1 00:00:02,600 --> 00:00:05,800 Speaker 1: You're listening to American Shadows, a production of I Heart 2 00:00:05,880 --> 00:00:21,560 Speaker 1: Radio and Grimm and Mild from Aaron Monkey. Dan looked 3 00:00:21,600 --> 00:00:25,080 Speaker 1: like any other forty something businessman. It was the day 4 00:00:25,079 --> 00:00:28,320 Speaker 1: before Thanksgiving, and Dan arrived at the Portland Airport dressed 5 00:00:28,320 --> 00:00:31,400 Speaker 1: in a respectable dark suit, white shirt, and black tie. 6 00:00:31,600 --> 00:00:34,920 Speaker 1: Carrying a briefcase. He paid for a ticket in cash 7 00:00:35,040 --> 00:00:38,280 Speaker 1: on Northwest Orient Airlines flight number three oh five, heading 8 00:00:38,320 --> 00:00:45,320 Speaker 1: to Seattle, Washington that November. Dan boarded the plane, found 9 00:00:45,400 --> 00:00:48,680 Speaker 1: seat eighteen C and ordered a bourbon and soda. While 10 00:00:48,720 --> 00:00:53,040 Speaker 1: waiting for the boeing to taxi onto the runway. Shortly 11 00:00:53,080 --> 00:00:56,320 Speaker 1: after three o'clock, flight attendant Florence Shaffner checked on him, 12 00:00:56,400 --> 00:00:59,760 Speaker 1: and he handed her a note. We should received such 13 00:00:59,760 --> 00:01:02,800 Speaker 1: an It's from business men away from home before the 14 00:01:02,840 --> 00:01:04,679 Speaker 1: same old line. They would be in town for a 15 00:01:04,760 --> 00:01:06,559 Speaker 1: day or week and would have a lot of time 16 00:01:06,600 --> 00:01:09,800 Speaker 1: on their hands. Undoubtedly this note would ask if she 17 00:01:09,880 --> 00:01:13,080 Speaker 1: might like to go to a movie or dinner. Unimpressed, 18 00:01:13,240 --> 00:01:17,680 Speaker 1: she pocketed the note unread, but dam caught her attention 19 00:01:17,880 --> 00:01:21,160 Speaker 1: and whispered, miss you had better look at that note. 20 00:01:21,840 --> 00:01:25,559 Speaker 1: I have a bomb. The note was written in neat 21 00:01:25,600 --> 00:01:30,400 Speaker 1: capital letters. The instructions were simple. Sitting down next to him, 22 00:01:30,480 --> 00:01:33,560 Speaker 1: she obliged, and he cracked open his briefcase long enough 23 00:01:33,560 --> 00:01:36,080 Speaker 1: for her to see a jumble of wires, two long 24 00:01:36,160 --> 00:01:40,640 Speaker 1: red cylinders, and a battery. Now that he had her attention, 25 00:01:40,760 --> 00:01:44,200 Speaker 1: he rattled off his demands two hundred thousand dollars in 26 00:01:44,240 --> 00:01:48,440 Speaker 1: American twenty dollar bills, four parachutes to primary and to reserve, 27 00:01:48,840 --> 00:01:51,440 Speaker 1: and a fuel truck waiting for them when they landed 28 00:01:51,480 --> 00:01:55,680 Speaker 1: in Seattle. He told her to relay that message quietly 29 00:01:55,760 --> 00:01:59,120 Speaker 1: to the pilots and then to return to him again. 30 00:01:59,200 --> 00:02:03,000 Speaker 1: She did as she was asked. Pilot WILLIAMS. Scott contacted 31 00:02:03,040 --> 00:02:06,440 Speaker 1: air traffic control in Seattle, who naturally called the authorities 32 00:02:07,520 --> 00:02:11,640 Speaker 1: at PM. The flight landed in Seattle. Dan had the 33 00:02:11,639 --> 00:02:15,120 Speaker 1: attendants closed all the blinds to prevent any assassination attempts, 34 00:02:15,840 --> 00:02:18,639 Speaker 1: and once the money was delivered and the plane was refueled, 35 00:02:18,919 --> 00:02:22,079 Speaker 1: he told Scott and the crew to head from Mexico City, 36 00:02:22,240 --> 00:02:25,160 Speaker 1: and they did. They made another stop in Reno for 37 00:02:25,200 --> 00:02:28,000 Speaker 1: more fuel, and when they took off again to f 38 00:02:28,160 --> 00:02:32,799 Speaker 1: one oh six fighters followed. At eight o'clock, the cockpit 39 00:02:32,919 --> 00:02:35,920 Speaker 1: flashed a warning light that the air stair had been activated. 40 00:02:36,639 --> 00:02:41,040 Speaker 1: Moments later, the tail section jerked upward briefly. Scott called 41 00:02:41,040 --> 00:02:43,400 Speaker 1: back to Dan to ask if everything was okay, but 42 00:02:43,560 --> 00:02:48,120 Speaker 1: received no response. Dan otherwise known as D. B. Cooper, 43 00:02:48,480 --> 00:02:52,639 Speaker 1: had jumped from the plane, taking the cash with him, 44 00:02:52,680 --> 00:02:56,520 Speaker 1: and so began the legend of the only unsolved case 45 00:02:56,560 --> 00:03:02,000 Speaker 1: of air piracy in America. Dramatic shure an oddity hardly 46 00:03:02,960 --> 00:03:06,600 Speaker 1: in the nineteen sixties, hijacking planes happened so frequently that 47 00:03:06,639 --> 00:03:12,600 Speaker 1: people joked about it. I'm Lauren Vogelbon, Welcome to American Shadows. 