02:40:11,080 --> 02:40:18,480
Speaker 2: it differently, right, and then we win, Like championships matter, okay,

2611
02:40:20,440 --> 02:40:23,120
Speaker 2: And I'm just talking all sides. So magic Oscar, they

2612
02:40:23,760 --> 02:40:26,240
Speaker 2: category right, that's how we put pucking Biggie somewhere else.

2613
02:40:26,400 --> 02:40:33,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, uh what now is that he's in the category.

2614
02:40:34,440 --> 02:40:35,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's in there.

2615
02:40:37,800 --> 02:40:40,000
Speaker 4: So speaking of nas, is he still answering this?

2616
02:40:40,240 --> 02:40:44,720
Speaker 2: Yeah? Finish more so then and then I gotta go Stockton,

2617
02:40:45,800 --> 02:40:53,000
Speaker 2: Chris Paul. This is gonna be tough one, but I

2618
02:40:53,240 --> 02:40:54,840
Speaker 2: got I gotta throw j Kidd in there.

2619
02:40:54,879 --> 02:40:56,879
Speaker 3: You know, how can you not Well.

2620
02:40:56,920 --> 02:40:59,240
Speaker 2: People gonna say Nash one two m v ps and

2621
02:40:59,520 --> 02:41:02,760
Speaker 2: but but but Jason Kidd. You know he was a

2622
02:41:02,760 --> 02:41:03,480
Speaker 2: motherfucker boy.

2623
02:41:03,560 --> 02:41:05,400
Speaker 3: Yeah yeah, yeah, jig kid.

2624
02:41:06,800 --> 02:41:07,000
Speaker 2: Yeah.

2625
02:41:08,720 --> 02:41:11,240
Speaker 4: When people say that Nash one to he did man,

2626
02:41:11,320 --> 02:41:14,240
Speaker 4: but shacking Kobe man, Man, Kobe should have won that.

2627
02:41:14,400 --> 02:41:14,560
Speaker 5: Man.

2628
02:41:14,879 --> 02:41:18,080
Speaker 2: But the rules, the rules again, that's the regular season award,

2629
02:41:18,280 --> 02:41:21,400
Speaker 2: But the rules changed. That's when the rules started changing

2630
02:41:21,800 --> 02:41:26,560
Speaker 2: where small people can start playing. So I was in actually,

2631
02:41:26,600 --> 02:41:28,840
Speaker 2: I was actually in the room with Mark Cuban the

2632
02:41:28,920 --> 02:41:33,240
Speaker 2: day he made that trade or didn't resign Nash. Were

2633
02:41:33,240 --> 02:41:35,560
Speaker 2: sitting in Dallas and it's Cuban and I were in

2634
02:41:35,560 --> 02:41:41,560
Speaker 2: the room and he's debating if if he should keep

2635
02:41:41,640 --> 02:41:46,680
Speaker 2: Nash and the rules hadn't changed yet, and you know,

2636
02:41:46,760 --> 02:41:48,480
Speaker 2: he had all his material and he was saying, you know,

2637
02:41:48,560 --> 02:41:51,920
Speaker 2: Nash is snowing slowing down a little bit. Uh, death

2638
02:41:52,080 --> 02:41:54,080
Speaker 2: was on the line. Definitely wanted, you know a little

2639
02:41:54,080 --> 02:41:57,320
Speaker 2: bit more money. Cubans like, I'm not sure, you know,

2640
02:41:57,879 --> 02:42:00,280
Speaker 2: And then he made the decision he wasn't gonna he

2641
02:42:00,400 --> 02:42:03,920
Speaker 2: wasn't going to resign Nash, and Nash went on to win,

2642
02:42:04,120 --> 02:42:06,720
Speaker 2: you know, MVP, but then he ended up being Jason

2643
02:42:06,800 --> 02:42:12,080
Speaker 2: Kidd and winning the championship. So do you want the

2644
02:42:12,200 --> 02:42:14,039
Speaker 2: MVP or do you want to win the championship? You

2645
02:42:14,120 --> 02:42:18,840
Speaker 2: want so, you know, Q made the decision smart. They

2646
02:42:18,920 --> 02:42:22,119
Speaker 2: ended up you know, winning the championship. But that's when

2647
02:42:22,160 --> 02:42:27,280
Speaker 2: the rules changed and the rules started favoring the smaller people,

2648
02:42:28,680 --> 02:42:32,240
Speaker 2: guards and everything else. They eliminated the hand check in

2649
02:42:32,640 --> 02:42:36,120
Speaker 2: you know, all that stuff. And you know D'Antoni gets

2650
02:42:36,160 --> 02:42:38,720
Speaker 2: credit for seven seconds or less. But that's not that's

2651
02:42:38,720 --> 02:42:41,560
Speaker 2: not fact free movement. That's not fact free movement. As

2652
02:42:41,600 --> 02:42:44,039
Speaker 2: a gentleman by the name of John McClinton, who I

2653
02:42:44,080 --> 02:42:48,600
Speaker 2: took into the Hall of Fame, John McClinton, who invented

2654
02:42:48,640 --> 02:42:52,440
Speaker 2: fast break basketball, and he invented seven seconds or less.

2655
02:42:53,000 --> 02:42:55,400
Speaker 2: I took John McClinton and his family into the Hall

2656
02:42:55,440 --> 02:42:58,600
Speaker 2: of Fame. The first hire I made in Toronto was

2657
02:42:58,720 --> 02:43:01,879
Speaker 2: John McClinton and they still have the John McClinton Award

2658
02:43:02,040 --> 02:43:04,200
Speaker 2: in Toronto and the first player to win it was

2659
02:43:04,240 --> 02:43:08,199
Speaker 2: Steve Nash out of Vancouver in Canada. But John McClinton

2660
02:43:08,440 --> 02:43:13,160
Speaker 2: invented seven seconds of less basketball. Now they give credit

2661
02:43:13,160 --> 02:43:14,080
Speaker 2: to d'An Toni.

2662
02:43:14,800 --> 02:43:16,039
Speaker 5: D'antonia and created ship.

2663
02:43:18,040 --> 02:43:20,640
Speaker 2: Jack don't like dantony he one ship always get a

2664
02:43:20,720 --> 02:43:22,360
Speaker 2: job now, but they come from John.

2665
02:43:22,280 --> 02:43:23,440
Speaker 5: McClinton, d Phony.

2666
02:43:23,640 --> 02:43:26,080
Speaker 2: You know, so let's let's let's be factual and get

2667
02:43:26,080 --> 02:43:30,199
Speaker 2: a credit where credit goes. Mark Jackson changed the game.

2668
02:43:31,560 --> 02:43:35,040
Speaker 2: John McClinton invented fast break basketball seven seconds.

2669
02:43:35,240 --> 02:43:37,080
Speaker 1: Never thought about it the way you broke down. But

2670
02:43:37,160 --> 02:43:39,320
Speaker 1: it makes complete sense about the Mark Jackson thing.

2671
02:43:39,640 --> 02:43:43,720
Speaker 2: YEP one album you listen to on repeat, Earth Wining

2672
02:43:43,800 --> 02:43:46,400
Speaker 2: fire Man, hold up. Don't do that to earth Win

2673
02:43:46,480 --> 02:43:48,119
Speaker 2: and fire. That's the way of the world. They West

2674
02:43:48,160 --> 02:43:52,119
Speaker 2: Side Boys went to Crane High School. Maurice White verdein

2675
02:43:52,280 --> 02:43:55,040
Speaker 2: that that's Chicago. I'm telling you that Chicago is deep.

2676
02:43:55,280 --> 02:43:57,080
Speaker 2: And when you look at the album, you look at

2677
02:43:57,080 --> 02:44:00,400
Speaker 2: the airic they you know, they they was talking to us.

