Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
Speaker 2: Friends Star, TV and movie Icon, Matthew Perry's sisters blast
Speaker 2: Perry's assistant, who, they say, quote repeatedly injected him with ketamine,
Speaker 2: leaving him in a hot tub to die. I'm Nancy Grace,
Speaker 2: this is Crime Stories. I want to thank you for
Speaker 2: being with us. That's right. Matthew Perry's sisters call out
Speaker 2: Perry's assistant Kenny Iwamasa for quote, repeatedly injecting him with
Speaker 2: ketamine that turned deadly on the day the Friends star
Speaker 2: died in his own hot tub. According to Madeline Morrison,
Speaker 2: Perry's sister, quote he injected my brother with a lethal
Speaker 2: dose of ketamine and left him in a hot tub
Speaker 2: to die. She goes on, it's difficult to put into
Speaker 2: words a sense of betrayal I felt when I found
Speaker 2: out what Kenney had done. These are, according to court filings,
Speaker 2: what happened to Matthew Perry.
Speaker 1: Let me start with the nine to one one call.
Speaker 1: Listen twenty three twenty three.
Speaker 3: A twenty three and radio in part of the drowning
Speaker 3: across the few drives. That's a twenty twenty three ms N.
Speaker 1: You can't tell a lot, but I learned something significant.
Speaker 1: Let's hear that one more time.
Speaker 3: Said twenty three ms N twenty three and radio in
Speaker 3: one of the drowning across the few drives. That's a
Speaker 3: twenty three twenty three MS.
Speaker 1: Now, some of those numbers are universal. Sometimes you hear
Speaker 1: numbers across a police ban or on an ema that
Speaker 1: are specific to that region. But what I'm hearing that
Speaker 1: really jumps out at me is response to the drowning.
Speaker 1: So at the beginning, it was believed that the friends
Speaker 1: start died of drowning because that's what was reported to them.
Speaker 1: But what do we really know? Take a listen to
Speaker 1: our friends at crime online.
Speaker 4: The Los Angeles Medical Examiner determined that fifty four year
Speaker 4: old Matthew Perry died from the acute effects of ketamine.
Speaker 4: Other contributing factors listed were drowning, coronary artery disease, and
Speaker 4: the effects of buprenorphine. Buprenorphine is used to treat opioid
Speaker 4: use disorder. The manner of death has been ruled an accident.
Speaker 1: Okay, see, I'm a trial lawyer, and that is why
Speaker 1: the medical examiners and everybody at the crime lab would
Speaker 1: go hide under their desk when they saw my beat
Speaker 1: up Honda pulling up because they knew as going to
Speaker 1: go through it line by line literally to make sense
Speaker 1: of what they wrote down in their scientific findings. What
Speaker 1: acute effects of ketamine. Other contributing factors were drowning, coronary
Speaker 1: artery disease, be prefer blue blo used to treat opioid disorder,
Speaker 1: manner of death, accident. There's so much there. I could
Speaker 1: do a whole flow chart on that to try to
Speaker 1: explain all that to a jury. Luckily we have experts
Speaker 1: with us. But first I'm going to go to a
Speaker 1: special guest joining us, Miguel Melndez joining us, senior writer
Speaker 1: for E t Entertainment tonight. Miguel, what a pleasure to
Speaker 1: have you on. Man. This sent shock waves through not
Speaker 1: only Hollywood, but across our country. Because I'm gonna follow
Speaker 1: this up with our shrink, Karen Stark. We think we
Speaker 1: know Matthew Perry. Why because we've seen him on the
Speaker 1: big screen, we've seen him on the little screen. We
Speaker 1: follow him in the tabloids. We think we know him
Speaker 1: and about his life. We've been following his struggle with addiction,
Speaker 1: and a lot of people can identify with that. If
Speaker 1: you haven't had that struggle in somebody, you know, somebody
Speaker 1: close to you has had that struggle. So Matthew Perry
Speaker 1: was kind of like every man that was struggling with
Speaker 1: a lot. But to you, Miguel Melendez, I want to
Speaker 1: go before I get into Matthew Perry himself and how
Speaker 1: it ended up this way, I want to talk to
Speaker 1: you about what happened, what surrounded the discovery of Matthew
Speaker 1: Perry dead in a hot tub leading up to that.
Speaker 1: Tell me about the discovery and what came out at
Speaker 1: the time that he was first discovered dead in the
Speaker 1: hot tub.
Speaker 5: Right, So what we know the timeline is that at
Speaker 5: eleven AM, Matthew have played pickleball. At one thirty seven
Speaker 5: PM is when Matthew was last known to be alive
Speaker 5: by his personal living assistant to live with him in
Speaker 5: the Pacific Policy home. He was ought to run aaron.
Speaker 5: At one thirty seven pm, the living assistant returned home
Speaker 5: and found Matthew floating face down in the jacuzzi. The
Speaker 5: assistant jumped into the pool, moved Matthew into the sitting
Speaker 5: position on the steps of the pool, and found him
Speaker 5: by the way on the heated side of the pool,
Speaker 5: called nine one one. Paramedics arrived and they moved and
Speaker 5: they pulled Matthew out of the pos.