48 00:03:18,240 --> 00:03:22,240 Speaker 1: It was business as usual. Flight attendants Donna Goldner and 49 00:03:22,320 --> 00:03:24,919 Speaker 1: Lena Anderson pushed their carts through the aisle on a 50 00:03:25,000 --> 00:03:29,320 Speaker 1: National Airlines flight from San Francisco to Miami. Both women 51 00:03:29,360 --> 00:03:32,079 Speaker 1: held back yawns as they served breakfast to the passengers 52 00:03:32,120 --> 00:03:34,280 Speaker 1: at five thirty in the morning on New Year's Eve 53 00:03:34,400 --> 00:03:38,040 Speaker 1: of nineteen sixty nine. As Anderson made her way through, 54 00:03:38,080 --> 00:03:42,400 Speaker 1: first class, passenger Alan Sheffield wrapped an arm around her waist, 55 00:03:42,520 --> 00:03:44,720 Speaker 1: pushed the muzzle of a gun into her ribs, and 56 00:03:44,800 --> 00:03:47,720 Speaker 1: told her the plane would be taking a detour to Cuba. 57 00:03:48,920 --> 00:03:51,160 Speaker 1: He forced her into the cockpit, where she repeated his 58 00:03:51,200 --> 00:03:55,440 Speaker 1: message to the pilots. Goldner was still serving passengers. When 59 00:03:55,440 --> 00:03:58,000 Speaker 1: the pilot announced the flight was now headed to Cuba. 60 00:03:58,840 --> 00:04:03,200 Speaker 1: She could only think not again. She had been on 61 00:04:03,240 --> 00:04:06,960 Speaker 1: a hijacked plane before, just earlier that year. There had 62 00:04:07,000 --> 00:04:10,480 Speaker 1: been a hundred and fifty nine hijackings in American airspace 63 00:04:10,600 --> 00:04:13,640 Speaker 1: since May of nineteen sixty one, with the majority happening 64 00:04:13,720 --> 00:04:18,400 Speaker 1: since nineteen sixty eight. Security was lax back then, no 65 00:04:18,640 --> 00:04:21,720 Speaker 1: t s A, no metal detectors, and no one searched 66 00:04:21,760 --> 00:04:25,520 Speaker 1: through bags. One couple had hidden a sawed off shotgun 67 00:04:25,560 --> 00:04:28,360 Speaker 1: in their five month old babies blankets and diverted their 68 00:04:28,400 --> 00:04:31,920 Speaker 1: flight from San Francisco to l a X. Flight crews 69 00:04:31,920 --> 00:04:35,520 Speaker 1: were trained to acquiesce to all hijackers requests to ensure 70 00:04:35,520 --> 00:04:39,680 Speaker 1: the safety of the lives on board. Some hijackers would 71 00:04:39,720 --> 00:04:41,800 Speaker 1: permit the plane to land and release most of the 72 00:04:41,800 --> 00:04:44,640 Speaker 1: passengers and crew, before forcing the rest to travel with 73 00:04:44,680 --> 00:04:48,880 Speaker 1: them as hostages to their final destination. In the nineteen sixties, 74 00:04:49,200 --> 00:04:52,240 Speaker 1: most passengers and crew felt that the hijackings were more 75 00:04:52,279 --> 00:04:56,320 Speaker 1: of an inconvenience and annoyance than any real danger, Even 76 00:04:56,400 --> 00:05:00,479 Speaker 1: if the hijackers were armed. The most popular nation for 77 00:05:00,520 --> 00:05:05,400 Speaker 1: hijackers was Cuba, including the first on May one of 78 00:05:05,520 --> 00:05:09,200 Speaker 1: nineteen sixty one, and Tulio Ramirez, an electrician from Miami, 79 00:05:09,480 --> 00:05:11,880 Speaker 1: held the pilot at knife point and announced that he 80 00:05:11,920 --> 00:05:14,919 Speaker 1: had been hired to assassinate Fidel Castro, but wanted to 81 00:05:14,920 --> 00:05:19,800 Speaker 1: go to Havannah to warn him instead. Americans, disillusioned with 82 00:05:19,839 --> 00:05:23,080 Speaker 1: the American dream, had a certain romance with Cuba in 83 00:05:23,080 --> 00:05:26,880 Speaker 1: the nineteen sixties. They believed Cuba had created a true 84 00:05:26,880 --> 00:05:29,520 Speaker 1: democracy and all they had to do was get there. 85 00:05:30,839 --> 00:05:34,040 Speaker 1: One hijacker recalled thinking, in a few hours, it would 86 00:05:34,040 --> 00:05:35,920 Speaker 1: be dawn in a new world. I was about to 87 00:05:36,040 --> 00:05:39,160 Speaker 1: enter paradise, a place where everyone was equal, where violence 88 00:05:39,200 --> 00:05:42,560 Speaker 1: against blacks, injustice and racism was a thing of the past. 89 00:05:44,480 --> 00:05:48,000 Speaker 1: As you might imagine, Cuba didn't offer the freedom they thought. 90 00:05:48,640 --> 00:05:51,520 Speaker 1: Hijackers were often whisked off the planes and taken to 91 00:05:51,560 --> 00:05:54,560 Speaker 1: the Spanish Citadel, where they were interrogated to ensure they 92 00:05:54,560 --> 00:05:57,839 Speaker 1: weren't working for the CIA. Others were sent to what 93 00:05:57,920 --> 00:06:02,000 Speaker 1: became known as the Hijacker House, an abysmal dormitory where 94 00:06:02,040 --> 00:06:05,600 Speaker 1: people were kept into sixteen square feet of living space apiece, 95 00:06:06,880 --> 00:06:09,159 Speaker 1: and some were sent to the sugarcane fields to work. 96 00:06:09,839 --> 00:06:12,680 Speaker 1: Due to the media blackout in Cuba, few would be 97 00:06:12,760 --> 00:06:17,479 Speaker 1: hijackers knew what had become of the others, Thinking those 98 00:06:17,560 --> 00:06:20,440 Speaker 1: before them had made it to paradise, More and more 99 00:06:20,520 --> 00:06:24,360 Speaker 1: hijackers demanded to go to Cuba, and so much so 100 00:06:24,400 --> 00:06:28,320 Speaker 1: that in nineteen sixty eight hijackings had reached epidemic levels. 101 00:06:29,320 --> 00:06:32,960 Speaker 1: The hostage passengers, for their part, often wandered around Havana 102 00:06:33,040 --> 00:06:35,320 Speaker 1: for a night, saw the sites, then returned to the 103 00:06:35,360 --> 00:06:39,799 Speaker 1: United States. At times, Castro welcomed the planes to humiliate 104 00:06:39,839 --> 00:06:42,960 Speaker 1: the United States and collected seven thousand dollars per plane 105 00:06:43,000 --> 00:06:47,760 Speaker 1: for their safe return. Hijackings between nineteen sixty eight and 106 00:06:47,839 --> 00:06:51,760 Speaker 1: nineteen seventy two averaged one per week. Two in a 107 00:06:51,839 --> 00:06:55,520 Speaker 1: day wasn't unheard of. Passengers would kid the flight crew, 108 00:06:55,800 --> 00:06:59,159 Speaker 1: go on and take me to Cuba. By July of 109 00:06:59,240 --> 00:07:02,719 Speaker 1: nineteen sixty the situation warranted a hearing before the Senate. 