2678
02:44:01,240 --> 02:44:07,400
Speaker 2: They was talking to us about nationality, birth rights, citizenship, spirituality.

2679
02:44:07,560 --> 02:44:09,760
Speaker 2: When you look at them pyramids and what they were

2680
02:44:09,800 --> 02:44:12,879
Speaker 2: to Hey, man, they were singing to you, Earth went

2681
02:44:12,959 --> 02:44:15,440
Speaker 2: and fire. Funniest thing that happened to you recently.

2682
02:44:17,800 --> 02:44:19,880
Speaker 3: The funniest thing that happened to me recently.

2683
02:44:21,520 --> 02:44:23,120
Speaker 2: You might have asked you for your ID when he

2684
02:44:23,160 --> 02:44:30,640
Speaker 2: was trying to get a drink. Funniest thing that happened

2685
02:44:30,640 --> 02:44:34,480
Speaker 2: to me recently. So I work on the NBA TV

2686
02:44:34,600 --> 02:44:39,520
Speaker 2: with Christian Letlow. Right, so I'm going through the Detroit Airport,

2687
02:44:40,400 --> 02:44:45,720
Speaker 2: going through the Detroit Airport and and you know, I'm

2688
02:44:46,160 --> 02:44:49,160
Speaker 2: playing golf with with these dudes at Oakland and this

2689
02:44:49,240 --> 02:44:52,520
Speaker 2: dude goes, oh.

2690
02:44:52,680 --> 02:44:54,439
Speaker 3: This guy goes, hey, ain't.

2691
02:44:54,200 --> 02:44:58,480
Speaker 2: You that dude that worked with Christian Letlow Detroit? I

2692
02:44:58,560 --> 02:45:04,160
Speaker 2: mean Detroit? Now my picture on the wall everything airport?

2693
02:45:04,240 --> 02:45:04,800
Speaker 3: When you go to.

2694
02:45:06,720 --> 02:45:09,080
Speaker 2: You know, ain't you that dude that were with Christian Letlo?

2695
02:45:10,200 --> 02:45:11,280
Speaker 3: I said yeah yeah.

2696
02:45:11,640 --> 02:45:14,240
Speaker 2: He goes, oh, man, I love her like she she's

2697
02:45:14,240 --> 02:45:17,760
Speaker 2: the best, she's great everything else. So I'm like, you know,

2698
02:45:17,920 --> 02:45:20,680
Speaker 2: he just going off. So you know, Letlo and now

2699
02:45:20,680 --> 02:45:23,400
Speaker 2: we're pretty tight. So I said, hey, you want to

2700
02:45:23,440 --> 02:45:25,720
Speaker 2: talk to her? He's like, oh yeah, so I dial

2701
02:45:25,800 --> 02:45:29,520
Speaker 2: up Letlo right right, So I give him the phone

2702
02:45:29,600 --> 02:45:34,600
Speaker 2: right So he now he starts asking her basketball questions like, hey,

2703
02:45:34,720 --> 02:45:37,400
Speaker 2: you know what, who you think gonna gonna win the

2704
02:45:37,520 --> 02:45:38,600
Speaker 2: championship this year?

2705
02:45:38,640 --> 02:45:38,840
Speaker 5: You know?

2706
02:45:38,920 --> 02:45:41,920
Speaker 2: And and you know who you think the best players?

2707
02:45:41,920 --> 02:45:45,720
Speaker 2: And so I'm looking at this dude like, hey, man,

2708
02:45:45,879 --> 02:45:48,720
Speaker 2: you know, I'm Thomas.

2709
02:45:48,760 --> 02:45:49,280
Speaker 3: You know what I mean.

2710
02:45:49,560 --> 02:45:51,959
Speaker 2: But you know, I'm feeling some kind of way, but

2711
02:45:52,120 --> 02:45:55,600
Speaker 2: I'm playing it off, right because I know when I

2712
02:45:55,600 --> 02:45:57,560
Speaker 2: get the phone back, I'm gonna get an autograph or

2713
02:45:57,600 --> 02:45:58,440
Speaker 2: pictu or something. Right.

2714
02:45:58,920 --> 02:46:01,960
Speaker 3: So, now they get through talking.

2715
02:46:02,040 --> 02:46:04,920
Speaker 2: He had me the phone back and he goes, oh, man,

2716
02:46:05,000 --> 02:46:07,360
Speaker 2: you're so lucky you get to work with let Alone.

2717
02:46:07,400 --> 02:46:09,600
Speaker 2: I just I just love her and I just think

2718
02:46:09,640 --> 02:46:12,520
Speaker 2: she's the best, you know, really really thank you, you know,

2719
02:46:13,560 --> 02:46:20,800
Speaker 2: and good luck to you. And he walked away. I'm like,

2720
02:46:20,879 --> 02:46:25,039
Speaker 2: what the hell? Like what? So, so I would say,

2721
02:46:25,080 --> 02:46:27,560
Speaker 2: that's the funniest thing that that that kind of happened.

2722
02:46:29,680 --> 02:46:31,920
Speaker 3: I'm that dude that work with Christian Letlo.

2723
02:46:32,200 --> 02:46:34,560
Speaker 1: And you could be this next person the other Isaiah

2724
02:46:34,640 --> 02:46:38,360
Speaker 1: Thomas talk about just the confusion that is constantly goes

2725
02:46:38,400 --> 02:46:39,120
Speaker 1: between you two.

2726
02:46:39,480 --> 02:46:46,640
Speaker 2: Man, I love it when he gets criticized because being

2727
02:46:46,720 --> 02:46:52,800
Speaker 2: named after you. But so I'm I'm scouting, and uh,

2728
02:46:53,040 --> 02:46:55,000
Speaker 2: I think I'm still in New York at that time,

2729
02:46:55,480 --> 02:46:59,960
Speaker 2: and and I'm hearing about this this guard in Seattle

2730
02:47:00,080 --> 02:47:03,680
Speaker 2: by the name of Isaiah Isaiah Thomas, and I'm like,

2731
02:47:04,959 --> 02:47:09,039
Speaker 2: this guy, this can't be right, you know, like, and

2732
02:47:09,879 --> 02:47:12,040
Speaker 2: are you thinking, like is he mine? Or what you're thinking?

2733
02:47:13,000 --> 02:47:19,520
Speaker 2: It's a lot of stuff that you know, it's like

2734
02:47:19,959 --> 02:47:22,080
Speaker 2: not not not is he mine or anything like that,

2735
02:47:22,160 --> 02:47:25,240
Speaker 2: but it's like you do know, you know not, But

2736
02:47:25,320 --> 02:47:29,400
Speaker 2: it's like so so now you know, now I start

2737
02:47:29,480 --> 02:47:34,279
Speaker 2: you know, doing a little a little research, right, and

2738
02:47:34,320 --> 02:47:36,320
Speaker 2: so now I get the film and I'm watching him play,

2739
02:47:37,480 --> 02:47:39,720
Speaker 2: and I'm like this this joke is kind of good,

2740
02:47:40,560 --> 02:47:44,440
Speaker 2: like really good. So now they got the Pac ten tournament,

2741
02:47:44,840 --> 02:47:48,080
Speaker 2: you know, was here in l A, you know, a

2742
02:47:48,080 --> 02:47:50,879
Speaker 2: while back when he was coming out of school, and

2743
02:47:52,360 --> 02:47:54,800
Speaker 2: they came in and they was playing U C. L A.

2744
02:47:56,240 --> 02:48:00,959
Speaker 2: So I'm like, okay, well, you know, I.

2745
02:48:00,920 --> 02:48:01,920
Speaker 3: Want to meet this dude.

