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Speaker 1: Hell no, we can savor prediction of ihearted yo. I'm

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Speaker 1: Any Reese.

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Speaker 2: And I'm Lorn vogel Bum. And today we have an

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Speaker 2: episode for you about giant tiger prawns.

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Speaker 1: Yes, oh, you know we love these seafood episodes.

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Speaker 2: Oh they're so cool. They're so weird. Sea creatures are

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Speaker 2: so strange, and I love them so much. Oh, this

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Speaker 2: is our first shrimp episode. We have been so remiss,

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Speaker 2: but it's fine. It's finally here.

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Speaker 1: I couldn't believe it when you told me that, how

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Speaker 1: have we never done?

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Speaker 2: Oh, I mean we've done like lobsters and crawfish, which

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Speaker 2: are not shrimp, but you know they're also little weird,

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Speaker 2: leggy crustacean buddies.

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Speaker 1: It's true.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I did have shrimp as pets for a long time,

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Speaker 2: and so maybe, you know, like both of us were like,

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Speaker 2: maybe we shouldn't talk about something that Lauren literally keeps

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Speaker 2: as a pet.

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Speaker 1: On our food show. I will.

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Speaker 2: I lost the aquarium during the move, but but I'm

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Speaker 2: going to get it back up and running. It is

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Speaker 2: like on the to do list. It's going to happen.

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Speaker 1: I'm very excited for more updates about this. I was

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Speaker 1: very invested in that aquarium.

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Speaker 2: And yeah, and more shrimp are coming, so here, here

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Speaker 2: we go. I just love them. They're so busy all

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Speaker 2: the time, they're doing stuff. It's great. Anyway. Note at

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Speaker 2: the top here, Yes, I said that the episode is

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Speaker 2: about giant tiger prawn and then immediately started talking about shrimp.

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Speaker 2: That is because the words shrimp and prawn are in

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Speaker 2: fact synonyms. Some people have tried to make them have

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Speaker 2: real definitions, but everybody else insists on being real chaotic

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Speaker 2: about it. So here we are.

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Speaker 1: I'm glad you put that note up there, because I

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Speaker 1: really was trying to make sure I was getting everything correct,

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Speaker 1: because a prawn, to me, feels so much bigger than

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Speaker 1: a shrimp.

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Speaker 2: See etymologically sure, Yeah, let's go with that.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Like, people are really confused about how this has occurred

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Speaker 2: because like, like some people are like, well, maybe it's

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Speaker 2: because the word shrimp also means small. Yeah, and so

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Speaker 2: for some people the word prawn means something bigger, but

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Speaker 2: other people use them in kind of the opposite way.

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Speaker 1: So we don't know.

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Speaker 2: No, no, we don't know.

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Speaker 1: Okay, Well, it is a fascinating episode, complicated in many ways.

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Speaker 2: The seafood industry typically is.

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Speaker 1: Yes, that was an actual crack. You could hear a voice, Yes,

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Speaker 1: but we have spoken about it before.

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Speaker 2: Sure, yeah, right, we did do that lobster in that

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Speaker 2: crawfish or crayfish episode if you if you prefer, they

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Speaker 2: are perhaps the most biologically pertinent seafood episodes we've done. Also,

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Speaker 2: definitely check out our big fish industry episode from the

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Speaker 2: Oahu episodes for a kind of macro look at the

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Speaker 2: complexities of fishing production.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yes, which we are going to get into a

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Speaker 1: little bit. Oh yeah here, but I suppose that brings

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Speaker 1: us to our question. Sure, Giant tiger prons what are they?

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Speaker 2: Well, Giant tiger prowns are a type of crustacean that

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Speaker 2: is a leggy animal that wears its skeleton on the

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Speaker 2: outside of its body and typically lives in the water.

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Speaker 2: Giant tiger prawns have long bodies, consisting of a carapace

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Speaker 2: containing the head and like most of the internal organs,

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Speaker 2: and then an abdomen containing a big, fleshy tail muscle.

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Speaker 2: And this is the part that we humans are mostly

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Speaker 2: interested in eating. Plus, it's got ten legs on the

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Speaker 2: underside of their bodies to help them move around. And

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Speaker 2: grab stuff. Their shell is firm but slightly flexible and

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Speaker 2: a little bit translucent, sort of like our fingernails. It's

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Speaker 2: in segments like armor, and can range in color from

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Speaker 2: rusty brown to gray blue in color, with this characteristic

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Speaker 2: striping in bands around their tail in contrasting black and white,

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Speaker 2: hence the name tiger. Yeah, they're called giant because they're

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Speaker 2: big for a shrimp. They can grow a little bit

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Speaker 2: over a foot long and like a couple inches thick,

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Speaker 2: that's about thirty by six centimeters or so, and they

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Speaker 2: can weigh nearly a pound, like a little bit less

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Speaker 2: than half a kilo. They can be cooked whole in

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Speaker 2: their shells, maybe roasted, grilled, steamed, or boiled, after which

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Speaker 2: they might be served cut open so that you can

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Speaker 2: pick out the tail meat. You can also remove the

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Speaker 2: carapaces and legs and just cook the tail portion, or

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Speaker 2: even just the tail meat. When it's raw. The meat

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Speaker 2: is slightly translucent white in color with a thin silvery

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Speaker 2: gray skin, and when it's cooked it'll go opaque white

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Speaker 2: with a bright orange pink skin. The tail meat is tender,

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Speaker 2: chewy like sort of springy or bouncy kind of and

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Speaker 2: savory sweet and a little rich and briny in flavor.