Speaker 1: Okay, hold on, Miguel, You're giving me so much information
Speaker 1: so quickly. I'm drinking from the fire hydrate because Miguel,
Speaker 1: you know, I like to dissect every single sentence, and
Speaker 1: I loved everything you just said as far as factually
Speaker 1: what I'm learning. Could you say it again and very slowly? Okay?
Speaker 1: Did you say the living assistant found him?
Speaker 6: Yes?
Speaker 1: Okay. Why did Matthew Perry have a live and assistant?
Speaker 5: That I can answer you, Nancy. I don't know the
Speaker 5: exact circumstances of what led to that. I do know
Speaker 5: that the living assistant, based on this report, is that
Speaker 5: he administered the the the detox drugs on Matthew twice
Speaker 5: a day.
Speaker 1: That's important. Miguel Melendez, Hold on, Miguel, hold the thought.
Speaker 1: Guys with me. He's a senior writer for entertainment tonight.
Speaker 1: You all know him. Miguel Melndez giving us everything we
Speaker 1: need to know to analyze this drug ketamine that claimed
Speaker 1: the life of Matthew Perry. Karen el start joining me.
Speaker 1: Renowned TV radio trauma expert at Karenstark dot com. Karen
Speaker 1: with the c if you're trying to find her, Karen, So,
Speaker 1: is it like a minder you have with AA that.
Speaker 1: I don't think they call it a minder. They call
Speaker 1: it something else, someone that checks in on you. It's
Speaker 1: like your partner, your buddy, that kind of that's who
Speaker 1: you call when you have a problem or you're going
Speaker 1: to relapse. Is that what you think is happening here?
Speaker 1: He had somebody to help him.
Speaker 7: It's called a sponsor. And his assistant she was his sponsor.
Speaker 7: She was his minder, as you said, Nancy, So she
Speaker 7: was there. She could not stop him from taking something,
Speaker 7: but certainly was trying. That was her role to make
Speaker 7: sure that he was on the straight and narrow and
Speaker 7: sticking to his determination to stop. And he was very
Speaker 7: open about it. But he really did want to stop
Speaker 7: taking drugs recreationally.
Speaker 1: He really did, and he made no secret about it.
Speaker 1: What led up to that moment Miguel Melndez is describing.
Speaker 1: But first again, Miguel, could you tell me the assistant
Speaker 1: comes in? You said he was near the heater end
Speaker 1: of the hot tub.
Speaker 5: Correct, So at four PM. The living assistant walks in
Speaker 5: from a running errands finds Matthew Perry floating space down
Speaker 5: into jacuzzi in the heated end.
Speaker 6: Of the pool.
Speaker 5: The assistant jumped into the pool, moved Matthew into the
Speaker 5: sitting position on the steps of the pool, and called
Speaker 5: nine to one one. Paramedics Soon ve pulled Matthew out
Speaker 5: of the pool onto the grass, where he was pronounced
Speaker 5: that at the scene, you know, I think.
Speaker 1: I had at bass akwors migam Melendez. I was saying
Speaker 1: hot tub because I've read jacuzzie. But was the jacuzi
Speaker 1: or the hot tub part of the pool? Was he
Speaker 1: in a pool or was he in a hot tub
Speaker 1: or jacuzi?
Speaker 5: It looked like it was a long pool that has
Speaker 5: a jacuzi in it. If they're not two separate.
Speaker 1: Okay, that makes perfect sense. Okay, guys, what led up
Speaker 1: to this moment? Take a listen to our friend Nicole Parton.
Speaker 4: Matthew Perry went to his country club to play a
Speaker 4: game of pickleball with friends around eleven am. Perry returned
Speaker 4: to his home after the game and was seen by
Speaker 4: his assistant, who was leaving the house to run Errand's
Speaker 4: at one thirty seven PM. At four o'clock PM, the
Speaker 4: assistant returned to the home. Investigator Jennifer Hertzog says the
Speaker 4: assistant found Perry floating face down in the heated end
Speaker 4: of the pool. The assistant jumped into the pool and
Speaker 4: moved him into a sitting position on the steps and
Speaker 4: called nine to one one. Paramedics responded, pulled Perry out
Speaker 4: of the pool and onto the grass, and pronounced him
Speaker 4: dead on the scene at four seventeen PM. His stepfather,
Speaker 4: Keith Morrison is listed as the informant, which means the
Speaker 4: dateline host is who identified Perry to authorities.
Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, that must have been so horrible on
Speaker 1: the stepfather to have to do that after the struggle
Speaker 1: he Matthew Perry went through so publicly against substance abuse.
Speaker 1: Mike McCormick joining me out of LA owner lead investigator
Speaker 1: MCM Investigations, Mike McCormick, thank you for being with us.
Speaker 1: I'm very curious Matthew Perry had been so open and
Speaker 1: public about his battle with addiction. Who I mean, even
Speaker 1: I know about that two thousand miles away, who would
Speaker 1: be supplying him dru ketamine and all the other things
Speaker 1: in his system.
Speaker 6: It was either prescribed to him that Kennedy was prescribed,
Speaker 6: or he's getting it off the street. There's only several
Speaker 6: ways of doing it. My understanding is that the frum
Speaker 6: he's a assistant or past girlfriend miss edwards that she's
Speaker 6: been involved with him off and on from about two
Speaker 6: thousand and six, and she used to purchase his drugs
Speaker 6: off the street for him. So the ketnamine and other
Speaker 6: drugs he may have been taking could come from e
Speaker 6: their source.
