1
00:00:01,440 --> 00:00:02,080
Speaker 1: The volume.

2
00:00:05,400 --> 00:00:08,119
Speaker 2: The NBA Finals are here. This is your last chance

3
00:00:08,200 --> 00:00:10,959
Speaker 2: to bet on the NBA until next season, and DraftKings

4
00:00:11,000 --> 00:00:13,560
Speaker 2: Sportsbook and official sports betting partner of the NBA is

5
00:00:13,560 --> 00:00:16,520
Speaker 2: pulling out all the stops to make this a finals.

6
00:00:16,560 --> 00:00:19,599
Speaker 2: To remember, one team will be crown champ and the

7
00:00:19,640 --> 00:00:22,240
Speaker 2: other will be lost to history. Who you got winning

8
00:00:22,280 --> 00:00:25,279
Speaker 2: at all? Put your hoops expertise to the test. All

9
00:00:25,320 --> 00:00:27,800
Speaker 2: season long, DraftKings has been the go to spot for

10
00:00:27,880 --> 00:00:31,000
Speaker 2: NBA player props and that doesn't stop now. Who's going

11
00:00:31,080 --> 00:00:33,360
Speaker 2: to carry their team to the chip? Try placing a

12
00:00:33,400 --> 00:00:36,440
Speaker 2: bet on your personal MVP to drop thirty, forty or

13
00:00:36,440 --> 00:00:39,160
Speaker 2: maybe even over fifty. Ready to place your own bet,

14
00:00:39,560 --> 00:00:42,440
Speaker 2: download the DraftKings sports Book app, lock in your bets

15
00:00:42,479 --> 00:00:45,320
Speaker 2: and finish the season as a winner. Here's something special

16
00:00:45,360 --> 00:00:48,720
Speaker 2: for first timers. New DraftKings customers. Bet five dollars to

17
00:00:48,760 --> 00:00:52,960
Speaker 2: get three hundred dollars in bonus bets if your bet wins.

18
00:00:53,400 --> 00:00:55,240
Speaker 2: Don't miss your last chance to bet on the NBA

19
00:00:55,320 --> 00:00:57,920
Speaker 2: this season. Download the DraftKings sports Book app and use

20
00:00:57,960 --> 00:01:02,320
Speaker 2: code hoops that's hoop. That's code hoops for new customers

21
00:01:02,360 --> 00:01:04,120
Speaker 2: to get three hundred dollars in bonus bets if your

22
00:01:04,160 --> 00:01:07,479
Speaker 2: bet wins. When you bet five bucks only on DraftKings,

23
00:01:07,520 --> 00:01:10,280
Speaker 2: the crown is yours. Gambling problem called one hundred gambler

24
00:01:10,480 --> 00:01:13,199
Speaker 2: In New York call eight seven seven eight hope and why,

25
00:01:13,360 --> 00:01:15,440
Speaker 2: or text hope and why to four six seven three

26
00:01:15,520 --> 00:01:18,440
Speaker 2: sixty nine. And Connecticut help is available for problem gambling

27
00:01:18,440 --> 00:01:21,360
Speaker 2: Call eight eight eight seven eight nine seven seven seven

28
00:01:21,480 --> 00:01:25,440
Speaker 2: seven or visit CCPG dot org. Please play responsibly on

29
00:01:25,480 --> 00:01:28,720
Speaker 2: behalf of Boothill Casino and Resort in Kansas twenty one plus.

30
00:01:28,920 --> 00:01:32,880
Speaker 2: Age and eligibility varies by jurisdiction void in Ontario. Bet

31
00:01:32,959 --> 00:01:37,440
Speaker 2: must win to receive reward minimum minus five hundred odds required.

32
00:01:37,959 --> 00:01:41,360
Speaker 2: Bonus bets expire one hundred and sixty eight hours after issuance.

33
00:01:41,360 --> 00:01:46,080
Speaker 2: For additional terms and responsible gaming resources, see dkang dot

34
00:01:46,200 --> 00:02:01,720
Speaker 2: co slash audio. Welcome to hop tonight here at the volume.

35
00:02:01,760 --> 00:02:03,720
Speaker 2: Happy Wednesday, everybody. I hope all of you guys are

36
00:02:03,720 --> 00:02:06,160
Speaker 2: having a great week well. Coming into the series, we

37
00:02:06,160 --> 00:02:09,120
Speaker 2: were hopeful that things would be competitive, that they'd be interesting,

38
00:02:09,160 --> 00:02:11,960
Speaker 2: And here we are after three games of the NBA

39
00:02:12,040 --> 00:02:16,160
Speaker 2: Finals and the Pacers are up to one two games

40
00:02:16,240 --> 00:02:19,800
Speaker 2: away from potentially stealing what would be one of the

41
00:02:19,919 --> 00:02:22,839
Speaker 2: craziest NBA championships that I've seen in my time cover

42
00:02:22,880 --> 00:02:25,080
Speaker 2: in the NBA. I can think of nobody better to

43
00:02:25,280 --> 00:02:28,120
Speaker 2: break this down with then Colin Cowhard, who has been

44
00:02:28,160 --> 00:02:30,120
Speaker 2: kind enough to give us his time tonight and join

45
00:02:30,160 --> 00:02:32,359
Speaker 2: the show. Colin, where is your head at? After three

46
00:02:32,400 --> 00:02:33,600
Speaker 2: games of the NBA Finals?

47
00:02:33,880 --> 00:02:39,200
Speaker 1: Well, yeah, the Pacers, you know, and you and I

48
00:02:39,240 --> 00:02:42,400
Speaker 1: had talked about this. The Celtics this year were better

49
00:02:42,440 --> 00:02:46,760
Speaker 1: on the road than at home. Denver is the same team.

50
00:02:46,880 --> 00:02:49,240
Speaker 1: Oklahoma City is not the same team on the road.

51
00:02:49,400 --> 00:02:53,680
Speaker 1: They're not there bench players. Their rotational players are young.

52
00:02:54,040 --> 00:02:57,040
Speaker 1: That's the downside the youth. They are not the same

53
00:02:57,080 --> 00:02:59,480
Speaker 1: team on the road. They're very vulnerable. Tonight they had

54
00:02:59,600 --> 00:03:03,600
Speaker 1: nineteen turnovers. They got really sloppy. I didn't think Sga

55
00:03:03,680 --> 00:03:06,399
Speaker 1: ever got into a great rhythm. He did a great

56
00:03:06,480 --> 00:03:11,320
Speaker 1: job coaching and prodding and poking his team. But my

57
00:03:11,440 --> 00:03:14,080
Speaker 1: takeaway is like tonight was a game that you know,

58
00:03:14,120 --> 00:03:16,440
Speaker 1: in football, there's the old thing about you can steal

59
00:03:16,560 --> 00:03:18,760
Speaker 1: yards and field position, and over the course of a

60
00:03:18,800 --> 00:03:21,720
Speaker 1: game you get better field position. I thought the Pacers

61
00:03:21,760 --> 00:03:29,960
Speaker 1: between steals blocks they had eleven between offensive rebounds. Stole

62
00:03:30,560 --> 00:03:34,960
Speaker 1: about eight to ten points tonight, just sneaky points, you know,

63
00:03:35,120 --> 00:03:37,760
Speaker 1: like one of them is McConnell on the inbounds. I

64
00:03:37,800 --> 00:03:42,040
Speaker 1: think from Caruso feels at point that's a huge, huge play,

65
00:03:42,160 --> 00:03:44,920
Speaker 1: especially when you're the home team in the crowded erupts.

66
00:03:45,400 --> 00:03:47,160
Speaker 1: And I just thought, over the course of a game,

67
00:03:48,240 --> 00:03:53,320
Speaker 1: just eight four or five baskets either denied or provided

68
00:03:54,040 --> 00:03:57,200
Speaker 1: sneaky points. And that's kind of the difference in the game.

69
00:03:57,280 --> 00:04:00,000
Speaker 1: It was just I mean that game until the last

70
00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:01,640
Speaker 1: three minutes, I didn't know who was gonna win it.

71
00:04:01,640 --> 00:04:04,119
Speaker 1: It was just a very tight game. And I think

72
00:04:04,240 --> 00:04:07,720
Speaker 1: they deserve a lot of credit. I mean Indiana's bench, Jesus,

73
00:04:07,840 --> 00:04:14,480
Speaker 1: I mean that again, bench at home, bench on the road. Matherin,

74
00:04:14,560 --> 00:04:17,520
Speaker 1: who starts sometimes for them, Who's that reminds me a

75
00:04:17,560 --> 00:04:21,080
Speaker 1: little bit of a little Westbrook, you know. He Westbrook

76
00:04:21,120 --> 00:04:23,599
Speaker 1: was hyper athletic. Matherin was a quarterback and a hockey

77
00:04:23,680 --> 00:04:27,080
Speaker 1: player in Canada. Goes to Arizona, as you know, crushes it.

78
00:04:27,920 --> 00:04:31,440
Speaker 1: Super athletic, but not as out of control as Westbrook.

79
00:04:31,520 --> 00:04:33,440
Speaker 1: Like he's gonna be a He's gonna be a great

80
00:04:33,480 --> 00:04:36,479
Speaker 1: player in this League. But I guess that's my The

81
00:04:36,520 --> 00:04:40,880
Speaker 1: Pacers just a lot of blocks and steals and effort

82
00:04:40,960 --> 00:04:42,520
Speaker 1: points and that's the ballgame.

83
00:04:43,880 --> 00:04:47,479
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, I had my eye on Matherin and

84
00:04:47,920 --> 00:04:51,560
Speaker 2: McConnell in particular off of the Pacers bench coming into

85
00:04:51,600 --> 00:04:54,120
Speaker 2: this series, not because I'm an Arizona fan, although obviously

86
00:04:54,200 --> 00:04:56,479
Speaker 2: it's been awesome watching those guys just kill it. I mean,

87
00:04:56,720 --> 00:04:58,880
Speaker 2: twenty eight points in an NBA Finals game. That is

88
00:04:58,920 --> 00:05:01,400
Speaker 2: like a real ether in the cat for a young

89
00:05:01,440 --> 00:05:03,800
Speaker 2: basketball player. And honestly, like when you I've had a

90
00:05:03,800 --> 00:05:06,120
Speaker 2: lot of male back questions and things like that from

91
00:05:06,160 --> 00:05:07,880
Speaker 2: fans over the course of the last couple of weeks

92
00:05:07,920 --> 00:05:10,200
Speaker 2: who've been asking, like, what's the next step for the Pacers,

93
00:05:10,200 --> 00:05:13,080
Speaker 2: Like where's their next leap? And it's that kid, it's him,

94
00:05:13,400 --> 00:05:16,279
Speaker 2: it's him becoming by age twenty five to twenty six,

95
00:05:16,360 --> 00:05:17,559
Speaker 2: an All Star level guard.

