1 00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:27,479 Speaker 1: Ridiculous History is a production of iHeartRadio. Welcome back to 2 00:00:27,520 --> 00:00:30,840 Speaker 1: the show, fellow Ridiculous Historians. Thank you, as always so 3 00:00:31,040 --> 00:00:34,120 Speaker 1: much for tuning in. Let's hear it for our own 4 00:00:34,720 --> 00:00:38,400 Speaker 1: wonder of the podcasting world. Super producer, mister Max william. 5 00:00:40,159 --> 00:00:42,640 Speaker 2: I exist. I haven't been on an episode with you, 6 00:00:42,680 --> 00:00:44,160 Speaker 2: guys and almost a month. 7 00:00:44,280 --> 00:00:47,239 Speaker 1: You've always been. You've always been. You've always been there in. 8 00:00:47,200 --> 00:00:50,960 Speaker 3: Spirit like Mufasa and the clouds giving us words of 9 00:00:51,000 --> 00:00:53,479 Speaker 3: wisdom from beyond, or are still alive? 10 00:00:54,120 --> 00:00:56,319 Speaker 2: I did sneak myself into I did. 11 00:00:56,560 --> 00:00:59,800 Speaker 4: I heard episodes that one I did here briefly sneak 12 00:01:00,120 --> 00:01:00,640 Speaker 4: with a boop. 13 00:01:01,120 --> 00:01:03,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's like, oh I missed Max. 14 00:01:03,360 --> 00:01:04,240 Speaker 4: You do a boop right here? 15 00:01:04,240 --> 00:01:04,920 Speaker 2: I just do a boop. 16 00:01:05,240 --> 00:01:09,160 Speaker 1: And you're referring to mister Noel Brown. Let's give it 17 00:01:09,240 --> 00:01:13,760 Speaker 1: up for him. I I am often called Ben Bollen 18 00:01:13,959 --> 00:01:18,280 Speaker 1: on this show. We are so happy to be back, Max, 19 00:01:18,319 --> 00:01:21,679 Speaker 1: who were very much missed, not just by Nolan myself 20 00:01:21,720 --> 00:01:24,400 Speaker 1: but by our fellow Ridiculous Historians. 21 00:01:24,520 --> 00:01:28,080 Speaker 3: Yeah, it was fun to have Jonathan Strickland, aka the 22 00:01:28,160 --> 00:01:30,399 Speaker 3: quizz or in in his. 23 00:01:30,720 --> 00:01:33,080 Speaker 4: Normal kind of persona. 24 00:01:33,240 --> 00:01:37,199 Speaker 3: I guess it's just his whatever his Clark kent to 25 00:01:36,840 --> 00:01:40,440 Speaker 3: h to Superman or super whatever. What's what's a good 26 00:01:40,800 --> 00:01:45,200 Speaker 3: alter ego of a super villain? Did usually have alter egos? 27 00:01:45,319 --> 00:01:45,479 Speaker 4: Well? 28 00:01:45,600 --> 00:01:48,240 Speaker 1: Sure? In a couple of horror films, there's been a 29 00:01:48,240 --> 00:01:50,960 Speaker 1: guy named doctor Akila that I don't trust. 30 00:01:52,520 --> 00:01:54,680 Speaker 4: Did Doctor Doom is a guy? He's Eric something? 31 00:01:54,800 --> 00:01:54,960 Speaker 5: Right? 32 00:01:55,400 --> 00:01:55,880 Speaker 4: Uh? 33 00:01:56,560 --> 00:02:02,440 Speaker 1: Eric Lencher is Magneto. Doctor is literally named Victor von Due. 34 00:02:02,400 --> 00:02:06,600 Speaker 4: Victor von Doom, right right right? So okay, wow, okay, well. 35 00:02:06,440 --> 00:02:09,919 Speaker 2: Now we have like what green goblin is William Dafoe. 36 00:02:11,520 --> 00:02:12,760 Speaker 1: Osborne guys. 37 00:02:14,720 --> 00:02:17,959 Speaker 3: Weirdly enough though, the green Goblin mask identical to William 38 00:02:18,000 --> 00:02:19,119 Speaker 3: Dafoe's actual. 39 00:02:18,840 --> 00:02:24,560 Speaker 1: Face, and uh, ed, we are going to talk about 40 00:02:24,760 --> 00:02:28,040 Speaker 1: Wonders of the Ancient World. We're very excited this is 41 00:02:28,480 --> 00:02:31,400 Speaker 1: you know, Willem Dafoe is a wonder of the modern 42 00:02:31,560 --> 00:02:36,480 Speaker 1: acting world. But where do we get this phrase wonders 43 00:02:36,560 --> 00:02:40,160 Speaker 1: of the ancient world? Why are there specifically seven? And 44 00:02:40,280 --> 00:02:44,440 Speaker 1: why do people still disagree? This question stayed with us 45 00:02:44,440 --> 00:02:46,800 Speaker 1: for a while. This is the first part of a 46 00:02:47,080 --> 00:02:50,919 Speaker 1: continuing series. You guys know, we love doing We love 47 00:02:51,000 --> 00:02:52,360 Speaker 1: doing series. 48 00:02:52,000 --> 00:02:53,799 Speaker 4: That just occasional series. 49 00:02:53,919 --> 00:02:58,000 Speaker 1: Yes, History of Condiments Inventors who died by their own hand. 50 00:02:58,840 --> 00:03:02,920 Speaker 1: And this one, this one is a love letter to 51 00:03:03,120 --> 00:03:15,320 Speaker 1: all our fellow fans of the excellent game Civilization NOL. 52 00:03:15,320 --> 00:03:16,760 Speaker 1: Have you ever played Civilization? 53 00:03:17,080 --> 00:03:19,360 Speaker 3: I haven't, but I know it's been around for a 54 00:03:19,400 --> 00:03:23,600 Speaker 3: long time. And it's sort of like sim City, right, Yeah, 55 00:03:23,680 --> 00:03:25,120 Speaker 3: isn't it sort of like it's. 56 00:03:25,639 --> 00:03:29,399 Speaker 2: It's oddly like the best educational video game of all time. 57 00:03:29,560 --> 00:03:30,760 Speaker 2: That's the best way to think of it. 58 00:03:30,840 --> 00:03:34,160 Speaker 1: Yeah. It's a turn based strategy game that tricks you 59 00:03:34,200 --> 00:03:35,720 Speaker 1: into learning history. 60 00:03:35,480 --> 00:03:38,040 Speaker 3: Top down though, right, like where you're kind of having 61 00:03:38,080 --> 00:03:41,600 Speaker 3: to manipulate aspects like almost more like stats kind of. 62 00:03:41,600 --> 00:03:42,680 Speaker 4: I guess maybe that's the turn. 63 00:03:42,600 --> 00:03:48,360 Speaker 2: You like the emperor for your civilization, but you never die. 64 00:03:48,360 --> 00:03:51,760 Speaker 1: And yeah, god emperor, okay, Yeah, and you can win 65 00:03:51,960 --> 00:03:55,040 Speaker 1: through a series of different conditions. 66 00:03:55,120 --> 00:03:58,920 Speaker 3: It's resource management. It's I love resource manager. That's one 67 00:03:58,960 --> 00:04:00,920 Speaker 3: of my favorite parts of any the RPG. I just 68 00:04:00,960 --> 00:04:04,320 Speaker 3: hang out making daggers in the forge, you know, and 69 00:04:04,560 --> 00:04:08,080 Speaker 3: selling my wares, right, I never get around to the quests. 70 00:04:07,800 --> 00:04:11,040 Speaker 2: I mean, Civilization. The saying for it that it's famous 71 00:04:11,200 --> 00:04:13,400 Speaker 2: is one more turn, right, He's like, I'm gonna do 72 00:04:13,440 --> 00:04:15,800 Speaker 2: one more turn, one more turn and then four hours 73 00:04:15,880 --> 00:04:18,440 Speaker 2: later you're still saying one more super addictive. 74 00:04:18,600 --> 00:04:22,440 Speaker 1: Also, the one big problem I have with it is 75 00:04:23,320 --> 00:04:27,680 Speaker 1: the further emphasis on nation states, which I just find 76 00:04:28,160 --> 00:04:33,279 Speaker 1: as an authoritarian and a tyrant. I find nation states offensive. 77 00:04:34,000 --> 00:04:35,159 Speaker 2: Have you played seven yet? 78 00:04:35,240 --> 00:04:35,440 Speaker 4: Oh? 79 00:04:35,520 --> 00:04:39,080 Speaker 2: You can be you can be a tyrant states and seven? 80 00:04:39,480 --> 00:04:41,560 Speaker 4: Well, guys, what system do I get it on? 81 00:04:41,720 --> 00:04:43,560 Speaker 3: How do I get in on the conversation and all 82 00:04:43,560 --> 00:04:45,719 Speaker 3: of the tyrannical fun and there is. 83 00:04:45,720 --> 00:04:50,120 Speaker 5: All cross compatible not to Yeah, and if you are 84 00:04:50,160 --> 00:04:55,000 Speaker 5: playing Civilization like our pal Nol, we wish we could 85 00:04:55,000 --> 00:04:57,560 Speaker 5: be there with you to experience it for the first time. 86 00:04:57,720 --> 00:05:02,200 Speaker 1: Tell us your favorite sieve hacks also true story. This 87 00:05:02,320 --> 00:05:04,080 Speaker 1: is what I mean when I say it tricks people 88 00:05:04,120 --> 00:05:09,440 Speaker 1: into learning history. You can we do we trick ourselves? Maybe? 89 00:05:09,480 --> 00:05:09,640 Speaker 3: Yeah? 90 00:05:09,720 --> 00:05:10,440 Speaker 4: You get so true? 91 00:05:10,839 --> 00:05:16,240 Speaker 1: Yeah you can. In this game, you can construct a 92 00:05:16,279 --> 00:05:24,200 Speaker 1: series of unique things, sometimes building sometimes notable historical monuments. 