Speaker 1: Pushkin. Now that you found yourself losing your mind? Are
Speaker 1: you here again finding that book you want to start?
Speaker 1: Real is Gone and Change. Welcome to part two of
Speaker 1: Rick Rubin's conversation with Neil Young Unbroken Record. We just
Speaker 1: heard some of Neil's song I Believe in You from
Speaker 1: his nineteen seventy masterpiece After the gold Rush. It's one
Speaker 1: of Rick's favorite songs on his favorite Neil album. It's
Speaker 1: a song that inspired a mystical experience for Rick that
Speaker 1: he'll try put it into words this episode. It's also
Speaker 1: one of only two songs on that album to feature
Speaker 1: Crazy Horse, the band Neil used exclusively on his newest album, Barn.
Speaker 1: Rick talks to Neil about his new album, the sessions
Speaker 1: for After the gold Rush, and when he started organizing
Speaker 1: his massive archives. This is Broken Record liner notes for
Speaker 1: the Digital Age. I'm justin Richmond. Here's part two of
Speaker 1: Rick Rubin with Neil Young over Zoom was After the
Speaker 1: gold Rush? The first thing you recorded at home? Yeah,
Speaker 1: I recorded in that house in Japan. I love that one.
Speaker 1: That's maybe maybe my favorite. Yeah. I love that one too.
Speaker 1: I love the fact that Bonn is related to it.
Speaker 1: In some of you ago ye put my finger on.
Speaker 1: But it is related to it's a lot of the
Speaker 1: same people. Niles is all over after the gold Rush.
Speaker 1: There's a lot of piano playing on after the gold Rush,
Speaker 1: either me or knows. That's the same thing with barn
Speaker 1: It's interesting the way that moved out. Yeah, is the
Speaker 1: song I Believe in You about a particular person. That
Speaker 1: song was written probably in nineteen seventy and guessing maybe
Speaker 1: a little earlier. It was written around the time I
Speaker 1: joined sn one and I had written it around that
Speaker 1: time along with birds, and I had come up with
Speaker 1: this arrangement of all lunch and me and I did
Speaker 1: all those three tracks at sunset Sound in the morning
Speaker 1: with Crazy Horse before I would go. But it stills.
Speaker 1: This house to practice was cs and one, so I
Speaker 1: recorded those then then after the CSNY tour and after
Speaker 1: all about I still have all those and that's why
Speaker 1: they're on after the gold Rush, because that's when I
Speaker 1: recorded after the goal. I see, do you remember who
Speaker 1: the song was about? Was it about a person or
Speaker 1: is it abstract? I'm really sure of the person, and
Speaker 1: a lot of cases it's me mixed up with someone else.
Speaker 1: So some of my feelings about now that you found
Speaker 1: yourself losing your mind, how you here again? Finding the
Speaker 1: one one thought was real was gone and changing. But
Speaker 1: then it's this other thing, now that you made yourself
Speaker 1: love me. It's like it's a funny song, isn't it.
Speaker 1: It's a really good one, first of all song. A
Speaker 1: lot of guys can relate to that. Yeah, you've made
Speaker 1: yourself love me because you can't forget all of things
Speaker 1: happened before. It's funny. I can't remember if I ever
Speaker 1: told you the story, but I had a near death
Speaker 1: experience to that song. Wow. I was driving was a
Speaker 1: full moon, and there's a time of year. I don't
Speaker 1: know the time of year, but there's a time of
Speaker 1: year when you're driving from Malibu into town when there's
Speaker 1: a very big full moon, big where it looks like
Speaker 1: it's very close, Yeah, and it's sitting right on the horizon,
Speaker 1: and it's you can't believe how big it is. It's surreal. Yeah,
Speaker 1: when you're close to the horizon may appear to be
Speaker 1: much bigger than when they get in the sky. So
Speaker 1: I'm driving on PCH and I get onto the ten
Speaker 1: and I'm listening. I'm listening to that album and that
Speaker 1: song comes on and something happens. And it's funny when
Speaker 1: I say near death, because I don't really know how
Speaker 1: to describe it, but I have a feeling. I would
Speaker 1: call it a positive feeling. I had to pull off
Speaker 1: the side of the road because I couldn't drive, and
Speaker 1: I felt like this, this is not the right way
Speaker 1: to say it. The song did. The song affected me
Speaker 1: in a way that took me out of myself where
Speaker 1: I relate it to dying because I was no longer here,
Speaker 1: I was gone, and it was a little scary, but
Speaker 1: it was also beautiful. It was it wasn't bad. It
Speaker 1: was scary, but it wasn't bad. It was not negative
Speaker 1: and um and that's the only time it happened to
Speaker 1: me in my life, that song. So I asked about
Speaker 1: that song, but it hit me in a very very
Speaker 1: hard way. That's in that song. I feel it. I
Speaker 1: don't know why it is, but I feel it too. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I can't put my finger on where it is in
Speaker 1: the song, but I think it's uh, finding that what
Speaker 1: you once thought was real was gone and changing. You know,
Speaker 1: how can I place you above me? Yeah? Incredible. It
Speaker 1: just all came out so fast it's that's why you
Speaker 1: That's how real writers, in my view, have nothing to
Speaker 1: do with what they're writing their vessels, you know. They
Speaker 1: just they're in the right place at the right time.
