1 00:00:00,200 --> 00:00:27,600 Speaker 1: Ridiculous History is a production of iHeartRadio. Welcome back to 2 00:00:27,640 --> 00:00:31,240 Speaker 1: the show, fellow Ridiculous Historians. Thank you, as always so 3 00:00:31,400 --> 00:00:35,000 Speaker 1: much for tuning in. Let's hear it for our number 4 00:00:35,040 --> 00:00:39,360 Speaker 1: one Horsey boy, the Main that just won't quit, our 5 00:00:39,479 --> 00:00:42,040 Speaker 1: super producer, mister Max Williams. Main. 6 00:00:42,720 --> 00:00:45,760 Speaker 2: Congratulations, Ben, you finally have after four and a half years, 7 00:00:45,800 --> 00:00:47,239 Speaker 2: and you hit me with one. I just don't know 8 00:00:47,240 --> 00:00:49,920 Speaker 2: how to respond on that one. The main part I 9 00:00:49,920 --> 00:00:51,879 Speaker 2: can hit you on, but the Horsey Boy, I just 10 00:00:52,600 --> 00:00:53,280 Speaker 2: yeah me Bud. 11 00:00:53,400 --> 00:00:53,600 Speaker 1: Yeah. 12 00:00:53,760 --> 00:00:55,960 Speaker 3: Max is speechless for the first time ever. 13 00:00:56,800 --> 00:00:58,000 Speaker 2: Yeah he still speaks. 14 00:00:58,600 --> 00:01:01,880 Speaker 3: No, Hey, guys, Irma Gert, it's the Kent Turkey Derby. 15 00:01:02,360 --> 00:01:06,800 Speaker 1: Ah, yes, yeah, that is none other than mister Noel Brown. 16 00:01:07,360 --> 00:01:10,520 Speaker 1: Uh Noel, do we have a sound cue for you yet? 17 00:01:10,840 --> 00:01:13,160 Speaker 3: Can it be that Horsey nay like from Insane in 18 00:01:13,200 --> 00:01:18,600 Speaker 3: the Membrane? You know? 19 00:01:19,400 --> 00:01:19,640 Speaker 1: Yeah? 20 00:01:19,880 --> 00:01:22,720 Speaker 4: For this what it must be, I mean for all times. 21 00:01:22,720 --> 00:01:24,720 Speaker 4: I'm cool with that as well. I'm totally I'm more 22 00:01:24,840 --> 00:01:26,440 Speaker 4: a Horsey boy than Max to be fair be. 23 00:01:26,959 --> 00:01:30,920 Speaker 2: Wow, oh wow, I agree completely and I don't even 24 00:01:30,920 --> 00:01:31,840 Speaker 2: know what means, but I agree. 25 00:01:31,880 --> 00:01:34,720 Speaker 3: Nobody does esa. 26 00:01:35,640 --> 00:01:38,200 Speaker 1: We're working out Horsey Boys Uh. 27 00:01:38,040 --> 00:01:39,880 Speaker 3: You know the horse girl phenomenon. That's the thing. 28 00:01:39,920 --> 00:01:44,800 Speaker 1: There's shout out Shane Gillis. Uh. Folks over on this 29 00:01:44,920 --> 00:01:48,720 Speaker 1: show they call me Ben Bullen, And we've all been there. 30 00:01:48,960 --> 00:01:51,480 Speaker 1: You know. You wake up one day and you say, 31 00:01:51,640 --> 00:01:55,840 Speaker 1: you know what, forget about work. It's nice outside. I 32 00:01:55,920 --> 00:01:58,640 Speaker 1: want to put on a fancy hat. I want to 33 00:01:58,680 --> 00:02:01,640 Speaker 1: maybe drink mint jus and I want to watch a 34 00:02:01,680 --> 00:02:04,880 Speaker 1: bunch of panicked horses run around in a circle. 35 00:02:11,639 --> 00:02:14,120 Speaker 4: You had me up until a nice day outside, and 36 00:02:14,120 --> 00:02:16,120 Speaker 4: then it was quite the leap to fancy hat meant 37 00:02:16,840 --> 00:02:19,000 Speaker 4: and paniced horses and a circle. 38 00:02:19,400 --> 00:02:22,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, we're not the most fancy hat guys ourselves. 39 00:02:22,560 --> 00:02:24,720 Speaker 4: I'm just saying, whoever came up with this as as 40 00:02:25,000 --> 00:02:27,440 Speaker 4: a wake up activity, they must have had something going on. 41 00:02:27,520 --> 00:02:29,200 Speaker 3: I almost willing to bet we're going to talk about 42 00:02:29,240 --> 00:02:30,240 Speaker 3: exactly what that was. 43 00:02:31,040 --> 00:02:34,200 Speaker 1: I want to set up. Yeah, it's as tad specific. 44 00:02:34,639 --> 00:02:38,600 Speaker 1: But as you said, Noel, there is an annual event 45 00:02:38,919 --> 00:02:43,560 Speaker 1: that all Americans just sort of except as normal. It's 46 00:02:43,600 --> 00:02:48,200 Speaker 1: called the Kentucky Derby. And today we're gonna learn whether 47 00:02:48,320 --> 00:02:51,400 Speaker 1: or not it is ridiculous. Spoiler it is? 48 00:02:51,960 --> 00:02:56,399 Speaker 3: Boy? Is it ever? And what better way to start 49 00:02:56,440 --> 00:02:57,440 Speaker 3: a ridiculous. 50 00:02:57,040 --> 00:03:01,760 Speaker 4: Topic than with an absolutely ridiculous historic name. You think 51 00:03:01,800 --> 00:03:05,360 Speaker 4: it's ridiculous, I mean, dude, the question you immediately asked 52 00:03:05,400 --> 00:03:08,480 Speaker 4: yourself is like, who is this guy related to? And 53 00:03:08,520 --> 00:03:11,400 Speaker 4: we answered that very quickly. We're talking about, of course, 54 00:03:12,080 --> 00:03:15,560 Speaker 4: none other than Colonel Merriweather Lewis Clark Junior is only 55 00:03:15,600 --> 00:03:18,480 Speaker 4: related to one of them, William Clark. But he got 56 00:03:18,520 --> 00:03:20,760 Speaker 4: Lewis up in there too, And I believe Lewis's first 57 00:03:20,840 --> 00:03:21,639 Speaker 4: name was Merriweather. 58 00:03:22,120 --> 00:03:25,560 Speaker 1: You know, I didn't think about that. You are absolutely I. 59 00:03:25,560 --> 00:03:26,480 Speaker 3: Was having to look it up. 60 00:03:26,520 --> 00:03:30,519 Speaker 4: I'm almost positive that's the guests Merriweather, Lewis and William Clark. 61 00:03:30,760 --> 00:03:32,720 Speaker 3: How come he's got didn't have a William in there? 62 00:03:33,240 --> 00:03:37,440 Speaker 3: His dad was William. Yeah, he really loved his boy, Merriweather. 63 00:03:38,200 --> 00:03:41,160 Speaker 1: Yeah, this is the colonel who is the grandson of 64 00:03:41,240 --> 00:03:46,920 Speaker 1: William Clark grandson. Yes, yeah, he is perhaps known from 65 00:03:47,080 --> 00:03:51,840 Speaker 1: a semi famous Lewis and Clark expedition, which of course 66 00:03:52,280 --> 00:03:55,760 Speaker 1: informed the much more important thing Oregon Trail. 67 00:03:56,040 --> 00:03:57,880 Speaker 3: Yeah, love it, Dysentry. 68 00:03:57,480 --> 00:04:02,480 Speaker 1: All day, Terry Ford, the River. So this guy is 69 00:04:02,520 --> 00:04:06,880 Speaker 1: originally from Kentucky. We'll call him Junior. He is a 70 00:04:06,920 --> 00:04:09,440 Speaker 1: man of means. He wants to see the rest of 71 00:04:09,440 --> 00:04:13,560 Speaker 1: the world, and unlike most Americans at the time, he 72 00:04:13,800 --> 00:04:17,800 Speaker 1: has the ability to travel across the pond. 73 00:04:17,960 --> 00:04:20,080 Speaker 4: Yeah, and I don't think we go on specifically what 74 00:04:20,240 --> 00:04:24,080 Speaker 4: his business was, but being a descendant of that famous line, 75 00:04:24,760 --> 00:04:26,880 Speaker 4: I imagine he was born into money. 76 00:04:27,480 --> 00:04:31,400 Speaker 1: He was not pushed for means. You know, they weren't 77 00:04:31,440 --> 00:04:35,760 Speaker 1: sweating the spoons nor the light built in eighteen seventy two. 78 00:04:35,839 --> 00:04:40,080 Speaker 1: Our but a junior travels over to England and he 79 00:04:40,320 --> 00:04:45,680 Speaker 1: witnesses a locally famous horse race in Epsom Surrey. It's 80 00:04:45,720 --> 00:04:50,320 Speaker 1: called not the Kentucky but the Derby Steaks, and people 81 00:04:50,360 --> 00:04:54,599 Speaker 1: in the know usually just call it the Derby. And Max, 82 00:04:54,680 --> 00:04:57,160 Speaker 1: as we're going on, we're going to lean on you 83 00:04:57,400 --> 00:05:01,080 Speaker 1: as our sportsman expert for few of these da. 84 00:05:01,080 --> 00:05:03,120 Speaker 2: I mean you, I wouldn't expect anything otherwise, but you know, 85 00:05:03,200 --> 00:05:08,400 Speaker 2: Kentucky Derby. I understand it. I also don't. 86 00:05:09,640 --> 00:05:13,360 Speaker 4: Like it's kind of like one of those things like NASCAR, 87 00:05:13,760 --> 00:05:16,560 Speaker 4: where it's really easy to reduce it down to this 88 00:05:16,680 --> 00:05:19,600 Speaker 4: notion of watching people drive a car around in circles, 89 00:05:20,120 --> 00:05:22,640 Speaker 4: and it's not until you drill down into the stats 90 00:05:22,680 --> 00:05:24,880 Speaker 4: and the mechanics of it all. And like again, if 91 00:05:24,880 --> 00:05:28,040 Speaker 4: we're looking at the horse horseboy side of things, the 92 00:05:28,120 --> 00:05:30,239 Speaker 4: breeds and the prowess. 