96
00:05:17,760 --> 00:05:20,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, and you know I said this, and I don't

97
00:05:20,040 --> 00:05:22,119
Speaker 1: know if you and I talked about this. Oklahoma City's

98
00:05:22,160 --> 00:05:26,560
Speaker 1: got more depth, but there's this sense that, Okay, Oklahoma

99
00:05:26,640 --> 00:05:29,479
Speaker 1: City's talents here in Indiana's is below and I'm like,

100
00:05:29,920 --> 00:05:32,520
Speaker 1: I don't I don't really buy that. I think I

101
00:05:32,560 --> 00:05:36,440
Speaker 1: think McConnell. I think TJ. McConnell's a really, really good

102
00:05:36,520 --> 00:05:40,240
Speaker 1: basketball player. I think Matherin, who started some games for

103
00:05:40,279 --> 00:05:41,880
Speaker 1: them this year. He started, he was like their third

104
00:05:41,960 --> 00:05:45,960
Speaker 1: or fourth leading scorer. He's exploding. I mean, we all

105
00:05:46,000 --> 00:05:49,720
Speaker 1: know that Siakam and Halle are great. Miles Turner's defense

106
00:05:49,760 --> 00:05:52,880
Speaker 1: in the second half was unbelievable. Like, I don't think

107
00:05:52,920 --> 00:05:55,880
Speaker 1: the gap in talent, especially when you go back home,

108
00:05:57,160 --> 00:05:59,680
Speaker 1: I don't think it's that. I mean Obi Toppin his

109
00:06:00,600 --> 00:06:02,440
Speaker 1: put them up by seven and then he got a

110
00:06:02,480 --> 00:06:05,640
Speaker 1: block on the other end. Like, I think the talent

111
00:06:05,760 --> 00:06:10,000
Speaker 1: disparity here is inches, not feet. I think Indiana's got

112
00:06:10,000 --> 00:06:12,200
Speaker 1: a real team and they and they have a lot

113
00:06:12,240 --> 00:06:15,520
Speaker 1: of different players. I mean Obi Toppins hyper athletic, Miles

114
00:06:15,560 --> 00:06:18,800
Speaker 1: Turner's a rim protector, Say Ockham's got a pretty touch.

115
00:06:19,279 --> 00:06:22,360
Speaker 1: Halle's more assist than scoring, but can do both. Nie

116
00:06:22,480 --> 00:06:26,760
Speaker 1: Smith can hit threes. McConnell's the spark plug, Matherin's the

117
00:06:26,800 --> 00:06:30,279
Speaker 1: young emerging, hyper athletic guy. I mean, they got a

118
00:06:30,360 --> 00:06:34,839
Speaker 1: lot of levers to pull. So I watched this. It's

119
00:06:34,920 --> 00:06:38,320
Speaker 1: just fun watching this series, and I'm like, at the

120
00:06:38,360 --> 00:06:40,560
Speaker 1: end of the game. I'm like, is he Indian? They

121
00:06:40,560 --> 00:06:42,800
Speaker 1: have more good players? I mean, they just pulled a

122
00:06:42,800 --> 00:06:43,800
Speaker 1: lot of levers tonight.

123
00:06:44,920 --> 00:06:48,200
Speaker 2: I do think they're better down the roster in terms

124
00:06:48,240 --> 00:06:51,920
Speaker 2: of just the level of like consistency they get from

125
00:06:51,920 --> 00:06:54,400
Speaker 2: all of their supporting players get There's like I'm watching

126
00:06:54,440 --> 00:06:56,720
Speaker 2: the end of the second quarter, like Ben Shephard's out

127
00:06:56,720 --> 00:07:00,520
Speaker 2: there and matherin and uh McConnell, and I'm sitting there

128
00:07:00,520 --> 00:07:03,560
Speaker 2: and I'm like, this is Carlisle riding his bench in

129
00:07:03,640 --> 00:07:06,560
Speaker 2: like what is typically a starting group session. I think

130
00:07:06,600 --> 00:07:08,719
Speaker 2: where you see the talent gap between okay See and

131
00:07:08,760 --> 00:07:11,679
Speaker 2: Indiana is like just that like top end shot creation,

132
00:07:11,840 --> 00:07:15,000
Speaker 2: like when things really bogged down and both defenses are

133
00:07:15,040 --> 00:07:17,240
Speaker 2: locked in, Shay is just so much better at like

134
00:07:17,280 --> 00:07:19,800
Speaker 2: getting to his spots and finding those like shots that

135
00:07:19,840 --> 00:07:22,600
Speaker 2: he can make. I think I do think that Oklahoma

136
00:07:22,640 --> 00:07:26,920
Speaker 2: City at their best, their ceiling is higher than Indiana's,

137
00:07:26,920 --> 00:07:28,480
Speaker 2: like when they're moving the ball well and they're knocking

138
00:07:28,520 --> 00:07:30,680
Speaker 2: down shots. And for the record, like if you're in

139
00:07:30,720 --> 00:07:33,520
Speaker 2: a matchup like this where you're a substantial underdog, you're

140
00:07:33,520 --> 00:07:37,760
Speaker 2: trying to create variants, You're trying to create margin and

141
00:07:37,880 --> 00:07:39,760
Speaker 2: all the stuff you're talking about. I agree with you.

142
00:07:39,800 --> 00:07:43,160
Speaker 2: They won this game in the margins. They won this

143
00:07:43,280 --> 00:07:47,480
Speaker 2: game forcing turnovers, blocking shots at the rim, and ball

144
00:07:47,520 --> 00:07:50,800
Speaker 2: pressuring Shae Gildas Alexander so much that he looked exhausted

145
00:07:50,840 --> 00:07:53,200
Speaker 2: by the end of the game. And this is all

146
00:07:53,320 --> 00:07:56,840
Speaker 2: low hanging fruit in basketball that's available for basically everybody.

147
00:07:56,880 --> 00:07:59,920
Speaker 2: Anybody can pick up the ball full court, anybody can

148
00:08:00,720 --> 00:08:03,000
Speaker 2: be aggressive in rotation and play passing lanes. There's a

149
00:08:03,000 --> 00:08:06,320
Speaker 2: certain athletic minimum you need to have, but anybody's capable

150
00:08:06,320 --> 00:08:08,520
Speaker 2: of taking advantage of these margins. And to me, that's

151
00:08:08,520 --> 00:08:10,920
Speaker 2: been the story of the Pacers this entire postseason run

152
00:08:11,280 --> 00:08:14,160
Speaker 2: is they have been so good on the margins. They're

153
00:08:14,200 --> 00:08:17,960
Speaker 2: making it so that the the the their variance is

154
00:08:18,040 --> 00:08:20,160
Speaker 2: much lower than other teams because they're getting so much

155
00:08:20,160 --> 00:08:21,960
Speaker 2: of that low hanging fruit every single game.

156
00:08:22,040 --> 00:08:24,640
Speaker 1: So Oklahoma City is two and four on the road

157
00:08:24,680 --> 00:08:27,040
Speaker 1: in the last three playoff rounds. So we have found

158
00:08:27,080 --> 00:08:31,440
Speaker 1: the hole. You know, every boxer, every baseball player, even

159
00:08:31,480 --> 00:08:34,760
Speaker 1: Barry Bonds when he was on cattle steroids, there's there's

160
00:08:34,800 --> 00:08:37,679
Speaker 1: a there's a there's part of the strikestone he can't hit.

161
00:08:37,840 --> 00:08:40,560
Speaker 1: Usually for a batter. It's on the hands and we're

162
00:08:40,600 --> 00:08:43,920
Speaker 1: looking for where's the hole in Oklahoma City's game and

163
00:08:43,960 --> 00:08:46,640
Speaker 1: it's this young team on the road. There is a

164
00:08:46,679 --> 00:08:49,000
Speaker 1: great variance what you get at home and what you

165
00:08:49,040 --> 00:08:52,040
Speaker 1: get on the road, and we found it. And Indiana

166
00:08:52,120 --> 00:08:57,240
Speaker 1: is a tremendously good home team. It just it's it's

167
00:08:58,000 --> 00:09:02,760
Speaker 1: I gotta tell you, Miles Turner doesn't get a lot

168
00:09:02,760 --> 00:09:05,840
Speaker 1: of love. You know, his asthetic, he'll hit the corner

169
00:09:05,840 --> 00:09:09,200
Speaker 1: of three. But that dude in the second half. I mean,

170
00:09:09,240 --> 00:09:12,240
Speaker 1: Homegrown was great early, but Miles Turner is one of

171
00:09:12,280 --> 00:09:16,360
Speaker 1: those guys that in the league, everybody knows about Miles Turner.

172
00:09:16,400 --> 00:09:19,760
Speaker 1: I mean, if he's on the market, Lakers included, there'll

173
00:09:19,760 --> 00:09:22,480
Speaker 1: be multiple Sooners for Miles Turner. Everybody in the league

174
00:09:22,520 --> 00:09:26,120
Speaker 1: gets it. But on this team, you know, like tonight,

175
00:09:26,679 --> 00:09:30,679
Speaker 1: we're watching McConnell and 'ren Halliburt and we're always watching Siakam.

176
00:09:30,760 --> 00:09:32,720
Speaker 1: I thought, I thought in the second half, I thought

177
00:09:32,720 --> 00:09:33,920
Speaker 1: Myles Turner was huge.

178
00:09:34,280 --> 00:09:37,480
Speaker 2: I agree he he The specific dynamic he struggled with

179
00:09:37,520 --> 00:09:40,120
Speaker 2: a little bit in this series is Carlisle has him

180
00:09:40,120 --> 00:09:42,600
Speaker 2: coming way out to the perimeter to show at the

181
00:09:42,640 --> 00:09:45,880
Speaker 2: level of these ball screens and the thunderguards are just

182
00:09:45,960 --> 00:09:48,760
Speaker 2: so fast that he's had some trouble containing him there.

183
00:09:49,080 --> 00:09:50,800
Speaker 2: But in that second in that second half, it was

184
00:09:50,800 --> 00:09:52,520
Speaker 2: almost like he found his second win to where he

185
00:09:52,600 --> 00:09:54,760
Speaker 2: was moving a little better so he wasn't losing contain

186
00:09:54,840 --> 00:09:57,360
Speaker 2: as much. Carlile had him start to be more aggressive

187
00:09:57,400 --> 00:09:59,640
Speaker 2: and attack the ball in more of like a blitz two,

188
00:09:59,679 --> 00:10:02,400
Speaker 2: which he forced a couple turnovers that way, and then

189
00:10:02,520 --> 00:10:04,840
Speaker 2: at the rim, like Miles, Turner has always been one

190
00:10:04,880 --> 00:10:06,600
Speaker 2: of the best like shot blockers in the league. He

191
00:10:06,640 --> 00:10:09,439
Speaker 2: always racks up high shot block totals and got Chet

192
00:10:09,480 --> 00:10:11,920
Speaker 2: at the rim that closed out. He's got crazy length

193
00:10:11,920 --> 00:10:13,920
Speaker 2: that close out on the three point shot from Chet

194
00:10:14,000 --> 00:10:16,679
Speaker 2: late that was a big one. The stuff with Mattherin

195
00:10:16,720 --> 00:10:19,000
Speaker 2: and McConnell I find really fascinating. The reason why I

196
00:10:19,040 --> 00:10:21,320
Speaker 2: was keyed in on them to start the series is

197
00:10:21,360 --> 00:10:25,000
Speaker 2: when you're playing these young, super athletic teams like Oklahoma City,

198
00:10:25,360 --> 00:10:28,800
Speaker 2: the guys that become super important are your athletes, the

199
00:10:28,840 --> 00:10:31,480
Speaker 2: guys that have like some sort of physical trait that's

200
00:10:31,480 --> 00:10:34,920
Speaker 2: tough to match up with. TJ McConnell is unassuming, but

201
00:10:35,040 --> 00:10:37,319
Speaker 2: he is actually one of the very best guards in

202
00:10:37,360 --> 00:10:40,079
Speaker 2: the NBA beating people off the dribble. So he's immensely

203
00:10:40,200 --> 00:10:42,720
Speaker 2: valuable in this matchup because he can get that first

204
00:10:42,800 --> 00:10:46,160
Speaker 2: bit of dribble penetration that breaks down Oklahoma City's defense.

