1
00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:02,160
Speaker 1: Welcome to another edition of Big Blue Kick Off live

2
00:00:02,279 --> 00:00:04,640
Speaker 1: right here on Giants dot Com. John SCHMLK pauled the

3
00:00:04,680 --> 00:00:06,640
Speaker 1: Tina with you the phone number two oh one nine

4
00:00:06,680 --> 00:00:09,719
Speaker 1: three nine four five on three. It is less than

5
00:00:09,760 --> 00:00:13,800
Speaker 1: a week until the NFL Draft. I am excited. I

6
00:00:13,840 --> 00:00:16,079
Speaker 1: know Paul is too. Let's go and a lot to

7
00:00:16,120 --> 00:00:18,400
Speaker 1: talk about on this Friday edition. We are two great

8
00:00:18,400 --> 00:00:22,080
Speaker 1: guests coming up. Sam Monson from Pro Football Focus will

9
00:00:22,160 --> 00:00:24,320
Speaker 1: join us in about ten minutes of twelve ten and

10
00:00:24,400 --> 00:00:26,800
Speaker 1: at twelve thirty five Charles Davis from the NFL Network

11
00:00:26,840 --> 00:00:29,080
Speaker 1: talking draft and we can get some NFL stuff from

12
00:00:29,080 --> 00:00:30,680
Speaker 1: both guys as well, but they both cover the league

13
00:00:30,720 --> 00:00:32,720
Speaker 1: and the draft, so it should be a lot of fun.

14
00:00:33,000 --> 00:00:34,640
Speaker 1: I'll be honest, not sure we're gonna get in a

15
00:00:34,680 --> 00:00:36,640
Speaker 1: lot of calls with you today, but we'll do our best.

16
00:00:36,840 --> 00:00:38,919
Speaker 1: The good thing is next week we're gonna do a

17
00:00:38,920 --> 00:00:42,160
Speaker 1: ton of your calls to get everybody's final opinions, opinions

18
00:00:42,159 --> 00:00:44,879
Speaker 1: in on the draft, the strategy, what the Giant should do.

19
00:00:44,920 --> 00:00:46,519
Speaker 1: I know we've had a lot of guests. We've hope

20
00:00:46,560 --> 00:00:48,120
Speaker 1: we've gotten you a lot of good information, but it

21
00:00:48,120 --> 00:00:50,440
Speaker 1: will be a lot of your opinion next week, along

22
00:00:50,479 --> 00:00:53,920
Speaker 1: with a handful of draft experts as well. All right, Paul,

23
00:00:53,960 --> 00:00:57,280
Speaker 1: let's take this stage by stage here. One, let's start

24
00:00:57,320 --> 00:01:00,440
Speaker 1: with the schedule release. That's what's happened most recently. Now,

25
00:01:00,480 --> 00:01:02,040
Speaker 1: it's not a huge deal. It's more and born for

26
00:01:02,120 --> 00:01:05,040
Speaker 1: Paul and I because we plan our travel schedule based

27
00:01:05,080 --> 00:01:07,160
Speaker 1: on this. But for the folks out there that don't

28
00:01:07,160 --> 00:01:09,440
Speaker 1: go to games or travel two games, it's not that

29
00:01:09,480 --> 00:01:11,560
Speaker 1: big of a deal because we know who the opponents

30
00:01:11,600 --> 00:01:14,760
Speaker 1: were already up. Paul, I look at the schedule. Not

31
00:01:14,920 --> 00:01:18,000
Speaker 1: a too many things jump out at me that really

32
00:01:18,040 --> 00:01:22,440
Speaker 1: that fans would care about, except that the Giants better

33
00:01:22,880 --> 00:01:25,680
Speaker 1: hit the ground with their feet moving, because if you

34
00:01:25,720 --> 00:01:29,200
Speaker 1: stumble early in the schedule, you're going to lose football games.

35
00:01:29,240 --> 00:01:32,600
Speaker 1: I broke it down on um giants dot Com in

36
00:01:32,640 --> 00:01:36,440
Speaker 1: our Cover three feature on Thursday. Of the first seven opponents,

37
00:01:37,800 --> 00:01:40,600
Speaker 1: every team but one, the Houston Texans, who, by the way,

38
00:01:40,640 --> 00:01:42,720
Speaker 1: will be better this year business Shawn Watson is gonna

39
00:01:42,760 --> 00:01:46,280
Speaker 1: be healthy one nine or more games. Last year, Cowboys

40
00:01:46,280 --> 00:01:53,000
Speaker 1: won nine, the Saints one ten, the Jaguars won ten,

41
00:01:53,600 --> 00:01:58,200
Speaker 1: the Panthers one eleven, the Falcons won ten, and the

42
00:01:58,240 --> 00:02:00,880
Speaker 1: Eagles one third team. So the first seven games is

43
00:02:00,920 --> 00:02:03,920
Speaker 1: really really tough, and by the way, the four games

44
00:02:04,000 --> 00:02:07,720
Speaker 1: after that aren't exactly easy either, with the Redskins at

45
00:02:07,760 --> 00:02:10,760
Speaker 1: San Francisco Tampa with the young team that's improving, and

46
00:02:10,800 --> 00:02:13,959
Speaker 1: the Eagles once again. So the Giants better start the

47
00:02:14,000 --> 00:02:16,040
Speaker 1: season playing good football. Are they gonna pay the price

48
00:02:16,040 --> 00:02:18,040
Speaker 1: in the lost com Yeah, I would not disagree with

49
00:02:18,080 --> 00:02:20,240
Speaker 1: that at all, John. I think one of the things though,

50
00:02:20,280 --> 00:02:22,880
Speaker 1: that the fans, at least the home fans are really

51
00:02:22,880 --> 00:02:26,000
Speaker 1: happy about. The Giants will open at home and Tom

52
00:02:26,040 --> 00:02:28,160
Speaker 1: Coughlin and the Jaguars come in, which is kind of

53
00:02:28,160 --> 00:02:30,679
Speaker 1: a cool thing. Giants don't get very many Week one

54
00:02:30,960 --> 00:02:34,880
Speaker 1: home games, that's just not been the case in recent years,

55
00:02:34,880 --> 00:02:37,440
Speaker 1: so that's a cool thing. And of course having TC

56
00:02:37,680 --> 00:02:41,200
Speaker 1: comeback is neat and then also having the closing game

57
00:02:41,360 --> 00:02:45,000
Speaker 1: at home against Dallas. I had not checked. Maybe I

58
00:02:45,000 --> 00:02:47,240
Speaker 1: should have. It's not that relevant, You're right to you

59
00:02:47,320 --> 00:02:49,600
Speaker 1: and I, but to a lot of fans out there,

60
00:02:49,639 --> 00:02:52,360
Speaker 1: to have the home opener and the regular season finale

61
00:02:52,520 --> 00:02:55,680
Speaker 1: both be home, that's kind of nice. We've won in

62
00:02:55,720 --> 00:02:58,519
Speaker 1: seventeen and it's the first time since they've gone to this.

63
00:02:59,000 --> 00:03:02,800
Speaker 1: You know division in schedule on Week seventeen, whether you

64
00:03:02,800 --> 00:03:04,680
Speaker 1: play all the games within your division that the Giants

65
00:03:04,720 --> 00:03:07,520
Speaker 1: have played Dallas in Week seventeen, so that's always a

66
00:03:07,520 --> 00:03:09,520
Speaker 1: fun thing. And they don't go to Dallas in Week one,

67
00:03:09,560 --> 00:03:12,160
Speaker 1: which is great. You get Tom Coffin in the building instead.

68
00:03:12,600 --> 00:03:16,280
Speaker 1: For Giant season ticket hold there's only one home four

69
00:03:16,320 --> 00:03:18,640
Speaker 1: o'clock game on Sundays. I know they like the one

70
00:03:18,639 --> 00:03:20,880
Speaker 1: o'clock games. Of course they can change with flex scheduling,

71
00:03:21,120 --> 00:03:23,799
Speaker 1: and only one home prime time game and that would

72
00:03:23,840 --> 00:03:28,639
Speaker 1: be the Thursday night game against the Philadelphia Eagles. So um,

73
00:03:28,760 --> 00:03:30,919
Speaker 1: a lot of six one o'clock home games, and again

74
00:03:30,960 --> 00:03:32,640
Speaker 1: that could change with flex scheduling late in the year.

75
00:03:33,080 --> 00:03:34,560
Speaker 1: I know a lot of the Giant fans that like

76
00:03:34,600 --> 00:03:37,040
Speaker 1: the one o'clock home games will suddenly like that. I

77
00:03:37,080 --> 00:03:38,840
Speaker 1: think that the other thing that I've been getting a

78
00:03:38,880 --> 00:03:41,600
Speaker 1: lot of tweets about. People are saying to me, Giants

79
00:03:41,600 --> 00:03:44,680
Speaker 1: won three games, they were fourth placed team, How did

80
00:03:44,680 --> 00:03:47,840
Speaker 1: they get such a nasty schedule? Because the the winning

81
00:03:47,840 --> 00:03:50,760
Speaker 1: percentage of the opponents based on last year is tied

82
00:03:50,800 --> 00:03:53,680
Speaker 1: for eighth most difficult in the league. There's a formula, folks, well,

83
00:03:53,720 --> 00:03:57,840
Speaker 1: of course, the divisional rotation happened to bite them in

84
00:03:57,880 --> 00:04:01,720
Speaker 1: the rear end this year because they throw under the rotation,

85
00:04:01,880 --> 00:04:05,480
Speaker 1: which is predetermined. Okay, they they rotate, you know, this

86
00:04:05,560 --> 00:04:07,640
Speaker 1: is just the way it is. They got the NFC

87
00:04:07,680 --> 00:04:11,120
Speaker 1: South and the a f C South this year. Guess

88
00:04:11,120 --> 00:04:14,800
Speaker 1: what that gives you a combined five teams that won

89
00:04:14,920 --> 00:04:19,280
Speaker 1: a minimum of nine games last season. So your divisional

90
00:04:19,400 --> 00:04:23,400
Speaker 1: rotation games are going to be very difficult because you

91
00:04:23,480 --> 00:04:27,440
Speaker 1: happen to draw two divisions who kick butt last season.

92
00:04:27,880 --> 00:04:31,000
Speaker 1: That's just the breaks of the game. You know, every year,

93
00:04:31,040 --> 00:04:33,839
Speaker 1: every division probably wants to play the a f C East,

94
00:04:34,120 --> 00:04:37,279
Speaker 1: but it doesn't work out that way. Lets the Patriots

95
00:04:37,320 --> 00:04:41,599
Speaker 1: exactly like that, John, I like that. Uh, And so

96
00:04:41,800 --> 00:04:45,520
Speaker 1: you know that's just the breaks. So that's the reason

97
00:04:45,600 --> 00:04:48,720
Speaker 1: why only two games on the schedule. I believe John

98
00:04:48,800 --> 00:04:51,080
Speaker 1: and I haven't gone over the formula in a while,

99
00:04:51,080 --> 00:04:52,880
Speaker 1: but I believe only two games on the schedule are

100
00:04:52,920 --> 00:04:57,080
Speaker 1: actually determined by your position in the standing. You play.

101
00:04:57,600 --> 00:05:01,040
Speaker 1: You play one FC division, you play one NFC division,

102
00:05:01,200 --> 00:05:03,800
Speaker 1: you play your own division. That makes up fourteen games,

103
00:05:03,800 --> 00:05:07,920
Speaker 1: and that's all by formula. Only two games against the

104
00:05:07,960 --> 00:05:11,000
Speaker 1: other you play the team that finished in the same

105
00:05:11,000 --> 00:05:15,920
Speaker 1: place that you did in the two other NFC conferences.

106
00:05:16,120 --> 00:05:19,839
Speaker 1: In the Giants case this year, that is the Chicago

107
00:05:19,920 --> 00:05:23,480
Speaker 1: Bears because they finished and the San Francisco forty, and

108
00:05:23,520 --> 00:05:27,359
Speaker 1: you rotate home and road. Now, unfortunately the Giant San Francisco.

109
00:05:28,160 --> 00:05:30,960
Speaker 1: The Niners are not a last place team with Jimmy

110
00:05:30,960 --> 00:05:33,480
Speaker 1: Garoppolo quarterback, and I think I don't think the Bears

111
00:05:33,480 --> 00:05:34,880
Speaker 1: are a playoff team this year, but I think they

112
00:05:34,920 --> 00:05:36,560
Speaker 1: will be better than they were last year. And Mr

113
00:05:36,640 --> 00:05:39,120
Speaker 1: Drabinski a second year. They made some fraging additions. So

114
00:05:39,240 --> 00:05:40,680
Speaker 1: that's it. I wanna get to the other stuff because

115
00:05:40,680 --> 00:05:42,359
Speaker 1: we've done enough on the schedule of just coming up

116
00:05:42,360 --> 00:05:44,840
Speaker 1: in five minutes real quick. Brandon Marshall let go by

117
00:05:44,839 --> 00:05:47,200
Speaker 1: the Giants. We talked all year about it that being

118
00:05:47,200 --> 00:05:49,240
Speaker 1: a medical issue. Was again be able to pass the physical?

119
00:05:49,400 --> 00:05:51,360
Speaker 1: When could he pass the physical? Well, they got to

120
00:05:51,400 --> 00:05:53,359
Speaker 1: the point of no return, they cut him on the

121
00:05:53,360 --> 00:05:56,520
Speaker 1: foul physical and they'll move on and we'll see if

122
00:05:56,520 --> 00:05:59,039
Speaker 1: they decide to add a bigger wide receiver sometime in

123
00:05:59,040 --> 00:06:02,359
Speaker 1: the draft or in free agency. And fans do not

124
00:06:02,400 --> 00:06:05,640
Speaker 1: get excited about Dez Bryant. Probably not gonna happen. There

125
00:06:05,680 --> 00:06:07,919
Speaker 1: are a lot of hurdles to clear with Dez Bryant.

126
00:06:07,920 --> 00:06:10,440
Speaker 1: One is the medical because you need to be relatively

127
00:06:10,480 --> 00:06:13,080
Speaker 1: sure he's gonna be able to get through with that foot.

128
00:06:13,320 --> 00:06:15,520
Speaker 1: He made it last year with Dallas, but that doesn't

129
00:06:15,520 --> 00:06:17,800
Speaker 1: mean he's gonna be able to buy another season on

130
00:06:17,800 --> 00:06:20,280
Speaker 1: that thing. I remember when the excuse train running for him,

131
00:06:20,320 --> 00:06:22,160
Speaker 1: they talked about him dealing with the knee injury all

132
00:06:22,240 --> 00:06:24,600
Speaker 1: year two and that's why he wasn't as effective. I know,

133
00:06:24,680 --> 00:06:26,080
Speaker 1: I'll believe it when I see it, but that's another

134
00:06:26,120 --> 00:06:29,560
Speaker 1: medical thing. So you got medical, you got a salary

135
00:06:29,640 --> 00:06:32,360
Speaker 1: uh to deal with, and then you also have potential

136
00:06:32,560 --> 00:06:34,760
Speaker 1: locker room issues that he's had in the past when

137
00:06:34,839 --> 00:06:36,840
Speaker 1: when he's been in Dallas. So you've got a lot

138
00:06:36,880 --> 00:06:39,000
Speaker 1: of hurdles to clear if you're gonna have Dez Bryant

139
00:06:39,040 --> 00:06:41,120
Speaker 1: on this roster. I don't like. I don't see it

140
00:06:41,160 --> 00:06:43,920
Speaker 1: as a likely, but you never know. I'll give you

141
00:06:43,960 --> 00:06:46,520
Speaker 1: a good name, all right, and it folks, I don't

142
00:06:46,560 --> 00:06:50,120
Speaker 1: know anything, but there's an unrestricted veteran free agent out

143
00:06:50,120 --> 00:06:55,000
Speaker 1: there who fits the description of a rather tall, experienced

144
00:06:55,000 --> 00:06:58,320
Speaker 1: receiver and a possession guy. That'd be Eric Decker, who

145
00:06:58,360 --> 00:07:02,480
Speaker 1: played for the Jets. I could see Eric Decker if

146
00:07:02,560 --> 00:07:04,919
Speaker 1: he still wants to play, and I haven't seen anything

147
00:07:05,080 --> 00:07:07,880
Speaker 1: recently that says he's for sure. I believe he visited

148
00:07:07,920 --> 00:07:10,160
Speaker 1: the Ravens a couple of weeks ago. That would be

149
00:07:10,200 --> 00:07:12,840
Speaker 1: the kind of guy I'd be looking at if I

150
00:07:12,880 --> 00:07:14,840
Speaker 1: was gonna pick up a veteran. I actually think that's

151
00:07:14,840 --> 00:07:18,360
Speaker 1: a really good fit. But they may decide to go

152
00:07:18,480 --> 00:07:20,480
Speaker 1: get a six ft four guy in the draft, which

153
00:07:20,520 --> 00:07:22,480
Speaker 1: they'll be some of those. There aren't many, but there's

154
00:07:22,520 --> 00:07:26,320
Speaker 1: a couple. They're they're they're they're available with Brown anybody,

155
00:07:26,480 --> 00:07:30,480
Speaker 1: or or maybe they find a Victor Cruz dark horse

156
00:07:30,560 --> 00:07:32,480
Speaker 1: after the draft is over. And by the way, I'll

157
00:07:32,480 --> 00:07:34,680
Speaker 1: throw this out there too. Not Victor, by the way,

158
00:07:34,680 --> 00:07:36,400
Speaker 1: but a Victor Cruz tidy, you know what I mean.

159
00:07:36,680 --> 00:07:38,760
Speaker 1: You kind of have enough guys to throw the football

160
00:07:38,800 --> 00:07:41,640
Speaker 1: to with Stolen Shepherd, Odell Beckham Jr. And Evan Ingram.

161
00:07:41,680 --> 00:07:43,400
Speaker 1: Those are three pretty darn good weapons. So it's not

162
00:07:43,400 --> 00:07:45,920
Speaker 1: like you need to find a big time impact guy.

163
00:07:46,080 --> 00:07:48,600
Speaker 1: You have three very good receivers that are already going

164
00:07:48,680 --> 00:07:50,520
Speaker 1: to take up a lot of those targets on the roster.

