1 00:00:02,800 --> 00:00:05,680 Speaker 1: Billy said, well, now if you kill her, you're gonna 2 00:00:05,680 --> 00:00:09,080 Speaker 1: have to kill Chris and Frankie because they will know 3 00:00:09,200 --> 00:00:12,160 Speaker 1: you get it and they will come after you. Jake 4 00:00:12,200 --> 00:00:15,480 Speaker 1: testify George was in a firing position. Jake said he 5 00:00:15,560 --> 00:00:18,720 Speaker 1: told him to shoot, but he didn't. Jake Jake the 6 00:00:18,800 --> 00:00:22,520 Speaker 1: rifle from George, and then when Chris shows up in 7 00:00:22,560 --> 00:00:26,280 Speaker 1: the doorway, he shoots over. What really stood out to 8 00:00:26,320 --> 00:00:30,200 Speaker 1: me was just the way he talked about killing people 9 00:00:30,640 --> 00:00:38,959 Speaker 1: like it was no big deal. This is the Pike 10 00:00:39,040 --> 00:00:45,360 Speaker 1: Damasacer returned to Pike County season four, episode eighteen. Jake 11 00:00:45,400 --> 00:00:49,920 Speaker 1: Wagner on the stand. I'm Courtney Armstrong, a television producer 12 00:00:49,960 --> 00:00:54,080 Speaker 1: at Kat's Studios with Stephanie Leidecker and Jeff Shane. It's 13 00:00:54,080 --> 00:00:57,240 Speaker 1: important to note that George Wagner the fourth pleaded not 14 00:00:57,360 --> 00:01:01,480 Speaker 1: guilty to all charges. His father, Billy Wagner, whose trial 15 00:01:01,560 --> 00:01:06,160 Speaker 1: is upcoming, also pleaded not guilty to all charges. At 16 00:01:06,160 --> 00:01:08,880 Speaker 1: the beginning of the eighth week of testimony, I traveled 17 00:01:08,920 --> 00:01:11,720 Speaker 1: to Ohio to be in the courtroom when jurors heard 18 00:01:11,760 --> 00:01:14,120 Speaker 1: from the man who seems to be at the center 19 00:01:14,480 --> 00:01:21,240 Speaker 1: of this trial, Jake Wagner. In April of twenty twenty one, 20 00:01:21,400 --> 00:01:24,479 Speaker 1: on the five year anniversary of the murders, Jake pled 21 00:01:24,480 --> 00:01:27,520 Speaker 1: guilty to eight counts of aggravated murder and agreed to 22 00:01:27,600 --> 00:01:31,760 Speaker 1: testify against his own family, including his older brother George. 23 00:01:33,880 --> 00:01:37,120 Speaker 1: In exchange, the prosecution removed the death penalty as a 24 00:01:37,160 --> 00:01:41,200 Speaker 1: possible punishment for all. Wagner's judge, Randy Dearing, allowed Jake 25 00:01:41,240 --> 00:01:44,880 Speaker 1: Wagner to opt out from having his testimony recorded. That's 26 00:01:44,920 --> 00:01:49,320 Speaker 1: why we will not hear Jake Wagner's voice in this episode. Still, 27 00:01:49,560 --> 00:01:56,000 Speaker 1: his testimony is chilling, dramatic testimony in Pike County Today, 28 00:01:56,200 --> 00:01:59,440 Speaker 1: brother versus brother. Today, Jake Wagner took the stand against 29 00:01:59,640 --> 00:02:03,040 Speaker 1: George Wagner the fourth. When Jake Wagner entered the courtroom, 30 00:02:03,080 --> 00:02:06,120 Speaker 1: both his hands and feet were shackled with long chain manacles. 31 00:02:06,880 --> 00:02:10,280 Speaker 1: He wore thick black glasses and a prison issued tan jumpsuit. 32 00:02:10,840 --> 00:02:14,200 Speaker 1: His hair was slicked back and in a ponytail. I 33 00:02:14,240 --> 00:02:16,520 Speaker 1: was not surprised to see him in jail clothes. You know, 34 00:02:16,560 --> 00:02:19,040 Speaker 1: a lot of the reporters had been speculating that, oh, 35 00:02:19,080 --> 00:02:20,920 Speaker 1: maybe they'll put him in street clothes. And I just 36 00:02:20,960 --> 00:02:25,680 Speaker 1: thought to myself, I've never seen an inmate testify. Was 37 00:02:25,680 --> 00:02:29,760 Speaker 1: put in street clothes. I mean the prosecution wanted these 38 00:02:29,800 --> 00:02:32,160 Speaker 1: people to be seen or at least Jake and Angela 39 00:02:32,280 --> 00:02:35,560 Speaker 1: as criminals. Now twenty nine years old, Jake Wagner has 40 00:02:35,600 --> 00:02:38,160 Speaker 1: been in the Franklin County jail for nearly four years. 41 00:02:38,800 --> 00:02:42,400 Speaker 1: The only noticeable change in his appearance as he looked stronger. 42 00:02:42,960 --> 00:02:45,400 Speaker 1: He looked fitter than the thin, gangly man he was 43 00:02:45,480 --> 00:02:50,320 Speaker 1: before his arrest. He looks like a different person. Now 44 00:02:50,560 --> 00:02:53,200 Speaker 1: you see Jake as a teenager and suddenly you got 45 00:02:53,200 --> 00:02:55,640 Speaker 1: a cod sitting there at that big table there in 46 00:02:55,639 --> 00:02:59,240 Speaker 1: a courthouse. It's an understatement to say Jake Wagner's testimony 47 00:02:59,280 --> 00:03:03,600 Speaker 1: has been highly an dissipated. Unsurprisingly, the courtroom was packed. 48 00:03:04,160 --> 00:03:08,400 Speaker 1: This is me speaking with Stephanie from Ohio. Was anybody 49 00:03:08,680 --> 00:03:12,200 Speaker 1: on the Wagner side that you could identify or was 50 00:03:12,240 --> 00:03:16,880 Speaker 1: it still a total no show for George. There wasn't 51 00:03:16,960 --> 00:03:21,680 Speaker 1: a seat to be had completely filled, including extra seats 52 00:03:21,680 --> 00:03:24,040 Speaker 1: that were put into the aisles, so that was just 53 00:03:24,080 --> 00:03:26,680 Speaker 1: getting in. So it felt unlike any other day in 54 00:03:26,720 --> 00:03:29,720 Speaker 1: the trial so far. It was a real buzz. There 55 00:03:29,760 --> 00:03:33,960 Speaker 1: appeared to be no one there for George Wagner. A 56 00:03:34,000 --> 00:03:37,520 Speaker 1: lot of the people outside of the media and victims' 57 00:03:37,520 --> 00:03:40,360 Speaker 1: family members were family members of the attorneys on the 58 00:03:40,400 --> 00:03:44,360 Speaker 1: prosecution and defense sides. That's interesting because you never would 59 00:03:44,400 --> 00:03:47,840 Speaker 1: really think that that's who would come, but this is 60 00:03:47,880 --> 00:03:51,320 Speaker 1: their big moment, So for family members of the lawyers, 61 00:03:52,200 --> 00:03:55,280 Speaker 1: that does make sense. After Jake took the stand, he 62 00:03:55,320 --> 00:03:57,800 Speaker 1: looked directly at his brother George from across the room 63 00:03:57,880 --> 00:04:01,360 Speaker 1: and smiled. For a brief moment, they made eye contact 64 00:04:01,720 --> 00:04:05,120 Speaker 1: the first time in years before George looked away. Here's 65 00:04:05,200 --> 00:04:08,600 Speaker 1: reporter Anjeanette Levy, who was in the courtroom. I was 66 00:04:08,600 --> 00:04:12,160 Speaker 1: sitting right behind George, and George made eye contact with him, 67 00:04:12,320 --> 00:04:14,280 Speaker 1: but I don't think it was for very long. Was 68 00:04:14,320 --> 00:04:17,320 Speaker 1: pretty short lived. And Jake just kind of, you know, 69 00:04:17,760 --> 00:04:19,960 Speaker 1: he kept looking around a little bit like he was 70 00:04:20,080 --> 00:04:22,239 Speaker 1: very It was almost kind of like this alert look. 71 00:04:22,320 --> 00:04:24,960 Speaker 1: He kept like turning his head, looking back and forth, 72 00:04:25,640 --> 00:04:30,919 Speaker 1: and you know, then things started. The questioning started. Prosecutor 73 00:04:30,920 --> 00:04:34,000 Speaker 1: Anjiecineppa started by asking Jake if it was difficult to 74 00:04:34,040 --> 00:04:37,640 Speaker 1: testify against his own family. He said it was very difficult. 