205
00:10:46,240 --> 00:10:48,800
Speaker 2: And he's such a good staunch athlete, like in terms

206
00:10:48,840 --> 00:10:51,320
Speaker 2: of like his but being a fire hydrant, low center

207
00:10:51,320 --> 00:10:53,560
Speaker 2: of gravity guy. He can pressure the ball and pick

208
00:10:53,600 --> 00:10:57,720
Speaker 2: up full court. He had three steals on baseline inbounds

209
00:10:57,720 --> 00:11:00,720
Speaker 2: in this game. Those were huge sequences in this game.

210
00:11:00,760 --> 00:11:03,000
Speaker 2: And then Ben matherin same sort of thing. He is

211
00:11:03,120 --> 00:11:06,680
Speaker 2: capable against a very athletic thunder team of getting to

212
00:11:06,840 --> 00:11:10,160
Speaker 2: his spots and rising up and knocking down shots because

213
00:11:10,200 --> 00:11:13,920
Speaker 2: he's a supreme athlete that can handle the ball. Nemhard

214
00:11:14,200 --> 00:11:16,719
Speaker 2: is a good ballhandler who's not a supreme athlete, and

215
00:11:16,840 --> 00:11:19,080
Speaker 2: Nie Smith is an elite athlete who's not a good

216
00:11:19,080 --> 00:11:23,040
Speaker 2: ball handler. TJ and Ben are both great athletes and

217
00:11:23,120 --> 00:11:25,680
Speaker 2: great ball handlers, and that's made them very valuable in

218
00:11:25,720 --> 00:11:29,240
Speaker 2: this matchup. And again, like Ben that like we're we

219
00:11:29,320 --> 00:11:31,920
Speaker 2: just saw a young player put up a massive twenty

220
00:11:31,960 --> 00:11:34,480
Speaker 2: eight point game in a in a must win NBA

221
00:11:34,559 --> 00:11:37,080
Speaker 2: Finals game like that is a huge moment for a

222
00:11:37,120 --> 00:11:39,280
Speaker 2: young player there, and like as far as like zooming

223
00:11:39,280 --> 00:11:42,640
Speaker 2: out and looking at the series, like I still lean

224
00:11:42,720 --> 00:11:46,240
Speaker 2: Oklahoma City. We have seen before teams like you know

225
00:11:46,280 --> 00:11:48,320
Speaker 2: the series. This actually reminds me a lot of is

226
00:11:48,360 --> 00:11:52,240
Speaker 2: Cleveland in twenty fifteen versus Golden State, where Golden State

227
00:11:52,320 --> 00:11:55,400
Speaker 2: is clearly the better team, but they're young and they're inexperienced,

228
00:11:55,400 --> 00:11:57,400
Speaker 2: and it's their first Finals appearance and they look a

229
00:11:57,400 --> 00:12:01,280
Speaker 2: little shook from the environment, and the Lebron goes up

230
00:12:01,280 --> 00:12:03,679
Speaker 2: to one on them. Now, obviously Indiana doesn't have the

231
00:12:03,800 --> 00:12:06,920
Speaker 2: Lebron element, but there was obviously way less talent down

232
00:12:06,960 --> 00:12:09,920
Speaker 2: the roster, but Indiana does have more veteran experience. They're

233
00:12:09,920 --> 00:12:12,679
Speaker 2: an older team, right, But what happens with Indiana here

234
00:12:12,720 --> 00:12:15,720
Speaker 2: is they're up to one, but Golden State was the

235
00:12:15,760 --> 00:12:18,840
Speaker 2: better team. They came in, won game four, then they

236
00:12:18,840 --> 00:12:21,040
Speaker 2: went home in won game five. Then they went back

237
00:12:21,080 --> 00:12:23,360
Speaker 2: to Cleveland and they won in game six. I am

238
00:12:23,440 --> 00:12:27,320
Speaker 2: going to give Indiana a good chance to win at

239
00:12:27,360 --> 00:12:29,080
Speaker 2: least one more home game, So I do think this

240
00:12:29,120 --> 00:12:31,080
Speaker 2: has a good chance to go seven. But I would

241
00:12:31,080 --> 00:12:33,840
Speaker 2: still make Oklahoma City the favorite at this point before

242
00:12:33,880 --> 00:12:35,320
Speaker 2: I kick it to you just so you know. The

243
00:12:35,400 --> 00:12:39,120
Speaker 2: Thunder are still from DraftKings minus two thirty to win

244
00:12:39,160 --> 00:12:42,800
Speaker 2: the series and the Thunder are minus six favorites in

245
00:12:42,880 --> 00:12:44,920
Speaker 2: game four. Where are you at in the series moving

246
00:12:44,920 --> 00:12:45,720
Speaker 2: forward at this point?

247
00:12:45,760 --> 00:12:49,320
Speaker 1: Well, I you know, Game seven's in Oklahoma City and

248
00:12:49,360 --> 00:12:53,640
Speaker 1: they're really good at home. And again, bench guys rotational

249
00:12:53,679 --> 00:12:56,719
Speaker 1: guys are different players at home. I mean the Indiana's

250
00:12:56,760 --> 00:12:59,000
Speaker 1: bench in the second quarters night was insane. I mean

251
00:12:59,040 --> 00:13:02,360
Speaker 1: it was literally, I mean I think Carlisle was shook.

252
00:13:02,720 --> 00:13:05,200
Speaker 1: It was just like, wow, that's one of their best

253
00:13:05,280 --> 00:13:11,000
Speaker 1: quarters of the playoffs. I think, like I one of

254
00:13:11,080 --> 00:13:12,920
Speaker 1: the things that was a little surprising to me, I

255
00:13:12,920 --> 00:13:17,080
Speaker 1: thought Oklahoma City looked tired in the fourth and now

256
00:13:17,160 --> 00:13:19,760
Speaker 1: now the first half it was sixty four sixty. I

257
00:13:19,760 --> 00:13:22,800
Speaker 1: think the pace was in it would totally Indiana's pace.

258
00:13:23,320 --> 00:13:27,679
Speaker 1: It slowed down as games can is that situationally as

259
00:13:27,720 --> 00:13:31,160
Speaker 1: the possessions get very, very big. But you noticed it too.

260
00:13:31,200 --> 00:13:33,520
Speaker 1: I thought, okay, see looked a little gas in the fourth.

261
00:13:33,559 --> 00:13:34,800
Speaker 1: They had a bad fourth quarter.

262
00:13:35,760 --> 00:13:39,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, so that's the advantage of ball pressure. Like there's

263
00:13:39,200 --> 00:13:41,200
Speaker 2: been a lot of talk about the coverages I have

264
00:13:41,320 --> 00:13:43,679
Speaker 2: had my concerns with how they've used Turner because I

265
00:13:43,679 --> 00:13:45,319
Speaker 2: think Turner is a very good shot blocker, so I

266
00:13:45,360 --> 00:13:48,319
Speaker 2: want him at the rim. I don't think he's particularly fast,

267
00:13:48,320 --> 00:13:49,959
Speaker 2: so I don't want him on the perimeter, so like

268
00:13:50,040 --> 00:13:52,600
Speaker 2: I've wanted him sitting further back. But a lot of

269
00:13:52,600 --> 00:13:54,880
Speaker 2: the full court ball pressure stuff has also had some

270
00:13:54,920 --> 00:13:57,520
Speaker 2: downsides in that. One of the things Oklahoma City will

271
00:13:57,559 --> 00:13:59,640
Speaker 2: do is they'll have Hartenstein come out or check come out,

272
00:13:59,679 --> 00:14:02,640
Speaker 2: and they'll screen like almost at half court while SHA's

273
00:14:02,720 --> 00:14:05,079
Speaker 2: battling the ball pressure, and then he gets ahead of

274
00:14:05,120 --> 00:14:07,400
Speaker 2: steam from like sixty feet away from the rim, and

275
00:14:07,440 --> 00:14:09,640
Speaker 2: he got a lot of layups early in the game

276
00:14:09,679 --> 00:14:12,400
Speaker 2: out of stuff like that. And so there's a downside

277
00:14:12,440 --> 00:14:15,800
Speaker 2: to ball pressure in that you can beat ball pressure

278
00:14:15,840 --> 00:14:19,040
Speaker 2: and get dribble penetration. The upside with ball pressure is

279
00:14:19,040 --> 00:14:21,920
Speaker 2: in the big picture, which is for forty eight minutes

280
00:14:22,000 --> 00:14:24,320
Speaker 2: in front of that crazy home crowd, when you're facing

281
00:14:24,400 --> 00:14:27,880
Speaker 2: Nie Smith and Matherin and Themhart and all these guys

282
00:14:27,920 --> 00:14:31,440
Speaker 2: just in your jersey the entire game down the stretch,

283
00:14:31,480 --> 00:14:33,760
Speaker 2: you just don't have the legs because beating that ball

284
00:14:33,800 --> 00:14:35,800
Speaker 2: pressure just takes it out of your legs, and so

285
00:14:35,840 --> 00:14:38,560
Speaker 2: there's no doubt that like Indiana played the long game

286
00:14:38,600 --> 00:14:42,280
Speaker 2: tonight in Oklahoma City controlled at various points, but down

287
00:14:42,280 --> 00:14:44,840
Speaker 2: the stretch, Shay had his hands on his knees. He

288
00:14:45,000 --> 00:14:47,240
Speaker 2: was trying to grift a little bit more down the stretch,

289
00:14:47,280 --> 00:14:49,560
Speaker 2: looking for foul calls. Like you can tell he was tired.

290
00:14:49,720 --> 00:14:51,640
Speaker 1: You know the other thing that you know, this is

291
00:14:51,680 --> 00:14:54,360
Speaker 1: just something you don't talk about a lot. We don't,

292
00:14:54,880 --> 00:14:59,800
Speaker 1: analysts don't. But I remember talking to Mark Warkin team

293
00:15:00,560 --> 00:15:02,840
Speaker 1: I covered him at UNLB with Jerry Tarkany, and he

294
00:15:02,920 --> 00:15:04,960
Speaker 1: was an executive in the league, and he used to

295
00:15:04,960 --> 00:15:10,120
Speaker 1: always say the most underappreciated part of those great Michael

296
00:15:10,200 --> 00:15:13,040
Speaker 1: Jordan Bulls teams was their length. He was like Rodman

297
00:15:13,200 --> 00:15:16,840
Speaker 1: was long, Pippin was wrong, Luke Longley was long, everybody.

298
00:15:16,840 --> 00:15:20,440
Speaker 1: But Steve Kerr was long like Ron Harper, and he

299
00:15:20,560 --> 00:15:23,920
Speaker 1: was just like they just got their hand on the balls.

300
00:15:24,440 --> 00:15:31,720
Speaker 1: Indiana is long, when Poppin' Sayakam Turner, Halliburton's long there tonight,

301
00:15:31,880 --> 00:15:35,040
Speaker 1: just to show you their length. Okase had four blocks,

302
00:15:35,800 --> 00:15:41,640
Speaker 1: Indiana had eleven. Okayse had six deals, Indiana had thirteen.