110 00:07:03,440 --> 00:07:06,279 Speaker 1: The f A A sent representative Irving rip who told 111 00:07:06,279 --> 00:07:08,719 Speaker 1: senators that unless they put in motion a way to 112 00:07:08,800 --> 00:07:13,200 Speaker 1: search every bag and passenger, the hijackings would continue. The 113 00:07:13,240 --> 00:07:15,880 Speaker 1: airlines weren't willing to put such restrictions in place for 114 00:07:15,920 --> 00:07:20,960 Speaker 1: fear people would choose alternate forms of transportation. Two weeks later, 115 00:07:21,120 --> 00:07:23,400 Speaker 1: a man by the name of Oran Richards hijacked a 116 00:07:23,440 --> 00:07:26,200 Speaker 1: Delta Airlines flight. He pulled a gun on the first 117 00:07:26,200 --> 00:07:29,880 Speaker 1: person he saw, Senator James Eastland of Mississippi, who had 118 00:07:29,960 --> 00:07:33,320 Speaker 1: happened to be at that Senate hearing. The crew managed 119 00:07:33,320 --> 00:07:36,040 Speaker 1: to call him Richards down and he's surrendered In Miami, 120 00:07:37,480 --> 00:07:39,800 Speaker 1: a thirty or four year old man hijacked a plane 121 00:07:39,800 --> 00:07:42,680 Speaker 1: back to Cuba because he missed his mother's for Holis 122 00:07:43,000 --> 00:07:45,360 Speaker 1: an air to a New Mexico real estate fortune. Dressed 123 00:07:45,360 --> 00:07:48,160 Speaker 1: as a cowboy and demanded to go to Cuba. A 124 00:07:48,200 --> 00:07:50,440 Speaker 1: college student forced a pilot to take him to Cuba 125 00:07:50,520 --> 00:07:54,560 Speaker 1: so he could study communism, and on one flight from 126 00:07:54,640 --> 00:07:58,280 Speaker 1: Newark to Miami, Allen Funt, the nineteen sixties host of 127 00:07:58,320 --> 00:08:02,000 Speaker 1: Candid Camera, boarded with his wife and daughter. A man 128 00:08:02,080 --> 00:08:04,040 Speaker 1: grabbed one of the flight attendants and put a knife 129 00:08:04,040 --> 00:08:07,440 Speaker 1: to her neck, demanding the pilots fly to Cuba. After 130 00:08:07,480 --> 00:08:10,800 Speaker 1: a few tense moments, another passenger shouted, wait a second, 131 00:08:10,960 --> 00:08:13,840 Speaker 1: we are not being hijacked. It's a Candid Camera stunt. 132 00:08:14,760 --> 00:08:18,280 Speaker 1: The passengers burst into laughter. Some asked Fund to autograph 133 00:08:18,360 --> 00:08:22,560 Speaker 1: their airsickness bags. Despite Fund's attempts to convince everyone that 134 00:08:22,600 --> 00:08:24,040 Speaker 1: he had nothing to do with it and it was 135 00:08:24,080 --> 00:08:28,200 Speaker 1: a real hijacking, no one believed him. When the hijacker 136 00:08:28,240 --> 00:08:31,600 Speaker 1: emerged from the cockpit, people applauded, but the joke was 137 00:08:31,680 --> 00:08:35,360 Speaker 1: on them. When the plane landed in Havana, the laughter 138 00:08:35,559 --> 00:08:39,359 Speaker 1: turned to anger, and perhaps oddly, not at the hijacker. 139 00:08:39,880 --> 00:08:43,800 Speaker 1: They berated Fund for tricking them, and by the end 140 00:08:43,840 --> 00:08:47,360 Speaker 1: of nineteen sixty nine, eighty six hijackings had taken place 141 00:08:47,360 --> 00:08:49,560 Speaker 1: in the United States, more than any other year in 142 00:08:49,600 --> 00:08:53,280 Speaker 1: aviation history, though not all of them brought laughter and 143 00:08:53,400 --> 00:08:57,520 Speaker 1: jokes to the passengers unharmed, and they weren't all short 144 00:08:57,679 --> 00:09:12,280 Speaker 1: Johns to Cuba. On October thirty one of nineti nine, 145 00:09:12,640 --> 00:09:16,239 Speaker 1: Raphael Minicello arrived at l a X dressed in camouflage. 146 00:09:16,880 --> 00:09:19,640 Speaker 1: He purchased a ticket on trans World Airlines Red Eye 147 00:09:19,640 --> 00:09:23,760 Speaker 1: flight number eighty five, and boarded at one thirty am. 148 00:09:23,800 --> 00:09:26,240 Speaker 1: The plane had started in Baltimore before making the journey 149 00:09:26,240 --> 00:09:29,880 Speaker 1: across the country to Los Angeles. A crew of three 150 00:09:29,960 --> 00:09:33,640 Speaker 1: manned the cockpit and four flight attendants tended to the passengers. 151 00:09:34,400 --> 00:09:36,760 Speaker 1: Most of the attendants were new to the job, having 152 00:09:36,800 --> 00:09:39,360 Speaker 1: only been with the airline for a few months, but 153 00:09:39,520 --> 00:09:43,079 Speaker 1: Charlene Demonico had been there three years, and she had 154 00:09:43,080 --> 00:09:46,080 Speaker 1: swopped shifts with another attendant so she could have Halloween 155 00:09:46,200 --> 00:09:50,439 Speaker 1: night off. Demonico and the other attendants lowered the cabin 156 00:09:50,559 --> 00:09:53,840 Speaker 1: lights to allow the bleary eyed passengers to get some sleep. 