75 00:04:37,760 --> 00:04:40,359 Speaker 1: When he was asked, would you love nothing more for 76 00:04:40,440 --> 00:04:42,840 Speaker 1: your brother, your mother, and your father to be able 77 00:04:42,920 --> 00:04:46,599 Speaker 1: to go home, and he said yes. The only other 78 00:04:46,680 --> 00:04:49,479 Speaker 1: emotion Jake appeared to show that morning was when he 79 00:04:49,560 --> 00:04:53,040 Speaker 1: mouthed quote, I am sorry, in the direction of the 80 00:04:53,120 --> 00:04:57,040 Speaker 1: Rodent family sitting in the courtroom. Then he calmly and 81 00:04:57,080 --> 00:05:01,680 Speaker 1: with little emotion, walked jurors through the killings. During more 82 00:05:01,720 --> 00:05:05,240 Speaker 1: than six hours of detailed testimony, Jake Wagner explained why 83 00:05:05,240 --> 00:05:08,039 Speaker 1: he wanted to kill Hannah Rodin, the mother of his child. 84 00:05:09,160 --> 00:05:13,280 Speaker 1: With Jake Wagner, what's fascinating about him is that he's 85 00:05:13,360 --> 00:05:17,800 Speaker 1: kind of the doorway into what can be described only 86 00:05:17,800 --> 00:05:21,080 Speaker 1: as a horror show. It's not just the night of 87 00:05:21,080 --> 00:05:23,880 Speaker 1: the homicide, it's everything leading up to it. It's a 88 00:05:24,120 --> 00:05:29,000 Speaker 1: life that these people led in the year's preceding. Jake 89 00:05:29,040 --> 00:05:32,839 Speaker 1: Wagner detailed how his family's criminal activity began long before 90 00:05:32,839 --> 00:05:36,239 Speaker 1: they were arrested for the Rodent, Manly and Gilly murders. 91 00:05:38,240 --> 00:05:41,920 Speaker 1: Prosecutor and Jacineppa asked Jake Wagner about the various homes 92 00:05:42,000 --> 00:05:46,280 Speaker 1: and vehicles his family owned. We found out through Jake 93 00:05:46,320 --> 00:05:49,919 Speaker 1: Wagner's testimony today that he, his brother, and his father 94 00:05:49,960 --> 00:05:53,560 Speaker 1: would commit crimes together, including multiple our sins to collect 95 00:05:53,560 --> 00:05:58,320 Speaker 1: insurance money and stealing high priced item from businesses. Jake 96 00:05:58,360 --> 00:06:00,960 Speaker 1: admitted that his parents set fire to their own home 97 00:06:01,080 --> 00:06:04,560 Speaker 1: on Bethel Hill Road to collect the insurance benefits. He 98 00:06:04,640 --> 00:06:08,200 Speaker 1: also testified that the Wagners torched multiple vehicles for the 99 00:06:08,240 --> 00:06:11,840 Speaker 1: same reason. Jake said they would steal everything from fuel, 100 00:06:11,920 --> 00:06:15,279 Speaker 1: to building materials to livestock, also that he learned to 101 00:06:15,279 --> 00:06:18,359 Speaker 1: pick a lock at a very young age. Here again 102 00:06:18,600 --> 00:06:21,919 Speaker 1: is long crime reporter an Jeannette Levy. She's followed by 103 00:06:22,000 --> 00:06:28,080 Speaker 1: forensic investigator Joseph Scott Morgan. They were taught these things 104 00:06:28,760 --> 00:06:31,360 Speaker 1: so that they could get away with crimes, and not 105 00:06:31,400 --> 00:06:34,680 Speaker 1: necessarily so they could be like good human beings. I mean, 106 00:06:34,720 --> 00:06:37,280 Speaker 1: they were raised to be criminals. It's quite sad when 107 00:06:37,320 --> 00:06:40,119 Speaker 1: you listen to them talk about how their dad would 108 00:06:40,120 --> 00:06:42,040 Speaker 1: sit them down with like a lock pick set when 109 00:06:42,080 --> 00:06:45,760 Speaker 1: they were seven, nine years old something like that, and 110 00:06:45,839 --> 00:06:50,280 Speaker 1: teach them how to pick locks and weird games about oh, 111 00:06:50,360 --> 00:06:52,400 Speaker 1: if you were out and about and you spot a cop, 112 00:06:52,440 --> 00:06:56,160 Speaker 1: you get a dollar. When you hear about the way 113 00:06:57,040 --> 00:07:00,600 Speaker 1: that Jake grew up, where he was essentially the discipled 114 00:07:00,920 --> 00:07:05,400 Speaker 1: into a life of crime, Billy described it as he 115 00:07:05,480 --> 00:07:09,200 Speaker 1: was teaching his boy survival skills, you know, how to 116 00:07:10,200 --> 00:07:12,320 Speaker 1: essentially steal a car or hot wire car in case 117 00:07:12,360 --> 00:07:15,640 Speaker 1: he ever got quote unquote kidnapped. And I'm thinking, you know, 118 00:07:15,840 --> 00:07:18,720 Speaker 1: I don't know of any parent out there that sits 119 00:07:18,760 --> 00:07:21,720 Speaker 1: around and thinks, well, let me tell my child how 120 00:07:21,760 --> 00:07:24,120 Speaker 1: to steal a car in case they ever get kidnapped. 121 00:07:24,520 --> 00:07:27,680 Speaker 1: I wonder, I wonder where all changes, entire rotations came in. 122 00:07:27,760 --> 00:07:30,080 Speaker 1: You know, did you at least talk about that first, 123 00:07:30,320 --> 00:07:32,200 Speaker 1: you know, And he's saying this, he's saying this from 124 00:07:32,240 --> 00:07:35,720 Speaker 1: the stand, and you're really getting a peek behind the 125 00:07:35,800 --> 00:07:41,520 Speaker 1: curtain at this life that they led. Jake told the 126 00:07:41,560 --> 00:07:44,920 Speaker 1: courtroom his relationship with Hannah may Rodin began when she 127 00:07:45,040 --> 00:07:48,280 Speaker 1: was just thirteen years old. He said he met Hannah 128 00:07:48,360 --> 00:07:50,680 Speaker 1: at the Pike County Fair where she was showing off 129 00:07:50,720 --> 00:07:54,320 Speaker 1: her pet rabbits. Despite being four years older than Hannah, 130 00:07:54,440 --> 00:07:56,880 Speaker 1: Jake asked her parents, Dana and Chris Rodin, if he 131 00:07:56,920 --> 00:08:02,480 Speaker 1: could date her. At times, their relationship was violent. Prosecutor 132 00:08:02,480 --> 00:08:05,440 Speaker 1: Angie Kinneppa asked Jake if he ever choked his young girlfriend, 133 00:08:05,840 --> 00:08:10,040 Speaker 1: as hannahme had once claimed, and he said, I never 134 00:08:10,120 --> 00:08:12,600 Speaker 1: choked her. And he was very like adamant about it, 135 00:08:13,040 --> 00:08:17,320 Speaker 1: and he said she was having a fit, and you know, 136 00:08:17,400 --> 00:08:20,280 Speaker 1: I held her up against the wall and I put 137 00:08:20,320 --> 00:08:23,800 Speaker 1: my arm on her collarbone, but I didn't choke her. 138 00:08:24,000 --> 00:08:26,840 Speaker 1: I just held her there until she calmed down. And 139 00:08:26,920 --> 00:08:30,400 Speaker 1: after he gave that answer, he kind of, like Angiekineppa, 140 00:08:30,480 --> 00:08:32,760 Speaker 1: kind of made a sighing noise. But it was just 141 00:08:32,800 --> 00:08:35,559 Speaker 1: like he was talking about this, like, oh, I didn't 142 00:08:35,640 --> 00:08:38,480 Speaker 1: choke her. I was just you know, holding her there. 