303
00:15:42,400 --> 00:15:45,480
Speaker 1: How many balls? How many times? In this game. Did

304
00:15:45,520 --> 00:15:47,800
Speaker 1: you see the ball loose around the free throw line

305
00:15:48,120 --> 00:15:50,840
Speaker 1: and it was just a pacer that got their hand

306
00:15:50,880 --> 00:15:55,440
Speaker 1: on it, and keep when there are certain TJ. McConnell's

307
00:15:55,440 --> 00:15:58,120
Speaker 1: obviously not long, but he's feisty and quick, so he

308
00:15:58,160 --> 00:16:00,640
Speaker 1: gets his hand and he's fast. But dude, when they've

309
00:16:00,680 --> 00:16:06,040
Speaker 1: got Turner and Halliburton and Poppin, that is the length

310
00:16:06,240 --> 00:16:09,760
Speaker 1: of the Pacers, and I thought it really frustrated. OKC

311
00:16:10,280 --> 00:16:13,760
Speaker 1: chat Holmgren had multiple shots blocked, So we don't talk

312
00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:16,680
Speaker 1: a lot about that. Rebounding is a lot of things

313
00:16:16,680 --> 00:16:20,800
Speaker 1: beyond late, but length gives you those extra possessions and

314
00:16:20,880 --> 00:16:25,080
Speaker 1: touches and disruptions. Blocks and steals tonight, I mean, are

315
00:16:25,200 --> 00:16:29,520
Speaker 1: just totally one sided. And I think again that's stealing points,

316
00:16:29,560 --> 00:16:30,880
Speaker 1: which I thought the Pacers did.

317
00:16:31,800 --> 00:16:34,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, Like there was a play where Jadub got a

318
00:16:34,560 --> 00:16:36,400
Speaker 2: clean corner catch out of the left corner. You might

319
00:16:36,400 --> 00:16:39,440
Speaker 2: remember this one in the in the first half and

320
00:16:39,600 --> 00:16:40,680
Speaker 2: or no, it was in the it was in the

321
00:16:40,680 --> 00:16:43,320
Speaker 2: second half. It was in the early part of the

322
00:16:43,320 --> 00:16:46,400
Speaker 2: second half, and Jadub drove Basine had a dunk, but

323
00:16:46,520 --> 00:16:49,160
Speaker 2: Tyreee came over and Tyreese has long arms, like Tyrese

324
00:16:49,200 --> 00:16:52,040
Speaker 2: has got length to your point, and he's the longest

325
00:16:52,040 --> 00:16:54,200
Speaker 2: point guard in the league. Yeah, and he's got reasonable

326
00:16:54,280 --> 00:16:57,000
Speaker 2: vertical athleticism too. So he got up and he contested

327
00:16:57,120 --> 00:16:59,560
Speaker 2: Jadub and Jadab missed the dunk. He missed the dunk.

328
00:16:59,600 --> 00:17:01,520
Speaker 2: And there there have been a few plays in this series,

329
00:17:01,560 --> 00:17:04,200
Speaker 2: like I actually think Halliburton has been a very good

330
00:17:04,520 --> 00:17:07,960
Speaker 2: defensive player in this entire playoff run. Like he's been sneaky,

331
00:17:08,040 --> 00:17:10,560
Speaker 2: really good because he's the thing within this is to

332
00:17:10,640 --> 00:17:14,160
Speaker 2: Carlisle's credit, everyone's committed to doing the job. And then

333
00:17:14,160 --> 00:17:16,600
Speaker 2: ty Reese like plays hard, like he's got his limitations.

334
00:17:16,640 --> 00:17:18,199
Speaker 2: He's not very big and strong and it kind of

335
00:17:18,240 --> 00:17:20,560
Speaker 2: looks like a a chicken run around his head cut

336
00:17:20,560 --> 00:17:23,159
Speaker 2: off sometimes on defense, but like he's got the length

337
00:17:23,280 --> 00:17:26,240
Speaker 2: to be impactful in that in that situation. And yeah,

338
00:17:26,240 --> 00:17:28,080
Speaker 2: like there was a there was a stretch there late

339
00:17:28,119 --> 00:17:30,119
Speaker 2: in the game where Carlisle rides top in for that

340
00:17:30,200 --> 00:17:33,040
Speaker 2: exact reason, like him being able to go over the

341
00:17:33,040 --> 00:17:36,280
Speaker 2: top of Oklahoma City on offense or meet somebody at

342
00:17:36,320 --> 00:17:38,760
Speaker 2: the summit at the rim on the other end, Like

343
00:17:38,800 --> 00:17:41,480
Speaker 2: those were that those have been huge parts of Indiana

344
00:17:41,520 --> 00:17:44,480
Speaker 2: success throughout this entire postseason run. And again, like you

345
00:17:44,520 --> 00:17:46,680
Speaker 2: want to know how you play passing lanes with length,

346
00:17:46,720 --> 00:17:49,520
Speaker 2: because all of a sudden it looks open, the passer

347
00:17:49,600 --> 00:17:52,320
Speaker 2: makes the read and it's not open because you have

348
00:17:52,359 --> 00:17:55,040
Speaker 2: the ability to close that ground. The one thing I

349
00:17:55,080 --> 00:17:56,800
Speaker 2: will say, and this is one of the reasons why

350
00:17:56,840 --> 00:17:59,000
Speaker 2: I still lean towards Oklahoma City to win the series,

351
00:17:59,359 --> 00:18:02,320
Speaker 2: there was a stretch in the third quarter where I

352
00:18:02,320 --> 00:18:05,520
Speaker 2: thought Oklahoma City really leveraged their athleticism.

353
00:18:05,600 --> 00:18:07,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, they're a good third quarter team too. They've done

354
00:18:07,920 --> 00:18:10,280
Speaker 1: this in the playoffs multiple times.

355
00:18:10,880 --> 00:18:13,960
Speaker 2: Yes, And like going back, even I thought Game two

356
00:18:14,320 --> 00:18:17,720
Speaker 2: felt like the entire night felt like that. I don't

357
00:18:17,800 --> 00:18:22,320
Speaker 2: think Indiana can beat Oklahoma City in Oklahoma City in

358
00:18:22,320 --> 00:18:25,240
Speaker 2: a must win game because I think they can leverage

359
00:18:25,280 --> 00:18:28,960
Speaker 2: their defense and physicality and overall athleticism to the point

360
00:18:28,960 --> 00:18:31,600
Speaker 2: that's like almost too much for them to overcome. So

361
00:18:31,680 --> 00:18:34,080
Speaker 2: I think Indiana's pathway is they have to win the

362
00:18:34,080 --> 00:18:37,320
Speaker 2: two home games. They absolutely can. For the record, I'm

363
00:18:37,320 --> 00:18:39,840
Speaker 2: not saying Oklahoma City is like the surefire going to

364
00:18:39,840 --> 00:18:42,800
Speaker 2: still win the series. I lean towards Oklahoma City, but

365
00:18:43,040 --> 00:18:46,399
Speaker 2: Indiana I think has to win on Friday, and I

366
00:18:46,400 --> 00:18:48,720
Speaker 2: think they have to win next week on Thursday. I

367
00:18:48,720 --> 00:18:49,600
Speaker 2: think that's their path.

368
00:18:49,720 --> 00:18:52,119
Speaker 1: Well, in the first six minutes of the game, Oklahoma

369
00:18:52,160 --> 00:18:56,400
Speaker 1: City was very disruptive. The Pacers were frustrated, the starters,

370
00:18:56,400 --> 00:18:59,840
Speaker 1: they just weren't getting good looks. So I mean Oklahoma

371
00:19:00,400 --> 00:19:03,760
Speaker 1: when they weren't gassed late and they're disruptive, there's no

372
00:19:03,800 --> 00:19:07,680
Speaker 1: getting around it. They're just fast and long and it's

373
00:19:07,720 --> 00:19:10,159
Speaker 1: almost collegiate like we've talked about. It doesn't look like

374
00:19:10,240 --> 00:19:12,919
Speaker 1: other defenses. So you know, I just don't want to

375
00:19:12,960 --> 00:19:15,240
Speaker 1: fall for this because I fell for it with Denver

376
00:19:15,400 --> 00:19:17,200
Speaker 1: and Boston, and I'm like, oh, these are going to

377
00:19:17,240 --> 00:19:21,199
Speaker 1: be dynasties and there are holes in Oklahoma City. I mean,

378
00:19:21,240 --> 00:19:25,240
Speaker 1: they'll probably lose Jalen Williams. Eventually, they can't pay everybody,

379
00:19:25,320 --> 00:19:27,560
Speaker 1: and they're going to pay home Grin because he's just

380
00:19:28,040 --> 00:19:30,000
Speaker 1: you know, he's just physically a different There's not a

381
00:19:30,040 --> 00:19:33,439
Speaker 1: lot of him out there. They're gonna pay SGA and

382
00:19:33,560 --> 00:19:36,080
Speaker 1: you know how it works now you can't pay three guys.

383
00:19:36,480 --> 00:19:38,720
Speaker 1: You know, Boston's going to go through this. So I

384
00:19:38,720 --> 00:19:41,480
Speaker 1: mean it's I know a lot of people look at

385
00:19:41,480 --> 00:19:43,920
Speaker 1: Oklahoma City and think, oh boy, this is going to

386
00:19:44,000 --> 00:19:46,359
Speaker 1: be something that they're going to be bad for the league.

387
00:19:46,400 --> 00:19:48,399
Speaker 1: It My take is this series is great. I mean,

388
00:19:48,480 --> 00:19:50,000
Speaker 1: we have two of the games in this series have

389
00:19:50,040 --> 00:19:55,480
Speaker 1: been all timers. And I also think I think Indiana

390
00:19:55,600 --> 00:19:58,119
Speaker 1: is a real team. I mean, I'm watching matherin tonight

391
00:19:58,160 --> 00:19:59,879
Speaker 1: and I again, I think he's got a little bit

392
00:19:59,880 --> 00:20:02,680
Speaker 1: of Westbrook, but he's not out of control. He's he's

393
00:20:02,720 --> 00:20:05,280
Speaker 1: a little bit more refined at this age. He was

394
00:20:05,320 --> 00:20:08,359
Speaker 1: a better college player than Westbrook. Again, more defined, and

395
00:20:08,520 --> 00:20:10,399
Speaker 1: I think he was the pac twelve player of the

396
00:20:10,480 --> 00:20:13,840
Speaker 1: year if I recall when he like, yeah, he was

397
00:20:13,880 --> 00:20:16,760
Speaker 1: a great player. But my takeaway I watched him and

398
00:20:16,800 --> 00:20:19,520
Speaker 1: I'm like, oh, they're gonna be good. Halliburton and him

399
00:20:19,760 --> 00:20:23,640
Speaker 1: and McConnell and and sayah, come, it's like Indiana's going

400
00:20:23,680 --> 00:20:27,879
Speaker 1: nowhere this I I don't know. I I said this

401
00:20:28,200 --> 00:20:31,080
Speaker 1: going back to the Cleveland series. I love watching the

402
00:20:31,119 --> 00:20:34,159
Speaker 1: Pacers play. I love their style, I love their I

403
00:20:34,200 --> 00:20:39,720
Speaker 1: love Halliburton. I just there's just there's something about a team.

404
00:20:40,680 --> 00:20:43,960
Speaker 1: There's a joy when Indiana plays. They are having a

405
00:20:44,040 --> 00:20:46,600
Speaker 1: really good time, and I think it just comes to

406
00:20:46,640 --> 00:20:47,240
Speaker 1: the TV.