157 00:09:54,760 --> 00:09:59,520 Speaker 1: Minicello caught Demonico's eye immediately. His outfit and oddly shaped 158 00:09:59,559 --> 00:10:03,720 Speaker 1: backpack stood out, and though he was polite, she couldn't 159 00:10:03,720 --> 00:10:08,679 Speaker 1: help but notice he seemed nervous. Once the passengers were settled, 160 00:10:08,760 --> 00:10:12,040 Speaker 1: she joined the other attendants in the galley. They also 161 00:10:12,080 --> 00:10:15,200 Speaker 1: thought the passenger and coach seemed odd and debated what 162 00:10:15,240 --> 00:10:17,719 Speaker 1: he might be carrying in that pack. One thought it 163 00:10:17,800 --> 00:10:21,400 Speaker 1: might be a fishing rod. Most of the flight's forty 164 00:10:21,400 --> 00:10:25,040 Speaker 1: passengers soon fell asleep, including the five members of the 165 00:10:25,040 --> 00:10:28,560 Speaker 1: pop band Harper's Bazaar that'd just come off a concert 166 00:10:28,559 --> 00:10:34,720 Speaker 1: in Pasadena. Someone brushed past guitarist Dicks Capitoni, waking him. 167 00:10:34,760 --> 00:10:37,160 Speaker 1: He looked up to see a man dressed in camo 168 00:10:37,440 --> 00:10:41,160 Speaker 1: holding an M one rifle walking toward the galley. He 169 00:10:41,200 --> 00:10:45,640 Speaker 1: woke drummer John Peterson. Was this really happening? Twenty one 170 00:10:45,679 --> 00:10:48,040 Speaker 1: year old flight attendant Tracy Coleman must have thought the 171 00:10:48,080 --> 00:10:51,960 Speaker 1: same thing. She calmly told Minchello, You're not supposed to 172 00:10:52,000 --> 00:10:54,959 Speaker 1: have that. An off duty pilot by the name of 173 00:10:55,040 --> 00:10:58,840 Speaker 1: Jim Finley stood to confront the hijacker, but upon staring 174 00:10:58,840 --> 00:11:01,080 Speaker 1: down the barrel of the m on, he made the 175 00:11:01,120 --> 00:11:05,200 Speaker 1: wise decision to return to his seat. Minnicello handed Coleman 176 00:11:05,240 --> 00:11:08,400 Speaker 1: a rifle bullet to show her and everyone else that 177 00:11:08,480 --> 00:11:12,439 Speaker 1: he was serious. He ordered Demonico to walk with him 178 00:11:12,440 --> 00:11:17,200 Speaker 1: to the cockpit. Once there, Minnchello became agitated. He refused 179 00:11:17,200 --> 00:11:19,679 Speaker 1: to allow the flight attendant to ring the bell, instructing 180 00:11:19,679 --> 00:11:22,800 Speaker 1: her to knock instead. She hoped that the pilot would 181 00:11:22,880 --> 00:11:26,760 Speaker 1: scent something was wrong and not open the door. Unfortunately, 182 00:11:26,880 --> 00:11:31,120 Speaker 1: the door swung wide open. She informed Captain Donald Cook, 183 00:11:31,360 --> 00:11:34,880 Speaker 1: First Officer Wenzel Williams, and flight engineer Lloyd Holrad that 184 00:11:34,960 --> 00:11:37,360 Speaker 1: a man with a gun was standing right behind her. 185 00:11:38,080 --> 00:11:42,920 Speaker 1: Minnicello shoved past, pointing the m one at Cook. With 186 00:11:42,960 --> 00:11:45,320 Speaker 1: the hijacker up at the front of the plane, thinly 187 00:11:45,360 --> 00:11:48,760 Speaker 1: searched the man's bags. He found more ammunition but no 188 00:11:48,880 --> 00:11:52,920 Speaker 1: other weapons. He determined from the hijacker's hair, attire and 189 00:11:53,040 --> 00:11:58,079 Speaker 1: weaponry that he must be military. More passengers awoke, perhaps 190 00:11:58,200 --> 00:12:02,079 Speaker 1: sensing something was wrong. The captain's voice came over the speakers. 191 00:12:02,760 --> 00:12:05,040 Speaker 1: We have a very nervous young man up here, and 192 00:12:05,080 --> 00:12:07,200 Speaker 1: we are going to take him wherever he wants to go. 193 00:12:08,800 --> 00:12:12,120 Speaker 1: People began to murmur about going to Cuba. A few 194 00:12:12,160 --> 00:12:15,120 Speaker 1: thought about how dangerous the man holding the cockpit crew 195 00:12:15,120 --> 00:12:18,480 Speaker 1: at gunpoint could be. The diversion would mean a delay 196 00:12:18,480 --> 00:12:22,680 Speaker 1: in getting to their destination, nothing more. Then the captain 197 00:12:22,720 --> 00:12:25,560 Speaker 1: came back on the inter calm. If you've made any 198 00:12:25,600 --> 00:12:28,480 Speaker 1: plans in San Francisco, don't plan on keeping them, because 199 00:12:28,520 --> 00:12:32,040 Speaker 1: you're going to New York. The band members began to 200 00:12:32,040 --> 00:12:35,680 Speaker 1: speculate among themselves new York, where would they go from there? 201 00:12:36,520 --> 00:12:40,200 Speaker 1: One mentioned Hong Kong, thinking that would be fun. But 202 00:12:40,320 --> 00:12:44,080 Speaker 1: up front, Minicello had presented the crew with a problem. 203 00:12:44,200 --> 00:12:47,080 Speaker 1: New York wasn't where he really wanted to go. He 204 00:12:47,160 --> 00:12:51,280 Speaker 1: wanted to take the plane to Rome. The plane didn't 205 00:12:51,320 --> 00:12:54,439 Speaker 1: have enough fuel for New York, much less Rome. Further, 206 00:12:54,679 --> 00:12:57,480 Speaker 1: none of the cockpit crew was qualified to fly internationally. 207 00:12:58,480 --> 00:13:01,160 Speaker 1: Minicello allowed the plane to stop up in Denver for fuel. 208 00:13:02,120 --> 00:13:04,840 Speaker 1: Cook alerted air traffic control in Denver of the situation, 209 00:13:05,040 --> 00:13:08,319 Speaker 1: and they cleared the plane to land. Minchello let the 210 00:13:08,360 --> 00:13:14,040 Speaker 1: passengers leave, and they did quickly where the FBI awaited them. 211 00:13:14,040 --> 00:13:17,920 Speaker 1: He kept the entire crew aboard, though on the three 212 00:13:17,920 --> 00:13:20,600 Speaker 1: hour flight to New York, Minchello poured himself a few 213 00:13:20,760 --> 00:13:25,360 Speaker 1: strange cocktails of gin and Canadian Club whiskey. Once they 214 00:13:25,440 --> 00:13:28,079 Speaker 1: landed at JFK, he ordered Cook to park the plane 215 00:13:28,120 --> 00:13:31,840 Speaker 1: as far from the terminal as possible. FBI agents knew 216 00:13:31,840 --> 00:13:34,440 Speaker 1: the hijacker planned to force the captain to fly to Rome, 217 00:13:34,800 --> 00:13:37,840 Speaker 1: and they attempted to approach while the ground crew refueled. 