165
00:07:50,560 --> 00:07:53,280
Speaker 1: So I would also add they believe they believe that

166
00:07:53,360 --> 00:07:55,960
Speaker 1: Corey Lattimer is a dominic kicks and diamond in the

167
00:07:56,080 --> 00:07:59,520
Speaker 1: rough because of the coaching experience that the R wide

168
00:07:59,520 --> 00:08:01,800
Speaker 1: receivers coach had with the Broncos. He was also a

169
00:08:01,800 --> 00:08:04,400
Speaker 1: former second round pick. He is talented, correct, so they

170
00:08:04,520 --> 00:08:08,200
Speaker 1: think he can be productive and be an assistance in

171
00:08:08,240 --> 00:08:10,120
Speaker 1: the on the depth chart. And you have Roger Lewis

172
00:08:10,200 --> 00:08:12,400
Speaker 1: back to so you know, I think they're gonna want

173
00:08:12,400 --> 00:08:15,440
Speaker 1: to add competition. Let's not get ourselves, folks. They will,

174
00:08:15,480 --> 00:08:19,000
Speaker 1: I believe add competition. Agree, But but Latimer is a

175
00:08:19,040 --> 00:08:20,920
Speaker 1: guy I think a lot of people forget about and

176
00:08:20,960 --> 00:08:22,840
Speaker 1: they think there's big ups in him. All right, now,

177
00:08:22,840 --> 00:08:24,880
Speaker 1: we got about two minutes before we get Sam Monson

178
00:08:24,960 --> 00:08:27,120
Speaker 1: on real quick on the Gentleman Press conference. We can

179
00:08:27,120 --> 00:08:29,240
Speaker 1: pass through all the quotes here, folks, but the bottom

180
00:08:29,280 --> 00:08:31,720
Speaker 1: line is that Dave Gunwan made the case for picking

181
00:08:31,720 --> 00:08:33,559
Speaker 1: sa Kwon Barkley when he raved about what a good

182
00:08:33,559 --> 00:08:37,000
Speaker 1: prospect he was and how running back value um she

183
00:08:37,080 --> 00:08:39,600
Speaker 1: should not be devalued. That's a myth. He talked about

184
00:08:39,640 --> 00:08:41,839
Speaker 1: how other people worry about skill position guys, but he's

185
00:08:41,840 --> 00:08:44,280
Speaker 1: worried about winning up front, so that points to Quentin

186
00:08:44,320 --> 00:08:46,640
Speaker 1: Nelson or Bradley Chubb. Then he talked that he was

187
00:08:46,679 --> 00:08:50,880
Speaker 1: asked directly whether or not any of these quarterbacks, um

188
00:08:51,080 --> 00:08:52,920
Speaker 1: don't have the full package. If any of them have

189
00:08:53,040 --> 00:08:54,960
Speaker 1: the full package, he says, I didn't say they didn't

190
00:08:54,960 --> 00:08:57,280
Speaker 1: have the full package. So and he also talked about

191
00:08:57,320 --> 00:08:59,520
Speaker 1: walking the tight rope of winning now and preparing the

192
00:08:59,559 --> 00:09:01,920
Speaker 1: team to the sure. So that means quarterback, if the

193
00:09:01,960 --> 00:09:04,400
Speaker 1: right guy is there, that's still on the table. And

194
00:09:04,440 --> 00:09:08,600
Speaker 1: finally he talked about maximizing value and maybe the best

195
00:09:08,600 --> 00:09:11,760
Speaker 1: way to maximize value. And he also talked about the

196
00:09:11,760 --> 00:09:14,760
Speaker 1: team needing depth. So how do you acquire more depth

197
00:09:14,760 --> 00:09:16,880
Speaker 1: for a team? Remember the Giants with three and thirteen

198
00:09:16,960 --> 00:09:19,520
Speaker 1: last year. Both him and Pat Shermer talked about in

199
00:09:19,640 --> 00:09:22,800
Speaker 1: not embracing that, but understanding where you are. Well, you

200
00:09:22,840 --> 00:09:24,280
Speaker 1: know what you need to film more than one hole?

201
00:09:24,320 --> 00:09:26,000
Speaker 1: So how do you do that by training down in

202
00:09:26,040 --> 00:09:28,640
Speaker 1: the draft? So, in other words, but all the options

203
00:09:28,640 --> 00:09:31,439
Speaker 1: are still open, yes, and he hasn't made his decision yet.

204
00:09:31,440 --> 00:09:32,760
Speaker 1: That was the other big thing out of the presser.

205
00:09:33,520 --> 00:09:36,040
Speaker 1: And he also said he had gotten phone calls about

206
00:09:36,040 --> 00:09:38,040
Speaker 1: the number two pick, and he will not make a decision.

207
00:09:38,040 --> 00:09:40,000
Speaker 1: I would not expect to see a decision until draft.

208
00:09:40,040 --> 00:09:47,000
Speaker 1: That's so, folks, let the blopping continue for another week,

209
00:09:47,200 --> 00:09:50,280
Speaker 1: no question, because there are no concrete answers. All right,

210
00:09:50,280 --> 00:09:52,480
Speaker 1: and now let's get to our first guest, Sam mon City.

211
00:09:52,480 --> 00:09:54,640
Speaker 1: He does a great job for Pro Football Focus and

212
00:09:54,679 --> 00:09:58,720
Speaker 1: Pro Football Focus if you're a subscriber, just released their draft. Guy, Folks,

213
00:09:59,040 --> 00:10:00,839
Speaker 1: I gotta tell you when I sent this to my

214
00:10:00,960 --> 00:10:03,320
Speaker 1: printer here guy, he goes John, this might be the

215
00:10:03,320 --> 00:10:06,680
Speaker 1: biggest book we've done except for one. It is, and Sam,

216
00:10:06,679 --> 00:10:09,200
Speaker 1: I'm holding up right now. It is more than five

217
00:10:09,679 --> 00:10:14,160
Speaker 1: pages of stats, charts, drafts of every player UM in

218
00:10:14,200 --> 00:10:16,760
Speaker 1: the year is probably gonna be drafted next week. It's

219
00:10:16,760 --> 00:10:18,840
Speaker 1: a wonderful book. Go to Pro Football Focus you want

220
00:10:18,840 --> 00:10:20,199
Speaker 1: to check it out. Sam, what do you want to

221
00:10:20,240 --> 00:10:23,600
Speaker 1: tell you about the book and how they get it? Yeah?

222
00:10:23,679 --> 00:10:25,880
Speaker 1: I mean you can go to prof focused dot com.

223
00:10:25,880 --> 00:10:28,679
Speaker 1: If I can go to join dot pro football focus

224
00:10:28,800 --> 00:10:31,320
Speaker 1: dot com forward slash draft you go straight to the

225
00:10:31,320 --> 00:10:34,800
Speaker 1: page that shows you everything about that draft guy. Full

226
00:10:34,840 --> 00:10:39,679
Speaker 1: written profiles with two prospects um for our staff profiles

227
00:10:39,679 --> 00:10:42,520
Speaker 1: on four prospects on some form of data on over

228
00:10:42,559 --> 00:10:45,400
Speaker 1: two thousand guys in there. So it is a monster

229
00:10:45,720 --> 00:10:48,760
Speaker 1: two thousand guys and holy smoke and Sam. One of

230
00:10:48,840 --> 00:10:50,640
Speaker 1: the things that I think is really interesting and something

231
00:10:50,679 --> 00:10:53,360
Speaker 1: you guys are kind of just developing and getting into

232
00:10:53,400 --> 00:10:57,360
Speaker 1: more detail on is your accuracy ratings and some of

233
00:10:57,360 --> 00:11:00,360
Speaker 1: your advanced stuff on ball placement for quarterbacks, which you

234
00:11:00,400 --> 00:11:02,520
Speaker 1: have in your quarterback book, but you also have it

235
00:11:02,600 --> 00:11:06,400
Speaker 1: for the rookies in this book, and you have accuracy charts,

236
00:11:06,480 --> 00:11:09,320
Speaker 1: what percentage of quarterbacks passes hit the body, hit the

237
00:11:09,360 --> 00:11:12,280
Speaker 1: hands or shorter over the head where they throw it,

238
00:11:12,520 --> 00:11:14,960
Speaker 1: what percentage of their throws go on certain routes in

239
00:11:14,960 --> 00:11:18,360
Speaker 1: what situations. This is pretty much the most comprehensive breakdown

240
00:11:18,400 --> 00:11:21,920
Speaker 1: of quarterback numbers you can find. Right. Yeah, it's the

241
00:11:21,960 --> 00:11:24,559
Speaker 1: perfect draft to be bringing this stuff to the table

242
00:11:24,600 --> 00:11:27,080
Speaker 1: as well, because you've got guys like Josh Allen and

243
00:11:27,160 --> 00:11:30,360
Speaker 1: guys like Baker Mayfield. And the big questions are, you know,

244
00:11:30,440 --> 00:11:32,719
Speaker 1: how much are external factors are part of this? How

245
00:11:32,800 --> 00:11:36,280
Speaker 1: much is the um, the the the offense that Baker

246
00:11:36,320 --> 00:11:39,880
Speaker 1: Mayfield played in factoring into his his numbers, And how

247
00:11:39,960 --> 00:11:43,839
Speaker 1: much is Josh Allen's completion percentage a product of the

248
00:11:43,880 --> 00:11:46,120
Speaker 1: fact that he's playing at Wyoming and his receiving call

249
00:11:46,280 --> 00:11:48,920
Speaker 1: wasn't great. So we're looking at that. We're looking at

250
00:11:48,920 --> 00:11:51,400
Speaker 1: not just whether the past is complete or not, but

251
00:11:51,520 --> 00:11:54,480
Speaker 1: where did he put it? Was the ball perfectly accurate

252
00:11:54,800 --> 00:11:57,120
Speaker 1: actually on the frame of the receiver or is it

253
00:11:57,280 --> 00:12:00,800
Speaker 1: left behind? Was it killing yards after the can opportunities,

254
00:12:00,840 --> 00:12:03,680
Speaker 1: all that kind of stuff. So we've actually charted exact

255
00:12:03,760 --> 00:12:06,360
Speaker 1: ball location on all these guys for every past they

256
00:12:06,360 --> 00:12:09,679
Speaker 1: attempted um and there's some amazing numbers in there. And

257
00:12:09,760 --> 00:12:12,880
Speaker 1: you know, again, it shows that it's not just a

258
00:12:12,920 --> 00:12:16,960
Speaker 1: case of completion percentage for Josh Allen. So once the

259
00:12:16,960 --> 00:12:19,680
Speaker 1: completion percentage does actually tell the story that he is

260
00:12:19,800 --> 00:12:24,240
Speaker 1: an inaccurate quarterback in the advanced true accuracy numbers bear

261
00:12:24,360 --> 00:12:26,840
Speaker 1: that out. Sam, let me ask you this, of of

262
00:12:26,960 --> 00:12:31,120
Speaker 1: all the guys at your at your PFF staff, I'm

263
00:12:31,160 --> 00:12:33,640
Speaker 1: sure you know there's so many games that are being watched,

264
00:12:33,920 --> 00:12:35,920
Speaker 1: so much tape that's being watched to come up with

265
00:12:35,960 --> 00:12:39,400
Speaker 1: the numbers. Are there a bunch of guys a handful

266
00:12:39,520 --> 00:12:43,000
Speaker 1: maybe two or three that you guys had an impression

267
00:12:43,280 --> 00:12:46,000
Speaker 1: when you watch the games of we really think this

268
00:12:46,040 --> 00:12:49,080
Speaker 1: guy is either not so good or maybe really good,

269
00:12:49,240 --> 00:12:51,760
Speaker 1: and then after you ended up all the numbers and

270
00:12:51,800 --> 00:12:54,960
Speaker 1: you did all your calculations and your charts, you found

271
00:12:54,960 --> 00:12:59,800
Speaker 1: out he was totally the opposite of what you thought. Um,

272
00:12:59,840 --> 00:13:03,160
Speaker 1: I don't think anyone's been anyone's come out completely the

273
00:13:03,160 --> 00:13:05,480
Speaker 1: opposite of what people thought. There are some guys where

274
00:13:06,120 --> 00:13:09,720
Speaker 1: you know that have have certainly with the advanced accuracy stuff,

275
00:13:09,760 --> 00:13:12,360
Speaker 1: the exact accuracy. There's some guys that didn't come out

276
00:13:12,440 --> 00:13:15,240
Speaker 1: quite the way we were expecting. Mason Rudolph is the

277
00:13:15,240 --> 00:13:18,320
Speaker 1: most obvious one. We expected him to be really good

278
00:13:18,320 --> 00:13:21,120
Speaker 1: with the advanced accuracy stuff this year, and he just wasn't.

279
00:13:21,120 --> 00:13:24,560
Speaker 1: He was one of the lower guys on ball locations stuff,

280
00:13:24,559 --> 00:13:26,800
Speaker 1: which was kind of confusing. He's been one of the

281
00:13:26,840 --> 00:13:30,640
Speaker 1: toughest evaluations of any of these quarterbacks this year. We

282
00:13:30,760 --> 00:13:33,720
Speaker 1: just haven't been able to do to nail down exactly

283
00:13:33,760 --> 00:13:35,680
Speaker 1: what he is. His numbers are kind of all over

284
00:13:35,679 --> 00:13:39,160
Speaker 1: the place. Um, he shows really well in some categories,

285
00:13:39,559 --> 00:13:41,880
Speaker 1: really badly in other categories, and he has a lot

286
00:13:41,920 --> 00:13:45,240
Speaker 1: of the same question Marxist Baker Mayfield does in terms

287
00:13:45,240 --> 00:13:48,360
Speaker 1: of playing in the Big twelve where defense is optional

288
00:13:48,480 --> 00:13:51,400
Speaker 1: and um, you know, having an offense that manufactures a

289
00:13:51,400 --> 00:13:53,720
Speaker 1: lot of easy looks for him and playing throwing to

290
00:13:53,800 --> 00:13:57,000
Speaker 1: a bunch of NFL caliber wide receivers as well. So

291
00:13:57,280 --> 00:14:00,680
Speaker 1: is is there anybody opposite? Though that after did the numbers,

292
00:14:00,720 --> 00:14:05,720
Speaker 1: the numbers said something better than what you thought you saw. Um,

293
00:14:05,760 --> 00:14:08,680
Speaker 1: I don't know that anyone has dramatically jumped up because

294
00:14:08,720 --> 00:14:11,240
Speaker 1: of the numbers, so that the numbers attended to confirm

295
00:14:11,360 --> 00:14:14,920
Speaker 1: what we've thought with a bunch of guys, Baker Mayfield's

296
00:14:14,920 --> 00:14:18,079
Speaker 1: advanced numbers were pretty much as good as his overall

297
00:14:18,200 --> 00:14:20,840
Speaker 1: numbers m Kyle Aletta. When we went and did his

298
00:14:20,920 --> 00:14:24,000
Speaker 1: stuff out of Richmond again, his numbers looked really good,

299
00:14:24,080 --> 00:14:28,080
Speaker 1: especially as accuracy plus, which is accuracy plus for us

300
00:14:28,240 --> 00:14:32,000
Speaker 1: is basically perfect ball location, not just putting it in

301
00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:35,520
Speaker 1: a cashable spot, but absolutely exactly where it needs to

302
00:14:35,560 --> 00:14:37,800
Speaker 1: be on that give and play. He was among the

303
00:14:37,800 --> 00:14:40,280
Speaker 1: best quarterbacks in factive a second of the guys that

304
00:14:40,360 --> 00:14:45,160
Speaker 1: we looked at. And accuracy plus um, which again confirms

305
00:14:45,160 --> 00:14:47,520
Speaker 1: what you saw if you saw him at the Senior Bowl.

306
00:14:47,640 --> 00:14:51,400
Speaker 1: Let red zone stuff was a work of art, you know,

307
00:14:51,440 --> 00:14:54,200
Speaker 1: Sam and it's funny your colleague Mike Renner over there

308
00:14:54,200 --> 00:14:55,840
Speaker 1: we have actually had on the show since he played

309
00:14:55,880 --> 00:14:57,880
Speaker 1: the piano force at the Combat a couple of years ago,

310
00:14:58,200 --> 00:15:01,520
Speaker 1: which was tremendous. By the way, Um, he had a

311
00:15:01,520 --> 00:15:03,520
Speaker 1: great tweet this morning, and this was his tweet. I'm

312
00:15:03,520 --> 00:15:06,160
Speaker 1: gonna read it. Practice time and player development is that

313
00:15:06,400 --> 00:15:08,800
Speaker 1: it is at an all time low. And this is sarcasm,

314
00:15:09,080 --> 00:15:11,800
Speaker 1: but let's draft players who might be quality starters just

315
00:15:11,840 --> 00:15:14,920
Speaker 1: in time to pay them in free agency. And and

316
00:15:14,960 --> 00:15:16,760
Speaker 1: I think it's a really good point. I think this

317
00:15:16,840 --> 00:15:18,160
Speaker 1: is kind of you guys are kind of on the

318
00:15:18,200 --> 00:15:20,880
Speaker 1: front lines of this war. And I think the league

319
00:15:20,960 --> 00:15:27,440
Speaker 1: is slowly shifting away from drafting traits versus drafting football players.

320
00:15:27,440 --> 00:15:29,200
Speaker 1: Because Paul and I talked about this all the time.

321
00:15:29,640 --> 00:15:32,600
Speaker 1: Practice time is limited now in the league, so you

322
00:15:32,600 --> 00:15:35,720
Speaker 1: can only do so much to get guys better from

323
00:15:35,720 --> 00:15:37,520
Speaker 1: what they wore in college. But at the same time,

324
00:15:37,600 --> 00:15:41,040
Speaker 1: Dave Gentleman talked about this as press conference yesterday. Colleges

325
00:15:41,080 --> 00:15:43,640
Speaker 1: are limited and how much they can practice with these

326
00:15:43,680 --> 00:15:47,400
Speaker 1: guys and develop them. So I think, how do you

327
00:15:47,440 --> 00:15:52,200
Speaker 1: guys find that balance between understanding what skills you can

328
00:15:52,360 --> 00:15:55,920
Speaker 1: develop in the NFL from what guys are coming out

329
00:15:55,920 --> 00:15:59,280
Speaker 1: of college and what things are really hard to fix

330
00:15:59,680 --> 00:16:03,600
Speaker 1: where a player is deficient in college heading into the NFL.

331
00:16:03,640 --> 00:16:05,400
Speaker 1: Have you guys been able to wrap your hands around

332
00:16:05,400 --> 00:16:08,240
Speaker 1: that at all. Yeah, I think there's never been a

333
00:16:08,240 --> 00:16:11,160
Speaker 1: worse time to be drafting project players because you just

334
00:16:11,200 --> 00:16:14,800
Speaker 1: don't have the time to turn them into complete to

335
00:16:14,960 --> 00:16:18,880
Speaker 1: complete NFL players. You don't find to fix all the flaws.