407
00:20:49,000 --> 00:20:51,919
Speaker 2: Agree Like I I understand some of the the the

408
00:20:51,920 --> 00:20:54,199
Speaker 2: negativity surrounding the Finals in the sense that like it

409
00:20:54,320 --> 00:20:57,159
Speaker 2: lacks some of that juice for you know, especially for

410
00:20:57,200 --> 00:21:02,360
Speaker 2: casual yeah Game two, huge names, yeah yeah, and Game

411
00:21:02,400 --> 00:21:04,879
Speaker 2: two is super boring, like and it like, and it

412
00:21:05,000 --> 00:21:07,720
Speaker 2: obviously has not been hitting great TV ratings. But there

413
00:21:07,800 --> 00:21:09,960
Speaker 2: is a natural ebb and flow with the cycle of

414
00:21:10,000 --> 00:21:12,920
Speaker 2: the NBA as stars age in and out, and we're

415
00:21:12,920 --> 00:21:16,000
Speaker 2: definitely in one of those roles right now. But I

416
00:21:16,040 --> 00:21:19,040
Speaker 2: do think that the Pacers are providing an excellent showcase

417
00:21:19,160 --> 00:21:21,240
Speaker 2: for another up and coming team in the Eastern Conference.

418
00:21:21,240 --> 00:21:22,760
Speaker 2: And by the way, the East is pretty wide open,

419
00:21:22,800 --> 00:21:24,960
Speaker 2: Like you could argue Indy has every bit as good

420
00:21:24,960 --> 00:21:26,600
Speaker 2: a chance to make it back to the Finals next

421
00:21:26,680 --> 00:21:29,200
Speaker 2: year as Oklahoma City does with how open things are

422
00:21:29,200 --> 00:21:31,159
Speaker 2: in the Eastern Conference, right. I love the point you

423
00:21:31,160 --> 00:21:33,080
Speaker 2: made about Olahoma City, like it will get tougher, Like

424
00:21:33,080 --> 00:21:35,120
Speaker 2: I think Oklahoma City needs to get this one, because

425
00:21:35,119 --> 00:21:37,960
Speaker 2: the reality is is that once you start it to

426
00:21:37,960 --> 00:21:39,640
Speaker 2: your point, if you pay all three of those guys

427
00:21:39,680 --> 00:21:41,680
Speaker 2: max maxes, and by the way, they're not gonna be

428
00:21:41,760 --> 00:21:43,920
Speaker 2: regular maxes, these are gonna be all NBA players. They're

429
00:21:43,920 --> 00:21:46,400
Speaker 2: gonna be super maxis, you know, Like, and so once

430
00:21:46,400 --> 00:21:48,280
Speaker 2: you pay all those guys, they're gonna basically have to

431
00:21:48,280 --> 00:21:50,320
Speaker 2: surround them with a bunch of guys on rookie contracts.

432
00:21:50,359 --> 00:21:52,040
Speaker 2: Like I think they're gonna end up using all these

433
00:21:52,119 --> 00:21:54,400
Speaker 2: draft pick draft picks. They have to just cycle role

434
00:21:54,440 --> 00:21:57,680
Speaker 2: players through and they're gonna be hunting like three four

435
00:21:57,760 --> 00:22:00,600
Speaker 2: year college guys that play for major programs Kansas and

436
00:22:00,680 --> 00:22:02,560
Speaker 2: Villanova that they can trust to come in and play

437
00:22:02,640 --> 00:22:04,840
Speaker 2: role player basketball in the end. That's what I think

438
00:22:04,840 --> 00:22:06,400
Speaker 2: that they're gonna end up. That's what I think Sam

439
00:22:06,400 --> 00:22:08,840
Speaker 2: Price's gonna end up doing, And so their margin will

440
00:22:08,840 --> 00:22:11,280
Speaker 2: get smaller because they won't be surrounded by as much talent.

441
00:22:11,320 --> 00:22:14,960
Speaker 2: This is a particularly important series for them to win.

442
00:22:16,040 --> 00:22:20,080
Speaker 1: Blending Vice's signature dynamic storytelling with the high octane world

443
00:22:20,080 --> 00:22:23,560
Speaker 1: of sports, Vice Sports brings an exciting and diverse range

444
00:22:23,560 --> 00:22:26,280
Speaker 1: of programming that goes beyond the game. From action pack

445
00:22:26,359 --> 00:22:29,560
Speaker 1: live events to gripping behind the scenes documentaries, to hard

446
00:22:29,640 --> 00:22:34,560
Speaker 1: hitting investigative pieces and in depth profiles of athletes, coaches, teams,

447
00:22:35,040 --> 00:22:38,199
Speaker 1: Vice Sports captures the raw energy, drama, and passion that

448
00:22:38,280 --> 00:22:42,120
Speaker 1: makes sports truly Unforgettable Catch live events and other exclusive

449
00:22:42,160 --> 00:22:46,600
Speaker 1: sports programs only on Vice TV. Go to vicetv dot

450
00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:49,040
Speaker 1: com to find your cable channel.

451
00:22:49,440 --> 00:22:52,680
Speaker 2: I wanted to move on to the Knicks. So I

452
00:22:53,000 --> 00:22:56,480
Speaker 2: see this support this morning, and it's from Sham's talking

453
00:22:56,520 --> 00:22:59,680
Speaker 2: about how they're just calling up around all these big

454
00:22:59,680 --> 00:23:03,920
Speaker 2: shots coaches in the league, Jason Kidd email Udoka, Quinn Snyder,

455
00:23:04,440 --> 00:23:07,760
Speaker 2: Chris Finch. What do you make of this bizarre behavior

456
00:23:07,920 --> 00:23:08,960
Speaker 2: from the Knicks right now?

457
00:23:09,000 --> 00:23:13,480
Speaker 1: I'm not a tinfoil hat guy, but James Dolan, who's

458
00:23:13,520 --> 00:23:15,359
Speaker 1: been in a band I'm not sure if he still is,

459
00:23:15,800 --> 00:23:18,840
Speaker 1: views himself as an artist and that's why he is.

460
00:23:19,200 --> 00:23:24,239
Speaker 1: His His greatest achievement is not the Knicks. I mean

461
00:23:24,440 --> 00:23:27,280
Speaker 1: he inherited the cable vision from his dad. Right, it's

462
00:23:27,480 --> 00:23:30,320
Speaker 1: the Sphere in Vegas, which is a remarkable Have you

463
00:23:30,400 --> 00:23:31,560
Speaker 1: been there? I think you have been there.

464
00:23:31,600 --> 00:23:33,560
Speaker 2: I've been there six times. I absolutely love it.

465
00:23:33,800 --> 00:23:38,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, So it's a remarkable musical engagement achievement all time

466
00:23:38,560 --> 00:23:41,400
Speaker 1: in the world, and that's really where his heart is.

467
00:23:41,520 --> 00:23:44,960
Speaker 1: Irving aves Off a former great promoter, now I think

468
00:23:44,960 --> 00:23:47,840
Speaker 1: he's MGM management. He is one of his closest friends.

469
00:23:47,880 --> 00:23:52,080
Speaker 1: He was, you know, he was a had a record label.

470
00:23:52,440 --> 00:23:55,600
Speaker 1: That's who. That's who James Dolan is. So when he

471
00:23:55,640 --> 00:23:57,480
Speaker 1: wants to get a GM, he goes after a star

472
00:23:57,920 --> 00:24:02,280
Speaker 1: Phil Jackson. Then he wanted Steve k and Amari Stodamire

473
00:24:02,320 --> 00:24:05,480
Speaker 1: on Bad Knees out of Phoenix, and Tibbs isn't his

474
00:24:05,640 --> 00:24:09,639
Speaker 1: kind of guy. So who does he go after? Jason Kidd,

475
00:24:09,640 --> 00:24:13,360
Speaker 1: who's a star. He's interested in Kevin Durant, who's a star.

476
00:24:13,680 --> 00:24:17,040
Speaker 1: That's who James Dolan is. He hangs around stars, he

477
00:24:17,160 --> 00:24:20,320
Speaker 1: loves stars. He's a creative. This is not a criticism,

478
00:24:20,840 --> 00:24:25,000
Speaker 1: but I think he listened to his players grumble. You know,

479
00:24:25,040 --> 00:24:28,080
Speaker 1: he sat down with his players and again he relates

480
00:24:28,119 --> 00:24:31,520
Speaker 1: to artists and athletes and stars. Just go look at

481
00:24:31,520 --> 00:24:33,760
Speaker 1: the history. And when he was doing the Spear for

482
00:24:33,840 --> 00:24:36,600
Speaker 1: two years, he was disengaged from the team, and they

483
00:24:36,600 --> 00:24:40,000
Speaker 1: got very patient and very pragmatic and very BASKETBALLI and

484
00:24:40,119 --> 00:24:44,840
Speaker 1: very villanova ish and that's and that's Tibbs. And so

485
00:24:44,880 --> 00:24:47,720
Speaker 1: you get rid of Tibbs. It's not the same culture,

486
00:24:48,400 --> 00:24:51,040
Speaker 1: it's not the same team. You still have the Villanova guys,

487
00:24:51,040 --> 00:24:53,200
Speaker 1: but it won't feel the same. So it just it

488
00:24:53,359 --> 00:24:57,480
Speaker 1: just feels like James, and I don't. I almost, you know,

489
00:24:57,720 --> 00:25:00,800
Speaker 1: he reminds me a little bit of Jim and that

490
00:25:01,160 --> 00:25:05,040
Speaker 1: Ersay would rather sit with his guitar and hang out

491
00:25:05,040 --> 00:25:08,679
Speaker 1: with Dylan outside of football more than anything else. And

492
00:25:08,720 --> 00:25:10,719
Speaker 1: I think James Dolan's a little bit of that. And

493
00:25:10,960 --> 00:25:14,040
Speaker 1: I think he's an emotional guy. He's an artist. He

494
00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:18,320
Speaker 1: relates to artists and he listens to his stars. And

495
00:25:18,359 --> 00:25:21,359
Speaker 1: he didn't have a plan, and I think it's a big,

496
00:25:21,640 --> 00:25:26,200
Speaker 1: big mistake. This, by the way, this is what every

497
00:25:26,359 --> 00:25:29,760
Speaker 1: Nick fan dreaded, is that when he came back from

498
00:25:29,760 --> 00:25:33,000
Speaker 1: the sphere he would get hands on And there are

499
00:25:33,119 --> 00:25:36,040
Speaker 1: various reports on who has their fingerprints on this, but

500
00:25:36,240 --> 00:25:38,199
Speaker 1: they're not getting rid of TIBs. He just signed a

501
00:25:38,240 --> 00:25:45,240
Speaker 1: new deal without Dolan, you know, acquiescing to a suggestion

502
00:25:45,480 --> 00:25:48,240
Speaker 1: or making the move himself. So in the end, this

503
00:25:48,320 --> 00:25:53,000
Speaker 1: is what the Knicks man. This league's crazy owners in

504
00:25:53,040 --> 00:25:57,120
Speaker 1: the NFL and the NBA. You know that all owners

505
00:25:57,160 --> 00:26:00,879
Speaker 1: now Jason are billionaires. It was ten years ago they weren't.

506
00:26:00,920 --> 00:26:02,840
Speaker 1: They made they were worth six hundred million or eight

507
00:26:02,960 --> 00:26:06,040
Speaker 1: hundred million. They wouldn't blow out staffs, They didn't want

508
00:26:06,040 --> 00:26:08,520
Speaker 1: to write a forty six million dollar check. That is

509
00:26:08,600 --> 00:26:11,800
Speaker 1: a rounding air. And now of these owners and they're all.