Speaker 2: Crime stores with Nancy Gray, Friends of superstar Matthew Perry
Speaker 2: is dead and seemingly everyone involved in his death is
Speaker 2: getting slaps on the wrist. The so called assistant, Ewa
Speaker 2: Masa allegedly lied to Perry's alums. The so called personal assistant,
Speaker 2: Ewa Massa allegedly lied to Matthew Perry's relatives about what
Speaker 2: happened the day Perry died in his Pacific Palisades home.
Speaker 2: Perry's sister Madeline says, quote, everything I believed about the
Speaker 2: day Matthew died, everything Ewa Masa told us was a lie.
Speaker 2: She went on the idea some one my brother considered
Speaker 2: family could betray him in such an unimaginable way. Is
Speaker 2: something I could never have conceived. Why is she so
Speaker 2: angry with facts like these? What sister wouldn't be?
Speaker 8: This is Wendy Patrick. It looks like the assistant that
Speaker 8: it was living with Matthew Perry at the time his
Speaker 8: death is a man named Kenny Alamsa right, not the prior.
Speaker 8: Not a prior girlfriend or a female assistant.
Speaker 1: You're right, Wendy Patrick. Guys, you're hearing californ a prosecutor
Speaker 1: and author of Why Bad Looks Good Wendy Patrick at
Speaker 1: wendypatrickphd dot com, The Star of Today with Dr Wendy
Speaker 1: on KCBQ. I was just coming to you, Wendy, on
Speaker 1: another point, a legal point, and that is I saw
Speaker 1: the trial go down. I don't know if you remember
Speaker 1: Archie Bunker of all in the Family YEA, when his
Speaker 1: son died of an overdose, he went after the supplier
Speaker 1: in the Fulton County courthouse. And I was just wondering,
Speaker 1: Wendy about people knowing about his public struggle against addiction.
Speaker 1: I mean, he wrote about it, he talked about it,
Speaker 1: very open about it. Who would supply someone battling addiction
Speaker 1: with drugs.
Speaker 8: It's a great question when you have when you're talking
Speaker 8: about somebody that's supposed to be a confidant, a sponsor,
Speaker 8: a helper, a minder. We have all these terminology, these
Speaker 8: terms that we It's very different than a Michael Jackson
Speaker 8: situation where you actually have somebody medically administering a drug.
Speaker 1: Who would do it?
Speaker 8: I would have to say, Nancy, as you and I
Speaker 8: and our listeners know the same people that are selling
Speaker 8: drugs to begin with, maybe somebody that doesn't know him
Speaker 8: well enough, or because it was prescribed lawfully for a
Speaker 8: medicinal purpose, somebody that honestly, although mistakenly thought that he
Speaker 8: needed it or could handle it in different doses. You know, Ketamine,
Speaker 8: if it's being as supervised, is used certainly, not very
Speaker 8: not as often as many other drugs. But you have
Speaker 8: to believe whether or not somebody thought they might be
Speaker 8: doing him a favor, if he was depressed, if he
Speaker 8: was dled.
Speaker 1: They could not have been more wrong. And if it
Speaker 1: comes out that we can find a supplier or someone
Speaker 1: who ate it or a bet at him, I want
Speaker 1: you to just think about this, Wendy Patrick, about criminal
Speaker 1: charges joining me right now? Is the expert in this
Speaker 1: field as far as I'm concerned, and the pre eminent
Speaker 1: expert doctor William Maroney, medical examiner, toxicologist, pathologist, opioid treatment expert,
Speaker 1: author of American Narcan, which is on Amazon. Doctor Moroney,
Speaker 1: take a listen to what we've learned about the autopsy.
Speaker 4: Matthew Perry's autopsy report doesn't say how or when Perry
Speaker 4: used ketamine prior to his death, but the coroner ruled
Speaker 4: out the ketamine treatments he had a week and a
Speaker 4: half before his death because ketamine has a half life
Speaker 4: of three to four hours or less. The report notes
Speaker 4: at the high levels of ketamine found in his post
Speaker 4: mortem blood specimens, the main lethal effects would be from
Speaker 4: both cardiovascular overstimulation and respiratory depression. Drowning contributes due to
Speaker 4: the likelihood of submersion into the pool as he lapsed
Speaker 4: into unconsciousness.
Speaker 1: And that's not all, doctor Moroney. Wait for it. I
Speaker 1: would never have in ma imagine this goes into the cocktail.
Speaker 4: The autopsy report noted Matthew Perry's history of chronic obstructive
Speaker 4: pulmonary disease inmphysema and diabetes. The report mentions Perry's past
Speaker 4: drug use, but notes Perry had reportedly been cleaned for
Speaker 4: nineteen months. The New York Post reports that in the
Speaker 4: autopsy report, a comment is made about Perry undergoing ketamine
Speaker 4: infusion therapy, most recently one and a half weeks before
Speaker 4: his death. The report states ketamine treatments are for anxiety
Speaker 4: and depression, but ketamine in the system couldn't be from
Speaker 4: the infusion therapy. Doctor Bankole Johnson, one of the leading
Speaker 4: neuroscientists and physicians in the field, tells The New York
Speaker 4: Post that ketamine in Perry's system is more likely from
Speaker 4: recreational use.