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Speaker 2: They're tasty on their own and can be served with

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Speaker 2: just a little bit of like lemon juice or butter

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Speaker 2: and a sprinkle of herbs. But that sweet, rich flavor

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Speaker 2: goes well with all kinds of sauces or in soups

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Speaker 2: or stews. They're big, tasty shrimp. Eating. Eating good shrimp

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Speaker 2: like these gives me the same feeling as laying out

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Speaker 2: on warm sand or like on a hot stone surface

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Speaker 2: at a spa. It's just the sense of like light fulfillment.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, good shrimp, good shrimp, right texture, right seasonings. Oh,

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Speaker 1: it's just it makes you want to be by the water.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's very sublime.

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Speaker 1: Yeah it is. Well.

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Speaker 2: The animals are also super cool before we eat.

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Speaker 1: Them, okay.

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Speaker 2: A taxonomical name Penius monodon giant tiger prawns are in

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Speaker 2: native to the Indian Ocean and warm parts of the

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Speaker 2: West Pacific, stretching from like Southeast Africa over across to

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Speaker 2: Australia and then up through southern Japan. They live near

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Speaker 2: coastlines at the ocean's floor, burrowing in the mud or sand,

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Speaker 2: and they're mostly active at night. The female shrimp tend

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Speaker 2: to be a little bit bigger than the males, and

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Speaker 2: they live for about three years. In the wild, they'll

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Speaker 2: head into like brackish river estuaries to mate and lay

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Speaker 2: eggs in like calm lagoons or mangrove shelters. I read

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Speaker 2: that they can lay over eight hundred thousand eggs in

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Speaker 2: one go.

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Speaker 1: WHOA.

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Speaker 2: Most of those will not survive, but here we are.

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Speaker 2: The eggs sink to the bottom and hatches larvae, which

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Speaker 2: go through a few metamorphoses while floating around like plankton

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Speaker 2: until they develop legs. Five pairs of short swimmerrats on

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Speaker 2: the underside of their abdomen or tail to help them

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Speaker 2: propel through the water, and then on the underside of

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Speaker 2: their carapus or kind of head. They've got five pairs

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Speaker 2: of more articulated walking legs, the front three of which

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Speaker 2: end in these teen s pincers for grabbing and manipulating objects.

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Speaker 2: At the front of the carapus, they have two pairs

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Speaker 2: of long antennae that they use to help feel what's

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Speaker 2: going on around them, and weird little beady eyes on

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Speaker 2: these short eyestalks. As they grow in size, they molt

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Speaker 2: their shells and grow new ones. They are predator, and

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Speaker 2: I understand they can be pretty aggressive towards other small crustaceans,

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Speaker 2: which are their primary food source. But most of the

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Speaker 2: giant tiger prowns that we eat come from farms, either

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Speaker 2: outdoor ponds or indoor tanks, and uh yeah there, we

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Speaker 2: eat them in whatever way you enjoy eating seafood. Shrimp

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Speaker 2: are always interesting because, like they're kind of mild, but

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Speaker 2: they've got those different flavor aspects that lend themselves to

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Speaker 2: a lot of different dishes, Like that sweetness can play

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Speaker 2: well with bright or tart flavors, that the richness can

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Speaker 2: stand up to spicy flavors, the savory ness can play

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Speaker 2: alongside like earthy or vegetable sort of flavors. Just a

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Speaker 2: nice protein.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I have had a realization lately that I've

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Speaker 1: always thought shrimp was like seafood light, Like if you

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Speaker 1: are a little nervous about seafood.

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Speaker 2: You don't, Yeah, if you don't really like fishy flavors,

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Speaker 2: then shrimp might be a good good intro for you. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Yes, But I've heard from a couple of friends they

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Speaker 1: don't like shrimp, and I don't want to do with

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Speaker 1: this information. I think it's a bad texture based on

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Speaker 1: what they describe kind of that watery texture like ill

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Speaker 1: cooked shrimp. I see, this is an experiment for me

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Speaker 1: to work on later. What about the nutrition.

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Speaker 2: Shrimp by themselves are pretty good for you, you know,

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Speaker 2: good source of protein and micronutrients. They contain some good fats.

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Speaker 2: They do contain dietary cholesterol, but the science jury is

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Speaker 2: out about whether that really affects most people's blood cholesterol levels.