218 00:13:38,440 --> 00:13:41,679 Speaker 1: The Cook warned the agents that Minnichello was highly agitated 219 00:13:41,760 --> 00:13:45,400 Speaker 1: and to stay clear, and that's when a shot rang out. 220 00:13:58,120 --> 00:14:02,760 Speaker 1: The crew was terrified. Fortunately no one was hurt. Minnicello, 221 00:14:02,880 --> 00:14:06,280 Speaker 1: by this point, extremely agitated, reminded them that their lives 222 00:14:06,280 --> 00:14:10,640 Speaker 1: were at stake. Cook again told the hijacker that they 223 00:14:10,679 --> 00:14:15,160 Speaker 1: didn't have the proper training to fly internationally. Minnicello issued 224 00:14:15,200 --> 00:14:19,440 Speaker 1: a new demand qualified pilots. He held the crew hostage 225 00:14:19,480 --> 00:14:23,240 Speaker 1: while the new pilots boarded irritated, he then demanded that 226 00:14:23,280 --> 00:14:28,640 Speaker 1: the refueling stopped and the plane take off immediately. New pilots, 227 00:14:28,680 --> 00:14:31,840 Speaker 1: Billy Williams and Richard Hastings did his hold, but got 228 00:14:31,880 --> 00:14:33,760 Speaker 1: through to him that there was no way they had 229 00:14:33,880 --> 00:14:36,640 Speaker 1: enough fuel to make the flight, and so once again, 230 00:14:36,920 --> 00:14:40,920 Speaker 1: the plane landed, this time in Bangor, Maine. While the 231 00:14:41,000 --> 00:14:44,400 Speaker 1: fueling was underway, Cook tried to convince Minchello to let 232 00:14:44,440 --> 00:14:49,040 Speaker 1: the original crew go, but the hijacker refused. The plane 233 00:14:49,080 --> 00:14:51,600 Speaker 1: took off again, and the crew tried to keep the 234 00:14:51,640 --> 00:14:55,760 Speaker 1: situation as calm as possible. Each opened up about their 235 00:14:55,800 --> 00:14:59,920 Speaker 1: private lives and an attempt to gain some rapport. Minnicello 236 00:15:00,160 --> 00:15:04,000 Speaker 1: asked if everyone on board was married. Cook quickly responded 237 00:15:04,000 --> 00:15:06,880 Speaker 1: that yes. They were thinking that the lie might make 238 00:15:06,880 --> 00:15:11,280 Speaker 1: Minicello sympathetic. Flight attendant Tracy Coleman got him to open 239 00:15:11,360 --> 00:15:14,200 Speaker 1: up the most. Minicello taught her a new card game. 240 00:15:15,560 --> 00:15:18,480 Speaker 1: As they passed the time, he told her more about himself. 241 00:15:19,120 --> 00:15:21,840 Speaker 1: His family had moved from Italy to Seattle in nineteen 242 00:15:21,880 --> 00:15:24,680 Speaker 1: sixty two. He had been bullied in high school due 243 00:15:24,720 --> 00:15:27,920 Speaker 1: to his accent and ended up dropping out, ending his 244 00:15:28,080 --> 00:15:31,960 Speaker 1: lifelong dream of becoming a commercial pilot had left home 245 00:15:32,040 --> 00:15:35,480 Speaker 1: shortly afterward at seventeen, moving to San Diego, where he 246 00:15:35,520 --> 00:15:38,600 Speaker 1: had joined the military. After boot camp, he was sent 247 00:15:38,640 --> 00:15:41,880 Speaker 1: to Vietnam. He talked about how he and his platoon 248 00:15:41,920 --> 00:15:45,120 Speaker 1: had been dropped off in the jungle. The conditions were 249 00:15:45,160 --> 00:15:48,240 Speaker 1: horrible and the mission was short and ended in a 250 00:15:48,320 --> 00:15:51,680 Speaker 1: lot of deaths on both sides. He had made friends 251 00:15:51,680 --> 00:15:55,400 Speaker 1: in his platoon and watched many of them die. After 252 00:15:55,440 --> 00:15:57,960 Speaker 1: the mission, he was awarded the Cross of Gallantry and 253 00:15:58,000 --> 00:16:02,960 Speaker 1: sent to Camp Pendleton. The nightmares were relentless. He and 254 00:16:03,000 --> 00:16:05,640 Speaker 1: the other surviving members of his platoon were diagnosed with 255 00:16:05,720 --> 00:16:08,960 Speaker 1: p t s D. Now all he wanted was to 256 00:16:09,000 --> 00:16:13,440 Speaker 1: go home, back to Italy. He turned twenty in the 257 00:16:13,480 --> 00:16:17,600 Speaker 1: air before the plane circled Rome's Fimchino Airport the morning 258 00:16:17,680 --> 00:16:22,600 Speaker 1: of November first, No one celebrated. T w A flight 259 00:16:22,680 --> 00:16:25,280 Speaker 1: number eighty five was now eighteen and a half hours 260 00:16:25,360 --> 00:16:29,520 Speaker 1: into the hijacking, and Minnicello made one more demand that 261 00:16:29,600 --> 00:16:31,200 Speaker 1: they parked the plane at the far end of the 262 00:16:31,280 --> 00:16:35,440 Speaker 1: terminal and be met by an unarmed policeman, and before 263 00:16:35,480 --> 00:16:38,160 Speaker 1: the flight landed, he offered to drive the crew to 264 00:16:38,240 --> 00:16:43,040 Speaker 1: a hotel. They all declined. Once the unarmed officer boarded, 265 00:16:43,160 --> 00:16:46,640 Speaker 1: Minnicello bid a polite farewell to the crew and apologized 266 00:16:46,640 --> 00:16:52,560 Speaker 1: for any inconvenience. Officer Petro Goulli became his new hostage 267 00:16:52,600 --> 00:16:55,720 Speaker 1: and was ordered to drive him to Naples. Four police 268 00:16:55,720 --> 00:16:59,200 Speaker 1: cars followed. Goulli drove into a dead end alley and 269 00:16:59,280 --> 00:17:03,640 Speaker 1: Minnicello umped out and fled on foot. Five hours later, 270 00:17:03,720 --> 00:17:06,040 Speaker 1: a priest found him trying to blend in at a 271 00:17:06,040 --> 00:17:09,640 Speaker 1: mass but camouflage at a church didn't work very well. 272 00:17:11,000 --> 00:17:14,160 Speaker 1: Word of the hijacker in his capture spread across the globe. 