Speaker 1: Male hormone testosterone injections. And there's one more ingredient. Why
Speaker 1: was Matthew Perry getting injections of the male hormone testosterone listen.
Speaker 9: According to Matthew Perry, he had been cleaned for nineteen months,
Speaker 9: but The Daily Mail reports the actor died from an
Speaker 9: overdose of the party drug ketamine. According to the autopsy report,
Speaker 9: a detective who attended the scene of Perry's death said, quote,
Speaker 9: during my investigation, no alcohol, elicit drugs or drug paraphernalia
Speaker 9: were found unquote. The Daily Mail also claims the fifty
Speaker 9: four year old was getting injections of the male hormone testosterone,
Speaker 9: and an unnamed female associate claimed the injections were causing
Speaker 9: him to be angry and mean for the last couple
Speaker 9: of weeks.
Speaker 1: From my point of view, doctor Moroney, as a lay
Speaker 1: person and not a doctor an MD like you, if
Speaker 1: something calls causes you to be angry and mean, it
Speaker 1: makes me wonder if it also didn't jack up his
Speaker 1: heart rate, this male testosterone injection. I mean, I don't
Speaker 1: know what to make of it, doctor Moroney, Because you've
Speaker 1: got ketamine, you've got testosterone, you've got the op or
Speaker 1: a treatment drug. There's so much going on there.
Speaker 10: What you have is a cocktail of disaster because you
Speaker 10: probably are dealing with multiple doctors that are not communicating,
Speaker 10: nobody's coordinating his care.
Speaker 11: And if he's getting ketamine, as it's said in the autopsy,
Speaker 11: there's ketamine contents in the stomach that would be ketamine pills.
Speaker 11: That's a rogue doctor, somebody outside of good practice guidelines
Speaker 11: giving pills they have no business giving. In addition to
Speaker 11: ketamine treatments.
Speaker 1: I mean, is a ketamine used by vets so animals
Speaker 1: don't have pain during operations.
Speaker 11: Yeah, it helps with anesthesia for your cats and dogs.
Speaker 11: But at low doses, it's been shown to be beneficial
Speaker 11: in a massively unstable major depressive disorder. But guess what
Speaker 11: that acceptable therapy is nasal? It's a nasal spray with
Speaker 11: your psychiatrist.
Speaker 1: Right. What you're saying ketamine, which many people believe is
Speaker 1: just used by veterinarians. Now people are using it, and
Speaker 1: you're saying that the only approved way for it to
Speaker 1: be used by people is by a nasal spray.
Speaker 12: The acceptable SDA approved supervised ketamine treatment is to go
Speaker 12: see your psychiatrist, have an appointment, get a nasal spray,
Speaker 12: and stay until you're stable, and have a counseling session.
Speaker 12: What you have here is somebody keeps saying, well, he's
Speaker 12: in treatment, he's in recovery, he's not getting enough psychosocial
Speaker 12: therapy because he's impaired, he's impulsive, he's processing poor decisions
Speaker 12: because he doesn't have that park link to all this medicine.
Speaker 1: What is ketamine?
Speaker 11: Ketamine is a class of medicine that works on transmitters
Speaker 11: called glutamate.
Speaker 1: Oh, dear Lord in Heaven, speak English man, What speak English?
Speaker 1: I mean? Is this something I've got to worry about
Speaker 1: they're going to have in the halls of my twins
Speaker 1: high school. I mean, I hear about ecstasy, coke, marijuana,
Speaker 1: blah blah blah blah. But ketamine.
Speaker 11: Ketamine's been abused for twenty years in drug culture and
Speaker 11: drug use.
Speaker 1: But is it traded freely on the street.
Speaker 11: It is on the street. You can buy it if
Speaker 11: you can ask for from your dealer, they'll get you some.
Speaker 11: But it's FDA approved as a nasal spray, and he's
Speaker 11: not getting the FDA approved version.
Speaker 1: Okay, I heard somebody jumping in. Is it wind your
Speaker 1: Karen Stark?
Speaker 7: Karen. It's used as a club drug. It started years ago, Nancy,
Speaker 7: but it's continuing. People do use it recreationally, but it's off.
Speaker 7: There are a lot of trials going on where they
Speaker 7: are psychedelics to stop addiction, just the opposite of what
Speaker 7: we have here and for depression, and that has to
Speaker 7: be a trial because it's not FDA approved.
Speaker 11: These are rogue doctors in rogue clinics. The only doctor
Speaker 11: that's probably legitimate here is the one giving them bupin orphine.
Speaker 11: That's the hardest word to say. But in order to
Speaker 11: do that, you have to have training. The rest of
Speaker 11: these people doing ketamine rogue.
Speaker 13: They're outside the law, they're outside good practice. We saw
Speaker 13: this with Anna, Nicole Smith, Michael Jackson, Prince, all these
Speaker 13: rogue doctors treating all these celebrities and you don't know
Speaker 13: who's around them.
Speaker 2: The so called personal assistant Iwell Massa allegedly lie to
Speaker 2: Matthew Perry's family about what happened to day the Friends
Speaker 2: star died. Sister Madelin says, quote, the personal respect hosible
Speaker 2: for my brother's death stood up and addressed the people
Speaker 2: who loved him most. That is like a cruel joke.