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Speaker 2: If it's a thing that you're watching out for, watch

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Speaker 2: out for that. Mind your shrimp portion sizes. If you're

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Speaker 2: lucky enough to be able to afford to do so. Yes, indeed,

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Speaker 2: well we do have some numbers for you. We do

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Speaker 2: no monetary ones though, Okay. Shrimp in general are the

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Speaker 2: most consumed seafood in the United States. Global production of

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Speaker 2: giant tiger prowns in particular is around seven hundred and

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Speaker 2: seventy thousand metric tons per year. Vietnam produces about thirty

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Speaker 2: five percent of that, mostly on small pond farms, and

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Speaker 2: they are the second most farm shrimp in the world,

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Speaker 2: at only about eleven percent of total farm shrimp. They

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Speaker 2: were the leading farmed species up until about twenty years

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Speaker 2: ago when white leg shrimp, which can be raised at

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Speaker 2: higher densities, surpassed them. White leg shrimp are now some

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Speaker 2: eighty three percent of farm shrimp production.

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Speaker 1: Dang, yeah, okay, okay, well we do have a history

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Speaker 1: for you on this one.

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Speaker 2: Oh my, heck, we do. We again, the seafood industry

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Speaker 2: is very complex, so we will get into that, oh boy,

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Speaker 2: will we as soon as we get back from a

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Speaker 2: quick word from our sponsors.

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Speaker 1: And we're back.

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Speaker 2: Thank you sponsored, Yes, thank you.

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Speaker 1: Okay. So, giant tiger prawns are indigenous to the Philippines, Australia,

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Speaker 1: and Southeast Asia. Oh we don't know how old the

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Speaker 1: species is, but decapods, a varied category of crustaceans that

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Speaker 1: includes shrimp, evolved four hundred and fifty million years ago

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Speaker 1: and they're still researching this, by the way.

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Speaker 2: Cool yeah, love it.

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Speaker 1: Yep yeah, yep. So probably pretty old and generally speaking,

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Speaker 1: humans with access to shrimp have been eating them since

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Speaker 1: prehistoric times. Records indicate that the ancient Romans and Greeks

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Speaker 1: had ready access to them and enjoyed them in a

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Speaker 1: variety of ways. While the written record is sparse, historians

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Speaker 1: believe that larger shrimp. Like giant tiger prawns, were eaten

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Speaker 1: boiled similarly to lobster, or in soups. They may have

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Speaker 1: also been roasted or used as an ingredient in patties

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Speaker 1: like simply patties. For more than a century, at least,

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Speaker 1: Indo Pacific coastal cities and towns in the areas where

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Speaker 1: great tiger prowns spawn naturally have been farming them on

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Speaker 1: a small scale. In the early days, they were cultivated

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Speaker 1: with other species of shrimp, usually in ponds. The first

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Speaker 1: known scientific description of the tiger prown was by J. C.

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Speaker 1: Fabricus in seventeen ninety eight, is also the one that

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Speaker 1: proposed the scientific name and then jumping way ahead. In

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Speaker 1: the nineteen thirties, there were several breakthroughs and advances in

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Speaker 1: shrimp farming at large.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, basically like getting shrimp larvae to survive in captivity

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Speaker 2: was a bit tricky. Research started in Japan, but then

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Speaker 2: moved to places like Tahiti, China, and Taiwan in the

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Speaker 2: nineteen sixties due to climate conditions being more favorable. Through

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Speaker 2: the sixties and into the seventies, there were advancements in

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Speaker 2: intensive farming, increasing yields and decreasing costs with shrimp farming.

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Speaker 2: Early on in this the main shrimp species being worked

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Speaker 2: with was the giant tiger prawn because they're relatively adaptable.

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Speaker 1: Yes, so research on breeding of the giant tiger prawn

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Speaker 1: and on the flavor compounds that make them so tasty

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Speaker 1: really got underway in the nineteen seventies. From nineteen seventy

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Speaker 1: eight to nineteen ninety one, the tiger prown was one

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Speaker 1: of six species of peniad shrimp sent to Hawaii for

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Speaker 1: research purposes, and thanks in part to this research, commercial

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Speaker 1: farms started opening in Thailand nineteen seventy two, and they

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Speaker 1: soon dominated the global market for farm raised tiger prawns,

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Speaker 1: and commercial production really took off soon after that. During

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Speaker 1: the nineteen seventies and eighties, global production of the tiger

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Speaker 1: prawn suppressed any other species of shrimp. A lot of

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Speaker 1: this was accomplished through technological innovations and farming in places

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Speaker 1: outside of the shrimp's natural range where the conditions were suitable,

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Speaker 1: like West Africa and the Caribbean. However, this had unintended consequences,

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Speaker 1: and many of those places around potentially introducing an invasive

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Speaker 1: species after some of the shrimp escaped from farms or

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Speaker 1: labs that they were being kept in Colombia, Venezuela, West Africa,

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Speaker 1: the Caribbean, Brazil, and the US all have similar stories

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Speaker 1: about tiger prawn shrimp escaping into the wild and in

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Speaker 1: some cases establishing a population. The ramifications are still being

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Speaker 1: studied in these places. For instance, tiger prowns were most

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Speaker 1: likely introduced to the US by accident after some escaped