Speaker 1: They know how to be to not scare the song.
Speaker 1: It's like we're trying to catch your rabbits, and you
Speaker 1: don't hang out at the hole and look down the hole.
Speaker 1: You've got to be, you know, blending and in school,
Speaker 1: I'm a tree. I'm you know, I'm a part of
Speaker 1: what's going on and not looking. I'm not looking at
Speaker 1: the hole by seeing anything over there. I might take
Speaker 1: a look, maybe I'm maybe I won't whatever. It's that
Speaker 1: kind of an attitude about music, not being too serious
Speaker 1: about catching the power of the song is incredible. And
Speaker 1: now even talking about it, I can feel change in
Speaker 1: my body just talking about, not hearing it, just discussing it.
Speaker 1: It's there's some there's a lot of juju in that song.
Speaker 1: Yeah there is. There's a version of birds, but if
Speaker 1: you listen to it, it's Danny Whitten's on that song too.
Speaker 1: That's one of the last great records that I made
Speaker 1: with Danny. So he's playing all the guitar stuff for
Speaker 1: nice Little things. I remember that making that quite a lot.
Speaker 1: It was one of the first songs that I've used
Speaker 1: the vibes on. There's a lot of things that I
Speaker 1: did on that record that been doing ever since I
Speaker 1: haven't done before. So that was an important record to me. Definitely.
Speaker 1: I'm glad you got connected to it. Yeah, the song
Speaker 1: that we talked about earlier from the new album with
Speaker 1: stars in it, Welcome Back. I can't say it gives
Speaker 1: me a feeling like that, but it's not the same
Speaker 1: experience at all, but it definitely pulls me in somewhere deep. Now.
Speaker 1: It's wild. I think when the stars are watching to
Speaker 1: see how you how you are, It's like the stars
Speaker 1: are watching you to see how you are, so you
Speaker 1: feel this connection. Something cares about me seems to be
Speaker 1: one of the stars. So there's that little part of it.
Speaker 1: Because I wrote it so fast, I can remember how
Speaker 1: I did it. Literally, those songs happened really fast. You
Speaker 1: can tell there's somebody run on sentences to just go
Speaker 1: on and on and on, and then they the playing
Speaker 1: The horse plays great on that song. They're so connected
Speaker 1: to the song. And in the movie you can hear
Speaker 1: Ralph saying that's the ship afterwards. That's a ship, do
Speaker 1: you know how to get Neil was really doing this shit.
Speaker 1: That was our ship, that's what we do. And he
Speaker 1: was a little bit you could tell he was just
Speaker 1: a little off, a little niff because everybody wasn't going,
Speaker 1: what a great book a record, Jesus, you know. Ralph
Speaker 1: was going, that was the ship, you know, and I
Speaker 1: even I I wasn't sure if that was it, or
Speaker 1: if it was the one before it, or because we
Speaker 1: only played it. I think we played it once the
Speaker 1: day before and twice that day and that was it.
Speaker 1: I think that was the last time, maybe the second
Speaker 1: last time. It's amazing, just the feeling, the feeling and
Speaker 1: the track. And it's also interesting because it's not really
Speaker 1: like a song, like you said, the run on sentences
Speaker 1: and it's more like a direct transmission of some kind.
Speaker 1: You know. It doesn't have to fit in the structure
Speaker 1: of how a song works because it's something different exactly. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I know it was somewhere else. That one. That's Darryll's favorite.
Speaker 1: It's mine too. She loved it since the first time
Speaker 1: she heard it, and I you know, when it was fresh,
Speaker 1: it was everybody was going, oh wow, what about that one?
Speaker 1: And there's another one about a guy waiting on his
Speaker 1: porch for somebody to make a delivery, and that's got
Speaker 1: some some ambience, but it doesn't have the same depth.
Speaker 1: But its just a very casual ambience that that is
Speaker 1: similar to that AMBIANCELF exactly. And I being geographically oriented
Speaker 1: myself to the music and where it is and when
Speaker 1: it is, I feel that the Barn has more of
Speaker 1: that in it. Yeah, so I'm going to go probably
Speaker 1: back to the Barn. Yeah, I've written some more songs
Speaker 1: that I'm working on. Strangely enough, I've written one song.
Speaker 1: The first song that I wrote that would have gone
Speaker 1: on Barn, I forgot. I didn't even do it, So
Speaker 1: I'm gonna do that on the next one. And probably
Speaker 1: you know, just because it's it was an honest forget.
Speaker 1: It wasn't like I waited for anything. So I might
Speaker 1: still be good, it might be fine. It's fresh, It's
Speaker 1: never been fun. I've never played it with anybody, but
Speaker 1: I know what it is. It's it's called break the chain.
Speaker 1: Do the songs from the time you write them and
Speaker 1: then you record them, how much do they change in
Speaker 1: that from the from the thing that comes in to
Speaker 1: the thing that happens in the recording that we get
Speaker 1: to hear. Nothing changes except during the performance. During the performance,
Speaker 1: if we hit the right whatever it is, the mantra,
Speaker 1: the note, the rhythm, whatever you want to call it,
Speaker 1: the ambiance, if we hit that vibe in the right place,
Speaker 1: it opens up the window and changes start flooding in.