2746
02:48:02,040 --> 02:48:06,320
Speaker 2: So now his mom was at the game, and so

2747
02:48:06,440 --> 02:48:08,200
Speaker 2: his mom and his dad they come up, you know,

2748
02:48:08,240 --> 02:48:10,440
Speaker 2: they say hello, and you know, and then I finally

2749
02:48:10,440 --> 02:48:13,080
Speaker 2: get to meet him. And when I got to meet him,

2750
02:48:13,240 --> 02:48:18,680
Speaker 2: it was like, damn, like you, I feel like I

2751
02:48:18,720 --> 02:48:21,640
Speaker 2: really know you. I feel like I do feel like

2752
02:48:21,680 --> 02:48:24,080
Speaker 2: there's some you know, the universe talk to you, and

2753
02:48:24,320 --> 02:48:27,600
Speaker 2: there's some spirituality that you know. And I'm and so

2754
02:48:27,879 --> 02:48:30,920
Speaker 2: I'm really feeling this dude, like I hadn't been in

2755
02:48:30,959 --> 02:48:34,959
Speaker 2: his presence, but in his presence, I'm like, dude, like,

2756
02:48:35,080 --> 02:48:39,480
Speaker 2: you know, we we vibing on a totally different level. Right.

2757
02:48:40,040 --> 02:48:40,959
Speaker 2: And so now.

2758
02:48:43,160 --> 02:48:46,240
Speaker 3: He don't get drafted or he's the last pick in

2759
02:48:46,280 --> 02:48:46,879
Speaker 3: the draft.

2760
02:48:47,120 --> 02:48:47,959
Speaker 5: He's at the draft.

2761
02:48:48,000 --> 02:48:51,600
Speaker 2: He's at the draft, and and in my mind, I'm like,

2762
02:48:52,200 --> 02:48:54,560
Speaker 2: this dude can really play. I don't know why. I

2763
02:48:54,560 --> 02:48:56,800
Speaker 2: don't know why they tripping, and I don't know why

2764
02:48:56,800 --> 02:48:59,360
Speaker 2: the scouts are tripping, but this dude can really play

2765
02:48:59,400 --> 02:49:02,640
Speaker 2: and he should be in the NBA. So he gets

2766
02:49:02,720 --> 02:49:08,879
Speaker 2: drafted by Sacramento. Michael Malone is his coach. Now, I've

2767
02:49:08,879 --> 02:49:13,000
Speaker 2: known Michael Malone since he was this big Brendan Malone.

2768
02:49:13,080 --> 02:49:16,920
Speaker 2: His father, right, was my assistant coach in Detroit, and

2769
02:49:16,959 --> 02:49:19,920
Speaker 2: he was also my first hire as a coach in Toronto.

2770
02:49:20,360 --> 02:49:23,440
Speaker 2: So I've known the Malone family forever, right, So that's

2771
02:49:23,440 --> 02:49:25,240
Speaker 2: why you don't never hear me say nothing bad about

2772
02:49:25,600 --> 02:49:30,720
Speaker 2: Mike Malone and Malone family. So so now he's got

2773
02:49:30,760 --> 02:49:34,440
Speaker 2: cousins in Isaiah. And if you go back and you look,

2774
02:49:35,400 --> 02:49:38,600
Speaker 2: that's the best cousins has ever played. Best Isaiah ever played. Yeah,

2775
02:49:38,600 --> 02:49:41,080
Speaker 2: Bookie said that was his favorite coach you ever had. Absolutely,

2776
02:49:41,440 --> 02:49:45,320
Speaker 2: And so now I'm following Isaiah and everything else.

2777
02:49:45,360 --> 02:49:51,200
Speaker 3: So and now he goes to Boston. Now I'm all

2778
02:49:51,240 --> 02:49:51,720
Speaker 3: fucked up.

2779
02:49:53,600 --> 02:49:57,679
Speaker 2: I'm really messed up now because Isaiah Thomas.

2780
02:49:58,200 --> 02:49:59,240
Speaker 5: It's playing for Boston.

2781
02:49:59,320 --> 02:50:03,680
Speaker 2: It's playing for the Boston Celtics. And they love Isaiah

2782
02:50:03,840 --> 02:50:07,680
Speaker 2: in Boston love it. And I'm like this, this don't

2783
02:50:07,680 --> 02:50:09,560
Speaker 2: go to get it, don't just don't work. How is

2784
02:50:09,600 --> 02:50:13,480
Speaker 2: this working? And now he's breaking all kinds of records

2785
02:50:13,680 --> 02:50:18,760
Speaker 2: in Boston and I'm here Tommy Heyson talking about, Oh, Isaiah,

2786
02:50:18,840 --> 02:50:22,200
Speaker 2: he's the best, He's he's the greatest, and oh you

2787
02:50:22,280 --> 02:50:25,440
Speaker 2: got love that Isaiah Thomas. And I'm like, you know,

2788
02:50:25,840 --> 02:50:27,840
Speaker 2: what's the little girl who does the thing when she

2789
02:50:27,879 --> 02:50:29,240
Speaker 2: say make it make sense.

2790
02:50:29,000 --> 02:50:31,520
Speaker 4: Make it makes sense.

2791
02:50:31,520 --> 02:50:32,879
Speaker 3: I didn't mean to call you a little girl. I

2792
02:50:32,879 --> 02:50:33,480
Speaker 3: mean the woman.

2793
02:50:33,959 --> 02:50:34,360
Speaker 2: Forgive me.

2794
02:50:34,400 --> 02:50:34,840
Speaker 3: I'm old.

2795
02:50:34,920 --> 02:50:39,240
Speaker 2: So you know, but but anyway, it just it just

2796
02:50:40,800 --> 02:50:45,360
Speaker 2: what are the odds? What are the odds that a

2797
02:50:45,440 --> 02:50:49,039
Speaker 2: young man is named after you? And we know how

2798
02:50:49,040 --> 02:50:50,880
Speaker 2: hard it is to make it to the NBA. Right

2799
02:50:51,920 --> 02:50:55,520
Speaker 2: then he gets to the NBA then plays for the

2800
02:50:55,560 --> 02:51:00,160
Speaker 2: Boston Celtics, and y'all got the same name. I mean

2801
02:51:00,200 --> 02:51:04,240
Speaker 2: that that that is that is some spooky kind of

2802
02:51:04,240 --> 02:51:06,240
Speaker 2: stuff that's going up with your universe stuff.

2803
02:51:06,320 --> 02:51:09,879
Speaker 3: So we we're gonna make the Celtics love Isaiah work

2804
02:51:09,920 --> 02:51:10,200
Speaker 3: with me.

2805
02:51:12,080 --> 02:51:14,000
Speaker 1: Nice best Kobe story you can share with.

2806
02:51:14,000 --> 02:51:16,280
Speaker 3: Us, best Kobe story that I can share with you.

2807
02:51:17,640 --> 02:51:22,920
Speaker 2: So I'm in New York and Polenka, who I've known

2808
02:51:23,000 --> 02:51:28,080
Speaker 2: since he was in college and we used to our

2809
02:51:28,200 --> 02:51:30,080
Speaker 2: Detroit team used to go up and play against you

2810
02:51:30,080 --> 02:51:32,440
Speaker 2: know the five five, you know, Chris and all them,

2811
02:51:33,040 --> 02:51:37,000
Speaker 2: and Polenka was was there. So now Polenka's representing Kobe,

2812
02:51:38,320 --> 02:51:43,000
Speaker 2: and you know, Rob called me and he's like, you know,

2813
02:51:43,760 --> 02:51:45,640
Speaker 2: Kobe really wants to talk to you. He wants to

2814
02:51:46,560 --> 02:51:49,400
Speaker 2: you know, he wants to you know, understand how you think.

2815
02:51:49,520 --> 02:51:49,680
Speaker 3: You know.