143 00:08:38,480 --> 00:08:43,800 Speaker 1: It was like this minimization or justification or rationalization for 144 00:08:44,360 --> 00:08:48,000 Speaker 1: basically holding your ex girlfriend against a wall because she 145 00:08:48,080 --> 00:08:51,520 Speaker 1: was upset about something. And you know he's claiming he 146 00:08:51,559 --> 00:08:54,520 Speaker 1: didn't choke her. Well, hanname saying he choked her like 147 00:08:54,600 --> 00:08:58,040 Speaker 1: that his arm was on her throat. So some of 148 00:08:58,040 --> 00:09:00,280 Speaker 1: these things were pretty strange to me the way he 149 00:09:00,280 --> 00:09:07,160 Speaker 1: would describe them. By age fifteen, Hannah Mae Rodent was 150 00:09:07,200 --> 00:09:09,840 Speaker 1: pregnant and gave birth to her daughter she shared with 151 00:09:09,920 --> 00:09:15,160 Speaker 1: Jake Wagner. Her tumultuous relationship with Jake ended in February 152 00:09:15,160 --> 00:09:17,960 Speaker 1: of twenty fifteen, a little more than a year before 153 00:09:18,000 --> 00:09:21,719 Speaker 1: the murders. Jake Wagner described his family's motive and one 154 00:09:21,720 --> 00:09:24,280 Speaker 1: of the worst massacres in Ohio's history that led to 155 00:09:24,320 --> 00:09:26,920 Speaker 1: the death of eight members of the Rodan family. After 156 00:09:26,960 --> 00:09:30,760 Speaker 1: their relationship broke up, Jake testified that he and his mother, 157 00:09:30,840 --> 00:09:33,839 Speaker 1: Angela began to have concerns about the safety of his daughter, 158 00:09:33,880 --> 00:09:36,360 Speaker 1: who was living with the Rodents. This was true in 159 00:09:36,360 --> 00:09:40,160 Speaker 1: particular after Hannah May started dating Corey Holdron, who Jake 160 00:09:40,240 --> 00:09:43,600 Speaker 1: believed was dealing drugs. Jake said he was concerned his 161 00:09:43,679 --> 00:09:45,960 Speaker 1: daughter wouldn't be safe living with the Rodents, even going 162 00:09:46,000 --> 00:09:49,119 Speaker 1: as far as saying he was concerned would be molested, 163 00:09:49,160 --> 00:09:52,280 Speaker 1: since he said it happened in both his family and 164 00:09:52,360 --> 00:10:00,200 Speaker 1: Hannah's family, Jake testified that his mother, Angela Wagner, was 165 00:10:00,280 --> 00:10:05,200 Speaker 1: monitoring Hannah May's private Facebook conversations. Jake's concern for his 166 00:10:05,320 --> 00:10:07,679 Speaker 1: daughter only grew when he became aware of an online 167 00:10:07,760 --> 00:10:10,719 Speaker 1: conversation where Hannah said the only way she would give 168 00:10:10,800 --> 00:10:13,520 Speaker 1: up custody of their daughter is if the Wagners killed 169 00:10:13,559 --> 00:10:18,760 Speaker 1: her first. Wagner said that his father, Billy Wagner, first 170 00:10:18,800 --> 00:10:21,800 Speaker 1: mentioned a murder plot, but he would not let it happen. 171 00:10:22,640 --> 00:10:25,560 Speaker 1: Jake testified he told Hannah he was concerned that their 172 00:10:25,640 --> 00:10:30,120 Speaker 1: daughter could be molested, and he claims that Hannah was dismissive, saying, quote, 173 00:10:30,280 --> 00:10:32,400 Speaker 1: if that happens, we'll just have to deal with it. 174 00:10:32,840 --> 00:10:36,120 Speaker 1: That alleged response, Jake Wagner told the court was the 175 00:10:36,160 --> 00:10:40,960 Speaker 1: tipping point. Jake Wagner said, by the winter of twenty 176 00:10:41,000 --> 00:10:43,920 Speaker 1: fifteen and twenty sixteen, he was concerned that his daughter 177 00:10:44,000 --> 00:10:47,200 Speaker 1: with Hannah Rodin might be molested, so he decided his 178 00:10:47,240 --> 00:10:52,000 Speaker 1: only choice to protect his daughter was actually to kill Hannah. 179 00:10:52,120 --> 00:10:56,240 Speaker 1: The prosecution says basically that that was made up, this 180 00:10:56,360 --> 00:10:58,720 Speaker 1: fear that the little girl would be molested. The prosecution 181 00:10:58,800 --> 00:11:01,960 Speaker 1: basically says that was something they kind of whipped up 182 00:11:01,960 --> 00:11:05,880 Speaker 1: in their heads to justify what they wanted to do. 183 00:11:09,520 --> 00:11:12,360 Speaker 1: And we had earlier in the trial seeing text messages 184 00:11:12,440 --> 00:11:16,400 Speaker 1: or Facebook messages where Hana Ma and Jake were talking 185 00:11:16,400 --> 00:11:21,040 Speaker 1: about their child, and it was just amazing to me 186 00:11:21,240 --> 00:11:24,679 Speaker 1: that in some points he would say things like I'll 187 00:11:24,720 --> 00:11:27,080 Speaker 1: take her even if I have to do it by force, 188 00:11:28,240 --> 00:11:35,080 Speaker 1: just some really eerie foreshadowing. So it just seemed to 189 00:11:35,080 --> 00:11:38,840 Speaker 1: me that they, for whatever reason, and everybody wants their 190 00:11:38,920 --> 00:11:42,080 Speaker 1: children to be with them, but this seems to be 191 00:11:42,320 --> 00:11:45,640 Speaker 1: some type of demand, like, no, this child is going 192 00:11:45,679 --> 00:11:51,360 Speaker 1: to be with me. Once he made up his mind 193 00:11:51,520 --> 00:11:54,680 Speaker 1: that Hannah Mae had to be killed, Jake testified that 194 00:11:54,720 --> 00:11:59,960 Speaker 1: the Wagner family began to plan and plot. His first 195 00:12:00,000 --> 00:12:04,800 Speaker 1: idea was to frame Hannah's boyfriend, Corey Holdron. Here's James Pilcher, 196 00:12:05,120 --> 00:12:09,600 Speaker 1: longtime investigative reporter in Cincinnati, now with Local twelve. He's 197 00:12:09,640 --> 00:12:15,199 Speaker 1: followed by Long Crimes and Jeanette Levy. Jake was convinced 198 00:12:15,480 --> 00:12:19,000 Speaker 1: that something needed to be done, that they were going 199 00:12:19,040 --> 00:12:22,480 Speaker 1: to kill Hannah and Corey and make it look like 200 00:12:22,480 --> 00:12:25,680 Speaker 1: a murder suicide, and Billy said, no, you can't do 201 00:12:25,760 --> 00:12:27,680 Speaker 1: that either, because they'll figure out it was us and 202 00:12:27,720 --> 00:12:30,160 Speaker 1: they'll come after us. I don't want somebody up up 203 00:12:30,200 --> 00:12:32,640 Speaker 1: there on the hill with a sniper rifle killing us. 204 00:12:32,920 --> 00:12:35,600 Speaker 1: Billy said, well, now, if you kill her, you're gonna 205 00:12:35,640 --> 00:12:39,040 Speaker 1: have to kill Chris and Frankie because they will know 206 00:12:39,320 --> 00:12:41,160 Speaker 1: who you did it and they will come after you. 207 00:12:41,440 --> 00:12:45,120 Speaker 1: So it was just this insane like, oh yeah, I 208 00:12:45,160 --> 00:12:47,160 Speaker 1: mean you're gonna kill well, we're going to kill her. 209 00:12:47,559 --> 00:12:52,560 Speaker 1: We got to kill everybody else too. We're going to 210 00:12:52,600 --> 00:13:03,320 Speaker 1: take a break. We'll be back in a moment. Jake 211 00:13:03,360 --> 00:13:06,680 Speaker 1: said the Wagner spent three months preparing, buying everything from 212 00:13:06,679 --> 00:13:10,000 Speaker 1: ammunition to shoes from Walmart to a device to jam 213 00:13:10,080 --> 00:13:14,240 Speaker 1: phone calls. Jake even ordered a Captain America Winter Soldier mask, 214 00:13:14,440 --> 00:13:18,480 Speaker 1: specifically for his brother George to wear. Jake Wagner said 215 00:13:18,480 --> 00:13:21,520 Speaker 1: that his brother George, who's on trial, was with him 216 00:13:21,800 --> 00:13:23,839 Speaker 1: when he bought a pickup truck and a false truck 217 00:13:23,880 --> 00:13:28,320 Speaker 1: bed cover for those killings. On the afternoon of April 218 00:13:28,320 --> 00:13:31,480 Speaker 1: twenty first, Billy Wagner told his sons this would be 219 00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:37,120 Speaker 1: the night. Four days earlier, Hannah Rodin had given birth 220 00:13:37,200 --> 00:13:40,000 Speaker 1: to her second child, so they knew she would be home. 221 00:13:40,480 --> 00:13:44,079 Speaker 1: Billy Wagner also believed the cloudy weather would prevent surveillance 222 00:13:44,120 --> 00:13:47,720 Speaker 1: satellites from tracking their movements. Wagner said he dyed his 223 00:13:47,760 --> 00:13:50,600 Speaker 1: hair a dark brown, like a character in the movie Boondocks. 224 00:13:50,640 --> 00:13:53,800 Speaker 1: Saints Wagner said before heading out, he watched a clip 225 00:13:53,800 --> 00:13:56,520 Speaker 1: of the movie to quote psych myself into what I 226 00:13:56,600 --> 00:14:03,880 Speaker 1: was about to do next. Jake Wagner described how he 227 00:14:03,920 --> 00:14:06,600 Speaker 1: walked barefoot to the truck to avoid tracking any dirt 228 00:14:06,679 --> 00:14:10,640 Speaker 1: from his home. Here again, forensic expert Joseph Scott Morgan. 229 00:14:11,520 --> 00:14:15,040 Speaker 1: We have longed to hear about what happened that night, 230 00:14:15,960 --> 00:14:18,400 Speaker 1: what went into the planning. You know, I was particularly 231 00:14:18,640 --> 00:14:23,640 Speaker 1: interested in the care that Jake talked about with walking 232 00:14:23,680 --> 00:14:26,440 Speaker 1: barefoot when he went back to the vehicle. He wanted 233 00:14:26,480 --> 00:14:29,360 Speaker 1: to prevent any kind of prints being left behind. He 234 00:14:29,440 --> 00:14:32,040 Speaker 1: had enough sense about that, and he even knew about 235 00:14:32,080 --> 00:14:34,920 Speaker 1: soil types, which is fascinating to me, because you know, 236 00:14:34,920 --> 00:14:38,520 Speaker 1: there's an entire discipline. He's not a dummy. He was 237 00:14:38,560 --> 00:14:41,560 Speaker 1: aware of that. He had a sensitivity to it. I 238 00:14:41,600 --> 00:14:44,480 Speaker 1: think it's another kind of point along the continuum that 239 00:14:44,560 --> 00:14:50,600 Speaker 1: goes to kill, because that's a premeditative factor. Then Jake 240 00:14:50,680 --> 00:14:53,920 Speaker 1: described how they went from house to house, killing eight people. 241 00:14:55,160 --> 00:14:57,880 Speaker 1: Jake described how his father, Billy, as well as George 242 00:14:58,040 --> 00:15:00,560 Speaker 1: all took part in these murders. On that he went 243 00:15:00,560 --> 00:15:03,480 Speaker 1: into detail, describing that they modified the bet of their 244 00:15:03,520 --> 00:15:05,840 Speaker 1: truck in order to hide George and himself in the 245 00:15:05,920 --> 00:15:08,920 Speaker 1: back while his father drove them to the road and trailers. 246 00:15:10,600 --> 00:15:13,640 Speaker 1: Once at the Rodent's property on Union Hill Road, Billy 247 00:15:13,640 --> 00:15:17,200 Speaker 1: Wagner lured Chris Rodin outside. Jake said the plan was 248 00:15:17,200 --> 00:15:19,880 Speaker 1: to shoot Chris Senior as he and Billy walked back 249 00:15:19,880 --> 00:15:23,640 Speaker 1: towards the Rodents marijuana gross site, but the shot never came. 250 00:15:24,400 --> 00:15:27,280 Speaker 1: Prosecutors were asking if George was going to be involved 251 00:15:27,280 --> 00:15:30,520 Speaker 1: in the killings. Jake said yes. Jake testified that George 252 00:15:30,560 --> 00:15:34,000 Speaker 1: was actually supposed to kill Chris Roden SR. Jake testified 253 00:15:34,000 --> 00:15:36,960 Speaker 1: George was in a firing position. Jake said he told 254 00:15:37,040 --> 00:15:40,120 Speaker 1: him to shoot, but he didn't. After a few minutes outside, 255 00:15:40,200 --> 00:15:43,040 Speaker 1: Chris Senior and Billy Wagner went back into the trailer 256 00:15:43,080 --> 00:15:46,760 Speaker 1: where Chris's cousin, Gary Roden was. After a few minutes, 257 00:15:46,800 --> 00:15:49,120 Speaker 1: Billy was able to convince Chris to come to the 258 00:15:49,160 --> 00:15:55,200 Speaker 1: door one more time, and the killing spree began again. 