336
00:16:19,440 --> 00:16:22,880
Speaker 1: We've been working a lot recently this offseason, in particular

337
00:16:23,040 --> 00:16:27,680
Speaker 1: of understanding what things are predictive, what things translate from

338
00:16:27,800 --> 00:16:29,960
Speaker 1: year to year, and what things translate from college to

339
00:16:30,040 --> 00:16:32,680
Speaker 1: the pros. And I think the next step for us

340
00:16:32,760 --> 00:16:36,920
Speaker 1: is being able to try and isolate which traits can improve,

341
00:16:37,000 --> 00:16:39,440
Speaker 1: you know, which things can you actually fix at the

342
00:16:39,440 --> 00:16:43,360
Speaker 1: next level. I'm dialing in on those players as Yeah,

343
00:16:43,400 --> 00:16:45,600
Speaker 1: we can take a guy who's not great at this

344
00:16:45,720 --> 00:16:48,560
Speaker 1: because this is fixable. But if a guy is basically

345
00:16:48,640 --> 00:16:51,480
Speaker 1: an accurate, say at a quarterback, there's no fixing that

346
00:16:51,680 --> 00:16:54,280
Speaker 1: we're not we don't have the time to rebuild this

347
00:16:54,320 --> 00:16:56,720
Speaker 1: guy's fundamental from the ground up and turn him into

348
00:16:56,720 --> 00:16:59,920
Speaker 1: a more accurate quarterback. Let's focus on something else that

349
00:17:00,040 --> 00:17:01,920
Speaker 1: we might be able to improve at the next level.

350
00:17:02,240 --> 00:17:03,960
Speaker 1: I think that's the big thing, is that the NFL

351
00:17:04,040 --> 00:17:07,320
Speaker 1: is still looking at guys who have all the athleticism,

352
00:17:07,359 --> 00:17:11,359
Speaker 1: all the measurables as things they can't teach, and thinking

353
00:17:11,440 --> 00:17:14,080
Speaker 1: they can teach these guys how to become football players,

354
00:17:14,080 --> 00:17:16,320
Speaker 1: but they don't have that kind of time anymore. So

355
00:17:16,960 --> 00:17:19,240
Speaker 1: they may be better served to pick the guys that

356
00:17:19,280 --> 00:17:21,840
Speaker 1: are quality football players and then try and draw a

357
00:17:21,880 --> 00:17:25,240
Speaker 1: line under uh, you know, try and draw a line

358
00:17:25,440 --> 00:17:28,399
Speaker 1: of basic athleticism required to get that done at the

359
00:17:28,400 --> 00:17:30,840
Speaker 1: next level, and say, Okay, we're gonna take a guy

360
00:17:30,880 --> 00:17:36,159
Speaker 1: that's been this productive unless he is catastrophically unathletic, you know,

361
00:17:36,280 --> 00:17:38,000
Speaker 1: so bad that there's just no way that's going to

362
00:17:38,080 --> 00:17:40,600
Speaker 1: work at the next level. Yeah. In that case, he's

363
00:17:40,600 --> 00:17:44,639
Speaker 1: going at the pro wrestling Yeah, Sam, let me let

364
00:17:44,680 --> 00:17:46,280
Speaker 1: me ask you this. You guys have been around now

365
00:17:46,280 --> 00:17:51,520
Speaker 1: for a few years. Um strictly by an analytics numbers perspective,

366
00:17:51,560 --> 00:17:53,280
Speaker 1: because I'm not going to be foolish enough to think

367
00:17:53,280 --> 00:17:56,359
Speaker 1: that that's the only component. Dave Gentleman says, when you

368
00:17:56,440 --> 00:17:58,400
Speaker 1: draft the number two overall, you have to be able

369
00:17:58,440 --> 00:18:00,479
Speaker 1: to see the guy fitted for a golden jacket. He's

370
00:18:00,480 --> 00:18:02,320
Speaker 1: got to be a Hall of Fame player down the road.

371
00:18:02,840 --> 00:18:07,600
Speaker 1: Strictly from an analytics numbers point of view, which guys

372
00:18:07,600 --> 00:18:10,439
Speaker 1: in this draft, if any or how many do you

373
00:18:10,520 --> 00:18:13,840
Speaker 1: believe our future Hall of Fame players? Forget about the

374
00:18:13,840 --> 00:18:16,600
Speaker 1: other things that that are involved in it. Strictly from

375
00:18:16,600 --> 00:18:21,359
Speaker 1: the numbers perspective, Yeah, I mean from an analytics point

376
00:18:21,440 --> 00:18:23,760
Speaker 1: of view, the guys that we are most confident in

377
00:18:23,960 --> 00:18:27,080
Speaker 1: having absolute dominant success at the next level would be

378
00:18:27,800 --> 00:18:31,399
Speaker 1: Quentin Nelson, the guard out of Notre Dame. The question

379
00:18:31,440 --> 00:18:33,840
Speaker 1: with him, which could make his value even higher, is

380
00:18:33,880 --> 00:18:35,840
Speaker 1: can he play left handle at the next level, which

381
00:18:35,880 --> 00:18:38,600
Speaker 1: is obviously a much more valuable position at the moment.

382
00:18:38,640 --> 00:18:40,679
Speaker 1: There isn't really anything that says he can't, other than

383
00:18:40,720 --> 00:18:43,200
Speaker 1: the fact that he hasn't done it before. UM. We're

384
00:18:43,240 --> 00:18:47,000
Speaker 1: also extremely high on Baker Mayfield, obviously a quarterback. He

385
00:18:47,160 --> 00:18:50,280
Speaker 1: was broken our system in terms of the best passing

386
00:18:50,280 --> 00:18:53,280
Speaker 1: grades we've ever seen. He has the two highest single

387
00:18:53,320 --> 00:18:56,240
Speaker 1: season grades he's ever seen from the quarterback UM, and

388
00:18:56,440 --> 00:18:58,960
Speaker 1: his third season is in the top seven. So his

389
00:18:59,040 --> 00:19:01,560
Speaker 1: grading has been just head and shoulders above anybody else.

390
00:19:01,800 --> 00:19:04,720
Speaker 1: The other guy We are incredibly high on his Maurice Hearst,

391
00:19:04,800 --> 00:19:07,640
Speaker 1: the defensive tackle out of Michigan, who was another guy

392
00:19:07,720 --> 00:19:10,800
Speaker 1: who has just distanced himself at the top of the

393
00:19:10,840 --> 00:19:14,760
Speaker 1: grading from any other guy, and particularly on on the

394
00:19:14,800 --> 00:19:18,719
Speaker 1: defensive line, from pass rushes and interior guys. The guys

395
00:19:18,800 --> 00:19:21,960
Speaker 1: that have dominated our system have translated really well to

396
00:19:22,040 --> 00:19:25,280
Speaker 1: the NFL. So people like Joey Bosa, people were picking

397
00:19:25,320 --> 00:19:27,679
Speaker 1: holes in his game wondering whether he's maxed out as

398
00:19:27,680 --> 00:19:31,199
Speaker 1: a prospect, but he dominated the college PFF grading and

399
00:19:31,240 --> 00:19:34,159
Speaker 1: he's dominated the NFL grading as well. Now you left

400
00:19:34,200 --> 00:19:37,200
Speaker 1: se Quon Barkley out of that list of three players,

401
00:19:37,200 --> 00:19:39,520
Speaker 1: and also Bradley Chubb, by the way, chop two. So

402
00:19:39,840 --> 00:19:43,600
Speaker 1: is it is it your analytics perspective that those two

403
00:19:43,640 --> 00:19:49,120
Speaker 1: guys are not potential Hall of Fame jacket guys. Yeah.

404
00:19:49,119 --> 00:19:51,560
Speaker 1: Bradley Child in particular is a guy that we are

405
00:19:51,760 --> 00:19:53,960
Speaker 1: less high on than other people. We don't actually have

406
00:19:54,040 --> 00:19:56,840
Speaker 1: him as a number one edge rusher in our in

407
00:19:56,880 --> 00:19:59,240
Speaker 1: our on our big board, we think that he is

408
00:19:59,240 --> 00:20:01,200
Speaker 1: going to be a good pass rusher, a very good

409
00:20:01,240 --> 00:20:04,040
Speaker 1: run defender, but not an all world kind of guy.

410
00:20:04,440 --> 00:20:07,280
Speaker 1: And if you're looking for that elite pass rushing talent.

411
00:20:07,800 --> 00:20:10,000
Speaker 1: The only guy really that fits that bill is Harold

412
00:20:10,040 --> 00:20:12,840
Speaker 1: Landry at a Boston college. He's just been far more

413
00:20:12,880 --> 00:20:19,199
Speaker 1: productive edge rusher and Barkley Barkley, I think, well, for

414
00:20:19,640 --> 00:20:22,760
Speaker 1: the guys that really are deep into the analytics of PFF,

415
00:20:22,800 --> 00:20:26,360
Speaker 1: they want to knock down every running back, let alone Barkley.

416
00:20:26,359 --> 00:20:28,399
Speaker 1: They won't want a single running back taken in the

417
00:20:28,400 --> 00:20:31,159
Speaker 1: first round. But if we if we move them to

418
00:20:31,200 --> 00:20:33,040
Speaker 1: the side for a little bit, I think you have

419
00:20:33,080 --> 00:20:37,040
Speaker 1: to understand what Barkley is, which is an incredibly talented

420
00:20:37,760 --> 00:20:42,960
Speaker 1: receiving option, not a dominant runner, a dominant ball carrier.

421
00:20:43,280 --> 00:20:47,200
Speaker 1: He's relatively struggles between the tackles. He's a run to

422
00:20:47,359 --> 00:20:50,040
Speaker 1: daylight kind of guy. Wants to bounce everything outside the

423
00:20:50,040 --> 00:20:53,240
Speaker 1: way Reggie Bush always did in his career. Um sometimes

424
00:20:53,240 --> 00:20:55,280
Speaker 1: it makes him some big plays and sometimes it loses

425
00:20:55,359 --> 00:20:58,240
Speaker 1: him a lot of opportunities as well. So I can

426
00:20:58,280 --> 00:21:01,479
Speaker 1: see a situation where Arkley is extremely good. I can

427
00:21:01,520 --> 00:21:05,080
Speaker 1: see him having dominant seasons, But really you are looking

428
00:21:05,119 --> 00:21:08,120
Speaker 1: at a guy who is a matchup weapon as a receiver.

429
00:21:09,080 --> 00:21:12,760
Speaker 1: Probably not a Hall of Fame kind of guy based

430
00:21:12,800 --> 00:21:15,040
Speaker 1: on his all round game. I want to go back

431
00:21:15,080 --> 00:21:16,960
Speaker 1: to the first part of that answer, Sam, why do

432
00:21:17,040 --> 00:21:20,919
Speaker 1: your analytics people believe running backs do not hold value

433
00:21:20,960 --> 00:21:24,600
Speaker 1: to be first round picks because all the numbers they're

434
00:21:24,600 --> 00:21:27,159
Speaker 1: pulling out at the moment in terms of expected points

435
00:21:27,200 --> 00:21:29,800
Speaker 1: at it and wins above replacement and all this kind

436
00:21:29,800 --> 00:21:32,800
Speaker 1: of complex stuff that baseball is in diving into for years.

437
00:21:33,200 --> 00:21:36,880
Speaker 1: Says that the passing game is paramount. Everything is coverage,

438
00:21:36,920 --> 00:21:40,280
Speaker 1: everything is receiving, it's passing the ball. Running really doesn't

439
00:21:40,280 --> 00:21:43,119
Speaker 1: move the needle that much. And also running is the

440
00:21:43,160 --> 00:21:46,960
Speaker 1: most dependent position in the NFL. So even if you

441
00:21:46,960 --> 00:21:48,760
Speaker 1: have a Hall of Fame guy back there, you need

442
00:21:48,800 --> 00:21:51,960
Speaker 1: the blocking otherwise it doesn't matter. And the difference between

443
00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:54,520
Speaker 1: a Hall of Fame guy versus just a pretty good

444
00:21:54,600 --> 00:21:56,879
Speaker 1: running back in the backfield. If you do have the

445
00:21:56,960 --> 00:22:00,040
Speaker 1: blocking to get them somewhere, Again, it's not moving a

446
00:22:00,119 --> 00:22:03,119
Speaker 1: needle that much. So you are far better off investing

447
00:22:03,480 --> 00:22:06,160
Speaker 1: that first round pick and somebody that can improve your

448
00:22:06,200 --> 00:22:09,600
Speaker 1: passing game, because that's what produces the wins. Whether it's

449
00:22:09,640 --> 00:22:13,640
Speaker 1: cornerbacks to cover, whether it's poss rushers to freshure the quarterback,

450
00:22:13,640 --> 00:22:16,800
Speaker 1: whether it's a quarterback himself. If you don't already have one,

451
00:22:17,119 --> 00:22:20,000
Speaker 1: or the pass protection or the receiver something that improves

452
00:22:20,000 --> 00:22:23,000
Speaker 1: your passing game, because that's what's moving the needle in

453
00:22:23,080 --> 00:22:27,440
Speaker 1: terms of expected points at it or correlating two wins

454
00:22:27,440 --> 00:22:28,800
Speaker 1: at the end of the day. Now, I'm going to

455
00:22:28,880 --> 00:22:30,720
Speaker 1: play the role of Dave Gentleman here and ask a

456
00:22:30,760 --> 00:22:32,879
Speaker 1: follow up question because Dave Gelman made the point of

457
00:22:33,000 --> 00:22:35,639
Speaker 1: yesterday's press conference that he believes the presence of a

458
00:22:35,680 --> 00:22:39,040
Speaker 1: great running back will impact how other teams will defend

459
00:22:39,080 --> 00:22:42,200
Speaker 1: you in the past game. I don't even know where

460
00:22:42,240 --> 00:22:45,679
Speaker 1: to start and how you can measure that analytically and statistically.

461
00:22:46,359 --> 00:22:48,400
Speaker 1: Maybe maybe you guys can figure out a way. Maybe

462
00:22:48,400 --> 00:22:50,359
Speaker 1: you have I don't know, Sam, but is there a

463
00:22:50,400 --> 00:22:52,320
Speaker 1: way for you guys to figure out if there is

464
00:22:52,359 --> 00:22:56,480
Speaker 1: an impact on how teams will defend s the a

465
00:22:56,520 --> 00:23:00,320
Speaker 1: team like the Cowboys differently because Elliott's on the field,

466
00:23:00,320 --> 00:23:02,520
Speaker 1: so even if he doesn't get the ball at any

467
00:23:02,560 --> 00:23:06,399
Speaker 1: given play, he will impact the pass game, you know

468
00:23:06,440 --> 00:23:10,200
Speaker 1: what I mean? Yeah, I think there is something to that,

469
00:23:10,400 --> 00:23:13,200
Speaker 1: um and that's that's the next step of this whole process,

470
00:23:13,200 --> 00:23:15,600
Speaker 1: And that's why we're not just letting the analytic guys loose.

471
00:23:17,920 --> 00:23:21,199
Speaker 1: Thank you, Sam, Thank you a little bit until we

472
00:23:21,240 --> 00:23:24,400
Speaker 1: really figure out where it is. But one thing that

473
00:23:24,800 --> 00:23:27,919
Speaker 1: the suggests it's not a huge impact is things like

474
00:23:28,000 --> 00:23:31,720
Speaker 1: play action. Um, play action is not dependent on the

475
00:23:31,800 --> 00:23:35,119
Speaker 1: running back being great. Play action works just by running

476
00:23:35,119 --> 00:23:37,920
Speaker 1: play action. You don't need to have Peak Elliott in

477
00:23:37,920 --> 00:23:40,120
Speaker 1: the bank field for play action to be effective. It's

478
00:23:40,119 --> 00:23:42,600
Speaker 1: going to work whether the running back is him, whether

479
00:23:42,640 --> 00:23:46,480
Speaker 1: it's Darren McFadden, whoever. So I think it definitely does

480
00:23:46,560 --> 00:23:48,960
Speaker 1: have an impact, but we haven't got as far yet

481
00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:52,399
Speaker 1: as defining exactly how big that impact is. Alright, final

482
00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:54,399
Speaker 1: one from me, Sam, I know you the time is

483
00:23:54,440 --> 00:23:57,639
Speaker 1: probably limited. Let me ask you this. Uh. We have

484
00:23:57,800 --> 00:24:02,800
Speaker 1: had so much conversation about out the disparity between the

485
00:24:02,840 --> 00:24:05,600
Speaker 1: top offensive lineman that is Nelson and the rest of

486
00:24:05,640 --> 00:24:07,960
Speaker 1: the other offensive lineman that there are a lot of

487
00:24:08,000 --> 00:24:11,080
Speaker 1: good second rounders available. You could still get a quality

488
00:24:11,200 --> 00:24:14,680
Speaker 1: starter if you pass on Nelson. We've talked about same

489
00:24:14,720 --> 00:24:17,479
Speaker 1: thing with Barkley. If you pass on Barkley, there's a

490
00:24:17,520 --> 00:24:21,000
Speaker 1: good chunk of of of other running backs who are

491
00:24:21,040 --> 00:24:23,560
Speaker 1: gonna be really good in the second round. But then

492
00:24:23,600 --> 00:24:26,840
Speaker 1: we've also talked about after Chub well, guess what the

493
00:24:26,880 --> 00:24:30,680
Speaker 1: defensive end position outside of Marcus Davenport drops off like

494
00:24:31,040 --> 00:24:32,520
Speaker 1: you're you're you know, you're in the middle of a

495
00:24:32,560 --> 00:24:36,680
Speaker 1: cliff um. You have thoughts on those three positions, and

496
00:24:36,680 --> 00:24:40,359
Speaker 1: and how close is that second group to the number

497
00:24:40,400 --> 00:24:43,600
Speaker 1: one guy as compared to with the defensive ends, where

498
00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:47,240
Speaker 1: the drop off seems to be deep. Yeah, I think

499
00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:50,200
Speaker 1: that's the one argument for taking a pass rusher high

500
00:24:50,200 --> 00:24:53,719
Speaker 1: in this draft, is that the drop office significant. We

501
00:24:53,800 --> 00:24:55,720
Speaker 1: at the moment have three guys that we think our

502
00:24:55,800 --> 00:24:59,280
Speaker 1: first round edge rushers. It's Harold Laundry, like I mentioned before,

503
00:24:59,359 --> 00:25:02,480
Speaker 1: it's Bradley Job and then it's Marcus Stavenport. After that

504
00:25:02,560 --> 00:25:06,200
Speaker 1: it is it does drop off precipitously, and if you

505
00:25:06,240 --> 00:25:09,320
Speaker 1: don't have a guy, it's it's a big concern. So,

506
00:25:09,880 --> 00:25:12,919
Speaker 1: you know, I think that the Giants can't pass up

507
00:25:12,920 --> 00:25:16,080
Speaker 1: with the opportunity of taking a quarterback at two. You're

508
00:25:16,119 --> 00:25:18,240
Speaker 1: just not going to get that role around every year.