Speaker 2: I still struggle with. He didn't just take my brother's life.
Speaker 2: He tainted our final memories of saying goodbye. Perry's sister
Speaker 2: Caitlin states she would quote never know if the lethal
Speaker 2: dose of ketamine was only lethal by accident. What happened
Speaker 2: the night beloved star Matthew Perry died in his own
Speaker 2: hot tub.
Speaker 1: Ketamine has been around and being abused for a long time.
Speaker 1: We just don't know that much about it, and we
Speaker 1: don't see it as much. We don't it's not soaked
Speaker 1: into our national understanding as well. But as far as
Speaker 1: I can remember that it's been called baby food, bump,
Speaker 1: cat killer, cat valium, fort, dodge, green, green, kay, kayland, kale.
Speaker 1: There's a a million slulling words for ketamine. And the
Speaker 1: first time I ever saw that was when I was
Speaker 1: prosecuting and somebody had it as an aside drug. They
Speaker 1: were dealing heroin, and they also had vitamin K. And
Speaker 1: you're gonna laugh at this, Mike McCormick, I said, so,
Speaker 1: what's wrong with vitamin K? Because I didn't know what
Speaker 1: that vitamin K was? Ketamine? And that was oh gosh.
Speaker 1: I was prosecuting a dope lord and he had a
Speaker 1: stash of vitamin K. That's the first time I heard
Speaker 1: about kendamine.
Speaker 5: And Matthew Parry was not the first celebrity to be
Speaker 5: open about the Kedemy therapy session. I mean, the week
Speaker 5: before he died on December one, Christy Keagan was very
Speaker 5: open about the fact that she underwent Academy therapy session
Speaker 5: to celebrate her birthday, and she said on Instagram how
Speaker 5: she saw space and time and her late so late
Speaker 5: son Jack is someone she saw during the this therapy session.
Speaker 5: So Kedemy has kind of like sort of has come
Speaker 5: into the conscious as of late and now more because
Speaker 5: of Matthew Perry's death, that you're seeing the horrible side
Speaker 5: effect that it can have.
Speaker 1: So, Miguel Lundez from AT Joining Us, you're saying that
Speaker 1: it's common use among celebrities to what fight depression, to.
Speaker 5: Fight depression, to figure themselves, to use them to use
Speaker 5: it as a form of therapy. Christy Keegan is far
Speaker 5: from the only celebrity who has been open about taking
Speaker 5: or undergoing academy therapy sessions. You have the lights of
Speaker 5: Sharon Osborne and Pete Davidson who have been open about this.
Speaker 5: But again, academy therapy session is not dangerous if it's
Speaker 5: done under supervision, as our doctor seen doctors chaff said,
Speaker 5: when you go rogue, and in this case, it seems
Speaker 5: to indicate that that's what Matthew Perry did. You're going
Speaker 5: to see the fatal consequences, consequences, and that's just that's
Speaker 5: exactly what happened.
Speaker 6: Here.
Speaker 1: You're hearing Miguel Melendez, senior writer AT and I've got
Speaker 1: to get everything he said, which is all correct, by
Speaker 1: the way, explain to me medically, Doctor William Maroney renowned
Speaker 1: expert in this field. So when you have ketamine treatment
Speaker 1: with a doctor, you're saying ketamine is ingested nasally like
Speaker 1: through dristand the spray into your nose, and if it's
Speaker 1: used any other way than it's rogue. Do I have
Speaker 1: that right, Maroni?
Speaker 11: The reason why it's rogue is the FDA approved spray
Speaker 11: comes with specific conditions, that you're observed, that they follow instructions,
Speaker 11: and that your safety comes first, and you really can't
Speaker 11: even drive to and from your session. You're supposed to
Speaker 11: have somebody take care of you. As soon as you
Speaker 11: let somebody take ketamine pills, well, it's unobserved, it's uncontrolled,
Speaker 11: and it's clear there was ketamine in his stomach and
Speaker 11: his level in his blood was exactly halfway between low
Speaker 11: anesthesia and high anesthesia. You don't have those levels when
Speaker 11: you're supervised. And the whole idea that ketamine therapy is
Speaker 11: matched to a psycho social treatment of behavioral counseling session,
Speaker 11: that's where you make the changes. You have better insight,
Speaker 11: you have better processing and stress, and you're not impulsive.
Speaker 11: The last thing you want with impulsive behaviors with somebody
Speaker 11: in addiction is to put them on poposterone.
Speaker 6: That's insane.
Speaker 11: Well everybody knows. It makes you feel really good as
Speaker 11: a man. You're sixty years old, suddenly you feel thirty six. Okay,
Speaker 11: but it comes at the price of frustration and anger
Speaker 11: and really short tempers. Add that to the impulsivity substance
Speaker 11: use disorder, and you could have, you know, a dark
Speaker 11: rabbit hole, a hidden monster in the shadows, and somebody
Speaker 11: who's not going to listen to somebody when they say, oh,
Speaker 11: you know, it's taken a few too many ketamine pills.
Speaker 11: Ketamine spray is not something you do every day. It's
Speaker 11: once or twice a month with counseling session.
