WEBVTT - What was the KGB? 0:00:00.160 --> 0:00:02.680 Hey, everybody. You may not know this yet, and if 0:00:02.720 --> 0:00:06.279 you don't, prepare to be blown away. We are creating 0:00:06.400 --> 0:00:09.479 right now the first ever Stuff you Should Know book. 0:00:09.560 --> 0:00:13.280 It's called Stuff you Should Know Colon, an incomplete compendium 0:00:13.280 --> 0:00:16.520 of mostly interesting things. And you can preorder it now, 0:00:16.880 --> 0:00:19.560 that's right. And if you pre order, everyone, there's an 0:00:19.560 --> 0:00:22.400 incentive because you get a free gift. And don't worry 0:00:22.440 --> 0:00:24.800 if you've already pre ordered, because you can just head 0:00:24.800 --> 0:00:28.680 on over to stuff you Should Read books dot com. 0:00:28.760 --> 0:00:31.400 It's a very beautiful little web page and it's got 0:00:31.600 --> 0:00:34.400 all the information. And if you already pre ordered, can't 0:00:34.400 --> 0:00:36.519 you just like upload your receipt and get that pre 0:00:36.680 --> 0:00:39.120 order gift. Yep, you can, and they will mail it 0:00:39.159 --> 0:00:40.680 off to you and you will get in the mail 0:00:40.680 --> 0:00:42.760 and say, oh, thank you. Don't mind if I do. 0:00:42.880 --> 0:00:45.080 And it's a poster that you will love and cherish 0:00:45.080 --> 0:00:48.320 and possibly pass on down to your children as an heirloom. 0:00:48.479 --> 0:00:50.920 That's right, everyone, We couldn't be more excited about this book. 0:00:50.920 --> 0:00:54.120 It's really coming together. Well, it's us through and through 0:00:54.280 --> 0:00:57.200 and you can go check out some excerpts at stuff 0:00:57.280 --> 0:01:01.320 you Should Read books dot com. Welcome to Stuff you 0:01:01.320 --> 0:01:10.520 Should know a production of I Heart Radios How Stuff Works. Hey, 0:01:10.640 --> 0:01:13.520 welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark and there's Charles W. 0:01:14.120 --> 0:01:17.560 Chuck Bryant. We are comrades in arms here at s 0:01:17.720 --> 0:01:21.880 Y s K step. You should not let me ask 0:01:21.920 --> 0:01:25.360 you something. When you were researching this and thinking in 0:01:25.400 --> 0:01:31.040 your brain about talking about it, did you get nervous? No? Okay, 0:01:31.600 --> 0:01:34.200 I guess you did a little bit. What were you 0:01:34.240 --> 0:01:39.400 nervous about talking about the freaking KGB? Yeah? I was like, 0:01:39.680 --> 0:01:42.399 and how they just kill anyone that they don't like? Okay, 0:01:42.600 --> 0:01:45.160 now you know I got the most nervous ever when 0:01:45.560 --> 0:01:48.520 we we recorded I wrote on and we recorded on 0:01:48.560 --> 0:01:53.680 Delta Force. Really, I was really nervous. Do you think 0:01:53.680 --> 0:01:55.720 they're gonna come kill you? I don't know. I mean 0:01:55.720 --> 0:01:58.960 they're supposedly, they're not supposed to exist, and we were 0:01:59.000 --> 0:02:01.160 talking about how they do exist, so I was like, 0:02:01.920 --> 0:02:04.760 surely not. But no, I know what you're talking about. 0:02:04.760 --> 0:02:06.880 It didn't happen in this one. So maybe this is 0:02:06.920 --> 0:02:10.880 the one that will get me because KGB, you know, 0:02:10.960 --> 0:02:13.760 those are the and it even says in this article, 0:02:13.840 --> 0:02:16.040 like when you think about the knock on your door 0:02:16.040 --> 0:02:18.880 in the middle of the night, come with us. That's 0:02:18.960 --> 0:02:22.200 KGB ops right there, right, But that was if you 0:02:22.240 --> 0:02:26.400 were a Russian, a Soviet citizen, which is true. It's something. 