Speaker 1: Improvisation start flooding in, and they all fit like a
Speaker 1: vlove and everything's cool. And as long as as long
Speaker 1: as I don't think, Yeah, poison, think thinking is you're thinking,
Speaker 1: you're thinking. Somebody said that there's no thinking. So if
Speaker 1: that happens again, we'll get we'll get something. And I
Speaker 1: had another song that I so I have that one
Speaker 1: and another one that I've written that there's probably going
Speaker 1: to be ones, you know if I if I end
Speaker 1: up doing it, I hope I do. It's almost like
Speaker 1: poison to talk about it. Yeah, because it's not done.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's not played, written, but I won't touch
Speaker 1: it or look at it until I'm playing it with craziness,
Speaker 1: so it will be preserved. Yeah, it may develop into something.
Speaker 1: When I played with the horse, We'll be right back
Speaker 1: with more from Neil Young After a quick break, we're
Speaker 1: back with Rick Rubin and Neil Young. When did you
Speaker 1: start recording around the full moon? I would probably happened
Speaker 1: about early sentence. Was it based on something you heard
Speaker 1: or something that you felt, or what started it? One
Speaker 1: day I felt like I just played some music and
Speaker 1: I felt great and everything's good and it's really good.
Speaker 1: I remember feeling good that morning, feeling good about everything,
Speaker 1: wanting to play more music, just being into it and
Speaker 1: feeling like it's going to be good. And played them.
Speaker 1: It was great, it was one was good. And then
Speaker 1: a while later I got that feeling again. That happened,
Speaker 1: you know, a month or so later, and then a
Speaker 1: couple of months and I felt it again. I want
Speaker 1: to get back in stem, play with play with somebody again,
Speaker 1: with the horse or whatever. And then I started wondering why.
Speaker 1: And then I started realizing, and I had a chronological
Speaker 1: record for my work, and I said, well, why don't
Speaker 1: I just go back see if there's any correlation between
Speaker 1: the ones that have got this feeling and the ones
Speaker 1: that you know in the time of day or the
Speaker 1: time of months. And that's when I realized that there's
Speaker 1: a window of opportunity that opens somewhere in the two
Speaker 1: week period, perhaps the ten day period four or full moon.
Speaker 1: It sort of starts coming and you can feel it.
Speaker 1: And if you're open to it, you can feel it.
Speaker 1: If you're not, if you're judging and trying to decide, well,
Speaker 1: is this it or not, I'm looking for proof, I mean, forget.
Speaker 1: So I was trying to be open to that. I
Speaker 1: looked at my records, but I had, which we're pretty
Speaker 1: primitive at the time, one of things will record it,
Speaker 1: and then later again and again and again through the years,
Speaker 1: I look kept looking, kept not that it's concisely perfect,
Speaker 1: but it seems that there's always something going on in
Speaker 1: the sky. There's also the new moon. When there's no moon,
Speaker 1: it's just a sliver. You start seeing it, something happens,
Speaker 1: you feel a change in your attitude. And then I said, well,
Speaker 1: that's got to have something to do it. Something. So
Speaker 1: I started, you know, looking at that way, and then
Speaker 1: you know, I'm mostly just guessing that. I'm saying, I
Speaker 1: think that the full moon that's allowed to do with it. Yeah.
Speaker 1: There's a song called human Race on Umbarns that's about
Speaker 1: the fires and floods. The children of the fires and floods.
Speaker 1: It's about all of them. But that's going on, and well,
Speaker 1: I can't we come together and stop it? Why can't
Speaker 1: we all come together and deal with this thing that's
Speaker 1: happening to us. The solo on that song was particularly fiery.
Speaker 1: I remember that was probably for me, the best solo
Speaker 1: on the album. On that song, yeah, I think you're
Speaker 1: I think you're probably right now. That was done three
Speaker 1: hours after the full moon. Yeah, the song was written
Speaker 1: in the out in a one or two hours before
Speaker 1: the full moon. The full moon was at eleven o'clock
Speaker 1: eleven thirty that more. Yeah, So as I was walking
Speaker 1: to the studio, which I do every processive open Field
Speaker 1: to go to mont Walk, I had a piece of
Speaker 1: paper and a pencil usually carrying. I had this, just
Speaker 1: come up with a couple of changes, and now I
Speaker 1: might have something on those or they're just changes that
Speaker 1: you've got to do with the sides the horse and
Speaker 1: think much about it. And then I wrote all the
Speaker 1: words on the way there. And we even played that
Speaker 1: song once. There's like three or four songs on this
Speaker 1: record that only have them played once. Wow. Yeah, it's interesting.