509
00:25:18,440 --> 00:25:22,080
Speaker 1: And Eli Manning is coming towards the end of his career.

510
00:25:22,119 --> 00:25:24,600
Speaker 1: How far off that is is up for debate. So

511
00:25:24,680 --> 00:25:26,520
Speaker 1: I think you've got to take a quarterback at two.

512
00:25:26,560 --> 00:25:30,160
Speaker 1: But if you don't, in terms of which positions drop

513
00:25:30,200 --> 00:25:33,280
Speaker 1: off the most deeply edge rusher is that one? All right? Sam,

514
00:25:33,280 --> 00:25:35,760
Speaker 1: I'm gonna do a lightning round with you last. But

515
00:25:35,800 --> 00:25:37,639
Speaker 1: before we get there, you just mentioned the Giants. So

516
00:25:37,960 --> 00:25:39,600
Speaker 1: what all the guys we've had on I've asked it

517
00:25:39,680 --> 00:25:41,960
Speaker 1: for their predictions and what you think the Giants will

518
00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:43,960
Speaker 1: do in the first and second round? And then I've

519
00:25:44,040 --> 00:25:47,120
Speaker 1: asked the same question, except what you would do if

520
00:25:47,119 --> 00:25:48,920
Speaker 1: you were the Giants in the first or second round?

521
00:25:48,960 --> 00:25:51,919
Speaker 1: So why don't you give me both of those? All right?

522
00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:56,200
Speaker 1: What I think they will do is, God, I think

523
00:25:56,200 --> 00:25:58,240
Speaker 1: they're going to take, say Klon Barkie at number two.

524
00:26:00,119 --> 00:26:02,840
Speaker 1: What I would do is take to take the quarterback, which,

525
00:26:02,920 --> 00:26:05,480
Speaker 1: you know, whichever your favorite guy doesn't go number one,

526
00:26:05,640 --> 00:26:07,480
Speaker 1: you pick him at number two because you're just not

527
00:26:07,520 --> 00:26:10,560
Speaker 1: going to get that shot again. I think number one,

528
00:26:10,960 --> 00:26:13,520
Speaker 1: I think it's probably going to be Sam Donalds, at

529
00:26:13,520 --> 00:26:16,119
Speaker 1: which point I would take Baker Mayfield number two because

530
00:26:16,160 --> 00:26:18,600
Speaker 1: we think he's the best quarterback there. And how about

531
00:26:18,600 --> 00:26:21,560
Speaker 1: the second round pick top of the second round? The

532
00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:23,639
Speaker 1: second round, I think they're in a pretty good spot

533
00:26:23,680 --> 00:26:26,320
Speaker 1: to address a number of needs. I think the top

534
00:26:26,359 --> 00:26:28,560
Speaker 1: of the second round is not the best place to

535
00:26:28,600 --> 00:26:31,000
Speaker 1: be in terms of value. But I think depending on

536
00:26:31,040 --> 00:26:33,160
Speaker 1: who falls out of that first round, you might get

537
00:26:33,200 --> 00:26:36,040
Speaker 1: a very good offensive lineman high in the second That

538
00:26:36,080 --> 00:26:37,800
Speaker 1: would be a pretty good place for the Giants to go.

539
00:26:37,920 --> 00:26:41,439
Speaker 1: They still need to keep rebuilding that offensive line. All right.

540
00:26:41,800 --> 00:26:44,800
Speaker 1: One more concept question, Sam, which you actually just jogged

541
00:26:44,840 --> 00:26:46,600
Speaker 1: my mind here. I wanted to ask you this. Have

542
00:26:46,760 --> 00:26:49,280
Speaker 1: you guys, you know, they have the traditional Jimmy Johnson

543
00:26:49,320 --> 00:26:52,640
Speaker 1: trade chart right with your guys in your number crunching.

544
00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:55,080
Speaker 1: If you don't pick a quarterback at number two, let's

545
00:26:55,080 --> 00:26:58,000
Speaker 1: just take that off the table for the time being.

546
00:26:59,240 --> 00:27:02,159
Speaker 1: Have you guys figured out, based on probability of draft

547
00:27:02,160 --> 00:27:05,840
Speaker 1: picks success and things like that, you know, value of

548
00:27:05,920 --> 00:27:08,800
Speaker 1: trading down to say, get the twelve and twenty two

549
00:27:08,800 --> 00:27:11,359
Speaker 1: in a second round pick from the Bills or staying

550
00:27:11,400 --> 00:27:14,160
Speaker 1: at two in terms of probability of success and value

551
00:27:14,440 --> 00:27:17,400
Speaker 1: of those individual draft positions. Is that something you guys

552
00:27:17,440 --> 00:27:20,560
Speaker 1: have worked on at all. We haven't done it on

553
00:27:20,600 --> 00:27:23,720
Speaker 1: a league wide basis. We've did I know the analytics

554
00:27:23,720 --> 00:27:26,080
Speaker 1: guys did a little bit of legwork on this um

555
00:27:26,200 --> 00:27:29,439
Speaker 1: in terms of trying to quantify the chances of the

556
00:27:29,440 --> 00:27:33,480
Speaker 1: Patriots early picks being more successful than the Jets picking

557
00:27:33,480 --> 00:27:36,760
Speaker 1: at number three overall, just based on those probability things.

558
00:27:36,800 --> 00:27:39,840
Speaker 1: He talked about the strike rate of graftis, and their

559
00:27:39,880 --> 00:27:43,879
Speaker 1: conclusion was that they were the Patriots are more likely

560
00:27:44,040 --> 00:27:46,639
Speaker 1: to have a better haul at the end of this

561
00:27:47,320 --> 00:27:49,760
Speaker 1: draft over the top few picks, and the Jets were

562
00:27:49,800 --> 00:27:52,480
Speaker 1: at number three overall. Based on those things, well, we'll

563
00:27:52,520 --> 00:27:54,800
Speaker 1: definitely be able to extrapolate it out to the full

564
00:27:54,880 --> 00:27:57,240
Speaker 1: league at some point. Excellent, all right, rapid fire, Because

565
00:27:57,240 --> 00:27:59,000
Speaker 1: there are some guys I know that you like more

566
00:27:59,040 --> 00:28:01,679
Speaker 1: than other people, and some guys you dislike more than

567
00:28:01,720 --> 00:28:05,000
Speaker 1: other people. So give me like fifteen twenty seconds or

568
00:28:05,040 --> 00:28:06,639
Speaker 1: however long you want to go on each one of

569
00:28:06,680 --> 00:28:09,080
Speaker 1: these guys on why you either have them higher or

570
00:28:09,200 --> 00:28:11,600
Speaker 1: lower than other people in the league. And and and

571
00:28:11,600 --> 00:28:13,359
Speaker 1: you've already touched on some of these guys, but I

572
00:28:13,400 --> 00:28:15,160
Speaker 1: want to touch on a couple others that we haven't

573
00:28:15,200 --> 00:28:19,280
Speaker 1: mentioned yet. Um let's start with this Tremaine Edmonds. You

574
00:28:19,320 --> 00:28:22,160
Speaker 1: have him ranked as your twenty ninth best player. Most

575
00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:26,960
Speaker 1: people think he's a top twelve guy. Why shouldn't he be?

576
00:28:26,960 --> 00:28:29,760
Speaker 1: Because his main selling point is that he's nineteen years old,

577
00:28:29,840 --> 00:28:32,280
Speaker 1: which is nice, but it's not exactly. It's not a

578
00:28:32,320 --> 00:28:35,080
Speaker 1: positive in his play. He's a he's a pretty good player,

579
00:28:35,119 --> 00:28:38,080
Speaker 1: but he's not a dominant player on the whole idea

580
00:28:38,200 --> 00:28:40,200
Speaker 1: that he's going to discover the secret to being ray

581
00:28:40,280 --> 00:28:42,600
Speaker 1: lewis in the thirteen months of age between him and

582
00:28:42,680 --> 00:28:47,480
Speaker 1: ro Kwan, who is a genuine top ten talented, very

583
00:28:47,480 --> 00:28:50,600
Speaker 1: good I have expected the Buyer Draft Guide and see

584
00:28:50,640 --> 00:28:53,000
Speaker 1: Frank rag Now on the cover. You guys love the

585
00:28:53,040 --> 00:28:56,120
Speaker 1: center out of Arkansas. Why should he be the first

586
00:28:56,200 --> 00:29:00,680
Speaker 1: interior offensive lineman off the board after Quentin Nelson. So

587
00:29:00,720 --> 00:29:03,160
Speaker 1: he's another one of those players that has put distance

588
00:29:03,320 --> 00:29:05,480
Speaker 1: between himself and everybody else at the top of the

589
00:29:05,520 --> 00:29:08,760
Speaker 1: PFF grading. He has the top two single seasons of

590
00:29:09,040 --> 00:29:12,800
Speaker 1: PFF grades for the center position, and he's well clear

591
00:29:12,800 --> 00:29:16,120
Speaker 1: of anybody else following him up there. He doesn't lose

592
00:29:16,200 --> 00:29:18,840
Speaker 1: in the run game. He has one of the best

593
00:29:19,400 --> 00:29:22,560
Speaker 1: um run block percentages over the past two years in

594
00:29:22,640 --> 00:29:24,680
Speaker 1: terms of losing blocks, and he also has one of

595
00:29:24,680 --> 00:29:26,480
Speaker 1: the best in terms of winning blocks as well. So

596
00:29:26,520 --> 00:29:29,480
Speaker 1: there's a bunch of players where obviously the offensive lineman

597
00:29:29,520 --> 00:29:31,880
Speaker 1: and the defensive linemen are happy enough to occupy the

598
00:29:31,920 --> 00:29:33,760
Speaker 1: same gap, and it's just a wash. It's not a

599
00:29:33,800 --> 00:29:36,840
Speaker 1: positive or negative. But he both wins all the time

600
00:29:36,920 --> 00:29:39,760
Speaker 1: that he doesn't lose, So he's he's, I think, a

601
00:29:39,800 --> 00:29:42,240
Speaker 1: lot better than everybody's giving him credit for. You wrote

602
00:29:42,240 --> 00:29:44,960
Speaker 1: a very good article this morning about Calvin Ridley. Why

603
00:29:44,960 --> 00:29:48,320
Speaker 1: do you think there's a pretty precipitous drop off after

604
00:29:48,440 --> 00:29:52,120
Speaker 1: him at the wide receiver position. I think this wide

605
00:29:52,160 --> 00:29:54,960
Speaker 1: receiver group is pretty chaotic. It's a bunch of guys

606
00:29:55,000 --> 00:29:58,080
Speaker 1: that have some significant flaws to their game, and each

607
00:29:58,080 --> 00:30:00,920
Speaker 1: one of them goes different things. Well. Alvin Ridley's rout

608
00:30:01,040 --> 00:30:05,000
Speaker 1: running is just absolutely obscene. It's incredible. Um, he does

609
00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:08,880
Speaker 1: things at an extremely high NFL level. He isn't just

610
00:30:09,040 --> 00:30:10,920
Speaker 1: you know, a crisp ratt runner and a guy that

611
00:30:11,520 --> 00:30:14,000
Speaker 1: gets open because of that. He understands how to move

612
00:30:14,120 --> 00:30:17,200
Speaker 1: defensive backs around the field by how he runs routes

613
00:30:17,240 --> 00:30:20,600
Speaker 1: and that's something you don't see even many NFL players

614
00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:23,160
Speaker 1: do and really just does it instinctively without having to

615
00:30:23,240 --> 00:30:26,680
Speaker 1: think about it at full speed. Um. The thing with him, though,

616
00:30:26,720 --> 00:30:28,600
Speaker 1: is that he needs to because he's not great at

617
00:30:28,600 --> 00:30:31,560
Speaker 1: the cat point, and he he it helps that he's

618
00:30:31,600 --> 00:30:33,880
Speaker 1: able to buy himself that extra wiggle room in terms

619
00:30:33,920 --> 00:30:37,320
Speaker 1: of separation. You have Marken Marcus Davenport as your thirty

620
00:30:37,440 --> 00:30:40,200
Speaker 1: second overall player. He's going to get drafted in the

621
00:30:40,240 --> 00:30:44,280
Speaker 1: top twenty. Why is that a mistake? I don't even

622
00:30:44,320 --> 00:30:46,120
Speaker 1: know that it's a mistake. I think we're just making

623
00:30:46,120 --> 00:30:48,800
Speaker 1: the point that he is a flawed prospect. He's very raw,

624
00:30:49,000 --> 00:30:53,000
Speaker 1: he hasn't dominated necessarily um and he doesn't show the

625
00:30:53,040 --> 00:30:56,080
Speaker 1: full spectrum of pass rush moves he's going to need

626
00:30:56,080 --> 00:30:59,560
Speaker 1: at the NFL level. But particularly with this draft class

627
00:30:59,560 --> 00:31:01,360
Speaker 1: being so week at edge rusher, I think you're right,

628
00:31:01,400 --> 00:31:03,280
Speaker 1: he's going to get pushed up the draft, and I

629
00:31:03,320 --> 00:31:05,520
Speaker 1: don't know that it's a bad move for that to happen.

630
00:31:05,640 --> 00:31:08,520
Speaker 1: It's just probably going to take an adjudgtment period for

631
00:31:08,600 --> 00:31:10,920
Speaker 1: him to be as good in the NFL. And Tavin Bryan,

632
00:31:11,160 --> 00:31:15,120
Speaker 1: same type of deal. Yeah, same thing again. He's he's

633
00:31:15,160 --> 00:31:17,080
Speaker 1: the guy that actually we're getting higher on as the

634
00:31:17,160 --> 00:31:19,440
Speaker 1: process goes and we start diving into his grade and

635
00:31:19,480 --> 00:31:22,640
Speaker 1: his numbers a little bit more. But again, he just

636
00:31:22,760 --> 00:31:24,280
Speaker 1: he isn't quite as good I think as a lot

637
00:31:24,320 --> 00:31:26,640
Speaker 1: of people are getting him credit for yet finally, and

638
00:31:26,640 --> 00:31:28,360
Speaker 1: then we can say goodbye. I'll let you get on

639
00:31:28,400 --> 00:31:30,840
Speaker 1: your soapbox about Josh Allen because I know you are

640
00:31:31,280 --> 00:31:33,800
Speaker 1: fighting the Twitter war on him on a daily basis.

641
00:31:33,800 --> 00:31:39,800
Speaker 1: Go ahead, Yeah, Josh Allen is a guy. If the

642
00:31:39,800 --> 00:31:41,760
Speaker 1: first thing you can tell me about a quarterback is

643
00:31:41,800 --> 00:31:43,520
Speaker 1: he has a cannon for an arm, it means he's

644
00:31:43,520 --> 00:31:46,240
Speaker 1: probably not a very good quarterback. Um, and that's the

645
00:31:46,320 --> 00:31:48,960
Speaker 1: case with Josh Allen. He has the strongest arm in

646
00:31:49,000 --> 00:31:51,760
Speaker 1: this stroft class, he has the strongest arm for in

647
00:31:51,880 --> 00:31:55,480
Speaker 1: most draft classes. But he's in an inaccurate quarterback. He's

648
00:31:55,520 --> 00:31:58,080
Speaker 1: a guy that hasn't been that good on a down

649
00:31:58,160 --> 00:32:01,760
Speaker 1: to down basis. The comp petition thing doesn't really wash

650
00:32:01,840 --> 00:32:04,800
Speaker 1: because the season before he was throwing to four different

651
00:32:04,920 --> 00:32:08,120
Speaker 1: NFL four different players that made the NFL at wyoming

652
00:32:08,400 --> 00:32:11,200
Speaker 1: and whatever you lose in terms of your competition, you're

653
00:32:11,240 --> 00:32:14,320
Speaker 1: supporting costs not being great. You also gained bank by

654
00:32:14,320 --> 00:32:16,160
Speaker 1: the fact that you're playing in the Mountain West, so

655
00:32:16,200 --> 00:32:19,360
Speaker 1: you're going up against guys that are pretty terrible as well. Um, Look,

656
00:32:19,440 --> 00:32:22,680
Speaker 1: Josh Allen is an ikea quarterback. There's a big box

657
00:32:22,720 --> 00:32:25,440
Speaker 1: and in there is a bunch of quarterback components and

658
00:32:25,480 --> 00:32:27,960
Speaker 1: you can't assemble the franchise quarterback out of the mall,

659
00:32:28,240 --> 00:32:30,520
Speaker 1: but you're gonna have to do it yourself. And you know,

660
00:32:30,560 --> 00:32:32,680
Speaker 1: the manual is in Swedish, so good luck with that.

661
00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:38,320
Speaker 1: It's an interesting way to describe. Love it. I love it,

662
00:32:38,360 --> 00:32:40,960
Speaker 1: by the way, Sam, he's my favorite quarterback in the draft.

663
00:32:41,040 --> 00:32:44,680
Speaker 1: But that's okay, Sam, great stuff. We appreciate the time,

664
00:32:44,680 --> 00:32:46,800
Speaker 1: my friend, enjoy the draft process, and we'll catch up

665
00:32:46,800 --> 00:32:49,880
Speaker 1: with you later in the offseason, right Bud, anytime. Taking

666
00:32:50,040 --> 00:32:52,320
Speaker 1: the guy. Sam Monson, a good friend, friend of the program,

667
00:32:52,320 --> 00:32:53,880
Speaker 1: does a great job, been joining us for years. And

668
00:32:53,880 --> 00:32:55,920
Speaker 1: again Pro Football Focus or Draft Guide is out, and

669
00:32:55,960 --> 00:33:00,000
Speaker 1: make sure you go check it out. Five pages of goodness.