0:02:26.760 --> 0:02:29.079 It's weird because like you you know all about the 0:02:29.160 --> 0:02:31.560 KGB just having been raised as a Cold War kid, 0:02:31.639 --> 0:02:35.440 you know. Um, But I never really put two and 0:02:35.440 --> 0:02:39.240 two together that it was a really all encompassing, um 0:02:39.520 --> 0:02:42.359 secret police kind of thing that they had going on. 0:02:42.480 --> 0:02:46.160 Because not only were they big on spying and getting 0:02:46.200 --> 0:02:49.880 their hands on advanced weapon technology and running disinformation campaigns 0:02:49.880 --> 0:02:52.800 around the world and trying to destabilize the United States 0:02:52.800 --> 0:02:58.000 and it's it's reach around the world. Um, they also 0:02:58.360 --> 0:03:02.480 were really focused internally and domestically as well, so that 0:03:02.560 --> 0:03:05.120 they were a secret police force that would come and 0:03:05.120 --> 0:03:07.680 get two centers and send them off to prison camps 0:03:07.680 --> 0:03:10.480 in the middle of the night. They basically did it all, 0:03:10.720 --> 0:03:13.840 and all of it was geared chuck toward keeping the 0:03:13.919 --> 0:03:18.360 Soviet Communist Party in power, and they were successful for 0:03:18.440 --> 0:03:23.799 several decades. Actually yeah, and um, I mean from reading 0:03:23.800 --> 0:03:27.480 this research, it seems like, I mean, they did do 0:03:27.520 --> 0:03:32.360 all the things, but their main charge was squashing from within. 0:03:32.760 --> 0:03:38.480 It seems like squishing your head from within. So KGB 0:03:38.760 --> 0:03:44.080 stands for I'm gonna try and read this and Russian, 0:03:44.960 --> 0:03:50.600 Uh commentet that's easy with a k uh ghosts dars 0:03:51.040 --> 0:03:58.040 veny be so pass nosty. It sounds like you just 0:03:58.240 --> 0:04:04.880 raised like an Aramaic deemon and klatu varata, so that 0:04:05.280 --> 0:04:10.119 means an English committee for State security. Uh. They were 0:04:10.560 --> 0:04:13.960 headquartered and we're gonna say we're a lot because technically 0:04:14.040 --> 0:04:18.320 the KGB itself is not around anymore. It's just been 0:04:18.360 --> 0:04:22.040 renamed though, so same stuff going on. Same place they 0:04:22.120 --> 0:04:25.360 were and are and are now headquartered under the FSB 0:04:26.080 --> 0:04:30.200 at lub Janka Square in Moscow, which is where the 0:04:30.279 --> 0:04:33.360 KGB was, right, Yeah, that's what I'm saying. That's where 0:04:33.400 --> 0:04:36.840 the headquarters was and still is. And it's this big, 0:04:37.200 --> 0:04:40.240 you know, beautiful sort of intimidating building right there in 0:04:40.320 --> 0:04:42.880 the square. And UM, I mean that's just par for 0:04:42.960 --> 0:04:46.159 the course. The KGB has basically been this entity that's 0:04:46.240 --> 0:04:50.440 changed names and official titles multiple times since the very 0:04:50.520 --> 0:04:53.520 beginning of the U S. S r UM, but it's 0:04:53.520 --> 0:04:56.920 still the same thing and it's there. It's actually really 0:04:57.000 --> 0:05:02.760 instructive to UM to study it because it seems that 0:05:02.960 --> 0:05:05.120 they are still very much up to the exact same 0:05:05.200 --> 0:05:09.239 things that they've been doing for decades now. And everybody 0:05:09.360 --> 0:05:12.320 very famously is well aware of UH the g r U, 0:05:12.400 --> 0:05:15.320 which is military intelligence. But it seems that the g 0:05:15.600 --> 0:05:20.240 r U, the FSB, UM and another group called the 0:05:20.640 --> 0:05:23.880 UM s VR, the Foreign Intelligence Service are all basically 0:05:24.000 --> 0:05:28.560 like the KGB. They're just it's just now been divided 0:05:28.600 --> 0:05:32.120 into separate entities, but they're all working together. But after 0:05:32.160 --> 0:05:34.919 the two thousand and sixteen election, everybody got a pretty 0:05:35.080 --> 0:05:38.400 pretty obvious taste of what the KGB has long been 0:05:38.520 --> 0:05:41.720 up to, which is trying to to meddle in American 0:05:42.360 --> 0:05:47.600 politics and trying to sow discord among Americans and ourselves. UM. 0:05:48.120 --> 0:05:51.520 And this is nothing new. Apparently they've been doing it 0:05:51.720 --> 0:05:54.880 since the outset. Uh, well actually since after World War 0:05:55.000 --> 0:05:57.600 Two at least. Yeah, I mean they've been doing this. 0:05:57.760 --> 0:06:01.600 If you talk about sewing discord, UH, there was Operation 0:06:01.680 --> 0:06:06.200 Pandora in the nineteen sixties, which was basically the Soviets 0:06:06.279 --> 0:06:09.760 trying to start a race war within the US. UH 0:06:09.880 --> 0:06:13.840 in filter trading