Speaker 1: It's a different approach. I try to find that moment
Speaker 1: and I don't really care about everything. Therefore, there's lots
Speaker 1: of unfinished records and lots of things that I just
Speaker 1: put down, made a rough, kept on moving at other
Speaker 1: things to do. Yeah, now I'm finding amazing. Would you
Speaker 1: say your relationship to those songs have changed over time
Speaker 1: or when you listen to them, is it like, does
Speaker 1: it bring you back to where you were? Or tell
Speaker 1: me what happens? Tell me what it's like to hear
Speaker 1: something you haven't heard in forty years that you that
Speaker 1: you recorded. Well, I know if I listen to I
Speaker 1: believe it's going to feel just like I did the
Speaker 1: day I did it. Yeah, So songs like that, records
Speaker 1: that have got that thing, whatever it is, they never
Speaker 1: lose it. They have it right for you. Don't get
Speaker 1: tired of it. I mean it did nothing but listen
Speaker 1: to that song and I get tired. Come back to it.
Speaker 1: Your first breath of it is great. Yeah, it feels
Speaker 1: like it always did to me. It does, and I
Speaker 1: think that feeling in my body and I know, okay,
Speaker 1: there it is. It's it's interesting and some people you
Speaker 1: try to explain that to anyone think crazy. We start
Speaker 1: on Monday. And stop on Friday. You don't waste any
Speaker 1: time during the week in the Fire and Flood song.
Speaker 1: It has Uh, it feels like biblical imagery. Did you
Speaker 1: grow up in the church? Was that it was it
Speaker 1: intentional to be biblical? No, But I think what happened
Speaker 1: is when we put those vocals on it. I sang
Speaker 1: the song Love and then we put the today children
Speaker 1: of the Fires, and that's definitely got a church vibe. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but choir singing and there's you know, Billy's voice and
Speaker 1: Ralph's voice singing, and you talk about a savior, you
Speaker 1: talk about a savior, and like there's a lot of
Speaker 1: words that are definitely feel like they come from a
Speaker 1: biblical place. It's interesting it happened so fast. I am more.
Speaker 1: I don't know, Yeah, because I was writing while I
Speaker 1: was walking, and I never even I never wasn't singing it.
Speaker 1: I was just writing it down and then I put
Speaker 1: it back in my pocket. I couldn't think of anything.
Speaker 1: I didn't try to. I just put it away. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and then when I waited, something else came along. I
Speaker 1: started writing. I never I always just try to catch
Speaker 1: what tones. I'm not trying to make any enough. Yeah,
Speaker 1: There's another one that I really love on the new
Speaker 1: album is again. I don't know the title, but it's
Speaker 1: it's a complicated thing. Oh yeah, it's so complete. Coming
Speaker 1: through the years. Yeah, coming through the years without your love,
Speaker 1: it's like a it's like a thought of what it
Speaker 1: would be like, what it's like to have a great,
Speaker 1: you know, partner that helps you and loves you and
Speaker 1: supports you and understands you, and it's there for you.
Speaker 1: And if you can be part of your life and
Speaker 1: understand her and put it back and get it back
Speaker 1: in the same way, try to and do that. And
Speaker 1: it's about that kind of field. It's, you know, coming
Speaker 1: through the years without your love, it's it's it's imagining
Speaker 1: what it would be like, but not even imagine just
Speaker 1: going no, let's not do that coming through the years
Speaker 1: about you. I'd rather be rich your love for me
Speaker 1: a few years. So that's just the thing about how
Speaker 1: lucky I feel, how good it is, also how scary
Speaker 1: it is that it could be not dead, because I've
Speaker 1: been in both places. That one songwriting wise, is different
Speaker 1: in that it feels more like a traditional It almost
Speaker 1: sounds like a sixties pop song. Yeah, it's not presented
Speaker 1: that way, but songwriting wise, it feels very traditional and beautiful. Well. Thanks.
Speaker 1: The other one that's like that is Don't Forget Love. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's like a C A minor F June seventh, over
Speaker 1: and over in class. It's just like what so yeah,
Speaker 1: But I couldn't stop playing and I and that song
Speaker 1: took me a couple of months. I'm going this is
Speaker 1: so jive, this song is I cannot I'm going away,
Speaker 1: and I come by the piano again and I start playing. Wow,
Speaker 1: I love these changes. And you know they're not new,
Speaker 1: but I love them and it doesn't matter that they're
Speaker 1: not new, because I'm not new. Eat. Yes, yes, And
Speaker 1: I started just writing words and came. They came slowly,
Speaker 1: but I didn't work out of My house is set
Speaker 1: up in such a way that I have to go
Speaker 1: buy the piano a lot to get from A to B.
Speaker 1: So on my way from A to B or B
Speaker 1: to A, I can stop at the piano and just
Speaker 1: think for a little bit. You never know, you never know.
Speaker 1: You have a song on the new album where you proclaim,
Speaker 1: you proclaim your American status. It feels like a proudly
Speaker 1: American song and even in the context of the song.
Speaker 1: You mentioned that you came from Canada, but you're an American, Yeah,
Speaker 1: And what was your view when you lived in Canada?
Speaker 1: What was your view of America? It was a long
Speaker 1: way away. I I was. I was up in Canada,
Speaker 1: and I heard about America and I saw some great music.
Speaker 1: It came from down there. And then when I started
Speaker 1: playing my music and going to high school and playing
Speaker 1: in my band, and you and this, and then I
Speaker 1: decided to stop going to school and just play music.
