Speaker 1: Welcome to Creature Future production of I Heart Radio. I'm
Speaker 1: your host of Many Parasites, Katie Golden. I studied psychology
Speaker 1: and evolutionary biology, and today on the show, we're talking
Speaker 1: about secret stashes. We all like to snack, and none
Speaker 1: of us like others stealing our snacks. So what do
Speaker 1: you do your hoard? But animals don't have that secret
Speaker 1: cabinet fold cookies. They hide behind their podcasting desk. So
Speaker 1: how do they do it? From massive dragon hoards of
Speaker 1: nuts to the treasure of tiny kickboxers we're looking at cash.
Speaker 1: Is that these animals only hope to clear by eating them?
Speaker 1: Discover this and more as we answer the angel question
Speaker 1: can a giant weasel see into the future? Joining me
Speaker 1: today is friend of the show Garfield, Expert, award winning
Speaker 1: Indie filmmaker and writer for the show Spirit Rangers, Joey Cleft. Welcome, Katy,
Speaker 1: Thanks so much for having me. Very excited to be back.
Speaker 1: Quick question, Uh, you said you're the host of Many Parasites.
Speaker 1: Is there like a favorite parasite that you're infested with?
Speaker 1: Probably demodex? Uh. They live in my eyelashes and they
Speaker 1: eat my dead skin, and they look like tiny microscopic aliens.
Speaker 1: Um that that does sound like a really useful parasite,
Speaker 1: and like, I mean, I feel like all parasites look
Speaker 1: like aliens in some level. Right, Well, good news you
Speaker 1: have them too. Technically, there's no useful parasite. Uh, there's
Speaker 1: I guess there's some Basically with the demodex, there's some
Speaker 1: nuance to whether they're actually parasites or if they're in
Speaker 1: a commensal relationship, meaning that they benefit from us and
Speaker 1: they don't actually do much for us, because like, while
Speaker 1: it seems like they might help out by eating the
Speaker 1: dead skin, they can cause problems and irritation if they're
Speaker 1: too any of them, and there's not really that much
Speaker 1: evidence that they do us much good. So they I
Speaker 1: think that depending on whether they actually cause any irritation,
Speaker 1: they're either just sort of in a symbiotic relationship with
Speaker 1: us where it's a commensal relationship where they don't really
Speaker 1: hurt us or their parasites when they kind of cause
Speaker 1: irritation and cause problems. Wow, the sounds like freeloaders to me.
Speaker 1: Start charging them rents. Yeah, well, just so many tiny
Speaker 1: little tenants, which makes us all landlords. When you think
Speaker 1: about it. Yuck. Yeah. Yeah. Now let's talk about the
Speaker 1: biggest parasite of all landload. Well, today we are talking
Speaker 1: about hoarding, uh cashing food. So it's something that animals
Speaker 1: do to keep a secret stash of food, especially in
Speaker 1: areas where there are sea and all shifts in food
Speaker 1: availability or if they really need to have a stable
Speaker 1: supply of food. So there are two main different types
Speaker 1: of hoarding methods. There is the larger method where an
Speaker 1: animal has a single or maybe a couple specific storage
Speaker 1: area that it stores food in and guards just kind
Speaker 1: of like a dragon, you know, it's got it's cave
Speaker 1: and it's got a bunch of coins and various damsels
Speaker 1: all in there. Yeah, I gotta say it. Really my
Speaker 1: favorite are the animals that hoard all their stuff in
Speaker 1: this specific space. And whenever there are news stories that
Speaker 1: come out about like I feel like there's a new
Speaker 1: story that m floats around every once in a while,
Speaker 1: Like there was a bird or a squirrel that stored
Speaker 1: a bunch of nuts in like a satellite dish or
Speaker 1: something like that, and um, the satellite dish was seeing
Speaker 1: interference and they were trying to figure out, like you
Speaker 1: know why isn't it running out of capacity? So they
Speaker 1: open it up and just like thousands and thousands of
Speaker 1: nuts poured out, and I was just like, no, that
Speaker 1: world stash, it's so hard for it. Better put that back.
Speaker 1: We're actually going to talk about something exactly like that
Speaker 1: in just a minute. But yeah, it is. It is
Speaker 1: sad when like you see these news stories, it's like
Speaker 1: they work so hard on that stash. Yeah, and these
Speaker 1: are little animals. It's like that's like that's like a
Speaker 1: lifetime worth of just like hoarded wealth that all of
Speaker 1: a sudden we're just taking from them. It was their
Speaker 1: nest egg, except instead of egg, it's a lot of nuts. Yeah. There,
Speaker 1: that was their retirement plan. So another technique is scatter hoarding.
Speaker 1: So instead of a larder, with scatter hoarding, they will
Speaker 1: hide their food in many different locations. So this is
Speaker 1: something that the eastern gray squirrel does. So they take
Speaker 1: a nut, they go they bury it somewhere and then
Speaker 1: go bury something else somewhere else. And so both of
Speaker 1: these methods can be quite advantageous. The first can be
Speaker 1: a tage just because you only have to defend and
Speaker 1: memorize like one or two larder's where you keep things in.
Speaker 1: But it is a problem because it is more prone
Speaker 1: to theft if a competitor finds your cash and you
Speaker 1: have put all your nuts in one hole, so to speak.
Speaker 1: Whereas with scatter hoarding, it can be advantageous because you
Speaker 1: have diversified your nut investment. But the disadvantage is that
Speaker 1: you have to memorize all these locations. You have to
Speaker 1: travel to all these places, and sometimes you forget and
Speaker 1: then we get like if you bury a nut in
Speaker 1: your squirrel and then you forget where it is that
Speaker 1: grows into a tree. So which is a squirrel's worst enemy?
Speaker 1: I don't know. I don't know if you can describe
Speaker 1: a tree as a squirrel's worst enemy. I mean, I
Speaker 1: guess that they like they bite trees, so it's like
Speaker 1: they feel like I feel like they dig and burrowing trees.
Speaker 1: That's them. That's combat for trees for them, right, I guess.
Speaker 1: But I mean maybe it's like it's an adversary or relationship.