259 00:15:55,760 --> 00:16:01,160 Speaker 1: Investigative reporters James Pilcher and an Jette Levy, Jake takes 260 00:16:01,200 --> 00:16:04,880 Speaker 1: the rifle from George and then when Chris shows up 261 00:16:04,920 --> 00:16:08,000 Speaker 1: in the doorway, he shoots him with the SCS and 262 00:16:08,040 --> 00:16:10,360 Speaker 1: he says he missed or couldn't get a shot. He 263 00:16:10,360 --> 00:16:13,080 Speaker 1: missed the first shot that went above him, and then 264 00:16:13,160 --> 00:16:15,480 Speaker 1: he'd lowered it close his eyes and just pulled off 265 00:16:15,520 --> 00:16:18,560 Speaker 1: a bunch of shots. And that's later corroborated by the 266 00:16:18,600 --> 00:16:20,880 Speaker 1: evidence where you see all of these other bullet holes 267 00:16:20,880 --> 00:16:24,520 Speaker 1: all around the door frame where he missed, but then 268 00:16:24,560 --> 00:16:28,040 Speaker 1: obviously in the line hit Chris in the shoulder and 269 00:16:28,160 --> 00:16:31,160 Speaker 1: the belly in the arm. I'll never forget seeing that 270 00:16:31,400 --> 00:16:34,400 Speaker 1: autopsy photo of the arm. What really stood out to 271 00:16:34,440 --> 00:16:38,320 Speaker 1: me was just the way he talked about killing people 272 00:16:38,760 --> 00:16:41,400 Speaker 1: like it was no big deal. You would think after 273 00:16:41,440 --> 00:16:45,000 Speaker 1: you maybe fired the first shot at somebody's head, you 274 00:16:45,120 --> 00:16:47,680 Speaker 1: might flinch, but it doesn't sound like there was any 275 00:16:47,680 --> 00:16:53,640 Speaker 1: flinching on Jake's part. Inside, Billy Wagner killed Gary Rodin 276 00:16:53,880 --> 00:16:57,800 Speaker 1: and fired several more shots into Chris Senior's body. Jake 277 00:16:57,840 --> 00:17:00,000 Speaker 1: Wagner said his father came running out of the house 278 00:17:00,280 --> 00:17:04,119 Speaker 1: in a quote nervous breakdown. Jake said that Billy came 279 00:17:04,280 --> 00:17:06,240 Speaker 1: out and was freaking out, and he was like, you 280 00:17:06,280 --> 00:17:09,200 Speaker 1: can't freak out now, it's too late. There's no turning back. 281 00:17:12,080 --> 00:17:14,840 Speaker 1: Jake went through Chris Roden Senior's pockets and grabbed the 282 00:17:14,920 --> 00:17:17,480 Speaker 1: keys to the marijuana shed so he could remove the 283 00:17:17,480 --> 00:17:20,600 Speaker 1: hard drive from the security system. When Jake returned to 284 00:17:20,640 --> 00:17:23,520 Speaker 1: the trailer, he said Chris and Gary Roden's bodies have 285 00:17:23,640 --> 00:17:27,000 Speaker 1: been moved into the back bedroom. Jake testified he threw 286 00:17:27,000 --> 00:17:29,560 Speaker 1: a blanket on top of them, but admitted to the 287 00:17:29,640 --> 00:17:33,280 Speaker 1: jury that he didn't know why. Throughout his testimony, Jake 288 00:17:33,280 --> 00:17:36,359 Speaker 1: appeared calm and responsive, and several times throughout it he 289 00:17:36,359 --> 00:17:38,760 Speaker 1: would even look at his brother George. However, I can 290 00:17:38,880 --> 00:17:41,159 Speaker 1: say that George would avert his gaze multiple times and 291 00:17:41,160 --> 00:17:44,520 Speaker 1: appeared to not even want to look at his brother. Next, 292 00:17:44,640 --> 00:17:48,080 Speaker 1: the Wagoners went to Frankie Rhoden's home. Jake said after 293 00:17:48,119 --> 00:17:50,359 Speaker 1: he crawled through a window, he let his brother and 294 00:17:50,400 --> 00:17:53,800 Speaker 1: father in through the front door. Frankie Roden's three year 295 00:17:53,840 --> 00:17:56,800 Speaker 1: old was lying on the couch. Jake said he walked 296 00:17:56,800 --> 00:17:59,400 Speaker 1: past the sleeping child to the back bedroom and shot 297 00:17:59,440 --> 00:18:03,200 Speaker 1: Frankie rod in his head as he slept. He further 298 00:18:03,320 --> 00:18:07,200 Speaker 1: testified that Frankie's fiance, Hannah Hazel Gilly, began to wake 299 00:18:07,880 --> 00:18:11,199 Speaker 1: and Jake said he shot her too. Then, for no 300 00:18:11,320 --> 00:18:15,639 Speaker 1: explained reason, Billy Wagner shot both Frankie and Hannah Hazel 301 00:18:15,680 --> 00:18:18,800 Speaker 1: Gilly in the head as well. Their six month old 302 00:18:18,840 --> 00:18:25,840 Speaker 1: son was sleeping between them. It was quite chilling in 303 00:18:25,840 --> 00:18:29,440 Speaker 1: a way, and I feel like that word is sometimes overused, 304 00:18:30,160 --> 00:18:33,280 Speaker 1: but just the matter of fact way in which he 305 00:18:33,960 --> 00:18:40,760 Speaker 1: described shooting people. It was just very nonchalant, according to Jake. 306 00:18:41,200 --> 00:18:44,840 Speaker 1: Then he his brother George and father Billy Wagner went 307 00:18:44,880 --> 00:18:48,159 Speaker 1: to Dana Roden's home. She had just arrived home from work. 308 00:18:48,840 --> 00:18:51,400 Speaker 1: The door was unlocked, and Jake said he just walked in. 309 00:18:52,000 --> 00:18:54,200 Speaker 1: He was surprised to see Dana awake in her bed. 310 00:18:54,920 --> 00:19:00,399 Speaker 1: Here again, investigative reporter an Jeannette Levy. He's literally standing 311 00:19:00,480 --> 00:19:02,679 Speaker 1: in the hallway, and he said he can see inside 312 00:19:02,760 --> 00:19:05,639 Speaker 1: Dana's bedroom from where he was standing, and then he 313 00:19:05,680 --> 00:19:09,000 Speaker 1: could also turn his head and see inside Handa Mae's bedroom. 314 00:19:09,040 --> 00:19:11,840 Speaker 1: He could see that Dana was on her cell phone. 315 00:19:11,880 --> 00:19:14,840 Speaker 1: He could see the light from her cell phone shining 316 00:19:14,880 --> 00:19:18,199 Speaker 1: on her face. And she made it. She looked at 317 00:19:18,280 --> 00:19:20,480 Speaker 1: him and made a gasp, and he said he took 318 00:19:20,480 --> 00:19:23,240 Speaker 1: a step and he shot her like I think twice, 319 00:19:23,480 --> 00:19:25,440 Speaker 1: and then he took and then he pivoted. He said 320 00:19:25,440 --> 00:19:27,240 Speaker 1: he was at a pivot point and he moved into 321 00:19:27,280 --> 00:19:30,120 Speaker 1: Hanna Mae's bedroom. She made a noise, she saw him, 322 00:19:30,560 --> 00:19:32,240 Speaker 1: and he shot her in the head. And then he 323 00:19:32,280 --> 00:19:35,080 Speaker 1: went back and he shot Dana again. There was no 324 00:19:35,359 --> 00:19:41,879 Speaker 1: hesitation on his part. It was just really disturbing. Before leaving, 325 00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:44,679 Speaker 1: Jake said he realized Hannah's fourty old newborn was in 326 00:19:44,720 --> 00:19:48,000 Speaker 1: the room and was concerned she might starve. He said, 327 00:19:48,119 --> 00:19:50,400 Speaker 1: you know, I know it doesn't really make sense, but 328 00:19:50,760 --> 00:19:53,800 Speaker 1: I didn't want to starve. I thought that if you know, 329 00:19:53,960 --> 00:19:56,560 Speaker 1: it took too long for them to find the bodies, 330 00:19:57,119 --> 00:20:01,800 Speaker 1: he might starve. So I moved Hannah so she could breastfeed. 331 00:20:01,880 --> 00:20:05,240 Speaker 1: I mean, it's a newborn baby. Newborn babies are helpless 332 00:20:05,240 --> 00:20:09,480 Speaker 1: as can be. And just that weird thought that you 333 00:20:09,560 --> 00:20:12,440 Speaker 1: thought a four or five day old baby is going 334 00:20:12,440 --> 00:20:16,720 Speaker 1: to nurse off her dead mother. It's just so crazy. 