93 00:05:24,240 --> 00:05:27,240 Speaker 1: Only one can exist in the world of the game 94 00:05:27,279 --> 00:05:31,800 Speaker 1: you're playing, and these are all based on true or 95 00:05:32,560 --> 00:05:36,120 Speaker 1: claimed actual historical one. 96 00:05:36,160 --> 00:05:36,320 Speaker 5: One. 97 00:05:37,400 --> 00:05:43,320 Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly. Enter our buddy Neba Kenzar. When when you 98 00:05:43,360 --> 00:05:46,240 Speaker 3: read his name on paper, though, it's like you know 99 00:05:46,279 --> 00:05:50,520 Speaker 3: that band i'd subauten. You know, it's like I never 100 00:05:50,600 --> 00:05:52,680 Speaker 3: say it right when you see it on paper, it's 101 00:05:52,800 --> 00:05:53,440 Speaker 3: just how. 102 00:05:53,240 --> 00:05:54,159 Speaker 4: Does that word exist? 103 00:05:54,760 --> 00:05:57,960 Speaker 3: But it's n e b u c h A d 104 00:05:58,360 --> 00:06:00,440 Speaker 3: n e z z a R, which in my mind 105 00:06:00,440 --> 00:06:03,000 Speaker 3: would be neb book chad Nezar. 106 00:06:03,480 --> 00:06:06,080 Speaker 4: But yeah, it's Nebuconezer. And he was kind of a 107 00:06:06,080 --> 00:06:06,600 Speaker 4: big deal. 108 00:06:07,160 --> 00:06:10,440 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, back in his day. If you want to 109 00:06:10,520 --> 00:06:15,800 Speaker 1: see the halcyon days, the glory days of Nebuconezer, you're 110 00:06:15,839 --> 00:06:18,880 Speaker 1: traveling with us back to the Middle East and you 111 00:06:18,920 --> 00:06:21,960 Speaker 1: are exploring the city of Babylon. We want to thank 112 00:06:22,040 --> 00:06:24,760 Speaker 1: our research associate Max for this. We also want to 113 00:06:24,800 --> 00:06:30,920 Speaker 1: thank Mark Cartwright over at World History Encyclopedia. Who yep, yep, yep. 114 00:06:31,040 --> 00:06:35,520 Speaker 1: Applause clause, Yeah, thank you Mark. You have broken this 115 00:06:35,680 --> 00:06:39,480 Speaker 1: down for all of us. In the modern day Babylon 116 00:06:39,720 --> 00:06:43,680 Speaker 1: is about fifty miles or eighty clicks south of the 117 00:06:43,720 --> 00:06:48,440 Speaker 1: modern day metropolis of Baghdad in Iraq, and if you 118 00:06:48,640 --> 00:06:52,720 Speaker 1: look at any sort of history of human civilization, you 119 00:06:52,839 --> 00:06:56,120 Speaker 1: are going to see Babylon mentioned prominently. 120 00:06:56,680 --> 00:06:56,880 Speaker 4: Well. 121 00:06:56,880 --> 00:06:58,640 Speaker 3: This is the part of the world that is often 122 00:06:58,680 --> 00:07:01,640 Speaker 3: referred to as the cradle of civilization, right. 123 00:07:02,160 --> 00:07:06,840 Speaker 1: Yeah, Yeah, the Delta, the Vans, the Levant, Yeah, the 124 00:07:06,880 --> 00:07:12,760 Speaker 1: Fertile Crescent and so on. So Babylon as a story, people, 125 00:07:13,280 --> 00:07:16,320 Speaker 1: we believe that people start hanging out there in a 126 00:07:16,480 --> 00:07:19,520 Speaker 1: stationary way in the third millennium BCE. 127 00:07:20,320 --> 00:07:21,000 Speaker 4: Long time ago. 128 00:07:21,280 --> 00:07:23,880 Speaker 1: Yeah, a long time ago. And Max, you had a 129 00:07:23,920 --> 00:07:26,920 Speaker 1: lovely piece of language here that I want to shout out. 130 00:07:27,600 --> 00:07:32,000 Speaker 1: You're saying this occurs back when years counted down, which 131 00:07:32,040 --> 00:07:35,240 Speaker 1: is super confusing for every public school student when you 132 00:07:35,320 --> 00:07:36,560 Speaker 1: first have to deal with that. 133 00:07:36,760 --> 00:07:39,520 Speaker 3: Right, still for me, can you break it down for 134 00:07:40,200 --> 00:07:44,600 Speaker 3: us perma public school students in the audience also? 135 00:07:44,720 --> 00:07:46,800 Speaker 2: Still, it was super confusing for the people that time, 136 00:07:46,960 --> 00:07:49,360 Speaker 2: like why do the numbers go down? Like what are 137 00:07:49,400 --> 00:07:50,240 Speaker 2: we counting down to? 138 00:07:50,400 --> 00:07:50,720 Speaker 4: Y'all? 139 00:07:51,160 --> 00:07:56,240 Speaker 1: The real shining moment of Babylon, as we understand it 140 00:07:56,280 --> 00:08:01,000 Speaker 1: now was in the sixth century BCE, during the reign 141 00:08:01,280 --> 00:08:06,320 Speaker 1: of nebuchad Nezer, the second to the city. Yeah. The 142 00:08:06,360 --> 00:08:10,080 Speaker 1: city was the capital of a huge empire, and it 143 00:08:10,200 --> 00:08:15,000 Speaker 1: was founded by his by nebuchon Nezer's father. Here's another 144 00:08:15,080 --> 00:08:23,120 Speaker 1: name we'll love, Nabopolasar, true, true, Nabo po l Assar. 145 00:08:23,280 --> 00:08:25,080 Speaker 1: The names were just cooler back then. 146 00:08:25,480 --> 00:08:28,760 Speaker 3: And he had done quite well militarily speaking, with victories 147 00:08:28,800 --> 00:08:32,679 Speaker 3: over the Assyrian Empire. Nebukondzer the second would go on 148 00:08:32,720 --> 00:08:38,120 Speaker 3: to even greater accolades, including capturing Jerusalem in five ninety 149 00:08:38,160 --> 00:08:39,120 Speaker 3: seven BCE. 150 00:08:39,920 --> 00:08:42,360 Speaker 4: Jerusalem was a major city at this point. 151 00:08:42,760 --> 00:08:45,720 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a true story, and kind of a controversial 152 00:08:45,720 --> 00:08:49,840 Speaker 1: one if we're being honest. He reached the He reached 153 00:08:49,840 --> 00:08:54,120 Speaker 1: the philosophical dilemma that a lot of warlords and world 154 00:08:54,240 --> 00:09:00,480 Speaker 1: conqueror types eventually reach if they don't die first. He said, Look, 155 00:09:00,800 --> 00:09:05,559 Speaker 1: I can't just be known for extravagant acts of violence. 156 00:09:05,720 --> 00:09:09,600 Speaker 1: I want people to understand that our empire is a 157 00:09:09,640 --> 00:09:12,240 Speaker 1: good thing for the world, and I want people to 158 00:09:12,720 --> 00:09:15,040 Speaker 1: want to be part of it. So I am going 159 00:09:15,120 --> 00:09:20,719 Speaker 1: to make my capital, Babylon the coolest place around. This 160 00:09:20,760 --> 00:09:26,320 Speaker 1: is where we absolutely bespoke. Absolutely, yes, yeah, Taylor made 161 00:09:26,480 --> 00:09:30,319 Speaker 1: to impress you. And this is where we see architectural 162 00:09:30,440 --> 00:09:35,280 Speaker 1: marvels like the Ishtar Gate, which is just adorned with 163 00:09:35,559 --> 00:09:40,920 Speaker 1: all sorts of depictions of animals, some of which are 164 00:09:41,000 --> 00:09:44,720 Speaker 1: real animals and some of which are animals from folklore 165 00:09:44,720 --> 00:09:45,200 Speaker 1: and fable. 166 00:09:45,480 --> 00:09:47,680 Speaker 3: Well, it's interesting, Ben, You and I just spent some 167 00:09:47,800 --> 00:09:51,520 Speaker 3: time in this general region of the world, in the 168 00:09:51,600 --> 00:09:56,040 Speaker 3: city called Doha that got a lot of money, you know, 169 00:09:56,160 --> 00:10:00,200 Speaker 3: from oil interests and things like that in relatively recent time. 170 00:10:00,280 --> 00:10:03,480 Speaker 3: And the way that city looks and feels just has 171 00:10:03,520 --> 00:10:06,400 Speaker 3: that new car smell even to this day, and that 172 00:10:06,520 --> 00:10:09,600 Speaker 3: kind of like cutting edge you know, marvel of the 173 00:10:09,600 --> 00:10:12,080 Speaker 3: of the modern world kind of feel, and that is 174 00:10:12,120 --> 00:10:14,880 Speaker 3: what was being you know, shot for here. 175 00:10:16,480 --> 00:10:20,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, and there was a wall surrounding the city, which 176 00:10:20,320 --> 00:10:23,200 Speaker 1: you can also build in the early stages of the 177 00:10:23,240 --> 00:10:27,880 Speaker 1: game Civilization just well, just noting that it's one of the. 178 00:10:27,920 --> 00:10:32,720 Speaker 3: Long wall though, right, it's what twenty clicks of brick, Yeah, twenty. 179 00:10:32,520 --> 00:10:36,679 Speaker 1: Brick clicks, twenty brick clicks. It was again cutting or 180 00:10:36,800 --> 00:10:42,040 Speaker 1: cutter edge. This double wall surrounded the city at the time. 181 00:10:42,280 --> 00:10:46,720 Speaker 1: So far as we know, this was the largest wall built. 