Speaker 1: Maybe I don't think so. I mean, like I don't like,
Speaker 1: I bite a sandwich, but it's not my enemy. Uh,
Speaker 1: the sandwich is Miami. Everything that I eat I am
Speaker 1: in a combat relationship with so question about Okay, so, like,
Speaker 1: which type of hoarder are you? I feel like I'm
Speaker 1: a scatter hoarder because i have a protein bars hidden
Speaker 1: all around Los Angeles and various locations, and I've got
Speaker 1: a tiny app that I used to track them, and
Speaker 1: so far nobody's found them yet. Well, when I was younger,
Speaker 1: I was a larger hoarder. I had like a closet
Speaker 1: my first time living on my own, I had a
Speaker 1: closet where I just put everything in. It was like
Speaker 1: in the cartoons where you opened the closet and everything
Speaker 1: falls out. And I decided enough with that. So then
Speaker 1: I became a scatter hoarder. So now I leave things
Speaker 1: and all sorts of crannies and and like I'll reach
Speaker 1: into desk drawers and there's some candy there, and then
Speaker 1: it's like where did I put my keys? Uh? You know,
Speaker 1: in a little I drilled a hole in the wall
Speaker 1: and I stuck them in there for safekeeping. So yes,
Speaker 1: I think currently I am a scatter hoarder. I mean
Speaker 1: it makes sense because like I feel like, you know,
Speaker 1: as adults were constantly on the move where I mean
Speaker 1: as a kid, Uh, like larger hoardering makes a ton
Speaker 1: of sense because you know you're primarily in one location.
Speaker 1: You're probably hanging around your house a bunch. But as adults,
Speaker 1: it's like we've got offices we're going to, We've got
Speaker 1: like different we've got our own homes with different sections
Speaker 1: of the house, we've got cars. It's like, I totally,
Speaker 1: I totally understand. You know your hoarding methods are going
Speaker 1: to increase and change as you age, Right, Yeah, you're
Speaker 1: also like increasingly paranoid that you're gonna need just like
Speaker 1: a quick bite to keep you from, uh taking another nap.
Speaker 1: So if you hide cheerios around the house, just in
Speaker 1: little crannies, it's like, oh, a cheerio, then I guess
Speaker 1: I won't need to rest my ancient thirty year old
Speaker 1: bones and take a nap. I mean, that's I feel
Speaker 1: like that's a real that's like a real thing. Where Um,
Speaker 1: when I was a kid, I would survive and entirely
Speaker 1: just on sustaining myself on just like drinking a two
Speaker 1: liter of orange soda day and I would feel fine.
Speaker 1: Whereas is an adult, it's like if I go more
Speaker 1: than like four or five hours without having a snack,
Speaker 1: I get like a headache, and it's just like getting
Speaker 1: old sucks. I know, you feel your body sort of
Speaker 1: like crying out when you aren't eating. It's like like
Speaker 1: when you're a kid. It's like, oh, I forgot to eat,
Speaker 1: no worries, I'll just eat this entire sleeve of oreos
Speaker 1: and be fine. Now it's like, oh, I forgot to
Speaker 1: have lunch on time. Okay, I'll eat now because my
Speaker 1: head hurts. Oh now that I'm eating, I also feel bad.
Speaker 1: What is going on? Yeah, it's like eight too much.
Speaker 1: Now I have to take a nap. And then like
Speaker 1: I feel like I like I drink such a little
Speaker 1: amount of caffeine that if I have just like a
Speaker 1: sip of caffeine, I'm just like no, I'm just like
Speaker 1: out of it. Like I'll crash for like two days.
Speaker 1: And it's just one of those things where it's like
Speaker 1: I used to like live off of soda, like I
Speaker 1: used to live off of serge. You know. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: can't like eating too much sugar now in my mouth
Speaker 1: actually burns from the sugar. It's your mouths right, No,
Speaker 1: it hurts the roof of my mouth. So it's great, um,
Speaker 1: but yes, So those are those the main two types
Speaker 1: larger larger cashing and scatter cashing. There's a third type
Speaker 1: of less common hoarding UM where the animal will actually
Speaker 1: take an inedible food and we'll store it somewhere and
Speaker 1: let it ripen, which is really fascinating. So we're actually
Speaker 1: going to talk about all three types of cashing, all
Speaker 1: three types of hoarding with three different animals. UM. So
Speaker 1: first we're going to talk about a recent story of
Speaker 1: a bunch of acorns hidden in the walls of a house.
Speaker 1: Oh no, I'm so I'm so mad at this that
Speaker 1: the cash was found. It was this was this your cash?
Speaker 1: This might have been my cash, my nuts. Well, apparently
Speaker 1: in Santa Rosa, California, someone was going about their business
Speaker 1: in their home and they noticed meal worms coming out
Speaker 1: of the walls, and so they called the next terminator
Speaker 1: because when you got worms in your walls, it might
Speaker 1: be time to do something. Yeah, I mean, I feel like,
Speaker 1: I look, it could be a bad sign if you're
Speaker 1: a family of if you're a family of birds, worms
Speaker 1: coming out of your walls might be a good sign.
Speaker 1: So I'm just saying, you know, like perspective, that's like
Speaker 1: if chocolate starts leaking from your ceiling. I guess if
Speaker 1: you're a bird, worms, worms is chocolate to birds. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and I feel like on some level of chocolate started
Speaker 1: leaking from your ceiling, part of you would be like, oh,
Speaker 1: this feels like a problem. They needs to be solved.
Speaker 1: But another part of you would be like, oh, wow,
Speaker 1: melted chocolate. Don't mind if I do. It's a problem
Speaker 1: that can be solved with this boon in my opinion,
Speaker 1: So in this house, they called the exterminator. So the
Speaker 1: exterminator started like cut a hole in the wall and
Speaker 1: a bunch of acorns started to fall out, And so
Speaker 1: he started to pull out the acorns and more and
Speaker 1: more and more acorns came out of the hole in
Speaker 1: the wall and they just kept coming. Yeah. Looking at
Speaker 1: the article, uh if it sounds like there are seven
Speaker 1: pounds of acorns in total they poured out of this wall.