335 00:20:17,520 --> 00:20:21,080 Speaker 1: Jake Wagner then walked into Chris Roden Junior's bedroom and 336 00:20:21,119 --> 00:20:25,040 Speaker 1: shot him point blank. Jake said then that he, his 337 00:20:25,119 --> 00:20:28,840 Speaker 1: brother George, and father Billy drove to Kenneth Roden's home, 338 00:20:29,040 --> 00:20:32,800 Speaker 1: where his father Billy killed him. He was the final victim, 339 00:20:33,000 --> 00:20:37,000 Speaker 1: and he was murdered with one gunshot. According to Jake's testimony, 340 00:20:37,040 --> 00:20:41,240 Speaker 1: The Wagner's collected shellcasings, cell phones and returned to their 341 00:20:41,240 --> 00:20:45,040 Speaker 1: home on Peterson Road. Here's Jeff speaking with attorney and 342 00:20:45,119 --> 00:20:48,160 Speaker 1: legal analyst Mike Gallon on the impact of Jake Wagner's 343 00:20:48,240 --> 00:20:51,600 Speaker 1: chilling testimony. I'm just curious, like what your take on 344 00:20:51,880 --> 00:20:54,680 Speaker 1: those impactful moments are and how they kind of changed 345 00:20:54,680 --> 00:20:58,040 Speaker 1: the course of this trial moving forward. His testimony appeared 346 00:20:58,119 --> 00:21:01,840 Speaker 1: credible to me. It didn't sound like he was puffing 347 00:21:01,880 --> 00:21:05,719 Speaker 1: it up or exaggerating it to a great degree. And 348 00:21:05,760 --> 00:21:07,920 Speaker 1: I just think he was believable. And do you think 349 00:21:07,960 --> 00:21:12,760 Speaker 1: that level of gory detail, like Hannah Roden's last moments, 350 00:21:13,359 --> 00:21:16,200 Speaker 1: does that move the jury in a way that none 351 00:21:16,200 --> 00:21:20,560 Speaker 1: of the other stuff has probably up until this moment. Absolutely, absolutely. 352 00:21:21,080 --> 00:21:25,159 Speaker 1: I'm sure those jurors were riveted hearing that testimony, because, 353 00:21:25,600 --> 00:21:28,679 Speaker 1: I mean, you know, that's the guts of the whole thing. Again, 354 00:21:28,840 --> 00:21:32,040 Speaker 1: you know, that's why everyone is there, the judge, the jurors, 355 00:21:32,080 --> 00:21:35,960 Speaker 1: the prosecutor, the defense lawyer is because of what he did, 356 00:21:36,600 --> 00:21:39,320 Speaker 1: what Jake did at that time, and it's just a real, 357 00:21:39,920 --> 00:21:45,439 Speaker 1: real important part of the trial. In the aftermath of 358 00:21:45,520 --> 00:21:49,159 Speaker 1: Jake Wagner's first day of testimony, the media pol filed 359 00:21:49,200 --> 00:21:51,920 Speaker 1: emotion with Judge Randy Deering to allow cameras in the 360 00:21:51,960 --> 00:21:55,880 Speaker 1: courtroom for the rest of Jake's testimony. The media argued 361 00:21:56,040 --> 00:21:57,960 Speaker 1: that the public had a right to see and hear 362 00:21:58,040 --> 00:22:00,520 Speaker 1: all of the testimony in the most expense of murder 363 00:22:00,560 --> 00:22:05,560 Speaker 1: investigation in their state's history. Under Ohio law, witnesses can 364 00:22:05,560 --> 00:22:09,960 Speaker 1: object to being filmed or recorded. In early October, an 365 00:22:10,000 --> 00:22:13,040 Speaker 1: Ohio Court of Appeal sided with the media outlets who 366 00:22:13,119 --> 00:22:17,159 Speaker 1: challenged the law, striking down parts of it, but Judge 367 00:22:17,160 --> 00:22:20,479 Speaker 1: Deering continued to allow witnesses to opt out as is 368 00:22:20,520 --> 00:22:23,959 Speaker 1: his right. After Jake Wagner's first day of testimony, a 369 00:22:24,000 --> 00:22:27,280 Speaker 1: coalition of media groups hired a first Amendment rights lawyer 370 00:22:27,320 --> 00:22:30,920 Speaker 1: to visit the issue. Hearing was scheduled for the next day. 371 00:22:31,840 --> 00:22:37,120 Speaker 1: Here's James Pilcher. Another eventful day here in Waverley, as 372 00:22:37,320 --> 00:22:40,560 Speaker 1: Jake Wagner, the younger brother of defendant George Wagner, took 373 00:22:40,600 --> 00:22:43,520 Speaker 1: the stand for the second straight day to testify against 374 00:22:43,520 --> 00:22:47,560 Speaker 1: his brother. Inside the courtroom, prosecutor Angiecineppa asked Jake Wagner 375 00:22:47,600 --> 00:22:50,119 Speaker 1: to describe what he and his family did after arriving 376 00:22:50,160 --> 00:22:54,520 Speaker 1: at home immediately following the murders. Today's testimony were picked 377 00:22:54,560 --> 00:22:57,800 Speaker 1: up right where they left off Monday, where Jake, Billy, 378 00:22:57,960 --> 00:23:01,399 Speaker 1: and George had returned to home from the killings at 379 00:23:01,440 --> 00:23:04,600 Speaker 1: about four point thirty am on April twenty second. Now, 380 00:23:04,600 --> 00:23:06,760 Speaker 1: he says on that night they actually drove back to 381 00:23:06,800 --> 00:23:09,360 Speaker 1: their family barn and began burning their clothes to get 382 00:23:09,480 --> 00:23:12,119 Speaker 1: rid of any evidence on them. Jake also says he 383 00:23:12,160 --> 00:23:14,399 Speaker 1: took each of their guns and began cutting them in 384 00:23:14,440 --> 00:23:16,800 Speaker 1: half with power tools, and even went so far as 385 00:23:16,840 --> 00:23:22,840 Speaker 1: to try burning them with a torch. However, Jake said 386 00:23:22,880 --> 00:23:25,719 Speaker 1: he was unable to melt down the weapons, so instead 387 00:23:25,760 --> 00:23:29,040 Speaker 1: he burnt off the serial numbers and then hit them. 388 00:23:29,480 --> 00:23:31,760 Speaker 1: Then he admitted to burying pieces of the guns in 389 00:23:31,800 --> 00:23:34,239 Speaker 1: the barn underneath a support beam, which he dug up 390 00:23:34,240 --> 00:23:36,840 Speaker 1: with help from George. Once they were done cleaning up, 391 00:23:37,000 --> 00:23:40,040 Speaker 1: they went inside to change clothes. Jake said he saw 392 00:23:40,040 --> 00:23:42,520 Speaker 1: his mother, Angelo Agner in the kitchen, but did not 393 00:23:42,680 --> 00:23:46,080 Speaker 1: speak with her. Later in the morning, friend Andrew Carson 394 00:23:46,119 --> 00:23:48,960 Speaker 1: called Jake and asked if he'd heard what happened. Jake 395 00:23:49,080 --> 00:23:51,560 Speaker 1: said he had seen it on the news. Once news 396 00:23:51,560 --> 00:23:53,679 Speaker 1: of the rodent's death began to spread, Jake says he 397 00:23:53,760 --> 00:23:56,520 Speaker 1: refused to speak about it with his family while in private, 398 00:23:56,800 --> 00:23:59,600 Speaker 1: and even tried to forget about it completely out of guilt. 