Speaker 1: And because he had the pills in his stomach still
Speaker 1: at the time of autopsy, we know it was rogue
Speaker 1: ketamine and not the type used for infusion treatment. And
Speaker 1: of course you've got the other factor weighing into Matthew
Speaker 1: Pierry's death, and that is with all these drugs in
Speaker 1: the system, he gets into the pool the hot tip
Speaker 1: and it's not the first time. Take a listen to
Speaker 1: our cut thirteen, how you doing.
Speaker 8: It's in security from Beverly Hilton Kio going on, I
Speaker 8: need a paramedic Franly, I got a point securial femail
Speaker 8: done in the bathroom.
Speaker 9: The fellow guy right now.
Speaker 5: But they're requesting paramedic crew.
Speaker 14: Okay, Para fell out there and love Riomcannel.
Speaker 4: I'm not sure she fell.
Speaker 5: She was in the bathroom with the water fourth fourth.
Speaker 1: Sixty four four three four.
Speaker 8: I'm sorry, the net the room four three four yeah, okay,
Speaker 8: and they're not eft or anything else.
Speaker 3: There's room four three four thirty four.
Speaker 5: Yeah, okay, you don't know see your country of breathing
Speaker 5: at all.
Speaker 8: Apparently she wasn't breathing and she's twenty six year old.
Speaker 14: She was not breathing.
Speaker 5: Yeah, okay, but see you in breathing.
Speaker 4: I aw, I don't know.
Speaker 5: Okay, it's the first thing that called me was guy
Speaker 5: ray and okay, much out of it. Okay, you know,
Speaker 5: got right here to go in there now, Okay.
Speaker 8: We'll come.
Speaker 5: Please go fire over there with that person not breathing,
Speaker 5: there's kind of like the first one.
Speaker 8: Still not breathing.
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's correct.
Speaker 11: Okay, we'll get in there for not bringing really give
Speaker 11: me to the.
Speaker 9: Room plan you can I get too, pr Yeah, we're
Speaker 9: going there now, can you give me into the rooms.
Speaker 3: I can try to get kepr on trucks.
Speaker 1: Oh, I'm sorry, uh no, because he kept.
Speaker 5: Hanging up on us, kept hanging up on you. Yeah, okay, right,
Speaker 5: we're good there unit with okay, okay, thank you away.
Speaker 1: And there was water in Whitney Houston's lungs, indicating she
Speaker 1: was alive when she was submerged under water. But according
Speaker 1: to what we learn, the level of cocaine in Whitney
Speaker 1: Houston's body was not but it was enough to make
Speaker 1: her unaware of the fact she was going under water,
Speaker 1: and in an eerie twist, the same thing happens to
Speaker 1: her daughter. To listen to our cut, sixteen.
Speaker 9: The only child of Whitney Houston and Bobby Brown, Bobby
Speaker 9: Christina Brown wanted to follow her mother's footsteps as a
Speaker 9: singer and actress. Tyler Perry cast Bobby Christina Brown in
Speaker 9: his television series For Better or Worse and had high
Speaker 9: praise for her work. In her personal life, she became
Speaker 9: engaged in Nick Gordon, a friend of the family who
Speaker 9: lived with them from the age of twelve. Never officially
Speaker 9: adopted by Whitney Houston and Bobby Brown, Bobby Christina Brown
Speaker 9: referred to him as her big Bra online. Their engagement
Speaker 9: shocked many. On January thirty first, twenty fifteen, Nick Gordon
Speaker 9: found Bobby Christina face down unconscious in a bathtub in
Speaker 9: her home in Alfaretta, Georgia.
Speaker 1: And then just recently, we lose another celebrity, Aaron Carter
Speaker 1: in our cut twenty one.
Speaker 9: As the younger brother of Nick Carter of the Bakstreet Boys,
Speaker 9: Aaron Carter had a connection to the Big time. He
Speaker 9: could sing, he could dance, and he had the look
Speaker 9: as with most teen idols when they're fifteen minutes is up.
Speaker 9: Aeron Carter struggled. His first stint in a treatment facility
Speaker 9: was announced by his manager when the singer was just
Speaker 9: twenty three. Then a year later, it was announced that
Speaker 9: he completed a twenty eight day rehab stint at the
Speaker 9: Betty Ford Center. On November fourth, twenty twenty two, Aaron
Speaker 9: Carter's housekeeper found his body in the bathtub at his home.
Speaker 9: The Los Angeles County Department of Medical Examiner Corner ruled
Speaker 9: cause of death was attributed to drowning after inhaling die
Speaker 9: floro ethane and taking the generic form of the brand
Speaker 9: name xanax. The report also indicated that Carter was incapacitated
Speaker 9: while in the bathtub due to the effects of the
Speaker 9: drugs he took, which contributed to his death by drowning.
Speaker 9: Aaron Carter was thirty four.
Speaker 1: You know, Winny Patrick, California prosecutor and author. So many people,
Speaker 1: not just celebrities, die in pools and hot tubs after
Speaker 1: too many drugs or too much alcohol.
Speaker 8: Yeah, it's so unfortunate. You know, we only hear about
Speaker 8: some of these famous people because they're famous. Think about
Speaker 8: how many men and women, friends, neighbors, family members die
Speaker 8: in the same way. But maybe don't just grab headlines.
Speaker 8: It's one of the reasons we always want to reach
Speaker 8: out sooner rather than later for people that are struggling.