Speaker 1: Which it's it's such an impressive amount. I think it
Speaker 1: was made by um. I believe two small woodpeckers over
Speaker 1: the span of like maybe two or three years or
Speaker 1: something like that, they made this huge stash of acorns.
Speaker 1: And uh, I really hope that the woodpeckers were watching
Speaker 1: through the window as this stash was discovered, and I
Speaker 1: hope that in woodpecker they were screaming my stash. No,
Speaker 1: They're like looking at the exterminator and be like, uh,
Speaker 1: it's not mine. I'm holding it for a friend. All
Speaker 1: those acorns, all right, I just picture they're like sitting
Speaker 1: on the their sitting on the on the pile of
Speaker 1: acorns in this in this old chimney, and they're just
Speaker 1: saying like, we did it, We've prepared for winter, We're
Speaker 1: gonna be good for ye. And then all of a sudden,
Speaker 1: the acorns are spilling and they're like, no, no, no, no, no,
Speaker 1: no no. My nest for little woodpeckers. So let's talk
Speaker 1: a little bit about a corn woodpeckers and why they
Speaker 1: would do such a thing. So a corn and woodpeckers
Speaker 1: are medium sized birds. Obviously they are a type of woodpecker.
Speaker 1: They've got a bright red spot on their head. They're
Speaker 1: quite pretty. They will drill holes in trees and store
Speaker 1: acorns in them. Basically they turn trees into Swiss cheese.
Speaker 1: H They fill the tree with a bunch of little
Speaker 1: holes and basically stuff like one acorn per hole. And
Speaker 1: so this is called a granary. It's typically in trees,
Speaker 1: although some times they will use man made wood structures
Speaker 1: when it's convenient, like telephone poles. UM. As the acorn
Speaker 1: sit in these holes, the acorns will actually start to
Speaker 1: shrink as they dry out, so the woodpecker has to
Speaker 1: fastidiously keep track of this. They will take the acorn
Speaker 1: out and stick it into a smaller hole so it
Speaker 1: doesn't fall out. UM. And to protect their acorns, they
Speaker 1: will often form social groups of families, basically a bunch
Speaker 1: of related sisters and then a bunch of related brothers.
Speaker 1: But the brothers are not related to the sisters, and
Speaker 1: so they can all mate together, and so they will
Speaker 1: all protect their uh protect their acorns from potential bandits. Uh.
Speaker 1: If the breeding collective is kind of disrupted um, other
Speaker 1: species of birds like scrub jays will come in try
Speaker 1: to steal the nuts. Uh. Sometimes another acorn woodpecker will
Speaker 1: come in and try to join the collective, insinuate themselves
Speaker 1: into this breeding collective. And sometimes some acorn woodpeckers just
Speaker 1: come by to spectate to watch the the show. Scrub
Speaker 1: jays are always up to no good pretty much. I
Speaker 1: gotta say a few things on that. I love that
Speaker 1: for these woodpeckers, this tree that they're stuffing with acorns
Speaker 1: basically becomes the family store where it's just like you
Speaker 1: got a mind of the store boy, Like it's a
Speaker 1: that they that they're like on watch constantly on this
Speaker 1: tree filled with acorns. And another thing about it is, um,
Speaker 1: do you know what trip pophobia is? Yes? I do, Uh,
Speaker 1: the fear of holes. Yeah, I gotta say, somebody that
Speaker 1: has tripp pophobia. This photo of this tree filled with
Speaker 1: acorns is terrifying. I'm very sorry. I'm very sorry. Yes,
Speaker 1: it is. It is. I can see how that would
Speaker 1: be unpleasant even for me. I do not have that phobia,
Speaker 1: but I feel a little bit of discomfort look at it. Yeah,
Speaker 1: because it basically it basically looks like somebody just machine
Speaker 1: gun to this tree full of acorns. It's just covered
Speaker 1: in holes, and it's like, oh, it's probably not great
Speaker 1: for the tree. You just see Nick Offerman running by
Speaker 1: you and saying like, squirrels got guns now? It's like,
Speaker 1: what squirrels got guns? Now? It is also like really
Speaker 1: twisted that these woodpeckers take these acorns and then essentially
Speaker 1: drill them into the tree. That the acorn came from.
Speaker 1: It is a little bit evil dead, isn't it. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's like, what's your problem? These birds are? These birds
Speaker 1: are left off. They're twisted and sick. The news story
Speaker 1: about this woodpecker is unusual because acorn woodpeckers typically stick
Speaker 1: the acorns in these individual holes that are horrifying to
Speaker 1: joey Um, not inside large hollow areas. But according to
Speaker 1: the exterminator who investigated the home um, he saw the
Speaker 1: birds dropping acorns into a hole in the chimney, and
Speaker 1: then they birds would come in a separate hole in
Speaker 1: the attic to feed on the acorns. So they will
Speaker 1: actually take advantage of uh naturally forming hollows and trees
Speaker 1: on occasion. Generally they do stick to this like acorn
Speaker 1: in whole structure because if the acorn stashed this pile
Speaker 1: get some wrought on it, it can sacrifice the whole thing.
Speaker 1: As what happened to these birds. It's humans came in
Speaker 1: and messed up the entire horde. So um. But they
Speaker 1: will sometimes try to use these naturally occurring basically cabinets
Speaker 1: uh and you mentioned earlier, like them using like um
Speaker 1: satellite dishes. They will do that in also in California,
Speaker 1: acorn woodpeckers filled a concave transmission tower with three hundred
Speaker 1: pounds of acorns, which stopped the signal from this transmission
Speaker 1: tower and they had to send someone up there to
Speaker 1: remove the acorns. Um, yeah, I gotta say, Okay, so
Speaker 1: I'm sticking by my thought. These uh, these woodpeckers are
Speaker 1: real sicks. But but aside from that, I gotta say
Speaker 1: I really appreciate that they basically with this this house
Speaker 1: where they filled this chimney with acorns, they essentially threw
Speaker 1: off the They threw off the chains of the patriarchy
Speaker 1: and built their own bird feeder. Like they're like, we
Speaker 1: don't need humans to do this, we can do it ourselves.
