WEBVTT - Casey Continued: Birth 0:00:00.680 --> 0:00:03.720 Welcome to Movie Crush, a production of I Heart Radio. 0:00:29.040 --> 0:00:32.880 Hey everybody, and Welcome to Movie Crush. Friday Interview Edition, 0:00:33.200 --> 0:00:41.200 Friday Filmmaker Series Edition, Friday Filmmaker Series, Casey Edition, Casey's Back. 0:00:41.800 --> 0:00:44.840 Glad to be back, Welcome. I just shook the table, 0:00:45.600 --> 0:00:49.120 that's how excited I am. Um. Yeah, thanks, thanks for 0:00:49.200 --> 0:00:51.360 having me again. I always look forward to these, yeah, man, 0:00:51.479 --> 0:00:54.080 So to catch everyone up, we did. We started a 0:00:54.120 --> 0:00:58.040 Casey on Kubrick series, which um, by the way, and 0:00:58.040 --> 0:01:00.640 that that has now born many filmmakers series. I I 0:01:00.760 --> 0:01:03.640 noticed I just listened to the first uh Paul Thomas 0:01:03.720 --> 0:01:06.600 Anderson episode. I really really enjoyed it. I'm looking forward 0:01:06.640 --> 0:01:08.440 to the rest of those. Yeah, Adam's great, but it 0:01:08.480 --> 0:01:11.200 was great too. Um yeah, especially that first film that 0:01:11.880 --> 0:01:15.880 still underseen. So I forgured you'd be all over that. So. Um, 0:01:15.880 --> 0:01:18.720 we did several Kubrick movies. We did The Shining, we 0:01:18.800 --> 0:01:21.920 did Pads of Glory, we did Barry Lyndon, we did 0:01:21.920 --> 0:01:25.160 Eyes Wide Shut and Full Metal Jacket and Full Metal five. 0:01:25.319 --> 0:01:28.240 Yeah that's not bad. And then you made the decision 0:01:28.280 --> 0:01:30.520 to do a little switcheroo, just a little detour and 0:01:30.600 --> 0:01:35.280 do a movie of something sort of inspired by Kubrick. Yeah, 0:01:35.319 --> 0:01:36.840 and it was a film that I had not seen, 0:01:37.040 --> 0:01:40.800 Jonathan Glazer's Birth. Yes, I remember this movie coming out. 0:01:41.240 --> 0:01:43.360 I was a huge fan of Sexy Beasts, so I 0:01:43.360 --> 0:01:45.679 don't know why I didn't see this. I didn't see 0:01:45.720 --> 0:01:48.680 Under the Skin yet either. Oh wow, yeah, oh it's yeah, 0:01:48.800 --> 0:01:51.080 it's um, he's one of your guys, probably probably use 0:01:51.160 --> 0:01:53.280 best film. So I would really say, I don't know 0:01:53.320 --> 0:01:57.280 between this and Birth, or between Birth and Under the Skin, 0:01:57.360 --> 0:02:00.840 It's it's hard to say. I probably still favorite Birth 0:02:00.880 --> 0:02:04.800 a little bit. But number three Yeah, yeah, that movie. 0:02:04.840 --> 0:02:06.680 I mean it's a great movie. But but I think 0:02:06.680 --> 0:02:09.040 he really takes off with Birth and and uh, under 0:02:09.080 --> 0:02:11.720 the Skin. So I don't know much about this guy. 0:02:11.720 --> 0:02:16.440 What's his deal. He comes from commercials and music videos primarily, 0:02:17.000 --> 0:02:18.800 and he still does a lot of that work today 0:02:18.840 --> 0:02:21.239 because you can see, like Sexy Beast comes out in 0:02:21.280 --> 0:02:23.440 two thousand, Birth two thousand four, and then he doesn't 0:02:23.440 --> 0:02:27.280 make another feature until Under the Skin. So it's kind 0:02:27.280 --> 0:02:29.760 of Kubrick like in that way that he has these 0:02:29.800 --> 0:02:32.919 long stretches of time. And on Wikipedia now there's something 0:02:32.919 --> 0:02:38.560 called like untitled Jonathan Glazer Projects he's he's he's averaging 0:02:38.560 --> 0:02:43.000 about one a decade, um, you know. Um. And I 0:02:43.000 --> 0:02:45.280 think he takes a similar approach to Kubrick in that, 0:02:45.720 --> 0:02:48.600 because he has this other living that he's making off 0:02:48.639 --> 0:02:51.799 of advertising and music videos and so on, he can 0:02:51.800 --> 0:02:54.120 just kind of pick his spots and take as many 0:02:54.200 --> 0:02:56.760 years as he wants to kind of find the right 0:02:56.800 --> 0:02:59.520 story and also do a lot of the kind of 0:02:59.560 --> 0:03:03.079 technical research and refinement that Kuber did as well. Yeah. 