Speaker 8: And I like the way in that last flip they
Speaker 8: talked a little bit about what happens after the fame.
Speaker 11: You know.
Speaker 8: One of the things that Matthew Perry said, he said,
Speaker 8: taking kay is like being hit in the head with
Speaker 8: a giant happy shovel. But the hangover outweighed the benefits.
Speaker 8: And that's part of what I think celebrities are getting
Speaker 8: better at explaining and that yes, perhaps they're self medicating,
Speaker 8: but it's not worth it in the end. And that's
Speaker 8: one of the messages that Matthew Perry wanted to leave.
Speaker 1: Us with Karen start joining us a renowned psychologist. Karen,
Speaker 1: we know that Matthew Perry told everyone he had been
Speaker 1: clean going on two years? Is that common for addicts
Speaker 1: to insist their claim.
Speaker 7: Is tremendous amount of denial nancy because they really are
Speaker 7: struggling in most cases to be clean. They don't want
Speaker 7: to be addicted, but they're very, very susceptible. And when
Speaker 7: you think about somebody who's famous like that, there are
Speaker 7: always people around who were willing to oblige them with
Speaker 7: drugs and tempt them with drugs because they want to
Speaker 7: make them happy, they want to be around the celebrity.
Speaker 7: It's something that happens all the time. So I am
Speaker 7: sure he was trying but obviously not exceeding, or that
Speaker 7: ketamine would not have been there.
Speaker 1: He had really been through a battle. I want you
Speaker 1: to take a listen to our cut four our friends
Speaker 1: from crime online. Something I didn't know until after Matthew
Speaker 1: Perry passed away after years of addiction.
Speaker 14: Matthew Perry spent five months in the hospital after his
Speaker 14: colon burst from prolonged opioid abuse. Perry says he was
Speaker 14: in surgery for seven hours, in a coma for two weeks,
Speaker 14: and doctors told his family he had a two percent
Speaker 14: chance of survival. After leaving the hospital, Perry used a
Speaker 14: colossomy bag for months.
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.
Speaker 2: Sister Caitlin joins Madeline Morrison, stating, I know when Kenny
Speaker 2: left the house he was doing one of two things,
Speaker 2: either escaping from something he knew he had done, or
Speaker 2: willfully abandoning a vulnerable person in a dangerous situation. How
Speaker 2: did Matthew Perry die?
Speaker 1: Doctor William Maroney joining us the pre eminent expert in
Speaker 1: this field, Doctor Moroney, I believe that if my colon
Speaker 1: had burst from along drug use, I would go through
Speaker 1: hell in high water not to get addicted again. But
Speaker 1: see that's me on the outside looking in because I'm
Speaker 1: not addicted. Addicts tell me that they can't stop themselves.
Speaker 11: What it is is, there is an insight issue that
Speaker 11: comes with substance use disorder, and the only way you
Speaker 11: can rewire the brain. It's like rewiring a vacuum cleaner,
Speaker 11: rewiring a radio, or you know, rewiring a power strip.
Speaker 11: You rewire the brain, not by feeding the body drugs
Speaker 11: just as a substitute, but in depth therapy, making selections,
Speaker 11: looking at the trauma in your life, choosing not to
Speaker 11: be impulsive, choosing to process your stress. You have to
Speaker 11: do that with another person, face to face. It's not
Speaker 11: always about the drugs. He may have been clean from
Speaker 11: heroin for two years, but his brain was not done
Speaker 11: processing that. Impulsivity and impulsivity, poor processing, and lack of insight.
Speaker 11: Those are the three things that substance use disorder people
Speaker 11: suffer with every single for alcohol, heroin. Okay, those are
Speaker 11: the three things. And the only way through that rewiring
Speaker 11: is with another person in a chair, face to face,
Speaker 11: and that's just not being done today. Everybody wants a pill,
Speaker 11: they want to quick fix, and these rogue doctors are
Speaker 11: not getting people the therapy they need. In the end,
Speaker 11: the same thing is going to happen. Somebody's going to
Speaker 11: be investigated by the medical board. There'll be another trial
Speaker 11: in a year, somebody's going to lose their license. And
Speaker 11: it's so sad that Matthew Perry had to die this way.
Speaker 1: Same thing with Michael Jackson, Conrad Murray. There was a trial,
Speaker 1: he gets convicted. In the end he walks free, and
Speaker 1: Michael Jackson still did same thing with Matthew Perry. A
Speaker 1: bright light has been extinguished because of ketamine. And I
Speaker 1: want to follow up with Miguel Melndez, Senior reporter, Entertainment Tonight. Miguel,
Speaker 1: I had no idea that Matthew Perry had been through
Speaker 1: so much in his battle, even having his colon burst
Speaker 1: from prolonged opioid abuse. But there's more, Miguel, let's nowur
Speaker 1: cut five.
Speaker 14: Two years after his near death experience, Matthew Perry goes
Speaker 14: to a rehab facility in Switzerland. He wrote that he
Speaker 14: faked pains and dumbs to get oxy conton during COVID.
Speaker 14: He was also getting daily ketamine infusions. While at the facility,
Speaker 14: Perry needed to have surgery and was given propofol. When
Speaker 14: he woke up eleven hours later, he found out his
Speaker 14: heart had stopped for five minutes and during the long
Speaker 14: CPR process, eight of his ribs were broken. The doctor
Speaker 14: then refused more mets.