Speaker 1: It's the bird singularity. They've learned to build their own
Speaker 1: bird feeders and now they're unstoppable. Yeah, now they don't
Speaker 1: need us. So in that case, I guess it's probably
Speaker 1: like by by emptying there there's seven hundred pound acorn cachet,
Speaker 1: we're just we're slowing them down. We've we bought humanity
Speaker 1: another couple of months, another generously, another couple of months
Speaker 1: before the up rising. Yeah, so Joey, what do you
Speaker 1: get when you cross a kangaroo and a rap Um.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna say my ex wife her just kidding, I
Speaker 1: don't have an ex wife. I just felt like that
Speaker 1: feels like the setup of like a nineteen forties Catskills comedies. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's like, you know, she's she's like a kangaroo because
Speaker 1: she kicks me, but she's like a rat because she
Speaker 1: loves cheese. Because she keeps biting the walls of our house.
Speaker 1: That's why we got into force. She ate my house.
Speaker 1: That feels like a probably women, they're always eating our house, right, fellas. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and then one guy in the house is like, yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: but no, the answer is kangaroo rats. Yeah right, yeah, answer, yeah,
Speaker 1: kangaroo rats. Kangaroo rats. So, kangaroo rats are native to
Speaker 1: western North America in hot, semi arid sort of desert regions,
Speaker 1: such as are found in California, Arizona, and in northern Mexico. Um.
Speaker 1: They are cute. They look like little mice that have
Speaker 1: kangaroo legs. They have these powerful rear legs that allow
Speaker 1: them to leap and run. They kind of hop around. Um,
Speaker 1: and yeah, they look like little tiny mouse sized kangaroos.
Speaker 1: They're very very cute. Yeah, yeah, I gotta say that.
Speaker 1: You have to if you, um, if you're listening to
Speaker 1: this and you have your phone or you're on a
Speaker 1: computer something like that, definitely google kangaroo grat It's a
Speaker 1: very adorable little critter. Um. It's for its very cute.
Speaker 1: It looks very pettable. UM as a big fan of
Speaker 1: animals that are cute and cuddly. I'm gonna give this
Speaker 1: thing five cute muzzles. I like that rating. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: there's there's a picture of it in the footnotes. Also
Speaker 1: in the footnotes is a picture of one of these
Speaker 1: kangaroo rats delivering a high flying kick to the face
Speaker 1: of a rattlesnake, because that is what they will do.
Speaker 1: They are way Wait, do they hunt rattlesnakes. No, they
Speaker 1: are victims of rattlesnakes. Rattlesnakes hunt them, but they are
Speaker 1: not a passive victim. They will kick the rattlesnake in
Speaker 1: the face to evade them. Um do they How often
Speaker 1: do they win these fights? You know, I don't know,
Speaker 1: like a percentage, but it's pretty effective. If they are
Speaker 1: able to detect that the rattlesnake is there before the
Speaker 1: rattlesnake strikes them. And they do successfully kick the rattlesnake,
Speaker 1: they have a very good chance of running away. So
Speaker 1: if they notice the rattlesnake in time, I'd say their
Speaker 1: chances are pretty good because they could definitely outrun a rattlesnake. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and if you look at this photo like it really
Speaker 1: feels like this kangaro rat has gotta direct hit on
Speaker 1: this rattlesnake's face, it's very funny. So another cute thing
Speaker 1: is that because they live in hot desert climates, they
Speaker 1: have to preserve their body moisture and regulate their temperature,
Speaker 1: so they will stay in their burrows during the hot day.
Speaker 1: They will plug up the holes with some dirt to
Speaker 1: keep cool um, and while they are sleeping during the day,
Speaker 1: they curl up into a little ball with their nose
Speaker 1: in their belly hair, which creates a pocket of moisture
Speaker 1: from the condensation around their nose. So very very adorable. Okay,
Speaker 1: I I'm going to google a picture of that kangaroo
Speaker 1: rat curled up in a ball and you're going to
Speaker 1: be able to hear me live react to this. Okay,
Speaker 1: let's kangaroot called new Ball, Live Live Joey a reaction.
Speaker 1: Yes they are. They're extremely cute. So the reason I
Speaker 1: bring up kangaroo rats is that they are scatter cashers
Speaker 1: or scatter hoarders, and they also store things in their
Speaker 1: cheeks in a really weird way. So they have cheek pouches,
Speaker 1: but it's not kind of like how you would think,
Speaker 1: like where a hamster. It's cheek pouches and they will
Speaker 1: stuff something in their mouth and it'll make their cheeks
Speaker 1: pooch out and it's very cute. The kangaroo rat has
Speaker 1: external cheek pouches that are not inside their mouths, but
Speaker 1: are like two pockets on either side of their face.
Speaker 1: So they have these two pockets on their cheeks that
Speaker 1: are lined with fur like internally, and it doesn't go
Speaker 1: it's like outside of their mouth. They don't put things
Speaker 1: into their mouth. They put them directly into these like
Speaker 1: little pockets like you have pockets on your pants. They
Speaker 1: just have pockets on the sides of their faces that
Speaker 1: they can stuff seeds into. Yeah, I gotta say the
Speaker 1: photo that you have that kangaroot cheek pockets um scrolling
Speaker 1: past it, I was immediately horrified because I thought this
Speaker 1: kangaroo had several mouths. Yeah, it's a little spooky. It's
Speaker 1: also like the photo, I feel so bad for this
Speaker 1: kangaroo rat because like this is probably it's like secret
Speaker 1: little seed stash, Whereas this human just like shoved the
Speaker 1: rat down and it's like pulling its cheek pocket open,
Speaker 1: and it's like, look at this. This is probably the
Speaker 1: most embarrassing moment of that kangaroo rats life. Where's his
Speaker 1: constitutional rights against unfair search and seizure? Yeah, I mean
Speaker 1: that that's that said, that kangaroo oute was probably also
Speaker 1: trafficking kangaroo rat cocaine. Sure, why not? It's not his
Speaker 1: is his friends? So oh yeah, right, he doesn't. I
Speaker 1: don't know how it got there. It will deposit these
Speaker 1: seeds from its weird little face pockets into cases that
Speaker 1: are distributed all throughout its territory. So it will run
Speaker 1: to a place, dig a little hole, buried seeds, run
Speaker 1: to another place, dig a little hole, bury its seeds,
Speaker 1: and so in this way, it is not unlike the
Speaker 1: eastern gray squirrel. Research into the behavior of kangaroo rats
Speaker 1: have found that they don't need landmarks to remember where
Speaker 1: they have buried their seeds in the short term, but
Speaker 1: after ten days they use landmarks to be able to
Speaker 1: triangulate where they stored their seeds. So they kind of
Speaker 1: memorized landmarks nearby where they stored things and used that
Speaker 1: to find caches that they had buried a long time ago.