2816
02:51:49,760 --> 02:51:52,520
Speaker 2: I've told him a lot about you know, Detroit, the

2817
02:51:52,600 --> 02:51:54,920
Speaker 2: bad Boys, everything else, and he wants to have a

2818
02:51:54,959 --> 02:51:59,000
Speaker 2: conversation with you. Now at that time, you know, Kobe

2819
02:51:59,080 --> 02:52:04,240
Speaker 2: is thinking about leaving in LA too, and he keeps

2820
02:52:04,240 --> 02:52:07,440
Speaker 2: saying it's not about the money. And in New York,

2821
02:52:07,560 --> 02:52:11,640
Speaker 2: all we had was a mid level to offer him. Now,

2822
02:52:11,640 --> 02:52:14,320
Speaker 2: he didn't visit I don't know if he visited any

2823
02:52:14,360 --> 02:52:18,560
Speaker 2: other teams, but he flew to New York to meet

2824
02:52:18,640 --> 02:52:23,840
Speaker 2: us to talk about signing with the Knicks, and all

2825
02:52:23,840 --> 02:52:26,320
Speaker 2: we had to offer was the mid level. But he

2826
02:52:26,480 --> 02:52:29,879
Speaker 2: was really like, I got to get out of LA

2827
02:52:31,240 --> 02:52:36,600
Speaker 2: and and I'm like, but Shack there right, And he

2828
02:52:36,680 --> 02:52:41,120
Speaker 2: was like, I want to win it on my own

2829
02:52:42,680 --> 02:52:52,840
Speaker 2: without Shack. That don't make no sense because if I

2830
02:52:52,959 --> 02:52:58,600
Speaker 2: win it with Shack, then I don't think I'm gonna

2831
02:52:58,680 --> 02:52:59,240
Speaker 2: be able.

2832
02:52:59,080 --> 02:53:03,240
Speaker 3: To rise the way I want a rise. And he says,

2833
02:53:03,280 --> 02:53:04,199
Speaker 3: so if.

2834
02:53:05,879 --> 02:53:09,880
Speaker 2: If i'm if Shaq is gone, or if I win

2835
02:53:09,959 --> 02:53:12,600
Speaker 2: at someplace else, then I can get to that next

2836
02:53:12,680 --> 02:53:15,000
Speaker 2: level or whatever level he was trying to get to.

2837
02:53:16,800 --> 02:53:19,800
Speaker 2: I was like, okay, so I've never heard any back

2838
02:53:21,080 --> 02:53:25,320
Speaker 2: like think like that. You know, that's it's kind of different.

2839
02:53:25,680 --> 02:53:28,240
Speaker 2: And Rob was sitting there and he goes, I told

2840
02:53:28,280 --> 02:53:29,879
Speaker 2: you this, He's a little different.

2841
02:53:30,040 --> 02:53:30,240
Speaker 3: You know.

2842
02:53:30,360 --> 02:53:33,960
Speaker 2: He says, so you want to shoulder that burden all

2843
02:53:34,280 --> 02:53:39,640
Speaker 2: by yourself? He goes, yeah, and and so now you know,

2844
02:53:39,680 --> 02:53:42,680
Speaker 2: he starts talking to me about the pistons and thinking

2845
02:53:42,879 --> 02:53:45,520
Speaker 2: and being and and at that time, I don't know

2846
02:53:45,560 --> 02:53:50,519
Speaker 2: if y'all remember, but Kobe wasn't well liked by his teammates.

2847
02:53:50,879 --> 02:53:51,320
Speaker 4: Uh.

2848
02:53:51,360 --> 02:53:53,879
Speaker 2: And he wasn't a guy that you know, hung out

2849
02:53:54,000 --> 02:53:57,879
Speaker 2: or anything like that. You know, very disciplined, very regimented,

2850
02:53:57,959 --> 02:54:03,120
Speaker 2: work atthick and everything else. And he's like, you know,

2851
02:54:03,200 --> 02:54:07,040
Speaker 2: I want people to like me. But at the same time,

2852
02:54:08,360 --> 02:54:11,160
Speaker 2: I don't want to change. And so I was like,

2853
02:54:11,200 --> 02:54:14,240
Speaker 2: don't change. I said, you're doing it the right way.

2854
02:54:14,680 --> 02:54:16,160
Speaker 2: I said, I'm not sure if you can win without

2855
02:54:16,200 --> 02:54:19,080
Speaker 2: Shack though. That dude looked me straight in the eye,

2856
02:54:19,640 --> 02:54:24,560
Speaker 2: and he goes, whether I'm with Shack or not, because

2857
02:54:24,600 --> 02:54:27,480
Speaker 2: I prefer to not be with him, because I.

2858
02:54:27,440 --> 02:54:28,480
Speaker 3: Want to win it on my own.

2859
02:54:31,680 --> 02:54:36,520
Speaker 2: I said, good luck, young man. And so that's my

2860
02:54:36,640 --> 02:54:40,680
Speaker 2: Kobe story, right, And that left an impression on me

2861
02:54:41,400 --> 02:54:44,199
Speaker 2: in terms of someone having.

2862
02:54:43,959 --> 02:54:46,760
Speaker 3: A wheel and a determination.

2863
02:54:47,800 --> 02:54:50,040
Speaker 2: And when they lost to the Celtics in Boston that

2864
02:54:50,200 --> 02:54:53,080
Speaker 2: game seven, I think it was it was Game six

2865
02:54:53,200 --> 02:54:57,520
Speaker 2: or seven, the first one, the Celtics beat him, and

2866
02:54:57,560 --> 02:54:58,760
Speaker 2: if you remember, he was.

2867
02:54:58,760 --> 02:55:02,720
Speaker 3: Like six for thirty or yet he had like a really.

2868
02:55:02,440 --> 02:55:07,959
Speaker 2: Bad game, and in my mind, I'm like, it's gonna

2869
02:55:08,000 --> 02:55:11,400
Speaker 2: be hard to get up that heell. And then the

2870
02:55:11,400 --> 02:55:13,039
Speaker 2: next year he comes back and he stamp it with

2871
02:55:13,080 --> 02:55:16,480
Speaker 2: a back to back boom boom, without shot, without shock

2872
02:55:16,840 --> 02:55:21,560
Speaker 2: five and with gasol, and then he does this right,

2873
02:55:22,120 --> 02:55:23,800
Speaker 2: So I was like, yeah, I got three with shack,

2874
02:55:25,480 --> 02:55:28,200
Speaker 2: but I got it, I got stamped back to back. Now,

2875
02:55:30,080 --> 02:55:34,400
Speaker 2: I understood that feeling the back to back. It's okay

2876
02:55:34,400 --> 02:55:38,240
Speaker 2: to win one, but when you can come back and

2877
02:55:38,280 --> 02:55:43,320
Speaker 2: dominate again and let all y'all know I'm that dude

2878
02:55:44,280 --> 02:55:48,160
Speaker 2: again again and ain't no bs, that's what he was

2879
02:55:48,200 --> 02:55:50,400
Speaker 2: able to do. So I understood that feeling.

2880
02:55:50,560 --> 02:55:56,400
Speaker 1: Kobe to the next next question, Oh, we had no shot,

2881
02:55:56,920 --> 02:56:00,879
Speaker 1: but of the idea and the respect right that he

2882
02:56:00,920 --> 02:56:03,360
Speaker 1: would even entertain it, And that never got out. So

2883
02:56:03,400 --> 02:56:05,160
Speaker 1: you had breaking news on all the smoke.

2884
02:56:05,200 --> 02:56:09,520
Speaker 2: God damn, I appreciate you. You got the stories that

2885
02:56:09,560 --> 02:56:12,680
Speaker 2: ain't got out. You know that we know that Jack.

2886
02:56:12,720 --> 02:56:15,760
Speaker 2: You should tell him the one about when you when

2887
02:56:15,800 --> 02:56:17,800
Speaker 2: you almost got ran out of this league.

2888
02:56:18,320 --> 02:56:19,440
Speaker 5: Where at an Indie.