273 00:17:14,800 --> 00:17:18,760 Speaker 1: Members of his platoon were shocked. The media reported on 274 00:17:18,800 --> 00:17:22,080 Speaker 1: his mental state, along with new information about the events 275 00:17:22,160 --> 00:17:25,080 Speaker 1: leading up to the hijacking. He had been putting money 276 00:17:25,119 --> 00:17:27,800 Speaker 1: into a marine savings account and had planned to send 277 00:17:27,800 --> 00:17:30,840 Speaker 1: it to his terminally ill father, who had recently returned 278 00:17:30,880 --> 00:17:34,720 Speaker 1: to Italy, but when he had checked the account, Manchello 279 00:17:34,800 --> 00:17:37,240 Speaker 1: found less money in it than he thought should be there. 280 00:17:38,200 --> 00:17:41,480 Speaker 1: He had complained to his superiors, but they ignored him. 281 00:17:41,560 --> 00:17:43,960 Speaker 1: The feeling betrayed, he had broken into the store on 282 00:17:44,040 --> 00:17:47,119 Speaker 1: base and stolen around two hundred dollars worth of goods. 283 00:17:48,040 --> 00:17:50,040 Speaker 1: He had stopped to drink beer in the shop and 284 00:17:50,160 --> 00:17:52,919 Speaker 1: fell asleep, which is where a military police found him 285 00:17:52,960 --> 00:17:56,760 Speaker 1: the next morning. He was scheduled to appear in court 286 00:17:56,880 --> 00:18:00,800 Speaker 1: on November one, and fearing prison, he led with the 287 00:18:01,000 --> 00:18:03,959 Speaker 1: M one rifle he had brought back from Vietnam registered 288 00:18:04,000 --> 00:18:07,400 Speaker 1: as a trophy. That was when he made his plan 289 00:18:07,480 --> 00:18:10,480 Speaker 1: to hijack a plane back to Italy, deciding on the 290 00:18:10,560 --> 00:18:14,399 Speaker 1: t W A flight. In Italy, he was seen as 291 00:18:14,400 --> 00:18:17,840 Speaker 1: a sort of underdog hero, a troubled and scared young 292 00:18:17,880 --> 00:18:19,760 Speaker 1: man who would do anything to get back to his 293 00:18:19,800 --> 00:18:23,720 Speaker 1: hometown and his dying father. The Italian news glossed over 294 00:18:23,800 --> 00:18:26,639 Speaker 1: his threats to the crew aboard the flight. The media 295 00:18:26,680 --> 00:18:29,360 Speaker 1: there betrayed him as a victim of a foreign country's 296 00:18:29,400 --> 00:18:34,240 Speaker 1: war machine. Minnchello was tried in Italy instead of being 297 00:18:34,240 --> 00:18:38,000 Speaker 1: extradited to the United States. He was convicted, but released 298 00:18:38,080 --> 00:18:40,240 Speaker 1: just a couple of years later. On May one of 299 00:18:40,320 --> 00:18:44,280 Speaker 1: nineteen seventy one, he turned twenty one during his sentence. 300 00:18:45,400 --> 00:18:47,080 Speaker 1: On the day of his release from the Queen of 301 00:18:47,080 --> 00:18:51,880 Speaker 1: Heaven Prison near Vatican City, he wore a suit. Photographers 302 00:18:51,880 --> 00:18:55,280 Speaker 1: and reporters crowded around him, and civilians showed up as well. 303 00:18:55,480 --> 00:18:57,439 Speaker 1: Making him a little unsure of how to handle all 304 00:18:57,440 --> 00:19:02,160 Speaker 1: the attention. He alternated between on certainty in being rather cocky. 305 00:19:03,440 --> 00:19:05,919 Speaker 1: One reporter asked if he was sorry for the hijacking, 306 00:19:06,600 --> 00:19:10,320 Speaker 1: why should I be? He said it wouldn't be until 307 00:19:10,359 --> 00:19:13,560 Speaker 1: he turned thirty one that his attitude about his actions changed. 308 00:19:14,320 --> 00:19:16,800 Speaker 1: After a friend talked him out of a violent attack 309 00:19:16,840 --> 00:19:20,800 Speaker 1: against a medical facility. Minnichello planned the attack after his 310 00:19:20,840 --> 00:19:24,880 Speaker 1: wife of a few years lost their second child. It 311 00:19:24,960 --> 00:19:27,760 Speaker 1: was then that Minichello promised to devote his life to God. 312 00:19:29,480 --> 00:19:32,359 Speaker 1: After learning that he no longer had any outstanding warrants 313 00:19:32,359 --> 00:19:34,840 Speaker 1: against him in the United States, he decided to return. 314 00:19:35,760 --> 00:19:38,159 Speaker 1: There was the matter of the court martial, though, and 315 00:19:38,240 --> 00:19:42,600 Speaker 1: it's no surprise that he was dishonorably discharged. With the 316 00:19:42,640 --> 00:19:45,520 Speaker 1: help of his fellow platoon members, Minchello tracked down the 317 00:19:45,520 --> 00:19:47,800 Speaker 1: crew of t w A Flight eighty five so that 318 00:19:47,840 --> 00:19:50,960 Speaker 1: he could apologize. He gave them each a copy of 319 00:19:51,000 --> 00:19:53,480 Speaker 1: the New Testament with a note inside thanking them for 320 00:19:53,560 --> 00:19:57,560 Speaker 1: their time and forgiveness for his actions. He apologized for 321 00:19:57,560 --> 00:20:00,320 Speaker 1: putting them in harm's way and referenced the book Fluke 322 00:20:00,600 --> 00:20:05,240 Speaker 1: chapter twenty three, Verse thirty four. Father forgive them, for 323 00:20:05,359 --> 00:20:16,120 Speaker 1: they do not know what they are doing. A lot 324 00:20:16,119 --> 00:20:19,480 Speaker 1: of things have changed since the nineteen sixties. I mean, obviously, 325 00:20:19,600 --> 00:20:23,240 Speaker 1: but in terms of flying, since nine eleven, no one 326 00:20:23,320 --> 00:20:26,679 Speaker 1: jokes about getting a lift to Cuba. Today we have 327 00:20:26,800 --> 00:20:30,840 Speaker 1: metal detectors, physical screenings, and X ray and other imaging devices, 328 00:20:30,880 --> 00:20:35,600 Speaker 1: among a whole host