182 00:10:47,040 --> 00:10:49,800 Speaker 1: So this is the first guy to build the biggest wall, 183 00:10:50,000 --> 00:10:52,880 Speaker 1: or rather, this is the first guy to you know, 184 00:10:53,040 --> 00:10:56,679 Speaker 1: make his public and probably his slaves build the world's 185 00:10:56,720 --> 00:10:57,280 Speaker 1: biggest one. 186 00:10:57,840 --> 00:10:59,920 Speaker 3: Well in a wall, you know, certainly while it may 187 00:11:00,080 --> 00:11:05,120 Speaker 3: have its aesthetic value, you know, architecturally speaking, you need 188 00:11:05,200 --> 00:11:07,160 Speaker 3: something to judge it up a little bit and kind 189 00:11:07,160 --> 00:11:08,800 Speaker 3: of you know, decorate your wall. 190 00:11:08,840 --> 00:11:09,560 Speaker 4: Even in a game. 191 00:11:09,640 --> 00:11:12,040 Speaker 3: You know, when you build your structure, you eventually want 192 00:11:12,040 --> 00:11:14,840 Speaker 3: to put down some throw rugs or some wall sconces, 193 00:11:14,880 --> 00:11:18,520 Speaker 3: you know, sure, some torches, perhaps a little balustrade, you know, 194 00:11:18,679 --> 00:11:22,160 Speaker 3: maybe a tasteful landscape painting. This is how this is 195 00:11:22,200 --> 00:11:27,520 Speaker 3: how new humanity is. At this point, he and his crew, 196 00:11:27,679 --> 00:11:30,280 Speaker 3: nepucidez Aer and his crew, they come up with the 197 00:11:30,360 --> 00:11:38,319 Speaker 3: idea of cultivating plants, not for the brutal struggle of survival, 198 00:11:38,440 --> 00:11:43,199 Speaker 3: but rather for aesthetic purposes, something to enjoy, a nice 199 00:11:43,240 --> 00:11:47,840 Speaker 3: backyard garden, pleasure garden, if you will. I don't know 200 00:11:47,840 --> 00:11:50,240 Speaker 3: why that term. I don't know why. Pleasure always just 201 00:11:50,280 --> 00:11:52,160 Speaker 3: sounds horny to me, even like when they say it 202 00:11:52,160 --> 00:11:52,520 Speaker 3: to you. 203 00:11:52,400 --> 00:11:54,760 Speaker 4: At Chick fil A. There's just something about that word 204 00:11:54,800 --> 00:11:55,760 Speaker 4: that seems naughty. 205 00:11:56,040 --> 00:11:58,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, well, especially with Chick fil A, which is a 206 00:11:58,960 --> 00:12:03,240 Speaker 1: popular a popular fast food chain based here in our 207 00:12:03,240 --> 00:12:06,599 Speaker 1: home state of Georgia. Chick fil A. I think the 208 00:12:07,160 --> 00:12:10,480 Speaker 1: language makes it creepy because they also say how may 209 00:12:10,520 --> 00:12:11,240 Speaker 1: I serve you? 210 00:12:11,760 --> 00:12:16,960 Speaker 3: And they're also a pretty heavily puritanically religious organization, you know, 211 00:12:17,000 --> 00:12:18,240 Speaker 3: as a company. 212 00:12:18,280 --> 00:12:21,960 Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, but that being said, you know, we always 213 00:12:22,000 --> 00:12:25,520 Speaker 1: strive for transparency. True at Kathy did give me, the 214 00:12:25,559 --> 00:12:27,280 Speaker 1: founder of Chick fil A, did give me a bunch 215 00:12:27,320 --> 00:12:29,560 Speaker 1: of money when I became an eagle scout, but he 216 00:12:29,679 --> 00:12:32,960 Speaker 1: kept sending me his books as well. So the idea 217 00:12:33,040 --> 00:12:36,280 Speaker 1: here is a normal thing now. A lot of people 218 00:12:36,400 --> 00:12:39,320 Speaker 1: in the crowd tonight. We're fans of gardening, right, or 219 00:12:39,360 --> 00:12:42,200 Speaker 1: we're fans of just growing something like flowers. You don't 220 00:12:42,280 --> 00:12:44,360 Speaker 1: eat them, you just take care of them and then 221 00:12:44,440 --> 00:12:47,479 Speaker 1: you smell them and you look at them. At this point, 222 00:12:47,600 --> 00:12:52,359 Speaker 1: this is a stunning new dare we say, disruptive idea. 223 00:12:52,960 --> 00:12:56,840 Speaker 1: They're building what appears to be a paradise on Earth, 224 00:12:56,920 --> 00:12:59,960 Speaker 1: and Babylon is one of the first to the post 225 00:13:00,240 --> 00:13:03,560 Speaker 1: on this. So the the concept spreads. This is a 226 00:13:03,800 --> 00:13:07,840 Speaker 1: historical flex. Shout out to our palace, Jack Miles for dailies. 227 00:13:07,600 --> 00:13:08,800 Speaker 4: Coming soon coming. 228 00:13:08,960 --> 00:13:10,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, we hope if we can get them. 229 00:13:11,200 --> 00:13:11,520 Speaker 4: Ben. 230 00:13:11,600 --> 00:13:14,280 Speaker 3: Isn't this also just a way of in this like 231 00:13:14,440 --> 00:13:17,800 Speaker 3: inhospitable climate, this part of the world surrounded by desert, 232 00:13:17,840 --> 00:13:22,000 Speaker 3: to almost say we can control nature, you know what 233 00:13:22,080 --> 00:13:24,360 Speaker 3: I mean. It's like there's a flex to it in 234 00:13:24,440 --> 00:13:27,880 Speaker 3: that respect too, almost as like as a show of power, 235 00:13:28,120 --> 00:13:31,559 Speaker 3: godlike abilities to like, you know, pull these beautiful plants 236 00:13:31,600 --> 00:13:33,520 Speaker 3: out of the earth in a place where they really 237 00:13:33,559 --> 00:13:39,640 Speaker 3: don't belong. Look upon my lilies despair to despair or 238 00:13:39,679 --> 00:13:41,600 Speaker 3: it rejoics because they're lovely. 239 00:13:41,640 --> 00:13:42,400 Speaker 4: Lilies are nice. 240 00:13:42,520 --> 00:13:47,199 Speaker 1: Also, check out our earlier episode about real life hermits. 241 00:13:47,400 --> 00:13:50,880 Speaker 3: That the garden hermits hanging out there. Are they guarding 242 00:13:50,920 --> 00:13:54,240 Speaker 3: the place? Are they just there for aesthetics? What's their deal? 243 00:13:54,440 --> 00:13:55,880 Speaker 3: Check out the episode to find out. 244 00:13:56,120 --> 00:13:57,760 Speaker 2: And to John Men, real quick, you guys are just 245 00:13:57,800 --> 00:13:59,760 Speaker 2: reminding me the way y'all keep talking about. There's this 246 00:14:00,040 --> 00:14:02,319 Speaker 2: episode of Star Trek Deep Space nine seasons. 247 00:14:02,320 --> 00:14:04,000 Speaker 4: We know was talking about Star Trek Max. 248 00:14:04,240 --> 00:14:06,600 Speaker 2: No, No, I think you'll appreciate this. 249 00:14:07,040 --> 00:14:08,680 Speaker 4: No, I know we will. I'm just joking. It doesn't 250 00:14:08,679 --> 00:14:10,680 Speaker 4: take much for you to bring it to Star Trek. Please. 251 00:14:11,040 --> 00:14:13,679 Speaker 2: But it's the scene between two of the antagonists of 252 00:14:13,679 --> 00:14:16,800 Speaker 2: the show, gold to Cot and Wayoun, and they're talking 253 00:14:16,800 --> 00:14:19,000 Speaker 2: about the strategy for a war and one of them 254 00:14:19,040 --> 00:14:20,680 Speaker 2: is like, yeah, what we should do is we should 255 00:14:20,720 --> 00:14:24,600 Speaker 2: blow up Earth, and the Cots like absolutely not. Now, 256 00:14:24,640 --> 00:14:26,640 Speaker 2: what we need to do is we need to conquer Earth. 257 00:14:26,880 --> 00:14:29,320 Speaker 2: We need to show them that our way is right right, 258 00:14:29,440 --> 00:14:32,280 Speaker 2: and their way is wrong and they need confirmed to us. 259 00:14:32,480 --> 00:14:35,720 Speaker 2: Then Wayne goes and then we blow it up, and 260 00:14:35,760 --> 00:14:38,680 Speaker 2: because's like only if they don't get down with it. 261 00:14:38,880 --> 00:14:43,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, you know, maybe right, So every open hand can't 262 00:14:43,080 --> 00:14:45,880 Speaker 1: evolve into a fist. And that is the story of empire. 263 00:14:46,520 --> 00:14:49,920 Speaker 1: We also know that to the point about those that 264 00:14:50,040 --> 00:14:53,880 Speaker 1: weird hermit episode of ridiculous History, we know these gardens 265 00:14:54,240 --> 00:14:58,960 Speaker 1: were considered, we're considered like paradise on Earth because it 266 00:14:59,120 --> 00:15:03,760 Speaker 1: wasn't just a map of cute justo flowers and hedges 267 00:15:03,840 --> 00:15:08,040 Speaker 1: and plants. There were also sculptures and water features, and 268 00:15:08,960 --> 00:15:12,920 Speaker 1: the views of like the perspective of where you were 269 00:15:12,920 --> 00:15:16,080 Speaker 1: supposed to stand and take it all in was very 270 00:15:16,120 --> 00:15:20,640 Speaker 1: much part of the design. Allegedly when there's a reason 271 00:15:20,680 --> 00:15:22,320 Speaker 1: we keep saying allegedly. So. 272 00:15:22,400 --> 00:15:25,960 Speaker 3: The main motivation for the gardens that Christopher Klein talks 273 00:15:25,960 --> 00:15:29,720 Speaker 3: about over at History is as follows. He says, the 274 00:15:29,720 --> 00:15:33,320 Speaker 3: Babylonian king Neba Kenazar the second was said to have constructive, 275 00:15:33,400 --> 00:15:36,120 Speaker 3: luxurious hanging gardens in the sixth century BC as a 276 00:15:36,160 --> 00:15:38,080 Speaker 3: gift to his wife amateus. 277 00:15:38,480 --> 00:15:42,240 Speaker 1: Look, folks, if you're listening, always try to impress your 278 00:15:42,280 --> 00:15:43,080 Speaker 1: significant other. 