Speaker 1: And I went off towards Toronto town by Town, then
Speaker 1: into Toronto, and I met a couple of Americans in
Speaker 1: bands playing the clubs on the way. So I became
Speaker 1: enamored of going down there to see what it was
Speaker 1: all about myself. And then I ended up according for
Speaker 1: Motown for a while. You know, that was an adventure
Speaker 1: with Rickie James. I was from that that didn't work out.
Speaker 1: That was gonna be really good. But that's when they
Speaker 1: caught right for draft gudging, Yeah, putting the jail and
Speaker 1: did something and screwed up Armiston. So as soon as
Speaker 1: he got arrested, then the Motown deal went away, and
Speaker 1: you were down They didn't want us without him, and
Speaker 1: uh for good reasons. He was the least aaron. He
Speaker 1: was a lot of the band. But I went, We
Speaker 1: went Faullmer and I went back to Toronto and sold
Speaker 1: all of our equipment and bought this hearse and got
Speaker 1: ready to travel to Los Angeles to start over again
Speaker 1: without just turned the BA agent. See what happened. So
Speaker 1: we got We sold all the stuff which didn't belong
Speaker 1: to us. So we sold the stuff that this investor
Speaker 1: had bought for the band, all the equipment, and you
Speaker 1: sold all all of that, bought the hearse and left town.
Speaker 1: We were good boys. We were following ourselves, following He
Speaker 1: wasn't missing any money. And somebody did that to me today,
Speaker 1: it wouldn't be a killing it so it wouldn't matter
Speaker 1: that much to me. But it wasn't a nice thing
Speaker 1: to do, but we did. Then we were headed for
Speaker 1: la Before that, I'd been to New York and did
Speaker 1: a demo at Electra Saw in New York. I remember,
Speaker 1: you know, trying to carry my twin Reverb down to
Speaker 1: the bus station from from the village. It was a
Speaker 1: long way and I just didn't have any money. So
Speaker 1: we got there. But that that was my previous New
Speaker 1: York City experience, and then I got to I really
Speaker 1: had when you arrived in April Fools Day in nineteen
Speaker 1: sixty six. And nothing's changed since we're still on the
Speaker 1: same role. So when did you realize you were enamored
Speaker 1: with America? You came down here, you started a band
Speaker 1: with Stills. When did you start feeling like I'm an American?
Speaker 1: When did that happen? Well, it was obvious I was
Speaker 1: being American. I was paying taxes, I was playing all
Speaker 1: over America for Americans. And you know, the one thing
Speaker 1: about me was I was a Canadian. So when I
Speaker 1: came out when the song, I came up with that
Speaker 1: thing where I said, I'm a Canarican, a different thing.
Speaker 1: That's what I the only way I could describe myself
Speaker 1: at that point. So if it all worked out and
Speaker 1: it's it's cool now now I am Athmerica. I got
Speaker 1: my mom. It's a paper and I had to take
Speaker 1: the test place. I answered all the questions the first time,
Speaker 1: and they realized after that, but they stricted taking the
Speaker 1: test and really kept track of what I was saying,
Speaker 1: so they brought me back into the test again. Wow.
Speaker 1: After I passed it, and they asked me all the
Speaker 1: same questions, for which I kept saying, well, you know,
Speaker 1: I answered this question, consult your records. Yeah, see what
Speaker 1: I said. But they didn't have a witness that signed.
Speaker 1: They didn't have the one thing they needed to put
Speaker 1: me away because I had said things about weed. Said
Speaker 1: they asked me if I had a smoke breed and
Speaker 1: I said, yeah, smoke beleding and smoke weed for a
Speaker 1: long time. I use it to write songs and it
Speaker 1: helped me at times, not always, but I enjoy it
Speaker 1: and removed me from reality sometimes in a way that
Speaker 1: I enjoy. So I said that in the first interview. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they wanted me to say that again. I said, well
Speaker 1: I can't. I can't do that. I answered the question,
Speaker 1: and you're asking me all the same questions. But there
Speaker 1: were many more people in the room. Yeah, yeah, and
Speaker 1: they were taking notes and according stuff fishy there was
Speaker 1: something wrong with it, and I think, you know, this
Speaker 1: was in the previous administrations here, and so I realized
Speaker 1: that it was trying. They were trying to trap me
Speaker 1: and my and my attorneys said, you got a watch
Speaker 1: up because they're trying to get you to say everything
Speaker 1: that you are to say. Yeah, so if you say
Speaker 1: it now you're liable for it. But before they accepted it,
Speaker 1: so you just got to leave it where it was.
Speaker 1: That was very interesting In the song, you say you
Speaker 1: see changes coming to this country. Do you view this
Speaker 1: as an optimistic song or pessimistic song? Well, I think
Speaker 1: it's an observance. It's not so much optimistic or I
Speaker 1: don't think change is bad. Yeah, I think changes come
Speaker 1: into this country or what could be happening here in
Speaker 1: this country could ultimately end up being the best thing
Speaker 1: that ever happened to America, where we discover that it
Speaker 1: matters who we are, that it matters that we have beliefs,
Speaker 1: that matters that we have a code of right and
Speaker 1: wrong and what's true and what isn't true, and the
Speaker 1: truth matters, all these things that you know that you
Speaker 1: think is part of being an Americans to be forthright
Speaker 1: and strong in your convictions and what it is and
Speaker 1: say what you mean and stand behind it, and stand
Speaker 1: behind your brother and you know, you know, stand beside
Speaker 1: people who you think need help. They may be fellow
Speaker 1: Americans in trouble. You could stand right there with them.
