Speaker 1: You're listening to Bloomberg Business Week with Carol Messer and
Speaker 1: Tim Stenebeck on Bloomberg Radio.
Speaker 2: First of all, just a little bit of a setup.
Speaker 2: Remember we caught up with Marcus Shaw, CEO at All Finance.
Speaker 3: Yes, I will never forget because he gave me that
Speaker 3: phrase that I use all the time, which is you
Speaker 3: need to put your greed above your bias.
Speaker 2: Yeah right, yeah, it makes so much sense. Well, and
Speaker 2: he is really specifically working on diversifying the All Finance space,
Speaker 2: and he talked about All Finance having their first graduating
Speaker 2: class of HBCU students who are now headed to the
Speaker 2: investment world. So all about diversifying the financial space. And
Speaker 2: that's where we get to our next guest. It's our
Speaker 2: regular Equality segment because JUNI is Equality Month. Harold Butler
Speaker 2: is City Group Global Markets, head of Diverse Financial Institutions Group,
Speaker 2: joining us on site here at Bloomberg Headquarters. Although I
Speaker 2: will say that we try to delve into this all
Speaker 2: the time, I don't need a month to do it.
Speaker 1: Yes, and I'm.
Speaker 2: Looking forward to the time where I think it's really important,
Speaker 2: but that we don't have to talk about it because
Speaker 2: it's just done.
Speaker 1: Wouldn't it be wonderful?
Speaker 2: Why aren't we done already? I've been doing this a
Speaker 2: long time, Yes, and Matt's been.
Speaker 3: Doing a long time.
Speaker 1: And do you know what is funny?
Speaker 3: I was reading there was a story today about the
Speaker 3: Supreme Court backing black congressional district and I think Alabama
Speaker 3: was in Alabama, Alabama, and I was thinking, how insane
Speaker 3: is it that we still have to deal with this
Speaker 3: kind of crap. If somebody a hundred years ago had
Speaker 3: read that headline, they would have been like, seriously, they
Speaker 3: haven't dealt with the racial problems in America yet.
Speaker 1: Seriously. Yeah, I mean exactly.
Speaker 3: It's just unbelievable.
Speaker 1: The right to vote, other things. Absolutely, I agree with you.
Speaker 2: What's wrong with society?
Speaker 4: You know, if I had a crystal ball, I could
Speaker 4: probably give you that answer, right.
Speaker 1: I think people need to relax. Quite frankly, what does
Speaker 1: that mean? What do you mean? I think people?
Speaker 4: I actually think folks are very uptight right in the
Speaker 4: US and general. And it's not necessarily just a financial markets.
Speaker 4: You know, I'll give you an example. You know, when
Speaker 4: you go my very first time to Europe, I had
Speaker 4: the pleasure of serving in the US Army and I
Speaker 4: got stationed at NATO's SUBPEC.
Speaker 1: And when I landed, and this is back several years ago,
Speaker 1: it was how many years? A long time?
Speaker 4: And when I landed in Belgium, I went to the
Speaker 4: installation and I said, well, where.
Speaker 1: Is everybody this?
Speaker 4: Oh, it's sies the time where people are taking the
Speaker 4: lunch and taking a break so they can reset themselves
Speaker 4: for today, right, and communicy families or whatever. And then
Speaker 4: they come back to work and to work a couple
Speaker 4: of hours, and they're much more effective.
Speaker 1: And I said, what's wrong with this picture?
Speaker 4: I'm in, I'm in.
Speaker 1: I want to join that too.
Speaker 2: We said that about Germany, right, that there was more balance.
Speaker 3: I mean, you know what because of the social system,
Speaker 3: because of the safety nets. I think also, you know,
Speaker 3: people aren't as worried about how am I going to
Speaker 3: pay for if I have an accident, how I pay
Speaker 3: for health care? If I get fired, how am I
Speaker 3: going to afford to pay my restaurant? Because there are
Speaker 3: so many more safety nets. And as a result, I
Speaker 3: think they need to use them less.
Speaker 2: To be honest, now I get it, they get you're
Speaker 2: not worried about it.
Speaker 1: So if we relax, Yes, I like to relax.
Speaker 2: Why do you think how can that improve the situation
Speaker 2: in terms of diversification. We I'm tired of hearing I
Speaker 2: love you, Mackenzie, but tired of hearing about the studies.
Speaker 2: I get it. It's better to be diversified. And there's
Speaker 2: a bottom line financial component to it. So tell me
Speaker 2: if we relax, how does that make things better?
Speaker 1: Well, I mean, let's use the financial component. Right. So,
Speaker 1: like you, I.
Speaker 4: Am oftentimes mind boggled at the same conversation around you know,
Speaker 4: why are we doing what we're doing?
Speaker 1: Right?
Speaker 4: Just recently, in fact, I was asked, so, why are
Speaker 4: we having the same conversation about equity?
Speaker 1: Yeah, why are we still having this conversation?
Speaker 4: And you know, without having to go into a history
Speaker 4: lesson which sometimes I don't mind doing. Right, uh, and
Speaker 4: and really helping that individual ask me the question to
Speaker 4: talk about helping them to understand why things.
Speaker 1: Are the way they are.
Speaker 4: I said, let's let's refocus your question and you ask yourself, right,
Speaker 4: if if the shoe were on the other foot, what
Speaker 4: how would it be different for you?
Speaker 1: Right?
Speaker 4: And when I say the shoe of being on the
Speaker 4: other foot, you know he's talking about in this case,
Speaker 4: I'm kind of tired of hearing about diverse and equity
Speaker 4: and all this kind of stuff.
Speaker 1: No, no, no, I'm just saying, why isn't it done right?
Speaker 4: That's just the whole point is that I think, I
Speaker 4: think we and I hope this is where we're going now.