93 00:05:29,839 --> 00:05:31,320 Speaker 3: Of these beautiful creatures. 94 00:05:31,320 --> 00:05:34,560 Speaker 4: But as we're going to get into I don't know, man, 95 00:05:34,360 --> 00:05:36,479 Speaker 4: I can definitely get a little more behind people being 96 00:05:36,520 --> 00:05:41,520 Speaker 4: into cars than this kind of parading of these specimens. 97 00:05:41,760 --> 00:05:45,880 Speaker 2: It's one thing to get here at the top NASCAR 98 00:05:45,960 --> 00:05:50,520 Speaker 2: has and Indie racing, Formula One racing has is quantity. 99 00:05:50,720 --> 00:05:54,919 Speaker 2: There is a lot of racing Kentucky Derby. 100 00:05:53,320 --> 00:05:57,120 Speaker 3: I had no idea we're going to get to that. 101 00:05:57,279 --> 00:05:58,760 Speaker 3: It's like all about the day. 102 00:05:59,040 --> 00:06:00,719 Speaker 4: It's like it's like the it's like hanging out in 103 00:06:00,760 --> 00:06:04,720 Speaker 4: the fish lot and then the Fish Concert's like moments long, 104 00:06:05,120 --> 00:06:06,120 Speaker 4: it's all. 105 00:06:06,080 --> 00:06:09,400 Speaker 1: About the lot, barely about the concert, and folks Nola 106 00:06:09,520 --> 00:06:14,599 Speaker 1: is saying fish Phis, that's it. Yeah, yeah, yeah, not 107 00:06:14,680 --> 00:06:17,440 Speaker 1: a parking lot with fish, but a parking lot full 108 00:06:17,480 --> 00:06:20,280 Speaker 1: of people who are fans of the jam band Fish, 109 00:06:20,680 --> 00:06:23,719 Speaker 1: which I think lots of. I like a lot of 110 00:06:23,760 --> 00:06:24,600 Speaker 1: their records. 111 00:06:24,920 --> 00:06:25,840 Speaker 3: I you know what. 112 00:06:25,880 --> 00:06:27,640 Speaker 4: I was actually just talking with some friends last night. 113 00:06:27,680 --> 00:06:30,360 Speaker 4: I would absolutely go see the Bandfish. I never have, 114 00:06:31,600 --> 00:06:32,280 Speaker 4: but I would do it. 115 00:06:32,320 --> 00:06:33,960 Speaker 3: There. I think they're interesting. 116 00:06:34,520 --> 00:06:40,240 Speaker 1: Make a weekend of it. So look the original Derby 117 00:06:40,560 --> 00:06:44,360 Speaker 1: over there in Surrey. It is first run in seventeen eighty. 118 00:06:44,480 --> 00:06:47,680 Speaker 1: It continues today. For now, all we need to note 119 00:06:47,720 --> 00:06:51,400 Speaker 1: about this is that it was and is open to 120 00:06:52,120 --> 00:06:57,640 Speaker 1: all three year old horses, which sounds very young for humans, 121 00:06:57,800 --> 00:07:03,880 Speaker 1: but is perfect racing for race horses. This inspires Junior. 122 00:07:03,920 --> 00:07:05,360 Speaker 4: Who, by the way, I was just looking at his 123 00:07:05,440 --> 00:07:08,240 Speaker 4: CV a little bit ben and he was known for 124 00:07:09,040 --> 00:07:11,360 Speaker 4: being a little bit touchy and had more than a 125 00:07:11,360 --> 00:07:15,320 Speaker 4: few occasions where he threatened people with guns. Yes, yeah, oddcat, 126 00:07:15,520 --> 00:07:18,280 Speaker 4: for sure. I definitely moneyed, which you know, we'll do 127 00:07:18,360 --> 00:07:21,200 Speaker 4: that to you if you're not careful. So Junior later 128 00:07:21,280 --> 00:07:24,720 Speaker 4: did travel to Perry, where he hooked up with the 129 00:07:24,880 --> 00:07:29,280 Speaker 4: French Jockey Club, because much like cycling, the French are ahead. 130 00:07:29,000 --> 00:07:31,040 Speaker 3: Of the curve in this particular sport as well. 131 00:07:31,680 --> 00:07:34,160 Speaker 4: That had been formed in eighteen sixty three, and the 132 00:07:34,160 --> 00:07:38,520 Speaker 4: French horse Boys had formed the nation's greatest horse race 133 00:07:38,600 --> 00:07:41,360 Speaker 4: up until that point, the Grand Prix de Pelis. 134 00:07:42,400 --> 00:07:47,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, this is the premiere race for the entire country. 135 00:07:47,960 --> 00:07:52,440 Speaker 1: It's needless to say Junior is impressed. He makes it 136 00:07:52,480 --> 00:07:55,760 Speaker 1: back to the United States and he found something called 137 00:07:55,800 --> 00:08:00,960 Speaker 1: the Louisville Jockey Club and he forms this which is 138 00:08:01,040 --> 00:08:04,480 Speaker 1: kind of like a country club kind of thing, we 139 00:08:04,480 --> 00:08:06,880 Speaker 1: could think of it that way. And he's hoping to 140 00:08:07,200 --> 00:08:14,080 Speaker 1: raise monetary support to build racing facilities. He's walking back 141 00:08:14,160 --> 00:08:18,120 Speaker 1: into Kentucky and talking to the well healed people and 142 00:08:18,160 --> 00:08:22,880 Speaker 1: he's saying, look, they got awesome horse races in Europe. 143 00:08:23,520 --> 00:08:28,800 Speaker 1: This leads to the foundation of Churchill Downs, which is 144 00:08:28,920 --> 00:08:33,920 Speaker 1: named after John and Henry Churchill because they're the guys 145 00:08:33,960 --> 00:08:37,400 Speaker 1: in that meeting who donated the land for the track. 146 00:08:37,640 --> 00:08:41,280 Speaker 1: And I believe Clark lived with their family for a 147 00:08:41,400 --> 00:08:44,520 Speaker 1: time or he had a real close connection to their family. 148 00:08:45,720 --> 00:08:47,880 Speaker 1: So at first this whole. 149 00:08:47,840 --> 00:08:50,520 Speaker 4: Enterprise was a right right out, right out of the gates, 150 00:08:51,400 --> 00:08:55,400 Speaker 4: was a phenomenal success. The horse folk from the region 151 00:08:55,640 --> 00:08:57,400 Speaker 4: would come out. It's sort of one of the only 152 00:08:57,440 --> 00:09:02,199 Speaker 4: games in town. They stood up and took notice. Unfortunately, 153 00:09:02,400 --> 00:09:06,200 Speaker 4: things did go a little bit sideways, not too far 154 00:09:06,280 --> 00:09:10,319 Speaker 4: along in this when a nouveau riche gold rush tycoon, 155 00:09:10,440 --> 00:09:12,240 Speaker 4: like a dude that was made his money in the 156 00:09:12,240 --> 00:09:18,040 Speaker 4: gold rush named James ben ali Hagen had a bit 157 00:09:18,080 --> 00:09:21,360 Speaker 4: of a dalliance with some gambling operations. Ben, maybe this 158 00:09:21,440 --> 00:09:22,960 Speaker 4: is this is something that you found. This is an 159 00:09:22,960 --> 00:09:24,040 Speaker 4: interesting tale. 160 00:09:24,720 --> 00:09:30,880 Speaker 1: Oh yes, Nipun left behind James Ben Ali Hagen, Turkish 161 00:09:30,960 --> 00:09:33,920 Speaker 1: national made his money in the gold Rush, and he 162 00:09:34,080 --> 00:09:38,559 Speaker 1: ran a foul a full of sketchy gambling monopolies. 163 00:09:38,640 --> 00:09:42,160 Speaker 3: I will, Ben, I will, all right, Well here we go. 164 00:09:42,360 --> 00:09:45,199 Speaker 1: So it's a bit of background. It's eighteen eighty six. 165 00:09:46,320 --> 00:09:52,480 Speaker 1: There's another guy named CM White. CM White purchases like 166 00:09:52,559 --> 00:09:58,079 Speaker 1: a EP level monopoly on what they were calling pooling privileges. 167 00:09:58,480 --> 00:10:03,800 Speaker 1: That's the right to leave gamble on Kentucky Derby horse races. 