Speaker 1: And that's what that song, that's what the feeling is
Speaker 1: in that song, and I think it could be a
Speaker 1: good thing, but like a lot of good things, it
Speaker 1: doesn't feel really good at first. And this definitely qualifies
Speaker 1: for that. We've got a lot on our plate. We have,
Speaker 1: obviously we have. Climate change is just number one that
Speaker 1: we ignore it, and number two is the pandemic, which
Speaker 1: we ignore as much as we can. We're trying to
Speaker 1: convince ourselves that we beat it now we can go
Speaker 1: back to regular life, which is not true. That's a
Speaker 1: that's a lie. That's not true. We used to have
Speaker 1: a leader that told us everything was okay, and maybe
Speaker 1: he thought it was nice to be comforting, and that's
Speaker 1: kind of where he was coming from. And that's the
Speaker 1: most gracious thing that I could say about that. But
Speaker 1: I do think that, you know, we're on on the
Speaker 1: edge of really discovering who we are. We need strong
Speaker 1: leadership and we need need help from each other. We'll
Speaker 1: be back with more from Neil Young. After a quick break,
Speaker 1: we're back with the rest of Rick Rubin's conversation with
Speaker 1: Neil Young. Tell me about protest songs. Over the course
Speaker 1: of your life, you've written a lot of protest songs.
Speaker 1: Tell me how you feel protest songs work in the world.
Speaker 1: Tell me effective a protest song or what you imagine
Speaker 1: it is. Well, it's reporting, it's talking about what's going on,
Speaker 1: like Ohio is. Like Ohio is just basically a description
Speaker 1: or something that happened and the feelings of young people
Speaker 1: about it happened, you know, walking about soldiers cutting us down.
Speaker 1: It's just that they're havn't been protest songs like that
Speaker 1: on the radio at that time. And now if you
Speaker 1: write a protest song like that, radio is gone. There's
Speaker 1: nobody who has their balls to stand up and play
Speaker 1: the song. They don't want They got it programmers, they
Speaker 1: got people who decide what they play. They there's a
Speaker 1: lot of people that would like to play what they
Speaker 1: want to play. The way things are set up, it
Speaker 1: doesn't matter. There's really no place for them to play it.
Speaker 1: There's no radio to speak of anymore that we all
Speaker 1: pay attention to. The great thing about them those days
Speaker 1: was everybody listening to the radio, So everybody reads the
Speaker 1: same thing. So if you get a message out there,
Speaker 1: it got to a lot of people. Yeah, no longer happened.
Speaker 1: So protest songs now are like fodder for media. Media.
Speaker 1: Guess the comment on the protest song and everybody in there.
Speaker 1: It becomes everybody's thing, and have a blog about what
Speaker 1: it means, you know, put down the person who wrote it,
Speaker 1: whatever it is. The day of the protest song as
Speaker 1: an active way of changing it's probably past. It's funny
Speaker 1: you talk about the media reaction because one of the
Speaker 1: craziest things I've ever seen on television in my life
Speaker 1: was you put out an album. I think it was
Speaker 1: called Impeach the President or what was it called? Living
Speaker 1: with War? Living with War? And is there a song
Speaker 1: impeach about impeaching the president. Impeach the President. Let's impeach
Speaker 1: the President. Okay, you were interviewed. I don't know if
Speaker 1: you remember this, but this was one of the more
Speaker 1: surreal things I've seen in my life. You are Neil Young.
Speaker 1: You were interviewed on CNN. I think it was maybe
Speaker 1: outside of Warner Brothers Records, the and the CNN interview.
Speaker 1: It was a short interview. It was you know, it
Speaker 1: was a minute long. Yeah, it was a young woman
Speaker 1: who clearly had no idea of who you were. And
Speaker 1: the CNN interview interviewer said, I remember she said to you, well,
Speaker 1: you have this song about impeaching the president, and a
Speaker 1: lot of people are saying it's really just like a
Speaker 1: publicity stunt, and this is on the news, and I'm thinking,
Speaker 1: I can't believe this is happening. I can't believe this
Speaker 1: is where we are that someone from the news is
Speaker 1: asking Neil Young at this point in his career, this
Speaker 1: was not that long ago. If he was doing a
Speaker 1: publicity stunt to get popular by talking about impeaching the president.