0:03:03.120 --> 0:03:05.000 I did a little bit of research into Birth and 0:03:05.000 --> 0:03:08.720 saw that you know, there were dozens of versions of 0:03:08.720 --> 0:03:12.160 this script, including page one rewrites yeah, yeah, which is 0:03:12.200 --> 0:03:16.400 just like that's tough. Yeah, So you can tell he 0:03:16.400 --> 0:03:19.360 obviously cares a lot about getting it right on the 0:03:19.400 --> 0:03:22.880 page before you ever get committed to shooting something. Yeah. 0:03:22.960 --> 0:03:26.880 And and Birth was and is a very very polarizing film. 0:03:26.960 --> 0:03:30.720 It is. Yeah, I got very famously booed at Venice. Yes. 0:03:31.040 --> 0:03:35.120 Um and uh, if you go on you know these 0:03:35.160 --> 0:03:41.320 aggregate sites, aggregators like Rotten Tomatoes something fifty something, I 0:03:41.320 --> 0:03:43.640 think it. Rotten Tomatoes is like thirty eight or forty. 0:03:44.200 --> 0:03:47.720 Critic is like right down the middle yea. And it's 0:03:47.800 --> 0:03:49.760 and after seeing it, it's sort of no wonder, like 0:03:51.080 --> 0:03:55.320 I can I really liked it, um, but I can 0:03:55.360 --> 0:03:58.840 see how it is not everyone's cup of tea. Oh yeah, yeah, 0:03:58.920 --> 0:04:02.480 it's a it's kind of an sird premise played super straight, 0:04:02.640 --> 0:04:05.480 super straight. And so either I think either you accept 0:04:05.480 --> 0:04:07.000 that and you go with it and you find that 0:04:07.120 --> 0:04:11.280 compelling to see. How would these kind of you know, 0:04:11.920 --> 0:04:17.080 educated adults, reasonable people react to this kind of absurd situation, 0:04:17.880 --> 0:04:20.320 um as opposed to I think some people just kind 0:04:20.320 --> 0:04:22.680 of are like, what this is nonsense and kind of 0:04:22.760 --> 0:04:25.679 you know, tune out. Yeah. So just um, some people 0:04:25.720 --> 0:04:27.839 listen to these and haven't seen the movie. Uh so 0:04:28.040 --> 0:04:30.000 to just get everyone, just to sort of the briefest 0:04:30.080 --> 0:04:34.240 of overviews. The premise of the film is that at 0:04:34.240 --> 0:04:36.919 the very beginning of the movie, you just see and 0:04:37.040 --> 0:04:40.599 we'll talk about that shot, but a jogger dies and 0:04:40.680 --> 0:04:42.640 you hear a little bit of voiceover from this jogger, 0:04:42.839 --> 0:04:45.520 and it is it turns out that that is the 0:04:45.600 --> 0:04:48.520 husband of Nicole Kidman. We pick up ten years later 0:04:49.000 --> 0:04:52.479 and a boy, a ten year old boy. Well, you 0:04:52.480 --> 0:04:54.000 see a baby get born, Yeah, you do see a 0:04:54.040 --> 0:04:56.680 baby get born, very key, and that baby grows up. 0:04:57.000 --> 0:05:00.320 Ostensibly that baby grows up to be uh his boy 0:05:00.400 --> 0:05:04.039 named Sean. Her former husband's name was Sean, and Sean 0:05:04.279 --> 0:05:07.400 enters Nicole Kidman's life. She's about to be married, She's 0:05:07.440 --> 0:05:11.360 engaged to Danny Houston's character Love Me Some, Danny always 0:05:11.520 --> 0:05:15.440 terrific and and claims to be her dead husband, and 0:05:15.480 --> 0:05:18.960 then what happens from there is the movie. Yeah, and um, 0:05:19.000 --> 0:05:20.680 I think you can watch the whole film and kind 0:05:20.680 --> 0:05:24.200 of come away with, you know, different different ideas of 0:05:24.240 --> 0:05:26.479 what really happened, which I think is interesting too. And 0:05:26.520 --> 0:05:29.760 that's probably another reason why you know, people are somewhat 0:05:29.760 --> 0:05:32.560 divided on it. Not that it's necessarily an open ending. 0:05:32.600 --> 0:05:34.760 I feel like the film actually kind of goes maybe 0:05:34.760 --> 0:05:36.360 a little too far out of its way to kind 0:05:36.360 --> 0:05:39.159 of show things stuff. Yeah. But but at the same time, 0:05:39.680 --> 0:05:44.240 that explanation for me is unsatisfying in the whole because 0:05:44.279 --> 0:05:46.960 I feel like there were still things that he knew, 0:05:47.120 --> 0:05:50.159 a sense that he had of who this family was 0:05:50.240 --> 0:05:52.440 and so on, some of the kind of tertiary characters 0:05:52.480 --> 0:05:55.320 that I would be really surprised that he could have 0:05:55.320 --> 0:05:58.000 gleaned all that just from some levels between two lovers. 