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Speaker 1: in South Carolina in nineteen eighty eight. Only about three

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Speaker 1: hundred of the original two thousand were recovered, although another

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Speaker 1: source put it at much higher. They said it was

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Speaker 1: like a thousand were recovered, but I both places said

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Speaker 1: three hundred. Yeah. And it wasn't until two thousand and

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Speaker 1: six that someone reported catching a tiger prown outside of

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Speaker 1: this initial recovery along the coast of the US, and

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Speaker 1: then a handful followed after that in states like Mississippi, Louisiana, Alabama,

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Speaker 1: and North Carolina. Over the years, other tiger prawns have

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Speaker 1: escaped from American labs during things like hurricanes. Reported sightings

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Speaker 1: of these shrimp have increased since two thousand and six,

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Speaker 1: with a particular spike beginning in twenty eleven. They are

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Speaker 1: now found in bodies of water from Texas to North

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Speaker 1: Carolina in the US, but most experts don't think they

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Speaker 1: have established a population. However, others do and think that

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Speaker 1: we need to be trying to pin down how big

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Speaker 1: it is.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it can be a problem because they prey on

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Speaker 2: native crustacean species and they can also carry diseases that

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Speaker 2: can spread to to native species. So if you do

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Speaker 2: fish around the Gulf of Mexico or along the east

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Speaker 2: coast of the US, and you do giant tiger prons,

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Speaker 2: it is scientifically recommended that you do not throw them back.

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Speaker 2: Like environmental researchers want you to eat them, yes, yes,

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Speaker 2: and report them, report them and then eat them. Yeah, yes,

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Speaker 2: or in whatever order you need to work that out.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Right.

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Speaker 2: Another problem that arose during this time was when farmers

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Speaker 2: started finding a top limit on intensive shrimp farming. The

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Speaker 2: first big production crash came around nineteen eighty seven to

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Speaker 2: nineteen eighty nine and Taiwan they were farming giant tiger

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Speaker 2: prons and during this two year period they lost eighty

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Speaker 2: percent of their yield due to stress and pollution and

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Speaker 2: ensuing diseases. In the shrimp populations there, And this next

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Speaker 2: note isn't necessarily about giant tiger prons, but I had

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Speaker 2: to include it. And they were by far still the

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Speaker 2: most farm shrimp when this occurred, so it's probably not

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Speaker 2: not about them, okay. The Japanese Emperor Hirohito passed away

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Speaker 2: in nineteen eighty nine, posthumously, becoming known as Emperor Shoa,

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Speaker 2: and his death was a big deal and there were

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Speaker 2: like a couple months of mourning and ceremony leading up

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Speaker 2: to the funeral, and it's thought that it caused a

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Speaker 2: farm shrimp market crash. Prices of shrimp that farmers could

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Speaker 2: get for their wares fell by almost fifty percent that year.

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Speaker 2: The theory is that so Japan was the largest market

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Speaker 2: for shrimp at that time, partially because shrimp are associated

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Speaker 2: with celebration in a lot of segments of Japanese culture

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Speaker 2: and the country was in mourning, so they stopped buying shrimp,

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Speaker 2: and this unfortunately coincided with an oversupply of shrimp in general.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, he Ahito's death caused a shrimp market crash.

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Speaker 2: Don't worry it bounce back.

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Speaker 1: It did, but wow, a lot of thing to put

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Speaker 1: on your obituary. All right, so yes. Meanwhile, doing all

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Speaker 1: of this, tiger prawn saw a pretty big boost in

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Speaker 1: popularity in the US and elsewhere in the nineteen nineties.

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Speaker 1: They were featured on bar and restaurant menus, in part

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Speaker 1: because the increased awareness to food chefs that hadn't been

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Speaker 1: exposed to it before, and in part because of the

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Speaker 1: rise of fusion restaurants. This was just We've talked about

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Speaker 1: this a lot before, but that time period was a

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Speaker 1: We're getting cable TV food shows, we see all that

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Speaker 1: kind of stuff, so people were getting like, hello, I

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Speaker 1: want to try this thing. That being said, things weren't

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Speaker 1: all looking up with concerns around over fishing made worse

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Speaker 1: by disease and pollution, lowering projected population growth because there

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Speaker 1: was this like graph that was saying, oh shrimp for days.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I got to be going up forever. And then

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Speaker 2: it was like, oh, that's not how systems work in nature.

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Speaker 1: That's just not correct.

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Speaker 2: Nope.

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Speaker 1: Yes, in two thousand and four, a tiger prawn farm

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Speaker 1: was set up in Florida, but it never took off.

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Speaker 1: And yeah, there is a lot of ongoing research about

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Speaker 1: the impact of this invasive species of shrimp in the

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Speaker 1: US to the environment and native species. Researchers are also

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Speaker 1: looking into where they may be coming from, which is

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Speaker 1: actually really interesting to me because it's like, is it currents?

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Speaker 1: Is it? Yeah? What is it? Like?

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Speaker 2: How do you track shrimp? Like even footlong shrimp are

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Speaker 2: still you know, in comparison to the oceans.