2889
02:56:19,520 --> 02:56:23,960
Speaker 2: And yeah, remember that call you made to me and

2890
02:56:24,000 --> 02:56:25,199
Speaker 2: I called the commissioner up.

2891
02:56:25,879 --> 02:56:27,680
Speaker 4: Man, I forgot about that.

2892
02:56:27,879 --> 02:56:29,280
Speaker 2: You was out. I was done.

2893
02:56:29,440 --> 02:56:31,680
Speaker 3: You was done. You was done.

2894
02:56:32,040 --> 02:56:33,880
Speaker 4: I was done so many times. But y'all remember that.

2895
02:56:34,040 --> 02:56:38,440
Speaker 2: And and you you said, I called you from AL.

2896
02:56:39,440 --> 02:56:40,720
Speaker 5: Yeah, that's how I got in touch with you.

2897
02:56:40,720 --> 02:56:42,480
Speaker 3: And I called David Stern. I said, you can't do

2898
02:56:42,560 --> 02:56:43,400
Speaker 3: that to him.

2899
02:56:43,640 --> 02:56:45,000
Speaker 2: I was done. You was out.

2900
02:56:45,080 --> 02:56:49,560
Speaker 3: I remember that you was gone. M that's how you

2901
02:56:49,600 --> 02:56:50,440
Speaker 3: got back in the league.

2902
02:56:50,480 --> 02:56:51,000
Speaker 2: I was done.

2903
02:56:52,000 --> 02:56:52,600
Speaker 5: You remember that.

2904
02:56:52,680 --> 02:56:54,040
Speaker 3: I guess that you should tell that story.

2905
02:56:54,120 --> 02:56:57,200
Speaker 4: I actually forgot about that, but I remember vividly now. Yeah,

2906
02:56:57,640 --> 02:56:59,960
Speaker 4: because I was I was trying to call everybody that

2907
02:57:00,040 --> 02:57:00,760
Speaker 4: I figured would.

2908
02:57:00,600 --> 02:57:04,879
Speaker 5: Help me at that time. Yeah, and Al saved me, saved.

2909
02:57:04,640 --> 02:57:08,520
Speaker 2: Me, Isaiah saved I mean I say.

2910
02:57:08,560 --> 02:57:13,120
Speaker 4: Saved me, but say you know what I mean, saved.

2911
02:57:12,560 --> 02:57:13,959
Speaker 5: Me, but connected me to you.

2912
02:57:14,440 --> 02:57:17,520
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, And and you got back out on the court.

2913
02:57:18,480 --> 02:57:23,000
Speaker 2: How many how many weeks after that? Three? Thank you?

2914
02:57:23,440 --> 02:57:23,920
Speaker 5: Three weeks.

2915
02:57:23,920 --> 02:57:25,879
Speaker 1: I was in the midst of you already suspended.

2916
02:57:25,959 --> 02:57:26,560
Speaker 3: He was gone.

2917
02:57:26,680 --> 02:57:27,240
Speaker 2: I was done.

2918
02:57:27,640 --> 02:57:29,440
Speaker 5: I was at home already, he was suspended.

2919
02:57:30,320 --> 02:57:32,320
Speaker 3: The wheels were greased and he was out.

2920
02:57:34,000 --> 02:57:35,080
Speaker 5: Huh.

2921
02:57:35,800 --> 02:57:40,200
Speaker 4: I don't I think I called ghostbusters. No, I ain't

2922
02:57:40,200 --> 02:57:46,440
Speaker 4: called ghostbusters. I ain't called ghostbusters. Donny Wall, I remember

2923
02:57:46,480 --> 02:57:49,560
Speaker 4: Donny wallh Zeke and.

2924
02:57:49,560 --> 02:57:53,199
Speaker 5: Uh Mike Brown.

2925
02:57:54,080 --> 02:57:55,520
Speaker 4: That's the only people that went the wall for me

2926
02:57:56,120 --> 02:57:58,039
Speaker 4: that I did, I remember vividly remember.

2927
02:57:58,440 --> 02:58:00,840
Speaker 1: But the only one that got to David Stern the ear. Yeah,

2928
02:58:01,400 --> 02:58:02,520
Speaker 1: I went to that man's office.

2929
02:58:03,080 --> 02:58:03,480
Speaker 2: M hmm.

2930
02:58:03,840 --> 02:58:04,520
Speaker 3: I can't do that.

2931
02:58:04,520 --> 02:58:08,360
Speaker 2: Then, that's dope.

2932
02:58:08,400 --> 02:58:09,840
Speaker 3: That's not going to happen.

2933
02:58:10,240 --> 02:58:14,280
Speaker 4: Minute my show was gone to I was gone.

2934
02:58:15,040 --> 02:58:16,280
Speaker 2: I've seen it. I was done.

2935
02:58:17,080 --> 02:58:19,080
Speaker 4: If you could see one guests on our show.

2936
02:58:18,840 --> 02:58:19,840
Speaker 5: O G, who would it be?

2937
02:58:19,879 --> 02:58:22,879
Speaker 2: Michael Jordan's put him in the seat, tell them to

2938
02:58:22,920 --> 02:58:24,600
Speaker 2: come sit here and answer the question.

2939
02:58:25,320 --> 02:58:29,000
Speaker 5: Whoever the person is to help us get him on.

2940
02:58:32,200 --> 02:58:38,080
Speaker 2: That's not a question, that's not a question. No, you

2941
02:58:38,160 --> 02:58:39,280
Speaker 2: love his shoe, you love it?

2942
02:58:39,400 --> 02:58:43,959
Speaker 4: Jingle yeah, y'all yeah, boxes, I'm still signed y'all his number.

2943
02:58:44,040 --> 02:58:46,879
Speaker 2: You know, y'all, somebody.

2944
02:58:46,680 --> 02:58:47,879
Speaker 4: That you can help us get on the show that

2945
02:58:47,879 --> 02:58:49,720
Speaker 4: you would like to see on our show. Because I

2946
02:58:49,720 --> 02:58:51,600
Speaker 4: didn't hit him a million times now, that ain't going

2947
02:58:51,640 --> 02:58:51,960
Speaker 4: as pan.

2948
02:58:52,120 --> 02:58:53,920
Speaker 5: That's that's how as quick as we wanted to.

2949
02:58:54,360 --> 02:59:00,480
Speaker 3: So here's real talk, right, we in this brotherhood.

2950
02:59:01,280 --> 02:59:05,280
Speaker 2: Should have to go to the loopholes. Our job and

2951
02:59:05,400 --> 02:59:14,440
Speaker 2: our responsibility is to come here and help you uplifts preach.

2952
02:59:15,000 --> 02:59:23,360
Speaker 2: That is our responsibility. That classified as black in the

2953
02:59:23,480 --> 02:59:29,320
Speaker 2: United States of America. Our job is to come and

2954
02:59:29,680 --> 02:59:37,080
Speaker 2: help each other. Now that being said, he needs to

2955
02:59:37,120 --> 02:59:41,520
Speaker 2: sit here. Now who else? Who else? Who else?

2956
02:59:41,520 --> 02:59:43,280
Speaker 3: Would I want you to see?

2957
02:59:43,320 --> 02:59:44,840
Speaker 1: We got a co run. You just topped off a

2958
02:59:44,840 --> 02:59:49,959
Speaker 1: cold run. We have magic Chuck and then you. Yeah,

2959
02:59:50,680 --> 02:59:52,480
Speaker 1: I got How about this? Y'all deserve it?

2960
02:59:52,800 --> 02:59:56,199
Speaker 4: Thank you, thank you very much.

2961
02:59:58,160 --> 02:59:59,400
Speaker 5: I got a request, though.