Speaker 1: Then ten days later they're just like, wait, where was that. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's like yeah, just like, oh, it was by the McDonald's. Yeah,
Speaker 1: instead of dude wears my car, Dude, where's my seeds?
Speaker 1: Where's my seeds that I stored in my mouth pouches?
Speaker 1: That is really interesting that they that like basically they
Speaker 1: carry seeds as it's not like a permanent storage thing.
Speaker 1: They're not constantly carrying like a reloaded seeds for seats,
Speaker 1: for snacks in their cheeks. It's more like that's just
Speaker 1: how they more easily carry seeds from location location to
Speaker 1: put them stat in these cases. Pockets. Yeah, face backpack,
Speaker 1: that'd be fine. What a very specific mutant superpower face backpacks.
Speaker 1: I mean, I like it. I've always wanted more pockets.
Speaker 1: Maybe not on my face, maybe not on my face,
Speaker 1: but look, these kangaroo rats make a work for them. Yeah,
Speaker 1: So now I want to talk about my favorite type
Speaker 1: of hoarding called ripening hoarding or ripening cachhing. This is
Speaker 1: where an animal will do something that is in a
Speaker 1: way very weirdly humans. So so weirdly human at doom,
Speaker 1: scrolls on Twitter and listens to radiohead. Yes, um, it's
Speaker 1: a it's a fascinating things stuff like in this economy,
Speaker 1: stocks and bonds, cell phones and shoes. Yeah, all human stuff.
Speaker 1: Uh so. The tyra is a very strange animal found
Speaker 1: in Central and South America in subtropical forests. It's in
Speaker 1: the Musteladae family, related to weasels and badgers, and they
Speaker 1: kind of look like a giant weasel. So they weigh
Speaker 1: they're they're about the size of like a medium sized dog,
Speaker 1: small to medium sized dog. They're like about fifteen pounds
Speaker 1: or seven KOs. They have dark brown body, brown head,
Speaker 1: and a lighter patch on their chest um. This throat
Speaker 1: patch is actually unique and can be used to identify
Speaker 1: individual tyras um, which is similar to another animal, the
Speaker 1: giant river otter, who has a neat throat patch that
Speaker 1: can be used by other giant river otters to recognize
Speaker 1: their friends. For the tyra's I'm not sure if the
Speaker 1: con specifics. That is, the members of their own species
Speaker 1: use the throat patches to identify each other, but humans
Speaker 1: can use them. So like, hey, that one is break
Speaker 1: I remember his throat patch. Yeah, it's a it's a
Speaker 1: cute accessory. I mean, I gotta feel like, I don't
Speaker 1: know us humans, we should we should all start getting
Speaker 1: throat patches. It's just a nice It's a nice way
Speaker 1: to like break up the fur um. You know. I
Speaker 1: think you could probably get designer throat patches, something from Gucci.
Speaker 1: I think that Tyra is just you know, the picture
Speaker 1: I'm looking at is really working it. Uh, so you
Speaker 1: go Tyra. They're very cute. They have these long fluffy
Speaker 1: tails as well, which I think brings them from Oh
Speaker 1: this is a sort of like newly animal that wants
Speaker 1: to bite me too. It's cute. Yeah, it's like it
Speaker 1: still wants to bite me, but I'm gonna try to
Speaker 1: pet it while it does. It's gonna bite me, but
Speaker 1: in this case, it's probably gonna be my fault because
Speaker 1: I tried to pet it. Oh for sure. So they
Speaker 1: are omnivores and they will hunt small mammals and reptiles,
Speaker 1: but they will also climb trees for fruit, and in fact,
Speaker 1: they will go to great lengths to get tasty fruit.
Speaker 1: One resourceful trick they have is picking unripe plantains, And
Speaker 1: an unripe plantain is not a nice thing to eat,
Speaker 1: so the tyra hides it somewhere, lets it ripen, and
Speaker 1: then finds and eats it later. Um. That's so interesting
Speaker 1: and it really makes me wonder like at what point
Speaker 1: did they evolved to learn how to do that? And
Speaker 1: I feel like I've heard other stories of animals, um,
Speaker 1: you know, hiding fruit or hiding food until it ferments,
Speaker 1: and I think that there's actually a few stories of
Speaker 1: like um animals hiding you know, grapes or something like
Speaker 1: that somewhere and then waiting for them to ferment, and
Speaker 1: then them and then getting drunk off of them because
Speaker 1: it basically it just turns into wine. Yeah. I mean,
Speaker 1: there are there are multiple cases of animals doing this
Speaker 1: sort of like ripening cashing behavior. Um pikas do it. Um.