0:05:58.040 --> 0:06:02.359 So I to me, it stilication Yeah, the implication is 0:06:02.400 --> 0:06:06.760 that he he saw the letters that and hitch buried 0:06:07.160 --> 0:06:09.960 and read them and then kind of you know, internalized 0:06:10.000 --> 0:06:12.040 all that. That's where he got all his intel from. 0:06:12.240 --> 0:06:15.960 Is sort of the implication. Um, But I don't think 0:06:16.000 --> 0:06:18.680 that explains everything. I think. Um. I think it's kind 0:06:18.680 --> 0:06:21.680 of enough of an explanation that it allows everybody in 0:06:21.720 --> 0:06:24.520 the film to kind of process it and move on. 0:06:25.080 --> 0:06:28.880 But I think there's still like some underlying, like supernatural 0:06:28.960 --> 0:06:32.320 kind of mystery there that you know, is sort of 0:06:32.360 --> 0:06:37.800 beyond logic or reason. Yeah, and there's also since you 0:06:37.839 --> 0:06:41.520 bring up supernatural. Part of the problem I think people 0:06:41.520 --> 0:06:46.599 had with this movie is that it's hard to pin down, um. Genre. Yeah, sure, 0:06:46.920 --> 0:06:50.080 because I've seen it described as a thriller, which is yeah, 0:06:50.120 --> 0:06:52.520 I I think you called it a thriller and I 0:06:52.560 --> 0:06:55.400 was just kind of marketed as such. Yeah, of course. Um, 0:06:55.480 --> 0:06:58.039 I've seen it labeled as a bit of a horror thing. Yeah, 0:06:58.080 --> 0:07:00.000 it's not really that. I don't really know. I've seen 0:07:00.040 --> 0:07:04.720 that labeled as a fantasy, but it's so anchored in reality, 0:07:04.800 --> 0:07:08.560 you know. Yeah, And it's hard And I think I 0:07:08.560 --> 0:07:10.480 think that I love the glaziers of the world because 0:07:10.520 --> 0:07:13.000 they don't. Um, he's clearly not in like Kubrick to 0:07:13.200 --> 0:07:15.040 not trying to put something in a tidy little box 0:07:15.720 --> 0:07:18.680 and something that um, he's okay with confounding an audience. Yeah, 0:07:18.840 --> 0:07:21.480 and I think that's kind of what happened here. Yeah. Um. 0:07:21.560 --> 0:07:23.440 I think a lot of credit to has to go 0:07:23.520 --> 0:07:27.080 to one of the screenwriters, Jean Claud Carrier, who worked 0:07:27.080 --> 0:07:30.080 a lot with Louis been Well during his like French period. 0:07:30.760 --> 0:07:33.600 Um boon Well is uh, you know, known as a 0:07:33.600 --> 0:07:39.200 surrealist somebody who was commenting on the real world and 0:07:39.280 --> 0:07:42.800 politics and in a very kind of provocative filmmaker in 0:07:42.840 --> 0:07:45.720 his own way, um, but doing it through this kind 0:07:45.720 --> 0:07:50.040 of surrealist, absurdist kind of situation where you just have 0:07:50.600 --> 0:07:52.920 a lot of times, I mean, his films tend to 0:07:53.000 --> 0:07:57.080 center around like the world of wealthy people and they're 0:07:57.160 --> 0:08:00.760 kind of weird parlor games and you know, personal dramas 0:08:00.760 --> 0:08:04.600 and yeah, yeah and uh and so it's always commenting 0:08:04.680 --> 0:08:07.880 on on class quite a bit in his films, and 0:08:08.000 --> 0:08:10.320 um but doing it through this kind of absurd lens. 0:08:10.360 --> 0:08:13.520 And I think this film does something very similar, except 0:08:13.560 --> 0:08:16.600 that I think it has more of an emotional kind 0:08:16.600 --> 0:08:20.560 of resonance. Um, there's more kind of care given to 0:08:21.840 --> 0:08:25.120 the actual kind of feelings up on the screen, and 0:08:25.200 --> 0:08:28.240 the audience kind of I think identifies way more with 0:08:28.280 --> 0:08:32.280 the characters in Birth than the kind of nameless, faceless 0:08:32.360 --> 0:08:35.160 bourgeoisie that