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Speaker 1: It's a tough sports not for everybody.

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Speaker 2: You gotta be a little sick to love this game,

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Speaker 2: and we got some sticks.

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Speaker 3: Welcome to NFL Daily, where I can promise you I

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Speaker 3: will not tear up during this podcast. My name is

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Speaker 3: Greg Rosenthal. I'm with Ali Connolly. It's not Saturday, but

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Speaker 3: it's close and it's the time of year that Ali

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Speaker 3: Connolly loves almost as much as the regular football season.

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Speaker 3: It's analyzing press conferences and assistant coach hiring season. Welcome OLLI,

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Speaker 3: how's it going over there in Manchester.

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Speaker 1: I'm doing good. When coaches get emotional about ball, it

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Speaker 1: also gets me a little bit deary.

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Speaker 3: It really is a little bit of a trend with

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Speaker 3: these introductory press conferences. We don't have Todd Monkins press

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Speaker 3: conference yet, but he is the new Browns coach.

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Speaker 4: We're going to talk about that. But we'll talk about

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Speaker 4: Jesse Minner and Joe Brady meeting the media.

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Speaker 3: We'll talk about different assistant coach hirings. We will talk

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Speaker 3: about your beloved and mine too, Ali, Who am I kidding?

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Speaker 3: I got like four Belichick books behind me, including one

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Speaker 3: by Steve Belichick Football scouting Methods. We'll talk about him

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Speaker 3: getting snubbed from the Hall of Fame and just the reaction.

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Speaker 4: And everything that's happening.

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Speaker 3: And if we even have time, I think I'll I'll

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Speaker 3: present my Hall of Fame vote if I had one,

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Speaker 3: because a lot of people criticize, but I always say, like,

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Speaker 3: if you say someone's a snub, you have to say

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Speaker 3: who you would take out. So I will go through

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Speaker 3: and make my picks. But it really is a crazy

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Speaker 3: time of year before we kind of get into it.

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Speaker 3: Ali like seeing the different coaching staffs come together in

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Speaker 3: the battle for all the assistant coaches, and you have

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Speaker 3: a better knowledge about, like the strength and weaknesses of

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Speaker 3: a lot of these guys than most. When Mike McCarthy

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Speaker 3: said that it's more challenging than ever to fill a

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Speaker 3: coaching staff, and I'm watching what's going on the last

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Speaker 3: few days, like, I think I agree with him, But

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Speaker 3: what do you think he meant by that?

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Speaker 1: I think what he maybe meant was a lot of

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Speaker 1: the guys that he's will with befoll of aged out

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Speaker 1: of the league because every single person he's interviewing or

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Speaker 1: requesting to be dueing or hiring goal who was in

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Speaker 1: his presentation to the Steelers of this is who I

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Speaker 1: would go for, all people who have long standing connections

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Speaker 1: with him. And then outside of Scott Tolz, it's a

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Speaker 1: lot of experience. Experience can be great stuff need experience,

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Speaker 1: but that could be an applausible explanation. It's not as

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Speaker 1: though he's going off the reservation and bringing an influx

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Speaker 1: of new ideas to his approach to running a team.

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Speaker 3: So I did Dave Danishek's show Football America. Everyone should

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Speaker 3: check that out whenever it comes out. And I couldn't

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Speaker 3: get my camera to work, so that's on my phone

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Speaker 3: and everything. And that's the thing about McCarthy that I

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Speaker 3: was pushing back on him because he was trying to

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Speaker 3: like gass up the McCarthy higher And it's not so

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Speaker 3: much just age in terms of energy, it's age in

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Speaker 3: terms of fresh ideas and your connection to the risers

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Speaker 3: within the league and who's on the cutting edge. And

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Speaker 3: I think that was a huge problem for Bill Belichick

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Speaker 3: at the end in the NFL and could be a

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Speaker 3: problem for hires like Mike McCarthy. And I don't know

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Speaker 3: where Todd Munkin fits on that spectrum, because yes, Todd

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Speaker 3: Munkin at sixty years old, is a first time head

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Speaker 3: coach in the NFL. It's been quite a journey. I

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Speaker 3: don't think a lot of people remember that he's been

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Speaker 3: in the Browns building before. They are quite familiar, not

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Speaker 3: this regime with Andrew Berry, but Todd Munkin was the

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Speaker 3: offensive coordinator in the Freddie Kitchens year, which was the

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Speaker 3: year that kind of blew up the franchise and got

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Speaker 3: Andrew Berry and everything in the building. And now he's

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Speaker 3: back as the head coach. A surprising hire. I think

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Speaker 3: everyone thought it was going to be one of the

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Speaker 3: younger guys like Nate Steelhouse with the Rams, and if not,

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Speaker 3: then it was possibly going to be Jim Schwartz. It

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Speaker 3: turns out to be neither. And it sounds like Monkin's

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Speaker 3: first order of business will be finding the defensive coordinator

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Speaker 3: because it doesn't sound like Jim Schwartz wants to stay

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Speaker 3: with him.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you say, people thought it would be Jim Schwartz

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Speaker 1: as the fallback up, and I think Jim Schwartz is

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Speaker 1: included in thinking that he was the fallback action. He

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Speaker 1: walks out the building shouting to everyone within his shot

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Speaker 1: that they'll never see him again. And you mentioned Mounkin

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Speaker 1: being there as O see before that was the in

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Speaker 1: which he was talking on the sideline to other coaches

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Speaker 1: about what a disaster the building the Browns was, and

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Speaker 1: so he comes back into the building and everything's going

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Speaker 1: to be fixed. This is an interesting hiot thing because

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Speaker 1: I really respect Top Monkin. I think you mentioned kind

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Speaker 1: of the age and agent experience not being the barometer

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Speaker 1: for they open to new ideas. He's as open to ideas,

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Speaker 1: I think as any guy who's been around the game

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Speaker 1: that long in the league and has recently been in

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Speaker 1: college kind of pushing the game forward and being around,

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Speaker 1: particularly defensively, some of the kind of the trend setting

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Speaker 1: minds at all levels of the sport. And so we

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Speaker 1: can tap into at least, if not those guys specifically,

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Speaker 1: that kind of thinking, that kind of logic be as

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Speaker 1: you approach not just the general scheme, but the work

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Speaker 1: week and practice habits. So I admire Top Mounkin. I'm

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Speaker 1: glad he's finally getting a shot. I do find it

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Speaker 1: from the brown side slightly baffling. Why do you find

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Speaker 1: it baffling? Let's let's actually just assume though that Sielhouse

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Speaker 1: didn't want the job that's how I'm operating, because when

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Speaker 1: we heard those finalists, it just.

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Speaker 3: Felt like he was the favorite. And then Zach Jackson

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Speaker 3: I listened to his podcast. He covers a team for

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Speaker 3: the Athletic and you know his understanding was that Schelhouse

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Speaker 3: in most of the candidates, but he was the most

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Speaker 3: serious one. We're told that like the Browns felt like

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Speaker 3: they had a good chance to keep Jim Schwartz under him,

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Speaker 3: and that they wanted Jim Schwartz, and if anything, they

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Speaker 3: were almost telling prospective candidates, you have to keep Jim Schwartz.

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Speaker 3: And according to Zach, it sounded like Schelhouse had some

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Speaker 3: real reservations, not just about how that relationship would work

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Speaker 3: with Jim Schwartz, because it might be awkward for a

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Speaker 3: young head coach, and just would he want his own

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Speaker 3: guy if it's going to be his building. But he

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Speaker 3: sounds like maybe he didn't quite believe the Browns, that

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Speaker 3: like he didn't think Jim Schwartz would want to stay

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Speaker 3: under him, and that that was maybe a part of

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Speaker 3: the reason why he wasn't comfortable with the job.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and I think, you know, I know Grant Udinsky

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Speaker 1: dealt with the same thing where it's not just Schwartz,

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Speaker 1: but it's like big chunks. The staff are told to you,

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Speaker 1: this is who will be in certain positions, and I

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Speaker 1: just don't know how you can approach that with a candidate.

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Speaker 1: I get it with the young guys that you want

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Speaker 1: to surround them with experienced people you who have no

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Speaker 1: how and have done the job at a high level,

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Speaker 1: particularly trying to replicate the Ben Johnson's spirit of bringing

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Speaker 1: a former head coach who can help you deal with

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Speaker 1: all kind of the under the hood issues that come

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Speaker 1: with being a head coach. When you make that giant

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Speaker 1: leap from coordinate the two head coach, it is different

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Speaker 1: when it's a guy going for the same job as you.

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Speaker 1: Then Ukuman's kind of the young whipper snapper and he

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Speaker 1: thinks he knows way more bald than you, and you

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Speaker 1: have to be the boss of that guy. I just

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Speaker 1: felt like they needed someone, not even in that vein

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Speaker 1: of let's go get the highlight, real oc type pass

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Speaker 1: game coordinator you can design offense for us. I thought

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Speaker 1: they needed real energy and someone who could just drive

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Speaker 1: the building. I'm looking at them the same light as

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Speaker 1: when Demiko went into the Texans, when Dan Campbell went

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Speaker 1: into the Lions, and those two guys had an outstanding

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Speaker 1: rollerdecks of coaches to call upon. They are unbelievable football

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Speaker 1: brains in their own right, but they have an abundance

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Speaker 1: of energy. And I just look at someone like Anthony

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Speaker 1: Weaver and I think that guy is so intelligent, so smart,

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Speaker 1: so crafty at the forefront of defensive design, even the

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Speaker 1: play calling is in great book, can kind of picture

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Speaker 1: what the sports should look like in twenty twenty six,

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Speaker 1: and just has energy for days and we'll just be

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Speaker 1: bursting with ideas and passion. I feel like they need

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Speaker 1: someone to drive the franchise forward. But this is a

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Speaker 1: frenchhip that runs from the top down. It's the owner,

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Speaker 1: it's the GM trying to save his career and survive

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Speaker 1: for his life. And getting someone in there who I

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Speaker 1: think is maybe a bit more dispassionate in how you

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Speaker 1: would run the whole program. I can just concentrate on

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Speaker 1: coaching the football team.

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Speaker 3: He will be great in front of a microphone. And

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Speaker 3: maybe that was attractive to them, because to me, he's

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Speaker 3: going to be very different than Kevin Stefanski. He's gonna

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Speaker 3: have quotes. The media's gotta like what he brings to him.

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Speaker 3: He's gonna be a little prickly with the players, He's

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Speaker 3: gonna be a personality. The problem is, I think it's

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Speaker 3: a situation where the GM does not ultimately have a

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Speaker 3: long leash, which means maybe Todd Munkin will not have

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Speaker 3: that long of a leash, and he's gonna have to

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Speaker 3: show some proof of concept sooner than later, which is

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Speaker 3: gonna be difficult with no offensive line in place, and

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Speaker 3: we'll see who the quarterbacks are. But yeah, like he

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Speaker 3: did fun stuff at Georgia. He did some fun stuff

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Speaker 3: with Lamar Jackson. I actually was someone that was watching

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Speaker 3: Conference USA OLLI in twenty fifteen when Todd Munkin was

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Speaker 3: coach of the Year for the Southern miss Golden Eagles

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Speaker 3: is it I forget what their name is, And he

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Speaker 3: was doing some fun stuff there, So maybe maybe he'll

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Speaker 3: be maybe he'll be good. I don't I actually don't

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Speaker 3: think it's like a bad hire. It's just the process

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Speaker 3: to get there was confusing.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I just think is where the roster is at.

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Speaker 1: I think if it was even slightly better and you

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Speaker 1: had maybe more offensive pieces of settled offensive line, you

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Speaker 1: could say this guy could maybe think it's the eight

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Speaker 1: to nine wins in this division. Could we find a

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Speaker 1: way of scrabbling through one season and being a playoff team,

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Speaker 1: I think it would look different. I think he's a

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Speaker 1: really really good offensive coach. Well for what they need,

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Speaker 1: I just need they need a more general sense of

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Speaker 1: direction and drive behind the franchise, amunking for all the

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Speaker 1: great parts of how we coach, that's just not really

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Speaker 1: what you get from him.

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Speaker 3: So I'm watching that or thinking about that higher and

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Speaker 3: then I start watching the Jesse Mintor press conference, and

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Speaker 3: it's obviously very different. Mintor is younger. He's bringing some

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Speaker 3: of that, especially in terms of schematics, youthful energy. But

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Speaker 3: I also found it really interesting next to him on

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Speaker 3: the stage where two men Eric Tacosta, who you would

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Speaker 3: expect and Sashi Brown who came from that Browns building.

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Speaker 3: Shout out to Sashi Brown, who is you know, one

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Speaker 3: of the analytics kind of kings to get a GM job.

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Speaker 3: And for our listeners who probably don't remember ten years ago,

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Speaker 3: he was part of the sixteen Browns.

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Speaker 4: Am I right? And I should be checking these things?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it was the sixteen Browns. The own

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Speaker 1: sixteen Browns the O sixteen Wizards, correct, right, didn't they

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Speaker 1: open the season terribly? Welsome was that too?

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Speaker 3: He was running the Wizards for about four seasons and

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Speaker 3: he's been in the Ravens building. But just we don't

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Speaker 3: do comeback Executive of the Year. How about comeback Executive

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Speaker 3: of the Year for Sascy Brown being on that stage

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Speaker 3: and presenting a coherent idea of everything that happened. Look,

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Speaker 3: Minter didn't get the people going. He wasn't nervous or anything.

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Speaker 3: He's just not like a raw Rah sounding type of guy.

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Speaker 3: But he has engendered a lot of loyalty from all

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Speaker 3: the players that he's had over the years. They said

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Speaker 3: that was important hearing from all the different people that

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Speaker 3: have worked with Jesse Minter. Let's actually listen to Minter

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Speaker 3: talking about his relationship with Lamar Jackson and some of

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Speaker 3: the players that actually were involved in the coaching process.

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Speaker 5: Lamar and I have had multiple conversations. It's been great,

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Speaker 5: it's been great to get to know him. I think

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Speaker 5: relationships take time, and so you don't become the head

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Speaker 5: coach of the Ravens and expect to have a deep

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Speaker 5: relationship with anybody.

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Speaker 4: So those take time.

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Speaker 5: We've been working towards that already, we've had wonderful conversations.

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Speaker 5: Look forward to many, many more.

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Speaker 3: He also mentioned how excited he is to coach Kyle Hamilton.

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Speaker 3: I think that's gonna be an awesome marriage, kind of

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Speaker 3: comparing him to Derwin. James mentioned that Kyle Hamilton was

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Speaker 3: part of a committee of players that was actually kind

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Speaker 3: of involved in the coaching hiring process where they got

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Speaker 3: their feedback, so it wasn't just Lamar Hamilton and some

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Speaker 3: other veterans. I thought it was a good press covernence.

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Speaker 3: We don't need to judge the press conference. What are

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Speaker 3: you excited about or what were your thoughts? Kind of

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Speaker 3: having watched what he said his vision for the Ravens

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Speaker 3: was going to be.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean when Jesse Mintis talks in public, it's

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Speaker 1: kind of moggding Spiel type as opposed to how he

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Speaker 1: talks when he's either presenting him from a coach still

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Speaker 1: behind the scenes speaking to play. So we got a

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Speaker 1: lot of like the public facing Jesse Minte. I felt

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Speaker 1: like to me he was far and away the best

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Speaker 1: candidate in the cycle. I think he just views the

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Speaker 1: game differently, And I don't mean just the general schemetic sense.

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Speaker 1: It's a lot of ovally with Mike McDonald and other people.

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Speaker 1: The way he approaches practice, the way he approaches the

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Speaker 1: building is just different in new age and trying to

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Speaker 1: push things forward to the point where Mike McDonald's who's

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Speaker 1: leading the best defense in the NFL taking his team

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Speaker 1: to the super Bowl. Went back to Michigan to find out,

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Speaker 1: what is this guy doing there better than I did

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Speaker 1: it when I was in NAZI, and then took that

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Speaker 1: stuff back to the NFL saying he's doing things better

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Speaker 1: than me in terms of how they manage the game

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Speaker 1: week and so to me, putting that guy the head

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Speaker 1: of your franchise, whether it works or not, we never know.

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Speaker 1: I think it's just the right move if you're going

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Speaker 1: to try and move on from a hard ball and say, well,

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Speaker 1: we want to keep some of the identity the ravens,

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Speaker 1: the common language how we view and evaluate players, but

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Speaker 1: we want you in different ideas. That's what we're hearing

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Speaker 1: with the Joe Brady higher rights, what we're hearing with

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Speaker 1: a lot of these highs. This is the guy who

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Speaker 1: actually practices what all the teams.

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Speaker 3: Preach, and he was comfortable it wasn't like I thought

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Speaker 3: he was stiff up there or anything. I just didn't

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Speaker 3: have any like massive takeaways, so I'm not going to

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Speaker 3: force it. Let's listen to Eric DaCosta, who was really

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Speaker 3: making his first head coaching hire as the head of

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Speaker 3: that front office, talk about the coaching search.

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Speaker 6: Steve challenged us a few weeks weeks ago to find

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Speaker 6: the next coach who would be here for eighteen years

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Speaker 6: and if we do our job, I won't be here,

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Speaker 6: which is great.

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Speaker 4: Was he paraphrasing Steve?

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Speaker 7: Yeah?

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Speaker 4: I think he was.

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Speaker 1: Yes. Bashati said in his press conference he wants to

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Speaker 1: win the SUP Bowl and get out as quickly as possible,

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Speaker 1: so I think he was saying that's what Steve told him.

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Speaker 3: Well, I also thought thee I misread it maybe as

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Speaker 3: a quote that it was more of like, but shot,

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Speaker 3: he's getting up there in years and who knows, And

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Speaker 3: that would get to kind of the podcast that I've

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Speaker 3: been doing with Colleen quite often, where we're talking about

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Speaker 3: just being aware of death at all times.

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Speaker 4: So shout out to Steve Bushotty for that. You never know.

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Speaker 3: Look, I was really taken by DaCosta saying, actually, Jesse

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Speaker 3: Minner had a lot of ground to make up because

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Speaker 3: I kind of remember him in this scouting assistant role,

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Speaker 3: and to be honest, it was like hard to imagine

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Speaker 3: him as a head coach. I didn't really see him

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Speaker 3: that way, but once we met in that change and

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Speaker 3: also just he said hearing from a lot of people

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Speaker 3: from around the league that have worked with him and

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Speaker 3: about jesse Minner's growth, that basically he was not the

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Speaker 3: same guy as he was when he was last in

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Speaker 3: the Ravens building, but.

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Speaker 1: At least gets to speak the language that gets them.

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Speaker 1: A woman fuzzy because you're repeating back to someone how

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Speaker 1: you do it is the right way to do it,

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Speaker 1: that I have some maybe new ideas to do it

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Speaker 1: different ways, And you look at some of the highest

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Speaker 1: there's an awful lot of that going on, right why

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Speaker 1: people like, yes, we are doing things pretty well. We've

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Speaker 1: gone out to check all the other ideas, but actually

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Speaker 1: what we do is going pretty good.

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Speaker 4: It's a great point.

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Speaker 3: It's why I'm gonna handle our Hall of Fame conversation

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Speaker 3: and what I think about the voting process, you know,

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Speaker 3: delicately later because I want to be part of that

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Speaker 3: process eventually. But I think I like what you're doing,

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Speaker 3: but I think we can adjust some things. Some actual

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Speaker 3: news that came from it is jesse Minner said he

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Speaker 3: will call the defense not a surprise and that they

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Speaker 3: will both still report to ownership Steve Bashati. So it's

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Speaker 3: not like DaCosta is getting x S power. They're keeping

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Speaker 3: the same structure. Tacasta said that that was important because

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Speaker 3: he said, look, we've won two super Bowls, We've won

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Speaker 3: a lot of games that way. I looked at the

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Speaker 3: relationship that as he knew some had with Brian Billick

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Speaker 3: and then with John Harbaugh. We also heard that John

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Speaker 3: Harbaugh texted them and said you should hire jesse Minner,

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Speaker 3: which is interesting. What do you think about jesse Minner

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Speaker 3: since we got yeah, and kind of the fit with

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Speaker 3: this defense, in the personnel that they have right now.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think he's gonna mimic a lot of what

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Speaker 1: Mike McDonald did before. I think the thing with Mint

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Speaker 1: it is more I'm not a massive believer in like

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Speaker 1: just the style of defense. Just philosophally, I like more

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Speaker 1: of an all out attack aggressive defense. I like events

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Speaker 1: Joseph style defense. Mint is a little bit more passive,

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Speaker 1: a little bit more relaxed a little bit in the

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Speaker 1: bluff pressure world, which is more aligned to Mike McDonald.

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Speaker 1: So I think it's just gonna be a pretty much

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Speaker 1: a Cobb and copy of that then comes down to

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Speaker 1: the day to day play calling. He's just more of

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Speaker 1: what will the infrastructure look like? And I think that

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Speaker 1: will be pretty radically different than what John Hobball was

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Speaker 1: doing at.

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Speaker 4: The end, So it was very different him.

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Speaker 3: Inner finishes his press conference almost immediately after that ends.

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Speaker 4: It was pretty short.