Speaker 1: They will take plants that are somewhat toxic and then
Speaker 1: high kind of put them in their dens and then
Speaker 1: they over time lose that toxicity. Leaf cutter ants will
Speaker 1: take sections of leaves and then they will sort of
Speaker 1: farm this fungus that grows on the leaves and then
Speaker 1: eat that later. So yeah, this is a technique used
Speaker 1: by all sorts of animals and it's really fascinating. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I feel like I want to say that I do
Speaker 1: that when I buy bananas from the store and then
Speaker 1: just don't eat them for a couple of weeks, and
Speaker 1: then when I find them they're like black, and then
Speaker 1: I'm like, hey, I could probably stilete one of these
Speaker 1: before throwing it away. That's definitely uh, me doing this
Speaker 1: behavior and not me being lazy and careless. My trick
Speaker 1: with bananas is I don't eat them because they are
Speaker 1: the devil's fruit. Wait there the devil's fruit. Why are
Speaker 1: there the devil's fruit? Because they're stinky and bad and
Speaker 1: I hate them. Oh, anything anything I don't like personally
Speaker 1: is immoral. So um so I guess that, like you
Speaker 1: were saying that, when you're eating a sandwich, you're not
Speaker 1: having combat with the sandwich, but if you're eating a banana,
Speaker 1: you're in combat with the banana exactly exactly. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm you're not eating it for necessenance, you're eating it
Speaker 1: to destroy it despite the banana exactly. So with these tiras,
Speaker 1: they will hide their bananas in these very creative spots,
Speaker 1: like sometimes in like the bowl of a bromeliad. So
Speaker 1: a bromeliad is this plant. It's like this sort of
Speaker 1: spiky plant that attaches itself to trees and it will
Speaker 1: form kind of like a bowl or like a shelf
Speaker 1: against the tree. And so these tires just like put
Speaker 1: the banana and the bromelia to hide it like they're
Speaker 1: hiding an Easter egg, and they'll come back a few
Speaker 1: days later to come get it when it's nice and
Speaker 1: ripe um. That's awesome And I'm just so crafty they are. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And there's like some discussion about like, well, does this
Speaker 1: mean that tiras are able to plan for the future.
Speaker 1: Can they conceive of the future because they are waiting
Speaker 1: for bananas to ripen um And I don't know if
Speaker 1: the fact that they ripen bananas is evidence that they
Speaker 1: have a concept of the future, but they at least
Speaker 1: understand that the food can't be eaten like right then,
Speaker 1: so they have to like put it somewhere, wait a while,
Speaker 1: and go get it, which I think is it's pretty intelligent. Yeah,
Speaker 1: when you have to think about like going back to
Speaker 1: the the acornwoodpecker, like presumably when they're up storing a
Speaker 1: munch of acorns in a chimney or something like that,
Speaker 1: there is this attitude that like there's you know, they're
Speaker 1: saving up for winter. They're like saving up for like
Speaker 1: more more lean times. So like I feel like in
Speaker 1: these animals that we're talking about, there's definitely at least
Speaker 1: some idea of planning that's going into the decisions that
Speaker 1: they're making. I mean, one can look at it two ways.
Speaker 1: I mean it could be planning or it could just
Speaker 1: be this instinct right like this, like with squirrels, like
Speaker 1: this instinct like I got a nut, I gotta bury it,
Speaker 1: and you know I would I would say that with
Speaker 1: things like squirrels and woodpeckers. Not not to say they're
Speaker 1: not intelligent. I'm just not sure that they. I think
Speaker 1: a lot of it has got to be instinctive, Like
Speaker 1: they just have this desire to get as much stuff
Speaker 1: as they can and shove it into things. Because it's
Speaker 1: such it's such repeated behavior. So it's so it's like
Speaker 1: my instinct to hide chocolate at my desk got it
Speaker 1: wake up in the morning, and I don't know why
Speaker 1: I'm doing it. I'm just doing it. Yeah, I mean, like,
Speaker 1: I think that even in humans, we still kind of
Speaker 1: have like you may have that like feeling of security
Speaker 1: if you accumulate a lot of food, like if if
Speaker 1: you've stored a lot of food, like when you're packing
Speaker 1: a backpack full of food or putting food in your pantry.
Speaker 1: I think there is a satisfaction in that. And I
Speaker 1: think with animals they are sort of some of these
Speaker 1: animals there and instinctively driven to do these things. When
Speaker 1: you're like preparing food, like you have food that you
Speaker 1: can't eat at the moment, but you put it in
Speaker 1: a position that you will be able to eat later.
Speaker 1: It could be instinctively driven, it could be learned behavior.
Speaker 1: It could like something like the tyra may not have
Speaker 1: a concept of the future, but may just through trial
Speaker 1: and air, know this to be a thing, or learn
Speaker 1: it from other tiras. You know. It's so it's it's
Speaker 1: it's unclear how much this reveals about how this animal
Speaker 1: can sort of think about the future, but it it's
Speaker 1: so like an example that I've read about that seems
Speaker 1: to indicate something where like, uh, there's like a story
Speaker 1: of captive chimpanzee like hoarding rocks, keeping rocks of very
Speaker 1: specific shape and then using those rocks to like toss
Speaker 1: at zookeepers or something. To me, I don't think that's
Speaker 1: like an instinct. I think that this Uh. I think
Speaker 1: that that chimpanzee is a jerk. It's premeditated, yeah, which
Speaker 1: I love, love love chimpanzee crimes. Um. But yeah, I
Speaker 1: think it's it's it's starts. It gets confusing because I
Speaker 1: think it's like, well, what is instinct? What is just
Speaker 1: this little squirrel going like I gotta not I want
Speaker 1: to bury it? And what is some like at what
Speaker 1: point do they does it become something where it's like, huh,
Speaker 1: have this thing? This is a surprise tool for later,
Speaker 1: Like you know, it's hard, it's hard to know what
Speaker 1: point at which that happens in animals. But I do
Speaker 1: think generally, like a chimpanzee, I am much more willing
Speaker 1: to believe I can think about the future and make
Speaker 1: a plan, whereas like an Eastern gray squirrel, I don't
Speaker 1: think it has a concept of the future. I think