168 00:10:03,920 --> 00:10:07,080 Speaker 4: Yeah, it's funny. I still call like office pools. You know, 169 00:10:07,640 --> 00:10:10,160 Speaker 4: I got that pool that's right. I guess that is 170 00:10:10,400 --> 00:10:12,640 Speaker 4: a gambling term. Yeah, I guess it's sort of like 171 00:10:12,679 --> 00:10:14,800 Speaker 4: the ante. It's like the pile of money that everyone 172 00:10:14,800 --> 00:10:17,000 Speaker 4: contributes to and then the winner takes all right. 173 00:10:17,120 --> 00:10:21,200 Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, just so, uh, this guy White, he pays 174 00:10:21,840 --> 00:10:25,600 Speaker 1: at the time, in eighteen eighty six, thirty thousand, six 175 00:10:25,679 --> 00:10:31,959 Speaker 1: hundred US dollars to control gambling at the emerging Kentucky Derby. 176 00:10:32,320 --> 00:10:35,520 Speaker 1: And I think we need a bit of an infletion calculator. 177 00:10:35,600 --> 00:10:39,880 Speaker 4: Can we get a boop, Max, dude, boom, there it 178 00:10:40,000 --> 00:10:41,480 Speaker 4: is when you do it. 179 00:10:41,679 --> 00:10:44,120 Speaker 3: A low dulcet boop of masks. 180 00:10:43,920 --> 00:10:47,920 Speaker 1: Love when he does it? Live all right, Sue. Thirty thousand, 181 00:10:48,040 --> 00:10:52,280 Speaker 1: six hundred dollars in eighteen eighty six is equivalent to 182 00:10:52,960 --> 00:10:57,160 Speaker 1: drum roll noel, you got it. 183 00:10:57,520 --> 00:11:02,000 Speaker 4: Oh, it's a million bucks roughly fifty million, fifty and 184 00:11:02,000 --> 00:11:04,600 Speaker 4: forty five, which still seems like a bargain to get 185 00:11:04,640 --> 00:11:07,440 Speaker 4: on the ground floor of what would ultimately be a 186 00:11:07,559 --> 00:11:12,240 Speaker 4: multimillion dollar operation. Dude anigar long term, right, I mean right, 187 00:11:12,720 --> 00:11:17,040 Speaker 4: this dude is so mafia about it. He says, okay, 188 00:11:17,080 --> 00:11:19,760 Speaker 4: I've got the rights. And he goes to every bookie 189 00:11:20,240 --> 00:11:23,600 Speaker 4: working at the Kentucky Derby and he says, you guys 190 00:11:23,679 --> 00:11:27,840 Speaker 4: have to pay me one hundred dollars straight up just 191 00:11:28,000 --> 00:11:31,880 Speaker 4: to work at this track, just to take bets, and 192 00:11:32,040 --> 00:11:34,439 Speaker 4: just to be clear, And this is maybe a sort 193 00:11:34,480 --> 00:11:37,120 Speaker 4: of a statement and a question. A bookie is a 194 00:11:37,160 --> 00:11:41,160 Speaker 4: book maker, and it's not inherently illegal, like there are 195 00:11:41,400 --> 00:11:45,160 Speaker 4: sports books operations, and so there are legal ones and 196 00:11:45,200 --> 00:11:46,880 Speaker 4: then there are illegal ones. But I think a lot 197 00:11:46,920 --> 00:11:49,560 Speaker 4: of times when people throw around bookie they're thinking about 198 00:11:49,600 --> 00:11:52,079 Speaker 4: the ones that'll like break your legs if you don't pay. 199 00:11:51,960 --> 00:11:53,080 Speaker 3: Up, right. 200 00:11:53,320 --> 00:11:56,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, The idea is you take bets from the general 201 00:11:57,040 --> 00:12:01,880 Speaker 1: public on any number of you usually sporting events. But 202 00:12:02,120 --> 00:12:05,640 Speaker 1: Las Vegas and Macaw get crazy with this. You make 203 00:12:05,720 --> 00:12:10,240 Speaker 1: a great point. The argument goes back to legitimacy, Like 204 00:12:10,400 --> 00:12:14,520 Speaker 1: it's totally legit and on the right side of the 205 00:12:14,600 --> 00:12:19,200 Speaker 1: law for there to be a bookie in say Monaco, 206 00:12:19,600 --> 00:12:23,480 Speaker 1: and you're betting on car races in Monaco. But we 207 00:12:23,600 --> 00:12:27,839 Speaker 1: had a super producer, Max, jump in for a second. Max, 208 00:12:27,880 --> 00:12:30,640 Speaker 1: you want to give us some on the street recognition 209 00:12:30,720 --> 00:12:31,240 Speaker 1: of bookies. 210 00:12:31,400 --> 00:12:33,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I think another big thing about bookies 211 00:12:33,880 --> 00:12:37,880 Speaker 2: because I've known some bookies. Most time they're part time bookies, 212 00:12:37,920 --> 00:12:41,840 Speaker 2: not like big time bookies. But until recently, socially America, 213 00:12:41,960 --> 00:12:45,679 Speaker 2: like sports gambling was very legal in most places in 214 00:12:45,720 --> 00:12:49,520 Speaker 2: the country. It's just illegal, right, yeah, illegal right yeah, yeah, apology, 215 00:12:49,960 --> 00:12:50,360 Speaker 2: but yeah, I. 216 00:12:50,720 --> 00:12:52,880 Speaker 4: Just making sure because it's a little confusing and it's 217 00:12:52,920 --> 00:12:55,439 Speaker 4: still kind of a gray area where like now you're 218 00:12:55,480 --> 00:12:58,240 Speaker 4: starting to hear these ads for these sports books, and 219 00:12:58,280 --> 00:13:00,360 Speaker 4: like when you go to certain casinos they have the 220 00:13:00,400 --> 00:13:03,600 Speaker 4: section where there's all these different what they call sports books, 221 00:13:03,720 --> 00:13:05,959 Speaker 4: and it's what gets back to sort of this. 222 00:13:05,960 --> 00:13:07,880 Speaker 3: Old timey way of doing things. 223 00:13:08,040 --> 00:13:10,559 Speaker 2: One of the fantasy football podcasts I listened to, I'm 224 00:13:10,559 --> 00:13:13,400 Speaker 2: not giving any publicity or for advertising anyone here someone 225 00:13:13,400 --> 00:13:13,800 Speaker 2: we're talking to. 226 00:13:14,040 --> 00:13:15,720 Speaker 1: This is brought to you by DraftKings. 227 00:13:16,040 --> 00:13:18,360 Speaker 2: Actually no, it's not DraftKings, but one of them. 228 00:13:18,480 --> 00:13:21,000 Speaker 1: No, no, but this is brought to you by DraftKings. 229 00:13:21,840 --> 00:13:24,320 Speaker 2: I was listening to a fantasy football podcast and they were 230 00:13:24,760 --> 00:13:27,320 Speaker 2: talking about a specific sports book that was like there 231 00:13:27,360 --> 00:13:29,760 Speaker 2: are big lines like the only one legal in Florida. 232 00:13:30,000 --> 00:13:33,200 Speaker 4: Right, yeah, right, that's the kind of language you're starting 233 00:13:33,240 --> 00:13:35,360 Speaker 4: to hear in this copy when we're still in this 234 00:13:35,400 --> 00:13:37,560 Speaker 4: wild West day. We talked about this very much in 235 00:13:37,600 --> 00:13:40,360 Speaker 4: our Fantasy Sports episode. So all this stuff kind of 236 00:13:40,360 --> 00:13:40,719 Speaker 4: figures in. 237 00:13:40,840 --> 00:13:42,840 Speaker 2: And how this ties in with bookies is like, you know, 238 00:13:42,880 --> 00:13:44,760 Speaker 2: for a long time, it's like, Okay, how do you 239 00:13:44,800 --> 00:13:47,280 Speaker 2: gamble on these things? There's just a guy you knew, 240 00:13:47,800 --> 00:13:49,360 Speaker 2: like in the neighborhood, who was outside of the bar 241 00:13:49,400 --> 00:13:49,640 Speaker 2: with you. 242 00:13:50,120 --> 00:13:53,200 Speaker 1: There's an etymology we have to get into, which is 243 00:13:53,920 --> 00:13:58,319 Speaker 1: that the in the origin story, during the day the 244 00:13:58,360 --> 00:14:03,040 Speaker 1: book makers or the book would physically write down in 245 00:14:03,280 --> 00:14:08,600 Speaker 1: a book your donation or your gamble and the odds 246 00:14:08,800 --> 00:14:13,599 Speaker 1: of a thing. So there is a reason it's called bookmaking. 