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Speaker 3: The Joe Brady press conference starts in Buffalo, and we're

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Speaker 3: going to get to all the new news in terms

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Speaker 3: of assistance and coordinators getting hired. But I wanted to

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Speaker 3: go through the head coaches first, and this was a

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Speaker 3: totally different vibe. Josh Allen is there. He is seen

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Speaker 3: with crutches and a broken foot, you know, showing up

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Speaker 3: to the press conference and showing up for his guy,

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Speaker 3: Joe Brady. It was very emotional. Actually, let's listen to

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Speaker 3: Joe Brady getting emotional talking about, you know, how much

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Speaker 3: his players mean to him.

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Speaker 2: Lastly, our players, my guys. I'm so appreciative of you

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Speaker 2: guys being here today. Thank you for allowing me to

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Speaker 2: be my self playing for me and being you with us.

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Speaker 2: I may be calling plays still, but I'm no longer

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Speaker 2: the offensive cord atter Max right.

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Speaker 1: The defensive and special teams guys.

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Speaker 2: One day. I can't wait to grow our relationship right

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Speaker 2: and deepen it and understand who you are and that

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Speaker 2: team you to grow that, And I can't wait to

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Speaker 2: go out to practice right and when you get it,

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Speaker 2: when you.

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Speaker 1: Get a takeaway and be able to celebrate with you.

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Speaker 1: Just like I was.

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Speaker 2: Talking a lot to you, I gotta get after Spencer

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Speaker 2: Brown the same way. And I'm in it with you

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Speaker 2: guys now right. I can't wait to do that.

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Speaker 3: Your thoughts. That was one of many emotional moments earlier on.

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Speaker 3: He really struggled to compose himself, looking at his wife

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Speaker 3: and everything. What were your takeaways from the Joe Brady introduction.

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Speaker 1: It's what I expected. He's always being a phenomenal public speaker.

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Speaker 1: He always gets emotional talking about football. He'll do the

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Speaker 1: coaching clinics circuit with like twelve guys in Louisiana and

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Speaker 1: start tearing up. So he just really is a past

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Speaker 1: and loves this thing. And I think that's really cool

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Speaker 1: and awesome and It's cool to see him have that

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Speaker 1: kind of emotion going into the thing. I thought Brandon

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Speaker 1: Bean's comments coming out of it were probably more impactful

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Speaker 1: and telling moving forward, just him noting on their process.

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Speaker 1: All these guys say were aligned. We had a great process.

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Speaker 1: You know, we hired a guy who's already stood near us,

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Speaker 1: even though we dumped on the coaching staff last week.

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Speaker 1: But he made note of some and that is really

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Speaker 1: impactful when you go through these series of interviews, particularly

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Speaker 1: when you've had a guy in there for a long time,

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Speaker 1: which is go out and find all the smart people

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Speaker 1: and steal as much intel as you can. What does

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Speaker 1: their sports science look like, what does their practice schedule

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Speaker 1: look like? Even if we know we're hiring Joe and

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Speaker 1: they claim they didn't, but I have a good sense

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Speaker 1: that I think that they knew that going into letting

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Speaker 1: McDermott go, let's go find good information from everyone else.

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Speaker 1: And sometimes in those interviews when you know, particularly the

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Speaker 1: sham Rooney rule ones that a lot of these teams do,

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Speaker 1: you maybe will not give all your great information in

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Speaker 1: those interviews if you don't think you're a real candidate,

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Speaker 1: but you can gather as much intel as possible from

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Speaker 1: other really smart people to feed into a process when

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Speaker 1: you've had one voice for as long as they have.

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Speaker 1: I think that it's a really good way of doing it.

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Speaker 1: And you compare that to the Steelers who just did

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Speaker 1: not do that. It's like one zoom conversation and we're

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Speaker 1: moving on with the thing. And while hiring the gal

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Speaker 1: he wanted to hide because of where he was born

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Speaker 1: and grew up. That's not using the process to the

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Speaker 1: full extent that you can. So I've been critical of

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Speaker 1: Brandon being the Ross construction, but I think that that

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Speaker 1: you compared that one process of a high that I

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Speaker 1: think is pretty good to very good to a pretty

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Speaker 1: poll on in Mike McCarthy, and you can see the difference.

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Speaker 3: Da Costa in Baltimore talked about that too, and they

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Speaker 3: actually went even further because they started the process earlier.

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Speaker 3: They interviewed like eighteen people, and he expressively said, especially

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Speaker 3: with these zoom calls, like we're just trying to get

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Speaker 3: as much information as we can.

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Speaker 4: We're going to take advantage of that.

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Speaker 3: Period where we had to wait to talk to anyone

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Speaker 3: in person, and we got a lot of things that

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Speaker 3: were really helpful to us. He talked about it openly.

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Speaker 3: That is fascinating, Brady. He really kind of threaded the

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Speaker 3: needle of giving Sean McDermott a TI on a credit

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Speaker 3: and saying how important Sean McDermott was for changing the

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Speaker 3: culture and that we're trying to build on that, and

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Speaker 3: that he accomplished great things. And you know, I think

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Speaker 3: saying the right things. I think this is going to

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Speaker 3: be a very popular press conference in terms of just,

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Speaker 3: you know, assuaging the fears of the Bills fans. Brady said,

436
00:20:20,720 --> 00:20:23,760
Speaker 3: you know, he knows what the expectations are in Buffalo.

437
00:20:23,880 --> 00:20:27,199
Speaker 2: I understand that I'm walking into this role in a

438
00:20:27,240 --> 00:20:30,399
Speaker 2: much better position than coach McDermott did. I am not

439
00:20:30,520 --> 00:20:34,119
Speaker 2: naive to that. I also understand that the expectations are

440
00:20:34,200 --> 00:20:37,760
Speaker 2: higher as well. I didn't take this job to shy

441
00:20:37,800 --> 00:20:41,240
Speaker 2: away from expectations. I sure as hell did not do that.

442
00:20:41,760 --> 00:20:45,320
Speaker 2: I'm embracing it. I'm understanding it, and I'm from meeting

443
00:20:45,320 --> 00:20:48,639
Speaker 2: it full on. I know what I simmed up for,

444
00:20:48,760 --> 00:20:50,800
Speaker 2: and we're going to embrace it because no one rises

445
00:20:50,800 --> 00:20:53,480
Speaker 2: to low expectations. I want what the city wants.

446
00:20:54,720 --> 00:20:58,879
Speaker 1: Let's go, he sold me, Alli, He sold me and

447
00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:01,280
Speaker 1: Joe Brady want a football great curses, and he went

448
00:21:01,359 --> 00:21:03,040
Speaker 1: so hard to drop an F bomb them and caught

449
00:21:03,119 --> 00:21:05,399
Speaker 1: himself at the final second, which I appreciate, and I

450
00:21:05,440 --> 00:21:08,080
Speaker 1: admire him giving Sean mcdumm at some props after the

451
00:21:08,080 --> 00:21:09,880
Speaker 1: guy who just gave him the job spent last week

452
00:21:10,359 --> 00:21:12,480
Speaker 1: doing anything but give Sean mcdumm at props. So I

453
00:21:12,520 --> 00:21:14,920
Speaker 1: thought that was pretty classy. I do think with Brady,

454
00:21:15,640 --> 00:21:19,080
Speaker 1: you know, I think their whole project there. The idea was,

455
00:21:19,080 --> 00:21:21,399
Speaker 1: if we're going to stabilize, as a worst case scenario,

456
00:21:21,400 --> 00:21:23,320
Speaker 1: we have Josh Allen's top five offense in the league.

457
00:21:23,359 --> 00:21:25,040
Speaker 1: Joe Brady can deliver that for us, and then just

458
00:21:25,160 --> 00:21:27,560
Speaker 1: on the margins, you get the right officiating call, the

459
00:21:27,600 --> 00:21:28,960
Speaker 1: right bounce of wall that should put us in a

460
00:21:29,040 --> 00:21:31,440
Speaker 1: championship game. I think that that is a fair assessment.

461
00:21:31,480 --> 00:21:33,280
Speaker 1: And if you looked at the design of the offense

462
00:21:33,320 --> 00:21:35,399
Speaker 1: that he installed and where it's at compared to the

463
00:21:35,440 --> 00:21:37,439
Speaker 1: rest league, if he was just doing that for the Cardinals,

464
00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:40,159
Speaker 1: and even if they were say fourteenth the league success rate,

465
00:21:40,200 --> 00:21:42,400
Speaker 1: whatever number you want to use, you would say that's

466
00:21:42,400 --> 00:21:45,240
Speaker 1: a really attractive external candidate. He just happens to be

467
00:21:45,320 --> 00:21:47,320
Speaker 1: with us and then has the relationship with Josh Allen.

468
00:21:47,359 --> 00:21:48,919
Speaker 1: So I do think you can start stacking things up

469
00:21:49,000 --> 00:21:50,879
Speaker 1: and say it makes a bunch of sense why you

470
00:21:50,880 --> 00:21:52,879
Speaker 1: would just say, let's give this a shot for a

471
00:21:52,920 --> 00:21:54,720
Speaker 1: couple of seasons. If it doesn't work, we'll still have

472
00:21:54,800 --> 00:21:57,560
Speaker 1: Josh Allen in his prime and we could maybe look elsewhere.

473
00:21:57,600 --> 00:22:00,560
Speaker 1: So I've come more around on the high than when

474
00:22:00,640 --> 00:22:01,680
Speaker 1: it was initially announced.

475
00:22:02,040 --> 00:22:02,440
Speaker 4: Okay.

476
00:22:02,560 --> 00:22:06,879
Speaker 3: I appreciate that because I didn't have a lot of

477
00:22:06,880 --> 00:22:09,520
Speaker 3: familiarity with Joe Brady public speaking, and by the end,

478
00:22:09,560 --> 00:22:12,080
Speaker 3: I'm like, Okay, I get why he's bewitched.

479
00:22:12,280 --> 00:22:16,080
Speaker 1: The national media member. The master marketer is Joe Brady.

480
00:22:16,119 --> 00:22:17,600
Speaker 1: And I appreciate that the.

481
00:22:18,040 --> 00:22:20,760
Speaker 3: Cynically look at that. You know you're you're there in

482
00:22:20,800 --> 00:22:23,120
Speaker 3: the snow in Manchester. You could cynically look at that.

483
00:22:23,320 --> 00:22:23,880
Speaker 4: I'm here in.

484
00:22:24,000 --> 00:22:26,359
Speaker 3: LA and I'm thinking, Okay, maybe this guy's gonna pop.

485
00:22:26,359 --> 00:22:28,720
Speaker 1: He's good, He's got the goods. The thing I will

486
00:22:28,720 --> 00:22:32,240
Speaker 1: say is what I appreciate about him is he gets

487
00:22:32,280 --> 00:22:34,480
Speaker 1: to Buffalo what they did on offense that we've talked

488
00:22:34,480 --> 00:22:37,480
Speaker 1: about together for two years now, with the smash mouth

489
00:22:37,520 --> 00:22:39,520
Speaker 1: spread infusion of getting the bigger bodies on the field,

490
00:22:39,560 --> 00:22:40,720
Speaker 1: but bringing a lot of the stuff he did at

491
00:22:40,800 --> 00:22:43,920
Speaker 1: LSU together was a directive from Sean McDermott that that's

492
00:22:43,960 --> 00:22:45,639
Speaker 1: how he wants it to look, and then he had

493
00:22:45,680 --> 00:22:47,480
Speaker 1: the chops to actually pull it together and make it

494
00:22:47,520 --> 00:22:49,240
Speaker 1: look excellent for a couple of seasons with all the

495
00:22:49,280 --> 00:22:51,760
Speaker 1: caveats that Josh Allen bails him out and everything looks

496
00:22:51,800 --> 00:22:54,000
Speaker 1: pretty good. If you call him plays for Josh Allen,

497
00:22:54,240 --> 00:22:56,399
Speaker 1: I am interested. Then well, if that's a directive from

498
00:22:56,440 --> 00:22:58,399
Speaker 1: the guy who's kind of viewing the game from a CEO,

499
00:22:58,560 --> 00:23:00,840
Speaker 1: you know, ten thousand foot view, can you step into

500
00:23:00,880 --> 00:23:03,720
Speaker 1: that role and have that same lens offense defense? And

501
00:23:03,720 --> 00:23:05,399
Speaker 1: that's why I think the DC hire is going to

502
00:23:05,440 --> 00:23:06,359
Speaker 1: be so impoltant.

503
00:23:06,760 --> 00:23:07,959
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's huge.

504
00:23:08,280 --> 00:23:11,560
Speaker 3: And I meant to mention with Jim Schwartz because he's

505
00:23:11,600 --> 00:23:14,440
Speaker 3: already getting talked about as a potential candidate in Buffalo.

506
00:23:14,800 --> 00:23:17,800
Speaker 3: San Francisco is another attractive job that is out there.

507
00:23:18,520 --> 00:23:20,639
Speaker 3: I don't think I'm burning anything by saying, you know,

508
00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:24,840
Speaker 3: I heard some whispers that like maybe he could even

509
00:23:24,880 --> 00:23:28,520
Speaker 3: be a candidate for a team that currently has someone

510
00:23:28,560 --> 00:23:31,880
Speaker 3: in place and would displace it. I don't know who

511
00:23:31,920 --> 00:23:35,000
Speaker 3: that would be, but he is an interesting name to

512
00:23:35,359 --> 00:23:39,560
Speaker 3: drop into it all. And yeah, like, on one hand,

513
00:23:39,640 --> 00:23:41,600
Speaker 3: you could look at Joe Brady as a little political.

514
00:23:41,640 --> 00:23:44,080
Speaker 3: He got a lot of credit for, you know, coaching

515
00:23:44,160 --> 00:23:47,119
Speaker 3: up like the greatest college group of skill position talent

516
00:23:47,200 --> 00:23:51,000
Speaker 3: ever assembled and now coaching up Josh Allen on the

517
00:23:51,000 --> 00:23:53,280
Speaker 3: other hand, like, maybe maybe he is a guy. He

518
00:23:53,320 --> 00:23:55,119
Speaker 3: did strike me as a guy that maybe he is

519
00:23:55,160 --> 00:23:58,880
Speaker 3: a guy like a Brian Schottenheimer who might be better

520
00:24:00,080 --> 00:24:02,600
Speaker 3: suited to run a building than he actually is as

521
00:24:02,760 --> 00:24:06,520
Speaker 3: just like a pure schematic game plan caller, which I

522
00:24:06,560 --> 00:24:09,320
Speaker 3: got that feeling from Schottenheimer, and I think that's that's

523
00:24:09,320 --> 00:24:10,479
Speaker 3: been born out a little bit.

524
00:24:10,520 --> 00:24:11,880
Speaker 4: So those are some positives. Also.

525
00:24:11,960 --> 00:24:14,879
Speaker 3: Josh Allen obviously loved some Josh Allen, though texted him

526
00:24:14,880 --> 00:24:18,320
Speaker 3: they wouldn't talk during the interview process, and he texted

527
00:24:18,400 --> 00:24:20,919
Speaker 3: him afterwards what was it? It was something like, I

528
00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:23,960
Speaker 3: didn't get you this job. You earned this job yourself.

529
00:24:24,880 --> 00:24:25,359
Speaker 3: Good when you.

530
00:24:25,359 --> 00:24:28,000
Speaker 1: Got he is in Carolina earned him, not jumped it.

531
00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:30,720
Speaker 1: Theos a stunding goal in place with Josh Allen the

532
00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:31,320
Speaker 1: gun of the job.

533
00:24:31,880 --> 00:24:34,440
Speaker 3: By the way, Josh Allen, some news there he talked afterwards,

534
00:24:34,440 --> 00:24:38,120
Speaker 3: and he said he had a fifth minute tarsl broken

535
00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:42,320
Speaker 3: bone in his foot, and he played through it during

536
00:24:42,359 --> 00:24:45,600
Speaker 3: the season, but he aggravated it against the Browns, which

537
00:24:45,720 --> 00:24:47,960
Speaker 3: I think we knew, and so he was playing through

538
00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:52,120
Speaker 3: it in the playoffs and now he's recovering from that injury.

539
00:24:52,119 --> 00:24:55,640
Speaker 3: But Josh Allen's happy, and maybe Bill's fans, like Eric

540
00:24:56,080 --> 00:24:58,160
Speaker 3: Roberts behind the glass, they're happy too.

541
00:24:58,240 --> 00:25:00,000
Speaker 4: Let's take a quick break. We're going to come back.

542
00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:03,119
Speaker 3: We're going to go through the coordinator, hire some assistant hires,

543
00:25:03,160 --> 00:25:05,520
Speaker 3: and talk Belichick in the Hall of Fame after this.

544
00:25:13,520 --> 00:25:14,639
Speaker 4: Back on NFL Daily.

545
00:25:14,880 --> 00:25:21,119
Speaker 3: As I mentioned in the seventies Fahrenheit twenties, as you

546
00:25:21,280 --> 00:25:24,800
Speaker 3: guys would say, there, Alli, I'm feeling better about the

547
00:25:24,840 --> 00:25:30,199
Speaker 3: Bills move, why not help get your friends hired? I mean,

548
00:25:30,240 --> 00:25:33,320
Speaker 3: I had one full time hire that I could use

549
00:25:33,440 --> 00:25:36,160
Speaker 3: that it attended ended up being the only one at

550
00:25:36,160 --> 00:25:38,400
Speaker 3: the NFL, and I used it on my friend Chris

551
00:25:38,440 --> 00:25:40,560
Speaker 3: Wesley and it was the best empire I ever had.

552
00:25:41,080 --> 00:25:43,800
Speaker 1: You know what you're can yeah, and you can trust

553
00:25:43,880 --> 00:25:45,600
Speaker 1: them and they don't go running to the heed you're

554
00:25:45,640 --> 00:25:46,840
Speaker 1: in leak on you all the time.

555
00:25:47,119 --> 00:25:50,160
Speaker 3: You know I'm in. I'm in on Joe Brady. Now,

556
00:25:51,200 --> 00:25:53,800
Speaker 3: let's talk about some of the coordinators. Although I do

557
00:25:53,920 --> 00:25:57,760
Speaker 3: want to at some point get what Allie teasingly said,

558
00:25:57,840 --> 00:26:00,400
Speaker 3: he can't even say what his real thoughts were Joe

559
00:26:00,480 --> 00:26:03,119
Speaker 3: Brady or that press commerce something. There was something about

560
00:26:03,119 --> 00:26:05,199
Speaker 3: that press commence that you're holding out on me.

561
00:26:05,640 --> 00:26:08,000
Speaker 1: That that'll be when we do NFL Daily after Duck

562
00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:09,919
Speaker 1: and we're like full five pints deep, and then we

563
00:26:09,920 --> 00:26:12,600
Speaker 1: can't release all the Joe Brady tapes. That's the show.

564
00:26:12,640 --> 00:26:14,880
Speaker 1: We're the outsiders. We don't we don't need to worry

565
00:26:14,920 --> 00:26:16,720
Speaker 1: about what they're going to say about us. We can

566
00:26:16,920 --> 00:26:19,199
Speaker 1: bury Brian Dable if we want, but there's really no

567
00:26:19,280 --> 00:26:22,160
Speaker 1: reason too. I think he's a good offensive coordinator higher

568
00:26:22,520 --> 00:26:25,480
Speaker 1: for the Tennessee Titans. When we last talked about this,

569
00:26:26,119 --> 00:26:28,840
Speaker 1: it was not for certainty. He was still up for

570
00:26:28,880 --> 00:26:30,760
Speaker 1: a couple other jobs, so we said, let's table that

571
00:26:30,880 --> 00:26:34,280
Speaker 1: until it's actually happening. He's also going to bring his

572
00:26:34,400 --> 00:26:37,960
Speaker 1: offensive line coach from New York with him to Tennessee.

573
00:26:38,080 --> 00:26:40,840
Speaker 1: Has some talent to work with up front.

574
00:26:41,000 --> 00:26:43,399
Speaker 3: Ultimately, if you kind of look at the teams in

575
00:26:43,440 --> 00:26:47,879
Speaker 3: the trickiest situations coming into the offseason. I get the

576
00:26:47,920 --> 00:26:51,439
Speaker 3: idea that Titans fans would have a lot of optimism

577
00:26:51,720 --> 00:26:55,840
Speaker 3: of Robert Sala Brian Dable. The front office is a

578
00:26:55,840 --> 00:26:59,400
Speaker 3: little more clear with Borgonzi is now in charge. How

579
00:26:59,400 --> 00:27:02,400
Speaker 3: are you feeling about the Titans overall and especially day

580
00:27:02,400 --> 00:27:04,560
Speaker 3: Ball and cam Ward mixing and matching.

581
00:27:04,960 --> 00:27:07,359
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't love the fit with cam Ward. I

582
00:27:07,359 --> 00:27:09,720
Speaker 1: think it's almost too on the nose too obviously pair

583
00:27:09,800 --> 00:27:12,679
Speaker 1: kind of big name coordinator with former first round draft pick.