Speaker 1: it is more driven just by these like instinctive urges. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I guess that that's That's something that's so interesting me
Speaker 1: about like, um, you know, animal intelligence, and you know,
Speaker 1: I'm a big cat guy. I think about cats all
Speaker 1: the time. I remember a cat that I had growing up,
Speaker 1: like my childhood cat, um. Whenever we would give it
Speaker 1: a bath, immediately after we gave it a bath, it
Speaker 1: would like snug. It would like, you know, while it's
Speaker 1: still wet, as we're dragging off with the towel, it
Speaker 1: would like snuggle up to us and want to sit
Speaker 1: on our laps. And at first we thought it was
Speaker 1: cute because it was so like violently opposed to get
Speaker 1: a path. And then it would poop on us, and
Speaker 1: then we were like, oh, this cat, that was for
Speaker 1: sure that cat doing that out of spike because it
Speaker 1: did not want a bath. And then it was like,
Speaker 1: it's like making eye contact with us while it's pooping
Speaker 1: in our laps. Well, I do think animals can be spiteful,
Speaker 1: especially cats, So I don't know, maybe that was out
Speaker 1: of spite. Could be. Yeah, Well, before we go, we
Speaker 1: have to play a little game, and that game is
Speaker 1: called Guess Who's Squawking? The Mystery Animal Sound game Every
Speaker 1: week I play a mystery animal sound in you the listener,
Speaker 1: and you the gifts try to guess who squawking, and
Speaker 1: that can be any animal in the world, not just birds,
Speaker 1: not just bees, any animal. Last week's Mystery Animals sound
Speaker 1: hint was this. This is one unhappy noodle. Do you
Speaker 1: hear that? Yeah, so I'm going to guess that that
Speaker 1: is a parakeet. Interesting gifts, Uh incorrect. However, so this
Speaker 1: was actually a mink rescued by Ontario Wildlife Rescue. This
Speaker 1: mink was apparently trapped in an air conditioner. Um. Yeah, no,
Speaker 1: they got him out. The noise of him. He's not
Speaker 1: in the air conditioner. He's like in a little transport cage. Okay, good,
Speaker 1: I think you were like this yeah this uh, this
Speaker 1: mink is in the process of being tortured with no. No,
Speaker 1: he's just he's just annoyed because probably a little scared
Speaker 1: because he's in a transport cage. But you know, they
Speaker 1: got him and then they they they released him. Um,
Speaker 1: but you know, so he's not These are not happy noises,
Speaker 1: but he's all right. Um this uh, this tiger is
Speaker 1: in the process of being no oh no. Um. So
Speaker 1: minks like to live by the water, and they will
Speaker 1: often fish things like fish for fish or crustaceans um,
Speaker 1: or they will hunt for things UH pick on somebody
Speaker 1: their own size, like rabbits UM. Unfortunately, minks are also
Speaker 1: prized for their fur, and mink farms UH will often
Speaker 1: like selectively breathe them for like white coats, and then
Speaker 1: they will kill them and harvest them for their fur
Speaker 1: um other than you know. Obviously, the problems with this
Speaker 1: is that minks are not well suited to a mostly
Speaker 1: sedentary cage lifestyle, and they will often show signs of
Speaker 1: mental deterioration and compulsive behavior in mink farms. UH. And then,
Speaker 1: aside from this being bad for minks very obviously, it's
Speaker 1: bad for people to Mink farms are not great in
Speaker 1: terms of safety when it comes to viruses because these
Speaker 1: minks are housed closely together in these battery cages and
Speaker 1: there's a lot of nose to nose contact and ability
Speaker 1: for viruses to spread quickly. So we actually saw sort
Speaker 1: of in the midst of the pandemic like um covid
Speaker 1: spread UH in these mink farms, and more recently we've
Speaker 1: seen H five in one the Avian influenza sort of
Speaker 1: go through a mink farm, which it typically does not
Speaker 1: transmit well within mammals. So the fact that it was
Speaker 1: transmitting from mink to mink in these mink farms is
Speaker 1: not It's not great. It's like not a good thing.
Speaker 1: So five and there's an H five five and one. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they keep coming out with sequels. Yeah, it's like it is.
Speaker 1: I feel like, um, you know, especially in times of COVID,
Speaker 1: it's like it was very big news whenever there was
Speaker 1: a new COVID strain, and now it's like I feel
Speaker 1: like things are covered like just slightly less, to the
Speaker 1: point that like you don't watch the news for three
Speaker 1: days and then you're just like there's a new virus.
Speaker 1: I should like monkey talks, what's that? You know? Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean you can drive yourself kind of nuts, like
Speaker 1: trying and keep up with all the stralians of viruses
Speaker 1: that come out because there's a lot. So I I
Speaker 1: don't want to scare people. I still think that, like
Speaker 1: especially with H five in one. Yeah, it's like epidemiologist, virologists,
Speaker 1: they're concerned about it. But these kinds of scares happened
Speaker 1: pretty frequently. It's just people aren't usually tuned into them. Um,
Speaker 1: like we don't really they don't really make it to
Speaker 1: the news as much, or even if they do, they're
Speaker 1: not as big of a deal. I think everyone's really
Speaker 1: plugged into it now because of COVID, because we've been
Speaker 1: through a pandemic. Uh So I think it's I think
Speaker 1: it's good, like more awareness is good to a certain extent,
Speaker 1: but I I think that like there it can go
Speaker 1: too far where people are just like it's scared that
Speaker 1: every new mutation of every virus is going to be
Speaker 1: like an apocalyptic event, which is very unlikely. But yeah,
Speaker 1: so it's it's like, yeah, you know, this is this
Speaker 1: is concerning. But you know, I do think that things
Speaker 1: like mink farms are not necessary, uh at least not
Speaker 1: necessary to have them be such sort of cruel bio hazards.
Speaker 1: I would say, oh yeah, I mean it's one of
Speaker 1: those things where it's like there's a there's a lot
Speaker 1: of reasons why mink farms are maybe not the best
Speaker 1: thing in the world, and this is definitely one of
Speaker 1: several reasons. Yeah. Also, like you know, just chill out.
Speaker 1: All the minks guys. They they just want to be
Speaker 1: They just want to scamp around, be furry little noodles
Speaker 1: and eat fish. Yeah you look, you don't. You don't
Speaker 1: have to wear mink coat. Just throw on a Garfield
Speaker 1: T shirt. It's just as nice and made of cotton.