247 00:14:14,040 --> 00:14:15,480 Speaker 1: They were literally making a. 248 00:14:15,440 --> 00:14:19,240 Speaker 4: Book one hundred percent and just wanted to pull a 249 00:14:19,280 --> 00:14:21,880 Speaker 4: little tidbit that was news to me, or at least 250 00:14:21,920 --> 00:14:23,600 Speaker 4: a question that I had that I maybe didn't fully 251 00:14:23,600 --> 00:14:25,640 Speaker 4: have the answer to, and involves a term that you 252 00:14:25,680 --> 00:14:28,960 Speaker 4: like to throw around them, the vigoroush The way that 253 00:14:29,000 --> 00:14:34,000 Speaker 4: bookies cover these bets is by or at least more 254 00:14:34,000 --> 00:14:35,920 Speaker 4: than cover. They're covering it, I guess, because people have 255 00:14:35,960 --> 00:14:38,640 Speaker 4: to pay down on their bets and then they either 256 00:14:38,640 --> 00:14:43,160 Speaker 4: get their money back plus whatever the winnings is based 257 00:14:43,200 --> 00:14:47,560 Speaker 4: on the odds of the bet. The bookmakers control the odds, 258 00:14:47,600 --> 00:14:51,600 Speaker 4: and they strategically not manipulate, but they sort of have 259 00:14:51,680 --> 00:14:54,680 Speaker 4: to have knowledge of what's being bet on in such 260 00:14:54,680 --> 00:14:56,800 Speaker 4: a way that they can move the odds around to 261 00:14:56,880 --> 00:14:59,640 Speaker 4: attract bets, but also make sure they're covering it and 262 00:14:59,640 --> 00:15:01,840 Speaker 4: that they're able to get their commission or they're viig 263 00:15:02,240 --> 00:15:02,920 Speaker 4: or vigorous. 264 00:15:03,120 --> 00:15:08,880 Speaker 3: Right. 265 00:15:10,160 --> 00:15:14,720 Speaker 1: So, the folks at the Kentucky Derby during its origin story, 266 00:15:15,240 --> 00:15:19,680 Speaker 1: it was not necessarily a social nor a fashion event 267 00:15:20,200 --> 00:15:24,000 Speaker 1: it was not the met Gala or whatever. They wanted 268 00:15:24,040 --> 00:15:27,440 Speaker 1: to make money off these horses. And so when our 269 00:15:27,480 --> 00:15:32,320 Speaker 1: buddy CM White shakes down all the bookies at the 270 00:15:32,360 --> 00:15:37,160 Speaker 1: new Kentucky Derby, the bookies boycott. They say, we're just 271 00:15:37,280 --> 00:15:39,880 Speaker 1: not going to show up. No one can gamble, you 272 00:15:40,000 --> 00:15:44,040 Speaker 1: can't make high dollar bets over at the Derby. This 273 00:15:44,120 --> 00:15:49,080 Speaker 1: happens in eighteen eighty six. Our pal gold Rush James Hagen, 274 00:15:49,560 --> 00:15:53,360 Speaker 1: does not vibe with this. He learns he cannot place 275 00:15:53,400 --> 00:15:57,000 Speaker 1: a bet on his champion horse that he, in a 276 00:15:57,040 --> 00:16:00,640 Speaker 1: burst of humility, names Ben Ali, and so he says, 277 00:16:00,720 --> 00:16:03,400 Speaker 1: you know what, I'm with the bookies, I'm going to 278 00:16:03,480 --> 00:16:07,120 Speaker 1: boycott the race as well. Not one horse from my 279 00:16:07,360 --> 00:16:12,840 Speaker 1: stable will participate in your little Kentucky Derby, and we're 280 00:16:12,920 --> 00:16:18,160 Speaker 1: not gonna play ball until the bookies return. Derby leadership 281 00:16:18,360 --> 00:16:22,240 Speaker 1: calls his bluff. That pisses him off even more. He 282 00:16:22,360 --> 00:16:27,080 Speaker 1: goes to talk to his other horse owning friends. What's 283 00:16:27,160 --> 00:16:30,480 Speaker 1: the word for a guy who owns horses the way 284 00:16:30,480 --> 00:16:31,480 Speaker 1: you own a restaurant? 285 00:16:31,600 --> 00:16:32,160 Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know. 286 00:16:32,840 --> 00:16:36,040 Speaker 1: A horseboy, horseboy, horsemen? 287 00:16:38,320 --> 00:16:39,760 Speaker 3: Yeah, I don't know. 288 00:16:39,840 --> 00:16:42,120 Speaker 4: I'm sticking with horseboy for just about everything pertaining to 289 00:16:42,160 --> 00:16:44,200 Speaker 4: the topic because I just love it so much. This 290 00:16:44,320 --> 00:16:48,080 Speaker 4: was bad news, right, This was like borderline devastating because 291 00:16:48,080 --> 00:16:50,640 Speaker 4: everyone starts to join in with these boycotts, other people 292 00:16:50,680 --> 00:16:53,640 Speaker 4: that have interest in the book, making nests of it all, 293 00:16:54,560 --> 00:16:58,680 Speaker 4: other owners, other you know, gamblers, et cetera. And while 294 00:16:58,680 --> 00:17:01,400 Speaker 4: the bookies did return the fire year in eighteen eighty seven, 295 00:17:01,640 --> 00:17:04,080 Speaker 4: the damage had kind of been done at least up 296 00:17:04,160 --> 00:17:06,359 Speaker 4: until some changes took place. 297 00:17:07,040 --> 00:17:13,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, this pattern continues until Churchill Downs goes so far 298 00:17:13,600 --> 00:17:20,239 Speaker 1: Churchill Downhill that it is going to be closed and 299 00:17:20,320 --> 00:17:24,200 Speaker 1: bankrupt around nineteen oh three. So it gets sold off 300 00:17:24,680 --> 00:17:29,760 Speaker 1: and a new crew steps in another colonel of course. Yeah, 301 00:17:29,840 --> 00:17:33,840 Speaker 1: his name's Matt Wynn. He's also from Louisville. And Churchill 302 00:17:33,920 --> 00:17:38,680 Speaker 1: Downs manages to repair its reputation. It becomes the number 303 00:17:38,800 --> 00:17:43,240 Speaker 1: one race for three year old thoroughbreds here in the 304 00:17:43,440 --> 00:17:44,520 Speaker 1: United States. 305 00:17:44,880 --> 00:17:47,679 Speaker 3: So let's just say that you're a jockey or what 306 00:17:47,680 --> 00:17:48,240 Speaker 3: do you say, a. 307 00:17:48,160 --> 00:17:52,560 Speaker 4: Horse lord, you know, the horse lord's fun and you 308 00:17:52,680 --> 00:17:56,080 Speaker 4: got a nagger affiliate or stallion that wins over there 309 00:17:56,119 --> 00:17:59,840 Speaker 4: at the Kentucky Derby. Well, I mean, wouldn't you want 310 00:17:59,840 --> 00:18:00,480 Speaker 4: to keep going? 311 00:18:00,840 --> 00:18:05,399 Speaker 1: Why stop? There, says everybody with a gambling problem. After 312 00:18:05,520 --> 00:18:10,119 Speaker 1: winning the Derby, horse owners start sending their horses in 313 00:18:10,200 --> 00:18:14,080 Speaker 1: the US to compete in two other races, the Preakness 314 00:18:14,080 --> 00:18:18,440 Speaker 1: Steaks in Baltimore and then the Belmont Steaks in Elmont, 315 00:18:18,680 --> 00:18:19,160 Speaker 1: New York. 316 00:18:19,640 --> 00:18:21,320 Speaker 3: In Belmont, New York, why don't they call it the 317 00:18:21,359 --> 00:18:23,600 Speaker 3: Elmont Steaks. That doesn't make any sense to me. 318 00:18:24,080 --> 00:18:24,960 Speaker 1: It's a whole thing. 319 00:18:25,320 --> 00:18:27,680 Speaker 3: Also, the Preakness. Doesn't that sound like a thing you'd 320 00:18:27,680 --> 00:18:30,040 Speaker 3: say about something that was really rad Like that is 321 00:18:30,080 --> 00:18:32,159 Speaker 3: the Preakness, The absolutely ruickness, you know. 322 00:18:32,359 --> 00:18:35,600 Speaker 1: Right, like the ability of having or the capability of 323 00:18:35,640 --> 00:18:39,080 Speaker 1: having the peak of a These always strikes me like 324 00:18:39,200 --> 00:18:43,840 Speaker 1: Jinko's are Preakness nineteen nineties jeans peak Preakness. 325 00:18:43,880 --> 00:18:46,800 Speaker 4: Indeed, So these other races were pre existing, but it 326 00:18:46,840 --> 00:18:49,520 Speaker 4: was just kind of like the success of the Kentucky 327 00:18:49,520 --> 00:18:51,719 Speaker 4: Derby kind of elevated them in a way because they 328 00:18:51,720 --> 00:18:53,080 Speaker 4: were the only other games in town. 329 00:18:53,520 --> 00:18:59,480 Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, they're pretty profitable races. In nineteen nineteen, there's 330 00:18:59,520 --> 00:19:03,840 Speaker 1: a horse named Sir Barton who is owned by a 331 00:19:04,000 --> 00:19:09,560 Speaker 1: human named John E. Madden, and Madden is also from Kentucky. Anyway, 332 00:19:09,680 --> 00:19:15,040 Speaker 1: Sir Barton wins all three of these races, the Kentucky Derby, 333 00:19:15,160 --> 00:19:19,240 Speaker 1: the Preakness Stakes, and the Belmont Steaks. This means the 334 00:19:19,320 --> 00:19:23,360 Speaker 1: Guy was the first triple Crown horse, a term we've 335 00:19:23,400 --> 00:19:27,320 Speaker 1: all heard before, but the term itself isn't used until 336 00:19:27,440 --> 00:19:28,800 Speaker 1: more than a decade later. 