Speaker 1: It was. It was surreal, it was, but it just
Speaker 1: showed how much the times have changed, you know, and
Speaker 1: the media has a great effect on things. And the
Speaker 1: media is not brilliant. Media is another machine. It's another
Speaker 1: there's another ceo, there's another leader calling the shots for
Speaker 1: every station. And the media is, like I believe, the
Speaker 1: most dangerous weapon in funding America. I don't think the
Speaker 1: media is a big help when I see some of
Speaker 1: these stations, either Fox or f MSNBCU not sometimes CNN,
Speaker 1: some of the people on cn but they they present
Speaker 1: stories in a way that to try to take a
Speaker 1: side and kind of and then they have these little
Speaker 1: personikety things they say, these little jokes about This is
Speaker 1: real stuff, and this is our source of information, and
Speaker 1: these people are twying with it like it's entertainment. They
Speaker 1: can't tell a difference between their own notoriety and the
Speaker 1: meaningfulness of the news. They don't have the respect for
Speaker 1: the news they have. They're looking to present their image.
Speaker 1: We don't want to harp on that forever. So let's
Speaker 1: talk about something much makes it makes us feel bad. Yes,
Speaker 1: let's talk about something. Yes, let's talk about something much
Speaker 1: more important. Yeah. Do you still have the cigar store
Speaker 1: Indian that used to be on stage with you sometimes? Yes?
Speaker 1: Does he have a name, Woody Woody beautiful? Yeah? Where's
Speaker 1: Woody these days? Where does he live these days? I
Speaker 1: believe wood he's an Oxnard. It's a nice place. I
Speaker 1: bet he likes Oxnard. He probably likes it a lot.
Speaker 1: He's with my band equipment stuff, which he likes to
Speaker 1: be with. Yeah, I bet that's where he feels good,
Speaker 1: you know. And And what is it? Unfortunate victim of
Speaker 1: the changing times? And Woody is a wooden Indian, Okay,
Speaker 1: a wooden Indian with some cigars. But back in the day,
Speaker 1: Indian tobacco is great. That's what all those tobacco stores
Speaker 1: used to be proud to sell this tobacco that they
Speaker 1: got from Indians, So having the chief out there with
Speaker 1: some cigars kind of said something good. But in today's world,
Speaker 1: I read about people saying, well, you know, you should
Speaker 1: be ashamed of yourself for using the name crazy Horse,
Speaker 1: and you've got to get rid of that wooden Indian.
Speaker 1: That's just a disgrace. And I, you know, try to
Speaker 1: tell wood about that. He doesn't believe it. And we
Speaker 1: played one you know that was owned by Native Americans
Speaker 1: and they were offended by Woody? Were they really? And
Speaker 1: they were offended by Woody? And I said, well that's fine,
Speaker 1: but wood he has to stay and listen. But we'll
Speaker 1: just cover Woody up so nobody knows he's here. So
Speaker 1: he put a blanket over Woody, beautiful Indian blanket over.
Speaker 1: He was feeling okay, and everything was fine, and we
Speaker 1: did our show and we went to the next show.
Speaker 1: But I realized everybody's sensitive today about things. But to
Speaker 1: be sensitive about things like that when there's so many
Speaker 1: other things to really focus on, it are really meaningful. Yes,
Speaker 1: is there a story behind the little lid up loves
Speaker 1: Love sign that you have on the stage. Daryl loves
Speaker 1: that sign. I got it from somewhere. She may have
Speaker 1: gotten it in a junk store somewhere, because we always
Speaker 1: visit these places where we can pick up all the
Speaker 1: stuff on the highway, and so she met a government there.
Speaker 1: I don't know where we got it, but it's always there. Now,
Speaker 1: it's on stage all the time. I love it. I
Speaker 1: do too. She does too. It arrived with her and
Speaker 1: that'll be here forever. Earlier, you talked about the process
Speaker 1: of becoming an American. Do you remember, and you revealed
Speaker 1: in the first interview that you smoke pot on occasion.
Speaker 1: Do you remember the first time you ever smoked pot? Yeah?
Speaker 1: I think I smoked part of York Wild Village in Toronto,
Speaker 1: probably in the nineteen sixty five. And do you remember
Speaker 1: if it had any connection to music with you right away? No,
Speaker 1: it didn't. There's a bunch of people sitting around in
Speaker 1: a room under a cafe called the Riverboat, or next
Speaker 1: door to the cafe called the Riverboat, which a music
Speaker 1: place back in the sixth season in Yorkville. It's like
Speaker 1: Greenwich Village in Canada. No, David Rays the guitar players
Speaker 1: played with Fall a lot of great players even sell here.
Speaker 1: But there's a lot of good things and uh, you
Speaker 1: know a company of guitar player accompanies David Gray acoustic guitar,
Speaker 1: and he had some leads. So I tried it. I'd
Speaker 1: never tried to. Sitting around with six or seven people.
Speaker 1: When's the first time noticed how it affected music? First
Speaker 1: time I smoked something played with the band. Then it
Speaker 1: became really obvious at the time that that happened. That
Speaker 1: wave of people discovering marijuana and music. Was everybody doing it?
Speaker 1: Was it like a known piece of the puzzle or doorway?
Speaker 1: It was kind of the underground of music. There was
Speaker 1: that underground. Not everybody did it, A lot of people
Speaker 1: in the underground. Yeah, and clubs. I was just starting.
Speaker 1: You couldn't it wasn't life so prevalent that you could
Speaker 1: walk in club and smell it. It's not like that yet.