groups like the Clan, the Jewish Defense League, 0:06:13.920 --> 0:06:17.720 and the African American Militants posing is them making fake 0:06:17.839 --> 0:06:23.760 pamphlets um from the different organizations and and blasting those 0:06:23.839 --> 0:06:26.320 out to basically try and start a race war. It 0:06:26.400 --> 0:06:30.320 didn't work, but it did create discord. Um. They've also 0:06:30.480 --> 0:06:35.040 posed as uh, people from Antifa and Black Lives Matter, 0:06:35.200 --> 0:06:38.240 and they're still doing the same thing today, Yeah, except 0:06:38.279 --> 0:06:41.760 now they're doing it in this hyper accelerated manner because 0:06:42.080 --> 0:06:46.080 things can spread so much more quickly on um on 0:06:46.240 --> 0:06:49.640 social media, and you can turn so many people's opinions 0:06:49.720 --> 0:06:52.400 on social media so much more quickly as well. So 0:06:52.480 --> 0:06:57.520 there doesn't seem to be officially any any disagreement, uh 0:06:57.760 --> 0:07:03.520 that that the Russians metal in American affairs. And I've 0:07:03.920 --> 0:07:06.760 I have long been like, well, you know that it 0:07:06.839 --> 0:07:09.440 doesn't excuse it, but you know, we can't ignore the 0:07:09.520 --> 0:07:12.240 fact that America medals in other countries affairs too, and 0:07:12.320 --> 0:07:14.320 has for a very long time too, And that is 0:07:14.360 --> 0:07:18.440 definitely instructive also in something to pay attention to, but 0:07:18.960 --> 0:07:21.000 first of all to what about is and but secondly, 0:07:21.480 --> 0:07:24.239 from what I read, there's this UM scholar who wrote 0:07:24.360 --> 0:07:28.880 this really really interesting article in the Brown Journal of 0:07:29.040 --> 0:07:32.560 Public Affairs I believe is what it was called, Uh yeah, 0:07:32.640 --> 0:07:36.320 Brown Journal of World Affairs. Guy named Calder Walton wrote this, 0:07:36.520 --> 0:07:42.000 um this this article on the KGB and it's disinformation campaigns, 0:07:42.120 --> 0:07:46.400 super readable, really exciting kind of UM. But he basically says, yes, 0:07:46.480 --> 0:07:49.040 America has done some very very shady stuff in the 0:07:49.080 --> 0:07:51.960 affairs of other countries and in its own affairs to like, 0:07:52.080 --> 0:07:55.720 you know, the CIA dosing Americans with LSD to see 0:07:55.760 --> 0:08:01.000 what happens kind of thing. Um, But the Americans and 0:08:01.040 --> 0:08:06.280 the Brits operations just pale in scope and breadth compared 0:08:06.320 --> 0:08:08.720 to what the KGB has done and what it seems 0:08:08.760 --> 0:08:13.560 like the FSB is now still doing right now. Yeah. 0:08:14.160 --> 0:08:17.000 Not not nice guys. So I just want to shout 0:08:17.040 --> 0:08:21.000 out that, um that that article it's called Spies, election 0:08:21.080 --> 0:08:24.920 meddling and disinformation Past and present. You should check it out. Yeah. 0:08:25.000 --> 0:08:27.000 I mean, if you want to look into the KGB 0:08:27.280 --> 0:08:31.560 and spying and espionage, there are so many great articles 0:08:31.640 --> 0:08:35.199 and documentaries on YouTube that you can watch. UM, some 0:08:35.320 --> 0:08:37.439 a little more fun than other, some very dry. The 0:08:37.520 --> 0:08:40.600 BBC as a two parter on the KGB that's very 0:08:40.720 --> 0:08:44.160 dry but very instructive. UM. So the KGB, if you 0:08:44.200 --> 0:08:47.320 want to talk about that organization, you gotta go back 0:08:47.480 --> 0:08:51.959 to pre KGB in December nineteen seventeen when Lennon created 0:08:52.040 --> 0:08:55.240 a secret police agency called the check A c H 0:08:55.320 --> 0:08:59.840 E k AH. They were the punishing sword of the revolutions. 