670
00:33:00,080 --> 00:33:02,560
Speaker 1: I'm telling you, folks, this thing is a monster. It's

671
00:33:02,600 --> 00:33:08,040
Speaker 1: great and it's a good analytical um companion to some

672
00:33:08,080 --> 00:33:11,920
Speaker 1: of the other more scout bassist draft guys they have

673
00:33:12,040 --> 00:33:14,640
Speaker 1: out there well. And and that's what it is. It's

674
00:33:14,720 --> 00:33:17,400
Speaker 1: like if you're going to a restaurant and you want seafood,

675
00:33:17,440 --> 00:33:19,800
Speaker 1: you order seafood. If you want steak, you order steak.

676
00:33:20,120 --> 00:33:22,720
Speaker 1: If you want steak, and someone gives you seafood you

677
00:33:22,760 --> 00:33:26,080
Speaker 1: may not be happy with it. Um, Sam is right.

678
00:33:26,280 --> 00:33:30,080
Speaker 1: The the analysis is one thing, that data is another.

679
00:33:30,160 --> 00:33:32,560
Speaker 1: These guys are great with their data. I would never

680
00:33:32,640 --> 00:33:35,680
Speaker 1: dispute the fact that their data collection is incredible. And

681
00:33:35,720 --> 00:33:38,920
Speaker 1: if you're simply looking at it from a computer mathematics perspective,

682
00:33:39,840 --> 00:33:41,600
Speaker 1: how can you argue with the effort that they put

683
00:33:41,640 --> 00:33:43,600
Speaker 1: into this book. I mean, it's huge book, so it's

684
00:33:43,600 --> 00:33:47,080
Speaker 1: a it's an encyclopedia, it's a phone book. But that's

685
00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:50,600
Speaker 1: not necessarily what an old school guy looks at. And

686
00:33:50,640 --> 00:33:52,560
Speaker 1: by the way, they do admit that there's more to

687
00:33:52,640 --> 00:33:55,080
Speaker 1: it than they do absolutely all the time. And that's

688
00:33:55,120 --> 00:33:57,560
Speaker 1: why I appreciated Sam what he said. You know, I

689
00:33:57,600 --> 00:33:59,360
Speaker 1: got a bunch of analytics guys here who want to

690
00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:01,760
Speaker 1: kill the running acts, but we and we we don't

691
00:34:01,800 --> 00:34:05,120
Speaker 1: let them, because Sam is well aware that there is

692
00:34:05,400 --> 00:34:09,080
Speaker 1: much more to that that onion than than just the slipper.

693
00:34:09,560 --> 00:34:11,719
Speaker 1: And and that's the thing that I try to warn

694
00:34:11,760 --> 00:34:13,640
Speaker 1: people about all the time, to be a little careful

695
00:34:13,719 --> 00:34:15,759
Speaker 1: because we get people on Twitter and on our shot

696
00:34:15,840 --> 00:34:20,120
Speaker 1: all the time, fans who quote PFF numbers and believe

697
00:34:20,200 --> 00:34:23,480
Speaker 1: that that's the end of the story. It's not and

698
00:34:23,480 --> 00:34:27,040
Speaker 1: and any coach, GM or personnel director or scout will

699
00:34:27,080 --> 00:34:29,960
Speaker 1: tell you that, no question about it. It's putting all

700
00:34:30,000 --> 00:34:32,440
Speaker 1: the pieces of the puzzle together to come to a

701
00:34:32,480 --> 00:34:34,480
Speaker 1: final decision. John in Vegas, We're gonna go to a

702
00:34:34,480 --> 00:34:35,920
Speaker 1: guest here real quick. If you want to hang on

703
00:34:35,920 --> 00:34:37,200
Speaker 1: the line, I'll get to you after the guest. If

704
00:34:37,200 --> 00:34:38,920
Speaker 1: you want to call back, I'll make sure I get

705
00:34:38,960 --> 00:34:40,120
Speaker 1: you on before the end of the show as well

706
00:34:40,120 --> 00:34:41,759
Speaker 1: as your call John is up to you. But for

707
00:34:41,800 --> 00:34:44,680
Speaker 1: now we're drained by Charles Davis, second straight here. We've

708
00:34:44,719 --> 00:34:46,239
Speaker 1: had him on before the draft. Of course, you know

709
00:34:46,320 --> 00:34:48,680
Speaker 1: him from NFL Network and NFL on Fox as well.

710
00:34:48,719 --> 00:34:50,680
Speaker 1: Does the draft, does the pro game? No one better

711
00:34:50,640 --> 00:34:53,240
Speaker 1: to talk to about trying to figure out what college

712
00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:56,560
Speaker 1: prospects will translate to the NFL level. Charles, you got

713
00:34:56,600 --> 00:34:59,600
Speaker 1: John Schmelkin, Paul Detino here in these Rutherford, New Jersey.

714
00:34:59,640 --> 00:35:02,799
Speaker 1: How are you today? Hello, Charles, Hey, guys, it's good

715
00:35:02,840 --> 00:35:05,080
Speaker 1: to talk with you again. Thanks for having me back on.

716
00:35:05,320 --> 00:35:07,880
Speaker 1: And yeah, I'm sure John from Vegas will be calling

717
00:35:07,920 --> 00:35:12,600
Speaker 1: you back absolutely, Charles. All right, let's get to it here,

718
00:35:12,960 --> 00:35:15,800
Speaker 1: uh Giants and number two, let's start big picture first,

719
00:35:16,320 --> 00:35:19,920
Speaker 1: simply from a value standpoint, or the Giants making a

720
00:35:20,040 --> 00:35:23,080
Speaker 1: mistake if they don't take advantage of the situation the

721
00:35:23,160 --> 00:35:25,600
Speaker 1: draft a quarterback, or do you believe that one of

722
00:35:25,600 --> 00:35:27,600
Speaker 1: the position players and you can talk about what everyones

723
00:35:27,640 --> 00:35:31,320
Speaker 1: you want, are worth the value of staying at number

724
00:35:31,320 --> 00:35:34,520
Speaker 1: two and selecting them there rather than moving down in

725
00:35:34,560 --> 00:35:38,040
Speaker 1: the draft and acquiring more picks. Yeah, I think that

726
00:35:38,120 --> 00:35:40,680
Speaker 1: the position players that they can acquire right there at too,

727
00:35:41,200 --> 00:35:44,760
Speaker 1: are worth the value of not selecting a quarterback, because

728
00:35:46,120 --> 00:35:49,840
Speaker 1: this quarterback crop is plentiful. But I don't think that

729
00:35:49,840 --> 00:35:52,480
Speaker 1: there's a consensus across the board that this guy is

730
00:35:52,560 --> 00:35:55,120
Speaker 1: the guy, that guy is the guy. That's fair, right,

731
00:35:55,160 --> 00:35:56,879
Speaker 1: I mean you guys, you guys talk to the talk

732
00:35:56,880 --> 00:36:01,000
Speaker 1: to people everywhere. But let's just take some recent drafts. Clearly,

733
00:36:01,840 --> 00:36:04,439
Speaker 1: Mario and Winston were one and to pick your order

734
00:36:04,440 --> 00:36:08,799
Speaker 1: at their time. Correct, Okay, Then then goff and went

735
00:36:09,000 --> 00:36:13,120
Speaker 1: pick your order, same deal, distance themselves in this draft?

736
00:36:13,960 --> 00:36:17,400
Speaker 1: Where is the distance? If you like Donald best, you

737
00:36:17,440 --> 00:36:19,160
Speaker 1: will hear a lot of you know, well, I don't

738
00:36:19,160 --> 00:36:20,839
Speaker 1: like him for this reason, that reason that I like

739
00:36:21,400 --> 00:36:25,680
Speaker 1: Rosen or I like Alan, or I like Mayfield, and

740
00:36:25,719 --> 00:36:27,680
Speaker 1: I don't know that there's that type of a distance

741
00:36:27,719 --> 00:36:30,279
Speaker 1: in that pack. So they could all turn out to

742
00:36:30,320 --> 00:36:31,960
Speaker 1: be great, they could all turn out to be not

743
00:36:32,080 --> 00:36:34,799
Speaker 1: so great. It's probably somewhere in between. But when I

744
00:36:34,840 --> 00:36:36,880
Speaker 1: look at the value, what the Giants can get it too.

745
00:36:37,520 --> 00:36:39,600
Speaker 1: You can get Quinton Nelson, the guard from Notre Dame,

746
00:36:39,640 --> 00:36:41,680
Speaker 1: the best offensive lineman in the draft. You get say

747
00:36:41,760 --> 00:36:44,520
Speaker 1: Kwon Barkley, the running back the Penn State, the best

748
00:36:44,560 --> 00:36:47,480
Speaker 1: player in the draft. You get Bradley Chubb, the defensive

749
00:36:47,480 --> 00:36:50,160
Speaker 1: event from Auth Carolina State, the best defensive event edge

750
00:36:50,239 --> 00:36:52,920
Speaker 1: rusher in the draft. I kind of like my chances

751
00:36:52,960 --> 00:36:54,839
Speaker 1: with one of those guys as well. If I'm not

752
00:36:55,040 --> 00:37:00,440
Speaker 1: sold and I want that particular quarterback at number two. Well, Charles,

753
00:37:00,480 --> 00:37:03,480
Speaker 1: we all know, though, that the quarterback is the sexy position.

754
00:37:03,560 --> 00:37:05,480
Speaker 1: And there are so many folks who think that there

755
00:37:05,520 --> 00:37:07,880
Speaker 1: are a bunch of teams that will be desperate and

756
00:37:07,960 --> 00:37:12,160
Speaker 1: I mean desperate to make a call to Dave Gentleman

757
00:37:12,520 --> 00:37:15,279
Speaker 1: and back up a tractor trailer load of picks and

758
00:37:15,320 --> 00:37:19,279
Speaker 1: make a deal. Now, how likely do you think that is?

759
00:37:19,680 --> 00:37:22,040
Speaker 1: Given the fact that there are many of us who

760
00:37:22,080 --> 00:37:25,719
Speaker 1: think this quarterback class has flaws across the board and

761
00:37:25,760 --> 00:37:29,200
Speaker 1: really should not be worth trading a tractor trailer load

762
00:37:29,239 --> 00:37:32,719
Speaker 1: of picks four. I think that what will happen is

763
00:37:32,880 --> 00:37:36,920
Speaker 1: someone will come up and make that offer, But I

764
00:37:36,920 --> 00:37:39,799
Speaker 1: don't think it would be the tractor trailer load. I

765
00:37:39,920 --> 00:37:42,359
Speaker 1: just don't think that. I think your your second part

766
00:37:42,400 --> 00:37:44,800
Speaker 1: of what you said is quite closer to the truth,

767
00:37:45,680 --> 00:37:48,080
Speaker 1: and it's maybe not something we all want to identify

768
00:37:48,200 --> 00:37:51,320
Speaker 1: because when we talk draft, You're exactly right. The quarterbacks

769
00:37:51,320 --> 00:37:53,279
Speaker 1: are sexy, and that's what we want to focus on,

770
00:37:53,600 --> 00:37:56,920
Speaker 1: and that's what drives the chatter and drives the interest

771
00:37:56,960 --> 00:37:59,440
Speaker 1: in this thing. But when you really get up close,

772
00:38:00,200 --> 00:38:02,560
Speaker 1: are you going to give a tractor trailer load full

773
00:38:02,840 --> 00:38:06,840
Speaker 1: for anyone? Name your quarterback. If it had been Andrew

774
00:38:06,920 --> 00:38:09,680
Speaker 1: Luck when he came out, I think there would have

775
00:38:09,680 --> 00:38:12,399
Speaker 1: been more interest. I think people would have made that move.

776
00:38:12,760 --> 00:38:15,160
Speaker 1: I don't think that we're at that stage with this crew,

777
00:38:15,600 --> 00:38:17,839
Speaker 1: even though we don't know what's going to happen. One

778
00:38:17,840 --> 00:38:20,320
Speaker 1: of them may very well wear a gold jacket one day,

779
00:38:20,440 --> 00:38:24,560
Speaker 1: maybe even two, who knows. But right now and projecting them,

780
00:38:24,600 --> 00:38:26,319
Speaker 1: you're looking at all the things. I believe that you

781
00:38:26,400 --> 00:38:29,120
Speaker 1: mentioned that when you get them up close under the microscope,

782
00:38:29,920 --> 00:38:32,239
Speaker 1: you may see a few flaws that keep you from

783
00:38:32,239 --> 00:38:34,839
Speaker 1: bringing that tractor trailer with you. You might just bring

784
00:38:34,840 --> 00:38:39,680
Speaker 1: an suv and under those conditions, I think, from what

785
00:38:39,800 --> 00:38:42,839
Speaker 1: you said and we agree, than Dave Gentleman should just

786
00:38:42,880 --> 00:38:45,440
Speaker 1: make the pick. Have conviction in somebody and take the

787
00:38:45,440 --> 00:38:48,680
Speaker 1: guy you want. And you guys have met Coach Gentleman.

788
00:38:48,760 --> 00:38:51,200
Speaker 1: You've known Coach Gentleman for a while, probably from the

789
00:38:51,239 --> 00:38:53,840
Speaker 1: first time he was with the Giants. Ever met a

790
00:38:53,880 --> 00:38:56,120
Speaker 1: man who, ever met a man who doesn't have who

791
00:38:56,160 --> 00:38:58,840
Speaker 1: has more conviction than Dave Gentleman decided to do something

792
00:38:58,920 --> 00:39:01,080
Speaker 1: and by the way, doesn't give a damn what other

793
00:39:01,080 --> 00:39:04,640
Speaker 1: people think. You know, he doesn't. You know, what's the

794
00:39:04,680 --> 00:39:06,960
Speaker 1: old Chris Roth routine about? Does he give you know,

795
00:39:07,480 --> 00:39:11,880
Speaker 1: a certain number of leaps to get zero? Beliep Yeah, Okay,

796
00:39:12,040 --> 00:39:15,200
Speaker 1: that's that's that's coach, and that's how he's been. I'm

797
00:39:15,280 --> 00:39:17,960
Speaker 1: fortunate enough I played against coach at high school and

798
00:39:17,960 --> 00:39:20,120
Speaker 1: have had the pleasure of knowing him for a long time.

799
00:39:20,520 --> 00:39:22,480
Speaker 1: I have no bat phone to him, I have no

800
00:39:22,560 --> 00:39:25,640
Speaker 1: inside information. I've been fired him for a long time.

801
00:39:25,800 --> 00:39:28,239
Speaker 1: And one thing that I've admired has when coach makes

802
00:39:28,239 --> 00:39:30,640
Speaker 1: a decision, off he goes, and no one sleeps better

803
00:39:30,640 --> 00:39:32,960
Speaker 1: than Dave Gentleman. You know, Charles, I want to dig

804
00:39:33,000 --> 00:39:35,000
Speaker 1: in a little bit more on on s Kwon Barkley

805
00:39:35,000 --> 00:39:37,879
Speaker 1: were joined by Charles Davis some NFL network. The way

806
00:39:37,960 --> 00:39:40,160
Speaker 1: I see him as a player is he's not gonna

807
00:39:40,160 --> 00:39:42,719
Speaker 1: be a guy that's gonna, you know, pounded twenty five

808
00:39:42,800 --> 00:39:45,480
Speaker 1: to twenty eight times a game like Ezekiel Elliott, but

809
00:39:45,560 --> 00:39:47,600
Speaker 1: he's gonna be a weapon in a different way. And

810
00:39:47,600 --> 00:39:49,560
Speaker 1: I use the word weapon instead of running back for

811
00:39:49,600 --> 00:39:51,359
Speaker 1: a reason. I think he's a guy that will give

812
00:39:51,400 --> 00:39:53,920
Speaker 1: you seventeen eighteen carries, but you're gonna be able to

813
00:39:53,960 --> 00:39:56,160
Speaker 1: use him in the past games split him out? Why

814
00:39:56,280 --> 00:39:58,319
Speaker 1: get him six to eight to nine touches in the

815
00:39:58,360 --> 00:40:00,640
Speaker 1: passing game? And he is to be a guy that,

816
00:40:00,680 --> 00:40:03,960
Speaker 1: if you use him right, maybe won't churn out yards

817
00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:06,920
Speaker 1: like Zeke Elliott, but can affect the game in just

818
00:40:07,000 --> 00:40:08,680
Speaker 1: as big of a way if you use him in

819
00:40:08,680 --> 00:40:10,359
Speaker 1: the passing game the right way. Do you agree with that?

820
00:40:11,320 --> 00:40:14,200
Speaker 1: I agree totally with that. And and let's go ahead.

821
00:40:14,280 --> 00:40:16,239
Speaker 1: You know, we all make comparisons, and you use the

822
00:40:16,239 --> 00:40:19,239
Speaker 1: one with Zeke Elliott and why say Klon Barkley would

823
00:40:19,280 --> 00:40:21,920
Speaker 1: be different. I think it's an apt comparison that you've made.

824
00:40:22,600 --> 00:40:25,080
Speaker 1: Work with me here on this one. If you're gonna

825
00:40:25,160 --> 00:40:27,640
Speaker 1: use say Kawan Barkley the way that we're talking about,

826
00:40:27,680 --> 00:40:30,759
Speaker 1: and it can be a premium way. You're talking about

827
00:40:30,800 --> 00:40:33,080
Speaker 1: an edge Er and James type of a player. You're

828
00:40:33,120 --> 00:40:37,040
Speaker 1: talking about a Matt Forte type of a player. Marshall, talk, guys,

829
00:40:37,719 --> 00:40:41,160
Speaker 1: a Marshall falk type of a player. Okay, Now, Marshall

830
00:40:41,200 --> 00:40:44,120
Speaker 1: was extremely special, you guys. You guys know you watched

831
00:40:44,160 --> 00:40:47,120
Speaker 1: him for all those years. Say Kwan is a bigger

832
00:40:47,239 --> 00:40:51,440
Speaker 1: version of him. But but Marshall, oh my god, there

833
00:40:51,520 --> 00:40:54,600
Speaker 1: wasn't anything you couldn't do with him. Say Kwan gives

834
00:40:54,600 --> 00:40:57,480
Speaker 1: you that same potential. Now he'll have to realize that

835
00:40:57,560 --> 00:40:59,680
Speaker 1: out on the field. Marshall, we know did it and

836
00:40:59,800 --> 00:41:02,000
Speaker 1: was a Hall of Famer. But this that type of

837
00:41:02,040 --> 00:41:04,799
Speaker 1: a player. Do you what you described? That's what I'm

838
00:41:04,880 --> 00:41:07,320
Speaker 1: That's what I'm describing back to you with with certain

839
00:41:07,360 --> 00:41:10,919
Speaker 1: player comparisons. Falk hits big. I think four k Hits

840
00:41:10,920 --> 00:41:13,440
Speaker 1: remember the beginning of Fourte's career. I mean he was

841
00:41:13,440 --> 00:41:15,759
Speaker 1: gonna run for a thousand, he's gonna catch it for

842
00:41:15,840 --> 00:41:19,360
Speaker 1: big yardage. Remember when Roger Craig was in his prime

843
00:41:19,840 --> 00:41:21,560
Speaker 1: and was seeking to run for a run for a

844
00:41:21,600 --> 00:41:24,920
Speaker 1: thousand and catch for about Thomas too, the old school

845
00:41:25,120 --> 00:41:28,279
Speaker 1: Thurman Thomas. That's what those guys can give you, and

846
00:41:28,560 --> 00:41:32,719
Speaker 1: the intelligence to play the game, to understand pass protection,

847
00:41:33,200 --> 00:41:35,640
Speaker 1: understand how do you know how to maneuver work with

848
00:41:35,760 --> 00:41:38,279
Speaker 1: your quarterback to get in the right spot to help him.