337 00:19:29,160 --> 00:19:29,600 Speaker 3: That's right. 338 00:19:29,680 --> 00:19:33,760 Speaker 4: A second horse named Gallant Fox also won all three. 339 00:19:34,400 --> 00:19:35,680 Speaker 3: Is this what they call the triple crown? 340 00:19:36,080 --> 00:19:40,919 Speaker 1: This is the triple crown because Gallant Fox inspired the 341 00:19:41,040 --> 00:19:44,879 Speaker 1: sports writer of the time, Charles Hatten, to popularize the 342 00:19:45,000 --> 00:19:50,679 Speaker 1: term triple crown. And this launches huge public interest, not 343 00:19:50,960 --> 00:19:54,480 Speaker 1: just in the States, but across the world, right, because 344 00:19:54,520 --> 00:19:57,920 Speaker 1: we learned this from England, and we learned this from France. 345 00:19:58,400 --> 00:20:01,960 Speaker 1: And there's a dark side because everyone in the US 346 00:20:02,560 --> 00:20:07,600 Speaker 1: is at this time fueled with a growing interest in 347 00:20:07,640 --> 00:20:12,920 Speaker 1: the pseudoscience of eugenics and social Darwinism, and they started 348 00:20:12,960 --> 00:20:17,200 Speaker 1: asking each other in certain circles whether it was possible 349 00:20:17,280 --> 00:20:20,240 Speaker 1: to breed a quote unquote super horse, and. 350 00:20:20,160 --> 00:20:21,880 Speaker 3: If we can do it with horses, maybe we can 351 00:20:21,960 --> 00:20:22,840 Speaker 3: do it with people. 352 00:20:23,640 --> 00:20:24,280 Speaker 1: Yeah. 353 00:20:24,400 --> 00:20:28,280 Speaker 4: It's weird, dude, The idea of like observing these specimens 354 00:20:28,320 --> 00:20:31,479 Speaker 4: being put through their paces. It just kind of like, well, 355 00:20:31,480 --> 00:20:32,960 Speaker 4: you're gonna get to it, Ben, I mean, I don't 356 00:20:32,960 --> 00:20:35,840 Speaker 4: mean to scoop it, but you know, with athletes that 357 00:20:35,960 --> 00:20:38,199 Speaker 4: put themselves through the ringer, you know, whether it be 358 00:20:38,280 --> 00:20:43,800 Speaker 4: training or drug enhancement, they know what they're doing, right, Yeah. 359 00:20:43,720 --> 00:20:45,439 Speaker 3: Yeah, we'll get to it. Lets let's talk a little bit. 360 00:20:45,520 --> 00:20:47,160 Speaker 3: Let's talk a little bit about the Triple Crown. 361 00:20:47,800 --> 00:20:52,000 Speaker 4: Since nineteen thirty one, the Triple Crown races have happened 362 00:20:52,000 --> 00:20:54,680 Speaker 4: in a specific order, for you win the Derby, then 363 00:20:54,720 --> 00:20:59,200 Speaker 4: the Preakness, and then the Belmont. First live radio broadcast 364 00:20:59,280 --> 00:21:02,280 Speaker 4: of the Derby came on May sixteenth, nineteen twenty five, 365 00:21:02,280 --> 00:21:04,520 Speaker 4: where you would have just had some absolute rapid fire 366 00:21:04,600 --> 00:21:06,880 Speaker 4: mid Atlantic follow. 367 00:21:06,640 --> 00:21:13,439 Speaker 1: By Babada's Charlie Brown left, tors bang, thank you, thank you. 368 00:21:13,480 --> 00:21:15,560 Speaker 4: We're gonna get into some really fun horse names, but 369 00:21:15,920 --> 00:21:18,560 Speaker 4: it just it's become such a joke in the best 370 00:21:18,600 --> 00:21:20,840 Speaker 4: possible way, these absurd horse names. And that's what I 371 00:21:20,840 --> 00:21:22,720 Speaker 4: think of when I think of the Kentucky Derby. Is 372 00:21:22,760 --> 00:21:26,000 Speaker 4: this that cartoonish kind of coverage. 373 00:21:25,520 --> 00:21:31,000 Speaker 1: Right, And if we fast forward, the first television coverage 374 00:21:31,080 --> 00:21:35,800 Speaker 1: aired on May seventh, nineteen forty nine, that was regional 375 00:21:36,040 --> 00:21:40,399 Speaker 1: and was pre recorded. The first national television coverage airs 376 00:21:40,440 --> 00:21:45,160 Speaker 1: on May third, nineteen fifty two. This feeds public interest. 377 00:21:45,320 --> 00:21:48,240 Speaker 1: This is great for the bookies. This is great for 378 00:21:48,320 --> 00:21:52,160 Speaker 1: the people who own and sell the horses. In nineteen 379 00:21:52,359 --> 00:21:58,200 Speaker 1: fifty four, just a few years later, the official prize 380 00:21:58,320 --> 00:22:02,719 Speaker 1: they call it a purse for first place, exceeds one 381 00:22:02,840 --> 00:22:07,720 Speaker 1: hundred thousand US dollars. In nineteen fifty four, if we 382 00:22:07,760 --> 00:22:11,639 Speaker 1: can throw to an inflation calculator, Max, give us a 383 00:22:11,680 --> 00:22:13,040 Speaker 1: wildly different boop. 384 00:22:18,119 --> 00:22:20,639 Speaker 3: Oh my god, that's relaxing, Rex. 385 00:22:21,320 --> 00:22:25,639 Speaker 4: Yeah, we got around one point two million dollars in 386 00:22:25,680 --> 00:22:26,760 Speaker 4: today's dollars. 387 00:22:27,160 --> 00:22:30,840 Speaker 1: Yeah, one billion, nearly one point three Yeah, one million, 388 00:22:30,880 --> 00:22:34,120 Speaker 1: two hundred thou nine and twenty one dollars and ninety 389 00:22:34,320 --> 00:22:38,320 Speaker 1: three cents. Uh. This is a big business, and like 390 00:22:38,400 --> 00:22:43,320 Speaker 1: all big businesses with serious money on the line, serious 391 00:22:43,359 --> 00:22:46,720 Speaker 1: problems come to light and you set it up so well. 392 00:22:46,760 --> 00:22:51,840 Speaker 1: In the human athletes then and now fall victim to 393 00:22:52,080 --> 00:22:57,320 Speaker 1: accusations of doping, and horses are no different. Here's another 394 00:22:57,440 --> 00:23:02,679 Speaker 1: horse name. We love a horse named Dancers image in 395 00:23:02,800 --> 00:23:03,960 Speaker 1: nineteen sixty eight. 396 00:23:04,320 --> 00:23:07,880 Speaker 4: That's right, Dancer's image in nineteen sixty eight was found 397 00:23:08,000 --> 00:23:12,520 Speaker 4: to contain the horse contained traces of an anti inflammatory 398 00:23:12,560 --> 00:23:15,560 Speaker 4: painkiller called phenal beautazone. 399 00:23:15,720 --> 00:23:20,639 Speaker 1: Yeah, unlike human athletes, our equine friends don't possess the 400 00:23:20,920 --> 00:23:25,240 Speaker 1: ability to consent to being doped or drugged, and they 401 00:23:25,240 --> 00:23:29,720 Speaker 1: don't have the capacity to understand what's being forced upon them. 402 00:23:30,119 --> 00:23:34,119 Speaker 1: This is just the beginning with issues surrounding animal racing, 403 00:23:34,520 --> 00:23:38,040 Speaker 1: from camels to dogs to horses. People oppose this. 404 00:23:38,280 --> 00:23:40,040 Speaker 4: Do you remember there was a I think it was 405 00:23:40,040 --> 00:23:43,639 Speaker 4: an HBO television series about horse racing that happened a 406 00:23:43,680 --> 00:23:48,199 Speaker 4: handful of years ago, and it was canceled very quickly, 407 00:23:48,280 --> 00:23:50,600 Speaker 4: maybe even before the season ended, because of it was 408 00:23:50,640 --> 00:23:53,640 Speaker 4: just rampant abuse of the animals, because they were trying 409 00:23:53,640 --> 00:23:55,680 Speaker 4: to make it as real as possible, and the only 410 00:23:55,680 --> 00:23:57,360 Speaker 4: way to make it as real as possible is to 411 00:23:57,640 --> 00:24:01,080 Speaker 4: treat the animals with a lot of, you know, brutality. 412 00:24:01,359 --> 00:24:01,560 Speaker 1: Yeah. 413 00:24:01,560 --> 00:24:05,640 Speaker 4: The show is called Luck and it was canceled due 414 00:24:05,640 --> 00:24:09,199 Speaker 4: to the deaths of three horses during its production. This 415 00:24:09,320 --> 00:24:12,520 Speaker 4: was a Dustin Hoffman vehicle and Pete got in the mix. 416 00:24:12,600 --> 00:24:15,120 Speaker 3: And so I'm saying, if that's what they're doing in a. 417 00:24:15,119 --> 00:24:19,639 Speaker 4: TV show to paint an accurate picture of this era, 418 00:24:20,600 --> 00:24:21,240 Speaker 4: what must. 419 00:24:21,080 --> 00:24:23,520 Speaker 3: Have been like you know, in the era. 420 00:24:24,000 --> 00:24:27,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, definitely an odor in the court, which is also 421 00:24:27,280 --> 00:24:32,280 Speaker 1: a name of a real life racehorse. Look. Just last year, 422 00:24:32,440 --> 00:24:37,679 Speaker 1: twenty twenty four, a journalist named Kalia Richardson from Rolling 423 00:24:37,760 --> 00:24:43,840 Speaker 1: Stone dove into the controversy surrounding racehorses. She said, quote 424 00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:47,959 Speaker 1: corruption and a witted all costs mentality have long been 425 00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:51,200 Speaker 1: a part of horse racing, but in recent years that 426 00:24:51,320 --> 00:24:57,160 Speaker 1: culture has led to dire consequences. The FBI got involved, folks. 427 00:24:57,520 --> 00:25:02,720 Speaker 1: More than two dozen people were charged with secretly distributing 428 00:25:02,880 --> 00:25:07,159 Speaker 1: drugs to race horses in twenty twenty and in twenty 429 00:25:07,200 --> 00:25:12,320 Speaker 1: twenty three, not that long ago, twelve horses. A dozen 430 00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:18,000 Speaker 1: horses died at Churchill Downs immediately before and after the race. 431 00:25:18,560 --> 00:25:22,040 Speaker 4: And Ben, you pointed out in your research that the 432 00:25:22,080 --> 00:25:25,119 Speaker 4: New York Times documentary Broken Horses is a good watch 433 00:25:25,160 --> 00:25:26,840 Speaker 4: if you want to dig a little deeper. Plus, we 434 00:25:26,920 --> 00:25:29,080 Speaker 4: have explorations of this on our other show stuff they 435 00:25:29,080 --> 00:25:31,480 Speaker 4: don't want you to know, along with our pal Matt Frederick. 436 00:25:31,560 --> 00:25:34,639 Speaker 1: And our pal Dylan, the Tennessee pal Fagan. 437 00:25:34,840 --> 00:25:36,840 Speaker 3: Yes, indeed also a bit of a horse point. 438 00:25:43,720 --> 00:25:46,439 Speaker 1: So we didn't want to leave you without a dope, 439 00:25:47,320 --> 00:25:51,800 Speaker 1: hoof to trot to dress hodge is weird. A lot 440 00:25:51,800 --> 00:25:57,400 Speaker 1: of people comment about the Kentucky Derby in terms of 441 00:25:58,240 --> 00:26:03,320 Speaker 1: social like social import right, So when you are looking 442 00:26:03,359 --> 00:26:06,280 Speaker 1: at the derby and the actual derby, by the way, 443 00:26:06,440 --> 00:26:09,439 Speaker 1: the actual horse racing is a very small part of 444 00:26:09,440 --> 00:26:13,479 Speaker 1: the modern experience. A lot of times the media is 445 00:26:13,520 --> 00:26:18,879 Speaker 1: going to focus on the fashion, the eye popping hats. Noel, 446 00:26:19,080 --> 00:26:23,480 Speaker 1: this is where you and I learned about something called fascinators. 447 00:26:23,880 --> 00:26:26,840 Speaker 3: Yeah, not to be confused with terrifiers. That's very different. 448 00:26:26,880 --> 00:26:32,280 Speaker 3: It's his own thing. Fascinators are a super posh accessory. 449 00:26:32,680 --> 00:26:39,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it's weird. Imagine the fanciest hat pin or 450 00:26:39,160 --> 00:26:44,240 Speaker 1: headband ever. It's a hairclip times a million. They're colorful, 451 00:26:44,280 --> 00:26:48,439 Speaker 1: they're vibrant. People wear them to stand out at the 452 00:26:48,520 --> 00:26:51,560 Speaker 1: Kentucky Derby, even if they're not wearing a hat. 453 00:26:51,840 --> 00:26:54,440 Speaker 4: Can I just say that I really love that National 454 00:26:54,440 --> 00:26:58,320 Speaker 4: Geographic is commenting on this as though they're like observing. 455 00:26:57,840 --> 00:27:00,479 Speaker 3: Like animals in the wild, and not the horses. 456 00:27:00,520 --> 00:27:03,119 Speaker 4: I'm talking about the people, you know, and these weird 457 00:27:03,280 --> 00:27:07,600 Speaker 4: mating rituals like peacocking around with their bizarre hats. I'm 458 00:27:07,640 --> 00:27:10,240 Speaker 4: sure we saw some like some of those crazy taxidermy 459 00:27:10,240 --> 00:27:13,440 Speaker 4: hat type situations that we've discussed I believe with our 460 00:27:13,440 --> 00:27:14,920 Speaker 4: buddy aj Bahamas. 461 00:27:15,200 --> 00:27:19,240 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, good callback, Noel. This reminds me of being 462 00:27:19,320 --> 00:27:25,880 Speaker 1: in college and looking at anthropological satire like the Nasserrema. 463 00:27:26,840 --> 00:27:29,400 Speaker 3: Dude, I love that. Yeah, I talk about that any 464 00:27:29,440 --> 00:27:31,040 Speaker 3: recent episode of stuff. They don't want you to know. 465 00:27:31,560 --> 00:27:32,560 Speaker 3: Let's not spoil it. 466 00:27:32,560 --> 00:27:36,200 Speaker 4: It's just a it's a sociological deep dive that will 467 00:27:36,520 --> 00:27:38,240 Speaker 4: tickle you satire. 468 00:27:38,400 --> 00:27:43,600 Speaker 1: We hope we also know that sombreros are common at 469 00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:44,680 Speaker 1: the Kentucky Derby. 470 00:27:44,800 --> 00:27:46,040 Speaker 3: Yeah, that threw me a little bit. 471 00:27:46,440 --> 00:27:48,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean it's a type of hat. 472 00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:49,520 Speaker 3: It is a type of hat. 473 00:27:49,560 --> 00:27:52,800 Speaker 4: But I mean, are we talking like Mexican sombreros or 474 00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:54,160 Speaker 4: is there is that not. 475 00:27:54,280 --> 00:27:57,480 Speaker 3: Like a bit a culturally appropriate of but maybe I'm I. 476 00:27:57,440 --> 00:28:02,720 Speaker 1: Mean it's more surface area port, more flowery stuff and 477 00:28:02,840 --> 00:28:06,960 Speaker 1: ribbons on it. These people are walking around with full 478 00:28:07,040 --> 00:28:08,840 Speaker 1: floral arrangements on your shirts. 479 00:28:08,880 --> 00:28:09,680 Speaker 3: I guess it's a good point. 480 00:28:10,000 --> 00:28:12,560 Speaker 4: Also, they're also walking around being intensely white and the 481 00:28:12,680 --> 00:28:13,880 Speaker 4: same they're. 482 00:28:13,680 --> 00:28:20,240 Speaker 1: Also appropriating the earlier races in England and France. 483 00:28:20,359 --> 00:28:22,199 Speaker 3: Not to mention Yeah, No, it's a good point this. 484 00:28:23,160 --> 00:28:24,959 Speaker 4: I won't be too pedantic about it, just that when 485 00:28:24,960 --> 00:28:26,600 Speaker 4: I saw some breras that threw me for a bit 486 00:28:26,640 --> 00:28:27,119 Speaker 4: of a loop. 487 00:28:27,840 --> 00:28:30,720 Speaker 3: We also have a term that I've seen. 488 00:28:31,040 --> 00:28:34,159 Speaker 4: It's one of those better Minehoff things in literature, A 489 00:28:34,160 --> 00:28:37,800 Speaker 4: good bit recently, the idea of a close which can 490 00:28:37,920 --> 00:28:40,920 Speaker 4: just be described like as a bunch of things like 491 00:28:40,960 --> 00:28:43,480 Speaker 4: a tide ribbon under your chin would be a closeh 492 00:28:43,800 --> 00:28:48,440 Speaker 4: But it's also here, very specifically, a style of accessor. 