Speaker 1: It's great. Yeah, man, I I Garfield sweaters over meat
Speaker 1: coats all the way. Honestly, to meet Garfield is much
Speaker 1: higher fashion. Oh yeah, for sure. If I see somebody
Speaker 1: on a runway with a mink coat, I'm just gonna
Speaker 1: be like, what is this nineteen? Whereas if I see
Speaker 1: somebody with a Garfield coat, I'm gonna be like, are
Speaker 1: you my new king or queen? You know how? Like
Speaker 1: animal rights activists like tossed red paint over like for
Speaker 1: we should toss orange paint and be like you've been
Speaker 1: garfed orange orange paint and then just like us, and
Speaker 1: then somebody runs in with like some black paint. Just
Speaker 1: paints on some black stripes really quick, two big google eyes. Yeah,
Speaker 1: garfing in the name of animal and human welfare. I
Speaker 1: like it, Garfield activist. I mean now the okay, so
Speaker 1: now might I might go the other direction? The urge
Speaker 1: to get uh a giant fur coat and to die
Speaker 1: the fur orange with pleque tots. So it looks like
Speaker 1: I skinned Garfield is you know, definitely I'm not going
Speaker 1: to do it, but the urge do it's greater than zero.
Speaker 1: I got good news for you. You can buy fake
Speaker 1: for an orange already probably and then wear that like
Speaker 1: a skin Garfield. You could probably even get like a
Speaker 1: big Garfield stuffed animal and skin that one, and then
Speaker 1: that will really sell the experience of you skinning a Garfield. Okay, yeah,
Speaker 1: this sounds like this sounds like a good fashion They're
Speaker 1: actually on Google there there's already a ton of Garfield
Speaker 1: fur coats, good healthy fun. I like how we've we've
Speaker 1: ended this podcast where I try very hard to spread
Speaker 1: empathy for animals with like this is how you can
Speaker 1: simulate skinning Garfield and wearing them, whereas I'm just like
Speaker 1: I gotta skin me a Garfield and then who will
Speaker 1: Hey Mondays, I think you would hate Mondays even more
Speaker 1: if you skinned them on a Monday. Yeah, that's my
Speaker 1: that's my special instructions to the mink farm because like
Speaker 1: is like, make sure that you before you die these
Speaker 1: mink fors Garfield killers, make sure you do it on
Speaker 1: a Monday. Wow. Yeah, Like yeah, we could be saying like, hey,
Speaker 1: maybe cool it with the spreading viruses and being mean
Speaker 1: to minks, or we could be like, actually, the problem
Speaker 1: is you don't dire for orange and make it look
Speaker 1: like Garfields. Honestly, Now I'm just going and I'm just
Speaker 1: going down the rabbit hole, like seeing what Garfield fur
Speaker 1: coat turns up. And there's a lot of like really
Speaker 1: amazing like Marina wool and faux for trimming jacket that's
Speaker 1: like very much Garfield kilors, but not on purpose, so
Speaker 1: it feels like it's high fashion. Well, I figured out
Speaker 1: my new the new me before you drop a bunch
Speaker 1: of disposable income on Garfield out or where we have
Speaker 1: to play this week's mystery animal sound. So the hint
Speaker 1: is it is something that no Lemur wants to hear. So, Joey,
Speaker 1: who do you think that is? I mean that sounded terrified,
Speaker 1: like no Lemur wants to hear this, and none of
Speaker 1: us do either. Yeah, I also did not want to
Speaker 1: hear that. Um, so I'm gonna say, look, as a
Speaker 1: grand expert, I think this might be a grant. You
Speaker 1: are absolutely correct, which means all the listener will hear
Speaker 1: is a mysterious quacking noise and uh so they will
Speaker 1: have to guess who is making that sound. But yes, congratulations,
Speaker 1: you're absolutely right if you think you know who is
Speaker 1: making that sound, and you write to me at Creature
Speaker 1: Feature Pod at email dot com. If you guess correctly,
Speaker 1: I might read your name on the podcast. Uh well, Joey,
Speaker 1: thank you so much for joining me today. Where can
Speaker 1: people find you? Um? Yeah, thanks so much for remy
Speaker 1: it's always a blasting on Creature Future and congrats on
Speaker 1: secretly incredibly fascinating. Yes, so you can find me on
Speaker 1: Twitter at Joey kagemant Um as well as TikTok at
Speaker 1: Joey Cayman, and then you can find me on Instagram
Speaker 1: at Joey Clift with like five or six eyes. And then, um,
Speaker 1: if you want to check out stuff I'm working on
Speaker 1: right now. Um. I was a writer consulting producer on
Speaker 1: the show Sphere Rangers, which just came out on Netflix,
Speaker 1: super super cool kids show. I think it really dig.
Speaker 1: And then my Comedy Central digital series Gone Native just
Speaker 1: came out on all of Comedy Central social channels. It's
Speaker 1: a bunch of fun animated shorts about just like microaggressions
Speaker 1: that native folks have to deal with. So check all
Speaker 1: that stuff out and uh and follow and listen to
Speaker 1: work Creature Feature. It's a great podcast. Thank you like
Speaker 1: plug yourself, not me, but I appreciate it. Yeah, yeah, yes.
Speaker 1: The main plug is to keep listening to this show
Speaker 1: you're listening to. Oh gosh, thank you. I don't think
Speaker 1: I don't think I've ever gotten reverse plugged before, but
Speaker 1: that's appreciate that. It's very thoughtful. Well, thank you guys.
Speaker 1: And and hey, I'm gonna plug Joey check out Joey
Speaker 1: stuff for goodness sakes. Thank you and thank you guys
Speaker 1: so much for listening. If you're enjoying the show and
Speaker 1: you want to leave radio review, I deeply appreciate it.
Speaker 1: I read all of them and I appreciate each and
Speaker 1: every single one. And thank you to these Space Classics
Speaker 1: for their super awesome song Exo Lumina. Creature Feature is
Speaker 1: a production of I Heart Radio. For more podcasts like
Speaker 1: the one you just heard, visit the I Heart Radio
Speaker 1: app Apple podcast or Hey guess what where have you
Speaker 1: listening to your favorite shows? I don't judge you. See
Speaker 1: you next Wednesday.