2962
03:00:00,720 --> 03:00:03,560
Speaker 4: It's different from me, Like I've been knowing about this

2963
03:00:03,600 --> 03:00:06,680
Speaker 4: guy when his teammates my whole life, and I've been

2964
03:00:06,720 --> 03:00:09,000
Speaker 4: in I've been in little tournaments where he saved me

2965
03:00:09,040 --> 03:00:13,240
Speaker 4: as a youngster. Joe Dumas, Joe been knowing me since

2966
03:00:13,240 --> 03:00:15,800
Speaker 4: I was a kid. Yeah, I'm playing in the Lake.

2967
03:00:15,720 --> 03:00:17,640
Speaker 5: Charles tournaments, basketball tournaments.

2968
03:00:17,959 --> 03:00:18,840
Speaker 2: Joe is a legend.

2969
03:00:19,080 --> 03:00:21,000
Speaker 5: Yes, I would love to get a chance to pick

2970
03:00:21,000 --> 03:00:21,520
Speaker 5: his brand and.

2971
03:00:21,440 --> 03:00:23,040
Speaker 4: Get to know him because I never had a conversation

2972
03:00:23,120 --> 03:00:23,400
Speaker 4: with him.

2973
03:00:23,480 --> 03:00:26,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's someone that you's have in his chair and

2974
03:00:26,480 --> 03:00:30,039
Speaker 2: he can be official season. Yes, you know he wants

2975
03:00:30,959 --> 03:00:33,800
Speaker 2: the Pistons, right, he's in the league office. The bad boys.

2976
03:00:34,200 --> 03:00:38,600
Speaker 2: The Sportsmanship Trophy, we're so bad. It's named after Joe.

2977
03:00:38,360 --> 03:00:42,720
Speaker 2: So the influence that we've had on this NBA that

2978
03:00:42,720 --> 03:00:45,760
Speaker 2: they don't give us credit for, talk about, right, Joe

2979
03:00:45,840 --> 03:00:46,400
Speaker 2: would be great.

2980
03:00:48,280 --> 03:00:50,200
Speaker 1: Let me ask you one more question. I mean we're dumb,

2981
03:00:50,240 --> 03:00:52,200
Speaker 1: but I mean you're just so open right now. We

2982
03:00:52,240 --> 03:00:56,039
Speaker 1: may never get this opportunity again. Why do you think

2983
03:00:56,120 --> 03:01:01,680
Speaker 1: And this sit down has been so eye opening, mind opening,

2984
03:01:01,879 --> 03:01:05,400
Speaker 1: and I've learned so much. Where did the bad narrative

2985
03:01:05,440 --> 03:01:06,520
Speaker 1: about you come from?

2986
03:01:07,240 --> 03:01:11,679
Speaker 2: Because I had the audacity to come into this league

2987
03:01:12,080 --> 03:01:13,320
Speaker 2: and ask.

2988
03:01:14,879 --> 03:01:15,760
Speaker 3: For diversity.

2989
03:01:17,320 --> 03:01:21,360
Speaker 2: And I said to the media, when I came into

2990
03:01:21,400 --> 03:01:28,680
Speaker 2: the NBA, it was ninety nine point nine percent white

2991
03:01:29,480 --> 03:01:37,039
Speaker 2: male coverage or no females, and it may be a

2992
03:01:37,840 --> 03:01:42,039
Speaker 2: one brother point one.

2993
03:01:41,280 --> 03:01:42,520
Speaker 3: Right, And.

2994
03:01:44,440 --> 03:01:49,720
Speaker 2: I said, I do not want to be judged or

2995
03:01:49,800 --> 03:01:59,880
Speaker 2: perceived only through the gaze of the white male. Is

2996
03:02:00,160 --> 03:02:02,920
Speaker 2: eighty That that that that debt And I went to

2997
03:02:02,959 --> 03:02:06,760
Speaker 2: the Commissioner's office. Well, Stern already charged me not to

2998
03:02:06,800 --> 03:02:10,360
Speaker 2: cut you off with this there this, So I came

2999
03:02:10,400 --> 03:02:15,320
Speaker 2: in under Larry O'Brien and then Larry left, David came

3000
03:02:15,400 --> 03:02:21,199
Speaker 2: in and to Stern's credit, this is what Stern did.

3001
03:02:21,920 --> 03:02:25,440
Speaker 2: Big respect to David Stern, because what David Stern did

3002
03:02:26,959 --> 03:02:34,960
Speaker 2: for NBA basketball in to America is David Stern said,

3003
03:02:36,200 --> 03:02:41,160
Speaker 2: black players classified as black in the United States. I'm

3004
03:02:41,200 --> 03:02:48,560
Speaker 2: gonna put them out front the center. Your researcher, Sports Illustrated.

3005
03:02:48,640 --> 03:02:51,199
Speaker 2: You can pull it up Sports Illustrated. On the cover

3006
03:02:51,440 --> 03:03:01,320
Speaker 2: of Sports Illustrated, will white America except the NBA's black players. Wow,

3007
03:03:01,640 --> 03:03:05,800
Speaker 2: that was the article that was the cover, and David

3008
03:03:05,840 --> 03:03:13,039
Speaker 2: Stern said, boom, I'm putting it there now. Now I'm

3009
03:03:13,080 --> 03:03:17,920
Speaker 2: following up, and I'm saying, we need some black coverage,

3010
03:03:18,360 --> 03:03:21,119
Speaker 2: you know, we need some some brothers. You know where

3011
03:03:21,120 --> 03:03:28,920
Speaker 2: they at in Detroit And it still may be to

3012
03:03:28,959 --> 03:03:34,280
Speaker 2: this day. I was making so much noise. They gave

3013
03:03:34,360 --> 03:03:39,039
Speaker 2: us two black beat writers, and I think Detroit at

3014
03:03:39,040 --> 03:03:41,840
Speaker 2: that time was the only team traveling with two black

3015
03:03:41,879 --> 03:03:47,160
Speaker 2: beat writers. Terry Foster, who's a columnist now True Sharp

3016
03:03:47,240 --> 03:03:51,439
Speaker 2: who passed away, became a columnist, Clifton Brown became a columnist,

3017
03:03:52,200 --> 03:04:02,000
Speaker 2: Brian Burrowell became a columnist. Jeanette Howard became a columnist

3018
03:04:05,280 --> 03:04:12,359
Speaker 2: that was Detroit, traveling around the NBA and Detroit today,

3019
03:04:13,360 --> 03:04:16,600
Speaker 2: I think they still have two black beat writers on

3020
03:04:16,640 --> 03:04:23,600
Speaker 2: the beat now, and I think Beard just got promoted

3021
03:04:23,640 --> 03:04:27,240
Speaker 2: to a columnist or he may even be an editor.

3022
03:04:28,680 --> 03:04:31,800
Speaker 2: So why do I get so much trouble Because a

3023
03:04:31,840 --> 03:04:34,440
Speaker 2: lot of the white males at that time who were

3024
03:04:34,440 --> 03:04:39,959
Speaker 2: writing didn't like what I was saying, and they thought

3025
03:04:40,040 --> 03:04:43,600
Speaker 2: that I was coming after their jobs or what have you.

3026
03:04:43,760 --> 03:04:47,360
Speaker 2: And back then, they painted all the pictures. They painted

3027
03:04:47,400 --> 03:04:50,720
Speaker 2: all the pictures, and not only did they paint the pictures,

3028
03:04:51,920 --> 03:04:57,840
Speaker 2: but after they so you would get interviewed, they would

3029
03:04:57,840 --> 03:05:00,680
Speaker 2: write down what you say, and then they would take

3030
03:05:00,680 --> 03:05:04,560
Speaker 2: it to an editor, and one hundred percent of the

3031
03:05:04,680 --> 03:05:12,080
Speaker 2: editors were white males, and then the editor would fritique

3032
03:05:12,120 --> 03:05:14,880
Speaker 2: what you said, and then they were put in the newspaper.