399 00:24:03,040 --> 00:24:14,600 Speaker 1: Let's stop here for another break Several weeks after the murderers, 400 00:24:14,680 --> 00:24:17,840 Speaker 1: Jake said BCI agents came to the Wagner's home. It 401 00:24:17,920 --> 00:24:20,600 Speaker 1: was after this visit that the Wagners began to worry 402 00:24:20,640 --> 00:24:24,200 Speaker 1: they were under surveillance. Billy Wagner decided they should dig 403 00:24:24,320 --> 00:24:26,960 Speaker 1: up the weapons and place them into a concrete bucket 404 00:24:27,080 --> 00:24:29,600 Speaker 1: and drop them into a lake on his parents' property. 405 00:24:30,240 --> 00:24:33,600 Speaker 1: The weapons remained underwater until the Wagners were arrested in 406 00:24:33,600 --> 00:24:37,760 Speaker 1: twenty eighteen. The best plea bargain in the state of Ohio, 407 00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:40,480 Speaker 1: it is how the defense described the deal that Jake 408 00:24:40,520 --> 00:24:43,360 Speaker 1: Wagner made to avoid the death penalty. On the third 409 00:24:43,440 --> 00:24:48,000 Speaker 1: day of Jake Wagner's testimony, the defense took over questioning immediately. 410 00:24:48,119 --> 00:24:51,439 Speaker 1: George Wagner's attorney, John Parker, tried to paint Jake as 411 00:24:51,440 --> 00:24:53,920 Speaker 1: a liar who turned on his own brother to avoid 412 00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:56,600 Speaker 1: the death penalty. Many of the jury were poisoned in 413 00:24:56,640 --> 00:24:59,440 Speaker 1: their seats as defense attorney John Parker said, you got 414 00:24:59,480 --> 00:25:02,280 Speaker 1: off the hook the death penalty for killing the Rodents, 415 00:25:02,440 --> 00:25:05,120 Speaker 1: yet your brother, who you admit did not kill any 416 00:25:05,160 --> 00:25:08,359 Speaker 1: of them, is still facing death. Parker quickly asked him 417 00:25:08,440 --> 00:25:11,040 Speaker 1: question after question to poke holes in Jake's account of 418 00:25:11,080 --> 00:25:15,320 Speaker 1: the massacre. The defense argued during its cross examination that 419 00:25:15,400 --> 00:25:18,840 Speaker 1: Jake Wagner murdered everyone and that George tried to stop 420 00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:22,639 Speaker 1: the murders. The defense read quotes from Jake's statements to 421 00:25:22,760 --> 00:25:27,199 Speaker 1: investigators that said, George didn't like the idea whatsoever. He 422 00:25:27,280 --> 00:25:29,760 Speaker 1: thought of Hannah as a sister. He said, he didn't 423 00:25:29,800 --> 00:25:32,679 Speaker 1: want to do it, don't trust Dad. He decided to 424 00:25:32,720 --> 00:25:35,359 Speaker 1: go because he was thinking Dad was trying to set 425 00:25:35,400 --> 00:25:38,840 Speaker 1: me up. Then the defense led Jake through each step 426 00:25:38,880 --> 00:25:42,560 Speaker 1: of the massacre as he smiled at the strangest times. 427 00:25:43,240 --> 00:25:46,200 Speaker 1: After the second day of Jake Wagner's testimony, I spoke 428 00:25:46,240 --> 00:25:49,400 Speaker 1: with Jeff and Stephanie. Something that really struck me from 429 00:25:49,880 --> 00:25:53,360 Speaker 1: Jake's first day of testimony was his attempt at interaction 430 00:25:53,600 --> 00:25:56,159 Speaker 1: with the Rodent family. Nothing I'm sorry, or trying to 431 00:25:56,160 --> 00:25:58,679 Speaker 1: make eye contact with George. Did you see any of 432 00:25:58,720 --> 00:26:02,040 Speaker 1: that and what was that like in person if you did. No, 433 00:26:02,400 --> 00:26:05,879 Speaker 1: there really wasn't any of that. Upon cross examination, I 434 00:26:05,880 --> 00:26:08,520 Speaker 1: believe the attorney mentioned it three or four times because 435 00:26:08,560 --> 00:26:14,560 Speaker 1: it was so pronounced. Was Jake's smiling slash smirking the 436 00:26:14,640 --> 00:26:18,240 Speaker 1: same thing that we all noticed and commented on when 437 00:26:18,240 --> 00:26:22,359 Speaker 1: he pled guilty, specifically when he was asked about killing 438 00:26:22,440 --> 00:26:26,280 Speaker 1: Hannah Rodin and he kind of smirked. And what Jake 439 00:26:26,440 --> 00:26:28,879 Speaker 1: did was acknowledge. He said, I know this is a 440 00:26:29,000 --> 00:26:33,080 Speaker 1: very serious matter. It's not funny. It's just something happened. 441 00:26:33,119 --> 00:26:36,919 Speaker 1: Anyone who knows me knows that I smile at the 442 00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:40,560 Speaker 1: worst moments, right like when they're watching the Booddock Saints 443 00:26:40,600 --> 00:26:43,679 Speaker 1: clip in court, He's smiling. At least that's what I 444 00:26:43,720 --> 00:26:48,600 Speaker 1: read the defense attorney. He had an interesting way of 445 00:26:48,680 --> 00:26:51,119 Speaker 1: getting Jake to say stuff, And what it appeared to 446 00:26:51,119 --> 00:26:54,800 Speaker 1: be was that the defense attorney was kind of doing 447 00:26:54,880 --> 00:26:58,920 Speaker 1: everything he could to get Jake to contradict himself, even 448 00:26:58,960 --> 00:27:02,520 Speaker 1: in small ways from what he has laid out. So 449 00:27:02,920 --> 00:27:06,879 Speaker 1: as an example, he said, oh, so you shot Hannah 450 00:27:06,960 --> 00:27:08,800 Speaker 1: rode In, the mother of your child, in the back 451 00:27:08,840 --> 00:27:11,199 Speaker 1: of the head. He said, no, I shot her in 452 00:27:11,240 --> 00:27:14,280 Speaker 1: the front of the head and was smiling. So is 453 00:27:14,280 --> 00:27:16,640 Speaker 1: he just a sociopath or just as horrible social skills? 454 00:27:16,680 --> 00:27:18,879 Speaker 1: I mean, what's your You obviously can't diagnose him, but 455 00:27:19,680 --> 00:27:24,040 Speaker 1: I hadn't realized the extent of just how long everything took. 456 00:27:24,560 --> 00:27:26,479 Speaker 1: For example, and here are a couple of things that 457 00:27:26,840 --> 00:27:31,760 Speaker 1: came to light today. They actually stopped, they being Billy, Jake, 458 00:27:31,840 --> 00:27:35,000 Speaker 1: and George. They made a stop on the way to 459 00:27:35,280 --> 00:27:41,280 Speaker 1: Chris Roden's house. What and Billy was driving. Jake was 460 00:27:41,480 --> 00:27:44,680 Speaker 1: under he had constructed in the back bed of the car. 461 00:27:45,119 --> 00:27:48,720 Speaker 1: He had constructed a wooden platform and put bales of 462 00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:52,280 Speaker 1: hay under it and was underneath that to hide so 463 00:27:52,320 --> 00:27:55,080 Speaker 1: he could lie and wait to then sniper under the car. 464 00:27:56,000 --> 00:28:00,320 Speaker 1: On the drive there, Billy pulled over and said, are 465 00:28:00,320 --> 00:28:02,720 Speaker 1: you sure you want to go through at this? You know, 466 00:28:02,840 --> 00:28:06,159 Speaker 1: now's the times turnaround if not, And the answer was 467 00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:11,200 Speaker 1: to just continue on. It's shocking. Later the courtroom was 468 00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:14,920 Speaker 1: shown some of the graphic crime scene photos. Jake admitted 469 00:28:14,960 --> 00:28:17,280 Speaker 1: that he had tried to block the gruesome images from 470 00:28:17,280 --> 00:28:20,480 Speaker 1: his mind. Can you imagine having to look at those 471 00:28:20,480 --> 00:28:25,320 Speaker 1: photos now with distance, knowing that you were the perpetrator. 