0:09:00.040 --> 0:09:03.120 They were known as and this was this was basically 0:09:03.200 --> 0:09:06.040 the like you said, it's gone under many names. It 0:09:06.240 --> 0:09:08.559 was the KGB before it was called the KGB. It 0:09:08.679 --> 0:09:14.079 was there to keep leadership in power UM, imprisoning, killing 0:09:14.840 --> 0:09:19.400 opponents both abroad and within the country, keeping people under surveillance, 0:09:19.720 --> 0:09:26.599 censoring news UH, and basically starting the espionage program on 0:09:26.760 --> 0:09:30.559 foreign soils UM. The Checker was followed by the O 0:09:30.760 --> 0:09:34.680 g PU, then the KGB, then the FSB slash SVR. 0:09:35.080 --> 0:09:38.160 But from that moment the CHECKO was formed till today 0:09:38.760 --> 0:09:46.520 there has been a steady, continuous, basically unbroken security apparatus 0:09:46.800 --> 0:09:53.880 that has been charged with domestic and external UM spying, surveillance, espionage, 0:09:53.920 --> 0:09:57.079 all that jam UM from from the from the get go. 0:09:57.840 --> 0:10:03.040 The today, they might still called themselves Checkists within the organization. 0:10:03.160 --> 0:10:05.560 It's a it's a name, the Checker that that original 0:10:05.640 --> 0:10:08.480 name is kind of stuck around if you're sort of 0:10:08.559 --> 0:10:11.640 on the inside, UH, and they you know, there are 0:10:11.880 --> 0:10:14.280 many ways that they can get what they want Uh, 0:10:14.520 --> 0:10:18.760 this one was a pretty interesting example here. UM. At 0:10:18.840 --> 0:10:21.599 one point there was a group early on in the 0:10:22.400 --> 0:10:26.319 UH Soviet unions existence where they had some socialists, some 0:10:26.520 --> 0:10:31.600 anti communists, um, that basically got together and they said, 0:10:31.720 --> 0:10:34.960 we're an organization now called the Monarchist Union of Central Russia. 0:10:35.800 --> 0:10:40.400 And what they didn't know is that the Monarchist Union 0:10:40.440 --> 0:10:44.280 of Central Russia was actually infiltrated by so many moles. 0:10:44.400 --> 0:10:48.400 It was a fake organization that real people joined that 0:10:48.520 --> 0:10:51.599 were socialist and anti communist, but it was all a 0:10:51.679 --> 0:10:53.560 big set up to get them all in one place 0:10:53.679 --> 0:10:57.080 basically root out who they were. You know, you gotta 0:10:57.160 --> 0:11:00.600 know your enemy, know who your resistance is. And they 0:11:00.760 --> 0:11:03.360 found who they were and they killed them. Yeah, and 0:11:03.559 --> 0:11:05.599 that nuts man. That Like, think about the effect that 0:11:05.640 --> 0:11:08.360 it has, not just in in getting rid of your 0:11:08.440 --> 0:11:12.480 opposition by forming a group where they all show themselves, 0:11:12.880 --> 0:11:15.480 but also like that becomes legendary. Like that's one of 0:11:15.559 --> 0:11:19.120 the first things that this this group, this security group did, 0:11:20.080 --> 0:11:23.800 and like it basically sends a pretty clear message like 0:11:24.040 --> 0:11:26.520 don't you can't even trust your own the people you 0:11:26.640 --> 0:11:30.360 think that that are your allies, you know, just talk 0:11:30.400 --> 0:11:34.439 about sewing discord among you know, opposition. That's just and 0:11:34.600 --> 0:11:37.560 like that was a hundred years ago and it's still 0:11:38.480 --> 0:11:41.600 like can give you chills just to think about that. Yeah, 0:11:41.640 --> 0:11:43.319 I mean, you start a group that you think is 0:11:44.120 --> 0:11:46.400 going to be battling your oppressor and it turns out 0:11:46.480 --> 0:11:48.959 that group is so infiltrated that it's not even a 0:11:49.000 --> 0:11:50.920 real group. Well I got the impression that it wasn't 0:11:50.960 --> 0:11:53.599 even that they were infiltrated, but that the checker or 0:11:53.760 --> 0:11:56.040 I should say that O g P. You actually started 0:11:56.120 --> 0:11:59.199 that group to the detract people, you know what I mean. No, 0:11:59.320 --> 0:12:02.440 that's what I'm saying. They infiltrated that that circle. Yeah, 0:12:03.040 --> 0:12:06.600 we started this fake organization. Yeah, that's so nuts man. 0:12:07.400 --> 0:12:10.079 So one thing that a lot of people forget, and 0:12:10.360 --> 0:12:12.719 our younger listeners might not realize, is that back in 0:12:12.760 --> 0:12:16.360 World War Two, the US and the USSR were allies. 