279 00:15:49,880 --> 00:15:52,480 Speaker 3: This was very sweet too, because he was trying to 280 00:15:52,560 --> 00:15:55,680 Speaker 3: bring her home, you know, to where they were in 281 00:15:55,800 --> 00:15:59,840 Speaker 3: this desert climate. She was homesick for the beautiful mountain 282 00:16:00,200 --> 00:16:06,000 Speaker 3: and fauna flora rather of her native media, which today 283 00:16:06,040 --> 00:16:11,040 Speaker 3: would be comprising the northwestern part of Iran. So in 284 00:16:11,160 --> 00:16:16,680 Speaker 3: order to get that desert to support this kind of life, 285 00:16:16,800 --> 00:16:20,120 Speaker 3: this kind of growth, you had to figure out some 286 00:16:20,200 --> 00:16:23,840 Speaker 3: kind of engineering aspects, you know, irrigation. We know that 287 00:16:23,880 --> 00:16:26,960 Speaker 3: a lot of early civilizations had aqueducts and ways of 288 00:16:27,040 --> 00:16:30,920 Speaker 3: moving water around. This is very similar to that. They 289 00:16:30,960 --> 00:16:34,840 Speaker 3: had to develop these systems involving pumps and water wheels 290 00:16:35,720 --> 00:16:38,560 Speaker 3: and cisterns or reservoirs, you know, kind of man made 291 00:16:38,640 --> 00:16:41,840 Speaker 3: reservoirs that would be able to raise and lower the 292 00:16:41,880 --> 00:16:46,360 Speaker 3: water from the Euphrates River to the very top the 293 00:16:46,400 --> 00:16:48,720 Speaker 3: tippy top of the gardens. And this was quite a 294 00:16:48,760 --> 00:16:51,280 Speaker 3: distance and quite a change in elevation. So the stuff 295 00:16:51,320 --> 00:16:54,360 Speaker 3: was mega innovative for the time. And honestly, I mean, 296 00:16:54,400 --> 00:16:56,400 Speaker 3: they haven't figured out how to do it. 297 00:16:56,400 --> 00:16:58,800 Speaker 4: Much better than that. I mean, water works largely. 298 00:16:58,840 --> 00:17:01,080 Speaker 3: Of course, there are pumps they're talking about that here too, 299 00:17:01,120 --> 00:17:02,960 Speaker 3: but gravity, you know, they just figured out how to 300 00:17:02,960 --> 00:17:05,360 Speaker 3: harness gravity to their to their benefit. 301 00:17:05,520 --> 00:17:05,920 Speaker 4: Mm hmm. 302 00:17:06,119 --> 00:17:09,040 Speaker 1: Absolutely, this is a huge flex And if we if 303 00:17:09,040 --> 00:17:12,119 Speaker 1: we go back to our pal Mark Cartwright, we see 304 00:17:12,240 --> 00:17:15,679 Speaker 1: that the what we call the hanging Gardens of Babylon 305 00:17:15,760 --> 00:17:21,000 Speaker 1: and legend and pseudo historically accurate stuff today I used 306 00:17:21,000 --> 00:17:23,280 Speaker 1: to have a different name. It was sometimes called the 307 00:17:23,359 --> 00:17:28,280 Speaker 1: hanging gardens of Semi Ramas, named after a an Assyrian 308 00:17:28,600 --> 00:17:34,960 Speaker 1: ruler who occurred so long ago that she became kind 309 00:17:35,000 --> 00:17:39,840 Speaker 1: of a godlike figure, a symbol of divinity and the 310 00:17:40,240 --> 00:17:45,199 Speaker 1: later right like Talos and Skyrim or like you know, 311 00:17:45,280 --> 00:17:50,719 Speaker 1: the first Emperor of China uh Greco. Romans later believed 312 00:17:50,840 --> 00:17:57,520 Speaker 1: that this Assyrian ruler extensively rebuilds Babylon in the ninth 313 00:17:57,720 --> 00:18:02,200 Speaker 1: century BCE. This is where we go to Herodotus, the 314 00:18:02,240 --> 00:18:06,960 Speaker 1: Greek historian, probably best known from Assassin's Creed Odyssey. He 315 00:18:07,080 --> 00:18:10,680 Speaker 1: describes that irrigation system you're talking about there, Noel, and 316 00:18:10,800 --> 00:18:16,520 Speaker 1: he he breaks down enough detail that we and modern 317 00:18:16,680 --> 00:18:21,919 Speaker 1: historians believe there was a massive innovative irrigation system in 318 00:18:22,080 --> 00:18:27,000 Speaker 1: Babylon and around the walls surrounding that city. But our 319 00:18:27,040 --> 00:18:32,320 Speaker 1: buddy heavy h does not mention any gardens specifically, So 320 00:18:33,600 --> 00:18:37,600 Speaker 1: why did he not mention one of the most spectacular 321 00:18:37,720 --> 00:18:40,840 Speaker 1: things about the most impressive city in the world. To 322 00:18:40,920 --> 00:18:44,959 Speaker 1: be fair, he also doesn't mention the Great Sphinx when 323 00:18:45,000 --> 00:18:46,359 Speaker 1: he talks about Giza, So. 324 00:18:46,600 --> 00:18:49,840 Speaker 3: Well, right, and we know the Great Sphinx exists, right, correct, 325 00:18:50,240 --> 00:18:54,200 Speaker 3: that is confirmed it's still around, right No, yeah, yeah. 326 00:18:54,080 --> 00:18:54,440 Speaker 4: I thought so. 327 00:18:54,600 --> 00:18:56,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's not in great shape. 328 00:18:56,000 --> 00:18:58,199 Speaker 4: But yeah, I know it's missing a nose and all 329 00:18:58,240 --> 00:18:58,800 Speaker 4: of that stuff. 330 00:18:58,840 --> 00:19:02,640 Speaker 3: But the point being that that thing is equally as 331 00:19:02,760 --> 00:19:06,119 Speaker 3: captivating and worth a mention as these hanging gardens, or 332 00:19:06,119 --> 00:19:09,520 Speaker 3: the implication being that maybe the hanging gardens didn't exist, 333 00:19:09,560 --> 00:19:11,720 Speaker 3: But you said he didn't mention that, so then your 334 00:19:12,040 --> 00:19:14,760 Speaker 3: point being that maybe he just didn't see them. 335 00:19:15,040 --> 00:19:18,880 Speaker 1: Yeah, maybe he was in a hurry, maybe he thought 336 00:19:19,000 --> 00:19:20,840 Speaker 1: that was just day one stuff. 337 00:19:21,520 --> 00:19:23,760 Speaker 3: The first Oh, good point, Ben, because in the sash 338 00:19:23,800 --> 00:19:26,400 Speaker 3: One Towers episode we did recently on stuff they don't 339 00:19:26,400 --> 00:19:29,120 Speaker 3: want you to know, a big part about why there 340 00:19:29,240 --> 00:19:32,320 Speaker 3: wasn't more Hubbub made about these things was that folks 341 00:19:32,800 --> 00:19:35,600 Speaker 3: traveling through might have just seen them as just you know, 342 00:19:35,880 --> 00:19:38,200 Speaker 3: kind of standard, sort of like they were just used 343 00:19:38,240 --> 00:19:38,800 Speaker 3: to seeing them. 344 00:19:39,080 --> 00:19:43,800 Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. In that case, the European explorers definitely looked 345 00:19:43,840 --> 00:19:47,360 Speaker 1: around and said, eh, yeah, big whoop, we have towers too. 346 00:19:47,840 --> 00:19:49,760 Speaker 3: Just like when someone wants you to look at their 347 00:19:49,800 --> 00:19:52,439 Speaker 3: new car, you're like, I've seen a car, Like, I'm 348 00:19:52,480 --> 00:19:54,320 Speaker 3: really happy for you and everything, but I know what 349 00:19:54,359 --> 00:19:55,399 Speaker 3: a car looks like. 350 00:19:55,800 --> 00:19:58,280 Speaker 1: Are you kidding? I get so excited I can't say 351 00:19:58,400 --> 00:19:58,840 Speaker 1: your car. 352 00:19:59,080 --> 00:20:01,199 Speaker 3: Well that you're different kind of person, Ben, and I 353 00:20:01,200 --> 00:20:03,000 Speaker 3: appreciate that about you, But in general, I think a 354 00:20:03,040 --> 00:20:05,480 Speaker 3: lot of folks will just like feign interest like I've 355 00:20:05,520 --> 00:20:06,040 Speaker 3: seen a car. 356 00:20:06,040 --> 00:20:07,520 Speaker 4: They're more just happy for their friend. 357 00:20:07,800 --> 00:20:10,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, I hear you. I hear you, And we know that, 358 00:20:10,680 --> 00:20:15,159 Speaker 1: we know that there are ancient sources that do talk 359 00:20:15,359 --> 00:20:21,840 Speaker 1: about the gardens. Brosis of costs is well, actually it's 360 00:20:21,960 --> 00:20:25,480 Speaker 1: a it's the non de plume of a priest named 361 00:20:25,520 --> 00:20:27,720 Speaker 1: Belle Uzru from Babylon. 362 00:20:27,920 --> 00:20:30,560 Speaker 4: Why would he change his name? Bell Uzru is way cooler. 363 00:20:30,800 --> 00:20:31,760 Speaker 4: It is way cooler. 364 00:20:32,320 --> 00:20:36,000 Speaker 1: Really, he moved to the island of KOs and just 365 00:20:36,240 --> 00:20:39,320 Speaker 1: changed his name, and you know, got himself buttoned up 366 00:20:39,520 --> 00:20:40,080 Speaker 1: as a. 367 00:20:40,040 --> 00:20:42,160 Speaker 4: Grecian Okay, got it? 368 00:20:42,840 --> 00:20:46,000 Speaker 3: A Grecian, not a Greco that only refers to like 369 00:20:46,119 --> 00:20:47,240 Speaker 3: stuff like Greco. 370 00:20:47,840 --> 00:20:49,840 Speaker 4: But you're a Roman, So why aren't you a Greco? 371 00:20:49,840 --> 00:20:53,080 Speaker 4: You're a Grecian. I'm sorry these terms baffle me sometimes. 