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Speaker 1: So yes, it's really interesting and the numbers are tricky

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Speaker 1: to get to since a lot of it depends on

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Speaker 1: people reporting a sighting or a catch. So again, if

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Speaker 1: you see one. Research has already been done about the

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Speaker 1: population that has established itself in Colombian waters after attempts

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Speaker 1: at controlled aquaculture failed. Research is also being done on

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Speaker 1: over fishing, responsible shrimp farming practices and the impact on

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Speaker 1: people who live in areas where tiger prawns are a

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Speaker 1: big part of the economy.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, as with any segment of the fishing industry, responsible

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Speaker 2: and sustainable aquaculture and fishing practices for a giant tiger

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Speaker 2: prown are concern and are also real complicated, like even

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Speaker 2: when buyers, when consumers are educated about why sustainability is important,

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Speaker 2: finding sustainable practices takes a lot of work and the

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Speaker 2: tools that we have to do so aren't really meant

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Speaker 2: for like the small farms that most of the world's

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Speaker 2: supply of giant tiger prowns are raised on, researchers and

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Speaker 2: organizations are working on it. For example, the Monterey Bay

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Speaker 2: Aquarium is currently helping Vietnamese farmers receive assessment and improve

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Speaker 2: their production methods if necessary. I get the idea that,

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Speaker 2: as with the Certified Organic label on American produce, small

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Speaker 2: farms might be doing everything sustainably but just not have

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Speaker 2: the resources to get certified. But a bunch of groups

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Speaker 2: are working with the farmers on this, so that's cool.

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Speaker 2: And as always, as a consumer, resources like the Monterey

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00:22:44,240 --> 00:22:48,439
Speaker 2: Bay Aquarium Seafood Watch can help you identify certified, sustainable

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Speaker 2: and best choice seafood options. When buying any packaged seafood product,

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Speaker 2: you can look for labels on the packaging like ASC Certified,

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Speaker 2: Farmed Responsibly or BAP certified. Those are going to indicate

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Speaker 2: products that have come from farms that have certification from

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Speaker 2: the Aquaculture Stewardship Council or the Best Aquaculture Practices Program, respectively.

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Speaker 2: So it's it's complicated, and it's a headache, and sometimes

348
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Speaker 2: you just really want to eat shrimp, but you know

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Speaker 2: it's it's it's worth, it's worth feeling good about the

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Speaker 2: thing if you have the time and resources to do so.

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Speaker 1: Yes, this was definitely an episode where I was like,

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Speaker 1: I really want to eat this, but now I've got

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Speaker 1: a yeah, try to be responsible. But now that we've

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Speaker 1: done the research, I'm like, okay, so I really need

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Speaker 1: to listen to some of these things. I did find

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Speaker 1: a restaurant that I trust that has.

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Speaker 2: The Oh that's great. Yeah, I see, And that's that's

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Speaker 2: a terrific thing. Like when you know food professionals who

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Speaker 2: are in the industry and who work with sourcing, who

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Speaker 2: who work with sources for these kind of things. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: I have done have done the legwork for you. Yes,

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Speaker 2: the thank you, the decapod legwork. Yeah, that's a little

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Speaker 2: legs busy like the dance. Oh A one note that

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00:24:11,359 --> 00:24:14,159
Speaker 2: I should have chimed in with. I didn't think I

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Speaker 2: was going to get to follow you up on it,

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Speaker 2: but you mentioned the flavors of these shrimp, and I did.

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Speaker 2: I didn't write it down, but I did find a

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Speaker 2: note about how most of the sweet flavors in shrimp

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Speaker 2: actually come from different amino acids and so what you

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Speaker 2: feed them perhaps obviously has a big impact on that

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Speaker 2: and getting like the right type of proteins to them

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Speaker 2: so that their bodies can use those building blocks to

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Speaker 2: make their flesh tasty.

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Speaker 1: It was very interesting to read scientific papers about the

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Speaker 1: taste of shrimp and reading for certain taste. I assume

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Speaker 1: that's kind of what you do when you describe how

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Speaker 1: food taste during our what is it sectually?

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Speaker 2: So yeah, I mean, except they've got they've got very

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Speaker 2: expensive equipment to help them figure it out.

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Speaker 1: So yes, yes, well this is the first of I'm

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Speaker 1: sure many shrimp episodes. Oh I hope so oh mean too.

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Speaker 1: We do love the seafood ones, even though they usually

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Speaker 1: do have a depressing yeah depressing note, But they're so interesting.

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Speaker 2: They are they really are what what amazing? What amazing

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Speaker 2: critters so tasty and butter.

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Speaker 1: Hmmm mm hmmmmm. Well, okay, that is what we have

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Speaker 1: to say about the giant tiger prawn for now.

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Speaker 2: It is uh and we would love to hear from

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Speaker 2: you if y'all have any recipes or personalized knowledge about

390
00:26:02,440 --> 00:26:05,400
Speaker 2: any of this, we would of course love to hear it.