849
00:41:38,480 --> 00:41:41,600
Speaker 1: That's another big part of those types of those guys games.

850
00:41:41,840 --> 00:41:44,759
Speaker 1: They thought right in sync with the quarterback. Charles has

851
00:41:44,800 --> 00:41:47,120
Speaker 1: been doing us a long time, and what I've come

852
00:41:47,200 --> 00:41:49,719
Speaker 1: to realize over the years is that a lot of

853
00:41:49,800 --> 00:41:53,040
Speaker 1: the trends that that are either in the beginning of

854
00:41:53,160 --> 00:41:55,959
Speaker 1: their happening or even have gone on for a few years,

855
00:41:56,520 --> 00:42:01,400
Speaker 1: seems to then affect somehow, some way the way coaches

856
00:42:01,440 --> 00:42:05,080
Speaker 1: and gms are gonna proceed moving forward. There's a trend

857
00:42:05,280 --> 00:42:10,080
Speaker 1: right now that defensive tackles are becoming better pass washers,

858
00:42:10,440 --> 00:42:13,040
Speaker 1: they're getting they're getting more pressure on the quarterback, and

859
00:42:13,200 --> 00:42:16,040
Speaker 1: so now all of a sudden, people are starting to

860
00:42:16,120 --> 00:42:19,759
Speaker 1: say that centers and guards are holding more value than

861
00:42:19,800 --> 00:42:22,960
Speaker 1: they ever have before. Do you agree with that? And

862
00:42:23,239 --> 00:42:25,760
Speaker 1: is it time then to say a guy like Quentin

863
00:42:25,840 --> 00:42:29,719
Speaker 1: Nelson is worthy of a number two pick. Yeah, and

864
00:42:30,080 --> 00:42:32,800
Speaker 1: I agree totally with it. And we can trace it

865
00:42:32,840 --> 00:42:35,600
Speaker 1: back to a number of places. One place we can

866
00:42:35,640 --> 00:42:38,400
Speaker 1: trace it the Giants beating the Patriots and Super Bowls.

867
00:42:39,520 --> 00:42:41,800
Speaker 1: Think about the pressure that was put on Tom Brady

868
00:42:41,840 --> 00:42:45,160
Speaker 1: and it wasn't all edge pressure. Think about the Super

869
00:42:45,239 --> 00:42:48,320
Speaker 1: Bowl Seattle had with New England. And if Cliff Avriel

870
00:42:48,400 --> 00:42:50,520
Speaker 1: does not get hurt, remember what he was doing going

871
00:42:50,560 --> 00:42:53,160
Speaker 1: inside with Michael Bennett and going right in the teeth

872
00:42:53,239 --> 00:42:55,320
Speaker 1: of him and right in the faith. And when he

873
00:42:55,400 --> 00:42:57,080
Speaker 1: went out of the game and they weren't giving that

874
00:42:57,120 --> 00:43:00,879
Speaker 1: same gut pressure, the game changed. Elson is the best

875
00:43:00,920 --> 00:43:04,200
Speaker 1: offensive lineman in this draft, guard, center, or tackle. So

876
00:43:04,520 --> 00:43:07,000
Speaker 1: you have to value and respect him. And now you

877
00:43:07,120 --> 00:43:08,800
Speaker 1: put him in there. And what I've been saying for

878
00:43:08,880 --> 00:43:12,600
Speaker 1: a while is he may not go where he's rated

879
00:43:12,640 --> 00:43:14,600
Speaker 1: in terms of how he is as a player, maybe

880
00:43:14,640 --> 00:43:17,520
Speaker 1: maybe the number two player in the draft. But whoever

881
00:43:17,680 --> 00:43:20,080
Speaker 1: gets him is getting a flat out jewel. And I'm

882
00:43:20,080 --> 00:43:22,080
Speaker 1: gonna tell you a team that flat out and needs him.

883
00:43:22,560 --> 00:43:26,000
Speaker 1: That's Chicago Bears. If you go with Mintel Drabinsky and

884
00:43:26,080 --> 00:43:29,480
Speaker 1: go from three to two and make your move if

885
00:43:29,560 --> 00:43:31,840
Speaker 1: you can get now Quentin Nelson this year, and I

886
00:43:31,880 --> 00:43:33,800
Speaker 1: don't know if he'll be there for them, but imagine

887
00:43:33,840 --> 00:43:36,440
Speaker 1: if he is, they should run to the podium and say,

888
00:43:36,520 --> 00:43:39,279
Speaker 1: here's our card. Because now you take Cody White here

889
00:43:39,320 --> 00:43:41,520
Speaker 1: and put him back at center. You get Kyle Long

890
00:43:41,640 --> 00:43:44,320
Speaker 1: back from his his surgeries, and you put Nelson in

891
00:43:44,400 --> 00:43:47,000
Speaker 1: at guard, and you're helping out your young quarterback. And

892
00:43:47,080 --> 00:43:49,319
Speaker 1: by the way, you're getting a little doubt from Jordan

893
00:43:49,400 --> 00:43:51,839
Speaker 1: Howard and Tarik Cohen too little from the ball. We've

894
00:43:51,880 --> 00:43:55,160
Speaker 1: been better. So to me, it's a screaming need. And

895
00:43:55,280 --> 00:43:57,440
Speaker 1: I know people are gunshot because of that draft. And

896
00:43:57,480 --> 00:43:59,719
Speaker 1: we had a few years ago with Jonathan Cooper, chance

897
00:43:59,760 --> 00:44:02,520
Speaker 1: more back we have, you know, dju, we had all

898
00:44:02,560 --> 00:44:05,520
Speaker 1: those guards that didn't pan out the way people wanted.

899
00:44:05,840 --> 00:44:13,759
Speaker 1: But people have to remember that drafts in the super draft, correct, Yeah,

900
00:44:13,800 --> 00:44:15,520
Speaker 1: And if you go back, that's actually been one of

901
00:44:15,560 --> 00:44:18,600
Speaker 1: the weakest drafts. And in recent years we're drawn by

902
00:44:18,680 --> 00:44:21,640
Speaker 1: Charles Davis. You know, Charles, when you look at the

903
00:44:21,760 --> 00:44:23,920
Speaker 1: top of the second round and the Giants have the

904
00:44:24,719 --> 00:44:27,400
Speaker 1: overall pick in this draft, I see depth at a

905
00:44:27,520 --> 00:44:29,400
Speaker 1: lot of different positions. I think you might have a

906
00:44:29,440 --> 00:44:32,080
Speaker 1: first round caliber corner at the top there. If they

907
00:44:32,080 --> 00:44:34,520
Speaker 1: don't go Barkley in the first round, you could get

908
00:44:34,640 --> 00:44:36,520
Speaker 1: a very good running back. At the top of that

909
00:44:36,640 --> 00:44:39,040
Speaker 1: second round. You can even get a very good interior

910
00:44:39,160 --> 00:44:42,719
Speaker 1: offensive lineman. Probably you go through those groups, or maybe

911
00:44:42,760 --> 00:44:44,120
Speaker 1: you think there's someone else and there that I'm not

912
00:44:44,160 --> 00:44:46,200
Speaker 1: including in terms of a position. Can go right ahead?

913
00:44:46,480 --> 00:44:48,600
Speaker 1: Where do you think the best value is gonna be

914
00:44:49,160 --> 00:44:53,000
Speaker 1: at thirty four for n Y g oh Man. Look,

915
00:44:53,120 --> 00:44:56,120
Speaker 1: if if Barkley turns out not to be the pick,

916
00:44:57,400 --> 00:44:59,279
Speaker 1: you'll have a choice of runners at the top of

917
00:44:59,280 --> 00:45:03,040
Speaker 1: the second round. Yeah, whether whether it's a Darius Gwiss,

918
00:45:03,560 --> 00:45:07,200
Speaker 1: whether it's a Sony Michelle, whether it's a Nick Chubb.

919
00:45:07,320 --> 00:45:10,640
Speaker 1: But carry on, Johnson of a shot Penny, you know

920
00:45:10,719 --> 00:45:13,319
Speaker 1: what I mean. I mean, you're gonna, You're you're gonna,

921
00:45:13,480 --> 00:45:14,880
Speaker 1: and you don't have to go right there in the

922
00:45:14,920 --> 00:45:17,520
Speaker 1: second round to get him. You mentioned a corner at

923
00:45:17,560 --> 00:45:20,399
Speaker 1: the time, and Isaiah Oliver could still be sitting there

924
00:45:20,440 --> 00:45:23,479
Speaker 1: from Colorado, a god with length. And you know something,

925
00:45:23,520 --> 00:45:26,719
Speaker 1: they've turned out players now a Judoba Woozier look pretty

926
00:45:26,760 --> 00:45:28,400
Speaker 1: well for the Giants last year coming out of that

927
00:45:28,480 --> 00:45:31,960
Speaker 1: same system. So you know, I assumeing the Cowboys. My

928
00:45:32,080 --> 00:45:35,160
Speaker 1: my apologies, but so so when you put it all together, Yeah,

929
00:45:35,280 --> 00:45:37,319
Speaker 1: there's gonna be some talent out there, and you're gonna

930
00:45:37,719 --> 00:45:42,280
Speaker 1: look and Isaiah Win tackle guard from Georgia, is sitting

931
00:45:42,360 --> 00:45:45,200
Speaker 1: right on that border about someone may snatch him in

932
00:45:45,239 --> 00:45:47,719
Speaker 1: the first round, but he could easily get into the

933
00:45:47,800 --> 00:45:50,680
Speaker 1: second and you're getting a first round player in my opinion,

934
00:45:51,080 --> 00:45:52,879
Speaker 1: right there at the top of the second round because

935
00:45:52,920 --> 00:45:55,360
Speaker 1: I've had him going to Atlanta for a while. You know,

936
00:45:55,680 --> 00:45:57,680
Speaker 1: I've got him. Look at the Seattle could could could

937
00:45:57,760 --> 00:45:59,920
Speaker 1: use him in a big way. Even though that they four,

938
00:46:00,440 --> 00:46:02,719
Speaker 1: they feel like they fortified their offensive line, they still

939
00:46:02,760 --> 00:46:05,400
Speaker 1: need help their number of players. Hey, the New England

940
00:46:05,440 --> 00:46:08,120
Speaker 1: Patriots if they want to keep him in because he

941
00:46:08,160 --> 00:46:10,640
Speaker 1: can play tackle. I think he's going to be better

942
00:46:10,719 --> 00:46:13,360
Speaker 1: inside and guard, but he can play tackle and he

943
00:46:13,440 --> 00:46:15,760
Speaker 1: can start for you there. So we've got a number

944
00:46:15,800 --> 00:46:17,880
Speaker 1: of places that we can go and it's gonna be

945
00:46:17,920 --> 00:46:19,920
Speaker 1: in because they're gonna be some first round guys. To

946
00:46:20,040 --> 00:46:22,920
Speaker 1: your point, they are gonna get pushed. How about you

947
00:46:23,560 --> 00:46:26,239
Speaker 1: mentioned the defensive tackles and how important they've become. Now

948
00:46:26,719 --> 00:46:29,120
Speaker 1: Deron Payne from Alabama is going to be an interration

949
00:46:29,200 --> 00:46:33,160
Speaker 1: in case study because the recent guys from Babama, their

950
00:46:33,200 --> 00:46:37,239
Speaker 1: strength has been in run stopping jarn Reid, A Shawan Robinson,

951
00:46:37,640 --> 00:46:40,800
Speaker 1: those guys. This guy's a little bit better pass rusher.

952
00:46:41,400 --> 00:46:44,200
Speaker 1: But again, people may see him from Obama and push

953
00:46:44,280 --> 00:46:46,279
Speaker 1: him to the second round and you may get a

954
00:46:46,360 --> 00:46:49,399
Speaker 1: value there. Charles is a guy who played this game

955
00:46:49,520 --> 00:46:51,640
Speaker 1: and who does study both n C Double A and

956
00:46:51,760 --> 00:46:54,719
Speaker 1: NFL football these days. Well, we just talked to Sam

957
00:46:54,760 --> 00:46:58,080
Speaker 1: Wnson a Pro Football focus and analytics have become so

958
00:46:58,360 --> 00:47:01,640
Speaker 1: critical now to what guys are looking at. But we

959
00:47:01,800 --> 00:47:04,319
Speaker 1: all know that's not the big picture. It's only one

960
00:47:04,360 --> 00:47:07,560
Speaker 1: slice of the orange. I'm curious from your perspective, since

961
00:47:07,600 --> 00:47:09,279
Speaker 1: you've been doing this a long time and have seen

962
00:47:09,320 --> 00:47:13,120
Speaker 1: all the levels and played, how do you feel the

963
00:47:13,320 --> 00:47:17,080
Speaker 1: the NFL is adapting to the usage of analytics. How

964
00:47:17,239 --> 00:47:21,000
Speaker 1: much of the percentage is overtaking maybe what the scouts

965
00:47:21,160 --> 00:47:23,600
Speaker 1: I is telling him. Where do we stand with that

966
00:47:23,800 --> 00:47:27,319
Speaker 1: right now? Good? That's a great question, and I think

967
00:47:27,440 --> 00:47:29,680
Speaker 1: we are sifting our way through it and trying to

968
00:47:29,760 --> 00:47:33,160
Speaker 1: figure out what our levels are. And I think one

969
00:47:33,200 --> 00:47:37,400
Speaker 1: thing that we have not discussed, and you guys probably have. Okay,

970
00:47:37,520 --> 00:47:39,239
Speaker 1: but I'm gonna bring it in from my from my

971
00:47:39,400 --> 00:47:43,040
Speaker 1: outside world. Analytics have been around the game since we

972
00:47:43,120 --> 00:47:48,520
Speaker 1: started playing them. We just didn't call him antaly. We

973
00:47:48,640 --> 00:47:52,440
Speaker 1: call them tendencies. Right, yeah, I mean, you turn on

974
00:47:52,600 --> 00:47:54,839
Speaker 1: you turn on the movie remember the Titans, and here

975
00:47:54,880 --> 00:47:57,720
Speaker 1: comes coach of Boone sliding across the bashef sheet of papers.

976
00:47:57,760 --> 00:48:00,719
Speaker 1: The coach Osten said, I had mischief. Your grimes from

977
00:48:00,760 --> 00:48:03,560
Speaker 1: the mass department watched their last three games, and here's

978
00:48:03,560 --> 00:48:07,280
Speaker 1: a breakdown of what they did as analytics. We didn't

979
00:48:07,320 --> 00:48:11,680
Speaker 1: call it that now because of the baseball and the moneyball,

980
00:48:12,360 --> 00:48:14,720
Speaker 1: and analytics got a bad rap because of what happened

981
00:48:14,760 --> 00:48:17,880
Speaker 1: in Cleveland. Okay, but when you really look at it,

982
00:48:18,160 --> 00:48:21,040
Speaker 1: when you look at Cleveland over the last couple of years,

983
00:48:21,080 --> 00:48:24,279
Speaker 1: Sashi Brown has been drummed out, Paul Dupodess has been

984
00:48:24,360 --> 00:48:27,280
Speaker 1: drummed out. The analytics thing has caught a lot of grief.

985
00:48:27,880 --> 00:48:30,840
Speaker 1: They actually did fortify their roster, they just didn't win games.

986
00:48:31,800 --> 00:48:33,640
Speaker 1: I mean, you look at that draft last year. You

987
00:48:33,719 --> 00:48:35,680
Speaker 1: can't tell me that that draft last year was not

988
00:48:35,760 --> 00:48:38,480
Speaker 1: a professional football draft. And you can call it whatever

989
00:48:38,560 --> 00:48:42,040
Speaker 1: you want to getting Jabrill Peppers, David and Joe Coup

990
00:48:42,080 --> 00:48:44,600
Speaker 1: and Miles Garrett all in the first round, three big

991
00:48:44,680 --> 00:48:47,440
Speaker 1: time players, that really good stuff. Call it, we call

992
00:48:47,520 --> 00:48:50,320
Speaker 1: it what you want to call it, of analytics, not

993
00:48:50,440 --> 00:48:53,680
Speaker 1: analysts whatever. That was a big draft. But those guys

994
00:48:53,760 --> 00:48:56,120
Speaker 1: call it bad rap on that and they're out. But

995
00:48:56,200 --> 00:48:58,680
Speaker 1: guess what, ten years from now, we'll look back and go,

996
00:48:58,800 --> 00:49:00,560
Speaker 1: you know something, they might have known a few things.

997
00:49:00,960 --> 00:49:02,879
Speaker 1: And that's where a little big well, I guess part

998
00:49:02,960 --> 00:49:05,719
Speaker 1: of part of the question, and I think it's it's

999
00:49:05,800 --> 00:49:07,880
Speaker 1: for the old school guys like me who think that

1000
00:49:07,960 --> 00:49:10,560
Speaker 1: maybe they're taking it too far. When you're talking about

1001
00:49:10,640 --> 00:49:13,000
Speaker 1: the rotation of the ball when the punters kicking it.