3033
03:05:15,080 --> 03:05:18,560
Speaker 2: And that's what you said, nothing like what came out

3034
03:05:18,560 --> 03:05:21,440
Speaker 2: of my mouth. Right, sometimes it was right, sometimes it

3035
03:05:21,560 --> 03:05:28,400
Speaker 2: was wrong. Whatever. So, and then the second thing is,

3036
03:05:29,160 --> 03:05:35,520
Speaker 2: y'all former players at that time when I became vice

3037
03:05:35,560 --> 03:05:40,560
Speaker 2: president and president of the union, agents at that time.

3038
03:05:41,840 --> 03:05:46,959
Speaker 3: Were taken twenty percent off the top.

3039
03:05:47,600 --> 03:05:50,720
Speaker 2: Damn, that's crazy. As for a player contracts. They were

3040
03:05:50,760 --> 03:05:55,400
Speaker 2: taking fifty percent on endorsements. So I put in this

3041
03:05:55,440 --> 03:06:00,160
Speaker 2: thing called agent certification, and I cut the fees from

3042
03:06:00,600 --> 03:06:06,160
Speaker 2: twenty percent to a negotiated four and then we slotted

3043
03:06:06,200 --> 03:06:10,920
Speaker 2: the salaries and we uniformed the contract in terms of language.

3044
03:06:12,320 --> 03:06:14,440
Speaker 2: I retired in ninety four and locked y'all out in

3045
03:06:14,520 --> 03:06:15,080
Speaker 2: ninety five.

3046
03:06:16,240 --> 03:06:18,640
Speaker 1: He said, they locked it out and they winked.

3047
03:06:20,480 --> 03:06:23,000
Speaker 3: Damn one more time. I retired in ninety four.

3048
03:06:23,040 --> 03:06:27,040
Speaker 2: They locked you out in ninety five, and then they

3049
03:06:27,040 --> 03:06:29,720
Speaker 2: started clawing back and taking everything that you once had,

3050
03:06:32,280 --> 03:06:35,680
Speaker 2: and then they start putting other people in place. So

3051
03:06:35,840 --> 03:06:42,840
Speaker 2: between the agent's narrative and some of the script writers,

3052
03:06:43,879 --> 03:06:46,879
Speaker 2: and so I want you to go back and look

3053
03:06:46,959 --> 03:06:50,080
Speaker 2: up this word. It's called hegemony.

3054
03:06:50,280 --> 03:06:51,040
Speaker 5: How you spelled it?

3055
03:06:51,680 --> 03:07:00,120
Speaker 2: H egm n y y'all get that fun me you

3056
03:07:00,200 --> 03:07:06,519
Speaker 2: don't need it, Jiminy and a hedgemont right. The scriptwriters,

3057
03:07:07,480 --> 03:07:15,200
Speaker 2: those who create the narrative, those who influence, those who

3058
03:07:15,240 --> 03:07:18,840
Speaker 2: tell you not to like me, and like that one.

3059
03:07:20,840 --> 03:07:25,320
Speaker 2: You don't know why you don't like me, You just know, well,

3060
03:07:25,440 --> 03:07:28,240
Speaker 2: it's just something I don't know. Did they look for

3061
03:07:28,280 --> 03:07:31,720
Speaker 2: any reason? You know? It's you know you know, but

3062
03:07:31,720 --> 03:07:40,000
Speaker 2: it's always some whatever it is, right, But you remember

3063
03:07:40,000 --> 03:07:42,440
Speaker 2: that word and you go back and you look at it, Jiminy,

3064
03:07:43,640 --> 03:07:47,000
Speaker 2: and put that in your definitions and start talking to

3065
03:07:47,040 --> 03:07:54,080
Speaker 2: people about it. But bring that that we're back into play,

3066
03:07:54,120 --> 03:07:59,720
Speaker 2: because that's what's happening in the NBA and these narratives

3067
03:07:59,720 --> 03:08:00,199
Speaker 2: and these.

3068
03:08:00,080 --> 03:08:01,400
Speaker 3: Stories and everything else.

3069
03:08:01,959 --> 03:08:06,200
Speaker 2: You know, from an educational standpoint, we need to know

3070
03:08:06,560 --> 03:08:10,080
Speaker 2: what the script writers are saying, how we being scripted,

3071
03:08:10,520 --> 03:08:14,119
Speaker 2: how were being spoken to and spoken about? The last

3072
03:08:14,120 --> 03:08:16,160
Speaker 2: thing I'm leading with in terms of the thing that

3073
03:08:16,200 --> 03:08:28,160
Speaker 2: I attacked and still attacked today. Language carries outside of

3074
03:08:28,200 --> 03:08:33,400
Speaker 2: the plan field. So these ugly labels that they attached

3075
03:08:33,520 --> 03:08:38,080
Speaker 2: to the Detroit Pistons. Bill Lambert had never been called

3076
03:08:38,120 --> 03:08:44,160
Speaker 2: a thug in his life, grew up in the suburbs,

3077
03:08:44,200 --> 03:08:46,840
Speaker 2: his father and a fortune five hundred company. He gets

3078
03:08:46,840 --> 03:08:51,760
Speaker 2: to the Detroit Pistons and they call Bill Lamber a thug.

3079
03:08:53,680 --> 03:08:56,280
Speaker 2: And we know what thug means outside of the game

3080
03:08:56,320 --> 03:08:59,720
Speaker 2: of basketball. So these dirty labels that they're attached to

3081
03:08:59,800 --> 03:09:04,640
Speaker 2: us right in all way of play. And then Detroit

3082
03:09:04,720 --> 03:09:06,879
Speaker 2: being the city that it is in all black city,

3083
03:09:07,560 --> 03:09:10,680
Speaker 2: So the language that they used around us and the

3084
03:09:10,800 --> 03:09:14,960
Speaker 2: narrative that they painted around us. Right, And when you

3085
03:09:15,080 --> 03:09:20,080
Speaker 2: try to refute those labels bad person, you're a bad person.

3086
03:09:20,280 --> 03:09:24,080
Speaker 2: You got pushed down further and further. Right, So.

3087
03:09:25,640 --> 03:09:26,840
Speaker 3: You know the.

3088
03:09:30,360 --> 03:09:34,160
Speaker 2: I had never been called a thug in my life,

3089
03:09:34,240 --> 03:09:39,560
Speaker 2: and I've said to civil writers along the way, don't

3090
03:09:39,560 --> 03:09:45,119
Speaker 2: ever call me a beast, don't ever call me an animal.

3091
03:09:47,840 --> 03:09:53,920
Speaker 2: Don't use dehumanizing words and terms to describe the way

3092
03:09:53,959 --> 03:10:00,720
Speaker 2: I play. That's not who I am, that's not what

3093
03:10:00,840 --> 03:10:06,880
Speaker 2: I represent. You're smart, you went to college, you're a journalists.

3094
03:10:06,920 --> 03:10:07,360
Speaker 5: You have a.

3095
03:10:07,320 --> 03:10:14,720
Speaker 2: Degree, you have a pretty vast vocabulary. You can find

3096
03:10:15,160 --> 03:10:22,080
Speaker 2: better words and language to use around the way I play.

3097
03:10:22,800 --> 03:10:33,520
Speaker 2: So I get drafted, I'm a restricted free agent. Then

3098
03:10:33,560 --> 03:10:43,400
Speaker 2: I become free. Let that sit with you for a minute.