584
00:27:12,720 --> 00:27:14,800
Speaker 1: But for the actual development of what does cam Ward

585
00:27:14,880 --> 00:27:16,359
Speaker 1: need in his game, I don't think it's going to

586
00:27:16,400 --> 00:27:19,080
Speaker 1: be that additive to what he does. Brian Abell come in,

587
00:27:19,119 --> 00:27:22,000
Speaker 1: it'll be a super spread offense, a lot of easy buckets,

588
00:27:22,000 --> 00:27:24,680
Speaker 1: a lot of kind of spread option principles, similar to

589
00:27:24,760 --> 00:27:27,200
Speaker 1: the final Embers of the time with Josh Allen, where

590
00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:29,600
Speaker 1: it's all super spread stuff. We already know cam Wall

591
00:27:29,640 --> 00:27:31,439
Speaker 1: can do that stuff. That's what he did in college,

592
00:27:31,480 --> 00:27:33,560
Speaker 1: That's what he made it, and that's where he flashed

593
00:27:33,560 --> 00:27:36,159
Speaker 1: and had all the crazy highlight throws of the Titans

594
00:27:36,240 --> 00:27:38,760
Speaker 1: last season. He needs to develop in a full field,

595
00:27:38,840 --> 00:27:41,600
Speaker 1: true professional offense, and I just don't think Brian Dabole

596
00:27:42,000 --> 00:27:44,480
Speaker 1: is as willing or interested in running a full field

597
00:27:44,480 --> 00:27:47,760
Speaker 1: professional offense anymore. A lot of under center, turn the back,

598
00:27:47,800 --> 00:27:51,440
Speaker 1: play action, heaviest sets, trying to design mismatches that way,

599
00:27:51,600 --> 00:27:54,360
Speaker 1: sprinkling in tempo with bigger sets. It's still a bit

600
00:27:54,840 --> 00:27:58,600
Speaker 1: slimmed down, a little twenty sixteen, I would say, by

601
00:27:58,640 --> 00:28:00,680
Speaker 1: its logic. And so I think what will happen is

602
00:28:00,720 --> 00:28:03,720
Speaker 1: Campbell will put up some solid numbers and people say

603
00:28:03,760 --> 00:28:05,439
Speaker 1: it's a good high, but how does it get us

604
00:28:05,480 --> 00:28:08,000
Speaker 1: to being a team that could really challenge someone and

605
00:28:08,480 --> 00:28:12,000
Speaker 1: freak out playoff caliber defenses. I just don't think that

606
00:28:12,040 --> 00:28:14,680
Speaker 1: fits that Unlessdabel wants to evolve, and coaches can always

607
00:28:14,720 --> 00:28:17,000
Speaker 1: evolve an out in fresh ideas. And I love Brian

608
00:28:17,040 --> 00:28:18,639
Speaker 1: Dable as a guy, even though I know he's a

609
00:28:19,080 --> 00:28:21,200
Speaker 1: unique kind of guy and he's not everyone's flavor. He's

610
00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:24,040
Speaker 1: my kind of guy, and I just don't for me,

611
00:28:24,200 --> 00:28:26,800
Speaker 1: it's leaning into the bad habits of Camwell more than

612
00:28:26,920 --> 00:28:28,400
Speaker 1: is trying to progress and develop the player.

613
00:28:28,960 --> 00:28:31,000
Speaker 3: Okay, I'll make the argument on the other side, what

614
00:28:31,160 --> 00:28:32,800
Speaker 3: if he is a little bit and this is a

615
00:28:32,840 --> 00:28:38,560
Speaker 3: bad example, because look, Greg Roman is an epithet to

616
00:28:39,520 --> 00:28:42,360
Speaker 3: some Ravens fans and especially Patrick Clay. I'm thinking about

617
00:28:42,440 --> 00:28:45,320
Speaker 3: Lamar Jackson era, but may maybe what if he's almost

618
00:28:45,400 --> 00:28:49,800
Speaker 3: like a similar analog to Well, he'll juice him up

619
00:28:49,840 --> 00:28:53,280
Speaker 3: in what he does really well for now and he's

620
00:28:53,320 --> 00:28:55,440
Speaker 3: not as long he maybe he doesn't wind up being

621
00:28:55,560 --> 00:28:58,120
Speaker 3: his long term guy. You just got to find your

622
00:28:58,560 --> 00:29:01,760
Speaker 3: I guess Todd Monkin in this scenario, maybe sooner than

623
00:29:01,800 --> 00:29:02,640
Speaker 3: the Ravens did.

624
00:29:02,880 --> 00:29:05,560
Speaker 1: But that would need to include some kind of development

625
00:29:05,680 --> 00:29:07,320
Speaker 1: path before you get to the next guy. And I

626
00:29:07,400 --> 00:29:09,920
Speaker 1: find that to be deeply insulting to Lamar Jackson, who

627
00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:13,080
Speaker 1: played in a pure progression offense in college football. That

628
00:29:13,160 --> 00:29:15,760
Speaker 1: was an NFL passing system from Petrino, which is not

629
00:29:15,920 --> 00:29:17,760
Speaker 1: what Camwell played. And he played in an all out

630
00:29:17,760 --> 00:29:19,400
Speaker 1: air raid offense. You see one side of the field,

631
00:29:19,440 --> 00:29:21,480
Speaker 1: you throw at one side the field. Brian Dabele is

632
00:29:21,520 --> 00:29:24,720
Speaker 1: still running the highest volume off just half field read

633
00:29:24,800 --> 00:29:27,360
Speaker 1: offense in the NFL. You just can't play that way

634
00:29:27,440 --> 00:29:29,680
Speaker 1: anymore when everyone's moving and rotating and rolling and you

635
00:29:29,680 --> 00:29:31,400
Speaker 1: can't figure out what anyone's doing. I mean, these guys

636
00:29:31,440 --> 00:29:34,080
Speaker 1: are done press conference after press conference right talking about

637
00:29:34,120 --> 00:29:36,200
Speaker 1: this very issue of going to a full progression read

638
00:29:36,280 --> 00:29:38,880
Speaker 1: type offense. That's not the way Dable sees things. He

639
00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:41,400
Speaker 1: wants to have a keen, critical eye on. He knows

640
00:29:41,400 --> 00:29:43,160
Speaker 1: where the ball is going, get the snap. It's control

641
00:29:43,200 --> 00:29:45,960
Speaker 1: freak type stuff and trying to limit any exposure to

642
00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:48,080
Speaker 1: the quarterback. And I think Camwarard will look good in that.

643
00:29:48,440 --> 00:29:50,120
Speaker 1: I'm not saying it's not going to work where you

644
00:29:50,200 --> 00:29:52,200
Speaker 1: get the touchdowns in the yardage and the numbers look

645
00:29:52,280 --> 00:29:54,240
Speaker 1: much better in year two. I'm talking about the development

646
00:29:54,240 --> 00:29:55,680
Speaker 1: of the player to go and be maybe more on

647
00:29:55,760 --> 00:29:57,480
Speaker 1: the top eight players in the league, which I think

648
00:29:57,520 --> 00:29:59,640
Speaker 1: he has truly the potential to do. If you can

649
00:30:00,000 --> 00:30:02,240
Speaker 1: going in on some of the rhythm bas parts of

650
00:30:02,320 --> 00:30:04,720
Speaker 1: his game, make him more consistent throw it, and then

651
00:30:04,840 --> 00:30:08,200
Speaker 1: build in the kind of upside highlight real stuff. The

652
00:30:08,360 --> 00:30:11,160
Speaker 1: development path should be what Kaylen Williams did with Ben Johnson,

653
00:30:11,200 --> 00:30:13,760
Speaker 1: where you get all the structured greatness and then you

654
00:30:13,840 --> 00:30:17,160
Speaker 1: can have some free lunch responsibilities within that Jared Goff

655
00:30:17,240 --> 00:30:19,360
Speaker 1: style offense. And that's where I believe they should have looked.

656
00:30:19,720 --> 00:30:23,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's all fair, and it's a good point on

657
00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:26,800
Speaker 3: where Lamar was. It's more the idea of well, can

658
00:30:27,320 --> 00:30:31,200
Speaker 3: he supercharge him for my own enjoyment because for everything

659
00:30:31,560 --> 00:30:35,240
Speaker 3: that Greg Roman gets picked on, that Lamar, that early

660
00:30:35,360 --> 00:30:37,920
Speaker 3: lamar Greg Roman. You know, for the first like eighteen

661
00:30:37,960 --> 00:30:39,480
Speaker 3: months of it was fun to watch, and I do

662
00:30:39,600 --> 00:30:41,320
Speaker 3: think this could be fun to watch. But I hear

663
00:30:41,360 --> 00:30:44,800
Speaker 3: what you're saying on the long term growth and cam

664
00:30:44,840 --> 00:30:48,400
Speaker 3: Ward is not starting from the same spot. He still

665
00:30:48,440 --> 00:30:50,720
Speaker 3: has a lot of developing to do, so does Aaron

666
00:30:50,720 --> 00:30:52,080
Speaker 3: Glenn as a head coach. I don't know if he's

667
00:30:52,080 --> 00:30:54,080
Speaker 3: going to get the time to do it.

668
00:30:55,240 --> 00:30:57,040
Speaker 4: We've learned that, you.

669
00:30:57,080 --> 00:30:59,160
Speaker 3: Know since we last tape. Brian Duker is going to

670
00:30:59,200 --> 00:31:03,560
Speaker 3: be his defensive court. He reached out to John Gruden

671
00:31:03,680 --> 00:31:07,680
Speaker 3: as a potential offensive coordinator option, or at least was

672
00:31:07,760 --> 00:31:10,000
Speaker 3: going to be an option in terms of some part

673
00:31:10,040 --> 00:31:15,080
Speaker 3: of the offensive staff. Just a bizarre series of events.

674
00:31:15,320 --> 00:31:17,960
Speaker 3: Zach Rosenblatt did a good job kind of pointing it

675
00:31:18,000 --> 00:31:22,680
Speaker 3: out from the athletic of that. Initially, Aaron Glenn said

676
00:31:22,720 --> 00:31:25,640
Speaker 3: he's not going to call the defensive plays. They interviewed

677
00:31:25,880 --> 00:31:31,160
Speaker 3: eight different guys. Duker was not even one of those

678
00:31:31,720 --> 00:31:35,440
Speaker 3: eight guys. Wink Martindale was the favorite for the job.

679
00:31:35,520 --> 00:31:37,960
Speaker 3: I think he expected to get the job. They changed

680
00:31:38,000 --> 00:31:41,040
Speaker 3: their mind at the last second. So they've spent three

681
00:31:41,120 --> 00:31:43,440
Speaker 3: weeks on this process. Duker is even one of the

682
00:31:43,520 --> 00:31:47,000
Speaker 3: nine people interviewed. Then after Martindale blows up, they interview

683
00:31:47,120 --> 00:31:50,000
Speaker 3: him the next day and hire him that that day, basically,

684
00:31:50,200 --> 00:31:52,520
Speaker 3: And so it doesn't give you a lot of confidence

685
00:31:52,600 --> 00:31:54,600
Speaker 3: that you're firing eight or nine guys at the last

686
00:31:54,640 --> 00:31:57,280
Speaker 3: second and hiring you know, this guy. And now Aaron

687
00:31:57,320 --> 00:31:59,320
Speaker 3: Glenn is going to be calling the defensive plays and

688
00:31:59,440 --> 00:32:02,640
Speaker 3: Frank Wright is apparently the favorite for the offensive coordinator job.

689
00:32:03,080 --> 00:32:05,480
Speaker 1: It's just preposterous. I mean, what was in the pitch

690
00:32:05,560 --> 00:32:07,640
Speaker 1: deck when he got the job. He was supposed to

691
00:32:07,760 --> 00:32:11,240
Speaker 1: come and arrive to be Rah Rah Instill, a confidence

692
00:32:11,400 --> 00:32:13,760
Speaker 1: CEO type, gonna run the whole building. And what was

693
00:32:13,800 --> 00:32:17,720
Speaker 1: the blueprint? This cannot be it week Martindale and Aaron

694
00:32:17,760 --> 00:32:21,280
Speaker 1: Glenn share no commonality in defensive style zero. And you

695
00:32:21,400 --> 00:32:24,680
Speaker 1: go into negotiations post interview. Let's get into contract talks,

696
00:32:24,760 --> 00:32:26,840
Speaker 1: then pull the ripcord because you decide, well, I'm going

697
00:32:26,880 --> 00:32:29,800
Speaker 1: to call the plays and I don't understand Wink Martindale's defense,

698
00:32:30,080 --> 00:32:31,760
Speaker 1: So let me go and get my buddy and I'll

699
00:32:31,800 --> 00:32:33,840
Speaker 1: call the plays. I mean, it's almost just insulting to

700
00:32:33,880 --> 00:32:36,000
Speaker 1: the profession to do what he did to the staff

701
00:32:36,200 --> 00:32:38,560
Speaker 1: of telling everyone they're going to be back then actually

702
00:32:38,680 --> 00:32:41,920
Speaker 1: you're out late in the cycle. Just totally unprofessional to

703
00:32:42,080 --> 00:32:44,520
Speaker 1: then go to TenneT Engstrand and say, well, you can

704
00:32:44,600 --> 00:32:46,760
Speaker 1: stay on the staff, but we're gonna try and bring

705
00:32:46,840 --> 00:32:49,880
Speaker 1: John Ruden as a senior advisor to help design the offense.

706
00:32:50,160 --> 00:32:52,000
Speaker 1: You won't call the plays, and then you have to

707
00:32:52,000 --> 00:32:53,920
Speaker 1: say to the boss, well, then what will my job be?

708
00:32:54,320 --> 00:32:57,280
Speaker 1: What was my role in the building week to week? Okay, yeh,

709
00:32:57,320 --> 00:33:00,880
Speaker 1: scratch that. You're out? Then where is the logic? Where's

710
00:33:00,920 --> 00:33:03,240
Speaker 1: the thinking? And then the default ant is going to

711
00:33:03,280 --> 00:33:06,360
Speaker 1: be I'll get my buddy for the defense to carry

712
00:33:06,360 --> 00:33:08,280
Speaker 1: the bottles and I'll design everything. And then I'm going

713
00:33:08,360 --> 00:33:09,600
Speaker 1: to hire Frank Reich as the OC.

714
00:33:11,840 --> 00:33:15,760
Speaker 3: The list for the OC candidates is pretty wild. It's

715
00:33:15,840 --> 00:33:19,360
Speaker 3: Darryl Bevell, who we remember from his time in Seattle's

716
00:33:19,440 --> 00:33:24,200
Speaker 3: Ronald Curry, Greg Roman getting interviewed there Lunda Wells from

717
00:33:24,280 --> 00:33:24,880
Speaker 3: the Cowboys.

718
00:33:24,880 --> 00:33:26,840
Speaker 4: I believe he's a tight ends coach. I'm not sure.

719
00:33:28,760 --> 00:33:28,960
Speaker 1: Yeah.

720
00:33:29,120 --> 00:33:30,640
Speaker 4: It's also hard when you go back.

721
00:33:30,680 --> 00:33:33,440
Speaker 3: There's some clips going around of Glenn talking about how

722
00:33:33,480 --> 00:33:35,240
Speaker 3: it took them a while to put together the coaching

723
00:33:35,360 --> 00:33:38,480
Speaker 3: staff last year, but you had to really look hard

724
00:33:38,560 --> 00:33:40,640
Speaker 3: for the right guys, and this was supposed to be

725
00:33:40,720 --> 00:33:43,600
Speaker 3: sort of the expertise of Glenn is that he's been

726
00:33:43,680 --> 00:33:47,160
Speaker 3: in the NFL a long time and that he's going

727
00:33:47,240 --> 00:33:49,880
Speaker 3: to be great at building staff. That was one of

728
00:33:49,920 --> 00:33:52,200
Speaker 3: the best things that Dan Campbell certainly did in Detroit,

729
00:33:52,400 --> 00:33:54,440
Speaker 3: was like know the right guys to hire, and it

730
00:33:54,560 --> 00:33:57,479
Speaker 3: really feels like they're flailing and just making up as

731
00:33:57,520 --> 00:33:57,960
Speaker 3: they go along.

732
00:33:58,240 --> 00:33:59,520
Speaker 4: It's depressing if you're a.

733
00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:03,520
Speaker 1: And it now feels like chasing names to satisfy someone else,

734
00:34:03,520 --> 00:34:05,160
Speaker 1: which is where I'll give Auron Glenn a little bit

735
00:34:05,200 --> 00:34:07,040
Speaker 1: of a cushion, right that the names on the list

736
00:34:07,200 --> 00:34:09,279
Speaker 1: are names that someone you maybe isn't in contact with

737
00:34:09,320 --> 00:34:11,120
Speaker 1: the spoile at day to day, but has owned a

738
00:34:11,160 --> 00:34:13,320
Speaker 1: team for a long time, would recognize the names of

739
00:34:13,360 --> 00:34:16,360
Speaker 1: guys who were successful even a semi generation to go.

740
00:34:16,960 --> 00:34:20,360
Speaker 3: So, speaking speaking of familiar names, Patrick Graham, who's bounced

741
00:34:20,360 --> 00:34:23,400
Speaker 3: around a lot as a defensive coordinator, is going to

742
00:34:23,480 --> 00:34:27,200
Speaker 3: be the Steelers defensive coordinator. I thought it was telling

743
00:34:27,400 --> 00:34:31,160
Speaker 3: that Art Rooney and Mike McCarthy said how it was

744
00:34:31,200 --> 00:34:34,960
Speaker 3: important for them to maintain the Steeler way, which was

745
00:34:35,000 --> 00:34:37,960
Speaker 3: a three four defense they wanted to They literally were saying, like,

746
00:34:38,040 --> 00:34:40,040
Speaker 3: we want to run the same defense. It's been effective

747
00:34:40,280 --> 00:34:43,000
Speaker 3: for so long. Why do we want to change that?

748
00:34:43,160 --> 00:34:45,239
Speaker 3: And I'm thinking that was the most expensive defense in

749
00:34:45,280 --> 00:34:49,480
Speaker 3: the league and it wasn't effective this year. But Patrick

750
00:34:49,480 --> 00:34:51,680
Speaker 3: Graham can can run that system. What do you think

751
00:34:51,719 --> 00:34:53,680
Speaker 3: about hit his fit with Pittsburgh.

752
00:34:53,840 --> 00:34:55,719
Speaker 1: It's also truly not what they've run. As you know,

753
00:34:55,840 --> 00:34:58,120
Speaker 1: no one just runs one front for the entire game,

754
00:34:58,160 --> 00:34:59,840
Speaker 1: and Mike McCarthy's two smiled. And I think that was

755
00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:02,319
Speaker 1: like red meat to the local media that we're going

756
00:35:02,400 --> 00:35:04,239
Speaker 1: to maintain the steel And I think red meat for

757
00:35:04,320 --> 00:35:07,320
Speaker 1: the ownership too. Yes, I agree with that. Yes, you

758
00:35:07,440 --> 00:35:09,920
Speaker 1: probably say that in your first meeting with them and

759
00:35:09,960 --> 00:35:11,560
Speaker 1: they go, okay, put that in the tech in the

760
00:35:11,680 --> 00:35:14,359
Speaker 1: check box. He's from Pittsburgh, his dad loves the team,

761
00:35:14,440 --> 00:35:16,319
Speaker 1: he runs the three four. Great, let's hire the guy.

762
00:35:16,440 --> 00:35:19,440
Speaker 1: Let's not speak to anyone else. Patrick Gray might have

763
00:35:19,440 --> 00:35:22,120
Speaker 1: a funny relationship with because I think one off design wise,

764
00:35:22,440 --> 00:35:23,960
Speaker 1: he's as good as there is in the league. And

765
00:35:24,000 --> 00:35:26,200
Speaker 1: I've I make this point all the time, and then

766
00:35:26,280 --> 00:35:28,160
Speaker 1: Raiders fans will say to me, well, when why do

767
00:35:28,280 --> 00:35:31,120
Speaker 1: we keep getting beat over the head defensively? And I say,

768
00:35:31,200 --> 00:35:33,520
Speaker 1: great point. I maybe I'm digging through the manutter of

769
00:35:33,600 --> 00:35:35,880
Speaker 1: the game too much and not recognizing the fact they

770
00:35:35,920 --> 00:35:38,200
Speaker 1: get throttled over the head all the time. So it's

771
00:35:38,239 --> 00:35:40,680
Speaker 1: like a pressure coach in a world of pressure in

772
00:35:40,760 --> 00:35:43,520
Speaker 1: this guy's football. I really think he's an A plus

773
00:35:43,600 --> 00:35:46,800
Speaker 1: design type guy, but you cannot ignore just the general facts.

774
00:35:46,800 --> 00:35:49,000
Speaker 1: And I get they've had tons of issues throughout his

775
00:35:49,120 --> 00:35:52,360
Speaker 1: time there in Vegas, one with Pete Carroll being not

776
00:35:52,480 --> 00:35:55,279
Speaker 1: allowed to call his own defense radically transformers defense doesn't

777
00:35:55,280 --> 00:35:57,600
Speaker 1: even understand half of what's going on there in terms

778
00:35:57,600 --> 00:35:59,680
Speaker 1: of the verbiage, and then obviously just not having the

779
00:35:59,719 --> 00:36:02,160
Speaker 1: talent the plays. I think when he's had a mudicum

780
00:36:02,200 --> 00:36:06,000
Speaker 1: of talent all three levels, they've been fairly okay. This

781
00:36:06,160 --> 00:36:08,320
Speaker 1: is by far the best group he will have wont with,

782
00:36:08,400 --> 00:36:11,200
Speaker 1: And so I would have it as like a bee

783
00:36:11,280 --> 00:36:13,880
Speaker 1: higha that I think he's better than. If you just

784
00:36:14,320 --> 00:36:17,560
Speaker 1: put together a table shaw of like defensive metrics with

785
00:36:17,680 --> 00:36:19,759
Speaker 1: his groups. They won't tell the full story of what

786
00:36:19,920 --> 00:36:21,640
Speaker 1: the potential could be with him as your DC.