1002
00:49:13,480 --> 00:49:17,680
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, they're they're getting so so computerized,

1003
00:49:17,840 --> 00:49:21,200
Speaker 1: so scientific, Charles, I wonder if they're not pushing the

1004
00:49:21,360 --> 00:49:24,759
Speaker 1: envelope so strong that they almost do themselves at the

1005
00:49:24,920 --> 00:49:27,880
Speaker 1: service when they when they come at you with numbers

1006
00:49:27,960 --> 00:49:30,839
Speaker 1: like that, because you know, there's not a scout the world,

1007
00:49:32,320 --> 00:49:35,480
Speaker 1: you know, you know what I mean, it does some degree,

1008
00:49:35,760 --> 00:49:40,239
Speaker 1: aren't the computerized numbers just a little bit overdone at

1009
00:49:40,320 --> 00:49:42,719
Speaker 1: times they are. And if you're using the computer to

1010
00:49:42,840 --> 00:49:46,080
Speaker 1: justify everything that you do, I would say the answer

1011
00:49:46,160 --> 00:49:49,239
Speaker 1: is going to be yes. But if the computer and

1012
00:49:49,400 --> 00:49:52,359
Speaker 1: you're true to it. Remember computers only spit out when

1013
00:49:52,440 --> 00:49:54,880
Speaker 1: we put in as humans. Right, So you've got a

1014
00:49:54,960 --> 00:49:58,160
Speaker 1: program that computer for what you want. What are you

1015
00:49:58,280 --> 00:50:00,520
Speaker 1: looking for? What is your baseline? What is this? What

1016
00:50:00,760 --> 00:50:03,080
Speaker 1: is that? But if you're going to take the computer

1017
00:50:03,320 --> 00:50:05,759
Speaker 1: and change the formula in the middle of what you're

1018
00:50:05,800 --> 00:50:08,840
Speaker 1: doing to justify what you want, then you're screwing the

1019
00:50:08,920 --> 00:50:11,640
Speaker 1: whole thing up. So if he if you're saying you're

1020
00:50:11,680 --> 00:50:14,799
Speaker 1: your corners have to be between five eleven and three

1021
00:50:14,880 --> 00:50:18,840
Speaker 1: eights right and six ft two and whatever, and you

1022
00:50:18,920 --> 00:50:20,440
Speaker 1: all of a sudden say, well, I really like that

1023
00:50:20,520 --> 00:50:23,040
Speaker 1: six four corner. I'm gonna tweak it a little so

1024
00:50:23,120 --> 00:50:27,319
Speaker 1: I can ye see were that's what we're getting. You've

1025
00:50:27,440 --> 00:50:30,399
Speaker 1: changed the game and now you're drafting Willie Nilly again.

1026
00:50:30,440 --> 00:50:32,080
Speaker 1: You might as well go back to Street and Smith

1027
00:50:32,160 --> 00:50:34,920
Speaker 1: like they used to. Who may do all American teams?

1028
00:50:35,400 --> 00:50:40,160
Speaker 1: Is that Coslook? Is that Cosloy used to do that?

1029
00:50:40,640 --> 00:50:42,600
Speaker 1: And many years ago in the fifties. He looked through

1030
00:50:42,640 --> 00:50:45,360
Speaker 1: the book and he just picked guys out, and that

1031
00:50:45,560 --> 00:50:48,320
Speaker 1: talent was done back then because we didn't have scouting

1032
00:50:48,440 --> 00:50:50,799
Speaker 1: services at the whole deal. And I always come back

1033
00:50:50,880 --> 00:50:54,800
Speaker 1: to this, guys, even the great ones are going to

1034
00:50:54,880 --> 00:50:57,880
Speaker 1: make mistakes along the west. I remember the great, the

1035
00:50:57,960 --> 00:51:01,160
Speaker 1: great Bill Walsh. There's gonna be no better quarterback guru

1036
00:51:01,280 --> 00:51:04,400
Speaker 1: ever than Bill Walsh. Right. I remember one year he

1037
00:51:04,600 --> 00:51:08,400
Speaker 1: said that the most NFL ready quarterback in this year's

1038
00:51:08,480 --> 00:51:13,000
Speaker 1: draft is John Beck from b y u H. How

1039
00:51:13,040 --> 00:51:16,480
Speaker 1: did that go? Okay? So so so so he not.

1040
00:51:16,760 --> 00:51:19,160
Speaker 1: You know, we're all going to make mistakes. I remember

1041
00:51:19,239 --> 00:51:22,120
Speaker 1: reading Ernie. Of course, he's fantastic book, and you guys

1042
00:51:22,200 --> 00:51:24,600
Speaker 1: probably read it as well. It's one of my favorite

1043
00:51:24,760 --> 00:51:27,920
Speaker 1: passages ever, was him talking about being with the Browns,

1044
00:51:27,960 --> 00:51:30,359
Speaker 1: a young guy at the time, and they were having

1045
00:51:30,400 --> 00:51:33,319
Speaker 1: the draft and Paul Brown wanted a quarterback that year,

1046
00:51:33,960 --> 00:51:37,240
Speaker 1: and all the quarterbacks he wanted went off the board

1047
00:51:37,360 --> 00:51:40,279
Speaker 1: and the last pick before him, I forgot who it was,

1048
00:51:40,480 --> 00:51:43,080
Speaker 1: or All Moral or Len Dawson or something like that.

1049
00:51:43,600 --> 00:51:46,759
Speaker 1: They make the pick and you know, back then, you

1050
00:51:46,840 --> 00:51:49,360
Speaker 1: did everything by you know, speaker phone hook up with

1051
00:51:49,440 --> 00:51:52,399
Speaker 1: the league office right now, you know everybody's going that way.

1052
00:51:52,719 --> 00:51:54,759
Speaker 1: And I remember Ernie, of course he describing that. You

1053
00:51:54,800 --> 00:51:57,120
Speaker 1: probably remember where he said, Paul Brown's head hit the

1054
00:51:57,239 --> 00:52:00,560
Speaker 1: hit the table, and of course no one spoke because

1055
00:52:00,600 --> 00:52:04,439
Speaker 1: it was Mr Brown. And finally you're the mis embodied voice. Day.

1056
00:52:05,600 --> 00:52:13,440
Speaker 1: I guess we have to take Jim Brown devastated, did

1057
00:52:13,520 --> 00:52:21,000
Speaker 1: not want Jim Brown to save his life. Guess what, Charles,

1058
00:52:21,080 --> 00:52:23,239
Speaker 1: I I have a big picture question. I think this

1059
00:52:23,320 --> 00:52:26,000
Speaker 1: has kind of been a debate that's been going back

1060
00:52:26,080 --> 00:52:29,440
Speaker 1: thirty forty years in scatting. Do you draft traits or

1061
00:52:29,520 --> 00:52:32,919
Speaker 1: do you draft football skills? And I think you get

1062
00:52:33,000 --> 00:52:35,600
Speaker 1: to a point now with limited practice time in the

1063
00:52:35,719 --> 00:52:39,000
Speaker 1: NFL that the question really becomes even more important because

1064
00:52:39,560 --> 00:52:43,120
Speaker 1: it's more difficult to take athletic traits and turn them

1065
00:52:43,160 --> 00:52:47,959
Speaker 1: into good production and football skills. Do you think front

1066
00:52:48,000 --> 00:52:51,759
Speaker 1: offices are making adjustments? Have an adjustments been made where

1067
00:52:51,800 --> 00:52:53,759
Speaker 1: maybe they look at a guy like Calvin Ridley and

1068
00:52:53,800 --> 00:52:57,160
Speaker 1: they say that guy runs NFL routes, but oh boy,

1069
00:52:57,239 --> 00:52:59,560
Speaker 1: Courtland Sutton is six four and you know he runs

1070
00:52:59,600 --> 00:53:01,720
Speaker 1: this and this, and he's big, but he can't run rounds.

1071
00:53:01,960 --> 00:53:05,040
Speaker 1: Are they kind of wrapping their heads around the new

1072
00:53:05,120 --> 00:53:08,160
Speaker 1: reality where maybe you have to think about drafting more

1073
00:53:08,200 --> 00:53:10,600
Speaker 1: complete football players because you don't have the time to

1074
00:53:10,680 --> 00:53:14,040
Speaker 1: develop guys the way you used to. I think that's

1075
00:53:14,040 --> 00:53:16,480
Speaker 1: a great point, and I think that the best teams

1076
00:53:17,120 --> 00:53:19,640
Speaker 1: have been doing that and we'll continue to do that.

1077
00:53:20,040 --> 00:53:22,879
Speaker 1: But it all comes back to when people talk about

1078
00:53:23,000 --> 00:53:28,439
Speaker 1: organizational philosophies that everyone is in sync all the way down.

1079
00:53:29,080 --> 00:53:31,760
Speaker 1: You know, it's like talking about I'm gonna take baseball

1080
00:53:31,800 --> 00:53:34,879
Speaker 1: into it. When we were growing up. Okay, I'm fifty three,

1081
00:53:35,239 --> 00:53:37,279
Speaker 1: all right, so I'm gonna tell you that. But now

1082
00:53:37,360 --> 00:53:39,920
Speaker 1: you had a mindset about what what time frame I

1083
00:53:40,000 --> 00:53:44,200
Speaker 1: grew up When I grew up in baseball, you played

1084
00:53:44,239 --> 00:53:49,560
Speaker 1: baseball the Orioles way. They had a manual. The Dodger's way.

1085
00:53:49,760 --> 00:53:52,920
Speaker 1: They had a manual. This is what we expect, this

1086
00:53:53,120 --> 00:53:55,120
Speaker 1: is what we look for. These are the drills we do.

1087
00:53:55,400 --> 00:53:57,839
Speaker 1: This is what's important to us, and they cut out

1088
00:53:57,880 --> 00:54:01,200
Speaker 1: the chaff about what's not important to them. The best

1089
00:54:01,320 --> 00:54:05,640
Speaker 1: organizations in football do that now. And I remember talking

1090
00:54:05,719 --> 00:54:08,480
Speaker 1: to someone recently and again Bill Walsh comes into play,

1091
00:54:08,760 --> 00:54:10,800
Speaker 1: and they would sit around and have their scouting meetings

1092
00:54:10,840 --> 00:54:12,400
Speaker 1: and the whole thing, and you don't want as soon

1093
00:54:12,480 --> 00:54:14,080
Speaker 1: as the scout was starting to tell you what a

1094
00:54:14,080 --> 00:54:16,480
Speaker 1: player couldn't do, he cut off the converts. I want

1095
00:54:16,520 --> 00:54:19,440
Speaker 1: to hear that tell me what he can do and

1096
00:54:19,520 --> 00:54:21,960
Speaker 1: how does that relate to what we do and are

1097
00:54:22,040 --> 00:54:24,759
Speaker 1: we getting and is that something we needed our organization.

1098
00:54:25,160 --> 00:54:29,279
Speaker 1: When you have that clear philosophy and everyone knows what

1099
00:54:29,400 --> 00:54:33,480
Speaker 1: you're scouting into and what you're looking for, that's when

1100
00:54:33,520 --> 00:54:35,480
Speaker 1: you have the best teams in the league, the best

1101
00:54:35,520 --> 00:54:38,680
Speaker 1: scouting in the league, the best organizations that sustain in

1102
00:54:38,760 --> 00:54:41,680
Speaker 1: the league, because there's no gray area on the whole thing.

1103
00:54:42,160 --> 00:54:44,879
Speaker 1: You're not gonna all of a sudden interject that guy

1104
00:54:45,000 --> 00:54:48,440
Speaker 1: into the conversation that doesn't fit with your organizations philosophy

1105
00:54:48,560 --> 00:54:50,800
Speaker 1: is because if so, you're gonna get kicked out of

1106
00:54:50,840 --> 00:54:53,920
Speaker 1: the room. That's not what we do, and who hired

1107
00:54:53,960 --> 00:54:57,680
Speaker 1: you in the first place? What we do that's that's

1108
00:54:57,760 --> 00:54:59,239
Speaker 1: those are the ones that do it. Now. Would you

1109
00:54:59,360 --> 00:55:01,520
Speaker 1: miss the case? Of course you will, of course, But

1110
00:55:01,640 --> 00:55:04,440
Speaker 1: you're better off having that in there and knowing what

1111
00:55:04,600 --> 00:55:07,600
Speaker 1: you want as opposed to always trying to shoehorn in

1112
00:55:07,800 --> 00:55:10,640
Speaker 1: something that doesn't fit what you're trying to get done.

1113
00:55:10,840 --> 00:55:13,080
Speaker 1: And you know what you have then a new GM,

1114
00:55:13,160 --> 00:55:15,920
Speaker 1: a new head coach, and new roster because you're not

1115
00:55:16,040 --> 00:55:19,120
Speaker 1: there anymore. Charles. I love what you just said because

1116
00:55:19,200 --> 00:55:22,160
Speaker 1: it applies to the Giants. I've told this right to

1117
00:55:22,239 --> 00:55:24,680
Speaker 1: Dave Gentleman's face, even though I've known him for many years.

1118
00:55:24,719 --> 00:55:28,399
Speaker 1: And he's back here for the second time. He's doing things.

1119
00:55:28,520 --> 00:55:33,440
Speaker 1: He's reinstalling George Young's Giants back with with this club.

1120
00:55:33,880 --> 00:55:36,320
Speaker 1: And it's amazing because you know, Dave got to the

1121
00:55:36,400 --> 00:55:39,799
Speaker 1: Giants after George had already retired. He came here under

1122
00:55:39,880 --> 00:55:43,680
Speaker 1: ernie of coursie. But it's amazing. Every time I talked

1123
00:55:43,719 --> 00:55:46,520
Speaker 1: to Dave Gentleman and everything that I've learned about what

1124
00:55:46,640 --> 00:55:48,719
Speaker 1: he has established here in the last couple of months,

1125
00:55:49,360 --> 00:55:52,239
Speaker 1: it's all got the ghost of George Young whispering in

1126
00:55:52,320 --> 00:55:56,560
Speaker 1: his ear. It's incredible. I'm seeing so many, so many

1127
00:55:57,160 --> 00:56:00,520
Speaker 1: blueprints that are coming back to life. And think that

1128
00:56:00,719 --> 00:56:03,479
Speaker 1: goes directly to the core of what you have just said.

1129
00:56:04,080 --> 00:56:06,000
Speaker 1: And that's why Dave Gentleman was the right guy to

1130
00:56:06,080 --> 00:56:09,720
Speaker 1: try to turn this franchise around. Yeah, and and look,

1131
00:56:10,160 --> 00:56:13,239
Speaker 1: the best ones always have it and they can they

1132
00:56:13,320 --> 00:56:17,719
Speaker 1: can articulate their philosophy in minimal, minimal senses and you

1133
00:56:17,880 --> 00:56:21,560
Speaker 1: understand what they're trying to do. Those are the best organizations,

1134
00:56:21,640 --> 00:56:24,640
Speaker 1: the best people putting them together. Everyone gets on Pete

1135
00:56:24,680 --> 00:56:26,759
Speaker 1: Carroll about the raw Ross stuff, and you know you're

1136
00:56:26,760 --> 00:56:29,160
Speaker 1: hearing Sherman get on him now, and you're hearing Michael

1137
00:56:29,200 --> 00:56:31,920
Speaker 1: Bennett get on him. It's always a guy getting on

1138
00:56:32,280 --> 00:56:34,800
Speaker 1: people who are no longer in those organizations. It's just

1139
00:56:34,920 --> 00:56:38,759
Speaker 1: always like that. But did Pete not have a philosophy

1140
00:56:38,840 --> 00:56:42,320
Speaker 1: that everyone understood in Seattle? But people not understand, you know,

1141
00:56:42,480 --> 00:56:44,759
Speaker 1: what his message was about, how he wanted to be great.

1142
00:56:44,960 --> 00:56:47,120
Speaker 1: And they have a theme for their practice sessions. Hey,

1143
00:56:47,239 --> 00:56:51,040
Speaker 1: it's turned over Tuesday and competitive plintsdays. Whatever it is.

1144
00:56:51,480 --> 00:56:54,320
Speaker 1: You can ridicule it all you want. I think his

1145
00:56:54,440 --> 00:56:57,520
Speaker 1: system has been proven to be very, very effective, and

1146
00:56:57,640 --> 00:56:59,600
Speaker 1: he had to work on that after, you know, he

1147
00:56:59,640 --> 00:57:01,920
Speaker 1: had his job a couple of times. You get to

1148
00:57:01,960 --> 00:57:04,439
Speaker 1: put that all together and put it into practice. Vince

1149
00:57:04,480 --> 00:57:07,800
Speaker 1: Lombardi would have been able to articulate his philosophy. Tom Landry,

1150
00:57:08,080 --> 00:57:11,000
Speaker 1: George Allen, Right, you mentioned Mr Young and what he

1151
00:57:11,080 --> 00:57:13,440
Speaker 1: put in place, and Ernie A. Corsi. All of them

1152
00:57:13,560 --> 00:57:16,520
Speaker 1: knew it. And guess what, the Bucks stopped there. And

1153
00:57:16,560 --> 00:57:18,400
Speaker 1: if you weren't, if you weren't all in on that

1154
00:57:18,600 --> 00:57:21,320
Speaker 1: organizational philosophy, then you could get a job somewhere else.

1155
00:57:21,360 --> 00:57:23,320
Speaker 1: Because that's how we're going to do it. So we

1156
00:57:23,440 --> 00:57:25,480
Speaker 1: do it the Giant's way. We do it this way

1157
00:57:25,760 --> 00:57:28,120
Speaker 1: the best ones have it. You're not gonna win a

1158
00:57:28,160 --> 00:57:30,640
Speaker 1: Super Bowl every year, but you're going to be in

1159
00:57:30,680 --> 00:57:33,400
Speaker 1: a position where year in and year out, you're playing

1160
00:57:33,440 --> 00:57:36,480
Speaker 1: in the playoffs and people understand what you're all about.

1161
00:57:37,080 --> 00:57:40,720
Speaker 1: What we call brand nowadays, there was always a brand,

1162
00:57:40,960 --> 00:57:43,760
Speaker 1: the packer and the Lombardi Packers brand was pretty simple,

1163
00:57:43,880 --> 00:57:47,640
Speaker 1: wasn't it. Small playbook on offense, tune it up really well,

1164
00:57:47,880 --> 00:57:49,720
Speaker 1: and we're gonna run the power, so we break down

1165
00:57:49,800 --> 00:57:52,320
Speaker 1: your throat and then barts and then bart star on

1166
00:57:52,480 --> 00:57:54,360
Speaker 1: third and short's gonna fake and fake to run to

1167
00:57:54,480 --> 00:57:57,720
Speaker 1: Jim Taylor ball warning and pro deep to Max McGee

1168
00:57:58,000 --> 00:58:01,360
Speaker 1: or Boyd Dollar or Carol Dale, and guess what, we're

1169
00:58:01,400 --> 00:58:03,440
Speaker 1: gonna win a lot of championships, and we're gonna be

1170
00:58:03,560 --> 00:58:07,200
Speaker 1: tough and nasty on defense. And they were that playbooks.