510
00:26:11,840 --> 00:26:13,400
Speaker 1: I see it in the NFL all the time, guys

511
00:26:13,400 --> 00:26:16,240
Speaker 1: will just blow out staffs. David Tepper write a sixty

512
00:26:16,359 --> 00:26:18,960
Speaker 1: eighty million dollar check. The owners didn't want to do

513
00:26:19,000 --> 00:26:21,959
Speaker 1: that eight ten, twelve years ago. They do now, So

514
00:26:22,560 --> 00:26:26,520
Speaker 1: I don't know who they're gonna land. They they I mean,

515
00:26:26,520 --> 00:26:28,960
Speaker 1: they've been turned out by seven coaches, all the good ones,

516
00:26:29,000 --> 00:26:32,159
Speaker 1: Finch and Emoduka and Jason Kidd, and they're just getting

517
00:26:32,160 --> 00:26:33,200
Speaker 1: turned down by everybody.

518
00:26:34,359 --> 00:26:36,879
Speaker 2: Yeah, matt Ishbia blew out his staff twice within two

519
00:26:37,000 --> 00:26:38,040
Speaker 2: years of owning the team.

520
00:26:38,280 --> 00:26:39,760
Speaker 1: Is it's ridiculous.

521
00:26:40,280 --> 00:26:42,760
Speaker 2: I uh, you know, it's it's fascinating because, like I

522
00:26:43,080 --> 00:26:45,160
Speaker 2: tried to look at it in a very open minded way,

523
00:26:45,200 --> 00:26:47,360
Speaker 2: because like I actually do think Jason Kid's a better

524
00:26:47,359 --> 00:26:49,240
Speaker 2: coach now than he gets credit for a couple of

525
00:26:49,320 --> 00:26:51,919
Speaker 2: years ago. I wasn't super high on him, but he,

526
00:26:52,160 --> 00:26:54,240
Speaker 2: just like anybody else, as a competitor, has been doing

527
00:26:54,320 --> 00:26:56,040
Speaker 2: it for a while now and he's gotten pretty good

528
00:26:56,040 --> 00:26:58,840
Speaker 2: at it. Like I was looking at the Knicks for

529
00:26:58,840 --> 00:27:01,480
Speaker 2: a second, like I agree with you in terms of

530
00:27:01,480 --> 00:27:05,199
Speaker 2: the kind of topsy turvy unstable nature with which you

531
00:27:05,280 --> 00:27:07,760
Speaker 2: look and you portray to people when you fire your

532
00:27:07,760 --> 00:27:09,959
Speaker 2: coach in a situation like this. But I also think

533
00:27:09,960 --> 00:27:11,560
Speaker 2: Tibbs left some meat on the bone with this next team.

534
00:27:11,560 --> 00:27:14,240
Speaker 2: I thought they underachieved all season, Like right out the gates,

535
00:27:14,240 --> 00:27:14,960
Speaker 2: they underachieved.

536
00:27:15,760 --> 00:27:18,960
Speaker 1: He's not a creative offensively, He's not. The team got

537
00:27:19,080 --> 00:27:20,760
Speaker 1: very predictable offensively.

538
00:27:21,760 --> 00:27:25,080
Speaker 2: I thought the major issue with this team schematically was spacing,

539
00:27:25,160 --> 00:27:27,960
Speaker 2: and it actually impacted both ends of the floor. On offense,

540
00:27:28,160 --> 00:27:30,679
Speaker 2: the meant what you're mentioning in terms of creative offense,

541
00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:32,960
Speaker 2: like his what he did on offense in terms of

542
00:27:33,000 --> 00:27:35,760
Speaker 2: his creativity. The spacing for this team was extremely poor,

543
00:27:35,760 --> 00:27:38,080
Speaker 2: which made life very difficult, but it had a trickle

544
00:27:38,119 --> 00:27:41,240
Speaker 2: down effect in the sense that poor spacing also affects

545
00:27:41,280 --> 00:27:43,760
Speaker 2: your transition defense, Like if you don't have your guys

546
00:27:43,760 --> 00:27:46,600
Speaker 2: situated in proper spaces on the floor, then on missus

547
00:27:46,680 --> 00:27:49,280
Speaker 2: and turnovers, you don't have guys in position to be

548
00:27:49,280 --> 00:27:52,800
Speaker 2: back in transition defense. And the Pacers annihilated them in

549
00:27:52,800 --> 00:27:57,119
Speaker 2: transition in worse than ever in Game six, like embarrassing fashion.

550
00:27:57,160 --> 00:27:59,320
Speaker 2: In Game six is Siakam and everyone else was just

551
00:27:59,320 --> 00:28:02,159
Speaker 2: getting run out lay up after runout dunk after runout layups.

552
00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:05,440
Speaker 2: So like I did think there was like a defensible

553
00:28:05,560 --> 00:28:09,560
Speaker 2: case to move on from TIBs to more of a tactician.

554
00:28:09,920 --> 00:28:12,679
Speaker 2: I actually see Jason Kidd is a solid option in

555
00:28:12,680 --> 00:28:15,800
Speaker 2: the sense that he was a master of modern four

556
00:28:15,840 --> 00:28:18,480
Speaker 2: out spacing with Luca when he was there, which actually

557
00:28:18,520 --> 00:28:21,040
Speaker 2: I think is a really natural fit with Brunson, and

558
00:28:21,240 --> 00:28:24,080
Speaker 2: Brunson co played for Kid before, so there's like some

559
00:28:24,160 --> 00:28:26,400
Speaker 2: natural stuff there. And then he did a good job

560
00:28:26,400 --> 00:28:28,720
Speaker 2: with transition defense with the MAVs despite them not being

561
00:28:28,720 --> 00:28:30,600
Speaker 2: super athletics, so I'd give him credit for that. That

562
00:28:30,640 --> 00:28:33,879
Speaker 2: would work. The thing there is it's just unrealistic, and

563
00:28:33,920 --> 00:28:37,200
Speaker 2: if I'm Jason Kidd, why would like I don't actually

564
00:28:37,240 --> 00:28:40,120
Speaker 2: see the Knicks as that grade of a job, like

565
00:28:40,560 --> 00:28:44,880
Speaker 2: insane New York pressure. The roster is really good, but

566
00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:46,360
Speaker 2: it's not amazing.

567
00:28:46,440 --> 00:28:49,640
Speaker 1: And hell, by the way, Mikhale Bridges wants a new contract.

568
00:28:49,680 --> 00:28:53,680
Speaker 1: OG's getting paid, Brunson's getting paid like the Mitchell Robinson.

569
00:28:53,920 --> 00:28:57,560
Speaker 1: These guys are getting paid like that. Dallas think Lively's

570
00:28:57,600 --> 00:28:59,880
Speaker 1: not getting paid, Cooper Flag won't get paid. I don't

571
00:28:59,880 --> 00:29:04,920
Speaker 1: know of Max Christy doesn't cost much. AD's getting paid,

572
00:29:04,920 --> 00:29:07,640
Speaker 1: but you get twenty four and eleven. Like I look

573
00:29:07,680 --> 00:29:11,520
Speaker 1: at Dallas and I'm like, I get excellence when they're healthy,

574
00:29:11,600 --> 00:29:16,200
Speaker 1: and I get an incredible top end with Lively and Flagg.

575
00:29:16,560 --> 00:29:19,400
Speaker 1: I know what the Knicks are and there's a ceiling

576
00:29:19,440 --> 00:29:21,360
Speaker 1: and I see it all the time.

577
00:29:22,680 --> 00:29:25,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, Like I don't see it as being the

578
00:29:25,280 --> 00:29:27,640
Speaker 2: kind of job that Jason Kidd would be willing to

579
00:29:27,680 --> 00:29:31,080
Speaker 2: basically sabotage his situation and force his way there. And

580
00:29:31,120 --> 00:29:33,000
Speaker 2: then like the other names I saw, I didn't even

581
00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:36,520
Speaker 2: particularly like ima Udoka is a motivator, that's like his

582
00:29:36,600 --> 00:29:38,960
Speaker 2: primary role. I don't think that's a specific need for

583
00:29:38,960 --> 00:29:41,600
Speaker 2: the Knicks. Like I think the specific thing that Nick's

584
00:29:41,600 --> 00:29:44,040
Speaker 2: need is just someone to come in and take them

585
00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:46,240
Speaker 2: to the next level in terms of their offensive organization

586
00:29:46,640 --> 00:29:48,680
Speaker 2: and their spacing, which will lead to them having a

587
00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:52,480
Speaker 2: bunch of additional benefits and transition defense. I understand there's

588
00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:55,520
Speaker 2: a hesitancy to call a guy like Mike Malone, and

589
00:29:55,560 --> 00:29:57,920
Speaker 2: the reason why is because he has a reputation for

590
00:29:57,960 --> 00:29:59,760
Speaker 2: being a hard ass and Tibbs was kind of a

591
00:29:59,800 --> 00:30:01,720
Speaker 2: hard and like, I don't think they want to go

592
00:30:01,800 --> 00:30:05,000
Speaker 2: down that route again. But there's like hard ass and

593
00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:08,480
Speaker 2: then there's TIBs, Like Mike Malone leaned on his starters

594
00:30:08,520 --> 00:30:12,000
Speaker 2: big minutes, but still not even close to what Tibbs did.

595
00:30:12,080 --> 00:30:14,320
Speaker 2: And one of the things I'll say about Mike Malone,

596
00:30:14,640 --> 00:30:18,280
Speaker 2: he was an excellent defense and spacing coach. He made

597
00:30:18,320 --> 00:30:22,360
Speaker 2: a championship defense out of non championship defensive talent, and

598
00:30:22,440 --> 00:30:25,240
Speaker 2: they were always consistently one of the best floor spacing

599
00:30:25,240 --> 00:30:27,000
Speaker 2: teams in the league. And they were very good. And

600
00:30:27,040 --> 00:30:29,760
Speaker 2: again we can we got to at least Acknowledge. Jokis

601
00:30:29,920 --> 00:30:32,120
Speaker 2: was there, so k makes it a lot easier obviously,

602
00:30:32,360 --> 00:30:36,080
Speaker 2: but he specifically was very good at making spacing opportunities

603
00:30:36,120 --> 00:30:38,600
Speaker 2: out of non spacers, guys like Aaron Gordon, guys like

604
00:30:38,880 --> 00:30:41,960
Speaker 2: Christian Brown, guys like Bruce Brown over the years, guys

605
00:30:42,040 --> 00:30:45,200
Speaker 2: like uh Russell Westbrook. Even so like fitting a guy

606
00:30:45,240 --> 00:30:48,040
Speaker 2: like Josh Hart, Mitchell Robinson, some of these non shooting

607
00:30:48,080 --> 00:30:50,320
Speaker 2: types of players, even mckail Bridges, who has struggled a

608
00:30:50,360 --> 00:30:52,560
Speaker 2: lot as a shooter in this postseason run. Like, I

609
00:30:52,600 --> 00:30:55,000
Speaker 2: actually think Mike Malone is a really good fit for

610
00:30:55,080 --> 00:30:57,560
Speaker 2: this NIXT team. I think He's a completely reasonable option

611
00:30:57,840 --> 00:31:00,280
Speaker 2: that doesn't involve you doing something insane like Paul around

612
00:31:00,280 --> 00:31:02,160
Speaker 2: the league. Because here's what gets crazy. Let's say you

613
00:31:02,160 --> 00:31:04,120
Speaker 2: call the MAVs and they're like, okay, sure, let's talk

614
00:31:04,160 --> 00:31:06,520
Speaker 2: about Jason Kidd. What are you going to offer us?