787
00:36:22,400 --> 00:36:25,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, he's managed to keep a DC job somewhere for

788
00:36:26,080 --> 00:36:28,719
Speaker 3: seven straight years. This will be eight Miami one year,

789
00:36:28,800 --> 00:36:31,160
Speaker 3: two for the Giants, and then four for the Raiders.

790
00:36:31,440 --> 00:36:34,320
Speaker 3: At no point did he ever have a great roster.

791
00:36:34,800 --> 00:36:37,600
Speaker 3: But at no point did he really have a good defense.

792
00:36:37,800 --> 00:36:41,040
Speaker 3: So that's like a lot that's a track record. A

793
00:36:41,120 --> 00:36:43,160
Speaker 3: lot of them were average, they weren't like, they weren't

794
00:36:43,200 --> 00:36:46,560
Speaker 3: bad with the Giants and the Dolphins. But this is

795
00:36:46,600 --> 00:36:48,680
Speaker 3: the best group. I'm interested to see it because I

796
00:36:48,680 --> 00:36:51,000
Speaker 3: think this would be a little bit of proof of concept. Okay,

797
00:36:51,040 --> 00:36:54,680
Speaker 3: here's Patrick Graham getting creative with a better group of players,

798
00:36:54,760 --> 00:36:57,520
Speaker 3: and so we shall see how that looks. The Chargers

799
00:36:58,239 --> 00:37:00,759
Speaker 3: made an interesting higher and we'll fire through these last

800
00:37:00,800 --> 00:37:03,279
Speaker 3: couple but get to the Hall of Fame. But they

801
00:37:03,360 --> 00:37:09,080
Speaker 3: hired Western Michigan defensive coordinator Chris O'Leary, And look, he

802
00:37:09,960 --> 00:37:12,040
Speaker 3: was part of this tree. He was in that building

803
00:37:12,480 --> 00:37:14,560
Speaker 3: a couple of years ago as a safety's coach. So

804
00:37:14,800 --> 00:37:16,759
Speaker 3: he's kind of doing the thing that Jesse Minter did,

805
00:37:16,880 --> 00:37:19,200
Speaker 3: like back and forth from college and then back into

806
00:37:19,239 --> 00:37:22,440
Speaker 3: the warm, loving embrace of the Harbas. But Jim Harbaugh

807
00:37:22,520 --> 00:37:24,400
Speaker 3: has a really good track record where you kind of

808
00:37:24,400 --> 00:37:25,759
Speaker 3: have to give him the benefit of the doubt of

809
00:37:25,920 --> 00:37:29,960
Speaker 3: hiring good coaches. If he has a secret sauce like that,

810
00:37:30,200 --> 00:37:31,759
Speaker 3: that has to be a big part of it.

811
00:37:32,280 --> 00:37:34,359
Speaker 1: Yeah, and what with men to back of Georgia State

812
00:37:34,640 --> 00:37:37,120
Speaker 1: eons ago, twelve years ago at this place, I just

813
00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:39,200
Speaker 1: fascinated by in this May Bowl, the Nationalowans. But this

814
00:37:39,360 --> 00:37:41,960
Speaker 1: kind of lend lease program that the Hallballs that developed

815
00:37:42,000 --> 00:37:45,240
Speaker 1: between college and the pros. And I think coach development

816
00:37:45,400 --> 00:37:48,040
Speaker 1: is rarely of a discussed it's always played development. And

817
00:37:48,640 --> 00:37:51,440
Speaker 1: we now are in an araway. What's the most recent

818
00:37:51,560 --> 00:37:53,840
Speaker 1: OC all the longest tenured OC in the league is

819
00:37:53,880 --> 00:37:56,160
Speaker 1: like what twenty twenty four, twenty twenty three, something like that.

820
00:37:57,160 --> 00:37:59,160
Speaker 1: So you have to have a development program for the

821
00:37:59,200 --> 00:38:02,799
Speaker 1: coaches and them say, well, you're a really talented safeties coach.

822
00:38:02,880 --> 00:38:04,560
Speaker 1: We want you to prepare it to cold plays. We

823
00:38:04,680 --> 00:38:07,040
Speaker 1: only have three preseason games, but maybe we give you

824
00:38:07,080 --> 00:38:09,320
Speaker 1: a couple of series go back down to college for

825
00:38:09,440 --> 00:38:11,719
Speaker 1: you go and get that skill set, then come back

826
00:38:11,760 --> 00:38:14,279
Speaker 1: to us. And it's kind of predetermined going in and

827
00:38:14,440 --> 00:38:17,800
Speaker 1: doing that for him Baltimore with Michigan. Hubble replicating that

828
00:38:17,960 --> 00:38:19,800
Speaker 1: going over to LA I think it's really fascinating the

829
00:38:19,840 --> 00:38:22,400
Speaker 1: way they've hit on a market inefficiency. I think that

830
00:38:22,440 --> 00:38:24,759
Speaker 1: I'm surprised that the teams haven't just said, Alabama will

831
00:38:24,760 --> 00:38:26,839
Speaker 1: be off feed a team, let's send three staff members there, aye,

832
00:38:26,880 --> 00:38:28,280
Speaker 1: and then call them back up to the big leagues.

833
00:38:28,640 --> 00:38:30,680
Speaker 3: Well, I think that was a huge part of Belichick's

834
00:38:30,680 --> 00:38:33,279
Speaker 3: success back in the day, which is why again I

835
00:38:33,320 --> 00:38:35,400
Speaker 3: think it's a young man's game. Is he was so

836
00:38:35,520 --> 00:38:38,799
Speaker 3: good at developing coaches. He had a very specific idea

837
00:38:38,840 --> 00:38:40,919
Speaker 3: of how he was going to develop coaches. That can't

838
00:38:41,000 --> 00:38:43,720
Speaker 3: last forever. But this is kind of a new school

839
00:38:43,760 --> 00:38:45,839
Speaker 3: way to do it. Wait, this is not the directional

840
00:38:46,480 --> 00:38:49,279
Speaker 3: Michigan University or college that.

841
00:38:49,320 --> 00:38:52,160
Speaker 4: You worked for. Is it the Michigan it is?

842
00:38:52,239 --> 00:38:53,239
Speaker 1: Indeed it is.

843
00:38:53,440 --> 00:38:56,920
Speaker 4: Yeah, it is. Oh, so he's your guy? You do

844
00:38:57,000 --> 00:38:57,680
Speaker 4: you do you have?

845
00:38:58,000 --> 00:38:59,880
Speaker 3: I mean, okay, so we should get excited about Chris

846
00:39:00,120 --> 00:39:02,319
Speaker 3: Leary from Western Michigan. I should I should have known

847
00:39:02,320 --> 00:39:04,280
Speaker 3: that's where Ali was once on staff.

848
00:39:04,400 --> 00:39:04,960
Speaker 4: Is that correct?

849
00:39:05,239 --> 00:39:06,200
Speaker 1: That is that is correct?

850
00:39:06,760 --> 00:39:07,000
Speaker 4: Wow?

851
00:39:07,360 --> 00:39:10,839
Speaker 3: All right, shout out to what's the nickname of the team,

852
00:39:10,880 --> 00:39:14,239
Speaker 3: the Western Michigan, the Broncos. The Broncos. All right, let's

853
00:39:14,239 --> 00:39:17,640
Speaker 3: go Broncos. Speaking of which, Wow, that was not on purpose.

854
00:39:17,680 --> 00:39:21,319
Speaker 3: What a transition. I thought it was fascinating that Bo

855
00:39:21,600 --> 00:39:23,520
Speaker 3: Nicks I just had to get this into the show,

856
00:39:24,040 --> 00:39:25,760
Speaker 3: called his own press conference.

857
00:39:26,280 --> 00:39:26,920
Speaker 4: This week.

858
00:39:28,400 --> 00:39:31,719
Speaker 3: We find out that the Broncos fired Joe Lombardi. By

859
00:39:31,760 --> 00:39:34,360
Speaker 3: the way, so he's gone. We can talk about that

860
00:39:34,600 --> 00:39:36,279
Speaker 3: for a second, but I do want to say that

861
00:39:36,360 --> 00:39:40,920
Speaker 3: Bo Nicks calling his own press conference to directly contradict

862
00:39:41,040 --> 00:39:43,760
Speaker 3: his own coach means it is time for delivering results

863
00:39:43,800 --> 00:39:47,160
Speaker 3: presented by uber eats. When football makes you hungry, order

864
00:39:47,760 --> 00:39:50,600
Speaker 3: uber eats. I've never seen a quarterback do that. That

865
00:39:50,800 --> 00:39:53,680
Speaker 3: is delivering results as a leader. Let's listen to Bo

866
00:39:53,840 --> 00:39:55,200
Speaker 3: Knicks talk about his injury.

867
00:39:55,480 --> 00:40:00,400
Speaker 7: Nothing predisposed, nothing that was there originally. I might have

868
00:40:00,440 --> 00:40:04,400
Speaker 7: gotten confused. Didn't have any predisposed issues. Man, My ankles

869
00:40:04,440 --> 00:40:07,200
Speaker 7: were feeling really good. I don't think he really should

870
00:40:07,239 --> 00:40:09,640
Speaker 7: share how many surgeries I've had in the past, to

871
00:40:09,760 --> 00:40:12,239
Speaker 7: be honest with you, but because I don't, you know,

872
00:40:12,360 --> 00:40:13,440
Speaker 7: he doesn't really even know that.

873
00:40:16,920 --> 00:40:19,680
Speaker 3: I just wanted this story to not go by without

874
00:40:19,800 --> 00:40:22,040
Speaker 3: the rest of the country hearing it because Broncos fans

875
00:40:22,160 --> 00:40:24,919
Speaker 3: are all about this story for the last twenty four hours,

876
00:40:24,960 --> 00:40:26,840
Speaker 3: but it's not going to really break through. But it

877
00:40:26,960 --> 00:40:30,320
Speaker 3: really was fascinating to me that Bownicks had two points

878
00:40:30,520 --> 00:40:32,960
Speaker 3: to two bones to pick basically that he was not

879
00:40:33,080 --> 00:40:36,120
Speaker 3: predisposed to this injury, whatever that means, like that it

880
00:40:36,200 --> 00:40:37,800
Speaker 3: was some sort of chronic thing that was going to

881
00:40:37,840 --> 00:40:42,279
Speaker 3: happen regardless, and that Sean Payton shouldn't be talking about

882
00:40:42,320 --> 00:40:43,839
Speaker 3: the amount of surgeries that he had.

883
00:40:43,800 --> 00:40:44,840
Speaker 4: Back in college. Love it.

884
00:40:45,280 --> 00:40:47,880
Speaker 1: It's just classic chilling Payton. If I told you before

885
00:40:47,960 --> 00:40:50,720
Speaker 1: on siteln seeing a coach reveal too much medical information

886
00:40:50,760 --> 00:40:53,000
Speaker 1: about one of his plays, you'll first overall pick would

887
00:40:53,000 --> 00:40:53,760
Speaker 1: have been chilling Payinton.

888
00:40:54,440 --> 00:40:54,919
Speaker 4: That's fair.

889
00:40:55,040 --> 00:40:57,719
Speaker 3: Sean Payton does like to share a lot, and you

890
00:40:57,760 --> 00:40:59,360
Speaker 3: always got to think about, like, well, why did he

891
00:40:59,480 --> 00:41:02,520
Speaker 3: share it? And I think it's because he was trying

892
00:41:02,600 --> 00:41:05,520
Speaker 3: to make the case that it's not my fault. I

893
00:41:05,680 --> 00:41:08,600
Speaker 3: called him for that that run that got his ankle

894
00:41:08,680 --> 00:41:12,160
Speaker 3: broken and ruined our Super Bowl chances, which he hasn't

895
00:41:12,200 --> 00:41:14,680
Speaker 3: really taken any heat with for in the first place,

896
00:41:15,040 --> 00:41:15,640
Speaker 3: which is fine.

897
00:41:15,680 --> 00:41:16,879
Speaker 4: It's football, it's bad luck.

898
00:41:16,960 --> 00:41:20,440
Speaker 3: But maybe that was subconsciously or consciously what he was

899
00:41:20,520 --> 00:41:21,680
Speaker 3: doing by saying these things.

900
00:41:22,040 --> 00:41:24,640
Speaker 1: Even that defense is a mess because if it's predisposed,

901
00:41:24,680 --> 00:41:27,799
Speaker 1: how would you only just discover it? And then why

902
00:41:27,840 --> 00:41:30,480
Speaker 1: would you be calling so many design quotes about runs

903
00:41:30,520 --> 00:41:31,759
Speaker 1: late in the season if you believe it was a

904
00:41:31,760 --> 00:41:34,240
Speaker 1: predisposed since he could have designle. If anything, it buries

905
00:41:34,239 --> 00:41:36,800
Speaker 1: you in a deeper grave than you were trying not

906
00:41:36,880 --> 00:41:37,160
Speaker 1: to dig.

907
00:41:38,520 --> 00:41:41,280
Speaker 3: And I think it was also like a little unfortunate

908
00:41:41,320 --> 00:41:44,600
Speaker 3: because the person asking the questions about how he had

909
00:41:46,040 --> 00:41:50,359
Speaker 3: gotten three surgeries previously even got the question wrong because

910
00:41:50,400 --> 00:41:52,640
Speaker 3: Peyton had said two previous surgery. They had gotten too

911
00:41:52,680 --> 00:41:55,439
Speaker 3: previous surgeries, So it was framed a little incorrectly, which

912
00:41:55,480 --> 00:41:58,120
Speaker 3: made Peyton look even worse. I just wanted to throw

913
00:41:58,200 --> 00:42:00,760
Speaker 3: that out there for the Broncos fans who are always

914
00:42:01,160 --> 00:42:02,360
Speaker 3: getting angry about everything.

915
00:42:02,719 --> 00:42:05,360
Speaker 1: And he may have meant to be fair pre existing

916
00:42:05,440 --> 00:42:07,800
Speaker 1: some kind of handline fracture they did not know about

917
00:42:07,880 --> 00:42:09,800
Speaker 1: until they went in, but he's the way he phrased

918
00:42:09,800 --> 00:42:11,440
Speaker 1: it was like it'd been a long term thing and

919
00:42:11,520 --> 00:42:14,080
Speaker 1: the full bows haven't defended oucuzations of being injury.

920
00:42:13,800 --> 00:42:16,760
Speaker 3: Pro it's I we're maybe too far in the weeds

921
00:42:16,760 --> 00:42:19,200
Speaker 3: where we're past the point of interest for most fans.

922
00:42:19,560 --> 00:42:22,000
Speaker 3: But I got to give Sean Payton credit because they

923
00:42:22,080 --> 00:42:25,440
Speaker 3: had to. The PR staff had to have checked with

924
00:42:25,640 --> 00:42:30,080
Speaker 3: Sean Payton of like, hey, man, I know the season's over,

925
00:42:30,400 --> 00:42:33,080
Speaker 3: been over. You said goodbye yesterday, you did the press

926
00:42:33,120 --> 00:42:34,200
Speaker 3: conference yesterday.

927
00:42:34,840 --> 00:42:37,640
Speaker 4: Bo just texted us like an hour ago.

928
00:42:37,680 --> 00:42:40,000
Speaker 3: And wants to do a zoom press conference out of

929
00:42:40,440 --> 00:42:43,960
Speaker 3: nowhere that we're just going to alert our guys to

930
00:42:44,160 --> 00:42:46,560
Speaker 3: last minute. I think he's probably gonna address what you

931
00:42:46,719 --> 00:42:50,080
Speaker 3: said about his injury, like is that cool? And Sean

932
00:42:50,120 --> 00:42:52,360
Speaker 3: Pain's a yeah, whatever, just let it, let him be happy.

933
00:42:52,520 --> 00:42:55,560
Speaker 3: So I'll give I'll give Sean Payton a little credit there.

934
00:42:55,640 --> 00:42:57,319
Speaker 3: Did you have any thoughts on, by the way, him

935
00:42:58,320 --> 00:43:02,800
Speaker 3: cleaning out his off defensive staff, including his coordinator Joe Lombardi,

936
00:43:02,840 --> 00:43:06,400
Speaker 3: but a couple of the position coaches too, including Kirie Kolbert,

937
00:43:06,400 --> 00:43:09,640
Speaker 3: who was one of my favorite Dynasty League draft picks

938
00:43:09,680 --> 00:43:11,880
Speaker 3: back in like two thousand and six. I did not

939
00:43:12,040 --> 00:43:14,040
Speaker 3: know he was on that staff, but he fired a

940
00:43:14,080 --> 00:43:16,320
Speaker 3: lot of the staff right after the season, which is

941
00:43:16,400 --> 00:43:19,000
Speaker 3: interesting for a team who I thought played well on offense.

942
00:43:19,280 --> 00:43:20,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean there were maybe a play or two

943
00:43:21,000 --> 00:43:24,760
Speaker 1: away from making the Super Bowl. And then he's pretty

944
00:43:24,800 --> 00:43:27,000
Speaker 1: savage about it by clearing out guys who've been with

945
00:43:27,080 --> 00:43:29,320
Speaker 1: him a long time, and then those guys saying publicly

946
00:43:29,440 --> 00:43:30,960
Speaker 1: like I knew this was coming for a while too.

947
00:43:31,080 --> 00:43:32,759
Speaker 1: Even if we made the whole dance, I think we

948
00:43:32,800 --> 00:43:35,480
Speaker 1: would have been out. And but we do criticize guys

949
00:43:35,560 --> 00:43:37,239
Speaker 1: for all the Sean Payton this of it. And you

950
00:43:37,280 --> 00:43:40,120
Speaker 1: can think whatever you want about Sean Payton. We criticized Belichick.

951
00:43:40,160 --> 00:43:42,600
Speaker 1: We just talked about Mike McCarthy being really insular. I

952
00:43:42,640 --> 00:43:45,080
Speaker 1: think the Chiefs have beg a tad bit to insula

953
00:43:45,520 --> 00:43:48,000
Speaker 1: in the mid run of their dynasty. He's at least

954
00:43:48,040 --> 00:43:49,759
Speaker 1: saying like, Okay, I've been with these guys for a

955
00:43:49,840 --> 00:43:51,800
Speaker 1: long time. We've kind of tapped all the resources for

956
00:43:51,880 --> 00:43:54,400
Speaker 1: this part of the span of kind of the Broncos rebuild,

957
00:43:54,440 --> 00:43:57,480
Speaker 1: of bringing some competency from the building after the Hacket debacle.

958
00:43:57,760 --> 00:43:59,640
Speaker 1: Now let's maybe press along. And he's got all these

959
00:43:59,680 --> 00:44:01,960
Speaker 1: young stuff. Is that I'm sure he wants to promote

960
00:44:01,960 --> 00:44:04,839
Speaker 1: and keep in house because they're all up for jobs elsewhere.

961
00:44:04,880 --> 00:44:07,759
Speaker 3: Yeah, Davis Webb in particular has been up for head

962
00:44:07,800 --> 00:44:11,040
Speaker 3: coaching jobs. He would be a strong candidate, you would think,

963
00:44:11,120 --> 00:44:13,800
Speaker 3: to get elevated to offensive coordinators. So that could be

964
00:44:14,160 --> 00:44:16,880
Speaker 3: what Peyton is doing there. That was delivering results presented

965
00:44:16,920 --> 00:44:19,239
Speaker 3: by Uber Eats. When football makes you hungry, get game

966
00:44:19,320 --> 00:44:22,200
Speaker 3: day deals on Uber eats, the official on demand delivery

967
00:44:22,239 --> 00:44:23,800
Speaker 3: partner of the NFL.

968
00:44:24,560 --> 00:44:24,759
Speaker 4: Order.

969
00:44:25,480 --> 00:44:28,160
Speaker 3: Now, all right, let's stop right there, actually, because I

970
00:44:28,280 --> 00:44:30,080
Speaker 3: have a feeling we're going to go along on this

971
00:44:30,200 --> 00:44:32,600
Speaker 3: Hall of Fame Belichick talk. Take one more break and

972
00:44:32,760 --> 00:44:44,840
Speaker 3: we'll be back in a second. Let's get to the

973
00:44:44,920 --> 00:44:49,359
Speaker 3: main event forty five minutes in. How dare they keep

974
00:44:49,400 --> 00:44:52,680
Speaker 3: our beloved Bill Belichick out of the Hall of Fame.

975
00:44:52,840 --> 00:44:56,000
Speaker 3: I'm trying to muster the same amount of outrage that

976
00:44:56,320 --> 00:45:02,520
Speaker 3: Jimmy Johnson and really everyone around the football community has

977
00:45:02,640 --> 00:45:06,560
Speaker 3: had over the last few days. Actually, let's we can

978
00:45:06,640 --> 00:45:09,560
Speaker 3: throw up if you're watching on YouTube that the tweet

979
00:45:09,880 --> 00:45:12,759
Speaker 3: from Jimmy Johnson, which which I really enjoyed because it

980
00:45:12,960 --> 00:45:17,279
Speaker 3: was a quote tweet of a Kayami Fairbairn field goal

981
00:45:17,440 --> 00:45:20,759
Speaker 3: from three weeks ago where he cut the lead to five.