3099
03:10:44,000 --> 03:10:55,039
Speaker 2: After I gain my freedom, now I can go anywhere. Okay,

3100
03:10:58,320 --> 03:11:09,080
Speaker 2: Now you can fantasize about you can trade me, you

3101
03:11:09,120 --> 03:11:11,480
Speaker 2: can bet on me, you can gamble on me, you

3102
03:11:11,520 --> 03:11:16,560
Speaker 2: can you can say words to me inside this place

3103
03:11:17,160 --> 03:11:19,840
Speaker 2: that no one would dare say outside of this place

3104
03:11:19,879 --> 03:11:25,480
Speaker 2: to me. So we're in a very slippery slope here,

3105
03:11:28,360 --> 03:11:38,040
Speaker 2: and the dehumanization of the NBA player needs to be uplifted. Now,

3106
03:11:38,120 --> 03:11:41,760
Speaker 2: I'm gonna give Adam Silver a big hand because what

3107
03:11:41,840 --> 03:11:44,720
Speaker 2: he said the other day, which he's getting heavily criticized

3108
03:11:44,760 --> 03:11:49,560
Speaker 2: for in terms of load management. Right, the first word

3109
03:11:49,600 --> 03:11:51,959
Speaker 2: that came out of Adam Silver's mouth was.

3110
03:11:53,520 --> 03:12:01,439
Speaker 3: These guys are what human? These are human beings.

3111
03:12:03,080 --> 03:12:09,840
Speaker 2: That's what he said. Oh oh oh, these guys, these

3112
03:12:09,879 --> 03:12:11,240
Speaker 2: guys ain't human they.

3113
03:12:11,200 --> 03:12:11,880
Speaker 3: Player did it?

3114
03:12:12,040 --> 03:12:16,960
Speaker 2: No, no, no, no, that commission is right. He wants

3115
03:12:17,040 --> 03:12:20,720
Speaker 2: to treat them like human beings. And he actually used

3116
03:12:20,720 --> 03:12:25,119
Speaker 2: the word human being. And you have one player right

3117
03:12:25,160 --> 03:12:31,680
Speaker 2: now who just left Brooklyn, and he keeps saying, don't

3118
03:12:31,720 --> 03:12:32,879
Speaker 2: dehumanize me.

3119
03:12:37,400 --> 03:12:39,240
Speaker 3: Words carry weight.

3120
03:12:43,280 --> 03:12:49,240
Speaker 2: Words carry weight, and it's important how you define read

3121
03:12:49,520 --> 03:12:51,039
Speaker 2: talk about me.

3122
03:12:52,240 --> 03:12:55,959
Speaker 3: I don't accept it. I push back on a lot

3123
03:12:56,000 --> 03:12:56,560
Speaker 3: of No.

3124
03:12:57,120 --> 03:13:01,480
Speaker 2: You can't speak to me that way. You can't talk

3125
03:13:01,520 --> 03:13:04,320
Speaker 2: to me that way. You can't say this to me. No,

3126
03:13:04,480 --> 03:13:09,440
Speaker 2: I'm not that. Oh well, when you talk to Isaiah Man,

3127
03:13:09,480 --> 03:13:14,480
Speaker 2: you know that now, Yeah, you come correct. Yes, I'm

3128
03:13:14,520 --> 03:13:18,720
Speaker 2: not accepting you calling me the N word, y'all can say,

3129
03:13:18,840 --> 03:13:23,920
Speaker 2: don't look in the dictionary. This is what it says. Right,

3130
03:13:24,480 --> 03:13:26,640
Speaker 2: don't call me that now, if you want to call

3131
03:13:26,640 --> 03:13:29,160
Speaker 2: your friend that you wanna call somebody, But don't call

3132
03:13:29,240 --> 03:13:31,200
Speaker 2: me that, because when I was growing up, if you

3133
03:13:31,240 --> 03:13:33,640
Speaker 2: call me that, we fighting. I'm fighting you every day

3134
03:13:34,680 --> 03:13:36,640
Speaker 2: no matter how much melanine you have in your skin

3135
03:13:37,120 --> 03:13:38,920
Speaker 2: or the lack of melanine you have in your skin.

3136
03:13:39,320 --> 03:13:42,600
Speaker 2: You call me that, it's on Don't call me that

3137
03:13:42,680 --> 03:13:44,959
Speaker 2: on the internet. Don't call me that on social media.

3138
03:13:45,600 --> 03:13:51,320
Speaker 2: Never ever ever call your mama that. Don't call me that, right,

3139
03:13:51,560 --> 03:13:54,520
Speaker 2: I'm not that. And how we speak to each other,

3140
03:13:54,600 --> 03:13:57,040
Speaker 2: how we treat each other, how we interact with each other,

3141
03:13:59,000 --> 03:14:02,359
Speaker 2: real talk. Taking it all the way back to the gangs.

3142
03:14:04,040 --> 03:14:09,720
Speaker 2: They weren't called gangs until they got labeled gangs. They

3143
03:14:09,720 --> 03:14:15,520
Speaker 2: were organizations in the community teaching us how to be

3144
03:14:15,800 --> 03:14:27,120
Speaker 2: upstanding citizens, live, act, treat each other. Then Big brother

3145
03:14:27,760 --> 03:14:31,240
Speaker 2: put some stuff in our neighborhood. Big Brothers started doing

3146
03:14:31,240 --> 03:14:33,959
Speaker 2: a lot of other stuff in our neighborhoods. And it's

3147
03:14:34,000 --> 03:14:39,760
Speaker 2: all documented. But you know the words that are being

3148
03:14:39,840 --> 03:14:46,600
Speaker 2: used right now. We can do better. Absolutely, man.

3149
03:14:46,640 --> 03:14:50,560
Speaker 1: We appreciate you, especially straight off a flight to come

3150
03:14:50,600 --> 03:14:52,320
Speaker 1: here and sit down and spend some time with us,

3151
03:14:52,320 --> 03:14:54,520
Speaker 1: and like I said, and just enlighten us. You know,

3152
03:14:54,560 --> 03:14:57,160
Speaker 1: I learned a lot today and I appreciate.

3153
03:14:56,879 --> 03:14:57,760
Speaker 3: I got some free stuff.

3154
03:14:58,160 --> 03:15:02,080
Speaker 2: You got some gears. But this this is one thing

3155
03:15:02,160 --> 03:15:06,360
Speaker 2: that all of us want, right. Don't give me no money. Okay,

3156
03:15:06,520 --> 03:15:07,920
Speaker 2: we won't gear. Do you want gear?

3157
03:15:07,959 --> 03:15:11,039
Speaker 3: You want the money, We take the gear over the money, right.

3158
03:15:11,080 --> 03:15:11,360
Speaker 2: Gear.

3159
03:15:11,680 --> 03:15:14,160
Speaker 5: We got some manscape, we got your body buffer.

3160
03:15:14,680 --> 03:15:17,480
Speaker 4: You know, we got some all the Smoke T shirt

3161
03:15:17,520 --> 03:15:20,640
Speaker 4: and sweatshirt, just some limited edition all the smoke gear

3162
03:15:20,720 --> 03:15:20,959
Speaker 4: for you.

3163
03:15:20,959 --> 03:15:23,280
Speaker 5: Will appreciate you showing up. Thank you off the plane.

3164
03:15:23,280 --> 03:15:24,280
Speaker 3: O G thank you.

3165
03:15:24,320 --> 03:15:27,199
Speaker 2: I got you so much. Man. We appreciate you than.

3166
03:15:27,200 --> 03:15:28,800
Speaker 3: I send you a bottle of champagne.

3167
03:15:29,040 --> 03:15:31,360
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, I had one for you.

3168
03:15:31,440 --> 03:15:32,400
Speaker 2: Well that's a wrap man.

3169
03:15:32,520 --> 03:15:37,080
Speaker 1: Isaiah Thomas, the one and only, the real Zeke All

3170
03:15:37,160 --> 03:15:40,800
Speaker 1: the Smoke, Showtime Basketball YouTube, and the iHeart Platform Black Effects.

3171
03:15:41,000 --> 03:15:42,119
Speaker 2: We'll see y'all next week