1171
00:58:07,200 --> 00:58:09,960
Speaker 1: One the thinnest playbooks going, and AT one five and

1172
00:58:10,000 --> 00:58:13,160
Speaker 1: At won five championships in the sixties. Talking my language, Charles,

1173
00:58:13,240 --> 00:58:16,240
Speaker 1: you're talking my language, Charles, real quick before he say goodbye,

1174
00:58:16,320 --> 00:58:19,040
Speaker 1: and asking everyone that's come on um what their prediction

1175
00:58:19,200 --> 00:58:20,840
Speaker 1: is for what the Giants will do in both the

1176
00:58:20,920 --> 00:58:22,840
Speaker 1: first and second round, and then what you would do

1177
00:58:23,040 --> 00:58:24,880
Speaker 1: if you were the general manager, why don't you give

1178
00:58:24,880 --> 00:58:27,640
Speaker 1: meat both of those round one and two. Well, I

1179
00:58:27,720 --> 00:58:30,560
Speaker 1: think the coach, gentleman, I believe he'll stick it to.

1180
00:58:31,240 --> 00:58:33,280
Speaker 1: I think there will be offers that will come, he'll

1181
00:58:33,360 --> 00:58:35,320
Speaker 1: listen to him. He's a smart man. I think he'll

1182
00:58:35,360 --> 00:58:38,000
Speaker 1: stick it to and he'll make his decision. The Giants,

1183
00:58:38,040 --> 00:58:41,400
Speaker 1: as you know, have always have always thrived on defense.

1184
00:58:41,520 --> 00:58:44,640
Speaker 1: That's why Bradley chub is really attractive to people. But

1185
00:58:44,720 --> 00:58:47,080
Speaker 1: I think Sae Kwon Barkley ends up being to picket too.

1186
00:58:47,560 --> 00:58:49,160
Speaker 1: I just think there's so many things you can do

1187
00:58:49,280 --> 00:58:51,360
Speaker 1: with him. How you help e lie, how you kick

1188
00:58:51,400 --> 00:58:54,040
Speaker 1: start your offense. He's a guy you can build around.

1189
00:58:54,080 --> 00:58:57,240
Speaker 1: And I know runners, it scares everybody, but we started

1190
00:58:57,280 --> 00:58:59,760
Speaker 1: taking these runners higher and it's paying off for a

1191
00:58:59,800 --> 00:59:05,320
Speaker 1: lot of people. Todd Gurley Ezekiel, Elliott, Leonard Fournette, Christian McCaffrey.

1192
00:59:06,120 --> 00:59:07,760
Speaker 1: Every one of them has been a home run for

1193
00:59:07,840 --> 00:59:10,240
Speaker 1: these teams that have drafted him. I think Saelan Barkley

1194
00:59:10,280 --> 00:59:12,280
Speaker 1: can be the exact same fact. Okay, so you think

1195
00:59:12,320 --> 00:59:14,520
Speaker 1: they would take Barkley, and you would take Barkley as well.

1196
00:59:15,880 --> 00:59:18,000
Speaker 1: I would take Barkley. Would be the guy that I

1197
00:59:18,080 --> 00:59:20,560
Speaker 1: would take if they if they if they stick it

1198
00:59:20,640 --> 00:59:23,600
Speaker 1: to and don't take Barkley, I would think that they

1199
00:59:23,600 --> 00:59:26,760
Speaker 1: would go Bradley Chub because I grew up in New

1200
00:59:26,840 --> 00:59:29,840
Speaker 1: York State guys, the rock stars in New York when

1201
00:59:29,880 --> 00:59:32,840
Speaker 1: the Giants were were good. We're always on the defensive side,

1202
00:59:33,240 --> 00:59:36,640
Speaker 1: Frank Gifford. Notwithstanding, Okay, the guys who got the best

1203
00:59:36,680 --> 00:59:41,000
Speaker 1: tables to touch shores and at sorties were the defensive players.

1204
00:59:41,760 --> 00:59:45,640
Speaker 1: One the offensive guy, well except for Gift Giant, except

1205
00:59:45,680 --> 00:59:49,280
Speaker 1: for Gift, Hey, Charles, except for Gifford. And the last

1206
00:59:49,280 --> 00:59:51,720
Speaker 1: thing I'll tell you is you guy who have been

1207
00:59:51,720 --> 00:59:55,439
Speaker 1: around Coach. I've been around him just enough, and he's

1208
00:59:55,480 --> 00:59:59,160
Speaker 1: told me this ever since I've known him. Charlie, It's

1209
00:59:59,160 --> 01:00:02,880
Speaker 1: always gonna be a big man's game. Think think about

1210
01:00:02,960 --> 01:00:04,800
Speaker 1: that when they when they line up at number two,

1211
01:00:04,920 --> 01:00:06,520
Speaker 1: And Charles, you don't have to give me an explanation,

1212
01:00:06,600 --> 01:00:08,000
Speaker 1: just real quick, top of the second round. I know

1213
01:00:08,080 --> 01:00:09,760
Speaker 1: what's tough. Give me your prediction and what you think

1214
01:00:09,760 --> 01:00:13,040
Speaker 1: they'll do. Top a round two, top a round two.

1215
01:00:13,280 --> 01:00:15,920
Speaker 1: I think you're starting to look at offensive line, you know,

1216
01:00:16,360 --> 01:00:19,040
Speaker 1: And I'm gonna tell you something aside they win, slides

1217
01:00:19,120 --> 01:00:22,000
Speaker 1: through there, run to I'd run to the I'd run

1218
01:00:22,040 --> 01:00:25,280
Speaker 1: to the podium to get him. Great stuff and run

1219
01:00:25,320 --> 01:00:26,760
Speaker 1: to the podium and go get him because you can

1220
01:00:26,800 --> 01:00:29,480
Speaker 1: play him in either spot. But I do think ultimately

1221
01:00:29,600 --> 01:00:32,880
Speaker 1: he feels with Justin Pugh should have been full time,

1222
01:00:33,160 --> 01:00:35,320
Speaker 1: which was a guard, but he couldn't be due to injuries.

1223
01:00:35,480 --> 01:00:37,360
Speaker 1: I know we're running over time, but I gotta steal

1224
01:00:37,400 --> 01:00:40,600
Speaker 1: thirty more seconds. Give me a percentage, Charles on the

1225
01:00:40,760 --> 01:00:45,120
Speaker 1: Browns not taking a quarterback because that could screw up

1226
01:00:45,160 --> 01:00:50,640
Speaker 1: a lot, because that could screw up the Giants. Yeah,

1227
01:00:50,680 --> 01:00:54,120
Speaker 1: I put it at five percent. Thank you, Charles. That

1228
01:00:54,240 --> 01:00:57,400
Speaker 1: they wouldn't. That they wouldn't. I think they do. And

1229
01:00:57,440 --> 01:00:59,560
Speaker 1: I think John Dorsey already knows who he wants, but

1230
01:00:59,600 --> 01:01:02,720
Speaker 1: he's small enough not to tell anyone even in his organization.

1231
01:01:02,960 --> 01:01:05,640
Speaker 1: I will believe it's not Sam Donald when I see it. Charles,

1232
01:01:05,760 --> 01:01:08,440
Speaker 1: great stuff. I can appreciate the time. I know he

1233
01:01:08,480 --> 01:01:10,200
Speaker 1: held your while. Thank you so much and enjoy it

1234
01:01:10,240 --> 01:01:12,640
Speaker 1: all right, our pleasure. Thanks for having me on. Guys,

1235
01:01:12,640 --> 01:01:14,720
Speaker 1: when you see coach Gettleman, please give him my family.

1236
01:01:14,720 --> 01:01:17,760
Speaker 1: We were well. Absolutely, that's Charles Davis. Uh. You see

1237
01:01:17,840 --> 01:01:19,680
Speaker 1: him on pat to the draft NFL network. He'll do

1238
01:01:19,760 --> 01:01:22,960
Speaker 1: but the draft coverage next week as well, NFL on Fox,

1239
01:01:23,240 --> 01:01:24,480
Speaker 1: and he gave us a lot of time there. He

1240
01:01:24,560 --> 01:01:28,479
Speaker 1: was fantastic, sensational, enjoyed it very much. Great conversation and sorry,

1241
01:01:28,560 --> 01:01:30,240
Speaker 1: Dan Salmon, we gotta wait on lunch because we have

1242
01:01:30,280 --> 01:01:32,959
Speaker 1: two people holding online here for calls and I gotta

1243
01:01:33,000 --> 01:01:35,720
Speaker 1: get to him. Okay, just one actually, John and Vegas

1244
01:01:35,800 --> 01:01:38,520
Speaker 1: is still there. John, hopefully you hit at the crabs

1245
01:01:38,600 --> 01:01:40,840
Speaker 1: table to pay for this call. What's going on, buddy?

1246
01:01:41,560 --> 01:01:46,800
Speaker 1: Unlimited minute? Okay, excellent, what's up? I was enjoying the conversation. Good.

1247
01:01:47,280 --> 01:01:53,200
Speaker 1: We tried, but actually, you guys answered one of my questions.

1248
01:01:53,280 --> 01:01:56,200
Speaker 1: I mean, if I'm on, uh, you know Davis Webb,

1249
01:01:56,280 --> 01:02:00,520
Speaker 1: he's chopped liver for me. I don't just I'm ribbed

1250
01:02:00,560 --> 01:02:02,600
Speaker 1: for me. I don't think we know what he is yet, John,

1251
01:02:02,640 --> 01:02:04,800
Speaker 1: I think we got to find out. Well, you know,

1252
01:02:04,880 --> 01:02:08,240
Speaker 1: we had a full mediocre season with him holding the clipboard.

1253
01:02:08,520 --> 01:02:11,280
Speaker 1: You know what, It's funny. I actually called, you know,

1254
01:02:11,400 --> 01:02:13,720
Speaker 1: for him to be drafted. I was because last year

1255
01:02:13,760 --> 01:02:16,760
Speaker 1: I'm thinking, you know, to start thinking about replacing Eli.

1256
01:02:17,640 --> 01:02:20,200
Speaker 1: And I like to this kid, Davis web I looked

1257
01:02:20,240 --> 01:02:23,160
Speaker 1: at some cape and you know, I mean, he's got

1258
01:02:23,240 --> 01:02:27,520
Speaker 1: the physical attributes, right, but no one talks about him.

1259
01:02:27,520 --> 01:02:30,440
Speaker 1: And I hear you guys, you know, talking about the prospects,

1260
01:02:31,320 --> 01:02:35,000
Speaker 1: and it's like, all right, is he chopped liver? John? John,

1261
01:02:35,040 --> 01:02:37,760
Speaker 1: tell him? Tell him how many times have I I'll

1262
01:02:37,800 --> 01:02:40,160
Speaker 1: just say this, And I know you listen to the show.

1263
01:02:40,640 --> 01:02:45,960
Speaker 1: You've obviously missed a couple because I'm tired. Oh perfect,

1264
01:02:46,080 --> 01:02:48,760
Speaker 1: Because John, I'm tired of Paul to Tino talking about

1265
01:02:48,800 --> 01:02:52,200
Speaker 1: Davis Webb. He loves Davis Webb. So you and him

1266
01:02:52,520 --> 01:02:55,680
Speaker 1: can meet somewhere, have lunch together and have a great

1267
01:02:55,720 --> 01:02:59,200
Speaker 1: conversation about you guys, love Davis Webb. Be wonderful. Hit

1268
01:02:59,240 --> 01:03:01,520
Speaker 1: me up on Twitter because I do think I am

1269
01:03:01,560 --> 01:03:05,040
Speaker 1: the unofficial King of the David's Web fan club, especially

1270
01:03:05,120 --> 01:03:08,160
Speaker 1: because ze Light has at least one, maybe two more years.

1271
01:03:08,480 --> 01:03:12,440
Speaker 1: I'm with you. The other thing is, you know Dez Bryant,

1272
01:03:12,960 --> 01:03:15,560
Speaker 1: I mean, what's what What's what's the block on him?

1273
01:03:15,680 --> 01:03:19,240
Speaker 1: Is it just everything between his ears, his attitude? Why

1274
01:03:19,280 --> 01:03:20,880
Speaker 1: wouldn't they give him a shot? I think there are

1275
01:03:20,960 --> 01:03:23,440
Speaker 1: multiple things with des Bryant. One, he's not the same

1276
01:03:23,520 --> 01:03:25,360
Speaker 1: physically he was when he came into the league. He's

1277
01:03:25,400 --> 01:03:28,480
Speaker 1: lost in least the step maybe two with all the

1278
01:03:28,640 --> 01:03:32,400
Speaker 1: leg injuries he's had and the foot injuries, yeah, you know,

1279
01:03:32,520 --> 01:03:34,240
Speaker 1: like's part of the foot. Foot's attached to the leg bone,

1280
01:03:34,280 --> 01:03:36,600
Speaker 1: you know, it goes. And he also has the issues

1281
01:03:36,680 --> 01:03:39,760
Speaker 1: between the head and the cowboy and Stephen Jones has

1282
01:03:40,120 --> 01:03:41,680
Speaker 1: you know, made this point a couple of times, and

1283
01:03:41,760 --> 01:03:44,800
Speaker 1: they discussed des Brian in the offseason. He's a pain

1284
01:03:44,840 --> 01:03:46,200
Speaker 1: in the rear end, and I think they're tired of

1285
01:03:46,280 --> 01:03:48,240
Speaker 1: dealing with him. And I think if you look at

1286
01:03:48,280 --> 01:03:50,880
Speaker 1: the type of guys Dave Gentleman is brought in this

1287
01:03:51,200 --> 01:03:54,440
Speaker 1: off season, they're not those types of guys, which is

1288
01:03:54,480 --> 01:03:56,360
Speaker 1: why I think Paul and I think it's probably pretty

1289
01:03:56,400 --> 01:03:58,520
Speaker 1: unlikely that that becomes an option. You know I threw

1290
01:03:58,560 --> 01:04:00,680
Speaker 1: out every Decker's name before. Is a guy who might

1291
01:04:00,760 --> 01:04:03,560
Speaker 1: fit that role who was still available. Look, I don't

1292
01:04:03,560 --> 01:04:05,560
Speaker 1: know anything about them talking to him. I don't know

1293
01:04:05,560 --> 01:04:07,960
Speaker 1: if they have it. I haven't. I'm simply saying, if

1294
01:04:08,000 --> 01:04:09,960
Speaker 1: you wanted a guy to fit that role, you want

1295
01:04:10,000 --> 01:04:12,040
Speaker 1: to bring you a veteran who's gonna be a tall

1296
01:04:12,120 --> 01:04:14,680
Speaker 1: guy and a possession receiver. He fits a lot of

1297
01:04:14,720 --> 01:04:17,720
Speaker 1: those those boxes. But again, that doesn't mean that you

1298
01:04:17,800 --> 01:04:20,080
Speaker 1: know he's a likely candidate. He just fits a lot

1299
01:04:20,120 --> 01:04:23,320
Speaker 1: of the description. You know something, I hear you guys

1300
01:04:23,400 --> 01:04:27,240
Speaker 1: talking about analytics, and the big problem is the X factor.

1301
01:04:27,680 --> 01:04:33,240
Speaker 1: There's no analytics for heart or for attitude, and that's

1302
01:04:33,280 --> 01:04:36,280
Speaker 1: part of it. And then and that's a big part

1303
01:04:36,320 --> 01:04:40,280
Speaker 1: of it. Thank you, John, Hey, have a good one.

1304
01:04:40,360 --> 01:04:42,600
Speaker 1: Hey you too, Buddy. Good look and good luck at

1305
01:04:42,600 --> 01:04:46,400
Speaker 1: the tables. Yes, thanks for calling and hanging on and

1306
01:04:46,480 --> 01:04:48,520
Speaker 1: a great job from Sam Monson and Charles Davis. Again,

1307
01:04:48,520 --> 01:04:50,360
Speaker 1: apologies for not getting to more of your calls, but

1308
01:04:50,400 --> 01:04:53,480
Speaker 1: I thought the guest today were really wonderful. Um next week, though,

1309
01:04:53,480 --> 01:04:55,720
Speaker 1: Wolf time for you. Paul and I are on on Monday.

1310
01:04:55,720 --> 01:04:57,720
Speaker 1: We're gonna have Tony Pauline, just one guest. We're gonna

1311
01:04:57,720 --> 01:05:00,280
Speaker 1: have at least forty minutes of calls that day. Get in,

1312
01:05:00,880 --> 01:05:02,840
Speaker 1: give us a call, We'll talk strategy, whatever else you

1313
01:05:02,840 --> 01:05:04,720
Speaker 1: want to talk about. We get have the Barkley quarterback

1314
01:05:04,800 --> 01:05:06,760
Speaker 1: battle that's going on on Twitter for the last month

1315
01:05:06,800 --> 01:05:08,320
Speaker 1: and a half. If you want whatever you want to

1316
01:05:08,360 --> 01:05:10,640
Speaker 1: do that school. I also have a fun scenario. I'm

1317
01:05:10,640 --> 01:05:12,880
Speaker 1: gonna give Paul next to see if I can move

1318
01:05:12,960 --> 01:05:16,040
Speaker 1: him off his spot, and I'll see if I can

1319
01:05:16,080 --> 01:05:18,040
Speaker 1: do that, and then we'll have again a lot of

1320
01:05:18,080 --> 01:05:19,840
Speaker 1: calls next week with a couple more guests as well.

1321
01:05:19,920 --> 01:05:21,960
Speaker 1: But try to get your opinion on what's going on

1322
01:05:22,400 --> 01:05:24,920
Speaker 1: in the NFL draft. Guys, thank you so much for

1323
01:05:25,040 --> 01:05:27,600
Speaker 1: joining us. For Paul to Tino, I am John Schmell.

1324
01:05:28,000 --> 01:05:32,640
Speaker 1: Enjoy what should be a almost spring weekend kind of

1325
01:05:33,120 --> 01:05:35,560
Speaker 1: it's not gonna be forty I can give you that.

1326
01:05:36,120 --> 01:05:38,200
Speaker 1: Enjoy it, have fun outside. We'll see you on Monday.

1327
01:05:38,400 --> 01:05:41,200
Speaker 1: And by the way, voluntary vanderd Minicamp is next week

1328
01:05:41,240 --> 01:05:43,000
Speaker 1: as well. Stay tuned to Giants dot com for coverage

1329
01:05:43,040 --> 01:05:45,480
Speaker 1: of that, and then the draft is on Thursday. It's

1330
01:05:45,520 --> 01:05:47,920
Speaker 1: finally here. Enjoy the preview, See that