982
00:45:21,280 --> 00:45:24,200
Speaker 3: Good times, uh, and what he said was I would

983
00:45:24,239 --> 00:45:26,680
Speaker 3: bet that if the Hall of Fame voters were public,

984
00:45:27,040 --> 00:45:29,400
Speaker 3: very few of the asses that did not vote for

985
00:45:29,520 --> 00:45:34,080
Speaker 3: Bill Bill Belichick would come forward. Already some are lying

986
00:45:34,200 --> 00:45:38,080
Speaker 3: about their vote. Jimmy Johnson, what a what a great

987
00:45:38,120 --> 00:45:41,640
Speaker 3: friend to have Ali in your corner, A great friend

988
00:45:41,680 --> 00:45:43,560
Speaker 3: to have, great for us who want to be in

989
00:45:43,640 --> 00:45:45,440
Speaker 3: this camp too. And then one of the greatest to

990
00:45:45,520 --> 00:45:47,640
Speaker 3: ever do it all levels of the game jumps out

991
00:45:47,640 --> 00:45:49,120
Speaker 3: there in front of all of us and says, I'll

992
00:45:49,160 --> 00:45:52,239
Speaker 3: take the shield. Let's do this, goes out publicly and

993
00:45:52,320 --> 00:45:55,479
Speaker 3: starts taking shots of Pollion and Tony Dungee about spy

994
00:45:55,600 --> 00:45:56,239
Speaker 3: gay and why he.

995
00:45:56,360 --> 00:45:58,799
Speaker 1: Learned to do stuff that became spi gay. In Bill

996
00:45:58,840 --> 00:46:01,320
Speaker 1: Belichick's era, loved that, love him, but in names to it,

997
00:46:02,040 --> 00:46:04,880
Speaker 1: I mean, it's just deeply insulting. I think everyone knows that.

998
00:46:05,719 --> 00:46:08,360
Speaker 1: Clearly a massive mess up in terms of the process,

999
00:46:08,520 --> 00:46:11,680
Speaker 1: in terms of maybe some bias, whether it's media members

1000
00:46:11,760 --> 00:46:14,880
Speaker 1: or people who competed against Bill Belichick. He's so clearly

1001
00:46:14,960 --> 00:46:17,400
Speaker 1: not just the slam dunk first ballot Hall of Famer.

1002
00:46:17,480 --> 00:46:20,320
Speaker 1: He's on the mount rushmorev greatest coaches to ever do

1003
00:46:20,440 --> 00:46:23,520
Speaker 1: at any level of the sport, and it really does

1004
00:46:23,640 --> 00:46:25,319
Speaker 1: hurt me for him. Now, I do think your point

1005
00:46:25,360 --> 00:46:27,600
Speaker 1: that you've made before on social media about the pr

1006
00:46:27,760 --> 00:46:30,279
Speaker 1: for him is a great point. But what does hurt

1007
00:46:30,320 --> 00:46:32,400
Speaker 1: me is how much he's obsessed with the history of

1008
00:46:32,480 --> 00:46:34,680
Speaker 1: the game and how much it will bother him. No

1009
00:46:34,800 --> 00:46:37,200
Speaker 1: one cares more that when they did the NFL one

1010
00:46:37,320 --> 00:46:39,760
Speaker 1: hundred series on NFL films and he's just like weeping

1011
00:46:39,800 --> 00:46:42,239
Speaker 1: about the wing team the nineteen twenties and those great

1012
00:46:42,320 --> 00:46:45,200
Speaker 1: Yale teams. It means so much to him, and so

1013
00:46:45,400 --> 00:46:49,400
Speaker 1: to not have that happen for whatever reason, whether it's politics, craft,

1014
00:46:49,520 --> 00:46:52,560
Speaker 1: whatever the conspiracies are, it does hurt me for him

1015
00:46:52,800 --> 00:46:54,919
Speaker 1: that there's always going to be this little buffer even

1016
00:46:54,960 --> 00:46:56,839
Speaker 1: when he goes in that it may be a little

1017
00:46:56,840 --> 00:46:57,320
Speaker 1: bit awkward.

1018
00:46:58,320 --> 00:47:00,279
Speaker 3: Yes, they hit him where it hurts in the end,

1019
00:47:00,400 --> 00:47:02,839
Speaker 3: and I agree. I wanted to make that point as

1020
00:47:03,040 --> 00:47:06,600
Speaker 3: part of like a tweet that used every single character.

1021
00:47:06,680 --> 00:47:08,879
Speaker 3: I was like, something had to go that got cut out.

1022
00:47:09,040 --> 00:47:12,200
Speaker 3: Was kind of like, this will hurt him in a

1023
00:47:12,280 --> 00:47:14,799
Speaker 3: way that I don't know if it's intentional. I think

1024
00:47:14,800 --> 00:47:17,799
Speaker 3: a lot of the reasons that people put out there

1025
00:47:19,400 --> 00:47:21,279
Speaker 3: could be part of it. In terms of him not

1026
00:47:21,400 --> 00:47:23,960
Speaker 3: being friendly with the media. But I do think it

1027
00:47:24,120 --> 00:47:28,240
Speaker 3: was more of a combination of yes, like a handful

1028
00:47:28,320 --> 00:47:30,040
Speaker 3: of people maybe on there that had a little bit

1029
00:47:30,040 --> 00:47:33,200
Speaker 3: of an anti Belichick bias. Bill Polian says that the

1030
00:47:33,400 --> 00:47:38,600
Speaker 3: NFL Hall of Fame has confirmed to him that he

1031
00:47:38,800 --> 00:47:43,640
Speaker 3: did vote for Belichick, after saying he wasn't sure he

1032
00:47:43,719 --> 00:47:46,560
Speaker 3: didn't remember if he voted for Belichick initially, to which

1033
00:47:46,600 --> 00:47:49,120
Speaker 3: I would say, and this is my bigger issue with

1034
00:47:49,200 --> 00:47:52,200
Speaker 3: the whole process is if you can't remember your vote

1035
00:47:52,239 --> 00:47:54,719
Speaker 3: two weeks later, you shouldn't have a vote. And I

1036
00:47:54,880 --> 00:48:00,279
Speaker 3: just think there's too many people with these vot votes

1037
00:48:00,480 --> 00:48:06,040
Speaker 3: that no longer cover the league. And I think there

1038
00:48:06,120 --> 00:48:09,960
Speaker 3: can be some voters that could be represented that way,

1039
00:48:10,239 --> 00:48:12,279
Speaker 3: but I think you got to have more diversity. And

1040
00:48:12,400 --> 00:48:17,680
Speaker 3: sometimes diversity isn't just having people of different color and gender,

1041
00:48:17,800 --> 00:48:21,880
Speaker 3: which this list could absolutely use more of, but also

1042
00:48:22,080 --> 00:48:25,160
Speaker 3: of different ways of thinking about the sport and different

1043
00:48:25,600 --> 00:48:29,200
Speaker 3: age groups. Like, yes, you should have covered the league

1044
00:48:29,280 --> 00:48:31,239
Speaker 3: for a good amount of time before you're a Hall

1045
00:48:31,239 --> 00:48:34,360
Speaker 3: of Fame voter. But I went through the list and

1046
00:48:35,920 --> 00:48:40,120
Speaker 3: it's pretty random. Fifteen selectors are not even really in

1047
00:48:40,200 --> 00:48:43,040
Speaker 3: the mix. Covering football now fifteen out of fifty and

1048
00:48:43,239 --> 00:48:49,360
Speaker 3: many more if you were choosing a journalist to represent

1049
00:48:49,520 --> 00:48:53,800
Speaker 3: that city, there's some there's some weird, weird picks.

1050
00:48:54,080 --> 00:48:56,800
Speaker 1: They just say as it is. It's pathetic and embarrassing.

1051
00:48:56,840 --> 00:48:59,640
Speaker 1: They have a lot of opinion columnists who've not coverd

1052
00:48:59,680 --> 00:49:02,320
Speaker 1: the spall for a long time doing it, and it

1053
00:49:02,440 --> 00:49:05,080
Speaker 1: really should be people who are dedicated to the history

1054
00:49:05,120 --> 00:49:07,279
Speaker 1: of the game. It doesn't matter what age they are

1055
00:49:07,440 --> 00:49:09,120
Speaker 1: in that respect. To me, I do think you do

1056
00:49:09,239 --> 00:49:11,319
Speaker 1: have to have a real selection of people on there

1057
00:49:11,400 --> 00:49:13,359
Speaker 1: on the older side, just because when you get into

1058
00:49:13,360 --> 00:49:14,960
Speaker 1: the veterans community, it's gonna be a lot of young

1059
00:49:15,080 --> 00:49:18,320
Speaker 1: people even around your age, Greg, who maybe will not

1060
00:49:18,320 --> 00:49:19,960
Speaker 1: have seen these players play in their prime. So I

1061
00:49:20,040 --> 00:49:22,600
Speaker 1: totally understand that side of things, but it needs to

1062
00:49:22,640 --> 00:49:25,040
Speaker 1: be someone were's is not unfortunately here with us. But

1063
00:49:25,280 --> 00:49:27,520
Speaker 1: that is the ideal candidate of someone who is so

1064
00:49:27,760 --> 00:49:31,839
Speaker 1: dedicated to learning and understanding the history of the game,

1065
00:49:31,920 --> 00:49:34,840
Speaker 1: would have real opinions, would go to bat for people,

1066
00:49:35,800 --> 00:49:38,080
Speaker 1: and that is the kind of person that you're ideally

1067
00:49:38,160 --> 00:49:40,960
Speaker 1: looking for. And does it matter that you have to

1068
00:49:40,960 --> 00:49:43,400
Speaker 1: have one representative of covering every single team I mean

1069
00:49:43,640 --> 00:49:45,879
Speaker 1: that to me almost doesn't make sense that if you're

1070
00:49:45,880 --> 00:49:48,439
Speaker 1: going into the Veterans Committee, I'd rather just have people

1071
00:49:48,480 --> 00:49:50,960
Speaker 1: who are historians of the game, really care about it,

1072
00:49:51,040 --> 00:49:54,280
Speaker 1: still actively follow it day to day. To have opinion

1073
00:49:54,360 --> 00:49:56,800
Speaker 1: colonists from the early two thousands who don't like Belichick

1074
00:49:56,800 --> 00:49:58,960
Speaker 1: because they were Team Tom all the way through is

1075
00:49:59,120 --> 00:50:03,040
Speaker 1: utterly bizarre. To have people not recuse themselves because they

1076
00:50:03,080 --> 00:50:05,040
Speaker 1: were getting their as kicked by Bill Belichick year after

1077
00:50:05,160 --> 00:50:06,600
Speaker 1: years they had to go and change all the rules

1078
00:50:06,960 --> 00:50:09,840
Speaker 1: that way, or cry about some cheating scandal that didn't exist.

1079
00:50:10,360 --> 00:50:12,760
Speaker 1: I just find it completely baffling. And even the process

1080
00:50:12,840 --> 00:50:14,960
Speaker 1: of well, there's five people up for it, you only

1081
00:50:15,040 --> 00:50:16,799
Speaker 1: get to pick three. So now you get this weird

1082
00:50:16,840 --> 00:50:19,080
Speaker 1: situation where you've got the people who don't cover the

1083
00:50:19,120 --> 00:50:21,279
Speaker 1: sport have a gripe with Bill personally, the people who

1084
00:50:21,320 --> 00:50:23,439
Speaker 1: competed against them and may have a cribe. Then people

1085
00:50:23,520 --> 00:50:25,960
Speaker 1: trying to kind of work their votes around to make

1086
00:50:26,000 --> 00:50:28,399
Speaker 1: sure someone they like get in because they think Bill

1087
00:50:28,440 --> 00:50:30,080
Speaker 1: Belichick is going to have enough votes to get in.

1088
00:50:30,440 --> 00:50:33,160
Speaker 1: Is how you get yourselves into this complete debacle. And

1089
00:50:33,600 --> 00:50:35,680
Speaker 1: it's just not what the Hall is supposed to be.

1090
00:50:35,719 --> 00:50:37,880
Speaker 1: About either the physical Hall of Canton or just the

1091
00:50:37,920 --> 00:50:40,320
Speaker 1: Hall in general should be much more than that. And

1092
00:50:40,400 --> 00:50:42,680
Speaker 1: they've let the great institution down.

1093
00:50:42,760 --> 00:50:45,080
Speaker 4: Greg Yeah, and do they know ball like?

1094
00:50:45,160 --> 00:50:48,200
Speaker 3: I think that'sould be part Like if it's gonna be

1095
00:50:48,320 --> 00:50:49,880
Speaker 3: the Hall of Fame, I think you got to have

1096
00:50:50,040 --> 00:50:54,759
Speaker 3: the best of the best. And maybe that a lot

1097
00:50:54,840 --> 00:50:57,279
Speaker 3: of them were better candidates at different points of their

1098
00:50:57,320 --> 00:51:00,600
Speaker 3: current but maybe not. Some of them are not really

1099
00:51:00,719 --> 00:51:03,560
Speaker 3: locked into the NFL as their main thing. For instance,

1100
00:51:03,640 --> 00:51:09,120
Speaker 3: Kansas City Star columnist Vahi Gregorian wrote a column about

1101
00:51:09,400 --> 00:51:13,600
Speaker 3: why Belichick didn't get his vote, which I appreciated because

1102
00:51:13,640 --> 00:51:15,880
Speaker 3: at least it gave the thought process. I don't agree

1103
00:51:15,960 --> 00:51:19,080
Speaker 3: with his thought process at all. It alluded to what

1104
00:51:19,440 --> 00:51:21,920
Speaker 3: you're just talking about. He wanted to get the veterans in.

1105
00:51:22,080 --> 00:51:24,640
Speaker 3: So to explain it to the listeners, you have the

1106
00:51:24,760 --> 00:51:28,800
Speaker 3: modern era candidates, and there's fifteen finalists and five of

1107
00:51:28,880 --> 00:51:33,160
Speaker 3: those maximum can get in. And then you have the

1108
00:51:33,400 --> 00:51:38,560
Speaker 3: Veterans Committee candidates, and as you said, there's five potential

1109
00:51:38,680 --> 00:51:40,080
Speaker 3: people that could have been.

1110
00:51:41,440 --> 00:51:42,120
Speaker 4: Put onto the list.

1111
00:51:42,200 --> 00:51:44,879
Speaker 3: They were the finalists essentially, but there's they're in three

1112
00:51:44,960 --> 00:51:50,040
Speaker 3: different buckets, three x players. One quote contributor and one

1113
00:51:50,400 --> 00:51:55,239
Speaker 3: former coach, and so those five men are competing for

1114
00:51:55,680 --> 00:51:58,920
Speaker 3: the same three spots. On top of that, they changed

1115
00:51:58,960 --> 00:52:01,560
Speaker 3: the way all this was changed a couple of years ago,

1116
00:52:02,000 --> 00:52:05,000
Speaker 3: where once you get to that part of the proceedings,

1117
00:52:05,719 --> 00:52:10,400
Speaker 3: you need an eighty percent approval to get in, and

1118
00:52:10,520 --> 00:52:11,879
Speaker 3: so do the math.

1119
00:52:12,320 --> 00:52:13,680
Speaker 4: It's really hard to do if.

1120
00:52:13,600 --> 00:52:15,960
Speaker 3: People are splitting their votes and you can only vote

1121
00:52:16,040 --> 00:52:19,000
Speaker 3: for three And it turned out last year that we

1122
00:52:19,160 --> 00:52:21,759
Speaker 3: just had a way smaller Hall of Fame class than ever.

1123
00:52:22,120 --> 00:52:26,560
Speaker 3: We didn't have as many of the ex veterans Committee

1124
00:52:26,560 --> 00:52:30,160
Speaker 3: players or coach Mike Shanahan's still waiting, and it created

1125
00:52:30,160 --> 00:52:32,320
Speaker 3: a situation where just like less people are coming in.

1126
00:52:32,520 --> 00:52:35,800
Speaker 3: So all of that can be true that they absolutely

1127
00:52:35,840 --> 00:52:38,120
Speaker 3: need to change the bylaws and the way that they

1128
00:52:38,840 --> 00:52:41,600
Speaker 3: decided to change it a couple of years ago when

1129
00:52:41,640 --> 00:52:45,080
Speaker 3: they thought too many people were getting in, now to

1130
00:52:45,280 --> 00:52:49,680
Speaker 3: few were getting in. But it makes zero sense. And

1131
00:52:49,760 --> 00:52:52,440
Speaker 3: here's where I really struggle with it. It's like Ken

1132
00:52:52,520 --> 00:52:55,439
Speaker 3: Anderson never deserved to go in over Bill Belichick. There's

1133
00:52:55,600 --> 00:52:57,800
Speaker 3: no way. You always have to vote for the person

1134
00:52:58,239 --> 00:53:02,080
Speaker 3: that deserves it the most, and these three veterans, by

1135
00:53:02,200 --> 00:53:06,239
Speaker 3: definition weren't voted in for twenty five straight years. Forget

1136
00:53:06,280 --> 00:53:09,480
Speaker 3: about being first ballot, they weren't first fifteen ballots. That's

1137
00:53:09,480 --> 00:53:12,719
Speaker 3: when you come off the ballot. And of course Bill

1138
00:53:12,800 --> 00:53:15,239
Speaker 3: Belichick should be in as a no brain. We don't

1139
00:53:15,239 --> 00:53:18,239
Speaker 3: even need to like make the case for Bill Belichick.

1140
00:53:18,440 --> 00:53:23,239
Speaker 3: But it's something I've been surprised actually there is this

1141
00:53:23,400 --> 00:53:27,239
Speaker 3: much outrage about I had a bad barometer. I'm like, oh, oh,

1142
00:53:27,320 --> 00:53:30,399
Speaker 3: this is nice. Everyone's just saying everything, so I don't

1143
00:53:30,400 --> 00:53:32,560
Speaker 3: even feel like I have to. They actually are even

1144
00:53:32,640 --> 00:53:37,680
Speaker 3: more outrage for me because knowing how crazy and out

1145
00:53:37,719 --> 00:53:39,680
Speaker 3: of touch some of the voters are and how crazy

1146
00:53:39,800 --> 00:53:44,120
Speaker 3: the process is, it was still shocking to me. But

1147
00:53:44,200 --> 00:53:47,279
Speaker 3: I think it was a little less shocking or surprising

1148
00:53:47,400 --> 00:53:50,040
Speaker 3: to me than a lot of the people who aren't

1149
00:53:50,080 --> 00:53:52,920
Speaker 3: as dialed into it, and maybe that caused the outrage.

1150
00:53:52,920 --> 00:53:55,000
Speaker 3: I was just like, I can't believe they pick this up,

1151
00:53:55,520 --> 00:53:58,840
Speaker 3: but actually, like I kind of can see how it happened,

1152
00:53:58,840 --> 00:54:02,880
Speaker 3: as stupid as it is, so go for it. Jimmy

1153
00:54:02,960 --> 00:54:05,680
Speaker 3: Johnson and every single show and everything out there, like,

1154
00:54:05,800 --> 00:54:08,520
Speaker 3: I'm glad you got this one because it's it's just

1155
00:54:08,680 --> 00:54:09,799
Speaker 3: obvious how bad it is.

1156
00:54:10,239 --> 00:54:12,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, the process is a mess. To not have it

1157
00:54:12,200 --> 00:54:14,640
Speaker 1: just be yes no. Why you have to tear different

1158
00:54:14,760 --> 00:54:17,239
Speaker 1: variations of Hall of famers as you said, How you

1159
00:54:17,280 --> 00:54:19,000
Speaker 1: can even do that anyway and not wind up with

1160
00:54:19,040 --> 00:54:20,919
Speaker 1: Bill being the one on your list Across the board

1161
00:54:20,960 --> 00:54:22,960
Speaker 1: with the guys on there is a joke. But to

1162
00:54:23,040 --> 00:54:25,120
Speaker 1: not have it be yes no. To have a fifty

1163
00:54:25,200 --> 00:54:27,759
Speaker 1: person selection committee, I think is way too small, and

1164
00:54:27,920 --> 00:54:30,520
Speaker 1: to have the names they have on there is frankly embarrassing.

1165
00:54:30,800 --> 00:54:33,719
Speaker 1: You look at some of the people you've read off.

1166
00:54:34,800 --> 00:54:36,759
Speaker 1: I've covered the sport fifteen years. I've worked in the

1167
00:54:36,800 --> 00:54:39,040
Speaker 1: sport for many of those years as a coach or

1168
00:54:39,040 --> 00:54:41,040
Speaker 1: as a scout. I've not heard of some of those

1169
00:54:41,080 --> 00:54:43,719
Speaker 1: people outside of last time the list came out of

1170
00:54:43,760 --> 00:54:47,319
Speaker 1: who the voters were. They don't cover the sport actively now.

1171
00:54:47,560 --> 00:54:49,719
Speaker 1: Bill Pollion knows way more about football than we do.