0:12:16.679 --> 0:12:19.760 We weren't like BFFs or anything like that, but we 0:12:19.880 --> 0:12:23.840 were we had a common enemy in the Nazis, US, 0:12:23.920 --> 0:12:28.559 the UK, the US, UM and the Soviets and UM. 0:12:29.559 --> 0:12:33.920 I read that from this time of basically working with 0:12:34.440 --> 0:12:39.760 the US and the UK, the USSR saw how good 0:12:39.880 --> 0:12:43.200 we were at disinformation campaigns, and it had two effects. 0:12:43.760 --> 0:12:47.880 It taught Soviets how to do these things. It basically said, hey, 0:12:47.960 --> 0:12:49.719 this is a really good way to sew discord and 0:12:50.240 --> 0:12:54.719 um to get information, fake information out um like with 0:12:54.880 --> 0:12:57.520 your enemy. So it taught the Soviets how to do that. 0:12:57.840 --> 0:13:00.599 But it also made the Soviets think that they just 0:13:00.720 --> 0:13:03.920 presume that the US and the UK, we're creating the 0:13:04.040 --> 0:13:07.800 same operations in the USSR too, So it really kind 0:13:07.880 --> 0:13:13.079 of hardened the Soviets enemy ship of America. Like it 0:13:13.160 --> 0:13:16.880 really kind of predisposed the uss are to be enemies 0:13:16.960 --> 0:13:19.040 with the US and with the u K and with 0:13:19.200 --> 0:13:21.760 the West in general. Um and it just kind of 0:13:21.800 --> 0:13:24.040 took off from there. And just to be clear, I 0:13:24.120 --> 0:13:29.280 saw a good distinction definition between misinformation and disinformation. Where 0:13:29.320 --> 0:13:33.880 misinformation is clear where the source of the information is 0:13:33.920 --> 0:13:37.720 coming from. It's just the information is faulty. So the government, 0:13:37.760 --> 0:13:40.120 the US government is giving out like bad info about 0:13:40.200 --> 0:13:44.760 coronavirus or something like that, that's misinformation. Disinformation is where 0:13:44.760 --> 0:13:47.680 the information is faulty, but it's it's not clear where 0:13:47.760 --> 0:13:50.319 this the information is coming from or where it came 0:13:50.360 --> 0:13:53.000 from originally. It's just popped up as like a rumor 0:13:53.080 --> 0:13:56.640 or something on social media. But the the information is 0:13:56.679 --> 0:13:59.439 faulty either way. It's just whether the source is clear 0:14:00.000 --> 0:14:03.319 who the sources are not. That's that's what disinformation is. 0:14:04.440 --> 0:14:08.240 So the checker are operating in World War two. Uh, 0:14:08.360 --> 0:14:12.959 they are spying on our Manhattan projects such that there's 0:14:13.000 --> 0:14:14.840 one quote in here that said they knew more about 0:14:14.840 --> 0:14:18.040 the creation of the atomic bomb than Truman did. Uh. 0:14:18.120 --> 0:14:22.640 They've really infiltrated things. This gave them a huge leg 0:14:22.760 --> 0:14:25.080 up in making their own bomb and their efforts to 0:14:25.760 --> 0:14:29.440 um welcome themselves into the atomic age, like they would 0:14:29.480 --> 0:14:31.040 have been way way behind had it not been for 0:14:31.120 --> 0:14:36.320 their espionage efforts in there in America. Uh, there are 0:14:36.400 --> 0:14:38.800 ways that they did this. There were spies who were 0:14:39.080 --> 0:14:41.440 um sort of the tried and true ways to pose 0:14:41.480 --> 0:14:44.680 as a diplomat um and actually get in an embassy 0:14:44.680 --> 0:14:47.400 in a different country, but you're really a spy. UM. 0:14:47.480 --> 0:14:49.520 You could also, if you've seen the movie The America 0:14:49.600 --> 0:14:52.560 or the TV show The Americans, that's called an illegal 0:14:52.720 --> 0:14:57.120 when you basically pass yourself off as someone of that 0:14:57.320 --> 0:15:00.720 nation's origin. UM. After World War two, in Finland, they 0:15:00.720 --> 0:15:04.360 would find records of infants who died at birth take 0:15:04.440 --> 0:15:08.840 that identity and then basically become a finished persons called 0:15:08.880 --> 0:15:12.520 a legend, and you are essentially living in that country 0:15:12.680 --> 0:15:15.800 as an American or as a finished individual, but you 0:15:15.840 --> 0:15:19.240 are really a secret agent for the Soviets, right, And 0:15:19.360 --> 0:15:23.720 I mean like super duper deep cover UM, so much 0:15:23.800 --> 0:15:25.880 so that you can expect to go