Speaker 1: It smell it on the street, but not somewhere Warrior
Speaker 1: in the cloth space with the people. Earlier, you mentioned
Speaker 1: the Rust, how the guitar rig changed right before Rust?
Speaker 1: How did how did it work out for you to
Speaker 1: film the Rust tour? Well, Larry Johnson meant good brow
Speaker 1: and David Meyers, director of photography, and you guy named
Speaker 1: Fred i'm er as a producer. You know, we just
Speaker 1: started thinking about filming it because it was a concept
Speaker 1: as a concert, it had a story as a concert,
Speaker 1: it was an ambience place, and so we wanted we
Speaker 1: decided to try to make a film. Mean, I was
Speaker 1: hanging out with Larry all the time and just made
Speaker 1: all we had made already a few years back before
Speaker 1: that movie. In seven and one seven two, we make
Speaker 1: Journey through the Past, which is my first film. I'm
Speaker 1: really not a filmmaker, you know. I make movies mostly
Speaker 1: for fun. I like to do it for fun. It's
Speaker 1: fun to do. It's great to create these and create
Speaker 1: these scenes and everything. You know. I can't really, I'm
Speaker 1: not I can't compete with all of the moviemakers because
Speaker 1: that's not what this is. I'm not doing that. It's
Speaker 1: about music and film fantasy. Yeah, different, that's what I like. Cool.
Speaker 1: I'm excited to see all of the eight films that
Speaker 1: you talked about finding through the archive project. That would
Speaker 1: be great to see. Yeah, they're gonna be fun. That's
Speaker 1: a good that's a that's a good ride. There's I
Speaker 1: think there's eight maybe nine that I think there's this
Speaker 1: is why this set is, you know the film start
Speaker 1: in a set, you know, volume three. There's a lot
Speaker 1: of evolution of ideas. Plus that's some audio documentary audio
Speaker 1: which I've done, like one one disc. Then the non
Speaker 1: star Nicolette Morrison. Mean, sitting around the table with David
Speaker 1: Briggs and I'm playing every song that I've just written
Speaker 1: for them, and they're starting to sing the parts while
Speaker 1: I'm playing for the first time. So there's like ten
Speaker 1: or twelve songs, you know, Long Day one and those
Speaker 1: kinds of songs from that era, and they're all saying
Speaker 1: and get going and laughing. It's more like a you know,
Speaker 1: it's a doctor you doctor musical. Yeah it sounds great. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's interesting. I mean I think people need more of
Speaker 1: the real thing behind the music. Yeah, and I can
Speaker 1: put out all my records, but I've already put on
Speaker 1: my records. I put the backstory of the records out
Speaker 1: a little bit, or things you might have missed or
Speaker 1: things that got left behind on the search for perfection
Speaker 1: organ songs. It's quite often the original things that happened
Speaker 1: when you look back and go, wow, why did we
Speaker 1: go by that? Why didn't we just stay right there
Speaker 1: and go home. So I've discovered a lot of things
Speaker 1: like that in the archives, because it's like nine hundred songs,
Speaker 1: whatever it is. I can't wait to hear the whole
Speaker 1: to sit back and you know, sit back and relax
Speaker 1: the whole thing, and probably take a day to listen
Speaker 1: to beautiful. It's great, cool man. Well, it's a pleasure
Speaker 1: speaking to you as always too. I miss you and
Speaker 1: I love you likewise, my friend, and I look forward
Speaker 1: to seeing you in person, giving you a big hug
Speaker 1: sooner than later. Yeah, me too. Maybe we can get
Speaker 1: together and listen to our hard luck stories. Oh my god,
Speaker 1: I haven't heard it since then, So I'm gonna and
Speaker 1: I'm gonna wait to listen until we listen together. I
Speaker 1: want to listen to it with you. Okay, that'll be great.
Speaker 1: It's gonna be fun stories. Modern world. We live in
Speaker 1: a modern world. Oh yeah, meat song. Yeah, and they
Speaker 1: were great. If we if edman from me cutting my
Speaker 1: finger or whatever, that we're probably won had on record
Speaker 1: right there and album that everybody would know. Now, all good,
Speaker 1: all good, whatever we trust the universe's order of events,
Speaker 1: All good, exactly exactly we do cool man all right,
Speaker 1: Speak to you soon. Love to Daryl, Thanks Man, be well.
Speaker 1: Thanks to Neil Young for spending so much time with
Speaker 1: us talking about his creative process and about the new
Speaker 1: material he's getting ready to release in the new year.
Speaker 1: You can hear all of our favorite Neil Young songs
Speaker 1: at broken Record podcast dot com. You can follow us
Speaker 1: on Twitter at broken Record. Broken Record is produced with
Speaker 1: help from Leah Rose, Jason Yambrel, Martin Gonzalez, Eric Sandler,
Speaker 1: and Jennifer Sanchez, with engineering help from Nick Chaffey. Our
Speaker 1: executive producer is Mio LaBelle Broken Record is a production
Speaker 1: of Pushkin Industries. Please remember to share, rate, and review
Speaker 1: us on your podcast a. Our theme musics by Kenny Beats.
Speaker 1: I'm justin Richmond.