of other checks and balances. In retrospect, 329 00:20:35,720 --> 00:20:37,879 Speaker 1: it may sound like the sixties was of free for 330 00:20:37,920 --> 00:20:41,000 Speaker 1: all when it came to hijacking planes, but it's not 331 00:20:41,040 --> 00:20:45,520 Speaker 1: that nothing was being done. In eight the FAA's Anti 332 00:20:45,600 --> 00:20:50,240 Speaker 1: Hijacking Task Force explored several deterrents. They invited the airlines 333 00:20:50,280 --> 00:20:53,280 Speaker 1: and even the general public to make suggestions to keep planes, 334 00:20:53,400 --> 00:20:57,399 Speaker 1: crew and passengers safe. Airlines put in force those orders 335 00:20:57,480 --> 00:20:59,879 Speaker 1: that all crew members must agree to a hijackers to 336 00:21:00,040 --> 00:21:03,560 Speaker 1: and hopefully preventing any harm to themselves and their passengers. 337 00:21:04,400 --> 00:21:07,480 Speaker 1: The airlines also suggested building a fake airport in South 338 00:21:07,560 --> 00:21:11,760 Speaker 1: Florida to resemble Havanna's airport. When a hijacker would disembark, 339 00:21:11,840 --> 00:21:16,199 Speaker 1: that'd be greeted by US authorities. The plan was never implemented, 340 00:21:16,880 --> 00:21:19,440 Speaker 1: not because it was ridiculous, but because of the expense 341 00:21:20,400 --> 00:21:24,120 Speaker 1: and as suggestions went that wasn't even the most bizarre. 342 00:21:25,480 --> 00:21:28,359 Speaker 1: Someone floated an idea for an ejector seat to launch 343 00:21:28,400 --> 00:21:32,159 Speaker 1: would be hijackers out of the plane. Another person filed 344 00:21:32,200 --> 00:21:35,080 Speaker 1: a patent for seats that would deliver an injection through 345 00:21:35,119 --> 00:21:38,840 Speaker 1: the cushions, capable of sedating or killing the person sitting 346 00:21:38,880 --> 00:21:42,560 Speaker 1: in it. Then there was the offer of free one 347 00:21:42,600 --> 00:21:45,439 Speaker 1: way flights to Cuba for would be hijackers, as long 348 00:21:45,480 --> 00:21:49,200 Speaker 1: as they promised to never return. As you might imagine, 349 00:21:49,400 --> 00:21:54,800 Speaker 1: Castro refused to accept those flights. That left another potential solution, 350 00:21:55,640 --> 00:22:00,159 Speaker 1: training ticket agents to spot suspicious behavior. While it may 351 00:22:00,200 --> 00:22:02,920 Speaker 1: have helped here and there, far too many hijackers just 352 00:22:03,160 --> 00:22:07,399 Speaker 1: didn't act suspiciously. The airlines were forced to consider a 353 00:22:07,480 --> 00:22:10,840 Speaker 1: solution that had already been suggested, but one they didn't 354 00:22:10,880 --> 00:22:14,399 Speaker 1: consider optimal and basically it was the worst option on 355 00:22:14,480 --> 00:22:19,159 Speaker 1: the table and yet very familiar to us today metal detectors, 356 00:22:19,359 --> 00:22:26,840 Speaker 1: luggage screening, and extra security. There's more to this story. 357 00:22:27,160 --> 00:22:29,600 Speaker 1: Stick around after this brief sponsor break to hear all 358 00:22:29,600 --> 00:22:39,240 Speaker 1: about it. Since that historic day in December when the 359 00:22:39,359 --> 00:22:42,399 Speaker 1: Right Brothers first took to the sky, air travel has 360 00:22:42,480 --> 00:22:45,600 Speaker 1: been a big part of American history, from planes and 361 00:22:45,760 --> 00:22:50,000 Speaker 1: jets to liquid fueled rockets. There are plenty of fascinating stories, 362 00:22:50,280 --> 00:22:53,440 Speaker 1: both of ingenuity and triumph, of the dark and tragic, 363 00:22:53,960 --> 00:22:59,160 Speaker 1: and of the downright bazaar. One of the strangest involves 364 00:22:59,400 --> 00:23:03,239 Speaker 1: fruit fly you see. In nineteen forty seven, they were 365 00:23:03,280 --> 00:23:07,359 Speaker 1: the first animal American scientists ever sent into space. The 366 00:23:07,440 --> 00:23:10,200 Speaker 1: goal was to measure the impact of cosmic radiation on 367 00:23:10,400 --> 00:23:14,200 Speaker 1: living creatures, so the insects were placed inside a recovered 368 00:23:14,280 --> 00:23:17,320 Speaker 1: not C V two missile and launched sixty seven miles 369 00:23:17,600 --> 00:23:21,080 Speaker 1: or a hundred nine kilometers up, just past the altitude 370 00:23:21,160 --> 00:23:25,719 Speaker 1: recognized as the border where space begins. The capsule then 371 00:23:25,760 --> 00:23:30,159 Speaker 1: returned parachuting down into New Mexico, where scientists waited. To 372 00:23:30,359 --> 00:23:33,400 Speaker 1: their delight, the flies were still alive and had suffered 373 00:23:33,480 --> 00:23:38,480 Speaker 1: no ill effects from radiation. Monkeys and apes also served 374 00:23:38,520 --> 00:23:41,920 Speaker 1: as proto astronauts. Albert the second was the first in 375 00:23:42,040 --> 00:23:45,000 Speaker 1: nineteen forty nine, but due to a parachute failure, he 376 00:23:45,240 --> 00:23:49,280 Speaker 1: sadly didn't survive. The Soviet Union sent a stray dog 377 00:23:49,359 --> 00:23:52,520 Speaker 1: from Moscow named Lyca into orbit in nineteen fifty seven, 378 00:23:53,080 --> 00:23:55,919 Speaker 1: though it was a one way trip, and the French 379 00:23:56,080 --> 00:23:59,400 Speaker 1: sent a tuxedo cat named Felisette up in sixty three, 380 00:24:00,000 --> 00:24:04,119 Speaker 1: and she returned alive and well. But competition between the 381 00:24:04,200 --> 00:24:06,840 Speaker 1: United States and the uss ARE over the space race 