1172
00:54:49,800 --> 00:54:52,320
Speaker 1: I think having someone like that on the committee should

1173
00:54:52,360 --> 00:54:54,320
Speaker 1: be there. But you should if you have a personal

1174
00:54:54,400 --> 00:54:57,640
Speaker 1: beef with someone, recruits yourself. Now with Bill Pollion, you know,

1175
00:54:58,320 --> 00:55:01,320
Speaker 1: does he have the ego to to accept he should

1176
00:55:01,320 --> 00:55:03,320
Speaker 1: recruit himself and recognize his bias. I doubt it. But

1177
00:55:03,320 --> 00:55:05,520
Speaker 1: if you have a big enough voting pool, you can

1178
00:55:05,560 --> 00:55:08,000
Speaker 1: at least mitigate some of those concerns. And I'm still

1179
00:55:08,040 --> 00:55:10,120
Speaker 1: not buying by the way Pauline is saying he can't

1180
00:55:10,160 --> 00:55:13,320
Speaker 1: remember then releasing going on serious XM and reading a

1181
00:55:13,560 --> 00:55:15,840
Speaker 1: well prepared statement that he had to read on the

1182
00:55:15,880 --> 00:55:18,000
Speaker 1: air about getting in touch with the with the Hall

1183
00:55:18,080 --> 00:55:20,080
Speaker 1: of Fame. If we're doing any sort of conspiracy theory,

1184
00:55:20,200 --> 00:55:22,319
Speaker 1: I'm guessing he confirmed the votes and never coming out

1185
00:55:22,360 --> 00:55:23,759
Speaker 1: because for some reason they're not going to release the

1186
00:55:23,800 --> 00:55:26,560
Speaker 1: ballots because they want Because it's this shrouded mystery of

1187
00:55:26,640 --> 00:55:30,480
Speaker 1: all these former columnists, opinion colonists deciding who's going to

1188
00:55:30,560 --> 00:55:32,760
Speaker 1: the Hall of Fame. Which matters, which goes on the tombstone,

1189
00:55:32,800 --> 00:55:35,480
Speaker 1: it's all about legacy, which matters for family members and

1190
00:55:35,560 --> 00:55:37,800
Speaker 1: generations about whether the guy was in or not. This

1191
00:55:37,880 --> 00:55:41,200
Speaker 1: is a voting body that will not put Mike Shanahan

1192
00:55:41,320 --> 00:55:43,600
Speaker 1: in when the rest of the league is saying, year

1193
00:55:43,640 --> 00:55:45,839
Speaker 1: after year, alls we want is a vision and version

1194
00:55:45,880 --> 00:55:47,560
Speaker 1: of Shannon and football. Does it look like he had

1195
00:55:47,560 --> 00:55:49,880
Speaker 1: an impact on the spot, does he have the hardware

1196
00:55:50,000 --> 00:55:51,799
Speaker 1: to prove he should be in there too? And yet

1197
00:55:51,800 --> 00:55:53,960
Speaker 1: the guy cannot get in Mike Holt cannot get in,

1198
00:55:54,080 --> 00:55:55,560
Speaker 1: and now Bill Belichick could not get in.

1199
00:55:56,680 --> 00:55:59,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's it's a killer, and they will, they will

1200
00:55:59,200 --> 00:56:02,759
Speaker 3: change the process. I actually sort of lost touch with it,

1201
00:56:03,440 --> 00:56:08,000
Speaker 3: and in my head they were changing the process after

1202
00:56:08,120 --> 00:56:12,399
Speaker 3: last year because they all agreed so uniformly, the people

1203
00:56:12,600 --> 00:56:15,480
Speaker 3: involved with the voting, that it was a mistake what

1204
00:56:15,640 --> 00:56:18,960
Speaker 3: happened that I thought the process had changed more.

1205
00:56:19,120 --> 00:56:20,440
Speaker 4: I don't think it changed at all.

1206
00:56:20,600 --> 00:56:25,120
Speaker 3: It will change ultimately, But and this is tricky because

1207
00:56:25,640 --> 00:56:29,080
Speaker 3: I respect a lot of the men and women, although

1208
00:56:29,160 --> 00:56:33,080
Speaker 3: obviously it's mostly men that have these votes. But I

1209
00:56:33,120 --> 00:56:37,919
Speaker 3: actually think the bigger issue is the composition of there's

1210
00:56:38,040 --> 00:56:42,480
Speaker 3: better people in each market to represent that market, and

1211
00:56:42,560 --> 00:56:46,040
Speaker 3: that it should not be a lifetime appointment, and that

1212
00:56:46,320 --> 00:56:48,640
Speaker 3: someone I guess the Hall of Fame is the people

1213
00:56:48,920 --> 00:56:51,800
Speaker 3: you know, needs to take an active role in that.

1214
00:56:52,000 --> 00:56:53,360
Speaker 4: Either it's got you either got.

1215
00:56:53,320 --> 00:56:56,520
Speaker 3: Term limits, or you just make the tough decisions because

1216
00:56:56,560 --> 00:57:00,440
Speaker 3: it's an important decision. And it's a really tough thing

1217
00:57:00,520 --> 00:57:02,360
Speaker 3: to be a Hall of Fame voter because most of

1218
00:57:02,440 --> 00:57:06,600
Speaker 3: these people didn't cover the league. They covered their team.

1219
00:57:07,040 --> 00:57:09,640
Speaker 3: And that's the other part where I think the composition

1220
00:57:09,760 --> 00:57:14,520
Speaker 3: could be less thirty two different people representing a city

1221
00:57:14,680 --> 00:57:17,200
Speaker 3: and then all these different at large and like more

1222
00:57:17,360 --> 00:57:21,520
Speaker 3: at large people because obviously there's self interest here, Like

1223
00:57:21,880 --> 00:57:24,200
Speaker 3: I'm talking about like people that cover the league, like myself,

1224
00:57:24,480 --> 00:57:27,920
Speaker 3: but I think the right national people that were covering

1225
00:57:28,000 --> 00:57:31,000
Speaker 3: the league broadly and whatever type of committee if it's

1226
00:57:31,120 --> 00:57:33,080
Speaker 3: X players, scouts, whatever, it doesn't all have to be

1227
00:57:33,200 --> 00:57:36,280
Speaker 3: media members either that are covering the league broadly, like

1228
00:57:36,440 --> 00:57:39,400
Speaker 3: of course those should be a bigger part of the

1229
00:57:39,480 --> 00:57:42,080
Speaker 3: pie than someone who is just covering the Titans.

1230
00:57:42,480 --> 00:57:46,680
Speaker 1: Like, yeah, it shouldn't be majority media members in right opinion,

1231
00:57:46,920 --> 00:57:49,120
Speaker 1: it should be historians of the game. If they're in

1232
00:57:49,200 --> 00:57:51,440
Speaker 1: the media members. It should have more of a national focus,

1233
00:57:51,480 --> 00:57:53,320
Speaker 1: because it's the whole of fame. It's not the whole.

1234
00:57:53,360 --> 00:57:55,200
Speaker 1: It's not the ring of honor, visa and team, which

1235
00:57:55,240 --> 00:57:57,720
Speaker 1: is how these guys are kind of presented from whoever

1236
00:57:57,840 --> 00:57:59,919
Speaker 1: brings them to the table. Then they put the augument open,

1237
00:58:00,000 --> 00:58:02,240
Speaker 1: they go back and forth. There should be some kind

1238
00:58:02,280 --> 00:58:05,520
Speaker 1: of weighted percentage of the current members of the Hall

1239
00:58:05,800 --> 00:58:07,240
Speaker 1: getting to have a vote to say do they want

1240
00:58:07,280 --> 00:58:08,880
Speaker 1: someone in the brotherhood or not, and you can kind

1241
00:58:08,880 --> 00:58:11,480
Speaker 1: of wait it versus the committee versus those guys too,

1242
00:58:11,520 --> 00:58:14,040
Speaker 1: which may lift someone over the top or knock someone below.

1243
00:58:14,320 --> 00:58:16,480
Speaker 1: The threshold should be really high by the way to

1244
00:58:16,520 --> 00:58:18,720
Speaker 1: get into the thing, rather than it being like the

1245
00:58:18,800 --> 00:58:21,240
Speaker 1: basketball Hall of Fame where everyone who go a single

1246
00:58:21,280 --> 00:58:24,240
Speaker 1: triple double or whatever can get in there. So and

1247
00:58:24,360 --> 00:58:26,640
Speaker 1: you cannot if you have a fifty person member body.

1248
00:58:27,320 --> 00:58:30,920
Speaker 1: How can you have Tony Dungein Bill Polline, who worked

1249
00:58:30,920 --> 00:58:33,400
Speaker 1: together during the peak of their careers on that plus

1250
00:58:33,480 --> 00:58:35,880
Speaker 1: someone represented it from the Coults, who may or may not,

1251
00:58:35,960 --> 00:58:37,760
Speaker 1: I don't know, be influenced by the fact too, the

1252
00:58:37,760 --> 00:58:40,040
Speaker 1: most famous people who ever worked for the franchise on

1253
00:58:40,200 --> 00:58:42,400
Speaker 1: that body too. So that's three people who may have

1254
00:58:42,480 --> 00:58:45,080
Speaker 1: a similar line of thinking making up that percentage of

1255
00:58:45,120 --> 00:58:46,880
Speaker 1: a fifty member body. It's just ridiculous.

1256
00:58:47,240 --> 00:58:48,760
Speaker 3: It bothers me out because some of the people I'm

1257
00:58:48,760 --> 00:58:51,640
Speaker 3: even thinking about, like I like a lot, but they're

1258
00:58:51,760 --> 00:58:55,920
Speaker 3: like covering other sports. Now, it's just like it doesn't

1259
00:58:56,160 --> 00:58:59,680
Speaker 3: it doesn't make a lot of sense. For instance, I'm

1260
00:58:59,680 --> 00:59:02,440
Speaker 3: gonna just like give an example of just what I'm

1261
00:59:02,440 --> 00:59:05,080
Speaker 3: talking about. Like they have a few at large broadcasters

1262
00:59:05,480 --> 00:59:07,680
Speaker 3: and it's like, yeah, Dan Fouts, I think made sense

1263
00:59:08,000 --> 00:59:09,920
Speaker 3: at the time, and if you wanted him as part

1264
00:59:09,960 --> 00:59:12,960
Speaker 3: of like the Veterans Committee, but it's like Greg Olsen

1265
00:59:13,440 --> 00:59:15,800
Speaker 3: would be a good person to have in there. So

1266
00:59:16,080 --> 00:59:18,400
Speaker 3: someone like if you want to have you know, someone

1267
00:59:18,440 --> 00:59:21,880
Speaker 3: that's representing broadcasting or some like that played with him.

1268
00:59:21,920 --> 00:59:24,600
Speaker 3: But it like there's there's a lot of ways that

1269
00:59:24,720 --> 00:59:27,840
Speaker 3: you could go, and uh, yeah, Belichick would obviously be

1270
00:59:27,960 --> 00:59:30,680
Speaker 3: on my my ballot. I hate the people that were

1271
00:59:30,720 --> 00:59:34,280
Speaker 3: making like the any of the arguments against them too,

1272
00:59:34,360 --> 00:59:37,560
Speaker 3: because if.

1273
00:59:36,480 --> 00:59:39,200
Speaker 1: They if they put your defensive game plan from a

1274
00:59:39,200 --> 00:59:41,040
Speaker 1: Super Bowl against the hottest offense the league I have

1275
00:59:41,040 --> 00:59:43,120
Speaker 1: ever seen at that time into the hole, why is

1276
00:59:43,160 --> 00:59:44,760
Speaker 1: the guy who designed the game plan then went on

1277
00:59:44,840 --> 00:59:46,240
Speaker 1: to win a Lombardi's not in it.

1278
00:59:46,680 --> 00:59:48,640
Speaker 3: Right, You're talking about the one he did as the

1279
00:59:48,680 --> 00:59:51,640
Speaker 3: Giants defensive coordinator, which is absolutely part of his run.

1280
00:59:51,720 --> 00:59:53,000
Speaker 4: And everyone's like, well, they didn't.

1281
00:59:53,280 --> 00:59:55,520
Speaker 3: He didn't win a Super Bowl without Brady at you know,

1282
00:59:55,680 --> 00:59:57,520
Speaker 3: like the you know, the best quarterback of all time,

1283
00:59:57,560 --> 00:59:59,240
Speaker 3: Tom Brady was not the best quarterback of all time

1284
00:59:59,440 --> 01:00:01,360
Speaker 3: between two thousand and one in two thousand and four,

1285
01:00:01,680 --> 01:00:03,760
Speaker 3: I can go back and show you all the rankings.

1286
01:00:03,840 --> 01:00:06,240
Speaker 3: No One consider him a top five quarterback. I think

1287
01:00:06,320 --> 01:00:09,480
Speaker 3: by the end of four that was maybe unfair. In fact,

1288
01:00:09,560 --> 01:00:12,440
Speaker 3: he was probably a little underrated by the end of four,

1289
01:00:12,560 --> 01:00:15,600
Speaker 3: but for one two oh three, like he was not

1290
01:00:15,760 --> 01:00:18,360
Speaker 3: that guy. They won because of the combination, and they

1291
01:00:18,360 --> 01:00:20,320
Speaker 3: won because of the combination throughout.

1292
01:00:20,680 --> 01:00:23,560
Speaker 1: Except Bill Pollion did have a first round grade on

1293
01:00:23,680 --> 01:00:25,800
Speaker 1: Tom Brady but decided not to take him, even though

1294
01:00:25,840 --> 01:00:27,680
Speaker 1: he took three centers in one draft class when he

1295
01:00:27,680 --> 01:00:29,480
Speaker 1: had Jeff Saturday. He decided not to take a first

1296
01:00:29,520 --> 01:00:31,200
Speaker 1: round quote back in any of the first six rounds

1297
01:00:31,200 --> 01:00:32,600
Speaker 1: of the draft because he had paid them money on

1298
01:00:32,640 --> 01:00:33,000
Speaker 1: his roust.

1299
01:00:33,240 --> 01:00:35,440
Speaker 3: You're reminding me of a quote that I was looking

1300
01:00:35,520 --> 01:00:37,280
Speaker 3: for as you were talking. But I wanted to really

1301
01:00:37,360 --> 01:00:40,440
Speaker 3: lock in more with the goal that Ali's spinning that

1302
01:00:40,520 --> 01:00:43,680
Speaker 3: I didn't find it where. Someone said in reference to

1303
01:00:43,760 --> 01:00:46,160
Speaker 3: this whole Bill Pollion saying that he voted for him

1304
01:00:46,680 --> 01:00:49,760
Speaker 3: was a politician quote was like, only trust people with

1305
01:00:49,840 --> 01:00:53,040
Speaker 3: their votes if they say they didn't vote against you, Like,

1306
01:00:53,280 --> 01:00:54,760
Speaker 3: never trust the person that.

1307
01:00:54,840 --> 01:00:55,880
Speaker 4: Says they voted for you.

1308
01:00:56,320 --> 01:00:59,200
Speaker 3: Was essentially the politicians vote Forget where that was from,

1309
01:00:59,280 --> 01:01:03,160
Speaker 3: But I I love that, and I do think there

1310
01:01:03,200 --> 01:01:06,280
Speaker 3: will be change, And I do think there's gonna be

1311
01:01:06,640 --> 01:01:11,200
Speaker 3: second impact effects where if Robert Kraft does get inducted,

1312
01:01:13,320 --> 01:01:16,080
Speaker 3: it's gonna cast a little bit of a pall over it,

1313
01:01:16,520 --> 01:01:20,400
Speaker 3: and Kraft is gonna have to pretend to be leading

1314
01:01:20,520 --> 01:01:23,800
Speaker 3: that charge from the stage because Belichick's gonna be there.

1315
01:01:24,480 --> 01:01:28,400
Speaker 3: Adam Venattereri is a really strong candidate this year, and

1316
01:01:28,720 --> 01:01:30,360
Speaker 3: I think he has a good chance to get in,

1317
01:01:30,480 --> 01:01:34,160
Speaker 3: So I think Belichick would be there for vinitary would

1318
01:01:34,200 --> 01:01:35,680
Speaker 3: he be there if it was just Craft?

1319
01:01:35,800 --> 01:01:36,880
Speaker 4: Maybe maybe not.

1320
01:01:37,000 --> 01:01:39,480
Speaker 3: But either way, Kraft when he makes that speech if

1321
01:01:39,520 --> 01:01:42,360
Speaker 3: he's getting in, has to make the same speech that

1322
01:01:43,280 --> 01:01:45,640
Speaker 3: all the ex patriots are gonna be making, and they

1323
01:01:45,680 --> 01:01:50,200
Speaker 3: all believe it of how much Bill Belichick was robbed.

1324
01:01:50,320 --> 01:01:53,120
Speaker 3: So it's gonna have this like second level impact where

1325
01:01:53,160 --> 01:01:55,840
Speaker 3: it actually, I think in a way is gonna be

1326
01:01:55,880 --> 01:01:58,080
Speaker 3: good for Belichick, even though it's going to really bother him.

1327
01:01:58,480 --> 01:02:00,160
Speaker 1: I think their only way out to this is an

1328
01:02:00,160 --> 01:02:02,040
Speaker 1: idea that Nick Wright but forward, which is the best

1329
01:02:02,080 --> 01:02:03,560
Speaker 1: idea they opened up. If you remember for the one

1330
01:02:03,640 --> 01:02:05,400
Speaker 1: hundred year anniversary where they just kind of went, we

1331
01:02:05,480 --> 01:02:07,840
Speaker 1: got to clear the backlog. We have a significant backlog

1332
01:02:07,920 --> 01:02:09,800
Speaker 1: here they're going to have to do that again and

1333
01:02:10,000 --> 01:02:12,880
Speaker 1: just make it a nauseating All Patriots run where you

1334
01:02:12,960 --> 01:02:15,080
Speaker 1: get Gronkin, you get everyone in all at once, you

1335
01:02:15,160 --> 01:02:17,240
Speaker 1: delay Craft for another season, and you just have six

1336
01:02:17,360 --> 01:02:19,160
Speaker 1: Pats on the stage. Nick Wright came up with this.

1337
01:02:19,240 --> 01:02:21,000
Speaker 1: I think it's the only way to spin their way

1338
01:02:21,000 --> 01:02:22,880
Speaker 1: out of this where you can then get the backlash

1339
01:02:22,920 --> 01:02:24,920
Speaker 1: to be able just being so frustrated that it's an

1340
01:02:24,920 --> 01:02:27,160
Speaker 1: All Patriots weekend. You put them on the Hall of

1341
01:02:27,240 --> 01:02:29,040
Speaker 1: Fame game, you do the whole thing, You celebrate the

1342
01:02:29,080 --> 01:02:31,400
Speaker 1: great dynasty of our time. You screen the Apple TV

1343
01:02:31,520 --> 01:02:34,200
Speaker 1: documentary where Robert Craft is dumping on Bill Belichick for

1344
01:02:34,280 --> 01:02:36,640
Speaker 1: ten hours, You do the whole shebang, and then it

1345
01:02:36,640 --> 01:02:38,680
Speaker 1: will kind of spin back around that people forget he

1346
01:02:38,840 --> 01:02:41,040
Speaker 1: was excluded from the first ballot and just be frustrated

1347
01:02:41,040 --> 01:02:42,840
Speaker 1: it to All Patriots weekend.

1348
01:02:42,920 --> 01:02:47,240
Speaker 3: Fun idea would be so loathsome for the rest of

1349
01:02:47,680 --> 01:02:51,120
Speaker 3: America to watch that weekend that I don't think it

1350
01:02:51,160 --> 01:02:54,520
Speaker 3: would you do the Hall of Fame much justice or service,

1351
01:02:54,560 --> 01:02:55,200
Speaker 3: but it would be fun.

1352
01:02:55,280 --> 01:02:57,840
Speaker 4: I support anything creative like that.

1353
01:02:58,000 --> 01:02:58,160
Speaker 1: I do.

1354
01:02:58,360 --> 01:03:01,400
Speaker 3: Also, you alluded to it earlier, but just to spell

1355
01:03:01,440 --> 01:03:03,240
Speaker 3: it out and if it wasn't obvious enough. We're going

1356
01:03:03,320 --> 01:03:06,560
Speaker 3: long on this because I do care a lot about

1357
01:03:06,560 --> 01:03:08,880
Speaker 3: the Hall of Fame process. I would love to personally

1358
01:03:08,920 --> 01:03:10,240
Speaker 3: be part of it, and I would I would take

1359
01:03:10,280 --> 01:03:15,120
Speaker 3: it seriously, like if they ever let an NFL media

1360
01:03:15,240 --> 01:03:17,440
Speaker 3: person be part of it like they now do with

1361
01:03:17,520 --> 01:03:20,640
Speaker 3: the Associated Press votes, And I care. And I kind

1362
01:03:20,680 --> 01:03:23,880
Speaker 3: of love that people are even caring about this because

1363
01:03:23,880 --> 01:03:25,360
Speaker 3: it's like, yeah, I get into this. I think this

1364
01:03:25,560 --> 01:03:29,640
Speaker 3: is stuff worth getting into. But I loved the little

1365
01:03:29,720 --> 01:03:31,560
Speaker 3: news item that you dropped earlier. But I don't know

1366
01:03:31,600 --> 01:03:34,200
Speaker 3: if the listener will kind of know the reference that

1367
01:03:34,240 --> 01:03:39,160
Speaker 3: you're talking about. Both Jimmy Johnson and Bill Cower have

1368
01:03:39,320 --> 01:03:42,400
Speaker 3: alluded to the fact that, like, oh yeah, it was

1369
01:03:42,440 --> 01:03:46,000
Speaker 3: common practice, everyone was doing the Spygate stuff, and that

1370
01:03:46,160 --> 01:03:49,480
Speaker 3: Howard Mud, the former Colts offensive line coach, he's the

1371
01:03:49,560 --> 01:03:51,600
Speaker 3: one that taught me Jack and he's the one that

1372
01:03:51,720 --> 01:03:55,080
Speaker 3: taught Jimmy Johnson how to do this. Howard Mudd eventually

1373
01:03:55,160 --> 01:03:58,200
Speaker 3: ended up working for Tony Dungee and Bill Pollian, of course,

1374
01:03:58,520 --> 01:04:01,440
Speaker 3: and that they're just now out on Front Street.