372 00:20:53,160 --> 00:20:55,199 Speaker 1: Now when you say that, all I can think of 373 00:20:55,440 --> 00:20:58,640 Speaker 1: is how much I want Greek food? Like, right, so good, 374 00:20:58,880 --> 00:20:59,720 Speaker 1: it's so good. 375 00:21:00,080 --> 00:21:01,960 Speaker 3: Well, you know what, Ben, there's some pretty solid Greek 376 00:21:01,960 --> 00:21:04,080 Speaker 3: places that will deliver to both of us. Maybe we 377 00:21:04,119 --> 00:21:08,879 Speaker 3: should be uber Eats buddies, like you have lunch together 378 00:21:09,000 --> 00:21:09,560 Speaker 3: over zoom. 379 00:21:09,600 --> 00:21:12,960 Speaker 1: That'd be cute, that would be so adorable. Max, would 380 00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:15,400 Speaker 1: you would you have a virtual lunch with us all three? 381 00:21:15,760 --> 00:21:18,680 Speaker 3: Yeah, I'll gift it to you guys. Okay, Greek food 382 00:21:18,760 --> 00:21:20,160 Speaker 3: for all the condition. 383 00:21:20,640 --> 00:21:24,960 Speaker 2: But Ben, as you know, Greek thermatologist, Yeah, that's the 384 00:21:25,040 --> 00:21:26,840 Speaker 2: dream Greek dermatologist condition. 385 00:21:27,359 --> 00:21:30,280 Speaker 4: The condition prevents you from enjoying Greek cuisine. 386 00:21:30,400 --> 00:21:33,399 Speaker 2: We were at a wedding of a mutual front of 387 00:21:33,440 --> 00:21:35,960 Speaker 2: all three of ours, and Ben and I are like, 388 00:21:36,080 --> 00:21:37,919 Speaker 2: we had to move Ben's cars on that when we 389 00:21:37,920 --> 00:21:39,680 Speaker 2: were out there walking and we were of course talking 390 00:21:39,720 --> 00:21:40,520 Speaker 2: about civilization. 391 00:21:40,680 --> 00:21:42,000 Speaker 4: Six that's the best part. 392 00:21:42,920 --> 00:21:46,440 Speaker 3: Accurate, the callback, that's the tiant. 393 00:21:47,680 --> 00:21:49,520 Speaker 2: So I'm telling Ben about the condition, but I'm also 394 00:21:49,560 --> 00:21:51,240 Speaker 2: talking about how much of Greek food. He he just 395 00:21:51,280 --> 00:21:53,639 Speaker 2: kind of goes Max. The answer is simple, you guy 396 00:21:53,640 --> 00:21:57,240 Speaker 2: just kind of find you a Greek thermatologist like that 397 00:21:57,240 --> 00:21:59,040 Speaker 2: that that that that's the solution there. 398 00:22:00,160 --> 00:22:01,320 Speaker 1: Dude, I'm telling exactly. 399 00:22:01,480 --> 00:22:04,000 Speaker 3: And can I just say Max, congratulations and all the 400 00:22:04,040 --> 00:22:07,919 Speaker 3: oscar buzz around the condition this season, I'm sorry your 401 00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:11,040 Speaker 3: lead actor Demi Moore turned in a fantastic performance, didn't 402 00:22:11,040 --> 00:22:11,879 Speaker 3: take on the oscar. 403 00:22:12,040 --> 00:22:13,000 Speaker 4: I think she was robbed. 404 00:22:13,240 --> 00:22:15,600 Speaker 1: You'll get them next time. So if you happen to 405 00:22:15,600 --> 00:22:21,600 Speaker 1: be a single available Greek dermatologist with excellent taste in podcasters, 406 00:22:22,320 --> 00:22:24,400 Speaker 1: we have a guy named Max Williams that we'd love 407 00:22:24,440 --> 00:22:25,000 Speaker 1: for you to meet. 408 00:22:25,359 --> 00:22:28,359 Speaker 3: Indeed, but Max, you pointed out off Mike when we 409 00:22:28,440 --> 00:22:30,440 Speaker 3: had a bit of a derail a minute ago, that 410 00:22:30,760 --> 00:22:33,520 Speaker 3: the writings that he left behind we really only have 411 00:22:33,680 --> 00:22:34,359 Speaker 3: excerpts of. 412 00:22:34,960 --> 00:22:40,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, we have we have other later authors quoting belle 413 00:22:40,640 --> 00:22:45,560 Speaker 1: usru or borosis, and a lot of the thing is 414 00:22:45,680 --> 00:22:49,280 Speaker 1: with that, with all the cribbing and the quoting that 415 00:22:49,359 --> 00:22:53,920 Speaker 1: occurs in ancient history, we have to look at some 416 00:22:54,119 --> 00:22:57,640 Speaker 1: other sort of cooperating evidence, and that's where we see 417 00:22:57,720 --> 00:23:01,879 Speaker 1: that a lot of his quote not did descriptions of 418 00:23:02,000 --> 00:23:08,359 Speaker 1: Babylon do seem to be supported by physical archaeology. He 419 00:23:08,480 --> 00:23:13,040 Speaker 1: talks about, for instance, high stone terraces that are supposed 420 00:23:13,080 --> 00:23:15,280 Speaker 1: to look like mountains, and how there are a lot 421 00:23:15,320 --> 00:23:19,560 Speaker 1: of trees and flowers planted on those mountains entirely to 422 00:23:19,760 --> 00:23:22,960 Speaker 1: kind of recreate again that part of Iran. 423 00:23:23,400 --> 00:23:23,840 Speaker 4: That's right. 424 00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:26,719 Speaker 3: And when we say the hanging gardens, the idea of that, 425 00:23:26,760 --> 00:23:29,080 Speaker 3: I mean it's a lot of these things are coming 426 00:23:29,119 --> 00:23:32,040 Speaker 3: down from like the ceiling essentially, right. 427 00:23:32,440 --> 00:23:36,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, And this is both form and function because it 428 00:23:36,359 --> 00:23:41,440 Speaker 1: is a it's a foundational piece of the irrigation methods 429 00:23:41,520 --> 00:23:45,359 Speaker 1: that are deployed here. And there are sources at the 430 00:23:45,440 --> 00:23:50,040 Speaker 1: time who, well a little bit later, who disagree on 431 00:23:50,440 --> 00:23:55,680 Speaker 1: the actual architects of the gardens. And sometimes you'll see 432 00:23:55,880 --> 00:24:00,239 Speaker 1: people describing the gardens as located in different places, like 433 00:24:00,320 --> 00:24:03,000 Speaker 1: these are terraces over in this part of town, or no, 434 00:24:03,119 --> 00:24:05,560 Speaker 1: they're at the royal palace, or no, they're kind of 435 00:24:05,600 --> 00:24:08,240 Speaker 1: next door to the royal Palace. It's like when it's 436 00:24:08,280 --> 00:24:10,840 Speaker 1: like when you hear old people who have lived in 437 00:24:10,880 --> 00:24:14,199 Speaker 1: a city for a long time, whenever they this is 438 00:24:14,200 --> 00:24:16,679 Speaker 1: a personal thing, because I'm noticing it as I age. 439 00:24:16,960 --> 00:24:20,280 Speaker 1: Sometimes when I'm telling stories, and I've seen actually the 440 00:24:20,320 --> 00:24:22,439 Speaker 1: three of us do this too. I get lost in 441 00:24:22,480 --> 00:24:24,919 Speaker 1: the directions and I'm like, no, that was on you 442 00:24:24,960 --> 00:24:26,280 Speaker 1: know sixth Street. 443 00:24:26,720 --> 00:24:29,680 Speaker 3: Brother, I'm not good at that in real life, let 444 00:24:29,720 --> 00:24:32,919 Speaker 3: alone recounting something from memory. It's like it's like I'm 445 00:24:32,920 --> 00:24:34,639 Speaker 3: a little grand dad trying to talk about where the 446 00:24:34,680 --> 00:24:36,560 Speaker 3: old A and P used to be exactly. 447 00:24:36,800 --> 00:24:40,240 Speaker 1: That's the thing. We get lost in the geography, and 448 00:24:40,680 --> 00:24:43,200 Speaker 1: it can derail the stories. So we see that happening. 449 00:24:43,280 --> 00:24:43,480 Speaker 3: Now. 450 00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:46,760 Speaker 1: Humans have always been the same, and we see people 451 00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:51,600 Speaker 1: arguing about how how they were constructed, you know, were 452 00:24:51,640 --> 00:24:57,480 Speaker 1: there layers of soil and stone or lead? How did 453 00:24:57,520 --> 00:25:00,520 Speaker 1: they prevent the water from seeping through the Harris Is 454 00:25:01,560 --> 00:25:04,640 Speaker 1: At this point, as we record in twenty twenty five, 455 00:25:04,720 --> 00:25:07,560 Speaker 1: and we're not being We're not poo pooing it, We're 456 00:25:07,600 --> 00:25:10,480 Speaker 1: not throwing cold water on the idea. We do have 457 00:25:10,560 --> 00:25:15,320 Speaker 1: to tell you there is no concrete proof that the 458 00:25:15,400 --> 00:25:16,960 Speaker 1: hanging gardens existed. 459 00:25:17,400 --> 00:25:18,120 Speaker 4: Yeah, that's right. 