615
00:31:06,720 --> 00:31:09,280
Speaker 2: We already acknowledged this is not a championship roster, So

616
00:31:09,280 --> 00:31:11,440
Speaker 2: you're going to give up assets for a coach. You

617
00:31:11,480 --> 00:31:13,840
Speaker 2: need players, You need talent in there, so like it's

618
00:31:13,840 --> 00:31:16,520
Speaker 2: specifically defensive talent your front court. So I don't really

619
00:31:16,600 --> 00:31:18,240
Speaker 2: understand what the endgame is here.

620
00:31:18,640 --> 00:31:21,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, I just I am on the short list of

621
00:31:21,880 --> 00:31:24,120
Speaker 1: people that think Dallas is going to be really good,

622
00:31:24,560 --> 00:31:29,040
Speaker 1: really fast. I think Flag and Lively are you know,

623
00:31:29,040 --> 00:31:32,080
Speaker 1: they're duke guys. They're gonna be quick learners. They play

624
00:31:32,120 --> 00:31:35,560
Speaker 1: at the highest level of competition Collegiately. I think One's

625
00:31:35,600 --> 00:31:37,719
Speaker 1: going to be One's twenty one or twenty two. He's

626
00:31:37,720 --> 00:31:39,680
Speaker 1: going to be a rim protector for the next decade.

627
00:31:39,960 --> 00:31:42,680
Speaker 1: So Cooper Flag can be out in transition, won't have

628
00:31:42,760 --> 00:31:45,000
Speaker 1: to worry about being down low and getting jammed up,

629
00:31:45,000 --> 00:31:47,480
Speaker 1: which has always been what Lebron loves. He doesn't want

630
00:31:47,520 --> 00:31:49,720
Speaker 1: to be messed up. In that junk. He wants to

631
00:31:49,960 --> 00:31:52,280
Speaker 1: you know, he wants that ball out and up the court.

632
00:31:52,920 --> 00:31:57,000
Speaker 1: So h and I just you know, PJ. Washington, Christy.

633
00:31:57,160 --> 00:31:58,920
Speaker 1: If Kyrie comes back, I'm not sure what they're going

634
00:31:58,960 --> 00:32:03,720
Speaker 1: to do with him. I would forget the taxes, forget

635
00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:07,080
Speaker 1: everything else. I would not lead Dallas. I think Dallas

636
00:32:07,120 --> 00:32:10,800
Speaker 1: is a good job. The situation that's fascinating to me

637
00:32:11,440 --> 00:32:16,040
Speaker 1: is Houston because I think I think right now san

638
00:32:16,080 --> 00:32:20,200
Speaker 1: Antonio is about ready to pop. So I like san

639
00:32:20,200 --> 00:32:22,360
Speaker 1: Antonio and they could get you honest, and I think, Okay,

640
00:32:22,400 --> 00:32:24,440
Speaker 1: see as set and I think Houston's going to be

641
00:32:25,120 --> 00:32:28,040
Speaker 1: in that group of three young teams a little lost

642
00:32:28,520 --> 00:32:33,600
Speaker 1: because Jalen Green, I'm in, Thompson's excellent, Sanngoon's excellent, but

643
00:32:33,680 --> 00:32:37,360
Speaker 1: there's just a lot of athleticism that's not very good

644
00:32:37,360 --> 00:32:39,960
Speaker 1: in a half court game. And I think I think,

645
00:32:40,040 --> 00:32:43,840
Speaker 1: okay Se has popped, san Antonio is going to pop,

646
00:32:44,240 --> 00:32:49,040
Speaker 1: and I so I could if I'm if I'm a dooka,

647
00:32:49,120 --> 00:32:52,520
Speaker 1: I would consider the job. I think Houston's one of

648
00:32:52,520 --> 00:32:55,360
Speaker 1: those that, like the national media, we hover in, we

649
00:32:55,440 --> 00:32:59,960
Speaker 1: drop in, we go. Oh, I got Houston. I didn't

650
00:33:00,200 --> 00:33:02,960
Speaker 1: like what I Saw. I'll be honest, and I think

651
00:33:03,000 --> 00:33:05,280
Speaker 1: you can push them around. I don't think they have

652
00:33:05,360 --> 00:33:08,360
Speaker 1: a lot of half court possessions that are just sort

653
00:33:08,400 --> 00:33:11,800
Speaker 1: of lost. You don't get good looks. They look a

654
00:33:11,800 --> 00:33:17,040
Speaker 1: little disorganized eye. But Jason kid to me, the next

655
00:33:17,080 --> 00:33:20,200
Speaker 1: five years in Dallas are gonna be fascinating with just

656
00:33:20,360 --> 00:33:22,600
Speaker 1: this trajectory that goes through the roof.

657
00:33:23,920 --> 00:33:27,560
Speaker 2: The roster is weird because it's kind of imbalanced in

658
00:33:27,560 --> 00:33:29,520
Speaker 2: the sense that they just have an absurd amount of

659
00:33:29,560 --> 00:33:34,920
Speaker 2: front court talent, like you crazy Lively Gafford, Anthony Davis, PJ. Washington,

660
00:33:34,960 --> 00:33:37,800
Speaker 2: and Cooper Flag, Like that's five starting caliber players that

661
00:33:37,840 --> 00:33:39,960
Speaker 2: all play the four or the five. So, like, I

662
00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:44,240
Speaker 2: do see an imbalance there, but there's an insane amount

663
00:33:44,240 --> 00:33:46,040
Speaker 2: of talent. And I actually go the other way there,

664
00:33:46,080 --> 00:33:48,320
Speaker 2: which is like they can afford to go into training

665
00:33:48,320 --> 00:33:50,280
Speaker 2: camp and just bring all these guys in and start

666
00:33:50,320 --> 00:33:52,560
Speaker 2: playing and basically look around the league and be like,

667
00:33:52,560 --> 00:33:56,400
Speaker 2: who's gonna throw us the Godfather offer for PJ. Washington,

668
00:33:56,480 --> 00:33:59,960
Speaker 2: for a Daniel gafferd Ford, Anthony Davis, Like you could

669
00:34:00,200 --> 00:34:02,480
Speaker 2: argue that Ad is going to be the target that

670
00:34:02,520 --> 00:34:05,320
Speaker 2: someone goes after, like because AD's hurt now, so he's

671
00:34:05,320 --> 00:34:08,160
Speaker 2: got that classic. Everyone's down on him. They think he's old,

672
00:34:08,160 --> 00:34:10,280
Speaker 2: they think he's beat up. Ad comes out of training

673
00:34:10,280 --> 00:34:12,920
Speaker 2: camp looking like he's in great shape, motivated, kicks everybody's

674
00:34:12,920 --> 00:34:15,080
Speaker 2: butt for a couple of months. He instantly becomes like

675
00:34:15,080 --> 00:34:18,360
Speaker 2: a dude you could flip for an enormous mountain of assets.

676
00:34:18,360 --> 00:34:22,160
Speaker 2: And so I look at Dallas as a very, very

677
00:34:22,200 --> 00:34:25,360
Speaker 2: healthy situation moving forward. It's not the same Luka Doncic

678
00:34:25,440 --> 00:34:27,440
Speaker 2: were right on the doorstep of the title, but they

679
00:34:27,480 --> 00:34:31,520
Speaker 2: do have a lot of big picture potential. So let's

680
00:34:31,560 --> 00:34:34,400
Speaker 2: talk about Kevin Durant. We got a report from Shams

681
00:34:34,440 --> 00:34:38,480
Speaker 2: today that Kevin Durant and his business partner Rich Clement

682
00:34:38,600 --> 00:34:42,600
Speaker 2: are kind of canvassing the league looking for potential opportunities.

683
00:34:42,640 --> 00:34:45,440
Speaker 2: The five names that were thrown out in the SHAMS

684
00:34:45,440 --> 00:34:49,800
Speaker 2: report for the Houston Rockets, San Antonio Spurs, the Miami Heat,

685
00:34:50,080 --> 00:34:54,319
Speaker 2: the Minnesota Timberwolves, and the New York Knicks. Did where

686
00:34:54,360 --> 00:34:56,440
Speaker 2: did your head go when you saw that report this morning?

687
00:34:56,560 --> 00:34:59,080
Speaker 1: Well, I think he works everywhere. I think there's very

688
00:34:59,120 --> 00:35:02,920
Speaker 1: few players that everywhere and KD is one of them.

689
00:35:03,280 --> 00:35:05,920
Speaker 1: He doesn't necessarily need to be the soul of the team.

690
00:35:06,440 --> 00:35:09,120
Speaker 1: He doesn't need the ball constantly in his hands. You

691
00:35:09,200 --> 00:35:14,000
Speaker 1: get great length a willing defender twenty four, twenty six.

692
00:35:15,040 --> 00:35:21,360
Speaker 1: I think KD fits everywhere. You know, if I was

693
00:35:21,440 --> 00:35:27,319
Speaker 1: KD i New York, I think he fits New York well.

694
00:35:27,320 --> 00:35:29,279
Speaker 1: But Brunson has the ball in his hands. I mean

695
00:35:29,280 --> 00:35:32,320
Speaker 1: in his mind, is he thinking Brunston's got some Westbrook

696
00:35:32,480 --> 00:35:35,399
Speaker 1: like dribble the air out of the ball. And I'm

697
00:35:35,440 --> 00:35:38,360
Speaker 1: sitting in the corner, like I could see him like

698
00:35:38,480 --> 00:35:41,880
Speaker 1: I've been through that. You know, Kyrie, who he played with,

699
00:35:41,920 --> 00:35:44,160
Speaker 1: also can be a little bit like that. So I

700
00:35:44,400 --> 00:35:47,040
Speaker 1: could see KD just saying, you know, because he's got

701
00:35:47,040 --> 00:35:49,839
Speaker 1: the leverage here, I could see him saying, I've kind

702
00:35:49,840 --> 00:35:54,359
Speaker 1: of done the ball centric guard thing. I just don't

703
00:35:54,360 --> 00:36:00,000
Speaker 1: want it again. Pat Riley and Spolster are very convincing people. Miami,

704
00:36:00,000 --> 00:36:02,520
Speaker 1: he's a great place to play, no state tax, It's

705
00:36:02,560 --> 00:36:05,120
Speaker 1: a winter league, a lot of warm weather. Like Miami's

706
00:36:05,120 --> 00:36:09,600
Speaker 1: a really attractive place out east. But I'm a KD fan.

707
00:36:09,640 --> 00:36:11,200
Speaker 1: I think he fits in a lot of places, and

708
00:36:11,360 --> 00:36:16,040
Speaker 1: Minnesota he obviously fits. And you know, we've talked about this,

709
00:36:16,200 --> 00:36:18,439
Speaker 1: like Lebron in his prime was great, but he had

710
00:36:18,440 --> 00:36:21,480
Speaker 1: to be the offensive ecosystem you had to Chris Bosh

711
00:36:21,760 --> 00:36:25,560
Speaker 1: had to reduce, you know, got marginalized. Kevin Love can

712
00:36:25,600 --> 00:36:28,719
Speaker 1: get marginalized. Guys get away from the rim, go you know,

713
00:36:28,920 --> 00:36:31,960
Speaker 1: Kyrie Irving, you can't have the ball that so Kevin

714
00:36:32,480 --> 00:36:37,879
Speaker 1: never provides that kind of obstacle, Like he just kind

715
00:36:37,920 --> 00:36:42,879
Speaker 1: of fits. So I can tell you this, if if, if,

716
00:36:43,000 --> 00:36:45,279
Speaker 1: if you were a GM and you talk to a

717
00:36:45,360 --> 00:36:48,680
Speaker 1: coach or players, a lot of guys would raise their

718
00:36:48,680 --> 00:36:51,840
Speaker 1: hands and say, get KD. Because I think he loves basketball.