382 00:24:07,080 --> 00:24:11,000 Speaker 1: and all the scientific, technological, and military domination that went 383 00:24:11,119 --> 00:24:15,000 Speaker 1: with it, heated up. The testing impact and radiation on 384 00:24:15,119 --> 00:24:18,639 Speaker 1: animals wasn't the same as testing on humans. To make 385 00:24:18,760 --> 00:24:22,119 Speaker 1: newer jet planes and rockets safe, American scientists had to 386 00:24:22,160 --> 00:24:28,280 Speaker 1: get creative. At first, they used human cadavers. Turns out 387 00:24:28,359 --> 00:24:30,560 Speaker 1: the public didn't care much for using the dead in 388 00:24:30,640 --> 00:24:33,960 Speaker 1: such a way. Even a handful of scientists had difficulty 389 00:24:34,040 --> 00:24:38,000 Speaker 1: with the moral and ethical use of human bodies. Enter 390 00:24:38,240 --> 00:24:43,560 Speaker 1: Sierra Sam, the first crash test dummy invented in Sam 391 00:24:43,640 --> 00:24:47,440 Speaker 1: tested aircraft seats, commercial and military, along with ejection seats, 392 00:24:47,520 --> 00:24:52,000 Speaker 1: aviation helmets, and pilot restraint harnesses. Sam became so popular 393 00:24:52,080 --> 00:24:54,600 Speaker 1: that he was mass produced for automotive companies as well. 394 00:24:55,800 --> 00:24:58,159 Speaker 1: Despite the use of crash test dummies, the US Air 395 00:24:58,240 --> 00:25:01,960 Speaker 1: Force still used animals into the nineteen fifties. During the 396 00:25:02,040 --> 00:25:04,280 Speaker 1: Cold War arms race had come up with the B 397 00:25:04,480 --> 00:25:09,160 Speaker 1: fifty Hustler, equipped to carry nuclear bombs, capable of mock 398 00:25:09,280 --> 00:25:12,000 Speaker 1: to flight, and able to detect fifty different kinds of 399 00:25:12,080 --> 00:25:16,200 Speaker 1: electronic failures. The plane proved difficult to control and maintain. 400 00:25:17,320 --> 00:25:20,120 Speaker 1: That didn't mean the military planned to give up on it, though, 401 00:25:20,600 --> 00:25:24,119 Speaker 1: It just needed a few tweaks, namely a way to 402 00:25:24,200 --> 00:25:29,159 Speaker 1: eject safely. After designing a new system, it needed extensive testing. 403 00:25:29,800 --> 00:25:32,400 Speaker 1: While human volunteers were used to test the device while 404 00:25:32,400 --> 00:25:34,639 Speaker 1: it was on the ground, the Air Force decided not 405 00:25:34,800 --> 00:25:37,399 Speaker 1: to use people living or deceased when it came to 406 00:25:37,520 --> 00:25:42,399 Speaker 1: testing in flight. They chose to forego even crash dummies. No, 407 00:25:43,240 --> 00:25:47,560 Speaker 1: they used bears, American black bears and Himilean brown bears 408 00:25:47,600 --> 00:25:51,280 Speaker 1: to be more precise. The animals were sedated, strapped into 409 00:25:51,320 --> 00:25:54,440 Speaker 1: the test capsules, and dejected from planes at a variety 410 00:25:54,480 --> 00:25:57,800 Speaker 1: of speeds. The capsules would parachute to Earth, where they 411 00:25:57,840 --> 00:26:02,040 Speaker 1: were collected. It isn't clear why the bears were used 412 00:26:02,080 --> 00:26:05,960 Speaker 1: instead of crashed dummies. All the bears survived the landing, 413 00:26:06,200 --> 00:26:10,640 Speaker 1: though many suffered broken bones and internal injuries. The most 414 00:26:10,720 --> 00:26:13,440 Speaker 1: famous was Yogi, a two year old black bear that 415 00:26:13,560 --> 00:26:15,760 Speaker 1: was ejected from a US Air Force B fifty eight, 416 00:26:15,960 --> 00:26:18,480 Speaker 1: going eight hundred and seventy miles an hour at thirty 417 00:26:18,520 --> 00:26:23,119 Speaker 1: five thousand feet. The parachute deployed, and for almost eight minutes, 418 00:26:23,359 --> 00:26:27,880 Speaker 1: the unconscious young bear drifted to earth. The Air Force 419 00:26:27,960 --> 00:26:30,680 Speaker 1: thought recording the event would be good for public support. 420 00:26:31,359 --> 00:26:33,440 Speaker 1: They were careful to tell the public that Yogi and 421 00:26:33,520 --> 00:26:36,320 Speaker 1: the other bears got a good meal afterward, while awaiting 422 00:26:36,359 --> 00:26:41,199 Speaker 1: a complete and thorough medical examination. Of course, unfortunately they 423 00:26:41,320 --> 00:26:44,840 Speaker 1: left out one important detail that the bears, both healthy 424 00:26:44,920 --> 00:26:49,280 Speaker 1: and injured alike, were euthanized and then autopsied. There was 425 00:26:49,320 --> 00:26:52,280 Speaker 1: decades before the records of their true fate finally surfaced, 426 00:26:53,400 --> 00:26:56,280 Speaker 1: but by then the B fifty eight hustler was retired 427 00:26:56,880 --> 00:27:00,280 Speaker 1: and the project had been brought to an end. Yeah 428 00:27:08,600 --> 00:27:12,760 Speaker 1: American Shadows is hosted by Lauren Vogelbaum. This episode was 429 00:27:12,840 --> 00:27:16,880 Speaker 1: written by Michelle Muto, researched by Ali Steed, and produced 430 00:27:16,920 --> 00:27:21,200 Speaker 1: by Miranda Hawkins and Trevor Young, with executive producers Aaron Mankey, 431 00:27:21,560 --> 00:27:25,400 Speaker 1: Alex Williams, and Matt Frederick. To learn more about the show, 432 00:27:25,640 --> 00:27:28,600 Speaker 1: visit Grim and Mild dot com. From more podcasts from 433 00:27:28,640 --> 00:27:32,639 Speaker 1: iHeart Radio, visit the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or 434 00:27:32,680 --> 00:27:34,320 Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcasts.