1 00:00:02,320 --> 00:00:05,440 Speaker 1: Happy Saturday everyone. This is gonna be a couple of 2 00:00:05,480 --> 00:00:08,080 Speaker 1: weeks in the past by the time this Saturday episode 3 00:00:08,119 --> 00:00:11,080 Speaker 1: comes out, But as we are recording it, a few 4 00:00:11,160 --> 00:00:14,200 Speaker 1: days ago, Prince Harry, the Duke of Sussex and Meghan, 5 00:00:14,360 --> 00:00:17,480 Speaker 1: Duchess of Sussex announced that they were stepping away from 6 00:00:17,520 --> 00:00:20,520 Speaker 1: their duties as senior members of the British Royal family. 7 00:00:21,079 --> 00:00:24,239 Speaker 1: And after what seems, at least from my outsider's perspective 8 00:00:24,280 --> 00:00:27,320 Speaker 1: to have been a very chaotic few days for the royals, 9 00:00:27,560 --> 00:00:30,000 Speaker 1: Queen Elizabeth the Second issued a statement that she and 10 00:00:30,040 --> 00:00:33,360 Speaker 1: the royal family were quote entirely supportive of Harry and 11 00:00:33,400 --> 00:00:36,879 Speaker 1: Megan's desire to create a new life. That announcement was 12 00:00:37,000 --> 00:00:40,440 Speaker 1: just yesterday. As of whin we're recording this tomorrow, it 13 00:00:40,479 --> 00:00:44,440 Speaker 1: could all explode, I know, who knows. Of course, this 14 00:00:44,560 --> 00:00:47,360 Speaker 1: put us in the mind of another famous stepping away 15 00:00:47,400 --> 00:00:49,880 Speaker 1: from the British Royal family, one that had a very 16 00:00:49,920 --> 00:00:53,479 Speaker 1: different tone and outcome, and that's the constitutional crisis that 17 00:00:53,600 --> 00:00:56,120 Speaker 1: led to the abdication of King Edward the eighth after 18 00:00:56,160 --> 00:01:00,480 Speaker 1: he announced his proposal to Mary Wallace Simpson. So we're 19 00:01:00,480 --> 00:01:02,960 Speaker 1: going to have that episode today and whenever we have 20 00:01:03,040 --> 00:01:06,039 Speaker 1: shared that episode on our social media. Folks have left 21 00:01:06,080 --> 00:01:09,120 Speaker 1: various comments about the Duke and Duchess of Windsor's Nazi 22 00:01:09,200 --> 00:01:12,600 Speaker 1: sympathies that like kind of a gotcha, but like we 23 00:01:12,720 --> 00:01:17,840 Speaker 1: know Katie and Sarah who who recorded these episodes, they 24 00:01:17,920 --> 00:01:20,080 Speaker 1: knew it also and talked about it in the episode, 25 00:01:20,120 --> 00:01:24,119 Speaker 1: and then they also put out an episode on that topic, specifically, 26 00:01:24,720 --> 00:01:28,000 Speaker 1: especially related to the contents of an FBI file on 27 00:01:28,040 --> 00:01:31,160 Speaker 1: the Windsors. Both of these episodes, which came out, as 28 00:01:31,160 --> 00:01:34,240 Speaker 1: I said, they're a bit shorter than our episodes typically 29 00:01:34,240 --> 00:01:36,600 Speaker 1: are today, so we are putting them out together today 30 00:01:36,760 --> 00:01:43,360 Speaker 1: as sort of a Saturday Classic doubleheater. So enjoying Welcome 31 00:01:43,400 --> 00:01:45,880 Speaker 1: to Stuff You Missed in History Class, a production of 32 00:01:45,959 --> 00:01:54,720 Speaker 1: I Heart Radios How Stuff Works. Hello, and welcome to 33 00:01:54,720 --> 00:01:58,000 Speaker 1: the podcast. I'm Katie Lambert and I'm Sarah Dowie and 34 00:01:58,120 --> 00:02:00,520 Speaker 1: Katie and I have had so much fun and talking 35 00:02:00,520 --> 00:02:03,760 Speaker 1: about royal scandals recently that we're going to talk about 36 00:02:03,760 --> 00:02:07,080 Speaker 1: at least one more. This one is from the twentieth century, though, 37 00:02:07,840 --> 00:02:11,280 Speaker 1: so in nineteen thirty six, Britain's King Edward the eight 38 00:02:11,760 --> 00:02:14,919 Speaker 1: renounced his throne in order to marry an American divorce 39 00:02:15,160 --> 00:02:18,480 Speaker 1: named Wallace Simpson, and he was the only British sovereign 40 00:02:18,520 --> 00:02:21,600 Speaker 1: ever to voluntarily resign the crown. So this is a 41 00:02:21,639 --> 00:02:24,720 Speaker 1: big deal. Yeah. It forces his shy younger brother to 42 00:02:24,760 --> 00:02:28,400 Speaker 1: become king, which ends up putting his eldest daughter in 43 00:02:28,440 --> 00:02:32,600 Speaker 1: the line of succession. That becomes Elizabeth the second Um 44 00:02:32,720 --> 00:02:36,920 Speaker 1: and Edward and Wallace are shunned by the injured royal family. 45 00:02:36,960 --> 00:02:41,280 Speaker 1: They travel the world, they hobnob with Nazis, and they 46 00:02:41,320 --> 00:02:45,639 Speaker 1: become style icons. But there's a big question about their relationship, 47 00:02:45,680 --> 00:02:48,639 Speaker 1: and that's what Is it a great love story? Did 48 00:02:48,639 --> 00:02:52,440 Speaker 1: he give up his throne um to marry the woman 49 00:02:52,520 --> 00:02:56,560 Speaker 1: he loved or is there something more tragic? So let's 50 00:02:56,639 --> 00:03:00,760 Speaker 1: meet our major players. Bessie Wallace war Field was born 51 00:03:00,840 --> 00:03:04,399 Speaker 1: June nineteenth, eighteen ninety six in Pennsylvania, but she grew 52 00:03:04,480 --> 00:03:07,200 Speaker 1: up in Baltimore and her birth was a bit of 53 00:03:07,200 --> 00:03:10,120 Speaker 1: a scandal because she was born only seven months after 54 00:03:10,160 --> 00:03:13,280 Speaker 1: her parents marriage. So do the math. Yeah, and they 55 00:03:13,280 --> 00:03:17,840 Speaker 1: were from a fairly elite family and society definitely cared 56 00:03:17,880 --> 00:03:20,400 Speaker 1: about that kind of thing. Her father died when she 57 00:03:20,480 --> 00:03:23,079 Speaker 1: was only five months old, though, and her mother had 58 00:03:23,120 --> 00:03:26,720 Speaker 1: to rely on handouts from a wealthy relative. She grew 59 00:03:26,840 --> 00:03:30,000 Speaker 1: up in Maryland and attended the Old Field School and 60 00:03:30,080 --> 00:03:33,200 Speaker 1: dumped her first name, And I kind of loved this quote. 61 00:03:33,240 --> 00:03:36,800 Speaker 1: She said that so many cows are called Bessie, so 62 00:03:37,000 --> 00:03:41,240 Speaker 1: she goes by Wallace instead. So she's part of high 63 00:03:41,280 --> 00:03:44,200 Speaker 1: society because she's born into it, but she's not because 64 00:03:44,200 --> 00:03:46,840 Speaker 1: she doesn't have the money. And this really bugs her. 65 00:03:47,240 --> 00:03:49,640 Speaker 1: So she needs to find a way in, and she 66 00:03:49,720 --> 00:03:53,440 Speaker 1: decides the way in is marriage, and she marries Earl W. 67 00:03:53,680 --> 00:03:56,560 Speaker 1: Spencer and navy pilot in nineteen sixteen, but it's a 68 00:03:56,560 --> 00:03:59,920 Speaker 1: complete disaster from the start. Her husband was an alcoholic 69 00:04:00,080 --> 00:04:02,960 Speaker 1: and he was very moody, and she ends up leaving him. 70 00:04:02,960 --> 00:04:05,840 Speaker 1: She has a short affair after that and lives in 71 00:04:05,960 --> 00:04:10,400 Speaker 1: Virginia for a time, but after her divorce, she has 72 00:04:10,440 --> 00:04:14,880 Speaker 1: another longer lasting affair with the then married Ernest Simpson, 73 00:04:15,040 --> 00:04:18,039 Speaker 1: who was a US born brit and she writes to 74 00:04:18,080 --> 00:04:20,800 Speaker 1: her mother, I really feel so tired of fighting the 75 00:04:20,800 --> 00:04:24,119 Speaker 1: world all alone and with no money. So it sounds 76 00:04:24,160 --> 00:04:26,360 Speaker 1: like she kind of settles for him well, and I 77 00:04:26,680 --> 00:04:29,560 Speaker 1: have sympathy for that sentiment. But they end up getting 78 00:04:29,560 --> 00:04:32,800 Speaker 1: married in ninety eight and they live near London. But 79 00:04:33,040 --> 00:04:37,839 Speaker 1: later she meets a more illustrious personage. That's Edward, Prince 80 00:04:37,839 --> 00:04:40,560 Speaker 1: of Wales, and she meets him at a house party 81 00:04:40,600 --> 00:04:44,200 Speaker 1: given by his mistress at the time, Lady Thelma Furnace. 82 00:04:44,760 --> 00:04:49,360 Speaker 1: So she's thirty five years old and married. But Wallace 83 00:04:49,440 --> 00:04:53,599 Speaker 1: has something seductive about her, something that draws this prince 84 00:04:53,680 --> 00:04:56,120 Speaker 1: to her. And who is he? Well, this is the 85 00:04:56,200 --> 00:05:00,200 Speaker 1: story of Edward. He was born June and he has 86 00:05:00,240 --> 00:05:04,960 Speaker 1: pretty much the longest name ever Edward Albert Christian George 87 00:05:05,000 --> 00:05:09,359 Speaker 1: Andrew Patrick David, so his friends called him David. And 88 00:05:09,440 --> 00:05:12,520 Speaker 1: he becomes Prince of Wales in nineteen eleven. He's really 89 00:05:12,560 --> 00:05:17,400 Speaker 1: not suited to his position. It exhausts him. He feels isolated, 90 00:05:17,520 --> 00:05:20,640 Speaker 1: and he's a frivolous young man. He's into drinking and 91 00:05:20,680 --> 00:05:25,400 Speaker 1: womanizing and clothes and he likes clothes. Yeah, he one 92 00:05:25,400 --> 00:05:29,880 Speaker 1: point writes to his longtime mistress and friend before his 93 00:05:30,040 --> 00:05:33,880 Speaker 1: mistress before he meets Wallace. If only the British public 94 00:05:33,960 --> 00:05:37,280 Speaker 1: really knew what a weak, powerless misery their press made 95 00:05:37,360 --> 00:05:40,640 Speaker 1: national hero was, they would have a nasty shock and 96 00:05:40,720 --> 00:05:44,360 Speaker 1: be not only disappointed, but damned angry too, and he 97 00:05:44,560 --> 00:05:48,560 Speaker 1: was a national hero. He was incredibly popular, and partly 98 00:05:48,600 --> 00:05:52,320 Speaker 1: that's because in the nineteen twenties he undertook extensive foreign 99 00:05:52,320 --> 00:05:55,440 Speaker 1: tours in the Empire to represent his father because he 100 00:05:55,480 --> 00:05:59,120 Speaker 1: wasn't allowed to serve in the army as crown prince. 101 00:05:59,360 --> 00:06:01,960 Speaker 1: He's they want to put him into the direct line 102 00:06:01,960 --> 00:06:06,159 Speaker 1: of danger. But yeah, he becomes very popular with his people, 103 00:06:06,520 --> 00:06:10,159 Speaker 1: and he's a you know, they're bright, young prince. He's 104 00:06:10,200 --> 00:06:12,880 Speaker 1: also during the twenties having a lot of affairs with 105 00:06:13,000 --> 00:06:17,440 Speaker 1: married women. Um and kind of a weird side note 106 00:06:17,480 --> 00:06:20,599 Speaker 1: that is really not related to anything here. He's somewhat 107 00:06:20,640 --> 00:06:24,680 Speaker 1: of an authority on horticulture, especially roses. His father gave 108 00:06:24,760 --> 00:06:29,560 Speaker 1: him a refuge, fort Belvedere, and he entertained his friends there, 109 00:06:29,600 --> 00:06:33,080 Speaker 1: and he had a he had an unconventional set of friends. 110 00:06:33,120 --> 00:06:38,040 Speaker 1: They weren't drawn from just the same aristocracy that generations 111 00:06:38,120 --> 00:06:41,120 Speaker 1: of monarchs have been hanging out with. They were more 112 00:06:41,200 --> 00:06:44,120 Speaker 1: like the high society. Right, So we've gotten this picture, 113 00:06:44,200 --> 00:06:48,240 Speaker 1: you know, Champagne and roses and clothes and lots of women, 114 00:06:48,360 --> 00:06:51,839 Speaker 1: but soon there's only one woman. So after Wallace and 115 00:06:51,960 --> 00:06:54,720 Speaker 1: Edward meet, they're just friendly for a while. But by 116 00:06:54,839 --> 00:06:57,680 Speaker 1: nineteen thirty four, Edward is a regular visitor to the 117 00:06:57,720 --> 00:07:01,880 Speaker 1: Simpson home and the relations ship is probably consummated around 118 00:07:01,880 --> 00:07:04,800 Speaker 1: this time, not to be too detailed. Yeah, and she 119 00:07:04,839 --> 00:07:09,039 Speaker 1: tells her aunt it requires great tact to manage both men. 120 00:07:09,520 --> 00:07:12,360 Speaker 1: I shall try to keep them both. So she's got 121 00:07:12,360 --> 00:07:16,680 Speaker 1: her husband having your cake and to eat him. And 122 00:07:16,960 --> 00:07:20,720 Speaker 1: it's not a discreet affair at all. They really flaunt it. 123 00:07:21,080 --> 00:07:23,720 Speaker 1: And you know, it was accepted that the king or 124 00:07:24,040 --> 00:07:27,480 Speaker 1: um the prince would have a mistress, but it would 125 00:07:27,520 --> 00:07:30,400 Speaker 1: be somebody who he would visit from time to time 126 00:07:30,440 --> 00:07:35,000 Speaker 1: and certainly not parade about in public and at public events. Well, 127 00:07:35,040 --> 00:07:38,400 Speaker 1: and not a married woman who also has another ex husband. Yeah, 128 00:07:39,000 --> 00:07:43,520 Speaker 1: But Edward becomes obsessed with Wallace and she's kind of 129 00:07:43,680 --> 00:07:46,800 Speaker 1: got a bullying personality and he likes it. She makes 130 00:07:46,880 --> 00:07:50,240 Speaker 1: him put on her shoes for her. Yeah, he's into that. 131 00:07:50,720 --> 00:07:53,440 Speaker 1: So the affair was kept out of most of the 132 00:07:53,440 --> 00:07:57,720 Speaker 1: British papers until the very end of edwards Kingship. It 133 00:07:57,840 --> 00:08:01,440 Speaker 1: was just a suppressed story. But it is a scandal 134 00:08:01,560 --> 00:08:04,480 Speaker 1: in America and a lot of the continent, where in 135 00:08:04,560 --> 00:08:08,240 Speaker 1: every paper. Yeah, it's it's kind of the original British 136 00:08:08,360 --> 00:08:13,360 Speaker 1: royal tabloid scandal, and Edward is proclaimed king at the 137 00:08:13,400 --> 00:08:16,880 Speaker 1: beginning of nineteen thirty six when his father dies, and 138 00:08:17,000 --> 00:08:20,239 Speaker 1: around the same time Wallace sues for divorce in July 139 00:08:20,360 --> 00:08:24,880 Speaker 1: of nineteen thirty six. So upon her divorce, of course 140 00:08:25,120 --> 00:08:29,480 Speaker 1: comes the next question will they marry? Edward wants to 141 00:08:29,520 --> 00:08:33,000 Speaker 1: marry Wallace, and he tries to get his family's acceptance 142 00:08:33,080 --> 00:08:36,120 Speaker 1: and they're not going for it at all. Also against 143 00:08:36,240 --> 00:08:38,720 Speaker 1: him as the Church of England of which he's head, 144 00:08:39,600 --> 00:08:42,479 Speaker 1: and most of the politicians in Britain and the Commonwealth. 145 00:08:42,559 --> 00:08:47,240 Speaker 1: His only notable allies Churchill, who's out of power at 146 00:08:47,280 --> 00:08:52,040 Speaker 1: the time. And another sort of side note. Churchill has 147 00:08:52,040 --> 00:08:56,319 Speaker 1: a reputation as being a bit of a yeah, but 148 00:08:56,720 --> 00:09:00,000 Speaker 1: his biographer said probably the only occasion when he address 149 00:09:00,040 --> 00:09:02,840 Speaker 1: us the House of Commons under the influence of alcohol, 150 00:09:02,960 --> 00:09:07,079 Speaker 1: not drunk but kind of tipsy, was during the abdication crisis, 151 00:09:07,120 --> 00:09:11,120 Speaker 1: when he's actually howled down and there are discussions of 152 00:09:11,160 --> 00:09:13,920 Speaker 1: a Morganatic marriage pursued, which is something we talked a 153 00:09:13,960 --> 00:09:16,800 Speaker 1: little bit about in the Madame de Montenal podcast. Yea 154 00:09:16,840 --> 00:09:21,160 Speaker 1: a marriage of social inequals right where she wouldn't become queen, 155 00:09:22,160 --> 00:09:26,160 Speaker 1: but they would be together and their children wouldn't inherit right. 156 00:09:26,559 --> 00:09:29,880 Speaker 1: But Prime Minister Stanley Baldwin tells Edward that is absolutely 157 00:09:29,920 --> 00:09:32,840 Speaker 1: not happening. It's not an option. And Edward wants to 158 00:09:32,920 --> 00:09:36,840 Speaker 1: also address his people through the radio pleading for their support, 159 00:09:37,000 --> 00:09:40,600 Speaker 1: and the that's not going to happen either. It's not allowed, 160 00:09:41,000 --> 00:09:43,800 Speaker 1: simply not done. He did write a speech though, and 161 00:09:43,840 --> 00:09:46,040 Speaker 1: in it he wrote, it has taken me a long 162 00:09:46,080 --> 00:09:49,440 Speaker 1: time to find the woman I want to make my wife. Yeah, 163 00:09:49,480 --> 00:09:52,440 Speaker 1: for real life without her, I have been a very 164 00:09:52,480 --> 00:09:55,920 Speaker 1: lonely man. So this is from his band speech. But 165 00:09:56,360 --> 00:09:59,280 Speaker 1: the whole thing really explodes in the press in Parliament 166 00:09:59,280 --> 00:10:02,760 Speaker 1: on December word and on the following day the word 167 00:10:02,800 --> 00:10:07,439 Speaker 1: abdication starts appearing in the papers. And before you start 168 00:10:07,480 --> 00:10:11,000 Speaker 1: to get too sympathetic towards the Prince for his you know, 169 00:10:12,000 --> 00:10:15,480 Speaker 1: romantic fairy tale love, we should talk a little bit 170 00:10:15,520 --> 00:10:17,720 Speaker 1: about some of the people who were suffering during this 171 00:10:17,760 --> 00:10:21,320 Speaker 1: whole thing. Yeah, his brother, known as Birdie to his family, 172 00:10:21,520 --> 00:10:25,920 Speaker 1: the future George the sixth, is really shy and he's 173 00:10:26,120 --> 00:10:29,720 Speaker 1: fought with a stammer. He's been forced to write with 174 00:10:29,760 --> 00:10:33,400 Speaker 1: his right hand, even though he's a lefty. And he's 175 00:10:33,440 --> 00:10:36,559 Speaker 1: also really happy where he is in life. He's married, 176 00:10:36,600 --> 00:10:40,680 Speaker 1: he has two young daughters, and he's terrified by the 177 00:10:40,720 --> 00:10:44,520 Speaker 1: prospect of becoming king. And his wife Elizabeth, told her 178 00:10:44,559 --> 00:10:47,520 Speaker 1: mother in law, Queen Mary, that she prayed every day 179 00:10:47,559 --> 00:10:50,640 Speaker 1: for the king to see reason and not abandon his people. 180 00:10:50,800 --> 00:10:54,280 Speaker 1: But as much as George didn't want to become king, 181 00:10:54,400 --> 00:10:56,959 Speaker 1: a lot of people thought he would be much better 182 00:10:57,040 --> 00:10:59,520 Speaker 1: at it than Edward was. Even his own father had 183 00:10:59,559 --> 00:11:02,000 Speaker 1: once said, I pray God that my eldest son will 184 00:11:02,040 --> 00:11:04,360 Speaker 1: never marry, and that nothing will come between Bertie and 185 00:11:04,440 --> 00:11:07,839 Speaker 1: Lilabet and the throne. And Lilabet is, of course now 186 00:11:07,880 --> 00:11:11,680 Speaker 1: Elizabeth the second Um. But still George isn't happy with 187 00:11:11,720 --> 00:11:15,520 Speaker 1: the prospect of becoming king, and he later records that 188 00:11:15,760 --> 00:11:19,080 Speaker 1: when he learned his brother would abdicate, I broke down 189 00:11:19,160 --> 00:11:22,640 Speaker 1: and sobbed like a child. So this is a tremendous 190 00:11:22,679 --> 00:11:27,000 Speaker 1: strain on him, and he's he's horrified by the duty 191 00:11:27,000 --> 00:11:30,319 Speaker 1: who's about to have to assume. But the king makes 192 00:11:30,320 --> 00:11:34,240 Speaker 1: his final decision December nineteen thirty six, and he submits 193 00:11:34,240 --> 00:11:38,599 Speaker 1: his abdication. I Edward do hereby declare my irrevocable determination 194 00:11:38,640 --> 00:11:42,240 Speaker 1: to renounce the throne for myself and my descendants. And 195 00:11:42,280 --> 00:11:46,280 Speaker 1: the instrument of abdication was endorsed by Parliament on December eleven, 196 00:11:46,440 --> 00:11:49,360 Speaker 1: and that evening Edward finally did get to have his 197 00:11:49,480 --> 00:11:53,760 Speaker 1: radio broadcast he had wanted pre abdication, and he tells 198 00:11:53,800 --> 00:11:56,560 Speaker 1: us people, I've found it impossible to carry the heavy 199 00:11:56,640 --> 00:11:59,920 Speaker 1: burden of responsibility and to discharge my duties as king 200 00:12:00,120 --> 00:12:02,760 Speaker 1: as I wished to do without the help and support 201 00:12:02,840 --> 00:12:05,800 Speaker 1: of the woman I love. A plea for sympathy, I've 202 00:12:05,800 --> 00:12:09,160 Speaker 1: ever heard one, And uh that night he disappears to 203 00:12:09,240 --> 00:12:11,960 Speaker 1: the wind. He goes to the continent and lives with 204 00:12:12,040 --> 00:12:16,560 Speaker 1: friends in Austria, discreetly apart from Wallace while her divorce 205 00:12:16,640 --> 00:12:22,120 Speaker 1: is finalized. And Wallace herself does not have a great reputation, 206 00:12:22,240 --> 00:12:25,720 Speaker 1: and at the time she was perceived as a schemer. 207 00:12:25,720 --> 00:12:28,440 Speaker 1: But was she because a document that was kept in 208 00:12:28,520 --> 00:12:32,040 Speaker 1: the private papers of Stanley Baldwin for years includes a 209 00:12:32,080 --> 00:12:35,400 Speaker 1: declaration that's signed by her before the abdication that said 210 00:12:35,440 --> 00:12:39,040 Speaker 1: she'd abandoned any interest in marrying His majesty wasn't even 211 00:12:39,880 --> 00:12:41,720 Speaker 1: what she was trying to get or at least she 212 00:12:41,720 --> 00:12:43,600 Speaker 1: signed a paper saying that wasn't what she was trying 213 00:12:43,640 --> 00:12:48,439 Speaker 1: to get. And even in edwards abdication speech, he mentions 214 00:12:48,559 --> 00:12:52,480 Speaker 1: that the the other person who is as closely involved 215 00:12:52,480 --> 00:12:55,080 Speaker 1: in this as I am, has urged me to the 216 00:12:55,160 --> 00:12:59,520 Speaker 1: last to not go through with it. So it seems 217 00:12:59,559 --> 00:13:02,880 Speaker 1: as the she was trying to talk him down from 218 00:13:02,920 --> 00:13:05,560 Speaker 1: actually giving up his throne. Well, and she had some 219 00:13:05,679 --> 00:13:09,440 Speaker 1: qualms about him. She was disturbed by how clingy he was. 220 00:13:09,600 --> 00:13:13,280 Speaker 1: And the quote that really struck us was when she 221 00:13:13,320 --> 00:13:15,600 Speaker 1: wrote to an uncle and said, how can a woman 222 00:13:15,679 --> 00:13:18,560 Speaker 1: be a whole empire to a man? And I think 223 00:13:18,559 --> 00:13:23,520 Speaker 1: that's the quote that really haunts their married life together, which, 224 00:13:24,040 --> 00:13:28,480 Speaker 1: after this whirlwind courtship and abdication, goes on for a 225 00:13:28,559 --> 00:13:41,959 Speaker 1: long time decades. So what's next. Edward is named the 226 00:13:42,040 --> 00:13:44,640 Speaker 1: Duke of Windsor by his brother, who's now George the sixth, 227 00:13:45,160 --> 00:13:49,640 Speaker 1: and Wallace's divorced. As finalized, they're married June third seven 228 00:13:49,720 --> 00:13:52,679 Speaker 1: by a Church of England clergyman at the Chateau de 229 00:13:52,800 --> 00:13:57,280 Speaker 1: Conde in France, and even though Wallace is now Duchess 230 00:13:57,280 --> 00:14:01,079 Speaker 1: of Windsor the title of Royal Highness is not extended 231 00:14:01,120 --> 00:14:03,760 Speaker 1: to her. That's a big deal. It is a big deal. 232 00:14:03,800 --> 00:14:06,960 Speaker 1: It's something that really bothers Edward for the rest of 233 00:14:07,040 --> 00:14:09,920 Speaker 1: his life. Um. They live in France for the next 234 00:14:09,920 --> 00:14:17,400 Speaker 1: two years and visit other countries, most famously visiting Germany asly. Um. 235 00:14:17,480 --> 00:14:21,080 Speaker 1: They're actually honored by Nazi officials in October of nineteen 236 00:14:21,120 --> 00:14:24,720 Speaker 1: thirty seven and have an interview with Hitler. Um. The 237 00:14:24,840 --> 00:14:28,240 Speaker 1: pro German sympathies of the couple end up becoming the 238 00:14:28,320 --> 00:14:32,920 Speaker 1: subject of an FBI investigation in nineteen one and also 239 00:14:33,080 --> 00:14:36,960 Speaker 1: the subject of a later podcast. So we're gonna sort 240 00:14:36,960 --> 00:14:40,320 Speaker 1: of skip over this Nazi period, so we'll jump ahead 241 00:14:40,400 --> 00:14:43,240 Speaker 1: to nineteen forty, when their pro Nazi sympathies have become 242 00:14:43,320 --> 00:14:46,840 Speaker 1: so obvious that Churchill has basically exiled them to the Bahamas. 243 00:14:47,240 --> 00:14:50,240 Speaker 1: The Duke is now the governor there, so they stay 244 00:14:50,280 --> 00:14:52,680 Speaker 1: in the Bahamas pretty much for the duration of the war, 245 00:14:52,840 --> 00:14:56,880 Speaker 1: returning to France in nineteen and they took up a 246 00:14:56,960 --> 00:15:00,960 Speaker 1: life as members of the international set at very flashy 247 00:15:01,080 --> 00:15:04,360 Speaker 1: celebrity kind of life that was reported in every single paper. 248 00:15:04,520 --> 00:15:08,240 Speaker 1: Time magazine even named Wallace Simpson their first Woman of 249 00:15:08,280 --> 00:15:10,360 Speaker 1: the Year. They've only had man of the year since 250 00:15:10,360 --> 00:15:13,480 Speaker 1: then because she was so talked about. Yeah, and pugs 251 00:15:13,480 --> 00:15:15,800 Speaker 1: and platinum or how I think Katie and I liked 252 00:15:15,800 --> 00:15:19,040 Speaker 1: to define them. I had eleven pugs at some point 253 00:15:19,040 --> 00:15:22,120 Speaker 1: and they had really cool names, Imp and Disraeli. Yeah, 254 00:15:22,160 --> 00:15:25,600 Speaker 1: she'd give them homemade dog biscuits and let them cuddle 255 00:15:25,680 --> 00:15:28,440 Speaker 1: up on her bed with her um. She was also 256 00:15:28,960 --> 00:15:33,560 Speaker 1: really into clothing and jewelry and were flashy stuff, big 257 00:15:33,680 --> 00:15:38,080 Speaker 1: jewels and lots of yellow gold. But interestingly, she banned 258 00:15:38,760 --> 00:15:42,760 Speaker 1: anything but platinum from her dinner parties. I guess it 259 00:15:42,760 --> 00:15:46,360 Speaker 1: seemed fancier to her. And while they were very rich, 260 00:15:46,840 --> 00:15:50,920 Speaker 1: Edward in his later years became very concerned about their finances. 261 00:15:50,960 --> 00:15:54,160 Speaker 1: He argued with his brother about his annual allowance and 262 00:15:54,240 --> 00:15:56,440 Speaker 1: refused to live in the United States as a private 263 00:15:56,440 --> 00:15:58,800 Speaker 1: citizen because he didn't want to deal with the taxes. Yeah. 264 00:15:58,840 --> 00:16:02,840 Speaker 1: I think that's to be expected for someone who was 265 00:16:03,040 --> 00:16:05,120 Speaker 1: born to be a king and who was king and 266 00:16:05,320 --> 00:16:09,520 Speaker 1: living has to settle for, you know, living like a 267 00:16:09,640 --> 00:16:14,080 Speaker 1: very wealthy man instead of a king. And Edward's personality, 268 00:16:14,240 --> 00:16:17,280 Speaker 1: not just his fortune, has also changed since the abdication. 269 00:16:17,520 --> 00:16:22,120 Speaker 1: He becomes as his biographer Philip Sigler says, reactionary to 270 00:16:22,160 --> 00:16:25,320 Speaker 1: the point of caricature, even though before the war he 271 00:16:25,400 --> 00:16:28,760 Speaker 1: had had many of the same values as conservatives. Yeah, 272 00:16:29,120 --> 00:16:33,840 Speaker 1: he's kind of embittered by his situation, and he's very 273 00:16:33,880 --> 00:16:37,760 Speaker 1: dependent on Wallace too. He's a very dependent husband, and 274 00:16:37,880 --> 00:16:41,920 Speaker 1: as we said earlier, still outraged over the fact that 275 00:16:42,360 --> 00:16:46,600 Speaker 1: she can't style herself as Royal highness right, and she's 276 00:16:46,600 --> 00:16:50,320 Speaker 1: not received as as she would be usually. So because 277 00:16:50,360 --> 00:16:53,280 Speaker 1: of some of this, he only makes short visits to England. 278 00:16:53,400 --> 00:16:55,720 Speaker 1: He goes back for the funeral of his brother, George 279 00:16:55,760 --> 00:16:57,920 Speaker 1: the sixth, and he goes back for the funeral of 280 00:16:57,960 --> 00:17:01,000 Speaker 1: his mother, Queen Mary, and he even fights upon Queen 281 00:17:01,040 --> 00:17:05,119 Speaker 1: Mary's death to Wallace, what a smug, stinking lot my 282 00:17:05,200 --> 00:17:08,320 Speaker 1: relations are. And you've never seen such a seedy, worn 283 00:17:08,320 --> 00:17:10,880 Speaker 1: out bunch of old hags. Most of them have become 284 00:17:11,280 --> 00:17:15,080 Speaker 1: so bitter, bitter words, very bitter. He's never gotten over 285 00:17:15,240 --> 00:17:19,080 Speaker 1: his family's unwillingness to accept Wallace as one of their own. 286 00:17:19,640 --> 00:17:22,840 Speaker 1: The Queen Mom always hated her, but her daughter, Elizabeth 287 00:17:22,840 --> 00:17:26,080 Speaker 1: the Second eventually attempted a reconciliation with Edward near the 288 00:17:26,119 --> 00:17:29,040 Speaker 1: end of his life, and he was very ill. He 289 00:17:29,160 --> 00:17:31,840 Speaker 1: was in bed dying a throat cancer, and his doctors 290 00:17:31,840 --> 00:17:34,560 Speaker 1: had taken care to cover up some of the tubing 291 00:17:34,720 --> 00:17:38,720 Speaker 1: and machinery that he was using to live. Yes, and 292 00:17:38,800 --> 00:17:41,159 Speaker 1: he was told not to get up because he was 293 00:17:41,200 --> 00:17:43,399 Speaker 1: so ill. But when she came in the room, he 294 00:17:43,520 --> 00:17:46,120 Speaker 1: rose and he bowed to her, and she was very 295 00:17:46,160 --> 00:17:49,840 Speaker 1: touched by that display of respect. So Edward dies of 296 00:17:49,960 --> 00:17:52,960 Speaker 1: his spirit cancer on the twenty eighth of May nineteen 297 00:17:53,000 --> 00:17:56,640 Speaker 1: seventy two in Paris and is buried near Windsor. And 298 00:17:56,880 --> 00:18:02,800 Speaker 1: the Duchess spent her remain inning time in isolation and 299 00:18:02,800 --> 00:18:07,560 Speaker 1: in inconcreasingly poor health. She's kind of lost without the Duke, 300 00:18:07,640 --> 00:18:11,080 Speaker 1: it seems, and she dies in nineteen six and is 301 00:18:11,119 --> 00:18:14,000 Speaker 1: buried behind her husband, at his request, in the Royal 302 00:18:14,040 --> 00:18:17,919 Speaker 1: Cemetery at Frogmore, also near Windsor Castle. But that's not 303 00:18:18,200 --> 00:18:21,159 Speaker 1: the end of our story, because several years ago, right 304 00:18:21,240 --> 00:18:25,360 Speaker 1: after the Queen Mother died there some new information came out. 305 00:18:25,359 --> 00:18:29,119 Speaker 1: The documents were really right that said maybe Wallace was 306 00:18:29,200 --> 00:18:31,920 Speaker 1: two timing Edward during their courtship. Actually there's no maybe 307 00:18:31,920 --> 00:18:35,680 Speaker 1: about it. She was so government papers from the time 308 00:18:35,680 --> 00:18:39,639 Speaker 1: of abdication were subject to a thirty year rule of secrecy, 309 00:18:39,640 --> 00:18:42,280 Speaker 1: you know, protecting people who are involved, and then some 310 00:18:42,359 --> 00:18:46,160 Speaker 1: were considered so sensitive that it was decided they wouldn't 311 00:18:46,160 --> 00:18:49,520 Speaker 1: be released for a hundred years. But after the Queen 312 00:18:49,560 --> 00:18:54,200 Speaker 1: Mother died Um, she was sort of the only living 313 00:18:55,040 --> 00:18:58,560 Speaker 1: UM person who was very much involved in the in 314 00:18:58,600 --> 00:19:02,440 Speaker 1: the documents. After she died, was decided the papers could 315 00:19:02,480 --> 00:19:06,920 Speaker 1: come out and they It turns out that both Simpson 316 00:19:07,080 --> 00:19:10,840 Speaker 1: and Edward were under surveillance by a special branch of 317 00:19:10,880 --> 00:19:15,320 Speaker 1: the Metropolitan Police. And while she was married pursuing her 318 00:19:15,359 --> 00:19:18,760 Speaker 1: affair with Edward, she also had a third lover named 319 00:19:18,840 --> 00:19:23,199 Speaker 1: Guy Trundle, a married car salesman who lived in Mayfair, 320 00:19:23,600 --> 00:19:27,040 Speaker 1: and he was a kept man. She gave him payments 321 00:19:27,160 --> 00:19:31,479 Speaker 1: and also expensive presence, and Edward had absolutely no idea. 322 00:19:31,520 --> 00:19:34,719 Speaker 1: Wallace went to great lengths to conceal his existence. There 323 00:19:34,760 --> 00:19:37,120 Speaker 1: was a lot on the line, I understand. So this 324 00:19:37,480 --> 00:19:39,560 Speaker 1: puts a little bit of a damper, i'd say, on 325 00:19:39,640 --> 00:19:43,479 Speaker 1: the on the fairytale romance, and it also shows just 326 00:19:43,560 --> 00:19:48,040 Speaker 1: how complex their relationship was. Biographies of Wallace seemed to 327 00:19:48,040 --> 00:19:51,920 Speaker 1: either go the way of being really salacious and gossipy 328 00:19:52,040 --> 00:19:54,719 Speaker 1: or whitewashing the entire thing. So so it's just a 329 00:19:54,720 --> 00:19:57,200 Speaker 1: grand romance, right, and it's and it's hard to find 330 00:19:57,200 --> 00:20:08,600 Speaker 1: that that middle bit. Definitely. Hello and welcome to the podcast. 331 00:20:08,640 --> 00:20:11,639 Speaker 1: I'm Katie Lambert and I'm Sarah Dowdy and Katie and 332 00:20:11,720 --> 00:20:15,000 Speaker 1: I talked about the glamorous jet setting life the Duke 333 00:20:15,040 --> 00:20:18,640 Speaker 1: and Duchess of Windsor in another podcast, and we only 334 00:20:18,800 --> 00:20:22,640 Speaker 1: briefly touched on what most people would consider the dark 335 00:20:22,720 --> 00:20:25,320 Speaker 1: side of their life. And a good symbol of the 336 00:20:25,440 --> 00:20:27,679 Speaker 1: dark side of their life would be the picture of 337 00:20:27,720 --> 00:20:30,680 Speaker 1: Adolf Hitler kissing the hand of the Duchess of Windsor, 338 00:20:30,880 --> 00:20:35,600 Speaker 1: which certainly does suggest problems, right, And this all starts 339 00:20:36,480 --> 00:20:40,600 Speaker 1: with a good example their wedding. They're much talked about wedding. 340 00:20:40,720 --> 00:20:43,439 Speaker 1: Wallace and Edward were married at the Chateau de Conde 341 00:20:43,640 --> 00:20:47,440 Speaker 1: in France, which was owned by a man named Charles Bideaux. 342 00:20:47,600 --> 00:20:50,320 Speaker 1: He was an eccentric millionaire known for his work with 343 00:20:50,359 --> 00:20:53,920 Speaker 1: scientific management and also for an expedition he sponsored called 344 00:20:53,960 --> 00:20:57,520 Speaker 1: the Champagne Safari, but he wasn't as well known for 345 00:20:57,600 --> 00:21:00,159 Speaker 1: his work for the Third Reich. He would lay or 346 00:21:00,240 --> 00:21:03,640 Speaker 1: kill himself right before he was put on trial for treason. 347 00:21:03,920 --> 00:21:07,040 Speaker 1: So from the very beginning, the shadow of the Nazis 348 00:21:07,160 --> 00:21:10,360 Speaker 1: is upon this couple. Yeah, and to give a little 349 00:21:10,480 --> 00:21:15,639 Speaker 1: context to why the once British king could feel sympathy 350 00:21:15,680 --> 00:21:19,760 Speaker 1: towards the Nazis, Edward feels as much German as English. 351 00:21:19,840 --> 00:21:24,520 Speaker 1: His great grandfather, Prince Albert, Victoria's husband is of German ancestry, 352 00:21:24,640 --> 00:21:28,800 Speaker 1: his mother Queen mary Um and he's also an ancestor 353 00:21:28,840 --> 00:21:32,359 Speaker 1: of King George the First, who is from a German family. 354 00:21:32,720 --> 00:21:36,760 Speaker 1: He even calls German his mother tongue. But after World 355 00:21:36,840 --> 00:21:40,800 Speaker 1: War One, the British monarchy wants to distance itself as 356 00:21:40,920 --> 00:21:45,200 Speaker 1: much as possible from its German heritage. Understandably, King George 357 00:21:45,240 --> 00:21:48,040 Speaker 1: the Fifth even changes their last name to Windsor from 358 00:21:48,119 --> 00:21:52,320 Speaker 1: saxocober Gotha, and Edward wants to reclaim this part of 359 00:21:52,320 --> 00:21:56,280 Speaker 1: his German heritage. And he also wasn't allowed to serve 360 00:21:56,320 --> 00:21:58,600 Speaker 1: in combat in World War One, and maybe that had 361 00:21:58,640 --> 00:22:02,440 Speaker 1: a little something to do with his love for the Germans. Yeah, 362 00:22:02,480 --> 00:22:05,160 Speaker 1: you would certainly think that fighting an enemy in World 363 00:22:05,240 --> 00:22:08,600 Speaker 1: War One would make you at least have some reservations 364 00:22:08,640 --> 00:22:11,199 Speaker 1: against them in the Second World War. But he's not 365 00:22:11,240 --> 00:22:13,760 Speaker 1: allowed to fight because he's the Crown Prince, and he 366 00:22:13,840 --> 00:22:17,080 Speaker 1: goes on sort of a publicity tour instead, which makes 367 00:22:17,119 --> 00:22:20,080 Speaker 1: him very popular with his own people, right, but when 368 00:22:20,160 --> 00:22:23,640 Speaker 1: he takes the throne, his sentiments are a bit at 369 00:22:23,680 --> 00:22:27,119 Speaker 1: odds with the rest of the British government. Hitler, of course, 370 00:22:27,240 --> 00:22:30,000 Speaker 1: is in power and Edward is a fan of his, 371 00:22:30,320 --> 00:22:33,879 Speaker 1: and the British government was not to put things simplistically, 372 00:22:34,600 --> 00:22:39,399 Speaker 1: when Hitler says he's sending forces into Rhineland, England says 373 00:22:39,480 --> 00:22:43,600 Speaker 1: that it supposed the government makes that known, and Edwards says, 374 00:22:43,640 --> 00:22:46,280 Speaker 1: both to his own government and to the German ambassador, 375 00:22:46,359 --> 00:22:49,960 Speaker 1: which was a huge breach of protocol. We're not opposed 376 00:22:50,000 --> 00:22:53,280 Speaker 1: to this. If you try to stop Hitler, I will abdicate. 377 00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:57,040 Speaker 1: So the threat of abdication actually came much earlier than 378 00:22:57,119 --> 00:22:59,879 Speaker 1: his actual abdication. Well, and it's so shocking here that 379 00:23:00,080 --> 00:23:04,200 Speaker 1: he's stepping far beyond the bounds of his figurehead sort 380 00:23:04,240 --> 00:23:08,240 Speaker 1: of position and actually threatening to take real action and 381 00:23:08,320 --> 00:23:12,080 Speaker 1: grasping at power. Yes, so he does abdicate to marry 382 00:23:12,160 --> 00:23:17,560 Speaker 1: twice divorced American woman Wallace Simpson. But back to being 383 00:23:17,680 --> 00:23:23,679 Speaker 1: a Nazi, Edward is pretty well informed politically, and he 384 00:23:23,760 --> 00:23:28,120 Speaker 1: has some real connections to the Nazi Party and two 385 00:23:28,119 --> 00:23:31,280 Speaker 1: people in power. Yeah. At a party in Vienna June 386 00:23:31,440 --> 00:23:35,600 Speaker 1: n seven, the Duke tells an Italian diplomat that the 387 00:23:35,680 --> 00:23:39,280 Speaker 1: US has cracked his country's intelligence code. So everybody is 388 00:23:39,359 --> 00:23:42,600 Speaker 1: kind of thinking, how does the Duke know this information 389 00:23:42,720 --> 00:23:45,239 Speaker 1: or how does he even have it. Bido sets up 390 00:23:45,280 --> 00:23:47,679 Speaker 1: for the couple a trip to Germany to meet Hitler 391 00:23:47,800 --> 00:23:50,800 Speaker 1: in October nineteen thirty seven, only a few months after 392 00:23:50,840 --> 00:23:53,359 Speaker 1: their marriage, right, and so they dine with him and 393 00:23:53,400 --> 00:23:56,080 Speaker 1: they're you know, the photo of Hitler kissing her hand, 394 00:23:56,720 --> 00:23:59,640 Speaker 1: and so we're not just talking about two people who 395 00:24:00,040 --> 00:24:04,760 Speaker 1: privately hold pro fascist sympathies. We're talking about people who 396 00:24:04,760 --> 00:24:07,959 Speaker 1: are making it obvious and again very at odds with 397 00:24:08,000 --> 00:24:10,439 Speaker 1: their own government. The photos of the Duke in Berlin 398 00:24:10,560 --> 00:24:14,200 Speaker 1: are used as Nazi propaganda. He even visits a training 399 00:24:14,280 --> 00:24:18,400 Speaker 1: camp which is reported about him seeing future Nazi leaders 400 00:24:18,520 --> 00:24:21,080 Speaker 1: and the Windsor set. The people who they hang out 401 00:24:21,119 --> 00:24:28,600 Speaker 1: with aren't drawn from regular aristocracy folks. It's celebrities. They're charming, 402 00:24:28,640 --> 00:24:31,720 Speaker 1: they're famous, and a lot of them are fascists. To write, 403 00:24:31,760 --> 00:24:35,560 Speaker 1: they hung out with other Nazi sympathizers such as Oswald 404 00:24:35,640 --> 00:24:39,040 Speaker 1: Mosley and his wife Diana Mitford. These two were actually 405 00:24:39,080 --> 00:24:43,159 Speaker 1: married in Joseph Gebel's house. He and Hitler were their witnesses, 406 00:24:43,320 --> 00:24:47,320 Speaker 1: and even more charming, Diana owned a diamond swastika necklace, 407 00:24:48,200 --> 00:24:50,520 Speaker 1: just a you know, special little detail about some of 408 00:24:50,560 --> 00:24:54,719 Speaker 1: their friends. Um and the Duke is frustrated at this 409 00:24:54,760 --> 00:24:58,520 Speaker 1: point that his family is dithering so much about what 410 00:24:58,720 --> 00:25:01,760 Speaker 1: his role will be it in what capacity will he 411 00:25:01,920 --> 00:25:05,119 Speaker 1: serve his country? And it's a it's a difficult question 412 00:25:05,119 --> 00:25:07,560 Speaker 1: because what do you give to a king who abdicates 413 00:25:07,560 --> 00:25:11,600 Speaker 1: you Obviously can't give him too much power, he's sacrificed it. 414 00:25:12,080 --> 00:25:14,080 Speaker 1: But he is the son of a king, and he's 415 00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:17,520 Speaker 1: someone who has been king, and he can't be completely sidelined, 416 00:25:17,840 --> 00:25:20,440 Speaker 1: and he wants power and he wants a voice. He's 417 00:25:20,520 --> 00:25:24,520 Speaker 1: advocating appeasement at this time, which was a very unpopular sentiment, 418 00:25:24,960 --> 00:25:27,760 Speaker 1: and he records an announcement in March nineteen thirty nine 419 00:25:27,920 --> 00:25:30,760 Speaker 1: urging peace with the Germans, and the BBCs is absolutely 420 00:25:30,840 --> 00:25:34,560 Speaker 1: not We're not airing that. So Britain declares war September 421 00:25:34,680 --> 00:25:37,760 Speaker 1: nineteen thirty nine, and the Duke is stationed in France 422 00:25:37,800 --> 00:25:43,560 Speaker 1: as a British liaison, but he's also communicating with the Nazis. 423 00:25:43,880 --> 00:25:46,160 Speaker 1: The German Minister mentions in a letter that he has 424 00:25:46,200 --> 00:25:49,320 Speaker 1: a direct line of contact to the Duke, and in 425 00:25:49,400 --> 00:25:53,159 Speaker 1: May nineteen forty, the Duke gets helpful information to Hitler 426 00:25:53,200 --> 00:25:56,520 Speaker 1: who's in Belgium and trying to invade France. And this 427 00:25:56,600 --> 00:25:59,080 Speaker 1: is when the red flags start popping up for people 428 00:25:59,160 --> 00:26:10,040 Speaker 1: like Winston church Chell. Yeah, the Duke is also the 429 00:26:10,080 --> 00:26:13,280 Speaker 1: one who tells the Germans that the Allies have their 430 00:26:13,320 --> 00:26:17,800 Speaker 1: plan for invading France. Consequently, uh the Nazis changed their 431 00:26:17,800 --> 00:26:22,880 Speaker 1: plan and Frances lost um. So there's an issue though. 432 00:26:22,920 --> 00:26:25,600 Speaker 1: The Duke and Duchess are in France when it falls, 433 00:26:25,680 --> 00:26:29,960 Speaker 1: and Churchill is terrified that the Nazis will kidnap them, 434 00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:32,399 Speaker 1: which is smart because that was actually the plan. The 435 00:26:32,480 --> 00:26:35,320 Speaker 1: Nazis wanted to kidnap Edward and they figured when Hitler 436 00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:38,199 Speaker 1: had conquered Great Britain, he could install Edward as the 437 00:26:38,200 --> 00:26:41,440 Speaker 1: puppet king, and then of course Wallace could be queen, 438 00:26:41,480 --> 00:26:45,160 Speaker 1: which was also her goal. And Joseph Gebel said about 439 00:26:45,160 --> 00:26:47,480 Speaker 1: the Duke, it's a shame he is no longer king 440 00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:50,199 Speaker 1: with him, we would have entered into an alliance. And 441 00:26:50,280 --> 00:26:52,240 Speaker 1: I'm going to say that if Gebel's is your biggest fan, 442 00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:55,800 Speaker 1: you might want to rethink what you're doing. The Duchess, meanwhile, 443 00:26:55,960 --> 00:26:59,640 Speaker 1: is hanging out with von Ribbon, Trope or Trop. We're 444 00:26:59,680 --> 00:27:02,359 Speaker 1: not entirely sure how to say that one who is 445 00:27:02,400 --> 00:27:05,520 Speaker 1: the Nazi Foreign Minister. Lots of people thought that he 446 00:27:05,600 --> 00:27:09,440 Speaker 1: was her lover. He supposedly sent her seventeen car nations 447 00:27:09,520 --> 00:27:12,760 Speaker 1: every day to represent the number of times they'd slept together. 448 00:27:13,400 --> 00:27:16,240 Speaker 1: And the British government is aware by this point that 449 00:27:16,320 --> 00:27:20,040 Speaker 1: the Duchess is having dealings with Ribbon Trop and they 450 00:27:20,280 --> 00:27:23,000 Speaker 1: keep moving them all around Europe to try to keep 451 00:27:23,040 --> 00:27:26,240 Speaker 1: them away from him. At one point they end up 452 00:27:26,320 --> 00:27:28,480 Speaker 1: moving them to Spain, but there are too many Nazi 453 00:27:28,520 --> 00:27:32,160 Speaker 1: sympathizers there and it doesn't stop the Duchess from corresponding 454 00:27:32,160 --> 00:27:35,159 Speaker 1: with him. So they move them to Portugal, but that 455 00:27:35,200 --> 00:27:38,160 Speaker 1: doesn't help either. She still manages to worm her way 456 00:27:38,160 --> 00:27:40,920 Speaker 1: in every single time, and the government is scared that 457 00:27:40,960 --> 00:27:43,680 Speaker 1: the Duke or the Duchess is going to say something 458 00:27:43,760 --> 00:27:48,720 Speaker 1: to the press about their Nazi sympathies. They want the 459 00:27:48,760 --> 00:27:50,560 Speaker 1: two of them where they can do no harm. The 460 00:27:50,600 --> 00:27:55,680 Speaker 1: idea is to neutralize their influence, shut them down basically. Um. 461 00:27:55,720 --> 00:27:58,359 Speaker 1: But they're having a good time hanging out with all 462 00:27:58,400 --> 00:28:02,000 Speaker 1: these German agents. It's all very glamorous for them, and 463 00:28:02,359 --> 00:28:06,119 Speaker 1: things do get more heated. Edward is giving statements to 464 00:28:06,160 --> 00:28:10,359 Speaker 1: the press that are very defeatist and kind of pro Nazi, 465 00:28:10,800 --> 00:28:15,359 Speaker 1: and Churchill orders him to come home or be court martialed, 466 00:28:15,359 --> 00:28:19,840 Speaker 1: and Edward responds that he's not coming back to England 467 00:28:19,960 --> 00:28:23,480 Speaker 1: until his wife is treated like royalty, which gets back 468 00:28:23,520 --> 00:28:26,720 Speaker 1: to an issued we discussed in our earlier podcast that 469 00:28:27,119 --> 00:28:30,280 Speaker 1: even though she was named the Duchess of Windsor, she 470 00:28:30,400 --> 00:28:35,399 Speaker 1: didn't have the title of Royal highness, and this is 471 00:28:35,440 --> 00:28:37,879 Speaker 1: a big sore point for the two of them. So 472 00:28:37,960 --> 00:28:40,920 Speaker 1: while they're in Portugal and July nineteen forty, the German 473 00:28:40,960 --> 00:28:44,560 Speaker 1: ambassador in Lisbon passes a message onto Berlin. The Duke 474 00:28:44,680 --> 00:28:48,000 Speaker 1: believes with certainty that continued heavy bombing would make England 475 00:28:48,040 --> 00:28:50,480 Speaker 1: ready for peace. So at this point the Duke is 476 00:28:50,520 --> 00:28:55,920 Speaker 1: advocating bombing his own people, which well, pretty shocking, yes, 477 00:28:56,720 --> 00:29:00,000 Speaker 1: And he also tells the Spanish Royal that England's government 478 00:29:00,040 --> 00:29:02,880 Speaker 1: it is going to collapse and that a new government 479 00:29:02,920 --> 00:29:06,280 Speaker 1: will take over and make peace with Germany and somehow 480 00:29:06,320 --> 00:29:09,800 Speaker 1: his brother George will abdicate and the Duke will get 481 00:29:09,800 --> 00:29:14,640 Speaker 1: to rules. So it's sounding pretty delusional, and Winston Churchill 482 00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:18,120 Speaker 1: knows the Duke is bad, bad news, and he's finally 483 00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:20,720 Speaker 1: had enough right about at this point is interesting too, 484 00:29:20,720 --> 00:29:25,040 Speaker 1: because Churchill was the Duke's major supporter when he was 485 00:29:25,120 --> 00:29:28,400 Speaker 1: a king, considering abdication well, and then he didn't know 486 00:29:28,520 --> 00:29:31,320 Speaker 1: about his his sympathies. It's not until the war he's 487 00:29:31,320 --> 00:29:36,080 Speaker 1: seen edwards hidden colors. So instead, the Duke and Duchess 488 00:29:36,120 --> 00:29:38,880 Speaker 1: are sent to the Bahamas in August ninety, where the 489 00:29:38,920 --> 00:29:42,440 Speaker 1: Duke will be governor, and the two of them hate this. 490 00:29:42,600 --> 00:29:45,400 Speaker 1: They absolutely hate it. They think of the Bahamas as 491 00:29:45,440 --> 00:29:50,120 Speaker 1: their Elba, which is really self aggrandizing, isn't it. Oh yeah, 492 00:29:50,320 --> 00:29:54,080 Speaker 1: we're just like Napoleon. And even there they're both still scheming. 493 00:29:54,200 --> 00:29:56,520 Speaker 1: Edwards trying to hang out on the yacht of axel 494 00:29:56,600 --> 00:29:59,760 Speaker 1: vennor Gren, who is the best friend of Hermann Goring, 495 00:29:59,840 --> 00:30:01,960 Speaker 1: and the British government says, are you kidding? No, that's 496 00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:05,160 Speaker 1: just not happening. And in December nineteen forty, the Duke 497 00:30:05,200 --> 00:30:07,560 Speaker 1: also gave an interview with Fulton our Slaur, who was 498 00:30:07,600 --> 00:30:10,520 Speaker 1: an American journalist, and in it he said that Hitler 499 00:30:10,600 --> 00:30:13,280 Speaker 1: was a great man and the right and logical leader 500 00:30:13,280 --> 00:30:16,600 Speaker 1: of Germany. And he also wanted Roosevelt to act as 501 00:30:16,640 --> 00:30:21,440 Speaker 1: some sort of mediator, which obviously Roosevelt, I mean, no way, 502 00:30:21,480 --> 00:30:26,120 Speaker 1: that's not happening. In one even Roosevelt put them under 503 00:30:26,200 --> 00:30:30,440 Speaker 1: FBI surveillance when they were visiting Miami, and supposedly she 504 00:30:30,600 --> 00:30:33,160 Speaker 1: was going to visit a dentist, but she did all 505 00:30:33,160 --> 00:30:35,280 Speaker 1: sorts of sketchy things like this, She was sending all 506 00:30:35,280 --> 00:30:37,160 Speaker 1: of her dry cleaning to New York. Why would you 507 00:30:37,160 --> 00:30:38,760 Speaker 1: send your dry cleaning to New York if you lived 508 00:30:38,760 --> 00:30:42,160 Speaker 1: in the Bahamas, unless you were passing secret messages along. 509 00:30:43,480 --> 00:30:47,800 Speaker 1: So the FBI report has some shocking things to reveal, 510 00:30:48,120 --> 00:30:51,480 Speaker 1: And the big bomb was that it was the Duchess's 511 00:30:51,600 --> 00:30:54,440 Speaker 1: politics that made it impossible for Edward to marry her 512 00:30:54,440 --> 00:30:57,360 Speaker 1: and keep the throne. It had nothing to do with 513 00:30:57,400 --> 00:31:00,280 Speaker 1: her divorces, which had been the official line all a long. 514 00:31:00,360 --> 00:31:03,920 Speaker 1: And so really Wallace Simpson may have saved us all 515 00:31:04,000 --> 00:31:09,920 Speaker 1: from the Nazi king. So yeah, that's obviously the big 516 00:31:09,960 --> 00:31:12,960 Speaker 1: shocker from the FBI report, but it also mentioned things 517 00:31:13,040 --> 00:31:15,360 Speaker 1: like the Duke was drunk a lot of the time, 518 00:31:15,480 --> 00:31:18,360 Speaker 1: and the Duchess told people that he was impotent and 519 00:31:18,520 --> 00:31:22,560 Speaker 1: she was the only person who could actually satisfy him. 520 00:31:22,640 --> 00:31:27,560 Speaker 1: So very uh, personal details for an FBI report, Um, 521 00:31:27,600 --> 00:31:31,480 Speaker 1: and pretty pretty surprising. Well, and it was a huge 522 00:31:31,640 --> 00:31:34,920 Speaker 1: deal when these records came out because the monarchy in 523 00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:39,160 Speaker 1: general had largely denied any allegations of Nazi sympathies, as 524 00:31:39,240 --> 00:31:44,160 Speaker 1: had the official biographer of Edward, so these revelations were 525 00:31:44,160 --> 00:31:47,320 Speaker 1: even more shocking. Well, it makes you wonder how much 526 00:31:47,680 --> 00:31:52,920 Speaker 1: people knew at the time. You know, obviously most people 527 00:31:52,960 --> 00:31:57,360 Speaker 1: didn't realize the extent of this couple's sympathies with the Nazis, 528 00:31:57,440 --> 00:32:00,760 Speaker 1: but um, what did they know? What did they know? 529 00:32:01,280 --> 00:32:04,920 Speaker 1: The Duchess and her memoirs actually paints them as victims 530 00:32:04,960 --> 00:32:07,800 Speaker 1: in all this, and says that they were tricked into 531 00:32:07,880 --> 00:32:11,040 Speaker 1: going to Germany because Hitler and Edward had a mutual 532 00:32:11,080 --> 00:32:14,920 Speaker 1: interest in public housing projects. And once there, you know, 533 00:32:15,320 --> 00:32:18,640 Speaker 1: they couldn't be rude. They're such high society people, so 534 00:32:18,760 --> 00:32:22,320 Speaker 1: you can't turn down an invitation to dinner. But even 535 00:32:22,400 --> 00:32:25,040 Speaker 1: until the end of the war, Edward is still quoted 536 00:32:25,040 --> 00:32:27,560 Speaker 1: as saying things like, after the war is over and 537 00:32:27,640 --> 00:32:30,640 Speaker 1: Hitler has crushed, the Americans will take over. The British 538 00:32:30,640 --> 00:32:32,920 Speaker 1: don't want me as king, but I'll be back as 539 00:32:32,920 --> 00:32:36,480 Speaker 1: their leader. Well, guess what, Edward, No, that never happened, 540 00:32:37,680 --> 00:32:41,360 Speaker 1: So the question remains, would Edward have been a quizzling 541 00:32:41,480 --> 00:32:44,320 Speaker 1: king if he had remained in power? Which is our 542 00:32:44,320 --> 00:32:47,280 Speaker 1: new favorite phrase. I think, Yeah, it's from a Norwegian 543 00:32:47,320 --> 00:32:50,680 Speaker 1: politician who helped the Nazis conquer his own country, and 544 00:32:50,760 --> 00:32:55,280 Speaker 1: it means a trader or collaborator, and um, it's a 545 00:32:55,680 --> 00:32:59,280 Speaker 1: it's a scary thought kind of to imagine this pro 546 00:33:00,040 --> 00:33:04,760 Speaker 1: Nazi sympathizer remaining King of England. Well, and it couldn't 547 00:33:04,800 --> 00:33:07,440 Speaker 1: help but remind me of when Prince Harry got in 548 00:33:07,560 --> 00:33:11,320 Speaker 1: so much trouble for wearing that Nazi outfit on Halloween. 549 00:33:11,640 --> 00:33:15,280 Speaker 1: Learned some windsor history, Harry. Well, and you're also forced 550 00:33:15,280 --> 00:33:17,600 Speaker 1: to think of the comparison of the man who actually 551 00:33:17,680 --> 00:33:21,160 Speaker 1: is King, Edward's younger brother and his wife Elizabeth, who 552 00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:25,520 Speaker 1: are so well known for their war efforts and keeping 553 00:33:25,520 --> 00:33:29,760 Speaker 1: the country together and boosting morale by staying in London 554 00:33:30,040 --> 00:33:32,920 Speaker 1: during the blitz right. They were in Windsor Castle and 555 00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:35,160 Speaker 1: Buckingham Palace the whole time. Even though they were told 556 00:33:35,200 --> 00:33:38,360 Speaker 1: to flee to Canada, they were actually almost killed in 557 00:33:38,360 --> 00:33:41,760 Speaker 1: in Buckingham Palace. It's quite a contrast and something to 558 00:33:41,800 --> 00:33:49,320 Speaker 1: think about. Thank you so much for joining us today 559 00:33:49,360 --> 00:33:52,280 Speaker 1: for this Saturday classic. If you have heard any kind 560 00:33:52,280 --> 00:33:54,480 Speaker 1: of email address or maybe a Facebook you are l 561 00:33:54,600 --> 00:33:56,880 Speaker 1: during the course of the episode, that might be obsolete. 562 00:33:56,960 --> 00:33:59,360 Speaker 1: It might be doubly obsolete because we have changed our 563 00:33:59,360 --> 00:34:02,880 Speaker 1: email address again. You can now reach us at history 564 00:34:02,920 --> 00:34:06,000 Speaker 1: Podcasts at i heart radio dot com, and we're all 565 00:34:06,000 --> 00:34:08,839 Speaker 1: over social media at missed in History, and you can 566 00:34:08,880 --> 00:34:12,560 Speaker 1: subscribe to our show on Apple podcasts, Google podcasts, the 567 00:34:12,600 --> 00:34:15,879 Speaker 1: I heart Radio app, and wherever else you listen to podcasts. 568 00:34:19,000 --> 00:34:21,120 Speaker 1: Stuff You Missed in History Class is a production of 569 00:34:21,160 --> 00:34:24,200 Speaker 1: I Heart Radio's How Stuff Works. For more podcasts for 570 00:34:24,280 --> 00:34:27,480 Speaker 1: my heart Radio, visits i heart radio app, Apple podcasts, 571 00:34:27,600 --> 00:34:29,560 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.