you see in like the been Well films. Yeah, 0:08:35.200 --> 0:08:38.000 for sure. Um, I will say that I love the movie. Yeah, 0:08:38.040 --> 0:08:40.520 Iven said that, Yet I was wondering. I know, I 0:08:40.600 --> 0:08:42.240 was kind of like, it's like, man, am I gonna 0:08:42.320 --> 0:08:44.280 go in there having to play defense or what's going on? 0:08:45.200 --> 0:08:47.920 Because it is you know, I just I just went 0:08:47.960 --> 0:08:52.160 into it eyes wide open and um. And just like 0:08:52.200 --> 0:08:53.640 you said, you can sort of need to buy the 0:08:53.679 --> 0:08:57.800 premise and by that it's played straight and not sit 0:08:57.840 --> 0:08:59.920 there and go But what about and I didn't do that, 0:09:00.080 --> 0:09:03.760 just watched it and love it. Yeah. Um yeah. Because 0:09:04.120 --> 0:09:07.480 you know, even though there are numerous similarities to Kubrick's films, 0:09:07.480 --> 0:09:10.240 and I'm sure we'll get into all that. Um, for 0:09:10.280 --> 0:09:13.040 all that, it still doesn't feel necessarily like a Kubrick 0:09:13.080 --> 0:09:17.080 film in all respects. I think again, Um, some of 0:09:17.120 --> 0:09:22.160 the just the the emotional character of it, the performances. Um, 0:09:22.200 --> 0:09:24.439 I think you can get quite emotionally involved in this one, 0:09:24.480 --> 0:09:26.800 whereas I think Kubrick tends to maintain a little bit 0:09:26.840 --> 0:09:29.800 more of an I see kind of distance. That's true, 0:09:30.240 --> 0:09:34.880 although I will say that there was some ice in 0:09:34.880 --> 0:09:40.200 this movie. Um, I think I'm thinking more well, Lauren McCall. 0:09:40.280 --> 0:09:43.160 And then not even the performances, just sort of these 0:09:43.280 --> 0:09:46.760 the the apartment and the apartment building. It all felt 0:09:46.840 --> 0:09:50.440 very Stanley Kubrick with this just very cold marble, um, 0:09:50.480 --> 0:09:57.640 not overly adorned. Um, there's a distance there. It wasn't 0:09:57.679 --> 0:10:01.600 a warm Yeah, no, that's very true. Um, But I 0:10:01.600 --> 0:10:04.200 still think like he he tends to use a few 0:10:04.200 --> 0:10:07.440 more close ups. He tends to kind of I don't know, 0:10:07.480 --> 0:10:11.079 I find I find Um, I'm I'm totally with Nicole 0:10:11.160 --> 0:10:13.520 Kidman as I watched this, and I really do feel 0:10:13.520 --> 0:10:17.199 her kind of internal struggle and her kind of knowing. 0:10:17.200 --> 0:10:19.040 On the one hand, rationally there's no way that this 0:10:19.120 --> 0:10:21.480 can be true, but emotionally feeling that it is true 0:10:21.520 --> 0:10:26.640 anyway and wanting it to be true absolutely absolutely, And 0:10:26.679 --> 0:10:29.520 I think ultimately like it is a film about love, 0:10:29.640 --> 0:10:32.200 it's a film about kind of the unknowability of the 0:10:32.240 --> 0:10:36.320 other person in that relationship that is so much based 0:10:36.400 --> 0:10:39.720 on projection on what we think that person is or 0:10:40.160 --> 0:10:44.640 means to somebody. Um. And it's almost like the boy 0:10:44.640 --> 0:10:48.280 sean is like he is that projection of Nicole Kidman's 0:10:48.440 --> 0:10:52.160 feelings about her late husband, whereas the reality, which is 0:10:52.200 --> 0:10:54.880 more represented by the NHGE character, is a little more 0:10:54.880 --> 0:10:59.360 complicated and not so pure and cut and dry. Um, 0:10:59.400 --> 0:11:01.840 but sean On is sort of that the boy is 0:11:01.880 --> 0:11:06.360 sort of that pure, you know, good intentions, never strayed, 0:11:06.600 --> 0:11:12.040 never you know, meant anything wrong, um, kind of kind 0:11:12.080 --> 0:11:15.840 of character. And so it's like and and then when 0:11:15.840 --> 0:11:18.760 it comes later to when the boy has to explain 0:11:18.880 --> 0:11:21.680 how he's not her husband, all he can say is 0:11:21.720 --> 0:11:25.120 something that sounds absurd on its face, which is that, um, 0:11:26.320 --> 0:11:28.880 I'm not your husband