460 00:25:18,160 --> 00:25:21,040 Speaker 3: We do, however, have an account from a German archaeologist 461 00:25:21,160 --> 00:25:28,760 Speaker 3: named Robert Caldewey who uncovered some foundational chambers and these 462 00:25:28,840 --> 00:25:32,480 Speaker 3: kind of you know, caverns, these vaults in the northeastern 463 00:25:32,520 --> 00:25:36,720 Speaker 3: part of a palace or the palace rather of Babylon, 464 00:25:37,640 --> 00:25:40,080 Speaker 3: and some of these vaults, one in particular, might have 465 00:25:40,160 --> 00:25:43,240 Speaker 3: been used as part of a pumping system or what 466 00:25:43,359 --> 00:25:46,080 Speaker 3: was known as a chain pump, and this would have 467 00:25:46,160 --> 00:25:51,520 Speaker 3: potentially been part of a subterranean structure powering kind of 468 00:25:51,520 --> 00:25:54,360 Speaker 3: the irrigation system of the hanging gardens. 469 00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:57,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's the idea, right, and that's cool, that's exciting. 470 00:25:58,119 --> 00:26:01,840 Speaker 1: It still technically is kind of certain substantial evidence, and 471 00:26:01,880 --> 00:26:05,560 Speaker 1: we can't here's the thing. Unlike the Sphinx, unlike the Pyramids, 472 00:26:05,640 --> 00:26:09,800 Speaker 1: unlike other ancient wonders, we cannot go see the Hanging 473 00:26:09,840 --> 00:26:13,560 Speaker 1: Gardens today. People have tried their own reproductions or their 474 00:26:13,560 --> 00:26:18,920 Speaker 1: own homages to it, but we still don't know whether 475 00:26:18,960 --> 00:26:19,600 Speaker 1: it existed. 476 00:26:19,800 --> 00:26:22,639 Speaker 4: Well, and yet it still is listed as one of 477 00:26:22,640 --> 00:26:23,960 Speaker 4: the wonders of the world. 478 00:26:23,720 --> 00:26:28,120 Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, yeah, absolutely, one of the interesting seven wonders, 479 00:26:28,240 --> 00:26:31,560 Speaker 1: just because the other six we can check out. The 480 00:26:31,680 --> 00:26:35,440 Speaker 1: other six are way more confirmed to have existed. 481 00:26:35,680 --> 00:26:52,719 Speaker 3: Should we list them out just to just yeah, yeah. 482 00:26:45,280 --> 00:26:48,040 Speaker 1: Let's do it, because this will give all of us 483 00:26:48,119 --> 00:26:50,480 Speaker 1: playing along at home a little bit of a sense 484 00:26:50,600 --> 00:26:54,720 Speaker 1: of where we're going with this series. There's the Great Pyramid, one, 485 00:26:54,960 --> 00:26:59,080 Speaker 1: Hanging Gardens, two, the Temple of Artemis, three, Statue of 486 00:26:59,119 --> 00:27:03,720 Speaker 1: Zoos and Olympia. Uh, that's for the mausoleum at Halikarnassis, 487 00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:08,720 Speaker 1: the Colossus of Rhodes, and of course the Lighthouse of Alexandria. 488 00:27:09,080 --> 00:27:11,600 Speaker 1: Those are the those are the like canonical seven. 489 00:27:11,840 --> 00:27:15,160 Speaker 4: And of those, which ones are actually we able to visit. 490 00:27:16,320 --> 00:27:18,800 Speaker 2: There's the only one that's still standing, the Pyramid. Sure, yeah, 491 00:27:18,840 --> 00:27:20,920 Speaker 2: the Pyramids are the only one that's still standing. God, 492 00:27:20,760 --> 00:27:22,959 Speaker 2: but we know the other ones exist. 493 00:27:23,160 --> 00:27:26,160 Speaker 1: We know for sure the other ones existed. And again, 494 00:27:26,359 --> 00:27:30,440 Speaker 1: what's what's fascinating. As we'll see in this series, there 495 00:27:30,480 --> 00:27:35,160 Speaker 1: have been multiple attempts to do reproductions of these things 496 00:27:35,200 --> 00:27:38,480 Speaker 1: because they're just super cool, man, they're super First off, 497 00:27:38,560 --> 00:27:41,240 Speaker 1: humanity has always been sort of a hold my beer 498 00:27:41,600 --> 00:27:46,600 Speaker 1: species right and saying, let's build something huge, you know 499 00:27:46,600 --> 00:27:48,480 Speaker 1: what I mean, look upon my work, see Mighty in 500 00:27:48,520 --> 00:27:52,440 Speaker 1: Despair and so on. But yeah, the Pyramid, the Great Pyramid, 501 00:27:52,480 --> 00:27:56,679 Speaker 1: would be the only one currently that we can we 502 00:27:56,720 --> 00:27:58,720 Speaker 1: can go see. And I think it's weird that the 503 00:27:58,760 --> 00:27:59,919 Speaker 1: Sphinx doesn't count. 504 00:28:00,200 --> 00:28:06,760 Speaker 2: It is weird, right, it's a sub wonder, they would say. 505 00:28:06,880 --> 00:28:09,480 Speaker 2: There's a lot of debate. Obviously, there are a bunch 506 00:28:09,560 --> 00:28:13,480 Speaker 2: more wonders after this, like you know the taj Ma Hall. 507 00:28:13,400 --> 00:28:19,560 Speaker 1: Sure, yeah, the Great Wall and your what yeah, not module, 508 00:28:19,600 --> 00:28:22,479 Speaker 1: I would even say, but the yeah, so we know 509 00:28:22,600 --> 00:28:28,080 Speaker 1: that after Here's why there's debate. After Nebekonezer, Babylon was 510 00:28:28,160 --> 00:28:32,640 Speaker 1: still an important city as part of several different empires, 511 00:28:33,200 --> 00:28:37,120 Speaker 1: and the rulers of both of these later empires, the 512 00:28:37,280 --> 00:28:42,520 Speaker 1: Akamenid and the Solucid Empires, both of their top people 513 00:28:42,960 --> 00:28:47,320 Speaker 1: would use the Palace at Babylon as their main hangout, 514 00:28:47,360 --> 00:28:50,520 Speaker 1: as their white house. So with all this argument, all 515 00:28:50,560 --> 00:28:57,360 Speaker 1: this hullabaloo and discourse about where the hanging gardens actually 516 00:28:57,400 --> 00:29:00,920 Speaker 1: were in Babylon and whether they existed, we see, like 517 00:29:00,960 --> 00:29:04,560 Speaker 1: you were saying, people are finding vaulted rooms, they're finding 518 00:29:04,600 --> 00:29:09,400 Speaker 1: stuff that clearly indicate some sort of irrigation system, but 519 00:29:09,880 --> 00:29:17,280 Speaker 1: they're not finding positive proof of the hanging gardens actually existing. 520 00:29:17,360 --> 00:29:19,760 Speaker 1: And this is where we get to Christopher Klein actually 521 00:29:19,800 --> 00:29:20,840 Speaker 1: existing there. 522 00:29:21,480 --> 00:29:25,120 Speaker 3: Stiff Kleine, writing for History, suggests that it's possible that 523 00:29:25,120 --> 00:29:29,240 Speaker 3: this search was being conducted in the wrong place, according 524 00:29:29,280 --> 00:29:33,560 Speaker 3: to Oxford University doctor Stephanie Daily, in fact, a scholar 525 00:29:33,600 --> 00:29:37,360 Speaker 3: in ancient Mesopotamian languages who found evidence in some new 526 00:29:37,400 --> 00:29:44,120 Speaker 3: translations of ancient texts belonging to King Censharib. They described 527 00:29:44,240 --> 00:29:50,320 Speaker 3: his own mega mega palace, you know, completely bespoke, referred 528 00:29:50,320 --> 00:29:53,960 Speaker 3: to in the writings as unrivaled palace as being a 529 00:29:54,120 --> 00:30:00,800 Speaker 3: wonder for all people. He also mentioned a technology a 530 00:30:00,960 --> 00:30:05,720 Speaker 3: bronze water raising kind of I guess it's a screw. 531 00:30:06,160 --> 00:30:08,200 Speaker 3: What it is, in fact, is that's it's described. It's 532 00:30:08,200 --> 00:30:09,680 Speaker 3: not you know, what you would think of as a 533 00:30:09,680 --> 00:30:13,120 Speaker 3: as a hardware screw, but it is a spiral and 534 00:30:13,200 --> 00:30:17,200 Speaker 3: it was invented by Archimedes, who also invented that time 535 00:30:17,240 --> 00:30:20,720 Speaker 3: travel device from that Indiana Jones movie that everyone loved. 536 00:30:21,280 --> 00:30:24,240 Speaker 1: Right, Okay, a couple of things there we've because I 537 00:30:24,320 --> 00:30:26,880 Speaker 1: have to do it, man, We talked about this on stuff. 538 00:30:26,880 --> 00:30:30,840 Speaker 1: They don't want you to know. Archimedes probably did invent 539 00:30:31,000 --> 00:30:34,680 Speaker 1: some version of this, but it's a matter of branding 540 00:30:34,800 --> 00:30:40,400 Speaker 1: because people clearly invented this screw parallel, Yeah, they invented 541 00:30:40,440 --> 00:30:44,360 Speaker 1: it before him, parallel thinking as you said, he was 542 00:30:44,520 --> 00:30:47,000 Speaker 1: just the most famous guy at the time, so he 543 00:30:47,080 --> 00:30:48,440 Speaker 1: got his name attached to it. 544 00:30:48,760 --> 00:30:51,760 Speaker 3: I guess I still don't fully understand how the technology works. 545 00:30:51,760 --> 00:30:53,160 Speaker 3: I don't know, Max, maybe this is something that you 546 00:30:53,160 --> 00:30:55,840 Speaker 3: could help with. Like it is a spiral and the 547 00:30:55,880 --> 00:30:59,800 Speaker 3: water is meant to travel upward, right, so how does 548 00:30:59,800 --> 00:31:00,800 Speaker 3: that exactly work? 549 00:31:01,440 --> 00:31:06,880 Speaker 2: Screw it? Okay, Yeah, it's actually very simple, but because 550 00:31:06,920 --> 00:31:09,040 Speaker 2: you think about the way, but it functions in the 551 00:31:09,080 --> 00:31:12,680 Speaker 2: same way that a screw would work on grander scale. 