719
00:36:51,880 --> 00:36:53,800
Speaker 1: He's a good teammates's got a good sense of humor.

720
00:36:54,160 --> 00:36:56,520
Speaker 1: He doesn't need to be the media darling. I think

721
00:36:56,560 --> 00:36:58,600
Speaker 1: he's really liked and respected in the league.

722
00:36:59,440 --> 00:37:01,279
Speaker 2: I heard him say agree, I've you know, I've loved

723
00:37:01,280 --> 00:37:03,879
Speaker 2: the point you made about his fit. Like he all

724
00:37:03,920 --> 00:37:06,480
Speaker 2: five of these teams the basketball makes a lot of sense.

725
00:37:06,480 --> 00:37:09,000
Speaker 2: There's one. The one team that I was like that

726
00:37:09,040 --> 00:37:11,560
Speaker 2: doesn't make as much of a sense in terms of

727
00:37:11,560 --> 00:37:13,800
Speaker 2: the basketball fit to me was the Spurs because it's like,

728
00:37:13,840 --> 00:37:15,839
Speaker 2: I don't love the idea of putting a super thin

729
00:37:15,920 --> 00:37:18,320
Speaker 2: front court player that likes the perimeter next to another

730
00:37:18,360 --> 00:37:21,319
Speaker 2: super thin front court player that likes the perimeter. I

731
00:37:21,360 --> 00:37:23,319
Speaker 2: wasn't a huge fan of that one. It also just

732
00:37:23,320 --> 00:37:26,000
Speaker 2: doesn't really fit San Antonio's timeline. So the Spurs one

733
00:37:26,040 --> 00:37:28,759
Speaker 2: was weird for me. The heat, I liked the fit.

734
00:37:28,880 --> 00:37:31,239
Speaker 2: I just don't know why KD would go there because

735
00:37:31,280 --> 00:37:33,279
Speaker 2: it just feels like another move to a team that's

736
00:37:33,320 --> 00:37:35,120
Speaker 2: not good enough to win the title. Like I'm just

737
00:37:35,160 --> 00:37:38,160
Speaker 2: not sure that, Like is is Kevin Durant, Tyler Harrow,

738
00:37:38,280 --> 00:37:42,120
Speaker 2: bam Adebayo? Is that enough to win the title? I don't.

739
00:37:42,120 --> 00:37:42,560
Speaker 2: I don't want to.

740
00:37:42,680 --> 00:37:49,360
Speaker 1: When I'm watching that kid, Benedict Mathern for Indy tonight,

741
00:37:49,400 --> 00:37:51,279
Speaker 1: I mean, I'm not trying to overreact here, but when

742
00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:54,920
Speaker 1: I'm watching him and I'm like, Jesus, he's just a kid,

743
00:37:55,040 --> 00:37:57,680
Speaker 1: like he's gonna you're gonna get this two out of

744
00:37:57,680 --> 00:38:00,000
Speaker 1: three games next year? Like this is this? I mean,

745
00:38:00,239 --> 00:38:02,000
Speaker 1: by the way, again, I think was Hei the third

746
00:38:02,040 --> 00:38:04,239
Speaker 1: leading scorer on the team or fourth leading scorer this year?

747
00:38:04,239 --> 00:38:08,600
Speaker 2: Like he I think coming into the coming into the series,

748
00:38:08,640 --> 00:38:11,400
Speaker 2: he was actually the highest per minute score for the

749
00:38:11,440 --> 00:38:13,200
Speaker 2: Pacers in this playoff run because I use in a

750
00:38:13,200 --> 00:38:15,319
Speaker 2: shorter role, but his like points per thirty six minutes

751
00:38:15,360 --> 00:38:16,160
Speaker 2: was the highest on the team.

752
00:38:16,200 --> 00:38:19,600
Speaker 1: Okay, So I watched him and I think, oh, he's

753
00:38:19,640 --> 00:38:22,919
Speaker 1: going to become a full time starter and it will

754
00:38:22,960 --> 00:38:26,880
Speaker 1: be Siakam, Halle and Mathern are their three leading scorers.

755
00:38:27,320 --> 00:38:28,759
Speaker 1: So I mean, I just I'm looking at the East

756
00:38:28,760 --> 00:38:30,880
Speaker 1: and I'm like, I think Indiana is going to take

757
00:38:30,920 --> 00:38:33,359
Speaker 1: a leap next year. You know they'll play with a

758
00:38:33,480 --> 00:38:39,040
Speaker 1: finals level confidence. So I just I don't think. I

759
00:38:39,760 --> 00:38:42,719
Speaker 1: just I and I'm not just saying this because they're

760
00:38:42,800 --> 00:38:46,120
Speaker 1: up two to one. I look at Indiana and I'm like, man,

761
00:38:46,200 --> 00:38:52,440
Speaker 1: that is a team with I mean outside of I

762
00:38:52,480 --> 00:38:56,040
Speaker 1: mean Sayakam, he is what he is. I feel like

763
00:38:56,960 --> 00:39:00,719
Speaker 1: seventy five percent of Indiana, all these players will be

764
00:39:00,719 --> 00:39:04,160
Speaker 1: better next year. I mean out Sakhams game is his game.

765
00:39:04,400 --> 00:39:05,680
Speaker 2: They're better than they were last year.

766
00:39:06,320 --> 00:39:10,239
Speaker 1: It's just like as I was just so impressed with

767
00:39:10,320 --> 00:39:14,600
Speaker 1: him tonight. So we can start talking about with Tatum

768
00:39:14,640 --> 00:39:17,640
Speaker 1: out next year. It's gonna run through Indy. We've gotta

769
00:39:17,640 --> 00:39:20,120
Speaker 1: be honest about this. It's gonna run through Indy. They

770
00:39:20,160 --> 00:39:23,640
Speaker 1: are deep, they're well coached, most of their players are ascending.

771
00:39:24,280 --> 00:39:25,720
Speaker 1: The East is running through Indy.

772
00:39:27,360 --> 00:39:30,560
Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree, And I don't see the heat as

773
00:39:30,640 --> 00:39:32,880
Speaker 2: like an obvious like, Oh, he goes there and he's

774
00:39:32,920 --> 00:39:34,920
Speaker 2: all of a sudden the favorite in the Eastern Conference.

775
00:39:35,440 --> 00:39:38,520
Speaker 2: I like the Rockets fit. I think his skill set

776
00:39:38,560 --> 00:39:41,080
Speaker 2: is desperately needed as a guy who's a career that

777
00:39:41,160 --> 00:39:44,040
Speaker 2: can shoot from the perimeter. He also brings length at

778
00:39:44,080 --> 00:39:46,480
Speaker 2: the rim, which is not like the Rockets are a big,

779
00:39:46,520 --> 00:39:49,040
Speaker 2: strong team. They're not like a long arms team like

780
00:39:49,080 --> 00:39:50,960
Speaker 2: Jabari Smith Junior is like the one guy they have.

781
00:39:51,160 --> 00:39:54,000
Speaker 1: The Rockets need him, Jason. I would argue the Rockets

782
00:39:54,120 --> 00:39:57,080
Speaker 1: need him more than any other team that he would

783
00:39:57,080 --> 00:39:59,439
Speaker 1: play for. They need him. They are a half court

784
00:39:59,480 --> 00:40:02,440
Speaker 1: offense lost a lot.

785
00:40:03,239 --> 00:40:05,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, and he would go in there and immediately vault

786
00:40:05,680 --> 00:40:08,040
Speaker 2: them into top tier championship contention. So that move makes

787
00:40:08,080 --> 00:40:10,480
Speaker 2: some sense. I will say, by far, out of these

788
00:40:10,520 --> 00:40:13,960
Speaker 2: five teams, my favorite fit is the Timberwolves. It's a

789
00:40:14,000 --> 00:40:17,440
Speaker 2: similar lack of redundancy in the sense that he brings

790
00:40:17,520 --> 00:40:19,839
Speaker 2: kind of like exactly what the team doesn't have, which

791
00:40:19,880 --> 00:40:22,680
Speaker 2: is a rock solid secondary ball handler next to Ant

792
00:40:22,920 --> 00:40:26,080
Speaker 2: who can really generate shots for his team. But they

793
00:40:26,120 --> 00:40:30,040
Speaker 2: can surround KD with elite super physical defense, which is

794
00:40:30,040 --> 00:40:33,680
Speaker 2: what he hasn't had in these other destinations. And also similarly,

795
00:40:34,040 --> 00:40:38,359
Speaker 2: Nasrid not super vertical, Julius Randall not super vertical, Rudy

796
00:40:38,400 --> 00:40:42,000
Speaker 2: Gobert is vertical, but like the Kevin Durant would be

797
00:40:42,000 --> 00:40:45,359
Speaker 2: a guy at the four spot, different from Kat last year,

798
00:40:45,400 --> 00:40:48,640
Speaker 2: different from Nas who brings real vertical length to the

799
00:40:48,640 --> 00:40:52,200
Speaker 2: table where you can imagine Jaden McDaniels, Kevin Durant and

800
00:40:52,239 --> 00:40:54,399
Speaker 2: Rudy Gobert on the floor together in that front line

801
00:40:54,440 --> 00:40:56,640
Speaker 2: and it's like all arms just everywhere, and it would

802
00:40:56,680 --> 00:40:59,040
Speaker 2: just be really, really difficult to handle. But it's gonna

803
00:40:59,040 --> 00:41:01,759
Speaker 2: be really interesting. Hopeful, I'm hopeful that we get a

804
00:41:01,880 --> 00:41:04,919
Speaker 2: pretty quick like a set of action here in late

805
00:41:05,000 --> 00:41:06,920
Speaker 2: June where we find out where all these guys land.

806
00:41:06,960 --> 00:41:09,759
Speaker 2: But Colin, I sincerely appreciate you taking the time. We'll

807
00:41:10,040 --> 00:41:13,400
Speaker 2: join us tonight. It was good to see you. Everyone

808
00:41:13,440 --> 00:41:15,000
Speaker 2: who's hanging out here on the YouTube's triom. We are

809
00:41:15,040 --> 00:41:18,040
Speaker 2: heading over to playback, so that's playback dot TV slash

810
00:41:18,040 --> 00:41:19,640
Speaker 2: hoops tonight. We're gonna be hanging out for an extra

811
00:41:19,680 --> 00:41:21,879
Speaker 2: hour here after the show, taking callers and stuff. Colin

812
00:41:22,040 --> 00:41:22,759
Speaker 2: was great to see you man.

813
00:41:22,760 --> 00:41:23,560
Speaker 1: Great to see you, buddy.

814
00:41:23,600 --> 00:41:26,000
Speaker 2: What's up guys. As always, I appreciate you for listening

815
00:41:26,000 --> 00:41:28,840
Speaker 2: to and supporting OOPS tonight. It would actually be really

816
00:41:28,880 --> 00:41:30,760
Speaker 2: helpful for us if you guys would take a second

817
00:41:30,840 --> 00:41:33,520
Speaker 2: and leave a rating and a review. As always, I

818
00:41:33,520 --> 00:41:35,279
Speaker 2: appreciate you guys supporting us, but if you could take

819
00:41:35,280 --> 00:41:37,840
Speaker 2: a minute to do that, I'd really appreciate it.

820
00:41:39,680 --> 00:41:40,360
Speaker 1: The volume