493 00:28:48,360 --> 00:28:53,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, like a bucket hat, a pillbox hat. This goes 494 00:28:53,240 --> 00:28:56,320 Speaker 1: so deep it could be an episode all its own. 495 00:28:56,640 --> 00:29:00,680 Speaker 1: We're probably not the ones. We're not the have dashers 496 00:29:00,800 --> 00:29:04,560 Speaker 1: you're looking for. We can tell you for anybody who 497 00:29:04,760 --> 00:29:07,840 Speaker 1: just asked, wait, I'm a guy, what do I wear 498 00:29:08,000 --> 00:29:11,080 Speaker 1: the Kentucky Derby, we can tell you can wear a 499 00:29:11,120 --> 00:29:15,800 Speaker 1: bowler hat once upon a time known as a Derby hat. 500 00:29:16,960 --> 00:29:22,480 Speaker 4: Yea the Brown Derby in Los Angeles, famous Hollywood hot 501 00:29:22,520 --> 00:29:24,920 Speaker 4: spot in the golden age of cinema. 502 00:29:25,120 --> 00:29:29,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, you can rock a pork pie here in the States. 503 00:29:29,400 --> 00:29:34,040 Speaker 1: Over in Louisville, Kentucky. You can wear a fedora for 504 00:29:34,120 --> 00:29:37,640 Speaker 1: the Kentucky Derby people won't be mad at you. The 505 00:29:37,680 --> 00:29:43,719 Speaker 1: custom hats are apparently quite expensive. There's a Kentucky Derby 506 00:29:43,960 --> 00:29:50,520 Speaker 1: Museum milliner named Jenny Fanisdale who told Business Insider that 507 00:29:50,640 --> 00:29:54,920 Speaker 1: people pay upwards of five hundred to six hundred dollars 508 00:29:55,320 --> 00:29:59,920 Speaker 1: US for a custom hat that they only wear once. 509 00:30:00,400 --> 00:30:02,440 Speaker 1: That seems like a lot of money for a one 510 00:30:02,640 --> 00:30:06,440 Speaker 1: use thing, but who are we to judge? 511 00:30:06,640 --> 00:30:09,520 Speaker 4: I have to say something just to correct myself, the 512 00:30:09,600 --> 00:30:12,520 Speaker 4: word klosh. I was totally wrong about what it was. 513 00:30:12,680 --> 00:30:14,000 Speaker 4: I knew i'd seen it, But you know what it 514 00:30:14,040 --> 00:30:16,720 Speaker 4: also is, Ben. It's the thing that you put over 515 00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:21,000 Speaker 4: food for the big reveal the domes. It's called a klosh. 516 00:30:21,320 --> 00:30:23,320 Speaker 4: I'm sorry. I said it was a bunch of ribbons, 517 00:30:23,320 --> 00:30:26,000 Speaker 4: and that was its own thing that you already mentioned 518 00:30:26,000 --> 00:30:28,440 Speaker 4: as well. But a klosh is that dome thing with 519 00:30:28,440 --> 00:30:30,480 Speaker 4: the little handle that you pull off to reveal the 520 00:30:30,520 --> 00:30:31,600 Speaker 4: fancy chicken or whatever. 521 00:30:31,880 --> 00:30:35,200 Speaker 1: I love it. And now, as we're wrapping up the 522 00:30:35,280 --> 00:30:39,680 Speaker 1: history of the Kentucky Derby, which is really a history 523 00:30:39,760 --> 00:30:43,800 Speaker 1: of Americans or Yanks trying to catch up with the British, 524 00:30:44,040 --> 00:30:48,200 Speaker 1: we could not picture a better ending than giving you 525 00:30:48,280 --> 00:30:55,360 Speaker 1: some of our favorite kooky racehorse names. I love goat Zapper, 526 00:30:55,880 --> 00:30:59,440 Speaker 1: I love po too. 527 00:31:00,080 --> 00:31:01,040 Speaker 3: Yeah, tell us about that one. 528 00:31:01,040 --> 00:31:03,400 Speaker 4: I believe there was a fun typo situation that led 529 00:31:03,400 --> 00:31:03,960 Speaker 4: to that name. 530 00:31:04,400 --> 00:31:08,400 Speaker 1: Yeah. So this is a horse from the seventeen hundreds, 531 00:31:08,840 --> 00:31:12,880 Speaker 1: and his owner asked the kid working at the stables 532 00:31:13,320 --> 00:31:17,760 Speaker 1: to write the horse's name down. The horse was called Potatoes. 533 00:31:18,200 --> 00:31:23,960 Speaker 1: That's what he responded to. The kid wrote pot and 534 00:31:24,000 --> 00:31:27,880 Speaker 1: then wrote the letter O eight times, and the owner 535 00:31:28,040 --> 00:31:31,040 Speaker 1: loved it, and so now the horse's name is historically 536 00:31:31,400 --> 00:31:33,720 Speaker 1: po two. 537 00:31:34,040 --> 00:31:36,160 Speaker 3: It's like one of those like you're trying to, you know, 538 00:31:36,240 --> 00:31:38,320 Speaker 3: make it hard for people to find you on social media, 539 00:31:38,360 --> 00:31:40,800 Speaker 3: and so you put like a very specific number of 540 00:31:40,880 --> 00:31:43,800 Speaker 3: like o's or i's or whatever. Have we talked about? 541 00:31:43,840 --> 00:31:45,800 Speaker 3: Hoof hearted? Hoof hearted? 542 00:31:46,400 --> 00:31:48,000 Speaker 1: I love who hearted? Yeah? 543 00:31:48,040 --> 00:31:48,480 Speaker 3: Who heard? 544 00:31:48,560 --> 00:31:49,640 Speaker 1: Can you say it five times? 545 00:31:49,720 --> 00:31:51,320 Speaker 3: I don't want to. I'm not going to do it. 546 00:31:51,360 --> 00:31:53,480 Speaker 4: Okay, who farted? That's how you say. It's all about 547 00:31:53,480 --> 00:31:56,560 Speaker 4: where he put the em fastus. And just just to 548 00:31:57,160 --> 00:32:00,400 Speaker 4: crib a little bit from Britannica here, at firstance, they 549 00:32:00,400 --> 00:32:04,160 Speaker 4: say hoof hearted seemed like a charming and appropriate. 550 00:32:03,600 --> 00:32:05,040 Speaker 3: Name for an equine friend. 551 00:32:05,360 --> 00:32:07,200 Speaker 4: But if you say it five times fast as you 552 00:32:07,240 --> 00:32:09,520 Speaker 4: pointed out, and you'll realize it's a clever dublo tendre 553 00:32:09,800 --> 00:32:11,800 Speaker 4: that made it past jockey club sensors. 554 00:32:11,800 --> 00:32:14,880 Speaker 3: And that's a big part of this whole horse naming game. 555 00:32:15,600 --> 00:32:19,000 Speaker 4: Got another one, are uh? And then I also some 556 00:32:19,080 --> 00:32:22,240 Speaker 4: more modern ones. I found a minute ago. Let's see 557 00:32:22,280 --> 00:32:23,120 Speaker 4: if I can find it. 558 00:32:23,800 --> 00:32:27,720 Speaker 1: Oh, I love ben Dover, no pun left behind. I 559 00:32:27,840 --> 00:32:34,160 Speaker 1: love sofa king fast. Get it sofa space king space fast, 560 00:32:34,600 --> 00:32:35,720 Speaker 1: but say it quickly. 561 00:32:36,160 --> 00:32:40,240 Speaker 4: That's a good old gag there, like a sofa king stupid. Also, 562 00:32:40,240 --> 00:32:43,760 Speaker 4: it's fine, We've got no souper. No, It's just it's 563 00:32:43,840 --> 00:32:46,160 Speaker 4: just an old gang. It's like it's where you like 564 00:32:46,200 --> 00:32:48,080 Speaker 4: write it down and then you ask someone to say 565 00:32:48,080 --> 00:32:50,280 Speaker 4: it over and over again, and then they end up saying, 566 00:32:50,280 --> 00:32:52,600 Speaker 4: I am so fuck gang stupid. You know, it's like 567 00:32:52,640 --> 00:32:56,000 Speaker 4: a it's a gag. It's a goof classic no soup 568 00:32:56,040 --> 00:33:00,640 Speaker 4: for you from the peak times of Seinfeld. We've got 569 00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:03,720 Speaker 4: bodacious tatas from nineteen eighty five. 570 00:33:05,040 --> 00:33:10,000 Speaker 1: Let's see, we've got Anita Bath, We've got Hugh Jass, 571 00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:11,960 Speaker 1: We've got Chester drawers. 572 00:33:12,000 --> 00:33:15,800 Speaker 4: Yeah, these are all Bart Simpson prank phone calls. Basically 573 00:33:16,560 --> 00:33:20,360 Speaker 4: Branjelina from two thousand and five, Peak Brad and Angelina time, 574 00:33:21,080 --> 00:33:21,959 Speaker 4: what am I chopped? 575 00:33:21,960 --> 00:33:24,360 Speaker 3: Liver? All one on one word. 576 00:33:24,720 --> 00:33:27,080 Speaker 1: I like the ones that are like a sentence. 