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Speaker 2: We do already have some listener mail for you though,

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Speaker 2: and we are going to get into that as soon

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Speaker 2: as we get back from one more quick break forward

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Speaker 2: from our sponsors, and we're back.

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Speaker 1: Thank you sponsor, Yes, thank you, and we're back with

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Speaker 1: Tiger Shrip.

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Speaker 2: I get the pounds and then all the little leggy's

398
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Speaker 2: going yeah, yeah, yeah.

399
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Speaker 1: There was a lot of action happening that you listeners

400
00:26:48,320 --> 00:26:56,680
Speaker 1: couldn't see, but I think it was communicated. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

401
00:26:56,800 --> 00:27:00,720
Speaker 1: all right. Valerie wrote, I recently listened to your episode

402
00:27:00,760 --> 00:27:05,200
Speaker 1: about the Horn and Hardart Automat. I have eaten there.

403
00:27:05,760 --> 00:27:08,440
Speaker 1: I grew up in NYC, and one of the last

404
00:27:08,520 --> 00:27:11,080
Speaker 1: lingering automat restaurants was still there when I was a

405
00:27:11,080 --> 00:27:14,000
Speaker 1: little kid. In the episode, you called it H and H,

406
00:27:14,080 --> 00:27:17,080
Speaker 1: but in my experience, nobody ever called it that, possibly

407
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Speaker 1: because there was a legendary NYC bagel shop called H

408
00:27:20,720 --> 00:27:23,720
Speaker 1: and H and having two H and h's would have

409
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Speaker 1: been confusing. In my recollection, people always called it the Automat.

410
00:27:30,560 --> 00:27:32,679
Speaker 1: I remember eating there two or three times with my

411
00:27:32,760 --> 00:27:35,720
Speaker 1: mom in the early nineteen seventies or maybe the very

412
00:27:35,800 --> 00:27:39,080
Speaker 1: late sixties, when we were out shopping at a giant

413
00:27:39,119 --> 00:27:43,320
Speaker 1: department store and needed a quick meal alas. I remember

414
00:27:43,560 --> 00:27:47,720
Speaker 1: always being given a dry and incredibly bland tuna sandwich

415
00:27:47,800 --> 00:27:51,679
Speaker 1: on white bread. Hopefully that was just chosen for me

416
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Speaker 1: as kid food and the grown ups had better options.

417
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Speaker 1: Now I feel old, but also glad to have experienced

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Speaker 1: a peace of history.

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Speaker 2: Oh it's so cool that you got to go. I

420
00:28:05,280 --> 00:28:07,960
Speaker 2: mean cool, Sorry that you had a bad sandwich like

421
00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:08,720
Speaker 2: three times, but.

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Speaker 1: I think they're so aesthetically pleasing. Yeah, like every picture

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Speaker 1: I've seen of them, I would have been like, even

424
00:28:17,520 --> 00:28:19,760
Speaker 1: if the sandwich was bad, I think I would have

425
00:28:19,800 --> 00:28:21,760
Speaker 1: been like, you would have had a good time. Yeah,

426
00:28:21,800 --> 00:28:27,639
Speaker 1: this is cool. Yeah, they are beautiful. Ah, there's just

427
00:28:27,640 --> 00:28:32,560
Speaker 1: something fun too about vending. Yeah. Yeah, it almost feels

428
00:28:32,600 --> 00:28:37,080
Speaker 1: kind of arcadey. Yeah right, totally. Oh heck, oh they're

429
00:28:37,119 --> 00:28:38,719
Speaker 1: totally right about that H and H thing.

430
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Speaker 2: Oh yeah no, that would not stand.

431
00:28:40,680 --> 00:28:40,760
Speaker 1: No.

432
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Speaker 2: And also the fact that people just called it the

433
00:28:42,840 --> 00:28:46,240
Speaker 2: automat is. I mean perhaps that should have been obvious

434
00:28:46,280 --> 00:28:54,560
Speaker 2: to everyone. Yeah, like yeah, yeah, guess yeah. Christine wrote

435
00:28:54,920 --> 00:28:57,600
Speaker 2: you wanted to know about Krispy Kreme. So here is

436
00:28:57,640 --> 00:29:02,160
Speaker 2: a brief tale about Krispy Kreme in Australia and the

437
00:29:02,240 --> 00:29:06,480
Speaker 2: sad fate of Dunkin Donuts in Australia and how neither

438
00:29:06,560 --> 00:29:11,160
Speaker 2: have won the donut war down under. Dunkin Donuts arrived

439
00:29:11,160 --> 00:29:13,760
Speaker 2: in Australia first in the late nineteen eighties. I honestly

440
00:29:13,760 --> 00:29:15,960
Speaker 2: don't recall if I ever tried them, and I can't

441
00:29:15,960 --> 00:29:18,360
Speaker 2: now because they closed their last shop in the early

442
00:29:18,400 --> 00:29:22,120
Speaker 2: two thousands. Apparently there was quite a fanfare at first.