because I love you something to 0:11:28.960 --> 0:11:31.800 that effect. Yeah, Because the whole conceit at the end 0:11:32.040 --> 0:11:37.080 is uh and Hay says, reveals that she was a lover, yeah, 0:11:37.240 --> 0:11:39.840 and that they've carried on this like long affair yeah, 0:11:39.920 --> 0:11:42.640 and was his real true love. So if you were Shawn, 0:11:43.040 --> 0:11:49.360 you would have come to seen me, not uh Anna yeah, Anna. Yeah. 0:11:49.520 --> 0:11:51.280 And so that's what he says at the end, He said, 0:11:51.320 --> 0:11:53.600 I can't be sewn because I love you yeah, and 0:11:53.679 --> 0:11:55.840 she says that makes no sense, and he says, I'm sorry, 0:11:55.880 --> 0:11:58.360 that's that's the best I can explain it, because he 0:11:58.400 --> 0:12:00.760 doesn't want to He doesn't want to shatter at that 0:12:00.880 --> 0:12:03.520 love that she has for her husband by revealing what 0:12:03.640 --> 0:12:06.680 happened and so and that's that's sort of what the 0:12:07.120 --> 0:12:08.960 character is planning on doing at the beginning of the 0:12:08.960 --> 0:12:11.720 film when she comes with all those letters in the 0:12:11.760 --> 0:12:16.040 box to the party, to the kind of engagement announcement. Um, 0:12:16.120 --> 0:12:19.240 she I think she wants to sort of free her 0:12:19.320 --> 0:12:22.079 from that that baggage that she's carrying around. That she's 0:12:22.080 --> 0:12:24.400 still kind of carrying a torch. She's still going to 0:12:24.480 --> 0:12:27.480 his grave. It seems like somewhat regularly and still kind 0:12:27.520 --> 0:12:30.480 of you know. The Danny Houston character talks a lot 0:12:30.559 --> 0:12:33.920 about how throughout their relationship he's had to kind of 0:12:33.960 --> 0:12:36.920 deal with this other presence of this this you know, 0:12:37.080 --> 0:12:40.240 this lost love that she still has real affection for 0:12:40.960 --> 0:12:42.880 and yet she she feels the need to move on, 0:12:42.960 --> 0:12:45.160 but at the same time, there's always going to be 0:12:45.160 --> 0:12:47.040 that part of her that kind of belongs to this 0:12:47.040 --> 0:12:49.880 other guy, and um yeah, And it's like kind of 0:12:49.880 --> 0:12:54.240 the big question though about all of us. Yes, and 0:12:54.240 --> 0:12:58.360 and there's there's situations people in my family. And there 0:12:58.400 --> 0:13:00.960 was another one I just read about where oh and 0:13:01.000 --> 0:13:02.719 know it was the big thing that went around the 0:13:02.720 --> 0:13:05.360 internet about the World War two veteran who had the 0:13:05.360 --> 0:13:10.480 French girlfriend starting seen in seventy or they're like seventy 0:13:10.960 --> 0:13:14.760 five years or something and they were reunited. But it's 0:13:14.840 --> 0:13:17.440 that whole thing of and this happened a lot in 0:13:17.440 --> 0:13:20.160 that generation where your husband would go off to war 0:13:20.280 --> 0:13:22.960 and maybe never come back, and you just pick up 0:13:22.960 --> 0:13:25.040 and move on and find someone else. But that is 0:13:25.040 --> 0:13:28.240 a big question of all of us if we believe 0:13:28.320 --> 0:13:33.000 in a destined partner or that there is only one, 0:13:33.720 --> 0:13:35.760 Like how do you move on from Like you find 0:13:35.800 --> 0:13:39.600 that person? That's the hardest thing in the world, Like 0:13:39.679 --> 0:13:41.480 what do you do from there? Yeah? How do you 0:13:41.480 --> 0:13:43.680 move on? Yeah? Exactly how do you move on? I 0:13:43.679 --> 0:13:46.040 mean it gets to the core of like do we 0:13:46.080 --> 0:13:48.520 think there is just one person that is you know, 0:13:48.679 --> 0:13:51.800 destiny to be right for you? Or are relationships more 0:13:51.840 --> 0:13:57.280 of like work and compromise and negotiation and you know 0:13:57.520 --> 0:14:01.000 it's something that you know you don't luck into meeting 0:14:01.040 --> 0:14:03.719 the person that's the exact perfect fit. You kind of 0:14:03.760 --> 0:14:07.959 build that with somebody and um, yeah, it's it's interesting. 