1375
01:04:01,520 --> 01:04:02,360
Speaker 4: Let's saying it publicly.

1376
01:04:02,360 --> 01:04:04,040
Speaker 3: It was like, we could have used you twenty years

1377
01:04:04,080 --> 01:04:07,280
Speaker 3: ago Jimmy and Bill just saying like, oh, everyone was

1378
01:04:07,920 --> 01:04:09,920
Speaker 3: doing spygate back in the day, but just like a

1379
01:04:10,000 --> 01:04:12,120
Speaker 3: fun little news NuGet dropped fifteen years later.

1380
01:04:12,480 --> 01:04:15,760
Speaker 1: To Cow's credit, he has been consistent. Color is like open, like,

1381
01:04:15,840 --> 01:04:17,640
Speaker 1: here is how I cheat it throughout my run. I

1382
01:04:17,720 --> 01:04:19,120
Speaker 1: don't care. I got the trophy.

1383
01:04:19,280 --> 01:04:19,760
Speaker 4: Who guess?

1384
01:04:20,400 --> 01:04:22,400
Speaker 1: And I admired that from Bill Cala. He did not

1385
01:04:22,520 --> 01:04:24,920
Speaker 1: include that the you know, his organization was pumping in

1386
01:04:25,000 --> 01:04:27,120
Speaker 1: crowd noise throughout playoff games, which may or may not

1387
01:04:27,200 --> 01:04:28,680
Speaker 1: have happened with Bill Pollion.

1388
01:04:29,800 --> 01:04:32,320
Speaker 3: That they never really beat the allegation there. Let's wrap

1389
01:04:32,440 --> 01:04:34,880
Speaker 3: up by saying, if I'm if I'm going to be critical,

1390
01:04:35,040 --> 01:04:38,000
Speaker 3: what would my ballot be? And you mentioned how they

1391
01:04:38,040 --> 01:04:41,920
Speaker 3: did kind of jam in some extra Hall of famers

1392
01:04:42,400 --> 01:04:44,720
Speaker 3: around the top one hundred a few years ago, and

1393
01:04:44,760 --> 01:04:47,040
Speaker 3: then now they're like pulling back and now they're they're

1394
01:04:47,040 --> 01:04:49,360
Speaker 3: going to have to figure it all out. I struggle

1395
01:04:49,400 --> 01:04:54,440
Speaker 3: with the Seniors Committee stuff. I don't feel as well

1396
01:04:54,560 --> 01:04:58,360
Speaker 3: positioned to have a strong opinion about it. So when

1397
01:04:58,400 --> 01:05:02,160
Speaker 3: it comes to the senior members and the contributors, Belichick

1398
01:05:02,160 --> 01:05:08,160
Speaker 3: would obviously get my vote. I'm torn on Robert Craft.

1399
01:05:10,520 --> 01:05:13,480
Speaker 3: Ken Anderson has my vote in part because of my

1400
01:05:13,640 --> 01:05:18,919
Speaker 3: conversations with Chris Westling about Ken Anderson and going through

1401
01:05:19,000 --> 01:05:21,320
Speaker 3: it and some of the bill Will Walsh quotes, and

1402
01:05:21,560 --> 01:05:23,640
Speaker 3: you're kind of giving him a little bit of credit

1403
01:05:23,680 --> 01:05:26,600
Speaker 3: for the career that he didn't have it. But I

1404
01:05:26,720 --> 01:05:30,360
Speaker 3: am all about peak, and Ken Anderson to me for

1405
01:05:30,560 --> 01:05:33,640
Speaker 3: his Peak would get my vote as a contributor. So

1406
01:05:33,720 --> 01:05:36,800
Speaker 3: Belichick and ken Anderson would be my two yeses from

1407
01:05:36,840 --> 01:05:41,360
Speaker 3: the seniors and the contributors. And I think I think

1408
01:05:41,400 --> 01:05:45,080
Speaker 3: I would split up Craft. I'm not I'm not sure

1409
01:05:45,400 --> 01:05:47,000
Speaker 3: what do you think on Craft.

1410
01:05:47,640 --> 01:05:50,280
Speaker 1: I just don't think I'm pro Ona's going in yes

1411
01:05:50,560 --> 01:05:54,440
Speaker 1: unless unless it's like Lamal Hunt totally good with Spot

1412
01:05:54,480 --> 01:05:56,320
Speaker 1: wouldn't exist the way it does today without him. That's

1413
01:05:56,360 --> 01:05:58,520
Speaker 1: the one. After that, I think I'm pretty good. I

1414
01:05:58,560 --> 01:06:01,520
Speaker 1: don't care. They did a great media right to deal overseas, frankly,

1415
01:06:01,600 --> 01:06:04,440
Speaker 1: but once Jerry Jones is in, it kind of opens

1416
01:06:04,480 --> 01:06:05,960
Speaker 1: it that you kind of Jerry Jones in that with

1417
01:06:06,000 --> 01:06:08,440
Speaker 1: those credentials in twenty years of poverty and not have

1418
01:06:08,640 --> 01:06:11,000
Speaker 1: Robert Craft in this. So they've kind of backed themselves

1419
01:06:11,040 --> 01:06:12,400
Speaker 1: into a lane to please Jerry.

1420
01:06:12,680 --> 01:06:13,720
Speaker 4: That's where I struggle with it.

1421
01:06:13,800 --> 01:06:15,920
Speaker 3: And I'm not a voter that has a history, and

1422
01:06:16,680 --> 01:06:19,040
Speaker 3: none of this is official anyway, So I'm just gonna

1423
01:06:19,040 --> 01:06:22,000
Speaker 3: say that, like, I'm not sure about craft because my

1424
01:06:22,200 --> 01:06:26,320
Speaker 3: instinct would be similar to yours, where I'd have a

1425
01:06:26,400 --> 01:06:30,440
Speaker 3: hard time ever voting an owner in unless like the

1426
01:06:30,520 --> 01:06:34,840
Speaker 3: bar is just so high compared to like possibly getting

1427
01:06:34,960 --> 01:06:38,040
Speaker 3: a Mike Shanahan or an ex player in.

1428
01:06:38,520 --> 01:06:41,400
Speaker 4: And that's just where I'm at with owners.

1429
01:06:41,800 --> 01:06:44,320
Speaker 1: I don't think that anything that happens on the field

1430
01:06:44,680 --> 01:06:47,240
Speaker 1: should be necessarily put to ownership. Now, you need a

1431
01:06:47,280 --> 01:06:49,320
Speaker 1: good owner to be successful in the field, but that's the.

1432
01:06:49,320 --> 01:06:52,040
Speaker 4: Whole case for Robert Kraft. I understand the other cases.

1433
01:06:52,160 --> 01:06:54,600
Speaker 1: No, they talk about the off the field stuff and

1434
01:06:54,720 --> 01:06:56,760
Speaker 1: working on the committees and building out the league and

1435
01:06:56,800 --> 01:06:58,960
Speaker 1: blah blah blahs if it wouldn't have happened on its own.

1436
01:06:59,480 --> 01:07:01,200
Speaker 1: To me, it has the way you've done something like

1437
01:07:01,400 --> 01:07:04,240
Speaker 1: art Runel Lamalhunt, where it's really the definition of the

1438
01:07:04,320 --> 01:07:06,400
Speaker 1: league as we see now where it makes sense that

1439
01:07:06,440 --> 01:07:08,560
Speaker 1: you go and so it's so beyond just the league

1440
01:07:08,600 --> 01:07:10,680
Speaker 1: and the sport and like how well they sell media

1441
01:07:10,760 --> 01:07:13,120
Speaker 1: rights and how many trophies you pick up to really

1442
01:07:13,200 --> 01:07:16,200
Speaker 1: impact in the sport more generally in the direction of it.

1443
01:07:16,280 --> 01:07:18,600
Speaker 1: And I don't think the Robert Craft's case could be

1444
01:07:18,640 --> 01:07:22,800
Speaker 1: anything about the direction of the sport itself beyond TV

1445
01:07:22,920 --> 01:07:25,200
Speaker 1: rights deals are pretty good and he was involved in negotiations.

1446
01:07:25,600 --> 01:07:27,960
Speaker 3: Sure, yes, and he has a lot of friends in

1447
01:07:28,080 --> 01:07:32,080
Speaker 3: the media, which I think helps his case and when

1448
01:07:32,120 --> 01:07:34,280
Speaker 3: he gets talked about here. But yeah, like the best

1449
01:07:34,320 --> 01:07:36,160
Speaker 3: case you had for Jerry Jones outside of the sport

1450
01:07:36,280 --> 01:07:38,720
Speaker 3: was like, well, he let everyone make more money because

1451
01:07:38,720 --> 01:07:41,280
Speaker 3: they started doing side deals with PEPSI And it's like,

1452
01:07:41,320 --> 01:07:42,880
Speaker 3: what are we talking about here? You're going to put

1453
01:07:42,880 --> 01:07:44,840
Speaker 3: that on a plaqu All right, let's go to the

1454
01:07:45,400 --> 01:07:46,320
Speaker 3: modern candidate.

1455
01:07:46,400 --> 01:07:49,080
Speaker 4: So I went through my ballot.

1456
01:07:49,480 --> 01:07:52,080
Speaker 3: Here are the fifteen people I'm going to just read

1457
01:07:52,120 --> 01:07:56,160
Speaker 3: them all that were eligible for enshrinment. Willie Anderson, the

1458
01:07:56,280 --> 01:08:01,080
Speaker 3: tackle of the Bengals for many years, Drew of the Saints,

1459
01:08:01,160 --> 01:08:04,640
Speaker 3: Jarry Evans, the guard who played with the Saints, Larry Fitzgerald,

1460
01:08:05,280 --> 01:08:08,840
Speaker 3: wide receiver with the Cardinals. Of course, Frank Gore, who

1461
01:08:08,880 --> 01:08:10,840
Speaker 3: had his best days with the forty nine ers at

1462
01:08:10,920 --> 01:08:11,440
Speaker 3: running back.

1463
01:08:11,720 --> 01:08:12,320
Speaker 4: My favorite.

1464
01:08:12,440 --> 01:08:15,440
Speaker 3: Really was excited to see him on the finalist list

1465
01:08:15,560 --> 01:08:18,479
Speaker 3: in his very first year, which bodes really well for

1466
01:08:18,560 --> 01:08:20,800
Speaker 3: him getting in at some point if he doesn't this year.

1467
01:08:21,200 --> 01:08:23,360
Speaker 3: Tory Holt, who's been a finalist for a while, wide

1468
01:08:23,360 --> 01:08:27,080
Speaker 3: receiver with the Saint Louis Rams. Luke Keikley, mostly known

1469
01:08:27,160 --> 01:08:31,160
Speaker 3: for being a multiple time guest of NFL Daily, Terrell Suggs,

1470
01:08:31,840 --> 01:08:36,040
Speaker 3: the ed rusher for the Ravens, Adam Vinati Thieri the

1471
01:08:36,160 --> 01:08:38,639
Speaker 3: kicker with the Patriots and the Colts. Reggie Wayne wide

1472
01:08:38,680 --> 01:08:41,639
Speaker 3: receiver with the Colts. Kevin Williams, part of the Twin Towers,

1473
01:08:41,680 --> 01:08:44,040
Speaker 3: the defensive tackle. Love seeing him as part of the finalists,

1474
01:08:44,040 --> 01:08:47,719
Speaker 3: now that's some progress for him with the Vikings, Jason

1475
01:08:47,760 --> 01:08:51,320
Speaker 3: Witten getting on to the finalist list right away, it

1476
01:08:51,439 --> 01:08:53,600
Speaker 3: wasn't that wasn't a given as a tight end, so

1477
01:08:53,640 --> 01:08:55,960
Speaker 3: that really bodes well for him. Darren Woodson, who was

1478
01:08:56,000 --> 01:08:58,599
Speaker 3: his teammate at one point with the Cowboys, and Marshall Yonda,

1479
01:08:59,360 --> 01:09:03,479
Speaker 3: the guard for the Ravens. My ballot Ali and you're

1480
01:09:03,520 --> 01:09:05,120
Speaker 3: just gonna respond off of this because we're going to

1481
01:09:05,160 --> 01:09:08,240
Speaker 3: get out of here. Drew Brees seems like a no

1482
01:09:08,360 --> 01:09:11,800
Speaker 3: doubter or right, no brainer, no brainer, And that's the

1483
01:09:11,840 --> 01:09:14,240
Speaker 3: thing with Belichick too. Like as much as I love Breeze,

1484
01:09:14,280 --> 01:09:17,880
Speaker 3: I've made some like all time quarterbacks list, and you know,

1485
01:09:18,080 --> 01:09:19,599
Speaker 3: you could put him in the top ten, you could

1486
01:09:19,640 --> 01:09:21,479
Speaker 3: not put him in the top ten. I think he's

1487
01:09:21,560 --> 01:09:24,800
Speaker 3: probably gonna be in almost anyone's top fifteen. Yes, But

1488
01:09:25,439 --> 01:09:28,800
Speaker 3: but the fact that like Belichick is, you know, has

1489
01:09:28,840 --> 01:09:30,800
Speaker 3: a pretty strong case for like number one or two

1490
01:09:30,920 --> 01:09:34,120
Speaker 3: coach and like people would go insane like Drew Brees,

1491
01:09:34,240 --> 01:09:38,040
Speaker 3: is a total, no doubt, no brainer. He's obviously getting

1492
01:09:38,120 --> 01:09:41,000
Speaker 3: in just comparing him to Belichick. Of course Belichick should

1493
01:09:41,040 --> 01:09:44,840
Speaker 3: be that as well. Larry Fitzgerald makes the list for

1494
01:09:44,960 --> 01:09:46,560
Speaker 3: me too, and I think he's going to get in

1495
01:09:46,680 --> 01:09:49,320
Speaker 3: on his first year. Any any Larry Fitzgerald thoughts from

1496
01:09:49,400 --> 01:09:51,439
Speaker 3: over the years. I think he's one of the greatest

1497
01:09:51,479 --> 01:09:52,519
Speaker 3: to have to do it. I think he should be

1498
01:09:52,600 --> 01:09:53,040
Speaker 3: no brainer.

1499
01:09:53,080 --> 01:09:55,519
Speaker 1: That the problem they've backed themselves into is waiting, making

1500
01:09:55,560 --> 01:09:58,360
Speaker 1: these receivers wait and having to receive a backlog that

1501
01:09:58,479 --> 01:10:00,600
Speaker 1: maybe he will just fall out of it. But he

1502
01:10:00,640 --> 01:10:01,680
Speaker 1: should not absolutely be in.

1503
01:10:02,400 --> 01:10:05,840
Speaker 3: There is no argument, like no great argument against him.

1504
01:10:06,880 --> 01:10:08,559
Speaker 3: You know, part of the Hall of Fame. All twenty

1505
01:10:08,760 --> 01:10:13,759
Speaker 3: ten teams. Obviously, the numbers that he accumulated are insane

1506
01:10:13,920 --> 01:10:17,639
Speaker 3: that the only thing that could even have possibly created

1507
01:10:17,680 --> 01:10:19,840
Speaker 3: any debate at the time is like first team All

1508
01:10:19,920 --> 01:10:22,479
Speaker 3: Pro one time. And I do remember I covered most

1509
01:10:22,520 --> 01:10:25,840
Speaker 3: of these years, Larry Fitzgerald was in this weird spot

1510
01:10:25,880 --> 01:10:28,800
Speaker 3: where he usually was like the third best receiver in

1511
01:10:28,840 --> 01:10:32,439
Speaker 3: the NFL or the fourth and that's incredible, Like he

1512
01:10:33,000 --> 01:10:35,200
Speaker 3: he was so good and I think sometimes you could

1513
01:10:35,240 --> 01:10:38,719
Speaker 3: have made the case he was the best and maybe

1514
01:10:38,720 --> 01:10:41,599
Speaker 3: he should have had more than one first team All Pro,

1515
01:10:41,800 --> 01:10:44,400
Speaker 3: but he it is worth pointing out that that was

1516
01:10:44,520 --> 01:10:47,800
Speaker 3: the case for him for most of his career, where

1517
01:10:47,840 --> 01:10:50,639
Speaker 3: it was like that, to me, is absolutely a Hall

1518
01:10:50,640 --> 01:10:52,920
Speaker 3: of famer, a no doubter. Or if your third or

1519
01:10:52,960 --> 01:10:55,320
Speaker 3: fourth best for most of your career, much less like

1520
01:10:55,400 --> 01:10:57,439
Speaker 3: ten or twelve straight years, that's a hall of famer.

1521
01:10:57,960 --> 01:11:01,040
Speaker 3: But he always did have kind of moss and mega

1522
01:11:01,320 --> 01:11:04,400
Speaker 3: yeah popping up just like going over the top.

1523
01:11:05,040 --> 01:11:07,760
Speaker 1: You're running through maybe the full great receivers of all times,

1524
01:11:07,800 --> 01:11:10,280
Speaker 1: and it's like, oh, you're sick this Okay. It depends

1525
01:11:10,320 --> 01:11:12,760
Speaker 1: what your threshold bar is. I guess I think there

1526
01:11:12,840 --> 01:11:15,040
Speaker 1: was at times where he was a better more impactful

1527
01:11:15,080 --> 01:11:17,280
Speaker 1: receiver than guys who may be a bit more glamorous

1528
01:11:17,360 --> 01:11:20,360
Speaker 1: and possibly more flesh. Is a vertical threat. Those guys

1529
01:11:20,439 --> 01:11:22,200
Speaker 1: used to always get the AP awards.

1530
01:11:22,400 --> 01:11:25,080
Speaker 3: Although then you think about the run he had in

1531
01:11:25,200 --> 01:11:27,599
Speaker 3: that year with the Cardinals going to the super Bowl.

1532
01:11:27,680 --> 01:11:30,400
Speaker 3: How just one of the most dominant runs. And he

1533
01:11:30,600 --> 01:11:33,360
Speaker 3: was that dominant as a receiver during that portion of

1534
01:11:33,439 --> 01:11:38,360
Speaker 3: his career as anyone. Luke Kickley to me was really surprising,

1535
01:11:38,360 --> 01:11:40,840
Speaker 3: you know, mission last year, just you know when you

1536
01:11:40,920 --> 01:11:44,679
Speaker 3: see it, I'm I'm someone who's going to reward peak.

1537
01:11:44,880 --> 01:11:48,040
Speaker 3: And to me, he was the best at his position

1538
01:11:48,280 --> 01:11:49,960
Speaker 3: during his career, and I do think he'll get in

1539
01:11:50,040 --> 01:11:50,360
Speaker 3: this year.

1540
01:11:50,720 --> 01:11:54,200
Speaker 1: Yeah. Him, Patrick Willis best linebackers I ever studied, ever evaluated,

1541
01:11:54,320 --> 01:11:55,680
Speaker 1: should be no doubted to me.

1542
01:11:56,200 --> 01:12:01,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, And unlike unfortunately for will A, you know, not

1543
01:12:01,400 --> 01:12:03,080
Speaker 3: as much. And I know he left the game earlier,

1544
01:12:03,120 --> 01:12:05,000
Speaker 3: but not as much injuries early in his career. And

1545
01:12:05,320 --> 01:12:08,720
Speaker 3: Kicklely to me was even maybe another level above, but

1546
01:12:08,760 --> 01:12:11,400
Speaker 3: that's unfair maybe to Patrick Willis. All right, So that

1547
01:12:11,600 --> 01:12:13,960
Speaker 3: that's three to me that are pretty easy, I think.

1548
01:12:14,400 --> 01:12:16,559
Speaker 3: And then for my final three spots, just to give

1549
01:12:16,680 --> 01:12:22,000
Speaker 3: people a clue. I considered in the end Adam Vinattieri,

1550
01:12:22,560 --> 01:12:26,000
Speaker 3: Marshall Yonda the guard for the Ravens, and Tory Holt,

1551
01:12:26,080 --> 01:12:29,360
Speaker 3: who I am feeling that that feeling that maybe some

1552
01:12:29,479 --> 01:12:29,640
Speaker 3: of the.

1553
01:12:29,720 --> 01:12:30,760
Speaker 4: Voters are like that.

1554
01:12:30,880 --> 01:12:32,800
Speaker 3: I do want him to get in, and I think

1555
01:12:32,840 --> 01:12:35,800
Speaker 3: he's waited long enough, but I have to be a

1556
01:12:35,960 --> 01:12:40,160
Speaker 3: man of my word, Ali, and I think put the

1557
01:12:40,200 --> 01:12:43,920
Speaker 3: people in that deserve it most right away. And I

1558
01:12:44,000 --> 01:12:46,840
Speaker 3: would have spent more time with this process obviously, and

1559
01:12:46,880 --> 01:12:48,280
Speaker 3: who knows if that would have come to a different

1560
01:12:48,280 --> 01:12:51,400
Speaker 3: result if I actually had a vote. But I think

1561
01:12:51,479 --> 01:12:55,840
Speaker 3: Vinitiery and Marshall Yonda just get in for me over

1562
01:12:56,920 --> 01:13:02,200
Speaker 3: Tory Hole. Marshall Yonda who all pros at multiple different positions.

1563
01:13:02,240 --> 01:13:04,160
Speaker 3: It was crazy to look at the PFF All Pros,

1564
01:13:04,200 --> 01:13:06,920
Speaker 3: which are less consistent because they're Grady is less consistent.