443
00:29:22,200 --> 00:29:24,160
Speaker 2: People tried them for a while for the novelty, than

444
00:29:24,200 --> 00:29:29,000
Speaker 2: they just died. Krispy Kreme got started up here around

445
00:29:29,040 --> 00:29:31,560
Speaker 2: twenty ten and are still going. While they have some

446
00:29:31,720 --> 00:29:34,680
Speaker 2: shops in Kiosks, most of their sales are via supermarkets,

447
00:29:34,680 --> 00:29:37,760
Speaker 2: which I think is why there's still a presence here. Again,

448
00:29:37,840 --> 00:29:39,840
Speaker 2: when they launched there was a bit of a novelty.

449
00:29:40,120 --> 00:29:42,800
Speaker 2: Then most people tended to pass them over in favor

450
00:29:42,840 --> 00:29:46,920
Speaker 2: of local alternatives. See Contrary to what you might read

451
00:29:46,960 --> 00:29:51,120
Speaker 2: on the Internet, Australians actually love donuts. Our love affair

452
00:29:51,200 --> 00:29:54,880
Speaker 2: with donuts is long. We just like different donuts. The

453
00:29:54,920 --> 00:29:58,440
Speaker 2: base donut is far less sweet. Iced donuts with sprinkles

454
00:29:58,440 --> 00:30:02,280
Speaker 2: are popular, icing through to a frosting th aglaze, as

455
00:30:02,360 --> 00:30:05,680
Speaker 2: are cream and jam filled donuts. But the undisputed King

456
00:30:05,720 --> 00:30:08,920
Speaker 2: of Donuts. Here is the plain cinnamon sugar topped donut.

457
00:30:09,480 --> 00:30:12,200
Speaker 2: Australian recipes for these go back to the mid nineteenth century.

458
00:30:12,360 --> 00:30:15,080
Speaker 2: They're a popular option with coffee up, particularly to eat

459
00:30:15,120 --> 00:30:17,920
Speaker 2: on the go. Most bakeries and cafes have cinnamon donuts

460
00:30:18,000 --> 00:30:21,760
Speaker 2: and a few different iced ones for sale. And then

461
00:30:22,400 --> 00:30:26,640
Speaker 2: there's Donut King. Donut King started in Sydney in nineteen

462
00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:28,600
Speaker 2: eighty one and by the end of the decade had

463
00:30:28,640 --> 00:30:32,000
Speaker 2: started to expand nationally. Around the same time, Dunkin Donuts

464
00:30:32,000 --> 00:30:35,640
Speaker 2: tried to establish themselves. Ask just about any Australian and

465
00:30:35,760 --> 00:30:39,800
Speaker 2: aside from some gourmet, very local options, Donut King's cinnamon

466
00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:42,720
Speaker 2: donut is considered the best. They still make the basic

467
00:30:42,760 --> 00:30:45,120
Speaker 2: mix in each store and the donut cooker is going

468
00:30:45,160 --> 00:30:48,840
Speaker 2: all day. You literally couldn't get them fresher. They also

469
00:30:48,920 --> 00:30:53,280
Speaker 2: make dinosaur donuts and Donut King also has good coffee.

470
00:30:53,320 --> 00:30:56,080
Speaker 2: I've yet to meet an American cafe coffee that can

471
00:30:56,160 --> 00:31:01,400
Speaker 2: compete with Australian cafe coffee. Taking a second on that

472
00:31:01,440 --> 00:31:05,520
Speaker 2: one harsh words going back to Christine, but faced with

473
00:31:05,560 --> 00:31:08,959
Speaker 2: the choice between a really really sweet, rather stiff and

474
00:31:09,080 --> 00:31:13,640
Speaker 2: possibly slightly stale crispy cream donut or a super fresh,

475
00:31:13,840 --> 00:31:16,719
Speaker 2: soft and pillowy donut with a crispy cinnamon sugar topping.

476
00:31:17,320 --> 00:31:20,880
Speaker 2: Which one are you gonna pick? Ps. You used to

477
00:31:20,920 --> 00:31:23,720
Speaker 2: be able to get triceratops and t rex donuts from

478
00:31:23,720 --> 00:31:27,000
Speaker 2: Donut King. Sadly they look more like lizards now, though

479
00:31:27,400 --> 00:31:29,600
Speaker 2: I suppose you could call them a diplodocus at a

480
00:31:29,640 --> 00:31:32,400
Speaker 2: stretch and no paciocephalosaurus.

481
00:31:37,480 --> 00:31:40,800
Speaker 1: Well, congrats on the pronunciation, Lauren.

482
00:31:41,600 --> 00:31:44,520
Speaker 2: I'm never sure if it's diplodocus or diplodocus.

483
00:31:45,880 --> 00:31:51,000
Speaker 1: So, but here, the fact that you have opinions and

484
00:31:51,080 --> 00:31:56,680
Speaker 1: two different options is amazing. I love this. I also

485
00:31:56,760 --> 00:31:59,800
Speaker 1: love donut opinions. I think this is fantastic. Oh yeah,

486
00:32:00,320 --> 00:32:06,800
Speaker 1: I love that old Dunkin Donuts tried their best Krispy Kreme.

487
00:32:07,440 --> 00:32:10,760
Speaker 2: Barely hanging on by a nail. Yeah, But Donut King,

488
00:32:11,280 --> 00:32:12,560
Speaker 2: yeah the King.

489
00:32:13,240 --> 00:32:16,320
Speaker 1: I think I had Donut King when I was in Australia. Yeah,

490
00:32:16,920 --> 00:32:19,160
Speaker 1: I think so, that was when I was in my

491
00:32:19,240 --> 00:32:23,320
Speaker 1: big donut fhase, so I feel like I must have yeah,

492
00:32:23,320 --> 00:32:27,520
Speaker 1: and I love cinnamon. Sure, So I mean that does

493
00:32:27,560 --> 00:32:30,239
Speaker 1: sound lovely. That sounds like a like a nice like

494
00:32:30,760 --> 00:32:34,720
Speaker 1: just just you know not again not too sweet. Yeah, yeah,

495
00:32:34,880 --> 00:32:40,280
Speaker 1: Dinosaur Donuts also Dinosaur donuts what I mean, I mean

496
00:32:41,920 --> 00:32:45,320
Speaker 1: the coffee. That's funny. I don't know enough about Krispy

497
00:32:45,400 --> 00:32:49,840
Speaker 1: Kreme or Dunkin Donuts coffee to really make a statement

498
00:32:50,880 --> 00:32:51,520
Speaker 1: on that one.

499
00:32:53,640 --> 00:32:56,680
Speaker 2: I Americans do just have. We we have very strong

500
00:32:56,720 --> 00:32:57,800
Speaker 2: opinions about our coffee.

501
00:32:58,400 --> 00:33:00,640
Speaker 1: Yes, and I don't.

502
00:33:01,680 --> 00:33:03,440
Speaker 2: I feel like most of the time at a like

503
00:33:03,440 --> 00:33:06,320
Speaker 2: a kind of fast food cafe like that, you're gonna

504
00:33:06,320 --> 00:33:11,880
Speaker 2: get kind of burnt coffee. But but I feel like

505
00:33:11,920 --> 00:33:13,600
Speaker 2: I have a good emotion about it.

506
00:33:16,520 --> 00:33:20,160
Speaker 1: Yeah. Sometimes if you know what you're getting, sometimes you're like,

507
00:33:21,440 --> 00:33:22,480
Speaker 1: it's burnt coffee.

508
00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:25,720
Speaker 2: Yeah, it tastes like the inside of a diesel engine,

509
00:33:25,720 --> 00:33:26,680
Speaker 2: and that's what you're going for.

510
00:33:27,320 --> 00:33:31,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly, That's what I need right now. That's okay.

511
00:33:32,680 --> 00:33:37,360
Speaker 1: But I do love this. Yeah. Yeah, please everyone keep

512
00:33:37,440 --> 00:33:42,640
Speaker 1: sending in international donuts. Yeah, oh oh absolutely. Yeah. And

513
00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:45,320
Speaker 1: it is. It is very just I just realized.

514
00:33:45,400 --> 00:33:49,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, like like I rolled right through the dinosaur name pronunciations,

515
00:33:49,160 --> 00:33:57,960
Speaker 2: but the coffee comment stopped me cold right, Yeah, very

516
00:33:58,320 --> 00:33:59,120
Speaker 2: very on brand of me.

517
00:34:00,080 --> 00:34:03,080
Speaker 1: Yes, it is. It is. People take their coffee serious.

518
00:34:03,680 --> 00:34:03,960
Speaker 1: I do.

519
00:34:04,280 --> 00:34:05,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, Lauren is.

520
00:34:05,720 --> 00:34:11,359
Speaker 1: One of them. Yes, well, thanks to both of these

521
00:34:11,360 --> 00:34:13,560
Speaker 1: listeners to writing in. If you would like to write in,

522
00:34:13,840 --> 00:34:17,680
Speaker 1: you can. You can email us at hello atsavorpod dot com.

523
00:34:17,840 --> 00:34:20,279
Speaker 2: We're also on social media. You can find us on

524
00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:24,560
Speaker 2: Instagram and Blue Sky. Yes, those are the two where

525
00:34:24,600 --> 00:34:27,200
Speaker 2: we've landed at savor Pod and we do hope to

526
00:34:27,200 --> 00:34:30,120
Speaker 2: hear from you. Savor is production of iHeartRadio. For more

527
00:34:30,160 --> 00:34:32,920
Speaker 2: podcasts from my Heart Radio, you can visit the iHeartRadio app,

528
00:34:33,080 --> 00:34:35,880
Speaker 2: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

529
00:34:36,000 --> 00:34:38,759
Speaker 2: But thanks as always to our superproducers Dylan Fagan and

530
00:34:38,760 --> 00:34:41,160
Speaker 2: Andrew Howard. Thanks to you for listening, and we hope

531
00:34:41,160 --> 00:34:58,640
Speaker 2: that lots more good things are coming your way