0:14:08.000 --> 0:14:10.480 I think there's also, liking a lot of Kubrick films, 0:14:10.840 --> 0:14:13.800 in this film, there's also the dimension of class because 0:14:14.320 --> 0:14:17.880 you see that the Nicole Kidman character, Danny Houston character, 0:14:17.960 --> 0:14:21.000 they they live in this kind of very affluent, old 0:14:21.040 --> 0:14:25.520 money world of New York high society, and Sean the 0:14:25.600 --> 0:14:29.400 boy is clearly from a much more like working class background, 0:14:29.520 --> 0:14:33.080 like his parents are educated, his dad's like a piano 0:14:33.160 --> 0:14:37.240 tutor or something. But yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, but um 0:14:37.320 --> 0:14:38.760 but you know, but his videy has the line though 0:14:38.760 --> 0:14:40.720 at one point he said something like they have money. Yeah, 0:14:40.760 --> 0:14:43.320 that's literally like the only description he gives. He's like, 0:14:43.400 --> 0:14:45.560 he's like where his people are, but they've got money. 0:14:45.640 --> 0:14:46.920 You did that feel like I'm red herring to you 0:14:47.000 --> 0:14:48.640 the first time, Like they're going to try to cash 0:14:48.640 --> 0:14:50.840 in or something like that might be some value because 0:14:51.000 --> 0:14:52.680 one of the things I loved about the film is 0:14:53.640 --> 0:14:56.280 I had no idea where it was gonna go. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 0:14:56.560 --> 0:14:59.240 There's a lot of tension in the film because if 0:14:59.240 --> 0:15:01.480 you buy into as an audience, you have no there 0:15:01.560 --> 0:15:05.680 there's no telegraphing. Yes, it's very smartly, like plotted out 0:15:05.720 --> 0:15:07.920 movie to where you really don't see where it's like 0:15:08.040 --> 0:15:10.960 going next, gonna is there a magical element that's gonna 0:15:10.960 --> 0:15:13.200 happen where all of a sudden it's big and she 0:15:13.280 --> 0:15:15.880 says the magic words and he turns into Sean or 0:15:15.920 --> 0:15:18.600 are his parents fleecing him? Or like is he gonna 0:15:19.000 --> 0:15:21.480 kill her? Or yeah, I had no idea where it 0:15:21.520 --> 0:15:24.880 was going. Yeah, Um, so I don't know. To me, 0:15:24.960 --> 0:15:26.600 I didn't. I didn't feel it like a red herring, 0:15:26.600 --> 0:15:30.280 but it is sort of only brought up that one time. Um, 0:15:30.320 --> 0:15:33.000 although you see it a little bit also with an 0:15:33.160 --> 0:15:36.720 Haitian the Peter stormare character that couple. They also seem 0:15:36.800 --> 0:15:39.720 to be slightly less moneyed. And I think it is 0:15:39.800 --> 0:15:42.360 Sean's brother, yes, right, yeah, so she was having an 0:15:42.360 --> 0:15:46.400 affair with her brother's husband yeah yeah, or not her 0:15:46.560 --> 0:15:50.760 brother brother in law. Um, and so I think you 0:15:50.880 --> 0:15:53.800 I think you can kind of see a lot of 0:15:53.840 --> 0:15:57.480 things going on class wise where Um, if you assume 0:15:57.560 --> 0:16:00.480 that the late Sean was kind of similar to his brother, 0:16:01.320 --> 0:16:04.960 he was probably marrying up by being with Nicole Kidman 0:16:05.200 --> 0:16:08.720 because it was her money and she lives with her 0:16:08.760 --> 0:16:14.240 mother the house on Long Island apartment, and something similar 0:16:14.320 --> 0:16:17.160 is going on. I think even a step up that's 0:16:17.200 --> 0:16:20.480 happening from Nicole Kidman to Danny Houston. Because when you 0:16:20.560 --> 0:16:22.760 see Nicole kidmane at work, she's like one of many 0:16:23.200 --> 0:16:25.400 a kind of a conference room table and they kind 0:16:25.400 --> 0:16:27.120 of come in and let her know that her sister had, 0:16:27.240 --> 0:16:29.480 you know, given birth. Um. Then at the end of 0:16:29.520 --> 0:16:32.520 the film, yeah, in the boardroom, and it's kind of 0:16:32.560 --> 0:16:34.240 like he seems like he