Speaker 1: Right.
Speaker 4: Much of the work that's been done, certainly past the
Speaker 4: horrific events that took place several years ago. There's a
Speaker 4: lot of corporations that have come into the space that
Speaker 4: are putting capital in the space. George Murder, George Floyd.
Speaker 2: The conversation shifted dramatically.
Speaker 4: Dramatically, right yet and yet I think I think progress
Speaker 4: is happening, But yet we're not there yet, right. And
Speaker 4: I think it's because it continues to be a difficult
Speaker 4: conversation for people to have. I think people some people
Speaker 4: don't really understand steal the what or what needs to happen.
Speaker 4: And I think some folks just get for clint about
Speaker 4: the level of commitment that they need to make right.
Speaker 1: We over a.
Speaker 4: Lot of times financial institutions in general, because it's the
Speaker 4: nature of how we do business. You know, we think
Speaker 4: about it a lot, right, We put do you think
Speaker 4: about risk and we think about this, and we think
Speaker 4: about that, and all.
Speaker 2: This out of time. The trader's got to pull the
Speaker 2: button and make the trade.
Speaker 4: You got to do it right. If we weren't on
Speaker 4: UH Radio, Live radio. I have a nice little term for.
Speaker 1: Them, but it's probably it sounds like we got to
Speaker 1: get off the pot. I mean, really what we need
Speaker 1: to do.
Speaker 3: I think also it's just it's so hard for people
Speaker 3: to over come their biases. When Marcus Shaw came on
Speaker 3: and he gave us this term, you need to put
Speaker 3: your greed over your biases, because his point was, if
Speaker 3: you have that kind of diversity, you're going to be
Speaker 3: able to generate more revenue, better margins. You're going to
Speaker 3: be able to make money. And that's what we all
Speaker 3: want to do, we all want ostensibly, right.
Speaker 2: So bias is that strong that people will give up
Speaker 2: making money.
Speaker 3: Let's talk about black banks versus sure, because you said
Speaker 3: sometimes you don't mind giving people a history lesson, and
Speaker 3: I think people need that. Here there are historically black banks.
Speaker 3: Are they still in operational the same sort of scale
Speaker 3: that they once were?
Speaker 4: Well, you know, since reconstruction, the black banks that are
Speaker 4: in existence today, about seventeen of them, So that's not
Speaker 4: a big number across the country, probably have more capital
Speaker 4: than they ever ever had. Right the number of years
Speaker 4: prior to these events that we've talked about, such as
Speaker 4: the murder George Bloyd and how the whole industry sort
Speaker 4: of change, it was a tough world, right, and it's
Speaker 4: still tough, but it is changing because the banks do
Speaker 4: have capital. Prior to you know, there wasn't capital to
Speaker 4: do things right, and so people oftentimes ask me, well,
Speaker 4: how come there are black financial institutions that have been
Speaker 4: around for one hundred years and they remain under a
Speaker 4: billion dollars.
Speaker 1: In assets for example, right?
Speaker 4: And then I like to say to the history lesson things,
Speaker 4: I said, well, if you were denied capital markets, if
Speaker 4: you couldn't play in the capital markets, you'd be the
Speaker 4: same way, right, because it's a vicious cycle, right, And
Speaker 4: if you don't have access to capital, you don't grow, right,
Speaker 4: And if you don't grow, you cannot offer the communities
Speaker 4: that you serve services and things like that.
Speaker 1: So you know, it has been a I think it's exponential.
Speaker 2: It does if if they're able to lend out and
Speaker 2: you keep going, it's.
Speaker 1: Just that's right, That's right.
Speaker 3: So what can be done about it? You are at city,
Speaker 3: can you do you work with them? Or are you competitors?
Speaker 1: Definitely not competitors.
Speaker 4: Right, so we've taken we're well, we're not that I'm
Speaker 4: gigantic waistline maybe a little bit, but you're what.
Speaker 2: We considered one of the big banks.
Speaker 4: Well, we are a big bank, right, and I'm thankful
Speaker 4: we're a big bank because we're able to do things
Speaker 4: in a unique way and we're the first. Really maybe
Speaker 4: you didn't know this, I'm so I'm happy to tell
Speaker 4: you this. We're the only bank still on the street,
Speaker 4: the first to actually create a dedicated business unit, the
Speaker 4: Verse Financial Institutions group. This focused at the minority deposit
Speaker 4: institution are to include broker dealers and asset managers because
Speaker 4: they're part of the equation as well. Absolutely right, And
Speaker 4: so our mission, our focus really has been to get
Speaker 4: to communities underrepresented, right, under invested communities through these financial
Speaker 4: institutions in a way that you know, we can help
Speaker 4: those banks attract investment to a community, to get rid
Speaker 4: of food deserts, which helps people eat more healthy so
Speaker 4: they don't go to the doctor. And you know as much,
Speaker 4: and it's you said earlier.
Speaker 1: It's a vicious cycle.
Speaker 2: Yeah, all those things that keep people from moving ahead
Speaker 2: financially as well as just kind of personally.
Speaker 1: Stay in touch.
Speaker 2: Let's know how things are.
Speaker 1: I'm happy to stay in touch. I got so much
Speaker 1: to talk about. You.
Speaker 4: If you have me back, we can have all kinds
Speaker 4: of fun talking about this week.
Speaker 3: We will definitely have you back. Thank you for coming in.
Speaker 3: Thank you for your service.
Speaker 1: Thank you very kind. By the way, thank you.
Speaker 2: Waistline is just fine.
Speaker 1: I'm just okay. I appreciate that.
Speaker 2: Harold Butler, who's Global Markets head of Diverse Financial Institutions
Speaker 2: Group at City Group