live like a 0:15:25.960 --> 0:15:32.120 pretty mundane everyday existence for years or decades as an 0:15:32.160 --> 0:15:35.320 American or as a fin or something like that, whatever 0:15:35.400 --> 0:15:38.360 your background wherever it says you're from UM, and then 0:15:38.400 --> 0:15:41.880 you might be called on to assassinate somebody one day 0:15:42.320 --> 0:15:47.920 UM or to start UM working sources. And it's not flagrant, 0:15:47.960 --> 0:15:50.200 it's not obvious. The point is that they make kind 0:15:50.240 --> 0:15:53.640 of UM contacts and friends with low level people at 0:15:53.680 --> 0:15:56.680 the edges of powers, how I saw it described. But 0:15:56.760 --> 0:15:59.920 I also saw that same person describe UM, who described 0:16:00.440 --> 0:16:04.520 illegals like that as UM, saying that there's probably more 0:16:04.600 --> 0:16:06.480 of them in the world today than there was even 0:16:06.600 --> 0:16:09.920 during the Cold War. That's so scary, isn't it scary? 0:16:10.120 --> 0:16:12.280 But here's the thing. This is one thing that I've 0:16:12.320 --> 0:16:15.720 learned about studying the KGB. It's possible there are far 0:16:15.960 --> 0:16:18.760 fewer illegals in the world today, maybe there's zero in 0:16:18.840 --> 0:16:22.760 the US. But the fact is somebody said that, and 0:16:22.840 --> 0:16:26.080 the KGBS track record is enough that it's possible that's 0:16:26.160 --> 0:16:29.000 the case. And that's all it takes. Now all of 0:16:29.000 --> 0:16:31.520 a sudden, people are paranoid and like, wait a minute, you, 0:16:31.760 --> 0:16:34.760 Tulca Gabbard, are you actually a tool of the Kremlin? 0:16:34.840 --> 0:16:36.680 Are you a plant by the KGB? Are you a 0:16:36.760 --> 0:16:40.280 sleeper agent who's running for president? Like, people start to 0:16:40.280 --> 0:16:42.760 get accusatory, and you can't trust anything anymore, and now 0:16:42.800 --> 0:16:44.680 you're starting to see your enemies all over the place. 0:16:45.000 --> 0:16:47.160 And all it took was a rumor that there's more 0:16:47.560 --> 0:16:51.480 sleeper agents that are associated with the KGB today than 0:16:51.560 --> 0:16:54.280 there were in the Cold War. And now everybody's paranoid 0:16:54.480 --> 0:16:57.520 and the KGB's work is done for the day. And 0:16:57.600 --> 0:17:02.560 that could simply be disinformation, exactly exactly. But because disinformation can, 0:17:03.120 --> 0:17:05.200 it takes on a life of its own. That's the 0:17:05.280 --> 0:17:09.159 point of disinformation that it makes people behave differently than 0:17:09.240 --> 0:17:11.520 they would if they had not heard that rumor and 0:17:11.560 --> 0:17:14.879 started to believe it. Because the other fact about disinformation 0:17:14.960 --> 0:17:16.840 we should do an entire episode on it, I think, 0:17:17.280 --> 0:17:20.320 is that it has to have a kernel of truth, Like, 0:17:21.119 --> 0:17:24.240 like the Black Panthers have to suspect that the Jewish 0:17:24.280 --> 0:17:28.840 Defense League is um there was prejudiced against them secretly, 0:17:29.240 --> 0:17:32.080 and so like these documents that that were found or 0:17:32.160 --> 0:17:36.160 sent to the Black Panther headquarters just proved this suspicion 0:17:36.240 --> 0:17:39.200 that they already have or something like that, or vice versa. Um. 0:17:39.960 --> 0:17:42.159 So it has to have like this kernel of truth 0:17:42.880 --> 0:17:45.480 for somebody to be like, no, here's the proof, and 0:17:45.560 --> 0:17:47.719 then it just takes off from there because people love 0:17:47.840 --> 0:17:51.600 urban legends. I wonder if there's ever been an Army 0:17:51.600 --> 0:17:57.040 colonel named Colonel Truth. No, No, all right, I think 0:17:57.080 --> 0:17:59.880 we should take a break and ponder that. And uh well, 0:18:00.000 --> 0:18:03.359 I'm back and talk about when the KGB was born. 0:18:03.720 --> 0:18:15.720 Right after this stuff you should know, Nasham shuck stuff 0:18:15.760 --> 0:18:30.240 you should know. So the KGB, I promised to tell you, 0:18:30.400 --> 0:18:33.160 it's the when that little baby was born. That little 0:18:33.200 --> 0:18:37.800 baby was born in ninety four, when the intelligence agency 0:18:37.880 --> 0:18:41.520 that it, like I said, long been operating, was reorganized 0:18:41.600 --> 0:18:45.000 officially finally as a KGB, with that same mission in hand. 0:18:45.440 --> 0:18:47.520 They were known as this this time as the Sword 0:18:47.640 --> 0:18:51.000 and the Shield of the Communist Party. And if you're 0:18:51.000 --> 0:18:54.560 talking about the structure of the agency itself. It depends 0:18:54.600 --> 0:18:56.200 on who. I mean, there's a lot that we don't know, 0:18:56.440 --> 0:18:59.280 but um, it depends on who you're asking. I've seen 0:18:59.280 --> 0:19:02.440 anywhere from a quarter of a million two seven hundred 0:19:02.520 --> 0:19:06.040 thousand people on staff if you count the whole extended 0:19:06.680 --> 0:19:11.400 network of like foreign border guards and stuff like that. Yeah, 0:19:12.119 --> 0:19:14.840 I think seven hundred thousand's the most I've I've seen, 0:19:14.920 --> 0:19:18.760 which is a huge, Yeah, huge, huge. Compared to any 0:19:18.880 --> 0:19:22.159 kind of like CIA or any other countries intelligence organizations, 0:19:22.400 --> 0:19:25.560 the KGB is just massive, right. Um. The other thing 0:19:25.640 --> 0:19:27.680 that I saw about the KGB is that you can 0:19:27.800 --> 0:19:30.800 make a pretty good assumption that, just especially during the 0:19:31.400 --> 0:19:35.240 Cold War, UM, that every single one of those agents 0:19:35.320 --> 0:19:38.119 were loyal to the Communist Party. And one way that 0:19:38.200 --> 0:19:41.399 they made sure that every single agent was loyal the 0:19:41.440 --> 0:19:44.359 Commist Party was to basically let them know that the 0:19:44.600 --> 0:19:47.120 other part other members of the KGB were spying on them. 0:19:47.480 --> 0:19:51.360 There was um entire sections that were dedicated to spying 0:19:51.960 --> 0:19:55.800 just on the armed forces, just on the military alone. Um. 0:19:55.880 --> 0:19:59.400 And that was one of I think twenty different directorate's 0:20:00.080 --> 0:20:03.359 um little divisions that were responsible for different kinds of 0:20:03.440 --> 0:20:08.399 tasks or different specializations. Yeah, the official like if you 0:20:08.440 --> 0:20:10.399 want to look at the official sort of charge of 0:20:10.480 --> 0:20:14.280 the KGB, um it is for areas and size. It 0:20:14.440 --> 0:20:17.280 is the struggle or an organization, I guess, the struggle 0:20:17.320 --> 0:20:21.959 against foreign spies and agents. Uh, the exposure and investigation 0:20:22.000 --> 0:20:25.960 of political and economic crimes by citizens. That certainly comes 0:20:25.960 --> 0:20:28.800 as a lot uh. Protection of state borders, That's what 0:20:28.880 --> 0:20:31.520 I was talking about, like the border um guards and 0:20:31.560 --> 0:20:34.320 stuff like that. And then this is the big one, 0:20:34.640 --> 0:20:39.000 protection of state secrets, right and then so like those 0:20:39.000 --> 0:20:41.359 are the big four, but there every like there was 0:20:41.400 --> 0:20:45.200 another about sixteen of them dedicated everything like making sure 0:20:45.280 --> 0:20:49.879 that the phone and radio systems were encrypted, um, to 0:20:50.119 --> 0:20:53.879 making sure that transportation sector wasn't infiltrated. Like the KGB 0:20:54.000 --> 0:20:57.320 had its fingers and absolutely everything. There was one directorate 0:20:57.720 --> 0:21:03.440 that was specifically tasked with surveilling and monitoring foreigners and 0:21:03.600 --> 0:21:09.600 people who the KGB suspected were um we're potentially dissidents 0:21:10.119 --> 0:21:13.280 who were Soviet citizens. And they they mostly hung around 0:21:13.359 --> 0:21:15.680 like Leningrad and Moscow because that's where most of the 0:21:15.720 --> 0:21:18.280 tourists were. But that was like a whole KGB division. 