1565
01:13:07,080 --> 01:13:09,720
Speaker 3: And he had five first team PFF All Pros and

1566
01:13:09,800 --> 01:13:11,920
Speaker 3: a second team and they were at three different positions.

1567
01:13:11,960 --> 01:13:13,560
Speaker 3: It was like he started out at right tackle, he

1568
01:13:13,600 --> 01:13:16,320
Speaker 3: did at left guard, he and right guard, but he

1569
01:13:16,400 --> 01:13:17,800
Speaker 3: also you know, at the end of his career, they

1570
01:13:17,800 --> 01:13:19,920
Speaker 3: made him switch guard positions and he was great at

1571
01:13:20,000 --> 01:13:22,600
Speaker 3: that too, And so I think there's an argument to

1572
01:13:22,920 --> 01:13:25,720
Speaker 3: be made like he was either the best or the

1573
01:13:25,840 --> 01:13:28,799
Speaker 3: second best at his position for an eight year period.

1574
01:13:29,200 --> 01:13:33,880
Speaker 3: Holt doesn't quite get there to me, And so if

1575
01:13:33,920 --> 01:13:37,080
Speaker 3: you are accepting that that Vinitaria gets in on his

1576
01:13:37,240 --> 01:13:39,680
Speaker 3: first chance, then those were my last two.

1577
01:13:39,800 --> 01:13:42,280
Speaker 1: Yeah. To me, it would be more between vinitarian hol

1578
01:13:42,360 --> 01:13:44,080
Speaker 1: At that point, I think Yonder is the guy who

1579
01:13:44,200 --> 01:13:46,439
Speaker 1: dominated all the whole famous who were gonna come through

1580
01:13:46,479 --> 01:13:48,719
Speaker 1: these next classes. And you speak to JJ Wall anyone

1581
01:13:48,800 --> 01:13:50,400
Speaker 1: like that, and say, who's the guy who would just

1582
01:13:50,479 --> 01:13:52,280
Speaker 1: like murge you for three or four reps in the game,

1583
01:13:52,320 --> 01:13:54,360
Speaker 1: it's Marshall Yonda. If all the greatest plays of all,

1584
01:13:54,439 --> 01:13:56,519
Speaker 1: I'm saying he's the guy gave them the most. Balda

1585
01:13:56,760 --> 01:13:59,640
Speaker 1: then had that level of consistency just to go in

1586
01:13:59,720 --> 01:14:00,000
Speaker 1: right way.

1587
01:14:00,560 --> 01:14:00,760
Speaker 7: Good.

1588
01:14:01,120 --> 01:14:04,240
Speaker 3: You made me feel better about that one because it's

1589
01:14:04,320 --> 01:14:06,400
Speaker 3: tough offensive line play. That's where if I had a

1590
01:14:06,479 --> 01:14:08,759
Speaker 3: VO I would dive more into it, not just the numbers,

1591
01:14:08,800 --> 01:14:10,479
Speaker 3: but talk to to more people.

1592
01:14:10,880 --> 01:14:11,880
Speaker 4: I admit that I didn't hear.

1593
01:14:11,960 --> 01:14:13,920
Speaker 3: It's more based off of what I saw, what I

1594
01:14:14,000 --> 01:14:16,840
Speaker 3: heard at the time, what people say, and I think

1595
01:14:16,920 --> 01:14:20,240
Speaker 3: for him at his position, if you compare him to

1596
01:14:20,640 --> 01:14:23,920
Speaker 3: let's say Willie Anderson at the time, Jarry Evans at

1597
01:14:23,960 --> 01:14:27,360
Speaker 3: the time, the other offensive lineman on this list. It's like, yeah,

1598
01:14:27,439 --> 01:14:31,000
Speaker 3: I think everyone would have agreed that Yonder for his

1599
01:14:31,200 --> 01:14:35,080
Speaker 3: position was higher, and ultimately I think that's true too

1600
01:14:35,120 --> 01:14:38,960
Speaker 3: if you compare him to Kevin Williams Witten who you know,

1601
01:14:39,040 --> 01:14:40,800
Speaker 3: these are guys that I did watch each and every

1602
01:14:40,840 --> 01:14:44,200
Speaker 3: year sugs. I love Gore and really hope that he

1603
01:14:44,280 --> 01:14:48,320
Speaker 3: gets in eventually, and even whole I think Yonda gets there.

1604
01:14:48,360 --> 01:14:50,120
Speaker 4: What are your thoughts on Vinettieri?

1605
01:14:50,640 --> 01:14:53,200
Speaker 3: And if there's anyone from that longer list that I

1606
01:14:53,240 --> 01:14:54,800
Speaker 3: gave you, I know I didn't I didn't prep you

1607
01:14:54,880 --> 01:14:57,559
Speaker 3: too long that stand out to you as another one

1608
01:14:57,600 --> 01:14:59,040
Speaker 3: that would be really strong to consider.

1609
01:14:59,400 --> 01:15:01,280
Speaker 1: The vinetieria he wants to me is interesting because it

1610
01:15:01,320 --> 01:15:02,960
Speaker 1: does come down to this phrase people like to use,

1611
01:15:03,000 --> 01:15:04,920
Speaker 1: if can you tell the story of the game or not?

1612
01:15:05,080 --> 01:15:07,080
Speaker 1: And I don't know how much you weight that. I

1613
01:15:07,120 --> 01:15:09,280
Speaker 1: actually do care about the whole being a place you

1614
01:15:09,360 --> 01:15:11,640
Speaker 1: can take someone and take them through the trajectory and

1615
01:15:11,720 --> 01:15:13,560
Speaker 1: history of the sport, and it would be difficult to

1616
01:15:13,640 --> 01:15:15,760
Speaker 1: tell it without that. How do you kick off a

1617
01:15:15,840 --> 01:15:17,800
Speaker 1: dynasty it begins with this guy's foot. Well was he

1618
01:15:17,880 --> 01:15:21,240
Speaker 1: also just as good and did he have like the longevity, Well,

1619
01:15:21,320 --> 01:15:23,640
Speaker 1: you have more longevity than basically anyone to kick a

1620
01:15:23,680 --> 01:15:26,559
Speaker 1: football at that higher level, doing it for two different

1621
01:15:26,560 --> 01:15:30,040
Speaker 1: teams who competed NonStop, and they won championships on his foot.

1622
01:15:30,560 --> 01:15:32,640
Speaker 1: So to me, he does cross the threshold. I have

1623
01:15:32,720 --> 01:15:34,560
Speaker 1: a really really high bar for the kickers because I

1624
01:15:34,600 --> 01:15:36,000
Speaker 1: think they probably do have to be in kind of

1625
01:15:36,040 --> 01:15:38,439
Speaker 1: the annals of the game to get in there, whereas

1626
01:15:38,479 --> 01:15:40,080
Speaker 1: other guys, I'm happy to just say they were the

1627
01:15:40,120 --> 01:15:42,080
Speaker 1: most dominant player at their position for a long time.

1628
01:15:42,560 --> 01:15:46,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, I I'm torn on it too. Now, Vinettieri does

1629
01:15:47,640 --> 01:15:50,120
Speaker 3: the all time like he is the all time leader

1630
01:15:50,280 --> 01:15:52,680
Speaker 3: in field goals, mate and stuff. So he has the cumulative,

1631
01:15:52,720 --> 01:15:54,720
Speaker 3: he has the All pros because he did it over

1632
01:15:54,800 --> 01:15:57,080
Speaker 3: a number of years. There was actually a year I

1633
01:15:57,200 --> 01:15:58,920
Speaker 3: was looking this up. I remembered it too, when he

1634
01:15:59,040 --> 01:16:01,880
Speaker 3: was forty two, where he was like eight years into

1635
01:16:02,439 --> 01:16:05,559
Speaker 3: the Colts era and he didn't miss a kick that year,

1636
01:16:05,720 --> 01:16:07,960
Speaker 3: Like I think he missed one kick that year. So

1637
01:16:09,400 --> 01:16:12,080
Speaker 3: in terms of a big spot, I voted him because

1638
01:16:12,080 --> 01:16:14,280
Speaker 3: I was like, should a kicker make the Hall of

1639
01:16:14,360 --> 01:16:18,800
Speaker 3: Fame basically, And if my answer is accepting yes, was

1640
01:16:18,880 --> 01:16:21,680
Speaker 3: he the best kicker like throughout a lot of those years? No,

1641
01:16:21,920 --> 01:16:25,040
Speaker 3: Like I think Justin Tucker, for instance, was a more

1642
01:16:25,200 --> 01:16:29,639
Speaker 3: dominant kicker year to year than Benettieria was a different era.

1643
01:16:29,760 --> 01:16:31,280
Speaker 4: I think you do have to adjust for eras.

1644
01:16:31,320 --> 01:16:33,400
Speaker 3: But even for that era, he didn't have like the

1645
01:16:33,479 --> 01:16:37,840
Speaker 3: biggest leg in terms of hitting long field goals as consistently.

1646
01:16:38,520 --> 01:16:40,200
Speaker 3: But how I looked at it in the end was like,

1647
01:16:40,320 --> 01:16:44,200
Speaker 3: if I'm going to say a kicker ever can get in,

1648
01:16:45,320 --> 01:16:45,880
Speaker 3: he would get in.

1649
01:16:46,520 --> 01:16:48,320
Speaker 4: And I think for his position.

1650
01:16:48,560 --> 01:16:52,000
Speaker 3: If I'm accepting that a kicker can get in for

1651
01:16:52,240 --> 01:16:54,360
Speaker 3: his position comparing him to the other players at the

1652
01:16:54,360 --> 01:16:55,880
Speaker 3: other positions, I would be fine.

1653
01:16:56,000 --> 01:16:57,200
Speaker 4: Not like if he had to wait.

1654
01:16:57,280 --> 01:16:58,800
Speaker 3: I don't think it's going to be some agree just

1655
01:16:59,560 --> 01:17:02,479
Speaker 3: you know, miscarriage of justice if Holt gets in over

1656
01:17:02,600 --> 01:17:04,880
Speaker 3: him or a bunch of different of the players listed.

1657
01:17:05,160 --> 01:17:08,080
Speaker 3: And because I think he'll get in eventually. But if

1658
01:17:08,080 --> 01:17:10,519
Speaker 3: I'm accepting that, I think, like he's that kicker, he's

1659
01:17:10,560 --> 01:17:11,280
Speaker 3: the kicker to get in.

1660
01:17:11,800 --> 01:17:13,760
Speaker 1: I agree with you, but it is tough because every

1661
01:17:13,880 --> 01:17:16,439
Speaker 1: year you could push him back by saying, well, Frank Gore,

1662
01:17:16,479 --> 01:17:18,920
Speaker 1: I'm running back this year, will do him. Torry Holt's

1663
01:17:19,000 --> 01:17:20,720
Speaker 1: his time, will put him, and well, you keep pushing out.

1664
01:17:20,760 --> 01:17:22,839
Speaker 1: Look at the clusses, the coming go but is absolutely

1665
01:17:22,920 --> 01:17:24,840
Speaker 1: stacked every season. Guys say, well an edge rush you

1666
01:17:24,920 --> 01:17:26,799
Speaker 1: it was maybe in the hole, a very good fringe

1667
01:17:26,800 --> 01:17:28,880
Speaker 1: hole of Fama. Let's put him above the kick if

1668
01:17:28,920 --> 01:17:31,240
Speaker 1: a kick is going to go in for all elements

1669
01:17:31,320 --> 01:17:33,080
Speaker 1: of it, the cumulative, the story of the game, the

1670
01:17:33,200 --> 01:17:33,640
Speaker 1: history of it.

1671
01:17:34,080 --> 01:17:37,680
Speaker 3: He's the guy and I and I look, all these

1672
01:17:37,760 --> 01:17:42,799
Speaker 3: guys are are such greats that have had such great careers,

1673
01:17:43,080 --> 01:17:45,439
Speaker 3: and I think this process is painful. We found out

1674
01:17:45,479 --> 01:17:48,479
Speaker 3: that Eli Manning is not gonna make it this year already.

1675
01:17:48,520 --> 01:17:50,960
Speaker 3: I don't like this trend that we're getting these reports

1676
01:17:51,000 --> 01:17:53,160
Speaker 3: that the guys don't make it. That's never happened before,

1677
01:17:53,560 --> 01:17:56,320
Speaker 3: because unfortunately they have to keep answering these questions and

1678
01:17:56,400 --> 01:17:59,479
Speaker 3: it becomes like an annual point of pain when it

1679
01:17:59,520 --> 01:18:02,599
Speaker 3: should be a point of pride that they're so close.

1680
01:18:02,640 --> 01:18:04,960
Speaker 3: So we know, I forgot to mention Eli before. I

1681
01:18:05,000 --> 01:18:07,160
Speaker 3: think it was because I knew he's already not gonna

1682
01:18:07,800 --> 01:18:11,519
Speaker 3: make it. But I'm not slagging any of these other names.

1683
01:18:12,640 --> 01:18:16,599
Speaker 3: To me, none of them maybe beyond yonder hit that point.

1684
01:18:16,680 --> 01:18:18,280
Speaker 3: To me that it was like, oh yeah, no doubt

1685
01:18:18,320 --> 01:18:20,120
Speaker 3: or for sure, like I expect them to get in

1686
01:18:20,439 --> 01:18:23,160
Speaker 3: and he's getting in, and so they're all in a

1687
01:18:23,240 --> 01:18:26,400
Speaker 3: similar bucket where you can make different cases. And for me,

1688
01:18:26,960 --> 01:18:30,240
Speaker 3: the Tory Hult case was I'm about peak. To me,

1689
01:18:30,360 --> 01:18:32,680
Speaker 3: he was the one in Saint Louis. He had a

1690
01:18:32,760 --> 01:18:36,200
Speaker 3: six year run where he went thirteen hundred to seventeen

1691
01:18:36,280 --> 01:18:39,240
Speaker 3: hundred yards where he was safely in the top five

1692
01:18:39,320 --> 01:18:41,960
Speaker 3: receivers in the NFL to me, in each one of

1693
01:18:42,040 --> 01:18:47,920
Speaker 3: those seasons, and just the subtle mover, incredible hands and

1694
01:18:48,720 --> 01:18:51,160
Speaker 3: to me kind kind of passes that test. It's why

1695
01:18:51,160 --> 01:18:53,400
Speaker 3: I'd probably vote Roger Craigan too. I forgot to mention

1696
01:18:53,560 --> 01:18:56,280
Speaker 3: that as my other player that I would vote in

1697
01:18:56,360 --> 01:18:58,519
Speaker 3: because for the first seven years of his career, if

1698
01:18:58,520 --> 01:19:01,360
Speaker 3: you look at yards from scrimmage, it's Eric Dickerson one,

1699
01:19:01,640 --> 01:19:03,720
Speaker 3: and then it's Roger Craig number two. Over like some

1700
01:19:03,840 --> 01:19:05,560
Speaker 3: of the greatest names you've ever seen, like you know,

1701
01:19:05,640 --> 01:19:08,760
Speaker 3: Barry Sanders and Walter Payton, who weren't like playing for

1702
01:19:08,880 --> 01:19:10,800
Speaker 3: every single one of those years, but he's, you know,

1703
01:19:11,200 --> 01:19:13,280
Speaker 3: solidly ahead of those guys. So to me, if you

1704
01:19:13,400 --> 01:19:15,880
Speaker 3: have a like dominant seven year run, like that's enough

1705
01:19:15,920 --> 01:19:18,760
Speaker 3: for me. I'm I'm for those guys more than the compilers.

1706
01:19:18,800 --> 01:19:21,160
Speaker 1: So so you're happy with kind of the whole of

1707
01:19:21,400 --> 01:19:25,080
Speaker 1: very very good as opposed to just hole off the elite,

1708
01:19:25,160 --> 01:19:27,679
Speaker 1: the elite top five of the position. That's why Suggs

1709
01:19:27,720 --> 01:19:30,160
Speaker 1: is a tricky yeh for me. I adore Terrell Suggs.

1710
01:19:30,400 --> 01:19:32,800
Speaker 1: He was not one of the best three players on

1711
01:19:32,920 --> 01:19:35,479
Speaker 1: his own defense often, even though I think he's one

1712
01:19:35,520 --> 01:19:37,280
Speaker 1: of the greats. But that to me would be the

1713
01:19:37,320 --> 01:19:39,160
Speaker 1: whole of very good. I think Jason Witten is the

1714
01:19:39,200 --> 01:19:41,519
Speaker 1: whole of good. The whole very very good to me,

1715
01:19:41,640 --> 01:19:43,559
Speaker 1: is whole a nut to you? Is is enough?

1716
01:19:44,479 --> 01:19:48,400
Speaker 3: I don't know, because honestly, after the first it's why

1717
01:19:48,680 --> 01:19:53,080
Speaker 3: in the end you said it should be yes or no. Okay,

1718
01:19:53,640 --> 01:19:55,639
Speaker 3: And I hate to do this with my guy Gore

1719
01:19:57,200 --> 01:19:59,760
Speaker 3: because I think I would be yes on Gore. But

1720
01:20:00,120 --> 01:20:02,360
Speaker 3: to me it's it's maybe a little bit of a bias,

1721
01:20:02,439 --> 01:20:04,240
Speaker 3: but I really do believe he was one of the

1722
01:20:04,320 --> 01:20:06,400
Speaker 3: best running backs in each of those years where he

1723
01:20:06,560 --> 01:20:09,360
Speaker 3: wasn't honored by the All Pro like. It was just

1724
01:20:09,479 --> 01:20:12,559
Speaker 3: sort of the situations that they used him in some ways.

1725
01:20:13,120 --> 01:20:15,439
Speaker 3: The six guys that I mentioned I strongly considered kind

1726
01:20:15,479 --> 01:20:17,320
Speaker 3: of those are my yeses. I don't think I have

1727
01:20:17,439 --> 01:20:20,000
Speaker 3: a yes for the rest of them, and so Holt

1728
01:20:20,160 --> 01:20:23,960
Speaker 3: has long been a guy I thought was was made

1729
01:20:24,080 --> 01:20:27,479
Speaker 3: my cut for whatever reason, and I think my is

1730
01:20:27,600 --> 01:20:30,120
Speaker 3: no on the rest of them. So it's tough that

1731
01:20:30,320 --> 01:20:33,760
Speaker 3: Sugs and Woodson. I think, like our hauls are very good,

1732
01:20:33,960 --> 01:20:34,960
Speaker 3: not quite well.

1733
01:20:34,960 --> 01:20:36,519
Speaker 1: I'm glad we solved it. Full of them. They can

1734
01:20:36,560 --> 01:20:38,519
Speaker 1: reach out to you next year and just pick it

1735
01:20:38,600 --> 01:20:38,960
Speaker 1: up from.

1736
01:20:38,840 --> 01:20:42,519
Speaker 3: The I'm gonna I'm gonna try to work some behind

1737
01:20:42,560 --> 01:20:44,840
Speaker 3: the scenes magic. Can I Can I somehow get on

1738
01:20:44,960 --> 01:20:48,000
Speaker 3: that committee. Probably not, It's never gonna happen. Eric's is like,

1739
01:20:48,479 --> 01:20:51,280
Speaker 3: this was supposed to be an hour long show, but

1740
01:20:51,400 --> 01:20:53,920
Speaker 3: you know what, Eric, it's the weekend, and we wanted

1741
01:20:53,920 --> 01:20:56,120
Speaker 3: to talk coaches, and we wanted to talk Hall of

1742
01:20:56,200 --> 01:20:58,240
Speaker 3: Fame because we're not going to talk about it at

1743
01:20:58,400 --> 01:21:00,519
Speaker 3: length during Bowl week.

1744
01:21:00,560 --> 01:21:01,840
Speaker 4: I thought this was the time to do it.

1745
01:21:01,920 --> 01:21:05,519
Speaker 3: We will obviously congratulate the men that did make it

1746
01:21:05,720 --> 01:21:07,960
Speaker 3: and hit on that but for the most part, next

1747
01:21:08,000 --> 01:21:09,760
Speaker 3: week is going to be all about the game and

1748
01:21:09,880 --> 01:21:11,599
Speaker 3: all about the rest of the league because we're talking

1749
01:21:11,640 --> 01:21:14,400
Speaker 3: about in two different players from different teams, and start

1750
01:21:14,439 --> 01:21:18,720
Speaker 3: looking ahead to the offseason. Ali, that was awesome. Apologies

1751
01:21:18,760 --> 01:21:21,679
Speaker 3: for keeping you so long. We'll get you back next week.

1752
01:21:21,880 --> 01:21:25,080
Speaker 3: And yes, we will be doing shows all next week

1753
01:21:25,479 --> 01:21:27,640
Speaker 3: from San Francisco, but we do have a show on

1754
01:21:27,920 --> 01:21:31,240
Speaker 3: Monday that will be from the Chris Westling podcast studio,

1755
01:21:31,320 --> 01:21:33,000
Speaker 3: So that's the next time you will hear from us

1756
01:21:33,360 --> 01:21:36,200
Speaker 3: in the feed. Who knows, maybe the Raiders or the

1757
01:21:36,240 --> 01:21:38,040
Speaker 3: Cardinals will finally hire someone, but I don't think so

1758
01:21:38,120 --> 01:21:39,519
Speaker 3: because they're waiting for Clint Kubiak.

1759
01:21:39,560 --> 01:21:40,040
Speaker 4: We'll see you that