552 00:31:12,880 --> 00:31:18,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's it's one of the earliest documented hydraulic machines. 553 00:31:18,320 --> 00:31:20,720 Speaker 1: So you're right that moves water. Like you said earlier, 554 00:31:20,760 --> 00:31:24,640 Speaker 1: it leverages gravity. So depending on the angle that you 555 00:31:24,760 --> 00:31:27,840 Speaker 1: put it on, when you turn the screw through one 556 00:31:27,920 --> 00:31:32,360 Speaker 1: mechanism or another, the screw kind of builds a ramp 557 00:31:32,680 --> 00:31:34,080 Speaker 1: to move the water up. 558 00:31:34,480 --> 00:31:36,360 Speaker 4: Got it. Okay, Yeah, that's pretty neat. 559 00:31:37,120 --> 00:31:40,640 Speaker 1: It's it's it's weird, it's it's I don't know. I 560 00:31:40,680 --> 00:31:44,200 Speaker 1: think it's super cool. I know it can sound kind 561 00:31:44,240 --> 00:31:48,560 Speaker 1: of like we're maybe easily impressed, but order just a 562 00:31:48,560 --> 00:31:51,080 Speaker 1: bunch of dorks, which is also entirely possible. 563 00:31:51,520 --> 00:31:55,040 Speaker 3: Yes, we're a good company with ridiculous historians, we hope. 564 00:31:55,200 --> 00:31:58,720 Speaker 1: Yes, they're yeah, agreed on all counts. And we know, 565 00:31:59,040 --> 00:32:01,760 Speaker 1: like I love the point bringing up here the idea 566 00:32:01,880 --> 00:32:05,840 Speaker 1: that there may have been some kind of hanging garden 567 00:32:06,720 --> 00:32:11,160 Speaker 1: somewhere else, relatively nearby, right in the Middle Eastern area 568 00:32:11,880 --> 00:32:16,520 Speaker 1: Nineva Mosul something like that. We know aqueduct technology was 569 00:32:16,760 --> 00:32:20,360 Speaker 1: very much in play. We've got some boss relief images 570 00:32:20,640 --> 00:32:24,960 Speaker 1: from the Royal Palace and nine US showing very very lush, 571 00:32:25,560 --> 00:32:31,880 Speaker 1: fertile gardens that were being irrigated through an aqueduct. Yeah, 572 00:32:31,920 --> 00:32:34,880 Speaker 1: and we know that in that part of the world, 573 00:32:34,920 --> 00:32:39,200 Speaker 1: in that city scape, the topography was less flat, there 574 00:32:39,320 --> 00:32:43,440 Speaker 1: was more variation, so it would have made it easier 575 00:32:43,760 --> 00:32:48,520 Speaker 1: to elevate water to the gardens versus you know, Babylon, 576 00:32:48,600 --> 00:32:52,320 Speaker 1: which has a relatively flat landscape. And maybe then the 577 00:32:52,400 --> 00:32:56,480 Speaker 1: confusion over the location of these gardens could be due 578 00:32:56,520 --> 00:33:00,400 Speaker 1: to the passage of empires, because the Assyrian forces honkeered 579 00:33:00,440 --> 00:33:05,120 Speaker 1: Babylon in six 't eighty nine BCE, and after that takeover, 580 00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:08,640 Speaker 1: NINEV got a new name. It was called the New Babylon. 581 00:33:08,760 --> 00:33:14,000 Speaker 1: So this can be super confusing to later historians and researchers. 582 00:33:14,320 --> 00:33:17,640 Speaker 1: So maybe what we're maybe the hanging gardens did exist, 583 00:33:18,080 --> 00:33:20,960 Speaker 1: but instead of being hanging guardens of Babylon, they were 584 00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:24,840 Speaker 1: hanging gardens of Nineva. This is crazy because it, like 585 00:33:24,960 --> 00:33:27,760 Speaker 1: I was trying to think of a more modern comparison. 586 00:33:28,360 --> 00:33:32,080 Speaker 1: Imagine if thousands of years from now we have a 587 00:33:32,160 --> 00:33:36,280 Speaker 1: future historian who is totally convinced that the Statue of 588 00:33:36,320 --> 00:33:38,080 Speaker 1: Liberty is in Poughkeepsie. 589 00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:40,200 Speaker 4: Yeah, for sure, that'd be interesting. 590 00:33:40,400 --> 00:33:43,000 Speaker 3: Gosh, I always think whenever I hear about historical accounts 591 00:33:43,040 --> 00:33:45,280 Speaker 3: of the Statue of Liberty, I can't not think about 592 00:33:45,280 --> 00:33:48,440 Speaker 3: the planet of the apes. They blew it up. We 593 00:33:48,480 --> 00:33:51,840 Speaker 3: were just talking about blowing things up. Yes, whole planets. Yeah, 594 00:33:52,040 --> 00:33:56,600 Speaker 3: super into the idea. And I hope that statement ages well. 595 00:33:57,240 --> 00:34:02,920 Speaker 3: Oh boy, we know that we know that there is 596 00:34:03,640 --> 00:34:08,280 Speaker 3: indication at least that something like the gardens existed. Something 597 00:34:08,920 --> 00:34:12,880 Speaker 3: in the real world informed this legend of an ancient wonder. 598 00:34:13,160 --> 00:34:16,759 Speaker 3: We just aren't sure on the specifics because of the 599 00:34:16,800 --> 00:34:20,520 Speaker 3: great game of telephone. And here's the good news, folks. 600 00:34:20,880 --> 00:34:24,719 Speaker 3: As we're recording, there are some people way smarter than us, 601 00:34:24,760 --> 00:34:28,600 Speaker 3: some real boffins and eggheads and Indiana Jones types who 602 00:34:28,760 --> 00:34:33,879 Speaker 3: are conducting science and archaeology in these areas. So they 603 00:34:34,000 --> 00:34:39,640 Speaker 3: may well, discover solid one hundred percent inarguable proof of 604 00:34:39,760 --> 00:34:43,320 Speaker 3: the hanging gardens of Babylon, or the hanging guardens of Nineveh, 605 00:34:43,600 --> 00:34:46,279 Speaker 3: or the hanging guards of Mosul, or you know, at 606 00:34:46,280 --> 00:34:49,880 Speaker 3: this point, just like a garden preferably hanging, preferably hanging. 607 00:34:50,160 --> 00:34:53,080 Speaker 3: And also shout out to the early Cure song Total 608 00:34:53,120 --> 00:34:54,719 Speaker 3: Banger the Hanging Gardens. 609 00:34:55,680 --> 00:35:00,440 Speaker 4: Check it out. It's a real goth fantasia of a tune. Now. 610 00:35:00,480 --> 00:35:02,560 Speaker 1: I love that you're pointing out that, Nol and we 611 00:35:02,760 --> 00:35:06,879 Speaker 1: also we also just before we wrap for time, we 612 00:35:06,960 --> 00:35:10,560 Speaker 1: have to address something that has surely been on everybody's 613 00:35:10,600 --> 00:35:12,440 Speaker 1: mind from the very top of this show. 614 00:35:12,760 --> 00:35:14,120 Speaker 4: What is it, Ben, What is it? I want to 615 00:35:14,160 --> 00:35:15,000 Speaker 4: know if it's on my mind? 616 00:35:15,040 --> 00:35:17,839 Speaker 1: Oh gosh, I hope it is, no, because when you 617 00:35:17,960 --> 00:35:21,279 Speaker 1: finally when you get to play civilization, and I'm so 618 00:35:21,480 --> 00:35:25,040 Speaker 1: happy for it is. Yeah, one of the questions you're 619 00:35:25,080 --> 00:35:27,240 Speaker 1: going to have is you're going to have this choice 620 00:35:27,280 --> 00:35:30,840 Speaker 1: of wonders, right, and it evolves as your civilization does. 621 00:35:30,960 --> 00:35:32,960 Speaker 3: But you can only have one in the world. Wasn't 622 00:35:32,960 --> 00:35:34,200 Speaker 3: that a thing you talked about at the top. 623 00:35:34,280 --> 00:35:34,719 Speaker 4: That's the thing. 624 00:35:34,800 --> 00:35:37,239 Speaker 3: So you pick your wonder and you written and they're 625 00:35:37,280 --> 00:35:38,880 Speaker 3: modeled after these things. 626 00:35:38,960 --> 00:35:42,360 Speaker 1: You can build multiple wonders. Other empires will try to 627 00:35:42,360 --> 00:35:45,799 Speaker 1: build them too, so you can build the Pyramids or 628 00:35:45,840 --> 00:35:49,680 Speaker 1: Stonehenge or Big ben or I think Broadway. There are 629 00:35:49,680 --> 00:35:54,040 Speaker 1: a ton of them, but if some Broadway, Yeah, yeah, 630 00:35:54,239 --> 00:35:57,600 Speaker 1: there were. They were stretched for ideas square, Yeah, there were. 631 00:35:57,640 --> 00:36:00,000 Speaker 1: There were a little stretch for ideas. 632 00:36:00,080 --> 00:36:03,600 Speaker 3: Commercial bloat sorry, hot take times square. 633 00:36:03,920 --> 00:36:08,600 Speaker 2: Yes, commercial bloat is a way to win civilizations. Yes, okay, 634 00:36:08,760 --> 00:36:10,839 Speaker 2: not in six, but I think it's seven. They brought 635 00:36:10,840 --> 00:36:12,520 Speaker 2: it back in previous ones that. 636 00:36:12,920 --> 00:36:16,640 Speaker 4: Called commercial bloat. This is like trade. 