577 00:33:27,600 --> 00:33:30,760 Speaker 4: Oh not everything, yeah, from two thousand and eight. We 578 00:33:30,800 --> 00:33:32,680 Speaker 4: have one, just so, where's the beef? 579 00:33:34,600 --> 00:33:37,240 Speaker 1: We have some that are pushing the limits. And I 580 00:33:37,320 --> 00:33:40,000 Speaker 1: want to give a shout out to ideal horse name, 581 00:33:40,360 --> 00:33:43,640 Speaker 1: who seems very into this. I was not aware of, 582 00:33:43,640 --> 00:33:48,719 Speaker 1: you guys that there is literally a horse called maya 583 00:33:49,720 --> 00:33:51,440 Speaker 1: enormous boot. 584 00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:55,000 Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah, and we couldn't. 585 00:33:55,080 --> 00:33:58,280 Speaker 4: We couldn't end today's episode without talking about Panty Raid 586 00:33:58,880 --> 00:33:59,880 Speaker 4: Panti of course. 587 00:34:00,080 --> 00:34:03,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, put some respect on his name. Midnight Charger, ghost Zapper. 588 00:34:04,080 --> 00:34:05,440 Speaker 1: We got Max coming in. 589 00:34:05,400 --> 00:34:06,320 Speaker 3: Hot, all right. 590 00:34:06,400 --> 00:34:09,480 Speaker 2: So, as there always is for these things, there is 591 00:34:09,520 --> 00:34:12,440 Speaker 2: of course a random horse name generator. 592 00:34:12,600 --> 00:34:13,560 Speaker 3: Love it guy. 593 00:34:14,000 --> 00:34:15,160 Speaker 2: You guys want to here's someone's like. 594 00:34:15,239 --> 00:34:18,319 Speaker 1: Yeah, play the game. This is like, uh, this is 595 00:34:18,400 --> 00:34:22,160 Speaker 1: like when I was reading weird words from that reference word. 596 00:34:22,200 --> 00:34:24,120 Speaker 2: So I'm going to say the name. You tell me 597 00:34:24,160 --> 00:34:28,000 Speaker 2: what the horse looks like or like sounds like here 598 00:34:28,000 --> 00:34:30,840 Speaker 2: are something. We got a majestic mirage. 599 00:34:31,400 --> 00:34:34,120 Speaker 1: It's clearly a horse. 600 00:34:34,520 --> 00:34:36,360 Speaker 3: Wait, what are you asking, Max, you're asking it to 601 00:34:36,400 --> 00:34:37,320 Speaker 3: describe the horse. 602 00:34:37,440 --> 00:34:39,239 Speaker 2: Yeah, what what do you think? Why why would we 603 00:34:39,320 --> 00:34:39,879 Speaker 2: name this horse? 604 00:34:39,920 --> 00:34:42,080 Speaker 4: I couldn't possibly answer that. I have no frame of 605 00:34:42,080 --> 00:34:44,400 Speaker 4: reference for any name to horse ratio. 606 00:34:44,560 --> 00:34:46,240 Speaker 1: There's no logic or reason. 607 00:34:46,600 --> 00:34:48,320 Speaker 3: Yeah to this, I think that's the point. 608 00:34:48,480 --> 00:34:50,480 Speaker 2: How about Thunderbolt Tango. 609 00:34:51,080 --> 00:34:53,320 Speaker 3: Maybe he's got like a yeah, a bit of a stripe. 610 00:34:53,600 --> 00:34:57,279 Speaker 1: That horse has a tank top, it loves the savannah bananas, 611 00:34:57,960 --> 00:34:59,960 Speaker 1: and it probably does scratch offs. 612 00:35:00,000 --> 00:35:01,839 Speaker 4: I'm also picturing it as being the kind of little 613 00:35:01,920 --> 00:35:04,120 Speaker 4: pony that like a cowboy might ride, maybe with like 614 00:35:04,160 --> 00:35:06,560 Speaker 4: a lightning streak stripe along its side. 615 00:35:06,760 --> 00:35:09,120 Speaker 3: Now I'm thinking of just race cars. I don't know, last. 616 00:35:08,920 --> 00:35:15,279 Speaker 2: One worst one, and I got velvet Nebula's. 617 00:35:13,760 --> 00:35:19,640 Speaker 1: Oh oh luscious fur. I would say, uh, probably machine 618 00:35:19,719 --> 00:35:20,600 Speaker 1: night rider. 619 00:35:20,400 --> 00:35:21,120 Speaker 3: Bit of achine. 620 00:35:21,280 --> 00:35:23,399 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it's a fun to pet. 621 00:35:23,680 --> 00:35:25,960 Speaker 2: I think I'm gonna use that nickname now, going for it, 622 00:35:26,040 --> 00:35:27,759 Speaker 2: but for something very different. 623 00:35:27,719 --> 00:35:28,120 Speaker 3: Was it again? 624 00:35:28,239 --> 00:35:31,920 Speaker 4: Velvet velvet Nebula, Velvet Nebula, Yeah, because I'm also now 625 00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:33,200 Speaker 4: thinking of space stuff. 626 00:35:33,200 --> 00:35:36,000 Speaker 3: I'm thinking of inper. 627 00:35:35,239 --> 00:35:38,560 Speaker 1: NASA for sure, first horse on the Moon. I am 628 00:35:38,600 --> 00:35:42,880 Speaker 1: super into it. Hey, hey, Max, you're gonna use Velvet 629 00:35:42,920 --> 00:35:44,880 Speaker 1: Nebula as your new persona. 630 00:35:45,400 --> 00:35:48,160 Speaker 2: I think I am, and you can be my starry Strider. 631 00:35:49,560 --> 00:35:50,800 Speaker 3: That's really sweet. What can I be? 632 00:35:51,080 --> 00:35:53,280 Speaker 2: You can be my moon shadow dancer. 633 00:35:53,640 --> 00:35:55,319 Speaker 3: Oh I love that, Thank you so love it. 634 00:35:55,719 --> 00:35:59,919 Speaker 1: That's very uh, that's very Van Morrison. Right, marvelous night. 635 00:35:59,840 --> 00:36:01,800 Speaker 3: For moon dances doing jazz hands. 636 00:36:02,120 --> 00:36:05,200 Speaker 1: We don't even have time to get into the traditional 637 00:36:05,239 --> 00:36:09,520 Speaker 1: cuisine of the Kentucky Derby, but we do have time 638 00:36:09,560 --> 00:36:13,120 Speaker 1: to thank you so much for tuning in, friends and neighbors, 639 00:36:13,160 --> 00:36:16,680 Speaker 1: fellow ridiculous historians. We're gonna call it a day. Thank 640 00:36:16,719 --> 00:36:22,160 Speaker 1: you as always to our super producer, Velvet Nebula. Max. 641 00:36:22,200 --> 00:36:24,839 Speaker 1: We're gonna use your horse name from now on. 642 00:36:25,320 --> 00:36:27,160 Speaker 3: Bet are you talking, by the way, are you talking 643 00:36:27,160 --> 00:36:28,120 Speaker 3: about the Hot Brown? 644 00:36:29,960 --> 00:36:34,360 Speaker 4: There's some funny dishes associated with the Oh my goodness, 645 00:36:34,480 --> 00:36:36,239 Speaker 4: but look at hop, y'all, it's worth it. 646 00:36:36,280 --> 00:36:37,800 Speaker 3: And if if it's if you're. 647 00:36:37,760 --> 00:36:41,480 Speaker 4: Familiar with other big, big, big money type of legacy 648 00:36:41,520 --> 00:36:45,040 Speaker 4: events like the Masters where they've got these famous pimento 649 00:36:45,120 --> 00:36:48,279 Speaker 4: cheese sandwiches or whatever. Oh yeah, I've never had one 650 00:36:48,440 --> 00:36:51,320 Speaker 4: and I grew up there, but yeah, the Hot Brown 651 00:36:51,440 --> 00:36:54,600 Speaker 4: classic Kentucky open face sandwich. It's just turkey and bacon 652 00:36:54,680 --> 00:36:57,120 Speaker 4: and some sort of gravy it looks like. 653 00:36:57,640 --> 00:37:01,080 Speaker 1: And big thanks as well to Alex Williams who compose 654 00:37:01,160 --> 00:37:05,200 Speaker 1: this banking track. Big thanks to aj Bahamas, Jacobs, Doctor 655 00:37:05,320 --> 00:37:09,680 Speaker 1: Rachel Big, Spinach, Lance Oh and our new friend Ross 656 00:37:09,680 --> 00:37:10,680 Speaker 1: bettish Man. 657 00:37:10,760 --> 00:37:12,080 Speaker 3: Ross is so cool I hope to have him back 658 00:37:12,080 --> 00:37:13,000 Speaker 3: again Talk ninety some. 659 00:37:13,640 --> 00:37:16,439 Speaker 4: He literally brought in the scope of the show time 660 00:37:16,480 --> 00:37:17,800 Speaker 4: wise with his very presence. 661 00:37:18,520 --> 00:37:20,520 Speaker 3: Thanks to you as well. Ben, This is a great one. 662 00:37:20,800 --> 00:37:23,080 Speaker 4: Thanks for bringing this and doing all the research on 663 00:37:23,120 --> 00:37:24,040 Speaker 4: the Kentucky Derby. 664 00:37:24,280 --> 00:37:28,759 Speaker 1: We'll see you next time. Anita Bath, Dixie Enormous, jack Niehoff, 665 00:37:29,040 --> 00:37:33,560 Speaker 1: Pat Mind, Wildie Stroker, and of course Buck Naked Hand. 666 00:37:33,840 --> 00:37:36,000 Speaker 3: We'll see you next time, folks. 667 00:37:42,800 --> 00:37:46,640 Speaker 4: For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 668 00:37:46,719 --> 00:37:48,840 Speaker 4: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.