kind of owns that room, 0:16:34.320 --> 0:16:38.320 you know, he's at the he's alone at a yes, 0:16:38.480 --> 0:16:40.840 and she she goes as far as to kind of 0:16:40.840 --> 0:16:43.000 get down on her knee and like embrace his hand, 0:16:43.080 --> 0:16:46.600 and it's this real like Miakula kind of thing, and 0:16:46.720 --> 0:16:49.800 it does feel like she's also moving up the kind 0:16:49.840 --> 0:16:52.200 of ladder in that way, and it's almost like the 0:16:52.280 --> 0:16:57.680 marriage of her to him. There's a dimension of it's 0:16:57.680 --> 0:17:00.720 not purely based on love. It's also based on security. 0:17:00.800 --> 0:17:03.640 It's based on like this is you know, this is 0:17:03.640 --> 0:17:05.240 going to set me up to have like the rest 0:17:05.280 --> 0:17:08.400 of my life be kind of solid and taken care 0:17:08.440 --> 0:17:11.400 of and provide for, you know, to start a family 0:17:11.480 --> 0:17:14.560 or whatever. Um. So, I think there's there's also that 0:17:14.640 --> 0:17:17.479 tension in there. Yes, there isn't a lot of Kubrick too. 0:17:17.680 --> 0:17:21.480 I think there was the original Sean O. G. Shawn 0:17:21.600 --> 0:17:24.040 and we never see we only had that one brief voiceover. 0:17:24.560 --> 0:17:27.399 Was a scientist, Yeah, and he was lecturing at hospitals. 0:17:27.400 --> 0:17:29.960 And so I see why he made him a scientist 0:17:29.960 --> 0:17:32.399 because it sort of fits the fact that, like because 0:17:32.440 --> 0:17:35.240 even says at the very beginning talks about reincarnations, the 0:17:35.240 --> 0:17:37.440 fact that he does not believe that. But I think 0:17:37.480 --> 0:17:41.400 it might have had a little more of impact had 0:17:41.480 --> 0:17:44.360 he been more blue collar even. Yeah, and like her 0:17:44.400 --> 0:17:48.320 true love was a fucking like high school teacher. Yeah, yeah, 0:17:48.359 --> 0:17:51.679 that's true. That's true. But I mean he's he's get that. 0:17:51.720 --> 0:17:53.960 But yeah, I mean he's getting like guest lectures. It 0:17:54.000 --> 0:17:57.679 doesn't sound like he was like, you know, like big 0:17:58.320 --> 0:18:01.040 name in the field. Yeah, he wasn't a wealthy guy, probably, 0:18:01.560 --> 0:18:04.160 but very smart. But maybe that was the middle ground 0:18:04.200 --> 0:18:14.040 from like humble kind of beginnings probably. Um. Touching on 0:18:14.080 --> 0:18:16.440 that scene you just talked about though, when she goes 0:18:16.720 --> 0:18:18.600 to him at the end and gets on her knees. 0:18:18.800 --> 0:18:21.880 I thought that scene was so real because she basically 0:18:23.040 --> 0:18:25.760 not basically she flat out says like, you know, what 0:18:25.800 --> 0:18:28.280 was I supposed to do? Like, how could I have 0:18:28.920 --> 0:18:32.159 done anything else? I couldn't send that boy away? Yeah? Um, 0:18:32.640 --> 0:18:35.640 And then he sits there and again I still didn't 0:18:35.680 --> 0:18:37.840 know what was going to happen, and he considers it 0:18:38.480 --> 0:18:40.479 because she basically is like, can we just move on 0:18:40.560 --> 0:18:43.800 and have our life together? And he goes, okay, Yeah, 0:18:44.560 --> 0:18:46.720 he's just like, you know what am I going to do? 0:18:46.800 --> 0:18:49.320 Start over now? I guess because he shows a lot 0:18:49.359 --> 0:18:52.560 of range in this movie. Um, as an audience member, 0:18:52.600 --> 0:18:54.880 you feel very bad for him for the longest time, 0:18:55.520 --> 0:18:58.680 and then he fucking loses it. He does Barry Lyndon 0:18:58.920 --> 0:19:03.280 exactly Bullington style. Yeah, like I mean is yanking him 0:19:03.280 --> 0:19:06.720 through the house and spanking him and like assaults him. Yeah, 0:19:06.960 --> 0:19:10.680 and it turns into a monster. But you also like, yeah, 0:19:10.720 --> 0:19:13.399 but funck man, what are you supposed to do? He was? 0:19:13.480 --> 0:19:16.040 He held it in for so long and then the 0:19:16.080 --> 0:19:17.480 kid was going out of his way to be a 0:19:17.520 --> 0:19:19.400 little ship to him by keeping the back of his chairs. 