Speaker 1: So this guy, Matthew Perry, I mean, we look at him, Miguel,
Speaker 1: and we think, Wow, he's famous. He's a star. He's
Speaker 1: got all this money in this beautiful home. This guy
Speaker 1: was in a living hell that nobody knew about. I mean,
Speaker 1: he had his colum burst from opioid use. Then he
Speaker 1: dies essentially during a surgery and all eight of his
Speaker 1: ribs are broken during CPR, and yet he went back
Speaker 1: to his own hellhole. He couldn't stop himself. Miguil, Yeah.
Speaker 5: I mean it's tragic. All these near death experiences rooted
Speaker 5: from his need of these substances. And he wrote in
Speaker 5: his book that he thought that the only reason why
Speaker 5: he was revived and given CPR in such aggressive manner
Speaker 5: was because person performing the CPR said, I can't let
Speaker 5: the guy from Friends die on my table.
Speaker 6: That can't happen on my watch.
Speaker 5: So in retrospect, Perry asked himself, had I not been
Speaker 5: on Friends, would they have stopped giving me CPR after
Speaker 5: three minutes? And said they went five minutes, five of them.
Speaker 5: And you talk about these drugs in his system. And
Speaker 5: even when he was detoxing in the final episode of
Speaker 5: Friends in two thousand and four, when the episode ended
Speaker 5: and it all came to a close and everyone felt emotional,
Speaker 5: not just the cast and the crew, but everyone who
Speaker 5: was tuned in to that show. Perry himself said in
Speaker 5: his book that he felt nothing because the detox drug
Speaker 5: that was in his system at the time made him
Speaker 5: feel numb. So even in the happiest moments, or what
Speaker 5: should have been the happiest moments of his life, he
Speaker 5: felt nothing. And again, it all rooted because of the
Speaker 5: substance issue that he's had for so long.
Speaker 1: Miguel, you are bringing up a whole other issue, not
Speaker 1: only the battle against addiction, but how it affects your
Speaker 1: life day to day. He couldn't even feel regular emotions.
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, this morning, when I was driving
Speaker 1: the twins to school, I was so happy just being
Speaker 1: with them. What a loss in your life not to
Speaker 1: be able to feel all those wonderful things. And guys,
Speaker 1: we're finding out now how his ketemine addiction began. Take
Speaker 1: your listen to Our cut six Our Friend. Investigative reporter Nicole.
Speaker 4: Parton Matthew Perry wrote about the ketamine infusions he received
Speaker 4: at the Swiss Clinic. He explained in his memoir that
Speaker 4: ketamine quote has my name written all over it. They
Speaker 4: might as well have called it Maddie. The New York
Speaker 4: Post reports that Perry described the drug as a giant
Speaker 4: exhale and said he would be blindfolded and listening to
Speaker 4: music when he got his injections. Perry also said he
Speaker 4: would disassociate during the infusions and often felt as if
Speaker 4: he were dying. Perry said he kept signing up for
Speaker 4: it because it was something different, and quote, anything different
Speaker 4: is good. Taking kay is like being hit in the
Speaker 4: head with a giant, happy shovel, but the hangover was
Speaker 4: rough and outweighed the shovel. Still in his memoir, Perry
Speaker 4: says ketamine was not for me.
Speaker 1: You know, doctor Maroney, Ketamine is my new nightmare, my
Speaker 1: new nightmare because I've never knowne of it actually killing
Speaker 1: anyone until now.
Speaker 11: Well, I think the ketamine awareness has went from zero
Speaker 11: to a hundred on our national barometer. But the whole
Speaker 11: idea is effective, evidence based FDA proved ketamine treatment comes
Speaker 11: with counseling, and where we have rogue doctors and really
Speaker 11: dark rabbit holes is people are going to look for
Speaker 11: this stuff and not match it to the counseling. The
Speaker 11: lack of feeling that he had meant that he was
Speaker 11: just altered by drugs. Seeing people having emotions. You know
Speaker 11: you talked about your kids. I got kids the same age.
Speaker 11: Where's the celebrities with taking their kids to school? They
Speaker 11: miss all that stuff. They're in they're in clinics, they're
Speaker 11: in rehab, their their homes are in the hills, and
Speaker 11: nobody had families out there that let's get back to
Speaker 11: simple things. If you're gonna do ketamine, you're gonna seek
Speaker 11: it out. Seek out the FDA approved ketamine, the counseling,
Speaker 11: the psychiatrist of behavioral health clinics, not the rogue. Rogue
Speaker 11: leads to death. You know.
Speaker 1: One saying that Matthew Perry said. He said that when
Speaker 1: I ever die, I'm probably going to be remembered from
Speaker 1: my role in Friends. But what I want to be
Speaker 1: remembered for is how I helped people and maybe helped
Speaker 1: them get out of or avoid addiction. And he has
Speaker 1: done that. He has helped so many people, and he's
Speaker 1: helping us now spreading the word about ketamine. It's not
Speaker 1: over yet.
Speaker 2: This whole group are like wet cats and a barrel,
Speaker 2: fighting and clawing for a way out. We wait as
Speaker 2: justice unfolds. Nancy Gray's crime Stories, signing off