472 00:28:26,200 --> 00:28:29,320 Speaker 1: But it's a different perspective you're seeing it in a photograph. 473 00:28:29,440 --> 00:28:33,400 Speaker 1: Has he seen crime photos yet? Yes? On cross examination, 474 00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:39,400 Speaker 1: the attorney was reminding Jake, he said, you have seen 475 00:28:39,480 --> 00:28:43,360 Speaker 1: pictures of Kenneth Roden, who was shot one time in 476 00:28:43,400 --> 00:28:46,720 Speaker 1: the eye. The similarity of just as Hannah Gilly was 477 00:28:46,760 --> 00:28:51,040 Speaker 1: shot straight through the eye, and Jake said, oh, when 478 00:28:51,080 --> 00:28:53,160 Speaker 1: I look at the photos, I try I don't want 479 00:28:53,200 --> 00:28:55,080 Speaker 1: to look at any of the wounds. I try not 480 00:28:55,200 --> 00:28:57,920 Speaker 1: to time. He said why, and he said, because I 481 00:28:57,960 --> 00:29:01,480 Speaker 1: don't want that to be in my memory. Attorney said, well, 482 00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:04,760 Speaker 1: that must be really nice. Hannah Mae Rodent's final moment 483 00:29:05,240 --> 00:29:10,480 Speaker 1: was him smiling at her. Can you imagine she's waking up, 484 00:29:10,960 --> 00:29:15,360 Speaker 1: maybe allegedly in her bed, nursing her child, and you 485 00:29:15,480 --> 00:29:20,800 Speaker 1: see your ex smiling at you. Those are her final moments. 486 00:29:23,080 --> 00:29:26,600 Speaker 1: At the end of Jake Wagner's testimony, George Wagner's defense 487 00:29:26,600 --> 00:29:29,680 Speaker 1: attorney John Parker once again asked Jake if he was 488 00:29:29,720 --> 00:29:34,960 Speaker 1: a stone cold killer. Jake said yes. Parker accused Jake 489 00:29:35,000 --> 00:29:37,840 Speaker 1: Wagner of selling his testimony to the state of Ohio 490 00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:41,880 Speaker 1: and implicating George to save his own life. Jake insisted 491 00:29:41,920 --> 00:29:45,880 Speaker 1: he had provided truthful testimony. Parker then said, while waving 492 00:29:45,920 --> 00:29:50,960 Speaker 1: his hand, dismissively take him away, Judge, no further questions here. Again. 493 00:29:51,240 --> 00:29:54,600 Speaker 1: Legal analyst Mike Allen on the impact of George Wagner's 494 00:29:54,640 --> 00:29:59,480 Speaker 1: three days of testimony, nobody was contending not the defense certainly, 495 00:29:59,520 --> 00:30:04,080 Speaker 1: and not the prosecution that George shot anyone. That was 496 00:30:04,240 --> 00:30:06,840 Speaker 1: never the case. I mean, the closest he got, according 497 00:30:06,840 --> 00:30:09,960 Speaker 1: to the testimony, was he was supposed to pull the 498 00:30:09,960 --> 00:30:12,200 Speaker 1: trigger on one of them, but he couldn't, and then 499 00:30:12,600 --> 00:30:15,280 Speaker 1: Jake had to do it. What the State of Ohio 500 00:30:15,360 --> 00:30:18,800 Speaker 1: had to show, and I watched this closely, they had 501 00:30:18,840 --> 00:30:23,880 Speaker 1: to show that George was a part of the preparation 502 00:30:24,400 --> 00:30:28,920 Speaker 1: for the murder murders, He was a part of the execution, 503 00:30:29,240 --> 00:30:34,040 Speaker 1: although somewhat a small part in the execution of the murders, 504 00:30:34,480 --> 00:30:37,480 Speaker 1: but he was a really big part in the aftermath 505 00:30:37,680 --> 00:30:40,640 Speaker 1: with respect to disposing of evidence and things like that, 506 00:30:41,240 --> 00:30:47,400 Speaker 1: and the state showed that. More on that next time. 507 00:30:48,560 --> 00:30:51,720 Speaker 1: For more information on the case and relevant photos, follow 508 00:30:51,800 --> 00:30:56,600 Speaker 1: us on Instagram at kat Underscore Studios. The Piketon Masker 509 00:30:56,640 --> 00:31:01,280 Speaker 1: is produced by Stephanie Leidecker, Jeff Shane, Connor Powell, Andrew Arnow, 510 00:31:01,600 --> 00:31:06,280 Speaker 1: Gabriel Castillo and me Courtney Armstrong. Editing and sound designed 511 00:31:06,320 --> 00:31:10,640 Speaker 1: by Jeff Ti Music by Jared Aston. The Pike Did 512 00:31:10,640 --> 00:31:13,640 Speaker 1: Maasacar is a production of iHeart Radio and Katie's Studios. 513 00:31:14,280 --> 00:31:17,680 Speaker 1: For more podcasts from iHeart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio app, 514 00:31:18,200 --> 00:31:22,480 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. 515 00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:30,600 Speaker 1: Please welcome Markite County Dogwin Festival. Queen Lord, I just 516 00:31:30,640 --> 00:31:36,840 Speaker 1: thank you for bringing us all together as a community. Okay, 517 00:31:38,720 --> 00:31:42,040 Speaker 1: there's blood all over the house. Who could have killed 518 00:31:42,200 --> 00:31:46,280 Speaker 1: eight family members in one mite? I lost my best 519 00:31:46,280 --> 00:31:49,520 Speaker 1: friends and I will never be the same because of 520 00:31:49,560 --> 00:31:54,560 Speaker 1: that day. Four crime scenes, no DNA, no witnesses. The 521 00:31:54,640 --> 00:32:00,240 Speaker 1: killer left those children laying in their mother's blood. That 522 00:32:00,280 --> 00:32:04,440 Speaker 1: comes to mind is overkill. Who was the master mind, 523 00:32:05,080 --> 00:32:09,160 Speaker 1: I'm telling you, is a framer. I'm not sitting in prison. 524 00:32:09,760 --> 00:32:14,680 Speaker 1: One thing I learned, the smaller the town, the bigger 525 00:32:14,760 --> 00:32:19,720 Speaker 1: the sacreds. Be sure to watch our upcoming documentary, The 526 00:32:19,800 --> 00:32:24,440 Speaker 1: Pike County Murders of Family Massacre, premiering on NBC Universal's 527 00:32:24,560 --> 00:32:28,800 Speaker 1: Oxygen Network and also streaming on Peacock this Thanksgiving Day 528 00:32:28,840 --> 00:32:32,840 Speaker 1: weekend November twenty fourth and November twenty fifth. Please check 529 00:32:32,880 --> 00:32:35,440 Speaker 1: your local listings and our hearts are with the Rodents 530 00:32:35,680 --> 00:32:36,760 Speaker 1: and the Gilly families.