0:19:19.400 --> 0:19:21.240 So he knew what he was saying. This ten year 0:19:21.240 --> 0:19:23.040 old boy was a threat to his marriage. And it's 0:19:23.080 --> 0:19:26.119 interesting that, Yeah, you do see that that evolution of 0:19:26.160 --> 0:19:29.919 his character where first he's just laughing about it. He's dismissive. 0:19:30.600 --> 0:19:34.920 He um, almost cute. He finds it kind of cute 0:19:34.920 --> 0:19:36.840 and kind of endearing. He's like, oh, this little kid, 0:19:36.920 --> 0:19:38.920 I don't know what is, you know angle is, but 0:19:39.440 --> 0:19:41.280 it's this is pretty funny. This is gonna be a 0:19:41.280 --> 0:19:45.159 good story. And then yeah, solutely but surely he starts 0:19:45.160 --> 0:19:48.280 to have those moments where he's like, this kid could 0:19:48.280 --> 0:19:51.920 really be a threat to this marriage, of this relationship. Yeah. 0:19:51.960 --> 0:19:54.360 Although I will say in that that very first elevator 0:19:54.400 --> 0:19:56.440 scene where he goes and gets the boy and they're 0:19:56.440 --> 0:20:00.320 in the elevator by themselves. Um. For of all, the 0:20:00.359 --> 0:20:04.480 movie does so much with the face acting and in 0:20:04.560 --> 0:20:06.399 his face in that scene. And we'll talk about the 0:20:06.560 --> 0:20:11.120 scene um and the shot of all shots later, but uh, 0:20:11.359 --> 0:20:13.800 even in the elevator, early on, he goes from like 0:20:14.240 --> 0:20:19.159 amusement two, I saw a glimmer of like this is 0:20:19.280 --> 0:20:21.560 going to be a problem for me, Like this kid 0:20:21.680 --> 0:20:23.760 is a threat to me because I think the kid 0:20:23.800 --> 0:20:27.720 has such a seriousness and he's so grounded and he's 0:20:27.760 --> 0:20:30.240 not he's not needy at all. He's not looking for 0:20:30.280 --> 0:20:34.000 anybody's approval. Um, even when he's kind of confronted with, 0:20:34.600 --> 0:20:36.720 you know, evidence that maybe he's not who he says 0:20:36.760 --> 0:20:39.880 he is. You know, his response is always something along 0:20:39.880 --> 0:20:42.240 the lines of like, I don't care and it doesn't 0:20:42.280 --> 0:20:44.200 matter and it's not going to change a thing about 0:20:44.400 --> 0:20:46.119 you know how I feel. Well. When they asked him 0:20:46.119 --> 0:20:48.440 to not see her anymore, he goes, I can't. Yeah, yeah, 0:20:48.600 --> 0:20:50.440 And they asked him like five times, and every time 0:20:50.480 --> 0:20:53.040 he goes, no, I can't. He he does not budge, 0:20:53.200 --> 0:20:56.439 And I think that obviously, Nicole Kivin's character finds that 0:20:57.040 --> 0:20:59.200 very moving, very and dear, and she's like, there really 0:20:59.240 --> 0:21:02.040 is something there, Like this kid is not bending at all, 0:21:02.080 --> 0:21:05.560 and he seems maybe he's mistaken, but he really does 0:21:05.600 --> 0:21:08.040 seem to believe this, And that's I think initially what 0:21:08.119 --> 0:21:11.360 really compels her about the kid. Yeah, I can see 0:21:11.359 --> 0:21:14.280 how an audience would hate this, I think, Yeah, but 0:21:14.400 --> 0:21:17.240 I just didn't just taking it. Yeah again, at face value, 0:21:17.240 --> 0:21:19.800 it's like this is such a such an absurd story about. 0:21:19.800 --> 0:21:22.159 I mean again, I think that's what makes it so 0:21:22.240 --> 0:21:24.719 moving in a lot of ways is that, you know, 0:21:25.000 --> 0:21:28.720 I think relationships love itself is very irrational, you know, 0:21:28.800 --> 0:21:31.240 I Mean, that's what It is kind of beautiful about 0:21:31.280 --> 0:21:33.240 it is that it doesn't add up and it doesn't 0:21:33.280 --> 0:21:35.920 necessarily make sense. And if you were to look at 0:21:36.240 --> 0:21:38.760 a situation from the outside with that kind of purely 0:21:38.840 --> 0:21:41.520 rational perspective, you could say, why is that person with 0:21:41.560 --> 0:21:44.000