0:21:18.320 --> 0:21:21.359 That's how many people they had and how many resources 0:21:21.480 --> 0:21:25.280 they threw at keeping tabs on the power structure and 0:21:25.400 --> 0:21:28.080 making sure that any challenges to the power structure were 0:21:28.080 --> 0:21:31.320 squashed in the cradle, not even strangled in the cradle, 0:21:31.640 --> 0:21:35.439 squashed in the cradle. Yeah. And you know, they recruited 0:21:35.600 --> 0:21:41.040 the best, the smartest people, the brightest people. Um. But 0:21:41.160 --> 0:21:43.920 like you sort of mentioned, it's not like like the 0:21:44.040 --> 0:21:47.880 KGB was something to be feared by every uh um 0:21:48.320 --> 0:21:51.440 citizen of the Soviet Union, I think. But jo joining 0:21:51.480 --> 0:21:54.600 the KGB to thwart that was not. It's not like 0:21:54.720 --> 0:21:57.560 that got you out of any sort of surveillance or 0:21:57.720 --> 0:21:59.879 and in fact, it may have even put you on 0:22:00.119 --> 0:22:02.919 or a bigger microscope, who knows. Yeah, I mean they 0:22:03.080 --> 0:22:07.640 they had every level of the military infiltrated with KGB agents, 0:22:07.720 --> 0:22:11.480 like every platoon, every detachment. If you were in a 0:22:11.600 --> 0:22:15.240 group with the military, with the military, somebody was a 0:22:15.320 --> 0:22:20.120 KGB officer posing as a soldier. That's right in their 0:22:20.160 --> 0:22:24.680 own military. It's amazing. Yeah. Uh. By the end, I 0:22:24.720 --> 0:22:27.920 mean I think it started, like I said, by the 0:22:28.080 --> 0:22:32.240 end of the nineteen sixties, it was firmly, firmly in 0:22:32.320 --> 0:22:36.520 place as as the watchdog of everybody in the in 0:22:36.600 --> 0:22:41.960 the Soviet Union. Um. And I mean again with the 0:22:42.480 --> 0:22:44.720 like people tend to say, like, well, the the the 0:22:44.880 --> 0:22:48.280 KGB was the counterpart of the CIA, but I mean 0:22:48.359 --> 0:22:51.200 in the CIA side some shady stuff, including domestically, but 0:22:52.320 --> 0:22:56.520 from from basically all sources. The main point of the 0:22:56.600 --> 0:23:03.639 KGB was domestic surveillance and domestic control of domestic challenges 0:23:04.320 --> 0:23:10.160 or dissent toward the Communist Party. That's right, um, spying 0:23:10.240 --> 0:23:17.239 on people, tapping phone lines, harassing people, arresting people, exiling people. Um. 0:23:17.440 --> 0:23:21.040 If you were a religious activist, good luck. If you 0:23:21.080 --> 0:23:24.480 were a human rights advocate, good luck. Um. If you 0:23:24.640 --> 0:23:27.000 were an intellectual, if you were just a you know, 0:23:27.160 --> 0:23:32.159 part of the intellectual um sort of university system of 0:23:32.200 --> 0:23:36.119 the Soviet Union, you better watch what you say because uh, 0:23:36.400 --> 0:23:39.080 you are definitely being watched, and every word that comes 0:23:39.080 --> 0:23:43.680 out of your mouth, even in a classroom, is being recorded. Yeah, 0:23:43.720 --> 0:23:46.200 and I mean some if you were super high profile, 0:23:46.280 --> 0:23:47.959 you might make it out with your life and your 0:23:48.000 --> 0:23:51.320 family might get out alive, but you would be exiled 0:23:51.640 --> 0:23:56.080 for criticizing the government. UM. A writer named Alexander soul 0:23:56.240 --> 0:24:02.679 Ze soul zettiness and even practice that soul Zette souls 0:24:02.760 --> 0:24:06.719 Zette Nissen. Yeah, I think that's kind of close. He Uh. 0:24:06.800 --> 0:24:10.399 He was actually I think a science teacher who started 0:24:10.440 --> 0:24:13.280 writing books about how bad things were in the Soviet 0:24:13.400 --> 0:24:17.080 Union and uh eventually won the Nobel Prize for literature. 0:24:17.520 --> 0:24:21.040 But um, he was eventually exiled. If you were um 0:24:21.680 --> 0:24:24.439 less of a well known person and you were critical 0:24:24.480 --> 0:24:26.919 of the government, you were more likely to find yourself 0:24:27.000 --> 0:24:30.760 in the Goolag, which is a system of prison camps 0:24:30.840 --> 0:24:34.720 that we referenced earlier, and um souls and souls En 0:24:34.800 --> 0:24:37.080 it's in. I think I said it right that time. 0:24:37.160 --> 0:24:40.520 I think that's right. He estimated that um about sixty 0:24:40.640 --> 0:24:44.760 million people were sent to those camps over the course 0:24:44.800 --> 0:24:48.920