637 00:36:17,200 --> 00:36:20,520 Speaker 1: It's like the there's the culture war. Uh, there's the 638 00:36:20,560 --> 00:36:24,080 Speaker 1: economic victory, there's uh domination victory. 639 00:36:24,480 --> 00:36:25,160 Speaker 3: And seven. 640 00:36:25,239 --> 00:36:25,920 Speaker 4: Now how they do it? 641 00:36:25,960 --> 00:36:28,440 Speaker 2: I was the three ages, and in the first age 642 00:36:28,880 --> 00:36:31,439 Speaker 2: there's an economic Golden age, which is like you get 643 00:36:31,480 --> 00:36:36,120 Speaker 2: by having by acquiring resources, especially luxury resources and stuff. 644 00:36:36,239 --> 00:36:36,520 Speaker 4: Seven. 645 00:36:36,560 --> 00:36:39,359 Speaker 2: By the way, it's really fun and it's getting better. 646 00:36:39,440 --> 00:36:40,600 Speaker 2: They just released the first. 647 00:36:40,480 --> 00:36:43,880 Speaker 3: Update nice and we'll I'm going to get in immediately 648 00:36:43,880 --> 00:36:46,239 Speaker 3: after we wrap this session. I also just found out 649 00:36:46,280 --> 00:36:48,440 Speaker 3: for any gamers in the audience, there's a new Monster 650 00:36:48,560 --> 00:36:51,839 Speaker 3: Hunter gamey PS five that I just got and I'm 651 00:36:51,880 --> 00:36:55,120 Speaker 3: only just now kind of almost through the intro tutorial part. 652 00:36:55,280 --> 00:36:58,000 Speaker 3: I love the last Monster Hunter game, but I found 653 00:36:58,000 --> 00:37:00,879 Speaker 3: it a little overwhelming at times, and apparently this new 654 00:37:00,920 --> 00:37:01,640 Speaker 3: one that. 655 00:37:01,680 --> 00:37:02,920 Speaker 4: Pairs that down a little bit. 656 00:37:03,000 --> 00:37:04,879 Speaker 3: So gonna get back into that one and then get 657 00:37:04,960 --> 00:37:06,359 Speaker 3: the new Civilization game. 658 00:37:06,520 --> 00:37:08,840 Speaker 1: And I'm still trying to sleep with a lot of 659 00:37:08,920 --> 00:37:14,120 Speaker 1: characters in Balder's Gate three, So wish me luck you guys. 660 00:37:16,000 --> 00:37:18,400 Speaker 3: So Balder's Gate three, man, that was too much for me. 661 00:37:18,440 --> 00:37:20,560 Speaker 3: I watched my friend play when he was visiting, and 662 00:37:20,600 --> 00:37:21,960 Speaker 3: I was just like, I don't know if this is 663 00:37:22,000 --> 00:37:24,920 Speaker 3: for me. It's too small to play on a TV too. 664 00:37:24,960 --> 00:37:27,319 Speaker 3: It's like all the text is so small. Oh yeah, yeah, 665 00:37:27,960 --> 00:37:29,560 Speaker 3: maybe a better experience on a PC. 666 00:37:29,760 --> 00:37:30,120 Speaker 4: I don't know. 667 00:37:30,719 --> 00:37:31,879 Speaker 1: Yeah, perhaps right. 668 00:37:32,120 --> 00:37:32,239 Speaker 4: Uh. 669 00:37:32,360 --> 00:37:35,200 Speaker 1: And the question here is should you build the hanging 670 00:37:35,320 --> 00:37:37,000 Speaker 1: gardens in Civilization? 671 00:37:37,640 --> 00:37:37,759 Speaker 3: Uh? 672 00:37:38,440 --> 00:37:42,400 Speaker 1: Yes, It's going to depend upon your empire's mileage and 673 00:37:42,440 --> 00:37:46,640 Speaker 1: the approach you take to the game. I would say, 674 00:37:46,719 --> 00:37:50,640 Speaker 1: don't necessarily prioritize it. There are better wonders out there. 675 00:37:50,920 --> 00:37:53,920 Speaker 2: Hanging gardens is always such an early wonder, and especially 676 00:37:53,920 --> 00:37:56,400 Speaker 2: because like if you play on any difficulty above Prince, 677 00:37:56,440 --> 00:37:58,640 Speaker 2: which they've renamed in the newest one, but like Prince 678 00:37:58,760 --> 00:38:01,360 Speaker 2: is like where everyone starts equal. But the other versions 679 00:38:01,400 --> 00:38:03,120 Speaker 2: of the game, especially once you get up like a 680 00:38:03,200 --> 00:38:08,799 Speaker 2: mortal or deity, the AI have significant advantages on you, 681 00:38:08,960 --> 00:38:11,759 Speaker 2: especially early games. So it's like, if you decide I'm 682 00:38:11,760 --> 00:38:15,080 Speaker 2: getting hanging gardens, cool, you're not getting anything else. Socially, 683 00:38:15,080 --> 00:38:17,200 Speaker 2: in Civilization six, it's like I want do you want 684 00:38:17,200 --> 00:38:20,800 Speaker 2: to hanging gardens? Or do I want a religion? 685 00:38:21,480 --> 00:38:21,680 Speaker 4: Right? 686 00:38:21,719 --> 00:38:24,480 Speaker 2: And in a lot of ways, it's fine if you 687 00:38:24,520 --> 00:38:26,319 Speaker 2: can get it, or if someone's not going for it, 688 00:38:26,400 --> 00:38:28,160 Speaker 2: then it's great because it'll make your city into a 689 00:38:28,200 --> 00:38:31,640 Speaker 2: metropolis very quickly. But there is better wonders. 690 00:38:32,040 --> 00:38:34,440 Speaker 1: I gotta say, as a person who always picks the 691 00:38:34,640 --> 00:38:38,480 Speaker 1: science condition for victory, I'm all about going to space, 692 00:38:38,640 --> 00:38:41,120 Speaker 1: you know what I mean. That's a classic human Yeah. 693 00:38:41,239 --> 00:38:43,160 Speaker 1: I can't wait to hear about your experience there and 694 00:38:43,239 --> 00:38:45,359 Speaker 1: all and folk reach for the stars. That's a good 695 00:38:45,360 --> 00:38:48,120 Speaker 1: advice for everyone to take home. There we go, There 696 00:38:48,160 --> 00:38:50,560 Speaker 1: we go. That's what we call a wrap up. Folks, 697 00:38:50,600 --> 00:38:53,279 Speaker 1: Thank you so much for tuning in. There's much more 698 00:38:53,320 --> 00:38:56,760 Speaker 1: to get to join us. Later. We're going to explore 699 00:38:56,920 --> 00:39:00,480 Speaker 1: some stories about Apple and apples be not in the 700 00:39:00,480 --> 00:39:04,880 Speaker 1: way and the beats and a besh and a fab whoa. 701 00:39:05,120 --> 00:39:06,759 Speaker 4: Well done, jim lely sweet and. 702 00:39:07,360 --> 00:39:11,120 Speaker 1: We're going to uh We're also going to have some 703 00:39:11,640 --> 00:39:16,560 Speaker 1: more adventures ahead, some special guests, some cameos. We can't 704 00:39:16,600 --> 00:39:19,040 Speaker 1: wait for you to be along. So thank you for 705 00:39:19,080 --> 00:39:21,680 Speaker 1: tuning in and also, of course thanks to our super 706 00:39:21,680 --> 00:39:25,520 Speaker 1: producer and research associate for today's episode, mister Max Williams. 707 00:39:25,920 --> 00:39:28,960 Speaker 3: That's right, huge thanks to Alex Williams who composed our theme. 708 00:39:29,080 --> 00:39:31,719 Speaker 3: Christa Frasciotis and Eve jeffco here in spirit and Ben. 709 00:39:31,960 --> 00:39:33,840 Speaker 3: Just a quick thing to say if anybody wanted to 710 00:39:33,880 --> 00:39:36,040 Speaker 3: reach out to us or suggesting the episodes, We're still 711 00:39:36,160 --> 00:39:38,719 Speaker 3: having gotten the keys back to our official Ridiculous Sister 712 00:39:38,800 --> 00:39:39,880 Speaker 3: and social media. 713 00:39:39,960 --> 00:39:41,920 Speaker 4: But you can find this as human people on the 714 00:39:41,920 --> 00:39:44,600 Speaker 4: internet if you wish. I'm how now Noel Brown on Instagram. 715 00:39:44,960 --> 00:39:48,319 Speaker 1: I am calling myself in a burst of creativity at 716 00:39:48,360 --> 00:39:51,120 Speaker 1: Ben Bullen wherever you find a place with an at sign. 717 00:39:51,160 --> 00:39:53,160 Speaker 1: You can also hit me up directly on the website 718 00:39:53,239 --> 00:39:54,360 Speaker 1: Benboland dot com. 719 00:39:54,680 --> 00:39:56,839 Speaker 4: Good you lock that down, man, than being your name 720 00:39:56,880 --> 00:39:58,000 Speaker 4: and all yeah. 721 00:39:58,320 --> 00:40:02,719 Speaker 1: Name too, yeah, with great affection to the other four 722 00:40:02,840 --> 00:40:05,440 Speaker 1: bin bulliins in the world, and yes I do know 723 00:40:05,480 --> 00:40:07,600 Speaker 1: them all. I reached out to them and I think 724 00:40:07,600 --> 00:40:09,919 Speaker 1: I creeped them out a little big thanks of course, 725 00:40:10,000 --> 00:40:13,080 Speaker 1: the rude dude. It's a ridiculous crime. And Noel, thanks 726 00:40:13,080 --> 00:40:14,880 Speaker 1: to you man, God you as well. 727 00:40:15,120 --> 00:40:17,760 Speaker 4: You're you're, you're the eighth wonder of the of the world. 728 00:40:17,800 --> 00:40:22,160 Speaker 4: Ben in my heart because of the Oh yeah, for sure. 729 00:40:22,239 --> 00:40:24,240 Speaker 4: Whatever the next time, folks. 730 00:40:31,280 --> 00:40:35,120 Speaker 3: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 731 00:40:35,200 --> 00:40:37,320 Speaker 3: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.